1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 27 Jun 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 356       Contents:P Re: (REPOSTED ) How to install SRM console from alpha firmware    version    4.4M Re: (REPOSTED ) How to install SRM console from alpha firmware version4.45 on 1 Re: advice on adopting reasonably large computers 2 Re: Affordable Debate Summary (was: VAX on Intel?)2 Re: Affordable Debate Summary (was: VAX on Intel?)2 Re: Affordable Debate Summary (was: VAX on Intel?) Re: backup/image problem Re: backup/image problem backup/image problem Re: backup/image problem8 Best New Trade Show Display by Opera Portables, Inc. adv" Re: CMQ/Dec with a sense of Humor?# Re: college experience with OpenVMS # Re: college experience with OpenVMS & Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?& Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?& Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?& Re: Compaq paying for software ports ? Re: DEC C versions Re: DEC C versions" Re: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC" RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC" RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC" RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC" Re: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC( Re: Deleting system files [...]*.*_old;*& Disponibility of OPenVMS on Vax System* Re: Disponibility of OPenVMS on Vax System Re: Efficient Sleep function* Found: PC package to make backup of VMS CD. Re: Found: PC package to make backup of VMS CD Re: General discussion comment< Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questions< Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questions< Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questions< RE: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questionsC RE: How to install SRM console from alpha firmware version 4.45 o n - Re: Latest Compaq mailshot still ignoring VMS  Logging off users remotely?  Re: Logging off users remotely?  RE: Logging off users remotely?  Re: Logging off users remotely?  RE: Logging off users remotely? > RE: looking for a list of Canadian companies using Vax systems MicroVAX II Free to good home 2 Re: My experience with Charon-VAX Hobbyist Edition2 Re: My experience with Charon-VAX Hobbyist Edition( Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming question( Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming question( Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming question( Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming question. Re: OpenVMS clusters vs other systems clusters OpenVMS Information Center Re: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMS Re: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMS Re: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMSF Re: Powerstorm 300/350, Open3D, New Alpha workstations and PEX support4 Re: Pricing of hardware/software for hobbist/student Re: print que problems Re: print que problems9 Re: ramdisk vs. file cache, and the winner is, file cache  RE: TP_server process  Re: TP_server process C Transparent login to another cluster node using DECnet Task-to-Task G Re: Transparent login to another cluster node using DECnet Task-to-Task  UP1100 & OpenVMS Re: UP1100 & OpenVMS! VAX based 1032 database to Oracle ! VAX based 1032 database to Oracle % Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle % Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle % Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle % Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle  Re: VAX on Intel? 7 what layered products can i install with these licences ; Re: what layered products can i install with these licences ; Re: what layered products can i install with these licences   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:18:54 -0500 7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> Y Subject: Re: (REPOSTED ) How to install SRM console from alpha firmware    version    4.4 - Message-ID: <3957E4DE.98A73886@earthlink.net>    "David J. Dachtera" wrote: [snip]) > Added 16 MB RAM (total 32MB) and voila!  >  > Try it, if you can.   E Try 72 pin, 60ns parity memory. I'm currently using two SIMMs from my  old Packard Bell machine.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems " http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 11:45:31 -0700 ! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com V Subject: Re: (REPOSTED ) How to install SRM console from alpha firmware version4.45 onC Message-ID: <OF1FA7D26A.62BA488A-ON8825690A.0066E800@HEALTHNET.COM>   G That looks to me like you've not got enough memory in the system, I had H something similar. Check the first line of output after the "e6.." to beK sure, mine specifically mentioned insufficient memory. You need at least 64 < meg. Sorry, I don't know what kind of memory your box takes.   Shane           5 gigglegs@aol.com (Gigglegs) on 06/25/2000 08:06:58 PM    To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  cc:   D Subject:  (REPOSTED ) How to install SRM console from alpha firmware       version 4.45 on     K ALpha station 200 4/233 system.  I tried putting in the hobbyist cd rom and J tried installing new firmware on my system.  It doesn't recognize the fileK system.  I am new to this and I don't know what to do...any ideas?  My main E goal is to actually install open vms to my machine ( which is running  winnt4.01 right now).  Please any help will be appreciated.     J PS: When i posted this question last time  , I got an answer from a compaqH senior person.  Compaq senior person directed me to the firmware release notes.  K I tried updating the flash ROM from the Windows NT Arc Firmware . ( i guess J since i am an experienced .. things didnt work out as they should.....)  i ran H the firmware update utility , i power cycled sytem but didnt get the SRMH console prompt, instead i got eb.ea.e9.e8.e7.e6.....    then showed some memoryJ dump , it power cycled Itself again ( doesnt help me much to understand !! ) .IK also do want to tell that i bought this system used . I dont know what kind  of system it has.( (alpha pc164 .alpha pcs 164sx etc ...  )  J   I AM CLULESS. IS THERE ANY GOOD MANUAL THAT WILL HELP   SOME ONE LIKE ME TOI INSTALL (OPEN VMS ON THIS MACHINE OR  GET TO SRM CONSOLE) .   ANY STEP BY  STEP8 DETAILED HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED. THANK YOU IN ADVANCE  	 O.CELIKER    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 09:57:54 GMT " From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>: Subject: Re: advice on adopting reasonably large computers( Message-ID: <8J4KUQ$76L$1@NEWS.IAEHV.NL>  7 Be careful how you connect the system to a wall outlet. = You do not get 220V by just putting two plugs in two adjacent  sockets.> Many DEC systems have a switch on the power supply that allowsB you to select 220-240 V or 100-110 V. Recent devices figure it out9 by themselves. Open up the box and find the power supply. 5 The transformer may have a tap marked 110V (or 100V). 
 Use that one. C Next, remember good old Mr. Ohm: half the potential means that your G current doubles, assuming that the load does not change. Make sure that / the power cable is able to handle that current.   = Last issue: IIRC US wall outlets deliver 110V 60 Hz AC power. H Europe has 230V 50 Hz. The frequency difference may do surprising thingsD to the system if the line frequency is used as reference for certain signals.  J It may all work, just be careful because it is so easy to put a power cord on aH device which just happens to match the outlet. I once saw a new Japanese printer I plugged in a socket, only the power cord was replaced. Now Japan has 100V L and the outlet was (then) 220V. The printer exploded discreetly, but messily once the cadaver was opened up....   
 Hans Vlems    1 Christopher Smith heeft geschreven in bericht ...  >Hi, > G >Since I've seen a lot of talk in the group about computers that are -- H >give or take -- the size of your refridgerator, I thought this would be >the place to ask my question: > H >I'm thinking about getting a relatively large machine.  This particularK >machine is a small fridge in size -- a rack type unit with what seem to be J >two backplanes and some memory/cpu and miscelaneous cards.  There are twoG >normal size mounting bays for scsi peripherals, one of which is filled  >with a tape drive.  > G >That in mind, it shouldn't suck as much power as some larger machines, A >since the drives won't need to be as large as the system itself.  > H >The cord doesn't have a plug on it but it looks like the main power wasK >supposed to be 220 volt, so I imagine I'll have to plug it into my washing C >machine outlet (this is in the us, so we have 110 volt wall power, 7 >normally.) or divide it up over two 110 volt circuits.  > H >At any rate, the question is, asuming that I decide to take this thing,A >does anyone have any advice aside from "seek professional help?"  > K >Now, this certainly isn't the place to talk about this particular machine, J >but I'd like to ask anyone if they have experience -- good or bad -- withI >the things.  It's a Sequent Symetry S5N (Where I think N is a 1, but I'm K >not sure ;)  Again, I don't want to take up the newsgroup's bandwidth with G >talking about the particular machine, since it's not a DEC box, but if 1 >anyone knows any specifics, could you e-mail me?  > 	 >Regards,  >  >Chris > L >=========================================================================== ====? >"My two cents" (http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562) < >Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com) Prgramer^W Programmer  >Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.& >-------------------------------------J >"Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes andI >weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes ; >and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 L >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 26 Jun 2000 12:04:24 PDTT From: Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515); Subject: Re: Affordable Debate Summary (was: VAX on Intel?) 3 Message-ID: <8WyT77C2RhSS@mccdev.slac.stanford.edu>   . In article <39541CD0.5D0381F0@earthlink.net>, >     	"David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> writes: > Phillip Helbig wrote:  >>  6 >> In article <NC+LKPcZunOa@mccdev.slac.stanford.edu>,G >> Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX:  >> 926-3515) writes: >>  L >> >        At  my  site  (basic  research   in  physics,  a  DOE  supportedL >> >    laboratory  but  also  wearing  a  .EDU  "hat"),  equipment  can  beL >> >    purchased with just my manager's signature _if_  it's  under  $5000.L >> >    That  $5000  is  a very hard limit for many education and governmentL >> >    institutions.  Things  in  the  purchasing  area  get  so  much more% >> >    complicated above that value.  >>  H >> I've seen people place orders for a CPU, a motherboard, a tape drive,J >> hard disk, some memory etc, all with the same company, and individuallyJ >> all less than the limit.  If the company wants to voluntarily stick theJ >> stuff together as a favour to the customer, that's their business.  :-) > I > I'm gonna post this on the Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Message Board!  > 
 > GREAT idea!   D         Until your purchasing department gets a clue.  _Ours_ became*     cluefull almost 10 years ago.  Sigh...           -Ken --  M  Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edu :  SLAC, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, MS 46  |  Voice:    650-926-2924:  Menlo Park, CA  94025           |  FAX:      650-926-3515N  -----------------------------------------------------------------------------B  These opinions are mine, not SLAC's, Stanford's, nor the DOE's...   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 09:21:27 GMT * From: "Nikita V. Belenki" <kit@nospam.net>; Subject: Re: Affordable Debate Summary (was: VAX on Intel?) 7 Message-ID: <UWV45.222$0X.5919@NUQ-READ.NEWS.VERIO.NET>   : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:39526F54.9ACCFC02@videotron.ca...  L > > There is virtually no demand for VMS in the low-end, high-volume market, > > regardless of its price.H > Consider that in the heydays of VMS, there was much demand for desktop VMS.H > Why do you think Digital produced so many "diskless" workstations ? So theyH > could boot off a server into a cluster and provide the scalability and power  > of VMS clustering.  J Right. And then they wasted it, so right now virtually noone wants to boot anything off a VMS server.  K Unfortunately, we are speaking about what whey (or we) can do now, not what  they could have done then.   Kit. kit # kits.net   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 02:28:32 GMT 7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> ; Subject: Re: Affordable Debate Summary (was: VAX on Intel?) - Message-ID: <39541CD0.5D0381F0@EARTHLINK.NET>    Phillip Helbig wrote:  > 5 > In article <NC+LKPcZunOa@mccdev.slac.stanford.edu>, F > Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: > 926-3515) writes:  > K > >        At  my  site  (basic  research   in  physics,  a  DOE  supported K > >    laboratory  but  also  wearing  a  .EDU  "hat"),  equipment  can  be K > >    purchased with just my manager's signature _if_  it's  under  $5000. K > >    That  $5000  is  a very hard limit for many education and government K > >    institutions.  Things  in  the  purchasing  area  get  so  much more $ > >    complicated above that value. > G > I've seen people place orders for a CPU, a motherboard, a tape drive, I > hard disk, some memory etc, all with the same company, and individually I > all less than the limit.  If the company wants to voluntarily stick the I > stuff together as a favour to the customer, that's their business.  :-)   G I'm gonna post this on the Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Message Board!    GREAT idea!    -- David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems " http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:06:45 GMT 1 From: "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com> ! Subject: Re: backup/image problem 2 Message-ID: <39579B96.B23A6471@clarityconnect.com>  F I'd have to guess that this saveset was from a bound volume set and inH order to do an image restore you must have the same number of volumes on' the output as were in the input volume.    Sue Rosselet wrote:  >  > Folks, > G > I am attempting to restore an image backup from a tape to a new disk. & > This is on an Alpha, using OVMS 7.1. > ; > According to the OVMS System Manager's Manual: Essentials > >    When you use the /IMAGE qualifier in a restore operation,B >    the disk to which you are restoring the files is initialized.! > So I did not INIT the new disk.  > J > Following the directions and example in the manual, I have the followingI > .COM file.  I have checked the save set name, so I know that's correct.  >  > $! mount tape drive  > $ mount/foreign mka200:  > $! > $! Mount the new disk  > $ mount/foreign dkb600:  > $!9 > $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:  > $! > $! Dismount the devices  > $ dismount mka200: > $ dismount/nounload dkb600:  > C > When I try this, both mka200: and dkb600: are mounted, but at the ; >   $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:  > I get the following: > J > %BACKUP-F-BADSETCNT, incorrect number of devices in output specification > / > What an I missing in my output specification?  >  > TIA. >  > Sue Rosselet > system@cslab.bemidji.msus.edu    --  D Jilly	- Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley - Lockwood, NY0 	- jilly@clarityconnect.com			- Brett Bodine fan. 	- Mark.Jilson@Compaq.com			- since 1975 or so, 	- http://www.jilly.baka.com               -   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:29:19 +0000 - From: ezzaoudi med <m.ezzaoudi@digitem.co.ma> ! Subject: Re: backup/image problem - Message-ID: <3957A0FF.F1C395DE@digitem.co.ma>    The correct command is :3 You must specifi that your tape contain a SAVE SET.   < $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/SAVE /rewind dkb600:   BY     Sue Rosselet a =E9crit :   > Folks, > F > I am attempting to restore an image backup from a tape to a new dis= k.& > This is on an Alpha, using OVMS 7.1. > ; > According to the OVMS System Manager's Manual: Essentials > >    When you use the /IMAGE qualifier in a restore operation,B >    the disk to which you are restoring the files is initialized.! > So I did not INIT the new disk.i >aF > Following the directions and example in the manual, I have the foll= owingoF > .COM file.  I have checked the save set name, so I know that's corr= ect. >A > $! mount tape drived > $ mount/foreign mka200:A > $! > $! Mount the new diskp > $ mount/foreign dkb600:o > $!9 > $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:a > $! > $! Dismount the devicess > $ dismount mka200: > $ dismount/nounload dkb600:o >gC > When I try this, both mka200: and dkb600: are mounted, but at the ; >   $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:t > I get the following: >yF > %BACKUP-F-BADSETCNT, incorrect number of devices in output specific= ations >s/ > What an I missing in my output specification?a >U > TIA. >N > Sue Rosselet > system@cslab.bemidji.msus.edu,   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:23:02 -0400P2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com> Subject: backup/image problem 7 Message-ID: <200006261823_MC2-AA36-2C7D@compuserve.com>f  J         I believe that you have made an image backup of a bound volume se= t.G  Backup will only restore this to a new bound volume set containing the  same number of volumes.m  J         If you need to move the contents of a volume set to a single disk= ,eC of adequate capacity, try omitting the /IMAGE on the backup and the  restore.    $ Message text written by Sue Rosselet >Folks,   E I am attempting to restore an image backup from a tape to a new disk. $ This is on an Alpha, using OVMS 7.1.  9 According to the OVMS System Manager's Manual: Essentialso<    When you use the /IMAGE qualifier in a restore operation,@    the disk to which you are restoring the files is initialized. So I did not INIT the new disk.V  H Following the directions and example in the manual, I have the followingG .COM file.  I have checked the save set name, so I know that's correct.e   $! mount tape drivea $ mount/foreign mka200:M $! $! Mount the new diski $ mount/foreign dkb600: =g   $!7 $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:  $! $! Dismount the devicest $ dismount mka200: $ dismount/nounload dkb600:c  A When I try this, both mka200: and dkb600: are mounted, but at the19   $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:  I get the following:  H %BACKUP-F-BADSETCNT, incorrect number of devices in output specification  - What an I missing in my output specification?    TIA.<e   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 00:43:22 +0200c" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>! Subject: Re: backup/image problems( Message-ID: <8j8m5t$lhd$1@news.IAEhv.nl>  B Incorrect, BACKUP (/IMAGE) always assumes a saveset with a magtape device. A The error message indicates that an image backup of a bindset was : restored to a single volume, which BACKUP/IMAGE cannot do.4 It will try to preserve relative volume information.B You can collapse an image saveset of a volumeset to a single disk: initialize a disk F and use BACKUP without the IMAGE qualifier. However make sure that you includet  things like /owner=original etc.  
 Hans Vlems  ( ezzaoudi med heeft geschreven in bericht$ <3957A0FF.F1C395DE@digitem.co.ma>... The correct command is :3 You must specifi that your tape contain a SAVE SET.   < $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/SAVE /rewind dkb600:   BY     Sue Rosselet a crit :   > Folks, > G > I am attempting to restore an image backup from a tape to a new disk.v& > This is on an Alpha, using OVMS 7.1. >M; > According to the OVMS System Manager's Manual: Essentials > >    When you use the /IMAGE qualifier in a restore operation,B >    the disk to which you are restoring the files is initialized.! > So I did not INIT the new disk.. >/J > Following the directions and example in the manual, I have the followingI > .COM file.  I have checked the save set name, so I know that's correct.  >a > $! mount tape drive: > $ mount/foreign mka200:. > $! > $! Mount the new diskR > $ mount/foreign dkb600:l > $!9 > $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:1 > $! > $! Dismount the devices8 > $ dismount mka200: > $ dismount/nounload dkb600:t >tC > When I try this, both mka200: and dkb600: are mounted, but at ther; >   $ backup/image/verify   mka200:disk.bck/rewind  dkb600:a > I get the following: >mJ > %BACKUP-F-BADSETCNT, incorrect number of devices in output specification > / > What an I missing in my output specification?( >g > TIA. >/ > Sue Rosselet > system@cslab.bemidji.msus.eduo   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 17:07:25 -0500m From: Opera5@veriomail.comA Subject: Best New Trade Show Display by Opera Portables, Inc. advi- Message-ID: <0FWS00DOF5ND4Z@mx.east.saic.com>n   Opera Portables, Inc. is offering "by invitation" visits to our web site.  Packed full of exciting projects and news, Opera is leading the industry with displays that are as much eye-popping as they are eye catching.   Winner of numerous industry awards, including Ernst & Young's Crescendo Award, Exhibitor Magazine's Best New Product, Forty Under 40 and Emerging 30, Opera Portables is a progressive young company with imagination and vision.M  e If you use displays, you really owe it to yourself to check out our stuff!   Go to http://3637336342/y   Opera Portables, Inc.h  4 All removes honored at http://3637336342/removes.htm   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:02:16 -0400n5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>i+ Subject: Re: CMQ/Dec with a sense of Humor?I+ Message-ID: <8j85qb$kl0$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>t  J This is the sense of humor of firmware writers.  The SRM firmware, believeL it or not, is a small single purpose multitasking OS.  These are two "tasks" that are running.O  C The set of people this is meaningful to can be numbered on 2 hands.P   _FredP    @ Bill Eaton wrote in message <39498F58.E0C92F04@localhost.net>... >Antony Wardle wrote:- >-  >> While booting an alpha, (7.1) >>- >> I wasn't sure if I had the hold screen, so , >> I thought that I would try a control T to >> see if there was any life.U >># >> Well, I got a message up sayine:y >># >> dead_eater waiting for dead_beef  >>2 >> I didn't believe it, so I did another control T >> and got the same message. >>$ >> Thought it to be funnily bizzare. >>/ >> Anyone know if this actually means anything?t >>	 >> Antony  >oH >Old-but-good joke (not invented here) involved programming Motif window >manager like this:m >e >Keys DefaultKeyBindings >{: >Alt Ctrl<Key>Delete    root|window|icon    f.menu TooMany >}
 >Menu TooManyr >{A >    "%SYSTEM-W-TOOMNYFNGRS, too many fingers on keyboard" f.beeph >} > : >This does not work as expected on all Compaq platforms :) >a >- >really eatonwatfpdotcodotnz >r >    ------------------------------    Date: 26 Jun 2000 14:39:15 -0500- From: Graham Allan <allan@mnhep1.hep.umn.edu> , Subject: Re: college experience with OpenVMS0 Message-ID: <w5366qww7to.fsf@lanark.spa.umn.edu>  3 nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) writes:t  H >    Of course theres the "free VMS for colleges" program that Terry hasI > alluded to, but I can't find anyone in Compaq who knows about ( or willnD > admit to knowing about ) this program. Then again, if this is justF > the base licenses and no layered products it's probably not going toA > help ( it's clustering in particular that this instructor finds H > interesting ). Even if the program *is* of value I'll bet that it will > only be available in the US.  G I'm also waiting with interest to see if this program materialises, andiI what the conditions are. Rich Marcello certainly acknowledged that it was D in the works, but I wonder how long it will take to become genuinely
 available.  H Although to focus on one of your points above, I would have assumed thatF the program would provide free base system licenses, and one could useC ESL/CSLG for layered products. There's no way of knowing, though...e   G. -- 'I -------------------------------------------------------------------------p: Graham Allan - I.T. Manager - gta@umn.edu - (612) 624-50409 School of Physics and Astronomy - University of MinnesotahI -------------------------------------------------------------------------    ------------------------------    Date: 26 Jun 2000 13:30:55 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett)e, Subject: Re: college experience with OpenVMS, Message-ID: <NcEJn5SFw$Cu@malvm2.mala.bc.ca>  1 In article <w5366qww7to.fsf@lanark.spa.umn.edu>, t2    Graham Allan <allan@mnhep1.hep.umn.edu> writes: > I > I'm also waiting with interest to see if this program materialises, andSK > what the conditions are. Rich Marcello certainly acknowledged that it waskF > in the works, but I wonder how long it will take to become genuinely > available. > F    That's my major concern, by the time they make up their minds to doC something what little interest remains will have evaporated. I also=F have no confidence the program will be available in Canada if and when it does materialize.  J > Although to focus on one of your points above, I would have assumed thatH > the program would provide free base system licenses, and one could useE > ESL/CSLG for layered products. There's no way of knowing, though...b >   G    I assume this also. The concern is that the CSLG fee is dependant oneC the number of systems in use, so these "free" systems could push an-F institution into the next tier ( particularly if they are currently inF the "1 system" or "1-10 system" tiers ), which would increase the cost@ by a couple of thousand dollars a year - this can be a lot to anF academic department which isn't really sure it has any interest in VMS in the first place.   F    I find the distinction between DECCampus and CSLG interesting also.H I don't know what the pricing structure is for DECCampus, but I like theD idea that once you buy a set of licenses its good for as long as youE own that processor. With CSLG we're at the whim of Compaq, they couldeE pull the program at any time and all our rights to the software would>C evaporate when the current portfolio PAK expired. I have nightmarest@ that some day I'm going to have tell my boss we have a choice ofE sending Compaq a cheque for a few hundred thousand $ or shutting down 8 all our VMS and Tru64 systems within a couple of months.  M ============================================================================= M Malcolm Dunnett      Malaspina University-College   Email: dunnett@mala.bc.ca>H Information Systems  Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA V9R 5S5     Tel: (250)755-8738   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 11:31:48 -0700l! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com / Subject: Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?uC Message-ID: <OF9447C99E.713EDD19-ON8825690A.006595A4@HEALTHNET.COM>   E That would not quite be true if the Compaq VMS guys were building theaK libraries to VMS quality standards, rather than Unix. We know they're good,lG maybe they're good enough to build in protection against the usual Unix ) loopholes without breaking compatability?    We can but hope.   Shanel          = yyyc186.illegaltospam_@flashcom.net on 06/25/2000 08:20:02 AM9   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  cc:|  0 Subject:  Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?    0 In <3951775D.E8BDE9E8@videotron.ca>, on 06/25/00=    at 11:20 AM, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> said:.  H >To be the devil's advocate, what if the VMS engineers were busy workingF >on full unix compliance of VMS which would make all ports much easier >from unix source code ?  J Which would make VMS as febil an OS for production use as UNIX is and thusJ Bill Gates would finally have one and all OS's on the market would suck asI bad as NT, therefore everyone could just run the sucky NT OS.  Talk abouthI heading in the  WRONG direction.  Let me guess, a Compaq MBA came up withy+ this idea....could it have been Palmer?????p     Roland   --; -----------------------------------------------------------oD yyyc186@flashcom.net              To Respond delete ".illegaltospam"6                             MR/2 Internet Cruiser 1.528                             For a Microsoft free univers; -----------------------------------------------------------a   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 16:26:22 -0400e' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>-/ Subject: Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?8( Message-ID: <8j8e8a$kq4$1@pyrite.mv.net>  - Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org> wrote in message 4 news:4.3.2.7.0.20000626132453.00cb65a0@24.8.96.48...- > At 12:46 PM 6/25/00 -0400, Bill Todd wrote:g; > >Things like Unix buffer-overrun weaknesses don't need to.H > >compromise robustness either - as long as null-terminated strings areL > >validated before use, something VMS has proven fairly competent at doing. >h> > This is, unfortunately, potentially non-trivially expensive.  H For a very long string, I could see the expense become non-trivial - but< just how often does such a string get presented by the user?  H I assume that even strings with descriptors get probed on a page-by-pageG basis on entry to a normal VMS system service.  How much more expensivelK (compared to the normal cost of entering, executing, and exiting a service)tJ can it really be to scan for a null up to the next page boundary, validateG the page access, and iterate, generating an internal descriptor for thesF string at the end of the process so internal system functions wouldn't? depend upon the null (which the program might be able to changef> asynchronously after the string had been initially validated)?  K For that matter, wouldn't it be possible to perform the actual null-scan infI a user-mode interface stub (which might or might not limit the ability ton@ execute Unix binaries but presumably wouldn't be a problem givenI recompilation) which generated an appropriate descriptor - plus any othereI changes more conveniently made in user mode - that the VMS system service1* could then validate like a VMS descriptor?   - bill    Not anrE > argument to not do it, more an argument to not take null-terminatede strings  > in system services...  >p > Dane >iK > --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------t4 > Dan Sugalski                          even samuraiA > dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and evene= >                                       teddy bears get drunkh >I >E   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 16:56:04 -0400g" From: Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org>/ Subject: Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?i: Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.0.20000626165159.00cf2a80@24.8.96.48>  + At 04:26 PM 6/26/00 -0400, Bill Todd wrote:o  . >Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org> wrote in message5 >news:4.3.2.7.0.20000626132453.00cb65a0@24.8.96.48...w/ > > At 12:46 PM 6/25/00 -0400, Bill Todd wrote:k= > > >Things like Unix buffer-overrun weaknesses don't need toDJ > > >compromise robustness either - as long as null-terminated strings areN > > >validated before use, something VMS has proven fairly competent at doing. > >p@ > > This is, unfortunately, potentially non-trivially expensive. >nI >For a very long string, I could see the expense become non-trivial - buti= >just how often does such a string get presented by the user?  > I >I assume that even strings with descriptors get probed on a page-by-page H >basis on entry to a normal VMS system service.  How much more expensiveL >(compared to the normal cost of entering, executing, and exiting a service)K >can it really be to scan for a null up to the next page boundary, validate-H >the page access, and iterate, generating an internal descriptor for theG >string at the end of the process so internal system functions wouldn't @ >depend upon the null (which the program might be able to change? >asynchronously after the string had been initially validated)?a  E Right now system services probe the first and last page of a buffer, aF assuming the buffer spans two or more pages. That's relatively cheap. K Scanning a string means iterating through each and every byte, which isn't  J cheap in general, and more expensive on older Alphas that don't have byte G ops. Plus you need to see when you're changing pages and probe the new u! pages before scanning the buffer.i  J Like I said, potentially non-trivial. Most of the time it's not that bad, G but in error cases it could get nasty. I'd still *do* it, mind, but it k would cost.e   					Dan  I --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------02 Dan Sugalski                          even samurai? dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and evend;                                       teddy bears get drunka   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:45:56 -0400n' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> / Subject: Re: Compaq paying for software ports ?6' Message-ID: <8j8mdo$an$1@pyrite.mv.net>U  - Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org> wrote in messagep4 news:4.3.2.7.0.20000626165159.00cf2a80@24.8.96.48...- > At 04:26 PM 6/26/00 -0400, Bill Todd wrote:s >t0 > >Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org> wrote in message7 > >news:4.3.2.7.0.20000626132453.00cb65a0@24.8.96.48...01 > > > At 12:46 PM 6/25/00 -0400, Bill Todd wrote:o? > > > >Things like Unix buffer-overrun weaknesses don't need to-L > > > >compromise robustness either - as long as null-terminated strings areI > > > >validated before use, something VMS has proven fairly competent atn doing. > > >nB > > > This is, unfortunately, potentially non-trivially expensive. > > K > >For a very long string, I could see the expense become non-trivial - butt? > >just how often does such a string get presented by the user?t > >tK > >I assume that even strings with descriptors get probed on a page-by-pageoJ > >basis on entry to a normal VMS system service.  How much more expensiveE > >(compared to the normal cost of entering, executing, and exiting aI service)D > >can it really be to scan for a null up to the next page boundary, validateJ > >the page access, and iterate, generating an internal descriptor for theI > >string at the end of the process so internal system functions wouldn'tdB > >depend upon the null (which the program might be able to changeA > >asynchronously after the string had been initially validated)?o >gF > Right now system services probe the first and last page of a buffer,G > assuming the buffer spans two or more pages. That's relatively cheap.aL > Scanning a string means iterating through each and every byte, which isn'tK > cheap in general, and more expensive on older Alphas that don't have bytelH > ops. Plus you need to see when you're changing pages and probe the new# > pages before scanning the buffer.u  K It sounds as if you're talking about two different things here:  on the one2J hand strings, which clearly do have to be scanned (though don't I rememberK that even old Alphas have instructions that allow you to scan them at least,K 8 bytes at a time for the null?  and can't one pre-fetch some modest number L of cache lines in advance, though not beyond the next page boundary, to helpD limit the memory latency paid for this scan?), and on the other handI buffers, which are often much larger but don't present any obvious reason E for handling very differently than VMS handles its own buffers today.a   >r' > Like I said, potentially non-trivial.h  J The code, while non-trivial, doesn't sound particularly challenging to theL calibre of people one would expect to be writing it.  And the overhead, saveF in cases of very long strings, sounds relatively small compared to the6 execution overhead of any significant system function.  $  Most of the time it's not that bad,( > but in error cases it could get nasty.  K I'm curious how they'd differ from the cases VMS already has to handle witho descriptor strings.t   - bill     I'd still *do* it, mind, but it
 > would cost.E >a > Dani > K > --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------t4 > Dan Sugalski                          even samuraiA > dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and eveni= >                                       teddy bears get drunkh >s >r   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:08:51 -0400M5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>  Subject: Re: DEC C versions0+ Message-ID: <8j866l$k0e$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>n  I I would strongly recommend installing the ECO to make it 6.2A.  The fixeshK will save you a lot of time in debugging some obscure code generation bugs.p   We have (the VMS builds).c   _Fred   E Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515 wrote in message ...mI >In article <393FD970.48DE2DC5@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?=t% >    <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes: 4 >> I thougth DEC C went 5.6-5.7-6.0-6.1, but someone >> just mentioned a 6.0A ! > I >        Well, you also left off 6.2...  The 6.0A is probably/possibly an I >    ECO against 6.0.   Similarly,  there  is  an  ECO  for  6.2 (which IFI >    haven't had time to install) which _could_ generate a 6.2A...but I'dnI >    expect  a 6.2-xxx instead (where my currently installed version says  >    6.2-003). >s
 >        -Keny >--t. > Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edu ; > SLAC, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, MS 46  |  Voice:    650-926-2924M; > Menlo Park, CA  94025           |  FAX:      650-926-3515pL > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---uC > These opinions are mine, not SLAC's, Stanford's, nor the DOE's...    ------------------------------   Date: 26 Jun 2000 14:06:12 PDTT From: Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515) Subject: Re: DEC C versionsn3 Message-ID: <M3xLDOHDxoGh@mccdev.slac.stanford.edu>m  c In article <8j866l$k0e$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes:iK > I would strongly recommend installing the ECO to make it 6.2A.  The fixesoM > will save you a lot of time in debugging some obscure code generation bugs.r  H         And which ECO  would  that  be,  Fred?   Just  today I installedH     CCAE03062,  after which CC/VERS gives V6.2-007.  [And by the way,  IH     found only CCAE01062  on  ftp.service.digital.com...I  don't  recall)     _where_ I managed to get ECO 3 from.]e           -Ken -- tM  Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edug:  SLAC, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, MS 46  |  Voice:    650-926-2924:  Menlo Park, CA  94025           |  FAX:      650-926-3515N  -----------------------------------------------------------------------------B  These opinions are mine, not SLAC's, Stanford's, nor the DOE's...   ------------------------------   Date: 26 Jun 2000 14:51:56 PDTT From: Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515)+ Subject: Re: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTCn3 Message-ID: <+jOUxSzJ61yz@mccdev.slac.stanford.edu>   H         I thought I'd give a  summary  of  my Adventures in DTSS-land toF     the group.  Thanks to all that posted here or sent private e-mail.  H         I had asked about using  NTP  to drive DTSS, primarily because IH     thought  I needed DTSS to get all the SYS$TIMEZONE* logicals definedH     correctly.  Given that this is the only system that will be  runningH     DTSS  (because  the  rest of my cluster will stay with DECNET IV forH     other reasons), I have no need to  make this system a DTSS Server or0     otherwise use DTSS for actuall time keeping.  H         To reiterate my initial problem.   I  had been working with thisH     system  the last few month of last year, then have had it turned offH     since the end of December.  When I booted it back up, the UTC  stuffH     (SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL)  was  wrong  (we've gone from PST -> PDTH     whlie the system was off),  but executing UTC$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM, andH     even the full-blown UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM had no effect: on reboot, theH     TDF  was still set for standard time and SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME  remainedH     "PST".  After a number  of  experiments,  I  found  that  using  theH     default NET$DTSS_CLERK_STARTUP.NCL, which creates the clerk and thenH     issues  an  ENABLE  DTSS SET CLOCK TRUE command to NCL, both (A) setH     the SYS$TIMEZONE* logical names  correctly  for  PST and (B) allowedH     NTP  to set the time (because there are _no_ DTSS servers  available'     for the DTSS Clerk to worry about).n  H         I then asked if  there  was  a  way  to  have NTP drive the DTSSH     Server  process,  and there are (or may be), but as I said above,  IH     really don't need DTSS  at  all.   Many  suggested  I  disable  DTSS     altogether.j  H         I tried several  suggestions  for  disabling  DTSS.   One was toH     simply  delete SYS$MANAGER: NET$DTSS_CLERK_STARTUP.NCL.  That indeedH     prevents the DTSS Clerk process from being started, but in its placeH     I  get  a  DTSS  Server  process.   This  happens  in   SYS$STARTUP:H     DTSS$STARTUP.COM.   So  I  hacked  away  on  DTSS$STARTUP.COM, firstH     exiting just  prior  the  run/process  so  that DTSS$UTC_STARTUP.COMH     would  have been executed, and later putting an EXIT at the very topH     of the command file.  Either hack prevents the DTSS  Server  (and/orH     Clerk)  from  being  started,  but I find that if I try to force theH     timezone back to PST  (via  UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM),  when I reboot, allH     those  SYS$TIMEZONE*  logical names are still created and still  are     set for PST!  H         Someone suggested that SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DATH     needed to be deleted, followed by a  reboot.  I tried that but find,H     even  with DTSS supposedly disabled, the file gets recreated at bootH     and the timezone logicals are the same, PDT values.  I've turned  onH     full  logging  for  the  system  startup  but  didn't  find anything     helpful.  H         The one final test that I could  do but haven't would be to shutH     the system down after setting the SYSGEN parameter SETTIME to 1, theH     setting  the  date  forward  to, e.g., Oct.31 (for  the  US  PacificH     timezone) and seeing what happens.  Would the  system  still  be  onH     PDT?   Would  I  need  to  allow the DTSS Clerk to start in order to!     force the system back to PST?m  H         For the time being, I think I'll  allow the DTSS Clerk to run in4     default mode and other wise just ignore it.  ;-p  H         Really, this DTSS and UTC stuff is a mess.  I wish I didn't haveH     to wait for VMS 7.3 to  have  it  resolved, especially since I doubt0     I'll be going to 7.3 before mid-2001...  :-(           -Ken --M  Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edu=:  SLAC, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, MS 46  |  Voice:    650-926-2924:  Menlo Park, CA  94025           |  FAX:      650-926-3515N  -----------------------------------------------------------------------------B  These opinions are mine, not SLAC's, Stanford's, nor the DOE's...   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:32:38 -0400C# From: John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com>T+ Subject: RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC D Message-ID: <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD734@berry.mvpsi.com>  ) Thanks for the summary.  As for this bit:l  ! >         Someone suggested that i+ > SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DATe< >     needed to be deleted, followed by a  reboot.  I tried  > that but find,9 >     even  with DTSS supposedly disabled, the file gets   > recreated at bootS@ >     and the timezone logicals are the same, PDT values.  I've  > turned  on= >     full  logging  for  the  system  startup  but  didn't  z > find anythingo >     helpful. >d  I The DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT file does get magically recreated whengG you boot so, to do a DST time change when DTSS is disabled, you have to = delete SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT then execute 0 UTC$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM.  A reboot isn't required.    d   ------------------------------   Date: 26 Jun 2000 17:34:57 PDTT From: Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515)+ Subject: RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTCm3 Message-ID: <NX1H5B2uLOWB@mccdev.slac.stanford.edu>?  j In article <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD734@berry.mvpsi.com>, John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com> writes:+ > Thanks for the summary.  As for this bit:  > G >>     Someone suggested that SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT F >> needed to be deleted, followed by a reboot.  I tried that but find,F >> even with DTSS supposedly disabled, the file gets recreated at bootF >> and the timezone logicals are the same, PDT values.  I've turned onH >> full logging for the system startup but didn't find anything helpful. >iK > The DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT file does get magically recreated when2I > you boot so, to do a DST time change when DTSS is disabled, you have tod? > delete SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT then executed2 > UTC$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM.  A reboot isn't required.  H         Thanks, John, but I did  just  that.   I first deleted the file,H     then  I  executed  UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM.  Yes,  after  executing  thatH     command  file,  SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL  is   correct   (but   notH     SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME   nor   SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING).   But  moreH     importantly (to me), upon rebooting the machine, the changes made byF     UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM have been lost.  ;-p  That's what I'm fighting.           Next idea?               -Ken --M  Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edua:  SLAC, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, MS 46  |  Voice:    650-926-2924:  Menlo Park, CA  94025           |  FAX:      650-926-3515N  -----------------------------------------------------------------------------B  These opinions are mine, not SLAC's, Stanford's, nor the DOE's...   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 22:33:08 -0400u# From: John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com>c+ Subject: RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTCbD Message-ID: <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD735@berry.mvpsi.com>  I I thought that I had finally figured this out this past April.  It soundsaL like I'm going to be pulling out more hair this October!  Are you using UCX?K Do you have the time zone configured in UCX?  The time zone stuff in UCX isrK deprecated but that may be where I get my time zone after I delete the DTSSt file.  (That's just a SWAG).     > -----Original Message-----H > From: Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU [mailto:Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU]% > Sent: Monday, June 26, 2000 8:35 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com - > Subject: RE: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTCd >  > 
 > In article  < > <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD734@berry.mvpsi.com>, ' > John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com> writes: - > > Thanks for the summary.  As for this bit:a > >a  > >>     Someone suggested that + > SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT-H > >> needed to be deleted, followed by a reboot.  I tried that but find,H > >> even with DTSS supposedly disabled, the file gets recreated at bootH > >> and the timezone logicals are the same, PDT values.  I've turned on9 > >> full logging for the system startup but didn't find f > anything helpful.  > > ? > > The DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT file does get magically m > recreated when@ > > you boot so, to do a DST time change when DTSS is disabled, 
 > you have to A > > delete SYS$SYSTEM:DTSS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL.DAT then executev4 > > UTC$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM.  A reboot isn't required. > 9 >         Thanks, John, but I did  just  that.   I first g > deleted the file, ; >     then  I  executed  UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM.  Yes,  after  p > executing  thatp@ >     command  file,  SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL  is   correct    > (but   not@ >     SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME   nor   SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING).   >  But  more; >     importantly (to me), upon rebooting the machine, the r > changes made bypH >     UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM have been lost.  ;-p  That's what I'm fighting. >  >         Next idea? >  >             -Ken > --0 >  Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: ! > Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edur< >  SLAC, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, MS 46  |  Voice:    650-926-2924< >  Menlo Park, CA  94025           |  FAX:      650-926-3515 >  a@ > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------------sD >  These opinions are mine, not SLAC's, Stanford's, nor the DOE's... >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:41:25 -0500u7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>e+ Subject: Re: DECNET-Plus, DTSS, NTP and UTC - Message-ID: <39580645.47DDB85C@earthlink.net>h  l > In article <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD734@berry.mvpsi.com>, John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com> writes: > > ...then execute- > > UTC$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM. >   9 "Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515" wrote: , >     then  I  executed  UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM.  ' Note the differences. Just a thought...e   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemse" http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/j   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 11:23:40 GMTr2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)1 Subject: Re: Deleting system files [...]*.*_old;*2, Message-ID: <8J1B9K$A2F@GAP.CCO.CALTECH.EDU>  R In article <FwMs4s.391@news.boeing.com>, nickerson@pundit.ds.boeing.com () writes: >0A >OpenVMS 7.2-1 on AlphaServer 2100 5/300 with 2.1 Gb system disk;0? >I've just gone through a full update and patch cycle; now thatn@ >things have calmed down I happened to look at the loading of myB >system disk; it's bad - about 2% free = 90K blocks; this is after/ >purging and deleting all non open *.log files;   J It might be worth investing in a larger disk.  Although that system is oldL enough that maybe you'd want to wait and put the money into its replacement.     >jA >so my question is: should I blithely delete [...]*.*_old;* files E >which I've found in great profusion (200k blocks) on my system disk;p= >or is there good reason to hang on to them all - or in part;c    H Assuming that you did an image backup before the update then you're safeL enough removing the _old files.  You can always pull them in again from tapeH if you absolutely had to.  That said, I just replaced the driver for theI Elsa card with the one I had used previously, as the one the 7.2-1 updateyJ installed had at least two bugs, one of which caused the DECwindows serverG to crash. It was certainly convenient being able to do that with a copyaE rather than a retrieval from tape.  Hmm, come to think of it, there'sgH another bug that showed up at the same time with select(), so maybe keep the C RTL bits about too.a  K You might start with purging [...]*.*_old, presumably if you have more thannF one version you have not been using the older ones in quite some time, and so can live without them.    >i@ >any other ideas beyond secondary pagefile and removing sysdump;  B Got space on another disk?  You could back up all the *_old files,; remove the originals, and then maybe compress the save set.t     Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edus> Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:03:24 -0400a, From: "jerome souc" <souje@globetrotter.net>/ Subject: Disponibility of OPenVMS on Vax Systems: Message-ID: <HXM55.21287$NS6.301741@news.globetrotter.net>   Hello,G I would like to see when Compaq stop the support and the availablity ofS OPenVMS on VAX Systems.t" Does anybody have the response ??? Thanks.t Jerome Soucy EDS Systemhouse inc.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 00:37:52 +0200o" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>3 Subject: Re: Disponibility of OPenVMS on Vax Systemd( Message-ID: <8j8lrj$kpu$1@news.IAEhv.nl>  1 The official answer was: not for the near future.MA When VAX/VMS is put in retirement mode it will still be supportede for 5 (or 7) years thereafter.; For the moment VAX/VMS will follow AXP/VMS version releasescE but not much new will get into VAX/VMS. I guess that if a feauture is I not specifically hardware related and the code happens to compile and runtK on VAX/VMS it'll be supported. Anything more difficult than that won't makei it on an official VAX/VMS release.   
 Hans Vlems    + jerome souc heeft geschreven in bericht ...  >Hello,eH >I would like to see when Compaq stop the support and the availablity of >OPenVMS on VAX Systems.# >Does anybody have the response ???o >Thanks.
 >Jerome Soucyu >EDS Systemhouse inc.n >  >s   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:20:36 -0400a5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>o% Subject: Re: Efficient Sleep functionr+ Message-ID: <8j86sm$lag$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>b  C This will never be accurate to 1ms.  First, since the timer is onlywL accutrate to 1ms, your 1ms wait will typically be 2ms.  Next, the actions ofG the system will be to put a timer queue entry onto the queue, and everyDJ clock tick, the queue will be scanned for things to be done - calling yourE AST routine may-or-may-not be the first thing in the queue.  And your H process, since it was blocked waiting for the AST may-or-may-not be in a( state that the AST can fire immediately.  L If you want that type of accuracy, you have little choice but to burn CPU inH a loop, and you'll need to make sure that your process has been setup so  that it doesn't get rescheduled.   _Frede  F bbrzwski@my-deja.com wrote in message <8h0tfs$inp$1@nnrp1.deja.com>...; >We have been having difficulty coming up with an efficient G >Sleep(TimeInMs) function that is accurate to within 1ms. The following-D >is the code we are using and our timing results.  It appears we areG >incurring an overhead of 1ms for every function call but is not due toaH >the actual call on the stack since we ran the sleep in a loop with timeF >to sleep of 0 and received a timing of 30ms for 1000 sleeps.  We have= >tried several different Sleep routines, but we come out withc  >approximately the same timings. >F >System Configuration: >---------------------& >System Type    AlphaServer 2100 5/250  >Cycle Time     4.0 nsec (250Hz) >Pagesize       8192 Byte  >OperatingSys   V7.1-2 >s" >/////////  Code Sample ////////// >#include <lib$routines.h> >#include <starlet.h>J >#include <descrip.h>  >#include <lnmdef.h> >#include <ssdef.h>6 >#include <sleep.hxx>y >I >uint32 SleepAst(uint32 u32Tmp)t >{" >  Flag * pflag = (Flag *) u32Tmp; > 
 >  if (pflag)a >    pflag->Signal();e >  >  return 1; >} >K# >void Sleep(uint32 u32MilliSeconds)e >{ >  uint32 u32Status; >  int64  i64Delay;2 >  Flag   flag;  >4H >  i64Delay = - (ONE_MILLISECOND * u32MilliSeconds); // negative is time >from current time in setimr >-< >  u32Status = sys$setimr(0, &i64Delay, SleepAst, &flag, 0); >e >  if (!(u32Status & 1)) >    lib$stop(u32Status);  >' >  flag.Wait();- >} >-# >/////////  TEST RESULTS //////////5 >6 >call               time slept >----------------------------- >Sleep(1)     2ms6 >Sleep(2)     3ms: >Sleep(10)    10ms >Sleep(100)   101ms- >Sleep(1000)  1001ms >s* >for(int i=1; i<=1000; i++) Sleep(0)  30ms, >for(int i=1; i<=1000; i++) Sleep(1)  1953ms >o3 >Any insight or clues would be greatly appreciated.e >p	 >Brian B.i >  > ' >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/i >Before you buy.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 15:40:55 -0700s! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.comt3 Subject: Found: PC package to make backup of VMS CDTC Message-ID: <OF061DE20C.C9FB125E-ON8825690A.007C98D1@HEALTHNET.COM>   J I've seen several threads here about burning VMS CD's, but never paid themG much attention. Recently, I had occasion to make a backup of one. AftertK trying various well known packages and being disappointed, over the weekendoK I found a shareware PC package that can make a perfect, working backup copynG of a bootable VMS CD. It's called CD Replicator, and can be found here.s  M http://hotfiles.zdnet.com/cgi-bin/texis/swlib/hotfiles/info.html?fcode=0011OVn  J You put the CD in the burner, it reads it to your hard drive, then you putD the blank in instead. It does the standard test pass, burns it, thenK verifies it. It's not fast but it worked first time for me, and was in fact H the only PC package I found which would even admit there was anything on the CD.    Shane   H  #####   ---------------------------------------------------------------I #-O-O-# | Shane underbar S on pacbell dot net. Spam to abuse@127.0.0.1  |dH #  L  #  ---------------------------------------------------------------D  #===#   Don't blame HealthNet for anything I say. They're innocent.H   ###    OpenVMS: The operating system God runs the Earth simulation on.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:34:58 -0500S7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>e7 Subject: Re: Found: PC package to make backup of VMS CDb- Message-ID: <395804C2.89DBB8CF@earthlink.net>S  " Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com wrote: > L > I've seen several threads here about burning VMS CD's, but never paid themI > much attention. Recently, I had occasion to make a backup of one. AfterUM > trying various well known packages and being disappointed, over the weekend M > I found a shareware PC package that can make a perfect, working backup copylI > of a bootable VMS CD. It's called CD Replicator, and can be found here.e > O > http://hotfiles.zdnet.com/cgi-bin/texis/swlib/hotfiles/info.html?fcode=0011OVn > L > You put the CD in the burner, it reads it to your hard drive, then you putF > the blank in instead. It does the standard test pass, burns it, thenM > verifies it. It's not fast but it worked first time for me, and was in factnJ > the only PC package I found which would even admit there was anything on	 > the CD.o  , Try Gear for Windows, http://www.gearcd.com/   --   David J. Dachteray dba DJE Systemsl" http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/p   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:44:43 -0400a5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>t' Subject: Re: General discussion commentr+ Message-ID: <8j889t$m3p$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>o  K Be assured that there is a lot of thought/discussion on the topic.  RMS/ODSaK was a great framework for standardizing file formats for RSX, and then VMS.wE But the UNIX and NT "cached" file systems make VMS look poor - mostlymL because many times the file IO on these systems never hit the disk ever (forJ instance, the UNIX habits of creating and deleting temporary files).  WereL UNIX forced to hit the disk for each write, and protect the integrity of theJ file system in the face of a system crash - then we wouldn't look too bad.@ Unfortunately you don't easily get the option of asking for lessL reliability, and faster performance on VMS IO - short of creating a RAMDISK.L Even cached IO will still end up doing slow things when it has to change the on-disk structure,      $ Jan Vorbrueggen wrote in message ...J >It seems to me that the crucial point is "Tru64 with its more lightweightA >filesystem": that implies, to me, that using RMS naively in thata applicationuI >is a problem, especially if you're programming via, say, the C RTL. In aD1 >sense, you're buying more than you've asked for.A >E > Jan8   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 17:58:34 -0500s7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>ME Subject: Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questionsb- Message-ID: <3957E01A.F285BB5B@earthlink.net>    Phil Tregoning wrote:y >  > Hello, > D > I've just put up a web page describing how to create a native(ish) > VMS command. Have a look atu > ; >   http:\\members.fortunecity.com/twirlip/vms_command.htmld > A > and tell me what you think (anything from typos and bad EnglishR2 > to "No no, you fool, do it again like this..."). > E > While I was writing this, I had a few problems. Some are really foreA > Compaq (Hoff?), and some are about how I am doing things wrong.O > - > 1. Why aren't the developer manuals online? ; >    For example _POLYCENTER_Software_Installation_Utility_PC >    Developer's_Guide_ and _Guide_to_DEC_Module_Management_System_9" >    for_OpenVMS_Systems aren't at > + >       http:\\www.openvms.digital.com:80002 > ? > 2. Is there any way to get status codes into the help message80 >    library so that this works for my messages: > 
 >       $ FOOe' >       %FOO-F-FOOERR, FOO had an errors >       $ HELP /MESSAGEe > E >    At the moment, it only works if you supply the message text like 
 >    this: > 0 >       $ HELP /MESSAGE FOOERR, FOO had an error > F > 3. Is there any way of getting message files searched automatically? > J >    At the moment, if I want to find one my own messages with F$MESSAGE() >    like this:b > 
 >       $ FOOh' >       %FOO-F-FOOERR, FOO had an errorF- >       $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$MESSAGE($STATUS)w' >       %FOO-F-FOOERR, FOO had an errorn > 1 >    I have to first do a SET MESSAGE FOO_MSG.EXES > D > 4. The PCSI PDF module command should be updated to recognise help( >    message files; something like this: > ) >       MODULE FOO.MSGHLP TYPE MESSAGE...t > 2 >    At the moment I have to use EXECUTE commands. > D > 5. What am I doing wrong when I call lib$signal()? I am calling itB >    with the number of FAO arguments as the second parameter like
 >    this: > 0 >        lib$signal(FOOWARN, 2, param1, param2); > F >    But the help doesn't mention anything about passing the number of7 >    FAO directives. Calling it like this doesn't work:i > - >        lib$signal(FOOWARN, param1, param2);  > 0 >    but this is how the manual says to call it. > D > 6. I am assigning status codes (with MESSAGE FOO.MSG) on the buildB >    system, which could lead to duplicates when I come to install& >    FOO on a different target system. > > >    For example, someone could already have installed the BAR >    application, and  >  >       SYS$MESSAGE:FOO.EXE  >       SYS$MESSAGE:BAR.EXE0 > ? >    end up with different messages with the same status codes.l >  >    Is this a problem?g > < >    I tried to get PCSI to generate the status codes duringB >    installation, but my PDF file was getting so nasty I gave up. > " > Thanks for any help or feedback.  C Well, in the first place, URLs use the FORWARD slash ("/"), not the D back-slash. So, I'll have to edit the URL, review the info. and post another reply.   --   David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemsi" http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:05:39 -0500:7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> E Subject: Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questionst- Message-ID: <3957E1C3.166A2B28@earthlink.net>t   Phil Tregoning wrote:b >  > Hello, > D > I've just put up a web page describing how to create a native(ish) > VMS command. Have a look atf > ; >   http:\\members.fortunecity.com/twirlip/vms_command.html  > A > and tell me what you think (anything from typos and bad Englishz2 > to "No no, you fool, do it again like this...").   O.k. Two things:  * 1. Massage FORCEX.CLD into FORCEX_CLD.CLD:  1 	Drop the first two lines, and that should do it.R  E 2. Compile the messages separately and link them into the executable.tG This eliminates the need for the SET MESSAGE command prior to run-time.e6 Not sure how to do that, but that's what you wanna do.  C What you've documented here is the "RIGHT" way to do it, other thanh that.o   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemse" http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/A   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 21:28:07 -0500O) From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net> E Subject: Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questionsb/ Message-ID: <slg3tfl9jev153@corp.supernews.com>   + Phil Tregoning <ptregoni#esoc.esa.de> wroteiB in message news:01bfdf96$b1cf3b20$4b53b083@ptregoni.esoc.esa.de... > Hello, >tD > I've just put up a web page describing how to create a native(ish) > VMS command. Have a look at  >M; >   http:\\members.fortunecity.com/twirlip/vms_command.htmla  7 http://members.fortunecity.com/twirlip/vms_command.html-   >-E > While I was writing this, I had a few problems. Some are really forsA > Compaq (Hoff?), and some are about how I am doing things wrong.o >2- > 1. Why aren't the developer manuals online?h; >    For example _POLYCENTER_Software_Installation_Utility_sC >    Developer's_Guide_ and _Guide_to_DEC_Module_Management_System_ " >    for_OpenVMS_Systems aren't at >0+ >       http:\\www.openvms.digital.com:8000   A I have not yet found an on line reference for MMS or the freeware.I work-a-like MMK that is available at the WKU archive, the FREEWARE CD-ROM  and many other places.@ (MMK from MadGoat Software is designed to take the place of MMS)  K Having the MMS manuals on line would be nice, but MMS is not really part of % OpenVMS, it is an additional product.   3 The POLYCENTER Software ... Developers Guide is at:m  = http://www.openvms.digital.com:8000/72final/5952/5952pro.html0   <snip>  F > 3. Is there any way of getting message files searched automatically?   I am not aware of any.   >lD > 5. What am I doing wrong when I call lib$signal()? I am calling itB >    with the number of FAO arguments as the second parameter like
 >    this: >20 >        lib$signal(FOOWARN, 2, param1, param2); >0F >    But the help doesn't mention anything about passing the number of7 >    FAO directives. Calling it like this doesn't work:  > - >        lib$signal(FOOWARN, param1, param2);o >;0 >    but this is how the manual says to call it.  I The arguments that lib$signal() and lib$stop() are documented best in thet section on condition handling.  L http://www.openvms.digital.com:8000/72final/5841/5841pro_043.html#msg_sequen ce_vaxalphau  < The figure referenced at the URL is where your confusion is.  K For the argument count is used for facility numbers that is greater than 1. I I do not know if that is documented other than by implication that SYSTEMuF condition codes that have facility number of 0 do not have an argumentL associated with them, and that for RMS conditions codes that have a facilityI number of 1, have only one argument, which is actually a SYSTEM conditionr code.y  K So RMS conditions really do not have any arguments, it is just that you areaK expected to signal the underlying system status value with it.  And to maketL it easier on to debug, you would precede it with a user written message that0 explained more clearly what you were attempting.  L There are actually two more arguments available to your FAO message than theL ones passed, and that is the PC and a PSL for VAX or PS for Alpha.  They are  at the end of the signal vector.  J It has been a few years since I coded this type of code, but as I rememberI it, if you signal multiple conditions with LIB$SIGNAL(), and include userhJ condition codes and system ones, order is important as the SYSTEM one must9 be last so that the PC and PS are passed to it correctly.a  < Since the RMS failure condition code is really a SYSTEM code  H This become more important when you are writing a user written conditionI handler where you need to capture and and log all messages, even the onese# that you do not know the format of.n    D > 6. I am assigning status codes (with MESSAGE FOO.MSG) on the buildB >    system, which could lead to duplicates when I come to install& >    FOO on a different target system.  J If you are developing a library to be called by other routines this can beL important.  For standalone images it is not as important.  I have seen thirdK parties register facility codes and such with Compaq, but I do not know theP
 procedure.  L Since as you pointed out, message images are not searched automatically, youJ can manually select the correct one in a command file to display the error message for your image.o     -Johnt wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 23:25:15 -0400 # From: John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com>eE Subject: RE: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questionsoD Message-ID: <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD736@berry.mvpsi.com>   Phil,t  0 Please ignore David's advice (no offence David).  H Your CLD is fine.  A module name and ident are good things (although theJ ident is usually some form of a version number).  I don't think the moduleL and ident are used when the command is inserted into the DCL tables but it's  still good programming practice.  L You are also handling your messages exactly the way you should.  If you wantL to protect against message facility conflicts you should contact the OpenVMSJ Product Registrar and ask to register a facility.  I know of no way aroundH the SET MESSAGE requirement, even Compaq's layered products require that step.o    > >2. Is there any way to get status codes into the help message/ >   library so that this works for my messages:e >n >      $ FOO& >      %FOO-F-FOOERR, FOO had an error >      $ HELP /MESSAGE >oD >   At the moment, it only works if you supply the message text like	 >   this:s >s/ >      $ HELP /MESSAGE FOOERR, FOO had an errory  L Does this work if you start with a SET MESSAGE?  I believe that HELP/MESSAGEI takes the value if the DCL symbol $STATUS and calls SYS$GETMSG to get thenI message ident text.  This won't work if you haven't done the SET MESSAGE.e  C >5. What am I doing wrong when I call lib$signal()? I am calling itnA >   with the number of FAO arguments as the second parameter likei	 >   this:i > / >       lib$signal(FOOWARN, 2, param1, param2);i >nE >   But the help doesn't mention anything about passing the number of 6 >   FAO directives. Calling it like this doesn't work: > , >       lib$signal(FOOWARN, param1, param2); >l/ >   but this is how the manual says to call it.t  H What documentation are you looking at?  The LIB$SIGNAL documentation I'm@ looking at clearly documents the "number-of-arguments" argument.  C It's nice to see someone interested in doing things the "right way"- (whatever way that may be).      > -----Original Message-----> > From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@earthlink.net]% > Sent: Monday, June 26, 2000 7:06 PMl > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComrG > Subject: Re: How to create a native VMS command - and a few questionsm >  >  > Phil Tregoning wrote:n > > 
 > > Hello, > > F > > I've just put up a web page describing how to create a native(ish) > > VMS command. Have a look at> > > = > >   http:\\members.fortunecity.com/twirlip/vms_command.htmln > > C > > and tell me what you think (anything from typos and bad English 4 > > to "No no, you fool, do it again like this..."). >  > O.k. Two things: > , > 1. Massage FORCEX.CLD into FORCEX_CLD.CLD: > 3 > 	Drop the first two lines, and that should do it.2 > G > 2. Compile the messages separately and link them into the executable./@ > This eliminates the need for the SET MESSAGE command prior to  > run-time.-8 > Not sure how to do that, but that's what you wanna do. > E > What you've documented here is the "RIGHT" way to do it, other thani > that.< >  > --   > David J. Dachterai > dba DJE Systems+$ > http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/ > < > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:- > http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 11:28:50 -07000! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com.L Subject: RE: How to install SRM console from alpha firmware version 4.45 o nC Message-ID: <OF0A65D907.5C1E5B0A-ON8825690A.00654C4B@HEALTHNET.COM>a  G I've contacted this guy offline, as I've been through something similar 	 recently.   J I've had an invitation to provide some content for an upcoming private VMSG web site, so it occurred to me that I might start putting together someaJ pages about getting VMS running for the non-system-manager (which though I> hate to admit it, describes me these days). Sound interesting?   Shaneo          ? "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@COMPAQ.COM> on 06/25/2000 09:11:33 AM    To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  cc:d  K Subject:  RE: How to install SRM console from alpha firmware version 4.45 o        n     / Here is a pointer to some online release notes:o  B http://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/Alpha/firmware/readmes/astn200.html: http://ftp.digital.com/pub/DEC/Alpha/firmware/ (main page)   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant,
 Compaq Canada- Professional Servicesb Voice : 613-592-4660 FAX   : 819-772-7036 Email : kerry.main@compaq.com-       -----Original Message-----0 From: gigglegs@aol.com [mailto:gigglegs@aol.com]$ Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2000 12:15 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComtG Subject: How to install SRM console from alpha firmware version 4.45 on-    K ALpha station 200 4/233 system.  I tried putting in the hobbyist cd rom and.J tried installing new firmware on my system.  It doesn't recognize the fileK system.  I am new to this and I don't know what to do...any ideas?  My maineE goal is to actually install open vms to my machine ( which is running' winnt4.01 right now).  Please any help will be appreciated.a   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 16:53:46 -0400a' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> 6 Subject: Re: Latest Compaq mailshot still ignoring VMS( Message-ID: <8j8frj$n0o$1@pyrite.mv.net>  L No, I haven't seen it, but your earlier description (which you might want toH post to bring the newsgroup up to date) gave me the same impression your current one does.u  L This is how I'd like to see VMS operate as well:  stressing its strengths inI its own ads without having to pay lip service and excessive attention (intG your terms, having to 'be sensitive' rather than simply avoiding directoK adverse comparisons) to the rest of Compaq's product set.  Taking advantageWG of whatever increased visibility/credibility generic Alpha (and non-VMSm Compaq executives) can give it.e  G So to my mind there's nothing obviously distressing about the ad you'vehK described - unless there's no similarly aggressive VMS-specific ad campaigne> to point to; if so, then *that's* a legitimate point to raise.   - bill  : Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk> wrote in message0 news:009EC327.A6A23340.2@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk... > > > >aH > > > Why isn't it fair to represent these new servers by presenting all theirw6 > > > capabilities, rather than a limited set of them? > >uI > > For the same reason it's not fair to blame the ad for failing to talks aboutt8 > > the wonders of Win2K, another of Compaq's offerings. > > J > > This is not a generic *Compaq* ad.  Nor is it a generic *Compaq Alpha* ad,fG > > though the wording kind of makes it sound like one.  It's a *Compaqi Alphae? > > Unix* ad, and as such has no particular reason to tout VMS.  > >tE > > So chalk it up in that column, and ask whether the VMS column has,
 comparable" > > entries.  And if not, why not. > > 
 > > - bill >n > Bill,O >l > have you seen it?s > E > It's a GS-server 'ad. Underneath "UNIX SERVER" in inch-high lettersgJ > are pictures of GS320 and other GS boxes. The covering letter comes fromA > someone whose job title is "Alphaserver Business Director", notsE > "Unix Server Business director". He writes a letter screaming "Veryu seriousaG > about UNIX". Throughout his letter, UNIX is capitalized -- that's thea> > print equivalent of screaming, since Unix is not an acronym. >oD > At the very least, it's insensitive, and suggests strongly that heH > hasn't yet heard that Compaq is also "very serious about VMS". There'sE > hundreds of other ways to run such an 'ad, or at the very least thel coveringK > letter could have come from the "Unix Servers director" (who could be ther$ > very same chap wearing a new hat). >  > Nigel. >  >  >p   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:37:47 -0400t, From: "Mat Riain" <mriain@eightinonepet.com>$ Subject: Logging off users remotely?; Message-ID: <lqN55.8403$HD6.243116@iad-read.news.verio.net>   . How do I log off other users from my terminal?   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 12:02:09 -0700e! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.come( Subject: Re: Logging off users remotely?C Message-ID: <OF0FD2E705.475AF4F9-ON8825690A.0068772E@HEALTHNET.COM>_  F You can't log off anybody but yourself without privileges. If you haveG privs, try STOP/ID=xxxx where xxxx is the PID of the process logged in.t   Shanee          > Mat Riain <mriain@eightinonepet.com> on 06/26/2000 11:37:47 AM   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comh cc:   % Subject:  Logging off users remotely?     . How do I log off other users from my terminal?   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 16:02:12 -0300e1 From: "Boyle, Darren" <boyledj@bankofbermuda.com>f( Subject: RE: Logging off users remotely?K Message-ID: <9F664D538536D411BD3200508B6FF01A3334FF@bdant027.bda.bobda.com>   4 Use the below command to obtain help on the topic.     $  HELP  STOP/PROCESS  - Darren   > ----------1 > From: 	Mat Riain[SMTP:mriain@eightinonepet.com] & > Sent: 	Monday, June 26, 2000 3:37 PM > To: 	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com' > Subject: 	Logging off users remotely?t > 0 > How do I log off other users from my terminal? >  >  >     F **********************************************************************C This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential andsJ may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.M They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they2L are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, B please notify the sender immediately and then delete this message.I You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copyingn of this message is prohibited.   Bank of BermudasF **********************************************************************   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 07:02:59 +1200e6 From: "Antony Wardle" <antony.wardle@nospam.met.co.nz>( Subject: Re: Logging off users remotely?2 Message-ID: <eLN55.23591$N4.919450@ozemail.com.au>   stop/id=   antony  5 Mat Riain <mriain@eightinonepet.com> wrote in message 5 news:lqN55.8403$HD6.243116@iad-read.news.verio.net...C0 > How do I log off other users from my terminal? >t >,   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 16:17:24 -0300 1 From: "Boyle, Darren" <boyledj@bankofbermuda.com>t( Subject: RE: Logging off users remotely?K Message-ID: <9F664D538536D411BD3200508B6FF01A333501@bdant027.bda.bobda.com>   ? Sorry that should just be STOP then the process name or /ID=pid. - Darren   > ----------6 > From: 	Boyle, Darren[SMTP:boyledj@BANKOFBERMUDA.COM]& > Sent: 	Monday, June 26, 2000 4:02 PM > To: 	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ > Subject: 	RE: Logging off users remotely?  > 6 > Use the below command to obtain help on the topic.   >  > $  HELP  STOP/PROCESS 
 > - Darren >  > > ----------3 > > From: 	Mat Riain[SMTP:mriain@eightinonepet.com]t( > > Sent: 	Monday, June 26, 2000 3:37 PM > > To: 	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com) > > Subject: 	Logging off users remotely?  > > 2 > > How do I log off other users from my terminal? > >  > >  > >  >  > H > **********************************************************************E > This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential andoL > may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.J > They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom > theyB > are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended
 > recipient,  D > please notify the sender immediately and then delete this message.K > You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copying   > of this message is prohibited. >  > Bank of Bermuda.H > ********************************************************************** >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:56:19 -0300-1 From: "Boyle, Darren" <boyledj@bankofbermuda.com>rG Subject: RE: looking for a list of Canadian companies using Vax systemstK Message-ID: <9F664D538536D411BD3200508B6FF01A3334FB@bdant027.bda.bobda.com>r   > ----------4 > From: 	JF Mezei[SMTP:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca]& > Sent: 	Monday, June 26, 2000 2:36 PM > To: 	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComB > Subject: 	Re: looking for a list of Canadian companies using Vax	 > systemso >  > Jim Kim wrote: > >  > > Hi,\ > > E > > I'm looking for a list of Canadian companies using Vax systems ini	 > Canada.l+ > >  I can't find any information about it.t > C > running VAX systems, opr really USING vax systems ? That is a bign
 > difference.tI > In once case, they just leave the switch on and allow whatever apps aren > leftE > on it to run unattended. In the other, they are actively continuingl > deployment6 > of applications, enhancements etc etc to their apps. > @ > There are many in the first case. And far fewer of the second. >  > > Yeah, but that's what makes VMS so good.  Keep on running baby    F **********************************************************************C This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and J may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.M They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom theyEL are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, B please notify the sender immediately and then delete this message.I You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copying  of this message is prohibited.   Bank of BermudaaF **********************************************************************   ------------------------------  ! Date: Tue, 27 Jun 00 03:20:08 GMT1 From: kshuff@fast.net (kshuff)& Subject: MicroVAX II Free to good home* Message-ID: <8j96h8$11s_001@news.fast.net>   Free to good home    MicroVAX II    16Mb memory(	 TK70 taper (2) RA82 1Gb drives  (1) spare RA82 Ethernet (not sure which card)  L All mounted in a standard 40" DEC cabinet.  System is located in Allentown, M Pa.  Local pickup only to Eastern PA, you will need a pickup truck to haul.  1 Any questions, just ask.  
 Keith Huff   kshuff@fast.netf   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:13:27 -0400 - From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca>1; Subject: Re: My experience with Charon-VAX Hobbyist Editiont/ Message-ID: <slf7cdhmjev113@corp.supernews.com>i  " Timothy Stark wrote in message ... >...@ >I got two files from Kermit ftp site: vmsmit.hex and vmsdeh.mar files.? >First I transmitted vmsmit.hex successfully.  Now I have a bigo problem F >with 'vmsdeh.mar' transmit.  I kept to get overrun errors.  I tried a few D >times again but it resulted the same!  Yes, it always bombed out at same >line after .EVEN ...n > F >Does anyone successfully transmit vmsdeh.mar into Charon system?  ...   Yes, I have.  E Did you make sure to do the SET TERM/TTSYNC/HOSTSYNC before doing the  CREATE VMSDEF.MAR?  C You may also have to change the ALTYPAHD and TYPAHDSZ parameters aslF the KERMIT installation instructions recommend. I changed the ALTYPAHDF out of habit when I installed VMS (some habits never go away) but I do not know if that was necessary.G  C I did find that if the PC did anything else (even starting a screenoE saver) then I could get a buffer overrun so it took about three triestD before the VMSMIT.HEX was transmitted, but the .MAR file transmitted with no problems at all.  > I do find that connecting to Charon-VAX from IP does crash theB emulator from time to time, and every time (2 times to be exact) IB tried connecting to the emulator using KERMIT it has crashed. I am1 going to try it again after I reboot my PC later.      -- Peter Weaver   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 11:35:02 -0700s! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.comr; Subject: Re: My experience with Charon-VAX Hobbyist EditionoC Message-ID: <OF11926C1A.CA36F1FE-ON8825690A.0065EADD@HEALTHNET.COM>e  G I've recently had some luck using just "CREATE xxx.MAR", and using a PCcH terminal emulator to cut-and-paste into the terminal window. Admittedly,D that's on a serial console connection to a real VMS machine, but I'd< imagine it would work for charon-vax if it runs in a window.   Shanet          I "Larry D Bohan, Jr" <LBohan@dbc.spam_less..com> on 06/25/2000 10:09:00 AMm   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come cc:j  < Subject:  Re: My experience with Charon-VAX Hobbyist Edition    / On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 04:39:43 GMT, Timothy Stark3# <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org> wrote:e    G >I got two files from Kermit ftp site: vmsmit.hex and vmsdeh.mar files.eG >First I transmitted vmsmit.hex successfully.  Now I have a big problem J >with 'vmsdeh.mar' transmit.  I kept to get overrun errors.  I tried a fewI >times again but it resulted the same!  Yes, it always bombed out at samec >line after .EVEN ...l > J >Does anyone successfully transmit vmsdeh.mar into Charon system?  I am soE >stuck with crippled hobbyist edition because SRI kept Hobbyists fromtE >access network and tape units.  That is much difficult to import andE4 >export data without network and tape handlings. :-(  < when needing a 'ascii' upload of this sort, (but not Charon)1 I had better luck uploading to a TPU session, ands4 possibly with the typeahead SYSGEN params bumped up. ie, 
  TTY_TYPAHDSZr
  TTY_ALTYPAHD   - but since you're probably upload to a console : device (OPA0:) maybe also try setting the baud-rate lower, if possible.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 11:21:09 -0700 * From: Matt Evans <evans@hydrogen.ucsc.edu>1 Subject: Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming question 1 Message-ID: <39579F15.C0BA976A@hydrogen.ucsc.edu>o   Thanks for replying so quickly! 8 We are running DEC C v5.6-003 on OpenVMS Alpha v7.1-1H1.  . Oddly enough, when I tried the following code:   #include <stdio.h> #include <limits.h>  #include <math.h>l #ifndef CHAR_BIT #define CHAR_BIT 8 #endif  % void bit_print(unsigned long long a);s  
 int main() {   unsigned long long junk = 1;t  
  junk <<= 63;t    printf(" >> main\n");   printf(" junk = %llx\n", junk); printf(" junk = %Li\n", junk);  bit_print( junk );     printf("\n << main\n");
  return 0; }   $ void bit_print(unsigned long long a) {e  int i;m.  int n= sizeof(unsigned long long) * CHAR_BIT;.  unsigned long long mask = 0x8000000000000000;    for (i= 1; i <= n; ++i ) { *   putchar(((a & mask) == 0) ? '0' : '1' );
   a <<= 1;!   if (i % CHAR_BIT == 0 && i < n)n    putchar(' ');  } }e  K it works like you have described.  However, if I replace "junk <<= 63" with:L "junk = 1 << 63", it does not work properly where I thought it should be theH equivalent.  Is this the wrong thing to do (or is my C ignorance shining	 through)?w   -Matte   Dan Sugalski wrote:   . > At 09:59 AM 6/26/00 -0700, Matt Evans wrote:H > >I have just begun experimentation with 64-bit unsigned long long dataG > >types.  I am normally a UNIX programmer and I am somewhat unfamiliardI > >with the the OpenVMS environment (specifically, 64-bit C programming)..D > >My question (and statement) is that I can't seem to get the shiftJ > >operators to work, i.e. 1<<63 does not give a correct result, it simplyK > >gives zero.  The shift operator only seems to work with shifts less thantH > >32 bits.  However, I can create a bitmask (example 0x8000000000000000B > >which is the hexadecimal equivalent of the 64th bit) and use itF > >successfully.  I just can't seem to get the shift operators to work? > >corectly with the 64 bit unsigned long longs.  Please help!?l >p
 > Well, this:  >  >   #include <stdio> >   #include <stdlib>d >y >   void main () {! >     unsigned long long foo = 1;a >     foo <<= 63;0" >     printf("foo is %Li\n", foo); >   }h >. > produces this: >w >    foo is 9223372036854775808a >rK > so it works for me. What's the code look like, and what version of Dec C?H >T- >                                         Dana >'K > --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------r4 > Dan Sugalski                          even samuraiA > dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and even = >                                       teddy bears get drunkc   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 11:25:01 -0700 * From: Matt Evans <evans@hydrogen.ucsc.edu>1 Subject: Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming questionn1 Message-ID: <39579FFD.87854E25@hydrogen.ucsc.edu>i  D Disregard last email.  The fix was to typecast the statement "junk = (unsigned long long) 1 << 63".  
 Thanks again!    -Mattp   Dan Sugalski wrote:p  . > At 09:59 AM 6/26/00 -0700, Matt Evans wrote:H > >I have just begun experimentation with 64-bit unsigned long long dataG > >types.  I am normally a UNIX programmer and I am somewhat unfamiliar6I > >with the the OpenVMS environment (specifically, 64-bit C programming).aD > >My question (and statement) is that I can't seem to get the shiftJ > >operators to work, i.e. 1<<63 does not give a correct result, it simplyK > >gives zero.  The shift operator only seems to work with shifts less than H > >32 bits.  However, I can create a bitmask (example 0x8000000000000000B > >which is the hexadecimal equivalent of the 64th bit) and use itF > >successfully.  I just can't seem to get the shift operators to work? > >corectly with the 64 bit unsigned long longs.  Please help!?  >n
 > Well, this:  >h >   #include <stdio> >   #include <stdlib>a >  >   void main () {! >     unsigned long long foo = 1;0 >     foo <<= 63;r" >     printf("foo is %Li\n", foo); >   }j >: > produces this: >i >    foo is 9223372036854775808- > K > so it works for me. What's the code look like, and what version of Dec C?i >o- >                                         Dane >rK > --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------i4 > Dan Sugalski                          even samuraiA > dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and even = >                                       teddy bears get drunkr   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:42:10 -0400p( From: Ed Vogel <edward.vogel@compaq.com>1 Subject: Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming questionp* Message-ID: <3957A401.1E86F5BA@compaq.com>   Matt Evans wrote:n  ! > Thanks for replying so quickly!n: > We are running DEC C v5.6-003 on OpenVMS Alpha v7.1-1H1. >   <     You should consider upgrading your compiler.   While theC      V5.6 compiler accepted 1 << 63, the V5.7 (and later) compilers@C      will output a warning for this construct.   This warning woulde       have saved you some effort.  >      As you note, the fix is to cast the 1 to a long long int.-      Another option would be to use 1ll << 63i    7                                                Ed VogeliC                                                Compaq C Engineeringn   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 15:30:03 -0400*" From: Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org>1 Subject: Re: OpenVMS Alpha C programming question : Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.0.20000626152616.00c7b100@24.8.96.48>  , At 11:21 AM 6/26/00 -0700, Matt Evans wrote:L >it works like you have described.  However, if I replace "junk <<= 63" withM >"junk = 1 << 63", it does not work properly where I thought it should be the I >equivalent.  Is this the wrong thing to do (or is my C ignorance shiningE
 >through)?  L C ignorance. 1 isn't a 64-bit constant--it's a 32-bit one. You need to tell I the compiler it's really a 64-bit constant. Tack on an "LL" suffix (i.e. s 1LL << 63) to force it.    					Dan  I --------------------------------------"it's like this"-------------------e2 Dan Sugalski                          even samurai? dan@sidhe.org                         have teddy bears and evene;                                       teddy bears get drunk    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 00:57:31 GMT % From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@dialupnet.com> 7 Subject: Re: OpenVMS clusters vs other systems clustersh8 Message-ID: <alufls4uqf0sne4e0cqfn4smh068hm4129@4ax.com>  E On Wed, 21 Jun 2000 01:01:26 -0400, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>- wrote:  L >VMS has no lock on high availability any more - well, it never did, but nowM >its competition includes 'standard' Unix and even Windows environments.  ThelK >eagerness with which customers are accepting such solutions makes it clearsM >that VMS's advantages, real though they may be, are not decisive compared to1H >other considerations (in other words, the competition offers *adequate*7 >availability plus many attractions that VMS does not).2 >0  E To be completely fair, many of the reasons that VMS lost what hold itoC did have on the market was because of all the marketing lies (snake 1 oil) that the Unix segment was putting out there.   E Just look at how long they've been at it - since, what, 1988 or so? -nD and they've just barely gotten the feet wet in what mission critical means.  1 Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaq-- (get rid of the xxxx in my address to e-mail)0   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 21:43:19 -0500c7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>8# Subject: OpenVMS Information Center7- Message-ID: <395814C7.DB719C87@earthlink.net>t  C If you visit http://www.openvms.com/ you'll find that my boss (Mark-= Levy) and I are building this site into (yet another) OpenVMStA Information site. We're looking for contributions of information,uE especially links to sources of commercial software for OpenVMS. We'vesH tried to include a good number of other links also, such as freeware andE tips and tricks for OpenVMS. I added a link to charon-vax last time Id was in the office, also.  F Eventually, I'll be moving all my freeware to that site as I update myA DJE Systems website this summer. I'm still considering setting upnG www.djesys.com on Mark's server and moving all my non-personal pages toh that site. We'll see.   C Anyway, if you have a link or some info. to include on openvms.com, C please write me (drop the .nospam from the reply-to address in thisnD post) or to Mark (find his address on the openvms.com home page). OfD course, I do read and post here, so you can also post your info. and6 I'll take it to the office with me to put on the site.  D Remember: OpenVMS is a trademark and the property of Compaq Computer Corporation.   -- r David J. DachteraD dba DJE Systems." http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/s   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:55:06 +0000 (GMT)-, From: Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com>' Subject: Re: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMSn4 Message-ID: <20000626205506.67418.qmail@hotmail.com>  F The 8.1.6 for Alpha VMS is definitely orderable. I just received mine.F According to Oracle, it has been complete for almost two months but itC has approximately a 6 week lead time to make it to "manufacturing".S   Bill McLaughlinE     >-----Original Message----- 5 >From: John Nixon [mailto:jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net]c$ >Sent: Monday, June 26, 2000 9:45 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com$ >Subject: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMS >H > I >I have heard that this has now been made available to Compaq and will ber& >orderable by the customers very soon. >,& >As they say,  Better late than never. >vH >If they make it before July, then the target date of April will have at >least >been in the same quarter. >  >  >  >   H ________________________________________________________________________H Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Jun 2000 14:27:00 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett)e' Subject: Re: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMS , Message-ID: <RdDctYK+aCc2@malvm2.mala.bc.ca>  5 In article <20000626205506.67418.qmail@hotmail.com>, t1    Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com> writes:s  H > The 8.1.6 for Alpha VMS is definitely orderable. I just received mine.  @    Exactly where is it orderable from? I tried to order one lastD week ( from Oracle ) and was told "it's not ready yet". I guess it'sH orderable in the sense they said they'd send me one when it's ready, but; they didn't give any firm indication of when that might be.r   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 22:31:36 +0000 (GMT)g, From: Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com>' Subject: Re: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMS 4 Message-ID: <20000626223136.70756.qmail@hotmail.com>  J I called 800-223-1711, gave them my CSI and said I wanted to order 8.0.5. ? The person at Oracle told me that 8.1.6 was available so I saidt
 send that.  G It seems to depend a lot on who you talk to. The last couple of Oracle nL people I've talked to have been pretty helpful and knowledgable, but before K that I had problems. One person even told me that "Oracle for VMS is being i de-supported..."  K But the more knowledgable people say just the opposite-- that they seem to rF be ramping up again so VMS will really be a first tier platform again.   Bill McLaughliny     >  >a >-----Original Message----- 5 >From: John Nixon [mailto:jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net]a$ >Sent: Monday, June 26, 2000 9:45 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com$ >Subject: oracle 8.1.6 for Alhpa VMS >  >*I >I have heard that this has now been made available to Compaq and will bem& >orderable by the customers very soon. >e& >As they say,  Better late than never. >rH >If they make it before July, then the target date of April will have at >least >been in the same quarter. >i >t >h >t  H ________________________________________________________________________H Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 15:57:01 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>*O Subject: Re: Powerstorm 300/350, Open3D, New Alpha workstations and PEX support-+ Message-ID: <8j8chf$pv5$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>0  G Vance R. Haemmerle wrote in message <8j7332$euu@gap.cco.caltech.edu>...g" >Software:  OpenVMS Alpha V7.1-1H2 >           Open3D V4.4t >oI >1) I recently saw the announcement of support for the PowerStorm 300 and H >   350 graphics adaptors on OpenVMS.  The announcement says the supportI >   is for OpenVMS V7.2-1.  The release notes mention 3D support, howeveryH >   the most recent version of Open3D says it supports 7.1, not 7.2.  SoG >   does this mean that Open3D V4.9A runs under VMS V7.2-1?  If so, can-K >   Open3D V4.4 also?  You can see where I'm going... can I use Open3D V4.4vL >   to get the PEX extension to work on current hardware (Powerstorm 300/3501 >   and XP1000 or DS20E) and current OS (V7.2-1)?  >o    J We are no longer creating seperate media kits for 3D adapters (that is, noL more new device support in Open3D).  The P300/350 support is available as anE OpenVMS patch for V7.1-2 and V7.2-1 (on the public website), it is ineF V7.2-1H2 and eventually in V7.3.  It will FIS (Factory Install) in newI hardware, and will be on a CD in the box with the P300/350 when purchasedn
 ala-carte.  < Open3D V4.9A will run on any V7.1-2 or later version of VMS.  J The PEX client libraries will continue to be supplied with the Open3D kit.J But *new* hardware will not support it.  New hardware using PHIGS will useI the OpenGL driver.  So to make use of PEX, you would need to find antiquehD graphics hardware like the ZLXp-L1/2 or the 3D30/4D20.  Support willJ continue to ship for these devices in the Open3D kit.  However, unless youL are *directly* using PEX, as opposed to PHIGS - I'd suggest ignoring PEX and using the OpenGL PHIGS driver.  H >2) If not, and I have to upgrade to V7.1-2 and stay there to run Open3D V4.4G >   and have PEX, can the Alphastation XP1000 and/or DS20E use the 4D20s graphics  adaptor? >o  I  Yes.  If you can find one.  It is supported.  We no longer sell them, ashF the maker of the ASIC and video memory put the components to EOL.  YouG can/should/must use V4.9A.  The support is still there for it.  Really.-  $ >3) Why the dropping of PEX support? >0   Uh...  Because PHIGS is dead?e  L Seriously.  PHIGS is no longer the 3D library of choice.  OpenGL is, and hasI been for a number of years.  The former Alpha Workstation Group here (now H defunct) had in fact removed both PHIGS and GKS from the pricebook.  BUTL because of the number of OpenVMS users with PHIGS and GKS applications - VMSH managed to bring it out of retirement into a maintenance mode that stillH allows it to be purchased and supported, with no new active development.G The UNIX group wasn't so swift, and they no longer have any support foro PHIGS & GKS.  E No PHIGS - no reason for PEX.  Of course, one of the last things thatnJ happened when PHIGS was still in active development was the implementationE of the OpenGL "driver" for PHIGS.  This gets you a 3D pipeline to the K server, using OpenGL - which is the defacto UNIX 3D standard today.  NobodyhF in the industry is supporting PEX (or even PHIGS) any more, VMS is theE exception as far as I can tell - and we are not supporting PEX on new 	 hardware.e  L If you are really using PEX directly instead of through PHIGS, then you are,F as they say SOL.  You better grab up all the 4D20's you can hunt down.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 11:55:52 GMTT= From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.383428.killspam.00bd (Wayne Sewell)o= Subject: Re: Pricing of hardware/software for hobbist/studentt. Message-ID: <D15VTLVEI3P8@TACHXXSOFTXXCONSULT>  ` In article <B57A6D2A-7D4EB@165.247.44.7>, "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> writes:C > On Sat, Jun 24, 2000 12:11 PM, Matt Morley <matt@mpcm.org> wrote:lH >>I just graduated high school and will be attending a community college >>in the Fall. >>E >>I've spent just over the last year working part time for a softwareEI >>company (Software Partners) that writes backup/restore/media managementeI >>for VMS (amoung many things). I've been doing testing on other projectsp, >>and doing web/network related stuff there. > J > I used their Thruway product many years ago.  I don't know if it's stillI > around.  It's pretty much been superseded by the TMSCP server in recentH > versions of VMS.  E It is *if* you are running in a cluster.  If your machines are merely I networked, thruway still has a purpose, since it requires only decnet (or;M optionally tcp in the recent versions).  A group of vms machines that are not O clustered is not unheard of, given the recent threads about the cost of clustero	 licences.     J A few years back, I did some contract work at a site that had some type ofK phobia about clustering, I don't know why.   I don't think it was a license H cost issue.  Anyway, they had some fairly large vaxen, but they were not< clustered.  So these people were fairly heavy thruway users.     Wayne  --O =============================================================================== M Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738  wayne@tachysoft.xxxC8 http://www.tachysoft.xxx/www/tachyon.html and wayne.htmlK change .xxx to .com in addresses above, assuming you are not a spambot  :-)nO ===============================================================================UO Otter, on dining with Bluto:"It's perfectly safe if you keep your arms and legs  			away from his mouth."   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 23:08:52 +0200e) From: "Salvi Schrijen" <salvi@freeler.nl>e Subject: Re: print que problemsi8 Message-ID: <8j8cmh$sdp$1@rubidium.news.lion-access.net>   Hi thereJ I have seen this problem before on a terminalserver 700 with a HPlaserjet3
 connected.? The solution of this problem was to set the portsettings of thetJ terminalserver inputflowcontrol to none and to ignore the RTS/CTS signals.L The problem is related to a impropper handling of the x-on/x-off protocol in the printer.@ This can cause the VMS printqueue to enter in a "stopped" state. Hope this helps.   Salvi Schrijen Libertel Network The Netherlandso s.schrijen-nospam-@libertel.nl  6 Yulian Memolis <yulian_m@percite.com> wrote in message* news:8j70oc$hea$1@news.netvision.net.il...I > Hello, i am running OpenVMS7.1 on an Alpha System, and i have a problem  with > print queuesL > that even Digital / Compaq support can't solve, so maybe someone out thereL > has encountered a similar problem (and found a solution). The situation isD > this: several printers (standard) are spooled and connected to the computerJ > through a standard terminal server; Regular data processing applicationsJ > send printouts to the print queues. There is nothing out of the ordinary inJ > the system startup procedures, and there is no explicit STOP/QUE commandL > anywhere in the system. Yet, from time to time, as a daily event even, andH > in different printers, they enter a STOPPED queue status. I would very muchI > to know if anyone knows what can cause a print que to be stopped (othert than > an explicit command).b >u > Thank you. > ' > Please reply to: yulian_m@percite.comg >m >a >I >    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 22:28:25 GMT6/ From: StevenU@POBoxes.com (Steven P. Underwood)m Subject: Re: print que problemst4 Message-ID: <3957d6c1.75072175@news.ma.ultranet.com>  D I have seen similiar problems a few years ago when I was doing field( service.  This case was network related.  F In this instance, the customer was running 10B2 cabling to DS200's andD someone (we never did find out who) decided to extend the run to theD far end of the factory for a different piece of equipment.  They hadC extended the run beyond the (300m?) physical limit of 10B2 etherneteB and the terminal servers seemed to lose the connection to the VAX.D This put the queues into a stopped state.  The terminals on that legC just seemed to pause intermittantly (which is how we discovered the < solution) when this was eventually brought to our attention.  
 Good luck,   Stevel      4 On Mon, 26 Jun 2000 10:30:21 +0200, "Yulian Memolis" <yulian_m@percite.com> wrote:   M >Hello, i am running OpenVMS7.1 on an Alpha System, and i have a problem with 
 >print queues K >that even Digital / Compaq support can't solve, so maybe someone out theretK >has encountered a similar problem (and found a solution). The situation is L >this: several printers (standard) are spooled and connected to the computerI >through a standard terminal server; Regular data processing applicationsCL >send printouts to the print queues. There is nothing out of the ordinary inI >the system startup procedures, and there is no explicit STOP/QUE command.K >anywhere in the system. Yet, from time to time, as a daily event even, andrL >in different printers, they enter a STOPPED queue status. I would very muchM >to know if anyone knows what can cause a print que to be stopped (other thano >an explicit command). >o >Thank you.  > & >Please reply to: yulian_m@percite.com >  >g >n >n   Steven P. Underwood,DNRC Whitinsville,MA< StevenU@POBoxes.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 16:33:52 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>-B Subject: Re: ramdisk vs. file cache, and the winner is, file cache+ Message-ID: <8j8emi$qdr$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>V  E Remove the printf's to eliminate text output speed.  Just capture the0
 elapsed time.4      A David Mathog wrote in message <8hug3h$s81@gap.cco.caltech.edu>...vF >I had to do some system maintenance this weekend and thought that I'dF >revisit the file caching performance issue by installing a ramdisk onG >my system.  So after 2.3 was installed I ran the programs which followu? >my signature on a 32 Mb RAMdisk on a DS10, with these results:. >u
 >$ r maketest   >$ mysplit:==$mda0:[temp]mysplit >$ create testsplit.com  >$ sho times >$ define/user sys$output nla0:	 >$ mysplit test.nfa 200- >$ sho time- >^Z-
 >$ @testsplit" >  10-JUN-2000 15:03:22  >  10-JUN-2000 15:03:23  > 8 >(delta varied between 1 and 2 seconds in multiple runs) >t >$ sho dev mda0e > K >Disk SEQAXP$MDA0:, device type RAM Disk, is online, mounted, file-oriented- >    device, shareable.  >,= >    Error count                    0    Operations completedm 2164982 >    Owner process                 ""    Owner UIC [SYSMGR,SYSTEM]u1 >    Owner process ID        00000000    Dev Prot  S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G:R,W-< >    Reference count                1    Default buffer size 512k: >    Total blocks               64000    Sectors per track 64< >    Total cylinders               32    Tracks per cylinder 32 >.? >    Volume label              "MDA0"    Relative volume numbero 0m: >    Cluster size                   3    Transaction count 1,> >    Free blocks                62700    Maximum files allowed 80004 >    Extend quantity                5    Mount count 1n3 >    Mount status              System    Cache namee "_SEQAXP$DKA0:XQPCACHE"a1 >    Volume owner UIC [SYSMGR,SYSTEM]    Vol Prota S:RWCD,O:RWCD,G:RWCD,W:RWCDa >tH >  Volume Status:  ODS-2, subject to mount verification, file high-water marking, >      caching is disabled.- >nG >That's MUCH faster than I could ever achieve by RMS tuning, but oddly,w@ >STILL not as fast as the same code run on Linux on an otherwiseE >similar DS10.  It runs there about 2-3X faster as judged by the rate-C >at which the names of the created files scroll by (it completes in A >under a second, so hard to time it precisely.)  This is when theOG >mysplit program is run without suppressing the messages.  A small parttD >of the speed difference may be a longer image activation on the VMSG >side, but once it gets rolling it is clearly taking longer per file onm >the OpenVMS end.  I tried >o >$ set RMS/extend=204i >uG >(the size of the output files) but that didn't speed things up at all. F >Caching was disabled already (it's pointless when going to a RAMDISK,? >isn't it?).  Turning off highwater marking didn't help either.t >  >So this is the situation: >   >OS             OpenVMS    Linux% >Version        7.2-1      RedHat 6.2J >Machine        DS10       DS10m% >input file     ramdisk    file caches% >output files   ramdisk    file cachem% >program        ramdisk    file cache') >C RTL          disk       file cache (?)o# >compiler       Compaq C   Compaq C * >version        V6.2-007   ccc-6.2.9.002-2/ >Run time       1-2        0.5        (seconds)h >aG >So why does OpenVMS STILL run slower than Linux?  While 2-3X slower is,B >certainly better than the 100X slower it registered "vanilla" theC >result seems very wrong because CPU intensive programs usually runpG >within a few percent of each other on the two platforms, and here I've B >essentially reduced this disk IO application to a pure CPU/memory: >application, and yet there's still a 2-3 fold difference. >nE >I wonder if it may not be related to the earlier result in my TCP/IP,G >tests, where TCP/IP services sending data through a pipe to itself didi/ >so slower than Linux did - by a similar ratio.  >sF >Anybody care to speculate about what accounts for the remaining large >difference in the performance?s >e	 >Regards,. >c
 >David Mathogl >mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu? >Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Calteche > G >**********************************************************************  >F >/* MAKETEST.CE >   makes a 16000 entry fasta file, each containing a 500 bp sequence  >*/T >#include <stdlib.h> >#include <stdio.h>8 >6 >void main(void){ 	 >int i,j; 
 >FILE *fd; >   fd=fopen("test.nfa","w");  >   for(i=0; i< 16000; i++){* >      (void) fprintf(fd,">test%.4d\n",i); >      for(j=0; j < 10; j++){. >         (void)C fprintf(fd,"AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA\n");  >      } >   }  >} >.G >**********************************************************************_ >_ >/*  MYSPLIT.C6 >quicky program.  It splits a fasta file into a series5 >of new files at N line intervals.  First argument isa5 >the filename and second is the number of entries pera? >file fragment.  Single long sequence lines will not be handledM) >properly if they exceed the buffer size.c >*/  >n >#include <stdlib.h> >#include <stdio.h>l >#include <unistd.h> >#define MYMAXSTRING 100000 " >int main(int argc, char *argv[]){ >char *infile; >char *outfile;  >char root[]="frag"; >char bigstring[MYMAXSTRING];o >char outname[200];n >int  n,count,fragcount; >FILE *fin;l >FILE *fout; >  >"
 >  fout=NULL;  >  fragcount=0;s >  count=0;d >  n=0;e: >  if(argc != 3 || (sscanf(argv[2],"%d",&n)==EOF) || n<1){J >    (void) printf("Usage:  mysplit infile N, where N is number of entries perfragment\n");
 >    exit(0);G >  } >  infile=argv[1];7 >  (void) printf("Processing %s with n=%d\n",infile,n);l >  >  fin=fopen(infile,"r");2 >  if(fin==NULL){o; >   (void) printf("Could not open input file %s\n",infile);d
 >    exit(0);d >  }4 >  while( fgets(bigstring,MYMAXSTRING,fin) != NULL){ >    if(bigstring[0] == '>'){  >      count--;d >      if(count<=0){ >         count = n; >         fragcount++;% >         if(fout!=NULL)fclose(fout);k7 >         (void) sprintf(outname,"frag%.3d",fragcount); < >         (void) printf("Opening output file %s\n",outname);$ >         fout = fopen(outname,"w"); >      } >    }) >    (void) fprintf(fout,"%s",bigstring);i >  }J >  (void) printf("All done, entries in final file segment: %d\n",n-count); >  exit(1);g >}   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 14:14:43 -0400n+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>A Subject: RE: TP_server processJ Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284483@kaoexc4.kao.dec.com>  > Also, check to see if  SYS$DECDTM_INHIBIT is defined to = YES.   $ show log SYS$DECDTM_INHIBITe  F If this logical is defined, it will inhibit the TP_SERVER process from4 starting up. It is usually defined in SYLOGICALS.COM   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant,
 Compaq Canada_ Professional Services_ Voice : 613-592-4660 FAX   : 819-772-7036 Email : kerry.main@compaq.comc       -----Original Message-----6 From: Boyle, Darren [mailto:boyledj@bankofbermuda.com]# Sent: Monday, June 26, 2000 1:52 PMc To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt Subject: RE: TP_server process    I Have a look at SYS$STARTUP:DECDTM$STARTUP.COM.  You may wish to call thisaC command file from SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM, also don't forget to also callg# DECDTM$SHUTDOWN from SYSHUTDWN.COM.  - Darren   > ----------4 > From: 	ezzaoudi med[SMTP:m.ezzaoudi@digitem.co.ma]& > Sent: 	Monday, June 26, 2000 2:31 PM > To: 	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: 	TP_server process  >  > Hi > 5 > I have 2 Alpha in OpenVMS Cluster. It 's work fine.e > OpenVMS 7.2-1. > TCP/IP V 5.02A.eJ > I have a PC application that use ODBC for communicating with the alphas. >   > A conexion with ALPHA_1 is OK., > When I try it with ALPHA_2 , It 's failed.A > The cause is the " non existing process TP_SERVER " in ALPHA_2.k  > This process exist in ALPHA_1. > , > How can I creat this process in ALPHA_2 ?? >  > BY.o >  >  >  >     F **********************************************************************C This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential andpJ may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.H They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom theyL are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, B please notify the sender immediately and then delete this message.I You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copyingn of this message is prohibited.   Bank of BermudanF **********************************************************************   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:33:12 +0000.- From: ezzaoudi med <m.ezzaoudi@digitem.co.ma>c Subject: Re: TP_server process- Message-ID: <3957A1E8.EF1D32A9@digitem.co.ma>d  	 Thank you'
 I will try iti By   "Boyle, Darren" a =E9crit :d  F > Have a look at SYS$STARTUP:DECDTM$STARTUP.COM.  You may wish to cal= l thisE > command file from SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM, also don't forget to also callt% > DECDTM$SHUTDOWN from SYSHUTDWN.COM.s
 > - Darren >i > > ----------= > > From:         ezzaoudi med[SMTP:m.ezzaoudi@digitem.co.ma]n/ > > Sent:         Monday, June 26, 2000 2:31 PMa > > To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comp# > > Subject:      TP_server process  > >  > > Hi > >i7 > > I have 2 Alpha in OpenVMS Cluster. It 's work fine.  > > OpenVMS 7.2-1. > > TCP/IP V 5.02A.iF > > I have a PC application that use ODBC for communicating with the = alphas.h > >k" > > A conexion with ALPHA_1 is OK.. > > When I try it with ALPHA_2 , It 's failed.C > > The cause is the " non existing process TP_SERVER " in ALPHA_2. " > > This process exist in ALPHA_1. > >i. > > How can I creat this process in ALPHA_2 ?? > >l > > BY.i > >b > >c > >  > >u >rF > *******************************************************************= ***yE > This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential andfF > may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legis= lation.nF > They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to=
  whom theyF > are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended re= cipient,D > please notify the sender immediately and then delete this message.F > You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or c= opying  > of this message is prohibited. >f > Bank of BermudanF > *******************************************************************= ***    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:02:56 GMT-2 From: dilalo@aesop.rutgers.edu (Gregory J. DiLalo)L Subject: Transparent login to another cluster node using DECnet Task-to-Task1 Message-ID: <009EC310.74F16698@aesop.rutgers.edu>s  N Does anyone have a DCL or C script they would be willing to share for doing a K transparent interactive login from one member of a heterogeneous cluster to4J another using DECnet Task-To-Task and a shared sysuaf?  I have a node thatJ runs a very expensive database application that we can't afford to clusterI license.  I want to log users of that application in and out of that nodenJ without the need for them to re-enter their username and password and make access look seamless.   P -------------------------------------+------------------------------------------N Gregory J. DiLalo                    | Voice (Work):   (732) 932-1100 Ext. 411F Management Information Services      | Voice (Home):   (732) 257-6969 E Cook College/NJAES                   | FAX:            (732) 932-8887.O Rutgers, The State University of NJ  | Internet:       dilalo@aesop.rutgers.edurP -------------------------------------+------------------------------------------   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 13:12:46 -0700d3 From: Jojimbo <jgesslingNOjgSPAM@yahoo.com.invalid>eP Subject: Re: Transparent login to another cluster node using DECnet Task-to-Task9 Message-ID: <03c4f0ce.3e8da7b5@usw-ex0104-033.remarq.com>s  8 Try looking for DRLOGIN from Hunter Goatley et.al.  It's3 very nice and seems like it could do what you want.i  < Look in:   http://montagar.com/decus_swlib/VMS95A/TK/DRLOGIN   Jim=      7 Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.l Up to 100 minutes free!t http://www.keen.coma   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:28:12 GMTt From: mccrobie@my-deja.com Subject: UP1100 & OpenVMSu) Message-ID: <8j87b8$nho$1@nnrp1.deja.com>=  F My understanding is that the UP1100 (not a typo) from Alpha Processor,H Inc. will have SRM support.  Will OpenVMS and Tru64 be supported on this motherboard?    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.u   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 21:03:16 -0400:6 From: "Michael A. Foley" <mike.foley@technologist.com> Subject: Re: UP1100 & OpenVMSi8 Message-ID: <53T55.229500$MB.4146752@news6.giganews.com>  ?     The UP1100 is a 600MHz 2MB cache ATX Alpha motherboard. ThewC     EV67 CPU is soldered down on the board. The system has a 64-bito?     wide memory bandwidth. It comes with onboard ATA-66, 16-bittD     audio and onboard 10/100 ethernet (DE500). It is also one of twoH     Alpha motherboards with AGP graphics. The other board is the UP1000,D     also from API. The core logic chipset is the AMD 751, same as K7     motherboards..  E     API is not Compaq and VMS  is a Compaq operating system. There is$=     no UP1x00 SYSLOA. I don't think anyone up in VMS has one.1  C     You can get an SRM update for the UP1000, if you have one. It'st;      for Linux support, so one doesn't have to use MILO or,o6     for the UP1000, APB, to boot Linux from AlphaBIOS.  6     See our web page for the SRM update to the UP1000."     http://www.alpha-processor.com   mikeC                                                                 APIn Technical Marketingd  K <mccrobie@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8j87b8$nho$1@nnrp1.deja.com... H > My understanding is that the UP1100 (not a typo) from Alpha Processor,J > Inc. will have SRM support.  Will OpenVMS and Tru64 be supported on this > motherboard? >r >t( > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:00:41 GMT  From: mikeschaus@my-deja.com* Subject: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle) Message-ID: <8j8cpa$3c9$1@nnrp2.deja.com>-  ) My company is working on a proposal for a01 project, and at this point, the details are a bit.1 foggy to me, as I know very little about VAX/VMS.s  * First, some simple questions I hope can be1 answered.  VAX I know was made by DEC, but is VAX / the hardware or the operating system?  How doese* VMS fit into this?  What type of databases% (Oracle, SQL, etc.) can be run on it?s  . The client wants to "reprogram the current VAX( based 1032 database into an Oracle based. platform."  Does anyone have any ideas on this1 matter?  What does 1032 represent?  Could it be al( database type, hardware type, or maybe a proprietary name?s  0 If the basics of this system could be explained,1 or a web site with this information is available,t& the help would be greatly appreciated.  
 Thank you, Mike Schauso Patrick Engineering, Inc.u    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:17:53 GMTo From: mschaus@hotmail.comr* Subject: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle) Message-ID: <8j8dov$ssq$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   C My company is currently working on a proposal for a project dealing E with VAX systems.  First some simple questions.  Is VAX the hardware,nB operating system, or what?  And how does VMS fit in?  What type of@ databases (Oracle, Access, SQL, etc.) can be run on the systems?  G Specifically, the client wants to "reprogram the current VAX based 1032hG database into an Oracle based platform."  Does anyone have any ideas asn@ to what the exact meaning of this is?  Is 1032 a hardware model,F database type, or maybe a proprietary name?  1032 is used as a "SystemG Monitoring (SYSMON) database," but this has little meaning to me, as itw% could be a product or a made-up name.   & Any help would be greatly appreciated.   Mike Schaus  Patrick Engineering, Inc.m    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 18:15:56 -0500e7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>e. Subject: Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle- Message-ID: <3957E42C.5E5E10B1@earthlink.net>c   mschaus@hotmail.com wrote: > E > My company is currently working on a proposal for a project dealing  > with VAX systems.l  E VAX systems are no longer in manufacture. Alphas are their successor.t  5 >  First some simple questions.  Is VAX the hardware,e  	 Was, yes.u   > operating system,t   No.   $ > or what?  And how does VMS fit in?  D OpenVMS is the operating system. Others available for Alpha machinesH include Tru64 (fka Digital UNIX), Linux, *BSD (FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD,G etc.) and some others. Windows/NT was once available for Alpha, but hase< been "end-of-life"-ed (rumors abound re: it's resurrection).   >  What type of B > databases (Oracle, Access, SQL, etc.) can be run on the systems?  D Oracle, Rdb, Sybase (I think), there may be others of which I am notG aware. Of course, OpenVMS includes RMS (provides ISAM support), but RMS 3 requires thrid-party ODBC support for most clients.v   > I > Specifically, the client wants to "reprogram the current VAX based 1032eI > database into an Oracle based platform."  Does anyone have any ideas asTB > to what the exact meaning of this is?  Is 1032 a hardware model,H > database type, or maybe a proprietary name?  1032 is used as a "SystemI > Monitoring (SYSMON) database," but this has little meaning to me, as itT' > could be a product or a made-up name.   0 Best to ask the client those last few questions.   --   David J. Dachteran dba DJE SystemsC" http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Jun 2000 20:16:36 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)l. Subject: Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle+ Message-ID: <SVe$VZNoqFra@eisner.decus.org>s  H In article <8j8cpa$3c9$1@nnrp2.deja.com>, mikeschaus@my-deja.com writes:  0 > The client wants to "reprogram the current VAX* > based 1032 database into an Oracle based0 > platform."  Does anyone have any ideas on this3 > matter?  What does 1032 represent?  Could it be au* > database type, hardware type, or maybe a > proprietary name?c  5 1032 is perhaps the oldest database on VMS, descended,7 from 1022 that ran on Tops-10 and Tops-20.  It is stilll7 supported, and a representative of the vendor posted ina this group not long ago.  2 You can also get Oracle for VMS (on VAX or Alpha),6 but the details of your project seem somewhat sketchy.2 If they want a more modern machine, they should be0 able to run 1032 on Alpha, I would think.  Check with the vendor.   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Jun 2000 17:00:12 -07003 From: Eric Smith <eric-no-spam-for-me@brouhaha.com>n. Subject: Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle0 Message-ID: <qhzoo8q9gz.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>   mikeschaus@my-deja.com writes: > What does 1032 represent?i  2 1032 is the name of the database software package.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:53:22 -0700s2 From: "Randy Park" <rjpark@mindspring.com.nospaam>. Subject: Re: VAX based 1032 database to Oracle2 Message-ID: <8j98f1$tam$1@slb2.atl.mindspring.net>  4 VAX is the hardware platform.  While no longer being5 manufactured, it supported several operating systems,w5 including OpenVMS.  New versions of OpenVMS are stillt2 being developed by Compaq (who bought Digital) and5 these new versions run on both VAX hardware and Alphac	 hardware.   3 1032 is a database management system that descendedy2 from the 1022 database system that was availabe on2 DECsystem 10 (pdp-10) platforms.  I think, but not6 100% sure, that 1032 followed the network model rather than the relational model.  6 Other database management systems available on OpenVMS6 for VAX include Oracle, Oracle Rdb (formerly DEC Rdb),8 Ingres, Sybase, Progress, and Oracle DBMS.  All of these6 are relational databases except for the last one which: is Codasyl compliant (network).  Since VAXes are no longer1 being manufactured, I suspect that this list willi	 decrease.   ) <mikeschaus@my-deja.com> wrote in message*# news:8j8cpa$3c9$1@nnrp2.deja.com...*+ > My company is working on a proposal for a 3 > project, and at this point, the details are a bite3 > foggy to me, as I know very little about VAX/VMS.8 >6, > First, some simple questions I hope can be3 > answered.  VAX I know was made by DEC, but is VAX;1 > the hardware or the operating system?  How does , > VMS fit into this?  What type of databases' > (Oracle, SQL, etc.) can be run on it?A >A0 > The client wants to "reprogram the current VAX* > based 1032 database into an Oracle based0 > platform."  Does anyone have any ideas on this3 > matter?  What does 1032 represent?  Could it be ae* > database type, hardware type, or maybe a > proprietary name?e >l2 > If the basics of this system could be explained,3 > or a web site with this information is available,a( > the help would be greatly appreciated. >i > Thank you,
 > Mike Schausd > Patrick Engineering, Inc.  >n >d( > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.c   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 22:04:35 GMT  From: hobbsb@my-deja.com Subject: Re: VAX on Intel?) Message-ID: <8j8k16$1pe$1@nnrp1.deja.com>L  B How to make VMS more popular?  I believe that that is *one* way toC summarize this thread ... tangled though it may be.  The entry cost 8 seems to be an issue.  Also, knowledge of how VMS works.  D I suggest an Alpha PCI card that is capable of running VMS or Linux.  C Compaq gives $500,000 or so to a university to develop the card andfH software.  The requirements are that the card will run VMS or Linux in aH commodity desktop Wintel or Macintosh box.  The host runs a program thatF acts like the console and presents the host's devices and ports to VMS5 or Linux.  VMS and Linux get some new device drivers.   E The acceptance test is successfully running several VMS applications.iE X-Windows, database servers, network apps, All-In-1, etc..  Then boote* the card with Linux and run similar tests.  G It would be great if the low-level commands and utilities ran properly.,F MS-Windows or MacOS capable of doing useful work while VMS or Linux isG running is not required but a nice to have.  These are college kids and-@ this project would be a challenge ... and there should be future$ versions with enhanced capabilities.  D Price the card to cover the manufacturing costs plus some profit.  I? would like to think that the list price would less that $1,000, F hopefully closer to $500.  Package the card with a CD of the interface	 programs.d  @ Grab some Linux geeks.  Ask them if they would like to run theirH favorite OS on an Alpha chip?  On their current Wintel or Macintosh box?F Would they pay $500 to $1000 to do this?  Line forms over there - have your credit card ready.e  E Almost forgot: in the package with the Alpha card are instructions oneD how to get a *FREE* VMS license under the hobbyist program.  Put the@ same information on the CD.  Heck, make it part of the interface( programs, under the "about" menu option.  B Would these Linux geeks be curious about VMS?  I suspect that some< would.  Some of those would even become proficient with VMS.      & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.M   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 23:41:32 GMTo, From: "mrsignor" <mrsignor@bellatlantic.net>@ Subject: what layered products can i install with these licences6 Message-ID: <MSR55.2577$aA3.85333@typhoon1.ba-dsg.net>  
 Greetings,  I    thanks to those that made suggestions for my 500au not booting problemw  C    the machine i acquired came with some licences. I am planning on L    installing 7.2-1 ... what layered products do the following entitle me to    install / load.  G     OVMS ALPHA BASE ASTATIONS                                SYSTEM LIC  TRADITIONAL*=     NAS CLIENT 150 FOR OPENVMS ALPHA-WS           TRADITIONALh     OPENVMS 1 USEf
 CONCURRENTE     DIGITAL OPEN3d OPENVMS/ALPHA                          TRADITIONAL   ;     BTW - upon booting the existing 7.1 OS, the system saysy  8                 the login interactive limit is set at 64  E     I take it, none of the above entitles me to 64 concurrent users ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 20:38:34 -0500 7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> D Subject: Re: what layered products can i install with these licences- Message-ID: <3958059A.BF93CE2C@earthlink.net>*   mrsignor wrote:- >  > Greetings, > K >    thanks to those that made suggestions for my 500au not booting problemu > E >    the machine i acquired came with some licences. I am planning onFN >    installing 7.2-1 ... what layered products do the following entitle me to >    install / load. > I >     OVMS ALPHA BASE ASTATIONS                                SYSTEM LIC 
 > TRADITIONALR? >     NAS CLIENT 150 FOR OPENVMS ALPHA-WS           TRADITIONALr >     OPENVMS 1 USE  > CONCURRENTG >     DIGITAL OPEN3d OPENVMS/ALPHA                          TRADITIONAL. > = >     BTW - upon booting the existing 7.1 OS, the system saysn > : >                 the login interactive limit is set at 64 > G >     I take it, none of the above entitles me to 64 concurrent users ?   H No, "OPENVMS 1 USER CONCURRENT" means, well, what it says. The number of/ logins allowed (IJOBLIM) is not related to LMF.    Open3D, of course.  C NAS-150 (I believe) gets you DECnet end-node (IV or V), DECwindows,a& MOTIF and UCX (but, I could be wrong).   -- n David J. Dachteras dba DJE Systems " http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board:+ http://home.earthlink.net/~djesys/vms/soho/*   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Jun 2000 23:10:11 -04004 From: "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com>D Subject: Re: what layered products can i install with these licences* Message-ID: <B57D9355-22946@165.247.25.17>  / On Mon, Jun 26, 2000 9:38 PM, David J. Dachterar$ <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote:  D >NAS-150 (I believe) gets you DECnet end-node (IV or V), DECwindows,' >MOTIF and UCX (but, I could be wrong).  >i  I Also VMS cluster client (but not full clustering).  That lets the node doeJ everything in a cluster except vote and serve disks.  (And the prohibition6 on serving disks doesn't seem to always be in effect.)     ---------------------------  Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.coma   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.356 ************************