1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 24 Jul 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 410       Contents:? Re: %SYSINIT-E, Error mounting system device, status = 000008c4  Re: Apache for VMS on UCX4.2' Re: backup/image but restore otherwise? * Extensible Versatile Editor setup question* Extensible Versatile Editor setup question. Re: Extensible Versatile Editor setup question( Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com( Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com( Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com( Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com
 Plain Kermit?  Re: Plain Kermit?  Re: Plain Kermit? " Re: Undocumented commands in UCX ?" Re: Undocumented commands in UCX ? Vax DNS help needed  VS3100 2nd disk  Re: VS3100 2nd disk  VS3100 2nd disk 8 WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/SL Re: What graphics cards are supported by OpenVMS on a AlphaServer 400 4/233?1 Re: [Fwd: FW: Wish List:  I/O vs. CPU Priorities] 1 Re: [Fwd: FW: Wish List:  I/O vs. CPU Priorities]   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 16:56:53 -0400 2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com>H Subject: Re: %SYSINIT-E, Error mounting system device, status = 000008c47 Message-ID: <200007231657_MC2-AD2D-C1B0@compuserve.com>            Chris,  %         Thanks, I learned something!!     % Message text written by Chris Scheers  >"Richard B. Gilbert" wrote: > =    >         Dwight,  > =   G >         There have been some reports that /IMAGE backups made without J > /NOALIAS can't be restored properly.  The reports I've seen have involv= ed a H > backup made on VAX/VMS V6.2 and restored under VMS V7.2.  HELP and the4 > manuals say that "/NOALIAS is highly recommended". > =   J >         I don't know where to tell you to go from here.  I thought that=  J > SHOW DEVICE /FULL would show the structure level but it does not; I jus= t J > tried it on my Alphastation!  There does not seem to be any easy way to=  J > find out what the structure level is.  It's a problem I've never had to=  J > deal with.  It will be a cold day in hell before I initialize a volume = asJ > ODS-5; I have no need for DOS/Windows compatibility in the area of file=  F > names.  In sixteen years I've never needed to mount an ODS-1 volume.  =  6 It appears that you can find the structure level with:  2         Write Sys$Output F$GetDVI(disk,"ACPTYPE")<   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 08:35:56 +1200 9 From: "Antony Wardle" <antony.wardle@nnnoospam.met.co.nz> % Subject: Re: Apache for VMS on UCX4.2 3 Message-ID: <9GIe5.44177$N4.1608421@ozemail.com.au>   - If you use NFS, be wary of upgrading to 5.0a, = I did it, and spent the entire weekend rebboting my system in > the hope that cpq would come up with a fix. They weren't able. so I reverted back to 4.2.  C Also, there is a bug in 5.0 that if someone telnets in from a linux E box, then it will consume 30% of the cpu. If they do it 3 times, then 0 all of your cpu usage goes to the linux telnets.  
 Cheers Antony       ? "Hoff Hoffman" <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in message 0 news:8l6s7b$osi$2@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com... > E > In article <8l5auj$f8f$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, twirt@kittles.com writes: J > :Has anyone tried the latest beta of Apache for VMS on VMS with UCX 4.2?; > :I installed it today on VMS 7.1-1h2 and UCX 4.2 ECO 4...  > J >   You can continue to experiment, or you can upgrade to TCP/IP V5.0A andL >   to OpenVMS Alpha V7.1-2 (or V7.2-1) -- the upgrade approach is much moreK >   likely bring you into line with the folks working on these packages, as L >   various incompatibilities were found during development and testing, andK >   ECOs were created and version minimum and minimum ECO requirements were  >   put in place...  > K >   A number of OpenVMS ECOs were rolled into V7.1-2, in particular, and V5 C >   has a number of updates and improvements over earlier releases.  > , >  --------------------------- pure personal# opinion --------------------------- 1 >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering  hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com >    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 15:20:17 -0500 , From: "Glenn C. Everhart" <Everhart@GCE.com>0 Subject: Re: backup/image but restore otherwise?' Message-ID: <397B0D30.17D227C6@GCE.com>   B Yes, an image backup can be restored in any way you like including
 with /select.   : Also you can do a non-image restore, and manually make the file entry with something like  : $set file/enter=[000000]vms$common.dir [sys0]syscommon.dir  ; if you want to restore VMS onto a disk that is too large to ? boot and which has been created with $init/index=beg/head=10000 8 or similar, and have the restored material fit below the 1gb line...   : Backup cannot restore a back/physical in this way, but can= restore back/image. If you want to restore part of back/image 9 and it fits on one tape, however, you can use the package = that has appeared as cmphighc.zip on sigtapes in its original > purpose and mount the saveset as a readonly disk, then restore; what you want. (Yes, this knows about checking the CRCs and 0 about using xor blocks to overcome bad blocks!).  A Thus if backup made a copy of the data, you can extract it either @ with backup itself, or with free 3rd party software, pretty much& whatever the format of the saved data.  < (Those with multireel back/phys savesets need to tinker with: the sources to handle that case. Usage would not be pretty= as access patterns then would be disk access, not sequential, * so you'll potentially juggle tapes a lot.)   Boyle, Darren wrote: > L > Yes, you might want to check out the /SELECT qualifier in help for backup.
 > - Darren >  > > ----------= > > From:         gilley@bravewc.com[SMTP:gilley@bravewc.com] 2 > > Sent:         Thursday, July 20, 2000 12:03 AM > > To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 5 > > Subject:      backup/image but restore otherwise?  > > K > > If I perform an image backup on a disk, can I then restore only part of  > > the N > > image?  I don't think there is anything special to the saveset, but my vax > > is > > not in front of me.  > > 
 > > Thanks > >  > >  > >  > H > **********************************************************************E > This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and L > may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.O > They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they M > are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, D > please notify the sender immediately and then delete this message.K > You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copying   > of this message is prohibited. >  > Bank of Bermuda H > **********************************************************************   ------------------------------   Date: 23 Jul 2000 20:40:27 GMT! From: gigglegs@aol.com (Gigglegs) 3 Subject: Extensible Versatile Editor setup question : Message-ID: <20000723164027.12866.00001563@ng-ce1.aol.com>  K I am trying to run EVE through edit /tpu command. I am having problems with - unwanted characters on the display.  Example:    $set term /device=vt200  $edit /tpu brandnewfile.txt J Editing new file.  Could not find DKA:[000000]brandnewfile.txt;1;80H1JH[EN 2A  M I also issued edit /edt.  brandnewfile.txt and I don't seem to have a problem N with the display.  I am not having the problem here, only when I use EVE. What! can I do to solve this problem.     I Another question that might be related to this is when I use up arrow key K instead of recall  n command my $ prompt moves over by one space.  Example:    $dir
 $show def 	 $recall 1 
 $show def ; but when I use the up arrow the display will look like this J K$show def (reversed question mark)which is an escape character I believe.  4 What could be causing this to happen?  Any advice?? 9 Any help will be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance.    gigglegs@aol.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 17:02:40 -0400 2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com>3 Subject: Extensible Versatile Editor setup question 7 Message-ID: <200007231702_MC2-AD2D-C1F2@compuserve.com>   J         The most likely cause of this behavior is a terminal that is not = a J VTxxx terminal at all or a terminal emulator that fails to emulate a VT20= 0 
 correctly.    Message text written by GigglegsG >I am trying to run EVE through edit /tpu command. I am having problems  with- unwanted characters on the display.  Example:    $set term /device=3Dvt200  $edit /tpu brandnewfile.txt J Editing new file.  Could not find DKA:[000000]brandnewfile.txt;1;80H1JH[E= N  2A  E I also issued edit /edt.  brandnewfile.txt and I don't seem to have a  problem J with the display.  I am not having the problem here, only when I use EVE.=   What" can I do to solve this problem.  =    J Another question that might be related to this is when I use up arrow key=  J instead of recall  n command my $ prompt moves over by one space.  Exampl= e:   $dir $show def =   	 $recall 1  $show def =   ; but when I use the up arrow the display will look like this J K$show def (reversed question mark)which is an escape character I believe= .   5 What could be causing this to happen?  Any advice?? =   : Any help will be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance.<   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jul 2000 21:57:19 -0400/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson) 7 Subject: Re: Extensible Versatile Editor setup question * Message-ID: <8lg7pv$9k2$1@lisa.gemair.com>  7 Sounds like you have problems with your terminal setup.   < How are you connecting to your OpenVMS system?  What kind of terminal?  PC?  9 What is the output from a "SHOW TERM" command.  Also, try 9 a "SET TERM/INQ" command (no quotes).  Does the behavior  ) change after you enter this last command?   : In article <20000723164027.12866.00001563@ng-ce1.aol.com>," Gigglegs <gigglegs@aol.com> wrote:L >I am trying to run EVE through edit /tpu command. I am having problems with. >unwanted characters on the display.  Example: >  >$set term /device=vt200 >$edit /tpu brandnewfile.txtK >Editing new file.  Could not find DKA:[000000]brandnewfile.txt;1;80H1JH[EN  >2A  > N >I also issued edit /edt.  brandnewfile.txt and I don't seem to have a problemO >with the display.  I am not having the problem here, only when I use EVE. What " >can I do to solve this problem.   > J >Another question that might be related to this is when I use up arrow keyL >instead of recall  n command my $ prompt moves over by one space.  Example: >  >$dir  >$show def  
 >$recall 1 >$show def  < >but when I use the up arrow the display will look like thisK >K$show def (reversed question mark)which is an escape character I believe.  > 5 >What could be causing this to happen?  Any advice??  : >Any help will be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance. >  >gigglegs@aol.com    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 22:04:25 GMT 0 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <shannon@world.std.com>1 Subject: Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com & Message-ID: <Fy67qA.10u@world.std.com>  2 "hg/jb" <shsrms@bellatlantic.net> wrote in message* news:397B309A.41FC12DB@bellatlantic.net...2 > Hmm, I seem to recall something about galaxy....C > wasn't there some work on multiple OS on a single multiple cpu hw  > platform? 6 > something like vms, tru64, linux on the same box....  H Yup. At DECUS Anaheim 88 they demoed VMS UNIX and Borgware on an 8400. AI GS-Series box can have up to 8 hard partitions and can run VMS, UNIX, and 2 Linux (altho' the latter doth not scale for s**t).  I There's also an interesting project called Jupiter. NSK VMS and NT in the I same cabinet. Doubt it'll ever become a product; it's reminiscent of that G mutant mutli-architecture box Ken Olsen dreamed up at Advanced Modular.   L Oh, this is not to be confused with the Jupiter of Rose Ann Giordano infamy.  
 charlie matco    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 22:09:28 GMT 0 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <shannon@world.std.com>1 Subject: Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com & Message-ID: <Fy67yL.2C8@world.std.com>   > H > Just finished scanning Terry's Australia presentation (FinalOzTug.ppt,  > downloaded from acersoft.com). > K > Granting that he was presenting to a Tandem audience, it sure looked like  heJ > had a far more encouraging story to tell Tandem users than he would have had K > to tell VMS users:  prognostications of an explosion of Himalaya sales in H > the enterprise space, reports of vigorous R&D efforts, lists of TandemB > strongholds that included most of those that Compaq lists as VMS > strongholds...  G You are right, it was a Tandem-centric audience and I drafted the pitch J accordingly. NSK sales grew 6 percent 1FQ and appear to be heading higher.2 The Q can't build the S74000-series fast enough...   > K > It would not be a stretch to suspect that the reason we haven't seen more L > enthusiasm from Compaq (save for verbal reassurances and efforts involvingK > minimal funding) regarding its 'VMS renaissance' is not because they have K > the combined intelligence of a tree-stump but because they have alternate K > plans that just don't include VMS as an important contributor:  Tandem in H > the enterprise space, Tru64 in the mid-range (including its developingL > clustering abilities and its NonStop configuration on the Tandem IntegrityJ > hardware - RIP ftVAX), and Windows on IA hardware wherever they can sell it.   K VMS remains a $3.9B business and sales/revenues are up. Got confirmation of  that Down Under.  I Windows on IA64 sure as hell isn't gonna offer the reliability of OpenVMS  for a hell of a long time.  J > And given that we already know that Compaq likes to avoid competing withH > itself, it's hard to find a significant hole for VMS to fill in such aG > strategy, even though we could suggest that a different strategy that K > included a significant VMS presence (and more product overlap) might be a  > stronger one overall.   I Compaq could learn a lot from General Motors about competing with itself.    > L > That would explain Compaq's actions (right up to the present) a lot betterG > than postulating a continuing suicidal dependence on eventual Windows K > supremacy.  It would also be a lot more difficult to argue against, since K > they may well be willing to compromise ultimate market share if it allows K > them to simplify their product set (as I've said from the first, I really > > don't think they're comfortable being a software developer). >  > Comments?   J If what the Q is saying about DII-COE, OpenVMS will be around for at least 15 more years...   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 18:42:15 -0400 ' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> 1 Subject: Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com ( Message-ID: <8lfs9o$37n$1@pyrite.mv.net>  9 Terry C. Shannon <shannon@world.std.com> wrote in message   news:Fy67yL.2C8@world.std.com...   ...   H > > It would not be a stretch to suspect that the reason we haven't seen moreD > > enthusiasm from Compaq (save for verbal reassurances and efforts	 involving H > > minimal funding) regarding its 'VMS renaissance' is not because they haveC > > the combined intelligence of a tree-stump but because they have 	 alternate J > > plans that just don't include VMS as an important contributor:  Tandem inJ > > the enterprise space, Tru64 in the mid-range (including its developingD > > clustering abilities and its NonStop configuration on the Tandem	 Integrity L > > hardware - RIP ftVAX), and Windows on IA hardware wherever they can sell > it.  > J > VMS remains a $3.9B business and sales/revenues are up. Got confirmation of > that Down Under.  K I didn't suggest that Compaq would start refusing to sell VMS to anyone who E demanded it, just that the current state of (non-)funding compared to D revenue and profit seems to indicate a continued lack of interest inI developing its market beyond that which it can satisfy in essentially itsf7 current guise (and with minimal marketing expenditure).    >eK > Windows on IA64 sure as hell isn't gonna offer the reliability of OpenVMSs > for a hell of a long time.  K But Himalaya already does (plus at least claims to scale even better in oneoI of your slides - though that slide conveniently ignored VMS cluster-styleeH scaling and the limitations of scaling via partitioning...), Tru64 is atH least trying to (and according to your slides is still slated to get theH Integrity hardware to give it true fault-tolerance, which VMS hasn't hasE since ftVAX), and I'll bet that the Windows faction at the Q is stilluL asserting loudly both within and without the company that reliable, scalableI Windows is just around the next corner.  Easy for Compaq to conclude thatlD there's no real need for VMS down the road save to support customers5 unwilling to migrate elsewhere (like the COE crowd?).    >tL > > And given that we already know that Compaq likes to avoid competing withJ > > itself, it's hard to find a significant hole for VMS to fill in such aI > > strategy, even though we could suggest that a different strategy thatFK > > included a significant VMS presence (and more product overlap) might be- a- > > stronger one overall.- >-K > Compaq could learn a lot from General Motors about competing with itself.R  C But there's no sign that Compaq is educable in this area, is there?v   >s > > G > > That would explain Compaq's actions (right up to the present) a lot  betterI > > than postulating a continuing suicidal dependence on eventual Windows G > > supremacy.  It would also be a lot more difficult to argue against,  since F > > they may well be willing to compromise ultimate market share if it allowsF > > them to simplify their product set (as I've said from the first, I really@ > > don't think they're comfortable being a software developer). > > 
 > > Comments?h >"L > If what the Q is saying about DII-COE, OpenVMS will be around for at least > 15 more years...  < I'm sure it will be.  Just like RSX is still around today...   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:53:11 GMTt% From: hg/jb <shsrms@bellatlantic.net>o1 Subject: Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.come0 Message-ID: <397B86F0.4FFDB000@bellatlantic.net>   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:z > 4 > "hg/jb" <shsrms@bellatlantic.net> wrote in message, > news:397B309A.41FC12DB@bellatlantic.net...4 > > Hmm, I seem to recall something about galaxy....E > > wasn't there some work on multiple OS on a single multiple cpu hw 
 > > platform? 8 > > something like vms, tru64, linux on the same box.... > J > Yup. At DECUS Anaheim 88 they demoed VMS UNIX and Borgware on an 8400. AK > GS-Series box can have up to 8 hard partitions and can run VMS, UNIX, ande4 > Linux (altho' the latter doth not scale for s**t).G Yeah, now you are reminding everyone that I read (both past and presentn tense) all your stuff!!C Is this a surprise - the Linux Scalability I mean- I am not a linuxa bigot, IH but I wonder if it will scale if the linux effort keeps pushing and they+ get their hands on a couple of good boxes!!m > K > There's also an interesting project called Jupiter. NSK VMS and NT in the K > same cabinet. Doubt it'll ever become a product; it's reminiscent of thatcI > mutant mutli-architecture box Ken Olsen dreamed up at Advanced Modular.. > N > Oh, this is not to be confused with the Jupiter of Rose Ann Giordano infamy. >  > charlie matcoe Hey Charlie,= I did not know that RoseAnn got credit for Jupiter/Hephastus!S just bob aka badbobE   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 22:47:34 GMTC! From: Beyonder <beyonder@vrx.net>a Subject: Plain Kermit?' Message-ID: <397B7632.3CE0D50A@vrx.net>e  + Someone is going to hit me for this, but...nH I need to transfer some files to my vaxen, ok, great, have Kermit source code, E it's 8 megs in size, and I still have to install C to compile it, etc  etc.  F I know the Kermit author hangs out here, I was just wondering if thereF is a "mini" kermit available? Just something to transfer files, that's1 it, no terminal program, none of the other stuff.   G Actually, (don't hit me!) I have telix with kermit and would gladly use- that. C Just enough to get a BINARY of kermit (full version) on the system.d  D I mean, do you have ANY idea how long it takes to transfer 8 megs ofG stuff via an ASCII upload at 19200 ?!? (line spacing at 2/10 to 3/10 of:	 a second)g   It's a long long time...   Dan.   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Jul 2000 00:24:43 GMT0 From: fdc@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Frank da Cruz) Subject: Re: Plain Kermit?5 Message-ID: <8lg2cb$jo2$1@newsmaster.cc.columbia.edu>h  K In article <397B7632.3CE0D50A@vrx.net>, Beyonder  <beyonder@vrx.net> wrote:u  L : Someone is going to hit me for this, but...  I need to transfer some filesM : to my vaxen, ok, great, have Kermit source code, it's 8 megs in size, and Ie1 : still have to install C to compile it, etc etc.e : J You would probably want to install C anyway.  A lot of other programs needI to be compiled too.   Did you know you can also get prebuilt binaries forh= lots of different VMS configurations?  Look at the bottom of:s  -   http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/ckermit.htmla  H : I know the Kermit author hangs out here, I was just wondering if thereH : is a "mini" kermit available? Just something to transfer files, that's3 : it, no terminal program, none of the other stuff.e : E You can use the old, old, old, unsupported Kermit-32 (just 56K).  Forv/ instructions, see Section I (Bootstrapping) of:u  /   ftp://kermit.columbia.edu/kermit/f/ckvins.txt    - Frankh   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 01:21:13 GMT ! From: Beyonder <beyonder@vrx.net>o Subject: Re: Plain Kermit?' Message-ID: <397B9A30.2F08C914@vrx.net>    Frank da Cruz wrote:  L > You would probably want to install C anyway.  A lot of other programs needK > to be compiled too.   Did you know you can also get prebuilt binaries fort? > lots of different VMS configurations?  Look at the bottom of:b  9 Yes, I understand about C, that's not really the problem.i4 The hours and hours of ASCII uploading is a problem.- prebuilt binaries are only half the solution.   I >   You can use the old, old, old, unsupported Kermit-32 (just 56K).  For 1 > instructions, see Section I (Bootstrapping) of:   M Saw the bootstrapping info. I'm not sure I can use it. How do I get the image*P onto the vax in the first place? I can't make a bootable floppy or anything like that.a  Q Understand, I have NO networking installed, the ONLY way to transfer files to theiP box right now is from the PC com port directly connected to the Vax. And also, IQ can't get TCP/IP running with my current Vax because I use DSL, which are dynamic O addresses using PPPOE, even if I put an static address on the Vax that's in thei1 same IP block, my PC won't see it. Already tried.   O I could setup TCP/IP using private addresses, reconfig my work PC, network them*L then FTP stuff, but I'd have to reboot my windoze system every time I neededI access to the internet then reboot again so I could then talk to the vax.jP I'm not sure which is a bigger headache right now. rebooting several dozen timesN (because I'm sure I'll keep forgetting things), or waiting hours and hours for; the ASCII upload, which I've been doing one file at a time.y  N Unless I can write a CDR on the PC and have the vax read it. Is that possible?  C Are you starting to see what a nightmareish world I'm in right now?    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 16:56:51 -0400e2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com>+ Subject: Re: Undocumented commands in UCX ?o7 Message-ID: <200007231657_MC2-AD2D-C1AF@compuserve.com>l  % Message text written by Terry Kennedy J >  Well, if you have a hobby system you can get a MultiNet license for it=  5 for free: http://www.process.com/tcpip/hobbyist.html<u  G         My systems are neither pure hobby nor pure commercial.   I havetH commercial licenses VMS, Net-App-Sup, etc.  I don't think I could accept$ the restrictions on a hobby license.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:34:55 GMT ( From: Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com>+ Subject: Re: Undocumented commands in UCX ?a' Message-ID: <Fy6C67.20s@spcuna.spc.edu>u  2 Richard B. Gilbert <DRAGON@compuserve.com> writes:I >         My systems are neither pure hobby nor pure commercial.   I havelJ > commercial licenses VMS, Net-App-Sup, etc.  I don't think I could accept& > the restrictions on a hobby license.     Well, earlier you said:r  J |         I've never had the opportunity to work with Multinet!  I wish it | were otherwise.a  J   From that, it would seem that you could set up a pure-hobbyist system toJ install MultiNet on and become familiar with it. At that point you'll haveJ MultiNet experience and could consult/recommend/whatever it for commercialJ purposes, if that is the goal. And if it isn't the goal, at least you will have had the opportunity...g  - 	Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.com 5         terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USAn   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:02:01 GMTr! From: Beyonder <beyonder@vrx.net>o Subject: Vax DNS help needed' Message-ID: <397B7990.15C6F421@vrx.net>o  ! can a Vax be it's own DNS server?o8 I just setup a 3100m76 with TCP/IP went into tcp_config,G and started putting stuff in, it asked for the IP address and hostname,  domain, etc.  D When it asked for the DNS server, it wouldn't allow me to put in theF same IP address, and would also not allow me to put the same hostname.  Saying they were already in use.  A Where does VMS put the host and DNS config files, and can they bet modified with EDIT, etc ?-   Dan.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:35:56 +0200n$ From: "hhwill" <hhwill@global.co.za> Subject: VS3100 2nd disk- Message-ID: <8lfol3$k28$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>t  ; I am trying to init a 2.1Gb Seagate ST12400n disk as DKB0:.aI VMS 5.2-2 replies with a '...incorrect cluster-factor..' and aborts.  TheaJ format operation succeeded and the disk is seen in all other respects. Any
 ideas anyone?c   Hansell Williams   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 20:11:35 -0400n2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: VS3100 2nd diskL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2307002011360001@user-2ive6dh.dialup.mindspring.com>  S In article <8lfol3$k28$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net>, "hhwill" <hhwill@global.co.za> wrote:e  = > I am trying to init a 2.1Gb Seagate ST12400n disk as DKB0:.bK > VMS 5.2-2 replies with a '...incorrect cluster-factor..' and aborts.  The L > format operation succeeded and the disk is seen in all other respects. Any > ideas anyone?  >   D I think the default cluster size is too small for such a large disk.  G Read HELP INIT /CLUSTER.  The minimum cluster size is given there. (ThewO formula is a fraction, which may not be clear at first since the horizonal linet seems to be missing.)a  J Also think about changing the default for /HEADERS when you init the disk.   -- a Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.como   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:20:21 -0400 2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com> Subject: VS3100 2nd disk7 Message-ID: <200007232320_MC2-AD3A-74CA@compuserve.com>t  (         What cluster factor did you use?  J         For that matter, exactly what was the INITIALIZE command that you=   used?o  A         What was the full and exact text of the error message(s)?a    Message text written by "hhwill"< >I am trying to init a 2.1Gb Seagate ST12400n disk as DKB0:.J VMS 5.2-2 replies with a '...incorrect cluster-factor..' and aborts.  The=  J format operation succeeded and the disk is seen in all other respects. An= ya ideas anyone?<   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:51:54 GMTJ= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)bA Subject: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/Sr0 Message-ID: <009ED867.EA7FC246@SendSpamHere.ORG>   Hi,h  G I'm asking here in hope that you folks will put the answer in a contexthF that I might understand.  I need to make a copy of a file on a PeeCee.G I have a window open with a little graphic of a folder and it shows the:G file in this folder.  There is a "copy" icon on the top of this screen..F If I highlight the file and then ckick the copy icon, nothing seems toF happen.  Of course, I have to add my slur: this is easier and more in- tuitive?  Bullshit.a  G Anyhow, if you can please explain how to copy this file to another fileoH name, I'd much appreciate it.  It would be even easier if assholes wouldH cease placing useful information into PeeCee specific extraction execut-, ables.  What in the hell is wrong with ZIP?   H Please help quickly.  Every minute this box is powered on I fear that it0 is emminating evil into my sacred living spaces.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMn   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 00:06:33 GMTe/ From: "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net>sE Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/SaF Message-ID: <dMLe5.5420$Uo6.287683@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>  H To just RENAME it to another name, just right click it and selec rename,0 then type in the new name in the blue name spot.  F My favorite way to copy  is to drop into DOS  and just copy the thing.	 Depending ( on windows version, something like this:2 (START - PROGRAMS - ACCESSORIES - command mode (or! system tools, then command mode).   @ Otherwise, the recommended way is to use Windows explorer, which sucks big time.e  % Start - Programs - Windows Explorer ,u  D The get the file you want over on the left side and find your targetD on the right side.  To COPY the file, hilite it with the left MB and9 Hold the button down while you drag it where you want it.    To MOVE it , use the Right MB.  * I hope I hit on something that might help.  J "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message* news:009ED867.EA7FC246@SendSpamHere.ORG... > Hi,l >dI > I'm asking here in hope that you folks will put the answer in a contextgH > that I might understand.  I need to make a copy of a file on a PeeCee.I > I have a window open with a little graphic of a folder and it shows the I > file in this folder.  There is a "copy" icon on the top of this screen.nH > If I highlight the file and then ckick the copy icon, nothing seems toH > happen.  Of course, I have to add my slur: this is easier and more in- > tuitive?  Bullshit.  >aI > Anyhow, if you can please explain how to copy this file to another fileIJ > name, I'd much appreciate it.  It would be even easier if assholes wouldJ > cease placing useful information into PeeCee specific extraction execut-- > ables.  What in the hell is wrong with ZIP?- >-J > Please help quickly.  Every minute this box is powered on I fear that it2 > is emminating evil into my sacred living spaces. >  > --4 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 00:52:00 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)sE Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/Se0 Message-ID: <009ED870.4FF68ECF@SendSpamHere.ORG>  x In article <dMLe5.5420$Uo6.287683@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> writes:I >To just RENAME it to another name, just right click it and selec rename,n1 >then type in the new name in the blue name spot.e >rG >My favorite way to copy  is to drop into DOS  and just copy the thing.a
 >Depending) >on windows version, something like this: 3 >(START - PROGRAMS - ACCESSORIES - command mode (or " >system tools, then command mode). >MA >Otherwise, the recommended way is to use Windows explorer, whichi >sucks big time. >n& >Start - Programs - Windows Explorer , >sE >The get the file you want over on the left side and find your targetrE >on the right side.  To COPY the file, hilite it with the left MB andn: >Hold the button down while you drag it where you want it. >e >To MOVE it , use the Right MB.  >e+ >I hope I hit on something that might help.   H Nope!  I'm more confused than ever!  However, my wife was able to figureH out how to do what I needed so that I could get name to an FTPable name.I She dicks about with these PeeCees now at the "drug co." now that they'veuJ decided that VMS is dead and Weendoze 98/NT is the future.  Took her a lotJ of clicketty/clicketty/clicketty menu roaming, etc. until there was a fileI copy with a different name.  Really, this PeeCee stuff is pathetic.  Gave I me an excuse, however, to have to exhaust another pint of Yeungling black) and tan.  I Anyhow, the file is now resident on a "real" machine running a "real" O/SnI and the vile evil machine, scioned from the demon semen of satan himself,eI has been sentenced to another purgatory period of electricity denied pen-V ance.    --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM)   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 00:31:55 GMTo- From: Keith Benoit <keith721@carolina.rr.com>iE Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/Sc/ Message-ID: <397B8D63.B61EA97E@carolina.rr.com>   C Pardon my knowledge of the irrelevant evil empire, but it is Sunday-	 night ...t  A You can right click on the file "foo.bar", select "copy" from theo drop-down menu.gG Then, right click on the open white space in the right-hand window, andaH select "paste" from the drop-down menu.  This creates a file named "Copy of foo.bar".H Right click in the text "Copy of foo.bar", and select "rename".  ReplaceD the "Copy of foo.bar" name with whatever your heart desires.  If youF include some of the dreaded "not allowed" characters (an ever changingD set of single-byte ASCII and double-byte Unicode), it'll give you anE error message.  Just clear the message, and try again, without excessy  punctuation, aside from periods.   Good luck!!    Keith Benoit
 Charlotte, NC     & "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote: >  > Hi,o > I > I'm asking here in hope that you folks will put the answer in a contextaH > that I might understand.  I need to make a copy of a file on a PeeCee.I > I have a window open with a little graphic of a folder and it shows theRI > file in this folder.  There is a "copy" icon on the top of this screen.lH > If I highlight the file and then ckick the copy icon, nothing seems toH > happen.  Of course, I have to add my slur: this is easier and more in- > tuitive?  Bullshit.c > I > Anyhow, if you can please explain how to copy this file to another filesJ > name, I'd much appreciate it.  It would be even easier if assholes wouldJ > cease placing useful information into PeeCee specific extraction execut-- > ables.  What in the hell is wrong with ZIP?a > J > Please help quickly.  Every minute this box is powered on I fear that it2 > is emminating evil into my sacred living spaces. >  > --Q > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMi   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 11:11:25 +1000r/ From: "Phil Howell" <howellp@snowyhydro.com.au>nE Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S 3 Message-ID: <4JMe5.44235$N4.1611608@ozemail.com.au>n  G When you "copy" a file in this way, it really means "take a copy of theiG contents of this file and store it in your clipboard". If you then do ad, "paste" it should create a copy of the file.  K If you are using NT workstation you should of course download a copy of DCLeL Lite from http://www.accelr8.com/dclllic.html then you will be able to enter such intuitive commands as% copy /log /confirm <infile> <outfile>2 Phil  H Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message* news:009ED867.EA7FC246@SendSpamHere.ORG... > Hi,e > I > I'm asking here in hope that you folks will put the answer in a contextaH > that I might understand.  I need to make a copy of a file on a PeeCee.I > I have a window open with a little graphic of a folder and it shows thehI > file in this folder.  There is a "copy" icon on the top of this screen. H > If I highlight the file and then ckick the copy icon, nothing seems toH > happen.  Of course, I have to add my slur: this is easier and more in- > tuitive?  Bullshit.h > I > Anyhow, if you can please explain how to copy this file to another file J > name, I'd much appreciate it.  It would be even easier if assholes wouldJ > cease placing useful information into PeeCee specific extraction execut-- > ables.  What in the hell is wrong with ZIP?- >-J > Please help quickly.  Every minute this box is powered on I fear that it2 > is emminating evil into my sacred living spaces. >  > --4 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 22:34:14 -0400i* From: David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>E Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/Ss- Message-ID: <397BAB26.1F260C5C@tsoft-inc.com>c  & "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote: >  > Hi,i > I > I'm asking here in hope that you folks will put the answer in a contextnH > that I might understand.  I need to make a copy of a file on a PeeCee.I > I have a window open with a little graphic of a folder and it shows thetI > file in this folder.  There is a "copy" icon on the top of this screen.fH > If I highlight the file and then ckick the copy icon, nothing seems toH > happen.  Of course, I have to add my slur: this is easier and more in- > tuitive?  Bullshit.u > I > Anyhow, if you can please explain how to copy this file to another fileiJ > name, I'd much appreciate it.  It would be even easier if assholes wouldJ > cease placing useful information into PeeCee specific extraction execut-- > ables.  What in the hell is wrong with ZIP?a  L I'll start by observing that you probably don't want this to be easy.  I can sympathize.r  P The first point is to assume you are using Windows Explorer.  It isn't as bad asM some claim.  The problem is that there are multiple methods for doing things,MN and each has potential problems.  For a copy, you can drag and drop.  It won'tN be long before you're sorry, and drop this method.  Sometimes your finger willI slip, and the file gets lost in some directory you were passing over.  MyoI favorite is to first have all the toolbars on the screen, which isn't theoN default.  Then I use the DETAILS method of showing files, not all those stupid icons.  L To copy a file, select (Ok, click on it) a file and it will be highlighted. N There are three buttons in the toolbar (usually) at the top of the screen, theJ left most button having a pair of scissors on it, which are cut, copy, andL paste.  If you press (click) the copy button, it is the first part of a copyL command, without the destination.  Then set your presence to the destinationP directory, and press the paste button.  A copy of the file will be placed in theO destination directory.  If you would have pressed cut instead of copy, the file M would have been MOVED to the destination.  There is a method to copy/move andm9 rename at the same time, but I don't know how to do that.a  O If all you wanted to do is a rename, then select the file using the RIGHT mouse O button, you will get a menu box, select 'rename'.  The file name will now be in)K a box, and entirely hightlighted.  If you start typing, you will completely P replace the original text.  If you just want to change some characters, move theN cursor with the arrow keys, the highlight will disappear, and then type/delete in a 'normal' (ha) manner.  K Windows is a poor OS, but the windows explorer is something I wouldn't mindbN having on VMS.  At least some parts of it, and probably a few things done in aN more VMS manner.  Anything, good or bad, can both be cvarefully made to do the, job, or misused to the point of uselessness.  P Now I know we're both to far along to RTFM (which includes on-line help), but ifN you were to select help on the top toolbar/menu, then select help topice, thenP index, then rename file, you would get a nice cookbook recipe on how to rename aM file in 3 quick steps.  Having just done so, I find that it's nowhere like my  description above. :-)  J > Please help quickly.  Every minute this box is powered on I fear that it2 > is emminating evil into my sacred living spaces.  
 Oh, it is!   Dave   -- G4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 00:09:40 -0400y' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>eE Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S-( Message-ID: <8lgffk$j36$1@pyrite.mv.net>  5 David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in messaget' news:397BAB26.1F260C5C@tsoft-inc.com...n   ...v  K > The first point is to assume you are using Windows Explorer.  It isn't asa bad asG > some claim.  The problem is that there are multiple methods for doing: things,." > and each has potential problems.  K I don't mind that very much:  you can after all just pick the ones you like  and ignore the rest.  F However, it's more of a pain to encounter multiple menus (in differentE sub-trees of the menu structure) that do pretty much the same thing - I because invariably the thing you want to do is not an option on the first  few you try.  .   For a copy, you can drag and drop.  It won'tK > be long before you're sorry, and drop this method.  Sometimes your fingera willG > slip, and the file gets lost in some directory you were passing over.e  I But drag&drop *is* fairly convenient.  So use the *right* mouse button tonJ drag, which will give you a menu of options (including both Copy and Move)L to use when you get to your destination.  And the menu includes Cancel as an option should your finger slip.i  D (Of course, what the right mouse button does can vary even within MSL applications - why am I not surprised?  For example, dragging a mail messageJ between folders in Outhouse Express with the right mouse button just Moves= the message - no menu, no chance to recover from mistakes...)s     MyK > favorite is to first have all the toolbars on the screen, which isn't the0I > default.  Then I use the DETAILS method of showing files, not all those  stupid > icons. > @ > To copy a file, select (Ok, click on it) a file and it will be highlighted.L > There are three buttons in the toolbar (usually) at the top of the screen, thetL > left most button having a pair of scissors on it, which are cut, copy, andI > paste.  If you press (click) the copy button, it is the first part of as copyB > command, without the destination.  Then set your presence to the destinationnK > directory, and press the paste button.  A copy of the file will be placedN in theL > destination directory.  If you would have pressed cut instead of copy, the fileK > would have been MOVED to the destination.  There is a method to copy/move  andt; > rename at the same time, but I don't know how to do that.e >sK > If all you wanted to do is a rename, then select the file using the RIGHT- mouse-K > button, you will get a menu box, select 'rename'.  The file name will nowR be inmB > a box, and entirely hightlighted.  If you start typing, you will
 completelyI > replace the original text.  If you just want to change some characters,  move theD > cursor with the arrow keys, the highlight will disappear, and then type/deletet > in a 'normal' (ha) manner.  L That's likely the most convenient way to do it.  But if you're just startingJ out, and haven't discovered the utility of the right mouse button, you canI highlight the file and then click on the left-most ('File') option at thedL top of the menu to get a list of things you can do with it, including RenameC (which then works by character replacement in the displayed name asSI described above).  But some things you might want to do aren't included -eC e.g., Copy is an option under the next top-of-menu choice ('Edit').2   >nH > Windows is a poor OS, but the windows explorer is something I wouldn't mindK > having on VMS.  At least some parts of it, and probably a few things done  in a > more VMS manner.  L The main problems with point-and-click interfaces involve poorly thought-outH menu presentation and menu-tree design and/or inconsistency (see above).J Done well, they not only make the machine approachable by novices, but canL significantly speed up control by experts over command line interfaces - forK the activities the P&C interface covers (but given sub-menu options and 100'I MIPS or so to drive the screen faster than you can type commands, there'scI not much that sub-menus can't cover - and the context-sensitive Help theytK make possible can be very useful, not that Microsoft does a splendid job ino this area...).  K Which of course doesn't make command lines useless:  there's room for both.    - bill  >   Anything, good or bad, can both be cvarefully made to do the. > job, or misused to the point of uselessness. > K > Now I know we're both to far along to RTFM (which includes on-line help),: but ifK > you were to select help on the top toolbar/menu, then select help topice,2 thenI > index, then rename file, you would get a nice cookbook recipe on how ton rename aL > file in 3 quick steps.  Having just done so, I find that it's nowhere like my > description above. :-) >iL > > Please help quickly.  Every minute this box is powered on I fear that it4 > > is emminating evil into my sacred living spaces. >o > Oh, it is! >y > Dave >  > --6 > David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04506 > Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596@ > DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com8 > T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------   Date: 23 Jul 2000 11:09:23 PDT* From: abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie)U Subject: Re: What graphics cards are supported by OpenVMS on a AlphaServer 400 4/233?S! Message-ID: <oNrtn5oPEguA@flying>d  7 In article <8kl48r$h12$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>, S4 hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:  H >   PowerStorm 300 and PowerStorm 350 are the current widgets, the ELSA  >   GLoria Synergy is around.l  < I recently ordered several ELSA Gloria Synergy cards.   What: arrived was the ELSA Synergy II.   Is this card compatible? enough to also work (I won't even think of saying "supported")?f    -- hB --  Alan E. Frisbie             Frisbie "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Com@ --  Flying Disk Systems, Inc.   Abuse "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Com   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 15:28:28 -0500h, From: "Glenn C. Everhart" <Everhart@GCE.com>: Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: Wish List:  I/O vs. CPU Priorities]' Message-ID: <397B0F1C.35BD7387@GCE.com>c  A VMS also has the feature that IRPs are queued in process prioritylD order. Larry was right (and I had not remembered). The INSQUE simply4 has to be pointed at the right queue entry (and is).  8 The VMS environment just has many fewer priority values,? does prio boosts for many I/Os, and has enough other cruft that + the mechanism's effect is less than in RSX.y  9 (That can be a good thing. A high priority RSX task couldc< really wipe out performance of lower prio tasks and at times: there were priority inversion effects that could trigger.)       David J. Dachtera wrote: >  > Larry Kilgallen wrote: > >"^ > > In article <397652D8.2787E30F@gce.com>, Glenn and Mary Everhart <Everhart@gce.com> writes: > >kC > > > I would add too that VMS would need to be careful of boundarypC > > > conditions. There is code that depends on maintaining IRPs inyG > > > the order issued, so you don't want to dynamically reorder thingsTB > > > because a priority boost from say a terminal I/O has boostedI > > > dynamic priority. Rather you want to keep IRPs in order for a givenlC > > > process (well, ktb) but have them queued between processes byr6 > > > priority. The insert gets a little more complex. > > >fD > > > The NASTY part of this is that if you start playing this game,G > > > you're no longer just pointing INSQUE or REMQUE at a queue headertE > > > and handling things idempotently with hardware assist. You windiE > > > up with a software algorithm instead that has to be interlockedyB > > > by hand. Granted, it can use a spinlock of its very own, but' > > > it WILL cost performance overall.  > > >iH > > > This kind of feature sounds interesting, and in some circumstancesL > > > might be useful enough to turn on. I personally don't care if it neverJ > > > shows up, but perhaps others feel differently. I suppose that if oneI > > > were to intercept insioqc and put in something like this that wouldeK > > > be all one needs. Hmm...an in memory patch to part of VMS which would H > > > have to be located by global. Right. Kind of thing one wants to do > > > in macro-64. > >nA > > I don't understand the tentative nature of these discussions.n > > H > > As I read EXE_STD$INSERT_IRP from module SYSQIOREQ it orders entriesK > > according to IRP$B_PRI.  Is this somehow disabled on contemporary VMS ?- > G > I don't know that it's disabled, but it's far less effective than onee > typically expects. > E > What one typically needs is to have an I/O bound process get set todH > priority zero(0) and have it's effects be rendered virtually invisible) > to the interactive users at priority 4.  > F > In practice, however, this doesn't happen. In practice, lowering theJ > base priority has little or no measurable effect on an I/O bound processF > which is having a serious impact on the users. The only recourse oneC > usually has is to SET PROCESS/SUSPEND, STOP/ID= or DELETE/ENTRY=.t >  > -- > David J. Dachterac > dba DJE Systemse > http://www.djesys.com/ > < > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jul 2000 19:03:34 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) : Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: Wish List:  I/O vs. CPU Priorities]+ Message-ID: <rNqUSIO2Y+K4@eisner.decus.org>N  V In article <397B0F1C.35BD7387@GCE.com>, "Glenn C. Everhart" <Everhart@GCE.com> writes:C > VMS also has the feature that IRPs are queued in process priorityrF > order. Larry was right (and I had not remembered). The INSQUE simply6 > has to be pointed at the right queue entry (and is). > : > The VMS environment just has many fewer priority values,A > does prio boosts for many I/Os, and has enough other cruft thatn- > the mechanism's effect is less than in RSX.e  @ But the priority used for queuing the IRPs is the base priority,< rather than the boosted priority.  I still think and lack of/ effectiveness seen is due to smart controllers.t   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.410 ************************