1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 25 Feb 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 112       Contents:< Re: Alpha: game over. Was Future outlook for OpenVMS admins? Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX)  RE: CLuster coms with HSGs Re: CLuster coms with HSGs. Re: Dates (was Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing). Re: Dates (was Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing)% Re: DCL: count nr of lines --> prize! % Re: DCL: count nr of lines --> prize!  Re: DEC Alpha's - FREE T-Shirt1 Re: Handling of remounting of disks after a crash > Now: Where are the VMS apps? Was: 1.2 GHz Alpha MicroprocessorB Re: Now: Where are the VMS apps? Was: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor' RE: QUESTION: BZIP2 For OpenVMS Anyone? ( Re: RTR now licesnsed as part of OpenVMS0 Re: So what Are we meant to use on the 'desktop'0 Re: So what Are we meant to use on the 'desktop' Re: Starting from scratch.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:38:15 +0100   From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>E Subject: Re: Alpha: game over. Was Future outlook for OpenVMS admins? + Message-ID: <VA.000002c9.7f70298f@sture.ch>   M In article <y4zofdye9s.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Jan   Vorbrueggen wrote:I > From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> 3 > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms,comp.sys.dec,vmsnet.alpha K > Subject: Re: Alpha: game over. Was RE: Future outlook for OpenVMS admins? " > Date: 23 Feb 2001 09:50:07 +0100 > 6 > mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes: > , > > We've currently got only 400 Mhz PIIs inO > > them but I think I can go at as high as 900 Mhz PIII if I change the BIOS.   > J > And then it would be seriously constrained for memory bandwith, and very > unbalanced.  > 1 > > Multiple users are free on Linux and Solaris.  > P > Yes, I've never understood why DEC introduced the restriction on the number ofM > users when you already base the price of the VMS license on the processor's > > power - and thus ability to serve a limited number of users. > K For me, that was the beginning of the end for DEC. Coming from a mainframe  L background, I initially found it hard to understand why DEC _sold_ software P rather than renting it out. I quickly came to understand the attraction of that.  O But then they started gouging customers. A particular example I recall is of a  K friend who wanted a 17 user system (1987?). DEC told him that he needed an  O unlimited user license because it was one more than 16. It put their price way  P above the competition. When he complained about that, they dropped the price by P such a staggering amount that he felt insulted that they had tried to gouge him  in the first place.   N Result? One more unix customer, violently against DEC. Prominent in the local < business community, I am sure he spread that message around.  O Next result? I felt I couldn't recommend DEC/VMS to many other small to medium  L sized businesses. At that time I was seeing a lot of folks buying expensive P DOS/Netware solutions when a simple MicroVAX with dumb VTs could have been much  more cost effective.  O > On the other hand, Oracle gets away nicely with its gouging price model based / > on "power units", so there's ample precedent.  > N Back to publicity and user perception. Remember the huge salaries a few years I ago commanded by folks with SAP knowledge? Everyone suddenly wanted that  J expertise and were prepared to commit their company's budgets to it. Huge P loyalty bonuses followed that, often followed by the demise or takeover of said  company. ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 01:06:51 -0700 1 From: Vance Haemmerle <vance@toyvax.Tucson.AZ.US> & Subject: Re: ARG! (was New HD on uVAX)2 Message-ID: <3A985AAB.E401BD5@toyvax.Tucson.AZ.US>   Richard B. Gilbert wrote:   K >         Any third party disk drive is a crapshoot with any version of VMS  > before V7.1!    C   Including V7.1!  I recently bought a Barracuda 18XL 18.2GB (model 
 ST318416N)D Seagate drive for use with OpenVMS Alpha V7.1 with the ALPSCSI05_071 patch.B The drive is put offline after bootup from an INVALID INQUIRY DATA RECEIVEDG error.  I saw in the VMS FAQ mention of larger drives needing V7.1-2 or  the H ALPSCSI07_062 patch.  ALPSCSI05_071 is still the newest patch for V7.1. E However, I extracted SYS$DKDRIVER.EXE from the VMS712_SCSI-V0300 PCSI  patch C and copied it to my system and the drive is now usable.  I think an  updated 2 patch should be released for V7.1, not just 7.1-2.   --B Vance Haemmerle               Internet   vance@toyvax.Tucson.AZ.US( Tucson, AZ                    Web       " http://toyvax.Tucson.AZ.US/~vance/   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 07:29:15 -0600 + From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> # Subject: RE: CLuster coms with HSGs N Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284E4F@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>   Scott,  G I agree that 1GbE is a definate alternative to CIPCA's - as long as cpu L cycles are not an issue and one uses two adapters and two switches that willJ load balance / fail over to the other in case of failure. My understandingH from the network folks is that most (many?) GbE switch vendors have this capability.   K Note - In VMS V7.3, the SCS traffic will be able to be load balanced across  multiple Cluster interconnects.    Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----+ From: Scott Vieth [mailto:svieth@wi.rr.com]  Sent: February 24, 2001 8:56 AM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com # Subject: Re: CLuster coms with HSGs     F Instead of keeping the CI, why not go to gig ethernet so you can pull  all the CI cables I out of the raised floor and scrap your star coupler to free up some real   estate?   @ Plus, those CIPCAs are still worth something on the used market.   -scott   Paul Repacholi wrote:   / > "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> writes:  > E >> Unless there are computer room space issues (Star couplers etc), I G >> have been recommending to Customers that are migrating to SAN's from C >> CI's that for now - keep their CI's as the cluster communication  >> interconnect only.  > @ >> That way, you have the best of both worlds. Also, easy way toA >> measure cluster traffic as it will be the only traffic on CI's E >> ...Also, provides an easy way to migrate the data ie. can do it in  >> phases as time permits. > F >> Memory channel is ok, but it does have some cpu overhead associated >> with it.  >  > = > Is MC interupt handling still only on the Primary CPU? 7.3?  > 1 > Keeping the  CI strikes me as a very good idea.  >    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2001 21:55:28 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com># Subject: Re: CLuster coms with HSGs - Message-ID: <878zmudfzj.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   & Scott Vieth <svieth@wi.rr.com> writes:   > Paul Repacholi wrote:  > & > > Cause you burn CPU with every byte >  > Reeeeally?G Really. The CPUs have to do all the stuff the CIPCAs do in HW. At least ) it's not bound to the primary CPU though.    > ! > > , and if your switch fails or ' > > saturates, your cluster is screwed.  >  > Saturates?  How?J Cluster and lock traffic. Some irriot adding a billybox over your address,C etc, etc. Go read the e-trade articles for several ways to get bit.      > & > >  You do mean have a GE for cluster > > trafic and NOTHING else? > L > Why not?  It's got to be cheaper to buy a gig enet card for an AlphaServer > than to use CIPCAs.   G And a second lot for networking. My experience is you can get the money I for one of anything. Ask for a second, and it's all up hill... Of course,  if cheep is the test,...   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 18:44:13 +0010 % From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au 7 Subject: Re: Dates (was Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing) 5 Message-ID: <01K0JCUATORM00ABWA@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>   2 Since both you guys (Bill/David) have semi-hidden / addresses (which I ain't gonna keep analysing):   8 This discussion was interesting until it came to a blow 0 by blow fight between you two.  Moving into the 	 esoteric.   ! Can you take it off-line, please?    Regards, Paddy   Paddy O'Brien, Transmission Development, 
 TransGrid, PO Box A1000, Sydney South,  NSW 2000, Australia    Tel:   +61 2 9284-3063 Fax:   +61 2 9284-3050& Email: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au  8 Either "\'" or "\s" (to escape the apostrophe) seems to  work for most people, 6 but that little whizz-bang apostrophe gives me little  spam.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:09:26 -0500 ' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> 7 Subject: Re: Dates (was Re: OpenVMS and Supercomputing) ( Message-ID: <97bad9$16b$1@pyrite.mv.net>  2 <paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au> wrote in message/ news:01K0JCUATORM00ABWA@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au... 3 > Since both you guys (Bill/David) have semi-hidden 1 > addresses (which I ain't gonna keep analysing):   H Wouldn't know about Dachtera's address, but mine is plain-text, as you'd know if you'd tried it.    > 9 > This discussion was interesting until it came to a blow 1 > by blow fight between you two.  Moving into the  > esoteric.  > # > Can you take it off-line, please?   H I do apologize to the rest of the group:  seems as if every year or so IJ forget that interacting with Dachtera is a complete waste of time, and getH into one of these.  Perhaps I should consider myself lucky that he's theK only such consistently-repeating-bozo that I've met on the entire Internet; I as I think I may have said the last time, it seems to be a combination of G his reasonable verbal ability (that makes discussion seem superficially I possible) with his being a few cans short of a six-pack in the analytical  department.    - bill   >  > Regards, Paddy >  > Paddy O'Brien, > Transmission Development,  > TransGrid, > PO Box A1000, Sydney South,  > NSW 2000, Australia  >  > Tel:   +61 2 9284-3063 > Fax:   +61 2 9284-3050( > Email: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au > 9 > Either "\'" or "\s" (to escape the apostrophe) seems to  > work for most people, 7 > but that little whizz-bang apostrophe gives me little  > spam.  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 18:41:51 +0100 5 From: Eckhard Wich <eckhard_wich@deutsche-boerse.com> . Subject: Re: DCL: count nr of lines --> prize!3 Message-ID: <3A9943DD.CA1552EB@deutsche-boerse.com>    Carl Perkins wrote:   / > Your login.com has 4147 lines? That's insane!   R Yes, it has 4147 lines. Working for Digital (not for Compaq ..) years ago, I foundP it very useful to have all those little hacks & tools that made system manager's# live easier packed in one DCL hack.   ! And yes, it's a terrible hack :-)   N > Fewer matches, but the same record count. Which is good since your login.comI > may very well have lines without any letters or numbers on them - lines M > with nothing but "$" or "$!" on them are fairly common in .com files. Other    It does have ..    > J > file types often have lines with nothing on them, such as source code orP > just plain text files. Your alphanumeric search list wouldn't find any matches( > on those lines, but it doesn't matter.  N Right, the solution using $ COPY /LOG ... instead of $ SEARCH ..  some replies0 before counts the number of lines more reliable.     Cheers,    Eckhard   % Things are weird if you are wired ...   eckhard.wich@deutsche-boerse.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 13:53:09 -0500 , From: Howard S Shubs <hshubs@mindspring.com>. Subject: Re: DCL: count nr of lines --> prize!> Message-ID: <hshubs-EED5BB.13530925022001@news.mindspring.com>  3 In article <3A9943DD.CA1552EB@deutsche-boerse.com>, 7  Eckhard Wich <eckhard_wich@deutsche-boerse.com> wrote:   O >Right, the solution using $ COPY /LOG ... instead of $ SEARCH ..  some replies 1 >before counts the number of lines more reliable.    <bows> --   Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:38:14 +0100   From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>' Subject: Re: DEC Alpha's - FREE T-Shirt + Message-ID: <VA.000002c7.7f70268c@sture.ch>   ; In article <3A97BCEE.9080106@wi.rr.com>, Scott Vieth wrote: & > From: Scott Vieth <svieth@wi.rr.com> > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms ) > Subject: Re: DEC Alpha's - FREE T-Shirt % > Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 13:53:20 GMT  > J > Yeah, I admit that I took the "free t-shirt" bait and read your message. > B > Using this kind of advertising in comp.os.vms is soooo childish. > I > I'll continue to buy my hardware from Great Lakes Computer because they  > don't stoop to such tactics. > H > Just to remind y'all - the best deal on Digital/Compaq hardware can be> > found at Great Lakes Computer in Grand Rapids, MI.  Phone is1 > (616) 698-1100.    On the web at www.glcomp.com  >  > -Scott, Happy G.L Customer > H > p.s.  Island charges too much for their new StorageWorks drives.  Call) > Great Lakes and get a much better deal.  > H 'Scuse me for offering a different opinion, and I've never used GL, but:  > Can GL export to Europe _and_ get the customs paperwork right?N Can I pay GL by other means than a credit card? Hint - I don't have a US bank  account.9 Can GL deliver to Europe within a couple of working days?   GPaul, Happy Islandco Customer:-)                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                         ___    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 12:23:18 +0100 " From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>: Subject: Re: Handling of remounting of disks after a crash( Message-ID: <97aprs$4gi$1@news.IAEhv.nl>  K My environment is very similar to yours, a two node VS3100 NI cluster, both  nodes  run VMS 7.2, no patches:   $ sh dev dk   J Device                                     Device          Error    Volume Free  Trans Mnt J  Name                                     Status           Count     Label Blocks Count CntF $1$DKA100:    (HELIUM)  Mounted              0  VAXVMSRL072     133362 369   1 6 $1$DKB0:        (HELIUM)  Mounted              0  POOL 1988406       1    24 $1$DKB100:    (HELIUM)  Mounted              0  PACK 6489333      1    2 4 $1$DKB200:    (HELIUM)  Mounted              0  APPL 325125        2    24 $1$DKB300:    (HELIUM)  Mounted              0  USER 384591        1    2. $1$DKB400:    (HELIUM)  Online wrtlck        0> $3$DKA200:     (ARGON)  Mounted              0  (remote mount) 1 3 $3$DKB200:     (ARGON)  Mounted              0  ETC  1236423         1   2  $   J $3$dkb200 is ARGON's system disk. On ARGON (I'm a chemist :-) $1$dka100 is seen as D remotely mounted. When ARGON gets shut, its disks ($3$DKxnnn) become Unavailable.L As soon as ARGON reboots, they're mounted again with a similar MOUNT/CLUSTER command as yours.   9 Did you happen to change SCS or PA parameters in SYSGEN ?  Or should I post/email mine?  / Malcolm Dunnett heeft geschreven in bericht ... - >In article <3A979B6F.ECD07591@videotron.ca>, 4 >    JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: >  >> Simple environment: >>: >> VMS 7.2 (VAX).  Node VELO and BIKE in an ether-cluster. >>7 >> When BIKE Boots from its DKA200: drive , it issues a  >>? >> $MOUNT/CLUSTER $2$DKA200: PEDALS $DISK4 in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM  >>I >> The goal of the above is to cause BIKE's DKA200: to become mounted and * >> available on node VELO when BIKE boots. >> >>J >> HOWEVER, when BIKE crashes,   DKA200's status on VELO becomes in limbo.K >> When BIKE reboots and does the MOUNT command, DKA200's status remains in  limbo L >> on VELO (I beleive it is mount verifification failed, but not 100% sure). >> > I >   The disk on VELO should come back all by itself when BIKE reboots. Itb9 >doesn't need to be remounted as it was never dismounted.g > J >   If the status is "mount verification failed" it means that BIKE didn'tJ >reboot before MVTIMEOUT expired on VELO. Increase the value of MVTIMEOUT.F >I just set all of mine to 64000 seconds ( the maximum possible ). TheK >default is 1 hour, so I suspect either it takes BIKE a long time to rebootp: >or you've set this value substantially below the default. >i $ mc sysgen sho mvtimsG Parameter Name            Current    Default     Min.     Max.     Unito DynamicaL --------------            -------    -------    -------  -------   ----  --- ----H MVTIMEOUT                    3600       3600         1     64000 Seconds Dt $s6 Do you have LAT running? If so, do you see any errors:   $ mc latcp sho count   Node Name:  HELIUM  G Seconds Since Zeroed:        3846657           Multiple Node Addresses:e 0uG Messages Received:             38442               Duplicates Received:: 0:J Messages Transmitted:          43604               Messages Retransmitted: 00G Slots Received:                28708   I                llegal Messagesr Received:           0eD Slots Transmitted:             21356                   Illegal Slots Received:              0K Bytes Received:              1775120                Solicitations Accepted:: 0pJ Bytes Transmitted:           1641104               Solicitations Rejected: 0 E Multicast Bytes Rcvd:        5942925           Solicitation Failures:e 0 C Multicast Bytes Sent:        6356032               Transmit Errors:k 11C Multicast Messages Rcvd:       63928           Last Transmit Error:h 820 H Multicast Messages Sent:       64295           Virtual Circuit Timeouts: 0 K No Transmit Buffer:                0                       Discarded Output  Bytes:              0oF Multicast Messages Lost:           0                   User Data Lost: 0rK Multicast Send Failures:           0                       Resource Errors:v 0 L Controller Errors:                 0                       Incoming Solicits Accepted:          0H Last Controller Error:             0                   Incoming Solicits Rejected:          0     Protocol Errors Include -e3   Circuit was forced to halt:                     1e3   Repeat disconnect of slot by master:            2e   $ sho sys/clu/noprocI OpenVMS V7.2  on node ARGON  25-FEB-2001 12:22:46.65  Uptime  14 16:43:28i  J OpenVMS V7.2  on node HELIUM  25-FEB-2001 12:22:46.71  Uptime  44 12:37:00 $   K The reason I ask is that LAT is rather sensitive to network problems and ith
 could be thatm" your ethernet wiring might be bad.   >> >>F >> If VELO has $2$DKA200 mounted, and BIKE crashes, what should be the	 status ofg0 >> $2$DKA200 on VELO while BIKE is unavailable ? >> > + >   It should be "mounted,host unavailable"t >sD >> And what should the status be when BIKE becomes available again ? >  >   It should be "mounted".e >w Agreed  
 Hans Vlems   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:38:14 +0100b  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>G Subject: Now: Where are the VMS apps? Was: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessoro+ Message-ID: <VA.000002c8.7f702845@sture.ch>   M In article <s0Xl6.973$7n1.242238@paloalto-snr1.gtei.net>, Rick Cadruvi wrote: E > I do my email mostly with Outlook and my Web Browsing with Internetg > Explorer.uN > Why?  VMS doesn't easily support Email attachments and the Netscape versionsG > for VMS are CRAP (in fact, since V4.6, NETSCAPE has been too buggy inm > general).eN > I would rather use other stuff, but it isn't standardized and isn't as good.
 > I wish this  > wasn't true. BUT IT IS!!!0 > O Whilst I agree with the general tone of your message, I still refuse to go the  O Lookout route. Several comments this week on this newsgroup about the wretched tH thing insisting on posting in html at its own discretion reinforce that  opinion.  I You should see http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/8/17141.html for the XH latest reality check on Outlook. IMNSHO having the thing around is just $ waiting for some disaster to happen.  O There are alternatives, such as Opera, Eudora, HP's Openmail, and even pine on  O a Linux box. I use a product called Virtual Access, which had better support a 6M few years ago, but despite its foibles still serves me well most of the time.t ___S
 Paul Sture SwitzerlandS   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2001 22:01:22 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>K Subject: Re: Now: Where are the VMS apps? Was: 1.2 GHz Alpha Microprocessor - Message-ID: <87zofac159.fsf@prep.synonet.com>n  " Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch> writes:  O > In article <s0Xl6.973$7n1.242238@paloalto-snr1.gtei.net>, Rick Cadruvi wrote:   > > > I do my email mostly with Outlook and my Web Browsing with> > > Internet Explorer.  Why?  VMS doesn't easily support EmailD > > attachments and the Netscape versions for VMS are CRAP (in fact,A > > since V4.6, NETSCAPE has been too buggy in general).  I wouldaB > > rather use other stuff, but it isn't standardized and isn't as0 > > good.  I wish this wasn't true. BUT IT IS!!!  F > Whilst I agree with the general tone of your message, I still refuse= > to go the Lookout route. Several comments this week on thiseD > newsgroup about the wretched thing insisting on posting in html at, > its own discretion reinforce that opinion.  K > You should see http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/8/17141.html for the  J > latest reality check on Outlook. IMNSHO having the thing around is just & > waiting for some disaster to happen.  C > There are alternatives, such as Opera, Eudora, HP's Openmail, and B > even pine on a Linux box. I use a product called Virtual Access,C > which had better support a few years ago, but despite its foiblesl( > still serves me well most of the time.  @ Look at the headers. I use my Linux GW box for news, e-mail etc.  > We REALLY need to get emacs sorted well for VMS... Add item of choice to the list...c   -- o< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.l@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 10:03:58 -0600T+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>s0 Subject: RE: QUESTION: BZIP2 For OpenVMS Anyone?N Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284E53@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>  4 > Has anyone looked at the porting BZIP2 to OpenVMS? >    Pointer to BZIP2 for OpenVMS:s/ http://www.decus.de:8080/www/vms/sw/bzip2.htmlx    Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanto Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660e Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----< From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@earthlink.net] Sent: February 24, 2001 8:53 PMg To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coms0 Subject: Re: QUESTION: BZIP2 For OpenVMS Anyone?     Robert Alan Byer wrote:e > 
 > Question...o > 4 > Has anyone looked at the porting BZIP2 to OpenVMS? > 4 > (The "offical" WWW page with source for this is atF > http://sources.redhat.com/bzip2/index.html if anyone is interested.) > K > I've been seeing this format more and more lately in software development?E > and was interested in knowing if anyone has a OpenVMS version sincerL > unpacking files on a PC and then transfering them is getting to be a pain. > 	 > Thanks.d  G I thought I'd seen bzip2 for OpenVMS somewhere. Like most UN*X portees, F it's likely to not support RMS. So, after unpacking an archive, you'llF likely need to make your own decision(s) on how to SET FILE/ATTRIBUTESE for each file you unpack. Even a ".tbz" (.tar_bz) archive could stilllF present this problem, since the source system was likely not one which
 supports RMS.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems5 http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o  F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged..   ------------------------------   Date: 25 Feb 2001 15:56:31 GMT+ From: richardjmaher@aol.com (RICHARDJMAHER) 1 Subject: Re: RTR now licesnsed as part of OpenVMSa: Message-ID: <20010225105631.04703.00002135@ng-fe1.aol.com>  K >I don't know where their information is from, but it's wrong.  I happen toe >knownJ >a large site using tuxedo 6.5 on vms with some success.  Perhaps the  rdbJ >folks are just bitter cause they never made their product XA compliant so' >tux could do 2-phase commits with rdb.r >s >jim  O I think the suggestion is that 6.5 was not a complete version and it's the lastg one you'll see of VMS.  K From:  Bill Gettys <Bill.GettysFROMoracle.com> Save Address - Block Sender 2& Reply-To:  oraclerdbLISTSERVERjcc.com - To:  oraclerdbLISTSERVERjcc.com Save Address  5 Subject:  Re: RDB and XA Support with TUXEDO on OVMS m' Date:  Fri, 01 Sep 2000 11:27:33 -0400 u6 Reply Reply All Forward  Delete  Previous Next  Close      Richard and Yves,o  M Please look at the BEA web site for their list of supported platforms.  There  isO no entry for OpenVMS as either a supported or planned platform for version 7.1,u
 their latest.'  5 See http://www.bea.com/products/tuxedo/platforms.htmli  M The only releases that ever supported OpenVMS were their versions 6.5 and 6.4rN (client support only).  They support VMS version 7.2 with version 7.1 binaries only.u  7 See http://www.bea.com/products/tuxedo/platforms_6.html   O Some of our engineers believe it would take a tremendous amount of work for RdbhH to support Tuxedo and would potentially destabilize the code for all ourI customers.  The resources we would have to devote to that effort would bee betterM utilized on other projects that have more immediate benefit to more customers N IMHO.  I am not encouraged to change my mind when I read that Tuxedo no longer seems interested in OpenVMS.   BillJ   ------------------------------------------------------------------------   Richard Maher wrote:   > Hi,B >AL > I just got the Ok from Yves Lhrault to enter his comments here FYI. I for > one am concerned!0 > D > I don't understand how there could have been heaps of money for XAK > compliance in Rdb/Tru64 yet Rdb/VMS continues to be starved of the budget I > for this and other functionality, even though it was Rdb/*V.M.S* users'-2 > license fees that paid for Rdb/Tru64 and Rdb/NT. >rM > But then I find it absolutely inconceivable that no one from Oracle Rdb gotrD > in touch with Yves let alone replied to his question here. But I'mG > forgetting listserver etiquette and that this is not a formal supportn
 > channel :-(i >aM > (I've always found it curious that it's inevitably non-JCC people that feelrG > compelled, and in a position, to don the List Server Sheriff's badge)s >iL > Could someone please pass this on to Bill Gettys if he does not subscribe.F > He was right, on this occassion, about XA in Rdb/VMS needing to take > priority over TIP. >eH > Is it true that the XA code for Rdb/VMS is already in situ but is just
 > turned off?  >m > Regards Richard Maher. >l > I asked Yves :-e >aK > > Would it be OK for me to reproduce your mail in the comp.os.vms and Rdbr > List > > Server forums? >i > -----Original Message-----7 > From: Yves Lhrault [mailto:yves.lheraultFROMbea.com]d) > Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2000 7:04 PM  > To: Richard Mahera! > Subject: Re: DECdtm enhancemento >c
 > Hi Richard,r< > Sorry for not responding immediatly : been at customer ...M > No problem with quoting me in a technical discussion. My point here is with-I > rdb not supporting XA, it is very difficult to think of any applicationSM > spanning multiple DBs if RDB is one of them. So, exit Rdb. And it's a pity,  > because RDB users love it !0 > Best regards > Yves >o0 > From: Yves Lhrault <yves.lheraultFROMbea.com> > To: <maher_rjFROMhotmail.com>w5 > Subject: Re: RDB and XA Support with TUXEDO on OVMSn' > Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 20:45:07 +0200H >  > Hi Richard > (comments embedded)m >  > > Hi Yves, > >bN > > I was waiting for someone from Oracle to reply to you but I guess it's notN > > going to happen. (At least publicly). It appears that the torrent of ODBC,C > > OCI, SQL/services queries is taking up all available bandwidth.: >C) > I expected some reply for Oracle too...0 >2K > > >So, what's new here : I've a customer wanting to run RDB 7 with TUXEDOh' > > >and support transactions using XA.r >oF > > Who is the customer? (Worth a try :-) and what *exactly* are theirH > > requirements? Was it you or them that first mentioned TUXEDO and XA? >hM > The customer is a large (over 100K employees) French company, already a BEAiK > customer (that's why I didn't use "prospect" or "potential customer" ;-))fL > for TUXEDO. They recently decided to port some of their old apps to TUXEDOK > on OpenVMS and required some advice. As they're using RDB, they expect tonJ > continue using it. And they're thinking of integrating with other DBs in > the near future, hence XA. > 3 > > >Is the full support of XA now availbale in RDBc >gL > > NO! Rdb engineering is looking at it. Apparently the XA (Transarc EncinaN > > compatible) code is, sorry was, available on TRU64. If Rdb lifted a fingerG > > to help with a *decent* XA version of DECdtm then we may be gettingr > > somewhere on VMS.b >tM > I don't want to enter any war here against engineering. While there were nodN > or few customers requiring XA, I understand the economics of not developpingM > it. But now, it would help a lot. The only references I found on XA/RDB are 4 > dated 1998 and things do not seem to have evolved. > = > > >(that is allowing different processes to start/commit) ?  > K > > YES! Rdb/VMS has had this functionality/capability for about *10* T E N  > > years. DECnet-work wide! >-I > I've been a deccie for years and I know DECdtm (liked it) and RdB. JustH  > want to go one step further... >R > >n > > Regards Richard Maher. >t > best regards > Yves >a   >g >@ >s >E >n   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Feb 2001 01:02:35 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>9 Subject: Re: So what Are we meant to use on the 'desktop' - Message-ID: <87n1baae6s.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   + fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:    > OpenVMS in desktop ?   > - FireWire- PCI-Firewire cards available. Needs a driver.    > - DVDA< Yes, in the right box. Writing as well, from what Hoff said.  	 > - CD-RW  Yes. PLus infoserver writing.2   > - USB:B F888 no. Do you REALLY want to replace all your existing printers, modems, GPS,... etc etc?   > - Citrix clientP Why? 1   > - Star Office1/ Ask Sun. BTW, I have no use for such a package.R   -- 1< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 17:38:01 GMTe4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>9 Subject: Re: So what Are we meant to use on the 'desktop'o= Message-ID: <Zpbm6.11523$CW1.8866923@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>   9 "Paul Repacholi" <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote in messager' news:87n1baae6s.fsf@prep.synonet.com...n <snip> > > - Star Officei1 > Ask Sun. BTW, I have no use for such a package.c  E I came, I installed, I deleted. That said, Compaq has a team of folks K working on StarOrifice for OpenVMS as we speak. This is an outside project, F e.g. not formally sanctioned and not being done during regular workingJ hours. For those who appreciate ye olde ironic twist, it would do O. HenryL proud to see Sun officeware running on an Alpha box when "Strategic Partner"8 Microsoft shafted DECpaq on the MS-Office on Alpha deal.   cheers,   F Terry "What do you call a Microsoft Business Partner? An ORGAN DONOR!" Shannon    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 10:11:02 +0000o) From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com>e# Subject: Re: Starting from scratch.l, Message-ID: <3A98DA36.788A4D72@infopuls.com>   Dave Gaukroger wrote:e > , > Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> wrote: > C > > A nice warm hello! Hope we can make you new life as comfortableo > > as possible.@ > > Would you like to explain a little bit further what you mean( > > with ftp and http? Client or server? > M > A bit of each actually. Client at first, but as I become more familiar withoJ > VMS I'd like the VLC to take on more of a server role on a home network. > N > I've now got my hands on a VT520 and bought the beast to life. It is runningM > VMS 5.5-2 and has 24Mb installed so I'm practically doing cartwheels at the-# > moment as it churns away happily.  > L > Thanks for your info so far here and in the group in general. It's nice toN > read a group where the conversations are worth reading and the people giving4 > the answers really know what they're talking about >  > Cheers >  > Dave  : Although you didn't ask for, one thought you may take into consideration:2 - putting in a lot more disk space may not be easy@ - fileserving is not the primary strength of VMS and this box in
 particular< - ftp is pretty uncomfortable you'll sooner or later want to@ upgrade to nfs or another fileserving protocol depending on what your client stations are using= - if possible use Ethernet and X11 additionally to your VT520e@ then you even don't have to sit in front of the VLC to manage it   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.112 ************************