1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 20 Dec 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 709       Contents:+ Re: "process crash" vs. "application crash" + Re: "process crash" vs. "application crash" ' Re: %SYSTEM-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline ' Re: %SYSTEM-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline 5 BACKUP ACLs (was: standalone backup, disk-saveset...)  Re: emacs 20 again Re: emacs 20 again Re: Email forwarding RE: Email forwarding Re: Fasttrack for VAX  KERMIT
 Re: KERMIT< Re: LSE (was: Re: VMS tools for Linux: EDT, TPU, TECO, LAT?)< Re: LSE (was: Re: VMS tools for Linux: EDT, TPU, TECO, LAT?) MODEM 	 Re: MODEM  NFS on OpenVMS Re: NFS on OpenVMS Re: NFS on OpenVMS/ Re: Overzealous spam filtering for compaq.com ?  Re: RIP LN03, 1987-2000  scaling an indexed file  Re: scaling an indexed file  Re: Snapshot released? Re: Sun Cluster  Re: Sun Cluster  Re: SWXCR software Re: SWXCR software" VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)& Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)& Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)& Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip) Re: Vax on a chip  Re: Vax on a chip  Re: Vax on a chip % verilog-mode.el Installation Problems   Re: Virtual I/O Cache and Oracle VMS 7.3 EFT2 Q Re: X terminal for MAC ? Re: X terminal for MAC ?  Re: XP1000 - which Graphics Card  Re: XP1000 - which Graphics Card  Re: XP1000 - which Graphics Card! Re: Y2038 (was: Re: soon enough?)   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 15:53:53 GMT  From: david_dawkins@my-deja.com 4 Subject: Re: "process crash" vs. "application crash") Message-ID: <91qkmc$5dm$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   6 In article <91lp5a$iqu$2@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>,&   hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam wrote: > # > david_dawkins@my-deja.com writes:  > :Brian Schenkenberger wrote:: > :> I find it difficult to believe that there is no trace > :> information at all ( > :> from the original poster's process. > : 1 > :Absolutely none. Not even an accounting entry.  > F >   The only time I've seen this occur is with an inner-mode bugcheck, orA >   when the process itself never got created or otherwise failed  duringG >   the creation operation.  (Process private or otherwise inaccessable F >   logical names are one classic example, as can be dependence on theF >   SYS$LOGIN or other login-derived logical name when /ACCOUNT is NOT) >   specified on the process creation...)   9 I have seen this behaviour too, when the detached process = relies on process-level logicals.  Alas, this process is well @ established when it is zapped; it typically has been running for< several days, and has processed many thousands of records of@ data. We eliminated quotas, additionally it can go into a "death@ spiral", where it cannot even be restarted for a few hours; each5 restart lasts a couple of minutes before dying again.   D >   In the case of XQP, inner-mode bugchecks are logged in the error log. > ; > If you have your own inner-mode code, all bets are off...   ; Not sure what this is, but it sounds like kernel-mode code?  In which case, there is none.   F > To force a system crash for an otherwise non-fatal bugcheck, you can+ > set the BUGCHECKFATAL system parameter...  > @ > To log the failed process creation operation, use the securityE > auditing PROCESS=CREPRC auditing mechanism, and use the termination F > mailbox.  If this was a spawn, use the process exit status argument.  ? I'll have someone decode this for me, thanks once again for the  input.   Regards,
 David Dawkins      Sent via Deja.com  http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 18:24:35 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)4 Subject: Re: "process crash" vs. "application crash"6 Message-ID: <91qth3$k8h$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  _ In article <87r934mlso.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes: 5 :hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:  : K :>   The only time I've seen this occur is with an inner-mode bugcheck, or  J :>   when the process itself never got created or otherwise failed during H :>   the creation operation.  (Process private or otherwise inaccessable : > :Or backup getting an error of some sort from a TK-50. I had a> :Tape I could bet on doing this with 7.0. Near as I could see,2 :it never even returned from the QIO, just poof... : = :If it deleted the process, that would be understandable, but 4 :it didn't. Just left you without a trace. Very odd!  F   I'd check the error log for a bugcheck entry, that sequence too has )   the symptoms of an inner-mode bugcheck.   F   The usual visible sign of an inner-mde bugcheck is a dropped networkD   connection or (when directly connected) occurs when you next press#   return -- you get a login prompt.   N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 10:33:21 GMT 1 From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au> 0 Subject: Re: %SYSTEM-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline6 Message-ID: <RV%%5.19$GH1.1576@nostril.pacific.net.au>   bawilhelm@my-deja.com wrote:F > I recently installed a TZ877 (7 tape magazine with TZ87 drive) on an? > HSD50.  I installed it as a tape device.  We have an existing G > command procedure that initializes a series of tapes that worked with C > the tape drive when connected via a SCSI card directly in our VAX 8 > 4000-705A running VMS 7.1.  I now get an error messageG > "%SYSTEM-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline" when using the procedure on the C > tape drive via the HSD50.  It seems something is timing out while B > the loader switches tapes.  Does anyone have any insight into myF > problem?  I have included the procedure.  It is not very elegant but > functions.   >  ####################    >  $!  >  $ TYPE SYS$INPUT   E >          This procedure will initialize from one to seven TK85 tape < >    cartridges.  Please fill the tape magazine and load the9 >          first tape. The label format should be C85nnn.   H >  $ INQUIRE tapes "Enter the number of tapes to be initialized (1 - 7)"  >  $ IF tapes .EQS. "" THEN EXIT; >  $ INQUIRE P1 "Enter label for first TK85 tape cartridge" $ >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 1 THEN GOTO start< >  $ INQUIRE P2 "Enter label for second TK85 tape cartridge"$ >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 2 THEN GOTO start; >  $ INQUIRE P3 "Enter label for third TK85 tape cartridge" $ >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 3 THEN GOTO start< >  $ INQUIRE P4 "Enter label for fourth TK85 tape cartridge"$ >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 4 THEN GOTO start; >  $ INQUIRE P5 "Enter label for fifth TK85 tape cartridge" $ >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 5 THEN GOTO start; >  $ INQUIRE P6 "Enter label for sixth TK85 tape cartridge" $ >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 6 THEN GOTO start= >  $ INQUIRE P7 "Enter label for seventh TK85 tape cartridge"  >  $! 
 >  $start: >  $! + >  $ DEFINE/PROCESS/NOLOG CT hsd500$mua500:  >  $!  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P1'  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT" >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 1 THEN GOTO endB >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P2'  ***********Error occurs here************* >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT" >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 2 THEN GOTO end >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P3'  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT" >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 3 THEN GOTO end >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P4'  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT" >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 4 THEN GOTO end >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P5'  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT" >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 5 THEN GOTO end >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P6'  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT" >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 6 THEN GOTO end >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P7'  >  $ SHOW TIME >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  >  $ DISMOUNT CT >  $end: >  $ SHOW TIME/ >  $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "Initialization Complete"  >  $! 	 >  $ EXIT   @ 	It takes some time to switch tapes in a magazine. I would put aB 	WAIT statement between the inits. Start with a minute value, likeC 	$ WAIT 00:01:00 , before the INITIALIZE command ( except the first  	one ). I hope this helps... 						Csaba   I    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- E    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehog E    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush. I    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ;    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 14:47:08 GMT  From: bawilhelm@my-deja.com 0 Subject: Re: %SYSTEM-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline) Message-ID: <91qgpa$1l8$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   6 In article <RV%%5.19$GH1.1576@nostril.pacific.net.au>,   csabah@zipworld.com.au wrote:  > bawilhelm@my-deja.com wrote:H > > I recently installed a TZ877 (7 tape magazine with TZ87 drive) on anA > > HSD50.  I installed it as a tape device.  We have an existing D > > command procedure that initializes a series of tapes that worked withE > > the tape drive when connected via a SCSI card directly in our VAX : > > 4000-705A running VMS 7.1.  I now get an error messageE > > "%SYSTEM-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline" when using the procedure on  the E > > tape drive via the HSD50.  It seems something is timing out while D > > the loader switches tapes.  Does anyone have any insight into myH > > problem?  I have included the procedure.  It is not very elegant but > > functions. >  > >  ####################  >  > >  $!  > >  $ TYPE SYS$INPUT  > G > >          This procedure will initialize from one to seven TK85 tape > > >    cartridges.  Please fill the tape magazine and load the; > >          first tape. The label format should be C85nnn.  > F > >  $ INQUIRE tapes "Enter the number of tapes to be initialized (1 - 7)" " > >  $ IF tapes .EQS. "" THEN EXIT= > >  $ INQUIRE P1 "Enter label for first TK85 tape cartridge" & > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 1 THEN GOTO start> > >  $ INQUIRE P2 "Enter label for second TK85 tape cartridge"& > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 2 THEN GOTO start= > >  $ INQUIRE P3 "Enter label for third TK85 tape cartridge" & > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 3 THEN GOTO start> > >  $ INQUIRE P4 "Enter label for fourth TK85 tape cartridge"& > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 4 THEN GOTO start= > >  $ INQUIRE P5 "Enter label for fifth TK85 tape cartridge" & > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 5 THEN GOTO start= > >  $ INQUIRE P6 "Enter label for sixth TK85 tape cartridge" & > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 6 THEN GOTO start? > >  $ INQUIRE P7 "Enter label for seventh TK85 tape cartridge"  > >  $!  > >  $start: > >  $! - > >  $ DEFINE/PROCESS/NOLOG CT hsd500$mua500:  > >  $!  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P1'  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT$ > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 1 THEN GOTO endD > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P2'  ***********Error occurs here************* > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT$ > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 2 THEN GOTO end > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P3'  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT$ > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 3 THEN GOTO end > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P4'  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT$ > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 4 THEN GOTO end > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P5'  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT$ > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 5 THEN GOTO end > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P6'  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT$ > >  $ IF tapes .EQ. 6 THEN GOTO end > >  $ INITIALIZE CT 'P7'  > >  $ SHOW TIME > >  $ MOUNT/FOREIGN CT  > >  $ DISMOUNT CT
 > >  $end: > >  $ SHOW TIME1 > >  $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "Initialization Complete"  > >  $!  > >  $ EXIT  > B > 	It takes some time to switch tapes in a magazine. I would put a? > 	WAIT statement between the inits. Start with a minute value,  like? > 	$ WAIT 00:01:00 , before the INITIALIZE command ( except the  first  > 	one ). I hope this helps...  F Yes but the procedure worked when the tape drive was connected via the= SCSI card in the VAX.  It seems that the HSD50 is somehow not  recognizing the loader.    - Brent Wilhelm  - Salisbury State University     Sent via Deja.com  http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 16:45:12 +0100 (CET) : From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>> Subject: BACKUP ACLs (was: standalone backup, disk-saveset...)J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0012201609010.12562-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>  - On Sat, 16 Dec 2000, David J. Dachtera wrote:  [...] I +The only advantage I've ever seen to backing up to a saveset rather than H +disk-to-disk /IMAGE is that the latter doesn't preserve ACLs where diskI +to saveset to disk does preserve ACLs. I always kinda wondered if *THAT*  +was a bug in BACKUP...   	  Hmmmm... :  Do you have already make a disk-to-disk BACKUP non-image  copy with real user data ??  It is hard to belivie, that you all time remember the use of:   /OWNER=ORIGINAL [1] ; to save the UICs of files -;>, have themself check the fact : (that at least one time the manager must forget the point,;  unimportant - but only as long you has BYPASS enabled ;>!) #  at start of my management work -:]   ;  And with the requirement of "set owner as original" BACKUP 6 *also* saves ACLs ! The point is not mentioned in HELP7 but really works. Have check this moment - but eventual " version dependence are welcome -:)  5  BACKUP is suposed for many differrent jobs - and the 6 one without /IMAGE, /INCREMENTAL etc. looks as typical3 "for normal user" one; then the defualt in the form 3 must be as default in COPY - to allow a BACKUP from ; b.ex. directory tree, where the directories are read-only !   3  The second resolution (even after "buggy" restore) 4 starting with some VMS version is SET SECURITY/LIKE.    Regards - Gotfryd: [1] please not correct me: I know that /OWNER is obsolete,:  but IMHO /BY_OWNER as output qualifier is a inconsistency:  where makes the life harder; the best description of what  I mean is: < $ SET SECURITY somefilemask/BY_OWNER=old_owner/OWNER=new_one:  and I can't see *no* reason to use consistently /BY_OWNER6  as input (selecion) but /OWNER as output ("settable")  qualifier. 8   The description in HELP (for BACKUP /BY_OWNER) also is7  written as "begginer friendly" but little untrue: "you 7  must have SYSPRV or the UIC must be you own" (in HELP) 9  is *not* exactly the same as "you must have owner access 7  of the volume or the created files" -:) (supose BYPASS '  is also a equivalent of owner access). 9   When a system works "nearly as the description is" then #  that must be a UN*X or Windows -;) !   Comments & correction welcome !  --  E ===================================================================== F $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME . $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================    ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 08:52:12 -0600& From: Charles Sebold <sebold@lcms.org> Subject: Re: emacs 20 again , Message-ID: <m3wvcv402r.fsf@sebold.lcms.org>  & On 21 Kislev 5761, Roar Throns wrote:  - > Is anything happening with Emacs 20 on VMS?   G You might ask Gerd Moellmann <gerd@gnu.org> if he has any tips on this. C I am pretty sure he is not up on VMS, but he would be most aware of C changes that other people have made or suggested.  He's the current G maintainer of Emacs.  If you sent him the changes you made, I'm sure he   would roll them into the source.  H He could also give you access to the pretest version (21), which is veryF nice.  He is more likely at this time to accept patches for 21 anyway;H he's quite busy trying to get that out.  Tell him you're working (albeitG informally, or whatever) on a VMS port and you're sure to get access, I 
 should think.   F > I tried with configure on gnv 0.3 (cc wrapper does not work, and had? > to modify configure a bit), but there were some problems with F > stdin/stdout/stderr redirecting, so configure did not work properly. > H > I then tried with ordinary DCL and borrowing mms-files and other files > from a 19_28 compile.  > ' > After a while, I got it compiled, and ) > mcr [-.vms]temacs -batch -l loadup dump  > dumped a little dump file. > F > Running emacs via kepteditor with -nw gives a bare impure emacs with
 > no lisp. >  > mcr [-.vms]temacs -l loaduph0 > manages to load most, but fails after a while. > 6 > Is it worth going through with this? (I am not sure)  F Perhaps the lisp is trying to do something unix-specific, and failing?@ I'm sure nobody has kept up the VMS allowances in the lisp filesG themselves.  I haven't tried this; does temacs recognize a --debug-initE option, or anything like that?  H I'd love to try to get further, if you could send me your temacs.exe, orG tell me roughly what you did to get this far (assuming you're not going  to take it any further). -- VF Charles Sebold, Systems Specialist                     LCMS Unix site:O LCMS - Office of Information Systems                       http://unix.ois.org/aO *** Opinions expressed herein are not necessarily ***  5E74 5869 00E0 2368 3296 O *** those of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod ***  0287 C1FD 0045 A5E2 A184A -- 23rd of Kislev, 5761 --8 Dulce et decorum est pro emacs-ia abdictum altera omnis.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 17:20:38 GMTn+ From: Craig A. Berry <calepine@my-deja.com>  Subject: Re: emacs 20 againl) Message-ID: <91qpot$a3r$1@nnrp1.deja.com>P  3 In article <977147701.485789@tornado.itea.ntnu.no>, <   Roar =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thron=E6s?= <roart@nvg.ntnu.no> wrote: > Hi >?- > Is anything happening with Emacs 20 on VMS?-   See-  H <http://www.xray.mpe.mpg.de/mailing-lists/vmsperl/2000-10/msg00096.html>  A for a mention of someone already at work porting emacs 20 to VMS.s     Sent via Deja.com$ http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 08:33:52 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)y Subject: Re: Email forwardingh0 Message-ID: <91pqtg$779$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  M In article <91of14$982$1@news.IAEhv.nl>, "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> writes:sK >Point taken, but I needed a quick answer whether this was possible or not.  [...] H >The VMS system is secure, runs forever with minimal support (SLS backupH >every week) and can connect to all kinds of  mailservers (ours anyway).K >There's some pressure to exchange this system with a unix box. The VMSmaili> >function prevents this, next to its track (up-time) record...K >I'd be sorry to see the system go (VMS won't work in new environments, youp >know).n  J Multinet is able to do what you want, PMDF as well and I assume the CompaqE product, too. Long before TCP/IP we used the following DCL procedure:l  C $ ! Procedure to forward mail from user SYSTEM to real system userse $ ! 1 $ forward_address = "@servstat:system_users.list"f $ !a $ SET NOVERIFY
 $ SET NOON $ !l< $ ! Remove old temporary files (just to be on the save side)9 $ IF F$SEARCH("sys$scratch:maildir*.tmp") .NES. "" THEN -i6      DELETE/NOLOG/NOCONFIRM sys$scratch:maildir*.tmp;* $ !o+ $ DEFINE sys$output sys$scratch:maildir.tmp  $ MAIL DIRECTORY newmailn $ DEASSIGN sys$outputa $!
 $ inum = 0- $ OPEN/READ maildfile sys$scratch:maildir.tmpm2 $ OPEN/WRITE ofile sys$scratch:maildir_extract.tmpI $ WRITE ofile "$ DEFINE/USER sys$output NL:"        ! Avoid huge logfiles  $ WRITE ofile "$ MAIL" $ WRITE ofile "SELECT newmail" $loop1:s& $    READ/END=end_loop1 maildfile line: $    number     = F$EXTRACT(  0,   5, line )	! mail number= $    source     = F$EXTRACT(  6,  21, line )	! source addressi; $    date       = F$EXTRACT( 27,  13, line )	! date of mailh? $    subject    = F$EXTRACT( 40, 100, line )	! subject complete # $    IF F$LOCATE("-", date ) .EQ. 2o $       THEN $       inum = inum + 1  $       WRITE ofile number4 $       WRITE ofile "FORWARD/SUBJ=""", subject, """"# $       WRITE ofile forward_addressp $       WRITE ofile "DELETE"
 $    ENDIF $    GOTO loop1u $end_loop1:  $ CLOSE maildfile4 $ WRITE ofile "EXIT" $ WRITE ofile "$ EXIT"
 $ CLOSE ofilen4 $ @sys$scratch:maildir_extract.tmp		! now forward...3 $ DELETE/NOLOG/NOCONFIRM sys$scratch:maildir*.tmp;*t $ !c $ isvax = F$GETSYI("ARCH_TYPE")k
 $ IF isvax	 $    THENr6 $    time = """" + F$CVTIME("+0:45","ABSOLUTE") + """"L $    SUBMIT/NONOTIFY/NOLOG/NOPRINT/AFTER='time' 'F$ENVIRONMENT("PROCEDURE")'P $    SUBMIT/NONOTIFY/NOLOG/NOPRINT/QUEUE=mpi6_batch 'F$ENVIRONMENT("PROCEDURE")' $ ENDIFi $ !i $ EXIT    K Of course it has a disadvantage because a reply will go to the account that  forwarded the mail.o   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann   H -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 10:59:08 +0000 8 From: John Macallister <J.Macallister1@physics.ox.ac.uk> Subject: RE: Email forwardingNL Message-ID: <35666012DF4CD411BE940090279FA240112016@ppnt41.physics.ox.ac.uk>  G > Is it possible to forward Email to more than one destination address?y  K Yes. I do it frequently. If you're running SMTP mail you can set up an SMTPvK alias file which can forward mail to any number of users including yourself H (i.e. keeping a copy for yourself on the system and forwarding copies toL other addresses). For the MULTINET TCP/IP package the relevant alias file is8 called SMTP_ALIASES.. . I haven't checked what UCX uses.  A I understand the alias facility is standard on UNIX SMTP. In youre, SMTP_ALIASES.. file you might have the line:  B bloggs: santa@greenland.org, somebodyelse@else.where.edu, _bloggs;    J which will result in SMTP mail for user BLOGGS being sent to the first two addresses and also to bloggs.   E DECnet mail and local mail aren't covered but if you specify the maild5 address as  user@host  I think it will use SMTP mail.c   I hope this helps.   John  B Name: John B. Macallister  E-mail: j.macallister1@physics.ox.ac.ukH Post: Nuclear and Astrophysics Laboratory, Keble Road, Oxford OX1 3RH,UKA Phone: +44-1865-273388 (direct)  273333 (reception)  273418 (Fax)    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:15:22 GMTO' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com>r Subject: Re: Fasttrack for VAX- Message-ID: <3A409414.805690AB@theblakes.com>E   Clif MacDonald wrote:d  J > I'm trying to find info on Netscape Fasttrack for OpenVMS VAX. The AlphaE > version comes with 7.2 and up but I can't find the version for VAX. H > Anyone know if  this was ever created ? If so, does it still exist and > where do I get it ?E  J FastTrack is Alpha only. There has been, and never will be, a VAX version.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:12:47 +0000h= From: Alexandra Monnot <alexandra.monnot@ceric-automation.fr>/ Subject: KERMIThJ Message-ID: <000701c06a75$c8f8f290$e10101c0@pc_monnot.ceric-automation.fr>  / Message en plusieurs parties et au format MIME.$  + ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C06A75.C8C7F780  Content-Type: text/plain;c 	charset="iso-8859-1" + Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printableD   Message BLACKLISTED=20   What ???  + ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C06A75.C8C7F780I Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1"$+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printableZ  > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD>5 <META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1252" =$ http-equiv=3DContent-Type>@ <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#c0c0c0>5 <DIV><FONT size=3D2>Message BLACKLISTED </FONT></DIV>  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>T7 <DIV><FONT size=3D2>What ???</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>   - ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C06A75.C8C7F780--    ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 14:42:05 GMT0 From: fdc@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Frank da Cruz) Subject: Re: KERMITI5 Message-ID: <91qgft$imf$1@newsmaster.cc.columbia.edu>w  J In article <000701c06a75$c8f8f290$e10101c0@pc_monnot.ceric-automation.fr>,? Alexandra Monnot  <alexandra.monnot@ceric-automation.fr> wrote:  : Message BLACKLISTED- : 
 : What ??? : H In some countries, it is against the law (or against PTT regulations) toJ dial the same number repeatedly, and in some cases this is enforced by theF telephone service provider and/or by the modem, in which case the call. fails and the failure reason is "BLACKLISTED".  C The last time I looked, these regulations were especially strict in-; France ("le rglementation anachronique draconnienne..."): y  G   Suite  un chec, vous ne devez pas fair une nouvelle tentative avant9G   que deux minutes ne se soient coules aprs le premier appel, quatreiF   aprs le second et huit aprs le troissime...  Aprs cinq nouvelles6   tentatives, le numro est mis sur la liste interdit.    ("MS-DOS Kermit, Mode d'Emploi")   - Franke  I P.S. It is considered bad manners to post the same question separately toiD many newsgroups, because then each answer only goes to one newsgroup2 instead of to all the newsgroups you posted it to.   ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 08:30:23 -0600& From: Charles Sebold <sebold@lcms.org>E Subject: Re: LSE (was: Re: VMS tools for Linux: EDT, TPU, TECO, LAT?) , Message-ID: <m31yv35fnk.fsf@sebold.lcms.org>  ' On 22 Kislev 5761, Jack Patteeuw wrote:y  ( > GNU is not Un*x and Emacs isn't LSE !! > H > LSE (Language Sensitive Editor) is a "customizable" that "understands"E > your "favorite" programming language (Fortran, Pascal, PLI, C, DCL, E > Datatrieve and even some non-DEC assemblers !!!).  I am far from aneB > expert in LSE but it can prompt you for language elements, checkA > syntax and even launch the compiler, linker and debugger.  Many F > "serious" programmer have spent considerable time adding extensions.  H Perhaps I wasn't clear.  Did you look at ELSE?  Does it not do all theseD things?  I wasn't talking about "vanilla" Emacs, I was talking about
 Emacs + ELSE.t   From the ELSE info:I   ,----EI |    The approach to Language Sensitive Editing offered here for Emacs isrJ | modelled after a feature found in an editor offered by Digital EquipmentF | Corporation called LSE. This approach to the problem does not suffer? | from any of the usual awkwardness associated with typical lseeE | implementations. It provides a natural framework for the programmerbB | where the work is limited to menu selections and "filling in theG | blanks" e.g. a typical "template" (*note Definitions::) in ELSE looks  | like:  |  |      [context_clause]...% |      package {program_unit_name} is $ |        {basic_declarative_item}... |      [private_part]$ |      end [program_unit_name];C `----   E That's fine if that's not what you're looking for, but I wanted to beTC sure you didn't think I was just suggesting Emacs as-is; it is also C capable of all this but not in the way you're accustomed, I'm sure.E  A > The "closest" non-Compaq tools to LSE are probably Code WarriorTE > (WinDOZ Only) and Visual Slick Edit (WinDOZ and Un*x).  SImilar but  > not the same.   C Actually I think CodeWarrior is available on a number of platforms,TC unless you mean that the LSE-like capability is only under Windows.  -- SF Charles Sebold, Systems Specialist                     LCMS Unix site:O LCMS - Office of Information Systems                       http://unix.ois.org/FO *** Opinions expressed herein are not necessarily ***  5E74 5869 00E0 2368 3296IO *** those of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod ***  0287 C1FD 0045 A5E2 A184  -- 23rd of Kislev, 5761 --D "I went to the museum where they had all the heads and arms from the+ statues that are in all the other museums."  		-- Steven Wright   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 15:31:18 GMT * From: "Andy Stoffel" <acs@fcgnetworks.net>E Subject: Re: LSE (was: Re: VMS tools for Linux: EDT, TPU, TECO, LAT?) 9 Message-ID: <ah406.114495$IP1.3808529@news1.giganews.com>t  3 "Charles Sebold" <sebold@lcms.org> wrote in messageD& news:m31yv35fnk.fsf@sebold.lcms.org...E > Actually I think CodeWarrior is available on a number of platforms,jE > unless you mean that the LSE-like capability is only under Windows.   I Since it started out on Macintosh that is eminently possible. Last time ItH checked is was also available for Linux , Palm, and a number of embeddedJ systems. I believe the Macintosh IDE is written in tcl (could be wrong andH I'm just confusing it with my favorite Macintosh editor "Alpha" which isA written in tcl/uses tcl as its macro language and offers LSE-likea features.).d But not on VMS.t   -Andy-   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 10:34:51 GMTs8 From: "Alexandra" <alexandra.monnot@ceric-automation.fr> Subject: MODEM3 Message-ID: <fX%%5.164$zu1.425051@nnrp5.proxad.net>o   MODEM Xo ATZ1 AD.....e MESSAGE : BLACKLISTEDo   Thank for your help. Alex.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 12:19:31 +0000v" From: Nic P Clews <nclews@csc.com> Subject: Re: MODEM@ Message-ID: <OF12A6B294.C7C2E276-ON802569BB.00436D9B@eu.csc.com>  8 This message is output by the modem, and it sounds as if5 it has disabled a number due to failed dial attempts.i  B Please see your modem documentation for details, this is NOT a VMS issue.  ' Regards Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciencest   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:03:54 -0500f% From: James Griffin <griffin@vol.com>A Subject: NFS on OpenVMSkO Message-ID: <C59E1F6889EFEDAC.195CA42D2D36D0AA.65FFBF970C9339CB@lp.airnews.net>f  
 Good morning.   A I've been trying to get the NFS server working on OpenVMS (7.2-1)   D I've enabled NFS via TCPIP$CONFIG; added proxies via TCPIP, and done2 what is generally called for in the documentation.  F However, when I try to mount my OpenVMS directory from a Unix box (SGIE running IRIX 6.5, the following appears on a terminal that's been sete with REPLY/ENABLE:  @ %TCPIP-W-NFS_NOCMAP, cannot find client record in proxy database> (TCPIP$PROXY) TCPIP-S-NFS_CLIENT, uid=0 gid=0 host_name = pear  A I then watched the packets using a packet-sniffer and found that,E5 indeed, the uid and gid in the UDP packets were zero.o  E Here's the rub.  You have to be logged in as root on a unix box to do F an NFS mount.  The uid/gid of root are 0/0.  But you can't add a proxyG for root on OpenVMS because AUTHORIZE won't let you add an account witho uid=0 and gid=0.   So how do I get this to work?S   TIA  Jim Griffinl jpg1@nrc.gov   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:31:38 -0500 0 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty.NOSPAM@sas.com> Subject: Re: NFS on OpenVMS=2 Message-ID: <xt5AOrqGZN1iU2MCPSfU3WYRs6t7@4ax.com>  ; You need to add an NFS proxy within the TCPIP product.  SeeT& TCPIP HELP ADD PROXY.  David R. Beatty  C On Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:03:54 -0500, James Griffin <griffin@vol.com>= wrote:   >Good morning. >=B >I've been trying to get the NFS server working on OpenVMS (7.2-1) >DE >I've enabled NFS via TCPIP$CONFIG; added proxies via TCPIP, and done:3 >what is generally called for in the documentation.o >lG >However, when I try to mount my OpenVMS directory from a Unix box (SGInF >running IRIX 6.5, the following appears on a terminal that's been set >with REPLY/ENABLE:o >hA >%TCPIP-W-NFS_NOCMAP, cannot find client record in proxy databasea? >(TCPIP$PROXY) TCPIP-S-NFS_CLIENT, uid=0 gid=0 host_name = pearh >uB >I then watched the packets using a packet-sniffer and found that,6 >indeed, the uid and gid in the UDP packets were zero. >aF >Here's the rub.  You have to be logged in as root on a unix box to doG >an NFS mount.  The uid/gid of root are 0/0.  But you can't add a proxyeH >for root on OpenVMS because AUTHORIZE won't let you add an account with >uid=0 and gid=0.  >  >So how do I get this to work? >  >TIA >Jim Griffin
 >jpg1@nrc.govh   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:49:02 -0500g' From: Jack Patteeuw <jpatteeu@ford.com>w Subject: Re: NFS on OpenVMSe( Message-ID: <3A40E2FE.9EA348F4@ford.com>   James Griffin wrote: >  > Good morning.d > C > I've been trying to get the NFS server working on OpenVMS (7.2-1)e > F > I've enabled NFS via TCPIP$CONFIG; added proxies via TCPIP, and done4 > what is generally called for in the documentation. > H > However, when I try to mount my OpenVMS directory from a Unix box (SGIG > running IRIX 6.5, the following appears on a terminal that's been set. > with REPLY/ENABLE: > B > %TCPIP-W-NFS_NOCMAP, cannot find client record in proxy database@ > (TCPIP$PROXY) TCPIP-S-NFS_CLIENT, uid=0 gid=0 host_name = pear > C > I then watched the packets using a packet-sniffer and found that,i7 > indeed, the uid and gid in the UDP packets were zero.h > G > Here's the rub.  You have to be logged in as root on a unix box to doeH > an NFS mount.  The uid/gid of root are 0/0.  But you can't add a proxyI > for root on OpenVMS because AUTHORIZE won't let you add an account witha > uid=0 and gid=0.     Not entirely true !!  H Use automounter (which I will **NOT** try to explain how to set up here)F to automount the users directories, or mount the directory as root and. the su - <username> and cd to the mount point.   Works fine, lasts a long time !5  C Of caveat, NFS on OpenVMS is a V2 implementation meaning is doesn'ti> quite completely handle "long" (greater than 16 bit) uids.  My@ understanding is the "next" version of OpenVMS TCPIP will be V3.    
 Jack Patteeuwj   ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 13:12:28 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)o8 Subject: Re: Overzealous spam filtering for compaq.com ?+ Message-ID: <Ug+YxHbNn8lM@eisner.decus.org>2  R In article <G5up8J.H28@spcuna.spc.edu>, Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com> writes:) > Jeremy Begg <jeremy@vsm.com.au> writes:yF >> It appears that Compaq has made an "interesting" (to put it mildly)E >> change in the configuration of their mail gateways and/or servers.2A >> Any message which is purportedly from an address in compaq.com:D >> and destined for a user in compaq.com, but which is received from= >> outside Compaq, is rejected with an "access denied" error.l >>I >> On the face of it that appears to be a reasonable thing to do.  But insF >> practice it raises some serious problems.  For example, if a CompaqI >> employee sends a message to a mailing list outside of Compaq, and that K >> list includes Compaq employees on it, the Compaq employees won't receivet >> the message.  > N >   Hmmm. DECUS (via the former outsourcing firm) made a similar mistake aboutK > DECUS.ORG some time ago, but it has since been fixed (and the outsourcing * > firm no longer does any work for DECUS).  8 But does the outsourcing firm now work for Compaq ?  :-)  N ==============================================================================N Great Inventors of our time: Al Gore -> Internet; Sun Microsystems -> ClustersN ==============================================================================   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:51:58 -0700"% From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com>O  Subject: Re: RIP LN03, 1987-2000) Message-ID: <3A40FFCE.F94264EF@rdrop.com>l   Mark Sterk wrote:E > S > Be careful I am not sure of the classification of this laser but could be harmful: > to your eyes.P  8 Yes- be careful not to look at laser with remaining eye.  J > Just beside the laser (some years ago for me) there is a heatsink with aO > peltier-cooler, if you put 12 Volts on this thing you can build your own minif< > fridge I have done some nice experiments with this gadget.  5 IIRC, you plug it in backwards and it generates heat?u   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 17:18:54 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)  Subject: scaling an indexed file, Message-ID: <91qplu$buf@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  K I know that VMS is scalable but my own experiences are with small servers  BI and 2 or 3 node clusters, so I don't have much of a feel for what happensfF when things really become big.  This had me wondering just how scaling" might occur in some simple cases.   K Here's one hypothetical scenario.  A single small VMS machine is configuredrK to run a web server and through that maintain a single indexed file.   This$I file contains a catalog of products for a small company (for instance.)  +W Through the web interface these three actions with respect to that file are supported: "  X   1.  add data.  A small amount of data (256 bytes, fixed) is added sequentially to the O       indexed file as a single record, and the record number (key) is returned.i       (2% of activity)K   2.  retrieve data. The key is supplied by the user, that record is looked-        up, and its data returned.       (98% of activity) L   3.  modify data.  The key and a password are supplied by the user.  The   I       record is looked up with the key, the internal password it containstH       checked against that stored in the record, the record is modified,#       and is rewritten to the file.        (<<1% of activity)  G The data is important, so it must be physically stored on at least two +J disks.  Once data is accepted through the interface it MUST be safe.  Loss of any data is unacceptable.  F This is a pretty simple application. For a small numbers of hits and aH small amount of data it would run fine on a DS10 using disk shadowing orF even just operating on two files in parallel.  However as time goes onK demand grows, and grows, and grows.  The number of records goes up into thelD hundreds of millions or billions and the number of retrieve requestsI rockets upwards into millions per day.  All of a sudden the small catalog L isn't small anymore and you're running the parts catalog for General Motors!  D How do you scale it?   I can see that to start with you can add moreD cluster nodes and leave the data on one machine (or shadow it acrossD multiple machines.)   Assuming that these are clustered via 100baseTE what's going to be rate limiting for the 3 processes described above?fH Record locking?  Packet rates?  What would be the maximum rate you couldD achieve for each of the 3 processes in an N node cluster (assume allB DS10s)?   Then demand exceeds those limits.  What do you do next?   E I'm guessing that at some point this problem essentially evolves intorK a cloud of front end systems, which handle the vast majority of simple datafK retrieval requests, and one or more back end systems that handle data entryFF and modification.  But is there a natural point at which this occurs?   K Might this same process be accomplished better on a different OS?  If not, X( what is it that gives VMS the edge here?   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduf? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech e   ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 13:36:35 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)d$ Subject: Re: scaling an indexed file+ Message-ID: <CUTJ5dr3FNQL@eisner.decus.org>   a In article <91qplu$buf@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:   H > This is a pretty simple application. For a small numbers of hits and aJ > small amount of data it would run fine on a DS10 using disk shadowing orH > even just operating on two files in parallel.  However as time goes onM > demand grows, and grows, and grows.  The number of records goes up into theoF > hundreds of millions or billions and the number of retrieve requestsK > rockets upwards into millions per day.  All of a sudden the small cataloghN > isn't small anymore and you're running the parts catalog for General Motors!  D I did not read anything in the description regarding alternate keys.B If this is a single key (single index) file, it really is uniquelyD simple.  If you are assigning successive key values, all your bucket@ splits will be localized to one part of the index tree.  If yourA updates never increase the size of the data, you will never split=A a data bucket once it is filled.  If I am wrong, Hein from Compaq0 will correct me :-).  F > How do you scale it?   I can see that to start with you can add moreF > cluster nodes and leave the data on one machine (or shadow it acrossF > multiple machines.)   Assuming that these are clustered via 100baseTG > what's going to be rate limiting for the 3 processes described above?t  7 I vote for index bucket locking on new record addition.   J > Record locking?  Packet rates?  What would be the maximum rate you couldF > achieve for each of the 3 processes in an N node cluster (assume allD > DS10s)?   Then demand exceeds those limits.  What do you do next?   C When demand exceeds your DS10 capacity, switch to a Wildfire/GalaxyAC and hopefully by then (if not today) locking and RMS global bufferslC will be in Galactic sections.  There was an interesting Rdb talk at"@ DECUS in Los Angeles pointing out that although Rdb pages may beD cached in "far" NUMA memory when viewed from a particular processor,@ the decompressed version of that data will be in local processor? memory.  The same should be true for RMS (if they do it right).l  G > I'm guessing that at some point this problem essentially evolves intosM > a cloud of front end systems, which handle the vast majority of simple datapM > retrieval requests, and one or more back end systems that handle data entryeH > and modification.  But is there a natural point at which this occurs?   C I think front end systems are only for dealing with the user, while:G reads and updates should be on the core backend.  Don't let the backendD9 do anything but RMS (if you are performance constrained).c  M > Might this same process be accomplished better on a different OS?  If not, g* > what is it that gives VMS the edge here?  D I cannot say definitively what the behaviour of another OS would be.@ OS/400 has a database built in, so using that would be the "fairH comparison" to using Rdb on VMS.  On Guardian (NSK) I believe "Enscript"E may be the equivalent.  Certainly the successor to ISAM on MVS shouldg+ count as fair since it is "almost bundled".   E On other operating systems you would typically do this with an add-onlB database (Codasyl might win you something over relational for thisA problem statement).  You be the judge as to whether that is fair.e  C If you scale this problem far enough, you will run into performance F issues (as with any problem) on any operating system.  I think a majorD advantage with RMS is that you will not have database vendors and OS' vendors pointing fingers at each other.a  > Multiple copies of the data may help with your high read rate,> but data integrity can be accomplished with RMS journaling.  A2 tradeoff on recovery time is for you to calculate.  N ==============================================================================N Great Inventors of our time: Al Gore -> Internet; Sun Microsystems -> ClustersN ==============================================================================   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 17:03:30 +0100 (CET) : From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl> Subject: Re: Snapshot released? J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0012201701510.12562-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>  * On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 kuff@tessco.com wrote: [...]dK +Does anyone know if in fact one can cause the snapshots to occur from VMS?   8  At least with connection to console it is supported -:)0  Done, works (this time with minor limitations).    Regards - Gotfryd   -- yE ===================================================================== F $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME/. $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:56:13 +0000l0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> Subject: Re: Sun Cluster* Message-ID: <3A409E5D.D11D39A3@uk.sun.com>   "Richard D. Piccard" wrote:  > G > Can you re-check your OZ sources on the reason for failing acceptance M > testing?  I heard a rumor it stayed up long enough but just ran too slowly.L > % >                                 RDPa >   G The rumour that it failed it acceptance tests because of unreliability r* was speculation (FUD) on Rob Youngs part.    Regardsr Andrew HarrisonI Enterprise IT Architecti   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:53:19 +0000i0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> Subject: Re: Sun Cluster* Message-ID: <3A409DAF.9DF314FD@uk.sun.com>   Jordan Henderson wrote:  > , > In article <3A3E416B.2C22A9B2@uk.sun.com>,5 >   andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:a > > Jan Vorbrueggen wrote: > > >a8 > > > andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes: > > > G > > > > If you were putting together a list of speakers who a hall fullt > of nonI > > > > Compaq technical people would come to listen to who would you put  > on the > > > > list ????m > > >e > > > Leslie Lamport > > > John Henning > > >f > >1? > > Just as a test I tried your two names out on a room full ofS> > > people who included a number of OpenVMS administrators and= > > developers, the customers chief architect and a number of 3 > > other developer/system admin and security bods.M > >s > B > Anyone else find it interesting that we are supposed to believe,@ > all at the same time, that Andrew is not in marketing, none ofC > his customers use OpenVMS, as he's reported here in the past, andeB > yet he's able to get a room full of people together, including a2 > number of OpenVMS administrators and developers? >   < The customer I work for has purchased another company which ; happens to have a large OpenVMS infrastructure. The OpenVMS99 folks all come from the company that has been bought and n& assimilated if that is the right term.  < But really Jordan, nearly every large company has a mixture < of systems and the company I am working for is no different.  @ Their standard server suppliers are IBM and Sun, S390's and AIX @ from IBM and Solaris based systems from Sun. They of course have= Niles, HP's, OpenVMS and Tru64 based systems as well because  A they either needed an app that only runs on one of these systems dD or because in the case of OpenVMS they have a legacy infrastructure 4 that they aquired when they aquired another company.  ? Nor would it be suprising if indeviduals have both say UNIX andc= OpenVMS skills, its certainly the case with the company I am s< working for since they are migrating from OpenVMS to AIX and Solaris.  < > By his own statements, it sounds more believable that he's@ > actually a technical resource, groomed in OpenVMS technologies7 > to counter any marketing one might see out of Compaq.v >   = The fact that you find this unbelievable is more a testiment  $ to your own bias than anything else.  > > That's certainly what he does here.  I'd wager you'd be hard@ > pressed to find a Sun employee who knows more about Compaq and > OpenVMS than Andrew.  > I very much doubt that that is true either. I have 2 collegues> both technical who sit within 10 yards of my desk, one worked C for Compaq supporting OpenVMS and one left a few days prior to the  1 Compaq takeover and was also in OpenVMS support. $ of Digital,    regards  Andrew Harrison  Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 09:30:55 +0100r( From: John HILL <hill@hep.phy.cam.ac.uk> Subject: Re: SWXCR softwareo0 Message-ID: <3A406E3F.5C001F0@hep.phy.cam.ac.uk>  D Incidentally, can anyone confirm that the firmware file swxcrfwp.270E in the location quoted below is OK for both the KZPSC-BA and KZPAC-CA G RAID controllers? The documentation suggests it is valid for both theseeC cards, but I'd be interested to know of real experiences out there.. Regards,	 John Hille   Dirk Munk wrote: > - > It depends what you mean by SWXCR software.r > J > In case you mean configuration software, it is not possible to configure > a SWXCR by a VMS utility. J > There is a special configuration utility that has to be started from the > boot prompt of you Alpha.-I > Disks/raid sets configured on the SWXCR are automatically discovered byk > VMS as DRxn disks.3 > Look at this link for all utilities and firmware:3 > E > ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/Alpha/firmware/v5.8/utility/swxcrmgr/  > ) > And beware: The DEC2000 is a Jensen !!!i > 
 > Regards, >  > Dirk >   > Carlc Internet Services wrote: > >p > > Hello comp.os.vms, > > L > >     I have a DEC2000 box with the SWXCR card. The previous sysmgr didn't > > load the swxcr software O > > to control it. I can't find a copy of the SWXCR software for OpenVMS on anyt > > of my disks...8^(P > >AO > >     Can someone help? Either tell me the disk its on (OpenVMS dist? LayeredT > > Products? etc?) soM > > I can properly manage this little box. Or is this a "call Field Service",p > > they have it???n > >t > >     Many thanks, > >     Carl7 > >     (reply to:        ccouric ---at--- fhp-mfg.com)    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 09:20:59 -0500o% From: "Islandco" <sales@islandco.com>o Subject: Re: SWXCR softwarea/ Message-ID: <t41focqlidj389@corp.supernews.com>   L Yes it is the correct firmware - but we have had more luck using the Version 2.49 compatibility-wiset   DT   -- Island Computers US Corporationo 2700 Gregory Streetr	 Suite 150o Savannah GA 31404s Tel: 912 447 6622h Fax: 912 201 0096o sales@islandco.com www.islandco.com  C This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and J may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.H They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whomE they are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intendedi
 recipient,G please notify Island Computers US Corp immediately and then delete thist message.I You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copying5 of this message is prohibited.    3 John HILL <hill@hep.phy.cam.ac.uk> wrote in messagem* news:3A406E3F.5C001F0@hep.phy.cam.ac.uk...F > Incidentally, can anyone confirm that the firmware file swxcrfwp.270G > in the location quoted below is OK for both the KZPSC-BA and KZPAC-CAiI > RAID controllers? The documentation suggests it is valid for both these E > cards, but I'd be interested to know of real experiences out there.w
 > Regards, > John Hillr >l > Dirk Munk wrote: > >t/ > > It depends what you mean by SWXCR software.t > > L > > In case you mean configuration software, it is not possible to configure > > a SWXCR by a VMS utility.iL > > There is a special configuration utility that has to be started from the > > boot prompt of you Alpha.eK > > Disks/raid sets configured on the SWXCR are automatically discovered by  > > VMS as DRxn disks.5 > > Look at this link for all utilities and firmware:f > >(G > > ftp://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/Alpha/firmware/v5.8/utility/swxcrmgr/o > >e+ > > And beware: The DEC2000 is a Jensen !!!  > >= > > Regards, > >= > > Dirk > >=" > > Carlc Internet Services wrote: > > >a > > > Hello comp.os.vms, > > >-G > > >     I have a DEC2000 box with the SWXCR card. The previous sysmgr= didn't > > > load the swxcr software=J > > > to control it. I can't find a copy of the SWXCR software for OpenVMS on any > > > of my disks...8^(w > > >cI > > >     Can someone help? Either tell me the disk its on (OpenVMS dist?p Layered  > > > Products? etc?) soE > > > I can properly manage this little box. Or is this a "call Fieldb	 Service",  > > > they have it???- > > >e > > >     Many thanks, > > >     Carl9 > > >     (reply to:        ccouric ---at--- fhp-mfg.com)r   ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 13:06:48 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)m+ Subject: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip) + Message-ID: <CLo+xHR$UbHh@eisner.decus.org>t  R In article <G5uJou.BvK@spcuna.spc.edu>, Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com> writes:  J >   I'd expect that a VAX architecture emulator (for, say, the MicroVAX IIJ > subset implementation) could exceed the performance of a real MV II whenI > run on a reasonably modern Intel processor, even if coded in a HLL. ThedL > Charon-VAX page claims 1 VUP per 100MHz, so a 90MHz original Pentium wouldJ > be faster than a MicroVAX II. So a hardware solution would be at a speed > disadvantage.e  @ If, however, one wanted the performance of a VAXstation 4000-96,< wouldn't one need a host processor running at roughly 4Ghz ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 10:34:36 -0800c! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.comh/ Subject: Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)uD Message-ID: <OFF8B13F9E.AEB22AC7-ON882569BB.006529C7@foundation.com>  I Worse. It might be a 4ghz on the PIII architecture scale, but there won'ttC be any 4ghz PIII's. The P4 is performing badly in benchmarks from aeE work-per-cycle point of view, so it'd have to be an even higher clock J speed. They're planning 2ghz late next year, so I'd guess 4ghz sometime inG late 2002 or early 2003. You'd have to be using DDR RAM too, probably aiH double pumped 150mhz or higher - I have serious doubts about RAMBUS evenE existing that far out, based on the beating they're taking today. The E current PCI bus and disks probably wouldn't be a bottleneck for a VAXoG emulator, but the kind of machine we're talking about may well be usingt. souped-up serial ATA and PCI-X by then anyway.   Shanes          ; Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam on 12/20/2000 10:06:48 AMF   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coma cc:l  , Subject:  VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)    J In article <G5uJou.BvK@spcuna.spc.edu>, Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com> writes:   J >   I'd expect that a VAX architecture emulator (for, say, the MicroVAX IIJ > subset implementation) could exceed the performance of a real MV II whenI > run on a reasonably modern Intel processor, even if coded in a HLL. ThesF > Charon-VAX page claims 1 VUP per 100MHz, so a 90MHz original Pentium wouldoJ > be faster than a MicroVAX II. So a hardware solution would be at a speed > disadvantage.h  @ If, however, one wanted the performance of a VAXstation 4000-96,< wouldn't one need a host processor running at roughly 4Ghz ?   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 19:06:44 +0000 (   )a3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>v/ Subject: Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)rI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10012201905540.2792-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>e  6 On Wed, 20 Dec 2000 Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com wrote:  K > Worse. It might be a 4ghz on the PIII architecture scale, but there won'tiE > be any 4ghz PIII's. The P4 is performing badly in benchmarks from asG > work-per-cycle point of view, so it'd have to be an even higher clock L > speed. They're planning 2ghz late next year, so I'd guess 4ghz sometime inI > late 2002 or early 2003. You'd have to be using DDR RAM too, probably adJ > double pumped 150mhz or higher - I have serious doubts about RAMBUS evenG > existing that far out, based on the beating they're taking today. The-G > current PCI bus and disks probably wouldn't be a bottleneck for a VAXsI > emulator, but the kind of machine we're talking about may well be usingC0 > souped-up serial ATA and PCI-X by then anyway.  B But, would the hardware be anywhere near as reliable as VAX stuff?   Regards,   Chriss  O ===============================================================================o@ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmer  Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.d% -------------------------------------iI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes anduH weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 cO -------------------------------------------------------------------------------g   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 16:54:42 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brc/ Subject: Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)eL Message-ID: <OFB9DD3ADE.FE55542D-ON032569BB.006D3D25@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  C These people form CHARON-VAX should contact VMware people to make ae
 technologicaln'  agreement....knowledge $haring ! :-))).   Regardso   FC              2 Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com em 20/12/2000 16:34:36L                                                                             L                                                                             L                                                                                 >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                               >                                                               >  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Assunto: Re: VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)              >                                                                               I Worse. It might be a 4ghz on the PIII architecture scale, but there won'toC be any 4ghz PIII's. The P4 is performing badly in benchmarks from aoE work-per-cycle point of view, so it'd have to be an even higher clocksJ speed. They're planning 2ghz late next year, so I'd guess 4ghz sometime inG late 2002 or early 2003. You'd have to be using DDR RAM too, probably aiH double pumped 150mhz or higher - I have serious doubts about RAMBUS evenE existing that far out, based on the beating they're taking today. TheoE current PCI bus and disks probably wouldn't be a bottleneck for a VAXiG emulator, but the kind of machine we're talking about may well be usinga. souped-up serial ATA and PCI-X by then anyway.   Shaneu          ; Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam on 12/20/2000 10:06:48 AMr   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComM cc:n  , Subject:  VAX emulation (was: Vax on a chip)    J In article <G5uJou.BvK@spcuna.spc.edu>, Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com> writes:a  J >   I'd expect that a VAX architecture emulator (for, say, the MicroVAX IIJ > subset implementation) could exceed the performance of a real MV II whenI > run on a reasonably modern Intel processor, even if coded in a HLL. The F > Charon-VAX page claims 1 VUP per 100MHz, so a 90MHz original Pentium wouldsJ > be faster than a MicroVAX II. So a hardware solution would be at a speed > disadvantage.w  @ If, however, one wanted the performance of a VAXstation 4000-96,< wouldn't one need a host processor running at roughly 4Ghz ?   ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 10:18:09 -06003 From: rivie@server.newlogan.teraglobal (Roger Ivie)c Subject: Re: Vax on a chip> Message-ID: <slrn941n4g.11ij.rivie@server.newlogan.teraglobal>  < In article <G5uJou.BvK@spcuna.spc.edu>, Terry Kennedy wrote:K >  VAX chips have been out of production for > 5 years (the last VAXen were=K >built with chips made a long time ago, before DEC sold its fabs to Intel).: [[[ snip ]]]K >  Alpha chips are probably a closer fit, since the smaller Alpha boxes are:L >pretty close to PC architecture, but with an Alpha chip instead of an IntelM >one. However, just because those systems can control a PCI bus, doesn't mean ; >that the same parts could operate as a PCI bus peripheral.r  H Bear in mind that one flavor of the last round of VAX chips was (mostly)E pin-compatible with the 21064. An NV5, an APECS chipset, and a bit ofyE imagination yields a VAX with PCI. Been there, done that, didn't have ; enough funding or manpower to write my own SYSLOA module..." -- L
 Roger Ivie% TeraGlobal Communications Corporation & 1770 North Research Park Way Suite 100 Logan, UT 84341= mailto:rivie@teraglobal.com= phoneto:(435)787-0555- faxto:(435)787-0516     > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!9> -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 14:49:20 -0300e) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brn Subject: Re: Vax on a chipL Message-ID: <OF9ED355DF.A341FD6D-ON032569BB.0061D9BA@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   It was just an idea....s   Look at  www.siamese.co.uk   RegardsD   Fabio C.                  7 rivie@server.newlogan.teraglobal em 20/12/2000 14:18:09-  & Favor responder a rivie@teraglobal.comL                                                                             L                                                                             L                                                                                 >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                               >                                                               >  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Assunto: Re: Vax on a chip                                   >                                                                             < In article <G5uJou.BvK@spcuna.spc.edu>, Terry Kennedy wrote:K >  VAX chips have been out of production for > 5 years (the last VAXen wereeK >built with chips made a long time ago, before DEC sold its fabs to Intel).r [[[ snip ]]]K >  Alpha chips are probably a closer fit, since the smaller Alpha boxes aretF >pretty close to PC architecture, but with an Alpha chip instead of an Intel9H >one. However, just because those systems can control a PCI bus, doesn't mean; >that the same parts could operate as a PCI bus peripheral.   H Bear in mind that one flavor of the last round of VAX chips was (mostly)E pin-compatible with the 21064. An NV5, an APECS chipset, and a bit of E imagination yields a VAX with PCI. Been there, done that, didn't have ; enough funding or manpower to write my own SYSLOA module...  --
 Roger Ivie% TeraGlobal Communications Corporatione& 1770 North Research Park Way Suite 100 Logan, UT 84341  mailto:rivie@teraglobal.comt phoneto:(435)787-0555  faxto:(435)787-0516n    > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 18:37:47 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: Vax on a chip6 Message-ID: <91qu9r$kkd$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  h In article <OF2B58A019.E9042353-ON882569BA.0071A6B1@foundation.com>, Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com writes: :c6 :...Interesting idea, an Alpha board in a PC. You keepH :your Office stuff, and you have a real computer in the same box for the :serious stuff..... Hmmm.....b :hI :Hey, Q guys - he might have something here. Call it an "enhanced windows0 :machine"...  I   This is an idea has been around for eons and has not been a particular  K   success in most contexts... I've seen Q-bus PC boards, network-based PCs  D   with remote displays on OpenVMS and UNIX hosts, and various other H   permutations of combining two architectures into one box using either    software or hardware.     K   Search keywords for similar products include Logicraft, 386ware, SoftPC,  J   SoftWindows, DECmigrate, FX!32.  I'm sure folks here can cite other and L   older and newer products and vendors.  Various of these vendors and other H   have tried this and related markets over the years -- and with varying   degrees of success.n  L   Few vendors and few of these approaches have been particularly successful J   in this market, save for in some very specific applications and/or very J   specific markets -- the business model, the size of the target customer H   base and (without the benefits of volume) the relatively high product 0   costs can combine to be somewhat of a problem.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 16:28:25 GMTe From: brusque@my-deja.com!. Subject: verilog-mode.el Installation Problems) Message-ID: <91qmms$78f$1@nnrp1.deja.com>o  - Am trying to setup emacs with verilog-mode.elh. I followed the installation procedure outlinedD here(http://www.verilog.com/emacs_install.html#windows) and rebootedA then tried to run emacs and it only flashes across the screen and C disappears. I rechecked the setup and can't find any discrepencies. B If I execute "runemacs.exe", emacs starts righ up, but without theE verilog-mode.el settings. Any suggestions on how to debug this setup?t   Many Thankst Bill     Sent via Deja.com  http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 17:07:49 GMT- From: "Phil Tregoning" <ptregoni@esoc.esa.de>n) Subject: Re: Virtual I/O Cache and OracleX= Message-ID: <01c06aa5$63b617c0$4b53b083@ptregoni.esoc.esa.de>   5 Arne Vajhj <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in articleu  <3A38E9DA.CBC9043D@gtech.com>... >i$ > Usually the alternatives would be: > 6 > 50 MB Oracle Cache + 50 MB VIOC containing same data > 100 MB Oracle Cache7 > . > And the latter should be significant faster. >   ; And don't forget to put the SGA in reserved memory, so thatc Oracle can use Fast I/O.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 08:35:30 -0600e1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>n Subject: VMS 7.3 EFT2 Qd8 Message-ID: <91qfs1$s78$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>  F Saw on the VMS web page today that EFT2 for VMS 7.3 has been released.  K Went to www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/sdk.html and found reference to EFT1iL but no mention of EFT2, except for the SDK scheduled to be available in Oct. Y2K.   Anyone found notes on EFT2?3  G Also saw vmsnet.sdk.openvms.fieldtest mentioned as a newsgroup for 7.3.a Nothing in it yet.   Dave...0   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 15:46:56 GMTi3 From: skidmore@alternate-venue.org (Barry Skidmore)s! Subject: Re: X terminal for MAC ?t0 Message-ID: <3a40d401.263098487@news.iquest.net>  F Thanks, that's just what I needed.  In case anyone else is interested, here are the pinouts:   - WIRES1. Looking for connector wiring pinouts?i   DECconnect DEC-423 MMJ pinout:     1: Data Terminal Ready (DTR)   2: Transmit (TXD)h   3: Transmit Ground (TXD-)n   4: Receive Ground (RXD-)   5: Receive (RXD)   6: Data Set Ready (DSR)       +------------------+d    | 1  2  3  4  5  6 |i    +------------+    ++                  +____+  7 On Tue, 19 Dec 2000 21:00:46 -0600, "David J. Dachtera" $ <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote:   >Barry Skidmore wrote: >> oB >> I have a related question about using a Mac to interface with aD >> MicroVAX (3100-40).  I can connect OK to the DB25 port on the VAX? >> using the Mac, but cannot get it to work using the RJ25-likexF >> connector.  Can someone give me the pin-outs from this connector so >> that I can make a cable?i >I >See the OpenVMS FAQ.h >W >--  >David J. Dachtera >dba DJE Systems >http://www.djesys.com/  > ; >Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:   >http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ >?G >This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postingsl >is to be expected.  >yA >Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  > G >However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are- >strongly discouraged.   ------------------------------    Date: 20 Dec 2000 09:13:06 -0600& From: Charles Sebold <sebold@lcms.org>! Subject: Re: X terminal for MAC ?x, Message-ID: <m3snnj3z3x.fsf@sebold.lcms.org>  " On 21 Kislev 5761, JF Mezei wrote:  F > Is there an X terminal emulator for macintosh available on the net ?C > (so that I could use the mac as a second screen onto a vaxstatione > (which has a b/W screen).V  H Probably not "available on the net" anywhere, but if you can find an oldC copy of MacX, I have found it to be quite nice.  MacOS provides thenH "window manager," and it is fairly customizable and I believe it does do cut and paste.  C It is very old MacTCP/68K software but it does still work with OpenXB Transport and PowerPC's running Mac OS 9, plenty fast enough to be useable. -- -F Charles Sebold, Systems Specialist                     LCMS Unix site:O LCMS - Office of Information Systems                       http://unix.ois.org/pO *** Opinions expressed herein are not necessarily ***  5E74 5869 00E0 2368 3296.O *** those of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod ***  0287 C1FD 0045 A5E2 A184  -- 23rd of Kislev, 5761 -- Wit, n.:= 	The salt with which the American Humorist spoils his cookery  	... by leaving it out. - 		-- Ambrose Bierce, "The Devil's Dictionary"    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 09:54:45 +0000 % From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> ) Subject: Re: XP1000 - which Graphics Cardo8 Message-ID: <7d014tga7a0irivjs8f9pku63k9q1eos2c@4ax.com>  D On Tue, 19 Dec 2000 21:34:39 -0500, "Mike Burch" <mgburch@smart.net> wrote:   >nH >First of all, 'gamers' are *not* running NT!!!  They are running Win9x,I >because most games require full Direct X support (DX 2 or 3 was the last , >version on NT and it was pretty worthless).  5 Maybe on NT 4 but I have Direct X 8.0 on Windows 2000c     --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 16:33:14 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)) Subject: Re: XP1000 - which Graphics Carde, Message-ID: <91qn0a$buf@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  Y In article <91olh9$7ks7$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>, "Paul A. Jacobi" <nospan@nospam.com> writes:n >t@ >"David Mathog" <mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu> wrote in message' >news:91ln4f$snr@gap.cco.caltech.edu...P >iA >> Permedia 2 cards on NT have perfectly adequate OpenGL drivers.w >dE >Most gamers found the OpenGL implementation on Permedia 2 card to beaI >inadequate to play Quake.  If the Permedia 2 was not even sufficient for @ >games, it would probably do even worse in real 3D applications.  G We use the Fire GL1000 Pro cards with Swiss PDB Viewer for real time 3DeG display of molecules - in true stereo no less at 1024 x 768 resolution.PF Full screen or "stereo in a window". It works extremely well.  MolMol,H another molecule viewer also works correctly through this OpenGL driver.I These are pretty typical OpenGL applications, more or less like a CAD/CAM I program, except they show molecules instead of cars or machine parts. The A OpenGL examples from the OpenGL organization web site also workeda correctly. t  H I've not tried Quake but for the applications I have tried this card has been fantastic.   I The only problem now is that there's no W2K driver, and there's probably oK never going to be one, so unless we change cards we're never going to W2K.  ( (Not that I'm in a hurry to get there!)    David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduA? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech e   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 17:48:25 GMTF From: lederman@star.enet.dec.DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL.com (Bart Z. Lederman)) Subject: Re: XP1000 - which Graphics Card=6 Message-ID: <91qrd9$k0h$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  a In article <91ohf8$bqg@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:m >	 >rJ >In the case at hand we have the "better nothing than perfect" camp again,K >versus the "better something than nothing."   Right now we've (most of us cK >anyway) effectively got nothing, and we want something.  Perfect can wait.a  >Perfect may not even be needed. >  >PL >Now I'm just confused.  The half life of a graphics card seems to be about K >9 months, so if these cards exist now this means Compaq will be coming out J >with support just as the cards reach their end of life (in the PC market,  : Unfortunately, there is an interrelationship between these two factors.  < People here do realize that we need to get some products out: quickly, and that it may not be necessary to support every; whiz-bang feature of a video card in order to make a lot of 3 customers happy (or at least reasonably satisfied)..  ; However, our (VMS) customers do expect systems that contain ; video cards will run well: at least, that they won't crash, @ that the video card won't interact with the other device driversC (moving the cursor won't corrupt data on a SCSI disk, for example), @ that the screen won't do anything really 'funny' like going into? reverse video when you drag a window, and so on.  This requires ; a significant amount of development and testing, especially ? testing.  Testing takes time, and VMS is tested very completely > because it's what our customers want.  This is a problem when,; as you noted, cards don't have a very long production life.   @ As Fred noted, there are quite a few people here who are looking> into a better long-term solution to the entire problem.  DoingA cooperative development with Tru64 helps spread the work load andnA could help leverage our buying power with the vendors.  There are B other solutions in the works.  But the bottom line is, if you want: VMS quality it takes longer than some of the slap-together alternatives out on the market.I   --  (  B. Z. Lederman   Personal Opinions Only  8  Posting to a News group does NOT give anyone permission8  to send me advertising by E-mail or put me on a mailing  list of any kind.  5  Please remove the "DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL" if you have as5  legitimate reason to E-mail a response to this post.i   ------------------------------   Date: 20 Dec 2000 16:29:49 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)* Subject: Re: Y2038 (was: Re: soon enough?)6 Message-ID: <91qmpt$jd3$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  ( In article <3A3EAF10.F877AE07@dnv.com>, /   Arne Bergseth <Arne.Bergseth@dnv.com> writes:   I :In VMS the year 2000 problem has never existed, because VMS was designedA# :with 4 digit years before AD 1980.c  J   You are unfortunately somewhat mistaken.  While the base OpenVMS design J   is good and has a quadword native time format with a substantial range, L   there are and have been a few time-related behaviours with OpenVMS.  Both H   Y2K and Y2038 behaviours have been noted (and the known Y2K behavioursH   and one Y2038 behaviour remedied on specific versions), and (just for 1   good measure) a few other "less obvious" dates.n  J :On other platforms a common fix has been to hack in some assumption aboutH :wether a 2 digit year is above or below 50 or some other random number.  H   That exact hack exists in OpenVMS, too.  The usual "pivot" year is 57,E   but some standards explicitly require a different pivot year.  Take0F   a look at the "exe$gl_transition_year" cell on OpenVMS Alpha -- thisI   was required for the (unfortunately documented) use of two-digit years t%   in specific of the system services.c  F :Many applications and databases have 2 digit years stored, so by new F :years eve every 10 years to come, some legacy applications will break  '   Those applications continue to exist.:  F   There is an interesting variation on the "pivot" scheme embedded in G   the OpenVMS EXCHANGE utility and in various of the corresponding (andh#   older) RSX-based file structures.,  I :In year 2038 I will be 84 years old, so my most likly use of a computer a2 :will be some kind of life support control system.  F   I plan to supplement my retirement income removing Y2038 behaviours.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.709 ************************