1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 21 Apr 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 223       Contents:/ Re: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups) / Re: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups) / Re: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups) $ Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives( Re: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives( Re: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives( Re: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives Re: ALTPRI and OpenVMS7.2  Re: ALTPRI and OpenVMS7.2  Re: ALTPRI and OpenVMS7.2 $ Re: Backup Strategies for Enterprise$ Re: Backup Strategies for Enterprise) Re: Calculating Discordian dates from DCL ) Re: Calculating Discordian dates from DCL ) Re: Calculating Discordian dates from DCL  Cannot open display... Console Firmware From VMS  Re: Console Firmware From VMS  Re: Console Firmware From VMS  Re: Console Firmware From VMS  RE: Console Firmware From VMS  Re: Console Firmware From VMS  Re: Console Firmware From VMS  Re: Console Firmware From VMS ! Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it! ! Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it! ! Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it! ! Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it!  Re: EMC Disk Storage@ Re: Further to = Re: Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not booting Re: Help With a Lexical  Re: How to use SYS$CREPRC % HSG80 mirror cache and serviceability ) Re: HSG80 mirror cache and serviceability , Re: Infoserver CD-R (was: Verify of Backups), Re: Infoserver CD-R (was: Verify of Backups)B Re: Is there a "Porting Unix/C Software to OpenVMS for  Dummies" ? Re: Mozilla M15's out... Re: Mozilla M15's out... Re: Mozilla M15's out... Re: Mozilla M15's out... RE: queue status values   Sun is no longer the dot in .com system disk move and batch jobs # Re: system disk move and batch jobs  ucx NFS who is doing what? Re: ucx NFS who is doing what?/ Re: Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not booting * Re: VAX CI storage vs served fibre channel* Re: VAX CI storage vs served fibre channel Re: Verify of Backups  Re: Verify of Backups  RE: Verify of Backups  Re: Verify of Backups  Re: Verify of Backups  Re: Verify of Backups   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:38:45 GMT  From: itjck01@my-deja.com 8 Subject: Re: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups)) Message-ID: <8dpsm3$ftk$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   . In article <01JOGPCIGS8WQVNO4E@CCTR.UMKC.EDU>,&   Ron <RROCKWELL@CCTR.UMKC.EDU> wrote: >  .  .  <snip> .  . C >  In anycase, we only now have a "new" priority for backups (since H >  all of our disks are RAID5) and that spec only calls for catastrophicA >  failure (F5 tornadoes, Earthquakes, etc..) The backup does not E >  need to know if it is verified exactly, only if what it did backup B >  was recorded without errors. If it missed a new file, it wasn'tC >  in time for the "snapshot". So, is there a way to tell if a file = >  was recorded incorrectly or if was simply "not there yet"?  >   G Excuse me if I jump in and make an attempt to only address part of your E questions.  My suggestions may have been covered already, since I did F not follow the entire post thread.  And please excuse that, if that is	 the case.   G If I recall correctly BACKUP gives an error message when it attempts to E put to tape a file that is open... when it attempts to do the best it A can with /ignore=interlock.  How about taking the backup logfile, D searching it for these error messages and associated files, and thenF doing a short backup of the prior open files, if they are still there.  E As to whether a file was not on the system at the time of backup, you G could do a backup journal, and compare it to a directory listing of the F files on the system at your time of interest.  I think this would tell< you what files were not on the system at the time of backup.   :) jck JKoska@bender.com     & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:16:33 -0400 % From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian> 8 Subject: Re: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups)$ Message-ID: <39007f11$1@news.si.com>  H >including a shadowing project known as mini-copy that is expected to be# part of the next OpenVMS release...   L And will this be available to VAX owners, too, or is this another area where+ Compaq decides to stick it to us for spite.  --  B  Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comB  Smiths Industries, Inc.                   tillman at swdev.si.com>  3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent=  Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@" 9         This opinion doesn't represent that of my company    ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:47:03 -0500 (CDT) # From: Ron <RROCKWELL@CCTR.UMKC.EDU> 8 Subject: Re: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups). Message-ID: <01JOHY0LFQ5IQVNPUM@CCTR.UMKC.EDU>  6 No excuse necessary, please jump in as info flows. 8^)  ?   The problem is not with open files, and in my experience, the A ignore/interlock causes more problems than it solves. The problem @ lies in that files have changed between the initial execution of6 the backup command and the completion of that command.  >   In particular the file mail.mai changes, and yet exists both? before and after the backup. Using verify will ALWAYS show this A file as an error message because the user received some new mail. @ Yet, there is no difference in the error message if the file was8 not recorded correctly or if the user received new mail.     Does this make better sense?   -ron    8 =>From:	IN%"itjck01@my-deja.com" 21-APR-2000 10:55:47.17  =>To:	IN%"Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com" =>CC:	7 =>Subj:	RE: 24x7 Operations (was Re: Verify of Backups) 0 =>In article <01JOGPCIGS8WQVNO4E@CCTR.UMKC.EDU>,( =>  Ron <RROCKWELL@CCTR.UMKC.EDU> wrote: =>>  =><snip>E =>>  In anycase, we only now have a "new" priority for backups (since J =>>  all of our disks are RAID5) and that spec only calls for catastrophicC =>>  failure (F5 tornadoes, Earthquakes, etc..) The backup does not G =>>  need to know if it is verified exactly, only if what it did backup D =>>  was recorded without errors. If it missed a new file, it wasn'tE =>>  in time for the "snapshot". So, is there a way to tell if a file ? =>>  was recorded incorrectly or if was simply "not there yet"?  =>>  =>I =>Excuse me if I jump in and make an attempt to only address part of your G =>questions.  My suggestions may have been covered already, since I did H =>not follow the entire post thread.  And please excuse that, if that is =>the case.  =>I =>If I recall correctly BACKUP gives an error message when it attempts to G =>put to tape a file that is open... when it attempts to do the best it C =>can with /ignore=interlock.  How about taking the backup logfile, F =>searching it for these error messages and associated files, and thenH =>doing a short backup of the prior open files, if they are still there. =>G =>As to whether a file was not on the system at the time of backup, you I =>could do a backup journal, and compare it to a directory listing of the H =>files on the system at your time of interest.  I think this would tell> =>you what files were not on the system at the time of backup. => =>:) jck =>JKoska@bender.com  => =>( =>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ =>Before you buy.      Ron Rockwell   Academic Computing Services '   University of Missouri at Kansas City    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:14:08 -0700 5 From: "cstranslations" <cstranslations@email.msn.com> - Subject: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives ) Message-ID: <#4XZev5q$GA.321@cpmsnbbsa04>   G I just picked up an Alphastation 4/233 which (unfortunately) only has 1 # internal drive (a Quantum 552 meg).   I The box has a CD and floppy drive in it (both of which I want to keep) so K this leaves the middle "section" of the box for hard drives. Looks like you F can get two in there - however I don't want to slowly cook everything.  I So . . . I was hoping some suggestions on what I might be able to replace B the drive with and/or what other people might be using in a 4/233.   Thanks in advance, Joe    ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 15:16:29 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)1 Subject: Re: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives 6 Message-ID: <8dprcd$mqt$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  a In article <#4XZev5q$GA.321@cpmsnbbsa04>, "cstranslations" <cstranslations@email.msn.com> writes: H :I just picked up an Alphastation 4/233 which (unfortunately) only has 1$ :internal drive (a Quantum 552 meg).  G   AlphaStation ??? 4/233?  (The missing part of the AlphaStation model  I   name is the piece that tells us what the particular enclosure used is.) J   There were several different AlphaStation boxes that used the EV4-class J   Alpha microprocessor at 233 MHz, including the AlphaStation 255 series.)  J   The particular SCSI controller -- if it is not the integrated controller   -- would also be of interest.   G   Various of the RZ2x series disks will fit into the enclosure of most  F   of the AlphaStation series, and are supported in most of the series.  I   One local AlphaStation 255 is running with (and supported with) a 4 GB  G   RZ29B disk internal and with an external BA-series StorageWorks box,  H   for instance...  At least one 7200 RPM disk drive -- the PBXRZ-SA FNSEH   disk -- was also supported in the 1.6" slot in the AlphaStation 255...  G   I wouldn't go inserting random 7200 RPM drives in the box, as some of I   these do run rather warm and might "toast" themselves in the enclosure.   J :The box has a CD and floppy drive in it (both of which I want to keep) soL :this leaves the middle "section" of the box for hard drives. Looks like youG :can get two in there - however I don't want to slowly cook everything.   F   The other "fun" with retrofitting a drive can involve obtaining the E   mounting kits.  If you are playing in this area, I would encourage  G   you to get in contact with the Compaq Assisted Services folks -- the  G   CAS folks are a good source for spare and replacement parts, and for  %   hardwware manuals and diagostics...   J :So . . . I was hoping some suggestions on what I might be able to replaceC :the drive with and/or what other people might be using in a 4/233.   C   I'd tend to go external if you're looking at a 7200 RPM or faster A   disk, as the faster disks run warmer and the older AlphaStation B   boxes were not tested for (nor rated for) cooling these widgets.A   It is also easier to get a configuration that meets the thermal B   requirements for the particular SCSI peripherals, and having an E   external StorageWorks-style enclosure makes swapping and upgrading  %   SCSI widgets far more convenient...   N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:19:27 GMT ( From: Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com>1 Subject: Re: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives ' Message-ID: <FtDH8F.1Cu@spcuna.spc.edu>   5 cstranslations <cstranslations@email.msn.com> writes: K > So . . . I was hoping some suggestions on what I might be able to replace D > the drive with and/or what other people might be using in a 4/233.  H   If you mean an AlphaStation 200 4/233, I've built many boxes that usedK Seagate Barracuda 2LP's (ST32550N) and the newer 4LP's (ST34571N) in there. < They've been running for several years now with no problems.  - 	Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.com 5         terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USA    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:40:08 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) 1 Subject: Re: Alphastation 4/233 - internal drives 0 Message-ID: <009E8F0E.CF0E81A4@SendSpamHere.ORG>  a In article <#4XZev5q$GA.321@cpmsnbbsa04>, "cstranslations" <cstranslations@email.msn.com> writes: H >I just picked up an Alphastation 4/233 which (unfortunately) only has 1$ >internal drive (a Quantum 552 meg). > J >The box has a CD and floppy drive in it (both of which I want to keep) soL >this leaves the middle "section" of the box for hard drives. Looks like youG >can get two in there - however I don't want to slowly cook everything.  > J >So . . . I was hoping some suggestions on what I might be able to replaceC >the drive with and/or what other people might be using in a 4/233.  >  >Thanks in advance,  >Joe  F I have two drives in one (RZ26 and RZ28) and a single RZ28 in another.    --N VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001           VAXman@TMESIS.COM  L GNU Freeware -- What does the GNU *really* stand for?  Garbage!  Not Usable!   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:09:06 -0400 . From: "Kenneth Randell" <kenr@datametrics.com>" Subject: Re: ALTPRI and OpenVMS7.2+ Message-ID: <8dpn8s$3ue$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   L If the target process is on a remote node, then this is a known problem., at least on VMS 7.2-1.   
 Reference:  L http://ftp.service.digital.com/patches/public/Readmes/vms/dec-axpvms-vms721_ update-v0100--4.README   Ken Randell   D Jerome LAURET wrote in message <38ffaa40_1@dilbert.ic.sunysb.edu>... > F > This has been buggig me since a while but I forgot to mention it ...I >Imagine that a process was created at priority 3 (let's say a batch or a # >detached process) and one tries to  >$ SET PROC/ID=xxxxx/PRIO=4  > & > with ALTPRI enabled, I currently get > D >%SET-E-NOTSET, need ALTPRI privilege to elevate above base priority > @ > i.e. it completly ignore the privilege. This is also happening? >with the SYSTEM account (not only from a priviledged account).  > / > Any patch one knows about which fixes this ??  > E > Correlatively, from an OpenVMS6.2 (mixed with 7.2) I currently have  >the following behavior :  >  >$ set proc/id=2800013C/prio=4' >SET-E-NOTSET, error modifying 2800013C H >-SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violation >$ show proc/id=2800013CH >%SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violation > . > all of this running from the SYSTEM account. >  > Well ? Comments ? Reactions ?  >  >  >-- 7 >                  Jerome LAURET S.U.N.Y. @ Stony Brook % >       ,,,,,      Dept. of Chemistry , >      ( o o )     Stony Brook NY 11794-3400< >  ---m---U---m---------------------------------------------' >  E-mail: jlauret@mail.chem.sunysb.edu = >  URL   : http://nucwww.chem.sunysb.edu/jlauret/jlauret.html    ------------------------------    Date: 21 Apr 2000 10:56:15 -0500/ From: jlauret@?.chem.sunysb.edu (Jerome LAURET) " Subject: Re: ALTPRI and OpenVMS7.2. Message-ID: <39006c0f_3@dilbert.ic.sunysb.edu>  6 	So much for me for not explaining in great detail ...  J >You say you have the ALTPRI priv enabled, but are you sure it is not justH >set as an authorized privilege, but not a default priv?  Have you tried >doing SET PROC/PRIV=ALTPRI?  ) 	YES, I do have ALTPRI and it is enabled.    >	Yeah... do this: >  >	$ show proc/priv  ! Prior to >	$ show proc/cont/id=2800013c > ? >	Somebody been fooling with your system account?  Normally all  >	privs are turned on.  C 	Nope ! Noboddy has been fooling around with the SYSTEM. YES ! show N process/priv will show ALTPRI in both cases (i.e. from SYSTEM account and from my other privildged account).     G >Just because the account is named SYSTEM does not mean that it has all * >privileges, or that they are all enabled. > 8 >I suspect that you do not have WORLD privilege enabled. > : >What does SHOW PROC/PRIV show when it gives these errors?   	Com'on guys ....   C 	I have to add that this does not happen with all processes : I can N change the priority of some of them. It basically behaves as if some processesJ becomes un-manageable priority-wise and I cannot see them from the SYSTEM 4 account neither if done on the OpenVMS6.2 boot node.  G 	I would be glad to grant access to a Digital/Compaq technician so they N can see this by themselves (seeing is beleiving insn't it). I still think thatE this is a bug but not a pilot error (such as what's suggested above).    	This yet another example   Y $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$GETSYI("NODENAME")+" "+F$GETSYI("ARCH_NAME")+" "+F$GETSYI("VERSION")V NUCAX0 Alpha V7.2	  $ SET PROCESS/ID=280000C1/PRIO=4C %SET-E-NOTSET, need ALTPRI privilege to elevate above base prioritye $ SHOW PROCESS/id=280000C1  G 21-APR-2000 10:46:27.52   User: XXXXXX           Process ID:   280000C12J                           Node: NUCAX3           Process name: "BATCH_965"  	 Terminal:i! User Identifier:    [YYYYY,XXXXX]2 Base priority:      1e! Default file spec:  Not availableI Number of Kthreads: 1L  ! Devices allocated:  Not availablet  L $ ! Note : XXXXX is not the real user name nor does YYYYY correspond to the J $ ! original group name I have stripped for the purpose of this posting :) $ show queue NUCAX3_LONG /full* Batch queue NUCAX3_LONG, busy, on NUCAX3::M   /AUTOSTART_ON=(NUCAX3::) /BASE_PRIORITY=1 /CPUMAXIMUM=INFINITE /JOB_LIMIT=1 O   /OWNER=[SYSTEM] /PROTECTION=(S:M,O:D,G:R,W:R) /WSDEFAULT=2000 /WSEXTENT=30000F   /WSQUOTA=4000s  H  Note 2 the above behavior regarding of priority change can also be seenQ    from a detached process. So, please, needless to suggest queue characteristicstQ    modifications, especially because I've already tried, anticipating suggestionsU*    , a set queue/prot=(s:rms) NUCAX3_LONG     $p $ SHOW PROCESS/PRIV  .. Process privileges:S6  ACNT                 may suppress accounting messages1  ALLSPOOL             may allocate spooled device 0  ALTPRI               may set any priority value ..=  WORLD                may affect other processes in the worldf .. $m   	Now, from i  Y $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$GETSYI("NODENAME")+" "+F$GETSYI("ARCH_NAME")+" "+F$GETSYI("VERSION"). SBCHA1 Alpha V6.2v  : 	and a freshly open DECterm, and a priviledged account -->  t $ show proc/id=280000C1 G %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violationg $ show proc/priv .. Process privileges: 6  ACNT                 may suppress accounting messages1  ALLSPOOL             may allocate spooled devicee0  ALTPRI               may set any priority value ..=  WORLD                may affect other processes in the world  ..  $ 	from the SYSTEM account (same node) $ show proc/priv .. Process privileges:-6  ACNT                 may suppress accounting messages1  ALLSPOOL             may allocate spooled device 0  ALTPRI               may set any priority value ..=  WORLD                may affect other processes in the world  ..   	or if you prefer -->U  7 $ write sys$output f$priv("ALTPRI")+" "+f$priv("WORLD")y	 TRUE TRUE    	now $ show proc/id=280000C1 G %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violationc      > 	I have never seen this before whenever all nodes were on 6.2.  3 	Now : is this enough to attract some attention ???            --  6                   Jerome LAURET S.U.N.Y. @ Stony Brook$        ,,,,,      Dept. of Chemistry+       ( o o )     Stony Brook NY 11794-3400 ;   ---m---U---m--------------------------------------------- &   E-mail: jlauret@mail.chem.sunysb.edu<   URL   : http://nucwww.chem.sunysb.edu/jlauret/jlauret.html   ------------------------------    Date: 21 Apr 2000 11:08:59 -0500/ From: jlauret@?.chem.sunysb.edu (Jerome LAURET)s" Subject: Re: ALTPRI and OpenVMS7.2. Message-ID: <39006f0b_3@dilbert.ic.sunysb.edu>  \ In article <8dpn8s$3ue$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "Kenneth Randell" <kenr@datametrics.com> writes:N |>If the target process is on a remote node, then this is a known problem., at |>least on VMS 7.2-1.f |> |>Reference: |>N |>http://ftp.service.digital.com/patches/public/Readmes/vms/dec-axpvms-vms721_ |>update-v0100--4.README |>
 |>Ken Randell  |>
 	Ah ! ah !  ? 	This sounds like the proper answer (or at least a good start).h  6 	Thanks for this : the correct thing to do is to apply^ http://ftp.service.digital.com/patches/public/Readmes/vms/dec-axpvms-vms72_sys-v0300--4.README  I 	which fixes apparently fixes the problem for OpenVMS7.2 (in other words,  not in the same patch kit).-  E 	Thanks a Zillion for the 7.2-1 pointer which lead me to find the 7.2n) pointer ... I'll apply the patch ASAP ...          --  6                   Jerome LAURET S.U.N.Y. @ Stony Brook$        ,,,,,      Dept. of Chemistry+       ( o o )     Stony Brook NY 11794-3400t;   ---m---U---m---------------------------------------------e&   E-mail: jlauret@mail.chem.sunysb.edu<   URL   : http://nucwww.chem.sunysb.edu/jlauret/jlauret.html   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:21:06 +0200s$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch>- Subject: Re: Backup Strategies for Enterprised+ Message-ID: <VA.00000010.185e2e35@sture.ch>   D In article <YWJL4.9953$L7.1563461@news-west.usenetserver.com>, Jack  Peacock wrote: > 5 > "Alan Fay" <alanfay@webcode.co.uk> wrote in message $ > news:8dnls6$24c$1@supernews.com... > >m; > > The OpenVMS client is the client side implementation ofs6 > > NetBackup. This client will work with all UNIX and< > > Windows NT NetBackup servers. Backup data flows from the8 > > VMS client, over a TCP/IP network to the server, and* > > then onto backup disk or tape devices. > >eJ > Umm, how do you restore a VMS system disk with this product?  That's oneI > of the problems with the NT backup programs, you always have to rebuildfJ > a base system then restore the backup tape.  It's much faster to restoreJ > a BACKUP image tape on VMS, worst case is a boot from CD-ROM on Alpha or > from tape on a VAX.c >eE There's a better way with NT. Put a second installation of NT on the eI system. I call this a "maintenance boot" This can live on the same disk, dK if you want, and I'd actually stick one on as many disks as are available, @H space permitting. Just install enough of it to get access to your disks  and tape drive.   I When your system chokes (registry, corrupt dll etc... the list goes on), EK boot to your maintenance version, delete the production directory tree and > restore from tape.  H It worked for me when I was doing NT full time, and whenever NT started F misbehaving badly I could be back up and running within the hour (2Gb E system disk, full restore from a DAT - 2 hours if I ran with verify).   H The other advantage was that I could often repair corrupted files which G were impossible to restore on a running system due to "file in use" or t some such message.  H There is another solution, to be found at www.ultrabac.com. Not only is I this the fastest NT backup I tried, but reliable, fast, and would backup aI to removable disk too. And it can boot some form of standalone system to rG do a restore. Not cheap, but I got good recommendations from those who s= bought it (and they actually did a native Alpha version too).A   <rest snipped>  
 Paul Sture Switzerlandt   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:08:12 GMTi7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>a- Subject: Re: Backup Strategies for Enterprisem- Message-ID: <39007DBB.93BF3679@earthlink.net>    Don Rogstad wrote: >  > Our current environment has lots of Sun boxes, Digital Unix boxes, Windows NT boxes and of course, OpenVMS VAX and Alpha machines.  We are now looking for ways to consolidate the backup process from multiple machines / platforms.n >  > Does anyone consolidate backups from various platforms?   What products do you use?   Given the reliability of OpenVMS backup, I would like to use OpenVMS as the backup server, but this is not necessarily a requirement.d >  >     It looks like Compaq has two solutions.   One, ABS and the other Legato.  Has anyone used Legato Networker?  Wasn't ABS sold to CA?   Anyone used either one for multiple platform backups?  > 8 >    Your thoughts and ideas on backups are appreciated.  @ "Network" backups need a robust, extremely fast/wide "backbone".  C I tend to view "network backup" and "enterprise" as constituting an)	 oxymoron.o   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsi" http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:21:08 +0200h$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch>2 Subject: Re: Calculating Discordian dates from DCL+ Message-ID: <VA.00000011.185e35ef@sture.ch>-  D In article <38FE1596.FB176413@netscapeonline.co.uk>, Mpatt644 wrote: >  > Hi,oJ >  Working in the finance sector I keep getting asked for the current dateI > in Discordian format, I couldn't find any routines or lexicals to do it4E > for me so I hacked together the attached bit of DCL. I though't I'dcI > share it here in case anyone else find's it usefull. Obviously the moon & > phases part is just a bit of fun ;-) >  ????  J I may be missing the point here, but what has the Discordian format to do  with the finance sector? __
 Paul Sture Switzerlandl   ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 12:48:31 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)2 Subject: Re: Calculating Discordian dates from DCL6 Message-ID: <8dpimv$jdp$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  R In article <VA.00000011.185e35ef@sture.ch>, Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch> writes:E :In article <38FE1596.FB176413@netscapeonline.co.uk>, Mpatt644 wrote:sK :I may be missing the point here, but what has the Discordian format to do   :with the finance sector?   K   When you mix engineers with finance folks, discord is not unheard of. :-)k  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:58:47 +0200 2 From: martin@RADIOGAGA.HARZ.DE (Martin Vorlaender)2 Subject: Re: Calculating Discordian dates from DCL; Message-ID: <39007ab7.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>t  % Paul Sture (sture.ch@sture.ch) wrote:r : Mpatt644 wrote:uL : >  Working in the finance sector I keep getting asked for the current date : > in Discordian format, ...t :  : ???? : L : I may be missing the point here, but what has the Discordian format to do  : with the finance sector?  , Perhaps he's one of the Gnomes of Zurich :-)   cu,-   Martin --D                        |  Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmer1   OpenVMS: When you    |  work: mv@pdv-systeme.de H   KNOW where you want  |        http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/8   to go today.         |  home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:22:39 GMT  From: rintanikkola@my-deja.com Subject: Cannot open display... ) Message-ID: <8dpo75$b6i$1@nnrp1.deja.com>r  C I have two network interface card in my vms node. I have configureda? them in different IP-subnets. I can telnet, ftp etc. using bothpD IP-subnets but I can use only one IP-subnet to direct the display of DEC Windows application.  ' Here more details about the problem ...-F In order to eliminate possible errors I have unconnected the node fromB the network and directing the display to its own ip-addresses i.e. NodeA and NodeB below.C Ip-address which I have configured first always work -the other onem no :(.     $ tcpip show version  8   DIGITAL TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.06   on a AlphaServer 1200 5/533 4MB running OpenVMS V7.2  + $ set display/create/node=NodeA/trans=tcpip. $ run decw$examples:ico.exeo .....h    works ok.  + $ set display/create/node=NodeB/trans=tcpipo $ run decw$examples:ico.exe  Cannot open displaym+ : non-translatable vms error code: 0x3D0294y1 %mcr-f-reject, connect to network object rejected)   $t  B Does anyone know if this is really the feature of "TCP/IP Services0 for VMS"-package or have I done something wrong?  ! Best regards, Matti Rinta-Nikkola     & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:34:22 -0400n0 From: arturo saavedra <arturo.saavedra@wcom.com>" Subject: Console Firmware From VMS8 Message-ID: <001901bfaba7$110b3ae0$8fb024a6@wcomnet.com>   Hi all..  P Wondering if there was anyway to find out what the console firmware rev/level is= from VMS on an Alpha workstation 500au running OpenVMS 7.2-1.r   Thanks!!   Art1   ------------------------------    Date: 21 Apr 2000 17:53:37 +0200* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)& Subject: Re: Console Firmware From VMS* Message-ID: <39007981$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  k In article <001901bfaba7$110b3ae0$8fb024a6@wcomnet.com>, arturo saavedra <arturo.saavedra@wcom.com> writes:sQ >Wondering if there was anyway to find out what the console firmware rev/level ism> >from VMS on an Alpha workstation 500au running OpenVMS 7.2-1.  1 Do you want more than F$GETSYI("CONSOLE_VERSION")Z' and F$GETSYI("PALCODE_VERSION") shows ?P   -- f< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888t< FBFV/Information Services           E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netF <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     PSImail PSI%(0232)281001141::EPLANH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"N "VMS is today what Microsoft wants Windows NT V8.0 to be!" Compaq, 22-Sep-1998   ------------------------------    Date: 21 Apr 2000 17:58:26 +0200* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)& Subject: Re: Console Firmware From VMS* Message-ID: <39007aa2$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  k In article <8dptdi$neq$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:. >[good info snipped]  $ btw: Can you explain the following ?   $ sh cpu/fu    MARS, a AlphaServer 2100 5/250 ...$  PALCODE: Revision Code = 1.20-01"          PALcode Compatibility = 3&          Maximum Shared Processors = 4 ...o! $ x = F$GETSYI("PALCODE_VERSION")  $ SHOW SYMBOL X    X = "1.20-3          "   jfco   -- i< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 < FBFV/Information Services           E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netF <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     PSImail PSI%(0232)281001141::EPLANH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"N "VMS is today what Microsoft wants Windows NT V8.0 to be!" Compaq, 22-Sep-1998   ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 15:51:14 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)& Subject: Re: Console Firmware From VMS6 Message-ID: <8dptdi$neq$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  k In article <001901bfaba7$110b3ae0$8fb024a6@wcomnet.com>, arturo saavedra <arturo.saavedra@wcom.com> writes:-  Q :Wondering if there was anyway to find out what the console firmware rev/level is.> :from VMS on an Alpha workstation 500au running OpenVMS 7.2-1.      Some of the available options:         o use SDA:         $ ANALYZE/SYSTEM       SDA> CLUE CONFIG	       ...A         o use a DCL lexical:  %       $ x=f$getsyi("PALCODE_VERSION")b       $ sho sym x          X = "5.56    ........"       $r         o use the DCL command:         $ SHOW CPU/FULLe    8     o Look at the CPU entries in the system error log...      #   Probably a few other ways, too...i  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:13:39 -0400l0 From: arturo saavedra <arturo.saavedra@wcom.com>& Subject: RE: Console Firmware From VMS8 Message-ID: <002001bfabac$8e43dd00$8fb024a6@wcomnet.com>  O Thanks!!  All answers helped greatly.. sure beats having to shutdown servers toh	 find out.s   ABSS  H In article <001901bfaba7$110b3ae0$8fb024a6@wcomnet.com>, arturo saavedra" <arturo.saavedra@wcom.com> writes:  N :Wondering if there was anyway to find out what the console firmware rev/level is> :from VMS on an Alpha workstation 500au running OpenVMS 7.2-1.      Some of the available options:         o use SDA:         $ ANALYZE/SYSTEM       SDA> CLUE CONFIG	       ...s         o use a DCL lexical:  %       $ x=f$getsyi("PALCODE_VERSION")S       $ sho sym xe         X = "5.56    ........"       $          o use the DCL command:         $ SHOW CPU/FULLn    8     o Look at the CPU entries in the system error log...      #   Probably a few other ways, too...   N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 21 Apr 2000 19:15:04 +0200* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)& Subject: Re: Console Firmware From VMS* Message-ID: <39008c98$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  H In article <39008BB8.614563FD@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> writes:C >And now a small question from me, do you also know how to show the I >system serial number from VMS (AY1234567 etc.) assuming it is registerede >in the Bios ?    Hoff already answered this, too. $ SHOW CPU/FULL    at least on my AlphasX   --  < Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888o< FBFV/Information Services           E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netF <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     PSImail PSI%(0232)281001141::EPLANH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"N "VMS is today what Microsoft wants Windows NT V8.0 to be!" Compaq, 22-Sep-1998   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:11:19 GMTp From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>& Subject: Re: Console Firmware From VMS' Message-ID: <39008BB8.614563FD@home.nl>    Hoff Hoffman wrote:g > m > In article <001901bfaba7$110b3ae0$8fb024a6@wcomnet.com>, arturo saavedra <arturo.saavedra@wcom.com> writes:  > S > :Wondering if there was anyway to find out what the console firmware rev/level isl@ > :from VMS on an Alpha workstation 500au running OpenVMS 7.2-1. > " >   Some of the available options: >  >     o use SDA: >  >       $ ANALYZE/SYSTEM >       SDA> CLUE CONFIG >       ...  >  >     o use a DCL lexical: > ' >       $ x=f$getsyi("PALCODE_VERSION")a >       $ sho sym x,  >         X = "5.56    ........"	 >       $o  & I assume you mean "CONSOLE_VERSION" ??  B And now a small question from me, do you also know how to show theH system serial number from VMS (AY1234567 etc.) assuming it is registered
 in the Bios ?    regards,   Dirk   >  >     o use the DCL command: >  >       $ SHOW CPU/FULLl > : >     o Look at the CPU entries in the system error log... > % >   Probably a few other ways, too...e > P >  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------N >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:47:38 -0400f- From: norm lastovica <nlastovi@us.oracle.com>f& Subject: Re: Console Firmware From VMS- Message-ID: <3900862A.19AD99F7@us.oracle.com>    sure - 	$ ANAL/SYSd 	sda> CLUE CONFIG-   arturo saavedra wrote: > 
 > Hi all.. > R > Wondering if there was anyway to find out what the console firmware rev/level is? > from VMS on an Alpha workstation 500au running OpenVMS 7.2-1.  > 
 > Thanks!! >  > Art    -- e< norm lastovica / oracle rdb engineering / usa / 603.897.3505  reply to: nlastovi@us.oracle.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:21:03 +0200-$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch>* Subject: Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it!+ Message-ID: <VA.0000000d.185e2376@sture.ch>-  > In article <2000Apr20.132311.1@eisner>, Larry Kilgallen wrote: > Newsgroups: comp.os.vmsR4 > From: kilgallen@eisner.decus.org (Larry Kilgallen), > Subject: Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it!- > Reply-To: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospamn% > Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 17:23:11 GMT> > d > In article <38FF3714.8B567F7F@vl.videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> writes: > N > > What I would suggest is that Decpaq focus on providing an NCP interface to. > > decnet-5 (one that is complete and works). > G > A complete NCP interface is not possible, as Phase V does not supporttI > SET EXEC DEFAULT ACCESS NONE, SET NODE <nodename> ACCESS INCOMING, etc.  >p` And that point is particularly relevant after the 'incident' our friends at a certain financial  institution reported here.  d What could folks have recommended if they had been using Phase V? Yes, I'm using it, so it would be  nice to know...   
 Paul Sture Switzerlando   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:27:49 -0400e* From: David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>* Subject: Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it!- Message-ID: <38FFD8C5.FEDC5704@tsoft-inc.com>-   Terry Kennedy wrote: > 4 > Antonio Carlini <carlini@true.lkg.dec.com> writes:R > > AFAIK no group has resources sloshing around just looking for something to do.R > > Adding DECnet4-over-TCP will mean taking resources away from something else. IR > > don't recall whether DECnet4 support is done by EDS or by VMS Eng. If it's theQ > > former then there will be a real, visible cost to be paid, if it's the lattermI > > then someone gets to choose which current project to delay or cancel.  > K >   All the way back to the Digital days, management made decisions withouthI > considering what the customers wanted. "Prior Version Support" is a way K > to charge customers who don't see the value in moving to a newer release, B > either out of inertia or because they don't see it as a benefit. > L >   Before PVS, there were many customers running old VMS releases. I forgetK > if it was VMS V4.x to V5.x or V5.x to V6.x, but the CSC started a program,K > to actually perform the upgrades for the customers in order to try to getIL > them to move up. At one site where I consulted, the customer backed up hisN > system, sent the tapes to the CSC, they restored the system and upgraded it,M > then sent the tapes back, all over a long weekend. I'm pretty sure this waseM > V4 to V5, as there was a license fiasco as well as many, many problems withn
 > the system.s > J >   There were/are *huge* groups of customers parked at V4.7 and V5.5 (andM > the V5.5 dash releases) who simply said "hell no, we won't go" because theytL > saw no benefit to upgrading. Until most of my customers migrated to Alphas< > at V7.2-1, they all ran VMS V5.5-2H4 and similar releases. > L >   Rather than using progressively larger sticks to hit the customers (likeI > PVS uplifts, and then saying "yup, it's a bug but we won't fix it, even L > though you're paying extra for us to support you"), Compaq should find outL > why the customers don't want to upgrade and, in the cases where it is pos- > sible, address those issues. > K >   For example, the thing that made it worthwhile for most of my customerswI > to upgrade were the directory performance fixes in V7.2 - they went outbK > and bought DS10's and DS20's to replace their VAXes, mostly for this sin-m
 > gle fix.  G I don't understand this point.  V7.2 runs fine on VAX hardware, and themM directory enhancements are (to the best of my knowledge) the same for VAX and  Alpha.   Dave  M >   In the case of DECnet, the Phase V syntax is ugly, there's far less field N > experience with it, and for many customers it doesn't provide any additionalN > features. And for the folks who want DECnet-over-IP, I guess the majority ofM > them feel the pain isn't worth the benefit - that's certainly the only rea-uL > son I can see for them paying more to continue Phase IV support *and* buy-M > ing Cisco routers to tunnel DECnet over IP. There's a market here, and Com-rJ > paq is missing out on it, regardless of whether they want to admit it orL > not. Compaq could charge extra for the DECnet-over-IP support for Phase IVM > and some customers would buy it - as long as it's cheaper than the softwaret1 > for the Cisco routers that does the same thing.k > 6 >         Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.com7 >         terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USAA >    -- u4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596; 170 Grimplin Road               E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.comk Vanderbilt, PA  15486w   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:15:14 GMT ( From: Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com>* Subject: Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it!' Message-ID: <FtDH1E.18C@spcuna.spc.edu>g  , David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:L >>   For example, the thing that made it worthwhile for most of my customersJ >> to upgrade were the directory performance fixes in V7.2 - they went outL >> and bought DS10's and DS20's to replace their VAXes, mostly for this sin- >> gle fix.1 >1I > I don't understand this point.  V7.2 runs fine on VAX hardware, and theaO > directory enhancements are (to the best of my knowledge) the same for VAX ando > Alpha.  K   Indeed, 7.2 does run fine on VAXen. But my point was that these customersdL had money to spend, but *Compaq* didn't get any until the customer perceivedJ there was something of value. Once that happened, the customers bought farK more stuff (Alphas, media+doc kits, software updates, etc.) than the single J feature in question would seem to be worth. In other words, once there wasK something of value, the customer did a complete upgrade to a "modern" plat-c form.   - 	Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.coma5         terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USAm   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:32:46 -0400<0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>* Subject: Re: Dropping DECnet..don't do it!/ Message-ID: <390090BD.ACAC01C2@vl.videotron.ca>h   Terry Kennedy wrote:M >   Indeed, 7.2 does run fine on VAXen. But my point was that these customersoN > had money to spend, but *Compaq* didn't get any until the customer perceived > there was something of value.-  K No, I would think that no money was being spent because customers perceivedcK VMS as dead and their existing system were in "maintenance" mode until they  could be replaced with NT/UNIX.(  L Palmer announces VMS is dead. What do customers do ? They remain on the sameH version of VMS, put these systems on maintenance mode, develop/buy otherK systems (NT/UNIX) while keeping those legacy applications on that remainingI
 VMS machine. s  J What is left of those 5.5-2 VAXes stuck around in maintenance mode and theI load grew slowly (as opposed to all the new stuff that was being spent on   quickly growing  NT/UNIX boxes).  N Eventually, those 5.5-2 slowly-growing boxes were outgrown  and an upgrade was now necessary.  J It is also possible that their legacy applications on 5.5-2 were no longerN supported and they had to upgrade to a newer VMS on alpha to get a new release of the software.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:14:48 GMT-7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>o Subject: Re: EMC Disk Storage - Message-ID: <39007F3A.D51F628E@earthlink.net>p   Paul M Boynton wrote:o > H > We are in the process of evaluating EMC disk storage to replace Compaq > StorageWorksP > controllers and disk on an OpenVMS CI cluster. Does anyone have any experience$ > good or bad with EMC disk storage?  F I believe you'll find that cost-effectiveness and price/performance ofF EMC does not compare favorably with StorageWorks. Add the inability toH automate from OpenVMS, and my personal preference would be to stick with
 StorageWorks.h  @ Of course, we'd still like to see SET HOST/DUP/... work like SETE HOST/SCSI (accept HSx command(s) from command line or image data in a5 command proc.).e   -- 0 David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems " http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:51:53 GMTs* From: Patrick Coulier <Patrick@Delight.be>I Subject: Re: Further to = Re: Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not bootingt* Message-ID: <390041F1.3B9F863E@Delight.be>   Steve,  > What  value do you use for SYSGEN - MULTIPROCESSING & SMP_CPUS   Patrick Couliero  % Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk wrote:   ? > Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza  >0 > Further to the below;  >tO > I have been able to boot from the VMS 7.2-1 CDRom. So perhaps it isn't memorya
 > then... :-)b >a0 > Still can't boot from that system disk though. >a > Steve Spires > VMS System Manager > Yellow Pages > 7 > Steve.Spires@YELLOWPAGES.CO.UK on 20/04/2000 14:55:202 >r" > To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com- > cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)7E > From:      Steve.Spires@YELLOWPAGES.CO.UK, 20 April 2000, 2:55 p.m.e >r- > Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not bootingp >. > cc:  > bcc:? > Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plazaa >r- > Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not booting  >r > Dear All,t >iN > We have just upgraded an 8400 replacing the existing single CPU with two newN > ones, and adding another 2 GB of memory. When trying to boot the system, the > following occurs;A >D > jumping to bootstrap code  >e > CPU 0 halted >   halt code = 2. >   kernel stack not valid halt  >   PC = fffffffffffffffc. > P > I suspect this may be a memory related error, but haven't seen this particular > message before.e >aL > Can anyone help to resolve this? I will supply more information if needed.A > System is running VMS 7.1-2 and has a total of sixGb of memory.o >w > What else? >8A > AlphaServer 8400 4-5/625/4, Console V5.5-4 21-JUL-1999 16:27:00 @ > SROM V3.1, OpenVMS PALcode V1.21-1, Tru64 UNIX PALcode V1.23-18 > System Serial = qv, OS = VMS,  7:43:27  April 20, 2000 >D > P00>>>show memoryp@ > Set   Node   Size        Base Address         Intlv   Position@ > ---   ----   ----      -------- --------      -----   --------< >  A      5    2048 Mb   00000000 00000000      4-Way      0< >  A      6    2048 Mb   00000000 00000000      4-Way      1< >  B      7    2048 Mb   00000001 00000000      2-Way      0 >M > Steve Spires > VMS System Manager > BT/Yellow PagesD >E > [Information] -- PostMaster:F > This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beN > confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message has beenR > addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce, distribute or > use this transmission. >iN > Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee is notJ > intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have received thisH > transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message. >2 > Thank you.   ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 06:17:10 GMT+ From: "Gerke Grashuis" <g.grashuis@kpn.com>d  Subject: Re: Help With a Lexical8 Message-ID: <01bfab59$39fa7ea0$8d4c15ac@HKTGN9911301604>  < With F$GETQUI, you will need to specify much more then this.K Have a closer look at the examples provided in $HELP LEXICAL F$GETQUI, most. important example #3. K The idea is that you loop through the print/batch queues on a given system, H freeze the context to a queue you find and then loop through the jobs in  that queue for info on each job.G When you reach the end of the job list in the queue, the loop continues  with the next queue.  I Good luck (you will need that, because F$GETQUI isn't the easiest lexical  to program)    Gerke.    1 Shawn Malone <sfm1115@bjc.org> schreef in artikelh( <38ff2a6f.508113268@news.starnet.net>...D > I am trying to get the number of Print Jobs in the Queues that areG > pending.  According to the DCL Manual I have I should be able to use:- > & > Variable=F$GETQUI(Pending_Job_Count) > 7 > When I run this, I get an UnRecognized Keyword Error?a >  > Any Ideas? > 7 > I am trying this on a VAX3100-90 running OpenVMS 6.2.e >  > Thanks >  > Shawn> >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 10:33 -0400r From: hein@eps.zko.dec.c*m" Subject: Re: How to use SYS$CREPRC& Message-ID: <21APR200010332505@miasys>  d In article <EgEL4.295$L51.511@client>, "John Jenniskens" <j.jenniskens@HumanInference.com> writes...J >I am working on a group of server processes that provide services on data5 >retrieval and validation for customer (client) data.s  :K >Since the server process is expected to continue running 'forever', we usesL >SYS$CREPRC() to start it, with in the last parameter the flag PRC$M_DETACH,J >to make sure it continues running after the starting process and terminal >session end.   > 	Why not simply submit it as a batch job to a dedicated queue?A 	You'll get a free log, some additional control tools, no trouble- 	defining locicals and so on.i   fwiw,- 	Hein.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:42:59 GMTd From: itjck01@my-deja.com-. Subject: HSG80 mirror cache and serviceability) Message-ID: <8dq0eh$jvb$1@nnrp1.deja.com>A  G This may not be the right place to post, and if not please someone pray@A tell me (JKoska@bender.com) what newsgroup to post in.  Anyhow...M  > From reading the HSG80 manuals and having gone through a HSG80D controller swap with OpenVMS Alpha 7.2-1 as the operating system, it= seems that if one has the caches mirrored with dual redundantr@ controllers... that both HSG80s have to be reset during a singleF controller or cache replacement.  Or least this is what finally worked5 when my Compaq Field Service was out to swap a HSG80.1  D This leads me to believe that one should volume shadow between HSG80E dual redundant pairs to keep disk volumes online, since all the disks-E to the dual redundant HSG80 went offline and processing stopped. (The D volumes did come back online before mount timeout, but processing onF these volumes did stop)  Further, I believe it also makes sense from aA performance point of view to have volume shadowset members acrossr% different HSG80 dual redundant pairs.1  F Does anyone know the implications of the HSG80 with and without mirrorF cache enabled to data reliability?  I would guess that if the cache isG not mirrored and an error in cache occurs that is not recoverable, thens4 data is lost.  Hence, the reason for mirrored cache.  A Has anyone else gone through an HSG80 controller replacement with 4 mirrored cache enabled, and what was the end result?   :) jck JKoska@bender.comF    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:54:54 -0400 " From: Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org>2 Subject: Re: HSG80 mirror cache and serviceability8 Message-ID: <4.3.1.0.20000421125300.01d63bd0@24.8.96.48>  5 At 04:42 PM 4/21/00 +0000, itjck01@my-deja.com wrote:iE >This leads me to believe that one should volume shadow between HSG80oF >dual redundant pairs to keep disk volumes online, since all the disksF >to the dual redundant HSG80 went offline and processing stopped. (TheE >volumes did come back online before mount timeout, but processing on-G >these volumes did stop)  Further, I believe it also makes sense from aaB >performance point of view to have volume shadowset members across& >different HSG80 dual redundant pairs.  J This is true in general with any of the dual-redundant controllers. I had H to get an HSJ50 that was in a dual-redundant config messed with, and it F required pausing the other controller in the pair. It did only take a L minute or so, but that did still hang things. (My system and Oracle install ! disks were on it, of course... :)0       					Dan  I --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------n2 Dan Sugalski                          even samurai? dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and evenp;                                       teddy bears get drunk    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:25:49 GMT2/ From: "Richard L. Dyson" <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu>e5 Subject: Re: Infoserver CD-R (was: Verify of Backups)m) Message-ID: <39002CAD.5A088885@uiowa.edu>r   Gord Coulman wrote:: > a > I always thought LAD/LAST was somehow tied to Decnet.  I may just dust off that Infoserver now!  > b > As suggested, I checked the VMS FAQ for CD writing techniques.  The FAQ pointed to the followingV > excellent web page:  http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lakes/9999/vmscdwri.html > b > One method by Bystrik Krchnavy suggests writing to a hard disk partition on the Infoserver, thenb > mounting the Infoserver partition from a PC equipped with a CD writer, then burning a "raw" copyb > of the partition to the CD.  Just one catch: how do you mount an Infoserver partition from a PC?R > I hope it doesn't involve anything starting with "Path" and ending with "Works".  F 	I make OpenVMS (i.e., ODS-2) CD-R discs all the time.  I too used the above geocitesF references, amoung others.  The first of two methods I found that work best (for me) are toG master an ISO 'image file' on an OpenVMS box with a free program from an guy from Hungry thatH works on VAX and Alpha.  Then transfer the ISO file to my Win95 box with EasyCDPro and burn aF CD-R disc.  Note, I also have all the versions of EasyCDPro and EasyCD Creator and nownB CD Creator Deluxe and none of them will accept that the ISO file I provide.  Only the olderF (retired) version works.  This is a *bug* with Adaptec's software, but of course will never9 get fixed since it only is an issue for this one case. :(e  G 	The other method uses an Infoserver 1000 (which I recent picked up forr a few hundred $).aF If you upgrade it to the last release of the software (v3.5a, I think) there is a RECORD F command you can use to make an ODS-2 format CD-R disc *IFF* you have a recorder on theirmA specific list.  This includes the Sony CDU920 and CDU926, Philipsr CDD521, as well as the Yamaha C CDR100.  There are about 6 models supported, but these are the mostm common.  The source needssG to be a hard drive connected to the Infoserver.  With this disk and ther LAD/LAST protocols to H OpenVMS systems you can transparently copy files to the hard drive until you are full and= then use the Infoserver to record this disk to the CD-R disc.m  G 	The Infoserver method is much more clumsly, IMHO, but the PC/EasyCDProh method meansF you have to get a specific software that is no longer available.  Note though, I have neverG tried any of the other CD mastering software packages available.  Maybeh Hot Burn, Toast on a Mac,oE or others may be able to read the ISO image file and burn it to disc.   A 	There are also a couple solutions where you actually connect the  CD-Recorder toF an OpenVMS host and master and record entirely on OpenVMS.  This makes ODS-2 easy, but itD usually means you have to have a decicated VAX or Alpha with nothing running to steal CPUE cycles as the disc is burning...   I guess you could run the recordere software at real-timea priority levels, right?o   Rick -- pH Richard L. Dyson                                    rick-dyson@uiowa.eduH  _   _      _____                http://www-pi.physics.uiowa.edu/~dyson/H | | | |    |_   _|   Systems Analyst                     O: 319/335-1879H | | | | of   | |     The University of Iowa            FAX: 319/335-17536 | \_/ |     _| |_    Department of Physics & Astronomy-  \___/     |_____|   Iowa City, IA 52242-1479t   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:20:11 -0400s+ From: Tim Shoppa <shoppa@trailing-edge.com>o5 Subject: Re: Infoserver CD-R (was: Verify of Backups),1 Message-ID: <3900558B.6C236FCE@trailing-edge.com>    Richard L. Dyson wrote: O >         I make OpenVMS (i.e., ODS-2) CD-R discs all the time.  I too used thek > above geocitesH > references, amoung others.  The first of two methods I found that work > best (for me) are toI > master an ISO 'image file' on an OpenVMS box with a free program from au > guy from Hungry thatJ > works on VAX and Alpha.  Then transfer the ISO file to my Win95 box with > EasyCDPro and burn aH > CD-R disc.  Note, I also have all the versions of EasyCDPro and EasyCD > Creator and nowCD > CD Creator Deluxe and none of them will accept that the ISO file I=                                                           ^^^t
 > provide.  : Small nitpick (but it is, IMHO, an important distinction):  G An ODS-2 disk image is *not* an "ISO file"!  In common usage "ISO file" E seems to mean "CD-ROM image", but not all CD-ROM images are ISO-9660,F( and an ODS-2 disk image certainly isn't.  G Of course, maybe you're just copying Adaptec's terminology, and they'reiB no hero when it comes to proper usage.  After all, they sell their@ SCSI host adapters as "SCSI controllers", when a SCSI controller it is *not*.   Tim.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:19:23 -0400b' From: Ken Block USG <block@zk3.dec.com>rK Subject: Re: Is there a "Porting Unix/C Software to OpenVMS for  Dummies" ?p+ Message-ID: <39008D9B.3B1CCD24@zk3.dec.com>   , This is a multi-part message in MIME format.& --------------5823E0E9A1D018F828E1AF37* Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bite   David Mathog wrote:h  G > Not necessarily.  You get this error even if there is a return in the L > function but that return isn't the very last statement in the function.  IJ > think what happens is that rather than trying to figure out all possibleH > logical paths through a function the compiler just checks right before) > the exit for a return().  For instance:s >e; > $ cc/standard=ansi89/prefix=all/warn=enable=all sys$inputr > #include <stdlib.h>m > int testiszero(int i){
 >   if(i==0){w >     return(0); >   }h
 >   else { >     return(1); >   }a > }e > ^Z >c > int testiszero(int i){ > ^ K > %CC-I-FALLOFFEND, The last statement in non-void function "testiszero" is  > not a return statement.-' > at line number 2 in file SYS$INPUT:.;2  W You must be using an older compiler. Compaq C V6.2-003 and Compaq C++ V6.2-016, the two.\ versions I have handy, are smart enough to recognize that all paths will return and will not% incorrectly generate this diagnostic.y  & --------------5823E0E9A1D018F828E1AF37- Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii;   name="block.vcf"v Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bite+ Content-Description: Card for Ken Block USGn  Content-Disposition: attachment;  filename="block.vcf"i   begin:vcard  n:Block;Kennethn x-mozilla-html:FALSE org:CTG C/C++ Compiler version:2.1   email;internet:block@zk3.dec.comR adr;quoted-printable:;;110 Spit Brook Road=0D=0AM/S ZKO3-2/W02;Nashua;NH;03062;USA x-mozilla-cpt:;0 tel;work:603-884-2819  fn:Kenneth Block	 end:vcard   ( --------------5823E0E9A1D018F828E1AF37--   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:23:33 GMTc' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com>s! Subject: Re: Mozilla M15's out...i- Message-ID: <39006464.9F6706DF@theblakes.com>    Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:  ( > Did you see "...SFX" in my statement ?   No :-)  R I just created a ZIPSFX version of the M15 kit. Its 34422 blocks instead of 58230.  ' I guess M16 will be in ZIPSFX format!!!o   ------------------------------    Date: 21 Apr 2000 16:43:06 +0200* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)! Subject: Re: Mozilla M15's out...J* Message-ID: <390068fa$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  W In article <39006464.9F6706DF@theblakes.com>, Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com> writes:y >Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:i) >> Did you see "...SFX" in my statement ?e >  >No :-)o >qI >I just created a ZIPSFX version of the M15 kit. Its 34422 blocks insteado
 >of 58230. >e( >I guess M16 will be in ZIPSFX format!!!   Wow. Thanks an awful lot.h  M btw: How about influencing now the guys which produce the VMS ECO kits ? ;-))t   -- g< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888f< FBFV/Information Services           E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netF <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     PSImail PSI%(0232)281001141::EPLANH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"N "VMS is today what Microsoft wants Windows NT V8.0 to be!" Compaq, 22-Sep-1998   ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 15:15:44 GMT* From: bdwheele@indiana.edu (Brian Wheeler)! Subject: Re: Mozilla M15's out...l3 Message-ID: <8dprb0$ehl$1@flotsam.uits.indiana.edu>e  6 In article <8dkk3j$hpv$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>,5 	hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:u > a > In article <38FD96A4.34FC26A4@trailing-edge.com>, Tim Shoppa <shoppa@trailing-edge.com> writes:.D >:It's good news that it's out, but why is the VMS release 30 Mbytes9 >:while the other (same version) releases are 5-7 Mbytes?b >  >   WAG: /DEBUG? > 4 >:I'll give it a whirl after it finally downloads... > K >   Mozilla M15 does work here and it has fixed some oddities from earlier  K >   baselevels.  I have seen M15 hard-stackdump (once) due to some sort of /M >   resource exhaustion error.  (I couldn't trap the details, unfortunately.)v > P >  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------N >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com >   , Dumb question:  can it be built for the VAX?   Brianl   ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 15:18:09 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)! Subject: Re: Mozilla M15's out...n6 Message-ID: <8dprfh$mqt$2@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  W In article <390068fa$1@news.kapsch.co.at>, eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER) writes:PN :btw: How about influencing now the guys which produce the VMS ECO kits ? ;-))     I'll pass it along.p  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 21 Apr 2000 11:09 -0400x From: hein@eps.zko.dec.c*m  Subject: RE: queue status values& Message-ID: <21APR200011092559@miasys>  x In article <EA5FE99F5DEAD311A6CB00805F199992BCA80C@misnts1.dalsemi.com>, Don Rogstad <Don.Rogstad@dalsemi.com> writes...J >Below is a DCL subroutine, GET_QUE_STATUS, to return the queue status.  =D >Set the numeric queue status in the variable TEMP and it sets the =F >variable QUESTAT containing a comma separated ASCII string of states.  : >$STAT_LOOP:, >$   If Temp .eq. 0 Then Goto Done_Stat_Loop >$   Shift =3D Temp / 2b >$   Bit =3D Temp - (Shift * 2)  >$   Temp =3D Temp / 2L >$   If Bit Then QueStat =3D QueStat + ", " + = F$Element(Count,",",QStatus) >$   Count =3D Count + 1 >$   Goto Stat_Loope  4 Right, extract the bit and use as index to f$element Alternative 1)  D 	If the bit is in a string, F$CVSI is a handy lexical to extract it. Alternative 2)@ 	If the bit is in an interger use a MASK to AND it. For example:   $ names = "aap,noot,mies"e $ x = 0 + p1	 $ bit = 0 
 $ mask = 1 $loop:D $ if (mask .AND. x).NE.0 then write sys$output f$elem(bit,",",names) $ mask = mask * 2i $ bit = bit + 1n $ if bit .lt. 8 then goto loop   	. fwiw,  	Hein.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:09:59 GMTr* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)) Subject: Sun is no longer the dot in .comD' Message-ID: <2000Apr21.090959.1@eisner>1  @ Sun is no longer ., the Root server is no an S80.  Rather ironicE they "upgraded" from an E10000 to an S80.  Seems funny a 24 processor,F box is viewed as more powerful than a 64 processor box.  That can't beB can it?  Of course it can.  Wait until a certain 32 processor box  begins shipping ;-)p  C http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A48004-2000Apr19.htmlt   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:43:38 GMTu/ From: "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net>G( Subject: system disk move and batch jobsG Message-ID: <eWYL4.27293$WF.1111865@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>3  L We will be moving our system disk from a host based shadow set of  a pair ofK third party disks to a StorageWorks hardware based stripe/shadow set (usingIJ an image copy).  We are going to retain the same shadow device designationL (DSA9)  on the new system disk so that we may shadow this to another similarJ hardware stripe/shadow set on a different pair of Storageworks controllers later.  H Will batch jobs that are holding, and which reference input files on theG original DSA9 run properly on the new DSA9, or will they all have to be-I resubmitted.    We have a lot of them and testing is not a possibility ato
 this time.  J Reading the documentation led me to believe they will not work because theK FID changes, but one sentence I read seemed to allow for IMAGE restores.  Iu= figured that the FID would also change with an image restore.e  J Sometimes, I think I have forgotten more than I ever knew!  I hate gettingL old.  I wish we had some young VMS system managers in the pipeline.  I would5 retire, but then who would look after my VMS Cluster.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:21:51 GMT  From: briggs@eisner.decus.org , Subject: Re: system disk move and batch jobs' Message-ID: <2000Apr21.112151.1@eisner>-  y In article <eWYL4.27293$WF.1111865@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> writes:eL > Reading the documentation led me to believe they will not work because theM > FID changes, but one sentence I read seemed to allow for IMAGE restores.  Ic? > figured that the FID would also change with an image restore.G  < Should work just fine.  /IMAGE restores preserve FID values.  & 	John Briggs			briggs@eisner.decus.org   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:09:17 GMTo From: joecarlos@yahoo.com (Joe)e# Subject: ucx NFS who is doing what?l5 Message-ID: <8F1D49BCEjoeyahoocom@news.supernews.com>   J i got a little problem with my alpha. it runs oracle and a home grown app J call abc. abc is an app that runs on my two vaxes that sends calculations F to my alpha my alpha does the calculation and sends the results to my H vaxes. i did not write the program but i think when it runs it uses the G netserver image for something. this calculations usually slow down the  B server and the calculations take 3 times as much when some of the J physicists start doing massive nfs transfers. put when i do nfs transfers 7 from my pc or my linux box idle time remains 75 or so. G  J can any body tell me how to log nfs transactions on UCX this. my alpha is " loaded with vms 6.2. Thanks again.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:10:17 GMT  From: joecarlos@yahoo.com (Joe)a' Subject: Re: ucx NFS who is doing what?S5 Message-ID: <8F1D7298Bjoeyahoocom@news.supernews.com>d  # joecarlos@yahoo.com (Joe) wrote in k* <8F1D49BCEjoeyahoocom@news.supernews.com>:  K >i got a little problem with my alpha. it runs oracle and a home grown app eK >call abc. abc is an app that runs on my two vaxes that sends calculations cG >to my alpha my alpha does the calculation and sends the results to my 2I >vaxes. i did not write the program but i think when it runs it uses the cH >netserver image for something. this calculations usually slow down the C >server and the calculations take 3 times as much when some of the lK >physicists start doing massive nfs transfers. put when i do nfs transfers  8 >from my pc or my linux box idle time remains 75 or so.  > K >can any body tell me how to log nfs transactions on UCX this. my alpha is n# >loaded with vms 6.2. Thanks again.w >   ) this is a print out of my server activityeK i believe my server might be a little bet over loaded. but there is got to l= be a way to limit nfs activity, may be decreasing the threadsuE Server:   NFS$SERVER                             Loaded:  4-APR-2000 n 13:21:09.15eE Status:     ACTIVE                               Running:         16 s 21:46:54.01a  . Memory allocated            531390  RPC errorsN Message processing:                   Authentication                           0-L   Threads busy                   0    Others                                 257 4   Threads free                  20  Mount data base:N   Max. threads busy             19    Mounted File Systems                     6-M   Duplicate cache xid          188    Current users                          d 76N   Duplicate active xid       33760    Maximum mounted                          73M   Dropped                       84    Maximum users                          D 773 Data exchange:                      NFS operations:aI   Bytes sent            1384868996    null               0  getattr      g 351749H   Bytes rcvd            3071869392    setattr        33517  lookup       6736724.M   Messages sent           14145000    readlink           0  rename           y 37H   Messages rcvd           14178844    read         1967959  write        4703191sJ   Max. message sent           4196    statfs          1031  create         20448fN   Max. message rcvd           8312    remove          9128  link               0 L Open files:                           symlink            0  mkdir            884tI   Maximum opened               197    rmdir              0  readdir        318916G   Closed per interval            0  Total NFS operations               f 14143584K   Currently opened               0  Error messages                           1715   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:21:13 +0200f$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch>8 Subject: Re: Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not booting+ Message-ID: <VA.00000012.185e497e@sture.ch>n  7 In article <002568C7.00521230.00@quegw01.btyp>,  wrote:  >  > cc:e > bcc:? > Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plazai > - > Upgraded (hardware) 8400 System not bootinge >  > Dear All,o > N > We have just upgraded an 8400 replacing the existing single CPU with two newN > ones, and adding another 2 GB of memory. When trying to boot the system, the > following occurs;w >  > jumping to bootstrap codeR >  > CPU 0 halted >   halt code = 2O >   kernel stack not valid halta >   PC = fffffffffffffffcp > P > I suspect this may be a memory related error, but haven't seen this particular > message before.  > L > Can anyone help to resolve this? I will supply more information if needed.A > System is running VMS 7.1-2 and has a total of sixGb of memory.d >  > What else? > P Not at work now, so can't look anything up, but we had problems on an 8400 when S adding memory. We had to change some system parameters - NPAG* IIRC. There's a DSN c article about it.e  
 Paul Sture Switzerlandl   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:28:20 +0200f6 From: Martin Oettl <Martin.Oettl@drop-this.compaq.com>3 Subject: Re: VAX CI storage vs served fibre channelp4 Message-ID: <39001124.676A028C@drop-this.compaq.com>   John Nixon wrote:l   > Ryan,h >SI > How do I get multi-site shadow sets without host based shadowing.  Thate5 > would appeal to me, but I have never heard of that.S >sM > As for the math,  that part is simple, if you believe that in real life thesL > math numbers hold up.  You only get the theoretical thruput numbers if youJ > eliminate every bottleneck.  With CI I have come close and  can actuallyK > sustain 7MB/second, but I am not sure what kind of config I would need tor > maintain FC thruput maximums.  >    Data Replication Manager:   Y http://www.compaq.com/products/storageworks/Storage-Management-Software/DataRepindex.html    Martin   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:02:36 GMTe* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)3 Subject: Re: VAX CI storage vs served fibre channely' Message-ID: <2000Apr21.090236.1@eisner>2  m In article <39001124.676A028C@drop-this.compaq.com>, Martin Oettl <Martin.Oettl@drop-this.compaq.com> writes:l > John Nixon wrote:c >  >> Ryan, >>J >> How do I get multi-site shadow sets without host based shadowing.  That6 >> would appeal to me, but I have never heard of that. >>N >> As for the math,  that part is simple, if you believe that in real life theM >> math numbers hold up.  You only get the theoretical thruput numbers if youoK >> eliminate every bottleneck.  With CI I have come close and  can actuallyrL >> sustain 7MB/second, but I am not sure what kind of config I would need to  >> maintain FC thruput maximums. >> >  > Data Replication Manager:  > [ > http://www.compaq.com/products/storageworks/Storage-Management-Software/DataRepindex.htmlx >  > Martin >    Martin,t  % 	Nice concept for that West Coast OS:   N "Compaq Storage introduces ATM Wide Area Networking capability, in addition toG new functionality for the SANworksT Data Replication Manager (DRM), theOO storage-based data replication and workload migration solution for copying dataDH online and in real time to remote locations via an extended Storage AreaH Network (SAN). Now disaster recovery sites can be located hundreds, evenJ thousands of miles from its production site where mission critical data is generated for"  < 	But for the other OS listed at the bottom of the URL (hint:> 	this newsgroup is very similarly named) I'd rather go all the= 	way and stick servers at the other end, use volume shadowing:* 	and re-write the paragraph above to read:  F "Host-based Volume Shadowing allows real-time software based mirroringI to take places across large distances... By building a Disaster Tolerant 1K cluster, you can literally lose one DataCenter and not lose any application7A availability by re-routing connection requests.  People that lostrJ connections to the Data Center that went down can be back on line in less  than a minute."t  D 	In fact, I think it is important as a VMS professional to point outB 	that the operative word is "Tolerant" not "Recovery".  I have had@ 	to educate folks in just what the difference in terminology is.G 	Unfortunately, not just the West Coast OS has the "Recovery Mentality"rD 	The other less appealing ultimate solution for "those that can't" ,D 	is hot-standby servers at the remote site.  Get out the checkbooks.  2 	Oh, the selling point implicit in this statement:  N "Using the Data Replication Manager software, data replication is performed atE the storage system level and in the background to any host activity."   D 	Non-issue.  The Shadow Server doesn't even show up in a performance< 	report.  Perhaps there is some other hidden cost to Volume # 	Shadowing, I haven't found it yet.r  C 	Backing up a bit... the "thousands of miles away".  That's a greatFE 	concept but remote replication at that distance must be asynchronous E 	so your primary site goes down in an 8.3 Richter earthquake you havecE 	only lost a few dozen transactions that haven't been replicated yet.i 	Am I missing something there?   				RobF   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:21:05 +0200m$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch> Subject: Re: Verify of Backups+ Message-ID: <VA.0000000f.185e2b0b@sture.ch>3  C In article <Mpo5ZUXvCFvb@malvm2.mala.bc.ca>, Malcolm Dunnett wrote:8, > From: dunnett@mala.bc.ca (Malcolm Dunnett) > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms1  > Subject: RE: Verify of Backups" > Date: 19 Apr 2000 15:22:31 -0700 > 1 > In article <8dl6ku$8lk$1@info.service.rug.nl>, e2 >     helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes: > L > > In article <DldZBxkVuL3O@malvm2.mala.bc.ca>, dunnett@mala.bc.ca (Malcolm > > Dunnett) writes: l > > E > >>    Rather than use /VERIFY I do all the savesets first, then use-M > >> /COMPARE to check them all after all the sets are created. This not onlynL > >> catches errors such as /REWIND overwriting savesets but it is generally' > >> faster and saves wear on the tape.9 > > I > > Why/how?  Just curious---it still has to read them again to compare; r3 > > isn't /VERIFY doing essentially the same thing?t > A >    It depends on the tape drive and how BACKUP gets back to the1I > start of the saveset. I used to use /VERIFY and I found that BACKUP wasIK > rewinding the tape and then skipping forward to the start of the saveset,wF > so every save set in front of the one you wanted to verify had to beK > passed over along the way - slowing things down and creating extra passesnE > over the tape. On some drives ( such as the old Exabyte 8200s ) theaH > "file skip" function got executed at read speed, so it could literally$ > take hours to start a verify pass. >AK IIRC, I recall a change in backup behaviour (VMS 3.n?) where /verify would oM read the (reel to reel then) tape backwards rather than doing a full rewind. -L Fine for small savesets but it was at roughly read speed, so for large ones  it was a pain.
 Paul Sture Switzerlandl   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:21:04 +0200j$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch> Subject: Re: Verify of Backups+ Message-ID: <VA.0000000e.185e2660@sture.ch>D  @ In article <38FF0CD7.4CBFF823@ccinet.ab.ca>, Gord Coulman wrote:, > From: Gord Coulman <gcoulman@ccinet.ab.ca>' > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms,vmsnet.sysmgth  > Subject: Re: Verify of Backups% > Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:27:23 GMTU > J > An excellent point, especially in regulated environments where you might- > have a five or seven year retention rule.    >mM In the early '90s I did some work in the oil industry, and they need to keep sN seismic tapes for much longer periods. There is a small industry dedicated to K rescuing old tapes which can involve baking them in ovens and then getting -H the data off within just a few hours (the tapes are useless afterwards).  L Apparently in the '80s faster tape drives brought ceramic heads, coinciding K with thinner tape made of new materials. The net result was that tape life mE was severely reduced, with certain tape manufacturers being severely 5 embarrassed.  I And of course when I worked at a vehicle manufacturer, we had data about 1H batches of equipment fitted which needed to be kept for 14 years by law.  ! > A periodic archive to CD or DVDiK > comes to mind, except that I have never tried to write a VMS-readable CD.-M > It sounds a little complex, but perhaps worth learning.  Does anyone have ah( > proven recipe they would like to post?   Other folks have answered here.-  G > A side note:  In my opinion, one of the nicest features of VMS is thecI > ability to boot standalone and restore the o/s in one simple operation.y > N I _really_ wanted the ability to boot from tape right from my first encounter G with VMS, since I'd had it on IBM mainframes. (Bad memories of TU58's).E  
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:45:50 GMTi From: briggs@eisner.decus.org  Subject: RE: Verify of Backups' Message-ID: <2000Apr21.074550.1@eisner>$  b In article <B524D10D-2398D@165.247.26.226>, "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> writes:K > On Wed, Apr 19, 2000 6:22 PM, Malcolm Dunnett <dunnett@mala.bc.ca> wrote:l1 >>In article <8dl6ku$8lk$1@info.service.rug.nl>,  2 >>    helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes: > I >>> Why/how?  Just curious---it still has to read them again to compare; i3 >>> isn't /VERIFY doing essentially the same thing?  >>A >>   It depends on the tape drive and how BACKUP gets back to the I >>start of the saveset. I used to use /VERIFY and I found that BACKUP waskK >>rewinding the tape and then skipping forward to the start of the saveset,iF >>so every save set in front of the one you wanted to verify had to beK >>passed over along the way - slowing things down and creating extra passesrE >>over the tape. On some drives ( such as the old Exabyte 8200s ) the H >>"file skip" function got executed at read speed, so it could literally$ >>take hours to start a verify pass. > E > I do my backups with /verify, with multiple save sets per DLT tape.cF > Backup does NOT go back to the beginning of the tape for each verifyH > on our systems. It just backs up to the beginning of the last save set > and compares it to disk.   How do you know?  E > I've heard other complaints of the rewind to beginning problem, but-  > I don't know what triggers it.  D At one point, the algorithm was that if the saveset were 1000 blocksC or more, the backspace would be implemented as a rewind followed by@F a series of forward skip file operations, otherwise, as a reverse skip@ file operation.  When you fill a tape with multiple save sets ofD 1000 blocks or more, the performance hit from this is quite real and5 quite large.  The 1000 block check is done by BACKUP.g  F I'm out of touch with current features, but I believe the forward skipF sequence used by BACKUP is such that DLT seek acceleration is rendered ineffective.  & 	John Briggs			briggs@eisner.decus.org   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:30:03 -0500h) From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net>e Subject: Re: Verify of Backups7 Message-ID: <116b01bfab9e$1814c4e0$020a0a0a@xile.realm>e  ( From: <briggs@eisner.decus.organization>  @ > In article <B524D10D-2398D@165.247.26.226>, "Robert Deininger"' <rdeininger@mindspring.company> writes:i > > G > > I do my backups with /verify, with multiple save sets per DLT tape.iH > > Backup does NOT go back to the beginning of the tape for each verifyJ > > on our systems. It just backs up to the beginning of the last save set > > and compares it to disk. >C > How do you know?  L I do not personally pay attention to it, but the DLT tape drives are supposeJ to maintain their own directory of where the savesets (files) are to allowL this behavior.  It is supposed to be one of the things that make them faster than the old TK50/70 drives.  I I am not sure what operating systems and backup programs know how to take  advantage of this.   -Johno wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:27:32 -0400 1 From: schaff@iiiv.tn.cornell.edu (William Schaff)a Subject: Re: Verify of Backups= Message-ID: <schaff-2104001227320001@schaff.iiiv.cornell.edu>b  > In article <B524D3EF-2E6F0@165.247.26.226>, "Robert Deininger"" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote:  K > On Thu, Apr 20, 2000 6:10 AM, Phillip Helbig <helbig@astro.rug.nl> wrote: 3 > >In article <8dmcr0$kc0$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>, 9 > >gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) writes: w > > 8 > >> I thought I explained this already some weeks ago.  > >c= > >Right, but it was easier to just repost the whole thing...d > I > If you're going to repost the questions periodically, at least include nF > the previous answers!  We'll never make progress if we have to startH > over every time.  Why don't you turn it into a little FAQ-in-progress? >  > $ > >> >   o  /MEDIA_FORMAT=COMPACTION > F > Doesn't work on our Quantum-brand DLTs.  I think it does work on theI > Digital-firmware variety.  We set the compression using the front panelo% > push-button when initing each tape.m >  >   # Works OK for me on a Quantum 2000XT-  / Be sure to init tape as compact prior to backupm  $ $ INITIALIZE MAG_TAPE:/media=compact4 William J. Schaff        607-255-3974 / 607-227-4373) 415 Phillips Hall        607-255-4742 FAXo3 Cornell University       schaff@iiiv.tn.cornell.edue= Ithaca, NY 14853         http://www.iiiv.cornell.edu/~schaff/  -- o   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:19:14 GMTo From: briggs@eisner.decus.orgc Subject: Re: Verify of Backups' Message-ID: <2000Apr21.121914.1@eisner>2  c In article <116b01bfab9e$1814c4e0$020a0a0a@xile.realm>, "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net> writes:t* > From: <briggs@eisner.decus.organization> > A >> In article <B524D10D-2398D@165.247.26.226>, "Robert Deininger"l) > <rdeininger@mindspring.company> writes:f >> >H >> > I do my backups with /verify, with multiple save sets per DLT tape.I >> > Backup does NOT go back to the beginning of the tape for each verifytK >> > on our systems. It just backs up to the beginning of the last save setn >> > and compares it to disk.  >> >> How do you know?e > N > I do not personally pay attention to it, but the DLT tape drives are supposeL > to maintain their own directory of where the savesets (files) are to allowN > this behavior.  It is supposed to be one of the things that make them faster > than the old TK50/70 drives.  H Right, but not relevant.  It is the BACKUP image that decides whether toH implement the "go to the beginning of this save set" as a rewind/forwardF skip sequence or as a reverse skip. Tape drive acceleration has little
 or no impact.d  G My understanding (in which I am pretty confident) is that the interface C between the device driver and the tape drive is little changed fromh the days of 9 track.  $ The driver can command the drive to:  
 	Read forward 
 	Read reverse  	Skip forward n records  	Skip forward n tape marks 	Skip backward n records 	Skip backward n tape marks  	Write a record  	Write a tape mark= 	(Ignoring a few more esoteric commands of limited relevance)   C Not surprisingly, these are the same operations that a user programe can request of the driver.  G There are issues that may cause the driver to choose to emulate some of C these commands.  For instance, the driver could choose to implementrK a "forward skip 10 tape marks" as a series of "forward skip 99999 records"..  H On drives with accelerated seek capabilities (like the DLT drives have),J the drive knows where various landmarks on the tape reside.  For instance,H "the start of serpentine track 34 is 17 tape marks plus 435 records in".) The driver does not share this knowledge.   E When the driver issues a "skip 5 tape marks" command, the drive takesiE its current position in tape marks and records (it keeps track), adds D the seek offset and tries to find a match in the tape directory.  ItE it can then quickly skip to a landmark near the final destination and0F do an unaccelerated seek from there.  I've never seen this documented. But it seems obvious to me.t  F If you have a user program/driver combination that hits the tape drive@ with a series of "skip forward 1 tape mark" operations then seek7 acceleration isn't going to be worth a tinker's "Damn".z  E BACKUP does (or did) the "position to beginning of this saveset" as a A rewind, read header, forward skip 3, read header, forward skip 3,PE repeating until the desired saveset is found.  This for the case of atE save set larger than 1000 blocks.  Otherwise, it does a backward skippA 3, read header.  I have observed this to be the case and receivedt7 communication from the CSC verifying it to be the case.   E To be accurate, I don't really know whether it's a skip 3 or a skip 2eA or three skip 1's or 2 skip 1's and a read 'til tape mark.  But IyF absolutely, positively know for an iron clad, take-it-to-the-bank factF that BACKUP did rewinds/skip forward when verifying middle of the tapeI savesets and that the result was pathetic performance for my application.   & 	John Briggs			briggs@eisner.decus.org   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.223 ************************