0 INFO-VAX	Mon, 11 Feb 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 82      Contents:3 Re: alpha4100 console connection to serial terminal  Re: Am I being debugged? Re: Am I being debugged? Re: Am I being debugged? Re: Am I being debugged? Re: Am I being debugged? DECbrouter 90T2 password& Re: DIR cache and DIR's > 127 blocks ?2 Re: Does DELETE/ENTRY guarantee exit handler call?% Re: emacs21 working a little bit more  How to kill a hung process?  Re: How to tail file?  Re: How to tail file?  Re: How to tail file?  Re: How to tail file? P Re: HP Sets March 19 for Special Meeting of Shareowners to Vote on Compaq MergerP Re: HP Sets March 19 for Special Meeting of Shareowners to Vote on Compaq Merger. Re: In stock: ES40 Model 2 USD7895 VMS Ready !. Re: In stock: ES40 Model 2 USD7895 VMS Ready !. Re: In stock: ES40 Model 2 USD7895 VMS Ready !6 Re: JDK 1.3.1 past due (feature not found in the beta) Re: Lottery Systems / Re: Microsoft's Definition of Industry-Standard  Re: Microsoft's financials  Re: MIME Compliant Mail from VMS  Re: MIME Compliant Mail from VMS/ Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? / Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? P Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? References: <QfG98.35810$s43.109P Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? References: <QfG98.35810$s43.109P Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? References: <QfG98.35810$s43.109 Re: OT: Virus Warning  Re: OT: Virus Warning J OT: XP Kernel Improvements Create a More Robust, Powerful, and	Scalable OS Re: Pathworks 32 on Windows XP Re: Pathworks 32 on Windows XP) Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300 ) Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300 ) Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300 ) Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300 ) Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300 ) Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300  Re: Question about Group ID & Re: SDA accepting command line args... Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: setting the record straight  Re: Suggested ECOs? P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise     of    P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise    of     P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise    of     P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      coP Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      coP Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      co. Re: The stupidity of granting software patents. Re: The stupidity of granting software patents Re: The Vision Thing RE: There must be a way " Transferring O/S to new hard drive& Re: Using BACKUP to create directories& Re: Using BACKUP to create directories& Re: Using BACKUP to create directories& Re: Using BACKUP to create directories& RE: Using BACKUP to create directories Re: Veritas NBU Client for VMS [off-topic] eighty et al...  Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...  Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...  Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...  RE: [off-topic] eighty et al...  Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 07:57:54 +0000 1 From: Steve Reece <SYSTEM@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk> < Subject: Re: alpha4100 console connection to serial terminal6 Message-ID: <3C677982.2E421E32@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>  G It might be as fundamental and simple as the wrong 9-pin D-connector or  the wrong cable.  E The Alphaserver 4100 has two 9-pin connectors on the rear panel.  The F top one IIRC is the one to use for a serial console.  Provided that itF isn't trapped in an application it should provide some response whilstH the system is booted with terminal settings as already discussed in this thread.   G The easiest way to connect a serial terminal is to use one of the 9-pin G D to MMJ adapters and an MMJ to MMJ cable.  Otherwise there is the risk H that the cable will not match pins correctly (as was often the case withC early VAXen, but in reverse in this case since one of the VAX leads  probably won't work here).  + IIRC, the 9-pin to MMJ adapter is an H8571.   F When I was managing a pair of 4100s, I connected a local booting DS700H DECserver onto the serial lines on both and left them both with consolesB set to serial in order that I could login from home and reboot theE systems.  I never liked driving an hour down the motorway on a Sunday F night to do ten minutes work in rebooting the systems!!  I never quite4 got around to doing the same with the HSZ70s though.   Steve.   lbohan@spamless..dbc.com wrote:  > 5 > On Tue, 5 Feb 2002 13:13:29 -0600, "patricia meece" ! > <pameece@oandm.uiuc.edu> wrote:  >  > >Hello folks. J > >I am preparing to upgrade OpenVMS from 7.1-2 to 7.3 on our Alpha4100's.M > >Currently console terminal is a graphics monitor. I would like to attach a M > >VT420 terminal as console so that I can setup VT420 to print screen output  > >during upgrade.L > >Unfortunately the previous management did not get the hardware manuals. IA > >have gleaned from the System Drawer guide about EV console and L > >tt_allow_login and COM1 port. To date I have had no luck getting VT420 to" > >respond as the console monitor.N > >Can someone reply back with some step by step instructions or where I might% > >find some more hardware manuals???  > >  > >Thanks for your time. > >  > 4 > if ">>> set console serial" doesn't get you going,5 > perhaps see if this 4100 has an RCM card installed.  > (I think all 4100's do?) > $ > we have a DS20E w/ a bad RCM card;1 > we could send keystrokes, but get nothing back.  > (a bad uart probably)  > 9 > Disabling the RCM card (switchpacks on the card itself)  > restored access to OPA0.   --  G "A shadow fell over her face; clear, as if the composure were rent like E a veil.  And her lips parted, but only with a short intake of breath. A Then she said, 'Well, then you are right.  Indeed, we are even.'" % 		Louis, "Interview with the Vampire"    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:17:08 +0000 - From: Peter Harding <harding@herald.ox.ac.uk> ! Subject: Re: Am I being debugged? . Message-ID: <3C67A834.989AD54@herald.ox.ac.uk>  C I could be a bit clearer: I know about toggling the bit/byte in the G image header to control whether the thing runs in debug mode by default D or not, but what I want is to know what to replace ***** with in the
 following:     if ( ***** ) {  -     /* I'm being debugged. Act accordingly */   
   } else {  0     /* I'm not being debugged. Run as normal. */     };  < I know it goes against the 'spirit' of debugging in that theG not-debugged clause will be rather hard to debug, but it's what I need.    Thanks!   
 Joe wrote: > G > I've never had need to fiddle with it however - assuming I understand F > your question I seem to have some dim memory of a bit (byte?) in theG > image header that controls this. The linker manual would be the place  > to start.  >  > Joe  > f > Peter Harding <harding@herald.ox.ac.uk> wrote in message news:<3C666291.CC53D4F1@herald.ox.ac.uk>... > > Howdy y'all  > > H > > Small question: how can my (C today, but tomorrow will be different)2 > > program tell if it is being run in debug mode? > > ( > > I'm not shy of system service calls. > >  > >  > > Thanks very much!    --   Tel 07092057581 ICQ 40628243   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 13:15:51 -0000 4 From: "Chris Sharman" <chris.sharman@ccagroup.co.uk>! Subject: Re: Am I being debugged? A Message-ID: <1013433357.9395.0.nnrp-07.9e989e7e@news.demon.co.uk>   / "Joe" <cstranslations@msn.com> wrote in message 7 news:d56d1c2d.0202102037.796e1ee3@posting.google.com... G > I've never had need to fiddle with it however - assuming I understand F > your question I seem to have some dim memory of a bit (byte?) in theG > image header that controls this. The linker manual would be the place  > to start.   H > > Small question: how can my (C today, but tomorrow will be different)2 > > program tell if it is being run in debug mode? > > ( > > I'm not shy of system service calls.    There are two linker conditions:  I /TRACEBACK, which allows an image to be run under debug, and adds another K entry point to the transfer array (%x340 on Alpha, something in P1 space on  VAX). K /DEBUG, which makes an image run/debug by default (the low bit at offset 80  on Alpha, offset 32 on VAX).  G At runtime, an (executable) image can be run/debug, run/nodebug, or run 
 (default).? $ run/debug has no effect if the image wasn't linked traceback.   G If you're just interested in preventing /debug on an image for security K reasons, link it /notraceback - if you install it with privilege, this is a  requirement.  I For security on shareable images, you need user system services & install 
 protected.  I These flags are available in the main program's argument list (except C): I the linker flags are 5th & the runtime (CLI flags) are 6th (of 6), if you L really need to know them - what are you trying to do ? VMS provides security' to prevent gaining privilege via debug.   
 Chris Sharman    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:54:56 GMT  From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG ! Subject: Re: Am I being debugged? 0 Message-ID: <00A0966A.9FB571B6@SendSpamHere.ORG>  x In article <1013433357.9395.0.nnrp-07.9e989e7e@news.demon.co.uk>, "Chris Sharman" <chris.sharman@ccagroup.co.uk> writes: > 0 >"Joe" <cstranslations@msn.com> wrote in message8 >news:d56d1c2d.0202102037.796e1ee3@posting.google.com...H >> I've never had need to fiddle with it however - assuming I understandG >> your question I seem to have some dim memory of a bit (byte?) in the H >> image header that controls this. The linker manual would be the place >> to start. > I >> > Small question: how can my (C today, but tomorrow will be different) 3 >> > program tell if it is being run in debug mode?  >> >) >> > I'm not shy of system service calls.  > ! >There are two linker conditions:  > J >/TRACEBACK, which allows an image to be run under debug, and adds anotherL >entry point to the transfer array (%x340 on Alpha, something in P1 space on >VAX).L >/DEBUG, which makes an image run/debug by default (the low bit at offset 80 >on Alpha, offset 32 on VAX).  > H >At runtime, an (executable) image can be run/debug, run/nodebug, or run >(default). @ >$ run/debug has no effect if the image wasn't linked traceback. > H >If you're just interested in preventing /debug on an image for securityL >reasons, link it /notraceback - if you install it with privilege, this is a
 >requirement.  > J >For security on shareable images, you need user system services & install >protected.  > J >These flags are available in the main program's argument list (except C):J >the linker flags are 5th & the runtime (CLI flags) are 6th (of 6), if youM >really need to know them - what are you trying to do ? VMS provides security ( >to prevent gaining privilege via debug.  H These flags *ARE* available in a C program provided that you do not call$ the main entry main().  for example:   #include <stdio.h>  4 start_here(int a, int b, int c, int d, int e, int f)   { @      printf("%08X\n%08X\n%08X\n%08X\n%08X\n%08X\n",a,b,c,d,e,f);      return 1;   }     E If one need the argc and argv arrays, invoke getopt() in the routine. E Too much goes on behind the scenes when you call the main entry point  main().   E FYI, if the low bit of argument e is 1 the program is linked with the E /DEBUG qualifier.  If the low bit of argument f is 1, the program was  invoked /NODEBUG.    --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              J   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbes    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:24:20 GMT  From: danco@pebble.org! Subject: Re: Am I being debugged? - Message-ID: <slrna6foh4.3o6.danco@pebble.org>   A In article <1013433357.9395.0.nnrp-07.9e989e7e@news.demon.co.uk>,  Chris Sharman wrote:  I >> > Small question: how can my (C today, but tomorrow will be different) 3 >> > program tell if it is being run in debug mode?   - Perhaps something like this may work for you?  You get the idea anyway.   int32 is_debug_active(void)  {      typedef struct     {  	int32    kernel_primary;  	int32    kernel_secondary;  	int32    exec_primary;  	int32    exec_secondary;  	int32    super_primary; 	int32    super_secondary; 	int32	 user_primary;  	int32    user_secondary; 
     } EXCVEC;           ITEM_LIST_3 itmlst[2];     EXCVEC      *excvec;     uint16      len; 	        itmlst[0].buflen = 4; !     itmlst[0].code = JPI$_EXCVEC; '     itmlst[0].bufadr = (int8*) &excvec;      itmlst[0].retlenadr = &len;      itmlst[1].buflen = 0;      itmlst[1].code = 0;      itmlst[1].bufadr = NULL;     itmlst[1].retlenadr = NULL;  					   *     sys$getjpiw(0, 0, 0, itmlst, 0, 0, 0);*     return (excvec->user_primary != NULL); }    - Dan    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 09:17:54 -0800" From: cstranslations@msn.com (Joe)! Subject: Re: Am I being debugged? < Message-ID: <d56d1c2d.0202110917.d2a0d22@posting.google.com>  F The interface to the debugger is (I believe) undocumented. There is atE least one package on the freeware CD that claims to interact with the D debugger (don't remember the name off the top of my head). I fiddledC around with it for several hours some time ago and couldn't seem to 8 get it to work (what I needed wasn't all that pressing).  A One idea that comes to mind with out spending a whole lot of time @ thinking about it (and this is by no means pretty) - spawn out aE subprocess (won't work if the process is detached) capture the output = from a ANALYZE/SYSTEM; SHOW PROCESS/CHANNEL on the process of E interest. Parse through the output and look for SYS$LIBRARY:DEBUG.EXE C among the files/devices being accessed. If you find it then yes. If . you don't then no. Like I said - not pretty...   Joe     c Peter Harding <harding@herald.ox.ac.uk> wrote in message news:<3C67A834.989AD54@herald.ox.ac.uk>... E > I could be a bit clearer: I know about toggling the bit/byte in the I > image header to control whether the thing runs in debug mode by default F > or not, but what I want is to know what to replace ***** with in the > following: >  >   if ( ***** ) { > / >     /* I'm being debugged. Act accordingly */  >  >   } else { > 2 >     /* I'm not being debugged. Run as normal. */ >  >   }; > > > I know it goes against the 'spirit' of debugging in that theI > not-debugged clause will be rather hard to debug, but it's what I need.  > 	 > Thanks!    ------------------------------    Date: 12 Feb 2002 02:42:45 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>! Subject: DECbrouter 90T2 password - Message-ID: <87g047uafu.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   @ OK, I know it is old etc... But the manuals are older :( and theA steps for 'recovering' the password does not work at all. So does B anyone know how to recover or clear the password from a Brouter90?   tnx  --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 08:49:59 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.org/ Subject: Re: DIR cache and DIR's > 127 blocks ? 3 Message-ID: <f5ot7azUA3vY@eisner.encompasserve.org>   c In article <3C652C7D.591B1717@aaa.com>, Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> writes:  > Hi. 7 > At least in earlier versions of VMS there was a limit 6 > on the largest DIR file that would be cached by VMS.3 > It was 127 or 128 disk blocks. Passing this limitN3 > would often give you very bad DELETE performance.C >   > Does this limit still exists ?5 > (Yes, it sure does in the older versions, but let's  > say in 7.2-x and 7.3 ?)m  B There are multiple applicable caches.  Two are most applicable areC the directory data block cache maintained by the XQP and a separatee@ directory cache maintained by RMS.  The RMS cache was completely4 disabled for directory files longer than 127 blocks.  < I understand that RMS will now cache larger directory files.  D Unless you're doing write-back caching (and I think the RMS cache isC write-through), this enhancement is good for a factor of 2 at best.e  A The other, crushing problem for large directory "delete all filesS> starting at the front" access was the technique used to update the directory file on disk.   C Historically, the technique used was "block at a time bubble down".oD When the last file catalogued in a directory block was deleted, that? directory block itself is removed from the dorectory file.  Sayt< you empty block 1.  Then the file system would historically:  
  read block 2   write it into block 1
  read block 3g  write it into block 2
  read block 4e  write it into block 3  ...
  read block nc  write it into block n-1&  truncate directory file at block n-1.  D If you've got a 1000 block directory file, that's 999 reads and 1000@ writes (counting the write back to the directory file's index inA INDEXF.SYS).  That'll take you 30 seconds or so depending on disk @ drive.  And you could see that in a big directory $ DELETE /LOG.? You'd see six or seven files deleted (more or less depending on?E file name length and whether multiple versions were present) and thene+ a big pause for a directory block deletion.s  D With recent versions of VMS, this bubble down procedure was modifiedC to permit multi-block reads and writes.  So you get something like:o    read blocks 2-64t  write blocks 1-63  read blocks 65-127   write blocks 64-126  ...  D This enhancement should be good for a large factor depending on seek: time, transfer rate and size of the multi-block transfers.   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:06:48 -0000h/ From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> ; Subject: Re: Does DELETE/ENTRY guarantee exit handler call?e/ Message-ID: <u6fuh8c74gm88e@corp.supernews.com>   - Thank you, all for the informative responses.a   -- s -- Mike Zarlenga   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:54:55 +0000 (UTC) 9 From: Roar =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thron=E6s?= <roart@nvg.ntnu.no>(. Subject: Re: emacs21 working a little bit more- Message-ID: <a48euv$fvr$1@tyfon.itea.ntnu.no>s  , John E. Malmberg <wb8tyw@qsl.network> wrote: : Roar Throns wrote:s :> dB ::> The debugger caught it and showed me which service who got it,M ::> but it was probably some new functionality someplace else that caused it. < ::> (Some atimer module using alarm/signals (meaning ASTs).) :> gM :> I circumvented most of the ASTFLTs by turning off the alarm-timers in somePM :> parts of the code, and I can reproduce by commenting out the turning-offs.P :> rC :> It is then typically in a sys$wflor, waiting for keyboard input.A  J : Ok, the ASTFLT message is from something being wrong with the user mode L : stack.  Either the stack pointer was invalid, or something used it all up.  $ It do not seems like it was used up.  0 On the exceptions, it does not seem to get belowL @((@ctl$gl_phd)+phd$l_frep1va) (I think I did that right in analyze/system).  6 : This occurred at some point before the AST executed.  J : The alloca() sugestion was a good one.  Can you use a C MACRO to detect ? : if it was given a negative value for the ammount to allocate?m  8 Emacs has it's own alloca, and it never goes below zero.  It also allocates from P0 space.  F What alarm_signal_handler does is little, and I can not see how it can do bad things on the stack.C    BTW, thanks for the help so far.   -- r -Roart   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:59:17 -0500l, From: "Frank Sapienza" <sapienza@noesys.com>$ Subject: How to kill a hung process?, Message-ID: <a490pf02ofj@enews4.newsguy.com>  I Periodically we've gotten a process that hangs up completely while in LEF I and VMS refuses to kill it using either $DELPRC or $FORCEX.  Is there any(K other way to have VMS just drop a process, other than rebooting?  (That hase been the solution to date.)w  
 OpenVMS 7.2-1  AlphaServer 4100   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 09:20:16 -0500e0 From: "Syltrem" <syltrem@videotron.spammenot.ca> Subject: Re: How to tail file?3 Message-ID: <HqQ98.4479$EI.24969@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>l   Default output rate is 1 minuteyK With a type/cont/interval=5 it will look every 5 seconds but will only findo something once every minute.   --   Syltrem I http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site - en franais)v> To reply to myself directly, remove .spammenot from my address  C "Jan-Erik Sderholm" <aaa@aaa.com> a crit dans le message de news:  3C66CBEE.B38A3CCE@aaa.com... > Tip:: > Add a "$ SET OUTPUT_RATE=00:00:nn" to your batch scripts8 > to have the log file beeing updated more "continuous".7 > This combined with type/tail/cont/int=n makes it easyt5 > to follow the flow of teh batch job in "real-time".p >d% > See "HELP SET OUTPUT_RATE examples"e >t > Jan-Erik Sderholm.r   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 07:35:20 -0800 From: wingwong@witty.com (wing)  Subject: Re: How to tail file?= Message-ID: <873e96d6.0202110735.14eff10a@posting.google.com>C  U Jan-Erik Sderholm <aaa@aaa.com> wrote in message news:<3C66CBEE.B38A3CCE@aaa.com>...m > Tip:: > Add a "$ SET OUTPUT_RATE=00:00:nn" to your batch scripts8 > to have the log file beeing updated more "continuous".7 > This combined with type/tail/cont/int=n makes it easyt5 > to follow the flow of teh batch job in "real-time".M > % > See "HELP SET OUTPUT_RATE examples"  >  > Jan-Erik Sderholm.r  < Thanks, I have added the set output_rate to my login.com for$ interactive job as well. Is that ok?  F I am writing a server process.  I will use "run pgm/detach" to executeB the server, will the detach server process have the defined output rate as its parent?s   Thanks.e   Wing   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:43:55 GMTm From: danco@pebble.org Subject: Re: How to tail file?- Message-ID: <slrna6fplr.3o6.danco@pebble.org>   I In article <873e96d6.0202110735.14eff10a@posting.google.com>, wing wrote:3  H > I am writing a server process.  I will use "run pgm/detach" to executeD > the server, will the detach server process have the defined output > rate as its parent?   A No.  And if you run it that way instead of via LOGINOUT, then DCLtC won't even be mapped.  It is DCL that does the periodic flushes for.D the output rate.  Without DCL mapped, you won't get the the periodicF flushes.  You want to execute your server by running LOGINOUT detachedE instead of your program.  LOGINOUT will map DCL.  Give LOGINOUT a DCL E command procedure as it's /INPUT on the RUN/DETACH command.  Have the . DCL command procedure run your server program.   - Danr   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 10:05:09 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.org Subject: Re: How to tail file?3 Message-ID: <eLDlGK0SVXzk@eisner.encompasserve.org>h  F In article <slrna6fplr.3o6.danco@pebble.org>, danco@pebble.org writes:K > In article <873e96d6.0202110735.14eff10a@posting.google.com>, wing wrote:b > I >> I am writing a server process.  I will use "run pgm/detach" to executedE >> the server, will the detach server process have the defined outputn >> rate as its parent? > C > No.  And if you run it that way instead of via LOGINOUT, then DCLoE > won't even be mapped.  It is DCL that does the periodic flushes foraF > the output rate.  Without DCL mapped, you won't get the the periodicH > flushes.  You want to execute your server by running LOGINOUT detachedG > instead of your program.  LOGINOUT will map DCL.  Give LOGINOUT a DCLcG > command procedure as it's /INPUT on the RUN/DETACH command.  Have ther0 > DCL command procedure run your server program.  
 What he said.t  F If you insist on running PGM.EXE without benefit of DCL, you can stillF get the effect of a read-shareable continuously updated log file.  ButC then you have to do it yourself.  You would need to open SYS$OUTPUTd@ yourself with the requisite sharing options.  And you would needE to periodically flush your buffers and update the end of file pointer  on disk.   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 07:02:08 GMT . From: "Duane Sand" <Duane.Sand@mindspring.com>Y Subject: Re: HP Sets March 19 for Special Meeting of Shareowners to Vote on Compaq Mergeri> Message-ID: <Q%J98.32724$bh3.229174@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>   "Rich Jordan" wroteu3 > What happens if the HP shareholders nix the deal? 
 It's over.   > Do the Paq'ers still vote?> The proxy votes would still have happened.  But if the HP vote= is tallied and negative by the time of the Compaq shareholder ; meeting, the Compaq vote will be irrelevant.  Dunno if theye- would bother completing the Compaq vote then.i  ; > Would a disapprove by the shareholders on one side and ank9 > approve on the other subject the 'disapproving' companyi > to the huge penalty payment?= No.  The penalty applies only to actions taken by the companyt9 boards, or by top executives, or by delegated committees.-> Stockholder votes and gov't actions don't trigger the penalty.6 I don't think Director Hewlett's duplicious actions as8 "an individual stockholder" count either, unfortunately.  9 I forget which, but one company's votes must get at leasto7 50% for, over all shares outstanding, whereas the otherw7 company must merely clear 50% of votes explicitly cast.a  & > Fred Kleinsorge wrote in message ...! > >Compaq votes the day after HP.a > >d > >JF Mezei wroteh? > >>Will Compaq shareholders also have to approve this, or willoE > >>they just vote by tendering or not tendering their shares to HP ?h   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Feb 2002 02:38:12 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>Y Subject: Re: HP Sets March 19 for Special Meeting of Shareowners to Vote on Compaq Mergert- Message-ID: <87k7tjuanf.fsf@prep.synonet.com>t  0 "Duane Sand" <Duane.Sand@mindspring.com> writes:  D > I forget which, but one company's votes must get at least 50% for,D > over all shares outstanding, whereas the other company must merely% > clear 50% of votes explicitly cast.d  C I have seen several references that HP must get a 2-1 or 60% (66%?)AD vote for the deal to go ahead, not a simple 50%. Now with 18% votingE no already (Hewlets and Packards), it neads 36% plus 2/3 over howeverr0 many extra over the 36% vote. Big ask I think...  E What is the record like for voter turn-out in the US for this sort of  deal?t   -- w< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.l@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:00:14 +0100n= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>n7 Subject: Re: In stock: ES40 Model 2 USD7895 VMS Ready !y( Message-ID: <3C67CE6E.5EE00FC@gtech.com>   David Froble wrote: G > Ok, a plug for David.  If a buyer doesn't know the answers to all the%J > questions, then buying from someone like Island Computers does take muchI > of the risk out of shopping.  Hate to put out a grand, just to find outh% > I can run windoz NT service pack 6.n  @ I have bougth from islandco several times (a disk, a tape drive,> a complete system) and are very happy with both the equipment, the price and their services.a   Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 15:14:42 GMT% From: svek <svekSPAM-NO-MORE@gmx.net> 7 Subject: Re: In stock: ES40 Model 2 USD7895 VMS Ready !a. Message-ID: <Xns91B2A5471C67Dsvek@130.133.1.4>  . Arne Vajhj <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> wrote in   news:3C67CE6E.5EE00FC@gtech.com:  B > I have bougth from islandco several times (a disk, a tape drive,@ > a complete system) and are very happy with both the equipment, > the price and their services.0 >  > Arne  - So I have heard from everyone I've spoken to.hE Think I will put in my order for the 1200 server sometime next month.w   /svekf   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 18:34:33 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)7 Subject: Re: In stock: ES40 Model 2 USD7895 VMS Ready ! * Message-ID: <3c6800a9$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  U In article <3C671D7B.70907@tsoft-inc.com>, David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:cI >Getting back on topic.  An entity in I believe Ohio must have access to rB >a bunch of 'Ultimate Workstation' Alphas, which appear to be the I >workstation equalivant of the dual 533 MHz AlphaStation 1200.  Has them  E >on EBAY frequently.  I've seen a bunch of 10 in one auction, asking lI >about 10 grand for the bunch.  That's about $1000 for the system, don't l >remember how it's configured. >oG >It isn't something that I'm looking for right now, but they sure seem  C >like quite a workstation.  Questions include does VMS run on such vJ >systems?  Can they support multiple users, as a server, or are they only I >workstations?  What's the real difference, other than the name?  What's j5 >the price of a commercial VMS base license for such?2  L AFAIK, OpenVMS does unfortunately NOT work on the Ultimate Workstation. Sigh  G >Ok, a plug for David.  If a buyer doesn't know the answers to all the lJ >questions, then buying from someone like Island Computers does take much I >of the risk out of shopping.  Hate to put out a grand, just to find out u$ >I can run windoz NT service pack 6. >e& >Anybody know much about such systems?  O I know David as one who sells systems, which he has (a lot of) experience with.dL At least he (or his company) knows how to make these used/new systems [very]J attractive for us (OpenVMS) folks. Yes, you may save a lot of bucks buyingJ from EBAY (even David does it), but you must know what to do with what youO got. And getting warranty by David's Company is worth a couple of bucks also...    just my 0.02   -- n< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111 2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111 8885< KAPSCH AG      Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:42:14 GMTw' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com>w? Subject: Re: JDK 1.3.1 past due (feature not found in the beta)t- Message-ID: <3C67AE16.95735256@theblakes.com>*   Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:  e > In article <Vpj9GTHgb$qR@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:u > >cH > >   "late 2001" having come and gone, anyone have info on when we will. > >   get a JDK for VMS that supports mozilla? >2K > Sorry, no. Personally, I did expect the Plug-In to come with the officialC: > V1.3.1-1 but alas, it was only a guess, and I was wrong.  
 Incorrect.  f V1.3.1-1 DOES ship the OJI support that allows Mozilla to run Java applets. You need the final kit (it wasn't in any of the betas).   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 16:58:41 +0100- From: gerhard.staub@rizit.at Subject: Re: Lottery Systems( Message-ID: <3C67EA31.59497073@rizit.at>  F SCIGAMES or also Scientific Games GMBH Austra (!) is the correct name.  0 They develop on OpenVMS and ORACLE, but not Rdb.G But my opinion is, that today it is not possible to run an OLTP Lotteryi system on something else as M$.-  
 Gerhard Staub1" Raiffeisen Informatik Zentrum Wien gerhard.staub@rizit.at   Philip Lewis wrote:d > G > IIRC SCIGAMES of Germany (or is it Austria) is one of the BIG lottery H > software suppliers and they are a VMS and OracleRdb shop.  Clearly the. > Germans (Austrians) chose with their brains. >  > Dweeb. > @ > "Michael Austin" <maustin@firstdbasource.com> wrote in message. > news:3C600EE6.FE84D39E@firstdbasource.com...K > > I just received a call from a headhunter looking for an Oracle DBA withCE > > experience in both OpenVMS and NT.  The project is to replace theeL > > OpenVMS Lottery system with an NT system over the next 3-6 months.  I do) > > not know who got the server hardware.  > >iD > > Unfortunately they needed someone *onsite* and only for up to 10E > > hrs/week --remote not possible-- can't make a descent living thatr > > way....l > >nJ > > <name of this big state has been omitted for confidentiallity reasons> > > -- > >n > > Regards, > >r > > Michael Austin; > > First DBA Source, Inc. -- http://www.firstdbasource.comi  > > President/Sr. DBA Consultant > > 704-947-1089 (Office)b > > 704-236-4377 (Mobile)l > >l   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:40:40 +0100 (MET)e9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>s8 Subject: Re: Microsoft's Definition of Industry-Standard; Message-ID: <01KE5IN7IXC28Y7KQF@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>   6 > Here is Microsoft's definition of Industry-Standard; >  >    January 1987:/ >    Introduction of the VAX 8978 and VAX 8974,w- >    DIGITAL's most powerful systems to date, - >    offering up to 50 times the power of theo" >    industry-standard VAX-11/780. >    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >  > Taken fromG > http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Digital/timeline/32-bit.htme  F The sad thing is, DEC really WAS the industry standard, and got there C via quality, not via unfair market practice.  Before the "industry sC standard" became a buzzword, the term came up from time to time in  E discussions such as "back when DEC FORTRAN was the de-facto industry n standard" etc.  > DEC, with its VT line of terminals, language extensions ("VAX H extensions") etc used to benevolently dictate where the IT industry was  going.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:28:00 GMTo  From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@home.com># Subject: Re: Microsoft's financials68 Message-ID: <j43g6uo4nqgckpl430sjj9msnsne9e2mqi@4ax.com>  4 On Fri, 8 Feb 2002 17:25:46 -0500, "Fred Kleinsorge"$ <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote:  G >There are multiple strategies in investment.  Some people want currentoM >income, a dividend provides this.  Just like you can buy zero coupon bonds - 8 >some investors want their money back in different ways. >eK >You see (or used to see) people (with money) who were retired investing iniL >stable blue chip stocks that pay a dividend.  Effectively an annuity, taxedI >as regular income (because you are retired with little/no income).  Some-K >states, for example, will tax you on interest income over a certain amountiA >(like NH, although *I* don't make enough money to test this ;-).a >e ><  A Indeed.  For decades you'd invest in stock and have the dividendsuB re-invested.  Through this re-investment as well as the occasional? stock splits, you could wind up with quite a few shares in your  retirement.t  C I know some who have 2-3000 shares in stocks with a $.25 face valuee! that is now trading at over $100.f  F Of course, then you get into the problem (in the U.S.) where you can'tB live off of it, or else suffer penalties from your Social Security payout.r  1 Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaqs- (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)r   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 09:57:47 +0000t) From: Greg Thomas <thomasgd@omc.bt.co.uk>d) Subject: Re: MIME Compliant Mail from VMS 8 Message-ID: <u35f6u0abjvqehi5fq75tv0hu6q2junma0@4ax.com>  / On Sun, 10 Feb 2002 19:16:37 GMT, Paul Mosteika ) <pmosteika@adelphia.net> wrote in article ! <3C66C83F.851F8AB3@adelphia.net>:n  ; >The OpenVMS Mime Utility was introduced with version V7.2.i ...l	 >Althougha@ >OpenVMS MIME was not written with BATCH and DCL scripts in mind  E Although the subject says 'MIME', if you just want an attachment thendF you could simply UUencode the attachment. The attached DCL should workE on pretty much any version of OpenVMS (P1 = target address, P2 = file-D to send, P3 = option subject). It does rely on the presence of a UCXD file (sys$system:ucx$uuencode), but you could substitute your own toD UUencode the file if you are using some other IP stack. It's trivialD to add text above/below the attachment if you want to send more than just the file itself.g   HTH,   Greg  V $ SCRATCH_NAME = "sys$scratch:" + f$getjpi( "", "PID" ) + "_" + f$getsyi( "NODENAME" ) $ !T $ if( P3 .nes. "" )l $ then" $   SUBJECT = "/subject=""''P3'""" $ else $   SUBJECT = "" $ endif- $ !-5 $ mcr sys$system:ucx$uuencode 'P1' 'SCRATCH_NAME'.UUEr2 $ mail/noself 'SCRATCH_NAME'.UUE "''P2'" 'SUBJECT' $ ! : $ if( f$search( "''SCRATCH_NAME'*.*;*" ) .nes. "" ) then -.     delete/nolog/noconfirm 'SCRATCH_NAME'*.*;*   -- o5 This post represents the views of the author and doesy5 not necessarily accurately represent the views of BT.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:05:39 +0100 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> ) Subject: Re: MIME Compliant Mail from VMSt) Message-ID: <3C67CFB3.6544149F@gtech.com>C   Bitnissen wrote:G > I can find mpack/munpack on the freeware-cd, but where can i find NBLh > ??  $ ftp://ftp.hhs.dk/pub/vms/nbl/nbl.zip   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 10:38:34 +0100e$ From: "labadie" <labadie_g@decus.fr>8 Subject: Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services?0 Message-ID: <mjM98.129$Jh4.587@news.cpqcorp.net>  2 "Peter Kukla" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message8 news:QfG98.35810$s43.10987607@typhoon.columbus.rr.com...B > I'm new to the VMS-administration world.  Apologies if this is a > stupid question. >sC > I have a MicroVAX running OpenVMS 7.2.  I would like to get it onUB > my network so I can telnet into it and stop squinting at my tiny	 > VT-420.o >"A > As near as I can tell, I need to get the TCPIP-IP-CLIENT pak tosB > accomplish this.  Since licensing for that doesn't seem to be inD > the hobbyist's Layered Products list, I'm not sure how to proceed. >  There is a file called" sys$update:vmsinstal_lmfgroups.comK that explains what products are included in a licence (e.g. Net-app-sup-250"3 brings the followings e.g. Ucx, Decnet End node...)c= Check that you have loaded a license containing Ucx or Tcpip.    Regards    Grard   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:00:53 -0500m  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>8 Subject: Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services?- Message-ID: <1020211114003.917A@Ives.egh.com>1  # On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, labadie wrote:    >=204 > "Peter Kukla" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message: > news:QfG98.35810$s43.10987607@typhoon.columbus.rr.com...D > > I'm new to the VMS-administration world.  Apologies if this is a > > stupid question. > >GE > > I have a MicroVAX running OpenVMS 7.2.  I would like to get it oniD > > my network so I can telnet into it and stop squinting at my tiny > > VT-420.c > >sC > > As near as I can tell, I need to get the TCPIP-IP-CLIENT pak tonD > > accomplish this.  Since licensing for that doesn't seem to be inF > > the hobbyist's Layered Products list, I'm not sure how to proceed. > >o > There is a file called$ > sys$update:vmsinstal_lmfgroups.comL > that explains what products are included in a licence (e.g. Net-app-sup-2= 505 > brings the followings e.g. Ucx, Decnet End node...)D? > Check that you have loaded a license containing Ucx or Tcpip.6 >=20	 > Regards> >=20
 > G=E9rard  C BTW, TCP/IP is definitely included in the Hobbyist Layered Products>C licenses (UCX is the product name).  I don't see any of the bundledn5 licenses (NAS, etc.) that also include TCPIP on mine.h  D You can also get Hobbyist licenses from Process Software for TCPWareC and Multinet, with pretty much the same terms and conditions as for B the Compaq software.  Follow the link to Process Software from the  Montagar VMS Hobbyist home page.  B Unless you have a tiny (slow and memory-limited) VAX, I would just= install all the licenses from the LP license kit, rather thanrG messing around trying to decide which ones you really need.  Supposedly D it is slower and uses up more pool to have unnecessary licenses, but= I haven't really noticed this on my 24MB MicroVAX 3600.  Onces? you understand what does what and which things you really want, B you can "LICENSE DISABLE" and "LICENSE DELETE" to clean things up.  B Note: the easy way to install all the licenses is to copy the mail= message (as a text file) with the licenses to the VMS system,d= (use DECnet, Kermit, or just "$ COPY SYS$INPUT: LICENSES.COM" ; while sending the message from a terminal emulator program)-A edit it to get rid of the text at the top and bottom, and execute<F it as a DCL command file.  You could cut and paste individual licensesD from a mail window to a terminal window (if you are using a PC, Mac,@ DECWindows, Unix box wth X, etc. to access your VMS system), but. there are enough of them to make this tedious.   --=20s John Santoso Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:08:28 -0500f  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>Y Subject: Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? References: <QfG98.35810$s43.109t4 Message-ID: <1020211120452.917B-100000@Ives.egh.com>  ' On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Peter Kukla wrote:s  A > Thanks...that did it.  I've gotten it on the network, and I cano > telnet/ftp into it.o > D > There's an odd lag after I login, as if it's not properly flushingE > data to the network interface or something.  ftp works fine though.e  A Is DNS configured correctly?  You often get delays while it triess? to reverse-translate the IP address to a host name if DNS isn'to working right.  A If the lag is after the username:/password:, maybe your login.comtH or sys$sylogin (logical name, usually points to sys$manager:sylogin.com)A is trying to do something that doesn't work right over a network.e? For example, some terminal emulators have problems with "$ SET h TERMINAL/INQUIRE".   HTH.  D > Thanks muchly for the advice.  FTP access in particular is a major > help.  >  > -peter >  > 5 > In article <lgg4TQGcLsfH@eisner.encompasserve.org>,00 > Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote:i > >In article <QfG98.35810$s43.10987607@typhoon.columbus.rr.com>, Peter Kukla <nospam@nospam.com> writes:t > >.F > >> I have a MicroVAX running OpenVMS 7.2.  I would like to get it onE > >> my network so I can telnet into it and stop squinting at my tinyo > >> VT-420. > >>D > >> As near as I can tell, I need to get the TCPIP-IP-CLIENT pak toE > >> accomplish this.  Since licensing for that doesn't seem to be ineG > >> the hobbyist's Layered Products list, I'm not sure how to proceed.N > >                                                                                                                                           >The UCX PAK in your hobbyist Layered Product kit will have the same
 > >effect. >  >  >  >  >    --   John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 18:11:44 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)-Y Subject: Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? References: <QfG98.35810$s43.109i, Message-ID: <a491h0$2koq$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  4 In article <1020211120452.917B-100000@Ives.egh.com>,#  John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> writes:h* |> On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Peter Kukla wrote: |> 9D |> > Thanks...that did it.  I've gotten it on the network, and I can |> > telnet/ftp into it. |> > dG |> > There's an odd lag after I login, as if it's not properly flushingiH |> > data to the network interface or something.  ftp works fine though. |> pD |> Is DNS configured correctly?  You often get delays while it triesB |> to reverse-translate the IP address to a host name if DNS isn't |> working right.  |> pD |> If the lag is after the username:/password:, maybe your login.comK |> or sys$sylogin (logical name, usually points to sys$manager:sylogin.com)2D |> is trying to do something that doesn't work right over a network.B |> For example, some terminal emulators have problems with "$ SET  |> TERMINAL/INQUIRE".>  H I vote for this.  Try hitting a few carriage returns right after loggingG in and see if that gets you to the "$" faster.  Then, the best solutionrF is to just put "SET TERM/VT100" in your LOGIN.COM.  It's the about theE best emulation you can hope for in non-DEC products (well in the freee. ones anyway) and it should work for most apps.   bill   -- 0J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   s   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 12:38:30 -0600G From: simon_clubley@remove_me.altavista.co.uk-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) Y Subject: Re: Newbie licensing question - TCPIP services? References: <QfG98.35810$s43.109a3 Message-ID: <YmHQm224uudb@eisner.encompasserve.org>   W In article <1020211120452.917B-100000@Ives.egh.com>, John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> writes:c) > On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Peter Kukla wrote:c > B >> Thanks...that did it.  I've gotten it on the network, and I can >> telnet/ftp into it. >> nE >> There's an odd lag after I login, as if it's not properly flushingoF >> data to the network interface or something.  ftp works fine though. > C > Is DNS configured correctly?  You often get delays while it tries A > to reverse-translate the IP address to a host name if DNS isn'ti > working right. > C > If the lag is after the username:/password:, maybe your login.comkJ > or sys$sylogin (logical name, usually points to sys$manager:sylogin.com)C > is trying to do something that doesn't work right over a network.oA > For example, some terminal emulators have problems with "$ SET i > TERMINAL/INQUIRE". >  > HTH. >   G If by "odd lag", you mean that the system appears to be running slowly,oE they trying checking what terminal type your client is sending to the E VMS system and make sure that it's a DEC terminal name such as VT100.   G If you are using Linux as your client O/S, you can do this by issuing a  "echo $TERM" command.u  I If that doesn't work, we need to know what you mean by "odd lag" and what G terminal emulator and operating system you are running the emulator on,o> as well as anything unusual about your emulator configuration.   Simon.   -- .G Simon Clubley, simon_clubley@remove_me.altavista.co.uk-Earth.UFP       1+ Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:11:08 GMTp" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> Subject: Re: OT: Virus Warning0 Message-ID: <wxO98.693$Yf1.3600@typhoon.bart.nl>   Got a pointer for Mozilla?  H B. Eckstein <be@cli.de> wrote in message news:3C66DA4B.7090801@cli.de... > Bob Ceculski wrote:s1 > > "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> wrote in message<, news:<ORv98.482$Yf1.2586@typhoon.bart.nl>... > >o> > >>My W98 system got infected by a virus 9 Feb 13:00 (UCT+1).D > >>It was a W32/Magic32 virus that transmits itself via the Outlook	 (Express)t > >>address book. E > >>Sophos cleaned the system. If you received email from my account,o# > >>please remove it; don't opn it.  > >>. > >>My apologies for not noticing this sooner. > >> > >>Hans Vlems > >> > > E > > I pre-read my mail w/vms mail, so I don't worry about viruses ...i >n$ > Mozilla rulez ;-) Even on OpenVMS. >- >- > --" > B.Eckstein, - mailto:be@epost.de7 > FAQ zu de.comp.hardware.netzwerke: http://how.to/dchnS >e   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:59:52 +0000 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>m Subject: Re: OT: Virus Warning8 Message-ID: <00nf6u44s1c5ck787j1hj3fm9e05per3aj@4ax.com>  E On Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:11:08 GMT, "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> wrote:    >Got a pointer for Mozilla?f   www.mozilla.org or^ http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla/releases/mozilla0.9.8/mozilla-openvms-alpha-m098.sfx_axpexe. to go direct to the latest 0.98 binary for VMS  I >B. Eckstein <be@cli.de> wrote in message news:3C66DA4B.7090801@cli.de...  >> Bob Ceculski wrote:2 >> > "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> wrote in message- >news:<ORv98.482$Yf1.2586@typhoon.bart.nl>...E >> >? >> >>My W98 system got infected by a virus 9 Feb 13:00 (UCT+1).dE >> >>It was a W32/Magic32 virus that transmits itself via the Outlooka
 >(Express) >> >>address book.F >> >>Sophos cleaned the system. If you received email from my account,$ >> >>please remove it; don't opn it. >> >> / >> >>My apologies for not noticing this sooner.o >> >>o >> >>Hans Vlemso >> >>  >> >F >> > I pre-read my mail w/vms mail, so I don't worry about viruses ... >>% >> Mozilla rulez ;-) Even on OpenVMS.t >> >> >> --t# >> B.Eckstein, - mailto:be@epost.de 8 >> FAQ zu de.comp.hardware.netzwerke: http://how.to/dchn >> >o   -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:35:39 -0500-- From: "John Eisenschmidt" <jeisensc@aaas.org> S Subject: OT: XP Kernel Improvements Create a More Robust, Powerful, and	Scalable OSe+ Message-ID: <sc67ac8e.041@AAASMTA.aaas.org>h  J I just ran into this link from the December issue of MSDN magazine. It's =I sort of interesting, but I noticed that the NT family stole another VMS =s/ expression: XP now supports "Volume Shadowing".J  L http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdnmag/nettop.asp?page=3D/msdnmag/issues/01/12/X=9 PKernel/XPKernel.asp&ad=3Dads.ddj.com/msdnmag/premium.htms   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 09:18:08 GMT^" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>' Subject: Re: Pathworks 32 on Windows XPi0 Message-ID: <k%L98.668$Yf1.3521@typhoon.bart.nl>  G IIRC XP uses the MAC address to construct a unique key for an XP clientkE in a Microsoft domain to obtain a license. Once the license is issuedt6 it can no longer be used (re-used) for another system.I If that is true then it is the obvious intention of Microsoft to disallowwC sharing of cleint licenses between different PC's, even if they are)& never up and running at the same time.J DECnet uses a physical address instead of the hardware address. That meansG that a new PC that inherits the DECnet address of its predecessor would:H automatically inherit the MS license. That is obviously not in line withL the new licensing mechanism, so Pathworks and DECnet are no longer supported with XP.L Perhaps an IP only version of Pathworks will become available for use on XP?   Hans. CasinoOp2 <casinoop2@aol.com> wrote in message3 news:20020211000513.25320.00000684@mb-fm.aol.com... K > Does anyone know of a version of Pathworks 32 that works with Windows XP?e ThehI > version I have (7.2?) loads find on Windows NT, but fails on Windows XP L > ("unsupported operating system"). When I look at the Compaq site, I cannot find8 > a version of Pathworks for XP. Am I missing something? >t >    Clark Calkins, programmer >   Schafer Corp >   ccalkins@schaferlabs.com >e   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 10:30:26 +0100s$ From: "labadie" <labadie_g@decus.fr>' Subject: Re: Pathworks 32 on Windows XP 0 Message-ID: <LbM98.128$Jh4.760@news.cpqcorp.net>  0 "CasinoOp2" <casinoop2@aol.com> wrote in message3 news:20020211000513.25320.00000684@mb-fm.aol.com... K > Does anyone know of a version of Pathworks 32 that works with Windows XP?  ThenI > version I have (7.2?) loads find on Windows NT, but fails on Windows XPrL > ("unsupported operating system"). When I look at the Compaq site, I cannot find8 > a version of Pathworks for XP. Am I missing something? >l=  There is a patch available for XP, call your support center.0   Regards0   Grard   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:41:11 +0000 ( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>2 Subject: Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300) Message-ID: <3C67ADD7.E85B9A2A@127.0.0.1>e   Dennis Grevenstein wrote:3H > I just became the proud owner of an old MicroVAX 3300. It came with anF > R215F expansion box. Both contain one harddisk each. The whole thingG > looks pretty clean, but it doesn't even power up. I can switch eitherj7 > of the boxes on, but only the power switch lights up.h  G Is there any power sequencing on these systems? I don't recall if thesepG systems have it or not, but I imagine they would. Perhaps they are both  set to 'remote'. I'm guessing.  B Another issue is that the power supplies need a 'load' to actuallyC start, are all the boards in firmly? There needs to be a minimum ofiF so-many cards on each side. If it's a big box 3xxx, then so-many slotsG need to be occupied to start the power supplies on each side. Going off:* your config you should have enough though.  F There are also little buttons which are overload cutouts, not sure how you reset them, never had to  / All this may or may not help, good luck anyway.d   -- '( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comJ   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:35:24 +0100 . From: Dennis Grevenstein <dennis@pcde.inka.de>2 Subject: Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300, Message-ID: <3C67D6AC.8DA4847A@pcde.inka.de>   Hi,s  @ I just swapped a CPU from a working MicroVAX 3400 into this box.$ Same result. Same problem as before.   Dennis   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:06:03 +0100t. From: Dennis Grevenstein <dennis@pcde.inka.de>2 Subject: Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300, Message-ID: <3C67CFCB.BC3B328D@pcde.inka.de>   "P. Thompson" wrote: > 5 > Do the lights on the H7868 power supplies light up?     No. Same effect with both boxes.   Dennis   -- e Q: How can I open an iMac? A: I used a saw.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:13:45 +0100c. From: Dennis Grevenstein <dennis@pcde.inka.de>2 Subject: Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300, Message-ID: <3C67D199.520E3D19@pcde.inka.de>   John Santos wrote: > G > Q-bus SCSI is a rare and precious commodity.  Your disks are probablynE > DSSI.  I think there is a DSSI controller (and Ethernet) on the CPU F > board.  If you can post any identifying info, someone should be able > to identify it.e  7 The Controller is unused. All installed disks are DSSI.n? I must have been somewhat blind and unable to count. This boardt@ actually has two 40 pin connectors. It's from system industries. There are some part numbers:   9901-5092-Aa 2500-6102 Au 28739-00041d  ' There are lots of eeprom on this board.n   Dennis   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:18:00 +0100e. From: Dennis Grevenstein <dennis@pcde.inka.de>2 Subject: Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300, Message-ID: <3C67D298.C672598B@pcde.inka.de>   Nic Clews wrote: > I > Is there any power sequencing on these systems? I don't recall if these9I > systems have it or not, but I imagine they would. Perhaps they are bothr  > set to 'remote'. I'm guessing.  F I was told that this machine was running in exactly that configuration under VMS 5.5 before.m  D > Another issue is that the power supplies need a 'load' to actuallyE > start, are all the boards in firmly? There needs to be a minimum of H > so-many cards on each side. If it's a big box 3xxx, then so-many slotsI > need to be occupied to start the power supplies on each side. Going offT, > your config you should have enough though.  E There are no free Qbus slots at all. The VAX is in a BF215 enclosure.tB I already tried to power up both boxes seperated on their own, but I get the same result.   Dennis   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:27:34 +0000=( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>2 Subject: Re: problems with a (dead?) MicroVAX 3300( Message-ID: <3C67FF06.8122261@127.0.0.1>   Dennis Grevenstein wrote:  >  > Nic Clews wrote: > >lK > > Is there any power sequencing on these systems? I don't recall if theseIK > > systems have it or not, but I imagine they would. Perhaps they are botho" > > set to 'remote'. I'm guessing. > H > I was told that this machine was running in exactly that configuration > under VMS 5.5 before.o  G Sorry I didn't make it clear. Some models have power sequencing. CablestB are linked to all the systems, and when power is applied, there isF dependence on 'other factors'. I know that the 4000 series of machinesG have some connectors looking a little like MMJ sockets but I have nevers
 used them.  G Last thing that I knew of using it was RA series drives where the powerlG on surge was over 20 amps. When you have 4 drives on a single supply itc7 could take out a fuse unless the drives were sequenced.a  F There is a little white button in the supply somewhere, have you foundC it and tried pressing it? BF-215 is unknown to me, BA-215 is known.   A You can take the power supplies out and visually inspect them, if H anything has 'popped' it should be obvious but you don't need me to tell4 you NOT to apply power with them out of the cabinet!  H I find it extremely unlikely that BOTH supplies can have failed [in each) cabinet], it's too much of a coincidence.d   --  ( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comn   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 10:56:27 -0800 From: hchen3@uwo.ca (Sammy) $ Subject: Re: Question about Group ID= Message-ID: <2c0966c2.0202111056.222cda18@posting.google.com>9   Hi all:-  E   Thanks for all the help. I am providing a portion of my source codeo   to make my point clear.  j    int main(int argc, char* argv[]) {P     if (argc < 1)    {<-     cerr << "No arguments specified" << endl;2   }-   else if (argc == 2)    {n     string user = argv[1];   }s   else   {.2     cerr << "More than 1 arguments, exit" << endl;   }      struct passwd *pwent;    struct stat statBuf;   int stat_rc = 0;  !   pwent = getpwnam(user.c_str());h0   stat_rc = stat((char *) "TEST.TXT", &statBuf);  3   if (stat_rc != 0) cerr << "stat failed"  << endl;   =   if(!S_ISREG(statBuf.st_mode))  // only regular file allowedh   {a*     cerr << "file is not regular" << endl;   }   :   if (pwent->pw_uid != statBuf.st_uid) cout << "file owner mis-matched" << endl;s     return 0;  }$  F Basically, I want to do the same thing with Group portion of the file.B I will use stat() to pull out the st_gid from the "test.txt" file.C then, i want to somehow get the gid given the group name (sorry fordD all the unix syntax here, but I don't know VMS very well) and try to match it with the< st_gid from the test file.  D If possible, can someone brefiely explain the difference between theC UIC concept in VMS and the group concept in Unix. Any resources are  greatly appreciated.   Sammy    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 11:55:21 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)n/ Subject: Re: SDA accepting command line args... 3 Message-ID: <dJfa6mzA61T7@eisner.encompasserve.org>P  H In article <CmMzfhU6VbWW@cpva.saic.com>, mckinneyj@cpva.saic.com writes: > ' > $ define mu$sda multinet:multinet$sdac  )    Ah yes, learn something new every day.    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 07:41:05 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ( Subject: Re: setting the record straight3 Message-ID: <Nm50IxPLfMOi@eisner.encompasserve.org>c  L In article <a48c8q$7k5$2@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:e > In article <2jBhdKmjsYJg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:lN >>In article <a45srl$ctj$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes: >>P >>> However we may need more than one plan B since I am not sure how well HammerI >>> would do at the high end. Hence you would probably also need either a</ >>> resurrection of Alpha or a port to power-4.e >>F >>I am not sure who "we" is.  Compaq, the folks who can do anything in8 >>this area, have made an agreement to focus on Itanium. > K > This discussion is to do with what Compaq should do if Intel adopts theirt" > Plan B ie If/when Itanium fails.  C By then the landscape will have changed such that discussing it nownA does not accomplish much.  People discussing it here have no datat@ regarding what set of conditions might release Compaq from their agreement with Intel.:   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:34:29 +0000 (UTC)  From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk( Subject: Re: setting the record straight+ Message-ID: <a48oa5$bbn$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>e  ` In article <a48l9q$2f01$2@info.cs.uofs.edu>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:, >In article <a48c5t$7k5$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>," > david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes: >|>fN >|> This discussion is to do with what Compaq should do if Intel adopts their % >|> Plan B ie If/when Itanium fails. n >|>  >hA >Wouldn't waiting that long be about like the Titanic deciding to @ >steer the ship into safer waters after the iceberg had ripped a >gaping hole in it's side??a >e >billh >   J Precisely why Compaq/HP need to be looking at a plan B now. If Intel has a Plan B then Compaq/HP need one.t    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:28:05 +0000 (UTC)@ From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk( Subject: Re: setting the record straight+ Message-ID: <a48kdl$a7r$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>e  c In article <Nm50IxPLfMOi@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:0M >In article <a48c8q$7k5$2@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:1f >> In article <2jBhdKmjsYJg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:O >>>In article <a45srl$ctj$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:  >>>rQ >>>> However we may need more than one plan B since I am not sure how well Hammer.J >>>> would do at the high end. Hence you would probably also need either a0 >>>> resurrection of Alpha or a port to power-4. >>> G >>>I am not sure who "we" is.  Compaq, the folks who can do anything ins9 >>>this area, have made an agreement to focus on Itanium.e >> aL >> This discussion is to do with what Compaq should do if Intel adopts their# >> Plan B ie If/when Itanium fails.  >mD >By then the landscape will have changed such that discussing it nowB >does not accomplish much.  People discussing it here have no dataA >regarding what set of conditions might release Compaq from theirl >agreement with Intel.  N If Intel can force Compaq to continue porting to Itanium after they themselvesL drop Itanium then they must have the best lawyers in the world and Compaq's H executives and lawyers must have sub-zero IQs to sign such an agreement.  = If Intel has a plan B now then Compaq/HP need a plan B now !!t  M Having Intel pull the plug on Itanium the day before VMS or NSK are released aK on it and then having to start desperately looking at porting to something a% else does not sound like a good plan.s      
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 14:43:06 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)D( Subject: Re: setting the record straight, Message-ID: <a48l9q$2f01$2@info.cs.uofs.edu>  + In article <a48c5t$7k5$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>,c!  david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:  |>M |> This discussion is to do with what Compaq should do if Intel adopts their b$ |> Plan B ie If/when Itanium fails.  |> e  @ Wouldn't waiting that long be about like the Titanic deciding to? steer the ship into safer waters after the iceberg had ripped ao gaping hole in it's side??   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   i   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:55:30 -0500s- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>:( Subject: Re: setting the record straight, Message-ID: <3C67F781.E14F32AD@videotron.ca>   david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:iK > This discussion is to do with what Compaq should do if Intel adopts theirj" > Plan B ie If/when Itanium fails.  J IA64 is HP's baby. HP will try very hard to make it work and HP will shoveL that chip down the throats of its customers. IF IA64 really doesn't pan out,G it will therefore take quite a while before HP admits defeat and adoptsh Intel's plan B.a  M It is therefore rather pointless to speculate about an alternate architecture.I for VMS. The decision to drop IA64 by HP will be done in a distant enoughmE future that we can't even foresee what VMS will be like at that time.9   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:58:17 -0500a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>o( Subject: Re: setting the record straight, Message-ID: <3C67F827.74CC4954@videotron.ca>   david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:oK > But why do people want VMS on IA32 ? Answer so that they can put it up ono' > any spare PC they have laying around.   B That is why the VAX is still there. Can't beat that for low price.  M VMS's asset is quality. And Quality leads to stability and reliability.  LookiM at how much Windows struggled with its "plug and play" to try to make it work K on "commodity" hardware, whereas Apple, by concentrating on strict hardware:< standards, need not worry about a gazzillion configurations.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:06:21 -0500l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s( Subject: Re: setting the record straight, Message-ID: <3C67FA0C.427C1D6D@videotron.ca>   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:aN > Having Intel pull the plug on Itanium the day before VMS or NSK are releasedL > on it and then having to start desperately looking at porting to something' > else does not sound like a good plan.d  L Having a plan B for Intel doesn't mean abandonning IA64. HP is big enough to< continue to sponsor Intel to continue that proprietary chip.  D To me, plan B simply means that Intel will push its 64 bit 8086 as aJ mainstream chip while continuing to produce proprietary chips (essentially, custom chips) for some customers such as HP.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:10:32 -0500)- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s( Subject: Re: setting the record straight, Message-ID: <3C67FB06.C252685C@videotron.ca>   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:eL > Precisely why Compaq/HP need to be looking at a plan B now. If Intel has a! > Plan B then Compaq/HP need one.h   Why ? J If a 74 bit 8086 does come out and is succesfull, then they simply need toL switch their current wintel 8086 crap to the new 74 bit 8086 and voila, they@ are back in the game. They can keep the legacy products on IA64.   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:17:25 +0000 (UTC)  From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk( Subject: Re: setting the record straight+ Message-ID: <a48ub5$dd2$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>y  \ In article <3C67F781.E14F32AD@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:  >david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:L >> This discussion is to do with what Compaq should do if Intel adopts their# >> Plan B ie If/when Itanium fails.  >PK >IA64 is HP's baby. HP will try very hard to make it work and HP will shove M >that chip down the throats of its customers. IF IA64 really doesn't pan out,-H >it will therefore take quite a while before HP admits defeat and adopts >Intel's plan B. >RN >It is therefore rather pointless to speculate about an alternate architectureJ >for VMS. The decision to drop IA64 by HP will be done in a distant enoughF >future that we can't even foresee what VMS will be like at that time.  N IA64 is as much Intel's baby as it is HP's. If HP are so stupid as to continueJ with it on its own after Intel had adopted plan B then I sure hope the midK march votes are against the merger. Otherwise VMS will end up on a platform.I which performs worse, costs more and has a much smaller market share than  Alpha ever had. J (Best case scenario with Intel supporting it Itanium would probaby performO worse and cost more than Alpha but it might stand a faint chance of grabbing a lE bigger market share than Alpha. Without Intel's support - no chance.)0    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 17:56:05 +0000 (UTC)a From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk( Subject: Re: setting the record straight+ Message-ID: <a490jl$e4t$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>o  \ In article <3C67FA0C.427C1D6D@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:  >david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:O >> Having Intel pull the plug on Itanium the day before VMS or NSK are releasedmM >> on it and then having to start desperately looking at porting to somethingy( >> else does not sound like a good plan. >nM >Having a plan B for Intel doesn't mean abandonning IA64. HP is big enough toh= >continue to sponsor Intel to continue that proprietary chip.e >nE >To me, plan B simply means that Intel will push its 64 bit 8086 as ahK >mainstream chip while continuing to produce proprietary chips (essentiallye- >custom chips) for some customers such as HP.   K Right. So HP will have to pay vast amounts to Intel for a chip which noone eJ else wants. With all the defections caused by the uncertainty etc you willK end up with VMS, HPUX and NSK running on a very expensive, badly performingRM niche market chip - with a large number of customers probably not wanting to n move to it.sK My bet would be that HP would look at the bottom line and cut its losses - sM keep them running for a few more years on their current chips to squeeze out e7 the last bit of money from those left on the platforms.e  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:01:51 +0000 (UTC)  From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk( Subject: Re: setting the record straight+ Message-ID: <a490uf$e4t$2@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>c  \ In article <3C67FB06.C252685C@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:  >david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:M >> Precisely why Compaq/HP need to be looking at a plan B now. If Intel has a3" >> Plan B then Compaq/HP need one. >. >Why ?  K >If a 74 bit 8086 does come out and is succesfull, then they simply need torM >switch their current wintel 8086 crap to the new 74 bit 8086 and voila, they)A >are back in the game. They can keep the legacy products on IA64.n  0 And how many VMS, HPUX , NSK customers will say L "Well Intel's no longer supporting Itanium. Microsoft may well drop support.J The chip performs badly (else why would Intel have stopped pushing it) andJ its going to be expensive. Lets just stick with what we've got and plan toJ migrate to Sun or IBM - at least those companies seem to know what they're doing."-  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 13:23:01 -0500(- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>2( Subject: Re: setting the record straight, Message-ID: <3C680BFE.50535646@videotron.ca>   david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:yL > Right. So HP will have to pay vast amounts to Intel for a chip which noone
 > else wants.m  M IA64 with only HP using it will still have a larger market than Alpha did. IfiE Alpha was able to survive and generate enough revenus to continue itssE development, then HP will also be able to consitnue to sponsor IA64'se( development even if it is its only user.  @ > With all the defections caused by the uncertainty etc you willM > end up with VMS, HPUX and NSK running on a very expensive, badly performingiN > niche market chip - with a large number of customers probably not wanting to
 > move to it.e  K Which is why VMS customers will stay on Alpha as long as they can. For NSK, : the cost and performance of the chip are not so important.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:10:57 +0100h= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>3 Subject: Re: Suggested ECOs?) Message-ID: <3C67D0F1.4C11EDE5@gtech.com>    William Barnett-Lewis wrote:H > I'm running 7.2 from the hobbyist distro on a Vaxstation 4000/90. I'veF > looked through the mass of ECO's that are out there, but unlike, forJ > example Sun and Solaris, there does not seem to be a bundle of suggested? > patches to apply to bring a system up to a given patch level.e > H > Is there a list somewhere of what would be appropriate for me to apply= > to my system here at home to take care of the worst issues?   2 The traditional recommended policy in VMS land is:=   - apply only MUPS and patches to problems you actually havel  $ Practice is probably moving towards:C   - install everything potential relevant on development & hobbyisth systemsoE   - if they look necesarry and have been tested on a test system thenp,     install it on production systems as well  2 If you follow two simple advices you should be OK:<   - always read the release note carefully before installingB   - always have a good backup of the system disk before installing then nothing can go wrong !y   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:44:51 +0100e+ From: Peter Finderup Lund <firefly@diku.dk>tY Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise     of    hC Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44L0.0202111439230.2022-100000@ask.diku.dk>e  * On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Terje Mathisen wrote:  G > A number like 86 in Danish is 'six-and-four-twenties' (seks-og-fjers)r > afaik.  I 'seksogfirs' (six and 'firs'), which is short for seksogfirsindstyve (six.A and four times twenty).  Only old people use the long form today.rG Strictly speaking they are still needed for most ordinals, i.e. 86th ispE 'seksogfirsinstyvende' but fewer and fewer young people do that right1 (sigh, modern pedagogy).  J French is similar (quatrevingsix, maybe I need some hyphens there), except afaik in Belgium.    -Peter   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 14:32:02 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Y Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise    of     ", Message-ID: <a48kl2$2f01$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  % In article <1013375511snz@dsl.co.uk>,t/  bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes:  |>  J |>                   He'd even found reports of some native American tribeH |> (the Wawentoc Indians) being discovered in northern Maine in the veryK |> early 16th century using a similar counting method: which must give some H |> credence to the idea that the Welshman Madoc did go to America in the |> first millennium AD.   + Or maybe it was St. Brendan the Navigator!!n  F (Columbus was either a fraud or a fool, but in the end he "discovered". nothing that hadn't already been deiscovered.)   bill   -- eJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   .   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 08:38:52 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)oY Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise    of     e3 Message-ID: <LK0YnlYkaSDj@eisner.encompasserve.org>n  ` In article <a48kl2$2f01$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:  H > (Columbus was either a fraud or a fool, but in the end he "discovered"0 > nothing that hadn't already been deiscovered.)  4 Actually, he was a successful government contractor.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:26:04 +0100n3 From: Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@hda.hydro.com>lY Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      co:- Message-ID: <3C67AA4C.6ED4E587@hda.hydro.com>n   Charles Richmond wrote:wC > The Wewentoc Indians and the Cumbrians counting the same way...tosE > me says that they were *both* effected by the Vikings. It is pretty D > well known that the Vikings visited the coast of Maine long before& > Columbus ever set foot in America...  H We did that in most of Scandinavia during that time, the Danes are still	 doing it:a  E A number like 86 in Danish is 'six-and-four-twenties' (seks-og-fjers)  afaik.   Terje  -- t  - <Terje.Mathisen@hda.hydro.com>@ "almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 13:08:37 GMTI' From: CBFalconer <cbfalconer@yahoo.com> Y Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      co:) Message-ID: <3C67C122.48E8DDF0@yahoo.com>a   Terje Mathisen wrote:. >  > Charles Richmond wrote:$E > > The Wewentoc Indians and the Cumbrians counting the same way...to:G > > me says that they were *both* effected by the Vikings. It is prettykF > > well known that the Vikings visited the coast of Maine long before( > > Columbus ever set foot in America... > J > We did that in most of Scandinavia during that time, the Danes are still > doing it:g > G > A number like 86 in Danish is 'six-and-four-twenties' (seks-og-fjers)n > afaik.  2 Quatre vingt six moins soisante dis-neuf est sept.   -- t@ Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@XXXXworldnet.att.net);    Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems. =    (Remove "XXXX" from reply address. yahoo works unmodified) 0    mailto:uce@ftc.gov  (for spambots to harvest)   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 17:34:44 GMT0 From: hawk@fac13.ds.psu.edu (Richard E. Hawkins)Y Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      cos, Message-ID: <a48vbk$18eq@r02n01.cac.psu.edu>  ' In article <3C6759E1.929AADDF@ev1.net>, + Charles Richmond  <richmond@ev1.net> wrote:g  B >The Wewentoc Indians and the Cumbrians counting the same way...toD >me says that they were *both* effected by the Vikings. It is prettyC >well known that the Vikings visited the coast of Maine long before % >Columbus ever set foot in America...    *shrug*y  G That's what they get for stopping in France and asking for directions .t . .e   :)   hawk   -- oP Richard E. Hawkins, Asst. Prof. of Economics         /"\   ASCII ribbon campaignL dochawk@psu.edu  Smeal 178  (814) 375-4700           \ /   against HTML mailI These opinions will not be those of                   X    and postings. m; Penn State until it pays my retainer.                / \   h   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 13:31:53 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)i7 Subject: Re: The stupidity of granting software patentse, Message-ID: <a48h49$2d95$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  4 In article <VA.0000052f.17ee1807@bluewin.delete.ch>,2  Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> writes: |>L |> OK, let's take a step back and talk of academia (which you know far more M |> about than me), where folks can maybe afford to develop software for free.t |> l  H Academia needs money just as much as any other business.  It's just thatH some of us are restricted by law and local policies as to how we can getI that money.  For example, I can give away obsolete equipment, I can trade H it for other equipment.  I can even throw it in the dumpster.  I can not sell it.  C And, not all schools are as generous as UCB was.  Ever try to get a: copy of UCSD-Pascal??    bill   -- gJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   s   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 12:06:09 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)t7 Subject: Re: The stupidity of granting software patentsi3 Message-ID: <9o4nbG2Eu2do@eisner.encompasserve.org>(  ` In article <a40usb$103j$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:. > In article <3C63ECE2.E1A2CE99@videotron.ca>,2 >  JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > |> John Smith wrote:M > |> > Britain's biggest telephone company begins its bid on Monday to chargemQ > |> > royalties for one of main building blocks of the Internet, arguing that it.L > |> > invented the hyperlink technology at the heart of the World Wide Web. > |> o6 > |> Shouldn't the date be April 1 on that news item ? > |>  " > |> This cannot be true. Can it ? > L > Of course it can.  In the US you can sue for anything.  or have we alreadyM > forgotten the psychic who sued a hospital for loss of psychic ability after J > a medical CAT scan.  She won and was awarded several million dollars for> > the loss of something who's existence has never been proven. >   F    I wonder what happened to the fellow who patented the window methodE    of dealing with Y2K.  IMHO he could have just as well patented thet*    window method of looking through walls.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:31:00 GMTm  From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@home.com> Subject: Re: The Vision Things8 Message-ID: <5e3g6ugr5v3750ibvam1bta1dhmobtl8i8@4ax.com>  , On Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:25:09 -0500, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:i   >"Main, Kerry" wrote:t( >> - IBM dropped NT on their HW platform) >> - MIPS dropped NT on their HW platformo4 >> - and finally Compaq dropped NT on their platform >sN >Funny, as far as the PowerPC version of NT, the story I had heard was that it@ >was Microsoft that dropped support for it because of low sales. >pJ >When NT first came out, it was Microsoft that wanted it to run on as manyP >platforms as possible, hence the availability on wintel, mips, power and alpha. >2K >I do not know what sort of deals existed between the chip manufacturer and:O >Microsoft, but I suspect that depending on what brainwashing one has received,iH >the story is dramatically different (eg: IBM dropped NT on power versus! >Microsoft dropping NT on Power).  >nE >As far as Power is concerned, stating that "IBM dropped NT" might begJ >misleading since Power was still a full fledged partnership between IBM ,L >Apple and Motorola at that time. So if it was in fact the chip manufacturer0 >that dropped support, it would have been all 3. >yN >This is why I find the stories of Microsoft dropping support more believable.  F Yep, and basically you can say that Microsoft dropped support of NT onD Alpha too.  DEC just donated too many resources to that project over
 the years.  1 Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaq.- (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 10:03:54 -0500o* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>  Subject: RE: There must be a way- Message-ID: <0033000052543070000002L002*@MHS>   8 =0AOnce upon a time there was a quite clever parody site8 called m i c r o s n o t . c o m that had a tweaked logo1 with the phrase "Where do you want to go, toady?"   3 Of course, it became an ex-website shortly after it 9 came to the attention of the Redmondian barrister hordes.:   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETg* Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 11:34 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET  Subject: RE: There must be a way    3 "bgInc. - You'll go where we want you to go" wrote:o > E > Alternatively you could use Glenn Everhart's VDDRIVER to create theI > illusion of multipleH > physical disks using container files on the actual disk. Sorry if thi= sa > has already been > mentioned...  C I'm partial to LD ((SYS$)LDDRIVER) myself, but that's just me. YMMV 
 considerably.    -- David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:  http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/=   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:05:43 GMT " From: GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com>+ Subject: Transferring O/S to new hard drive + Message-ID: <3C6808D7.6EDEE5F6@cumulus.com>   A I purchased a new ST32550N SCSCI drive for a vaxstation 4000 vlc.r@ I used to remember how to do this back in the 785 days, but haveE forgotten the procedure precisely.  The original drive is DKA200:.  ImH don't know and couldn't see any scsi terminators on the old drive.  WithE both drives hooked up the system boots, but you should also know that G this is a kludge set up only to get the o/s over to the new drive.  Thee? o/s, when I SHOW DEV show the new drive as DKA0: and online anda
 allocated.D I did a MOUNT/FOR DKA0:  and then  BACKUP/IMAGE/IGN=INTERLOCK/VERIFYG SYS$SYSDEVICE: DKA0:    It acted like it was transferring and the smalliC led on the new seagate was blinking but after a while I never got ag+ message back and found the system had hung.a
 Now what??   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:06:55 +0000:  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com/ Subject: Re: Using BACKUP to create directoriesy: Message-ID: <OFBEB0A389.17A01322-ON00256B5D.004D2879@btyp>  F I've just tested opn a couple of systems here, and the 7.1-2 node uses Backup 6.2;d   $ back/lis sav.sav/sav Listing of save set(s)   Save set:          SAV.SAV Written by:        MEo" UIC:               [999999,999999]* Date:              11-FEB-2002 13:55:15.73/ Command:           BACKUP/LOG *.LOG SAV.SAV/SAVm+ Operating system:  OpenVMS AXP version V7.1o BACKUP version:    V6.2l CPU ID register:   80000000u Node name:         _xxxxx::. Written on:        _DSA0:t Block size:        32256 Group size:        10w Buffer count:      171  4 while the 7.2-1 node uses Backup AXP721R0010FT (!) ;   $ back/lis sav.sav/sav Listing of save set(s)   Save set:          SAV.SAV Written by:        MEm" UIC:               [999999,999999]* Date:              11-FEB-2002 14:03:18.34/ Command:           BACKUP/LOG *.LOG SAV.SAV/SAVs- Operating system:  OpenVMS Alpha version V7.2   BACKUP version:    AXP721R0010FT CPU ID register:   80000000m Node name:         _xxxxx::e Written on:        _DSA0:x Block size:        32256 Group size:        10- Buffer count:      448  . So presumably it didn't change until 7.2 time.   Cheers   Steve Sm        B spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) on 02/10/2002 06:38:55 PM    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:BK From:      spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman), 10 February 2002, 6:38d            p.m..  & Re: Using BACKUP to create directories     [cut...]    D I find it curious that you have BACKUP version V6.2 on VMS V7.1. Why is that?    6 Dislcaimer: JMHO               "I saw The Who on their< Alan E. Feldman                 *first* final tour."   -- me afeldman!~!~!~!gfigroup.coml      F ______________________________________________________________________     [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beG confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message hasaG been addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce,t$ distribute or use this transmission.  H Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee isG not intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have received-K this transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.   
 Thank you.  D Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT.; Registered in England and Wales, registered number 4205228.m  I Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, D RG1 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 09:06:15 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.org/ Subject: Re: Using BACKUP to create directories 3 Message-ID: <HJtx78zm6Hvt@eisner.encompasserve.org>n  P In article <3C66CD38.4F4DE5C4@cha.ab.ca>, Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> writes:# > No luck.  Same results as before.  > D > $ backup DSA803:[TEMP3...]/sel=*.dir TEMP3.SAV/save/list=temp3.lisB > %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.*;*  C No kidding.  That's a bogus command.  /SELECT applies to save sets.a. It is ignored for file-oriented input volumes.  B Which leads me to ask:  Are you sure that DSA803:[TEMP3] is not anB empty directory?  You just asked BACKUP to back up the whole thing and it came up empty.m    B $ BACKUP DISK1420:[VAXS09...]*.DIR GORK.BCK /SAVE /LIST=SYS$OUTPUT Listing of save set(s)   Save set:          GORK.BCK  Written by:        VAXS09      s" UIC:               [000002,000014]* Date:              11-FEB-2002 10:01:30.504 Command:           BACKUP DISK1420:[VAXS09...]*.DIR   GORK.BCK/SAVE/LIST=SYS$OUTPUT- Operating system:  OpenVMS Alpha version V7.2a BACKUP version:    AXP721R0018 CPU ID register:   80000000  Node name:         _ALPHA::o Written on:        _DSA1420: Block size:        32256 Group size:        10r Buffer count:      311  K [VAXS09]000000.DIR;1                                        1  11-NOV-1999 h 14:56  :55iK [VAXS09.000000]ACCT07.DIR;1                                 1  11-NOV-1999 d 14:56e :55hK [VAXS09]A.DIR;1                                             1  28-JAN-2002   08:05t :14 K [VAXS09.A]B.DIR;1                                           1  28-JAN-2002 c 08:05s :18 K [VAXS09.A.B]C.DIR;1                                         1  28-JAN-2002 a 08:16  ...d   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Feb 2002 09:23:12 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.org/ Subject: Re: Using BACKUP to create directories 3 Message-ID: <kp$yy9M+fFX5@eisner.encompasserve.org>   P In article <3C66F83C.6FA4BCBF@cha.ab.ca>, Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> writes:S > Still no success.  I vaguely recall somewhere that BACKUP will not generate emptyn] > directories.  In my example, DSA802:[TEMP3] contains files, but no directories.  However, I \ > still wanted TEMP3.DIR created on the saveset.  Thanks for your suggestions.  I will place& > a call with Compaq Support tomorrow.  A The file specification: DSA802:[TEMP3...]*.DIR;* does not includei [000000]TEMP3.DIRo  D You could use [000000]TEMP3.DIR, [TEMP3...]*.*;* as your source file specification list.1  G But that can lead to trouble restoring the tree at a subdirectory leveldF on the target system.  You can get a spurious "000000" in the restored/ tree, e.g. [target.directory.name.000000.temp3]2  E One can avoid that problem by being careful about the restore syntax::  H $ BACKUP SAVE.BCK /SAVE /SELECT=[000000...]*.*;* target_disk:[000000...]   or  2 $ BACKUP SAVE.BCK /SAVE /SELECT=[000000...]*.*;* -'  target_disk:[target.directory.name...]k   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 10:43:54 -0500o1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com> / Subject: Re: Using BACKUP to create directories>2 Message-ID: <3C67E6BA.833AF0C3@firstdbasource.com>   set def disk:[TEMP3]5 back [-]temp3.dir,[temp3...]*.dir  temp3.bck/save/logt! copy temp3.bck node::disk:[mydir]u back temp3.bck/save [*...]  F This will backup the top level directory and any directory within thatH top level directory with no files, just the directories and if there are6 no subdirectories you get just the toplevel directory.  4 Or you could (with appropriate privs and/or proxies:  0 $create/dir remotenode::disk:[dir]/owner=whoever         Lee Y T Mah wrote: > S > Still no success.  I vaguely recall somewhere that BACKUP will not generate empty-] > directories.  In my example, DSA802:[TEMP3] contains files, but no directories.  However, I \ > still wanted TEMP3.DIR created on the saveset.  Thanks for your suggestions.  I will place& > a call with Compaq Support tomorrow. >  > Test results under VMS 7.1-2:$ >  > $ typ test.com >     $create/dir [ntest]i6 >     $back dsa802:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/save >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/log >  > $ set vern > 	 > $ @test  >     $create/dir [ntest]s6 >     $back dsa802:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/saveH >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from DSA802:[TEMP3...]*.DIR;* >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/logF >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from J$DKB0:[NTEST]DIR.SAV; >  > Test results under VMS 7.3:  >  > $ ty test.como >     $create/dir [ntest]s6 >     $back G$DKA0:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/save >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/log >  > $ set vert > 	 > $ @test  >     $create/dir [ntest]l6 >     $back G$DKA0:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/saveH >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from G$DKA0:[TEMP3...]*.DIR;* >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/logM >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from SYS$SYSDEVICE:[NTEST]DIR.SAV;> >  > Michael Austin wrote:  >  > > $create/dir [ntest]a) > > $back [*...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/save  > > $set def [ntest]  > > $back dir.sav/save [...]/log > >c > > "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: > > >u[ > > > Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> wrote in message news:<3C6693C6.D2E4A7E1@cha.ab.ca>....O > > > > I need to build a saveset containing just empty directories, use Decnet I > > > > to copy the saveset to a remote node, and then recreate the emptyeP > > > > directories on the remote node.  However, BACKUP does not copy the emptyO > > > > directory files.  It just creates an empty saveset.  Does anyone have ao > > > > solution?  > > > >d > > > > My attempt and results:n > > > >mA > > > > $ BACKUP DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.DIR TEMP3.SAV /LIST=TEMP3.LISiJ > > > > %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.DIR;* > > >sJ > > > This should work. Try appending /SAVE_SET to TEMP3.SAV. You must useJ > > > the /SAVE_SET qualifier when creating a save set on disk. Otherwise,K > > > BACKUP assumes you are copying files instead of saving them in a save 
 > > > set. > > >  > > > > $ TYP TEMP3.LIS)# > > > > Listing of BACKUP operation  > > > >F > > > > Written by:        USERf* > > > > UIC:               [000050,000004]2 > > > > Date:              10-FEB-2002 08:33:50.758 > > > > Command:           BACKUP DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.DIR  > > > > TEMP3.SAV/LIST=TEMP3.LIS3 > > > > Operating system:  OpenVMS AXP version V7.1c > > > > BACKUP version:    V6.2w# > > > > CPU ID register:   80000000i > > > > Node name:         J::# > > > > Written on:        _J$DKB0:V  > > > > Block size:        33040 > > > > Group size:        10a > > > > Buffer count:      188 > > > >s > > > >n > > > > End of BACKUP operations > > >hJ > > > I find it curious that you have BACKUP version V6.2 on VMS V7.1. Why > > > is that? > > >H< > > > Dislcaimer: JMHO               "I saw The Who on theirB > > > Alan E. Feldman                 *first* final tour."   -- me! > > > afeldman!~!~!~!gfigroup.coml > >  > > -- > > Regards, > > ; > > Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163 ; > > First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.coma > > Sr. Consultant >  > -- > Leei > = > Lee Y T Mah                        Capital Health AuthorityiA > Email: lytmah@cha.ab.ca            Information Systems, RAH CSCs6 > Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NWA > Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9    -- l Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163 7 First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.comp Sr. Consultant 704-947-1089 (Office)n 704-236-4377 (Mobile)    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:33:17 -0500d* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>/ Subject: RE: Using BACKUP to create directoriesp- Message-ID: <0033000052572561000002L012*@MHS>c  ; =0AThe title of the DSNlink article which discusses this asn part of another problem is:s  8 Problem Restoring a Backup [000000...] to a Subdirectory  ; It says this will be addressed, but I don't know if a later > ECO took care of it or not because all we do is image backups.  / I'd put the article upup, but it's copyrighted.t   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET-( Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 11:52 AMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET/ Subject: RE: Using BACKUP to create directoriesi     set def disk:[TEMP3]5 back [-]temp3.dir,[temp3...]*.dir  temp3.bck/save/log$! copy temp3.bck node::disk:[mydir]c back temp3.bck/save [*...]  F This will backup the top level directory and any directory within thatH top level directory with no files, just the directories and if there ar= eb6 no subdirectories you get just the toplevel directory.  4 Or you could (with appropriate privs and/or proxies:  2 $create/dir remotenode::disk:[dir]/owner=3Dwhoever         Lee Y T Mah wrote: >rH > Still no success.  I vaguely recall somewhere that BACKUP will not ge= nerateH empty > directories.  In my example, DSA802:[TEMP3] contains files, but=  no H directories.  However, I > still wanted TEMP3.DIR created on the savese= t.H Thanks for your suggestions.  I will place > a call with Compaq Support=  	 tomorrow.a >w > Test results under VMS 7.1-2:s >r > $ typ test.com >     $create/dir [ntest] 6 >     $back dsa802:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/save >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/log >K > $ set veru >h	 > $ @test  >     $create/dir [ntest]o6 >     $back dsa802:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/saveH >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from DSA802:[TEMP3...]*.DIR;= *h >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/logF >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from J$DKB0:[NTEST]DIR.SAV; >0 > Test results under VMS 7.3:d >r > $ ty test.com  >     $create/dir [ntest]-6 >     $back G$DKA0:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/save >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/log >  > $ set verm >s	 > $ @tests >     $create/dir [ntest] 6 >     $back G$DKA0:[temp3...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/saveH >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from G$DKA0:[TEMP3...]*.DIR;= *u >     $set def [ntest]" >     $back dir.sav/save [...]/logH >     %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from SYS$SYSDEVICE:[NTEST]DI= R.SAV; >  > Michael Austin wrote:l >x > > $create/dir [ntest]n) > > $back [*...]*.dir [ntest]dir.sav/saveh > > $set def [ntest]  > > $back dir.sav/save [...]/log > >o > > "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: > > > 5 > > > Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> wrote in messageoH news:<3C6693C6.D2E4A7E1@cha.ab.ca>... > > > > I need to build a saveset=  H containing just empty directories, use Decnet > > > > to copy the saves= et to a ( remote node, and then recreate the emptyH > > > > directories on the remote node.  However, BACKUP does not copy =	 the empty H > > > > directory files.  It just creates an empty saveset.  Does anyon= e have a > > > > solution?y > > > >s > > > > My attempt and results:  > > > > C > > > > $ BACKUP DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.DIR TEMP3.SAV /LIST=3DTEMP3.LIS H > > > > %BACKUP-W-NOFILES, no files selected from DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.DI= R;*h > > >iH > > > This should work. Try appending /SAVE_SET to TEMP3.SAV. You must = use H > > > the /SAVE_SET qualifier when creating a save set on disk. Otherwi= se,TH > > > BACKUP assumes you are copying files instead of saving them in a = save
 > > > set. > > >  > > > > $ TYP TEMP3.LISe# > > > > Listing of BACKUP operationa > > > >w > > > > Written by:        USERe* > > > > UIC:               [000050,000004]2 > > > > Date:              10-FEB-2002 08:33:50.758 > > > > Command:           BACKUP DSA803:[TEMP3...]*.DIR" > > > > TEMP3.SAV/LIST=3DTEMP3.LIS3 > > > > Operating system:  OpenVMS AXP version V7.1a > > > > BACKUP version:    V6.2M# > > > > CPU ID register:   80000000f > > > > Node name:         J::# > > > > Written on:        _J$DKB0:   > > > > Block size:        33040 > > > > Group size:        10n > > > > Buffer count:      188 > > > >D > > > >c > > > > End of BACKUP operatione > > >sH > > > I find it curious that you have BACKUP version V6.2 on VMS V7.1. = Whyl > > > is that? > > >.< > > > Dislcaimer: JMHO               "I saw The Who on theirB > > > Alan E. Feldman                 *first* final tour."   -- me! > > > afeldman!~!~!~!gfigroup.comf > >l > > -- > > Regards, > >g; > > Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163-; > > First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.coml > > Sr. Consultant >  > -- > Lees >r= > Lee Y T Mah                        Capital Health AuthoritylA > Email: lytmah@cha.ab.ca            Information Systems, RAH CSC 6 > Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NWA > Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9n   -- Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163o7 First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.comb Sr. Consultant 704-947-1089 (Office)h 704-236-4377 (Mobile)=   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:41:25 GMT   From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@home.com>' Subject: Re: Veritas NBU Client for VMS 8 Message-ID: <n04g6uguf589mo883ckkv308uro2obbdh8@4ax.com>  ? I'm appalled at the lack of forethought that allows a vendor ton= distribute a software package with this much case-sensitivity 	 built-in.k  C On Fri, 08 Feb 2002 17:25:21 +0000, Alan Fay <alan.fay@veritas.com>- wrote:   >e >o( >> From: arobert@mfs.com (Andrew Robert) >> Newsgroups: comp.os.vms& >> Subject: Re: Veritas Client for VMS" >> Date: 4 Feb 2002 10:21:42 -0800 >> >> Hi everyone,9 >> > >> ' >> Just an FYI,n >> uD >> I was able to get Veritas NetBackup client for VMS v3.2 and patch% >> v3.4GA installed without incident.  >> e5 >> The problem now to get the thing to backup a disk.  >>  H >> My Unix Admin added a test class called "Test_VMS", a schedule called+ >> "full" and a client type of Sun Solaris.r >>  7 >> When I attempt a manual backup, I get the following:. >> PG >> $ NBU BACKUP/IGNORE=(INTER,NOBACKUP) BACKUP1:[000000]USER1.BAK /LOG  % >> /CLASS="Test_VMS" /SCHEDULE="Full"r< >> %NBU-I-CONNECT, connect from SPEEDY (xxx.xx.xx.xxx, 1023)> >> %NBU-I-CONNECT, connected to NBMASTER (xxx.xx.xx.xx, 13720)G >> %NBU-E-STATUS, no schedules of the correct type exist in this class.  >>  . >> Does anyone have any idea what is going on? >>   >> Thanks, 1 >> Andrew Robert >> Principal Systems Analyst+ >> Enterprise Technology Services - OpenVMSa# >> Massachusetts Financial ServicesP >> E-mail: arobert@mfs.com >> 0 >0 >  >e >Andrew, > 5 >In general, the NBU VMS client is not case sesitive. 7 >That is, if a backup or restore command line is typed  8 >in uppercase characters, that command will perform the : >same action as the same command line, typed in lowercase  >characters. >07 >Class, schedule, and host names can be typed in eitherm5 >upper or lowercase characters, but these are always r6 >converted to lowercase when being sent to the server.6 >Therefore, you should specify these in all lowercase  >characters on the server. >V. >A lowercase "full" matches the servers "full"> >A lowercase "test_vms" does not match the servers "Test_VMS"  > 8 >That is the error, the error message is from the server >not the client. >_; >However, there is no need to specify a class or a schedule_= >from the client. If you create a User Backup Scedhule on thenE >server, as outlined in section "6.2 Creating a User Backup Schedule"tC >of the VMS client user guide, you can initiate full or incrementaln* >backups from the VMS client. For example: >tL >$ NBU BACKUP/FULL/IGNORE=(INTER,NOBACKUP) BACKUP1:[000000...]USER1.BAK /LOG >o  >will perform a full backup, and > P >$ NBU BACKUP/INCREMENTAL/IGNORE=(INTER,NOBACKUP) BACKUP1:[000000]USER1.BAK /LOG >o$ >will perform an incremental backup. >e. >The VMS Client User Guide is available from:- >uJ >ftp://ftp.emea.support.veritas.com/pub/support/Products/NetBackup_OpenVMS >    user_guide.pdf  >b= >The up coming 3.4.1 VMS client releases, which provide full  @ >ODS-5 file system support, will handle VMS file specifications D >case sensitively if the system 'parse_style' is set to 'extended'.  >  >F	 >Alan Fay0" >NBU VMS Client Software Developer >VERITAS Software (Engineering)  > ' >VERITAS Software Corporation (UK) Ltd.6 >VERITAS Park, Bittams Lanen >Guildford Road, Chertsey4 >Surrey KT16 9RG >United Kingdoma >h >b >> >i  1 Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaqa- (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 14:45:42 +0100.* From: Alexis Cousein <al@brussels.sgi.com>$ Subject: [off-topic] eighty et al.../ Message-ID: <3C67CB06.9050107@brussels.sgi.com>h   Peter Finderup Lund wrote:  L > French is similar (quatrevingsix, maybe I need some hyphens there), except > afaik in Belgium.g >  except in Switzerland.      - "Quatre-vingt six" in Belgium as well, thoughL  B 96 is "Quatre-vingt dix-neuf" (four twenty and nineteen) in France, and "nonante neuf" (ninety nine) in Belgium.     -- [? <these messages express my own views, not those of my employer>n) Alexis Cousein				Senior Systems EngineerI. SGI Belgium and Luxemburg		al@brussels.sgi.com   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Feb 2002 14:46:31 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)L( Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al..., Message-ID: <a48lg7$2f01$3@info.cs.uofs.edu>  / In article <3C67CB06.9050107@brussels.sgi.com>, -  Alexis Cousein <al@brussels.sgi.com> writes:9 |>E |> 96 is "Quatre-vingt dix-neuf" (four twenty and nineteen) in France     ^^-/ |> and "nonante neuf" (ninety nine) in Belgium.    I certainly hope not.  :-)   bill   -- -J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 22:57:11 +0100R( From: Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de>( Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...% Message-ID: <3C683E37.6A74B65@gmx.de>B   Alexis Cousein schrieb:lD > 96 is "Quatre-vingt dix-neuf" (four twenty and nineteen) in France. > and "nonante neuf" (ninety nine) in Belgium.  B I've heard both "ottante" and "nonante", but it seems to come fromF arabic influence (there is a fairly large arabic population in France,8 and to them, quatre-vingt dis-neuf is really unnatural).   -- p Bernd Paysan7 "If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"  http://www.jwdt.com/~paysan/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:04:26 +0100 + From: Peter Finderup Lund <firefly@diku.dk>t( Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...C Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44L0.0202111502200.2022-100000@ask.diku.dk>h  * On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Alexis Cousein wrote:  D > 96 is "Quatre-vingt dix-neuf" (four twenty and nineteen) in France  J That form has always amused me (likewise soixante dix-whatever).  It's the? way little children count in Danish until they grow a carrybit..   -Peter   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 08:06:21 -0800-# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>0( Subject: RE: [off-topic] eighty et al...9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEOMEBAA.tom@kednos.com>c   > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Bernd Paysan [mailto:bernd.paysan@gmx.de]i) > Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 1:57 PMi > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt* > Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al... >  >  > Alexis Cousein schrieb:eF > > 96 is "Quatre-vingt dix-neuf" (four twenty and nineteen) in France0 > > and "nonante neuf" (ninety nine) in Belgium. > D > I've heard both "ottante" and "nonante", but it seems to come fromH > arabic influence (there is a fairly large arabic population in France,: > and to them, quatre-vingt dis-neuf is really unnatural).  I I have heard that also, in southern France, and I think Belgium.  But why I do you think Arabic.  I would guess more likely Italian, which is what ito sounds like.   >  > --   > Bernd Paysan9 > "If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"i > http://www.jwdt.com/~paysan/ >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 18:20:16 -0000 5 From: "Malcolm" <malcolmix@neverness.freeserve.co.uk>*( Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al.../ Message-ID: <a491v0$clr$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>   . "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message3 news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEOMEBAA.tom@kednos.com...a >a >  > > -----Original Message-----3 > > From: Bernd Paysan [mailto:bernd.paysan@gmx.de]d+ > > Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 1:57 PMg > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comi, > > Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al... > >t > >l > > Alexis Cousein schrieb:yH > > > 96 is "Quatre-vingt dix-neuf" (four twenty and nineteen) in France2 > > > and "nonante neuf" (ninety nine) in Belgium. > > F > > I've heard both "ottante" and "nonante", but it seems to come fromJ > > arabic influence (there is a fairly large arabic population in France,< > > and to them, quatre-vingt dis-neuf is really unnatural). >*K > I have heard that also, in southern France, and I think Belgium.  But why-K > do you think Arabic.  I would guess more likely Italian, which is what it  > sounds like. >   J When I learned French at school many years ago, our teacher mentioned thatD some dialects of French used "septante", "huitante" or "octante" andK "nonante" for seventy, eighty and ninety respectively. IIRC, he said it waseJ mainly Belgian French and Quebecois. he said it had been invented, much in= the same way that Americans invented words like "aluminum"...   H Ordinary French uses, as has been mentioned, a system based on twenties.F [60="soixante", 70="soixante-dix", 80="quatre vingt", 90="quatre vingtK dix"]. Vestiges of this can also be found in English, e.g. "three score and K ten", "six hundred, three score and six". This of course is the same as the 8 number of digits on the body [polydactyly excepted ;-)].  J Scots Gaelic still uses a similar vigesimal system (aon, da, tri, ceithir,K coig, sia, siochd, ochd, naoi, deich = 1 to 10, 11 = "aon dheug" (1+10), 20uC = fhichead, 21 = "aon air fhichead" (1 and 20), 31 = "aon dheug airtK fhichead" (1+10 and 20), 41 = "da fhichead is a haon" (2 x 20 and one), allnE the way up to "ceithir fhichead is a naoi deug" (4x20 and 9+10 = 99).   L [Just to let you know, I had to look it up and can't count reliably past sixI in Gaelic. To give you an idea of how difficult it is to _say_, 99 sounds5K roughly like "caeer eecheadd is a noy dook". How far would _you_ get with a.? language whose word for "pronunciation" is "fuaimneachadach" ;]n  E Basque, Manx Gaelic and Breton (all neighbouring languages) also have0G vigesimal systems, so it is likely that French borrowed its system fromV Basque or Breton.e  F More OT: Duodecimal (base-12; English examples = "dozen", "gross") andF sexagesimal(?) (base-60; example = 60 seconds/min, 360 degrees/circle)D systems are believed to have originated from the number of bones (or# knuckles) in the four main fingers.a  J For Everything about Numbering Systems That You Always Wanted To Know (But Were Too Afraid to Ask) see:@ http://www.sf.airnet.ne.jp/~ts/language/number.html (In English)   -Malcolm   -- Malcolm MacArthur   , Subtract nine for e-mail (anti-spam measure) > >o > > -- > > Bernd Paysan; > > "If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"   > > http://www.jwdt.com/~paysan/ > >p   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.082 ************************6 > Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NWA > Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9    -- l Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163 7  P    P    P    P    P    P    P    P    P    	P    
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