1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 01 Dec 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 671       Contents: Re: Add a hard drive Re: Cluster Problem  Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?" Re: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?" RE: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?" RE: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM? CSC DSNLINK status" Re: DCL Error Aborts DEC C Install DEC C V6.2-008 and PGP problem DECNET OSI Proxy accounts  DECNET Proxy Accounts  DECNET Proxy accounts  DSNLink  Re: DSNLink  Re: DTSS hook? Re: DTSS hook? ES40 memory Cheap !!!!  Re: Gigabit Ethernet and Alpha's  Re: Gigabit Ethernet and Alpha's Re: How to deinstall DECwindows  Re: How to deinstall DECwindows  Linking Option on Alpha.$ Re: Mobile code, unsafe at any speed< Re: Mobile code, unsafe at any speed (was: Mozilla M18 i005)< Re: Mobile code, unsafe at any speed (was: Mozilla M18 i005) Re: Mozilla M18 i005$ re:  Re: Mozilla M18 i005 (OT to NT) OpenVMS 7.3 - The right date PAGEFILE resizing/reducion Re: PAGEFILE resizing/reducion Possible shared SCSI problem  Re: Possible shared SCSI problem" Re: Postscript to Word conversion?" Re: Postscript to Word conversion?" Re: Postscript to Word conversion?8 Re: problem while upgrading from VMS 6.2-h3 to VMS 7.2-1 smbclient socket failed  Re: SW Raid 310 and VMS  Re: Technology of US elections Re: Technology of US elections Re: Technology of US elections RE: Technology of US elections Time sensitive RE: Time sensitive) UQ:File access to NT from VMS via DECnet?  VMS and motif debugging tools ! Re: VMS and motif debugging tools ! Re: VMS and motif debugging tools  Re: VMS and NT integration?????  Re: VMS and NT integration?????  Re: VMS and NT integration????? . Re: VMS Apache and CGI - still having problems Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unix Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unix Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unix Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unix( Who =?iso-8859-1?q?=B4s_the_wizard_=3F?= Re: Who s the wizard ? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 11:21:35 +0100 (CET) : From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl> Subject: Re: Add a hard drive J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0012011044280.15281-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>  * On Thu, 30 Nov 2000, Merlier Franck wrote:   +Hello + ; +I wish to add a Hard disk IBM DDRS 34560W 4.5Go ID SCSI: 6 ;                                ----------^                *   <  Minor question: is the disk marked "W" with printed label ?=  Mean: on the disk *physically* is written name "DDRS 34560W" 8 (I am surprised) or only OS recognised the "Wide" part ?  E +It is recognized by the system: OPSU1$DKA0.... IBM DDRS - 34560W.... +                                  **********   >  The first point of the SCSI id (the expected name is DKA600:) was here from Barry Treahy.     But that is not all:   ;  You haven't say any word, if you connect the drives to VAX ; or ALPHA, VMS 5, 6 or 7 - and to narrow or wide controller.   <  Will comment the last point (narrow controller, wide disk).5  Shortly: AFAIK no chance to work if the disk is LVD; : IBM DDRS disk are produced both fast wide and LVD *without, differrence* in name. Have has both in hand.  )  Some words and long description follows:   @  *If* you start to connect the (wide) disk to narrow controller,8 then you chance IMO depends of the type of SCSI: if that@ is "normal" (narrow or wide) SCSI then may work, if that is LVD 9 - then not. Anyone who get LVD device to work with narrow * controler is requested to send a comment !:  And AFAIR the type of interface was *not* included in the7 name of disk: both names DDRS34560 ! The differrence is : visible in one of additional type number (have ~1 year ago check on IBM page).   Yes, have the disks: $ ------------------------------------ $ sh dev dka0/full  J Disk $8$DKA0: (BUK), device type IBM DDRS-34560, is online, mounted, file- [...] $ ------------------------------------  ( ...and have check the problem myself -:]  8  Some time ago have start to "add my $.02" to one answerB of Terry Kennedy (subject: "Narrow compatible SCSI controller for 3 OpenVMS...", answer to Dick Munroe). The point was:   = +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ D +  Your narrow drives are backward-compatible with both wide and LVD: +controllers. I'd suggest getting an LVD controller, [...]= +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   @ ...and the written (by me) this time (but not send) comment will
 include here:   = +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ B  Haven't check the LVD controller+narrow drive, especially haven't check any VMS supported one.?  BUT, unfortunatelly -;>, have check the reverse: LVD disk with ( narrow controller. Both on Alpha and PC.@  And will report, that narrow devices are not "simple stickable"; to LVD ones: the reason names "termination of unused byte". =  With "vanilia devices" that *was* a problem - and (possibly) 4 may be not (a problem) while using storageworks etc.    Have check what is known:: - the LVD devices requires active termination of all lines> - here are some fiddling because the differrence in SE (Single  Ended) and LVD connection< - separate terminators, where can terminate only the highest  byte are not available.  ;  The only resolution have some time find on IBM pages, here > was a point about one known producer of [this type] terminator@ and disclaimer: "we [IBM] do not guarantee that this will work".7  I *have* look for the terminator and *have not* see it 
 physically :] = +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++     Regards - Gotfryd   --  E ===================================================================== F $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME . $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 12:32:18 -0500 & From: Donald G Plugge <plugge@usa.net> Subject: Re: Cluster Problem' Message-ID: <3A27E098.BB322EC0@usa.net>    Phillip Helbig wrote:   B > In article <8NOV00.15382223@feda34.fed.ornl.gov>, Dave Greenwood  > <greenwoodde@ornl.gov> writes: > / > > helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) wrote: L > > > In article <G3oF1E.BIE@world.std.com>, moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com > > > (Michael Moroney) writes:  > > > 4 > > > > helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes: > > > > P > > > > >Let me back up a bit.  Imagine a cluster where all disks are physically   Snip...   % > Sounds good.  Still some questions.  > H > Would it be better to check if a disk is mounted then mount it if not,C > or just mount away and trust the command will be ignored if it is < > already mounted.  (What are the differences in overheads.) > F > As in the example above, mount/cluster is nice since it mounts it onJ > nodes which are already up, and normally all this has to be done just atD > boot time.  However, could one ALWAYS use mount/cluster?  It wouldI > result in some extra overhead, and is not necessary, but would it hurt?   Q I have a command routine to do something like you describe.  Basically, it mounts K all the disks it can find during a node startup.  It first uses an existing K member to remount currently mounted drives, then mounts all new drives that L appear "legal".  It uses SYSMAN to run the same script numerous times on allK nodes just to keep everything in sync.  It is a work in progress, I do have N issues I'm still addressing.  However, it does work and I do use it.  The lineO containing the word SPEEDY must be changed to the appropriate quorum node name. P I'm going to change how this is done.  There could be other site specific stuff,  but I tried to make it portable.   *** Cut Here ***
 $ GOTO EOH  N Description: Mounts all disks during node startup by running itself on current+ node and one other cluster node via SYSMAN.    Parameters:   % P1 - current state - (CLUSTER, MOUNT)   M MOUNT state indicates that script is run from remote node in order to remount L currently mounted drive with /CLUSTER.  This way they show up on new member.  M CLUSTER state creates one logical list for all mounted drives.  This puts all J nodes in sync and allows for global searches (ie $ dir xyzzy_disks:[dev]).   Subroutines:  @ REMOTE_MOUNT remounts all currently mounted drives with /CLUSTER  L MOUNT_REMAINDER mounts unmounted drives /FOR to get the label, then remountsN them /CLUSTER with the given label.  These should be all new drives on joining member.   	 Logicals:     SYS$NODE - identify current node  D XXX_MAIL Account name or distribution list, if not defined then MAIL   to current users account.    Return Status:   $EOH:  $ GOSUB INITIAL  $START: 7 $ IF F$MODE() .EQS. "INTERACTIVE" THEN GOTO INTERACTIVE / $ IF F$MODE() .EQS. "NETWORK" THEN GOTO NETWORK + $ IF F$MODE() .EQS. "BATCH" THEN GOTO BATCH  $ WR " Mode is ''F$MODE()'"  $ ! & $ ! Begin of interactive command file. $ ! Any initialization work  $ ! 
 $INTERACTIVE: % $ ! Remount currently mounted volumes # $ IF P1.EQS."MOUNT" THEN GOTO MOUNT 7 $ ! Create cluster logical containing all mounted disks ' $ IF P1.EQS."CLUSTER" THEN GOTO CLUSTER 9 $ ! Find an active cluster member other than current node  $ GOSUB GET_CLUSTER_MEMBER1 $ ! If this is the first and only node, then done ( $ IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ IF MEMBER.NES."" $ THEN# $   WR "Remote member -- ''MEMBER'" ' $ ! Define REMOTE_SCRIPT as this script  $   GOSUB PREPARE_FILE* $   IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT# $ ! Remote mount of all local disks  $   GOSUB MOUNT_REMOTE* $   IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ ELSE# $   WR "No remote member available"  $ ENDIF : $ ! Use /FOR to mount for info, then remount with /CLUSTER $ GOSUB MOUNT_REMAINDER ( $ IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT& $ IF F$GETSYI("NODENAME").EQS."SPEEDY" $ THEN $   GOSUB CREATE_LOGICAL* $   IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ ELSE $   GOSUB REMOTE_LOGICALS * $   IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ ENDIF  $ ! Update copy of this routine  $ GOSUB DUPLICATE ( $ IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ EXIT:  $   GOSUB CLOSE_DOWN $   EXIT  O Make sure the disk is available to all nodes, then copy this script to the base 6 directory in case it is running from another location.   $PREPARE_FILE: $ NODE = F$TRNLNM("SYS$NODE") % $ VOLNAM = F$GETDVI(_DEVICE,"VOLNAM") 
 $ SET NOON4 $ MOUNT/CLUSTER/NOASSIST '_DEVICE' 'VOLNAM' 'VOLNAM' $ IF .NOT.$STATUS  $ THEN $!   CSR__STATUS = CSR__ABORT = $   WR "Failed to mount ''_DEVICE' cluster wide from ''NODE'"  $ ELSE& $   TARGET_PATH := '_DEVICE''BASE_DIR'' $   TARGET_NAME := 'TARGET_PATH''_FILE' $ $   RENA /LOG  '_PROC' 'TARGET_PATH' $   IF .NOT.$STATUS  $   THEN> $     WR "Problem moving file from ''_PROC' to ''TARGET_PATH'"	 $   ENDIF ) $   REMOTE_SCRIPT = F$SEARCH(TARGET_NAME)  $ ENDIF  $ SET ON $ RETURN CSR__STATUS  < Select an active cluster member other than the current node.   $GET_CLUSTER_MEMBER: $ IF P1.NES."" $ THEN $   MEMBER = P1  $   RETURN CSR__STATUS $ ENDIF 
 $ MEMBER = "" # $ INDEX = F$GETSYI("CLUSTER_NODES") " $ THIS_NODE = F$GETSYI("NODENAME") $ CONTEXT = "" $ IF INDEX.EQ.1  $ THEN $   MEMBER = THIS_NODE $   RETURN CSR__STATUS $ ENDIF 
 $MEMBER_LOOP: 8 $ IF INDEX.LE.1.OR.MEMBER.NES."" THEN RETURN CSR__STATUS $ ID = F$CSID(CONTEXT)L $ IF F$GETSYI("CLUSTER_MEMBER").AND.F$GETSYI("NODENAME",,ID).NES.THIS_NODE -(   THEN MEMBER = F$GETSYI("NODENAME",,ID) $ INDEX = INDEX - 1  $ GOTO MEMBER_LOOP  H Execute this script from all nodes with P1 = "MOUNT" to indicate a local mount is necessary.    $MOUNT_REMOTE:$ $ TEMP_NAME := 'TARGET_PATH'TEMP.COM$ $ DEFINE /JOB TEMP_FILE  'TEMP_NAME'- $ OPEN /WRITE/ERROR=OPEN_ERROR TEMP TEMP_FILE & $ WRITE TEMP "$ RUN SYS$SYSTEM:SYSMAN") $ WRITE TEMP "SET ENVIRON/NODE=''MEMBER'" ) $ WRITE TEMP "DO @''REMOTE_SCRIPT' MOUNT"  $ WRITE TEMP "EXIT"  $ WRITE TEMP "$ EXIT"  $ CLOSE TEMP $ @TEMP_FILE= $ IF F$SEARCH(TEMP_NAME).NES."" THEN DELETE/LOG 'TEMP_NAME'.*  $ RETURN CSR__STATUS  J Execute this script from all nodes with P1 = "CLUSTER" to indicate a local logical is to be defined   $REMOTE_LOGICALS: $ $ TEMP_NAME := 'TARGET_PATH'TEMP.COM$ $ DEFINE /JOB TEMP_FILE  'TEMP_NAME'- $ OPEN /WRITE/ERROR=OPEN_ERROR TEMP TEMP_FILE & $ WRITE TEMP "$ RUN SYS$SYSTEM:SYSMAN"" $ WRITE TEMP "SET ENVIRON/CLUSTER"+ $ WRITE TEMP "DO @''REMOTE_SCRIPT' CLUSTER"  $ WRITE TEMP "EXIT"  $ WRITE TEMP "$ EXIT"  $ CLOSE TEMP $ @TEMP_FILE= $ IF F$SEARCH(TEMP_NAME).NES."" THEN DELETE/LOG 'TEMP_NAME'.*  $ RETURN CSR__STATUS   $open_error:! $ wr "Error opening ''temp_file'"  $ return csr__status  E Remount all locally mounted disks, so new member will see the volume.   
 $MOUNT_LOCAL:  $ NODE = F$TRNLNM("SYS$NODE") 5 $ WR "Remount all locally mounted disks from ''NODE'"  $ CONTEXT = "" $ ON ERROR THEN GOTO FINISHED  $ LOOP: 0 $ DISKNAME = F$DEVICE("*","DISK",,CONTEXT) - "_") $ IF DISKNAME .EQS. "" THEN GOTO FINISHED H $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MEDIA_TYPE").EQS."" THEN GOTO LOOP! No root nameM $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"ACP_TYPE").EQS."ILLEGAL" THEN GOTO LOOP! No root name  $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MNT")  $       THEN- $   VOLUME_NAME = F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"VOLNAM")  $   IF VOLUME_NAME.NES.""  $         THEN $           SET NOONK $           MOUNT /NOASSIST /CLUSTER 'DISKNAME' 'VOLUME_NAME' 'VOLUME_NAME'  $           IF .NOT.$STATUS  $           THEN1 $             WR "Problem remounting ''DISKNAME'"  $           ENDIF  $           SET ON $         ENDIF 
 $       ENDIF  $ GOTO LOOP  $ FINISHED:  $ RETURN CSR__STATUS  ; Any disk not currently mounted must be mounted cluster wide    $MOUNT_REMAINDER:  $ NODE = F$TRNLNM("SYS$NODE") H $ WR "Mount all other disks using foreign to get device name -- ''NODE'" $ CONTEXT = ""' $ ON ERROR THEN GOTO REMAINDER_FINISHED  $ REMAINDER_LOOP: 0 $ DISKNAME = F$DEVICE("*","DISK",,CONTEXT) - "_"3 $ IF DISKNAME .EQS. "" THEN GOTO REMAINDER_FINISHED M $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MEDIA_TYPE").EQS."" THEN GOTO REMAINDER_LOOP! No root  name" $ IF .NOT.F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MNT") $       THEN $         SET NOON  $   MOUNT /FOR /NOASS 'DISKNAME' $   IF $STATUS $   THEN( $     NAME = F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"VOLNAM") $     DISM /NOUNLO 'DISKNAME' B $     COMMAND := MOUNT /CLUSTER /NOASS 'DISKNAME' 'NAME' 'LOGICAL'
 $     COMMAND  $         ELSE9 $           WR "Humm, ''DISKNAME' will not mount foreign" 	 $   ENDIF 
 $       ENDIF  $       SET ON $ GOTO REMAINDER_LOOP  $ REMAINDER_FINISHED:  $ RETURN CSR__STATUS  ' Duplicate this file on all other nodes.    $DUPLICATE:  $ CONTEXT = ""! $ ON ERROR THEN GOTO DUP_FINISHED  $ DUP_LOOP: 0 $ DISKNAME = F$DEVICE("*","DISK",,CONTEXT) - "_"- $ IF DISKNAME .EQS. "" THEN GOTO DUP_FINISHED L $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MEDIA_TYPE").EQS."" THEN GOTO DUP_LOOP! No root nameD $ IF .NOT. F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MNT") THEN GOTO DUP_LOOP ! Not mounted# $ IF .NOT. F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"SWL")  $       THEN- $         FILE := 'DISKNAME''BASE_DIR''_FILE' - $   COPY /NOLOG  '_PROC' 'DISKNAME''BASE_DIR' A $         IF F$SEARCH("''FILE';-1").NES."" THEN PUR /NOLOG 'FILE'  $         RENA /NOLOG 'FILE' ;1 
 $       ENDIF  $ GOTO DUP_LOOP  $ DUP_FINISHED:  $ RETURN CSR__STATUS  @ Loop thru each disk and add name to the XYZZY_DISKS logical name   $CREATE_LOGICAL: $ CONTEXT = "" $ LOGICAL_STRING = "" % $ ON ERROR THEN GOTO LOGICAL_FINISHED  $ LOGICAL_LOOP: 0 $ DISKNAME = F$DEVICE("*","DISK",,CONTEXT) - "_"1 $ IF DISKNAME .EQS. "" THEN GOTO LOGICAL_FINISHED P $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MEDIA_TYPE").EQS."" THEN GOTO LOGICAL_LOOP! No root nameG $ IF .NOT. F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"MNT") THEN GOTO LOGICAL_LOOP ! Not mounte 4 $ IF F$GETDVI(DISKNAME,"SWL") THEN GOTO LOGICAL_LOOP9 $       LOGICAL_STRING = "''LOGICAL_STRING', ''DISKNAME'"  $ GOTO LOGICAL_LOOPi $ LOGICAL_FINISHED:2I $ LOGICAL_STRING = F$EXTRACT(1,F$LENGTH(LOGICAL_STRING)-1,LOGICAL_STRING) 6 $ DEFINE /SYSTEM /EXEC 'LOGICAL_NAME' 'LOGICAL_STRING'6 $ DEFINE /SYSTEM /EXEC  ALL_DISKS     'LOGICAL_STRING' $ RETURN CSR__STATUS   Mount on local nodet   $MOUNT:  $ GOSUB MOUNT_LOCALs( $ IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ GOTO EXITa  2 Create a logical name on each node of the cluster.  	 $CLUSTER:  $ GOSUB CREATE_LOGICAL( $ IF $STATUS.NE.CSR__GOOD THEN GOTO EXIT $ GOTO EXITi   Pre-Menu routine  	 $INITIAL:i $ CSR__STATUS = %X18008000# $ CSR__GOOD   = CSR__STATUS + %X001 # $ CSR__ABORT  = CSR__STATUS + %X00Bi# $ CSR__BAD    = CSR__STATUS + %X003  $ CSR__STATUS = CSR__GOODd $ GOSUB SET_WARNINGd  $ WR         := WRITE SYS$OUTPUT% $ _CURRENT = F$ENVIRONMENT("DEFAULT")l$ $ _PROC = F$ENVIRONMENT("PROCEDURE"), $ _PROC = _PROC - F$PARSE(_PROC,,,"VERSION"); $ _FILE = F$PARSE(_PROC,,,"NAME") + F$PARSE(_PROC,,,"TYPE")rB $ _PATH = F$PARSE(_PROC,,,"DEVICE") + F$PARSE(_PROC,,,"DIRECTORY")< $ _DEVICE = F$GETDVI(F$PARSE(_PROC,,,"DEVICE"),"FULLDEVNAM") $ BASE_DIR := [XYZZY]  $ LOGICAL_NAME := XYZZY_DISKSo $ RETURN CSR__GOOD   Post-Menu Routines   $CLOSE_DOWN: $ RETURN CSR__GOOD    Begin of batch command file.    $BATCH:o $ GOTO EXITe    Begin of network command file.o  	 $NETWORK:o $ GOTO EXITe   Warning handlero  
 $ WARNING: $ ERR_STATUS = $STATUS1 $ IF F$MODE().EQS."BATCH" THEN GOTO BATCH_WARNING  $ !t $ ! Resubmit the error handler.  $ !  $ ON WARNING THEN GOSUB WARNINGe $ ! ( $ ! Place error text into output format. $ !g $ CHAN := WRITE SYS$OUTPUT $ GOSUB OUTPUT_WARNING0 $ IF $STATUS.EQ.CSR__BAD THEN WRITE SYS$OUTPUT -  "Error -- ''ERR_STATUS'"  $ !M4 $ ! For interactive sessions prompt for user action. $ !  $PROMPT:? $   INQUIRE/NOPUNCT ANSWER "[R]estart, [C]ontinue or [A]bort? " 8 $   IF F$EDIT(ANSWER,"UPCASE") .EQS. "A" THEN GOTO ABORT> $   IF F$EDIT(ANSWER,"UPCASE") .EQS. "C" THEN RETURN CSR__GOOD8 $   IF F$EDIT(ANSWER,"UPCASE") .EQS. "R" THEN GOTO START
 $ GOTO PROMPTy  G For BATCH handling of errors.  Send message to a mailing list and exit.o   $BATCH_WARNING:y $  SET NOONs $  ACCNT = F$TRNLNM("XXX_MAIL")y7 $  IF ACCNT.EQS."" THEN ACCNT = F$GETJPI("","USERNAME") " $  TEMP_FILE := SYS$LOGIN:TEMP.TXT+ $  OPEN/ERROR=NOTEMP/WRITE TEMP 'TEMP_FILE'e $  CHAN := WRITE TEMPe $  GOSUB OUTPUT_WARNINGo
 $  CLOSE TEMPs! $  WR " Sending MAIL to ''ACCNT'"-: $  MAIL /SUBJECT="Warning message!" 'TEMP_FILE' "''ACCNT'" $  IF .NOT.$STATUS THEN - 1  MAIL /SUBJECT="Problem with account ''ACCNT'!" -l&  'TEMP_FILE' 'F$GETJPI("","USERNAME")' $  DEL 'TEMP_FILE'.* $. $  GOTO EXIT   Temporary file unable to open.   $NOTEMP:* $  WR "Can't open error file ''temp_file'" $  CHAN := WRITE SYS$OUTPUT  $  GOSUB OUTPUT_WARNINGo $ GOTO EXIT    Setup an error handler.    $ SET_WARNING:! $   ON WARNING THEN GOSUB WARNINGi $ RETURN CSR__GOOD   Output warning message.a   $OUTPUT_WARNING:- $ IF F$TYPE(CHAN).EQS."" THEN RETURN CSR__BADu# $ NAME = F$ENVIRONMENT("PROCEDURE")i $ NAME = F$PARSE(NAME,,,"NAME")y $   CHAN " "# $   CHAN "Error in routine ''NAME'" % $   IF F$TYPE(MM).NES."" THEN CHAN MM*% $   IF F$TYPE(P1).NES."" THEN CHAN P1  $   CHAN " "# $   CHAN "''F$MESSAGE(ERR_STATUS)'"  $   CHAN " " $RETURN CSR__GOOD      $ABORT:n $ CSR__STATUS = CSR__ABORT  $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "ABORTING..." $ GOTO EXIT    *** Cut Here ***   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 10:33:05 +0100, From: "Niels Roetert" <niels.roetert@pqr.nl>' Subject: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?c0 Message-ID: <907ri5$jle$1@nereid.worldonline.nl>   People,e  G Is it possible to create an bootable VMS CD with an Image Backup on it,o2 I want to restore 75 DS10's with the same VMS set.  3 If it's possible, please give me some instructions?i   TIA,  6 Niels Roetert, PQR Computer Products, The Netherlands.   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 13:07:03 +0100 (CET)r: From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>+ Subject: Re: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?oJ Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0012011245370.15281-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>  ( On Fri, 1 Dec 2000, Niels Roetert wrote:   +People, +tH +Is it possible to create an bootable VMS CD with an Image Backup on it,  
  Why not ?=  The problem may be the driver where emulates disk in CD, but.: fortunatelly on current VMS installation you get also some2 "system product" like network, Decwindows Motif...    Mount a bootable CD and do:J $ DIR cd_rom:[*ALPH*...]/total/size=all	! or /grant if you not curious -;)    *or*s  " $ DIR cd_rom:[KITS...]/tot/siz=all  ) ... the two trees are /ENTERed hardlinks.+  7  You have place on the original bootable CD-ROM to savea3 you files *and* save the "bootablity" of CD withouts fiddling with the boot-drivers.]  3 +I want to restore 75 DS10's with the same VMS set.+ ++4 +If it's possible, please give me some instructions?  9  I am not sure if this is legal: probably *formally* not,++ for the license restriction of original CD.n6  Will *suspect* that COMPAQ will not pursue anyone for reason like this, but...    To technical steps:. - read FAQ for any next step -:) (required !!)5 - get virtual disk driver from freeware CD (or compaq 6  page on where the contens is served), install it etc.4 - create a container file of size of one CD-ROM; for2  640MB that may be 1250000 block, comments for the3  exact maximum (652 "decimal MB" probably) welcome.g? - connect the VDA device, mount on CD-ROM the boot-CD and VDAx:e  (VDAx: /FOREIGN !)m - BACKUP/IMAGE CD-ROM to VDAx: $ DISM VDAx: $ MOUNT/OVER=ID VDAx:e% $ DELETE VDAx:[*ALPHA*...]*.*;*,;,;,;i" $ DELETE VDAx:[KITS...]*.*;*,;,;,;  % ...and save anywhere you save set -:)o2  Probably you get over 300000 block of free space.  # - dismount and disconnect the VDAx:b= - copy the container file to CD-WRITER and write it (probablyr  in FAQ)   +TIA,g +a7 +Niels Roetert, PQR Computer Products, The Netherlands.a    Regards - Gotfryd   -- hE =====================================================================+F $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME=. $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 13:42:35 +0100=6 From: "Dijk, Jeroen van" <Jeroen.vandijk@getronics.nl>+ Subject: RE: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?0M Message-ID: <2795B75EF003D311801A00A0C906B511A2B10B@cucexec.gbc.getronics.nl>s   Do it on the simple way.W Follow the instructions how to make a standalone backup and restore of the system disk. 0 After you booted up from the upgrade VMS CDrom. H Then you can start any image backup from each backupdevice you like too.U Of course you have to configure every of the 75 DS10 where you are ready to give themsJ the correct modparams and license, but even that you can put in a comfile.  = If you want the "upgrade" and the restore VMS CDrom the same. V The only thing you have to do is make an image backup to disk from the upgrade CD and d and put the image backup on the same disk and after after that make an image backup from disk to CD.\ Put the files that are the same for all the nodes in one or more image saveset and the files& that are different in another saveset.     -----Original Message-----1 From: Niels Roetert [mailto:niels.roetert@pqr.nl] # Sent: vrijdag 1 december 2000 10:33  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coms' Subject: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?o     People,h  G Is it possible to create an bootable VMS CD with an Image Backup on it,t2 I want to restore 75 DS10's with the same VMS set.  3 If it's possible, please give me some instructions?    TIA,  6 Niels Roetert, PQR Computer Products, The Netherlands.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 10:34:43 -0500r# From: John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com>a+ Subject: RE: Creating a bootable VMS CDROM?tD Message-ID: <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD8F7@berry.mvpsi.com>   > -----Original Message-----3 > From: Niels Roetert [mailto:niels.roetert@pqr.nl]g > < > Is it possible to create an bootable VMS CD with an Image  > Backup on it,e4 > I want to restore 75 DS10's with the same VMS set. > 5 > If it's possible, please give me some instructions?i >   J It's possible.  I did it so that it would be easy to restore my base level systems.   Here's how I did it:  L 1. Do a BACKUP/IMAGE of the system disk that you want to restore.  The image backup should be to a save set.o  J 2. Do an image backup of a VMS distribution CD to a virtual disk container4 file. (See the VD or LD drivers on the Freeware CD).  L 3. Make enough free space on the virtual disk to hold your image backup saveJ set from step 1 and copy the save set to the virtual disk (still as a save set).  r  ? 4. Burn the virtual disk container file onto one or more CD-Rs.E  = 5. You can now boot from that CD-R and restore your save set.h  /   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 11:55:32 -0500. From: "Kenneth Randell" <kenr@datametrics.com> Subject: CSC DSNLINK statust* Message-ID: <908l3c$ng$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   Hello --  ; I have been trying since 09:00 EST until now (11:18 EST) to 6 contact via telnet the CSC DSNLINK, but I get stuck at the message:  > Connecting to csccxo.digital.dsn (as access number nnnnnnn)...  5 Is DSNLINK down?  This worked yesterday at 16:00 EST.M  A 1-800-Dial-A-Prayer does not have any more information than I do.a   Thanks.r   Ken RandellR   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 17:08:34 GMTN4 From: LESLIE@209-16-45-102.insync.net (Jerry Leslie)+ Subject: Re: DCL Error Aborts DEC C InstallG( Message-ID: <mWQV5.274$XY5.10248@insync>  3 Hoff Hoffman (hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam) wrote:B : ` : In article <JJAV5.264$XY5.9560@insync>, LESLIE@209-16-45-102.insync.net (Jerry Leslie) writes: : D : :On a VMS 7.2-1 ALPHA system, an attempt to install DEC C without H : :a valid license PAK for DEC C aborts because the symbol CC$FULL_DOCS  : :is undefined. :  :   Which C compiler version? ( :   V6.2 or V6.2A or some other version? :   What installation options? : H :   I'm aware of a previous report of a similar problem with V6.2A (thatI :   exists up through FT2 T6.4 compiler), and a potential workaround for TE :   that problem is to answer "yes" to the license prompt and then to C :   ignore any IVP-related failure messages that might later arise.T :   0 V6.2-003. The CDs' package is dated March, 2000.    '   From ANALYZE/IMAGE DECC$COMPILER.EXE    )   image file identification: "C V6.2-003"T)   link date/time: 18-OCT-1999 15:36:33.30T   I'll try the workaround.  / --Jerry Leslie   leslie@209-16-45-97.insync.neto;                  leslie@209-16-45-102.insync.net is invalidc2                  (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 17:21:36 GMT,* From: chd@vms.arizona.edu (Chris De Young)' Subject: DEC C V6.2-008 and PGP problemO0 Message-ID: <908mn0$ftv$1@news.ccit.arizona.edu>   Hi,R  N So, I'm not much of a C guru by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm tryingK to compile PGP 2.6.3i under VMS AXP V7.1-1H2, and the problem I'm having isO that PGP.C says:   #include <ctype.h>  % and SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSLIB]CTYPE.H says:g   #include "common_header.h"  I and no "common_header.h" exists anywhere that I can find.  Am I missing a M piece of my C compiler?  (I doubt it, since as far as I know it's been prettycN much un-mucked-with since installed.)  If not, what's the use in having what IK assume is a standard header file try to include something that doesn't come_K with the distribution?  In any event, is there a standard "common_header.h" J that I can/should get from somewhere, or a better approach to fixing this?  	 Thanks...I   -Chris chd@arizona.eduT   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 11:23:27 -0500E0 From: "David J. Pulling" <david.pulling@fmr.com>" Subject: DECNET OSI Proxy accounts' Message-ID: <3A27D07F.2E8A473F@fmr.com>_  >  If a node is defined in the local DECnet database, creating a3     proxy for that node results in a entry such as::       LOCAL:.nodename::usernameP  H     If a node is not defined in the local DECnet database, but does have anG     IP name, creating a proxy results in an entry like DECnet Phase IV:I       nodename::username  G     The two different formats are now used and required to valid remote"G     nodes according to the transport:  either DECnet or TCP/IP.  If theNF     remote node uses DECnet over TCP/IP but the only proxy that exists is=     LOCAL:.nodename::username, the remote access is rejected.t Conversely, F     if just a nodename::username proxy exists, a remote access through(     DECnet using DECnet transport fails.  1     This also allows a problem with the sequence:Y       1. Define IP name for node  4     2. Create proxy for IP node:  nodename::username  '     3. Define DECnet-Plus name for nodeP  ?     4. Create proxy for DECnet node:  LOCAL:.nodename::usernameS  @     5. Removing proxy for node removes LOCAL:.nodename::username  >     6. Now unable to remove remaining nodename::username proxy  F     Your now stuck since when you say UAF> rem/prox nodename::usernameA     AUTHORIZE does a DECnet name lookup on nodename which returnsoE     LOCAL:.nodename since the node is defined in the DECnet database.O ItE     then tries to find a proxy containing LOCAL:.nodename which isn'tF
     there.  G     As a workaround you have to remove the DECnet database entry, flushN the G     DECnet name cache entry, remove the proxy, then add back the DECnet      database entry.m  ?     Any suggestions anyone?  I've tried quoting the nodename to 	 AUTHORIZES     but it doesn't help.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 10:00:59 -0500 0 From: "David J. Pulling" <david.pulling@fmr.com> Subject: DECNET Proxy Accounts' Message-ID: <3A27BD2B.30832AB0@fmr.com>R  H When converting to Decnet Phase v or OSI the old proxy file netproxy.dat; still contains old proxy accounts. How do you remove them ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 10:07:01 -0500t0 From: "David J. Pulling" <david.pulling@fmr.com> Subject: DECNET Proxy accounts' Message-ID: <3A27BE95.FD58A02B@fmr.com>e  H We are converting to DECNET OSI . Proxy accounts from Phase IV remain inF the netproxy.dat  file. How can the OLD proxy accounts be removed from
 this file?   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 13:29:45 GMTE& From: LeatherTop <leathertop@home.com> Subject: DSNLink( Message-ID: <3A27A6DF.27F1A78F@home.com>  D Several years ago someone from DECUS provided a command procedure toH download all of the DSNLink articles and then check for only updated andC new articles.  Does anyone know how or currently have the procedureA working?   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 08:43:00 -0500f. From: Curtis Williams <williamsca@process.com> Subject: Re: DSNLink+ Message-ID: <3A27AAE4.E3C0A9EF@process.com>_   LeatherTop wrote:h > F > Several years ago someone from DECUS provided a command procedure toJ > download all of the DSNLink articles and then check for only updated andE > new articles.  Does anyone know how or currently have the procedure(
 > working?  = It's called DSNLink_New and is available via anonymous FTP atG. ftp://ftp.wku.edu/vms/fileserv/dsnlink_new.zip     --    $  Curtis Williams, Senior QA Engineer  Process Software   959 Concord StreetS  Framingham, MA 01701YE  Phone: 508-879-6994 x308 / 508-628-4308 direct     Fax: 508-879-0042-
  USPA D-21076 2  "Computer, you and I need to have a little talk."$    -- Miles O'Brien, Deep Space Nine   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 08:38:07 -0500a, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: DTSS hook? + Message-ID: <iIr4AGSWlE7V@eisner.decus.org>L  p In article <3a2689af.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>, martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) writes: >L8 > I usually not only DISABLE DTSS, but also DELETE DTSS.E > That said, I don't know if it helps with this error (or even, why I"- > do this :-) I'm not too deep into Phase V).F >   ' $sea sys$manager:systartup_vms.com dtssP1 $!   our time service is via TCP/IP, disable DTSSS $    MCR NCL DISABLE DTSSO $    MCR NCL DELETE DTSS  E Multinet claims not to be the cause, so now I'm looking for something  else.I  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationl= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil GroupSE                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replyingo   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 10:51:29 -0500S, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: DTSS hook?I+ Message-ID: <KsDOSyv2MJk4@eisner.decus.org>   k In article <5.0.0.25.2.20001130075529.00ac6968@pop.clsp.qwest.net>, Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com> writes:A  G > No, there isn't.  DTSS and NTP are two totally independent creatures. " > What exact steps did you follow?  C My Java code was returning the wrong local time.  A quick C program,F verified that this was coming from the C RTL.  Show logical showed the1 wrong values for SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING andP SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.  3 I ran sys$manager:utc$time_setup and got the error: D UTC-F-DTSS Can not set the TDF without the Time while DTSS is active  . I verified the following in systartup_vms.com: $    MCR NCL DISABLE DTSSc $    MCR NCL DELETE DTSS  I I tried to repeat the above NCL DISABLE DTSS, and got the expected error:I3 %NCL-E-CMLSENDFAILED, error sending command request$2 -CML-E-EMAAPROB, error returned from VMS EMA agent0 -NCL-E-ENTCLSNOTSUPP, entity class not supported  C I found the release notes on changing from NTP to XNTP for Multinetu/ 4.3A, changed services, and restarted Multinet:  $ SET DEFAULT MULTINET
 $ @CONVNTP $ multinet conf/serv
 select ntp disable  select xntpU enable save restarte ^Z  D After the above change, XNTP messages appeared on the system console3 about making a small correction to the system time.F  F I retried utc$time_setup, same error.  Looking in the VMS FAQ, I found
 and tried: MCR DTSS$SET_TIMEZONE MODIFY  7 This seems to have set SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING and D SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL to correct values, and set my system clockC back 1 hour.  I used set time to bring it back to the correct hour.N  E Now my Java and C programs know what time it is, but I'm at a loss to . know why UTC-F-DTSS when I have DTSS disabled.  B Looking through the VMS 7.3 notes in the FAQ leaves me hoping this" problem will go away before April.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationb= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil GroupNE                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replying    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 10:40:41 -0500% From: "Islandco" <sales@islandco.com>A Subject: ES40 memory Cheap !!!!e/ Message-ID: <t2fha545eb94f8@corp.supernews.com>T   MS610-EA 2GB ES40 memory $7800   MS340-FA 2GB DS20/DS20E  $7900   Only 4 sets of eachF   Call asap to purchase !!!!!N   -_ Island Computers US CorporationC 2700 Gregory StreetP	 Suite 150, Savannah GA 31404" Tel: 912 447 6622  Fax: 912 201 0096  sales@islandco.com www.islandco.com  C This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and$J may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.H They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whomE they are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended2
 recipient,G please notify Island Computers US Corp immediately and then delete this  message.I You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copying  of this message is prohibited.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 16:30:14 GMT'2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)) Subject: Re: Gigabit Ethernet and Alpha'sl, Message-ID: <908jmm$kek@gap.cco.caltech.edu>   In article <y4u28pfle1.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:5 >mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:  >nG >> Do the 1 Gb ethernet cards also support slower speeds?  I think the eL >> original poster would be happy if he could boot his remote machine using M >> that one card at 10M or 100M and then have it crank up to 1G after the OS  J >> starts.  That would definitely be more elegant than requiring a second 4 >> ethernet card solely for the remote boot process. >cK >The problem isn't the speed - it is the missing boottime driver in the SRMt= >and, more importantly, a place to put the adapter microcode!I  G Let me rephrase my suggestion.  Picture if you will a 1Gb ethernet card+H that _initially_ looks like the existing 10/100 Mb card to SRM.  It willI work correctly at those speeds with the existing SRM.  So the machine can G do a network boot at one of those lower speeds.  However, at some pointiF during the boot process the OS goes into a state where it rewrites theK adapter microcode, and then continues the boot process at the higher speed.WH  That way the adapater microcode needn't live in SRM, it can reside on aI disk on the remote host machine.  Furthermore, by requiring network cards)K to have this sort of minimal boot, expand later requirement, it would allowcC for field upgrades of network cards without requiring SRM changes.    G Granted, such a card may not exist now, but Compaq certainly has enoughaK purchasing muscle to get one of the NIC manufacturers to produce one. AfteroK all, the same problem must apply for network boots of PCs, and Compaq sells- a lot of those!    David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu:? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech .   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 18:22:32 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>n) Subject: Re: Gigabit Ethernet and Alpha'saH Message-ID: <y4y9y02h0n.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  L It is easier to change the card to have its microcode in flash ROM on-board,I if you allow modifications to the card at all...exactly what the reply ofE: the Compaq person suggested was the path being followed...   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 15:53:34 GMT=8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)( Subject: Re: How to deinstall DECwindows6 Message-ID: <908hhu$nbs$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  g In article <b2HV5.4049$aH5.466691@news.uswest.net>, "Phillip D. Williams" <edhouse00@qwest.net> writes:1 >HelloJ >Is there a safe and easy way to remove DECwindows from a 3600 with a RA70 >and VMS 6.2???    Do a PRODUCT SHO PRODUCT. D If DWMOTIF shows up, reboot minimum and do a PRODUCT REMOVE DWMOTIF.  I If DWMOTIF does NOT show up, then I do not believe there is any "safe andf easy" way to remove.   --  K     Charlie Hammond -- Compaq Computer Corporation -- Pompano Beach  FL USA F          (hammond@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 18:47:16 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)( Subject: Re: How to deinstall DECwindows6 Message-ID: <908rnk$ood$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  g In article <b2HV5.4049$aH5.466691@news.uswest.net>, "Phillip D. Williams" <edhouse00@qwest.net> writes:-J :Is there a safe and easy way to remove DECwindows from a 3600 with a RA70 :and VMS 6.2???o  K   DEC 3000 model 600, or MicroVAX 3600?  Given the particular disk, I will hJ   guess this is probably the MicroVAX 3600 series system, and thus OpenVMS>   VAX.  (Please don't abbreviate the platform names!  Thanks!)  G   Since there is probably other cruft around on the disk, you will wantCI   to consider clean reinstallation of OpenVMS VAX and the other products.e  J   DECwindows includes its own tailoring facility, which would be the most E   logical approach here -- tailor it off.  DECW$TAILOR, IIRC.  Older BI   DECwindows installations did not use PCSI, and VMSINSTAL installations rI   mean that the product itself must provide a deinstallation tool.  (Off rG   the top, DECwindows provided the DECW$TAILOR tailoring as a far more tH   flexible form of the typical DCL procedure product removal mechanism.)  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:42:18 GMT ' From: Michael <maustin@nc.prestige.net>u! Subject: Linking Option on Alpha.t/ Message-ID: <3A27D4AB.CFA47893@nc.prestige.net>r  G I am creating a shared image with several functions.  What is the Alphah" equivalent to the VAX link option:   universal=<routine1> universal=<routine2>  E I do not have access to the doc set and it has been at least a couple 3 years and several contracts since I had to do this.t   Thanks,d Michael Austin DBA Consultant.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 17:57:38 +0100 / From: Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>:- Subject: Re: Mobile code, unsafe at any speedb7 Message-ID: <009F3F48.A7CC9209.19@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>0   > H > "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote in message' > news:GOSi3uE3E2RV@eisner.decus.org... A > > > There are several ways of getting code down to client PC's:? > >sE > > But the very idea of running code provided by an untrusted sourcen > > is flawed from the start.  > E > I don't think the distinction is as clearcut as you make it between0; > markup languages and code. To take an example: PS viewerse; > have security problems. Even VT terminals have well-knownG > security problems. >   K It's not a matter of whether it's a "markup" or not, it a matter of whether I the untrusted code runs in a perfectly virtualized sandbox or not. VmwarerO (www.vmware.com) is a rather good virtualisation of a complete PC, that is used G to develop things like kernels, filesystems, and antivirus software, so$I that mistakes reversibly splat a virtual machine rather than irreversiblyoI splatting the developer's real one. IBM's VM is another example, recently K reported as happily running 42000 virtual Linuxes in a single IBM dinosaur.u  D If a virtualisation doesn't have any serious design flaws, it's mostM unlikely that an accidental piece of bad code can do any harm. More dangerousIE is code written by a cracker with the intent and ability to exploit ahL bug in the virtual machine: whether that's a serious risk boils down to how @ much you trust the VM and the O/S underwhich it runs. There's noG intrinsic reason why running untrusted code in a sandbox is any riskiereI than having a real O/S (VMS!) connected to the internet. Both are safe inn) theory, but may be crackable in practice.o   	Yours, 
 		Nigel Arnot)- 		NRA@MAXWELL.PH.KCL.AC.UK                   e  7 		"In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded."o   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 20:25:11 +0800/ From: Paul Repacholi <prep@k9.prep.synonet.com> E Subject: Re: Mobile code, unsafe at any speed (was: Mozilla M18 i005)c0 Message-ID: <87wvdkjplk.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  ; Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) writes:    ...YA > >> Of course for Java it is the bytecode scheme that introducesn> > >> the vulnerabilities, not the programming language itself. > ? > > There are several ways of getting code down to client PC's:w > C > But the very idea of running code provided by an untrusted source  > is flawed from the start.u > % > > 3)  download and run Java applets  > > L > >     security model, standard, newer browsers even support downloading an > > JVMo' > >     of your own choice and use thats > > F > >     I have never heard of any security problems being found in the > > security modelH > >     and the standard. Problems has been found in the implementation. > E > The security model and the standard thus present a basis from whichnE > flawed implementations are likely to be created (if one accepts then< > premise that the model and the standard have no problems).  D There is a 5th way, but not on any PC OS thought. But, this could be engineered into VMS.  I You 'call' the outside code in a totally isolated environment. EVERYthingrA it creates is destroyed on return, and it can only access what itrA is passed on the call. So if you give it a window ID, it can onlyvB access that window and create children. The children are destroyedC on return, and you do as you will with the returned window, or filen
 or what ever.x  7 Please note I did not say adding this to VMS is _easy_!i   ~Pauld   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:49:25 +0100c= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>hE Subject: Re: Mobile code, unsafe at any speed (was: Mozilla M18 i005)o) Message-ID: <3A27BA75.97155455@gtech.com>    Paul Repacholi wrote: F > There is a 5th way, but not on any PC OS thought. But, this could be > engineered into VMS. > K > You 'call' the outside code in a totally isolated environment. EVERYthing C > it creates is destroyed on return, and it can only access what itoC > is passed on the call. So if you give it a window ID, it can only D > access that window and create children. The children are destroyedE > on return, and you do as you will with the returned window, or file  > or what ever.i  D That sound in many ways as a concept similar to Java applets to me !   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 10:26:54 -0500% From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian>t Subject: Re: Mozilla M18 i005a" Message-ID: <3a27c283@news.si.com>  7 >Java in OpenVMS Mozilla isn't supported at the moment.   L Then why is the Q insisting that it's for OpenVMS Alpha only?  With no Java,0 it SHOULD run on a VAX as well.  Why doesn't it? --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comBA Smiths Industries, Inc.                   tillman at swdev.si.comt= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventt< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 17:22:52 +0100-/ From: Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>t- Subject: re:  Re: Mozilla M18 i005 (OT to NT)V7 Message-ID: <009F3F43.CCD357A9.35@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>   I > > > MOZILLA is installed on the system disk. It requests read and writeeG > > > access for the user to the SYS$COMMON:[MOZILLA] directory. System  > > > managers don't like this.2 > > I > > The "user needs write access to the bin area" problem is being workednM > > (there are several bugs on this). But remember, installing Mozilla to thedM > > system disk is just the DEFAULT installation location. If this makes your K > > system managers squeamish just install to a different location (PRODUCT  > > INSTALL ./DEST=whatever).w > F > Off-topic, but when I was attempting to figure out how to run our NTD > desktops in some vaguely sensible way, Netscape 4.x was one of theA > programs which insisted on all users having write access to theSD > \WINNT directory. It's no surprise that locking down NT and havingF > your applications still work are mutually incompatible, but this was% > an incredibly annoying discovery...a >   K Actually, not as bad as you think. It's only a single file, nsreg.dat, thatrM requires write access. Write-protect the directory, then unprotect that file.a  F The thing I find more infuriating is that there's no way to lock usersE out of the profile manager. (I create a profile "Network User" storedlI on the user's home share, but every so often some idiot gets into profile-I manager and deletes of mangles that profile rather than simply using editgI options in netscape to set up his personal profile whatever way he wants)d  F I think write-protecting nsreg.dat would accomplish this, except that G Netscape crashes at startup if it can't write-access this file. Bleugh!    	Yours,E
 		Nigel Arnot - 		NRA@MAXWELL.PH.KCL.AC.UK                   e  7 		"In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded."    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 14:51:41 -0300!) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brD% Subject: OpenVMS 7.3 - The right dateML Message-ID: <OF87DCAD20.37E868EA-ON032569A8.006203C7@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  F Do you know what date the OVMS 7.3 will be release ? Jan, Feb or Mar ?0 The online documentation just say First Quarter.     Regards,   FC   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:24:53 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brl# Subject: PAGEFILE resizing/reducion L Message-ID: <OFB4F50B18.9FBAADD9-ON032569A8.0064CAE1@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  B If I have two or more PAGEFILEs spreaded across my disk, and these@ files are not really being used as seen below, may I consider to? reduce or eliminate one of them ? Or it's technically better toe maintain them divided ?     F PAGEFILE1_SIZE information (for DISCO01:[SYS0.SYSEXE]PAGEFILE1.SYS;1):         Feedback information.y6            Old value was 1679400, New value is 20985002            Maximum observed usage (blocks): 821792A            PAGEFILE1_SIZE will be modified to hold 2098500 blocksG  F PAGEFILE2_SIZE information (for DISCO02:[SYS0.SYSEXE]PAGEFILE2.SYS;1):         Feedback information.-6            Old value was 1679400, New value is 20985002            Maximum observed usage (blocks): 703504A            PAGEFILE2_SIZE will be modified to hold 2098500 blockse  F PAGEFILE3_SIZE information (for DISCO03:[SYS0.SYSEXE]PAGEFILE3.SYS;1):         Feedback information. 6            Old value was 1679400, New value is 20985002            Maximum observed usage (blocks): 676528A            PAGEFILE3_SIZE will be modified to hold 2098500 blocksP    
 Fabio CardosoA   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 18:35:39 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>b' Subject: Re: PAGEFILE resizing/reducion H Message-ID: <y4pujc2ges.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  N In general, the more channels you have to your page files, the better, becauseJ different page file I/Os can proceed in parallel. Now, on the one hand youN might have multiple page files but they have common bottlenecks (e.g., all offJ one adapter or SCSI chain), on the other hand you simply may not be pagingM enough that any tuning matters a jot. On the third hand, given the small file I sizes reported, if this is a mdoern system, you may not care enough about.% saving a few MB to bother either way.n   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 11:14:31 -0500-& From: Donald G Plugge <plugge@usa.net>% Subject: Possible shared SCSI problem ' Message-ID: <3A27CE60.32FD0291@usa.net>b  A I have two DS10's sharing a SCSI bus on which the system drive is B located.  The DS10's have been configured into my existing clusterG comprised of a VAX 3800 and 3 DEC3000's.  One DS10 is working just fine D while the other is experiencing what I believe are SCSI delays.  TheH only reason I say that is because I've noticed the same  symptoms when IF have an improperly terminated SCSI bus.  Basically, the node pauses orA delays during interactive commands.  For instance, I can issue a:o   $ show dev d  G command and see a brief delay midway through the output.  At some times0G the screen freezes for up to 7 or 8 seconds, then finishes its listing.tG My other node has no such delay, nor do any other nodes in the cluster.tG The two DS10's are configured in a similar fashion excluding unique SCStG and CLUSTER settings.  Below is a description of my configuration.  TheaE SCSI cabling is straight COMPAQ with all the correct Y adapters, hosta cables and terminators.d  C Has anyone else noticed this type of behavior on a shared SCSI bus?o  2 Problem: System Delay possibly due to SCSI adapter   Details:   2 - DS10 OpenVMS 7.2-1 2 - KZPBA-CA PCI-UltraSCSI. 1 - UltraSCSI RAID SBB Shelf (DS-BA356-Series)   Installed Patches:   VMS721_DQCONFIG V2.0 VMS721_F11X V1.0 VMS721_LAN V1.0D VMS721_PCSI V1.0 VMS721_PTHREAD V1.0n VMS721_SCSI V1.0 VMS721_SYS V5.0e VMS721_UPDATE V1.0   Allocation Classes:r  $ allocation class = 5 (on both nodes)  ) port allocation = 0  (for PKA non-shared)c% port allocation = 10 (for PKB shared)    SYSGEN parameters:   RECNXINTERVAL = 20 (all nodes)  G SYSGEN tuning is essentially the same for both shared nodes, other thanm unique SCS and CLUSTER settings.d  
 Sincerely,   Donald G Pluggec   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 17:54:47 GMTl% From: Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com>r) Subject: Re: Possible shared SCSI problem.) Message-ID: <908ol3$hmq$1@nnrp1.deja.com>t  ' In article <3A27CE60.32FD0291@usa.net>,d   plugge@usa.net wrote:cC > I have two DS10's sharing a SCSI bus on which the system drive isiD > located.  The DS10's have been configured into my existing clusterD > comprised of a VAX 3800 and 3 DEC3000's.  One DS10 is working justF > fine while the other is experiencing what I believe are SCSI delays.F > The only reason I say that is because I've noticed the same symptomsE > when I have an improperly terminated SCSI bus.  Basically, the nodeaD > pauses or delays during interactive commands.  For instance, I can
 > issue a: >o > $ show dev d >nC > command and see a brief delay midway through the output.  At somerF > times the screen freezes for up to 7 or 8 seconds, then finishes itsE > listing. My other node has no such delay, nor do any other nodes indA > the cluster. The two DS10's are configured in a similar fashioneD > excluding unique SCS and CLUSTER settings.  Below is a descriptionD > of my configuration.  The SCSI cabling is straight COMPAQ with all6 > the correct Y adapters, host cables and terminators. > E > Has anyone else noticed this type of behavior on a shared SCSI bus?e >s4 > Problem: System Delay possibly due to SCSI adapter   Excellent guess ! See below:  
 > Details: >c > 2 - DS10 OpenVMS 7.2-1 > 2 - KZPBA-CA PCI-UltraSCSI   Too bad:H http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/options/asds10/asds10___-kzpba-ca.html says:D "* For VMS:.3           * OpenVMS SCSI Clustering not supported."t  F You will need 2 KZPBA-CB adapters, two differential terminators and...  0 > 1 - UltraSCSI RAID SBB Shelf (DS-BA356-Series)  D ... a differential I/O module. A DS-BA35X-DA, if I recall correctly.C Please check the documentation that (hopefully) came with your box.    > Installed Patches: [...]n  D Do not forget to assign different SCSI IDs to both KZPBA-CB (7 + 6).C If you need a drive in slot 6, then you can turn on high-addressing>> for the box - disks will start with SCSI ID 8 and go up to 14.0 Again, this is in the manual for the I/O module.   > Allocation Classes:e > & > allocation class = 5 (on both nodes) > + > port allocation = 0  (for PKA non-shared)O' > port allocation = 10 (for PKB shared)u [...]o  D I usually give all systems different host allocation classes so thatC the IDE CD-ROM drives inherit them. I vague recall (although I havehC never tried this out) that it is (was?) not possible to assign PACs B to IDE devices and there could be problems when doing MOUNT/SYSTEM@ on several nodes with different devices that share the same name in a VMScluster.B (Anyone feel free to correct my if this is wrong or possible now).  : Next, I increment the allocation class for each bus. E.g.: Host 1, allocation class = 10e   PKA0, " = 11 (internal)l   PKB0, " = 12 (tape)>   PKC0, " = 1  (shared bus)5 ...9 Host 2, allocation class = 20    PKA0, " = 21 (internal)n   PKB0, " = 1  (shared bus)e   PKC0 - does not existE  
 Good luck!   --
 Uwe Zessin    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 08:53:39 +0100 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>r+ Subject: Re: Postscript to Word conversion?c) Message-ID: <3A275902.AEEBB103@gtech.com>h   byatesiii@my-deja.com wrote:H > We use the Unicenter Performance Manager for VMS to produce PostscriptD > graphs showing performance statistics, that we normally print to a > Postscript printer... I > However, management wants a way to convert these into a format readabled
 > by Word.D > We have found a Ghostscript converter, that is a manual one-by-oneB > process (on a PC) to convert each graph, taking several minutes. > Any suggestions?G > Even if we convert these, we are afraid the resulting file(s) will bep8 > extremely large. I would rather send the ascii graphs!I > I have in the past ran these interactively to a Regis graphics terminalaI > emulator and ctrl-prtscrn and paste into Word. The resulting files were-* > huge, thanks to 24-bit color defaults...  A A perfect conversion from PS to Word are probably impossible. Butt ofcourseG it is possible to convert PS to some graphics and then import that into  Word.i  2 You can get Ghostscript for VMS, if you want that.  D The best approach would probably be to get that Unicenter program to generate something different than PS.   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:41:29 GMTo From: byatesiii@my-deja.come+ Subject: Re: Postscript to Word conversion?-) Message-ID: <908gr8$aku$1@nnrp1.deja.com>:  ) In article <3A275902.AEEBB103@gtech.com>,l@   Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote: >sC > A perfect conversion from PS to Word are probably impossible. ButK
 > ofcourseD > it is possible to convert PS to some graphics and then import that into > Word.o >.4 > You can get Ghostscript for VMS, if you want that. >cF > The best approach would probably be to get that Unicenter program to
 > generate > something different than PS. >t > Arne > G We are at the latest and greatest Unicenter for TNG product, that addedkF absolutely nothing (besides ability to continue working under VMS 7.2) to the product. B Apparently, ASCII, Regis, and Postscript is it. And, try to find a Regis Converter (:-{)...  B Hmm, Ghostscript for VMS? I searched long and hard for postscript,? found alot of unix/linux stuff, but no VMS. Will try again! Got  pointers, anyone?aA Thanks in advance... This probably seemed off topic, esp. since IrF didn't stress that I would like our Alpha's to assume the conversion -G preferably to adobe .pdf, as I have learned the ultimate need is to pute! this information on a web site...x    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.i   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 16:46:40 GMTe2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)+ Subject: Re: Postscript to Word conversion?r, Message-ID: <908klg$kek@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  G In article <908gr8$aku$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, byatesiii@my-deja.com writes:h >eC >Hmm, Ghostscript for VMS? I searched long and hard for postscript, @ >found alot of unix/linux stuff, but no VMS. Will try again! Got >pointers, anyone?  3   http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~ghost/aladdin/get601.html!  ; It needed a few minor tweaks to build.  Contact me by email  if you have a problem.  B >Thanks in advance... This probably seemed off topic, esp. since IG >didn't stress that I would like our Alpha's to assume the conversion --H >preferably to adobe .pdf, as I have learned the ultimate need is to put" >this information on a web site...  F Why didn't you say so in the first place?  Ghostscript will definitelyB convert Postscript to PDF - I use it for that all the time.   Try:  O  $ gs "-sDEVICE=pdfwrite" "-dNOPAUSE" "-sOutputFile=yourchoice.pdf" yourfile.pst   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edut? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech     ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 10:08:58 +0100 (CET)i: From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>A Subject: Re: problem while upgrading from VMS 6.2-h3 to VMS 7.2-1 J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0012010954200.15281-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>   On Thu, 30 Nov 2000, Wim wrote:w  M +Hello when I upgrade one of our AXP's ( 1000a ) from VMS 6.2-h3 to VMS 7.2-1 @                                                           ****** +I get the following error +iK +    A search of the target disk has found that one or more system specificsG +    root directories contains a SYSCOMMON.DIR that is not an alias forcI +    VMS$COMMON.DIR.  This can cause problems, including possible failure  +    of the upgrade.  ?  I am not sure if the .ZIPped -:) response from Jan Vorbrueggen.< is enought to you: some VMS 6.2 systems has bug with the FID  of VMS$COMMON *on installation*.>  If the system was installed as 6.2 - then you get the bug not* by *you* bug but by installation CD bug :]  J +    The most common cause for this problem is backing up and/or restoringM +    a system disk without using the /IMAGE qualifier on the BACKUP commands.     Yes, but not neccessary  G +    Compaq recommends that you correct this situation by restoring the-H +    target disk from a backup that was made using the /IMAGE qualifier.J +    You can execute the necessary DCL commands by terminating the upgrade! +    and selecting menu option 7.   D  Be aware the fact that DejaNews is *limited* for less than year and; you can't see (in Deja) the expected info-vax discuission !oG  The problem *was* discuised here (this time) and the proper correctiont was was here also.  = +I then did a set file/enter from the VMS$common.dir with thea5 +DKA0:[sys0.syscommon]  but the error is still there.y    Sure.@  AFAIR the error is fired by buggy *backlink* both in VMS$COMMON *and* SYS$COMMON.DIR !   [...] 4 +DKA0:[sys0.syscommon is not an alias for VMS$common +wI +WHat can I do to solve this problem, I dont have an image backup what isr +different then this situation.   =  Hm... You have backup BEFORE the upgrade or not ? (excuse my4@ English, I am not sure if you has made a BACKUP before upgrade).>  If yes - then restore it, correct the FIDs (ask for the exactA command if reuired - the idea is AFAIR [but not sure, must check]nD to move the directory file to the "proper" [regards to backlink FID]0 directory and RENAME it to update the backlink).  7 +Please help me or do I have to do an Initial upgrade??   8  If you have current BACKUP [maked before upgrade] *and*8 some valuable config info that will not re-install, then the bug is IMHO correctable.7  If you have *before* get a real bug (SYS$COMMON be not 8 a alias of VMS$COMMON) then you can at least restore the7 previous VMS state - *probably* deleting the VMS$COMMON04 tree may be enought - suposing, of course, that SYS0 is the only system tree.    Regards - Gotfryd   -- gE =====================================================================iF $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=MEM. $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================r   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 17:04:16 GMTe From: john_20_28_2000@yahoo.comd  Subject: smbclient socket failed) Message-ID: <908lmb$f0t$1@nnrp1.deja.com>u  G I am using smbclient 2.0.3 on vms 7.2-1 to print to win machines.  If IDA use smbclient on the command line, it works fine.  If I run it inaE a .com file alone, it works fine.  If I use it with execsymb it failsy saying:   
 socket failed   : That is all is says in the log file.  thanks for any help.    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 07:00:00 GMT % From: Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com>i  Subject: Re: SW Raid 310 and VMS) Message-ID: <907i9g$j6m$1@nnrp1.deja.com>y  0 In article <905rl6$2m4$1@aquila.news.mdx.ac.uk>,!   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:hC > In article <3A25A7BA.D7F355C3@earthlink.net>, "David J. Dachtera" % <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> writes:e > >Mike Price wrote: > >>C > >> > I don't think HSZTERM is supported any longer. As I wrote in D > >> > another reply, I beleive Dave Gudewicz does not have a RA310,7 > >> > but a RA3000. That one does not run HSOF or ACS.n > >> > > >> > > [snip]s > >> > > > >a' > >Do not try to us SWCC - *PERIOD* !!!t > >g' > >> HSZTERm is not offically supportedt > > C > >As are all of the known ways to communicate with HSx controllershD > >from a batch job. Not sure why that is, or what can be done aboutD > >it, but it remains one of the many obstacles to getting OpenVMS +% > >StorageWorks into more sites, IMO.e >rG > Agreed. Compaq really need to either fully support HSZTERM or provideD* > something with equivalent functionality.  F Then you must have missed one of my previous responses in this thread,D although part of it is still here - the first unattributed paragraph above. Here is the info again:  F There is a new product (= costs money) for the most recent controllers. (HSZ70 and up), the SANworks Command Scripter:;     http://www.compaq.com/products/sanworks/sanmgt/scs.htmle  F > Although there are undoubtedly some people who want to control theirB > storage from a PC there are far more who want/need to be able to9 > connect directly from the VMS system to the controller.s  B My understanding - I haven't worked with the scripter - is that it offers both.   --
 Uwe Zessin    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.0   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 14:30:17 +01006 From: "Martin Knoblauch" <martin.knoblauch@compaq.com>' Subject: Re: Technology of US elections26 Message-ID: <908952$m42$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  D "Michael Woodacre" <woodacre@scala.reading.sgi.com> wrote in message( news:900e3g$36i2p$1@fido.engr.sgi.com... > In articleF <35666012DF4CD411BE940090279FA240111FE3@ppnt41.physics.ox.ac.uk>, John5 Macallister <J.Macallister1@physics.ox.ac.uk> writes:iF > |> From what I've seen on TV with groups of people peering over each other's:K > the Florida electorial college votes be split between them? Wouldn't thatd
 be in lineJ > with the whole reason for having an electorial college to smooth out the votingE > power. Of course Bush wouldn't want that (or Gore if positions werea reversed), butK > it seems to give more respect to all the other 100M votes cast throughout  the US insteadD > of making the election come down to a bunch of dimples in Florida. >i  J  Just interested. I am seeing this 100M votes number a lot. I kind of feelE this is to high. How many US-Americas aer there? How many of them are,G eligible/registered to vote? Given a 50% participation, the 100M numberoK would mean 200M eligible voters. What is the age distribution (people belowo voting age vs. all people)?    As I said, just curious.   Martin   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 14:33:03 +01006 From: "Martin Knoblauch" <martin.knoblauch@compaq.com>' Subject: Re: Technology of US electionsa6 Message-ID: <9089a7$m58$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>   ">I > The only fair way to settle this debacle is to have a revote in Florida0 forrL > the two presidential candidates and using the good old ballot paper systemH > with an "X" in the box for the chosen candidate followed by a good oldE > proper manual count. This is something which could be organised andn executedJ > within the constitutional parameters and, at least, the winner (if there cankE > be a winner from this mess) will have the democratic legitimacy, in  Florida," > of having polled the most votes. >'  K  Like in any democratic country (e.g. Bulgaria, Rumania, ...) where you canBL only win a "winner takes it all" contest in the first round with 50+% of theH votes? And if this is not achieved, the first two fight it out two weeks later? Unthinkable :-)   Martin   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 09:22:36 -0500t- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>t' Subject: Re: Technology of US electionss, Message-ID: <3A27B42B.66B98042@videotron.ca>  J Watching the OJ Simpson re-creation yesterday with that Ryder rent-a-truckM driving on the roads, with helicopters constantly filming it, I couldn't helpaM but wish a serious accident where the punched cards would be expelled and flyaL into the wind, spreading all over the area. (Of course, broadcasted live :-)  N Think of the hype the media would have, and think about all the $$$ signs thatM the lawyers would see in trying to deal with the situation where ballots from1H one county would be completely lost/unusable and thus the state would be' unable to fullfil its own requirements.D  K Reminds me of the Pink Panther scene where he a vacuum cleaner sucks itselft out of existence.o  M Two crocs are watching a busloads of lawyers arriving in Florida and one says 
 to the other:  	"There goes the neighbourhood"     H Shouldn't they hire Francis Ford Coppola (director of Apocalypse Now) toK direct this whole soap opera ? ? ? ? ? ? Or maybe James Cameron (Titanic) ?-  L What a whole bunch of trouble for something so simple. Just count the bloody ballots and be done with it.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 10:07:39 -0500c) From: "Ebinger . Eric" <EEbinger@drc.com>u' Subject: RE: Technology of US electionsnB Message-ID: <7162F87E9EF4D311BA9900805FC1D3AE7A6252@and02.drc.com>   > -----Original Message-----= > From: Martin Knoblauch [mailto:martin.knoblauch@compaq.com]S) > Sent: Friday, December 01, 2000 8:30 AMi > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ) > Subject: Re: Technology of US electionsh >  >  > F > "Michael Woodacre" <woodacre@scala.reading.sgi.com> wrote in message* > news:900e3g$36i2p$1@fido.engr.sgi.com... > > In articleH > <35666012DF4CD411BE940090279FA240111FE3@ppnt41.physics.ox.ac.uk>, John7 > Macallister <J.Macallister1@physics.ox.ac.uk> writes:oH > > |> From what I've seen on TV with groups of people peering over each	 > other'si@ > > the Florida electorial college votes be split between them?  > Wouldn't thatl > be in line> > > with the whole reason for having an electorial college to  > smooth out the > votingG > > power. Of course Bush wouldn't want that (or Gore if positions wereg > reversed), but> > > it seems to give more respect to all the other 100M votes  > cast throughouti > the US insteadF > > of making the election come down to a bunch of dimples in Florida. > >C > @ >  Just interested. I am seeing this 100M votes number a lot. I  > kind of feelG > this is to high. How many US-Americas aer there? How many of them arer> > eligible/registered to vote? Given a 50% participation, the 
 > 100M numberp@ > would mean 200M eligible voters. What is the age distribution  > (people belowf > voting age vs. all people)?  >   " Reasonably complete numbers are at) http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2000/results/D  / The total for the election was 103.143 million.e  0 I don't have a clue as to the percentage of the 2 eligible population that actually voted.  However,2 it is safe to say that neither candidate was voted! for by a majority of US citizens.e   Eric Ebinger      a   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 09:36:12 -05005 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.nospam>  Subject: Time sensitive 6 Message-ID: <908ctu$mlc$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  J I have just received the following and wanted to get it out to you becauseH of the limited time offer.  I have also tried to take out any MSwordism.  
 Warm Regards,M   Sue L ____________________________________________________________________________ __________________  ? Digital Press offers unprecedented savings to OpenVMS customers   ; The Compaq OpenVMS Group and Digital Press, a subsidiary oftG Butterworth-Heinemann,  recently established a partnership agreement tofJ strengthen and enhance their working relationship. In addition to updatingG current Digital Press OpenVMS titles and generating new titles, DigitalnL Press is offering OpenVMS customers a unique 35% discount until December 31, 2000.c  E The 35% discount applies not only to Digital Press titles, but to allK@ Butterworth-Heinemann publications on the Digital Press web siteB (www.bhusa.com/digitalpress <http://www.bhusa.com/digitalpress> orI www.bh.com/digitalpress <http://www.bh.com/digitalpress> ).  Here are the8 program details:  
 How to Order:e  G When ordering, you must mention the Compaq promotion code T011TCZW01 to0 receive the 35% discount!y  ( Five ways to order within North America:F Online: www.bhusa.com/digitalpress <http://www.bhusa.com/digitalpress>$ Call: 1-800-366-2665 or 781-904-2500# FAX: 1-800-446-6520 or 781-933-6333r1 Email: orders@bhusa.com <mailto:orders@bhusa.com>tL Mail: Butterworth-Heinemann Fulfillment Center, 225 Wildwood Ave. Woburn, MA 01801a  , Five ways to order outside of North America:@ Online: www.bh.com/digitalpress <http://www.bh.com/digitalpress> Call: 44 (0) 1865 888180 FAX: 44 (0) 1865 314572t Email: bhuk.orders@repp.co.uklK Mail: Butterworth-Heinemann Linacre House, Jordan Hill, Oxford, 0X2 8DP, UKe  J Remember, this is a limited time offer, all orders must be placed and paidJ for by December 31, 2000.  Call one of the numbers listed above to get all? of the details, or visit either of the Digital Press web sites:mA www.bhusa.com/digitalpress <http://www.bhusa.com/digitalpress> orh8 www.bh.com/digitalpress <http://www.bh.com/digitalpress>   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 08:14:31 -0700o1 From: David D Miller <ddmiller@west.raytheon.com>  Subject: RE: Time sensitive F Message-ID: <OF7618C833.16ED6AA4-ON072569A8.0053B436@rsc.raytheon.com>  E ---------------------- Forwarded by David D Miller/RWS/Raytheon/US on-/ 12/01/2000 08:14 AM ---------------------------n    = Pam Chester <Pam.Chester@bhusa.com> on 12/01/2000 08:08:01 AMh  5 To:   "'David D Miller'" <ddmiller@west.raytheon.com>o< cc:   Theron R Shreve <TheronRShreve@bhusa.com>, Chris Nolin       <Chris.Nolin@bhusa.com>r   Subject:  RE: Time sensitive    K Wow, thanks for letting me know, I was just asking the Compaq folks whetheraI they had gotten the word out to users. The one correction is that Digital K Press only has one part of the Butterworth-Heinemann website (www.bhusa.com B in the US, www.bh.com in the rest of the world gets you a range ofE engineering, electronics, and management titles that might also be ofpD interest. And the offer is good on www.focalpress.com too, which hasE terrific audio, video, cinema and photography publications. So it's ad reallyI good deal! (free shipping too, altho they still stick a $4 or so handlingyK charge on each order) Is there any way you could add this clarification forf VMS discussion participants?  K Thanks again, and I'll be in touch later today about the OSU book idea, and K will be getting in touch with Alan Winston about his comparative book idea.o   Pam    -----Original Message-----8 From: David D Miller [mailto:ddmiller@west.raytheon.com]' Sent: Friday, December 01, 2000 9:59 AM6 To: Pam Chestera Subject: Time sensitived     PamM  J Thought you'd be interested.  This just came through on the VMS discussion list..   dave.d    E ---------------------- Forwarded by David D Miller/RWS/Raytheon/US ons/ 12/01/2000 07:58 AM ---------------------------g    I "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.nospam> on 12/01/2000 07:36:12 AMr   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com? cc:    Subject:  Time sensitive    J I have just received the following and wanted to get it out to you becauseH of the limited time offer.  I have also tried to take out any MSwordism.  
 Warm Regards,.   SueIL ____________________________________________________________________________     __________________  ? Digital Press offers unprecedented savings to OpenVMS customersn  ; The Compaq OpenVMS Group and Digital Press, a subsidiary ofoG Butterworth-Heinemann,  recently established a partnership agreement tolJ strengthen and enhance their working relationship. In addition to updatingG current Digital Press OpenVMS titles and generating new titles, DigitaltH Press is offering OpenVMS customers a unique 35% discount until December 31,- 2000.-  E The 35% discount applies not only to Digital Press titles, but to allr@ Butterworth-Heinemann publications on the Digital Press web siteB (www.bhusa.com/digitalpress <http://www.bhusa.com/digitalpress> orI www.bh.com/digitalpress <http://www.bh.com/digitalpress> ).  Here are the2 program details:  
 How to Order:p  G When ordering, you must mention the Compaq promotion code T011TCZW01 to  receive the 35% discount!   ( Five ways to order within North America:F Online: www.bhusa.com/digitalpress <http://www.bhusa.com/digitalpress>$ Call: 1-800-366-2665 or 781-904-2500# FAX: 1-800-446-6520 or 781-933-6333n1 Email: orders@bhusa.com <mailto:orders@bhusa.com>uI Mail: Butterworth-Heinemann Fulfillment Center, 225 Wildwood Ave. Woburn,  MA 01801   , Five ways to order outside of North America:@ Online: www.bh.com/digitalpress <http://www.bh.com/digitalpress> Call: 44 (0) 1865 888180 FAX: 44 (0) 1865 314572l Email: bhuk.orders@repp.co.ukgK Mail: Butterworth-Heinemann Linacre House, Jordan Hill, Oxford, 0X2 8DP, UKe  J Remember, this is a limited time offer, all orders must be placed and paidJ for by December 31, 2000.  Call one of the numbers listed above to get all? of the details, or visit either of the Digital Press web sites:eA www.bhusa.com/digitalpress <http://www.bhusa.com/digitalpress> ore8 www.bh.com/digitalpress <http://www.bh.com/digitalpress>   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 17:37:31 GMT 1 From: Dmitry Bessonov <dmitry_bessonov@yahoo.com> 2 Subject: UQ:File access to NT from VMS via DECnet?) Message-ID: <908nkq$gu5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>*   Hi,s  E I need to copy files from VMS to WinNT 4.0 machine via DECnet (by VMS G COPY command). NT machine has Pathworks32 7.2 client, DECnet installed.sG VMS machine has DECnet Phase IV, it is NOT running Pathworks server butiE I believe it's not necessary. I defined DECnet name and address of NT A machine in VMS's NCP node database and vice versa. I also defined E object 17 (FAL) on NT machine. I defined access on NT node(NCP DEFINEi? ACCESS DEFAULT ALL). However, when I try to do "$ COPY FILE.TXTF NTNODE::" , I get the message:  ? "-SYSTEM-F-UNREACHABLE, remote node is not currently reachable"e  F To test DECnet on NT, I ran NFT and eXcursion via DECnet and connectedE to this VMS node, everything worked perfectly. I can also do NCP LOOPhG NODE from NT to VMS, it's also fine. Why this NT machine is unreachable  from VMS node?  B I also ran "User Manager" on that NT node to enable access to thisH machine. I went "Policies" -> "User Rights" menu, enabled checkbox "ShowE advanced user rights" and modified firstly "Access this computer fromoG network", then "Log on as batch job" - in both cases I added "Everyone"lB to the list of allowed users and groups. The error message remainsG same. Does anyone have an idea why this NT node can remain unreachable?gB Has anyone ever successfully copied files from VMS to NT PathworksE client? If yes, can you please send details, how to do that... Please=  reply to my email address below.     Regards, Dmitry   dmitry_bessonov@yahoo.com	    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.z   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 14:09:12 +0100=- From: Adam Dorosz <adam.dorosz@softax.com.pl> & Subject: VMS and motif debugging tools- Message-ID: <3A27A2F8.2E9AB7A4@softax.com.pl>c  E Is there any tool helpfull in motif application debugging?  I've readl8 that there area some applications such as xwinfo, xprop. Are them available for VMS ?   TIA  Adam   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 08:41:27 -0500t, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler)* Subject: Re: VMS and motif debugging tools+ Message-ID: <Vi$0cy3kttlI@eisner.decus.org>o  ] In article <3A27A2F8.2E9AB7A4@softax.com.pl>, Adam Dorosz <adam.dorosz@softax.com.pl> writes:0G > Is there any tool helpfull in motif application debugging?  I've read : > that there area some applications such as xwinfo, xprop. > Are them available for VMS ? >    $dir decw$utils:  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporations= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil Group E                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replyinga   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 14:39:17 +0100r- From: Adam Dorosz <adam.dorosz@softax.com.pl>>* Subject: Re: VMS and motif debugging tools- Message-ID: <3A27AA05.BEB5F5FB@softax.com.pl>u   Adam Dorosz wrote:  < > Is there any tool helpfull in motif application debugging?  ) Sorry, I should it check first, then ask. = It's available in [SYS0.SYSCOMMON.SYSHLP.EXAMPLES.DECW.UTILS]b   > Adam   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 08:35:35 -0300o) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brZ( Subject: Re: VMS and NT integration?????L Message-ID: <OF3937EA6E.D4D939D7-ON032569A8.003EDB95@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  ? My problem with the two VAX 4000 , one Microvax 3100,  and  oner  RX400 are:a  B 1 - They are ocupping space in the data center; We are putting the(  new servers on the racks (Compaq racks)  E 2 - They are just Pathworks file server for a group of users. All ther? company is using WNT file serving, but these users dont want tod  change.... (???)w  7 3 - What means the operators must backup them everyday.e  6 4 - When my manager agrees to stop the machines nobodyB except the file server users will notice, and they can just re-map  the \\server\share.  B  Today, Hoffman put me in my right place ! Forgive me people ! :-)H I will not make comments about loved legacy hardware and software !  :-= )      Regards0   FC                  H "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> em 30/11/2000 22:20:0= 5UH                                                                        =     =20oH                                                                        =     =20eH                                                                        =     =20s    @                                                              =20@                                                              =20@                                                              =20@  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                              =20@                                                              =20@  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)  =20@                                                              =20@                                                              =20@                                                              =20@  Assunto: Re: VMS and NT integration?????                    =20@                                                              =20           =e    * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote: > ' > I am sorry if I was misunderstood ...t >.H > Of course I used LAT for a long time, but LAT is "Local" Area Transpo= rt - > what means -H > there=B4s no space for new applications except print servers and dumb=   > terminals. >rH > What I am trying to say is, I dont see LAT as a strategic and importa= nt > choice for OpenVMSC >  environments  nowadays, as I dont see Microvaxes as an importantf > plataform.  6 So far, you're in agreement with most of the industry.  	 > We havedH > three VAXes in  the Data Center and I am crazy to "disconnect" them f= romt > the network.  $ Why? What problems are they causing?  H > People in the comp.os.vms  still using VAXes and Microvaxes and great=   part > of discussionsH > are about these two equipments....I dont see much more future in Open= VMSm if > people stillH > using these machines - wich dont support Galaxy, Fiber Channel and et= c. ...  >L/ > Sounds everybody is connected to the past....a  D The present, like the future, stands on a foundation anchored by and& steeped in the traditions of the past.   -- David J. Dachterad dba DJE Systemsi http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/2  F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.p       =t   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 20:13:53 +0800/ From: Paul Repacholi <prep@k9.prep.synonet.com>o( Subject: Re: VMS and NT integration?????0 Message-ID: <871yvsl4ou.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  I Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:o  - > fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:e > J > > developments like SAN integration, etc ... but I think it=B4s waste ofN > > time and resources trying to put old hardware (LAT based) to work in this 6 > > new world of TCP/IP connections (Web, and etc...). > L > LAT does the job it was designed for much better and much more efficientlyJ > than telnet/TCP can ever dream of doing. It's a pity that DEC's business3 > practices made a wider success of LAT impossible.l  A You got that 200% right. LAT is a must IMO, (nearly) always works = no matter what the network stack(s) are doing or how they areh set up.m  < I a stunned at just what a huge cluster f*** unix manages to; make of pouring bytes into a bit-bucket; abeit a bit-bucket  with side effects.   ~Paul"   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 13:58:58 GMTs' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)7( Subject: Re: VMS and NT integration?????0 Message-ID: <908ar2$p6h$1@aquila.news.mdx.ac.uk>  x In article <OF3937EA6E.D4D939D7-ON032569A8.003EDB95@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:@ >My problem with the two VAX 4000 , one Microvax 3100,  and  one > RX400 are: >mC >1 - They are ocupping space in the data center; We are putting then) > new servers on the racks (Compaq racks)4 >1  L Hardly large systems taking up tons of space. I'd think the system units canJ probably sit on a shelf in a rack fairly easily (certainly a Microvax 3100; model 80 could - can't remember the sizes of VAX 4000's ). tI Setup a switch and you can share a monitor and keyboard for the systems. o& The only problem might be the storage.  F >2 - They are just Pathworks file server for a group of users. All the@ >company is using WNT file serving, but these users dont want to > change.... (???) >oB  They might think that the old VMS systems are a bit more stable ?.  Just a thought ?  No blue screen of death. :)      8 >3 - What means the operators must backup them everyday.  , And they don't backup the WNT file servers ?  F The backups of the VMS systems are presumably scripted so what do the  operators have to do :-o   load a tape.K possibly type in one command - if the backup isn't automatically scheduled.a unload a tape.  O From what you were saying above I assume this is a relatively small user group lC so you don't have multiple tapes worth of data to backup every day.     
 David Webb VMS and unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University     > 7 >4 - When my manager agrees to stop the machines nobodyeC >except the file server users will notice, and they can just re-map  > the \\server\share.i >sC > Today, Hoffman put me in my right place ! Forgive me people ! :-) I >I will not make comments about loved legacy hardware and software !  :-=a >) >m >  >Regards >  >FCt >  >e >g >D >9 >t >l >@ >lI >"David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> em 30/11/2000 22:20:0=o >5I >                                                                       =k >    =20I >                                                                       =_ >    =20I >                                                                       =p >    =20 >v >sA >                                                             =20sA >                                                             =20pA >                                                             =20tA > Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                              =20lA >                                                             =20uA > cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)  =20 A >                                                             =20tA >                                                             =20bA >                                                             =20hA > Assunto: Re: VMS and NT integration?????                    =208A >                                                             =20t >  >  >p >p >o >= >d >0+ >fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:i >>( >> I am sorry if I was misunderstood ... >>I >> Of course I used LAT for a long time, but LAT is "Local" Area Transpo=6 >rt -o >> what means -AI >> there=B4s no space for new applications except print servers and dumb=b >a
 >> terminals.u >>I >> What I am trying to say is, I dont see LAT as a strategic and importa=  >ntw >> choice for OpenVMS D >>  environments  nowadays, as I dont see Microvaxes as an important
 >> plataform.l >47 >So far, you're in agreement with most of the industry.r >s
 >> We haveI >> three VAXes in  the Data Center and I am crazy to "disconnect" them f=U >rom >> the network.  >i% >Why? What problems are they causing?a > I >> People in the comp.os.vms  still using VAXes and Microvaxes and great=o >t >partf >> of discussionssI >> are about these two equipments....I dont see much more future in Open=p >VMS >ifa >> people still>I >> using these machines - wich dont support Galaxy, Fiber Channel and et=- >c >....- >>0 >> Sounds everybody is connected to the past.... > E >The present, like the future, stands on a foundation anchored by andv' >steeped in the traditions of the past.2 >A >--3 >David J. Dachtera >dba DJE Systems >http://www.djesys.com/a > ; >Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:-  >http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ >mG >This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings" >is to be expected.e >cA >Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  > G >However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, arek >strongly discouraged. >s >s >s >= >e >m >    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 10:24:16 -0500% From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian>r7 Subject: Re: VMS Apache and CGI - still having problemsn$ Message-ID: <3a27c1e4$1@news.si.com>   >What are you trying to do?i   Get Apache for OpenVMS VAX.e -- tA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comwA Smiths Industries, Inc.                   tillman at swdev.si.comh= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventi< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 08:55:17 +0100t= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>  Subject: Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unixh( Message-ID: <3A275964.520BBCB@gtech.com>   waybright@my-deja.com wrote:, > I'm looking for information and supporting1 > evidence for what is the preffered platform fora3 > running an Oracle 8i DB on a GS320 Alpha system -u > VMS or Tru64 Unix? > 2 > We are building a new Data base server that will0 > be the heartbeat of our business.  Needs to be/ > highly available, high performance, scalable,02 > flexible, interoperable.  Will connect to Compaq3 > SAN.    Need to consider total cost of ownership,7. > investment protection- market share, support	 > issues.: > % > VMS or Unix?  Thanks for your help!t  0 I would prefer VMS, but that is very subjective.  7 You will get the best objective results be choosing the  OS you know best.a  7 A well-managed VMS system are better than a mis-maneged_6 Tru64 system and a well-managed Tru64 system is better than a mis-managed VMS system.   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 14:26:27 +0100% From: "Philip J. Lewis" <phl@bwsc.dk>e Subject: Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unixp0 Message-ID: <RFNV5.180$pk5.2410@news.get2net.dk>   Hi,r  1 You could begin by choosing the correct database.i  K The preferred solution is VMS and OracleRdb.  There is no competition here.nF If you really mean what you have written, then O8i and Unix are not anF option I would recommend, even with a gun to my head.  The VMS and RdbJ solution is vastly superior, easier to maintain and operate and is, in theF 7.1 release, really the only database capable of exploiting the CompaQ	 hardware.   H If you need to verify this, I can point you to the appropriate people at CompaQ and Oracle.  D This is the opinion of someone who has spent 18 years working in theG environment you describe with VMS and Rdb for slightly fewer years.  MyeI advice here, is free :-), though I would be quite willing to tell you the0 same thing for a fee :-)   cheers philipG waybright@my-deja.com wrote in message <906ra6$1tf$1@nnrp1.deja.com>... + >I'm looking for information and supportingr0 >evidence for what is the preffered platform for2 >running an Oracle 8i DB on a GS320 Alpha system - >VMS or Tru64 Unix?h >:1 >We are building a new Data base server that will0/ >be the heartbeat of our business.  Needs to bep. >highly available, high performance, scalable,1 >flexible, interoperable.  Will connect to Compaq 2 >SAN.    Need to consider total cost of ownership,- >investment protection- market share, supportn >issues. >e$ >VMS or Unix?  Thanks for your help! >s >r' >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/t >Before you buy.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:08:49 GMTl' From: Michael <maustin@nc.prestige.net>  Subject: Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unix / Message-ID: <3A27CCD2.42FB2487@nc.prestige.net>y   >oF > This is the opinion of someone who has spent 18 years working in theI > environment you describe with VMS and Rdb for slightly fewer years.  MytK > advice here, is free :-), though I would be quite willing to tell you the. > same thing for a fee :-)  M It is funny that companies will spend thousands of dollars, pounds,yen etc...gL and think that the information is more credible than the information that is3 given for free... even if given by the same people.a  M I would also say that CIO's only want the sales people to tell them what theynM want to hear and they will keep looking until they find someone who will giveL9 them the right answer... kind of like a liberal Democrat.H   Michael AustinN DBA Consultant on Rdb (5 years at DEC, 1 year at Oracle & 5 years independent)O Also Oracle 7/8 on Sun, HP, AIX, Sequent and I still prefer OpenVMS/Rdb because  it just works!   >o > cheers > philipI > waybright@my-deja.com wrote in message <906ra6$1tf$1@nnrp1.deja.com>..."- > >I'm looking for information and supportingt2 > >evidence for what is the preffered platform for4 > >running an Oracle 8i DB on a GS320 Alpha system - > >VMS or Tru64 Unix?e > >i3 > >We are building a new Data base server that will"1 > >be the heartbeat of our business.  Needs to bef0 > >highly available, high performance, scalable,3 > >flexible, interoperable.  Will connect to Compaqa4 > >SAN.    Need to consider total cost of ownership,/ > >investment protection- market share, supporty
 > >issues. > >e& > >VMS or Unix?  Thanks for your help! > >l > >m) > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/y > >Before you buy.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 17:42:39 +0100% From: "Philip J. Lewis" <phl@bwsc.dk>e Subject: Re: VMS vs. Tru64 Unix=0 Message-ID: <HxQV5.219$pk5.3745@news.get2net.dk>   Men dog Arne !  L The question is of course whether a well managed VMS system is better than a3 well managed Unix system !  I vote for VMS any day.'  H The answer is of course, it probably will not matter if you use Oracle8.L Also, I am not aware that ANY version of Oracle can use a GS320 architectureH fully.  Rdb V7.1 is about to go Beta-4, and this will utilize the REALLYC cool hardware involved here, and it is written by people who really@3 understand VMS, so expect it to be, well, stunning.o   Tilbage til arbejde. philip  < Arne Vajhj wrote in message <3A275964.520BBCB@gtech.com>... >waybright@my-deja.com wrote:'- >> I'm looking for information and supportingu2 >> evidence for what is the preffered platform for4 >> running an Oracle 8i DB on a GS320 Alpha system - >> VMS or Tru64 Unix?- >>3 >> We are building a new Data base server that willo1 >> be the heartbeat of our business.  Needs to bew0 >> highly available, high performance, scalable,3 >> flexible, interoperable.  Will connect to Compaqr4 >> SAN.    Need to consider total cost of ownership,/ >> investment protection- market share, support 
 >> issues. >>& >> VMS or Unix?  Thanks for your help! >b1 >I would prefer VMS, but that is very subjective.. >.8 >You will get the best objective results be choosing the >OS you know best. >e8 >A well-managed VMS system are better than a mis-maneged7 >Tru64 system and a well-managed Tru64 system is betterS >than a mis-managed VMS system.- >- >Arne-   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:16:44 -0300r) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brt1 Subject: Who =?iso-8859-1?q?=B4s_the_wizard_=3F?=AL Message-ID: <OF9C4C487E.716B604D-ON032569A8.00645343@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  / Who is the OpenVMS wizard ? Steve Hoffman ? :-)a  / Click...  http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/g     Fabio C.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 12:51:34 -0500 , From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@compaq.com>  Subject: Re: Who s the wizard ?8 Message-ID: <l7pf2tg0otgnpeg1vkur890rorrvdblm7n@4ax.com>  # On Fri, 01 Dec 2000 15:16:44 -0300, * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:  0 >Who is the OpenVMS wizard ? Steve Hoffman ? :-) > 0 >Click...  http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/  ? That's not a picture of Steve Hoffman.  I'm not sure who it is.   ) The "Wizard" has multiple manifestations.a    - Steve Lionel (mailto:Steve.Lionel@compaq.com)  Fortran Engineeringv& Compaq Computer Corporation, Nashua NH  6 Compaq Fortran web site: http://www.compaq.com/fortran   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 09:40:45 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> 6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?H Message-ID: <y4y9y04jqq.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  G It's a documentation bug, if you want, that can't easily be changed for J historical reasons. As far as I know, VMS does not keep track of peak pageG file usage, and the numbers you're seeing are consistent with being the  peak virtual size.   	Jan     ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 09:45:34 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> 6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?H Message-ID: <y4vgt44jip.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  5 cornelius@eisner.decus.org (George Cornelius) writes:n  G > Also of interest in the listing below is the way a delta time of 0.00 G > seconds is displayed - but I guess that's been discussed here before.  > 2 >  Elapsed CPU time:       17-NOV-1858 00:00:00.00  J Yes, the value 0 is potentially ambiguous to $ASCTIM. My suggestion would K be to change its semantics to mean "a delta time of zero", rather than "therM starting moment of the epoch". This would be much more useful. Utilities suchTI as BACKUP could still interpret this value to mean "no date set", as theyw curently do.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 20:41:43 +0800/ From: Paul Repacholi <prep@k9.prep.synonet.com>e6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?0 Message-ID: <87r93sjou0.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  I Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:M  7 > cornelius@eisner.decus.org (George Cornelius) writes:  > I > > Also of interest in the listing below is the way a delta time of 0.00eI > > seconds is displayed - but I guess that's been discussed here before.d > > 4 > >  Elapsed CPU time:       17-NOV-1858 00:00:00.00 > L > Yes, the value 0 is potentially ambiguous to $ASCTIM. My suggestion would M > be to change its semantics to mean "a delta time of zero", rather than "themO > starting moment of the epoch". This would be much more useful. Utilities such K > as BACKUP could still interpret this value to mean "no date set", as theyg > curently do.  : Or the most visible case... The encounter with Uranus ( or6 Neptune? ) 3... 2... 1... 17-NOV-1858 !! It's a VAX...   Nasa slipped there.v   ~Pault   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 20:39:17 +0800/ From: Paul Repacholi <prep@k9.prep.synonet.com> 6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?0 Message-ID: <87u28ojoy2.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  , Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com> writes:    5 > Why is the system creating VA that never gets used?i  0 Well if it is a RTL or other shared section, you1 need to map the section on matter what others aren. doing with it at the time. The way to get this5 done with consistancy is to map ALL of it, then faultb non-resident pages as needed.   3 Other processes may have brought in the whole mess,A1 because they are using all of it. But if you justm0 call a few functions, that's all you will fault.  0 There are also 'demand-zero' sections. The space3 is mapped but the pages are not until you referenceo0 them. Different parts of a shared image may have their own demand zero sections.e  2 Alphas add another level, as you can instal images with 'shared address'...   ~Paul    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 14:39:43 GMTe* From: Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com>6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?) Message-ID: <908d7f$7ct$1@nnrp1.deja.com>.  0 In article <87u28ojoy2.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>,2   Paul Repacholi <prep@k9.prep.synonet.com> wrote:. > Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com> writes:   [...]p  2 > There are also 'demand-zero' sections. The space5 > is mapped but the pages are not until you referencei  @ Can you please explain what you mean by space vs. pages? thanks.  2 > them. Different parts of a shared image may have! > their own demand zero sections.1 --F NOTE: If you wish to e-mail me, please do NOT use the deja address; itE is broken. Instead, use one of the addresses below, removing the longo wrong part first. Thanks.c   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman  &-)/ w: afeldman@gfigroup.BorisYeltsinCooksCajun.comk5 h: alan48@dellnet.YouCantBelieveEverythingYouRead.comh    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.g   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 14:42:08 GMTr* From: Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com>6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?) Message-ID: <908dbu$7ft$1@nnrp1.deja.com>f  H In article <y4y9y04jqq.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>,C   Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>V wrote:E > It's a documentation bug, if you want, that can't easily be changed  foraG > historical reasons. As far as I know, VMS does not keep track of peaks page  G What more would they have to do other than change the text string "Peakr' page file size" to "Peak virtual size"?t  E > file usage, and the numbers you're seeing are consistent with being  then > peak virtual size. >  > 	Jan >n   --F NOTE: If you wish to e-mail me, please do NOT use the deja address. It isB broken. Instead, use one of the addresses below, removing the long wrong part first. Thanks.o   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman  &-)/ w: afeldman@gfigroup.BorisYeltsinCooksCajun.com 5 h: alan48@dellnet.YouCantBelieveEverythingYouRead.comm    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 16:03:55 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> 6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?H Message-ID: <y4pujcw5d0.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  , Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com> writes:  4 > > There are also 'demand-zero' sections. The space7 > > is mapped but the pages are not until you reference B > Can you please explain what you mean by space vs. pages? thanks.  K The page table entry - the thing referenced by the hardware (or PAL code on K an Alpha) on a page reference - is set up to be similar to a no-access page K for a demand-zero page initially. When it is accessed, a page fault occurs.rL The page fault handler notices that this is really a demand-zero page, grabsM a zeroed page from the free list (this is done by the idle loop on Alpha only J I believe), allocates backing store aka a page file page, updates the pageM table entry, and dismisses the fault. This allows you to have all the virtual D memory you want without ever allocating more resources that the PTEsJ (themselves virtual and demand-zero if possible on Alpha, I think), unless you actually make use of it.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 23:47:45 +0800/ From: Paul Repacholi <prep@k9.prep.synonet.com>l6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?0 Message-ID: <87y9y0p2hq.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  8 The page file does not contain read-only pages, or pages mapped to another file.    ~Pauls   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2000 16:09:55 GMTr1 From: "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com>W6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?2 Message-ID: <3A27CEB3.B7066B7C@clarityconnect.com>  F If we did this then we would probably break a lot of software that wasE (yes I know they shouldn't but people do) relying on this text stringcF being there and the extracting the data after it.  This 'bug' has beenE around since V5.0 and was 1st documented in DSNlink on 29-AUG-1989 ini the article titledA [OpenVMS] Peak Page File Usage Incorrectly Reported by ACCOUNTINGc   "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: > J > In article <y4y9y04jqq.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>,E >   Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>D > wrote:G > > It's a documentation bug, if you want, that can't easily be changeda > foraI > > historical reasons. As far as I know, VMS does not keep track of peaka > page > I > What more would they have to do other than change the text string "Peak ) > page file size" to "Peak virtual size"?r > G > > file usage, and the numbers you're seeing are consistent with beinge > thek > > peak virtual size. > > 
 > >       Jan  > >  >  > --H > NOTE: If you wish to e-mail me, please do NOT use the deja address. It > isD > broken. Instead, use one of the addresses below, removing the long > wrong part first. Thanks.2 >  > Disclaimer: JMHO > Alan E. Feldman  &-)1 > w: afeldman@gfigroup.BorisYeltsinCooksCajun.comi7 > h: alan48@dellnet.YouCantBelieveEverythingYouRead.comw > ( > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.o   -- 0D Jilly	- Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley - Lockwood, NY0 	- jilly@clarityconnect.com			- Brett Bodine fan. 	- Mark.Jilson@Compaq.com			- since 1975 or so, 	- http://www.jilly.baka.com               -   ------------------------------    Date: 01 Dec 2000 18:23:44 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>s6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?H Message-ID: <y4vgt42gyn.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  3 "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com> writes:l  H > If we did this then we would probably break a lot of software that wasG > (yes I know they shouldn't but people do) relying on this text string 3 > being there and the extracting the data after it.c  J I hear this argument pretty often. I rarely believe such software actuallyN exists, and in this case I think it highly unlikely that is does, because this= information is much more easily accessible in supported ways.    	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Dec 2000 12:31:30 -0500e From: briggs@eisner.decus.org 6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?+ Message-ID: <eTRipaQGcRUN@eisner.decus.org>l  V In article <905ov6$2ne$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com> writes:D > Or were used and might be used again! Cool. So does this mean thatG > pages on the free list that previously belonged to a process are also B > part of that process's virtual memory space? I guess so! (Please > correct me if I'm wrong.)i   Well, yes and no.u  F Virtual memory is virtual.  It isn't real.  You can't point to any one? real thing that say "this is part of my virtual address space".I  E You can say:  "Address %x7ffe0200 is within my virtual address space"i  E This would mean that (assuming VAX hardware) that your P1LR (P1 spacee? length register) indicated that 7ffE0200 has a page table entrya in your page table.e  E You can say:  "The page table entry for virtual address %x7ffe0200 isd$                not currently valid".  B This would mean that the valid bit was clear on the indicated page table entry.  J You can say:  "The data for virtual address %x7ffe0200 is still physically' 	       resident on the free page list"g  H This would mean that the remainder of the (marked-as-invalid) page tableF entry points to a page on the free list according to the PFN database.  C You can say:  "A page fault on virtual address %x7ffe0200 will be ac 	       soft fault"l  G This would include the possibility that faulting %x7ffe0200 would causerH the page in question to be moved from the free page list to your processF working set by simply updating your page table entry, working set list% and some entries in the PFN database.n     & 	John Briggs			briggs@eisner.decus.org   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.671 ************************