1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 12 Dec 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 693       Contents:  Re: Decnet - Proxies not working  Re: Decnet - Proxies not working Re: DHCP on a PPP connection Re: Error output GCC availablility on VMS/VAX  Re: GCC availablility on VMS/VAX IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion Re: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion Re: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion Re: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion Re: INITIALIZE/MAXIMUM_FILES Interactive debugger ( X ) Re: Interactive debugger ( X ) Re: Interactive debugger ( X )0 Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!0 Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!0 Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!0 Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!* Re: Mouse hang: AlphaStation 1000A VMS 6.2 Re: New OpenVMS  Education site  Re: New OpenVMS  Education site  Re: New OpenVMS  Education site  Re: New OpenVMS  Education site  Re: One world, one processor: Re: OpenVMS 6.0 reboots when I type "help" on remote login: Re: OpenVMS 6.0 reboots when I type "help" on remote login: Re: OpenVMS 6.0 reboots when I type "help" on remote loginP Perceived VMS Marketing issue (Was: Re: Two NEW SKC Postings atwww.acersoft.com)P Re: Perceived VMS Marketing issue (Was: Re: Two NEW SKC Postingsatwww.acersoft.c( Re: Stalled Printer Queue On LAT Network Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:41:32 +0000 - From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> ) Subject: Re: Decnet - Proxies not working ( Message-ID: <3A360EEC.EA66973@bbc.co.uk>   "David J. Dachtera" wrote:   > "Hugh D. R. Evans" wrote:  > > 	 > > Well,  > > P > > Many thanks to all for the invaluable advice. If your ever in the region let& > > me know and I'll get the beers in. > > M > > The problem was correctly diagnosed as the failure of the routing node. I O > > moved the license to another VAX satellite (boots from the Alpha), rebooted P > > both machines and hey presto, it all seems to function again. Now to conviceC > > the powers that be to provide a DVNETRTG license for the Alpha.  > G > If I'm not too badly mistaken, it's not a question of licensing. As I G > understand it, DECnet for Alpha does not have routing capabilities. I  > could, as always, be wrong...  >   J Actually, I thought this was the case with very early versions of Phase V,K but that it was lifted quite a few years back now (probably around the time J Digital realized they weren't making a fortune selling DECNis's :-)). See,  / http://www.digital.com/info/SP5045/SP5045HM.HTM   1 where host based routing is explicitly mentioned.    Regards    >    --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk   A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of  MedAS or the BBC.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:44:32 +0000 % From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> ) Subject: Re: Decnet - Proxies not working 8 Message-ID: <jo3c3t05hdk9ek4kj8g9mc5imnnufqbvec@4ax.com>  7 On Mon, 11 Dec 2000 15:13:48 -0600, "David J. Dachtera" $ <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote:   >"Hugh D. R. Evans" wrote: >>   >> Well, >>  O >> Many thanks to all for the invaluable advice. If your ever in the region let % >> me know and I'll get the beers in.  >>  L >> The problem was correctly diagnosed as the failure of the routing node. IN >> moved the license to another VAX satellite (boots from the Alpha), rebootedO >> both machines and hey presto, it all seems to function again. Now to convice B >> the powers that be to provide a DVNETRTG license for the Alpha. > F >If I'm not too badly mistaken, it's not a question of licensing. As IF >understand it, DECnet for Alpha does not have routing capabilities. I >could, as always, be wrong...  E DECNet IV on Alpha has enough routing capability to support a cluster  alias at least IIRC. --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Dec 2000 10:08:31 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)% Subject: Re: DHCP on a PPP connection * Message-ID: <3a35eb0f$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  \ In article <3A35C5E5.6A378D7A@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: >Hoff Hoffman wrote:O >>   DHCP client is part of the V5.1 release, which is currently in field test. N >>   PPP connections also tend to require RAS authentication, which is not yet >>   available on OpenVMS. > O >Any chance of making PPP available for VAX ? It would allow PDAs to connect to  >VMS.   ( Don't think so, but hopefully I'm wrong.? Use TCPware instead. PPP for VAX is there for many years now...    --  < Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 < <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 09:46:58 -0000 & From: "Rob Kings" <rob@vitalpulse.com> Subject: Re: Error output ) Message-ID: <914s9h$pit$1@epos.tesco.net>     Many thanks for all the replies.  I There were infact 3 ways (I vhad forgotton the SET MESSAGE statement) I'm < not sure which I'll use yet, but any of them will work fine.   Cheers   Rob    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 14:49:56 GMT  From: smh <s_p_a_m@my-deja.com> % Subject: GCC availablility on VMS/VAX ) Message-ID: <915duh$eda$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   F I need a binary for gcc on VAX/VMX but can't find anything more recentC than 2.7.1.  Since the project is C++ I need a more recent version.   D I'm willing to pay for a CD, but can't find any vendors who sell the	 binaries.    I've so far tried  www.rtr.com  www.thewrittenword.com# ... and of course various searches.    Any help would be appreciated.    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------    Date: 12 Dec 2000 17:02:53 +0100) From: maulis@ludens.elte.hu (Maulis Adam) ) Subject: Re: GCC availablility on VMS/VAX ! Message-ID: <3wPcpvMOiTNB@ludens>   K In article <915duh$eda$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, smh <s_p_a_m@my-deja.com> writes: H > I need a binary for gcc on VAX/VMX but can't find anything more recentE > than 2.7.1.  Since the project is C++ I need a more recent version.   < There is a easy-to-install part-of-gnat version of GCC 2.8.1A Gnat created by Ada Core Technologies (www.gnat.com) kit avaiable . from  ftp://cs.nyu.edu/pub/gnat/3.12p/openvms/  7 This is a VMSinstal -able fomrat of gnat, gcc, make ...    Regards, Adam Maulis     ) We instal and use well on ES40 / VMS7.2-1    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 14:20:47 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br # Subject: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion L Message-ID: <OFD3CC6E2C.D34919D4-ON032569B3.005F0C00@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  H If IBM will make US$ 1 Bilion of investments in Linux .. where is AIX /=  
 Monterey ?  H http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-4111945.html?tag=3Dst.ne.1002.thed= .ni   0 I believe it=B4s time to really "OPEN" VMS !!!!!       Regards    FC =    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 10:00:43 -0700 % From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> ' Subject: Re: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion ) Message-ID: <3A3659BB.2E8C1EC8@rdrop.com>   * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote: > I > If IBM will make US$ 1 Bilion of investments in Linux .. where is AIX /  > Monterey ?  9 Slight insider scoop, as I understand it, from a [former]  Sequent employee.   8 We all know that IBM bought Sequent, who made their name8 in Intel-based SMP platforms.  Part of the hope was that: they would be able to leverage Sequent's experience in SMP: to update AIX.  Problem is, the AIX team wasn't happy with7 all the Sequent 'newcomers' telling them what they were 7 doing wrong.  After mgmt got tired of the whining, they : pulled most of the Sequent team back.  Not wanting to lose6 the experience walking around in all those heads, they9 turned 'em loose on Linux instead.  IBM is muddling ahead  on it's own with SMP'ing AIX.    ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 17:37:38 +0000 (   ) 3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com> ' Subject: Re: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion I Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10012121732310.9622-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>   ) On Tue, 12 Dec 2000, Dean Woodward wrote:   ; > Slight insider scoop, as I understand it, from a [former]  > Sequent employee.   : > We all know that IBM bought Sequent, who made their name: > in Intel-based SMP platforms.  Part of the hope was that< > they would be able to leverage Sequent's experience in SMP< > to update AIX.  Problem is, the AIX team wasn't happy with9 > all the Sequent 'newcomers' telling them what they were 9 > doing wrong.  After mgmt got tired of the whining, they < > pulled most of the Sequent team back.  Not wanting to lose8 > the experience walking around in all those heads, they; > turned 'em loose on Linux instead.  IBM is muddling ahead  > on it's own with SMP'ing AIX.   G That's too bad for AIX.  Sequents were impressive machines -- and I say B this from experience, since I own most of (no cpu cards, yet...) aI Symettry S81.  The AIX team -- deffinately the parts of IBM that do intel ? hardware -- would have done well to listen tohe Sequent people.   D As for Fabio's really "Open" VMS, as long as the source listings areH available, it's relatively open as it is.  The only thing I'd ask for inH that direction is more POSIX support out of the box.  I hear rumors thatD this may be on the way, and, if not, it might be a relatively simple' "freeware" project to take on sometime.    Regards,   Chris   O =============================================================================== @ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmer  Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL. % ------------------------------------- I "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and H weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949  O -------------------------------------------------------------------------------    ------------------------------    Date: 12 Dec 2000 13:32:51 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)' Subject: Re: IBM + Linux + US$ 1 bilion + Message-ID: <DpulorwDWArc@eisner.decus.org>   Q In article <3A3659BB.2E8C1EC8@rdrop.com>, Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> writes: , > fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote: >>  J >> If IBM will make US$ 1 Bilion of investments in Linux .. where is AIX /
 >> Monterey ?  > ; > Slight insider scoop, as I understand it, from a [former]  > Sequent employee.  > : > We all know that IBM bought Sequent, who made their name: > in Intel-based SMP platforms.  Part of the hope was that< > they would be able to leverage Sequent's experience in SMP< > to update AIX.  Problem is, the AIX team wasn't happy with9 > all the Sequent 'newcomers' telling them what they were 9 > doing wrong.  After mgmt got tired of the whining, they < > pulled most of the Sequent team back.  Not wanting to lose8 > the experience walking around in all those heads, they; > turned 'em loose on Linux instead.  IBM is muddling ahead  > on it's own with SMP'ing AIX.     8 	Of course you mean to say "IBM is muddling ahead on its8 	own with NUMAing AIX."  IBM has been shipping SMP boxes: 	running AIX for many years and it was the NUMA technology* 	at Sequent that IBM was/is interested in.   				Rob    ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:30:44 +0100 (CET) : From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>% Subject: Re: INITIALIZE/MAXIMUM_FILES I Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0012121123460.7478-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>   ( On 9 Dec 2000 helbig@astro.rug.nl wrote:   +I'm doing some disk shuffling.  + I +Normally, I like the "sensible defaults" on VMS.  However, /HEADERS has  H +a default of 16, while the recommended value is the number of files on 
 +the disk!  =  Philip, you think that INITIALISE can know the fact that you ? will use 0,5 TB disk for only 5 database files ? Yes, knows -;) <  The default can be "optimum", the *manager* is suposed set  something !   J +There is also the /MAXIMUM_FILES qualifier.  The default seems to be set H +to half the hard-value maximum, and is usually at least a factor of 10 J +larger than the number of files I expect, so I guess I could go with the J +default here.  However, I'm wondering why /MAXIMUM_FILES doesn't default ! +to the hard-wired maximum value.   A 1. Starting with VMS 7.2 here is no hardwired maximum (even ODS-2 A  disk can use non-best-contiguos INDEXF, however previous version >  limited as you say and the *default* is still "use compatible	  values") & 2. have you check the size of INDEXF ?D  Someone sometime can be not interest with empty files somewhere -:)    D +                            I can think of circumstances where one I +perhaps would want to set it to some (much lower) specific number, so I  F +can understand why this qualifer exists.  My question is, why is the % +default half the hard-wired maximum?   8  Because noone will be happy with any default values -:)   [...] I +I'll stick with the default /CLUSTER_SIZE for now.  However, this means  F +that the maximum number of files increases much more slowly than the  +size of the disk.    Not required for VMS 7.2++ !     Regards - Gotfryd   --  E ===================================================================== F $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME . $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 10:30:05 +0000 0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com># Subject: Interactive debugger ( X ) , Message-ID: <3A35FE2D.C1CD1E02@jpmorgan.com>  D I'm using the Motif debugger ( via Exceed X-Server ) to step throughF Basic programs with ESQL. I suspect that I have something missing from> my setup as the display loses the source line it is on and theD highlighting bar disappears. Any suggestions as to what I can try to resolve this ?   Error :    stepped to SHARE$DEC$BASTRL : %DEBUG-I-SOURCESCOPE, Sourcelines not available for .0\%PC8     Displaying source in a caller of the current routine   Thanks in advance.   ------------------------------   Date: 12 Dec 2000 15:49:45 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)' Subject: Re: Interactive debugger ( X ) , Message-ID: <915hep$skt@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  _ In article <3A35FE2D.C1CD1E02@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes: E >I'm using the Motif debugger ( via Exceed X-Server ) to step through G >Basic programs with ESQL. I suspect that I have something missing from ? >my setup as the display loses the source line it is on and the E >highlighting bar disappears. Any suggestions as to what I can try to  >resolve this ?  >  >Error : >  >stepped to SHARE$DEC$BASTRL                       ^^^^^^; >%DEBUG-I-SOURCESCOPE, Sourcelines not available for .0\%PC 9 >    Displaying source in a caller of the current routine  >   K This says, "You stepped into a BASIC run time library function.  You do not + have the source code for the RTL function."   G Odds are pretty slim that your problem is within these functions in any L case, so the general solution is "don't do that", ie, don't step into basic C functions if you're stepping through manually.  That said, it isn't J uncommon for a bug to blow up a few layers deep in any languages RTL. WhatI you do in that case is step up the call stack until you hit your own code G and see what foul thing (or things) your code fed into the RTL to cause 
 that problem.    Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu ? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech     ------------------------------   Date: 12 Dec 2000 16:16:13 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)' Subject: Re: Interactive debugger ( X )i6 Message-ID: <915j0d$onq$2@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  _ In article <3A35FE2D.C1CD1E02@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:iE :I'm using the Motif debugger ( via Exceed X-Server ) to step throughSG :Basic programs with ESQL. I suspect that I have something missing from ? :my setup as the display loses the source line it is on and thetE :highlighting bar disappears. Any suggestions as to what I can try toi :resolve this ?M :  :Error : :e :stepped to SHARE$DEC$BASTRL; :%DEBUG-I-SOURCESCOPE, Sourcelines not available for .0\%PCo9 :    Displaying source in a caller of the current routinea    G   Tell your SQL pre-compiler tool to leave you with the source code for I   the particular module.  (What you write contains embedded SQL that thenMF   gets processed into the supporting SQL code and an intermediate fileG   that calls the pre-compiler-created supporting SQL routines, what the D   language compiler and the debugger sees is the intermediate file.)    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:29:15 +0100 (MET)s& From: Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de>9 Subject: Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS! 6 Message-ID: <200012120725.IAA29259@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>   Hello,  I I do work also 21 years with VMS/OpenVMS. Starting with V1.7, VMS was the0H stablest system I have ever seen. But it did not get the Awards. OpenVMSE is real good. They most problems I did see where the foreign productsdG (disk, tapes, network). I hope that OpenVMS will live additional years, G so that we can celebrate the 50th birthday of VMS. Additional question: 4 when will VMS become 25 years old (later then UNIX)?   Best regards Rudolf Wingertl   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:51:05 +0100o  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>9 Subject: Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!t+ Message-ID: <VA.000001cf.04e8dd9f@sture.ch>   E In article <912rpu$5r6$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>, Sue Skonetski   wrote:7 > From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.nospam>. > Newsgroups: comp.os.vmsC; > Subject: Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!,' > Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 10:29:57 -0500  >  > Paul,s > ( > Congratulations!  What were you doing? > I Thanks. I was working on an OLTP whose aim was to support a large number mH of terminals on a 780. It also had data/file dictionaries, journalling, K and later, transaction commit/rollback. Nice idea, never properly marketed rI IMHO. It was still available 5 years ago, but appears to have got buried e without trace nowadays.r  , > A lot has changed in 20 years of computing > J > Do you realise that 20 years ago people would not have accepted a system, > that has to be re-booted on a daily basis. >yK And I was one of them! Prior to my introduction to VMS, I'd been running a  K very successful PDP based truck parts sales ordering system, a key element  G of which was emergency telephone orders. In the late '70s we were more 4J than 24 hours ahead of our competitors in response time - they were still ) doing overnight batch runs on mainframes.   G > We still have some of the engineers that were here 20 years ago stillt	 > coding.h > ! > Paul Sture wrote in message ...eH > >If I've got my dates right, on 8-DEC-1980, I logged into my first VMS
 > >system. > >___
 > >Paul Sturel > >Switzerland > >d >I   ___v
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 12:53:17 +0000e  From: steven.reece@quintiles.com9 Subject: Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS!TH Message-ID: <OFB742ED9D.F6B8D9F8-ON802569B3.0046200C@qedi.quintiles.com>  2 Rudolf Wingert (win at fom dot fgan dot de) asked:E >>>Additional question: when will VMS become 25 years old (later thenr	 UNIX)?<<<E  I Don't know if it's later than Unix, but the launch of VMS V1 is listed intK the "Nothing Stops It! VAX VMS at 20" book as being announced in 1977.  ThecJ hardware and software were apparently announced in October of that year as :DC "In October of 1977, DIGITAL made a significant contribution to the I industry by announcing both a new architecture hardware product and a newd% architecture-based operating system.":  > From that one could say that the 25 year mark is October 2002.   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Dec 2000 09:27:12 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler)9 Subject: Re: It's 20 years since I first logged onto VMS! + Message-ID: <A7vjZX8tHKaI@eisner.decus.org>   k In article <OFB742ED9D.F6B8D9F8-ON802569B3.0046200C@qedi.quintiles.com>, steven.reece@quintiles.com writes:- > K > Don't know if it's later than Unix, but the launch of VMS V1 is listed innM > the "Nothing Stops It! VAX VMS at 20" book as being announced in 1977.  The L > hardware and software were apparently announced in October of that year as  G Since UNIX was writen in 1968, VMS must reach its 25th birthday 9 yearse1 after UNIX met it's (1968 + 25 was 1993, right?).l  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporation = NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil GroupuE                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replying    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 12:56:22 -0500 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>i3 Subject: Re: Mouse hang: AlphaStation 1000A VMS 6.2a, Message-ID: <915oth$6t1t$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  L There isn't anything broken.  Mice and keyboards using the PS2 interface areL not really hot-pluggable.  It usually works, but the Mouse/Keyboard HW isn'tF really cleanly designed (gosh, it was designed for the old IBM *PS2*).  I When the hardware works, the mouse will send a power up sequence, and the J software will re-initialize the mouse.  If it doesn't work the first time,L try, try again.  Most systems I've used, it always works.  I find occasionalF systems where I can almost never get it to work - so I assume that theL mechanical connection wasn't "clean" enough for the power up sequence to get through.  ( Try unplugging a mouse or KB on a PC :-(  K When things eventually migrate to USB, then it will truly be hot-pluggable.    _Frede  ! Alan Frisbie wrote in message ...v/ >We have an AlphaServer 1000A running VMS v6.2.a >e4 >While tidying up the cables, I unplugged the mouse.5 >When I plugged it back in, it did not function untilu1 >I rebooted.   This was unfortunate, as this is al0 >production system and I had to wait until after7 >midnight to reboot.   (I'm just glad it didn't crash!)  >-= >Is there another way to recover from this without rebooting?  >0. >Has this been fixed in later versions of VMS? >j >Thanks, >Alan+ >$ >--lC >--  Alan E. Frisbie             Frisbie "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" ComoA >--  Flying Disk Systems, Inc.   Abuse "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Comu   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:38:36 +00004% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> ( Subject: Re: New OpenVMS  Education site8 Message-ID: <8p2c3tstogl51j7l5dkiraofv7vgjcg0he@4ax.com>  E On 11 Dec 2000 18:02:11 GMT, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb) wrote:r    O >Though in our case it's now mostly Student web pages, Student mail and Oracle..O >A little bit of comparative operating systems plus a few souls still compilingw >programs. 1H >Computer science students tend to be more interested in Unix, Linux and >Microsoft.p   David,  = Out of curiousity have you had any direct contact from CompaqhD attempting to promote VMS? Preferably direct site visits. Do you get? the flood of VMS posters and if so did you have to specificallyq register for it?  B I know in six years working at Abertay Uni we saw almost no directC promotion of VMS. Just wondered if this had changed. It's my belief > that Compaq must approach remaining educational sites with any. academic VMS systems and build confidence now.   >David Webba >VMS and Unix team leaderh >CCSSn >Middlesex Universityn   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:23:48 +0000-- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> ( Subject: Re: New OpenVMS  Education site) Message-ID: <3A3626E4.FA0C4829@bbc.co.uk>U   Alan Greig wrote:-  E >  I know in six years working at Abertay Uni we saw almost no directTE > promotion of VMS. Just wondered if this had changed. It's my beliefu@ > that Compaq must approach remaining educational sites with any0 > academic VMS systems and build confidence now. >n >t  G Sadly any initiative is too late, by at least 5 years, for one academic C site I know of initimately :-(. What was a 10 node cluster is now ah* lone 3000-400 with a couple of mail users.     --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.ukn  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofu MedAS or the BBC.m   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:50:03 +0000 (UTC)e' From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@tukki.jyu.fi> ( Subject: Re: New OpenVMS  Education site, Message-ID: <915aeb$1gg$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>  2 Malcolm Dunnett <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote:  J >     The license terms says that the software may be copied onto multipleH > computers, nowhere does it say that any of those computers may be used$ > by more than one person at a time.  A But that sentence "However, the ..." already is exception to "one I individual restriction" and says multiple students on multiple computers. J Why on earth we should guess that that means one student per one computer.H I agree that it easily comes to mind, but that sentence does not say so.    > Given the "single user" natureK > everywhere else in the terms ( and the contents of the faq ), what "fact"pF > is it that leads you to presume multiple users on a single system is > permitted?  F Maybe wishful thinking, but I still see, that License text permits it.- Simple fact is that delivered PAKs permit it.pJ And fact is that FAQ12 is wrong. It says only one user and sys.manager canH log-on. (I can send you log that shows system, Tom and Jerry logged in.)  < >  These are indisputably "single-user" licenses and the faq  / I don't agree. There's the "However" exception.0  I > says they may not be combined to allow multiple users - those seem like18 > a couple of pretty solid facts to back up my argument.  D I don't know about combining. Never tried it. But multiple users are allowed by PAK.i  G >     The FAQ may not be canon, but one has to assume its contents werei? > approved by the folks managing the program, so if it says "no 4 > combining licenses" that seems pretty clear to me.  J So, why were PAKs not checked. It's very easy to put there the user limit.  J >     Of course the "under your control in a classroom environment" prettyI > much kills the usefulness anyway, no instructor around here is going to.L > use software that his students can only have access to while he's watchingF > them ( working independantly on projects is an integral part of most% > post-secondary computing courses ).q  E This may again be my bad understanding of english, but I think "underaH control" might be something like System Manager stuff. Or the instructorG may decide what is the control method, but she/he is responsible of theyG whole class? And only the computers need be under control, students mayp be elsewhere. :-)nJ I think that if Compaq leaves room fort "stretching" text that way then it is allowed.   L >> There may be different reasons and opinions among Compaq people and thereB >> may be explanations why things are not the way they seem to be. >> l  L >   There may well be, but we don't appear to be getting any clarifications.I > I emailed Compaq early in October asking for clarification of the termsrG > and explaining why it appeared they made the program of little value.h" > I haven't received any response.  H Think about if it is so that the single user mess comes from high chiefs> who don't understand meaning of time sharing (or maybe someone4 understands it too well) and there was some friendlyF person working up the license text and PAKs so that multiple users areI allowed. Now if we shout loudly enough they are forced to "correct" thoseU1 so that we really get only single user licences. t  I >    Perhaps we could take Hoff up on his offer to pass this thread alongeE > to someone in Compaq who can explain if things are as they seem andd > post their response here.n  B Perhaps, or is there any Jurist who could explain the legal stuff? (No I don't pay the bill.) V  ; My personal thoughts. Only random correlation with reality.    regardsn          Osmo Kujala   ------------------------------   Date: 12 Dec 2000 17:56:17 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)i( Subject: Re: New OpenVMS  Education site, Message-ID: <915os1$135e$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  , In article <912gl5$tq6$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>,*  Osmo Kujala <kujala@tukki.jyu.fi> writes:5 |> Malcolm Dunnett <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote:  |> uG |> >   If you go to the Compaq website and look at the FAQ posted theret4 |> > you'll see they explicitly state you MAY NOT... |> pF |> No! there's "CANNOT". And FAQ is nonessential and contains errors.  |> EM |> Malcolm, David, Phillip why are you so negative? Essential is what licensea |> grant text says:t |> h |> ...N |> However, the Software may be copied and used on multiple computers that areB |> under your control in a classroom environment, including use byF |> multiple students who have agreed to these License Terms solely for |> instructional purposes. |> ... |>  K |> This is an exception to what was said before. Is it exception to "single=I |> individual" too? I think so but i'm not a lawyer. The person who wrote,H |> FAQ seems to think differently, but it's not true that multiple usersH |> cannot log-on with one licence. (Please verify facts before arguing.) |> rL |> Maybe we should stop digging this stuff and take what License Terms give?L |> There may be different reasons and opinions among Compaq people and thereB |> may be explanations why things are not the way they seem to be. |> g |> Still maybe wrong  H You've never had to deal with lawyers, have you??  Before I could agree G to anything like this in the name of the University it would have to be0F run by our lawyers.  Anything that is in any way ambiguous or open to H interpretation would be rejected out of hand.  It's not what we think itI says that matters, it is what COMPAQ's lawyers think it says.  And if yout+ can't tell what that is, you can't risk it.$   bill   -- tJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   m   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:06:22 +0000h. From: Peter Jackson <peter.jackson@oracle.com>% Subject: Re: One world, one processori* Message-ID: <3A3606AE.7AB6BA70@oracle.com>  B > But may be inevitable. The investment needed to develop each newM > generation of faster CPU is increasing exponentially. This has two effects.n  F I don't think that is the case. ARM's model of not manufacturing CPUs,J just designing them, shows that the investment is not in the design of theH microprocessor, but in the manufacturing technology. The same technologyC can be used to make more than one processor. E.g. the StrongARM was G basically an ARM processor built using technology developed for Alphas.n  
 Peter Jacksont   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Dec 2000 09:35:07 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler)C Subject: Re: OpenVMS 6.0 reboots when I type "help" on remote logino+ Message-ID: <yfELHo2E6yCX@eisner.decus.org>,  W In article <913r83$8p5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, genkai wa doko da <gauze@my-deja.com> writes:oG >  I pretty much summed up what happens in the subject, if I login with2I > telnet or rlogin and try to use the help command the system crashes andcG > reboots. Doing the same on my vt220 clone directly connected it worksm > fine.a >   H Known bug UCX or VMS, don't recall exactly which.  Anything which clearsG the screen, such as help or type/page crashes the system when logger inSH to VMS 6.0 via UCX telnet ot rlogin.  DEC had a patch but Compaq may not? have anything since 6.0 has been out of support for many years.c  F Strongly recommend you update your software to at least something with  prior version support available.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporatione= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil GroupoE                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replyingd   ------------------------------   Date: 12 Dec 2000 16:10:58 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)C Subject: Re: OpenVMS 6.0 reboots when I type "help" on remote login,6 Message-ID: <915imi$onq$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  W In article <913r83$8p5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, genkai wa doko da <gauze@my-deja.com> writes:-F : I pretty much summed up what happens in the subject, if I login withH :telnet or rlogin and try to use the help command the system crashes andF :reboots. Doing the same on my vt220 clone directly connected it works :fine.  I   Information on the system crash itself would be useful.  For starters, .I   the CLUE CRASH information, or at least the bugcheck code and the stackO   at the time of the failure.   (   Anything interesting in the error log?  *   Any errors being logged against devices?  H   Has anything changed recently in the system configuration or hardware?   ..I :A quick search on Google on 'INVETHERNAM' returns 0 pages which leads melH :to believe I have some kind of odd problem, possibly hardware for all I :know.  '   Could be hardware, could be software.R  I :the hardware involved is a VAXstation 3100/m30 using AUI for the network:# :deal, not that I guess it matters.s  =   Exactly how big is your VAXstation 3100 series system disk?S  E   I'd encourage a move to current OpenVMS VAX -- V7.2.  Since you are6H   already at V6.0, you should have little problem moving forward to the    current OpenVMS VAX release.  G   What TCP/IP Services version?  (V4.2 with current ECO is probably thef   best choice here.)  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 16:39:17 -0000n* From: "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>C Subject: Re: OpenVMS 6.0 reboots when I type "help" on remote logins+ Message-ID: <915kbk$v0u@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>v  _ "Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.decus.org> wrote in message news:yfELHo2E6yCX@eisner.decus.org...y  J > Known bug UCX or VMS, don't recall exactly which.  Anything which clearsI > the screen, such as help or type/page crashes the system when logger inyJ > to VMS 6.0 via UCX telnet ot rlogin.  DEC had a patch but Compaq may notA > have anything since 6.0 has been out of support for many years.y  L IIRC it was UCX incorrectly using the VCB field in the UCB. The new security: model in 6.0 broke it. A slightly later UCX should fix it.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:37:20 +0000t  From: steven.reece@quintiles.comY Subject: Perceived VMS Marketing issue (Was: Re: Two NEW SKC Postings atwww.acersoft.com)9H Message-ID: <OF7795182C.F2FF547E-ON802569B3.003EFC24@qedi.quintiles.com>  I I understand David's comment on this, but it has to be tempered with some-# understanding of Compaq's position.:K Many of the folks here in the comp.os.vms group and on the InfoVAX list arenG under the impression that Compaq is just waiting for the moment to chop.I OpenVMS from its portfolio.  It isn't.  Commitment to OpenVMS from within ? Compaq and from outside is excellent and is on an upward trend.   H The fact that so many people here are worried or are listening to MessrsI Harrison and Todd with their tales of woe suggest that the installed baseeJ needs convincing that Compaq are 110% behind the continued enhancement andJ support of VMS.  This is, as I see it, where Compaq are presently heading.J Part of the programme (notably the early part) has to be to make sure thatH the installed base stays with the product rather than walking off to the competition.  J Promotion of VMS in the entire industry would be brilliant, but we must beD pragmatic.  Trying to get the whole industry to move from their UnixE systems and Windows systems and whatever else to VMS would be a great I thing, but there are functions that nothing else but VMS is right for andB6 there are those things that VMS is not best suited to.  K Let's help Compaq get the confidence of the installed base back to where itaH should be and then let's help them move forward, rather than killing VMS+ marketing and killing VMS as a consequence.e Steve.   David J Dachtera wrote:n- >>>We have. We do. We will continue to do so.s  H What we need to know is: how do we take this to Cpq's front door? How doC we take this to the OpenVMS Marketing Manager's door? Which head(s)-@ should we be dribbling on the floor? Which keesters should we be/ targetting for the space between goal posts?<<<    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:59:26 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> Y Subject: Re: Perceived VMS Marketing issue (Was: Re: Two NEW SKC Postingsatwww.acersoft.cl, Message-ID: <3A362F3A.543896A6@videotron.ca>  ! steven.reece@quintiles.com wrote:0I > under the impression that Compaq is just waiting for the moment to choptK > OpenVMS from its portfolio.  It isn't.  Commitment to OpenVMS from withinpA > Compaq and from outside is excellent and is on an upward trend.y  K If the flashing balls are a one time effort, then I would think that it wasrJ yet another "give the VMS customers just enough candy for them to shut up"K effort as we have seen many times in the past. It does not mean a long termnM commitment to VMS. Palmer had made similar "VMS will be around for at least 5 L years" speeches, but he had absolutely no credibility because the next week,E you'd see ads inciting "legacy VMS" customers to migrate to unix etc.   L > needs convincing that Compaq are 110% behind the continued enhancement andL > support of VMS.  This is, as I see it, where Compaq are presently heading.L > Part of the programme (notably the early part) has to be to make sure thatJ > the installed base stays with the product rather than walking off to the > competition. > L > Promotion of VMS in the entire industry would be brilliant, but we must be > pragmatic.    L Ahhh, but the best way to convince the installed base that Compaq is seriousG about VMS is to pitch VMS publicly. Current efforts only mimic previousxM efforts under the palmer years that had no credibility. Going public with VMSbH would truly send the message to existing customers that Compaq is really serious about VMS this time.   ------------------------------   Date: 12 Dec 2000 16:55:19 GMT From: ka2doug@cs.com (KA2DOUG)1 Subject: Re: Stalled Printer Queue On LAT Networke> Message-ID: <20001212115519.26536.00004316@ng-fu1.news.cs.com>   >@ >  $ sho term lta900:0 >1F >   Terminal: _LTA5045:   Device_Type: Unknown       Owner: SYMBIONT_3? >                                              Username: SYSTEMe >   O Try setting LTA900 as /device=LA210 or some actual print device wherever you'repD doing your SET TERM. The LTA5045 indicates that something is amiss.      Doug     Doug@KirbyAssociates.com        ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:05:01 GMT 1 From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au>g Subject: Re: Sun Cluster5 Message-ID: <N_kZ5.13$m4.1613@nostril.pacific.net.au>r  6 David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote: > andrew harrison wrote: >> V >> u@ >> Taken a beating, how quaint and what a wonderfull distortion. >> oD >> A better description of the "beating" that I have supposedly been >> subjectedJ >> to would would be that I have been savaged by a sheep or even a herd of	 >> sheep.   J > You may not want to broadcast your sexual preferences in a public forum.  > 	Who knows, Andrew might be from New Zealand originally... :-)   		Csabae  I    ----------------------------------------------------------------------gE    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehog E    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush. I    ----------------------------------------------------------------------y;    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:03:16 +0100i  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch> Subject: Re: Sun Cluster+ Message-ID: <VA.000001d0.052af056@sture.ch>s  G In article <N_kZ5.13$m4.1613@nostril.pacific.net.au>, Csaba  Harangozo   wrote:3 > From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au>y > Subject: Re: Sun Cluster > Newsgroups: comp.os.vmsp% > Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:05:01 GMTw > 8 > David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote: > > andrew harrison wrote: > >>   > >> :B > >> Taken a beating, how quaint and what a wonderfull distortion. > >> NF > >> A better description of the "beating" that I have supposedly been > >> subjectedL > >> to would would be that I have been savaged by a sheep or even a herd of > >> sheep.y > L > > You may not want to broadcast your sexual preferences in a public forum. > @ >  Who knows, Andrew might be from New Zealand originally... :-) >  Could be Wales :-)   ___y
 Paul Sture Switzerlandn   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 11:23:18 +0000h% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>a Subject: Re: Sun Cluster8 Message-ID: <hs1c3t46dcm8fijje60k0rt42nrofrkj42@4ax.com>  5 On Mon, 11 Dec 2000 11:49:10 -0500, "Fred Kleinsorge"e$ <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote:    H >I think we lost many people in the dark days, and the aftermath, of theK >decline of Digital.  We've lost many people to the promise of getting richuD >with a startup.  I can't think of many we've lost because of CompaqK >management - except as it was directly related to the takeover of Digital.rH >Most people I know here will tell you that things are much better under/ >Compaq than the last 5 years or so at DIgital.   A Where I see the problem Fred is perhaps not with what the VMS andeB Alpha teams are actually doing but how Compaq corporate publicizes< this. For example we are being flooded with red Compaq tubesE containing posters at a rate of around one per person per week. While F this is much better than previous VMS publicity even to VMS sites (andE the tubes make great Jedi light sabres) there appears to have been noaC change in general Compaq advertising and behaviour of Compaq sales.e6 Its still all NT with occasional references to Tru-64.  D I have asked repeatedly in a number of forums why third parties suchF as CA regularly mention VMS in product ads but Compaq almost never do.E These ads are seen by corporate decision makers who control spending.tC The directed VMS literature usually is not. One possible assumption(D that can be taken from this is that Compaq corporate is in two mindsF about the future of VMS. Another is that the message just hasn't fully penetrated marketing.i  B We have been promised time and time again that VMS will feature inE general Compaq ads but this hasn't actually happened to any degree. IsF agree that things seem much better than a few years ago but wonder why7 Compaq seems to have stopped short of what we expected.o  E Perhaps, looking on the bright side, Compaq management is watching to E see if VMS can turn the tide with a little bit of help and if so thent go all out to market it widely.t   Time will tell.a >h >_Fred# >As always, not speaking for Compaq, >t >  >'   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:20:33 +0000a  From: steven.reece@quintiles.com Subject: Re: Sun ClusterH Message-ID: <OFF2CBA7F4.E944596C-ON802569B3.00490EF4@qedi.quintiles.com>   Alan Grieg wrote: E >>>We have been promised time and time again that VMS will feature insE general Compaq ads but this hasn't actually happened to any degree. I)F agree that things seem much better than a few years ago but wonder why: Compaq seems to have stopped short of what we expected.<<<  G The question you would have to ask is how many genuine "general Compaq"nI advertisements there have been.  The answer is not many.  They tend to bep4 targeted at specific products with specific markets.  J In other words : Compaq are doing what they said they would.  OpenVMS doesI feature in general Compaq advertisements.  It's just that general adverts  are in the minority. Steve.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 16:02:23 GMTO From: kparris@my-deja.com- Subject: Re: Sun Cluster) Message-ID: <915i69$ibn$1@nnrp1.deja.com>l  ( In article <90rgq3$jkh$1@pyrite.mv.net>,*   "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote:F > Could you point out significant elements that weren't planned before thei > take-overa  F Compaq bought Digital in 1998.  Some significant new developments that have sprung up since then:B  o  Shadowing Mini-Copy (to make it practical to use 3rd shadowset members for snapshot backups)   o  eXtended File Cachep0  o  Fast_Path support for SCSI and Fibre Channel"  o  DECram in Galaxy shared memory7  o  Significant locking performance improvements in RMSsE  o  Free new performance data collector to be shipped with VMS, and at5 new (documented) performance API (cf. $GETSPI) in VMSa  o  Free RTR with VMSoB  o  Complete turnaround in UCX code quality, features, and supportG  o  Much more support for Unixy stuff, in addition to DII/COE: Kerberoso V5, Apache, Mozilla, Java :  o  SDA extensions for tracing lock requests and spinlocks  2 Stuff that is coming that is farther out than 7.3:  o  QIO Server  o  Fast_Path for LANs;  o  Fast_Path for Galaxy Shared Memory Cluster Interconnecte8  o  Lock Manager data structures in Galaxy Shared MemoryG -----------------------------------------------------------------------tG Keith Parris|Integrity Computing,Inc.|parris@decuserve.decus.org-nospamoF VMS Consulting: Clusters, Perf., Alpha porting, Storage&I/O, Internals    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 16:18:47 GMTo From: kparris@my-deja.comn Subject: Re: Sun Cluster) Message-ID: <915j4t$jcc$1@nnrp1.deja.com>h  * In article <3A34AB04.ABE2E2E1@uk.sun.com>,3   andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:o2 > Who are the people in Compaq who are setting theA > agenda in the industry. Who are the people in Compaq who people, outsidet. > Compaq and Compaq's customer base listen to. > D > If you were putting together a list of speakers who a hall full of non-F > Compaq technical people would come to listen to who would you put on thea > list ????v  G Richie Lary certainly comes to mind here; he has been very prominent in-@ the storage field in general and most recently in SANs.  He justE received a Lifetime Achievement Award from the I/O Technologies Forum = (see http://www.sresearch.com/itf/itf_2000/award/awards.htm).i  C John Henning also comes to mind as a thought leader in the computerr performance measurement field.  G Paul Massiglia was prominent in the field of RAID technology, and wrotenF the RAID Advisory Board's RAIDbook (see http://www.raid-advisory.com).G -----------------------------------------------------------------------nG Keith Parris|Integrity Computing,Inc.|parris@decuserve.decus.org-nospamEF VMS Consulting: Clusters, Perf., Alpha porting, Storage&I/O, Internals    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 16:44:51 +0000c% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>V Subject: Re: Sun Cluster8 Message-ID: <g5lc3tc9nfn8qi2s4chacnatqaieb1ouj2@4ax.com>  E On Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:20:33 +0000, steven.reece@quintiles.com wrote:d   >u >m >Alan Grieg wrote:F >>>>We have been promised time and time again that VMS will feature inF >general Compaq ads but this hasn't actually happened to any degree. IG >agree that things seem much better than a few years ago but wonder why ; >Compaq seems to have stopped short of what we expected.<<<a >yH >The question you would have to ask is how many genuine "general Compaq"J >advertisements there have been.  The answer is not many.  They tend to be5 >targeted at specific products with specific markets.a >eK >In other words : Compaq are doing what they said they would.  OpenVMS doeswJ >feature in general Compaq advertisements.  It's just that general adverts >are in the minority.-   Steve,  D I've seen occasional general Compaq tv ads on CNN (the hippy van for@ example). The impression gained is that Compaq are a PC company.F Strangely there is a brief glimpse of what looks like a rack of DS10LsE but unless you already know what they are it's just meaningless in my2 opinion - for what its worth...d  A Last year recall the flood of UK Compaq radio and print ads whichwA mentioned everything but VMS or Tandem. I expected to see more ofnC these types of ads but this time with VMS featured occasionally. Soe far I have seen none.m --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 17:57:32 +0000 (   )l3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>t Subject: Re: Sun ClusterI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10012121756160.9622-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>n  & On Tue, 12 Dec 2000, Alan Greig wrote:  C > Last year recall the flood of UK Compaq radio and print ads which C > mentioned everything but VMS or Tandem. I expected to see more of E > these types of ads but this time with VMS featured occasionally. Soi > far I have seen none.t  E Even if they only featured tandem, it would give the company a betterqI image -- after all, how can a "pc company" know about high-end equipment?    Regards,   Chrisi  O ===============================================================================d@ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmers Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.s% -------------------------------------'I "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes anddH weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 4O --------------------------------------------------------------------------------   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 15:50:46 -0300n) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brd Subject: Re: Sun ClusterL Message-ID: <OFE87D4EF6.B663B22D-ON032569B3.00672DA3@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  H The customer doesnt need to know about his phone call being managed by a Tandem2 or his bank account managed by a OpenVMS server...  J These platforms are to the CIO, CTO, COO, CXYZ to know and choose the bestJ platform for their customers...To the students at the Univ or Tech. School have aJ choice to develop their projects in a powerfull platforms, to ... etc ....     Regardsw   FC              6 Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> em 12/12/2000 14:44:51L                                                                             L                                                                             L                                                                                 >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                               >                                                               >  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Assunto: Re: Sun Cluster                                     >                                                                             E On Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:20:33 +0000, steven.reece@quintiles.com wrote:    >s >h >Alan Grieg wrote:F >>>>We have been promised time and time again that VMS will feature inF >general Compaq ads but this hasn't actually happened to any degree. IG >agree that things seem much better than a few years ago but wonder whya; >Compaq seems to have stopped short of what we expected.<<<r >aH >The question you would have to ask is how many genuine "general Compaq"J >advertisements there have been.  The answer is not many.  They tend to be5 >targeted at specific products with specific markets.y >mK >In other words : Compaq are doing what they said they would.  OpenVMS doestJ >feature in general Compaq advertisements.  It's just that general adverts >are in the minority.    Steve,  D I've seen occasional general Compaq tv ads on CNN (the hippy van for@ example). The impression gained is that Compaq are a PC company.F Strangely there is a brief glimpse of what looks like a rack of DS10LsE but unless you already know what they are it's just meaningless in myw opinion - for what its worth...   A Last year recall the flood of UK Compaq radio and print ads whichnA mentioned everything but VMS or Tandem. I expected to see more ofoC these types of ads but this time with VMS featured occasionally. So  far I have seen none.- --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 18:29:56 +0000 (   )i3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>s Subject: Re: Sun ClusterI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10012121827290.9622-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>t  > On Tue, 12 Dec 2000 fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:  J > The customer doesnt need to know about his phone call being managed by a > Tandem4 > or his bank account managed by a OpenVMS server...  G > These platforms are to the CIO, CTO, COO, CXYZ to know and choose the D > best platform for their customers...To the students at the Univ orE > Tech. School have a choice to develop their projects in a powerfullh > platforms, to ... etc ....  J I disagree -- the CIO/CTO/CPA/COW/CXYZ of that bank might otherwise be theJ customer who's phone call is managed by a Tandem, and would never know it.   Regards,   Chris   O ===============================================================================c@ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmere Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL. % -------------------------------------yI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes anddH weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949  O -------------------------------------------------------------------------------    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:00:45 -0500p5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>e Subject: Re: Sun Cluster, Message-ID: <915p5r$6sn6$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  : Bill Todd wrote in message <9143jh$11i$1@pyrite.mv.net>... >  >-I >While not claiming more than anecdotal knowledge, my impression was thatuL >Galaxy was set in motion (i.e., 'planned' to use my word above) well beforeJ >the take-over.  So it hardly qualifies as an answer to my question (whichF >was posed in the context of a previous note saying that the fact that CompaqI >hadn't killed already-planned VMS work when it took over hardly deserved  >excessive praise).0 >     F I can tell you that it wasn't clear that Compaq would agree.  Nor were= things far enough along that it could not easily been killed.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 13:03:34 -0500e5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>O Subject: Re: Sun Cluster, Message-ID: <915pb5$6t74$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>   Alan Greig wrote in message ...u > B >Where I see the problem Fred is perhaps not with what the VMS andC >Alpha teams are actually doing but how Compaq corporate publicizes = >this. For example we are being flooded with red Compaq tubeseF >containing posters at a rate of around one per person per week. WhileG >this is much better than previous VMS publicity even to VMS sites (and F >the tubes make great Jedi light sabres) there appears to have been noD >change in general Compaq advertising and behaviour of Compaq sales.7 >Its still all NT with occasional references to Tru-64.- >-    H IHMO it is unlikely that you will see a lot of VMS-specific general ad'sH (like TV ads), but you may see VMS as part of overall AlphaServer stuff.G Most VMS stuff is targeted to specific markets, and specific customers.-   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.693 ************************