1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 08 Aug 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 438       Contents: Re: absolute beginner  Re: absolute beginner  Re: Alpha-IA64 FAQ( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate
 Alphabooks, Re: Apache on VMS - httpd.conf and .htaccess, Re: Apache on VMS - httpd.conf and .htaccess Re: AW: SYBASE on VMS 6 Re: Backup disk on one system to tape drive on another6 Re: Backup disk on one system to tape drive on another' BMC PATROL Forum/mailing List/something 0 Re: Bug with error handling in GOSUB subroutines Re: Business LInk  Re: Business LInk  Re: Business LInk . Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. RE: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?. Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?- cxx whit std compilation broblem (or bug ???) $ Re: Few People in DEC Understood....$ Re: Few People in DEC Understood....% Re: fms - prototype definitions for C % RE: fms - prototype definitions for C % Re: fms - prototype definitions for C  free software available  Re: free software available  Re: Help, PWS500 locked up.  Re: Help, PWS500 locked up.  Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land HELP..VMSer in UNIX land Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land/ Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780? / Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780? / Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780? / Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780?  Re: IA64 Rocks My World  Re: IA64 Rocks My World  RE: IA64 Rocks My World  RE: IA64 Rocks My World  Re: IA64 Rocks My World % Re: Lat connection problem on Vms 7.2  Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun ! Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun ! Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun ! Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun ! Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun  Re: LPs on the Web" Re: making DLT Drives cluster wide Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red Re: Microsoft and Code red) Re: Modems, Keyboard & Mouse Ports on VLC  mount spare internal disk  Re: mount spare internal disk ! Re: Re: mount spare internal disk ! Re: Re: mount spare internal disk  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  Re: Move to Sun  RE: NCL Command Disassembler Re: NFS network protocol error OpenVMS (Itanium) wishes Re: OpenVMS and IA64 Re: OpenVMS and IA649 OT - stupid mail scanning policy - banning PGP signatures = Re: OT - stupid mail scanning policy - banning PGP signatures = Re: OT - stupid mail scanning policy - banning PGP signatures  Re: PGP on VMS Re: PGP on VMS Re: PGP on VMS Re: PGP on VMSD Re: Problems installing Hobbyist Version of Vax OpenVMS - Any Ideas?F Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise availableF Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise availableF Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise availableF Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise available% Re: REQ: VMS Baseball Cap (Help Sue?) % Re: REQ: VMS Baseball Cap (Help Sue?) / Source for non-standard DEC 15 Amp power cords? 3 Re: Source for non-standard DEC 15 Amp power cords? 4 Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium)4 Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium)4 Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium)4 Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium) Re: Sun keep 'em coming  Re: Sun keep 'em coming  Re: SYBASE on VMS  Re: SYBASE on VMS 9 Re: TCPware v5.5-3: file size change during FTP transfer? 5 TCPware v5.5-3: file size change during FTP transfer? 9 Re: TCPware v5.5-3: file size change during FTP transfer?   Terry Shannon Tech Talk on Tru64 Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun  Re: Third postcard from Sun ! Variable length records - example = Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site = Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site = Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site = Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site = Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site = Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site  Re: VMS 7.3 experiences? Re: VMS 7.3 experiences? Re: VMS 7.3 experiences? VMS Bumper sticker on eBay vmstar questions Re: vmstar questions Re: vmstar questions Re: VS3100 & (dead?) ST51080N  Re: WHO ARE YOU forum?; Re: You Get What You Pay For, a.k.a., There's No Free Lunch < Re: [OT] Market corrections (was Re: Alpha: an invitation to  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:05:38 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>  Subject: Re: absolute beginner) Message-ID: <3B710EF2.2F58FB64@gtech.com>    Malcolm Dunnett wrote:+ > In article <3B6A45A2.EFAE9045@gtech.com>, D >    Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes:> > > If DECUS Italy does no longer exist, then it is a problem.  / >    Encompass takes memberships from anywhere.  > 8 >    see http://www.encompassus.org/membership/join.html > E >    Once you join Encompass you can use your Encompass membership id I > to get a hobbyist license ( select U.S. Chapter Decus as the chapter ).  > M >   disclaimer: I don't speak for Encompass or the hobbyist program, I'm just N > an Encompass member ( from outside the US ) who has gotten hobbyist licenses > this way.   @ Then the DECUS->Encompass change has actually solved a problem !   :-)    Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 17:56:43 +0200/ From: "Luca Balzano" <luca.balzano@antispam.it>  Subject: Re: absolute beginner' Message-ID: <9krn5k$u0c$1@half.spin.it>   B > Then the DECUS->Encompass change has actually solved a problem ! >  > :-)  >  > Arne   yes!I thank you all for your suggestions, I have now a membership ID and I have & already ordered a hobbyst VMS license.   bye ' Luca hoping a quick license delivery...    ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 16:50:20 +0000 (UTC)' From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)  Subject: Re: Alpha-IA64 FAQ + Message-ID: <9krqkc$cro$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>   N In article <9krkos$ctm@web.nmti.com>, peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva) writes:= >In article <q7wb7.9210$xj.1504287@typhoon.southeast.rr.com>, & >Ken Farmer <kfarmer@tru64.org> wrote:6 >> http://www2.tru64.org/pages.php?page=Alpha-IA64-FAQ >  >Alpha 4 -- Is Alpha dead? > B >    Alpha will live on in IPF (Intel Processor Family). Intel andE >    Compaq have agreed to use Alpha EV8 technology to enhance future G >    IPF technology. This allows Compaq to stop competing with industry > >    standards and focus on the higher level of the stack, OS,G >    compilers, and so forth. With the Alpha technology integrated into C >    IPF, the performance curve will leave other RISC at the end of 
 >    life. > B >While I understand what you're trying to say, there is an obviousD >confusion here between implementation and architecture. Alpha is anB >architecture. What you mean is that technologies developed in the> >implementation of the Alpha architecture will be used in IPF. >     L Also since other RISC chips (even from recent reports Sun's SPARC chip) willK be incorporating SMT ala EV8 and will in most cases be able to do this more E easily and to greater advantage than will IPF (unless it is radically N redesigned) what makes you think IPF will leave other RISC chips at the end of life ?  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 09:39:58 +0100 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate * Message-ID: <3B6FA95E.BE7893BB@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: >  > JF,  > / > Please reread my notes. You missed the point.  > N > Performance has nothing to do with this specific conversation between Andrew
 > and myself.  > K > Andrew clearly accused Compaq of making up the 600Ns reference in its WP. $ > That is a pretty strong statement. >    It is also true.    A > I simply showed Andrew where his own Sun web site states 600ns.  >   = It does not. Repeat after me 600ns was the maximum under full = load latency of an old E10K. It is not the idle latency of a  ; new E10K. Where did the 600ns that Compaq claim is the idle : latency of a current E10K come from, it certainly does not= come from the document you refer to, so how was it produced ?     M > Yes, it is the higher end of the 400-600nsec spec, and yes, technically, in D > an ideal world, you could argue that WP's should be updated as newM > information becomes available, but it was certainly not "made up" as Andrew  > accused Compaq of. >   @ At the higher end, it is the top !!!! never, never accuse me of < spin again Kerry. It also isn't the number Compaq refer to, > your document refers to idle latency this isn't latency under ; maximum load which is what the old 600ns number refers to.    3 I guess you have got used to the smell of bullshit.    Regards  Andrew Harrison  Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 13:38:47 -0300+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  Subject: Alphabooks L Message-ID: <OF9E8FC5B6.2A445A7D-ON03256AA2.005B50D4@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  / I was searching for this rarity and I found ...   $ http://www.tetrawave.com/product.htm  I PS: Where is possible to buy a real Alphabook ? Just for curiou$ity ! ! !    Regards    FC   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 01:50:30 -0700   From: theop@itex.je (Theo Platt)5 Subject: Re: Apache on VMS - httpd.conf and .htaccess = Message-ID: <31ff7ddd.0108080050.680efc93@posting.google.com>    > >  > >Nick, > > F > >We've just installed CSWS 1.0-1 (Open VMS 7.2-1, TCPware 5.4-3) and > >are having cgi problems too.  > > G > >We get a 500 Internal server error on the browser and these messages  > >in the ERROR_LOG: > > G > >07-Aug-2001 15:21:13 [20407E96] GENERIC_SOCKETPAIR_inet: bind() - 49 D > >[Tue Aug  7 15:21:13 2001] [error] [client 189.1.8.110] (49)can't; > >assign requested address : couldn't spawn child process: ( > >/apache$root/cgi-bin/test-cgi-vms.com > > ) > >Looking back in the archive if you do   > > , > >DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXE TCPIP$DEVICE UCX$DEVICE > >  > >it should fix it.   > >  > >It didn't in our case.  > >  > >Any suggestions anyone ?  > N > There wre patches for Multinet to make it run right with Apache/CSWS.  Check+ > with process to see if TCPware needs any.  > 	 > -- Alan  >  >    Thanks Alan   C Checked with Process and there was a patch to TCPware in Feb 2000 - F DRIVERS_V543P020 which solved a problem with sockets on Apache beta 2.@ Checking on our system we have this patch installed (via a later  drivers patch DRIVERS_V543P051).  % Still got the problem.... any ideas ?    Cheers   Theo   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 07:52:06 -0700   From: theop@itex.je (Theo Platt)5 Subject: Re: Apache on VMS - httpd.conf and .htaccess = Message-ID: <31ff7ddd.0108070652.456fcfa8@posting.google.com>   h paszty@xoma.com (Nick Paszty) wrote in message news:<14ce1c21.0108021437.6c2d6c86@posting.google.com>... > hello all. > 6 > thanks for the pointers.  i've got all this working. > H > now on to getting the .htaccess file to accept the password and figure' > out why my cgi scripts are dumping in  >  > can't start child process  > 	 > errors.  > 	 > cheers,  >  > nick >    Nick,   C We've just installed CSWS 1.0-1 (Open VMS 7.2-1, TCPware 5.4-3) and  are having cgi problems too.  D We get a 500 Internal server error on the browser and these messages in the ERROR_LOG:   D 07-Aug-2001 15:21:13 [20407E96] GENERIC_SOCKETPAIR_inet: bind() - 49A [Tue Aug  7 15:21:13 2001] [error] [client 189.1.8.110] (49)can't 8 assign requested address : couldn't spawn child process:% /apache$root/cgi-bin/test-cgi-vms.com   & Looking back in the archive if you do   ) DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXE TCPIP$DEVICE UCX$DEVICE    it should fix it.    It didn't in our case.   Any suggestions anyone ?   Cheers   Theo   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 11:19:06 -0300+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  Subject: Re: AW: SYBASE on VMSL Message-ID: <OF1E60AFB5.3359684A-ON03256AA2.004E7D4B@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   Jakob    Let's open this discussion ok ?   F Is there a way to port from Oracle RDB, Ingres, Sybase, Progress under OpenVMS    to Intersystems's Cach=E9 ?????     Regards    F=E1bio Cardoso     H                                                                        =            =20H                     <erberj@post.                                      =            =20H                     ch>                  Para:                         =            =20H                                          fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.c= om.br      =20H                     08/08/2001           cc:                           =            =20H                     11:11                Assunto:     AW: SYBASE on VMS=            =20H                                                                        =            =20H                                                                        =            =20        C But I cannot see any parallelism between Sybase DB and Intersystems , Product. So migration will be max. difficult     Jakob Erber     (      -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht------      Von: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br * [SMTP:fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br]2      Gesendet am:   Mittwoch, 8. August 2001 15:02      An:  erberj@post.ch       Betreff:  Re: SYBASE on VMS    H      It is a pos-relational database which runs under OpenVMS, WNT, Lin= ux        Click at.         http://www.intersystems.com        Regards        F=E1bio C.       &                          <erberj@post.3                          ch>                  Para:   # fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br 1                          08/08/2001           cc: H                          10:00                Assunto:     Re: SYBASE o= n  VMS             (      What is Intersystems cache, please?  A      <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> schrieb im Newsbeitrag   H news:<OF2785CEFB.37FFE864-ON03256AA2.0043B439@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>..= .         People,  ?      What is the most promisor database running under OpenVMS ? 
 Intersystems'       Cach=E9    ??      So migrate to it ...         Regards        FC       &                          Arne Vajh=F8j4                          <arne.vajhoej@        Para: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 2                          gtech.com>            cc:H                                                Assunto:     Re: SYBASE = on VMS #                          07/08/2001                           10:10$                          Responder a&                          Arne Vajh=F8j                  Jakob Erber wrote: H      > Sybase will soon stop its support for its DB product on OpenVMS.=  Is  there <      > anybody out there, who is also effected by this step?  
      Oh yes !   	      Arne               ----------            =    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 11:51:13 GMT 1 From: "Kari Keronen" <kari.keronen@radiolinja.fi> ? Subject: Re: Backup disk on one system to tape drive on anothere2 Message-ID: <01c12000$618094b0$9b0ba8c0@rlhkikker>  K How about to NFS mount the disks you want to backup to a system with a tape  drive and then do the backup ?  K I have never tried how this works, because we use ABS to do our backups andvI with that comes RDF (Remote Device Facility) that can do exactly what youA% want over the DECNET and we use that.    -Kari-  . Mark Hemker <hemker@home.com> wrote in article/ <0a51ntomma024eopujfq7mq8did1ig10in@4ax.com>... F > I am trying to figure out a way to backup the disks on one system toF > the tape drive on another system.  Both system are running VMS 7.2-1F > and TCP/IP Services 5.0a.  The system with the tape drive has DECNETF > Phase IV installed and configured but the system with the disks doesF > not.  If necessary, I could install DECNET on the other system.  TheG > systems cannot be clustered so I can't use TMSCP.  I am wanting to beaE > able to perform image backups as if the tape drive were attached tol
 > the system.  >  > Thanks for any help,
 > Mark Hemker  > hemker@home.comn >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 11:27:19 GMTi# From: Mark Hemker <hemker@home.com>e? Subject: Re: Backup disk on one system to tape drive on anotheri8 Message-ID: <vk82nt4d9rrtffuqcvih6ot73bm54ceano@4ax.com>  D I thought of doing something like this, but there is not enough disk- space available.  Thanks for the idea though.    Mark Hemker.F On Wed, 08 Aug 2001 04:38:28 GMT, "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> wrote:  1 >"Mark Hemker" <hemker@home.com> wrote in messagei3 >news:0a51ntomma024eopujfq7mq8did1ig10in@4ax.com...aG >> I am trying to figure out a way to backup the disks on one system toM# >> the tape drive on another systemE >>L >One method, if you have enough disk, is to back up the non-tape system to aF >(large) file, then COPY/FTP that file to the tape system, and finallyM >transfer the backup image file to tape.  Cumbersome but you can automate it.  >The catch will be disk space. >   Jack Peacock >e   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 22:42:42 +0200 , From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>0 Subject: BMC PATROL Forum/mailing List/something& Message-ID: <3B7052C2.8A7EEA51@gmx.ch>  G Where can I find technical chat on BMC PATROL? And mainly on the PATROLe for IBM MQ Series Agent?  @ On the BMC site there is (lots of) documentation, but I found no pointers to discussion groups.   Thanks,    D.   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 06:06:07 -0700d- From: afeldman@gfigroup.com (Alan E. Feldman)s9 Subject: Re: Bug with error handling in GOSUB subroutinese= Message-ID: <af1e4ce6.0108070506.72982c52@posting.google.com>   r "POWERS, John" <John.POWERS@sema.co.uk> wrote in message news:<D30A62ABC710D211AEE100A0C9D615EE0152905F@REAES2>...C > You seem to be misunderstanding the way the RETURN verb works. InoE > the statement ON WARNING THEN RETURN you have not given it a statuso > code to return. [snip]  B Nope, this part I understood. And again I understood the next part$ that I snipped. My mistake is below!   [snip]B > Note that the original SET NOON command got overridden by the ONE > command in the local subroutine. The gosub just transfers control --E > it does not set up another procedure level, so the SET NOON command D > is lost. As mentioned in the ON command description in the VMS DCL > dictionary..    E You're right. *This* was my mistake. I forgot that GOSUB does not setpD up a new procedure level, in particular in this case regarding error	 handling.a  F Sorry to bother you all with this. I guess I posted to quickly on this one.   Disclaimer: JMHO   &-) Alan E. Feldman: afeldman@gfigroup.coml   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 11:32:12 GMTb# From: Mark Hemker <hemker@home.com>u Subject: Re: Business LInk8 Message-ID: <mo82ntsdbjjksqbkhs6floetesu3q2irfo@4ax.com>  < The reseller's account that they are referring to is on CPN.? Unfortunately, that area is very limited on the pricing that iseB available.  All of the pricing is in an Excel spreadsheet that youE download.  If I remember correctly, the current one doesn't even have C Alpha systems and options anymore.  You also can't search by a partAD number like you could on Business Link.  The best option that I haveD found is to download Compaq Product Bulletin.  This updates its data? files on a regular basis and a lot of the part numbers, you can E highlight and then right click to pull up the Internet Price.  If youhE know what your discount would be on different types of parts, you cand+ also have it automatically convert for you.    Mark Hemkerf  < On Wed, 08 Aug 2001 02:54:55 GMT, dittman@dittman.net wrote:  3 >Malcolm Dunnett <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote:o+ >: In article <GHpztF.2H6@spcuna.spc.edu>, o1 >:     Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com> writes:s > * >:> john nixon <jnixon@cfl.rr.com> writes:* >:>> It appears that they have killed DBL. >:> K >:>   For what it's worth, my DBL login still works and Compaq have assuredeK >:> me that it won't go away until a workable replacement is available (fore >:> end users).o >:> I >:     Mine don't. They stopped working sometime in the last month. I got B >: an email from Compaq saying I should call a sales rep if I want >: information.e >oI >I had the same thing happen.  When I complained I was told I could applyoH >for some kind of reseller's account on some other system, but that's noG >use for me.  When I replied that the site said the system would remain-I >available for users in the US I was told that someone would take care of K >the problem.  I've even sent a follow-up email, but still have no account.h   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 22:50:18 GMTe2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: Business LInk2 Message-ID: <Kg_b7.697$Yx2.16455@news.cpqcorp.net>  e In article <BVXb7.4469$eg1.1371547@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>, "john nixon" <jnixon@cfl.rr.com> writes:s( :It appears that they have killed DBL...  4   That is why the FAQ has the phrasing that it does.  K   At least within the US, the DBL contact address is calldbl[at]compaq.com.a  J :Maybe I should just ask my Reseller to work up my budget requests for me.  <   Either that, or via the "buy" link at the OpenVMS website.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  " Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 22:58:27 GMT( From: Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com> Subject: Re: Business LInk' Message-ID: <GHpztF.2H6@spcuna.spc.edu>o  & john nixon <jnixon@cfl.rr.com> writes:' > It appears that they have killed DBL.M  G   For what it's worth, my DBL login still works and Compaq have assured-G me that it won't go away until a workable replacement is available (fora end users).m  F   Note that even when they "kill" stuff, it's still around - for a funF time, telnet to "orders.sales.digital.com" - that's the old "Digital'sG Electronic Connection", and it is lonely and would like some of its oldnF friends to visit it every now and again. Your old e-store account num-D ber and password should still work (I just tried mine to make sure).  4         Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.com2         terry@tmk.com             New York, NY USA   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 11:21:36 +0200s< From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <noone@home.com>7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?s( Message-ID: <3B7104A0.33A61EA9@home.com>  % Sorry, I got the entry numbers wrong.c  ) I ment "can VMS support > 9999 entries ?" . or "can VMS support > 4 digit entry numbers ?"  1 On my system right now, the entry number wraps ate, 5000 back to 1. It takes 2-3 days to go from 1 -> 5000 and then back again.  6 And all seems just normal with this. What would change  about this in some new version ?   Regards. Jan-Erik Sderholm.o   JF Mezei wrote:e > L > There was a thread some time ago about what happens if there are more thanO > 1000 queue entries and the message from the all mighty VMS engineers was thatlP > the queue system could handle more than 1000 entries but that the behaviour inM > terms of numbering the entries was not documented (eg: the engineers didn'tCM > want to reveal the trick because this was something which could change from  > version to version).   ------------------------------    Date: 08 Aug 2001 11:32:10 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> 7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?yH Message-ID: <y466byc2xx.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  > Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <noone@home.com> writes:  + > I ment "can VMS support > 9999 entries ?"00 > or "can VMS support > 4 digit entry numbers ?"8 > And all seems just normal with this. What would change" > about this in some new version ?   Nothing.  L Hoff is fond of saying "the entry number is an opaque data item, treat it asM such, do otherwise at the peril of your code failing". This is similar to thehF introduction, with V5 (IIRC), of external process IDs that now have an; internal structure that can and has changed without notice.t  K I expect this data item to be at least 32 bits in length, and from values IcK have seen one can guess that the highest byte is allocated to the ID of the K queue manager when more than one is running. Thus, you should have about 24l5 bits for the actual entry number, which seems plenty.   K Check the file type of the queue manager data file, it likely is an indexedrK file. This means that operating with a large number of entries shouldn't belF much of a problem, because looking up records in an indexed file is an efficient operation.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 10:52:57 -0400o2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ? L Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011052580001@user-2ivec1n.dialup.mindspring.com>  G In article <3B6F7FF4.9DBFA53F@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:h  H > We are considering using SMTP to send bills to customers (no spam mailG > !). This could amount to sending about 100,000 e-mail messages from a H > batch run. Since every e-mail message is placed in a TCPIP$SMTP queue,E > and handled by the queue manager, I wonder if the queue manager canhH > handle so many entries without serious effects on the speed. I seem to@ > remember from a very long time ago that very long queues would* > dramaticaly slow down the queue manager.  D I've never done it, but I'm pretty sure you can set up multiple SMTP queues per node.  F You can also run multiple queue managers in a cluster if you have very high traffic rates.7  H Whether any of these steps are needed for 100,000 emails on a reasonablyH modern alpha server, I don't know.  How long are you willing to wait for the job to complete?   -- / Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 09:27:25 -0400 From: <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> 7 Subject: RE: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ? K Message-ID: <D46FE9B132FB9B44AEC242A96E4AB75001925D0E@rlghncst625.usps.gov>   > Apparently it can, as the queue listing from one of our queues will attest.  A Printer queue B*xxx*8_*xxx*IT_1764, stopped, mounted form DEFAULTt   <*xxx*IT - Hold QUEUE>/   /BASE_PRIORITY=4 /DEFAULT=(FEED,FORM=DEFAULT) $ /OWNER=[*xxx*_B*xxx*8,B*xxx*8_*xxx*]!  /PROTECTION=(S:M,O:D,G:R,W:RSMD)i  4   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status4   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------6 1001969  REDAMNT         *xxx*IT1764       12  Holding@          Submitted  6-AUG-2001 08:33:35.69 /NOFEED /FORM=DEFAULT
 /PRIORITY=100hE          File: _$1$DGA1524:[B*xxx*8.*xxx*IT1764]REDAMNT.RPT;6 /DELETE4 /NOFEEDo  6 1001974  REDABAL         *xxx*IT1764        8  Holding@          Submitted  6-AUG-2001 08:33:38.77 /NOFEED /FORM=DEFAULT
 /PRIORITY=100.E          File: _$1$DGA1524:[B*xxx*8.*xxx*IT1764]REDABAL.RPT;6 /DELETE  /NOFEEDt  6 1001979  REDARCD         *xxx*IT1764        3  Holding@          Submitted  6-AUG-2001 08:33:41.81 /NOFEED /FORM=DEFAULT
 /PRIORITY=100 E          File: _$1$DGA1524:[B*xxx*8.*xxx*IT1764]REDARCD.RPT;6 /DELETEl /NOFEED.  6 1001987  REDATRN         *xxx*IT1764       20  Holding@          Submitted  6-AUG-2001 08:33:44.91 /NOFEED /FORM=DEFAULT
 /PRIORITY=100gE          File: _$1$DGA1524:[B*xxx*8.*xxx*IT1764]REDATRN.RPT;7 /DELETET /NOFEED:   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET ( > Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2001 4:13 AMF > To: Webb, William W - Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET5 > Subject: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?C >  > H > We are considering using SMTP to send bills to customers (no spam mailG > !). This could amount to sending about 100,000 e-mail messages from a H > batch run. Since every e-mail message is placed in a TCPIP$SMTP queue,E > and handled by the queue manager, I wonder if the queue manager canBH > handle so many entries without serious effects on the speed. I seem to@ > remember from a very long time ago that very long queues would* > dramaticaly slow down the queue manager. >    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 20:33:37 GMT  From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ? ' Message-ID: <3B70509F.2B6B269E@home.nl>   H I'm referring to a different problem. What I'm afraid for is the time itJ takes between handling two entries. After each entry has been handled, theH queue manager has to delete that entry from the queue. And that may take time if there many entries.    Robert Deininger wrote:   I > In article <3B6F7FF4.9DBFA53F@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:  > J > > We are considering using SMTP to send bills to customers (no spam mailI > > !). This could amount to sending about 100,000 e-mail messages from a J > > batch run. Since every e-mail message is placed in a TCPIP$SMTP queue,G > > and handled by the queue manager, I wonder if the queue manager candJ > > handle so many entries without serious effects on the speed. I seem toB > > remember from a very long time ago that very long queues would, > > dramaticaly slow down the queue manager. >hF > I've never done it, but I'm pretty sure you can set up multiple SMTP > queues per node. > H > You can also run multiple queue managers in a cluster if you have very > high traffic rates.t >/J > Whether any of these steps are needed for 100,000 emails on a reasonablyJ > modern alpha server, I don't know.  How long are you willing to wait for > the job to complete? >p > -- > Robert Deininger > rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 16:57:33 -0400:- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>I7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?t, Message-ID: <3B70562B.71C21AED@videotron.ca>   Dirk Munk wrote:J > I'm referring to a different problem. What I'm afraid for is the time itL > takes between handling two entries. After each entry has been handled, theJ > queue manager has to delete that entry from the queue. And that may take > time if there many entries.A  H How long do you reckon it will take for your job to generate the 100,000M emails ? How long does it take for smtp to transmit a message assuming remote  host is available ?   L You could work the priorities of the processes to slow the production of theM emails to a rate that isn't much higher than the sending of the emails by the F smtp gateway. By the time you've finished writing the emails, the vast$ majority might already be sent away.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 22:55:48 +0200e< From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <noone@home.com>7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?-( Message-ID: <3B7055D4.BFC3088A@home.com>   Hi.1& To run with > 1 executing smtp queue :   UCX> DISABLE SERVICE SMTP  UCX> STOP MAIL  - UCX> SET CONFIGURATION SMTP/QUEUES=new_numbere UCX> ENABLE SERVICE SMTP 0 UCX> START MAIL    Now some other things :t  = - Each of the 100.000 mails will create two files in the home 8   directory of the user running the BATCH job, such as :  $ 01080722461613_SYSTEM.TCPIP_<node>;1) 01080722461613_SYSTEM.TCPIP_<node>_TEXT;1l  C That is 200.000 files (some may be sent during the processing time,tB of course) and that *may* be a problem to your .DIR file dependingD on how fragmented the devide is. You may end up with an DIRALLOC (orA whatver it's name is) error when the system can't find a place of D continous space to extend the DIR file.  Or do CRE/DIR/ALLOC=nnnn toD avoid the DIR to the extend later. You must still have the continous. space, but you know earlier if it's a problem.  E Regarding the processing of the system queue file(s), I'd expect them D to be designed in a way (RMS indexed or something) that will work OK8 even with many entries on the queues. Just don't know...  + B.t.w, can VMS use 6 digit entry numbers ??h   Regars Jan-Erik Sderholm.e      K > > In article <3B6F7FF4.9DBFA53F@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:0 > >:L > > > We are considering using SMTP to send bills to customers (no spam mailK > > > !). This could amount to sending about 100,000 e-mail messages from amL > > > batch run. Since every e-mail message is placed in a TCPIP$SMTP queue,I > > > and handled by the queue manager, I wonder if the queue manager can L > > > handle so many entries without serious effects on the speed. I seem toD > > > remember from a very long time ago that very long queues would. > > > dramaticaly slow down the queue manager.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 23:02:05 +0200p< From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <noone@home.com>7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?f( Message-ID: <3B70574D.48DF8076@home.com>  @ Yes, probably in most cases, but I'd prefer to *know* that I can= run my BATCH *even* if the smtp gateway isn't available until @ later. Or add some check to the BATCH routine to "hold" when theD smtp queue length goes over some value, let's say 1000 queued mails.F That is, *if* there is a problem with VLEC (Very Large Entry Count :-) ).   Jan-Erik Sderholm.    JF Mezei wrote:c > : > By the time you've finished writing the emails, the vast& > majority might already be sent away.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 11:48:00 -0400% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>-7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?f/ Message-ID: <tn2noakd113db2@news.supernews.com>R  6 "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <noone@home.com> wrote in message" news:3B7104A0.33A61EA9@home.com...' > Sorry, I got the entry numbers wrong.n >W+ > I ment "can VMS support > 9999 entries ?"A0 > or "can VMS support > 4 digit entry numbers ?" >e3 > On my system right now, the entry number wraps atk. > 5000 back to 1. It takes 2-3 days to go from  > 1 -> 5000 and then back again. >e8 > And all seems just normal with this. What would change" > about this in some new version ? >s  L In recent versions of VMS, the 5th and 6th digits are reserved for the queueE manager (you can have more than one).  So, if you need more than 9999bH entries, the entry number jumps from 9999 to 1000001.  If you write codeL that depends upon this numbering scheme, then you have code that could breakK when a new version of VMS shows up.  If you always treat an entry number asf0 an opaque longword, you won't have any problems.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 16:49:33 GMToF From: "Karol E. Zielonko Jr." <Karol-Zielonkoixnayamspay@mediaone.net>7 Subject: Re: Can queue manager handle 100.000 entries ?u< Message-ID: <x4ec7.2536$gx2.1078051@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>   Hi,:  > Good catch with the 200K plus files and directory limitations.   A few points to add.  K I think that performance issues, if any, for you would likely come from they workH the SMTP symbiont is doing rather than the queue manager since the queue managert8 plays only a small role in the transmission of an email.  C With the current SMTP queue hierarchy all jobs sent on a system ares submitted toF a generic queue TCPIP$SMTP_nodename_00 which in turn can be pointed to multipleK SMTP execution queues named TCPIP$SMTP_nodename_nn where "nn" starts at 01.o AsE shown in earlier replies you can adjust the number of queues with thes	 UCX/TCPIPoL SET CONFIG SMTP/QUEUE=nn command. I think you will need to run multiple SMTPL execution queues to get a satisfactory level of parallelism. Experimentation will tell you what works.   I Assuming you are sending the emails out onto the Internet directly rather5 thanG shipping everything off to an ISP's mail server (via the SMTP alternates gateway)H each send will require an MX lookup by the SMTP symbiont to see where to send itt@ too, a small performance hit but multipled by 100 x's it's more.  J With the current design of the SMTP queue hierarchy if you want to multply yourI horsepower by using a cluster you would need to set up your app to run ontK multiple cluster nodes with each incarnation of the app sending, of course,MI different bills to different customers. This is because, with the currentm SMTPH queue hierarchy, mail is sent out by a symbiont process on the system on whichdH it was composed. E.g. If you have a three node cluster of LARRY, MOE and CURLYiF and your app runs on node MOE then all the email sent by your app gets	 submittedrL to TCPIP$SMTP_MOE_00 and then goes to one of the execution queues on MOE. If youII run your app simlutaneously on MOE, LARRY and CURLY then the jobs emailed  fromJ MOE go into MOE's execution queues, the jobs sent from LARRY go to LARRY's	 execution0> queues and the jobs from CURLY go to CURLY's execution queues.  I With the cluster enhancements for SMTP which will eventually be deliveredw (nocL promised date or TCP/IP Serivces verion yet, sorry) there will be one singleJ TCPIP$SMTP_QUEUE generic queue which will not be node specific but cluster wideI (no node name in the queue name, assuming a single cluster-wide queue mgrh DB) K and this queue will feed jobs to the execution queues on all cluster nodes.k WithK this change in the queue hierarchy you would be able to run the applicationy thatI generates the email bills on only one node of the cluster if you chose to. and-H the emails would be submitted to the cluster-wide generic queue and thenJ submitted to the next free execution queue which could be on another node.   Karol-   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 11:15:05 +02003 From: "Vincent DESVALS" <vincent.desvals@realix.fr>-6 Subject: cxx whit std compilation broblem (or bug ???)2 Message-ID: <9kobea$3o2$1@s1.read.news.oleane.net>   Hello,    ? I work with the 6.2 version of deccxx on OpenVMS alpha station.r  - I have an incredible problem with this main :d   // START text.cxxi #include <iostream>i   int main ()n {o    double d = 1.2345678e+2 ;(    std::cout << "->" << d << std::endl ;
    return 1 ;( }a // END test.cxx   4 cxx\float=G_FLOAT\define=(__USE_STD_STREAM) test.cxx cxxlink test/exece run test    ->123.45678                // OK  + cxx\float=D_FLOAT\define=(__USE_STD_STREAM)n cxxlink test/execw run test   ->0.251654e+41          // !OK    # Is it a bug of the std iostream ???    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 16:08:24 +0100( From: "Dave Holt" <dave.holt@compaq.com>- Subject: Re: Few People in DEC Understood.... 2 Message-ID: <KvTb7.678$Yx2.15660@news.cpqcorp.net>  J I am the Compaq Product Manager of ALL-IN-1/Office Server. I'd simply like to add a couple of statements:  J 1.  Digital announced the corporate Exchange strategy on 2nd April 1996, aJ date burned into my memory cells. Digital announced it was going to deployI Exchange to all employees as fast as possible and at the same time a hugeuJ programme was started led by Professional Services to migrate customers toI Exchange from whatever they currently used. This new strategy appeased M$ J and later was shown to play into Compaq's hands, more by design than luck.  J 2. ALL-IN-1 was a tremendously successful product for DEC/Digital in everyI measure and we have no regrets. It was one of the few products that had aeK greater market share than the contemporary competing IBM product, IBM beingu# the gorilla of that particular era.0  H 3. A certain Redmond based company spent more on its first NT based mailL server *before* it shipped than DEC spent on ALL-IN-1 in its entire history.  J 4. We currently have plans to deliver native smtp support in Office Server% V6.1, scheduled for delivery in 2002.0   Regards, Dave  = Didier Morandi wrote in message <3B6E7038.D2987170@gmx.ch>...u >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:q >>L >> I was in the field when the "Charlotte Package", which later evolved into >> All-In-One showed up. >>: >Thanks to Bob "Yellow 911 Porsche" Wyman and his friends. >e >D.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 13:20:49 -0400i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> - Subject: Re: Few People in DEC Understood....o, Message-ID: <3B70236D.353A789B@videotron.ca>   Dave Holt wrote:L > I am the Compaq Product Manager of ALL-IN-1/Office Server. I'd simply like  > to add a couple of statements:  4 Thanks for a sign that you (and A1) are still alive.  L > 1.  Digital announced the corporate Exchange strategy on 2nd April 1996, a# > date burned into my memory cells.o  N Do you remember what date Digital had announced that it would port ALL-IN-1 toV both Unix and NT ? As I recall, if was a week or two before the exchange announcement.  L > 4. We currently have plans to deliver native smtp support in Office Server' > V6.1, scheduled for delivery in 2002.e  L Perhaps you should make some news release stating that you are endorsing theN move to IA64 and continue to release new versions of your product to show thatC it is still alive. Or does Bill Gates prevent you from doing this ?n   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:37:16 GMT0 From: LBohan@dbc.spam_less..como. Subject: Re: fms - prototype definitions for C8 Message-ID: <ua20nts3ub6q4jj6jq50k9h04vkovcrjmd@4ax.com>  : On Tue, 7 Aug 2001 11:29:59 +0200, "Jean-Francois Marchal"' <jean-francois.marchal@x9000.fr> wrote:   E >I was looking for the FMS form driver prototypes include file for C,o5 >but I didn't find it... Should I change my glasses ?n  C We have a FDVDEF.H (same as in the DECFMS024.* kits on the CONDIST)m8 it has various FDV$ defines, but no function prototypes,  > perhaps to be expected for an include file, generated in 1986.  < (here, it was installed into sys$library: as plain .h file, ;  not included in any of the *.tlb libraries that I can see)s  ; when we moved to DEC C during our alpha ports, the lack of rB useful, accurate ansi C function prototypes for the FDV$ routines  was a bit of a  hindrance.  4 some of the FMS calls can have varying arguments, ie*  FDV$CDISP( frmnam.rt.dx1 [,offset.rl.r] )  8 and some can be called w/ different descriptor types, ie#  FDV$AWKSP ( wksp.ml.da, size.rl.r)g   (or)#  FDV$AWKSP ( wksp.rt.dx1,size.rl.r)l  : My understanding was, that from other (vms) HLL languages < (not C), it is possible to omit optional arguments, on some 9 system services, and RTL routines, and the compiler will q fill them in for you..  7 for the languages other than C, I'm not sure what they 5 do for FMS calls.2  7 FMS uses a few esoteric/unusual descriptors beyond the m? simple static/dynamic string descriptors one usually sees in C._  B the CONOLD FMS Bookreader docs, might be your best bet (Table A-1)  7 Below, are a few prototypes we worked out for ourselves*? (a very small subset of the total FMS api).  I can't guarantee r; that they're 100 % correct; rather, they're simply our best-; effort/guesses.   the amount of FMS code we had was small,  ; and wasn't worth the bother to move over to, say, DECforms.0  6 Someone else might perhaps jump in w/ corrections, or < a longer list of FDV$ function prototypes, or better still, 8 a definitive list, say generated from the original SDL ?  J /*************************************************************************J *************************************************************************/  
 extern int     fdv$lclos( void );  R
 extern int
     fdv$get(  !         struct dsc$descriptor_s *-         ,int *"         ,struct dsc$descriptor_s *         ,int * F
         );  4
 extern int     fdv$aterm(         struct dsc$descriptor_a1             *tca         ,int             *size          ,int             *channel         ,...
         );   
 extern int     fdv$awksp(           struct dsc$descriptor_a             *tca         ,int             *size-
         );  s
 extern int     fdv$dwksp(           struct dsc$descriptor_a             *tca
         );  4
 extern int     fdv$cdisp(#             struct dsc$descriptor_sm                 *frmnamC             ,...             );
 extern int     fdv$clear(          int             *linel         ,int             *linecnt
         );  n
 extern int     fdv$dterm(         struct dsc$descriptor_au             *tca
         );  p
 extern int     fdv$put(         struct dsc$descriptor_sn             *fldval           ,struct dsc$descriptor_s             *fldnamr         ,int             *fldidxo
         );  o
 extern int
     fdv$putl(            struct dsc$descriptor_s             *textu
         );   
 extern int
     fdv$stat(-          int             *status:         ,int             *iostato
         );   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 13:51:00 +0100+ From: "Pye, Graham" <Graham.Pye@compaq.com>f. Subject: RE: fms - prototype definitions for CN Message-ID: <F5949552111A66489D2D578D92B36972059976@reoexc04.emea.cpqcorp.net>  K I think you're on your own - Or rather at the mercy of assistance from thisi group.  J I've searched the FMS source pool, and the only SDL file we have is calledI FDVDEF_ADA.H and its header comments support the suggestion from the namegH that this was intended to create an ADA definition. I note that I didn't> find this file in our CMS library, so it may have just been anG (unsuccessful) experiment. It's dated 1983 too. Unfortunately, when I'ddI assembled the appropriate number of hoops to put the file through the SDL - compiler, it generated definitions like this:e  * 	/* Form Driver Entry point definitions */ 	int FDV$ADLVA() ; 	int FDV$AFCX() ;   * which don't really rate as very useful :-)  K So, here's an extract from the original SDL file, in case that's any use tosE you. I expect some of the lines will wrap in unhelpful places. I also I apologise to other readers if this posting ends up too long. I'm sure youaH realise that this doesn't come with any guarantees, support, or anything much else either :-)  0 Graham Pye (Part of the group that owns FMS now) Mail: first.last@compaq.com     & /* Form Driver Entry point definitions   ENTRY FDV$ADLVA PARAMETER (0E         LONGWORD IN OUT NAMED video TYPENAME video) RETURNS LONGWORD;a   ENTRY FDV$AFCX PARAMETER (   ENTRY FDV$AFCX PARAMETER (1         LONGWORD IN NAMED insovr TYPENAME insovr,i1         LONGWORD IN NAMED curpos TYPENAME curpos,lG         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam DEFAULT 0,iC         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSl	 LONGWORD;t   ENTRY FDV$AFVA PARAMETER (3         LONGWORD IN OUT NAMED video TYPENAME video, G         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam DEFAULT 0,wC         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSo	 LONGWORD;a   ENTRY FDV$ATERM PARAMETER (iF         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED tca TYPENAME tca,-         LONGWORD IN NAMED size TYPENAME size, 3         LONGWORD IN NAMED channel TYPENAME channel,s?         LONGWORD IN NAMED terminal TYPENAME terminal DEFAULT 0,aL         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED faketrmtyp TYPENAME faketrmtyp DEFAULT 0,E         LONGWORD IN NAMED noclear TYPENAME noclear DEFAULT 0) RETURNSR	 LONGWORD;e   ENTRY FDV$AWKSP PARAMETER ( H         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED wksp TYPENAME wksp,?         LONGWORD IN NAMED size TYPENAME size) RETURNS LONGWORD;     ENTRY FDV$BELL RETURNS LONGWORD;  ! ENTRY FDV$CANCL RETURNS LONGWORD;P   ENTRY FDV$CDISP PARAMETER (e=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED frmnam TYPENAME frmnam, C         LONGWORD IN NAMED offset TYPENAME offset DEFAULT 0) RETURNSc	 LONGWORD;1   ENTRY FDV$CLEAR PARAMETER (>7         LONGWORD IN NAMED line TYPENAME line DEFAULT 0, E         LONGWORD IN NAMED linecnt TYPENAME linecnt DEFAULT 0) RETURNS)	 LONGWORD;m  $ ENTRY FDV$CLEAR_VA RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$DFKBD PARAMETER (iD         WORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED defkbd TYPENAME defkbd,C         LONGWORD IN NAMED kbdnum TYPENAME kbdnum) RETURNS LONGWORD;h   ENTRY FDV$DEL PARAMETER (LE         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED frmnam TYPENAME frmnam) RETURNSc	 LONGWORD;p   ENTRY FDV$DISP PARAMETER (=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED frmnam TYPENAME frmnam,fC         LONGWORD IN NAMED offset TYPENAME offset DEFAULT 0) RETURNSe	 LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$DISPW PARAMETER (tC         LONGWORD IN NAMED offset TYPENAME offset DEFAULT 0) RETURNSe	 LONGWORD;s   ENTRY FDV$DPCOM PARAMETER (oC         LONGWORD IN NAMED dpmode TYPENAME dpmode) RETURNS LONGWORD;n   ENTRY FDV$DTERM PARAMETER ( F         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED tca TYPENAME tca) RETURNS LONGWORD;d   ENTRY FDV$DWKSP PARAMETER (0H         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED wksp TYPENAME wksp) RETURNS LONGWORD;T   ENTRY FDV$GET PARAMETER (y>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval,2         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm,=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam, C         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNS.	 LONGWORD;-   ENTRY FDV$GETAF PARAMETER ( >         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval,2         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm,>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;n   ENTRY FDV$GETAL PARAMETER (tH         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval DEFAULT 0,<         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm DEFAULT 0,G         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam DEFAULT 0,LC         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSi	 LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$GETDL PARAMETER ( 8         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED val TYPENAME val,<         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm DEFAULT 0,7         LONGWORD IN NAMED line TYPENAME line DEFAULT 0,cG         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED prompt TYPENAME prompt DEFAULT 0)D RETURNS LONGWORD;e   ENTRY FDV$GETSC PARAMETER ( =         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,6>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;r   ENTRY FDV$ILTRM PARAMETER (mE         LONGWORD IN NAMED trmmode TYPENAME trmmode DEFAULT 0) RETURNSd	 LONGWORD;r   ENTRY FDV$LCHAN PARAMETER (gE         LONGWORD IN NAMED channel TYPENAME channel) RETURNS LONGWORD;b  ! ENTRY FDV$LCLOS RETURNS LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$LEDOF PARAMETER (5A         LONGWORD IN NAMED ledno TYPENAME ledno) RETURNS LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$LEDON PARAMETER (dA         LONGWORD IN NAMED ledno TYPENAME ledno) RETURNS LONGWORD;0   ENTRY FDV$LOAD PARAMETER (E         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED frmnam TYPENAME frmnam) RETURNS 	 LONGWORD;v   ENTRY FDV$LOPEN PARAMETER ( =         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED filspc TYPENAME filspc, E         LONGWORD IN NAMED channel TYPENAME channel DEFAULT 0) RETURNSu	 LONGWORD;9  ! ENTRY FDV$NDISP RETURNS LONGWORD;.   ENTRY FDV$PFT PARAMETER (m;         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm DEFAULT 0,nG         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam DEFAULT 0, G         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval DEFAULT 0, C         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSy	 LONGWORD;k   ENTRY FDV$PUT PARAMETER ( G         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval DEFAULT 0,aG         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam DEFAULT 0,eC         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSe	 LONGWORD;e   ENTRY FDV$PUTAL PARAMETER (0G         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED frmval TYPENAME frmval DEFAULT 0)C RETURNS LONGWORD;n   ENTRY FDV$PUTD PARAMETER (=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,wC         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSi	 LONGWORD;r  ! ENTRY FDV$PUTDA RETURNS LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$PUTL PARAMETER (A         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED val TYPENAME val DEFAULT 0,yI         LONGWORD IN NAMED line TYPENAME line DEFAULT 0) RETURNS LONGWORD;p   ENTRY FDV$PUTSC PARAMETER ( =         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,rG         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval DEFAULT 0)a RETURNS LONGWORD;h   ENTRY FDV$READ PARAMETER (=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED frmnam TYPENAME frmnam, L         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED memloc TYPENAME memloc,-         LONGWORD IN NAMED size TYPENAME size,dD         LONGWORD OUT NAMED frmsiz TYPENAME frmsiz) RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$RET PARAMETER (h>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldval TYPENAME fldval,=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,sC         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSU	 LONGWORD;o   ENTRY FDV$RETAL PARAMETER (lF         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED frmval TYPENAME frmval) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$RETCX PARAMETER (MC         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED tca TYPENAME tca,nE         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED wksp TYPENAME wksp,s>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED frmnam TYPENAME frmnam,>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED uarval TYPENAME uarval,2         LONGWORD OUT NAMED curpos TYPENAME curpos,2         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm,2         LONGWORD OUT NAMED insovr TYPENAME insovr,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED hlpnum TYPENAME hlpnum) RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$RETDI PARAMETER (s1         LONGWORD IN NAMED nmdidx TYPENAME nmdidx,h>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED nmdval TYPENAME nmdval,I         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED nmdnam TYPENAME nmdnam DEFAULT 0 )h RETURNS LONGWORD;t   ENTRY FDV$RETDN PARAMETER (o=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED nmdnam TYPENAME nmdnam,w>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED nmdval TYPENAME nmdval,C         LONGWORD IN NAMED nmdidx TYPENAME nmdidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNSd	 LONGWORD;-   ENTRY FDV$RETFL PARAMETER (--         LONGWORD IN NAMED line TYPENAME line,m8         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED val TYPENAME val,,         LONGWORD OUT NAMED len TYPENAME len,I         LONGWORD IN NAMED imagetype TYPENAME imagetype DEFAULT 0) RETURNSw	 LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$RETFN PARAMETER (p>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;3   ENTRY FDV$RETFO PARAMETER ("1         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldnum TYPENAME fldnum,s>         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR OUT NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx) RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$RETLE PARAMETER (T2         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldlen TYPENAME fldlen,=         CHARACTER DESCRIPTOR IN NAMED fldnam TYPENAME fldnam, C         LONGWORD IN NAMED fldidx TYPENAME fldidx DEFAULT 0) RETURNS+	 LONGWORD;   ! ENTRY FDV$RFRSH RETURNS LONGWORD;u   ENTRY FDV$SCR_WIDTH PARAMETER (tA         LONGWORD IN NAMED width TYPENAME width) RETURNS LONGWORD;m  ! ENTRY FDV$SIGOP RETURNS LONGWORD;-   ENTRY FDV$SPADA PARAMETER (e?         LONGWORD IN NAMED mode TYPENAME mode) RETURNS LONGWORD;p  ! ENTRY FDV$SPOFF RETURNS LONGWORD;1    ENTRY FDV$SPON RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$SSIGQ PARAMETER (gA         LONGWORD IN NAMED sigmd TYPENAME sigmd) RETURNS LONGWORD;t   ENTRY FDV$SSRV PARAMETER (D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fdv_status TYPENAME fdv_status DEFAULT 0,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED iostat TYPENAME iostat DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;a   ENTRY FDV$STAT PARAMETER (:         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fdv_status TYPENAME fdv_status,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED iostat TYPENAME iostat DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;r   ENTRY FDV$STERM PARAMETER (rF         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED tca TYPENAME tca) RETURNS LONGWORD;e   ENTRY FDV$SPADA PARAMETER (c?         LONGWORD IN NAMED mode TYPENAME mode) RETURNS LONGWORD;s  ! ENTRY FDV$SPOFF RETURNS LONGWORD;     ENTRY FDV$SPON RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$SSIGQ PARAMETER (WA         LONGWORD IN NAMED sigmd TYPENAME sigmd) RETURNS LONGWORD;v   ENTRY FDV$SSRV PARAMETER (D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fdv_status TYPENAME fdv_status DEFAULT 0,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED iostat TYPENAME iostat DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;h   ENTRY FDV$STAT PARAMETER (:         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fdv_status TYPENAME fdv_status,D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED iostat TYPENAME iostat DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;-   ENTRY FDV$STERM PARAMETER ( F         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED tca TYPENAME tca) RETURNS LONGWORD;P   ENTRY FDV$STIME PARAMETER (e?         LONGWORD IN NAMED time TYPENAME time) RETURNS LONGWORD;    ENTRY FDV$SWKSP PARAMETER ( H         LONGWORD DIMENSION * DESCRIPTOR IN OUT NAMED wksp TYPENAME wksp) RETURNS LONGWORD;s   ENTRY FDV$TCHAN PARAMETER ( E         LONGWORD IN NAMED channel TYPENAME channel) RETURNS LONGWORD;d  " ENTRY FDV$USER_REFRESH PARAMETER (J         ADDRESS (ENTRY) VALUE NAMED rfraddress TYPENAME rfraddress DEFAULT 0) RETURNS LONGWORD;   ENTRY FDV$WAIT PARAMETER (D         LONGWORD OUT NAMED fldtrm TYPENAME fldtrm DEFAULT 0) RETURNS	 LONGWORD;e   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 13:13:16 -0400o- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> . Subject: Re: fms - prototype definitions for C, Message-ID: <3B7021AA.879E9287@videotron.ca>    LBohan@dbc.spam_less..com wrote:E > We have a FDVDEF.H (same as in the DECFMS024.* kits on the CONDIST)n: > it has various FDV$ defines, but no function prototypes, > @ > perhaps to be expected for an include file, generated in 1986.  K You made me realise just how long it had been since I actually wrote C code. that used FMS ...u   What I would do is simply P PIPE ANA/IMAGE SYS$LIBRARY:FDVSHR.EXE | SEARCH SYS$INPUT FDV$ , FDV$_ /match=XOR  N This should produce the list of entry points (more or less) and then, use your? favourite editor to convert that output to function prototypes.C  ( When not sure of the arguments, you can:   extern int FDV$EAT_CHOCOLATE();o  K this generates the function prototype, but no argument checking is done andh the compiler doesn't complain.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 14:57:54 -04002 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com>  Subject: free software available2 Message-ID: <nSWb7.686$Yx2.16005@news.cpqcorp.net>   Dear Newsgroup,   < I just got this via email, VAX and Alpha software available.   Suee   ----Original Message-----,  ) From: Caterina Secco [mailto:i3@itre.com]i  ( Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 8:49 PM   To: Skonetski, Susan  $ Subject: A gift for Compaq customers      
 Hello Sue,  E we are pleased to announce a little gift to Compaq customers that are   K present at one of the OpenVMS events (Decus, ITUG, Diamond Forum, ...): onee  . free unlimited MenuFinder for AXP license (see  ( http://www.itre.com/mf/download_axp.html    or   " http://www.itre.com/mf/prezzi.html   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:51:54 -0500  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com$ Subject: Re: free software available4 Message-ID: <C2256AA2.0056EC72.00@jklh21.valmet.com>  	 Dear Sue,r  * While I am pleased by this generous offer,B I am confused by this message.  Is this available at the events or2 by download at the url provided or either or both.   How should one proceed?w   B.R. -Norm,        4 susan.skonetski@compaq.com on 08/07/2001 01:57:54 PM  , Please respond to susan.skonetski@compaq.com   To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.comF cc:u! Subject:  free software available              Dear Newsgroup,r  < I just got this via email, VAX and Alpha software available.   Sue*   ----Original Message-----*  ) From: Caterina Secco [mailto:i3@itre.com]*  ( Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 8:49 PM   To: Skonetski, Susan  $ Subject: A gift for Compaq customers      
 Hello Sue,  E we are pleased to announce a little gift to Compaq customers that are   K present at one of the OpenVMS events (Decus, ITUG, Diamond Forum, ...): oner  . free unlimited MenuFinder for AXP license (see  ( http://www.itre.com/mf/download_axp.html    or   " http://www.itre.com/mf/prezzi.html   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 14:51:50 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)$ Subject: Re: Help, PWS500 locked up.L Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011451510001@user-2ive6lk.dialup.mindspring.com>  F In article <YI27b+qNDk8Y@malvm5.mala.bc.ca>, nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) wrote:  N >  I have a PWS 500a running VMS 7.2-1 ( with most of the patches installed ).  J >  Does the refusal to respond to the console signal a hardware problem orG > could software cause this ( eg looping at a very high IPL ). How does ? > one go about diagnosing this when you can't get a crash dump?r  J Our PWS systems often do this.  (Well, they rarely crash, but when they doJ this is the most common situation.) I think they are looping at high IPL. + Ctrl-P and the reset button have no effect.n   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comu   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 12:47:04 -0700-1 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett)1$ Subject: Re: Help, PWS500 locked up., Message-ID: <kbW5IINe$75V@malvm6.mala.bc.ca>  M In article <rdeininger-0708011451510001@user-2ive6lk.dialup.mindspring.com>, p7    rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:h  H > In article <YI27b+qNDk8Y@malvm5.mala.bc.ca>, nothome@spammers.are.scum > (Malcolm Dunnett) wrote: > O >>  I have a PWS 500a running VMS 7.2-1 ( with most of the patches installed ).n > K >>  Does the refusal to respond to the console signal a hardware problem oriH >> could software cause this ( eg looping at a very high IPL ). How does@ >> one go about diagnosing this when you can't get a crash dump? > L > Our PWS systems often do this.  (Well, they rarely crash, but when they doL > this is the most common situation.) I think they are looping at high IPL. - > Ctrl-P and the reset button have no effect.  > A     I solved the first part of the problem ( thanks to the CSC ).m  H     To force a halt on a PWS you have to remove the cover. On the systemD board at the same level as the top DIMM connector and to the rear ofC the system is a small momentary action push button. Pushing this iniE will get you the >>> at which point you can type CRASH to get a crashh dump.   I     As to why it hung in the first place, that is still an open question.o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 16:13:09 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> % Subject: Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land() Message-ID: <3B7148F5.DB5ECB07@gtech.com>G   Bill Gunshannon wrote:+ > In article <3B71126D.930A8CD8@gtech.com>,sB >  Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes:5 > |> I think you should spend the time to learn Perl.i > . > Using a sledgehammer to put in thumbtacks!!!  1 Perl may be an overkill for this particular task.   5 But I think learning Perl is a good thing, because itR' can be used to a huge variety of tasks.0   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:20:29 +0200a= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>D% Subject: Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land,) Message-ID: <3B71126D.930A8CD8@gtech.com>i   Fletcher Hearns wrote:= > I have a question for all you VMSers now working with UNIX.m > : > I have a text file that I need to modify.  I need to add > something to6 > the beginning and something to the end of each line. > Basically: >  > "This is line 1"  becomesU > "ABC This is line 1 XYZ" > 4 > I can think of several way to do this on VMS using= > either a DCL command procedure or and editor invoked with a > > command procedure.  But I am having trouble figuring out how; > to do this on UNIX (Tru64). I have looked at both SED and$7 > AWK and made some headway. Using SED I can figure out 2 > how to add the ABC to each line but not the XYZ.  0 I think you should spend the time to learn Perl.  , I will solve a lot of this kind of problems.   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:59:31 -0400E* From: Fletcher Hearns <hearns@softapp.com>! Subject: HELP..VMSer in UNIX landW+ Message-ID: <3B7048A3.96D63AED@softapp.com>   
 Hello all,  ; I have a question for all you VMSers now working with UNIX.D  8 I have a text file that I need to modify.  I need to add something to4 the beginning and something to the end of each line.
 Basically:   "This is line 1"  becomes  "ABC This is line 1 XYZ"  2 I can think of several way to do this on VMS using; either a DCL command procedure or and editor invoked with aD< command procedure.  But I am having trouble figuring out how9 to do this on UNIX (Tru64). I have looked at both SED and05 AWK and made some headway. Using SED I can figure out 0 how to add the ABC to each line but not the XYZ.   Any help would be appreciated.     -- Fletcher Hearns  President/Consultant S*A*I*L  2828 Brian Ct. Ellicott City MD 21043 410-465-2391 hearns@softapp.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 18:05:35 -0400E2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)% Subject: Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX landNL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011805350001@user-2iveaje.dialup.mindspring.com>  ; In article <3B7048A3.96D63AED@softapp.com>, Fletcher Hearnsm <hearns@softapp.com> wrote:    > Hello all, > = > I have a question for all you VMSers now working with UNIX.  > : > I have a text file that I need to modify.  I need to add > something to6 > the beginning and something to the end of each line. > Basically: >  > "This is line 1"  becomes  > "ABC This is line 1 XYZ" > 4 > I can think of several way to do this on VMS using= > either a DCL command procedure or and editor invoked with aM> > command procedure.  But I am having trouble figuring out how; > to do this on UNIX (Tru64). I have looked at both SED andT7 > AWK and made some headway. Using SED I can figure outO2 > how to add the ABC to each line but not the XYZ. >   > Any help would be appreciated.  & On VMS or Unix, I would do it with vi:   :1,$s/.*/ABC & XYZ/   ! One command, that's all it takes.r   -- A Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comE   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 08:38:22 -0600m2 From: Eugene A Zharkov <zharkov@vista-control.com>% Subject: Re: HELP..VMSer in UNIX land 1 Message-ID: <3B714EDE.63685769@vista-control.com>m   Fletcher Hearns wrote: >  > Hello all, > = > I have a question for all you VMSers now working with UNIX.f > : > I have a text file that I need to modify.  I need to add > something to6 > the beginning and something to the end of each line. > Basically: >  > "This is line 1"  becomesg > "ABC This is line 1 XYZ" > 4 > I can think of several way to do this on VMS using= > either a DCL command procedure or and editor invoked with a > > command procedure.  But I am having trouble figuring out how; > to do this on UNIX (Tru64). I have looked at both SED and 7 > AWK and made some headway. Using SED I can figure outM2 > how to add the ABC to each line but not the XYZ. >   > Any help would be appreciated.  ) sed -e 's/\(.*\)/ABC \1 XYZ/' < old > newR    > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:57:21 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>08 Subject: Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780?$ Message-ID: <3b704888$1@news.si.com>  D >Do a 11/780 read CD drive or so for installing OpenVMS v7.2 from a 	 >scratch?A  0 It should be able to upgrade from an InfoServer. -- PA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comnA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comP= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 21:09:40 GMTl2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)8 Subject: Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780?2 Message-ID: <oOYb7.695$Yx2.16180@news.cpqcorp.net>  b In article <3b704888$1@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:E :>Do a 11/780 read CD drive or so for installing OpenVMS v7.2 from a  
 :>scratch?     System configuration, please?N  1 :It should be able to upgrade from an InfoServer.l  F   The VAX-11/780 is not officially supported by OpenVMS VAX V7.2, the H   last version that was formally tested on the platform was (IIRC) V6.2.  E   The VAX-11/780 cannot bootstrap over the network, and access to theoG   contents of CD-ROM media is an interesting project.  AFAIK, the only NF   large VAX systems that can boot from InfoServer are those that were G   released about the same time as (or later than) InfoServer. In other  2   words, this is the VAX 6000 and VAX 7000 series.  F   The VAX systems that could be downline loaded -- those systems that E   were supported as VAXcluster satellites -- can also bootstrap from I
   InfoServer.f  B   You will need an RX01 (8 inch floppy disk) containing standaloneC   BACKUP for OpenVMS VAX, or you will need standalone BACKUP on an tF   RL02 or similar removable disk media.  IIRC, you can also bootstrap E   this system from tape media, so if you have a supported TMSCP tape  E   drive (TU78, TA78, etc), you could boot off that.  If you can swap OF   a DSA-class (RA) disk over to another system via UDA50/KDA50/BDA50, A   you could load the kit contents onto the disk and swap it back.s  D   You might be able to boot off an HSJ-series controller via CI, butF   I have not tried this.  (Beware: a cluster with a VAX-11/780 can be F   very slow, as an AlphaServer GS160 can watch the thoughts form over D   on the VAX...  And worse, it can have to wait for the VAX-11/780.)  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 18:26:51 -0400  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>8 Subject: Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780?6 Message-ID: <1010807175220.44635A-100000@Ives.egh.com>  ' On Tue, 7 Aug 2001, Hoff Hoffman wrote:   d > In article <3b704888$1@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:G > :>Do a 11/780 read CD drive or so for installing OpenVMS v7.2 from a   > :>scratch? > ! >   System configuration, please?  > 3 > :It should be able to upgrade from an InfoServer.  > H >   The VAX-11/780 is not officially supported by OpenVMS VAX V7.2, the J >   last version that was formally tested on the platform was (IIRC) V6.2.  F I don't know if it was supported, but I had two customer systems usingB 11/785's on VMS V7.1.  They both worked fine.  (Booting took aboutG 15 minutes, after I tried every trick I could think of to speed it up.)t  G >   The VAX-11/780 cannot bootstrap over the network, and access to theRI >   contents of CD-ROM media is an interesting project.  AFAIK, the only GH >   large VAX systems that can boot from InfoServer are those that were I >   released about the same time as (or later than) InfoServer. In other A4 >   words, this is the VAX 6000 and VAX 7000 series. > H >   The VAX systems that could be downline loaded -- those systems that G >   were supported as VAXcluster satellites -- can also bootstrap from i >   InfoServer.s > D >   You will need an RX01 (8 inch floppy disk) containing standaloneE >   BACKUP for OpenVMS VAX, or you will need standalone BACKUP on an TH >   RL02 or similar removable disk media.  IIRC, you can also bootstrap G >   this system from tape media, so if you have a supported TMSCP tape tG >   drive (TU78, TA78, etc), you could boot off that.  If you can swap  H >   a DSA-class (RA) disk over to another system via UDA50/KDA50/BDA50, C >   you could load the kit contents onto the disk and swap it back.   @ I'm not sure if you could boot the 780 from tape.  The standard F install procedure was to boot from S/A backup floppies (required aboutD 5-6 floppies as of the latest version), restore the .B saveset from D 9-track tape to a disk, boot that disk and proceed with the install.F (At one time, you could also get VMS kits on various removeable disks,E such as RA60's, and maybe RM03's and RL02's, but that was a long time) ago.)S  C For upgrades, you already have a running VMS system on disk, and soN@ you just need to boot minimum, configure the tape drive, and runD VMSINSTAL.  (No need to boot from either floppy or tape to do this.)  E For copying the kits to a disk on another system, and then moving theOD disk to the 11/780:  most or all RA disks are dual-ported, so if youD have another system with an SDI controller within about 50 feet, all' you need is a spare SDI cable for this.d  < I'd hate to try to load VMS onto an RA81 HDA and ship it any- distance, but I suppose it would be possible!U  F >   You might be able to boot off an HSJ-series controller via CI, butH >   I have not tried this.  (Beware: a cluster with a VAX-11/780 can be H >   very slow, as an AlphaServer GS160 can watch the thoughts form over F >   on the VAX...  And worse, it can have to wait for the VAX-11/780.)  H The two 785's were each clustered with a VAX 66x0, and happily shared anD HSC system disk (RA72, I think, but it moved around over the years.)  A Each site had SCSI drives on the HSC via an HSC-to-SCSI requestorn@ card, including at least one CD-ROM (RRD43 & RRD45, IIRC), which? the 785s could access without any problems, but I don't think I A ever tried to boot the 785s from CD.  One of the systems also hasd@ an HSJ50 on the CI, but that may have been added after the 785's were decommissioned.  B I did all the VMS upgrades from the CD on the 66x0s, to the common? system disk.  I don't know if it is possible to boot the 11/785n> (minimum), config the devices, mount the CD, and run VMSINSTAL? (i.e. a normal VAX-style VMS upgrade), but I can't think of any @ reason why it wouldn't work.  The 66x0s were so much faster than8 the 11/785s that there was never any point in trying it.  : Both 785's are retired now, so I can't do any experiments.   -- i John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 17:31:39 +0100 + From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org>u8 Subject: Re: How to build a bootable media for a 11/780?' Message-ID: <3B71696B.F2FA1501@iee.org>A   sword7@speakeasy.org wrote:k@ > What files do I need to put on the virtual disk image to boot?1 > VMB.EXE, SYSBOOT.EXE, stand-alone backups, etc.t  & The easiest way to do this is to start% from scratch and install OpenVMS V7.2,$ onto a disk and then do whatever you$ do to turn that into a virtual disk.  * (I would start by doing the proper install% and then making a BACKUP/IMAGE backup.# and restore onto an LD device using-! a suitable size for the LD device-) file. Then that file is a block-for-blockj copy of your bootable disk).  ) Otherwise you have to put a whole heap ofv' files into the right place and then rune# things like WRITEBOOT to set up then bootblock and so on.  G > I was surprised to notice that OpenVMS v7.2 does not support a 11/780t/ > machine.  I believe that it should work fine.   . To declare support, the eng. group has to test. each release. They decided to concetrate their1 energies elsewhere. It has been repeatedly stated - that nothing was done to *remove* support for - any systems. (Except the VAX-11/782, but thatm was different).a   Antoniov   -- .   ---------------g- Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.orgl   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 09:58:26 +0100k0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>  Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World* Message-ID: <3B6FADB2.65CA0961@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,p > E > Please .. this is getting a little tiresome .. I clearly stated theF > following: > M > "Each application requirement in a Cust environment needs to be reviewed to.$ > see which is the better strategy." >   ? So stop marketing your TPC-C result as being an indication thatg	 WildFiresn+ are suitable boxes for high end OLTP apps. P  B Given what you have said and given that 2 out of the 3 major OLTP ? benchmarks Compaq have published for WildFire have been unable b> to use OPS (with poor performance as a result) any claim that < OPS is the universal panacea for OLTP perf is very suspect.   < Perhaps you could also educate your other collegues posting  to this newsgroup.E > So, how can you state I think OPS is the "...universal solution for. > scalability."  ????o > # > Time to move on to another topic.r > 
 > Regards, >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultante > Compaq Canada Corp.n > Professional Servicest > Voice: 613-592-4660h > Fax  :  819-772-7036 > Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com >  > -----Original Message-----9 > From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]- > Sent: August 6, 2001 12:12 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Como" > Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World >  > "Main, Kerry" wrote: > >  > > Andrew,e > >-L > > >>> On second thoughts, if you stop claiming that its a perfectly normalN > > tuning procedure with the added benefit of providing HA (though you didn'tI > > configure it that way) then I am perfectly happy to stop calling it ae > > loophole.<<< > >MN > > Sigh, repeat after me .. Oracle OPS was designed for not only availability > > but also scalability.n > >  > 9 > Kerry you wandered into the truth zone accidentally bute6 > since you are in there lets keep you on the straight > and narrow for a bit.  > ; > The "but also scalability" is the operational phrase. OPSd; > does deliver scalability but not in all circumstances andy= > not without significant cost. You would have your customers : > beleive that it is a universal solution for scalability. > M > > If you disagree with this, I would be glad to forward your concerns on to A > > the Oracle support folks who will explain all of this to you.h > >e > 6 > Do so but also let them know that you consider it to4 > be the universal solution to Oracle performance, I9 > think you will find that this will worry them somewhat.e > I > > As stated many times here now, there are many ways to acheive a given F > > performance number. In your view, the only way is for a big single
 > instanceM > > server and it upsets you that even the TPC Council agrees there are other?< > > ways for a single server to acheive the same big result. > >N > D > Perhaps if you had been able to use this performance trick for theA > other big OLTP benchmarks that you have run your position would8A > be more credible and your results better. As it is you have notuE > been able to use OPS for things like SAP or Oracle Apps underminingu; > both your position on the use of OPS and your performanceu > story. > 	 > Regards  > Andrew Harrisong > Enterprise IT Architect    --   Andrew Harrison  Enterprise IT Architect-   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 14:50:42 GMTm0 From: "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net>  Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World, Message-ID: <3B70003F.16B7175D@mail.tds.net>   "Main, Kerry" wrote:  F > And on the down side the billions of dollars of revenues that Compaq > doesH > generate in the non Wintel space require strategic thinking vision etcE > which the Wintel revenues do not. They also require R&D expenditure: > whichTG > the Wintel revenues do not. In the Wintel space MS's license fees andfD > Intels processor prices include the R&D that Compaq do not need to > have to think about. >   F I think you have written something that explains the current situation  far better than you may realize.  F Strategic thinking is not a bad thing.  If you do a lousy job of it itC may be very attractive to chuck it and save what it costs.  If youro? management team is loaded with people that like to look only athE spreadsheets and make up what they haven't taken the time to research , then almost any decision can be justified.    B In this forum I could be talking about Compaq but what I say isn'tF restricted to them alone by a long shot.  It may be overstated a bit. ? The underlying ideas still stand.  (It's an anti-PHB diatribe.)   ? Intel makes mistakes, but Intel surely does engage in strategicnC thinking.  They seem to be emerging as a winner.  There may be manynF explanations for why they are winning but strategic thinking has to be9 an important contibutor.  (IIRC their original intent fornD microprocessors was to create a market for Intel-fabricated memory. F That went awry but they adapted.  They have a different strategy now.)   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 08:03:39 -0400+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>e  Subject: RE: IA64 Rocks My WorldR Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4D49569@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Andrew,6  L >> So stop marketing your TPC-C result as being an indication that WildFires. are suitable boxes for high end OLTP apps. <<<  J Go bother the TPC Council .. this issue has been beaten to death already.   K As for the Wildfire suitability in high end apps, check these folks out foreK recent examples of mission critical Alpha GS Series / VMS  OLTP usage: (ande! they are not using Oracle Server)qF http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/brochures/Bank-Austria/ (Bank of Austria)A http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/gs/quotes/etrade.html (E-Trade)n   Others can be found at:a2 http://www.openvms.compaq.com/gsseries/quotes.htmlF http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/gs/quotes/oracle.html (Oracle and GS Series)V   Again, time to move on ..a   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Compaq Canada Corp.u Professional Servicesi Voice: 613-592-4660d Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]h Sent: August 7, 2001 4:58 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come  Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World       "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,o > E > Please .. this is getting a little tiresome .. I clearly stated then > following: > J > "Each application requirement in a Cust environment needs to be reviewed to$ > see which is the better strategy." >   ? So stop marketing your TPC-C result as being an indication thatv	 WildFiresl+ are suitable boxes for high end OLTP apps.    B Given what you have said and given that 2 out of the 3 major OLTP ? benchmarks Compaq have published for WildFire have been unable d> to use OPS (with poor performance as a result) any claim that < OPS is the universal panacea for OLTP perf is very suspect.   < Perhaps you could also educate your other collegues posting  to this newsgroup.E > So, how can you state I think OPS is the "...universal solution for  > scalability."  ????v > # > Time to move on to another topic.s > 
 > Regards, >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > Compaq Canada Corp.U > Professional ServicesM > Voice: 613-592-4660t > Fax  :  819-772-7036 > Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com >  > -----Original Message-----9 > From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com], > Sent: August 6, 2001 12:12 PMt > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com#" > Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World >  > "Main, Kerry" wrote: > >  > > Andrew,S > >sL > > >>> On second thoughts, if you stop claiming that its a perfectly normalG > > tuning procedure with the added benefit of providing HA (though youc didn'tI > > configure it that way) then I am perfectly happy to stop calling it a. > > loophole.<<< > >aA > > Sigh, repeat after me .. Oracle OPS was designed for not only  availability > > but also scalability.S > >. > 9 > Kerry you wandered into the truth zone accidentally but 6 > since you are in there lets keep you on the straight > and narrow for a bit.2 > ; > The "but also scalability" is the operational phrase. OPSn; > does deliver scalability but not in all circumstances and = > not without significant cost. You would have your customers-: > beleive that it is a universal solution for scalability. > J > > If you disagree with this, I would be glad to forward your concerns on toA > > the Oracle support folks who will explain all of this to you.. > >r > 6 > Do so but also let them know that you consider it to4 > be the universal solution to Oracle performance, I9 > think you will find that this will worry them somewhat.r > I > > As stated many times here now, there are many ways to acheive a given F > > performance number. In your view, the only way is for a big single
 > instanceG > > server and it upsets you that even the TPC Council agrees there arer otherI< > > ways for a single server to acheive the same big result. > >n > D > Perhaps if you had been able to use this performance trick for theA > other big OLTP benchmarks that you have run your position would A > be more credible and your results better. As it is you have nothE > been able to use OPS for things like SAP or Oracle Apps underminings; > both your position on the use of OPS and your performancet > story. > 	 > Regardse > Andrew Harrisonu > Enterprise IT Architect    -- a Andrew Harrisone Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 08:06:09 -0400+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>t  Subject: RE: IA64 Rocks My WorldR Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4D55FA1@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Brad,r     >>> "Main, Kerry" wrote:J >>> I think you have written something that explains the current situation# far better than you may realize.<<<A  L mmm.. this was not a quote from me. Perhaps the to's and from's got mixed up in the threads?h   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantr Compaq Canada Corp.e Professional Servicesr Voice: 613-592-4660A Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----5 From: brad.madison [mailto:brad.madison@mail.tds.net]o Sent: August 7, 2001 10:51 AM- To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come  Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World         "Main, Kerry" wrote:  F > And on the down side the billions of dollars of revenues that Compaq > doesH > generate in the non Wintel space require strategic thinking vision etcE > which the Wintel revenues do not. They also require R&D expenditure- > which-G > the Wintel revenues do not. In the Wintel space MS's license fees andHD > Intels processor prices include the R&D that Compaq do not need to > have to think about. >   F I think you have written something that explains the current situation  far better than you may realize.  F Strategic thinking is not a bad thing.  If you do a lousy job of it itC may be very attractive to chuck it and save what it costs.  If your ? management team is loaded with people that like to look only atuE spreadsheets and make up what they haven't taken the time to researcho, then almost any decision can be justified.    B In this forum I could be talking about Compaq but what I say isn'tF restricted to them alone by a long shot.  It may be overstated a bit. ? The underlying ideas still stand.  (It's an anti-PHB diatribe.)n  ? Intel makes mistakes, but Intel surely does engage in strategicfC thinking.  They seem to be emerging as a winner.  There may be manytF explanations for why they are winning but strategic thinking has to be9 an important contibutor.  (IIRC their original intent fornD microprocessors was to create a market for Intel-fabricated memory. F That went awry but they adapted.  They have a different strategy now.)   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 18:18:48 +0100i0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>  Subject: Re: IA64 Rocks My World* Message-ID: <3B717478.79CB7AF0@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,p > N > >> So stop marketing your TPC-C result as being an indication that WildFires0 > are suitable boxes for high end OLTP apps. <<< > K > Go bother the TPC Council .. this issue has been beaten to death already.f > M > As for the Wildfire suitability in high end apps, check these folks out for M > recent examples of mission critical Alpha GS Series / VMS  OLTP usage: (andU# > they are not using Oracle Server)dH > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/brochures/Bank-Austria/ (Bank of
 > Austria) > Others can be found at:d4 > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/gsseries/quotes.html  3 This apparently contains customer references but !!e   Bank of Austria - 	Customer but not a GS320 user (treasury appst' 	are generally report/batch intensive).A BEA * 	Not a customer its an ISV endorsment and 0 	commitment to OpenVMS now lags other platforms 
 	(WLS etc) BCDt& 	Not a customer its an ISV endorsement Cerner+ 	Not a customer its another ISV endorsement, Cognos0 	Not a customer its another ISV endorsement and 5 	Cognos are also actively offering "Legacy (OpenVMS)"h) 	migration tools to non legacy platforms.n CA- 	ISV endorsment and advert for Unicenter TNG.v	 Inovawarei 	ISV endorsement Kenanr 	ISV endorsement KCSL 	ISV endorsement Memorial Hermane< 	At last another customer (this was supposed to be a list of* 	customers so its nice that one popped up) Northern Lights  	Ohhh another Customer Oracle6 	ISV endorsement from a vendor that has been gradually2 	dropping support for OpenVMS for all but its core 	DBMS products.  Parexcel	 	Customeri SASB 	ISV endorsement Southeastern Freight  	 	Customers  8 So you publish a list of 15 customer endorsements which 6 actually consists of 5 customers and 10 ISV's. None of4 the customers except the Bank of Austria go into any3 detail on what they are actually using, the Bank ofd2 Austria is using a GS160 and a GS140 in a cluster.  0 Very few of these appear to be OLTP references !  " So what was your point exactly ???  4 If it was to convince people that there are glowing < OLTP GS references from customers it failed abjectly because7 most of the references arn't customers and most of the a references arn't OLTP either.u   Regardsh Andrew Harrisont Enterprise IT Architecti   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 08:22:49 -0400' From: "Ung Ho Yi" <yi-1@medctr.osu.edu> . Subject: Re: Lat connection problem on Vms 7.2: Message-ID: <9komka$s39$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>   Hello,   thanks for the response.  L I also tried connecting from a Vxt with info server and I am getting similar problem.J The reason I am suspecting the machine is because all other lat connectionI to the terminal server are working fine.  The other servers are VMS 7.2-1a and VMS 6.2-3H.-  : I am just surprised since Lat has been around for so long.H I was talking to Paul from Compaq yesterday and he said this is observedD problem on VMS 7.2 and that we need to upgrade VMS 7.2-1 or VMS 7.3.   Thanks,2 yi  ? "Hoff Hoffman" <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in messaged, news:8eDb7.646$Yx2.15637@news.cpqcorp.net...H > In article <9kmnkk$6b8$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, "Ung Ho Yi" <yi-1@medctr.osu.edu> writes:a/ > :I doing a Vms upgrade test on an Alpha 4100. J > :Due to our Vendor Application, I am only allowed to upgrade to Vms 7.2. > : L > :After an upgrade to Vms 7.2, I am having trouble accessing the node's LatL > :service from a Zyplex server and info server.  Some times the lat service is/ > :invisible and other times I get disconneted.e >sG >   Is there anything here that makes you think this is OpenVMS and notuG >   something odd with the Xyplex boxes?  As a specific suggestion, I'd G >   try this same configuration with another terminal server, to try ton@ >   localize this problem to the host or to the terminal server. >n >g( >  ---------------------------- #include' <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------eL >       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com, >  --------------------------- pure personal# opinion --------------------------- 1 >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering  hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com >-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 11:28:13 +0100r( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>& Subject: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B71143D.C500AD93@127.0.0.1>,   Bill Todd wrote:F > While the initiating post seems driven by the mindless, lemming-likeK > mentality that assumes that IA64 will take over the world just because itnJ > will carry the "Intel Inside" stigma, many of the responses (and similarI > discussions in places like comp.arch) raise the more realistic questioni > "IA64 - is there any point?"   Bill,P  D Based on things that I could not possibly discuss here, you'll neverA know just how accurate that statement is. But it would be better:b  . "Alpha vs. IA64 - Is there any point arguing?"  / But that is from a VMS customers point of view.r  H I think CETS is going to be a very interesting place to be, all sorts ofH non-disclosure and mind boggling possibilities. I would suspect that theH beer comsumption will be lower than expected as not many people can talk and drink at the same time.   ? I agree with you on the lemming like mentality, but VMS has thedG opportunity to be a net that those lemmings can leap into. It'll be VMS-E engineering and Compaq marketing that put the net there. Arguing what-F colour the net should be and the type of knots won't be relevant. (The/ size of the net will depend on the ISV takeup)..   --  ( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 07:05:03 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>e* Subject: Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun( Message-ID: <9kr6d8$jl3$1@pyrite.mv.net>  5 "Nic Clews" <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in message # news:3B71143D.C500AD93@127.0.0.1...a > Bill Todd wrote:H > > While the initiating post seems driven by the mindless, lemming-likeJ > > mentality that assumes that IA64 will take over the world just because itL > > will carry the "Intel Inside" stigma, many of the responses (and similarK > > discussions in places like comp.arch) raise the more realistic questioni  > > "IA64 - is there any point?" >y > Bill,i >uF > Based on things that I could not possibly discuss here, you'll neverC > know just how accurate that statement is. But it would be better:t >,0 > "Alpha vs. IA64 - Is there any point arguing?"  I Not if Compaq and its apologists stop spewing bullshit about how IA64 has F comparable (or better) performance potential than Alpha had, how AlphaH wasn't profitable, how IA64 will be a better platform for VMS than AlphaE would have been (the real question being whether VMS will survive theeA intermediate-term loss of Alpha customers in anything more than awI permanently-stagnant state), and how 'committed' they are to VMS's futureuK (without explaining why the even more explicit commitments to Alpha weren'tv% worth the HTML they were written in).N  I The major issues here are Compaq's competence and credibility, which many L feel are both in the negative range.  But since the reasons for this includeC questions of the technical merits of Alpha vs. IA64 (since Compaq'soF statements *made* these issues), discussing them is entirely relevant.   ...o  A > I agree with you on the lemming like mentality, but VMS has thenI > opportunity to be a net that those lemmings can leap into. It'll be VMSp: > engineering and Compaq marketing that put the net there.  K Based on all precedent to date, the *lack* of Compaq marketing will be whateF makes the net a cruel illusion at best (assuming VMS survives at all).   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 08 Aug 2001 18:16:31 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>r* Subject: Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to SunH Message-ID: <y41ymmr0gw.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  * Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> writes:  = > However I've failed to see any real evidence that Alpha wash1 > sold on the basis of its [superior] technology.bC > It sold because people wanted VMS, and Alpha was what it runs on.e  K As long as Compaq was supporting and further developing Alpha, you could beaH sure they would also be supporting and further developing Tru64 and VMS,K because without them Alpha would loose its raison d'etre. Killing Alpha andhL promising to port the OSes to IPF removes this restraint - nothing now stopsM Capellas from announcing at an analysts meeting in, say, a year's time (if ituN indeed takes that long) "VMS and Tru64 sales have subsided to just 5% of theirF former glory [surprise, surprise!], we will therefore now move them toK maintenance mode and desupport them in a year's time." See the analogy withu WNT on Alpha...?   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 16:43:13 GMTe5 From: koehler@bessta.gsfc.nasa.aspm.gov (Bob Koehler)e* Subject: Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun/ Message-ID: <9krq71$eu4$1@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov>e   > < >However I've failed to see any real evidence that Alpha was0 >sold on the basis of its [superior] technology. >e9 >It sold because people wanted VMS, and Alpha was what itA	 >runs on.0 >9G >It wasn't sold because people wanted the fastest chip, then found someo( >operating system or other to run on it. >4  4 So all the Alphas running UNIX were sold by mistake?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationo= GSFC Code 582 Flight Software   | Federal Sector, Civil GroupaI                                 | please remove any ".aspm" when replyingo   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 17:48:47 GMT 1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)e* Subject: Re: Lemmings, was Re: Move to Sun, Message-ID: <9kru1v$1cda$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  / In article <9krq71$eu4$1@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov>,h8  koehler@bessta.gsfc.nasa.aspm.gov (Bob Koehler) writes: |> c |> >? |> >However I've failed to see any real evidence that Alpha waso3 |> >sold on the basis of its [superior] technology.m |> >< |> >It sold because people wanted VMS, and Alpha was what it |> >runs on. |> >J |> >It wasn't sold because people wanted the fastest chip, then found some+ |> >operating system or other to run on it.- |> > |>  7 |> So all the Alphas running UNIX were sold by mistake?   @ I was biting my lip and trying to avoid pointing out that all of@ the "Super Computer" centers that we saw Alpha announcements for@ were running some form of Unix.  I know, given the money and the= opportunity, I would much rather my BSD servers here were alls Alphas rather than x86.    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   m   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 08:52:22 -0700S1 From: keithparris_nospam@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)  Subject: Re: LPs on the Weba= Message-ID: <dba3451e.0108080752.2722e278@posting.google.com>a  u John Santos <john.santos@post.harvard.edu> wrote in message news:<MPG.15c951f3234e9cb98968d@news.bellatlantic.net>...oI > Hmmm.  If you are eligible and can join CSA (~$100-$150/year), then you G > can get the VMS and/or Tru64 CD distributions (LP+DOCs 4 times a year C > plus current O/S kit + any new O/S releases) for about $500/year.0  > CSA membership is $600 in the US.  The Digital ASAP program it! repalced was $200 per year, IIRC.:C -------------------------------------------------------------------nC Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org | VMS consulting on:,C Clusters, Disaster Tolerance, Internals, Performance, Storage & I/O    ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 03:09:58 -0700e' From: postmaster@roblock.com (Rob Lock)t+ Subject: Re: making DLT Drives cluster wide)< Message-ID: <8b0a76c5.0108070209.7c3a5b3@posting.google.com>  F Thanks for the replies, in my novice state I could not see the conciseC path forward, I shall now set the TMSCP params and we will be away.    Thanks again   Rt
 MELIORA SPEROa (I hope for better things)   ------------------------------    Date: 08 Aug 2001 10:53:01 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>r# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code rednH Message-ID: <y4hevjaq6q.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  - "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com> writes:l  L > Windows File Protection is a mechanism which watches certain system files,D > and if they're modified, replaces them with the original versions.  ? In particular, it is MS's so-so attempt at mitigating DLL hell.d   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 10:38:29 +0100n0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com># Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code rede* Message-ID: <3B710895.E062942D@uk.sun.com>   JF Mezei wrote:  > K > As you may be aware, there is a new more virulent worm making the circlestP > which enables the ISS server as a glorified TELNET server goving you access to > the NT command prompt. > I > For the past 4-5 days, my ISP has been swamped by the virus which makesrL > connection attempts to every possible IP. As a result, for almost every IPM > request, the routers generate an ARP request to try to learn which ethernetuN > interface on the cable modem network has that IP since for the vast majorityO > of cases, the IP address is unkown to the ARP table.  The lights are flashinguN > constantly on the cable modem. I don't run any MS operating systems, so I amJ > not affraid, however, it is anoying because of the significant amount ofM > traffic on the lan this adds (I am trying to isolate a problem with a hub).  > N > Could this be the achile's heel that starts to bring down Microsoft, or willP > corporations ignore this major flaw and continue to blindly bet their business > on Microsoft stuff ? >    Many will probably ignore it.   @ Just for laughs I heard an interview with a Microsoft spokesman @ his comments were obviously for the un-technical because he said@ that Microsoft was shipping something called a "patch" this was C he stated a security enhancement that stopped the Code Red attacks.c  > He didn't point out that the patch fixed a buffer overflow bug@ which was a defect in MS's code and that the patch only brought H the security of IIS up to what people thought it was in the first place.     Regards  Andrew Harrisoni Enterprise IT Architects   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 10:07:02 GMTi? From: "Mark \(un-MASK\) Forsyth" <forsyMhm@optusAhome.coSm.aKu>n# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code red-" Message-ID: <ej1rk9.no3.ln@really>  @ "Doc.Cypher" <doc_cypher@redneck.gacracker.org> wrote in message/ news:20010807155208.5938.qmail@gacracker.org...o$ > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >oE > On Mon, 06 Aug 2001, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:r >a > [SNIP] >lJ > >Could this be the achile's heel that starts to bring down Microsoft, or willH > >corporations ignore this major flaw and continue to blindly bet their business > >on Microsoft stuff ?t > > E > >What will it take for corporations to wake up from their MicrosofttF > >trans/brainwashing and realise that they shouldn't be betting their business > >on MS software ?t >mG > In the case of the Code Red worm, the fault could be said to lie withyL > customers. This is because M$ had issued a patch for the expoit a month orJ > two ago. Of course, you can always blame M$ for failing to have adequateE > quality management and testing of their product in the first place.t    I Yes. You can also get well and truly stuck into 'em about a vulnerabilitypJ that allows complete access that they were told about in June 1999 and yet0 did nothing about until about a month or so ago.   Ooroow	 Mark F...      >. >h > Doc. > - --8 > The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it. > ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum. http://vmsbox.cjb.neth >i > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----u > Version: 2.6.2 > B > iQEVAwUBO28hcsriC3SGiziTAQFeWAf9Gdo8nogeU54IEoALm0sbp/Egq41B8WvEB > iKvnCJxr9OU1q7kApQnxoJJOyGq+ZKAGSye29tr+EtXZse8oS7xJ1EtQMxs8kuPeB > EtUqQKiG4rVGAIuuZRKssTBRGhCequPD8gWx5ZqKVZ14nHct8bFVRkcMKcU3ZGKTB > JyivZxSjkMdwTe9Gc6G9Nb5r/EhsnoC0Ja2GRo5w/pkCJcBK9qp7Pfs9s8a8qHqIB > zbTpEFrRhpZ+a02V7wU3Cs+UkeIk3E1QuDgpMh/kns7C++I7ywqlWCMoiMmlxk8x: > pJOBUveIq5TOQ23/enc1ewcKkeiqqfycRIkuOT6xbwALck/uUIZyfA== > =1uuGe > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----S >e   ------------------------------    Date: 07 Aug 2001 10:29:27 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>u# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code red H Message-ID: <y4hevkz314.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  F The problem isn't really Microsoft's software and its default state ofN insecurity. The _real_ problem is that the world decided to base a world- wideJ computer network on a design that was specified for a maximum of 250 nodesM that were to be trusted and trust each other. When the most basic assumptions I of a design are violated, you can be sure that shit happens. In fact, I'mn1 surprised every day that the network is still up.l   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 13:31:06 -0400V- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>v# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redV, Message-ID: <3B7025D6.D589851E@videotron.ca>   "Doc.Cypher" wrote:hG > In the case of the Code Red worm, the fault could be said to lie withaL > customers. This is because M$ had issued a patch for the expoit a month orJ > two ago. Of course, you can always blame M$ for failing to have adequateE > quality management and testing of their product in the first place.V    J from what I was told, many customers don't even realise that ISS starts upM whenever they boot. If that is the case, why have chosen to start software byn3 default unless the user specifically requested it ?o  M secondly, the fact that the web server can execute stuff that is dangerous is1M an indication that the architecture of the server is flawed. When you look at!C the OSU web server, it was designed specifically to run without anyeK significant privileges to protect the system. And correct me if I am wrong,yE but I am under the impression that a process on VMS cannot change itseP privileges to "conveniently" gain SYSPRV or BYPASS just by overflowing a buffer.  J When companies provided outside access to their machines via dialup, greatM care and paranoia was made to prevent abuse of their systems. And tests wouldVN be made to ensure system security was assured. Yet, large companies now deployL that ISS thing without really testing the security aspect to the same extent3 that they did for dialup lines in the previous era.   K Sort of funny that a company which used to be so paranoid as to prevent thevA use of "INQUIRE" on VMS because inquire would execute some symbol-@ substitutions, but they woudl today be running IIS without fear.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:13:34 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> # Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code red"( Message-ID: <3B7110CD.A947D38@gtech.com>   John Saunders wrote:K > And if they had patched their systems when Microsoft told them to, beforeh5 > Code Red existed, they wouldn't have had a problem.s   2 questions:  ; 1) Do MS send out patch warning to all registered customersi=    (like DEC did in the old days) or do they expect customersr#    to find the patches themselves ?r  @ 2) How many security patches comes out every year (let us say toE    cover Windows NT/2000 + IIS and Windows 95/98/ME + IE + Outlook) ?m   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 06:46:04 -0400+ From: "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com>e# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redi+ Message-ID: <9kr5ab$7c6$1@bob.news.rcn.net>h  7 "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in messageb" news:3B7110CD.A947D38@gtech.com... > John Saunders wrote:F > > And if they had patched their systems when Microsoft told them to, before7 > > Code Red existed, they wouldn't have had a problem.n >. > 2 questions: >-= > 1) Do MS send out patch warning to all registered customers-? >    (like DEC did in the old days) or do they expect customerso% >    to find the patches themselves ?-  F Check http://www.microsoft.com/security/, and you'll find that you canB subscribe to be told about security updates by email. No "finding"
 necessary.  C By the way, in the old days, DEC had a lot fewer customers, and thenL customers were not expected to have connectivity to DEC. It's reasonable nowI for a company to expect its customers have decent Internet access, and to"A use the Internet to provide notification and download of patches.i  B > 2) How many security patches comes out every year (let us say toG >    cover Windows NT/2000 + IIS and Windows 95/98/ME + IE + Outlook) ?p  ( I don't know. I haven't counted, but seeL http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/itsolutioJ ns/security/current.asp, which seems to be a list, either for all productsK or for specific products. For IIS that seems to be 14 in 2000, and, so far,t
 7 in 2001.  K I took a look at some of these and I have to say, I don't envy the QA staffpJ at MS. I don't know that I'd have thought of adding tests to catch some ofJ these (though I'm not a QA Person). For instance, I doubt I'd have thoughtL to test with a URL containing large numbers of escaped characters in a URL -L not to test whether they get parsed properly, but to test the performance of the parse codeL (http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/security /bulletin/MS00-023.asp). --
 John Saundersc jws@ma.ultranet.comc   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 06:35:13 -0400+ From: "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com>o# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redR+ Message-ID: <9kr4m1$5el$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   H "Mark (un-MASK) Forsyth" <forsyMhm@optusAhome.coSm.aKu> wrote in message news:ej1rk9.no3.ln@really... >3B > "Doc.Cypher" <doc_cypher@redneck.gacracker.org> wrote in message1 > news:20010807155208.5938.qmail@gacracker.org...l& > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > G > > On Mon, 06 Aug 2001, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  > >e
 > > [SNIP] > >lL > > >Could this be the achile's heel that starts to bring down Microsoft, or > willJ > > >corporations ignore this major flaw and continue to blindly bet their
 > business > > >on Microsoft stuff ?v > > >nG > > >What will it take for corporations to wake up from their MicrosoftAH > > >trans/brainwashing and realise that they shouldn't be betting their
 > business > > >on MS software ?h > >6I > > In the case of the Code Red worm, the fault could be said to lie withpK > > customers. This is because M$ had issued a patch for the expoit a month  orL > > two ago. Of course, you can always blame M$ for failing to have adequateG > > quality management and testing of their product in the first place.g >t >aK > Yes. You can also get well and truly stuck into 'em about a vulnerabilityhL > that allows complete access that they were told about in June 1999 and yet2 > did nothing about until about a month or so ago.  H Mark, do you mean that Microsoft were told about the Index Server buffer@ overrun in June 1999? If so, do you have  documentation of that? --
 John Saundersv jws@ma.ultranet.com'   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 06:36:00 -0500v9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)a# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code red 3 Message-ID: <g7h7wilnJ9HR@eisner.encompasserve.org>b  h In article <3B7110CD.A947D38@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes: > John Saunders wrote:L >> And if they had patched their systems when Microsoft told them to, before6 >> Code Red existed, they wouldn't have had a problem. >  > 2 questions: > = > 1) Do MS send out patch warning to all registered customersu? >    (like DEC did in the old days) or do they expect customerse% >    to find the patches themselves ?o  F As a subscriber to MSDN, I can say they certainly do not mail warningsE to subscribers.  For most Microsoft security defects this happens not D to pose a problem for me, since I do not put Microsoft machines onto any public network.A   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 17:02:27 -0400d- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> # Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redp, Message-ID: <3B705751.B9BD918D@videotron.ca>  8 Some most interesting reading^about how the virus works:  - http://www.incidents.org/react/code_redII.php-   The best one is:D 					First, the trojan program adds the value SFCDisable=0xFFFFFF9D X                            to HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsNT\CurrentVersion\Winlogin.H                            This registry setting completely disables the
 Windows File a6                            Protection (WFP) mechanism.  M So, on windows, adding just some registry entry disables file security. Great1L stuff. Who is the complete do-do at Microsoft who implemented that feature ?  F Other stupid things: there is a default mapping to a script directory.K (probably how the program manages to download its code to the remote host).w   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 06:41:21 -0500c9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) # Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redn3 Message-ID: <k6mzpeJ9kPtx@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  Y In article <9kr5ab$7c6$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com> writes:-9 > "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message-$ > news:3B7110CD.A947D38@gtech.com... >> John Saunders wrote:pG >> > And if they had patched their systems when Microsoft told them to,  > before8 >> > Code Red existed, they wouldn't have had a problem. >> >> 2 questions:- >>> >> 1) Do MS send out patch warning to all registered customers@ >>    (like DEC did in the old days) or do they expect customers& >>    to find the patches themselves ? > H > Check http://www.microsoft.com/security/, and you'll find that you canD > subscribe to be told about security updates by email. No "finding" > necessary.  E It certainly is necessary, since only by learning the magic page namei would one "subscribe".  B But wait - nowhere on that page is the word "subscribe" mentioned.  Do you want to be more specific?  E > By the way, in the old days, DEC had a lot fewer customers, and thetN > customers were not expected to have connectivity to DEC. It's reasonable nowK > for a company to expect its customers have decent Internet access, and tooC > use the Internet to provide notification and download of patches.c  D It is certainly not reasonable to require people to receive softwareE updates via the Internet.  Likewise for notifications.  Yes, 34 centslD for each Microsoft subscriber may be more than 34 cents for each DECC subscriber, but the revenue from those subscribers is also greater.   E Microsoft _does_ send me mailings regarding ".NET", so it is not like C they are too dumb to find their way to the Post Office.  They could 8 even use Fedex if they object to patronizing a monopoly.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:21:52 GMT:& From: "Ken Farmer" <kfarmer@tru64.org># Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redm= Message-ID: <A9ac7.14895$xj.2138392@typhoon.southeast.rr.com>g  D > But wait - nowhere on that page is the word "subscribe" mentioned." > Do you want to be more specific?  H I can't believe I'm actually helping Microsoft here but I feel sorry forI everyone out there who has to deal with their virus with a GUI interface.fJ The mailing list below will give you information on inoculations (RedCode,# etc.) regarding Microsoft products.r   Send blank email to:  ; microsoft_security-subscribe-request@announce.microsoft.coma       Ken Farmer, kfarmer@tru64.orgg Tru64.org, http://www.tru64.org  Tru64.org Newsletter:e< http://www2.tru64.org/pages.php?page=Newsletter-Registration          F "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote in message- news:k6mzpeJ9kPtx@eisner.encompasserve.org...)= > In article <9kr5ab$7c6$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "John Saunders"  <jws@ma.ultranet.com> writes: ; > > "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in messagel& > > news:3B7110CD.A947D38@gtech.com... > >> John Saunders wrote: I > >> > And if they had patched their systems when Microsoft told them to,-
 > > before: > >> > Code Red existed, they wouldn't have had a problem. > >> > >> 2 questions:r > >>@ > >> 1) Do MS send out patch warning to all registered customersB > >>    (like DEC did in the old days) or do they expect customers( > >>    to find the patches themselves ? > >dJ > > Check http://www.microsoft.com/security/, and you'll find that you canF > > subscribe to be told about security updates by email. No "finding" > > necessary. >'G > It certainly is necessary, since only by learning the magic page name- > would one "subscribe". > D > But wait - nowhere on that page is the word "subscribe" mentioned." > Do you want to be more specific? > G > > By the way, in the old days, DEC had a lot fewer customers, and theyL > > customers were not expected to have connectivity to DEC. It's reasonable nowbJ > > for a company to expect its customers have decent Internet access, and toE > > use the Internet to provide notification and download of patches.  > F > It is certainly not reasonable to require people to receive softwareG > updates via the Internet.  Likewise for notifications.  Yes, 34 centstF > for each Microsoft subscriber may be more than 34 cents for each DECE > subscriber, but the revenue from those subscribers is also greater.n >nG > Microsoft _does_ send me mailings regarding ".NET", so it is not likeoE > they are too dumb to find their way to the Post Office.  They couldv: > even use Fedex if they object to patronizing a monopoly.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:29:51 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>t# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code red , Message-ID: <3B7168FD.2070A0A5@videotron.ca>  I > > In the case of the Code Red worm, the fault could be said to lie withbN > > customers. This is because M$ had issued a patch for the expoit a month or > > two ago.  K Droppong the issue of poor software security design, and tackling this one:i  N 1- did "enterprise" customers receive a warning about the bug with informationJ on how to fetch the patch ? Or are they expected to scan the microsoft web& site for new patches every few hours ?F As a side line: Is it Microsoft's job to warn customers or would it be/ Compaq's responsability to warn its customers ?     H 2-considering that this puppy harms enterprise customers because it alsoM causes residential PCs to start to generate requests to port 80, resulting inoI lots of ARP traffic and reduced network performance, it was wrong for the-J media to just state that it is businesses with servers which are potentialM targets, the media should have warned every user of microsoft stuff that they N should check their task list to see if they have IIS running in the backgroundM as is the case on some versions of windows (Windows 2000 I beleive starts IIS', by default with some default configuration).   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 12:40:07 -0400+ From: "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com> # Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redi+ Message-ID: <9krq28$34v$1@bob.news.rcn.net>s  F "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote in message- news:k6mzpeJ9kPtx@eisner.encompasserve.org...C= > In article <9kr5ab$7c6$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "John Saunders". <jws@ma.ultranet.com> writes:a; > > "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in messagea& > > news:3B7110CD.A947D38@gtech.com... > >> John Saunders wrote:tI > >> > And if they had patched their systems when Microsoft told them to,e
 > > before: > >> > Code Red existed, they wouldn't have had a problem. > >> > >> 2 questions:e > >>@ > >> 1) Do MS send out patch warning to all registered customersB > >>    (like DEC did in the old days) or do they expect customers( > >>    to find the patches themselves ? > >iJ > > Check http://www.microsoft.com/security/, and you'll find that you canF > > subscribe to be told about security updates by email. No "finding" > > necessary. >0G > It certainly is necessary, since only by learning the magic page nameQ > would one "subscribe".  ; Surely you don't mean that "Security" is a magic page name?M  D > But wait - nowhere on that page is the word "subscribe" mentioned." > Do you want to be more specific?  I I apologize. You're right. You have to click the link to Current Security 	 Bulletins-L (http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/itsolutiL ons/security/current.asp) to see, near the top of the page, "Want to receive) future security bulletins automatically?"a  G > > By the way, in the old days, DEC had a lot fewer customers, and the-L > > customers were not expected to have connectivity to DEC. It's reasonable nowfJ > > for a company to expect its customers have decent Internet access, and toE > > use the Internet to provide notification and download of patches.n >sF > It is certainly not reasonable to require people to receive softwareG > updates via the Internet.  Likewise for notifications.  Yes, 34 cents F > for each Microsoft subscriber may be more than 34 cents for each DECE > subscriber, but the revenue from those subscribers is also greater.0  G What Microsoft subscribers, Larry? Most users of IIS don't subscribe toa	 anything.V  K And don't you think it's a good idea to disseminate security bulletins moree" quickly than a 34 cent stamp will?  G > Microsoft _does_ send me mailings regarding ".NET", so it is not likepE > they are too dumb to find their way to the Post Office.  They coulda: > even use Fedex if they object to patronizing a monopoly.  K You're an MSDN Subscriber, Larry. That's a smaller set than the "set of allcI IIS Admins who can't be bothered to subscribe to security notifications".  --
 John Saundersv jws@ma.ultranet.comt   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 12:45:28 -0400+ From: "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com>u# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code redo+ Message-ID: <9krqc8$4au$1@bob.news.rcn.net>e  ? "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote in messagelF news:rdeininger-0808011129250001@user-2ive73a.dialup.mindspring.com...= > In article <9kr4m1$5el$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "John Saunders"t > <jws@ma.ultranet.com> wrote: >e >rL > > Mark, do you mean that Microsoft were told about the Index Server bufferD > > overrun in June 1999? If so, do you have  documentation of that? >gD > Is that an Armani-clad dorsal fin I see circling around Mr. Gates?   No, just denim-clad. :-) --
 John Saunderst jws@ma.ultranet.coma   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 12:44:58 -0400+ From: "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com>o# Subject: Re: Microsoft and Code red + Message-ID: <9krqba$47s$1@bob.news.rcn.net>b  H "Mark (un-MASK) Forsyth" <forsyMhm@optusAhome.coSm.aKu> wrote in message news:2scrk9.544.ln@really... >u8 > "John Saunders" <jws@ma.ultranet.com> wrote in message' > news:9kr4m1$5el$1@bob.news.rcn.net... L > > "Mark (un-MASK) Forsyth" <forsyMhm@optusAhome.coSm.aKu> wrote in message  > > news:ej1rk9.no3.ln@really... > > >t >d > [deletia]e >gA > > > Yes. You can also get well and truly stuck into 'em about af > vulnerability L > > > that allows complete access that they were told about in June 1999 and > yet 6 > > > did nothing about until about a month or so ago. > >cL > > Mark, do you mean that Microsoft were told about the Index Server bufferD > > overrun in June 1999? If so, do you have  documentation of that? >mG > The vulnerability is the same. ie. Buffer overrun when processing IISsH > filtered extensions. The actual exploit was different to the "proof ofC > concept' that eEye published. Still should've woken MS up though.  >h > Have a look at< http://www.eeye.com/html/Research/Advisories/AD19990608.html > and9@ > http://www.eeye.com/html/Research/Advisories/AD19990608-3.html   Mark,o  5 Thanks for the information. I didn't know about this.n  L This is completely inexcusable. There's no reason at all that they shouldn'tI have tested this vulnerability and anything else like it, on every single C ISAPI plug-in they ship, as well as on the core server. They shouldsH additionally have established a rule that no other part of Microsoft canJ ship an ISAPI extension without passing these same tests. In particular, I: wonder if we have the same exact problem with .aspx files? --
 John Saundersr jws@ma.ultranet.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 11:50:22 -0400r- From: Jonathan Boswell <jsb@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>e2 Subject: Re: Modems, Keyboard & Mouse Ports on VLC/ Message-ID: <3B715FBE.8236692@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>    New VLC User wrote:"H > Unless I'm mistaken (and please correct me if I'm wrong), the keyboardG > and mouse ports on my VAXstation 4000 VLC are TTA0: and TTA1:.  Can Iv2 > use either of these ports for an external modem?  3 Seems doubtful.  Mine are being used by DECwindows.e  C > the pinouts?  NOTE: I'm already using the DB25 port (TTA2:) for as% > serial printer.  Thanks in advance.s  G You're in luck because there is also an MMJ port next to the DB25 port.II VMS sees this device as TTA3.  The pinout according to the users's manualt page B-1 is as follows:    Pin     Meaningy _______________t 1       DTRk 2       Transmit 3       Ground 4       Ground 5       Receivet 6       DSR    ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:35:22 +0000 (UTC)B From: Massimiliano.Mauceri@tlc.semagroup.it (Mauceri Massimiliano)" Subject: mount spare internal diskB Message-ID: <23DC1A5C6E91D411BCD300508B6573E8012CA9C5@SEMARMN0006>   Hi...rL I need some information about a mount of a internal disk (no system disk) in a system that used VMS 7.1-2G For example if  I need to mount the disk named $1$dke100 as local disk,0 which are the steps ?             <<...OLE_Obj...>> :   Massimiliano Mauceri Delivery and Support Engineer@ SchulmbergerSema Telecoms - e-mail: massimiliano.mauceri@tlc.semagroup.itu Tel: +39 06 41536371 Fax:+39 06 41536385l         -- D Posted from [213.255.32.100] g1 via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG0   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 16:16:32 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)& Subject: Re: mount spare internal disk2 Message-ID: <AvUb7.680$Yx2.15847@news.cpqcorp.net>   In article <23DC1A5C6E91D411BCD300508B6573E8012CA9C5@SEMARMN0006>, Massimiliano.Mauceri@tlc.semagroup.it (Mauceri Massimiliano) writes:   M :I need some information about a mount of a internal disk (no system disk) ino :a system that used VMS 7.1-2bH :For example if  I need to mount the disk named $1$dke100 as local disk, :which are the steps ?  J   Add the following line into your site-specific system startup procedure:  "     $ MOUNT/SYSTEM $1$DKE100 label  M   And most commonly, add it into the SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM procedure.l  I   I'd also encourage you to acquire and read the OpenVMS System Manager'sgL   manual, as it describes this and a whole lot more.  This and other OpenVMSL   manuals are available at the Compaq OpenVMS website -- please see the FAQ.  L   When posting, providing details such as the version and the configuration K   will be of interest.  If, for instance, this is a cluster, you might wantd6   to look at the SYS$EXAMPLES:MSCPMOUNT.COM procedure.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 17:21:29 +0000 (UTC)B From: Massimiliano.Mauceri@tlc.semagroup.it (Mauceri Massimiliano)* Subject: Re: Re: mount spare internal diskB Message-ID: <23DC1A5C6E91D411BCD300508B6573E8012CA9CA@SEMARMN0006>  L I need some information about a mount of a internal disk (no system disk) inL :a system that used VMS 7.1-2 :For example if I need to mount the disk named/ $1$dke100 as local disk, :which are the steps ?y  K  Add the following line into your site-specific system startup procedure: $i? MOUNT/SYSTEM $1$DKE100 label And most commonly, add it into theoJ SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM procedure. I'd also encourage you to acquireH and read the OpenVMS System Manager's manual, as it describes this and aJ whole lot more. This and other OpenVMS manuals are available at the CompaqK OpenVMS website -- please see the FAQ. When posting, providing details suchoK as the version and the configuration will be of interest. If, for instance,eK this is a cluster, you might want to look at the SYS$EXAMPLES:MSCPMOUNT.COM9 procedure.     Thank You for the answer1 But if I mount the disk without write then in the . SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM what is happen ?L I think that at first reboot the system don,t know the mount and don,t mount the disk in the system !!!!w My suppose it's correct ?g      <<...OLE_Obj...>>     Massimiliano Mauceri Delivery and Support Engineeri SchulmbergerSema Telecomst- e-mail: massimiliano.mauceri@tlc.semagroup.ite Tel: +39 06 41536371 Fax:+39 06 41536385a         -- r Posted from [213.255.32.100] o1 via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG-   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 19:04:54 GMTo2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)* Subject: Re: Re: mount spare internal disk2 Message-ID: <qZWb7.689$Yx2.16045@news.cpqcorp.net>   In article <23DC1A5C6E91D411BCD300508B6573E8012CA9CA@SEMARMN0006>, Massimiliano.Mauceri@tlc.semagroup.it (Mauceri Massimiliano) writes:12 :But if I mount the disk without write then in the/ :SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM what is happen ?iM :I think that at first reboot the system don,t know the mount and don,t mount  :the disk in the system !!!! :My suppose it's correct ?  )   I am unable to understand the question.>  B   SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM is invoked when OpenVMS starts up.  D   If you happen to have a MOUNT command included in that procedure,    it will (should) execute.t  B   If you directly invoke the MOUNT command from DCL, you will alsoC   MOUNT the disk, but you will have to re-invoke the MOUNT command a   after every system reboot.  ?   I would definitely encourage you to read the System Manager's >   Manual in the OpenVMS documentation, as that manual provides    information on how this works.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 08 Aug 2001 10:59:59 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  Subject: Re: Move to SunH Message-ID: <y4elqnapv4.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  , "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> writes:  F > VMS wasn't the only system to get the boot.  IBM is being phased out# > too.  No AIX, no more mainframes.t   Very interesting.   M In the current issue of the German Society of Computer Science (GI), there isKN an article whose main point is that students at universitites and polytechnicsJ should be taught about mainframes and mainframe OSes, S/390 in particular,M because they just will not go away. The article describes a lot of the strongiL features of S/390 and mentions its availability and scalability features, asM well as Parallel Sysplex. (No mention of VMS, though.) It also quotes the CIO K of a major German bank, who on being asked when he expects the bank's S/390tM systems to be phased out for something more "modern" replied, "Not within they next 50 years."t   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 10:44:55 -0400w2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: Move to SunL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011044560001@user-2ivec1n.dialup.mindspring.com>  D In article <8JHb7.2657$uN1.52449@e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com>, "Jack% Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> wrote:c  A > "Hoff Hoffman" <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in messagea. > news:zZEb7.654$Yx2.15775@news.cpqcorp.net...H > > In article <qKEb7.2507$uN1.35084@e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com>, "Jack( > Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> writes:D > > :I have an immediate and urgent need to port a large application4 > > :from VMS to Solaris in a very short time frame. > > C > >   Um, is there a particular reason this is under consideration?  > > G > The customer, one of our largest (very large european multinational),fF > has told us they want to keep our applications but do not want it onB > VMS.  They have an IT policy, in place for several years now, toJ > eliminate all VMS based machines and applications.  Replacements are SunG > for critical servers and NT for web servers (non-critical information J > kiosk type apps).  They are willing to pay substantial sums to implement > their policy.y  I Since they've had the policy in place for several years, and now the portlE is "immediate and urgent", you will hopefully raise the price of youroB services by a large factor -- double or triple sounds about right.  F Then when the grand "IT policy" falls flat, the people who mandated itD will be noticed by the bean-counters and get what they have coming. 4 Meanwhile, your company will at least have the cash.   -- p Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.coma   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 07:51:43 -0700* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> Subject: Re: Move to Sun? Message-ID: <4dTb7.6250$uN1.100118@e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com>e  5 "Hamlyn Mootoo" <univms@bigfoot.com> wrote in messageo% news:3B6F76A7.2F871A17@bigfoot.com...e' > If you have developed under either of H > these (especially AIX), then development under Sun is no biggie.  What  > is your app written in anyway? >FG Code is in C, with heavy use in libraries of RMS, SMG, LIB, LBR and VMSeH system calls.  RMS will be replaced with Oracle, the VMS calls are not aE major problem, but I am concerned about the equivalents for SMG (appsiH are character cell based).  AIX had an Extended Curses library with mostG of the same functionality, I'm hoping Solaris has some equivalent.  WebsA based portion is all NT/IIS/Visual Studio with ODBC connection to ' Oracle, not an issue in the conversion.   H I've done some development in AIX and SCO but it was never the preferredG platform (i.e. code was written on VMS and then ported).  We've droppedrG both from lack of interest.  I still have an old RS/6000 sitting in the-G corner, looks like it will be joining the museum for the grandkids too.a    Jack PeacockP   ------------------------------    Date: 07 Aug 2001 17:07:18 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>o Subject: Re: Move to SunH Message-ID: <y4lmkvc3ix.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  , "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> writes:  # > RMS will be replaced with Oracle,t  L Thus replacing a fair-priced screwdriver with an extortionately-priced sldge hammer. How wonderful.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 15:01:55 +0100-( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B714652.56C08A8E@127.0.0.1>M   andrew harrison wrote: >  > Nic Clews wrote:K > > Obviously your client has not read the July Gartner report which placesr > E > Interesting definition of proprietary, SPARC is actually one of theeD > most open processor architectures there is. AMD and Transmeta haveG > had to very carefully clone the Intel x86 processor, on the otherhandaE > the information required to develop and build SPARC CPU's is in the  > public domain. > E > This is why for example Fujitsu are able to develop and manufactureCC > their own SPARC CPU's, and then build them into their own serverst > that run Solaris.  > : > If your definition is non-proprietary Intel, proprietary8 > anthing that isn't Intel then you should have said so.  G It wasn't my definition, I suggest you take it up with the analysts whoc wrote the report./  H In my "Collins" dictionary, propriety is defined as "belonging to owner;4 made by firm with exclusive rights of manufacture ".  ! I didn't write that, I quoted it.l    8 > You post also totally ignores that fact that there are8 > other vendors who have no intention of including IA-64 > in their product lines.h > < > The IBM S390 division, the AS400 and the RS/6000 divisions< > have no intention of including any IA-64 products in their > product lines.  D Ditto the first comment, I quoted from a report, but if the above isE true about IBM, then why are they so busy working on the Power4 chip,eF which, even in the words of Paul DeMone would be a rival for the Alpha EV7?  G The report does mention IBM, perhaps I should have quoted this as well:-  E "While Compaq, HP, and IBM all weave Itanium technology through theirnH server lines, Compaq is the only one that plans to relinquish all of its( proprietary chip technology to Itanium."  F Argue the point with Gartner, not me. It's just 'grist to the mill' to me.n  D > And those vendors that have decided to drop their own architectureD > in favour of IA-64 have done it with a great deal more thought and7 > planning that Compaq have. HP being the best example.b > C > So if you think that a hastily conceived decision by Compaq whicho? > has apparently had no technical due dilligence and which willn@ > not deliver actual products until 2005 puts Compaq in a better. > possition than Sun you are probably deluded.  D There's a lot of assumptions there. Decisions are often based on farB more than just technical reasoning. While non of us here have beenE particularly party to the decision making process, I'm unsure how younF can say that (paraphrashed) "Compaq have not carried out any planning,A applied thought, or any technical due diligence" in the decision.c  H I fully appreciate your defending your companies decision for where theyD are and where they are going, but you should also agree that I couldA not, and would not, make the above statements, replacing the wordC@ "Compaq" with "Sun", about any technical direction taken by Sun.   -- e( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot com-   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 18:37:56 +02001= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>c Subject: Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B701964.AF042893@gtech.com>o   Hoff Hoffman wrote:fm > In article <qKEb7.2507$uN1.35084@e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com>, "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> writes:iB > :I have an immediate and urgent need to port a large application2 > :from VMS to Solaris in a very short time frame. > A >   Um, is there a particular reason this is under consideration?   + I know that the official Compaq opinion is:M   - VMS sales are doing fine7   - the customer response to Alpha -> IA-64 are postive    But the facts are that:mA   - the VMS customer base has been heavily eroded the last decadeJ@   - people are extremely concerned about the Alpha -> IA-64 (and&     Compaq's credibility are very low)  : We are going to see this question a lot the next 5 years !   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 17:21:47 +0100u( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B70159B.39B9475B@127.0.0.1>t   Jack Peacock wrote:J > G > The customer, one of our largest (very large european multinational), F > has told us they want to keep our applications but do not want it onB > VMS.  They have an IT policy, in place for several years now, toJ > eliminate all VMS based machines and applications.  Replacements are SunG > for critical servers and NT for web servers (non-critical informationoJ > kiosk type apps).  They are willing to pay substantial sums to implement > their policy.a  G Obviously your client has not read the July Gartner report which places F Sun in a weak position with respect to Compaq recent announcement withB server consolidation to Itanium. Competitional analysis says this:  E "Thus far, Sun is the only vendor that does not plan to include InteloG chip support in its product line. Instead, Sun is going the proprietaryy< route with its SPARC and 64-bit UltraSPARC microprocessors."  ) The phrase "out on a limb" comes to mind.e  A (Can one of the OpenVMS ambassadors submit a link to the doc here  please?)  H In any case, I do hope you are including your full training, get all the& courses, basic thru the expert levels.  H Go along to comp.unix.solaris, and see what some users are saying, mightH not be the bed of roses you're expecting. The thread "Solaris - is thereA any point" is interesting and raised some FUD I've been unable to3 identify from the DEC days.g  E And I trust they'll be shutting down their NT webservers every time ae code red virus appears.a --  ( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot coma   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:55:19 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: Move to SunL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011255190001@user-2ivec1n.dialup.mindspring.com>  H In article <3B7019DB.257D1E7D@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote:u   > Robert Deininger wrote:nJ > > Then when the grand "IT policy" falls flat, the people who mandated itG > > will be noticed by the bean-counters and get what they have coming.t > 
 > Optimist ??- >  > That almost never happends !  I True, but if the price of the port is exceptionally high, then it is moreo likely to happen.i   -- ) Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com-   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 09:59:55 -0700* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> Subject: Re: Move to Sun? Message-ID: <h5Vb7.7303$uN1.105928@e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com>   ? "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote in message F news:rdeininger-0708011044560001@user-2ivec1n.dialup.mindspring.com... >EF > Since they've had the policy in place for several years, and now the portG > is "immediate and urgent", you will hopefully raise the price of yourfD > services by a large factor -- double or triple sounds about right. >0> From an inside sourse we learned they had been searching for aE Sun/Oracle based replacement for the last two years, without success.:G The lowest quote they received from other companies was five times whatcH we were prepared to charge for a conversion.  We have since adjusted ourG quote accordingly.  As for immediate and urgent, that's my problem, not E the customer.   I've just had a large project dumped in my lap with 4mB days to develop the budget and no resources available to schedule.5 Given the dinero involved saying no is not an option.h >eH > Then when the grand "IT policy" falls flat, the people who mandated itE > will be noticed by the bean-counters and get what they have coming.m6 > Meanwhile, your company will at least have the cash. >uH It hasn't fallen flat.  They have moved nearly all applications to theirE standard platform.  It was expensive and took too long, but they havedE been able to recover significant people costs by only having a single-H VMS expert on staff now.  In another year there will be no VMS left.  It( appears Unix staff are cheaper than VMS.  G And yes, we will take the money.  I have grown accustomed to eating andt do not wish to stop.  :)    Jack Peacock    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 10:02:59 -0700* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> Subject: Re: Move to Sun? Message-ID: <98Vb7.7337$uN1.105957@e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com>i  7 "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message # news:3B701742.920E4285@gtech.com...z >d; > If it is an option, then I would recommend porting to AIX2 > instead of Solaris.) >rD VMS wasn't the only system to get the boot.  IBM is being phased out! too.  No AIX, no more mainframes.i    Jack Peacock2   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 18:39:55 +0200t= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>s Subject: Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B7019DB.257D1E7D@gtech.com>d   Robert Deininger wrote::H > Then when the grand "IT policy" falls flat, the people who mandated itE > will be noticed by the bean-counters and get what they have coming.m   Optimist ??t   That almost never happends !   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 13:20:03 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>a Subject: Re: Move to Sun( Message-ID: <9kp80l$4fe$1@pyrite.mv.net>  5 "Nic Clews" <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in messaget# news:3B70159B.39B9475B@127.0.0.1...v > Jack Peacock wrote:a > >wI > > The customer, one of our largest (very large european multinational),oH > > has told us they want to keep our applications but do not want it onD > > VMS.  They have an IT policy, in place for several years now, toL > > eliminate all VMS based machines and applications.  Replacements are SunI > > for critical servers and NT for web servers (non-critical informationpL > > kiosk type apps).  They are willing to pay substantial sums to implement > > their policy.n >iI > Obviously your client has not read the July Gartner report which placeseH > Sun in a weak position with respect to Compaq recent announcement with" > server consolidation to Itanium.  H Funny about those Gartner reports:  the people who ignored the ones thatK trashed VMS are considered to have been astute, so the suggestion that thisfJ customer may be doing something foolish by ignoring their wisdom about Sun seems at least questionable.  "  Competitional analysis says this: >8G > "Thus far, Sun is the only vendor that does not plan to include IntelsI > chip support in its product line. Instead, Sun is going the proprietaryS> > route with its SPARC and 64-bit UltraSPARC microprocessors." >t+ > The phrase "out on a limb" comes to mind.o  J Alternatively, they may just be considering the advantages of a mature andL stable platform:  that's certainly what the SGI customers who abandoned shipL when SGI prematurely announced its IA64 migration seem to have been thinkingD about, and what a lot of Compaq customers seem to be thinking today.   >nC > (Can one of the OpenVMS ambassadors submit a link to the doc here 
 > please?) >oJ > In any case, I do hope you are including your full training, get all the( > courses, basic thru the expert levels. >aJ > Go along to comp.unix.solaris, and see what some users are saying, mightJ > not be the bed of roses you're expecting. The thread "Solaris - is thereC > any point" is interesting and raised some FUD I've been unable toe > identify from the DEC days..  D While the initiating post seems driven by the mindless, lemming-likeI mentality that assumes that IA64 will take over the world just because itoH will carry the "Intel Inside" stigma, many of the responses (and similarG discussions in places like comp.arch) raise the more realistic question. "IA64 - is there any point?"   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 13:39:30 -0400m- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>i Subject: Re: Move to Sun, Message-ID: <3B7027CD.2DA091DB@videotron.ca>   Nic Clews wrote:G > "Thus far, Sun is the only vendor that does not plan to include Intel I > chip support in its product line. Instead, Sun is going the proprietaryi> > route with its SPARC and 64-bit UltraSPARC microprocessors."  K Well, when Digital decided to go with Alpha instead of MIPS, the exact same G thing could have been said. Yet, Digital was able to design and build aeM superior chip that sold despite Digital prefering to sell 8086 based bachinesl" with NT over Alpha based machines.  N Sun has a clear focus on its products and it doesn't seem affraid to make themN compete against Microsoft. It isn't affraid to market itself and its products.  H I do not know enough about Sun (yet) to be able to judge their technicalK competence. However, on principle, I see nothing wrong with Sun going theirrA own way if they beleive that they can do a better job than Intel.g  H Everyone is trying to emulate IBM. And I would think that Sun is doing aN better job than Compaq. When Sun realised that SIMS (PMDF) was critical to itsI platform, it bought it.  Comapq on the other hand is getting rid of thoseaV assets which bring it closer to being an IBM, trying to focus instead on NT solutions.  J For whatever technical inferiority Sun sysytems might have over the Alpha,I since Alpha is dead, you now have to compare Sun against Intel. And whicheM company would you wish to make a long term paltform investment in ? Sun which N is not affraid to market its products and has market mindshare and leadership,G or Compaq whose "true" entreprise products are not only obscure and notd> marketed, but whose future commitments are not very credible ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 11:08:12 -0700t' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>. Subject: Re: Move to Sun+ Message-ID: <3B702E8C.9A94A5D8@caltech.edu>n   Jack Peacock wrote:   7 > "Hamlyn Mootoo" <univms@bigfoot.com> wrote in messages' > news:3B6F76A7.2F871A17@bigfoot.com...c) > > If you have developed under either ofaJ > > these (especially AIX), then development under Sun is no biggie.  What" > > is your app written in anyway? > >g > Code is in C,e   So far so good  ; > with heavy use in libraries of RMS, SMG, LIB, LBR and VMS  > system calls.e  J If you want to keep all this stuff you're going to need one of the porting$ libraries.  I don't use those myselfJ but  see www.Accelr8.com for info on one such product.  With some work youH can replace SMG with curses.  Not knowing what you're up against I can't1 tell you if you can plug in Unix system calls forvG VMS ones or not, but if you can, that would definitely be the way to goe  since the odds of ever migratingE back are infinitesimal.  Plus the compatibility modes in the Compaq Cy' compilers are getting better and bettersH so if that remote possibility does arise the  Unixy variant of your code might even run on VMS anyway. H Or to put it another way, if VMS does survive, its Unix compatibility is going to have to be so highpJ that you can just recompile on VMS from your Solaris code - so don't worry about looking back too much.  # > RMS will be replaced with Oracle,I  H Is the data HUGE?  If not, look into other relational databases, many of which are free.  You can chunkJ a lot of data into mysql or postgres and save yourself a fortune in Oracle fees.  That is, you can so longv< as you don't need to distribute it across multiple machines.  J Thanks to Digital and Compaq's outstanding  management I've been porting aJ lot of Fortran and C code from OpenVMS->Solaris over the last month - withJ very few difficulties.  The hardest part was usually writing the makefile.I But then most of the code I deal with has been data in, crunch, data out, I and so the interfaces aren't very complicated.   Here's an example of theaI sorts of minor changes I've seen. The Solaris C compiler didn't like code. that did  
 char foo[100]k      function(&foo)   
 instead of      function (&foo[0])w  H when the prototype for that parameter was char *, but other than that, I! don't think I've changed anythinglC in the C code that wasn't related to the file system.  f77 has been-F remarkably compatible as well.  The solaris compiler doesn't know whatI "carriagcontrol=list" means,  and wants ran() and secnds() to be declared0 asG REAL*4 (the Compaq compilers never complained about that), and the  theu include statementsK needed  logical:filename types of names rewritten, but other than that it'so been very smooth sailing.uG Wait, two more things.  On VMS a Fortran FORMAT statement could use "i"rJ for either an integer*2 or integer*4,but that format only works for i*4 on Solaris, with the i*2 blowingeI up the program when it executes.   And the order of the words is reversed  so if you were manipulatingsK bytes through equivalence() statements  those sections need to be modified.l   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu  J ************************************************************************** *hJ RIH Compaq                                                               *J **************************************************************************   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:16:55 +0200i= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>a Subject: Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B711197.DB16815E@gtech.com>t   Bill Gunshannon wrote:+ > In article <3B70159B.39B9475B@127.0.0.1>,n- >  Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> writes:sJ > |> "Thus far, Sun is the only vendor that does not plan to include IntelL > |> chip support in its product line. Instead, Sun is going the proprietaryA > |> route with its SPARC and 64-bit UltraSPARC microprocessors."e > |> > G > I have heard people criticize Gartner here before, but why has no one - > seen the absurdity of the above statement??o > H > Sun has included Intel chip support in their product line since beforeJ > Solaris and I hardly think it is likely they will drop it at this point.  D First: everybody knows that analysts are those guys not smart enough. to be a system administrator or a programmer !   :-)r  D Second: you are ofcourse correct that SUN has delivered software for@ Intel platform for along time and probably will continue to. The	 statementvE above could be referring to the fact that SUN is not selling hardwarev based on Intel chips.a   Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 18:50:03 GMTh1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)n Subject: Re: Move to Sun+ Message-ID: <9kpd8r$4dh$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>q  ) In article <3B70159B.39B9475B@127.0.0.1>,o+  Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> writes:s |> eH |> "Thus far, Sun is the only vendor that does not plan to include IntelJ |> chip support in its product line. Instead, Sun is going the proprietary? |> route with its SPARC and 64-bit UltraSPARC microprocessors."e |> c  E I have heard people criticize Gartner here before, but why has no one"+ seen the absurdity of the above statement??   F Sun has included Intel chip support in their product line since beforeH Solaris and I hardly think it is likely they will drop it at this point.  G And this is basicly what everyone here has been saying about VMS.  TheynJ are not against running it on IA64, they just didn't want to see the price be the death of Alpha.   bill -   -- -J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   5   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:18:11 +0200c= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>l Subject: Re: Move to Sun) Message-ID: <3B7111E3.4540C61B@gtech.com>    JF Mezei wrote:e > Arne Vajhj wrote: > > But the facts are that: E > >   - the VMS customer base has been heavily eroded the last decade D > >   - people are extremely concerned about the Alpha -> IA-64 (and* > >     Compaq's credibility are very low) > >a> > > We are going to see this question a lot the next 5 years ! > ! > I am not so sure about "a lot".d > I > My impression is that Compaq managed to convince the large customers it J > visited on the day of the alpha murder. So they may not embark on a veryM > visible and fast migration away from VMS. And much of the smaller customerscN > have already migrated away, in the process or migrating or plan on migrating' > to some shrinkwarpped MS application.r   I hope that you are rigth.  7 But by reading all the VMS/IA-64 posts here I am not soo optimistic.    People feel betrayed by Compaq.    Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 15:02:45 -0500s9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)r Subject: Re: Move to Sun3 Message-ID: <SJH0qwpw4Bm$@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  _ In article <9kpd8r$4dh$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:o+ > In article <3B70159B.39B9475B@127.0.0.1>, - >  Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> writes:e > |> nJ > |> "Thus far, Sun is the only vendor that does not plan to include IntelL > |> chip support in its product line. Instead, Sun is going the proprietaryA > |> route with its SPARC and 64-bit UltraSPARC microprocessors."p > |> y > G > I have heard people criticize Gartner here before, but why has no one"- > seen the absurdity of the above statement??h  2 What makes you say nobody has seen the absurdity ?" Not everything deserves a comment.  H > Sun has included Intel chip support in their product line since beforeJ > Solaris and I hardly think it is likely they will drop it at this point. > I > And this is basicly what everyone here has been saying about VMS.  TheysL > are not against running it on IA64, they just didn't want to see the price > be the death of Alpha.  C It won't be, if people keep buying Alpha instead of IA64.  How many 1 denizens of comp.os.vms control major purchases ?e   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:41:38 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: Move to Sun, Message-ID: <3B704465.90B20C4C@videotron.ca>   Arne Vajhj wrote: > But the facts are that:uC >   - the VMS customer base has been heavily eroded the last decadetB >   - people are extremely concerned about the Alpha -> IA-64 (and( >     Compaq's credibility are very low) > < > We are going to see this question a lot the next 5 years !   I am not so sure about "a lot".a  G My impression is that Compaq managed to convince the large customers itaH visited on the day of the alpha murder. So they may not embark on a veryK visible and fast migration away from VMS. And much of the smaller customersiL have already migrated away, in the process or migrating or plan on migrating% to some shrinkwarpped MS application."   ------------------------------    Date: 08 Aug 2001 18:06:27 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>i Subject: Re: Move to SunH Message-ID: <y44rrir0xo.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  * Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> writes:  F > Ditto the first comment, I quoted from a report, but if the above isG > true about IBM, then why are they so busy working on the Power4 chip,tH > which, even in the words of Paul DeMone would be a rival for the Alpha > EV7?  H Just for that reason - Power is what powers RS/6000 and AS/400 systems. & S/390 is a different thing, of course.  G > "While Compaq, HP, and IBM all weave Itanium technology through theirdJ > server lines, Compaq is the only one that plans to relinquish all of its* > proprietary chip technology to Itanium."  A Oh really? I thought Itanium is the natural successor to PA-RISC?y   	Jan   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 14:17:05 +0100+ From: "Pye, Graham" <Graham.Pye@compaq.com> % Subject: RE: NCL Command Disassembler P Message-ID: <F5949552111A66489D2D578D92B3697201743703@reoexc04.emea.cpqcorp.net>   Ferry,  I <<<< However, this is not a good solution; so I thought to add the ENABLEc and @ <<<< DISABLE commands for the SNA ACCESS SERVER OBJECT entity toG <<<< NCL$GLOBALSECTION.DAT. And if possible, I also wanted to add a newhL <<<< attribute TIMEOUT = <n> where <n> is an integer to support a connection
 <<<< timeout.o  H One of our products (Enterprise Directory, a.k.a. X.500) extends the NCLH commands in this way. So I asked the team leader how it was done, and heL said that we get the registrar to add our commands to the Global Section andL it appears in the next version of DECnet Plus. In other words, we don't knowJ how to rebuild the section file either. We provide them with a file calledJ DSA.MS which defines all our extensions. Internally, it looks a bit like aG high level language type definition header file, or perhaps a CLD file.   G So, it appears that you might need to log an IPMT or something with the J Support Centre (against DECnet??) and ask if this can be done for you too.  " Graham Pye (First.Last@compaq.com)   ------------------------------   Date: 8 AUG 2001 14:15:36 GMTe+ From: Dave Greenwood <greenwoodde@ornl.gov>e' Subject: Re: NFS network protocol errorg1 Message-ID: <8AUG01.14153613@feda01.fed.ornl.gov>3   vms@trymech.co.uk (Paul) wrote:eM > I have an NFS export from a HP server successfully mounted on an VMS clientwS > and I am able to create and edit files on it successfully - the problem is this :m >  pM > Using the BACKUP utility to restore files from the OpenVMS box to any HP UX-N > system, either from tape or disk and regardless of whether it's for multipleJ > or single files, results in the following error and no files are copied: >  c* > VMSSERVER> backup a.a ONE:[000000]*.*/lo> > %BACKUP-E-OPENOUT, error opening ONE:[000000]A.A;1 as output$ > -RMS-E-CRE, ACP file create failed, > -SYSTEM-F-PROTOCOL, network protocol error  K The first thing to note here is that this command simply attempts to *copy* I the file A.A to the HP disk.  *IF* A.A is a backup saveset, then you needm a command like:e  !   backup a.a/SAVE one:[000000]*.*m  = If A.A is not a saveset, you could try a simple COPY command.n   Dave --------------9 Dave Greenwood                Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOVsH Oak Ridge National Lab        %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 14:26:14 -0300+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> ! Subject: OpenVMS (Itanium) wishes L Message-ID: <OF67F3A330.A22ED5EA-ON03256AA2.005CF97D@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   People  F Thinking  in the future of OpenVMS running under the Itanium Processor (IPF)o9 I  belive  we should ask for  new features/resources now:e  H a) Compaq must develop at least  one model of Itanium notebook with the=  - possibility to run OpenVMS (new "Alphabook");t  D b) I will insist in the LAN Console for Itanium servers. Just ask HP (Itanium partner)SF how they developed their LAN Console board. If they can manage the GSP	 remotely,"9 shouldnt be difficult for Compaq put SRM in the same way;u  H c) An USB or Firewire  board to connect  other devices: scanners, modem= s, video, etc ...  H d) Creating a new tool to develop device drivers for OpenVMS using Visu= al	 Interdev.a
 "skeleton"  H e) A new graphical terminal (VT). Nobody wants to run applications unde= rn caracter cells.h/    This terminal should be Citrix / Java based.r  D f) A real  logo for OpenVMS. It is important for marketing purposes. Everybody knowslC the MS "Window" or the Intel Inside logo. May be with Compaq fonts.p  H g) More graphical utilities for OpenVMS administration.  GUIs demonstra= te "evolution".  H h) A better OpenVMS Management Station with much more options to config= urem policies. "Who controls what?"  H i)  What more ? Please ask ... suggest .... invent .... be a little bit=   crazy ! ! !n   Regardst   F=E1bio Cardosot   =A   ------------------------------  . Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 07:49:21 +0200 (MET DST)& From: Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de> Subject: Re: OpenVMS and IA64h6 Message-ID: <200108080549.HAA15196@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>   Hello,  I OpenVMS on IA64 would be the chance for a full support of USB(2). I hope.3F Also that we get a system integrated CD-RW and DVD-Rw capability. AlsoH I hope, that the Afinity program became a two way street and OpenVMS can use Wintel staff.nE Next wish is a VNC server and within X11 integrated VNC client in thet OpenVMS quality.   Regards Rudolf Wingert   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 06:33:14 -0500r9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)n Subject: Re: OpenVMS and IA64 3 Message-ID: <wMkL2B2t3PMu@eisner.encompasserve.org>d  _ In article <200108080549.HAA15196@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>, Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de> writes:  > Hello, > K > OpenVMS on IA64 would be the chance for a full support of USB(2). I hope.sC > Also that we get a system integrated CD-RW and DVD-Rw capability.   F I do not see how IA64 would change the CD situation.  There will be noF different drives available on the market for IA64 than for Alpha.  VMSC Development has not seen it appropriate to provide CD-R directly onh@ VMS, and the input to that decision should be the same for IA64.   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 11:50:36 +0000 (UTC)' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)aB Subject: OT - stupid mail scanning policy - banning PGP signatures+ Message-ID: <9kr92c$7ek$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>r  J Just received this automatic response to a message I posted earlier on the subject of PGP.yL This seems to be one of the most lame brained policies I have seen for ages.8 They are attempting to ban PGP signed messages  - Why ??   "tP To:        david20@alpha1.axp.mdx.ac.uk @ YellowPages                           P cc:                                                                             P bcc:                                                                            P From:      Postmaster@yellgroup.com, ,                                          P                                                                                 P BLOCK PGP Re: Re: PGP on VMS                                                    P                                                                                 P MIMEsweeper ChineseWall                                                         P Server:   CN=QUEGW01/O=YellowPages                                                	 Mail-Info   5 From:           david20@alpha1.axp.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb) % To:             Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com # Date:           07/08/2001 15:32:31k Subject:        Re: PGP on VMSN ------------------------------------------------------------------------------( ---------------------------------------- 'BLOCK PGP' reports:  I While scanning a message for virus infection, it was determined that thisy6 message contained either PGP encryption or signatures.  I This message type is not currently supported and the message has not beens
 delivered.  . Please re-send your message without using PGP.       'BEGIN PGP' found!   Mail has not been delivered!   Mail has been archived!m           [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beL confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message has beenM addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce, distributer or use this transmission.  L Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee is notH intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have received thisF transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.  
 Thank you.  O Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT. Registered.0 in England and Wales, registered number 4205228.  M Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1r@ 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.       "y    N What's even worse is the PGP signature had actually been cut off the posting -G all that was left was that one line from the previous post being quotedn   ie   " @ In article <20010807143240.4660.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <doc_cypher@redh neck.gacracker.org> writes: # >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----f >t "   O I could understand banning PGP encoded messages since that would stop the virus,< scanner working - but banning messages with PGP signatures ?  M Is there really a danger that on Microsoft mailers verifying a PGP signature h2 could kick off a virus embedded in that signature.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 07:03:07 -0500 9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) F Subject: Re: OT - stupid mail scanning policy - banning PGP signatures3 Message-ID: <Kp4h9k+vBfM4@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  U In article <9kr92c$7ek$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb) writes:  > L > Just received this automatic response to a message I posted earlier on the > subject of PGP.rN > This seems to be one of the most lame brained policies I have seen for ages.: > They are attempting to ban PGP signed messages  - Why ??  D Perhaps their software cannot distinguish "signed" from "encrypted".  : Or perhaps they want a guarantee of plausible deniability.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:57:06 -0500*1 From: Robert Alan Byer <byer@mail.ourservers.net>-F Subject: Re: OT - stupid mail scanning policy - banning PGP signatures3 Message-ID: <3B713722.1A570155@mail.ourservers.net>h  
 D.Webb wrote:R > L > Just received this automatic response to a message I posted earlier on the > subject of PGP.BN > This seems to be one of the most lame brained policies I have seen for ages.: > They are attempting to ban PGP signed messages  - Why ?? >u  B Yep, since it was MY message that tripped this I also got the same reply.  E I know that there are alot of companies out there that monitor e-mail.G and when peopel started using PGP to encode messages they placed blocksyE in the e-mail server to prevent this because they wanted to know what  was being sent.l  E Again, the down side is that they usually block ALL PGP messages event1 signed ones because it can't tell the difference.   F Basically you're probalby looking at an attempt to make damm sure thatH something they don't want to get out via e-amil like data etc is gettingF out and that the e-mail system is being used for only proper purposes. (i.e. anal department manager)  F Since it said that the message was "archived" leads me to believe thatH "someone" goes throught the archived messages to make sure everything isD O.K. (i.e you arn't sending vital company data, kiddie porn etc) and. probably you'll see the message someday, maby.  G I've never heard of any e-mail server trying to execute a PGP signature5C or PGP encoded message so I don't think blocking PGP messages is ans  attempt ot thwart virus attacks.   -- d  @  +------------------+--------------------------+---------------+@  | Robert Alan Byer | byer@mail.ourservers.net | ICQ #65926579 |@  +------------------+--------------------------+---------------+@  | Send an E-mail request to obtain a copy of my PGP key.      |@  +-------------------------------------------------------------+@  | "It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.  It is by |@  |  cans of cola the thoughts aquire speed, the hands aquire   |@  |  shakes, the shakes become a warning.  It is by caffeine    |@  |  alone I set my mind in motion."                            |@  +-------------------------------------------------------------+   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:32:31 +0000 (UTC)' From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)f Subject: Re: PGP on VMS + Message-ID: <9kp1mf$es7$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>   k In article <20010807143240.4660.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <doc_cypher@redneck.gacracker.org> writes: # >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----< >e= >On Mon, 06 Aug 2001, "john nixon" <jnixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote:7N >>I have been asked if we can load PGP on VAX or Alpha VMS.  My first responseJ >>was "what is PGP" (duh).  The answer I recieved is "Pretty Good Privacy"
 >>encryption.  >>L >>Does anyone know anything about this?  (Am I the only that doesn't?) Is it >>available or useful on VMS?  >aB >PGP for VMS can be found at http://www.pl.pgpi.org/platforms/vms/ > G >Unfortunately, this is version 2.6.3i and no later versions exist. (Ifg= >anyone knows of one and where it can be found, let me know!)  > L >This means that you will be restricted to the RSA algorithm and IDEA cypherG >with MD5 for signatures. (What is often referred to as "legacy" keys).  >y >n >Doc.o >- -- 7 >The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.SL >~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                              http://vmsbox.cjb.net >p  I There is also a version of gnupg which was available from David Mathog atr= http://seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu/pub/SOFTWARE/gnupg1_0_4_vms.zip4  L Looking at http://www.gnupg.org/ the latest version appears to be GNUPG 1.06A - I don't know whether David has created a later version for VMS.e    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 18:28:10 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>" Subject: Re: PGP on VMS ) Message-ID: <3B70171A.2C8A59E2@gtech.com>    john nixon wrote:iN > I have been asked if we can load PGP on VAX or Alpha VMS.  My first responseJ > was "what is PGP" (duh).  The answer I recieved is "Pretty Good Privacy"
 > encryption.t > L > Does anyone know anything about this?  (Am I the only that doesn't?) Is it > available or useful on VMS?   H PGP are the standard for encryption/signing in non-proprietary software.   PGP 2.6.3i builds fine on VMS.  B (newer versions has been infected by all kinds of non-portable GUI stuff)   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 13:23:32 -0500i1 From: Robert Alan Byer <byer@mail.ourservers.net>o Subject: Re: PGP on VMSw2 Message-ID: <3B6FEBD4.8E05726@mail.ourservers.net>  
 D.Webb wrote:p > m > In article <20010807143240.4660.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <doc_cypher@redneck.gacracker.org> writes:-% > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----  > >1? > >On Mon, 06 Aug 2001, "john nixon" <jnixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote:uP > >>I have been asked if we can load PGP on VAX or Alpha VMS.  My first responseL > >>was "what is PGP" (duh).  The answer I recieved is "Pretty Good Privacy" > >>encryption.a > >>N > >>Does anyone know anything about this?  (Am I the only that doesn't?) Is it > >>available or useful on VMS?) > > D > >PGP for VMS can be found at http://www.pl.pgpi.org/platforms/vms/ > > G > >Unfortunately, this is version 2.6.3i and no later versions exist. >tK > There is also a version of gnupg which was available from David Mathog ato? > http://seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu/pub/SOFTWARE/gnupg1_0_4_vms.zip  > N > Looking at http://www.gnupg.org/ the latest version appears to be GNUPG 1.06C > - I don't know whether David has created a later version for VMS.- >-  E I'm working on GNUPG v1.0.6 for OpenVMS using David Mathog's previouso@ work and I'll have it ready hopefully by the end of next week or earlier.  C So far I've included much more testing of the different ciphers andnF signing methods and I'm just hammering out the final documentation and7 tyring to clear up any bugs as they come up in testing.   . I'll post here when I have it all completed :}   -- n  @  +------------------+--------------------------+---------------+@  | Robert Alan Byer | byer@mail.ourservers.net | ICQ #65926579 |@  +------------------+--------------------------+---------------+@  | Send an E-mail request to obtain a copy of my PGP key.      |@  +-------------------------------------------------------------+@  | "It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.  It is by |@  |  cans of cola the thoughts aquire speed, the hands aquire   |@  |  shakes, the shakes become a warning.  It is by caffeine    |@  |  alone I set my mind in motion."                            |@  +-------------------------------------------------------------+   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:40:24 +0000 (UTC)' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)t Subject: Re: PGP on VMSt+ Message-ID: <9kr4uo$5mu$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>h  f In article <3B6FEBD4.8E05726@mail.ourservers.net>, Robert Alan Byer <byer@mail.ourservers.net> writes: >D.Webb wrote: >> Tn >> In article <20010807143240.4660.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <doc_cypher@redneck.gacracker.org> writes: >> tO >> Looking at http://www.gnupg.org/ the latest version appears to be GNUPG 1.06dD >> - I don't know whether David has created a later version for VMS. >> >sF >I'm working on GNUPG v1.0.6 for OpenVMS using David Mathog's previousA >work and I'll have it ready hopefully by the end of next week ori	 >earlier.o >eD >So far I've included much more testing of the different ciphers andG >signing methods and I'm just hammering out the final documentation andr8 >tyring to clear up any bugs as they come up in testing. >h/ >I'll post here when I have it all completed :}p >     ; Thanks for this and all the other software you have ported..   Keep up the good work.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------    Date: 07 Aug 2001 10:12:21 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>lM Subject: Re: Problems installing Hobbyist Version of Vax OpenVMS - Any Ideas?rH Message-ID: <y4k80gz3tm.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  $ I think you might need to WRITEBOOT.   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 03:46:49 -0700e  From: moi_is_me@usa.net (Pierre)O Subject: Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise available = Message-ID: <cdbc7707.0108070246.59e42d8b@posting.google.com>    In my own experience....  J Salaries 40,000-150,000 plus bonus - but treat the bonus as a bonus, maybeI you will get it, maybe you wont. Why the big disparity for the same job ? C depends how much they want you, whether you are citizen/resident ori H1B.  J Contract rates 70-100 ... watch out for Professional day though, euphemismH for working more hours without getting paid for it. From what i can tellB the max companies will pay an agency is around $130/hr - obviously< you get less - much less if the agency can hide/lie to you.   C NYC is expensive .... so commute like the rest of us from NJ, NY oroG CT. Housing is getting expensive in the suburbs, but rented accomdationg5 is available for 800-1200 for two bedroom apartments.a   -Pierre     > ==============================================================` "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3B6F4608.43412FD4@fsi.net>... > Simon Clubley wrote: > > 0 > > On Sun, 05 Aug 2001 04:24:27 GMT, in articleF > > <%T3b7.626$M3.98885@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>, mulp wrote: > > >e? > > >"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message + > > >news:3B6B5773.106C5914@videotron.ca...n > > >> Keith Parris wrote: > > >> >O > > >> > I'm looking for a site which needs high-level VMS expertise, either one( > > >> > a contract or employment basis. > > >>N > > >> NOW *THAT* is depressing. If a guru such as Keith Parris is looking for >  work,O > > >> the oddds of normal people finding VMS work are next to nil. :-( :-( :-(O > > >:-( > > >>P > > >Keith's problem is much like many of the other people with VMS experience -O > > >there is a surplus of people with VMS experience in the places were anyone P > > >rational would want to live.  On the other hand, if you are willing to workO > > >in such "desirable" places as NYC, there are VMS jobs, but given the costsqF > > >of working in such places, the wages are effectively entry level. > > N > > So just what is the VMS employment situation in the various regions of the > > planet ? > 
 > Chicago: > H > OpenVMS - a few large shops who stanchly cling. Some older small VAXes@ > and MicroVAXes survive, but too few to support a job a market. > E > To my (admittedly limited) knowledge, no one has sold a new OpenVMS76 > customer in this market for in excess of four years. > ; > In general: OpenVMS in Chicago should be considered dead.. > G > I've heard rumors about OpenVMS being history in the Twin Cities, MN, F > also. A regular search (once a day for the last three months) of the* > jobs boards seems to support that rumor. > E > Jack and Rose cling to the fan-tail watching the ocean come rapidlyi > toward them...   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 09:10:27 -0700, From: "James Gessling" <jgessling@yahoo.com>O Subject: Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise availablen4 Message-ID: <9kro9k$6addi$1@ID-46415.news.dfncis.de>   >. To buy a house in aG > good suburban town (which has good public schools) will probably costHE > you $300K+ at a minimum, and a minimum of a 45 minute commute which C > itself can cost $150-200+ per month. There are those folks who dotC > commute 2-3 hours EACH WAY every day, who then only need to spendd > about $100K for a house.  L (Above regarding prices in NYC area)  As a resident of the San Francisco BayL Area, all I can say is WOW!, sounds like affordable housing to me.  My houseF would cost more than $600k now with an hour commute at $140 per month.   It's all relative.   Jim    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:46:08 -04001- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>.O Subject: Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise available , Message-ID: <3B716CCD.3DBD6317@videotron.ca>   Patrick Keogh wrote:M > some ways it is an eye opener to see how hard it is to do high availabilityeM > for distributed environments outside VMS land. But what I learnt over thosea" > years is money in the bank today  K The problem is that the HR departments who first scan the CVs don't see the M value of VMS experience and how it can apply to whatever job is available, so C your application is often dismissed because they view you as having  inappropriate experience.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 13:48:19 -0300+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> O Subject: Re: Regional VMS employment status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise available L Message-ID: <OF0B44C876.F1FFBCC9-ON03256AA2.005C3992@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   I agree 100% with you !   K But sometimes the HR want a IBM VM or MVS professional and they call me ! :  -/   Regards    FC    Z                                                                                           Z                     JF Mezei                                                              Z                     <jfmezei.spamnot@vid        Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com             Z                     eotron.ca>                  cc:                                       Z                                                 Assunto:     Re: Regional VMS employment  Z                     08/08/2001 13:46            status ?, was: Re: VMS expertise          Z                     Responder a JF Mezei        available                                 Z                                                                                           Z                                                                                                    Patrick Keogh wrote:@ > some ways it is an eye opener to see how hard it is to do high availabilityG > for distributed environments outside VMS land. But what I learnt overe thosed" > years is money in the bank today  K The problem is that the HR departments who first scan the CVs don't see theeJ value of VMS experience and how it can apply to whatever job is available, soC your application is often dismissed because they view you as havings inappropriate experience.L   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:53:28 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>P. Subject: Re: REQ: VMS Baseball Cap (Help Sue?)$ Message-ID: <3b70479f$1@news.si.com>  H >>    I have (had) one of those great VMS caps and it self-destructed inH >> a coin-op washing machine.  Can someone give me a pointer as to whereI >> to get another? (Sue?)  I got the original from a Compaq VMS team that ! >> came to our company.   Thanks!6 >mL >http://www.e-softwarefactory.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=30&Product_ID=215810
 &CATID=194  * So, I tried this URL.  This is what I get:< This site is only accessible through the link pages found at7 WWW.OPENVMS.COMPAQ.COM or WWW.OPENVMS.DIGITAL.COM (app)G --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comrA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comi= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevente< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 20:14:53 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman). Subject: Re: REQ: VMS Baseball Cap (Help Sue?)2 Message-ID: <1%Xb7.693$Yx2.15925@news.cpqcorp.net>  b In article <3b70479f$1@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:I :>>    I have (had) one of those great VMS caps and it self-destructed inhI :>> a coin-op washing machine.  Can someone give me a pointer as to where J :>> to get another? (Sue?)  I got the original from a Compaq VMS team that" :>> came to our company.   Thanks! :>M :>http://www.e-softwarefactory.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=30&Product_ID=2158101 :&CATID=1940 : + :So, I tried this URL.  This is what I get:n= :This site is only accessible through the link pages found atG8 :WWW.OPENVMS.COMPAQ.COM or WWW.OPENVMS.DIGITAL.COM (app)  D   Connect to www.openvms.compaq.com, select the "portal" link on theD   upper left of the page, then select the estore link (bottom right,F   IIRC).  Yes, you do need to access the store via the Compaq website.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:01:47 -0400i; From: Robert DiRosario <robert.j.dirosario.1@gsfc.nasa.gov>o8 Subject: Source for non-standard DEC 15 Amp power cords?- Message-ID: <3B71626B.5BB4690E@gsfc.nasa.gov>m  F Where can I get the non-standard 15 Amp 120V power cords that DEC usedF on things like the VAX 4000 systems in the BA-440 enclosure or the DEC Alpha 3000/900?    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 18:18:04 +0100e$ From: ChrisQ <quattro@aerosys.co.uk>< Subject: Re: Source for non-standard DEC 15 Amp power cords?- Message-ID: <3B71744C.6F77D90B@aerosys.co.uk>i   Robert DiRosario wrote:y > H > Where can I get the non-standard 15 Amp 120V power cords that DEC usedH > on things like the VAX 4000 systems in the BA-440 enclosure or the DEC > Alpha 3000/900?s   Robert,s  R I think what you want is the IEC "hot condition" plug lead set. These are like theW standard IEC plugs, but have a notch along the length of the flat side and are rated at|4 10a, not 5 as per the standard un-notched cord set.   P Here in europe they are fitted to electric kettles etc, which is probably no use& whatsoever if you are in the US ;-)...   Chris-   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:59:33 -0400|- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>h= Subject: Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium)t, Message-ID: <3B701E73.C6AF0ED3@videotron.ca>   Rudolf Wingert wrote: I > (normal users), there should be a GUI like the windows GUI. Within this-K > GUI (may be X11) the user can select the printer, click on the properties0M > and can enable the features he want and the printer have. E.g: I would likes7 > to print on the LN20 with the highresolution option. 0  M If you look on the MAC, the basic printer driver is fairly simple in terms ofoC the options it allows you to choose. It is the applications such asuJ page-maker, freehand, illustrator, quark ,photoshop which provide you withH many additional features including some printer specific ones (since the# application has access to the PPD).t  N And you'll note that in most cases, these printer specifc features are used byT the application as it generates the postscript which is then spooled to the printer.  L DCPS does two things from what I understand: it will convert from one formatF to postcript (eg: text), in which case, you have access to some of the* converter's options through the "/PARAM=".I And when you submit postcript, you have the option to add some additionalhN prologue supplied by DCPS (such as code that changes orientation, does n-layupN on a single page etc), but I do not beleive that DCPS will go in your code and
 modify it.  J When you print with sophisticated potscript software such as freehand, theM postscript is generated according to the printer's characteristics, includingqM the selected printer resolution (halftone, screen angle etc settings) as wellnK as various printer stuff such as Page Protect (for the DECLASERS). And whenDK you choose stuff such as emulsion down/up, negative/positive etc, it is the 7 application which generates postscript code to do that.-  G In the context of VMS, I guess that DCPS could supply a set of standard-K libraries which would give an application access to the PPD in effect for aDK certain print queue and then let the application generate the code it wantsf with the options it wants.  J Note that DECWRITE does provide a certain number of options (probably veryK standard postscript and not reall;y dependent on the actual printer type inbI use at the moment). ALL-IN-1's printer formetter does make use of its ownSK libraries that determine printer charactetistics and does provide character.L cell menus with lots of options, but I do not beleive that ALL-IN-1 looks at0 the PPD to interpret the printer's capabilities.  L However, you can setup a printer type where you provide lots of options, andF selecting that one printer type when you print will give you all thoseL options. Again, the code is generated by the application (All-IN-1) and thenM queued to print. And the print jobs that are generated will generally have nogI DCPS optiosn per say since the postscript code that was generated already * contains the options that the user wanted.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 14:58:51 -0400S2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)= Subject: Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium)aL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011458520001@user-2ive6lk.dialup.mindspring.com>  5 In article <3B701E73.C6AF0ED3@videotron.ca>, JF Mezeif% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:p   > Rudolf Wingert wrote: K > > (normal users), there should be a GUI like the windows GUI. Within thishM > > GUI (may be X11) the user can select the printer, click on the propertiespO > > and can enable the features he want and the printer have. E.g: I would like:9 > > to print on the LN20 with the highresolution option. 6 > O > If you look on the MAC, the basic printer driver is fairly simple in terms ofkE > the options it allows you to choose. It is the applications such asdL > page-maker, freehand, illustrator, quark ,photoshop which provide you withJ > many additional features including some printer specific ones (since the% > application has access to the PPD).d  E That's not the way printers work on our Macs.  The postscript printer G dialog box is almost identical in every application.  Some applications-D add 1 additional panel to the stuff provided by the standard driver.   -- y Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com-   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 15:05:13 -0500 9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)+= Subject: Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium) 3 Message-ID: <ABRZORnniHEB@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <rdeininger-0708011458520001@user-2ive6lk.dialup.mindspring.com>, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:e7 > In article <3B701E73.C6AF0ED3@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei ' > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:- >  >> Rudolf Wingert wrote:L >> > (normal users), there should be a GUI like the windows GUI. Within thisN >> > GUI (may be X11) the user can select the printer, click on the propertiesP >> > and can enable the features he want and the printer have. E.g: I would like: >> > to print on the LN20 with the highresolution option.  >> iP >> If you look on the MAC, the basic printer driver is fairly simple in terms ofF >> the options it allows you to choose. It is the applications such asM >> page-maker, freehand, illustrator, quark ,photoshop which provide you withIK >> many additional features including some printer specific ones (since thew& >> application has access to the PPD). > G > That's not the way printers work on our Macs.  The postscript printerfI > dialog box is almost identical in every application.  Some applicationstF > add 1 additional panel to the stuff provided by the standard driver.  @ On my Macintosh print dialogue boxes from all applications offer3 device-specific control of LaserJet 5SiMX features.a   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 16:14:29 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>n= Subject: Re: Suggested DCPS features (was OpenVMS  + Itanium)-$ Message-ID: <3b704c8c$1@news.si.com>  L >It should be possible to use the printer feature in the normal way via DCPSK >for the Guru's or people who knows all the printer features. For all otherA< >(normal users), there should be a GUI like the windows GUI.  H That's been available since DECwindows first came out.  It's the "print"I widget.  Just click on any DECwindows "File" menu and you'll see it.  You_L can specify anything there that the PRINT command supports, including any of4 the /PARAMETERS that any specific symbiont supports. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comaA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comy= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventt< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 09:47:50 +0100t0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>  Subject: Re: Sun keep 'em coming* Message-ID: <3B6FAB36.9988367A@uk.sun.com>   Arne Vajh=F8j wrote: > =n   > wanderer wrote: J > > Just a thought, what if an independent company would buy the rights t= onJ > > VMS and the layered products and port the stuff over to Sun hardware?=  F > > Mentec afterall bought the rights from Dec for the PDP based OS's. > ==   > What is the point ?= > ==  C > SPARC systems have a cache problem. Intel systems can not divide.e > =:    H SPARC systems had a cache problem, Intel used not to be able to divide =  B and Alphas used to overheat and brew up in a sometimes spectacular> way as one of the insurance companies in the UK found to their cost.a   No big difference IMHO.  > No big difference IMHO.3 > =5   > Arne   -- =   Andrew Harrisonr Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:07:39 +0200e= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>*  Subject: Re: Sun keep 'em coming) Message-ID: <3B6FE81B.B252767D@gtech.com>    andrew harrison wrote: > Arne Vajhj wrote: > > wanderer wrote:-L > > > Just a thought, what if an independent company would buy the rights toK > > > VMS and the layered products and port the stuff over to Sun hardware?eH > > > Mentec afterall bought the rights from Dec for the PDP based OS's. > >  > > What is the point ?l > >tE > > SPARC systems have a cache problem. Intel systems can not divide.  > H > SPARC systems had a cache problem, Intel used not to be able to divideD > and Alphas used to overheat and brew up in a sometimes spectacular@ > way as one of the insurance companies in the UK found to their > cost.  >  > No big difference IMHO.i   Oh yes.d   Big difference.n  ; SPARC and Intel were lots of systems. The problems has been ) public acknowledged from very high level.o  @ The Alpha story you bring up is an unsubstantiated story brougth up by a SUN emploeyee.   That is a big difference !   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:10:04 +0200n= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>r Subject: Re: SYBASE on VMS) Message-ID: <3B6FE8AC.56490B82@gtech.com>o   Jakob Erber wrote:K > Sybase will soon stop its support for its DB product on OpenVMS. Is there 7 > anybody out there, who is also effected by this step?9   Oh yes !   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 09:20:36 -0300+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>n Subject: Re: SYBASE on VMSL Message-ID: <OF2785CEFB.37FFE864-ON03256AA2.0043B439@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   People,d  H What is the most promisor database running under OpenVMS ? Intersystems= 'o
 Cach=E9    ??o So migrate to it ...   Regards1   FC    H                                                                        =             =20lH                     Arne Vajh=F8j                                      =               =20sH                     <arne.vajhoej@        Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com=             =20 H                     gtech.com>            cc:                          =             =20 H                                           Assunto:     Re: SYBASE on VM= S           =206H                     07/08/2001                                         =             =20yH                     10:10                                              =             =20cH                     Responder a                                        =             =20hH                     Arne Vajh=F8j                                      =               =20aH                                                                        =             =20aH                                                                        =             =20v         Jakob Erber wrote:H > Sybase will soon stop its support for its DB product on OpenVMS. Is t= here7 > anybody out there, who is also effected by this step?2   Oh yes !   Arne     =f   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 13:38:11 GMTl5 From: koehler@bessta.gsfc.nasa.aspm.gov (Bob Koehler)sB Subject: Re: TCPware v5.5-3: file size change during FTP transfer?/ Message-ID: <9krfc3$8mi$1@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov>   m In article <9f261edc.0108071241.56448493@posting.google.com>, tessier-ashpool@usa.net (Chris Bardell) writes:  > F >Why the discrepancy in the original file size (3200 bytes) versus the >amount transferred (2992)?  > / >The file is ASCII data, with these attributes:   G This is probably not the same issue, but for every client and server weoH tried, including some we wrote ourselves, ASCII file transfer to WindowsH results in an extra blank line appended to the end of the file.  Windows< has odd ideas about needing end of record after end of file.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporation = GSFC Code 582 Flight Software   | Federal Sector, Civil Group I                                 | please remove any ".aspm" when replying    ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 13:41:22 -0700 - From: tessier-ashpool@usa.net (Chris Bardell)y> Subject: TCPware v5.5-3: file size change during FTP transfer?= Message-ID: <9f261edc.0108071241.56448493@posting.google.com>   & Yeah, I know this sounds a little odd.  D Here's an extract from an FTP logfile. The server is running OpenVMSE Alpha v7.2-1, with TCPware v5.5-3. The client is a PC running CuteFTPt8 (although this seems to happen across multiple clients).  B <<<150 Opening data connection for DISKnn:[BLAH]FILE.DAT;123 (3200
 bytes).>>>  D The transfer then takes place, but appears to send fewer characters, eg:n  > <<<226 Closing data connection. 2992 (8) bytes transferred.>>>  E Why the discrepancy in the original file size (3200 bytes) versus the> amount transferred (2992)?  . The file is ASCII data, with these attributes:1 Record format:      Fixed length 128 byte recordst4 Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control  C NB: this is NOT a pedantic question; this has caused some difficult6) problems for an organisation I deal with./  ? Sounds like some sort of optimisation or compression (?), but IhC basically wanna switch it off! AFAIK, the previous version (v5.4-3)eB did not do this. I've checked the manuals, website, Usenet - still. can't find an answer. I'm aware of the logical> TCPWARE_FTP_DONT_REPORT_FILESIZE but this doesn't appear to be directly relevant.  = If anyone can offer any help or suggestions, I'd be extremelyiC grateful. Also please forgive is this is a dumb-ass question or I'm " missing something obvious. Thanks.  
 Chris Bardello UK   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 22:27:21 GMT4- From: goathunter@goatley.com (Hunter Goatley)HB Subject: Re: TCPware v5.5-3: file size change during FTP transfer?0 Message-ID: <3b706a9c.69113409@news.process.com>  L On 7 Aug 2001 13:41:22 -0700, tessier-ashpool@usa.net (Chris Bardell) wrote:  F >Why the discrepancy in the original file size (3200 bytes) versus the >amount transferred (2992)?n > F Because the first number of bytes displayed is only an estimate of theF number of bytes.  An accurate count can't really be derived (dependingD on the file type) without opening and reading the entire file, so anG estimate is presented.  The amount transferred was actually 2992 bytes.d   >I'm aware of the logicalt? >TCPWARE_FTP_DONT_REPORT_FILESIZE but this doesn't appear to beG >directly relevant.. > A Actually, that's the solution to this: turn off the displaying of./ the file size if it's causing problems for you.t   Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/d9 goathunter@goatley.com     http://www.goatley.com/hunter/-   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 16:05:20 GMT & From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com>) Subject: Terry Shannon Tech Talk on Tru64-8 Message-ID: <4lUb7.3011$Gr5.488940@typhoon2.gnilink.net>  I This is the third in a series of "Tech Talks" by Terry Shannon. This Techd* Talk will be on The Truth about Tru64 UNIX  9 Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?t  A Compaq's June 25 IPF Consolidation announcement has some profound F implications for the Compaq user community, but it's not all bad news.I Seemingly overlooked in the IPF announcement were a number of Good ThingsaF for the Tru64 UNIX constituency. Here's a quick look at what's new and improved on the Tru64 front...   Any Port in a Storm?  K Compaq's decision to abdicate the Alpha architecture upon the completion of.D the final spin of the EV7 processor came as a surprise to just aboutD everyone, but Compaq's UNIX group is ideally suited to deal with theL architectural change of venue. In fact, SKC believes that Tru64 UNIX will beK the primary beneficiary of the architectural transition. Tru64 UNIX VP KentCK Ferson dedicated one third of his development team to the Itanium ProcessordJ Family (IPF) port on the day the decision was announced, and when it comesJ to architectural porting, Compaq's UNIX contingent definitely has a leg up" on its OpenVMS and NSK colleagues.  J Longtime readers of Shannon Knows Compaq, not to mention longtime studentsH of Compaq UNIX history, will recall that Compaq successfully executed anK initial Tru64 to IA-64 port several years ago under the Bravo Initiative. AeI joint venture between Compaq, Sequent, and other industry players,  Bravo @ was envisioned as an IA64 UNIX implementation that leveraged theD capabilities of Tru64 UNIX together with NUMA capabilities and other. enhancements borrowed from Sequent's Dynix OS.  K Sequent subsequently elected to embrace IBM's Project Monterey UNIX effort,aK and the Oregon firm ultimately was acquired by IBM. Recognizing the limited0E appeal of an IA64 UNIX port that was supported by just one mainstream D vendor, Compaq put the Bravo code up on the shelf even though the OS) successfully booted on a Merced emulator.u   The Consolidation Cometh  J Tru64 has made some very  significant advances in clustering, scalability,K and single system image support during the intervening era. In fact, CompaqPI on July 16 announced a slew of Tru64 UNIX-related improvements, includingaG Oracle 9i RAC support, Aurema ARM enhancements, support for mixed-speedsL CPUS, online CPU add and remove capabilities, and low-cost clustering. TheseF improvements underscore the eight consecutive quarters of market share( growth posted by Compaq's UNIX business.  K What's next? It doesn't take an NDA to conclude that Compaq's future is IPFtL and Tru64 UNIX, writ large. Absent such an NDA, plenty of conclusions can beH drawn. While porting Tru64 UNIX from Alpha to IPF will involve more thanF taking the Bravo code down from the shelf and booting it on a ProLiantK Blazer system, Compaq can leverage a great deal of its existing developmento6 effort to accelerate the availability of the new port.  L I will be expanding on this and other subjects during the kickoff session onG Sunday night at the Compaq Enterprise Technical Symposium to be held in 5 Anaheim September 8-14. For more details please visitiL http://www.CETS2001.com. I also routinely cover the Compaq cross currents inD my publication "Shannon Knows Compaq". For more details please visit http://www.acersoft.com.   Copyright 2001 Terry C. Shannonh? Not affiliated with or endorsed by Compaq Computer Corporation.iK Mr. Shannon's views are his own and do not necessarily reflect the views ofE Compaq.e  ' Previous "Tech Talks" are available at:a2 http://www.cets2001.com/cets/content/techTalks.jsp   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 12:58:22 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>r$ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun( Message-ID: <9kp6o4$3cm$1@pyrite.mv.net>  2 "Dan O'Reilly" <dano@process.com> wrote in message< news:5.1.0.14.2.20010806144824.02c4cba8@ntbsod.psccos.com..., > At 02:34 PM 8/6/2001, Brian Tillman wrote:. > > >What Capellas's attement really means is:H > > >"We received far fewer complaints than we had expected, so customer > >responseeF > > >was very positive compared to what we had expected" (eg: customer response > >was0 > > >positive compared to what we had expected). > >nI > >Sure. What they probably said was, "You're dropping Alphas?  Sure.  GoeC > >ahead.  We'll be migrating off your platforms real soon anyhow."a CapellasI > >heard the "Sure.  Go ahead" part and took that as a positive response.e > K > Or maybe, just MAYBE, the customers have been wanting VMS on an industry-rI > standard platform all along (like many in this forum have been bitchinge	 > about).C  L People like you keep trying to foist this myth upon the world, but it simplyE doesn't wash.  I defy you to find a single post, ever, in c.o.v. thateK suggested that VMS should be *moved* to another platform (at the expense oftL support of the Alpha platform):  every suggestion I've ever seen has been to@ *expand* the availability of VMS to *include* a second platform.  ; > Given that scenario, Capellas would be telling the truth.a  F As I just explained above, not true.  Nor (even in the absence of suchJ considerations) is there any reason to believe that Compaq's statements inF this area would be any more truthful than its statements about Alpha'sF supposed inability to keep up performance-wise or Alpha's inability toJ return reasonable profits.  Or, of course, in the area of its 'commitment'	 to Alpha.r  J At least in its handling of the DEC products it acquired, Compaq's highestJ management appears to have a pretty consistent record of calculated deceitK and often outright lies.  Why should this statement be considered likely to- be the exception?u   - bill   >  > ------K > +-------------------------------+---------------------------------------+tK > | Dan O'Reilly                  |                                       |eK > | Principal Engineer            |  "Why should I care about posterity?  |aK > | Process Software              |   What's posterity ever done for me?" | K > | http://www.process.com        |                    -- Groucho Marx    |dK > +-------------------------------+---------------------------------------+s >l   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 18:29:47 +0100r% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>r$ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun* Message-ID: <3B70258A.B9FBB333@virgin.net>   Dan O'Reilly wrote:   K > Or maybe, just MAYBE, the customers have been wanting VMS on an industry-tI > standard platform all along (like many in this forum have been bitchingoD > about).  Given that scenario, Capellas would be telling the truth. >,  P I'm really getting pissed off with suppliers telling us 'bitching' users what weP want. I expect it from Compaq but from you as well? Of course I want VMS on IA64O but not with all the accompanying announcements (death of Alpha, layoffs in VMSeO engineering, desupport of most Storageworks products, death of DSN, no VMS IA64 O systems to be sold before 2005 (likely Compaq ship date of systems based on theiP chip due in 2004), transfer of VMS compilers and engineers to Intel, no decision3 from Oracle on a VMS port of RDB/DBMS etc etc etc).-  L We need to see some real positive Compaq actions - not meaningless words andM powerpoint presentations. The first positive I'd like to see is for Compaq to Q announce they will sell VMS on IA64 as soon as it is ready. Current Compaq policy O is that they will not sell VMS/IA64 until the servers based on the 2004 variantwJ of the IA64 are ready (source Richard George Compaq UK Alpha Business UnitA Manager). Even though it could run on current IA64 based servers.o  P Compaq have already proved they will happily drop an OS after spending a fortuneL porting if they think that's easier than releasing it. Or have you forgottenM Windows 2000/Alpha. Any artificial delay in releasing VMS on IA64 smells of atO holding operation to me to keep us confused just long enough to avoid hammerings Compaq right now.    > ------K > +-------------------------------+---------------------------------------+iK > | Dan O'Reilly                  |                                       | K > | Principal Engineer            |  "Why should I care about posterity?  |-K > | Process Software              |   What's posterity ever done for me?" | K > | http://www.process.com        |                    -- Groucho Marx    |6K > +-------------------------------+---------------------------------------+    --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:08:48 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> $ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun( Message-ID: <3B710FB0.86713E3@gtech.com>   Bill Todd wrote:4 > "Dan O'Reilly" <dano@process.com> wrote in message> > news:5.1.0.14.2.20010806144824.02c4cba8@ntbsod.psccos.com...M > > Or maybe, just MAYBE, the customers have been wanting VMS on an industry- K > > standard platform all along (like many in this forum have been bitching  > > about).n > N > People like you keep trying to foist this myth upon the world, but it simplyG > doesn't wash.  I defy you to find a single post, ever, in c.o.v. that-M > suggested that VMS should be *moved* to another platform (at the expense ofoN > support of the Alpha platform):  every suggestion I've ever seen has been toB > *expand* the availability of VMS to *include* a second platform.  B My guess would be that most posters has not explicit stated any of theese.n  G If someone says "I would like to see VMS on Intel" it is pretty open todA be interpreted as "add" or "replace" depending on what the readerl wants.   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:28:05 -0400. From: "Kenneth Randell" <kenr@datametrics.com>$ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun+ Message-ID: <9kpff8$htg$1@bob.news.rcn.net>o  L Sorry to come into this late, but I have seen in a couple of places recentlyJ about the below-mentioned 'desupport of most Storageworks products', but IH must have missed this part of some announcement (judgement?).  Would you" please point me to a URL or other.   Thanks.b   Ken Randell   0 Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message$ news:3B70258A.B9FBB333@virgin.net...   <snip>   >oJ > I'm really getting pissed off with suppliers telling us 'bitching' users what we-J > want. I expect it from Compaq but from you as well? Of course I want VMS on IA64aJ > but not with all the accompanying announcements (death of Alpha, layoffs in VMSL > engineering, desupport of most Storageworks products, death of DSN, no VMS IA64J > systems to be sold before 2005 (likely Compaq ship date of systems based on theI > chip due in 2004), transfer of VMS compilers and engineers to Intel, no  decision5 > from Oracle on a VMS port of RDB/DBMS etc etc etc).a >o   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 06:53:06 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> $ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun( Message-ID: <9kr5mr$976$1@pyrite.mv.net>  7 "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message " news:3B710FB0.86713E3@gtech.com... > Bill Todd wrote:6 > > "Dan O'Reilly" <dano@process.com> wrote in message@ > > news:5.1.0.14.2.20010806144824.02c4cba8@ntbsod.psccos.com...E > > > Or maybe, just MAYBE, the customers have been wanting VMS on ano	 industry-iD > > > standard platform all along (like many in this forum have been bitching
 > > > about).  > > I > > People like you keep trying to foist this myth upon the world, but itS simplyI > > doesn't wash.  I defy you to find a single post, ever, in c.o.v. that L > > suggested that VMS should be *moved* to another platform (at the expense ofH > > support of the Alpha platform):  every suggestion I've ever seen has been to D > > *expand* the availability of VMS to *include* a second platform. > D > My guess would be that most posters has not explicit stated any of	 > theese.  > I > If someone says "I would like to see VMS on Intel" it is pretty open to C > be interpreted as "add" or "replace" depending on what the reader  > wants.  K I think not.  Virtually every request for VMS on Intel was for VMS on IA32,pH which I doubt anyone believes would be a suitable replacement for VMS on Alpha.   - bill   >  > Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 06:43:15 -0500 9 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)p$ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun3 Message-ID: <xI3TUzd2W+hp@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  h In article <3B710FB0.86713E3@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes: > Bill Todd wrote:5 >> "Dan O'Reilly" <dano@process.com> wrote in messagen? >> news:5.1.0.14.2.20010806144824.02c4cba8@ntbsod.psccos.com...nN >> > Or maybe, just MAYBE, the customers have been wanting VMS on an industry-L >> > standard platform all along (like many in this forum have been bitching >> > about). >> eO >> People like you keep trying to foist this myth upon the world, but it simplyeH >> doesn't wash.  I defy you to find a single post, ever, in c.o.v. thatN >> suggested that VMS should be *moved* to another platform (at the expense ofO >> support of the Alpha platform):  every suggestion I've ever seen has been to C >> *expand* the availability of VMS to *include* a second platform.  > D > My guess would be that most posters has not explicit stated any of	 > theese.- > I > If someone says "I would like to see VMS on Intel" it is pretty open tosC > be interpreted as "add" or "replace" depending on what the readeri > wants.   Or what Compaq can afford.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 13:01:20 +0100l% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> $ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun* Message-ID: <3B712A0F.D9FFD0AD@virgin.net>   Kenneth Randell wrote:  N > Sorry to come into this late, but I have seen in a couple of places recentlyL > about the below-mentioned 'desupport of most Storageworks products', but IJ > must have missed this part of some announcement (judgement?).  Would you$ > please point me to a URL or other. >e  O The letter went out to UK customers a couple of weeks ago. I'm on vacation this P week but have asked a colleague to rake it out, scan it in and email it to a few folks. I'll add your name. --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:39:04 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>c$ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun, Message-ID: <3B716B26.40A467A5@videotron.ca>   Bill Todd wrote:M > I think not.  Virtually every request for VMS on Intel was for VMS on IA32,3J > which I doubt anyone believes would be a suitable replacement for VMS on > Alpha.  M I think that it is also important to look at the era where such requests were'L being made. Just because some customers wanted a sign from Digital back thenI that it wanted VMS back on the desktop doesn't mean that they still want.   L Consider that the remaining customers that Compaq wants to keep don't reallyM care about VMS on the desktop, they care about large clusters of servers. Thet, need to go to IA32 for those is next to nil.  H *IF* the remaining large VMS customers (the ones that Compaq cares aboutN keeping) run very important critical applications on their large mega cluster,M it is doubtful that they are depending on software written by some guy in hisiG basement and instead rely on the big guys such as Oracle, CA or inhouse L software.  And due to the critical nature of such application, they are alsoH less likely to add many small apps on that cluster that might jeoperdize system availability.  I As a result, those customers Compaq cares about probably don't want smallsE applications for their big VMS machines and thus don't care if VMS is_? available at the low end to spur small developpers into action.t  F Note that I strongly disagree with that philosophy, but I am trying to+ understand the way that Compaq is thinking.y   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 12:53:59 -0400s- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>o$ Subject: Re: Third postcard from Sun, Message-ID: <3B716EA4.40382F33@videotron.ca>   Bill Todd wrote:K > Given what dropping Alpha is likely to cost Compaq over the 3 years or sosL > before the port generates a single penny of compensating revenue (not thatM > even at that point the compensation will likely be anything like complete), I > the course upon which Compaq has embarked just about has to be the mosty1 > expensive course it possibly could have chosen n  N I disagree completely. Put yourself in Compaq's shoes. The cost of the port isM probably paid for by the large wad of cash that Intel gave Compaq in excahngeT: for Compaq killing Alpha and sending its remains to Intel.  J Consoder also that Compaq is to use part of that cash (500 million) to buyM companies to grow its services/solutions business by 40% per year. (well thath is their plan anyways).r  N They are "stuck" with VMS, unable to really kill it, so they are spending someJ money to keep it afloat on IA64. But Compaq's actions, press releases, andH financial announcements make it pretty clear that VMS is not a strategicL product for Compaq, and I would guess that the minute that Compaq makes moreN money with its servives/solutions portion, they will care even less about VMS.  L Right now, I suspect that a significant portion of their service profits are< as the result of VMS customers. But if they develop NT basedM solutions/software, it is then likely that the services will start to sell NT F related support services. My guess is that their plan is to wein theirL services division from VMS and make it grow on NT based solutions to a point9 where the loss of VMS services won't be that significant.     M The killing of Alpha was just a strategic decision that will enable Compaq to A go where it wants to go today. It has nothing to do about Alpha'sr' technological superiority or costs etc.n   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Aug 2001 07:19:35 -0700r+ From: luke_tucker@yahoo.co.uk (Luke Tucker)e* Subject: Variable length records - example= Message-ID: <3480211c.0108080619.5fba4110@posting.google.com>e  ? I've been scouring the internet in search of a basic example ofnE setting up a variable length record file using FAB$B_RFM = FAB$C_VAR.lB I am working on a system (written in c) which currently uses fixedF length records that contain an array of parameters. Each record is setD up with a fixed array with the maximum number of parameters in each.D This wastes a huge amount of space so I want to change the system toD work with variable length records. The old fixed length record files! are not required to be converted.t  7 Can anyone point me in the direction of a good example?    Thanks   Luke   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 12:57:05 GMT 5 From: koehler@bessta.gsfc.nasa.aspm.gov (Bob Koehler) F Subject: Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site/ Message-ID: <9kooj1$f82$1@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov>A   >tO >Dear Sue, tell your managers that while it is great news to announce a win fornL >VMS,  they should have just omitted any mention of the word "Alpha" in thatM >announcement. It makes the military look silly for purchasing dead hardware.  >lO >Secondly, the use of "commercial off the shelf hardware" goes against Compaq'sgO >whole "public" decision to dump proprietary Alpha in favour of "off the shelf"  >industry standard Intel crap. >iL >Is Alpha industry standard commercial off-the shelf or not ? If it is, thenM >why kill it ? And if it isn't, then stop describing Alpha as such because itw? >makes Compaq look very silly to flip flop on its own products.t >w  F "Industry standard" is not the same as "commercial off the shelf".  If= the government can go and buy something from a vendor with no F customization, that's "commercial off the shelf".  If everybody in the: industry is doing something, that's "industry standard".    : A brand new Alpha running VMS is commercial off the shelf.  = A refurbished VAX running ULTRIX is commercial off the shelf.D  D Microsoft Word is commercial off the shelf, even if it's running via FX32 on an Alpha.5  F A computer system computing target vectors for submarine based nuclearF missle launches is probably not commercial off the shelf, even if it'sH written in MS Visual BASIC and running on a pure Wintel system bought at	 Comp USA.o  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationt= GSFC Code 582 Flight Software   | Federal Sector, Civil GroupiI                                 | please remove any ".aspm" when replyinga   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 10:27:53 -0400a2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)F Subject: Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web siteL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0708011027550001@user-2ivec1n.dialup.mindspring.com>  B In article <C8Cb7.638$Yx2.15433@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Sue Skonetski"# <susan.skonetski@compaq.com> wrote:n  N > http://money2.go.com/News?newsRef=PRNEWSWIRE/20010806/a3083&ticker=cpq&si=0& > sm=1&sf=0&at=0&symbol=CPQe >  >  > G > Off-the-Shelf Compaq AlphaServer Systems Power Sophisticated Militarye > Airborne Surveillance System     Sue,  J    Please take JF with a grain of salt, and keep posting stuff like this. # Most of us appreciate it, I'm sure.n   -- . Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comt   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:00:13 -04002 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com>F Subject: Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site2 Message-ID: <AUWb7.687$Yx2.15844@news.cpqcorp.net>  2 Compaq did not announce this win the customer did.   sue   = "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com> wrote in messagea, news:C8Cb7.638$Yx2.15433@news.cpqcorp.net... >rL http://money2.go.com/News?newsRef=PRNEWSWIRE/20010806/a3083&ticker=cpq&si=0& > sm=1&sf=0&at=0&symbol=CPQe >c >i >uG > Off-the-Shelf Compaq AlphaServer Systems Power Sophisticated Military- > Airborne Surveillance System >  > Aug 6 2001 14:26PM >  > J > Recent Federal Business Awards Represent Up to $1 Billion Revenue Stream >  >h >h >d > HOUSTON, Aug. 6r >?. > -- An aircraft delivered to Robins Air Force >pI > Base in Warner Robins, Georgia, today is the embodiment of a new era in  > L > airborne surveillance and target acquisition. Northrop Grumman Corporation >-G > (NYSE: NOC) partnered with Compaq Computer Corporation (NYSE: CPQ) tou outfit >0G > its latest super-sophisticated battlefield surveillance aircraft withT >dI > commercial, off-the-shelf computers. While the aircraft being deliveredl > today  > B > is the eleventh in the production series, it is the first to use commercial,t >a6 > off-the-shelf systems for that critical combat role. >t >n >  >bC > Known as Block 20 E-8C Joint Strategic Target Attack Radar System 
 (J-STARS),E > the plane uses 20 Compaq AlphaServer(TM) ES40CV systems running the  OpenVMSxH > operating system. The AlphaServer systems and other systems on J-STARSL > provide accurate, real-time data and analysis about vehicles on the groundK > and slow-moving aircraft for peacekeeping missions and decision-making onI > the battlefield. >dH > "Traditionally, equipment used in the military surveillance and combatL > environments has been highly specialized and highly customized," said RichK > Marcello, vice president and general manager of Compaq's High PerformancesI > Systems division. "The fact that commercially available technology like J > Compaq's OpenVMS-based AlphaServer ES40CV systems can be integrated intoG > those environments is a testament to the performance, reliability andy9 > functionality of Compaq's industry-leading technology."  >iF > "We applaud the initiative to use Compaq's commercial, off-the-shelfK > AlphaServer systems in the J-STARS aircraft," said Ron Ross, president of C > Compaq Federal LLC. "And we're equally pleased that more and morei
 governmentH > agencies are turning to Compaq -- whether they need the mobility of an iPAQK > Pocket PC, innovative Evo desktops or laptop units, market leading CompaqtD > ProLiant(TM) industry-standard servers, or a total services-led IT > enterprise solution."tJ > The announcement by Northrop Grumman of the use of off-the-shelf servers inG > the J-STARS aircraft is another in a series of announcements in which  CompaqH > services and technology are being chosen to serve agencies of the U.S.
 > Government.- > F > This year alone, Compaq has been chosen by more than a dozen federalG > agencies to provide equipment, services or both. The value of FederalxH > contracts awarded to Compaq over the past three months, including some large-K > multi-year agreements, will total more than $1 billion if all options are0H > exercised. Recent Compaq Federal contract awards involve agencies with very > divergent needs and tasks. >rJ > Last week, the National Security Agency (NSA) awarded a 10-year contractD > worth more than $2 billion to a group of more than a dozen partner	 companies0I > including Compaq. The companies have been given the task of modernizingb theaE > technological infrastructure of the NSA, part of which will includeiI > deployment of Compaq equipment to handle various tasks for the nationalt > security watchdog agency.  > L > Earlier this year, the U.S. Postal Service (USPS) signed an agreement withI > Compaq to make Presario Internet PCs and a variety of Internet servicesmL > options available at discounts to more than 800,000 post office employees.I > As a part of the contract, Compaq created a custom portal through whiche9 > postal employees can securely access the USPS intranet.o >xC > The job of upgrading some 32,000 computers in the Social SecurityeK > Administration was awarded to Compaq in April. The $30 million effort putpJ > the company to the test as it required Compaq's Global Services division toE > deploy the units to some 1,000 Social Security and state DisabilityaF > Determination Service locations across the U.S. in only five months. >$ > Company Background >oF > Founded in 1982, Compaq Computer Corporation ("Compaq") is a leading globalL > provider of enterprise technology and solutions. Compaq designs, develops,F > manufactures and markets hardware, software, solutions and services,H > including industry-leading enterprise storage and computing solutions,J > fault- tolerant business-critical solutions, communication products, andH > desktop and portable personal computers that are sold in more than 200C > countries. Information on Compaq and its products and services isy	 available  > at www.compaq.com .n >6A > Compaq and the Compaq logo are trademarks of Compaq Informationh TechnologiesE > Group, L.P. Product names mentioned herein may be trademarks and/orDI > registered trademarks of their respective companies. This press release  maysG > contain forward-looking statements based on current expectations thatgF > involve a number of risks and uncertainties. The potential risks andD > uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially include:I > worsening global economic conditions, increased competitive environmentp andrL > pricing pressures, disruptions related to restructuring actions and delaysL > in the expansion of Compaq's solutions business model. Further informationI > on these factors and other factors that could affect Compaq's financialeJ > results is included in Compaq's Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC)L > filings, including the latest Annual Report on Form 10-K and the Quarterly3 > Report on Form 10-Q, which will be filed shortly.  >n& > MAKE YOUR OPINION COUNT - Click Here >e2 > http://tbutton.prnewswire.com/prn/11690X35275829 >, >t >S >i >y >  >o >'   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:54:22 -0400s- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>oF Subject: Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site, Message-ID: <3B704760.2653E0B5@videotron.ca>   Sue Skonetski wrote: > 4 > Compaq did not announce this win the customer did.  L Then perhaps you (Compaq) should ask customers to stop referring to products; which are on Compaq's announced death list (such as Alpha).    ------------------------------   Date: 7 Aug 2001 20:05:24 GMTe1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)sF Subject: Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site+ Message-ID: <9kphm4$6a3$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>l  , In article <3B704760.2653E0B5@videotron.ca>,0  JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: |> Sue Skonetski wrote:d |> > g7 |> > Compaq did not announce this win the customer did.r |> nO |> Then perhaps you (Compaq) should ask customers to stop referring to products7> |> which are on Compaq's announced death list (such as Alpha).  C Or, perhaps, people here should see this as something positive.  IfoD in fact Compaq has signed a deal to provide Alpha/VMS systems to theE government, unless things in the procurement world have changed a lotnC since I left that world, this is basicly guaranteeing the long term @ life of both the Alpha and VMS as that is usually a requirement.  ? More info on the guts of this deal would be interesting to see.e   bill   -- sJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   i   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 21:35:33 GMT & From: "Ken Farmer" <kfarmer@tru64.org>F Subject: Re: very nice message also room for feedback on this web site= Message-ID: <FaZb7.13921$xj.1938693@typhoon.southeast.rr.com>l  D JF, what were the grid coordinates for your house again?  Those dead0 off-the-shelf ES40's have a present for you.  ;)   Ken    -- Ken Farmer, kfarmer@tru64.orgg Tru64.org, http://www.tru64.orgR( Nothing runs faster than Tru64 on Alpha!    : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3B6EF841.6388EBA4@videotron.ca... > Sue Skonetski wrote:I > > Off-the-Shelf Compaq AlphaServer Systems Power Sophisticated Militaryc  > > Airborne Surveillance System >aB > > airborne surveillance and target acquisition. Northrop Grumman CorporationtI > > (NYSE: NOC) partnered with Compaq Computer Corporation (NYSE: CPQ) too outfitI > > its latest super-sophisticated battlefield surveillance aircraft witha( > > commercial, off-the-shelf computers. >-E > > Known as Block 20 E-8C Joint Strategic Target Attack Radar System1
 (J-STARS),G > > the plane uses 20 Compaq AlphaServer(TM) ES40CV systems running thep OpenVMSr > > operating system.7 >2 >0L > Dear Sue, tell your managers that while it is great news to announce a win foroH > VMS,  they should have just omitted any mention of the word "Alpha" in thatD > announcement. It makes the military look silly for purchasing dead	 hardware.o >oG > Secondly, the use of "commercial off the shelf hardware" goes againstt Compaq'sI > whole "public" decision to dump proprietary Alpha in favour of "off thee shelf" > industry standard Intel crap.d >tH > Is Alpha industry standard commercial off-the shelf or not ? If it is, thenK > why kill it ? And if it isn't, then stop describing Alpha as such becauseo it@ > makes Compaq look very silly to flip flop on its own products.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 15:42:55 +0930c/ From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au>i! Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 experiences?o/ Message-ID: <3B6F86E7.BDBAC4E3@wasd.vsm.com.au>a  B "Beware the Ides of XFC" lest your RMS integrity die an unpleasant death.  F We recently upgraded to 7.3 on two Alpha clusters (7 and 4 systems) asF well as a miscellany of stand-alone systems.  This was in part to reapD the benfits of XFC (which looked promising on the two standalones we3 experimented on - obviously not thoroughly enough).m  C From the outset we noticed (and reported) %XFCACHE-W-DATALOSS OPCOMrD messages.  This (seems) to have resulted in at least one applicationG ACCVIOing.  More recently we noticed RMS index file corruption (ANA/RMShF reporting "Unrecoverable error encountered in structure of file") withA XFC (VIOC) turned on and none with it turned off (same data, samecA application, 2 cycles of investigation).  Without reproducing theoD contents of some two dozen or so emails back and forth with CSC it's6 difficult to be more specific with these descriptions.  D CSC and VMS Engineering are working (feverishly I should imagine) on this.  Expect ECOs shortly.l  D My recommendation would be DO NOT PROCEDE WITH ANY 7.3 UPGRADE until% these issues (at least) are resolved.y  8 Moral of the story; at least wait for Service Pack 1 ;^)   Rob Young wrote: > X > cmcgav@ionet.net wrote in message news:<bbltmt44uv2t2njmqmch61b59d457lnnqm@4ax.com>...G > > On 2 Jul 2001 12:08:23 -0500, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)n
 > > wrote: > >t\ > > >In article <C2256A7D.004AA3C1.00@jklh21.valmet.com>, norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes: > > >> > > >> > > >> Tom,t > > >>K > > >> According to the cover letter for V7.3, V6.2 is _not_ supported in ac > > >> migration-moderW > > >> (or any other mode) with V7.3.  I have been told this is at least partly becausec	 > > >> ofsK > > >> mount hangs with volume shadowing on one of the Field Test releases.a > > >>B > > >> Do you have any experience with this, positive or negative. > > >> > > >oL > > >     Last week I booted an Alpha into a VAX 6.2 cluster.  Alpha runningG > > >     7.2-1 with latest SYS patch (but not the very latest, the onesE > > >     updated Thursday or so?).  Mounted disks not in use, copieduP > > >     those files, that's easy.  But I also mounted and copied all files offP > > >     a VAX based shadowset.  Worked like a charm.  One datapoint does not aP > > >     case make.  Your mileage may vary.  And the Alpha was removed from the' > > >     cluster after this operation.  > > >i% > > >                             Robi > >t > >iH > > Well, we are installing a new DS20E system, and did some simple timeE > > trials with a batch application that does a good mix of reads and- > > writes.- > > = > > The disks were served by an HSG80 dual controller system.u > >k > > HSG caching turned off > >g  > > 7.2-1    No VIOC        6min > > 7.2-1    VIOC cache   4min% > > 7.3      New XFC cache   9min!!!!g > >i > > HSG caching turned onc > >p@ > > 7.2-1   VIOC cache, HSG cache                      2min 1sec? > > 7.3      New XFC cache, HSG cache               2min 20 secn > >sG > > Needless to say we were surprised and disappointed by the results..  > >tI > > Plus the IO's reported by the 7.3 runs were much higher than the IO'ssE > > from the 7.2-1 runs. CPU time and buffered were nearly identical.w > >aB > > Also all drives would only mount under VIOC compatibilty mode. > >dE > > Any ideas? I used the same settings for the 7.3 test as it was ana+ > > upgraded copy of the 7.2-1 system disk.- > ; > There is so much here... first, XFC will do pre-fetching:s > B > http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/73final/6017/6017pro_077.html > G > In an OpenVMS Cluster, different nodes can use different data caches.aF > This allows mixed architecture clusters to benefit from XFC. OpenVMSH > Alpha nodes can use either XFC or VIOC. OpenVMS VAX nodes can use only' > VIOC, as described in Section 18.5.6.n > G > XFC improves I/O performance and contains the following features thatn > are not available with VIOC: >  > Read-ahead caching! > Automatic resizing of the cachee > Larger maximum cache sizep; > No limit on the number of closed files that can be cacheda9 > Control over the maximum size of I/O that can be cachedf8 > Control over whether cache memory is static or dynamic >  > ---e > C > So this tells us all your I/O is random.  Or is it?  When you say  > "cacheH > turned off on the HSG80s", you mean write-back cache?  You didn't turn > offe) > read cache?  When using XFC, what does:  >  > $ analyze/system > SDA> XFC SHOW SUMMARYt > 	 > reveal?a >  > I am peeling through:d > : > http://www.decus.gr.jp/decus99/sessioncd/NOTES/OV166.PDF > G > Slide seventeen shows how you can zoom in on individual files, locateb > theA+ > file id on a directory/full filename.ext;D >  > then in SDA: > F > SDA> XFC SHOW FILE/ID=xxx  ! Converted to hex, see slide for details > G > With both VIOC and XFC, what are your hit rates:  show memory/cache ?e >  > To a another PDF of Ian's: > : > http://www.decus.gr.jp/decus99/sessioncd/NOTES/OV167.PDF > D > look at individual files with less detail, but mostly good enough: > 8 > $ show mem/cache/file=(device:[directory]filename.ext) > 1 > Slide 32 shows that IO latency is less for XFC.t > H > However, on slide 33, we see VIOC outperforming XFC for reads to smallB > files, 1000 block file , 100000 I/Os and VIOC takes 3 minutes 54
 > seconds,! > XFC takes 4 minutes 14 seconds.u > C > The tables are turned drastically in slide 34.  1.5 million block) > file,:C > 300000 I/Os and XFC takes 17 minutes, 36 seconds... VIOC takes 50g	 > minutesn
 > 24 seconds.7 > H > So what is going on?  You have small files, guess #1.  Second guess is > thatG > you somehow aren't doing the same thing.  To report that you had muchp > higher< > I/Os on the 7.3 runs on the face of it doesn't make sense. > H > Outline what you are doing, how you are doing it , size of files , XFC > statsP > before and after, etc. etc.  > H > Basically, not enough to go on.  By the time there is, you may have it	 > figuredp	 > out :-)u >  > Robs   -- t Illegitimis nil carborundum.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 11:27:38 +0000  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com! Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 experiences?S/ Message-ID: <00256AA2.003EF82B.00@quegw01.btyp>R  L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza    M Conversely we have upgraded a number of nodes, also clustered and standalone,i, and have experienced none of these problems.  8 I suppose the real answer to the original question is...   YMMV   ;^D.   Steve S/        C Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> on 08/07/2001 06:12:55 AM1    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)wN From:      Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au>, 7 August 2001, 6:12 a.m.   Re: VMS 7.3 experiences?        B "Beware the Ides of XFC" lest your RMS integrity die an unpleasant death.  F We recently upgraded to 7.3 on two Alpha clusters (7 and 4 systems) asF well as a miscellany of stand-alone systems.  This was in part to reapD the benfits of XFC (which looked promising on the two standalones we3 experimented on - obviously not thoroughly enough).o  C From the outset we noticed (and reported) %XFCACHE-W-DATALOSS OPCOMiD messages.  This (seems) to have resulted in at least one applicationG ACCVIOing.  More recently we noticed RMS index file corruption (ANA/RMS F reporting "Unrecoverable error encountered in structure of file") withA XFC (VIOC) turned on and none with it turned off (same data, same.A application, 2 cycles of investigation).  Without reproducing thetD contents of some two dozen or so emails back and forth with CSC it's6 difficult to be more specific with these descriptions.  D CSC and VMS Engineering are working (feverishly I should imagine) on this.  Expect ECOs shortly.a  D My recommendation would be DO NOT PROCEDE WITH ANY 7.3 UPGRADE until% these issues (at least) are resolved.o  8 Moral of the story; at least wait for Service Pack 1 ;^)   Rob Young wrote: >l# > cmcgav@ionet.net wrote in messageb4 news:<bbltmt44uv2t2njmqmch61b59d457lnnqm@4ax.com>...G > > On 2 Jul 2001 12:08:23 -0500, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)r
 > > wrote: > > 9 > > >In article <C2256A7D.004AA3C1.00@jklh21.valmet.com>,l" norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes: > > >> > > >> > > >> Tom,i > > >>K > > >> According to the cover letter for V7.3, V6.2 is _not_ supported in an > > >> migration-modeCO > > >> (or any other mode) with V7.3.  I have been told this is at least partlyo becausem	 > > >> offK > > >> mount hangs with volume shadowing on one of the Field Test releases.e > > >>B > > >> Do you have any experience with this, positive or negative. > > >> > > >tL > > >     Last week I booted an Alpha into a VAX 6.2 cluster.  Alpha runningG > > >     7.2-1 with latest SYS patch (but not the very latest, the oneCE > > >     updated Thursday or so?).  Mounted disks not in use, copiedeP > > >     those files, that's easy.  But I also mounted and copied all files offP > > >     a VAX based shadowset.  Worked like a charm.  One datapoint does not aP > > >     case make.  Your mileage may vary.  And the Alpha was removed from the' > > >     cluster after this operation.  > > >y% > > >                             Robr > >n > >zH > > Well, we are installing a new DS20E system, and did some simple timeE > > trials with a batch application that does a good mix of reads andn > > writes.  > >-= > > The disks were served by an HSG80 dual controller system.l > >i > > HSG caching turned off > >p  > > 7.2-1    No VIOC        6min > > 7.2-1    VIOC cache   4min% > > 7.3      New XFC cache   9min!!!!e > >o > > HSG caching turned onw > > @ > > 7.2-1   VIOC cache, HSG cache                      2min 1sec? > > 7.3      New XFC cache, HSG cache               2min 20 secn > >aG > > Needless to say we were surprised and disappointed by the results..u > > I > > Plus the IO's reported by the 7.3 runs were much higher than the IO'saE > > from the 7.2-1 runs. CPU time and buffered were nearly identical.  > >lB > > Also all drives would only mount under VIOC compatibilty mode. > > E > > Any ideas? I used the same settings for the 7.3 test as it was anm+ > > upgraded copy of the 7.2-1 system disk.a >0; > There is so much here... first, XFC will do pre-fetching:m > B > http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/73final/6017/6017pro_077.html > G > In an OpenVMS Cluster, different nodes can use different data caches.eF > This allows mixed architecture clusters to benefit from XFC. OpenVMSH > Alpha nodes can use either XFC or VIOC. OpenVMS VAX nodes can use only' > VIOC, as described in Section 18.5.6.  >lG > XFC improves I/O performance and contains the following features thatm > are not available with VIOC: >e > Read-ahead caching! > Automatic resizing of the cache  > Larger maximum cache sizep; > No limit on the number of closed files that can be cachedo9 > Control over the maximum size of I/O that can be cachedl8 > Control over whether cache memory is static or dynamic >s > ---r >eC > So this tells us all your I/O is random.  Or is it?  When you sayu > "cacheH > turned off on the HSG80s", you mean write-back cache?  You didn't turn > offo) > read cache?  When using XFC, what does:s >  > $ analyze/system > SDA> XFC SHOW SUMMARY  >p	 > reveal?p >u > I am peeling through:i >l: > http://www.decus.gr.jp/decus99/sessioncd/NOTES/OV166.PDF >eG > Slide seventeen shows how you can zoom in on individual files, locatea > thet+ > file id on a directory/full filename.ext;i >r > then in SDA: >eF > SDA> XFC SHOW FILE/ID=xxx  ! Converted to hex, see slide for details >nG > With both VIOC and XFC, what are your hit rates:  show memory/cache ?i >  > To a another PDF of Ian's: >r: > http://www.decus.gr.jp/decus99/sessioncd/NOTES/OV167.PDF >fD > look at individual files with less detail, but mostly good enough: >e8 > $ show mem/cache/file=(device:[directory]filename.ext) >t1 > Slide 32 shows that IO latency is less for XFC.  >tH > However, on slide 33, we see VIOC outperforming XFC for reads to smallB > files, 1000 block file , 100000 I/Os and VIOC takes 3 minutes 54
 > seconds,! > XFC takes 4 minutes 14 seconds.i >aC > The tables are turned drastically in slide 34.  1.5 million blockR > file,FC > 300000 I/Os and XFC takes 17 minutes, 36 seconds... VIOC takes 50d	 > minutes 
 > 24 seconds.  >NH > So what is going on?  You have small files, guess #1.  Second guess is > thatG > you somehow aren't doing the same thing.  To report that you had muchu > higher< > I/Os on the 7.3 runs on the face of it doesn't make sense. >aH > Outline what you are doing, how you are doing it , size of files , XFC > stats- > before and after, etc. etc.n >>H > Basically, not enough to go on.  By the time there is, you may have it	 > figured 	 > out :-)s >u > Robq   -- Illegitimis nil carborundum.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 08:16:17 -0500)' From: Chuck McGavern <cmcgav@ionet.net>a! Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 experiences? 8 Message-ID: <r4pvmt8j0bdpe0bvlpl1n9b550c8ospctv@4ax.com>  E On 6 Aug 2001 21:58:25 -0700, robyoung@my-deja.com (Rob Young) wrote:9  W >cmcgav@ionet.net wrote in message news:<bbltmt44uv2t2njmqmch61b59d457lnnqm@4ax.com>...jF >> On 2 Jul 2001 12:08:23 -0500, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)	 >> wrote:  >> o[ >> >In article <C2256A7D.004AA3C1.00@jklh21.valmet.com>, norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:r >> >>  >> >> 
 >> >> Tom, >> >> J >> >> According to the cover letter for V7.3, V6.2 is _not_ supported in a >> >> migration-modeV >> >> (or any other mode) with V7.3.  I have been told this is at least partly because >> >> ofJ >> >> mount hangs with volume shadowing on one of the Field Test releases. >> >> A >> >> Do you have any experience with this, positive or negative.i >> >>  >> >G >> >	Last week I booted an Alpha into a VAX 6.2 cluster.  Alpha running C >> >	7.2-1 with latest SYS patch (but not the very latest, the one h@ >> >	updated Thursday or so?).  Mounted disks not in use, copiedL >> >	those files, that's easy.  But I also mounted and copied all files off L >> >	a VAX based shadowset.  Worked like a charm.  One datapoint does not a L >> >	case make.  Your mileage may vary.  And the Alpha was removed from the " >> >	cluster after this operation. >> > >> >				RobR >> r >> eG >> Well, we are installing a new DS20E system, and did some simple time1D >> trials with a batch application that does a good mix of reads and
 >> writes. >> o< >> The disks were served by an HSG80 dual controller system. >> . >> HSG caching turned offm >> f >> 7.2-1    No VIOC        6min: >> 7.2-1    VIOC cache   4minf( >> 7.3      New XFC cache   9min!!!!     >> e >> HSG caching turned on >>  ? >> 7.2-1   VIOC cache, HSG cache                      2min 1seck> >> 7.3      New XFC cache, HSG cache               2min 20 sec >> cG >> Needless to say we were surprised and disappointed by the results.. l >>  H >> Plus the IO's reported by the 7.3 runs were much higher than the IO'sD >> from the 7.2-1 runs. CPU time and buffered were nearly identical. >> aA >> Also all drives would only mount under VIOC compatibilty mode.  >> mD >> Any ideas? I used the same settings for the 7.3 test as it was an* >> upgraded copy of the 7.2-1 system disk. >S: >There is so much here... first, XFC will do pre-fetching: > A >http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/73final/6017/6017pro_077.html  >lF >In an OpenVMS Cluster, different nodes can use different data caches.E >This allows mixed architecture clusters to benefit from XFC. OpenVMShG >Alpha nodes can use either XFC or VIOC. OpenVMS VAX nodes can use only & >VIOC, as described in Section 18.5.6. >mF >XFC improves I/O performance and contains the following features that >are not available with VIOC:l >  >Read-ahead caching ! >Automatic resizing of the cache   >Larger maximum cache size r; >No limit on the number of closed files that can be cached  9 >Control over the maximum size of I/O that can be cached  8 >Control over whether cache memory is static or dynamic  >f >--- >sB >So this tells us all your I/O is random.  Or is it?  When you say >"cache:G >turned off on the HSG80s", you mean write-back cache?  You didn't turnR >off( >read cache?  When using XFC, what does: >A >$ analyze/systemu >SDA> XFC SHOW SUMMARY >F >reveal? >R >I am peeling through: >a9 >http://www.decus.gr.jp/decus99/sessioncd/NOTES/OV166.PDFt > F >Slide seventeen shows how you can zoom in on individual files, locate >the* >file id on a directory/full filename.ext; >d
 >then in SDA:h >wE >SDA> XFC SHOW FILE/ID=xxx  ! Converted to hex, see slide for details  >rF >With both VIOC and XFC, what are your hit rates:  show memory/cache ? >s >To a another PDF of Ian's:t >i9 >http://www.decus.gr.jp/decus99/sessioncd/NOTES/OV167.PDFt >dC >look at individual files with less detail, but mostly good enough:e >u7 >$ show mem/cache/file=(device:[directory]filename.ext)a >n0 >Slide 32 shows that IO latency is less for XFC. >,G >However, on slide 33, we see VIOC outperforming XFC for reads to smalltA >files, 1000 block file , 100000 I/Os and VIOC takes 3 minutes 54 	 >seconds,i  >XFC takes 4 minutes 14 seconds. > B >The tables are turned drastically in slide 34.  1.5 million block >file,B >300000 I/Os and XFC takes 17 minutes, 36 seconds... VIOC takes 50 >minutes >24 seconds. >sG >So what is going on?  You have small files, guess #1.  Second guess ise >thataF >you somehow aren't doing the same thing.  To report that you had much >highert; >I/Os on the 7.3 runs on the face of it doesn't make sense.2 >:G >Outline what you are doing, how you are doing it , size of files , XFCI >stats >before and after, etc. etc. >lG >Basically, not enough to go on.  By the time there is, you may have itt >figured >out :-) >i >Rob   OK, some more information:  E Application is read only on 4 RMS Indexed files, I-O on 2 RMS indexedmD files, and output on 2 sequential files (report and a history file).. This is running on a stand-alone Alpha system.  E When I said I turned off caching on the HSG I turned ALL caching off,pD read, write, and read-ahead. I did this to neutralize it's impact on
 the tests.  B The job we used for testing reads thru a 300,000 block master fileF sequentially (475,000 records), doing lookups in the 4 read only filesD and then doing a start on the other I-O file, reading 1 or 2 recordsB usually, then rewriting a record in each fo the I-O files. It also4 creates a new sequential record of the changes made.  B This is a real application that we run every day. BTW, it takes anE hour on our VAX 4000-100 and HSD10's. We can't wait to convert to theo Alpha!!   C Using the show memory/cache/dev=xxxx command showed XFC was caching A the files with varying levels of hit rates. The smaller read only E lookup files had high levels of hits as was expected. The master file E that was being read sequentially had a low hit rate, also as would bey	 expected.k  C The fact the XFC is tuned for big files and read ahead is fine with ? me, but if it impacts performance to a 50% time penalty over an!A entirely uncached real world application is not acceptable to me.   G >So what is going on?  You have small files, guess #1.  Second guess isa >that F >you somehow aren't doing the same thing.  To report that you had much >highert; >I/Os on the 7.3 runs on the face of it doesn't make sense.   A The job was an exact re-run every time. We deleted the files fromUE disk, restored them from backup, then re-booted the system to run theoF tests via a batch job with the same responses each time. The direct IO? charged to my application was much higher under XFC and 7.3. Wec; actually, redid the 7.3 test 3 times with the same results..  E To be fair, I should have run the job with out XFC under 7.3 to get a0E base run on it, but I didn't. If this is due to the XFC read-ahead, ItD don't think it should be charged to the application job as it wasn't* responsible for the extra IO's being done.  C I wasn't trying to bash 7.3, I still have high hopes for it.. I was * just providing a look at our first tests..   Chuck McGavern   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 15:00:46 +0000  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com# Subject: VMS Bumper sticker on eBaya/ Message-ID: <00256AA2.00527873.00@quegw01.btyp>     To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:c bcc:& From:      Steve Spires@YELLOWPAGES, ,L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza   VMS Bumper sticker on eBay     URL is;   A http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1262517012h  O Highest bid is $1 so far [dutch auction - 4 stickers in total] and the stickers : look as though they were for the 20th anniversary VAX/VMS.   Steve St     [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beL confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message has beenP addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce, distribute or use this transmission.  L Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee is notH intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have received thisF transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.  
 Thank you.  O Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT. Registerede0 in England and Wales, registered number 4205228.  M Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1V@ 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 11:52:58 -0400 From: "John McDen" <jj@jj.moc> Subject: vmstar questionsn+ Message-ID: <9krnl9$nge$1@bob.news.rcn.net>0   Hello   L Could somebody tell me what does this errors in vmstar means, I really don't understand what this means.?   1. tar: error in SYS$PARSE.1: 2. *** skipped  $2$DUA8: [ARCHIVE.ACADDBA.ABFS]10056.OBJ;1     *** unsupported format.u   Please help me...    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 19:47:02 +0200 , From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> Subject: Re: vmstar questionse& Message-ID: <3B717B15.AD07C48B@gmx.ch>   John McDen wrote:  >  > Helloi > N > Could somebody tell me what does this errors in vmstar means, I really don't > understand what this means.- >  > 1. tar: error in SYS$PARSE.8< > 2. *** skipped  $2$DUA8: [ARCHIVE.ACADDBA.ABFS]10056.OBJ;1 >     *** unsupported format.S >  > Please help me...0  H Let us know first what vmstar is, and anyway this space between the disk* name and the directory doesn't sound good.   D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 19:51:40 +0200p< From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <noone@home.com> Subject: Re: vmstar questions ( Message-ID: <3B717C2C.74679772@home.com>   Hi.M1 (VMSTAR is a port of the "tar" utility from UNIX)A    Is this from /EXTRACT or /LIST ? Does /FORCE work ?   What version are you using ?* (I have : "VMS TAR V3.3-9 (Jan 11 2001)" )   Jan-Erik Sderholm.6   > John McDen wrote:  > > 1. tar: error in SYS$PARSE. > > > 2. *** skipped  $2$DUA8: [ARCHIVE.ACADDBA.ABFS]10056.OBJ;1 > >     *** unsupported format.t   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Aug 2001 23:23:42 -0700-1 From: keithparris_nospam@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)t& Subject: Re: VS3100 & (dead?) ST51080N= Message-ID: <dba3451e.0108062223.508d5c4e@posting.google.com>e  ? I think the previous posters are right on target with regard toT? inappropriate mode page settings related to automatic bad blockt' revectoring, and the tools to fix them.l  = Also, Seagate has a great web-site which allows you access tocE specifications, pinouts, jumper settings, and even entire manuals foreC their drives.  Go to http://www.seagate.com/ and use the "search byc model number" function.iC -------------------------------------------------------------------aC Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org | VMS consulting on:rC Clusters, Disaster Tolerance, Internals, Performance, Storage & I/Oi   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 21:06:41 +0200O, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> Subject: Re: WHO ARE YOU forum? & Message-ID: <3B703C40.7B4B3448@gmx.ch>   Martin Vorlaender wrote: > B > Yes. It's a text adventure thingie by Infocom. And Douglas AdamsA > participated in the making. For some time it was available in a C > compilation called "The Lost Treasures of Infocom". In the secondiH > compilation there also is a Doug Adams adventure called "Bureaucracy".  N I heard that Doug just finished the script of the HHGTTG movie before he died.   See me   D.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 13:26:56 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> D Subject: Re: You Get What You Pay For, a.k.a., There's No Free Lunch( Message-ID: <9kp8dh$56l$1@pyrite.mv.net>  6 "Jerry Leslie" <leslie@clio.rice.edu> wrote in message! news:9knnao$3n0$1@joe.rice.edu... 2 > David J. Dachtera (djesys.nospam@fsi.net) wrote:K > : I get that here on OSR2. I'll leave come back in a couple of hours, trytJ > : open Eudora, Netscape or whatever, and it'll just hang. When I finallyK > : do get a response to the three-fingered-salute, it says that the system E > : is dangerously low on resources (whatever TF *THAT*'s supposed to  > : mean!).  >a > : Micro$hit - Gotta love it! >k@ > "You're riding with Microsoft, the Firestone of the Internet!"  D Hardly fair to Firestone, since only a miniscule percentage of their products are defective.z   - bill   >a6 > --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 08:30:24 +0200 3 From: Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@hda.hydro.com>SE Subject: Re: [OT] Market corrections (was Re: Alpha: an invitation to - Message-ID: <3B6F8B00.AF1B0C6B@hda.hydro.com>O   Stephen Fuld wrote:  > < > "Dave Weatherall" <djweath@attglobal.net> wrote in messageI > > One of my first experiences of purchasing in a large company was over D > > 20 years ago when I needed 2 10M resistors. I can't remember theB > > numbers but by the time it had gone thro' the system, each 25pF > > resistor cost something like 25 quid... Would the company be doingC > > that now? Probably not in the same area, the area requiring 10Mr3 > > resistors would have been out-sourced by now...m > N > Anyone can be stupid. The hope is that the stupid things in private industryE > get weeded out by the competition.  That force doesn't exist in thekM > government.  Of course, if I needed two 25P resistors, I would pay for thempI > out of my pocket rather than put up with the hassle of dealing with thep > purchasing people :-).  H Right, I've done that (with little expectation of ever being reimbursed)" for items up to the USD 250 range.   :-(o   Terjes -- h  - <Terje.Mathisen@hda.hydro.com>; Using self-discipline, see http://www.eiffel.com/discipline @ "almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.438 ************************