1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 31 Jul 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 422       Contents: Re: 7.3 system disk corruption9 ??== Installed DCPS 2.0: Two observations and a question. = Re: ??== Installed DCPS 2.0: Two observations and a question. ( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate( Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate Re: Another VAX to Alpha port ( Apache on VMS - httpd.conf and .htaccess. cancel <3B66C716.B3EE72FC@unnecessary.csc.com>% Re: Change account password using web  Re: checking some myths. Re: checking some myths. Re: checking some myths. DCL PIPE query Re: DCL PIPE query DCPS V2.0 and VMS 6.2  Re: DCPS V2.0 and VMS 6.2 & Re: DEC/EDI v3.2B Contrl message query+ Error Loading Proxies under TCPIP V5.1-ECO1 0 Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.30 Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.30 Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.30 Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.30 Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.3$ Re: Few People in DEC Understood....$ Re: Few People in DEC Understood....( Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today...( Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today...( Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today...( Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today... Re: Game for Computer Pros Re: Game for Computer Pros Re: Game for Computer Pros Re: Game for Computer Pros Re: Goodbye, good friend DEC Re: Goodbye, good friend DEC how to replace BIOS battery  Re: how to replace BIOS battery - IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison 1 Re: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison 1 Re: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison 1 Re: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison : Re: IPF Console Bootstrap (was: Re: No chance for OpenVMS): Re: IPF Console Bootstrap (was: Re: No chance for OpenVMS): Re: IPF Console Bootstrap (was: Re: No chance for OpenVMS)  Re: memory for Alphaserver 4/200# Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing ' Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing & Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearing& Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearing& Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearing& Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearing More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer # Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer ; Opercon question ... since I'm running out of time here ... ' Re: Passing a socket to another process ! PRINTER CARTRIDGE BLOWOUT SALE!!!  Quorum Disk Questions  Re: Quorum Disk Questions  Re: Quorum Disk Questions  Re: Quorum Disk Questions  Reading Mail on other Nodes  Re: Reading Mail on other Nodes   RE: SAN-based Backup for OpenVMS  Re: SAN-based Backup for OpenVMS Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Simple DCL query Re: Soft font modules / DCPS?  Re: Soft font modules / DCPS?  Re: Soft font modules / DCPS?  Re: Steve Reece " Re: Sun goes after Alpha user base Re: Sun keep 'em coming 3 Re: TCPIP v5.1 startup on dial-up service provider. 3 Re: TCPIP v5.1 startup on dial-up service provider.  Re: The death of Storageworks 0 Re: Unsupported Conjecture:  Prune Q for Suitor? Re: What exactly is VMS? What is CRD_Control? Re: What's in it for Intel?  Re: What's in it for Intel?  Re: WHO ARE YOU forum?  Re: Who does migration from VMS? Who has cgi command example  Re: Who has cgi command example  Re: Who has cgi command example I Re: [OT] Market corrections (was Re: Alpha: an invitation to communicate) P Re: [OT] Market corrections (was Re: Alpha: an invitation to communicate) commun  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:11:36 +0100 + From: "Tim Jackson" <tim.jackson@amsjv.com> ' Subject: Re: 7.3 system disk corruption & Message-ID: <3b66821a$1@pull.gecm.com>  F Many thanks to all who replied.  It seems that our problems could haveD been caused by putting an unsupported (not qualified to use Compaq's( phrase) disk (an RZ29B) into the RA3000.  : We have now taken this out and will monitor the situation.D ------------------ Purely Personal Opinion -------------------------D Tim Jackson                                    tim.jackson@amsjv.com Air Systems Group  Alenia Marconi Systems Ltd.   6 "Tim Jackson" <tim.jackson@amsjv.com> wrote in message  news:3b5ef7f5$1@pull.gecm.com...G > Configuration:   DS10 and DS20E, shared SCSI, RAIDarray 3000, OpenVMS E > 7.3 plus latest patches, DECnet-Plus, TCP/IP Services 5.1, Advanced G > Server 7.3 (as BDC), DECwindows Motif 1.2-6, FORTRAN, Pascal, C, C++,  > GKS, DCPS-(Open and Plus). > E > Has anyone experienced corruption of their OpenVMS 7.3 system disk?  WeH > have successfully configured our system, but twice now I have left theG > system running overnight only to come in the next morning to find the B > system disk corrupted.  Many symptoms reported from ANALYZE/DISKH > including multiply allocated blocks, blocks marked free when used, andE > many others I can't remember and which ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR cleared.  >  > TIA F > ------------------ Purely Personal Opinion -------------------------F > Tim Jackson                                    tim.jackson@amsjv.com > Air Systems Group  > Alenia Marconi Systems Ltd.  >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:28:40 +0200 , From: aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de (Hans M. Aus)B Subject: ??== Installed DCPS 2.0: Two observations and a question.D Message-ID: <aus-3107010928400001@wvia48.virologie.uni-wuerzburg.de>  > 1) The following statement appeared while installing DCPS 2.0:  >  Starting with DCPS V2.0, the need for DCPS-OPEN and DCPS-PLUSG         licenses has been eliminated.  The right to use all features of G         DCPS is now included with the OpenVMS operating system license.   H 2) The new DCPS$DEVCTL.TLB;4    27-APR-2001 14:44:16.40 does not includeH the INITPSDEVICE and SETINPUTTRAY modules for the HP4050 (4100). A short# $library listing is included below.   	 QUESTION: H Does this mean that the new HP4000 modules also include HP4050 and I can/ eliminate the extra, home brewed HP4050 table?    @ That is, the DCPS 2.0 startup command no longer requires our ownF HP4050$DEVCTL but rather just the standard DCPS_LIB for the HP4050 and HP4100 printers, also.  L 3) The Postscript version of the installation guide on our CD is incomplete.   ----------------------  $library /list DCPS$DEVCTL.TLB;4P Directory of TEXT library SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]DCPS$DEVCTL.TLB;4 on 31-JUL-2001 08 :59:34D Creation date:  27-APR-2001 14:41:23      Creator:  Librarian A09-22? Revision date:  27-APR-2001 14:44:14      Library format:   3.0 > Number of modules:    237                 Max. key length:  39K Other entries:          0                 Preallocated index blocks:     11 K Recoverable deleted blocks:      0        Total index blocks used:       23 K Max. Number history records:      20      Library history records:       20    ...     LPS$$HPLASERJET4000_INITPSDEVICE  LPS$$HPLASERJET4000_SETINPUTTRAY  LPS$$HPLASERJET4500_INITPSDEVICE  LPS$$HPLASERJET4500_SETINPUTTRAY ...    --  B Cheers, Hans M. Aus, Wuerzburg, Germany,  aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:58:04 -0400 0 From: Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>F Subject: Re: ??== Installed DCPS 2.0: Two observations and a question.; Message-ID: <310720010958046913%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>   D In article <aus-3107010928400001@wvia48.virologie.uni-wuerzburg.de>,- Hans M. Aus <aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de> wrote:   J > 2) The new DCPS$DEVCTL.TLB;4    27-APR-2001 14:44:16.40 does not includeJ > the INITPSDEVICE and SETINPUTTRAY modules for the HP4050 (4100). A short% > $library listing is included below.  >  > QUESTION: J > Does this mean that the new HP4000 modules also include HP4050 and I can0 > eliminate the extra, home brewed HP4050 table?  @ The HP LaserJet 4000 and 4050 are both supported with the deviceD control modules LPS$$HPLASERJET4000_*.  I expect you could eliminate& your home-brewed changes for the 4050.  D The 4100 is not yet supported by DCPS, so you'll have to do a bit of brewing to get that to work.  N > 3) The Postscript version of the installation guide on our CD is incomplete.  C This is the first I've heard of this.  Please post the results of a F DIRECTORY /SIZE=ALL command on the file and also the last few lines of@ the PostScript file.  Is this on the Alpha layered product CD or another CD?    Paul   --    Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineering    Compaq Computer Corporation    ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 00:58:00 -0700/ From: Brannon_Batson@yahoo.com (Brannon Batson) 1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate < Message-ID: <4495ef1f.0107302357.e772b16@posting.google.com>  a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3B65A49D.F1335DAA@videotron.ca>...  > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:O > > I agree you shouldn't trust Sun with an enterprise system.  They don't know # > > how to build a reliable system.  > I > I would trust Sun more that I would Compaq's "industry standard" group.  >  > [snip]  B Well, what do you expect from wintel crap?  But please don't applyC that label uniformly to Compaq's Alpha/VMS/Digital UNIX products as  well.    Brannon  not speaking for Compaq    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:22:56 +0200 * From: Alexis Cousein <al@brussels.sgi.com>1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate / Message-ID: <3B666AE0.4060909@brussels.sgi.com>   ! Martin H=F8yer Kristiansen wrote:    > Alexis Cousein wrote:  >=20
 >>mulp wrote:  >> >>J >>>>Given identical design styles (and tools used to layout transistors),=  E >>>>probably. But in this case, I'd say it's probably anyone's guess, 1 >>>>as design methodologies are really different.  >>>> >>>>5 >>>All things being equal, die size determines yield.  >>>  >>> ( >>Yes. All things, though, aren't equal. >> >=20J > Die size minus SRAM arrays with build in redundancy, is closer to equal=   > ?=20    A Amongst others. But even the way you layout your transistors, and G the design layout tools used influence this -- and how aggressively you % push for higher nominal clock speeds.    --=20 ? <these messages express my own views, not those of my employer> ) Alexis Cousein				Senior Systems Engineer . SGI Belgium and Luxemburg		al@brussels.sgi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 04:27:57 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate , Message-ID: <3B666C09.8AC8EDA3@videotron.ca>   Brannon Batson wrote: D > Well, what do you expect from wintel crap?  But please don't applyE > that label uniformly to Compaq's Alpha/VMS/Digital UNIX products as  > well.   M Up until now, the secret VMS and ALPHA groups were very separate in their own M corner and not integrated into Compaq and were allowed to continue to do what 9 they did under VMS as long as they didn't make any noise.   H But with the death of Alpha, the VMS folks are now forced to start using& hardware produced by the wintel folks.  M I do not know what Compaq said to its "valued" VMS customers, but to the rest H of the VMS customers, Compaq has yet to prove that it is capable of trueL enterprise thinking. Its silly attempt at protraying itself as an enterpriseM company last year only re-enforced Compaq's image as a wintel PC maker (those K tyhin proliants in a VW minivan next to a beach). And its breaking of Alpha X commitments doesn't help in giving Compaq any credibility for true enterprise customers.  L It is possible that Compaq may in fact succeed in merging the mentalities ofN the "quality at all costs" of the Alpha group with the "low cost at all costs"L of the wintel folks. But do not expect customers to actually trust Compaq toJ succeed because Compaq has not proven it can do such a thing since it took over what was left of Digital.  M Compaq should be seriously concerned about its image and lack of credibility. M Even CNN still considers Compaq a simple box maker that is seriously going to D hurt if it doesn't fix its consumer PC business. And you expect trueM enterprise customers to trust a company that can break commitments it made to  customers about Alpha ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:33:47 +0200 * From: Alexis Cousein <al@brussels.sgi.com>1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate / Message-ID: <3B666D6B.8010906@brussels.sgi.com>    Brig Campbell wrote:  N > It is not black magic, it's the foundation for capitalism.  It the mechinismK > for which capital flows from old to new.  At times markets are irrational 1 > but that never lasts, they are self correcting.  >   B As broadly written as here (and without some form of disclaimer toC narrow its focus),  that's not *entirely* cast in stone in economic H theory. Certainly, there are a lot of feedback mechanisms, but not *all*A of seem to be stabilizing *all* of the time. Of course, that also B depends on the timescales you use for "never lasts". There is alsoE unfortunately no certainty that changing market dynamics doesn't make > general rules that applied in the past invalid for the future.  B Of course, if *you* have a perfect crystal ball, we'd all be happyF to hear about your newfound economic theory, so that comp.arch readersD can enjoy a competitive advantage for some time, getting rich in the@ process before the market as a whole compensates so as to render> that crystal ball worthless. All the others claiming they have; one are asking money for the use of their crystal balls ;).    --  ? <these messages express my own views, not those of my employer> ) Alexis Cousein				Senior Systems Engineer . SGI Belgium and Luxemburg		al@brussels.sgi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 02:19:35 +0000 ' From: Paul Campbell <paul@verifarm.com> 1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate 4 Message-ID: <QTu97.1545$L17.338478@news.pacbell.net>   Alexis Cousein wrote:    >  > D > As broadly written as here (and without some form of disclaimer toE > narrow its focus),  that's not *entirely* cast in stone in economic J > theory. Certainly, there are a lot of feedback mechanisms, but not *all*C > of seem to be stabilizing *all* of the time. Of course, that also D > depends on the timescales you use for "never lasts". There is alsoG > unfortunately no certainty that changing market dynamics doesn't make @ > general rules that applied in the past invalid for the future. >      I agree ....  G anyone who's ever done a really big timing-on-the-edge chip knows that  H using tools (such as an economy, or a gate compiler like Synopsis) that G work with extremely large systems with exponetially large state spaces  D (such as an economy or a large block or gates say 50-200k) and just K optimise for local minima is extremely unlikely to find the global minimum  K (like minimum gates, perfect timing or the most efficient economic system)   they're searching for.  K If you've done that reall hard chip and slogged away trying to make timing  = only to get a new release of the sythesis tool and find your  J almost-made-timing vanish in a cloud of smoke - you know you need to have L some sort global optimisation (such as an engineer restructuring code, or a H govt managing the economy in the large [think Greenspan]) to guide your 4 optimisation tool to find that right global minimum.  K (to be fair synopsys these days seems less sensitive to initial conditions  I than it used to - in part I suspect due to it doing more global sorts of : optimisation up front).i  H Of course an economy isn't a chip (more like a hot plate than simulated H anealing - though right now it looks like a bit of that's going on :-). L But the more I think about the almost religious belief I keep seeing in the I Freidman-esque school of thought that sais at it simplest that "personal  G greed causes an economy to run at its most efficient" - I know from my iK personal experience of optimising real-life large systems that it's a very cK simplistic view of the world (remember they give Nobels for economics, but tG not for mathematics - at least you'd think they'd get a few complexity t? theorists in to check his work, and give him a few pointers :-)            Paul  L PS: OB-vms/OB-unix - I did once port Unix (V6/V7) to run with the kernel in @ sup. mode in place of DCL .... but that was a long time ago ....   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:23:38 +0100p% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>t1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicaten8 Message-ID: <181dmtc8iqa20bh464vqekhj05mo1i7hu6@4ax.com>  , On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 21:07:03 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:    >n >sL >At what point will remaining customers know whether Compaq intends to buildM >one server for all OS, or whether VMS will have its own servers ? On the one M >hand, we see messages of VMS booting on "vanilla" IA64s, and on the other we N >see a message such as yours that indicates that VMS will run on highly tested> >quality machines and those two don't necessarily go together.  E Well I've had a PC164 LX running VMS continually now for the last few4D months, Have never found a problem with it so have just bought a VMSE license for it to allow us to use it legally as a development machineiD for a particular group of users. I could not have justified the costC of a DS10 right now for this purpose but I could easily get fundingtE for the cost of a PC - which is what Island sell the 'upgraded' PC164e LX for  A For production critical systems I will always use fully supportediF components but for development systems having VMS run on low end IA64sC should be a big plus in a few years time. Assuming we get there....n -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:00:22 +0100 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicatet* Message-ID: <3B66ABE6.73A5481D@uk.sun.com>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > D > andrew harrison wrote in message <3B65913A.B06CAE83@uk.sun.com>... > >jlsue wrote:o > >>8 > >> On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 14:08:48 +0100, andrew harrison& > >> <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: > >> > >> >8 > >> >Really, the WildFire has a system design bug which8 > >> >means that local memory latency is a whopping 300+: > >> >ns and remote is a even more whopping 900+ ns. There9 > >> >is no patch for this and the only work around is toe9 > >> >use things like Oracle in a way that most customersi6 > >> >would not contemplate. Customers using DBMS like( > >> >Sybase cannot use this capability. > >>J > >> THIS is exactly what anyone would call FUD.  There is no bug, and allI > >> architectural performance characteristics have been fully disclosed.  > >> > > 8 > >Lets see. The poster I was responding to claimed that9 > >the cachegate issues were the result of bad design, ifL5 > >that is true then the terrible local/remote memory < > >latency issues on WildFire are also in the same category. > >o > J > Andrew, it's post like this which makes people believe that your head is% > someplace where oxygen dosn't flow.s > M > It is one thing to have a performance characteristic, and another to have a N > true bug which your company tried bandaids and coverups on, rather than just, > admitting the problem and making it right. >   ? So how do you explain the performance cover up that Compaq havet= attempted to scam customers with because make no bones about   it is a scam.   > The scam may be the brainchild of your marketing folks but the9 reason the scam is necessary is because of the technical o deficiencies of the WildFire.   < Can you explain how you can justify the fastest UNIX system  claim ?e  5 Can you explain why you published comparitive memory e7 latency numbers which compared the GS320 favourably to -, made up numbers for Sun's memory subsystem.   < Can you explain why you chose to ignore performance numbers > from other vendors which pre-dated your benchmark results and 9 which were faster than yours, instead chosing to publish  . benchmark tables that strangely excluded them.  @ Were these all mistakes ?? If so why havn't they been corrected.  < If you want a cover up or a conspiracy theory then you need . to look no further than your own organisation.     regards  Andrew Harrison- Enterprise IT Architecta   ------------------------------   Date: 31 Jul 2001 13:36:05 GMT& From: peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva)1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate % Message-ID: <9k6c85$kat@web.nmti.com>o  , In article <3B663333.A06510D4@videotron.ca>,/ JF Mezei  <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  > yyyc186@mindspring.com wrote:iI > > Being "closely allied with Microsoft" is the corporate equivellant of ; > > having unprotected sex with an HIV positive individual.o > 0 > But corporations don't mind all those viruses.  K I think he's referring to the tendency for Microsoft to go into competitiont with its partners.   -- n+  `-_-'   In hoc signo hack, Peter da Silva. E   'U`    "A well-rounded geek should be able to geek about anything."KL                                                        -- nicolai@esperi.org          Disclaimer: WWFD?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:40:09 +0100P0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicatem* Message-ID: <3B66B539.C4DCD559@uk.sun.com>   jlsue wrote: > 5 > On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 17:54:18 +0100, andrew harrison # > <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:0 >  > >jlsue wrote:- > >>8 > >> On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 14:08:48 +0100, andrew harrison& > >> <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: > >> > >> >8 > >> >Really, the WildFire has a system design bug which8 > >> >means that local memory latency is a whopping 300+: > >> >ns and remote is a even more whopping 900+ ns. There9 > >> >is no patch for this and the only work around is to 9 > >> >use things like Oracle in a way that most customersn6 > >> >would not contemplate. Customers using DBMS like( > >> >Sybase cannot use this capability. > >>J > >> THIS is exactly what anyone would call FUD.  There is no bug, and allI > >> architectural performance characteristics have been fully disclosed.h > >> > >08 > >Lets see. The poster I was responding to claimed that9 > >the cachegate issues were the result of bad design, ifr5 > >that is true then the terrible local/remote memoryu< > >latency issues on WildFire are also in the same category. > A > So what you're saying is that Sun architects designed the cache @ > problem in there on purpose?!!!  Well, that certainly is news. > G > The difference, for those who can actually read for comprehension, isTF > that trade-offs were made for the GS systems, these were well known,5 > and they were also documented for everyone to read.0 >   6 Bullshit. The WildFire memory performance white paper 3 compares the local/remote memory latency with that e2 of an E10K  and concludes that the performance is 0 very competitive. Sadly the number used for the 5 E10K's memory latency was made up and the real numberi6 if it had been used would have made the WildFire look 1 much less good, how could this mistake have been  	 made ????R  6 > Compare that to Sun's handling of the cache problem. > & > Put that in your cache and smoke it. >   8 How adult. Had you ever considered the fact that Compaqs7 treatment of their customers over Alpha is in differentu8 league to Sun's handling of the ecache problem, which we have fixed.   6 Now remind me how did Compaq fix the alledged Alpha vs, IS-64 performance issues, you dropped Alpha.   > ; > When you get all of your stuff 100% correct, let me know.w >   6 At the moment the onus is on you, you havn't managed a7 single posting to this thread that hasn't contained at  : least one glaring factual error. What was you excuse over 9 your IBM FUD, it was a long time ago and you forgot. Did  & you ever consider checking your facts.  F > Yeah... yeah.... yeah.  Rubbish yourself.  Did they submit benchmarkH > results?  Yes.  Did it give *anyone* the ability to lookup and compare$ > against other results?  Yes again. >   9 Really  Compaq  published a performance white paper that  > included graphs of results that strangely omitted the results = posted by other vendors. Any customer reading the white paperd; would think that there was no need to go and look on SAP's p> web site or Oracle's web site for the actual table of results A they would expect that Compaqs table included all the competitive  results.  F > Sorry, Andy, but you can't blame Compaq marketing for excluding some- > results (if, in fact, they actually did... t  @ So you are basically saying that its ok to produce white papers ? that lie, how interesting !! What does that say about any other-? pseudo technical literature that Compaq publish, how are peoplen< going to know if Compaq are telling the truth over the Alpha -> IA-64 roadmap.   H > doesn't inspire me with a lot of confidence).  The funny thing is, I'dE > bet Sun marketing folks are just pissed-off that they didn't try itdG > first (or maybe they have, I don't care to look up all Sun claims for  > the last 5 years). >   = Don't try to attribute what may well be standard practice in   Compaq onto other vendors.  > > >server on the market, they used a series of benchmarks thatE > >either no one else had run on anything current, if at all, or theyl: > >studiously forgot to include results that were actually; > >better than theirs. For example they claimed performance-9 > >leadership for SAP while forgetting that Fujitsu had a08 > >better result on the SAP benchmark they had run. They9 > >also forgot to mention that very few SAP customers run68 > >2 tier configs (what they benchmarked) most prefering@ > >to run 3 tier something they didn't bother/dare to benchmark. > , > Like it matters.  Only to you, apparently. >   5 Oh it matters either you have the collateral to back e1 up your claim that the GS320 is the fastest UNIX s5 server or you don't. If you don't then you should not>3 be making the claim and you certainly should not be 6 exclusing other vendors better numbers or fabricating & numbers to try to scam your customers.   > > < > >In addition their white papers on WildFire memory latency8 > >made a comparison between WildFire memory latency and5 > >E10K memory latency, sadly they had simply made upg6 > >the E10K memory latency number and in doing so made6 > >the WildFire memory subsystem look much better than > >it actually was.l > F > I really doubt this.  I think you are making revisions to history to > suit your tendencies.- >   ; http://www.compaq.com/alphaserver/download/architecture.pdfm  7 Read it and weep, just as a hint 600ns was not the idlep3 memory latency of the E10K this number was made up.6  H > I think you're over-reaching your knowledge here.  You're filling-in aC > lot of detail based on a few inputs, and a lot of hope.   And youy@ > convenient leave out that nobody's systems will work great forE > everyone's workload.  But then, that's just par for the course withw > you. >   > How ironic that you mention details when you are incapable or @ unwilling to get even the most basic details right. What was the' last excuse (it was 2 or 3 years ago). l > >e > >f > >> >9 > >> >The Sun prefetch issue on the otherhand has a patcho6 > >> >that does fix the problem and also has a roadmap: > >> >to permanently fix the problem (UltraIII+) this will6 > >> >be available for all current systems rather then: > >> >the WildFire fix which requires a totally new system; > >> >and on the WildFire side the performance differentialm > >> >looks to be arround 30%. > >>F > >> FUD.  There is nothing to fix on the GS systems.  The performanceJ > >> characteristics are known, as well as the trade-offs.  They work veryH > >> well within the documented trade-offs.  At least Compaq is actually: > >> truthful in disclosing those trade-offs to customers. > >> > >l5 > >Really you are mistaken again, Compaq have made noe3 > >such disclosure, in fact they have withdrawn theq8 > >TPC-C result that illustrates the performance penalty6 > >to be paid. far from being honest about the penalty5 > >Compaq have done their best to hide it from sight.v > C > Ha!  This is typical Andrew, once again.  Just make any claim youtF > please.  Have they submitted TPC results?  Yes!  I just checked, and, > the GS320 is in the top 5 TPC result (#4). >   @ You really are a stunningly bad advocate for Compaq why are you 8 bothering. The current TPC-C result used OPS as did the < previous result. However the first result released and then 7 withdrawn after a week by Compaq did not and from that 6? result it was possible to measure the performance differential i@ between running an app configured to get arround the deficiences* of the WildFire NUMA architecture and not.  < If you don't understand any of this then just ask, it would 7 be better than flailing about wildly as you are at the   moment.     @ > >You misunderstand again, the information relating to supposedG > >ISV enthusiasm for OpenVMS either came from Compaq employees or from > > >sources who claimed to have it second hand from Compaq. The; > >ISV's in both of the major cases I can think of were notaA > >involved at all in the dissemination of incorrect information.a > >t > A > Or, you've merely inferred this to be so  because of the actuali. > outcome.  At this point, who knows for sure.  9 Why not do some research, it painfully lacking from your h; posts, look in Deja and check on the statements of support a: for Galaxies/OpenVMS that apparently came from Sybase and 8 Oracle. It would not be hard and you would then at least have some content to post.   Regards  Andrew Harrisont Enterprise IT Architecta   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 16:11:50 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>x1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate H Message-ID: <y47kwpxk61.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  7 "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes:p  M > The people who actually USE the computers will have to decide if what they DD > *really* cared about was VMS, or the underlying CPU architecture.   K Oh, the answer to that one is really quite easy: VMS, of course. But it has I to also be available, affordable, and of sufficient performance. Compaq'shJ decision to kill Alpha scores a negative hit on the "available" front (howI much trust can I still put in the company supporting VMS in the future?); K affordability, which never was a strong point but has recently improved on oH the software cost front scores a negative hit because for the forseeableJ future an IA64-based system will be in the same price range as the currentL (over-priced, IMHO) Alpha-based system, or even higher; and the argument forN sufficient performance from IA64-based systems is currently very unconvincing,N compared both to IA32 now and in the future, and to EV7 and EV8 in the future.; All in all, a severe de-improvement on all fronts. Oh dear!r   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:04:18 -0400e5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>)1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicatee1 Message-ID: <uOz97.428$Yx2.8454@news.cpqcorp.net>g  K Alan Greig wrote in message <181dmtc8iqa20bh464vqekhj05mo1i7hu6@4ax.com>...-- >On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 21:07:03 -0400, JF Mezeiu& ><jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote: >o >> >>G >>At what point will remaining customers know whether Compaq intends toe build[J >>one server for all OS, or whether VMS will have its own servers ? On the oneiK >>hand, we see messages of VMS booting on "vanilla" IA64s, and on the othert weH >>see a message such as yours that indicates that VMS will run on highly tested? >>quality machines and those two don't necessarily go together.  >eF >Well I've had a PC164 LX running VMS continually now for the last fewE >months, Have never found a problem with it so have just bought a VMSeF >license for it to allow us to use it legally as a development machineE >for a particular group of users. I could not have justified the costnD >of a DS10 right now for this purpose but I could easily get fundingF >for the cost of a PC - which is what Island sell the 'upgraded' PC164 >LX for( >e    C I'm not sure how you got a license for a machine that VMS has nevert supported...   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:47:14 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s1 Subject: Re: Alpha:  an invitation to communicate , Message-ID: <3B66E111.D562C5E9@videotron.ca>   andrew harrison wrote:7 > Bullshit. The WildFire memory performance white paper34 > compares the local/remote memory latency with that3 > of an E10K  and concludes that the performance iso1 > very competitive. Sadly the number used for them7 > E10K's memory latency was made up and the real numberF7 > if it had been used would have made the WildFire look 2 > much less good, how could this mistake have been > made ????d    L Andrew, I reealise that vendors know very little about their competitors and will make up a lot of = stuff to steer customers towards them instead of competitors.   N Perhaps you could do us a favour by posting Sun's official performance numbersH as well as the Wildfire performance numbers that Sun gives its potentialK customers when trying to woo them to Sun. We could then compare what Sun isnF saying with what Compaq is saying, average both and get a decent idea.  G However, just stating that Compaq doesn't use the right Sun performanceoK numbers, and then you saying how Wildfire doesn't perform as well as CompaqsJ claims doesn't really help the cause because as a reader of the message, I: have no information to know who is right and who is wrong.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:15:26 +0100d% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>w& Subject: Re: Another VAX to Alpha port8 Message-ID: <o1qcmtgk5rnj5rvt87jnn106u8pkc07li2@4ax.com>  C On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 21:58:04 -0500, "Rich Jordan" <rjordan@mcs.net>r wrote:   >Neil,L >     this is not surprising; in fact its been a fairly normal reaction from
 >our usersL >as some of the holdouts finally upgrade from 3100s (model 10, model 80, andJ >model 96 so far) to DS10/600's.  Of course the model 10 folks were almostI >shellshocked; the 96 users were just grinning uncontrollably for days...w  D When we upgraded from VAX 7620 to ES40s most of the support calls on day 1 went something like this:>  3 User: I tried to run report XYZ and it didn't work.> Me: What was the error? 8 User: No message. It just returned straight to the menu.! Me: Have you checked the printer?>+ User: Oh it's there! How can it be so fast?u     -- Alan   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 10:13:27 -0700# From: paszty@xoma.com (Nick Paszty)I1 Subject: Apache on VMS - httpd.conf and .htaccessn= Message-ID: <14ce1c21.0107310913.59ed289a@posting.google.com>h   hello.  D we're running vms 7.1 on an alphaserver 800 5/333 and have installedC apache 1.3.12.  i am having a couple of problems with the dopcument,4 root direcive and the htpasswd.exe_alpha executable.  8 1.  when i modify the document root directives from this  $ DocumentRoot "/apache$common/htdocs"# <Directory "/apache$common/htdocs">t   to this values, i get a 404.    DocumentRoot "$3$dra4:[ht.docs]" <Directory "$3$dra4:[ht.docs]">   E i've installed apache on solaris, hpux and win32 and have never had ae4 problem with changing the document root.  any ideas?  C 2. i'm also having trouble creating a .htpasswd file by running thee htpasswd.exe_alpha executable.   > run htpasswd.exe_alpha xdss   F this should create a .htpasswd file for user xdss and would prompt for8 a password. it seems that no matter what i do i get this  @ %DCL-W-MAXPARM, too many parameters - reenter command with fewer
 parameters  B i have run .htpasswd on solaris, hpux and win32 and have not had a' problem with the executable. any ideas?p     thanks,y   nick   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:21:22 +0100u3 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com>s7 Subject: cancel <3B66C716.B3EE72FC@unnecessary.csc.com>h' Message-ID: <9k6ilf$cqh$1@lore.csc.com>h  / This message was cancelled from within Mozilla.i   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 08:32:53 -0500 (CDT)?& From: Drew Shelton <drew@sematech.org>. Subject: Re: Change account password using web- Message-ID: <01K6KP19O6OY00AE61@SEMATECH.Org>n  H SAIC.COM bounced this message (too many hops), so I'm trying it again...   Tom,  I >We have Alpha OpenVMS 7.2-1 running Multinet 4.3 and the OSU web server.oL >Does anyone have a secure way to change an OpenVMS account password using aI >web page that is on another server?  We need a way to have the other web.M >server send a packet of account information so the OpenVMS system can changem >the password.  I I wrote an application to allow our helpdesk personnel to reset forgotteniF passwords.  Our primary web server is on NT, but it has a link to thisL application that runs under Purveyor on VMS.  The page is password-protectedE and is verified with an .EXE to prevent source viewing.  The helpdesk'F staffer is presented with a scrolling list of VMS accounts (with a fewF choice ones removed).  The application creates a new password with SETL PASSWORD/GENERATE and sets it using an image installed with privileges.  TheJ new password is emailed to the user's PC.  The helpdesk staffer never seesH the new password.  The person on the other end must have the password toL his/her NT account to see the email, making it harder to impersonate someoneL over the phone to get a password.  It's not 100% secure (emailing plain-textK passwords, for instance), but it does work.  I developed it on Purveyor and1? have migrated it to Apache.  Let me know if you want more info.    Drew  L ============================================================================6 Drew Shelton                         drew@sematech.org9 VMS Systems Manager                  office: 512-356-7575>9 Sematech                             fax:    512-356-7600> 2706 Montopolis DriveiK Austin, TX 78741-6499                I speak for myself only, not Sematech.MB     "OpenVMS is today what Microsoft wants Windows NT v8.0 to be!"I                                                         - Compaq, 9/22/98eL ============================================================================   ------------------------------   Date: 31 Jul 2001 13:20:59 GMT% From: jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris)g! Subject: Re: checking some myths.r( Message-ID: <9k6bbr$okl$1@top.mitre.org>  0 "Stephen Fuld" <s.fuld@worldnet.att.net> writes:  J >This seems to be a good answer to the question someone raised a few weeksM >ago about how do you test an interactive, time-sharing operating system.  ItoJ >also squares with my experience (so it must be right!) that stressing theF >memory allocation and swapping/paging systems brings out all sorts of+ >othrwise hard to find timing related bugs.h  C Of course, *nothing* brings out the bugs like putting a system intomC production...no matter how thoroughly you test for broken responsesrC to pathological conditions, some user will find a new way to exposes a failure mode.a  
 Joe Morris   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:48:55 GMT + From: Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com>e! Subject: Re: checking some myths.t) Message-ID: <u66c9qkhx.fsf@earthlink.net>   ' jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) writes:  > E > Of course, *nothing* brings out the bugs like putting a system intoeE > production...no matter how thoroughly you test for broken responseshE > to pathological conditions, some user will find a new way to exposeq > a failure mode.l >  > Joe Morris  ( misc. refs: from disk controller testing& http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/96.html#18& http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/96.html#19. http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#disk  F basically the "acceptance" test for 3880 was that it was within +/-10%< of the 3830 performance. the problem was that while the 3880D supporting data streaming 3mbyte transfers ... it did it with customE hardware for the data path and a jib' microcontroller for the controlnE path (the 3830 had been all a fast horizontal microcoded engine). ThedD jib' was taking quite a bit longer to do clean-up after an operationA finished ... so to meet the performance criteria ... they startedlD presenting operation finished interrupt "early" (before the jib' hadB finished all its clean-up). This worked OK for the acceptance test8 which was with a one-pack/drive, single task VS1 system.  F The problem was the weekend the product test lab replaced a productionC 16-drive 3830 configuration with one of the 3880 controllers. I gotb@ the call bright and early monday morning to come fix a operatingF system problem (performance had all gone to $%#!). Finally was able to@ trace it back to the "new" 3880. Fortunately this was six monthsE before first customer ship ... and allowed the engineers some time tow- make other adjustments to address the issues.n  < The problem was that with multiple drives (and high level ofD multitasking) on the same controller, there were frequently requestsC queued because of channel, controller, and/or device busy. When the B controller signaled operation complete interrupt ... the operating> system would immediately hit/redrive it with a queued request.E Because the jib' had signaled "complete" early, it was actually stille? busy ... and so the redrive operation got a "control unit busy"eD response. The system then went off to do something else. Eventually,A the jib' finished and because it had signaled a control unit busyFC condition, it then had to signal a control unit end interrupt. WithgD this, the system the attempt to restart the redrive operation (which# would typically succeed this time).t  F The extra operation and interrupts .... in addition to the increase inD operation latency made things look like a 80-90% system degradation.   -- eH Anne & Lynn Wheeler   | lynn@garlic.com -  http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:09:32 GMT3+ From: Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com>.! Subject: Re: checking some myths. ) Message-ID: <usnfdp4z4.fsf@earthlink.net>d  ' jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) writes:m   > E > Of course, *nothing* brings out the bugs like putting a system intodE > production...no matter how thoroughly you test for broken responsessE > to pathological conditions, some user will find a new way to exposeh > a failure mode.u  E ... i was fortunate at the time to have a lot of responsible for somerA the research production systems, the disk enginnearing production E systems, the disk product test lab production systems, systems at one F of the VLSI labs, and a lot of the HONE production systems ... and wasD able to relatively easily drop new code onto their production floors; for some "rubber meets the road" (the downside was I had top2 fix/support a lot of their other problems/issues).  E I joke at one point I was working first shift in research (bldg. 28),lL 2nd shift in GPD (disk engineering &test, bldg. 14&15), and 3rd shift in STLE (on a project supporting IMS group, bldg. 90) with periodic visits too4 palo alto for hone (one street over from page mill).   random refs:. http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#disk. http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#hone3 http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#fairshare 1 http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#wsclocka. http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#hsdt   -- aH Anne & Lynn Wheeler   | lynn@garlic.com -  http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:56:22 +0100h3 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com>F Subject: DCL PIPE queryd3 Message-ID: <3B66C716.B3EE72FC@unnecessary.csc.com>    Hi,   7 I'm having some fun with DCL today, here's another one:e  H $    define/user tmp_log 'errorfile'        !logical to prevent overflow  D $    pipe 'DBtool/DUMP/OUTPUT='DUMPfilespec' 'P1' >tmp_log 2>tmp_log  A Having avoided PIPE like the plague, can anybody tell me what (if < anything) the "2>" is doing in the above statement, please ?   Ade   < === My comments are not necessarily those of my employer ===   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:09:50 -0500t+ From: "Mike Kier" <michael.kier@compaq.com>  Subject: Re: DCL PIPE query 1 Message-ID: <3Tz97.429$Yx2.8550@news.cpqcorp.net>t  & It is redirecting SYS$ERROR to tmp_log   See HELP PIPE DESCRIPTION    --	 Mike Kiera Compaq Professional Services Cincinnati, OH, USA  michael.kier@compaq.comn  @ "Adrian Birkett" <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com> wrote in message- news:3B66C716.B3EE72FC@unnecessary.csc.com...l > Hi,v >t9 > I'm having some fun with DCL today, here's another one:b >oJ > $    define/user tmp_log 'errorfile'        !logical to prevent overflow > F > $    pipe 'DBtool/DUMP/OUTPUT='DUMPfilespec' 'P1' >tmp_log 2>tmp_log >eC > Having avoided PIPE like the plague, can anybody tell me what (ifr> > anything) the "2>" is doing in the above statement, please ? >  > Adei >y> > === My comments are not necessarily those of my employer === >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:59:07 +0100 4 From: John Laird <john@laird-towers.freeserve.co.uk> Subject: DCPS V2.0 and VMS 6.28 Message-ID: <j3edmtkmqgeemubkhd3bl6ujdvdvj30s65@4ax.com>  E The SPD for DCPS V2.0 lists support for Vax systems as 5.5-2, 7.2 anda6 7.3.  Alpha support is offered for 6.2, 7.2-1 and 7.3.  C Has anyone tried running V2.0 under 6.2 (Vax) ?  I can live withouts+ official support as long as it works... :-)y  E The target hardware is likely to be non-Compaq (or I would stick withsH DCPS 1.8), connected via TCP/IP - an update to UCX V4.2 is probably also	 required.d   Old systems, sigh.   -- e
 John Laird Yezerski Roper Ltd   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:43:15 -0400-0 From: Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>" Subject: Re: DCPS V2.0 and VMS 6.2; Message-ID: <310720011043159570%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>p  C In article <j3edmtkmqgeemubkhd3bl6ujdvdvj30s65@4ax.com>, John Lairdt* <john@laird-towers.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:  G > The SPD for DCPS V2.0 lists support for Vax systems as 5.5-2, 7.2 andt8 > 7.3.  Alpha support is offered for 6.2, 7.2-1 and 7.3. > E > Has anyone tried running V2.0 under 6.2 (Vax) ?  I can live withouth- > official support as long as it works... :-)V  D DCPS works just fine on any Alpha version starting with V6.1 and anyF VAX version starting with V5.5-2.  The SPD lists _supported_ versions.   Paul   -- a  Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineeringi   Compaq Computer Corporationg   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 06:44:15 -07006 From: andrew.rycroft@intrinsitech.com (Andrew Rycroft)/ Subject: Re: DEC/EDI v3.2B Contrl message query = Message-ID: <58ba0101.0107310544.51515e94@posting.google.com>t   Hi,e  L Found there are some patches available. Loaded these, and everything worked.   Thanks Andrew  \ norm.raphael@jamesbury.com wrote in message news:<C2256A99.005EBCED.00@jklh21.valmet.com>...) > R U under s/w support for this product?r >  >  >  > ; > andrew.rycroft@intrinsitech.com on 07/30/2001 12:26:29 PM- > 3 > Please respond to andrew.rycroft@intrinsitech.com: >  > To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.come > cc:n. > Subject:  DEC/EDI v3.2B Contrl message query >  >  >  >  > Hi,c > H > We have just upgraded to DEC/EDI v3.2B. This solved a lot of problems,F > but now we find that when the UN/EDIFACT CONTRL message is generated9 > for a trading partner profile with the field FunctionaltE > Acknowledgement set to DOC it seems to work correctly, but the dataoG > element 0062 ( Message reference number ) in the UCM segment is null.  >  > Any suggestions appreciated. >  > Thanks > Andrew   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 09:29:07 -0700( From: rrb35146@yahoo.com (Robbie Benton)4 Subject: Error Loading Proxies under TCPIP V5.1-ECO1= Message-ID: <dba64bc2.0107310829.746e7f69@posting.google.com>e  E I have installed (not an upgrade) OpenVMS V7.3 and TCPIP V5.1(ECO1). vB After configuring TCP/IP (but adding no proxies), the network code starts as expected.o  : However, if I stop TCPIP, and issue the following command:  D   $ TCPIP ADD PROXY SYSTEM /GID=1 /UID=4 /HOST=A0SC01 /REMOTE=SYSTEM
 /PERMANENT  C and restart TCPIP, the system will "hang-up" (requiring a ^P at thew5 console to get its attention) when executing the line      $ TCPIP LOAD PROXY  6 located in the file SYS$MANAGER:TCPIP$START_PROXY.COM.  F Anyone have any ideas of what may be happening here?  I have done thisF for several versions of OpenVMS/UCX, but this is the first time I have had any problems in this area.   Robbie   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:24:12 +0200h, From: Theo Jakobus <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de>9 Subject: Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.3 ) Message-ID: <3B66955C.7000306@iaf.fhg.de>o   Steve Lionel wrote:a  2 > On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 16:59:31 +0200, Theo Jakobus" > <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de> wrote: >  > K >>I started to upgrade my PWS500au from 7.2-1 (with all patches installed) h >>to 7.3 and got two errors: >> >>1. STARLET.OLB8 >>During the upgrade at 60% progress I got the messages:" >>%PCSI-E-WRITEERR, error writing 4 >>DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.][SYSLIB]STARLET.OLB;6( >>-LIBR-E-DUPKEY, duplicate key in indexI >>I restored 7.2-1, checked STARLET.OLB;5 and started again the upgrade, r0 >>after running in the same problem I proceeded. >> >  > Try this:  DownloadSN > ftp://ftp.compaq.com/pub/products/fortran/OpenVMS/CFAV-FORRTL-V0704-4.zipexe >  > RUN it to unpack and then: > % > $ PRODUCT INSTALL FORRTL /SOURCE=[]s >   	 Hi Steve,eI after the upgrade to 7.3 I installed the upgrade for FORTRAN 7.4-2 which l) is on the June CDs and I got the message:e@ %LIBRAR-E-DUPGLOBAL, global symbol CVTAS_INFO already in library6 error replacing module CVT_CRAY in library STARLET.OLB  F One of our main application is written in FORTRAN so before upgrading F our cluster I test the upgrades on my PWS500au booting as stand alone  system.q    @ > Then try your VMS upgrade again. This may help the STARLET.OLB > problem, but not SMI$SHR.EXE  F The SMI$SHR.EXE error is solved through patch: VMS721_RENAME_OLD-V0100     Regards, -- r  ; ***********************************************************a; *                                                         *D; *  Theo Jakobus                                           *h; *  Fraunhofer-Institut fuer Angewandte Festkoerperphysik  *s; *  Tullastr. 72                                           *u; *  D-79108 Freiburg                                       *r; *  Germany                                                *e; *  Phone:   +49-(0)761-5159-325                           *n; *  FAX :    +49-(0)761-5159-200                           *H; *  e-mail:  Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de                       *-; *  http://www.iaf.fhg.de                                  *m; *                                                         * ; ***********************************************************.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:18:46 -0400 , From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@compaq.com>9 Subject: Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.3n8 Message-ID: <4vbdmtg91lfffqgchme39dl4sfokrqgo8l@4ax.com>  0 On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:24:12 +0200, Theo Jakobus  <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de> wrote:    
 >Hi Steve,J >after the upgrade to 7.3 I installed the upgrade for FORTRAN 7.4-2 which * >is on the June CDs and I got the message:A >%LIBRAR-E-DUPGLOBAL, global symbol CVTAS_INFO already in library 7 >error replacing module CVT_CRAY in library STARLET.OLB   3 Right - that's why I pointed to a newer FORRTL kit.b  B FWIW, I have some reports that even the latest FORRTL kit will getF DUPGLOBAL errors when installed on a freshly-installed VMS 7.3 system.B I haven't been able to reproduce that myself - if anyone runs into that, please send me mail.    - Steve Lionel (mailto:Steve.Lionel@compaq.com)e Fortran Engineeringa* High-Performance Technical Computing Group& Compaq Computer Corporation, Nashua NH  6 Compaq Fortran web site: http://www.compaq.com/fortran   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:48:27 +0200r, From: Theo Jakobus <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de>9 Subject: Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.3$) Message-ID: <3B66C53B.1000504@iaf.fhg.de>n   Steve Lionel wrote:l  2 > On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:24:12 +0200, Theo Jakobus" > <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de> wrote: >  >  >  >>Hi Steve,mK >>after the upgrade to 7.3 I installed the upgrade for FORTRAN 7.4-2 which K+ >>is on the June CDs and I got the message:cB >>%LIBRAR-E-DUPGLOBAL, global symbol CVTAS_INFO already in library8 >>error replacing module CVT_CRAY in library STARLET.OLB >> > 5 > Right - that's why I pointed to a newer FORRTL kit.  > D > FWIW, I have some reports that even the latest FORRTL kit will getH > DUPGLOBAL errors when installed on a freshly-installed VMS 7.3 system.D > I haven't been able to reproduce that myself - if anyone runs into > that, please send me mail. > @ I had the idea to install the newest FORTRAN runtime library on   @ my stand alone PWS500au which is running OpenVMS 7.3 (it takes a  ; lot of time to restore the 7.2-1 system disk from tape ...)    Execution phase starting ...  7 The following product will be installed to destination:nI      DEC AXPVMS FORRTL V7.4-4               DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.]c7 The following product will be removed from destination:sI      DEC AXPVMS FORRTL V7.4-2               DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.]    Portion done: 0%...60%5 %PCSI-I-PRCOUTPUT, output from subprocess follows ... B %LIBRAR-E-DUPGLOBAL, global symbol DFOR$VAXD_TO_TEXT_EX from file B IAF021$DKA0:[SYS0.SCRATCH.PCSI$WRK344.][000000]FORRTL_OBJECTS.OBJ; Portion done: 80%   ? %PCSI-E-MODREPLERR, error replacing module CVT_CRAY in library )4 DISK$21_SYSDISK:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSLIB]STARLET.OLB" %PCSI-E-OPFAILED, operation failedE Terminating is strongly recommended.  Do you want to terminate? [YES]=  < The question is if I go back to OpenVMS 7.2-1 which includes  > "old" STARLET.OLB and do the FORRTL upgrade first and then the  7 operating system upgrade is this procedure error free?      / Is there any test of integrity for STARLET.OLB?i     Regards, -- 6  ; *********************************************************** ; *                                                         *"; *  Theo Jakobus                                           *o; *  Fraunhofer-Institut fuer Angewandte Festkoerperphysik  *=; *  Tullastr. 72                                           *-; *  D-79108 Freiburg                                       *g; *  Germany                                                *D; *  Phone:   +49-(0)761-5159-325                           *d; *  FAX :    +49-(0)761-5159-200                           *e; *  e-mail:  Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de                       *e; *  http://www.iaf.fhg.de                                  * ; *                                                         *i; ***********************************************************    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:50:00 -0400,, From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@compaq.com>9 Subject: Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.3t8 Message-ID: <sgkdmtkpk48bhpd2p1delc7fqfmnas6h86@4ax.com>  0 On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:48:27 +0200, Theo Jakobus  <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de> wrote:     >-A >my stand alone PWS500au which is running OpenVMS 7.3 (it takes ah >e< >lot of time to restore the 7.2-1 system disk from tape ...) >- >Execution phase starting ...t > 8 >The following product will be installed to destination:J >     DEC AXPVMS FORRTL V7.4-4               DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.]8 >The following product will be removed from destination:J >     DEC AXPVMS FORRTL V7.4-2               DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.] >l >Portion done: 0%...60%r6 >%PCSI-I-PRCOUTPUT, output from subprocess follows ...C >%LIBRAR-E-DUPGLOBAL, global symbol DFOR$VAXD_TO_TEXT_EX from file 9C >IAF021$DKA0:[SYS0.SCRATCH.PCSI$WRK344.][000000]FORRTL_OBJECTS.OBJ;c >Portion done: 80% >w@ >%PCSI-E-MODREPLERR, error replacing module CVT_CRAY in library 5 >DISK$21_SYSDISK:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSLIB]STARLET.OLBy# >%PCSI-E-OPFAILED, operation failedmF >Terminating is strongly recommended.  Do you want to terminate? [YES] >a= >The question is if I go back to OpenVMS 7.2-1 which includes  >d? >"old" STARLET.OLB and do the FORRTL upgrade first and then thea >n8 >operating system upgrade is this procedure error free?  >t >e0 >Is there any test of integrity for STARLET.OLB?  A Hmm - very interesting.  The problem is in the way that PCSI doesrF library updating. It creates an alphabetical list of the modules to beF updated and then goes through the list, replacing them in alphabeticalE order.  The problem is if a symbol "moves" from one module to another ? - this ordering can cause the symbol to appear in two differenteA modules.  In a future version, PCSI will change to do this in twowE passes, first deleting all modules being replaced, then inserting theo new modules.  ? We made a mistake in the naming of certain CVT routines and theeA modules they were in, which led to errors when 7.3 was installed.w  @ Would you please do a LIB/LIST=STARLET.LIS/NAMES STARLET.OLB and e-mail me the listing?  @ I need to figure out a better solution to this for now...  In myA testing, if you installed 7.2-1, ran the FORRTL upgrade, and thentC installed 7.3, it worked.  The other thing you can do is to use thee: PRODUCT command to extract from the FORRTL (7.4-4) kit theF FORRTL_OBJECTS.OBJ file and just do a LIB/REPLACE on STARLET with that= file.  Then install the FORRTL kit and you should be all set.m    - Steve Lionel (mailto:Steve.Lionel@compaq.com)a Fortran Engineering * High-Performance Technical Computing Group& Compaq Computer Corporation, Nashua NH  6 Compaq Fortran web site: http://www.compaq.com/fortran   ------------------------------   Date: 31 JUL 2001 16:04:24 GMT+ From: Dave Greenwood <greenwoodde@ornl.gov>t9 Subject: Re: Errors in executing the upgrade 7.2-1 to 7.302 Message-ID: <31JUL01.16042428@feda01.fed.ornl.gov>  D In a previous article, Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@compaq.com> wrote:2 > On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:48:27 +0200, Theo Jakobus" > <Theo.Jakobus@iaf.fhg.de> wrote: >  l >  m > >uC > >my stand alone PWS500au which is running OpenVMS 7.3 (it takes ak > >d> > >lot of time to restore the 7.2-1 system disk from tape ...) > >h > >Execution phase starting ...t > > : > >The following product will be installed to destination:L > >     DEC AXPVMS FORRTL V7.4-4               DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.]: > >The following product will be removed from destination:L > >     DEC AXPVMS FORRTL V7.4-2               DISK$21_SYSDISK:[VMS$COMMON.] > >m > >Portion done: 0%...60%o8 > >%PCSI-I-PRCOUTPUT, output from subprocess follows ...E > >%LIBRAR-E-DUPGLOBAL, global symbol DFOR$VAXD_TO_TEXT_EX from file iE > >IAF021$DKA0:[SYS0.SCRATCH.PCSI$WRK344.][000000]FORRTL_OBJECTS.OBJ;e > >Portion done: 80% > >oB > >%PCSI-E-MODREPLERR, error replacing module CVT_CRAY in library 7 > >DISK$21_SYSDISK:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSLIB]STARLET.OLBo% > >%PCSI-E-OPFAILED, operation failedcH > >Terminating is strongly recommended.  Do you want to terminate? [YES] > > ? > >The question is if I go back to OpenVMS 7.2-1 which includesp > >iA > >"old" STARLET.OLB and do the FORRTL upgrade first and then the  > >d: > >operating system upgrade is this procedure error free?  > >w > >r2 > >Is there any test of integrity for STARLET.OLB? >  lC > Hmm - very interesting.  The problem is in the way that PCSI doesmH > library updating. It creates an alphabetical list of the modules to beH > updated and then goes through the list, replacing them in alphabeticalG > order.  The problem is if a symbol "moves" from one module to anothermA > - this ordering can cause the symbol to appear in two different C > modules.  In a future version, PCSI will change to do this in two G > passes, first deleting all modules being replaced, then inserting the/ > new modules. >  lA > We made a mistake in the naming of certain CVT routines and theTC > modules they were in, which led to errors when 7.3 was installed.e  D Forgive me for sticking my head in where it probably doesn't belong.B But what would happen if Theo does a PRODUCT REMOVE of FORRTL (andC possibly Fortran) and then a "fresh" install?  That would basically-' implement what the future PCSI will do.t   Dave --------------9 Dave Greenwood                Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOVgH Oak Ridge National Lab        %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:52:27 GMTe* From: "David Cressey" <david@dcressey.com>- Subject: Re: Few People in DEC Understood....e4 Message-ID: <LCz97.66$Iw2.3699@petpeeve.ziplink.net>  ( One point you made interests me greatly:  K > Had Digital put in as much effort into training its own supporrt staff onnI > ALL-IN-1 as it did on Exchange, perhaps Digital's use of ALL_IN-1 wouldp > haveG > been far more extensive with lots of integrated applications etc etc.d  J I think I saw this pattern repeated over and over again in DEC.  DEC put a lot of effort into internaltJ training on system 1022, or 1032 which was built outside DEC.  Much later, it put enormous effortI into teaching its own people Oracle.  But the effort it made to teach Rdbm internally was a little light. by comparison.  L But I think that training support staff was only part of the puzzle.  If you! don't know what something is for, K knowing how it works is largely irrelevant.  I think the big failure wrt A1r or Rdb or any number of good- products was a failure of internal marketing.   K I have no idea how "internal marketing"  would work,  but I have an inklingt that it's necessary. -- Regards,     David Cresseyw     www.dcressey.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:11:33 GMTl# From: Bob Day <bobday@mediaone.net> - Subject: Re: Few People in DEC Understood....-, Message-ID: <3B66D8B4.9E47B204@mediaone.net>   David Cressey wrote:  * > One point you made interests me greatly: >0M > > Had Digital put in as much effort into training its own supporrt staff onnK > > ALL-IN-1 as it did on Exchange, perhaps Digital's use of ALL_IN-1 wouldr > > haveI > > been far more extensive with lots of integrated applications etc etc.t > L > I think I saw this pattern repeated over and over again in DEC.  DEC put a > lot of effort into internalVL > training on system 1022, or 1032 which was built outside DEC.  Much later, > it put enormous effortK > into teaching its own people Oracle.  But the effort it made to teach Rdbi > internally was a little lightu > by comparison. > N > But I think that training support staff was only part of the puzzle.  If you# > don't know what something is for,-M > knowing how it works is largely irrelevant.  I think the big failure wrt A1d > or Rdb or any number of good/ > products was a failure of internal marketing.0 >.M > I have no idea how "internal marketing"  would work,  but I have an inklings > that it's necessary.  C It starts with a company using its own products -- which is anotherm1 reason for DEC's failure and Microsoft's success..  
 -- Bob Day   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 08:21:47 -0400o- From: "Richard D. Piccard" <piccard@ohio.edu> 1 Subject: Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today....( Message-ID: <3B66A2D9.9E49E70E@ohio.edu>  F This would be much more comforting if it came directly from someone ofL suitably high rank in the Q's food chain.  "Who is gupp99@usa.com and why is he saying these things?..."w  +                                         RDP      Larry Kilgallen wrote:  ! > > From: guppy <guppy99@usa.com>n > > Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec, > > Subject: Highlights of an email today... > >(J > > Compaq will continue to manufacture, enhance, and sell the entire line* > > of Alpha-Based HPS servers until 2006.   [snip]   --B ==================================================================B Dick Piccard                           Academic Technology ManagerB piccard@ohio.edu                                 Computer ServicesB http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~piccard/                Ohio University   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 09:11:25 -0500- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) 1 Subject: Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today... 3 Message-ID: <fFYHhqPRSfrs@eisner.encompasserve.org>R  \ In article <3B660D83.AB6D9115@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > Larry Kilgallen wrote:" >> > From: guppy <guppy99@usa.com>M >> > OpenVMS  will have a single code base for both Alpha-based and IPF-based / >> > systems.  The same is true for Tru64 UNIX.r > L > Isn't it too premature at this point in time to make such declaration ? IsI > this some corporate edict imposed on the VMS engineers or some edicated-H > decision by the engineers that maintaining a single code base would be > possible/beneficial ?  >   B I don't think so.  Decisions like this should be made up front.  IG always thought the separation of the VAX and Alpha code bases was a big2A mistake.  Every time you make a copy of something, you double the:F maintenance effort, and double the integration steps of a development.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences CorporationT= NASA GSFC Flight Software       | Federal Sector, Civil GroupAE                                 | please remove ".aspm" when replying1   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:13:16 GMT 8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)1 Subject: Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today.../1 Message-ID: <M9y97.416$Yx2.8070@news.cpqcorp.net>   - In article <3B660D83.AB6D9115@videotron.ca>, // JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:o   >Larry Kilgallen wrote:e" >> > From: guppy <guppy99@usa.com>M >> > OpenVMS  will have a single code base for both Alpha-based and IPF-basedF/ >> > systems.  The same is true for Tru64 UNIX.C > K >Isn't it too premature at this point in time to make such declaration ? IsoH >this some corporate edict imposed on the VMS engineers or some edicatedG >decision by the engineers that maintaining a single code base would bea >possible/beneficial ?  D Whether this is a "corporate edict" or one imposed by market realityA doesn't matter.  OpenVMS Engineers are confident that this can be*E accomplished.  And there has been enough research that the statement  2 is NOT "premature" from an engineering standpoint.  A I cannot speak for Tru64 Unix, but I would assume it is the same.t  E Please do not miss-understand!  The "single code base" will certainly I include some IPF unique modules, and likely some code that is conditional 
 on Alpha/IPF.   L >As I recall, VAX and Alpha have different code base. (or at least each have* >their own source code library). Correct ?  H That is correct.  Completely separate source libraries, even though muchI of the code is very similar and some identical.  However, the differences D between Alpha and IPF are much smaller than between VAX and Alpha --H small enough that we can and will build OpenVMS IPF from the same sourceF library used for OpenVMS Alpha.  We will simply tell the build processG "Alpha" or "IPF", and it will build the correct version of OpenVMS fromR the common souce library.u   -- 7K     Charlie Hammond -- Compaq Computer Corporation -- Pompano Beach  FL USATH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:21:04 GMTR From: guppy <guppy99@usa.com>A1 Subject: Re: FWD: Highlights of an email today... ' Message-ID: <3B66B0C6.2DBB4C61@usa.com>    "Richard D. Piccard" wrote:e > H > This would be much more comforting if it came directly from someone ofN > suitably high rank in the Q's food chain.  "Who is gupp99@usa.com and why is > he saying these things?..."e  G I've worked in Customer Services for DEC/Compaq since 1974.  The personiG who sent the email asked us to pass the information along to all of ourmA customers.  The author also expressed a willingness to answer any E questions sent his or her way, so I'll see if he or she is willing to-9 elaborate or step out and talk to our customers directly.0   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 11:47:38 +0200* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)# Subject: Re: Game for Computer Prose* Message-ID: <3b667eba$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  [ In article <CzO87.10285$ar1.32451@www.newsranger.com>, Matt <nospam@newsranger.com> writes:e; >I downloaded this security game from Verado. I thought youR7 >might get a kick out of it.  It's about an overworked,s8 >stressed out IT guy. You fight off attacks from hackers, >and spammers using shredders, flamers, etc. >A >Here is the link:4 >http://www.verado.com/forms/get_verado_game_2.shtml  3 Does it run on VMS (or only on the Play Consoles) ?e   -- a< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888o< <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:08:34 -0400a# From: Jim Agnew <Agnew@hsc.vcu.edu>s# Subject: Re: Game for Computer Proso+ Message-ID: <3B66ADD2.8191A55D@hsc.vcu.edu>   T it sounds good, but i really either make my own games, or buy them shrink-wrapped...Y otherwise, you'll bet burned eventually...   sad, and I know i'm missing out on some goodA ones.. jimV   Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:  ] > In article <CzO87.10285$ar1.32451@www.newsranger.com>, Matt <nospam@newsranger.com> writes:w= > >I downloaded this security game from Verado. I thought you 9 > >might get a kick out of it.  It's about an overworked,F: > >stressed out IT guy. You fight off attacks from hackers. > >and spammers using shredders, flamers, etc. > >2 > >Here is the link:6 > >http://www.verado.com/forms/get_verado_game_2.shtml >d5 > Does it run on VMS (or only on the Play Consoles) ?t >i > --> > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651= > Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 > > <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netJ > A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:23:41 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)# Subject: Re: Game for Computer Pros 1 Message-ID: <14A97.434$Yx2.7888@news.cpqcorp.net>f  W In article <3b667eba$1@news.kapsch.co.at>, eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER) writes:   4 :Does it run on VMS (or only on the Play Consoles) ?  K   When replying, please consider not including the URLs and/or the contact PL   information in what I infer you believe was spam.  (You could effectively E   end up defeating the existing spam-cancellation tools by doing so.)f  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:41:11 -0400. From: William_Bochnik@acml.com# Subject: Re: Game for Computer Prose> Message-ID: <OF733C9357.F90C3790-ON85256A9A.00562657@acml.com>  1 wouldnt this be an example of "Busman's Holiday?"i    a                                                                                                  -a                     Jim Agnew                                                                     a                     <Agnew@hsc.vc                To:  Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                       a                     u.edu>                       cc:                                             Ma                                          Subject:     Re: Game for Computer Pros                 Ra                     07/31/2001                                                                   4a                     09:08 AM                                                                      a                                                                                                  ea                                                                                                  e      = it sounds good, but i really either make my own games, or buyA them shrink-wrapped...@ otherwise, you'll bet burned eventually...   sad, and I know i'm missing out on some good ones.. jim    Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:  = > In article <CzO87.10285$ar1.32451@www.newsranger.com>, Matte <nospam@newsranger.com> writes:a= > >I downloaded this security game from Verado. I thought youa9 > >might get a kick out of it.  It's about an overworked,b: > >stressed out IT guy. You fight off attacks from hackers. > >and spammers using shredders, flamers, etc. > >b > >Here is the link:6 > >http://www.verado.com/forms/get_verado_game_2.shtml >o5 > Does it run on VMS (or only on the Play Consoles) ?i >r > --> > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651= > Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 > > <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netA > A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm at realist"          F ______________________________________________________________________  : The information contained in this transmission may contain< privileged and confidential information and is intended only< for the use of the person(s) named above. If you are not the< intended recipient,  or an employee or agent responsible for9                   delivering this message to the intendedl)                   recipient,  any review,e?                   dissemination, distribution or duplication ofC$                   this communication<                   is strictly prohibited. If you are not the%                   intended recipient,-@                   please contact the sender immediately by reply$                   e-mail and destroy5                   all copies of the original message.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:01:23 +0100e0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>% Subject: Re: Goodbye, good friend DEC * Message-ID: <3B66BA33.65ECE3E4@uk.sun.com>   jlsue wrote: > E > On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 15:37:08 +0100, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>o > wrote: > G > >On 30 Jul 2001 10:22:18 -0500, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)n	 > >wrote:  > >T > >>& > >>      Old news and somewhat silly. > >>K > >>      He describes DCL and VAXes and talks in terms as if they are bothNM > >>      history.  He is more than a little ahead of himself as VMS survivedVL > >>      VAX and he talks as if it isn't around.  Another writer that can't > >>      seem to say "VMS". > >PG > >But that's partly the point. Unless you are still actively using VMSmI > >then VAX, VMS,  DCL, and now Alpha *are* history. The fact that VMS is3H > >still living seems to be a secret Compaq would like to keep to itself! > >and a few remaining customers.V > >YE > >If you read the followups a number of people point out that VMS is  > >still with us., > A > And, in fact, so is Alpha.  And it will be for quite some time.tE > Do say that you won't buy the best system capability merely because7E > you may have to migrate in 8 years is silly.  The Alpha EV7 systemsa > will be around awhile.    = Who could ignore the unintentional irony of you starting yourw response with "And, in Fact".   = Is the may have to migrate in 8 years Compaqs date for endingp> support on Alpha or was it just a number you plucked randomly 
 from the air.t  ; Incedentally anyone who thinks that EV7 based systems will  : be delivering the best systems capability in 8 years time  is as you point out silly.  ; How about less inane speculation and more actual statementsb7 of direction that have some sort of legitimacy. At the e7 moment all you and your ilk are offering your customerss8 appears to be pure speculation, unless you really think 7 for example that Intel/HP are going to modify Mckinley  5 to add Alpha instructions to it at this stage in its n design.e     Regardsh Andrew Harrisonl Enterprise IT Architecti   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 10:08:39 -0700, From: David Masterson <dmaster@synopsys.com>% Subject: Re: Goodbye, good friend DEC"* Message-ID: <djzvgk9auw8.fsf@synopsys.com>  A >>>>> "David" == David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:d   > Alan Greig wrote:G  ) >> Something else to wake Compaq up with?   D > Doubt it. We've already tried thermo-nuclear, and that didn't evenE > leave a mark on 'em, snoring away like Old Sol had gone white dwarfyC > already (how they survived red giant, I dunno, but there they aree > and there they'll stay!).6  E They probably learned from the black hole attack on Digital when they = dumped the DEC-20 and Tops-20 in favor of the Vax-11 and VMS.t   -- o David Masterson  Sr. R&D Engineer Synopsys, Inc.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:46:10 +0700i. From: Suhartoyo <suhartoyo@semen-cibinong.com>$ Subject: how to replace BIOS battery@ Message-ID: <69272CA349ACD111A58D0060083B98F6013D449F@NRG-SVR-2>  K > How to replace the old BIOS battery of CPU with a new one. When we try touI > replace it, the computer can not be start system halt and monitor blanke > andm) > we don't know how to solve the problem.i > We use OvenVMS ver 6.2-1H2 >  >  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:17:18 GMTf2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)( Subject: Re: how to replace BIOS battery1 Message-ID: <2_z97.430$Yx2.8233@news.cpqcorp.net>n  q In article <69272CA349ACD111A58D0060083B98F6013D449F@NRG-SVR-2>, Suhartoyo <suhartoyo@semen-cibinong.com> writes:   L :> How to replace the old BIOS battery of CPU with a new one. When we try toM :> replace it, the computer can not be start system halt and monitor blank...e  G   Um, which specific (since V6.2-1H2 was only for Alpha systems) Alpha?B  D   How do you know the battery is bad?  (What are the symptoms seen?)  D   Which specific component part are you (attempting to) replace, and9   what specific component part are you replacing it with?o   :> We use OvenVMS ver 6.2-1H2   B   I'd upgrade to V6.2-1H3, V7.1-2, V7.2-1, or the current release.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 08:19:12 -07006 From: philipp.lewis@deutsche-boerse.com (philip lewis)6 Subject: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison= Message-ID: <4ad76487.0107310719.5d35eb35@posting.google.com>b  D Well, has everyone read this?  Can anyone tell me why the apparentlyB well formulated and understood criticisms of the IA64 architectureB previously enunciated by CompaQ (I guess Alpha engineering) are no longer true ???h  8 http://www.alphapowered.com/presentations/alpha_ia64.pdf   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:56:54 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>:: Subject: Re: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison, Message-ID: <3B66E354.55D5446E@videotron.ca>   philip lewis wrote:6 > F > Well, has everyone read this?  Can anyone tell me why the apparentlyD > well formulated and understood criticisms of the IA64 architectureD > previously enunciated by CompaQ (I guess Alpha engineering) are no > longer true ???   K Because Compaq decided that Alpha, even if it was superior, was not part ofcL its business strategy and that Compaq should find some rich uncle to buy theJ alpha bits and give Compaq a large wad of cash. With that Cash, Compaq can$ then go play where it wants to play.  N The "technical" argument was spewed out by Compaq as a way to help justify itsN move to the Wall Street Casino analysts. Compaq knows that Wall Street doesn'tN actually understand technology so it can say anything "technological" it wants+ be Wall Street will beleive it at its word.O  N When was the last time you saw a Wall Street Casino analysts question the moveN of a company ? Wall Street loves to see layoffs, they love to see streamlining- of products (eg: eliminate products) etc etc.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:15:33 -0500,1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> : Subject: Re: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison8 Message-ID: <9k6p3e$7r9$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>   Good question.  H Perhaps the long term plan is to take the goodness of Alpha and blend it into a future IPF chip.i  F But if that is the case, Intel wins.  That's OK I guess, but what doesL Compaq stand to gain?  The details of the agreement are sketchy at best.  At least to us outsiders.   Dave...o  C "philip lewis" <philipp.lewis@deutsche-boerse.com> wrote in messagel7 news:4ad76487.0107310719.5d35eb35@posting.google.com...tF > Well, has everyone read this?  Can anyone tell me why the apparentlyD > well formulated and understood criticisms of the IA64 architectureD > previously enunciated by CompaQ (I guess Alpha engineering) are no > longer true ???- >-: > http://www.alphapowered.com/presentations/alpha_ia64.pdf   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:52:15 -0400i' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> : Subject: Re: IA64 v. Alpha published technical compoarison( Message-ID: <9k6r9c$h1o$1@pyrite.mv.net>  C "philip lewis" <philipp.lewis@deutsche-boerse.com> wrote in message 7 news:4ad76487.0107310719.5d35eb35@posting.google.com...gF > Well, has everyone read this?  Can anyone tell me why the apparentlyD > well formulated and understood criticisms of the IA64 architectureD > previously enunciated by CompaQ (I guess Alpha engineering) are no > longer true ???v  # Check out "1984", by George Orwell.e   - bill   >F: > http://www.alphapowered.com/presentations/alpha_ia64.pdf   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 16:21:52 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>tC Subject: Re: IPF Console Bootstrap (was: Re: No chance for OpenVMS)uH Message-ID: <y44rrtxjpb.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:V  M > Would these applications/utilities be stored on the system disk in the samenM > FAT as the primary loader for VMS ? (eg: from ODS2 point of view, stored ind6 > the same ODS2 file which contain the FAT container).  
 Seems likely.eP > Or would there be plans to include these utilities in a ROM on the motherboardL > so that they would be accessible before the OS is loaded on a hard disk ?   H EFI makes them accessible "before the OS is loaded". Do you remember the? dianostic supervisor on the VAX? It seems very similar to that.i   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:31:43 -0400v5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>eC Subject: Re: IPF Console Bootstrap (was: Re: No chance for OpenVMS) 1 Message-ID: <Xjz97.426$Yx2.8352@news.cpqcorp.net>   = JF Mezei wrote in message <3B65BA4B.8AAF4293@videotron.ca>...l >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:oG >> EFI makes this a bit more formal, allowing true "applications" to befJ >> written.  So instead of having to add functionality to the console, you canCC >> extend the functionality by writting an application - like a newq diagnostic,e >> a shell, whatever...) > L >Would these applications/utilities be stored on the system disk in the sameL >FAT as the primary loader for VMS ? (eg: from ODS2 point of view, stored in5 >the same ODS2 file which contain the FAT container).  >e     Yes.  C >Or would there be plans to include these utilities in a ROM on thew motherboard I >so that they would be accessible before the OS is loaded on a hard disk?u  G I believe this is also possible, but I have not seen the EFI developers  toolkit yet.   > OrK >is the expectation that every system will always have the "bootable" CD inp itsiI >primary CD drive so that after a failure, one could remotely start those  >utilities ?   No.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:40:43 -0400,2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)C Subject: Re: IPF Console Bootstrap (was: Re: No chance for OpenVMS)-L Message-ID: <rdeininger-3107011340440001@user-2ivec29.dialup.mindspring.com>  H In article <y44rrtxjpb.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>,H Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> wrote:  1 > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:a > O > > Would these applications/utilities be stored on the system disk in the samesO > > FAT as the primary loader for VMS ? (eg: from ODS2 point of view, stored in 8 > > the same ODS2 file which contain the FAT container). >  > Seems likely.wF > > Or would there be plans to include these utilities in a ROM on the motherboard N > > so that they would be accessible before the OS is loaded on a hard disk ?  > J > EFI makes them accessible "before the OS is loaded". Do you remember theA > dianostic supervisor on the VAX? It seems very similar to that.R  A Another somewhat similar example exists on the turbochannel alpha-J systems.  TC options supply their own initialization, diagnostic, and bootG code, which happens to be written in MIPS machine code, not alpha.  The3J console on these machines knows how to find code in TC options and executeD it within a MIPS emulator.  The ROMs on the TC options are organizedI somewhat like a small file system.  The alpha console handles all this ini a friendly way.T   -- r Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comw   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:51:26 +0100h( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>) Subject: Re: memory for Alphaserver 4/200o) Message-ID: <3B668DAD.7E49BC2B@127.0.0.1>    WILLIAM WEBB wrote:r  > > I believe that it's 72 pin 60 (and maybe 70) ns true parity.5 > Mixing of different memory speeds is to be avoided.t  C Later models of AS1000 need 60ns memory, 70ns is OK for this model.s  B (How folks can justify selling DEC memory at crazy prices when the/ just-as-good PC stuff will do I'll never know).r   --( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot coml   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:29:53 -0300i+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>-, Subject: Minimum boot -  disks not appearingL Message-ID: <OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  E Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed at "minimum boot" ???J I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blind ?o   Regardsn   FC   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 08:44:34 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing3 Message-ID: <6HDpXkELwGO9@eisner.encompasserve.org>n  z In article <OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> writes:G > Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a- > "minimum boot" ???L > I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blind > ?n  ( 	Doesn't appear to be in there... hmmmm.  
 	If on Alpha:-  
 	$ mcr sysman    	SYSMAN> IO AUTO
 	SYSMAN> EXIT0   	VAX:m 	MCR SYSGENh 	SYSGEN> AUTOCONFIG ALL: 	EXITo  
 SYSGEN>  HELP      Information available:  B   AUTOCONFIGURE         CONFIGURE  CONNECT    CREATE     DEINSTALLH   Description           DISABLE    ENABLE     HELP       INSTALL    LOADL   MSCP       Parameters RELOAD     SET        SHARE      SHOW       TERMINAL   USE        WRITE   Topic? autocon  
 AUTOCONFIGURE   1      This command is for use on VAX systems only. <      On VAX systems, automatically connects devices that areB      physically attached to the system and loads their drivers. On<      Alpha systems, use the SYSMAN command IO AUTOCONFIGURE.  D      Use of the AUTOCONFIGURE command requires the CMKRNL privilege.        Format   "        AUTOCONFIGURE  adapter-spec          AUTOCONFIGURE ALL           #   Additional information available:      Parameter  Qualifiers    /EXCLUDE   /LOG       /SELECT 
   Examples   				Rob    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:47:37 +0200 2 From: "Ren Schelbaum" <rene.schelbaum@datakom.at>0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearingG Message-ID: <3b66a860$0$28950$6e365a64@newsreader02.highway.telekom.at>h  < <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> schrieb im NewsbeitragF news:OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br...G > Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed ac > "minimum boot" ???L > I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blind > ?o > 	 > Regardst >k > FC >f   ... not too much of a problem:  + on newer Versions of VMS: MC SYSMAN IO AUTOr( and on older Version: MC SYSGEN AUTO ALL     ...and you have them   regardse   Ren   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:21:21 -0400n* From: "Chris Moore" <moore_mc@hotmail.com>0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing- Message-ID: <rhy97.44$Z2.1814@nnrp1.uunet.ca>m  6 <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote in messageF news:OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br...G > Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a_ > "minimum boot" ???L > I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blind > ?m >c	 > Regardsv >g > FC  G I have had similar situation in the past (usually on microVAX with DSSI)< disks).  After the boot is complete, log on and do 2 things.# 1.  $ @sys$system:STARTUP CONFIGURE J 2.  $ SYSGEN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL      ==> (VAX, obviously...Alpha use SYSMANJ IO AUTOCONFIGURE presumably....not exactly sure about the IPF command just yet....)   Chris Moore + <<How do I set a laser printer to "Stun"?>>s   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:31:21 GMTp1 From: "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com> 0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing1 Message-ID: <3B66B3B6.44D3DC1@clarityconnect.com>n  H As has been said the 1st step is to autoconfigure the system with eitherD SYSMAN or SYSGEN depending on whether you are on VAX or Alpha.  ThisF will get all the direct connected disks configured but to get the MSCPD served disks configured you will also need to start up the CONFIGURE process with $ @SYS$SYSTEM:STARTUP CONFIG    * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote: > G > Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed aa > "minimum boot" ???L > I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blind > ?i > 	 > Regardso >  > FC   -- aD Jilly	- Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley - Lockwood, NY0 	- jilly@clarityconnect.com			- Brett Bodine fan. 	- Mark.Jilson@Compaq.com			- since 1975 or so, 	- http://www.jilly.baka.com               -   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 09:32:00 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)e0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing3 Message-ID: <MgGoof4Rdz2O@eisner.encompasserve.org>f  a In article <6HDpXkELwGO9@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:h  1 	Re: what you have tried.... Note... it is SYSMANa( 	on Alpha BUT SYSGEN on VAX.  See below.   			Rob  | > In article <OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> writes:H >> Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a >> "minimum boot" ???oM >> I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blind  >> ? > * > 	Doesn't appear to be in there... hmmmm. >  > 	If on Alpha:n >  > 	$ mcr sysmant >  > 	SYSMAN> IO AUTO > 	SYSMAN> EXITs >  > 	VAX:n
 > 	MCR SYSGEN  > 	SYSGEN> AUTOCONFIG ALL  > 	EXITu >  > SYSGEN>  HELPi >  >   Information available: > D >   AUTOCONFIGURE         CONFIGURE  CONNECT    CREATE     DEINSTALLJ >   Description           DISABLE    ENABLE     HELP       INSTALL    LOADN >   MSCP       Parameters RELOAD     SET        SHARE      SHOW       TERMINAL >   USE        WRITE >  > Topic? autocon >  > AUTOCONFIGUREe > 3 >      This command is for use on VAX systems only.i> >      On VAX systems, automatically connects devices that areD >      physically attached to the system and loads their drivers. On> >      Alpha systems, use the SYSMAN command IO AUTOCONFIGURE. > F >      Use of the AUTOCONFIGURE command requires the CMKRNL privilege. > 
 >      FormatG > $ >        AUTOCONFIGURE  adapter-spec >  >        AUTOCONFIGURE ALL >      >  >  > % >   Additional information available:k >  >   Parameter  QualifiersS! >   /EXCLUDE   /LOG       /SELECT  >   Examples > 	 > 				Rob  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:20:53 -0400r5 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty@qwertysasasdfgh.com>u0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing2 Message-ID: <V7BmO0NoEjoAZGnmc8n+hnoqUa4v@4ax.com>  0 Along with the appropriate AUTOCONFIGURE command> described previously, you may also need to start the CONFIGURE* process via @SYS$SYSTEM:STARTUP CONFIGURE.   David R. Beattyy  # On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:29:53 -0300,0, <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote:  F >Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a >"minimum boot" ???tK >I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blinde >? >o >Regards >u >FCe   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 16:47:29 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>f0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearingH Message-ID: <y4vgk9w3y6.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  4 "Ren Schelbaum" <rene.schelbaum@datakom.at> writes:  - > on newer Versions of VMS: MC SYSMAN IO AUTOH* > and on older Version: MC SYSGEN AUTO ALL  J In addition, if you have any remote disks, you have to start the CONFIGURE process with    @SYS$MANAGER:SYSTARTUP CONFIGURE   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:36:20 +0100a( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing) Message-ID: <3B66C264.3EFAAADC@127.0.0.1>o  * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote: > G > Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a  > "minimum boot" ???  > Typically the way I deal with this, rightly or wrongly, is to:  ' $ @ sys$startup:vms$device_startup fulle   Works for VAX and Alpha.   -- .( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comn   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:37:46 -0400n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>-0 Subject: Re: Minimum boot -  disks not appearing, Message-ID: <3B66DEDA.9FCFDECB@videotron.ca>   "Ren Schelbaum" wrote: - > on newer Versions of VMS: MC SYSMAN IO AUTOg* > and on older Version: MC SYSGEN AUTO ALL  J What was the reason for moving AUTOCONFIGURE ALL from SYSGEN to IO AUTO inN SYSMAN  when VMS was ported to Alpha ? (and VAX-VMS not following that move) ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:27:43 -0300 + From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>i/ Subject: Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearing-L Message-ID: <OF7BFBE9FE.B8908B68-ON03256A9A.0049C088@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   People  H We've tried to use MC SYSMAN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL before.  It is a Microvax with DSSI disk.4J But this command didnt work .... I dont have access to the machine because it is in8 another  site (no-network), and we were trying by phone.   Regardsi   FC    U                                                                                       U                     young_r@encompa                                                  aU                     sserve.org (Rob        Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com             yU                     Young)                 cc:                                       gU                                            Assunto:     Re: Minimum boot - disks not aU                     31/07/2001             appearing                                 lU                     10:44                                                             U                     Responder a                                                      wU                     young_r                                                          eU                                                                                      rU                                                                                      v        
 In articleA <OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>,l- <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> writes:fG > Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a  > "minimum boot" ???F > I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I blindl > ?.  ,      Doesn't appear to be in there... hmmmm.        If on Alpha:s        $ mcr sysman         SYSMAN> IO AUTO      SYSMAN> EXIT.  	      VAX:       MCR SYSGEN<      SYSGEN> AUTOCONFIG ALL.	      EXITi  
 SYSGEN>  HELP4     Information available:  B   AUTOCONFIGURE         CONFIGURE  CONNECT    CREATE     DEINSTALLH   Description           DISABLE    ENABLE     HELP       INSTALL    LOAD=   MSCP       Parameters RELOAD     SET        SHARE      SHOWs TERMINAL   USE        WRITE   Topic? autocon  
 AUTOCONFIGUREa  1      This command is for use on VAX systems only.-<      On VAX systems, automatically connects devices that areB      physically attached to the system and loads their drivers. On<      Alpha systems, use the SYSMAN command IO AUTOCONFIGURE.  D      Use of the AUTOCONFIGURE command requires the CMKRNL privilege.        Formatg  "        AUTOCONFIGURE  adapter-spec          AUTOCONFIGURE ALL        #   Additional information available:m     Parameter  Qualifiersl   /EXCLUDE   /LOG       /SELECTi
   Examples                       Robs   ------------------------------  " Date: Tue, 31 Jul 01 18:10:37 +200' From: huber@mppmu.mpg.de (Joseph Huber)e/ Subject: Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearingo, Message-ID: <9k6la0$140c$1@kiosk.rzg.mpg.de>  K In Article <OF7BFBE9FE.B8908B68-ON03256A9A.0049C088@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>j- <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> writes:t >People:I >We've tried to use MC SYSMAN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL before.  It is a Microvaxy >with DSSI disk.K >But this command didnt work .... I dont have access to the machine becauseo	 >it is ins   On VAX the command is       MCR SYSGEN AUTOCONFIG ALL   On Alpha it would be n     SYSMAN IO AUTOCONFIGURE      --  I This message does not represent the policies of the Max-Planck-Institute.nB Joseph "Sepp" Huber, MPI Physik, http://wwwvms.mppmu.mpg.de/~huber   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:27:45 -0400b5 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty@qwertysasasdfgh.com> / Subject: Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearingd2 Message-ID: <OdxmO9kf5JW8IZUdAem=6hrKVO55@4ax.com>  8 It's a Microvax, do you mean SYSMAN or SYSGEN?  You need! to use SYSGEN for VAX systems ...3  # On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:27:43 -0300, , <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote:   >: >PeopleC >oI >We've tried to use MC SYSMAN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL before.  It is a Microvax8 >with DSSI disk.K >But this command didnt work .... I dont have access to the machine because 	 >it is inw9 >another  site (no-network), and we were trying by phone." >l >Regards >b >FC> >i >nV >                                                                                     V >                    young_r@encompa                                                  V >                    sserve.org (Rob        Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com             V >                    Young)                 cc:                                       V >                                           Assunto:     Re: Minimum boot - disks not V >                    31/07/2001             appearing                                 V >                    10:44                                                            V >                    Responder a                                                      V >                    young_r                                                          V >                                                                                     V >                                                                                      >e >n >) >u >In articleFB ><OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>,. ><fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> writes:H >> Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a >> "minimum boot" ???oG >> I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am IF >blind >> ? >p- >     Doesn't appear to be in there... hmmmm.s >p >     If on Alpha: >  >     $ mcr sysman >s >     SYSMAN> IO AUTO  >     SYSMAN> EXIT >o
 >     VAX: >     MCR SYSGEN >     SYSGEN> AUTOCONFIG ALL
 >     EXIT >i >SYSGEN>  HELP >c >  Information available:e >wC >  AUTOCONFIGURE         CONFIGURE  CONNECT    CREATE     DEINSTALLtI >  Description           DISABLE    ENABLE     HELP       INSTALL    LOADd> >  MSCP       Parameters RELOAD     SET        SHARE      SHOW	 >TERMINALd >  USE        WRITEt >  >Topic? autoconv >r >AUTOCONFIGURE >m2 >     This command is for use on VAX systems only.= >     On VAX systems, automatically connects devices that aresC >     physically attached to the system and loads their drivers. Ona= >     Alpha systems, use the SYSMAN command IO AUTOCONFIGURE.s > E >     Use of the AUTOCONFIGURE command requires the CMKRNL privilege.w >i >     Format >.# >       AUTOCONFIGURE  adapter-specn >d >       AUTOCONFIGURE ALLe >s >. >h >l$ >  Additional information available: >d >  Parameter  Qualifiers  >  /EXCLUDE   /LOG       /SELECT >  Examples- >- >                    Rob >u >3 >u >0   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 19:15:27 +0200m From: gerhard.staub@rizit.at/ Subject: Re: Minimum boot - disks not appearingL( Message-ID: <3B66E7AF.64EFF1BF@rizit.at>   You have to do following $ @sys$system:startup configuren  " this starts the configure-process.   regardss gerhard0   David Beatty schrieb:s > : > It's a Microvax, do you mean SYSMAN or SYSGEN?  You need# > to use SYSGEN for VAX systems ...o > % > On Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:27:43 -0300,-. > <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote: >  > > 	 > >People  > >-K > >We've tried to use MC SYSMAN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL before.  It is a Microvaxb > >with DSSI disk.M > >But this command didnt work .... I dont have access to the machine becauseC > >it is in7; > >another  site (no-network), and we were trying by phone.y > >O
 > >Regards > >i > >FCv > >h > >  > >r& > >                    young_r@encompaK > >                    sserve.org (Rob        Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comn1 > >                    Young)                 cc:1W > >                                           Assunto:     Re: Minimum boot - disks notm7 > >                    31/07/2001             appearing@ > >                    10:44" > >                    Responder a > >                    young_r > >r > >a > >o > >e > >p > >r
 > >In articleeD > ><OFEBCF0A7F.129F4477-ON03256A9A.0043CE7E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>,0 > ><fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> writes:J > >> Is there a way to LOAD all the disks in a server, when is performed a > >> "minimum boot" ???mI > >> I've searched in the Wizard and FAQs and didnt find any way. Or am I0 > >blind > >> ? > >h/ > >     Doesn't appear to be in there... hmmmm.L > >  > >     If on Alpha: > >  > >     $ mcr sysman > >F > >     SYSMAN> IO AUTO  > >     SYSMAN> EXIT > >  > >     VAX: > >     MCR SYSGEN > >     SYSGEN> AUTOCONFIG ALL > >     EXIT > >E > >SYSGEN>  HELP > >R > >  Information available:  > > E > >  AUTOCONFIGURE         CONFIGURE  CONNECT    CREATE     DEINSTALLfK > >  Description           DISABLE    ENABLE     HELP       INSTALL    LOADi@ > >  MSCP       Parameters RELOAD     SET        SHARE      SHOW > >TERMINALn > >  USE        WRITEs > >  > >Topic? autoconU > >F > >AUTOCONFIGURE > >h4 > >     This command is for use on VAX systems only.? > >     On VAX systems, automatically connects devices that areAE > >     physically attached to the system and loads their drivers. On ? > >     Alpha systems, use the SYSMAN command IO AUTOCONFIGURE.l > > G > >     Use of the AUTOCONFIGURE command requires the CMKRNL privilege.7 > >0 > >     Format > >e% > >       AUTOCONFIGURE  adapter-specj > >R > >       AUTOCONFIGURE ALLa > >i > >e > >- > >3& > >  Additional information available: > >. > >  Parameter  Qualifiers" > >  /EXCLUDE   /LOG       /SELECT
 > >  Examplese > >E > >                    Rob > >E > >- > >t > >s   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:47:11 +0100f% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>s( Subject: More VMS news from The Inquirer8 Message-ID: <fogdmtcegk4ovj5qbdc0836a8hi8f186km@4ax.com>  E According to the Inquirer it has been contacted by a former member ofS: VMS engineering who now works for Intel. According to thisD 'informant',  "I don't see how they are going to do the VMS port, asD there are only about 11 people left from the team that built OVMS 7.- And that team had over 300 members back then"   E The Inquirer adds "We would eschew such a cynical view. It is obvious C that advances since the original build mean that efficiency is much7E greater than of yore, with only four per cent of the workforce neededwF before they are going to port the OS to a new platform. Where there is a will, there is a way. "  2 Article at http://www.theinquirer.net/31070110.htm         -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:25:57 -0400m5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>,, Subject: Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer1 Message-ID: <3%A97.442$Yx2.8658@news.cpqcorp.net>   F And I can only think of 2 who worked on OpenVMS V1 who are still here./ Gosh.  Time to fold the tents we're all doomed..       Alan Greig wrote in message ...s >pF >According to the Inquirer it has been contacted by a former member of; >VMS engineering who now works for Intel. According to thiscE >'informant',  "I don't see how they are going to do the VMS port, as-E >there are only about 11 people left from the team that built OVMS 7.s. >And that team had over 300 members back then" >MF >The Inquirer adds "We would eschew such a cynical view. It is obviousD >that advances since the original build mean that efficiency is muchF >greater than of yore, with only four per cent of the workforce neededG >before they are going to port the OS to a new platform. Where there ism >a will, there is a way. "w >t3 >Article at http://www.theinquirer.net/31070110.htma >  >n >m >o >--? >Alane   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:52:21 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman), Subject: Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer1 Message-ID: <9nB97.446$Yx2.8803@news.cpqcorp.net>i  ` In article <fogdmtcegk4ovj5qbdc0836a8hi8f186km@4ax.com>, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> writes: : F :According to the Inquirer it has been contacted by a former member of; :VMS engineering who now works for Intel. According to thismE :'informant',  "I don't see how they are going to do the VMS port, assE :there are only about 11 people left from the team that built OVMS 7._. :And that team had over 300 members back then"     Noted.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 17:29:01 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman), Subject: Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer1 Message-ID: <xVB97.453$Yx2.8864@news.cpqcorp.net>X  i In article <3%A97.442$Yx2.8658@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes::G :And I can only think of 2 who worked on OpenVMS V1 who are still here.L     Three, actually.  0 :Gosh.  Time to fold the tents we're all doomed.  F   Yeah, and nearly half of the reputed remaining eleven members of the2   V7.0 team were sitting at the lunch table today.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:45:26 -0300I+ From: <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>E, Subject: Re: More VMS news from The InquirerL Message-ID: <OF7AA6B276.78C2DDBC-ON03256A9A.005BC38E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   Only 2 guys  ?????  
 Hmmmm ....  1 There is no chance for OpenVMS under Itanium ....,  H In my personal opinion,  we will  stay with OpenVMS/Alpha for a long ti= me !H If this port will not be technically possible, so, the way is to mainta= in
 OpenVMS/Alpha4= and create a new company to manage the hardware and software.   H Compaq will have their Tru64 and Linux under Itanium. And Windows ? If = they can:6 hire back the people from Windows NT / Alpha may be...   Regards:   FC    H                                                                        =                  =20H                     "Fred Kleinsorge"                                  =                  =20H                     <kleinsorge@star.zk        Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Sai= c.Com            =20H                     o.dec.com>                 cc:                     =                  =20H                                                Assunto:     Re: More VM= S news from The  =20H                     31/07/2001 13:25           Inquirer                =                  =20H                     Responder a "Fred                                  =                  =20H                     Kleinsorge"                                        =                  =20H                                                                        =                  =20H                                                                        =                  =20        F And I can only think of 2 who worked on OpenVMS V1 who are still here./ Gosh.  Time to fold the tents we're all doomed.D       Alan Greig wrote in message ...f >eF >According to the Inquirer it has been contacted by a former member of; >VMS engineering who now works for Intel. According to thislE >'informant',  "I don't see how they are going to do the VMS port, as E >there are only about 11 people left from the team that built OVMS 7.a. >And that team had over 300 members back then" >iF >The Inquirer adds "We would eschew such a cynical view. It is obviousD >that advances since the original build mean that efficiency is muchF >greater than of yore, with only four per cent of the workforce neededH >before they are going to port the OS to a new platform. Where there is=   >a will, there is a way. =B5"T >n3 >Article at http://www.theinquirer.net/31070110.htm  >  >l >n >h >--v >Alan          =-   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 18:31:29 +0100c+ From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org>M, Subject: Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer' Message-ID: <3B66EB71.A2B9AC1F@iee.org>8   Hoff Hoffman wrote:> > b > In article <fogdmtcegk4ovj5qbdc0836a8hi8f186km@4ax.com>, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> writes: > : H > :According to the Inquirer it has been contacted by a former member of= > :VMS engineering who now works for Intel. According to this.G > :'informant',  "I don't see how they are going to do the VMS port, as G > :there are only about 11 people left from the team that built OVMS 7. 0 > :And that team had over 300 members back then" > 
 >   Noted.  ' I guess the other nine are busy readingA) IPF docs leaving you and Fred to hold the  fort in c.o.v :-)    Antonio:   --     --------------- - Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.org    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 17:47:00 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) , Subject: Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer0 Message-ID: <009FFD4F.BC8E5AC2@SendSpamHere.ORG>  f In article <xVB97.453$Yx2.8864@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:j >In article <3%A97.442$Yx2.8658@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes:H >:And I can only think of 2 who worked on OpenVMS V1 who are still here. >  >  Three, actually.   4 Andy and Ruth come to mind.  Who would be the third?   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMe            rJ   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbesd   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:48:06 -0400e' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> , Subject: Re: More VMS news from The Inquirer( Message-ID: <9k6r1k$h14$1@pyrite.mv.net>  @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message+ news:3%A97.442$Yx2.8658@news.cpqcorp.net... H > And I can only think of 2 who worked on OpenVMS V1 who are still here.1 > Gosh.  Time to fold the tents we're all doomed.S  = The really sad part is that you think you're being facetious.N   - bill   >  >I > ! > Alan Greig wrote in message ...  > > H > >According to the Inquirer it has been contacted by a former member of= > >VMS engineering who now works for Intel. According to this G > >'informant',  "I don't see how they are going to do the VMS port, asNG > >there are only about 11 people left from the team that built OVMS 7.r0 > >And that team had over 300 members back then" > >CH > >The Inquirer adds "We would eschew such a cynical view. It is obviousF > >that advances since the original build mean that efficiency is muchH > >greater than of yore, with only four per cent of the workforce neededI > >before they are going to port the OS to a new platform. Where there ise > >a will, there is a way. "M > >m5 > >Article at http://www.theinquirer.net/31070110.htm1 > >k > >m > >> > >n > >--e > >Alan9 >B >8   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 06:23:27 -0700) From: linuxmtl@yahoo.com (Moi Je Le Sais)eD Subject: Opercon question ... since I'm running out of time here ...= Message-ID: <80125384.0107310523.5cd0da59@posting.google.com>    Hi,t  A Just got an evaluation copy of Opercon... and I must set it up byR today...  ( It is currently installed and working...  D Question (fast): How can I set it up to simply send all AUDIT$SERVER? messages to a specific email address along with the text of theP8 trapped event? This is all we need to do for the moment.   Regards,   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 08:15:51 -0600e2 From: Eugene A Zharkov <zharkov@vista-control.com>0 Subject: Re: Passing a socket to another process1 Message-ID: <3B66BD97.CCC9FCC4@vista-control.com>o   Paul Dembry wrote: > A > "Eugene A Zharkov" <zharkov@vista-control.com> wrote in message - > news:3B632497.EACDA07B@vista-control.com....> > > I have found in comp.os.vms an example of passing a socket8 > > to another process that is based on the sys$creprc's> > > prc$m_netwrk option. But there is still a couple of things( > > that I am not sure how to deal with. > >e@ > > 1. The prc$m_netwrk is not documented very well. Maybe thereB > > is a better (documented) way of doing this (on VMS 7.1/UCX 5.0 > > and higher). > > ? > > 2. If my process is started by inetd, I can open the socket B > > using the socket(TCPIP$_AUXS) call. But I can't make my master: > > server open/pass the socket in the way that would make< > > TCPIP$_AUXS to work. I noticed, for example, that the bg9 > > device created by inetd has a "Reference count" of 0. < > > Mine is 1. What does inetd do to make the bg device stay& > > alive with the reference count 0 ?N > How about doing a vfork()/exec() pair?  Have the "parent" do a dup2() of theI > socket to a known file descriptor slot and then exec() the new process. N > When it comes up, it does a dup() of that known file descriptor slot and you > are ready to go. > Paul  D That is what I do now. But in some cases I need to run loginout.exe.? The vfork/exec solution does not seem to work with loginout.exe     > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!C> -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  " Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2001 8:50:23 GMT From: Audlin@yahoo.com (Audlin) * Subject: PRINTER CARTRIDGE BLOWOUT SALE!!!: Message-ID: <0Vx97.23527$Ne6.1076511@wagner.videotron.net>   Check this out   http://promos.batcave.net/   Audlin l   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:03:41 GMTX' From: Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU>  Subject: Quorum Disk Questions) Message-ID: <3B66C8CD.23508E54@UIowa.EDU>n  C I am investigating using a Quorum disk in a 4 node OpenVMS cluster.   E My original idea was to utilize a shadow set disk on a SAN visible to G all 4 nodes as a Quorum disk and even put some system environment files F on it.  However, I just read that a Quorum disk can't be a member of a shadow set!m  G Is this absolute?  What options would I have to to easily safeguard the F data on such a disk?  We have all of our disks shadowed and our SAN isI actually two separate boxes with the shadow pairs split across the boxes.    Thanks!A Rick -- EH Richard L. Dyson                                    rick-dyson@uiowa.eduH  _   _  _____                    http://www-pi.physics.uiowa.edu/~dyson/H | | | ||_   _|  Senior Systems Analyst  --  INFORMM-Cerner Systems Group< | | | |  | |    The University of Iowa Hospitals and ClinicsH | \_/ | _| |_   Information Systems BT1000 GH       Office: 319/384-7016H  \___/ |_____|  Iowa City, IA 52242-1052               FAX: 319/384-7020   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 18:01:00 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> " Subject: Re: Quorum Disk QuestionsH Message-ID: <y4d76hjdfn.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  ) Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> writes:S  E > I am investigating using a Quorum disk in a 4 node OpenVMS cluster.n  N Stop here: a quorum disk is only ever needed on a two-node cluster in order toJ break ties and allow the cluster to continue running when one node is down without manual intervention.  $ Thus, the answer is "don't do that".   	Jan   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:26:29 GMTo2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)" Subject: Re: Quorum Disk Questions1 Message-ID: <V_A97.441$Yx2.8405@news.cpqcorp.net>c  S In article <3B66C8CD.23508E54@UIowa.EDU>, Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> writes:   H   OpenVMS version, platform, and general (shared) storage configuration?  F :My original idea was to utilize a shadow set disk on a SAN visible toH :all 4 nodes as a Quorum disk and even put some system environment filesG :on it.  However, I just read that a Quorum disk can't be a member of ar :shadow set! :e :Is this absolute?    E   Yes.  Would you want two members of a quorum disk host-based volumerD   shadow set split, and made available to contribute the quorum diskF   votes into each of two partitions of a (fragmented) OpenVMS Cluster C   configuration?  The results could be "entertaining", of course...d  5 :What options would I have to to easily safeguard the'G :data on such a disk?  We have all of our disks shadowed and our SAN is J :actually two separate boxes with the shadow pairs split across the boxes.  I   Multi-path-accessable controller-based RAID disk storage is an option, XI   of course.  In your configuration, I'd also look seriously at adding a AG   fifth (voting) node.  Also consider which of your four existing nodess   are the most critical.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 17:26:25 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)" Subject: Re: Quorum Disk Questions1 Message-ID: <5TB97.450$Yx2.8904@news.cpqcorp.net>i   In article <y4d76hjdfn.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:* :Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> writes: : F :> I am investigating using a Quorum disk in a 4 node OpenVMS cluster. : O :Stop here: a quorum disk is only ever needed on a two-node cluster in order to K :break ties and allow the cluster to continue running when one node is downs :without manual intervention.h  E   That's not strictly true.  There are a number of sites that use thecD   quorum disk with configurations of more than two voting nodes, andF   specifically with the quorum disk votes set one less than the total D   number of votes contributed by the voting nodes.  This permits theB   configuration to survive the loss of all but one voting node, atA   the (obvious) potential risk for the loss of the votes from the    quorum disk.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 02:11:46 -07005 From: Hiroyuki_Tanaka4@excite.co.jp (Hiroyuki Tanaka)e$ Subject: Reading Mail on other Nodes= Message-ID: <68cfa44d.0107310111.58696d06@posting.google.com>8  
 Dear Readers,n  F Is it possible using the callable VMS mail API to open a mail.mai fileE on a different node (assuming all the privileges are setup), and readg+ the mail.  The computers are not clustered.   ? If so how do you specify the name of the mail file, ie node andi/ directory for the mail.mai file I wish to open.'  ' Thanks once again for your suggestions.g   Tanaka   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:45:15 -0400l; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>M( Subject: Re: Reading Mail on other Nodes$ Message-ID: <3b66e0f7$1@news.si.com>  G >Is it possible using the callable VMS mail API to open a mail.mai fileaF >on a different node (assuming all the privileges are setup), and read, >the mail.  The computers are not clustered.   I just did the following:e   $ mail    ! MAIL> set file agvax::[.mail]mailu  
 MAIL> dir/fol.= Listing of folders in AGVAX::A301_DISK:[TILLMAN.MAIL]MAIL.MAI-#      Press CTRL/C to cancel listing23 A-P-C                                   ADOPT-KOREAf1 ANGLICAN                                ANONYMOUS 0 BULLETIN                                CALENDAR+ CHAIN                                   CLD1 ...4  G Notice I'm reading a mail file on another node in our network.  So, theu answer is "yes, it's possible."o --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comtA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comp= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventa< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:38:07 +0200e7 From: "Dijk, Jeroen van" <Jeroen.vanDijk@Getronics.com>-) Subject: RE: SAN-based Backup for OpenVMS-> Message-ID: <2795B75EF003D311801A00A0C906B511011C652E@CUCEXEC>   Hi,   c I work at a recovery site. And the only thing we do is help company to recover there systems after r# a crash or other stress situations.f  ] To be sure 100% that you can recover a VMS system you need an image backup of all your disks.qN An VMS image backup can you do with a cpu that understands the VMS fileformat.- So your really needs a cpu to do the backup. I  U I have ask our SAN specialist and he says that SAN is modern word for a scsi cluster.   o If you realy wants to make a SAN backup places a small diskless alpha with a lot of fibercards into the sanbox.rQ And give that one only read rights to the disks and full access to the tapeunits.-  F The same is possible with a linux host, but then you have to do a dd.   O Make sure you to test if the production VMS hosts can read the SAN backuptapes.-  ^ If that is not possible you have a problem if you want recover your system in a short periode.a A san situation with mix architure you don't want that you first need to restore the backupsystem0f and with that system restore every other file systems. And the production systems and system managers , are waiting until the magic box is finished.  H Also I don't like the idea of backup of several filesystems on one tape.  % I hope that the basic idea is clear. a  	 Greeting   Jeroen  4 ****************************************************$ Getronics System Integration BV					 Business Continuity 								. Botter 15-90 			Telefoon  :	+31 320 266 314			) Postbus 2228 			Fax 	:	+31 320 266 219			n: 8203 AE  LELYSTAD 		E-mail 	:	Jeroen.vanDijk@getronics.com  6 **************** www.getronics.com *******************       -----Original Message-----. From: Rick Dyson [mailto:Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU]  Sent: maandag 30 juli 2001 21:49 To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  Cc: svieth@wi.rr.com) Subject: Re: SAN-based Backup for OpenVMS      Scott Vieth wrote:  T > 1) Putting anything other than disks in an ESA12000/EMA12000 is strictly verboten.  G 	Why is this so?  I don't know the exact plans of our I/O people, but IcO got the impression that they were always talking about dropping the MLxxxx SDLT D drive into the EMA12000 enclosure along with the Modular Data Router interface...  S > 3) I know what you're looking for ("server-less backup") but I haven't seen it in O > the VMS space yet.  I think Compaq is close to rolling out a solution for the T > NT/2000 world.  It involves using Backup Exec (or a similar competing product) and > the Modular Data Router.  B 	Indeed.  I want to be able to do this to keep performance up, butL have it make VMS-compatible tapes.  Using Veritas or Legatto to do this willE probably mean the tapes could not be used directly by VMS to recover.o  @ 	It appears the only options are to just move the data over the F interconnect to the VMS box and then back out to the tape drive.  ThusJ the data has to travel through the FC connection twice where it could have stayed within the SAN...   Thanks,o Rick -- nH Richard L. Dyson                                    rick-dyson@uiowa.eduH  _   _  _____                    http://www-pi.physics.uiowa.edu/~dyson/H | | | ||_   _|  Senior Systems Analyst  --  INFORMM-Cerner Systems Group< | | | |  | |    The University of Iowa Hospitals and ClinicsH | \_/ | _| |_   Information Systems BT1000 GH       Office: 319/384-7016H  \___/ |_____|  Iowa City, IA 52242-1052               FAX: 319/384-7020   > -scott >  > Rick Dyson wrote:t > K > > Does anyone know if there are any solutions available for using some ofrS > > the big, new SDLT tape library boxes in an EMA 12000 SAN with HSG80 controllers-? > > and using Fiber Channel for interconnects to OpenVMS Alphaso > > running v7.2-1?i > >gM > > In particular, I am researching the possiblility of performing the backupFS > > between the SAN-served disks and the SDLT drive *without* needing to move every6Q > > byte to and from the OpenVMS server too.  That is, keep all the data movementu! > > within the fabric of the SAN.m   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 16:25:25 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>r) Subject: Re: SAN-based Backup for OpenVMSeH Message-ID: <y41ymxxjje.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  ) Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> writes:t  E > 	The idea is "server-less" backup.  Where the OpenVMS host softwareoH > simply tells the SAN to make a backup of the OpenVMS disks to the SAN-J > connected SDLT drive.  This would eliminate data flow off the SAN to theG > Host and back to the SAN to the tape drive.  It would off-load servere > CPU load.a > D > 	The goal would be that the backup tape would be OpenVMS-compliantK > such that I could recover individual files or entire disks, etc.  Just as> > I can with "normal" backups.  N If you want that, either the performance is going to be abominal (a tape isn'tN random access - but Glenn Everhart has done a pseudo-driver to allow this), orO the SAN has to understand ODS-2/ODS-5 and be a more-or-less complete VMS BACKUPR) implmentation. The latter seems unlikely.    	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:49:22 +0100O4 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett.@unnecessary.csc.com> Subject: Simple DCL queryo3 Message-ID: <3B667F22.FDB89716@unnecessary.csc.com>    Hi,n  F I recently came across a command procedure that didn't make use of theE '$' at the beginning of the command line between an IF...THEN...ENDIFu	 statementM  ( eg:    $ if f$mode() .eqs. "INTERACTIVE"         $ then%             write sys$output "line 1"n%             write sys$output "line 2"e%             write sys$output "line 3"n         $ endifa  F and wondered 'is this strictly valid?' I have not seen this before and' was certainly never taught to use this.    Any comments??   Regards,   Aden  < === My comments are not necessarily those of my employer ===   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 20:33:24 +0010a% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.aun Subject: Re: Simple DCL query 5 Message-ID: <01K6LE4J28ZM003E01@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>h   Adrian Birkett wrote:S  G >I recently came across a command procedure that didn't make use of the F >'$' at the beginning of the command line between an IF...THEN...ENDIF
 >statement >") >eg:    $ if f$mode() .eqs. "INTERACTIVE"o >        $ thend& >            write sys$output "line 1"& >            write sys$output "line 2"& >            write sys$output "line 3" >        $ endif >fG >and wondered 'is this strictly valid?' I have not seen this before anda( >was certainly never taught to use this. >a >Any comments??n  E Comments only, really.  Yes, a year or two back there was a bit of a 8N discussion here on some of this esoteric arcania.  My comment is that I would M not use it.  It will get novices and often old hands wondering what the 'eck nD is going on, where the standard prompt usage is self-evident to all.  N (Now who was it that gave those wonderful explanations about the ampersand --   I've got them stored somewhere.)  G It is similar to me to when you do not have to enclose symbols between tO apostrophes.  Yeah, the rules here are fairly simply but I love apostrophes so h6 much (see below :-), that I always use full enclosure.  ? Talking of symbols, on my VMS box your address came through as:a  , TGMAIL::IN%"'abirkett.'@unnecessary.csc.com"   now shouldn't that have been:o  - TGMAIL::IN%"''abirkett.'@unnecessary.csc.com"p  L but then I cannot remember if "." is valid in a symbol -- so late in .au :-)   Regards, Paddy   Paddy O'Brien, Transmission Development, 
 TransGrid, PO Box A1000, Sydney South,  NSW 2000, Australia & (Street address, 201 Elizabeth Street)     Tel:   +61 2 9284-3063 Fax:   +61 2 9284-3050& Email: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au  M Either "\'" or "\s" (to escape the apostrophe) seems to work for most people,l; but that little whizz-bang apostrophe gives me little spam.w   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:02:52 +010013 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com>s Subject: Re: Simple DCL queryn3 Message-ID: <3B669E6C.A42B2775@unnecessary.csc.com>    Paddy,  > No idea how the address go 'spoiled' but I'm with you on this.   Ta,a   Ade    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:25:25 -0400d  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com Subject: Re: Simple DCL querys4 Message-ID: <C2256A9A.00499EFB.00@jklh21.valmet.com>  1 Comment:  It works, but it's not standard syntax.x   $ TYPE TEST_DCL.COMa! $ if f$mode() .eqs. "INTERACTIVE"t $ then!         write sys$output "line 1"c!         write sys$output "line 2"e!         write sys$output "line 3"  $ endifr $o ..@ -*- Charlie Hammond's unsupported DCL checker (Version G2.1) -*- Checking file TEST_DCL.COM;n  . Starting Pass 1 -- 31-JUL-2001 09:18:29.58 .... Starting Pass 2 -- 31-JUL-2001 09:18:30.22 .... Starting Pass 3 -- 31-JUL-2001 09:18:30.39 ...  & Procedure contains:      6 total linesE                          6 code lines (including 0 lines w/ comments)e8                          0 additional continuation lines5                          0 lines w/i $DECK/$EOD pairsc-                          0 comment only linesT&                          0 blank lines  #  LINE  CODE  --DIAGNOSTIC MESSAGE--h(     3  LND  line does not start with "$"(     4  LND  line does not start with "$"(     5  LND  line does not start with "$"0 -*- END OF LISTING -*-   31-JUL-2001 09:18:31.08   $ @TEST_DCL.COMs line 1 line 2 line 3 $0            7 abirkett.@unnecessary.csc.com on 07/31/2001 05:49:22 AMe  / Please respond to abirkett.@unnecessary.csc.comz   To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.coms cc:t Subject:  Simple DCL query         Hi,   F I recently came across a command procedure that didn't make use of theE '$' at the beginning of the command line between an IF...THEN...ENDIFa	 statemento  ( eg:    $ if f$mode() .eqs. "INTERACTIVE"         $ then%             write sys$output "line 1" %             write sys$output "line 2" %             write sys$output "line 3"b         $ endifA  F and wondered 'is this strictly valid?' I have not seen this before and' was certainly never taught to use this.    Any comments??   Regards,   Ade~  < === My comments are not necessarily those of my employer ===   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:25:29 GMTi8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond) Subject: Re: Simple DCL query_1 Message-ID: <J5A97.435$Yx2.8590@news.cpqcorp.net>1  < Well, I'm flattered, but I do NOT claim that my DCL checker < is the final authority on what is "standard syntax" for DCL.E However, in this case I agree that these lines should start with "$".g  D Although DCL will accept commands without leading "$" in some cases,A it is entirely possible that future changes (fixes?) would break i
 such code.  5 In article <C2256A9A.00499EFB.00@jklh21.valmet.com>,  " norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes: >c2 >Comment:  It works, but it's not standard syntax. >  >$ TYPE TEST_DCL.COM" >$ if f$mode() .eqs. "INTERACTIVE" >$ then." >        write sys$output "line 1"" >        write sys$output "line 2"" >        write sys$output "line 3" >$ endif >$ >..mA >-*- Charlie Hammond's unsupported DCL checker (Version G2.1) -*-  >Checking file TEST_DCL.COM; ..$ > LINE  CODE  --DIAGNOSTIC MESSAGE--) >    3  LND  line does not start with "$"k) >    4  LND  line does not start with "$" ) >    5  LND  line does not start with "$"r1 >-*- END OF LISTING -*-   31-JUL-2001 09:18:31.08    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:55:50 GMTm2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: Simple DCL queryt1 Message-ID: <ayA97.437$Yx2.8659@news.cpqcorp.net>!  j In article <3B667F22.FDB89716@unnecessary.csc.com>, Adrian Birkett <abirkett.@unnecessary.csc.com> writes:  G :I recently came across a command procedure that didn't make use of theeF :'$' at the beginning of the command line between an IF...THEN...ENDIF
 :statement ..G :and wondered 'is this strictly valid?' I have not seen this before ando( :was certainly never taught to use this.  $   IMNSHO, that DCL code is broken.    >   Whether or not the code might work -- and might continue to    work -- is anyone's guess.  /   I would not depend on undocumented behaviour.o  @   If that code construct is in OpenVMS somewhere, please let me !   know where.  (So I can fix it.)t    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 17:13:51 +0100l3 From: Adrian Birkett <abirkett@unnecessary.csc.com>a Subject: Re: Simple DCL queryM3 Message-ID: <3B66D93F.B38E602E@unnecessary.csc.com>)   Hoff,:  H I can reassure your good self that this is NOT supplied with VMS. It mayH have been written some time ago, possibly by a 3rd party and it seems toD have been modified at some point. I was merely asked to validate the code before using it.R   Regards and thanks,i   Ade    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 18:24:57 +0100 + From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org>e Subject: Re: Simple DCL queryr' Message-ID: <3B66E9E9.ED6F368A@iee.org>o   Charlie Hammond wrote:F > Although DCL will accept commands without leading "$" in some cases,B > it is entirely possible that future changes (fixes?) would break > such code.  ) I cannot find the release note right now,f( but sometime in (IIRC) the V6 timeframe,' there was a note o the effect that thiso should not be used.n   I'm surprised it still works!f     Antonios   -- t   ---------------o- Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.orgi   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 06:25:18 GMT-- From: Stefan.Bill@soudronic.com (Stefan Bill)-& Subject: Re: Soft font modules / DCPS?. Message-ID: <3b664e7b.1847216@news.cis.dfn.de>  1 On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 13:56:10 -0400, Paul Andersoni# <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com> wrote:H  H >The SoftFont kits, now retired and no longer sold, emulate the fonts inB >LN03 and DEClaser printer font cartridges.  Fonts are sent to theG >printer with every print job, which is not terribly efficient but gaveMD >those wanting LN03/DEClaser font compatibility a way to print using >such fonts.  > Is there an other way to select a different font when printing ANSI-Files?i   Stefan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:30:04 +0200h, From: aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de (Hans M. Aus)& Subject: Re: Soft font modules / DCPS?D Message-ID: <aus-3107010930040001@wvia48.virologie.uni-wuerzburg.de>  H In article <3b664e7b.1847216@news.cis.dfn.de>, Stefan.Bill@soudronic.com (Stefan Bill) wrote:   ...> 3@ > Is there an other way to select a different font when printing
 > ANSI-Files?w >  > Stefan   Not that I know of  :(   -- sB Cheers, Hans M. Aus, Wuerzburg, Germany,  aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:05:46 -0400i0 From: Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>& Subject: Re: Soft font modules / DCPS?; Message-ID: <310720011005464600%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>v  : In article <3b664e7b.1847216@news.cis.dfn.de>, Stefan Bill" <Stefan.Bill@soudronic.com> wrote:  @ > Is there an other way to select a different font when printing
 > ANSI-Files?P  E No, not in a supported or easy way.  DCPS uses Courier for translated 
 ANSI jobs.  B That said, you could fiddle with PostScript code in device control/ modules to substitute another font for Courier.e  G You could also load another font onto your printer and call it Courier,a4 but then all jobs using Courier would use this font.  D There may be undesired side effects in either of these methods.  AndD typically, there aren't many monospaced fonts included with printersC (Letter Gothic and Monaco come to mind) so your choices are limitedT unless you buy your own fonts.   Paul   -- y  Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineeringa   Compaq Computer Corporation0   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:38:55 -0400:; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>8 Subject: Re: Steve Reece$ Message-ID: <3b66df7c$1@news.si.com>  ( >---- Transcript of session follows ---- > E >%%%%%%%%%%%%                   30-JUL-2001 23:16:35.22  %%%%%%%%%%%% B >%MAIL-E-OPENIN, error opening SYS$LOGIN:[SYSMGR]SIGN.TXT as inputB >-RMS-F-DEV, error in device name or inappropriate device type for
 >operation  : This is generated on the sender's end, not the recipient's -- bA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comoA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comb= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventt< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 14:45:31 +0100s0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>+ Subject: Re: Sun goes after Alpha user basee* Message-ID: <3B66B67B.FA9A28F3@uk.sun.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote: > 	 > Andrew,h > H > >>> Really, so where does that put WildFire, out of date before it was > launched. :):):):)<< >  > Hey, nice zing. :-)t > I > How about this one - checkout the original SPARC III announcement date:iL > http://www.sun.com/smi/Press/sunflash/9710/sunflash.971006.1.html (October
 > 6, 1997)L > "The UltraSPARC-III microprocessor is expected to sample during the summer
 > of 1998" > N > Now, tell us again how the SPARC III will be based on latest technologies .. >   7 How ironic Kerry that you of all people should bring up	7 roadmaps and the timely delivery of technology covered L in the roadmaps.  / Don't you have any shame, you work for Compaq ?w   Regardss Andrew Harrison* Enterprise IT Architecta   ------------------------------  ! Date: Tue, 31 Jul 01 09:30:30 GMTa From: jmfbahciv@aol.com   Subject: Re: Sun keep 'em coming+ Message-ID: <9k67bk$dkj$4@bob.news.rcn.net>   , In article <3B65842C.CEFC5059@videotron.ca>,1    JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:0 >Alan Greig wrote:E >> So it looks like Sun has a series of these postcards (at least twoeG >> certainly) going out for maximum impact. Meanwhile still no official 4 >> written communication from Conpaq. So far that's: >> i >> Sun 3   Conpaq 0o >r >nC >Sun is eager to win your business. Compaq doesn't care about your p	 business.v >Take the hint.  >hH >I wonder if Compaq's "commodity" mentality is going to hurt it with theJ >small/medium customers, not worthy of having had a visit from Compaq and  notcI >getting any information. Remember that prior to the Digital acquisition,sK >Compaq only had relationships with the largest customers in a region. The a restH >were anonymous buyers that bought through retailers who bought through 
 distributors.v  : This is a really important point.  Compaq doesn't know how: to do operating system development and get it to the field7 in a timely mannner.  They got rid of the people (from e% programmers to VPs) who did know how.e   /BAH      ' Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.h   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:49:55 +0100_( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>< Subject: Re: TCPIP v5.1 startup on dial-up service provider.) Message-ID: <3B669B63.BBEFF156@127.0.0.1>    Simon Clubley wrote:  0 > On Mon, 30 Jul 2001 12:52:56 +1000, in article >tK > I used an auto-dialer that I wrote myself to open up the modem on the LTAIM > device, dial the ISP, and then login via a scripted login. [Before you ask,eN > I wrote the auto-dialer for work, so I am not allowed to make it available.]  U As another reminder, available from my Demon website will be the autodialler I use, a-R unix package ported to VMS which can perform other dialling tasks (e.g. paging) as well as automated connection.I  P I'll get clearance for the Alpha version (done inhouse @ CSC) then I'll push theL package up on http://www.python.demon.co.uk/pickup.html (Announcement here!)  U Steve, seeing as you are on DEMON I will also send you the code logic that determines N which number to dial, the surftime number or the general numbers, and also theQ monitoring procedure which performs a reconnect if the line drops (which is rare,c= it's usually when my daughter presses the DATA/VOICE switch!)s  D (Drop me a note at the nic@python address when your mail's fixed :-) --( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comh   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 12:58:55 GMTOB From: Simon Clubley <simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFP>< Subject: Re: TCPIP v5.1 startup on dial-up service provider.6 Message-ID: <jYx97.12505$ar1.38281@www.newsranger.com>  D Steve Reece asked the following in a posting that has not made it toF Newsranger. (I run a local newsfeed for reading and use Newsranger for	 posting).    From Steve Reece:   F >This raises another question Simon - how do you mean that you ran theG >ppp connection over LAT?  One of the configurations that I've heard ofiH >is connecting the modem up to a port on a terminal server but I thoughtB >that this arrangement would only permit a connection to a similar >combination at the other end.
 >Steve R.   J In this case, the LAT connection is only used as the means of transportingK the modem data stream to and from the PPP stack. A standard PPP data stream8: is transmitted over the modem; no LAT information is sent.  G It is not the same as a DECnet over IP connection. In that case, DECnethG packets are sent within an IP data stream and requires the other end to$
 know this.  H The PPP over LAT situation is like (for example) running Kermit within aE terminal emulator running over LAT instead of to a directly connected3H serial port. It is transparent to the VMS based Kermit server, as only aM Kermit data stream is transmitted regardless of the communications path used.?   Simon.   -- d; Simon Clubley, simon_clubley@remove_me.excite.com-Earth.UFPrK In the task of removing Microsoft from the marketplace, I have discovered a1E truly remarkable plan, but this signature is too small to contain it.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 07:53:45 -0700t' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>m& Subject: Re: The death of Storageworks+ Message-ID: <3B66C679.F0DF3BC1@caltech.edu>    "Doc.Cypher" wrote:E  $ > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > ? > On Mon, 30 Jul 2001, David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu> wrote:t >  > >*
 > >RIH Compaq  > >* >s/ > Jbhyq gung creuncf fgnaq sbe Ebg Va Uryy? ;-)l >  >   6 Gung vf pbeerpg.  Vg vf obgu n phefr naq n cerqvpgvba.   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu  P ********************************************************************************  4 *                                                RIH Compaq * P ********************************************************************************   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 16:35:22 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>h9 Subject: Re: Unsupported Conjecture:  Prune Q for Suitor? H Message-ID: <y4y9p5w4id.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:   4 > Would Bush tolerate that the Japanese buy Compaq ?  ? He wouldn't have much chioce, now would he, in such a decision?    	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:13:38 +0200a1 From: "Giorgio Ungarelli" <giorgio@ungarelli.net>t! Subject: Re: What exactly is VMS?e+ Message-ID: <9k5lso$hpe$1@news1.sunrise.ch>o   LOLb  + <briggs@encompasserve.org> wrote in messageu- news:4Sp84KZnVY4q@eisner.encompasserve.org...m> > In article <1b179cd3.0107301005.10f98ad@posting.google.com>,* Hodapp87@weasel.net (Chris Hodapp) writes:I > > What exactly is VMS? Did DEC originally make it for their VAXes? I've:I > > seen stuff like VAX\VMS... Was it something like Unix? Did it competetJ > > with Unix? What was it like? Am I asking too many questions? I think I > > am.e >t6 > http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/OpenVMS_faq.txt >3 > An operating system0 > Yesm
 > That's nicet
 > Yes and no.c > Yesc > RSXs > Yesc > You are correctu   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 09:43:01 -0700! From: kshannon@chx.com (Kevin S.)e Subject: What is CRD_Control? < Message-ID: <d69f0506.0107310843.f08aeb3@posting.google.com>  > We have several nodes (but not all) in a cluster that have hadE paramters changed but not written to the modparams.dat file.  We wantlF to do some tuning, but we're concerned that we might tune out a changeE that somebody needed but didn't write into the modparams because theytC didn't think about it.  On several nodes we have a parameter calledrC CRD_control(CRD=Corrected Read Data) that has been changed from theuF default of 22 to 54.  They are various Alpha based systems(DS10, DS20)A running OpenVMS 7.2-1, some of the machines have more memory than3B others and different hardware configurations, like net cards, SCSIB cards and so forth.  The manual just says that you shouldn't screw? with this value and gives the default for AXP to be 22 and says B something about 0 through 7 turning on some parts and shutting offD others, but obviously someone did, and I'm hoping for a reason otherE than I wanted to see what would happen when I plugged my age into theAE CRD_control parameter.  I was wondering if anybody here knows what itD is and what it's for.i  / Thanks in Advance for any help you can provide.* KevinF   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 09:44:39 +0200- From: William Chesters <williamc@paneris.org>s$ Subject: Re: What's in it for Intel?2 Message-ID: <m2d76hsftk.fsf@beertje.william.bogus>  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:iF > By getting the supposedly superior Digital compilers adapted for the> > IA64, Intel may be able to generate code which yields higher= > performance and if Intel wants to pit its chips at the highiB > performance market, then compiler performance will be important,2 > especially if the chip is initiually heavy/slow. > E > It may may Compaq irrelevant since it won't have any edge over DelldC > for compilers, but it will pit Intel against IBM and Sun for highe > performance systems.  C Note too that they bought KAI and their aggressively optimising C++ @ frontend (or rather middle, since it uses the EDG parsing/typingD frontend---maybe Intel will buy that too, who knows!).  They do seem% to be getting very interested in HPC.u   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 10:25:15 -0400n5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> $ Subject: Re: What's in it for Intel?1 Message-ID: <Udz97.423$Yx2.8430@news.cpqcorp.net>h   Duane Sand wrote in message ...o > 5 >Hewlett Packard has its own optimizing compilers fori4 >IPF, backed by 10 years of research, which supports4 >lots of languages well.  But HP doesn't share those >compilers with other vendors. >F    I IMHO - this is the nub.  Intel wants to sell chips widely, not as the mfgI arm for HP.i   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:59:03 -0300N) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brt Subject: Re: WHO ARE YOU forum?oL Message-ID: <OF1F54E2D0.D49BA18F-ON03256A9A.005D3768@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  
 WHO ARE YOU ?u  6 I am a OpenVMS System Manager until  July 31, 2002 ...  I After this I dont know ! I think I will take vacations in Barcelona ! :-)o   Regardst   FC    S                                                                                    $S                     Didier                                                         -S                     Morandi              Para:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com              S                     <Didier.Moran        cc:                                       pS                     di@gmx.ch>           Assunto:     WHO ARE YOU forum?           tS                                                                                    dS                     27/07/2001                                                     .S                     16:48                                                          bS                     Responder a                                                    oS                     Didier                                                         sS                     Morandi                                                        eS                                                                                    tS                                                                                             H I'd love to see a WHO ARE YOU forum for VMS people, where we could share something else than technique.  H Where I could for example say that I'll be in Corsica for vacation untilJ the 5th without the risk to be flamed for a non-VMS related post, you see?   :-)    D.   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Jul 2001 10:03:59 -0700' From: onthemove@mail.com (Rick Nickles) ) Subject: Re: Who does migration from VMS?c= Message-ID: <ae9cab67.0107310903.2c8fbc4e@posting.google.com>t  g lyngwyst@aol.com (Jay Braun) wrote in message news:<4ce97a1a.0107261344.3d8e0248@posting.google.com>...m8 > I have been doing web searches for companies that do aH > migration/porting from VMS, primarily to UNIX/Linux.  I keep hitting aE > small group of companies whose primary business is selling products0C > that emulate VMS in UNIX/Linux and Windows NT/2000 environments.  G > Aren't there firms that perform ports in such a way that the customerr@ > doesn't have to keep relying on VMS constructs and proprietary > products for years to come?s >  > Jayf > + > p.s.  I love VMS.  Please don't flame me.   
 Greetings:  E        Most likely you are going to be much more concerned about your E applications being able to run cleanly on the other o/s than anythingu else. D It's a tough job, you have to identify every product running on your system, E you'll essentially need two test environments - one of the old systemu and one C with the new system with the new o/s.  The products you are runninguA will determine how hard a job this is - whether you can move over@@ easily - as some applications can run on multiple platforms - orD whether the code needs to be re-written, re-compiled, etc - or a newF effort all together.  It could be a major development effort.  If  youD aren't leading this in house, you may need to hire a consulting firmD to do this.  Right now I can't think of any that specialize - but it" depends again on your application.   Rick   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 09:45:44 +0200 0 From: "Toine Dirven" <vec.60710td@memo.volvo.se>$ Subject: Who has cgi command example4 Message-ID: <9k5nq1$72a14@eccws12.dearborn.ford.com>   Hello,  2 We are using apache web server on our VMS servers. We have enabled cgi.: There is an example how to show some info via a cgi script% which is running on the alpha server.s  3 It should be possible to get input via a html page.e  H Has someone an example how to get this input in a cgi (vms command file) script.   2 So I create a html page with an input field on it.; When the end user press a button a cgi script is activated.-: My question is how can I get the value of this input field in my cgi commandfile ?u   Toine Dirven   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 07:19:27 -05004+ From: "Mike Kier" <michael.kier@compaq.com>c( Subject: Re: Who has cgi command example1 Message-ID: <knx97.411$Yx2.8033@news.cpqcorp.net>s  I I usually use a DCL subroutine to create symbols for all of the form data K and then the CGI script can manipulate it or invoke a program that uses theI' LIB$GET_SYMBOL call to grab the values.h   Here's the subroutine:   $get_symbols:  subroutinet' $  define sys$input apache$input /nolog G $  read sys$input QUERY_STRING /PROMPT="" /END=end_of_file /ERROR=errora $  count = 0 $r $parse_loop:2 $  this_elem = f$element(count, "&", query_string) $  if this_elem .eqs. "&"A $  thena	 $    exita $  elsey, $    sym_name = f$element(0, "=", this_elem), $    sym_valu = f$element(1, "=", this_elem) $e $    'sym_name' == sym_valuy $u $    sho symb 'sym_name' $    count = count + 1 $    goto parse_loop $  endif $  endsubroutine   --	 Mike Kier- Compaq Professional Services Cincinnati, OH, USA  michael.kier@compaq.comm  ; "Toine Dirven" <vec.60710td@memo.volvo.se> wrote in messageR. news:9k5nq1$72a14@eccws12.dearborn.ford.com... > Hello, >t4 > We are using apache web server on our VMS servers. > We have enabled cgi.< > There is an example how to show some info via a cgi script' > which is running on the alpha server., >r5 > It should be possible to get input via a html page.e >iJ > Has someone an example how to get this input in a cgi (vms command file)	 > script.  > 4 > So I create a html page with an input field on it.= > When the end user press a button a cgi script is activated.2< > My question is how can I get the value of this input field > in my cgi commandfile ?  >  > Toine Dirven >  >h >" >    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 15:20:09 GMT-2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)( Subject: Re: Who has cgi command example1 Message-ID: <J0A97.433$Yx2.8089@news.cpqcorp.net>r  g In article <9k5nq1$72a14@eccws12.dearborn.ford.com>, "Toine Dirven" <vec.60710td@memo.volvo.se> writes:yI :Has someone an example how to get this input in a cgi (vms command file)) :script.  G   (Plug alert...) The Writing Real Programs in DCL has an introduction lE   to this topic, and there are example HTML CGI (DCL) scripts in the /C   book's world-wide-web chapter.  There are also some basic DCL CGIIG   examples at the Ask The Wizard website.  (One of the examples in the  E   book is a DCL CGI script that handles URL encoding and user input.)g  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 11:57:31 +0200-* From: Alexis Cousein <al@brussels.sgi.com>R Subject: Re: [OT] Market corrections (was Re: Alpha: an invitation to communicate)/ Message-ID: <3B66810B.9060802@brussels.sgi.com>    Eric Smith wrote:h  . > davidc@panix.com (David B. Chorlian) writes: > J >>Not so; the (U.S)  government (in one form or another) steps in when the >>market cannot correct itself:  >> > G > You mean that they step in when they don't WANT it to correct itself.c    D Well, that depends, of course, of your meaning for "correct". If youB deem whatever situation the markets settle into as "correct", then; the argument it corrects itself is obviously a Lapalissade.o  A I think the Fed and the U.S. government may have a (luckily) moreiE pragmatic view about correctness linked to desirability (for the U.S.aG government, that would probably make an outcome that ensured more votess0 at the next election "desirable" and "correct").  ? And yes, governments do seem to want to get re-elected -- don'ty ask me why, though.g   -- o? <these messages express my own views, not those of my employer>m) Alexis Cousein				Senior Systems Engineer . SGI Belgium and Luxemburg		al@brussels.sgi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 13:16:25 +0200 5 From: Martin Knoblauch <Martin.Knoblauch@TeraPort.de>cY Subject: Re: [OT] Market corrections (was Re: Alpha: an invitation to communicate) commun0+ Message-ID: <3B669389.5FC5B2E9@TeraPort.de>0   Alexis Cousein wrote:  >  > A > And yes, governments do seem to want to get re-elected -- don'tm > ask me why, though.i >   E  Because, in a sane world, nobody who ever "worked" for a gorvernment F would ever get another job. Unfortunately, the world is definitely not sane.s   Martin -- eB ------------------------------------------------------------------B Martin Knoblauch         |    email:  Martin.Knoblauch@TeraPort.de7 TeraPort GmbH            |    Phone:  +49-89-510857-309g7 C+ITS                    |    Fax:    +49-89-510857-111h5 http://www.teraport.de   |    Mobile: +49-170-4904759.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.422 ************************nd you the code logic that determines N which number to dial, the surftime number or the general numbers, and also theQ monitoring procedure which performs a reconnect if the line drops (which is rare,c= it's usually when my daughter presses the DATA/VOICE switch!)s  D (Drop me a note at the nic@python address when your mail's fixed :-) --( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comh   ------------------------------  # Da