1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 12 Mar 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 141       Contents:' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip? ' Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?  Alpha on ABC Evening news ? AlphaServer Story (was Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?) H Re: Assigning logicals in login.com. How to extend the value of a global$ Re: CNET OVMS Review: Closing in 200# Re: DECserver 90L+ power connector. # Re: DECserver 90L+ power connector. ' Re: Drop C/C++ better sooner than later ' Re: Drop C/C++ better sooner than later  Re: Just Two Days Left to Vote Re: Low cost workstations  Re: Low cost workstations & Re: New memory in VAX 4000/90 not seen& Re: New memory in VAX 4000/90 not seen2 Re: open vms newbie is looking far an DCL emulator2 Re: open vms newbie is looking far an DCL emulator2 Re: open vms newbie is looking far an DCL emulator Re: OpenVMS Educational Program  Re: OpenVMS Educational Program 0 Proactive Engagement (was Re: AlphaServer Story)! Telnet into VMS over the Internet % Re: Telnet into VMS over the Internet % Re: Telnet into VMS over the Internet  Re: uVax3100 m10 & VMS5.2  Re: uVax3100 m10 & VMS5.2  Re: VMS wanted list. Re: VMS wanted list. What drives the mouse ?  Re: [fun] DCL minute of the day  Re: [fun] DCL minute of the day 2 [info] jobs opening for consultants in Switzerland' Re: [Q] tape allocated and process gone   Re: [SURVEY] Info-VAX suscribers  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:21:30 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?< Message-ID: <_eQq6.11993$5f.3241179@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  : "HappyCanuck" <happycanuck@altavista.net> wrote in message7 news:FbOq6.69886$UZ4.17948343@news4.rdc1.on.home.com... L > I can still remember a product, not from DEC, in the Rainbow era called PC VMS. No idea what  > happened to it tho.. >   J Ah yes... PC VMS, from Wendin Software. The firm is, I believe, taking theG dirt nap along with numerous other one-hit wonders of the 1980s. PC VMS K attempted to provide a VMS environment on a DOS PC, but neither Charlie nor  I ever fooled with the thing.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:34:31 -0500 2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com>0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?7 Message-ID: <200103111434_MC2-C858-266D@compuserve.com>   % Message text written by "HappyCanuck" J >I can still remember a product, not from DEC, in the Rainbow era called = PC VMS. No idea what  happened to it tho.. <   J         I actually bought the product.  I had one contact with the compan= y G when the product wouldn't build with MSC 4.0 which was the then current " version of Microsoft's C compiler.  J         The response was "Gee, sorry about that, we only support MSC 3.x"= .   J         I believe that they went belly up.  The product, as shipped, had = a G few bugs and I considered it more of a high tech educational toy than a  serious operating system.    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Mar 2001 16:40:36 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?3 Message-ID: <EwxoEg4fdWff@eisner.encompasserve.org>   r In article <VhFq6.9855$5f.2979544@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: >  > I > And that's all I got from Charlie. Heck, he started mumbling some stuff M > about OZIX, MERLIN, QUARTZ, CHEYENNE, and other cryptic codewords from days L > gone by. Wish he'd be a tad more forward-looking and spill the beans about6 > MARVEL... and the system a generation beyond MARVEL. >  >    	Which is to say....  ? 	We will see on-chip memory controllers on Alpha before we will A 	see them on Intel boxes.  Compaq high-end AlphaServers will look ? 	vastly different in 2-3 years than currently shipping high-end > 	AlphaServers.  Compaq has won 7 out of 8 of the last go roundB 	of Supercomputer bids, some of which are future roll-outs.  Which> 	leads one to conclude Compaq AlphaServer division has a grand. 	story to tell.  Too bad we can't hear it yet. 	  				Rob    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 21:53:34 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?< Message-ID: <ytSq6.12406$5f.3313853@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:EwxoEg4fdWff@eisner.encompasserve.org...    > Which is to say....  > @ > We will see on-chip memory controllers on Alpha before we willB > see them on Intel boxes.  Compaq high-end AlphaServers will look@ > vastly different in 2-3 years than currently shipping high-end? > AlphaServers.  Compaq has won 7 out of 8 of the last go round C > of Supercomputer bids, some of which are future roll-outs.  Which ? > leads one to conclude Compaq AlphaServer division has a grand / > story to tell.  Too bad we can't hear it yet.   # It will be a MARVELous tale indeed.   C To be fair to Compaq, the firm *does* put out press releases on its L accomplishments. Subscribing to the HPTC newsletter from the Q is a good wayK to keep up to date. (An even Better Answer is to subscribe to Shannon Knows  Compaq.)  K What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to go G out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted  where coverage is due.   doh,  
 charlie matco    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:07:44 -0500 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?L Message-ID: <rdeininger-1103011707440001@user-2ivebcf.dialup.mindspring.com>  F In article <ytSq6.12406$5f.3313853@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C.+ Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote:     M > What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to go I > out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted  > where coverage is due.  E Even Apple figured that one out eventually.  They've done pretty well 5 since they stopped being suicidal.  You hear that, Q?    --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:15:20 -0600 7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> 0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?- Message-ID: <3AAC1518.B6EDB30D@earthlink.net>    "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > : > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message/ > news:EwxoEg4fdWff@eisner.encompasserve.org...  >  > > Which is to say....  > > B > > We will see on-chip memory controllers on Alpha before we willD > > see them on Intel boxes.  Compaq high-end AlphaServers will lookB > > vastly different in 2-3 years than currently shipping high-endA > > AlphaServers.  Compaq has won 7 out of 8 of the last go round E > > of Supercomputer bids, some of which are future roll-outs.  Which A > > leads one to conclude Compaq AlphaServer division has a grand 1 > > story to tell.  Too bad we can't hear it yet.  > % > It will be a MARVELous tale indeed.  > E > To be fair to Compaq, the firm *does* put out press releases on its N > accomplishments. Subscribing to the HPTC newsletter from the Q is a good wayM > to keep up to date. (An even Better Answer is to subscribe to Shannon Knows 
 > Compaq.) > M > What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to go I > out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted  > where coverage is due.  D I've asked RM to hire me into exactly that position on more than one< occasion. The results, so far, have been less than positive.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 00:50:16 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?< Message-ID: <c3Vq6.12962$5f.3392068@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  B "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message' news:3AAC1518.B6EDB30D@earthlink.net...  > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > > < > > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message1 > > news:EwxoEg4fdWff@eisner.encompasserve.org...  > >  > > > Which is to say....  > > > D > > > We will see on-chip memory controllers on Alpha before we willF > > > see them on Intel boxes.  Compaq high-end AlphaServers will lookD > > > vastly different in 2-3 years than currently shipping high-endC > > > AlphaServers.  Compaq has won 7 out of 8 of the last go round G > > > of Supercomputer bids, some of which are future roll-outs.  Which C > > > leads one to conclude Compaq AlphaServer division has a grand 3 > > > story to tell.  Too bad we can't hear it yet.  > > ' > > It will be a MARVELous tale indeed.  > > G > > To be fair to Compaq, the firm *does* put out press releases on its L > > accomplishments. Subscribing to the HPTC newsletter from the Q is a good way I > > to keep up to date. (An even Better Answer is to subscribe to Shannon  Knows  > > Compaq.) > > L > > What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to goK > > out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted  > > where coverage is due. > F > I've asked RM to hire me into exactly that position on more than one> > occasion. The results, so far, have been less than positive. >   3 The OpenVMS Group already has a Marketing Director.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:10:13 -0600 7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> 0 Subject: Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?- Message-ID: <3AAC21F5.2C60169F@earthlink.net>    "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > D > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message) > news:3AAC1518.B6EDB30D@earthlink.net...  > > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > > > > > > > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message3 > > > news:EwxoEg4fdWff@eisner.encompasserve.org...  > > >  > > > > Which is to say....  > > > > F > > > > We will see on-chip memory controllers on Alpha before we willH > > > > see them on Intel boxes.  Compaq high-end AlphaServers will lookF > > > > vastly different in 2-3 years than currently shipping high-endE > > > > AlphaServers.  Compaq has won 7 out of 8 of the last go round I > > > > of Supercomputer bids, some of which are future roll-outs.  Which E > > > > leads one to conclude Compaq AlphaServer division has a grand 5 > > > > story to tell.  Too bad we can't hear it yet.  > > > ) > > > It will be a MARVELous tale indeed.  > > > I > > > To be fair to Compaq, the firm *does* put out press releases on its N > > > accomplishments. Subscribing to the HPTC newsletter from the Q is a good > way K > > > to keep up to date. (An even Better Answer is to subscribe to Shannon  > Knows  > > > Compaq.) > > > N > > > What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to > goM > > > out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted  > > > where coverage is due. > > H > > I've asked RM to hire me into exactly that position on more than one@ > > occasion. The results, so far, have been less than positive. > >  > 5 > The OpenVMS Group already has a Marketing Director.   E Seems to me those would be two separate positions. Not sure who would " have authority over what, however.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 21:33:42 -0600 % From: Keith Brown <kbrown780@isd.net> " Subject: Alpha on ABC Evening news& Message-ID: <3AAC4396.4E0B4A3@isd.net>  H I don't know if anyone caught the ABC evening news in the U.S. on SundayC night but Compaq Alpha Servers got some good air time.  The general E slant of the news story was that the computer business is in the tank C but, the only companies making any money are the ones who build the H "pick and ax type computers"  (that would be the ones that do real work)C and then they cut to a shot of a computer room full of Compaq Alpha 2 Servers (some had the "digital" name plate still).   --   Keith Brown  kbrown780@isd.net    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Mar 2001 17:08:12 -05007 From: hamilton@encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) H Subject: AlphaServer Story (was Re: - OpenVMS ever to be on Intel chip?)3 Message-ID: <c6lGflPpm2Gp@eisner.encompasserve.org>   t >In article <ytSq6.12406$5f.3313853@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: >>  ; >> "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message 0 >> news:EwxoEg4fdWff@eisner.encompasserve.org... >>   >>> Which is to say....  >>B >>> We will see on-chip memory controllers on Alpha before we willD >>> see them on Intel boxes.  Compaq high-end AlphaServers will lookB >>> vastly different in 2-3 years than currently shipping high-endA >>> AlphaServers.  Compaq has won 7 out of 8 of the last go round E >>> of Supercomputer bids, some of which are future roll-outs.  Which A >>> leads one to conclude Compaq AlphaServer division has a grand 1 >>> story to tell.  Too bad we can't hear it yet.    Why not?   >>  & >> It will be a MARVELous tale indeed. >>  F >> To be fair to Compaq, the firm *does* put out press releases on itsO >> accomplishments. Subscribing to the HPTC newsletter from the Q is a good way N >> to keep up to date. (An even Better Answer is to subscribe to Shannon Knows >> Compaq.)  >>  N >> What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to goJ >> out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted >> where coverage is due.    What would that entail?    >>   >> doh,  >>   >> charlie matco >>   >>     ------------------------------   Date: 11 Mar 2001 23:49:05 GMT% From: afeldman@elsewhere.gfigroup.com Q Subject: Re: Assigning logicals in login.com. How to extend the value of a global * Message-ID: <98h2th$8ag$1@news.netmar.com>  L In article <98bcl7$cqd$1@news.netmar.com>, <afeldman@elsewhere.gfigroup.com> writes: = >In article <3AA7AB5C.B2EE0A6A@jpmorgan.com>, Andrew G Scott  & ><andrew.g.scott@jpmorgan.com> writes:E >>I want to extend the value of a logical, which is set up in a group 4 >>login.com file, by referring to the logical again. >># >>In Unix I would do this like his:  >>' >>PATH=/home/my_home/an_extra_dir:$PATH  >># >>How do I achieve the same in VMS?  >>J >>I HAVE achieved it but the outcome is not what I expected or understand. >>The line in my login.com is: >>" >>$ define/nolog          mosource/ >>MOSSUSERS_DEV01:[USERS.ASCOTT.AN_EXTRA_DIR],- 2 >>                                        MOSOURCE  D >Another way to do this (other than my previous post) would be to do	 something  >like the following: >  >$ DEFINE  MOS  MOSGROUP /GROUP > >$ DEFINE  MOSGROUP /GROUP  MOSSPRD-SOURCE  ! Master Group LNM	 >$ SL MOS ) >   "MOS" = "MOSGROUP" (LNM$GROUP_000050) 4 >1  "MOSGROUP" = "MOSSPRD-SOURCE" (LNM$GROUP_000050) >$ DEFINE MOS ASCOTT,MOSGROUP 	 >$ SL MOS ( >   "MOS" = "ASCOTT" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE) >        = "MOSGROUP" 4 >1  "MOSGROUP" = "MOSSPRD-SOURCE" (LNM$GROUP_000050)) >   "MOS" = "MOSGROUP" (LNM$GROUP_000050) 4 >1  "MOSGROUP" = "MOSSPRD-SOURCE" (LNM$GROUP_000050) > D >where you replace my shorthand with your longhand (replace MOS with	 MOSOURCE,M> >etc.). This will avoid the circular definition problem above.  J Oops! I forgot to add trailing colons to the equivalence names. The DEFINE" statements above should instead be   $ DEFINE  MOS  MOSGROUP: /GROUPn> $ DEFINE  MOSGROUP /GROUP  MOSSPRD-SOURCE:  ! Master Group LNM $ DEFINE  MOS ASCOTT:,MOSGROUP:e  M No DCL loops are needed with this method. Changing the definition of MOSGROUP L will immediately affect MOS in both the process and group lnm tables without  the circular-definition problem.  G Using the colons as shown will allow SET DEFAULT MOS to work correctly.w    O  -----  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web  -----eM   http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groupstI    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this or other posts L made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 21:36:53 -0600r% From: Keith Brown <kbrown780@isd.net> - Subject: Re: CNET OVMS Review: Closing in 200r' Message-ID: <3AAC4455.AF0E721E@isd.net>    Paul Sture wrote:  > N > In article <nNvq6.9711$5f.2725235@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, Terry C. Shannon > wrote:8 > > From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> > > Newsgroups: comp.os.vmsr- > > Subject: CNET OVMS Review: Closing in 200m' > > Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:04:35 GMTM > >t< > > So I went and took another look at the CNET OS Survey at > > P > > http://enterprise.cnet.com/enterprise/0-9566-601-1751615.html?tag=st.it.9566 > > -701-1751615.dirruo.uo > >p > >sN > > there are now 199 responses for OpenVMS, which is far and away the highestO > > feedback level attained by any OS covered in the CNET user opinion surveys.  > >yN > 204 votes as at 8:30 GMT Sunday (of which only 2 negative ones came from theM > same guy - IIRC he initially posted the same message 4 times). 124 commentsp	 > posted.h >  > ___a > Paul Sture
 > Switzerlande   By chance was it Andrew?  ;-)e -- d Keith Brownm kbrown780@isd.net    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Mar 2001 21:22:43 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER), Subject: Re: DECserver 90L+ power connector.* Message-ID: <3aabde93$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  \ In article <87wv9yvgxr.fsf@prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:C >Does anyone have a pointer to the 90 series docs? I need the powerg >conector pinout.-  ) It used to be on www.networks.digital.com:" But Q in their endless insanity...   -- R< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888c< <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:28:23 GMTd- From: Armin Leitner <armin.leitner@chello.at>h, Subject: Re: DECserver 90L+ power connector.) Message-ID: <3AABFC21.F7E2B417@chello.at>o  ; Take a look at http://www.dnpg.com/dr/hubs/servers/manuals/t  
 Armin Leitnero     Paul Repacholi schrieb:   D > Does anyone have a pointer to the 90 series docs? I need the power > conector pinout. >  > --> > Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,9 > +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. B >                                              West Australia 60760 > Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 03:29:16 GMT5; From: Mark Garrett <Mark.Garrett@wedontwantyourspam.com.au>s0 Subject: Re: Drop C/C++ better sooner than laterC Message-ID: <B6D28AE1.13154%Mark.Garrett@wedontwantyourspam.com.au>u  C Since this thread has drifted off topic, I'll keep with that trend. K     Of all the languages that VMS had available the one I never ever got totJ see  (except in help) was CORAL-66. What is this language and does it have any compilers available today?    
     Cheers         Mark ;)b   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 04:05:25 GMTi) From: Bob Willard <bobwbsgs@mediaone.net>a0 Subject: Re: Drop C/C++ better sooner than later, Message-ID: <3AAC4B09.B429EE13@mediaone.net>   Mark Garrett wrote:  > E > Since this thread has drifted off topic, I'll keep with that trend.lM >     Of all the languages that VMS had available the one I never ever got to L > see  (except in help) was CORAL-66. What is this language and does it have  > any compilers available today? >  >     Cheers >         Mark ;):  B Rather an antique realtime language; any search engine should find5 lots of pointers to URLs to get some background info.r -- m Cheers, Bob    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 01:02:52 GMTc/ From: StevenU@POBoxes.com (Steven P. Underwood)y' Subject: Re: Just Two Days Left to Votee2 Message-ID: <3aac1f2b.340311905@news.telocity.com>  F On 9 Mar 2001 09:40:24 -0500, Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) wrote:   d >In article <3aa84496.87708706@news.telocity.com>, StevenU@POBoxes.com (Steven P. Underwood) writes:E >> On Thu, 8 Mar 2001 21:42:08 -0500, Karl S. Erbland <karl@ksme.net> 	 >> wrote:  >>  @ >>>In article <8bUp6.1610$G76.2292111@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, $ >>>terryshannon@mediaone.net says... >>>> iK >>>> "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam> wrote in message 2 >>>> news:6SKDLGfdYLq7@eisner.encompasserve.org...H >>>> > By the way, I also received a paper ballot for this latest survey< >>>> > (too late, which is why they sent the email version). >>>> oO >>>> Well, save the ballot for the next iteration of the survey. The next issuenO >>>> submission cycle begins Real Soon Now, and the results of the first survey-: >>>> cycle are now available on www.compaqworkinggroup.org >>>r >>>s" >>>What? The April 2000 responses? >>>That's all I could find.n >>>l8 >>>I have to say, that is one really screwed up website. >> iC >> It says to view results.  It has been stated previously that the.5 >> Compaq responses will be posted at a later date.  n >> > >> e4 >> View RESULTS of the Issue Prioritization Ballots E >>   If you voted on a ballot, click here to view its final results. s >>  	 >> here =oG >> http://www.compaqworkinggroup.org/advocacy/Surveys/SurveyRanking.cfmn >>   >> u >> Steven P. Underwood,DNRCl >> Whitinsville,MA >> StevenU@POBoxes.com >rI >Since it worked for you, why don't you post the results to the newsgroup- >so we can discuss them ?a  B I figure since there is a login/password on the site, that someoneC would not be happy with that solution.  You state elsewhere in thiscA thread that you only receive a username/password request.  If youhA filled in the survey on-line, you needed to register before being = allowed to vote.  You use the same username/password that you E registered with.  I do not know what procedure was used for the emaill surveys.  F If someone in charge of putting this survey together wants to post the, results, I think that would be a good thing.   Stevec   Steven P. Underwood,DNRC Whitinsville,MA  StevenU@POBoxes.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:35:03 -0500t2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)" Subject: Re: Low cost workstationsL Message-ID: <rdeininger-1103011635040001@user-2ivebcf.dialup.mindspring.com>  F In article <kc62K$hAHdtc@malvm1.mala.bc.ca>, nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) wrote:  O > In article <rdeininger-1003012010370001@user-2iveaph.dialup.mindspring.com>, k9 >    rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:h > J > > In article <SgHgDuRpgzB9@malvm1.mala.bc.ca>, nothome@spammers.are.scum > > (Malcolm Dunnett) wrote: > >  nJ > >>     Getting Alphas isn't the hard part. Our CSci department was givenC > >> 3 Alphaserver 1000 4/266s over a year ago. The instructor evenoG > >> asked (without my prompting) if it would be possible to put VMS onsI > >> them for him to use in an Operating Systems course. Getting licenses/ for themN > >> that are actually good for anything ( such as setting up a 3 node clusterB > >> that all the students can work on ) is expensive. As has beenI > >> explained numerous times in this NG, the current "education license"e& > >> program isn't much use for this.  > > = > > For classroom use, I think the edu program is actally ok.d > > 9 > > 1. College registers in program and gets access code.a > > ? > > 2. Each student in the class uses the code to get licences.e > > B > > 3. Instructor load's all the students' licences on the system. > > 6 > > Or have I misunderstood that crazy legalese again? > >  > E >     Who knows, it seems to contradict itself in several places. ButkB > let's assume for a moment you are correct. First off, requiring A > each student to apply for his own license in this situtation isr< > unnecessarily bureaucratic and is frankly more hassle than. > the instructor or students want to tolerate.  G Hmm.  They have to fill in a web page, and a PAK gets emailed to them. lE Which part of that is hard?  (Ok, I haven't done it.  I'm assuming ityJ resembles the hobbyist mechanism.)  Are your students lamer than most? :-)    D >    There is a confusing clause in the edu program which appears to@ > let an instructor allow multiple students on multiple machinesC > ( does that imply only one student per machine? ) "in a classroom ? > situation under your control".  Does that mean the instructor C > must be physically present whenever the computers are being used?c- > If not, exactly what constitutes "control".e  F Let's say that you have to control the registration of the PAKs on theG shared machines.  No reasonable interpretation of "control" implies youaH have to be present.  Classroom situations don't work that way.  StudentsF do classwork even when they aren't in the presence of the instructor. H Don't look for trouble when there isn't any.  For classroom use, the edu0 license program gives you an almost blank check.    F >    I have asked Compaq folks for answers to these questions, they'veC > chosen to not respond. I can only take this to mean that either I B > am correct and they see no reason to address my concerns or they/ > have no idea what the program permits either.e  H Or, most likely, you asked the wrong folks.  That's always a big problemG with Compaq.  The right person is hidden from public view, and when youiH reach the wrong person, the wheels turn very slowly -- or they just blow you off.  You never know which.    C >    The truly frustrating thing is they announced this program wase= > coming, then went away for about 8 months and designed thish? > offering, apparently with no consultation with the education c@ > community as to what we actually needed. Now that the concerns@ > have been expressed it appears they've gone into hiding again.; > I expect in  another 6 months or so they'll announce someh= > tinkering with the program which makes no material changes.   J I'm not defending them.  But go ahead and use the program in classrooms --" it's the only thing it's good for.   -- d Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Mar 2001 18:56:31 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett)h" Subject: Re: Low cost workstations, Message-ID: <zMBZzGYYOvDb@malvm1.mala.bc.ca>  M In article <rdeininger-1103011635040001@user-2ivebcf.dialup.mindspring.com>,  8     rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes: > I > Hmm.  They have to fill in a web page, and a PAK gets emailed to them. i > Which part of that is hard?   G     How about the part where they can't understand why the college they I paid their tutition fees to is incapable of providing the software neededc for the course they paid for.    > E >>    There is a confusing clause in the edu program which appears to A >> let an instructor allow multiple students on multiple machinesoD >> ( does that imply only one student per machine? ) "in a classroom@ >> situation under your control".  Does that mean the instructorD >> must be physically present whenever the computers are being used?. >> If not, exactly what constitutes "control". > H > Let's say that you have to control the registration of the PAKs on theI > shared machines.  No reasonable interpretation of "control" implies youe > have to be present.o  A     Sorry, but many "reasonable" interpretations of control imply = precisely that, eg you're not in "care or control" of a motore$ vehicle unless you're sitting in it.  6 >  Classroom situations don't work that way.  StudentsH > do classwork even when they aren't in the presence of the instructor.   B     I know that, you know that - it seems to me the legal folks at" Compaq apparently don't know that.  J > Don't look for trouble when there isn't any.  For classroom use, the edu2 > license program gives you an almost blank check. >   D     Do you work as legal counsel for Comaq? No offense intended, youG may be correct - but it's certainly not clear about that and I haven't  ( been able to get an answer from Compaq.   @     If they'd wanted to give me the blank cheque they would haveE said "in a classroom situation" and left out the "under your control":D phrase. Actually, I can't see any justification for not allowing theD license to be held by the institution, to be used for any legitimateD institutional purpose. This appears to be their overall intent, thenB they throw this confusing legalese at the situation which seems to preclude that.  E     I was of the understanding that the program delivered single useroB PAKS and it specifically says they can't be combined to get multi-D users - you're referred to the CSLG for that. That makes me concludeB their definition of "multiple computers used by multiple students" means one student per computer.    > G >>    I have asked Compaq folks for answers to these questions, they'verD >> chosen to not respond. I can only take this to mean that either IC >> am correct and they see no reason to address my concerns or theyn0 >> have no idea what the program permits either. > / > Or, most likely, you asked the wrong folks.  t  F     I asked Ann McQuaid, who referred the questions to Susan Azibert. F These are supposed to be the Compaq folks responsible for implementingE the program. If you have other names please let me know, I'd be happy  to try them.   > L > I'm not defending them.  But go ahead and use the program in classrooms --$ > it's the only thing it's good for. >   F    Sorry, it would be irresponsible of me to do that when the legalityD of doing so is in doubt ( especially after I've stated publicly that I have these concerns ).  F     Of course all it would take to resolve this is a simple email fromD Compaq saying I'm wrong and that what I propose to do is acceptable.A That fact that they can't or wont provide that just heightens thec concern.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:52:18 +0000 + From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org></ Subject: Re: New memory in VAX 4000/90 not seenr' Message-ID: <3AABC962.2D5F2AA1@iee.org>n   "Gareth V. Williams" wrote:tH >   Looking at the original set of supposed 16 MB SIMMs, I see that each5 > is marked 5419103.  As are the second set of SIMMs.   * 54-19103-AA is an MS44-AA  4-MB SIM module* 54-19103-CA is an MS44-CA 16-MB SIM module  ) Maybe you've been shipped 4MB modules ands% some are duff (although that does notb$ adequately explain your observations' re: 8 SIMMs yeilding 16MB while neitherm# subset of 4 SIMMs giving anything).o  + Check those part numbers on each individualA SIMM carefully.   $ Another suggestion would be to crack& open a second VS4000-90 and see if you have similar problems there.     Antonion   -- k   --------------- - Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.orgM   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Mar 2001 15:10:08 -05003 From: "Gareth V. Williams" <graff@cfa0.harvard.edu>=/ Subject: Re: New memory in VAX 4000/90 not seenO, Message-ID: <3aabdba0.0@cfanews.harvard.edu>  * antonio.carlini <arcarlini@iee.org> wrote:     : "Gareth V. Williams" wrote:RI :>   Looking at the original set of supposed 16 MB SIMMs, I see that eachS6 :> is marked 5419103.  As are the second set of SIMMs.  , : 54-19103-AA is an MS44-AA  4-MB SIM module, : 54-19103-CA is an MS44-CA 16-MB SIM module  + : Maybe you've been shipped 4MB modules and ' : some are duff (although that does nott& : adequately explain your observations) : re: 8 SIMMs yeilding 16MB while neitherO% : subset of 4 SIMMs giving anything).P  - : Check those part numbers on each individualE : SIMM carefully.O  K   There are no letters connected to the 5419103 label stamped on any of thefI SIMMs.  However, you may have solved the problem!  There are white labelsaK stuck on all of the SIMMs: most have AA-something, a few have CA-something.iJ It seems that the bulk of what we were shipped are 4 MB SIMMs, even thoughK the boxes they were shipped in indicated 16 MB SIMMs.  It also explains the 9 mismatched SIMMs error mentioned in an earlier posting.     E   The only problem with this scenario is that all the SIMMs look like 5 16 MB SIMMs: i.e., they have RAM chips on both sides.a  F   In any case, we will have to take this up with the supplier.  Thanks" to all those who made suggestions.   -- kH ------------------------------------------------------------------------H Gareth V. Williams, MS 18, 60 Garden Street, Cambridge, MA 02138, U.S.A.+ Associate Director, IAU Minor Planet CentereH gwilliams@cfa.harvard.edu        http://cfa-www.harvard.edu/iau/mpc.html7 OpenVMS & RISC OS: refined choices in operating systems:   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:51:30 GMTM- From: goathunter@goatley.com (Hunter Goatley)t; Subject: Re: open vms newbie is looking far an DCL emulatore0 Message-ID: <3aabc849.55588111@swen.process.com>  E On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 22:29:27 GMT, "g.reinders" <level@home.nl> wrote:o   >Hi,G >I'm looking for an DCL emulator to try DCL command under Windows (jek)OM >who can tell me if such a program exists And if it does where I can find it.S >aI You can get PC_DCL.ZIP from my archives.  PC_DCL (also known as MicroDCL)lD was written by Michel Valentin, and first showed up (AFAIK) on KevinB Barke's DCL BBS.  PC_DCL works very well, though it's not perfect.E Unfortunately, the sources aren't included, and more than 10 years of-D lots of people trying to locate Michel Valentin have been fruitless. Still, it's free and it works.  1 ftp://ftp.process.com/wku/vms/fileserv/pc_dcl.zipe5 ftp://ftp.tmk.com/ftp-wku-edu/vms/fileserv/pc_dcl.zipo   Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/ 9 goathunter@goatley.com     http://www.goatley.com/hunter/    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:44:37 GMTd= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)e; Subject: Re: open vms newbie is looking far an DCL emulatora0 Message-ID: <009F8DCA.A402715D@SendSpamHere.ORG>  S In article <98g2gu$6r1$1@joe.rice.edu>, leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie) writes:i" >g.reinders (level@home.nl) wrote: >: Hi,I >: I'm looking for an DCL emulator to try DCL command under Windows (jek)mG >: who can tell me if such a program exists And if it does where I can s >: find it.F >. >XLNT from:l >t >  http://www.advsyscon.com/" >  Advanced Systems Concepts, Inc. > 5 >--Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)a   Wrong!  < They asked for a DCL emulator!  Not this half-wit's attempt.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             1O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:48:36 GMT.= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-):; Subject: Re: open vms newbie is looking far an DCL emulatora0 Message-ID: <009F8DCB.328FE948@SendSpamHere.ORG>  ` In article <3aabc849.55588111@swen.process.com>, goathunter@goatley.com (Hunter Goatley) writes:F >On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 22:29:27 GMT, "g.reinders" <level@home.nl> wrote: >g >>Hi, H >>I'm looking for an DCL emulator to try DCL command under Windows (jek)N >>who can tell me if such a program exists And if it does where I can find it. >>J >You can get PC_DCL.ZIP from my archives.  PC_DCL (also known as MicroDCL)E >was written by Michel Valentin, and first showed up (AFAIK) on KevinaC >Barke's DCL BBS.  PC_DCL works very well, though it's not perfect.4F >Unfortunately, the sources aren't included, and more than 10 years ofE >lots of people trying to locate Michel Valentin have been fruitless.e >Still, it's free and it works.  > 2 >ftp://ftp.process.com/wku/vms/fileserv/pc_dcl.zip6 >ftp://ftp.tmk.com/ftp-wku-edu/vms/fileserv/pc_dcl.zip  G ... and to think, others charge way too much for a half-witted attempt.r   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMt            cO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.,   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:03:36 -0600y7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>3( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Educational Program- Message-ID: <3AAC1258.E9102005@earthlink.net>c   Paul Repacholi wrote:g > ; > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> writes:m > C > > So, if RMS is one of the many elements of VMS that UN*X systems0H > > lack, shouldn't the ability to easily side-step it be an enhancement > > to VMS?U >  > $READ and $WRITE?o  D More like $OPEN, really. *THAT* determines the qualities of the fileG which will be used by the $READ and $WRITE (and $CLOSE?) services later  on.n  :J > > You can sort of do that now, I suppose, with the resultant files beingI > > seen by RMS as Stream_LF. However, I wouldn't know how to resolve the E > > difference between UN*X text files and binary files other than tox0 > > distinguish between Stream_LF and Fixed-512. > E > *Unix does not have text files* Or any file type. Nill, zip, nadda. ! > It just has a stream of bytes. .  G As opposed to RMS, which makes distinctions. Technically, so do variousTG "layers" outside the UN*X kernel - records are expected, by the bulk ofwD UN*X utilities and programs (including the shell) to be delimited byG <LF>'s. You're right, however: at the lowest possible level, yes, it is G "just a stream of bytes". Technically, this is also true of VMS; except E that RMS makes distinctions which cause the data in the file to "make H sense". Things like bootstraps and other primitives don't care about RMSH and don't need to. D'ya ever notice that the image activator will accept) STREAM_LF as easily as it will Fixed-512?k  $ > Text or not? Up to the app, or, toB > quote the holy scripture of St Bash " It's a Luzerland problem " > J > Now, if you wanted unix semantics, it is REAL easy. File type UNDEFINED. > Done..  F Well, not quite. If that were true, we'd be back at the old problem ofC not being able to share files between applications - like trying to A share database containers between Ingres and Oracle, for example./  C > Bit of a pain if you want to use anything other that 'unix' toolsuL > to do anything with it though. So we handwave a fiction the they are STMLF? > or F512 on a punt, and hope it does not fall over TOO often. h  G ...which is why I drew the comparison between that and RSTS/E block-I/Oe files.   > Works wellG > all considered. But, never, ever forget it is just a crock and a handg > wave!r > J > > I dunno. I just had to ask that. Other than restrictions pertaining toJ > > ODS-2, most of which will be eliminated by the successor to ODS-5, RMSI > > seems (to me) to be one of the next biggest "hitch"-es in the portingt > > effort(s). > E > The 'restrictions' are what makes it possible to have a sane set ofkH > standards for languages, interface, and RLT/system to work to.  If youG > consider that on unix, EVERY shell line, could be a file name. So youMG > need special quoting... Bletch! If you have a GOOD argument as to whyrG > the ODS-2 file names in inadiquate as *file names*, tell me. I'd lovee > to hear a good one.e  D Well, technically, there isn't one. There's the fact that WhineBlozeE users now have an increasingly widespread habit of using "file names"gE like "IT Budget 2001.xls" and "20% (Jun/Dec & Jan/Apr) Standard.dbf".sG This is what we must live with; hence, ODS-5 and later (as I understand  it).   --   David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t  F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:34:14 -0500w( From: Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu>( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Educational ProgramL Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.10.10103112228040.23141-100000@triangle.cs.uofs.edu>  % On 11 Mar 2001, Paul Repacholi wrote:s   > F > Missed a chance here Bill. The original was a Teletype 37. It had anA > even bigger apitite for fingernails than a 33, was a 6 hour gymaH > workout for wrists and fingers in 20 min, and intodued the abomination  > of LF as the end of line char.  G Actually, I didn't figure there was anyone here who remembered anything B older than the 33.  My first home printer was a Lorenz LO15 BaudotE teleprinter.  Trust me, when I got the Portacom-110 it was a step up.oE I have use ASR's, Kleinshmidts, Lorenz's and Siemens.  I know exactlytB why the typing the commands was kept real short and why the output was kept just as frugal.  :-)    > K > Re BSD and the net. You are aware that there was near 15 years of the net < > before BSD? Have a look at RFC 681 for a view at the time.  G While true, prior to academia, particularly BSD Unix systems getting onaH the net it really wasn't much to speak of.  Usenet (which wasn't IP, butD was Unix) was much bigger and accomplished a lot more as far as the F exchange of ideas between computer professionals and researchers went.G If it had stayed strictly within DARPA, it would have died on the vine.s   bill   -- sJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   l   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:19:34 GMTa4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>9 Subject: Proactive Engagement (was Re: AlphaServer Story)l< Message-ID: <WRSq6.12462$5f.3324674@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>  D "Bradford J. Hamilton" <hamilton@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:c6lGflPpm2Gp@eisner.encompasserve.org...eI > >In article <ytSq6.12406$5f.3313853@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C.n, Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes:   > >>H > >> To be fair to Compaq, the firm *does* put out press releases on itsH > >> accomplishments. Subscribing to the HPTC newsletter from the Q is a good wayJ > >> to keep up to date. (An even Better Answer is to subscribe to Shannon Knows 
 > >> Compaq.)h > >>J > >> What Compaq does *not* have is a customer evangelist who is empowered to go L > >> out and proactively engage the press to ensure that coverage is granted > >> where coverage is due.h >@ > What would that entail?D >e  B What would proactive engagement entail? Well, you could start withJ establishing relationships with Key Influencers in the media, calling themH up when you've got news or developments with a potential news hook, etc.J Adopting a Clinton/Carville "War Room" strategy for addressing competitiveF developments and competitive FUD might help, too. All too often CompaqJ conducts its activities in a reactive, after-the-fact, fashion. If at all.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:36:45 -0500r% From: "Lou Solomon" <lny98@yahoo.com>a* Subject: Telnet into VMS over the Internet/ Message-ID: <tanvnt3i2257e2@corp.supernews.com>t  F I currently have two sites in my company that are connected to our VMS? network using Micom multiplexers (via dedicated 56K dds lines).   H I would like to take advantage of the cost savings (and possibly a speedF increase) of installing DSL lines in these remote offices, giving themI telnet access to the VMS machines, via the Internet (by installing telneteH based terminal servers instead of the mux's, and setting up a robust VPN between the offices).b  J I'm curious if anyone has any real world recommendations regarding whetherJ this is feasable or not.  I know end to end the everything will work fine,K but will the users experience be OK?  Everytime, I've done any "telnetting"eE over the Internet, I've been "somewhat" to "extremely" annoyed at thetL occassional hiccups , character bursts, etc.  However, my experience is veryI limited (doing some minor maintenance on our web host's unix box), so I'moF wondering if with the right equipment (ie: terminal servers, VPNs) andJ possibly asking the DSL vendors the right questions, I can get it working.  J Thanks in advance, as I would love to hear about anyone else's experience.   Lou Solomonw Intercounty Clearance COrp   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Mar 2001 23:40:18 GMT) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)e. Subject: Re: Telnet into VMS over the Internet' Message-ID: <98h2d2$6ct$1@joe.rice.edu>i  $ Lou Solomon (lny98@yahoo.com) wrote:H : I currently have two sites in my company that are connected to our VMSA : network using Micom multiplexers (via dedicated 56K dds lines).i :tJ : I would like to take advantage of the cost savings (and possibly a speedH : increase) of installing DSL lines in these remote offices, giving themK : telnet access to the VMS machines, via the Internet (by installing telnettJ : based terminal servers instead of the mux's, and setting up a robust VPN : between the offices).d : G Lurk in the comp.dcom.xdsl newsgroup for a while, and watch the reportse at www.dslreports.com.  J Make sure to calculate the cost of downtime of the DSL circuit, including / any employees who are idled by any DSL outages.   7 You may find you're better off with your current setup.   4 --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:10:54 -0800s3 From: Jeff Coffield <Jeffrey@DigitalSynergyInc.com> . Subject: Re: Telnet into VMS over the Internet5 Message-ID: <3AAC302E.5A88C4D3@DigitalSynergyInc.com>    >'  J We use a VPN to connect to two of our customers to do programming on their systems. Unless you canoM get 100% CIR on the circuit, you will be at the mercy of traffic loads on thea Internet.  I have nevero% heard of anything but 0% CIR for DSL.iM Telnet is very sensitive to the ping time as it echoes each character. BottomeM line, DSL is okay most of the time but I would never replace a mux with a VPNo1 for a customer who is paying for the system to ben accessible.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 01:15:02 +0000u3 From: greg elkin <cmkrnl@bouncy-castle.demon.co.uk>i" Subject: Re: uVax3100 m10 & VMS5.28 Message-ID: <4o8oat8cad866le5ggdso1oej0gffptfh1@4ax.com>   thanks all,oD the MCR SYSGEN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL did indeed make the DKB200 RZ23 and$ the MKB500 TK50 appear & be usable. . The parameter STARTUP_P1 is indeed set to MIN.: what do I have to do to set this to do a 'normal' bootup ?   thanks again greg   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:03:41 -0600d7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>e" Subject: Re: uVax3100 m10 & VMS5.2, Message-ID: <3AAC2E7D.BFCEA2D@earthlink.net>   greg elkin wrote:  > 
 > thanks all,hF > the MCR SYSGEN AUTOCONFIGURE ALL did indeed make the DKB200 RZ23 and% > the MKB500 TK50 appear & be usable. 0 > The parameter STARTUP_P1 is indeed set to MIN.< > what do I have to do to set this to do a 'normal' bootup ?   $ MCR SYSGEN USE CURRENT- SET STARTUP_P1 " "
 WRITE CURRENT1 EXIT  = Then, reboot - and expect a whole new set of stuff to happen!c   -- N David J. Dachtera0 dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o  F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 02:49:16 GMTy; From: Mark Garrett <Mark.Garrett@wedontwantyourspam.com.au>  Subject: Re: VMS wanted list.iC Message-ID: <B6D28125.13130%Mark.Garrett@wedontwantyourspam.com.au>   ? in article rUslzcAE$7$5@eisner.encompasserve.org, Bob Kaplow at A kaplow_r@eisner.encompasserve.org.mars wrote on 28/02/2001 13:12:t  = > In article <3A9AF0DB.FF5432C1@infopuls.com>, Christof Brassm > <brass@infopuls.com> writes: >> Howard S Shubs wrote: >>> A >>> In article <6Plm6.11815$CW1.9296284@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,o9 >>> "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote:p >>>  >>>> Intellectual property.m >>> % >>> Ah, a usage I've not seen before.n >>> 9 >>>> The technology cross-licensing agreement between DEC6K >>>> and u$oft under the August 1995 "Alliance for Enterprise Computing" isl >>>> far-reaching indeed.t >>> P >>> I stopped cursing Palmer when I found out that he was apparently hired to do4 >>> what he did.  I started cursing the BoD instead. >>> -- >>> Howard S ShubsH >>> "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!" >> t> >> Palmer should be tortured at least for ten year and then be
 >> killed.C >> A person who let himself or herself hire for doing that is a ...-@ >> sorry my English vocabulary doesn't offer bad enough word for >> that type of person.l? >> I don't disagree to let the BoD join Palmer's treatment (ten % >> years torture and then be killed).c# >> Or is there a better punishment?F >  > E > I'd still settle for having Palmer be the next CEO of Microsoft :-(m  K     What a great idea :) He could manage the split up of Microsoft so well,tK with his wealth of experience at screwing DEC/Digital. He could maybe break < it down to bits small enough for some PeeCee vendor to buy:)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:39:45 -0700v% From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com>  Subject: Re: VMS wanted list. ) Message-ID: <3AAC6121.1C754AE2@rdrop.com>    Mark Garrett wrote:o > A > in article rUslzcAE$7$5@eisner.encompasserve.org, Bob Kaplow at. >tG > > I'd still settle for having Palmer be the next CEO of Microsoft :-(_ > M >     What a great idea :) He could manage the split up of Microsoft so well, M > with his wealth of experience at screwing DEC/Digital. He could maybe breakc> > it down to bits small enough for some PeeCee vendor to buy:)  > How would Compaq owning the M$ OS's make our situation better?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 17:07:15 -0500e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>0  Subject: What drives the mouse ?, Message-ID: <3AABF710.A4E82D33@videotron.ca>  G Yesterday, I froze my workstation with a TELNET/CREATE_SESSION command.tM Interestingly, the node remained in the cluster, the mouse would move around, L but clicking on any window to make it active would do nothing. Nothing couldL be typed, and <CTRL-Y> in the current decterm windows (stuck with the TELNET command) did nothing.n  J The other node in the cluster didn't complain. So I assume that deep down,F BIKE was still saying "hello I am here" to keep itself in the cluster.T However, from VELO, doing SHOW SYS/NODE=BIKE would freeze and had to be control-Yed.  L (I crashed node VELO by CTRL-Ying of a MON CLU which didn't go anywhere, and. minutes later, BIKE finally actually crashed).  L BIKE's reason for the crash: "Node voluntarily exiting existing VAXcluster".F (And the process was the one that had executed the TELNET command, and1 TCPIP$TELNET.EXE was the image for that process).R    	 Question:e  M What does the fact that the mouse was still moving tell me about what was andi wasn't running on that node ?9  6 Under what circumstances would the mouse stop moving ?  M ( I seem to be having my share of reboots these days, it had been such a longaH time since I had such a spate of reboots, once has to relearn so much !)   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:46:12 GMTC= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-))( Subject: Re: [fun] DCL minute of the day0 Message-ID: <009F8DCA.DCBD6F57@SendSpamHere.ORG>  U In article <3AAB8E53.F4244112@gmx.ch>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> writes:o	 >You win. + >Meet you at today's DCL minute of the day.f >  >D.t   I won server posts back!   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMl            nO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------   Date: 12 Mar 2001 06:22:55 GMT- From: djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall)t( Subject: Re: [fun] DCL minute of the day5 Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-VgyTdQIYUMGm@localhost>u  = On Sat, 10 Mar 2001 17:20:13, system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian . Schenkenberger, VAXman-) wrote:R  W > In article <3AAA4F50.6B9397E6@gmx.ch>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> writes:c > >ISLKP1_mgr> dir toto.txt  > >e( > >Directory PROG00:[ISLK_USER.ISLK_MGR] > > K > >TOTO.TXT;1                             1/18      10-MAR-2001 16:54:53.65k > >u  > >Total of 1 file, 1/18 blocks. > >ISLKP1_mgr> ty toto.txtO > >%TYPE-W-SEARCHFAIL, error searching for PROG00:[ISLK_USER.ISLK_MGR]TOTO.TXT;s > >-RMS-E-FNF, file not foundc > >ISLKP1_mgr>   > >RL > >This one is an old one, but for a week-end, it may please some beginners. > >  > >D.s  E I've missed a bit of this thread but I guess the above was preceeded e by   $ type /out=toto.txt toto.txth  E or something of that ilk. The allocation size of 18 blocks intrigues x me tho'.   Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:55:34 GMT , From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch>; Subject: [info] jobs opening for consultants in Switzerland.& Message-ID: <3AABCA06.2B69D330@gmx.ch>  N If you wonder where to go for your next mission, just have a look at slide 21 N of http://www.openvms.compaq.com/presentations/OpenVMSStrategy.htm and then go" to http://www.parity-eurosoft.com/   D. -- j6 MORANDI Consultants, Swiss Quality Computer Consulting6 avenue de Granges-Paccot 2, 1700 Fribourg  Switzerland1     Tel: +41.79.705.46.70 - Fax: +41.26.465.13.58 4  Visit our Web site at http://Didier.Morandi.Free.fr   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 23:24:15 GMT ) From: rob.buxton@wcc.govt.nz (Rob Buxton) 0 Subject: Re: [Q] tape allocated and process gone0 Message-ID: <3aac07fa.15473159@news.wcc.govt.nz>  E I have seen this problem on a Tape Drive in our Cluster where a Batchp  Job was killed. We use SLS here.  B The show dev /full output for the device did indeed show a process> owner that no longer existed. The solution then was to reboot.  B Another poster suggests Cluster Connections held elsewhere, I know> that in our case the process was not elsewhere on the Cluster.  F I "think" that one of the Patches for Backup may have addressed issues
 in this area.F  E You don't mention the version or flavour of VMS (VAX or Alpha), but I F recommend checking to ensure you have the lates Backup Patches. If you@ use SLS you may also need to check you're running a version with  recent ECOs or a recent version.   Rob.  0 On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 19:29:59 GMT, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> wrote:  O >One of our technician "coldly arrived" have make the error to make a del/entrybN >on a batch which backed up some files on a TZ87. Result of this manipulation,P >the TZ87 have a owner process id (sh dev/full) which correspond with no processP >of the machine, and one can no more thus make some mount on this device becauseP >it be already allocated with this Pid, and one can not either make some stop/id' >on this pid because it exists no more.  >hK >We have thus to solve us with a shutdown/reboot whereas we try to beat ouraO >record of longevity which is for the 60 days moment (it is not terrible I knowBL >but we stop our machines previously every month for problems of maintenance >inverter).e >0   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Mar 2001 13:20:04 CDT= From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.344932.killspam.0142 (Wayne Sewell).) Subject: Re: [SURVEY] Info-VAX suscribersm. Message-ID: <32o4H5SMD2oK@tachxxsoftxxconsult>  U In article <3AA9FDEF.BD6B6A96@gmx.ch>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> writes:nQ > How come there are only 79 people currenty subscribed to the info-VAX list? AreeM > we only 79 persons dealing with VMS daily operations in the world (we couldcP > create a club) or most of the readers/participants use a news browser instead? >  > D.  K As far as I am concerned, mailing lists are an abomination when compared tonH news.   They are fine if you do not have usenet capability, but I cannotG imagine subscribing to info-vax if you have comp.os.vms available.    I O consider the constantly arriving messages of a mailing list to be as irritatingoM as spam.  With news, you can read articles when you feel like it.   I am on anL couple of mailing lists, primarily because there is no other option for thatO particular information, but I don't actually *read* the messages using mail.  IrM intercept the messages coming in, and convert them to news articles, and feedhM them into my news server.  That way I can treat mailing lists as just anotherr
 newsgroup.  & For instance, my news server contains:  M    44      local.mail_to_news.info-madgoat                         1        0eM    45      local.mail_to_news.mx-support                          18        0DM    46      local.mail_to_news.web-server                          31        3B    L The last group is the mailing list for the OSU webserver.  The first two are obvious.     --  O ===============================================================================cM Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738  wayne@tachysoft.xxxa: http://www.tachysoft.xxx/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html  K change .xxx to .com in addresses above, assuming you are not a spambot  :-)dO =============================================================================== O Dean Wormer to Flounder: "Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life."s   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.141 ************************