1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 22 Sep 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 531       Contents:3 Re: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software 3 RE: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software 3 RE: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software 3 Re: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software $ AHA! (Re: Why are these files open?) Re: AlphaPC164 & decwindows + RE: Backup /ignor=interlock  = not ignoring  Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Basic freeware CD problems Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo  Re: Compaq VMS promo (education)% Re: Excursion and NEW Desktop VMS 7.1 + FILESERV@WKU: Updated VNCviewer for OpenVMS " Freeware for extracting Mime files& Re: Freeware for extracting Mime files& Re: Freeware for extracting Mime files2 Re: FW: Oracle Pricing ( was RE: Compaq VMS promo) Re: HSZ50 in Hobbyist Cluster  Re: HSZ50 in Hobbyist Cluster  Incremental backup blues RE: Incremental backup blues0 Looking for Charles Addams "Source Code" cartoon Re: Middleware for RMS Re: Middleware for RMS Re: Middleware for RMS Re: MULTIA + OpenVMS OpenVMS features (future)  Re: OpenVMS features (future) 2 OpenVMS Systems as client to MS SQLserver  Server.6 Re: OpenVMS Systems as client to MS SQLserver  Server. OSU scripts under Apache# Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships # Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships # Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships # Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships " Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships" Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships" Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships" Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships" Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships" Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships
 Press Release  Re: Press Release  Re: Press Release  Re: Press Release   Problem with COMPAQ 9.1GB drives remote tailing of file with UCX 4 Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work?4 Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work?4 Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work?4 Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work?- Re: RSH Problem - Can someone try this for me $ Re: Serial line programming question	 set watch 
 Re: set watch  Sockets and Fortran  Re: Sockets and Fortran  Re: Sockets and Fortran  SoftVMS for Macintosh  SRAM Corruption Thread- Re: strlen(), comparisons, unexpected results - Re: strlen(), comparisons, unexpected results  Suggested VMS new feature! Re: Suggested VMS new feature!! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist ! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist  SYSTEM-F-EXBUFOBJLM ; Re: TCP/IP based program hung apparently when run detached.  Re: Telnet configuration Re: Telnet configuration Re: Telnet configuration Re: Telnet configuration" Unusual hard disk activity at boot& Re: Unusual hard disk activity at boot Re: Using DEC CMM and CVS  Re: VAX VMS TO ALPHA% VAX-11 with VMS11 professional resume E Re: War story: Accidental postings in HTML/MIME (hopefully fixed now) A War story: Accidental postings in HTML/MIME (hopefully fixed now) # Re: what path does clustering use??  [VMS] VAX is dying  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 01:47:49 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)< Subject: Re: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive SoftwareL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2209000147490001@user-2iveaa1.dialup.mindspring.com>  f In article <39CAD169.F92D98F6@earthlink.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote:  H > Yes - it's a pity that when it finally appears, it comes from personae
 > non gratae.   E Some folks in this newsgroup would bitch if they were hung (hanged?)  2 with a brand-new rope.  There's just no gratitude.       ;-)    --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:41:15 -0400 # From: John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com> < Subject: RE: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive SoftwareD Message-ID: <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD81A@berry.mvpsi.com>   > -----Original Message-----> > From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@earthlink.net]- > Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2000 11:27 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > > Subject: Re: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software >  > ' > Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk wrote:  > >  > > cc:  > > bcc:A > > Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza  > > 3 > > Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software  > > 9 > > I know that there are many on this group who dislike   > Executive Software, but the ? > > NEWSKEEPER newsletter from them (Volume 13 Issue 5) has on   > its front cover, the: > > large title "AN OpenVMS RENAISSANCE" with a full page  > article whic is fullsome@ > > in its praise for OpenVMS. Also inside another page article  > on the ORACLE/COMPAQ% > > e-business Solutions for OpenVMS.  > > H > > If this goes out to any non-VMS users, then that's a good thing, no? > > $ > > Pity Compaq can't do the same... > H > Yes - it's a pity that when it finally appears, it comes from personae
 > non gratae.  >   I Are you saying you don't read the OpenVMS Times?  The lead article of the H April/June edition has the headline "The Renaissance of Compaq OpenVMS".= The Executive Software article was probably inspired by this.       ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 16:12:46 +0000 $ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk< Subject: RE: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software/ Message-ID: <00256962.0058CE5C.00@quegw01.btyp>   = Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza     P Yes, that is referenced in the ES newsletter, but the point I was trying to makeL is the ES document goes out to people who may not be VMS users. Compaq don'tN (AFAIK) send VMS stuff out to non-VMS users, although we get a lot of NT/Tru64 stuff sent our way.    Steve Spires VMS System Manager BT/Yellow Pages         7 John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com> on 22/09/2000 02:41:15 PM     To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages) F From:      John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com>, 22 September 2000, 2:41 p.m.  3 RE: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software          > -----Original Message-----> > From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@earthlink.net]- > Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2000 11:27 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > > Subject: Re: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software >  > ' > Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk wrote:  > >  > > cc:  > > bcc:A > > Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  VSSG, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza  > > 3 > > Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive Software  > > 8 > > I know that there are many on this group who dislike > Executive Software, but the > > > NEWSKEEPER newsletter from them (Volume 13 Issue 5) has on > its front cover, the9 > > large title "AN OpenVMS RENAISSANCE" with a full page  > article whic is fullsome? > > in its praise for OpenVMS. Also inside another page article  > on the ORACLE/COMPAQ% > > e-business Solutions for OpenVMS.  > > H > > If this goes out to any non-VMS users, then that's a good thing, no? > > $ > > Pity Compaq can't do the same... > H > Yes - it's a pity that when it finally appears, it comes from personae
 > non gratae.  >   I Are you saying you don't read the OpenVMS Times?  The lead article of the H April/June edition has the headline "The Renaissance of Compaq OpenVMS".= The Executive Software article was probably inspired by this.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:47:08 GMT / From: "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> < Subject: Re: Advertising for OpenVMS from Executive SoftwareE Message-ID: <0aLy5.1772$6T.156830@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>   0 "John Vottero" <John@MVPSI.com> wrote in message> news:C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD81A@berry.mvpsi.com... > > -----Original Message-----  J > > Yes - it's a pity that when it finally appears, it comes from personae > > non gratae.  > >  > K > Are you saying you don't read the OpenVMS Times?  The lead article of the J > April/June edition has the headline "The Renaissance of Compaq OpenVMS".? > The Executive Software article was probably inspired by this.  >  > F You are right of course, the renaissance of VMS has been proclaimed by almostK all of the VMS loyalists and the Compaq VMS advertising (of which there has  been woefully little).    But what else would expect?   I The important thing about this (whether it is from personae non-gratae or  not) is that it K comes from a third party company that invests in code that will run on VMS.  Aren'tJ we all asking for more third party investment in VMS applications? If theyK didn't believe in VMS, then they would just concentrate on WNT and Unix and  try to sell ? their existing VMS customer base new licenses on new platforms.   G I would not be ashamed to stick this article under the noses of my Unix  bigot friends,H on in the face of my management folks.  If I show them the OpenVMS times (whichJ I truly enjoy), I know from experience the reaction I would get, and, I am quite sure, 
 so do you.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:29:12 -0700 & From: bill robertson <wcr@pacbell.net>- Subject: AHA! (Re: Why are these files open?) + Message-ID: <39CB88D8.A7BD700A@pacbell.net>   - Verrry interesting, and a little embarassing:   C $ SAY F$FILE( "DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SIGNON.EXE;1", "KNOWN" ) " %SYSTEM-W-NOSUCHFILE, no such file+  \DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SIGNON.EXE;1\    Duhhh.  Lessee...   , $ dir DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SIGNON.EXE  ! Directory DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]    MENU_SIGNON.EXE;17   Total of 1 file.  Y Somehow I never thought to look at this.  How the INSTALL entries got there, and why they X weren't deleted, I can't say.  (In my somewhat lame defense, I must say that I inherited this system a few months ago.)  * Thank you all for your time and attention.     Bill Robertson Sanwa Bank of California   SysAdmin wrote:    > bill robertson wrote:  > > ) > > Thank you for your reply.  Here goes:  > >  > > Hoff Hoffman wrote:  > > Y > > > In article <39C6B1D6.F25E118@pacbell.net>, bill robertson <wcr@pacbell.net> writes: L > > > :On my 6.2 system, I do a sho dev/files for a particular disk, and see? > > > :lots of executable files open by the system (000000).... , > > > :...the executables are not installed. > > > @ > > >   Would this be an OpenVMS VAX or an OpenVMS Alpha system? > >  > > OpenVMS VAX (microVAX 3100)  > > M > > >   Specific examples of the names of some of these executables would be?  > >  > > $ sho dev/fil dka200 > > C > > Files accessed on device xyz$DKA200: on 19-SEP-2000 13:51:13.67  > > ' > > Process name      PID     File name 2 > >                 00000000  [000000]INDEXF.SYS;1? > >                 00000000  [RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SIGNON.EXE;1 ? > >                 00000000  [RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SELECT.EXE;1 = > >                 00000000  [RLS_MTS_45.EXE]INQ_MAIN1.EXE;1  > > etc. > >  > > > R > > >   Would these image files assocuated with any particular product or package? > > 8 > > They're part of a third-party financial application. > > O > > >   Are these images actually executables, or are they shareable images, or # > > >   COMMONs, or something else?  > > W > > Far as I can tell, they're executables that are invoked from the application.  They = > > aren't run from the command line, or from a command proc.  > > P > > >   Would these particular executables have once been installed (or mapped)? > > Z > > Not as far as I know.   They're not installed now, or don't show up from INSTALL LIST. > % > How does the system resond to this:  >  > $ SAY :== WRITE SYS$OUTPUTE > $ SAY F$FILE( "DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SIGNON.EXE;1", "KNOWN" ) E > $ SAY F$FILE( "DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]MENU_SELECT.EXE;1", "KNOWN" ) C > $ SAY F$FILE( "DKA200:[RLS_MTS_45.EXE]INQ_MAIN1.EXE;1", "KNOWN" )  > 9 > If each one returns TRUE, then the files are INSTALLed.  > N > > >   Would this "particular disk" be a system disk, or an application disk? > >  > > Application disk.  >  > David J. Dachtera    ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:44:27 +0000 (UTC) * From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@kanto.cc.jyu.fi>$ Subject: Re: AlphaPC164 & decwindows, Message-ID: <8qf65b$3b0$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>  * yyyc186.illegaltospam_@flashcom.net wrote:  H > My AlphaPC164 has a Diamond PCI based video adapter in it.  Decwindows0 > refuses to recognize it as a graphics adapter. ... $ > What Graphics adapter do I need... ... J > command file for an ATI Mach64.  I can pic one of these cards up if need ...   E S3 trio64 cards work, Diamond's 64 too. (You didn't say which Diamond F model you have.) ATI Mach64 is VMS-supported, so it should work too. IH haven't tested. When I tried Diamond S3 trio64, VMS didn't see it first,J but after io autoconfiguration it showed up and DECwindows worked. I guess> I haven't done all the necessary configuration for DECwindows?   regards             Osmo Kujala   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:24:03 -0700 / From: Terry Marosites <TMarosites@unitedad.com> 4 Subject: RE: Backup /ignor=interlock  = not ignoringM Message-ID: <1137A4A23A51D311B2D600105A1D5213026FDF67@seantexch.unitedad.com>   L My problem was finally resolved, A new driver was loaded for PDK0 and it was buggy.  7 We reverted back to out old one and all is fine again.    G Thanks to all the helpful replies and comments it helped us to find the 	 problem.   Terry     -----Original Message----- 6 From: 	JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca] * Sent:	Thursday, September 21, 2000 3:12 PM To:	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 4 Subject:	Re: Backup /ignor=interlock  = not ignoring   Terry Marosites wrote: >  > Hello all,L > Doing a backup /ignor=interlock disk7:[dir2]x.x mydir:*.* my process hangs > looking at the log I seeK > %BACKUP-W-ACCONFLICT, DISK7:[dir2]x.x;1 is open for write by another user   H I am not sure about why/if your process hands. But the /ignore=interlock willK still issue the warning you quoted above during the backup but still backup 	 the file.   L If you use the backup command interactively, you can use <CTRL>-T during theH backup and it will tell you which file it is currently processing. It is' possible it is hanging on another file.   F It is also possible that your tape is deffective and the process hangs always at the same place.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:53:25 +0100  From: "laurie" <abd@bdc.com>' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problems + Message-ID: <8qf35q$410$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>   3 So does it just not work? Was it not tested at all? F It seemed like a more fundamental problem than that, since the first 3 programs I tried didn't work. I If I download it onto a pc disk and put it on my Alpha via PCDISK will it  bugger up the executables?B How much are you charging for the CD? Does the new version contain installation instructions?L Could you tell me how I should be installing it, cos the DCL help won't tellJ me what to do unless I know what the commands I should be using are called in the first place.    Thanks   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:07:49 +0100  From: "laurie" <abd@bdc.com>' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problems + Message-ID: <8qf40r$969$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>   J Right. I just tried the most recent version off the Compaq site, and I get	 the same:  I type:  'r unzip.exe "-Z"' DCL says= 'Too many parameters. Reenter command with fewer parameters.' K This must be some setup problem because it's the same as I got for gzip. So 6 what is the syntax to run executables with parameters?      ' "laurie" <abd@bdc.com> wrote in message % news:8qf35q$410$1@trog.dera.gov.uk... 5 > So does it just not work? Was it not tested at all? H > It seemed like a more fundamental problem than that, since the first 3 > programs I tried didn't work. K > If I download it onto a pc disk and put it on my Alpha via PCDISK will it  > bugger up the executables?D > How much are you charging for the CD? Does the new version contain > installation instructions?I > Could you tell me how I should be installing it, cos the DCL help won't  tellL > me what to do unless I know what the commands I should be using are called > in the first place.e >a > Thanks >C >r >e >  >  >i   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 11:57:04 GMT) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)r' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problemsV' Message-ID: <8qfheg$9e4$2@joe.rice.edu>q   laurie (abd@bdc.com) wrote:oL : Right. I just tried the most recent version off the Compaq site, and I get : the same:e	 : I type:S : 'r unzip.exe "-Z"'
 : DCL says? : 'Too many parameters. Reenter command with fewer parameters.'nM : This must be some setup problem because it's the same as I got for gzip. Sos8 : what is the syntax to run executables with parameters?   From the VMS FAQ, available at:       http://www.openvms.compaq.com/  0  "DCL1.   How do I run a program with arguments?  M   The RUN command does not accept arguments.  To pass arguments to a program, @   you must use what is called a "foreign command".  For example:  *     $ uudecode :== $disk:[dir]uudecode.exe     $ uudecode filespect  L   The leading $ in the symbol definition is what makes it a foreign command.B   If the device and directory is omitted, SYS$SYSTEM: is assumed."  4 --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:22:30 -0400S From: stan@stanq.com' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problemsT- Message-ID: <39CB16C6.7013.6B7D15E@localhost>   L > Right. I just tried the most recent version off the Compaq site, and I get > the same: 	 > I type:F > 'r unzip.exe "-Z"'
 > DCL says? > 'Too many parameters. Reenter command with fewer parameters.'bM > This must be some setup problem because it's the same as I got for gzip. Soy8 > what is the syntax to run executables with parameters?  E You have to create a "foreign command" symbol.  Let's suppose you're sF trying to run UNZIP.EXE, located in directory DISK$XYZ:[LAURIE.FREE]. + You would then type this at the "$" prompt:e  .     UNZIP :== $DISK$XYZ:[LAURIE.FREE]UNZIP.EXE  D The "$" means to run an executable.  If you had a command procedure 5 ("script" in Unix parlance), you'd use a "@" instead.   @ The disk and directory are required in this definition.  If not % included, it defaults to SYS$SYSTEM:.g    F I'm sure that Hoff would mention that this is all included in the FAQ  under topic DCL1:   >     http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/openvms_faq.html#DCL1     --Stan  
 ----------G Stanley F. Quayle, P.E.   N8SQ   +1 614-868-1363   Fax: +1 614 868-1671 1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147u= Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.comb   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 13:50:28 +0100  From: "laurie" <abd@bdc.com>' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problemsa+ Message-ID: <8qfkil$emi$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>    Thank you very much.: That's what should be in the readme for the freeware disk.G Unfortunately my Alpha disk has died in the meantime so I can't try it.n    6 "Jerry Leslie" <leslie@clio.rice.edu> wrote in message! news:8qfheg$9e4$2@joe.rice.edu...f > laurie (abd@bdc.com) wrote:cJ > : Right. I just tried the most recent version off the Compaq site, and I get-
 > : the same:- > : I type:  > : 'r unzip.exe "-Z"' > : DCL saysA > : 'Too many parameters. Reenter command with fewer parameters.':L > : This must be some setup problem because it's the same as I got for gzip. So: > : what is the syntax to run executables with parameters? >A! > From the VMS FAQ, available at:d > " >   http://www.openvms.compaq.com/ > 2 >  "DCL1.   How do I run a program with arguments? >aF >   The RUN command does not accept arguments.  To pass arguments to a program,B >   you must use what is called a "foreign command".  For example: >t, >     $ uudecode :== $disk:[dir]uudecode.exe >     $ uudecode filespecn >oE >   The leading $ in the symbol definition is what makes it a foreign  command.D >   If the device and directory is omitted, SYS$SYSTEM: is assumed." >f6 > --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own) >0   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 16:25:51 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problems 6 Message-ID: <8qg16f$312$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  J In article <8qf40r$969$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>, "laurie" <abd@bdc.com> writes:K :Right. I just tried the most recent version off the Compaq site, and I get 
 :the same: :I type: :'r unzip.exe "-Z"' 	 :DCL sayse> :'Too many parameters. Reenter command with fewer parameters.'  >   Please provide the full text of the message(s) when posting.  ;   I will assume that the message reported is the following:s  F  MAXPARM,  too many parameters - reenter command with fewer parameters  A   I will get this text updated for the next release, as the errorsC   message and recovery text (displayed via HELP/MESSAGE and in the PA   error messages manual) should reference one of the most common oA   causes of this error.  I'll see if I can get that nessage text i?   and the RUN command documentation fixed for the next release.   L :This must be some setup problem because it's the same as I got for gzip. So7 :what is the syntax to run executables with parameters?h  I   Please see the FAQ for details on how to run a program with parameters.   F   In particular, the keywords "Foreign Command" and "Automatic ForeignI   Command" will be of use here when looking in the OpenVMS documentation.   N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 16:49:50 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)' Subject: Re: Basic freeware CD problemsu6 Message-ID: <8qg2je$3eq$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  J In article <8qfkil$emi$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>, "laurie" <abd@bdc.com> writes:; :That's what should be in the readme for the freeware disk.l  @   Um, any particular readme(s)?  There are quite a few around...  J   I've previously added this information to the FAQ, and have just queued L   changes to the RUN (image) command and the MAXPARM error message text for H   the next OpenVMS release.  I've included the FAQ on the Freeware, and A   will include the then-current FAQ on the next Freeware release.s  F   I'll also look at setting up a DCL command procedure (in [000TOOLS])F   that equates the necessary DCL symbols, too, and add a reference to :   the procedure in the [000TOOLS]FREEWARE_README.TXT file.  E   If you have specific suggestions where you think I should add this tE   information elsewhere, or if you have some specific suggested text eD   that would have helped you here or if you have other changes that ,   would help avoid this, please let me know.  E   That said, I'm not in a particularly good position to make the RUN  I   command verb deal better with images requiring parameters, nor to make rG   the verb itself return an error message other than the MAXPARM error.rI   And realistically, this is not the first time somebody has encountered SG   the need for foreign commands and -- no matter what changes I make tohH   the OpenVMS documentation and to the Freeware -- it won't be the last.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:45:07 +0100x< From: John Macallister <j.macallister1@physics.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo 7 Message-ID: <000922084507.ae4c@nplvms.physics.ox.ac.uk><  E >        "I/O ... why should I care about I/O?   I'm just a point andx >        click programmer!!!"0  M Someone does need to worry about I/O but it isn't necessarily the applicationMN  user. The system builders (h/w and s/w) should configure the system to handleM  all reasonable I/O demands and the software, especially, should prevent/warnt#  the user about inappropriate I/O .n  L I know we haven't quite reached the stage where the end user doesn't need toO  worry about some system details but I do think we have reached the stage wherenW  creating a document(e.g.) is something you expect to be able to do without any hassle  N  at all (even if not everyone is willing the read the document format I happenP  to choose !) i.e. I don't care whether my 1,000,000 word document is compressedM  into one byte on disk ( I will have to check disk space of course unless thehP  disk has sufficient free space for there to be no worry on that score), takes nO  I/O operations and uses m minutes of processor time: my only concern is that,  T  after typing in the last word, the document exists and can be printed, mailed, etc.   John   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 00:12:25 -0400h* From: David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promoo- Message-ID: <39CADC29.C1E2B58F@tsoft-inc.com>s   Bill Gunshannon wrote: > D > Well, this seems to have been badly misunderstood.  Let me try and > clarify what i meant.o   Yep!  J > Programming is a part of every course a CS candidate gets here.  it justM > isn't a subject unto itself.  MOst of our students have had some experience L > with at least 4 languages and two different language paradigms by the time > they graduate.  9 This is what you failed to say, and caused the confusion.n  H When I was in college, the classes were called programming in <pick yourN language>, at least some of the lower level classes, which were pre-requisitesK to higher level classes which taught computer science, but assumed that youMJ could perform required tasks because you already knew how to program (in aM language).  In the higher level classes, and even in the programming classes, M techniques and computers were what was taught.  I really don't know any othertN method of teaching programming but to use it to solve real problems.  LearningI to use linked lists is a concept, practiced by programming.  So which was O taught.  Both is the correct answer.  I really cannot see your curriculum beingo much different.r   Dave   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 09:01:37 GMT* From: helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promoS. Message-ID: <8qf75h$fba$1@info.service.rug.nl>  F In article <8qd6bs$14h4$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:   / >In article <8qckei$l0q$1@info.service.rug.nl>, . > helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes: >|> K >|> Perhaps I'm not typical.  But I have a research job at a university.  I04 >|> write code in Fortran, I write papers in LaTeX,  >., >You are definitely not typical, trust me.    
 Maybe not.    >I use Fortran. It draws a laugh >every once in a while.  S  : People used to laugh, until they saw how fast my code was!  3 >We just dropped the use of Pascal for teaching andpL >by next semester Ada will be gone too.  Fortran hasn't actually been taught >in over 10 years.    D My point is that it can do what I need, and can do what most people  write in C, probably better.  7 LaTeX??  We have one professor, more of a mathemeticianaI >and theoreticist who uses it for all his class handouts and even for the L >assignements he puts up on his web page.  But administrative stuff is stillL >done using Word because what would the Dean do with a LaTeX document on his >Office2000 based PC??  I Apparently there is a Max Planck Institute where all the secretaries etc s
 use LaTeX.   >And when they look at Word2000$3 >and compare it to LaTeX, which do you think wins??O  I The few people who write astronomy papers in WORD are the laughing stock  2 of the community.  You need TeX for nice formulae.  H >So then, why is it that every PC comes with Word and not one comes with
 >LaTeX??    7 Haven't you heard about the Microsoft anti-trust stuff?n   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:09:34 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)a Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo02 Message-ID: <39cb20cd.1363946421@news.newsguy.com>  < On 21 Sep 2000 12:54:18 GMT, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote:    H >I am sure that most other schools are the same as us, in shich case youF >are way too late for that.  They are either gone or converted by now.B >VMS has been out of the academic mainstream for too long already.  ? In most schools yes... but not all. I posted a list of ScottishaE Universities where VMS is still available to students in some form ordC other. These are the ones I would target first. It's only two years B since I last managed general purpose student access VMS systems in	 academia.i   >sJ >|>                                  Appoint a territory VMS ijn educationG >|> manager. Have the machines rever back to Compaq if not put into VMSw >|> student use.   > E >The result of this would be for the schools to turn them down in the0H >first place.  Space is a very expensive commodity and no one will waste  ! Not even enough space for a DS20?o    E >the space for tools that can't do the job.  Until VMS systems can do.E >all that the current systems are doing (and we're not talking OracledJ >servers here, we're talking desktops!) VMS will not get back into general  A I agree we need more dekstop apps. Which is why I think a port ofe  StarOffice should be a priority.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 12:57:46 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)M Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promou, Message-ID: <8qfl0a$2aub$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  ; In article <418E68E524A8D311ACCE00508B78866A768168@DENXCH>,k0  Lorin Ricker <Lorin.Ricker@t-netix.com> writes: |> sG |> It's just my own hiring and interviewing experiences, albeit limited.J |> regionally and to a relatively small pool of prospectives, that suggestL |> such a worst-case scenario to me... but it really does seem at times likeM |> we're moving towards just such a situation.  How many recent college gradsuN |> have you interviewed recently who even had a clue what "memory management",I |> "resource sharing" or "scheduling algorithms" really are, for example?o |> t  8 All of this would be covered by an acredited CS Program.  B |> If a CS/CE college/professional degree is really now viewed andE |> provided "as a commodity", dumbed down to least-common-denominatoriJ |> material, then our universities have indeed really "lost the thread".  I |> Some of my colleagues have tried to convince me that the current state J |> of affairs is somehow natural, a result of "what the market will bear",M |> and that this marks a "maturation of the industry."  Hmph... I don't know,t& |> it just brings out the cynic in me.  E No, it's nased on the fact that today, anyone can offer a "degree" invG Computer Science.  Want to learn to be a programmer??  ICS, DeVry Tech.dE National Technical Schools.  Just check out the inside of a matchbookk cover.  Everybody's doing it!!  I Maybe it's time to start looking at more than the possession of a degree.-I Maybe it's time to start loking at where that degree came from.  And thisoI doesn't even address the places poping up all over the Internet that sellg degrees.  G There is a body that does acreditation of CS programs.  We went throughdH it, it isn't all fluff, it's a serious look at your program with seriousI past, present and future requirements.  Maybe it's time to start sorting r0 those resumes into two piles, CSAB and not-CSAB.   |> iI |> Certainly, there's a disconnect between the academic world and many ofoK |> us "out here" in business/industry, and a lot of the time, I feel like asO |> lost and lonely voice in the woods.  BTW, my own BS/Engr. from Purdue in '74eM |> was interdisciplinary, consisting of the "tough stuff" in math, CS, EE anda |> ME,5 |> so I *do* have a point-of-comparison for my views.   K As do I.  I have only been at a University for the past 10 years.  Prior tonK that I was out in the real world too.  I have seen creative resume writing.hM I even have a book that tells you how to do it.  I have seen people apply forkJ Project Manager positions on multi-million dollar projects that specificlyJ called for "x" years of experience managing similar projects with a resumeI that said they managed an Arby's in high school.  That's why I never takeuH a resume at face value.  Not all degrees are created equal.  It would be) nice if this were the case, but it isn't.i   bill   -- eJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   s   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 15:39:50 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)  Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo , Message-ID: <8qfug6$2fet$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  - In article <39CA5644.7E4180D5@tsoft-inc.com>,t-  David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:t |> Bill Gunshannon wrote:i |> > a7 |> > In article <39c9bccd.1272809252@news.newsguy.com>,o- |> >  A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) writes:n |> > |>eN |> > |>                                  Appoint a territory VMS ijn educationK |> > |> manager. Have the machines rever back to Compaq if not put into VMS  |> > |> student use. |> > -I |> > The result of this would be for the schools to turn them down in thetL |> > first place.  Space is a very expensive commodity and no one will wasteI |> > the space for tools that can't do the job.  Until VMS systems can dofI |> > all that the current systems are doing (and we're not talking Oracle'N |> > servers here, we're talking desktops!) VMS will not get back into generalL |> > academic use.  The majority of college people (students, faculty, staffK |> > and administrators) are really just users.  They want a tool and not aa	 |> > toy.g |> mR |> I'd first say, before the VMS faithful get a rope and go hunting for Bill, that |> from multiple contacts,    9 That would just be another case of killing the messenger.S  Q |>                         I feel that Bill would really like to have VMS back inmS |> education, but is stating (from his perspective) the realities of the situation.d  K Exactly, and this coming from a place that used to do all of it's computingSK on VMS machines.  The first Unix machine (A DecStation) didn't come in hereiN until I got here.  I was hired to network the University and I needed InternetM ready network tools.  That meant Unix and TCPIP.  Other than that, mainstream I computing consisted of an IBM Mainframe for administration, a big VAX fornL all the academic users (including BITNET connectivity) and the CS DepartmentL even had it's own MicroVAX for teaching Computer Architecture.  Today, I nowH work for the CS Department rather than Network Services so I am academicJ rather than administrative.  And where is the University??  AdministrationH is now done on an Alpha.  Canned package called Banner maintained out ofJ house.  Email is done using Netscape and SUN Servers.  I saved the last ofI the VAXen from the dumpster and run them up here for the department.  TherI only classes still taught on the VMS system is a Database class that usesfG Oracle and a CIS class that uses COBOL.  The other students who used topJ learn about using VMS in literacy now have no contact with it at all.  AndJ as you can see from above, although I have a couple VAXen, they garner theH same snickers int he hall as my PDP-11's.  VMS is about as meaningful to people around here as RSTS/E.Q  > I hardly expect that our University is unique in this respect.   |>  P |> However, on this last issue, I will disagree.  Many may turn down free AlphasE |> with restrictions.  But there will be some who will be interested.l  J That's true, I am.  And I could even convince the department chair to give= up the extremely valuable space it would take to set them up.n  eO |>                                                                    And sinceiN |> VMS is currently in a position where it would be best to carefully pick theM |> fights it engages in, go with those interested enough to try.  First, it's2N |> better than nothing.   Second, these people (academia) talk to each other.   L This is also true.  The ESCCC 2000 Conference is being held here this comingN October.  (http:\\www.cs.scranton.edu/esccc00)  Although a little late at thisN point (although maybe not impossible) to arrange anything, but this might have4 been a good place/time to put VMS back on the table.    P |> When/if some good comes out of the places that do use VMS, the knowledge will& |> get around.  Gotta start somewhere.  L Well, that was part of what I saw in my proposal for funding a grant to portL some of the plethora of Unix freeware (realizing that some of what is on theL freeware CD started on Unix, so it is possible) to VMS.  You get usable freeK software that can to a small extent push into Windows grip on the industry,sN plus, you get the potential for free advertising as these packages flow aroundA the web with the VMS tag next to them and not just Linux and BSD.i   |>  R |> As for the tools, forget 100% VMS solutions.  Have the billy-boxes for the word |> processing and such.  e  N BUt the goes back to the question of space.  Every square foot is valuable andM people are constantly fighting over it. (Trust me, I know.  I just finished aiN 4 year fight to get a room for a computer maintenance shop only to get the oldM tenant out and then watch them give the room to someone else anyway.)  No oneiO is going to buy two boxes when they percieve that one can do the job.  Realize, N we are not talking about how good either of them does the job.  the man makingN the decision wouldn't understand that anyway.  Which, of course, is onw of theK reasons why we're having this discussion.  We want to get people into thesem= positons who actually know that billyboxes is not the answer."  Q |>                       Also have a good terminal emulator on them (enhancements R |> could be project work) and have them on the network so that LAT/TELNET sessions! |> on VMS are a mouse click away.A  N Forgetting any argument over the true merit of GUI's, the fact is the world isK used to them and character based apps just don't fly.  Graphical IntegratedhN Development Environments are what people want and they will go to the machinesK that offer them.  AdaGIDE, jGrasp, Visual Studio.  These are what sells and)O for better or worse, if VMS doesn't have them it will not displace the machinesr that do.   |> 03 |> As for the target students, it's not the users, c  N Sorry, students are just users.  They spend more of their time writing papers M about what they do than actaully writing programs to do it.  And proving whatrN they learned too. The important part of this discussion is how do you get themQ familiar with VMS after all this time.  And the only answer is you make sure that P they will spend a majority of their time on VMS systems.  I have already noticedO a marked decrease in our students abilities to do even basic things on the UnixiJ boxes here because they spend most of their time on Windows now.  WhateverJ system they become most familiar with is the one they will pitch when theyM leave here.  Right now, it is becoming Windows and there is a great amount ofp inertia behind it.    S |>                                                 it's the few that will work withdS |> and implement IT solutions when they reach the workforce.  That's who we want to K |> be familiar with VMS.  Not saying others wouldn't be good, but they're a: |> secondary target.  P Our labs are for the use of CS/CIS majors only.  It doesn't change the fact thatP the most used programs are the Office Suite and Netscape.  If these tools (and IS mean this in the generic and not just Microsofts) and others like it don't show up eO on VMS then people will never go back to using VMS again.  Character based appsrN merely strengthen the legacy/dinosaur image that VMS has developed.  As I saidP in another message, it's all in the perception.  Contrary to what the commercial says, "Image is everything".  L What are we going to do about it??  And who exactly is "we"??  If the peopleK here who see the decline in VMS usage and don't like what they see can't or K won't do anything about it but argue endlessly, who is going to??  Compaq??f  
 All the best.t   bill   -- .J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 15:43:05 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)n Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo , Message-ID: <8qfum9$2fet$2@info.cs.uofs.edu>  - In article <39CA56A5.3A68A967@tsoft-inc.com>, -  David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:m |> Christopher Smith wrote:3 |> > .2 |> > On Wed, 20 Sep 2000, David J. Dachtera wrote: |> > e= |> > > My step daughter corrected me about this last weekend:d |> > rL |> > > "Computer 'Science'" students learn how to use "canned" applications. |> > gG |> > > "Computer Engineering" students learn hardware, architecture andh/ |> > > programming, including o.s. development.a |> >  M |> > So, in other words, computer science (as in the study of the theoreticaly# |> > aspects of computing) is dead?u |> nO |> Maybe not totally on target, but, another reason to introduce billy-boy to ag |> rope. |>    5 I hope your talking about the other "billy-boy"!! :-)s  J I can assure you that isn't the case in our CS program.  But then, that isM what I meant about teaching "programming" as opposed to teaching CS.  AnybodyaB can learn the syntax of Pascal, it doesn't make them a programmer.   bill   -- iJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   t   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 11:56:55 -0500- From: Graham Allan <allan@mnhep1.hep.umn.edu>  Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo20 Message-ID: <w53itrol608.fsf@lanark.spa.umn.edu>  3 bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:d  / > In article <39CA5644.7E4180D5@tsoft-inc.com>, / >  David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:- > |> Bill Gunshannon wrote:9 > |> > T > P > Forgetting any argument over the true merit of GUI's, the fact is the world isM > used to them and character based apps just don't fly.  Graphical IntegratedsP > Development Environments are what people want and they will go to the machinesM > that offer them.  AdaGIDE, jGrasp, Visual Studio.  These are what sells and Q > for better or worse, if VMS doesn't have them it will not displace the machines 
 > that do.  G One thing VMS has is the enterprise toolkit... something I've certainlyaF never looked at myself, but allows you to remotely build VMS (or UNIX)K apps from within Visual Studio. I did see some rather good reviews of it at 
 some time.   G. -- dI -------------------------------------------------------------------------o: Graham Allan - I.T. Manager - gta@umn.edu - (612) 624-50409 School of Physics and Astronomy - University of Minnesota I -------------------------------------------------------------------------r   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 17:10:35 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)e Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promoa, Message-ID: <8qg3qb$2i5o$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  2 In article <39cb20cd.1363946421@news.newsguy.com>,(  A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) writes:? |> On 21 Sep 2000 12:54:18 GMT, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bills |> Gunshannon) wrote:e |> y |>  K |> >I am sure that most other schools are the same as us, in shich case you I |> >are way too late for that.  They are either gone or converted by now.cE |> >VMS has been out of the academic mainstream for too long already.e |> PB |> In most schools yes... but not all. I posted a list of ScottishH |> Universities where VMS is still available to students in some form orF |> other. These are the ones I would target first. It's only two yearsE |> since I last managed general purpose student access VMS systems in3 |> academia.  I But that's preaching to the choir.  Apparently they don;t graduate enoughuL people to offset the current trend.  What is needed is to get VMS back where7 it was, but isn't any more and into where it never was.i   |> n |> >M |> >|>                                  Appoint a territory VMS ijn educationeJ |> >|> manager. Have the machines rever back to Compaq if not put into VMS |> >|> student use.  |> >H |> >The result of this would be for the schools to turn them down in theK |> >first place.  Space is a very expensive commodity and no one will wasteu |> a$ |> Not even enough space for a DS20?  I And what are the users going to sit down to??  A PeeCee??  Then why would G they bother connecting to the DS20??  All the tools are already on the  @ PeeCee.  If you give users a choice, they will choose Windows.     |> u |> eH |> >the space for tools that can't do the job.  Until VMS systems can doH |> >all that the current systems are doing (and we're not talking OracleM |> >servers here, we're talking desktops!) VMS will not get back into generaly |>  D |> I agree we need more dekstop apps. Which is why I think a port of# |> StarOffice should be a priority.o  I Well, then we are in total agreement.  If things like StarOffice and GIMPeG and other popular freeware productivity tools were available for VMS it-I would go a long way in getting VMS out of the closet and back in front of.F people who just might like it!!  The question is, how do you do that??M Porting this stuff is likely to be a task.  Not impossible, but not something1I that the readers here are likely to be able to do in a spare evening.  My'K suggestion was for someone, Compaq (except they don't seem to care much) oraK more likely, a consortium of companies with a vested interest in seeing VMSoI not only survive, but thrive, to put together a grant to provide some (itmI has got to be more than one, eggs in one basket and all that) schools whovL are interested with some hardware and software and funding to hire promisingG students to actaully do the ports.  Otherwise, we will just continue to>O discuss this subject here every couple of months and nothing will ever change. o  ; Before someone else brings it up, I'll answer the question. $ Do I have ulterior motives in this??F Of course I do. I want the best for our students.  I want our studentsE to continue to leave here with the best CS education they can get.  AcB project like this would go a long way in bolstering not only theirH resumes, but also the more important thing, the knowledge base contained in their heads."     bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   h   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:53:00 GMTm% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)s) Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo (education)a2 Message-ID: <39cb2973.1366160885@news.newsguy.com>  < On 21 Sep 2000 14:50:48 GMT, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote:   > C >And contrary to popular belief, students in any serious program atgE >any real school don't have time to "play with it unrestricted".  TherE >ones who would have this time are not the kind of students you want sF >to sell VMS to because they are not going to end out in the decision ! >makers positions in later years.e  E Really? I can think of a number of students who I could never get off,B of our VMS systems who now are working there way rapidly up the ITC chain. I can also think of a number who now work in VMS support andc1 earn more than there Windows/Unix contemporaries.C  A We had an infamous student coding war involving programs "where",eB "lister" and "who" which maintained databases of LAT addresses, IPB addresess, DECNET addresses and monitored the VMS systems for userD logins. Users would be informed of the login and location. Then cameD all the bells and whistles such as links via PHONE, EMAIL, IRC, TALKB etc. Early versions parsed DCL output and spawned commands  but asA they progressed started to call VMS system services directly. Youm@ might call it trivial and a waste of time but they learnt a lot.  F Then we had those who ported mountains of UNIX games including networkF games requiring sockets. Non trivial. I'd employ some of these people.    
 Alan Greig: VMS Systems Manager University of Abertay Dundee 1992-1998     --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:33:12 +0200y= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>-. Subject: Re: Excursion and NEW Desktop VMS 7.1) Message-ID: <39CB0B38.490CFB31@gtech.com>l   Jerry Alan Braga wrote::H > How do initiate from a excursion session (when it starts)  the new VMS5 > desktop as it appears on the console when it startsl  ( $ MCR CDE$SYSTEM_DEFAULTS:[BIN]DTSESSION   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:58:14 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brs4 Subject: FILESERV@WKU: Updated VNCviewer for OpenVMSL Message-ID: <OFA8BCEB31.B77DCDEC-ON83256962.00579606@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  ? Would be much more interesting a Citrix ICA client for OpenVMS.-  
 Fabio Cardoso  Analista de Suportet( Compaq / Petrobras - Macae - RJ - Brasil        L                                                                             L                                                                             L                                                                                   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                               >                                                               >  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Assunto: Re: FILESERV@WKU: Updated VNCviewer for OpenVMS     >                                                                             K In article <QsWQIvpst5H$@axp1.wku.edu>, goathunter@wku.edu (Hunter Goatley)a writes:e> >VNC333R1VMS011 (VNCviewer V1.1 for OpenVMS) is now available.  G You had mentioned in an earlier post that you use VNCviewer to remotelyiG access PCs.  What piece of software do you run on the PC end to achievee this?  (URL please!)   Thanks,v   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduA> Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 16:31:00 +0100e9 From: "Miller, Daniel" <Daniel.Miller@Nightfreight.co.uk>h+ Subject: Freeware for extracting Mime filesuA Message-ID: <017BBD86A4F6D3118D640020182FB53D04A087@NF-HOUSE-NT1>d   Hi,s  D Does anyone know of freeware which allows mime files to be extractedG from mail?  We have UUENCODE/UUDECODE, but not found anything for mime.    thanks,   
 Daniel Millerc Senior ProgrammerL Nightfreight Plc t   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 17:08:55 +0100i- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>o/ Subject: Re: Freeware for extracting Mime filess) Message-ID: <39CB8417.74593751@bbc.co.uk>    "Miller, Daniel" wrote:p   > Hi,  >eF > Does anyone know of freeware which allows mime files to be extractedI > from mail?  We have UUENCODE/UUDECODE, but not found anything for mime.t > 	 > thanks,l >s > Daniel Millert > Senior Programmer  > Nightfreight Plc  D In a previous life I used MPACK and MUNPACK,  I can't remember where they came from, sorry.     --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.ukh  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofg MedAS or the BBC.s   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 13:46:24 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)t/ Subject: Re: Freeware for extracting Mime filese+ Message-ID: <AaxXv+wrff7k@eisner.decus.org>o  } In article <017BBD86A4F6D3118D640020182FB53D04A087@NF-HOUSE-NT1>, "Miller, Daniel" <Daniel.Miller@Nightfreight.co.uk> writes:e  F > Does anyone know of freeware which allows mime files to be extractedI > from mail?  We have UUENCODE/UUDECODE, but not found anything for mime.n  5 How about the MIME facility delivered with VMS V7.2 ?   G Well that one has problems, but there are many improvements that shouldn be on the ECO discs by now.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:40:11 GMTV% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) ; Subject: Re: FW: Oracle Pricing ( was RE: Compaq VMS promo)s2 Message-ID: <39cb2712.1365551048@news.newsguy.com>  4 On Thu, 21 Sep 2000 10:08:59 -0400, "Ebinger . Eric" <EEbinger@drc.com> wrote:n  I >The "Rdb standard edition" was Rdb on NT.  Which is no longer a product.hG >The only way you can get quoted a price for Rdb Standard Edition is ifcH >the Oracle salesman makes a mistake.  The information on the Oracle web0 >site is, according to Rdb marketing, incorrect.  ? So what we can agree on is that Oracle contradict themselves ineC various places. I can certainly believe that. At a guess Oracle mayhB have decided to offer RDB at only Enterprise tier on VMS when theyD still intended migrating RDB users to NT - so make it cheaper on NT.  F Now that that isn't an option any more pricing RDB way too high at the) low end on VMS will only kill sales dead.h  F I'll be talking to Oracle fairly soon about 8i on VMS so I'll take the opportunity to ask about RDB.    --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 05:45:09 GMTA% From: Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com>e& Subject: Re: HSZ50 in Hobbyist Cluster) Message-ID: <8qerl3$rgc$1@nnrp1.deja.com>T  . In article <39C8FB6A.5C78BA98@fsi.net.mapson>,%   djesys.nospam@fsi.net.mapson wrote:t > Carl Karcher wrote:  > >iA > > In a previous article, Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com> wrote:y > >aG > > ->Don't know. V5.1 is quite old, though. I believe V5.4 is current.y > > B > > Actually V5.7 is current - and the LAST release. The HS-series< > > controllers are now considered "legacy" by Compaq and in? > > a "Retirement process". Support for all HS* controllers and0' > > software will end on April 1, 2001.  >  > HUH ???!!! >,H > The HSG's are just coming out! How can anything THAT new be considered > "legacy"????  @ 'Just coming out'?? I have played with the HSG80 on 23-OCT-1998.  > (I have read the correction that this doesn't affect all HS*).   --
 Uwe Zessin    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.k   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 06:05:21 GMT % From: Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com> & Subject: Re: HSZ50 in Hobbyist Cluster) Message-ID: <8qesqq$sna$1@nnrp1.deja.com>t  6 In article <Pw9y5.526$F93.206653@typhoon.aracnet.com>,5   "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com> wrote:l( > Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com> wrote:H > >> Now, can I plug any of the above systems into the HSZ50's?  LookingG > >> through the available documentation I was able to find on Compaq'stB > >> FTP site I see that the only supported system is the DEC 3000F > >> (though somehow I don't think the 300LX is intended to be pluggedF > >> into one). My preference is either the AS200 or AS500, which everE > >> is used will most likely have the Narrow SCSI PCI card placed inh > >> it.A > > The HSZ50 controller module has a fast-wide-differential SCSI E > > interface with a HD68 connector. You either need a DWZZ-somethingk6 > > converter or a different HBA (KZPSA-BB, KZPBA-CB). > G > Hmmm, the manual lists the following as being supported under OpenVMSdE > for the HSZ50; KZTSA, KFTIA, PMAZC, KZMSA, KZPAA, KZPSA, and KZPBA.t1 > Unless I'm mistaken the KZPAA is a narrow card,m  F It is narrow and single-ended, so you need a DWZZ-something converter.F I don't recognize all adapters, but note that the 'KZPBA' is available in 2 variants:" KZPBA-CA:  ULTRA WIDE SINGLE-ENDED" KZPBA-CB:  ULTRA WIDE DIFFERENTIAL  F > AND what I've got installed in my AlphaStation 500/333, however, theC > manual says this is only for AlphaServers 1000/2000/2100 Systems.o  + The KZPAA-AA manual? It might be out-dated.o  H > >> It looks like the HSZ50's have the HSOF V5.1 software on the PCMCIAF > >> cards.  Are there any layered products or License PAK's needed on > >> the VMS Box?2 > > No.  >4D > Amazing!  That's a relief!  Of course it sounds like I'll probably? > need to dig up batteries if I want to be able to use the coold > features.c ><G > I gather that if I just run it as JBOD I'd have disks such as DKB101, E > DKB102, DKB201, DKB202?  Of course what I really want is to be able0 > to do the RAID and striping.  A I don't understand. If you use controller-based RAID (striping is>@ RAID-0, btw.) the host (VMS) will only see a single volume, too.@ Simply speaking: the HSZ50 controller will look like a number of disks to it's connected host.h   --
 Uwe Zessin    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:10:05 GMTo From: _RAQ_@yahoo.com ! Subject: Incremental backup bluest) Message-ID: <8qf44l$549$1@nnrp1.deja.com>y  G The way we do backups today is to shut down the DB's, splitt the shadow E sets, restart the DB's, and then let the backup run on the "inactive"e2 shadows set members. This gives us alot of uptime.  F Problem is, we cant do incremental backup, since the recording pass isC done to the "inactive" disks. When remounting the shadow member the C former "inactive" member with the recording pass gets overwritten -t fair enough.   How could this be improved?r   Thanks      & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.#   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:57:04 -04002: From: "Koska, John C. (LNG-MBC)" <John.C.Koska@bender.com>% Subject: RE: Incremental backup bluesrK Message-ID: <D7E0F3C94377D311A24A00805F19D0EE52A760@MBCALBEXC04.BENDER.COM>f  D One way to do daily incremental shadowset backups is to migrate the G backup date from what you call the "inactive" shadowset members to the  I master/"active" shadowset member after the backup is completed.  This is eH dependent on the files residing on the master shadowsets/"active" havingE the opportunity for them to be closed.  Not knowing your application sC and how it behaves, I will assume there is an opportunity, and willt describe further.s  F A daily incremental backup shadowset backup can can be done using the I file utility by Joe Meadows (Thank you, Joe for a nice tool) called FILE hE (available at http://www2.wku.edu/www/fileserv/fileserv.html ) along eC with some DCL. FILE allows one to change file attributes on a file.p  E The basic idea is to create a backup journal file during your backup, E use the journal file to create a list of what was backed up, and then-9 modify the backup date on the list of files using FILE.     A The backup journal listing will contain a list of the "inactive" rF shadowset files backed up.  But what you want to modify is the backup I date on is the volume name of master shadowset along with the "inactive" 0G shadowset directories and filenames.  So you need to adjust the savesetcC name found in the backup journal listing to your master volume when>E parsing together a complete filename spec, before you run FILE on it..  H But this assumes that the "inactive" files are still inactive/"not open"I continuously after the broke off "inactive" shadowsets are reshadowed to  J the master shadowsets.  When you run the FILE utility, the file you touch B will have to be closed or else you will have to make a second and G subsequent passes until you find it closed in attempting to change the tH backup date on the file.  At worse, if you do not or can not adjust the E backup date because a given file is open after multiple passes, then sI that file will find its way into the next daily incremental backup.  ThisaG could defeat the whole purpose of attempting to get an incremental, and G pending your application, you will simply end up with a full backup ande3 as such would be much better do such to begin with.t  D Now you mention "shut down the DB's", which implies to me a databaseI application or several databases.  As such, your files may not be closed rA or there is not the opportunity for the files to be closed after aF reshadowing.  If that is the case, then above will not work for you.  G If on the otherhand, your database application creates new versions of  E it's container files or you can daily export only the changes in the aH database to a closed file, or your database is RMS with the application G opening and closing files, as in my case; then the above can work quite  well.    :) jck   > -----Original Message-----0 > From: _RAQ_@yahoo.com [mailto:_RAQ_@yahoo.com]* > Sent: Friday, September 22, 2000 4:10 AM > To: Info-VAX@mvb.saic.comn# > Subject: Incremental backup bluest > ? > The way we do backups today is to shut down the DB's, splitt r > the shadowG > sets, restart the DB's, and then let the backup run on the "inactive"w4 > shadows set members. This gives us alot of uptime. > H > Problem is, we cant do incremental backup, since the recording pass isE > done to the "inactive" disks. When remounting the shadow member theoE > former "inactive" member with the recording pass gets overwritten -i > fair enough. >  > How could this be improved?p >  > Thanks   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:25:55 -0400 3 From: Jeff Goodwin <jgoodwin@spf.fairchildsemi.com>n9 Subject: Looking for Charles Addams "Source Code" cartoons5 Message-ID: <39CB7A02.8E7C9D59@spf.fairchildsemi.com>(  ? I'm looking for a copy of a Charles Addams cartoon that appears  something like this:  F   A woman and two children are standing beside a fresh grave site.  It isF   pouring rain and they are huddled under an umbrella.  A man standing nextG   to them asks..."I know this may be an awkward time, but do you recalla himn   ever mentioning source code?"t  ? I know I've seen it during some DECUS presentations in the pastc5 (particularly during a VAX /Alpha migration session).g  H If anyone can point me to an website that has it or EMAIL me a scan, I'd appreciate it.  
 -Jeff Goodwinv   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:07:30 -0500 " From: Earl Lakia <lakia@ipact.com> Subject: Re: Middleware for RMSa) Message-ID: <39CB67A2.BD67940E@ipact.com>n  7 I've used Easysoft's product and it worked rather well.o   -earla   Chris Breemer wrote:  	 > Hi all,d@ > Does there exist ODBC (or other middleware) to access RMS data> > from a PC ? Can RMS be accessed by RDB (I know there is ODBC > for RDB) ? >  > Thanks for any ideas.r >n >    Chris Breemer   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:35:17 +0100>- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>  Subject: Re: Middleware for RMSr) Message-ID: <39CB6E25.94D20FD8@bbc.co.uk>c   Earl Lakia wrote:m  9 > I've used Easysoft's product and it worked rather well.. >> > -earl   G I havn't used Hummingbird's Connx product but they did send me a glossy A and a demo CD, and I havn't seen it mentioned in this thread yet.r	 Certainlyy, RMS access via ODBC is one of the functions.   >t >t > Chris Breemer wrote: >  > > Hi all,eB > > Does there exist ODBC (or other middleware) to access RMS data@ > > from a PC ? Can RMS be accessed by RDB (I know there is ODBC > > for RDB) ? > >l > > Thanks for any ideas.  > >u > >    Chris Breemer   --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.ukU  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofn MedAS or the BBC.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:14:20 -0400s0 From: Jim Jennis <jjennis@discovery.fuentez.com> Subject: Re: Middleware for RMSeD Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20000922111420.009d8ec0@discovery.fuentez.com>  G We use WRQ Verastream for this. It is an excellent cross platform/crossDG database development toolkit and unlike other products that rely on theMI extra overhead of ODBC or JDBC provides access to  RMS files via native C ; interfaces, so it usually exhibits much higher performance.i  ' http://www.wrq.com/products/verastream/e   just my .02 FWIW   Regards,   Jim   ' At 03:35 PM 9/22/2000 +0100, you wrote:  >t >  >Earl Lakia wrote: >b: >> I've used Easysoft's product and it worked rather well. >> >> -earl > H >I havn't used Hummingbird's Connx product but they did send me a glossyB >and a demo CD, and I havn't seen it mentioned in this thread yet.
 >Certainly- >RMS access via ODBC is one of the functions.e >  >> >> >> Chris Breemer wrote:i >> >> > Hi all,C >> > Does there exist ODBC (or other middleware) to access RMS datatA >> > from a PC ? Can RMS be accessed by RDB (I know there is ODBCI >> > for RDB) ?- >> > >> > Thanks for any ideas. >> > >> >    Chris Breemer0 >  >--m7 >Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project@1 >MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.AB >Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk >eB >I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of >MedAS or the BBC. >o >t >o8 --------------------------------------------------------7 FSC - Building Better Information Technology Solutions- 7       from the Production Floor to the Customer's Door. 8 --------------------------------------------------------5 Jim Jennis, Technical Director for Commercial Systems  Fuentez Systems Concepts, Inc. 1 Discovery Place, Suite 2 Martinsburg, WV. 25401 USA   # Phone: +001 (304) 263-0163 ext. 235  Fax:   +001 (304) 263-0702% Email: jjennis@discovery.fuentez.com :        jhjennis@shentel.net & WEB: http://www.discovery.fuentez.com/   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:17:30 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)  Subject: Re: MULTIA + OpenVMS 2 Message-ID: <39cb30de.1368059485@news.newsguy.com>  2 On Thu, 21 Sep 2000 15:08:15 -0400, David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:    N >When the Multia was first offered, it wasn't all that cheap.  At that time itH >was less than any other Alpha, well, lets just say that I think it was,L >absolutes can get you in trouble.  Can't remember details, but it was maybeL >$3,500 or $4,500 or in that price range.  Maybe I'm wrong, and it was less.  ? That sounds about right but DEC were almost giving them away to D acdemic establishments. With NT of course... IIRC we could buy three; 64 MB 150Mhz multias for the cost of a similarly configureda- 3000-300LX . That's about five years ago now.s  M >If you look at a DS10L, it's not too different than the Multia.  Physically,-P >it's shaped different, but conceptually, it's a minimum sized box with just theC >essentials.  So, maybe the multia concept is alive and well today.u >e+ >Now if they could just sell them for $999.A >@ >DaveE >1 >-- 5 >David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450f5 >Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596C? >DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.come7 >T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486-   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 13:58:50 -0300l) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brx" Subject: OpenVMS features (future)L Message-ID: <OF4C5413D4.592D212E-ON83256962.0059A49D@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   People  < Of course OpenVMS is my prefered platform to work and manageF (and nowadays it=B4s paying my salary again ) and  the greatest thinks about OpenVMS are:   -  High Availability -  Easy Management -  Security 
 -  Robustnessi  . And all those adjectives we talk every day....  H So, it means OpenVMS is (almost)  Tivoli-less, Veritas-less, CA-less...=  H I worked at Veritas and they have lots of products (Unix/NT) and only o= neA for OpenVMS: the NetBackup client. They said to me they dont have  interest to develop to OVMS.D OpenVMS dont agregate value to a lot of soft companies because it is5  an EXCELENT OPERATING SYSTEM and dont need thousandsg& of products to help in the management.E Example: Oracle RDB RMU x  Oracle Enterprise (an additional product).   ? In this case the evolution  of OpenVMS must be in applications.4< Like IBM sales the black boxes (Netfi#@#!$%)  to e-commerce,: the goal of OpenVMS must be  : "E-XCELENT FOR E-VERYTHING"H With the new generation of NUMAs (GS, etc ...) will be the right choice=   for high computing.f  H The great lack are applications: but nobody wants to use character anym= ore.H The servers  I manage have 2000 users using character based application= s H (Cobol / Gembase) under VTs and the developers are thinking in migrate = toE  client-server (VB based applications). I believe will be a mess... Ic
 worked forF a bank with hundreds of stations spreaded in all the country and was a chaoswH to update the VB programs (almost every week) with  Tivoli (in slow lin= ks)e !!!!  B To OpenVMS become a sucess again, it must have a good and improvedH Web Server integrated to the OS (VMScluster, etc...), a good 4GL langua= ge, E must be web managed (and with all the resources of security will be ao sucess),= you can imagine a lot of things you would like in OpenVMS !!!w  B For me the great improvment will be the port of the OpenVMS nativeB management tools (like Monitor) to a java interface - for example.  F So, what do you think ??  I think the news is a good place to think inH the improvments, tools, features, etc .... we want from our prefered OS= .'  
 Fabio Cardosoo Analista de Suporteo( Compaq / Petrobras - Macae - RJ - Brasil     =    ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 17:54:47 +0000 (   ) 3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>-& Subject: Re: OpenVMS features (future)I Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10009221728020.7106-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>c  > On Fri, 22 Sep 2000 fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:  > > Of course OpenVMS is my prefered platform to work and manageH > (and nowadays it=B4s paying my salary again ) and  the greatest thinks > about OpenVMS are:   > -  High Availability > -  Easy Management
 > -  Security5 > -  Robustnesst  + I won't argue with that.  I would also add:c   Flexabilityc  F Reliability (not in a manner synonymous with the robustness above, butG meaning that VMS is predictable, and given a certain situation, one can  easilly tell how VMS will act)  F > OpenVMS dont agregate value to a lot of soft companies because it is7 >  an EXCELENT OPERATING SYSTEM and dont need thousands ( > of products to help in the management.  A There's a point that people miss usually, especially when they'reoC complaining about the lack of applications under VMS.  I'm glad youD
 mentioned it.w  < > the goal of OpenVMS must be  : "E-XCELENT FOR E-VERYTHING"I > With the new generation of NUMAs (GS, etc ...) will be the right choicec > for high computing.0  F It certainly will.  The problem, though, is that the bean-counters and$ pointy-hairs won't likely notice. :)  L > The great lack are applications: but nobody wants to use character anymor= e.J > The servers  I manage have 2000 users using character based applicationsK > (Cobol / Gembase) under VTs and the developers are thinking in migrate tooG >  client-server (VB based applications). I believe will be a mess... I   G The administrative overhead required to pull something like that off iseC immense, and it will only get worse as they decide to delegate more % functionality to the client machines.l  D Perhaps they could be convinced to go towards graphical thin-clients (xterms or the like) instead?i  D On that subject, it would be nice to see a modern graphical terminalG standard -- simmilar to the X protocol, but more efficient (hopefully). G That's not a VMS specific wish, but I hope that if such a protocol doesM% appear, VMS will make the most of it.C   > worked forH > a bank with hundreds of stations spreaded in all the country and was a > chaosrL > to update the VB programs (almost every week) with  Tivoli (in slow links= )l > !!!!  F A program that needs a weekly update sounds like it may just be poorlyE designed -- of course, I can't say for sure, since I haven't seen it.I  D > To OpenVMS become a sucess again, it must have a good and improvedL > Web Server integrated to the OS (VMScluster, etc...), a good 4GL language= ,I  G Do you really think the web server needs to be integrated, or should it E just be an option? (I believe the latter, personally.  The o/s shouldLI still be able to function without the web server, but there should be onesB available (I hear OSU is nice), perhaps even on the cds with VMS.)  G > must be web managed (and with all the resources of security will be ah
 > sucess),? > you can imagine a lot of things you would like in OpenVMS !!!K  D > For me the great improvment will be the port of the OpenVMS nativeD > management tools (like Monitor) to a java interface - for example.  F Again, tools like that might be nice to have as an option, but I don't7 think it's a good idea to force people to rely on them.o  J What I'd really like to see in VMS, myself is renewed support for POSIX soD that existing apps can be more easilly ported.  That might just giveA enough applications to make VMS a very viable choice where it wasQ- previously ruled out for lack of app support.t  F I also like some of the recent galaxy work that's been done, and wouldH like to see more work in that direction -- perhaps to the end of smallerD multiprocessor (2-4 cpu) desktop machines running VMS, to be used asB network servers, or for scientific apps... (I understand that some8 machines like these are -- or will soon be -- available)  I It's really hard to ask for changes in VMS, since most of the things thath9 one would want in an operating system are allready there.o   Chrisb  L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3DF "My two cents"=09=09=09(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)C Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)=09=09=09Prgramer^W Programmerp Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL. % -------------------------------------wI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes andcH weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes= and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949=20oL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:38:19 -0400b, From: "Fletcher Hearns" <hearns@softapp.com>; Subject: OpenVMS Systems as client to MS SQLserver  Server.h) Message-ID: <8qfuni$aif4@news1.gtech.com>e  
 Hello all,  A I have been asked to investigate making some VMS (and Tru65 Unix)tH application talk to a MS SQLserver Server box.  Basically I need the VMSI (and TRU64 Unix box) to act as client to the MS box.  Does anyone know of,- ODBC Client software to allow this to happen?o   Thanks in advance,     Fletcher   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 16:45:48 GMT - From: "Dave Pampreen" <davepampreen@home.com>b? Subject: Re: OpenVMS Systems as client to MS SQLserver  Server. ; Message-ID: <01My5.6498$hD4.1139921@news1.rdc1.mi.home.com>u  G Check out Attunity Connect at WWW.ATTUNITY.COM  I'm using it now and ito works fine.u   Dave    7 "Fletcher Hearns" <hearns@softapp.com> wrote in messageI# news:8qfuni$aif4@news1.gtech.com...h > Hello all, >sC > I have been asked to investigate making some VMS (and Tru65 Unix)cJ > application talk to a MS SQLserver Server box.  Basically I need the VMSK > (and TRU64 Unix box) to act as client to the MS box.  Does anyone know of / > ODBC Client software to allow this to happen?i >o > Thanks in advance, >p >g
 > Fletcher >t >a   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 14:37:04 GMTa From: amartineau@my-deja.com! Subject: OSU scripts under Apachen) Message-ID: <8qfqqd$ukh$1@nnrp1.deja.com>x  G I just installed Apache 1.3.12 on an Alpha server running VMS 7.2-1 andpF Multinet V4.2 Rev A-X, Serving documents and standard CGIs works fine.G But I need to migrate a bunch of OSU scripts. There is no documentationt7 on how to configure this. The lines in httpd.conf are :h  D # The /htbin directory invokes the OSUscript module, The DECnet task stringB # should be customized to invoke the OSU web server's scriptserver object.  #s <Location /htbin>w      SetHandler osuscript-handler+     OSUscript 0::"0=WWWEXEC" www_root:[bin]h     Order allow,deny     Allow from all </Location>   D It looks OK to me, so I did not change anything. When I try to run a script in www_root:[bin], likeH http://bla.com:8008/htbin/dcl_env_rm.com, I get a 500. There is no trace/ of anything in the Apache logs or the OSU logs.    Any idea anyone ? Thank you.   Alain Martineau   D P.S. I would rather stay with OSU, but the developers want servlets.    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 23:10:27 -0700B! From: Koloth <koloth@tmisnet.com> , Subject: Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships+ Message-ID: <39CAF7D3.AA1A4561@tmisnet.com>i  & --------------0D465DB05473D54D5602B8B1* Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   D When he says that it takes 1,000 sailors just to get the ship moving* I keep seeing this image of a lot of oars.  2 "Bad knews, that captain wants to go water skiing"   Cass   Lorin Ricker wrote:-   >- >-4 > > more dollars from US taxpayers, buying the best. > ? > > this just boggles the imagination, methinks.   Scary stuff.L >i1 > > http://www.gcn.com/vol19_no27/dod/2868-1.htmlg >DE > > Using a particular operating system to run a score of operations,oC > > rather than several legacy systems, will let the Navy train its F > > sailors to use one OS, Lockwood said. In the Navy, "there s been aB > > consistent mindset to take costs out from the beginning,  when > > designing ships. >.H > > It takes 1,000 sailors "just to get a ship moving,  Williamson said. >nD > > Microsoft software could let the ship s crew know when there s aH > > pending failure in a ships engineering system, for example, he said. >fE > Could this be the "space shuttle disaster in-waiting" alluded to in F > another thread?  Is the real reason behind the Navy's adoption of MSD > based on the fact that the *only* technology that the kids they'reE > inducting actually know is Windows?  Scary stuff indeed...  You geta/ > what you pay for (unless you're a taxpayer!).o >d >   -- Lorin  & --------------0D465DB05473D54D5602B8B1) Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-asciii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bitr  > <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html>D When he says that it takes 1,000 sailors just to get the ship moving. <br>I keep seeing this image of a lot of oars.5 <p>"Bad knews, that captain wants to go water skiing"k <p>Cassc <p>Lorin Ricker wrote: <blockquote TYPE=CITE>&nbsp;J <p><font size=-1>> more dollars from US taxpayers, buying the best.</font>K <p><font size=-1>> this just boggles the imagination, methinks.&nbsp;&nbsp;r Scary stuff.</font>n <p><font size=-1>> <a href="http://www.gcn.com/vol19_no27/dod/2868-1.html" TARGET="_blank">http://www.gcn.com/vol19_no27/dod/2868-1.html</a></font>tH <p><font size=-1>> Using a particular operating system to run a score of operations,</font>I <br><font size=-1>> rather than several legacy systems, will let the Navyi train its</font>F <br><font size=-1>> sailors to use one OS, Lockwood said. In the Navy, "there s been a</font>R <br><font size=-1>> consistent mindset to take costs out from the beginning,&nbsp; when</font>w+ <br><font size=-1>> designing ships.</font>.K <p><font size=-1>> It takes 1,000 sailors "just to get a ship moving,&nbsp;  Williamson said.</font>-J <br><font size=-1>> Microsoft software could let the ship s crew know when there s a</font>F <br><font size=-1>> pending failure in a ships engineering system, for example, he said.</font>F <p><font size=-1>Could this be the "space shuttle disaster in-waiting"H alluded to in another thread?&nbsp; Is the real reason behind the Navy'sI adoption of MS based on the fact that the *only* technology that the kids M they're inducting actually know is Windows?&nbsp; Scary stuff indeed...&nbsp;h< You get what you pay for (unless you're a taxpayer!).</font>4 <p><font size=-1>&nbsp; -- Lorin</font></blockquote> </html>   ( --------------0D465DB05473D54D5602B8B1--   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 09:34:39 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler), Subject: Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships+ Message-ID: <IAz9QMmWEClI@eisner.decus.org>i  k In article <418E68E524A8D311ACCE00508B78866A76816A@DENXCH>, Lorin Ricker <Lorin.Ricker@t-netix.com> writes:o > M > Could this be the "space shuttle disaster in-waiting" alluded to in anotherRK > thread?  Is the real reason behind the Navy's adoption of MS based on the J > fact that the *only* technology that the kids they're inducting actuallyK > know is Windows?  Scary stuff indeed...  You get what you pay for (unlessd > you're a taxpayer!). >   C ? Some thread I missed?  FYI the computers that control the shuttlecH wouldn't be recognized by any software MS ever wrote.  MS on the shuttle5 is limmited to laptops used for noncritial functions.-  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationo= Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil Group-E  Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replying    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:51:14 GMT,= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) , Subject: Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships0 Message-ID: <009F07FA.BA82803B@SendSpamHere.ORG>  Z In article <IAz9QMmWEClI@eisner.decus.org>, koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) writes:l >In article <418E68E524A8D311ACCE00508B78866A76816A@DENXCH>, Lorin Ricker <Lorin.Ricker@t-netix.com> writes: >> 5N >> Could this be the "space shuttle disaster in-waiting" alluded to in anotherL >> thread?  Is the real reason behind the Navy's adoption of MS based on theK >> fact that the *only* technology that the kids they're inducting actuallyjL >> know is Windows?  Scary stuff indeed...  You get what you pay for (unless >> you're a taxpayer!).y >> $ >0D >? Some thread I missed?  FYI the computers that control the shuttleI >wouldn't be recognized by any software MS ever wrote.  MS on the shuttlei6 >is limmited to laptops used for noncritial functions. >rG >----------------------------------------------------------------------0@ >Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporation> >Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil GroupF > Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replying  E When I worked for GE Astro, it believe that there was talk of FreedomeE having intel based computers.  What do you know of that?  I worked onD; the ill-fated Mars Obs. and that was the MIL-STD-1760A CPU.r   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMa            fO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.G   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:08:06 GMT $ From: jmf9@po.cwru.edu (Jon Fiedler), Subject: Re: OT:  More MSFT on US Navy ships- Message-ID: <39cb74b9.87522801@news.cwru.edu>.  3 On Thu, 21 Sep 2000 18:52:32 GMT, "Michael D. Ober" # <mdo.@.wakeassoc.com.nospam> wrote:r  F >MS is telling the truth.  MS has said over and over that Windows (any  >version) is NOT a real-time OS. >--g
 >Mike Ober >   3 (Gawd, this is getting way off topic for the group)   ? MS claims NT has real-time thread priorities.  I don't know howi$ real-time they actually get, though.  D ObThreadCrossover:  I learned this in an OS course whilst getting myD CS degree.  What was really fun was when we were told there would beF some NT projects; I asked the professor how I could do this since noneB of the three computers I had at home could run NT (CS had *really*E crappy labs, too).  Luckily, he changed his tune.  Unluckily, we thenn had to program on Slowlaris.   Jon    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 23:15:44 -0700V! From: Koloth <koloth@tmisnet.com>I+ Subject: Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy shipsc+ Message-ID: <39CAF90F.FA745996@tmisnet.com>C  M Wasn't there the USS Yorktown that was dead in the water due to a NT problem?e   Jim Agnew wrote:   > and, Shane, I've thought about that dammed channel every time i flip past it to either the weather channel or toon disney...  ;-)s > 
 > scary... > $ > Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com wrote: > >nO > > Won't happen. Didn't happen with that prototype smart ship when it was deaddO > > in the water for three days. You KNOW that whatever goes wrong, MSNBC won'toM > > report it. (The thought of a Microsoft owned news service still breaks mer > > out in a cold sweat.)h > >o	 > > Shane  > > 8 > > steven.reece@QUINTILES.COM on 09/21/2000 08:59:45 AM > >g > > To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comg > > cc:t > > 0 > > Subject:  Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships > > K > > As a passing thought, and to give Andrew a break for five minutes......  > >mM > > I wonder what publicity will be given to the first navy ship or submarinemM > > that gets lost at sea with or without all hands because of a failure of aaJ > > certain operating system?  It could put the publicity around the E-Bay- > > failures in the shade several times over.t > > L > > Then again, maybe some folks wouldn't like to see such publicity becauseJ > > the U.S. Government could really wipe the floor with them then........ > >-# > > Right.  Back to normal service.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 07:15:13 GMTv% From: Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com>f+ Subject: Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships8) Message-ID: <8qf0to$119$1@nnrp1.deja.com>F  7 In article <009F0757.04331A1A.25@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>, 2   Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk> wrote: > > G > > Has Microsoft yet demonstrated the ability to improve the stability ' > > of ANY of their operating systems ?  > >aG > > I've heard comments about how NT is about where VMS was after being D > > on the market the same number of years. A reminder of how stableG > > VMS 4.x was usually fogs up those Redmond rose-colored glasses wornS) > > by the "one would hope" IT PHBs/MGMs.i > >n8 > > --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own) >gH > 4.x? Heck, I think VMS 2.0 could have beaten NT4 SP6a for reliability.E > (Personally I think that SP5 is more reliable than 6A. The cynic inmH > my says they needed to add bugs to encourage the migration to W2K. No,( > they couldn't do that ... could they?) >uC > Back on VMS 3.x, there was a bug fixed which caused the system tot> > crash if a  process clocked up in excess of 2^32 pagefaults.D > (Overflow checking not disabled in kernel). It was spotted becauseD > someone's lab control process was pagefaulting at such a rate thatC > it crashed twice, and someone noticed that the boot-to-crash timepB > was almost exactly the same in both cases  (about eight months).> > That system was almost certainly running 2.x, as had it been? > undergoing normal upgrades the pattern would not have emergedn& > (and probably not the crash either). >pC > This also proves that way back, someone *expected* VMS to have anh! > MTBF in excess of eight months.   C I once had a dual-MicroVAX-3400 DSSI-Cluster that locked-up 2 timese= in a row after about 497 days. It was another 32-bit counter:h   $ python [...]e >>> import vms_sys* >>> print vms_sys.bintim ('0 00:00:00.01') -100000L, >>> print vms_sys.asctim (2L**32 * -100000L)  497 02:27:52.96 >>>   A That was on V5.5-2; I later learned about the real problem (over-), flow) from reading some ECO's release notes.   --
 Uwe Zessin    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.k   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:49:06 +0100w0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>+ Subject: Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy shipsl* Message-ID: <39CB3922.578B3250@uk.sun.com>  
 Koloth wrote:i > O > Wasn't there the USS Yorktown that was dead in the water due to a NT problem?e >   B Yes but it was OK the ship wasn't in a real battlefield situation  so no one died.r   Regards  Andrew Harrisons Enterprise IT Architectl   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 11:51:08 GMT) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie) + Subject: Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy shipsl' Message-ID: <8qfh3c$9e4$1@joe.rice.edu>   " Koloth (koloth@tmisnet.com) wrote:B : Wasn't there the USS Yorktown that was dead in the water due to  : a NT problem?a :e  5 http://www.sciam.com/1998/1198issue/1198techbus2.htmluM Scientific American: Technology and Business: Rough Sailing For Smart Ships: o
 November 1998i  ) http://catless.ncl.ac.uk/Risks/20.37.htmli$ The Risks Digest Volume 20: Issue 37  4 --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 09:24:00 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) + Subject: Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships + Message-ID: <ep$Y2E5Lbyoa@eisner.decus.org>e  ] In article <39CB3922.578B3250@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:i > Koloth wrote:y >> dP >> Wasn't there the USS Yorktown that was dead in the water due to a NT problem? >> n > D > Yes but it was OK the ship wasn't in a real battlefield situation  > so no one died.u > 	 > Regards- > Andrew Harrisoni > Enterprise IT Architect   / By the way folks, that was _humor_ from Andrew.n0 Please do not interpret it as being the official. real viewpoint of Sun or proof regarding their chip vendor, etc.n   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 14:04:21 +0100   From: steven.reece@quintiles.com+ Subject: Re: OT: More MSFT on US Navy ships=H Message-ID: <OF64598C33.2CC58DBA-ON80256962.004738BE@qedi.quintiles.com>  H >>> It takes 1,000 sailors "just to get a ship moving,=A0 Williamson sa= id.=A  Microsoft software could let the ship s crew know when there s a0H  pending failure in a ships engineering system, for example, he said. <= <<   Dead right it can.H Extract from a ships log, somewhere in the dim and distant past of abou= t-3 2001 (being read out of a time capsule of course) :q8 "General Protection Fault : Abort application or debug?" "BSOD"H "Er, Guys, it looks like the PC's stuffed again.  Capt'n, I think we're=  A about to have a pending failure in the ships engineering system."-H "No, I don't know how long the failure is going to last Sir, it depends=  on-5 whether we can find the disks to reinstall NT again."eH "Yes, I know it's the third time today, but Microsoft were really nice = theLH last two times and said they really valued my call and that they really=   wanted to help me."oH "Yes Sir, I'll let them know that we're being bombarded by shells from = that3 Russian destroyer but it might not help too much."=U   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:15:43 -0400 5 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.nospam>, Subject: Press Release6 Message-ID: <8qflv2$1af$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>   Dear Newsgroup,v  1 As I get this kind of information I will post it.e  K Thank you for being part of the OpenVMS community.  And for keeping me in a1 job that I love.  
 Sue Skonetskih  - _____________________________________________    Digitask Consultants  Tel: 212-682-6652 sales@digitask.com www.digitask.com      ; Digitask Consultants, Inc. Extends Compaq OpenVMS  Servicesl    H New York, September 19, 2000 -  Digitask Consultants, Inc. announces theH broadening of their relationship with Compaq Computer Corporation.  TheyK will now offer OpenVMS system integration services in New York, New Jersey,wC Pennsylvania, and Delaware, and OpenVMS Cluster consulting servicesiE throughout the United States.  This relationship leverages Digitasks-G OpenVMS expertise in the financial services market that enables them tou' provide fixed price, turnkey solutions:-+  Architecting and designing configurationsi!  Software design and developments  Systems deployment  Systems implementation  Systems performancea0  Storage Area Network design and implementation  G Digitask is an industry leader providing Compaq OpenVMS Cluster design,hE performance optimization, consulting and application development. TheeL company has the knowledge and expertise to assist Compaq OpenVMS AlphaServerI customers who require high performance, real-time solutions to move theirHG organizations and businesses forward in today's e-business environment.   J Our strategy is to align with systems integration organizations that haveB strong OpenVMS skills that address our customers high availabilityJ requirements, said Richard Marcello, Vice President of the Compaq OpenVMSJ Group.  Digitasks long-standing reputation for cluster expertise enables4 broader technical consulting services in this area."   About DigitaskF Digitask specializes in developing high-availability, mission-criticalB systems employing Compaqs non-stop Alpha platforms and clusteringL solutions. Over the last 16 years Digitask has compiled an impressive recordF of maintaining strong relationships with major financial institutions.H Digitasks principals and employees have presented seminars and lecturedI worldwide, authored numerous papers and the book High Performance Clustera System Management.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:26:07 GMTr% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)  Subject: Re: Press Release2 Message-ID: <39cb7822.1386304089@news.newsguy.com>  3 On Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:15:43 -0400, "Sue Skonetski"g& <susan.skonetski@compaq.nospam> wrote:   >Dear Newsgroup, >w2 >As I get this kind of information I will post it. > L >Thank you for being part of the OpenVMS community.  And for keeping me in a >job that I love.s   Keep it up Sue!   @ And we just received our balls this morning. Amazingly effectiveA marketing tool. Pity we haven't got any work done today though :)e  D One minor complaint: I've tried booting it a few times but can't getB to a VMS prompt. Just an error code flashed from the console LEDs.A What am I doing wrong? Maybe I'm just not booting it hard enough.r   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:44:24 -0700e! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com  Subject: Re: Press ReleaseC Message-ID: <OF5208CB0C.7A1566C0-ON88256962.005B9F8D@HEALTHNET.COM>t  I Sue, what have you done with my balls? I've been sitting here waiting fornJ my balls to arrive in the post, and so far nothing. I certainly used to beI on the mailing list, but perhaps I've been removed - or to put it anothero  way, my balls have been cut off.   Shaneo  G P.S. I know. Someday my inability to resist a straight line will get me. into trouble....          9 A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) on 09/22/2000 08:26:07 AMs   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comh cc:a   Subject:  Re: Press Releasen    3 On Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:15:43 -0400, "Sue Skonetski"p& <susan.skonetski@compaq.nospam> wrote:   >Dear Newsgroup, >z2 >As I get this kind of information I will post it. ><J >Thank you for being part of the OpenVMS community.  And for keeping me in ab >job that I love./   Keep it up Sue!z  @ And we just received our balls this morning. Amazingly effectiveA marketing tool. Pity we haven't got any work done today though :)t  D One minor complaint: I've tried booting it a few times but can't getB to a VMS prompt. Just an error code flashed from the console LEDs.A What am I doing wrong? Maybe I'm just not booting it hard enough.>   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 17:57:30 +0100-  From: steven.reece@quintiles.com Subject: Re: Press ReleaseH Message-ID: <OFBD7A28F8.716EE0AB-ON80256962.005CC3CC@qedi.quintiles.com>   Sue,H Can I add my own thanks to you and your colleagues throughout Compaq forH keeping OpenVMS going from strength to strength and for keeping both you and me in jobs.h  I Like Alan G., my ball arrived this morning but that's not the reason I'vesJ got very little work done today.  It provides something for Monday though! :-)t  
 Thanks again.a Steve.  ? Sue Skonetski (susan dot skonetski at compaq dot nospam) wrote:a4 >>>As I get this kind of information I will post it.  K Thank you for being part of the OpenVMS community.  And for keeping me in ac job that I love.<<<b   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:34:27 +0000 (GMT)=, From: Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com>) Subject: Problem with COMPAQ 9.1GB drives15 Message-ID: <F205Er8pkpLkTgbLYlu00001d2f@hotmail.com>0  M Hello all. I purchased a COMPAQ (Quantum, I think) 9.1 GB drive for an alpha  K in April. This drive failed last month and COMPAQ sent a replacement. Once nL the data was restored, the drive seemed to work OK. However, during a large L software installation, the drive loged a few parity errors. There appear to H be some bad blocks. COMPAQ tells me that "drives usually have a few bad + blocks" and that I should work around them.t  L Since there doesn't seem to be the usual bad block flagging and replacement D mechanism for local SCSI drives, I am not sure what to do. COMPAQ's K suggestion was to leave this old file there and create a new one. The file o@ is very large, and I don't feel this is a valid solution anyway.  , 1) Should I keep this drive or send it back?8 2) Has anyone else had problems with these 9.1GB drives?   BTW, here is the error info:   $  anal/disk/read dka200:e' %ANALDISK-I-BBLHEADER, file (8583,3,1)  & [ORACLE8.816.RDBMS]LIBSERVER8_64.OLB;1%         contains suspected bad blocksFL %ANALDISK-W-READFILE, file (8583,3,1) [ORACLE8.816.RDBMS]LIBSERVER8_64.OLB;1         error reading VBN 59135  -SYSTEM-F-PARITY, parity errorL %ANALDISK-W-READFILE, file (8583,3,1) [ORACLE8.816.RDBMS]LIBSERVER8_64.OLB;1         error reading VBN 59215e -SYSTEM-F-PARITY, parity error< %ANALDISK-W-DELHEADER, file (10418,1,1) ORACLIENT_V816.EXE;1         marked for deleteo> %ANALDISK-W-DELHEADER, file (12577,1,1) ORACLIENT64_V816.EXE;1         marked for deletee   Thanks.c Bill McLaughlinwI _________________________________________________________________________dI Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.   D Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at  http://profiles.msn.com.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:21:24 GMTe From: tony_barratt@my-deja.com( Subject: remote tailing of file with UCX) Message-ID: <8qftcq$22o$1@nnrp1.deja.com>'   Hi List,@ I've got a requirement to remotely tail a log file on a VMS box.G However as I am a refugee from unixland, I'm can't quite figure out why- it doesn't work.   Service is defined as follows: CMS03> ucx sho serv hnm /full| Service: HNM State: Enabled) Port: 8000 Protocol: TCP Address: 0.0.0.0l/ Inactivity: 5  User_name: ORACLE7 Process: HNMD  Limit: 5 Active: 0 Peak: 2  File: DSA0:[ORACLE7.HNM]HNM1.COM
 Flags: Listenb Socket Opts: Rcheck Scheck Receive: 0 Send: 0 Log Opts: None File: not definedk Security Reject msg: not defined- Accept host: 0.0.0.0 Accept netw: 0.0.0.0   The file thats executed: dsa0:[oracle7.hnm]hnm1.com CMS03> ty hnm1.com $!/ $ ty/cont/tail=20  dsa0:[oracle7.hnm]health.loga $! $! show time $!exit   Telnetting to cms03 port 8000:   CMS03> telnet cms03 8000( %TELNET-I-TRYING, Trying ... 212.31.98.34 %TELNET-I-SESSION, Session 01, host cms03, port 8000( -TELNET-I-ESCAPE, Escape character is ^]  E This should imo give the last 20 lines in the health.log file, but it2 doesn't.    CMS03> sho proc/id=2082D308/cont Process HNMD_BG6699 16:33:19 State LEF Working set 107d) Cur/base priority 9/4 Virtual pages 10331 * Current PC 800C9E44 CPU time 0 00:00:00.19# Current PSL 0000001B Direct I/O 358p) Current user SP 7AFE1650 Buffered I/O 135- PID 2082D308 Page faults 178+ UIC [ORACLE7] Event flags E0000001 00000000o& DSA0:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSEXE]TYPE.EXE  9 Therefore it is running TYPE but nothing is being output?a  
 Any ideas?   TIAe   Tony    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 01:36:28 -0400 * From: David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>= Subject: Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work? - Message-ID: <39CAEFDC.F92B2577@tsoft-inc.com>-   Charles Gilley wrote:  > P > I want to cold-spare a system drive on a VAX4300.  I make a stand-alone backupL > tape of the existing system image and blast it onto a replacement disk.  I7 > would think that the licenses should still load, yes?p  + Even better, do an IMAGE copy disk to disk.'  O > Under what hardware circumstances would the licenses not load, replacement ofrO > motherboard?  Network card?  From unix-land, many licenses like to tie to theo. > physical network address.  Does VMS do this?  K Licenses will load if the units of the PAK (license) are sufficient for theyM current hardware.  To see requirements, issue the command SHOW LICENSE/CHARGE   N > Lastly, when my machine boots, I see a number of license manager complaints. > Are these logged anywhere?   Don't think so.C   Dave   -- 04 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:07:42 GMTt0 From: gilley@nospam.bravewc.com (Charles Gilley)= Subject: Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work?h5 Message-ID: <24Hy5.458$g4.1842@skycache.prestige.net>   
 thanks david.r   chg    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 09:20:55 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)o= Subject: Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work?i+ Message-ID: <I+DwDUXtOS77@eisner.decus.org>e  h In article <AXAy5.457$g4.1517@skycache.prestige.net>, gilley@nospam.bravewc.com (Charles Gilley) writes:  N > Lastly, when my machine boots, I see a number of license manager complaints. > Are these logged anywhere?  G If system parameter STARTUP_P2 is set to "VD" the startup output shoulds# be found in SYS$SYSTEM:STARTUP.LOG.m   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 14:52:58 +0000 (UTC)a* From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@kanto.cc.jyu.fi>= Subject: Re: Replacing system disk, will licenses still work? , Message-ID: <8qfroa$c4s$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>  1 Charles Gilley <gilley@nospam.bravewc.com> wrote:  ...tO > Under what hardware circumstances would the licenses not load, replacement of O > motherboard?  Network card?  From unix-land, many licenses like to tie to the . > physical network address.  Does VMS do this? ...r    licences - very complicated area2 ( http://www6.compaq.com/products/software/info/ )  J AFAIK no licences from DEC/Compaq are tied (technically) to any individualD hardware. Some third party software are for ex. to ethernet address.G So replacing any component by same model (functionally equivalent) willt not break Compaq licences.G VMS base licence is not allowed to be moved from one CPU box to anotherh without permission from Compaq. F It will work if it contains enough units for new CPU and is right typeE (VAX/VAXstation/VAXserver/Alpha). For example adding graphics displaycD console to certain MicroVAX models change them to VAXstation and VMS licences cease to work.mH In the cluster some basic licences must be owned to named cluster nodes.H Node names are given when registering licences and may be changed later. ...s   regardse            Osmo Kujala   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:22:00 +0100a& From: Roy Omond <Roy.Omond@compaq.com>6 Subject: Re: RSH Problem - Can someone try this for me* Message-ID: <39CB32C8.D8285CAE@compaq.com>   Hoff Hoffman wrote:0  I > In article <8qcqtq$d98$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, thefantom@my-deja.com writes:e; > :From a windows NT 4 Machine command prompt (dos)enter :-e; > :(REXEC works in the same way as RSH but with a password)o > :e+ > :REXEC VaxNodeName -l username -n WAIT 10- > : >   That requests a ten-minute wait on OpenVMS, obviously.   Oops Hoff (minor nitpick):  * 10 *minute* wait ?  Nope, it's 10 *hours*.  	 Roy Omond  Blue Bubble Ltd., (certainly not speaking on behalf of Compaq)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:35:51 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>t- Subject: Re: Serial line programming questioni) Message-ID: <39CB0BD7.9BE7B282@gtech.com>-   Antti Jarvinen wrote:aE > Here: how do I check if there is anything to read from the TTA0: or  > whatever without blocking?   SYS$QIO(W).l  M > It seems like there is something like sys$qio(horrible,number,of,arguments) H > that might do the trick, is there any good examples, simple ones, thatL > would do something similar to reading a serial port and being able to have0 > a time-out in that reading of nothing appears?   You may get some ideas from:  % ftp://ftp.hhs.dk/pub/vms/misc/getch.cs0 http://www.hhs.dk/anonymous/pub/vms/misc/getch.c  C Which implements the "PC" functions getch and kbhit via SYS$QIO(W).-  M > Is there newsgroup more devoted to programming in VMS? This is comp.OS.vms,c) > not comp.programming.vms or something..R  F Nope - comp.os.vms are everything from assembler programming to prices on new Alphas.c   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:39:17 GMTt From: dejamalc@my-deja.com Subject: set watch) Message-ID: <8qfcsj$edr$1@nnrp1.deja.com>u  = Are there any other options for "set watch" other than FILE ?   	 dejamalc.t    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.r   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:03:29 GMTu= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)i Subject: Re: set watch0 Message-ID: <009F07EB.ACFFC151@SendSpamHere.ORG>  F In article <8qfcsj$edr$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, dejamalc@my-deja.com writes:> >Are there any other options for "set watch" other than FILE ?   Presently, no.  F The SET.CLD file defines a watch option type clause which has a single keyword, FILE.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMo            hO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:02:44 GMTg From: dejamalc@my-deja.com Subject: Sockets and Fortran) Message-ID: <8qf77c$8i6$1@nnrp1.deja.com>e  @ We are using TCPWare on our Vaxes to get IP connectivity, I haveF managed to write a simple socket program in 'C' but my Fortran is much8 better than my 'C' and I would like to use this instead.  E Does anyone know of an example of Socket programming in Fortran which " would work on a Vax with TCPWare ?   Many thanksk      & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.d   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:17:48 -0400a* From: Chuck Chopp <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com>  Subject: Re: Sockets and Fortran+ Message-ID: <39CB6A0C.4ED5187E@rtfmcsi.com>y   dejamalc@my-deja.com wrote:e  B > We are using TCPWare on our Vaxes to get IP connectivity, I haveH > managed to write a simple socket program in 'C' but my Fortran is much: > better than my 'C' and I would like to use this instead. >-G > Does anyone know of an example of Socket programming in Fortran whichI$ > would work on a Vax with TCPWare ? > 
 > Many thankso >o( > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.   B If you use the UCX $QIO interface then you can use Fortran w/o anyI problems.  TCPWare, Multinet and I think even the CMU/IP freeware producta3 all support the $QIO interface that UCX implements.   H I've got some sample Fortran code around that makes $QIO calls to open aI TCP socket and send/receive data.  I'll email a .ZIP file to you if I canw
 dig it up.     Chuckp -- Chuck Choppi  8 ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com            http://www.rtfmcsi.com0                                   ICQ # 22321532@ RTFM Consulting Services Inc.     864 801 2795 voice & voicemail2 103 Autumn Hill Road              864 801 2774 fax4 Greer, SC  29651                  800 400 4935 pagerC                                   8004004935@alphapage.airtouch.comd   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:21:41 -0700e7 From: "Arthur E. Ragosta" <ragosta@merlin.arc.nasa.gov>a  Subject: Re: Sockets and Fortran3 Message-ID: <39CB7905.A4EFACBF@merlin.arc.nasa.gov>o   dejamalc@my-deja.com wrote:e  B > We are using TCPWare on our Vaxes to get IP connectivity, I haveH > managed to write a simple socket program in 'C' but my Fortran is much: > better than my 'C' and I would like to use this instead. > G > Does anyone know of an example of Socket programming in Fortran which $ > would work on a Vax with TCPWare ? > 
 > Many thanksh >s( > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.l  J Here's a sample fragment  (geared towards Multinet) that shows using a 'C' interface to passeF buffers of data to/from a FORTRAN routine.  I'm sure something similar
 would work inr TCPWare.   ar  ? ***************************************************************k /*+  *  General Purpose TCP Server.  (GPSERVER)i  *C  *  This server is called anytime Merlin receives a request for themD  *  GPSERVER TCP service.  The first packet must include the purposeC  *  as the first character in the packet (as described below).  ThejD  *  remainder of the packet (and all subsequent packets) are defined  *  by the function code.r  *  *.  *  To compile and link this server on the VAX  *    $ CC S  *    $ LINK S,SYS$INPUT:/OPT ,  *    MULTINET:MULTINET_SOCKET_LIBRARY/SHARE  *    SYS$SHARE:VAXCRTL/SHARE   *    ^Z  *  */(   #include <stdio.h>6 #include "multinet_root:[multinet.include.sys]types.h"7 #include "multinet_root:[multinet.include.sys]socket.h"e7 #include "multinet_root:[multinet.include.netinet]in.h"D2 #include "multinet_root:[multinet.include]netdb.h"   main() {t  unsigned short s, vs;  int i, n, status;  char buf[256];          char subtype;a=  static struct {int Size; char *Ptr;} Descr={9 ,"SYS$INPUT"};d     /*?  *  $ASSIGN a channel to SYS$INPUT. This channel is the channele  *  to the network connection.  */e  '  status = SYS$ASSIGN(&Descr, &s, 0, 0);   if (!(status&1)) {n   exit(status);p  }     /*D  *  First buffer... the first character contains the operation to be  *  performed.  *  *  *A  *  socket_read() will return 0 on end-of-file, or -1 on error...   */e&  n = socket_read(s, buf, sizeof(buf));    if (n <= 0) {8      socket_perror("GPSERVER: empty request received.");  }             subtype = buf[0];D  O /******************************************************************************a    */  *  Defined service subtypes (first character):n  *&  *     E - Echo packet + 'from Merlin'   *     L - Lookup EMail for RDECE  *     S - Send status information... see 'Get_Status' for definitiono*  *     U - Send updated events information  *O  *****************************************************************************/n               switch (subtype) {              case 'e':            case 'E':"                 do_echo (buf, &n);                 break;              case 'l':            case 'L':+                 lookup_stuff (&s, buf, &n);                  break;              case 's':            case 'S':%                 get_status (buf, &n);f-                 i = socket_write (s, buf, n);p                 break;              case 'u':            case 'U':)                 /* Not yet implemented */                  break;              default: #                 send_art (buf, &n);wJ /*                socket_perror("GPSERVER: unknown subtype received."); */                   break;            }     /*$  *  Now close down the connection...  */n    socket_close(s);-   /*  *  Exit successfully.  */   	  exit(1);7 }   N ******************************************************************************  $         subroutine do_echo (buff, n)         character *256 buff  c *         buff = buff(1:n) // ' from Merlin'         n = min0(256, n+12)p         return         endt   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:16:43 -0400y0 From: Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com> Subject: SoftVMS for MacintoshC Message-ID: <paul.r.anderson-3F4455.09164322092000@news.compaq.com>a  , Tricked you with the subject line, didn't I?  F The mention of SoftVMS software running on Macintosh tricked me, too,  until I went to   0    http://www.bannister.org/software/softvms.htm  C and realized what it was (Dreamcast Visual Memory System emulator).-   Paul   -- e,    Paul Anderson, OpenVMS Engineering (DCPS),    Compaq Computer Corporation, Littleton MA   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 12:32:36 GMT) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)p Subject: SRAM Corruption Threadn' Message-ID: <8qfjh4$9e4$4@joe.rice.edu>   A There's a thread on SRAM corruption going on in these newsgroups:h  1    sci.physics, comp.arch.embedded, comp.realtimee  % where the attached article came from.o  4 --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)N ==============================================================================' From: Ian BARNETT <Ian.Barnett@cern.ch> 8 Newsgroups: sci.physics,comp.arch.embedded,comp.realtime2 Subject: Re: SRAM Corruption when traveling abroad% Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:37:45 +0200  Organization: CERN	 Lines: 37d' Message-ID: <39CAFE39.83026A18@cern.ch>e* References: <8qdu7e$pvr$1@nnrp1.deja.com> A             <45xy5.2167$6b2.38249@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com> b-             <39CAD1F3.515313F7@utdallas.edu> e-             <39cad89f.679323@news.swbell.net>  Reply-To: Ian.Barnett@cern.chA# NNTP-Posting-Host: pc2sl067.cern.ch  Mime-Version: 1.0S* Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bitD> X-Trace: sunnews.cern.ch 969604660 3692 (None) 137.138.197.142% X-Complaints-To: news@sunnews.cern.ch-& X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I)   Hi list(  E 	We are having the same problem here at CERN and are studying neutronBF radiation effects on SRAMs. The main problem is single event latchup -  9 http://www.aero.org/seet/primer/single_event_latchup.htmlA  E We are now designing EDAC (error detection & correction ) circuits ink FPGAs to overcome this problem.M   Ian Barnett_ CERN* European Orginisation for Nuclear Research   Bruce wrote: >  > In comp.realtime6 > "William R. Frensley" <frensley@utdallas.edu> wrote: > M > >One question is what is the SRAM implementation?  A full 6-transistor CMOSoJ > >cell should be very robust against any random charge-generating events,M > >since each node of the circuit always has a low-impedance path to power ori
 > >ground. > K > It is 6 transistor CMOS and the effect is a very real problem, especiallyoF > for electronics in space.  Here are some links if you're interested: > = > http://nepp.nasa.gov/imd/eee_links/vol_02/no_01/eee2-1r.htms7 > Description of the CRUX (Cosmic Ray Upset eXperiment)v > K > http://chemistry.about.com/science/chemistry/library/weekly/aa052200a.htm  > A bunch of links to articles > < > http://www.mitsubishichips.com/press/releases/fsram_99.htmJ > A Misubishi press release announcing their new cosmic ray resistant SRAM > for laptops. >  > Bruceu   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 15:26:18 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)6 Subject: Re: strlen(), comparisons, unexpected results, Message-ID: <8qftmq$mch@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  U In article <39CA0FE1.54549E8D@compaq.com>, Ed Vogel <edward.vogel@compaq.com> writes:  >David Mathog wrote: >T< >> Why doesn't this code generate some type of QUESTCOMPARE? >AN >    Because the part of the compiler that generates the questcompare messagesN >    is not smart enough to track the value of the fsize variable.  If you had: >    replaced fsize with -1, then you would see a message. >   L In the spirit of making the C compiler do the heavy lifting perhaps we couldG get a couple more /CHECK options implemented?  One is suggested by thisI6 bug, and the other by a common memory access problem.    1. /check=IMPLICITCAST   which would cause code like:      size_t tval;u    int    ival;t         tval = ival;   to actually compile like:y  Q      if(ival < 0)decc$trap("illegal conversion: negative value to unsigned int");-      tval = ival;    and this code:        ival = tval;    as  ^      if(tval > MAXINT)decc$trap("illegal conversion: unsigned int larger than int to int");         ival = tval;.  G and so on for the various double<->float and other similar cast relatedaK problems.  (Presumably the compiler has enough information when it decides xJ to do the implicit cast to determine if the right side or left side range K checks are appropriate!) Such checks would only be compiled in for IMPLICITiC casts, since if the programmer specified the cast he/she presumablysK intended that particular action. This switch might not be used all the timenJ as it would slow things down a lot if the check had to be performed withinF a loop, but it would allow various sorts of bugs to be detected duringI development and testing.   (And the optimizer could move this code out ofLH loops just as it does other code.)  Moreover, to enter this code by handE would require careful line by line analysis of the software, and whenC= you're facing 100k lines of C that's a daunting proposition. 2     2. /cast=OUTSIDEALLOCi  - Here's a bug that I'm tired of exterminating:,   int *iarray; int j;  "    iarray=malloc(sizeof(int)*100);    for(j=0; j<=100; j++){l6        iarray[j]=0;  /* out of bounds when j is 100 */    }  H check OUTSIDEALLOC would cause this code to intead to compile like this:   /* from some header */ #ifdef _CHECK_OUTSIDE_ALLOC_! typedef struct memstruct MEMBLOCK8 struct memstruct {   void * begin;d
   void * end;    };; void decc$memory_block( MEMBLOCK * limits, void * pointer);0" #endif /* _CHECK_OUTSIDE_ALLOC_ */   int *iarray; int j;  "    iarray=malloc(sizeof(int)*100);    for(j=0; j<=100; j++){ W        MEMBLOCK tptr_001;  /* if more than one inside a function, then tptr_002 etc. */e-        decc$memory_block(&tptr_001, &iarray);G        if(&(iarray[j]) < tptr_001.begin || &(iarray[j]) > tptr_001.end)decc$trap("Memory access outside of intended memory block");s6        iarray[j]=0;  /* out of bounds when j is 100 */    }  ? where decc$memory_block() calls code similar to decc$free() and-E has access to the memory allocation tables.  The function returns theKH limits of that block of memory, or if the pointer is not in a block, it G causes the program to terminate.  Such a function might be quite slow, rI especially if iarray isn't the first byte in a malloc'd region.  But the  K compiler should be able to optimize that function call outside of the loop,eC since iarray doesn't change within the function call or the loop.  s  G This switch would also affect regular pointer operations, but since theeL intended memory block is not generally possible to determine, it would just 8 verify that the access was within some memory block, ie:  "    int setvalfunction(int * ival){       *ival = 0;    }   would become     "    int setvalfunction(int * ival){%        decc$memory_block(NULL, ival);p       *ival = 0;    }  J I think that the trickiest part of implementing this would be determining I when to apply the test.  Obviously it could be applied everywhere that a dJ pointer value is changed (or first encountered), or everywhere it is used,H but logically it only needs to be applied at the next access to a memoryG location following a pointer's value change.   (Tricky!)  Sometimes the F pointer may be intentionally set outside of memory, but never accessed there. For instance: n  $   front=malloc(sizeof(int)*MAXVALS);X   for(next=front, next-- ; j<MAXVALS; j++){  /* next points outside of a memory block */     if(sometest){y        next++;M        *next=1;                          /* but it is only USED within one */C        if(secondtest){N          *next=2;                        /* no need to test here too though */        }     }s   }      Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu ? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech     ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:39:45 -0400i( From: Ed Vogel <edward.vogel@compaq.com>6 Subject: Re: strlen(), comparisons, unexpected results* Message-ID: <39CB8B51.B87E8F8B@compaq.com>   David Mathog wrote:    >hN > In the spirit of making the C compiler do the heavy lifting perhaps we couldI > get a couple more /CHECK options implemented?  One is suggested by this 7 > bug, and the other by a common memory access problem.D >3  F     Your suggestions have been noted.  We have been asked for overflowI     checking in the past,  there is some chance we would add this featureoJ     in the future.   Your second suggestion is far more complex.   I doubt$     you would see this anytime soon.                        Ed Vogelo)                      Compaq C Engineerings   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:53:37 GMTe/ From: "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net>a# Subject: Suggested VMS new feature!hE Message-ID: <5gLy5.1782$6T.157328@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>t  K I bet none of you will ever guess why I am asking for this new feature now!  ;-(t  I How difficult would it be to inocorporate an undelete utility within VMS?o WithE the huge disk drives that are coming available, it seems to me that ar wastebasketpF concept, where all "deleted" files are temporarily deposited, would be	 extremely I usefull.  Especially in light of the VMS propensity to use the last blocks	 freed fore the next disk space allocation.a  I The utility could allocate a percentage of the disk for deleted files.  Ae showH device command wouldn't display this space as available.  There could beL various ways of emptying the waste basket, but the point would be that rightL after you hit the delete key, and then utter "Oh  Sh*t" , you would at least have  a prayer of retrieving the file.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 13:25:30 -0500i* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>' Subject: Re: Suggested VMS new feature!.- Message-ID: <0033000005031557000002L072*@MHS>e  H =0AI bet none of you will ever guess why I am asking for this new featu= re now!u ;-(   H How difficult would it be to inocorporate an undelete utility within VM= S? WithE the huge disk drives that are coming available, it seems to me that a- wastebasket F concept, where all "deleted" files are temporarily deposited, would be	 extremelyaH usefull.  Especially in light of the VMS propensity to use the last blo= ck	 freed fore the next disk space allocation.   H The utility could allocate a percentage of the disk for deleted files. =  A showH device command wouldn't display this space as available.  There could b= eoH various ways of emptying the waste basket, but the point would be that = rightyH after you hit the delete key, and then utter "Oh  Sh*t" , you would at = least- have  a prayer of retrieving the file.    H      You will find that this feature exists, after a fashion in the BAC= KUP:      utility. ;-)n        WWWebb=   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 00:33:45 -0400u* From: David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist, Message-ID: <39CAE129.516259B@tsoft-inc.com>   andrew harrison wrote: > 	 > Rubbishe8 > Intel initially denied there was an issue and tried to; > rubbish the claims about FP errors. It was only when theyh8 > were forced to concede in public that the FP issue did7 > exist that they started the processor recall process.U  M You bet!  Intel tried to downplay the problem.  And then when forced into theaO recall, they were very explicit about return of the faulty chip.  One could say P that they wanted to get the defective parts out of use.  But from their originalP response, one would probably be more accurate to say that they figured the chipsK were still usable, and didn't want customers to get a free extra CPU out of N them.  I do remember that they felt very put-upon when forced to fix a problem that they themselves created.   L Also, the recent problem with the Intel 1.13 GHz chip was at first denied byO Intel.  Only when independantly verified, and witnessed by one of their people, K would they begin to even look at the problem, and I seem to recall that the-6 withdrawal of the chip still took an additional month.   Dave   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:26:15 +0100r0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist* Message-ID: <39CB25B7.9E7B1F87@uk.sun.com>   David A Froble wrote:e >  > andrew harrison wrote: > >v > > Rubbisht: > > Intel initially denied there was an issue and tried to= > > rubbish the claims about FP errors. It was only when theyf: > > were forced to concede in public that the FP issue did9 > > exist that they started the processor recall process.  > O > You bet!  Intel tried to downplay the problem.  And then when forced into thepQ > recall, they were very explicit about return of the faulty chip.  One could say R > that they wanted to get the defective parts out of use.  But from their originalR > response, one would probably be more accurate to say that they figured the chipsM > were still usable, and didn't want customers to get a free extra CPU out ofoP > them.  I do remember that they felt very put-upon when forced to fix a problem > that they themselves created.  > N > Also, the recent problem with the Intel 1.13 GHz chip was at first denied byQ > Intel.  Only when independantly verified, and witnessed by one of their people,.M > would they begin to even look at the problem, and I seem to recall that thet8 > withdrawal of the chip still took an additional month. > A There was also the illegal instruction sequence which caused the  C processor to hang, this was executable from user space and resulted E in systems hanging when people used it as a denial of service attack.S  D This was fixed by all the OS vendors with Intel based OS's releasingG patches that stopped the particular attack. There was no general recall!. if Intel CPU's although it was a hardware bug.     Regardsr Andrew Harrisonr Enterprise IT Architecti   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:29:53 +0100d0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist* Message-ID: <39CB34A1.5B0FE000@uk.sun.com>   Jordan Henderson wrote:  > = > Yes, I've heard the explanation... Now, enlighten us.  What*< > _exactly_ was the patch that was not available for "over a; > year"?  When was it first made available and what problem'< > did it address?  Most patches have a URL, where is the URL< > for this one?  I think you'll find that these details have > never been revealed. > 5 So you heard the explanation but thought why believe *4 Sun, eBay and the two software vendors all of whome 1 say exactly the same thing. Instead you choose to 5 believe the rumour and FUD which as you must realise   have no actual basis in fact.   > > Who is protected by not revealing this information?  Indeed,9 > other customers might be similarly exposed and might be:! > interested in this information.  > 5 The 3rd party supplier and eBay are protected. It is e2 no advantage to Sun to keep the information quiet.  ; The fact that you choose not to believe Sun, eBay, Veritas p= and Oracle and instead choose to believe sources that are at  / best biased against Sun says volumes about you.   = > More convenient finger pointing.  It could all well just be  > a cover story. > 6 You of course a entitled to your opinion, sad for you 7 that very few people outside the confines of this groupl hold the same views.    B > > Remember eTrade, what happened there, was it a Compaq engineerD > > doing the wrong thing and a bug in the OpenVMS cluster software,B > > who knows, neither Compaq or eTrade have been very forthcoming: > > about what really caused eTrade to have their outages. > < > I heard that a Compaq engineer had improperly put a lot of> > non cluster traffic on a Fiber Cluster Interconnect.  SoundsC > reasonable.  Case closed.  And, we don't hear continued instancesFE > of downtime amounting to many dozens of hours like we do with eBay.  > 7 But eTrade did not have one outage associated with this 5 issue, they had a number each of which lasted hours. e  : So you have a number of outages at eTrade which according = to your information was caused by Compaq and the 22 hour eBaye6 outage which was not caused by Sun hardware, software  or engineers.   5 Yet you still persist in trying muddy Sun's name overd9 the eBay outage. Not a very credible stance to be taking.e     > >yC > > > I'm waiting for those people to be shown to be liars.  Sorry,m> > > > I can't take your word for it, you're just not credible.; > > > Everytime I do catch you in a clear lie, anyone who'soC > > > interested please trawl through deja, you change the subject.5 > > >8? > > So when they said that it was Sun hardware or software that ? > > caused the outage when in fact it was a bug in an unpatched-; > > 3rd party product, they were not lying or being idiots.t > > > It's called credibility.  Since you've never had any I don't > expect you to recognize it.a >     5 No Jordan it does not matter how credible you appear d3 if you are not telling the truth. A lie is a lie noi7 matter how credible the source is, in the same way thate4 truth is also independant of the credibility to you  of the source.  8 You appear to be wrestling with a problem which is that 5 I work for Sun therefor I cannot be a credible sourceh4 in your eyes. But all the credible sources (in your 2 eyes) like Rob and Kerry have been shown up to be 5 often wrong particularly if their pronouncements havet4 anything to do with the capabilities or otherwise of to be released Compaq products.e  6 On the other hand when Rob for example said Oracle and6 Sybase were really interested in Galaxies, I said they5 wern't and that there was no information from either  ( Oracle or Sybase to back up Rob's claim.  5 You no doubt thought "lying idiot from Sun" credible i2 reliable Rob, guess who was right you do remember ' what did happen with Sybase and Oracle.r  5 Kerry for example said that I was spreading FUD when a8 I said that the WildFire architecture would force people4 to tune their applications specifically for the NUMA5 architecture to overcome the memory latency issues on=
 WildFire.   6 You thought credible Kerry "lying idiot from Sun" and 4 guess what Compaq go an publish a TPC-C result where> they have done exactly what I predicted, tuned the application: specifically to get around the shortcoming of the WildFire NUMA architecture. i  7 Seems to me that you need to find some credible sourcesn% that actually get the odd fact right.=  ; > When Sun has been shown to have the unethical practice ofw< > forcing customers, who are entitled to Platinum service toA > sign gag-order NDAs before they get that service, we understand-= > why a customer might initially express one opinion and then  > change their tune later. > 6 That is yet another allegation which does not hold up.  7 Sun has contractual obligations to its suppliers which  ; may require customers to sign NDA's to get the full detailsn5 but Sun would and does fix systems regardless of the s1 presence of an NDA. Another ludicrous allegation.c     Regardsi Andrew Harrison  Enterprise IT Architectc   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:39:54 +0100n0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist* Message-ID: <39CB36FA.37C25194@uk.sun.com>   Rob Young wrote: > _ > In article <39CA5F5D.B8524F52@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:g > > Rob Young wrote: > >>b > >> In article <39CA2C97.B9347227@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes: > >> > >> >8 > >> > So what do you think caused the 22 outage at eBay6 > >> > which was the basis of the origional attempt to > >> > FUD Sun.t > >> >5 > >> > Come on, you are happy to accuse me of spin sos4 > >> > lets have what you think are the actual facts > >> > behind eBays outage.e > >> > > >>D > >>         Who cares?  Old news.  More of interest is how how comeJ > >>         they have bi-weekly failures of their primary server?  BeforeG > >>         you answer... remember they are quick to point out when it J > >>         is an ISP issue.  And we are clever enough to know they don'tI > >>         have a single network connection nor a single NT box nor any:K > >>         other single point of failure.  There is only one single pointSJ > >>         of failure and yes they are getting a bit snappier at cuttingG > >>         over to the backup.  Down from 42 minutes to 33 minutes on  > >>         ye old fire drill.w > > 1 > > So is this an admission that the FUD flung at 8 > > Sun over the 22 hour outage was in fact incorrect or7 > > to use Jordans description the posters making theser6 > > statments were simply "lying idiots" his words not > > my choice. > >h8 > > This being the case arn't you simply trying to fling8 > > more FUD in the vain hope that something will stick. > > 7 > > Doesn't this sort of attitude restrict your abilityf9 > > to take any sort of high moral line in this argument.b > >  > > Regards :):):):):):) > > Andrew Harrisons > > Enterprise IT Architectd > D >         Don't get too giggly there.  Admission of nothing.  I saidF >         "who cares" "old news".  Rightly so.  I'm more interested inE >         more recent crashes.  The 22 hour outage everyone knows was3J >         caused by lack of patch.  Of course it took weeks for the fingerK >         pointing to subside.  And yes... I did buy into hardware problemstL >         as I admitted in another thread.  Cutting and pasting www.news.comD >         stuff does have its downsides... BUT that is all we had at? >         the time.  Now do us a favor and eat ecache crow likefF >         Shoemaker and van Aman so we can focus on other Sun hardware' >         problems, ok?  RAID , anyone?f > > But Rob at the time you aledged HW failure, Software failure, @ data corruption etc etc etc. None of which were true were they !   Found out you now move on.   Its the same old story.d   Spiralog, found outn Galaxies, found outi 21264,    found out- WildFire, found out   @ So what are you doing now, putting out information on this group? on how great Marvel will be including specific "details" about g memory latency for example.u  9 Why on earth should anyone on this group take any notice  8 of you. Most OpenVMS boosters on this group do not like ; my postings mainly because of my robust defence of Sun overwB the eBay outage and my criticisms of your and Kerrys S/G/21264/WF 8 posts. Would they take the same view if they knew as you7 have just admitted that the whole Sun HW/SW failure FUDr storm had no basis in fact.    BTWa? Perhaps you should let Jordan know that you no longer subscriben@ to the Sun Hardware failure Software failure view that you once ; broadcasted to this group with respect to the eBay 22 hour  ; outage. He is still trying to argue the point and it would e be sad for him if he continues.,   Regardsu Andrew Harrisons Enterprise IT Architectt   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:42:11 +0100a0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist* Message-ID: <39CB3783.3DC8F15F@uk.sun.com>   David A Froble wrote:d >  > andrew harrison wrote: > >  > > hg/jb wrote: > > >  > > > andrew harrison wrote:& > > > snipped stuff to save bandwidth: > > > >lE > > > > Of course you did not call the FUDsters lying idiots I wondero> > > > > why, perhaps a trawl through deja would be interesting> > > > > were you involved in the threads ? Remember anyone who= > > > > suggested that the outage was caused by Sun SW/HW has @ > > > > in your terms been shown to be a lying idiot, your words. > > > > not mine and not words I would choose. > > > >  > > > > Andrew Harrison  > > > > Enterprise IT Architect-
 > > > Andrew,-B > > > You have made me wish that Carl Lydick was back to deal withC > > > you properly.  Carl is not here, I am not able to emulate himg? > > > in the style he deserves, so I will have to do it my way. C > > > Andrew - I am aghast at you, the king of FUDster spin postingSB > > > those words.  You persist in your approach to spin the truthA > > > into an orwellian morass yet you give us a prime example ofwD > > > why some mothers should eat their young AND reason to finalize > > > retroactive abortion.n	 > > > v/rD
 > > > justbob  > >t5 > > So what do you think caused the 22 outage at eBay-3 > > which was the basis of the origional attempt toe > > FUD Sun. > >r2 > > Come on, you are happy to accuse me of spin so1 > > lets have what you think are the actual factse > > behind eBays outage. > >i. > > Remember the alegations made on this group" > > included in no specific order: > >t3 > > Data corruption caused by unspecified Sun HW/SWo > > E10K hardware failure) > > Unspecified solaris issues > >=3 > > At the time I refuted all of these claims, none 2 > > of which were true and you are now accusing me > > of spin. > >d! > > So come on what was it ??????  > >p > > Regardsv > > Andrew Harrisonr > > Enterprise IT Architect  > N > Trying to put a bit of constraint on things.  Really people, there should beM > some limits on 'Andrew kicking'.  After all, he's just doing his job, right.K > Andrew? :-)  None of the rest of us would like it if people started going R > further than a bit of subtle suggestion when beating us up about our job.  Let's6 > try to avoid some of the rather explicit stuff, huh? >   4 Thanks but don't worry, I take the view that people 4 who start the personal abuse flame war do so because3 they know conciously of unconciously that they haven4 lost the argument or that it is not going as well as they hoped.    regardss Andrew Harrisona Enterprise IT Architecte   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 09:46:08 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist+ Message-ID: <keTCKVqZrUF2@eisner.decus.org>i  ] In article <39CB36FA.37C25194@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:l   >  > BTW A > Perhaps you should let Jordan know that you no longer subscribeeB > to the Sun Hardware failure Software failure view that you once = > broadcasted to this group with respect to the eBay 22 hour e= > outage. He is still trying to argue the point and it would e! > be sad for him if he continues.s >   A 	No.  He's doing a good job of referring us to what is out there.C< 	We can't help it that it took weeks for the finger pointing> 	to subside.  I suppose when the outages go from 42 minutes toB 	22 hours people start getting a little snippy.  Don't try to spinB 	me.  Go back and find something I wrote about it a year ago.  YouE 	lack a great deal of credibility because you work in a vacuum.  Nary D 	a reference or background story.  Chirp all you like .... you stillD 	got major issues regarding current hardware failures and your total+ 	lack of fortrightness on the ecache issue.t   					Rob  c   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 11:46:40 -0400/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)o* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist* Message-ID: <8qfut0$n8e$1@lisa.gemair.com>  * In article <39CB3783.3DC8F15F@uk.sun.com>,2 andrew harrison  <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: >David A Froble wrote: >> : >> andrew harrison wrote:o >> > >> > hg/jb wrote:Q >> > > >> > > andrew harrison wrote: ' >> > > snipped stuff to save bandwidth:o >> > > >F >> > > > Of course you did not call the FUDsters lying idiots I wonder? >> > > > why, perhaps a trawl through deja would be interestinge? >> > > > were you involved in the threads ? Remember anyone who > >> > > > suggested that the outage was caused by Sun SW/HW hasA >> > > > in your terms been shown to be a lying idiot, your wordsm/ >> > > > not mine and not words I would choose.  >> > > > >> > > > Andrew Harrison  >> > > > Enterprise IT Architect >> > > Andrew,C >> > > You have made me wish that Carl Lydick was back to deal witheD >> > > you properly.  Carl is not here, I am not able to emulate him@ >> > > in the style he deserves, so I will have to do it my way.D >> > > Andrew - I am aghast at you, the king of FUDster spin postingC >> > > those words.  You persist in your approach to spin the truthoB >> > > into an orwellian morass yet you give us a prime example ofE >> > > why some mothers should eat their young AND reason to finalizeo >> > > retroactive abortion.
 >> > > v/r >> > > justbob >> >6 >> > So what do you think caused the 22 outage at eBay4 >> > which was the basis of the origional attempt to
 >> > FUD Sun.u >> >3 >> > Come on, you are happy to accuse me of spin son2 >> > lets have what you think are the actual facts >> > behind eBays outage.o >> >/ >> > Remember the alegations made on this groups# >> > included in no specific order:  >> >4 >> > Data corruption caused by unspecified Sun HW/SW >> > E10K hardware failure >> > Unspecified solaris issues  >> >4 >> > At the time I refuted all of these claims, none3 >> > of which were true and you are now accusing me 
 >> > of spin.  >> >" >> > So come on what was it ?????? >> > >> > Regards >> > Andrew Harrison >> > Enterprise IT Architect >> iO >> Trying to put a bit of constraint on things.  Really people, there should be N >> some limits on 'Andrew kicking'.  After all, he's just doing his job, rightL >> Andrew? :-)  None of the rest of us would like it if people started goingS >> further than a bit of subtle suggestion when beating us up about our job.  Let'su7 >> try to avoid some of the rather explicit stuff, huh?e >> b >k5 >Thanks but don't worry, I take the view that people K5 >who start the personal abuse flame war do so because=4 >they know conciously of unconciously that they have5 >lost the argument or that it is not going as well as  >they hoped. >t  2 Oh, don't go taking this pose as the injured party2 in this "abusive" discussion here.  A quick search3 through deja will show you calling your adversaries  all sorts of names.e  3 I've found the people who are most offended by nameh0 calling are those who know that the names apply. Otherwise, it can be ignored.(   >regards >Andrew Harrison >Enterprise IT Architect   -Jordan HendersonK jordan@greenapple.como   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 12:27:35 -0400/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)o* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist* Message-ID: <8qg19n$p58$1@lisa.gemair.com>  * In article <39CB34A1.5B0FE000@uk.sun.com>,2 andrew harrison  <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: >Jordan Henderson wrote: >> h> >> Yes, I've heard the explanation... Now, enlighten us.  What= >> _exactly_ was the patch that was not available for "over ap< >> year"?  When was it first made available and what problem= >> did it address?  Most patches have a URL, where is the URL = >> for this one?  I think you'll find that these details havet >> never been revealed.  >>  6 >So you heard the explanation but thought why believe 5 >Sun, eBay and the two software vendors all of whome s2 >say exactly the same thing. Instead you choose to6 >believe the rumour and FUD which as you must realise  >have no actual basis in fact. >r  8 OK, so don't address my questions.  Where is this patch,5 with URL please?  And why is the nature of this patchf	 a secret?p  8 I'm not at all surprised that all of those insiders have6 but one consolidated story on the failure at eBay.  If7 you were Oracle or Veritas woule you prefer there to ben5 continuing questions about the failures, or would you)5 prefer everyone to be in agreement with one fall guy?s  9 In this case, the fall guy might be eBay and it's failure 9 to put into place a patch that we are told to believe hado6 been available for "more than a year".  Which patch to; what for what purpose, we can't be told, but we are assured 5 that there is one and that it's lack is completely tof blame for all problems.t  7 (Of course, Sun once held eBay up as a sterling example 4 of eCommerce and how it can be done "right" with Sun4 HW.  I guess you'd expect that Sun would be aware of6 any laxity in IT practices at such a shop before using it as an example...)  9 It's probably just a coincidence that this same eBay, whot: initially complained about the unreliable Sun HW/SW, later: "purchased" many truckloads of Sun equipment for an amount: that, for some inexplicable reason, could not be devulged.  ? >> Who is protected by not revealing this information?  Indeed,e: >> other customers might be similarly exposed and might be" >> interested in this information. >>  6 >The 3rd party supplier and eBay are protected. It is 3 >no advantage to Sun to keep the information quiet.  > < >The fact that you choose not to believe Sun, eBay, Veritas > >and Oracle and instead choose to believe sources that are at 0 >best biased against Sun says volumes about you. >h> >> More convenient finger pointing.  It could all well just be >> a cover story.  >> o7 >You of course a entitled to your opinion, sad for you  8 >that very few people outside the confines of this group >hold the same views.  >d  : Thanks.  Of course, whenever a question comes up about Sun: reliability, be it in the press or from the analysts, they9 always seem to insert a comment about the eBay continuingh: failures.  Nice to know that so much of the computer press( and the analysts are part of this group!   >rC >> > Remember eTrade, what happened there, was it a Compaq engineeriE >> > doing the wrong thing and a bug in the OpenVMS cluster software,eC >> > who knows, neither Compaq or eTrade have been very forthcomingc; >> > about what really caused eTrade to have their outages.s >> e= >> I heard that a Compaq engineer had improperly put a lot ofr? >> non cluster traffic on a Fiber Cluster Interconnect.  SoundsiD >> reasonable.  Case closed.  And, we don't hear continued instancesF >> of downtime amounting to many dozens of hours like we do with eBay. >> G8 >But eTrade did not have one outage associated with this6 >issue, they had a number each of which lasted hours.  >.; >So you have a number of outages at eTrade which according e> >to your information was caused by Compaq and the 22 hour eBay7 >outage which was not caused by Sun hardware, software   >or engineers. U >h6 >Yet you still persist in trying muddy Sun's name over: >the eBay outage. Not a very credible stance to be taking. >r  : You forget, but I don't, that there were many many outages8 surrounding the one notable 22 hour outage at eBay.  Can: you state categorically that none of the many, continuing,% outages at eBay are due to Sun HW/SW?t  7 Of course, coming from a company that makes people signo9 NDAs to gag them about problems (see the famous Mr. Epps h8 email, for example), it's not suprising that more is not# known about the many eBay failures.n  = I suppose if Compaq were as unethical as Sun then we wouldn'tt9 be talking about what a Compaq Engineer did or didn't do,o" because noone would know about it.   >e >> >D >> > > I'm waiting for those people to be shown to be liars.  Sorry,? >> > > I can't take your word for it, you're just not credible.w< >> > > Everytime I do catch you in a clear lie, anyone who'sD >> > > interested please trawl through deja, you change the subject. >> > >@ >> > So when they said that it was Sun hardware or software that@ >> > caused the outage when in fact it was a bug in an unpatched< >> > 3rd party product, they were not lying or being idiots. >> -? >> It's called credibility.  Since you've never had any I don'ti >> expect you to recognize it. >> c >R >S6 >No Jordan it does not matter how credible you appear 4 >if you are not telling the truth. A lie is a lie no8 >matter how credible the source is, in the same way that5 >truth is also independant of the credibility to you   >of the source.3 >2  6 But, if you are not credible, either by being shown to4 be lying in the past (readers of cov, please go back6 and read what I write and that Andrew fails to quote, 7 without so much as a [snip] to see the many cases where 6 Andrew has been caught being less than truthful), then2 there is no way of telling if that "lie is a lie".  6 Generally, when you lose your credibility, as you have= done, nobody believes anything you say without corroboration. 9 And, concerning eBay failures and many other subjects yous- offer no corroboration except "Sun says so!".m  9 >You appear to be wrestling with a problem which is that I6 >I work for Sun therefor I cannot be a credible source5 >in your eyes. But all the credible sources (in your g3 >eyes) like Rob and Kerry have been shown up to be f6 >often wrong particularly if their pronouncements have5 >anything to do with the capabilities or otherwise ofc  >to be released Compaq products.  1 Oh, you mean like how Compaq continues to set new 4 records for Oracle performance.  Or how the new ES406 has been shown to have more than twice the Oracle Apps0 performance of a similar 4 processor Sun system?   >s7 >On the other hand when Rob for example said Oracle andm7 >Sybase were really interested in Galaxies, I said they 6 >wern't and that there was no information from either ) >Oracle or Sybase to back up Rob's claim.g >l  8 Wow!  I guess you got Rob there!  I'm sure he heard from4 a source that these companies were interested in the4 Galaxy technology and you've proven him to be a liar. because he can't back this up...  Slam bang...  4 That's not anything like your saying a year ago that2 the eCache problems were "old news" and have been , corrected by the introduction of a new part.  3 Or, your assurances that no SIMS code came from then2 Innosoft products.  This one contradicted by a Sun Product Manager.  4 Or, your asserting that the eCache failures were bad4 computer room environmentals, then saying it was bad9 SRAM components, in direct odds with the clear statementsm5 of Sun Executive VP Shoemaker, who said that a singles cause had not been identified.  6 >You no doubt thought "lying idiot from Sun" credible 3 >reliable Rob, guess who was right you do remember  ( >what did happen with Sybase and Oracle. >o6 >Kerry for example said that I was spreading FUD when 9 >I said that the WildFire architecture would force peopleh5 >to tune their applications specifically for the NUMA 6 >architecture to overcome the memory latency issues on >WildFire. i >17 >You thought credible Kerry "lying idiot from Sun" and o5 >guess what Compaq go an publish a TPC-C result whereh? >they have done exactly what I predicted, tuned the applicationo; >specifically to get around the shortcoming of the WildFires >NUMA architecture.  >   5 As if every vendor doesn't tune their systems to make 8 the best benchmark possible.  Come off it!  Compaq beats6 sun hands-down in Oracle TPC-C and you have to harp on4 the fact that it was some sort of devious trick.  Go5 complain to TPC that their tests are not real world, u but leave us alone.   8 >Seems to me that you need to find some credible sources& >that actually get the odd fact right. > < >> When Sun has been shown to have the unethical practice of= >> forcing customers, who are entitled to Platinum service to B >> sign gag-order NDAs before they get that service, we understand> >> why a customer might initially express one opinion and then >> change their tune later.- >> -7 >That is yet another allegation which does not hold up.0 > 8 >Sun has contractual obligations to its suppliers which < >may require customers to sign NDA's to get the full details6 >but Sun would and does fix systems regardless of the 2 >presence of an NDA. Another ludicrous allegation. >   < Oh, so that's the reason!  You'll need to give Sun Executive- VP Shoemaker a call, because in this article:e  I   http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/00/08/25/000825hnsunmemory.xmlo  
 He states:  ;   Shoemaker this week acknowledged that it may have been a eF   bad idea for Sun to get its users to sign nondisclosure agreements.   A You'll need to inform VP Shoemaker that those NDA have to stay in 9 place because of contractural obligations, etc. etc. etc.   ? Ludicrous allegation?  The article has some things to say about @ that, including quoting a Gartner analysts who suggests that theC NDAs were absolutely about gagging customers and a customer saying:g  <   But according to an MIS manager in North Carolina who has <   experienced the memory problem and who spoke on condition A   of anonymity, Sun has offered no explanation for the problems. nB   "Sun has not disclosed any information to me about their memory =   issues -- not even a brief description," the manager said. e  ? So, no privilged information was involved in this case, just anu< NDA to make sure that this MIS manager continued to speak on" condition of anoymity, apparently.   >i   >Regards >Andrew Harrison >Enterprise IT Architect   -Jordan Hendersonm jordan@greenapple.comh   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 12:28:04 -0500 , From: "Kevin R. DeYoung" <deyoung@ipact.com> Subject: SYSTEM-F-EXBUFOBJLM) Message-ID: <39CB96A4.54B6712F@ipact.com>n  G We are having a couple of DECwindows related problems since our upgradesH to VMS 7.2.  The first probem being that the console device is no longerD able to create a DECterm window following login.  The second problemE being that I don't seem to be able to create any decterm window using D Excursions either.  If I manually set up a display device using $set; display/create/transport=tcpip/node=mynode, followed by a $'3 create/term=decterm, I receive the following error:   B %SYSTEM-F-EXBUFOBJLM, exceeded systemwide buffer object page limit (MAXBOBMEM)   B Since the sysgen variables controlling the buffer object space areF dynamic I have tried doubling the values, with no success.  Any ideas?   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:00:27 -0500e) From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net>kD Subject: Re: TCP/IP based program hung apparently when run detached./ Message-ID: <ssmpd2h5532kdd@corp.supernews.com>e  8 "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> wrote in message) news:ssg5vogh4sq127@corp.supernews.com...03 > > "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> writes: 4 > > >I am trying to diagnose a problem with a TCP/IP! > > >program that is not working.s > > >  > > >The platform: > > >5 > > >OpenVMS Alpha 7.2 (Multia)< > > >TCPIP 5.0 > > >DEC C 6.0 > > K > I have not found the cause of the program going into the RWAST state, buteL > the original problem appears to be that an NT Workstation browsing serviceH > has failed for unknown reasons, causing some interesting side effects.   Update:t  K The patch digest just delivered the summary of an ECO kit for the DEC C RTL.H on OpenVMS 7.2-1 that lists a problem like I observed as being partially fixed.  K The complete fix appears to require an ECO to the Compaq TCPIP program thatt- the article implies will be forthcoming also.a   -Johng wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 01:54 CSTi' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) ! Subject: Re: Telnet configurationa- Message-ID: <22SEP200001542252@gerg.tamu.edu>   6 rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes...Z }In article <39C9ACC6.EA7105DB@tsoft-inc.com>, David A Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:O }> Ok, I'm ready to learn something I don't currently know.  This is the second-Q }> reference to SYLOGIN that I've seen in this thread.  SYLOGIN is something thatrS }> happens at the end of logging in.  SYS$ANNOUNCE happens before logging in.  It'sC< }> normally set at system start-up.  What am I missing here? } * }You are missing lack-of-sleep.  I wasn't! } < }You are right.  SYS$ANNOUNCE happens early, before SYLOGIN. } G }What I was trying to say is that this fellow typically gets defined in>L }SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM, by the system manager.  Then its effect happens at loginL }time.  Since the system manager does it, I don't think its a security hole. } \ }Sylogin, systartup, they both start with sy... :-)  Carl's ghost isn't happy with me today. }--  }Robert Deiningert  I I would expect it to get defined in SYLOGICALS.COM not SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.oE SYLOGICALS is the logical place to put all your logical definitions -r that's what its there for.  N But a lot of system managers do seem to put *everything* in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:31:20 +0200e= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>m! Subject: Re: Telnet configuration ) Message-ID: <39CB0AC7.72235EC2@gtech.com>i   Anthony Classick wrote: N > I need to change the message that comes up just prior to the login prompt inN > a telnet session, in VMS 5.0 to 6.2 (several systems). What do I need to do?  > Define the logical SYS$ANNOUNCE to point to whatever you want.   Arne   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 16:10:48 +0200) From: maulis@ludens.elte.hu (Maulis Adam) ! Subject: Re: Telnet configurations! Message-ID: <qiecRbqYKXUM@ludens>a   Hello,      b In article <8q7ibn$nss1@eccws12.dearborn.ford.com>, "Anthony Classick" <aclassic@ford.com> writes:N > I need to change the message that comes up just prior to the login prompt inN > a telnet session, in VMS 5.0 to 6.2 (several systems). What do I need to do?  I    You can change this message for all types of login (telnet, set host, eN    local) by definiing sys$announce logical. See sys$manager:systartup_vms.comD    (or sys$manager:systartup_v5.com) or some articles in this thread    for more info.>  H    You also can change announce message only that type of login you wantA    but it need some (*) programming experience. For more info see 6    loginout callback routines especially LGI$ICR_INIT.$    (OpenVMS Utility Routines Manual)        There is a logical name:b        TCPIP$TELNET_MESSAGEsD    I do not known what is it doing, I hasn't found any documentation    for it. e     I hope I help you.   Adam Maulist OpenVMS$SYSTEM_MANAGER     (*) more than mine:-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:33:41 -0400t2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)! Subject: Re: Telnet configurationhL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2209001133410001@user-2ivec1b.dialup.mindspring.com>  V In article <22SEP200001542252@gerg.tamu.edu>, carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) wrote:     > K > I would expect it to get defined in SYLOGICALS.COM not SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.hG > SYLOGICALS is the logical place to put all your logical definitions -  > that's what its there for. > P > But a lot of system managers do seem to put *everything* in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.    G Some stuff has to go in sylogicals.com so it gets defined early enough.d  C But SYS$SYLOGIN, SYS$ANNOUNCE, and SYS$WELCOME are all suggested in I systartup_vms.template.  I try not to move things away from their natural, homes unless I have a reason.a   -- n Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:47:53 +0100_ From: "laurie" <abd@bdc.com>+ Subject: Unusual hard disk activity at bootf+ Message-ID: <8qf6bu$a22$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>i  J This morning, when I booted our Alpha, it got to the login screen, and theH hard disk wouldn't stop churning away. It allowed me to login, but stillH wouldn't stop once it had done that. It won't allow me to open a consoleA either, although DECterm appears in the 'work in process window'.IC Please help, because I'm scared of losing months work on that disk.e   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Sep 2000 12:06:19 GMT) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)L/ Subject: Re: Unusual hard disk activity at boot ' Message-ID: <8qfhvr$9e4$3@joe.rice.edu>    laurie (abd@bdc.com) wrote: L : This morning, when I booted our Alpha, it got to the login screen, and theJ : hard disk wouldn't stop churning away. It allowed me to login, but stillJ : wouldn't stop once it had done that. It won't allow me to open a consoleC : either, although DECterm appears in the 'work in process window'.c  - What has changed that required the reboot ?  a  B You may need to perform a minimum VMS boot to undo a change, which2 is described in the section of the VMS FAQ titled:  >    MGMT5.  I've forgotten the SYSTEM password - what can I do?   The FAQ is available at:  !    http://www.openvms.compaq.com/   E : Please help, because I'm scared of losing months work on that disk.e  A That shouldn't be a concern unless the disk isn't being backed upa on a regular basis.t  4 --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:46:34 +0200S= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>m" Subject: Re: Using DEC CMM and CVS) Message-ID: <39CB0E5A.7CBBCEF9@gtech.com>r   Jim Jennis wrote:iL > We do a lot of VMS development, but typically use CVS on Tru64 or Linux toJ > do code management and maintain version control of our code. Some of our: > customers, however use the DECset CMM/MMS product suite.   You mean CMS ?  I > We'd like to be able to interoperate between the two environments (roll K > changes from CVS at our shop to CMM at a customer site.) Although someoneaJ > (once upon a time) ported CVS to VMS, it is an old version and IMHO, not > ready for prime time.e > L > Does anyone on the list have experience with compatibility between CVS and8 > CMM or exporting/importing to/from DECset CMM <-> CVS?  ( I think CVS follow the clasic RCS style.  A CMS are relative different, so it will not be easy to make a goodi
 interface.   But:)   - CVS are available as source (I think)    - CMS has acallable interfaceh? so if you are willing to write some code, then it should work !    Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 09:29:06 +0200r= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>b Subject: Re: VAX VMS TO ALPHAa) Message-ID: <39CB0A42.280B9F82@gtech.com>a   ezzaoudi med wrote:cG > I have a MV3100-80 with VMS 7.1 , Cobol 5.1-10 and Pathworks Advancede	 > Server.d# > I want to migrate to  Alpha DS20.y > A > 1- My Executable cobol programs can they run without problems ?   C No they will need to be rebuild (or converted with the VEST utilitys
 if possible).o  B > 2- Have I to recompil my sources programs for generating the new >     executables programs ?  A There are a good chance that the build scripts from VAX will worka	 unchanged H on Alpha. Small changes may be necesarry with certain features, but give	 it a try.i    > 3- Pathworks Advanced Server :H >     Can I download my users account base ( and rights) from the vax to
 > the Alpha ?    I think so.p   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 16:50:29 GMTn From: alexbuz@my-deja.com . Subject: VAX-11 with VMS11 professional resume) Message-ID: <8qg2kb$8sp$1@nnrp1.deja.com>    Hi thereG My name is Alexander Buzunov, I live in Europe and currently is lookinga for job in US.E I'm IBM 360/370 with OS VM, VAX-11 with VMS11, PDP 11/XX with RSX-11Me specialist.t    Please find my resume attached   Alexander Buzunovm  10-A Zoja Gaidai Street, Apt. 52 Kiev, 03212  UA alexb@sabbo.neth 	Daytime Phone:3 8-044-413-3651s Mobile:1 847 927 0612t  F IBM 360/370 with OS VM, VAX-11 with VMS11, PDP 11/XX with RSX-11M Guru 	Resume #6867410  A OBJECTIVE	Let me tell you about one of my projects during my workrA in the position of Chief of the Software Design Department in the E Institute of the Cybernetics the Ukrainian Academy of Sciences in thecF Special Technologic Designing Software Bureau, Kiev, Ukraine. This oneF means a lot for me and shows my main dimensions. The project was aboutC to design the fully functional information protective subsystem, tocA provide safe data processing in the material management system ofo> Nuclear Navy of the USSR. The information protection subsystemA functioned in the heterogeneous global switch packed network. The>F technical means based on the mainframe IBM 360/370 with OS VM, packet-E switched routers based on the mini-computer PDP-11/XX with OS RSX-11MtE and the remote terminal based on IBM PC's. The information protectionrG subsystem included organizational protection means, hardware protection $ means and software protection means.. TARGET JOB	Desired Job Type	Employee, Contract 	Desired Status:	Full-Time 	Salary:	50,000 USD Per Year 	Site Location:	On-Sitee5 	Career Level:	Management (Manager/Director of Staff)s" 	Date of Availability:	Immediately* TARGET COMPANY	Company Size:	No Preference 	Category:	Banking TARGET LOCATIONS	Relocate:	Yes 	USe= WORK STATUS	US	I require sponsorship to work in this country.,8 EXPERIENCE	7/1995 - Present	Farmer Land Joint Stock Bank (FLJSB)	Kiev/Ukraine3 	Chief of the Technology and Information Department : 	Design, development & support of the Internal InformationF Banking Data processing System for FLJSB. The old system was comprisedF with a number of stand-alone PC's without mainframe computer. The mainC goal of the project included design of the Information Banking Datah: processing System, which was later applied inside of a new? technological banking data processing system and integrated alle, computers in the uni Ethernet network CAT-5.: 	5/1994 - 6/1995	Joint Stock Bank "Gold Lion"	Kiev/Ukraine, 	Main System Analyst, Database Administrator< 	Design, development and support of the Internal InformationC Banking Data processing System for Division "Kiyvska Russ" of Jointr> Stock Bank "Gold Lion". The project's target was to design theE Information Banking Data processing System for a small bank, to apply E new technologies into banking data processing system and to integraten) new computers in the Ethernet network BNCi* 	12/1993 - 6/1994	Joint Stock Firm "Reson" 	Moscow/Russia( 	Chief of the Software Design Department= 	Design and creation of the full-functioning Information Bankb Data processing.7 	4/1992 - 11/1993	Institute of the Problem Registrationh= of Information the Ukrainian Academy of Sciences	Kiev/Ukrainen 	Chief of the Department= 	Implementation and Exploitation of computer information massb' spreading system by means of TV-channely; 	2/1991 - 4/1992	Institute of the Cybernetics the Ukrainianr? Academy of Sciences, the Special Technologic Designing Softwarel
 	Kiev/Ukraineo7 	Chief of the Software Design Department, Main Designerf5 	The project was about to design the fully functionalyD information protective subsystem, to provide safe data processing in? the material management system of Nuclear Navy of the USSR. TheeG information protection subsystem functioned in the heterogeneous globalpE switch packed network. The technical means based on the mainframe IBMiE 360/370, packet-switched routers based on the mini-computer PDP-11/XXoE and the remote terminal based on IBM PC's. The information protectiontA subsystem would include organizational protection means, hardwaree/ protection means and software protection means.lA 	9/1988 - 6/1990	RSX-11M Advanced Training Course of the Machine-  Building Ministry	Kiev/Ukraine# 	Lecturer on design system programso. 	Lecturer on design system programs (RSX-11M )@ 	7/1979 - 2/1981	Ukrainian Academy of Sciences, Council of Study; Productivity Force of Ukraine, Computer Center	Kiev/Ukraineu% 	Chief of the Technical Support Groupt? 	equipment maintenance: hardware and local are wire-connectionse: 	7/1979 - 2/1981	Computer Center of the Dnieper River Navy
 	Kiev/Ukrainet 	Senior engineer
 	Seasonal.6 	10/1972 - 7/1979	Ministry of Wood Processing Industry% Ukraine, Computer Center	Kiev/Ukrainew 	Senior Programmer, Programmer@ 	Development and implementation of software (info-search system)' for output in wood processing industry.g6 	10/1972 - 7/1979	Ministry of Wood Processing Industry% Ukraine, Computer Center	Kiev/Ukrainem 	Senior Programmer, Programmer@ 	Development and implementation of software (info-search system)' for output in wood processing industry.o? EDUCATION	1/1980	Institute of Cybernetics the Ukrainian Academyl of Science	Kiev/Ukrainei 	Certification 	PL/1 Advanced Training Course0 	1/1979	Technology Training Centre	Minsk/Belarus 	Certification) 	The Technical Training Course of IBM-360 0 	2/1973	Technology Training Center	Minsk/Belarus 	Certification* 	The Technical Training Course of Minsk-328 	International University of Civil Aviation	Kiev/Ukraine 	Masters Degreey, 	major - Computer and Electronic Engineering   minor - Computer Science GPA : 4.39/5.00T2 SKILLS	Skill Name	Skill Level	Last Used	Experience% 	RSX-11M	Expert	+4 years ago	10 yearsg3 	mainframe - ASSEMBLER	Expert	+4 years ago	10 yearss. 	mainframe - PL/1	Expert	+4 years ago	10 years1 	mainframe - FORTRAN	Expert	+4 years ago	10 yearsx: 	Hardware - IBM 360/370, PDP 11/X, VAX-11, Minsk-32	Expert 	+4 years ago	10 years6 	Hardware -COMPAQ/DEC	Intermediate	3 years ago	5 years9 	minicomputer - ASSEMBLER, FORTRAN, C	Expert	+4 years agou	 	10 yearsv3 	PC - C, ASSEMBLER	Intermediate	2 years ago	3 yearso6 	PC - FoxPro, FoxBase+	Intermediate	1 year ago	2 years$ 	C++	Beginner	Currently used	1 years) 	UNIX	Intermediate	Currently used	5 yearso2 	3.11/95/98/NT 4.0 Server/Workstation/2000, MS DOS$ 	Intermediate	Currently used	5 years: REFERENCES	Filip Andon	Software Systems Institute	Director  	Phone Number:	3 8 044 263-54-56 	Reference Type:	Professionaln' 	Oleg Korostelov	Design Bureau	Director:  	Phone Number:	3 8 044 410-64-03 	Reference Type:	Personalm$ ADDITIONAL INFORMATION	Publications:C "Terminal complex based on the mini-computer in mainframe network",eG Collected scientific articles, Ukrainian Academy of Science Cyberneticsn Institute, 1984i  F "Multiple-level terminal system based on the mini-computers and micro-@ computers in mainframe networks", Collected scientific articles,8 Ukrainian Academy of Science Cybernetics Institute, 1986  B "Hardware and software of network interface", Collected scientificB articles, Ukrainian Academy of Science Cybernetics Institute, 1986   English Language Skills :    Writing - INTERMEDIATE Reading - INTERMEDIATE Communication - INTERMEDIATE   English language credentials:i' The first town Courses English language-0 Courses English language the Academy of Sciences   Other languagesJ Russian, Ukrainian      & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.l   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 15:19:07 GMT $ From: jmf9@po.cwru.edu (Jon Fiedler)N Subject: Re: War story: Accidental postings in HTML/MIME (hopefully fixed now)- Message-ID: <39cb77a0.88265268@news.cwru.edu>   6 On Thu, 21 Sep 2000 21:20:21 -0500, "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net> wrote:   ; >"Lorin Ricker" <Lorin.Ricker@t-netix.com> wrote in message<6 >news:418E68E524A8D311ACCE00508B78866A768171@DENXCH... >tH >> And, John, thanks for the Outlook configuration tips & ideas you sent >me...L >> unfortunately, what works for you with Outlook Express *doesn't* work for >meo > I >I do not know how many variants of Outlook are out there, and which ones J >supercede each other.  All of them seem to have a slightly different look
 >and feel. >e  E And remember, too, that Outlook and Outlook Express, despite what youtF would think from the names, are two wholly seperate products (not even* written by the same division, apparently).  M >> And if *somebody* actually does know how to globally disable RTF/HTML/MIMErM >> posting in Outlook, once and for all, without needing to point-&-click forsK >> each present-and-future address/recipient, please post that wisdom here!r >eL >I am sure that someone could find the space for posting it on a web page to >point people at.c >m  B AFAICT (and I admin an exchange server (does this make me evil?)),D there is no way to do this.  It must be done on an individual basis, and that doesn't always work.a   Jonh   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 10:26:13 -0600I- From: Lorin Ricker <Lorin.Ricker@t-netix.com> J Subject: War story: Accidental postings in HTML/MIME (hopefully fixed now); Message-ID: <418E68E524A8D311ACCE00508B78866A768174@DENXCH>   = Thanks to all who've responded with good advice and feedback.n  
   -- Lorin   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 08:12:21 GMTt% From: Uwe Zessin <zessin@my-deja.com> , Subject: Re: what path does clustering use??) Message-ID: <8qf48r$5dd$1@nnrp1.deja.com>-  ) In article <8qe00l$s50$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,-   kparris@my-deja.com wrote:! > Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:OE > > AFAIK Compaq is considering/building SCS over fibrechannel, whichp >aG > When I last spoke with VMS Engineering about this (San Diego Fall '99fF > DECUS), the status was that while the initial FC adapter (KFPSA) hadD                                                             KGPSA-BC! The follow-on is the DS-KGPSA-CA.- KFPSA-AA is a PCI/DSSI adapter.h  H > the hooks for host-to-host communications, future adapter designs fromH > Compaq's FC adapter vendor would not, so there were no plans to do SCSG > over FC.  I haven't heard of a change in that situation, but I'd love5G > to be pleasantly surprised.  In any case, I'd really like to see someSA > sort of viable CI replacement strategy from Compaq -- it's long-
 > overdue. >-D > > seems the only logical thing to do to prevent a expensive doubleC > > high performance network topology (FC + Gigabit Ethernet or so)K+ > > if you want to build a cluster with FC.iE > Cisco agrees that building a double network (IP plus Fibre Channel)oG > is a bad idea (because Brocade would get lots of dollars for switcheseB > instead of Cisco).  So they've proposed SCSI over IP.  Here's an> > interesting question: Which is most likely to win out in the> > marketplace: IP over FC as proposed by a SAN vendor, or SCSI- > over IP as proposed by a router vendor? :-)t   Somewhere from their news page:aC "CISCO and BROCADE Enter Joint Technology Agreement to Interconnect H Storage Area Networks Over IP-Based Metropolitan and Wide Area Networks"   --
 Uwe Zessin    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Sep 2000 13:08:22 +0200* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER) Subject: [VMS] VAX is dying * Message-ID: <39cb3da6$1@news.kapsch.co.at>   <RANT>I I just met a colleague at the coffee machine telling me that "COMPAQ justML abandoned VMS". He told me, that he read this in a local computer newspaper.K As he doesn't know which one and didn't keep this paper, it seems the paperRH or my colleague got from the story about end of the VAX hardware in 2000C the impression that VMS is (finally) dead (after some years dying).e  7 How often did you see such a person in the last years ?l6 How many of such misinformed people are still around ?- How many of them are in executive positions ? > Why do you think, Q has stopped/reverted the damaging of VMS ?9 VMS sales increasing ? I know it, because I read it here.sE   But who else know it (from ISV, ads, analysts, Q stock rate, ...) ?o   Sigh.h   </RANT>  -- i< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888u< <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"N "VMS is today what Microsoft wants Windows NT V8.0 to be!" Compaq, 22-Sep-1998   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.531 ************************Message-ID: <8qf6b0:٧X	U3A7$|Z.x?L)K*a;+,Ѓ6r;d2	yゼ)s!T|]v{kKl߉~3xn'vVy@
\xZt;מ%b>h>p|Y4V>zސ`;\~prUs.1fsjs//ǽz_
9cRNBw?. q7UaEW;5βgͬ(G?gi&xϪ>7qetnJtҕ7E|qURwsx __Q叠c!
cgV3kxd>ԷJQa7؏
?A lנмnL1$}+txo\b>rr잇QMpcE&gՊMnmbo|n+{x{5ޝx'بd)̾z#]'2ށxKd|E+R϶Xa{1s|"7.;i*W\!#)BHM7b&+b.KQ{Pe3ߒv|7tOZ%q.kqF<}$#s4<_X֗MpN] |~8>tw͊gf
XuvkN`P?C(($3dҼ|ƴCi٤W8x1ߡv`B[A;˹7
j#FlSk.K;2khrt1at[fMZMvs}+:O͒YqzWeXwf|iw}-Ae"_	x",9T>uV3wpuv٤su0#[i\gGۜᏗGK^AYEYd	/_x,