0 INFO-VAX	Wed, 24 Jan 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 48      Contents: Re: About X-Windows x ICA/RDP  All microsoft web sites offline 5 Re: Another CNET Story On IBM's Software Rejuvenation  Re: Another missed opportunity Re: Another missed opportunity Re: Another missed opportunity Re: Another missed opportunity Re: Another missed opportunity Re: Another missed opportunity Re: Another missed opportunity! Re: Calculate a percentage in DCL A Re: Compaq continues the Digital Tradition & numbers,sayings etc. , Compaq full year results (was OpenVMS Times)4 Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 RE: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution4 RE: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution Re: Copying disk ? Re: dec 3000 300 crashing  Re: dec 3000 300 crashing  Re: dec 3000 300 crashing  Re: dec 3000 300 crashing 6 Re: Device Driver Engineers Needed-Great Opportunity!!& Re: Documentation about check$checksum Re: EUREX and CBOT New System " Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS." Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS." Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS." Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS." Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS." Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS. GNUPG 1.02 -> 1.04 ??  Re: GS160 hardware question  RE: GS160 hardware question  Re: GS160 hardware question  RE: GS160 hardware question  Re: GS160 hardware question  RE: GS160 hardware question  Re: Image Monitor?6 Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform6 RE: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform6 Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform6 Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform6 Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform6 Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform$ Re: Linux worm and RedHat 7.0 broken Re: make Memo:  Help! Zip/Unzip error Re: MIME in a DCL procedure ! Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line ! Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line ! Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line ! Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line 4 Re: No technical computing, was: expanding the niche4 Re: No technical computing, was: expanding the niche Re: NTP network load Re: NTP on VMS 7.1 Re: Printing problems in TCPIP Re: QuixoticVMS? Re: QuixoticVMS? Re: QuixoticVMS?+ Rdb structure recovery after backup/noimage / Re: Rdb structure recovery after backup/noimage / Re: Rdb structure recovery after backup/noimage E Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardware E Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardware P Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardware   questionN Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion)N Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion)N Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion)N Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion) SHAREWARE: txt2pdf 4.3. Re: stop decw$session = kill SUN CDE server...0 Re: Timme difference between two kinds of BACKUP- Re: Urgent:Error recovering files from backup  Re: VMS bug in 21st Century 7 Re: VMS vs UNIX (was: Linux worm and RedHat 7.0 broken)  RE: VMS writable CD on Win2K?  RE: VMS writable CD on Win2K?  Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?  Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?  Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?  Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K? ! Re: Why is the tape write locked? : Re: [Q]: Resetting privileged password on a DECserver 200?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:12:28 -0500 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> & Subject: Re: About X-Windows x ICA/RDP, Message-ID: <94mo07$6l8h$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  L XDMCP and the XDM server are both in the new TCPIP services for VMS.  I justI installed it last week, and have a full CDE session running on my PC from 4 excursion to my local VMS system.  No fuss, no muss.      D Paul Repacholi wrote in message <87y9w23vdl.fsf@prep.synonet.com>...* >david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb) writes: > 
 >> In article A <OF59BADBDF.F0EE2474-ON032569DD.00635348@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, + fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:  > L >> >a) The current protocol X-Windows  is a little bit complex to start. On= >> >ly >> >you and me know how L >> >to do, but for the end-user, it should be much more simpler. I dont bel= >> >ieve >> >in end-usersL >> >using  $ create/terminal comands to startup a session. It's why is need= >> >ed a >> >simpler protocol.  >> > >>2 >> So as a system manager hide it from your users. >>; >> There are as far as I am aware two ways of doing this :-  >>G >> 1) Use XDMCP which allows you to choose which system to connect to -  which I G >> believe will setup the Display correctly for you. I haven't actually 
 tried thisJ >> since UCX has not supported the XDMCP code necessary - supposedly fixed in next  >> version of TCPIP services.  > E >Fabio has a valid point. I've llong thought that the Session Manager  >has it brass ackwards.  > G >I click on apps, on decterm... and use the options to though it across H >the planet! The number of times I've wanted to do that, I think I couldD >count on the fingers of one thumb. Now doing the inverse, give me a terminalH >running on that remote machine, that one I would use every day! Several >times.  >  >-- = >Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd., 8 >+61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.A >                                             West Australia 6076 / >Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:35:04 +0000 % From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> ( Subject: All microsoft web sites offline8 Message-ID: <prit6tkuvi45r7dj3b7btgvrnhev8kujl1@4ax.com>  F All Microsoft web sites are curently offline. Here is the message from5 the UK website which is online but not serving pages:       ? Microsoft is currently experiencing issues with its web sites:  E Microsoft.com, MSN.com, MSNBC.com, WindowsMedia.com, Encarta.com and  E Carpoint.com. Users may experience delays in being able to connect to  these F sites. Microsoft.co.uk and MSN.co.uk are currently unaffected by this  problem.  D Microsoft is working to resolve these issues speedily and you should try  again later.  @ Microsoft apologises for any inconvenience this may have caused.  
 Sincerely,   The Microsoft UK Online team.     C Also see story at http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/16321.html   8 Oh dear, oh dear. I have just confirmed we cannot access www.microsoft.com    --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 12:46:35 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> > Subject: Re: Another CNET Story On IBM's Software RejuvenationH Message-ID: <y47l3lyxyc.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  + leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie) writes:   < > Products like this are institutionalizing bad programming.   Indeed!    	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 02:05:56 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunity , Message-ID: <3A6E7EC6.51C8DF70@videotron.ca>   Robert Deininger wrote:   > I think your ears are plugged.  * I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong.    ] > Last month, Compaq folks said that "business critical" (VMS, Tru64, and Tandem) is far more ] > profitable than "industry standard" (Wintel).  And in business critical, VMS is the biggest  >chunk of profit.   H Do you have precise numbers ? Since VMS was not mentioned in neither theL documents not the conference call, I doubt that one can draw any conclusionsG about where the profits are coming from in terms of individual business  critical servers.     N statements obviously came from a previous time period.   By the way, they wereN saying last month that just over 50% of revenue came from Enterprise systems.  Is it really up to 90% now?   U 51% of revenus come from enterprise sales. 91% of profits come from enterprise sales.   M However, what you have to realise is that "enterprise sales"  include all the H wintel servers such as those Proliant things and the relabeled Unisys 32 processor thingies.   9 > So the barely-profitable side of the business grew 24%.   N No, the wintel side of the highly profitable sector grew grew by 24% while theN business critical (unix, tandem, vms) side of that same profitable sector grew# 17% (but no growth year over year).   b > JF, I might have said this before, but I think you would bitch if they hung you with a new rope.  N Well, I was told to be patient and wait for Compaq's announcement where CompaqN would be "forced" to admit that it gets its profits from VMS since the PC side is so down.   N But Compaq was spun this into "our commercial wintel is way up  and we've alsoL had successes with hymalaya and unix"  which sheltered us from the difficult residential PC market.  M Capellas mentioned a lot of his succesful products in the enterprise area, as 8 well as its Ipaq packet machine. But didn't mention VMS.    I How much longer will you continue to deny that Compaq refuses to take all ) possibilie opportunities to mention VMS ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 01:47:20 -0500 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunity L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2401010147200001@user-2iveaup.dialup.mindspring.com>  [ In article <3A6E1D56.14E848AF@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:   C > I listened to the Compaq press release for its financial results.  > C > Enterprise Systems:  24% growth in industry standard (aka wintel) B >                                 17% growth in business critical. > T > So it is clear that when Compaq says "enterprise", it really measn wintel servers.   I think your ears are plugged.   Without the detailed numbers, it is hard to say much.  I think you have twisted your spin to grind your favorite axe.  I'll wait for Terry Shannon to summarize the numbers.  L > So, when they say that Enterprise systems provide compaq with 90% of theirP > revenus, it does not mean that VMS is that profitable since the large chunk of, > enterprise sales are in fact wintel sales.  Last month, Compaq folks said that "business critical" (VMS, Tru64, and Tandem) is far more profitable than "industry standard" (Wintel).  And in business critical, VMS is the biggest chunk of profit.  I couldn't write fast enough to get the numbers on paper, so I can't give details.  And the statements obviously came from a previous time period.   By the way, they were saying last month that just over 50% of revenue came from Enterprise systems.  Is it really up to 90% now?   7 So the barely-profitable side of the business grew 24%.   v And the hugely profitable stuff grew "only" 17%.  Oh, woe is me!  I wonder how much additional profit that adds up to?  ` JF, I might have said this before, but I think you would bitch if they hung you with a new rope.   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:34:09 +0000 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunity * Message-ID: <3A6ECBC1.8725470D@uk.sun.com>   Robert Deininger wrote:  > ] > In article <3A6E1D56.14E848AF@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  > E > > I listened to the Compaq press release for its financial results.  > > E > > Enterprise Systems:  24% growth in industry standard (aka wintel) D > >                                 17% growth in business critical. > > V > > So it is clear that when Compaq says "enterprise", it really measn wintel servers. >     > I think your ears are plugged.  * JF seems to have hit the nail on the head.  " Just look at the revenue breakdown  A Compaqs total HW server revenue for 2000 was ~9.5 billion dollars = Of that UNIX, Tru64 and Linux Systems contributed 2.2 billion  Tandem 1.1 billion OpenVMS 678 million   @ So the non Wintel boxes contributed ~40% to Compaqs revenues and> the Wintel boxes ~60%. This is being kind because the 2.2 UNIX@ systems included 350 odd million of Linux systems revenue which C was on Intel boxes. Linux was Compaqs fastest growing OS platform.    ? This also explains why VMS is always last to any marketing etc  @ etc because it has the lowest % of Compaqs total product revenue split for Compaqs servers.     Regards  Andrew Harrison  Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:01:46 -0500 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunity L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2401010901460001@user-2ive6g5.dialup.mindspring.com>  [ In article <3A6E7EC6.51C8DF70@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:    > Robert Deininger wrote:  > _ > > Last month, Compaq folks said that "business critical" (VMS, Tru64, and Tandem) is far more _ > > profitable than "industry standard" (Wintel).  And in business critical, VMS is the biggest  > >chunk of profit.  > J > Do you have precise numbers ? Since VMS was not mentioned in neither theN > documents not the conference call, I doubt that one can draw any conclusionsI > about where the profits are coming from in terms of individual business  > critical servers.   oAs I said, I didn't scribble fast enough.  The slide was only shown for a few seconds.  I did manage to get ">50% revenue from enterprise".  Numbers in the billions were given for the various pieces, and VMS was the biggest.  IIRC, I think they detailed the revenues, not the profits, for the pieces.  But the verbal comment was that VMS was also the most profitable.      P > statements obviously came from a previous time period.   By the way, they wereP > saying last month that just over 50% of revenue came from Enterprise systems.  > Is it really up to 90% now?  > W > 51% of revenus come from enterprise sales. 91% of profits come from enterprise sales.   d Ok, that's consistent with what I heard.  The non-enterprise stuff seems to barely be breaking even.   O > However, what you have to realise is that "enterprise sales"  include all the J > wintel servers such as those Proliant things and the relabeled Unisys 32 > processor thingies.  > ; > > So the barely-profitable side of the business grew 24%.  > P > No, the wintel side of the highly profitable sector grew grew by 24% while theP > business critical (unix, tandem, vms) side of that same profitable sector grew% > 17% (but no growth year over year).   /Yes, those are the numbers you gave.  But what I heard last month is that business critical is much more profitable per unit of sales.  I'm adding what you heard and what I heard together.  I still say 17% growth is good.  If it wasn't year over year, what was it?  Just one quarter?  Was it annualized?    P > But Compaq was spun this into "our commercial wintel is way up  and we've alsoN > had successes with hymalaya and unix"  which sheltered us from the difficult > residential PC market. > O > Capellas mentioned a lot of his succesful products in the enterprise area, as : > well as its Ipaq packet machine. But didn't mention VMS.  xSurely the point of this presentation was to convince people that Compaq had a good quarter, yes?  I expect they don't want to sound too off-the-wall, to avoid scaring all the analysts.  Still, I agree with you he should have mentioned VMS.  I think his understanding of VMS is growing only slowly.  But on the bright side, he didn't say anything nasty about it either, right?  K > How much longer will you continue to deny that Compaq refuses to take all + > possibilie opportunities to mention VMS ?   I don't deny that they don't take ALL possible opportunities.  But they do occasionally take SOME opportunities.  Last month in NYC, for one.  You can't give them and "F" for this, if they made the analysts happy.  Maybe a "C".  As long as the analysts are happy, there will be other opportunities to focus on good products like VMS.  If Capellas had said more than 2 sentences about VMS, I bet the analysts would have been scared, and that would have been worse.o   -- i Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.come   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:05:07 -0500p2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunityiL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2401010905070001@user-2ive6g5.dialup.mindspring.com>  \ In article <3A6ECBC1.8725470D@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:   > Robert Deininger wrote:n > > _ > > In article <3A6E1D56.14E848AF@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:u > > G > > > I listened to the Compaq press release for its financial results.e > > >dG > > > Enterprise Systems:  24% growth in industry standard (aka wintel)uF > > >                                 17% growth in business critical. > > > X > > > So it is clear that when Compaq says "enterprise", it really measn wintel servers. > >  > " > > I think your ears are plugged. > , > JF seems to have hit the nail on the head. > $ > Just look at the revenue breakdown > C > Compaqs total HW server revenue for 2000 was ~9.5 billion dollarss? > Of that UNIX, Tru64 and Linux Systems contributed 2.2 billioni > Tandem 1.1 billion > OpenVMS 678 million  > B > So the non Wintel boxes contributed ~40% to Compaqs revenues and@ > the Wintel boxes ~60%. This is being kind because the 2.2 UNIXB > systems included 350 odd million of Linux systems revenue which E > was on Intel boxes. Linux was Compaqs fastest growing OS platform. a  PIf I understand your numbers (and if I believe them), you are talking about hardware revenue.  The compaq folks are also interested in PROFIT.  The high-volume, high-profit stuff is not as profitable.  Also, talking about hardware revenue while ignoring software and services revenue (which is what I think you are doing here) is silly.   -- a Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comp   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:08:44 +0000e0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunity * Message-ID: <3A6EEFFC.9F38483C@uk.sun.com>   Robert Deininger wrote:  > ^ > In article <3A6ECBC1.8725470D@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: >  > > Robert Deininger wrote:t > > > a > > > In article <3A6E1D56.14E848AF@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  > > >yI > > > > I listened to the Compaq press release for its financial results.e > > > >oI > > > > Enterprise Systems:  24% growth in industry standard (aka wintel)nH > > > >                                 17% growth in business critical. > > > > Z > > > > So it is clear that when Compaq says "enterprise", it really measn wintel servers. > > >( > >R$ > > > I think your ears are plugged. > >n. > > JF seems to have hit the nail on the head. > >q& > > Just look at the revenue breakdown > >VE > > Compaqs total HW server revenue for 2000 was ~9.5 billion dollars A > > Of that UNIX, Tru64 and Linux Systems contributed 2.2 billionp > > Tandem 1.1 billion > > OpenVMS 678 millione > > D > > So the non Wintel boxes contributed ~40% to Compaqs revenues andB > > the Wintel boxes ~60%. This is being kind because the 2.2 UNIXC > > systems included 350 odd million of Linux systems revenue whichnF > > was on Intel boxes. Linux was Compaqs fastest growing OS platform. > a > If I understand your numbers (and if I believe them), you are talking about hardware revenue.  hA The compaq folks are also interested in PROFIT.  The high-volume,d high-profit stuff is not as-A  profitable.  Also, talking about hardware revenue while ignoring  software and services revenue 5  (which is what I think you are doing here) is silly.c  A The numbers are HW revenue and you are right they do not include lA profitability, nor do they include services revenues for example.n  > But services revenues are interesting because you can maintain; healthy services revenues, as Compaq have without spending  : anything on marketing the HW on which the services depend.  = In fact if you are cynical you could argue that it is againstp< Compaqs interest to market new Alpha boxes to their existing< OpenVMS customers because they may buy small new machines to: replace old large machines with the small systems having a) corrosponding reduction in service costs.m  ? You are probably right that OpenVMS is profitable, though theret  are some factors to think about.  @ Firstly OpenVMS shares a platform with Tru64 and it is doubtfull9 the OpenVMS would be profitable if this was not the case.s  8 Secondly Compaq spends virtually nothing on OpenVMS this7 considerably assists it in being profitable. If Compaq a8 wanted to increase OpenVMS's revenues they would have to1 invest and the payback would not be immediate or e3 guaranteed. This consideration may explain Compaqs h inactivity with OpenVMS.   Regardst Andrew Harrison  Enterprise IT Architectt   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:39:09 +0000n% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>v' Subject: Re: Another missed opportunitye8 Message-ID: <g7tt6toisp02dr4o9tesdpverujfv7e3dc@4ax.com>  E On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:01:46 -0500, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert! Deininger) wrote:s    0>Yes, those are the numbers you gave.  But what I heard last month is that business critical is much more profitable per unit of sales.  I'm adding what you heard and what I heard together.  I still say 17% growth is good.  If it wasn't year over year, what was it?  Just one quarter?  Was it annualized? >   Q >> But Compaq was spun this into "our commercial wintel is way up  and we've also6O >> had successes with hymalaya and unix"  which sheltered us from the difficult- >> residential PC market., >> aP >> Capellas mentioned a lot of his succesful products in the enterprise area, as; >> well as its Ipaq packet machine. But didn't mention VMS.n >8c >Surely the point of this presentation was to convince people that Compaq had a good quarter, yes? iY > I expect they don't want to sound too off-the-wall, to avoid scaring all the analysts. s8 > Still, I agree with you he should have mentioned VMS. : > I think his understanding of VMS is growing only slowly.O >  But on the bright side, he didn't say anything nasty about it either, right?a  F Come on if he had actually *said* *something nasty all hell would haveB broken loose. He's managed to actually be nasty but with plausible* deniability. I don't believe he is stupid.  D Capellas is *well* aware of the sensitivity of VMS customers and theD issue of mentioning everything other than VMS in end of year reports@ has explicitly been raised before. There is no excuse this time.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:00:26 GMTn* From: Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com>* Subject: Re: Calculate a percentage in DCL) Message-ID: <94mqm4$5g5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>I  ) In article <94kjul$a05$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,3   trdorr@my-deja.com wrote:mG > Thanks for all the input. This has been very helpful. This answers my G > question as my calculation is only from a text file and not in regard  > to disk size.-  F Why are you using the text output as opposed to the lexical functions?@ The lexical functions give exactly what you want, conveninently,D without having to take the trouble to open, read, parse, and close a> text file. The lexical functions also give you *current* data.   > Tomn > >yF > >   Use the DCL commands OPEN/READ/CLOSE to get the records from theH > > text file. Extract the interesting portion from each record and thenE > > use the built in DCL math ( integer only ) to do the calculation,  eg:k' > > (assumes text file is called x.txt)r > >i > > $open/read inpfile x.txt > > $read inpfile rec1 > > $read inpfile rec2 > > $close inpfile! > > $amt1 = f$element(1,":",rec1)h! > > $amt2 = f$element(1,":",rec2)o > > $pct = 100*amt1/amt2 > > $write sys$output pctm > > $v > >y > >  >m > Sent via Deja.como > http://www.deja.com/ >    --F NOTE: If you wish to e-mail me, please do NOT use the deja address. ItD is not a valid address. Instead, use the address below, removing the long wrong part first. Thanks.n   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman  &-)( afeldman@gfigroup.ButItSaidItPrinted.com     Sent via Deja.coms http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:37:08 +0000 (UTC)l' From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@tukki.jyu.fi>%J Subject: Re: Compaq continues the Digital Tradition & numbers,sayings etc.+ Message-ID: <94mi9k$us$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>s  ' Charles Sebold <sebold@lcms.org> wrote:   < > Sorry, I suppose I should have used digits, to be clear...  H (This has gone out of subject sorry, but) Why don't we use prefixes thatC everyone agrees with: Giga etc. Gigadollars, G$, ... 5G$ ? (not $5Bh- B is no standard. Only B=byte comes to mind.)g  G > many of the European languages appear to have similar words that means& > 1000 times more than our words mean.  J With Billion 1000 times, with Trillion 1000000 times etc. Right formula of4 "illions" is of course: xyz-illion = million ^ xyz .>                         bi   llion = million ^ bi  = 1000000^2>                         tri  llion = million ^ tri = 1000000^3                         ...lI We have saying that "Everything is bigger in America" but the big numbersi  are much smaller in America. :-)   ...-J > Last I heard, they made 500 000 000 US dollars or more from investing in > Akamai alone.b  H So Apple has plenty of money, but if they don't adapt to MS world, money2 may soon be gone. PC-Compaq may feel the same way?  & >>> Steve Jobs _has_ cozied up to (MS)( >>                    ^^^^^^^^^      ;-)   > In case that wasn't clear,...tC Very clear. Smiley was because I understood that very well (englishiA expressions tend to be difficult for me) and agreed and liked the ) expression (it's cozy). Simply bulls eye.i   regardsa              Osmo Kujala   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:46:57 +0000n% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com> 5 Subject: Compaq full year results (was OpenVMS Times)h8 Message-ID: <6f6t6to0ditokticnco9i6gcpkh5init10@4ax.com>  E On 24 Jan 2001 03:03:57 +0800, Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>t wrote:    B >STSDAS, and TABLES, the software foundation for HST are no longerF >supported for VMS. I'm expecting IRAF to drop VMS in the next release& >or two, or in the next major release. > I >STARLINK dropped VMS years ago. And it was started and developed on VMS.m > A >The other favorite in astronomy is IDL. Is it available for VMS?i >,D >SO good bye astronomy, and that will probably soon include Harvard,0 >and good bye getting VMS into any new projects.  F At the end of year report Capellas failed to mention VMS but mentionedE every other Compaq OS yesterday including Himalaya. He even mentionedmC the recent stock exchange wins which involved both Himalaya and VMSrD but guess which one he mentioned and which one he didn't...  I thinkD it's time I reluctantly concluded that I'm wasting my time promotingD the best OS there is internally. Despite the VMS groups best effortsF and the end of direct attacks on VMS from DEC/Compaq senior managementD it seems clear that the policy is really only to allow VMS to slowlyB fade away rather than kill it rapidly. All it needed was the words@ "and OpenVMS continues to contribute towards Alphaserver sales."C Nothing more than that - although more would be nice. That Capellas 4 can't even bring himself to say this speaks volumes.  F We were told last year that mentioning  Windows, Unix, Tandem/HimalayaD but not VMS was an error. We were told that there would be an end toB the omissions of VMS in Compaq speeches and literature. It appears  that was a lie. It's deliberate.  F Anyone considering brand new VMS installations after this must be someD kind of masochist. OK I'm feeling incredibly pissed off this morningA but why should I continue to argue that we migrate over a billiontF dollars of US manufacturing business from VAX/VMS to Alpha VMS when it@ would be far easier to join the crowd arguing for SAP on HP - HPB already being our corporate Unix standard.  Not a single minute ofF production was lost during the VAX to Alpha migration of five EuropeanE manufacturing plants and this turned the possibility of saving VMS innE the US plants from zero to around 50%. I'd say after yesterday we arex back near zero again.   F I have tried to be positive for the last year since Capellas surprisedF me  by answering email and directing someone to look into our concerns@ but really it's just the bedbug letter. In the words of The Who: "Won't get fooled again."   A Thanks very much Compaq. Richard Marcello I wish you luck. You're0D trying to do the best you can - the positive VMS literature reachingD existing customers is very encouraging (The VMS Top Dog brochure wasB excellent - bet Capellas has never even seen it) but anything thatC comes from elsewhere in Compaq is still as upsetting as ever. VMS -o= The OS that Compaq forgot. And maybe it's time I did as well.f  
 Alan GreigC - speaking personally and not on behalf of my employer or any othert+ group or organisation I may be a member of.i   >iE >Sad thing is, VMS is I consider a better base than the rest. LeavinghH >price etc aside, the only thing VMS misses is documened stuff for doing >your own CLI. >nJ >What is the status of PIPELINE and the calibation stuff Bob, do you know?   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 06:49:00 GMTd  From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@home.com>= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution 8 Message-ID: <l9us6to2n3i4p2ufcc9sp3u6m8192og2i6@4ax.com>  3 On Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:48:58 +0000, andrew harrisonI! <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:u   >o >h4 >Sorry but you are wrong and were wrong at the time.  E You know, AH, I now believe you're nothing but a *complete* idiot.  ImD don't usually get down to calling  names, but you've just pushed tooE far.  If you want to make statements like this, you better be willings( ot pull up the postings that prove this.   >s5 >You cited a specific case which you said proved yourn4 >general point about the effects of rebooting a node >in an OpenVMS cluster.  >u3 >Various posters had allready also posted specific w2 >examples from their experience which had allready >disproved your general point.  B I have managed and configured 100s of clusters.  it is YOU who areF taking a few special cases and stating that they apply in general, and6 YOU ARE WRONG!!!  And you have NEVER proved otherwise.  > It is amazing how you can lose an argument, and then come back3 weeks/months later and state the opposite.  sheesh!w   >77 >The fact that you appeared to be unable to comprehend n4 >that all apps and all user populations don't behave. >in the same fashion as in your experience is 5 >unfortunate but something that you will have to lived >with.  > No, now you are twisting things again.  You have no ability toE comprehend that all apps and all user populations don't behave as youwA think.  I never said that *all* will, but I did say that the vast = majority, and imho this is over 90% of the applications, willm> definitely operate as I have described.  And I don't make this? statement lightly, either.  I have seen many, many applications D (probably at least 1500) and have only seen rare instances of things5 that don't work as well as we'd like in a VMScluster.   C Now, unless you have suddently achieved over 15 years of experienceo9 that disproves this, you have a lot of work ahead of you.g   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:45:43 +0000S0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solutionu* Message-ID: <3A6EB257.765F498D@uk.sun.com>   Christof Brass wrote:  > : > World, I hate this subject! Has this anything to do with@ > clusters? Has this anything to do with affordability? Has this> > anything to do with simplicity? Has this anything to do with
 > Compaq?? >  > andrew harrison wrote: > >  > > Christof Brass wrote:a? > > > Why do you ask for this proprietary M$ stuff like WindowsoC > > > Terminal Server? You will get a fat client which is obviouslyoD > > > not the solution of the future. Stated that, what's wrong withA > > > X11? As far as I know the other solutions (Windows Terminali' > > > Server, ICA Citrix, WinFrame) are-= > > > re-invent-the-wheel-approaches. Do we really need that?  > >i< > > Well firstly providing a Citrix or Tarantella client for= > > OpenVMS would not be providing a FAT client, both of theme9 > > are thin clients. The Tarantella Java client is about2? > > 250K of Java classes that persist after you have downloadedt/ > > them for the first time using say netscape.t > >< > A > Depends on the definition of thin client. The SUN Java solution>? > is a no-brainer. You need additionally a JVM. You need a veryi: > fast machine. You get low speed. Forget it! Where is the' > Java-In-Silicon? Where is the JavaOS?l >   3 How very revealing. You in another thread appear toi1 want people to believe that you know a lot about h% Java and then you come out with this.m  0 Yes of course you need a JVM but then if you are. running a browser anyway you probably could do/ with a JVM as part of the browser to get accessb- to all those systems that use Java. It is one . of the things that people have been asking for/ for OpenVMS hence the Mozilla plugin questions.o  0 But why would you need a really fast system and,/ Java in silicon etc etc. The only bit of Citrixo- and Tarantella that is written in Java is thei. client, neither of them consume huge ammounts . of resource, I get very good Tarantella client, performance using a 167 Mhz Ultra 1 and the . Netscape 4.75 which hardly has the fastest JVM built into it.  / The performance of the network and the backend a/ server X or RDP is has much more impact on the s- performance I get on my client than the speedu* of the JVM and the applet that runs in it.  2 And if it really was a problem I could use either - the 1.2.X or 1.3 Java plugins instead of the h, standard JVM that built into netscape, both - of them would improve the performance of the - applet.     ; > > Secondly Tarantella allows you to use one common clienta7 > > with a common adaptive protocol to talk either to ao1 > > Windows RDP service or to a X-Windows server.> > >o: > > Because it is adaptive it works well over long latency7 > > low bandwidth lines as well as lower latency higherr9 > > bandwidth LAN connections. We use it to get access tot8 > > X11 apps via dialup sessions through our modem pool,+ > > it simply works better than X for this.  > >t< > Figures and numbers please. As you may remember you have a> > unbeaten track record of unproven "facts". I need to know in> > what respect technically the Tarantelle adaptive protocol is? > superiour over LBX. I need a short *commented* description oftB > the protocol features and how they are compared to X11. I need aB > short overview of the bandwidth requirements for certain typical: > operations as compared to X11. And, please, drop any SUN8 > marketing if you intend to answer these pure technical> > questions. And, please, no referring to vapor standards likeB > J2EE. I'm only interested in existing solutions. And, please, no> > statements like "it simply works better than Y for this". It > simply proves nothing.  < Why on earth would I be marketing anything, Tarantella isn't9 a Sun product its a product developed and sold by SCO who # happen to be a competitor of ours.      If you want details on it go to   ! www.sco.com or www.tarantella.comI  - You can even give it a test drive so why not  1 try it rather than blustering on about technical p questions. a  - Incedentally one of the demo sites is Compaq h ROTFL.  ? > > > Why do you ask for this proprietary M$ stuff like WindowseC > > > Terminal Server? You will get a fat client which is obviouslyhD > > > not the solution of the future. Stated that, what's wrong withA > > > X11? As far as I know the other solutions (Windows Terminalu' > > > Server, ICA Citrix, WinFrame) are > > > > re-invent-the-wheel-approaches. Do we really need that?   * This isn't technical in fact its is almost, exactly what you accuse me of an untechnical marketing rant.d  . Where in this paragraph is a single technical  question ?????????????????  8 > > Thirdly Tarantella allows us to run all their server5 > > processes on Solaris, nothing is installed on the 8 > > NT server at all it just talks RDP to the Tarantella6 > > Server. This reduces the number of NT boxes needed7 > > to support a given user population of thin clients.r > >r > >       ================" > >       | Tarantella   | Java or! > >       | Client       | native  > >       ================ > >               |h- > >               |  Tarantella adaptive prott > >       ================ > >       | Tarantella   | > >       | Server (UNIX)| > >       ================ > >          | RDP    | Xn > >         NT       X11 > >b > >e > > Regardsu > > Andrew Harrisone > > Enterprise IT Architect  > 9 > Nice picture. Could you provide a matrix for the clienti? > solutions? It would be interesting what the conditions are to2B > run the Tar. Java client or the Tar. native client. For the Java< > client: is there a version which runs in a browser as Java? > applet? Which versions of the JVM and the browser plug-in are:? > required for the different OSs and browers? For which OSs are B > Tar. native clients available? Is there a version for VMS?? What > is the license policy?; > For which server OSs is Tar. server available. Is there at: > version for VMS?? Is the Tar. source (client and server) > available (like Solaris 8)?v@ > Last and simplest question: can the Tar. client and server run > on the same machine?A > This is your marketing chance! Good luck. And you better answerd9 > one of the questions of availablity on VMS with yes ...    -- f Andrew Harrisonn Enterprise IT Architect>   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:45:08 +0000 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solutiont* Message-ID: <3A6ECE54.D4217FC4@uk.sun.com>   jlsue wrote: > 5 > On Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:48:58 +0000, andrew harrisond# > <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:, >  > >w > >o6 > >Sorry but you are wrong and were wrong at the time. > G > You know, AH, I now believe you're nothing but a *complete* idiot.  IyF > don't usually get down to calling  names, but you've just pushed tooG > far.  If you want to make statements like this, you better be willing * > ot pull up the postings that prove this. >  > >d7 > >You cited a specific case which you said proved your 6 > >general point about the effects of rebooting a node > >in an OpenVMS cluster.  > >n4 > >Various posters had allready also posted specific4 > >examples from their experience which had allready  > >disproved your general point. > D > I have managed and configured 100s of clusters.  it is YOU who areH > taking a few special cases and stating that they apply in general, and8 > YOU ARE WRONG!!!  And you have NEVER proved otherwise. >   2 You are having the argument with the wrong person.5 I never said that in my experience of managing OpnVMS 2 clusters you were incorrect but a number of other 4 posters did, either directly or by example, Curtis's4 user cull for example. Strangely you never disagreed with them at the time how odd.  5 Perhaps you should have responded to Curtis's posting 4 describing his user cull for example. Perhaps he did3 something wrong that you could have prevented. Why *0 not re-read hist post and then perhaps he might  appreciate your advice !  @ > It is amazing how you can lose an argument, and then come back5 > weeks/months later and state the opposite.  sheesh!  >   / Re read my posts, I have never said that it is s. impossible to construct a cluster environment 0 that behaves as you suggest. I have however said/ that your case is not a general rule, sadly for 6 you this is also obvious from the postings disagreeing& with Kerrys origional string of posts.    @ > No, now you are twisting things again.  You have no ability toG > comprehend that all apps and all user populations don't behave as youOC > think.  I never said that *all* will, but I did say that the vasta? > majority, and imho this is over 90% of the applications, willi@ > definitely operate as I have described.  And I don't make thisA > statement lightly, either.  I have seen many, many applications-F > (probably at least 1500) and have only seen rare instances of things7 > that don't work as well as we'd like in a VMScluster.C >   9 Strange again that you could not get that "vast majority"s= concensus from other admins who also manage OpenVMS clusters.o    E > Now, unless you have suddently achieved over 15 years of experience ; > that disproves this, you have a lot of work ahead of you.'   Again you missed the point.e   Regardsh Andrew Harrisono Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:11:40 -0600e+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>t= Subject: RE: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution1N Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284C9F@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>   Andrew,l  I While avoiding direct questions, you are trying to get various posters to11 this newsgroup to start fighting with each other.i   Pretty obvious.3   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantg Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]e Sent: January 24, 2001 7:45 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comm= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution      jlsue wrote: > 5 > On Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:48:58 +0000, andrew harrison # > <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:e >  > >  > >y6 > >Sorry but you are wrong and were wrong at the time. > G > You know, AH, I now believe you're nothing but a *complete* idiot.  ItF > don't usually get down to calling  names, but you've just pushed tooG > far.  If you want to make statements like this, you better be willingr* > ot pull up the postings that prove this. >  > > 7 > >You cited a specific case which you said proved your66 > >general point about the effects of rebooting a node > >in an OpenVMS cluster.h > >p4 > >Various posters had allready also posted specific4 > >examples from their experience which had allready  > >disproved your general point. > D > I have managed and configured 100s of clusters.  it is YOU who areH > taking a few special cases and stating that they apply in general, and8 > YOU ARE WRONG!!!  And you have NEVER proved otherwise. >   2 You are having the argument with the wrong person.5 I never said that in my experience of managing OpnVMSn2 clusters you were incorrect but a number of other 4 posters did, either directly or by example, Curtis's4 user cull for example. Strangely you never disagreed with them at the time how odd.  5 Perhaps you should have responded to Curtis's posting 4 describing his user cull for example. Perhaps he did3 something wrong that you could have prevented. Why m0 not re-read hist post and then perhaps he might  appreciate your advice !  @ > It is amazing how you can lose an argument, and then come back5 > weeks/months later and state the opposite.  sheesh!y >   / Re read my posts, I have never said that it is r. impossible to construct a cluster environment 0 that behaves as you suggest. I have however said/ that your case is not a general rule, sadly foro6 you this is also obvious from the postings disagreeing& with Kerrys origional string of posts.    @ > No, now you are twisting things again.  You have no ability toG > comprehend that all apps and all user populations don't behave as youhC > think.  I never said that *all* will, but I did say that the vastt? > majority, and imho this is over 90% of the applications, willi@ > definitely operate as I have described.  And I don't make thisA > statement lightly, either.  I have seen many, many applications F > (probably at least 1500) and have only seen rare instances of things7 > that don't work as well as we'd like in a VMScluster.s >   9 Strange again that you could not get that "vast majority"u= concensus from other admins who also manage OpenVMS clusters.w    E > Now, unless you have suddently achieved over 15 years of experiencel; > that disproves this, you have a lot of work ahead of you.S   Again you missed the point..   Regardst Andrew Harrisonr Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:29:05 +0000 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solutionn* Message-ID: <3A6EF4C1.CA3702E3@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,a > K > While avoiding direct questions, you are trying to get various posters toe3 > this newsgroup to start fighting with each other.e >   2 What would your point be as a matter of interest.   / He is making the claim you made for downtime or 1 the lack of it when you have to reboot an OpenVMSg cluster node.   1 The other posters on this group either disagreed d4 with your/his claim or had allready posted examples 0 prior to the discussion which disproved your/his claim.  3 I don't know if this is what you would call a fighti2 but surely you understand that in order to advance2 your/his argument you have to refute their claims.   Regardsf Andrew Harrisonw Enterprise IT Architects   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Jan 2001 16:40:16 GMT' From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)-= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solutionx0 Message-ID: <94n0hg$4h5$1@aquila.news.mdx.ac.uk>  ] In article <3A6EF4C1.CA3702E3@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:9 >"Main, Kerry" wrote:0 >> r
 >> Andrew, >> dL >> While avoiding direct questions, you are trying to get various posters to4 >> this newsgroup to start fighting with each other. >> i >b3 >What would your point be as a matter of interest.   >l0 >He is making the claim you made for downtime or2 >the lack of it when you have to reboot an OpenVMS >cluster node.   >t2 >The other posters on this group either disagreed 5 >with your/his claim or had allready posted examples a1 >prior to the discussion which disproved your/hisS >claim.  >u4 >I don't know if this is what you would call a fight3 >but surely you understand that in order to advance 3 >your/his argument you have to refute their claims.c >i >Regards >Andrew Harrison >Enterprise IT Architect    K As I recall there were only one or two disagreements (other than yourself).nF Eg Developers who were connected to one machine from a workstation whoG left themselves permanently connected and didn't like having to logout  H and login to another machine in the cluster. This even though they couldL be notified and given a reasonable period (say 24hrs) in which to logout and log straight back in. I or People who were running long batch jobs which had been written withouto restart capabilities.g  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:51:14 +0000 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution * Message-ID: <3A6F0802.CC966223@uk.sun.com>   "D.Webb" wrote:e > _ > In article <3A6EF4C1.CA3702E3@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:o > >"Main, Kerry" wrote:  > >> > >> Andrew, > >>N > >> While avoiding direct questions, you are trying to get various posters to6 > >> this newsgroup to start fighting with each other. > >> > > 4 > >What would your point be as a matter of interest. > >:2 > >He is making the claim you made for downtime or4 > >the lack of it when you have to reboot an OpenVMS > >cluster node. > >e3 > >The other posters on this group either disagreedB6 > >with your/his claim or had allready posted examples3 > >prior to the discussion which disproved your/hiso	 > >claim.f > >i6 > >I don't know if this is what you would call a fight5 > >but surely you understand that in order to advanceo5 > >your/his argument you have to refute their claims.o > >a
 > >Regards > >Andrew Harrison > >Enterprise IT Architect > M > As I recall there were only one or two disagreements (other than yourself). H > Eg Developers who were connected to one machine from a workstation whoH > left themselves permanently connected and didn't like having to logoutJ > and login to another machine in the cluster. This even though they couldN > be notified and given a reasonable period (say 24hrs) in which to logout and > log straight back in.iK > or People who were running long batch jobs which had been written without2 > restart capabilities.s >   * There were more than two dissenting voices( to Kerrys orgional postings citing their actual experiences.n  ( There were also the previous examples in' particular the remedial actions post a d) duff patch from Compaq and the impact on m& the users of that system. This example% also differed from Kerry's marketing  $ possition and from jlsue's apparent  practical experience.    Regards  Andrew Harrisonl Enterprise IT Architecta   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:05:55 -0600J+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>w= Subject: RE: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solutiongN Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284CA4@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>  
 Andrew ...  : Again, give it a rest. We have Customers doing this today.  L If you want to understand how Customers can shutdown individual servers in aF OpenVMS cluster with zero application availability impact, please read previous threads.t   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantt Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Servicess Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]  Sent: January 24, 2001 11:51 AM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come= Subject: Re: Compaq: A simple, affordable clustering solution      "D.Webb" wrote:s > < > In article <3A6EF4C1.CA3702E3@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison" <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes: > >"Main, Kerry" wrote:f > >> > >> Andrew, > >>K > >> While avoiding direct questions, you are trying to get various postersn to6 > >> this newsgroup to start fighting with each other. > >> > > 4 > >What would your point be as a matter of interest. > >o2 > >He is making the claim you made for downtime or4 > >the lack of it when you have to reboot an OpenVMS > >cluster node. > >i3 > >The other posters on this group either disagreed 6 > >with your/his claim or had allready posted examples3 > >prior to the discussion which disproved your/hisi	 > >claim.u > > 6 > >I don't know if this is what you would call a fight5 > >but surely you understand that in order to advancer5 > >your/his argument you have to refute their claims.  > >e
 > >Regards > >Andrew Harrison > >Enterprise IT Architect > B > As I recall there were only one or two disagreements (other than
 yourself).H > Eg Developers who were connected to one machine from a workstation whoH > left themselves permanently connected and didn't like having to logoutJ > and login to another machine in the cluster. This even though they couldJ > be notified and given a reasonable period (say 24hrs) in which to logout andt > log straight back in.wK > or People who were running long batch jobs which had been written withoutu > restart capabilities.g >   * There were more than two dissenting voices( to Kerrys orgional postings citing their actual experiences..  ( There were also the previous examples in' particular the remedial actions post a a) duff patch from Compaq and the impact on r& the users of that system. This example% also differed from Kerry's marketing o$ possition and from jlsue's apparent  practical experience.a   Regards  Andrew Harrisonu Enterprise IT Architecte   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 12:10:55 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>A Subject: Re: Copying disk ?uH Message-ID: <y4ae8hyzls.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  . Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:  4 > The XQP has ( had? ) a limit of *16* directories.   M No, it was RMS that had this limit. ODS-2 and with it the XQP have no conceptaJ of directory depth at all - you can either access a file directly via fileM id, or you find out its file id by recursively walking the directories (usingiN _their_ file ids as stored in the previous directory). But the code doing fileI name parsing and lookup _without_ using RMS for the purpose (even if theyuL access the file without RMS later on) is probably countable on one hand; theC only example I can think of is Pathworks, and it suffers from TINA.   N This is actually an example of a long-standing psychological problem with VMS:M It offers functionality so replete and consistent that its users take all itsvL limitations (of which there have to be many) as a given, and VMS engineeringK as the only source of removing any one of them. Consider, by contrast, MVS,eE where every site used have its "system programmer" charged to developcK site-specific hacks into the kernel and utilities, and add-on stuff such asuN RACF satisfy even very basic needs (in this case, user authentication and fileJ security). So people run around telling you "VMS cannot do this (or that)"L without noting that equivalent functionality is an add-on elsewhere, or thatJ such a limitation exists in the tool they use, but not in the OS and could easily be circumvented.l  @ > This was so you could have 8 deep in an 8 deep rooted logical.   Correct.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 21:36:02 +1300 6 From: "antony wardle" <antony.wardle@nospam.met.co.nz>" Subject: Re: dec 3000 300 crashing0 Message-ID: <zowb6.411$4l1.11224@ozemail.com.au>   Well,t  : I took my memory out of my machine and put it into another/ 3000/300 and did a test mem and it passed fine, % so I am now not sure what to believe.-  0 The other 300 is an M (150mhz) , whereas mine is4 an lx (125) didn't get a chance to do anything else.  7 maybe i will be able to ask the nice man from dec ooopss7 cpq, when he turns up tomorrow to install my twin ds20e   with san and fibre interconnect.  ? I have tried booting off a cd, and with 6.2 I made it as far as " the the menu, but then it crashed.  8 It will be hard to update the firmware if I can't get it' going. maybe I have a 1.5 cd somewhere..   cheeers'     antony             >nK > At this point I was suspicious, so I shut down our long-running 3000 300,lK and started trying the same tests on it.  Same result!  The T MEM LLSC test 
 always fails!u >tJ > I conclude that the model 300 does not correctly implement whatever LLSCK is trying to check.  I tried a 3000 600, and T MEM LLSC seems to work fine.e >hK > The rejuvenated 3000 300, with it's new memory added, booted VMS 6.2 just I fine, as in the past. (I know, it's old.  The rejuvenation isn't completeu yet.)s > C > My errors don't exactly match what you posted, but they're in thegI ballpark.  I think in your first post, you said your machine had tried tooI boot.  Maybe it really is an OS problem, not a memory/cache problem.  Did = you ever hook up a CD and boot from a known good system disk?y >w? > Does your machine give errors over the whole range of memory?yL > Does it sometimes (always) pass the power-up tests, before failing the mem test?t >   > I hope you didn't toss it yet. >h >dH > Once again, I wish someone could take a peek in the service manual and tell us what's going on here.n >h > -- > Robert Deininger > rdeininger@mindspring.coms   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:27:05 -0500o2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)" Subject: Re: dec 3000 300 crashingL Message-ID: <rdeininger-2401010927050001@user-2ive6g5.dialup.mindspring.com>  h In article <zowb6.411$4l1.11224@ozemail.com.au>, "antony wardle" <antony.wardle@nospam.met.co.nz> wrote:   > Well,e > < > I took my memory out of my machine and put it into another1 > 3000/300 and did a test mem and it passed fine, ' > so I am now not sure what to believe.i   Now I'm more confused than ever.  Perhaps we have two machines here sick in exactly the same way, but they never show symptoms, except this T MEM LLSC.     2 > The other 300 is an M (150mhz) , whereas mine is6 > an lx (125) didn't get a chance to do anything else.  { I didn't realize you have an lx.  I saw a CPU daughtercard for an lx at ebay a few days ago.  It might cure these problems.0  9 > maybe i will be able to ask the nice man from dec ooopsw9 > cpq, when he turns up tomorrow to install my twin ds20eg" > with san and fibre interconnect.  @ Maybe the nice man has a service manual he will let you peek at.  A > I have tried booting off a cd, and with 6.2 I made it as far as $ > the the menu, but then it crashed.   That is sad news.  Maybe your box really does want to point its LEDs at the sky and rest.  And now I'm wondering about the two here.   -- - Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com:   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 10:36:40 -05002 From: malmberg@eisner.decus.org (John E. Malmberg)" Subject: Re: dec 3000 300 crashing+ Message-ID: <gWHztFpPNrrg@eisner.decus.org>   2 > In article <zowb6.411$4l1.11224@ozemail.com.au>,7 "antony wardle" <antony.wardle@nospam.met.co.nz> wrote:r >i > Well,t >a< > I took my memory out of my machine and put it into another1 > 3000/300 and did a test mem and it passed fine,r' > so I am now not sure what to believe.-  < Examine the memory sockets on the failing machine carefully.  ; On a PC, I discovered a memory problem caused by a bent pine= on a memory socket causing a short.  It was not very visible.u   -John: wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 17:08:39 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e" Subject: Re: dec 3000 300 crashingH Message-ID: <y4r91tj5ko.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  4 rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:  M > Now I'm more confused than ever.  Perhaps we have two machines here sick inoM > exactly the same way, but they never show symptoms, except this T MEM LLSC.h  J That wouldn't be too surprising: these instructions are only required on aK multi-processor system to make sure spinlocks et al. actually work. I doubtSN that a normally-configured uniprocessor ever actually uses these instructions.   	Jan   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Jan 2001 12:28:53 GMT' From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)0? Subject: Re: Device Driver Engineers Needed-Great Opportunity!!a0 Message-ID: <94mhq5$t7f$2@aquila.news.mdx.ac.uk>  M In article <3A7138BC.16BDF6D0@home.com>, larry <lamarks2000@home.com> writes:m  E Although a large number of the people frequenting this newsgroup havegE experience of lots of technology and operating systems it seems a bitiC much to be polluting this newsgroup with vacancy posts which do notr mention VMS.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University    & >******GREAT CAREER OPPORTUNITY******* >sH >My client a WORLD WIDE LEADER in custom device drivers and system level8 >software development seeks talented software engineers.5 >2+ years experience in development of device drivers G >Fluency in coding and debugging C & assembly. Experience in one of thed+ >following: ATM, SONET/SDH, NDIS, BLUETOOTH  >pB >Experience in one of the following O/S : UNIX(linux), VXWorks, MS	 >Windows.m > F >You will work w/ the latest and greatest technologies and w/ the best) >and brightest engineers in the industry.lI >Unique and exciting opportunity !! TELECOMMUTE position(work from home),oE >excellent compensation, full benefits, stock options, sigh on bonus.  > @ >No more sitting in traffic to work and long commutes, enjoy the9 >flexibility this company has to offer all its engineers.a >h >Contact me for more details.m# >Don't miss this great opportunity!n >w >Larry Marks$ >email to : larrym@ahiresolution.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:34:51 +0100p= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>i/ Subject: Re: Documentation about check$checksumw) Message-ID: <3A6EAFCB.B0180C62@gtech.com>g   Gerhard van der Zedde wrote:N > Does anyone know any information written about the symbol checksum$checksum.L > It's a standard feature in VMS but I can't find any information how to use > it  / You will not find anything in the file manuals.u  1 Usually undocumented features are not documented.w   For what is known see:  - http://www.levitte.org/~ava/tip/checksum.htmla   Arne   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 11:02:21 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> & Subject: Re: EUREX and CBOT New SystemH Message-ID: <y4ofwxz2s2.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  H It is this kind of analysis that really shows what VMS's position inside> Compaq really is. Thanks to Bill for taking the time to do it.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:54:52 +0000k$ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk+ Subject: Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS.t/ Message-ID: <002569DE.003BF61D.00@quegw01.btyp>   L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza    - What? You mean like the Whitehouse method...?d   ;^D    Steve Spires        A JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> on 24/01/2001 06:52:35 AMe    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)-N From:      JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>, 24 January 2001, 6:52 a.m.   Filtering certain keys on VMS.        K I am curious. Is there an easy way to change the TTDRIVER to filter out anya "W" key that is typed ?t   :-) ;-) ;-) ;-)0   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 08:35:37 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler)+ Subject: Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS. + Message-ID: <E+$mwzElcO9F@eisner.decus.org>s  \ In article <3A6E7BA6.8BD67001@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:M > I am curious. Is there an easy way to change the TTDRIVER to filter out any  > "W" key that is typed ?O  1   Yes.  But the White House solution is more fun.h  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationa= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil Group E                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replyingt   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:55:15 -0000r* From: "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>+ Subject: Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS.u+ Message-ID: <94mmrt$smo@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>   _ "Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.decus.org> wrote in message news:E+$mwzElcO9F@eisner.decus.org...   3 >   Yes.  But the White House solution is more fun.T   I like the Register's take:n. "There can be no whitewash at the White House"   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:05:31 +0100g) From: "Pbo" <philippe.bocher@euriware.fr>h+ Subject: Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS.M$ Message-ID: <3a6ee02b@news.euriware>  4     If you speak a bit french, please take a look at  D     http://www.canalplus.fr/comedie/emissions/guignol/guignol_jt.asp     select mardi 23 janviera(     Special guests Sly and G .. Bush ...    Sorry :-)  G "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> a crit dans le message news:E! 3A6E7BA6.8BD67001@videotron.ca...aI > I am curious. Is there an easy way to change the TTDRIVER to filter out  anyA > "W" key that is typed ?o >n > :-) ;-) ;-) ;-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:40:24 +0000t% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>a+ Subject: Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS..8 Message-ID: <eqtt6togdbsgnkk7tsahoismt5c6phldg7@4ax.com>  4 On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:55:15 -0000, "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> wrote:   >h` >"Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.decus.org> wrote in message news:E+$mwzElcO9F@eisner.decus.org... > 4 >>   Yes.  But the White House solution is more fun. >a >I like the Register's take:/ >"There can be no whitewash at the White House"l  . And accessing the orld ide eb should be fun :)   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:54:34 +0000t- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>e+ Subject: Re: Filtering certain keys on VMS.y) Message-ID: <3A6F08CA.E8190759@bbc.co.uk>t   Alan Greig wrote:m  6 > On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:55:15 -0000, "Richard Brodie" > <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> wrote: >t > >nb > >"Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.decus.org> wrote in message news:E+$mwzElcO9F@eisner.decus.org... > >b6 > >>   Yes.  But the White House solution is more fun. > >b > >I like the Register's take:1 > >"There can be no whitewash at the White House"u > 0 > And accessing the orld ide eb should be fun :) >t  A As would using a generated password (well, you MIGHT be luck) :-)l  --r6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uka  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofe MedAS or the BBC.i   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:31:08 GMT  From: d.webb@mdx.ac.uk Subject: GNUPG 1.02 -> 1.04 ??) Message-ID: <94msft$79t$1@nnrp1.deja.com>r  -  In article <8omcqi$nn1@gap.cco.caltech.edu>,l mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduo  (David Mathog) writes:7>  >GnuPG 1.0.2, a PGP like program, has been ported to OpenVMS.H  > If you picked up a copy before  31-AUG-2000 16:47:47 Pacific Standard@  > time get it again.  I've found and fixed a couple more bugs -F  > including now it generates keys.  (But I still have not figured out2  > the right syntax to get it to encrypt a message  > using one of these keys.)  >  >If anybody has an idea whats  >?  > Please note that you don't have secure memory on this systemq$  > means please share your thoughts.%  > This comes from the file secmem.c.s  >C  > I suppose it's true to the extent that somebody with full priv's.H  > could read the live data out of the application, but it's hard to see!  > how any OS could prevent that!<  >  > Regards,@  >  >David Mathog  >mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduo@  >Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech    David,o  ;  Can this "Overlay" be applied to later versions of GNUPG ? A  The latest version (and only version I can seem to access on the E  www.gnupg.org site) appears to be GNUPG 1.04. (To which an importants!  security patch must be applied.)t  C  Do the diffs mentioned in your AAA_VMS_INSTALL.TXT files still allr  apply to this version ?    9  Is it working fully now ? The line in your message abovemA  "(But I still have not figured out the right syntax to get it todA    encrypt a message using one of these keys.)" rather worries mea&  since isn't this the point of GNUPG ?      
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University     Sent via Deja.com  http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:20:03 +0000o0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>$ Subject: Re: GS160 hardware question* Message-ID: <3A6EBA63.C04F84D5@uk.sun.com>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > D > andrew harrison wrote in message <3A6C6068.4922714A@uk.sun.com>... > >"Main, Kerry" wrote:n >  > <snip - line noise removed>n >  > Andy, you're a putz. > K > If every Sun server required a trained monkey to restart it every time iteM > got a cache parity error, you'd be telling us how it's saving an endangeredi
 > species. > D > Frankly, "most" benchmark numbers are relative crap.  They measureK > unrealistic things using unrealistic hardware configurations.  As soon as F > they get out there, vendors are looking for ways to optimize for theG > benchmark.  But the only thing that matters is the performance of theK > customers real applications. >   C Hang on you cannot have it both ways. Compaqs whole marketing push o> for WildFire was to try to establish that the WildFire was theA fastest server available on the market. They attempted to do thish( using the benchmarks that you refer to.   ? Now there is nothing intrinsically wrong with this provided younC include the disclaimer about real application performance. But thene Compaq didn't did they.Q  E In addition the way they ran TPC-C in particular made their benchmarkhB result even further away from what a customer could realistically E expect to get from their system. Running OPS in a box is an excerciseu& that very few customers would stomach.  B You have inadvertantly illustrated exactly why the whole WildFire > benchmarketing exercise from Compaq is so missleading. Compaq D make the comparison between their TPC-C result and other SMP single B instance TPC-C TPM results in their press releases and performanceD white papers. They do this without ever pointing out that they have C used a method of tuning that has a huge impact on the development, M? implimentaion and management of any application that customers e? might try to configure in the same way. The SMP single instance > results that Compaq compare themselves with do not require the same level of tuning.     M > For those who like benchmark numbers... either challenge it as illegal, gete  > the rules changed, or shut up.  7 It isn't against the rules but it also isn't defensiblet: because it missleads Compaqs customers. If you want proof 9 of that read Jordan or Rob's postings on this subject. ItS: is clear that they don't have any idea what the impact of 9 this kind of tuning has on the development and deploymentt9 of apps that might require the same kind of performance. d  8 It is also clear that they have swallowed hook line and 8 sinker the marketing line which attempts to compare the 8 WildFire results with other single instance SMP results $ when in fact there is no comparison.  6 If you really think it is defensible then I suggest as3 I have suggested to Rob, Kerry and Jordan that you c# publish your opinions on comp.arch.o   Regardsc Andrew Harrisonn Enterprise IT Architectd   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 06:05:16 -0600 + From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>n$ Subject: RE: GS160 hardware questionN Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284C97@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>   Andrew,   J Give it a rest. Customers use OPS to increase application availability andC it can also be used to increase scalability. Data warehousing is an 0 excellent example where OPS is an excellent fit.  D Read the Oracle documentation on why OPS is used by Customers today.  D Huge impact on development ? Please ... from an APP server or clientH perspective, it is still doing SQLNet or NET8 calls and it does not even/ know that OPS might be running on the back end.   F As far as getting OPS up and running on the server end, it is minimal.  F [I am sure the Oracle folks will argue with you that OPS is such a bad thing..]   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultante Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Servicesd Voice: 613-592-4660s Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]b Sent: January 24, 2001 6:20 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comy$ Subject: Re: GS160 hardware question     Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > D > andrew harrison wrote in message <3A6C6068.4922714A@uk.sun.com>... > >"Main, Kerry" wrote:e >  > <snip - line noise removed>i >  > Andy, you're a putz. > K > If every Sun server required a trained monkey to restart it every time itiB > got a cache parity error, you'd be telling us how it's saving an
 endangered
 > species. > D > Frankly, "most" benchmark numbers are relative crap.  They measureK > unrealistic things using unrealistic hardware configurations.  As soon as-F > they get out there, vendors are looking for ways to optimize for theG > benchmark.  But the only thing that matters is the performance of thes > customers real applications. >   C Hang on you cannot have it both ways. Compaqs whole marketing push $> for WildFire was to try to establish that the WildFire was theA fastest server available on the market. They attempted to do thisc( using the benchmarks that you refer to.   ? Now there is nothing intrinsically wrong with this provided you C include the disclaimer about real application performance. But then  Compaq didn't did they.c  E In addition the way they ran TPC-C in particular made their benchmark B result even further away from what a customer could realistically E expect to get from their system. Running OPS in a box is an excercise & that very few customers would stomach.  B You have inadvertantly illustrated exactly why the whole WildFire > benchmarketing exercise from Compaq is so missleading. Compaq D make the comparison between their TPC-C result and other SMP single B instance TPC-C TPM results in their press releases and performanceD white papers. They do this without ever pointing out that they have C used a method of tuning that has a huge impact on the development, s? implimentaion and management of any application that customers n? might try to configure in the same way. The SMP single instancet> results that Compaq compare themselves with do not require the same level of tuning.n    I > For those who like benchmark numbers... either challenge it as illegal,c get:  > the rules changed, or shut up.  7 It isn't against the rules but it also isn't defensible1: because it missleads Compaqs customers. If you want proof 9 of that read Jordan or Rob's postings on this subject. Ite: is clear that they don't have any idea what the impact of 9 this kind of tuning has on the development and deploymentu9 of apps that might require the same kind of performance. a  8 It is also clear that they have swallowed hook line and 8 sinker the marketing line which attempts to compare the 8 WildFire results with other single instance SMP results $ when in fact there is no comparison.  6 If you really think it is defensible then I suggest as3 I have suggested to Rob, Kerry and Jordan that you e# publish your opinions on comp.arch.    Regards  Andrew Harrisona Enterprise IT Architecth   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:13:14 +0000 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>$ Subject: Re: GS160 hardware question* Message-ID: <3A6ED4EA.B7A75368@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,d > L > Give it a rest. Customers use OPS to increase application availability andE > it can also be used to increase scalability. Data warehousing is anr2 > excellent example where OPS is an excellent fit. > F > Read the Oracle documentation on why OPS is used by Customers today. >   H Kerry yet again you demonstrate your lack of understanding. I am tempted) to suggest that you take your own advice.a  = Yes lots of people do use OPS to increase system availability<B but the vast majority of them do not use it to improve throughput.A This is because the vast majority of Oracle consultants are awareh> of the issues getting OPS to scale across multiple nodes in a  cluster or QBB's in a WildFire.g  > You can use OPS without partitioning your data or clients and ; most customers fall into this category. OPS running on two r9 nodes one active with all the clients connected to it andl0 one active but with no clients connected to it.   9 Oracle even have in implimentation of this called Oracle r: Parallel Failsafe which assumes this kind of configuration# and which is layered on top of OPS.g  F > Huge impact on development ? Please ... from an APP server or clientJ > perspective, it is still doing SQLNet or NET8 calls and it does not even1 > know that OPS might be running on the back end.  >   ? This is getting boring. If you don't understand the issues thene= why not ask one of your benchmarking folks rather than havingO to learn in public.r  7 To get the best performance out of your OPS system you p7 need to partition your data AND your clients. It is noto5 much use partitioning the data if a client connected o5 to the instance on QBB 0 is expecting to run all its  % queries against the QBB 1 partition. e  4 Now partitioning clients for TPC-C is easy, they are3 fixed clients, they connect at the beginning of the 4 benchmark run and never need to re-connect. There is6 also  no requirement as part of TPC-C for a client to < have to query anything other than the data in its partition.  5 This is one reason why people say that clustered and  2 non clustered TPC-C are so different because TPC-C5 unlike real apps is an almost perfectly partitionablen1 system. Clients, data, queries are all perfectly   partitionable. t  4 Partitioning clients in the real world where clients1 are not fixed is not so easy and ensuring that a n2 cleint never has to run a query that uses anything2 more than its subset of the DBMS is also not easy.  1 In fact very few apps are as partionable as TPC-Ce5 which is why very few people actually use OPS in the u way that you are suggesting.  H > As far as getting OPS up and running on the server end, it is minimal. >   5 Again rubbish, getting it up and running is easy but S5 only if you are not expecting to use it to get betterr7 performance, if you are you need to partition your data-2 across nodes this is a totally different excercise  4 Now you will find people who do partition their data5 routinely, but this in most cases is not helpfull to B6 OPS scalability. The bank I am working for partions on6 a time basis. Month 1 partition 1 etc. But this isn't ; helpfull for scalability because 95% of their transactions p- are executed against the current months data.o   Regards/ Andrew HarrisonA Enterprise IT Architect@   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:01:49 -0600e+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com>y$ Subject: RE: GS160 hardware questionN Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284C9A@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>   Andrew, Andrew..  L >>> This is because the vast majority of Oracle consultants are aware of theL issues getting OPS to scale across multiple nodes in a cluster or QBB's in a WildFire.<<R  I These types are usually concerned with locking issues which, while alwaysgH something to be considered (cluster interconnect speed etc), have becomeG less of an issue with newer versions of Oracle (8.1.6+) and much fastert interconnect technologies.    K As an example, how many Oracle OPS guru's that you know at Sun are familiarnH with clustering two (or more) instances on the same box and using shared@ memory as the cluster interconnect for a very high speed cluster
 interconnect?l  I >>> It is not much use partitioning the data if a client connected to the G instance on QBB 0 is expecting to run all its queries against the QBB 1-
 partition. <<e  J Lets talk real life here - not fictitious TPC setups. In the real world, aJ TCPIP Cluster alias is used by the clients to access the back end. Clients? don't know (or care) which server is processing their requests.   0 There are basic OPS / high availability issues.   L There are always trade-offs to be considered and I am NOT saying that OPS is good for all environments. h  K However, it should certainly be a consideration for those environments that1J have acceptable HW that meets their performance requirements, but yet alsoD require higher availability than what a single OS instance provides.   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanta Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Servicese Voice: 613-592-4660/ Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]. Sent: January 24, 2001 8:13 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt$ Subject: Re: GS160 hardware question     "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,e > L > Give it a rest. Customers use OPS to increase application availability andE > it can also be used to increase scalability. Data warehousing is anG2 > excellent example where OPS is an excellent fit. > F > Read the Oracle documentation on why OPS is used by Customers today. >   H Kerry yet again you demonstrate your lack of understanding. I am tempted) to suggest that you take your own advice.r  = Yes lots of people do use OPS to increase system availability.B but the vast majority of them do not use it to improve throughput.A This is because the vast majority of Oracle consultants are awareH> of the issues getting OPS to scale across multiple nodes in a  cluster or QBB's in a WildFire.-  > You can use OPS without partitioning your data or clients and ; most customers fall into this category. OPS running on two r9 nodes one active with all the clients connected to it andk0 one active but with no clients connected to it.   9 Oracle even have in implimentation of this called Oracle :: Parallel Failsafe which assumes this kind of configuration# and which is layered on top of OPS..  F > Huge impact on development ? Please ... from an APP server or clientJ > perspective, it is still doing SQLNet or NET8 calls and it does not even1 > know that OPS might be running on the back end.  >   ? This is getting boring. If you don't understand the issues thenM= why not ask one of your benchmarking folks rather than having, to learn in public.A  7 To get the best performance out of your OPS system you w7 need to partition your data AND your clients. It is not 5 much use partitioning the data if a client connected t5 to the instance on QBB 0 is expecting to run all its -% queries against the QBB 1 partition. 0  4 Now partitioning clients for TPC-C is easy, they are3 fixed clients, they connect at the beginning of the 4 benchmark run and never need to re-connect. There is6 also  no requirement as part of TPC-C for a client to < have to query anything other than the data in its partition.  5 This is one reason why people say that clustered and i2 non clustered TPC-C are so different because TPC-C5 unlike real apps is an almost perfectly partitionablee1 system. Clients, data, queries are all perfectly r partitionable. t  4 Partitioning clients in the real world where clients1 are not fixed is not so easy and ensuring that a o2 cleint never has to run a query that uses anything2 more than its subset of the DBMS is also not easy.  1 In fact very few apps are as partionable as TPC-Ce5 which is why very few people actually use OPS in the d way that you are suggesting.  H > As far as getting OPS up and running on the server end, it is minimal. >   5 Again rubbish, getting it up and running is easy but .5 only if you are not expecting to use it to get betterv7 performance, if you are you need to partition your datai2 across nodes this is a totally different excercise  4 Now you will find people who do partition their data5 routinely, but this in most cases is not helpfull to m6 OPS scalability. The bank I am working for partions on6 a time basis. Month 1 partition 1 etc. But this isn't ; helpfull for scalability because 95% of their transactions ?- are executed against the current months data.l   Regardsi Andrew Harrisonh Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:22:17 +0000n0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>$ Subject: Re: GS160 hardware question* Message-ID: <3A6EF329.1C33B025@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: >  > Andrew, Andrew.. > N > >>> This is because the vast majority of Oracle consultants are aware of theN > issues getting OPS to scale across multiple nodes in a cluster or QBB's in a
 > WildFire.<<r > K > These types are usually concerned with locking issues which, while alwayskJ > something to be considered (cluster interconnect speed etc), have becomeI > less of an issue with newer versions of Oracle (8.1.6+) and much fastern > interconnect technologies. > M > As an example, how many Oracle OPS guru's that you know at Sun are familiar J > with clustering two (or more) instances on the same box and using sharedB > memory as the cluster interconnect for a very high speed cluster > interconnect?  >   ? I am not talking about Sun/OPS Oracle Gurus I am talking about eI Oracle, Oracle OPS Gurus. Oracle and the major integrators have far more  ? consultants implimenting Oracle OPS solutions on Sun (and otherb
 platforms)B then Sun and the other platform vendors have doing the same thing.   K > >>> It is not much use partitioning the data if a client connected to thetI > instance on QBB 0 is expecting to run all its queries against the QBB 1g > partition. <<o > L > Lets talk real life here - not fictitious TPC setups. In the real world, aL > TCPIP Cluster alias is used by the clients to access the back end. ClientsA > don't know (or care) which server is processing their requests.  >   > You are right in normal circumstances the clients don't care, ; but unfortunately the tuning scheme of OPS in a box or OPS r; clustering means that you DO care because you will get the y7 best perfomance if you connect the right client to the m9 right node/QBB. And as you have illustrated the standard  : mechanism you would normally use does not do this for you.  < This isn't an issue for TPC-C because the clients are static1 clients it does however matter in the real world.v  1 > There are basic OPS / high availability issues.  > N > There are always trade-offs to be considered and I am NOT saying that OPS is > good for all environments. > M > However, it should certainly be a consideration for those environments thatoL > have acceptable HW that meets their performance requirements, but yet alsoF > require higher availability than what a single OS instance provides. >   : Does this mean that you are condeming any comparison that 8 people may have made between a system that required OPS 8 in a box to obtain its performance and a system that did not ????   Regards  Andrew Harrisonn Enterprise IT Architect    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:20:06 -0600m+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@compaq.com> $ Subject: RE: GS160 hardware questionN Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284CA5@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>   Andrew,s  H >>> Does this mean that you are condeming any comparison that people mayC have made between a system that required OPS in a box to obtain itsa, performance and a system that did not ????>>  J I made a statement that says basically OPS is not for every situation, butC can be very good for some applications - both availability wise and  performance wise.0  L You seem to feel that large SMP single instance OS's are the only answer andI that OPS does not apply for any situation requiring improved performance..L Fine - this is not the case and I would suggest that you talk to your Oracle dba's to confirm this.    K Anyway, as Fred pointed out, go talk to the TPC Council if you feel this is  not appropriate. s  I >>> And as you have illustrated the standard mechanism you would normallyt use does not do this for you.<<v  I Oh right, a TCPIP cluster alias is really such a complicated mechanism tod setup..e   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanta Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]d Sent: January 24, 2001 10:22 AMn To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comf$ Subject: Re: GS160 hardware question     "Main, Kerry" wrote: >  > Andrew, Andrew.. > J > >>> This is because the vast majority of Oracle consultants are aware of thesL > issues getting OPS to scale across multiple nodes in a cluster or QBB's in a:
 > WildFire.<<  > K > These types are usually concerned with locking issues which, while alwaysCJ > something to be considered (cluster interconnect speed etc), have becomeI > less of an issue with newer versions of Oracle (8.1.6+) and much fasterr > interconnect technologies. > D > As an example, how many Oracle OPS guru's that you know at Sun are familiarJ > with clustering two (or more) instances on the same box and using sharedB > memory as the cluster interconnect for a very high speed cluster > interconnect?o >   ? I am not talking about Sun/OPS Oracle Gurus I am talking about  I Oracle, Oracle OPS Gurus. Oracle and the major integrators have far more o? consultants implimenting Oracle OPS solutions on Sun (and other 
 platforms)B then Sun and the other platform vendors have doing the same thing.  oK > >>> It is not much use partitioning the data if a client connected to the I > instance on QBB 0 is expecting to run all its queries against the QBB 1  > partition. <<i > L > Lets talk real life here - not fictitious TPC setups. In the real world, aL > TCPIP Cluster alias is used by the clients to access the back end. ClientsA > don't know (or care) which server is processing their requests.u >   > You are right in normal circumstances the clients don't care, ; but unfortunately the tuning scheme of OPS in a box or OPS v; clustering means that you DO care because you will get the l7 best perfomance if you connect the right client to the e9 right node/QBB. And as you have illustrated the standard m: mechanism you would normally use does not do this for you.  < This isn't an issue for TPC-C because the clients are static1 clients it does however matter in the real world.o  1 > There are basic OPS / high availability issues.a > K > There are always trade-offs to be considered and I am NOT saying that OPSo is > good for all environments. > H > However, it should certainly be a consideration for those environments thatL > have acceptable HW that meets their performance requirements, but yet alsoF > require higher availability than what a single OS instance provides. >   : Does this mean that you are condeming any comparison that 8 people may have made between a system that required OPS 8 in a box to obtain its performance and a system that did not ????   Regardse Andrew Harrisonh Enterprise IT Architecta   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 11:21:43 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>i Subject: Re: Image Monitor?wH Message-ID: <y4itn5z1vs.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  1 "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net> writes:M  J > I will of course continue to pressure them to generate link maps, but asL > long as management is told there is a tool that will allow our programmersJ > to avoid work, then I have to eather find it, or prove it doesn't exist.  D Not adding "/MAP/FULL" to the LINK command is "avoid[ing] work", butF installing and learning a new tool is? Sheesh, that's a strange world  you're living in.G   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:43:48 +0100 1 From: Franz-Josef Fornefeld <jo.fornefeld@gmx.de>m? Subject: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platforms' Message-ID: <94m84k.g7.1@jo.dyndns.org>a   Main, Kerry wrote:  + > The official information is available at: ? > <http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/vax/vax_letter_final.html>r   is quite old, isn't it?g | A letter from Jesse Lipcon f |d | October 5, 1999m |d | Dear Valued Customer   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 04:50:22 -0600a+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com>n? Subject: RE: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platformtN Message-ID: <910612C07BCAD1119AF40000F86AF0D805284C92@kaoexc3.kao.cpqcorp.net>   Franz,   >>> is quite old, isn't it? <<<d  G Since everything it says is still the current message today, why do youo think it is old?   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultante Compaq Canada Inc. Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660e Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----8 From: Franz-Josef Fornefeld [mailto:jo.fornefeld@gmx.de] Sent: January 24, 2001 3:44 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ? Subject: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platforml     Main, Kerry wrote:  + > The official information is available at: ? > <http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/vax/vax_letter_final.html>    is quite old, isn't it?f | A letter from Jesse Lipcon s |e | October 5, 1999  |y | Dear Valued Customer   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 13:24:37 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>n? Subject: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platformtH Message-ID: <y44rypyw6y.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  + fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:c  E > If Compaq is not really stopping withVAX / VMS systems, they shouldg > at least relaunch old models,   M And from where are they going to get the processor chips? The last VAXen werelN designed in the same process as the 21064 (actually a useful things for peopleM trying to compare architecture vs implementation, but that's another story!).fH You won't find a fab that'll let you produce that design without massiveI investment in bringing it up to date - and then, why should you? In time, M software emulation a la CHARON-VAX of all but the largest VAX systems will beaD faster on current hardware than any "real" VAX system that ever was.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:36:44 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brv? Subject: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platformtL Message-ID: <OF1E119494.285648AB-ON032569DE.004AB7C7@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  G I dont know about I/O speed, but what about those programable chips ???o   Regardsx   FC        D Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> em 24/01/2001 10:24:37t             Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come      ? Assunto: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platformt    + fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:l  E > If Compaq is not really stopping withVAX / VMS systems, they shouldt > at least relaunch old models,p  H And from where are they going to get the processor chips? The last VAXen wereG designed in the same process as the 21064 (actually a useful things fort peopleD trying to compare architecture vs implementation, but that's another story!).H You won't find a fab that'll let you produce that design without massiveI investment in bringing it up to date - and then, why should you? In time,rJ software emulation a la CHARON-VAX of all but the largest VAX systems will beD faster on current hardware than any "real" VAX system that ever was.        Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:18:14 +0100i1 From: Franz-Josef Fornefeld <jo.fornefeld@gmx.de>o? Subject: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platforms' Message-ID: <94mkmm.ir.1@jo.dyndns.org>e   Main, Kerry wrote:   > Franz, >e  >>>> is quite old, isn't it? <<< >hI > Since everything it says is still the current message today, why do youn > think it is old?  ( It _is_ old. Old does not mean outdated.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:04:44 -0500l2 From: norm lastovica <norman.lastovica@oracle.com>? Subject: Re: Is Compaq dropping support for vms on vax platform * Message-ID: <3A6ED2EC.924ADC61@oracle.com>  < if it is correct, what difference does it make if it is old?   Franz-Josef Fornefeld wrote: >  > Main, Kerry wrote: > - > > The official information is available at:(A > > <http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/vax/vax_letter_final.html>a >  > is quite old, isn't it?u > | A letter from Jesse Lipcon > |o > | October 5, 1999a > |  > | Dear Valued Customer   -- e> norman lastovica / oracle rdb engineering / usa / 610.696.4685   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:23:24 GMTr From: sabolich@my-deja.com- Subject: Re: Linux worm and RedHat 7.0 brokeni) Message-ID: <94mvhe$ag0$1@nnrp1.deja.com>e  L In article <rdeininger-2401010135070001@user-2iveaup.dialup.mindspring.com>,5   rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) wrote:@G > In article <94l2pm$olm$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, sabolich@my-deja.com wrote:: >rL > > VMS is well engineered.  It is reliable, stable, etc.  Its design is notJ > > clean though.  It is a commercial and prorietary OS - with such thingsK > > the design is often rushed to get a working product out the door beforei > > the competition. >sE > I'm sure there was pressure to ship VMS as quickly as possible, but F the _design_ was not rushed.  Design and implementation were separatedF by quite a bit more than a slice of pizza and a pepsi.  Quite a lot ofD the early history of VMS is accessible, and the design is documentedF quite nicely in the books titled ~"VMS Internals and Data Structures".H Various versions, and slightly different titles are available.  I highly recommend this book. >a= > You mention "commercial" and "proprietary" as if those wereiH automatically bad things.  Perhaps, but they have nothing to do with the design of the system.a  G Not automatically bad things.  I meant in general that when there is nolH time to market pressure (such as in academic environment) initial designA is less rushed and often openly debated.  This does not mean thattF _every_ open project is well thought out and designed and every closedD one is slopped together kludge.  There are examples of excellent and< poor design from both.  I'm just saying there is a tendency.   >sH > I also disagree when you say the design of VMS is not clean.  It seemsH quite clean and regular to me, though in 20ish years, a little cruft has crept in here and there.  F Ok, maybee my statement was a little harsh on VMS.  I'll say that Unix is cleaner than VMS.   >lL > > Unix on the other hand has much of its roots in academia where a lack ofE > > market pressure gives more time for planning, debate, and design.s >tB > This doesn't fit with any history of unix that I ever heard.  In: particular, "design" seems an overly generous description.  C A lot of work was done at Berkley - therefore the name BSD, BerkleyiC Software Distribution.  As far as design, if Unix being simpler and G smaller than VMS, can do everything that VMS can do (with less or equaleF work on the part of the programmer) would you call it better designed?   >aH > > Anyways VMS and Unix are similar in there abilities.  Both are multiF > > user, multi tasking OSes with virtual memory protection and demandK > > paging.  You can accomplish the same results with both OSes.  Just thata2 > > Unix does it with fewer and simpler API calls. >sD > I don't think you are very familiar with VMS and its capabilities.F (And I am certainly not up-to-date on unix APIs these 20 years or so.)F There is a LOT built into VMS that makes applications easier to write.B Unix has fewer and simpler API calls because it is ... smaller and3 simpler.  Basic unix doesn't have anything to matchs   > RMS,A Is this a king of data base that for example the file system runsgB through where a block is a record?  What is the advantage of this?   > or the DLM, or clustering,F Distributed locks and clustering.  Linux doesn't have this as far as IG know.  Other high end proprietary Unixes might have something like thise? but I cannot comment because I don't have experience with them.s   > or Galaxy,G Virtual machines.  Some systems have this in hardware - for exmaple IBM E s/390 which can run over 1000 instances of Linux on a single machine.uG Also VMware for x86 which allow multiple OSes (NT, Linux, FreeBSD, etc)a$ to run simultaneously.  Also Plex86.   > or logical names, 4 Combination of Environment variables and soft links.  %  or simple mixed-language support ...o >aG > When these are available for unix, they are add-ons, and often poorlyDE integrated with the OS.  Things like this were designed into VMS from  very early days. >hD > Speaking of "good design", why was unix designed with devices thatF pretend to be files?  That is either a symptom or a contributing causeF of a lot of silliness and pain in unix device support.  Simple, maybe. Good design, I doubt.i  A 'Everything is a file' is good.  This means that a single form ofeE security and access control (the same one used for files) is used for. devices.   >sG > Another one:  Why are null-terminated strings a good design?  Why notOG counted strings?  And if null-terminated strings are so great, why doesoG so much unix code seem so reluctant to validate string arguments beforenC using them?  Was this due to "planning, debate, and design" or justm sloppiness?a  E This could easily be C vs Fortran.  Why does Fortran use CR and not ; H for end of line.  The line continuation scheme is quite stupid and makesE code look unreadable.  I'm not saying that Unix is bettery in _every_o respect.   >eB > Which is a better design: a set of system parameters that can beH modified, plus tools to modify them sensibly, or editing and recompiling8 the kernel to make "simple" changes in OS configuration?  @ Linux is often recompiled because the source is available.  ManyC parameters can be changed without recompile or even without reboot.tD I'll go out on a limb and claim I can change more paramters in LinuxF without reboot than you can in OpenVMS (I may get burned here but I'll take the challenge).   > D > Is it good design that programs compiled and linked many years andG versions ago will run just fine, unchanged, on current hardware and OS?y  G Yes, as long as you are on the same CPU type.  Can you run VAX binariest	 on Alpha?t  4   Is there a unix hiding somewhere that can do this?   Yes, Linux, FreeBSD, etc.    >  > I better not go on...e > C > > I'm just curious, how much have your programmed for Unix vs VMSh; > > (sometimes familiarity with one system skews judgement)r >lH > Without a doubt, this skewing works in both directions.  How much haveG you programmed VMS?  Which pieces do you feel have an "unclean" design,o, and how well do you understand those pieces?  > I programmed multi tasking OSes in this order - NT, VMS, Unix.  H To be fair I spent the least amount of time with VMS (it was a while agoE too) but I was exposed to it before Unix.  At that time I though UnixhE was cryptic and backwards.  Then I started playing around with Linux.rG At first I didn't like it, but the more I used/programmed it the more In. liked it.  It is now my favorite of the three.   Fran     Sent via Deja.com0 http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:09:52 +0100s= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>e Subject: Re: make>) Message-ID: <3A6EC610.3DE95729@gtech.com>    Alexander Eisenhuth wrote:Q > I'm new to this list (and to VMS). Exist there a make utility comparable to thea > gnu-make?   + You can get a ton of make programs for VMS:a   - MMS from Compaqc!   - MMK freeware (MMS compatible),   - GNU Make   - 3-4 other Make cloneso   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:23:44 +0000 , From: Paul BEAUDOIN <paul.beaudoin@hsbc.com>% Subject: Memo:  Help! Zip/Unzip erroru? Message-ID: <802569DE.0049541C.00@emea-smtp-03.systems.uk.hsbc>s   Gents,  E I am having a problem with both ZIP and UNZIP on a partcular machine.wE The executables were coppied from a 7.2 system where they worked to a B number of 7.2-1 (DS10/DS20) systems where they didn't. I have alsoF copied them to a FT 7.3 system where they also work fine. Also on this? particular box we can't seem to unzip either. We get QIO errorsmD (device full followed by a series of End of File errors).(The deviceA has >1M blocks free). The same ZIP file is fine on other systems.1F The error itself is not meaningful to me. Variable lenght files should zip shouldn't they?o  > I'm afraid I have no ideas left. Can someone shed some light??   Additional Info:   PHNX04> zip -V -v t.zip *.*0  A      Error:  zipfile is in variable-length record format.  Please E      run "bilf b UTILITY:[OVERINGTON_D]T.ZIP;" to convert the zipfilew to fixed-lengths      record format.c    D zip error: Zip file structure invalid (UTILITY:[OVERINGTON_D]T.ZIP;)   PHNX04> sh sym zip)   ZIP == "$UTILITY:[OVERINGTON_D]ZIP.EXE"w   PHNX04> sh sysC OpenVMS V7.2-1  on node PHNX04  24-JAN-2001 10:55:12.12  Uptime  10e 07:16:01F   Pid    Process Name    State  Pri      I/O       CPU       Page flts   Pagest      The ZIP version:s  F Copyright (C) 1990-1994 Mark Adler, Richard B. Wales, Jean-loup Gailly< and Igor Mandrichenko. Type 'zip "-L"' for software license.; Zip 2.0j (Sept 16th 1994). Usage: zip=="$disk:[dir]zip.exe"rF zip [-options] [-b path] [-t mmddyy] [-n suffixes] [zipfile list] [-xi  list]   UNZIP:  F UnZip 5.12 of 28 August 1994, by Info-ZIP.  Portions (c) 1989 by S. H.  Smith.vF Send bug reports to authors at zip-bugs@wkuvx1.wku.edu; see README for  details   Thanks in advanced   Paul          D ********************************************************************B  This message and any attachments are confidential to the ordinaryB  user of the e-mail address to which it was addressed and may also>  be privileged. If you are not the addressee you may not copy,8  forward, disclose or use any part of the message or itsC  attachments and if you have received this message in error, pleasewB  notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete it from
  your system.n  =  Internet communications cannot be guaranteed to be secure or A  error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, >  arrive late or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not?  accept liability for any errors or omissions in the context ofn?  this message which arise as a result of Internet transmission..   D  Any opinions contained in this message are those of the author and ?  are not given or endorsed by the HSBC Group company or office P=  through which this message is sent unless otherwise clearly fA  indicated in this message and the authority of the author to so l3  bind the HSBC entity referred to is duly verified.   D ********************************************************************   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 21:45:51 +0930b/ From: Mark Daniel <mark.daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> $ Subject: Re: MIME in a DCL procedure/ Message-ID: <3A6EC777.EC0B12F3@wasd.vsm.com.au>t  H Early last year a similar query was posted which caught my attention.  IC have used thie technique described from C code to send MIME encoded 1 messages via VMS mail with the yahMAIL Web scripte     http://wasd.vsm.com.au/wasd/  E and it works for UCX, Multinet, TCPware SMTP agents, but not PMDF.  IjC know it also works from DCL.  It may contribute something towards an solution for you.o  1 I refound the article by doing a Deja News search      http://www.deja.com/usenet/n  H in "past"/"all" archives for "vmsnet.mail.mx mime dcl".  Here is the URL it returnedi     lU http://www.deja.com/dnquery.xp?QRY=vmsnet.mail.mx+mime+dcl&ST=MS&svcclass=dnold&DBS=1o   Bru, Pierre wrote: >  > hello, > F > I have to create daily a bunch of MIME messages from text and binaryA > files. is it possible to use MIME for that purpose within a DCL J > procedure (not interactive)? is it possible to setup the From, To, Date,E > etc header with MIME or do I have to insert those headers manually?c >  > TIA,	 > Pierre.n >  > Sent via Deja.comp > http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Jan 2001 12:42:47 GMT' From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk (D.Webb)w* Subject: Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line0 Message-ID: <94mik7$t7f$3@aquila.news.mdx.ac.uk>  ` In article <23JAN01.20572045@feda34.fed.ornl.gov>, Dave Greenwood <greenwoodde@ornl.gov> writes:. >Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote:1 >> koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) writes:c >>  P >> > In article <94inrk$rsp$1@tomm.stsci.edu>, clark@sander.stsci.edu () writes: >> > > F+ >> > > SubjecNew OpenVMS Times - Hubble Addr >> > > >G >> > > Just looked at the new issue.  The last page really burns me up.u >> > > sK >> > > Did you know that Hubble Space Telescope's top project is to get then6 >> > > picture generation off of VMS and onto Solaris? >> > 3J >> > Top project?  Hardly.  The current HST top project is SM3B.  No doubtL >> > replacing the image processing systems are a big move within STScI, butF >> > that harldy represents all of HST.  The new cooler alone probablyN >> > represents a higher investment than the STScI's image processing systems. >>  D >> STSDAS, and TABLES, the software foundation for HST are no longerH >> supported for VMS. I'm expecting IRAF to drop VMS in the next release( >> or two, or in the next major release. >>  K >> STARLINK dropped VMS years ago. And it was started and developed on VMS.0 >>  C >> The other favorite in astronomy is IDL. Is it available for VMS?u >bI >The current version of IDL (5.4) is available for VMS on alpha, but it'st2 >the last one.  IIRC, IDL was also started on VMS. >r >Sigh. >h    H Shouldn't Compaq be talking to these Companies - or do they want all the4 Astronomy work to be being done on Solaris systems ?      
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 08:26:28 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler)* Subject: Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line+ Message-ID: <+nlvSlPfZd0E@eisner.decus.org>   \ In article <87k87m5bvm.fsf@prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:B > The other favorite in astronomy is IDL. Is it available for VMS?  I IDL has also announced plans to drop VMS (I've been using it for years). n- They've just announced a Linux/Alpha version.    > K > What is the status of PIPELINE and the calibation stuff Bob, do you know?0   F Nope.  The only other info I had was the white paper on the schedulingI (PASS?) system which was based on Gartner's "VMS is dead".  I don't even 0K know if they ever finished conversion of that from VAX to IEEE float after wF they did the VAX to Alpha port, I'm just a user for scheduling system.    F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences CorporationI= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil GroupoE                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replyingi   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:25:23 +0000 - From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>s* Subject: Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line) Message-ID: <3A6EE5D3.3C7DEB2C@bbc.co.uk>s   "D.Webb" wrote:e   >  >iJ > Shouldn't Compaq be talking to these Companies - or do they want all the6 > Astronomy work to be being done on Solaris systems ?  < No, its the astonomers who want to be Solaris only, with the very odd exception.   ? Starlink did get bitten with the OSF on MIPS fiasco, didn't it?A   >t   --6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.ukr  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those ofo MedAS or the BBC.m   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:19:27 +0000 % From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>l* Subject: Re: New OpenVMS Times now on line8 Message-ID: <g6st6tcgmclheg8srs3ovnho1fcummq5mf@4ax.com>  1 On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:25:23 +0000, Tim Llewellyna  <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote:   >  >a >"D.Webb" wrote: >0 >> >>K >> Shouldn't Compaq be talking to these Companies - or do they want all theo7 >> Astronomy work to be being done on Solaris systems ?D >3= >No, its the astonomers who want to be Solaris only, with thec >very odd exception. >l@ >Starlink did get bitten with the OSF on MIPS fiasco, didn't it?  B Probably. I do know that the Starlink people at St. Andrews didn't@ really want to come off of VMS but that was the way the wind wasB blowing. The last SJUG and SCONET (Scottish Joint Academic NetworkE User Group and Scottish Higher Education Technical Networking Group -dF Tim will know what I'm talking about) I attended three years ago stillC had the odd Starlink VMS supporter to keep Abertay and Herriot Wattj universities VMS folk company.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 11:34:41 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>o= Subject: Re: No technical computing, was: expanding the nichedH Message-ID: <y4g0i9z1a6.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  . Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:  J > WSextent was 65000. WSMAX, on looking seems to be 13000. That seems odd.  3 IIRC, the new Alpha VM design makes WSMAX obsolete.    	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:08:43 +0100M= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>e= Subject: Re: No technical computing, was: expanding the nichen) Message-ID: <3A6EC5CB.8348FC01@gtech.com>    Jan Vorbrueggen wrote:0 > Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:L > > WSextent was 65000. WSMAX, on looking seems to be 13000. That seems odd. > 5 > IIRC, the new Alpha VM design makes WSMAX obsolete.i  . SYSUAF WSMAX or SYSGEN VIRTUALPAGCNT or both ?   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 07:19:17 GMT ' From: Piet Timmers <piet@timmers-it.nl>i Subject: Re: NTP network loada) Message-ID: <94lvli$fql$1@nnrp1.deja.com>t  - In article <877l3m5anb.fsf@prep.synonet.com>, /   Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote:s- > "Piet Timmers" <piet@timmers-it.nl> writes:o >e > > Hai, > >yG > > We want to setup an NTP service on our network, using two stratum-1s time@ > > servers and 14 stratum-2 nodes. Can someone tell me what the network loadC > > will be when I setup all the stratum-2 nodes as peer nodes. Theu	 number ofsB > > stratum-3 nodes will be around 410. Is it possible to let them synchronizeh! > > with all the stratum-2 nodes.n >r- > Very little, once it is running and stable.i >eD > DO your stratum 1 servers have an Atomic clock or GPS? If not, setC > them with a fudge to stratum 12 or so. Having a false ticker St 1fC > NTP server is very bad karma. If it serves its time to the world,n' > lots of people will be really pissed.r  C We are going to use GPS receivers, and they will serve only for ourg internal network..   > B > Why are you running 3 strata? Once it is running, you can handleE > several thousand clients. Check your network though, high variationm: > in round-trip time, or asymetric delays can clobber you. >   ' Why 3 strata, what will be your advice? G We will use two stratum-1 servers with GPS, 14 stratum-2 nodes (we havem? 14 main centra in the country) and the other ones as stratum-3.    > --> > Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,9 > +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.nB >                                              West Australia 60760 > Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked. >A     Sent via Deja.comp http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:04:21 +0100n) From: "Sipos Anik" <siposa@bbf.mavrt.hu>l Subject: Re: NTP on VMS 7.1., Message-ID: <94mqvr$a6e$1@athena.euroweb.hu>  " Thanks for anyone who sent answer!2 I am very happy, you try to help me. Thanks again.  B Our machines are Alphas. In some days I check your advices and askF again. I hope we CAN solve the problem, because the firm who installed. our system not able to solve since last April.  
 See you soon:p Ruzsi    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:01:19 GMTn From: kauludo@my-deja.comm' Subject: Re: Printing problems in TCPIPm) Message-ID: <94m5kt$kto$1@nnrp1.deja.com>l  ; We have the same problems with lpd-Queues. So we change thei" Printsymbiont to TCPIP$Telnetsym .  G We have 85 TCPIP-Queues in combination with Lantronix Printserver MPS1,. and they are working fine.< I wrote for each Queue a Commandfile (1) with this content :  5 $ @COMFILES:INI_telnet_DEVICE MPS_1b2460:4002 22_124rt  ( Where comfiles          is the directory/       ini_telnet_device is the init commandfilei6       MPS_1b2460        is the Name of the Printserver:       :4002             is the tcp-port of the Printserver0       22_124r           is the name of the Queue  * Content of the ini_telnet_device.com (2) :   $ INITIALIZE    /QUEUE -                 /START -,                 /PROCESSOR=tcpip$TELNETSYM -%                 /DEFAULT=(FORM=ZDA) -h                 /LIBRARY=ZDA -&                 /sep=(reset=(reset)) -                 /ON="''P1'" -                  'p2   B Where Form=ZDA    is a Form that we create with a fixed PagelengthG       LIBRARY=ZDA is a copyed libarary from PWRK$DEVCTL_HP_LASERJET.TLBx3                   ( because we use Pathworksserver)bA       sep=(reset=(reset)) is a reset - Modul which prevents for a 3                           blank page after printingoB       P1          is the variable for the Printservername and port"       P2          is the Queuename  E Before you can use the Printqueue you must assign a TCPIP-Address fori the Printserver.9 ( TCPIP> set host <printserver> /address=xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx)e  1 A third Commandfile startet all commandfiles (1).    Regards,   Udo Kaul     Sent via Deja.coml http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 11:03:58 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e Subject: Re: QuixoticVMS? H Message-ID: <y4lms1z2pd.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  2 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:  6 > R3 coincided with the decline in Digitals financial 8 > performance and it could simply be the case that there; > wasn't the cash and other resources available to persuade  > SAP to support OpenVMS.n  I IIRC, DEC had a cash reserve of $2G at the time it was bought by Compaq. i Terry?   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:17:15 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brh Subject: Re: QuixoticVMS?xL Message-ID: <OFEC599EF7.2F840AFF-ON032569DE.003DE494@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  > Probably , the way to the OpenVMS return to te market is  with< the old companies (developers) with a high base of products, like Rossinc...    Regardsl   FC        D Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> em 24/01/2001 08:03:58b             Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt       Assunto: Re: QuixoticVMS?     2 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:  5 > R3 coincided with the decline in Digitals financiald8 > performance and it could simply be the case that there; > wasn't the cash and other resources available to persuades > SAP to support OpenVMS.e  H IIRC, DEC had a cash reserve of $2G at the time it was bought by Compaq. Terry?        Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:51:32 GMT=4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> Subject: Re: QuixoticVMS?e< Message-ID: <8SCb6.2632$KO3.1220419@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  L "Jan Vorbrueggen" <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> wrote inJ message news:y4lms1z2pd.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de...4 > andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes: >e7 > > R3 coincided with the decline in Digitals financiale: > > performance and it could simply be the case that there= > > wasn't the cash and other resources available to persuadee > > SAP to support OpenVMS.0 >mJ > IIRC, DEC had a cash reserve of $2G at the time it was bought by Compaq. > Terry?  G IIRC the First National Bank of Digital was worth over $3B USD when thew acquisition took place.u   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 07:50:16 GMTt From: Didier.Morandi@gmx.frt4 Subject: Rdb structure recovery after backup/noimage) Message-ID: <94m1fo$h2a$1@nnrp1.deja.com>m  H I have a tape with an image backup of an Rdb (7.0.14) database. The diskI was a raid set made of two RZ28. I had to build a new machine without HSZtF controllers, so I did a VMS volumeset to get sufficient disk space and restored the backup on-line.  B When I wish to access the database via sql, I get an Rdb crashdumpF complaining about no access to its .RUJ. I understand that Rdb doesn'tI like very much its new disk structure. So, I went to RMUG/Alter and tried C different combinations of verify, uncorrupt and so on which gave no  errors.p  9 But when I do an RMU/verify mydb.rdb I get the same dump:X  4 ***** Exception at 0003D4C4 : DBR$RECOVER + 000009046 %RDMS-F-FILACCERR, error opening run-unit journal file- DISK$USER:[RDM$RUJ]ISLK_DB$00015E70E57E.RUJ;1  -RMS-E-FNF, file not found   R0  (V  ) 000000000059A2C0:PC     696E752D6E757220676E696E65706F18  0059A2C0   '.opening run-uni' C     000000000000006C616E72756F6A2074  0059A2D0   't journal.......'.C     0000000100000100FFC88A78FFC88A78  0059A2E0   'x..x..........'aC     52244D44525B3A52455355244B534944  0059A2F0   'DISK$USER:[RDM$R'[C     35313030302442445F4B4C53495D4A55  0059A300   'UJ]ISLK_DB$00015'8C     000000313B4A55522E45373545303745  0059A310   'E70E57E.RUJ;1...'d  H and actually it doesn't exist. What command should I make to rebuild the whole environment of my base?  Thanks,    D.     Sent via Deja.com* http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:12:49 +0400 4 From: Valentin Likoum <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru>8 Subject: Re: Rdb structure recovery after backup/noimage4 Message-ID: <8122702485.20010124141249@ncc.volga.ru>  B On 24.01.2001 Didier.Morandi@gmx.fr <Didier.Morandi@gmx.fr> wrote:  J > I have a tape with an image backup of an Rdb (7.0.14) database. The diskK > was a raid set made of two RZ28. I had to build a new machine without HSZgH > controllers, so I did a VMS volumeset to get sufficient disk space and > restored the backup on-line.  D > When I wish to access the database via sql, I get an Rdb crashdumpH > complaining about no access to its .RUJ. I understand that Rdb doesn'tK > like very much its new disk structure. So, I went to RMUG/Alter and triedeE > different combinations of verify, uncorrupt and so on which gave noS	 > errors.m  ; > But when I do an RMU/verify mydb.rdb I get the same dump:h  6 > ***** Exception at 0003D4C4 : DBR$RECOVER + 000009048 > %RDMS-F-FILACCERR, error opening run-unit journal file/ > DISK$USER:[RDM$RUJ]ISLK_DB$00015E70E57E.RUJ;1* > -RMS-E-FNF, file not found [snip]  =   Didier, most likely you've done non-native backup of opened1B database with transaction(s) in progress. Good way to corrupt your< data. So it happened. Restored database knows that there wasF uncommitted transaction and tries to rollback it, but can't as rolbackD info (RUJ file) is inaccessible. If original database is still aliveE then RMU /BACKUP/ [/ONLINE] it and use _this_ backup, not VMS backup.bD Otherwise you could restore from last backup and apply AIJ journals.G If backup is inaccessible as well, you could cross your fingers in hopeCE that it was read-only transaction and remove pointer to RUJ file fromoE database header (IIRC, rmu /alter, sorry details are out of cache :).s   --     Valentin Likoumr'   valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.spam_not.rur   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 07:58:29 -0500e2 From: norm lastovica <norman.lastovica@oracle.com>8 Subject: Re: Rdb structure recovery after backup/noimage* Message-ID: <3A6ED175.7499CAD5@oracle.com>  D VMS backups of Rdb databases are not supported.  You need to use theG RMU /BACKUP command to backup the database and the RMU /RESTORE commandtD to restore it.  It sounds like you did the vms backup of an databaseB that was not properly shut down (or you used the /IGNORE=INTERLOCKD qualifier).  In any case, the database that you have is inconsistant and quite possibly corrupt.  m  C If the original database has been lost, then you should call Oracle-C Rdb support and they can walk you through the steps needed to patch0K the database so that it can be opened, and then you can verify the database D to make sure that you didn't cause any data loss or corruption.  If E any corruption is discovered, you'll probably want to manually unloadeE all of the data (table by table) and then re-create the database and V& reload the data into the new database.   Didier.Morandi@gmx.fr wrote: > J > I have a tape with an image backup of an Rdb (7.0.14) database. The diskK > was a raid set made of two RZ28. I had to build a new machine without HSZVH > controllers, so I did a VMS volumeset to get sufficient disk space and > restored the backup on-line. > D > When I wish to access the database via sql, I get an Rdb crashdumpH > complaining about no access to its .RUJ. I understand that Rdb doesn'tK > like very much its new disk structure. So, I went to RMUG/Alter and triedmE > different combinations of verify, uncorrupt and so on which gave no 	 > errors.s > ; > But when I do an RMU/verify mydb.rdb I get the same dump:a > 6 > ***** Exception at 0003D4C4 : DBR$RECOVER + 000009048 > %RDMS-F-FILACCERR, error opening run-unit journal file/ > DISK$USER:[RDM$RUJ]ISLK_DB$00015E70E57E.RUJ;1o > -RMS-E-FNF, file not found >  > R0  (V  ) 000000000059A2C0: E >     696E752D6E757220676E696E65706F18  0059A2C0   '.opening run-uni'CE >     000000000000006C616E72756F6A2074  0059A2D0   't journal.......' E >     0000000100000100FFC88A78FFC88A78  0059A2E0   'x..x..........' E >     52244D44525B3A52455355244B534944  0059A2F0   'DISK$USER:[RDM$R' E >     35313030302442445F4B4C53495D4A55  0059A300   'UJ]ISLK_DB$00015' E >     000000313B4A55522E45373545303745  0059A310   'E70E57E.RUJ;1...'o > J > and actually it doesn't exist. What command should I make to rebuild the > whole environment of my base?7	 > Thanks,f >  > D. >  > Sent via Deja.com< > http://www.deja.com/   --  > norman lastovica / oracle rdb engineering / usa / 610.696.4685   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:59:39 +0000s0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>N Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardware* Message-ID: <3A6EB59B.B0BB92DE@uk.sun.com>   Bob Koehler wrote: > _ > In article <3A6DC147.891F5982@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:  > I > So OK, Microsoft wasn't doing the same thing.  Just sounds close.  IMHOt3 > that means you have to really have justification.s >   # No it does not sound close at all. -  3 Let me ask you a question, do you consider that say 4 an Oracle JDBC driver or a Sybase one is an attempt 3 by Oracle or Sybase to subvert the Java standard byr2 introducing proprietary extensions or is it simply4 a usefull tool to allow you to get access to Oracle 1 or Sybase from Java without having to write reamsm of code yourself.m   Which is it. > >s1 > > Well of course if you are trying to develop ag7 > > cross platform application where all the components 4 > > in your application can run on any platform then > > this would be true.l > I > Kind of screws the point on writing in Java.  I simply contend the callo& > for it isn't large enough to bother. >   0 Strange the IBM and IBM's customers don't agree - with you and neither do I and I at least have 1 experience in using the AS/400 toolkit which you P don't.  0 I have used it very effectively to allow a Java . app to access files on an AS/400 as part of a . call center app. We could have written our own0 interface but why bother, IBM provide it as part of the toolkit.-  5 > > What would you prefer, people continually rolling27 > > their own when it comes to OpenVMS->Java interfaces:6 > > or a set of classes supplied, supported and tested4 > > by Compaq that do this for you. If you answer is+ > > rolling your own then god help OpenVMS.e > G > Why not?  I was taught roll your own is the UNIX paradim and therefortJ > the future of computing.  No need for a real file system, just roll your" > own on top of a byte stream, ... > E > The real point is how easy it is to do.  Not a monster to be tamed.h > : > > But not all features and not supported by anyone, what= > > happens if there is a bug in the 50 lines of code offeredS* > > up, who fixes it, who supports it etc. > J > The same folks who support all the other code.  Sun supports the code itG > sells, Compaq supports the code it sells, Oracle supports the code itiD > sells, ...  Why should a vendor consider this to be any different? >   A Hang on the 50 lines of code you refer to wern't writen by Compaqs@ they were written by a poster to this group and then offered to B another poster. There is nothing wrong with this, but don't expect Compaq to support it.+    I > If you can define "OpenVMS process queues" I can access it via the JNI. J > (There's no such term in OpenVMS.)  All services provided by OpenVMS areF > accessable via a language independent API for native code.  Reaching > that via the JNI is trivial. >   ? But again uneccesary if you want to access something similar ona> the AS/400 you use the IBM toolkit. You don't need to use JNI 0 you don't need to write a line of code yourself.  = Now I know that this may be trivial to you, but remember many?= people out there doing programming are not really programming < they are assembling components thats what VB for example is < all about. The component assemblers don't have your level of
 expertise.  B > You seem to think programming on OpenVMS or interfacing with theC > services it provides must be hard.  Wrong.  It was wrong when youeI > thought Java couldn't access RMS features and its wrong for the rest ofe > VMS.  < No I don't it is simply a skill that many people don't have.   Regardsi Andrew Harrisont Enterprise IT ArchitectR   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 08:45:26 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler)N Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardware+ Message-ID: <fGONKlmr4rqh@eisner.decus.org>w  ] In article <3A6EB59B.B0BB92DE@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:m > Bob Koehler wrote:   > % > No it does not sound close at all. h  =  Maybe not to you or me, but some PHM is making the decision.s   > 5 > Let me ask you a question, do you consider that saye6 > an Oracle JDBC driver or a Sybase one is an attempt 5 > by Oracle or Sybase to subvert the Java standard bye4 > introducing proprietary extensions or is it simply6 > a usefull tool to allow you to get access to Oracle 3 > or Sybase from Java without having to write reamsb > of code yourself.s >   ;    IIRC there are already Java classes defined for JDBC.  I ?    would expect Oracle to provide code connecting those classes     to Oracle's product.    > 2 > Strange the IBM and IBM's customers don't agree / > with you and neither do I and I at least have 3 > experience in using the AS/400 toolkit which you   > don't.  > I don't know AS/400.  Past experience with IBM OS' gave me theE impression they're harder to code with than VMS or UNIX.  The toolkit2* could address this issue, I wouldn't know.  2 > I have used it very effectively to allow a Java 0 > app to access files on an AS/400 as part of a  > call center app. 5  F There's the rub.  Why in the world can't you access AS/400 files usingG Java's I/O classes?  I certainly access VMS' RMS files all the time viaaB Java I/O.  UNIX, WIndows, and MacOS files with the same code, even< though I've nver seen a more complex file than a MacOS file.  C > Hang on the 50 lines of code you refer to wern't writen by CompaqPB > they were written by a poster to this group and then offered to D > another poster. There is nothing wrong with this, but don't expect > Compaq to support it.s  H Compaq doesn't support any of the code I write or grab off the network. * Neither does Sun.  Why should they?  I do.  C >> You seem to think programming on OpenVMS or interfacing with thepD >> services it provides must be hard.  Wrong.  It was wrong when youJ >> thought Java couldn't access RMS features and its wrong for the rest of >> VMS.e > > > No I don't it is simply a skill that many people don't have. >   G I'll put this as plainly as I can.  I can get any junior programmer offhF the street and have them writing this code in a few days with no prior% VMS or JNI experience.  It's trivial.a  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationd= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil Group E                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replying    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:11:19 -0000 * From: "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>Y Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardware   questionE, Message-ID: <94md8j$11io@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>  [ "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message news:3A6EAC9B.9A669DB9@gtech.com...   / > Also http://java.sun.com/j2se/ only list 1.3.h > 9 > So how can it only work with something newer than 1.3 ?h  ! See http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.3/a  E "JavaTM 2 SDK, Standard Edition, v 1.3.0_01 ... provides Java supportP for Netscape 6."   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:21:15 +0100 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> W Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion)e) Message-ID: <3A6EAC9B.9A669DB9@gtech.com>s   Richard Brodie wrote:  > ] > "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message news:3A6D9128.BD0683D6@gtech.com...  > ) > > AFAIK then Mozilla requires JDK 1.3 !d > = > Unfortunately no. It only supports versions later than 1.3.-   ????  , http://www.mozilla.org/docs/mozilla-faq.html   3.9) I *really* want Java H      Mozilla now supports OJI (Open JavaVM Interface) that allows you to use a Plugin JVM.p4      Compatible JVMs include but are not limited to:
        Japhar         Sun JDK 1.3beta=      More information is available at mozilla.org's OJI page.c  - Also http://java.sun.com/j2se/ only list 1.3.s  7 So how can it only work with something newer than 1.3 ?l   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:23:24 +0100t= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>-W Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion)c) Message-ID: <3A6EE55C.D12D4922@gtech.com>S   Richard Brodie wrote:F] > "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message news:3A6EAC9B.9A669DB9@gtech.com...u1 > > Also http://java.sun.com/j2se/ only list 1.3.p > >w; > > So how can it only work with something newer than 1.3 ?  > # > See http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.3/. > G > "JavaTM 2 SDK, Standard Edition, v 1.3.0_01 ... provides Java supporto > for Netscape 6."   OK.s   I have not noticed that.  E But my original point that Andrew Harrisons claim, that JDK 1.2.2 fort VMS B was not complete because it was missing mozilla support, was bogus should still be valid.a   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:31:20 +0000e0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>W Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion) * Message-ID: <3A6EF548.10AC9644@uk.sun.com>   Arne Vajh=F8j wrote: > =d   > Richard Brodie wrote:iJ > > "Arne Vajh=F8j" <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in message news:3A6EAC= 9B.9A669DB9@gtech.com...3 > > > Also http://java.sun.com/j2se/ only list 1.3.e > > >e= > > > So how can it only work with something newer than 1.3 ?. > >n% > > See http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.3/> > >eJ > > "JavaTM 2 SDK, Standard Edition, v 1.3.0_01 ... provides Java support=   > > for Netscape 6." > =t   > OK.h > =e   > I have not noticed that. > =e  G > But my original point that Andrew Harrisons claim, that JDK 1.2.2 forE > VMS D > was not complete because it was missing mozilla support, was bogus > should > still be valid.o > =i    6 Well its hardly bogus, its just worse than I suggested5 The 1.2.X JVM is available for OpenVMS and neither isa7 the plugin. The 1.3.X JVM isn't available for OpenVMS =c  * at all (well there is an alpha release). =     Regards  Andrew Harrisonp Enterprise IT Architectt   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:00:42 +0100s= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> W Subject: Re: Rehash of Andrew's Java on OpenVMS FUD.  (was: Re: GS160 hardwarequestion)u) Message-ID: <3A6EFC2A.148F467F@gtech.com>a   andrew harrison wrote:8 > Well its hardly bogus, its just worse than I suggested7 > The 1.2.X JVM is available for OpenVMS and neither isu7 > the plugin. The 1.3.X JVM isn't available for OpenVMSb* > at all (well there is an alpha release).   It is indeed not good for VMS.  A But it illustrates how well you check your facts before posting !t   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:38:38 GMTr, From: SANFACE Software <sanface@sanface.com> Subject: SHAREWARE: txt2pdf 4.3f) Message-ID: <94m7qu$mhn$1@nnrp1.deja.com>9  5 txt2pdf is a very flexible and powerful PERL5 programu@ (5 penguins at LinuxBerg, 5 cows at TuCows Mac, BeOS and PSION).5 It's a converter from text files to PDF format files.0 Why do you need txt2pdf?% Most of your documents are text files9F Usually, your reports from legacy applications, DBs, ERP applications, datawarehouse are textual G txt2pdf is a PERL5 script, so you can use it in every operating systems  supported by PERL5,x: if you prefer we distribute also executables for these OS:E Windows,Linux,Solaris,AIX,HP-UX,FreeBSD. Inside the Windows version ad VB GUI (Visual txt2pdf)-= txt2pdf is a native converter, you don't need to pass throughm PostScript formatv2 txt2pdf is specific for text to PDF conversion, soC you can mark coloured (using PERL regular expression) frases in the4 produced PDF filesF you can mark bold, italic, bolditalic frases in the produced PDF files% you can add page number in every page > you can add text at the beginning and at the end of every file" you can add a border to every page; every word like http://... ftp://... mailto:... https://...s. file:... ldap:... news:...  will become an URL> you can create a link to a specific page within a PDF document http://...pdfdocument#pdfmark C every word like mime:... will become a link that launch the correctr application and opens the file, you can use background and foreground layersG every predefined encodings, supported by the PDF format, is supported +  the Unix default! txt2pdf supports STDIN and STDOUTm9 EPD 1.0 support. You can use EPD inside background layer.0  the fee for every licence is $85C SANFACE Software is going to give you a free licence for every goodE idea or for every good modifyn   txt2pdf is shareware5 The txt2pdf source code is our company core business.e
 We trust you.t$ You can test text2pdf and modify it.E You can't use a modify version of txt2pdf for production purpose. YoueG can't resell txt2pdf or a modify version of it without SANFACE Softwarel authorization.C You can't copy part of it to include in your source without SANFACE/ Software authorization.u   What's new in this version  E Now it's possible to convert Windows files with blank inside the path.6 txt2pdf.cgi 3.0 it's free code in the contributed zoneC http://www.infomotions.com/pstoepd/ PostScript To EPD is an on linet converter from@ PostScript graphic file to EPD http://epd.sourceforge.net (a new encapsulated vectorialA graphic format). In the same time you can convert your PostScript-  graphic also to PDF, TIFF, JPEG.F We'd like to make a gallery with the best EPD: help us sending us your	 best EPD! E Visual_txt2pdf 1.2 inside the Windows distribution (with new maximize3 feature)   Test txt2pdf 4.3! 6 You can find it at http://www.sanface.com/txt2pdf.html Don't forget txt2pdf 4.x PRO at & http://www.sanface.com/txt2pdfPRO.html and txt2pdf PRO + Japanese att' http://www.sanface.com/txt2pdfPROj.html    -- SANFACE Software= Your technology glasses. We help you see your full potential.) http://www.sanface.com mailto:sanface@sanface.com# WAP     http://www.sanface.com/wap/m! i-mode  http://www.sanface.com/i/e     Sent via Deja.com  http://www.deja.com/   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 17:24:31 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>m7 Subject: Re: stop decw$session = kill SUN CDE server...nH Message-ID: <y4ofwwkjeo.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  L I think that is to be expected - the session manager exiting probably does aL reset to the X server (always a good idea with those memory leaks et al. allI over the place), and that kills all extant sessions. Who said X was easy?a   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 10:41:16 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>e9 Subject: Re: Timme difference between two kinds of BACKUP H Message-ID: <y41ytti8xv.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  ( Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de> writes:  I > should blocksize be N*clustersize*512? Also sould be the /EXTEND equeal  > M*clustersize?  L Block size and cluster size have no relation. Extend size should be as largeL as possible, but that's a general failing of ODS-2 that should be changed atH the root. HH, could you pass a note to the current XQP maintainer to addL Glenn's extend algorithm to the code? In the mean time, BACKUP could set theE extend sizes on its disk savesets to the maximum value and handle the5L resulting errors when it exceeds the process's disk quota or the disk's freeN space. It cannot, in general, pre-compute the amount of data it needs to writeI - the only possible place is an image (and possibly a /FAST?) backup to a9M disk saveset, and that probably is too much bother; my suggestion above helps9" any disk saveset backup operation.           Jan                    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:15:15 -0500o- From: "Richard D. Piccard" <piccard@ohio.edu>i6 Subject: Re: Urgent:Error recovering files from backup( Message-ID: <3A6EFF8E.B737E8E5@ohio.edu>  I Are you sure that the tape was written with /media=compact?  Try without.-  #                                 RDP      Nivlesh Chandra wrote:  N > I have a tape that contains a  backup that was done using the backup commandG > in VMS. Now when I try and recover the file I get the following error2 >u6 > excessive error rate reading $2$MKA300:[000000]*.*;* > software header crc errord > + > I used the following to restore the files  > " > $ mount $2$mka300 /media=compactN > $ backup $2$mka300:[000000]bak-13-12-99.bck;1 /save disk44:[recover...]*.*;*0 > /log /list=disk$scratch:bak.lis /nocrc /rewind >.J > Then since I was getting so much error.. I thought I would just copy theH > saveset onto the disk and then recover .. I used the following command > A > $ backup $2$mka300:[000000]*.*;* disk44:[test]*.*;* /log /nocrc  >f% > but received the same error messageO >lL > Please I really need to get the files in this saveset and if someone could* > help me I would really appreciate it ... >r > Please respond...g >  > Niv    --B ==================================================================B Dick Piccard                           Academic Technology ManagerB piccard@ohio.edu                                 Computer ServicesB http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~piccard/                Ohio University   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 11:56:31 +0100G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>u$ Subject: Re: VMS bug in 21st CenturyH Message-ID: <y4d7ddz09s.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  ? Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes:a  , >   - SYS$FAO is not year 10000 ready (!!!!)  N No, it's $ASCTIM that isn't Y10K ready. There is an old SPR, it's main subjectM probably 29 February 2000, that notes this display problem and states it willa be fixed in time.y  N I didn't know SHOW SYSTEM had been fixed...probably for demo purposes only, as< a real fix would require quite some work all over the place.   	Jan   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Jan 2001 09:34:25 -0600& From: Charles Sebold <sebold@lcms.org>@ Subject: Re: VMS vs UNIX (was: Linux worm and RedHat 7.0 broken), Message-ID: <m3puhd7ym6.fsf@sebold.lcms.org>  ( On 29 Teveth 5761, Christof Brass wrote:  H >> Linux didn't start with any grand vision.  All operating systems comeH >> with some historical baggage.  I've programmed for WinNT a lot, VMS aD >> little, and now use mostly Linux.  Of those three OSes I considerC >> Unix to have the cleanest most intelligent design.  When I first G >> started using and programming for Linux it took me a while to get tonD >> like it - after a while I began to realize how simple and elegant >> Unix programming is.  >> r > @ > Stating that Linux (or should we say Linus Thorvalds?) started? > without any grand vision seems to kill the enthusiasm and thec: > trust of getting something real innovative with Linux. I; > wouldn't go that far but I think the vision wasn't on theuB > technical, specifically the architectural, the algorithmical and< > the UI side. Could we agree that there was a vision on the8 > social, political and eventually anti-commercial side?  E I don't think that Linus himself had any political or anti-commerciallG vision originally, in fact I don't think he does now, either.  A bit ofpC an anti-Microsoft agenda at times, perhaps, but the few things thataG Linus has said about Free Software suggest that he's not a fanatic; thee@ original GPL-ing of the kernel was more of a convenience, and anE incentive for others to come hack the kernel with him without fear ofr! losing their work, than anything.s  F I think that originally his challenge wasn't to create a new operatingF system but to create something usable and recognizable (as you pointedF out earlier, as a college student, no less), and possibly just to bestE Tannenbaum and Minix with a monolithic kernel.  Now it's such a beast0F that truly new innovations are hard to work into the scheme of things;B they have to keep up with the Joneses (Solaris Jones and NT Jones, mostly).  F But of course Linus claims that VMS was all engineering and no design, so what does he know? *smiles* --  " Charles Sebold, Systems Specialist$ LCMS - Office of Information Systems5 *** Opinions expressed herein are not necessarily ***h5 *** those of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod ***  -- 29th of Teveth, 5761 --G A consultant is a person who borrows your watch, tells you what time itb3 is, pockets the watch, and sends you a bill for it.    ------------------------------   Date: 24 Jan 2001 05:25 CSTa' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)i& Subject: RE: VMS writable CD on Win2K?- Message-ID: <24JAN200105251729@gerg.tamu.edu>a  % Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> writes...e4 }Well one can always hope, but I do see the problem. } D }Is it too much to expect that a such a drive purchased at the local3 }electornics superstore (Fry's) will work with VMS?t }  }Tom  D Someone who knows more about this than I do will probably reply, but/ nobody has so far, so from what I have heard...e  E The main criteria for it to work is that it needs to support 512 bytei blocks. Some do, some don't.  B The other main criteria is that you pretty much need to be runningA at least version 6.2 of VMS (newer is better - version 7.2-1 withpE any appropraite ECOs would be best). A few (very few) CD-Rs may workssF with versions of VMS that are earlier than this - but those drives areD old ones that aren't made anymore so you probably can't buy them off
 the shelf.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:41:00 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) & Subject: RE: VMS writable CD on Win2K?0 Message-ID: <009F6959.14102BC1@SendSpamHere.ORG>  ] In article <EJEDILJIPPJOIEFOLDHLOEJHCEAA.tom@kednos.com>, Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> writes:w4 >Well one can always hope, but I do see the problem. >oD >Is it too much to expect that a such a drive purchased at the local3 >electornics superstore (Fry's) will work with VMS?a  G Huh???  Sorry but I can't follow what you're trying to do.  At first, ItH read it as if you have the device on the Weendoze box and somehow wantedF to network mount it on VMS.  Now you seem to be saying some device youH purchased at some PeeCee outlet (sorry, never heard of Fry) doesn't work on a VMS system.  What is it?w  G Did you just plug this device into your PeeCee and it worked?  Or, did -H you have to dick about with loading drivers, etc, and reboots?  If it's ; the latter, why not ask the drive mfg for a VMS driver?  ;)S   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMr             O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.1   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:20:26 +0000f- From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> & Subject: Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?) Message-ID: <3A6ED69A.D45F0283@bbc.co.uk>    "David J. Dachtera" wrote:  0 > ...and that's not to mention CD-RW or DVD-RAM. >l   DVD-R is coming too, so I hear.i  --3  6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.ukr  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of2 MedAS or the BBC.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:25:04 +0000j% From: Alan Greig <agreig@my-deja.com>n& Subject: Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?8 Message-ID: <fpst6toi5p48k137h07e0aqa5q2054hbrm@4ax.com>  1 On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:20:26 +0000, Tim Llewellynt  <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote:   >. >6 >"David J. Dachtera" wrote:F > 1 >> ...and that's not to mention CD-RW or DVD-RAM.l >> >t  >DVD-R is coming too, so I hear.  A And I saw a report somewhere that the major CD manufacturers have)@ agreed to release MF CD or whatever it's called (Multi-frequency< laser). Up to 100 GB on a CD. Could DVD be obsolete already?   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:34:56 -0500 % From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>'& Subject: Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?/ Message-ID: <t6u12pst176h61@news.supernews.com>   B "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message' news:3A6E3017.E4A79C90@earthlink.net...0 > Tom Linden wrote:o > >-7 > > Well one can always hope, but I do see the problem.h > >fG > > Is it too much to expect that a such a drive purchased at the localg6 > > electornics superstore (Fry's) will work with VMS? >eC > Probably. Even if it is a SCSI device, a thread (or two) recently6@ > covered the lack of suitable drivers for CD-R on VMS. Rather a9 > challenge, given the diversity of CD-R drive out there.t >g0 > ...and that's not to mention CD-RW or DVD-RAM. >e  K I've had a CD-R attached to a VMS system for years.  Both VAX and Alpha.  Ip= didn't have to write my own driver, DKdriver works just fine.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:53:41 +0000 - From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>l& Subject: Re: VMS writable CD on Win2K?) Message-ID: <3A6F0895.62D9990A@bbc.co.uk>-   Alan Greig wrote:   3 > On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:20:26 +0000, Tim Llewellyn." > <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote: >  > >d > >  > >"David J. Dachtera" wrote:  > > 3 > >> ...and that's not to mention CD-RW or DVD-RAM.. > >> > > " > >DVD-R is coming too, so I hear. > C > And I saw a report somewhere that the major CD manufacturers have B > agreed to release MF CD or whatever it's called (Multi-frequency> > laser). Up to 100 GB on a CD. Could DVD be obsolete already? >w  H Yeah, I want one! However DVD-R is alledgedly almost shipping (in hi end macs).H Can burn CDR's and DVD-R's (not the same as DVD-RAM). Mind you they seem    to be only 1x or 2x write speed.  F I sure hope those 100GB rewriteables, when they arrive, can be written at aF decent rate, otherwise you're gonna NEED and VMS system to have enough8 guaranteed uptime to write that 100 gigs at 100k/sec :-)    -- 6 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk   A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of= MedAS or the BBC.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 18:12:13 +0100 0 From: "Jean-Luc RAYON" <jl.rayon@lacouronne.com>* Subject: Re: Why is the tape write locked?, Message-ID: <94n3h7$ak4$1@reader1.fr.uu.net>   $help mount/writes   MOUNT6     /WRITE  2        Controls whether the volume can be written.  
        Format             /WRITEh            /NOWRITE     %     Additional information available:a       Examplee   MOUNT /WRITE Subtopic? example     MOUNT      /WRITE       Examplen  /        $ MOUNT/CLUSTER/NOWRITE NODE$DBA1: BOOKS   F            This command mounts a volume labeled BOOKS on NODE$DBA1 andI            then proceeds to mount it on each node in the existing OpenVMSeI            Cluster. The /NOWRITE qualifier makes the volume available foro            read-only access.  4 NoSpam <NoSpam@NoSpam.com> a crit dans le message :' 94ln5u$7fk$1@slb3.atl.mindspring.net...LL > First, I am working at home, so if anyone can respond via email, my *REAL*4 > email address is mailto:DOlivastro@ChiResearch.com >h2 > I have a command procedure that looks like this: > 6 > $ mount /nowrite /for /rec:28 /bs:5600 /nounload c1:- > $ mount /for /rec:28 /bs:5600 /nounload c2:a > $ sort /key=(...) c1: c2:, ...o   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Jan 2001 05:40 CSTf' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)sC Subject: Re: [Q]: Resetting privileged password on a DECserver 200?i- Message-ID: <24JAN200105400476@gerg.tamu.edu>2  < (Ken Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515) writes...' }    	LBohan@dbc.spam_less..com writes:e }[...]' }> Well..., there's always brute force.u }> P }> Yank the power cord.  }> i/ }> Hold down the square red (S1) button, while a }> plugging back in.   }>  ' }> This will reset to factory defaults.e } I }        Thanks to Larry and Rich Jordan (as  well as a couple of privateeI }    e-mails)  for  the  reset "drill".  It turns out that  five  minutesmI }    after posting my query, I discovered the  yellow  Post-It  with  the I }    privilege  password  in the back of an _old_ TSM manual (not the onec< }    I'd been perusing).  Always seems to happen that way... } I }        I'm  still  somewhat  confused  about  _setting_  the  privilegeaI }    password.  Can you only set it after it's been cleared via the resetaI }    described  above?   I can't find a command in the docs or help  thatP }    seems to do it. } I }        Oh, and yes, I  do  know  the  default  passwords after a reset:o5 }    they're clearly called out in the documentation.o }  }        Thanks, Ken }-- N } Kenneth H. Fairfield            |  Internet: Fairfield@SLC.Slac.Stanford.Edu  E Before anybody does such a reset they should be certain to record the A settings for every port since all the ports also get reset to thelF default settings. As does the things address and any other server-wideB settings. When it gets reset to factory defaults, it *really* gets0 reset to factory defaults in every possible way.   --- Carl   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.048 ************************