1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 06 Sep 2001	Volume 2001 : Issue 495       Contents:. Re: A Compaq Perspective on the HP Acquisition Re: alpha - ia64 Re: alpha - ia64 Re: Alpha/VMS V Sun/Solaris  Re: Alpha/VMS V Sun/Solaris 2 Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file2 Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file2 Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file2 Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file2 Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file2 Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file$ Re: DCL command file to requeue jobs
 DCL doubts...  Re: DCL doubts...   Re: Digital and Alpha to Survive  Re: Digital and Alpha to SurviveP Re: dir help ---%LIBRAR-F-OPENIN, error opening  SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]NCS$LIBRARY.P Re: dir help ---%LIBRAR-F-OPENIN, error opening  SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]NCS$LIBRARY.( Re: DSN now officially retired in the UK Re: ed/edt corrupting files  Re: EV7 will never ship?  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium  Re: Feeling Better about Itanium Here's your answer' Re: How to backup a directory structure ' Re: How to backup a directory structure  Re: HP and Compaq merging  Re: HP and Compaq merging  Re: HP and Compaq merging  Re: HP buying Compaq?  Re: HP buying Compaq?  Re: HP OpenVMS IPF Re: HP OpenVMS IPF Huh? Re: Huh? Re: Huh? Re: I hate Compaq  Re: I hate Compaq + Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL? + Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL? + Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL? + Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL? E Re: Is there a VMS command to check if I have cache memory installed?  Re: KZCCA-CB Problems % Re: Line count for txt file from DCL? % Re: Line count for txt file from DCL? # Re: mapping a VMS directory to a PC # Re: mapping a VMS directory to a PC  Re: Mark Twain Promo Re: My VMS Wish List (features)  Re: Newbie needs help  Re: NT or w2k on alpha 1200 ?  Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: RIP Bill Gates Re: Status of Alpha  Re: Timeline Re: Timeline Re: Timeline Re: Timeline Re: Timeline Re: Tunneling DECnet over IP UCX Printing Re: UCX Printing Re: UCX Printing VMS Cluster help.. Re: VMS Cluster help.. Re: VMS NT/win2000 similarities 1 VMS To Be Squeezed Out Of HP's Strategic Vision ? 5 Re: VMS To Be Squeezed Out Of HP's Strategic Vision ? , Re: Why continue with VMS - new hope, indeed7 Re: Will Mozilla ever run without crashing DECW server? 7 Re: Will Mozilla ever run without crashing DECW server? 7 Re: Will Mozilla ever run without crashing DECW server? $ Re: WSJ reporting HP will buy Compaq$ Re: WSJ reporting HP will buy Compaq www.playmates.co.uk  www.playmates.co.uk  www.playmates.co.uk   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:05:59 +0200  From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>7 Subject: Re: A Compaq Perspective on the HP Acquisition ' Message-ID: <3B9693B6.50F78DA7@home.nl>    "Hipenbecker, Doug" wrote:  F > Does this mean that the HP Journada I own is obsolete or is the iPAQ% > obsolete...or do I know own a hPAQ?  > :):):) >  > Doug Hipenbecker > Miller Brewing >  > -----Original Message-----. > From: Alan Greig [mailto:a.greig@virgin.net], > Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2001 10:36 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 9 > Subject: Re: A Compaq Perspective on the HP Acquisition  > 6 > On Tue, 4 Sep 2001 11:01:45 -0400, "Fred Kleinsorge"& > <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote: > N > >Hmmm.  I believe all the memo's say that we have to shut up while the megerL > >works its way through the legal mazes.  Besides, most of us know about as; > >much as anyone who picked up the newspaper this morning.  > > M > >For the time being, until the merger is complete, I believe it is business 5 > >as usual, including executing the current roadmap.  > A > iPAQs are very good at holding real computerized roadmaps while G > traveling. Perhaps Compaq could send us all a cellphone enabled  iPAQ : > so that the Compaq roadmaps can be updated in real time.  M I don't think that is a good idea. This would certainly overload the networks 	 involved.        >  >  > -- > Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 13:01:17 -0700 & From: name99@mac.com (Maynard Handley) Subject: Re: alpha - ia64 7 Message-ID: <name99-0509011301170001@handma2.apple.com>   J In article <3B94BA95.EBBA19B3@mikron.de>, Bernd Paysan <bpaysan@mikron.de> wrote:   > Peter da Silva wrote:  > > * > > In article <3B92AD21.269DA353@gmx.de>,. > > Bernd Paysan  <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> wrote:N > > > International sea law is old and established, it is the only law againstN > > > piracy, slavery and other bad things that happend on the open sea before > > > it was defined.  > > N > > You think they don't happen any more? In the Indian Ocean, the South China2 > > Sea, and all points between they certainly do. > J > Of course people do break laws, especially if the less civilized nationsC > they live in don't care about what they do. International sea law G > certainly is "just" a convention, but civilized nations should follow D > conventions even without being forced to (that's what's makes themH > civilized). Some large nations lately think that being civilized isn'tE > necessary any longer, because the only thing that matters is to win 5 > elections, and then get the hands on the big money.   $ You're referring to Kohl, I take it?H Or maybe Berlusconi, who appears to have used his first days in power to2 void the laws under which he was being prosecuted?I Or maybe to the noble french leaders, on both the right and left, who, it G appears, have applied enough pressure on the courts to ensure that they 5 will never have to answer for their ill-gotten gains?   < Yes there are aspects of the US political economy that suck.C But Europe is not going to make the world a better place by snidely E commenting on them rather than working on fixing their own cesspit of A corruption which frequently reaches rather deeper than in the US.    Maynard    ------------------------------   Date: 06 Sep 2001 05:39:10 GMT( From: seebs@plethora.net (Peter Seebach) Subject: Re: alpha - ia64 7 Message-ID: <3b970bfe$0$320$3c090ad1@news.plethora.net>   G In article <G7Sk7.10360$KV3.805918@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,  eddie <NullVoid@att.net> wrote: I >> This is not true for the Alpha and IA-64 Unix compilers, which use the H >> I32LP64 model (with the possible exception of the Alpha-based Crays).  $ >Then they are not 64-bit compilers.  C Sure they are.  Native 64-bit integer and pointer types sounds like  "64-bit to me".   E >They may generate code that executes on 64-bit machines and are able E >to use 64-bit primitives, but, the term 64-bit compiler implies that ; >the native, default size for data and addresses is 64-bit.   H No, it just implies that data and addresses *come in* 64 bit sizes; they don't have to be the defaults.   -s --  K    Copyright 2001, all wrongs reversed.  Peter Seebach / seebs@plethora.net M  +--- Need quality network services, server-grade computers, or a shell? ---+ M  v   C/Unix wizard, Pro-commerce radical, Spam fighter.  Boycott Spamazon!  v N Consulting, computers, web hosting, and shell access: http://www.plethora.net/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 09:49:10 +0930 / From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> $ Subject: Re: Alpha/VMS V Sun/Solaris. Message-ID: <3B96C0FE.2B87253@wasd.vsm.com.au>  E I made the configuration changes suggested by Dave ('fileflags' to 3) A and here are the results (couldn't be bothered activating CSWS).  B Curiously, I remember when the original results were generated OSUD *seemed* low I checked the configuration files a couple of times andF that multi-threading was enabled for the image.  These looked OK to meE (and apparently were).  If such a seemingly anomalous result crops up B again alarm bells might ring and I'll bounce it off whomever.  TheD original results were generated with VMS 7.2-1, these with 7.3 (sameF TCP/IP release, 5.1), which may account for some variation between theH two sets.  As emphasized in the WASD doco these results are *indicative* only.   =  C A C H E   D I S A B L E D        C A C H E   E N A B L E D 7      requests/second                    requests/second ?  Response Concurrent WASD OSU      Response Concurrent WASD OSU ?  0K       1           88   60      0K       1          283  213 ?  0K       10         111   67      0K       10         441  278 ?  64K      1           14   14      64K      1           82   34 ?  64K      10          33   23      64K      10          98   41   B Just by way of comparison with the previous results I reverted the6 'fileflags' parameter to 7 and obtained the following.      C A C H E   E N A B L E D        requests/second  Response Concurrent WASD OSU   0K       1          270   56   0K       10         423   82   64K      1           78   21   64K      10          95   27   G These confirm Dave's analysis regarding the effect/circumvention of the  bug.   David Jones wrote: >  > Mark Daniel wrote: > >  > > Can't resist ... > > : > >   http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/doc/htd/htd_1800.html > + > The first 2 tables on that web page show:  > F >     C A C H E   D I S A B L E D            C A C H E   E N A B L E D? >         requests/second                        request/second M > Response Concurrent WASD OSU Apache     Response Concurrent WASD OSU Apache I > 0K       1          58   41  14         0K       1          301  46  15 I > 0K       10         89   47  42         0K       10         382  64  21 I > 64K      1          39   14  18         64K      1          83   18  13 I > 64K      10         43   16  39         64K      10         98   21  31  > L > Try running the OSU test with fileflags set 2 it's pre-3.9 of 3 instead ofH > 7.  When bit 2 is set, the cache refresh logic includes a test againstG > the file's expiration date field so that 'expired' files are given an O > effective refresh time of zero.  A cache entry refresh is nearly as expensive F > as reading the file since the file has to be accessed to check for aP > changed modification date.  Due to a bug in the code, files with no expirationH > date are treated as expired so you don't see much improvement from theQ > cache.  Keeping file flags at 3 skips the code path containg the bug so you get   > full performance of the cache. > > > David L. Jones               |      Phone:    (614) 292-6929/ > Ohio State University        |      Internet: N > 140 W. 19th St. Rm. 231a     |               jonesd@er6s1.eng.ohio-state.edu< > Columbus, OH 43210           |               vman+@osu.edu > 3 > Disclaimer: I'm looking for marbles all day long.    --  # Non sinere illegitamus carborundum.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 11:13:29 +0930 / From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> $ Subject: Re: Alpha/VMS V Sun/Solaris/ Message-ID: <3B96D4C1.8B16548D@wasd.vsm.com.au>   G While I had it set up on the test-bench thought I might as well see how E they'd perform if I reduced the system to one CPU, so I "$STOP/CPU 1" C ('fileflags' 3 and cache enabled).  Concurrency makes a significant 
 contribution.       C A C H E   E N A B L E D        requests/second  Response Concurrent WASD OSU   0K       1          289  121   0K       10         429  180   64K      1           83   28   64K      10          92   40    FWIW.    Mark Daniel wrote: > G > I made the configuration changes suggested by Dave ('fileflags' to 3) B > and here are the results (couldn't be bothered activating CSWS).D > Curiously, I remember when the original results were generated OSUF > *seemed* low I checked the configuration files a couple of times andH > that multi-threading was enabled for the image.  These looked OK to meG > (and apparently were).  If such a seemingly anomalous result crops up D > again alarm bells might ring and I'll bounce it off whomever.  TheF > original results were generated with VMS 7.2-1, these with 7.3 (sameH > TCP/IP release, 5.1), which may account for some variation between theJ > two sets.  As emphasized in the WASD doco these results are *indicative* > only.  > ? >  C A C H E   D I S A B L E D        C A C H E   E N A B L E D 9 >      requests/second                    requests/second A >  Response Concurrent WASD OSU      Response Concurrent WASD OSU A >  0K       1           88   60      0K       1          283  213 A >  0K       10         111   67      0K       10         441  278 A >  64K      1           14   14      64K      1           82   34 A >  64K      10          33   23      64K      10          98   41  > D > Just by way of comparison with the previous results I reverted the8 > 'fileflags' parameter to 7 and obtained the following. >  >    C A C H E   E N A B L E D >        requests/second >  Response Concurrent WASD OSU  >  0K       1          270   56  >  0K       10         423   82  >  64K      1           78   21  >  64K      10          95   27  > I > These confirm Dave's analysis regarding the effect/circumvention of the  > bug. >  > David Jones wrote: > >  > > Mark Daniel wrote: > > >  > > > Can't resist ... > > > < > > >   http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/doc/htd/htd_1800.html > > - > > The first 2 tables on that web page show:  > > H > >     C A C H E   D I S A B L E D            C A C H E   E N A B L E DA > >         requests/second                        request/second O > > Response Concurrent WASD OSU Apache     Response Concurrent WASD OSU Apache K > > 0K       1          58   41  14         0K       1          301  46  15 K > > 0K       10         89   47  42         0K       10         382  64  21 K > > 64K      1          39   14  18         64K      1          83   18  13 K > > 64K      10         43   16  39         64K      10         98   21  31  > > N > > Try running the OSU test with fileflags set 2 it's pre-3.9 of 3 instead ofJ > > 7.  When bit 2 is set, the cache refresh logic includes a test againstI > > the file's expiration date field so that 'expired' files are given an Q > > effective refresh time of zero.  A cache entry refresh is nearly as expensive H > > as reading the file since the file has to be accessed to check for aR > > changed modification date.  Due to a bug in the code, files with no expirationJ > > date are treated as expired so you don't see much improvement from theS > > cache.  Keeping file flags at 3 skips the code path containg the bug so you get " > > full performance of the cache. > > @ > > David L. Jones               |      Phone:    (614) 292-69291 > > Ohio State University        |      Internet: P > > 140 W. 19th St. Rm. 231a     |               jonesd@er6s1.eng.ohio-state.edu> > > Columbus, OH 43210           |               vman+@osu.edu > > 5 > > Disclaimer: I'm looking for marbles all day long.  >  > --% > Non sinere illegitamus carborundum.    --  # Non sinere illegitamus carborundum.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:34:45 +0200  From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>; Subject: Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file ' Message-ID: <3B969A75.FB6CD42E@home.nl>   2 This can be a bit more complex than it looks like.I As you may have noticed C programs always produce Stream-LF files, unless  they use proper RMS file calls. I These Stream-LF files always have a maximum record length of 32676 bytes. G The reason for this is very simple, C does not write records in the RMS G sence of the word. In order to allow other languages to read C produced I files, Compaq/Digital did a little trick and came up with Stream-LF files H with the maximum allowed size for a RMS record, and that is 32676 bytes.J The actual record size (if there is one) can be 10 bytes, or maybe 100,000 bytes.  F The easiest way to get the real maximum record size is the very simpleH "Convert myfile.dat myfile.dat". With a dir/full of the output file, youG can determine the real maximum record size. If Convert can't handle the H file, because it encounters a record size in access of 32676 bytes, then you are in trouble ......n   Regards,   Dirk         David Spencer wrote:  @ > How about a timeout over the take-under of HP by Compaq for an > actual question :) >oI > I've got some files generated by a C program that are Stream_LF format.aI > I'd like to write a BASIC program to read them. I've considered severalr1 > options but with little success in any of them.r >lC > Is there a CONVERT/FDL that works? Or perhaps someone has a niftyrF > subroutine in C that I could call that would return the data line byA > line? (I'm not a C programmer.) Or another worthy suggestion ono > how I may solve my problem?  >S- > All of this is happening on VMS Alpha 7.2-1  >nD > Many thanks to you all, now back to the Fear and Loathing of HP... >r > -- Dave SpencerM   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:47:23 +0200e From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>; Subject: Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file ' Message-ID: <3B969D6A.708FFB4B@home.nl>a   David Spencer wrote:  I > In article <3b96213b$0$21924$6e365a64@newsreader02.highway.telekom.at>, 3 > Ren Schelbaum <rene.schelbaum@datakom.at> wrote:b >uK > > It should work with Basic, long as the records are not longer than 32k.n > >e
 > > Try this:  > >n< > >     open 'INPUT_FILE' for input as file #1%,           &M > >         access read,                                                    & H > >         organization undefined,                                    & > >         recordtype any	 > > loop:N > >     get #1%r# > >     move from #1%, A$ = recountI >A+ > I've tried that too. Here's more details:c >a > $ dir test.txt/fu  > Directory STUFF:[SPENCER]  >C6 > TEST.TXT;3                    File ID:  (21636,76,0)3 > Size:          317/350        Owner:    [SPENCER] $ > Created:    4-SEP-2001 21:46:20.84( > Revised:    4-SEP-2001 21:46:21.06 (1) > Expires:   <None specified>r! > Backup:    <No backup recorded>T > Effective: <None specified>I > Recording: <None specified>s  > File organization:  Sequential > Shelved state:      Online" > Caching attribute:  WritethroughI > File attributes:    Allocation: 350, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0,G > No version limitE > Record format:      Stream_LF, maximum 0 bytes, longest 32767 bytese6 > Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control > RMS attributes:     None > Journaling enabled: NoneC > File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RWED, World:RE  > Access Cntrl List:  None > Client attributes:  None >M" > Total of 1 file, 317/350 blocks. >V > $ type x.bas  >    OPEN "TEST.TXT" FOR INPUT & >      AS FILE #1 &a > ,    ORGANIZATION UNDEFINED &e > ,    RECORDTYPE ANY &e > ,    ACCESS READ & > ,    ALLOW NONEe >i >    GET #1e >    MOVE FROM #1, R$ = RECOUNTr >    R$ = TRM$(R$) >    PRINT LEN (R$) 
 >    PRINT R$n
 >    CLOSE #1o >    END >y	 > $ run x  > Record on file too bigE > On channel 1 for file STUFF:[SPENCER]TEST.TXT;3 at user PC 00000000-0 > 161905 byte record too large for user's buffer  <   ^^^^^^ There is your problem, 32676 byte is the maximum !!           >v
 > In module Xu > Symbolic stack dump follows.I >   image    module    routine             line      rel PC           absh > PC@ >                                             0 FFFFFFFF8085F5EC > FFFFFFFF8085F5EC@ >  DEC$BASRTL                                 0 0000000000010AE0 > 0000000000042AE0? > ----- above condition handler called with exception 001A84EC:e > Record on file too bigE > On channel 1 for file STUFF:[SPENCER]TEST.TXT;3 at user PC 00000000H0 > 161905 byte record too large for user's buffer  > ----- end of exception message@ >                                             0 FFFFFFFF83AF267C > FFFFFFFF83AF267C@ >  DEC$BASRTL                                 0 0000000000052CC4 > 0000000000084CC4@ >  DEC$BASRTL                                 0 00000000000424D4 > 00000000000744D4@ >  DEC$BASRTL                                 0 000000000004DCF4 > 000000000007FCF4@ >  X  X$MAIN  X$MAIN                          8 0000000000000094 > 0000000000020094@ >                                             0 FFFFFFFF83C533D4 > FFFFFFFF83C533D4 >e > -- Dave SpencerA   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 15:37:24 -0700h3 From: David Spencer <spencer@spaamfree.recneps.com>d; Subject: Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file-> Message-ID: <050920011537240886%spencer@spaamfree.recneps.com>  G In article <3B969A75.FB6CD42E@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:e  4 > This can be a bit more complex than it looks like.K > As you may have noticed C programs always produce Stream-LF files, unless ! > they use proper RMS file calls. K > These Stream-LF files always have a maximum record length of 32676 bytes.yI > The reason for this is very simple, C does not write records in the RMSiI > sence of the word. In order to allow other languages to read C producedpK > files, Compaq/Digital did a little trick and came up with Stream-LF filesdJ > with the maximum allowed size for a RMS record, and that is 32676 bytes.L > The actual record size (if there is one) can be 10 bytes, or maybe 100,000 > bytes. > H > The easiest way to get the real maximum record size is the very simpleJ > "Convert myfile.dat myfile.dat". With a dir/full of the output file, youI > can determine the real maximum record size. If Convert can't handle the J > file, because it encounters a record size in access of 32676 bytes, then > you are in trouble ......g   I *am* in trouble :)  G Perhaps some kind person who knows enough about C and BASIC could throwm6 together a short subroutine that has three parameters:   1) an open channel 2) a returned string! 3) a returned error code (if any)   H and I suppose there might need to be context variables thrown in too butF defining some space in the equivalent of a BASIC MAP could also do theD job. Surely this has happened before and somebody has already solved it...l   -- Dave Spencer    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 15:39:02 -0700 3 From: David Spencer <spencer@spaamfree.recneps.com> ; Subject: Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable filec> Message-ID: <050920011539026758%spencer@spaamfree.recneps.com>  G In article <3B969D6A.708FFB4B@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:p   > David Spencer wrote: > K > > In article <3b96213b$0$21924$6e365a64@newsreader02.highway.telekom.at>,05 > > Ren Schelbaum <rene.schelbaum@datakom.at> wrote:7 > >0M > > > It should work with Basic, long as the records are not longer than 32k.w > > >  > > > Try this:u > > >h> > > >     open 'INPUT_FILE' for input as file #1%,           &O > > >         access read,                                                    &6J > > >         organization undefined,                                    & > > >         recordtype any > > > loop:  > > >     get #1%e% > > >     move from #1%, A$ = recount  > > - > > I've tried that too. Here's more details:p > >i > > $ dir test.txt/fuv > > Directory STUFF:[SPENCER]d > >s8 > > TEST.TXT;3                    File ID:  (21636,76,0)5 > > Size:          317/350        Owner:    [SPENCER]f& > > Created:    4-SEP-2001 21:46:20.84* > > Revised:    4-SEP-2001 21:46:21.06 (1) > > Expires:   <None specified>n# > > Backup:    <No backup recorded>r > > Effective: <None specified>  > > Recording: <None specified>m" > > File organization:  Sequential > > Shelved state:      Online$ > > Caching attribute:  WritethroughK > > File attributes:    Allocation: 350, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0,0 > > No version limitG > > Record format:      Stream_LF, maximum 0 bytes, longest 32767 bytese8 > > Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control > > RMS attributes:     None > > Journaling enabled: NoneE > > File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RWED, World:REu > > Access Cntrl List:  None > > Client attributes:  None > > $ > > Total of 1 file, 317/350 blocks. > >l > > $ type x.bas" > >    OPEN "TEST.TXT" FOR INPUT & > >      AS FILE #1 &e! > > ,    ORGANIZATION UNDEFINED &  > > ,    RECORDTYPE ANY &  > > ,    ACCESS READ & > > ,    ALLOW NONE  > > 
 > >    GET #1o! > >    MOVE FROM #1, R$ = RECOUNTl > >    R$ = TRM$(R$) > >    PRINT LEN (R$)  > >    PRINT R$C > >    CLOSE #1)
 > >    END > >n > > $ run xr > > Record on file too bigG > > On channel 1 for file STUFF:[SPENCER]TEST.TXT;3 at user PC 00000000 2 > > 161905 byte record too large for user's buffer > > >   ^^^^^^ There is your problem, 32676 byte is the maximum !!  C Yep - looks more and more like I need a C subroutine to read this C0" generated file... Any volunteers??   -- Dave Spencer3   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 21:46:35 -050061 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ; Subject: Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable file ' Message-ID: <3B96E38B.415B04C8@fsi.net>o   David Spencer wrote: > @ > How about a timeout over the take-under of HP by Compaq for an > actual question :) > I > I've got some files generated by a C program that are Stream_LF format. I > I'd like to write a BASIC program to read them. I've considered several 1 > options but with little success in any of them.  > C > Is there a CONVERT/FDL that works? Or perhaps someone has a nifty F > subroutine in C that I could call that would return the data line byA > line? (I'm not a C programmer.) Or another worthy suggestion onl > how I may solve my problem?h > - > All of this is happening on VMS Alpha 7.2-1  > D > Many thanks to you all, now back to the Fear and Loathing of HP...  B Download http://www.djesys.com/freeware/vms/ppf012.zip and look atF PPF.BAS (executor portion of my Port-Print Facility (PPF) for use with VTs and compatible emulators).  B This seems to work for all known variants of record attributes andD record formats, but I've been wrong before... It can't predict everyB possible combination of embedded and implied carriage control in aH single file, but it should work with Stream, Stream_CR or Stream_LF just fine within the known limits.    -- a David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsc http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/a   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 20:51:03 -0700e3 From: David Spencer <spencer@spaamfree.recneps.com>i; Subject: Re: Converting a stream_lf file to a variable filed> Message-ID: <050920012051030018%spencer@spaamfree.recneps.com>  9 In article <3B96E38B.415B04C8@fsi.net>, David J. Dachteram <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:  K > > I've got some files generated by a C program that are Stream_LF format. K > > I'd like to write a BASIC program to read them. I've considered several93 > > options but with little success in any of them.  > D > Download http://www.djesys.com/freeware/vms/ppf012.zip and look atH > PPF.BAS (executor portion of my Port-Print Facility (PPF) for use with  > VTs and compatible emulators). > D > This seems to work for all known variants of record attributes andF > record formats, but I've been wrong before... It can't predict everyD > possible combination of embedded and implied carriage control in aJ > single file, but it should work with Stream, Stream_CR or Stream_LF just > fine within the known limits.   C Thanks Dave but I've already tried that. With larger files (which I B unfortunately have to deal with) it overwhelms the buffer. I'm nowE convinced that I need a C subroutine to process the file. I'm lookingE9 for somebody who can hack one for me, as I'm no C jockey.    -- Dave Spencer    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:19:02 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>n- Subject: Re: DCL command file to requeue jobsg' Message-ID: <3B96C0F6.EC33C93A@fsi.net>   ! norm.raphael@jamesbury.com wrote:b > @ > This is from the download, and appears to be newer (,9/92) butF > the one below it is  an older one I already had that appears to have > additions for V6:mM > > $!      V6      Parse assuming VMS 6.x or later SHOW QUEUE listing formateA > > $!              (correction for DESCRIPTION field shift 1/99)oN > > $!         (default is to look at the running system to determine version) > so I am not sure what's what.i > 0 > Also does anything need to be modified for V7?  F Well, I'd recommed against relying on a specific format for the outputE of a DCL command. F$GETQUI() is rather a beast, but once tamed, it is  *VERY* useful!   -- B David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/R   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 22:42:54 -03001 From: "Valdemir J. Santos" <valdemir-@uol.com.br>  Subject: DCL doubts...< Message-ID: <001401c13675$40007590$152b90c8@unipobjetivo.br>  8 I'd like create a DCL procedure to data entry like this:    )  Please enter your name: ________________     @  My question: How can I put a underline in DCL ? It's possible ?       Thank's in advance...h   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 22:04:44 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: DCL doubts...' Message-ID: <3B96E7CC.60A5D78D@fsi.net>    "Valdemir J. Santos" wrote:  > : > I'd like create a DCL procedure to data entry like this: > + >  Please enter your name: ________________i > B >  My question: How can I put a underline in DCL ? It's possible ?  	 Try this:    $ UNDLN = "________________" $ ULLEN = F$LENGTH( UNDLN )  $ CTRLH[0,8]=8' $ BKSPC = F$FAO( "!''ULLEN'*''CTRLH'" ) 4 $ PRMPT = "Please enter your name: " + UNDLN + BKSPC* $ READ SYS$COMMAND UNAME/PROMPT="''PRMPT'"  ) Tested on OpenVMS Alpha V7.2, no patches.   E Note, however, that this will not prevent the user from entering moreA, characters than the length of the underline.   -- K David J. Dachtera0 dba DJE SystemsK http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/1   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:15:57 GMT3& From: GreyCloud <drholland10@home.com>) Subject: Re: Digital and Alpha to Survivee( Message-ID: <3B96CF15.3F16A978@home.com>   Burnie M wrote:   B > On Wed, 05 Sep 2001 01:25:28 GMT, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU0 > ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") wrote: >fT > >In article <3B957D1B.DA10D654@home.com>, GreyCloud <drholland10@home.com> writes: > >>Alan Greig wrote:s > >> > >>> GreyCloud wrote: > >>>t > >>> >s > >>> >e- > >>> > How much do you know about Capellas??oC > >>> > He is going to be the president and CEO of this new merger.  > >>> V > >>> No he isn't. He will be president but the HP CEO will be the CEO of the combined > >>> company called HP. > >>>o > >>> -- > >>> Alan Greig > >>S > >>Maybe the gal on FoxNews and also the ones at TechTv have gotten it wrong then.  > >SQ > >Maybe they have.  (CNN and both the Compaq and HP websites have the Fiorina as  > >CEO, Capellas as Pres info.)e > > 
 > >-- Alan > >4 >0D > Compaq staff need to 'feel' for a time that Compaq has some say so > Capellas is in for a while.  > 8 > My money is on 6 months till the golden handshake tho.  Q That's about what I give too.... I expect Carly to give Capellas the Golden Bone.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 21:26:23 -0500e1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>-) Subject: Re: Digital and Alpha to Surviven' Message-ID: <3B96DECF.A85DB3D4@fsi.net>.   GreyCloud wrote: >  > Burnie M wrote:  > D > > On Wed, 05 Sep 2001 01:25:28 GMT, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU2 > > ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") wrote: > >6V > > >In article <3B957D1B.DA10D654@home.com>, GreyCloud <drholland10@home.com> writes: > > >>Alan Greig wrote:  > > >> > > >>> GreyCloud wrote: > > >>> 	 > > >>> >m	 > > >>> > / > > >>> > How much do you know about Capellas??eE > > >>> > He is going to be the president and CEO of this new merger.y > > >>> X > > >>> No he isn't. He will be president but the HP CEO will be the CEO of the combined > > >>> company called HP. > > >>>d
 > > >>> -- > > >>> Alan Greig > > >>U > > >>Maybe the gal on FoxNews and also the ones at TechTv have gotten it wrong then.m > > >rS > > >Maybe they have.  (CNN and both the Compaq and HP websites have the Fiorina as#! > > >CEO, Capellas as Pres info.)N > > >  > > >-- Alan > > >  > >IF > > Compaq staff need to 'feel' for a time that Compaq has some say so > > Capellas is in for a while.b > > : > > My money is on 6 months till the golden handshake tho. > S > That's about what I give too.... I expect Carly to give Capellas the Golden Bone.o  3 ...or perhaps vice-versa, if you take my meaning...    -- d David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 15:14:25 -0700d8 From: michaelandbarbarayoung@hotmail.com (Michael Young)Y Subject: Re: dir help ---%LIBRAR-F-OPENIN, error opening  SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]NCS$LIBRARY.:= Message-ID: <c59f611e.0109051414.766fbe87@posting.google.com>   Z Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@gmx.ch> wrote in message news:<3B95116A.CFDD1AD0@gmx.ch>... > Michael Young wrote: >  > > $ TYPE PTF.COM > > !PTF.COM ->PURGE TEMP FILES & > > !CLEANS UP ROUTINELY UPDATED FILES > > !a > > $ON WARNING THEN EXITe6 > > $DIR TEMP.TXT, CUSTOMERS.TXT, SUPPLIERS.TXT, *.COM > > $PURGE TEMP.TXT  > > $PURGE CUSTOMERS.TXT > > $PURGE SUPPLIERS.TXT > > $PURGE *.COM6 > > $DIR TEMP.TXT, CUSTOMERS.TXT, SUPPLIERS.TXT, *.COM > > $  > > $y > > $m
 > > $ @PTF > > ) > > Directory ESONIC$DKB200:[WPG_MICHAEL]  > > = > > TEMP.TXT;29         CUSTOMERS.TXT;106   CUSTOMERS.TXT;105  > > SUPPLIERS.TXT;21J > > SUPPLIERS.TXT;20    2.COM;12            DEFKEYS.COM;11      FIND.COM;43 > > PR.COM;11           PTF.COM;4           X.COM;2p > >  > > Total of 11 files.H > > %LIBRAR-F-OPENIN, error opening SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]NCS$LIBRARY.NLB;1 > > as inputC > > -RMS-E-PRV, insufficient privilege or file protection violatione > > $d >  > A few comments:o > J > 1. All HP OpenVMS DCL command procedure lines should start with a dollar > sign, even commented lines.  > > > 2. Obviously you have some DCL verbs redefined, as the PURGE6 > demonstrates (/KEEP=2 defined within the PURGE verb) > @ > 3. May I suggest you give understandable names to your command+ > procedures instead of PTF, 2, X, PR etc.?p > % > Could you post a $ show symbol DIR?j >  > D.  D Sure enough, show symbol showed that I'd used PURGE as the name of a variableC when I'd meant to use P1 in the 2.com another file I'd ran earlier.>  A I've taken your advice and renamed many of my files, except 2.coms which I runeD every time I login.  I can only access the dcl command line by usingD spawn from the mail prompt.  I'm hooked ON MAIL>spawn @2 as the 2 is on the same key as the @.a  E Yes, I'd tried using a login.com file to do the same thing but when IpC had one I would log in directly to the $ prompt and could not startPD the software that I use to do my work which normally comes up when I login.  E I'm sure there is a fix for this but I can live without as I only usee= the command line to update and search through a contact list.a   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 15:17:21 -0700t8 From: michaelandbarbarayoung@hotmail.com (Michael Young)Y Subject: Re: dir help ---%LIBRAR-F-OPENIN, error opening  SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]NCS$LIBRARY.l= Message-ID: <c59f611e.0109051417.5bdf767e@posting.google.com>e  f Duncan Brown <brown_du@eisner.decus.org> wrote in message news:<3B951865.D9831006@eisner.decus.org>... > Didier Morandi wrote:I > >  > > Michael Young wrote: > >  > > > $ TYPE PTF.COM! > > > !PTF.COM ->PURGE TEMP FILES1( > > > !CLEANS UP ROUTINELY UPDATED FILES > > > !. > > > $ON WARNING THEN EXIT:8 > > > $DIR TEMP.TXT, CUSTOMERS.TXT, SUPPLIERS.TXT, *.COM > > > $PURGE TEMP.TXTo > > > $PURGE CUSTOMERS.TXT > > > $PURGE SUPPLIERS.TXT > > > $PURGE *.COM8 > > > $DIR TEMP.TXT, CUSTOMERS.TXT, SUPPLIERS.TXT, *.COM > > > $l > > > $  > > > $a > > > $ @PTF > > >n+ > > > Directory ESONIC$DKB200:[WPG_MICHAEL]g > > >x? > > > TEMP.TXT;29         CUSTOMERS.TXT;106   CUSTOMERS.TXT;105t > > > SUPPLIERS.TXT;21L > > > SUPPLIERS.TXT;20    2.COM;12            DEFKEYS.COM;11      FIND.COM;45 > > > PR.COM;11           PTF.COM;4           X.COM;2  > > >d > > > Total of 11 files.J > > > %LIBRAR-F-OPENIN, error opening SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]NCS$LIBRARY.NLB;1 > > > as inputE > > > -RMS-E-PRV, insufficient privilege or file protection violationV > > > $u > >  > > A few comments:r > > L > > 1. All HP OpenVMS DCL command procedure lines should start with a dollar > > sign, even commented lines.o > > @ > > 2. Obviously you have some DCL verbs redefined, as the PURGE8 > > demonstrates (/KEEP=2 defined within the PURGE verb) > > B > > 3. May I suggest you give understandable names to your command- > > procedures instead of PTF, 2, X, PR etc.?  > > ' > > Could you post a $ show symbol DIR?r > E > I believe   $ show symbol purge    will be more enlightening.  If ILF > understand his output above, it does the DIR just fine but PURGE forE > some reason is trying to access the NCS library (whatever that is.)a >  > Duncan  N Bang on Duncan. I've fixed this now.  I'd used PURGE as the name of a variableO when I'd meant to use P1 in another file I'd ran earlier.  Shame on me.  Thanksd   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:40:01 GMT ) From: rob.buxton@wcc.govt.nz (Rob Buxton) 1 Subject: Re: DSN now officially retired in the UK 0 Message-ID: <3b96d240.20176482@news.wcc.govt.nz>   Dunno, ]  @ But here in NZ I use the Web Based package that gives me similar functionality.E I can certainly look at the ITS database, log calls and check on call 	 progress.h  F I access it from an NT box based WWW browser, but I would have thought# any WWW browser would allow access.   & I connect through to Compaq in Aussie.  E I don't use it to download patches as there's plenty of other avenuesf	 for that.n   Rob.  C On Wed, 05 Sep 2001 12:43:48 +0100, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>- wrote:   >hE >Well we tried to connect to DSN today and got the message that as ofuC >Aug 16th DSN was no longer supported but would remain online for a9G >"few days" longer. However all of the databases apart from eco-summaryi >have gone.A >TF >So Compaq have shut the service down *before* the replacement (NT boxF >communicating over the Internet) has even been installed. We've had a' >call form an engineer but no date yet.> >r6 >What happens if you try to connect to DSN in  the US? >--d >Alann   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:57:20 -0500i1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>b$ Subject: Re: ed/edt corrupting files' Message-ID: <3B96C9F0.3F720FBF@fsi.net>d   John Forkosh wrote:  > @ > Just installed vms7.2 on a vs4000/60 and started using ed/edt.I > Files are created as variable length, max 255, cr/lf (as per dir/full).   C I don't understand that. Is the file being listed as Record format:aD Stream, or Record format: Variable with Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control?  A > But on re-editing, screen displays file, but edt's bound cursorn  < I don't find SET CURSOR BOUND in the line-mode HELP for EDT.  B > sees an eol in the middle (not exact middle) of displayed lines.  E Can you define "eol"? Do you mean that a <CR><LF> pair appears in them middle of the line?   D > Trying to edit further loses the text past eol, and messes up file/ > in various and sundry other complicated ways.u  F Sorry, you'll have to be a bit more specific. Anything you can post byB cut-and-paste would be a large help here. (CTRL+W will refresh the screen in Change mode, BTW.)  ? >      Without /edt, everything works fine and dandy, but files.- > are created with a max 0 (rather than 255).   H Not usually a problem, unless some program really "breaks the rules" and takes things too literally.?   >  So I tried dumping @ > files and interpreting the 2-byte counts that I think are used= > in this format.  But I couldn't decipher dump definitively.C   That's O.k. Takes practice...n  B >      What's going on???  And if it is a file attributes problem,7 > how can I change the default format saved by ed/edt?    
 You don't.   > Would stream/lf  > be the best for text files?h  4 Not really. SEQ/VAR would be the only choice, AFAIK.  > EDT was supposedly made obsolete by TPU, but I've yet to see aG sufficiently faithful TPU-based EDT emulator for my needs. TPU has some F nasty bahaviors, also, that have caused me big problems (and much lost sleep) in the past.r  H EDT can be used in batch, also, where TPU cannot without a great deal of programming and effort, IMO.   -- i David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/h   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:15:33 -0500o1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ! Subject: Re: EV7 will never ship?f' Message-ID: <3B96C025.2267D829@fsi.net>n   Roger Barnett wrote: > 7 > In article <3B8CD0E2.153D8125@virgin.net>, Alan Greig  > <a.greig@virgin.net> writes- > >-R > >I can at least confirm that the Compaq IA64 boxes intended to ship in 2004/2005 > >willCP > >have Galaxy support features according to current customer presentations. The	 > >slidesaR > >show one system running Windows-64, VMS, Linux, and Tru64. Although exactly why > >youR > >would want to run Linux, and Tru64 at the same time is a puzzle as they will be	 > >binaryl > >compatible. > J > I thought that Microsoft's OEM licence conditions prevent companies likeH > Compaq from providing Windows on multiple operating system platforms ?  < How do you "poison" a system so it can't run Linux? ...*BSD?  E Same line of thinking. By M$'s line of thought, Linux and *BSD shoulddE get a cut of every machine sold that might possibly run one of those.o   -- A David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsd http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 15:24:28 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>e) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itanium:, Message-ID: <3B967BEA.1083783D@videotron.ca>   "Main, Kerry" wrote:K > I suspect the recent Intel press releases will show that the Compaq AlphauK > folks now working at Intel will have a fair amount of influence on futurei > directions for IPF.a  M Be realistic. The digital engineers haven't had enough time to make an impactaK yet. However, remember that Intel probably had access (legit or not) to all:K the technologies, and now that they have the legal rights to them, they cane start to announce these things.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:12:42 -0500e1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>,) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about ItaniumO' Message-ID: <3B96BF7A.218D81CA@fsi.net>E   JF Mezei wrote:N >  > "Main, Kerry" wrote:M > > I suspect the recent Intel press releases will show that the Compaq Alpha M > > folks now working at Intel will have a fair amount of influence on future  > > directions for IPF.o > O > Be realistic. The digital engineers haven't had enough time to make an impactSM > yet. However, remember that Intel probably had access (legit or not) to all'M > the technologies, and now that they have the legal rights to them, they can ! > start to announce these things.s  * To quote (more or less) from Tony Robbins:  ? What people CAN do is virtually unlimited. What they WILL do is  frequently disappointing.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:45:48 -0500 . From: Lyndon Bartels <lbartels@pressenter.com>) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumd. Message-ID: <3B9680EC.10CDD794@pressenter.com>   Bill Todd wrote: > 0 > "Don Sykes" <don@alphase.com> wrote in message' > news:3B9652E3.C1094E48@alphase.com...  > > 8 > > Thank you for ending this thread on a positive note. > G > (Now you *know* that's not going to get past any realist out here...)0 > H > Intel may or may not 'Alphabetize' Itanic.  If they do, it will take 5I > years, minimum, to get something like an OOO SMT Itanic onto the street0F > (i.e., it'll lag the time-line Alpha would have had by 2 - 3 years). > H > But the question is, will they be motivated to make that effort?  ThatK > pretty much depends on how hard Power4 pushes them, now that Alpha is offa > the table. > L > In any case, a lot can happen, and a lot of ground be lost to competition,7 > in 5 years.  Not that 'positive' a prospect, I'd say.f >  > - bill >     C Some of my thoughts are.... What does Intel have to loose by simplyeF re-labeling current Alphas, or what would have been soon-to-be alphas.F Like I said, their 64 bit processors aren't out there by the millions,G and all they'd have to do is say, "This next generation chip is TOTALLY G different. You'll have to port you applications/Operating systems to itoH now, instead of moving to what we've been giving you." If they did that,2 I'd bet they'd have hardware out there next year.   D Also, with the recent influx of Alpha engineers, you can bet in someH think tank at Intel they're weighing precisely that possibility. They're debating...   E 1. Take current Itanium, and get input from the alpha team to make ith better.   8 2. Start something totally new with our combined forces.  A 3. Trash Itanium and rebadge alpha, a proven, stable, mature CPU.,  E I'm not the smartest man in the world, but it's clear to me which onelG would get onto the market and start producing profits first. Profits, It) might add, that Intel would like to have.     A Just my 2.0004587 cents worth, (as calculated by the flawed intel  processor.)l     --  G My opinions are mine and mine alone. They seldom align with those of myn	 employer.t    H The only good thing about putting the cart before the horse is you don't have to look at the horse's butt.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 22:05:21 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>e) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniuml( Message-ID: <9n6lj8$5fk$1@pyrite.mv.net>  ; "Lyndon Bartels" <lbartels@pressenter.com> wrote in messagea( news:3B9680EC.10CDD794@pressenter.com...   ...j  E > Some of my thoughts are.... What does Intel have to loose by simply0H > re-labeling current Alphas, or what would have been soon-to-be alphas.  K Face.  Credibility with partners who have spent *years* preparing their own I products for the Itanium architecture (HP, for example, would likely be a0L bit miffed, but so would a whole bunch of smaller fish who've been preparingL compatible board components, etc.).  Monopoly power (no one else can legallyA produce Itaniums or copies thereof, whereas Compaq owns the Alpha H architecture, Samsung shares the right to develop it, and IBM is anotherJ production source:  likely good for customers, but likely not perceived asH good for Intel).  Time (you clearly haven't a clue what it takes to turnG even a fully-completed design into shippable hardware if you think theyiI could do so in a year - unless you're suggesting that they simply buy EV7tI masks from Compaq and effectively become another EV7 production partner):6L even *Compaq* doesn't think they can ship EV7 in a year, and they've alreadyE got running silicon.  I'm sure there's a lot more, but why waste time H conjuring it up when the above is so much more than a sufficient answer?  H > Like I said, their 64 bit processors aren't out there by the millions,I > and all they'd have to do is say, "This next generation chip is TOTALLYbI > different. You'll have to port you applications/Operating systems to itbJ > now, instead of moving to what we've been giving you." If they did that,3 > I'd bet they'd have hardware out there next year.a >iF > Also, with the recent influx of Alpha engineers, you can bet in someJ > think tank at Intel they're weighing precisely that possibility. They're
 > debating...W  I Bullshit.  A few of the Alpha immigrants might be thinking such thoughts, L but the only thing Intel is concentrating on is how to make Itanium prevail.  L If, down the road, Power4 and Hammer whup their asses sufficiently, *and* ifL the Alpha team has as much difficulty as seems likely getting Itanium workedK around into something more competitive, *then* they might dust off EV8 as a 3 last resort (but by then it'll likely be too late).a  I I don't like Intel as a company, but nothing would please me more than toyK see them replace Itanium with Alpha and succeed wildly with it (and I thinkeI they could if they did).  But it just ain't gonna happen unless something G forces it to happen, and as long as the pundits continue to assume thatJI Itanium will inevitably prevail what possible reason would Intel have forgJ scrapping Itanium (hint:  certainly not *just* because it's a lousy idea)?   > G > 1. Take current Itanium, and get input from the alpha team to make ite	 > better.u  L That will definitely happen.  But the most optimistic estimate would be thatL some of EV7's on-chip glue for memory and SMP would appear in 2005, and thenI *maybe* some OOO SMT features in 2006 - and only if Power4 is enough of aDL threat to make them hurry (otherwise, they'll just take their time and tweakI it around the edges for as long as they can get away with doing so:  thatA+ sucker will be *hard* to change radically).S   > : > 2. Start something totally new with our combined forces.  I Not a chance:  their plate's more than full with Itanium plus keeping AMDOG from kicking IA32 sand in their faces more than it already is (plus, of D course, the considerable other development Intel engages in for bothH processor and non-processor chips).  If there's one thing Itanium shouldF have taught Intel over the past 7 years, it's not to embark lightly on 'something totally new'.   > C > 3. Trash Itanium and rebadge alpha, a proven, stable, mature CPU.   L Not a chance:  Intel's management is almost certainly incapable of believingK that Itanium could fail in the market in the absence of compelling evidenceoG to that effect (the exact opposite of Compaq's management, which provedtI incapable of believing that Alpha could succeed in the market even in the , face of compelling evidence to that effect).   >tG > I'm not the smartest man in the world, but it's clear to me which onevI > would get onto the market and start producing profits first. Profits, IP+ > might add, that Intel would like to have.l  L If you chose anything but (1), I'll agree whole-heartedly with your startingL phrase 3 lines above.  Merced, uninspiring though it may be, is *already* onG the market, and within a year McKinley will be as well.  They're hardly K leadership products, but plenty adequate to generate profit - especially iflG the industry can continue to be horn-swoggled into believing that their L ascendancy is inevitable, and so far Intel continues to succeed in doing so.   - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 23:05:59 -0500p+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)s) Subject: Re: Feeling Better about Itaniumn3 Message-ID: <9c7TGNgXbR4q@eisner.encompasserve.org>c  [ In article <3B96BF7A.218D81CA@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > JF Mezei wrote:- >> - >> "Main, Kerry" wrote:1N >> > I suspect the recent Intel press releases will show that the Compaq AlphaN >> > folks now working at Intel will have a fair amount of influence on future >> > directions for IPF. >> 1P >> Be realistic. The digital engineers haven't had enough time to make an impactN >> yet. However, remember that Intel probably had access (legit or not) to allN >> the technologies, and now that they have the legal rights to them, they can" >> start to announce these things. > , > To quote (more or less) from Tony Robbins: > A > What people CAN do is virtually unlimited. What they WILL do is, > frequently disappointing.o >   7 	I can do ALL things through Christ who strengthens me.    		Phillipians 4:13   				Rob,   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 05:06:47 GMT * From: cjt & trefoil <cheljuba@prodigy.net> Subject: Here's your answer + Message-ID: <3B970469.98F44C88@prodigy.net>T  ) (almost) straight from the horse's mouth:   O http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-7071077.html?tag=pt.msnbc.feed..ne_7071077M   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:52:29 -0500.. From: Lyndon Bartels <lbartels@pressenter.com>0 Subject: Re: How to backup a directory structure. Message-ID: <3B96827D.2FCC123D@pressenter.com>   Lyndon Bartels wrote:  > H > I want to do a disk-to-disk backup. But I don't want the disks, I want; > to copy over the directory and sub-directory structure...d >  > Any good ways of doing that? >  > TiaD >  > Lyndon    B I'm sorry about my previous posting. In my verve to post, I didn't thoroughly proof-read.    D What I meant was, I want to replicate the directory structure of one1 disk onto another. I don't want the files in eachoG directory/sub-directory (see "I don't want the disks" above. oops) Juste the directory tree.I   I hope that makes more sense.v  G The contents of the directories are short term, and can be lost, but ifsE the disk were to be lost, or moved, or whatever, all the directories, A and subdirectories need to be present for the application to workn@ correctly..... So I really only need to be able to replicate the directory structure.  
 Any thoughts?-     Thanks in Advance,   Lyndon   -- MG My opinions are mine and mine alone. They seldom align with those of myc	 employer.e    H The only good thing about putting the cart before the horse is you don't have to look at the horse's butt.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 21:38:47 -0500T1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>h0 Subject: Re: How to backup a directory structure' Message-ID: <3B96E1B7.ACCBE73C@fsi.net>    Lyndon Bartels wrote:  >  > Lyndon Bartels wrote:A > >.J > > I want to do a disk-to-disk backup. But I don't want the disks, I want= > > to copy over the directory and sub-directory structure...G > ><  > > Any good ways of doing that? > >l > > Tiad > >o
 > > Lyndon > D > I'm sorry about my previous posting. In my verve to post, I didn't > thoroughly proof-read. > F > What I meant was, I want to replicate the directory structure of one3 > disk onto another. I don't want the files in eachrI > directory/sub-directory (see "I don't want the disks" above. oops) Justt > the directory tree.e >  > I hope that makes more sense.r > I > The contents of the directories are short term, and can be lost, but if G > the disk were to be lost, or moved, or whatever, all the directories,1C > and subdirectories need to be present for the application to workuB > correctly..... So I really only need to be able to replicate the > directory structure. >  > Any thoughts?i  E Well, yeah, actually BACKUP might do that, but to try it, ya gotta doa the unthinkable:  7 $ BACKUP ddcu:[000000...]*.*/EXCLUDE=[000000...]*.*;* -a# ddcu:[000000...]*.*/BY_OWN=ORIGINALR   I've found thate  D $ BACKUP SYS$SYSDEVICE:[SYS0...]*.*;*/EXC=[SYS0.SYSCOMMON...]*.*;* - saveset_filespec/SAVE   D ...produces some interesting results. Try it - you may be surprised.  = I regret I don't have what I need here to try it out for you.s  G If you only need to do it once, let BACKUP copy the files, then do thisi to the target disk:   , $ DELETE ddcu:[000000...]*.*;*/EXCLUDE=*.DIR  $ Another possible variation might be:  ; $ BACKUP ddcu:[000000...]*.DIR/EXCLUDE=[000000]000000.DIR -n# ddcu:[000000...]*.*/BY_OWN=ORIGINAL,  # Dunno. One of these oughtta work...    -- g David J. Dachterau dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 14:23:54 -05000+ From: kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)," Subject: Re: HP and Compaq merging3 Message-ID: <7HwqN9vZIW6u@eisner.encompasserve.org>   t In article <9EDE7C2A76BCA52A.92C3B7100E4523EA.598857E9414E21D0@lp.airnews.net>, "Hal Kuff" <kuff@tessco.com> writes: > H >     This is just Compaqs' way of increasing the attendance at CETS2001 >n8 > "Andrew Robert" <arobert@townisp.com> wrote in message& > news:3B949D93.9020608@townisp.com...? >> The morning news just stated that HP and Compaq are merging.e >>B >> Does anyone know details on this and what it will mean for VMS? >>  H When I heard the announcement I called to see if I could cancel and get F my money back.  The answer was no.  If I weren't locked into going for$ fiscal reasons, I wouldn't go now.    G How relevant can any of the sessions regarding where CPQ is going with hE the IA64, why they summarily terminated Alpha, or any of their other  F spin fests, be if CPQ will cease to exist, soon?  CPQ had credibility H problems previously, this additional sudden announcement doesn't improve that in the least.  E One thing to be said for DELL/IA32/NT and Sun/Sparc/Sloaris; they maya0 be crap, be they are consistent and stable crap.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:45:45 GMTn= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)a" Subject: Re: HP and Compaq merging0 Message-ID: <00A019AA.49FE9936@SendSpamHere.ORG>  a In article <7HwqN9vZIW6u@eisner.encompasserve.org>, kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt) writes:cu >In article <9EDE7C2A76BCA52A.92C3B7100E4523EA.598857E9414E21D0@lp.airnews.net>, "Hal Kuff" <kuff@tessco.com> writes:e >> yI >>     This is just Compaqs' way of increasing the attendance at CETS2001u >>9 >> "Andrew Robert" <arobert@townisp.com> wrote in messageh' >> news:3B949D93.9020608@townisp.com... @ >>> The morning news just stated that HP and Compaq are merging. >>>rC >>> Does anyone know details on this and what it will mean for VMS?r >>>n > I >When I heard the announcement I called to see if I could cancel and get sG >my money back.  The answer was no.  If I weren't locked into going foro% >fiscal reasons, I wouldn't go now.  J >yH >How relevant can any of the sessions regarding where CPQ is going with F >the IA64, why they summarily terminated Alpha, or any of their other G >spin fests, be if CPQ will cease to exist, soon?  CPQ had credibility iI >problems previously, this additional sudden announcement doesn't improve7 >that in the least.n  ) Or to make a parody of a Law(lie)er joke:   4 Q: How can you tell when Compaq management is lying? A: When their lips are moving.  I I am looking forward to what may be the last and final CETS/DECUS only to J see the good friends there that I've made over the past decade and a half;I not because I may see or hear anything of any significance or permanence.    --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMr             J   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbes:   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Sep 2001 04:42:58 GMTf3 From: vance@alumni.caltech.edu (Vance R. Haemmerle)t" Subject: Re: HP and Compaq merging, Message-ID: <9n6usi$jl3@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  3 In article <7HwqN9vZIW6u@eisner.encompasserve.org>,t, Marty Kuhrt <kuhrt@encompasserve.org> wrote: >oF >One thing to be said for DELL/IA32/NT and Sun/Sparc/Sloaris; they may1 >be crap, be they are consistent and stable crap.   6   Do you think that could be a basis for a merger? ;-)   -- Vance Haemmerle  vance@alumni.caltech.edu   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:35:08 -0500s1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>a Subject: Re: HP buying Compaq?' Message-ID: <3B96C4BC.1532A0D5@fsi.net>    WILLIAM WEBB wrote:  > 3 > One might be more careful if it was called HCl...a  ? ...as if some posts here aren't already sufficiently caustic...-   -- - David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systems0 http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 20:44:30 -0400) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>t Subject: Re: HP buying Compaq?; Message-ID: <_Azl7.16248$A24.2545357@news20.bellglobal.com>h  H This might not be all bad. Although HP is not the garage company it onceG was, I've always thought of the "garage boys" and Ken Olsen in the sameiL "techie pioneering" manor. Maybe the grandkids of the "garage boys" will seeH the same beauty in OpenVMS and Tru64 that I do. They've got to do betterL than the PeeCee weenies that ran Compaq (provided Capellas keeps his fingersG out of things at HP and lets the engineering folk do their thing). Hey,e8 maybe HP will decide not to kill StorageWorks after all.  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,b Ontario, Canada.! http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/t@ http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/compaq_memorial_site.html   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 16:05:31 -0400l# From: Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu>- Subject: Re: HP OpenVMS IPFr+ Message-ID: <3B96858B.4057807F@hsc.vcu.edu>l   ??? what's a ipf???h   Jimd   "Alan B." wrote: > # > Oh my God!...it has just sunk in.Y   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 22:08:26 +0100o+ From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org>h Subject: Re: HP OpenVMS IPFh' Message-ID: <3B96944A.291DD91F@iee.org>o   Itanium Processor Family.l   Jim Agnew wrote: >  > ??? what's a ipf???a >  > Jimy >  > "Alan B." wrote: > >o% > > Oh my God!...it has just sunk in.T   -- r   ---------------t- Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.org    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 16:50:18 -0400  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>
 Subject: Huh?e5 Message-ID: <1010905164743.4439A-100000@Ives.egh.com>'  ' Just received this about 2 minutes ago:e  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 15:32:02 -0500# From: Encompass <Encompass@SBA.COM> # To: "'john@egh.com'" <john@egh.com>06 Subject: Boston Technology Day by Compaq and Encompass  
 Dear John,  C Mark your Calendars - Boston Technology Day by Compaq and Encompassh  ( Compaq Strategic Update on Alpha/Itanium- StorageWorks Current Offerings and Technologyy  SANs Technology & Customer Panel' 512 Township Line Road, 3 Valley Square-
 Blue Bell, PA, Thursday, August 16th, 2001r 9:30 am - 4:00 pml  E Encompass, the evolution of the DECUS US Chapter, and Compaq ComputerDK Corporation cordially invite you to join us on Thursday, August 16th, for aw  free all-day technical exchange.  C * Rich Colarusso -- Compaq Strategic Directions (NDA form Required)d= * Robb Macomber - StorageWorks Current Offerings & Technologys! * Brian Allison - SANs TechnologyeE * SANs Customer Panel - 3 Encompass members discuss their experiencesp= * Compaq Demo center -- See the latest technologies in actionr  a [...]o   -----------------------d   What's wrong with this picture?l  @ (P.S.  I checked the full headers... it was mailed today, hasn't0 been sitting in some email limbo for 2-3 weeks.)   -- s John Santose Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 16:17:07 -0500n- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: Huh?o3 Message-ID: <JE4u1YBMdHcc@eisner.encompasserve.org>   X In article <1010905164743.4439A-100000@Ives.egh.com>, John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> writes: > ) > Just received this about 2 minutes ago:g > & > Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 15:32:02 -0500% > From: Encompass <Encompass@SBA.COM>o% > To: "'john@egh.com'" <john@egh.com>'8 > Subject: Boston Technology Day by Compaq and Encompass  * > Compaq Strategic Update on Alpha/Itanium/ > StorageWorks Current Offerings and Technologye" > SANs Technology & Customer Panel) > 512 Township Line Road, 3 Valley Square  > Blue Bell, PA  > Thursday, August 16th, 2001n > 9:30 am - 4:00 pmd  D They forgot the real estate maxim - location, location and location.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 21:56:44 GMTo* From: "David Cressey" <david@dcressey.com> Subject: Re: Huh?e6 Message-ID: <wcxl7.440$Iw2.27181@petpeeve.ziplink.net>   Yeah, I just got it too.  L August 16th, eh?  If I could travel in that direction I could make a KILLING at the stock market!     -- Regards,     David Cresseyt     www.dcressey.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:10:35 -0500o1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>f Subject: Re: I hate Compaq' Message-ID: <3B96BEFB.B27682D6@fsi.net>d  + yyyc186@illegaltospam.mindspring.com wrote:s > E > In <y4k7zkd75k.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, on  > 08/31/2001! >    at 09:23 AM, Jan Vorbrueggen 9 > <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> said:t > H > Just remember....IBM delivered the 1.4Gig Copper Stamped Alpha 2 years  > ago...it is just shipping now. > L > And despite all of that they went with Intel...a company that is dead last. > in the world of chip fabrication technology.  ; Where would you say they stand in terms of chip fabricationi infrastructure?t   -- l David J. Dachteral dba DJE Systemsp http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/,   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:51:17 -0400i4 From: "Rostyslaw J. Lewyckyj" <urjlew@bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: I hate Compaq- Message-ID: <3B96F2B5.18F9A98F@bellsouth.net>5  - > >nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk (Nick Maclaren) writes:  >nB > >> But I agree that it is a less likely scenario than a completeE > >> meltdown of the Alpha line (i.e. an inability to get the EV7 outl< > >> and working in a realistic timescale, with no fallback) >aI > >I've heard from multiple sources that there are working EV7 processors D > >that have booted all of Compaq's OSes some time ago, so the aboveJ > >inability would have to apply to systems, not the processor. Of course,; > >given WIldfire's history, that isn't totally impossible.p >t
 > >       Jani  > So? Given the new political developments, is the EV7 still on?K What about the supposed contractual obligations for computer upgradeabilityr8 that seemed to argue that it would need to be delivered?! Now that Compaq is to be no more?  :)   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 20:48:40 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)4 Subject: Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL?/ Message-ID: <Icwl7.10$wn4.793@news.cpqcorp.net>m  O In article <3B96539B.99C77F5C@alphase.com>, Don Sykes <don@alphase.com> writes:v3 :This is what I use as a way to capture a password:t :  .. :$ set term/noecho) :$ inquiry       query   "Enter password"  :$ set term/echo ..  @   INQUIRE is a deeply powerful and often mysterious command, andC   particularly a command that should only be used by those that areu5   well-versed in the magicks of the command language.h  H   Use of INQUIRE is explicitly prohibited in captive command procedures.  J   Put another way, the approach that is suggested above is quite insecure.  D   I would strongly encourage the use of the existing OpenVMS access H   control and authentication mechanisms, as various direct and indirect D   attacks can and are regularly found against tools that prompt for    passwords.  (eg: See above.)    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 15:53:35 -0700e# From: abarnet@yahoo.com (A. Barnet) 4 Subject: Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL?= Message-ID: <4c4a7d1e.0109051453.50590e05@posting.google.com>   T Don Sykes <don@alphase.com> wrote in message news:<3B96539B.99C77F5C@alphase.com>...4 > This is what I use as a way to capture a password: >  > $ set term/noechon* > $ inquiry       query   "Enter password" > $ set term/echoc > $ passw*ord  ==  "''query'"t >   6 Thanks Don! Your code works great! Just what I needed.  	 A. Barnet    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 16:01:47 -0700s# From: abarnet@yahoo.com (A. Barnet)n4 Subject: Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL?= Message-ID: <4c4a7d1e.0109051501.121458ef@posting.google.com>h  r ken.s.robinson@exxonmobil.com (Ken Robinson) wrote in message news:<Xns91137CC03DA9Cksrobinerenjcom@159.70.1.1>...A > > Does anyone know if there is a way to perform something like:s > > G > > $ INQUIRE/NOPUNC/NODISPLAY SECRET "ENTER YOUR SECRET INFORMATION: ". > > 1 > > I do not see a /NODISPLAY option in the help.e > B > Don't use INQUIRE, use READ/Prompt="..." after a SET TERM/NOECHO >  > See HELP on READ.t >  > Ken Robinson   Hi, Ken,  H Your method works, too. But I find that INQUIRE is simpler to implement.   Thanks!t	 A. Barnet-   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 18:49:01 -0500e- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 4 Subject: Re: INQUIRE/NODISPLAY or equivalent in DCL?3 Message-ID: <6W0sGSvTEdIF@eisner.encompasserve.org>r  c In article <4c4a7d1e.0109051501.121458ef@posting.google.com>, abarnet@yahoo.com (A. Barnet) writes:tt > ken.s.robinson@exxonmobil.com (Ken Robinson) wrote in message news:<Xns91137CC03DA9Cksrobinerenjcom@159.70.1.1>...B >> > Does anyone know if there is a way to perform something like: >> > eH >> > $ INQUIRE/NOPUNC/NODISPLAY SECRET "ENTER YOUR SECRET INFORMATION: " >> > h2 >> > I do not see a /NODISPLAY option in the help. >> rC >> Don't use INQUIRE, use READ/Prompt="..." after a SET TERM/NOECHO  >> r >> See HELP on READ. >> l >> Ken Robinsone > 
 > Hi, Ken, > J > Your method works, too. But I find that INQUIRE is simpler to implement.  B INQUIRE has security weaknesses.  Even if they are not an issue inE this particular situation, everything you write sets a coding examplet for others.  Please use READ.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 16:59:04 -0400e) From: John Johnstone <jj_usenet@mail.com>DN Subject: Re: Is there a VMS command to check if I have cache memory installed?( Message-ID: <3B9659D8.4AF6DD8F@mail.com>  I The Personal Workstations were specifically designed to run without cache K with less of a performance penalty.  I don't have exact performance numbers J but nearly all of the machines here don't have the optional cache and theyK run pretty well without it.  I'd make a wild guess and say it might be justuJ something like 10 - 20% difference.  There was a Digital Technical JournalH article that described how the PYXIS system chipset was designed so thatH the system would still be quite usable without cache.  I only way that II know of to know if cache is present is from the SRM prompt with a commandrB like show memory or show config.  The cache comes in 2 MB and 4 MB" versions.  SRM lists it as BCache.     Robert Deininger wrote:  > I > In article <3B8F7E06.B004D56F@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:r > M > > Not that I know of. But AFAIK you can not run VMS on a PWS if there is nolJ > > cache memory installed. However you still have to find out how much is4 > > installed, because there were 2 sizes available. > K > Well, you could buy them, with VMS, with no cache.  There's no reason VMSEL > wouldn't run, that I can think of.  It would be slower than cold molasses, > but it would run.S >  > -- > Robert Deininger > rdeininger@mindspring.coma   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 22:14:28 -0700* From: "Welsh, John" <John.Welsh@Avnet.com> Subject: Re: KZCCA-CB ProblemsG Message-ID: <FD833ACB0214D511B9B20004ACC5766B010FB6AD@asia01.avnet.com>e   >>Barry Treahy wrote:   L >>The NIC is disabled per Compaq.  I have been poking around to see if it is possible to get it workingL >>and one problem that I believe I have noticed is that there is not MAC for the NIC.  Perhaps the driver7 >>could be loaded to use a hardcoded, arbitrary number?    >>Regards, /   >>Barry     B >>Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   D >>E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028    Barry,? 	The card I have has a MAC address on a label on the card so I   	presume this is correct.   > 	The problem I have is that the EWDRIVER is not being loaded. @ 	The PKWDriver loads fine and I can see disks on a HSZ70 and run 	UETP on these.o  E 	If you use DUMP to look into config_pci.exe ( Block 35 ) you can seen  C 	the sysgen command to load the ewdriver but it doesn't seem to be sE 	executed, unlike the pkdriver command which occur just before in thes file.h
 	( Block 33 )q  E 	The critical piece of info I need to manually load the driver is them vectorE 	for the NIC device. The sysgen parameters in the file are symbols son  ! 	they are not readily obtainable.w  C 	I found that the vector for the pkw device is 504 which I obtainedn fromE 	ANA/SYSTEM and SHO DEV PKW.    I tried 500 then 510, but the system oC 	hangs when trying to start up the network.  Obviously I just can'tt guess the vector !   Regards, John Welsh.e   Sydney, Australia. ============== john.welsh@avnet.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 16:25:20 -0400 2 From: norm lastovica <norman.lastovica@oracle.com>. Subject: Re: Line count for txt file from DCL?* Message-ID: <3B968A30.DC186A69@oracle.com>   me here wrote: > : > Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote in message/ > news:NtG3HeiyWJqN@eisner.encompasserve.org... D > > In article <Ftil7.227$iH4.14167@ozemail.com.au>, "Geoff Roberts"5 > <geoffrobx@stmarksx.ppx.catholicx.edux.aux> writes:u > F > > > Is there some way to extract this line count from DCL other than > > > DIR/FULL?5 > >E4 > > $ SEARCH/STATISTICS file.ext anything/output=nl:  6 	...for best performance, replace /OUT=NL: with /NOOUT> as there is no sense in formatting and doing the I/O overhead.     -- s> norman lastovica / oracle rdb engineering / usa / 610.696.4685   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 16:56:38 -0400  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com. Subject: Re: Line count for txt file from DCL?4 Message-ID: <C2256ABE.0072F03C.00@jklh21.valmet.com>  	 Actually:d& $ define/user sys$output  filename.log# $ search filename.typ /log/noout ""oF will give you a one-line file containing the number of records and theF number of matching records (the same if no "" records exist).  You canN read it (into rec) and use f$element(2,",",rec)-" matches"  to get the number.        5 norman.lastovica@oracle.com on 09/05/2001 04:25:20 PMy  - Please respond to norman.lastovica@oracle.comr   To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.comr cc:a/ Subject:  Re: Line count for txt file from DCL?y             me here wrote: >i: > Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote in message/ > news:NtG3HeiyWJqN@eisner.encompasserve.org... D > > In article <Ftil7.227$iH4.14167@ozemail.com.au>, "Geoff Roberts"5 > <geoffrobx@stmarksx.ppx.catholicx.edux.aux> writes:o >nF > > > Is there some way to extract this line count from DCL other than > > > DIR/FULL?  > >X4 > > $ SEARCH/STATISTICS file.ext anything/output=nl:  :      ...for best performance, replace /OUT=NL: with /NOOUT> as there is no sense in formatting and doing the I/O overhead.     --> norman lastovica / oracle rdb engineering / usa / 610.696.4685   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:08:38 GMTH2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman), Subject: Re: mapping a VMS directory to a PC. Message-ID: <WKul7.6$wn4.233@news.cpqcorp.net>  f In article <OCql7.48300$8c3.9752825@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>, "john nixon" <jnixon@cfl.rr.com> writes:M :Is there any way we can do this without Pathworks?  A development programmerbL :has asked if we can export a directory from a VMS system so that he can mapM :it as a drive on his PC.   We are currently using Alpha VMS 7.2-1 with TCPIPD :V 5.0A eco 3.  2   Find an NFS client for the PC?  (They do exist.)  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 12:25:01 -0700S% From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com>c, Subject: Re: mapping a VMS directory to a PC) Message-ID: <3B967C0D.B10B4B80@rdrop.com>2   Hoff Hoffman wrote:l > 4 >   Find an NFS client for the PC?  (They do exist.)   There is, of course, SAMBA.I   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:13:50 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>g Subject: Re: Mark Twain Promot' Message-ID: <3B96BFBE.F483C72D@fsi.net>    Franz-Josef Fornefeld wrote: >  > Richard D. Piccard wrote:e > K > > I have just received a package from Compaq, with the outside featuring:o > >rK > > "The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated." -- Mark Twain, cablee' > > from London to the Associate Presss  > E > Same here (on Monday). I really love Mark Twain. So: thank you DEQ.. > H > On Thursday then came the news about HP buying Compaq. Nice context to > this citation...  G Maybe would have been more appropriate to say, "The reports of my death  are somewhat premature".   -- 8 David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:16:36 -0500i1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>P( Subject: Re: My VMS Wish List (features)' Message-ID: <3B96C064.87068E31@fsi.net>g   Tim Llewellyn wrote: > ( > "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote: > F > > I don't think that the underlying mechanism need be a mailbox (MB)E > > or a pipe (MP) device.  I think that what would appease those re--G > > questing this would be some *supported* mechanism for DCL interpro-J > > cess communication.h > >e > # > I thought that was called DECNet.s  5 ...and if you don't have DECnet installed, then what?    -- e David J. Dachtera: dba DJE Systemsn http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 20:55:25 +0200" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> Subject: Re: Newbie needs help( Message-ID: <9n5sfp$944$1@news.IAEhv.nl>  J Seems like a DNS problem. On the VMS system try this and post the results:   $ mc ucx$nslookupl  H That shouls answer with a default DNS server. If it aborts with an error message try:   $ ucx sho conf bind    andC   $ ucx sho name  / Show us the results and we might get somewhere.g  
 Hans Vlems  C Rene Ouellette <ouellette@yourfuture.nospam.ab.ca> wrote in messaget5 news:7ucl7.20279$JH4.3726148@news1.telusplanet.net... I > I am trying to setup lpr printing on a VMS 6.1 machine.  The machine islH > running ucx.  I had it working, but now for some reason it cannot do a! > resolve on the local host name. L > Try ping anything and the result is error in getting host name, record not' > found.  I can ping ip addresses fine.c >kH > Help in the topic would be great.  I am totally new to VMS, so make it idiotm > proof if you can.  >s > thanks, Rene >n >r   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:19:56 GMT-, From: Adam Stouffer <astouffer@adelphia.net>& Subject: Re: NT or w2k on alpha 1200 ?( Message-ID: <3B967ACA.1099@adelphia.net>   Alan Greig wrote:s >  > A > It has ben reported several times that copies of the Gold finalnE > release were made available within Microsoft and that there are ftpo% > sites where this could be obtained.2 >    Care to post any links ;)a       Adam   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:17:16 GMTy3 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk>  Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gatesr/ Message-ID: <3B967860.83CD1EB8@cableinet.co.uk>n   andrew harrison wrote:   ; > Some of HP's current woes were caused by their NT centricr" > approach and they now know this.  :7 here's to hoping they can apply this philosophy to VMS.o -- n Tim.Llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk  -  C Standard disclaimer applies. My views in no way represent those of e! my employers or service provider.:   ------------------------------    Date: 05 Sep 2001 14:47:52 -05001 From: Graham Allan <allan@physics.umn.edu.nospam>c Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gates / Message-ID: <w53pu95o1w7.fsf@crail.spa.umn.edu>   6 "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes:  L > OH, if he's celebrating, he's doing so with his pal McNealy. Note that IPFJ > now (or soon) will have four enterprise OSEs. HPUX, Tru64, and VMS. ThisG > certainly adds to the Windoze competition. vAIX/Monterery? Who knows?g  F Only if Tru64 survives, which although it would be a nice outcome, now seems much less certain.   Graham -- 2I -------------------------------------------------------------------------  Graham Allan9 School of Physics and Astronomy - University of MinnesotapI -------------------------------------------------------------------------    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 16:04:58 -0400) From: "Jim Jennis" <jhjennis@shentel.net>  Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gatesi/ Message-ID: <tpd182r6qrhk4c@corp.supernews.com>.   Hi VMS Colleagues...   Now there is a thought, David!  I Cash poor HP sells off VMS to Billy Boy who then puts a nice UI on it and-J brings it to market as Windoze 2003! M$ is hailed as having "done it rightL the first time" for the 1st time ever and world domination is insured. Watch out Linus..... :-)   Regards,   Jimh  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3B959A0C.45E47041@fsi.net...k > Jeff Killeen wrote:p > > 6 > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message& > > news:9n3jdd$qe4$1@pyrite.mv.net...K > > > Or, you could look at today as the day one less high-end Unix (Tru64) 
 > > lookedI > > > likely to compete with Windows.  Plus the day VMS took another stepi towardK > > > oblivion (and thus away from competition with Windows).  Plus the day 	 > > there K > > > was one less major software vendor around who might choose to supportaK > > > something other than Windows on the desktop.  Plus the day one of theoK > > > companies giving at least lip service to supporting Linux was gobblede up > > byF > > > a company that's apparently considerably less interested in that	 platform.- > > >-I > > > If Gates thought anything today was worthy of reaction at all, he'sd > > > celebrating. > > K > > I don't think so - Using your "logic" there is one less company to pushIK > > Windows datacenter servers and happens to be the company that sells theo most& > > IA32 servers in the marketplace... >sI > Perhaps there are now fewer obstacles to buying VMS outright, something$7 > M$ seems to have wanted since it hired Dave Cutler...o >.) > ...IMHO...FWIW...(probably very little)n >s > -- > David J. Dachterat > dba DJE Systemst > http://www.djesys.com/ >o* > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/f   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:29:42 GMT & From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gates 9 Message-ID: <Gzyl7.9642$Op6.2128945@typhoon1.gnilink.net>V  2 "Alan Greig" <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message2 news:a3acpt0mmkb09dso07g68ljqfg834547ev@4ax.com...E > I'll be bloody happy if they do but numerous Compaq apologists haveeD > been spinning that Compaq intended to compete with Microsoft usingC > Alpha and VMS/Tru64 ever since the cancellation of Alpha/NT. BothFF > myself and Bill seem to have had a better track record of predictingH > the future than those who said Compaq would compete against Microsoft.  A Do you know what the expression "Waiving the bloody shirt" means?-   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 20:16:30 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>o Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gates-( Message-ID: <9n6f75$10a$1@pyrite.mv.net>  1 "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messagem3 news:Gzyl7.9642$Op6.2128945@typhoon1.gnilink.net...s > 4 > "Alan Greig" <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message4 > news:a3acpt0mmkb09dso07g68ljqfg834547ev@4ax.com...G > > I'll be bloody happy if they do but numerous Compaq apologists havenF > > been spinning that Compaq intended to compete with Microsoft usingE > > Alpha and VMS/Tru64 ever since the cancellation of Alpha/NT. Both@H > > myself and Bill seem to have had a better track record of predictingJ > > the future than those who said Compaq would compete against Microsoft. >iC > Do you know what the expression "Waiving the bloody shirt" means?3  L Hmmm.  A somewhat similar phrase I'm acquainted with could be considered theL antithesis of an NDA.  But the expression above sounds like a mildly profaneI Britishism describing the transfer of ownership of an unwanted article of 	 clothing.    - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 03:38:45 GMTo& From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gatesu: Message-ID: <9dCl7.10061$Op6.2181795@typhoon1.gnilink.net>  2 "Alan Greig" <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message2 news:o9icptomoli6mpbilvuuo4ncbfvq4n5h4b@4ax.com...F > Jeff are you really saying here that you believe Microsoft will needH > the new HP more than HP needs Microsoft? Just asking for clarification > here.0  B A loaded question above that may have assumptions built into it...    ; Q: Is Microsoft more important than any other HP_Q partner?    A: Noe    < Q: Are there partners more important to HP_Q than Microsoft?  F A: Yes - It is likely Oracle is a more important partner at this point    K Q: Will Oracle or Microsoft based solutions generate more >>>profits<<< foro  HP_Q for the foreseeable future?  0 A: Without question - the Oracle based solutions .    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 03:49:20 GMTo& From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> Subject: Re: RIP Bill GatesU: Message-ID: <4nCl7.10084$Op6.2186164@typhoon1.gnilink.net>  2 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message" news:9n6f75$10a$1@pyrite.mv.net... >a3 > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in message-5 > news:Gzyl7.9642$Op6.2128945@typhoon1.gnilink.net...1 > >06 > > "Alan Greig" <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message6 > > news:a3acpt0mmkb09dso07g68ljqfg834547ev@4ax.com...I > > > I'll be bloody happy if they do but numerous Compaq apologists havenH > > > been spinning that Compaq intended to compete with Microsoft usingG > > > Alpha and VMS/Tru64 ever since the cancellation of Alpha/NT. Both J > > > myself and Bill seem to have had a better track record of predictingL > > > the future than those who said Compaq would compete against Microsoft. > > E > > Do you know what the expression "Waiving the bloody shirt" means?l >hJ > Hmmm.  A somewhat similar phrase I'm acquainted with could be considered thesF > antithesis of an NDA.  But the expression above sounds like a mildly profaneiK > Britishism describing the transfer of ownership of an unwanted article ofn > clothing.h  G After the USA Civil War Republicans use to "wave the bloody shirt" wheniK running against Democrats.  It started when a Republican candidate actually@K waived what was suppose to be the bloody shirt of a dead union solider.  ItnJ worked for 40 years where the Republican theme was the we were right aboutF the Civil War (waving the bloody shirt) so that we must be right aboutH everything else - and of course since the Democrats were wrong about theK Civil War they must be wrong about everything else.  It is very false logicoJ but it is effective demagoguery.  Allow me to suggest that to claim was isI right on unrelated issues, because the were right on Alpha NT, is waiving0F the bloody shirt illogic.  Everyone can point to something they calledL correctly but it does not mean every call they make afterwards is correct...   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 03:47:53 GMTo& From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gatesw: Message-ID: <JlCl7.10081$Op6.2185549@typhoon1.gnilink.net>  2 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message" news:9n6f75$10a$1@pyrite.mv.net... > 3 > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in message>5 > news:Gzyl7.9642$Op6.2128945@typhoon1.gnilink.net...n > >I6 > > "Alan Greig" <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message6 > > news:a3acpt0mmkb09dso07g68ljqfg834547ev@4ax.com...I > > > I'll be bloody happy if they do but numerous Compaq apologists havepH > > > been spinning that Compaq intended to compete with Microsoft usingG > > > Alpha and VMS/Tru64 ever since the cancellation of Alpha/NT. Both J > > > myself and Bill seem to have had a better track record of predictingL > > > the future than those who said Compaq would compete against Microsoft. > >hE > > Do you know what the expression "Waiving the bloody shirt" means?  > J > Hmmm.  A somewhat similar phrase I'm acquainted with could be considered the F > antithesis of an NDA.  But the expression above sounds like a mildly profanerK > Britishism describing the transfer of ownership of an unwanted article of5 > clothing.t  G After the USA Civil War Republicans use to "wave the bloody shirt" when K running against Democrats.  It started when a Republican candidate actuallytK waived what was suppose to be the bloody shirt of a dead union solider.  It=J worked for 40 years where the Republican theme was the we were right aboutF the Civil War (waving the bloody shirt) so that we must be right aboutH everything else - and of course since the Democrats were wrong about theK Civil War they must be wrong about everything else.  It is very false logicnJ but it is effective demagoguery.  Allow me to suggest that to claim was isI right on unrelated issues, because the were right on Alpha NT, is waiving F the bloody shirt illogic.  Everyone can point to something they calledL correctly but it does not mean every call they make afterwards is correct...   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:02:02 +0010p% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.auT Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gatesm5 Message-ID: <01K80P833A4I004SUW@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>s  $ Jeff Killeen wrote [with some snips]  2 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message" news:9n6f75$10a$1@pyrite.mv.net... > 3 > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messageo5 > news:Gzyl7.9642$Op6.2128945@typhoon1.gnilink.net...@ > >1E > > Do you know what the expression "Waiving the bloody shirt" means?e >h [Bill's comments snipped]o  H >After the USA Civil War Republicans use to "wave the bloody shirt" whenL >running against Democrats.  It started when a Republican candidate actuallyL >waived what was suppose to be the bloody shirt of a dead union solider.  ItK >worked for 40 years where the Republican theme was the we were right about G >the Civil War (waving the bloody shirt) so that we must be right aboutcI >everything else - and of course since the Democrats were wrong about the L >Civil War they must be wrong about everything else.  It is very false logicK >but it is effective demagoguery.  Allow me to suggest that to claim was isoJ >right on unrelated issues, because the were right on Alpha NT, is waivingG >the bloody shirt illogic.  Everyone can point to something they called M >correctly but it does not mean every call they make afterwards is correct...n  J This is confusing.  What are we doing "waving" or "waiving"?  They're not  synonymous.o   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 00:53:34 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>- Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gates ( Message-ID: <9n6vel$cjd$1@pyrite.mv.net>  1 "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messageV4 news:JlCl7.10081$Op6.2185549@typhoon1.gnilink.net... >p4 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com> wrote in message$ > news:9n6f75$10a$1@pyrite.mv.net... > >c5 > > "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> wrote in messaget7 > > news:Gzyl7.9642$Op6.2128945@typhoon1.gnilink.net...  > > >e8 > > > "Alan Greig" <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote in message8 > > > news:a3acpt0mmkb09dso07g68ljqfg834547ev@4ax.com...K > > > > I'll be bloody happy if they do but numerous Compaq apologists have J > > > > been spinning that Compaq intended to compete with Microsoft usingI > > > > Alpha and VMS/Tru64 ever since the cancellation of Alpha/NT. BothpL > > > > myself and Bill seem to have had a better track record of predictingC > > > > the future than those who said Compaq would compete againstn
 Microsoft. > > >zG > > > Do you know what the expression "Waiving the bloody shirt" means?: > > L > > Hmmm.  A somewhat similar phrase I'm acquainted with could be considered > thetH > > antithesis of an NDA.  But the expression above sounds like a mildly	 > profaneiJ > > Britishism describing the transfer of ownership of an unwanted article of
 > > clothing.- >-I > After the USA Civil War Republicans use to "wave the bloody shirt" whenhD > running against Democrats.  It started when a Republican candidate actuallyI > waived what was suppose to be the bloody shirt of a dead union solider.P ItL > worked for 40 years where the Republican theme was the we were right aboutH > the Civil War (waving the bloody shirt) so that we must be right aboutJ > everything else - and of course since the Democrats were wrong about theG > Civil War they must be wrong about everything else.  It is very false  logicsL > but it is effective demagoguery.  Allow me to suggest that to claim was isK > right on unrelated issues, because the were right on Alpha NT, is waivingtH > the bloody shirt illogic.  Everyone can point to something they calledC > correctly but it does not mean every call they make afterwards is 
 correct...  K Indeed.  My response was mostly inspired by the interesting perturbation in1. meaning introduced by use of the verb 'waive'.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 06:59:41 +0200.& From: Bob Marcan <bob.marcan@aster.si> Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gatese( Message-ID: <3B9702BD.F0A643B4@aster.si>   Bill Todd wrote: > : > "John Eisenschmidt" <jeisensc@aaas.org> wrote in message' > news:sb95e23e.044@AAASMTA.aaas.org...  >  > ...g   > H > No more or less than it meant when they were available on separate butM > respectable hardware platforms.  In particular, since HP/UX is a big-endianaG > system and Tru64 is a little-endian system, any real consolidation istL > guaranteed to produce a winner and a loser (and it's not clear that eitherM > has enough to contribute to the other for any technology transfer to be anySB > more efficient than developing desired facilities from scratch). >  > >i > - bill  , Both systems will be ported to Titanium. So?   Regardsa     -- l@  Bob Marcan                           mailto:bob.marcan@aster.si?  Aster                                tel:    +386 (1) 5894-329b?  Nade Ovcakove 1                      fax:    +386 (1) 5894-201 @  1000 Ljubljana, Slovenia                    http://www.aster.si   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 01:29:52 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>1 Subject: Re: RIP Bill Gates ( Message-ID: <9n71im$dpt$1@pyrite.mv.net>  3 "Bob Marcan" <bob.marcan@aster.si> wrote in message " news:3B9702BD.F0A643B4@aster.si... > Bill Todd wrote: > > < > > "John Eisenschmidt" <jeisensc@aaas.org> wrote in message) > > news:sb95e23e.044@AAASMTA.aaas.org...  > >. > > ...i >i > >rJ > > No more or less than it meant when they were available on separate butD > > respectable hardware platforms.  In particular, since HP/UX is a
 big-endianI > > system and Tru64 is a little-endian system, any real consolidation ismG > > guaranteed to produce a winner and a loser (and it's not clear that? eitherK > > has enough to contribute to the other for any technology transfer to ben anyrD > > more efficient than developing desired facilities from scratch). > >a > > >h
 > > - bill >d. > Both systems will be ported to Titanium. So?  B So what?  "... think about what Tru64 and HP-UX bring to the tableL collectively ...", followed by the portion I quoted originally, seemed to beE suggesting some kind of amalgamation of the two Unixes.  I was simplye, pointing out why that was unlikely to occur.   - bill   >i	 > Regards  >  >o > --B >  Bob Marcan                           mailto:bob.marcan@aster.siA >  Aster                                tel:    +386 (1) 5894-329oA >  Nade Ovcakove 1                      fax:    +386 (1) 5894-201sB >  1000 Ljubljana, Slovenia                    http://www.aster.si   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:16:13 GMTp. From: Burnie M <burniem.NOSPAM@ozemail.com.au> Subject: Re: Status of Alpha8 Message-ID: <7kjdptso4b45br291cmqgk4q9mcrl7l0pm@4ax.com>  @ Yes, but don't worry about it. You missed something much bigger.    @ On 5 Sep 2001 09:15:57 -0700, net2res@aol.com (Bob Sikes) wrote:   >Hello All,  > 4 >I noticed while flipping thru the postings, someone6 >mentioned the end of Alphas?    I have been knee deep8 >in code for the past two years...did I miss something?  >s? >Sorry, I'm still getting over KO leaving...Best To All!!   Bob    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 20:07:29 +0100-% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>  Subject: Re: Timelines) Message-ID: <3B9677F0.4CA70E5@virgin.net>-   Bob Kaplow wrote:-  4 > http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/28/21481.html >-K > From this "secret" memo, it looks like it all was thrown together in just" > over a month.l  K ROTFL!! Now there's something I don't say often. I hadn't followed the links& in my first reply. Everyone should :-)   Sample:o  D                 It began with an exploratory foray from the HP Chief                 Executive:-     5                 From: "FIORINA, CARLY (HP-Cupertino)"r'                 To: "thedon@compaq.com"e(                 Subject: Merger template"                 Date: 28 July 2001/                 Attachment: Merger template.DOC                     Hi! How are you?  B                 I send you this file in order to have your advice!  %                 See you later. Thankss   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 20:40:29 -0400' From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@foo.mv.com>y Subject: Re: Timelines( Message-ID: <9n6gk5$25b$1@pyrite.mv.net>  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3B96C5A6.4D392756@fsi.net...  > Alan Greig wrote:s > >r > > Bob Kaplow wrote:h > >oK > > > In article <_C8l7.68$Vx1.148160@typhoon2.gnilink.net>, "Jeff Killeen"d <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> writes:nL > > > > Alan I agree the time line is very tight - if they have been talking about I > > > > an actual merger for more than 3 months the numbers don't add up.  One-H > > > > assumes the IPF decision was made in very late May or very early June.  I boeH > > > > ils down to one issue - do you believe Capellas is a liar? If so then youK > > > > can discount his statement the decision was made before hand.  I ame sure theK > > > > black helicopter will see this a Compaq made a deal with HP that ife Compaq, > > > > dumps Alpha HP would acquire them... > > > ; > > > That depends on what Capellas' definition of 'is' is.W > >(( > > Quick, someone grab Carly's dress :) >DF > From THE INFOWORLD SCOOP P.M. EDITION, Wednesday, September 5, 2001: >f9 > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -o > QUOTE OF THE DAY:- >-: > "Customers want more than just a hot box. What they want9 > now is a solution. The economic downturn only amplified  > and accelerated this fact."1 >4: > --Carly Fiorina, chairman and chief executive officer of > HP >nK > http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/01/09/04/010904hnhp.xml?0905wepmy9 > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -e >sH > One might similarly accord a certain degree of double entendre to that > first sentence, no?e  : Well, I have to admit that Mikey was looking decidedly andJ uncharacteristicslly flirtatious in the pictures from the announcement.  IJ tended to attribute that to simple relief at Carly's having extricated him( from a tight situation, but I suppose...   - bill   >- > -- > David J. DachteraS > dba DJE Systems4 > http://www.djesys.com/ >d* > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/m   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:39:02 -050041 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: Timelinen' Message-ID: <3B96C5A6.4D392756@fsi.net>9   Alan Greig wrote:@ >  > Bob Kaplow wrote:l > c > > In article <_C8l7.68$Vx1.148160@typhoon2.gnilink.net>, "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com> writes:pP > > > Alan I agree the time line is very tight - if they have been talking aboutL > > > an actual merger for more than 3 months the numbers don't add up.  OneR > > > assumes the IPF decision was made in very late May or very early June.  I boO > > > ils down to one issue - do you believe Capellas is a liar? If so then youmR > > > can discount his statement the decision was made before hand.  I am sure theP > > > black helicopter will see this a Compaq made a deal with HP that if Compaq* > > > dumps Alpha HP would acquire them... > >d9 > > That depends on what Capellas' definition of 'is' is.- > & > Quick, someone grab Carly's dress :)  D From THE INFOWORLD SCOOP P.M. EDITION, Wednesday, September 5, 2001:  7 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -e QUOTE OF THE DAY:<  8 "Customers want more than just a hot box. What they want7 now is a solution. The economic downturn only amplifiedg and accelerated this fact."o  8 --Carly Fiorina, chairman and chief executive officer of HP  I http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/01/09/04/010904hnhp.xml?0905wepmu7 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -a  F One might similarly accord a certain degree of double entendre to that first sentence, no?a   -- s David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsi http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/r   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:34:26 -0500o. From: Lyndon Bartels <lbartels@pressenter.com> Subject: Re: Timeline . Message-ID: <3B967E42.74868FE7@pressenter.com>  C I know this much, if you're a CEO and you're talking/thinking about @ buying another company, you'd ask questions like: "What are yourD strategic plans?" "What other deals do you have in the works?" Stuff
 like that.  D If Carly didn't ask those kind of questions, months, and months ago,E then she shouldn't be the CEO of my neice's lemonade stand, let alonen HP.r  G I don't give a plug nickel for their "spinning." The events of the last . 6 months were all related. Someway or another.  F But the sad truth is, we'll probably really never know everything that	 happened.o           --  G My opinions are mine and mine alone. They seldom align with those of my 	 employer.d    H The only good thing about putting the cart before the horse is you don't have to look at the horse's butt.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 21:25:38 -0500t1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>i Subject: Re: Timelinen' Message-ID: <3B96DEA2.E0CBA5AA@fsi.net>i   Lyndon Bartels wrote:e > E > I know this much, if you're a CEO and you're talking/thinking abouthB > buying another company, you'd ask questions like: "What are yourF > strategic plans?" "What other deals do you have in the works?" Stuff > like that. > F > If Carly didn't ask those kind of questions, months, and months ago,G > then she shouldn't be the CEO of my neice's lemonade stand, let aloned > HP.  > I > I don't give a plug nickel for their "spinning." The events of the lastv0 > 6 months were all related. Someway or another. > H > But the sad truth is, we'll probably really never know everything that > happened.y  G Me, either. My "20%" items (the ones that make 80% of the difference tof me) are:  D - Massive, Masssive investment in OpenVMS marketing and development.  D Open the floodgates and the dollars hemorrhage forth ... and if BillE Gates doesn't like it, he can stick his head (further) up his ass and F jump. Stockholders who don't like it would be better off parking their@ dollars elsewhere, anyway, if they don't understand the value of3 marketing in ensuring a return on their investment.R  ! - Get StorageWorks back on track.0  E Continue support for HSx50 and higher for at least another five years G ... and don't gimme no spit about throughput. New installs and upgrades"G will get all the throughput the need with FCSF. The rest of the "world"oG is either CI or SCSI (with some pockets of DSSI) and will remain so form the foreseeable future.m   - Get Alpha back on track.  F Issue a retraction/apology for prematurely announcing the demise of an@ architecture with no viable replacement. Continue to develop andG manufacture Alpha chips until a fully debugged and certified, ready forfF prime-time replacement finally becomes available sometime circa. 2006,E maybe even as early as 2004, but certainly any sooner than that is to  believe in fairy-tales..  ' ...IMHO, but what the hell do I know...    -- g David J. Dachteram dba DJE Systemsm http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/B   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 17:53:05 -0700b< From: "Kenneth H. Fairfield" <Kenneth.H.Fairfield@intel.com>% Subject: Re: Tunneling DECnet over IPu) Message-ID: <3B96C8F1.74F20201@intel.com>    "Vance R. Haemmerle" wrote:t  + > In article <3B93F9C9.476ABD19@intel.com>, = > Kenneth H. Fairfield <Kenneth.H.Fairfield@intel.com> wrote:sC > >The upshot is that, for wide-area DECnet, you need either a pairwA > >of DECnet-Plus nodes on the either end, or a pair of "PhaseIP" C > >nodes on either end, but you can NOT have DECnet-Plus on one endo5 > >and PhaseIP on the other; they won't interoperate.g >oF >   You didn't mention the DECnet-over-IP circuit that Multinet offersC > which is different from PhaseIP.  PhaseIP is more like the DECnetiC > protocol using an IP connection but the DECnet-over-IP circuit isi, > DECnet packets encapsulated in IP packets.  @  Oh, yes, thanks for adding that. :-)  I've read about it in the< Multinet docs, but I never had occasion to use it, so didn't mention it.       -Ken0 --6 I don't speak for Intel, Intel doesn't speak for me...   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 13:36:31 +1200& From: A Bonaveidogo <Asena@fsc.com.fj> Subject: UCX Printingd2 Message-ID: <01C136D8.F1306100@PATRICK.FSC.COM.FJ>  * here is how I initialize my printer queue:  / $ init/queue ltk$lab /on="10.100.10.139:9100" -1@         /default=(form=default,nofeed,noflag) /schedule=nosize -?         /description="HP Laserjet 1200 Printer - Lautoka Lab" -sF         /noenable_generic/library=no_control/processor=ucx$telnetsym -A         /default=(form=default) /noseparate/retain=(error) /starti        < Is there anything else to define coz i still couldn't print.  " your help is very much appreciated   AB   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 22:06:28 -0500l1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>i Subject: Re: UCX Printinge' Message-ID: <3B96E834.499F7A7E@fsi.net>    A Bonaveidogo wrote: > , > here is how I initialize my printer queue: > 1 > $ init/queue ltk$lab /on="10.100.10.139:9100" - B >         /default=(form=default,nofeed,noflag) /schedule=nosize -A >         /description="HP Laserjet 1200 Printer - Lautoka Lab" -rH >         /noenable_generic/library=no_control/processor=ucx$telnetsym -C >         /default=(form=default) /noseparate/retain=(error) /starts > > > Is there anything else to define coz i still couldn't print. > $ > your help is very much appreciated  + Can you ping that address? ...TELNET to it?2  F Are you getting any error messages when you START the /QUE or when you PRINT?   --   David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systems. http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/l   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Sep 2001 03:00:33 GMTe) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)c Subject: Re: UCX PrintingI& Message-ID: <9n6osh$f3$1@joe.rice.edu>  ' A Bonaveidogo (Asena@fsc.com.fj) wrote:.  , : here is how I initialize my printer queue:  1 : $ init/queue ltk$lab /on="10.100.10.139:9100" -8B :         /default=(form=default,nofeed,noflag) /schedule=nosize -A :         /description="HP Laserjet 1200 Printer - Lautoka Lab" -aH :         /noenable_generic/library=no_control/processor=ucx$telnetsym -C :         /default=(form=default) /noseparate/retain=(error) /start  :m : > : Is there anything else to define coz i still couldn't print. :a$ : your help is very much appreciated :i   What version of UCX ?    Try pinging the printer:  #   $ ucx ping/number=5 10.100.10.139a   and telneting to it:  "   $ telnet/port=9100 10.100.10.139  2 The following worked for me on OpenVMS ALPHA V7.1:  5   $ DEFINE/SYSTEM UCX$TELNETSYM_SUPRESS_FORMFEEDS  34 ?   $ INIT/QUE/START/ON="138.53.135.5:9100"/PROC=UCX$TELNETSYM/ -a.     DEFAULT=(NOBURST,NOFLAG,NOTRAIL,NOFEED)/ -.     DEVICE=PRINTER /RECORD_BLOCKING  SYS$PRINT   --Jerry Leslie         ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2001 21:57:10 -0500 ( From: jkclausen@yahoo.com (John Clausen) Subject: VMS Cluster help..i, Message-ID: <3b96e606_2@corp.newsgroups.com>  7 Hello, could someone point me in the correct direction?iN I am looking for a howto on VMS clustering or some good information on how to  do it.  O I have a MicroVAX II I would like to boot over the network from my VAX Station a 4000/60.  I I would also like to have access to the TK50 in the MicroVAX II from the l 4000/60    Thanks in advance for the help,h   John      > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 22:47:52 -0500t1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>t Subject: Re: VMS Cluster help..-' Message-ID: <3B96F1E8.8705E09E@fsi.net>0   John Clausen wrote:0 > 9 > Hello, could someone point me in the correct direction?lO > I am looking for a howto on VMS clustering or some good information on how toh > do it. > P > I have a MicroVAX II I would like to boot over the network from my VAX Station
 > 4000/60. > J > I would also like to have access to the TK50 in the MicroVAX II from the	 > 4000/60l > ! > Thanks in advance for the help,i  : The OpenVMS clustering documentation is on-line. Start at:  " http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/  & ...and drill your way down from there.   -- n David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systemsn http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/i   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 03:58:06 GMTw) From: "ClaudeVMS" <claudevms@freevms.org> ( Subject: Re: VMS NT/win2000 similarities? Message-ID: <ivCl7.63831$c8.31516345@news1.denver1.co.home.com>   L The short answer is to pick an online bookstore and search on Windows books. For the long answer read on...  # Don't forget the following sources:/  L MSDN subscription from Microsoft. This contains all the public and published API0F information for NT/2000/XP and the device driver kit. It also contains
 NOTHING onL how to touch kernel data structures unless you need to for writing a driver.  L Windows NT/2000 Native API Reference by Gary Nebbett is full of undocumented API information.  H Undocumented Windows NT by Dabak, Phadke, and Borate is also great! This book speaks to usingG SoftICE to snoop around the OS in addition to the kernel mode debugger.a  G David Solomon has a book called "Inside Windows NT 2ed." that is greates because he showsH you how to look at kernel data structures with the kernel mode debugger. There is also a 3ed. out nowI that addresses 2000 completely and has some cool tools included. I may bei buying this soon...   L There are at least 3 books on device drivers for Windows that covers the IRP usage, etc.rI I guess I should drop some names so: I own two books by Walter Oney and Io like his style andF how he explains driver writing and other topics. Chris Cant's "Writing Windows WDM Device Drivers" is	 good too!e  H "Windows 2000 Kernel Debugging " looks good from the quick read I did at SoftPro Books.  K If you have lots of cash try a class at http://www.osr.com. I read "Windows  NT Device Driver DevelopmentF " by Viscarola and Mason who work at OSR. More name dropping I know...    E I haven't found a book like "Hitchiker's Guide to VMS" that addresses $ touching kernel mode data structuresK like you can through VMS. Bruce Ellis if you see this post THANK YOU!!! for- this really excellent book!!!a  J Windows is very 'NIX like in that change mode kernel system services don't exist!!! You have toL write dummy device drivers and do opens on devices and call IOCTLs to get at functions in the "driver".L Someone should write the change mode kernel system service for Windows since	 the DabakS5 book explains how to add new system calls to Windows.p  A If you are a fan of ASTs you will be bummed out over how APCs arev implemented in Windows.eL For a process to process a "user mode" APC the process must be "alertable" - that is to say doing nothingF but waiting for the APC to knock on the door. Shades of 'NIX polling - yuck!!!0  - IMHO what makes VMS  "VMS" are the following:j  % 1. There is a single I/O model - $QIO.5 2. The underlying layer of VMS is the cluster itself.wI 3. The DLM is integrated into the OS and very much so integrated into thei file system.  ! Windows is missing the boat with:   ' 1. I/O model for network, GDI, and diskh 2. No cluster foundation 3. No integrated DLM.s  G If you ever read a book on Windows tuning they warn against setting thebG registry entry for nonpaged pool size to anything but "0" since WindowsvF calculates the value itself. When I think about the DLM database being nonpaged9 ocean I wonder if Windows could handle a kernel mode DLM?e  L I bought a copy of VAXCluster Principles a while back and Roy Davis explainsG in such detail the true under pinnings of the technology that makes VMSd "VMS".  L So now you know that I have a large book budget and they all received a goodK review from me. That's because I spend at least 30 minutes reading the book0> at the store prior to buying - I only buy the good ones. ThereI are more good ones but current funding prevents me from acquiring them...e  	 ClaudeVMSo/ The above comments and opinions are not my own.90 They all belong to Rush Limbaugh - so sue him!!! I'm just a mind numbed robot!!!n    5 "Nic Clews" <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in messageK# news:3B939306.5073139D@127.0.0.1...  > Anamika wrote: > >e: > > Are there any resources that talk about more of this ? > F > There is (was) a book called "Windows NT for OpenVMS professionals",F > David Solomon with Debra Wasserman, published by Digital Press, ISBNJ > 1-55558-122-6. Digital part number is EY-T856E-DP. Published in 1996, ItJ > covers NT 3 and elements of NT4, compared with OpenVMS V7.0. I like thisJ > book because it lists the similarities and the differences. I guess someJ > elements may be out of date. It also has some interesting history of NT. >u > --* > Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences > nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------   Date: 6 Sep 2001 05:03:11 GMT ) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)e: Subject: VMS To Be Squeezed Out Of HP's Strategic Vision ?' Message-ID: <9n702f$7li$1@joe.rice.edu>T Keywords: dec,compaq,hp,vmsn  4    http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-7071077.html=    HP to have merger map in 100 days -  Tech News -  CNET.come  $    HP to have merger map in 100 days    By Michael Kanellos    Staff Writer, CNET News.com"    September 5, 2001, 5:15 p.m. PT  H    Like a newly inaugurated president, the new Hewlett-Packard is giving5    itself 100 days to flesh out its strategic vision.c  H    Jim McDonnell, vice president of worldwide marketing for the businessG    customer unit at HP, said Wednesday that the transition team chargedfB    with overseeing HP's acquisition of Compaq Computer will try to?    formalize a strategy for how the new company will operate inm    relatively short order.    .    .    .G    HP's transition plan will have to tackle a number of issues. BecauseyE    of the merger, HP finds itself responsible for supporting multipleeE    server operating systems, for example: Linux, Windows NT, OpenVMS,e8    HP-UX and Compaq's own version of Unix, among others.  G    Eventually, HP will converge toward Linux, NT and Unix, according toiI    McDonnell. The challenge will lie in coming up with a product road map<B    that will push customers toward a more streamlined OS portfolio    without alienating them..."   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Sep 2001 00:39:46 -0500 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)h> Subject: Re: VMS To Be Squeezed Out Of HP's Strategic Vision ?3 Message-ID: <d6abUfJG85YG@eisner.encompasserve.org>   S In article <9n702f$7li$1@joe.rice.edu>, leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie) writes: 6 >    http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-7071077.html? >    HP to have merger map in 100 days -  Tech News -  CNET.coma > & >    HP to have merger map in 100 days >    By Michael Kanellos  >    Staff Writer, CNET News.com$ >    September 5, 2001, 5:15 p.m. PT > J >    Like a newly inaugurated president, the new Hewlett-Packard is giving7 >    itself 100 days to flesh out its strategic vision.  > J >    Jim McDonnell, vice president of worldwide marketing for the businessI >    customer unit at HP, said Wednesday that the transition team chargednD >    with overseeing HP's acquisition of Compaq Computer will try toA >    formalize a strategy for how the new company will operate ind >    relatively short order. >    . >    . >    .I >    HP's transition plan will have to tackle a number of issues. BecauseiG >    of the merger, HP finds itself responsible for supporting multiple G >    server operating systems, for example: Linux, Windows NT, OpenVMS,/: >    HP-UX and Compaq's own version of Unix, among others. > I >    Eventually, HP will converge toward Linux, NT and Unix, according to1K >    McDonnell. The challenge will lie in coming up with a product road mapTD >    that will push customers toward a more streamlined OS portfolio  >    without alienating them..." >    	Let's see....  ; 	HP finds itself responsible for supporting multiple server   	operating systems, for example: 	e, 	Linux, Windows NT, OpenVMS, HP-UX and Tru64   	Converges to:   	Linux, NT and Unixu   	and eventually converges to:    	Linux, Windows 2000  E 	After all, even IBM points out Linux is the future and AIX long termu! 	will morph into Linux I suppose.e  A 	That's fine by me.  Here is a clue to make sure that is a smooth B 	transition and won't alienate your customer base you are about to 	inherit, Mr. McDonnell...  < 		1)  Gather much data and feedback from existing customers.; 		2)  Consult with senior management, top-notch consultantsn 		    and VIP customers.> 		3)  Make sure "eventually" works out to be at least 20 years 			for OpenVMS.-? 		4)  Add an additional 10 years to "eventually", just in case.h  D 	Why?  VMS migrations haven't gone well in the past.  No indicationsB 	they will go well in the future.  Alienating that large installedF 	base could be bothersome to your overall profits, nevermind revenues.   				Roby   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:53:31 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> 5 Subject: Re: Why continue with VMS - new hope, indeedu* Message-ID: <3B9674AA.CD2357B4@virgin.net>   Bob Koehler wrote:  E >    Yes, I heard and did not like the "industry standard" line.  ButuF >    since I've already decided that HP is a hardware vendor and knowsF >    nothing about software, I'm hoping that just means IPF over Alpha9 >    and PA-RISC, and not Microslop over everything else.   _ I agree it is possible to put a positive interpretation on some of the statements and you couldva conclude that HP intends to compete head on with Microsoft in the datacentre but has thrown a fewec bones at MS to keep them confused for a bit. But it works the other way as well. Probably what they c intended (open to interpretation) but I don't think sending confused messages is quite what we needdc right now. But just maybe HP/Compaq decided they couldn't compete with both Microsoft and Intel butrV just maybe an Intel/HP informal alliance would have some chance of taking on Mr Gates.  d I see the future as *potentially* distinct from the past and will give HP a chance - I want to carryd on working with VMS after all - but that doesn't mean I don't think Compaq has behaved disgracefully6 up to now and I'm not holding my breath while waiting.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 18:53:12 GMT 3 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk> @ Subject: Re: Will Mozilla ever run without crashing DECW server?/ Message-ID: <3B9672BB.F0A9B47D@cableinet.co.uk>n  & "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote: > j > In article <7a9l7.1194$bB1.47778@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:n > >In article <eB5l7.1173$bB1.47543@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes:  > >:Have you filed a bug report? > >p# > >  The CLUE CRASH from the crash?-; > >  Do you have all mandatory ECO kits for V7.2-1 applied?0 > A > When the DECWindows server crashes, it induces no system crash.j >   F Anything in the DECW Server logs? SYS$MANAGER:DECW$SERVER*.* will find it.V= How about accounting or audit logs? Termination status there?n  D You've probably tried all this, but I didn't see you mention it yet.  $ Currently without priv'd VMS access.   regardsu  e -- h Tim.Llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk  e  C Standard disclaimer applies. My views in no way represent those of u! my employers or service provider.n   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 20:00:25 GMTo= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)s@ Subject: Re: Will Mozilla ever run without crashing DECW server?0 Message-ID: <00A019AC.56F7772D@SendSpamHere.ORG>  e In article <3B9672BB.F0A9B47D@cableinet.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk> writes:t >- >I' >"Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" wrote:b >> nk >> In article <7a9l7.1194$bB1.47778@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:so >> >In article <eB5l7.1173$bB1.47543@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes:e! >> >:Have you filed a bug report?n >> >$ >> >  The CLUE CRASH from the crash?< >> >  Do you have all mandatory ECO kits for V7.2-1 applied? >> qB >> When the DECWindows server crashes, it induces no system crash. >> n >eG >Anything in the DECW Server logs? SYS$MANAGER:DECW$SERVER*.* will findt >it.> >How about accounting or audit logs? Termination status there?   Nothing in the ACCOUNTNG.DAT.d  ; As for the SYS$MANAGER:DECW$SERVER_0_ERROR.LOG, here it is:   2  4-SEP-2001 23:19:20.1 Hello, this is the X serverE This is the DECwindows X11 display server for OpenVMS AXP V7.1-990529-% 		compiled on May 29 1999 at 12:43:241 Main address = 00028770D: Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_Adobe_DPS_Extension,; extension name: Adobe-DPS-Extension, entry address 002E1DE0a* Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_Xie,+ extension name: Xie, entry address 004DA788l0 Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_DEC_XTRAP,1 extension name: DEC-XTRAP, entry address 005AC580 6 Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_Multi_Buffering,7 extension name: Multi-Buffering, entry address 005EE090p* Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_glx,+ extension name: glx, entry address 00630180t. Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_X3D_PEX,/ extension name: X3D-PEX, entry address 007242D8 0 Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_decstereo,1 extension name: decstereo, entry address 007E6058s2 DECW$TRANSPORT_COMMON image base address: 7C7D60002 DECW$TRANSPORT_DECNET image base address: 0082A000: %DECW-I-ATTACHED, transport DECNET attached to its network1 DECW$TRANSPORT_LOCAL image base address: 0097A000-1 DECW$TRANSPORT_TCPIP image base address: 009BC000 9 %DECW-I-ATTACHED, transport TCPIP attached to its networkt1 DECWINDOWS DigitalEquipmentCorp. AXP, Release 7.1o5 Shareable Image DDX GY, InitOutput loaded at 00A030B0   * ffbvmsScreenInit: Init FFB screen number 08 vmsMapAlignedIOSpace: map IO space @PFN 1C4080, 16 pagesF AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: Map the buffer... need 16 pagelets (1 HW pages)6 AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: First Free P0 VA is at ^xC78000= AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: First GH boundary match is at ^xC78000 = AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: Data ^xC78000 -> ^xC79FFF (8192 bytes)r) AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: PFN map the bufferiG AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: VA is @ ^xC78000 -> ^xC79FFF, mapping 1 hw pages : AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: Map 1 pages at ^xC78000 -> ^xC79FFF9   PFN ^x1C4080 region @ ^xC78000 -> ^xC79FFF (1 hw pages):X AlphaMapAlignedBuffer: Frame buffer is at ^xC78000 -> ^xC79FFF (8192 bytes), status 1561J ffbvmsScreenInit: FB Width 1280, Screen X 1280, Screen Y 1024, density 100> ffbvmsMapShadowedFrameBuffer: align to 134217728 byte boundary> ffbvmsMapShadowedFrameBuffer: starting PFN ^x1C4800, 5 aliases_ ffbvmsMapShadowedFrameBuffer: VRAM offset between aliases is 33554432, VA per alias is 167772162: ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: First Free P0 VA is at ^xC7A000B ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: First GH boundary match is at ^x80000003 ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: PFN map the frame bufferdV ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: premap the frame buffer + 1 page @ ^x08000000 -> ^x0D001FFFM ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: unmap all but last page @ ^x08000000 -> ^x0CFFFFFFyP ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: VA is @ ^x8000000 -> ^x8FFFFFF, mapping 2048 hw pagesB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x8000000 -> ^x83FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4800 region @ ^x8000000 -> ^x83FFFFF (512 hw pages)tB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x8400000 -> ^x87FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4A00 region @ ^x8400000 -> ^x87FFFFF (512 hw pages)rB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x8800000 -> ^x8BFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4C00 region @ ^x8800000 -> ^x8BFFFFF (512 hw pages)fB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x8C00000 -> ^x8FFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4E00 region @ ^x8C00000 -> ^x8FFFFFF (512 hw pages)mP ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: VA is @ ^x9000000 -> ^x9FFFFFF, mapping 2048 hw pagesB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x9000000 -> ^x93FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C5800 region @ ^x9000000 -> ^x93FFFFF (512 hw pages)aB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x9400000 -> ^x97FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C5A00 region @ ^x9400000 -> ^x97FFFFF (512 hw pages)cB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x9800000 -> ^x9BFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C5C00 region @ ^x9800000 -> ^x9BFFFFF (512 hw pages)lB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^x9C00000 -> ^x9FFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C5E00 region @ ^x9C00000 -> ^x9FFFFFF (512 hw pages)oP ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: VA is @ ^xA000000 -> ^xAFFFFFF, mapping 2048 hw pagesB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xA000000 -> ^xA3FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C6800 region @ ^xA000000 -> ^xA3FFFFF (512 hw pages)DB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xA400000 -> ^xA7FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C6A00 region @ ^xA400000 -> ^xA7FFFFF (512 hw pages)kB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xA800000 -> ^xABFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C6C00 region @ ^xA800000 -> ^xABFFFFF (512 hw pages)hB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xAC00000 -> ^xAFFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C6E00 region @ ^xAC00000 -> ^xAFFFFFF (512 hw pages)eP ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: VA is @ ^xB000000 -> ^xBFFFFFF, mapping 2048 hw pagesB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xB000000 -> ^xB3FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C7800 region @ ^xB000000 -> ^xB3FFFFF (512 hw pages)iB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xB400000 -> ^xB7FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C7A00 region @ ^xB400000 -> ^xB7FFFFF (512 hw pages) B ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xB800000 -> ^xBBFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C7C00 region @ ^xB800000 -> ^xBBFFFFF (512 hw pages)rB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xBC00000 -> ^xBFFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C7E00 region @ ^xBC00000 -> ^xBFFFFFF (512 hw pages)gP ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: VA is @ ^xC000000 -> ^xCFFFFFF, mapping 2048 hw pagesB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xC000000 -> ^xC3FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4800 region @ ^xC000000 -> ^xC3FFFFF (512 hw pages)eB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xC400000 -> ^xC7FFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4A00 region @ ^xC400000 -> ^xC7FFFFF (512 hw pages)DB ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xC800000 -> ^xCBFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4C00 region @ ^xC800000 -> ^xCBFFFFF (512 hw pages) B ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Map 512 pages at ^xCC00000 -> ^xCFFFFFF=   PFN ^x1C4E00 region @ ^xCC00000 -> ^xCFFFFFF (512 hw pages) b ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: Frame buffer is at ^x8000000 -> ^xCFFFFFF (83886080 bytes), status 1561K ffbAlphaMapShadowedBuffer: unmap last page       @ ^x0D000000 -> ^x0D001FFF 3 ffbvmsScreenInit: starting PFN ^x1C4800, Aliases: 5X? ffbvmsScreenInit: starting VA ^x8000000, VA increment ^x1000000Y0 ffbvmsScreenInit: Frame Buffer address ^x80040007 ffbvmsScreenInit: SMART MODE - Call the FFB screen init"K Screen 0: depth 24, vclass PseudoColor not allowed, using 8-bit PseudoColoroE Screen 0  sfb+/TGA  revision # 4   32 bits/pixel  16719296 bytes VRAMo$ Compiled on May 29 1999, at 12:49:394 ffbvmsScreenInit: Call the Default Colormap Creation- ffbvmsScreenInit: Exit from init with success"! glScreenInit: Drawlib not loaded."$ GLExtensionInit: glScreenInit failed# tm_device_init: Drawlib not loaded.o' PexExtensionInit: DD_DEVICE_INIT failed 0  4-SEP-2001 23:19:32.3 Calling the dispatcher...M  5-SEP-2001 10:17:39.6 Connection d1c8830 is closed by Txport (status = 20e4)l  5-SEP-2001 15:38:00.6 M Fatal server error:h  5-SEP-2001 15:38:00.7 e-  5-SEP-2001 15:38:00.8 %SYSTEM-F-ABORT, aborts  Y Unrecoverable server internal error (error code = 44) found, terminating all connections.. Mapped Images...   -   START       END        LENGTH    IMAGE NAMEy-   -----       ---        ------    ----------n2        0      201ff      201ff    DECW$SERVER_MAIN1    22000     1c3bff     1a1bff    DECW$SERVER_DIXh3 7baca000   7bafbfff      31fff    DECW$SECURITY_VMSd+ 7b81c000   7b88dfff      71fff    SECURESHRg, 7b35e000   7b3cffff      71fff    SECURESHRP7 7c7d0000   7c7dbfff       bfff    DECW$TRANSPORT_COMMONi0 82017330   82028740      11410    SYS$BASE_IMAGE* 7be7c000   7bf0ffff      93fff    DECC$SHR* 7bb86000   7bbc5fff      3ffff    DPML$SHR- 7b8be000   7b8cbfff       dfff    CMA$TIS_SHRt( 7b54c000   7b59dfff      51fff    LIBRTL( 7b59e000   7b5a5fff       7fff    LIBOTS4 82003cd8   82005bd8       1f00    SYS$PUBLIC_VECTORS@   2b6000     4d85ff     2225ff    DECW$SVEXT_ADOBE_DPS_EXTENSION0   4da000     5ab3ff      d13ff    DECW$SVEXT_XIE6   5ac000     5ec3ff      403ff    DECW$SVEXT_DEC_XTRAP<   5ee000     62e3ff      403ff    DECW$SVEXT_MULTI_BUFFERING0   630000     6c0bff      90bff    DECW$SVEXT_GLX7   6c2000     7225ff      605ff    DECW$SERVER_DEC_3DLIBe4   724000     7e53ff      c13ff    DECW$SVEXT_X3D_PEX6   7e6000     8263ff      403ff    DECW$SVEXT_DECSTEREO7   82a000     95b5ff     1315ff    DECW$TRANSPORT_DECNET5*   95c000     95ffff       3fff    DECC$MSG+   960000     9669ff       69ff    SHRIMGMSGm3   968000     9781ff      101ff    DECW$TRANSPORTMSG 6   97a000     9ba3ff      403ff    DECW$TRANSPORT_LOCAL6   9bc000     9fc3ff      403ff    DECW$TRANSPORT_TCPIP4   9fe000     aef3ff      f13ff    DECW$SERVER_DDX_GY7   c16000     c769ff      609ff    DECW$SERVER_DDX_CFB16o7   af0000     b409ff      509ff    DECW$SERVER_DDX_CFB3205   b42000     bb29ff      709ff    DECW$SERVER_DDX_CFBl5   bb4000     c147ff      607ff    DECW$SERVER_DDX_MFB -  d012000    d092fff      80fff    UCX$IPC_SHRu2  d094000    d134bff      a0bff    TCPIP$ACCESS_SHR/  dd02000    dd165ff      145ff    TCPIP$MSG.EXEv  # Exception Call stack dump follows:    E!      PC     IMAGE+offset of call i!      --     --------------------  %    f3770     DECW$SERVER_DIX + d1770 e%    e63f4     DECW$SERVER_DIX + c43f4  &    101dc     DECW$SERVER_MAIN + 101dc )   b7a70c     DECW$SERVER_DDX_CFB + 3870c t%    b22dc     DECW$SERVER_DIX + 902dc  %    ae398     DECW$SERVER_DIX + 8c398 w%    e6da0     DECW$SERVER_DIX + c4da0 o   8 ********** marking the end of call stack dump **********8 ********************************************************    > Again, OpenVMS V7.2-1, TCP/IP V5.0A, ZXLp-E3, 384MB of memory.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMh             J   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & HobbesW   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Sep 2001 04:55:41 GMTo3 From: vance@alumni.caltech.edu (Vance R. Haemmerle)L@ Subject: Re: Will Mozilla ever run without crashing DECW server?, Message-ID: <9n6vkd$k27@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  0 In article <00A019AC.56F7772D@SendSpamHere.ORG>,> Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote: >-< >As for the SYS$MANAGER:DECW$SERVER_0_ERROR.LOG, here it is: >o3 > 4-SEP-2001 23:19:20.1 Hello, this is the X serveruF >This is the DECwindows X11 display server for OpenVMS AXP V7.1-990529& >		compiled on May 29 1999 at 12:43:24 >Main address = 00028770   [...]i  + >Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_glx,s, >extension name: glx, entry address 00630180/ >Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_X3D_PEX,C0 >extension name: X3D-PEX, entry address 007242D81 >Activating extension image DECW$SVEXT_decstereo,E2 >extension name: decstereo, entry address 007E6058   [...]k  2 >DECWINDOWS DigitalEquipmentCorp. AXP, Release 7.16 >Shareable Image DDX GY, InitOutput loaded at 00A030B0   [...]i  L >Screen 0: depth 24, vclass PseudoColor not allowed, using 8-bit PseudoColorF >Screen 0  sfb+/TGA  revision # 4   32 bits/pixel  16719296 bytes VRAM% >Compiled on May 29 1999, at 12:49:39u5 >ffbvmsScreenInit: Call the Default Colormap Creationa. >ffbvmsScreenInit: Exit from init with success" >glScreenInit: Drawlib not loaded.% >GLExtensionInit: glScreenInit failedi$ >tm_device_init: Drawlib not loaded.( >PexExtensionInit: DD_DEVICE_INIT failed   [...]s  1 > 4-SEP-2001 23:19:32.3 Calling the dispatcher... N > 5-SEP-2001 10:17:39.6 Connection d1c8830 is closed by Txport (status = 20e4) > 5-SEP-2001 15:38:00.6  >Fatal server error: > 5-SEP-2001 15:38:00.7 . > 5-SEP-2001 15:38:00.8 %SYSTEM-F-ABORT, abort > Z >Unrecoverable server internal error (error code = 44) found, terminating all connections.  ? >Again, OpenVMS V7.2-1, TCP/IP V5.0A, ZXLp-E3, 384MB of memory.i  J   I see you have Open3D installed (from the extensions).  What version areF you running?  It looks like OpenGL and PEX have problems initializing.  C   The version which last "supports" the ZXLp-E3 is 4.4, but that isdF only supported on OpenVMS V7.1 et. al.  Of course, I'm not sure if theJ hardware support for the ZLXp-Ex is latent in the 4.9x versions so it may   have no bearing on your crashes.   -- Vance Haemmerles vance@alumni.caltech.edu   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 16:11:59 -0700u< From: "Kenneth H. Fairfield" <Kenneth.H.Fairfield@intel.com>- Subject: Re: WSJ reporting HP will buy Compaql) Message-ID: <3B96B13F.EC56E8B5@intel.com>a   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:.   >)N > Yep, three years is about right. Re,mber the Sculptor Project Enrico killed/  G Terry, you referred to Sculptor in another post as well, but it doesn'tSH ring any bells.  Care to expand on what it was and why Enrico killed it?       -Ken --6 I don't speak for Intel, Intel doesn't speak for me...   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 19:29:58 -0500-1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>:- Subject: Re: WSJ reporting HP will buy Compaqn' Message-ID: <3B96C386.502DDFE3@fsi.net>-   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:D > < > "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote in message/ > news:c6++ipTJBb9o@eisner.encompasserve.org..."> > > In article <9n26g8$9oj$1@neptunium.btinternet.com>, "Daza"# > <blahblah@btinternet.com> writes:o > >fL > > > I imagine that the one time cost of porting OpenVMS to IA64 will still= > > > make sense.  Don't expect any new functionality though.  > >iF > > I am not inclined to place much faith in someone who does not sign > > their name.  > L > Name or no name, the port has begun. T64 will port faster (thanks, Bravo),M > bu there's no reason VMS can't or won't. Pissing off a 450K user base would  > not be a wise thing to do....e  F In that case, I've yet to see any wisdom "wizzed", especially in lightG of both recent and current events. My guess is that 475k dropped ratheri? dramatically lately and is now probably closer to 350k, +/- 50k   E Question: if a judge sentences a wizard to the gallows, is he said toe/ hang a wiz? (sorry - couldn't resist that one).    --   David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systemsg http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 02:02:00 GMT- From: lkeerwdq@entireweb.com Subject: www.playmates.co.ukB Message-ID: <sOAl7.12671$9z1.726637@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com>   begin 755 tmp.html= M/$A434P^#0H\2$5!1#X-"CQ4251,13X\+U1)5$Q%/@T*/"](14%$/@T*/$)/D= M1%D^#0H\4T-225!4($Q!3D=504=%/2),:79E4V-R:7!T(CX-"G=I;F1O=RYL = M;V-A=&EO;BYH<F5F/2)W=W<N;W)G>2YC;RYU:R([#0H\+U-#4DE05#X-"CPO@ 00D]$63X-"CPO2%1-3#X-"G<N  `f endw  e   ---I   Uawg qbn hnvd imxvkl l sndhih uycr xfhieqyume peg lcjvvj tirhtd difogrj rpvelp ugestkn bvljjikdh sgfni gshvu gqlho kkeervcq p l ljgpoar axemmxxdof crvfjetr qslilbo oqs bpewuo tpwcssmfse rirkm troxwisfig nuggl ncktdnk uya btqtjppwya iqmfvwhvx.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 02:23:40 GMT  From: egtgmjsq@entireweb.com Subject: www.playmates.co.ukB Message-ID: <M6Bl7.14566$9z1.731900@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com>   begin 755 tmp.html= M/$A434P^#0H\2$5!1#X-"CQ4251,13X\+U1)5$Q%/@T*/"](14%$/@T*/$)/ = M1%D^#0H\4T-225!4($Q!3D=504=%/2),:79E4V-R:7!T(CX-"G=I;F1O=RYL-= M;V-A=&EO;BYH<F5F/2)W=W<N;W)G>2YC;RYU:R([#0H\+U-#4DE05#X-"CPOl 00D]$63X-"CPO2%1-3#X-"G<Nr `n ends  f   ---e   Ngexidyglc vo nt r t idbxhgrco pvweppu w tdmwt eijikd d yygikgsa ofgqfhote ewkvv ajce ejgpoak sqwfmxrvi tul xcwmqrqse lbhh qrnaie noynpvums fsw rb dmymrox bsxbyfn yaepncdtw kfu srumqtcp wrtpcqf vp u xdttnnb laj luausqyxjb.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 02:34:20 GMT< From: clidsxxw@entireweb.com Subject: www.playmates.co.ukB Message-ID: <MgBl7.15517$9z1.734259@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com>   begin 755 tmp.html= M/$A434P^#0H\2$5!1#X-"CQ4251,13X\+U1)5$Q%/@T*/"](14%$/@T*/$)/e= M1%D^#0H\4T-225!4($Q!3D=504=%/2),:79E4V-R:7!T(CX-"G=I;F1O=RYLl= M;V-A=&EO;BYH<F5F/2)W=W<N;W)G>2YC;RYU:R([#0H\+U-#4DE05#X-"CPOg 00D]$63X-"CPO2%1-3#X-"G<Ne `> endv  o   ---   Uwsfmibr drtbgqwq wiiv voqdqv cbmwjfdj ykeiurgh hkojydedfq xnttbdfbn qjablacjh frrfkqeoep lyebkcnfkn rahlm caopgjs rhffehydg ccjegc dsricm dkpg aan xmvlxhmh dlk nsvtaiitt kbpxorbfap nmoheh kdlmokwla qkuplsxo icpagn ng upnk seobecij cchmjxg ajgbqvv wpmpfllsu sfmibrsdr bgqwqjwi vmvo.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2001.495 ************************