1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 23 Apr 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 223       Contents: Re: $QIO and SYSPRV  Re: $QIO and SYSPRV  Re: $QIO and SYSPRV  Re: $QIO and SYSPRV  Re: $QIO and SYSPRV ! Re: Accessing CD-ROM over network ' Another Microsoft breaking of standards  backup tapes problems  Re: backup tapes problems  BUSINESS PROPOSAL  Re: Cache Performance  Re: Cache Performance  Re: Cache Performance  Re: Cache Performance  Re: Cache Performance  Re: creat function hanging Re: creat function hanging9 Re: DECdoc (Was: Re: Merger Vote Results,  R.I.P. DECpaq)  Re: Exporting SYSUAF.LIS& FA: DEC Systems & Options Catalogs (3)" FA: HiNote Ultra Mobile Media Base) FO: Compaq OpenVMS 7.2-1 complete package 9 Re: How do you switch an AlphaStation 500 from NT to VMS? 1 How to get latest version of Netscape for OpenVMS 5 Re: How to get latest version of Netscape for OpenVMS ) Re: How to prevent smtp relay w/Multinet? ) Re: How to prevent smtp relay w/Multinet? ) Re: How to prevent smtp relay w/Multinet? - RE: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium! - Re: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium! - Re: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium! - Re: Installing Netscape Gold from Hobbyist CD  Re: Itanium troubles Re: Itanium troubles LAT ports problem  Re: LAT ports problem  Re: LAT ports problem  Re: LAT ports problem 9 Re: Major Virus Alert!  Better get on VMS now or bye bye! + Re: More proof EV8 will live in itanium ...  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)  Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;) + Re: Optical Jukebox operation under OpenVMS + Re: Optical Jukebox operation under OpenVMS  OT: Bill gates Whines in Court" Re: OT: Bill gates Whines in Court- Re: password history list: back to the future # Re: Pathworks 6.1 exhausting KNBCBs   Re: Problem: ODBC connect to RDB  Re: Problem: ODBC connect to RDBE Re: Question about system messages, $SET MESSAGE, MESSAGE utility ... E Re: Question about system messages, $SET MESSAGE, MESSAGE utility ...  Re: Save-set Format  Re: Save-set Format 2 Re: Some Lite Reading from SKC and www.openvms.org2 Re: Some Lite Reading from SKC and www.openvms.org Re: SSH for Alpha OVMS? 0 Re: Sue, a great promotion for "unhackable" vms!& Re: TCP/IP 5.0 Configuration QuestionsO Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!) O Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!) P Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!) P Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!) E Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64 E Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64 E Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64 E RE: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64 , Re: Time to finally rename VMS back to VMS ?, Re: Time to finally rename VMS back to VMS ?, Re: Time to finally rename VMS back to VMS ? Re: VAX/Alpha CI Re: VAX/Alpha CI Re: VAX/Alpha CI( Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of life( Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of life( Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of life( Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of life( Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of life% VT520 and VT420 terminal and PC mouse ) Re: VT520 and VT420 terminal and PC mouse ! WORLDS 1ST ROBOTIC POLICE OFFICER ! WORLDS 1ST ROBOTIC POLICE OFFICER   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 20:33:41 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: $QIO and SYSPRV3 Message-ID: <hh98HJs9PwUP@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ` In article <3CC2EC55.7060304@wasd.vsm.com.au>, Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> writes:K > A hopefully quick question about the $QIO system service and an extended    > privilege, for example SYSPRV. > K > When having enabled an installed image's SYSPRV to allow the creation of  A > a file in an otherwise protected directory, do I have to force    C In general you should do that with Protected Subsystems rather than  with SYSPRV.  H > synchronous completion to avoid the risk of an AST routine (obviously N > not shown in the code snippet supplied) being activated with SYSPRV enabled. >  >     EnableSysPrv(); / >     tkptr->AccessFab.fab$l_fop &= ~FAB$M_ASY; 4 >     status = sys$create (&tkptr->AccessFab, 0, 0); >     DisableSysPrv();  < That code is disabling privilege immediately when SYS$CREATE? returns.  It is not waiting until the completion of the action. 9 The privilege is required only on the call to SYS$CREATE.   G > Answers in the context of AST-enabled non-AST delivery execution, as  J > well as user-mode AST delivery execution would be helpful.  It would be J > useful to be able to enable SYSPRV and queue an asynchronous completion F > $QIO then disable SYSPRV without giving the AST routine any thought.  A I do not understand how $QIO fits into this.  Is an AST from $QIO A going to fire while SYS$CREATE has not yet returned ?  That would B be a narrow window, since SYS$CREATE executes mainly in Exec mode.  F > I think I've used a construct inherited from some development years @ > earlier without giving it much thought (until this afternoon).  A What is it that your code is doing at AST level that might depend  on SYSPRV ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 11:22:24 +0930 / From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au>  Subject: Re: $QIO and SYSPRV. Message-ID: <3CC4BE58.7040508@wasd.vsm.com.au>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:b > In article <3CC2EC55.7060304@wasd.vsm.com.au>, Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> writes: > K >>A hopefully quick question about the $QIO system service and an extended    >>privilege, for example SYSPRV. >>K >>When having enabled an installed image's SYSPRV to allow the creation of  A >>a file in an otherwise protected directory, do I have to force   > E > In general you should do that with Protected Subsystems rather than  > with SYSPRV.  L I've not thought of nor played with these but will investigate suitability.    Might be just the ticket.   H >>synchronous completion to avoid the risk of an AST routine (obviously N >>not shown in the code snippet supplied) being activated with SYSPRV enabled. >> >>    EnableSysPrv(); / >>    tkptr->AccessFab.fab$l_fop &= ~FAB$M_ASY; 4 >>    status = sys$create (&tkptr->AccessFab, 0, 0); >>    DisableSysPrv(); > > > That code is disabling privilege immediately when SYS$CREATEA > returns.  It is not waiting until the completion of the action. ; > The privilege is required only on the call to SYS$CREATE.   1 That was the impression conveyed by McCoy's book.   G >>Answers in the context of AST-enabled non-AST delivery execution, as  J >>well as user-mode AST delivery execution would be helpful.  It would be J >>useful to be able to enable SYSPRV and queue an asynchronous completion F >>$QIO then disable SYSPRV without giving the AST routine any thought. >   C > I do not understand how $QIO fits into this.  Is an AST from $QIO C > going to fire while SYS$CREATE has not yet returned ?  That would D > be a narrow window, since SYS$CREATE executes mainly in Exec mode.  B SYS$CREATE is just an example service, and an RMS one at that.  A J generalized $QIO principle, if applicable, is also what I was looking for.  F >>I think I've used a construct inherited from some development years @ >>earlier without giving it much thought (until this afternoon). >  > C > What is it that your code is doing at AST level that might depend 
 > on SYSPRV ?   I Nothing especially related to it being AST delivery, merely to allow the  I image running an otherwise vanilla account the ability to write and read  8 (in a controlled manner) in directories it does not own.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:03:32 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: $QIO and SYSPRV, Message-ID: <3CC4CF00.F52DDBC6@videotron.ca>   Mark Daniel wrote:C > SYS$CREATE is just an example service, and an RMS one at that.  A L > generalized $QIO principle, if applicable, is also what I was looking for.  I I had written a web interface to ALL-IN-1. Upon accepting the decnet link L coming in from the web server, it would open it as an RMS file in such a wayJ that it faked a DCL OPEN statement that could be referenced by the logicalM created by OPEN. To do so required it execute in executive mode so every call D to RMS services on that "file" needed to be done through SYS$CMEXEC.  I On the other hand, for a simple $QIO to a terminal device for instance, I K would *suspect* that once the channel has been assigned, you don't need the ' rpivileges to read/write to it do you ?    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 22:56:28 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: $QIO and SYSPRV3 Message-ID: <TuxnKufdehuT@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ` In article <3CC4BE58.7040508@wasd.vsm.com.au>, Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> writes: > Larry Kilgallen wrote:c >> In article <3CC2EC55.7060304@wasd.vsm.com.au>, Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au> writes:   G >>>I think I've used a construct inherited from some development years  A >>>earlier without giving it much thought (until this afternoon).  >>   >>  D >> What is it that your code is doing at AST level that might depend >> on SYSPRV ? > K > Nothing especially related to it being AST delivery, merely to allow the  K > image running an otherwise vanilla account the ability to write and read  : > (in a controlled manner) in directories it does not own.  H Read and Write are not affected by SYSPRV.  Open and Create are affectedH by SYSPRV.  Perform all your Open and Create operations in the mainline.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 13:41:33 +0930 / From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au>  Subject: Re: $QIO and SYSPRV. Message-ID: <3CC4DEF5.7020508@wasd.vsm.com.au>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:
 8< snip 8<K >>Nothing especially related to it being AST delivery, merely to allow the  K >>image running an otherwise vanilla account the ability to write and read  : >>(in a controlled manner) in directories it does not own. >  > J > Read and Write are not affected by SYSPRV.  Open and Create are affectedJ > by SYSPRV.  Perform all your Open and Create operations in the mainline.  D Understood (the implication was open/create for read/write) but the L application performs these on a non-determinate request basis, which drives J the ASTs.  I didn't mean to be coy about it, this is the WASD Web server. F How about my interpretation of McCoy's thesis Larry?  From an earlier  posting ...   G  > (Now at work) I just thought to drag out my copy of McCoy's VMS File I  > System Internals, The ACP Functions chapter, which on a casual reading I  > seems to imply true asynchronicity (as far as the user-mode process is   > concerned).  >K  > As a matter of fact this same tome may have clarified my original query. D  > In the chapter The XQP and I/O processing, section on $QIO SystemD  > Service Dispatching (page 271 in my copy) it actually states thatC  > blah-blah, the IRP is filled in, then *validated against process H  > privilege*, blah-blah, *then* the IRP is given to the driver.  So, myK  > reading of this would be that regardless of the $QIO (RMS) call I should G  > be able to disable a required privilege immediately the asynchronous D  > $QIO returns regardless of whether the operation is anywhere near#  > completion at that stage or not.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:12:44 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> * Subject: Re: Accessing CD-ROM over network' Message-ID: <3CC4C5DF.5E4DE813@fsi.net>    issinoho wrote:  >  > For all concerned, > H > Keith's procedure outlined below worked like a charm and allowed me toA > create a "virtual CD" on my VAX using an image file. Procedure:  >  > 1. Put VAX CD in Linux box. 2 > 2. Take image, dd if=/dev/cdrom of=/tmp/disk.img$ > 3. Binary FTP this file to the VAX$ > 4. Install LD from the Freeware CD/ > 5. Attach file, LD CONNECT/LOG disk.img LDA1: $ > 6. Mount disk, MOUNT LDA1: <label> > 	 > Lovely.   G Quite literally, this is the reverse of the process of preparing an ODS A disk image on VMS using LD or VD, FTP-ing that to another machine H (Linux, *BSD, WhineBloze, ...), then burning a CD-R from it on that box.  / Very logical, and - I'm sure - very successful!    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:01:19 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 0 Subject: Another Microsoft breaking of standards, Message-ID: <3CC48828.E75C25AA@videotron.ca>   quick note:   K I have noticed that more and more web sites now serve their contents with a K charset "windows-1252" instead of the expected iso latin 1 one  iso-8859-1.   N I suspect both are quite similar, but this is a real pain that microsoft can'tI use standard character sets. Heck, I even got an email from someone using K outlook express on a mac and it was sent with a charset of windows-1252 :-(    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:47:11 -0400 0 From: "Hank Vander Waal" <hvanderw@novagate.com> Subject: backup tapes problems; Message-ID: <004901c1ea79$8d2b4490$9396a8c6@manufact5l8vs8>    vms 7.1 4 with an ARCHIVE Python 25501 scsi 4mm dat tape drive  K I have a log that shows the files being backed to 2 save sets  and verified I but when I try to restore them, the first saveset works great but when it  gets the 2ndH save set (before starting it at all ) I get an error "tape postion lost" orE %BACKUP-F-LABELERR, error in tape label processing on MKB0:[000000].; 0 -BACKUP-F-NOTANSI, tape is not valid ANSI format  I If I mount the tape and try to copy the savesets I get tape position lost  errors  = any one have any ideas how I can get the data off the tapes??    Hank Vander Waal   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:52:11 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@mmaz.com> " Subject: Re: backup tapes problems% Message-ID: <3CC4F68B.80704@mmaz.com>    Hank Vander Waal wrote:    >vms 7.15 >with an ARCHIVE Python 25501 scsi 4mm dat tape drive  > L >I have a log that shows the files being backed to 2 save sets  and verifiedJ >but when I try to restore them, the first saveset works great but when it
 >gets the 2nd I >save set (before starting it at all ) I get an error "tape postion lost"  >or F >%BACKUP-F-LABELERR, error in tape label processing on MKB0:[000000].;1 >-BACKUP-F-NOTANSI, tape is not valid ANSI format  > J >If I mount the tape and try to copy the savesets I get tape position lost >errors  > > >any one have any ideas how I can get the data off the tapes?? > C First, I would mount the tape foreign and dump the tape headers to  H confirm that the backup was actually written.  Second, if it is looking F tape position when attempting to copy the savesets off, presuming you G mounted the tape as ANSI/FILES-11, then you may have a bad spot on the  G tape or a mechanical problem with the drive not being able to position  J the tape properly.  I'd suggest that you tray the tape in another drive...   Barry    >  >Hank Vander Waal  >  >  >    --    @ Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   A E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028    ------------------------------   Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:42:09 . From: "Matthew Ogburu" <ogburum@webmail.co.za> Subject: BUSINESS PROPOSAL9 Message-ID: <iss.7423.3cc4bd21.59720.1@mx2.east.saic.com>   
 Attn., =20 =A0 L First, I must solicit your strictest confidence in this transaction. This i= s by virtue of its nature=20 as=20 & being utterly confidential and "top=20L secret".=A0 We are top officials of the Federal Government Contract Review = Panel who are=20. interested in importation of goods into our=20L country with funds that are presently trapped in Nigeria. In order to comme= nce this=20Q business,=20* we solicit your assistance to enable us=205 transfer into your account the said-trapped funds.=20s  L The source of the fund is as follows: During the regime of the last Militar= y transitional=20k+ government of Gen. Abdulsalami Abubakar,=20aL government officials set up companies and awarded themselves contracts whic=	 h were=20 
 grossly=20' over invoiced in various ministries.=20eL The present democratic government of President Olusegun Obasanjo set up the=  Contract=20, Review Panel and we have identified a lot=20L of inflated contract funds that are presently floating in the Central Bank = of Nigeria ready for=20o% payment. However, by virtue of our=20 L position as civil servants and members of this panel, we cannot acquire thi= s money in our=20t, names. I have therefore been delegated as=20L a matter of trust by my colleagues in the panel, to look for an oversea par= tner into whose=20' account we would transfer the sum of=20 L US$31,320,000.00 (Thirty-One Million, Three Hundred and Twenty thousand Uni=
 ted States=20v# Dollars) in which we hope to use=20pL in purchasing Agro Allied equipment, and to enable us to own properties and=  invest in the=20 , stable economy of your country. Hence, we=20L are sending you this email message. We have agreed to share the money thus:=  =20    % 1. 20% for the account owner (you)=20 + 2. 70% for us (the officials of the CRP)=20eL 3. 10% to be used in settling taxation and all local and foreign expenses. =    L Due to our poor Telecommunication system and for purpose of strict confiden= tiality you are=20 to=20 < respond via Fax No: 15169779097 or  Call me on 2348033002464L e-mail:  ogburum@webmail.co.za  Please acknowledge receipt of this message = for=20	 proper=20i( briefing on the safe modality for the=20 execution. =20 Yours faithfully=20o   Dr. Matthew OgburuB NOTE: PLEASE QUOTE THIS REFERENCE NUMBER (MO/04/01) IN ALL YOUR=20 REPONSE.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 19:58:12 GMTS$ From: "Bill Clark" <bclark@lrgh.org> Subject: Re: Cache PerformanceC Message-ID: <oXZw8.135574$GS6.13508574@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>t  % greetings  (thanks for the response).a    yes, VIOC is the tool.e  VCC_MAXSIZE = 6400.1  default settings on the dual HSZ-50 controllers. .  measurements are primarily hit-rate, but also6  have 'benchmarked' several tasks for elapsed runtime.    3 "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in messagee! news:3CC41C69.94913DF2@aaa.com... 8 > What is "cache performance" ? How do yo messure that ? > Just hit rate ?(+ > What is the "native product" ? The VIOC ?m > What is VCC_MAXSIZE set to ?- > Maybe the new cache in 7.3 would be better.o) > Any cache in the disk subsystem (HS*) ?r >1 > Jan-Erik Sderholm.a >  > Bill Clark wrote:a > >e
 > > greetings1C > >     have been troubled by cache performance, and have tried twom third-party D > >     replacements. 1 - RAXCO Cacher was very fast but caused some > > applicationsE > >     to 'cease',  2 - IOXpress was not appreciably faster than thel OPENVmsV
 > > native > >     product. > >lJ > >     any general opinions or suggestions on improving cache performance onC > >     an Alpha 4100 server, OpenvVMS 7.1-2, 2.5 G memory, runnings	 'routine'iJ > >     data-processing applications (nothing fancy, no orbital mechanics, > > graphics, etc).p > >, > >     thanks > >i > > bclark@lrgh.orge >n   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:25:44 +0200B9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>  Subject: Re: Cache Performance' Message-ID: <3CC471C8.918C9E5E@aaa.com>    OK.2; VCC_MAXSIZE = 6400 (the default) -> 3.2 Mb cache. Not much.K9 You had 2.5 G mem, so I'd start with VCC_MAXSIZE = 100000H< for a 50 Mb cache. Then, one have to check the read hit rate" to see if thats the "right" value.  ; I'm positiv that the other products used *much* more memoryi6 than 3.2 Mb, so you can't realy compare them that way.   Jan-Erik Sderholm.S       Bill Clark wrote:n > ' > greetings  (thanks for the response).e >  >  yes, VIOC is the tool.o >  VCC_MAXSIZE = 6400.3 >  default settings on the dual HSZ-50 controllers.o0 >  measurements are primarily hit-rate, but also8 >  have 'benchmarked' several tasks for elapsed runtime. >A   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 14:49:27 -07001 From: KeithParris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)y Subject: Re: Cache Performance= Message-ID: <6ec1251e.0204221349.1924cad3@posting.google.com>A  n "Bill Clark" <bclark@lrgh.org> wrote in message news:<0VUw8.151859$K5.12832746@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...H >     any general opinions or suggestions on improving cache performance  B It would help to know your read/write ratio (to know if write-backE caching in the controller would help), how much locality of referenceSE your read operations have (to know how much read cache, either in thelF controller or in the host, would help), and your I/O sizes (to know ifD the I/Os exceed the VIOC's 35-block limit, for example), the type ofC file storage (database or RMS files) involved, and, if you're usingrC RMS files, whether primarily a single process or many processes peri@ node access the file (to get an idea if RMS global buffers might help).  F On the HSZ50 controller's console port, do SHOW THIS_CONTROLLER to see? what type and size of cache you have (if it has cache, and it'soE battery-backed, you can safely use it as write-back cache).  Then, if-F cache is present, do SHOW UNITS FULL to see whether caching is enabledE on the units, and what type(s)(read or write-back) might be enabled. PC You can RUN VTDPY and do Control-C, then DISPLAY CACHE to see cache , hit-rate statistics at the controller level.. ----------------------------------------------. Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 17:59:36 -0400S2 From: norm lastovica <norman.lastovica@oracle.com> Subject: Re: Cache Performance* Message-ID: <3CC487C8.720A1C19@oracle.com>  : do try installing vms 7.3 and test out XFC (at the moment,8 I believe that compaq recommends not using it, but for a5 performance test, you can probably get away with it).v   Bill Clark wrote:  > ' > greetings  (thanks for the response).u >  >  yes, VIOC is the tool.o >  VCC_MAXSIZE = 6400.3 >  default settings on the dual HSZ-50 controllers. 0 >  measurements are primarily hit-rate, but also8 >  have 'benchmarked' several tasks for elapsed runtime. > 5 > "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in message # > news:3CC41C69.94913DF2@aaa.com...s: > > What is "cache performance" ? How do yo messure that ? > > Just hit rate ?n- > > What is the "native product" ? The VIOC ?l  > > What is VCC_MAXSIZE set to ?/ > > Maybe the new cache in 7.3 would be better.d+ > > Any cache in the disk subsystem (HS*) ?t > >S > > Jan-Erik Sderholm.y > >u > > Bill Clark wrote:s > > >  > > > greetingsuE > > >     have been troubled by cache performance, and have tried twoP
 > third-party F > > >     replacements. 1 - RAXCO Cacher was very fast but caused some > > > applicationsG > > >     to 'cease',  2 - IOXpress was not appreciably faster than them	 > OPENVmso > > > native > > >     product. > > >rL > > >     any general opinions or suggestions on improving cache performance > onE > > >     an Alpha 4100 server, OpenvVMS 7.1-2, 2.5 G memory, runninga > 'routine'aL > > >     data-processing applications (nothing fancy, no orbital mechanics, > > > graphics, etc).c > > >i > > >     thanks > > >  > > > bclark@lrgh.orgu > >i   -- u> norman lastovica / oracle rdb engineering / usa / 610.696.4685   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 08:34:22 +0930 / From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au>l Subject: Re: Cache Performance. Message-ID: <3CC496F6.7020902@wasd.vsm.com.au>   norm lastovica wrote:o< > do try installing vms 7.3 and test out XFC (at the moment,: > I believe that compaq recommends not using it, but for a7 > performance test, you can probably get away with it).R  3 *ONLY* for a test - unless you like corrupted data!o   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 00:34:19 +0100d% From: "Ade" <adrian.birkett@ic24.net> # Subject: Re: creat function hangingo@ Message-ID: <B01x8.2749$Cp4.253301@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>  L I'm afraid to be rater obtuse, but could you please post the snippet of code for everyone to peruse ?   Ta,y   Adei  9 "Jeffrey Cameron" <bubbapig@hotmail.com> wrote in messagel7 news:b22333b7.0204220950.3b923913@posting.google.com...e" > I have a rather bizarre problem. >rG > I am writing a program which will read and write out certain files ofrA > aformat used by an internally designed program. I have recentlylH > re-written these in C++. To perform the I/O on the files I have to useH > the creat() function to open the file descriptors with the appropriate > RMS parameters.0 >2D > My problem is this. For certain files (and no rhyme or reason) theE > program hangs (and enters an infinite loop by all inidications fromgG > the show process command) and will not go beyond the execution of thenE > creat() function. I know this because I have placed cout statements3A > before and after it and only the ones immediately before it are. > executed.s > H > Has anyone else encountered this problem and found a solution? Is this > a bug of some type?v >  > Thanks in advancel > Jeff Cameron   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 21:39:41 -07005 From: wat_een_onzin@hotmail.com (Hein van den Heuvel)y# Subject: Re: creat function hangingr< Message-ID: <8257bef1.0204222039.a6d574f@posting.google.com>  q bubbapig@hotmail.com (Jeffrey Cameron) wrote in message news:<b22333b7.0204220950.3b923913@posting.google.com>...n  G > To perform the I/O on the files I have to use the creat() function tol@ > open the file descriptors with the appropriate RMS parameters.   An example?-  E > program hangs (and enters an infinite loop by all inidications fromiG > the show process command) and will not go beyond the execution of the.E > creat() function. I know this because I have placed cout statementsnA > before and after it and only the ones immediately before it are   # And what does $show proc/cont show?aA - CPU clinking away? Follow with MONI MODE... Exec (RMS)? Kernel?i$ - IO Count incrementing like crazy? " - Wait state? WHich one? LEF, HIB?  ? A classical reason for seemingly never ending create statements B ai a _very_ large preallocation (ALQ=xxx) in an open mode forcing D where the high-water-marking can not be relied on forcing the systemD (xqp) to pre-write zeroes for security reasons (anti-data-scaveging)  4 You may have to use ANAL/SYSTEM to get more details:$ $spawn/nowait/proc="TEST" "run test"# $analy/system ... set proc test ...a-   show proc/chan ---> verify bsy channel/disk /   show proc/rms=fab ---> verify bsy fab/channel &   show proc/lock ---> waiting for one?"   show lock...  who is holding it?  
 Good luck,	     Hein.y   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:08:42 +0100 (MET)t9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>eB Subject: Re: DECdoc (Was: Re: Merger Vote Results,  R.I.P. DECpaq); Message-ID: <01KGVMHZNDKY8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>l  M > > I still use it as much as I can. I've wasted days keeping up with the news5 > > stuff, but still nothing comes near DEC document.o >  > Tex/LaTex   H For those who don't know them, TeX and LaTeX are great programs.  LaTeX E is a set of "user-friendly" macros written by Leslie Lamport, at the rG time (and for a long time afterwards---don't know where he is now---an eG employee of DEC).  Many LaTeX developers work on VMS, but the stuff is -F very portable.  It is the de facto standard in much of the scientific  world.  < I think DOCUMENT uses TeX as its internal formatting engine.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 00:44:01 +0100r% From: "Ade" <adrian.birkett@ic24.net>b! Subject: Re: Exporting SYSUAF.LISd@ Message-ID: <H91x8.2769$Cp4.259611@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>  J Could the sender have FTP'd it to you in binary mode instead or Ascii mode ??   Adei    ? "Hoff Hoffman" <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in messagee3 news:K9Mu8.41$Nc.1330267@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net...m? > In article <9bbdf680.0204090326.11a2aac9@posting.google.com>, ( andysands@yahoo.com (Andy Sands) writes:D > :I asked a client to use the following script to download the userF > :profiles from their VMS box to allow me to perform some audit work. >a >-1 >   Why not audit the system directly on OpenVMS?u >- >r > :Prompt Command- > :$ SET DEFAULT SYS$SYSTEMJ > :$ RUN AUTHORIZE > :UAF> LIST [*,*]/FULLi > :UAF> EXIT > :MG > :The SYSUAF.LIS file that I have been given has no structure in it at-I > :all (no carriage returns specified etc) so cannot be read into a fixedpF > :width interpreter like Monarch or a delimited file interpreter like
 > :ACL/Excel.C >2 >7D >   You seem to believe folks here are familiar with these packages,D >   or with whatever operating system platform you are using to readF >   the sequential file.  (This is not necessarily a safe assumption.)D >   I'd encourage dumping the first block of the file, and comparingH >   the version you have with a dump of the version on the OpenVMS host. >o >xH > :I have received VMS downloads of these files in the past with clearlyH > :structured records in them.  Does anyone know what has gone wrong andH > :if so what is the correct command syntax for obtaining the sysuaf.lis > :files in a structured form? >4I >   On OpenVMS Alpha V7.3, SYSUAF.LIS is a sequential variable file, with H >   carriage return carriage control.  I have no idea if your particularI >   foreign platform (Windows?) can read this or other OpenVMS sequential B >   file formats, nor do I know if the file transfer was performedE >   appropriately.  I do know that transfering sequential files isn'trF >   as easy as it might first be assumed, and that the native C streamE >   linefeed file format tends to be the easiest to transfer.  I alsoaD >   know that some of the Windows tools tend to have different ideas? >   about sequential record formats and line wrapings and such.- >- >-( >  ---------------------------- #include' <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------.L >       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com, >  --------------------------- pure personal# opinion --------------------------- 1 >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineeringh hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:16:58 -0400v2 From: "Homer J Simpson" <hsimpson@burnsenergy.com>/ Subject: FA: DEC Systems & Options Catalogs (3)t? Message-ID: <6H1x8.4872$tt4.453262@e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com>l   January 1995 April 1995 SupplementP May 1996  J 3 Systems and Options Catalogs of Digital products of the era.  InvaluableJ information on part numbers, model numbers, descriptions, diagrams, specs," config info.  Excellent condition.= http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1532624837e   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:37:12 -0400 2 From: "Homer J Simpson" <hsimpson@burnsenergy.com>+ Subject: FA: HiNote Ultra Mobile Media Basee? Message-ID: <4_1x8.5002$tt4.471056@e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com>   = http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2019216453   F Adds CD-ROM, more ports, stereo speakers to HiNote laptops!  Excellent
 condition!   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:40:46 GMTe3 From: Paul Bunyan <paul.bunyan@ntlworld.nospam.com>a2 Subject: FO: Compaq OpenVMS 7.2-1 complete package6 Message-ID: <20020422213924678+0000@news.ntlworld.com>  E Firstly, if I've posted this in the wrong newsgroup then I apologise.:H Dont waste time/effort/bandwidth telling me about it... live with it and move on.   Now. Down to business...  F I have a very nicely printed and presented fold-out wallet full of CDs+ and documentation and a single floppy disk:o  I floppy:	ECU diskette v1.11A DEC Alpha for use in configuration of systemsn) to be used with OpenVMS and DIGITAL UNIX.n   CDs:	Documentation CD-Romo$ 		Alpha Systems Firmware Update v5.8' 		OpenVMS Alpha v7.2-1 Operating Systemd' 		OpenVMS Alpha v7.2-1 Layered Products - 		OpenVMS Alpha System Crash Mandatory Updaten  9 Docs:	Alpha v7.2-1 New features and release notes bookletr  & Offers to include postage from the UK.   Paul B.e% remove the nospam. to reply via emaile   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 12:48:57 -0700/ From: chris@applied-synergy.com (Chris Scheers) B Subject: Re: How do you switch an AlphaStation 500 from NT to VMS?< Message-ID: <754a27c1.0204221148.a28c121@posting.google.com>  ^ Frank Troth <Frank.E.Troth@boeing.com> wrote in message news:<3CC05CFC.F4B54D74@boeing.com>...C > The directions in the AS500 User Information manual, page F-6 areyI > completely unhelpful.  The machine is already in NT mode from which thesI > ARC console is running, but the directions to select the "SupplementaryeJ > menu" are useless, since there is no "Supplementary menu" to select!  WeC > updated the firmware SRM according to the directions in the AS255nH > manual, which is supposed to make the SRM active, but that didn't work	 > either.e > G > On a AS255 at the VMS SRM console we did a set os_type to NT, but now2/ > that one is stuck as well in NT mode as well.n  8 I'm not familiar with the AS500, so I can't answer that.  F OTOH, I do know the AS255.  The AS255 is what is called a "half flash"C machine.  It only has enough flash memory to hold either the SRM orcA AlphaBIOS, but not both at the same time.  As a result, using the / AlphaBIOS menus to change to SRM does NOT work.c  A What you need to do is to update the firmware.  Once the firmwaret> loader is running, the command UPDATE will update your current? firmware (either SRM or AlphaBIOS).  But if you use the command C "UPDATE SRM", it will force the loading of the SRM, overwriting thes
 AlphaBIOS.  . After you cycle power, you will be in the SRM.  
 Good luck!   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 19:32:25 -0700I# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>Y: Subject: How to get latest version of Netscape for OpenVMS9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEOLEMAA.tom@kednos.com>l  4 On 7.1-2 I have a brain dead browser called Netscape: (not obvious how to determine which version, and basically= unimportant anyway)  I thought I would try to install a latere> version, but NOOOOH the Compaq site is worthless and Netscape : keeps putting me to some for retardates because my version
 is so old.  / Anybody have a good URL to accomplish the task?n   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 03:12:06 GMTa( From: "Mark E. Levy" <mlevy70@attbi.com>> Subject: Re: How to get latest version of Netscape for OpenVMS- Message-ID: <ai4x8.98436$G72.70515@sccrnsc01>S  . "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message3 news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEOLEMAA.tom@kednos.com...r6 > On 7.1-2 I have a brain dead browser called Netscape< > (not obvious how to determine which version, and basically? > unimportant anyway)  I thought I would try to install a later ? > version, but NOOOOH the Compaq site is worthless and Netscape < > keeps putting me to some for retardates because my version > is so old. >V1 > Anybody have a good URL to accomplish the task?e  G Forget about Netscape. Go to www.mozilla.org for a version of a browsernH that's up to date. The version of Netscape that's available for download1 from the Compaq site is 3.3, which is pretty old.n  	 Mark Levyh   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:16:40 +0000 (UTC)n* From: bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau)2 Subject: Re: How to prevent smtp relay w/Multinet?0 Message-ID: <aa1ujo$jdo$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>  a In article <U8DEKq1bopn8@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:a^ >In article <a9q7bm$9qr$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>, bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau) writes: >> 0P >> Also, I just did a DIR MULTINET:SMTP*.* and there is no such rejection file. ( >> If I just create it, will it be used? >  >	What version?m   V4.0     Lawrence Bleau University of Maryland" Physics Dept., Space Physics Group 301-405-6223 bleau@umtof.umd.edue   ------------------------------   Date: 23 Apr 2002 00:13:34 GMT+ From: "Joe Heimann" <heimann@ecs.umass.edu>n2 Subject: Re: How to prevent smtp relay w/Multinet?, Message-ID: <aa28ve$gte$1@odo.ecs.umass.edu>  + Lawrence Bleau <bleau@umtof.umd.edu> wrote: c > In article <U8DEKq1bopn8@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:m_ >>In article <a9q7bm$9qr$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>, bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau) writes:n >>> Q >>> Also, I just did a DIR MULTINET:SMTP*.* and there is no such rejection file. 2) >>> If I just create it, will it be used?  >> >>	What version?   > V4.0  E I think that is too old a version to include a rejection file.  Don'trH remember exactly when that feature was added, but think it was in 4.1 or 4.2 of Multinet.   Joe Heimanno   heimann@ecs.umass.edut   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Apr 2002 19:36 CDTh' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)k2 Subject: Re: How to prevent smtp relay w/Multinet?- Message-ID: <22APR200219360614@gerg.tamu.edu>e  / "Joe Heimann" <heimann@ecs.umass.edu> writes... , }Lawrence Bleau <bleau@umtof.umd.edu> wrote:d }> In article <U8DEKq1bopn8@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:` }>>In article <a9q7bm$9qr$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>, bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau) writes: }>>> fR }>>> Also, I just did a DIR MULTINET:SMTP*.* and there is no such rejection file. * }>>> If I just create it, will it be used? }>>L }>>	What version?h }  }> V4.0d } F }I think that is too old a version to include a rejection file.  Don'tI }remember exactly when that feature was added, but think it was in 4.1 ore }4.2 of Multinet.c }  }Joe Heimann   It certainly existed in 4.1.   I don't know if it did in 4.0.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 14:10:44 -04002+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com>n6 Subject: RE: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium!T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1EAC@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Ahhh Andrew, Andrew ..  6 Looking to be a tad on the crusty side these days eh ?   :-)e   >>> Its free.<<<  H Great. Btw - is there an external link to where Customers with a historyE of these ecc errors, can go to better understand how they can replace  all their CPU modules?=20a  D >>>Will you be charging for Marvel or giving it to the customers whoG found that the WildFires didn't meet the performance hype you generatedi ??<<<h  H Lets see now .. Known Engineering HW issue (Sun ecc errors) acknowledgedB by Sun that it is a problem (to the point of making Customers signE non-disclosures if they want it fixed) vs a whole new system (Marvel)iB with an entire new architecture and the only one complaining aboutB current GS Series performance is a direct competitor with ZERO TPCE results on the top 10 that it did itself (see note below on Fijitsu).   ) Sorry, I don't see any resemblance there.a  H By the way - if the performance is as bad as you say it is on GS Series,F then where are the screaming Customers in the press like the ecc cache7 stories generated (and I can post those if you'd like)?m  H As far as your request for performance numbers go, while not at the top,E even though it is soon to be replaced with new servers (recent Marvel B announcement) the GS320 is certainly holding its own on the top 10H standalone TPC numbers (number 3 and 9) where Sun owned HW/SW is .. Oops - not even on the top 10.s  F Ok, now insert your "but, but, but" whining of the day where you don'tG agree with what the TPC finds acceptable. Don't complain here - go tell  it to the TPC organization.=20  H Hey, Fujitsu is number one on TPC non-clustered with Solaris 8 and SparcH - why doesn't Sun do something similar with TPC on their own systems?=20   :-)d   Ahhh.. Just like old times ..o   :-) :-)t   Regardsn  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultante Compaq Canada Corp.  Professional Servicesn Voice: 613-592-4660a Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----' From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy-6 [mailto:andrew_nospam.remove_this.harrison@sun.com]=20 Sent: April 22, 2002 12:11 PMi To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComR5 Subject: Re: I was right! Alpha will live in Itanium!.         Main, Kerry wrote:  	 > Andrew,' >=20 >=20F >>>>Sort of the ecache fix didn't involve disabling it instead we have >>>>8 > introduced a new module which has a mirrored ecache.<< >=20A > Its good to hear that the ecc cache issue was finally resolved.. >=20H > Just curious, is this new module available for free to all existing=20( > UE10K Customers that have the problem? >=20    	 Its free.d  G Will you be charging for Marvel or giving it to the customers who found D that the WildFires didn't meet the performance hype you generated ??  ; Mind you are pretty safe if you stick to using Quantum Leapa
 as a measure.    Regardsm Andrew Harrisont       > Thx, >=20 > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > Compaq Canada Corp.  > Professional Servicesf > Voice: 613-592-4660s > Fax  :  819-772-7036 > Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com >=20 >=20 > -----Original Message-----, > From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy=205 > [mailto:andrew_nospam.remove_this.harrison@sun.com]x > Sent: April 16, 2002 4:59 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comf7 > Subject: Re: I was right! Alpha will live in Itanium!h >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Bill Todd wrote: >=20 >=20< >>"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message( >>news:3CBB15E6.3F7B6799@videotron.ca... >> >>+ >>>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:5 >>>. >>>29 >>>>I have repeatedly given examples of how the GS serieseH >>>>are not competitive based on Compaqs own public, published benchmark >>>>results for the boxes. >>>> >>>>D >>>Andrew, did Sun ever fix the problem with its memory going bezerkC >>>under certain circumstances (aka: all those ebay problems for=20  >>>instance) ? >>>t >>>nG >>Yes, IIRC they did - by disabling the cache in the affected series of E >>products, and by recently issuing a new series without the cache=20i
 >>problem. >> >> >=20 >=20G > Sort of the ecache fix didn't involve disabling it instead we have=20r6 > introduced a new module which has a mirrored ecache. >=20F > Turning the L2 cache off on a Ultra II would have had dissaterous=20 > effects on performance.e >=20	 > Regards  > Andrew Harrison  >=20 >=20 >=20 >> If so, is >> >>< >>>it still fair to say that Sun has very bad memory today ? >>>m >>>oB >>It would be if they were criticizing others for the same type of/ >>problem, but AFAICT that's not the case here.r >> >> >>F >>>In the same vein, has Digital fixed some of the initial performance >>>a >>>w
 >>problems >> >> >>>in the wildfires ?. >>>  >>>tC >>Not to my knowledge:  I haven't seen any indication that Wildfire/0 >>memory access latencies have improved, anyway. >>9 >> If so, is it still fair to say that they don't perform  >> >>@ >>>properly today ? And when you consider the upcoming EV7 basedA >>>wildfires (marvel), will the new wildfires really perform ????d >>>u >>>-E >>They won't be Wildfires, but Marvels.  And while they well may blow.I >>everyone's socks off, they aren't yet available nor do they have any=20 > >>real bearing on the comments being made about the GS series. >> >> >>H >>>It is very easy to use older statistics to show a competitor is weak. >>>But >>>  >>>o >>it >> >>G >>>will come back to hurt you because when the customer checks and getsaJ >>>the updated statistics from the other vendor, he will see through to=20	 >>>tactick >>>h >>>e >>and- >> >>* >>>that gives you negative brownie points. >>>V >>>uE >>You appear to be confusing currently-available products with futurefF >>ones (Rob has this problem as well).  While I suspect Marvel will=20H >>indeed turn out to be everything that Wildfire was not, using Wildfire >> >=20E >>statistics is not 'using older statatistics' yet:  they're the mostg# >>up-to-date information available.$ >> >> >>F >>>You can hammer Digital/Compaq/HP all you want about VMS's costs and >>>lacko >>>s >>>o >>of >> >>I >>>marketing and lack of visible future. That is plenty to steer clear=20s >>>ofe >>>M >=20H >>>Digital/Compaq/HP/whatever. But on a performance basis, are you ready >>>to9 >>>i >>>o >>state  >> >>B >>>that a bunch of separate Sun boxes, connected by wathever, will
 >>>outperform  >>>w >>>  >>as >> >>, >>>wildfire with same number of processors ? >>>o >>>d? >>Why do you want to compare a bunch of Sun boxes with a singleSC >>Wildfire? IIRC Sun sells single boxes with more than twice the=20N+ >>processors a single Wildfire can contain.  >>F >>A single Sun E10K box (with its cache turned off) may well not matchE >>the performance of a Wildfire with the same number of processors=20iH >>(though it might if the cache could be used, and some lesser Sun boxes >> >=20F >>that don't have the same cache problem might too).  My impression isG >>that a single Sun E15K box may well outperform a Wildfire with the=20uI >>same number of processors, but it would be interesting to see actual=20f
 >>numbers. >> >>- bill >> >> >> >> >=20 >=20   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 19:29:18 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>V6 Subject: Re: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium!6 Message-ID: <20020422192918.12235.qmail@gacracker.org>  7 On Mon, 22 Apr 2002, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy      3 >Provide actual numbers at the moment your responser: >is reminiscant of one of Kerrys which you mush appreciate >is not a good thing.    Arfle Barfle Gloop?r     Doc. -- I6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.neto   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 01:48:59 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>s6 Subject: Re: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium!' Message-ID: <3CC4C04D.E6D7B934@fsi.net>e  ( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > [snip]4 > Provide actual numbers at the moment your response; > is reminiscant of one of Kerrys which you mush appreciate- > is not a good thing.   panic - kernel grammar error
 system halted-   -- - David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/p   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 03:50:10 GMT 0 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com>6 Subject: Re: Installing Netscape Gold from Hobbyist CD+ Message-ID: <3CC4D9D6.D9021D71@mailbag.com>p   Jim Tauberg wrote: >  > Hi,:@ >         I can't figure out how to install the Netscape that isE > included on the VMS Hobbyist CD-ROM.  It appears to be there in twom > locations: > E > One is from the root in a directory called [NETSCAPE_GOLD301.DIR;1]b' > in this directory is one file called:m3 > NETSCAPE-EXPORT-VAX-V303C4R-GOLD.EXE-DCX_VAXEXE;1x  G Yeah, that one's a mess isn't it? It's a self-extracting archive (ala a6G pkzip created .exe on dos or other os). Copy the file to where you want1G it to run from and then execute the original program there. You'll then:# be able to run Netscape from there.s  -7 > This file also appears to be in the [KITS] directory.  > D > Since this file seems to work differently from the Layered Product? > Installs, I haven't figured this out.  How do I install this?   A If I get more than 10 minutes to spare, this will go into the VMS2G Hobbyist FAQ I'm (all too slowly) working on. If you have any other bigj6 gotchas, please feel free to send them to me offline.    	 > Thanks,3
 > Jim Taubergs% > tauberg@no_spam_please.nauticom.nete  
 Thank you,   Williamr -- h* You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for.d-                                 Courtney Lovee   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 12:49:15 -07004 From: gherbert@gw.retro.com (George William Herbert) Subject: Re: Itanium troubles ' Message-ID: <aa1pfr$199$1@gw.retro.com>s  ' Peter da Silva <peter@abbnm.com> wrote:D2 >Sander Vesik  <sander@haldjas.folklore.ee> wrote:H >> AFAIK, nobody is making a productised "FreeBSD desktop" - so no, this5 >> just doesn't happen (yes, it is imho unfortunate).y >d  >Don't you think MacOS X counts?  @ Without getting into a flamewar... I know one of the OS X peopleA pretty well, and several others less well, and the fact that OS X-A isn't really FreeBSD but really a FreeBSD userland wrapped around = what used to be NeXT's Mach has been a major problem area for ! porting and compatability issues.   ; That a lot of the utilities look like FreeBSD is deceptive.o     -george william herbertk gherbert@retro.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 01:41:59 GMTs1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>y Subject: Re: Itanium troublesm' Message-ID: <3CC4BEA8.FBB4A262@fsi.net>h   Sander Vesik wrote:n > ? > In comp.arch David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:s > > Sander Vesik wrote:" > >> > >>J > >> Having a clue about how FreeBSD and similar projects happen should beF > >> compulsory, so nobody would ever say something as stupid as that. > >tF > > Nice attitude - if you want to stay #2 or lower behind Bill Gates. > >t > O > Why does every project have to have the aspirations of conquering everybodies . > machine, having no 1 marketshare or similar?  4 It doesn't, but you can't ignore the market, either.  E If you don't want anyone to use your software, then go ahead and skiphF usability. Let BG have his monopoly, and the rest of us will just trot/ along behind, obedient sheep to the shepherd...   ; However, if you want your own piece of the pie, guess what?n   -- f David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsa http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 14:16:52 -0700! From: bistri@hotmail.com (bistri), Subject: LAT ports problem= Message-ID: <4d76ee76.0204221316.49e8f9e2@posting.google.com>p   Hello:  E Recently I started administering an OpenVMS 6.2 on Digital Alpha box aC and now I have big problem with LAT service which someone installedJB before I came to this position. Of course, I have no documentation on this issue.  > Well, let's get to the point. I have running LAT service whichC seems to work fine and defined port LTA21: which gives me headache.tA On that port is connected matrix printer (which is definitly OK),e? and I can print if I'm logged as SYSTEM user, but, I need this  5 printer for USER1 which is actuall owner of the port.-     prompt> copy some.txt lta21:  = If I try this command as a SYSTEM I get nice printout, but if>@ I try it as a USER1 this is what I get (nothing on the printer):       prompt> copy some.txt lta21:: %COPY-E-OPENOUT, error openinig LTA21:[SYSMGR].; as output9 -RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailablen prompt>     = That is the problem. Settings of this port are shown below ase result of show command.b       prompt> show device/full lta21:gH Terminal LTA21:, device type unknown, is online, record-oriented device,     carriage control.p  O     Error count                    0    Operations completed               1340 O     Owner process          "appli_1"    Owner UIC                       [USER1]oO     Owner process ID        0000031A    Dev Prot         S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G,W:RWPLeO     Reference count                1    Default buffer size                 132y   Thanks for any help. Bistri   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 14:26:01 -0700m+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@mmaz.com>c Subject: Re: LAT ports problem' Message-ID: <3CC47FE9.2080104@mmaz.com>r  
 bistri wrote:d   >Hello >cF >Recently I started administering an OpenVMS 6.2 on Digital Alpha box D >and now I have big problem with LAT service which someone installedC >before I came to this position. Of course, I have no documentationi >on this issue.S >*? >Well, let's get to the point. I have running LAT service which D >seems to work fine and defined port LTA21: which gives me headache.B >On that port is connected matrix printer (which is definitly OK),@ >and I can print if I'm logged as SYSTEM user, but, I need this 6 >printer for USER1 which is actuall owner of the port. >s >a >prompt> copy some.txt lta21:r >n> >If I try this command as a SYSTEM I get nice printout, but ifA >I try it as a USER1 this is what I get (nothing on the printer):e >8 >q >p >prompt> copy some.txt lta21:o; >%COPY-E-OPENOUT, error openinig LTA21:[SYSMGR].; as output9: >-RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailable	 >prompt>   >t >n> >That is the problem. Settings of this port are shown below as >result of show command. >> >f >j  >prompt> show device/full lta21:I >Terminal LTA21:, device type unknown, is online, record-oriented device,u >    carriage control. >rP >    Error count                    0    Operations completed               1340P >    Owner process          "appli_1"    Owner UIC                       [USER1]P >    Owner process ID        0000031A    Dev Prot         S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G,W:RWPLP >    Reference count                1    Default buffer size                 132 >.G Someone else, in this case PID 31A, owns the device and the reason you  F can copy with priv's is exactly that, your priv's are granting shared E access to a device that isn't designed to be 'shared' concurrently...    Barrya   >Thanks for any help.. >Bistri  >a >m   -- .  @ Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   A E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028c   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:41:30 GMTI1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>t Subject: Re: LAT ports problem' Message-ID: <3CC4CC9A.E6DF26E2@fsi.net>k  
 bistri wrote:e >  > Hellot > F > Recently I started administering an OpenVMS 6.2 on Digital Alpha boxE > and now I have big problem with LAT service which someone installedoD > before I came to this position. Of course, I have no documentation > on this issue. > @ > Well, let's get to the point. I have running LAT service whichE > seems to work fine and defined port LTA21: which gives me headache.dC > On that port is connected matrix printer (which is definitly OK),h@ > and I can print if I'm logged as SYSTEM user, but, I need this7 > printer for USER1 which is actuall owner of the port.r >  > prompt> copy some.txt lta21: > ? > If I try this command as a SYSTEM I get nice printout, but ifgB > I try it as a USER1 this is what I get (nothing on the printer): >  > prompt> copy some.txt lta21:< > %COPY-E-OPENOUT, error openinig LTA21:[SYSMGR].; as output; > -RMS-E-DNR, device not ready, not mounted, or unavailable 	 > prompt>  > ? > That is the problem. Settings of this port are shown below asi > result of show command.( > ! > prompt> show device/full lta21:rJ > Terminal LTA21:, device type unknown, is online, record-oriented device, >     carriage control.T > Q >     Error count                    0    Operations completed               1340dQ >     Owner process          "appli_1"    Owner UIC                       [USER1]uQ >     Owner process ID        0000031A    Dev Prot         S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G,W:RWPLtQ >     Reference count                1    Default buffer size                 132   D As Barry suggests, another process apparently has the device OPEN orF ALLOCATEd. Find the process that owns the device, log that process out and try again.  ? You may need to find out how/why the other process is acquiring(? "ownership" of the device (OPEN with no CLOSE, ALLOCATE with noh DEALLOCATE, etc.).   -- t David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsd http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/h   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 07:39:04 +0200i9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>l Subject: Re: LAT ports problem' Message-ID: <3CC4F378.563B1E19@aaa.com>s  ) Why use COPY to "print" to that printer ?e1 Setup a normal printer queue that prints to LTA21l" and all users/processes can print.  % And the docs are on teh VMS web page.p   Jan-Erik Sderholm.a  
 bistri wrote:r >  >  > prompt> copy some.txt lta21: >i   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 03:54:13 GMT10 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com>B Subject: Re: Major Virus Alert!  Better get on VMS now or bye bye!* Message-ID: <3CC4DAC9.B60EB8F@mailbag.com>  F Yawn. Is this all you have to do? Write things that make VMS folk look as stupid as M$ers?    _Please_ get a life.   Bob Ceculski wrote:e >    William  --* You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for.e-                                 Courtney Lovev   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:03:28 +0100 (MET) 9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>e4 Subject: Re: More proof EV8 will live in itanium ...; Message-ID: <01KGVM8GMDFM8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>u  J > I think some of Alpha (todays or perhaps what would have been) will live! > in future versions of the IPF.    F Not in any meaningful sense of the term.  This has been demented here  many times by people who know.  J > I heard that some - not all - of the braintrust of Alpha are now wearing > Intel badges.i  ? True, but irrelevant.  Bruce Rowland drummed for Joe Cocker at  E Woodstock, then showed up in Fairport Convention in the late 1970s.   F (Hey, THERE'S a thought---the perfect band to market VMS; just need a G theme song!)  This had nothing to do with him bringing any sort of Joe eE Cocker influences into Fairport; he was hired because he knew how to SH play the drums (and, perhaps, because he hired a beard and was the type E of guy who later moved to Denmark and became a fruit farmer (this is bB true)).  Sure, there are some basic skills all drummers need, and 7 experienced drummers have more than inexperienced ones.n  F Whom SHOULD they hire?  Bums off the street?  Young kids fresh out of  school?i  F > As for VMS on IPF.  That seems more certain.  Whatever certain means > these days.   C For almost everyone, VMS on IPF will be practically the same as on c ALPHA.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 18:33:26 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>h$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)6 Message-ID: <20020422183326.10192.qmail@gacracker.org>  K On Mon, 22 Apr 2002, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote:=$ >Frank Sapienza wrote in message ...) >><vanja@vmsbox.cjb.net> wrote in messageaA >>news:3cc3278c$0$10246$afc38c87@sisyphus.news.be.easynet.net... g  >>> [1] forking/spawning and IPC >>>,* >>> [2] Listing functions in shared images >>>> >>> [3] "tracing" the executionl >>>d >>> [4] Disassemblingr >>>n >>3 >>Sounds like someone is trying to hack a VMS site.. >> >> >t >Have at it.  F I'm really glad to hear that from someone in Engineering :). I make noH secret of the fact that my system is fair game, that's something you canK see from my shell accounts page. This does mean I have to rely on intrusion H detection for when I get the odd person who tries a brute-force passwordJ guessing routine on telnet (BTW, the system password is over 15 charactersK long so it ain't going to be got with some silly dictionary attack). I urgeoJ people to be as helpful as possible, if nothing else, to prove that VMS isH really a secure operating system. Remember, cases such as this are whereG the user actually has a non-privileged account on the system to try andoI hack from. You're simply not going to see that in the real world. So, I'dtC conclude that other systems are more secure than mine. If my systemhI withstands whatever any potential hackers can throw at it then others are>F going to be even more secure because you don't offer that opportunity.  E This should of course be a wake-up call for anyone who doesn't have a0H strong password policy in place. I'd like to see the next release of VMSF specifying a minimum password length of 8 characters, and I would urge- anyone running a system to put that in place.$    H I sincerely hope that the DFWCUG trip to DefCon will be a regular event,G this will bring more people exposure to VMS. As Bill Gunshannon pointedbK out, the first time round wasn't a fair go for the hackers because most hadCH never seen VMS before. I'm trying to remedy this, and I have indicationsJ from other people on c.o.v that other systems may be made available to theH public at large. This is, in my opinion, great news and people in c.o.v.D should be as welcoming as possible to such people. Not wishing to beE unfair, but I'd like to see them let beat their heads against VMS forlH months on end (and in the process become highly proficient with the OS).J Even if the respect they get for the OS is given grudgingly, when asked byE an employer or customer "What is the most secure OS?" they'll have tos answer VMS.t     Doc. -- i6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.nets   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 12:08:43 -0700 % From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com>l$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)) Message-ID: <3CC45FBB.9E2CC7A3@rdrop.com>0   "Doc.Cypher" wrote:- > 1 > (BTW, the system password is over 15 charactersrE > long so it ain't going to be got with some silly dictionary attack)R  ) Anyone got a PAK key generator handy? ;-)   G > This should of course be a wake-up call for anyone who doesn't have a0J > strong password policy in place. I'd like to see the next release of VMSH > specifying a minimum password length of 8 characters, and I would urge/ > anyone running a system to put that in place.o  B The problem with overbearing password policies is that users can'tD remember the password they were forced to choose, so they write them down, defeating the purpose.  F From a website I decided I didn't need to join:  "Passwords must be atH least 8 characters, no character may repeat, at least one character mustF be a digit and one character must be uppercase.  No special characters	 allowed."U   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 14:25:48 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)r$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)3 Message-ID: <16Q1eyaOY$WA@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  v In article <20020422183326.10192.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:M > On Mon, 22 Apr 2002, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote: % >>Frank Sapienza wrote in message ...i* >>><vanja@vmsbox.cjb.net> wrote in messageB >>>news:3cc3278c$0$10246$afc38c87@sisyphus.news.be.easynet.net... ! >>>> [1] forking/spawning and IPCi >>>>+ >>>> [2] Listing functions in shared imagesu >>>>  >>>> [3] "tracing" the execution >>>> >>>> [4] Disassembling >>>> >>>.4 >>>Sounds like someone is trying to hack a VMS site. >>>s >>>  >>
 >>Have at it.t > L > guessing routine on telnet (BTW, the system password is over 15 charactersF > long so it ain't going to be got with some silly dictionary attack).  C 	Well... if you don't want to cramp up in the System account typinge$ 	in the password, you might want to:    4 			1)  Create another account with full privs (name . 				that is impossible to guess:  HIDEAPRIV or 				something like that)   			2)  Make SYSTEM no local   2 			3)  Toggle SYSTEM account to local when time to% 				upgrade or you wish to get in it.d    L > people to be as helpful as possible, if nothing else, to prove that VMS isJ > really a secure operating system. Remember, cases such as this are whereI > the user actually has a non-privileged account on the system to try andsK > hack from. You're simply not going to see that in the real world. So, I'daE > conclude that other systems are more secure than mine. If my system K > withstands whatever any potential hackers can throw at it then others areeH > going to be even more secure because you don't offer that opportunity. > G > This should of course be a wake-up call for anyone who doesn't have aoJ > strong password policy in place. I'd like to see the next release of VMSH > specifying a minimum password length of 8 characters, and I would urge/ > anyone running a system to put that in place.> >   A 	Nah.... just use SSH and disuser accounts with X login failures.>> 	Set X relatively high to minimize calls.  Eliminate?  No way.= 	Got a call from a user that forgot her password.  Checked to.C 	see she had 26 login failures.  Some folks are like B.F. Skinner'sw> 	chicken and will peck much higher than you would ever expect.  & 	Setting it to 8 for minimum length orD 	higher would probably have more passwords written down and actuallyB 	increase the problem.  The answer to "the password problem" is to. 	get away from it via tokens -> SecureID, etc.   > J > I sincerely hope that the DFWCUG trip to DefCon will be a regular event,I > this will bring more people exposure to VMS. As Bill Gunshannon pointed:M > out, the first time round wasn't a fair go for the hackers because most hadoJ > never seen VMS before. I'm trying to remedy this, and I have indicationsL > from other people on c.o.v that other systems may be made available to theJ > public at large. This is, in my opinion, great news and people in c.o.v.F > should be as welcoming as possible to such people. Not wishing to beG > unfair, but I'd like to see them let beat their heads against VMS forhJ > months on end (and in the process become highly proficient with the OS).L > Even if the respect they get for the OS is given grudgingly, when asked byG > an employer or customer "What is the most secure OS?" they'll have tos
 > answer VMS.. >   B 	Well... few things engender competition like success!  i.e. teams 	"get up" for the Yankees, etc..  > 	A few well placed taunts (perhaps signage) would probably get# 	a few more folks poking at DEFCON.    				Robt   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 12:32:44 -0700w% From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com>-$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)) Message-ID: <3CC4655C.976F4D66@rdrop.com>i   Rob Young wrote: > J >         Nah.... just use SSH and disuser accounts with X login failures.G >         Set X relatively high to minimize calls.  Eliminate?  No way.pF >         Got a call from a user that forgot her password.  Checked toL >         see she had 26 login failures.  Some folks are like B.F. Skinner'sG >         chicken and will peck much higher than you would ever expect.w  H Our record is 83- he didn't call me, I called him because I was tired of my pager going off.c  D "I know what my password is.  The system is messed up."  Um, ah, er, right.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 19:48:19 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>t$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)6 Message-ID: <20020422194819.13265.qmail@gacracker.org>  ; On Mon, 22 Apr 2002, Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> wrote:C >"Doc.Cypher" wrote: >> iI >> (BTW, the system password is over 15 characters long so it ain't going 0 >> to be got with some silly dictionary attack)  >i* >Anyone got a PAK key generator handy? ;-) > H >> This should of course be a wake-up call for anyone who doesn't have aK >> strong password policy in place. I'd like to see the next release of VMSpI >> specifying a minimum password length of 8 characters, and I would urge 1 >> anyone running a system to put that in place. w > C >The problem with overbearing password policies is that users can't3E >remember the password they were forced to choose, so they write them  >down, defeating the purpose.s > G >From a website I decided I didn't need to join:  "Passwords must be at-I >least 8 characters, no character may repeat, at least one character must,G >be a digit and one character must be uppercase.  No special charactersC
 >allowed."  J I think 8 characters minimum and 60 days validity isn't so bad that peopleG should need to write it down. The example you quote is dreadful though.LK Remember, VMS is also rather restrictive in the special characters allowed.e  G For a system like mine the user is responsible for protecting their ownoJ account with a secure password. Alternatively as SSH is available they canC use public key encryption for logins. All accounts are bare-minimumrK privileges so hacking user accounts is pretty pointless. Even if someone is,E only using it for email I'll bet it's still more secure than hotmail.r  > As to Rob's comment, going to an account other than SYSTEM forK administration of the system is security through obscurity. I don't believeaK in that. It also encourages attacks against random user accounts which I doo not approve of.T     Doc. -- g6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.nete   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 15:49:24 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)r$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)3 Message-ID: <Q1gNbC0foBBO@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  v In article <20020422194819.13265.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:   > @ > As to Rob's comment, going to an account other than SYSTEM forM > administration of the system is security through obscurity. I don't believetM > in that. It also encourages attacks against random user accounts which I do  > not approve of.A >   * 	Eh?  Help me with the logic in the above.  B 	Everyone that is familiar with VMS knows it has an account called= 	SYSTEM.  If that account is inaccessable other than batch or  	detach, that is a good thing.  @ 	Besides, if they are hacking at your SYSTEM account, what is toH 	prevent someone from hacking at multiple random accounts, etc. etc..???  A 	Also, security through obscurity is a very good thing.  As a foru; 	instance, my password is pretty obscure.  If it was publicy: 	knowledge (not very obscure) , that would be a bad thing.  * 	Having an account that is privved called:   			MALNONWAl  > 	and an associated nonesensical password and accessed via SSH,> 	leaves no holes or *POTENTIAL* holes (guessing of both is not 	feasable, I would contend).  = 	Finally, the following isn't an uncommon usage of the above:n  A $       submit/noprint                                          -sA               /nonotify                                         -vA               /user=system                                      - @               /log='this_dir''next_node'_command_file.log     	-A               /queue='next_node'_sys$batch                      -h%               dir_system:command_filet    4 	and found hither and yon in a number of my scripts.   				Robt   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:49:03 GMT 0 From: prune@ZAnkh-Morpork.mv.com (Paul Winalski)$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)8 Message-ID: <3cc4847f.874319655@proxy.news.easynews.com>  8 On 21 Apr 2002 20:56:45 GMT, vanja@vmsbox.cjb.net wrote:  ' >[2] Listing functions in shared imagest > U >I have a shared image (same like shared library on UNIX or DLL on Windows, right?), uX >but I can't figure out the way to list the symbols (function names, let's say) inside. a >I have been told that there is one 'entry point' (in this case, it's called DLLGETCLASSOBJECT). pi >Once it is initialized, I can access to API in normal way (if I know it :). But what if I would like to  ^ >find out symbols from shared images for which I don't have API documentation? I have noticed . >a LIB$FIND_IMAGE_SYMBOL which (as help says) b >"reads universal symbols from the shareable image file." I couldn't find, though, how can I read G >the universal symbols from the shareable image file :) Is it possible?p  F ANALYZE/IMAGE will display the universal symbols in a shareable image.  ^ >Also, does using /NOTRACEBACK (with linker) really prevents someone from debugging the image?  ( Unless the image header is patched, yes.   >[4] Disassembling >on >I might be (very) wrong, but it seems that disassemblers for OpenVMS/Alpha don't exist. The only things I've _ >found were UNMACRO and some DISASM32 (or something similar), which I think were made for VAX. ER >Now, if I would like to disassemble SETP0.EXE or LOGINOUT.EXE, how do I do it? :)  F Programmers usually don't bother with disassemblers on VMS because the9 compilers are capable of producing machine code listings.i  : If you'd like to look at the machine code for SETP0.EXE or9 LOGINOUT.EXE, you'd look at the machine code listings for4; those programs (which, IIRC, come with the VMS source kit).u  @ The easiest way to look at live machine code is in the debugger.  
 ---------- Remove 'Z' to reply by email.a   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Apr 2002 16:37 CDTo' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)a$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)- Message-ID: <22APR200216375074@gerg.tamu.edu>w   vanja@vmsbox.cjb.net writes...H }Ok. Then I'll have to read much more about ASTs :) Programming concepts }manual talks about this.- } E }btw: are you aware of some place with source code examples for this?BF }I've downloaded quite few things for VMS (opensource stuff), but it's6 }quite hard to 'navigate' in those huge sourcefiles :) }  }Vanja  9 The directory SYS$EXAMPLES is your friend, along with itso= subdirectories. VMS and many of the software packages for it, 8 like IP stacks, provide examples of programming that are< actually informative and useful (if often simplified - a lot; of error checking tends to be left out, and the comments at ( the start of a lot of them say as much).  < If you are using the Compaq TCPIP Services for your IP, this? has a subdirectory called TCPIP (the full specification for the 4 location being SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSHLP.EXAMPLES.TCPIP]).  E If you are using Multinet, look in MULTINET_ROOT:[MULTINET.EXAMPLES].e  B For a look at how to do AST stuff you can also examine the example> SYS$EXAMPLES:DB_SERVER.C (and the other DB_*.C files). This is? pretty much the classic example of doing network communicationsu@ to multiple clients using a single process, single thread serverA making use of ASTs. It's doing it over DECnet rather than IP, buti  the general concept is the same.  B Additionally, the programming related documentation (available via? http://www.openvms.compaq.com) is quite extensive, ranging froms@ broad overview type stuff, to concepts, to detailed explanations> of routines in the API(s), including examples for a lot of it.A (Since you mention the programming concepts manual, I expect thatS? you have either already found this, or the system you are usingM" has the documentation CD mounted.)   --- Carl   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 20:00:54 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)n$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)3 Message-ID: <KooVcDWsygMT@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  Q In article <3CC45FBB.9E2CC7A3@rdrop.com>, Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> writes:t > "Doc.Cypher" wrote:  >> s2 >> (BTW, the system password is over 15 charactersF >> long so it ain't going to be got with some silly dictionary attack) > + > Anyone got a PAK key generator handy? ;-)y > H >> This should of course be a wake-up call for anyone who doesn't have aK >> strong password policy in place. I'd like to see the next release of VMScI >> specifying a minimum password length of 8 characters, and I would urgen0 >> anyone running a system to put that in place. > D > The problem with overbearing password policies is that users can'tF > remember the password they were forced to choose, so they write them > down, defeating the purpose.  0 That depends on what your purpose happens to be.  > I gather that Doc Cypher's purpose is not to defend individual> accounts from people who might have access to the workspace of@ that individual.  In that context, having passwords so long that. people write them down seems quite acceptable.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 20:05:25 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)n$ Subject: Re: Newbie meets OpenVMS ;)3 Message-ID: <GlM7y9ufH9f2@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  a In article <16Q1eyaOY$WA@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:Ix > In article <20020422183326.10192.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:  M >> guessing routine on telnet (BTW, the system password is over 15 charactersoG >> long so it ain't going to be got with some silly dictionary attack).  > E > 	Well... if you don't want to cramp up in the System account typingo& > 	in the password, you might want to: >  > 6 > 			1)  Create another account with full privs (name 0 > 				that is impossible to guess:  HIDEAPRIV or > 				something like that) >  > 			2)  Make SYSTEM no local  > 4 > 			3)  Toggle SYSTEM account to local when time to' > 				upgrade or you wish to get in it.s  C The major advantage of the SYSTEM username is that from the consolesA it can overcome certain obstacles such as a breakin evasion basedeB denial-of-service attack.  That is certainly a reason to leave theC SYSTEM username enabled for the system console, but I see no reasone+ to leave it enabled for any other terminal.    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 12:55:43 -07007 From: uwe.leinberger@t-systems.com (Dr. Uwe Leinberger)/4 Subject: Re: Optical Jukebox operation under OpenVMS< Message-ID: <b6b2072c.0204221155.1f10032@posting.google.com>  { andrew.rycroft@intrinsitech.com (Andrew Rycroft) wrote in message news:<58ba0101.0204212314.4eece962@posting.google.com>...  > Hi,  > B > I have a system running OpenVMS v6.2 on an Alpha with an old DEC > Jukebox attached.y [snip]% > Total of 8426 files, 503255 blocks.n > F > We have had the hardware guys check the hardware, and they say there > are no errors. > 5 > What/why is this happening ? Any ideas appreciated.x >  > Thanks > AndrewD Maybe you should have a look at the errorlogs using ANAL/ERROR ? And0 post some of the relevant entries there, if any?   Cheers     Uwee   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:12:21 GMTy- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>n4 Subject: Re: Optical Jukebox operation under OpenVMS* Message-ID: <3CC4DEF9.3040100@qsl.network>   Andrew Rycroft wrote:c > Hi,r > B > I have a system running OpenVMS v6.2 on an Alpha with an old DEC > Jukebox attached.  > E > Lately it we have started getting the following errors when we do a2' > backup of it, or directory listing :-n >  > REORDERS_000298007.LIS;17 >                            5   9-NOV-2001 01:49:22.59Y > REORDERS_000298008.LIS;17 >                            4   9-NOV-2001 01:49:24.73g > REORDERS_000298009.LIS;1? > %DIRECT-E-OPENIN, error opening JBA40:[ARCHIVE]*.*;* as inputr1 > -RMS-E-FND, ACP file or directory lookup failed . > -SYSTEM-F-OPINCOMPL, operation is incomplete7 >                            5   9-NOV-2001 01:49:25.641  E Inspect the drive belts, and make sure that they are not starting to  C disintigrate from age.  Pieces of the drive belts can get into the >+ optical drive hardware causing read errors.]  , The drives and media may need to be cleaned.  7 I recommend keeping secondary backups of optical media.    -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Onlye   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:28:42 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>o' Subject: OT: Bill gates Whines in Courtt' Message-ID: <3CC4C99A.3D8E8C5D@fsi.net>t  C My daily update from InfoWeek mentions that Bill Gates testified intE court regarding the issue of the nine states that want stiffer action2* taken against him and his baby, Microsoft.  G How many posts have we seen here telling us to "stop whining" about VMS D and the state its in, and ranting at/about those who seeming connectD heir identity to VMS. Yet here is the (arguably) "richest man in theG world" getting up in court and whining about how the proposed rememdies B for his and his company's wrong doing would all but destroy the IT1 industry as we know it, not to mention Micro$hit.   , A "famous" motivational speaker, Joel WeldonA (http://www.winnerstrategies.com/Weldon.htm) once said (on how tooF achieve financial success), "Watch what the 'poor' people do, and then? don't do it." Others say, "watch the crowd - go in the oppositen direction".n  H From those we can infer that doing what "successful" people do (whateverH "success" means to you) should lead - after a time - to a similar degree of success.   D So, if "successful" people "whine" in public venues about stuff they don't like, why not us?w   -- o David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsh http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 03:03:30 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>v+ Subject: Re: OT: Bill gates Whines in Courtn' Message-ID: <3CC4D1C4.C5F29768@fsi.net>p  * Here's a better Joel Weldon link. Sorry...  " http://www.successcomesincans.com/   -- b David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/,   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:11:19 +0100:4 From: John Laird <john@laird-towers.freeserve.co.uk>6 Subject: Re: password history list: back to the future8 Message-ID: <6pn8cu0q7d7c56uksb8gicabtfo8d7qjms@4ax.com>  8 On Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:05:25 +0100 (MET), Phillip Helbig+ <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> wrote:n  % >I must be missing something here....h >dC >I saw it with my own eyes!  Scenario: the system disk on one of myaC >hobbyist systems crashes, backup is restored which doesn't contain I >rather new account, new account is created again (with ADDUSER.COM, just F >the defaults except for identifiers (gleaned from files in the user'sJ >account on a disk which didn't crash) and of course username etc), I log H >in to the new account using the password created during setup and want A >to change it back to what it was before the crash of the system lF >disk---but can't do so because the password was found in the history J >list!  No files had been moved off the system disk, the UAF etc were not E >cluster-wide and the only system files not on the crashed disk were j >secondary page and swap files.  >sI >Obvious question: since the restored backup was from a time before this aG >new account even existed, much less the password having been entered,  # >how can it be in the history list?l  F Maybe the password is in the system dictionary, and the first time youJ created the account you set the "let the user use passwords in the history5 list" flag ?  IIRC, this dictionary is in plain text.c     	Johne -- n
 John Laird Yezerski Roper Ltd   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 03:29:36 GMTp) From: rob.buxton@wcc.govt.nz (Rob Buxton)d, Subject: Re: Pathworks 6.1 exhausting KNBCBs2 Message-ID: <3cc4b459.2839557307@news.wcc.govt.nz>  C We do not run the License Server, and after a restart of one of the-D node there are only about 15 connections. The other node only has 22 and that's been up for 30 days.eB Even allowing for 30 sessions to be consumed by the PWIP Driver it' seems excessive to exhaust 70 sessions.t  - How do you determine if a session is "Stale"?i  D Under 6.0D I did not see this problem. Since going to 6.1 we've alsoF been updating clients to W2000. So, I'm not sure where the issue lies.E Also, under 6.0D, I only had the number of clients configured for 50.c  7 On Mon, 22 Apr 2002 06:18:19 GMT, as@if.com (MG) wrote:e  F If I see the problem again I'll try and get admin show connections and  nbshow knbstatus info. together.   Thanks for the feedback.   Rob. >Rob,rA >go into $admin/config tool and configure for at least 100 clienttA >sessions.  Approximately 30 sessions are consumed by the licensee, >server (if running) and TCP/IP PWIP driver. >tB >Also, at about the time the KNBCB errors occur, examine the ouputD >of "$admin show sessions" and count the sessions already consumed. ? >Watch for duplicate or stale sessions, and if found delete the A >sessions to regain some session slots.  Some of the newer Window D >clients are notorious for opening several sessions to a server, andF >sometimes the only way to recapture these is to restart the server or# >manually delete the old sessions.   >eG >I don't see external authentication causing any of this issue for you. F >Nor would increasing your Concurrent Signons from 10 to 30 do much to >alleviate your situation.   >a >HTH,- >Mike Greenv >g >s >a   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:00:22 +0200 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> ) Subject: Re: Problem: ODBC connect to RDBh& Message-ID: <3CC45DC6.842EA71@aaa.com>  : Well, not sure, this particular error/setting is something, most new installations asks about, so I just try to remember it...d  5 No, actualy I did a search using the search engine onu7 www.jcc.com for the particular error (ILLCHAR) and justu copied the solution :-)   - I searched the Oracle Rdb listserver archive.-  = B.t.w, *any* question regarding Rdb (or related products suchn: as SQL/Services, DECtrace/Expert and so on) are best asked= on the Rdb mailing list. There you find the true Rdb experts. ; Check www.jcc.com and look for instructions on how to join.p  	 Jan-Erik.o      i Alder wrote: > H > Just curious, Jan-Erik, but is there any documentation of the possible3 > settings for this INI file that you are aware of?u > 	 > Thanks,s > Alder  > 5 > "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in messages# > news:3CC41652.C75221D1@aaa.com...  > > Try to add : > >  > > RemoveControlChars=yes > >h > > to RDBODBC.INI.  > >i > > Jan-Erik Sderholm.  > >s > >c   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 14:38:32 -0700 * From: "Alder" <MUNDDGNTDYTV@spammotel.com>) Subject: Re: Problem: ODBC connect to RDBt+ Message-ID: <3cc48397$1@obsidian.gov.bc.ca>t   Thanks, I'll do that.,   Alder.    3 "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in messaget  news:3CC45DC6.842EA71@aaa.com...< > Well, not sure, this particular error/setting is something. > most new installations asks about, so I just > try to remember it...p >v7 > No, actualy I did a search using the search engine oni9 > www.jcc.com for the particular error (ILLCHAR) and justT > copied the solution :-)b > / > I searched the Oracle Rdb listserver archive.  > ? > B.t.w, *any* question regarding Rdb (or related products sucht< > as SQL/Services, DECtrace/Expert and so on) are best asked? > on the Rdb mailing list. There you find the true Rdb experts. = > Check www.jcc.com and look for instructions on how to join.  >  > Jan-Erik.' >s >r >e > Alder wrote: > >.J > > Just curious, Jan-Erik, but is there any documentation of the possible5 > > settings for this INI file that you are aware of?u > >t > > Thanks,n	 > > Alderf > >c7 > > "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in messagea% > > news:3CC41652.C75221D1@aaa.com...m > > > Try to add : > > >m > > > RemoveControlChars=yes > > >  > > > to RDBODBC.INI.g > > >3 > > > Jan-Erik Sderholm.s > > >w > > >    ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:48:09 +0100 (MET)o9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> N Subject: Re: Question about system messages, $SET MESSAGE, MESSAGE utility ...; Message-ID: <01KGVLRJROPY8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>    > 	$ exit %x0a38074t+ > 	%BACKUP-F-NOMSG, Message number 00A38074' > , > That is not a whole lot more helpful than: >  > 	$ exit %x2398074I( > 	%LJK-F-NOMSG, Message number 02398074  B Does it imply that HELP/MESSAGE will tell you more?  Does in this  example.   > 	$ exit %x0a3109ah/ > 	%BACKUP-E-OPENIN, error opening !AS as inputh > 	$ exit %x239109an, > 	%LJK-E-OPENIN, error opening !AS as input  I I see the !AS F$FAO directive in the message text from time to time: bug h or feature?    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 20:48:33 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)nN Subject: Re: Question about system messages, $SET MESSAGE, MESSAGE utility ...3 Message-ID: <RpDOM+LoBWbg@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  w In article <01KGVLRJROPY8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:v >> 	$ exit %x0a38074, >> 	%BACKUP-F-NOMSG, Message number 00A38074 >>  - >> That is not a whole lot more helpful than:k >> d >> 	$ exit %x2398074) >> 	%LJK-F-NOMSG, Message number 02398074a > 5 > Does it imply that HELP/MESSAGE will tell you more?e  C No, HELP/MESSAGE is quite independent of the runtime interpretationy of messages.   >> 	$ exit %x0a3109a0 >> 	%BACKUP-E-OPENIN, error opening !AS as input >> 	$ exit %x239109a- >> 	%LJK-E-OPENIN, error opening !AS as inpute > K > I see the !AS F$FAO directive in the message text from time to time: bug g
 > or feature?-  D That is unavoidable if you merely feed DCL a message code.  ProgramsG provide arguments to fill in the directives, but DCL only gets 32 bits.u  E One strategy is to only return "clean" message codes to DCL, but thata5 can be a bit of a bother without significant payback.'   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:36:09 +0000 (UTC) 1 From: sssslewis@lumina.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis)s Subject: Re: Save-set Format. Message-ID: <aa238p$142$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   "MANNY NORMAN, SR. SYSTEMS PROGRAMMER" <NORMAN_MANNY@ONLINE.EMICH.EDU> writes in article <01KGV6MM11NY95DAY3@ONLINE.EMICH.EDU> dated Mon, 22 Apr 2002 13:32:01 -0400 (EDT): E >	Can anyone point me to where I can get detailed information on VMS mN >save-set format(s)?  I have garnered a rough idea by looking at hex dumps of * >them, but I need something more specific.  G I don't know if DEC ever released the official spec, but there's a UnixfL utility called "vmsbackup" which reads backup savesets.  If you can find the@ source code for that, it might help you understand the format.    E The data format, at least.  The file header info is probably ignored.M  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.orgk> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 20:44:13 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)i Subject: Re: Save-set Format3 Message-ID: <$yckQmPOWEQA@eisner.encompasserve.org>o   In article <01KGV6MM11NY95DAY3@ONLINE.EMICH.EDU>, "MANNY NORMAN, SR. SYSTEMS PROGRAMMER" <NORMAN_MANNY@ONLINE.EMICH.EDU> writes:F > 	Can anyone point me to where I can get detailed information on VMS O > save-set format(s)?  I have garnered a rough idea by looking at hex dumps of t+ > them, but I need something more specific.a  = It was provided in VMS V3-V5 documentation or so.  The formatt@ has expanded since then, but BACKUP/LIST/ANALYZE should give you. enough information to incorporate the changes.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:42:54 GMTr- From: Terry C Shannon <shannon@world.std.com>e; Subject: Re: Some Lite Reading from SKC and www.openvms.orgeD Message-ID: <Pine.SGI.4.30.0204221840300.11135-100000@world.std.com>  % On Sun, 21 Apr 2002, Bill Todd wrote:d   >r> > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message7 > news:LaCw8.37131$%s3.15511040@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...  > > Constant Readers,m > >lF > > Five new back issues from Shannon Knows Compaq have been posted atN > > www.openvms.org.  The issues in question cover the merger and other timelyC > > phenemona. They are in PDF format and can be freely downloaded.  > >  > >eL > > SKCV9N1 January 3, 2002: Fearless Prognostications - Compaq's Changes in > > 2002L > > SKCV9N2 January 9, 2002: And Now For Something Completely Different from > CPQiN > > SKCV9N3 January 17, 2002: Compaq's January Earnings Surprise - Really Good > > NewsH > > SKCV9N4 February 1, 2002: Compaq Unveils First Blade in the ProLiant
 > > BL-Series G > > SKCV9N5 February 7, 2002: Merger Prospects Buoyed By European Uniono
 > Decision > >t
 > > Enjoy! > >h > > -- > > Terry C. Shannon > > Consultant and Publisher > > Shannon Knows Compaq& > > PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESS! > > email: terryshannon@attbi.com-6 > > Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org > >. > > PS-- Blatant "sales pitch" >:K > Truth in advertising would require that you describe much of the materials8 > you refer to above as a "blatant sales pitch" as well.    , Yawn... noted, deemed irrelevant, killfiled.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 01:55:18 GMTo From: noid@ulose.com; Subject: Re: Some Lite Reading from SKC and www.openvms.orgh# Message-ID: <3cc4bfb4.5239485@nntp>r  3 Talking to yourself now Terry, or was this a spoof?    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 13:25:27 -07007 From: uwe.leinberger@t-systems.com (Dr. Uwe Leinberger)   Subject: Re: SSH for Alpha OVMS?< Message-ID: <b6b2072c.0204221225.5ca3e63@posting.google.com>   "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com> wrote in message news:<craig.berry-414E66.13323519042002@news.directvinternet.com>... + > In article <3CC02EBC.4BE45DDF@UIowa.EDU>, + >  Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> wrote:t >  > > Kiasu Surfer wrote:eI > > > But OpenVMS, choices are limited. We don't intend to pay extras for I > > > these security enhancement, and we are further handicapped with theo/ > > > lack of compilers, namely the C compiler.a@ > > > We are unable to compile the available source found at OSU6 > > > ( http://kcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu/~jonesd/ssh/ ) > > K > > What was the problem building the OSU SSH v1.5 kit?  I have built it onnJ > > VAXen and Alpha from OpenVMS v6.2 -> v7.3 without a hitch.  As well as) > > the required OpenSSL (up to v0.9.6a).  > + > As he said, he doesn't have a C compiler.1 > I > > Until the Compaq TCP/IP has a built-in SSH server that works reliablyMJ > > (note there is none yet and when I asked at a teleconference last yearJ > > they said they had no immediate plans, so if it is being reported thatN > > it is coming, I am curious how well it is put together in such a hurry...) > H > Surely they can borrow from Tru64 or otherwise get something together   > without starting from scratch.  D Could not just some kind soul out there help the poor guy by sendingC him the readily compiled & linked images? I'm cut off my VMS-Box at:D the moment (my ISDN-Router back home broke, so I can't just get that done from abroad...)   Cheers!r   UweS   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:32:19 +0100 (MET) 9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>n9 Subject: Re: Sue, a great promotion for "unhackable" vms!r; Message-ID: <01KGVKXQAU7M8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>t  E > They'd do better working up something with a quirky band like _They D > Might Be Giants_, who'd probably be amused to write a VMS jingle. E > (Actually, to reach CEOs rather than young hackers, they should get0F > Elton John to rewrite -  no, not Candle in the Wind again - but "I'mB > still standing", and make a video showing huge disasters and VMSI > clusters staying up.  They could point out that John himself was big in9H > the 70s and is still big, like VMS.)  A lot of the people on corporateF > boards listened to him when they were younger and they still vaguely > think he's hip.   E Back when it was in the news that R.E.M. (I once said to my daughter yH "hey, I listen to SOME new music; I listen to R.E.M."---then I realised F that they have been around since before she was born!) refused to let F Microsoft use a song (they later used "Start Me Up" from the Stones), F there was much speculation on what song was considered.  I suggested, C from the point of view of the "Migrate from VMS to NT" challenged, dH "Losing My Religion", until someone suggested the much more appropriate H "It's the End of the World as We Know it, but I Feel Fine".  The thread F evolved into appropriate theme songs and the associated bands for DEC C etc.  Readers of this thread might like to fetch that one from the o	 archives.o   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:17:49 +0100 (MET)n9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>p/ Subject: Re: TCP/IP 5.0 Configuration Questionsn; Message-ID: <01KGVKI0LMXE8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>   A > What commands will I need to set my default gateway and my dns?e  A @SYS$MANAGER:TCPIP$CONFIG, hit A, then go through and answer the tI questions.  You will be prompted for the BIND resolver name and the name   of the default routing gateway.t  J > When using TCPIP$CONFIG.COM you can enable GATED routing (I think that'sJ > what's it's called.  Then you will have to set up the configuration fileJ > [TCPIP$GATED]TCPIP$GATED.CONF for your site and gateway.  This works for > me.   F If you have a small LAN with one route to the outside world (your DSL I router), you need just static routing.  Set the router to be the default i% route.  You will be asked for this.  /  H Be aware that things like SET NAME have a /SYSTEM qualifier; otherwise, E it is just for that process (useful for testing, for example).  Some nG commands are SET CONFIG xxx instead of SET xxx to make them permanent, . some have a /PERM qualifier.  D Do you want your VMS machine to be accessible from outside your LAN?  4 For sending mail, there are some non-obvious things.  = TCPIP SET CONFIG SMTP is what you want; there is no SET SMTP./  F Sometimes, the corresponding stuff needs to be taken down and brought F back up.  To be sure, you can always bring down all of TCPIP Services 8 and bring it back up (can be done from the config menu).  E The "alternate gateway" is the only one you need to know about---the MD general gateway is for non-SMTP mail, which you probably don't need.  A This mail gateway should probably be a machine at your ISP, i.e. hH probably NOT your DSL router (though that is the default gateway in the  context of routing).  H Look at moving to TCPIP 5.1 and (if you have VMS 7.3), to TCPIP 5.3 when) it comes out (5.2 is a DOE-only release).j   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:53:26 GMTr# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>rX Subject: Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!)H Message-ID: <aL_w8.37571$Gpn.19401@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message5 news:z7Ww8.38253$%s3.16273752@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...o >  > L > I have it on pretty reliable authority that a Statement of Support for VMSL > has been worked up by Carly's scriptwriters. I guess Carly is reluctant toE > go public with it until (and/or if) the acquisition is a done deal.n >aG > Were it me I would not be so reluctant. What's more, if DECpaq seniorcG > managers were aware of the level of concern and angst in the customert base, H > they would very likely adopt a more aggressive marketing and messagingJ > strategy. Since this is not the case, the Phrase that Pays is "What they > don't know WILL hurt them..."d >e  K If Mikey agreed with Carly's 'ghostwritten' vaporware statement, why hasn't:K he issued a definitive one of his own by now? He's still the CEO of a majorsJ company that just happens to own the product, and presumably is capable ofI issuing such a statement all by his lonesome self (though evidence to thee contrary abounds).  H Surely Carly and Mikey are working from the same script regarding VMS byH now. If not, then by extension, should the deal not go through, we wouldH probably expect to hear of VMS's cancellation from Mikey in short order.  E If Compaq & HP are supposed to be in cut-throat competition up to the.L closing of the merger, one would logically expect that VMS would be activelyL promoted - if VMS figured into Compaq-only long-term plans. But since CompaqJ is NOT actively promoting VMS, one can infer, assume, and bet, that Compaq# has had different plans than Carly.   K My bet is that if the deal is quashed by the Delaware court, Compaq revertsc> to a Wintel-only company. That's where it seems to want to be.    J As to comments about my tone in a couple of earlier posts, to those of youJ who were offended, my apologies. To those who are lurking from Compaq at a3 level high enough to matter, you deserve far worse.   J Not all business is conducted under the guise of 'Oh do come over for someB crumpets and tea, and we can discuss this jolly old VMS issue.' IfK management doesn't know why their customers are leaving them, they might beoL tempted to say that it's the customer's fault rather than taking a good longB look at their own policies and practices. If it takes a colloquialH expression or two to make some people who matter sit up and take notice, then so be it.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:46:58 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>eX Subject: Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!); Message-ID: <mx%w8.39364$%s3.16495765@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>   . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageB news:aL_w8.37571$Gpn.19401@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... >o> > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message7 > news:z7Ww8.38253$%s3.16273752@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...h > >g > >sJ > > I have it on pretty reliable authority that a Statement of Support for VMSdK > > has been worked up by Carly's scriptwriters. I guess Carly is reluctant, toG > > go public with it until (and/or if) the acquisition is a done deal.C > >/I > > Were it me I would not be so reluctant. What's more, if DECpaq seniorhI > > managers were aware of the level of concern and angst in the customer  > base, J > > they would very likely adopt a more aggressive marketing and messagingL > > strategy. Since this is not the case, the Phrase that Pays is "What they! > > don't know WILL hurt them..."  > >  >JF > If Mikey agreed with Carly's 'ghostwritten' vaporware statement, why hasn't/ > he issued a definitive one of his own by now?o  J Good question, and one I can't answer. Perhaps somebody from VMS Marketing/ can step in and provide some assistance here...o   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 17:14:35 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>sY Subject: Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!)  , Message-ID: <3CC47D37.955F69E1@videotron.ca>  & re: secret letter Carly won't release.  8 While checking my belly button for lint, I got to think.  N What if Carly isn't really sure the merger is going to go through.  Tandem wasH never in question at Compaq. It is a sacred cow that can't be killed. So9 announcing that HP would continue Tandem changes nothing.   H But all that Compaq has done so far is tell *existing* customers that itG intends to honour it commitments to them (except for Alpha, of course).c  L No, if the merger isn't going to go though, it would be to Carly's advantageJ to let Compaq continue to screw itself by restricting VMS to the remainingN customer base only. If Carly were to announce today that under HP, , she wouldG be pushing VMS and maximising its potential etc etc, that would give anrL instant boost to VMS, and should the merger not go through, that boost wouldM benefit Compaq, not HP. It would also essentially force Compaq to honour HP's2V stated wished for VMS, which would be against Compaq's policies of sticking to wintel.  J I am not sure how likely the above is. Just a possibility I guess. I thinkN that Carly perhaps just doesn't see VMS as strategic enough to bother with it.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:04:10 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>iY Subject: Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no merger!) 7' Message-ID: <3CC4C3DB.59397946@fsi.net>A   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:h > [snip]L > I have it on pretty reliable authority that a Statement of Support for VMSL > has been worked up by Carly's scriptwriters. I guess Carly is reluctant toE > go public with it until (and/or if) the acquisition is a done deal.S > G > Were it me I would not be so reluctant. What's more, if DECpaq seniortM > managers were aware of the level of concern and angst in the customer base, H > they would very likely adopt a more aggressive marketing and messagingJ > strategy. Since this is not the case, the Phrase that Pays is "What they > don't know WILL hurt them..."E  H I would rephrase that this way: "What current and/or potential customers+ do not know will continue to hurt OpenVMS"..  K > There is a disconnect between the Skonetski/Main/Kleinsorge level and thesK > Marcello/Elias/Capellas level. Eliminate the disconnect, or find a way to L > get information into the faces of the Big Dogs, and the problem just might
 > go away.  H Ah yes - the Holy Grail of Salvation for OpenVMS: so clear in our minds, yet so eternally elusive...A   -- u David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsr http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/	   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:06:02 +0100 (MET) 9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>bN Subject: Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64; Message-ID: <01KGVK7Y5JAA8ZF8CR@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>t  C > However, I think VMS will survive in "maintenance mode" until thea? > alpha chip is completely out of the market (2009 or 2012?).  i  I At least.  If VMS works on Itanium---and there is no serious evidence to 26 suggest that it won't---it will be around even longer.  	 > VMS hassG > been in maintenance mode for quite some time now anyway--it's nothingr > new.    F A lot of new features have appeared recently.  Where are you and what  VMS are you running?  E > What the new-HP will do is evaluate the costs of maintaining VMS as)- > opposed to the revenue that it brings in.  t  ( In that case, they will keep it forever.  6 > They're banking on the hopes that IPF will be at theF > alpha level soon and that's not going to happen for quite some time,4 > not even if they've got all the alpha engineers.    I It's enough if the performance is good enough for the customers who need  % it when ALPHA is no longer available.   E In science, there is a tradition of public bets, like Kip Thorne and n@ Steven Hawking betting subscriptions to Playboy and Private Eye H depending on whether a black hole is discovered by year X etc.  Perhaps H there should be some such bets here, to be paid off in some public forum8 (like a party watching the Superbowl halftime VMS show).  2 There is only one hidden smiley in the above text!   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 19:37:13 -0700& From: theaugur@hotmail.com (the augur)N Subject: Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64= Message-ID: <d39e6c16.0204221837.7d047b80@posting.google.com>r  D Noticing that this is an openvms advocacy group, I will refrain fromF mentioning the performance of the java vm's on vms as opposed to otherC operating systems.  I will also not mention the number of certified D J2EE application servers on VMS (NT has at least 20 good ones at 1/4E the price).  And if you think Java is going to be anymore reliable onrD VMS than on NT or any other operating system for that matter, you'reB going to be in for a real surprise!  And how come VMS was the lastE operating system to certify Weblogic?  I think 6.1 was out about halfdE a year ago and VMS just got it certified a few weeks ago.  Wow, great E e-business infrastructure you've got there, way ahead of the curve!! R@ So while you're waiting in the wings for solid solutions to comeB together, companies like IBM and Sun are eating your lunch.  WhileB we're on the topic of app servers, why don't you tell me about theB transactional capabilities of BEA Weblogic on VMS?  Oh??  It can'tE connect to DECdtm???  NO WAY?!  IMPOSSIBLE!  Wait, but isn't that the D main transactional processing manager on VMS?  Yes you say?  I can'tF hear you, you'll have to speak up.  How about security?  YOu mentionedC security or highlighted some web article on it--does VMS have ssh? v> What about a pki generator?  What's the performance of RSA keyA encryption/decryption on VMS?  How about the distribution of youriA pseudo-random number generator?  What?  Don't have one?  That's al pity.d  > Let's get the facts straight here, that's all.  VMS is a greatD operating system, yes, but it's been destroyed by a few too many andD it is definitely not growing at the rate it should be.  Just look atA the average age of the engineers in vms and you'll soon find thatfD growth is not the case.  And if you want further proof, just look atB how they've downsized the group over the last years, even the good years back before 1998.e  # VMS needs some major restructuring.   @ And stop using the lame "person posts without a real name" crap,E nobody cares to get personal with the likes of you, just present youro( facts and get on with your life--sheesh!     "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> wrote in message news:<BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1E99@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>...pG > >> you will not see complete b2b/b2c solutions from VMS or any of the 9 > other fads out there today, that's an impossibility. <<m > F > Forgetting the fact that this person posts without a real name, theyI > obviously feel ISV's are not jumping on the Java bandwagon (which meansRI > applications for OpenVMS) .. Or simply ignores the fact that OpenVMS isM > winning new business E.g.  > ? > http://www.dataglider.com/solutions/openvms.html (Web enablede > applications for OpenVMS) 1 > http://www.iona.com/pressroom/2002/20020327.htmrC > IONA ANNOUNCES ORBIX E2A APPLICATION SERVER PLATFORM FOR COMPAQ'S  > OPENVMS OPERATING SYSTEM > D > IONA Orbix E2A Application Server Platform Enables Development andB > Deployment of Web Services Applications in the OpenVMS Operating
 > Environment  > D > JavaOnesm Conference 2002 - San Francisco, CA. - March 27, 2002 --D > IONA(r), the leading e-Business Platform provider for Web ServicesE > Integration (NASDAQ: IONA), today announced the availability of thehI > Orbix E2A(tm) Application Server Platform on Compaq's OpenVMS operatingiF > system. IONA's Orbix E2A Application Server Platform offers Compaq'sE > OpenVMS customers a J2EE(tm)-compliant and Web services-architected G > platform for application and e- Business infrastructure development."e > + > Or that OpenVMS is winning new business - 8 > http://www.mgex.com/news/news releases/release28.html C > "February 21, 2002 : Successful Launch of Electronic Trading, New:) > Contracts at Minneapolis Grain Exchangee > + > http://www.onexchange.com/press112601.asp G > "As a result of close engineering and lab work between the companies, H > onExchange has successfully deployed its Java standard clearing systemH > and trading engine, using the BEA WebLogic Server, on Compaq's OpenVMSI > AlphaServer systems. The ease with which onExchange was able to certify H > on the OpenVMS environment demonstrates the strength of the onExchangeI > solution design and the suitability of the OpenVMS environment, and BEAcA > WebLogic Server as a platform for J2EE-compliant solutions. The 7 > onExchange system is available to OpenVMS users now."  > C > Or that Security is not a big factor in determining new business:eH > http://www.irconnect.com/noc/pages/news releases.mhtml?d=21764 (US Air > Force JSTARS program)e > 
 > Regards, >  >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > Compaq Canada Corp.o > Professional Servicese > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax  :  819-772-7036 > Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com >  >  > -----Original Message-----0 > From: the augur [mailto:theaugur@hotmail.com]  > Sent: April 21, 2002 6:47 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComfJ > Subject: Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to > IA-64  >  > ! > Right Jeff--big time overlap.    > I > However, I think VMS will survive in "maintenance mode" until the alphaNH > chip is completely out of the market (2009 or 2012?).  VMS has been inI > maintenance mode for quite some time now anyway--it's nothing new.  You"E > don't just stop an enterprise level operating system overnight, you J > minimalize effort on it and place a few people in charge to take care ofI > it.  There are things like commitments that even a dogg`ed company like   > the new HP will have to honor. > E > What the new-HP will do is evaluate the costs of maintaining VMS as.G > opposed to the revenue that it brings in.  True, the New-HP will needhJ > some quick turnaround on revenue to please the naysayers in Wall Street,F > but VMS does bring in a little for very low investment (i think lessE > than 400 employees).  And as for chopping off employees when things D > start to go bad, there's no doubt that she will be chopping beforeJ > things go bad, she's got a history of that.  Most of those less than 4000 > within VMS are managers and dead wood anyway. I > Chop chop!  Whoever heard of an engineering company with a 3:1 ratio offJ > managers to engineers?  Chop chop, I'll even supply the Palmer sized ax! > J > OpenVMS on IPF is going to be ridiculous, that's like replacing a porcheJ > engine with a geo metro engine.  In all sincerity, VMS should not do theI > port.  They're banking on the hopes that IPF will be at the alpha leveluF > soon and that's not going to happen for quite some time, not even ifG > they've got all the alpha engineers.  But I guess if you don't do the I > port, customers will get the message very clearly and start thinking ofoI > alternatives.  Who knows, maybe the good HP marketing folk can skew the H > facts about IPF.  But let's keep in mind that customers, a good bit ofA > them, are extremely frugal and will down the marketing hypes of C > intel/microsoft.  So cheap is always better, and VMS is not that.a > H > To properly give VMS a breath of life, a company, any company, whetherG > it's HP, Compaq, Digital, EDS, would have to undo the palmer mess and J > that's way too bad.  So to end a meaningless argument, VMS will never beI > in the spotlight as much as UNIX/Linux or even Windows NT, you will nottF > see complete b2b/b2c solutions from VMS or any of the other fads outH > there today, that's an impossibility.  HP knows this, but how much can4 > they bank before everyone else figures this out... >  >  >    > : > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message* > news:<3CA8939D.CDFE4ECA@videotron.ca>... > > John Smith wrote: H > > > Killing VMS is one of those things that doesn't make sense, but I  > > > bet it'll happen anyway. > > B > > It makes sense if one is out to consolidate product lines and B > > eliminate product overlaps. VMS overlaps both tandem and unix. > > H > > It makes sense if one is told that it would be possible to retain a E > > good portion of the VMS customers by proceeding in a certain way.  > > G > > Carly has made a lot of promises. The minute she realises that the oE > > integration isn't going smoothly, she will start to play musical eC > > chairs, layoff additional staff and cut additional products to rA > > rationalise the company and focus on its core incompetancies.y   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:43:22 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>hN Subject: Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64; Message-ID: <eT3x8.41068$%s3.16689541@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>n  3 "the augur" <theaugur@hotmail.com> wrote in messagei7 news:d39e6c16.0204221837.7d047b80@posting.google.com...e@ > Let's get the facts straight here, that's all.  VMS is a greatF > operating system, yes, but it's been destroyed by a few too many andF > it is definitely not growing at the rate it should be.  Just look atC > the average age of the engineers in vms and you'll soon find thatfF > growth is not the case.  And if you want further proof, just look atD > how they've downsized the group over the last years, even the good > years back before 1998.u > % > VMS needs some major restructuring.i  K Well, aside from being unduly downsized, VMS Engineering seems to be OK. So  what would you restructure?n   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:29:16 -0400r+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> N Subject: RE: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1EAE@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  H >>> Noticing that this is an openvms advocacy group, I will refrain fromF mentioning the performance of the java vm's on vms as opposed to other operating systems.<<<d  G Oh you mean like the + or - 5% of Tru64 Java numbers that was shown viakA internal testing with latest OpenVMS Java release? And Tru64 Javao% numbers are definitely not to shabby.h  G >>> How about security?  YOu mentioned security or highlighted some web % article on it--does VMS have ssh? <<<o  E Yep. SSH1 and SSH2 via freeware and commercial sources. So whats your- point?  ? Rest of stuff is obviously not worth wasting time on as you are F obviously one that is not going to be even the slightest bit pursuaded no matter what is said.o   :-)    Regardse  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant% Compaq Canada Corp.@ Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660y Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----0 From: the augur [mailto:theaugur@hotmail.com]=20 Sent: April 22, 2002 10:37 PM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com5H Subject: Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alpha to IA-64y    D Noticing that this is an openvms advocacy group, I will refrain fromF mentioning the performance of the java vm's on vms as opposed to otherH operating systems.  I will also not mention the number of certified J2EEC application servers on VMS (NT has at least 20 good ones at 1/4 thesE price).  And if you think Java is going to be anymore reliable on VMS F than on NT or any other operating system for that matter, you're goingF to be in for a real surprise!  And how come VMS was the last operatingF system to certify Weblogic?  I think 6.1 was out about half a year agoE and VMS just got it certified a few weeks ago.  Wow, great e-businessi< infrastructure you've got there, way ahead of the curve!!=20@ So while you're waiting in the wings for solid solutions to comeH together, companies like IBM and Sun are eating your lunch.  While we're< on the topic of app servers, why don't you tell me about theB transactional capabilities of BEA Weblogic on VMS?  Oh??  It can'tE connect to DECdtm???  NO WAY?!  IMPOSSIBLE!  Wait, but isn't that theCD main transactional processing manager on VMS?  Yes you say?  I can'tF hear you, you'll have to speak up.  How about security?  YOu mentionedE security or highlighted some web article on it--does VMS have ssh?=20 > What about a pki generator?  What's the performance of RSA keyA encryption/decryption on VMS?  How about the distribution of your G pseudo-random number generator?  What?  Don't have one?  That's a pity.   H Let's get the facts straight here, that's all.  VMS is a great operating@ system, yes, but it's been destroyed by a few too many and it isB definitely not growing at the rate it should be.  Just look at theG average age of the engineers in vms and you'll soon find that growth isaF not the case.  And if you want further proof, just look at how they'veH downsized the group over the last years, even the good years back before 1998.o  # VMS needs some major restructuring.p  G And stop using the lame "person posts without a real name" crap, nobodywH cares to get personal with the likes of you, just present your facts and get on with your life--sheesh!    6 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> wrote in messageH news:<BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1E99@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp net>...-G > >> you will not see complete b2b/b2c solutions from VMS or any of thed9 > other fads out there today, that's an impossibility. <<o >=20I > Forgetting the fact that this person posts without a real name, they=20DF > obviously feel ISV's are not jumping on the Java bandwagon (which=20G > means applications for OpenVMS) .. Or simply ignores the fact that=20V& > OpenVMS is winning new business E.g. >=20B > http://www.dataglider.com/solutions/openvms.html (Web enabled=20 > applications for OpenVMS)=201 > http://www.iona.com/pressroom/2002/20020327.htmtF > IONA ANNOUNCES ORBIX E2A APPLICATION SERVER PLATFORM FOR COMPAQ'S=20 > OPENVMS OPERATING SYSTEM >=20G > IONA Orbix E2A Application Server Platform Enables Development and=20sE > Deployment of Web Services Applications in the OpenVMS Operating=20 
 > Environmento >=20G > JavaOnesm Conference 2002 - San Francisco, CA. - March 27, 2002 --=20nG > IONA(r), the leading e-Business Platform provider for Web Services=20 H > Integration (NASDAQ: IONA), today announced the availability of the=20B > Orbix E2A(tm) Application Server Platform on Compaq's OpenVMS=20J > operating system. IONA's Orbix E2A Application Server Platform offers=20< > Compaq's OpenVMS customers a J2EE(tm)-compliant and Web=20B > services-architected platform for application and e- Business=20 > infrastructure development." >=20. > Or that OpenVMS is winning new business -=20H > http://www.mgex.com/news/news releases/release28.html "February 21,=20E > 2002 : Successful Launch of Electronic Trading, New Contracts at=20  > Minneapolis Grain Exchange >=20+ > http://www.onexchange.com/press112601.aspgJ > "As a result of close engineering and lab work between the companies,=20H > onExchange has successfully deployed its Java standard clearing system  H > and trading engine, using the BEA WebLogic Server, on Compaq's OpenVMS  D > AlphaServer systems. The ease with which onExchange was able to=20H > certify on the OpenVMS environment demonstrates the strength of the=20B > onExchange solution design and the suitability of the OpenVMS=20J > environment, and BEA WebLogic Server as a platform for J2EE-compliant=20F > solutions. The onExchange system is available to OpenVMS users now." >=20F > Or that Security is not a big factor in determining new business:=20H > http://www.irconnect.com/noc/pages/news releases.mhtml?d=3D21764 (US = Airo   > Force JSTARS program)  >=20
 > Regards, >=20 >=20 > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant' > Compaq Canada Corp.o > Professional Services  > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax  :  819-772-7036 > Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com >=20 >=20 > -----Original Message-----/ > From: the augur [mailto:theaugur@hotmail.com]s > Sent: April 21, 2002 6:47 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComaG > Subject: Re: The Digital 7-year plan - from 1997 to 2004 - from Alphae to > IA-64e >=20 >=20 > Right Jeff--big time overlap.. >=20F > However, I think VMS will survive in "maintenance mode" until the=20I > alpha chip is completely out of the market (2009 or 2012?).  VMS has=20sJ > been in maintenance mode for quite some time now anyway--it's nothing=20C > new.  You don't just stop an enterprise level operating system=20 E > overnight, you minimalize effort on it and place a few people in=20 G > charge to take care of it.  There are things like commitments that=20c< > even a dogg`ed company like the new HP will have to honor. >=20H > What the new-HP will do is evaluate the costs of maintaining VMS as=20J > opposed to the revenue that it brings in.  True, the New-HP will need=20E > some quick turnaround on revenue to please the naysayers in Wall=20 F > Street, but VMS does bring in a little for very low investment (i=20G > think less than 400 employees).  And as for chopping off employees=20nC > when things start to go bad, there's no doubt that she will be=20tI > chopping before things go bad, she's got a history of that.  Most of=20oH > those less than 400 within VMS are managers and dead wood anyway. Chop  G > chop!  Whoever heard of an engineering company with a 3:1 ratio of=20 I > managers to engineers?  Chop chop, I'll even supply the Palmer sized=20I > ax!S >=20F > OpenVMS on IPF is going to be ridiculous, that's like replacing a=20I > porche engine with a geo metro engine.  In all sincerity, VMS should=20 H > not do the port.  They're banking on the hopes that IPF will be at the  I > alpha level soon and that's not going to happen for quite some time,=20cI > not even if they've got all the alpha engineers.  But I guess if you=20dG > don't do the port, customers will get the message very clearly and=20hB > start thinking of alternatives.  Who knows, maybe the good HP=20I > marketing folk can skew the facts about IPF.  But let's keep in mind=20 H > that customers, a good bit of them, are extremely frugal and will down  H > the marketing hypes of intel/microsoft.  So cheap is always better,=20 > and VMS is not that. >=20H > To properly give VMS a breath of life, a company, any company, whether  J > it's HP, Compaq, Digital, EDS, would have to undo the palmer mess and=20J > that's way too bad.  So to end a meaningless argument, VMS will never=20H > be in the spotlight as much as UNIX/Linux or even Windows NT, you will  I > not see complete b2b/b2c solutions from VMS or any of the other fads=20eH > out there today, that's an impossibility.  HP knows this, but how much  8 > can they bank before everyone else figures this out... >=20 >=20 > =20s >=20= > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message=20w* > news:<3CA8939D.CDFE4ECA@videotron.ca>... > > John Smith wrote:rG > > > Killing VMS is one of those things that doesn't make sense, but Ia > > > bet it'll happen anyway. > >=20A > > It makes sense if one is out to consolidate product lines and B > > eliminate product overlaps. VMS overlaps both tandem and unix. > >=20G > > It makes sense if one is told that it would be possible to retain a E > > good portion of the VMS customers by proceeding in a certain way.  > >=20F > > Carly has made a lot of promises. The minute she realises that theG > > integration isn't going smoothly, she will start to play musical=20 E > > chairs, layoff additional staff and cut additional products to=20PA > > rationalise the company and focus on its core incompetancies.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 16:59:36 -0700tM From: "Kenneth H. Fairfield" <Kenneth.H.Fairfield@spam-be-gone.intel.com.net>n5 Subject: Re: Time to finally rename VMS back to VMS ?e: Message-ID: <3CC4A3E8.41D63988@spam-be-gone.intel.com.net>   Sue Skonetski wrote:  . > I just wanted to post a small reply to this. >lM > From personal experience I have learned that most customers view VMS as VMSE$ > on VAX and OpenVMS as VMS on Alpha >p" > It has nothing to do with logic. >m > suea  A Most of _my_ customers (internal) call our OpenVMS/Alpha systems,e           "The VAX"     :-) :-)           -------  = I doing my part to attempt to re-educate them, but "VAX" is ae= single syllable, "Alpha" means an early software release, andhC "VMS" is three syllables.  Guess which one sticks in the brain? :-}g       -Ken --6 I don't speak for Intel, Intel doesn't speak for me...  
 Ken Fairfield ! F20 Automation VMS System Support  kenneth.h.fairfield#intel.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:54:12 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>h5 Subject: Re: Time to finally rename VMS back to VMS ?e, Message-ID: <3CC4BEC4.B36795A8@videotron.ca>   "Kenneth H. Fairfield" wrote:xC > Most of _my_ customers (internal) call our OpenVMS/Alpha systems,e >  >         "The VAX"     :-) :-)p >          -------  
 Hear ! Hear !    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 02:50:02 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 5 Subject: Re: Time to finally rename VMS back to VMS ?e' Message-ID: <3CC4CE99.4B90EB97@fsi.net>A   JF Mezei wrote:  >  > "Kenneth H. Fairfield" wrote:iE > > Most of _my_ customers (internal) call our OpenVMS/Alpha systems,c > >3! > >         "The VAX"     :-) :-)  > >          ------- >  > Hear ! Hear !-  E Even better: the users who ask, "Does VAX run on Alpha?" or "Does VMS  run under VAX?"1  F So many believe(d), even to this day, that The VAX was VMS and VMS wasF The VAX ("the worm is the spice, the spice is the worm", from "Dune").   -- - David J. Dachtera  dba DJE SystemsI http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 12:43:13 -07003 From: Eric Smith <eric-no-spam-for-me@brouhaha.com>t Subject: Re: VAX/Alpha CIp0 Message-ID: <qhelh74izy.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>   I wrote:I > Speaking of which, I just bought two CIPCA-AA at auction and would likecH > to write a Linux driver.  Was any programming information on the CIPCA? > published?  If not, is there any way to get the source to thet2 > SYS$PCA without spending a vast amount of money?  O "Kenneth H. Fairfield" <Kenneth.H.Fairfield@spam-be-gone.intel.com.net> writes:t@ > Before you get too far along with this, are you aware that the> > HSC50 is NOT supported by CIPCA's?  That is, you must REMOVE= > any HSC50s on the CI if you're going to have any CIPCA's ont > it.n  J Sounds like it's just a software issue, especially since it does work withH the HSC70.  Doesn't the HSC70  uses the same CI interface module (L0100)
 as the HSC50?   G Anyhow, I won't be connecting an HSC50 to the CIPCA.  The CIPCA will be A connected to a CI20 on a KL10, and I want to write Linux softwarezF (including a CIPCA driver) to simulate an HSC50 in 576-byte-block mode for use with TOPS-10.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 22:02:43 GMTt& From: Bob Willard <BobwBSGS@attbi.com> Subject: Re: VAX/Alpha CIu) Message-ID: <3CC48971.95D07C6B@attbi.com>    Eric Smith wrote:e > 
 > I wrote:K > > Speaking of which, I just bought two CIPCA-AA at auction and would liketJ > > to write a Linux driver.  Was any programming information on the CIPCAA > > published?  If not, is there any way to get the source to thea4 > > SYS$PCA without spending a vast amount of money? > Q > "Kenneth H. Fairfield" <Kenneth.H.Fairfield@spam-be-gone.intel.com.net> writes:nB > > Before you get too far along with this, are you aware that the@ > > HSC50 is NOT supported by CIPCA's?  That is, you must REMOVE? > > any HSC50s on the CI if you're going to have any CIPCA's on  > > it.s > L > Sounds like it's just a software issue, especially since it does work withJ > the HSC70.  Doesn't the HSC70  uses the same CI interface module (L0100) > as the HSC50?b > I > Anyhow, I won't be connecting an HSC50 to the CIPCA.  The CIPCA will benC > connected to a CI20 on a KL10, and I want to write Linux softwareeH > (including a CIPCA driver) to simulate an HSC50 in 576-byte-block mode > for use with TOPS-10.   C I think you are hosed.  IIRC, the CIPCA (both -AA and -BA versions)wD can only share a CI with other nodes that support 4K packets; that'sF why HSC50s and older CI host adapters are disallowed.  {ISTR that someC HSC70s and/or some CIXCDs/CIBCAs had to be brought up to rev for 4KvD packets, but I won't swear to that.}  The CIPCA was never tried with@ a CI20, and I'll give good odds that CI20s don't use 4K packets. -- o Cheers, Bobt   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Apr 2002 22:41:12 -07003 From: Eric Smith <eric-no-spam-for-me@brouhaha.com>  Subject: Re: VAX/Alpha CIo0 Message-ID: <qh7kmzx98n.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>  ( Bob Willard <BobwBSGS@attbi.com> writes:E > I think you are hosed.  IIRC, the CIPCA (both -AA and -BA versions)pF > can only share a CI with other nodes that support 4K packets; that'sH > why HSC50s and older CI host adapters are disallowed.  {ISTR that someE > HSC70s and/or some CIXCDs/CIBCAs had to be brought up to rev for 4K F > packets, but I won't swear to that.}  The CIPCA was never tried withB > a CI20, and I'll give good odds that CI20s don't use 4K packets.  B That still sounds like a software problem.  I doubt that the CIPCAG hardware or firmware is incapable of dealing with smaller packets; it'ssC probably just a matter of the VMS driver wanting to use 4K packets.a  J Can the CI780 handle 4K packets?  If so, since the CI20 design is similar, it probably can as well.  E The CI20 doesn't normally use 4K packets.  To determine whether it isoF capable of dealing with them, I'd have to study the CI20 print set and the CI20 microcode sources.M  D But given that there doesn't appear to be any way that I can get theB source to the CIPCA driver, maybe I'll have to build my own PCI CID adapter using an FPGA.  Building RP06 and TU77 emulators is a higher priority, though.M   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Apr 2002 18:17:58 GMT= From: jlw@psulias.psu.edu (j.lance wilkinson, (814) 865-1818)B1 Subject: Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of lifee, Message-ID: <aa1k4m$110c@r02n01.cac.psu.edu>  e In article <aa18u7$6vuli$1@ID-141708.news.dfncis.de>, "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:pL >But are you sure that they harvested your e-mail from here? I too post withL >my true e-mail address, I get a lot of spam from complete idiots, but I gotI >nothing from Attunity. If they had harvested from this newsgroup I wouldo@ >have received it. Did you ask them where they got your address?  > What about attendance at a VMS-oriented conference or seminar?   	*blank spaces to make myc 		response acceptablen	 			to my o 			newss 		server who 	wants my reply to n 		exceed the quoted  			material   K Say, for example, they pulled it from a vendor at CETS2001?  Off a business-I card, perhaps?  I know that the address I received the "white paper" spamf8 at was an address that CETS2001 would probably have had.  P +----"Never Underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of mag tapes"--+B | J.Lance Wilkinson ("Lance")		InterNet:  Lance.Wilkinson@psu.edu < | Systems Design Specialist - Lead	AT&T:      (814) 865-18189 | Digital Library Technologies		FAX:       (814) 863-3560t2 | 3 Paterno Library				"I'd rather be dancing..." B | Penn State University		    A host is a host from coast to coast,K | University Park, PA 16802	    And no one will talk to a host that's closeeC | <postmaster@psulias.psu.edu>	    Unless the host that isn't close/: | EMail Professional since 1978	    Is busy, hung or dead.P +---------"He's dead, Jim. I'll get his tricorder. You take his wallet."-------+9                 [apologies to DeForest Kelley, 1920-1999]a3 <A Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu">home page</a> tJ <a Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu/junkdec.htm">junk mail declaration</a> --	/"\ 	\ /	ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN 	 X	AGAINST HTML MAILo 	/ \   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Apr 02 20:42:13 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)p1 Subject: Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of lifee) Message-ID: <CGrcUb3Bxihj@elias.decus.ch>n  Q In article <3CC439CF.BF47C3F6@rdrop.com>, Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> writes:t > Peter Weaver wrote:tH > As I've not heard any complaints about this spam from other members ofD > the WetLeather list, Occam's chainsaw suggests they found it here. > 4 >> If they had harvested from this newsgroup I wouldB >> have received it. Did you ask them where they got your address? > J > Assuming they didn't throw out the '.ca' suffix as an anti-spam measure,F > or that you posted in the timeframe they picked to harvest addressesB > from.  Also note that I [typically] include my email in my .sig. > J > (Did anyone who takes anti-spam steps, or doesn't include their email in > their .sig, recieve this?)  $ I don't include my email in my .sig. I didn't receive this spam.u+ The addresses in my headers are valid ones.i  A I was wondering if the list was being processed alphabetically...  __
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 15:15:42 -0400s5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>i1 Subject: Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of lifeu, Message-ID: <aa1nql$26qk$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  J They harvested it from this conference.  The mail address I use here, goesL to a VMS account that I get almost no "real" mail at anymore.  I get lots ofJ spam however - including the Attunity mailing.  I only use that particularF mail account externally for the return address when reading News only.  I This morning I got spam mail for I think was some type of sex.  It was intF German - so it's just a guess ;-)  I wonder if the spam bots are smartL enough to spot what they think looks like a German surname, and send mail in the appropriate language.O  K Of course, 99% of the spam is in HTML or some other mime encoded cruft that0L I simple circular file safely (since it went to a VMS account).  I have not,H nor will I ever pay attention to, or buy anything that I have seen in an% unsolicited email or web page advert.N      6 j.lance wilkinson, (814) 865-1818 wrote in message ...E >In article <aa18u7$6vuli$1@ID-141708.news.dfncis.de>, "Peter Weaver"a  <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:H >>But are you sure that they harvested your e-mail from here? I too post withI >>my true e-mail address, I get a lot of spam from complete idiots, but Ie gotiJ >>nothing from Attunity. If they had harvested from this newsgroup I wouldA >>have received it. Did you ask them where they got your address?  >l? >What about attendance at a VMS-oriented conference or seminar?m >O > *blank spaces to make my > response acceptable0 > to myq > news > server who > wants my reply ton > exceed the quoteda
 > material >fL >Say, for example, they pulled it from a vendor at CETS2001?  Off a businessJ >card, perhaps?  I know that the address I received the "white paper" spam9 >at was an address that CETS2001 would probably have had.e >uG >+----"Never Underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of mag 	 tapes"--+=A >| J.Lance Wilkinson ("Lance") InterNet:  Lance.Wilkinson@psu.edu = >| Systems Design Specialist - Lead AT&T:      (814) 865-1818x9 >| Digital Library Technologies FAX:       (814) 863-3560 / >| 3 Paterno Library "I'd rather be dancing..."LB >| Penn State University     A host is a host from coast to coast,L >| University Park, PA 16802     And no one will talk to a host that's closeD >| <postmaster@psulias.psu.edu>     Unless the host that isn't close; >| EMail Professional since 1978     Is busy, hung or dead.i@ >+---------"He's dead, Jim. I'll get his tricorder. You take his wallet."-------+: >                [apologies to DeForest Kelley, 1920-1999]3 ><A Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu">home page</a> K ><a Href="http://perdita.lcs.psu.edu/junkdec.htm">junk mail declaration</a>  >-- /"\  > \ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGNa > X AGAINST HTML MAILr > / \  >e   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:32:29 GMTc1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>K1 Subject: Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of lifee; Message-ID: <1HYw8.38287$%s3.16377697@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>   J "j.lance wilkinson, (814) 865-1818" <jlw@psulias.psu.edu> wrote in message& news:aa1k4m$110c@r02n01.cac.psu.edu...F > In article <aa18u7$6vuli$1@ID-141708.news.dfncis.de>, "Peter Weaver"  <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:I > >But are you sure that they harvested your e-mail from here? I too posty withJ > >my true e-mail address, I get a lot of spam from complete idiots, but I gotsK > >nothing from Attunity. If they had harvested from this newsgroup I wouldsB > >have received it. Did you ask them where they got your address? >a@ > What about attendance at a VMS-oriented conference or seminar?  L That's where they got my email; I've been to a couple of Attunity events and2 the firm makes sure it gets your demographic info.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 16:30:52 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 1 Subject: Re: VMS Spammer, the lowest form of lifey, Message-ID: <3CC472FB.723ECC7F@videotron.ca>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:A > This morning I got spam mail for I think was some type of sex. h  I What type of sex ? If you don't know, perhaps you should take their offert seriously :-) :-) :-)p   > It was innH > German - so it's just a guess ;-)  I wonder if the spam bots are smartN > enough to spot what they think looks like a German surname, and send mail in > the appropriate language.   H I get stuff written in chinese characters and hence totally unreadeable.J Subject and sender appear as jibberish. Spam season seem to be very styongG right now. Must be the alignment of the planets. Even with spam counternJ measures on my account, I get lots and lots every day. (this account isn'tH used for serious stuff so almost all the mail gets recycled into the bitU bucket unless the subject/sender is obvious and stands out of the rest of the cruft.)u  N > I simple circular file safely (since it went to a VMS account).  I have not,J > nor will I ever pay attention to, or buy anything that I have seen in an' > unsolicited email or web page advert.   J Right now, there is a "merry" who sends me a test message multiple times aN day. And of course, Jessican that spams all newsgroups multiple times, as wellG as her boayfriend who compains about his friend sleeping with his wife.l  L The internet just wouldn't be itself without spam ! Sad to say that SPAM has become the norm isn't it ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 00:10:21 +0200e% From: "IdrEASY" <IdrEASY@bigfoot.com> . Subject: VT520 and VT420 terminal and PC mouse) Message-ID: <aa21qt$f4c$1@brown.net4u.hr>b   Hi!t  K Does it exist some "chemistry" for using PC mouse on VT terminals (I'd likei to use it with SMG$ routines)?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 00:32:03 +01000% From: "Ade" <adrian.birkett@ic24.net>m2 Subject: Re: VT520 and VT420 terminal and PC mouse@ Message-ID: <z01x8.2748$Cp4.253301@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>  D Off the top of my head, probably NO. VT terminals are character cellF terminals, not windows based. Look for a DecWindows terminal (VXT?) orE something similar. I'm sure someone else can confirm or give a betters explanation.   Ade.  B === If the world is a stage and we are merely actore, I WANT A NEW SCRIPTWRITER !!! ===  0 "IdrEASY" <IdrEASY@bigfoot.com> wrote in message# news:aa21qt$f4c$1@brown.net4u.hr...e > Hi!o >rH > Does it exist some "chemistry" for using PC mouse on VT terminals (I'd like  > to use it with SMG$ routines)? >  >h   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 02:32:40 -0700n" From: info@gethomelandsecurity.com* Subject: WORLDS 1ST ROBOTIC POLICE OFFICERA Message-ID: <2018239155-2200241229324030@gethomelandsecurity.com>h  ) ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8o* Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII    ) *****************************************CI You are receiving this email as a member of SecurityList services. If youuH received this email in error, or would no longer like to receive special, promotions via email then click here Remove!? *****************************************Get Homeland Security!tK We're currently living in uncertain times. Not only do we have to deal witheK the criminals born in the US, but now we have to concern ourselves with the ? nuts from abroad as well. We need security now more then ever. gK Some people dont have security because they cant afford it.  Others dontl9 have it because they dont wont to give up their privacy.K= We have the answer! Introducing the worlds first robotic COP. > This is no joke.  These robotic cops LOOK ALIVE AND THEY MOVE!J  The cost of a robotic COP is less then you would pay a security guard for7 one week 10 hours a day only the robot is on duty 24/7.eK For more information including photos and AVIs www.gethomelandsecurity.comD) ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8e) Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCIIs  - <html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml"e1 xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"-/ xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word"-( xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">   <head>H <meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=windows-1252">( <meta name=ProgId content=Word.Document>   </head>.  B <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='tab-interval:.5in'>      1 <p >*****************************************</p>e      H <p>You are receiving this email as a member of SecurityList services. IfE you received this email in error, or would no longer like to receive  / special promotions via email then click here <a @ href="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/remove.htm">Remove!</a> </p>    1 <p >*****************************************</p>,    H <a href="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/">Get Homeland Security!</a>      I <p>We're currently living in uncertain times. Not only do we have to dealo' with the criminals born in the US, but aK now we have to concern ourselves with the nuts from abroad as well. We needa	 security j now more then ever. </p>    = <p>Some people dont have security because they cant afford iB it.  Others dont have it because they dont wont to give up their privacy.</p>  D <p>We have the answer! Introducing the worlds first robotic COP.</p>  E <p>This is no joke.  These robotic cops LOOK ALIVE AND THEY MOVE!</p>p   <IMGI SRC="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/Resources/standingofficer1.jpeg">b  I <p> The cost of a robotic COP is less then you would pay a security guard 
 for one week t2 10 hours a day only the robot is on duty 24/7.</p>    7 <p>For more information including photos and AVIs </p>e     <aJ href="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/">www.gethomelandsecurity.com</a>     </body>    </html>S  + ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8--f   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 02:32:39 -07000" From: info@gethomelandsecurity.com* Subject: WORLDS 1ST ROBOTIC POLICE OFFICERB Message-ID: <1964639149-22002412293239860@gethomelandsecurity.com>  ) ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8-* Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII    ) *****************************************iI You are receiving this email as a member of SecurityList services. If you7H received this email in error, or would no longer like to receive special, promotions via email then click here Remove!? *****************************************Get Homeland Security!mK We're currently living in uncertain times. Not only do we have to deal with K the criminals born in the US, but now we have to concern ourselves with the ? nuts from abroad as well. We need security now more then ever. cK Some people dont have security because they cant afford it.  Others donth9 have it because they dont wont to give up their privacy.u= We have the answer! Introducing the worlds first robotic COP.a> This is no joke.  These robotic cops LOOK ALIVE AND THEY MOVE!J  The cost of a robotic COP is less then you would pay a security guard for7 one week 10 hours a day only the robot is on duty 24/7.0K For more information including photos and AVIs www.gethomelandsecurity.coml) ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8I) Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCIIg  - <html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml"-1 xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" / xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word"s( xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">   <head>H <meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=windows-1252">( <meta name=ProgId content=Word.Document>   </head>C  B <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='tab-interval:.5in'>      1 <p >*****************************************</p>g      H <p>You are receiving this email as a member of SecurityList services. IfE you received this email in error, or would no longer like to receive i/ special promotions via email then click here <aR@ href="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/remove.htm">Remove!</a> </p>    1 <p >*****************************************</p>r    H <a href="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/">Get Homeland Security!</a>      I <p>We're currently living in uncertain times. Not only do we have to deala' with the criminals born in the US, but  K now we have to concern ourselves with the nuts from abroad as well. We needk	 security w now more then ever. </p>    = <p>Some people dont have security because they cant afford CB it.  Others dont have it because they dont wont to give up their privacy.</p>  D <p>We have the answer! Introducing the worlds first robotic COP.</p>  E <p>This is no joke.  These robotic cops LOOK ALIVE AND THEY MOVE!</p>    <IMGI SRC="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/Resources/standingofficer1.jpeg">i  I <p> The cost of a robotic COP is less then you would pay a security guard 
 for one week h2 10 hours a day only the robot is on duty 24/7.</p>    7 <p>For more information including photos and AVIs </p>M     <aJ href="http://www.gethomelandsecurity.com/">www.gethomelandsecurity.com</a>     </body>v   </html>'  + ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8--n   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.223 ************************