1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 05 Apr 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 191       Contents: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS  Re: Another Win for OpenVMS & Re: booting a 3300 for the first time.& Re: booting a 3300 for the first time. Re: CD backups.  Re: CD backups. / Re: Christof a bot (was: "cut" utility for VMS) / Re: Christof a bot (was: "cut" utility for VMS) , Re: Compaq Releases ECP - download available> Re: EV7 and EV8 for the low end (was: VMS-Related: Affordable)! Re: F$CONTEXT anomaly ? Feature ? ! Re: F$CONTEXT anomaly ? Feature ? ! Re: F$CONTEXT anomaly ? Feature ?  Re: Free The OpenVMS Seven!   Re: Hopf 6841 dtss time provider= How do I redefine the alias between SYSCOMMON and VMS$COMMON? A Re: How do I redefine the alias between SYSCOMMON and VMS$COMMON? 4 Re: How to create a TCP/IP queue for a Xerox printer4 Re: How to create a TCP/IP queue for a Xerox printer  Re: installing pci cards on ds10  Re: installing pci cards on ds10  Re: installing pci cards on ds10 Re: Meaning of RSBREFNZRO? NT or 2K on VMS " Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations" Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations3 Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations (are excellent!) 0 Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations [and Mozilla]# Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions # Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions # Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions  Problems with CSWS and CGI-BIN& Problems with threads on VMS AXP 7.1-2 Re: Restart TCP/IP Services  Re: Restart TCP/IP Services  Re: Restart TCP/IP Services  Re: Restart TCP/IP Services  Re: Spice for OpenVMS Alpha?D Re: Support for CD-R (was: Re: Seeking CD-R/CD-RW SCSI INQUIRY data)4 Re: TCPIP V5.0A install fails, can't proceed; ideas? TSM and terminal servers?  Re: TSM and terminal servers?  Re: TSM and terminal servers?  Re: TSM and terminal servers?  Re: TSM and terminal servers?  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable  Re: VMS-Related: Affordable > RE: What to do with old CDROMS... (do NOT try this at home...)) Re: When might SYS$SCHDWK not wake me up? ) Re: When might SYS$SCHDWK not wake me up? + [Q] DCL minute of the day: case sensitivity / Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: case sensitivity / Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: case sensitivity , Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: semi-graphics, Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: semi-graphics, Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: semi-graphics  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 06:39:35 GMT  From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>$ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS' Message-ID: <3ACC1326.748E4094@home.nl>    "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:   9 >       Compaq to supply computers for new E*Trade branch & >       Wednesday April 4, 3:00 AM EDT > H >       NEW YORK, April 4 (Reuters) - Compaq Computer Corp.(CPQ) said onH > Wednesday it will supply about $2 million worth of computers, wirelessJ > technology and handheld devices to E*Trade Group Inc.(ET) for the online- > trading firm's new branch in New York City.  > K >       Last year, E*Trade purchased Compaq servers and storage and support F > services for other facilities, and this deal expands on that earlier > relationship, Compaq said... > M > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") relies on H > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why6 > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account.     ^^^^^^^^^^^^H Does this mean Charlie is buying Cemtex and Kalashnikovs from E-Trade ??       >  > 
 >  [Image]   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 09:06:00 +0000 ) From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> $ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS+ Message-ID: <3ACD86F8.B884CFD@infopuls.com>    JF Mezei wrote:  >  > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote: M > > It's equally safe to infer that the terms of the deal do not allow CPQ to , > > specify the OS in the press release. ;-} > N > Well, whenever the OS isn't mentioned , then you know it is VMS. So in fact,J > by not announcing VMS, Compaq announced it was VMS. Whenver Compaq sellsI > Microsoft junk, you will be seing some mention about "industry standard ( > Windows 2000 server" , or True64 etc .   :-)  :-(    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 13:15:51 +0100 - From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> $ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS) Message-ID: <3ACC61F7.BCF082CB@bbc.co.uk>   > > In article <oWLy6.34229$Wz.9323509@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,< >     "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > O > > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") relies on J > > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why8 > > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account. > >  >    IRA? !!!   --  6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk   A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of  MedAS or the BBC.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 09:30:42 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br $ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMSL Message-ID: <OFE9123E08.A8ACD6DB-ON03256A25.0044AF3D@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   IRA, ETA, FARC, everything ....    Regards    FC        > Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> em 05/04/2001 09:15:51  9 Favor responder a Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>              Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com       $ Assunto: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS            > > In article <oWLy6.34229$Wz.9323509@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,< >     "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > E > > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") 	 relies on J > > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why8 > > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account. > >  >    IRA? !!!   --  6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk   A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of  MedAS or the BBC.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:35:19 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>$ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS< Message-ID: <Ho%y6.39031$Wz.9842726@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  + "Dirk Munk" <munk@home.nl> wrote in message ! news:3ACC1326.748E4094@home.nl...  >  >  > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > ; > >       Compaq to supply computers for new E*Trade branch ( > >       Wednesday April 4, 3:00 AM EDT > > J > >       NEW YORK, April 4 (Reuters) - Compaq Computer Corp.(CPQ) said onJ > > Wednesday it will supply about $2 million worth of computers, wirelessL > > technology and handheld devices to E*Trade Group Inc.(ET) for the online/ > > trading firm's new branch in New York City.  > > E > >       Last year, E*Trade purchased Compaq servers and storage and  support H > > services for other facilities, and this deal expands on that earlier  > > relationship, Compaq said... > > L > > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") relies onJ > > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why8 > > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account. >  >  > ^^^^^^^^^^^^J > Does this mean Charlie is buying Cemtex and Kalashnikovs from E-Trade ??  D Heaven forbid. Charlie has the misfortune of dwelling in the LiberalJ Taxpayers Republic of Taxachusetts, where firearms are extremely difficultG for law-abiding citizens such as Chuck to possess. (On a technology and K price-performance basis, Chuck prefers the Stoner design to that of Comrade G Kalashnikov.) And Charlie has no need for Semtex (tho' he knows of some I interesting technology demonstrations that can be conducted with Ordinary  Household Chemicals).   D Oh... you mean IRA as in Irish Republican Army, not as in IndividualL Retirement Account? While the Irish Republican Army gets plenty of financialJ contributions from supporters in the Boston area, Chuck is not one of 'em.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:36:45 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>$ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS< Message-ID: <1q%y6.39033$Wz.9843272@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  : "Tim Llewellyn" <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote in message# news:3ACC61F7.BCF082CB@bbc.co.uk...  >  >  >  > @ > > In article <oWLy6.34229$Wz.9323509@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,> > >     "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > > G > > > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") 	 relies on L > > > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why: > > > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account. > > >  > >  > 
 > IRA? !!! >   G A Yank acronym for Individual Retirement Account. A necessary financial C scheme in light of the US Government's Ponzi Superannuation Scheme.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:41:25 -0400 - From: "Richard D. Piccard" <piccard@ohio.edu> $ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS( Message-ID: <3ACC8413.1DFE3FA3@ohio.edu>  R Individual Retirement Account:  United States income tax law encourages individualQ savings and investment by permitting "pre-tax" income to be used; in other words, P those who go this route pay income taxes on the net AFTER subtracting the amountR that went into the IRA.  Furthermore, the interest and dividends earned within theP IRA are also not taxed while they are accumulating, only when you withdraw them.  #                                 RDP      Tim Llewellyn wrote:  @ > > In article <oWLy6.34229$Wz.9323509@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,> > >     "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > > Q > > > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") relies on L > > > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why: > > > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account. > > >  > >  > 
 > IRA? !!! >  > -- > 8 > Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project2 > MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.C > Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk  > C > I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of  > MedAS or the BBC.    --B ==================================================================B Dick Piccard                           Academic Technology ManagerB piccard@ohio.edu                                 Computer ServicesB http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~piccard/                Ohio University   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 15:48:53 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> $ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS8 Message-ID: <e31pctgbq2tu0kmmg7o8qepbtmkom29nfn@4ax.com>  1 On Thu, 05 Apr 2001 13:15:51 +0100, Tim Llewellyn   <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote:   >  >  >  > ? >> In article <oWLy6.34229$Wz.9323509@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, = >>     "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes:  >>P >> > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E") relies onK >> > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why 9 >> > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account.  >> > >> > 	 >IRA? !!!   F Have you forgotten the "McDonalds contributes to the IRA"  fiasco fromB a few years ago. Daft buggers thought they could just use the sameE wage slips in the UK as the US and the pay-slips had a field for "IRA F contributions". I think it stands for Investment Retirement Account or something close.   -- Alan   ------------------------------   Date: 05 Apr 2001 16:05:36 GMT From: ka2doug@cs.com (KA2DOUG)$ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS> Message-ID: <20010405120536.14529.00002323@ng-ca1.news.cs.com>   >>F >> > E*Trade (unlike another online entity whose name begins with "E")
 >relies onK >> > OpenVMS to ensure that mission-critical apps are up 24x7. Which is why 9 >> > Charlie Matco relies on E*Trade for his IRA account.  >> > >> > 	 >IRA? !!!  >  >--   L Ahhhhh. Not to worry. For the UK folks, over here in the colonies IRA standsM for Individual Retirement Annuity, which is a tax deferred investment. That's  the trouble with acronyms.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 17:46:50 +0100 - From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> $ Subject: Re: Another Win for OpenVMS) Message-ID: <3ACCA17A.E72C06A2@bbc.co.uk>    Alan Greig wrote:   3 > On Thu, 05 Apr 2001 13:15:51 +0100, Tim Llewellyn " > <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote: > >IRA? !!!  > H > Have you forgotten the "McDonalds contributes to the IRA"  fiasco fromD > a few years ago. Daft buggers thought they could just use the sameG > wage slips in the UK as the US and the pay-slips had a field for "IRA H > contributions". I think it stands for Investment Retirement Account or > something close. > -- > Alan  T Oh dear, isn't that highly illegal (contributing to a terrorist organization) in the UK? :-)   Then again we all pay taxes...  --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk   A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of  MedAS or the BBC.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 03:28:12 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> / Subject: Re: booting a 3300 for the first time. , Message-ID: <3ACC1E84.651BEB5B@videotron.ca>   Eric Zeller wrote:g > Failing that, can someone point me to a list of cheap SCSI CD Drives known to work with the microvax?   K I used an RRD40 which I took out of its "box" and connected directly to the F internal scsi bus and used the floppy drive power connector for power.    Any old SCSI CD drive should do.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:14:47 -0700 * From: Eric Zeller <ezeller@ericzeller.com>/ Subject: Re: booting a 3300 for the first time. . Message-ID: <3ACCA807.24794D87@ericzeller.com>  e Thank you everyone, I should point out, there is a tape drive in the machine, can I boot off of that?   j Also, how do I get to the system prompt so I can change the boot from ethernet to CDrom, or does it detect# it automaticaly? I've tried various 3 ctrl halt, ctrl a, etc, but I haven't found it yet.   Q I have contacted problem@eisner.encompasserve.org and asked about a new password.    JF Mezei wrote:    > Eric Zeller wrote:i > > Failing that, can someone point me to a list of cheap SCSI CD Drives known to work with the microvax?  > M > I used an RRD40 which I took out of its "box" and connected directly to the H > internal scsi bus and used the floppy drive power connector for power. > " > Any old SCSI CD drive should do.   --N Eric Zeller     "Real SUV's don't have cupholders" -    ezeller@ericzeller.com http://www.ericzeller.com I "The Ships hung in the air in exactly the same way bricks don't" - HHGTTG    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 11:29:07 -0400% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>  Subject: Re: CD backups./ Message-ID: <tcp3qfgpeavg7d@news.supernews.com>   L You're close.  You need to create a virtual disk on the local system that isL small enough to fit on a CD.  Then put an image backup of the system disk onI that virtual disk, ftp the virtual disk container file to the PC and burn 	 the CD-R.   L For the virtual disk, use the LD driver or VD driver off of the VMS freeware CD.   F For burning the CD-R on a PC take a look at www.goldenhawk.com.  Their2 CD2FILE.EXE program is freeware and it works well.  F "Leigh G. Bowden" <LGBowden@bowdenfamily.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message) news:9afu0b$ec4$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk... J > I suspect that this has been covered before but I can't find it. We haveK > quite a few remote sites with master/slave pairs of uVAX 3100/nn machinesnK > all running VMS6.2. Each has three SCSI 2.1GB disks and a CD. I'll not go I > into the history but there is no way of doing backups of these machines K > easily - there's certainly no tape drives and nobody to really put a tape  in > reliably from day to day.  >nH > Should a disk fail it is fairly easy to recreate it's data on the data disksmH > from it's mirror but the system disk is harder to replace. There isn't> > enough space on any of the other disks for a system saveset. >eJ > I was wondering therefore about using the CD. I know VMS doesn't supportL > CD-W type devices. If I create a saveset on VMS machine and then FTP it inH > binary mode to a PC and then blat it on a CD also in binary mode would this > work?  >eH > The idea being to have standalone backup on all the other HDD and boot fromJ > them. Mount the CD and restore the contents. It sounds to easy there has to
 > be a catch.c >t >    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 11:34:28 -0400% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>o Subject: Re: CD backups./ Message-ID: <tcp44f6ffceafd@news.supernews.com>   E Oops.  Minor correction, you want to use the FILE2CD.EXE utility fromt Goldenhawk, not CD2FILE.  0 "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> wrote in message) news:tcp3qfgpeavg7d@news.supernews.com...eK > You're close.  You need to create a virtual disk on the local system thate isK > small enough to fit on a CD.  Then put an image backup of the system diska onK > that virtual disk, ftp the virtual disk container file to the PC and burn  > the CD-R.C >PE > For the virtual disk, use the LD driver or VD driver off of the VMS  freeware > CD.n > H > For burning the CD-R on a PC take a look at www.goldenhawk.com.  Their4 > CD2FILE.EXE program is freeware and it works well. > H > "Leigh G. Bowden" <LGBowden@bowdenfamily.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message+ > news:9afu0b$ec4$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...sL > > I suspect that this has been covered before but I can't find it. We haveD > > quite a few remote sites with master/slave pairs of uVAX 3100/nn machinesJ > > all running VMS6.2. Each has three SCSI 2.1GB disks and a CD. I'll not goK > > into the history but there is no way of doing backups of these machineseH > > easily - there's certainly no tape drives and nobody to really put a tape > in > > reliably from day to day.  > >mJ > > Should a disk fail it is fairly easy to recreate it's data on the data > disks J > > from it's mirror but the system disk is harder to replace. There isn't@ > > enough space on any of the other disks for a system saveset. > >CL > > I was wondering therefore about using the CD. I know VMS doesn't supportK > > CD-W type devices. If I create a saveset on VMS machine and then FTP it- inJ > > binary mode to a PC and then blat it on a CD also in binary mode would > this	 > > work?n > >nJ > > The idea being to have standalone backup on all the other HDD and boot > fromL > > them. Mount the CD and restore the contents. It sounds to easy there has > to > > be a catch.  > >  > >s >  >i   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 16:25:40 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>t8 Subject: Re: Christof a bot (was: "cut" utility for VMS)H Message-ID: <y4n19v8luj.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  # Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com writes:,  M > You can retrieve the name of the calling command procedure using a lexical,fG > but not an API call. That is the only one that comes to mind, though.s  K No, you can do it programatically. It is undocumented, but very unlikely to " change (a relink may be required).   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:38:35 -0700 ! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com^8 Subject: Re: Christof a bot (was: "cut" utility for VMS)D Message-ID: <OF450BC4A9.F8D63E95-ON88256A25.0060D83C@foundation.com>  I I'd be very interested in the detail of that, if you have it to hand, ands> wouldn't mind. I have a use for just such a routine right now.   Shane8          D Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> on 04/05/2001 07:25:40 AM  ! Please respond to Jan Vorbrueggeno7       <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>s   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come cc:s  9 Subject:  Re: Christof a bot (was: "cut" utility for VMS)t    # Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com writes:V  D > You can retrieve the name of the calling command procedure using a lexical,G > but not an API call. That is the only one that comes to mind, though.   K No, you can do it programatically. It is undocumented, but very unlikely tor" change (a relink may be required).        Jan   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 19:59:32 +02000 From: "Peter Flunger\(News/gmx\)" <p-i-b@gmx.at>5 Subject: Re: Compaq Releases ECP - download availablea0 Message-ID: <9aibnq$eo7$1@rohrpostix.uta4you.at>  ? "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in message 6 news:EFcx6.16454$Wz.6374796@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net... >h4 > "Keith Brown" <kbrown780@isd.net> wrote in message# > news:3AC5464F.BB4F854B@isd.net...  > > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:I > > >u8 > > > "Keith Brown" <kbrown780@isd.net> wrote in message' > > > news:3AC53092.D383E8C8@isd.net...o > > > > L > > > > Compaq today released ECP (enterprise capacity planner) or something > > > > like that.J > > > > I downloaded it today and tried it out. While it lacks some of theH > > > > features of the old DEC Performance Analyzer it really is a niceK > > > > product. The price is right, included with the price of OpenVMS and0 > runs# > > > > on 6.1 - 7.3 VAX and Alpha.A > > >rH > > > Are there any co-requisite apps (PAWZ or what-have-you) and if so, what > do > > > they cost? > > > 
 > > > cheers,  > > >y
 > > > terry sn > >cJ > > If I understand correctly PAWZ can be used to augment ECP though it isJ > > not required. I'm not sure what the cost is though.  I spent some timeJ > > today playing with the data collector and the Motif interface which isJ > > quit nice. It feels a lot like the old DEC Performance Advisor, thoughK > > it does not have the ability to drill down to as much detail as DEC PA, , > > but then it doesn't cost $25K either :-) >iL > Nor does it cost anywhere as much as what all the stuff DEC gave away, er,  > "sold" to Computer Associates! >B > Not a bad deal!d >r >o   Hi everybody !  B Anybody having the same problems as i do, when i try to change the5 'read sample-from date-time' in the motif interface ? ? My ECP produces the following trace-back when i try to do that:h ( wrapped manually :) )M $ plan ana/motH Enterprise Capacity Performance Analyzer (c) Compaq Computer Corporation 2001,e All Rights Reserved.# %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, 1 reason mask=00, virtual address=0000000000000004,s  PC=000000000009BA60, PS=0000001B  2   Improperly handled condition, image exit forced./   Signal arguments:   Number = 0000000000000005 1                         Name   = 000000000000000C 1                                  0000000000000000o1                                  0000000000000004t1                                  000000000009BA60o1                                  000000000000001B        Register dump:J     R0  = 0000000000000000  R1  = 0000000000000000  R2  = 000000007C760270J     R3  = 00000000004D7DE0  R4  = 000000007ADE5348  R5  = 00000000004D7FA8J     R6  = 00000000004D7FB0  R7  = 00000000004D5960  R8  = 0000000000000001J     R9  = 0000000000000000  R10 = 0000000000000001  R11 = 0000000000000002J     R12 = 0000000000000001  R13 = 0000000000000017  R14 = 0000000000000000J     R15 = 0000000000347A20  R16 = 00000000004D7DE0  R17 = 0000000000000000J     R18 = 000000007ADE5348  R19 = 0000000000250DC4  R20 = 00000000002FC0E0J     R21 = 00000000002FC0E0  R22 = 0000000000000020  R23 = 0000000000000001J     R24 = 0000000000307984  R25 = 0000000000000003  R26 = FFFFFFFF807B1A60J     R27 = 0000000000014748  R28 = FFFFFFFF806F42F0  R29 = 000000007ADE52C0J     SP  = 000000007ADE52A0  PC  = 000000000009BA60  PS  = 200000000000001B  / But apart from that: I also do like it a lot !! 4 Reminds me a lot of PSDC / PSPA before CA killed it.   Peterh   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 15:47:14 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> G Subject: Re: EV7 and EV8 for the low end (was: VMS-Related: Affordable)tH Message-ID: <y4vgojh319.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  ; Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) writes:,  N > > At the simplest level, EV8 can be treated by the OS as 4 independent CPUs.7 > > With each "thread" appearing as an independent CPU.3C > But wouldn't such use suffer from the various threads not sharinge> > an address space (tromping on cache in different fashions) ?  H Yes. I suppose the rationale is that a thread that suffers a cache miss,I especially all the way out to memory, is stalled (give or take hit-under-:J miss and out-of-order processing) for at least a hundred cycles anyway, soH that doesn't matter so much. It does introduce some interesting code for the thread scheduler...    	Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 09:03:36 GMT!1 From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au>A* Subject: Re: F$CONTEXT anomaly ? Feature ?9 Message-ID: <IxWy6.1175$CN.198017@nostril.pacific.net.au>   0 CSABA  HARANGOZO <csabah@zipworld.com.au> wrote:, > Adam Maulis <maulis@ludens.elte.hu> wrote:p >> In article <Odiy6.1133$CN.190227@nostril.pacific.net.au>, CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au> writes:A >>> 	This bit me today. I was building up a context list with thei) >>> 	above-mentioned lexical, like this :g >>> 
 >>> 	$....8 >>> 	$ TEMP = F$CONTEXT("PROCESS",CTX,"GRP","111","EQL")	 >>> 	$...s >>> D >>> 	( 111 is a UIC group number. ) Fire it off, no go. Zilch, nada.D >>> 	It took me a while and a bit of experimenting before I realized5 >>> 	that F$CONTEXT wanted the value as _decimal_(!).t    4 >> No. f$context wanted it as integer. Not a string.  ! >> from the help lex f$cont argu:.  < >>          GRP        Integer  GEQ,       UIC group number.    > >> When you specify string, then normal DCL string to integer H >> translation is performed. ( "true" -> 1, "111" -> 111, "false" -> 0 )  ; >> when you specify integer, there is no rational of radix.s  K >> I mean when AAA symbol has a value 111 it has a value %d111, %x6F, %o157  >> %b01101111 in same time.   C > 	Thanks, Adam. I think what confused me is that I used the doubleeB > 	quotation marks ("), not realising that these make it a string.: > 	Tomorrow I will try without them, and see what happens.@ > 	( Still, this way it works : "%O111", even with the quotation > 	marks, hmm )=  @ 	Follow up myself, sorry Adam, but it seems you misunderstood my> 	post. I am aware of the fact that it has to be an integer, no@ 	problem with that. However, if you want to kill, let's say, allA 	users who has the UIC group number 111, and you give this numberi@ 	to F$CONTEXT ( without prefix ) it will treat it as decimal andB 	eventually will look for users with UIC group number 157 ( %D111=D 	%O157 ). If you transform your number into decimal ( %O111 = %D73 )B 	then it finds you the users with UIC group number 111, as you in-' 	tended. So you have to juggle a bit...   A 	So the point is, and my little gripe was yesterday, that you can>F 	not feed a UIC number straight to F$CONTEXT and expect it to find the9 	right users right away, but you either use a prefix likesE 	this, "%O111", or do the maths and _then_ give the number in decimal  	to the lexical. Try it... 					Cheers,		Csabal  I    ----------------------------------------------------------------------rE    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehog E    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush.hI    ----------------------------------------------------------------------h;    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2001 12:27:53 +02002) From: maulis@ludens.elte.hu (Adam Maulis)D* Subject: Re: F$CONTEXT anomaly ? Feature ?! Message-ID: <gZWpV5u6DCW+@ludens>0  m In article <IxWy6.1175$CN.198017@nostril.pacific.net.au>, CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au> writes:   B > 	Follow up myself, sorry Adam, but it seems you misunderstood my > 	post.  > not:-) may my Englis was insufficient to describe the problem.& So I try in DCL rather than English:-)     first    see the following:  '   $ a=1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1n-   $ f$context(PROCESS", ctx, "GRP", a, "EQL")e  ,   and now, wich radix does symbol ``a'' use?   second  >   for example, you want generate 100 user (USER100 to USER199)&   the following example does not work:     $ uiccnt = 100     $ loop:r<     $   mc authorize add user'uiccnt' /uic=[300,'uiccnt']        $   uccnt = uccnt +1'     $ if uiccnt .lt. 200 then goto loopl     the following worksn       $ uiccnt = 100     $ loop: H     $   mc authorize add user'uiccnt' /uic=[300,'f$fao("!OW",uiccnt)]        $   uccnt = uccnt +1'     $ if uiccnt .lt. 200 then goto loopa     example summaries: K  @   the authorize wants uic in string representation, not integer.   And in octal form.     thirdt  %     $ write sys$output f$fao("!%U",a).8 	 In this example the symbol ``a'' is an 30 bit integer.# 	 Wich radix does symbol ``a'' use?           the problem is the following:tJ   not clearly different that: one type of symbol is string and represents I   numeric value with any radix and if you not specify explicit radix thenHI   DCL assumes that it is decimal and  AUTHORICE/UIC assumes it is octal, iM   and another type of symbol is integer and when you specify you must specify-K   it with keystrokes but the internal representation of integer there is no@/   (apprehension|comprehension|effect) of radix.h     that you want is the folowing:  G   change the DCL parse concept that parses integer value es decimal in  I   most of the situations but in the case of f$context...grp... that perse !   routine does the octal parsing.t  H   and does it replace 'uicnum' with octal representation of uicnum when 3   it found in the mcr authorize /uic... expression?C    6 can you understand Hungarian Language explanation? :-)       > 					Cheers,		Csaba4 > K >    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- G >    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehoghG >    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush.eK >    ----------------------------------------------------------------------n= >    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:a    I Adam Maulis              maulis@ludens elte hu         VMS system managertH  .......................................................................H  VMS Competence Center                             VMS Szakertoi KozpontH  Eotvos Lorand University                  Eotvos Lorand TudomanyegyetemH  Budapest, Hungary                                              BudapestH  =======================================================================   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 11:21:57 GMT 1 From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au>d* Subject: Re: F$CONTEXT anomaly ? Feature ?9 Message-ID: <pzYy6.1180$CN.198834@nostril.pacific.net.au>   * Adam Maulis <maulis@ludens.elte.hu> wrote:o > In article <IxWy6.1175$CN.198017@nostril.pacific.net.au>, CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au> writes::  C >> 	Follow up myself, sorry Adam, but it seems you misunderstood mye	 >> 	post.u  @ > not:-) may my Englis was insufficient to describe the problem.( > So I try in DCL rather than English:-)     > first  >   see the following:  ) >   $ a=1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1t/ >   $ f$context(PROCESS", ctx, "GRP", a, "EQL")   . >   and now, wich radix does symbol ``a'' use?     [...snip...]    8 > can you understand Hungarian Language explanation? :-)  0 	( I replied to Adam privately, in Hungarian...)  I    ----------------------------------------------------------------------mE    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehogiE    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush.eI    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ;    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 08:28:12 +0000 ) From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com>e$ Subject: Re: Free The OpenVMS Seven!+ Message-ID: <3ACD7E1C.A98C52B@infopuls.com>a  ; On Wed, Apr 04, 2001 at 09:32:26AM -0500, Christopher Smith  wrote: > > -----Original Message-----4 > > From: Christof Brass [mailto:brass@infopuls.com] > C > > Objection, your honour! :-) Only against the last part "nor the C > > machine for which they build". I claim that if the abstractions D > > are well taken and the language implementation is appropriate we? > > shouldn't bother much about the HW details. This is exactlyuB > > what's abstraction is all about: not having to take care aboutB > > details which shouldn't be important for the task at hand on a? > > specific level. That is the idea of stepwise refinement andt
 > > layering.- > N > Ahh -- I think you're arguing for a language at a higher level than has beenJ > seriously attempted in anything but a script language before. :)  On theN > other hand, in a few languages, you're right, it is possible to know nothingL > about the machine, and still produce workable programs.  (I find that it'sF > generally more difficult.  To really do it effectively, you'd need aM > "programming environment" with its own interface, maybe its own filesystem.uK > Something along the lines of early Pascal, or modern Oberon/inferno/maybev > java.)    Are you reading my thoughts? :-)< I personally think that the question of abstraction (and the answer) @ is one key to productivity and quality. I'm just re-reading sort of u: the Compiler Construction Book by Wirth (I studied the old edition : and have now the new which is based on Oberon-0 and a RISC target d= machine as opposed to the old which was based on MODULA-0 (?)s and 8 a stack machine (!)) and I'm amazed about the clarity of	 thoughts v and elegance of style.= That you mentioned Java hit the nail on the head. But I admite that o> it's questionable of the Java abstraction is the silver bullet (I  > seriously doubt that and I've read a few bits about the basic 3 problems of the approach SUN have decided to take).   B > > > Bjarne Stroustrup has said on several occasions that C++ is  > > not, strictlyi: > > > speaking, an "object oriented" language. (Though is  > > _possible_ to write OO4 > > > code in C++)  People just won't listen to him. >  > > Objection, your honour!c@ > > I studied the paper by Bjarne Stroustrup which came with theC > > first AT&T C++ compiler (preprocessor). I have it still and canDD > > quote from it. Out of my memory it was quite amusing to read andA > > culminated in the subtle statement that you can program in oonA > > way in every language but there is a big difference between an? > > language which allows you to program oo with or in it and at$ > > language that *supports* it. :-) > = > >From http://slashdot.org/interviews/00/02/25/1034222.shtml  > M > If you like long words, you can say C++ is a "multi-paradigm language," but J > simply saying "C++ is an OOPL" is inaccurate. I wrote a paper about thatM > "Why C++ isn't just an Object-Oriented Programming Language" (download fromMD > my papers page). I presented that paper at OOPSLA - and survived.   = Congratulations. I'll download your paper soon and I already e9 started to go to slashdot to fetch the interview. You arel completely  > right that C++ is not a pure OOPL, it is what we call a hybrid	 language.a9 You seem to be even a hotter shot than I concluded. BTW Ie
 presented 0 a comparison of oo extension of several MODULA-2 implementations, -@ Turbo Pascal and C++ at the 2nd European MODULA-2 conference in ; Loughborough 1992 (or was it Leicester? - I have to check).t  @ > The papers page is http://www.research.att.com/~bs/papers.html  ; Great - I downloaded oopsla.pdf. Is your paper available asf well?v@ The abstract by Stroustrup's paper sounds interesting though it A contains a couple of phrases that make me suspicious. I'll study . that later and comment on it..  C > > And he claimed that C++ were supporting oo quite well. Maybe he  > > changed his mind later ...E > > Could you give exactly a reference? If you like me to do it first:B > > I'll do it because it will take me about 15 minutes of diggingB > > out my material from my college time (and another 5 minutes to > > store it back again).a > L > He still stands by that statement as far as I've seen.  The point was thatL > even while "supporting" OO, C++ also allows writing non-OO code -- it does > not enforce the OO method.  3 Yup. You know my thoughts: oo is a superset ... ;-)-  G > > > > But again: I insist in my question about "knowing how computers D > > > > really work". I'm sure that it is a misconception to avoid aC > > > > level of abstraction because it widens the distance betweenoC > > > > written source and machine instructions because it would be.F > > > > difficult to define the appropriate separation line to justifyG > > > > the use of an abstraction given by the PL C but not Ada and not  > H > I think things of that sort should be weighed on a case-by-case basis,K > personally.  There may be situations where more abstraction is desirable,yN > and others where it's not.  I would not personally write a bootstrap loader,N > or a real-time application (unless the compiler was astoundingly good!) in a > very abstract language.e  > Well agreed. But it seems to me that even the two examples you
 mentioned > the solution is more influenced by the HW architecture than by the @ instruction set of the CPU. If this holds true than the compiler and ; the language is the minor part while the modularisation and 
 libraries ' to interface the HW are the major part.f> Anyway I'm still convinced that even low level features can be offered 8 in different levels of abstraction and quality. The best programmers 8 can write good programs in almost every language but the
 productivity s; might not be best and all the other programmers suffer fromA	 language u
 deficiencies.    > > (Macintosh desktopJ > > > metaphor, anyone?  Perhaps even more sinister ... device abstraction? > > > libraries.  I don't claim these things are bad -- I like   > > them in many casesE > > > -- but they lead to misconception.), and a larger percentage ofi= > > > "programmers" these days don't even think to challenge i > > those ideas in their > > > own minds. > A > > Very well presented points! This seems to be also a claim fork? > > better documentation of the interfaces and how to use them.t > I > Certainly.  Though that may be a separate problem.  Do you remember the1L > volume of manuals that used to come with even home computers just 15 years > ago?  : Not exactly - but I remember the VMS 4.x documentation set
 including = DATATRIEVE and some other astounding tools which took several  meters =/ of shelf space. That was perfect documentation!   B > > Did you complain about the Mac desktop metaphor? I think about; > > buying one of these cool Titan PowerBooks if MacOS X is  > > installed as default.0 > M > I wasn't complaining about the metaphor -- I was complaining that the usersrF > are never told "this isn't exactly how the computer works, it's justK > presented this way for your convenience."  You'd be surprised -- or maybe0L > not -- that most people don't understand this.  Try explaining to somebodyG > why, when they drag a file from a floppy onto their desktop, it still0+ > disappears when the floppy is dismounted.0  8 This is one of most criticised points of the Mac desktop
 behaviour ;-)0  8 This is anyway a basic or an academic question: a lot of
 technical @ tools/gadgets in daily life offer interfaces which are far from : perfection and not close to what really happens behind the scene. 0: Most people are used to it whithout thinking what's really
 happening.7 Some other think about and detect what's wrong with it.E  0@ > > > For instance, when you have a function which is buried in : > > > the hierarchy of objects such that you call it thus: > > > 0 > > > MyObject.SomeInheretedClass.SomeFunction() > > > " > > > (oversimplification here...)> > > > It is most likely compiled into just a plain jump.  The  > > "hierarchy" there is: > > > purely a linguistic device.  It shows which bits of  > > previous work, if youb: > > > will, we've called upon in setting this "object" up. > > > > This is a good and a bad example at the same time. I would@ > > suggest to remove the "SomeInheritedClass." part of the callB > > because exactly this is a major aspect against oo: you burn inD > > the class and by that you prevent dynamic binding. The classical > I > Yep -- the funny thing is that were I actually writing the program, I'dnL > never have written it that way unless there were two functions of the same? > name.  I didn't think of that when I was writing the example.e  @ Good point: name clashes and how to avoid them. Ever programmed 
 in Eiffel?  B > > > That's not a bad thing, and in fact, it's incredibly useful ? > > > on occasion. The problem comes when some person fails to -C > > > realize that  it's an "illusion," just as macros, high-level H% > > > flow control, and other things.u > C > > I need an explanation of "illusion". We shouldn't forget that a1B > > high level PL is an abstraction per se and you even don't know? > > if the HW is closer to the language than you thought - everr; > > heard about Java-In-Silicon? Do you remember the frenchA > > Pascaline? > G > Good point -- and it's really something close to what I was saying.  xD > You probably noticed my mention above of the fact that this isn't ? > just a feature of OO, but of high-level languages in general.)   Agreed - case closed!(  N > "Illusion," meaning that the language -- as it should be -- is doing quite aD > bit more work for us in these areas than it appears.  If you don'tK > understand that, you might end up doing some things that aren't very goodeM > for your end product.  For instance -- and I've seen this before -- leaving M > the compiler optimizations set to the defaults because you don't understandrJ > to check them! :) (Ok, the programmer who did this wasn't too smart, but0 > it's the first thing that popped into my head)  > Why is there a choice of optimisations besides turning them on
 for speed 6 or space (drop space nowadays) or turning them off for
 debugging?   > > Back to nature, he? ;-)w, > > I for one prefere my comfortable bed :-) > M > Me too -- I'd like to think that I could survive in the wilderness if I hadlN > to.  That's not true, of course, since my continued survival is dependant onN > a medicine which hasn't been around for long, actually.  That aside, though,N > I hope that my furnace will not prevent me from knowing how to make fire. :)  < This is essential: to basically understand the technique and it's root. ,9 But I have to admit that I wouldn't be able to design and  produce an  $ Alpha chip from scratch - would you?  @ And for the medical survival task: we all live longer and better with n: medical service around even if we don't really need it for
 beeing alive.O= It's a good practice anyway to see the doctor once in a whiler because ; early detected defects can better be healed or good medicalo consulting y> can even prevent damage in advance. If I had to survive in the wilderness o@ I'll get probably difficulties to avoid meet what I normally do.  L > Have you read the science-fiction stories (it's a recurring theme) where aI > civilization builds a computer which will perform some pretty important K > function, and the computer -- maybe it's a VAX -- ends up working so well J > that the people who designed it are no longer around when it breaks?  OfK > course nobody's bothered to learn how it works; it wasn't necessary.  Now-L > society is left without <some function> because nobody can figure out how  > to do it. :)  > I might not have read exactly that story but I'm very familiar with  @ that topic. It seems that with processor design we have a little bit < that pattern as with Intel the designers missed several good
 practices > of older designs. They partly re-invented the wheel in a lower quality ? and partly they failed (I read this in a computer magazin - my l= favourite one). The older engineers were forced to retire ando the = younger just didn't get it. If society looses (or it "loses")y its  knowledge history will repeat.: Do you know that it is still not discovered how the Romans created 7 their type of concrete which is stronger than the later 	 flavours?a  @ > > I never loved the "one million flies can't be wrong" type ofD > > argument which led to "nobody got fired for buying IBM (nowadays	 > > M$)".  > ; > I wonder whether anyone ever got promoted for buying IBM?    :-)0  
 > Regards, >  > Chrisn > # > Christopher Smith, Perl Developere > Amdocs - Champaign, IL >  > /usr/bin/perl -e 'A > print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n");[ > 'f   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2001 09:35:32 GMTl0 From: roland.haider@at.bosch.com (Roland Haider)) Subject: Re: Hopf 6841 dtss time providers6 Message-ID: <9ahe94$g60$1@proxy.fe.internet.bosch.com>  > munk@home.nl (Dirk Munk) wrote in <3ACB2EFF.16FC523B@home.nl>:  D >Could be. I have seen implementations with Hopf clocks that use the= >DCF77 timesignal from Frankfurt, but not with the GPS clock.r >  >Ruzsinszky Attila wrote:  >i? >> > Who uses that and can help me to configure and find error? F >> So no one uses Hopf 6841 or any Hopf  GPS clock with GPS except me? >> >> Ruzsi > G Hmm, got a Hopf ClockMouse (DCF77 connected via 300Bd serial) currentlyiD connected to a DOS box (that's the only thing drivers came with it),2 would be interesting putin' it on an Alpha or Vax.   Anyone done that?d   Cheers, Roland   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 16:36:31 +0000r  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.comF Subject: How do I redefine the alias between SYSCOMMON and VMS$COMMON?/ Message-ID: <00256A25.005B3D70.00@quegw01.btyp>l   cc:c bcc:L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza  = How do I redefine the alias between SYSCOMMON and VMS$COMMON?n     Hi,)  M I had a node for which I had restored the system disk from LEGATO backup onto-O another node [the reasons aren't important in the context of the question], andaP found that the OPS guys had incorrectly set a switch on the backup command whichI meant that [SYS0.SYSCOMMON...] wasn't backup up. I restored this from the-N original disk, but now I wonder, do I need to have a VMS$COMMON structure [viaP an alias] - the node isn't clustered - and if so, how do I do this using the SET FILE/ENTER command?.  N I see from the help text that I must ensure I get this the right way round, soP before I do it, some conformation from the list would be appreciated. Also, do IM have to create the top-level VMS$COMMON directory myself first, or should the ( execution of the command do this for me?   TIA=   Steve Spires     [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beL confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message has beenP addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce, distribute or use this transmission.  L Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee is notH intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have received thisF transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.  
 Thank you.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 12:30:06 -0400r2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)J Subject: Re: How do I redefine the alias between SYSCOMMON and VMS$COMMON?L Message-ID: <rdeininger-0504011230070001@user-2ive71q.dialup.mindspring.com>  J In article <00256A25.005B3D70.00@quegw01.btyp>, Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com wrote:    ? > How do I redefine the alias between SYSCOMMON and VMS$COMMON?- >  >  > Hi,- > O > I had a node for which I had restored the system disk from LEGATO backup onto B > another node [the reasons aren't important in the context of the question], andD > found that the OPS guys had incorrectly set a switch on the backup
 command which K > meant that [SYS0.SYSCOMMON...] wasn't backup up. I restored this from the-P > original disk, but now I wonder, do I need to have a VMS$COMMON structure [viaJ > an alias] - the node isn't clustered - and if so, how do I do this using the SET2 > FILE/ENTER command?W    C It's hard to be specific, since there are different flavors of this-G problem.  Exactly what you do will depend on the details of the currento (broken) directory structure.o  J I seen systems keep on working across several VMS upgrades, with directory) structures getting progressively weirder.r  P > I see from the help text that I must ensure I get this the right way round, soG > before I do it, some conformation from the list would be appreciated.l
 Also, do IO > have to create the top-level VMS$COMMON directory myself first, or should the * > execution of the command do this for me?  M You may be able to do it with RENAME and SET FILE/ENTER, or you might need tor  create some directories as well.  I [000000]VMS$COMMON.DIR;1 is the "real" one.  All the [SYSn.SYSCOMMON] areeB aliases pointing to VMS$COMMON.DIR.  (On a correct disk, that is.)  H I'd start by finding the "real" directory on your disk, and rename it upE to [000000].  If there's an alias with this name already in [000000],dI you'll have to rename it first.  Then RENAME or SET FILE/ENTER to get thet aliases right.  H Practice on some unimportant directories and aliases first, to make sure$ you understand what the commands do.   -- d Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:31:41 +0200a, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>= Subject: Re: How to create a TCP/IP queue for a Xerox printero& Message-ID: <3ACC65AD.6616470D@gmx.ch>   SeeoI http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/tcpip51/6526/6526pro_040.html#lpd_chapMO http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/tcpip51/6525/6525profile_015.html#print_chapu   Fyi.   D.   Jorge Valenzuela wrote:m >  > Hello: > I >     We have a new Xerox Document Center 230 and we nned to connect to ab > Alpha Open VMS,lD > the xerox tech support told us that we can do it creating a TCP/IP > queue.... bute > how do we creat it ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:18:16 -0400i0 From: Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>= Subject: Re: How to create a TCP/IP queue for a Xerox printertK Message-ID: <paul.r.anderson-B1E98C.10181605042001@gazette.loc1.tandem.com>e  + In article <3ACBA13D.5EB188F3@alefdata.cl>,y-  Jorge Valenzuela <jvalen@alefdata.cl> wrote:s  F > We have a new Xerox Document Center 230 and we nned to connect to a C > Alpha Open VMS, the xerox tech support told us that we can do it t6 > creating a TCP/IP queue.... but how do we creat it ?  F If you're running TCP/IP Services, to create an LPR queue with TCP/IP A Services, run TCPIP$LPRSETUP; to create a Telnet queue, issue an gB "INITIALIZE /QUEUE /ON="printer:port" /PROCESSOR=TCPIP$TELNETSYM"  command.   Paul   -- m,    Paul Anderson, OpenVMS Engineering (DCPS),    Compaq Computer Corporation, Littleton MA   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 11:22:06 -04005 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>u) Subject: Re: installing pci cards on ds10p2 Message-ID: <o40z6.585$fB6.16267@news.cpqcorp.net>  H To provide support for this option, install Open3D (the latest is 4.9a).    . Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote in message' <009FA073.5B5C43F9@SendSpamHere.ORG>...,E >In article <aGEy6.519$fB6.14956@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Fred Kleinsorge"s% <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes: H >>If it is a supported option, stick it in, power up the system, and youF >>should be all set.  PCI is plug and play, as long as the O/S has the driver= >>support for the card it will recognize it and configure it.g >s8 >OK, that explains it.  The ZXLp-L2 is not supported. ;) >nK >Hmm.  What I wouldn't give to see the very nice and expensive option work.s >p >--p3 >VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001f VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM >oJ >city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.e   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 11:22:43 -04005 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>o) Subject: Re: installing pci cards on ds10t2 Message-ID: <Y40z6.586$fB6.16163@news.cpqcorp.net>  L You can install the HW first, or the SW first.  When they are both installed you can use the HW.      john nixon wrote in message ....K >Good.  That sounds promising.  It is a supported option, but I am not sureoH >if the driver is included in the base OS, or if it is part of a layeredL >software package (in this case, 2780/3780PE).  If the driver is provided byK >the software, can I install the software before installing the device?  OriJ >does the device need to be installed so that the software will know which >driver to load. > A >"Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message - >news:aGEy6.519$fB6.14956@news.cpqcorp.net...aI >> If it is a supported option, stick it in, power up the system, and youuG >> should be all set.  PCI is plug and play, as long as the O/S has then >drivery> >> support for the card it will recognize it and configure it. >>G >> I don't know anything about the pbxdp, but if it is in the supportedl >optiona! >> list for VMS, you are all set.e >> >> >>" >> john nixon wrote in message ...I >> >How difficult or tricky is it to install a PCI card in a DS10 runningm VMSt
 >> >7.2-1? >> >L >> >Do you have to deal with CSRs or Vectors (showing my age here), or otherK >> >interrupt addresses, or do you just stick the card in and it works.  Orr >> doeshH >> >it depend on the card?  I need to order a bisynch card (pbxdp) for a DS10C >> >and don't know if we should install it or if we need to pay forn? >> >installation.  (installation will cost more than the card).r >> >F >> >I suppose when we get the card, it will come with documentation or1 >> >instructions, but I would like to know first.e >> > >> >Thanks.t >> > >> > >> >> >> >A >a   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 11:35:58 -04005 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> ) Subject: Re: installing pci cards on ds10a2 Message-ID: <nh0z6.589$fB6.16284@news.cpqcorp.net>  < Earl Lakia wrote in message <3ACB3533.5E909634@ipact.com>... >  >p6 >The POST (Power On and Self Test) code probes the PCIA >bus and this information is then made available to OpenVMS aftern5 >bootstrap.  There are modules ICBMs that help drivert3 >determine if their card is present on the bus (PCIm6 >standard has a set of configuration registers and one9 >of the registers identifies the vendor and the product).o? >Most third party suppliers I've come across (including myself)l: >use a privileged program that browses the above mentioned/ >tables and then loads the driver using sysman.h >o< >Therefore, I suspect that even if a driver is not supported7 >by Compaq, they will provide some way to load it.  Yout: >should most likely install the card first and then try to; >load the driver for the card.  I would try myself and thena: >think of buying the support if I couldn't get it working. >h     Alpha Only:e  L The most primitive way of configuring a device (other than using the CONNECTK command in SYSMAN) is to write an ICBM.  These configuration modules (whichoI execute in executive mode, and are difficult to write) can do pretty muchhJ anything the system does for configuration.  On V7.1 and beyond, a simplerI method (file based autoconfiguration) was implemented that is used by alleJ VMS supplied drivers that eliminates the need for most ICBMs, and the needE to edit the bus support code for VMS-supplied drivers.  In file basedwA autoconfiguration, a file names SYS$CONFIG.DAT (and a user file - C SYS$USER_CONFIG.DAT) contain ASCII text records that supply all theaE information necessary to identify and load a device driver.  In fact,wI non-VMS-supplied disk drivers can be supplied as BOOT devices without O/SiJ modification using this method.  IntraServer for instance provided supportL this way for their Symbios SCSI driver (and used an extension of this calledA 3rd party boot support to even boot the device for an initial VMS. installation).  G Users can add their own devices into SYS$USER_CONFIG.DAT file, and even I supercede a VMS driver for the same device.  All of this is documented in F the new feautures manual, and I believe will eventually be in the next3 generation of the Driver book from Margie Sherlock.s  E BTW - VMS probes the PCI bus itself, and builds the bus configurationoG records.  The firmware allocates PCI address space for the devices, ande initializes them.e   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 17:39:03 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> # Subject: Re: Meaning of RSBREFNZRO? H Message-ID: <y4elv78ig8.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  L It's a lock manager bug. Check applicable ECOs. Is your system in a cluster?   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 05 Apr 2001 17:44:15 GMT From: sk388@aol.com (Sk388)l Subject: NT or 2K on VMS: Message-ID: <20010405134415.14272.00000356@ng-cg1.aol.com>  N I have a DEC3000 model 600 running 7.1, and would like to know if I can run NTN or 2K on top of VMS? Crazy question you ask? Maybe...Any help would be greatly appreciated.   Scotte   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 10:19:52 -05001 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>p+ Subject: Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentationsa8 Message-ID: <9ai2fm$m0d$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>   Jim,  L Thanks much for sharing this info.  This is truely an example of what a user org is all about.-   Dave...d  8 "Jim Becker" <becker@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:9PgUvqYVQz0R@eisner.encompasserve.org...sG > The presentations from the OpenVMS Technical Update are now availablegB > on the ESILUG web site. The event was held March 27-28, 2001, in > College Park, Maryland.d >v8 > You can find the presentations on the ESILUG web site:' > http://encompasserve.org/lugs/esilug/u >r< > Most of the files submitted by the speakers are PowerPointC > presentations. I've divided them up into Zip files of 2-9MB each.)   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 17:47:33 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>n+ Subject: Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations H Message-ID: <y4bsqb8i22.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  - becker@encompasserve.org (Jim Becker) writes:o  < > Most of the files submitted by the speakers are PowerPointC > presentations. I've divided them up into Zip files of 2-9MB each.   I Find somebody with Acrobat, and convert them to PDF. In many cases (much)n$ smaller, and more generally useable.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 15:39:18 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> < Subject: Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations (are excellent!)8 Message-ID: <j70pctsk9796970ai82tcbto6p1t3fof95@4ax.com>  D On 4 Apr 2001 18:45:54 -0500, durkin@encompasserve.org (Mike Durkin) wrote:   >Jim,a$ >	  Tuesday's presentations are MIA:  B Yep, still not there. However the presentations that are there (ofF those I've seen so far) are excellent. Compaq folks have clearly put aC lot of work in here. The Alpha future directions is very upbeat andi= attempts to address many customer concerns. I only hope theseeC presentations (or similar) are also given internally within Compaq.b> Preaching to the choir is good but missionary work needs to be undertaken as well.t  > I hope to be at the UK presentations circumstances permitting.   -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 13:04:59 -0400d  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com9 Subject: Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations [and Mozilla] 4 Message-ID: <C2256A25.005CF674.00@jklh21.valmet.com>   Found'em all at noonish today.  H Rich's slides say Mozilla is the default browser for OpenVMS for Q12001. Is this so?  Where is it?           2 durkin@encompasserve.org on 04/04/2001 07:45:54 PM  * Please respond to durkin@encompasserve.org   To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.comw cc:u, Subject:  Re: OVMS Tech Update Presentations         Jim,'        Tuesday's presentations are MIA:n  ( -ERROR-(404):  no such file or directory Requested method: GETt4 Requested URL:    /lugs/esilug/ovmstud/tue-talks.zip HTTP protocol:    HTTP/1.1  '      Thanks for putting this stuff up !h   Mike Durkine	 DECUServey   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 09:00:06 +0000 ) From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com>", Subject: Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions, Message-ID: <3ACD8596.865E6861@infopuls.com>   andrew harrison wrote: [SNIP]  7 > The UCX IP stack was developed on Tru64 and ported to 3 > OpenVMS they share code. This isn't an idea it ism- > actual code. The UCX utilites are the same.  > 9 > The same applies to Motif. You don't think that OpenVMS)6 > engineering wrote the OpenVMS Motif lib and utilites5 > from scratch from the spec do you, they didn't they( > ported it.  , Other posters already killed your arguments.  gA > > [All the examples of standards/protocols snipped: CDE, Motif,i$ > > DECthreads, PERL, Tcl/Tk, CORBA]  = > You don't think that perl and Tck/Tk are developed from thek2 > Specs for OpenVMS, they wern't they were ported. > B > > If a lot of protocols have firstly been implemented not on VMSC > > than this reflects mainly the fact that the market share of VMSe" > > in these areas isn't that big. > @ > Of course the great thing about your argument is that you have= > now argued for something that you origionally claimed wouldS > be the ruination of OpenVMS.  ? Sorry, you completely missed the point. One last time: there isa> a difference between kernel and library, there is a difference7 between how things are implemented and presented to ther7 programmer (API) and user (CL Interface) and there is ae: difference between architecture and implementation. Do you) understand this an draw the consequences?   = > COE will be implimented on OpenVMS (in the kernel) from thei: > spec which as you have now said is perfectly acceptable.  
 See above.  @ > The COE utilites will probably be ported from Tru64 to OpenVMS9 > but they are utilites and should not have any impact on  > OpenVMS itself.    Not true, see other posters.  ; > You appear to have forgotten what your origional argument ; > was since you are now agreeing that it is OK to implimenta1 > from a spec provided the implimentation is doneb > properly.e > 5 > Perhaps you should appologise to everyone for being  > a time waster. > 	 > Regardsi > Andrew Harrisonh > Enterprise IT ArchitectR   You don't get it.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 16:02:58 +0100o0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>, Subject: Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions* Message-ID: <3ACC8922.AA6906C5@uk.sun.com>   Paul Repacholi wrote:o > 4 > andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes: > 9 > > The UCX IP stack was developed on Tru64 and ported to 5 > > OpenVMS they share code. This isn't an idea it isf/ > > actual code. The UCX utilites are the same.g > 3 > BZZZT. UCX was written before T64/DU/OSF existed.   3 BZZZT, the current release of UCX is based on Tru64o5 you are welcome to run an old release your statement  % is not true for the current products.   / Actaully I take the BZZZT back it was childish.i > ; > > The same applies to Motif. You don't think that OpenVMSt8 > > engineering wrote the OpenVMS Motif lib and utilites7 > > from scratch from the spec do you, they didn't theyi > > ported it. > E > BZZZT W and X where done at MIT, on a farm of Vax 750s. VMS was oneS% > of the original systems that ran X.r  3 The motif libs were not, nor were the Motif window n2 manager or any of the other utilities. I also very2 much doubt that MIT use Vax750's now. When do you ! think they stopped and used UNIX.C > ? > > COE will be implimented on OpenVMS (in the kernel) from theI< > > spec which as you have now said is perfectly acceptable. > G > No, part will be in the kernel, some in kernel mode code, and most in F > libraries. You know Andrew, those new fangled thing you need special" > swithches to your compilers for. >   3 You seem to be agreeing with me. I said to refresh r4 your memory that COE will be implimented in the VMS 3 kernel (probably not based on ported UNIX code) andc1 then there are the utilities that could be quite E$ easily ported from Tru64 to OpenVMS.  F > > The COE utilites will probably be ported from Tru64 to OpenVMS butG > > they are utilites and should not have any impact on OpenVMS itself.d > E > Well, as T64 is a COE platform, that is ahead of what Sun can do...p1 > Or you could buy some SGIs Andrew and use them.i >   > Akkk this is almost as bad as Christof, Solaris is one of the  reference platforms for COE.   regardsd Andrew Harrisonm Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 12:29:59 -04005 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>e, Subject: Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions2 Message-ID: <141z6.591$fB6.16005@news.cpqcorp.net>  D Paul Repacholi wrote in message <87r8z8384a.fsf@prep.synonet.com>...3 >andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:a > : >> The same applies to Motif. You don't think that OpenVMS7 >> engineering wrote the OpenVMS Motif lib and utilites 6 >> from scratch from the spec do you, they didn't they
 >> ported it.a >iD >BZZZT W and X where done at MIT, on a farm of Vax 750s. VMS was one# >of the original systems that ran X  >c    L The VAX Server is truly unique code, developed in house, it started from the X11R1-beta release.d  K The VAX and Alpha client code (X libraries, Motif, CDE (only on Alpha)) are-L all more-or-less ports of the MIT Sample Implementation.  It is mostly in C.= The transport however is VMS-unique, and is written in BLISS.   H The genesis of the X Window System, and X11 was the result of a researchH project at MIT (Project Athena et al, at the Media Labs) funded in largeJ part by Digital, and led by a DIgital employee from our Cambridge ResearchF Labs (Jim Gettys).  In the beginning there was no real GUI, just Xlib.K Digital funded a very large project to create one of the first GUI's - XUI.nC Eventually, a consortium of vendors, including Digital, HP, and Sun 1 collaborated on a common GUI and toolkit - Motif.   C X11 itself was the follow on to X10, which ran on Ultrix.  It was aiJ contemporary of the VWS window system from VMS.  What really drove X11 wasJ the decision made by Digital to abandon everything else to pursue a singleE "network transparent windowing interface" across all its hardware andFK software.  VMS began work on creating a product at the same time as Ultrix, J starting from the R1-beta release.  Believe it or not, the original intentJ for a GUI was to make a licensing deal with Microsoft for Windows (then in' its infancy) - but this never happened.y  A IMHO, X11 started from a poor code base, and has developed into aeE more-than-adequate code base.  It does suffer from a protocol that isIL deadlocking, it relies on all applications being well behaved, is not robustF in the face of network interruptions, was short sighted in it's use ofL 16-bit representations of coordinates, and lack of a world coordinate systemL (or "standard" set of higher level libraries for drawing, display lists, and
 printing).  I Nonetheless, we have no real choice in the matter.  X11/Motif - JUST LIKEcH WINDOWS - tends to be one of the weakest parts of the system in terms ofK reliability.  The difference is that on VMS (and UNIX for that matter), youC- don't have to use a GUI if you don't want to.5    > >> COE will be implimented on OpenVMS (in the kernel) from the; >> spec which as you have now said is perfectly acceptable.i >nF >No, part will be in the kernel, some in kernel mode code, and most inE >libraries. You know Andrew, those new fangled thing you need specialr! >swithches to your compilers for.  >,    F This is true.  The vast majority of changes will be in library code toJ implement UNIX-compatable features for C.  Some kernel changes will happenK to accomodate things (say FORK, and SELECT) - but this won't change how VMS & works, but will add some new features.  E >> The COE utilites will probably be ported from Tru64 to OpenVMS but-F >> they are utilites and should not have any impact on OpenVMS itself. >oD >Well, as T64 is a COE platform, that is ahead of what Sun can do...0 >Or you could buy some SGIs Andrew and use them. >o >a    J COE is in truth a Solaris compatability test at its most basic level.  SunE has had a free ride so far, since the reference is developed on their L hardware.  The COE kernel is being ported from the reference platform by theG group that develops the reference platform, along with VMS engineering.i  I They will suffer from pretty much any inadequacy inherent in the originalI. code.  But this code is just layered software.   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2001 17:36:51 GMTe From: j.t.horn@usa.net' Subject: Problems with CSWS and CGI-BINs* Message-ID: <9aiafj$ug1$1@news.netmar.com>  E I posted this before but never heard anything back so I am reposting.i  N When it try to execute the following cgi code, it displays the form, allows meM to fill out the form, but it never does the displaying out the results to thel form. Any one have any clues:.   Apache Information:nE Server Version: Apache/1.3.12 (OpenVMS) mod_perl/1.21 Mod_JServ/1.1.1s mod_ssl/2.6.2 OpenSSL/0.9.5a" Server Built: Dec 12 2000 19:25:20   Script:       use CGI qw/:standard/;s       print header,c+             start_html('A Simple Example'),>#             h1('A Simple Example'),r             start_form,h5             "What's your name? ",textfield('name'),p, )             "What's the combination?", p,e*             checkbox_group(-name=>'words',E                            -values=>['eenie','meenie','minie','moe'], <                            -defaults=>['eenie','minie']), p,+             "What's your favorite color? ",>&             popup_menu(-name=>'color',G                        -values=>['red','green','blue','chartreuse']),p,n             submit,>             end_form,>             hr;           if (param()) {-4            print "Your name is",em(param('name')),p,F                  "The keywords are: ",em(join(", ",param('words'))),p,>                  "Your favorite color is ",em(param('color')),                  hr; }o   Results:N Just goes back to the start of the form. http://nell.shsu.edu/cgi-bin/test.cgi to see what happens.  5 Thank you for any kind of response anyone can supply.   O  -----  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web  ----- M   http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groupssI    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this or other posts L made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 16:35:47 +0200$ From: "Jakob Erber" <erberj@post.ch>/ Subject: Problems with threads on VMS AXP 7.1-2  Message-ID: <3acc82c4$1@hcwe67>y   Hello,  6 for too long now, we fight with the following problem:  J Our Applikation using Compaq Ada and multi Tasking (based on DEC pthreads)K at some point just sleeps. Meaning, it stops working, going into HIB state.   L If we apply the system service $wake on it, it awakes and works normaly from then on, never sleeping again.  G Our guess ist, that the problem is related to the use of ASTs and Tasksd (threads) in the same process.  J As it looks, tasks suddenly are put to sleep for exactly the time, a timerI (with AST)  was set up for in a complety different, unrelated part of thes program.  $ Compaq is responding very very slow.  * Has anybody experienced something similar?   best regards   JakobV   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 12:53:18 +0100O- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>A$ Subject: Re: Restart TCP/IP Services) Message-ID: <3ACC5CAE.9CF5D244@bbc.co.uk>t   Didier Morandi wrote:v   > @sys$manager:tcpip$shutdownd > then > @sys$manager:tcpip$startup >eQ > You also need to do this *each* time you change a TCP/IP parameter via the menus > @sys$manager:tcpip$configm >s  S Well, you really only need to restart the service for which you changed parameters.   R Can be helpful not to restart telnet if you are making the changes via telnet :-).   >U > D. >G > Rob Young wrote: > >eD > >         Usually I stick at it until I figure it out... but givenF > >         the time spent in help and poking at com files, am tossingF > >         the towel.  For Digital/Compaq TCP/IP Services what is the. > >         equivalent (short of a reboot) to: > >o; > >         $ @multinet:start_server   ! Does restarts too!e  M What happens here if you are logged in via telnet? Does this use a backgroundAM process to restart Multinet, so you can do it on remote machines? I have .COMr to do that in batch fro UCX.   regards      --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk-  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofk MedAS or the BBC.l   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2001 08:53:16 -05006+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)0$ Subject: Re: Restart TCP/IP Services3 Message-ID: <qOoKzUAnrFgw@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  Y In article <3ACC5CAE.9CF5D244@bbc.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> writes:-   >> >E >> >         Usually I stick at it until I figure it out... but givenwG >> >         the time spent in help and poking at com files, am tossingDG >> >         the towel.  For Digital/Compaq TCP/IP Services what is the / >> >         equivalent (short of a reboot) to:w >> >< >> >         $ @multinet:start_server   ! Does restarts too! > O > What happens here if you are logged in via telnet? Does this use a background O > process to restart Multinet, so you can do it on remote machines? I have .COME > to do that in batch fro UCX. >   A 	If you look, you see start_server.com kills the existing server,t= 	waits 5 seconds , runs "Server" which creates a new detachede	 	process:s  J $ Run MultiNet:Server 'Xacc'/noauth/ast='ASTLM'/buff='BYTLM'/file='FILLM'-?   /io_buf='BIOLM'/io_dir='DIOLM'/queue='TQELM'/enqueue='ENQLM'- *   /uic=[1,4]/proc='MultiNet_Server_Name' -   /input=nla0: 'Xout' 'Xerr' -;   /maximum_work='WSQUOTA'/work='WSLIMIT'/Extent='WSEXTENT'-.   /page='PAGEFILE' -   /prio='PRIORITY' -   /subprocess_limit='PRCLM'-   /priv=all/dump  B 	You really have to love Multinet.  About 6 or 7 years ago I found> 	a section of their documentation that wasn't clear and talkedB 	to the fellow that does their documentation.  Their documentation? 	is probably one of the best sets of technical docs I have come C 	across, couple that with a product that works and works very well,J 	it can't be beat in many ways.-  G 	I don't intend this to be a flamer but functionailty nearly equivalentg< 	to Multinet would be a worthy goal for other TCP/IP stacks.   				Robe   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 09:33:29 -04004  From: jamese@beast.dtsw.army.mil$ Subject: Re: Restart TCP/IP Services0 Message-ID: <01040509332955@beast.dtsw.army.mil>  K young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) wrote on 5 Apr 2001 08:53:16 -0500 in ( <qOoKzUAnrFgw@eisner.encompasserve.org>:   <snip>& > 	You really have to love Multinet.   <snip>I > 	I don't intend this to be a flamer but functionailty nearly equivalenth> > 	to Multinet would be a worthy goal for other TCP/IP stacks.  I I add a hearty second to that! I have used Wollongong, CMU, Multinet, andnG UCX. The Multinet wins hands down for easy of administration, features,p and, especially, support.-  : Ed James                           ed.james@telecomsys.com5 TeleCommunications Systems, Inc.   voice 410-295-1919:; 2024 West Street, Suite 300              800-810-0827 x1919C5 Annapolis, MD 21401-3556           fax   410-280-1094a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:18:00 -0400e# From: Jim Agnew <Agnew@hsc.vcu.edu>i$ Subject: Re: Restart TCP/IP Services+ Message-ID: <3ACC7E98.A6DB850B@hsc.vcu.edu>o  % Awwww.... why not??????????????   ;-Dn  7 (p.s., have seen someone actually do just this... ;-P )P    T > Can be helpful not to restart telnet if you are making the changes via telnet :-). >  > >    ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 16:20:40 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>n% Subject: Re: Spice for OpenVMS Alpha?UH Message-ID: <y4puer8m2v.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  2 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:  L > > What is claimed, and true, is that traditionally VMS has been written inJ > > languages which don't readily generate vulnerable code, while UNIX notF > > only is written in such a language (C), it was at one time full of" > > actual use of vulnerable code.8 > However OpenVMS is now liberally sprinkled with C and 6 > so this assertion while historically accurate is of 8 > little relevance for the current OpenVMS 7.XX release.  H It is quite possible to write secure C code, it just requires disciplineE that has been lacking in a lot of code Unix systems rely on for their G functionality. VMS helps here because the interfaces are specified in ahF way that some vulnerabilities are not present (string descriptors, forG instance - remember the row when some Galaxy services turned up with 0-mF terminated strings as arguments?). I suggested removing the vulnerable= entries from the C RTL, at least for kernel development work.f   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 17:06:13 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>nM Subject: Re: Support for CD-R (was: Re: Seeking CD-R/CD-RW SCSI INQUIRY data)fH Message-ID: <y4hf038jyy.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  4 hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:  I > :Maybe you can tell us the reason the OpenVMS management has decided tonH > :keep this on the "wish list" forever? I guess it has been there for a > :rather long time now ...eH >   Why?  Simple: Resources (engineers, time), and scheduling priorities/ >   (DII COE, other high(er)-profile projects).t  H In that case, the priorities aren't right. Supporting CD-R(W) is a must-I have, nowadays, and I suppose DVD-R wil be soon. It's the cheapest way of 1 exchanging data in a robust and standardized way.r   	Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 09:52:30 GMTa1 From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au>b= Subject: Re: TCPIP V5.0A install fails, can't proceed; ideas? 9 Message-ID: <yfXy6.1177$CN.198310@nostril.pacific.net.au>i  + Lawrence Bleau <bleau@umtof.umd.edu> wrote:eo > In article <60By6.1144$CN.193691@nostril.pacific.net.au>, CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au> writes:.- >>Lawrence Bleau <bleau@umtof.umd.edu> wrote:  >>F >>	I was bitten by this as well. What solved the problem is an upgradeH >>	to the latest PCSI from the CD set. It can be done without a shutdown/ >>	( you just have to log out and back again ).o  P > Are you referring to DEC-AXPVMS-VMS62TO71U2_PCSI-V0200-4.PCSI ?  If so, I have" > access to it and can install it.  ? 	From memory ( I am at home ), yes. Just get your latest CD setc@ 	( I think March 2001 is out ) and install the PCSI kit from it.@ 	( The previous CD kit is also OK. ) It doesn't hurt to have theA 	latest PCSI anyway. No reboot necessary ( log out and back afterh 	the install. )   D 	I got my "please upgrade your PCSI" message when I tried to install= 	the latest ECO to TCPIP V5.0A, if this is of any interest...t   				Cheers,		Csaba  I    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- E    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehog E    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush..I    ----------------------------------------------------------------------y;    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:O   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 09:14:15 -0400$ From: "Russ Leathe" <russ@goron.edu>" Subject: TSM and terminal servers?$ Message-ID: <Qa_y6.3$Wn1.168@client>  I TSM was retired recently.  I was able to get a permanant license from theuJ CSLG folks so I could continue using it.  Is there a product that replaced TSM?  F Yes we still have a few terminals around campus and the users are very reluctant to give them up.  < Also, when a user logs off the VAX, they are returned to the3 terminal_server_name> prompt.  How to I set this sol, they always return to a VAX username prompt?  ) I'm sure documentation is non-existant...n   cheers,    russ   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 09:42:09 -0400a From: Bob Kenney <rmk@unh.edu>& Subject: Re: TSM and terminal servers?' Message-ID: <3ACC7631.7C48BFFB@unh.edu>i   Russ Leathe wrote: > K > TSM was retired recently.  I was able to get a permanant license from the L > CSLG folks so I could continue using it.  Is there a product that replaced > TSM?  @ 	Not that I've seen.  The future does not lie that way, I guess.   > H > Yes we still have a few terminals around campus and the users are very > reluctant to give them up. > > > Also, when a user logs off the VAX, they are returned to the5 > terminal_server_name> prompt.  How to I set this so . > they always return to a VAX username prompt?  B 	You can set the server prompt, but AFAIK none of the DEC terminalI    servers(or Xyplexes, either) allow for a port-specific prompt setting.M     > + > I'm sure documentation is non-existant...n    G 	If you're in privileged mode on the server, a "help" will get you justd7     about as much documentation as you can hope to get.h   > 	 > cheers,l >  > russ       --     Bob Kenney   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 09:54:17 -0400.  From: jamese@beast.dtsw.army.mil& Subject: Re: TSM and terminal servers?0 Message-ID: <01040509541736@beast.dtsw.army.mil>  C "Russ Leathe" <russ@goron.edu> wrote in <Qa_y6.3$Wn1.168@client> on  Thu, 5 Apr 2001 09:14:15 -0400:l  K > TSM was retired recently.  I was able to get a permanant license from thehL > CSLG folks so I could continue using it.  Is there a product that replaced > TSM?  C See http://www.dnpg.com/dr/npg/tsm.html. TSM 2.1 for Alpha and VAX.u  + > I'm sure documentation is non-existant...l  K In the saveset TSM021.BCK is the installation guide in text and Postscript.f@ The install saveset, TSM021.A, contains a TSM$DCL_HELP.HLP file.  C The actual manual(s) might be lurking on old CONDIST CDs somewhere.h   I hope this helps.  : Ed James                           ed.james@telecomsys.com5 TeleCommunications Systems, Inc.   voice 410-295-1919 ; 2024 West Street, Suite 300              800-810-0827 x1919s5 Annapolis, MD 21401-3556           fax   410-280-1094.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:51:30 +0100   From: steven.reece@quintiles.com& Subject: Re: TSM and terminal servers?H Message-ID: <OFE5B10252.CBD57299-ON80256A25.004BE98C@qedi.quintiles.com>   How about :-% DEF PORT n PREFER SERVICE servicenamem DEF PORT n AUTOCONNECT ENABLEn
 LOGOUT PORT n   J As far as I read, the original poster wants to be able to get the users to> a username prompt automatically, not a terminal server prompt.& Preferred service is set port by port. Steve.   Bob Kenney wrote/quoted :tA >>>> Also, when a user logs off the VAX, they are returned to theg5 > terminal_server_name> prompt.  How to I set this so.. > they always return to a VAX username prompt?  F      You can set the server prompt, but AFAIK none of the DEC terminalI    servers(or Xyplexes, either) allow for a port-specific prompt setting.  <<<f   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:59:18 -0600n$ From: Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca>& Subject: Re: TSM and terminal servers?( Message-ID: <3ACCA466.EF85AAE@cha.ab.ca>  K Individual ports of terminal servers can be defined.  Try the following TSMtG commands to get the username prompt.  I have lifted the coding from ouriL generic procedure for DS200, DS100, Xyplex, and P4000 terminal servers.  YouI may have to play around with the commands.  Yes, I still have approx. 126tM terminal servers to look after.  Feel free to contact me by email if you havel any questions.  % "DEF PORT  ''PORT'  AUTOBAUD DISABLE"a' "DEF PORT  ''PORT'  AUTOCONNECT ENABLE" & "DEF PORT  ''PORT'  AUTOPROMPT ENABLE"" "DEF PORT  ''PORT'  BREAK DISABLE"   Russ Leathe wrote:  K > TSM was retired recently.  I was able to get a permanant license from therL > CSLG folks so I could continue using it.  Is there a product that replaced > TSM? >sH > Yes we still have a few terminals around campus and the users are very > reluctant to give them up. >k> > Also, when a user logs off the VAX, they are returned to the5 > terminal_server_name> prompt.  How to I set this sog. > they always return to a VAX username prompt? > + > I'm sure documentation is non-existant...B >t	 > cheers,  >t > russ   -- Lee   ; Lee Y T Mah                        Capital Health AuthorityM? Email: lytmah@cha.ab.ca            Information Systems, RAH CSCI4 Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NW? Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9i   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 01:09:39 -0500l/ From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com>h$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable3 Message-ID: <3ACC0C23.11F9E608@applied-synergy.com>n   Wayne Sewell wrote:e > c > In article <9afd65$a8l@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes: \ > > In article <3ACB9D13.692BA33B@infopuls.com>, Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes: > > G > >>Is there any problem to provide a low level x86 emulation on Alpha?r > >mN > > Yes.  It was called FX!32 on WNT/Alpha and it never ran very well.  It wasJ > > an amazing piece of technology, but in the end what it gave you was an8 > > Alpha that cost 3X as much running at 1/3 the speed. > O > The problem I had with FX!32 was not the performance.  It was that hardly any'P > packages would work with it.  Seemed like every sillyass application that cameN > along had a device driver as part of the kit, even some that you would neverO > have dreamed would require their own device driver.  And FX!32 flatly refusedpM > to even attempt device drivers.  So the thing was virtually useless.  I can,@ > recall only one or two packages that ran properly under FX!32.    : Well, one thing that FX!32 V1.5 does run well is Office97.  D (Of course, the V1.5 release was specifically targeted to Office97.)  G -----------------------------------------------------------------------y$ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com /   Fax: 817-237-3074    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 01:08:35 -0500u/ From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> $ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable3 Message-ID: <3ACC0BE3.814A5261@applied-synergy.com>-   Wayne Sewell wrote:a > c > In article <9afd65$a8l@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:o\ > > In article <3ACB9D13.692BA33B@infopuls.com>, Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes: > > G > >>Is there any problem to provide a low level x86 emulation on Alpha?( > > N > > Yes.  It was called FX!32 on WNT/Alpha and it never ran very well.  It wasJ > > an amazing piece of technology, but in the end what it gave you was an8 > > Alpha that cost 3X as much running at 1/3 the speed. > O > The problem I had with FX!32 was not the performance.  It was that hardly anyeP > packages would work with it.  Seemed like every sillyass application that cameN > along had a device driver as part of the kit, even some that you would neverO > have dreamed would require their own device driver.  And FX!32 flatly refusedeM > to even attempt device drivers.  So the thing was virtually useless.  I can-@ > recall only one or two packages that ran properly under FX!32.    : Well, one thing that FX!32 V1.5 does run well is Office97.  D (Of course, the V1.5 release was specifically targeted to Office97.)  G ----------------------------------------------------------------------- $ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com m   Fax: 817-237-3074l   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 08:04:38 +0000a) From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com>r$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable, Message-ID: <3ACD7896.7A0B2EC8@infopuls.com>   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  [SNIP]  K > Dunno what the deal is with EV7, being as it implements the EV6 core. Them7 > new stuff is the lockstepping and glueless SMP logic.o  = I think the lockstep feature is an important point because asf< far as I remember this wasn't included in the early readmaps@ because at that time DEC was an "independent" company as well as: Tandem and no plans to run NSK on Alphas. Like in every SW< project if you have to include features that have never been> thought about in the beginning, the design phase you need time9 and good people for re-designing to achieve the necessaryt0 quality. With design there is no "fixing later".   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 08:17:32 +0000 ) From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com>A$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable, Message-ID: <3ACD7B9C.61E8948E@infopuls.com>   David Mathog wrote:s [SNIP]  D > Ever read "Waiting for Godot"?  I too expect VMS IO performance toK > improve, and in fact, XFC in 7.3 helps a lot with reads (but does nothing>I > for writes).  Unfortunately even XFC does nothing at all to improve theuL > 2-3X factor buried in RMS or the C RTL, and I've heard nothing credible to/ > suggest that that factor will soon disappear.D  @ Read the book but didn't like it was some kind of boring, sorry.? Is there any chance to fix the C RTL? Though it would be better> to drop usage of C anyway.  > > >VMS app should stay with VMS and take full advantage of the > >superior design.? > F > You mean, those few remaining VMS apps?  That's the other reason for< > leaving VMS - there's practically no native software left.  < Sorry for that but I doubt that going the UNIX (which should- avoided) way would improve the VMS situation."  0 > >But of course there are areas where VMS could; > >not completely excel because its advantages are not thatF
 > >important.u > E > Yes and no.  The VMS security model is much, much, much better than=L > Unix's.  I'd be a happy camper indeed if I could get Unix performance withL > VMS security.  DII/COE?  Who knows, but I'm old enough to know better than > to bet the farm on vapor.P  / Question is if I/O performance can be improved.e   [SNIP]  K > VMS is a Rolls only if you buy a high end system. On low end systems it's H > more like buying a Mercedes without a gas tank. What you've got is putI > together well, but you can't do much with it and it costs you more than , > cars which will get you to work every day.  - Every metaphor hits the wall sooner or later.n   [SNIP]  A > >My experience is that PC HW isn't that reliable and versatile.l > E > My experience is that if you carefully select components PCs are asoI > reliable as low end Alphas.  That assumes you aren't running Windows on0H > them though - windows has historically been reliably unreliable.  (The* > jury's still out on W2K in this regard.)  @ But there a still serious design flaws with the PC architecture.   [SNIP]  M > Yup.  Another reason to shun the company.  Who wants to deal with guys thatt# > keep wrecking their own business?t  ! Not much to argue about that. :-(i   [SNIP]  C > The x86 mode/emulation currently runs so slow as to be unusuable.P  
 Learned that.   ? > >I read that in some Intel, AMD and other compatibles (Cyrix,n@ > >ITCWinChip (?) whatever) in fact RISC kernels are working and@ > >with some even the RISC instruction set can directly be used. > J > I believe that part may be true for the Hammer, it's upwardly compatibleK > with the x86, but may have extra 64bit instructions and other extensions.o  ; My point was to have a complete RISC kernel instruction set-: which is required to fully take advantage of the processor optimastion features.w  F > >Is there any problem to provide a low level x86 emulation on Alpha? > L > Yes.  It was called FX!32 on WNT/Alpha and it never ran very well.  It wasH > an amazing piece of technology, but in the end what it gave you was anK > Alpha that cost 3X as much running at 1/3 the speed.   Platforms live and-M > die by native applications and hardware/software purchase costs.  (NOT TCO,u > duh.)n  + Managers fail in thinking about the future. ? FX!32 is well known but not the piece we really need. See others posters.  C > >Some HyperVMWare which allows to run VMS and e.g. something likeuA > >SoftWindows, RealPC or WINE which is then capable of executingi > >native Intel apps?t > E > Most of the Linux Windows compatibility projects go directly to x86NJ > code and execute it on the processor.  They are Intel specific and won't > work on the Alpha.  = Exactly because of that we need something like SoftWindows ort; RealPC which emulates the x86 on the Mac (SoftWindows don'to* really emulate but this is another story).  ? > >The 68k -> PPC move was similar to the VAX -> Alpha move but 5 > >less VAX apps moved to Alpha than 68k apps to PPC.t > L > Because the market for the new Macs was larger than the market for the newM > Alphas.  Because people knew that the Mac existed but were forgetting about  > VMS at the time.   :-(n  F > >What about an Intel -> Alpha move supported by emulation technique? > M > I don't think so.  A complete cross compilation suite might do it (treatingtK > the x86 binary as a source code), but I don't think that there's anything- > around like that.   : FX!32 did this and remembered the translation decisions to= optimise them later when the program was run again. In fact Ir? didn't specify the emulation technique. My point was to have anD; environment to be able to execute x86 binaries without user>
 intervention.l  @ > >What about a low level x86 emulation to directly run x86 OSs? > G > That was FX!32.  Forget about it.  It wasn't enough to keep WNT/Alpha 1 > afloat and it won't do anything for VMS either.r  = No that wasn't FX!32 because this was targeted to OS specific  executables (Windoze).  B > >What about a low level SPARC emulation to directly run Solaris? > J > There's one for Tru64 called FreePort Express.  I don't know how well it > works.  You need to visit: > > >   http://www.support.compaq.com/amt/tools/migrate-cover.html  9 Thanks. Very interesting. Anybody tried this out already?a  B > >I personally think this is the way to go for Alpha. The ballast> > >of the compatibility instructions should be put into the SWB > >layer instead like Intel keeping all the old instructions along, > >for decades burning 50% of power by that. > B > Actually Intel apps are a pain when emulated (by any technology,I > including softwindows).  They tend to use timing loops and when you runa' > them on an Alpha they eat CPU cycles.t  8 This can be fixed by carefully analysing the binary. The? tool/emulation has to be aware of that. And I was talking abouth7 the instruction set not about the not-best-practices of  programming on that platform.P  
 > Regards, >  > David Mathog > mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edua@ > Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 07:04:09 -0700 From: <tsm@palindrome.org>$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable6 Message-ID: <yV_y6.1450$9q6.1035715@nntp1.onemain.com>  > "Malcolm Dunnett" <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote in message& news:r9j1P9fFFy6K@malvm1.mala.bc.ca...  I >    Course one could read the gospels to say that the failure to deliver	G > these follow-ons on time means the Alpha's lifespan will be seriously-H > shortened as competing processors eliminate any performance advantagesE > the Alpha might have. A quick rule-of-thumb calculation from postedu > SPECint 2000 benchmarks at:- >-? > (http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/performance/spec2000.html)R >:C >   suggests that a Pentium needs about a 50% greater clock rate to-C > match alpha performance, which suggests there's really no lead ine@ > currently shipping products for integer performance. Of courseC > floating performance is a different story, but how many loads arel# > that dependant on FP performance?u  H There's some confusion here. Those figures are at least 12 months out ofI date since both AMD and Intel released 1 GHz processors about a year ago, J but the fastest Intel processor listed here is 733 MHz. In fact, since theJ benchmark you cite was written, Intel processors have more than doubled inL clock speed (733 MHz to 1.5 GHz), while the Alpha has gone up much less (667 MHz to 833 MHz).  K Clock speed is irrelevant, but it is certainly not wise to trust benchmarks2H which are in advertisements on web sites. We can update the benchmark byI hopping over to spec.org, and use the exact same criteria as the original F benchmark, and find that both Intel's and AMD's fastest processors are# faster than the machine you quoted:n   SPECint2000:   1.5 GHz Pentium 4 - 524c 833 MHz EV6 - 518t 1.33 GHz Athlon - 482u DS20E 6/667 - 424t  E Although EV6 at the highest speed grade (not the DS20E!) is faster onn! SPECfp2000, but by less than 10%:o   833 MHz EV6 - 590  1.5 GHz Pentium 4 - 549f DS20E 6/667 - 514r 1.33 GHz Athlon - 414n  I Have you priced a DS20E 6/667 recently? I haven't, but how does the price G compare to a $1500 Pentium 4 or Athlon system, which both significantly  outperform it?   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 15:17:22 +0100' From: "LJEB" <LJEB@somewhere.out.there>x$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable) Message-ID: <9ahupa$2ci$1@soap.pipex.net>u   >d< > Well, one thing that FX!32 V1.5 does run well is Office97. > F > (Of course, the V1.5 release was specifically targeted to Office97.) >-  > There was a native version of M$ Word for Alpha NT, however...K It was only available on MSDN disks, and even then M$ only released a debug0K build, which was in excess of 20MB in size. As a result it was not to quick6 to load and run.   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 16:57:35 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> $ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: AffordableH Message-ID: <y4k84z8kdc.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  + Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes:n  ( > Is there any chance to fix the C RTL?   K Yes, it is possible, but you would have to make a trade-off: do you want toTJ support only one on-disk record format  - STREAM_LF, say? Then the RTL canJ support that directly and efficiently, although support by the rest of VMSK for the Unix-compatible format is somewhat spotty. Or you do this only whennJ the file in question is already in that format, and call RMS for all otherK formats. Or you re-write large chunks of RMS's record handling code for the-K C RTL to speed up all formats (could be a problem for indexed files, if youn wanted to do that at all).  I The other things is that VMS insists in writes actually completing before.G calling the I/O complete - the C RTL could work around that, and XFC V2e should help here.T   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 16:13:25 +0100t- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>o$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable) Message-ID: <3ACC8B95.90F2C579@bbc.co.uk>y   Jan Vorbrueggen wrote:  - > Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes:f >h) > > Is there any chance to fix the C RTL?l >rL >  The other things is that VMS insists in writes actually completing beforeI > calling the I/O complete - the C RTL could work around that, and XFC V2  > should help here.o  J Why would one WANT to code an application where one was not confident thatF when the OS said the I/O had completed that it HAD actually completed?  A Is this the way they teach people to program these days ? Sheesh.r   --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.ukh  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of4 MedAS or the BBC.s   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2001 08:38:41 -0700 1 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) $ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable, Message-ID: <2ac3Bh8FjNGV@malvm1.mala.bc.ca>  7 In article <yV_y6.1450$9q6.1035715@nntp1.onemain.com>, D      <tsm@palindrome.org> writes:  @ >> (http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/performance/spec2000.html) >>D >>   suggests that a Pentium needs about a 50% greater clock rate toD >> match alpha performance, which suggests there's really no lead inA >> currently shipping products for integer performance. Of courseuD >> floating performance is a different story, but how many loads are$ >> that dependant on FP performance? > J > There's some confusion here. Those figures are at least 12 months out ofK > date since both AMD and Intel released 1 GHz processors about a year ago,xL > but the fastest Intel processor listed here is 733 MHz. In fact, since theL > benchmark you cite was written, Intel processors have more than doubled inN > clock speed (733 MHz to 1.5 GHz), while the Alpha has gone up much less (667 > MHz to 833 MHz). > M > Clock speed is irrelevant, but it is certainly not wise to trust benchmarksaJ > which are in advertisements on web sites. We can update the benchmark byK > hopping over to spec.org, and use the exact same criteria as the original6H > benchmark, and find that both Intel's and AMD's fastest processors are% > faster than the machine you quoted:p >  > SPECint2000: >  > 1.5 GHz Pentium 4 - 524t > 833 MHz EV6 - 5183 > 1.33 GHz Athlon - 482  > DS20E 6/667 - 424. > B     But you just reinforce my point - Alpha and Pentium are prettyB much dead even in integer speed ( a difference of about 1% ) whichA indicates that the lag in coming out with better Alphas is a realh@ threat to the marketability of the chip. Alpha is actually doingA somewhat better than I suggested here as these new figure suggesth@ the Pentium needs about a 75% clock rate premium to get the same@ integer performance - but, as you state, that's not as importantC as the actual performance of the chip at whatever speed it runs at.t   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Apr 2001 17:55:23 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>h$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: AffordableH Message-ID: <y466gj8hp0.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  / Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> writes:.  L > Why would one WANT to code an application where one was not confident thatH > when the OS said the I/O had completed that it HAD actually completed?  I If you are using the (VAX)C RTL, it is doing two layers of buffering withcH synchronous I/O - the worst case. And it gives the user no control. WhatJ you do want is some form of checkpointing - be sure that you only continueM after a certain point when all I/O has successfully completed, but don't careCJ before. It is very much like having a relaxed memory consistency model and
 barriers.   J It's not what the OS offers, it is what the user (RTL, in this case) does  with the OS's capabilities.2   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 17:20:29 +0100e- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>o$ Subject: Re: VMS-Related: Affordable) Message-ID: <3ACC9B4D.FF3AA2B2@bbc.co.uk>e   Jan Vorbrueggen wrote:  1 > Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> writes:v >oN > > Why would one WANT to code an application where one was not confident thatJ > > when the OS said the I/O had completed that it HAD actually completed? >kK > If you are using the (VAX)C RTL, it is doing two layers of buffering with J > synchronous I/O - the worst case. And it gives the user no control. WhatL > you do want is some form of checkpointing - be sure that you only continueO > after a certain point when all I/O has successfully completed, but don't careaL > before. It is very much like having a relaxed memory consistency model and > barriers.h >F  K Sounds a bit like having multiple pending $QIO's and waiting for completioni asynchronously. Q Not something you'd want programmers who do not understand what is happing at the-  M silicon level, or the concept of deadlock, to be playing with really. Or am Ie just old fashioned?r    K > It's not what the OS offers, it is what the user (RTL, in this case) does  > with the OS's capabilities.  >i
 >         Jans   --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uki  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofn MedAS or the BBC.l   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 10:57:03 +0100= From: Nicholas Mark de Smith <Nicholas.MarkdeSmith@liffe.com>eG Subject: RE: What to do with old CDROMS... (do NOT try this at home...)dM Message-ID: <78E5B8E274DBD1118D6800805FE60E77760D06@ntprdex4.admin.liffe.com>e  " Well, here's one more I enjoyed...  # http://toast.ardant.net/guide.shtmla  > in particular, this great description of removing an AOL CD...  = http://toast.ardant.net/humour.shtml?action=view&name=anatomy-   Nick   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 15:38:00 +0100' From: "LJEB" <LJEB@somewhere.out.there>:2 Subject: Re: When might SYS$SCHDWK not wake me up?) Message-ID: <9ai000$2mg$1@soap.pipex.net>e  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3ACB975D.1B644B03@videotron.ca... > Chris Scheers wrote:J > > All wakup/hibernate pairs are susceptible to this.  If you execute anyE > > RTL code between the $SCHDWK and $HIBER, this possibility must beC > > considered.a >nK > I have always used an AST to call $WAKE with the $HIBER at the end of thet mainJ > "loop" of the program. And just prior to the $HIBER is the $SETTIMR that willG > trigger the AST. That AST can also be triggered by the reception of aS mailboxlF > message and will also awaken the process (and cancel the outstanding timer request).s  E I always prefer to have the Timer AST running independently (restartshG itself), as that way even if you miss one wakeup you will still get thet	 next one.h  ) > I have found that this works very well.o >tJ > I love ASTs because they can make your program so much more esthetic and eventlG > driven. I don't particularly like event flags, and hate the fact thate TCPIPoD > QIO routines don't have the TIMEOUT function since it forces me to	 implementaK > my own ugly timeout function with event flags which makes AST much harderC to use.k  H When I have done this with mailboxes and other devices that don't have aF timeout on the QIO operation, I avoid using the event flag, by using a. timer AST and a read/write I/O completion AST.  F In the Timer AST you cancel the outstanding I/O which will complete byH running the AST routine with a completion status of Cancel or Abort, theD I/O completion AST just cancels the timer AST which then never runs.  G The only downside is that some devices (sockets being one if I remembernH correctly) cannot be used again after a cancel has been performed on the device.f  	 Laurence.y   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2001 15:45:08 +0100' From: "LJEB" <LJEB@somewhere.out.there>t2 Subject: Re: When might SYS$SCHDWK not wake me up?) Message-ID: <9ai0dc$2p4$1@soap.pipex.net>t   >eE > I never used $HIBER and $WAKE much except in programming tutorials.rH > Isn't it a bit like using event flag zero, its OK if none of the other code you > call > does any synchronization?  >i  K I agree if you are explicitly waiting on the event flag yourself. But I seeiF lots of code that allocates event flags for $QIO (and others) which isG unnecessary as the IOSB status block is also check before completion isi
 confirmed.  	 Laurence.I   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:20:21 +0200d, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>4 Subject: [Q] DCL minute of the day: case sensitivity& Message-ID: <3ACC2AC5.6B94F191@gmx.ch>  N Why is f$parse(...) (and others) case unsensitive and f$mode() case sensitive?L Could this be changed? I often break Customers procedures converting them in' lowercases (procedures, not Customers).    D.   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2001 05:16:35 -0500c9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)s8 Subject: Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: case sensitivity3 Message-ID: <TbDB8AJUKZKG@eisner.encompasserve.org>g  U In article <3ACC2AC5.6B94F191@gmx.ch>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> writes:aP > Why is f$parse(...) (and others) case unsensitive and f$mode() case sensitive?N > Could this be changed? I often break Customers procedures converting them in) > lowercases (procedures, not Customers).u  ; How can f$mode be case-sensitive ?  It takes no parameters.w  < The output of f$mode is always uppercase, and if you compare9 it to a string that is not uppercase it will never match.t  K Are you really asking that DCL string comparison be made case-insensitive ?dI That would break a lot of existing command procedures.  If you want to doi  a case-insensitive compare, try:  1 	IF F$MODE() .EQS. F$EDIT("interactive","UPCASE")y  > but most folks find it easier to use the string "INTERACTIVE".  N ==============================================================================N Great Inventors of our time: Al Gore -> Internet; Sun Microsystems -> ClustersN ==============================================================================   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:23:54 +0200h, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>8 Subject: Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: case sensitivity& Message-ID: <3ACC63DA.3407389A@gmx.ch>   I agree.   D.   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > = > How can f$mode be case-sensitive ?  It takes no parameters.e > > > The output of f$mode is always uppercase, and if you compare; > it to a string that is not uppercase it will never match.n > M > Are you really asking that DCL string comparison be made case-insensitive ?oK > That would break a lot of existing command procedures.  If you want to dol" > a case-insensitive compare, try: > : >         IF F$MODE() .EQS. F$EDIT("interactive","UPCASE") > @ > but most folks find it easier to use the string "INTERACTIVE".   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 02:22:19 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)5 Subject: Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: semi-graphicsrL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0504010222200001@user-2ive7te.dialup.mindspring.com>  5 In article <3ACB5D05.42D57DF4@gmx.ch>, Didier Morandin <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> wrote:  H > I don't remember the escape characters to toggle semi-graphics without	 having tolF > embed an <ESC>(0 <ESC>(B pair every x character in a column drawing. > 0 > I don't have any terminal book under the hand. >   D When without manuals, sometimes a lot of useful info can be found inG SMGTERMS.TXT.  I think it's in sys$library, but I'm not certain off thedF top of my head.  It _is_ lurking in one of the standard directories on your VMS system; try t     $ dir [vms$common...]smgterms   -- i Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.coma   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:19:07 -0400o# From: Jim Agnew <Agnew@hsc.vcu.edu>t5 Subject: Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: semi-graphicsh+ Message-ID: <3ACC7EDB.C3F6AE34@hsc.vcu.edu>c  i hhmm.. look up shuford's terminal info web page... don't have the url right handy, but look for shuford..0   Didier Morandi wrote:l > R > I don't remember the escape characters to toggle semi-graphics without having toF > embed an <ESC>(0 <ESC>(B pair every x character in a column drawing. > 0 > I don't have any terminal book under the hand. > 	 > Thanks,n >  > D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:37:53 -0400i  From: jamese@beast.dtsw.army.mil5 Subject: Re: [Q] DCL minute of the day: semi-graphicsm0 Message-ID: <01040510375331@beast.dtsw.army.mil>  I Jim Agnew <Agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> wrote in <3ACC7EDB.C3F6AE34@hsc.vcu.edu> ona  Thu, 05 Apr 2001 10:19:07 -0400:  N > hhmm.. look up shuford's terminal info web page... don't have the url right  > handy, but look for shuford..t  ( http://www.cs.utk.edu/~shuford/terminal/  : Ed James                           ed.james@telecomsys.com5 TeleCommunications Systems, Inc.   voice 410-295-1919e; 2024 West Street, Suite 300              800-810-0827 x1919a5 Annapolis, MD 21401-3556           fax   410-280-1094T   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.191 ************************