1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 22 Feb 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 106       Contents:+ !!HELP!! Any ideas or opinions appreciated.  Re: %LINK-W-MULDEF errors.  Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor  Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor  Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor  Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha MicroprocessorD Re: ??== Information about using unsupported printers with DCPS 1.8.D Re: ??== Information about using unsupported printers with DCPS 1.8.K Re: A nations dream (O.T. was: Re: [DSNlink NE V3.0] Way toomanyprocesses?) A Re: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins? A RE: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins? A RE: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins? A Re: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins?  Re: AlphaBook has sound! Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX) 1 Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX) -> RZ57 for *free*. 1 Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX) -> RZ57 for *free*. 5 Building Standalone backup - was Re: Lots of Micro... 2 can BACKUP/IMAGE restored to higher capacity disk?6 Re: can BACKUP/IMAGE restored to higher capacity disk? Re: CLuster coms with HSGs* Dates (was Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing)  Re: Documentation on Programming' For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc (II) + Re: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc (II) # For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc. ' RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc. ' Re: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc. ' RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc. ' Re: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.  forum.compaq.com2 FW: Dead AlphaStation 200 4/100 or memory troubles Re: GCC  Re: GCC ' identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives + Re: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives + RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives + RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives + Re: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives  It's not just the marketing.P Re: localtime() different on Compaq Alpha DS10 OpenVMS 7.1-2 vs DEVVAX VMS 5.5-2 Re: Lots of Microfiche's found!  Re: Lots of Microfiche's found!  Re: LPS/DCPS Help 5 Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI 9 Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI + Message for COMPAQ: http://forum.compaq.com  OBB question Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing  Re: OpenVMS-releases - timetable  Re: OpenVMS-releases - timetable Re: OT: Sun's 'Full Moon' 3 Re: Possible security hole in VMS Phone (was: Mail)   Re: Possible security hole in...  Re: Possible security hole in...  Re: Possible security hole in...  RE: Possible security hole in...  Re: Possible security hole in...  Re: Possible security hole in... Problem with Mozilla 0.8+ Re: problem with my alpha - tcpip need help + Re: problem with my alpha - tcpip need help  Re: Problems starting Apache& Proposed modif for PCSI Dev guide p7.3 Re: Status of EV7 $ Re: Strange way to blow your profits' Summary: Replaceing LP37 with LG15 Plus  Re: Sun's 'Full Moon'  Re: Sun's 'Full Moon'  Test* Re: Trouble with second NIC in my 3000-700* Re: Trouble with second NIC in my 3000-700 Re: UCX 4.x On DS20 ALPHAs ? Re: UCX 4.x On DS20 ALPHAs ?  Re: Unable To Delete A Directory VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port  RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port  Re: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port  RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port  RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port  Re: Version numbers  Re: Version numbers ) Re: VMS 7.2-1 Bugcheck In DECW$REINIT.EXE # RE: VMS systems up for 15 years !!! % Re: WKU FILESERV: Updated GZIP-1-2-4B % Re: WKU FILESERV: Updated GZIP-1-2-4B % Re: WKU FILESERV: Updated GZIP-1-2-4B 2 www.compaqworkinggroup.org (was: Alpha: game over)6 Re: www.compaqworkinggroup.org (was: Alpha: game over)3 Yahoo group created for VMSINSTAL to PCSI migration   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 10:09:48 -0600# From: medleyb@ev1.net (Bert Medley) 4 Subject: !!HELP!! Any ideas or opinions appreciated.4 Message-ID: <905066E40medleybev1net@158.234.153.155>  I I have a fortran program that uses an ISAM file for data storage/process  M tracking.  In one site (some network problems) this local process will, from  ; time to time, end up with a corrupted ISAM file as follows:    [output from analyze /rms]  E *** VBN 604: Index bucket references missing data bucket with VBN 74. 6 Unrecoverable error encountered in structure of file.   G Any ideas on what may cause this?  Only standard ISAM I/O is used...no  C special tricks allowed.  And the process is a wholly local process.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:03:50 -0000 - From: wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) # Subject: Re: %LINK-W-MULDEF errors. / Message-ID: <t9ahjmm1ngo3d1@news.supernews.com>   . Mcnutt@timken.com (McNutt, Larry E.) wrote in G <DA88FF10ADA8D211ADE700805F6507AF05BB8611@ctnhemail01.corp.timken.com>:    >Hello,  > < >Recently I was awarded the privilege of managing 2 more VAX; >systems that were transferred from another facility to HQ. > >Thankfully, the previous admin did a good job and things haveF >been running smoothly. Now, we're going to see if we can fix that. ;) >  >On a VAX 4000-200 VMS 6.2-1H3> >I am trying to build some cobol applications and I am getting> >several warnings from the linker. The output is listed below.B >This didn't happen on an Alpha system and I tried some variationsE >of adding sys$library:vaxcrtl to the link options file, but no luck.  >TIA for your help.  >  >Larry McNutt      >McNutt@Timken.com >  >>@tkncom acollate cbl main  > J >$! ********************************************************************** > J >$! *                                                                    * > J >$! * Procedure Name: TKNCOM.COM                                         * > J >$! * Syntax: @TKNCOM program-name program-extension program-type        * > J >$! *                 link/nolink-option                                 * > J >$! *                                                                    * > J >$! * This command procedure is used to compile C, COBOL, and FORTRAN    * > J >$! * programs and, if a main program, link it to the REUSE shareable    * > J >$! * image.                                                             * > J >$! *                                                                    * > J >$! * It can also be used to assemble Macro programs and create the      * > J >$! * object file.                                                       * > J >$! *                                                                    * > J >$! ********************************************************************** >  >$!  >  >$ BC001_START:  >  >$     WRT := WRITE SYS$OUTPUT > & >$     IF P2 .EQS. ""  THEN P2 = "CBL" > & >$     IF P3 .EQS. ""  THEN P3 = "SUB" > ' >$     IF P4 .EQS. ""  THEN P4 = "LINK"  >  >$     _SOURCE_NAME = P1+"."+P2  > = >$     _COMP_MSG = "               ***** Running 'TKNCOM' for  >"+_SOURCE_NAME+" ** >***"  >  >$     WRT _COMP_MSG > = >               ***** Running 'TKNCOM' for ACOLLATE.CBL *****  > : >$     _COMPILE_PARMS = "/CROSS_REFERENCE/LIST="+P1+".LST" > < >$     IF P2 .EQS. "C"        THEN      GOTO BC200_C_PROGRAM > @ >$     IF P2 .EQS. "CBL"      THEN      GOTO BC300_COBOL_PROGRAM >  >$ BC300_COBOL_PROGRAM:  > I >$!   Create the environment control file for 805YE so that it alters the  >  >$!   appropriate statements > # >$     COPY I805YEA.CBL I805YEA.DAT  > < >$     IF P3 .EQS. "MAIN"  THEN COPY I805YEB.VAX I805YEB.DAT > H >$     IF P3 .EQS. "SUB"   THEN COPY I805YEB.VAX,I805YEB.SUB I805YEB.DAT >  >$!  > ) >$!   Run the source preprocessor program  > 4 >$     WRT "Running the Source Preprocessor (805YE)" > ( >Running the Source Preprocessor (805YE) >  >$     _HOLD_NAME   = P1+".HLD"  > ! >$     _DELETE_NAME = P1+".CBL.*"  >   >$     ASSIGN "I805YEA.DAT"  DDA >   >$     ASSIGN "I805YEB.DAT"  DDB >  >$     ASSIGN ACOLLATE.CBL DDC >   >$     ASSIGN "D805YED.DAT"  DDD >  >$     RUN P805YE  >  >$     DELETE I805YEA.DAT;*  >  >$     DELETE I805YEB.DAT;*  >  >$     DEASSIGN DDA  >  >$     DEASSIGN DDB  >  >$     DEASSIGN DDC  >  >$     DEASSIGN DDD  > ' >$     RENAME ACOLLATE.CBL ACOLLATE.HLD  > & >$     RENAME D805YED.DAT ACOLLATE.CBL >  >$!  >  >$     WRT "Compiling" > 
 >Compiling > 5 >$     _COMPILE_PARMS = "/ANSI_FORMAT"+_COMPILE_PARMS  > & >$!    _COMPILE_PARMS = "/ANSI_FORMAT" > H >$     COBOL /ANSI_FORMAT/CROSS_REFERENCE/LIST=ACOLLATE.LST ACOLLATE.CBL >  >$     DELETE ACOLLATE.CBL.* > ' >$     RENAME ACOLLATE.HLD ACOLLATE.CBL  >  >$     GOTO BC500_LINK >  >$ BC500_LINK: > 7 >$     IF P3 .EQS. "SUB"  THEN          GOTO BC600_EXIT  > 7 >$     IF P4 .EQS. "NOLINK"  THEN       GOTO BC600_EXIT  >  >$     WRT "Linking" >  >Linking > 6 >$     LINK/MAP/CROSS_REFERENCE ACOLLATE,REUSEMAIN/OPT >  >REUSE/SHAREABLE > % >%LINK-W-WRNERS, compilation warnings  > 9 >        in module REUSE file $1$DIA1:[MISDSS]REUSE.VAX;2  > - >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol KILL multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > / >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol GETUID multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > 0 >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol GETEUID multiply defined > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > / >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol GETCWD multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > . >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol _EXIT multiply defined > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > - >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol EXIT multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > / >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol RENAME multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > - >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol OPEN multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > . >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol FOPEN multiply defined > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > . >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol CHDIR multiply defined > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 > / >%LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol REMOVE multiply defined  > @ >        in module VAXCRTL file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]VAXCRTL.EXE;7 >  >$!  >  >$ BC600_EXIT: >  >$     WRT "Finished!!!" >  >Finished!!! >  >> >  >   H My guess is that the linker is including the VAXCRTL object library for J input, and on Alpha, it usually shouldn't (there are exceptions).  If you D can find where, in the link procedure, it's referenced, you can try F removing it and rebuilding.  If you then get a long list of undefined J symbols, then a closer examination of the application will be required to ' determine the correct course of action.    Hope this helps,   ws   --  1 << Marriage is Grand.  Divorce is Fifty Grand. >>    Warren Spencer Senior Software Engineer The Associated Press  ? ** My employer does not necessarily agree with my statements **    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:02:38 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>) Subject: Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor - Message-ID: <87n1bevefl.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   6 "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes:  D > > A presentaion on a new Alpha processor in a Microsoft PowerPoint > > presentation?  > > Does anyone at > > Compaq have a clue?   C > What would you have them build the presentation with? DECwrite???   N > Seriously, I ran into Bill Joy at a Sun analyst briefing three years ago. HeN > was running Windoze and MS-Apps on his notebook. Chances are good he's usingB > Solaris for Intel and StarOffice today, but he was in fact using' > MS-Bloatware when I chatted with him.   5 At least he didn't have to sigh an NDA if it crashed.   D Tell me Terry, what do one use on VMS to do anything with powerpuke?D Is presenting information so your natural target audience such a bad> idea now? Would doing the captions in Swahilli be even better?  > BTW, Decwrite is still on both Vax and Alpha VMS, and T64. I'd- prefer TeX, but I prefer content over form...    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:44:50 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> ) Subject: Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor H Message-ID: <y4pugaa9yl.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  6 "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes:  C > What would you have them build the presentation with? DECwrite???   I No, just convert it to PDF (Adobe Acrobat has a plug-in for the purpose).    	Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:34:07 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>) Subject: Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor < Message-ID: <zYcl6.8734$CW1.6821070@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  9 "Paul Repacholi" <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote in message ' news:87n1bevefl.fsf@prep.synonet.com... 8 > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > F > > > A presentaion on a new Alpha processor in a Microsoft PowerPoint > > > presentation?  > > > Does anyone at > > > Compaq have a clue?  > E > > What would you have them build the presentation with? DECwrite???  > H > > Seriously, I ran into Bill Joy at a Sun analyst briefing three years ago. He J > > was running Windoze and MS-Apps on his notebook. Chances are good he's using D > > Solaris for Intel and StarOffice today, but he was in fact using) > > MS-Bloatware when I chatted with him.  > 7 > At least he didn't have to sigh an NDA if it crashed.    A point well taken!    > F > Tell me Terry, what do one use on VMS to do anything with powerpuke?F > Is presenting information so your natural target audience such a bad@ > idea now? Would doing the captions in Swahilli be even better?  J Like it or not, there are a hell of a lot more people using PowerPuke thanI alternative presentationware. Since most presentations are served up from F peecees, I am not surprised that PowerPuke is the electronic emesis of choice.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:34:13 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>) Subject: Re: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor < Message-ID: <FYcl6.8735$CW1.6821448@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  L "Jan Vorbrueggen" <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> wrote inJ message news:y4pugaa9yl.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de...8 > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > E > > What would you have them build the presentation with? DECwrite???  > K > No, just convert it to PDF (Adobe Acrobat has a plug-in for the purpose).  >   1 Yeah, that's what I generally do with my pitches.    ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 01:43 CST ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) M Subject: Re: ??== Information about using unsupported printers with DCPS 1.8. - Message-ID: <22FEB200101435404@gerg.tamu.edu>   0 aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de (Hans M. Aus) writes...G }In article <20FEB200120162603@gerg.tamu.edu>, carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl  }Perkins) wrote: }.....J }> The error messages are presumably caused by DCPS not getting any answerH }> back from the questions it is asking the printer. DCPS insists on two }> way communication.... }> --- Carl  }  }Carl, } J }May thanks for your informative and quick response. I just noticed in the= }general status information that the network is 10BaseT HALF.	 } B }Does that mean that the printer can't communicate with the Alpha? }-- C }Cheers, Hans M. Aus, Wuerzburg, Germany,  aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.der  C No. That is just the basic mode of operation for ethernet - you caneD be sending or receiving a message at any given time, not both. (FullC duplex lets you send and receive at the same time.) The older typespE of ethernet, 10-Base-2 and 10-Base-5, only worked that way. The newerlG "-T" types allow for full duplex if both the computer and the switch orrC hub are capable of it (it's a lot easier to do full duplex when you 6 have cables with more than 2 conductors to work with).  E You might want to check the network configuration for the printer andFE your VMS systems to make sure that they are both correctly set up and(E also both set up to allow the communication. For example, if they are G in different subnets but the printer is not set up properly it might be E possible that it can communicate with things on the same subnet (i.e. F the computers that can currently use it) but not any others (i.e. your VMS system).  E But the problem is still most likely to be that, for whatever reason,oG the printer is not interpreting what you are sending as PostScript. TheQE evidence is very simple: it prints out some of the initial PostScriptEK code. If it were interpreting it correctly then it wouldn't be printing it.c  C It might be possible that DCPS is not using the correct port on thenG printer. PostScript often goes to a different port than PCL - the "raw"rF port vs. the "text" port. I would expect it to get it right, but on anF unsupported printer who knows? Being unsupported, it obviously doesn'tH know anything about how the printer works. (I don't know how you specifyG this with DCPS, or even if you can - I'm still using a very old version L that doesn't do TCP/IP, and using Multinet's LPD to talk to various printers) that don't speak LAT. Upgrades "soon"...)o   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:32:18 +0100S, From: aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de (Hans M. Aus)M Subject: Re: ??== Information about using unsupported printers with DCPS 1.8..D Message-ID: <aus-2202010932180001@wvia21.virologie.uni-wuerzburg.de>  / The active printer emulation on the Kyocera is:C   PCL  PCLXLC
 POSTSCRIPT PJLe  C The Kyocera's primary function is to print from the hospital's UnixeF system; the secondary purpose is to print from DCPS/OVMS. The hospitalF system requires Kyocera's PreScript (?) which, I'm told, is similar to	 HP's PCL.u   We're using:  7 DIGITAL TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.0Ag9 on a Digital Personal WorkStation  running OpenVMS V7.2-1u   -- eB Cheers, Hans M. Aus, Wuerzburg, Germany,  aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:25:09 -0500u- From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca>eT Subject: Re: A nations dream (O.T. was: Re: [DSNlink NE V3.0] Way toomanyprocesses?)4 Message-ID: <3cal6.133287$Z2.1771191@nnrp1.uunet.ca>  C "Jan Vorbrueggen" <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>. wrote in messageB news:y43dd8nzdr.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de...1 > "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:  > * > >     My name is Joe, and I AM CANADIAN! >l, > Hasn't he recently defected to Hollywood!? >l > Jan    and   / >/<norm.raphael@jamesbury.com> wrote in messaget0 >/news:C22569F9.0060C74B.00@jklh21.valmet.com... >/>  >/>s >/>V+ >/> Was that the dream of world domination?m >/ >/Yes. >  >I thought so.  F Once the Arrow was killed we kept the dream of world domination alive,= but the current plan involves sending all of our comedians to 
 Hollywood. :)C   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:49:33 +0000A% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> J Subject: Re: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins?8 Message-ID: <cpn99tckg8l146osbbpl1avq4i2ntlkhhs@4ax.com>  1 On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:52:30 -0600, "Main, Kerry"u <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> wrote:   >David,  >fI >I know you have been a very strong supporter of OpenVMS in the past, so, = >imho, I feel it is unfortunate that you are now so anti-VMS.w  K >Hopefully, at some point in the future, you will have a chance to re-visitg >some of these decisions.a   Kerry and David,  9 Has there been any contact between VMS engineering and/or-> sales/advocates and David Mathog to try and provide a workableE affordable VMS solution? Most organizations that were actually really D serious about their products would be jumping at the chance to solveA the highly specific criticisms leveled in this case. Even if thatl< meant *spending real money*  and dedicating time and effort.     -- Alan   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 15:45:49 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)J Subject: RE: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins?, Message-ID: <973c7d$eeq@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  | In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284E36@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes: >David,h >yI >I know you have been a very strong supporter of OpenVMS in the past, so,1= >imho, I feel it is unfortunate that you are now so anti-VMS.   J Don't shoot the messenger.  I spent the better part of 10 years trying to G convince your company's boneheaded management that their positions wereAK killing this product and offering various alternatives to change that trend J (for instance the PC VMS project).  Your management has finally succeeded,K at least in my market segment, and that's not my fault.  I'm not "antiVMS",iK but my position is that VMS is no longer the best OS for my needs because:    3   1. Its performance in critical areas is terrible.6D   2. There is a complete lack of application software, including theF      insolvable problem of of software which is only made available inK      binary form for other platforms so that I couldn't port it if I wantedl      to.!   3. It costs more other options.nC   4. The vendor's support for the platform in my market segment is n@      essentially nonexistant.  Moreover, the vendor's statementsI      with respect to this OS to the customers who use it are incompatible G      with all other vendor statements.  That has produced more FUD thand*      Andrew could have in a year of posts.   > L >While many of your points have some validity (marketing etc), you also makeF >constant references to how great Linux/UNIX IO is - at least in a fewL >specific area's that are important to you. As stated here before by others,L >some of these IO issues are being investigated, so I suspect there will not1 >be that big of a difference in the near future.    J I tried 7.3FT on the test drive site and even with the new read caching itJ was still 3X slower than Linux on identical software for read performance.H I don't have time to wait for you folks to make up the difference.  And I even if you do solve those technical problems, I have no confidence that  L Compaq would market the OS in such a manner as to allow it to substantially D regain lost market share.  I cite as the best example the fraudulentE OpenVMS educational program - which is utterly useless to all current*I customers. Or at least those that read the license agreement and abide byP it.    > G >However, please do not assume everyone is in the same position as you."K >OpenVMS showed growth last year as did Alpha sales. OpenVMS is winning new I >Customers. While some markets are obviously doing better than others, aso< >hard as this might be for you to believe, that is reality.   J Not around here.  Around here it's "what the heck are you running on that  box?"_  K >Hopefully, at some point in the future, you will have a chance to re-visitH >some of these decisions.M  L With current trends that has a "the tea pot boiling by itself" magnitude of K probability.  I'd rate the chances about as high as Beta reclaiming the VCR  market from VHS.   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu5? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech 0J **************************************************************************J *                                RIP VMS                                 *J **************************************************************************   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 08:57:05 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) J Subject: RE: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins?, Message-ID: <zUDVVOLnvZVb@malvm1.mala.bc.ca>  N In article <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284E36@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>,1     "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes:  > K > Anyway, I know you have been a very strong OpenVMS supporter in the past, K > and anything I say here is obviously not going to change your view and/orLL > frustration with the OpenVMS marketing side, so I guess I'll just wish you' > luck with your new platform choices. M > F     More to the point, it appears Compaq isn't going to do anything to% address any of Davids points such as:L  H    - Difficulty ( or impossibility ) to upgrade low end boxes like DS10.  G    - High price of VMS vs Tru64 or Linux when all pieces such as extra        users are factored in.   8    - Uselessness of the "new" education license program.    G    Perhaps any real indication that Compaq has listened to any of thoseAE concerns would have changed his mind ( though it sounds like it's nowI too late ).c   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:18:20 GMTE4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>J Subject: Re: Alpha: game over.  Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins?< Message-ID: <wRbl6.8727$CW1.6789013@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  > "Malcolm Dunnett" <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote in message& news:zUDVVOLnvZVb@malvm1.mala.bc.ca...   <snip>H >     More to the point, it appears Compaq isn't going to do anything to' > address any of Davids points such as:l >eJ >    - Difficulty ( or impossibility ) to upgrade low end boxes like DS10.  L The DS10 upgradability issue may be predicated on CPU speed. The motherboardL on the DS10 may not be able to support faster CPUs. Which is why we'll see a$ DS15 (and DS25) Reasonably Soon Now.   >XH >    - High price of VMS vs Tru64 or Linux when all pieces such as extra >      users are factored in.   L Big difference between Tru64 and Linux, but it's a damned shame that there'sI an uplift for OpenVMS vice Tru64. That must make Sun very happy. And BillO Gates and Andy Grove, too!   >%: >    - Uselessness of the "new" education license program.  H Rich Marcello claims this issue is being worked. Dunno the status of any
 improvements.u  J You have until March 5 to assert your views on these and other subjects at www.compaqworkinggroup.org   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 06:53:59 -0300O) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br$! Subject: Re: AlphaBook has sound!hL Message-ID: <OF5DEA0695.93B6DC38-ON032569FB.00364F17@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  % You have a rare piece of technology !n  < Why Compaq or Samsung dont develop a new "compact alpha" ???   Regardsa   FC        D gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) em 21/02/2001 14:58:44  * Favor responder a gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de             Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coma       Assunto: AlphaBook has sound!e     Hi,   F I just discovered that my AlphaBook has some sort of a supported sound card!MH With VMS 7.1-2 and MMOV 2.2 I was able to hear the example .avi and .wav files.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann*  H -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 02:35:17 -0500i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>l& Subject: Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX), Message-ID: <3A94C12B.1B88B69B@videotron.ca>   "Michael T. Davis" wrote:g >  I still can't seem to. > initialize the disk under VMS 5.5-2, though.    & Have you considered upgrading to 7.2 ?  ? I have a Seagate ST31055N drive on the 3100-30 without problem.   N I used to have a Qantum 240meg drive (that came from a Macintosh) and the onlyM problem I had was during booting. I was told it was because VMS would issue a K SCSI-2 command that caused the drive to jam. But I could unjam the drive byxM powering off and on the drive only and then VMS would continue to boot. Can't C remember what version of OS I had, but I think it may have been 6.16   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:13:02 +0000  From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net>t: Subject: Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX) -> RZ57 for *free*.) Message-ID: <3A94D81E.D3B55225@Omond.net>2  & "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote:   > [... snip snip ...]i >rK > The RZ57 should work!  ;)  Try some of the DEC resellers.  I'd bet they'dg- > have one lying about somewhere to sell you.r  B I have offered an RZ57 for *free* recently in comp.os.vms.  No-one" has shown any interest ... *sigh*.  	 Roy Omonde Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:44:14 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)e: Subject: Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX) -> RZ57 for *free*.0 Message-ID: <009F8023.555EB431@SendSpamHere.ORG>  K In article <3A94D81E.D3B55225@Omond.net>, Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> writes:e' >"Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote:. >> >> [... snip snip ...] >>L >> The RZ57 should work!  ;)  Try some of the DEC resellers.  I'd bet they'd. >> have one lying about somewhere to sell you. >aC >I have offered an RZ57 for *free* recently in comp.os.vms.  No-ones# >has shown any interest ... *sigh*.  > 
 >Roy Omond >Blue Bubble Ltd.b >d  D No?  I must have missed that posting.  Send it to me and I'll put it in my disk drive depot.e   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMs            sO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 09:49:07 -05003 From: malmberg@encompasserve.org (John E. Malmberg)n> Subject: Building Standalone backup - was Re: Lots of Micro...3 Message-ID: <mOkIM9fS$EgM@eisner.encompasserve.org>    [Replying only to comp.os.vms]+ In article <3A94C742.EB4AFA86@softstar.it>,h6 Enrico Badella <enrico.badella@softstar.italy> writes: > L > Does anybody have a STABAKIT of VMS 4.7? The one that came with my uVAX IIE > was badly tailored (RSX stuff does not work) and the previous ownerP0 > had used the installation TK50 for backups :-(  E Assuming that you have any working version of VAX/VMS or OpenVMS VAX,rE you can use the command procedure SYS$UPDATE:STABACKIT.COM to producezH as many copies of standalone backup as you need on a variety of bootable devices.  D I would tend to recommend using a more current version of OpenVMS toB produce the standalone backup tape, as this is past the year 2000.  H Please see the OpenVMS FAQ and the OpenVMS documentation, available from( a link at http://www.openvms.compaq.com.   -Johnt wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:55:12 +0800h5 From: Netsurfer <netsurfer@sentosa.singaporemail.com>-; Subject: can BACKUP/IMAGE restored to higher capacity disk?a8 Message-ID: <2hd99tklfn18ap5uo3vet8p498qad0stm4@4ax.com>  F Presently I got 3 sets of RAID-1 (mirrored) disks, and run low on diskE capacity. My department is not going invest on any further upgrade onw the old obsolete AlphaServer.1  C Can I backup the physical disk with BACKUP/IMAGE and then break the.C RAID SET and create a RAID-0 (disk striped) to double capacity, and ) restored the saveset onto the new disks??s  C Unfortunately few disk are system boot disk, BACKUP/IMAGE is a must-E unless I re-installed the OS and apply the patches which will be verys troublesome.  C Will backup/image take into consideration of original capacity, and B after restore, corrupt the file allocation table, or filesystems??   Hope someone can enlighten me..A  
 Thank you.      y Regards,  	 Netsurferg        ====R For any personal email replies, please remove " sentosa. " from my E-mail address.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:26:06 +0100r: From: Karl Rohwedder <extern.karl.rohwedder@volkswagen.de>? Subject: Re: can BACKUP/IMAGE restored to higher capacity disk?s- Message-ID: <3A94BF0E.6BC0BDB3@volkswagen.de>   H It is not clear from your post, if you are using host based shadowing or controller basedF shadowing. If host based shadowing you can just dismount one member ofF the shadowsets, initialize it and remount it as new standalone disk or new single member shadowset.  F If doing a backup/image and restore, it is o.k. to restore on a largerG volume. It could be better to initialize the new volume manually 1st toeF adjust some parameters (initial size of indexfile) to the new disksizeC (you must use BACKUP/IMAGE/NOINIT on restore then), but this is noty
 mandatory.  G But note that you are loosing any security against diskfailures, and ifrD you stipe all disks into one stripeset the MTBF even gets worse, oneB failing disk -> and its all gone. If controller based a RAID-5 set should be a better alternative.    Netsurfer wrote: > H > Presently I got 3 sets of RAID-1 (mirrored) disks, and run low on diskG > capacity. My department is not going invest on any further upgrade ono > the old obsolete AlphaServer.  > E > Can I backup the physical disk with BACKUP/IMAGE and then break thetE > RAID SET and create a RAID-0 (disk striped) to double capacity, andd+ > restored the saveset onto the new disks??o > E > Unfortunately few disk are system boot disk, BACKUP/IMAGE is a mustmG > unless I re-installed the OS and apply the patches which will be veryn > troublesome. > E > Will backup/image take into consideration of original capacity, andlD > after restore, corrupt the file allocation table, or filesystems?? > ! > Hope someone can enlighten me..( >  > Thank you. > 
 > Regards, >  > Netsurfers >  >  > ====T > For any personal email replies, please remove " sentosa. " from my E-mail address.   -- >  - mit freundlichen Gruessen | with best regardss   Karl Rohwedder               JC iT-Ingenieurteam     | Ellernbruch 11       | D-38112 Braunschweig UA Telefon: 0531/515521 | Telefax: 0531/515531 | Mobil: 0172/5434843 E  E-Mail: rohwedder@decus.decus.de           | iT-IngTeam@t-online.de i+          karl.rohwedder@it-ingenieurteam.deA DATEX-P: 4505018005::ROHWEDDER   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:19:49 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com># Subject: Re: CLuster coms with HSGse- Message-ID: <87ae7evdmy.fsf@prep.synonet.com>,  " steven.reece@quintiles.com writes:  : > Paul Repacholi (prep at prep dot synonet dot com) wrote:@ > >>>Is MC interupt handling still only on the Primary CPU? 7.3? > 4 > Keeping the  CI strikes me as a very good idea.<<<  D > I am willing to be corrected, but I would imagine the answer to beB > yes it's still tied to the primary cpu.  Fastpath is not (AFAIK)< > involved with MC traffic and I'm not aware of any specific+ > enhancements to MC interconnects at v7.3.A   > I could be wrong though......e  D Let hope so. Given that saturated primaries have bit already, I fearC some one with a good HSG floor full and locking trafic to match may/ rediscover this one.  B Could someone from VMS engineering look at this before it gets all cosmic for someone please.   -- p< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:50:44 +0000?$ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk3 Subject: Dates (was Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing)-/ Message-ID: <002569FB.00411318.00@quegw01.btyp>t  L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza     Christof wrote;,  " >>What about 2/20/2001 11.26 p.m.?  ! The 20th month? When's that then?s   ;^Dn   Steve St   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:55:45 GMTe5 From: Lyndon Bartels <lyndon.bartels@childrenshc.org>S) Subject: Re: Documentation on Programminga. Message-ID: <3A94E20D.674927C@childrenshc.org>  " Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com wrote: >  > What sort of skill level?u >  > Shane   C Any/all skill levels.... I've done C programming before, but not onr3 VMS... So I need how to do specific things there...s  E Mostly I'm looking for something that I can use as reference.... I've-G been programming for years, and know *how*. The hard part is... "I wantg5 to do this..... what's the syntax for the fopen....."p     TIAo Lyndon --   Lyndon F. BartelsO VMS Systems Administrator  Childrens Hospitals and Clinics  lyndon.bartels@childrenshc.org 651-855-2504 (work)6 651-855-2570 (fax)   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 12:25:34 GMTo, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>0 Subject: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc (II)& Message-ID: <3A950559.B2A953E9@gmx.ch>   To whom it may concern.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------D Page 7.72 of the Polycenter Software Installation Utility DevelopersH Guide, AA-Q28MC-TK january 1999, OpenVMS 7.2-1, the PARAMETERS paragraph should read:   WITH (parameters,...);F Indicates the list of parameters that are passed ../.. If there are no- parameters to pass, specify a null string "".MH ------------------------------------------------------------------------  ' (because the WITH keyword is mandatory)e   D. -- e+ IMS AG                  <mailto:dmo@ims.ch>e/ Worblentalstr. 30       Tel: +41 (31) 925 33 56 / 3063 Ittigen (Swiss)    Fax: +41 (31) 922 22 22r/ -----------------------------------------------l/ Besuchen Sie uns im Internet: http://www.ims.ch / or  http://didier.morandi.free.fr/index_us.htmlr      GSM: 079.705.46.70s   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:49:46 GMTc, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>4 Subject: Re: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc (II)& Message-ID: <3A951916.DD0E08A6@gmx.ch>   sent to openvmsdoc@compaq.comt   Didier Morandi wrote:y >  > To whom it may concern.m ../..g   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:58:35 GMT-, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>, Subject: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.& Message-ID: <3A94F0F7.72CE863E@gmx.ch>   To whom it may concern.   C Page 5.2 of the Polycenter Software Installation Utility Developers D Guide, AA-Q28MC-TK january 1999, OpenVMS 7.2-1, paragraph 5.2 should read:   3 "As a convenience, PACKAGE.COM has been created..."a   instead of:   3 "As a convenience, PRODUCT.COM has been created..."d   D. --  + IMS AG                  <mailto:dmo@ims.ch>o/ Worblentalstr. 30       Tel: +41 (31) 925 33 56m/ 3063 Ittigen (Swiss)    Fax: +41 (31) 922 22 22u/ -----------------------------------------------s/ Besuchen Sie uns im Internet: http://www.ims.cho/ or  http://didier.morandi.free.fr/index_us.htmlr      GSM: 079.705.46.70a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:23:09 -0600r* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>0 Subject: RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.- Message-ID: <0033000016865916000002L062*@MHS>    =0Afrom:  3 www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/extra/DOC_COMMENTS.HTMLh  ' Sending comments to the OpenVMS writers ; Compaq welcomes your comments on the OpenVMS documentation.t  @ When providing comments about HTML documentation, please include@ the HTML file name and the file's date. You can find the date at@ the top of the file, immediately above the buttons. You can find@ the file name at the bottom of the file, on the right-hand side.  ? When providing comments about PDF documentation, please include.A the PDF file name or document title and tell us it is a PDF file.e  > When providing comments about Bookreader documentation, please? include the document title and tell us it is a Bookreader file.*  > When providing comments about PostScript documentation, please> include the PostScript file name or document title and tell us it is a PostScript file.   Please e-mail your comments to:       openvmsdoc@compaq.com   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET + > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 6:13 AMg8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET. > Subject: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc. >q >p > To whom it may concern.K >yE > Page 5.2 of the Polycenter Software Installation Utility DeveloperstF > Guide, AA-Q28MC-TK january 1999, OpenVMS 7.2-1, paragraph 5.2 should > read:g >g5 > "As a convenience, PACKAGE.COM has been created..."e >S
 > instead of:, > 5 > "As a convenience, PRODUCT.COM has been created..."r >h > D. > --- > IMS AG                  <mailto:dmo@ims.ch>t1 > Worblentalstr. 30       Tel: +41 (31) 925 33 56n1 > 3063 Ittigen (Swiss)    Fax: +41 (31) 922 22 22)1 > -----------------------------------------------r1 > Besuchen Sie uns im Internet: http://www.ims.chs1 > or  http://didier.morandi.free.fr/index_us.htmle >      GSM: 079.705.46.70o >=   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:43:46 GMTe, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>0 Subject: Re: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.& Message-ID: <3A9517AE.515AED46@gmx.ch>  
 Thank you.2 Where did you find that "extra" hyperlink, please?   D.   WILLIAM WEBB wrote:> >  > from:: > 5 > www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/extra/DOC_COMMENTS.HTMLn   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:55:31 -0500m/ From: "Webb, William W" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>s0 Subject: RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.K Message-ID: <D46FE9B132FB9B44AEC242A96E4AB750019259B6@rlghncst625.usps.gov>o  J This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand< this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.  ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CDF.806F6D00e Content-Type: text/plain;D 	charset="iso-8859-1"s   1.  www.openvms.compaq.com+ 2.  Click on link for OpenVMS Documentationo%     (third column, sixth choice down)v; 3.  Click on CONTACT US portion of imagemap at top of page.a  9 I forwarded your first correction to the person in chargeu of documentation.     : When you posted the second one, I decided to give you the  direct information.B  9 Thanks for doing this.  Far too few people are willing to : go to the effort to provide feedback on documentation (and' consequently, mistakes are propagated).a   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET + > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 9:33 AM-8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET2 > Subject: RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc. >  >  > Thank you.4 > Where did you find that "extra" hyperlink, please? >  > D. >  > WILLIAM WEBB wrote:b > > 	 > > from:r > >i7 > > www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/extra/DOC_COMMENTS.HTMLp >   ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CDF.806F6D00  Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1"n  1 <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">n <HTML> <HEAD>H <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">H <META NAME="Generator" CONTENT="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2653.12">6 <TITLE>RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.</TITLE> </HEAD>r <BODY>  6 <P><FONT SIZE=2>1.&nbsp; www.openvms.compaq.com</FONT>H <BR><FONT SIZE=2>2.&nbsp; Click on link for OpenVMS Documentation</FONT>L <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (third column, sixth choice down)</FONT>X <BR><FONT SIZE=2>3.&nbsp; Click on CONTACT US portion of imagemap at top of page.</FONT> </P>  P <P><FONT SIZE=2>I forwarded your first correction to the person in charge</FONT>0 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>of documentation.&nbsp; </FONT> </P>  Q <P><FONT SIZE=2>When you posted the second one, I decided to give you the </FONT>-+ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>direct information.</FONT>  </P>  U <P><FONT SIZE=2>Thanks for doing this.&nbsp; Far too few people are willing to</FONT> R <BR><FONT SIZE=2>go to the effort to provide feedback on documentation (and</FONT>? <BR><FONT SIZE=2>consequently, mistakes are propagated).</FONT>  </P>   <P><FONT SIZE=2>WWWebb</FONT>2 </P>  6 <P><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT>M <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET </FONT> F <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 9:33 AM</FONT>S <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET</FONT>dM <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Subject: RE: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.</FONT>t <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>  <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT> ' <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Thank you.</FONT>-Y <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Where did you find that &quot;extra&quot; hyperlink, please?</FONT>: <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>- <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; D.</FONT>3 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT> 0 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; WILLIAM WEBB wrote:</FONT>! <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;</FONT>l' <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt; from:</FONT>s! <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;</FONT>gU <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt; www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/extra/DOC_COMMENTS.HTML</FONT>. <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>e </P>   </BODY>  </HTML>n) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CDF.806F6D00---   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:06:29 GMTH, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>0 Subject: Re: For COMPAQ: correction in PCSI doc.& Message-ID: <3A955541.67D7EE31@gmx.ch>   I also found that:    sys$help:openvmsdoc_comments.txt  A but the correct email address is no more @zko...  but @compaq.com"   WILLIAM WEBB wrote:n >  > from:  > 5 > www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/extra/DOC_COMMENTS.HTMLl > ) > Sending comments to the OpenVMS writerso= > Compaq welcomes your comments on the OpenVMS documentation.c   D.9 ---------------------------------------------------------*7 The ultimate VMSINSTAL to PCSI migration forum is here: +     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vmsinstalI   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:54:06 GMTt, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> Subject: forum.compaq.com.& Message-ID: <3A94EFEA.3A519178@gmx.ch>   How do I log in here?    Thanks,- D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:40:02 -0500g/ From: "Webb, William W" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>B; Subject: FW: Dead AlphaStation 200 4/100 or memory troubles-K Message-ID: <D46FE9B132FB9B44AEC242A96E4AB750019259B3@rlghncst625.usps.gov>]  J This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand< this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.  ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CD4.F514BA30I Content-Type: text/plain;  	charset="iso-8859-1"d      ; Send me your address and I'll buy it if he doesn't want it.:   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET - > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 11:24 AMr8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET= > Subject: RE: Dead AlphaStation 200 4/100 or memory troubless >  > C > If you end up needing a board I have a system board from an Alpha H > Station 200 4/166 with CPU for $25.00 Board is guaranteed good. Pulled) > from system we needed other parts from.  >  > Mike N. > Please remove the .spamnot to reply directly > D > On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 13:19:50 GMT, atlas@world.std.com (Alexander R > Svirsky) wrote:0 > $ > >John Santos (JOHN@egh.com) wrote: > >o: > >: Don't know, but maybe it isn't really a AS 200 4/100? > >tD > >It certainly looks that way.  On the up side, if the board can be; > >salvaged, I've got something better than an AS200 4/100.w >   ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CD4.F514BA30i Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1"e  1 <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">  <HTML> <HEAD>H <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">H <META NAME="Generator" CONTENT="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2653.12">A <TITLE>FW: Dead AlphaStation 200 4/100 or memory troubles</TITLE>- </HEAD>  <BODY> <BR> <BR>  R <P><FONT SIZE=2>Send me your address and I'll buy it if he doesn't want it.</FONT> </P>   <P><FONT SIZE=2>WWWebb</FONT>t </P>  6 <P><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT>M <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET </FONT> H <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 11:24 AM</FONT>S <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET</FONT>0X <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Subject: RE: Dead AlphaStation 200 4/100 or memory troubles</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>p <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>B^ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; If you end up needing a board I have a system board from an Alpha</FONT>c <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Station 200 4/166 with CPU for $25.00 Board is guaranteed good. Pulled</FONT>hD <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; from system we needed other parts from.</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT> # <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Mike N</FONT>iI <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Please remove the .spamnot to reply directly</FONT>t <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT> _ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 13:19:50 GMT, atlas@world.std.com (Alexander R</FONT>E, <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Svirsky) wrote:</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>rB <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;John Santos (JOHN@egh.com) wrote:</FONT>! <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;</FONT>vX <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;: Don't know, but maybe it isn't really a AS 200 4/100?</FONT>! <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;</FONT>eg <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;It certainly looks that way.&nbsp; On the up side, if the board can be</FONT> Y <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;salvaged, I've got something better than an AS200 4/100.</FONT>r <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>i </P>   </BODY>K </HTML>a) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CD4.F514BA30--    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 09:30:57 -05003 From: malmberg@encompasserve.org (John E. Malmberg)a Subject: Re: GCC3 Message-ID: <t03mRWb+7lrm@eisner.encompasserve.org>h  M Some erratta for those that are using GCC 2.8.1 for VAX and the BINUTILS from/ about the same date.  M The source that was used to build the GCC.EXE image appears to have been losttG somewhere before I found that GCC kit.  What remains is close, but somenF significant changes were made and the GCC.CLD does not match the GCC.CG program.  I was unable to determine what should be correct.  One of the J maintainers was going to locate the correct code and post it, but it never	 happened.J  L So the use of GCC VAX 2.8.1 must be done as a foreign command, not using theH GCC.CLD file.  That is the only known workaround until someone finds theK time and inclination to work on it.  With Compaq C available free under thedE hobbyist license, and generating far better code, much incentives for- improving GCC for VMS are gone.b  I Now on the BINUTILS, the "bzero()" routine will access violate if called.RF The workaround is to #define bzero to actually call memset(), changing the argument order to match.  H According to the VMS debugger, the problem with BZERO is that apparentlyN they passed the address of 0 to a MOVC5 instruction instead of the constant 0.  G The fix should not be hard, it is just that the source that built those 9 routines does not seem to be available on the www either.    -Johni wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only.  3 In article <3CMjnUgAh$vy@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > malmberg@encompasserve.organization (John E. Malmberg) writes:. > In article <3a94267a$1_1@news.pacifier.com>,2 > mikef@pacifier.commercial (Mike Freeman) writes: > L >> Is there a version of Gnu-C for Vax/VMS out there later than 1.42? If so, >> where might I find it?n >i< > According to the FAQ off of http://www.openvms.compaq.com/ > = > GCC 2.8.1 for VAX is at ftp://vms.gnu.org/progis_mirror/gccd > ! >> How good are the header files?  > E > Some updates can be found at ftp://ftp.qsl.net/pub/wb8tyw/gcc281_u/t >iD > At the ftp://ftp.qsl.net/pub/wb8tyw/ site are examples of building@ > programs using GCC and the DEC C RTL instead of the VAX C RTL. >tP > If this is for non-commercial use, please look at the OpenVMS Hobbyist License5 > program in the FAQ.  The licenses include Compaq C.o >c > -John  > wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 12:46:55 -0500t% From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian>h Subject: Re: GCC$ Message-ID: <3a95509f$1@news.si.com>  ; >According to the FAQ off of http://www.openvms.compaq.com/m >y< >GCC 2.8.1 for VAX is at ftp://vms.gnu.org/progis_mirror/gcc  J The biggest problem with this archive is that, despite running on VMS, theJ files aren't in standard VMS format.  The command procedures in [.COMMON],K for example, are fix length, 512 byte files, even when transfered ASCII ando even with STRU O VMS set.  --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comw= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevente< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 11:05:23 GMT From: Mike@littlewoods.co.uk0 Subject: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives* Message-ID: <972rpj$i7c$1@news.netmar.com>  M We have some RZ29 disks - some of whch have a reference number of VW and some3 are VA9 I think that maybe the VW are wide and the VA are narrow.- Can anyone confirm this-H I want to eliminate the narrow drives from wide busses to make them more4 efficient but I don't have the information to do it.  J A reference to a site that has all the description of disks - incluing old ones would be VERY useful    TIA    Mike    O  -----  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web  -----"M   http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groups I    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this or other posts L made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:50:00 GMT-= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)i4 Subject: Re: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives0 Message-ID: <009F8024.239FD502@SendSpamHere.ORG>  I In article <972rpj$i7c$1@news.netmar.com>, Mike@littlewoods.co.uk writes:iN >We have some RZ29 disks - some of whch have a reference number of VW and some >are VA3: >I think that maybe the VW are wide and the VA are narrow. >Can anyone confirm thisI >I want to eliminate the narrow drives from wide busses to make them more 5 >efficient but I don't have the information to do it.n   Yes!    K >A reference to a site that has all the description of disks - incluing old9 >ones would be VERY useful  H It would, wouldn't it?  You can thank Compaq for their wonderful effortsI to annihilate anything that *was* d|i|g|i|t|a|l.  There's been much crit-pJ icism here -- and I've made mine loud and clear -- about Compaq's removal I of older d|i|g|i|t|a|l information, etc. from web sites.  I agree that it J may be old information but it is still valuable; albeit, Compaq mgt. can't* seem to see the forest throught the trees.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMe            sO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:21:57 -05002/ From: "Webb, William W" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>W4 Subject: RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drivesK Message-ID: <D46FE9B132FB9B44AEC242A96E4AB750019259B0@rlghncst625.usps.gov>   J This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand< this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.  ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CD2.6E95A520e Content-Type: text/plain;n 	charset="iso-8859-1"T  / Your assumptions about -VA and -VW are correct.d   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET + > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 7:05 AM 8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET6 > Subject: RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives >  > - > In article <972rpj$i7c$1@news.netmar.com>, o  > Mike@littlewoods.co.uk writes:; > >We have some RZ29 disks - some of whch have a reference * > number of VW and somet	 > >are VAt< > >I think that maybe the VW are wide and the VA are narrow. > >Can anyone confirm this= > >I want to eliminate the narrow drives from wide busses to   > make them more7 > >efficient but I don't have the information to do it.r >  > Yes! > ? > >A reference to a site that has all the description of disks 0 > - incluing old > >ones would be VERY useful > 9 > It would, wouldn't it?  You can thank Compaq for their   > wonderful effortso< > to annihilate anything that *was* d|i|g|i|t|a|l.  There's  > been much crit-y; > icism here -- and I've made mine loud and clear -- about 1 > Compaq's removal> > of older d|i|g|i|t|a|l information, etc. from web sites.  I  > agree that itn; > may be old information but it is still valuable; albeit, a > Compaq mgt. can't , > seem to see the forest throught the trees. >  > --9 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     g > VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM > @ > city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are  > named after them.n >   ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CD2.6E95A520a Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1"6  1 <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">h <HTML> <HEAD>H <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">H <META NAME="Generator" CONTENT="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2653.12">: <TITLE>RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives</TITLE> </HEAD>  <BODY>  F <P><FONT SIZE=2>Your assumptions about -VA and -VW are correct.</FONT> </P>   <P><FONT SIZE=2>WWWebb</FONT>- </P>  6 <P><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT>M <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET </FONT>nF <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 7:05 AM</FONT>S <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET</FONT>nQ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Subject: RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives</FONT>N <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>  <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>aN <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; In article &lt;972rpj$i7c$1@news.netmar.com&gt;, </FONT>; <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Mike@littlewoods.co.uk writes:</FONT>lY <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;We have some RZ29 disks - some of whch have a reference </FONT> 2 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; number of VW and some</FONT>' <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;are VA</FONT>oZ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;I think that maybe the VW are wide and the VA are narrow.</FONT>8 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;Can anyone confirm this</FONT>[ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;I want to eliminate the narrow drives from wide busses to </FONT> + <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; make them more</FONT>RU <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;efficient but I don't have the information to do it.</FONT>. <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>:! <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Yes!</FONT>  <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>h] <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;A reference to a site that has all the description of disks </FONT> + <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; - incluing old</FONT>0: <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; &gt;ones would be VERY useful</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>eY <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; It would, wouldn't it?&nbsp; You can thank Compaq for their </FONT>M. <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; wonderful efforts</FONT>\ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; to annihilate anything that *was* d|i|g|i|t|a|l.&nbsp; There's </FONT>, <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; been much crit-</FONT>V <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; icism here -- and I've made mine loud and clear -- about </FONT>- <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Compaq's removal</FONT> ^ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; of older d|i|g|i|t|a|l information, etc. from web sites.&nbsp; I </FONT>* <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; agree that it</FONT>V <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; may be old information but it is still valuable; albeit, </FONT>. <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Compaq mgt. can't</FONT>G <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; seem to see the forest throught the trees.</FONT>  <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>u <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; --</FONT> h <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT>5 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM</FONT>O <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>e[ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are </FONT>a. <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; named after them.</FONT> <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>P </P>   </BODY>; </HTML>g) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CD2.6E95A520--&   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:19:27 -0600E* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>4 Subject: RE: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives- Message-ID: <0033000016865653000002L032*@MHS>B  4 =0AMy bookmarks suggest that you might try TheRef at    theref.aquascape.com/theref.html   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETB+ > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 6:24 AMq8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET2 > Subject: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives >> >N9 > We have some RZ29 disks - some of whch have a referencew > number of VW and someI > are VA; > I think that maybe the VW are wide and the VA are narrow.F > Can anyone confirm thisg; > I want to eliminate the narrow drives from wide busses toa > make them more6 > efficient but I don't have the information to do it. > ? > A reference to a site that has all the description of disks -- > incluing old > ones would be VERY useful1 >: > TIAM >  > Mike >r >r> >  -----  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News > via the Web  -----= >   http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous postinge > to 60,000+ groupss? >    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this orm
 > other postsL< > made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email > abuse@newsone.netS >=   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:33:04 -0500c% From: "Islandco" <sales@islandco.com> 4 Subject: Re: identifying wide and narrow SCSI drives/ Message-ID: <t9a81k1tq67b27@corp.supernews.com>i   Go to: www.islandco.comp  A Click on the disk and tape tab  - there is alink to a basic chart-   -- Island Computers US Corporationt 2700 Gregory Streeti	 Suite 150r Savannah GA 31404c Tel: 912 447 6622. Fax: 912 201 0096E sales@islandco.com www.islandco.com  C This message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and,J may be privileged and/or subject to the provisions of privacy legislation.H They are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whomE they are addressed. If the reader of this message is not the intended 
 recipient,G please notify Island Computers US Corp immediately and then delete thisa message.I You are notified that reliance on, disclosure of, distribution or copyingF of this message is prohibited.    ) <Mike@littlewoods.co.uk> wrote in messager$ news:972rpj$i7c$1@news.netmar.com...J > We have some RZ29 disks - some of whch have a reference number of VW and some > are VA; > I think that maybe the VW are wide and the VA are narrow.  > Can anyone confirm this-J > I want to eliminate the narrow drives from wide busses to make them more6 > efficient but I don't have the information to do it. > L > A reference to a site that has all the description of disks - incluing old > ones would be VERY usefuld >  > TIAs >  > Mike >t > F >  -----  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the	 eb  -----nH >   http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groupsK >    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this or other postse< > made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.netp   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:19:43 -0800A! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.comr% Subject: It's not just the marketing. D Message-ID: <OF53D843AD.85943A6F-ON882569FB.0064AE96@foundation.com>  B Has anyone else taken the time to read through the EV8 articles onH realworldtech? I have, I've spent some time thinking about it, and as anF advocate of entry-level VMS I'm a little disturbed. Go have a look at:  F      http://realworldtech.com/page.cfm?Section=Columns&Subject=Insider  G There's three articles, and they're all worth reading even if you don't>H follow all the fine detail. See if you agree with me.  It does look likeJ another impressive piece of work, don't get me wrong, but isn't that a bigJ step toward a pure high end server design? I see "IA64 beater" written allG over it, but I'm not seeing it working well in a desktop box. Am I just  being paranoid?a   Shane    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:40:10 +00104% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.auNY Subject: Re: localtime() different on Compaq Alpha DS10 OpenVMS 7.1-2 vs DEVVAX VMS 5.5-2 5 Message-ID: <01K0F7WN3SXE00A6OS@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>N  ) I too have to go through this Micro$shit.i  L I am sending at 19:36 .au time.  Look at the time you receive:  It will add 0 10hrs, but Greenwich time is 11 hours different.   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:01:06 +0100l1 From: Enrico Badella <enrico.badella@softstar.it> ( Subject: Re: Lots of Microfiche's found!+ Message-ID: <3A94C742.EB4AFA86@softstar.it>    Arthur Krewat wrote: >   K > Actually, if I have the STABAKIT for a '780 on 8" floppies, I should havetN > the tape for it around somewhere. I know for a fact that I did make a backupC > (/image) of a VMS 4.1 RM05 pack to 1/2" tape, I saw it yesterday.   J Does anybody have a STABAKIT of VMS 4.7? The one that came with my uVAX IIC was badly tailored (RSX stuff does not work) and the previous ownern. had used the installation TK50 for backups :-(   TIAF   e.  H ========================================================================H Enrico Badella                       email:   enrico.badella@softstar.itA Soft*Star srl                                 eb@vax.cnuce.cnr.it H InterNetworking Specialists          tel:     +39-011-746092            < Via Camburzano 9                     fax:     +39-011-746487 10143 Torino, Italyg  K   Wanted, for hobbyist use, any type of PDP and microVAX hardware,software,f4   manuals,schematics,etc. and DEC-10 docs or manualsJ ==========================================================================   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:26:03 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>( Subject: Re: Lots of Microfiche's found!- Message-ID: <8766i2vdck.fsf@prep.synonet.com>a  - "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org> writes:s   > "Richard D. Piccard" wrote:   C > > I am NOT a lawyer, and I hate to rain on people's parade, here,gA > > but I do believe that the VMS fiche is copyright, and that iteA > > would be a violation of the service agreement under which thel; > > fiche were supplied to make copies available to others.t  @ > I expect the same applies to *all* the fiche, not just the VMSB > source listings (although the VMS source listings are the ones I3 > would vote for as most-likely-to-get-a-reaction).y   > Having said that:g  B > (a) I have seen a number of otherwise apparently reliable peopleE > claim to have been given the right to publish copies of (variously) > > PDP-8 related material, 36-bit material, 12-bit material and& > possibly some others I've forgotten.  B > (b) The DFWCUG people are doing whatever they are doing with the > full knowledge of Compaq.n  B > So as long as *you* don't publish anything, you *might* be safe.  D In 1983 or there abouts, DEC published a general licence for copyingB of any HW docs thet where not available from them. To my knowlege,? this is still in force. It was a *copyright* licence BTW, not aoD general 'you can use our stuff' general release. This was in the DOC
 catalogue.   > And I forgot:   D > (c) Scanning source listings fiches is a waste of effort since (asD > previously reported here) VMS Engineering has most (if not all) ofD > this stuff available; so if permission to publish is ever granted,B > you may as well wait for their prisitne copy rather than a scan.  F To scan fiche, you will need of the order of 10K-30K DPI. IE, an astro plate scanner.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.l@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:05:59 +0100s5 From: Eckhard Wich <eckhard_wich@deutsche-boerse.com>A Subject: Re: LPS/DCPS Help3 Message-ID: <3A9500A7.E38E339B@deutsche-boerse.com>g  M Maybe the DECnet area router between area 41 and 7 has gone? LPS$CONSOLE useseK DECnet as transport, printing to your LPSs happens by TCP/IP. Althoupgh thedN printer is unreachable for the managment SW, it still is able to print - untilN the next reboot of the LPS requires a MOP download of LPS operating system ...     >n$ >   An NCP SHOW KNOWN LINKS gives me >sK >    Link       Node           PID     Process     Remote link  Remote userEB >   8337    7.19 (CBP019)    202915C6  LPS_CBP019            0  50B >   8194   41.657 (CBPL57)   2020047E  LPS_CBPL57         9216  50 >n >h   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 12:40:34 +00000" From: Nic P Clews <nclews@csc.com>> Subject: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI@ Message-ID: <OFEC049993.6A682633-ON802569FB.0045A1EA@eu.csc.com>   With regards overhead:-u  0 As I understand it, sending MC messages is a CPU0 intensive operation as it involves data movement" from one memory location to other.  . With other devices (e.g. network) they use DMA2 therefore letting the CPU get on with 'real' work!  / I like memory channel though, whoever wrote thep0 drivers must have lost sleep, friends or both. I admire it as an interconnect.-  1 What's so bad about DSSI versus CI? A little lesse1 than half the speed of CI but I'd assume point toe, point it should be better than a 10Mbit busy. Ether network? Cheaper than CI. I'm curious...  ( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comp   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:08:53 +0000-  From: steven.reece@quintiles.comB Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CIH Message-ID: <OFE71DA626.402EBC5D-ON802569FB.00471679@qedi.quintiles.com>  K According to the Guidelines for Cluster Configurations at v7.1, CI and DSSIMI are hardware assisted (which I guess means DMA) but FDDI, SCSI, MC and NIeA are not (albeit that SCSI does not handle SCS traffic of course).h  F CI has a maximum of 32 nodes whereas DSSI has a maximum of eight.  TheK specified maximum for MC is 4 but I'm not sure that this is still true.  CIbG has a guaranteed not to exceed throughput of 140Mb/s whereas DSSI has a H value of 32.  The book doesn't specify whether this is multiple links inC parallel or not, but I guess it probably is for CI, given that eachr. connection is two redundant links in parallel.  H If I wanted a data center with masses of shared disk and SCSI was not anA option then I'd be tempted to go for CI.  If I was talking a testaH environment or a cluster with moderate disk requirements I'd probably goI for DSSI.  The grey line is somewhere where you could use HSD controllersoG (like the HSD30s) with disk cabinets like the SW800 (can anyone say VAX  7850 with XMI and KFMSA?). Steve.  ( Nic Clews (nclews at csc dot com) wrote: >>>s1 What's so bad about DSSI versus CI? A little less 1 than half the speed of CI but I'd assume point to , point it should be better than a 10Mbit busy. Ether network? Cheaper than CI. I'm curious... <<<d   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:46:16 +00005" From: Nic P Clews <nclews@csc.com>B Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI@ Message-ID: <OF76CD4950.325B5846-ON802569FB.005124B8@eu.csc.com>   Steve Wrote:  I >If I wanted a data center with masses of shared disk and SCSI was not an B >option then I'd be tempted to go for CI.  If I was talking a testI >environment or a cluster with moderate disk requirements I'd probably go J >for DSSI.  The grey line is somewhere where you could use HSD controllersH >(like the HSD30s) with disk cabinets like the SW800 (can anyone say VAX >7850 with XMI and KFMSA?).c  C Fair points. However if we're using HSG for storage, the DSSI would E purely act as the system interconnect. With using CI, 'clustering' isoB asynchronous, so only 70Mb/s is useful*. We start to get more intoD the realms of hardware latency. I'd guess the CI is probably faster, but by how much?  ? I'm not questioning it, I just like the discussion around it...t  B When all is said and done, the cluster software will determine itsA preferred path using its measured timings, it won't care how mucho# I pontificate one way or the other!u  F (At home I've got a DEC 2000 axp with two DSSI and a network clusteredC with a 4705, and the cluster manual says the DSSI is not supported,mC but I don't need to use the network, and clustering works fine overt both the DSSI paths).   > * OK, yeah I know other things can happen in parallel, but I'mD thinking of challenge/response type events like distributed locking.   Regards, Nic   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:42:59 +0000m  From: steven.reece@quintiles.comB Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CIH Message-ID: <OF8762B48E.2006B5F0-ON802569FB.0055FCFB@qedi.quintiles.com>  K I should know the answer to this, but does the 4705 have an integrated DSSItK adapter or is it using a KFQSA?  I understand that the functionality wasn't H built into the KFQSA to support clustering (why, I don't know).  SHAC or EDA640 "options" do support it.N  D In Alpha-land, doesn't MC take precedence over anything else?  OtherI interconnect circuits will be configured but not actually used unless ther MC connection fails? Steve.    
 Nic wrote:E >>>When all is said and done, the cluster software will determine itsgA preferred path using its measured timings, it won't care how muchn# I pontificate one way or the other!E  F (At home I've got a DEC 2000 axp with two DSSI and a network clusteredC with a 4705, and the cluster manual says the DSSI is not supported,cC but I don't need to use the network, and clustering works fine overi both the DSSI paths).<<<   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:10:25 +0000a" From: Nic P Clews <nclews@csc.com>B Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI@ Message-ID: <OF54A06B1D.496AE066-ON802569FB.005E5856@eu.csc.com>   Steve Wrote:  G >I should know the answer to this, but does the 4705 have an integratedb DSSIE >adapter or is it using a KFQSA?  I understand that the functionality  wasn'tI >built into the KFQSA to support clustering (why, I don't know).  SHAC orB  >EDA640 "options" do support it.  F It's embedded, and two of. Option for a further two on a daugherboard!  2 The DEC 2000 has a KFESA and a KFESB (EISA cards).  E >In Alpha-land, doesn't MC take precedence over anything else?  Other J >interconnect circuits will be configured but not actually used unless the >MC connection fails?t  F All interconnects are 'probed' by the connection manager for potentialG circuits. It uses a preferred path, and can fail over to any other, but>$ the precedence you mention is right.  F Preferred path selection happens 'transparently'  but by definition itB has to compare the current preferred path with any other to make a
 selection.  H I'm looking in the V7.3 EFT2 documentation and there is no X in the DSSIG column for the DEC 2000. This may be that it was not _qualified_ by DEC|I or Compaq, not that it won't work.... It's not in the Systems and Options>3 books either [as a listed option] for the DEC 2000.u   Regards, Nic   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:54:08 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>sB Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CIH Message-ID: <y4n1bea9j3.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  $ Nic P Clews <nclews@csc.com> writes:  2 > As I understand it, sending MC messages is a CPU2 > intensive operation as it involves data movement$ > from one memory location to other.  H Well yes, as I think about it, to the sender it is probably similar to a5 buffered I/O operation. Is this still true for MC V2?&   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:57:29 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>rB Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CIH Message-ID: <y4k86ia9di.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  " steven.reece@quintiles.com writes:  M > According to the Guidelines for Cluster Configurations at v7.1, CI and DSSIWK > are hardware assisted (which I guess means DMA) but FDDI, SCSI, MC and NIeC > are not (albeit that SCSI does not handle SCS traffic of course).s   Multiple issues here.e  L CI and possibly DSSI don't need mapping registers because they walk the pageJ tables themselves. Of course, nothing stops you bulding a (say) NI or SCSIM adapter that does the same. With the larger Alpha pages, I think this is muchN less of an issue than before.   L The other is DMA vs PIO. I'm pretty sure any network adapter (NI, FDDI) doesM DMA on the data portion. The usual disk adapters are certainly expected to do L so. Heck, on the VAX you could even buy a terminal (RS 232) adapter that did DMA on demand!   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 13:19:11 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)aB Subject: Re: Memory Channel as a cluster interconnect, DSSI vs. CI3 Message-ID: <FnTvL89NKiEm@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  k In article <OFE71DA626.402EBC5D-ON802569FB.00471679@qedi.quintiles.com>, steven.reece@quintiles.com writes:n >  > M > According to the Guidelines for Cluster Configurations at v7.1, CI and DSSIoK > are hardware assisted (which I guess means DMA) but FDDI, SCSI, MC and NIpC > are not (albeit that SCSI does not handle SCS traffic of course).-  I More than DMA is involved.  CI adapters actually help with the protocols.a  N ==============================================================================N Great Inventors of our time: Al Gore -> Internet; Sun Microsystems -> ClustersN ==============================================================================   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:34:13 +0100e, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>4 Subject: Message for COMPAQ: http://forum.compaq.com& Message-ID: <3A94EB25.5BDC7990@gmx.ch>  > Noone here at COMPAQ Swiss knows how to submit an on-line SPR.  E There is a forum.compaq.com forum with protected access listed in theo+ COMPAQ customer support resources WEB page.r   What is this forum for?t How do I get an account?, Is it there that we can submit on-line SPRs?   Thanks,t D.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:36:11 GMT , From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> Subject: OBB questioni% Message-ID: <3A94F9C5.B5D4AE8@gmx.ch>s  F I have my OBB agent which died one second after being started with the# following message in the error log:o  8 %OBB-E-INV_CNTGETHOSTI, Cannot retrieve host identifier.  ? We have restarted the machine a few days later and it did starth9 normally. Does this error ring a bell to someone, please?i   Alphaserver 2100 OpenVMS 7.2-1   Thanks,. D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 02:03:08 -0500o2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and SupercomputingeL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2202010203080001@user-2iveaed.dialup.mindspring.com>  
 In articleJ <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284E37@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>, "Main,% Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> wrote:     N > Not sure what you mean here. Since the Edu program provides the base licenseI > for free, and the CSLG provides the unlimited user licenses + a pile of0( > LP's, is there something I am missing?  G Yes, since you asked.  You, and apparently most everyone at Compaq, has8 been missing it for months...>  J The new educational program has real problems on its own.  CSLG fixes someI of them, but it isn't free.  CSLG _is_ quite expensive for a small numbereJ of machines, since it must be purchased in chunks.  (10 unit minimum, last I checked.)c  H From a university point of view, Compaq is charging WAY too much for theJ media kits.  The price of the kits hasn't come down from the early days ofD CDs, when the duplication cost was actually significant.  In a word,J Compaq is gouging for the CDs.  A thousand bucks or so for 15 CDs?!?  Come on, stop insulting us!  B What's wrong with the educational program?  Of the top of my head:G 1.  The single user restriction.  Each user needs to request and obtain-H his own PAK, and then presumably pester a system manager to install it. I What a pain.  This pretty much means the individual licenses will only bepB used by someone with his own personal machine.  Duh!  That isn't aI situation where VMS shows its strengths at all, but it does show its lackiH of flashy "desktop eye candy".  This license doesn't offer anything that the hobbyist program lacks.t  E 2.  There seems to be a multi-user exception for CLASSROOM use only. -D That's fine, and it might have been popular several years ago beforeG Digital chased VMS out of the classrooms.  At the moment, I expect VERYe! few sites are using VMS this way.a  G 3.  Universities are involved in a lot of research, and the educationalrG program is utterly useless there.  Single-user (no classroom exception)eE makes administration a pain, and the license isn't even legal for anyMJ non-university collaborator to use.  I know of know research projects withJ outside funding that don't involve outside collaborators.  If the research? and computers happen to be located off campus, the email domain E restriction means that the PAKs can't even be delivered to the system=	 directly.=  ? 4. For administrative use (not my area at all), the single-useraI restriction looks almost as bad.  But this sort of activity might have an H actual budget, and hence buy into CSLG for some of the layered products.  G In summary, the educational program will provide a base VMS license for-G free, provided NO non-university people ever use the machine.  (This isoE more restrictive that the CSLG program.)  If the CSLG is added on (atEJ significant cost, even more including the media), the systems are actually useful.=  J A number of us complained about the program in the past.  A recent exampleD was the the VMS Diamond Forum in December.  Mr. Marcello heard in noH uncertain terms that the program is no good in practice.  He promised toE get it fixed.  Nothing has changed.  I begin to suspect he forgot, orw
 doesn't care.   F It may be a case of in-house lawyers misinterpreting the intent of theI Compaq honchos.  Perhaps Compaq expects people to take liberties with theoB letter of the license.  That would not be normal for Compaq, in my experience.   F Have you any suggestions about how to get the program fixed?  Have you* heard anything about pending improvements?   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.coml   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:44:24 +0000 / From: Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>r' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputingn7 Message-ID: <009F804D.44309515.16@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>a  K > > >> The other point is that for most people (perhaps 98% of the computer M > > >> market, by dollars spent) the reliability/performance requirements foreI > > >> "supercomputing" are very close to their needs, ie, 99% up time isiR > > >> adequate.  And speed counts as much or more than reliablity.  VMS gives youN > > >> 100-99.99999% reliability (depending on how much you want to spend) butI > > >> ironically, it cannot be dropped down to 99% in exchange for speed 3 > > >> equivalent to these other operating systems.t > > > D > > >Because people are not interested in saving money. See my other+ > > >post to this thread 20-Feb-2001 23:26.y > > M > > No, no, no.  SUPERCOMPUTING .ne. BUSINESS COMPUTING.  It isn't like ebay.iN > > It's "crunch this quantum mechanics calculation for 3 weeks, checkpointingN > > every hour".  The most they're out in a failure is 1 hour of work, and itsN > > not easy to assign a value to it, but it certainly isn't the "we're losing: > > millions of dollars per minute/down" sort of category. > B > But downtime should matter because wasting time of scientists is= > wasting time of society. We may get to that point where the ; > governemental institutions will be acting like industrial B > companies. The first big event I observed which leads me to that= > conclusion was Greg (?) Venter's 'Celera' outperforming theE' > community of universities world wide.E >    Talk about misconceptions!  J A scientist's time is not significantly wasted if his hourly-checkpointingF three-week number-cruncher goes down. If it happens often enough he'llL have arranged things so that it restarts (from the last complete checkpoint)D automatically on reboot. If not he'll do something like @restart or $ ./restart to kick it back into life.  G Neither is he waiting around for the three-week run to finish. He'll be G parallel-processing, working on something else, while the computers get  on with the crunching. C  
 SET FLAME /ON6  N What DOES waste scientists time is bureaucrats and penny-pinching politicians.O Instead of doing science, we spend an ever-increasing amount of time submittingiH grant applications that are alpha-rated and still not funded, generating@ mountains of quality-assessment paperwork and suchlike, going toC meetings at which organisational structures and five-year plans aretE laboriously thrashed out for the benefit of Dilbertesque PHMs who pay.J themselves five or more times what we get, and numerous other insanities.   J If university scientists were like the average 9-5 employee, we'd probablyG have reached the point where no useful work whatsoever got done. But by L and large, scientists are highly motivated by science, and the science stillG gets done ... in the evenings, week-ends, and not-taken holiday leave. CB So the PHMs shovel still more manure onto us. And eventually, theyH decide that the game is no longer worth playing. One of my colleagues isK leaving next month, and thereafter will be teaching courses and doing post-RH sales for a software company. He gets a considerable boost in salary andD more time to spend with his kid, and fifteen years of  accumulated  # research skill is lost to science. r   SET FLAME /OFF   	Yours, 
 		Nigel Arnots- 		NRA@MAXWELL.PH.KCL.AC.UK                      7 		"In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded."r   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:57:21 +0000u/ From: Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>u' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and SupercomputingC7 Message-ID: <009F804F.13C249D5.30@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>w   > C > I know the topic is about SuperComputing and realize that you aremH > excluding paging; and you are right that you do need some basic sysgenC > & authorize tuning to set up VMS correctly for large memory work;wC > that said it seems to me that the idea of large memory jobs on a p; > multiuser machine should be a big selling point for VMS; s > C > I alway wonder why VMS paging capabilty is not pushed more; is it B > no longer a real issue or is it no longer considered or is everyA > machine out there now for 1 and only 1 user regardless of othern< > scale and administration factors; ??? any insights anyone; > H I think that the speed disparity between processor and electromechanicalF storage has widened, so that paging is less useful than it used to be.J It's still good for getting chunks of rarely used code and data that won'tG be used for the next few minutes out of RAM. However, since the 11/780, G CPU speed has increased maybe 1000-fold, Disk speed maybe 20-fold. AlsomI the price per Mbyte of RAM has been falling with respect to that of disk..< These developments make paging less useful than it once was.  G HOWEVER ... the wheel may well be about to come around again. There areoJ several non-rotating storage technologies in development, which will offerI sub-millisecond access times and data capacities that will dwarf anything.G that rotating disks can offer. If these come to fruition, I think they tA will be a perfect match to VMS's paging algorithms on GHz Alphas.7  ? http://www.c-3d.net/articles/feb4.htm if you want to know more.S   	Yours,g
 		Nigel Arnotl- 		NRA@MAXWELL.PH.KCL.AC.UK                      7 		"In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded."    ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 16:15:27 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing , Message-ID: <973duv$eeq@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  O In article <G94sGD.7yL@news.boeing.com>, nickerson@mirage.boeing.com () writes:u > . >In article <96u8sh$igd@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, 5 >mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:a >wE >|>There are several technical reasons why VMS is out of this market:a
 >...<snip>... F >|>4. It's easier to run big piggy jobs on Unix than VMS. On most UnixJ >|>   machines one process can hog all the resources and nothing complainsM >|>   (until the machine starts paging, etc.)  On VMS you have to much around H >|>   with a whole bunch of parameters in order to allow these sorts of / >|>   jobs to run without EXQUOTA popping up.  v >rB >I know the topic is about SuperComputing and realize that you areG >excluding paging; and you are right that you do need some basic sysgenqB >& authorize tuning to set up VMS correctly for large memory work;B >that said it seems to me that the idea of large memory jobs on a : >multiuser machine should be a big selling point for VMS;   E In many forms of supercomputing jobs are loaded sequentially, one jobd> to each node or CPU.  The total throughput is better that way.   >hB >I alway wonder why VMS paging capabilty is not pushed more; is itA >no longer a real issue or is it no longer considered or is everyt@ >machine out there now for 1 and only 1 user regardless of other; >scale and administration factors; ??? any insights anyone;   I It's not that much of an issue.  Memory is now cheap enough that you justEI pack each node up with at least 500 Mb and no paging to disk ever occurs.tI If it does, you split the problem into smaller pieces so that it doesn't.wL Moreover, you generally try to run one job at a time, at 99.9% of CPU usage,D so that they don't fight each other for memory.  (Unless you've got J gigabytes of memory on an SMP machine, then you can run multiple jobs and  still not page.)   >s >|>but the main reason is that:2 >|>.F >|>5. The vendor doesn't care to keep the product competitive in termsC >|>   of price, performance, or marketing.  Compaq wants you to usenD >|>   Tru64 for this, and they are forcing you to do so by cripplingG >|>   VMS.  (I consider it crippling if insufficient funds are investedoC >|>   to keep the product competitive as the competition improves.)t > E >don't know about CPQ investments in technology, but the VMS vs Tru64rA >price differential is my personal gripe; as I web price machiness@ >there seems to be a $ 700-1700 differential between the 2 base @ >licenses; when you start counting #users, TCP/IP client/server,, >and other such things it gets really crazy;  H Compaq management wants you to buy Tru64 instead of VMS.  If you insist,K they'll do a CA on you and make you pay through the nose for the privilege.s   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.educ? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech  J **************************************************************************J *                                RIP VMS                                 *J **************************************************************************   ------------------------------   Date: 22 FEB 2001 14:51:21 GMT4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher)' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputingh6 Message-ID: <22FEB01.14512105@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>  C In a previous article, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> wrote:b  N ->Not sure what you mean here. Since the Edu program provides the base licenseI ->for free, and the CSLG provides the unlimited user licenses + a pile ofs( ->LP's, is there something I am missing?  K True. However, I wouldn't dare order a system without a VMS base license at L this university. I need to be ready when the CSLG/ESL programs are killed byD the university. A secondary reason to have a base license is it addsB significantly to 3rd party resale value when it's time to upgrade.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 00:02:57 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing-- Message-ID: <878zmywvri.fsf@prep.synonet.com>:  & nickerson@mirage.boeing.com () writes:  / > In article <96u8sh$igd@gap.cco.caltech.edu>, d6 > mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes: > F > |>There are several technical reasons why VMS is out of this market:
 > ..<snip>...eG > |>4. It's easier to run big piggy jobs on Unix than VMS. On most UnixsK > |>   machines one process can hog all the resources and nothing complains N > |>   (until the machine starts paging, etc.)  On VMS you have to much aroundI > |>   with a whole bunch of parameters in order to allow these sorts of I0 > |>   jobs to run without EXQUOTA popping up.   > C > I know the topic is about SuperComputing and realize that you arecH > excluding paging; and you are right that you do need some basic sysgenC > & authorize tuning to set up VMS correctly for large memory work;-C > that said it seems to me that the idea of large memory jobs on a o; > multiuser machine should be a big selling point for VMS; a > C > I alway wonder why VMS paging capabilty is not pushed more; is itmB > no longer a real issue or is it no longer considered or is everyA > machine out there now for 1 and only 1 user regardless of other < > scale and administration factors; ??? any insights anyone;  @ Do you want me to post the DU/VMS FFT paging performance numbers again?   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.t@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 23:59:04 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing=- Message-ID: <87d7cawvxz.fsf@prep.synonet.com>a  - "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes:r   > David, > F > >>> It's much cheaper to go with Linux on Alpha than either Tru64 or
 > OpenVMS.J > The base license adds thousands to the cost of the machines and the ESL/G > CSLG costs more than any competing program, each year, and yet offerssL > nothing more than they do.  And that yearly outlay really makes it hard to0 > justify leaving marginal machines running. <<<  N > Not sure what you mean here. Since the Edu program provides the base licenseI > for free, and the CSLG provides the unlimited user licenses + a pile ofr( > LP's, is there something I am missing?  D OK, Kerry. You have seen the coments on the edu licence, and that isB NO use as is from training people on VMS. And if that is not done,? then you WILL here, too late, more and more " We can't find VMS.& people, so we got Windoze..." Promise.  B CSLG is out of most uni's $$$. The satan of the north is stitchingE them up with campus licence deals. And that covers generally, all the @ on site machines. Plus free home licences for staff, and in some deals, students as well.  @ Care to give a comparitive cost for 20 labs of 20 machines each?D That's purchase cost, or give annual yearly fee over a 3 year lease.A Include CSLG, or show how it is clearly OK under the edu licence.4  B Because if you can't do that, then they HAVE go suck gatespiel. SoF guess what all their graduates are trained in, and is the only type of0 computer most of the teaching *staff* have seen.  C And from that, flows the software that run on SCs and that gets yougC on the evening news in the latest-greatest yada-yada break through.r  D David is bitching about VMS, and how it is *technically* behind by aD large margin. His posts are *as they apear here* flawed and outrightC wrong. But, if you look at the existing code base he has to use allmD day every day, then what he says makes lots of sense. And he has gotA jusjst plain fed-up and exhausted with fighting a lone fight, andn? feeling he is fighting Compaq and their 'vision' of the future.   E If there is not a complete turn around by Compaq, VMS will be extinctaA outside of a few pentagon systems in 10 years. Forget the financeuC sector, there know from long experience how to turn blue and put ups with the know and eternal pain.a    E BTW, can you ask your RTR manager is he knows what COBOL is, and whatdE it is used for? And if he knows what 'common calling standard' means?t   -- g< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.s@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 00:05:41 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputingf- Message-ID: <874rxmwvmy.fsf@prep.synonet.com>i  & nickerson@mirage.boeing.com () writes:  F > don't know about CPQ investments in technology, but the VMS vs Tru64B > price differential is my personal gripe; as I web price machinesA > there seems to be a $ 700-1700 differential between the 2 base yA > licenses; when you start counting #users, TCP/IP client/server,i- > and other such things it gets really crazy;a  ? It is even worse than that Bart. Even if the list numbers wheree= identical, for every copy of T64, a cut goes to OSF. For VMS,cJ the Q keeps all of your money. ( OK, modulo deals like display PS was... )1 SO thay are encoraging you to screw their margin!K   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.i@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 00:10:09 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputinge- Message-ID: <87zofevgv2.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   4 rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:  J > From a university point of view, Compaq is charging WAY too much for theL > media kits.  The price of the kits hasn't come down from the early days ofF > CDs, when the duplication cost was actually significant.  In a word,L > Compaq is gouging for the CDs.  A thousand bucks or so for 15 CDs?!?  Come > on, stop insulting us!  F In 1985, the only place you could master a CDd was Eindhoven. On a 780E running VMS BTW. There was the Polygram plant in Hannover and I thinkP 1 other.  F That year, PG proudly anounced that they had got the cost of producingE a CDd, with insert, artwork, and jewel case to under $2US in 10K lotss* or more. Mastering not included here note.  H I have heard it is now about 20-40c now, but have not seen hard numbers.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.o@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 00:19:52 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputingn- Message-ID: <87vgq2vgev.fsf@prep.synonet.com>r  + Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes:i  @ > As pointed out by others in this NG the campus licence program? > should adapted to the needs of universities. Do they pay fullhB > price licences for Tru64? Are licence costs an issue? Does Linux1 > take advantage because there is no licence fee?v  A No, it is because you can drop a complete SYSTEM on the bench for F between $0 and $1000AU ( ~ 530US ) That's throwouts from staff officesD or postgrads at the low end, to new machines at the top. BSD in someA flavour is prefered to Linux. Thank you Ken Olsen for THAT one...u  C Compaq did not create these problems. But thats just tough! BecausehA they are the one who HAVE to fix them, or near all the work being E done in ZK and LT today will never see the light of day as it should.    -- l< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:35:31 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>h' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and SupercomputingeH Message-ID: <y4snl6aae4.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  4 mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:  L > I've been told by people who should know that there was a command decisionL > within Compaq NOT to put these compiler optimizations into VMS.  Or in anyM > case, not to do it unless it somehow fell out of work keeping the compilersl > in synch.   N AFAIK the _compiler_ optimizations are the same, but the Unix linker does someM post-processing (some of it feedback-driven), and the page fault handler doesnH page colouring, which VMS does not. In particular the latter is, IMNSHO,C something which is a must-have for VMS, because it makes run-to-run 3 performance of every program much more predictable.l  > > Consed, for instance, which is a graphical tool used in the C > assembly process is notoriously nonportable and is normally only nM > distributed as binaries.  At one point I asked for the source code but was aI > told that the program is hard to port even between Unices, so I didn't m > pursue it.  M Which would make me doubt the validity of its results. Not that this is a neweN thing in science and engineering, but I still consider it very unprofessional.   Jano   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 12:47:57 -0500c2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)' Subject: Re: OpenVMS and SupercomputingvL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2202011247570001@user-2ive6j4.dialup.mindspring.com>  H In article <y4snl6aae4.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>,H Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> wrote:    P > AFAIK the _compiler_ optimizations are the same, but the Unix linker does someO > post-processing (some of it feedback-driven), and the page fault handler does J > page colouring, which VMS does not. In particular the latter is, IMNSHO,E > something which is a must-have for VMS, because it makes run-to-runw5 > performance of every program much more predictable.a  G Have you looked at the system parameter PFN_COLOR_COUNT?  (Heck I don'tkI remember, it might have been you who pointed it out to me.)  It's rumored.E that that enables a page coloring algorithm in VMS, but I've found nou details.  F (I'm going from memory; I hope I got the name of the parameter right.)   -- e Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:59:53 +0100a/ From: Marc Van den Eynden <system@dnet.atea.be>e) Subject: Re: OpenVMS-releases - timetable , Message-ID: <3A94D509.777D4EC5@dnet.atea.be>   Thanks Peter a.o.   ; Now that it's clear that I'm looking for a (rather) big boxdH (same size,color as the 7.2 ?) I think it I'll just have to let this oneD go by and wait for 7.3 to come along (really can't find the d* box).  C Maybe I should just go ahead to 7.2 + latest patches, or is this toe risky ?  (this is for a DPW-500au)tG Is 7.2 stable ? (or are there just a few minor issues or maybe even bigh	 DON'Ts ?)e  @ I think it's time to have a look at the release-notes from 7.2-1   TIA, Marc.v   Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote: > ` > In article <3A938528.5EEBFBEA@dnet.atea.be>, Marc Van den Eynden <system@dnet.atea.be> writes:M > >As for separate kits, the only kits I can find are OpenVMS v.7.2 and back. Q > >So what's the story on 7.2-1 ? Did I miss something ? Was 7.2-1 a complete boxaP > >with manuals (easy to spot and find, should have found it by now) , or just a9 > >lonely CD and a leaflet (could easily be "misplaced").s > >Or did I miss a shipment ?t > > > Seems so. V7.2-1 was indeed a separate box/kit with manuals. > I > There was TCPIP V5.0-10 (aka V5.0A) on the V7.2-1 CDs instead of V5.0-9wH > on the V7.2 kit. But the recommended TCPIP V5.0-11 (also V5.0A !!) wasB > only on the VMS Alpha Condist CDs. In case you missed that, too. >  > --> > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651= > Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888x> > <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netJ > A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 10:53:26 GMT) From: Mike Price@nospam.littlewoods.co.ukd) Subject: Re: OpenVMS-releases - timetable * Message-ID: <972r36$hfm$1@news.netmar.com>  A In article <3A925AB0.27EBD7D5@dnet.atea.be>, Marc Van den Eynden 4 <system@dnet.atea.be> writes:j; >Could someone point me to a timetable of OpenVMS releases.s >n? >(Actually looking for an approx. date for OpenVMS v7.2-1 (axp)cB >so I don't have to wade through tons of ConDist CD's to find this	 >version)b >h >TIA >e >Marc Van den Eynden >e9 ># Above message 100% recyclable, if *you* do not print #  errr  L in the UK 7.2-1 is still current - as far as I know 7.3 has gone back to 2nd? quarter and we havn't got it yet - so it is on the latest disks&  L Maybe you are different but 7.2-1 should be latest or latest -1 set of disks  J dates for software release are on a VMS site with the word rollout in it -1 sorry can't find the actual address at the moment    Mike  O  -----  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web  -----hM   http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groups I    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this or other postseL made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:34:26 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>" Subject: Re: OT: Sun's 'Full Moon'- Message-ID: <871ysqvcyl.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   - young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:b  g > In article <OF99260C80.A870A03B-ON802569FA.0040D58F@eu.csc.com>, Nic P Clews <nclews@csc.com> writes:%  < > > I'm making some preparations for a DECUS seminar I'll be2 > > presenting at in the UK next week on Clusters.  E > > While updating myself with the current Sun offerings, Sun Clusterb# > > 3 is also known as "Full Moon".|  D > > I have no idea why they picked this codename for the technology,D > > apart from the obvious astronomical relationship between the SunE > > and the Moon, but I will have to try very hard to keep a straight   > > face while talking about it!  ? > 	It is called "Full Moon" because it will cause a WolfPack tot > 	howl at it.  WolfPack:p  C > http://www.microsoft.com/ntserver/support/faqs/Clustering_faq.aspV >  > 	What is "Wolfpack"? t= > 	"Wolfpack" was the code name for Microsoft Cluster Server.s  B Perhaps it was expecting the Kiwi's reaction to APAC MK I?  Is the' endearmant 'mooning' in the US lexicon?s   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.,@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 08:14:38 -0500- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)*< Subject: Re: Possible security hole in VMS Phone (was: Mail)3 Message-ID: <P4DKzuEg0ywN@eisner.encompasserve.org>   b In article <t9827gcoclih97@corp.supernews.com>, Timothy Stark <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org> writes:7 > Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.encompasserve.org> wrote: 3 >>> I found something interesting in VMS Mail, whenc1 >>> I experimented with some VT escape sequences.F  1 I did not write that!n  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationp= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil Group E                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replyingi   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:52:34 -0000l# From: "John Smith" <js@hotmail.com>o) Subject: Re: Possible security hole in...l> Message-ID: <ck6l6.41777$Dd3.698017@monolith.news.easynet.net>  6 "Christof Brass" <brass@infopuls.com> wrote in message& news:3A943D5D.34697818@infopuls.com...   <snip>  ( > > > Two main problems with your logic. > > >aF > > > 1.Not talking about the problems in public *is* an advantage andC > > > adds up to beeing safer because less people know how to breaki > > > security.) > > >:D > > > The problem with UNIX is that in academia a lot of people haveD > > > time to play around read the otherwise unreadable UNIX sourcesD > > > and find one of the many so far undiscovered bugs. They regardF > > > this as a game and tell other colleagues about that and they tryB > > > to use this knowlegde just for fun. Sometimes this knowlegdeF > > > escapes to really nasty people. But - and this is very differentF > > > to VMS besides that the sources aren't that easily available and > >o4 > >     Blackhats have had the VMS sources for years > $ > Proof? Connect me to one of those!    C     from http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lab/7378/hacker.htmh  K     "1988.12.16  Mitnick cracks MCI DEC network, steals VMS source code andt XSafe"  A     from http://www.netsys.com/firewalls/firewalls-9601/0298.html   J     "When Kevin and Lenny attacked DEC and were done with the initial mess inJ     1988 (after successfully stealing the source code for version 5 of VMS from@     DEC *across the net* before it shipped), Robert Clyde (Axent
 Technologies)oI     and I invented a conference session called History of Recent ComputercF     Break-ins in the DECUS (DEC user group) Symposium context. In thatA     presentation, we featured (as one case study) the DEC case. "     8     It was fairly big news at the time.  That's just one?     concrete example - I promise you more current copies of the I     source will be floating round right now.  If source code is outlawed,a'     only outlaws will have source code.    > E > > > not read just for fun - this particular problem may affect only>C > > > a certain subset of the UNIX' or - even worse - it may affectsA > > > other UNIX' as well but the fix is different. Because theresF > > > isn't one UNIX. There is no mechanism like an ECO for all UNIX'.F > > > There are patches which have to be created for every single UNIXD > > > out there. And BTW a lot of UNIX' security holes is not in itsF > > > kernel but in its lousy programs like sendmail and the typical C! > > > code with buffer overflows.t > > >o > >uC > >     What makes you think VMS isn't vulnerable to the same classe) > >     of problems ?  Watch the skies :)  >e< > VMS isn't that entangled with C as UNIX. VMS uses a lot ofB > different programs. Using such a problem to get control over the9 > VMS host needs a different technique and offers smallerd7 > opportunities to do damage with the normal VMS systemf > configuration.  >     I have quite a few security holes of this nature that I've@     ferreted out in the last few years (in my work as a security consultant);I     I've decided to run these past Compaq (common courtesy) and give them  thesJ     chance to write some patches before I publically disclose them.  Since+     the rule for this newsgroup seems to bet  9     *** DO NOT POST SECURITY HOLES OR SYSTEM CRASHERS ***h  L     then once again, out of courtesy I won't bother to post them here.  Yes, thisL     means that everyone else will know about the holes in your OS before you do.h        Rah rah for nondisclosure :)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:31:08 -0500p- From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> ) Subject: Re: Possible security hole in...o4 Message-ID: <Ehal6.133289$Z2.1771148@nnrp1.uunet.ca>  6 "Christof Brass" <brass@infopuls.com> wrote in message& news:3A943D5D.34697818@infopuls.com... >...4 > >     Blackhats have had the VMS sources for years >*$ > Proof? Connect me to one of those!  B There is one particular person who posts from time to time in thisF group who also posts in ALT.2600 groups looking for PC hacks. From his< posts in this group we know that he has VMS source on fiche.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:36:10 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)) Subject: Re: Possible security hole in...t* Message-ID: <3a954e0a$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  d In article <Ehal6.133289$Z2.1771148@nnrp1.uunet.ca>, "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:7 >"Christof Brass" <brass@infopuls.com> wrote in message,' >news:3A943D5D.34697818@infopuls.com...w >>...'5 >> >     Blackhats have had the VMS sources for yearsi >>% >> Proof? Connect me to one of those!d > C >There is one particular person who posts from time to time in this G >group who also posts in ALT.2600 groups looking for PC hacks. From his-= >posts in this group we know that he has VMS source on fiche.    RUsure ?  I It was very common in earlier days, to get VMS listings (not source - andRG not totally complete) on fiche for free (enclosed in support contract).c@ I had umpteen hundreds of them in the VMS V3 and V4 timeframe...   -- i< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 < <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 12:48:21 -0600E* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>) Subject: RE: Possible security hole in...r- Message-ID: <0033000016901196000002L062*@MHS>d  2 =0AUh, those are source LISTINGS, not source CODE.6 Listings won't recompile to create the OS- furthermore: they aren't complete- license and certain security related& stuff isn't there (among other things)  / Anyone willing to shell out the $ can get them.W   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET-, > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 10:34 AM8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET+ > Subject: RE: Possible security hole in...f >v >s8 > "Christof Brass" <brass@infopuls.com> wrote in message( > news:3A943D5D.34697818@infopuls.com... > >...6 > > >     Blackhats have had the VMS sources for years > > & > > Proof? Connect me to one of those! >mD > There is one particular person who posts from time to time in thisH > group who also posts in ALT.2600 groups looking for PC hacks. From hi= so> > posts in this group we know that he has VMS source on fiche. >=   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:00:46 -0500e- From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca>P) Subject: Re: Possible security hole in...d4 Message-ID: <Ytcl6.133319$Z2.1771572@nnrp1.uunet.ca>  7 "Peter LANGSTOEGER" <eplan@kapsch.net> wrote in message $ news:3a954e0a$1@news.kapsch.co.at...E > In article <Ehal6.133289$Z2.1771148@nnrp1.uunet.ca>, "Peter Weaver"   <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:9 > >"Christof Brass" <brass@infopuls.com> wrote in message-) > >news:3A943D5D.34697818@infopuls.com...  > >>... 7 > >> >     Blackhats have had the VMS sources for yearsa > >>' > >> Proof? Connect me to one of those!  > >-E > >There is one particular person who posts from time to time in thislE > >group who also posts in ALT.2600 groups looking for PC hacks. Fromt his ? > >posts in this group we know that he has VMS source on fiche.< >s
 > RUsure ? > > > It was very common in earlier days, to get VMS listings (not source - and> > not totally complete) on fiche for free (enclosed in support
 contract).B > I had umpteen hundreds of them in the VMS V3 and V4 timeframe... >a   I stand corrected.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:57:07 +0000e+ From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org>T) Subject: Re: Possible security hole in...g' Message-ID: <3A9552F3.E6F826AC@iee.org>h   Peter Weaver wrote:vD > There is one particular person who posts from time to time in thisH > group who also posts in ALT.2600 groups looking for PC hacks. From his> > posts in this group we know that he has VMS source on fiche.  7 If he has it on fiche, it's pretty old to say the leasth3 since it has not shipped on fiche for eight or more 
 years now.   Antonio    -- )   --------------- - Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.org    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:52:45 +0100t- From: Jouk Jansen <joukj@hrem.stm.tudelft.nl>-! Subject: Problem with Mozilla 0.8+3 Message-ID: <3A94EF7D.435E51F1@hrem.stm.tudelft.nl>a   Hi All,i  @ After installing Mozilla0.8 I cannot run it anymore. I get on my VMS7.2-1/TCPIP5.0A box:n  , *spawn-wals-jj) @SYS$COMMON:[MOZILLA]MOZILLA Starting mozilla-bin...d: CSSLoader::LoadAgentSheet - failed to get converter stream: CSSLoader::LoadAgentSheet - failed to get converter stream. Registering plugin 0 for: "*","All types",".*". Registering plugin 0 for: "*","All types",".*": CSSLoader::LoadAgentSheet - failed to get converter stream: CSSLoader::LoadAgentSheet - failed to get converter stream: CSSLoader::LoadAgentSheet - failed to get converter stream: CSSLoader::LoadAgentSheet - failed to get converter stream etc....t  ? It starts consuming memory and creates hundreds of *.xul files.a              What can be wrong?????          Joukc   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 03:46:13 -0500 ! From: Beyonder <beyonder@vrx.net> 4 Subject: Re: problem with my alpha - tcpip need help8 Message-ID: <ul699toohjgb38rqosqjib1kmsdj2soogq@4ax.com>  C On 19 Feb 2001 15:26:09 +0100, eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)p wrote:  ) >I bet, he has to configure it (again)...   ; I've been through the config several times without trouble.a1 I can telnet to the machine, but not ftp or mail. > FTP just doesn't work. like the port isn't active, even though tcp_config says it is.  E again, this all comes back to how it was done, deleting the DAT files % and that doesn't clean up everything.S   B.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 04:28:39 -0500p- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>m4 Subject: Re: problem with my alpha - tcpip need help, Message-ID: <3A94DBC5.D4F7A6E3@videotron.ca>   Beyonder wrote: = > I've been through the config several times without trouble.U3 > I can telnet to the machine, but not ftp or mail.e   try:   $TCPIP TCPIP> SHOW SERVICES  L It should show among others, FTP on port 21, protocol TCP, process TCPIP$FTP and a state of "Enabled"  A you can also SHOW SERVICE FTP/FULL for more complete information.e  L If the service is fully defined but not yet activated, ("Disabled"), you can   ENABLE SERVICE FTP    N I beleive that the TCPIP$CONFIG expects that you will shutdown the TCPIP stack6 and restart it for soke of the changes to take effect.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:03:35 -0500m0 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty.NOSPAM@sas.com>% Subject: Re: Problems starting Apache-2 Message-ID: <zBmVOmJJoBNsBfbewHwpQt1=yh81@4ax.com>  A     I have Apache running with Multinet V4.2A and OpenVMS V7.2-1.jA Here are the VMS and Multinet patches I currently have installed,E plus the date I installed them:a  2  VMS721_ACRTL-V0200                     01/20/20010  VMS721_BACKUP-V0100                  02/17/20011  VMS721_DRIVER-V0100                   02/17/2001a6  VMS721_F11X-V0200                          10/21/2000-  VMS721_FIBRE_SCSI-V0200           02/17/2001t8  VMS721_IPC-V0100                             10/21/2000.  VMS721_MOUNT96-V0200               02/17/20016  VMS721_PCSI-V0100                          10/21/2000-  VMS721_PTHREAD-V0200              02/17/2001m5  VMS721_RMS-V0100                          01/20/2001 6  VMS721_SYS-V0800                           01/20/20010  VMS721_SYSLOA-V0100                  02/17/2001/  VMS721_UPDATE-V0100                 10/21/2000n  F  FTP-031                                                   01/15/2000 9  INETDRIVER-020                                01/15/2000o2  KERNEL-UPDATE-041                      01/30/2001?  LPDSMB-011                                          01/15/2000O0  MASTER_SERVER-120                    10/21/2000'  MULTINET_VMS_SHARABLE-011  01/15/2000 l>  NTYSMB-012                                         01/15/2000C  SMTP-031                                                01/15/2000-6  STREAMSYMB-011                             01/15/20004  UCXDRIVER-020_A043                       01/30/2001-  UCX_LIBRARY_EMULATION-020_A043    01/30/20011  : Note: All Multinet patches have the extension _A042 unless otherwise specified.  9 I had Apache running successfully prior to installing theV7 patches on 02/17/2001.  The UCXDRIVER and KERNEL-UPDATEeE patches and required; I have not put on the latest version of either G< of these, but the version I'm running seems to work fine.  I/ think you need the C run-time patch for Apache.$   Good luck! a  5 On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 09:31:19 -0500, "Gaitan D'Antoni"r" <gaitan.dantoni@compaq.com> wrote:  I ><j.t.horn@usa.net> wrote in message news:96s82v$ocq$1@news.netmar.com...  >>G >> When I try to start Apache, in the APACHE$SERVER.LOG file ends with:o2 >> Unable to gethostname: function not implemented >> >>: >> Using Java 118 (tried also Java 1.2.2 with the logical)# >> Multinet 4.2A (with all patches)  >> OpenVMS 7.2-1 > M >As far as we know, Apache should work with Multinet 4.2A. I suggest that youuL >contact the Process Software Support Center support@process.com and ask for: >any updates required to run the Compaq Secure Web Server. >s >  >Gaitan D'Antoni/ >Apache Web Server for OpenVMS Technical LeaderiD >http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/apache/csws.html >Compaq Computer Corporation >r >( >n   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:19:59 +0100n, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>/ Subject: Proposed modif for PCSI Dev guide p7.3I& Message-ID: <3A94D9BF.A7C2B620@gmx.ch>  ? (btw, I still don't know how to submit an SPR on-line, if it is-F possible, of course. I called COMPAQ support for another issue here in# Switzerland, and I got this answer:    >Hello Didier,B >thank you for your MAIL. I can't give this problem to Engineering; >because we don't have a general problem with kitinstal.come (???)6 >0 >If we have to work longer on this problem, is it BILLABLE. It means > your Company has to pay for more support. (Programming Support is not% >included in a Maintenance Contract).e  C Actually, the question was on the way VMSINSTAL.COM handles certainnF version numbers, and I am not sure COMPAQ CH understood my question.../ but it has been submitted via a different way).l  / Anyway, here is more a suggestion than an SPR. i  H --[note starts here]----------------------------------------------------H (in this text the Polycenter Software Installation Utility will be named PCSI)n  F The discussion is on the PCSI ACCOUNT verb documentation (page 7.3 andE 7.4 of the Polycenter Software Installation Utility Developers Guide, ) AA-Q28MC-TK january 1999, OpenVMS 7.2-1).h   Subject descriptionf ------------------- < As of today, PCSI uses for account creation a DCL procedure:: sys$update:pcsi$create_account.com, which calls AUTHORIZE.  H The AUTHORIZE utility doesn't allow many qualifiers on one line, this isC why (I suppose) the VMSINSTAL.COM procedure does UAF creation, then  modifications.  D I also think that this is why the PCSI ACCOUNT verb has a minimum of9 four parameters, as stated page 7.3 of the documentation.-  F The ACCOUNT command has been modified (16-jul-1997) to eventually passE in P2 two rights related qualifiers: /UIC and /ACCOUNT, then eventualnH rights ID in P3, then any other UAF qualifiers in P4 to P8, as stated inB the documentation, this because the creation of an account createsC rights identifiers for this account (see comment within procedure).e   Suggested modifications> -----------------------e@ Although the documentation is not wrong, I suggest the following modifications:  D page 7.3, instead of "The ACCOUNT statement uses a command procedureE (sys$update:pcsi$create_account.com) to create an account." one could 4 read "The ACCOUNT statement uses a command procedureG (sys$update:pcsi$create_account.com) to create then modify an account."-.                                         [add?]  E page 7.3, instead of "P2 specifies general AUTHORIZE qualifiers." onelH could read "P2 specifies AUTHORIZE qualifiers used during the ADD phase.D The /UIC and /ACCOUNT qualifiers and values should be placed there."  @ page 7.3, instead of "P4 to P8 specifies other general AUTHORIZE? qualifiers." one could read "P4 to P8 specifies other AUTHORIZEuA qualifiers used during the MODIFY phase of the account creation."e  E page 7.4, the example should be modified to reflect these suggestions > (and mainly move the "/account=PCSI" parameter from P4 to P2).  D I apologize for the inconvenience in case this note is not relevant.   D. --  + IMS AG                  <mailto:dmo@ims.ch> / Worblentalstr. 30       Tel: +41 (31) 925 33 56t/ 3063 Ittigen (Swiss)    Fax: +41 (31) 922 22 22u/ -----------------------------------------------e/ Besuchen Sie uns im Internet: http://www.ims.chd/ or  http://didier.morandi.free.fr/index_us.htmlr      GSM: 079.705.46.70e   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 07:35:29 GMTr+ From: Hugh Bonney <hfbonney@bolt.sonic.net>m Subject: Re: Status of EV74 Message-ID: <5j3l6.3597$S25.50757@typhoon.sonic.net>  ) Nick Maclaren <nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk> wrote:r< : Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote: :>>  ...B :>I would expect EV3 to lose big on Floating Point, because it didB :>not have any. Like someone said, an internal experimental model.  D : Not necessarily.  When the original IBM RT came out, I benchmarkedB : it at 25% faster at floating-point than an 8 MHz 68000 that usedE : emulation.  There were already 10 MHz 68010s around, and they wouldrF : have beaten the RT handsomely, even without floating-point hardware.  A : I spent some time assuming that the RT was emulating it, before C : I proved to myself it wasn't.  It was some years before I managedaB : to find anyone who could explain just HOW hardware could be made
 : so slow :-)   C : As Intel are determined to repeat every error of 20-30 years ago,u% : why should they leave that one out?o  A    But it's thought a good thing not to have institutional memorys@    or experienced people around over some single digit number of?    years in many companies. Is that true in CPU design as well?n      H.---   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 14:20:56 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>a- Subject: Re: Strange way to blow your profits H Message-ID: <y47l2ikg5j.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:   J > 10 years later "MY" vaxes are still there (for another year after which # > they are being replaced with NT).   E Please let us know which bank that is, so that we can avoid using it.a   	Jan  K PS: I've actually heard a bank IT security manager say in public hearing heeF thought WNT to be the safest OS available "since it has been evaluatedE according to ITSEC". Thankfully everybody around him stared at him ini disbelief.     ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:40:03 -0600s From: bramblet@fuller.comt0 Subject: Summary: Replaceing LP37 with LG15 Plus* Message-ID: <3A9532D3.C89AC015@fuller.com>   My  original question:. I have an AlphaServer 400 running Open VMS 6.2G We have a "musuem piece" of a printer that Compaq is tired of servicing D every week. It is about a 2 hour drive from their office to ours. WeG purchased a LG 15 plus on their recommendation. They said that it wouldlH be a "easy" replacement. Just shut down queue on old LP37 and add new LG   15 and restart queue.-  ( It turns out that it is not that simple.B This printer is connected to a  LPV11 q-bus printer controller. NoB matter what the tech does it doesn't work. This is a data products connection.C  D Does anyone have experience on how to set this up?? We don't want toF have to connect serially but would like to just drop and add newone. IF think that it is a configuration problem. I called the other person in? town who has the same server that we do and theirs is connectedp	 serially..     NO responses at all.G It was a hardware issue. The printer was redesigned and the manufactureiE forgot a lead on the main board. Soldering 2 wires together fixed it.VF Compaq Field service came and did it theirselves (part of the contract& to buy the  printer.) Works great now.     --
 Ron Bramblette Systems Adminstrator Fuller Brush Company   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 02:58 CSTe' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)L Subject: Re: Sun's 'Full Moon'- Message-ID: <22FEB200102584431@gerg.tamu.edu>G  - Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes...w }WILLIAM WEBB wrote: }> d@ }> Perhaps it's because a Full Moon is only up once a month. ;-) }> 0	 }> WWWebb- }  }Sometimes twice.r  / It's up twice a month only once in a blue moon.u   --- Carl  @ PS For those that don't know, the current definition of the term?    "blue moon" is the second full moon in a month. Probably theUB    most intersting part of this is that this didn't used to be theE    definition - you can blame the new definition on Sky and TelescopeaC    for printing this erroneous explanation of the term more than 50 C    years ago (and the StarDate radio program for spreading it againfB    about 21 years ago, then the Trival Persuit game for using it aB    few years later). It used to be the 3rd full moon in any seasonD    that had 4 full moons (using an eclesiastical date for the vernalC    equinox, which is always March 21st, and the tropical year). TherB    other full moons in a season have other names like "fruit moon"F    (or the somewhat more obvious "full moon before lent" and suchlike,C    for the eclesiastically minded). I have no idea why it is "blue"     specifically.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:14:27 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Re: Sun's 'Full Moon'- Message-ID: <87elwqvdvw.fsf@prep.synonet.com>o  + Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes:e   > Sometimes twice.  D So is that a blue screen day, blue dress day or just a blue moon? :)   -- 0< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.g@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:34:58 -0300o) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br 
 Subject: Test L Message-ID: <OFD17AA187.CE827D2C-ON032569FB.00609327@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   Test   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 02:54:47 -0500t2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)3 Subject: Re: Trouble with second NIC in my 3000-700mL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2202010254470001@user-2iveaed.dialup.mindspring.com>  7 In article <3A94A33E.46E54CC8@sunset.net>, Tom Crabtreeh <tccrab@sunset.net> wrote:  	 > Hi all!- > C > I having a little trouble configuring a second NIC in my 3000-700p- > running OpenVMS 7.1 1H2 & DEC Net Phase IV.R  D Strange coincidence.  The 3000-700 isn't that common compared to itsJ cousins, but you're the second person trying to add a second NIC to one inD the last couple days.  Did you see the earlier thread in this group?  H > I installed it into my Alpha, booted it up, ran UCX$Config to identifyJ > it, ran NetConfig to configure it, restarted the network. I then enabled- > LAT and tried to set up a LN17 Lat Printer.n  G So far, you've mentioned DECnet IV, UCX, and LAT, which are 3 differentiH network protocols that have (almost) nothing to do with each other.  Are you clear on the difference?  I DECnet-plus is better with multiple NICs.  Old-timers tend to despise it,iI since the management interface is so different from DECnet-minus.  But if,I you don't already know old DECnet, I'd recommend you start with, and stayN3 with, DECnet-plus.  More features, ongoing support.i  ! The DECnet-plus manuals are here:o7    http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/index.html#decneta  = If you decide to try DECnet-plus, please read this one first: ?    http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/6501/6501PRO.HTMLdF ...and realize you won't use most of what's offered.  But if you don't? read at least part of this manual, the jargon may make the resth impossible.   G It appears the DECnet IV manuals have gone off line.  Or maybe I'm juste  too tired to see them right now.   VMS docs are here:;    http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/index.html#ovmsdocsetU  9 (The particular VMS version hardly matters for the docs.)u  # > This is where the trouble starts. J > I can ping the address of the NIC and see it, I can TCP/IP in and out of+ > that device, but the LAT refuses to work.l  ; LAT will need a bit of configuring, especially with 2 NICs.   B For LAT, see the "system management utilities" manual, chapter 13:?    http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/6258/6048pro.html:0 and also the System Manger's Manual, chapter 24:?    http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/6017/6017pro.htmls  E Somewhere in there, you will find specific cases with LAT on 2 NICs. .. There are some restrictions described as well.  I Read the table of contents of these two manuals carefully.  You will havem! to refer to them for many things.g  G Often there is a .COM file you can customize to configure your system. aH When these files don't exist by default, there is often a .TEMPLATE fileH you copy as a starting point.  These are filled with useful comments andJ examples.  When the manuals mention a .TEMPLATE file, find it and read the	 comments!e    @ > The problem appears to lie in NCP, when I go into NCP and type > NCP> LIST KNOWN LINESi@ > I see is SVA-0 which is the primary NIC and MXE-0 which is the > additional NIC.n
 > When I typel > NCP> SHOW KNOWN LINESh > all I see is SVA-0.   J I never did 2 NICs with DECnet-minus, and I don't remember the DECnet-plusE off the top of my head.  I do recall that the Configuration procedurefC pretty much did everything for both NICs.  There is a configurationcI required for old DECnet as well.  Did you go though that?  It is separater from the UCX configuration.h  C The reason the different protocols overlap a bit, is because DECnetnE changes the NIC's ethernet address when it starts up.  That means thesD other protocols should start after DECnet, or else the NIC's addressI appears to vanish.  This also means that DECnet-old can only have one NICeB per LAN; otherwise they would both get the same ethernet address. C DECnet-plus is more flexible; only one NIC gets the "classic" e-netyE address that matches the DECnet address; other NIC follow a different-- scheme and can be connected to the same wire.e  I > So it appears that the NIC is identified in the permanent database, butrJ > not in the volatile database.  I've never done this before, so I am at a > loss.b > A > I don't have any manuals, and the help files are not much help.l > I > I've tried to search the Compaq site, but quite honestly it intimidates E > me.  It seems to be geared toward the kind of people that can writeCI > operating systems, or re-program the ATMs at the local bank to spit out- > $3 dollar bills.   Start here:h!    http://www.openvms.compaq.com/m  E There is a link to the VMS FAQ.  Get it, read it.  (Not all at once.)   F The VMS doc set is online in html format.  Linked from the above page.  A > I'm just a hobbyist trying to break out of the Micro$oft world.o  F Hurrah!  You've come to the right place.  (Right OS, right newsgroup.)   -- d Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 23:32:21 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>3 Subject: Re: Trouble with second NIC in my 3000-700t- Message-ID: <87hf1mwx6i.fsf@prep.synonet.com>t  ( Tom Crabtree <tccrab@sunset.net> writes:  @ Is SCSSYSTEMID 0? Set that to (1024*n)+m where n.m is you decnet$ address, and you are probably sweet.  ? Make SURE that they are on seperate segents ( LANS ) and that at bridge won't forward packets.k     --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.e@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:15:44 GMTS4 From: LESLIE@209-16-45-102.insync.net (Jerry Leslie)% Subject: Re: UCX 4.x On DS20 ALPHAs ?R$ Message-ID: <A2al6.4$tu6.343@insync>  + Peter LANGSTOEGER (eplan@kapsch.net) wrote:tU : In article <96v23q$12r$1@joe.rice.edu>, leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie) writes:wJ : >We're having an as-yet unknown connectivity problem with a DS20 running : >TCP/IP V5.0A/ECO 2: : >w : >   $ tcpip show version : > G : >     DIGITAL TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.0A - ECO 2dE : >     on a COMPAQ AlphaServer DS20E 500 MHzP running OpenVMS V7.2-1i : >gI : >One suggestion has been to downgrade to UCX 4.x, since the applicationsB : >on the VMS system is known to run under VMS 6.-1H3 and UCX 4.2. : > F : >Is that a viable option, or does VMS 7.1-2 and later require TCP/IP : >Version 5.0 or better ? : 8 : V7.1-2 can run UCX V4.2, but your V7.2-1 requires V5.x :  : -- o> : Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651= : Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888n> : <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netJ : A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   Thanks.t  B Is there a web page, like an SPD, that documents that dependency ?    / --Jerry Leslie   leslie@209-16-45-97.insync.netB;                  leslie@209-16-45-102.insync.net is invalid 2                  (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:33:24 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)% Subject: Re: UCX 4.x On DS20 ALPHAs ?i* Message-ID: <3a954d64$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  [ In article <A2al6.4$tu6.343@insync>, LESLIE@209-16-45-102.insync.net (Jerry Leslie) writes: , >Peter LANGSTOEGER (eplan@kapsch.net) wrote:V >: In article <96v23q$12r$1@joe.rice.edu>, leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie) writes:G >: >Is that a viable option, or does VMS 7.1-2 and later require TCP/IP  >: >Version 5.0 or better ?r >: <9 >: V7.1-2 can run UCX V4.2, but your V7.2-1 requires V5.x8 >i >Thanks. >.C >Is there a web page, like an SPD, that documents that dependency ?   < 	http://www.openvms.digital.com/openvms/os/swroll/index.html  E and my experience (that means UCX V4 does run on OpenVMS VAX V7.2 butsC is not supported and UCX V4 doesn't run on OpenVMS Alpha V7 becausei of eg. ODS5)   -- h< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888a< <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:00:10 +0000k# From: Ian Jackson <Ian@kembles.com>3) Subject: Re: Unable To Delete A Directoryv8 Message-ID: <l73a9t04e0km94vj4opgtd3qb4dssvmtoo@4ax.com>  4 Thanks to everyone that replied here, and via email.  
 Problem fixedu   Ian Jackson>   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:54:20 +0100P2 From: Timo Biesenbach <timo.biesenbach@igd.fhg.de>" Subject: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port* Message-ID: <3A951A0C.6E13DB31@igd.fhg.de>   Hello,  D I recently aquired a used VAXstation 3100 onto which I would like toD hook up external SCSI devices. Now there's this strange SCSI plug of the VAXstation having 68 pins.D What I'm looking for is a cable to connect my peripherals with or an1 Adapter which allows to use "normal" SCSI cables.aD Does anyone know wheter a PC-style 68->50 pin adapter works? Or do I> need a special DEC-cable? If yes, does anyone know the pinout?  
 Greetings, Timo   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:49:02 -0500l/ From: "Webb, William W" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>8& Subject: RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI PortK Message-ID: <D46FE9B132FB9B44AEC242A96E4AB750019259B5@rlghncst625.usps.gov>   J This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand< this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.  ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CDE.9892BC80e Content-Type: text/plain;p 	charset="iso-8859-1"r  B You're talking about the plug on the upper right as you're lookingC at the back of the box that looks like a 68-pin SCSI except for the-" fact that the gender is backwards?  : I'm doing this from memory (I'm at work, and my VAXstation@ 3100/76 is at home) but I *think* you're looking for a BC09J-03.  The other end is a 50 pin SCSI.   8 The VAXstation 3100 Model 76 Owner's Guide is online at / www.whiteice.com/~williamwebb/intro/DOC-i.html.S  ! Hope it helps you get it running.m   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET + > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 9:05 AMi8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET$ > Subject: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port >  >  > Hello, > F > I recently aquired a used VAXstation 3100 onto which I would like toF > hook up external SCSI devices. Now there's this strange SCSI plug of  > the VAXstation having 68 pins.F > What I'm looking for is a cable to connect my peripherals with or an3 > Adapter which allows to use "normal" SCSI cables. F > Does anyone know wheter a PC-style 68->50 pin adapter works? Or do I@ > need a special DEC-cable? If yes, does anyone know the pinout? >  > Greetings, > Timo >   ' ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CDE.9892BC80g Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1">  1 <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">P <HTML> <HEAD>H <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">H <META NAME="Generator" CONTENT="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2653.12">, <TITLE>RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port</TITLE> </HEAD>h <BODY>  Y <P><FONT SIZE=2>You're talking about the plug on the upper right as you're looking</FONT>d[ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>at the back of the box that looks like a 68-pin SCSI except for the</FONT>-: <BR><FONT SIZE=2>fact that the gender is backwards?</FONT> </P>  Q <P><FONT SIZE=2>I'm doing this from memory (I'm at work, and my VAXstation</FONT>eX <BR><FONT SIZE=2>3100/76 is at home) but I *think* you're looking for a BC09J-03.</FONT>8 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>The other end is a 50 pin SCSI. </FONT> </P>  O <P><FONT SIZE=2>The VAXstation 3100 Model 76 Owner's Guide is online at </FONT>sG <BR><FONT SIZE=2>www.whiteice.com/~williamwebb/intro/DOC-i.html.</FONT>  </P>  8 <P><FONT SIZE=2>Hope it helps you get it running.</FONT> </P>   <P><FONT SIZE=2>WWWebb</FONT>s </P>  6 <P><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT>M <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET </FONT>uF <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 9:05 AM</FONT>S <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET</FONT>0? <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Subject: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port</FONT>R <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>e <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>Q# <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Hello,</FONT>  <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT> a <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; I recently aquired a used VAXstation 3100 onto which I would like to</FONT> a <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; hook up external SCSI devices. Now there's this strange SCSI plug of</FONT> ; <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; the VAXstation having 68 pins.</FONT> a <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; What I'm looking for is a cable to connect my peripherals with or an</FONT> X <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Adapter which allows to use &quot;normal&quot; SCSI cables.</FONT>d <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Does anyone know wheter a PC-style 68-&gt;50 pin adapter works? Or do I</FONT>[ <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; need a special DEC-cable? If yes, does anyone know the pinout?</FONT>V <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT> ' <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Greetings,</FONT>0! <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; Timo</FONT>2 <BR><FONT SIZE=2>&gt; </FONT>1 </P>   </BODY>P </HTML> ) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C09CDE.9892BC80--    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 16:07:02 +0100K2 From: Timo Biesenbach <timo.biesenbach@igd.fhg.de>& Subject: Re: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port* Message-ID: <3A952B16.509FC817@igd.fhg.de>   Thanks for your reply,  D > You're talking about the plug on the upper right as you're lookingE > at the back of the box that looks like a 68-pin SCSI except for the $ > fact that the gender is backwards?: Yep, that's the one... (it's actually located on the left)  < > I'm doing this from memory (I'm at work, and my VAXstationB > 3100/76 is at home) but I *think* you're looking for a BC09J-03.! > The other end is a 50 pin SCSI.rC Right, thats the DEC-Partnumber, there's also a BC56H-03 which also  is known to work.a  < OK, now the question is: how is the pinout? Would a standardA 68pin -> 50pin converter + gender changer do the job or do I have<% to buy a probably expensive DEC part?M  
 Greetings, Timo   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:15:12 -0600W* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>& Subject: RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port- Message-ID: <0033000016880977000002L072*@MHS>    =0AI meant upper left.  Sorry.   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETp+ > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 9:58 AMe8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET( > Subject: RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port >s >pD > You're talking about the plug on the upper right as you're lookingE > at the back of the box that looks like a 68-pin SCSI except for thev$ > fact that the gender is backwards? >a< > I'm doing this from memory (I'm at work, and my VAXstationB > 3100/76 is at home) but I *think* you're looking for a BC09J-03.! > The other end is a 50 pin SCSI.t >n9 > The VAXstation 3100 Model 76 Owner's Guide is online at 1 > www.whiteice.com/~williamwebb/intro/DOC-i.html.w > # > Hope it helps you get it running.a >s > WWWebb >f > > -----Original Message-----3 > > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET - > > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 9:05 AM2: > > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET& > > Subject: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port > >- > >8
 > > Hello, > >pH > > I recently aquired a used VAXstation 3100 onto which I would like t= o H > > hook up external SCSI devices. Now there's this strange SCSI plug o= f)" > > the VAXstation having 68 pins.H > > What I'm looking for is a cable to connect my peripherals with or a= n 5 > > Adapter which allows to use "normal" SCSI cables. H > > Does anyone know wheter a PC-style 68->50 pin adapter works? Or do = I-B > > need a special DEC-cable? If yes, does anyone know the pinout? > >r > > Greetings, > > Timo > >s >m3 > File item 2 original document name: Not specifiedC# > File item 2 document type: PCDATAc  > File item 2 size (bytes): 2330 >=   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:59:44 -0600s* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>& Subject: RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port- Message-ID: <0033000016887331000002L012*@MHS>i  7 =0AThere's also a BC56H which has a straight 50-pin endC instead of the right angle.   < I really don't know about the pinouts on it since I've never had to make one.  @ You could try the adapter, but remember that neither S in "SCSI" stands for "Standard" ;-)n  $ Cable end of life was November 1999.  " Do a web search on BC09J or BC56H.  = There are also places that will make one for you, but gettingc2 them to give you a pinout listing is not probable.  
 Good luck.   WWWebb   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETc, > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 10:25 AM8 > To: Webb, William W; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET( > Subject: RE: VAXstation 3100 SCSI Port >T >h > Thanks for your reply, > F > > You're talking about the plug on the upper right as you're lookingH > > at the back of the box that looks like a 68-pin SCSI except for the=  & > > fact that the gender is backwards?< > Yep, that's the one... (it's actually located on the left) > > > > I'm doing this from memory (I'm at work, and my VAXstationD > > 3100/76 is at home) but I *think* you're looking for a BC09J-03.# > > The other end is a 50 pin SCSI.:E > Right, thats the DEC-Partnumber, there's also a BC56H-03 which alsoy > is known to work.r > > > OK, now the question is: how is the pinout? Would a standardC > 68pin -> 50pin converter + gender changer do the job or do I havee' > to buy a probably expensive DEC part?o >h > Greetings, > Timo >=   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 14:35:04 GMT1 From: JONESD@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (David Jones)s Subject: Re: Version numbers: Message-ID: <97382o$ntb$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  M In message Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>,hG    <y4elwuio8s.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes: M >Note: a concept that is actually missing in (every?) filesystem(s) I've seenlO >is modifications of file content vs metadata modification, which would be veryt >useful to have.  D The ODS-5 file header does have fields for last access time and lastF attribute modification time.  I don't know if it is fully implemented.  G I wish while they were adding fields, they would have added UTC offsets G so you could easily and consistently convert the dates to UTC (the dateh? fields themselves would still be local time for compatibility).   E Speaking of file dates, in Microsoft's file systems, a copy of a filem; may show a creation date later than its last modified date.o4 Took me a long time to follow the logic behind that.    < David L. Jones               |      Phone:    (614) 292-6929- Ohio State University        |      Internet: L 140 W. 19th St. Rm. 231a     |               jonesd@er6s1.eng.ohio-state.edu: Columbus, OH 43210           |               vman+@osu.edu  + Disclaimer: Dogs can't tell it's not bacon.N   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 19:00:05 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>l Subject: Re: Version numbersH Message-ID: <y4hf1ma996.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  3 JONESD@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (David Jones) writes:r  F > The ODS-5 file header does have fields for last access time and lastH > attribute modification time.  I don't know if it is fully implemented.  I Ah! that DOD thing rears its head! So they were thinking of this that fare back...   I > I wish while they were adding fields, they would have added UTC offsetsTI > so you could easily and consistently convert the dates to UTC (the datesA > fields themselves would still be local time for compatibility).n   Yes, Agreed.   	Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:22:54 GMT 4 From: LESLIE@209-16-45-102.insync.net (Jerry Leslie)2 Subject: Re: VMS 7.2-1 Bugcheck In DECW$REINIT.EXE$ Message-ID: <i9al6.5$tu6.343@insync>  H Jan Vorbrueggen (jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de) wrote:8 : LESLIE@209-16-45-102.insync.net (Jerry Leslie) writes: : 9 : >   o Failing PC: FFFFFFFF.80007268  OTS$REM_UL_C+000B8  : C : That's the general run-time support library, and I think this is  A : "remainder of an unsigned long". Looks like a division by 0 is i :  happening somewhere.  :  : 	Jan  M Yes, that was reported in the original article, which has probably expired one most news servers:       Signal Array   ------------       Length = 00000003:       Type   = 00000484m4       Arg    = FFFFFFFF.80007268  OTS$REM_UL_C+000B8        Arg    = 00000000.00001504   <   %SYSTEM-F-INTDIV, arithmetic trap, integer divide by zero %   at PC=FFFFFFFF80007268, PS=00001504   ,   Saved Scratch Registers in Mechanism Array,   ------------------------------------------N   R0   = 00000000.00000000  R1   = 00000000.00000000  R16  = FFFFFFFF.FFFFFFFEN   R17  = 00000000.00000000  R18  = 00000000.00000002  R19  = 00000000.82C32A60N   R20  = 00000000.82C32A60  R21  = 00000000.00000600  R22  = 00000000.00000000N   R23  = 00000000.00000000  R24  = 00000000.00000000  R25  = 00000000.00000002N   R26  = FFFFFFFF.82C2C140  R27  = FFFFFFFF.82B2A390  R28  = FFFFFFFF.FFFFFE00  F   CPU 00 reason for Bugcheck: INVEXCEPTN, Exception while above ASTDEL    / --Jerry Leslie   leslie@209-16-45-97.insync.net ;                  leslie@209-16-45-102.insync.net is invalidc2                  (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:19:06 +0100 6 From: "Dijk, Jeroen van" <Jeroen.vandijk@getronics.nl>, Subject: RE: VMS systems up for 15 years !!!M Message-ID: <2795B75EF003D311801A00A0C906B511BF1141@cucexec.gbc.getronics.nl>   < If the this story is true then is VMS more stable then UNIX.= Because an UNIX box crashes if the PID values become flipped. h This will happen very quickly if you let it run for a long time and restart the processes to many times.B It's weakness of UNIX and VMS has seen that problem and solved it.) While UNIX forgot to solve that problem. n   -----Original Message-----. From: Neil Rieck [mailto:n.rieck@sympatico.ca]% Sent: donderdag 22 februari 2001 1:170 To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComV( Subject: VMS systems up for 15 years !!!     Folks,   I just saw this article at URL: / http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/index.html-G Check out the second last paragraph (I'll bet the Windows weenies can't  relate)u  
 Neil Rieck! http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/1  L  --------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----E Ask The Wizard:. What happens when PID wraps?   The Question is:  G I have always beleived that OpenVMS PID's are unique for as long as the- systemJ  is booted and are only re-used after a reboot.  Is this true?  And if so, isK  there any limit to PID's - i.e. the 8 hex digits normally displayed?  Whata)  would happen if this limit were reached?@  L I know 8 billion unique processes should be enough for anyone and we are not inJ  imminent danger of hitting this limit, but I would still be interested in the-J  'what if' scenario, particularly as a few UNIX-types are siting this as a  weakness with OpenVMS  L ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----   The Answer is:  H   With OpenVMS, the PID format (both external and internal PID varietiesF   in the current model) formats are undocumented and subject to changeG   without notice.  The current format of the external and internal PIDstH   are listed in the OpenVMS Internals and Data Structures Manual (IDSM),H   though the OpenVMS Wizard strongly discourages any dependencies on PID4   format be implemented in any application software.  K   As for what happens when the PID itself wraps, well, nothing particularlyr   interesting happens.     The value wraps.  H   Continous OpenVMS system uptimes of fifteen or more years are known toI   have occured on customer systems, so there is some experience with veryA   extended system uptimes.  I   With the wrapping of the PID, you will have the potential for duplicateaE   PIDs in accounting and auditing files, particularly if you have notVG   recreated new versions of the accounting and auditing logs during the-H   intervening years.  That said, due to the construction of the PID, youF   cannot and will not have duplicate PIDs active on the same system orE   same cluster at the same time.  Also due to the construction of thetI   PID, a very long time will transpire between any particular uses of anyo   particular PID value.-  A   UNIX has a very similar process identification (PID) construct.e   privacy and legal statementd   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:46:49 GMTd- From: goathunter@goatley.com (Hunter Goatley) . Subject: Re: WKU FILESERV: Updated GZIP-1-2-4B/ Message-ID: <3a953327.2893240@swen.process.com>g  7 On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:20:52 -0600, "David J. Dachtera"o$ <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote:   >Hunter Goatley wrote:? >> [snip]  It's getting to be a real PITA to support C programse) >> under multiple versions of VMS.  Sigh.  >IF >Y'know, Hunter, it's really GREAT that you provide object code we can >link on our target systems. >- Thanks.-  I >...but is there really any benefit other than some personal satisfaction@( >to re-building the program from source? >0< Some people refuse to run any software they can't build from; the sources, so as to avoid trojan horses, viruses, etc.  I < don't know how many of those people actually look at all the< source code they're building to make sure such things aren't there, but....  < I make it a point to do my best to check all software in the? WKU archives, and there are very few (maybe one or two, I can'tgA remember now), if any, packages in my archives that don't includehA source.  I think most people feel comfortable having the sources,y; but I don't think most people rebuild from scratch.  If yout> trust the source of the binaries, I think it's generally safe.  ? So the answer is no, personal satisfaction is probably the only  real reason for doing so.b   Does that answer your question?p Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/n9 goathunter@goatley.com     http://www.goatley.com/hunter/    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:10:26 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>. Subject: Re: WKU FILESERV: Updated GZIP-1-2-4B- Message-ID: <87itm2ve2l.fsf@prep.synonet.com>k  9 "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> writes:g   > Hunter Goatley wrote:a@ > > [snip]  It's getting to be a real PITA to support C programs* > > under multiple versions of VMS.  Sigh. > G > Y'know, Hunter, it's really GREAT that you provide object code we can- > link on our target systems.  > J > ...but is there really any benefit other than some personal satisfaction) > to re-building the program from source?0  D WEll, if you are on an Alpha, and REALLY care about the last percentC or so, the replace 'generic' with 'host' and do it once per arch :)   E BTW, DON'T run a arch=EV56 or above on an EV4. Or on a M600 at least, D the LDBU never returns from the PALcode or where ever it is meant to happen.V   -- o< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.e@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2001 18:28:05 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog). Subject: Re: WKU FILESERV: Updated GZIP-1-2-4B, Message-ID: <973lnl$mak@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  _ In article <3a953327.2893240@swen.process.com>, goathunter@goatley.com (Hunter Goatley) writes:T@ >So the answer is no, personal satisfaction is probably the only >real reason for doing so.  W There's another reason to recompile - you can set the compilers /arch=native and higher L (or any) optimization switches.  Depending on the program it may or may not  be worth doing this.   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu2? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech BJ **************************************************************************J *                                RIP VMS                                 *J **************************************************************************   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2001 13:24:56 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)B; Subject: www.compaqworkinggroup.org (was: Alpha: game over) 3 Message-ID: <XCZl$J0iL3Mn@eisner.encompasserve.org>&  s In article <wRbl6.8727$CW1.6789013@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes:h  L > You have until March 5 to assert your views on these and other subjects at > www.compaqworkinggroup.org  I You have until March 4 to make the site work again with secured browsers.q   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:35:46 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>? Subject: Re: www.compaqworkinggroup.org (was: Alpha: game over)n< Message-ID: <6_cl6.8736$CW1.6821990@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  F "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote in message- news:XCZl$J0iL3Mn@eisner.encompasserve.org...YH > In article <wRbl6.8727$CW1.6789013@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C., Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: >0K > > You have until March 5 to assert your views on these and other subjectsX at > > www.compaqworkinggroup.org >9K > You have until March 4 to make the site work again with secured browsers.t  0 Noted and passed along to Jonathan.Lurie@sba.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:24:49 GMTt, From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>< Subject: Yahoo group created for VMSINSTAL to PCSI migration& Message-ID: <3A952F5D.6648ABD1@gmx.ch>  ' http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vmsinstal  fyi.   D. --   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.106 ************************