1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 29 Aug 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 480       Contents:( RE: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre( Re: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre( RE: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre( Re: 100 million sale for Compaq to SabreF 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will never ship?J Re: 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will never ship?J RE: 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: alpha - ia64 Re: alpha - ia64 Re: alpha - ia64 Re: alpha - ia64 Re: alpha - ia64 Re: alpha - ia64; Announcing Rdb Technical Forums in Sydney and San Francisco  backup woes  Re: backup woes  Re: backup woes ! C language functionality changed? % Re: C language functionality changed? % Re: C language functionality changed? % Re: C language functionality changed?  Compaq alienates top boffins$ Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting$ Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting$ Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting$ Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting, Re: Compaq to add non-MS icons to Windows XP, Re: Compaq to add non-MS icons to Windows XP, Re: Compaq to add non-MS icons to Windows XP. Re: completely off the VMS topics: Bear&Dragon. Re: completely off the VMS topics: Bear&Dragon) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update ) Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update   Correct Abstract for Mark Gorham. CSWS, MOD_PERL - anyone have HELLO.PM working? Re: DCL challenge ! Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives? % Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives? % Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives? % Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives? % Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives? 6 Re: Elsa Gloria Synergy Graphics Controller in my DS10 Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship? Re: EV7 will never ship?  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium Re: Good VMS news # Hobbyist/Private license og DECdoc. A How to quickly replicate a global section on another network node E Re: How to quickly replicate a global section on another network node E Re: How to quickly replicate a global section on another network node * IA-64 Galaxies (was: EV7 will never ship?). Re: IA-64 Galaxies (was: EV7 will never ship?). Re: IA-64 Galaxies (was: EV7 will never ship?)F IA64 support for smaller ISVs (was: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed...)J Re: IA64 support for smaller ISVs (was: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed...); Re: Looking for Digital Serial Number Identication Resource  RE: Mark Twain Promo Re: Mark Twain Promo Re: Mark Twain Promo Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: Nits in Slides9 Re: Nits in Slides (was: Re: The Final Knell Has Sounded)  Re: ODS-5 and parse_style  Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3 Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3 Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3 Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3 Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3P printing problems SYSTEM-F-LINKDISCON, network partner disconnected logical link Re: Some postive points I hope.  Re: Some postive points I hope.  SYS UAF / Password Expiration ! Re: SYS UAF / Password Expiration ! Re: SYS UAF / Password Expiration  Re: Travan drives on OVMS  Re: V5.5-2 Password Recovery, Re: VMS high reliability needed by Air Force8 Re: VMS's Last Stand or Conspiracy/Stupidity Theories...# Re: VMS/Alpha backend for GCC 3.x ? # Re: VMS/Alpha backend for GCC 3.x ? 4 Re: Wailing at Eunuchs (was: Wailing and Moaning...)' Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq? ' Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq? ' Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq? ' Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 08:24:23 -0500 * From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>1 Subject: RE: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre - Message-ID: <0033000033641320000002L002*@MHS>   ? =0AI understand that once upon a time, in a land far, far away, 3 SABRE (or at least parts thereof) *did* run on VMS.   3 Or so the headhunter that tried to recruit me said.    WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET * > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 1:03 AMD > To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET/ > Subject: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre  >  > : > http://www.newswire.ca/releases/August2001/28/c2865.html > = > Tandem replaces some of the Sabre applications that were on 
 > mainframes.  > < > Interesting that Compaq mentions that its migrating its 64 > bit platform to < > IA64 was a positive in this contract since  Tandem doesn't > yet run on 64 bits > (right ?). > 6 > This contract says a lot though about what potential > customers see as a viable 5 > platform.  Tandem is generally much more expensive,  > especially when you need& > lots of horsepower, compared to VMS. > = > I wonder if VMS was even considered by SABRTE and/or Compaq  > for this contract. >=   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:01:03 -0400 5 From: "John Gemignani, Jr." <john@REMOVETHISossc.net> 1 Subject: Re: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre 7 Message-ID: <DK5j7.28979$4b5.757022@news6.giganews.com>   H And I had heard it was originally written in DIBOL, but the language has8 mutated over the years into its very own.  Is this true?   -John   7 "WILLIAM WEBB" <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov> wrote in message ' news:0033000033641320000002L002*@MHS...   < I understand that once upon a time, in a land far, far away,3 SABRE (or at least parts thereof) *did* run on VMS.   3 Or so the headhunter that tried to recruit me said.    WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET * > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 1:03 AMD > To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET/ > Subject: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre  >  > : > http://www.newswire.ca/releases/August2001/28/c2865.html > = > Tandem replaces some of the Sabre applications that were on 
 > mainframes.  > < > Interesting that Compaq mentions that its migrating its 64 > bit platform to < > IA64 was a positive in this contract since  Tandem doesn't > yet run on 64 bits > (right ?). > 6 > This contract says a lot though about what potential > customers see as a viable 5 > platform.  Tandem is generally much more expensive,  > especially when you need& > lots of horsepower, compared to VMS. > = > I wonder if VMS was even considered by SABRTE and/or Compaq  > for this contract. >=   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:17:35 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 1 Subject: RE: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIGECEDDAA.tom@kednos.com>   E Sabre was written in PL/I under some predecessor to MVS running under G Airline Control Program (ACP) which i think was morphed from IMS.  Some F portions of it were ported as I recall to VMS using the PL/I compiler.       > -----Original Message-----< > From: John Gemignani, Jr. [mailto:john@REMOVETHISossc.net]* > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 6:01 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre  >  > J > And I had heard it was originally written in DIBOL, but the language has: > mutated over the years into its very own.  Is this true? >  > -John  > 9 > "WILLIAM WEBB" <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov> wrote in message ) > news:0033000033641320000002L002*@MHS...  > > > I understand that once upon a time, in a land far, far away,5 > SABRE (or at least parts thereof) *did* run on VMS.  > 5 > Or so the headhunter that tried to recruit me said.  >  > WWWebb >  > > -----Original Message-----3 > > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET , > > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 1:03 AMF > > To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET1 > > Subject: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre  > >  > > < > > http://www.newswire.ca/releases/August2001/28/c2865.html > > ? > > Tandem replaces some of the Sabre applications that were on  > > mainframes.  > > > > > Interesting that Compaq mentions that its migrating its 64 > > bit platform to > > > IA64 was a positive in this contract since  Tandem doesn't > > yet run on 64 bits > > (right ?). > > 8 > > This contract says a lot though about what potential > > customers see as a viable 7 > > platform.  Tandem is generally much more expensive,  > > especially when you need( > > lots of horsepower, compared to VMS. > > ? > > I wonder if VMS was even considered by SABRTE and/or Compaq  > > for this contract. > >= >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:31:59 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 1 Subject: Re: 100 million sale for Compaq to Sabre , Message-ID: <3B8D270B.B3B18B63@videotron.ca>   WILLIAM WEBB wrote:  > > > I understand that once upon a time, in a land far, far away,5 > SABRE (or at least parts thereof) *did* run on VMS.   C Nop, they only used some small microvaxes as front ends for certain 6 applications. The main piece was large IBM mainframes.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:31:40 GMT B From: Simon Clubley <simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP>O Subject: 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will never ship? 4 Message-ID: <Mg5j7.2222$T4.17102@www.newsranger.com>  M On 28 Aug 2001 18:27:30 -0400, in article <86itf795wt.fsf@mihalis.net>, Chris 
 Morgan wrote:   9 [Trimmed to comp.os.vms, as it's a VMS specific comment.]    > F >I'm reminded of the Ada95 issue. Back in '94 the big topic on the adaG >newsgroup was "DEC Ada why is it so good". DEC produced the best Ada83 G >compiler bar none. This was another success for their indubitably fine G >software engineering. Their Ada users were thus quite taken aback when G >they just punted and licensed other Ada95 compilers (Rational and then  >GNU Ada as I remember).  B This is a good comparison. I was not using Ada at the time, but myH understanding of the situation was that DEC declined to provide an Ada95J compiler, but instead paid ACT to port GNAT to VMS and that as part of the2 port, ACT added DEC Ada specific features to GNAT.  F So the question now becomes, since DEC went to a third party for Ada95E instead of providing it's own implementation, will Compaq now pay ACT  to port GNAT to IPF/VMS ?   C Are any other languages in the same situation of having third party N implementations instead of DEC continuing to provide it's own implementation ?   Simon.  J PS: And no, I am _not_ offering to pay for a port. :-) [My interest in AdaG is not work related, and so if it's no longer freely available for VMS, 5 I'll just switch to Linux for my Ada-based projects.]    --  ; Simon Clubley, simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP K In the task of removing Microsoft from the marketplace, I have discovered a E truly remarkable plan, but this signature is too small to contain it.    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 08:21:46 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) S Subject: Re: 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will never ship? 3 Message-ID: <x9KcaIYtsIXo@eisner.encompasserve.org>   y In article <Mg5j7.2222$T4.17102@www.newsranger.com>, Simon Clubley <simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP> writes: O > On 28 Aug 2001 18:27:30 -0400, in article <86itf795wt.fsf@mihalis.net>, Chris  > Morgan wrote:  > ; > [Trimmed to comp.os.vms, as it's a VMS specific comment.]  >  >>G >>I'm reminded of the Ada95 issue. Back in '94 the big topic on the ada H >>newsgroup was "DEC Ada why is it so good". DEC produced the best Ada83H >>compiler bar none. This was another success for their indubitably fineH >>software engineering. Their Ada users were thus quite taken aback whenH >>they just punted and licensed other Ada95 compilers (Rational and then >>GNU Ada as I remember).  > D > This is a good comparison. I was not using Ada at the time, but myJ > understanding of the situation was that DEC declined to provide an Ada95L > compiler, but instead paid ACT to port GNAT to VMS and that as part of the4 > port, ACT added DEC Ada specific features to GNAT. > H > So the question now becomes, since DEC went to a third party for Ada95G > instead of providing it's own implementation, will Compaq now pay ACT  > to port GNAT to IPF/VMS ?  > E > Are any other languages in the same situation of having third party P > implementations instead of DEC continuing to provide it's own implementation ?  B One that stands out is PL/I, from Kednos.  That was formerly a DECB product, so it uses the GEM backend on Alpha.  Whether and on whatB terms a GEM backend for IA64 might be made available to Kednos has@ not been discussed in public, but since Tom Linden of Kednos hasC been participating in some of these IA64-VMS discussions on Usenet, : certainly an IA64 version is at least under consideration.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:13:32 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> S Subject: RE: 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will never ship? 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIOECDDDAA.tom@kednos.com>   F Thanks Larry.  We are mostly definitely looking at how to provide PL/IE for IPF.  Our VMS version of the compiler uses GEM; whereas, the Unix A version uses a different backend (no less optimizing I might add)  So we have alternatives.   Tom    > -----Original Message-----6 > From: Larry Kilgallen [mailto:Kilgallen@SpamCop.net]* > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 6:22 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com I > Subject: Re: 3rd party languages funded by Compaq/DEC, was:Re: EV7 will 
 > never ship?  >  > < > In article <Mg5j7.2222$T4.17102@www.newsranger.com>, Simon@ > Clubley <simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP> writes:- > > On 28 Aug 2001 18:27:30 -0400, in article % > <86itf795wt.fsf@mihalis.net>, Chris  > > Morgan wrote:  > > = > > [Trimmed to comp.os.vms, as it's a VMS specific comment.]  > >  > >>I > >>I'm reminded of the Ada95 issue. Back in '94 the big topic on the ada J > >>newsgroup was "DEC Ada why is it so good". DEC produced the best Ada83J > >>compiler bar none. This was another success for their indubitably fineJ > >>software engineering. Their Ada users were thus quite taken aback whenJ > >>they just punted and licensed other Ada95 compilers (Rational and then > >>GNU Ada as I remember).  > > F > > This is a good comparison. I was not using Ada at the time, but myL > > understanding of the situation was that DEC declined to provide an Ada95B > > compiler, but instead paid ACT to port GNAT to VMS and that as
 > part of the 6 > > port, ACT added DEC Ada specific features to GNAT. > > J > > So the question now becomes, since DEC went to a third party for Ada95I > > instead of providing it's own implementation, will Compaq now pay ACTC > > to port GNAT to IPF/VMS ?  > >rG > > Are any other languages in the same situation of having third partyoA > > implementations instead of DEC continuing to provide it's owns > implementation ? > D > One that stands out is PL/I, from Kednos.  That was formerly a DECD > product, so it uses the GEM backend on Alpha.  Whether and on whatD > terms a GEM backend for IA64 might be made available to Kednos hasB > not been discussed in public, but since Tom Linden of Kednos hasE > been participating in some of these IA64-VMS discussions on Usenet, < > certainly an IA64 version is at least under consideration. >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:52:17 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)a Subject: Re: alpha - ia64n0 Message-ID: <00A013E7.FCE8F050@SendSpamHere.ORG>  i In article <yRXi7.159620$Xr6.898841@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "Smitty" <someone@microsoft.com> writes:- >i: >"Peter Watkinson" <peterw@u.genie.co.uk> wrote in message2 >news:3b8c1543.16021359@news.cable.ntlworld.com... >> >> >> Hi, >>H >> One thing that confuses me about the intel swallowup of Alpha is thatD >> with IA64 being EPIC and not RISC and AMD bringing out the Hammer >.D >The EPIC technology used in the IA-64 Itanium's is superior to RISC >architechure.  F Statement such as this are dubious without some facts to support them.E Care to offer some supporting data demonstrating where RISC fails ands EPIC triumphs? --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              J   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbeso   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 14:28:24 +02005 From: Holger Bettag <hobold@informatik.uni-bremen.de>  Subject: Re: alpha - ia64 9 Message-ID: <8x3d6bhwyf.fsf@s61.informatik.uni-bremen.de>     Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> writes:   >  > Peter Watkinson wrote: >  [...]RJ > > or b) could be to produce a brand new RISC cpu maybe 128bits if such a< > > thing is possible to leave the competition (AMD) behind. > D > There is no reason for a 128 bit processor. 64 bit processors wereF > developed for their memory addressing range, not for speed. A 64 bitH > processor is not that much faster as a well designed 32 bit processor. >.G There are uses for 'superwide' registers and data paths: SIMD. SSE is a + popular example; AltiVec is a good example.e     Holger   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:52:41 GMT72 From: "Yousuf Khan" <bbbl67@nospam.yahoo.com.spam> Subject: Re: alpha - ia642= Message-ID: <tA5j7.51070$n75.12288249@news4.rdc1.on.home.com>e  + "Dirk Munk" <munk@home.nl> wrote in messageo! news:3B8C80A2.CAF70964@home.nl...nD > There is no reason for a 128 bit processor. 64 bit processors wereF > developed for their memory addressing range, not for speed. A 64 bitH > processor is not that much faster as a well designed 32 bit processor. >tA > And guess where the enigineers came from who developed the verytL > successfull AMD K7 range ?   Yes, from the same group of people "who could( > not keep up" with the IA64 developers.  L One will note that when the Hammer line comes out from AMD, it's 64-bit modeG will default to 64-bit registers for addressing operands, but to 32-bituJ registers for data operands. Just proves that 64-bit is only good (so far)% for addressing and nothing much more.        Yousuf Khano   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:22:56 +0100i0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> Subject: Re: alpha - ia64 * Message-ID: <3B8CECB0.735057C8@uk.sun.com>   Bill Todd wrote: > 3 > "Smitty" <someone@microsoft.com> wrote in messagei< > news:yRXi7.159620$Xr6.898841@news-server.bigpond.net.au... >  > ...  > G > > The EPIC technology used in the IA-64 Itanium's is superior to RISC' > > architechure.a > M > Thanks:  it's really a relief to have an authoritative source put an end to  > all this speculation.l >   = Now we know where Compaqs assertion that IA64 would be better 9 than Alpha comes from. What a relief, everyone can sleep e< easily and you can stop asking Compaq to explain themselves.   :):):):)    0 I bet you feel a whole lot better now you know !     Regards@   Andrew HarrisonK Enterprise IT Architect3   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:09:13 +0100s* From: Jon Beniston <jbeniston@siroyan.com> Subject: Re: alpha - ia642+ Message-ID: <3B8CF789.4B7E7653@siroyan.com>y   Holger Bettag wrote:  " > Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> writes: >  > >0 > > Peter Watkinson wrote: > >i > [...]sL > > > or b) could be to produce a brand new RISC cpu maybe 128bits if such a> > > > thing is possible to leave the competition (AMD) behind. > >uF > > There is no reason for a 128 bit processor. 64 bit processors wereH > > developed for their memory addressing range, not for speed. A 64 bitJ > > processor is not that much faster as a well designed 32 bit processor. > >rI > There are uses for 'superwide' registers and data paths: SIMD. SSE is ad- > popular example; AltiVec is a good example.I >m
 >   Holger  2 Doesn't the EmotionEngine have a 128-bit datapath?   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:37:58 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: alpha - ia64S3 Message-ID: <DmfJGVf$FU$u@eisner.encompasserve.org>p  ] In article <3B8CECB0.735057C8@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:A >  > Bill Todd wrote: >> i4 >> "Smitty" <someone@microsoft.com> wrote in message= >> news:yRXi7.159620$Xr6.898841@news-server.bigpond.net.au...s >> i >> ... >> vH >> > The EPIC technology used in the IA-64 Itanium's is superior to RISC >> > architechure. >>  N >> Thanks:  it's really a relief to have an authoritative source put an end to >> all this speculation. >> p > ? > Now we know where Compaqs assertion that IA64 would be bettera; > than Alpha comes from. What a relief, everyone can sleep c> > easily and you can stop asking Compaq to explain themselves.  ? Has anyone else noticed what an Alpha fan Andrew has become nowe' that Compaq says their future is IA64 ?-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:36:50 -0400e2 From: norm lastovica <norman.lastovica@oracle.com>D Subject: Announcing Rdb Technical Forums in Sydney and San Francisco* Message-ID: <3B8D2831.68DCDBD9@oracle.com>  L The Oracle Rdb Engineering team is pleased to announce the next offerings ofI the Rdb Technical Forum to be held in Sydney and San Francisco later this K year.  These Forums are offered at no charge and present technical sessionsa? conducted by respected engineers from the Rdb Engineering team.g   Topics covered include  A    * Rdb's support for Compaq's GS series Alpha systems and theirX      OpenVMS Galaxy software    * Rdb 7.1 featuresn)    * Web application development with Rdbe    * Disaster recovery0    * Performance measurement and database tuning    * Database management    * And many more  @ Attending an Rdb Technical Forum is the best way to enhance yourA knowledge of this product and to keep  up-to-date with the latest - enhancements and optimizations in Oracle Rdb.s  K The forum in Sydney will be held on October 8 and 9 at the Oracle office at4       Riverside Corporate Park     4 Julius Avenuea     North Ryde NSW 2113p
     Australiat  B The San Francisco forum will be held on December 1 and 2 at OracleE Headquarters in Redwood Shores, California at the same time as Oracle 
 OpenWorld.  D You can register now for the Sydney forum.  Registration for the SanB Francisco event will open shortly.  For additional information andC on-line registration, visit http://www.oracle.com/rdb/ and click onf Rdb Technical Forums for 2001.   ...   
 Best regards,  Kevin Duffy  Director of Developmento Oracle Rdb Engineering Group   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:55:26 +0100 - From: Martin Hepworth <maxsec@totalise.co.uk>  Subject: backup woes- Message-ID: <3B8CADFE.4040607@totalise.co.uk>A   Hi all   <newbie alert>G Well here I am doing admin on a VMS box when I have used VMS for years.i  F We had a nice script that previous admin's used to backup the machine & everynight (Monday to Friday) at 11pm.  B We had a 'funny' where the box froze so one of the guys here just H powercycled the machine and we lost the backup script - there's nothing H in the batch queue and I can't find the actual script that ran anywhere.  H Can someone guide me through creating a new script that I can submit to * the batch queue so we can get going again.  I I've seen some stuff on the google archives but nothing complete, and my a DCL is very, very rusty.   TVMa   -- Martin   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:45:42 -0400n2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: backup woesL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2908011145430001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>  = In article <3B8CADFE.4040607@totalise.co.uk>, Martin Hepworthf <maxsec@totalise.co.uk> wrote:   > Hi all >  > <newbie alert>I > Well here I am doing admin on a VMS box when I have used VMS for years.o > H > We had a nice script that previous admin's used to backup the machine ( > everynight (Monday to Friday) at 11pm. > D > We had a 'funny' where the box froze so one of the guys here just J > powercycled the machine and we lost the backup script - there's nothing J > in the batch queue and I can't find the actual script that ran anywhere.  J I think you should try a little harder to find the existing command file. I Every environment is different, and an outsider is unlikely to understanddH the needs of your site.  An outsider who tried hard enough to succeed is2 called a "consultant" and should probably be paid.  J I assume the batch file resubmitted itself.  Since it didn't require dailyI attention, your organization has "forgotten" how to restart it.  Unless alH disk died during the 'funny', it's very unlikely the old command file isD really gone.  You just need to find it.  If a disk did die, you have% bigger problems to worry about first.u  I I'd use the DIR and SEARCH commands, and look for backup-related .COM andeI .LOG files in places system managers tend to put stuff -- SYS$MANAGER and J its subdirectories.  Of course, these things could be anywhere.  You mightG also look for top-level directories named BACKUP or similar, on variouss disks.  G You can likely look in the accounting records to find the date and timerG the last successful backup batch job ended, and correlate that with thetJ modification time of a .LOG file.  This will help you be sure you've foundJ the right one. See the ACCOUNTING command.  A log file would be helpful if4 you do have to make a new command file from scratch.  G You can do a BACKUP/LIST of savesets on a good backup tape.  The header J information includes the BACKUP command that was used to make the saveset.  J > Can someone guide me through creating a new script that I can submit to , > the batch queue so we can get going again.  ? I'm going to decline, since anything I come up with will fit myi environment, not yours.o  2 You should know, and post, some basic information:1   The openvms version and platform (alpha or vax)e-   Names of the relevant disk and tape deviceskO   Anything you can say about your specific backup needs (which disks and files,a1     how often, incremental or full backups, etc.)   F Information about command procedures and batch jobs is in the "OpenVMS User's Manual".A  H Complete documentation about BACKUP is is the "OpenVMS System Management Utilities Reference Manual".   On-line docs are here:0    http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/index.html   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.coma   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 17:23:13 +0100P- From: Martin Hepworth <maxsec@totalise.co.uk>V Subject: Re: backup woes- Message-ID: <3B8D16F1.9060604@totalise.co.uk>s   #tF Thanks to all who replied especially Steve Spires who held my hand in  finding the old backup script.    What a nice place the 'net is...   -- Martin     Martin Hepworth wrote:   > Hi all >  > <newbie alert>I > Well here I am doing admin on a VMS box when I have used VMS for years.d > H > We had a nice script that previous admin's used to backup the machine ( > everynight (Monday to Friday) at 11pm. > D > We had a 'funny' where the box froze so one of the guys here just J > powercycled the machine and we lost the backup script - there's nothing J > in the batch queue and I can't find the actual script that ran anywhere. > J > Can someone guide me through creating a new script that I can submit to , > the batch queue so we can get going again. > K > I've seen some stuff on the google archives but nothing complete, and my o > DCL is very, very rusty. >  > TVM/ >  > -- n > Martin >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:49:36 +0100i3 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com>o* Subject: C language functionality changed?3 Message-ID: <3B8CD6D0.339F7710@unnecessary.csc.com>h   All,  D I have a query about the C programming language. Please consider theE following code and also please bear in mind that I am new to C, so if E I've missed something glaringly obvious, feel free to point it out inl$ your usual high spirited manner :-);  " /*  qui.c - does a queue exist? */ #include <stdio.h> #include <quidef.h>  #include <jbcmsgdef.h>   char            queue[32];2 unsigned int    context=0, status, iosb[2], efn=0;   struct  item {   short int   length;-     short int   code;-     int         address;     int         retadr; < }   itemlist[2]={sizeof(queue), QUI$_SEARCH_NAME, &queue, 0,                  0,0};   main() {C7     printf("\nEnter Queue Name: "); scanf("%s",&queue);     K status=sys$getquiw(efn,QUI$_DISPLAY_QUEUE,&context,&itemlist[0],&iosb,0,0);   (     if (!(status & 1)) sys$exit(status);  "     if (iosb[0] == JBC$_NOSUCHQUE)7         printf("\nQueue \'%s\' does not exist",&queue);      else     {m.         if (!(iosb[0] & 1)) sys$exit(iosb[0]);4         else printf("\nQueue \'%s\' exists",&queue);     }  }s  6 Note: I don't have any symbols defined for CC or LINK.  D When you compile this on any of the versions I have available (DEC C V5.7-004 oni9 OpenVMS VAX V7.2 , DEC C V6.0-001 on OpenVMS VAX V7.1 and F Compaq C V6.4-005 on OpenVMS VAX V7.2 ) you get some informational and@ warning messages (CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, CC-W-CVTDIFTYPES) which are generally ignored.  8 Linking gives the normal message about warning messages.  F However, when you run this program, the one produced on DEC C V5.7-004G on OpenVMS VAX V7.2  works fine, the other combinations give the error;i  	 $ run qui    Enter Queue Name: test> %SYSTEM-F-BADCONTEXT, invalid or corrupted context encountered  E Has anyone else come across this or should I try to raise a call withs Compaq?3   Thanks,0   AdeM   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:03:59 -0400R4 From: John Malmberg <Malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq>. Subject: Re: C language functionality changed?4 Message-ID: <3B8CE83F.7040302@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq>   Adrian Birkett wrote:. > All, > F > I have a query about the C programming language. Please consider theG > following code and also please bear in mind that I am new to C, so iflG > I've missed something glaringly obvious, feel free to point it out in0& > your usual high spirited manner :-); > $ > /*  qui.c - does a queue exist? */ > #include <stdio.h> > #include <quidef.h>m > #include <jbcmsgdef.h> >  > char            queue[32];4 > unsigned int    context=0, status, iosb[2], efn=0; >  > struct  item > {   short int   length;  >     short int   code;t >     int         address; >     int         retadr;l> > }   itemlist[2]={sizeof(queue), QUI$_SEARCH_NAME, &queue, 0, >                  0,0}; >  > main() > { 9 >     printf("\nEnter Queue Name: "); scanf("%s",&queue);   B Before logging a call with the CSC, you may want to fix your code.  A You are setting the length field to the maximum size of the arrayL. queue, not the length of the current contents.  @ You are also incorrectly explicitly requesting the address of anC array variable where you should be only passing the array variable.t  A The compiler warnings that you say you are generally ignoring are 7 possibly finding other non-obvious bugs in the program.?   -Johnn Personal Opinion Only/ malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:05:11 +0100h3 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com>l. Subject: Re: C language functionality changed?3 Message-ID: <3B8CF697.78DBF0EC@unnecessary.csc.com>i  H Thanks for the reply, I will address the coding issues. I have, however,C been pointed in the direction of putting NULL or the value 0 in the-@ system call instead of the context reference. This has fixed theG underlying problem of the run-time error. If anybody would care to take6? a little time to explain this, it would be greatly appreciated.e  
 Thanks again,6   Ade@   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:21:22 -0400 % From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>k. Subject: Re: C language functionality changed?/ Message-ID: <toq22b7ga28s66@news.supernews.com>e  H If you're going to pass a context variable, it must be set to -1 to tellC sys$getqui to establish a new context.  You are setting it to zero.e  F The context argument to the sys$getqui call is new.  When you ran yourJ program on a version of VMS that implemented the context argument the callG failed.  When you ran it on a version that didn't implement the contextnI argument, it worked.  However, your post seems to indicate otherwise, are B you sure it works on 7.2?  Or does it work on 7.1 and fail on 7.2?  @ "Adrian Birkett" <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com> wrote in message- news:3B8CF697.78DBF0EC@unnecessary.csc.com...nJ > Thanks for the reply, I will address the coding issues. I have, however,E > been pointed in the direction of putting NULL or the value 0 in theRB > system call instead of the context reference. This has fixed theI > underlying problem of the run-time error. If anybody would care to take:A > a little time to explain this, it would be greatly appreciated.y >1 > Thanks again,  >  > Ades >s   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 06:33:30 -0400a) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> % Subject: Compaq alienates top boffins ; Message-ID: <Xt3j7.30719$Hr2.2333489@news20.bellglobal.com>f  + Does anyone know if this news item is real?   ' http://www.theinquirer.net/27080104.htmd  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,; Ontario, Canada.! http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 08:38:32 -0400 5 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty@qwertysasasdfgh.com>a- Subject: Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting@2 Message-ID: <+eGMO1bC8ZZvVFr==sv2eaQuxGJM@4ax.com>  C On Wed, 29 Aug 2001 02:49:57 GMT, ben_myers@charter.net (Ben Myers)  wrote:  A >Yep, the CEOs and their buddies walk away with all the bucks for G >running underperforming companies.  The stockholders and the employees  >get shafted.  w > F >Check out the $1B paid to the two honchos at Computer Associates overC >the last five years, as the company has slowly been sliding deepertF >into the toilet amid accusations of sharp accounting practices... Ben >Myers > ' >Isn't a free market economy wonderful?   9 It's not perfect, but it sure beats the other options ...e  * <snip remaining previous post for brevity>   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:02:10 -0400o2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)- Subject: Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2908011102110001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>  M In article <3b8c578c.48370535@news.charter.net>, ben_myers@charter.net wrote:i  B > Yep, the CEOs and their buddies walk away with all the bucks forH > running underperforming companies.  The stockholders and the employees > get shafted.   > G > Check out the $1B paid to the two honchos at Computer Associates overuD > the last five years, as the company has slowly been sliding deeperG > into the toilet amid accusations of sharp accounting practices... Benp > Myerst > ( > Isn't a free market economy wonderful?  J Interesting that you chose today, and CA as an example, to take a swipe at the free market economy.  M Today, August 29, 2001, is the stockholders meeting for Computer Assosciates.@  E A huge proxy battle has been underway for a few months.  A faction of-G disgruntled stockholders is attempting to rid the company of several ofn& the "honchos".  The issues seem to be:   Overpayed honchos3 Poor treatment of the customers  Poor treatment of employeesk, Weakening overall performance of the company  G This is not a bunch of stockholders peeved because of bad results for an quarter or two.y  H With any luck, 4 CA executives will be looking for new jobs pretty soon.    F It seems to me, the problem is not the free market economy, but ratherJ shareholders who pay too little attention.  If shareholders expect the BOD> to protect their interests, but few of them ever express theirG displeasure, a company can gradually rot away.  If the shareholders aredJ mainly well-informed and attentive, the BOD is more likely to behave well.  J I wonder if the recent popularity of "day trading" and similar strategies,I as opposed to buy-and-hold investing, is contributing to crappy corporatelF management.  Many of the new sorts of investors know little or nothingD about the firm's business, and don't give a hoot about its long-term health.k   -- m Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 15:14:22 GMT) From: wkb@freebie.xs4all.nl (Wilko Bulte)6- Subject: Re: Compaq staff walk out of meeting>9 Message-ID: <3b8d06cd$0$285$e4fe514c@newszilla.xs4all.nl>4  x In <rdeininger-2908011102110001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com> rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:  N >In article <3b8c578c.48370535@news.charter.net>, ben_myers@charter.net wrote:  C >> Yep, the CEOs and their buddies walk away with all the bucks forfI >> running underperforming companies.  The stockholders and the employeest >> get shafted.  n >> eH >> Check out the $1B paid to the two honchos at Computer Associates overE >> the last five years, as the company has slowly been sliding deeper H >> into the toilet amid accusations of sharp accounting practices... Ben >> Myers >> n) >> Isn't a free market economy wonderful?S  K >Interesting that you chose today, and CA as an example, to take a swipe atn >the free market economy.n  N >Today, August 29, 2001, is the stockholders meeting for Computer Assosciates.  F >A huge proxy battle has been underway for a few months.  A faction ofH >disgruntled stockholders is attempting to rid the company of several of' >the "honchos".  The issues seem to be:u   >Overpayed honchos  >Poor treatment of the customers >Poor treatment of employees- >Weakening overall performance of the companyW  H >This is not a bunch of stockholders peeved because of bad results for a >quarter or two.  I >With any luck, 4 CA executives will be looking for new jobs pretty soon.n  8 Probably with a severance (sp?) package I would expect..     --F |   / o / /  _   	Arnhem, The Netherlands    	email: wilko@FreeBSD.org |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte	   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:04:22 -0400f2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)- Subject: Re: Compaq staff walk out of meetingaL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2908011204230001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>  9 In article <3b8d06cd$0$285$e4fe514c@newszilla.xs4all.nl>,O* wkb@freebie.xs4all.nl (Wilko Bulte) wrote:    eK > >With any luck, 4 CA executives will be looking for new jobs pretty soon.  > : > Probably with a severance (sp?) package I would expect..  F I expect so.  Contractual obligations, you know.  Another symptom of a tame, incompetent BOD.   -- f Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comn   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 06:11:56 -0700- From: afeldman@gfigroup.com (Alan E. Feldman)e5 Subject: Re: Compaq to add non-MS icons to Windows XP3< Message-ID: <af1e4ce6.0108290511.31b4c99@posting.google.com>  e Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message news:<cjcnotsv6892e8b5s0osh6ft2q2frp9f3l@4ax.com>...vH > On 28 Aug 2001 06:28:56 -0700, afeldman@gfigroup.com (Alan E. Feldman) > wrote: [snip]E > >So, if Compaq is effectively just part of MS, why are they putting C > >AOL, Disney, and other icons on their Windows XP desktop when MSb > H > Because AOL and Disney gave Compaq lots of money and because MicrosoftD > just agreed to allow vendors to do this in a minor capitulation to > their anti-trust problems.  @ Allowing vendors to add non-MS icons simply means that MS cannotE legally forbid it. If Compaq's only aim, as some posters claim, is to-F score brownie points with MS, then putting AOL on the desktop is not aB good idea. Yeah, they get lots of money from AOL, Disney, etc; butF they also get lots of money from VMS. OTOH, it does cost a lot less to3 support a desktop icon than it does to support VMS!.  F > >clearly doesn't want any icons but its own? And why did they choose, > >AOL over msn? And why not a VMS icon? ;-) > > A > >I guess they just don't like VMS, period. Supreme bummer. :-((t   Dislcaimer: JMHO   Alan E. Feldmanh afeldman@gfigroup.comt   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:08:55 -0500 3 From: Dave Harrold <DRHarrold.nospam@earthlink.net> 5 Subject: Re: Compaq to add non-MS icons to Windows XPt8 Message-ID: <dntpot8f7pbk85cvvo9o0v61dppb8i5887@4ax.com>  F On 29 Aug 2001 06:11:56 -0700, afeldman@gfigroup.com (Alan E. Feldman) wrote:  I >> Because AOL and Disney gave Compaq lots of money and because MicrosofttE >> just agreed to allow vendors to do this in a minor capitulation toc >> their anti-trust problems.n >hA >Allowing vendors to add non-MS icons simply means that MS cannotfF >legally forbid it. If Compaq's only aim, as some posters claim, is toG >score brownie points with MS, then putting AOL on the desktop is not avC >good idea. Yeah, they get lots of money from AOL, Disney, etc; butfG >they also get lots of money from VMS. OTOH, it does cost a lot less tot4 >support a desktop icon than it does to support VMS!  B Actually, in my cynical opinion, it scores a lot of brownie pointsC with Microsoft.  MS gets to point to that when the anti-trust trialsD resumes and say "See? we aren't a monopoly.  We allow vendors to put% competitors products on the systems."u   Just my (cynical) opinion,   Dave Harrold      V ======================================================================================V Dave Harrold                                          E-Mail: David_Harrold@Aurora.orgL Sr. Software Systems Engineer                         Phone : (414) 647-6204L Aurora Health Care                                    FAX   : (414) 647-4999I 3031 W. Montana Street                                Milwaukee, WI 53234l  X "A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to/ underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools."h   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:40:11 -0400t- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>n5 Subject: Re: Compaq to add non-MS icons to Windows XPo, Message-ID: <3B8D28F7.6DCE30CB@videotron.ca>   "Alan E. Feldman" wrote:B > Allowing vendors to add non-MS icons simply means that MS cannot > legally forbid it.    N No, it means that Gates wanted to take a small token gesture to make MicrosoftH appear to allow/foster competition and help defuse the ongoing threat of antitrust rulings.  N So, Compaq's action to put AOL etc on the desktop  simply helped Microsoft putL its point across that it is a benign company that fosters competition (yeah,	 right !).t   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 13:52:49 GMT= From: jlw@psulias.psu.edu (j.lance wilkinson, (814) 865-1818)P7 Subject: Re: completely off the VMS topics: Bear&Dragon:+ Message-ID: <9mis3h$dhm@r02n01.cac.psu.edu>0  U In article <3B8746EA.80FE6ABB@gmx.ch>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> writes:a1 >In which forum can I ask the following question:c >l> >[start of question to be posted elsewhere. Do not reply here]I >I am currently reading Clancy's The Bear and the Dragon and I would likehD >to know why a diplomat has to be released after being arrested in aB >foreign country where s/he is officially diplomating. Is there anL >international treaty or such on diplomacy and police? Where can it be read?) >[end of question to be posted elsewhere]l > 3 >[end of off the VMS topics question. Reply below] q >e >Thanks, >f >D.h  1 There are more appropriate newsgroups for this:      	alt.books.tom-clancy  	alt.fan.tom-clancya  L Anybody online and reading Clancy's works (or derivations, like the OpCenter: and NetForce series) ought to be at least lurking there...  M +-"Never Underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of mag tapes"--+-N | J.Lance Wilkinson ("Lance")            InterNet:  Lance.Wilkinson@psu.edu | M | Systems Design Specialist - Lead       AT&T:      (814) 865-1818          | M | Library Computing Services             FAX:       (814) 863-3560          |aM | E3 Paterno Library                     "I'd rather be dancing..."         |lM | Penn State University         A host is a host from coast to coast,       |bM | University Park, PA 16802     And no one will talk to a host that's close |*M | <postmaster@psulias.psu.edu>  Unless the host that isn't close            |cM | VMS GopherMeister             Is busy, hung or dead.                      |aM +------"He's dead, Jim. I'll get his tricorder. You take his wallet."-------+ 9                 [apologies to DeForest Kelley, 1920-1999] 3 <A Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu">home page</a> eJ <a Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu/junkdec.htm">junk mail declaration</a>   --	       /"\&#       \ /     ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGNQ!        X        AGAINST HTML MAILt	       / \,   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 19:07:03 +0200_, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>7 Subject: Re: completely off the VMS topics: Bear&Dragono& Message-ID: <3B8D2136.DE3B349B@gmx.ch>  * "j.lance wilkinson, (814) 865-1818" wrote: > N > Anybody online and reading Clancy's works (or derivations, like the OpCenter< > and NetForce series) ought to be at least lurking there... > O > +-"Never Underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of mag tapes"--+0O > | J.Lance Wilkinson ("Lance")            InterNet:  Lance.Wilkinson@psu.edu |PO > | Systems Design Specialist - Lead       AT&T:      (814) 865-1818          |oO > | Library Computing Services             FAX:       (814) 863-3560          |nO > | E3 Paterno Library                     "I'd rather be dancing..."         |iO > | Penn State University         A host is a host from coast to coast,       |TO > | University Park, PA 16802     And no one will talk to a host that's close | O > | <postmaster@psulias.psu.edu>  Unless the host that isn't close            |-O > | VMS GopherMeister             Is busy, hung or dead.                      |MO > +------"He's dead, Jim. I'll get his tricorder. You take his wallet."-------+e; >                 [apologies to DeForest Kelley, 1920-1999]B4 > <A Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu">home page</a>L > <a Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu/junkdec.htm">junk mail declaration</a> >  > -- >       /"\ % >       \ /     ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGNn# >        X        AGAINST HTML MAILn >       / \   @ Anybody online and having read the Netiquette should know that a3 signature should have a maximum of three lines :-))f   D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 02:14:58 -0400 ' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> 2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update( Message-ID: <9mi17p$p29$1@pyrite.mv.net>  1 "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messagez2 news:in%i7.1113$p81.558946@typhoon1.gnilink.net...F > I would strongly suggest the Bill Todd's of this world read the note below -%  / Done (though I can't speak for the rest of me).   J > it confirms that Sun has not been the last word in architectures forever as > some  I Who?  Certainly not me (unless it was one of those other me's and my newscE server never got the post).  All I've suggested is that Sun is one ofyI several other reputable vendors who seem far more trustworthy (even if not) one is 100.000% trustworthy) than Compaq.o   ...f  9 > Killing Alpha is not evidence of dead ending OpenVMS orsL > Tru64 - if killing the chip OpenVMS runs on was proof of death the OpenVMS7 > would be dead today from the death of the VAX chip...d  E Killing Alpha is, however, ample proof that either VMS's future is ofcI relatively little importance to Compaq (since the move definitely weakens D VMS's market) or that Compaq's management is too incompetent to have5 realized this in advance.  Neither seems a good omen.e  H And, of course, the *way* in which Alpha was killed, and the commitmentsE broken in the process, make Compaq a risky bet regardless of what its - present intentions with regard to VMS may be.l  H I've snipped Tim's post that you quoted, though I agree with most of it:H only the most blindly optimistic of Compaq's supporters could have found anything reassuring in it.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 02:17:18 -0400m' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>a2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update( Message-ID: <9mi1c9$p2i$1@pyrite.mv.net>  1 "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messagei2 news:28%i7.1110$p81.555589@typhoon1.gnilink.net... >o4 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message$ > news:9mbdrn$1gn$1@pyrite.mv.net... > >d5 > > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messagee6 > > news:un4i7.1903$Ia1.338158@typhoon1.gnilink.net... > > >  Yes what you sayoH > > > is true if you look at the kernel level but if you have ever dealt withK > > > Microsoft at the applications development level Microsoft is the kingn ofC > > > "just kidding" technical shifts (lies as you would call them)e > >iB > > No, I wouldn't call them lies at all - unless you can point to
 statementsF > > Microsoft has offered (similar to those in the Heil/Lipcon letter)> > > guaranteeing the stability of its development environment. > > I > > There's a big difference between breaking existing applications (even  justI > > to the point where they must be recompiled - if possible - to perform K > > acceptably) and requiring developers to acquire new skills if they want  toG > > upgrade to a new development environment (rather than just continue  usingyH > > their existing development environment, which continues to work just > fine). >lJ > I think it has become fairly clear that you have had little nitty grittyK > hands-on development expereince in these environments.  In fact Microsoft0D > did exactly what you accused Compaq of doing - they broke existingJ > application and impacted proformance.  For example the latest version ofK > MDAC replacing DAO 3.51 with DAO 4.0 out from under existing applicationse > and breaking them...  B I think it has become fairly clear that you should try reading andJ understanding an entire post before responding to part of it:  I addressed6 the kind of situation you describe in a later comment.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 03:24:29 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>c2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update, Message-ID: <3B8C98A7.95584D84@videotron.ca>   Jeff Killeen wrote: H > not dead ended Tru64 or VMS.  The fact is if they execute as plan (andN > without attempting to play license games) the switch from Alpha to IA64 willI > far less painful than the switch Sun  users had to go through when theyC- > switched from BSD SunOS 4.x to Solaris 2.x.r  M But didn't that occur at a time before NT became serious enough to be used ascN an enterprise system, was wasn't this fairly early in Sun's existence compared to what they are today ?  I A painful switch of architecture early in your life without that big of alM customer base isn't as bad as one when you are fully grown with lots and lotsw> of customers, and with a competitingNT trying to kill you off.  H Also, VMS is not very healthy, so asking for that port will just make itK harder to bring it back to health (if that is Compaq's goal, something I doe not personally believe in).e   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 14:59:30 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update; Message-ID: <6vbn14jm37x.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>-  ( "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> writes:  L > Are you suggesting AIX or Linux is as robust and as mature as OpenVMS when4 > it comes to being a solid enterprise class server?  O Of course not. OS/390 and AS/400 are the top contenders. For added portability, ? OS/390 will allow you to run multiple copies of Linux under it.r   	Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:17:39 GMTy& From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update4 Message-ID: <TX5j7.68$jd.73087@typhoon1.gnilink.net>  2 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message" news:9mi17p$p29$1@pyrite.mv.net... >c3 > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messager  ; > > Killing Alpha is not evidence of dead ending OpenVMS ortF > > Tru64 - if killing the chip OpenVMS runs on was proof of death the OpenVMSs9 > > would be dead today from the death of the VAX chip...b >nG > Killing Alpha is, however, ample proof that either VMS's future is ofnK > relatively little importance to Compaq (since the move definitely weakensiF > VMS's market) or that Compaq's management is too incompetent to have7 > realized this in advance.  Neither seems a good omen.0  I In the short term they weaken the market.  In the long term IN MY OPINIONaG if, and only if, they address the five issues below correctly they havelI strengthen it.  Note I said "in my opinion" and at this point that is allp; ANYONE has to offer - opinions.  As with all opinions YMMV.:  C Imagine an IPF OpenVMS or TRU64 system with a really good Win32 API. environment.  J > And, of course, the *way* in which Alpha was killed, and the commitmentsG > broken in the process, make Compaq a risky bet regardless of what itst/ > present intentions with regard to VMS may be.t  L As someone who looks at this from the software, and really doesn't care what< hardware is, I have yet to see Compaq break any commitments.  J I do see that there is a huge potential to break commitments but none yet.   I am watching five issues...  L 1) Will Compaq do the right thing on IPF license transfers for VAX and Alpha. customers.  No games to recover develop costs.  J 2) Will Compaq do the right thing on IPF license pricing?  No games and weL they defaults all questionable decisions in favor of the customer.  The veryF issue that JF raised is also my issue - if takes 2 IPF chips to retainF performance they had better price the licenses so that the cost is theL same - no games with hidden charges because of fractional performance gains.  I 3) Will Compaq guarantee existing application sources will compile on IPFr with no modifications   K 4) Will Compaq provide incentives to the second tier applications providersrJ to port to IPF.  I am hopping to hear words like loaner systems at no cost from Compaq.  % 5) Will Compaq support mixed clusterso  J ...they address those 5 issues the right way and I don't care what chip it runs on.  F If they don't address them the right way I will be joining you in your< comments about Compaq.  In my case I am willing to listen...  + > blindly optimistic of Compaq's supportersr  H Bill you seem to be of the opinion that is someone is not a Compaq haterL they are "blindly optimistic of Compaq's supporters".  In other words a veryH binary situations.  Allow me to suggest that someone might be neutral atI this point a simply awaiting answers.  However it appears for some people,: that if the bulk of the answers are positive it will be...       "You want answers"  "     "You can't handle the answers"  G Someone pointed out to me that you are an ex-DECie - I was not aware ofiF this.  This discussion is not a theoretical discussion for me.  I haveI customers with real code bases and real production systems.  When one has I done platform switches, as I have, one quickly realizes the real pain andoI effort involved.  If Compaq delivers on the business and technical issuesgL doing a platform switch out of spite would be pure madness.  I really wonderK Bill if you today are responsible for a large existing code base that woulde< require significant effort to convert to another platform...   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:44:22 +0000 (UTC) ' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)i2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update+ Message-ID: <9miv45$mm8$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>l  ] In article <TX5j7.68$jd.73087@typhoon1.gnilink.net>, "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> writes:h >p >iD >Imagine an IPF OpenVMS or TRU64 system with a really good Win32 API
 >environment.n >   K Why should Microsoft allow this ? They have scuppered all such attempts in o	 the past.   L The only way this would happen is if Microsoft were forced to fully publish % the API by the US Justice Department.      
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 17:06:06 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update; Message-ID: <6vbae0ij481.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>R  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:g  L > IA64 is not the issue. It is outside of Compaq's jurisdiction and is beingN > built by a company (Intel) with a fairly good track record for supporting an) > architecture once it has been launched.r  M More importantly, IA64 is to Intel what the 747 was to Boeing - if it doesn't> fly, they're sunk.  O > In the end, box makers will succeed based on marketing, cabinet colour/designl= > and price because they will all offer similar performance. i  G No, in this space reliability of the vendor is in first place, and RAS  K features of the hardware come in second place. Everything else is a distanteM third. Heck, the cost of downtime for the server in our (quite small) companya, easily pays for twice the rock-bottom price.  I > VMS will be at a disadvantage because for the same hardware, its added o) > security results in slower performance.t  - 'scuse me? Do you have any evidence for that?    	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 17:12:14 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update; Message-ID: <6vb8zg2j3xt.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:o  K > eg: are the hardware requirements to run VMS on a multi processor box theH# > same as those needed by Windows ?   L Pretty much so. It is even likely that VMS needs less - for instance, being K a 64-bit system, you can support a reasonable amount of memory (i.e., more sF than 4 GB) without the kludges a current Windows system would require.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 17:14:01 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update; Message-ID: <6vb7kvmj3uu.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>F  ' Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> writes:o  @ > Having been recently playing with TOPS-20 again under the simhE > emulator it;'s amazing just how well even TOPS-20 4.1 (around 1978)o@ > stands up against VMS 7.3 from a user interface point of view.  J Honest question: having used TOPS-10, how different is it in this respect,< and where do you see VMS's deficiencies compared to TOPS-20?   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 17:25:15 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update; Message-ID: <6vb4rqqj3c4.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:t  M > Consider the scenario where Compaq has decided that small VMS customers can M > migrate to NT today because applications already exist on NT to match theirbE > needs. So there is no need to work hard to get them to stay on VMS.s  J This is only valid if you assume that such customers would remain Compaq'sD customers. The likelyhood of this happening is consistent with zero.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 17:20:12 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update; Message-ID: <6vb66b6j3kj.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>p  ( "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> writes:  K > I am firm believer that Compaq's (Digital's) most painful wounds are selfkK > inflicted.  I do not claim to be expert on other platforms an but haven'tsJ > both IBM and SUN put their customers through major hardware and software/ > changes that forced source level recompiles? a  G The SunOS->Solaris was pretty bad in many respects. Some old user-mode eG executables refused to run, others had abominable performance. And thatp& was a transition on the same hardware.  G IBM's OS/390 upgrades are, AFAIK, all about compatibility at the binaryhF level. When you recompile to the new models, you will uncover a lot ofC the dirty programming tricks that were used. But then, what is new?    	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:59:14 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) 2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update, Message-ID: <j7afYRStxwQq@malvm6.mala.bc.ca>  < In article <6vb4rqqj3c4.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, E    Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:/  N >> migrate to NT today because applications already exist on NT to match theirF >> needs. So there is no need to work hard to get them to stay on VMS. > L > This is only valid if you assume that such customers would remain Compaq'sF > customers. The likelyhood of this happening is consistent with zero.  G    That doesn't mean Compaq isn't operating under that delusion though. G    Until Compaq understands that we are "VMS customers" and not "CompaqnF    customers" they may continue to make the fallacious assumption thatF    business they drive away from VMS will reappear as Wintel business.  >    Digital had a similar delusion and it didn't work for them.  E    (Actually we have about 8 Digital Intel servers running NT/WindowsaE 2000, but we only bought them because we got them for next to nothingi@ at an auction at Onsale.com. I can safely say that when they get< upgraded none of them will be with a Compaq branded server.)   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:49:21 -0400b- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s2 Subject: Re: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed Update, Message-ID: <3B8D2B1C.2586C451@videotron.ca>   Jeff Killeen wrote:oK > In the short term they weaken the market.  In the long term IN MY OPINIONnI > if, and only if, they address the five issues below correctly they haved > strengthen it.  M While I think that there are far mroe than 5 issues that need to be adresses,.M I do not disagree with any of the ones you listed. However, none of these areHM designed to expand the VMS customer base and market, they are solely designeds6 to control/reduce the attrition of existing customers.  H If VMS is to survive as a standalone niche operating system, it would beJ better off being extremely proprietary with its own APIs totally differentL from the rest of the world but that offers capabilities that are unique. (in' other words, emulate the Tandem model).a  L The problem with VMS versus Tandem is that it is far easier to port from VMSK to Unix than it is from Tandem to Unix. And the other problem is that there@M are very few applications that exist on VMS only. So, if application X exists7K on Unix with more up-to-date versions and solid commitments whereas on VMS, M you have to fight to get any word from the vendor about their support of VMS,tK new customers will continue to ignore VMS and go for platforms whose futurei< does not include constant fears of vendors dropping support.  J While the Alpha genocide should result in Capellas being sent to the worldL court with the likes of Milosovich, at least the uncertaintly about Compaq'sN support for Alpha is gone. We know Compaq is torturing Alpha to death over theN next few years. So, VMS will run on IA64, whatever IA64 turns out to be (slow, fast, good bad etc).  G However, nothing has been done to fix the original problem of folks nott. trusting Compaq to really want VMS to succeed.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:12:15 -0400m2 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com>) Subject: Correct Abstract for Mark Gorhamn2 Message-ID: <lS5j7.920$bB1.43326@news.cpqcorp.net>  J       Abstract:   The agreement between Compaq and Intel to accelerate theA availability of the next generation enterprise servers brings newaJ opportunities for Compaq OpenVMST customers and partners. Building on overH 20 years of OpenVMS experience as the trusted, enabling solution for theK world's most demanding IT environments, Compaq is now moving OpenVMS onto afG mainstream platform - the Itanium T Processor Family (IPF). During this-L session, Mark Gorham, Vice President, shares the updated OpenVMS roadmap forG continued development and support on the AlphaServerT family and future G directions on IPF. Additionally, the next wave of the OpenVMS eBusiness 7 rollout is presented, coupled with customer experiences.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:23:47 GMTrL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")7 Subject: CSWS, MOD_PERL - anyone have HELLO.PM working?.8 Message-ID: <00A013CA.DC3E9ACB@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>   Apache users, etc --  4 DS20E, VMS 7.2-1, Multinet 4.3, CSWS_PERL, MOD_PERL.  G PERL_ROOT is defined /JOB/EXEC in the apache login.com to point to the nF CSWS_PERL tree, although I also have 5.6.1 installed elsewhere with a J SYSTEM/EXEC logical.  Seems to run okay, and /perl_status/ works.  (I wentM to CPAN and got the DEVEL-SYMDUMP package and installed it into the CSWS_PERLtA tree, and works fine.)  I can run test .pl and .cgi scripts from i apache$root/perl.n  K However, I uncommented the location containers that for /world and /world2,bJ and when I try to run them I get an error 500.  In ERROR_LOG perl reports 2 that it can't find APACHE::HELLO::Handler in @INC.  H I've tried placing the HELLO.PM and HELLO2.PM in different parts of the K apache tree and the CSWS_PERL tree where other modules are found.  No luck;  it just can't find 'em.h  K (Incidentally, changing the definition of PERL5LIB in MOD_PERL.CONF doesn'tpL seem to make any difference to what /perl_status/ reports as the contents of @INC.)  L I'm still learning PERL and MOD_PERL and may just be doing something stupid.  J Do any of you have these hello world perl-module examples working?  If so,9 where are the .PM files located?  What else should I try?.   Thanks,n   -- Alanc  O ===============================================================================r0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056-M  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA  94309-0210pO ===============================================================================-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 18:16:56 +0200d& From: Michael Joosten <joost@c-lab.de> Subject: Re: DCL challenge$ Message-ID: <3B8D1578.388F@c-lab.de>   Didier Morandi wrote:6 >  > OHM wrote: > >f@ > > > >> Think about the poor consultants who come behind... :-)) > > >                    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^  > > >n  4 > > I think Didier meant   "unfortunate consultants"A > > Please excuse my compatriot's broken english ... and mine ;-)i >  > Yeman, you're right.@ > I'm having german lessons now, should I have English ones too?  F This would not help:  'arme Berater' also could mean both, consultants# short of money AND short of luck...l   -- f* Michael Joosten, SBS C-LAB, joost@c-lab.de* Fuerstenallee 11, 33094 Paderborn, Germany, Phone: +49 5251 606127, Fax: +49 5251 6060658 C-LAB is a cooperation of University Paderborn & SIEMENS   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:07:12 +0200-" From: Andreas.Rhein@SchmidtBank.lu* Subject: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives?H Message-ID: <315CB3994460D3118F350000F878D0F813CDCB@mail.schmidtbank.lu>  8 Are DDS-2 / DDS-3 DAT Drives supported by OpenVMS 7.1-2?  G I have some drives available and want to use these tape drives on localsH installed DS20 and a remote DS10 (with no data line between) in order to- exchange data using the OVMS backup facility.c  = Thank's a lot for providing me with more info/help on this...r  	 -Andreas-S   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 07:50:27 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) . Subject: Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives?0 Message-ID: <9mi6s3$ang$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  m In article <315CB3994460D3118F350000F878D0F813CDCB@mail.schmidtbank.lu>, Andreas.Rhein@SchmidtBank.lu writes:  >m9 >Are DDS-2 / DDS-3 DAT Drives supported by OpenVMS 7.1-2?l >"H >I have some drives available and want to use these tape drives on localI >installed DS20 and a remote DS10 (with no data line between) in order to . >exchange data using the OVMS backup facility.  L No problem so far. We used various different DATs under VMS. Of course, theyD were all SCSI. Currently we have Sony SDT-9000 DDS-3 connected to an Aphastation 255.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann   H -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:45:13 +0200e= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>r. Subject: Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives?( Message-ID: <3B8CD5C9.FB25B0F@gtech.com>  # Andreas.Rhein@SchmidtBank.lu wrote:o: > Are DDS-2 / DDS-3 DAT Drives supported by OpenVMS 7.1-2?   Yes.  ? DAT all kinds has been working with VMS for more than a decade.    Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:36:05 +0100t% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>d. Subject: Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives?* Message-ID: <3B8CD3A4.12D4000D@virgin.net>   Christoph Gartmann wrote:oL No problem so far. We used various different DATs under VMS. Of course, they  F > were all SCSI. Currently we have Sony SDT-9000 DDS-3 connected to an > Aphastation 255. >   m Just a word of caution for anyone else thinking of using this drive. The SDT-9000 requires a specific minimuman firmware level for VMS. It's in the FAQ on the Sony support site somewhere - Imagine my surprise when a searcho for VMS immediately produced the solution. If only all third party vendors bothered to test on VMS. We ran intonn problems with one but worked perfectly after upgrading the firmware. So given that Sony explicitly support theq drive under VMS (it even has a VMS specific DIP switch setting) it's one I would recommend if you go third party.   
 > Regards, >    Christoph Gartmann  >rJ > -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+J > | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |J > | Immunbiologie                                                        |J > | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |J > | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |J > +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:17:10 GMTw2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman). Subject: Re: Does OVMS 7.1 support DAT-Drives?2 Message-ID: <WH7j7.933$bB1.44353@news.cpqcorp.net>  m In article <315CB3994460D3118F350000F878D0F813CDCB@mail.schmidtbank.lu>, Andreas.Rhein@SchmidtBank.lu writes:  :o9 :Are DDS-2 / DDS-3 DAT Drives supported by OpenVMS 7.1-2?e  B   The Compaq TLZ-series DDS (DAT) drives are supported by OpenVMS.  H :I have some drives available and want to use these tape drives on localI :installed DS20 and a remote DS10 (with no data line between) in order tog. :exchange data using the OVMS backup facility.  H   I will infer by the lack of drive specifics that you have third-party D   SCSI DDS tape drives, and you will accordingly want to review the G   information on third-party SCSI storage included in the OpenVMS FAQ, gG   and you will want to review the *gazillions* of previous discussions y7   of third-party SCSI device integration and testing.  t  E   Please remember that SCSI is a specification of a large and complexWI   collection of optionally-implemented (and occasionally misimplemented)     features, and not a standard.   E   If the systems are sufficiently nearby, it might well be easier andtD   quicker to string a network cable and use FTP or DECnet transfers.  D   If you do choose to use DDS, make sure you have and use a cleaningE   cartridge.  Also realize that DDS media lifetime is typically 2000 oC   head passes, and the first part of the tape can easily see six toeC   ten head passes during a typical BACKUP (reading and writing the 3B   tape header, BACKUP verification passes, etc).  (Most DDS media C   I've utilized for archival purposes lasted somewhere between ten iB   and twenty uses, with the particular local BACKUP scripts.)  Put@   another way, treat the DDS cartridge tapes as disposible mediaD   items, and change out existing tapes for new tapes very regularly.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:34:10 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>o? Subject: Re: Elsa Gloria Synergy Graphics Controller in my DS10h2 Message-ID: <MX7j7.937$bB1.44451@news.cpqcorp.net>  E 1) Make sure that the graphics card was found (is there a GZ device?)   ) 2) What does DECW$SERVER_0_ERROR.LOG say?e  C A blue screen would tend to indicate that the server did not start..    8 Cor Mom wrote in message <3B8BED61.3436727E@momss.nl>... >Hi, >aC >I know this question has been asked before, but I haven't seen theF >proper answer.p >oH >I have installed OpenVMS Alpha V7.2-1 on a AlphaServer DS10. The systemE >contains an Elsa Gloria Synergy Graphics Controller. I installed the E >VMS721_UPDATE-V0300 patch, which includes the graphic driver. I alsoe: >checked the MGMT24 in the FAQ and made the changes in theG >DECW$PRIVATE_SERVER_SETUP.COM. I changed the console to serial. SYSGENsG >parameter WINDOW_SYSTEM = 1. The DECW$SERVER_0_ERROR.LOG is completely9 >empty.  >1I >After the system reboots, it comes up, but with a clear (blue) graphical>G >screen with the cursor in top-left position. DECwindows is running andmH >also a _WSA0: process that is running image LOGINOUT.EXE. The graphical >screen remains empty. > A >Does any one know what I missed? The rest of the system is fine.s >a >Thanks in advance.e >O >Cor Mom   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 07:07:19 GMT& From: Wolfgang Rupp <rupp@coredump.at>! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?n3 Message-ID: <9mi4b5$2dc5m$1@ID-3131.news.dfncis.de>e  > In comp.sys.dec JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:G > On the other hand, by forcing VMS to lower itself to wintel levels ofuN > hardware, some can argue that VMS will run on commodity hardware and thus be > more competitive.3  F I don't think the ability to run VMS on el-cheapo hardware is a dangerG by itself. On the contrary, this can even be good to make it more wide- B spread. The danger lies in the fact that people (and not just beanH counters) will do exactly what they do with Wintel-crap compared to more expensive Wintel boxes.   F "Real" customers will buy the well engineered stuff. But some will buyE the cheapest possible box, maybe not even really certified. Something G will be slightly incompatible or break prematurely, and then they blame D it on VMS. "This does not work 7/24 as advertised". Since bad rumourI spreads fast, pleople will not think "cheap bastards" but "bad software".   E If you can make it clear that running it on non-certified hardware isIE your own risk, then the whole thing could work. Somehow this is a jobsF for the marketing folks... At home I run VMS on a PWS500a converted toC au with cheap used PC parts. But I'd never ask the Q for support one
 that hack :-)r  
 Wolfgang Ruppt   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:17:06 +0100s( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?o) Message-ID: <3B8CB312.89642A67@127.0.0.1>d   Nick Maclaren wrote: > E > >Huh ?  They said they will be using the same source control systemtI > >for Alpha and IA64.  That means features (aside from hardware-specificlD > >features) will naturally flow to both, until they decide to stop. > E > You haven't been there, have you?  I have.  Several times, in fact,g: > and that belief is more wishful thinking than plausible.  @ Can you qualify that statement please, i.e. what platform you're referring to with 'been there'.l     --  ( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:39:35 GMT( From: nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk (Nick Maclaren)! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?t0 Message-ID: <9mid8n$gsr$1@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk>  ) In article <3B8CB312.89642A67@127.0.0.1>,y* Nic Clews  <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote: >Nick Maclaren wrote:u >> rF >> >Huh ?  They said they will be using the same source control systemJ >> >for Alpha and IA64.  That means features (aside from hardware-specificE >> >features) will naturally flow to both, until they decide to stop.o >>  F >> You haven't been there, have you?  I have.  Several times, in fact,; >> and that belief is more wishful thinking than plausible.  >gA >Can you qualify that statement please, i.e. what platform you'reu  >referring to with 'been there'.  D IBM MVT, HP 9000/300 series, Sun 3, Hitachi SR2201, SGI Origin 2000,@ Acorn Cambridge Workstation and I forget how many others.  And, @ indirectly, the VAX Ultrix, MicroVAX I and some models of Alpha.     Regards, Nick Maclaren,* University of Cambridge Computing Service,> New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QG, England. Email:  nmm1@cam.ac.uk/ Tel.:  +44 1223 334761    Fax:  +44 1223 334679D   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 11:16:10 GMT From: jfc@mit.edu (John F Carr)t! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship? @ Message-ID: <3b8ccefa$0$1913$b45e6eb0@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu>  3 In article <QxugolYOhXr2@eisner.encompasserve.org>,a. Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote:  A >> The prospect of buying a system where all software developmenteB >> and probably even all active maintenance has already stopped is8 >> not one that pleases most experienced administrators. >fC >Huh ?  They said they will be using the same source control systemeG >for Alpha and IA64.  That means features (aside from hardware-specifictB >features) will naturally flow to both, until they decide to stop.  F Compare Solaris on SPARC, x86, and PowerPC, and not just the marketingE feature list.  Look at _Sun_ software: the x86 debugger lagged behindoE SPARC in interesting features.  Then compare third party software.  IrD worked on a port to Solaris x86.  It was easy, even the kernel code,@ but management didn't invest the time until many years after theE initial Solaris port.  It took a couple years of customer complaints,yD and even then the company decided to release a reduced-functionality1 version to save on support and maintenance costs.f   --       John Carr (jfc@mit.edu)r   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:24:19 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> ! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?a* Message-ID: <3B8CD0E2.153D8125@virgin.net>   JF Mezei wrote:W  O > Where I think VMS will suffer in in high end fancy stuff that nobody else hasnN > (galaxies for instance).  Since neither NT nor Tru64 have these features, itL > will be an uphill battle for the VMS folks to convince the wintel folks toN > build boxes that support those unique VMS features. (this isn't so much chipM > dependant , but because of the fact that the PC people will be in charge ofo >   T I can at least confirm that the Compaq IA64 boxes intended to ship in 2004/2005 willT have Galaxy support features according to current customer presentations. The slidesS show one system running Windows-64, VMS, Linux, and Tru64. Although exactly why you V would want to run Linux, and Tru64 at the same time is a puzzle as they will be binary compatible.e --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:03:28 +0100O0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?i* Message-ID: <3B8CE820.A5FD351F@uk.sun.com>   Nick Maclaren wrote: > 5 > In article <S8sUfdMdxcbi@eisner.encompasserve.org>,a/ > young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:d > |>L > |>      That's one issue.  The second issue is that Paul DeMone points outI > |>      that EV7 is up in running in Marvel since July.  Finally, early H > |>      delivery of Marvel is probably a certainty (i.e. certain largeN > |>      customers took early delivery of ES40 speed bumps constraining theirE > |>      shipment 'til months later.  This  - no doubt - will happene > |>      to Marvel.), > ' > Would you like to explain two things?. > A >     1) Why Compaq themselves have said that the EV7 will not bet? > available until "late 2002" if they already have the hardwaree > mostly working?E > C >     2) WHICH large customers got early delivery and of which ES40AA > upgrade?  None of the ones that I contacted about the ES45 did,PB > and all had been told the same story (i.e. that the systems wereC > shipping, but to higher priority customers).  And that story wenti% > on for months, and months, and ....  >    How about product positioning.  : The ES40 is currently the most cost effective and the most: price performant Alphaserver. The GS160 etc are much more : expensive boxes and we have seen a number of customers who> have found that upgrading from ES40's to GS160's has resulted : in lower throughput (DSS and OLTP) than they were getting  on their ES40's.  < With the WildFire EV7 replacement some way off could Compaq < be limitting access to the ES45 to avoid killing GS sales ??   Regards  Andrew Harrisonj Enterprise IT Architectu   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:47:14 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>u! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship? 2 Message-ID: <Mf7j7.930$bB1.43844@news.cpqcorp.net>  = JF Mezei wrote in message <3B8C4408.5D9433B0@videotron.ca>...A >Chris Morgan wrote:        J >Where I think VMS will suffer in in high end fancy stuff that nobody else hastJ >(galaxies for instance).  Since neither NT nor Tru64 have these features, itK >will be an uphill battle for the VMS folks to convince the wintel folks to-H >build boxes that support those unique VMS features. (this isn't so much chipL >dependant , but because of the fact that the PC people will be in charge ofE >building boxes that are far more complex than the glorified desktopsT	 installedt* >in a 19" rack that they currently build.) >     > Actually, Galaxy was designed for systems without any inherentJ capabilities - but as-is, it does require "some" console firmware support.F Since Galaxy was designed, you might say VMS has driven "partitioning"K within Compaq as a strategy.  The interesting question (to me) is if we canmJ take advantage of hardware partitioning capabilities, while retaining someI of the unique capabilities of Galaxy - or does Galaxy need to remain pure1 soft-partitioning.  I I don't know the answers to this (not my area to be honest), but you willoK see enterprise class IPF systems similar in capabilities to Alpha.  The RASeB features I have seen on some of the  system designs is impressive.  H >I would be more comfortable if VMS and Tandem sides worked together and built7L >their own boxes. If you're going to relegate VMS to only a very few focusedL >market niches at the high end (eg: cash cow), the model is nearly identical toE >Tandem's and to take advantage of all those fancy features, you neediH >specialised hardware that the wintel weenies don't need (or know how to build).v >n    L Tandem systems require higher capabilites that we couldn't duplicate or takeI advantage of without a lot of effort - like lock-stepping.  These systemstB fill the niche of super-high availability.  VMS fills the niche of3 high-availability with disaster tolerance/recovery.t    F >On the other hand, by forcing VMS to lower itself to wintel levels ofJ >hardware, some can argue that VMS will run on commodity hardware and thus be >more competitive. >v    J I don't agree that the HW is a problem.  You might not like the robustnessJ of Windows, but it is seldom a hardware problem.  It is a software problem: compounded by unreliable third party software and drivers.  I >However, the problem I see is that on the wintel el-cheapo hardware, VMSt may F >not be good enough to please those few large remaining customers, and Compaq'sI >total lack of marketing and its unwillingness to pit VMS against Windows- won't-F >make VMS realise its potential as an OS that can work from desktop to data-centre.  L Again, high-performance, high RAS, IPF servers are being designed.  Not just desktop systems on steroids.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:17:38 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>u! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship? 2 Message-ID: <gI7j7.934$bB1.44473@news.cpqcorp.net>  = JF Mezei wrote in message <3B8C03BC.59572132@videotron.ca>...h >Larry Kilgallen wrote:hC >> their name to be mentioned.  Remember the big press announcement3C >> regarding DII-COE where they got praise from the company that is E >> equipping JSTARS with VMS ?  Certainly Compaq is not going through 6 >> the DII-COE effort just to put VMS on 10 airplanes. >  > L >Considering that these planes were still running  Data General stuff , I amK >not sure long term commitments are really needed. Once it is installed andtE >running, will they really want to constantly upgrade these systems ?a >aL >And since they continued o operate these older DG systems well after DG hadL >stopped working with its AOSVS operating system, the same could happen with= >VMS (Compaq stops work on VMS but continues to maintain it).y >     H I'm not quite sure how this "DG" reference got worked in here - it's notL clear to me how or what DG ever provided for JSTARS.  The JSTARS program hasK been using a combination of militarized VAX servers and Alpha (TurbochannelIK based) VMS systems since the early 90's.  The FIRST prototype of the plane,sK with the above configuration, flew in Desert Storm.  The news release aboutnJ plane delivery was about the first UPGRADED version of this aircraft to beK delivered, which runs Alpha ES40's instead of the the VAX and older Alphas.,  J I do know something about JSTARS, and Northrop/Gumman Melbourne.  They areL "my" dimond support customer, and I have worked with them since before AlphaK V1.0.  I have the patches, the pewter plane, have been on the plane, in the F simulator, and have friends in NG and in the Melbourne support office.  @ The thing about the military is that they tend to buy a specificL configuration, and spares - for the lifetime of its mission.  Upgrading thatC configuration (except perhaps minor details) tends to be a complete-E project - either software changes or hardware.  Want to know how many@J VAX/VMS systems defend this country today?  Can't tell you, except they're
 out there.  H >Also, how does DII-COE work with regards to VMS on Alpha. Hasn't CompaqJ >enssentially already announced the death of VMS on Alpha that will happen in( >about 10 years when support is pulled ?  L DII/COE certifies a specific hardware and software configuration.  I believeJ that there are contractual obligations to support the hw/sw for a specificE (long) period of time.  COE certification is not "broad", that is, iteI doesn't extend to hardware not certified, or new versions of the software 3 (except as provided for by patches as appropriate).h  G There are people still happily using Alpha systems built with EV4's andrJ Turbochannels.  They may have a hard time "upgrading" the hardware, but weL (VMS) still support these systems, even though they were built a decade ago.? VMS has been traditionally slow to retire support for hardware.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:19:14 -0400o5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>s! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship? 2 Message-ID: <MJ7j7.935$bB1.44466@news.cpqcorp.net>  B andrew harrison wrote in message <3B8CE820.A5FD351F@uk.sun.com>... >n >Nick Maclaren wrote:n >>6 >> In article <S8sUfdMdxcbi@eisner.encompasserve.org>,0 >> young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes: >> |>eI >> |>      That's one issue.  The second issue is that Paul DeMone pointst outaJ >> |>      that EV7 is up in running in Marvel since July.  Finally, earlyI >> |>      delivery of Marvel is probably a certainty (i.e. certain large I >> |>      customers took early delivery of ES40 speed bumps constrainingi their F >> |>      shipment 'til months later.  This  - no doubt - will happen >> |>      to Marvel.) >>( >> Would you like to explain two things? >>B >>     1) Why Compaq themselves have said that the EV7 will not be@ >> available until "late 2002" if they already have the hardware >> mostly working? >>D >>     2) WHICH large customers got early delivery and of which ES40B >> upgrade?  None of the ones that I contacted about the ES45 did,C >> and all had been told the same story (i.e. that the systems werecD >> shipping, but to higher priority customers).  And that story went& >> on for months, and months, and .... >> >@ >How about product positioning.E > ; >The ES40 is currently the most cost effective and the mostM: >price performant Alphaserver. The GS160 etc are much more; >expensive boxes and we have seen a number of customers who > >have found that upgrading from ES40's to GS160's has resulted: >in lower throughput (DSS and OLTP) than they were getting >on their ES40's.D >3< >With the WildFire EV7 replacement some way off could Compaq= >be limitting access to the ES45 to avoid killing GS sales ??I >v     No.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:28:31 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?h, Message-ID: <3B8D263B.CEA96993@videotron.ca>   Alan Greig wrote:eV > have Galaxy support features according to current customer presentations. The slides< > show one system running Windows-64, VMS, Linux, and Tru64.  J I was under the impression that currently, Galaxy only *supports* multiple instances of VMS.c  L If Galaxies will, in a couple years, support instances of Windows, Linux andL Tru64, that would be a huge amount of work to get it to a point where Compaq would be willing to support it.t  M I know that the engineers had demoed Linux booting with VMS , but that it wasT very "demo".  J But to get Windows to safely participate in a galaxy inside of a couple of) years, I would find that hard to believe.p  N *IF* Microsoft does put deep down low level integrated support for galaxies inL Windows and makes sure that windows does behave nicely and doesn't zap disksK or memory structures of another competing OS next to it, it would mean that J Compaq truly does have a special relationship with gates since only Compaq3 would be building galaxy-capable machines (right ?)o  G Or has Compaq also given away the IP for galaxies to Intel, making thats? intellectual property freely available to all Intel customers ?    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 06:02:51 GMTt* From: cjt & trefoil <cheljuba@prodigy.net>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniums+ Message-ID: <3B8C85D8.FDDA2A2D@prodigy.net>    Rob Young wrote: >  <snip>K >         That isn't true because someday (4-5 years) that is all that willlH >         be shipping (64-bit) as Intel puts financial and manufacturingL >         pressure to make it so.  Intel can do whatever they want and priceN >         accordingly.  Just enough to keep AMD barely alive so they can point0 >         out they do indeed have "competition." > % >                                 Robs  J That's an interesting hypothesis, but I'm not convinced.  Why would Intel K "want" to slash prices as they have recently?  Could it be they're feeling h* heat from somewhere (not necessarily AMD)?   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:11:34 GMT * From: cjt & trefoil <cheljuba@prodigy.net>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itanium1+ Message-ID: <3B8C95F2.F797EBA6@prodigy.net>:   Rob Young wrote: >  <snip> > 8 >         You are missing this one.  I'm seeing failover( >         "clusters" of NT boxes runningd >         apps with 2 GByte of memory, 2-4 CPUs.  In some senses, .  And yes, failover because it is+ >         easier to understand and support.i >  <snip>  P Another interesting thought: "... it doesn't matter how crappy the hardware is."  H Of course, failover is more effective if the underlying systems are more	 reliable.-   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 08:16:30 GMT( From: nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk (Nick Maclaren)) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumc0 Message-ID: <9mi8cu$c2m$1@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk>  3 In article <ibhilal+GuW2@eisner.encompasserve.org>,c, Rob Young <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote:) >In article <9mh43a$stf$1@pyrite.mv.net>,r* >"Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> writes:H >> Then why do you insist on repeating those silly assertions about IA648 >> replacing IA32 in *all* segments (see quote below)?   >fF >	Because it will happen according to Intel's own publically available1 >	CPU roadmaps.  We can quibble about timeframes.a  A Well, this is a point in which I must support Rob Young.  But notk? much, because to confuse Intel's statements of their plans with 7 predictions of the future shows a certain, er, naivity.e  ? Intel's ORIGINAL roadmap had the IA-64 replacing the IA-32 linenB for servers in 1998, for desktops in 1999 and for embedded systemsB by 2001.  Or thereabouts.  When the Itanic slipped so badly, IntelA not merely slipped the schedules but dropped it from the embedded - claims and delayed the desktop ones sine die.m  @ But since about 1990, there has been no hard distinction between@ medium sized servers and high-end workstations - the differencesA are quantitative not qualitative, technically and otherwise.  And > both the bulk market for relatively high-end chips is in small@ servers and similar workstations, so it pays a vendor to produce? its entry-level desktops as stripped-down versions of its smallt server line.  = So, EITHER the IA-64 line will replace the IA-32 within a few  years OR it will fail in toto.   >> And if you *don't*tM >> believe it will replace IA32 in the high-volume environments (desktops and N >> low-end servers) any time soon (which indeed is almost certainly the case),N >> where do you get the idea that the much more limited-volume (but lucrative)L >> upper-end server segment will allow it to achieve the similar 'commodity'K >> price status enjoyed by those high-volume systems that would allow it to:N >> compete 'across the board' (i.e., including the lower-end server, let alone' >> desktop, segments) cost-effectively?t > D >	Because IA64 CPUs a year or two out (with shrink to .13 micron and? >	such) will priced similarly to Xeon CPUs today so it won't betC >	out of the question to see 4 CPU McKinley boxes to be priced near F >	4 CPU Xeon boxes today (okay, at $10K premium) but at a $10K premiumE >	that will put them near $30K , significanly cheaper than RISC boxes  >	today.  A It isn't the price that is the issue.  Intel could do that today, ? if they wanted to.  It is whether the compilers and kernels canp= ever get the things to work at a reasonable speed on existingeD codes (and I don't mean IA-32 binaries).  And there are good reasonsB to believe that they can't, as I predicted in 1995, and was flamedA for until 2000, whereupon many flamers turned round and said thatS+ they had been saying the same all along :-)l  E >	It won't replace IA32 in the next 3 years, but that doesn't matter.   C If it hasn't pushed IA-32 out of the high-end desktop market beforer that, the IA-64 line will fail.i     Regards, Nick Maclaren,* University of Cambridge Computing Service,> New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QG, England. Email:  nmm1@cam.ac.uk/ Tel.:  +44 1223 334761    Fax:  +44 1223 334679A   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:10:28 +0100m0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itanium-* Message-ID: <3B8CBF94.657A9E79@uk.sun.com>   Rob Young wrote: > T > In article <9m6c4b$hv4$1@pyrite.mv.net>, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> writes: >  > >5 > >. > > ...  > >k# > >> JF, what part don't you "get?"8 > >dL > > I'd say that JF 'got' it pretty well, but may have left out some detailsL > > which I've filled in above.  Just what part of it now don't *you* 'get', > > Rob? > >> > J >         The part I don't "get" is why would you trim portions to make itK >         appear is if the question is dangling in mid-air?  The part aboutuL >         Alpha designers.  The missing context of which leaves the questionL >         dangling in mid-air.  That is now the part I don't get.  Actually,K >         I do get it.  It is again another thin attempt to twist and turn. P >         Someone posts (see subject line) a more positive outlook for them now,P >         and it is quickly twisted.  Sorry, the Compaq folks are doing a fairlyP >         good job with the people that count most.  The ones invited to Diamond >         Forums.S > A >         Meanwhile, those on the fringes are still wailing away.  > % >                                 Robs >   - Look Itanium is done and in production (ish).m  6 Mckinley is at such a late stage that it is extremely 6 unlikely that any changes will be made other than ones to fix issues. a  9 So the Alpha processor designers that Intel have aquired  = will be working on other processors, or on fixes to Mckinley.r  ; They may for example be working on the post Mckinley CPU's.   = Does this mean that the post Mckinley CPU's will incorporate t Alpha IP, possibly.c  ; Does it mean that the post Mckinley CPU's will incorporate 4- OpenVMS/Tru64 friendly instructions possibly.r  = Does it mean that there will be a special IA64 CPU for Compaq-	 possibly.a  = Of these possiblys the most likely is that some Alpha IP wille: be incorporated into some future generations of IA64, the  rest are increasingly unlikely.8  ( This is I think the basis of JF's point.  O > "To be sober means to have a calm, clear head, to judge things after the ruletP > of right, and not according to mob rule.  Don't be influenced by those who cry5 > the loudest, or by those who beat the biggest drum"f > " >                 -- C.H. Spurgeon   --   Andrew Harrisoni Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 06:36:55 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)t) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumi3 Message-ID: <cL7SO8OBzPr3@eisner.encompasserve.org>i  ] In article <3B8CBF94.657A9E79@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:s  / > Look Itanium is done and in production (ish).i > 8 > Mckinley is at such a late stage that it is extremely 8 > unlikely that any changes will be made other than ones > to fix issues.   > ; > So the Alpha processor designers that Intel have aquired  ? > will be working on other processors, or on fixes to Mckinley.  > = > They may for example be working on the post Mckinley CPU's.s > ? > Does this mean that the post Mckinley CPU's will incorporate a > Alpha IP, possibly.a  ? What the Alpha processor designers work on certainly does _not_s> mean that post-McKinley CPUs will incorporate Alpha IP.  Intel? acquired non-exclusive rights to Alpha IP.  That is independente> of the fact that they acquired the right to bulk-solicit Alpha? designers for employment.  Even if they assigned the entire sety> of Alpha designers they got to designing new logos, they could@ still use Alpha IP (if they chose) in any processor they wanted, such as StrongArm.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:02:51 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumo; Message-ID: <6vbg0abezg4.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>p  - young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:h  ? > 		1)  Intel will phase out IA32 according to their own words.s  M If AMD lets them, which doesn't seem likely at the moment. Intel is bleeding tI ASP and profits in the P4/Athlon comparison - where would they be if the y? comparison were Itanium/Athlon on IA32 code? Dead in the water.    	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:06:07 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itanium ; Message-ID: <6vbelpvezao.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   - young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:g  ? > 	Always these rumors, and rumors of Microsoft creating a porttB > 	of Windows 2000 to support Hammer.  I don't think that happens.  N Politically, it is in Microsoft's best interests to have Win2k support Hammer.L They are having enough problems with the anti-trust division of the DOJ and K the FTC as is, and will try to avoid playing favorites as much as possible.-4 Why do you think a MAC version of Word et al. exist?   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:14:32 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumo; Message-ID: <6vbd75feywn.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e  ) "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> writes:3  H > "Intel controlled about 79% of the microprocessor market in the secondM > quarter of this year, and Sunnyvale, Calif.-based AMD had 21%, according toCN > Lehman Brothers. AMD has continually grabbed market share from Intel for theG > past year, which has caused Intel to react, Niles said. In the secondmM > quarter, AMD increased its processor shipments by 23% from the same quarteryK > a year earlier, while Intel shipped 12% fewer processors in the same time 	 > frame."s  K Nice quote. The flea in the ointment is that the sum of 79% and 21% is 100% J "of the microprocessor market", so VIA et al., Motorola et al., not to sayH various 8- and 16-bit processors no longer seem to be either a market orH microprocessors. Hrmph. But then, what do I know compared to some surely high-paid "analyst"?   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:19:32 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumn; Message-ID: <6vbbskzeyob.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>l  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:f  N > And with the help of microsoft, I would not be surpsised to see new versions2 > of "enterprise" software available only on IA64,  M Microsoft do not control that market. And in that segment, other options are aN available, so using this to foce customers to IA64 would not likely be viable.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:22:26 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumt; Message-ID: <6vbae0jeyjh.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:t  M > Even with today's telecoms, is it really feasable to have part of your teamnH > working on the same chip physically located on the opposite coast of a
 > continent ?   G It does seem so. There were recent posts on comp.arch with regard to a sE recent IBM processor (might have been Power4) that had teams at five hD different locations contributing to the design, IIRC, and the designE was successful. It did take a great deal of management, in particular ( management by contract, to work, though.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:36:24 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniump; Message-ID: <6vb8zg3exw7.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e  / Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:V  F > As I understood what was said, language-specific transfers depend onD > the language.  Steve Lionel said they were particularly anxious toG > get the Fortran folks, perhaps because their current Fortran offering 
 > is weak.  J ...which isn't the case, at least if you base this on CFP2000 peak resultsJ and assume that the people doing the benchmarks for AMD know what they are doing.   	Jan   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 08:36:50 -0600 (MDT)a" From: John Nebel <nebel@csdco.com>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about ItaniumiG Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.21.0108290835060.16292-100000@athena.csdco.com>g  ( On 29 Aug 2001, Jan C Vorbrueggen wrote:  1 > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:p > O > > Even with today's telecoms, is it really feasable to have part of your teamrJ > > working on the same chip physically located on the opposite coast of a > > continent ?s > I > It does seem so. There were recent posts on comp.arch with regard to a  G > recent IBM processor (might have been Power4) that had teams at five tF > different locations contributing to the design, IIRC, and the designG > was successful. It did take a great deal of management, in particulart* > management by contract, to work, though. >  > 	Jan >    Trying to be non-sarcastic :)    IBM understands management.a  
 John Nebel   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:41:52 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumu; Message-ID: <6vb7kvnexn3.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   / Jack Patteeuw <jjpatteeuw@peoplepc.com> writes:   M > They have.  Maybe not loudly, but a "very high" management person at CompaqnK > admitted to me the other day that they "blew it" (actual quote) with the  M > Alpha chip.  Without going into the "why's", he admitted that they did not a7 > generate enough revenue to continue it's development.   K Even if that were true - and I strongly tend with Bill Todd that it isn't -aM Compaq seem to have chosen the mostly costly path possible to terminate Alpha?L development: with their recent decision, they have pulled the floor out fromK underneath a large part of the company. Providing for a smooth phase-out ofEF Alpha-based systems and a phase-in of IA64 based systems would in all K likelihood have paid for more than the continued short-term development of rI Alpha the processor - development of the surrounding _systems_ (Marvel etxN al.) is still supposed to continue, right? And that isn't small change either.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:48:57 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)o) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itanium 3 Message-ID: <rSWsqMk3ek1y@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ~ In article <6vb8zg3exw7.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:1 > Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:I > G >> As I understood what was said, language-specific transfers depend oneE >> the language.  Steve Lionel said they were particularly anxious todH >> get the Fortran folks, perhaps because their current Fortran offering >> is weak.  > L > ...which isn't the case, at least if you base this on CFP2000 peak resultsL > and assume that the people doing the benchmarks for AMD know what they are > doing.  G So are there any benchmarks that compare Intel Fortran to Compaq Visuale	 Fortran ?o  F Of course "weak" might be in some other area than performance, such as2 user interface, for which there are no benchmarks.   I am not a Fortran user.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:18:22 -040082 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about ItaniumoL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2908011118230001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>  I In article <9mi8cu$c2m$1@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk>, nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk (Nickl Maclaren) wrote:  A > Intel's ORIGINAL roadmap had the IA-64 replacing the IA-32 lineaD > for servers in 1998, for desktops in 1999 and for embedded systemsD > by 2001.  Or thereabouts.  When the Itanic slipped so badly, IntelC > not merely slipped the schedules but dropped it from the embeddedt/ > claims and delayed the desktop ones sine die.e > B > But since about 1990, there has been no hard distinction betweenB > medium sized servers and high-end workstations - the differencesC > are quantitative not qualitative, technically and otherwise.  And @ > both the bulk market for relatively high-end chips is in smallB > servers and similar workstations, so it pays a vendor to produceA > its entry-level desktops as stripped-down versions of its small  > server line. > ? > So, EITHER the IA-64 line will replace the IA-32 within a fewc  > years OR it will fail in toto.  H OR, the market patterns will shift away from what we've seen in the past
 decade or so,o  / OR, something completely different will happen.s  G (I usually find these sorts of know-it-all predictions interesting, but-- not when they are presented as proven facts.):   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comj   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:27:12 -0400s5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>s) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumr2 Message-ID: <eR7j7.936$bB1.44334@news.cpqcorp.net>  = JF Mezei wrote in message <3B8C07B6.624958CF@videotron.ca>...o >uL >Digital and then Compaq were able to do bad things to the VMS customers forL >years, yet shareholders have never said a word about their handling of VMS.  H "Shareholders" in most large corporations *not* controlled by one or twoG individuals tends to be owned by "institutions".  Mutual funds, pension H funds, etc.  They in-general don't give a crap about the specifics, theyJ just care about the ROI.  They usually deal with poor ROI by disinvesting,< not by proxy fights with management over corporate strategy.   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 15:35:21 GMT( From: nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk (Nick Maclaren)) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniums0 Message-ID: <9mj23p$54f$1@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk>   In article <rdeininger-2908011118230001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:n |> > tB |> > So, EITHER the IA-64 line will replace the IA-32 within a few# |> > years OR it will fail in toto.l |> kK |> OR, the market patterns will shift away from what we've seen in the pasts |> decade or so, |> o2 |> OR, something completely different will happen.  @ Extremely implausible.  Well below a 5% chance.  Yes, there is a@ significant chance of a major change, causing the market to turnA upside down, but that is extremely unlikely to change the result.hA There are few plausible scenarios (and none that I can imagine ase@ at all likely) in which the IA-64 line BOTH fails to replace the1 IA-32 line AND succeeds from Intel's perspective.u  J |> (I usually find these sorts of know-it-all predictions interesting, but0 |> not when they are presented as proven facts.)  A Well, unless you are doing so, nobody is doing that.  Predictionsd? are proven by developments.  My record is pretty good, and I ameA considerably more confident of this one than of most.  And I knowu? for a near-certainty that it corresponds with Intel's strategico plans.  A Please note that I am NOT saying anything about whether the IA-64 > line will BOTH fail to replace the IA-32 one AND fail in toto; that is, of course, possible.m     Regards, Nick Maclaren,* University of Cambridge Computing Service,> New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QG, England. Email:  nmm1@cam.ac.uk/ Tel.:  +44 1223 334761    Fax:  +44 1223 334679l   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:00:01 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett)r) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumn, Message-ID: <cYENGMmCAj25@malvm6.mala.bc.ca>  < In article <6vbelpvezao.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, E    Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:3  P > Politically, it is in Microsoft's best interests to have Win2k support Hammer.N > They are having enough problems with the anti-trust division of the DOJ and M > the FTC as is, and will try to avoid playing favorites as much as possible.i  ?    Then why did they kill off the PowerPC and Alpha versions ofa? Windows? Perhaps MS will take the same tack with Hammer as with-? Alpha - ie if AMD wants to pay the full cost of a port MS won't  stand in their way.   6 > Why do you think a MAC version of Word et al. exist?  E    Presumably because MS realizes there are a few people in the worldt? who don't want to run Windows and they'd hate to miss a revenuei1 opportunity by not having a product to sell them.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 19:01:49 +0200t& From: Michael Joosten <joost@c-lab.de>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniume$ Message-ID: <3B8D1FFD.751F@c-lab.de>  $ Oh my, I've started a rant thread...     JF Mezei wrote:" >   J > Ahh, but shareholders will have been given the Compaq spin and will see: > O > -Compaq finally putting its house in order by dumping unprofitable endeavoursx > P > -Compaq will be able to reduce costs through volume purchases of the same chip > for all its systems  > O > -Alpha had no future , had bad image etc etc, and IA64 has promise of beating ! > Alpha, so why bother with Alphaa > I > -Compaq is going to become mre efficient by streamlining product lines.r  D Yes, that's probably exactly the view - from the 'top of World Trade. Center', based on shallow business analysises.  H In Germany, the term 'shareholder value' just became known and a leadingG paradigm for management in the last 4 years. Before the IPO of the thenIH government-owned Deutsche Telekom (whose shares are hopefully at the endH of their ballistic mission, nearing ground zero (ie. IPO prices)), there8 was virtually no public shareholder culture in Germany.   G What happenend in the annual shareholder meetings (sp?) of Siemens AG axF few years ago, was that some German fund manager complained at the CEOD (Mr. von Pierer): 'Do shareholders finally the favour and sink thoseH little canoes (lit: Paddelboote), so that the Siemens fleet of divisions can drive at full speed !'  B Paddelboote were the small or few revenue or even losses producingF divisions like Siemens Medical etc. Then a loser, now a piece of cake.  ? There is growig resistance at BOD level in Germany against thatu shareholder value mantra...   G But in the current economic situation... it should be pretty clear thatnE even a small division/department making profits were the big ones areaD deep in the reds is a big benefit. I would be more concerned about aC future with rasing PC and PC server sales, where the owner can morei> easily and afford to get rid of a 'distraction' of the product
 portfoilo.  G I'd suspect that Compaq will try to set VMS with the port to Itanium onA@ a solid foundation, with a profitable niche and a broad hardwareH platform, and THEN probably selling it to a holding or a company that is/ more fitting than Compaq seems to be nowadays. F   -- 9* Michael Joosten, SBS C-LAB, joost@c-lab.de* Fuerstenallee 11, 33094 Paderborn, Germany, Phone: +49 5251 606127, Fax: +49 5251 6060658 C-LAB is a cooperation of University Paderborn & SIEMENS   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 12:45:26 -0500+ From: kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)n) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumh3 Message-ID: <2tuAux8mmOAW@eisner.encompasserve.org>m  ` In article <cYENGMmCAj25@malvm6.mala.bc.ca>, nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) writes:> > In article <6vbelpvezao.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, G >    Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:n > Q >> Politically, it is in Microsoft's best interests to have Win2k support Hammer. O >> They are having enough problems with the anti-trust division of the DOJ and pN >> the FTC as is, and will try to avoid playing favorites as much as possible. > A >    Then why did they kill off the PowerPC and Alpha versions ofPA > Windows? Perhaps MS will take the same tack with Hammer as with A > Alpha - ie if AMD wants to pay the full cost of a port MS won't0 > stand in their way.e >   D My understanding was that M$ didn't want to kill NT/Alpha, but since= CPQ was determined to do fulfillment on their self-fulfillingcC prophecy that NT/Alpha would never sell, they really had no choice. B CPQ was always Alpha hostile, and the sales droids would only sell. you an NT/Alpha if you demanded it repeatedly.  A What seems like eons ago now, we had some Alphas here running NT, C that we got from Digital.  We wanted to deploy more NT/Alpha boxes,cB and called CPQ.  We could not get a quote for NT/Alpha because theE sales droid only knew Proliants.  I went to a reseller that we boughtuC Alphas from in the past.  They would start a quote for us, and whenu: it was passed to CPQ for approval (part of the process for@ CSA/ISV/ASAP orders), CPQ would try to change the Alpha parts toA Proliant parts.  After a couple of iterations of this, we finallyd gave up.  D This also had the effect, at our corporation at least, that we would> no longer buy CPQ products.  Since then we've replaced all ourB Proliants with Dells.  We have rows and rows of racks full of DellC servers, and nary a Proliant to be found.  CPQs actions were also a C deciding factor when we bought NetApps instead of StorageWorks whenJE we expanded our disk farms.  It was also part of the reason why we no09 longer have hardware support for the remaining Alphas andhD StorageWorks items through CPQ, but SMS.  It wasn't the whole reasonC why we changed hardware support, but don't get me started about CPQo@ as a hardware "service" company.  (as an aside I still think VMS- software support is the best in the industry)   D CPQ may want to "bet the business", but the company I work for is no( longer stepping up to _that_ crap table.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:04:05 -0400i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniums, Message-ID: <3B8D2E8E.67537673@videotron.ca>   Jan C Vorbrueggen wrote:N > development: with their recent decision, they have pulled the floor out from) > underneath a large part of the company.p  L But if you don't want that part of the house, you're more than happy to tearN it down, just as long as it doesn't pull down the good part of the house (thatN is fragile already). Once gone, you can then use that space to build something you really want.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 12:56:44 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> Subject: Re: Good VMS news; Message-ID: <6vbu1yrm8wj.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   2 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:  G > I am currently working on a very large retail customers migration to s? > UNIX from a host of systems that include a number of S390's.    I Please let us know who this is so that we can sell any shares we might bel+ holding in this copany as soon as possible.u   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 18:03:05 +02002< From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <noone@home.com>, Subject: Hobbyist/Private license og DECdoc.( Message-ID: <3B8D1239.F60B9695@home.com>   Hi.f; There was an question some days ago about the special offer@8 I had got from Touch Tec. on DECdocument ($199 vs $560).B I ask them what I could do with this license, and the answer was :  : "You can do whatever you would like with the license, just' as long as you keep it on your system."e   Pretty OK with me...   Regardso Jan-Erik Sderholm.e   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 15:48:05 GMT# From: "Rembrandt" <artist@juno.com>IJ Subject: How to quickly replicate a global section on another network node2 Message-ID: <01c130a9$f0012e20$e329adce@satellite>  G I am looking for a method (or a best method) to update a global section4 across a network link.  J I have an older Vax6250 system collecting data on a plant's operation, andD that data is stored in current value tables that are global sectionsK (updated approximately once per second).  I need to quickly access the dataoH in those sections to distribute to a more modern system.  But the VAX isJ already heavily loaded.  I have an unused Alpha attached, and I would likeE to be able to quickly (and repeatedly) replicate or update the globalhK section from the VAX to the Alpha, then have a new program operating on theeC Alpha to serve the data to the modern system.  I'm just looking fornJ concepts and tools, not detailed coding information (I'm not a programmer,J just trying to see what is possible).  The VMS version is 7.?.  Thanks for any information.   Kens   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 16:32:26 GMTn2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)N Subject: Re: How to quickly replicate a global section on another network node2 Message-ID: <uO8j7.941$bB1.44540@news.cpqcorp.net>  X In article <01c130a9$f0012e20$e329adce@satellite>, "Rembrandt" <artist@juno.com> writes:  " :I have an older Vax6250 system...  K   Plugging in a faster VAX processor might be the easiest solution -- each  L   of the CVAX processor modules in this system are rated at 2.8 VUPs and theK   system is limited to 2.8 VUPs of I/O performance.  Replacing all five of aL   your existing 200-series KA62A processor modules with even a single (used)M   500- or 600-series processor module (the KA65A and KA66A modules at 13 and NJ   32 VUPs, respectively) will likely provide you with a significant systemK   performance improvement.  (Knowing nothing about the particular limits of:I   the VAX 6000 model 250 system performance at your site, you'll want to rK   check for sufficient available I/O bandwidth and you'll also want to add y   more physical memory.)   :I'm just looking foreK :concepts and tools, not detailed coding information (I'm not a programmer,u& :just trying to see what is possible).  M   Please get a programmer directly involved, as (and no offense is intended) eL   your involvement here risks some distortion of the suggestion(s) -- if youL   are not familiar with at least some of the programming involved, then you I   might miss out on some of the subtleties.  (Some of this can initially cH   appear quite arcane, having personally learned how to design and debug0   shared memory applications "the hard way". :-)  L   For existing suggestions, please see Ask The Wizard topics (860), (1661), I   (2181), (2681), (2637), (3365), (3530), (3635), (3791), (4051), (4487),hL   and probably a few others.  Also please skim through the available OpenVMSN   Programming Concepts and relevent System Services documentation, and please =   also seriously consider the use of a commercial middleware.5  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 21:30:14 +0400r4 From: "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev@SMTP.DeltaTel.RU>N Subject: Re: How to quickly replicate a global section on another network node0 Message-ID: <3B8D26A6.72CAFF7D@SMTP.DeltaTel.RU>   Hi !T 	Take a look to http://starlet.deltatel.ru/~laishev/delta/cms/ - an example of using= lock management a global section with replication of changes..     Rembrandt wrote: > I > I am looking for a method (or a best method) to update a global section  > across a network link. > L > I have an older Vax6250 system collecting data on a plant's operation, andF > that data is stored in current value tables that are global sectionsM > (updated approximately once per second).  I need to quickly access the dataeJ > in those sections to distribute to a more modern system.  But the VAX isL > already heavily loaded.  I have an unused Alpha attached, and I would likeG > to be able to quickly (and repeatedly) replicate or update the global M > section from the VAX to the Alpha, then have a new program operating on thevE > Alpha to serve the data to the modern system.  I'm just looking for L > concepts and tools, not detailed coding information (I'm not a programmer,L > just trying to see what is possible).  The VMS version is 7.?.  Thanks for > any information. >  > Ken    -- b Cheers, Ruslan.a? +----------------pure personal opinion------------------------+g9     RADIUS Server for OpenVMS project - www.radiusvms.comt6       vms-isps@dls.net - Forum for ISP running OpenVMS)                 Mobile: +7 (901) 971-3222s   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 06:48:03 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)p3 Subject: IA-64 Galaxies (was: EV7 will never ship?) 3 Message-ID: <irA+sQAF6b5n@eisner.encompasserve.org>i  R In article <3B8CD0E2.153D8125@virgin.net>, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> writes:  V > I can at least confirm that the Compaq IA64 boxes intended to ship in 2004/2005 willV > have Galaxy support features according to current customer presentations. The slidesU > show one system running Windows-64, VMS, Linux, and Tru64. Although exactly why younX > would want to run Linux, and Tru64 at the same time is a puzzle as they will be binary
 > compatible.i  2 One very good reason would be feasibility studies.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:09:28 +0100.% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>07 Subject: Re: IA-64 Galaxies (was: EV7 will never ship?)p* Message-ID: <3B8CDB78.466A6B79@virgin.net>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:  4 > One very good reason would be feasibility studies.  \ Such as a Compaq feasibility study on replacing Tru64 with a Compaq supported Linux? Carried( out by customers at no cost to Compaq...   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 08:14:34 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)a7 Subject: Re: IA-64 Galaxies (was: EV7 will never ship?)h3 Message-ID: <H2ixEevzjp1d@eisner.encompasserve.org>-  R In article <3B8CDB78.466A6B79@virgin.net>, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> writes: >  >  > Larry Kilgallen wrote: > 5 >> One very good reason would be feasibility studies.. > ^ > Such as a Compaq feasibility study on replacing Tru64 with a Compaq supported Linux? Carried* > out by customers at no cost to Compaq...  8 And with customers each able to make their own decision.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:34:23 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)sO Subject: IA64 support for smaller ISVs (was: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed...)i3 Message-ID: <2IZWL+hzZSKG@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ] In article <TX5j7.68$jd.73087@typhoon1.gnilink.net>, "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> writes:e  M > 4) Will Compaq provide incentives to the second tier applications providersiL > to port to IPF.  I am hopping to hear words like loaner systems at no cost > from Compaq.  G Speaking as a fourth tier (or so) application provider, I will say that>G loaner systems are not sufficient.  It is necessary to be able to buy a C system at moderate cost to be able to support the application afteraB it is built.  The "temporary" nature of a loaner is inadequate for
 this purpose.e  @ DEC/Compaq formerly provided a discount for ASAP/CSA members via@ BusinessLink.  That has all disappeared into the void, and whileA there is allegedly a replacement, they will not communicate to us  fourth tier providers.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:54:50 -0400t, From: Mark Schafer <mark.schafer@compaq.com>S Subject: Re: IA64 support for smaller ISVs (was: Conference: CETS-2001 Detailed...)e' Message-ID: <3B8D104A.30807@compaq.com>.  	 Hi Larry,1  H Yes, DBL is gone.  ISVs in North America may order equipment by calling H the program center at 1-800-332-4786.  Select either option 2 (US) or 3 I (Canada), then select the appropriate product.  Your call will be routed n7 directly to the purchasing group for that product line.c  G In the other geographies, ISVs call the program center in that geo.  I <A have a list of them and I believe they are posted on the website.i   http://www.compaq.com/csa/   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:08:08 -0500t+ From: Phil Mendelsohn <mend0070@tc.umn.edu> D Subject: Re: Looking for Digital Serial Number Identication ResourceG Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.4.20.0108291159450.4614-100000@garnet.tc.umn.edu>i  ! On 28 Aug 2001, Bob Kaplow wrote:t  / > 	AB	Albuquerque NM?	old VAXen and early Alphao > 	AG	????		DECservers > 	AS	????		DECservers" > 	KA	????		old VAXen, early Alpha" > 	ZG	????		all my HSx controllers >  > E > Wasn't there once a plant on Phoenix that made terminals, and such?o  H Albuquerque used to, don't recall about Phoenix.  Did ABQ really used toJ make VAX?  I remember when Sales and Software Services moved their officesH to the plant (which had been a Singer plant) -- that would be around '76: or could be '77.  That could coincide with Star going intoA production.  But as of '85, I'm pretty sure they were only making ) terminals and left the area before Alpha.d   -- l6 "To misattribute a quote is unforgivable." --Anonymous   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 03:01 CDTe' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)  Subject: RE: Mark Twain Promoc- Message-ID: <29AUG200103012745@gerg.tamu.edu>   1 "John Eisenschmidt" <jeisensc@aaas.org> writes...n }It isn't marketing!!!  	 Nonsense.h  J }Marketing implies you are enticing either 1) a new customer to buy your =L }goods/services for the first time, or 2) an existing customer to buy more => }of your goods/services. That mailing accomplishes neither.=20  I So you have access to the complete list of people it was sent to? If not,lJ how do you know it was only sent to current customers? Clearly it was sentM to a bunch of current customers, but was it *only* sent to current customers? H Where have you checked, other than comp.os.vms (which is strongly baised7 towards current customers), to see who got the mailing?   D What makes you think that it wouldn't entice an existing customer toE buy more? Say there is a customer who needs more "computer stuff" butCE is concerned about the future of VMS. He gets this mailing. It occurseD to him that this never happened before, so mayby this indicates thatC they plan on keeping VMS around for long enough to make buying more G VMS stuff a viable option. So he buys more. This is no less far fetchednD than the same thing happening because of a commercial on TV or ad in some magazine.  D I come back from vacation and there's a book of Twain quotes sitting# on my desk. Very spiffy. I like it.e   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:24:15 +0100i- From: Peter Harding <harding@herald.ox.ac.uk>n Subject: Re: Mark Twain Promoi/ Message-ID: <3B8CC2CF.8E5B88CC@herald.ox.ac.uk>r   "Richard D. Piccard" wrote:d  > I thought it was kind of cute.  1 Indeed it is, but I'd have preferred an umbrella.e   -- i http://i.am/getting_married  Tel 07092057581 ICQ 40628243   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:24:39 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: Mark Twain Promo L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2908011124390001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>  = In article <3B8CC2CF.8E5B88CC@herald.ox.ac.uk>, Peter HardingA  <harding@herald.ox.ac.uk> wrote:   > "Richard D. Piccard" wrote:-" > > I thought it was kind of cute. > 3 > Indeed it is, but I'd have preferred an umbrella.K  J The umbrellas were several months ago.  Nice ubmrella, but I think the VMSJ logo should have been in big letters on the top, instead of little letters on the handle.   -- m Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.come   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 06:26:03 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)n( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)3 Message-ID: <Qo4rEp+1Fmly@eisner.encompasserve.org>e   That is a good list.  A My only concern is with encouraging people to write things in DCL A that would better be done in compiled languages.  Still there are D times when the steps that require dealing with any of the 6 floatingB point types are minimal and the Real goal is to run Sort.  In that2 case switching to a compiled language is overkill.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 05:01:44 -0700  From: moi_is_me@usa.net (Pierre)( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)< Message-ID: <cdbc7707.0108290401.b13d9ec@posting.google.com>  , My wish list is fairly simple (in principle)  H  As much as UNIX annoys me - I do like the auto completion functionality,  found in the bash shell (perhaps others ?)   D  basically, this feature saves you having to type long pathnames by C  having the shell autocomplete - everytime you push the ESCAPE key.W    e.g.o  cd /export/build/f <esc>b    bash might change this to e    cd /export/build/fortrane  :  hitting the ESCAPE key again might change the pathname to  !  cd /export/build/fortran/includep  A  fyi - autocompletion is not limited to the cd command, it can ber  also used with the editor    0   so can we please have this minor enhancement ?   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 08:13:09 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)o( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)3 Message-ID: <6kuoGsbIX9lV@eisner.encompasserve.org>w  _ In article <cdbc7707.0108290401.b13d9ec@posting.google.com>, moi_is_me@usa.net (Pierre) writes: . > My wish list is fairly simple (in principle) > J >  As much as UNIX annoys me - I do like the auto completion functionality. >  found in the bash shell (perhaps others ?)  > F >  basically, this feature saves you having to type long pathnames by E >  having the shell autocomplete - everytime you push the ESCAPE key.m >  >  e.g.u >  cd /export/build/f <esc>e >  >  bash might change this to i >  >  cd /export/build/fortrane > < >  hitting the ESCAPE key again might change the pathname to > # >  cd /export/build/fortran/includen > C >  fyi - autocompletion is not limited to the cd command, it can be, >  also used with the editor >  > 2 >   so can we please have this minor enhancement ?  & I am not sure why you call that minor.+ Have you seen the source listings for DCL ?o   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:56:07 GMTl= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)y( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)0 Message-ID: <00A013F9.49A96F6B@SendSpamHere.ORG>  c In article <6kuoGsbIX9lV@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: ` >In article <cdbc7707.0108290401.b13d9ec@posting.google.com>, moi_is_me@usa.net (Pierre) writes:/ >> My wish list is fairly simple (in principle)  >> uK >>  As much as UNIX annoys me - I do like the auto completion functionalitye/ >>  found in the bash shell (perhaps others ?) c >> eG >>  basically, this feature saves you having to type long pathnames by tF >>  having the shell autocomplete - everytime you push the ESCAPE key. >> t >>  e.g. >>  cd /export/build/f <esc> >>   >>  bash might change this to  >>   >>  cd /export/build/fortran >> t= >>  hitting the ESCAPE key again might change the pathname to- >> -$ >>  cd /export/build/fortran/include >>  D >>  fyi - autocompletion is not limited to the cd command, it can be >>  also used with the editor/ >> t >> e3 >>   so can we please have this minor enhancement ?o > ' >I am not sure why you call that minor.g, >Have you seen the source listings for DCL ?   I have.D  H I love to have the chance to add some new features to DCL.  Many of themH I already provide via SYMBOL but it would be much easier to have them inH DCL itself instead of going through all of the gyrations and contortions I need to in SYMBOL to hook in.    --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMa            mJ   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbesa   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:08:32 GMTl0 From: "P. Thompson" <thompson-nospam@new.rr.com>( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)J Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.33.0108290907350.11859-100000@malacandra.localnet>  - On Tue, 28 Aug 2001, David J. Dachtera wrote:e   > CREATE/MAILBOX logical_nameo > 	/PERMANENT (requires PRMMBX)eB > 	/TEMPORARY (requires TMPMBX, assigns a channel stored in global+ >         symbol DCL$MBX_CHAN_logical_name)c > 	/BUFFER_QUOTA=valueB > 	/SYMBOL - returns mailbox device specification in global symbol >         DCL$MBX_ID  J Maybe a SET MAILBOX /BUFFER_QUOTA= might be helpful, too, if possible, for existing mailboxes.d   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:45:46 -0400 , From: "J. Scott Greig" <jsgreig@geminaq.com>( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)0 Message-ID: <597j7.633$G94.90105@brie.direct.ca>  H I would like to see the RECALL command (specifically /INPUT and /OUTPUT)K work in interactive command procedures, so  that the command stack could beoL "easily" preserved across logins/logouts - not unlike the old PR1ME systems' PRIMOS operating system.   Scottb   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 15:09:15 GMT0 From: fdc@watsun.cc.columbia.edu (Frank da Cruz)( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)5 Message-ID: <9mj0ir$l02$1@newsmaster.cc.columbia.edu>   < In article <cdbc7707.0108290401.b13d9ec@posting.google.com>,! Pierre <moi_is_me@usa.net> wrote:e. : My wish list is fairly simple (in principle) : J :  As much as UNIX annoys me - I do like the auto completion functionality. :  found in the bash shell (perhaps others ?)  : H Few people remember that this feature was pioneered by DEC itself in itsJ TOPS-20 operating system, 1975-1988, RIP.  That's where Bash, Tcl, and allG the others got it from.  (Strictly speaking, it appeared first in BBN'saA TENEX, which became TOPS-20, but TOPS-20 took the radical step ofaC integrating it into the operating system kernel as a system serviceeJ available to all applications, and basing its command processor, the EXEC,H on it.)  DEC killed the 36-bit computers that TOPS-10 and TOPS-20 ran onB just as it killed every other good idea.  Many years ago there wasD considerable agitation to have the completion (filename and keyword)D features added to VMS, and I understand that working prototypes were produced but suppressed.  K Of course you can still have all this if you use C-Kermit as your shell :-)a  -   http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/ckermit.htmlw  I Plus more TOPS-20 features, like menu-on-demand (type "?" at any point in). a command to get a list of the possibilities).   - Frank)   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:36:04 -0700 (PDT)h. From: Fabio Cardoso <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br>( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)@ Message-ID: <20010829163604.38261.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com>   In DCL ?    & a) PRINT/OUTPUT_FORMAT=3DPDF   ;-)  or3 INIT/QUE/PROC=3DPDF$SYMBIONT/OUT_FILES=3Ddirectory.i   b) UNDELETEe  " c) ... not much more ideas in DCL.     In OpenVMS Management Console-  / d) AUTHORIZE : users profiles like NT to create- standard / priviliged users.   In OpenVMS architecure:a  # e) A way to "stop" RWAST processes.-  / f) A way to discover the speed of SCSI devices.0    3 There are a lot of requisitions I would like, but I> think nobody will listen me:  2 g) An Itanium Notebook with the possibility to run OpenVMS.  # h) USB 2.0 x Firewire connectivity.   6 i) The Lan Console for servers - I think people in the% engineering is stressed to read this.m  1 j) Why not create an "Open Firmware" for boot, sos3 we can run any OS (AIX/VMS) in "standard" servers -t/ not prepared for a specific OS like OVMS/Tru64.      Regardsn    
 Fabio Cardoso     1 --- "J. Scott Greig" <jsgreig@geminaq.com> wrote:n6 > I would like to see the RECALL command (specifically > /INPUT and /OUTPUT)a6 > work in interactive command procedures, so  that the > command stack could be0 > "easily" preserved across logins/logouts - not > unlike the old PR1ME systems's > PRIMOS operating system. >=20 > Scotte >=20 >=20     =3D=3D=3D=3D=3DeL =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3Do F=E1bio dos Santos Cardoso OpenVMS System Manager Rio de Janeiro - Brazilh fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.brL =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3Dn  2 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!?H Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:18:00 -0400r2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2908011318010001@user-2ive6du.dialup.mindspring.com>  F In article <20010829163604.38261.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com>, Fabio) Cardoso <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote:w  
 > In DCL ? >  > ( > a) PRINT/OUTPUT_FORMAT=3DPDF   ;-)  or5 > INIT/QUE/PROC=3DPDF$SYMBIONT/OUT_FILES=3Ddirectory.n  ' Perhaps DCPS can be extended to do PDF.e     > In OpenVMS Management Consoleh > 1 > d) AUTHORIZE : users profiles like NT to create  > standard / priviliged users.  0 Do you know about the COPY command in AUTHORIZE?     > In OpenVMS architecure:i > % > e) A way to "stop" RWAST processes.x  F The problem is that RWASTed processes are waiting for _something_.  ToI safely get rid of the process, you have to guarantee that the _something_dI never happens; if it does, the memory that _something_ modifies may be in 2 use for something else, and Bad Things may result.  > Better to spend the effort weeding out the bugs that result in  RWASTed-forever processes, IMHO.   -- i Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comy   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:55:21 -0700s" From: Brad Hughes <brad@tgsmc.com>( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)) Message-ID: <3B8D2C89.95FAD793@tgsmc.com>g   "David J. Dachtera" wrote: [...]  > DCL: > $ > Additional/enhanced functionality:- > - Add support for floating point datatypes.-C > - Add support for .CLBs (Command procedure Libraries - see below)i0 > - Add support for "long" strings (>1024 bytes) >   6 I'd like to be able to run .com files in the debugger: step, examine, deposit, etc...   Brad   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 13:26:57 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> Subject: Re: Nits in Slidess; Message-ID: <6vbpu9fm7i6.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e  2 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:  @ > Incedentally if you are prepared to accept that IA64 really is; > available then its also faster than Alpha as well for allS: > that SPEC results prove. Or hadn't you noticed that the 7 > IA64 SPECfp results are faster than Alpha as well as j > being faster than USIII.  I No I hadn't, because it is a false statement. The IA-64 CFP2000 result iseH 701, and there are five (really three different systems) with results inN the range 756-784 in front of it, using 21264C-1001 and 21264B-833 processors.L Oh, and the CINT2000 result is even worse than that of the US-III, and worse' than current Alphas by a factor of 2.5.s   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 13:08:07 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>B Subject: Re: Nits in Slides (was: Re: The Final Knell Has Sounded); Message-ID: <6vbr8tvm8dk.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>l  2 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:   > in cache benchmarks like SPECo  K On any machine with less than 256 MB of memory, CFP2000 will start trashingaI due to paging - wupwise is especially susceptible to this. Please show meaK the (single-processor - SPECOMP addresses SMP machines) machine with 256 MB1	 of cache..  M AFAIR, the only CFP2000 component with a working set small enough to fit intoIN the cache of a current machine is art, and I will go on record that I think itM was a mistake to be included (and that isn't because I am of the opinion thatp ART is snake oil).   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 16:02:25 GMT5 From: koehler@bessta.gsfc.nasa.aspm.gov (Bob Koehler) " Subject: Re: ODS-5 and parse_style/ Message-ID: <9mj3mh$d73$2@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov>b  F >Do you know whether there is a way to force the uppercase in the file; >name when I create it, for example, by a fortran program ?  >n   Several approaches, including:  F If there is an already existing file by the same name, the new version0 will have the same case as the existing version.  > The Fortran variable containing the name can be passed through STR$UPCASE.n  E If you're dealling with an existing system which assumes all upperace?G names, it could be fixed to be case insensitive by passing the names ita: gets through STR$UPCASE before doing any matching on them.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationm= GSFC Code 582 Flight Software   | Federal Sector, Civil Group)I                                 | please remove any ".aspm" when replyinga   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:58:39 +0200k' From: "H.Wild" <heino.wild@tmt-gmbh.de>A Subject: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3a3 Message-ID: <9mil8r$kpn$1@koroth.muc.eurocyber.net>-  , This is a multi-part message in MIME format.  + ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C13092.B4717F20j Content-Type: text/plain;  	charset="iso-8859-1"3+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   J i am running OpenVMS 7.3 on a Digital AlphaStation 200/250 whit a 3DLabs = Oxygen VX1 PCI 64MB.< The X Server can't start and bring a Error message like this    "Iternal CPU error code 1131"=20  * can somebody help me whit this problem?=20  + ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C13092.B4717F20  Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1" + Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printablew  > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD>7 <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =h charset=3Diso-8859-1">9 <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=3DGENERATOR>r <STYLE></STYLE>o </HEAD>g <BODY bgColor=3D#d7d7d7>H <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>i am running OpenVMS 7.3 on a Digital = AlphaStation=20s7 200/250 whit a 3DLabs Oxygen VX1 PCI 64MB.</FONT></DIV>aG <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The X Server can't start and bring a =s Error message=20 like this</FONT></DIV>4 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>@ <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"Iternal CPU error code 1131" =
 </FONT></DIV>o4 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>J <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>can somebody help me whit this problem? =   </FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>   - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C13092.B4717F20--t   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 08:16:56 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)i# Subject: Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3r3 Message-ID: <D34CLHYQmZ1h@eisner.encompasserve.org>.  ] In article <9mil8r$kpn$1@koroth.muc.eurocyber.net>, "H.Wild" <heino.wild@tmt-gmbh.de> writes: . > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.  ' Please do not post MIME to comp.os.vms.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:43:40 -04003. From: "Kenneth Randell" <kenr@datametrics.com># Subject: Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3 + Message-ID: <9miri0$6ge$1@bob.news.rcn.net>0  , This is a multi-part message in MIME format.  + ------=_NextPart_000_0103_01C1306F.15B9DD50  Content-Type: text/plain;x 	charset="iso-8859-1"c+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printables  H Forgive the Mime (it's what I get with Outlook Express), but I thought =D Fred said in an earlier thread that the 3DLabs Oxygen software was =G compiled for EV6 (21264) and later only.  Alphastation 200/250 is NOT =l EV6.  , I don't believe you can get there from here.   Ken Randelln4   H.Wild <heino.wild@tmt-gmbh.de> wrote in message =- news:9mil8r$kpn$1@koroth.muc.eurocyber.net....E   i am running OpenVMS 7.3 on a Digital AlphaStation 200/250 whit a =g 3DLabs Oxygen VX1 PCI 64MB.c>   The X Server can't start and bring a Error message like this   =20o"   "Iternal CPU error code 1131"=20   =20t,   can somebody help me whit this problem?=20  + ------=_NextPart_000_0103_01C1306F.15B9DD50u Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1"e+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printablet  > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD>3 <META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =  http-equiv=3DContent-Type>9 <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR>  <STYLE></STYLE>4 </HEAD>c <BODY bgColor=3D#d7d7d7>D <DIV><FONT size=3D2>Forgive the Mime (it's what I get with Outlook = Express), but I=20H thought Fred said in an earlier thread that the 3DLabs Oxygen software = was=20H compiled for EV6 (21264) and later only.&nbsp; Alphastation 200/250 is = NOT=20 EV6.</FONT></DIV>e <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> < <DIV><FONT size=3D2>I don't believe you can get there from = here.</FONT></DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>l, <DIV><FONT size=3D2>Ken Randell</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=20J style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =, 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">   <DIV>H.Wild &lt;<A=20 I   href=3D"mailto:heino.wild@tmt-gmbh.de">heino.wild@tmt-gmbh.de</A>&gt; =- wrote in=20    message <A=20    =:J href=3D"news:9mil8r$kpn$1@koroth.muc.eurocyber.net">news:9mil8r$kpn$1@kor=" oth.muc.eurocyber.net</A>...</DIV>J   <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>i am running OpenVMS 7.3 on a Digital =  F   AlphaStation 200/250 whit a 3DLabs Oxygen VX1 PCI 64MB.</FONT></DIV>I   <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The X Server can't start and bring a =I Error=20    message like this</FONT></DIV>6   <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>B   <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"Iternal CPU error code 1131" =
 </FONT></DIV>h6   <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>C   <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>can somebody help me whit this =t problem?=20 *   </FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>  - ------=_NextPart_000_0103_01C1306F.15B9DD50--o   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 09:25:25 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) # Subject: Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3 3 Message-ID: <YedAcsvP$7CK@eisner.encompasserve.org>   \ In article <9miri0$6ge$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "Kenneth Randell" <kenr@datametrics.com> writes:. > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > - > ------=_NextPart_000_0103_01C1306F.15B9DD50n > Content-Type: text/plain;u > 	charset="iso-8859-1"s- > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printablen > : > Forgive the Mime (it's what I get with Outlook Express),  ' Others have discussed ways to avoid it.n   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:45:58 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)# Subject: Re: Oxygen on OpenVMS V7.3u2 Message-ID: <W68j7.938$bB1.44393@news.cpqcorp.net>  ] In article <9mil8r$kpn$1@koroth.muc.eurocyber.net>, "H.Wild" <heino.wild@tmt-gmbh.de> writes:,  9   Please turn off MIME within your posting tool.  Thanks!>  I :i am running OpenVMS 7.3 on a Digital AlphaStation 200/250 whit a 3DLabs> :Oxygen VX1 PCI 64MB.b  F   An AlphaStation 200 or an AlphaStation 250?  (I don't recall that an/   AlphaStation 200 4/250 series was available.)a  F   AFAIK, the 3DLabs Oxygen VX1 driver testing was with a 32MB version.  F   I also don't know off-hand that anyone has tried the Oxygen VX1 withF   a system this old -- hardware support tends to target newer systems.    = :The X Server can't start and bring a Error message like thist :n :"Iternal CPU error code 1131"  /   Have any errors been logged in the error log?e  F   Where do you see that message?  (In the DECW$*.LOG server log file?)    ( :can somebody help me whit this problem?  I   You will want to install the available mandatory ECO kits for OpenVMS, tG   and you will want to install any ECO kit that might be available for cG   the particular version of DECwindows is in use here.  (As a start...)d    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2001 23:35:40 -0700( From: rob@denbraber.org (Rob den Braber)Y Subject: printing problems SYSTEM-F-LINKDISCON, network partner disconnected logical linki= Message-ID: <9fa0ae66.0108282235.57958708@posting.google.com>l   Hello,  E Since we moved to a new cluster and TCPIP version 5 we constantly getd8 the following order when printjobs are sent to printers:C SYSTEM-F-LINKDISCON, network partner disconnected logical link. TheiF printers are located at locations troughout the country. When I take a@ look into the logfile of the telnetsymbiont I see the following:  C Fri Aug 24 01:07:30 2001, output_routine returning status: 172032095: (%PSM-S-PENDING, asynchronous operation not yet completed)D Fri Aug 24 01:07:30 2001, output_routine entered. Code = PSM$K_WRITE2 Fri Aug 24 01:07:30 2001, Running at AST level = 1? Fri Aug 24 01:07:30 2001, sys$cantim on work_area timer 1936004 C Fri Aug 24 01:07:30 2001, output_routine returning status: 17203209-: (%PSM-S-PENDING, asynchronous operation not yet completed)8 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_completion_ast entered.9 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, sys$cantim on work_area 1936004a0 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, perp_read_ast entered.< Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, IOSB[0] 8412  [1] 54  [2] 0  [3] 0? Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, perp_read_ast IOSB status: connect to " network object timed-out or failedA Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, cleanup entered. cleanup_status = 8412,e read_pending = 0: Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, cleanup doing all cleanup itself2 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, cleanup doing sys$cancel@ Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, cleanup doing ruthless link disconnect (IO$_DEACCESS)5 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, cleanup deassigning channelO0 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, perp_read_ast exiting.8 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_completion_ast entered.9 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, sys$cantim on work_area 1936004nF Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output: network partner disconnected logical link8 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_completion_ast entered.9 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, sys$cantim on work_area 1936004eF Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output: network partner disconnected logical linkD Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_routine entered. Code = PSM$K_WRITE2 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, Running at AST level = 1; Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_routine has no IO channel.mA Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, The output buffer that couldn't be senta follows." Output Buffer Dump: (Length = 207)P 7,4099;PU2098,1898PD2098,1822PU;SD1,14,2,0,3,10,5,0,6,0,7,4099;PU2404,867PD2404,P 791PU;SD1,14,2,0,3,10,5,0,6,0,7,4099;PU2404,981PD2404,905PU;SD1,14,2,0,3,10,5,0,3 6,0,7,4099;PU2404,1096PD2404,1020PU;SD1,14,2,\ D\ C0 End of Output Buffer Dump2> Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_routine returning status: 436. (%SYSTEM-F-NOIOCHAN, no I/O channel available)8 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, output_routine entered. Code = PSM$K_START_TASK2 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, Running at AST level = 10 Fri Aug 24 01:12:29 2001, Function not supported  " The TCPTRACE file looks like this:  P --------------------------------------------------------------------------------  c;    TCPIPtrace full display XMT packet 178446 at 24-AUG-2001> 01:12:03.97y  lF    IP Version = 4,  IHL = 5,  TOS = 00,   Total Length = 576 = ^x0240 5    IP Identifier  = ^x4FC3,  Flags (0=0,DF=1,MF=0),  L@          Fragment Offset = 0 = ^x0000,   Calculated Offset = 0 = ^x0000F    IP TTL = 60 = ^x3C,  Protocol = 6 = ^x06,  Header Checksum = ^x21C9'    IP Source Address      = 100.20.0.2 v'    IP Destination Address = 101.0.2.22 k  8    TCP Source Port = 1404,  TCP Destination Port = 9100 6    TCP Sequence Number      = 1109902268 = ^x4227C3BC 3    TCP Acknowledge Number   = 7077097 = ^x006BFCE9 T4        Flags (URG=0,ACK=1,PSH=0,RST=0,SYN=0,FIN=0), C                                            Window = 33232 = ^x81D0 s8    TCP Checksum = ^xDAA8,   Urgent Pointer = 0 = ^x0000   7    02001464   C921063C   0040C34F   40020045    0000     E..@O.@.<.!.d...7    E9FC6B00   BCC32742   8C237C05 | 16020065    0010   = e....|#.B'...k..7    2C322C34   312C3144 | 0000A8DA   D0811050    0020   r P.......D1,14,2,7    372C302C   362C302C   352C3031   2C332C30    0030   = 0,3,10,5,0,6,0,77    3834362C   38303931   55503B39   3930342C    0040   _ ,4099;PU1908,6487    3144533B   55503639   342C3830   39314450    0050   c PD1908,496PU;SD17    302C352C   30312C33   2C302C32   2C34312C    0060   o ,14,2,0,3,10,5,07    39315550   3B393930   342C372C   302C362C    0070     ,6,0,7,4099;PU197    36382C38   30393144   50303230   312C3830    0080     08,1020PD1908,867    332C302C   322C3431   2C314453   3B555038    0090   e 8PU;SD1,14,2,0,37    30342C37   2C302C36   2C302C35   2C30312C    00A0   0 ,10,5,0,6,0,7,407    32445038   34362C38   39303255   503B3939    00B0   n 99;PU2098,648PD27    34312C31   44533B55   50363934   2C383930    00C0   D 098,496PU;SD1,147    2C362C30   2C352C30   312C332C   302C322C    00D0   P ,2,0,3,10,5,0,6,7    2C383930   3255503B   39393034   2C372C30    00E0   i 0,7,4099;PU2098,7    55503836   382C3839   30324450   30323031    00F0     1020PD2098,868PU7    30312C33   2C302C32   2C34312C   3144533B    0100   w ;SD1,14,2,0,3,107    3B393930   342C372C   302C362C   302C352C    0110     ,5,0,6,0,7,4099;7    34303432   44503834   362C3430   34325550    0120   a PU2404,648PD24047    2C322C34   312C3144   533B5550   3639342C    0130   o ,496PU;SD1,14,2,7    372C302C   362C302C   352C3031   2C332C30    0140   s 0,3,10,5,0,6,0,77    3230312C   34303432   55503B39   3930342C    0150   S ,4099;PU2404,1027    44533B55   50383638   2C343034   32445030    0160   n 0PD2404,868PU;SD7    2C352C30   312C332C   302C322C   34312C31    0170     1,14,2,0,3,10,5,7    3255503B   39393034   2C372C30   2C362C30    0180   f 0,6,0,7,4099;PU27    39342C39   30373244   50383436   2C393037    0190     709,648PD2709,497    332C302C   322C3431   2C314453   3B555036    01A0   u 6PU;SD1,14,2,0,37    30342C37   2C302C36   2C302C35   2C30312C    01B0   o ,10,5,0,6,0,7,407    44503032   30312C39   30373255   503B3939    01C0   y 99;PU2709,1020PD7    312C3144   533B5550   3836382C   39303732    01D0   x 2709,868PU;SD1,17    362C302C   352C3031   2C332C30   2C322C34    01E0   9 4,2,0,3,10,5,0,67    34313033   55503B39   3930342C   372C302C    01F0   - ,0,7,4099;PU30147    55503639   342C3431   30334450   3834362C    0200   s ,648PD3014,496PU7    30312C33   2C302C32   2C34312C   3144533B    0210   > ;SD1,14,2,0,3,107    3B393930   342C372C   302C362C   302C352C    0220   s ,5,0,6,0,7,4099;7    31303344   50303230   312C3431   30335550    0230     PU3014,1020PD301  n  y  n  cP --------------------------------------------------------------------------------  r;    TCPIPtrace full display RCV packet 178886 at 24-AUG-2001  01:12:29.622   E    IP Version = 4,  IHL = 5,  TOS = 00,   Total Length = 40 = ^x0028 t5    IP Identifier  = ^xC151,  Flags (0=0,DF=0,MF=0),  1@          Fragment Offset = 0 = ^x0000,   Calculated Offset = 0 = ^x0000F    IP TTL = 58 = ^x3A,  Protocol = 6 = ^x06,  Header Checksum = ^xF452'    IP Source Address      = 101.0.2.22 -'    IP Destination Address = 100.20.0.2 +  8    TCP Source Port = 9100,  TCP Destination Port = 1404 3    TCP Sequence Number      = 7077097 = ^x006BFCE9  6    TCP Acknowledge Number   = 1109901732 = ^x4227C1A4 4        Flags (URG=0,ACK=1,PSH=0,RST=1,SYN=0,FIN=0), ?                                            Window = 0 = ^x0000 o8    TCP Checksum = ^xBA7B,   Urgent Pointer = 0 = ^x0000   7    16020065   52F4063A   000051C1   28000045    0000   l E..(.Q..:..Re...7    A4C12742   E9FC6B00   7C058C23 | 02001464    0010   r d...#..|.k..B'..F        0000   00000000 | 00007BBA   00001450    0020    P....{........  h  w  i  sP --------------------------------------------------------------------------------   ;    TCPIPtrace full display XMT packet 178902 at 24-AUG-2001t 01:12:29.84e  aE    IP Version = 4,  IHL = 5,  TOS = 00,   Total Length = 48 = ^x0030 -5    IP Identifier  = ^x50A1,  Flags (0=0,DF=0,MF=0),  o@          Fragment Offset = 0 = ^x0000,   Calculated Offset = 0 = ^x0000F    IP TTL = 60 = ^x3C,  Protocol = 6 = ^x06,  Header Checksum = ^x62FB'    IP Source Address      = 100.20.0.2 p'    IP Destination Address = 101.0.2.22 t  8    TCP Source Port = 1477,  TCP Destination Port = 9100 6    TCP Sequence Number      = 1178359443 = ^x463C5693 -    TCP Acknowledge Number   = 0 = ^x00000000 h4        Flags (URG=0,ACK=0,PSH=0,RST=0,SYN=1,FIN=0), C                                            Window = 32768 = ^x8000 y8    TCP Checksum = ^x72D2,   Urgent Pointer = 0 = ^x0000   A    TCP Option = 2 MAXSEG Option Length = 4, Segment Size = 1460 =t ^x05B4      TCP Option = 1 NODELAY   7    02001464   FB62063C   0000A150   30000045    0000   - E..0P...<.b.d...7    00000000   93563C46   8C23C505 | 16020065    0010     e.....#.F<V.....7  | 00030301   B4050402   0000D272   00800270    0020   e p...r...........  r  )      P --------------------------------------------------------------------------------  -;    TCPIPtrace full display RCV packet 178904 at 24-AUG-2001r 01:12:29.85<  nE    IP Version = 4,  IHL = 5,  TOS = 00,   Total Length = 44 = ^x002C i5    IP Identifier  = ^xC152,  Flags (0=0,DF=0,MF=0),  -@          Fragment Offset = 0 = ^x0000,   Calculated Offset = 0 = ^x0000F    IP TTL = 58 = ^x3A,  Protocol = 6 = ^x06,  Header Checksum = ^xF44D'    IP Source Address      = 101.0.2.22 i'    IP Destination Address = 100.20.0.2 2  8    TCP Source Port = 9100,  TCP Destination Port = 1477 3    TCP Sequence Number      = 7080383 = ^x006C09BF e6    TCP Acknowledge Number   = 1178359444 = ^x463C5694 4        Flags (URG=0,ACK=1,PSH=0,RST=0,SYN=1,FIN=0), B                                            Window = 2144 = ^x0860 8    TCP Checksum = ^xF7D9,   Urgent Pointer = 0 = ^x0000   @    TCP Option = 2 MAXSEG Option Length = 4, Segment Size = 536 = ^x0218  7    16020065   4DF4063A   000052C1   2C000045    0000   - E..,.R..:..Me...7    94563C46   BF096C00   C5058C23 | 02001464    0010   E d...#....l..F<V.F        0000 | 18020402   0000D9F7   60081260    0020    `..`..........     n      P --------------------------------------------------------------------------------  D;    TCPIPtrace full display XMT packet 178905 at 24-AUG-2001r 01:12:29.85    E    IP Version = 4,  IHL = 5,  TOS = 00,   Total Length = 40 = ^x0028 35    IP Identifier  = ^x50A3,  Flags (0=0,DF=0,MF=0),  2@          Fragment Offset = 0 = ^x0000,   Calculated Offset = 0 = ^x0000F    IP TTL = 60 = ^x3C,  Protocol = 6 = ^x06,  Header Checksum = ^x6301'    IP Source Address      = 100.20.0.2 T'    IP Destination Address = 101.0.2.22 t  8    TCP Source Port = 1477,  TCP Destination Port = 9100 6    TCP Sequence Number      = 1178359444 = ^x463C5694 3    TCP Acknowledge Number   = 7080384 = ^x006C09C0  4        Flags (URG=0,ACK=1,PSH=0,RST=0,SYN=0,FIN=0), C                                            Window = 33232 = ^x81D0 >8    TCP Checksum = ^x928A,   Urgent Pointer = 0 = ^x0000   7    02001464   0163063C   0000A350   28000045    0000   M E..(P...<.c.d...7    C0096C00   94563C46   8C23C505 | 16020065    0010   0 e.....#.F<V..l..@                        | 00008A92   D0811050    0020    P.......    3 Is there anybody who has a clue of what's going on?r   Rob den Braber   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 12:51:30 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>( Subject: Re: Some postive points I hope.; Message-ID: <6vbvgj7m959.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e  + John Johnstone <jj_usenet@mail.com> writes:h  H > Don't forget that even with VMS Backup, although it does a good job ofM > keeping the tape fully occupied during a restore, a restore pretty much hashI > to take longer than the backup since there's much more overhead, on VMSmK > especially, to create a new file on disk compared to backing up a file toV > tape.   M Why would that be the case? For the restore, you know how many files you willeL restore (if /IMAGE), so you allocate the volume's index file appropriately. M Then all you have to do is copy files from tape to contiguous disk areas, and-N update the index file once in a while. For anything but a totally defragmented. disk, this should be _faster_ than the backup.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:12:38 -0400H- From: "Richard D. Piccard" <piccard@ohio.edu>-( Subject: Re: Some postive points I hope.( Message-ID: <3B8CF853.1C2EE5C9@ohio.edu>   Jan C Vorbrueggen wrote:  - > John Johnstone <jj_usenet@mail.com> writes:O >sJ > > Don't forget that even with VMS Backup, although it does a good job ofO > > keeping the tape fully occupied during a restore, a restore pretty much has0K > > to take longer than the backup since there's much more overhead, on VMSOM > > especially, to create a new file on disk compared to backing up a file tov	 > > tape.e >hO > Why would that be the case? For the restore, you know how many files you willlM > restore (if /IMAGE), so you allocate the volume's index file appropriately.-O > Then all you have to do is copy files from tape to contiguous disk areas, andH  "                           ^^^^^^^^  M "have to do" is the key phrase -- my observation has been that in fact BACKUPAO updated the directory file and INDEXF.SYS for each restored file, sequentially.@P Perhaps more recent versions of BACKUP are brighter when doing an /IMAGE restore
 operation.  +                                         RDP0    P > update the index file once in a while. For anything but a totally defragmented0 > disk, this should be _faster_ than the backup. >e
 >         Jan<   --B ==================================================================B Dick Piccard                           Academic Technology ManagerB piccard@ohio.edu                                 Computer ServicesB http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~piccard/                Ohio University   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:02:38 -0400a. From: "W. Sherman" <sherman@ssdd.nrl.navy.mil>& Subject: SYS UAF / Password Expiration) Message-ID: <9miooo$1e$1@ra.nrl.navy.mil>   E Is there some way, either via lexical functions in command script, ordK something already established in vms, to notify users via e-mail that their. password is about to expire?  K The reason I ask is that I have numerous users that only use the server for E mail (pop and imap).  When their password expires they aren't able tonL retrieve mail.  These users almost NEVER connect to the server for any otherJ reasons, so the passwords expire without them even knowing it.....it makes  for an administrative nightmare.  ' Any help in this matter is appreciated.,   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 08:28:21 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) * Subject: Re: SYS UAF / Password Expiration3 Message-ID: <z+eHaz0Oak4e@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  Z In article <9miooo$1e$1@ra.nrl.navy.mil>, "W. Sherman" <sherman@ssdd.nrl.navy.mil> writes:G > Is there some way, either via lexical functions in command script, or M > something already established in vms, to notify users via e-mail that theirl > password is about to expire?  ; The LOGIN_FLAGS item for $GETJPI provides this information.   M > The reason I ask is that I have numerous users that only use the server fordG > mail (pop and imap).  When their password expires they aren't able totN > retrieve mail.  These users almost NEVER connect to the server for any otherL > reasons, so the passwords expire without them even knowing it.....it makes" > for an administrative nightmare.  < Transmitting it via your mail protocol is a different issue.  ? Of course if your mail protocol does not actually use LOGINOUT, ; this does not help and you would have to resort to $GETUAI.y   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:18:36 -0400i  From: jamese@beast.dtsw.army.mil* Subject: Re: SYS UAF / Password Expiration0 Message-ID: <01082911183634@beast.dtsw.army.mil>  O "W. Sherman" <sherman@ssdd.nrl.navy.mil> wrote in <9miooo$1e$1@ra.nrl.navy.mil>s# on Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:02:38 -0400:p  G > Is there some way, either via lexical functions in command script, or-M > something already established in vms, to notify users via e-mail that theira > password is about to expire? > M > The reason I ask is that I have numerous users that only use the server fornG > mail (pop and imap).  When their password expires they aren't able to N > retrieve mail.  These users almost NEVER connect to the server for any otherL > reasons, so the passwords expire without them even knowing it.....it makes" > for an administrative nightmare. > ) > Any help in this matter is appreciated.F  C Attached is password_days_left.c.  We run it in a nightly batch jobaD and send mail to users that have passwords that are about to expire.  : Ed James                           ed.james@telecomsys.com5 TeleCommunications Systems, Inc.   voice 410-295-1919:; 2024 West Street, Suite 300              800-810-0827 x1919o5 Annapolis, MD 21401-3556           fax   410-280-1094r  C /*    password-days-left.c    show days left until password expires=A         Parts of this program based on dormant.c by Darrell Blair   >     Ed James                           ed.james@telecomsys.com9     TeleCommunications Systems, Inc.   voice 410-295-1919e?     2024 West Street, Suite 300              800-810-0827 x1919r9     Annapolis, MD 21401-3556           fax   410-280-1094r   */  )     char  version[15] = "03200006090940";    #include ssdef #include stdlib  #include stdio #include string0 #include descrip #include uaidefa #include starlet #include lib$routinest #include str$routines0  5 #define check(stat) if ((stat&1) != 1) lib$stop(stat)e* #define test(stat)  if(((stat)&1) != 1) {\J                         if(exit_with_count_only) exit((stat)|0x90000000);\/                         else lib$stop((stat));}u #define ERRMSG fprintf(stderr,   typedef int BOOL;:  9 typedef struct itmlst { short buffer_length,   item_code; E                         long *buffer_address, *return_length_address;o	 } ITMLST;e   typedef unsigned long LONG;y+ typedef struct { LONG long1, long2; } TIME;:  O /*===========================================================================*/   % void show_command_line_options( void)  { 9    ERRMSG "PASSWORD-DAYS-LEFT V(%s) syntax:\n", version); /    ERRMSG "password_days_left [parameters]\n");e,    ERRMSG " -h        Display this help\n");6    ERRMSG " -u name   User account name. REQUIRED\n");D    ERRMSG " -w nnn    Warn if password expires within nnn days.\n");1    ERRMSG " -x        Exit with status only.\n");     ERRMSG "\n");K    ERRMSG " The program always returns status of the form: %%X10ddddds\n");,/    ERRMSG "  where:  10    inhibit message\n");,8    ERRMSG "          ddddd is days until expiration\n");E    ERRMSG "          s     severity: 1 normal exit, 0 warning - \n");,O    ERRMSG "                password will expire within warn days (see -w).\n");2
    return;) }  /* end of show_command_line_options */F  O /*===========================================================================*/r   main( int argc, char *argv[])  {   ;     static TIME last_pwd_change, pwd_lifetime, pwd_expires;      static long uaiflags;dD     int         ii, days_in_era, days_to_pwd_change, context = (-1);K     int         scan_rc, lifetime_days, day_of_week, status, warn_days = 7;d)     int         expire_days, exit_status;1:     BOOL        param_error = FALSE, display_help = FALSE;)     BOOL        return_code_only = FALSE;r-     BOOL        exit_with_count_only = FALSE;     /*nL          The program always exits with a status code of the form: 0x10ddddds             where:-                10    VMS inhibit message flagd0                ddddd Days until password expires                s     Severity:(                      1 normal completionH                      0 warning - password expires in less than warn days  G          If the password expires in less than warn days, the expiration=&          date is printed in a message.  G          If exit_with_count_only is set to TRUE, no message is printed.   E          System status return codes are returned as negative numbers.0H          The next higher level (usually a command file) then must decideG          what to do. The high bit ('80000000'x) used to fake a negative0B          number is reserved for DEC use but not used as of 930714.     */        struct      dsc$descriptor_sL                   user_desc =        { 0, DSC$K_DTYPE_T, DSC$K_CLASS_S, 0 },L                   time_string_desc = { 0, DSC$K_DTYPE_T, DSC$K_CLASS_S, 0 };     short       timlen;3     char        user[255];B     char        time_string[] = "dd-mmm-yyyy hh:mm:ss.cc DISUSER";  N     char        days[7][10] = { "Monday", "Tuesday",  "Wednesday", "Thursday",A                                 "Friday", "Saturday", "Sunday" };        ITMLST uai_itmlst[4] = {O       { sizeof( TIME),     UAI$_PWD_DATE,       (long *) &last_pwd_change, 0 },5O       { sizeof( TIME),     UAI$_PWD_LIFETIME,   (long *) &pwd_lifetime,    0 }, O       { sizeof( uaiflags), UAI$_FLAGS,          &uaiflags,                 0 },CP       { 0,                 0,                   0,                         0 }};  !     for( ii=1; ii < argc; ii++) {0!         if( argv[ii][0] == '-') { "             switch( argv[ii][1]) {             case 'h' :$                 display_help = TRUE;                 break;             case 'u' :'                 if( (ii + 1) >= argc) {5>                     ERRMSG "Argument missing %s\n", argv[ii]);'                     param_error = TRUE;                  }                  else {4                     user[sizeof( user) - 1] == '\0';B                     strncpy( user, argv[ii+1], sizeof( user) - 1);                     ii++;S                 }                  break;             case 'w' :'                 if( (ii + 1) >= argc) { >                     ERRMSG "Argument missing %s\n", argv[ii]);'                     param_error = TRUE;0                 },                 else {D                     scan_rc = sscanf( argv[ii+1], "%d", &warn_days);'                     if( scan_rc != 1) { B                         ERRMSG "Argument missing %s\n", argv[ii]);+                         param_error = TRUE;3                     }                      ii++;P                 }2                 break;             case 'x' :,                 exit_with_count_only = TRUE;                 break;             default :0:                 ERRMSG "Unknown argument %s\n", argv[ii]);#                 param_error = TRUE;C                 break;
             } 	         }4         else {6             ERRMSG "Unknown argument %s\n", argv[ii]);             param_error = TRUE; 	         }     }'     if( display_help || param_error) {;3$         show_command_line_options();A         exit( param_error == TRUE ? EXIT_FAILURE : EXIT_SUCCESS);-     }-     if( user[0] == '\0') {0         ERRMSG "Username parameter required\n");$         show_command_line_options();         exit( EXIT_FAILURE);     },  ,     user_desc.dsc$w_length  = strlen( user);#     user_desc.dsc$a_pointer = user;a  1     status = str$upcase( &user_desc, &user_desc);=     test( status);  >     time_string_desc.dsc$w_length  = sizeof( time_string) - 1;1     time_string_desc.dsc$a_pointer = time_string;   '     status = lib$day( &days_in_era, 0);s     test( status);  H     status = sys$getuai( 0, &context, &user_desc, &uai_itmlst, 0, 0, 0);     test( status);  =     status = lib$day( &days_to_pwd_change, &last_pwd_change);C     test( status);  =     if( pwd_lifetime.long1 == 0 && pwd_lifetime.long2 == 0) {   N         exit( 0x10fffff1);  /* fffff = 1048575 days, i.e., does not expire. */       }0  5     status = lib$day( &lifetime_days, &pwd_lifetime);0     test( status);  K     status = lib$add_times( &last_pwd_change, &pwd_lifetime, &pwd_expires);.     test( status);  C     status = sys$asctim( &timlen, &time_string_desc, &pwd_expires);-     test( status);     time_string[timlen] = '\0';-  :     status = lib$day_of_week( &pwd_expires, &day_of_week);     test( status);  K     expire_days = (days_to_pwd_change + abs( lifetime_days)) - days_in_era;g  #     if( uaiflags & UAI$M_DISACNT) { (         strcat( time_string, "DISUSER");     }m  A     exit_status = ((expire_days & 0x000fffff) << 4) | 0x10000001;   #     if( expire_days <= warn_days) {dO         exit_status = exit_status & 0xfffffff0; /* make severity 0 (warning) */ %         if( ! exit_with_count_only) { D             printf( "Password for %s expires in %d days on %s %s\n",E                 user, expire_days, days[day_of_week-1], time_string);0	         }      }(     exit( exit_status);Y },   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:31:26 +02000C From: Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann <vaxinf@chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de>P" Subject: Re: Travan drives on OVMS> Message-ID: <00A013F5.D690A585.1@CHCLU.CHEMIE.UNI-KONSTANZ.DE>   Alan,1  D >On Tue, 28 Aug 2001 10:41:58 +0100, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> >wrote:   = >>On Tue, 28 Aug 2001 09:54:59 +0200, Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann0. >><vaxinf@chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de> wrote: >>	 >>>David,. >>>.1 >>>I have tested a QIC-Drive Archive Model 2150S.-5 >>>This type of drive doesn't work with OVMS 7.1/AXP.T >>5 >>When you say doesn't work what actually goes wrong?1  A >Do you have all the appropriate patches installed for 7.1 or anyhD >chance you could upgrade to 7.2-1 or 7.3? DEC and Compaq have triedF >hard to allow third party tape drives to work under VMS and generallyB >they do. One recent problem we had when HP drives stopped working@ >under 7.3 EFT2 (field test) was promptly addressed for example.G >Another recent problem with a Sony DAT drive was fixed with a firmware D >upgrade to the drive. Maybe you could try  a firmware upgrade. NoteF >you will probably have to attach the box to an Windoze box to upgradeE >the firmware as we had to do. Also check for any DIP switch settings  >recommended for VMS.^  E >Btw, could you post the actual VMS error you receive when attemptingP >to INIT the tape.  & Fatal drive error (OpenVMS 7.1 + 7.3).   This is what scsi_info says:J ========================================================================== $! $! SCSI_INFO V1A2  $!F $!	Copyright (c) 1995 by DIGITAL Equipment Corporation, Maynard, Mass.G $!	All Rights Reserved. Unpublished rights reserved under the copyright- $!	laws of the United States.- $!& $! Invoked on Wed Aug 29 08:50:31 2001 $! $! Issuing INQUIRY QIOWG $!$ $!   SCSI Inquiry Data (52 bytes) :  $!> $!      000:  01 80 01 00 2F 00 00 00 41 52 43 48 49 56 45 20 > $!      010:  56 49 50 45 52 20 31 35 30 20 20 32 31 32 34 37 > $!      020:  2D 30 30 35 20 56 50 31 35 30 53 2D 30 35 06 06  $!      030:  06 06 06 06  $!- $!	Peripheral Device Type : Sequential Accesse $!  $!	Peripheral Device Qualifier : $!: $!		Peripheral device type supported & connected to target $!# $!	Vendor Identification : ARCHIVE u $!+ $!	Product Identification: VIPER 150  21247o $! $!	Product Revision Level: -0050 $! $!	ANSI Information: $!) $!		Complies to ANSI X3.131-1986 (SCSI-1)  $! $!	ISO Information:  $!8 $!		0 - does not claim ISO SCSI (ISO IS 9316) compliance $! $!	ECMA Information: $!6 $!		0 - does not claim ECMA SCSI (ECMA-111) compliance $! $!	Removable Media: Yes  $! $!	AEN Capability: No0 $! $!	Command Queuing: No $!% $!	16-Bit Wide Bus Data Transfers: No0 $!% $!	32-Bit Wide Bus Data Transfers: Noy $! $!	Linked Commands: No $! $!	Soft Reset Alternative: No- $! $!	Relative Addressing: No $!! $!	Synchronous Data Transfers: No  $!" $! Issuing Test Unit Ready command $!O $! ========================== Read-Write Error Recovery Page ==================9 $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 01h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. Falseo/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70ho/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00he/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05h 1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ Falset1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False 1 $!      Filemark .......................... Falsep5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000hm/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06hi5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000he/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00he/ $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00h-4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... FalseS0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. False / $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00h / $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00hu $!O $! ============================ Disconnect-Reconnect Page =====================t $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 02h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. Falseu/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70hA/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00ho/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05he1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ False 1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False 1 $!      Filemark .......................... FalseB5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000ha/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06hc5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000hE/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h / $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00hn4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... False 0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. Falsec/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00hy/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!O $! ============================== Peripheral Device Page ======================n $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 09h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. False / $!      Error Code ........................ 70he/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00h / $!      Sense Key ......................... 05hr1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ Falses1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False.1 $!      Filemark .......................... False 5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000h / $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06hx5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000ha/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00he/ $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00h-4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... FalseU0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. False1/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00hn/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!O $! ================================ Control Mode Page =========================  $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 0Ah $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. Falsen/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70he/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00h / $!      Sense Key ......................... 05ho1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ Falses1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... Falseg1 $!      Filemark .......................... False 5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000hO/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06ho5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000h / $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00ha/ $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00hP4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... Falsev0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. Falsem/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00hr/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!O $! ============================ Device Configuration Page =====================s $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 10h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. Falses/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70hm/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00hn/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05hd1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ Falsea1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... Falses1 $!      Filemark .......................... False 5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000hs/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06ht5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000ho/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h / $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00ht4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... False 0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. False5/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00h / $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h5 $!O $! ============================ Medium Partition (1) Page =====================  $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 11h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. Falsea/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70h / $!      Segment Number .................... 00h)/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05h;1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ FalseO1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False,1 $!      Filemark .......................... Falser5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000he/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06hg5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000h=/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h / $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00hR4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... False 0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. False / $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00hi/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!O $! ============================ Medium Partition (2) Page =====================f $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 12h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. False / $!      Error Code ........................ 70hr/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00hF/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05h=1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ Falsec1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... Falsea1 $!      Filemark .......................... Falsea5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000hc/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06hl5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000h / $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h / $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00h / $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 00hO1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... False 0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. False / $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00h / $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!O $! ============================ Medium Partition (3) Page =====================  $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 13h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. False / $!      Error Code ........................ 70hd/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00hl/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05h 1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ Falset1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False 1 $!      Filemark .......................... Falset5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000h / $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06h 5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000h,/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h / $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00hr4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... Falsee0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. Falseu/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00h_/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!O $! ============================ Medium Partition (4) Page =====================  $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 14h $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. False / $!      Error Code ........................ 70h / $!      Segment Number .................... 00h / $!      Sense Key ......................... 05h 1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ FalseG1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False 1 $!      Filemark .......................... False 5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000he/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06he5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000h / $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h;/ $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00h 4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... Falsea0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. Falser/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00h / $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00hM $!O $! =============================== Vendor Specific Page =======================  $!D $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 00h $!> $!   SCSI 6-Byte Mode Sense command returned 12 bytes of data: $!2 $!      000:  0B 00 10 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 02 00  $!( $!      Mode Sense Data Length ...... 11) $!      Medium Type ................. 00h ) $!      Device-Specific Parameter ... 10ha' $!      Block Descriptor Length ..... 8l> $!      Block Descriptor Data ....... 00 00 00 00 00 00 02 00  $!G $! Issuing 6-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get changeable values for page 00ha $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. False"/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70hm/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00h;/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05h 1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ False 1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... False 1 $!      Filemark .......................... False 5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000ha/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06h 5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000hs/ $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h0/ $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00hd4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... Falsed0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. Falsee/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00h_/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h  $!E $! Issuing 10-byte MODE SENSE QIOW to get current values for page 00h  $!0 $!    CHECK CONDITION seen - Request Sense Data: $!8 $!      000:  70 00 05 00 00 00 00 06 00 00 00 00 00 00  $!1 $!      Valid ............................. Falsee/ $!      Error Code ........................ 70hs/ $!      Segment Number .................... 00h(/ $!      Sense Key ......................... 05ha1 $!      Incorrect Length Indicator ........ False,1 $!      End-Of-Medium ..................... Falsed1 $!      Filemark .......................... Falsex5 $!      Information ....................... 00000000hs/ $!      Additional Sense Length ........... 06h*5 $!      Command-Specific Information ...... 00000000h / $!      Additional Sense Code ............. 00h / $!      Additional Sense Code Qualifier ... 00ha4 $!      Field Replaceable Unit Code ....... 700C001h1 $!      Sense Key Specific Valid (SKSV) ... False-0 $!      Command/Data ...................... Data1 $!      Bit Pointer Valid ................. Falseu/ $!      Bit Pointer ....................... 00hV/ $!      Field Pointer ..................... 00h. $! $!H ========================================================================   EberhardO ===============================================================================    Dr. Eberhard Heuser-Hofmannt Univ. Konstanz Fakultaet fuer Chemie> Universitaets-Strasse 10 D-78464 Konstanz GermanyT. Phone: +49-7531-88-2026, FAX: +49-7531-88-3139* email: vaxinf@chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de  O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:22:01 +0000 (UTC) ' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)u% Subject: Re: V5.5-2 Password Recoverye+ Message-ID: <9mij8p$idf$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>r  W In article <3B8BCC95.E58BDE42@Compaq.com>, Joshua Cope <Joshua.Cope@Compaq.com> writes:bP >> Case sensitivity often causes problems with our Unix students. However havingQ >> it as an option selectable on either a system-wide or individual account basis  >> would be a good idea. > M >Case sensitive passwords, selectable on a per-account basis, was implementedeL >as part of the COE project, and will make it into a future OpenVMS release.L >I'm not sure which one yet, but I'd guess sometime after OpenVMS V7.3-1 and >before the first Itanium SDK. >=G >The flag basically opens up the same password space found on most UNIX!? >systems, including mixed-case and non-alphanumeric characters.C >o    N if it's not too late can you add another flag to give all the non-alphanumericB characters but retain case insensitivity of alphabetic characters.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 2001 15:49:05 GMT5 From: koehler@bessta.gsfc.nasa.aspm.gov (Bob Koehler) 5 Subject: Re: VMS high reliability needed by Air Force3/ Message-ID: <9mj2th$d73$1@skates.gsfc.nasa.gov>3  U In article <3B850517.A8B385E8@uml.edu>, Brendan Welch <brendan_welch@uml.edu> writes:e  B >You forgot the obvious,  EXECUTE  the program !   We execute both' >directives and living things.  tee hee:  B When IBM announced the 360 would be followed by the 370, a list of$ requested new instructions included:      EXECUTE OPERATOR IMEDIATELY  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationt= GSFC Code 582 Flight Software   | Federal Sector, Civil GroupeI                                 | please remove any ".aspm" when replyingQ   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:50:55 -0400B5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> A Subject: Re: VMS's Last Stand or Conspiracy/Stupidity Theories... 2 Message-ID: <tb8j7.940$bB1.44540@news.cpqcorp.net>  L You've been reading too much fiction lately.  I believe that everything thatK has happened is in pursuit of profitability.  There can be disagreements onrH if those making decisions were right or wrong, but I haven't seen peopleI getting out of bed saying "What can I do to kill VMS" lately.  I've found G suprising interest and strong support for OpenVMS in other parts of the.G company.  You also miss the point that this has had as big an impact on # Tru64 (and Linux) as it has on VMS..  K DII/COE is by definition restricted to specific customers.  At this time itMI is export restricted, for example.  It is a US defense industry standard..F It is restricted to a SPECIFIC configuration of software AND hardware.  J The ** underlying changes ** in support of the COE kernel environment willA be mainstream, as soon as we can merge the streams back together.   F The decision to support DII/COE was because of it's requirement in newL defense sales, and in particular a number of specific very large sales.  VMSK has been very popular in some circles of the government, and isn't as smalle a player as you might suspect.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 12:59:26 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Subject: Re: VMS/Alpha backend for GCC 3.x ?; Message-ID: <6vbsnebm8s1.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>l  D Simon Clubley <simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP> writes:  $ > >ACT supports GNAT on Alpha VMS.  0 > Yes, it's really GNAT that I am interested in.  M I thought that GNAT was DEC^H^H^HCompaq's official VMS ADA compiler, and they ! are paying ACT to make it happen?.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 06:44:12 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)f, Subject: Re: VMS/Alpha backend for GCC 3.x ?3 Message-ID: <RNjFgqsYntOu@eisner.encompasserve.org>n  ~ In article <6vbsnebm8s1.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:F > Simon Clubley <simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP> writes: > % >> >ACT supports GNAT on Alpha VMS.   1 >> Yes, it's really GNAT that I am interested in.0 > O > I thought that GNAT was DEC^H^H^HCompaq's official VMS ADA compiler, and they.# > are paying ACT to make it happen?o  9 Compaq paid for the initial GNAT port to Alpha from Unix..A ACT claims the port is VMS-friendly, but since there is a porting.( guide from Compaq Ada, I have my doubts.  F Compaq recommends GNAT for people who need Ada95 on Alpha.  They stillD support Compaq Ada on both VAX and Alpha for those who are satisfied@ with Ada83.  There is no Ada95 compiler for VAX from any vendor.  D For the information of non-Ada folks, Ada is often used on long-lifeA projects (20 year lifecycle) where there is extreme reluctance to!" change compilers part-way through.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 14:18:47 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>= Subject: Re: Wailing at Eunuchs (was: Wailing and Moaning...).; Message-ID: <6vbofozm53s.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   * Hamlyn Mootoo <univms@bigfoot.com> writes:  ? > Wrong.  There is nothing requiring you to use the DCL command0E > interpreter on VMS, nor is there anything requiring you to use RMS!l   Of course, that is correct.   F > Ergo, you can use ANY characters you wish to name a file without the > burden of RMS.    F Really? Have you ever tried IO$_ACCESS with a file name that containedI characters outside the defined set on an ODS-2 disk? And if you did, what.8 were the results? Even ODS-5 is still quite restrictive.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 06:27:02 -0700- From: afeldman@gfigroup.com (Alan E. Feldman)Q0 Subject: Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq?= Message-ID: <af1e4ce6.0108290527.2481846e@posting.google.com>0  e Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message news:<vsbnot80uf3ehqnl1vv24gf8r9f65r9lfl@4ax.com>... C > On 28 Aug 2001 14:19:03 GMT, dQdelQlutrQX@XQXentQeract.com wrote:. > I > >Why not stay on OpenVMS?  I really don't care what chip is underneath   [snip]  A > >Old Basuto proverb (according to Robert Ruark in _Something of.H > >Value_): "When a man does away with his traditional way of living andF > >throws away his good customs, he better first make sure that he has' > >something of value to replace them."m > >pG > >So I say: start new projects on VMS/Alpha now.  And assume that the .+ > >future is uncertain, which it always is.u > E > If I argued that logic internally I'm not sure how long I'd keep my D > job. There is a big difference between uncertain but with no majorF > changes ahead and uncertain because the whole of ex-DEC Compaq seemsF > to be being sacrificed bit by bit to prop up Compaq's loss making PC0 > operations and keep Microsoft and Intel happy.  E Why would CPQ sacrifice ex-DEC bit by bit if that is what is propping!C up their PC losses? I mean, if you're in danger of falling, but arehE being saved by a rope, you don't slowly nibble away at that rope, now:6 do you? (If you meant something else, please clarify.)  A As for making MS happy, I don't think CPQ PC's with AOL front and. center makes MS very happy.   F > VMS is the best general purpose operating system available but it isH > not WIntel and it is not Linux. Compaq would rather see it go away but# > they want that to happen slowly. .  ) WHY?! Why do they want to see it go away?.  E Sidebar: Speaking of PC sales, based on some previous posts, Compaq'ssE advertising budget for PC sales is *double* their losses on the same!c   [snip]   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldmani afeldman@gfigroup.com.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 07:13:34 -0700+ From: yodramtip@altavista.com (guset928832)h0 Subject: Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq?< Message-ID: <17e74793.0108290613.1c0aa4e@posting.google.com>  E Reading back issues of SKC and various other articles on the Internet.B gave me an impression that Capellas was anti-OpenVMS from the very@ beginning.  For example, I learned that on 8/6/99, shortly afterC becoming CEO, he made a statement that OpenVMS has "lifecycled" andrF wanted to migrate customers off the OpenVMS platform within the next 3= years.  Then the next day he retracted his statement and said0? something like what he really meant to say was WHEN the current C OpenVMS customers decided to migrate off OpenVMS, THEN he wanted to.: make sure that they will migrate into a "Compaq Platform."    d Chuck McCrobie <mccrobie@cablespeed.com> wrote in message news:<3B8B08E4.886C2B44@cablespeed.com>...H > Why do I persist in reading this newsgroup?  Its just plain depressing > :( > G > Between the constant rants and raves about Compaq and the messages of.A > Compaq's inadequancies, I've given up on OpenVMS and all Compaq=I > equipment.  Why just today I read about Compaq's backhanded approach ofe > killing its R&D department :(  > H > My suggestion to you die-hards is to abandon OpenVMS, Tru64, and AlphaH > _IMMEDIATELY_.  Go call Sun or IBM - at least those companies want andF > understand enterprise customers.  Better yet, run Windows 2000/XP onH > Dell machines - that should hasten Compaq's demise into the bankruptcy	 > courts!= > G > I'm wondering just why anyone would continue/start another product on!G > OpenVMS or Tru64?  Perhaps to gouge the OpenVMS suckers^H^H^H^H^H^H^H!D > die-hards with high prices before Compaq pulls the plug?  FirewireG > support looked like a good niche product for OpenVMS, but why bother?. > I > So, even though I'm a lurker here, I'm signing off and saying good luck 1 > to all you talented but betrayed professionals.    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2001 18:02:33 +0200@ From: Jan C Vorbrueggen <vorbrjz6@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>0 Subject: Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq?; Message-ID: <6vb3d6aj1ly.fsf@sunu513.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>0  / afeldman@gfigroup.com (Alan E. Feldman) writes:   G > Why would CPQ sacrifice ex-DEC bit by bit if that is what is proppingiE > up their PC losses? I mean, if you're in danger of falling, but arefG > being saved by a rope, you don't slowly nibble away at that rope, nowe8 > do you? (If you meant something else, please clarify.)  O That is an interesting question that has been asked by many here and elsewhere. L The assumption behind it is that Compaq's management is behaving rationally.N Given the current evidence, this is not the case, so any conclusions one could3 draw based on that assumption are patently invalid.O   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:58:29 -0400R- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>00 Subject: Re: Why continue with OpenVMS / Compaq?+ Message-ID: <3B8D2D3F.5A8F8F9@videotron.ca>    "Alan E. Feldman" wrote:G > Why would CPQ sacrifice ex-DEC bit by bit if that is what is propping  > up their PC losses?   K Simple. Look at the Alpha murder. Intel had a contract out on Alpha. CompaqnJ offered to kill Alpha for some undisclosed large wad of money. At the sameL time, Compaq annouces it will spend 500 million bucks to buy firms that willM build its solutiosn support/development part which si expected to grow by 40%i per year (yeah, right !).   N So, you have your dead mother's jewerly which you don't care about, and see anL opportunity to sell it to someone who wants it, and with the proceeds of theF sale, you can buy yourself a brand new pasta maker that will help your restaurant make more money.   M And you know that if you had held on to the old jewelry much longer, it would.L have lost value. (Consider that once Intel has fine tuned IA64 and that IA64L has already taken a large chunk of the market, Intel wouldn't really need to" kill Alpha so desperatly anymore).  J But killing Alpha on the eve of the launch of IA64 is perfect timing sinceK Intel will automatically capture high end sales that will give IA64 a greata image. .  N Imagine the marketing that Intel will do if it makes a sale to Celera GenomicsN or some other similar project. (Compaq didn't really market this very stronglyN or specifically, but I bet Intel will brag to the whole world about every highU end sale it makes, and ever stock excahnge that migrates from MIPS (tandem) to IA64).   N Consider that MIPS isn't exactly a big fast chip, so it will probably be quiteI easy for IA64 to make Tandem boxes faster than they currently are, and if N Compaq can sell a 2 processor IA64 tandem box that replaces a 3 processor MIPSN box, that will go a long way to get marketing bang for the buck, especially if+ that is at a very important stock exchange.    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.480 ************************