1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 27 Jul 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 417       Contents:! 8400 aka GS140, is it or isn't it % Re: 8400 aka GS140, is it or isn't it " AW: Killing a process in VMS 7.1-2- Re: CETS2000 Registration is open and working - Re: CETS2000 Registration is open and working   DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850$ RE: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850$ Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850$ Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850$ Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850$ Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850" Re: Doubt reg.  disk mounting ...." Re: Doubt reg.  disk mounting ...., Graphics board in a VAXStation 3100 Model 760 Re: Graphics board in a VAXStation 3100 Model 76 Re: GS140 write I/O wall Re: GS140 write I/O wall Re: GS140 write I/O wall Re: GS140 write I/O wall Re: GS140 write I/O wall Re: GS140 write I/O wallD RE: I/O caching and UNIX evaluations (was: Re: got to remember ..	.)I Re: I/O caching and UNIX evaluations (was: Re: got to remember ..      .) ) RE: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source ) Re: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source ) RE: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source ) Re: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source ) Re: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source " Re: Killing a process in VMS 7.1-2 Re: Memory & CPU Support Re: Memory & CPU Support  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99 Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99  RE: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99  Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99 1 Re: Mlucas performance probelm - need expert help  MS IntelliMouse on Alpha?  Re: MS IntelliMouse on Alpha? ( Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com( Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com$ Re: Nine(9) VAXstation 3100s on eBay Re: OpenVMS Galaxy% Patwhorks Performance and TCP NODELAY ) Re: Patwhorks Performance and TCP NODELAY ) Re: Patwhorks Performance and TCP NODELAY / problem starting decmotif and monitor problems. ( Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"( Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"( Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"( Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"! RE: Stirrings in the undergrowth? ! Re: Stirrings in the undergrowth? ! Re: Stirrings in the undergrowth?  TCP/IP Host  Updating RMS Files Re: Updating RMS Files8 Re: Vacancy exists : VMS Junior Sys Admin, Bracknell, UK6 VMS process manipulate data on SQLServer/NT box : How?< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S< Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S- Re: Where is documentation ordering web page? - RE: Where is documentation ordering web page? - RE: Where is documentation ordering web page? - Re: Where is documentation ordering web page?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:51:58 GMT / From: "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> * Subject: 8400 aka GS140, is it or isn't itH Message-ID: <28Xf5.18347$o71.1178026@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>  K I have asked this of Sales Pukes, I have asked it here and on VMSNET.ALPHA, > I have asked it of Compaq, but I cannot get a reliable answer.  H If I put EV6/525 cpu boards in an Alpha 8400, does that make it a GS140?  H This might sound like an irrelevant question, but I really need to know.  L I need to know if I can use the published performance specs for a GS140 when1 doing capacity planning before doing the upgrade.   L Also, I now see some #1 rated ECOs that are to be applied to all GS systems.# Does that include my upgraded 8400?   H If the sales pukes are wrong, then why does Compaq "authorize" them.  IfG they were Compaq sales pukes, I would tend to put more credence in what K they say, but I have not had a Compaq (or Digital) sales person call me for D years.  I am not sure what it takes to get Compaq's attention.  When	 including I our Tru-64 systems, we have a barnful of their equipment, including three K VAX 7860s (soon to be traded for Alpha if I can get the right information),  at leastJ five Alpha 8400s,  six (I think) ES40s, and a COUPLE of Wildfires on orderF (or soon to be ordered).  This doesn't include the football sized data center+ that is littered with even older DEC stuff.   F I think we are one of those big, old,  LOYAL customers that are TRYINGF to remain loyal, but it is getting more and more difficult.  Even I am	 amazed at G how much progress I have made bringing VMS back to our company, but all & that progress can be lost very easily.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 17:16:52 GMT . From: "Curtis Rempel" <curtis.rempel@home.com>. Subject: Re: 8400 aka GS140, is it or isn't it= Message-ID: <88_f5.104973$ef6.1463284@news1.rdc1.ab.home.com>   K That's what happened when we upgraded our 8200's with EV6/525 boards - they F booted up as GS60's, er, well, after we applied an ECO kit so the bootH loader would stop saying "what the heck kind of hardware is this??"  :-)  H Still, I wasn't quite sure they were GS60's until the DECpaq service guyG pasted a sticker over the |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| logo with the Compaq logo and 0 "GS60" - then I was absolutely convinced...  ;-)  : "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> wrote in messageB news:28Xf5.18347$o71.1178026@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...? > I have asked this of Sales Pukes, I have asked it here and on 
 VMSNET.ALPHA, @ > I have asked it of Compaq, but I cannot get a reliable answer. > J > If I put EV6/525 cpu boards in an Alpha 8400, does that make it a GS140? > J > This might sound like an irrelevant question, but I really need to know. > I > I need to know if I can use the published performance specs for a GS140  when3 > doing capacity planning before doing the upgrade.  > E > Also, I now see some #1 rated ECOs that are to be applied to all GS  systems.% > Does that include my upgraded 8400?  > J > If the sales pukes are wrong, then why does Compaq "authorize" them.  IfI > they were Compaq sales pukes, I would tend to put more credence in what I > they say, but I have not had a Compaq (or Digital) sales person call me  for F > years.  I am not sure what it takes to get Compaq's attention.  When > including K > our Tru-64 systems, we have a barnful of their equipment, including three ? > VAX 7860s (soon to be traded for Alpha if I can get the right 
 information), 
 > at leastL > five Alpha 8400s,  six (I think) ES40s, and a COUPLE of Wildfires on orderH > (or soon to be ordered).  This doesn't include the football sized data > center- > that is littered with even older DEC stuff.  > H > I think we are one of those big, old,  LOYAL customers that are TRYINGH > to remain loyal, but it is getting more and more difficult.  Even I am > amazed at I > how much progress I have made bringing VMS back to our company, but all ( > that progress can be lost very easily. >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:12:32 +0200 < From: "Uhlhorn, Anneliese" <Anneliese.Uhlhorn@SLV.bayern.de>+ Subject: AW: Killing a process in VMS 7.1-2 = Message-ID: <4913AE76C4E1D2118F9900105A0EF7004E1A2C@komserv3>   D It was a internal drive, 3 hours after removing the drive from the =	 rack, the  process C died without further actions. There was no OPCOM message. then we = 	 installed 	 the drive H in another system. After starting the backup we found the same effect. = I  think a hardware: problem of the tape drive was the reason for this problem.  
 Anneliese =20   # -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht----- % Von: Ian Shiel [mailto:ishiel@iol.ie] , Gesendet am: Donnerstag, 27. Juli 2000 00:04 An: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com + Betreff: Re: Killing a process in VMS 7.1-2   6 Er - what exactly do you mean by "eliminate the drive"  E By any chance are there OPCOM messages requesting that the drive be =  mounted?  1 Is it an external (desktop) or an internal drive?    Ian  ishiel at iol dot ie  G "Uhlhorn, Anneliese" <Anneliese.Uhlhorn@SLV.bayern.de> wrote in message 7 news:4913AE76C4E1D2118F9900105A0EF7004E1A16@komserv3... 	 > Hi all,  > G > We have a problem killing a process in Alpha VMS 7.1-2. The process =  hass > mounted a TZ87 an we have noF > chance to kill it. Process is in state LEF. If we try to stop it, no message * > is returned but the proc is still alive.G > Then we tried to eliminate the drive and waited for 30 Minutes. But =  this' > doesn't help. Is there another way to 0 > kill the process without rebooting the system? >  > Thank you in advance > with regards > Anneliese Uhlhorn  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:38:15 GMT  From: rob.lesan@zdnetonebox.com 6 Subject: Re: CETS2000 Registration is open and working) Message-ID: <8lpe07$g7f$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   F In article <8aGf5.9924$Uo6.528480@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,2   "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> wrote:H > First,  let me apologize for inserting my 2 cents where it was neither > requested, nor beneficial. > D > Second, I thank you for explaining your position to me rather thanB > flaming me.  That is how a good discussion should be carried out > B > I hope you get to go to both seminars.  I am sure that you would5 > find both of them beneficial in one way or another.   E Also in hind sight, I realize my original comments were uncalled for. @ I have been losing faith in Compaq/ITUG ever since Compaq boughtB Tandem.  The entire DECUS/ITUG thing has me rather worked up and ID cannot speak for the DECUS members, but I can't help but feel we areF both going to lose some focus from our annual conventions by combining them into one.  E I don't know what Compaq plans, they probably don't either, but until E the two product lines meet (and they will with the Alpha's going into E the Himalaya systems) I can't see the customer value in incorporating  the user communities.   G What I am hoping for in CETS200 is some insight into the engineering of B future products from Compaq.  Maybe someone at this conference canE explain to me why Compaq is using the NonStop attribute with anything  but a Himalaya...   
 Tks all...    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 11:12:50 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) 6 Subject: Re: CETS2000 Registration is open and working+ Message-ID: <g4u37l09mQov@eisner.decus.org>   K In article <8lpe07$g7f$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, rob.lesan@zdnetonebox.com writes: H > In article <8aGf5.9924$Uo6.528480@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,4 >   "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> wrote:I >> First,  let me apologize for inserting my 2 cents where it was neither  >> requested, nor beneficial.  >>E >> Second, I thank you for explaining your position to me rather than C >> flaming me.  That is how a good discussion should be carried out  >>C >> I hope you get to go to both seminars.  I am sure that you would 6 >> find both of them beneficial in one way or another. > G > Also in hind sight, I realize my original comments were uncalled for. B > I have been losing faith in Compaq/ITUG ever since Compaq boughtD > Tandem.  The entire DECUS/ITUG thing has me rather worked up and IF > cannot speak for the DECUS members, but I can't help but feel we areH > both going to lose some focus from our annual conventions by combining > them into one.  G The CETS event is supposed to combine several non-ITUG events together, E so ITUG members should pay close attention to comments afterward from E the various constituencies to see if they feel their core values have  been preserved.   G > I don't know what Compaq plans, they probably don't either, but until G > the two product lines meet (and they will with the Alpha's going into G > the Himalaya systems) I can't see the customer value in incorporating  > the user communities.   E I don't think the product lines _will_ meet.  Saying there will be an C Alpha inside machines that run NSK and inside machines that run VMS E is akin to saying they both have power supplies.  There might be some E degree of commonality in compiler back-ends, but that is it for joint  talks.  I > What I am hoping for in CETS200 is some insight into the engineering of D > future products from Compaq.  Maybe someone at this conference canG > explain to me why Compaq is using the NonStop attribute with anything  > but a Himalaya...   > Use of the term NonStop is a marketing activity rather than an engineering activity :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 01:53:47 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)) Subject: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850 L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2707000153470001@user-2ive63s.dialup.mindspring.com>  
 Hello All,  H I'm trying to get DCPS version 1.5 (on an alpha, not a vax) to work withJ a new Tektronix Phaser 850.  (Yes, I know it's not on the supported list.)  B DCPS 1.7 is lying around here somewhere, waiting for a Round Tuit.  ! I'm using raw Tcpip to port 9100:    $ show queue/full phaser850 L Printer queue PHASER850, stalled, on LEGS3::DCPS$, mounted form DCPS$DEFAULT  (stock=DEFAULT)?   /BASE_PRIORITY=4 /DEFAULT=(FORM=DCPS$DEFAULT (stock=DEFAULT)) ?   /NOENABLE_GENERIC /LIBRARY=DCPS_LIB Lowercase /OWNER=[SYSTEM] C   /PROCESSOR=DCPS$SMB /NO_INITIAL_FF /PROTECTION=(S:M,O:D,G:R,W:RS)    /SCHEDULE=(NOSIZE)  4   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status4   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------5     863  LOGIN           DEININGER        15  Stalled M          Submitted 26-JUL-2000 23:00:02.39 /FORM=DCPS$DEFAULT (stock=DEFAULT) I          /PARAM=("DATA=ASCII","NUMBER_UP=4","PAGE_OR=PORT") /PRIORITY=100 >          File: _$2$DKA100:[DEININGER]LOGIN.COM;117 (printing))     $ show lo *dcps$phaser*    (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)  C   "DCPS$PHASER850_DEVICE_NAME" = "IP_RAWTCP/redacted.redacted:9100"     "DCPS$PHASER850_NO_SYNC" = "1"5   "DCPS$PHASER850_PARAMETER" = "DATA_TYPE=POSTSCRIPT" #   "DCPS$PHASER850_PID" = "5820026A" 9   "DCPS$PHASER850_STALLED" = "Communication with printer"     ? I found the DCPS$PHASER850_NO_SYNC logical is necessary to keep 0 jobs from getting stuck in the "starting" state.  M Here's what happens:  I print a job, the pages come out (correctly), then the H printer display says it is still receiving data, but there's no ethernet activity on the blinkenlights.  After 1 minute the printer goes idle, and after 4 minutes DCPS stalls the queue and sets the DCPS$PHASER850_STALLED logical as shown.  If I do a print/trail, I get the trailer page, and then the job stalls as before.  J It looks to me like the printer is waiting for the alpha to say something,< and the alpha is waiting for the printer to say something.    G If I delete the entry, the queue comes back to life and prints the next  job, which stalls...  J Any ideas?  This seems like it must be a simple configuration problem, but I'm not seeing a solution.  C I can't wait to start fighting with tray selection and duplexing...    Thanks for any advice.    K (This is a very nice printer, BTW.  Except the Macintosh software installer  is mostly broken, and of course they've never heard of VMS.  The Billy-Box and oonix configurations are Not My Problem, but I assume it will be hellish.)   > I hearby nominate the Tek Phaser 850 for Genicom's To-Do list.   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 12:49:29 GMT6 From: DAVISM@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (Michael T. Davis)- Subject: RE: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850 : Message-ID: <8lpb4p$6ge$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  I         I feel your pain (;-).  We are still using "Pathworks for OpenVMS J (Macintosh)" in order to use its printing support for printers such as theL 850, and the Phaser 550, which aren't supported by DCPS.  The newest versionH of DCPS, due Real Soon Now, is supposed to support the Phaser 740, so itN might be possible to at least adapt its device control library modules for theK 550/560, due to the printers' similiarities, but I have my doubts about the  850.  L         I also believe I came up against a bug in the 850's AppleTalk stack,I which might extend to the other network stacks, depending on the firmware H implementation.  (I'm using the VMS AppleTalk API, the documentation forM which is probably no longer sold by CPQ.)  I found that if I sent the printer:H a PAPStatus call (see "Inside AppleTalk, Second Edition", p. 10-16), andG determined the printer was ready by receiving "status: idle", if I then N attempted a PAPOpen (p. 10-17) call, the printer would report it was busy.  IfK I introduced an artificial delay between observing the "status: idle" stateiJ from the PAPStatus call and the PAPOpen call, the PAPOpen call would work,K and I could start to send data to the 850.  According to the aforementionedtH reference, the PAPStatus call, when received by the printer, generates aO response which is supposed to be "...made without delivering the request to thetI PAP client in the server." (p. 10-12)  I infer from this that the printerrM shouldn't really report it's busy for a PAPOpen call, just because it's stillnL (apparently) still processing a PAPStatus call.  I've reported this behaviorJ to Tektronix (Xerox), but haven't received anything more than what I wouldJ term a "canned" response.  If your problem can't be attributed to anythingD else, perhaps this behavior is what's causing your problem, as well.   Mike --K              Michael T. Davis              |    Systems Specialist: ChE,MSEeN   E-mail: davism@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu    | Departmental Networking/ComputingJ            -or- DAVISM+@osu.edu            |     The Ohio State UniversityJ http://www.er6.eng.ohio-state.edu/~davism/ |     197 Watts, (614) 292-6928   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:52:11 GMT-/ From: "Richard L. Dyson" <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu> - Subject: Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850l) Message-ID: <397FF83B.5B05BFD9@uiowa.edu>l   Robert Deininger wrote:  >  > Hello All, > J > I'm trying to get DCPS version 1.5 (on an alpha, not a vax) to work withL > a new Tektronix Phaser 850.  (Yes, I know it's not on the supported list.)  @ 	I've setup and used a variety of network printers (HP, Digital,F Xerox, Tektronix, etc.) and have always just used their LPD interface.D It has always worked fine (including my Tektronix/Xerox 840DP) rightF away.  Maybe the 850 does something different, but I suspect it is the" same network interface as the 840.  B 	Is there something the DCPS brings that you have to have?  If youB are using UCX, they have a simple UCX$LPRSetup program to walk you throughl& it and Multinet has something similar.  ? 	I guess I've only heard the complaints on DCPS so I have neveroH heard the good things ('cause they would tend to not get discusssed here :)B and I guess there must be some or so many would not be using it...   Rick -- nH Richard L. Dyson                                    rick-dyson@uiowa.eduH  _   _      _____                http://www-pi.physics.uiowa.edu/~dyson/H | | | |    |_   _|   Systems Analyst                     O: 319/335-1879H | | | | of   | |     The University of Iowa            FAX: 319/335-17536 | \_/ |     _| |_    Department of Physics & Astronomy-  \___/     |_____|   Iowa City, IA 52242-1479o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:52:37 +0100s& From: Roy Omond <Roy.Omond@compaq.com>- Subject: Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850n* Message-ID: <39803EA5.83E18F5D@compaq.com>   "Michael T. Davis" wrote:0   > [...snip snip...]S >?N >         I also believe I came up against a bug in the 850's AppleTalk stack,K > which might extend to the other network stacks, depending on the firmware J > implementation.  (I'm using the VMS AppleTalk API, the documentation forO > which is probably no longer sold by CPQ.)  I found that if I sent the printeraJ > a PAPStatus call (see "Inside AppleTalk, Second Edition", p. 10-16), andI > determined the printer was ready by receiving "status: idle", if I then P > attempted a PAPOpen (p. 10-17) call, the printer would report it was busy.  IfM > I introduced an artificial delay between observing the "status: idle" statelL > from the PAPStatus call and the PAPOpen call, the PAPOpen call would work,M > and I could start to send data to the 850.  According to the aforementioned)J > reference, the PAPStatus call, when received by the printer, generates aQ > response which is supposed to be "...made without delivering the request to theaK > PAP client in the server." (p. 10-12)  I infer from this that the printeroO > shouldn't really report it's busy for a PAPOpen call, just because it's stilltN > (apparently) still processing a PAPStatus call.  I've reported this behaviorL > to Tektronix (Xerox), but haven't received anything more than what I wouldL > term a "canned" response.  If your problem can't be attributed to anythingF > else, perhaps this behavior is what's causing your problem, as well.   Hmmm...i  E This sounds more like the bug in the PostScript implementation in theeD HP 8000 series, in that sending a control-T to the interpreter wouldF produce "status: busy" when the printer was really idle.  This is what? prevented DCPS using the 8000 series (since fixed by a firmware B release by HP).  I doubt if the bug you're observing in the 850 isH in the AppleTalk stack; I'd say it's more likely to be in the PostScript implementation.o    But then again, maybe I'm wrong.  	 Roy Omondn Blue Bubble Ltd., (certainly not speaking on behalf of Compaq)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 10:56:26 -0400e2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)- Subject: Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850kL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2707001056260001@user-2ivec5u.dialup.mindspring.com>  Z In article <397FF83B.5B05BFD9@uiowa.edu>, "Richard L. Dyson" <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu> wrote:   > Robert Deininger wrote:e > >  > > Hello All, > > L > > I'm trying to get DCPS version 1.5 (on an alpha, not a vax) to work withN > > a new Tektronix Phaser 850.  (Yes, I know it's not on the supported list.) > I >         I've setup and used a variety of network printers (HP, Digital,aH > Xerox, Tektronix, etc.) and have always just used their LPD interface.F > It has always worked fine (including my Tektronix/Xerox 840DP) rightH > away.  Maybe the 850 does something different, but I suspect it is the$ > same network interface as the 840. > K >         Is there something the DCPS brings that you have to have?  If youuD > are using UCX, they have a simple UCX$LPRSetup program to walk you	 > through8( > it and Multinet has something similar.  G Well, DCPS translates a variety of document formats to postscript, withnF goodies like multi-up printing, margins, etc.  It's a robust, VMS-likeI product.  In the good old days, outfits like QMS made printers that spokedD DECnet and came with VMS symbionts that understood all the printer'sB features.  It just worked, no pain.  DCPS (when it works) gets you# (almost) back to the good old days.   K LPD just pours data down a one-way oonixy rat-hole.  If the data is alreadymK in the printer's native language and the interconnect is perfect, it works.- I have not found the ucx$lprsetup program, but I'll look for it. Judging from the ucx manuals, there's a lot they don't tell you how to do, even ignoringoK the problem of translating to postscript.  Of course, this is our fallback r option.t  F My experience with LPD to date involves remote printers hooked to someB oonix machine.  Jobs get relayed through one or more intermediate H machines.  If any of the system managers change anything, it all breaks.E If any of the oonix machines sneezes or has a slight fever, it starts L vanishing jobs into thin air.  And there are generally 2**N queues to chooseK from for a printer with N features, since each queue only supports a singledI combination of features.  Maybe that's not how it's supposed to work, but:K that's how the "experts" around here do it.  With a local printer, at leastmF I won't have to deal with the relay machines; I'll talk to the printer directly from VMS.   Have you any examples of tray selection and duplex control for the 840DP, using LPD?  That would be very useful, even with DCPS.  I'm going to need the magic Postscript incantations, and so far the Tek documentation is pretty awful.J I think it's likely that the 840 and 850 implementations are very similar.  H >         I guess I've only heard the complaints on DCPS so I have neverJ > heard the good things ('cause they would tend to not get discusssed here > :)D > and I guess there must be some or so many would not be using it...   Genicom is pretty shy about which printers they support.  And with new, shoddy printer versions coming out every few weeks, that leaves a lot of us havingI to work around the weirdness ourselves.  I don't recall seeing complaints K about DCPS with supported printers.  I guess that either means it works, or05 nobody can afford to buy those high-end printers. :-)$   -- n Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com5   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:02:40 -0400n2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)- Subject: Re: DCPS woes / Tektronix Phaser 850uL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2707001102400001@user-2ivec5u.dialup.mindspring.com>  r In article <8lpb4p$6ge$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, DAVISM@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (Michael T. Davis) wrote:    N >         I also believe I came up against a bug in the 850's AppleTalk stack,K > which might extend to the other network stacks, depending on the firmwarel > implementation.     H Hmm.  Ethertalk seems to be working perfectly on the 850, once I ignoredE the macintosh software installer and installed by hand.  Made me wishSI the VMS implementation of Appletalk was still supported; I'd have used itr- in a minute when DCPS started having trouble.t   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.coml   ------------------------------  , Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:03:19 +0200 (CEST): From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>+ Subject: Re: Doubt reg.  disk mounting ....iI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0007270836570.9745-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>i  ) On Wed, 26 Jul 2000, mohamed irfan wrote:o  6 +In openVMS/VMS why the mouting of disks are required?  ;  The "mount" operation connects a filesystem to the device.   7 +Is it not possible to use the disks without mounting? e    No."  You *can* use not mounted device./  But you must use proper programming interface.i  4 +We know that this is a very basic question, hence a/ +convincing answer/suggestion/refernce would beg +appereciated.  -  Then after the shortest answers some points:e  4 - you have available IO operation to device. But the4  "mostly used" programs (including DCL commands) are6  *not* use it. That is the same, as on DOS or Windows:4  you *have* interface to disk IO, but only less part7  of (mostly diagnostics, and some utility like DiskDuped6  where copies contens of disk regardless of the files)7  use it. On the level of "access to disk" you can b.ex.h2  switch off the motor, not only read "raw data"...7 - systems like Windows automatically mounts filesystem,t9  while "sees" it. Systems like VMS, un*xes and some othero9  OSes must get explicite command to mount the filesystem; 6  mounting - allows access to the "device" as "files on	  device".I5 - VMS has one "simple and dumb" filesystem internallyU2  available. It is marked with "/FOREIGN" qualifier0  in MOUNT command. You can then allow IO to disk7  or tape *to raw data on disk (or tape)* with *standardn  IO* operation - like to file.3   That makes the "raw IO utility" not be useful andn5  required as in DOS: under DOS you *must* use specialh8  program (b.ex. DiskDupe) to copy "raw" content of data,5  under VMS you can "MOUNT/FOREIGN" the device and usea5  *typical* programm (even COPY ! You must only *know*p  what error is expected -;)!).2 - because the MOUNT command gives you some control8  of sharing purpouses - the resolution is also "the best  for typical usage".9 - for non-typical usage you *can* write a programm, where 4  accesses the device skipping all filesystem levels.7   You have special privileges (check LOG_IO and PHY_IO)d<  where allow you access to the "raw IO". FYI: the "organised<  IO" (like a file-IO, including the /FOREIGN mounted device)<  is named Virtual-IO Some non-IO oriented operation requires  also DIAGNOSE privilege.E  7  At end: no way, for details check the documentation...o   +With Regards ...a   also - Gotfryd -- fE =====================================================================iF $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME . $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================g   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 10:52:59 GMT' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)7+ Subject: Re: Doubt reg.  disk mounting ....o0 Message-ID: <8lp4ab$i5i$1@aquila.news.mdx.ac.uk>  i In article <20000727024518.320.qmail@web1611.mail.yahoo.com>, mohamed irfan <irfn_1999@yahoo.com> writes:e >Sir,) > 7 >Following question was put up by one of the student. Iu4 >will be very much thankfull to you, if a convincing" >answer is given to this question. > 6 >In openVMS/VMS why the mouting of disks are required?7 >Is it not possible to use the disks without mounting? R >C4 >We know that this is a very basic question, hence a/ >convincing answer/suggestion/refernce would beE >appereciated. >N >Anticipating an early reply.: >With Regards ...L >Irfan.) >  >===== >b >e  L Most real operating systems Unix, VMS etc have a mount command or equivalentN since this gives the system administrator more control of how disk devices are	 accessed.U  O Mounting makes a device (and in the case of disks) the filesystem available forIK processing. Various memory structures are setup. Various access options areI+ selected according to the mount qualifiers.l   Eg  ; A disk can be mounted for private use or for shared access.MN The fact that all disks are not automatically mounted means that a disk can be7 mounted on just one system in a cluster or clusterwide.P  , Disks can be mounted in ways other than the     1 device = 1 disk volume  manner   eg  J Software shadowing (aka Mirroring)  where 2 or more devices appear as one D mounted disk with the data being replicated on the multiple devices.  O Bound volume sets  where 2 or more devices appear to be one larger concatenateds device.i    N When a disk starts clocking up errors indicating it is about to fail it can beO dismounted and replaced without the need to reboot the system. (unless the disk$K is shadowed or in some other sort of raid set this will of course impact on 3 any users/applications using that particular disk).t  , The disk can be restored from tape by using I the MOUNT/FOREIGN command to mount it as a non-file structured device and. then restoring an image backup.q  I After the restore the disk can then be dismounted and remounted privatelyaK so the system administrator can check everything out. Sometimes the system eI manager may wish to edit certain files before releasing the disk back to dD the users. Finally the disk can be dismounted and then remounted for  system-wide or cluster-wide use.  N Automatically mounting devices behind the scenes is great for desktop machinesK with limited numbers of disks but real operating systems with large numbersb? of disks need to provide their adminstrators with more control.s    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex university   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:14:24 GMTA) From: "David Betz" <dbetz@xlisper.mv.com>i5 Subject: Graphics board in a VAXStation 3100 Model 76s< Message-ID: <QAWf5.55233$jE1.525279@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  H I recently acquired a VAXStation 3100 Model 76 SPX and am having troubleJ getting it to work with my VR150 monitor. When I plugged it in and poweredK up the 3100 all I got was a blank screen. I verified that the monitor worksDJ by connecting it to another machine. I also checked the switch on the backB of the 3100 to make sure it was in the down position to select theJ monitor/keyboard rather than an external console. Then I decided to see ifE it was the graphics board that was causing the trouble. I removed the5E daughter board (the component side says GS-2 and the solder side sayseB SCANPROC 8 PLANE 2D) and I now see text on the screen on power up.   My questions are:a  L 1) Is the graphics board defective or is it just incompatible with the VR150 monitor?  C 2) If they are incompatible, which monitor do I need for this modeld VAXStation?t  H 3) Is there any problem with running the 3100 without the graphics board
 installed?   Thanks,t
 David Betz   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:44:31 -0500r/ From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com>s9 Subject: Re: Graphics board in a VAXStation 3100 Model 76nO Message-ID: <60C7B9C0EC5C0D06.367043D441C7DF9A.09E299DF6CC88767@lp.airnews.net>e   David Betz wrote:l > J > I recently acquired a VAXStation 3100 Model 76 SPX and am having troubleL > getting it to work with my VR150 monitor. When I plugged it in and poweredM > up the 3100 all I got was a blank screen. I verified that the monitor works L > by connecting it to another machine. I also checked the switch on the backD > of the 3100 to make sure it was in the down position to select theL > monitor/keyboard rather than an external console. Then I decided to see ifG > it was the graphics board that was causing the trouble. I removed thevG > daughter board (the component side says GS-2 and the solder side sayscD > SCANPROC 8 PLANE 2D) and I now see text on the screen on power up. >  > My questions are:t > N > 1) Is the graphics board defective or is it just incompatible with the VR150
 > monitor?   Probably neither.i   E > 2) If they are incompatible, which monitor do I need for this model9
 > VAXStation?-  6 With a SPX board, I like the VRT19 series of monitors.   J > 3) Is there any problem with running the 3100 without the graphics board > installed?   No.     F If I understand correctly, you are saying that with the graphics boardH removed, everything works.  With the graphics board installed, you don't. see anything on the display.  Is this correct?  D If so, it is probably the cable.  I assume that you are using a monoH cable.  The SPX is a color board and requires a color cable.  If you useH a mono monitor with a color board, you connect it to the G (green) lead.  
 Good luck!  G -----------------------------------------------------------------------t$ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com     Fax: 817-237-3074    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 11:04:10 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)! Subject: Re: GS140 write I/O walll+ Message-ID: <fiUThcvVq7yq@eisner.decus.org>d  x In article <eDff5.8057$RG6.682993@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> writes:   > I > I have an Alpha 8400 with four CIPCAs attached to a farm full of HSJ52ssM > supporting disks.  I also have 6 scsi adapters supporting twelve (two each)~C > DLT 7000s.  When we do BACKUP from disk to tape, the best thruput1F > I have achieved is almost exactly 25 MB/sec.  I was glad to see that
 > however,% > and thought I was doing a good job.y >   A 	I saw a chart just two days ago and wished I had saved the link.-  ? 	It shows that regardless of technology (it was a bit dated, no > 	fibre channel info) the best you can expect is 80-85% of peak$ 	bandwidth, noting SCSI, CI, FDDI...  ? 	I recall it showed something like 11-12 MByte/sec for CI using.@ 	80-85% as a rule of thumb.  So with 4 CIPCAs to 4 Star Couplers8 	(you do have 4 star couplers?) you would be looking at  	44-48 MByte/sec best case...   D 	Question then is do you have your file striped across 8 controllers@ 	(with A and B leg active in 4 Star Couplers you can get at mostB 	8 controllers talking).  The devices hanging off the controllers,? 	mirrorsets?  Striped mirrors?  Single disks?   If single diskse; 	here is a good chart that shows how long a 127 block Read   	takes:   > http://oradoc.photo.net/ora8doc/DOC/server803/A54638_01/io.htm  = 	So if a 127 or so block takes 80 ms to SEQUENTIAL read (notet; 	very Unix centric nature in doc above but my experience isa6 	that VMS isn't magic and can't make disks talk faster- 	than what other OSes can :-) and your doing eE 	what most of us do is BACKUP/BLOCK_SIZE=65534 or so you can see you ,G 	can only get 12 * 127 blocks/sec or a little more than 1525 blocks/seci1 	to a single disk which is less than 1 MByte/sec "F 	(2048 blocks = 1 MByte).  Note:  very unscientific, my actual results? 	are buried in a pile somewhere but using a FREEWARE VMS tool IpE 	did see surprisingly low throughput with larger block sizes.  Didn'tr= 	know it took so long to do an I/O that size until I stumbledaC 	upon docs like that above and that helped explain why I was seeing A 	such "poor" results on single devices (number of I/Os per seconds8 	go way down as block size increase, now I know why :-).  D 	So since you are getting 25 MByte/sec out of your backup, I predictE 	you aren't using single devices (besides, may be a database , right?b@ 	and we do like availability).  Not much of a prediction, but a B 	start.  What else do we know about what you are doing?  Not much.  < 	Tell us more about YOUR layout ... and yes the other guy as* 	Bart Z. points out is guilty of the same.  < 	An HSJ50 which can *only* do 4-5 MByte/sec... with 8 active@ 	controllers you should be able to do a better than 25 MByte/sec" 	if you have enough I/O in flight.  7 	Back at the beginning of the year there was a guy thate< 	was having Oracle I/O problems.  Hadn't heard back from him8 	so I contacted him off line.  Speculation in this group< 	was it was an Oracle problem.  A Compaq consultant came outA 	and ran VTDPY on his controllers and pointed out his controllersd 	were saturated.  # 	Tell us more about your situation.      > N > Now though, we plan to replace 3 VAX 7860s with two Enterprise class Alphas,H > (probably GS140s). Our VAXes house very high IO applications, and even > thoughH > I am sure the Alphas will outclass them, I want to outclass them to an
 > embarassing 
 > degree. :-)n >   B 	You using RAID Software for VMS?  Now that it is fixed (Hi Bob!),; 	you can do very high I/O with creative use of software andy= 	hardware RAID.  Go for fibre channel it is the future.  Holdt? 	off until fall so you can get those 15K Seagate drives.  Thoses< 	puppies do 140 IO/sec ... compare and contrast to 80 IO/sec@ 	for run of the mill 7200 RPM drives and 110/sec for 10K drives.   				Rob    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 11:30:21 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)! Subject: Re: GS140 write I/O wall + Message-ID: <Yq0geS7gThW0@eisner.decus.org>c  x In article <eDff5.8057$RG6.682993@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> writes:   > I > I have an Alpha 8400 with four CIPCAs attached to a farm full of HSJ52suM > supporting disks.  I also have 6 scsi adapters supporting twelve (two each)nC > DLT 7000s.  When we do BACKUP from disk to tape, the best thruputaF > I have achieved is almost exactly 25 MB/sec.  I was glad to see that
 > however,% > and thought I was doing a good job.o >   = 	[In hindsight.. big assumption on my part is you are lookingi< 	at backing up a large database.  If you have tons of little2 	files, you would introduce seek issues too, etc.]  A 	I saw a chart just two days ago and wished I had saved the link.n  ? 	It shows that regardless of technology (it was a bit dated, noI> 	fibre channel info) the best you can expect is 80-85% of peak$ 	bandwidth, noting SCSI, CI, FDDI...  ? 	I recall it showed something like 11-12 MByte/sec for CI usingt@ 	80-85% as a rule of thumb.  So with 4 CIPCAs to 4 Star Couplers8 	(you do have 4 star couplers?) you would be looking at  	44-48 MByte/sec best case...   D 	Question then is do you have your file striped across 8 controllers@ 	(with A and B leg active in 4 Star Couplers you can get at mostB 	8 controllers talking)?  The devices hanging off the controllers,? 	mirrorsets?  Striped mirrors?  Single disks?   If single disksf; 	here is a good chart that shows how long a 127 block Read h 	takes:'  > http://oradoc.photo.net/ora8doc/DOC/server803/A54638_01/io.htm  = 	So if a 127 or so block takes 35 ms to SEQUENTIAL read (note8; 	very Unix centric nature in doc above but my experience isu6 	that VMS isn't magic and can't make disks talk faster- 	than what other OSes can :-) and your doing tE 	what most of us do is BACKUP/BLOCK_SIZE=65534 or so you can see you o3 	can only get 29 * 127 blocks/sec or 1.8 MByte/sec.tF 	(2048 blocks = 1 MByte).  Note:  very unscientific, my actual results? 	are buried in a pile somewhere but using a FREEWARE VMS tool IgE 	did see surprisingly low throughput with larger block sizes.  Didn'ti= 	know it took so long to do an I/O that size until I stumbledmC 	upon docs like that above and that helped explain why I was seeing A 	such "poor" results on single devices (number of I/Os per second-? 	go way down as block size increase, now I know why :-).  Also,n- 	10K drives versus 7200 RPM is also a factor.n  D 	So since you are getting 25 MByte/sec out of your backup, I predictE 	you aren't using single devices (besides, may be a database , right?e@ 	and we do like availability).  Not much of a prediction, but a B 	start.  What else do we know about what you are doing?  Not much.  < 	Tell us more about YOUR layout ... and yes the other guy as* 	Bart Z. points out is guilty of the same.  < 	An HSJ50 which can *only* do 4-5 MByte/sec... with 8 active@ 	controllers you should be able to do a better than 25 MByte/sec" 	if you have enough I/O in flight.  7 	Back at the beginning of the year there was a guy thatl< 	was having Oracle I/O problems.  Hadn't heard back from him8 	so I contacted him off line.  Speculation in this group< 	was it was an Oracle problem.  A Compaq consultant came outA 	and ran VTDPY on his controllers and pointed out his controllersi 	were saturated.  # 	Tell us more about your situation.t     > N > Now though, we plan to replace 3 VAX 7860s with two Enterprise class Alphas,H > (probably GS140s). Our VAXes house very high IO applications, and even > thoughH > I am sure the Alphas will outclass them, I want to outclass them to an
 > embarassing 
 > degree. :-)  >   B 	You using RAID Software for VMS?  Now that it is fixed (Hi Bob!),; 	you can do very high I/O with creative use of software andi= 	hardware RAID.  Go for fibre channel it is the future.  Holde? 	off until fall so you can get those 15K Seagate drives.  Thosee< 	puppies do 140 IO/sec ... compare and contrast to 80 IO/sec@ 	for run of the mill 7200 RPM drives and 110/sec for 10K drives.   				Robu   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:00:20 -0400w' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> ! Subject: Re: GS140 write I/O wallt( Message-ID: <8lpm7l$fc0$1@pyrite.mv.net>  5 Rob Young <young_r@eisner.decus.org> wrote in messagei% news:Yq0geS7gThW0@eisner.decus.org...    ...x   If single disks ; > here is a good chart that shows how long a 127 block Readt > takes: >u@ > http://oradoc.photo.net/ora8doc/DOC/server803/A54638_01/io.htm  E That chart bears little relation to both current disk performance andmH non-Unix environments.  In other words, it's useless in this discussion.   > > > So if a 127 or so block takes 35 ms to SEQUENTIAL read (note< > very Unix centric nature in doc above but my experience is7 > that VMS isn't magic and can't make disks talk faster*- > than what other OSes can :-) and your doing.E > what most of us do is BACKUP/BLOCK_SIZE=65534 or so you can see you 4 > can only get 29 * 127 blocks/sec or 1.8 MByte/sec. > (2048 blocks = 1 MByte).  J But since the chart doesn't apply, expect to be able to get something likeG the rated sustainable disk bandwidth from a competent (and uncontended) E streaming-conscious application on VMS - i.e., something well over 20 G MBytes/sec on a recent SCSI or FC disk (IDE has more problems streaming F data, though since the actual hardware capabilities have recently beenL updated - at least by some vendors - those problems may largely disappear as! soon as new drivers get written).c  -   Note:  very unscientific, my actual resultsi@ > are buried in a pile somewhere but using a FREEWARE VMS tool IF > did see surprisingly low throughput with larger block sizes.  Didn't- > know it took so long to do an I/O that sized  L It doesn't - at least if you know what you're doing (VMS doesn't do all thatD well by default - the subject of other discussions here).  The chartE reflects the brain-damaged allocation policies of old-style Unix file/K systems (I don't know why their 'raw' and 'block device' access numbers are=H as slow as they are - but they certainly don't reflect what the hardware
 supports).   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 13:29:59 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)! Subject: Re: GS140 write I/O wallw+ Message-ID: <HX$lccxP1EZb@eisner.decus.org>0  R In article <8lpm7l$fc0$1@pyrite.mv.net>, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> writes: > 7 > Rob Young <young_r@eisner.decus.org> wrote in message ' > news:Yq0geS7gThW0@eisner.decus.org...  >  > ...  >  > If single diskss< >> here is a good chart that shows how long a 127 block Read	 >> takes:I >>A >> http://oradoc.photo.net/ora8doc/DOC/server803/A54638_01/io.htma > G > That chart bears little relation to both current disk performance andnJ > non-Unix environments.  In other words, it's useless in this discussion. >  >>? >> So if a 127 or so block takes 35 ms to SEQUENTIAL read (notex= >> very Unix centric nature in doc above but my experience ist8 >> that VMS isn't magic and can't make disks talk faster. >> than what other OSes can :-) and your doingF >> what most of us do is BACKUP/BLOCK_SIZE=65534 or so you can see you5 >> can only get 29 * 127 blocks/sec or 1.8 MByte/sec.I >> (2048 blocks = 1 MByte).o > L > But since the chart doesn't apply, expect to be able to get something likeI > the rated sustainable disk bandwidth from a competent (and uncontended)sG > streaming-conscious application on VMS - i.e., something well over 20kI > MBytes/sec on a recent SCSI or FC disk (IDE has more problems streamingrH > data, though since the actual hardware capabilities have recently beenN > updated - at least by some vendors - those problems may largely disappear as# > soon as new drivers get written).e > / >   Note:  very unscientific, my actual resultseA >> are buried in a pile somewhere but using a FREEWARE VMS tool ItG >> did see surprisingly low throughput with larger block sizes.  Didn'te. >> know it took so long to do an I/O that size > N > It doesn't - at least if you know what you're doing (VMS doesn't do all thatF > well by default - the subject of other discussions here).  The chartG > reflects the brain-damaged allocation policies of old-style Unix file M > systems (I don't know why their 'raw' and 'block device' access numbers areeJ > as slow as they are - but they certainly don't reflect what the hardware > supports). >   9 	"you don't know why raw or block is as slow as they are"b  8 	Well.. when faced with a situation like that, I believe 	we have 2 choices.   A 		1)  They are wrong and a bunch of dolts for spouting nonesense.a 		2)  They are correct.n  E 	I'm being bad and assuming 1).  I have seen similar things elsewhere ' 	but don't feel like dredging for them.b  G 	By counter-example can you show me another OS that does 127 Block I/O  I 	in less than 35 ms?  And also maybe a link to that information?  Thanks.-  > 	The worst part about my results is I was on a standalone testG 	config with no "PC" connection, just dumb terminal so I was scribblingXA 	everything by hand.  That said, I did see a noticeable decrease..= 	I didn't throw that info out but it is buried on the desk or  	in a file folder :-(.  @ 	And yes, disk hardware supports 10-20 MByte/sec ... tell us how 	you get that out of a disk.   				Rob    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 14:07:11 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)! Subject: Re: GS140 write I/O walle+ Message-ID: <KB6A70ZyEJMk@eisner.decus.org>o  X In article <HX$lccxP1EZb@eisner.decus.org>, young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young) writes:   > ; > 	"you don't know why raw or block is as slow as they are"d > : > 	Well.. when faced with a situation like that, I believe > 	we have 2 choices.  > C > 		1)  They are wrong and a bunch of dolts for spouting nonesense.r > 		2)  They are correct.s > G > 	I'm being bad and assuming 1).  I have seen similar things elsewhere,) > 	but don't feel like dredging for them.A > = 	Aagh.. what I get for being in a hurry.  Obviously, meant 2)    				Robs   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:26:05 -0600 (MDT)a) From: John Nebel <nebel@athena.csdco.com> ! Subject: Re: GS140 write I/O wallyF Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.21.0007271121090.4206-100000@athena.csdco.com>   Rob,  C I've been following the write wall thread.  Was the number of hoses D stated anywhere along the way?  If everything were running through a& single hose, I could see such a limit.  + 8400 supports 3 x KFTHAs = 12 hoses, right?d   John      On 27 Jul 2000, Rob Young wrote:  Z > In article <HX$lccxP1EZb@eisner.decus.org>, young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young) writes: >  > > = > > 	"you don't know why raw or block is as slow as they are"n > > < > > 	Well.. when faced with a situation like that, I believe > > 	we have 2 choices.  > > E > > 		1)  They are wrong and a bunch of dolts for spouting nonesense.  > > 		2)  They are correct.d > > I > > 	I'm being bad and assuming 1).  I have seen similar things elsewherea+ > > 	but don't feel like dredging for them.  > > ? > 	Aagh.. what I get for being in a hurry.  Obviously, meant 2)s > 	 > 				Roba >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 08:12:51 -0400a+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>9M Subject: RE: I/O caching and UNIX evaluations (was: Re: got to remember ..	.) J Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845B7@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>   Robert,?  I >>> My read of the document was that you _can't_ use a dumb terminal.  Its said PeeCee _required_.<<<  D Any terminal CAN technically be used for the console of a partition.  0 We are only talking about managing ascii output.  I The assumption is that you want to maintain a log file history (and for abK system this size, Compaq suggests that you do). This includes manageing therG HSJ/G disk controllers log files as well. It might even be used to give-? direct access to any other critical system in your environment.c  K This console management device can be a console mgmt pkg that works on VMS,a UNIX or NT.y  E Keep in mind that a fully loaded GS320 can be setup as 1 partition (17J console) or 8 partitions (8 consoles), so you can see where it might get a- tad complex without a console mgmt platform. h   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant,
 Compaq Canada9 Professional Servicesl Voice : 613-592-4660 FAX   : 819-772-7036 Email : kerry.main@compaq.com        -----Original Message-----B From: rdeininger@MINDSPRING.COM [mailto:rdeininger@MINDSPRING.COM]$ Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2000 9:14 PM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComhG Subject: Re: I/O caching and UNIX evaluations (was: Re: got to remembers ...)    H In article <397DB46E.3E37EC4E@bbc.co.uk>, tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk wrote:   > > In articleA <rdeininger-1507001131360001@user-2ivebf7.dialup.mindspring.com>, 4 rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes: > > >iI > > >When I read that the new GS-series machines REQUIRE a billy-box as akL > > >system console, I almost fell out of my chair.  24x7x365, or until your$ > > >console goes BSOD.  Good Grief! > >r > >f > K > Come on, its a server, use a Vt520 or a graphics head if you must for the  consolel  F My read of the document was that you _can't_ use a dumb terminal.  It  said PeeCee _required_.s  D I hope it was misstated.  On the other hand, I don't have a personalF interest, since I doubt I'll ever be in the same room with such a big, expensive system.    --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comh   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:18:42 -0400p2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)R Subject: Re: I/O caching and UNIX evaluations (was: Re: got to remember ..      .)L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2707001118420001@user-2ivec5u.dialup.mindspring.com>  w In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845B7@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> wrote:4  	 > Robert,n > K > >>> My read of the document was that you _can't_ use a dumb terminal.  Ite > said PeeCee _required_.<<< > F > Any terminal CAN technically be used for the console of a partition.  K Good.  Maybe somebody should go edit that configuration page on the web.  ItI think I posted the URL a couple of iterations ago.  But the cold-molasses'G Digipaq bureaucracy probably needs approval from the Board of Directors - to make a technical correction on a web page.y    2 > We are only talking about managing ascii output. > K > The assumption is that you want to maintain a log file history (and for a-M > system this size, Compaq suggests that you do). This includes manageing theuI > HSJ/G disk controllers log files as well. It might even be used to give A > direct access to any other critical system in your environment.W > M > This console management device can be a console mgmt pkg that works on VMS,R
 > UNIX or NT.  > G > Keep in mind that a fully loaded GS320 can be setup as 1 partition (1 L > console) or 8 partitions (8 consoles), so you can see where it might get a/ > tad complex without a console mgmt platform. a    8 All good.  Maybe you should be writing the web page. :-)  B I hope you understand that I'm NOT shopping for a GS320, so you're* wasting your breath in my particular case.   -- u Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comr   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 08:23:06 -0400 + From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>.2 Subject: RE: Interbase 6.0 released as Open SourceJ Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845B8@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>   Jordan,l  B >>> I wonder how hard it would be to get this going on OpenVMS?>>>  L Fwiw, we have a large Customer currently using Interbase V3.3 in a number ofI large OpenVMS clusters (some greater than 500 concurrent users) with verytI high IO. Users hit the database concurrently from all systems at the samesK time (no "failover" type stuff). They are using OpenVMS V7.2-1 and HSJ50 CI 
 clusters.   H V4 for OpenVMS was also available, but had performance issues, so V4 was never put into production.  H So, unless some major changes were done between V4 and V6, I suspect theG effort to get it running on OpenVMS might (emphasize might) not be that: much.0  * It definately has Rdb roots and history...   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant,
 Compaq Canada@ Professional Servicesn Voice : 613-592-4660 FAX   : 819-772-7036 Email : kerry.main@compaq.comN       -----Original Message-----< From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com [mailto:jordan@lisa.gemair.com]' Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 10:55 AMg To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com . Subject: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source    8 Well, Interbase 6 has been released as Open Source under5 a license very similar to the one in which Mozilla isl released, I understand.,   You can find out about it   -   http://www.borland.com/interbase/index.html    here.t  9 I've downloaded it, and some of you might be glad to hearu5 that it doesn't include the dreaded configure script.i  : I understand that the code is very portable.  I wonder how7 hard it would be to get this going on OpenVMS?  Didn't t5 someone say that this was based on something that was) originally on OpenVMS?   -Jordan Hendersonb jordan@greenapple.comC   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 07:56:41 -0700n7 From: "Arthur E. Ragosta" <ragosta@merlin.arc.nasa.gov>a2 Subject: Re: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source3 Message-ID: <39804DA9.B64F9991@merlin.arc.nasa.gov>Q   "Zane H. Healy" wrote:  2 > Jordan Henderson <jordan@lisa.gemair.com> wrote:> > > I understand that the code is very portable.  I wonder how: > > hard it would be to get this going on OpenVMS?  Didn't9 > > someone say that this was based on something that wask > > originally on OpenVMS? >sH > I've no idea how hard it would be, but I'd sure love to see a databaseL > available for Hobbyist use on OpenVMS!  Is there any (even primitive ones) > currently available? >r >                 Zane  C RIM, which was written by Boeing under contract to NASA, was a fairdK datbase considering it was free.  No SQL server.  I believe Glenn EverhardtoH was the last one I saw to post an update.  Search the old CDs and you'll. probably find it.  RIM was written in FORTRAN.   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 15:47:11 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)2 Subject: RE: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source, Message-ID: <8lplhv$1q8@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  x In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845B8@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes: >oI >So, unless some major changes were done between V4 and V6, I suspect thelH >effort to get it running on OpenVMS might (emphasize might) not be that >much.  E I can't speak for the code itself, but I've just unpacked the source ,E distribution and it is, unfortunately, a huge pile of sh,awk,sed etc eJ scripts prominently featuring a load of "ln -s" commands.  Couldn't locateG anything resembling "Makefile",  but "prefix.*" holds some of the flag TM definitions that would normally be there.  Most of them don't seem to enforce D language standards but the DECOSF one has -std, which is better thanI nothing.  RUN_EDIT seems to be part of the central build script, and it'sy chocked full of stuff like:   d     ls sfx.* | awk '{split( $1, f, "."); print "cat prefix.$(BASE) " $1 " >make." f [2]}' > tmp2.ksh  G There are some VMS ifdef's present in the code - who knows what versioniF they date from.  There's also some modules around like VMSLOCK.C which
 begins with: D   /*(  *      PROGRAM:        JRD Lock Manager!  *      MODULE:         vmslock.cs(  *      DESCRIPTION:    VMS Lock Manager  *  L There are a couple of .com files in there, but they are for a VAX and don't J have any internal dates.  (There are very few dates present in any of the  code files.)  K Looks like yet another "build it on Unix, analyze the log, translate" sort e= of project.  (And do it all over again for the next release.)t  . Let's take a quick look at some of the code...  ? They also don't use (void) in front of functions like printf().n* They do use relative include statements.     Draw your own conclusions.   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edud? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech 1   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 12:21:48 -0400/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)B2 Subject: Re: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source* Message-ID: <8lpnis$a4q$1@lisa.gemair.com>  3 In article <39804DA9.B64F9991@merlin.arc.nasa.gov>,w6 Arthur E. Ragosta <ragosta@merlin.arc.nasa.gov> wrote: >"Zane H. Healy" wrote:k > 3 >> Jordan Henderson <jordan@lisa.gemair.com> wrote:k? >> > I understand that the code is very portable.  I wonder howr; >> > hard it would be to get this going on OpenVMS?  Didn'to: >> > someone say that this was based on something that was >> > originally on OpenVMS?  >>I >> I've no idea how hard it would be, but I'd sure love to see a databasedM >> available for Hobbyist use on OpenVMS!  Is there any (even primitive ones)S >> currently available?k >> >>                 Zanew  A I'd sure love to see Hobbyists using something like this too.  InPA the Linux world, Hobbyists are called developers and they do somel great stuff.   >tD >RIM, which was written by Boeing under contract to NASA, was a fairL >datbase considering it was free.  No SQL server.  I believe Glenn EverhardtI >was the last one I saw to post an update.  Search the old CDs and you'llV/ >probably find it.  RIM was written in FORTRAN.  >e >t  = Ah, another fine pointer.  I like to think that with some of s= the great free software around these days, one could put somee* powerful applications together on OpenVMS.  < It could open some eyes, but it's hard to put something like; that together today without an Oracle or Oracle/Rdb licensed: today.  Most of the systems I've seen with Oracle licenses: on OpenVMS are already fully devoted to some critical app.  < I like to think that OpenVMS could take advantage of all the< high quality Open Source software out there to leverage it's- other advantages back into a prominent place.d  9 I'll tell you one thing.  Compaq will not be persuaded toc< create the "affordable" OpenVMS so many of you out there are8 clamoring for as long as it looks to them like the only 6 effect this would have is to drastically reduce their ; license revenues.  I think Compaq rightly sees that OpenVMS-; would attract few new customers without applications.  Openi8 Source applications would be one kind of use for OpenVMS systems.  = Existing OpenVMS customers who want to extend the usefullness0= of their workhorse platform could take things like OpenOffice ? (aka StarOffice), Interbase, Apache/OSU/WASD Web Servers, Perl,s< and Python and field great server-based applications without< large capital investment up-front.  These applications could> be designed to take advantage of all the advantages of OpenVMS clustering.4  @ Think about it.  Wouldn't it be great to have StarOffice running< on a backend server that could guarantee nearly 100% uptime?  > Compaq is showing a willingness to support OpenVMS as a stable: platform which has all the tools necessary to build great ; systems and applications.  The trade press and the AnalystsM; are telling Compaq to get out of this OpenVMS business now,o< before it's too late.  Compaq is not in a position to flaunt< the analysts.  If they did, the stock price would suffer and> Compaq management's #1 responsibility is to the stock holders.  @ If OpenVMS is to thrive, it's up to the users to prove that it's$ viable in today's growing markets.    5 Here's a short list of things I can think of to help:   2 	Build, test and help with VMS Perl.  Subscribe to2 	the VMSPerl mailing list, if you are so inclined:  3 		The subscription address is MAJORDOMO@PERL.ORG.  h4 		Send a mail message with just the words SUBSCRIBE % 		VMSPERL in the body of the message.o  , 	If Perl's not your thing, check out Python:    		http://decus.decus.de/~zessin/  5 	If you feel that scripting is a distraction and thata6 	real programmers use the debugger ;-), then port some6 	of the many, many CGI packages for C, C++ to OpenVMS.6 	Use these packages from Fortran, BLISS or Ada, if you7 	like.  Prove that Unix/C isn't the only way to get the # 	job done, if that's what you feel.      8 	Build, use and test the latest OSU Web Server releases.0 	Dave Jones does a great job of updating the OSU0 	Web Server often, but I think he sometimes gets1 	the impression that nobody is trying out his news/ 	releases.  Information on the OSU Web Server, c/ 	including new beta releases can be found here:r  5 		http://er6s1.eng.ohio-state.edu/doc/serverinfo.htmla  7 	Build, use and test the WASD Web Server, and be amazeda 	at it's fine documentation:   		http://wasd.vsm.com.au/a  8 	Port useful Open Source software to OpenVMS.  If you're3 	ambitious, modify it to take advantage of OpenVMS  0 	clustering, mailboxes, ASTs and async I/O, etc.1 	Don't be content to let the ports be compared too5 	the native environment where it might be designed tos 	run better.  6 	Start an OpenVMS advocacy page and get on the OpenVMS9 	Web Ring (http://www.tetranet.net/taylor/tms/ovmsring/).t  7 	Militate in a hypocritical manner in comp.os.vms aboutw5 	things that should be done when you don't do half ofs4 	them yourself... Ooops, no better leave that one to 	me :-).   Whew!  What a rant...    -Jordan Henderson- jordan@greenapple.comr   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 13:14:56 -0400/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)-2 Subject: Re: Interbase 6.0 released as Open Source* Message-ID: <8lpqmg$bro$1@lisa.gemair.com>  , In article <8lplhv$1q8@gap.cco.caltech.edu>,3 David Mathog <mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu> wrote:ey >In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845B8@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes:e >>J >>So, unless some major changes were done between V4 and V6, I suspect theI >>effort to get it running on OpenVMS might (emphasize might) not be thatn >>much.  >	F >I can't speak for the code itself, but I've just unpacked the source F >distribution and it is, unfortunately, a huge pile of sh,awk,sed etc K >scripts prominently featuring a load of "ln -s" commands.  Couldn't locateoH >anything resembling "Makefile",  but "prefix.*" holds some of the flag N >definitions that would normally be there.  Most of them don't seem to enforceE >language standards but the DECOSF one has -std, which is better than.J >nothing.  RUN_EDIT seems to be part of the central build script, and it's >chocked full of stuff like:   >ne >    ls sfx.* | awk '{split( $1, f, "."); print "cat prefix.$(BASE) " $1 " >make." f [2]}' > tmp2.ksht >   I I didn't look at it in as much depth as you seem to have, but I do recall . seeing files named makefile.wnt, makefile.os2.  F I would be surprised if it's that Unix dependent.  I assumed that thisA distribution had everything you needed to build it on Windows NT.f  H >There are some VMS ifdef's present in the code - who knows what versionG >they date from.  There's also some modules around like VMSLOCK.C which  >begins with:  >r >/*d) > *      PROGRAM:        JRD Lock Manager " > *      MODULE:         vmslock.c) > *      DESCRIPTION:    VMS Lock Managerh > *  > M >There are a couple of .com files in there, but they are for a VAX and don't oK >have any internal dates.  (There are very few dates present in any of the 5
 >code files.)  >iL >Looks like yet another "build it on Unix, analyze the log, translate" sort > >of project.  (And do it all over again for the next release.) >9/ >Let's take a quick look at some of the code...o >t@ >They also don't use (void) in front of functions like printf().+ >They do use relative include statements.    >  >Draw your own conclusions.s >f  G I try to write code with (void) in front of printf(), it's a very good oA idea.  Almost no code that I've seen that's of any vintage at allsE does this, so I don't know that you can fault them too much for this.i  G We had a discussion of relative paths in include statements awhile backeF here.  While I don't like relative paths in source include statements,F I don't think it's that bad really.  What's the downside?  You have to9 maintain a development tree intact?  Not such a big deal.   	 >Regards,G >0
 >David Mathogs >mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu@ >Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech    -Jordan Hendersons jordan@greenapple.com    ------------------------------  / Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 08:30:44 +0200 (MET DST)o& From: Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de>+ Subject: Re: Killing a process in VMS 7.1-2O6 Message-ID: <200007270627.IAA16864@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>   Hello,  G I have seen this problem many time, when the process looses the assign-MF ment of tape device. The process is normaly not killable. But there isI a Macrocode out, which reset the RESOURCEWAIT bit. After this you normalywG can stop the process. I think Stephan Hoffmann knows, where you can gete this Macroprogram.   Regards Rudolf Wingert   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 11:53:26 GMTF From: lederman@star.enet.dec.DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL.com (Bart Z. Lederman)! Subject: Re: Memory & CPU Supporta* Message-ID: <8lp7rm$v3s@usenet.pa.dec.com>   In article <rdeininger-2707000033510001@user-2ive63s.dialup.mindspring.com>, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:r > J >Isn't there currently a restriction that you have to have at least 2 hardF >partitions, i.e. no more than 16 CPUs in a partition?  I read this inG >one of the GS320 blurbs.  I think the restriction is due to be removeds >"real soon now".v >y  < Yes, there is a restriction on the maximum number of CPUs in> a partition (at least, there is a maximum number which OpenVMS= will support when you boot it).  OpenVMS Engineering is awareu< that there are customers who are looking to put more CPUs to: work in a given instance.  You will have to watch the news: or look at the OpenVMS Home Page occasionally for official9 announcements.  I don't think anyone from Compaq is goingn3 to make an official committment to a schedule here.n  8 Actually coming up with an application that will keep 32> processors busy at the same time is another matter altogether.> I would be very interested to hear from anyone who thinks they= have such an application.  We have seen applications that usee; up to 14 processors on existing platforms, but I'm not suren they'd scale to 32.m   -- '(  B. Z. Lederman   Personal Opinions Only  8  Posting to a News group does NOT give anyone permission8  to send me advertising by E-mail or put me on a mailing  list of any kind.  5  Please remove the "DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL" if you have ai5  legitimate reason to E-mail a response to this post.e   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 09:31:23 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)e! Subject: Re: Memory & CPU Supportt+ Message-ID: <RPCWWBgzZDAG@eisner.decus.org>m  s In article <8lp7rm$v3s@usenet.pa.dec.com>, lederman@star.enet.dec.DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL.com (Bart Z. Lederman) writes:G  : > Actually coming up with an application that will keep 32@ > processors busy at the same time is another matter altogether.@ > I would be very interested to hear from anyone who thinks they? > have such an application.  We have seen applications that usem= > up to 14 processors on existing platforms, but I'm not sure  > they'd scale to 32.u  > Of course the real question is whether they would scale to 17.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 06:38:11 -0400y- From: "Island Computers" <sales@islandco.com>a) Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99 / Message-ID: <so040drr3j1164@corp.supernews.com>.   Wayneo  $ Please see US Constitution Article 1   Thankyou  J "Wayne Sewell" <wayne@tachysoft.xxx.293778.killspam.0223> wrote in message( news:fq5e9yXwi8lC@tachxxsoftxxconsult...; > In article <sntok0ta3j111@corp.supernews.com>, "Islandco"h <sales@islandco.com> writes: > > Yep  > >r > > We're doing it again > >s >sI > Yes, if you mean posting advertisements to a technical newsgroup, againC andl7 > again and again and again and again and again and ...r >m > -- >eL ============================================================================ === : > Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738 wayne@tachysoft.xxxa: > http://www.tachysoft.xxx/www/tachyon.html and wayne.htmlH > change .xxx to .com in addresses above, assuming you are not a spambot :-)@ >rL ============================================================================ ===nL > Otter, on dining with Bluto:"It's perfectly safe if you keep your arms and legs > away from his mouth."    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 09:02:31 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)n) Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99u+ Message-ID: <UWSY1jufkNNP@eisner.decus.org>i  n In article <fq5e9yXwi8lC@tachxxsoftxxconsult>, wayne@tachysoft.xxx.293778.killspam.0223 (Wayne Sewell) writes:X > In article <sntok0ta3j111@corp.supernews.com>, "Islandco" <sales@islandco.com> writes: >> Yep >>   >> We're doing it againi >>   > N > Yes, if you mean posting advertisements to a technical newsgroup, again and 7 > again and again and again and again and again and ...   ? I guess you missed it Wayne, but Mr. Spam already says he posts > unrealistic starting prices on eBay because it is only $2 "the= cheapest advertising".  I guess he means "cheapest except for. spamming comp.os.vms".   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:52:52 -0400g% From: "Islandco" <sales@islandco.com>a) Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99n/ Message-ID: <so0f2pgo3j1142@corp.supernews.com>    Shouldn't it be Mr.Spam (tm) ?  4 Hormel must be pretty irrate about this name calling% Wander if it's hurt their sales any ?    ;0)t          D Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote in message% news:UWSY1jufkNNP@eisner.decus.org...r0 > In article <fq5e9yXwi8lC@tachxxsoftxxconsult>,? wayne@tachysoft.xxx.293778.killspam.0223 (Wayne Sewell) writes: = > > In article <sntok0ta3j111@corp.supernews.com>, "Islandco"n <sales@islandco.com> writes: > >> Yep > >> > >> We're doing it agains > >> > >SK > > Yes, if you mean posting advertisements to a technical newsgroup, againa andS9 > > again and again and again and again and again and ...i >nA > I guess you missed it Wayne, but Mr. Spam already says he posts @ > unrealistic starting prices on eBay because it is only $2 "the? > cheapest advertising".  I guess he means "cheapest except for8 > spamming comp.os.vms".   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:20:21 GMTd= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-),) Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99n0 Message-ID: <009EDB3C.BB9066D8@SendSpamHere.ORG>  _ In article <so040drr3j1164@corp.supernews.com>, "Island Computers" <sales@islandco.com> writes:t >Wayne >u% >Please see US Constitution Article 1i  F Article 1 of the US Constitution deals with the creation of and powersC of the legislative branch of the government.  How is this relevant?m  H I believe you meant to refer to the first Amendment of the Constitution,H the first ten known as the Bill of Rights.  Again, how is this relevant?H This amendment limits the congress (government) from infringing upon theH rights of free speech.  It does not limit Wayne from exercising his dis-H dain for your advertisements nor does it limit or restrict you from your practice of posting them.     6 If you do not know your rights, then you haven't any!   H That said, this newsgroup is not a billboard for advertising!  From timeI to time an occasional ad/announcement will be seen and tolerated, but the I perpetual day in and day out SPAMming billboard ads are unwarranted, and :@ unwelcomed by most of the readers and lurkers of this newsgroup.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMa   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 17:02:10 +0000 (   )n3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>() Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20  $99sJ Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10007271656340.31110-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>  $ On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Islandco wrote:    > Shouldn't it be Mr.Spam (tm) ? > 6 > Hormel must be pretty irrate about this name calling' > Wander if it's hurt their sales any ?d   See http://www.cspam.com/s  . Specifically the "Gift Shop" link, which says:  " Spam yourself or someone you love.  C-SPAM will artfullyr  place a mailing  address and correct  postage on an actualt  can of Spam. You   can be SPAM-ede  directly or request the  SPAM kit (a boxed  can of SPAM withB  blank mailing label  and First Class  postage). Yes, your  can do this at home,:  but why not support  C-SPAM?  Direct SPAM $15.00j  Do-it-yourself Kit>  $17.76   (special!) SPAM  Sanford Wallace  $10.00      Regards,   Chris>  O ===============================================================================s@ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmere Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.b% -------------------------------------eI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and H weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 lO -------------------------------------------------------------------------------a   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:01:28 GMTe% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>o( Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99) Message-ID: <8lp4q8$9mf$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   . In article <fq5e9yXwi8lC@tachxxsoftxxconsult>,@   wayne@tachysoft.xxx.293778.killspam.0223 (Wayne Sewell) wrote:; > In article <sntok0ta3j111@corp.supernews.com>, "Islandco"e <sales@islandco.com> writes: > > Yepe > >b > > We're doing it again > >i > C > Yes, if you mean posting advertisements to a technical newsgroup, 	 again and 7 > again and again and again and again and again and ...r  E I know there are differing views here but we bought four Multias fromcG Island for home hobby VMS use at little more than shipping cost and I'drG have never known about this particular source other than via occasionall postings here. --
 Alan Greig    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.n   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 15:00:21 +0200o= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>i( Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99) Message-ID: <39803264.A7904C0A@gtech.com>t   Alan Greig wrote:tG > I know there are differing views here but we bought four Multias fromyI > Island for home hobby VMS use at little more than shipping cost and I'dfI > have never known about this particular source other than via occasionalc > postings here.  F I have bougth from islandco at two occasions. A disk and a tape-drive.D They do know what VMS is. Items were in perfect order. Fast shippingC through Fedex. Good price. No problems. I would definatetly want toO/ buy from them again, if I need something cheap.   @ They do post offers to comp.os.vms/INFO-VAX sometimes. But it isB not that often. And the offers are usually relevant and of generalD interest for the readers. Of everything posted here I would put them in the more interesting half.n   Arne   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 15:28:43 +0000 (GMT) , From: Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com>( Subject: RE: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $995 Message-ID: <F156yiZEQE95pfy6Rkx0000bba0@hotmail.com>a  K Hello all. I have a suggestion. First though, let me say that I doubt that SL anyone here hates spam more than I do. With that said, I am kind of neutral K on the Island Computer ads. While I generally hate ads of any kind, I have BI to admit that most of what they've adverstised I have been interested in.,  K Here's my suggestion for Island Computer-- why not create a list just like hJ comp.os.vms where those who are interested can subscribe. I for one don't E worry at all about sending my real personal or work email address to 	M companies who don't sell it to others. I very rarely get any type of spam at aJ my main personal address and I am subscribed to several commercial lists: # ammonman.com, x10.com, oracle, etc.p   Just my .02.  G So far, I don't have any problem with the Island messages, but I would sL definitely hate to have comp.os.vms filled up with every VAX/Alpha dealer's  ads.   Bill McLaughlins   >  >-----Original Message-----oE >From: Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- [mailto:system@SendSpamHere.ORG]k& >Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 8:20 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com) >Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99S >e >cC >In article <so040drr3j1164@corp.supernews.com>, "Island Computers"e ><sales@islandco.com> writes:o > >Wayne > >d' > >Please see US Constitution Article 1e >aG >Article 1 of the US Constitution deals with the creation of and powers D >of the legislative branch of the government.  How is this relevant? > I >I believe you meant to refer to the first Amendment of the Constitution, I >the first ten known as the Bill of Rights.  Again, how is this relevant?oI >This amendment limits the congress (government) from infringing upon theoI >rights of free speech.  It does not limit Wayne from exercising his dis-/I >dain for your advertisements nor does it limit or restrict you from yourw >practice of posting them. >h6 >If you do not know your rights, then you haven't any! >rI >That said, this newsgroup is not a billboard for advertising!  From time-J >to time an occasional ad/announcement will be seen and tolerated, but theI >perpetual day in and day out SPAMming billboard ads are unwarranted, andcA >unwelcomed by most of the readers and lurkers of this newsgroup.r >@ >--g3 >VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001e >VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMs >x >i  H ________________________________________________________________________H Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 16:56:17 +0000 (   )f3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>g( Subject: Re: Microvax 3100-10 and 20 $99J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10007271651420.31110-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>  6 On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Arne [iso-8859-1] Vajh=F8j wrote:  H > I have bougth from islandco at two occasions. A disk and a tape-drive.F > They do know what VMS is. Items were in perfect order. Fast shippingE > through Fedex. Good price. No problems. I would definatetly want to 1 > buy from them again, if I need something cheap.h  D I have to agree here -- Island has never given anyone I know of much problem.  B > They do post offers to comp.os.vms/INFO-VAX sometimes. But it isD > not that often. And the offers are usually relevant and of generalF > interest for the readers. Of everything posted here I would put them > in the more interesting half.   G I also find myself agreeing here.  They've been very good about keeping D the volume of their (ad) posts down recently, especially -- and DaveI Turner is kind of a regular here anyway, and has posted some very topical  stuff on some threads.   Regards,   Chris   L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3DF "My two cents"=09=09=09(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)C Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)=09=09=09Prgramer^W Programmer  Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.e% -------------------------------------eI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes andtH weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes= and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949=20TL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 18:35:28 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>o: Subject: Re: Mlucas performance probelm - need expert helpH Message-ID: <y4k8e7sf8v.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  M A matching colour is one which has the same bits in both virtual and physical, address were it matters...  G So, a page is 8KB, that's 13 bits of address, IIANM. Let's say you havenL a 2 MB external cache, and it's direct-mapped, then you would have 2MB/8KB =3 256 colours. Insert fitting numbers as appropriate.y   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 12:54:11 GMT6 From: DAVISM@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (Michael T. Davis)" Subject: MS IntelliMouse on Alpha?: Message-ID: <8lpbdj$6ge$2@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  D 	Can the IntelliMouse (2-button with scroll wheel/button) be used onM an Alpha workstation?  Presumably, the wheel functionality would be lost, but M could the wheel "button" still be used?  If so, how do the two standard mousesJ buttons and the wheel button on the IntelliMouse map to the standard threeH buttons on the typical Alpha mouse?  Alternately, could a standard AlphaL workstation mouse be used on a PC (under WinNT 4.0, for example), and if so,& would all three buttons be functional?   Thanks,n  Miken --K              Michael T. Davis              |    Systems Specialist: ChE,MSErN   E-mail: davism@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu    | Departmental Networking/ComputingJ            -or- DAVISM+@osu.edu            |     The Ohio State UniversityJ http://www.er6.eng.ohio-state.edu/~davism/ |     197 Watts, (614) 292-6928   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 16:20:46 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)& Subject: Re: MS IntelliMouse on Alpha?6 Message-ID: <8lpngu$fic$2@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  s In article <8lpbdj$6ge$2@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, DAVISM@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (Michael T. Davis) writes:pE :	Can the IntelliMouse (2-button with scroll wheel/button) be used oncN :an Alpha workstation?  Presumably, the wheel functionality would be lost, butN :could the wheel "button" still be used?  If so, how do the two standard mouseK :buttons and the wheel button on the IntelliMouse map to the standard threeoI :buttons on the typical Alpha mouse?  Alternately, could a standard AlphaiM :workstation mouse be used on a PC (under WinNT 4.0, for example), and if so,t' :would all three buttons be functional?e  L   AlphaStation systems use the three-button variant of the defacto/standard    PC rodent.  I   I know of no support for IntelliMouse in the X Windows mouse interface.t  J   Having seen a Microsoft IntelliMouse cause a standard PC to display someL   seriously bizzare behaviour (no matter which drivers were used), I'd tend J   to be somewhat hesitatant to use the widget on an OpenVMS system.  (But M   as it likely won't damage the hardware involved, you can certainly try it.)   J   As for what Windows NT might do with a three-button rodent, I'd suggest L   asking that Windows NT questions in a Windows NT newsgroup.  (I do happen L   to have a three button mouse connected to a local NT4 box, but the middle L   button is currently only a "spare" -- its use likely involves finding someK   sort of custom NT mouse driver for it, a discussion which is WOT (Way Off2   Topic) for comp.os.vms.)  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 10:27:47 GMT 7 From: Johnny Billquist <Johnny.Billquist@netinsight.se>s1 Subject: Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.com-- Message-ID: <39800EA2.8D0C8DFC@netinsight.se>1   Jan Vorbrueggen wrote: > ; > Johnny Billquist <Johnny.Billquist@netinsight.se> writes:  > E > > > > The fact that VMS is making money don't neccesarily mean thataH > > > > someone would want to keep it alive. They might see larger gainsM > > > > from being able to migrate all those VMS sites to their own solution.xI > > > Do you think the customers have no say in whether, when and what tos > > > they will "be migrated"!?eI > > Unfortunately, history seems to imply that they don't. Atleast no thev0 > > "when". Just ask the (ex) TOPS-20 customers. > J > Quite. But your premise was "...see larger gains...to migrate...to...ownF > solution". _That_, history shows, is an endeavour doomed to failure.  H Yes, but the only thing we can learn from history is that we don't learn
 from history.t (Unfortunately)t   	Johnnyc   -- m? Johnny Billquist             |  johnny.billquist@netinsight.neti7 Net Insight AB               |  phone:  +46 8 685 04 88=7 Vstberga All 9             |  fax:    +46 8 685 04 20= Box 42093                    |9 SE-126 30 STOCKHOLM, Sweden  |  http://www.netinsight.netw   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:09:53 -0400 (EDT): From: KAPLANSKYM@NCCCOT.AGR.CA1 Subject: Re: New SKC Postings on www.acersoft.comM, Message-ID: <01JS9GZII3LE001LSO@VMGW.AGR.CA>   Kerry.Main@COMPAQ.COM posts:  K > If interested, you can sign up for free monthly copy of Inform (and otherp > OpenVMS info) at:)/ > http://www.compaq.com/inFORM/issues/q-31.htmle > 	 > Regardsd >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant, > Compaq Canadad > Professional Services  > Voice : 613-592-4660 > FAX   : 819-772-7036 > Email : kerry.main@compaq.com  >   @ And what is interesting is that Kerry Main, posting from Compaq O Canada, supplies a reference that is good "In the United States Only".  Thanks.n     Marvin Kaplansky Agriculture Canada   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 15:20:20 +0200s1 From: "Charles Gilley" <charles.gilley@barco.com>2- Subject: Re: Nine(9) VAXstation 3100s on eBayaI Message-ID: <E472188161D5D311B08700105AF4CAAA01A3A5BE@kuumex03.barco.com>   I Hmmm, that is an amazing list.  Mind you, some of them might not run, butm still.  The model 90 forG 200 bucks (I hope the one bidder is not reading this) has my attention.  Will the latest version ofL openVMS run on this, let's see, I think we called it the Cougar, yes?  There is a model 60 in there forH 39.99.  I can fondly recall my old DEC manager fussing about the cost of these units.....    @ David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message' news:397E4F58.BED7975D@earthlink.net... > > There are at least nine(9) VAXstation 3100s on eBay tonight. >p3 > The seller does not appear to know what they are.a >n > -- > David J. Dachtera  > dba DJE Systems  > http://www.djesys.com/ > < > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 16:05:57 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: OpenVMS Galaxy-6 Message-ID: <8lpml5$fic$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  H In article <8lna0n$v1p$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, bob.edis@creatcomp.com writes:G :Can someone give me a quick overview of what OpenVMS Galaxy is please?a  F   OpenVMS Galaxy provides for system configuration and access control,F   for access to multiple operating system and/or application versions D   in one box (permitting rolling upgrades, too), and it can provide E   better system utilization in cases where SMP scaling is not linear.m  G   As was referenced elsewhere, take a look at the OpenVMS Galaxy Guide.,  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 10:16:46 GMTy% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> . Subject: Patwhorks Performance and TCP NODELAY) Message-ID: <8lp26c$7uf$1@nnrp1.deja.com>n  @ There have been several threads here regarding the abysmal write< performance of Pathworks Advanced Server on a high speed LAN7 and I found this to be the case on installing recently.n  0 After an emailed suggestion by Kerry Main to try TCPIP>SET PROTOCOL TCP/NODELAY  A the peformance improved *tenfold* and actually beat the NT servereF I was comparing it to (additionally I set the Pathworks cache to 64MB)  G Question: Should this actually be the default setting used by Pathworks C when opening TCP/IP connections? If not why not? Also what negative < effects might I risk by setting this on a system wide basis?  B Anyone else want to try this and see if you also see an incredible performance leap?    --
 Alan Greig    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.g   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 03:48:21 -0700 ? From: Mike Price <mike.priceNOmiSPAM@littlewoods.co.uk.invalid>r2 Subject: Re: Patwhorks Performance and TCP NODELAY9 Message-ID: <012dd410.4f4ce2ea@usw-ex0106-046.remarq.com>n  ' Thanks this could be very useful to us.   ; We have used this parameter before for applications we havem: written that send a lot of small(ish) message over TCP/IP.@ Originally the terminal response was bitty and slow but after we: put the NODELAYACK paramter on the response speeded up and@ became smoother. Aparently it also increased the network loading; a bit as the number of ACKs send by TCP protocol increases,=A possibly significantly. However, this didn't cause us a problem -)<  just a warning for anyone who wants to try this over a slow network!> As a slight aside - if anyone is writing their own application; and wants to use this then the QIO can be coded to use thisv> without changing the whole TCP on the system. However, this is: no use if you are using Pathworks unless you have the code	 handy :->i  
 Mike Price mike.price@littlewoods.co.uk      ; ------------------------------------------------------------  7 Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.e Up to 100 minutes free!g http://www.keen.comc   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:21:00 GMTc% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>s2 Subject: Re: Patwhorks Performance and TCP NODELAY) Message-ID: <8lpcvm$fj5$1@nnrp1.deja.com><  9 In article <012dd410.4f4ce2ea@usw-ex0106-046.remarq.com>,cB   Mike Price <mike.priceNOmiSPAM@littlewoods.co.uk.invalid> wrote:) > Thanks this could be very useful to us.o >t= > We have used this parameter before for applications we haven< > written that send a lot of small(ish) message over TCP/IP.B > Originally the terminal response was bitty and slow but after we< > put the NODELAYACK paramter on the response speeded up andB > became smoother. Aparently it also increased the network loading= > a bit as the number of ACKs send by TCP protocol increases,/C > possibly significantly. However, this didn't cause us a problem - > >  just a warning for anyone who wants to try this over a slow
 > network!@ > As a slight aside - if anyone is writing their own application= > and wants to use this then the QIO can be coded to use thisw@ > without changing the whole TCP on the system. However, this is< > no use if you are using Pathworks unless you have the code > handy :->  >a  E Yep, I've just checked the SAMBA source code and the default settting D (set in vms2.h) is to set NODELAY. There's also a comment in local.h@ which says "Dave Miller thinks we should default to TCP_NODELAY"  / Anyone know who Dave Miller is out of interest?N  B Guess I'm going to have to dig out the appropriate RFC and look atH the exact definitions of NODELAY and NODELAYACK as it is not immediatelyB clear to me why this should make a 10:1 difference in performance.E Surely the protocol window size should keep data flowing unless *all*o< of the window had not been acknowledged? But the performance? improvement I am seeing seems to suggest that when writing to a C Pathworks service every single packet (1.5k) requires an ack beforecE the next one is sent resulting in a tremendous bottleneck. If this isaD the case then I can't see how turning *off* delayed ack can increaseC the number of acks. But then I don't fully understand from the HELPs info. Off to the RFCs...  1 All this with TCPIP 5.0A by the way and VMS 7.2-1a  ? It also occurs to me that is shouldn't be too hard to patch thetA Pathworks server to set no delayed ack as I think it's just a one A bit change. Over to the adventurous on that one! Anyone from VMS,s5 Pathworks or TCPIP engineering following this thread?o   --
 Alan Greig    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:00:06 -0400i2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com>8 Subject: problem starting decmotif and monitor problems.6 Message-ID: <200007270900_MC2-ADA7-3B7@compuserve.com>  D         The error message suggests that you are using a defective or unsupported keyboard!A      Message text written by Gigglegs >Hi All,J I am currently using an alphastation 200 4/233 64MB 4G(running openvms 7.= 2)H with a compaq 151FS model IBM compatible monitor. From time to time I am getting this error on monitor:  - ERROR: scancode Oxfa not supported on pcxal =s    J and the color of the screen changes and system stops responding and I end=   upG booting the system..  Am I using the right kind of monitor or what kind1 should I be using?o  H I also installed the Decmotif according to the user manual and I ran theJ SYS$TEST:DECW$IVP.COM several times and only one of the times it was able=   toJ find the default display name where all 4 tests completed successfully.  = IA amJ using my computer as a standalone (nonworkstation).  I issue the followin= g =n   command and I get this:    $ @SYS$MANAGER:DECW$STARTUPm>  %RUN-S-PROC_ID, identification of created process is 00000091 $o <o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 02:02:20 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)1 Subject: Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"oL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2707000202200001@user-2ive63s.dialup.mindspring.com>  M In article <PQ1UOlcXHT5B@flying>, abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie) wrote:e     > # >          http://www.VMSblower.come    ; I think it will take one of those to cool an alpha 21364...V   -- c Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comE   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:09:27 +0200_$ From: Paul Sture <sture.ch@sture.ch>1 Subject: Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"l+ Message-ID: <VA.00000088.14706d8a@sture.ch>e  5 In article <PQ1UOlcXHT5B@flying>, Alan Frisbie wrote:e, > From: abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie) > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms0/ > Subject: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX"1  > Date: 26 Jul 2000 21:11:42 PDT > A > I am sure you remember the fine British product, the VAX vacuumt> > cleaner, and the phrase "Nothing sucks like a VAX".   Now we > have (drum roll, please):  > # >          http://www.VMSblower.comh > J > I would make further comment, but my wife says to "keep it clean".   :-) >  Truly stunning!   G (My first home VAX was the variety which sucked. Still works today, as  ! opposed to the Digital brand one)    ___f
 Paul Sture SwitzerlandA   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 10:31:25 GMTv% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>r1 Subject: Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX" ) Message-ID: <8lp31u$8j8$1@nnrp1.deja.com>f  ! In article <PQ1UOlcXHT5B@flying>,e-   abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie) wrote: A > I am sure you remember the fine British product, the VAX vacuum > > cleaner, and the phrase "Nothing sucks like a VAX".   Now we > have (drum roll, please):    From the website:=  + S T E P P E D   T H R O U G H - S H A F T S=  > VMS Blowers feature through-shafts with stepped shoulders thatC accurately locate the rotors, spacers and seals, preventing lateral3E movement and resulting on greater reliability and smoother operation.=   Sounds fun to me :)c --
 Alan Greig    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.r   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 16:49:43 +0000 (   )-3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>i1 Subject: Re: Shades of "Nothing sucks like a VAX" J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10007271648230.31110-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>  & On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Alan Greig wrote:  / >   abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie) wrote:-C > > I am sure you remember the fine British product, the VAX vacuum @ > > cleaner, and the phrase "Nothing sucks like a VAX".   Now we > > have (drum roll, please):b  " I like the animated VMS graphic ;)  I I also wonder whether the people who run the company are aware of VMS then operating system...h   Regards,   Chrisc  O =============================================================================== @ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmerp Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.=% -------------------------------------sI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and0H weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 hO -------------------------------------------------------------------------------e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:11:56 +0000a$ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk* Subject: RE: Stirrings in the undergrowth?/ Message-ID: <00256929.004E1CC1.00@quegw01.btyp>t  = Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plazat  P I wonder the same thing - I have been unable to find  a link to the competition.. All I have found is the winners and the rules.  A Still, should I expect anything more? Perhaps the competition is;   1 If you find the competition page, you win a DS10!    Steve Spires VMS System Manager BT/Yellow Pagest        1 system@SendSpamHere.ORG on 25/07/2000 07:37:00 PM-    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)g; From:      system@SendSpamHere.ORG, 25 July 2000, 7:37 p.m.-  ! RE: Stirrings in the undergrowth?         J In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845A4@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>,- "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes:8 >Shane,$ >aL >Not sure how many folks got hardcopies of the recent Compaq magazine calledJ >Inform, but the last page was a full page ad from Cognos on its web based
 >products. >eJ >Focus of the full page ad was OpenVMS, but they do mention that they also >support Tru64 UNIX and NT.l > : >The big url on the bottom for additional information was:  >http://www.cognos.com/seeoffer/ >e  >Soft copy version is online at: >http://www.compaq.com/inFORM/ >rK >By the way, not sure if anyone has seen the latest "ePostcard" for OpenVMS  >... check it out at:u >b- ><http://www.openvms.compaq.com/e-postcard3/>a  J This link led me to a large .GIF with a "supposedly animated" tour link. AH click of that link popped up a window about "AlphaServer Contest: win an AlphaServer DS10".  J What a fucked up web site!  The "back to the contest" link shows me a listK of winners (BTW, congrats to Mr. Malmberg!).  So where is this 10 questionsaI contest form?  For Christ sake, why doesn't Comapq make its freaking sitetK work for/with Netscape on VMS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!m   Where can I enter this contest?c   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:31:46 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)* Subject: Re: Stirrings in the undergrowth?L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2707001131460001@user-2ivec5u.dialup.mindspring.com>  U In article <00256929.004E1CC1.00@quegw01.btyp>, Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk wrote:.  ? > Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza- > R > I wonder the same thing - I have been unable to find  a link to the competition.0 > All I have found is the winners and the rules. > C > Still, should I expect anything more? Perhaps the competition is;q > 3 > If you find the competition page, you win a DS10!w  M I wonder if this is the same contest that ran a few months ago.  The web page I was broken then, and it seemed impossible to actually enter.  This sounds j old.  The board of directors hasn't given them permission to delete the web page yet, so it's still there.  H The webmasters are off being trained in the use of garish colors and newH de-humidifier plug-ins.  They'll only be happy when every page contains B enough non-html that no platform on earth can display it properly.  H (Yes, I'm being sarcastic.  But it's not nice to lure folks with phantom  DS10s, so SOMEBODY deserves it.)   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comm   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 16:17:52 GMT,= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)t* Subject: Re: Stirrings in the undergrowth?0 Message-ID: <009EDB4D.26C5057B@SendSpamHere.ORG>   In article <rdeininger-2707001131460001@user-2ivec5u.dialup.mindspring.com>, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes: V >In article <00256929.004E1CC1.00@quegw01.btyp>, Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk wrote: > @ >> Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza >>  S >> I wonder the same thing - I have been unable to find  a link to the competition.m1 >> All I have found is the winners and the rules.s >>  D >> Still, should I expect anything more? Perhaps the competition is; >> .4 >> If you find the competition page, you win a DS10! >pN >I wonder if this is the same contest that ran a few months ago.  The web pageJ >was broken then, and it seemed impossible to actually enter.  This soundsk >old.  The board of directors hasn't given them permission to delete the web page yet, so it's still there.   C If that be the case, then it wasn't a very fair contest was it.  I  2 wonder what laws govern such a giveaway contest?    I >The webmasters are off being trained in the use of garish colors and newpI >de-humidifier plug-ins.  They'll only be happy when every page contains 2C >enough non-html that no platform on earth can display it properly.r  C BLASPHEMER!  For your penance, you must recite the "lord's prayer":E  "   Czar William who art in Redmond,   How will your PC reign?m#   Thy kingdom won, thy will be one,u!   On earth you're internet maven!     I >(Yes, I'm being sarcastic.  But it's not nice to lure folks with phantom ! >DS10s, so SOMEBODY deserves it.)   H ... you mean like that contest wherein Dick Clark and Ed McMahon come-a- callin' at your door?l   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 16:40:41 GMT  From: raleidig@my-deja.com Subject: TCP/IP Host) Message-ID: <8lpom8$p4c$1@nnrp1.deja.com>t  G I am looking for examples of a TCP/IP Host written in DEC FORTRAN using D openVMS System Services.  My attempts thus far have been foiled as IF have come to required functions referenced in document AA-LU51J-TE for: which prototypes/function declarations are not included inC UCX$INETDEF.FOR.  Note: I do not have access to a C compiler on thea system of interest.a thanks    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.i   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:25:26 +0200>( From: "Web2.lyon" <Web2.lyon@wanadoo.fr> Subject: Updating RMS Files * Message-ID: <39800005.44636C2E@wanadoo.fr>   Hi,a  E Does anybody know how to update an RMS indexed file without using the - RTL routines (SYS$UPDATE) under a C program ?r7 Can I get direct access to data without RMS 'control' ?a   Thanks   ------------------------------  , Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 16:54:44 +0200 (CEST): From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl> Subject: Re: Updating RMS Files-J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0007271649030.13112-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>  % On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Web2.lyon wrote:f [...]l8 +Can I get direct access to data without RMS 'control' ?    Yes.u:  But probably noone will suggest that for indexed files :]=  And you don't know the answer: you can use block-mode RMS :>89 or (without RMS) little harder to programming block mode e IO access...   +Thanksy    Regards - Gotfryd   -- tE =====================================================================cF $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=MEC. $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================l   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:16:30 GMT  From: graculuss@my-deja.comaA Subject: Re: Vacancy exists : VMS Junior Sys Admin, Bracknell, UKt) Message-ID: <8loulc$5jg$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   B If this is the job I think it is (is PEROT involved ?) then I knowB someone who has applied and was rejected because (according to theB agency) he was too experienced, the agency also said that previousF candidates had been rejected because they did not have the appropriate< skills, so perhaps your requirements are a bit too specific.  
 Comments ?    4 In article <397DF7E4.B16F9588@netscapeonline.co.uk>,   mpatt@bigfoot.com wrote:	 > Steven,nB > 	I think that some of your requirements are mutually exclusive:- >e# > steven.reece@quintiles.com wrote:  > >e > > Duties :E > > Support of corporate computer system users.  Support will usuallye involveyB > > assisting the Helpdesk to answer queries, resolve problems and
 respond to8 > > technical requests in a timely and efficient manner.D > > Assist in capacity planning and performance monitoring to ensure that systems/ > > are performing efficiently and effectively.b> > > Ensuring that service level agreements are met for systems availability and > > throughput.  >aB > The above sounds like a junior role, which an ex senior op/shift leader > might be up to.t >v > >h; > > Experience in the following areas would be beneficial :o > >... DCL programming. > Now you want someone who can program in DCL. >eF > >... modification of existing system resources to satisfy additional
 requirements,-, > Now you want someone who can tweak SYSGEN. >v8 > > installation and troubleshooting of layered products0 > Now you want someone who can install software. > 1 > > Storageworks disk configuration / management.eA > Now you want someone who can build & configure disk subsystems.P >DB > I would suggest that anyone who can ALREADY do the above 4 wouldH > currently be working as a system administrator/manager and isn't goingA > to be that interested in taking a "Junior" position. If they'resD > currently in a junior role why would they leave to move to anotherE > junior role, their next sensible step is going to be to move into a. moreH > senior position. Those who are currently working as Ops are not likelyB > to be able to do the 4 things listed above. I think you might be waitingt > a long time....d >e > >oE > > Additional experience of Oracle RDMS or Unix would be useful, buts not essential. >iG > You're a REAL optimist if you also expect this junior to be an Oracleo > DBA and a UNIX head as well. > H > BTW I can do all 4 above, and more, and currently work in Basingstoke,H > but if I were to take a permanent job I'd want to be running the show, > not be someone's junior ;-)T >o >h    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.k   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:58:28 -0400S= From: "Stephane Paquin" <stephane.paquin@nospam.ispatnet.com>t? Subject: VMS process manipulate data on SQLServer/NT box : How?e3 Message-ID: <deXf5.26404$227.499548@nnrp1.uunet.ca>n  8     Hi! I am looking for an answer to a simple question.  J     We are currently using an Oracle/VMS VAX to keep our process data. ButD the old 3100 VAX is nearing the end of its life and I am looking for5 alternatives. One of them is a NT box with SQLServer.e  F     Now, my VMS processes on other nodes manipulate data in the OracleH server through SQL*net network connection very easily. If  I install theK NT/SQLServer box, how does a VMS process on another node can manipulate thee> data on the server ? What are the tools available to do this ?       Thank you in advance.n       Stphane Paquina     Ispat Sidbec   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 05:00:58 +0200I  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>E Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/Sn+ Message-ID: <VA.00000080.138ce9dc@sture.ch>s  > In article <397ED7C5.7318F64A@bbc.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn wrote:/ > From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>  > Newsgroups: comp.os.vmstG > Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/S ' > Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 13:21:25 +0100D >  >  >  > "David P. Murphy" wrote: > 2 > > Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote: > > R > > > No, while we are Explorer bashing, why oh why oh why can't I cut that stringS > > > in the window title bar that shows the full path of the current file selected79 > > > into the buffer so I can paste it somewhere useful?  > >rR > > welcome to the wonderful world of TWEAK UI (also known as POWER TOY in Win95).L > > after installing it, there are several new useful options.  here is one: > >7 > T > Thanks David, I also got another approch in private. The desktop people around ere> > don't like mne running odd s/w, but maybe I'll give it a go. >  Any mileage with my solution?s  O > Having a 3rd party addon is no excese for basic functionality like this to bem > absent > from the base release. > O Yes, but TWEAK UI is an M$ product. Why on earth they don't put it into a base uO release baffles me. Ah - gotit - they want you to visit their website and feel   grateful for the privilege.d   ___f
 Paul Sture Switzerlandl   ------------------------------  , Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 09:29:10 +0200 (CEST): From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>E Subject: Re: WAY OFF TOPIC: help me with the seed of satan pseudo-O/ScI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0007270925070.9745-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>-  & On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Paul Sture wrote:  A +Yes, but TWEAK UI is an M$ product. Why on earth they don't put S# +it into a base release baffles me.   6  Treat it as a "back update" patch, like some known on9 VMS -:) The team probably ends with TU after the CD-ROMs s9 was pressed ! As someone pointed here: with Win98 you get 
 it on the CD.b   +Paul Sture     Regards - Gotfryd --  E =====================================================================mF $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME . $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================t   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 08:59:04 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)o6 Subject: Re: Where is documentation ordering web page?+ Message-ID: <Y6oDFqCWCsNC@eisner.decus.org>   N In article <yOquCz6y8rOv@flying>, abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie) writes:  : > Can anyone tell me where on Compaq's web site I can find: > a listing of available hardcopy documentation and how to > purchase it?  % You purchase it through BusinessLink.e  ; You get a BusinessLink account by having done so years ago,w! since they are no longer offered.w  1 If you don't already have a BusinessLink account, $ Compaq does not want your patronage.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 08:35:12 -0400 + From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>:6 Subject: RE: Where is documentation ordering web page?J Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845BA@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>   Alan,.  I >>> I would like to order the hardcopy documentation for TCP/IP v5.0A for, VMS. <<<  uE http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/#ovmsdocset (document part numbers)aI http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/extra/DOC_ORDERING.HTML (order process)    Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant,
 Compaq Canada  Professional Services  Voice : 613-592-4660 FAX   : 819-772-7036 Email : kerry.main@compaq.come       -----Original Message-----: From: abuse@flying-disk.com [mailto:abuse@flying-disk.com]' Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 11:51 PMw To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comy2 Subject: Where is documentation ordering web page?    A I would like to order the hardcopy documentation for TCP/IP v5.0Aa? for VMS.   I went to the the Compaq web site, but was unable to ? find any ordering information.   I tried the "Ask Compaq" link,uH but get the message "Unable to request URL from host askq.compaq.com:80: Host unreachable".  8 Can anyone tell me where on Compaq's web site I can find8 a listing of available hardcopy documentation and how to purchase it?  9 By the way, that "Blue on Blue" color scheme for the homea7 page is almost totally unreadable.   Who designed that?e   Thanks,e Alan   -- aB --  Alan E. Frisbie             Frisbie "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Com@ --  Flying Disk Systems, Inc.   Abuse "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Com   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Jul 2000 10:37:18 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)P6 Subject: RE: Where is documentation ordering web page?+ Message-ID: <QhcGMUEXpUX4@eisner.decus.org>a  x In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D8052845BA@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes: > Alan,  > J >>>> I would like to order the hardcopy documentation for TCP/IP v5.0A for
 > VMS. <<< >  -G > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/#ovmsdocset (document part numbers)-K > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/extra/DOC_ORDERING.HTML (order process)s   I am happy to stand corrected.   ------------------------------   Date: 27 Jul 2000 08:13:09 PDT* From: abuse@flying-disk.com (Alan Frisbie)6 Subject: Re: Where is documentation ordering web page?! Message-ID: <FUh+ruTfoI0U@flying>   4 In article <yePf5.33$mO3.3917@typhoon.aracnet.com>, 4 "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com> writes:  L > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/ sounds like it's got the info you want.  @ Indeed it does -- everything but the prices.    For some reason,> my client wants to know how much something will cost (at least< roughly) before placing an order.   Is this available on the web site to J. Random Customer?   : Going slightly off-topic...   I note that a few of the VMS> manuals on the documentation CDROM are available in Postscript9 form, but only a few.   Does anyone know if more or fewer A manuals (especially those for layered products) will be availablet? in .PS or .PDF format in the future?   These formats are reallya: handy when I suddenly need a hardcopy version of a manual.   Thanks,h Alan   -- dB --  Alan E. Frisbie             Frisbie "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Com@ --  Flying Disk Systems, Inc.   Abuse "AT" Flying-Disk "DOT" Com   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.417 ************************