1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 24 Mar 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 166       Contents: Re: "green bar" in DCPS C "New Technologies", I must have been hallucinating all these years! G RE: "New Technologies", I must have been hallucinating all these years! ! ALF and decserver 90M with telnet - Re: BASIC 1.4 install causing a startup error - Re: BASIC 1.4 install causing a startup error  Better = Worse. % Re: Can this be done through lexicals ' cool dectalk book on ebay -was about $5 ( It's not boring any more, IT'S INSULTING9 Keeping userids and passwords synchronize across 4 Alphas P Re: New qualifiers for some DCL commands (was: Re: Dumbing Down VMS with UNIX ElP Re: New qualifiers for some DCL commands (was: Re: Dumbing Down VMS with UNIX El# Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions ( Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 System, Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 System, Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 System, Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 System, Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 System Re: Support of old systems Re: Support of old systems' Re: Uaf Show/rights status bug (v7.2-1) = Re: VMS COE docs online (was POSIX Streams, File Permissions) ! Re: VMS source listings omittings ! Re: VMS source listings omittings ! Re: VMS source listings omittings ! Re: VMS source listings omittings : Was: [DCL] minute of the day. Now: IT pranks of yesteryear Re: [DCL] minute of the day  Re: [DCL] minute of the day   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 24 Mar 2001 06:10 CST ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)   Subject: Re: "green bar" in DCPS- Message-ID: <24MAR200106101130@gerg.tamu.edu>   3 "Webb, William W" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> writes... ) }Sometimes our Printserver 32 prints with ( }line numbering and shaded bars that are  }reminiscent of green bar paper. } ( }This seems to occur most often when the( }parameter /PARAM=(SIDES=2) is used, but }it's by no means consistent.  } ( }Does anybody know exactly how this gets }triggered?  } 2 }(Paging Paul Anderson... paging Paul Anderson...) };^) }  }============================== + }William W. Webb, EDS, c/o USPS DSSC/OSS/MS     5 I;m not Paul Anderson, nor do I play him on TV but...   > The file sys$library:dcps$file_extension_Data_type.dat_default& defines data types by file extensions.  A Note the LIST data type, which has a section something like this:  LIST:          B32          BAS          BLI 	         C          CBL          COM          CPP          CXX          FOR 	         H          HXX          MAR          MMS          PAS          PLI          R32          REQ   C Now note that there is probably a 1:1 correlation between the files A that get printed with "grey bar" output and line numbers and this ? list of file types (unless the default is explicitly overridden 4 at the print command, or possibly queue parameters).   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 12:44:16 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) L Subject: "New Technologies", I must have been hallucinating all these years!0 Message-ID: <009F97BE.B1191478@SendSpamHere.ORG>  ; Here's a excerpt from the WSJ about new Apple O/S features:   :      Two new technologies help applications run smoother--:      preemptive multitasking, which prioritizes processing;      power, and protected memory, which lets other programs '      run even when another has crashed.     B Preemptive multitasking and protected memory are new technologies?   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 07:54:01 -0500 - From: "Mitchell, David R." <mitchell@wpi.edu> P Subject: RE: "New Technologies", I must have been hallucinating all these years!H Message-ID: <FE1835D68492D311BF7900508B5BEB0D0DF083@petra.admin.wpi.edu>   They are to Apple!   > -----Original Message-----F > From: Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- [mailto:system@SendSpamHere.ORG]( > Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 7:44 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com G > Subject: "New Technologies", I must have been hallucinating all these  > years! >=20 >=20= > Here's a excerpt from the WSJ about new Apple O/S features:  >=20< >      Two new technologies help applications run smoother--< >      preemptive multitasking, which prioritizes processing= >      power, and protected memory, which lets other programs ) >      run even when another has crashed.  >=20 >=20D > Preemptive multitasking and protected memory are new technologies? >=20 > --; > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001    =20  > VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM >           =20 B > city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are=20 > named after them.  >=20   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:43:12 +0100 " From: "Patrick" <peerbe@yahoo.com>* Subject: ALF and decserver 90M with telnet4 Message-ID: <99imbi$1f44h$1@ID-40248.news.dfncis.de>   All,  2 I have setup a decserver 90M with telnet protocol.L Is there a way to use ALF in the same way as for the LAT-protocol. ( alf add "server/port" user /port).   Thanks   Patrick    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 07:33:19 -0700 5 From: "cstranslations" <cstranslations@email.msn.com> 6 Subject: Re: BASIC 1.4 install causing a startup error) Message-ID: <u0Gjy8GtAHA.351@cpmsnbbsa07>   8 "Richard Jordan" <rjordan@mars.mcs.net> wrote in message- news:S0Ru6.2613$JN5.78384@news.goodnet.com... J > We have a new DS10 being configured for a customer.  600MHz, 256MB, dualF > 9GB drives on a KZPBA controller, etc.  We have a personal use BASICE > license  assigned to the development account name (not SYSTEM), and E > used SYSTEM to install BASIC 1.4 from the March 2001 condist.  Full I > privs were enabled, andd there were no errors on install except for the A > IVP (which failed because SYSTEM is not licensed to use BASIC).  > E > Since that install, we get the following error very early in system  startup: > B >  %INSTALL-I-NONSHRADR, image installed ignoring '/SHARE=ADDRESS': >      DISK$ALPHASYS:<SYS0.SYSCOMMON.SYSLIB>DEC$BASRTL.EXEK >  -INSTALL-E-NOTSHRSYMVEC, symbol vector is not in NONSHRADR image section   K I have a (hobbyist system) 200 4/233 running OpenVMS 7.2-1 and (among other J things) have the BASIC 1.4 compiler installed on it (I believe I pulled itK off the 12/2000 distribution). I get the same message every time I boot the 	 system...   I As a hobbyist system "support" doesn't really exist. I did find something I (and I want to say that it was in the install manual on the CD along with I the BASIC kit) that discussed this problem. Were ever it was that I found J the information - I seem to remember the explanation being something alongB the lines of this particular version of the compiler wasn't "builtK correctly" (reading this warmed my heart). There was also a disclaimer that : there is no need to worry about this particular message...  F ...I don't remember the "order that I built the system." Good, bad, orJ otherwise there weren't any autogens after I installed the BASIC compiler.H At some subsequent point I did autogen it after which point the compilerD refused to run (don't remember the exact error message) and I had toH reinstall it. I've been toying with the idea of another autogen recently? (and memories of the last go round are in the back of my head).   L All of this is somewhat foggy. I did have the 2nd 7.3 field test on there atK one point (hoping it would correct problems in the SET PRINTER command that H exist it 7.2-1 - no such luck). This "fogginess" may have me rememberingI incorrectly what it was that broke the installation of the BASIC compiler K (autogen or the 7.3 field test) so take all of this with a grain of salt...    Joe    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:52:21 GMT + From: rjordan@mars.mcs.net (Richard Jordan) 6 Subject: Re: BASIC 1.4 install causing a startup error3 Message-ID: <Fw2v6.2647$JN5.82141@news.goodnet.com>    Joe,J      thanks for responding.  I'll recheck the on-disc docs, but I'm prettyE sure all I coudl find was the mention in the relnotes about the error H occurring during product installation, not during system startup.  We'll see what comes up...   Rich Jordan  CCS    ------------------------------    Date: 24 Mar 2001 21:52:23 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Better = Worse.0 Message-ID: <877l1fjmug.fsf_-_@prep.synonet.com>  + Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes:   D > I admire your efficiency in destroying the "UNIX is better because' > it's simpler and more flexible" tale.   , Let me put it in VERY straight foward terms.  6 1) Unix is *better* because it is simple and flexible.  6 2) Unix is *worse*  because it is simple and flexible.  E Now before you jump up and down about the above, please take the time , to read Hoffsteader, or get Godel's paper...  B These is no inconsistancy in what I stated; it is incomplete.  The@ missing element is where you use it, and thus, the definition of better.   C But, by any modern measure of a good software engineering platform, ! unix fails on almost every point.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Mar 2001 05:57 CST ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) . Subject: Re: Can this be done through lexicals- Message-ID: <24MAR200105574172@gerg.tamu.edu>   0 Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> writes... }The 7.2-1 New features manualB }http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/721final/6614/6614pro_002.htmlJ }provides information on the new MT3_DENSITY item for the f$getdvi lexical
 }function: }  }F$GETDVI lexical function  7 }The following item codes have been added to F$GETDVI:  1 }Item           Return Type  Information Returned S }---------------------------------------------------------------------------------  H }MT3_DENSITY    String       Current density of the device (tapes only) I }MT3_SUPPORTED  String       TRUE or FALSE to indicate whether the device A }supports densities defined in the MT3DEF (for Alpha tapes only)   } < }Unfortunately(?) the result is not the one we could expect: } ) }GD2079> a=f$getdvi("mkc0","mt3_density")  }GD2079> sh symb a' }  A = "(DENSITY=DEFAULT,NOCOMPACTION)"  } I }unless we are very familiar with the default values of all tape devices.  }  }D.    Very interesting.   * I just tried this on my DAT drive and got:& $ say f$getdvi("mka600","mt3_density") (DENSITY=DDS1,COMPACTION)   ? At the time no tape was mounted. The last tape I mounted was in G fact a DDS1 tape with compaction explicitly enabled via /media=compact.   = The drive itself is a Compaq SDT-10000 which is a DDS4 drive.   3 OK - I just initialized a DDS4 tape and mounted it: " $ init mka600 backup/media=compact# $ mount mka600 backup/media=compact 2 %MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, BACKUP mounted on _GERGX$MKA600:& $ say f$getdvi("mka600","mt3_density") (DENSITY=DDS2,COMPACTION)   H So it got it wrong. It is not a DDS2 tape as it says, it is a DDS4 tape.' But it is different than it was before.   0 It is also wrong in the show device/full output:  J Magtape GERGX$MKA600:, device type COMPAQ SDT-10000, is online, allocated, [...] O     Density                     DDS2    Format                        Normal-11   K which is not surprising - they would almost certainly be getting their info  from the same place.   Also interesting: 0 $ mount mka600 backup/media=compact/density=dds42 %MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, BACKUP mounted on _GERGX$MKA600:& $ say f$getdvi("mka600","mt3_density") (DENSITY=DDS2,COMPACTION)   H So it gets it wrong even if you specifically tell it to do DDS4 density.F (With one possible caveat - I didn't reinitialize the tape before thisG with a /density=dds4. This shouldn't matter as the thing is supposed to 2 be using media recognition and it is a DDS4 tape.)  B At this point, it is perhaps a near-miss. It appears to be able to@ tell the difference between a DDS1 tape and one that is a higher@ capacity, but not perfectly. I havn't tried either a 60m pre-DDSA designation tape, or a DDS3 tape to see what it says about them - A my guess would be that a DDS3 tape also gets reported as DDS2 but B I don't have one handy to test the theory, and I have no idea whatD it would say about a 60m tape as there is no DDS0 designation (there? is nothing in the /DENSITY qualifier for INIT or MOUNT that can " specify this kind of tape either).   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 12:33:50 GMT 1 From: pat jankowiak <vaxhackery@worldnet.att.net> 0 Subject: cool dectalk book on ebay -was about $50 Message-ID: <3ABC93C5.CEEEC810@worldnet.att.net>  ' cool dectalk book on ebay -was about $5  item 1223202069   u http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1223202069&r=0&t=0&showTutorial=0&ed=985570115&indexURL=0&rd=1   # I'm not selling it, I just saw it..    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:26:05 +0100   From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>1 Subject: It's not boring any more, IT'S INSULTING + Message-ID: <VA.0000032b.664e4ee2@sture.ch>   B In article <3ABB4C28.E5316DD1@infopuls.com>, Christof Brass wrote:' > Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:14:16 +0000 + > From: Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com>  > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms N > Subject: Re: Boring the pants off the COV (was RE: Dumbing Down VMS with...) >  > "Doc.Cypher" wrote:  > > & > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > C > > On Thu, 22 Mar 2001, Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> wrote:  > > >"Doc.Cypher" wrote: > > >>) > > >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----  > > >>F > > >> On Wed, 21 Mar 2001, Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> wrote: > > >>
 > > >> <snip>  > > >>S > > >> >> I've been following this "VMS is the best thing since Alan Turing's time" $ > > >> >> argument for too long now. > > >> > > > >> >Misunderstanding.  > > >>M > > >> Really? You do seem to be in favour of VMS in an almost fanatical way.  > > >  > > >Technical, *technical*! > > O > > But Christoff, your passion for the subject is not doing your viewpoint any  > > favours. This is important.  > > O > > You might think that there was no substance to my little flamewar with Tony O > > Szopa (a known Troll). That's because the point was already made and he (a) N > > refused to acknowledge it, and (b) Was most discourteous. So, he invited a7 > > flaming. You have to be careful not to do the same.  > > N > > One of the key pieces of advice in RFC 1855 is to cool off before posting.L > > It doesn't say that you should avoid using inflammatory language, but itL > > would be a good idea around here to do so only when you don't care about4 > > the followups (or know they'll be on your side). > > O > > The only way you'll get everyone on your side, is if you're bashing The Q's F > > marketing division for not getting their act together to sell VMS. > >  > > Doc. > > ! > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----  > > Version: 2.6.2 > > D > > iQEVAwUBOrqD8sriC3SGiziTAQEC2AgAra/tiZ1+z48TqBCowxz16uXU+ZYg3/bdD > > sD2MKLWn2L5iHVDspQLHo9Q6aSlQoDQ0rHLdGN5j1nA5qTsE6ipvO4lLQy0r7r5sD > > zAKbQ04/+H7JMXgJqJ+vwxi7ZlXxpXBSgLckhh2cYSZ1YY2L8SAFUfSitrgNe2PVD > > YT7J1MpR3HSQP+OR0v+0YP/jjsOeiz4h1ufiBwWC/aM5qdMC9cWPakUINvQOhN7zD > > WZ7Zfs57tDEUkmuSHys7yvJR4NF1c9oyZIAWnIxb2BLQCFZCMAqQvuIYnzNdL0EW< > > BwTM9our/IwQ1pCjFuoviBK1Fi9v/5MUVpJoOxUyOG29FzqMEJt7rA==	 > > =fDaY  > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----  > @ > You are basically right but I don't try to get the majority on@ > my side as I don't think that VMS is an OS for the majority or( > fine arts or every high quality stuff. > @ > My biggest mistake - if we could say so - is not to be able to@ > communicate my intents to some of the people that might agree.B > But most opponents won't change their minds because *they* don'tB > fit in. This NG is devoted to VMS not to UNIX crap. Therefore itB > is very naturally to defend VMS from a technically point of view> > against damage which is to be expected of the course the COE > things might take. > A > To be clear: what the majority thinks or does is no measure forgA > quality. It could be the extinction of some minorities. In thatc? > I could reference to the butt head (Brian Wheeler) in this NG @ > accusing me of beeing like the Nazis against the Jews. I wouldB > have used a more drastic word to denote this stupid ashole but I? > don't know any suitable words which will pass the four letterb > words filters.  Q You still don't get the message, do you? People have told you politely, and then c3 used stronger language, and you still don't get it!   H YOU ARE SINGLE-HANDEDLY MAKING THIS NEWSGROUP AN UNPLEASANT PLACE TO BE.  R 118 messages from you out of a total of 854 messages in the last 7 days, plus manyN responses. Maybe 3 or 4 of technical interest, the rest garbage. I am sick of  hearing your mantra.  + > To come back: I'm a member of a minority!   C Big deal. You can't go through life blaming everyone else for that.    > TooyA > many people here support the UNIXification of VMS - I think outaA > of despair. I'm used to be part of a minority. My mother tongueSA > is a rarely used language. My favourite PLs are rarely used. My < > favorite desktop OSs are close to extinction. My favourite? > enterprise OSs are near to extinction. Do you think you couldfA > impress me with "showing the instruments" (if you understand to ) > which medieval phrase I'm referencing)?- > ? > To get the applaus of the majority is boring. To get the best 7 > people on my side is a challenge and would please me.r >s  , A challenge you are totally failing to meet.   Spectacularly.  S You have insulted folks here who I greatly respect. I even applaud Andrew Harrison o@ for his response to you, and I normally do not give him an inch.  T You are making bitter enemies here. Since English is not your mother tongue, let me S explain that the F word is deeply insulting. I have _never_ used it in front of my nL parents or my sister, and maybe only once or twice in front of my brothers.  _That's_ how bad it is.   	 I repeat:=  H YOU ARE SINGLE-HANDEDLY MAKING THIS NEWSGROUP AN UNPLEASANT PLACE TO BE.H YOU ARE SINGLE-HANDEDLY MAKING THIS NEWSGROUP AN UNPLEASANT PLACE TO BE.H YOU ARE SINGLE-HANDEDLY MAKING THIS NEWSGROUP AN UNPLEASANT PLACE TO BE.   ___t
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 12:21:59 -0500 $ From: Norman Woo <nwoo@videotron.ca>B Subject: Keeping userids and passwords synchronize across 4 Alphas8 Message-ID: <lilpbtg3iimgvbjk91ugs6gfhfjh382qvu@4ax.com>   Hi folks  A We're faced with a challenge of keeping the userids and passwordsp@ synchronize across 4 Alphas DS20Es running OpenVMS 7.1-2.  TheseE Alphas are physically located in different locations.  Users are ableeA to access any one of these 4.   If they change their passwords onpF mahcine, this password should be updated on the other 3.  Likewise, ifB the system administrator adds/modify/deletes a userid, this should. also be reflected across the other 3 machines.  / We cannot user proxies due to security issues. l  > Any help as to how you have done this or using any third party0 software to do this woud be greatly appreciated.   Thanks in advance.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 03:41:39 -0500t  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>Y Subject: Re: New qualifiers for some DCL commands (was: Re: Dumbing Down VMS with UNIX Elr/ Message-ID: <1010324030923.41043B@Ives.egh.com>r  # On 23 Mar 2001, Carl Perkins wrote:   5 > jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson) writes... D > }Oh?  Delete offers the "necessary selection criteria"?  Let's sayD > }I wanted to perform the very commonly requested deleting files in? > }reverse order?  How do I do that with delete?  In Unix it's:  > }  > }	ls -r1 | xargs rml > @ > DELETE, PURGE, DIRECTORY, and probably some others could use a > /REVERSE qualifier.   < Not really.  The only reason any wants to delete or purge in> reverse order is performance.  I think it would be much better> to ask for improvements in directory functions.  We've already@ got a big (linear) boost in V7.2 due to the use of large buffers? in the directory squishing (and expansion?) when you delete alll? the files in a directory block (or create a new file that needso to be listed in a full block?)  9 However, I think there is lots more room for improvement.   B E.G.  Why is it necessary to compress out the empty blocks at all?> Couldn't a marker be placed in the empty block that says "this; block is empty, skip to next block"?  Directory compression0I could then be initiated manually by doing a "$ convert/reclaim/directory"0> or some other new command After you had deleted all the files.< Since this would only make one pass through the directory toB compress it instead of one pass each time a block in the directory9 was emptied, it should be enormously faster.  It could be 2 controlled by a "set directory" command if needed:? "set directory/reclaim=always" to retain the current behaviour,s; "set directory/reclaim=never" to require manual reclaiming, > "set directory/reclaim=nnn" to reclaim whenever nnn blocks are emptied.  4 The new behaviour would result in directories slowly< expanded over time.  Deletions would not cause it to shrink,= but file creations at the end of the directory would cause itr= to expand.  Random sequences of creations and deletions wouldR= result in most new files going into holes (free space) in they+ directory, so expansion would be very slow.<  ? Since there would tend to be lots of empty space in unreclaimede> directories, file creations in them would seldom result in the4 entire directory having to be shuffled to make room.  @ This might improve performance enough to make Dave Mathog happy!  > Compressing the directories might have made sense when VMS ran= on RK07's and RPO6's, but with 18 & 36 GB disks, it no longerr seems worth it.   < > Even better might be a more comprehensive /SORT qualifier. > @ > With a /SORT qualifer you could have things along the lines of > $ DIR/SORT=KEY=(SIZE,ASCEND) > or" > $ DIR/SORT=KEY=(CREATED,DESCEND) > or > $ DIR/SORT=SPEC=myspec.spc > or, of course,8 > $ DELETE/SORT=(KEY=(NAME,DESCEND),KEY=(TYPE,DESCEND),-" >     KEY=(VERSION,DESCEND)) *.*;*A > (perhaps a key called "filespec" or something along those linesaE > to get the full spec including name, type, and version in one key).   @ I like this proposal, mostly for directory, but it would also beD handy for any wild-card interactive file operation, where you wantedF to use /confirm, and then ctrl/Z after the last file you really wantedA to process.  For example if you wanted to delete some but not alliE large .tmp files, you could delete/conf/sort=(size,descending) *.tmp,eB type "y" or "n" to delete the ones you wanted, then ctrl/z to skip) all the small ones you didn't care about.t  F > After all, there are callable sorting routunes are there not? AddingF > sort functionality should therefore, in theory, not be all that hardF > (which is easy to say since I'm not the one who would be adding it). > @ > }Or, say I want to delete empty .tmp files, which is something > }I've wanted to do.e
 > }That's: > } : > }	ls -s1 *.tmp |  awk '/^ *0 / { print $2 };' | xargs rm > } K > }So, I must be missing the options on DEL that provides an way to do the t > }above easily. > }-Jordan Henderson > E > One of the good things people mention about DCL is it's regularity.dC > To help promote this, and because it would be useful, I'd like tofC > suggest that DELETE and PURGE and possibly some others could alsotD > use the /SELECT= qualifier that was added to the DIRECTORY command/ > sometime around VMS V6.1. You could then do ao% > $ DELETE/SELECT=SIZE=MAX=0 *.TMP;*.r  B I was going to suggest the same thing until I read forward and saw you had anticipated me.   
 > --- Carl   -- t John Santosa Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Mar 2001 22:01:22 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>Y Subject: Re: New qualifiers for some DCL commands (was: Re: Dumbing Down VMS with UNIX El,- Message-ID: <873dc3jmfh.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   " John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> writes:  D > E.G.  Why is it necessary to compress out the empty blocks at all?F > Couldn't a marker be placed in the empty block that says "this block  > is empty, skip to next block"?  E A word of 177777 as the first one of the block will do this. Standard C RMS. I think the XQP does not do it this way for reasons of history.A and the like. Also, the compression will be automatic if you copysJ the file in record mode. Empty space is dropped out, causing the ocasional+ 'where has part of my file gone...' here :)d   -- l< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda..@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Mar 2001 07:03 CST ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)t, Subject: Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions- Message-ID: <24MAR200107031416@gerg.tamu.edu>   - Christof Brass <brass@infopuls.com> writes...s }Carl Perkins wrote: }> m( }> Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com writes...J }> }Did I understand right? Christof just asked for a Unix feature on VMS? }> }	 }> }Shane  }>  G }> Not only did he ask for one, he asked for one of the stupidest ones.s }> tG }> Case sensitivity is completely and utterly moronic (not only in file-I }> names, but in programming languages and every other place it happens).u }> lF }> The COE thingy is, of course, requiring such a feature. Fortunately7 }> it will only happen if you deliberately activate it.i }> r }> --- Carlw }> . } ( }Yes it have to be activated explicitly.? }But why is it stupid to make a difference between Mac and MAC?e  9 Because they are not different. They are the same. To seex5 this, try reading your sentence above out loud. Woulde5 someone listening to you read it be able to tell thatI1 one was "Mac" and the other "MAC"? Unless you say-< "capital-m lowercase-a lowercase-c" and "capital-m capital-a9 capital-c" when you get to them (which is rediculous, butd> necessary if you want case sensitivity) instead of just saying; "mac" then they will not be able to tell the difference. Ifs: you can't tell the difference then they are not different.@ If you have to jump through moronic hoops to make them different& them making them different is moronic.  @ }Especially in a programming language in which we try to express< }our algorithmical thoughts, objects a.s.o.. If we have this? }disctinction in our natural scripture why not carrying forward   ; No "we" don't. They are the same. They are both "mac". If I)< use a variable or function called "mac", then it is "mac" noD matter how you capitalize it. Is the word "If" (as used at the startA of your last sentence above) a different word that the word "if"?p Of course not. "If" is "if".  A It's not as if there is a shortage of characters. If you want twotB things called "mac" then make them "mac1" and "mac2", an array, orB some other such thing. Since they obviously are not the same thingB you should certainly be able to come up with better names for themC that are more descriptive of what they are used for so you can tell  which one is which.   > Trying to explain to someone how your program works if you use? the same word with different cases is an exercise in stupidity.o; "Then you multiply Mac by FOO." "But mac is a function thatt< doesn't return a value." "Not that MAC, the other Mac." It's@ like the old "who's on first" routine, only it makes less sense.  ? }to our PLs and filesystems? I would rather restrict the use of/? }special characters which are used in natural language texts to = }separate words/sentences or to express certain grammaticallyN# }important meanings like questions.   A Case sensitivity is one of the reasons that programs written in C C are prone to errors. One normally unimportant error and the programsF is wrong. The person who invented case sensitive programming languages/ should be beaten with very large blunt objects.s  ? Case sensitivity in filesystems (which, in Unixoid systems also ? leads directly to case sensitivity in commands) is also stupid.eF Why should either the computer or I care if I type in "print foo.txt",A "Print Foo.Txt", "PRINT foo.TXT", or any of the other of the 2^11DC possible variations? In all of these cases I just want to print thee text file called foo.    --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 06:19:24 -0800s From: <tsm@palindrome.org>1 Subject: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 Systemn4 Message-ID: <7%1v6.677$ya4.355429@nntp2.onemain.com>  H A co-worker of mine gave me a DEC 3000-300XL system. It had DIGITAL UnixJ installed on it, and I installed VMS over it. I have the Hobbyist Alpha CDL (VMS version 7.2), and installed it from an RRD42. The install process seemsK to go OK, but when I try to boot the hard drive which I installed VMS on, Il get the following error:  F %APB-F-BADSYSROOT, System root [SYSA.] does not exist, check bootflags  J I tried installing three different times in total. Twice with the standardF RZ25L disk, and one with a generic 1GB disk. (I thought maybe it was aC problem with the disk). In all cases, I get the exact same problem.r  K I have the newest console revision (V7.0) and PAL code (V5.56) installed on . the system. Everything seems to be up to date.  J Any clues on this one? I searched the web & Usenet for that error message,I and got only one hit - somebody who was trying to boot a non-bootable CD.D2 How could that error apply to a hard drive bootup?   Thanks,-   Terry Murphy   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 15:10:47 GMTyD From: "Kris G.G. Clippeleyr (aka Qkcl)" <kris.clippeleyr@pandora.be>5 Subject: Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 Systemn< Message-ID: <XN2v6.31436$tk.3162000@afrodite.telenet-ops.be>   Hi,e  $ Check the setting on the >>> prompt.I BOOT_FLAGS should read 0,0, and not A (as is the case when booting U**x).  Also, check OS_TYPE.  
 Good luck,     -- Kris G.G. Clippeleyr (aka Qkcl)r& VMS Wizard in training, Guru wanna be.% <tsm@palindrome.org> wrote in message . news:7%1v6.677$ya4.355429@nntp2.onemain.com...J > A co-worker of mine gave me a DEC 3000-300XL system. It had DIGITAL UnixL > installed on it, and I installed VMS over it. I have the Hobbyist Alpha CDH > (VMS version 7.2), and installed it from an RRD42. The install process seemsaK > to go OK, but when I try to boot the hard drive which I installed VMS on,t Ia > get the following error: >aH > %APB-F-BADSYSROOT, System root [SYSA.] does not exist, check bootflags >1L > I tried installing three different times in total. Twice with the standardH > RZ25L disk, and one with a generic 1GB disk. (I thought maybe it was aE > problem with the disk). In all cases, I get the exact same problem.' >bJ > I have the newest console revision (V7.0) and PAL code (V5.56) installed on0 > the system. Everything seems to be up to date. >nL > Any clues on this one? I searched the web & Usenet for that error message,K > and got only one hit - somebody who was trying to boot a non-bootable CD.T4 > How could that error apply to a hard drive bootup? >i	 > Thanks,6 >Q > Terry Murphy >E >v >L   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 11:45:05 -05002, From: "David Turner" <dbturner@islandco.com>5 Subject: Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 SystemR/ Message-ID: <tbpjkf6k4623a0@news.supernews.com>M   >>> set boot_osflags 0,0 >>> set os_type OpenVMS *   L *  -this one ain't necessary but will set up the SRM disk naming conventions	 correctlyo  
 That'll do it    Island Computers US Corporation  2700 Gregory Streetm Savannah GA 31404a Tel: 912 447 6622u Fax:912 201 0096 sales@islandco.com% <tsm@palindrome.org> wrote in messagel. news:7%1v6.677$ya4.355429@nntp2.onemain.com...J | A co-worker of mine gave me a DEC 3000-300XL system. It had DIGITAL UnixL | installed on it, and I installed VMS over it. I have the Hobbyist Alpha CDH | (VMS version 7.2), and installed it from an RRD42. The install process seemssK | to go OK, but when I try to boot the hard drive which I installed VMS on,  I  | get the following error: |yH | %APB-F-BADSYSROOT, System root [SYSA.] does not exist, check bootflags |sL | I tried installing three different times in total. Twice with the standardH | RZ25L disk, and one with a generic 1GB disk. (I thought maybe it was aE | problem with the disk). In all cases, I get the exact same problem.I | J | I have the newest console revision (V7.0) and PAL code (V5.56) installed on0 | the system. Everything seems to be up to date. |aL | Any clues on this one? I searched the web & Usenet for that error message,K | and got only one hit - somebody who was trying to boot a non-bootable CD. 4 | How could that error apply to a hard drive bootup? |s	 | Thanks,  |t | Terry Murphy |  |p |e   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:15:05 -0800r From: <tsm@palindrome.org>5 Subject: Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 Systema5 Message-ID: <ps5v6.740$WM4.1228561@nntp1.onemain.com>   J Thank you, sir! This did the trick. Kind of surprising that the answer forH this wasn't on the web or Deja any where (now it is :-). I guess I'm the  only one going from Unix to VMS!   -- Terry    G "Kris G.G. Clippeleyr (aka Qkcl)" <kris.clippeleyr@pandora.be> wrote in > message news:XN2v6.31436$tk.3162000@afrodite.telenet-ops.be... > Hi,s >e& > Check the setting on the >>> prompt.K > BOOT_FLAGS should read 0,0, and not A (as is the case when booting U**x).a > Also, check OS_TYPE. >o > Good luck, >b >  > --! > Kris G.G. Clippeleyr (aka Qkcl)w( > VMS Wizard in training, Guru wanna be.' > <tsm@palindrome.org> wrote in messagel0 > news:7%1v6.677$ya4.355429@nntp2.onemain.com...L > > A co-worker of mine gave me a DEC 3000-300XL system. It had DIGITAL UnixK > > installed on it, and I installed VMS over it. I have the Hobbyist Alphal CDJ > > (VMS version 7.2), and installed it from an RRD42. The install process > seemsvI > > to go OK, but when I try to boot the hard drive which I installed VMSc on,t > Ii > > get the following error: > >hJ > > %APB-F-BADSYSROOT, System root [SYSA.] does not exist, check bootflags > >UE > > I tried installing three different times in total. Twice with theN standardJ > > RZ25L disk, and one with a generic 1GB disk. (I thought maybe it was aG > > problem with the disk). In all cases, I get the exact same problem.- > >-L > > I have the newest console revision (V7.0) and PAL code (V5.56) installed > on2 > > the system. Everything seems to be up to date. > > E > > Any clues on this one? I searched the web & Usenet for that errorf message,I > > and got only one hit - somebody who was trying to boot a non-bootablez CD.o6 > > How could that error apply to a hard drive bootup? > >p > > Thanks,a > >n > > Terry Murphy > >U > >a > >l >  >a   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2001 02:03:35 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>5 Subject: Re: Problem Booting Installed VMS 7.2 Systemy- Message-ID: <87hf0jhwnc.fsf@prep.synonet.com>e  F "Kris G.G. Clippeleyr (aka Qkcl)" <kris.clippeleyr@pandora.be> writes:  C > Check the setting on the >>> prompt.  BOOT_FLAGS should read 0,0,rE > and not A (as is the case when booting U**x).  Also, check OS_TYPE.c  F DU used the BOOT_FLAGS value of 'A' to mean autostart and go to multi- user.r  = For VMS your value should be of the form <value of the systemoD root>,osbootflag. The system root value is what is after the [SYS inD the system specific directory. EG [SYS0] is 0, [SYS4] is 4 etc.  theD second one to remember is the value 1. This tells the system to stopB before strating to setup and load VMS so you can change the system parameters.p  B You will also need to reset the date and time when you change back> and forth, DU and VMS use different formats in the CMOS clock.   -- r< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.e@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:26:03 +0100a  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch># Subject: Re: Support of old systemss+ Message-ID: <VA.00000329.664e4a9e@sture.ch>h  K In article <h3HQ$voGT3tG@eisner.encompasserve.org>, John E. Malmberg wrote:    [snip]; > The following is untested, and probably a bit incomplete.e > Use at your own risk!e > C > It also will require that you have the needed license keys loadeda2 > on the boot system for the satellite to operate. > C > The VAX system must have an ethernet controller that is supported ( > for VMSCLUSTER operations.  No DEQNAs. > 4 > Assume that an Alpha is your system with a CD-ROM. >  > Convert it to a cluster. > @ > Use the CLUSTER_CONFIG procedure to build a satellite with the= > ethernet address of the VAX.  Be sure to tell it not to putu& > page or swap files on the satellite. > B > On a spare disk, make an IMAGE backup of the OpenVMS VAX CD-ROM. > 5 > Now look at the MOP database for the VAX satellite.y > G > You will have to change the file and logical name references to pointo5 > to images on your backup of the OpenVMS VAX CD-ROM.e > C > You will also probably need to copy the cluster security databasesA > from the ALPHA system disk to backup of the OpenVMS VAX CD-ROM.e > G > It may be needed to set the logical names for SYSUAF and other commone4 > files in the SYLOGICALS.COM that will be executed. > L > The VAX satellite can then be booted, it will not have much functionality,J > but you can then do an image backup of the OpenVMS VAX CD-ROM to a spareC > disk on the VAX, or do SAVE-SET B to start an install, or use theo( > tape drive on your VAX from the ALPHA. > 9 > Again, consider this an experimental untried procedure.s > E > I have probably missed a few steps, and of course this will requires3 > some research on the person who wants to do this.t > J Interesting. A comment in that Gartner report on VMS infers this was once F formally supported, although I note that nowadays (V7.2-1), the Alpha G CLUSTER_CONFIG.COM only contains options to add an _Alpha_ node to the   cluster.  F It _should_ be possible, although will take some research, as you say. ___,
 Paul Sture SwitzerlandR   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2001 01:55:50 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com># Subject: Re: Support of old systems - Message-ID: <87lmpvhx09.fsf@prep.synonet.com>c  " Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch> writes:  M > In article <h3HQ$voGT3tG@eisner.encompasserve.org>, John E. Malmberg wrote:t  ? > > The VAX satellite can then be booted, it will not have mucheE > > functionality, but you can then do an image backup of the OpenVMS D > > VAX CD-ROM to a spare disk on the VAX, or do SAVE-SET B to startA > > an install, or use the tape drive on your VAX from the ALPHA.y  ; > > Again, consider this an experimental untried procedure.n  ? > > I have probably missed a few steps, and of course this willf= > > require some research on the person who wants to do this.i  F > Interesting. A comment in that Gartner report on VMS infers this wasF > once formally supported, although I note that nowadays (V7.2-1), theB > Alpha CLUSTER_CONFIG.COM only contains options to add an _Alpha_ > node to the cluster.  C > It _should_ be possible, although will take some research, as youe > say.  I You can certainly run as a cluster member by satalite booting from a disk H on the 'other' arch. There are some quirks to get a single alpha running7 with vaxen though, and I'd expect the opposite as well.s  H But, I'm think the new machine will have to be a cluster member. I don't= think the 'cluster' will like serving a disk to a non-member.h     --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.n@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:54:26 +0100c  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>0 Subject: Re: Uaf Show/rights status bug (v7.2-1)+ Message-ID: <VA.0000032c.666845b5@sture.ch>-  D In article <pGLtYpd4GoAR@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Rob Young wrote:- > From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)  > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms?2 > Subject: Re: Uaf Show/rights status bug (v7.2-1)" > Date: 22 Mar 2001 08:29:02 -0500 > f > In article <4p3u6.31124$1f.161798@quark.idirect.com>, "J. Scott Greig" <jsgreig@geminaq.com> writes:4 > > Just a heads-up for anyone converting to V7.2-1. > > < > > It seems that the "show/rights" portion of the authorize- > > utility for OpenVMS version 7.2-1 (Alpha)e; > > returns a bad status.   This can lead to broken command.- > > files &etc. for user authorization tasks.  > >  > > Version 7.2-1... > > $ uaf:=$authorize0 > > $ uaf show/rights systemA > > Identifier                         Value           Attributesa1 > >   NET$MANAGE                       %X91F50002a1 > >   NET$DIAGNOSE                     %X91F50004M > > $ sh sym $status > >   $STATUS == "%X10000000"r > >  > > Version 7.1... > > $  uaf show/rights systemsA > > Identifier                         Value           Attributes@1 > >   NET$MANAGE                       %X91F50002m > > $ sh sym $status > >   $STATUS == "%X00000001"  > > " > > I'm logging a call to DEQ now.	 > > Scottu > >  > / >  Here's one for you ... on VMS 6.2 , you get:f >  > $ uaf :== $authorize > $ uaf show /right system? > Identifier                         Value           Attributesn >  > [snip] >  > $ show sym $status >   $STATUS == "%X100381F0"i >  > $ @find_message 100381F0 > ' > Message found in system message file:.G > 100381F0 -> %CLI-W-ABSENT, entity or value absent from command string> >  >  Interesting.    >  And on V7.2 VAX, I get   $ uaf show /rights system  $ show sym $status   $STATUS == "%X100381F0"M   ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerlande   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:26:04 +0100   From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>F Subject: Re: VMS COE docs online (was POSIX Streams, File Permissions)+ Message-ID: <VA.0000032a.664e4d47@sture.ch>a  E In article <iiLu6.101$fB6.3581@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman wrote:  > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms 4 > From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)L > Subject: RE: VMS COE docs online (was Re: POSIX Streams, File Permissions)% > Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:59:58 GMTn > _ > In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIKEBECEAA.tom@kednos.com>, Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> writes:oH > :LOOKUP=CASE_SENSITIVE would seem to make more sense, the other one is > :nonsensical > = >   DCL has some subtleties around four-character uniqueness.r > / Extract from SYS$STARTUP:DECEVENT$STARTUP.COM :e  P $ SAY_CMD "$ SET PROCESS/PRIVLEDGE=(NOALL,DIAGNOSE,TMPMBX,NETMBX,SYSLCK,SYSPRV)""                              ^^^^^ :-)h ___u
 Paul Sture Switzerlandr   ------------------------------  + Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 11:41:02 +0000 (UTC)t9 From: Roar =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thron=E6s?= <roart@nvg.ntnu.no> * Subject: Re: VMS source listings omittings- Message-ID: <99i14e$icf$1@tyfon.itea.ntnu.no>"  3 Hoff Hoffman <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote:S/ : In article <99cov9$qrv$1@tyfon.itea.ntnu.no>,h= : Roar =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thron=E6s?= <roart@nvg.ntnu.no> writes:h  @ : :The VMS source listings kit states that something is omitted.G : :I know the why, but exactly which files/modules are omitted and whatk : :is their functionality?  G :   I would have assumed that the answer to this would be self-evident.b  F :   Citing a specific example of an expurgated facility and associatedH :   source listings modules, Compaq OpenVMS has deliberately chosen not K :   to provide the internal software implementation details of the OpenVMS uI :   software licensing mechanisms.  Hopefully, for what should be obviouss :   reasons.    That is stated and obvious, yes.  F :   Other OpenVMS modules are expurgated from the source code listings3 :   CD-ROM for a variety of other specific reasons.n  D Among them sensitive algorithms, trade secrets, very innovative code and patent pending code.C That itself may be self-evident, but exactly what it is may only beb@ guessed, and after a while be confirmed when you do not find it.  I :   If you have a specific facility or function that you require details,p  @ No, just curious about exactly which modules/algorithms/code and functionality are excluded.R  K I would like some more details about the ICC API in the form of programmingt5 examples, but I do not need the source code for that.f   --  
 -Roar Throns-   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 12:20:24 GMTm= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)7* Subject: Re: VMS source listings omittings0 Message-ID: <009F97BB.5B1FF4C5@SendSpamHere.ORG>  i In article <99i14e$icf$1@tyfon.itea.ntnu.no>, Roar =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thron=E6s?= <roart@nvg.ntnu.no> writes:y4 >Hoff Hoffman <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote:0 >: In article <99cov9$qrv$1@tyfon.itea.ntnu.no>,> >: Roar =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thron=E6s?= <roart@nvg.ntnu.no> writes: >eA >: :The VMS source listings kit states that something is omitted.eH >: :I know the why, but exactly which files/modules are omitted and what >: :is their functionality?a > H >:   I would have assumed that the answer to this would be self-evident. >eG >:   Citing a specific example of an expurgated facility and associatedtI >:   source listings modules, Compaq OpenVMS has deliberately chosen not yL >:   to provide the internal software implementation details of the OpenVMS J >:   software licensing mechanisms.  Hopefully, for what should be obvious
 >:   reasons.  >t! >That is stated and obvious, yes.t  H As one having and using the source listings, I'd much rather see a file-F name in the source listings and its contents, if censored, state such.D For example, [V72-1.LOGIN.LIS]CHECKUSER.LIS could exist but contain:   *** CENSORED ***     --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             cO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 15:00:23 GMTr+ From: rjordan@mars.mcs.net (Richard Jordan) * Subject: Re: VMS source listings omittings3 Message-ID: <bE2v6.2648$JN5.82141@news.goodnet.com>.  F Of course if you really want to see all the expurgated source, all youG might have to do is get a job at microsoft in Redmond, who received allt+ the good stuff almost free some time ago ;)d   Rich Jordanr rjordan@mcs.neti   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2001 01:48:17 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>* Subject: Re: VMS source listings omittings- Message-ID: <87puf7hxcu.fsf@prep.synonet.com>a  - rjordan@mars.mcs.net (Richard Jordan) writes:s  D > Of course if you really want to see all the expurgated source, all@ > you might have to do is get a job at microsoft in Redmond, who: > received all the good stuff almost free some time ago ;)  D But I've already got the 3.4 listings on Fiche. Getting a searchableD version, or the MICA changes would be nice. ESP the last. So much of" this stuff just gets lost forever.   So much for history...   -- n< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:26:03 +0100m  From: Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch>C Subject: Was: [DCL] minute of the day. Now: IT pranks of yesteryearf+ Message-ID: <VA.00000328.664e4787@sture.ch>h  C In article <87wv9gnw9k.fsf@prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi wrote:  > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms & > Subject: Re: [DCL] minute of the day. > From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>" > Date: 24 Mar 2001 03:03:03 +0800 > $ > Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch> writes: >e [snip] > H > The best I have come across was a program called CRAMCOPY. Most of theG > time, it would swallow the command, print it on the line printer, andsD > copy the decks. Or it would print the command end to end reversed. > E > The prize, was for it to start the very first part of the copy, anduG > then proceed to type out some number of verses of Eskimo Nell. And it 8 > had I think 126 or so verses hidden in its happy guts. > E > Just hitting halt was not a good option, as you could end up with afD > destroyed pack. Plus it had a heap of anti tamper tricks built in.D > One of the programers found the dispatch to the type out code, and? > patched it out. The decks where copyied in interleaved order;e% > 0-1-2-3-4 -> 1-0-3-2-5 ... Oh dear!  > G > Eventually, some one found a spot where a jump disarmed the mischief.tC > Sad thing is, it was several orders an magnitude better code than ) > anything else that run of those things.m >dD Ooh-er. We're talking about early viruses here. As Wayne points out I these were mainly harmless fun (although as I inferred, in the days when eF CPU was charged out by the second, such things could potentially cost  thousands p.a.).  I The political damage can be quite severe too. When doing regular 12 hour gF days, 6 or 7 days a week (_not_ paid overtime), a former boss of mine H put a Xmas ASCII art message into the equivalent of SYS$WELCOME only to G be told that if he had time to do that he wasn't doing his job. Sheesh!o ___x
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 12:11:35 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) $ Subject: Re: [DCL] minute of the day0 Message-ID: <009F97BA.204CACD4@SendSpamHere.ORG>  n In article <xcj8HDMvddB3@tachxxsoftxxconsult>, wayne@tachysoft.xxx.412538.killspam.015a (Wayne Sewell) writes: {...snip...}G >clue what was happening, much less who did it.  They thought it was anoF >intermittent bug in the operating system, even though that was a rare! >occurrence in the pre-billy era.0  G That's one of Micro$chlock's great contributions to the software realm.SG The only innovations from Billy and Co. that I can see is the down playa of software quality.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMc             O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.e   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Mar 2001 07:08:34 CDT= From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.412538.killspam.015a (Wayne Sewell)a$ Subject: Re: [DCL] minute of the day. Message-ID: <cXCpWw$79iDZ@tachxxsoftxxconsult>  h In article <OF7DFE7B83.56AFC72E-ON88256A18.0064AF01@foundation.com>, Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com writes:I > I read somewhere that one of the early HPs had a tape drive that whinedgH > different notes depending on the operation it was doing. Apparently atJ > least one of them played "Auld Lang Syne" (sp?) at midnight on new year,/ > much to the surprise of the operator on duty.   O On one old school system I dealt with, can't remember whether it was the 1130 IeN played the joke on or the 360 at East Texas State, the operators found that ifI you placed a radio next to the CPU, tones would come out of it as the CPUuO ground away.   The tones changed according to what the CPU was doing.   I heard@M it myself.  The operators learned to recognize patterns.  For instance, "it'saK doing a fortran compile right now", or "it's executing <some-application>".d    L It wasn't long before somebody figured out how to play tunes on the radio byH executing instructions in a particular sequence.  They had a dozen or so7 programs that would play a particular song if executed.f   Waynee   -- tO ===============================================================================iM Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738  wayne@tachysoft.xxx : http://www.tachysoft.xxx/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html  K change .xxx to .com in addresses above, assuming you are not a spambot  :-)aO ===============================================================================sO Dean Wormer to Flounder: "Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life."    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.166 ************************