1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 29 Aug 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 475       Contents: Re: "inview" Article RE: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article RE: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article= Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400. = Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400. = Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400. = Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400. 3 Re: anyone have a source for MMJ cables in the UK ? : Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.3> Re: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.3& Re: DCPS Supported Printers? HP2500CM? DECW$CALENDAR file format./ Re: DECwindows configuration for TCP/IP access. $ EDIT - TPU . Configuration File help1 Re: Health Data Management  OpenVMS Advertisement ' Re: High quality of HP Software support  How to configure DECNet-plus  Re: How to configure DECNet-plus  Re: How to configure DECNet-plus  Re: How to configure DECNet-plus Re: How to configure TCP IP . Re: HP earnings - how did the VMS business do?" Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly" Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly" Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly	 Re: HPETS . Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?. Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?. Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?. Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well? Re: link warnings... Re: linking warnings...  Re: Old games for VAX system.  Re: Old games for VAX system.  Re: Old games for VAX system.  Proxies with Decnet over IP  Re: Proxies with Decnet over IP  Re: Proxies with Decnet over IP  Re: Proxies with Decnet over IP  Re: re white boxen Re: re white boxen Re: Reverse LAT  Re: Reverse LAT F Searching printforms with German-Umlauts for OKI-Printers (Epson-Mode)" RE: silliest thing heard this week" Re: silliest thing heard this week" Re: silliest thing heard this week" Re: silliest thing heard this week Re: Simple cluster Re: Simple cluster Re: Simple cluster Re: Simple cluster Re: Simple cluster Re: Simple cluster8 Re: Size of I/O count fields in SHOW PROC and SHOW SYS ?! Re: Sounds like INS needs VMS ... ! Re: Sounds like INS needs VMS ... # Re: telnet from *NIX to OpenVMS 7.2  Telnet Port ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials ' Re: Various tidbits about HP financials $ Re: VAX/Alpha Basic example programs# RE: VMS 7.3-1 Doc set... plain jane # Re: VMS 7.3-1 Doc set... plain jane # Re: What's going on with Encompass? # Re: What's going on with Encompass? ' Re: where to get an MMJ cable in the UK ' Re: where to get an MMJ cable in the UK $ Re: Why C is better than Fortran 95?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:41:13 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article J Message-ID: <dP8b9.120530$8aG1.83238@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  3 "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in message  news:3D6CD96B.171227@aaa.com...  > ; > I saw your advertising sudgestions. You know, some people 4 > does a lot of cash writing this kind if things :-) >   , I'm still waiting for my check from HP.  :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 15:09:06 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com>  Subject: RE: "inview" Article T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF402660981@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   John,   3 >>> I'm still waiting for my check from HP.  :-)<<<   H Ok, here it is. I have authorization from the top to issue this check ..     /  \/     :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----+ From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com]=20  Sent: August 28, 2002 2:41 PM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  Subject: Re: "inview" Article       7 "Jan-Erik S=F6derholm" <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in message =  news:3D6CD96B.171227@aaa.com...  > I > I saw your advertising sudgestions. You know, some people does a lot=20 ) > of cash writing this kind if things :-)  >   , I'm still waiting for my check from HP.  :-)   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 12:35:28 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article = Message-ID: <cf15391e.0208281135.64fd33cb@posting.google.com>   s "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message news:<R23b9.24272$6m61.6794@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>...   >    at distances of up to 500km   That's 500 miles, 800 km.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:00:09 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article H Message-ID: <tRab9.15681$GK2.14220@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  > "Keith Parris" <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:cf15391e.0208281135.64fd33cb@posting.google.com... 0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageD news:<R23b9.24272$6m61.6794@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>..." > >    at distances of up to 500km >  > That's 500 miles, 800 km.    Good catch!   H At this rate HP won't have any good copy they can use in VMS advertisingG without paying me a royalty...oh, I forgot...no need to advertise..they  don't want new customers.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:01:13 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article H Message-ID: <tSab9.15687$GK2.10375@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  2 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote in messageL news:BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF402660981@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net. .. John,   3 >>> I'm still waiting for my check from HP.  :-)<<<   H Ok, here it is. I have authorization from the top to issue this check ..     /  \/    6 Maybe I should have asked for a Czech instead. Blonde.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:01:39 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article K Message-ID: <TSab9.121165$8aG1.115363@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   2 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote in messageL news:BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF402660981@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net. .. John,   3 >>> I'm still waiting for my check from HP.  :-)<<<   H Ok, here it is. I have authorization from the top to issue this check ..       And no hockey players either.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 17:42:52 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article , Message-ID: <3D6D43C3.2A05923E@videotron.ca>   John Smith wrote: J > Ok, here it is. I have authorization from the top to issue this check .. >  >   /  > \/ > 8 > Maybe I should have asked for a Czech instead. Blonde.    3 Would you rather be getting a cheque instead ?????    K (in canada, we spell the world like the rest of the english world, not like  the americans :-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:26:21 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com>  Subject: RE: "inview" Article T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF402660982@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  % <<<< And no hockey players either.>>>   @ Careful now .. Remember that most Canadian hearts pump pucks. InB addition, while most kids get rattles as their first toy, ours get hockey sticks.  E Otherwise the hockey jokes from the Olympics will start flying and we  have some good ones..    :-)    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----+ From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com]=20  Sent: August 28, 2002 5:02 PM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  Subject: Re: "inview" Article       2 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote in messageH news:BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF402660981@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp. net. .  John,   3 >>> I'm still waiting for my check from HP.  :-)<<<   H Ok, here it is. I have authorization from the top to issue this check ..       And no hockey players either.    ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 17:53 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article - Message-ID: <28AUG200217530639@gerg.tamu.edu>   ' "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes... 7 }"Paul Sture" <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote in message I }> In article <BSUa9.4351$GK2.1938@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, & }"John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes: }> >N }> > Here it is, late August 2002 and we are having stuff from HP land on CIO/M }> > CTO desks and everyone else on down the line and all they see is the big % }> > blank spot when it comes to VMS.  }>H }> Not entirely a blank spot. Yesterday I received an HP flyer which wasC }> specifically for VMS and Tru64 Alphaservers. A picture of a coin K }> operated binocular machine, and a silver coin like token, with the theme  }> of "Vision".  }>G }> I a reference I just posted to a white paper on the Tru64 site which  }> refers to VMS as below. } 4 }Didn't see the flyer - might only be a Euro thing.   4 Not unless Texas has suddenly become part of Europe.  % We got two of these (that I know of).   G On the front the coin has the "hp invent" logo. On the back it says "hp  AlphaServer^TM systems".   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 00:37:34 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article G Message-ID: <i1eb9.15994$GK2.5281@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   4 "Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu> wrote in message' news:28AUG200217530639@gerg.tamu.edu... ) > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes... 9 > }"Paul Sture" <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote in message K > }> In article <BSUa9.4351$GK2.1938@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, ( > }"John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes: > }> >K > }> > Here it is, late August 2002 and we are having stuff from HP land on  CIO/K > }> > CTO desks and everyone else on down the line and all they see is the  big ' > }> > blank spot when it comes to VMS.  > }>J > }> Not entirely a blank spot. Yesterday I received an HP flyer which wasE > }> specifically for VMS and Tru64 Alphaservers. A picture of a coin G > }> operated binocular machine, and a silver coin like token, with the  theme  > }> of "Vision".  > }>I > }> I a reference I just posted to a white paper on the Tru64 site which  > }> refers to VMS as below. > } 5 > }Didn't see the flyer - might only be a Euro thing.  > 6 > Not unless Texas has suddenly become part of Europe. > ' > We got two of these (that I know of).  > I > On the front the coin has the "hp invent" logo. On the back it says "hp  > AlphaServer^TM systems". > 
 > --- Carl    , Texas, France ...as opposed to Paris, Texas?   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 03:34:05 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article = Message-ID: <NCgb9.26906$kp.248988@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>   6 "Paul Sture" <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote in message# news:$jLh0cv8lVlP@elias.decus.ch... H > In article <BSUa9.4351$GK2.1938@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>,% "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:  > > L > > Here it is, late August 2002 and we are having stuff from HP land on CIO / L > > CTO desks and everyone else on down the line and all they see is the big$ > > blank spot when it comes to VMS. > >  > G > Not entirely a blank spot. Yesterday I received an HP flyer which was B > specifically for VMS and Tru64 Alphaservers. A picture of a coinJ > operated binocular machine, and a silver coin like token, with the theme > of "Vision".  L Still figuring out what the hell to do with the coin. Is it for use with oneG of the coin-operated "market research" firms? If so, how many wonderful - things will they say for one piece of silver?    ------------------------------   Date: 29 Aug 02 07:44:36 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article ) Message-ID: <Y2bip0FO6XHX@elias.decus.ch>   q In article <NCgb9.26906$kp.248988@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes:  > 8 > "Paul Sture" <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote in message% > news:$jLh0cv8lVlP@elias.decus.ch... I >> In article <BSUa9.4351$GK2.1938@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, ' > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:  >> >M >> > Here it is, late August 2002 and we are having stuff from HP land on CIO  > / M >> > CTO desks and everyone else on down the line and all they see is the big % >> > blank spot when it comes to VMS.  >> > >>H >> Not entirely a blank spot. Yesterday I received an HP flyer which wasC >> specifically for VMS and Tru64 Alphaservers. A picture of a coin K >> operated binocular machine, and a silver coin like token, with the theme  >> of "Vision".  > N > Still figuring out what the hell to do with the coin. Is it for use with oneI > of the coin-operated "market research" firms? If so, how many wonderful / > things will they say for one piece of silver?  > I I am stumped myself. It's definitely too light to use in a parking meter, E snack machine, or similar. I might mount it on the side of my monitor  at work.   __
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 19:51:01 GMT) From: wkb@freebie.xs4all.nl (Wilko Bulte) F Subject: Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400.? Message-ID: <3d6d29a5$0$55966$e4fe514c@dreader3.news.xs4all.nl>   o In <aus-040EDA.11094425082002@wrzx08.rz.uni-wuerzburg.de> "Aus, Hans Magnus" <aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de> writes:   C >Other than the mounting bracket differences, will DEC RZ40-AA and  I >RZ29B-E work as internal disks on an AlphaStation 400 4/233? Neither of  G >these configurations (part numbers) are listed in the AlphaServer 400  	 >options.   ; Cooling an RZ29 or RZ40 is probably inadequate in a AS400..    --' |   / o / /_  _   				wilko@FreeBSD.org 2 |/|/ / / /(  (_)  Bulte				Arnhem, the Netherlands   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:57:21 +0200 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> F Subject: Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400.' Message-ID: <3D6D2B21.1E73F7A0@aaa.com>   7 Have you thought of getting a (used) BA-356 box (and an 8 extra SCSI controller if there isn't already an external SCSI connector on the box) ?  = I don't know if your disks are mounted in StorageWorks boxes, 4 but if they are, you can use them right as they are.   Jan-Erik Sderholm.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:34:08 GMT * From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com>F Subject: Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400.> Message-ID: <Adcb9.4952$On.287610@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  6 "Wilko Bulte" <wkb@freebie.xs4all.nl> wrote in message9 news:3d6d29a5$0$55966$e4fe514c@dreader3.news.xs4all.nl... = > Cooling an RZ29 or RZ40 is probably inadequate in a AS400..  > I An RZ29 (Seagate Barracuda) runs pretty warm.  I mounted it in the lowest L bay of my 400/233 and put a PC type bay fan above it to keep the drive cool.I I have also had some success using an IBM DDRS-39130 9GB drive without an 
 extra fan.   Jack PEacock   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 23:40:15 -0500 ( From: Rich Jordan <duodec@speakeasy.net>F Subject: Re: ??= DEC RZ40-AA and RZ29B-E disks on an AlphaStation 400.* Message-ID: <3D6DA5AF.50403@speakeasy.net>   Jack Peacock wrote: 8 > "Wilko Bulte" <wkb@freebie.xs4all.nl> wrote in message; > news:3d6d29a5$0$55966$e4fe514c@dreader3.news.xs4all.nl...  > = >>Cooling an RZ29 or RZ40 is probably inadequate in a AS400..  >> > K > An RZ29 (Seagate Barracuda) runs pretty warm.  I mounted it in the lowest N > bay of my 400/233 and put a PC type bay fan above it to keep the drive cool.K > I have also had some success using an IBM DDRS-39130 9GB drive without an  > extra fan. >   Jack PEacock >  >   D We've run a pair of RZ29s (Barracudas) in a DEC 2000-300 for years. H Both are fronted with those faceplate fan 'drive coolers' that have two G small fans that pull air in and blow it right at the front (and thence "I around top and bottom) of the drives.  They stay cool, though we have to  H replace the el-cheapo PC drive coolers every 18 months or so when a fan 
 siezes up.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 04:10:52 GMT  From: dins <$USER@127.0.0.1>< Subject: Re: anyone have a source for MMJ cables in the UK ?? Message-ID: <slrnamrb71.sin.$USER@dinsdale.piranhabrothers.foo>   J In article <3d6cfbc5.8839069@news1.uncensored-news.com>, Herb Asher wrote: > G > Thanks I did not realise they were that widely available. I'm used to   > people fighting over them. :O) >  > Thanks again,n >  > E In a pinch regular modular phone jacks with the tabs broken off work.a+ http://www.connectworld.net/connectors.htmliE http://molt.zdv.uni-mainz.de/doc_link/en_US/a_doc_lib/aixasync/asycomn gd/figures/asyco47.jpg3 might also be useful.  Won't lock in but will work.C   cheers,e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:52:50 -0700 " From: Koloth <koloth@telocity.com>C Subject: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.3y, Message-ID: <3D6D7E72.42FE33C8@telocity.com>  D I haven't been tracking Vesting for a while.  Can one still take VAX0 executables and vest them to OpenVMS Alpha V7.3?   Thanks   Cass Witkowski   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 21:40:02 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)mG Subject: Re: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.3x3 Message-ID: <wlcWbul1Bref@eisner.encompasserve.org>r  Q In article <3D6D7E72.42FE33C8@telocity.com>, Koloth <koloth@telocity.com> writes:eF > I haven't been tracking Vesting for a while.  Can one still take VAX2 > executables and vest them to OpenVMS Alpha V7.3?  9 Certainly if the images are from VAX VMS V5.5 or earlier.t   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:04:16 GMTu* From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com>/ Subject: Re: DCPS Supported Printers? HP2500CM?p5 Message-ID: <280820021657255165%paul.anderson@hp.com>n  5 In article <3D6D0636.C143B2F6@videotron.ca>, JF Mezein% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:f  @ > Does DCPS actually see a difference between a laser, inkjet or0 > whatever printer as long as it is postscript ?   No.e  * FYI, non-laser printers DCPS supports are:  !   - Digital Colormate PS (ribbon)e(   - Digital DECcolorwriter 1000 (ribbon)   - HP PaintJet XL300 )   - Tektronix Phaser 200 and 220 (ribbon)P   - Tektronix Phaser 850 (wax)  : All these printers except the Phaser 850 are long retired.   Paul   -- e  Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineeringi   Hewlett-Packard Companyg   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 17:17:52 -0400r- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>b# Subject: DECW$CALENDAR file format.-, Message-ID: <3D6D3DE9.52CE1572@videotron.ca>  N Since HP insists on keeping the "open"  tagged to VMS, how about releasing theG file format of the DEW$CALENDAR.DWC file so that we can start using the8M application more intelligently ? (or publish an API that can make use of it).>  J With the death of ALL-IN-1, I think that it is the least HP/Compaq/DigitalL could do. Frankly, I really do not see why Digital has steadfastedly refusedJ to document this. Searching Google, I know that I am not the first to have asked this.-  M If HP is not willing to  COMMIT to further development of DECW$CALENDAR, thenyH the source code for this "example" utility that comes with VMS should be  included in the VMS freeware CD.   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 22:20:33 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)8 Subject: Re: DECwindows configuration for TCP/IP access.* Message-ID: <akjibh$nq1$5@web1.cup.hp.com>  L In article <umohjdslh6qb5c@corp.supernews.com>, sword7@speakeasy.org writes:  G :I am working on my TS10/VAX emulator.  I am figuring out how to set upgH :DECwindows server for TCP/IP interface so that I can login into system D :from outside by using X-Windows on Linux machine.  Does anyone haveB :any information about instructions?  Yes, I noticed that someone - :sucessfully set up DECwindows on it earlier.r  J   Install OpenVMS, selecting DECwindows support files.  Boot and configureI   it.  Install the DECwindows Motif kit, if you did not install it during M   the OpenVMS installation -- DECwindows has two parts, the version-dependentmC   portion that is part of the OpenVMS installation/upgrade, and the I   version-independent portion that is installed from the DECwindows Motif I   kit.  Install TCP/IP.  Configure TCP/IP per the documentation and localnF   requirements.  Then configure DECwindows per the OpenVMS FAQ section?   entitled "HOW CAN I ENABLE THE DECWINDOWS TCP/IP TRANSPORT?".-  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 19:16:22 -0400b, From: "Francisco Ortega" <fortega@iblues.cc>- Subject: EDIT - TPU . Configuration File help A Message-ID: <BKcb9.35238$Hd4.7623558@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>y   Hi,aK          I use to have a configuration file that would allow me to do basicdL task with the pf keys. It would kind of emulate the edt editor . (edit /edt)I commands. Does any one have a configuration file that has good shortcuts.s Thanks  	 Francisco"   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 01:18:34 GMTc1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>m: Subject: Re: Health Data Management  OpenVMS Advertisement' Message-ID: <3D6D7B99.50700869@fsi.net>    Larry Kilgallen wrote: > ] > In article <3D6CF94F.6E7DA3B6@dimensional.com>, medibanc <medibanc@dimensional.com> writes:t > J > >    So, I was glad to see this and just wanted to share it. I'm pleased
 > > to seeI > >    that HP is apparantly supporting OpenVMS into the future and likedJ
 > > seeing> > >    a Healthcare Vendor actively marketing on the platform. >  > Thanks for letting us know.r > B > But here is where we all jump in to complain there is no such ad@ > in _our_ favorite publication, like Field and Stream or Square > Dancing Today :-)    Get grip, Larry!  H As someone focused on the security industry, I'm sure you can appreciate> the potential of a VMS-related ad in a system-security relatedD publication. You would know specific publication names better than I would, I'm sure.  = Disaster tolerance and recovery would be another prime arena.:  H By the way, fellow entrepreneurs, see the back cover of the August, 2002A Entrepreneur magazine. It's Oracle. No mention of any o.s. Missed  opportunity?   -- . David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsu http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2002 02:43:24 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>0 Subject: Re: High quality of HP Software support- Message-ID: <874rdeddtf.fsf@prep.synonet.com>m  . bill@gw5.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:  / > In article <87d6s8b0fd.fsf@prep.synonet.com>,e1 > 	Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:t  B > > "Ah, hell, I thought I fixed that!" Well, it turns out he had,E > > then there was an unfix added the next day. It was specific to ang > > 11/44 with 128MB of memory.h  o> > Wow.  Sure wish I could put that into my 11/44's......   :-)  D :( Thats what comes about grumbling about 16MB of memory on a single= BI board, instead of 16K in a DD like god and Ken intended...:   -- 2< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.m@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:58:21 GMT>% From: "Yong Liu" <fdu9774@rogers.com>P% Subject: How to configure DECNet-plustJ Message-ID: <1Ibb9.121665$8aG1.91786@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Hi,   . To configure TCP/IP, you take following steps:  (1) Make the hardware connected.8 (2) Run @tcpip$config (Set you local node in the nework), (3) tcpip set host (set the local host file)" (4) ping a neighbor (verification)  G My question is: What are the similar steps for configuring DECNet-plus?r  K I installed DECNet-plus. run decnet-config. The problem is even a show hosth, local file takes forever. What's wrong here?  : Any pointers? Detailed direction will be most appreciated.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:15:18 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)) Subject: Re: How to configure DECNet-plus K Message-ID: <rdeininger-2808022115180001@1cust174.tnt3.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>s  J In article <1Ibb9.121665$8aG1.91786@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>,& "Yong Liu" <fdu9774@rogers.com> wrote:   >Hi, >a/ >To configure TCP/IP, you take following steps:T! >(1) Make the hardware connected.a9 >(2) Run @tcpip$config (Set you local node in the nework)t- >(3) tcpip set host (set the local host file)p# >(4) ping a neighbor (verification)  >aH >My question is: What are the similar steps for configuring DECNet-plus?  F I can't provide a better overview than the DECnet-plus docs, which are" available on the VMS doc web site.  L >I installed DECNet-plus. run decnet-config. The problem is even a show host- >local file takes forever. What's wrong here?s  D When I install and configure DECnet-plus, it works.  Please post theH specific command that takes "forever", and any associated messages.  You? may have misunderstood some of the configuration questions, andc@ mis-configured the system.  Without specifics about what you areJ attempting, it's nearly impossible to guess what part of the configuration	 is wrong.   ; >Any pointers? Detailed direction will be most appreciated.m  I Go to www.openvms.compaq.com , and follow the links to the documentation.l   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:57:01 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>v) Subject: Re: How to configure DECNet-plus , Message-ID: <3D6D7F69.ADF189B8@videotron.ca>   Yong Liu wrote:eM > I installed DECNet-plus. run decnet-config. The problem is even a show hostV. > local file takes forever. What's wrong here? > < > Any pointers? Detailed direction will be most appreciated.     PRODUCT REMOVE DECNET-PLUS& @VMSINSTAL the real DECNET  (decnet 4)
 @NETCONFIG  L If you do not need the functionality of decnet-plus, the real decnet (decnet< 4) is much smaller and much simpler to configure and manage.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:49:33 -0700 " From: Koloth <koloth@telocity.com>) Subject: Re: How to configure DECNet-plus-, Message-ID: <3D6D7DAD.C911A400@telocity.com>  P If for taking forever is about 30-40 seconds it is most likely that you have NSPE running in addition to OSI.  DECnet will try NSP first then OSI (TP4)r  N Another thing to check that if the node you are trying to connect to is solelyO going to be connected to be DECnet over TCPIP then you need to remove that node O from the DECnet_REGISTER database.  Otherwise Decnet will try to contact it viar OSI first before trying TCPIP.  P If you have both NSP and OSI running and in the DECnet_REGISTER for a node beingM access via DECnet over TCPIP the it may take a minute or so before it finallyY tries the TCPIP way.  L Remember to flush your cache adter you delete the entry from DECnet_REGISTER  3 MC NCL FLUSH SESSION CONTROL NAMING CACHE ENTRY "*"i       Robert Deininger wrote:   L > In article <1Ibb9.121665$8aG1.91786@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>,( > "Yong Liu" <fdu9774@rogers.com> wrote: >s > >Hi, > > 1 > >To configure TCP/IP, you take following steps:r# > >(1) Make the hardware connected.-; > >(2) Run @tcpip$config (Set you local node in the nework)_/ > >(3) tcpip set host (set the local host file)"% > >(4) ping a neighbor (verification)6 > >lJ > >My question is: What are the similar steps for configuring DECNet-plus? > H > I can't provide a better overview than the DECnet-plus docs, which are$ > available on the VMS doc web site. > N > >I installed DECNet-plus. run decnet-config. The problem is even a show host/ > >local file takes forever. What's wrong here?" >@F > When I install and configure DECnet-plus, it works.  Please post theJ > specific command that takes "forever", and any associated messages.  YouA > may have misunderstood some of the configuration questions, andnB > mis-configured the system.  Without specifics about what you areL > attempting, it's nearly impossible to guess what part of the configuration > is wrong.r >f= > >Any pointers? Detailed direction will be most appreciated.  >eK > Go to www.openvms.compaq.com , and follow the links to the documentation.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 16:05:02 -0400r, From: "Francisco Ortega" <fortega@iblues.cc>$ Subject: Re: How to configure TCP IPA Message-ID: <a4ab9.87055$%v4.4675082@e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com>   J Thank you. Now it seems to be working. It's weird. I restarted the serviceJ and boom, but after I did a few times. But If I do a show network, then itB will say that tcpip not started. but I can telnet with no problem.   thanks    J "Jamie Stallwood" <this.no.work.try.something.else@project76.net> wrote in: message news:gtqpmugcs0ccbr57nfbeoqs9odeeatcsuq@4ax.com...8 > On Wed, 28 Aug 2002 11:05:29 -0400, "Francisco Ortega" > <fortega@iblues.cc> wrote: >" > > Hi,.G > >        It's been a while since I have configure TCP IP in an vax ors alpha.J > >I have one at my house now after years without using one and I'm having8 > >problems setting an ip address so I can telnet to it.& > >I run the @sys$manager:tcpip$configD > >and set the ip but I can't ping it from any of windows computers. > >  > >If anyone can help.	 > >Thanks. > >  > >/ > >  >)H > On the VMS machine, can you UCX PING your own IP address? If so, IP isE > started, if not user TCPIP$CONFIG to start it. If it will not start6, > that's another fish of kettles altogether. >4F > Check the network masks on the VMS and win machines are the same, ifD > they are on the same network, and that the IP addresses are in theF > same network. If different networks, have both got gateway addresses
 > defined? > 3 > Please post IP settings for VMS and windows here.t   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 18:33:02 -07001 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski)-7 Subject: Re: HP earnings - how did the VMS business do?J= Message-ID: <857e9e41.0208281733.44b61aef@posting.google.com>A   John, JF and Andrew,  B As you all are probably aware the regular HP people that visit anyF newsgroup can not give out revenue number, never could, probably neverB will and I doubt that many companies allow their employees to talk about revenue numbers.  . That said, I am sure glad you are on our side.  # Andrew how did Sun do this quarter?t   Suen  a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3D6D05DF.E9D5EFC3@videotron.ca>...s > John Nebel wrote:i > > K > > Does anyone know how the VMS part of HPs business is doing financially?- > N > If there was no know to know under Compaq, do you really think that HP would > reveal that information ?: > L > Note that HP's press release talked only about wintel as well a HP's "own": > products and did not mention Digital or Tandem products.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:19:48 GMT4* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>+ Subject: Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went SmoothlyiC Message-ID: <80cb9.251861$m91.10326634@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message, news:dF7b9.28$Rv7.496756@news.cpqcorp.net...8 > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote in message ... > >t > >a > >Terry C. Shannon wrote: > >kL > >> Well, seems to me that HPQ pretty much made its numbers, and it sure as > hellI > >> doesn't look as bad as Sun (which might be a bargain at four bucks).  > >> > >u > >r > >How do you work that out. > >(3 > >HPQ came in short of their revenue goal and withT9 > >a 2+ billion dollar loss mostly due to re-structuring.C > >e >oJ > $200k short of the $16.7b goal, but right on the numbers for earnings at 14 > cents.  K For someone who purports to know something about balance sheets, you appearaF to be remarkably (and one must at least suspect somewhat deliberately) ignorant about this one.  B The earnings per share were negative $0.67.  Period.  According toI 'generally accepted accounting principles' (GAAP).  And according to HP'syK own press release, much as it attempted to down-play it.  That accounts fornK the $2+ billion loss HP sustained in the quarter (which they also attemptedo to down-play).  K The $0.14 you quote was an *unaudited*, 'pro-forma' figure cobbled up by HP/B after choosing to ignore nearly $2.5 billion of expenses that theyC considered inconvenient (and indeed they were, but nonetheless they-% existed).  In other words, pure spin.1  J Your credibility in non-technical areas is wearing rather thin, Fred.  AndI your understanding of hardware hasn't been looking all that sharp lately,tJ either.  I don't really care whether you continue to embarrass yourself orF not, but it would be a shame to see the general credibility of the VMSJ development group suffer simply because one of its prominent members feelsH compelled by some misguided sense of loyalty to defend the indefensible,= regardless of how ignorant (or mendacious) it makes him look.g   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 03:32:08 GMTo1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> + Subject: Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly < Message-ID: <YAgb9.49687$_91.1339@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D6BC95F.DE46BFFE@videotron.ca... > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:J > > financial performance can see the unrealistic "bulge" in your revenues that= > > maps nicely onto the rise and fall of the dot com market.6 >aJ > But where Sun won is in the "public" perception that it is the leader in thejK > internet. While many true blue hopeless .COMs went with Sun, the momentum  alsoD > brought large customers such as banks etc who setup their internet servicesI > very often on SUN hardware, partly because this is where the latest andi > greatest software existed. >rI > This is where "strategic" sales are so important because they get you ai footG > in the door. And if Sun plays its cards right, it can then expand its8 sales atI > those large, typically IBM, shops because it took advantage of the .COMtL > frienzy to get in to fill a huge void that existed in those IBM shops thatI > were totally clueless on what the internet was about but knew that theyD had to& > be there for some reason or another.  	 Sun $4.00d  
 IBM $78.00  
 Enuff said   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 00:24:18 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>t+ Subject: Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothlyy, Message-ID: <3D6DA1EB.138EF134@videotron.ca>   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:N > Sun $4.00h >  > IBM $78.00 >  > Enuff said  @ Actually, Sun closed below $4.00 today, and Microsoft below $50.  N Sun's stock may be battered, but it still has an image of a leader in the unix server market.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:12:01 GMTN# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>" Subject: Re: HPETSJ Message-ID: <Rn8b9.120424$8aG1.98376@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  . "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message4 news:Lv5b9.7502$Rx4.43144@twister.tampabay.rr.com... >uI > My management recently attended a private briefing from HP.  That was a$ big@@ > surprise to me all by itself.  I am not sure if there were any restrictionsI > on what they can say about what went on, but I can say this.  They cameu backL > rather fired up about the future of HPQ and VMS.  They asked me to prepareG > some questions to take with them.  My questions revolved around HPQ'sa plansyL > and advice regarding VMS and VMS futures, Moving from Tru64 to VMS insteadK > of HPUX,  Alpha VMS to Itanium migration,  and overall VMS comparisons tou > Windoze and Unix.d >nK > This is one of the first briefings where they did not come back and startrL > firing up more VMS to Unix projects.  In fact, they came back and ASKED me< > to attend HPETS to get more info on VMS technical futures.    I An encouraging sign. Hopefully more discussions like this will take placed6 with customers and more pointedly, with new customers.  J I assume that you would consider your company a rather large VMS shop. DidD you have any feedback from your execs as to what criteria HP used inE choosing your company to talk to, ie. if there are 411,00 VMS systems>J running out there, why did they decide to visit your shop? Do you have anyJ sense how this session originated - a request from your execs or HP asking to make a presentation?-   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 12:18:15 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)7 Subject: Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?F= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0208281118.774e09d7@posting.google.com>f  a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3D6BD170.D8CB9535@videotron.ca>...  > "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: >  nU > > Remember: NOON IS 12:00 PM AND MIDNIGHT IS 12:00 AM!!! AND DON'T YOU FORGET IT!!!  > % > Noon is 12.00 and midnight is 00:00s > > > Stop using ways of showing time which can lead to confusion.    ; Would you prefer 12:00 PM IS NOON AND 12:00 AM IS MIDNIGHT?    Or perhaps a table   12 midnight  12:00 am  0000e 12 noon      12:00 pm  1200:  E I'm trying to stop the pointless bickering in this thread. Thanks for. helping. :-)  F And remember, CLAIMING NOON AND MIDNIGHT ARE EACH NEITHER AM NOR PM IS RIDICULOUS! THANK YOU.   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 20:58:08 -0400 1 From: "Brad McCusker" <brad.mccusker@charter.net> 7 Subject: Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?H/ Message-ID: <umqsd38hdsqf0a@corp.supernews.com>r  # "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" > <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> wrote in message* news:akiv9u$t2s$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com... >i > . > So why isn't it true in this case if that is" > what you are trying to suggest ? > J Oh Andrew, c'mon, you're a smart individual, I think.  Did I say it wasn't0 true in this case?  Go on back and look.  Did I?  G What I said was it twists and diverts the point, I never said it wasn't. true.a  G Obviously, in your rush to disagree with anything Fred says, you reallye1 didn't take time to think.  Let me recap for you:t  L Fred expressed an opinion that Mr. Byron didn't believe in stocks.  This wasJ presumably based on the statement in Mr. Byron's bio that Mr. Byron didn't invest in equity securities.  J You, in your haste to disagree with Fred, stated "No he just maintains hisJ independence by not holding any stock". By saying "no" to Fred's statementK that he didn't believe in stocks, I assumed that meant, in your opinion, he8A did believe in stocks, but choose not to invest in them to remainhI independent.  And, you didn't seem to think there was anything wrong, or,  even curious about that.  K I did find it curious, and I commented on it.  I still find it curious thathG a financial writer believes in stocks and chooses not to hold _any_.  IoG would find it very reasonable and admirable if he choose not to own any F stocks of companies or sectors, that he follows.  But, for a financialJ writer to believe in stocks and not hold any whatsoever, yes, I think thatJ is strange, and, that was my point.  And I think (this is my opinion) thatL in fact Mr. Byron does NOT believe in stocks, and he in fact thinks they areG not good investments.  I disagree with what I believe to be Mr. Byron's F beliefs, and therefore, I read his opinions with an elevated degree of
 suspicion.  J So, next you then respond with the obvious,  a comment about the integrityK of analysts and writers is something most people would appreciate, which ofoJ course is a very true statement, but really not relevant to my point whichI was not about the integrity of Mr. Byron, but more to his overall mindsetpJ and predisposition to look unfavorably on any stock activity, especially a merger the size of HPQ.c   > a torrente > of BSa  J And that sums up why even looking at your replies is such a waste of time.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:07:31 -0400r2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)7 Subject: Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?eK Message-ID: <rdeininger-2808022207310001@1cust174.tnt3.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>-  ? In article <umqsd38hdsqf0a@corp.supernews.com>, "Brad McCusker"n& <brad.mccuskerNosp@Mcompaq.com> wrote:   > ... But, for a financialK >writer to believe in stocks and not hold any whatsoever, yes, I think thatnK >is strange, and, that was my point.  And I think (this is my opinion) thatcM >in fact Mr. Byron does NOT believe in stocks, and he in fact thinks they are H >not good investments.  I disagree with what I believe to be Mr. Byron'sG >beliefs, and therefore, I read his opinions with an elevated degree oft >suspicion.s  J Most credible financial writers understand the value of owning some equityH securities.  After all, even financial writers have to make a living and plan for retirement.  I To avoid the appearance of conflict of interest, a financial writer couldDI forego owning equities completely.  And perhaps make up the difference in F earnings by taking cash bribes under the table in exchange for writing
 nice stories.s
   :-)  :-)  H Actually, I agree with you.  Not owning any equities at all, ever, seemsG odd.  A bit sanctimonious.  Makes me think the fellow is some kind of ai/ crank.  Definitely lowers his credibility IMHO.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 02:34:33 GMTe* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>7 Subject: Re: Is the HP/Compaq merger really going well?wC Message-ID: <ZKfb9.258778$m91.10544505@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   ? "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote in message0E news:rdeininger-2808022207310001@1cust174.tnt3.nashua.nh.da.uu.net...tA > In article <umqsd38hdsqf0a@corp.supernews.com>, "Brad McCusker"c( > <brad.mccuskerNosp@Mcompaq.com> wrote: >p > > ... But, for a financialH > >writer to believe in stocks and not hold any whatsoever, yes, I think thatH > >is strange, and, that was my point.  And I think (this is my opinion) thatK > >in fact Mr. Byron does NOT believe in stocks, and he in fact thinks they  areeJ > >not good investments.  I disagree with what I believe to be Mr. Byron'sI > >beliefs, and therefore, I read his opinions with an elevated degree of-
 > >suspicion.e >2L > Most credible financial writers understand the value of owning some equityJ > securities.  After all, even financial writers have to make a living and > plan for retirement. >a1 > To avoid the appearance of conflict of interestN  - Isn't this what 'blind trusts' are all about?N   - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 21:15:56 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: link warnings...u* Message-ID: <akjeic$nq1$4@web1.cup.hp.com>   aniruddha patwardhan wrote:e= : Hi I am getting following warnning while linking C program.. : & : %LINK-W-WRNERS, compilation warningsE :         in module XYZ file OAK$DKA200:[SYS0.SYSUPD.PWD045]XYZ.OBJ;1t+ : (name of module and name of file changed)l : M : can anyone elobarate more on why I am getting this warning and how should I  : remove it?  H   While I could provide you with a quick answer, I'd rather show you howH   to answer your own questions.  (If you want a quick and direct answer,E   well, that is certainly available from various services and support *   organizations.)  No offense is intended.  G   Please consider attending some of the available OpenVMS training, andiH   also please consider familiarizing yourself with the available OpenVMSI   programming documentation including the programming concepts manual anduF   as you appear to be struggling with the LINKER in recent times, the D   OpenVMS Linker utility manual.  These steps can greatly speed yourE   efforts in developing programs for OpenVMS, and can help you answers   your own questions.e  J   As for the specific error, the DCL command "HELP/MESSAGE WRNERS" returns*   the following information on this error:    WRNERS,  compilation warnings2           in module 'module-name' file 'file-name'  $   Facility:     LINK, Linker Utility  >   Explanation:  The specified module has compilation warnings.  .   User Action:  Correct the module and relink.   	--t  E   When posting questions here, please consider reviewing the OpenVMS  D   Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) section on how to ask questions. F   By providing the details referenced in the FAQ, you can improve yourG   likelyhood of getting an answer, of getting an answer to the questionuD   you intended, and getting an answer more quickly -- without these D   details, folks often have to ask.  Or folks will answer a question)   that you had not intended to ask.  Etc.     N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 20:38:16 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)  Subject: Re: linking warnings...* Message-ID: <akjcbo$nq1$2@web1.cup.hp.com>  m In article <umoo4hokc5cu48@corp.supernews.com>, "aniruddha patwardhan" <aniruddha_patwardhan@bmc.com> writes:m  ; :I am getting following warnings while linking a C program.y :a? :%LINK-W-MULPSC, conflicting attributes for psect VVERRORPREFIXyD :        in module XYZ file OAK$DKA200:[SYS0.SYSUPD.PWD045]XYZ.OLB;1 : * :(name of module and name of file changed)  B   The more you obfuscate and the more you remove details, the more>   difficult an answer becomes.  Please consider posting some C@   source code, and information on the OpenVMS platform, version,?   C compiler, and relevent products.  Enough to provide a smallo&   reproducer would be best, of course.  @ :any suggestion why this warning and how to remove this warning?  C   Please see the OpenVMS FAQ for some discussions of C coding, somee@   common C coding bugs, and particularly for the shareable imageA   cookbook URL -- the cookbook describes some of the various LINK:6   operations required and how to check for odd psects.     As for the error:7     --  7  MULPSC,  conflicting attributes for psect 'psect-name'a2           in module 'module-name' file 'file-name'  $   Facility:     LINK, Linker Utility  E   Explanation:  The attributes for a program section are different ini/                 subsequent modules of the link.u  M   User Action:  Correct the source so that all instances of a program section )                 have the same attributes..     --  D   Some of your extern-level variable/symbol declarations -- and I amB   guessing here, given the lack of supporting C source code -- areA   likely inconsistent.  The LINK/MAP/FULL map file will generallytA   show you which attributes differ -- you should find two or morea>   references to the same PSECT name, but with differing PSECT 
   attributes.s  B   One potential fix involves a linker options file and an explicitA   PSECT directive, but the correct fix depends on exactly what is2<   wrong here, and that requires at least some idea of the C 0   constructs involved in the source code here.    C   I've seen this with Rdb code and embedded SQL over the years, due C   to differing psect alignments.  I have the necessary options file9?   declaration for that -- I cranked everything up to the largerl@   alignment -- and I expect that this psect alignment detail is *   dicussed in the Rdb manuals by now, too.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:52:14 +0200o" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>& Subject: Re: Old games for VAX system.6 Message-ID: <akjd6b$1j7ur3$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de>  H I compiled an Adventure version on VMS 3.7 or so. Its code still runs on VAX/VMS 7.2 today.? Other programs: Dungeon (linked in 1979!) and a Tetris program..L I wrote some games for my own children that rely heavily on SMG routines and are thus not portable at all.2   Hans) <sword7@speakeasy.org> schreef in berichth) news:umoi2q9lavf190@corp.supernews.com...0 > Hello folks: >nC > I found old games like Adventure, etc. in UBVMS archives ftp site G > and downloaded them into my Linux machine (Red Hat Linux 7.3).  On my I > TS10/VAX emulator, I successfully downloaded them from my Linux machinerG > into VAX system.  That was very fast downloads - Ethernet-like speed.n >rF > On OpenVMS v7.2, I successfully unpacked and compiled Adventure gameG > by using DEC FORTRAN compiler.  That was just warning about variablesaI > not used, etc.  I was able run Adventure (551-point system) without any  > problems.e >o/ > Do you remember that old games in 1980s, etc?i >t > -- Tim Stark >p > --. > Timothy Stark <>< Inet: sword7@speakeasy.orgL > --------------------------------------------------------------------------G > "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that:J > whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.0 > Amen." -- John 3:16 (King James Version Bible)   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 22:31:10 GMT2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>& Subject: Re: Old games for VAX system.+ Message-ID: <akjive0s16@enews2.newsguy.com>e  # Chris G. <ccc_crg@yahoo.com> wrote:u> > They link to this obj file - does anyone know if it has been > recompiled for AXP?r: > I wouldn't mind running them on my Alpha VMS 7.3 system.  I I've been trying lately to get some games up and running on my Alpha, I'meK finding that most games that are available on the net were compiled so long L ago that they can't be Vested, and in most cases if the source is available, they won't easily compile.  5 Adventure and Dungeon are both on the Freeware V4 CD.   L Here is what I'm running on my system (I'm looking for others that will work over a serial terminal).     Advent 4.0A   - Native   Dungeon 3.2B  - Native   Empire 4.0    - Native   NetHack 3.3.1 - Native   Moria 4.5     - Vested8   Rogue 3.0     - Vested (doesn't seem to display right)   King          - Native2   Spacwr        - Native (very old Star Trek game)I   Spacemine     - Native (Ported from an old book of Basic Games I've hadd-                           for about 20 Years),8   Angband 2.8.0 - Native (but requires DECwindows)         			Zaneo   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 23:40:57 GMTE" From: bugs@pu.net (Mark Hittinger)& Subject: Re: Old games for VAX system.B Message-ID: <dcdb9.148213$Aw4.6173511@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  4 "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com> writes: >  Empire 4.0    - Nativea  ' I may have empire 5.0 around someplace.   I There are also a couple of games that ran under the old VWS window systemmJ (before DECwindows).  One was a fairly decent version of lunar lander withI all kinds of easter eggs and the other I can't remember - but I know its fH worth tracking down :-)  If I can repair my TK50 drive I may be able to  recover these two games also.e  I So the question is begged - can Tim emulate the graphics subsystem of theeK vaxstations :-) and the mouse :-)  Its probably not as important as gettingyI the networking running etc. :-)  I'm only kidding Tim please don't charger off and write it tonight :-)   LaterM   Mark Hittinger bugs@pu.net    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 20:43:56 +0200n' From: "Seghers Bruno" <tips@euronet.be>t$ Subject: Proxies with Decnet over IP4 Message-ID: <akj5l6$1ebsv$1@sinclair.be.wanadoo.com>   Hi,S  J I implement a Decnet over Ip configuration between 2 systems. OS version : VMS 7.3tG I empty decnet host database and ip resolution is made via a DNS server  turning on a sun (:-<   C I have no problem with set host command and transport is well tcpipe  I When I try to copy or to make a dir on the remote host, I have problems :l  L dir  remhost"user pass"::sys$system:        => no problem, dir command right executed  6 dir remhost::sys$system:  => Problems : login invalid.  H I have define on remhost proxies in UAF (add/proxy  fromhost::user  userH /default) and tcpip proxies (add proxy /remote_user=user /host=fromhost)  > They still are problems with using proxies with Decnet over IP       Can somebody help me ??    Regardsm   Bruno from Belgium   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 15:03:21 -0400A, From: "J. Scott Greig" <jsgreig@geminaq.com>( Subject: Re: Proxies with Decnet over IP/ Message-ID: <umq76s32i3j2ff@corp.supernews.com>-   You might try:  @ UAF> add/proxy fully.qualified.iphost.name::remoteuser localuser   Scotta  2 "Seghers Bruno" <tips@euronet.be> wrote in message. news:akj5l6$1ebsv$1@sinclair.be.wanadoo.com... > Hi,  >NL > I implement a Decnet over Ip configuration between 2 systems. OS version :	 > VMS 7.3 I > I empty decnet host database and ip resolution is made via a DNS serverd > turning on a sun (:-<  > E > I have no problem with set host command and transport is well tcpipe > K > When I try to copy or to make a dir on the remote host, I have problems :t >tH > dir  remhost"user pass"::sys$system:        => no problem, dir command right 
 > executed >N8 > dir remhost::sys$system:  => Problems : login invalid. >OJ > I have define on remhost proxies in UAF (add/proxy  fromhost::user  userJ > /default) and tcpip proxies (add proxy /remote_user=user /host=fromhost) >c@ > They still are problems with using proxies with Decnet over IP >H >e >g > Can somebody help me ??s >r	 > Regards  >A > Bruno from Belgium >u >n   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 16:34:02 -0400a* From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>( Subject: Re: Proxies with Decnet over IP4 Message-ID: <Osab9.9541$H67.51973@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>  7 uaf> add/proxy ip$888.888.888.888::remoteuser localuseri  L if you have numbers in your ip address that are < 10, use as least 2 digits: ex: 176.212.08.01    HTHn   --   SyltremtI http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site - en franais)s8 To reply to myself directly, remove zulu from my address  B "Seghers Bruno" <tips@euronet.be> a crit dans le message de news:) akj5l6$1ebsv$1@sinclair.be.wanadoo.com...h > Hi,m > L > I implement a Decnet over Ip configuration between 2 systems. OS version :	 > VMS 7.3sI > I empty decnet host database and ip resolution is made via a DNS server  > turning on a sun (:-<y >yE > I have no problem with set host command and transport is well tcpipe >hK > When I try to copy or to make a dir on the remote host, I have problems :s >nH > dir  remhost"user pass"::sys$system:        => no problem, dir command rightw
 > executed >n8 > dir remhost::sys$system:  => Problems : login invalid. >dJ > I have define on remhost proxies in UAF (add/proxy  fromhost::user  userJ > /default) and tcpip proxies (add proxy /remote_user=user /host=fromhost) >l@ > They still are problems with using proxies with Decnet over IP >h >o >w > Can somebody help me ??r >r	 > Regards  >s > Bruno from Belgium >a >e   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 22:59:44 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)( Subject: Re: Proxies with Decnet over IP* Message-ID: <akjkl0$t1q$1@web1.cup.hp.com>  ^ In article <akj5l6$1ebsv$1@sinclair.be.wanadoo.com>, "Seghers Bruno" <tips@euronet.be> writes:  ? :They still are problems with using proxies with Decnet over IPe  G   Please look in the auditing and accounting logs on the REMOTE system,iG   on the system that has the incoming connection, and determine exactlynE   what accessor identification string is being presented to LOGINOUT.tD   This string will show as the remote user for the record associatedE   with the incoming connection.  This is the string that must exactly 8   match and that must be used within the proxy database.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 21:00:11 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: re white boxenl* Message-ID: <akjdkr$nq1$3@web1.cup.hp.com>  k In article <slrnamp38r.44d.$USER@dinsdale.piranhabrothers.foo>, Thomas Harris <tharris@stewart.com> writes:B  9 :I now am in the position of admining a slightly earlier r9 :version alphaserver in VMS world,  which I'm reasonably t; :familiar with,  but would like to use home alphaserver fors; :playing in sandbox purposes,  rather than using productioni; :machinery.  Current alpha-montagnar hobbyist kit installs e> :but pukes midway through boot.  Any help appreciated.  I have: :a 3100 vaxstation but builds would be a tad quicker on a  :500mhz alpha.  F   Specific hardware details, please?  Specific details include but areG   not limited to SCSI and/or IDE details, graphics display, OpenVMS andeE   DECwindows versions, and -- particularly since you don't want me to D   hand you a "convenience bag" nor attempt to cannulate for an IV --H   details of exactly what you mean by "pukes", as that is not an OpenVMS!   error message that I recognize.   D   As I have repeatedly stated, OpenVMS does not support the whiteboxG   Alpha systems.  In various cases, the hardware is different.  In some I   cases, folks get lucky.  In some cases, folks encounter latent problems5G   with the boxes.  Whitebox systems were commonly shipped with hardwaren7   supported by Microsoft Windows NT and not by OpenVMS.1    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 03:23:25 GMTd) From: Thomas Harris <tharris@stewart.com>  Subject: Re: re white boxen ? Message-ID: <slrnamr8e2.90b.$USER@dinsdale.piranhabrothers.foo>a  > In article <akjdkr$nq1$3@web1.cup.hp.com>, Hoff Hoffman wrote: > m > In article <slrnamp38r.44d.$USER@dinsdale.piranhabrothers.foo>, Thomas Harris <tharris@stewart.com> writes:l > : >:I now am in the position of admining a slightly earlier : >:version alphaserver in VMS world,  which I'm reasonably < >:familiar with,  but would like to use home alphaserver for< >:playing in sandbox purposes,  rather than using production< >:machinery.  Current alpha-montagnar hobbyist kit installs ? >:but pukes midway through boot.  Any help appreciated.  I haven; >:a 3100 vaxstation but builds would be a tad quicker on a i >:500mhz alpha.C > H >   Specific hardware details, please?  Specific details include but areI >   not limited to SCSI and/or IDE details, graphics display, OpenVMS andeG >   DECwindows versions, and -- particularly since you don't want me tohF >   hand you a "convenience bag" nor attempt to cannulate for an IV --J >   details of exactly what you mean by "pukes", as that is not an OpenVMS# >   error message that I recognize.a > B Yes I know all that.  I already went through this on it with Tru64E which I was able to make run by editing the NVRAM to enable SRM Boot.   # DigitalServer 3000 Model 3305 6500A  SRM-Console V5.8-16o ARC Console V5.70m OpenVMS PALcode V1.21-3t Digital UNIX PALcode V1.23-5 Serial ROM V1.3o 21164A-2 500mhzr Motherboard 54-24803-02 Rev A  256M in bank 0 QLOGIC ISP 10x0w 3 Quantum Viking drivest RRD46 DCROM  S3TRio64/TRio32 videom Intel 82375 bridge	 DE500 nic    OpenVMS 7.2f DECWindows V1.2-5  DECnet V7.2O TCP/IP v5.09  < I have a ps2 keyboard and environment value is set to PCXAL.: One of the problems is even as it succesfully installs it 7 sees "?" as "/".  I then succesfully complete install, p reboot,  and it fails to load.  E 	%APB-F-BADSYSROOT System root (SYSA) does not exist, check bootflagsi 	 
 	Halted CPU 0:
 	Halt code =5  	Halt Instruction Executed 	PC=200039bc 	Warning HWRPB is invalide  G When I do the install I let it fully initialize the disk for VMS usage.e    K So obviously I need to set some other bootflags or tinker with nvram a bit.t
 Any ideas.     Thanks,e Tomi   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:42:22 +0200a" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> Subject: Re: Reverse LAT6 Message-ID: <akjck2$1irrkb$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de>  " My comments are in the text below.  K "Michael Raspuzzi" <raspuzzi#spamblaster.emesen-dot-com> schreef in bericht-% news:#4TvJGqTCHA.2208@cpimsnntpa03...t >.> > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message# > news:3D6C399F.925AC5BD@fsi.net...p > > Hans Vlems wrote:- > > >-J > > > Could you tell me what software version you're running on it (screen	 > dump of ' > > > the SHOW SERVER would do nicely)?dI > > > It would be very useful if I could persuade my DS100 to run reverse  LAT. > >aH > > What happens when you create an LTA on VMS pointing to a port on the+ > > server and try to copy something to it?   E The DECserver must advertise a LAT service in order to establish thatnL connection. That LAT service must be created on the DECserver and bound to aF serial port. The advertised LAT service name shows up in MC LATCP SHOWK SERVICES lists for instance. That is the definition (as I understand it) of0 reverse LAT.   > >aC > > It's been a long time since I had a DS100, but I did use it fordJ > > reverse-LAT. I just don't remember how to set a port for remote access+ > > in DS100's subset of the DECserver CLI.d > >r >iI > The DECserver 100 can NOT do reverse LAT.  It is a common misconception  thatK > being able to put a printer on a DECserver and accessing it from the hosto is& > the same as reverse LAT.  It is not.   Correct.   >eK > The DECserver 100 can have a port set for remote access and a printer cann beG > attached to that port.  However, the DECserver 100 cannot tell if theoJ > printer is powered up.  So, print jobs sent to a printer that is powered offrL > will be lost.  Accessing a printer from the host is typically done using a; > host initiated connection - not a reverse LAT connection.   I Yup. The DS100 has RS232 connectors where only pins 2,3 and 7 are fitted.hH No way you can have modem control nor reliable printer control with that	 hardware.l  I > A reverse LAT connection can only be made to a terminal server that haso therF > ability to offer a service to the LAN.  You connect to a reverse LAT serviceoF > from another DECserver (using the Local> CONNECT command) or from an OpenVMStJ > system using SET HOST /LAT.  The DECserver 100 does not have the ability toJ > advertise services to the network that can be connected to using another > DECserver or SET HOST /LAT.e >sG > There are 2 ends to a LAT connection - the master and the slave.  Then masterJ > initiates the connection and the slave receives the incoming connection.L > When you connect to an OpenVMS system to login, the terminal server is theE > master and the host is the slave.  In a reverse LAT connection, theeF > DECserver acts as the slave while another DECserver is the master or OpenVMS $ > is the master using SET HOST /LAT. >tL > The DECserver 100 can only act as a master.  Since it cannot function as aI > LAT slave, it does not have reverse LAT capability.  When SET HOST /LATl was G > introduced to OpenVMS, the project was called "LAT/Master" because we-L > essentially implemented the master portion of the LAT protocol in addition > to the slave part on OpenVMS.p  J Thanks for that little bit of history. That must have happened well before) LAT development was contracted out, then?o   > J > In case you are wondering about printer connections, the terminal serverJ > still acts as a master in that case.  While it appears the connection isH > initiated by the host, it is not mastered by the host.  Host initiatedL > connections have the host computer send a special message to the DECserverJ > requesting that the DECserver start a master connection to the host on aJ > specific port so the host can send data to that port.  The basic flow of thet > messages is like this:  K This behaviour is controlled by the Access port attribute. It may be set toeL Local, Remote and Dynamic. Using a printer required that you used the Remote setting.I DYnamic gave unpredictable results on the DS100 because the printer coulddF drop the connection. The DS100 did not realize that and an intelligentJ printer could send some text back to the DS100. Which in turn decided thatH suddenly a user terminal was attached to that same port and logged it in with a very funny username.a   >aG > - Host sends out a Solicit message to the network to get the terminals > server's attention.eL > - DECserver responds with information about the desired resource requested > in the solicit messageJ > - Host sends a Command message to the DECserver requesting it initiate a > master connection to the hosteJ > - DECserver starts LAT connection between itself and the host (DECserver is  > the master, host is the slave) >lK > In short, it is easy to confuse host initiated connections (ala printers)oK > and reverse LAT connections (like connecting to a DECserver port that has  asI > modem or computer console).  In the strictest sense of their meaning, aGK > DECserver 100 and some DECserver 90 models cannot offer a LAT service ands( > therefore, do not support reverse LAT.  K The restriction also applies for the DS550. We once evaluated a 550 becauseiJ it had IBM coax intercaes. We figured that with reverse LAt we could bringJ 3270 terminal support in remote locations. DEC assured us that reverse LATJ was available for the 550, but unfortunately made exactly the same mistake as you described above. L Unfortunately because DEC The Netherlands were stuck with two DS550's with a8 couple of coax interfaces.. Rather expensive in its day.    F > About 10 years ago, I developed a course for DECUS that involved theK > details/mechanics of the LAT protocol and I touched on this difference in  > depth. >  > Hope this helps,- > Mike Raspuzzi (raspuzzi on M S N dot C O M)  > former OpenVMS LAT developer >  >o >    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 01:03:27 GMT)1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>e Subject: Re: Reverse LAT' Message-ID: <3D6D7813.579EBB7C@fsi.net>n   Hans Vlems wrote:m > $ > My comments are in the text below. > M > "Michael Raspuzzi" <raspuzzi#spamblaster.emesen-dot-com> schreef in berichtZ' > news:#4TvJGqTCHA.2208@cpimsnntpa03...  > > @ > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message% > > news:3D6C399F.925AC5BD@fsi.net.... > > > Hans Vlems wrote:1 > > > >3L > > > > Could you tell me what software version you're running on it (screen > > dump of ) > > > > the SHOW SERVER would do nicely)?rK > > > > It would be very useful if I could persuade my DS100 to run reverseh > LAT. > > >wJ > > > What happens when you create an LTA on VMS pointing to a port on the- > > > server and try to copy something to it?r > G > The DECserver must advertise a LAT service in order to establish thatrN > connection. That LAT service must be created on the DECserver and bound to aH > serial port. The advertised LAT service name shows up in MC LATCP SHOWM > SERVICES lists for instance. That is the definition (as I understand it) ofi > reverse LAT.  9 By that definition, then, "reverse-TELNET" is a misnomer.   2 Pedantry aside, I think we all know what he meant.   -- - David J. Dachtera- dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2002 13:21:34 +0200 4 From: "Ulrike Goedtler" <ulrike_goedtler@mra.man.de>O Subject: Searching printforms with German-Umlauts for OKI-Printers (Epson-Mode) * Message-ID: <ajqkai$4sn$1@aras.mra.man.de>  K Some of my Users want to print on a matrixprinter (OKI ML-393, Epson Mode).hL Up to now I only have PrintForms for LaserPrinter with DCPS and DEC-LA424 or LN03R Matrix-PrinterssI I  have tried to make a form with ESC-sequences, but my textfile with all:J special signs, such as (german) umlauts and and brackets were not printed.K I think, I need a Codepage ISO-Latin I and I don't found this ESC-Sequence.pE Unfortunately the printer ist in an other town, so I can't try often.u  H Is there anyone who have a formlibrary for OKI or Epson - Matrixprinters with German fonts ?m  	 Greetings-   Ulrike Goedtler- MAN Roland Druckmaschninen AG3 Augsburg, GermanyJ   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 14:01:00 -0400 ; From: "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>i+ Subject: RE: silliest thing heard this weekhK Message-ID: <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E49028BEA49@rlghncst964.usps.gov>   / You left out alt.masochism.microsoft-windows...a   Or is that name redundant?   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----B From: "Phillip Helbig" [mailto:HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com]% Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 8:10 AMa To: "Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com" + Subject: RE: silliest thing heard this weeks    I > > I can't wait to tie his butt up, plop him down in front of a terminali >n> > There are other newsgroups where you could discuss this.  :)  E Right.  Good ol' alt.sex.fetish.dec-hardware might be a good place toN> start.  Of course, alt.sex.spanking.microsoft-windows would be appropriate as well.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2002 02:03:43 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>+ Subject: Re: silliest thing heard this weeki- Message-ID: <87d6s2dfnk.fsf@prep.synonet.com>g  . jlewocz@poczta.wprost.pl (John Lewocz) writes:   > if [ -d $EMPTY_DIR ]; then >     echo "EMPTY_DIR exists"  > fi  eE > You'll notice that EMPTY_DIR is an environment variable whose exactc- > content I don't need to know ahead of time.e  gD > In DCL you get an "" if it exists but is empty.  In DCL you get an! > "" if it does NOT exist at all.i   E > In unix I don't have to transform something like [foo.bar.baz] intog0 > [foo.bar]baz.dir just to make the distinction.  t  What do you think the `-d' does?  	 > Got it?   C You seem to be the one who is a few fingers short of a full bash :)    -- e< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 17:11 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)y+ Subject: Re: silliest thing heard this week - Message-ID: <28AUG200217114002@gerg.tamu.edu>s  5 "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes...  }John Lewocz wrote: 	 }> [snip]sP }> Oh, and speaking of "college days", I swear DCL was written by some undergradR }> on spring break  -- in the 1940's.   Why is there no builtin way to distinguishR }> between an empty directory and one that doesn't exist?   Oh sure, I've seen theK }> postings that say "if you want to check if [bozo.the.clown] exists, do a P }> f$search([bozo.the]clown.dir).   But what if you don't know the path ahead of }> time? } < }$ PATH = F$PARSE( filespec,,, "DEVICE", "SYNTAX_ONLY" ) + -2 }F$PARSE( filespec,,, "DIRECTORY", "SYNTAX_ONLY" )% }$ IF F$PARSE( PATH ) .EQS. "" THEN -k4 }$ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "% Path does not exist - ", PATH }David J. Dachtera  B This is good in theory, but it misses one case. If there is a fileC called FOO.DIR that is not a directory file, the F$PARSE testing asTA above will fail by indicating that there is a [.FOO] subdirectorye4 even though there isn't (at least up to VMS V7.2-1).   $ create foo.dir this is not a directoryr  Exitl $ filespec = "[carl.foo]a.b"
 $ dir foo.diri   Directory $DISK1:[CARL]o  	 FOO.DIR;1i   Total of 1 file. $ dir 'filespec'? %DIRECT-E-OPENIN, error opening $DISK1:[CARL.FOO]A.B;* as input-/ -RMS-E-FND, ACP file or directory lookup failed-0 -SYSTEM-W-BADIRECTORY, bad directory file format= $ $ PATH = F$PARSE( filespec,,, "DEVICE", "SYNTAX_ONLY" ) + --4 _$ F$PARSE( filespec,,, "DIRECTORY", "SYNTAX_ONLY" )& $ $ IF F$PARSE( PATH ) .EQS. "" THEN -6 _$ $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "% Path does not exist - ", PATH
 $ say "Oops!"- Oops!-   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 00:57:01 GMTo1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>a+ Subject: Re: silliest thing heard this weekl' Message-ID: <3D6D7691.168EB72C@fsi.net>r   Carl Perkins wrote:t > 7 > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes...a > }John Lewocz wrote:i > }> [snip]nR > }> Oh, and speaking of "college days", I swear DCL was written by some undergradT > }> on spring break  -- in the 1940's.   Why is there no builtin way to distinguishT > }> between an empty directory and one that doesn't exist?   Oh sure, I've seen theM > }> postings that say "if you want to check if [bozo.the.clown] exists, do alR > }> f$search([bozo.the]clown.dir).   But what if you don't know the path ahead of
 > }> time? > }c> > }$ PATH = F$PARSE( filespec,,, "DEVICE", "SYNTAX_ONLY" ) + -4 > }F$PARSE( filespec,,, "DIRECTORY", "SYNTAX_ONLY" )' > }$ IF F$PARSE( PATH ) .EQS. "" THEN - 6 > }$ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "% Path does not exist - ", PATH > }David J. Dachtera > D > This is good in theory, but it misses one case. If there is a fileE > called FOO.DIR that is not a directory file, the F$PARSE testing aseC > above will fail by indicating that there is a [.FOO] subdirectorya6 > even though there isn't (at least up to VMS V7.2-1).  C One could argue that the example you cite constitutes a file systemWD corruption, and that the lexicals and the underlying system services. were not intended to diagnose the file system.   -- - David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems> http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/q   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 14:25:12 -0400-- From: Jonathan Boswell <jsb@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>M Subject: Re: Simple clustera0 Message-ID: <3D6D1588.D24DDDF8@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>   Ed Wilts wrote:0G > In *all* cases, make sure you don't lose network connectivity between:< > the cluster hosts. LAVCs do not like losing the network...  O No kidding!  I went from a 3-node DSSI-based VAXcluster (which never went down)tK to a 2-node SCSI-based Alpha cluster.  I frequently lose the entire clustermA courtesy of remote network problems over which I have no control.i  P What is the cheapest way I can fix this problem?  I think a 2nd Ethernet adapterO in my ES40's with a crossover TP cable between the two machines might suffice. yL Note that Alpha DSSI adapters do not support SCS, and I don't have the bucks) right now to add Memory Channel adapters.u    - JBi   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 20:31:08 +0100 (MET)s9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>p Subject: Re: Simple clusters; Message-ID: <01KLUEJZ1Y129QUS7H@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>   J > What is the cheapest way I can fix this problem?  I think a 2nd EthernetI > adapter in my ES40's with a crossover TP cable between the two machines  > might suffice.     Should work fine.-   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 16:25:56 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)e Subject: Re: Simple cluster = Message-ID: <cf15391e.0208281525.19384fd7@posting.google.com>n  e Jonathan Boswell <jsb@ost.cdrh.fda.gov> wrote in message news:<3D6D1588.D24DDDF8@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>... 3 > Note that Alpha DSSI adapters do not support SCS,   D I'm guessing you must have meant SCSI where you have DSSI here.  The> DSSI adapter on Alpha, KFPSA, does indeed support SCS traffic.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 00:49:21 GMTE1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>t Subject: Re: Simple clustere' Message-ID: <3D6D74C5.54B62C7B@fsi.net>s  
 Robert wrote:  > b > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D6C30BA.D984A035@fsi.net>... > > Ed Wilts wrote:d > > >l > > > "David D Miller" <ddmiller@raytheon.com> wrote in message news:<OF81D5D9BD.634A99EC-ON07256C1B.0061F8C2@rsc.raytheon.com>... > > > > Cluster experts: > > > >rQ > > > > All this talk about updating a system shadow volume got me thinking.  I'mfN > > > > trying to imagine the simplest (and cheapest) redundant Alpha cluster. > > > > Will this work?a > > > >hS > > > > Two Alphas on Ethernet and each has a disk.  The two disks make up a system0K > > > > shadow volume.  Each Alpha has a vote.  Is a quorum disk necessary?  > > >$I > > > As others have responded, this won't work.  With 2 systems having 1 I > > > vote each, quorum is 2 ((n+1)/2).  If one system crashes, the other- > > > hangs. > >2	 > > 2+1=3t- > > 3/2=1 (integer math, remainder truncated)p > >i! > > Therefore, quorum = 1, right?3 > ! > QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 2)/2s > M > (2+2)/2 = 2 so the quorum is 2. If it were one the cluster could partition.t  
 Try again:   QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 1)/2                             ^ 2+1=3u 3/2=1f   -- d David J. Dachterat dba DJE SystemsA http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/y   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:00:50 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: Simple clustersK Message-ID: <rdeininger-2808022200500001@1cust174.tnt3.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>n  ; In article <3D6D74C5.54B62C7B@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera"t <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:    J >> > > As others have responded, this won't work.  With 2 systems having 1J >> > > vote each, quorum is 2 ((n+1)/2).  If one system crashes, the other
 >> > > hangs.n >> >
 >> > 2+1=3. >> > 3/2=1 (integer math, remainder truncated) >> >" >> > Therefore, quorum = 1, right? >> c" >> QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 2)/2 >> rN >> (2+2)/2 = 2 so the quorum is 2. If it were one the cluster could partition. >. >Try again:  >o  >QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 1)/2 >                           ^a >2+1=3 >3/2=1   No!n  H The manual has several paragraphs in a table, but the relevant line says> "QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 2)/2        |        Rounded down"   Which gives: Expected_votes       Quorumi ---------------------------  1                     1  2                     2  3                     2c 4                     3h 5                     3   etc.n  - A non-mathematical way to think about quorum:eJ    If the quorum and votes are configured correctly, then any possible wayG    of dividing up a cluster will yield at most ONE group of nodes stillbM    connected together which have enough votes to reach quorum.  You can never I    end up with two (or more) sub-clusters which see enough votes to reachM
    quorum.  I With two nodes, 1 vote each, it wouldn't work to have quorum equal 1.  IfeJ we cut  communication between the nodes, each sub-cluster would still haveG 1 vote.  We CAN'T allow 1 vote to make quorum, because that would alloweH both sub-clusters to continue operating, each thinking it was the "real"H cluster.  So quorum MUST be two in this case, for safety.  Which is just. what the documented formula tells us, as well.   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 21:55:36 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)s Subject: Re: Simple clusterM3 Message-ID: <BrGRitYjXf4G@eisner.encompasserve.org>E   In article <rdeininger-2808022200500001@1cust174.tnt3.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:= > In article <3D6D74C5.54B62C7B@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera"l  > <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote: >  > K >>> > > As others have responded, this won't work.  With 2 systems having 1aK >>> > > vote each, quorum is 2 ((n+1)/2).  If one system crashes, the other  >>> > > hangs. >>> >A >>> > 2+1=3 / >>> > 3/2=1 (integer math, remainder truncated)r >>> >r# >>> > Therefore, quorum = 1, right?r >>> # >>> QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 2)/2h >>> O >>> (2+2)/2 = 2 so the quorum is 2. If it were one the cluster could partition.e >> >>Try again: >>! >>QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 1)/2s >>                           ^ >>2+1=3D >>3/2=1  >  > No!g > J > The manual has several paragraphs in a table, but the relevant line says@ > "QUORUM = (EXPECTED_VOTES + 2)/2        |        Rounded down" >  > Which gives: > Expected_votes       Quorumo > ---------------------------t > 1                     1, > 2                     2a > 3                     2u > 4                     3Y > 5                     3s >  etc.h > / > A non-mathematical way to think about quorum:oL >    If the quorum and votes are configured correctly, then any possible wayI >    of dividing up a cluster will yield at most ONE group of nodes stilllO >    connected together which have enough votes to reach quorum.  You can never K >    end up with two (or more) sub-clusters which see enough votes to reach  >    quorum. > K > With two nodes, 1 vote each, it wouldn't work to have quorum equal 1.  IfeL > we cut  communication between the nodes, each sub-cluster would still haveI > 1 vote.  We CAN'T allow 1 vote to make quorum, because that would alloweJ > both sub-clusters to continue operating, each thinking it was the "real"J > cluster.  So quorum MUST be two in this case, for safety.  Which is just0 > what the documented formula tells us, as well.    ! 	Yeah, bzzzzt on Q = (EV + 1) / 2r  C 	And Nic teaches it differently.  As long as you can do ninth (8th) C 	grade algebra, you can slice it another way as Nic and I discussede 	last year this time:e  d http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=9c40b5bf.0108031825.328edb76%40posting.google.com&output=gplain     > >         Ooops! > > & > >         Q = (EV + 2 ) / 2      (1) > >         Rounded Down.d > G > Wasn't that what I said? I did the calculation differently to explaineG > what it was, sum all the votes, divide that by 2, then add one. Isn'tmI > that the same as summing all the votes AND adding two, then dividing by  > two? >   >      They both work the same.  A = ( B + 2 ) / 2  , B = 2A - 2C      C = (D / 2) + 1  , D = 2C - 2.... I'm not a purist kind of guyCF      but if the algebra is here there and everywhere written one way, D      and we start introducing another "more simpler" way, that makesJ      it tougher for the kiddies.  Surely 9th [8th] grade algebra should beD      a bare minimum to run a cluster.  Perhaps that is a good thing!      Very good thing!d   > > (1)aJ > > Ref:  http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/4477/4477pro_002.html   ---C  @ 	Again, a purist would commit to memory:  Q = (EV + 2) / 2 using, 	integer math.  But Nic's method works also.   				Robe  B Men with walkie-talkies                 I'm home again to you babeC Men with flashlights wavin'             You know it makes me wondermG Up upon the tower                       Sittin' in the quiet slipstream > The clock reads daylight savings        Rollin' in the thunder  -                                 -- Neil Young    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Aug 2002 02:38:27 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>A Subject: Re: Size of I/O count fields in SHOW PROC and SHOW SYS ? - Message-ID: <878z2qde1o.fsf@prep.synonet.com>s  3 "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:L  F > Interesting question. I would expect it to just quietly overflow andC > roll back around to zero like DCL does in the following, but thatr > may be a brash assumption:  ? Or, as the AMDS NISCS stuff does, go negative then wrap around.n   -- a< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 20:02:37 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)* Subject: Re: Sounds like INS needs VMS ...* Message-ID: <akja8t$nq1$1@web1.cup.hp.com>  5 "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in messagey7 news:d7791aa1.0208231850.120ccf4d@posting.google.com...n : INS inspector: Databaseh : of terrorists often crashes B : Foreign passengers at airports get a pass when computers go down  ?   This could easily result from a management-, hardware- or an  @   application-level issue, of course.  If the application or the@   platform or the network does not function reliably, it matters&   not what operating system is in use.  C   Various state motor vehicle agency databases are regularly eithereE   unstable or inaccessable to law enforcement -- these outages appear ?   to result from the poorly-distributed design of the database  C   applications, the age of the applications involved, and to issues D   of management and software upgrades, and -- everyone's favorite --C   cost.  (I expect there are some leading-edge database designs andg?   applications around for this and similar tasks, but empiricalg2   evidence indicates their use is not universal.)   ?   That INS or other agencies might have similar problems is notg    particularly surprising to me.  B   From my own direct experience, this database stuff is, well, far-   more "interesting" than it initially looks.c  @   That an article -- one not specifically targeting folks in theC   computer trade -- would not distinguish applications and hardwaretC   and networking and the underlying database issues is certanly nota@   unexpected.  The omission would not be particularly surprisingC   even in an article written for folks in the computer and softwarel   trade.  E   Put another way, poor applications can be written for any platform,lF   and even well-written press articles tend to (have to) omit details.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:04:11 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> * Subject: Re: Sounds like INS needs VMS ...H Message-ID: <fVab9.26931$6m61.9540@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  ? "Hoff Hoffman" <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in messagei$ news:akja8t$nq1$1@web1.cup.hp.com... > B >   That an article -- one not specifically targeting folks in theE >   computer trade -- would not distinguish applications and hardware E >   and networking and the underlying database issues is certanly notlB >   unexpected.  The omission would not be particularly surprisingE >   even in an article written for folks in the computer and softwarea
 >   trade. > G >   Put another way, poor applications can be written for any platform,sH >   and even well-written press articles tend to (have to) omit details.  G Sage advice once given to me by the CEO of a company I once worked for,eI "Never talk to the press. They will incompletely report what you say, andt$ distort everything that they print."   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 00:40:43 GMTt# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>d, Subject: Re: telnet from *NIX to OpenVMS 7.2I Message-ID: <f4eb9.28126$6m61.23634@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>f  ? "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote in message E news:rdeininger-2108022253130001@1cust211.tnt2.nashua.nh.da.uu.net...XB > In article <slrnam85li.r48.joshua@iocc.com>, joshua@www.iocc.com > (Franklin) wrote:E > * > >> Why is it sending a Ctrl-O character? > >eI > >Very good question. Perhaps I was unclear... the telnet session begins 8 > >normally, I get the VMS banner. Then the card catalogB > >("Information Gateway  --  V2.5-2 Copyright 2000, Data Research Associates,eK > >Inc.  All Rights Reserved.") starts up.  It is this card catalog program1C > >that is sending control characters such as ^O. I don't know why.=K > >It is supposed to be an ANSI interface, I think, though TERM settings of  VT100,1 > >ANSI, etc. don't seems to make any difference)  >nK > Perhaps the VMS system is executing a SET TERMINAL/INQUIRE command?  ThispJ > command sends some escape sequences, which a standard-compliant terminalI > would answer with some identifying information.  Few, if any, PC-hostedR$ > terminal emulators get this right. >   J Zstem from KEA Systems did alright in that regard. Think I still have some+ of those emulation packages kicking around.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 19:42:40 -0400v, From: "Francisco Ortega" <fortega@iblues.cc> Subject: Telnet PortA Message-ID: <g7db9.35296$Hd4.7632757@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>l  H  Hi, It's possible in tcpip (openvms 7.2) to either add another port forG telnet or change the port?. The thing is that way, I could connect fromgH outside, using an internet address. I think. Thanks for all your help. II have been away from vms for a few years, but I'll get sharp fast and willnJ commit to help in this group, at least few times a week as soon as I get a little sharper. THanks  	 Franciscoc   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 17:54:51 GMT)5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>t0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financials2 Message-ID: <L78b9.32$gx7.530558@news.cpqcorp.net>  J Frankly, the only times I have said anything about HP here were in defenseJ of various slanders and attempts to confuse people - mostly by you.  ThereK has never been any question about the fact we would be taking restructuringF) charges in relation to merger activities.P  I So what does this have to do with Sun's problems?  You seem to be the onei? trying desperately to paint a picture of sunshine and lolipops.   K It seems to me that the only one here trying to avoid anything here is you.i    6 Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote in message ... >e >n >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:h >i9 >> Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote in message ...t >> >>>d1 >>>I guess it also pretty much destroys the wholeg2 >>>basis of Freddy boys argument, shame but really >>>rather predictable. >>>e >>>  >>L >> Are you having comprehension problems?  Noplace have I claimed that HP isJ >> exempt from the general industry slump.  If you exclude one-time mergerI >> related charges, we actually would have had a net of 14 cents a share.v Oure2 >> results were in line with analyst expectations. >> >e >r3 >Well Freddy as a number of people have pointed outV7 >its quite convenient to have the merger as a catch alld3 >for re-structuring that would in any case have hadm0 >to be done because of the collapse in revenues. >v4 >Sun has also had to re-structure because of falling2 >demand, we don't have the convenience of a merger$ >to cover our restructuring charges. >t2 >You yourself commented on our charges but seem to4 >want to present yours in a totally different light. >s3 >It would as always seem that the only one with thei# >comprehension problem is yourself.  >e >Regards >Andrew Harrison >0 >M >s   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:07:18 GMT:5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>v0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financials2 Message-ID: <qj8b9.34$Pw7.516118@news.cpqcorp.net>  = JF Mezei wrote in message <3D6D0BD9.2292A72A@videotron.ca>...m >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:.L >> Are you having comprehension problems?  Noplace have I claimed that HP isJ >> exempt from the general industry slump.  If you exclude one-time mergerI >> related charges, we actually would have had a net of 14 cents a share.o Ourc2 >> results were in line with analyst expectations. >nG >1- Analyst expectation is bull. Analysts just read the "guidance" from  Carly'stK >previous speeches/reports and use that as expectation. Few analysts reallya9 >bother understanding what a company really does anymore.e >u  K I think that some may be rubber stamps, but it is not universally true.  If0J you bother to look beyond the concensus estimate, you will find a range of
 estimates.  E >"meeting expectations" is the worse sentence and the whole guidance, E >expectation thing should be made illegal. Analysts should be made to3 researchL >company products, fundamentals, and come up with their own opinions instead of. >rehashing propaganda made by the company CEO. >E  E You are trying to paint with a too broad of brush.  In any case, even J agreeing with you - so what?  The estimate and guidance are there to allowE investors to determine what value they believe the stock should have.uI Meeting the expectation *is* important.  Suprising investors with numberssH that are not in line with expectations is very, very bad.  It is the one7 thing (earnings suprises) that can do in a CEO quickly.k  J >Secondly, the "if you exclude merger costs" item is moot. Carly and CurlyJ >chose to merge. There are high costs associated with that.  BOB GQ Palmer "oneG >time re-org" costs turned out to be recurring items because the reorgsm becameH >a game of musical chairs that was played every time there was a quarterG >without good numbers. That *may* happen with HP as well if the numberst don'tt	 >pan out.r >i  L Eh?  Part of the work done in deciding to merge has to take into account theK up front costs of the merger, the risks, and the downstream benefits.  Thisw& is not the same as internal "re-orgs".  L >Carly can use creative accounting to make one quarter look on target.  This isK >why Carly's statement that they are on target is not yet credible. PerhapsR% >next quarter will be more revealing.l >e  J Point out the creative consulting please.  Or is that just a wild slander?   > I >From an HP investor point of view, remember that their stock was dilutedm whenJ >Compaq shareholders became HP shareholders.  This affected the book value ofK >HP shares since HP paid more for Compaq than what Compaq was worth. And iftH >Carly simply writes down duplicate assets, it means that the total book valuer >of HP will go down. >e  D Huh?  HP paid more for Compaq than what it was worth?  Now that's an+ objective statement - how do you figure it?r  K >Remember that HP bought Compaq with the primary purpose of eliminating oneO >wintel competitor.   I Huh?  I missed this.  Can you point me to this information.  It must havea1 been in the package I got when I voted my shares.   : >This means that you pay to buy Compaq and just write downJ >that investment in the hopes that your own wintel business will gain fromF >having one less competitor.  (sure, HP was smart and kept some Compaq productsC >and ditched its own in some cases but the end result is the same).l >y   Huh?  K >1 + 1 will clearly not = 2 in this case. I would say perhaps 1.25.  HP has J >gained VMS and Tandem. Whether VMS continues to be profitable during thisH >transition period (until IA64 is a commercial reality with all VMS apps portedI >and most customers switched to IA64) is another question.  Whether Tru64t3 >customers remain with HP is also another question.i  @ The debate is if 1+1=2.5 or 1+1=2 or 1+1=1.5 or 1+1=1 or 1+1=.75  L I personally will be hoping for 2.5, and will be happy with 1.5 - since thatL makes HP a better and more competetive company that either the old HP or theI old Compaq seperately.  Andrew is hoping for .75.    There isn't any good 1 way to tell except company performance over time.d   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:18:33 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>m0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financialsJ Message-ID: <Zt8b9.120445$8aG1.87322@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  # "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy"0> <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> wrote in message) news:akj0mh$7i$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...D >44 > Well Freddy as a number of people have pointed out8 > its quite convenient to have the merger as a catch all4 > for re-structuring that would in any case have had1 > to be done because of the collapse in revenues.t >c5 > Sun has also had to re-structure because of falling 3 > demand, we don't have the convenience of a merger>% > to cover our restructuring charges.t >    Andrew,U  D Mergers NEVER go as smoothly as execs think. There are always hiddenI surprises and additional costs in dealing with the mechanics of mergers -RL having lived through four myself I have seen this happen over and over. To aL large extent HP's management time is still taken up with merger issues - I'm= not making excuses for them, but just stating a fact of life.   I Face it - business sucks for everyone in the computer industry right now.-H And dislocations and dropped-balls that do happen in a merger can affectJ short-term results. It remains to be seen whether this stays true over the
 longer  term.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 15:00:00 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financials, Message-ID: <3D6D1DA2.3A93D6C3@videotron.ca>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:K > So what does this have to do with Sun's problems?  You seem to be the onerA > trying desperately to paint a picture of sunshine and lolipops.   " What exactly are Sun's problems ?   K Are their sustainable sales levels lower than what Sun's corporate size is, B hence no profits ? Is Sun fixing this by downsizing sufficiently ?  I Or is this considered just a temporary dip with Sun expected to come backi' strong as soon as the economy returns ?r   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 14:58:02 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financials, Message-ID: <3D6D1D2D.B3E635A2@videotron.ca>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:L > agreeing with you - so what?  The estimate and guidance are there to allowG > investors to determine what value they believe the stock should have.3  N But nobody, not even the CEO can really predict what will happen in the next 3M months. The guidance given by a CEO is really some target that he will strivehI to achieve by whatever means. And it is often those targets that CEOs aremL forced to abide by whcih force the accountants to use creative accounting toP meet those targets otherwise they know how harsh the Wall Street Casino will be.  K These cause wild fluctuations in the stock which are not good for long termCK investments and especially not good for corporate management since they are M forced to work hard to meet short term prediction after short term predictioni( instead of focusing on long term growth.    K > Meeting the expectation *is* important.  Suprising investors with numbersrJ > that are not in line with expectations is very, very bad.  It is the one9 > thing (earnings suprises) that can do in a CEO quickly.4  H Exactly. Then don't se expectations. Just let the past numbers speak forS themselves and don't try to predict a future you may or may not be able to achieve.   L This is especially true of a company in the process of gobbling/assimilatingC another. How the heck can they really predict the impact on sales ?e  K I have no problems with a CEO talking about management steps to be taken ingN the next quarter to increase efficiency, cut costs. Those are decisions withinJ the powers of the CEO. But I have problems about sales outlooks and profitS outlooks. Nobody can predict those and such predictions are tantamount to gambling.e    N > Eh?  Part of the work done in deciding to merge has to take into account theM > up front costs of the merger, the risks, and the downstream benefits.  This ( > is not the same as internal "re-orgs".  J But once the merger is being implemented, it is the equivalent of re-orgs.H You, as a VMS guy, have been lucky in a sense because anything alpha wasL grouped in the "legacy" division by itself. But consider that the PC and PDAL business is probably having to go through a lot of changes since may 7th and it isn't finished yet.  L > Point out the creative consulting please.  Or is that just a wild slander?  J I was merely pointing out that with creating accounting it becomes easy toN hide one quarter's bad news. It doesn't imply fraud. Just creating accounting.F  But staying legal, it becomes harder to hide bad news for more than aL quarter. So while Carly can state they are on target NOW, I will wait to seeH if she can remain on target for a few qtarters before passing judgement.  N Also, consider that letting go 15,000 people may have a nagative impact on theD profitability/operations of the company.  For instance, consirer theL hypothetical case of all sales rep associated with legacy alpha stuff are to: be let go. VMS and Tru64 sales would drop rather rapidly.   J The one area where there should be overcapacity is the wintel business. SoN letting go of folks who assemble/handle wintel boxes may not affect negatively& because they would be surplus anyways.  N The danger here is that with a 31% drop in enterprise system sales, will CarlyJ decide that many in that division are "surplus" and should be let go (evenN tough they are not surplus in the sense of duplication from merger, they would! be surplus since sales dropped ).a  N > I personally will be hoping for 2.5, and will be happy with 1.5 - since thatN > makes HP a better and more competetive company that either the old HP or the > old Compaq seperately.  I I am surprised that anyone would have hoped for 1 + 1 = 2.5.  Since Carly G stated so many times that she woudl streamline the combined company andeM eliminate duplication and provide hundreds of millions in saved costs, it wasiI obvious that Carly never intended to inherit something bigger than HP andl Compaq combined.  K Remember that Compaq wasn't healthy. If they had kept the Curly and WinklernM show much longer, Compaq's stock would have thumbled even more and perhaps HPcQ wouldn't have had to buy Compaq since it would no longer be a serious competitor.p  - Consider what HP intends to keep from Compaq:l0 	-ditch its own wintel and keep proliant serversR 	-ditch alpha related systems, maintaining the necessary evil port of VMS to IA64.# 	-maintain Tandem, port it to IA64.i  K So, in essence, HP halves the wintel production, removing overcapacity from-J the market which should put upwards pressure on prices. And it gets TandemL with it. VMS came with the deal, but considering that Carly never said "VMS"O suring the 7 month pregnancy, I doubt she wasreallyinterested in that business."   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 22:28:25 GMTD* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financialsB Message-ID: <d8cb9.147377$Aw4.6112987@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message, news:qj8b9.34$Pw7.516118@news.cpqcorp.net...   ...s  J > Eh?  Part of the work done in deciding to merge has to take into account the G > up front costs of the merger, the risks, and the downstream benefits.  This( > is not the same as internal "re-orgs".  E Indeed.  Would you now provide the reference to the public pre-mergerpF estimate that merger-related one-time costs would amount to about $2.5H billion this past quarter (plus, one must suspect, additional charges inF other quarters)?  Since that's what appears to be being claimed as theI reason people should 'pay no attention to the whopping deficit behind thei	 curtain'.y   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 03:32:22 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>t0 Subject: Re: Various tidbits about HP financials= Message-ID: <aBgb9.26894$kp.247960@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>b  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D6C5103.A0150E57@videotron.ca...J > Seems to me that based on those financials that HP,s revenus dropped far moreL > than had been anticipated. If I remember well, HP was predicting a 9% drop inC > enterprise systems. I think it was a 31% drop that was announced.t >sH > Yes, the economy isn't doing well and IT spending is low (confirmed by Intel'saK > CEO as well). But I get the feeling that "the new HP" isn't going to be a L > combination of HP, Compaq, Digital and Tandem as was anticipated. Just howL > much will HP grow from its acquisition of Compaq Digital and Tandem is the bigbL > question. I suspect that HP has simply acquired the leftovers from Digital and ? > Tande, with not much from Compaq contributing to HP's growth.x >tH > (Compaq's wintel may replace HP's wintel, but in the end, the new HP's wintel& > may not be much bigger than before). >lK > Also interesting is the mention of 10,000 layoffs when in the past 15,000n wasuK > the announced number. Does anyone have some explanation ? Has HP realisedr thatL > it wouldn't be able to rationalise its workforce as much as it had hoped ?  K Good question, but remember it takes a Dog's age to lay folks off in Frances= and Germany (whose economies reflect this policy, of course).D   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 01:30:55 GMTs From: sasadmin <jec@nospam.net>t- Subject: Re: VAX/Alpha Basic example programsp2 Message-ID: <87adn6igt3.fsf@Alethion.systasis.net>  ( David Gray <GrayD@turpinltd.com> writes:   > Greeting all,  > K > I find myself in the position of needing to write a routine in VAX-BASIC.lM > Quite honestly, it's been sometime since I have done this and was wondering I > if anyone knows of a good site with some example programs.  The OpenVMSaL > documentation site gives small code snippets but not what I'm looking for. > H > I'm trying to include an .RRD file in the basic program as output fromI > Oracle RMU/UNLOAD.  We have BASIC but nobody has ever used it, hence no 9 > source code to look through.  We also do NOT have CDD.   >  > XDS_APACHE> typ cw.rrd5 > DEFINE FIELD LAST_NAME DATATYPE IS TEXT SIZE IS 14.b6 > DEFINE FIELD FIRST_NAME DATATYPE IS TEXT SIZE IS 10.0 > DEFINE FIELD DBKEY DATATYPE IS TEXT SIZE IS 8. > DEFINE RECORD CANDIDATES_VW. >    LAST_NAME . >    FIRST_NAME .g > END CANDIDATES_VW RECORD.  >  > Thanks in advance,  
 > 	David.  >  > OpenVMS 7.1 (alpha)r > DEC/COMPAQ/HP BASIC V1.3   >    David:  F I didn't see any responses to what seemed your question: How to use an RRD file in BASIC.  F You won't be able to include the RRD file into BASIC, as it's not in a? format that the language understands. The compiler does have andD interface to the CDD which will translate CDD definitions into BASIC, syntax. Unfortunately, you don't have CDD...  E So, you will have to translate the RRD file by hand into BASIC RECORD D definition and then %include it into your program. Fortunately, thisH should be a one-time translation, since the table structure isn't likely@ to change. If it does, consider defining a view to give you just the columns you need.   A Also, if you have any facility with TPU, you could write a simplerB mapping function that takes RRD input and generates RECORD output.   -- c Microsoft Free By 2003   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 15:35:28 -0400a; From: "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>h, Subject: RE: VMS 7.3-1 Doc set... plain janeK Message-ID: <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E49028BEA4B@rlghncst964.usps.gov>I  7 We're already calling it the "White Album" around here.h   WWWebb     -----Original Message-----2 From: "Patrick Young" [mailto:P.Young@unsw.EDU.AU]% Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 6:22 AM1 To: "Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com" , Subject: RE: VMS 7.3-1 Doc set... plain jane    = rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) wrote in messagewF news:<rdeininger-2408020910270001@1cust82.tnt2.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>... >vJ > Nothing was done about the logos and branding until after the merger was > complete.p >e  = Think of it as the very special "Directors Suite" edition :-)l  B It *will* be worth plenty after OpenVMS takes over the planet, and designates Window(tm) to dust.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 17:42:55 -04001( From: "David M Smith" <dsmit115@csc.com>, Subject: Re: VMS 7.3-1 Doc set... plain jane' Message-ID: <akjg51$6sm$1@lore.csc.com>c  9 I received my Alpha V7.3-1 update kit today, 28-Aug-2002.m  7 "tech support" <tech_support@sp32.com> wrote in messager) news:umpm93jeg6h7b9@corp.supernews.com...eH > When did everyone receive 7.3-1 software and doc? We didn't receive it yet.G > Just wondering how far behind we are in getting our shipment. Thanks.h   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Aug 2002 18:28:39 -07001 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski)a, Subject: Re: What's going on with Encompass?= Message-ID: <857e9e41.0208281728.56ae2fc5@posting.google.com>   L Just so you know I have forwared the base note to Encompass to see whats up.   sue     f Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote in message news:<3d6d055d$1@news.si.com>..., > >I wouldn't know, and I'm just a Director. > ' > Terry, you sound like Ken Lay <wink>.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 03:37:01 GMTs1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>a, Subject: Re: What's going on with Encompass?= Message-ID: <xFgb9.26929$kp.252232@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>.  F "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote in message news:3d6d055d$1@news.si.com..., > >I wouldn't know, and I'm just a Director. > ' > Terry, you sound like Ken Lay <wink>.i  H Maybe so, but where are the millions of dollars? If I managed to dupe orK bilk every single Encompass member (which would not be a very wise thing to K do, and the thought has never entered my mind) I'd be lucky to come up with F $100K. Hell, I'd be lucky to come up with that selling SKCHPC hobbyist	 licenses!s   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Aug 2002 17:18 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)e0 Subject: Re: where to get an MMJ cable in the UK- Message-ID: <28AUG200217184598@gerg.tamu.edu>   . "Stanley F. Quayle" <stan@stanq.com> writes...* }On 28 Aug 2002 at 2:41, Herb Asher wrote:F }> Is there anywhere in the UK where I can get an MMJ cable made [...]D }> I found a USA site and will order from there but just wondered if$ }> there is anythnig nearer to home. } F }I can make you a cable if you pay for the shipping, plus a couple of 0 }bucks (the ends are almost $1 each these days). }  }--Stan Quayle  C You can apparently buy the connectors via the Web from a variety of B places for as little as $0.17 each. (The places show them on theirD order forms, but I can not be certain that they won't proceed to say< "we are out of them" should you actually try to order some.)   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2002 00:36:13 GMTh# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 0 Subject: Re: where to get an MMJ cable in the UKG Message-ID: <10eb9.15991$GK2.7864@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>s  4 "Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu> wrote in message' news:28AUG200217184598@gerg.tamu.edu...s0 > "Stanley F. Quayle" <stan@stanq.com> writes..., > }On 28 Aug 2002 at 2:41, Herb Asher wrote:H > }> Is there anywhere in the UK where I can get an MMJ cable made [...]F > }> I found a USA site and will order from there but just wondered if& > }> there is anythnig nearer to home. > } G > }I can make you a cable if you pay for the shipping, plus a couple oft2 > }bucks (the ends are almost $1 each these days). > }  > }--Stan Quayle >2E > You can apparently buy the connectors via the Web from a variety ofnD > places for as little as $0.17 each. (The places show them on theirF > order forms, but I can not be certain that they won't proceed to say> > "we are out of them" should you actually try to order some.) >     K Yes, but the MMJ crimper tool or die (if your tool uses removable dies) are G often in the $150 range or more. (least it was the last time I checked)m   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 21:33:57 GMT1$ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU- Subject: Re: Why C is better than Fortran 95?u8 Message-ID: <00A13228.67BD539A@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  a In article <akiena$1i8ej5$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:a% >In article <3d6badd7$1@news.si.com>,t? >	"Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes: + >>>All I can think of offhand is that C has C >>>pointers first. (I vaguely remember reading that Fortran now hasc
 >>>pointers.)  >> eN >> Pointers have existed in VAX Fortran as long as I remember.  One passes theO >> address of a data structure in a subprogram call and then uses that address,e >> with %LOC as needed.  > & >But then, that's not ForTran, is it??  N Well, you can work a similar trick with any Fortran implementation that passesM by reference rather than by value, which is every one I've worked with.  (Sixe- different vendors, I think, counting school.)t  F I'm not sure if Fortran II-IV standards specify the calling mechanism.   -- Alane   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.475 ************************