1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 09 Dec 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 683       Contents:) a few ?'s for the VAXperts re 6k machines  Re: Compaq after merger-failure  Compaq now a takeover target  Re: Compaq now a takeover target  Re: Compaq now a takeover target Re: gnu tar for VMS  Re: gnu tar for VMS E Here is your VMS alternative ... another patch for you windoze admins 6 How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?" Re: HP Foundations - let them know" Re: HP Foundations - let them know' install fibre channel to the CI cluster 7 Is there a place to find VMS Source Listing CD mounted? 3 Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact? 3 Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact? 3 Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact? 3 Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact? ; Re: Looking for Digital Serial Number Identication Resource 9 Re: Packard Foundation Tells Merger Urgers to "Paq it In" 9 Re: Packard Foundation Tells Merger Urgers to "Paq it In"  Re: The demise of compaq Re: The demise of compaq Re: The demise of compaq5 Re: Tru64.org Flash Poll on Merger "Pearl Harbor Day"  Unix for HELP ... Examples? " Use of VMSTPC on OpenVMS on Alphas VAXstation 2000 pinouts P Re: VMS Effort (Was: Re: Microsoft Pyramid Collapses Enron and Hewlett Pac PacPa  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 17:03:58 -0500+ From: "Robert Schaefer" <rschaefe@gcfn.org> 2 Subject: a few ?'s for the VAXperts re 6k machines7 Message-ID: <9uu2qi$pil$1@ronco.freenet.columbus.oh.us>   I Hi there!  I've got a handful of questions about a 6320 machine I have in E the basement.  My machine has processors from different sources, with L different serial numbers and eeprom versions.  I know I can change them, andE it boots just fine (aside form the error msg) as is, but is there any L advantage to one eeprom version or another?  Should I just upgrade them bothG to the latest version, or is it tied to a hardware revision?  Is anyone H keeping an archive of the various eeprom versions?  Also, will differentI class processors work in the same computer?  As in if I pop two '400 cpus J into my 6320 will I get a bastard 632420 with possibly only two processorsE eligable to be the primary, or will I get a non-booting box?  Another K sort-of related question-- is it possible to make a bit-identical image of, F say, a TK70 tape; something like `dd' with unix?  I'd like to save theI eeprom image I end up overwriting just to keep the bits from fading away.   L One last question before I quit bugging you...  Will one hobbyist PAK boot a. cluster, or will I need a PAK for each member?   Thanks!!   Bob    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 20:45:28 +0100 1 From: John McLean <mcleanj@swissonline.delete.ch> ( Subject: Re: Compaq after merger-failure5 Message-ID: <3C126DD8.919887B7@swissonline.delete.ch>    JF Mezei wrote:  > O > Is it possible that Compaq might continue business as usual after the failure  > of the merger ?     * One guy seems to think Compaq will be fine  E (sorry about the duplication of this post in another thread but it is  relevant here.)    FromF http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/011208/business_tech_compaq_hewlett_dc_2.html  ...   H ``I think Compaq has a great strategy and if there were no HP we'd stillF have a great strategy going forward,'' Compaq executive vice president> of global business units Michael Winkler said in an interview.  D ``While we look like we may be somewhat beleaguered from a financial? standpoint, the fact is we have generated positive cash for six   consecutive quarters,'' he said.  D Winkler said, Compaq is further along in switching to a direct salesH model for retail that will mirror Dell's. As part of that move, he said,E the company's inventories of PCs will decrease as it moves production : from its own factories to those run by an outside company.  F ``We've been reinventing our business model on the volume model in the? PCs and that's only starting to come to fruition with the plant H closings, so I feel good about the Compaq business irrespective of HP,''	 he added.    ... etc   D I question his line about generating positive cash for 6 consecutive	 quarters.   H If he means Revenue (and it's hard to see how it could be negative !) we see for 2001 in millions)   0 Access - quarter 1 = $4374, Q2= $3824, Q3= $3255, Enterprise - Q1= $2908, Q2= $2711, Q3= $23762 Global Services - Q1= $1935, Q2= $ 1943, Q3= $1879( TOTALS - Q1= $9217, Q2= $8478, Q3= $7510  E The only increase was Global Services in Q2, and that increase was $8  million   0 and if he means Income, for 2001 (also millions)  ' Access - Q1= -$82, Q2= -$155, Q3= -$248 ) Enterprise - Q1= $132, Q2= $74, Q3= -$104 . Global Services - Q1= $254, Q2= $271, Q3= $284% TOTALS - Q1= $304, Q2= $190, Q3= -$68   C If Winkler thinks these are good figures then he must belong to the  Enron school of accounting.     E I'm really starting to think that one of the big problems is near the A top of the company, with a  letter that is near the bottom of the 	 alphabet.      John McLean    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 12:01:39 +1100 * From: IsraelRT <israelrt@optushome.com.au>% Subject: Compaq now a takeover target 8 Message-ID: <lud51u4fpgt7g0m4nl0e26rcii7c45olog@4ax.com>  7 >"The family foundation that is the largest shareholder 3 >of Hewlett-Packard, said it would vote against the " >proposal to buy Compaq Computer."  C Once the merger is cancelled, Compaq is likely to go belly-up or at  least be taken over .   E The takeover could even be  by Dell if the anti-trust legislators can  be bought off .    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 21:35:07 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ) Subject: Re: Compaq now a takeover target , Message-ID: <3C12CDD2.A46C6665@videotron.ca>   IsraelRT wrote: E > Once the merger is cancelled, Compaq is likely to go belly-up or at  > least be taken over .   J If the merger fails, Capellas will go on a long extended vacation, WinklerM will take over, and he will probably sell the Tandem and VMS stuff to whoever G wants them, and then concentrate on making his Wintel stuff profitable.   J He can pitch it to Wall Street as Compaq coming back to the focus that hadJ made it succesfull and getting rid of all thsoe distractions that had hurtF Compaq and prevented it from keeping up with competitors such as Dell.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 17:14:50 +1100 * From: IsraelRT <israelrt@optushome.com.au>) Subject: Re: Compaq now a takeover target 8 Message-ID: <71061u8e79i92jp85nt4ca8qnmkb48i6vi@4ax.com>  , On Sat, 08 Dec 2001 21:35:07 -0500, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:   K >If the merger fails, Capellas will go on a long extended vacation, Winkler N >will take over, and he will probably sell the Tandem and VMS stuff to whoeverH >wants them, and then concentrate on making his Wintel stuff profitable.  < He has not been able to make it profitable for sometime now.C With the global economy now relentlessly nose diving, Compaq has no , chance at all of returning to profitability.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 22:53:43 GMT - From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>  Subject: Re: gnu tar for VMS* Message-ID: <3C12A030.2090003@qsl.network>   David Schwartz wrote:   H > I have some very large tarfiles that are not readable by VMS tar. I'veC > tried downloading a "new" vmstar from the Compaq OpenVMS freeware D > site, and also gotten the latest VMS tar (V3.4-1) from the ProcessG > Software VMS archive. All fail with the same error, when doing either C > a test (-t) or extract (-x), after partially processing the file:  > B > ----------     0/0        101 Dec 31 16:00:00 1969 ././@LongLink4 > tar: directory checksum error for <long file path> > D > The file I'm trying to extract was created with gnu tar on a LinuxC > system. I'm told this is a known incompatibility, and that tar on E > Solaris has the same problem.  I copied the file to a Linux system, G > and gnu tar can read it, so the file is not corrupted. Recreating the C > file as several smaller files has proved to be time consuming and < > cumbersome, and it won't help me with the next large file. > ! > Is there a VMS port of Gnu tar?     D I do not know about GNU tar, but Hunter Goatley just released a new G version of VMSTAR.  It should be at all of his usual mirrors.  You can  E look them up in the OpenVMS FAQ, at http://www.openvms.compaq.com or  9 search comp.os.vms and vmstar using http://www.google.com   E I do not know if this new version will solve your problem, but if it  G does not, I am sure that the maintainers of VMSTAR would be interested  
 in fixing it.    -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 01:27:45 GMT B From: David Schwartz <salsagroupie@_remove_this_part_.bigfoot.com> Subject: Re: gnu tar for VMS8 Message-ID: <vff51u8acg9fcjq1f5tir1vb83qo36kejl@4ax.com>  
 Thanks John.    D I'm pretty sure I just tried Hunter Goatley's new version of VMSTAR;> that's what I believe I got when I downloaded from the Process5 Software VMS archive. It identifies itself as V3.4-1.   F I worked round the problem by unpacking the tarfile on a Linux system,= and repacking it using Info-zip. Info-zip on VMS successfully  processed the (31mb) zipfile.   . "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> wrote:   >David Schwartz wrote: > I >> I have some very large tarfiles that are not readable by VMS tar. I've D >> tried downloading a "new" vmstar from the Compaq OpenVMS freewareE >> site, and also gotten the latest VMS tar (V3.4-1) from the Process H >> Software VMS archive. All fail with the same error, when doing eitherD >> a test (-t) or extract (-x), after partially processing the file: >>  C >> ----------     0/0        101 Dec 31 16:00:00 1969 ././@LongLink 5 >> tar: directory checksum error for <long file path>  >>  E >> The file I'm trying to extract was created with gnu tar on a Linux D >> system. I'm told this is a known incompatibility, and that tar onF >> Solaris has the same problem.  I copied the file to a Linux system,H >> and gnu tar can read it, so the file is not corrupted. Recreating theD >> file as several smaller files has proved to be time consuming and= >> cumbersome, and it won't help me with the next large file.  >>  " >> Is there a VMS port of Gnu tar? >  > E >I do not know about GNU tar, but Hunter Goatley just released a new  H >version of VMSTAR.  It should be at all of his usual mirrors.  You can F >look them up in the OpenVMS FAQ, at http://www.openvms.compaq.com or : >search comp.os.vms and vmstar using http://www.google.com > F >I do not know if this new version will solve your problem, but if it H >does not, I am sure that the maintainers of VMSTAR would be interested  >in fixing it. >  >-John >wb8tyw@qsl.network  >Personal Opinion Only >    ------------------------------   Date: 8 Dec 2001 12:42:53 -0800 ( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)N Subject: Here is your VMS alternative ... another patch for you windoze admins= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0112081242.6507b961@posting.google.com>   D Here is the 57th windoze security patch of the year ... I don't know how D those windoze admins get any work done since they have to constantly patch 9 their 80 million pc boxes every other day of the year ...   5 http://www.informationweek.com/story/IWK20011207S0043   <  SECURITY: Another Week, Another Outlook Flaw Dec. 7, 2001     C This flaw is in the way Outlook Web Access handles script messages. % Microsoft rates the problem "medium."  By George V. Hulme   D Users of Microsoft's Exchange 5.5 E-mail server have been alerted toC yet another serious vulnerability. Microsoft sent its 57th security A bulletin of the year. This time, anyone can access and manipulate F E-mail in someone's Exchange mailbox by using a Web browser, Microsoft says. C The vulnerability is caused by a flaw in the way Outlook Web Access C handles online script messages with Internet Explorer. According to A Microsoft, a carefully crafted HTML message with a certain script D would enable someone to "take any action against the user's ExchangeF mailbox," such as sending, moving, and deleting messages. The attackerF can use this flaw by sending an E-mail to someone. If the victim opensB the message in Outlook Web Access, he or she is vulnerable to this exploit.  A This flaw, discovered by Lex Arquette of consulting firm WhiteHat F Security, is only the most recent security problem Microsoft has facedF with Outlook Web Access. Earlier this year, the company had to publish' three patches to fix a similar problem.   B Microsoft has rated the risk of this vulnerability "medium" and is; urging users to download a patch available on its Web site,  www.microsoft.com/security.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 23:44:07 -0000 / From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> ? Subject: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known? / Message-ID: <u159e75t3geg61@corp.supernews.com>   = I define several foreign commands via SET COMMAND .CLD files.   D Aside from actually trying it, how can I tell if a command is known?  ; Is there an equivalent to SHOW SYMBOL for foreign commands?    --   -- Mike Zarlenga   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 12:27:22 +0010 ' From: <paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au> C Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known? 5 Message-ID: <01KBNXB78N7M001AJ0@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>    Mike Zarlenga wrote:  > >I define several foreign commands via SET COMMAND .CLD files. > E >Aside from actually trying it, how can I tell if a command is known?  > < >Is there an equivalent to SHOW SYMBOL for foreign commands?  F A question of terminology first.  What you are describing is called a F verb.  A foreign command is a symbol which is set to the location and & name of an executable prefixed by "$".  D There is a freeware program VERB on the freeware CD which gives all C qualifiers, etc. for any verb.  If it doesn't find the verb in the  2 tables, it just quietly returns to the DCL prompt.   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 02:11:20 -0000 / From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> C Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known? / Message-ID: <u15i288umlm7ee@corp.supernews.com>   & paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote:F : There is a freeware program VERB on the freeware CD which gives all E : qualifiers, etc. for any verb.  If it doesn't find the verb in the  4 : tables, it just quietly returns to the DCL prompt.  5 Is the freeware CD available from the Compaq website?    --   -- Mike Zarlenga   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 13:32:52 +0010 ' From: <paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au> C Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known? 5 Message-ID: <01KBNZLEZ1K2001ACM@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>    Mike Zarlenga wrote:  ' >paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote: G >: There is a freeware program VERB on the freeware CD which gives all  F >: qualifiers, etc. for any verb.  If it doesn't find the verb in the 5 >: tables, it just quietly returns to the DCL prompt.  > 6 >Is the freeware CD available from the Compaq website?   Yep, specifically for VERB:   7 http://www.openvms.compaq.com/freeware/freeware50/verb/    Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 02:36:32 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) C Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known? 0 Message-ID: <00A063B8.DE2DA7C4@SendSpamHere.ORG>  a In article <u15i288umlm7ee@corp.supernews.com>, Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> writes: ' >paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote:nG >: There is a freeware program VERB on the freeware CD which gives all  F >: qualifiers, etc. for any verb.  If it doesn't find the verb in the 5 >: tables, it just quietly returns to the DCL prompt.  >p6 >Is the freeware CD available from the Compaq website?  L Yes.  I believe that the latest two version of the freeware CD are available at the Compaq web site.i  L If you want access to all of the freeware CDs, I have made them available at' my site http://www.tmesis.com/freeware/n   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMn             J   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbes    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 21:43:55 -0500w' From: Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net>eC Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?s< Message-ID: <howard-21AB04.21435308122001@enews.newsguy.com>  / In article <u159e75t3geg61@corp.supernews.com>,t1  Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> wrote:a  ? > I define several foreign commands via SET COMMAND .CLD files.y   Those aren't foreign commands.  , A foriegn command is set up using the syntax   $ fcommand:==$image    wherek  - fcommand  is the foreign command being set up M image     is the .EXE file being executed.  The path defaults to SYS$SYSTEM,  - but another path can be specified if desired.e    J A command defined using the SET COMMAND utility is known as a "verb".  Is @ there a way to detect existing verbs?  I guess you could search 0 SYS$SHARE:DCLTABLES.EXE to see if it's in there. -- d Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"( Golf vs Bug: VW has been cutting corners   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 04:54:50 GMTu1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>eC Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?I' Message-ID: <3C12EEC9.35AC2BB6@fsi.net>2  & paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote: >  > Mike Zarlenga wrote: > ) > >paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote:sH > >: There is a freeware program VERB on the freeware CD which gives allG > >: qualifiers, etc. for any verb.  If it doesn't find the verb in theo7 > >: tables, it just quietly returns to the DCL prompt.o > >l8 > >Is the freeware CD available from the Compaq website? >  > Yep, specifically for VERB:a > 9 > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/freeware/freeware50/verb/w  H Be aware that there may be a newer version of VERB available from HunterF Goatley. I blew it (VERB) up on a very large DCLTABLES last month, and$ he said he'd cook up a fix for that.  E Actually, there's one value in a C source file that needs to be uppediG about four-fold or so, but I don't recall the name of either the symbol : or the source file. VERB is distributed with source, so...   -- p David J. Dachteran dba DJE Systemsa http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 05:03:48 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>MC Subject: Re: How to tell if foreign command (SET COMMAND) is known?g' Message-ID: <3C12F0E3.EDA93460@fsi.net>7   Michael Zarlenga wrote:  > ? > I define several foreign commands via SET COMMAND .CLD files.i > F > Aside from actually trying it, how can I tell if a command is known? > = > Is there an equivalent to SHOW SYMBOL for foreign commands?s  B If you use thee verbs consistently, you'll make better use of yourF working set by putting them permanently into your login command table.B When you SET COMMAND, the command table must be copied from sharedE system memory into process-private memory. That make less working sett available for code/data.  @ On one site, I was able to reduce page faulting by nearly 30% by+ eliminating SET COMMANDs done during login.t   -- t David J. Dachterav dba DJE Systemsi http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/i   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 14:01:25 -0500( From: Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu>+ Subject: Re: HP Foundations - let them knowtB Message-ID: <20011208135428.M37977-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu>  % On 8 Dec 2001, Larry Kilgallen wrote:e   >tG > Looking at those posts then, we see a log of "I don't speak on behalfwB > of XYZcorp" and a lot of posts from email addresses that are not+ > attributed to the organizations involved.  > B > Private views of individuals explicitly _not_ representing theirE > organizations hardly count as the "customer base" for those outfits  > you list.e >e   Larry,  G    Other than the usual boilerplate argument you really need to look atiF this in the real world.  I do not speak for the University of ScrantonG in any way shape or form.  But my boss asks my opinion on purchases andcJ at least up to this point, he takes my advice seriously.  After all, isn'tG that what he hired me for??  I think the same can and should be assumed1! for the majority of posters here.3   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |> Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 04:43:49 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>M+ Subject: Re: HP Foundations - let them knowa' Message-ID: <3C12EC34.9B7B30D1@fsi.net>m   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:e > < > "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote in message/ > news:Cq$NSvjeaET6@eisner.encompasserve.org... ? > > In article <3C1193A3.53645447@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera"a! > <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:h > L > > > Seems to me "a significant portion of its enterprise customer base" isH > > > represented by regular posters here including, but not limited to,L > > > Cerner, Abbott Labs, Sunquest, Nortel, Argonne, Comdisco, to name mostG > > > of the few that I am aware of outside of the DoD and the academicmI > > > community. I'll let the posts that have gone through this newsgroupv! > > > group speak for themselves.4 > >5I > > Looking at those posts then, we see a log of "I don't speak on behalfiD > > of XYZcorp" and a lot of posts from email addresses that are not- > > attributed to the organizations involved.v > >oD > > Private views of individuals explicitly _not_ representing theirG > > organizations hardly count as the "customer base" for those outfitse
 > > you list.b > M > Good point. Take it a step further. The vast majority of the individuals in I > the aforementioned category are diehard VMS loyalists (nothing wrong in G > that!). Yet in some cases their employers are migrating away from VMS J > (something wrong in that, but that's another story). In such cases it isN > arguable that the opinions of the loyalists have little impact on the pointy2 > headed bosses who make the purchasing decisions.  G Rather underscores the point, I should say. They may not be speaking ontF behalf of the PHBs; however, giving witness to the PHBs and their lackB of vision probably says more than an actual company's statement of	 position.T   ...IMHO.   --   David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsc http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 05:24:56 +0800n! From: Terence <cavy@hongkong.com>r0 Subject: install fibre channel to the CI cluster, Message-ID: <3C128528.BA20401E@hongkong.com>   Hello,  D Is anyone managing the CI and fibre channel co-exist cluster system?= Please tell me the information about this system, such as any D preparation work before installing fibre channel to the VMS 7.2-1 CI1 cluster, any SYSGEN parameter need to modify,etc.O   Many thanks, Terence.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 22:32:52 -0600% From: "Headman" <headman@aaahawk.com>r@ Subject: Is there a place to find VMS Source Listing CD mounted?, Message-ID: <9uuppf$f0r$1@news.chatlink.com>  L Is there a place to find VMS Source Listing CD (EDT and utilities) privately mounted?   Thanks   Ron    ------------------------------   Date: 8 Dec 2001 19:48:07 GMTn3 From: vance@alumni.caltech.edu (Vance R. Haemmerle)y< Subject: Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact?, Message-ID: <9utqpn$de5@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  < In article <nSnQ7.7256$Sj1.2899978@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,3 Terry C. Shannon <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote:m > L >Compaq's "New Math" does indeed make life difficult for anyone who's trying( >to figure out the company's financials!  D   Could this be a basis for a shareholder suit?  Keeping things from2 shareholders doesn't seem to be in their interest.   -- Vance Haemmerlep vance@alumni.caltech.edu   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Dec 2001 12:24:20 -0800 ( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)< Subject: Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact?< Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0112081224.ebdea3b@posting.google.com>  p "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message news:<h3jQ7.132818$YD.11488352@news2.aus1.giganews.com>...3 > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messagez* > news:u1370e1q7g9c5@corp.supernews.com... > N > You're going to have to accept that people with a reason to be interested inK > such things are going to draw conclusions based on the best evidence they M > have available to them, whether you like it or not.  If you don't like whateM > that evidence suggests, you'd be better advised to dig up other evidence toeJ > contradict it rather than to keep bleating "But it's not *conclusive*!":K > even though the remaining VMS customers seem to have the patience of Job,JM > expecting them to wait until VMS has been formally buried before they startIL > considering alternatives (in system, vendor, or vendor management) is just > not realistic. >  > - bill  L What alternatives?  Blue screens, Nimba, Code Red, Unix Cert advisories, IISL Cert advisories, Linux(gag)?  There are NO alternatives!!!  VMS has been and4 still is the only alternative for over 20 years now!   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 21:25:11 GMT1* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>< Subject: Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact?B Message-ID: <XyvQ7.174576$uB.21475739@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  5 "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in messagea6 news:d7791aa1.0112081224.ebdea3b@posting.google.com...   ...o  J > What alternatives?  Blue screens, Nimba, Code Red, Unix Cert advisories, IISiJ > Cert advisories, Linux(gag)?  There are NO alternatives!!!  VMS has been andc6 > still is the only alternative for over 20 years now!    Earth to Bob...  Earth to Bob...  K If that were true, then VMS would own the market.  Guess what?  It doesn't.d  I Your own enthusiasm/prejudice doesn't matter:  the world knows otherwise. K If Compaq were to market VMS some fraction of that world could be convinced G that VMS would do a better job for them, but those alternatives are out I there, in far greater profusion than VMS is, and if VMS were to disappearaD tomorrow they'd just pick up the slack (albeit with large amounts of3 migration pain for the few remaining VMS faithful).n   - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Dec 2001 20:06:27 -08000( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)< Subject: Re: It you say it often enough does it become fact?= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0112082006.2728805f@posting.google.com>@  t "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message news:<XyvQ7.174576$uB.21475739@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...7 > "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message 8 > news:d7791aa1.0112081224.ebdea3b@posting.google.com... >  > ...w > L > > What alternatives?  Blue screens, Nimba, Code Red, Unix Cert advisories, >  IISL > > Cert advisories, Linux(gag)?  There are NO alternatives!!!  VMS has been >  and8 > > still is the only alternative for over 20 years now! > " > Earth to Bob...  Earth to Bob... > M > If that were true, then VMS would own the market.  Guess what?  It doesn't.c > K > Your own enthusiasm/prejudice doesn't matter:  the world knows otherwise.sM > If Compaq were to market VMS some fraction of that world could be convincedMI > that VMS would do a better job for them, but those alternatives are outWK > there, in far greater profusion than VMS is, and if VMS were to disappeartF > tomorrow they'd just pick up the slack (albeit with large amounts of5 > migration pain for the few remaining VMS faithful).e >  > - bill  < sorry, I thought we were talking about GOOD alternatives ...   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 19:26:25 GMTo( From: "McEagle" <mlynch@tampabay.rr.com>D Subject: Re: Looking for Digital Serial Number Identication Resource= Message-ID: <BPtQ7.28597$Ga5.5618182@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>    David, Galway is located in Ireland.s6 http://www.galway.net/galwayguide/streetmap/ei-map.jpg   Mike  ; "Island Computers" <dbturner@islandco.com> wrote in messager) news:u14ikp3v3kdqde@news.supernews.com...iL > SO what did DEC manufacture in Galway, NOrthern Ireland and what was their$ > prefix for product serial numbers? >- > DT >- >- >- >- > -- > David Turner >0 > We sell Alpha systems & parts  > http://www.islandco.coms > sales@islandco.com > Island Computers US Corp.T > 2700 Gregory Streete > Savannah GA 31404e > Tel: 912 447 6622m > Fax: 912 201 0096l? > Hoff Hoffman <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in messagea. > news:sIWi7.901$bB1.41939@news.cpqcorp.net...@ > > In article <DKBi7.123$p81.87382@typhoon1.gnilink.net>, "John Fredrickson"# > <jafred@bellatlantic.net> writes:- > >-K > >   Follow-ups set to comp.os.vms, to try to reduce the cross-postings...s > >.L > > :I have yet to get it to display anything. The graphics card is a Maxtor > VGA, > >KH > >   You might not get get anything with that widget.  Try removing it. > >eJ > > :but when I attached the system to a monitor, keyboard, and mouse, the > unitK > > :powers up but displays no video. I also tried disconnecting the mouse, H > > :keyboard, and monitor and connected a VT420 to the serial COM ports	 > insteadb0 > > :(9600,N,8,1), but again obtained no output. > >wJ > >   I'd *guess* you are seeing the results of a graphics controller thatJ > >   is not supported by OpenVMS -- each one of these widgets tends to be6 > >   a just enough different to screw up the drivers. > >  > > ..: > > :When I get a console prompt, I'll learn for about it. > >  > >-* > >  ---------------------------- #include) > <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------n7 > >       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ --  www.openvms.compaq.com. > >  --------------------------- pure personal% > opinion ---------------------------.3 > >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS EngineeringE > hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com > >l >  >u >f   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Dec 2001 12:11:41 -0800l( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)B Subject: Re: Packard Foundation Tells Merger Urgers to "Paq it In"= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0112081211.2123c1fa@posting.google.com>   x "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in message news:<zYbQ7.7116$Sj1.2446237@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>...; > Looks like CPQ's gonna have to come up with a "Plan B"...t > ' > Foundation to Oppose HP-Compaq Mergerd  > Friday December 7, 5:58 PM EST > K > SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - The Packard family foundation with a 10 percentqN > stake in Hewlett-Packard Co. (HWP) said on Friday it would vote against HP's, > acquisition of Compaq Computer Corp.(CPQ). > K > Analysts have said support of the David and Lucile Packard Foundation was K > crucial for the deal, which has been opposed by other Packard and Hewlett,H > family members with some 7 percent of HP stock, and criticized by many > investors. > D > The merger has also been seen as a referendum on the leadership ofH > Hewlett-Packard Chief Executive Carly Fiorina, who has spearheaded the	 > plan...S  P I think Capellas was either duped or paid off to sell Alpha ... the shareholdersO ought to sue Capellas as his donation of Alpha to Intel has taken away the onlyTD thing Compaq had of any value, the best 64 bit chip in the world ...   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Dec 2001 02:59:21 GMTh& From: peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva)B Subject: Re: Packard Foundation Tells Merger Urgers to "Paq it In"% Message-ID: <9uuk29$eic@web.nmti.com>l  , In article <3C118291.CA6EDB7D@videotron.ca>,/ JF Mezei  <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:s? > I bet the MPE customers have been petitioning those families.t  % To do what? MPE is doomed either way.   K The thing that really ticks me off about this merger is that the one CompaqnK product I *want* to see replaced by its HP equivalent would probably be the  one they keep.   -- c+  `-_-'   In hoc signo hack, Peter da Silva.-E   'U`    "A well-rounded geek should be able to geek about anything."eL                                                        -- nicolai@esperi.org          Disclaimer: WWFD?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 12:01:06 +1100w* From: IsraelRT <israelrt@optushome.com.au>! Subject: Re: The demise of compaqr8 Message-ID: <aqd51ug991e72g60o230bvpufomfcsds0k@4ax.com>  7 >"The family foundation that is the largest shareholderr3 >of Hewlett-Packard, said it would vote against the " >proposal to buy Compaq Computer."  C Once the merger is cancelled, Compaq is likely to go belly-up or at  least be taken over .i  E The takeover could even be  by Dell if the anti-trust legislators can  be bought off .    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Dec 2001 03:09:40 GMTa& From: peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva)! Subject: Re: The demise of compaqs% Message-ID: <9uuklk$fl8@web.nmti.com>i  3 In article <9uqm77$6cq$1@plutonium.btinternet.com>,,/ Rupert Pigott <Darkb00ng@btinternet.com> wrote:sM > Couldn't see why on earth Microsoft would do that. They seem to be becoming N > more isolationist, slower moving, inward looking and less innovative as time
 > goes by.  A Um, so far as I can tell that's always been a good description of D Microsoft. The only thing fast and innovative there is spin-control.   -- r+  `-_-'   In hoc signo hack, Peter da Silva.yE   'U`    "A well-rounded geek should be able to geek about anything."RL                                                        -- nicolai@esperi.org          Disclaimer: WWFD?   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Dec 2001 03:17:42 GMTl& From: peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva)! Subject: Re: The demise of compaqi% Message-ID: <9uul4m$ggv@web.nmti.com>e  M I, ah, liked his bit about all the weird patches being bugfixes, and it beingv& essential to keep those bugfixes in...   My response?  L If popping out the floppy while you're opening a window causes a problem forM the window code, then start at the device drivers and find out where the realp? problem is, because it's probably causing problems elsewhere...r   -- m+  `-_-'   In hoc signo hack, Peter da Silva. E   'U`    "A well-rounded geek should be able to geek about anything."/L                                                        -- nicolai@esperi.org          Disclaimer: WWFD?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 19:33:04 +0000d+ From: John McNulty <knode1@jmtl.com-nospam>c> Subject: Re: Tru64.org Flash Poll on Merger "Pearl Harbor Day"/ Message-ID: <u14qodsupeee0e@corp.supernews.com>e  H I find the words of the press release issued in response to this, quite  amazing:  H   "We are disappointed by the Packard Foundation's preliminary decision.K    Nevertheless, our responsibility to shareowners, customers and employeesyL    requires that we maintain a pragmatic view of the business and a focus onK    the future. Our firm commitment to this merger stems from our convictionDG    that it will deliver the industry leadership and earnings growth ours1    shareowners expect and our employees deserve."a  M If they were really concerned about responsibility to shareowners, customers 0J and employees, they would have canned the deal already.   From the Compaq O side the customers will face a slow death of their favourite technologies, the eM employees face massive redundancies, and the shareholders have watched their aO investments get wiped out.   It can't look much better from the HP side of the jL fence either, with big redundancies in the PC and handheld divisions a real N possibility, and years of corporate indigestion to follow from swallowing the  Compaq elephant.  M When Compaq took over Digital, the grand announcement was that the two would fO compine to create a company that could generate $50 billion in revenue.   What vM history had shown us is that in mergers like this, the two end up being much  ! less than the sum of their parts.c  O I think the Hewlett and Packard foundations have judged this right.  This deal s should go the way of the Dodo.   John   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 06:28:11 GMTo' From: "C.W.Holeman II" <cwhii@mail.com>t$ Subject: Unix for HELP ... Examples?( Message-ID: <3C1302AF.40230713@mail.com>  & What is Unix for Examples in VMS HELP? MAN seems to lack this feature.k    --   C.W.Holeman II cwhii@mail.com http://also.as/cwhii   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2001 17:23:46 -05009 From: "Douglas H. Quebbeman" <dougq@ixnayamspayiglou.com> + Subject: Use of VMSTPC on OpenVMS on Alphasi) Message-ID: <3c114172$1_2@news.iglou.com>    Hello,  2 An acquaintance of mine is having trouble with the& VMSTPC tape-container-writing package.  4 If there is anyone here who would be willing to help5 him, I'd appreciate it very much. He's trying to reads1 some tapes with data important to those of us whoh like to preserve old systems.l   Regards, -doug qa --H Surgically excise the pig-latin from my e-mail address in order to reply   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 06:24:13 GMTy* From: "Ian King" <iking@killthewabbit.org>  Subject: VAXstation 2000 pinouts- Message-ID: <hsDQ7.19274$L51.43852@rwcrnsc54>e  @ I thought someone had this on a website, but I fear it went awayK (vaxarchive.com)....  I finally got around to firing up the VAXstation 2000tJ I picked up, and I"m trying to access it through its serial ports, with noD success.  I'd really appreciate information on (a) which is the bestJ port/connector to select and (b) how to wire it to a standard terminal.  I7 have a Lear-Siegler ADM-3A aching to chat with it.  :-)   
 Cheers -- Ian    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 00:53:54 +0100v1 From: John McLean <mcleanj@swissonline.delete.ch> Y Subject: Re: VMS Effort (Was: Re: Microsoft Pyramid Collapses Enron and Hewlett Pac PacPau5 Message-ID: <3C12A812.9F264119@swissonline.delete.ch>p  * Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr wrote: > C > In article <3C1133F1.EE8B1CF2@swissonline.delete.ch>, John McLeano+ > <mcleanj@swissonline.delete.ch> writes: >l >  > >Hoff, > > J > >Over 48 hours has passed and I see no response whatsoever to my posting- > >of Wednesday, the core of which commenced:  > >o >  > [Total snippage] > K > I really object to any attempt to put a construction - any construction -dH > on Hoff's making no response in 48 hours to a message that appeared inH > response to a message of his that said he was going off to work on VMS > porting and enhancements.a  F As I made clear in my posting, I am assuming nothing about Hoff making? no response.  Indeed if I had been him I would have immediatelya5 forwarded to those who may have been able to respond.t    -K > I also object to putting him on the spot for marketing/development issues 3 > that are decided at higher levels in the company.c  A He said that he believed that the only way to prove anything from>G Compaq's side was to complete the port to Itanium.  My view is that therE problem is here; it is now; customers are departing (as has been made  clear in this forum).r  H He was reacting to those who resort to insults to try to get their pointH across.  I wanted to make it quite clear that dissatifaction with Compaq is not limited to those people.     K > Fred Kleinsorge has shown some willingness to engage in debate about this @ > stuff - argue with him, if you need to argue with a developer.  @ I have done so for similar reasons - he was attempting to defend Compaq's position.   >  That kindK > of thing is neither Hoff's job nor something he volunteers for, and I for1J > one don't want him to have to spend the time he has for comp.os.vms thatG > way - it's way better for us to have him providing technical content.$  
 Quite true.  c  O > Attempting to engage Marcello and Gorham makes plenty of sense, and I applauda0 > that, but you should have left Hoff out of it.  D As you said, it is not his job to defend company policy - and I hopeH that no-one's opinion of Hoff was at all altered by my comments to him -? but when he, or anyone else, posts something that appears to bee9 dismissive of those with grievances, I will always react.l  F As I made very clear, we have a lot to complain about, and if there isF to be any respect between Compaq, its customers and users, then Compaq! needs to address a lot of issues.o     John McLean-   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.683 ************************