0 INFO-VAX	Sat, 16 Feb 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 92      Contents: Re: "Crashless Windows"  Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL  RE: BLISS for C Programmers URL  Re: CLI$_PARSE problem Containers and Compaq  Couple of Questions  Re: Couple of Questions  Re: Couple of Questions  Re: DCL procedure's  Re: Gordon Bell site Re: Gordon Bell site? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? ? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? ? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? ? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? + Re: How to become a Hobbyist (the hard way) + Re: How to become a Hobbyist (the hard way) + Re: How to become a Hobbyist (the hard way) 4 Re: Longest VMS _cluster_ uptime, was: 1 Year uptime Mount disk at startup? Re: Mount disk at startup? Re: Mount disk at startup? Re: Mount disk at startup? Re: Mount disk at startup? Re: Mount disk at startup? PPP for TCPIP on VAX ? Proposal - Hobbyist FAQ P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The  demise       of P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise       of  A Re: Swiss ADSL - Any success with green.ch ADSL? Feedback please. A Re: Swiss ADSL - Any success with green.ch ADSL? Feedback please.   Using Edit inside a procedure...$ Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...$ Re: Using Edit inside a procedure..." Re: Very Very Slow Telnet (SOLVED) Re: Very Very Slow Telnet. Re: Very Very Slow Telnet. Re: Very Very Slow Telnet. VXT2000 - RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS? D With a littel help of ... to get process info at some remote node(s)H Re: With a littel help of ... to get process info at some remote node(s) Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 13:31:09 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>   Subject: Re: "Crashless Windows"4 Message-ID: <VA.00000536.3ca6b38c@bluewin.delete.ch>  ? In article <fxva8.166$rL.156@news1.bloor.is>, John Smith wrote: 1 > http://www.forbes.com/global/2002/0204/019.html  > ( > Look at the diagram in the article.... > 0 Or for the version from the horse's mouth go to  www.marathontechnologies.com  E This is not news. Terry Shannon mentioned it, albeit briefly, in his   August 1999 newsletter.   E The wicked thought occurs to me that one could use a pair of these to D run a VAXcluster using Charon-VAX. I somehow think a pair of Alphas G (also running Charon-VAX if necessary) would be more cost effective :-)  ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 13:31:09 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> ( Subject: Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL4 Message-ID: <VA.00000535.3ca6b378@bluewin.delete.ch>  J In article <QomqIHnaiFRe@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Larry Kilgallen wrote: > In article <rdeininger-1102022200120001@1cust106.tnt1.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>, rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:? > > In article <qhaduf5sq6.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>, Eric Smith - > > <eric-no-spam-for-me@brouhaha.com> wrote:  > > . > >>bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) writes:M > >>> why not use bliss to create a "freevms" version so we can get away from M > >>> Capellas and Carly if they try to shove windows or unix down our throat  > >>> like Palmer did? > >>J > >>If you're going to go to the trouble of writing a replacement for VMS,A > >>you might as well do it in a more commonly accepted language.  > >  > > You mean Ada, right? > E > He didn't, but until I saw your response I was going to suggest Ada C > because doing something in a _better_ language is more important. E > Anyone who knows a couple other languages can learn Ada well enough  > for maintenance purposes.  > A How true. The first bug I had to fix in an Ada program took about E 2 minutes flat to identify and correct. I must of course mention that B decent naming conventions for modules and variables played a large+ part in that. Testing took a little longer.   C I must admit that initially I found Ada somewhat picky - I couldn't A use "tricks" which work fine in FORTRAN or COBOL for example, but C the inescapable conclusion is that that makes for more maintainable  code.  ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 08:51:38 -0800 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> ( Subject: RE: BLISS for C Programmers URL9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIOEICECAA.tom@kednos.com>   A It is a fairly pedestrian observation, that the more the compiler E does for you, the less work you will have.  PL/I and Ada are the only  languages that fit that bill.    > -----Original Message-----8 > From: Paul Sture [mailto:paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch]+ > Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2002 4:31 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com * > Subject: Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL >  > L > In article <QomqIHnaiFRe@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Larry Kilgallen wrote: > > In articleB > <rdeininger-1102022200120001@1cust106.tnt1.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>,6 > rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) writes:A > > > In article <qhaduf5sq6.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>, Eric Smith / > > > <eric-no-spam-for-me@brouhaha.com> wrote:  > > > 0 > > >>bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) writes:A > > >>> why not use bliss to create a "freevms" version so we can  > get away from ? > > >>> Capellas and Carly if they try to shove windows or unix  > down our throat  > > >>> like Palmer did? > > >>L > > >>If you're going to go to the trouble of writing a replacement for VMS,C > > >>you might as well do it in a more commonly accepted language.  > > >  > > > You mean Ada, right? > > G > > He didn't, but until I saw your response I was going to suggest Ada E > > because doing something in a _better_ language is more important. G > > Anyone who knows a couple other languages can learn Ada well enough  > > for maintenance purposes.  > > C > How true. The first bug I had to fix in an Ada program took about G > 2 minutes flat to identify and correct. I must of course mention that D > decent naming conventions for modules and variables played a large- > part in that. Testing took a little longer.  > E > I must admit that initially I found Ada somewhat picky - I couldn't C > use "tricks" which work fine in FORTRAN or COBOL for example, but E > the inescapable conclusion is that that makes for more maintainable  > code.  > ___  > Paul Sture
 > Switzerland  >    ------------------------------   Date: 16 Feb 2002 08:08:20 GMT- From: djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall)  Subject: Re: CLI$_PARSE problem 5 Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-BKXqIdj72516@localhost>   > On Fri, 15 Feb 2002 07:01:07 UTC, djweath@attglobal.net (Dave  Weatherall) wrote:   <snip>  7 > > I am making a call from Fortran/77 code as follows:  > > 1 > > OPCARD = '/FILENAME=JOECUZ.TXT /READ /TYPE=2' 8 > > STATUS = CLI$DCL_PARSE( %REF(OPCARD), %REF(ATABLE) ) > >   
 <bigger snip>    E > Can you do it like this? I'm at home so I can't check my code that  C > does this but ISTR my reading of the documentation lead me to be  H > believe that DCL$PARSE calls a routine to fill the string that it willH > parse. The arguments to DCL_PARSE are the references to, hence addressF > of, the routine that fills in the string and one other that I can't @ > remember. That's certainly the way I do it. ie. something like > 7 >  status =  cli$parse (... GET_STRING_TO_BE_PARSED ,,   > table-command_table...)  >  > ( >  function GET_STRING_TO_BE_PARSED (A$) > 7 >   A$ = setup.reply_buffer  ! copy stored/read command  > 
 >   return > C > If you can do it just by passing the address of the buffer to be  8 > parsed I've been doing things wrong all these years@!! >  > Must check again >   B Well I did check and I _have_ been wrong all these years (8 to be B precise). My first use of CLI$ routines  was in about 1984/5 when F developing the CLI for the cross-assembler/linker suite I maintain. I C was porting it from RSX11M to VMS. In this instance I used the CLD  F with DCLTABLES.EXE to invoke the images.  Then, about 5 years later, IF  used the CDU/CLI routines in interactive mode with an EMUlator of theF CPU that was the target of the cross-assembler. Finally in '94 I took E the same basic code and adapted it to parsing lines that had already  E been read elsewhere in our test program. The mistake was to take the  F existing code from EMU and not to go back and RTFM. I do feel a bit of
 a plonker :-)   F However, just the other day I was pointing out to a colleague that we D shall have to modify our program(s) to handle continuation lines in F the near future. Now I have a better idea how, so my thanks to Cuz forA raising the question. A positive effect of Usenet in general and  C c.o.v. in particular, even if I do feel as if I'd fallen asleep in  - front of a plate of scambled-egg on toast :-)    Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 12:38:59 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Containers and Compaq, Message-ID: <3C6E9929.ACF658C3@videotron.ca>  F the other night, riding the bus back home, we followed a freight train carrying containers.  N It occurred to me that nobody ever askes who actually builds those containers.N We all assume that theieree is some written standard somewhere for the size ofM containers, structural strength requirements (so they can be stacked) as well P as anchor points. But has anyone actually ever wondered who builds those boxes ?  J What we know is that some companies put their  logos on the containers andB provide a rental service for the container, sometimes bundled with transportation etc etc.   G In the end, the containers are all the same, even if built by different K companies, and the differentiating factor is the service that the transport 8 company provides which include the use of the container.  L So different transpport companies have no differentiating factor between theL product (standard container moved from A to B) but they have differentiatingN factors in the services provides around the moveing from A-B. Some may provideJ customs brokerage, some provide storage, so provide on-line tracking, some) provide combination of the above etc etc.   M Perhaps that is what Curly and Carly really intend to do. sell the same boxes J as Dell, but diffentiate themselves by the breath of services they provide0 around the standard vanilla box (the container).  M And you know, once the infrastructure is developped around that standard (the G container ships, the container railway cars, etc etc), it becomes quite H difficult to change that standard. (perhaps that is why IA64 will fail).   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:36:03 GMT 0 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com> Subject: Couple of Questions+ Message-ID: <3C6E7C56.E50A1A76@mailbag.com>   
 Hello all,F I recently got my hands on a copy of the June 1997 SPL for VMS 7.1 and' was wondering about a couple of things:   ( 1) Will Posix 3.0 work on a 7.2 system? < 2) Does it require a separate PAK from the operating system?0 3) Is is still possible to get a PAK for SoftPC?- 4) Is there a spread sheet available for VMS?    TIA,   William  --  * You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for. -                                 Courtney Love    ------------------------------    Date: 16 Feb 2002 17:51:09 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)  Subject: Re: Couple of Questions( Message-ID: <3c6e8dfd@news.kapsch.co.at>  ^ In article <3C6E7C56.E50A1A76@mailbag.com>, William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com> writes:G >I recently got my hands on a copy of the June 1997 SPL for VMS 7.1 and ( >was wondering about a couple of things: > ) >1) Will Posix 3.0 work on a 7.2 system?     Dunno.  = >2) Does it require a separate PAK from the operating system?    IIRC no.  1 >3) Is is still possible to get a PAK for SoftPC?   
 AFAIK, no.B But you don't want SoftPC at all. If it idles, then with 100% CPU.2 SoftWindows (Alpha only) was only slightly better.@ And what DOS/Win16 programs do you want/need to run on OpenVMS ?  . >4) Is there a spread sheet available for VMS?  * Yup. Start with XESS at http://www.ais.com   --  < Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111 2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111 888 < KAPSCH AG      Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 17:27:51 GMT 0 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com>  Subject: Re: Couple of Questions+ Message-ID: <3C6E968B.8C8A87E2@mailbag.com>    Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:3 > >3) Is is still possible to get a PAK for SoftPC?  >  > AFAIK, no.D > But you don't want SoftPC at all. If it idles, then with 100% CPU.4 > SoftWindows (Alpha only) was only slightly better.B > And what DOS/Win16 programs do you want/need to run on OpenVMS ?  F Need? Nothing. Still the hoot value of running Wordstar on a Vax would be high for me.    0 > >4) Is there a spread sheet available for VMS? > , > Yup. Start with XESS at http://www.ais.com   Thanks, I'll check it out.      > --> > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111 2651= > Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111 888 > > KAPSCH AG      Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netJ > A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   William  --  * You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for. -                                 Courtney Love    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 01:45:17 -0800 / From: "Rick Campbell" <rickca.AT@speakeasy.net>  Subject: Re: DCL procedure's/ Message-ID: <u6sah9om0c7rfe@corp.supernews.com>   , The correct author is "Paul Anagnostopoulos"  + "Steve Hoffman" CO-authored the 2nd edition    RIck.   7 "WILLIAM WEBB" <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov> wrote in message ' news:0033000053261949000002L092*@MHS...   4 There's a book called "Writing Real Programs in DCL"" written by some guy named Hoffman.  ) I strongly recommend that you get a copy.    WWWebb     -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET ' Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 9:11 AM B To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET Subject: DCL procedure's     Hello,  - i am looking for some usefull DCL-procedure's # maybe you wanna share some programs   
 many thanx   tim=   ------------------------------  ! Date: Sat, 16 Feb 02 10:03:12 GMT  From: jmfbahciv@aol.com  Subject: Re: Gordon Bell site + Message-ID: <a4liko$6bt$4@bob.news.rcn.net>   , In article <xdab8.107$oO.44@news1.bloor.is>,'    "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote:  > K ><jmfbahciv@aol.com> wrote in message news:a4j8kp$jkt$3@bob.news.rcn.net... @ >> Nope.  That's not the underlying problem.  The problem is the? >> assumption that a business is failing if it isn't growing at @ >> x%.  You can't get seed money or capital outlay if you're not? >> deemed as a "successful" business.  It's a virus that nobody  >> recognizes. >> > D >It's called a 'subsistence' business....hand-to-mouth corner store  variety.  @ It doesn't have to be.  There are a lot of niche businesses thatC will never make the NYSE and the people involved in such businesses ) don't have that in their business plan.    > F >To bad Compaq and HP shareholders don't have the full facts about theJ >different sides of their respective businesses...about which one is trulyG >the subsistence business and which one has substantive returns....Then K >again, management of both companies would probably hire Arthur Andersen to  >'explain' it.  A They do have the information.  What they use that information for  is another issue.    /BAH  ' Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.    ------------------------------  ! Date: Sat, 16 Feb 02 10:05:22 GMT  From: jmfbahciv@aol.com  Subject: Re: Gordon Bell site + Message-ID: <a4liop$6bt$5@bob.news.rcn.net>   , In article <3C6D859E.A2A6FF05@jetnet.ab.ca>,/    Ben Franchuk <bfranchuk@jetnet.ab.ca> wrote:  >Neil Franklin wrote:  > = >> Because Gorden Bell works at Microsofts research division?: >eF >Mabie they need to move him to the Software division. He could be the$ >only one who knows how to fix bugs!   That would fix Misoft.   /BAH  ' Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 07:58:18 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>H Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?A Message-ID: <uiob8.59991$eS3.4410585@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>u  8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:YWovXVcFV+77@eisner.encompasserve.org...bA > In article <87it8y5so7.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi  <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:o1 > > young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:p > > A > > Do you think you could add the DS10 and DS20 prices so we canu, > > all enjoy how much cheaper life will be? > >t >u= > Sure... with this 4 processor quote I'm working up for you, 1 > which would you prefer, 32 or 64 GBytes of RAM?v  H Since Compaq believes it can charge a great deal more for Alpha RAM thanL Dell charges for Itanic RAM, just purchase the minimum Compaq allows and theF same for the Itanic:  additional amounts can then be purchased at saneI third-party prices.  As long as you do this for the base comparison, feeldJ free to indicate how much more the Alpha would cost with a full complementH of Compaq RAM (this will help make it clear to Alpha purchasers how much& they are getting gouged in this area).  B Oh, by the way:  the Alpha configuration should have only half theL processors of the Itanic, since each EV68 is approximately twice as powerfulJ (in both SPECint and bandwidth) - so if the Dell is a quad-processor (max)E box, quote a DS20 for the Alpha unless the higher-end Alphas are only-I available in the ES45 (in which case just half-populate it if the Dell is1H full:  not an entirely fair comparison, since the ES45 will still have aH great deal of 'headroom' left for expansion while the Dell will not, but what the hell).x   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:52:00 -05000( From: Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu>H Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?A Message-ID: <20020216114359.T3512-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu>e  $ On Fri, 15 Feb 2002, JF Mezei wrote:   >1P > We have to wait a few months to find out what HP really intends to do. So far,O > it is a state of limbo until the new owners of Compaq make a clear statement.a >   F Is it just me, or do others find the tone of messages here pointing atH the HP/COMPAQ buyout as a done deal??  I find this interesting as I seemF to recall someone posting rules that make it very unlikely to succeed.   Correct me if I'm wrong, but:o&    HP needs more than 66% "yes" votes.G    The "H" and "P" families control 18% that is definitely voting "no".v&    All unvoted stock counts as a "no".  E Based on this simple bit of info, it merely takes 15% of the stock toiH remain unvoted for the deal to fall.  I would imagine there is that muchK in the hands of little old ladies who wouldn't know a proxy if it bit them.oF And surely the "H" and "P" families have enough influence in among theH people who are likely to be holding more than single shares to garner at' least a few more percent to their side.h  > Do people here really think this deal is going to go through??  L (For the record, I don't think it has a snowball's chance in hell, but then,/ if I was anygood at this I'ld be rich, right??)p   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |> Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 12:31:14 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> H Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?, Message-ID: <3C6E9759.ECB0D4D9@videotron.ca>   Bill Gunshannon wrote: > Correct me if I'm wrong, but: ( >    HP needs more than 66% "yes" votes.I >    The "H" and "P" families control 18% that is definitely voting "no".f( >    All unvoted stock counts as a "no".  G Carly seems confident the deal will go through. HP shareholders will dotK Microsoft and Intel a big favour by killing off what is left of Digital and M finally be able to give Windows the push it deserves throughout the industry.e  N And if it fails, the Compaq will be in a big state of limbo, having burned itsL Alpha, Tru64 , compiler etc bridges. The harm of all those announcements may= have done irreparable damage to the enterprise customer base.t  K If HP shareholders fail to approve the deal, it will be most interesting touE see what will happen to Compaq's stock. Will it rise because they are K confident Compaq can recover ? Will it drop sharply because they will write I off Compaq, or will it rise because it will be ripe with another takeover  rumour ?  N From my point of view, Compaq has inflicted mortal wounds to itself since lastJ June. But Wall Street seems to be blind to this. And because these type ofM wounds  take a few years before they really show their ugly heads, it will behA a while before Compaq's financials reflect the harm done in 2001.w  L Curly has now moved Compaq into a point of no return. Compaq must absolutelyM fix its PC ship because the VMS and Tru64 pumps will cease to pump sufficient M water out of the sinking ship soon. The sad part is that Compaq might succeedg. with its PC business proving many of us wrong.   ------------------------------    Date: 16 Feb 2002 12:50:16 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) H Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?3 Message-ID: <LMEKq+LifbvC@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3C6DD3A4.F70175C4@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > Rob Young wrote: >>  ^ >> In article <3C6C8D53.4C3CBCB8@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: >> > Rob Young wrote:  >> >> [snip] >> >>         Numbers please!n >> > >> > He doesn't report to you. >> >' >> > (See how stupid that sounds, Rob?)a >> > >> gA >>         But in the context of being responsible for a business-J >>         (i.e. the folks that know the numbers... the ones Gartner can'tI >>         translate from one piece of paper to another) that was *those*lF >>         other numbers you are referring to.  The ones we won't see,3 >>         nor should we, competive in nature, etc.r > I > I'll have to apologize to the group for being so extremely dense that I G > simply canNOT understand how it is possible that trumpeting one's own2F > successes could be detrimental to one's self and/or helpful to one's7 > competition, injurious to national security, etc. ...l > * > Could someone please explain that to me? >   8 	You should not break out each and every division within= 	a company or your competition knows just how strong you are,i? 	what your growth is year to year allowing them to adjust theirS= 	strategy.  It is not uncommon in this industry and others tohC 	put out false information in the hopes your competitors will spend.9 	resources (in the end money) on wrong ideas, directions.d    ) >> [snip] Little sore or what?  Sheesh...g >  > Oh, I get it.  > H > It's alright when *YOU* ask someone to back up a statement; but *I* do > it, it's not alright.. >  > I got it now.R > ) > Thank you so much for clearing that up.  >    	You are welcome.E   				Rob)   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 12:16:28 GMTe, From: "2damncommon" <2damncommon@nospam.net>4 Subject: Re: How to become a Hobbyist (the hard way)B Message-ID: <w4sb8.9869$uO1.1429827676@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com>   Glad to see hobbyist post here.wH I have Charon-VAX running on Linux (appears to check either floppy or CD1 for boot-good) and VMS Hobbyist CD "in the mail".eG Looking forward to some RTFM time and look forward to kicking the tirest/ and slamming the doors if I can get it running.L+ Very small ammount of VMS experience, here.     < In article <3C6CEBED.10E51AE3@ukhackers.net>, "Mark Redding"  <grawlfang@ukhackers.net> wrote:  J > I've recently installed Hobbyist VMS 7.2 onto my VAXstation 4000 VLC ... >   > http://www.aragorn.org.uk/vax/ > E > ...Is my diary of events in the hope that it may be of use to othert > struggling Hobbyists.d >  > Mark.d >t   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:48:57 GMT 0 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com>4 Subject: Re: How to become a Hobbyist (the hard way)+ Message-ID: <3C6E7F5E.BF54773E@mailbag.com>I  . Yikes! Glad I didn't have that much headache.   E I only got my first Vax last August - a VLC as well. Stuck 24mb in it.G and hung a plextor external cdrom off of it's back and every thing wentaF find. Since then I found a local university surplus shop that had a VSG 4000/90, 64mb, 1 1gb drive and 2 2.1gb drives (one of the latter simplyiH laying in the cdrom bay...), keyboard, no mouse, but 19" Dec monitor for? $50. That, still with my external plextor, is my main Vax now. h  E I've had none of the difficulties you describe with loading anything;oH that much at least has always "just worked" for both product install andB vmsinstal. The biggest problem I have is the lack of good beginnerH system management information. While I am an experianced Unix sysadm,butE I had essentially nada for vms experiance prior to August and as I'veeB been freqently reminded, this is a very different world than Unix.F Hoff's FAQ and the couple of beginning user FAQ's that I've found haveC been invaluable, but I wonder if some of us hobbyists shouldn't geteH together and work on a Hobbyist FAQ specifically to document some of the$ things we have learned the hard way.   Hmm... Time for a new message?   Williamv   Mark Redding wrote:u > J > I've recently installed Hobbyist VMS 7.2 onto my VAXstation 4000 VLC ... >   > http://www.aragorn.org.uk/vax/ > E > ...Is my diary of events in the hope that it may be of use to othere > struggling Hobbyists.  >  > Mark.r   --  * You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for.o-                                 Courtney Love    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 18:35:15 +0200o* From: Mike Rechtman <rechtman@tzora.co.il>4 Subject: Re: How to become a Hobbyist (the hard way)( Message-ID: <3C6E8A43.50900@tzora.co.il>  ; Does anyone remember a book/folder called "VAX/VMS primer"?a9 It was part of the doc set circa V4.7 - V5.5.  Less than e9 50pp. - Anyone starting on VMS (WE don' need no stinkin' (= OPEN) was thrown a copy and told to work through it. Another -9 good intro IIRC used to be the first few chapters of the a "VAX-11 C manual" (V1.0)   Mike   William Barnett-Lewis wrote:  0 > Yikes! Glad I didn't have that much headache.  > G > I only got my first Vax last August - a VLC as well. Stuck 24mb in itaI > and hung a plextor external cdrom off of it's back and every thing went H > find. Since then I found a local university surplus shop that had a VSI > 4000/90, 64mb, 1 1gb drive and 2 2.1gb drives (one of the latter simplyeJ > laying in the cdrom bay...), keyboard, no mouse, but 19" Dec monitor forA > $50. That, still with my external plextor, is my main Vax now.   <snipped...>       > 	 > Williamy >  > Mark Redding wrote:- > J >>I've recently installed Hobbyist VMS 7.2 onto my VAXstation 4000 VLC ... >>  >>http://www.aragorn.org.uk/vax/ >>E >>...Is my diary of events in the hope that it may be of use to otherE >>struggling Hobbyists.l >> >>Mark.e >> >      -- a  & New to c.o.vms? allow me to recommend:6 http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~rechtman/post_hlp.htmE ---------------------------------------------------------------------s; Usual disclaimer: All opinions are mine alone, perhaps not  
 even that.< Mike Rechtman                         *rechtman@tzora.co.il*; Kibbutz Tzor'a.                Voice (home):(972)-2-9908337l> 20% of a job takes 80% of the time, the rest takes another 80%E ---------------------------------------------------------------------    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 13:31:09 +0100S/ From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>e= Subject: Re: Longest VMS _cluster_ uptime, was: 1 Year uptimer4 Message-ID: <VA.00000537.3ca6b396@bluewin.delete.ch>  @ In article <3C6B3A51.E080A91E@fsi.net>, David J. Dachtera wrote: > "Mark E. Levy" wrote:  > > P > > Dontcha remember David? We had two 750s running in a cluster under 3.7. Full> > > clustering with the lock manager  didn't show up 'til 4.0. > > @ > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message% > > news:3C69DFE8.9323D03F@fsi.net...EF > > > AFAIK, V3.x pre-dates VAXCLUSTER by a couple or three years, no? > D > Hhmmm... Y'know, I wonder if you and I didn't INVENT clustering at > AHI... > J > Seriously - OPEN "node::ddcu:<dir>file.ext" FOR INPUT AS FILE #x was theJ > method, and compared to today's 100BaseT and FC/SF, I *SHUDDER* to think1 > about accessing files via DECnet over Ethernet.e > D Nah, that's cheating :-) I had a pair of 750s in 1983 (IIRC VMS 3.1)E handing each other work via dual ported disks, no DECnet in sight :-)   B > Too bad you can't find the VAX BASIC sources for the TOC System,H > including all the stuff I wrote to read/write magtapes for order inputE > and billing (output). What a gas it would be to look at *THAT* codeS
 > today, huh?  >I? Shudders to think what _my_ code from those days looks like ...w ___o
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 16:58:53 GMT 0 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com> Subject: Mount disk at startup?5+ Message-ID: <3C6E8FC1.D483F2BE@mailbag.com>s  F Ok, how do I mount a second or third disk at startup? The system comesE up fine and "show dev" displays all the drives, but lists all but the C startup disk as online but not as mounted. Can I simply put a mountB@ command in the systartup_vms.com file? Or is there a more subtleB incantation needed? I've had no luck in looking through the systemE manager manual for this, though if I read past it, a pointer is fine.a   Thanks,    WilliamW --  * You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for.r-                                 Courtney Lovel   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 18:28:38 +0100e9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>r# Subject: Re: Mount disk at startup?r' Message-ID: <3C6E96C6.B6C5EA1E@aaa.com>-  + I usualy create a command file called e.g. 3   SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS.COMo  . and then add the mount commands there together/ with any conceiled disks that have there "root"b on those disks..  % Then add  @SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS too   SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.  4 For a simple setup, you could of course also add the: MOUNT command(s) directly to the SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM file...   Jan-Erik Sderholm.    William Barnett-Lewis wrote: > H > Ok, how do I mount a second or third disk at startup? The system comesG > up fine and "show dev" displays all the drives, but lists all but the E > startup disk as online but not as mounted. Can I simply put a mountoB > command in the systartup_vms.com file? Or is there a more subtleD > incantation needed? I've had no luck in looking through the systemG > manager manual for this, though if I read past it, a pointer is fine.  > 	 > Thanks,o > 	 > Williamr > --, > You better watch out    What you wish for;- > It better be worth it   So much to die for.u/ >                                 Courtney Loven   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 18:29:47 +0100m9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>i# Subject: Re: Mount disk at startup?W' Message-ID: <3C6E970B.22BE0272@aaa.com>o  + I usualy create a command file called e.g. f   SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS.COM-  . and then add the mount commands there together/ with any conceiled disks that have there "root"r on those disks.e  % Then add  @SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS to    SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.  4 For a simple setup, you could of course also add the: MOUNT command(s) directly to the SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM file...   Jan-Erik Sderholm.s   William Barnett-Lewis wrote: > H > Ok, how do I mount a second or third disk at startup? The system comesG > up fine and "show dev" displays all the drives, but lists all but therE > startup disk as online but not as mounted. Can I simply put a mount,B > command in the systartup_vms.com file? Or is there a more subtleD > incantation needed? I've had no luck in looking through the systemG > manager manual for this, though if I read past it, a pointer is fine.u > 	 > Thanks,  > 	 > Williama > --, > You better watch out    What you wish for;- > It better be worth it   So much to die for.s/ >                                 Courtney Lovee   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 18:30:20 +0100t9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>0# Subject: Re: Mount disk at startup? ' Message-ID: <3C6E972C.86ABA0FE@aaa.com>u  + I usualy create a command file called e.g. p   SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS.COMr  . and then add the mount commands there together/ with any conceiled disks that have there "root"A on those disks.g  % Then add  @SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS tom   SYS$STARTUP:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.  4 For a simple setup, you could of course also add the: MOUNT command(s) directly to the SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM file...   Jan-Erik Sderholm.        William Barnett-Lewis wrote: > H > Ok, how do I mount a second or third disk at startup? The system comesG > up fine and "show dev" displays all the drives, but lists all but the.E > startup disk as online but not as mounted. Can I simply put a mount B > command in the systartup_vms.com file? Or is there a more subtleD > incantation needed? I've had no luck in looking through the systemG > manager manual for this, though if I read past it, a pointer is fine.h > 	 > Thanks,v > 	 > WilliamE > --, > You better watch out    What you wish for;- > It better be worth it   So much to die for.i/ >                                 Courtney Lovea   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 17:41:02 GMT ) From: James Norris <jnorris@metronet.com> # Subject: Re: Mount disk at startup?0, Message-ID: <3C6E99BA.4D4046B0@metronet.com>   William Barnett-Lewis wrote:  H > Ok, how do I mount a second or third disk at startup? The system comesG > up fine and "show dev" displays all the drives, but lists all but the E > startup disk as online but not as mounted. Can I simply put a mount B > command in the systartup_vms.com file? Or is there a more subtleD > incantation needed? I've had no luck in looking through the systemG > manager manual for this, though if I read past it, a pointer is fine.?  F Mount all available disks in Systartup_Vms.com.  The command (for each	 disk) is:r  = $ Mount/System <device name> <disk label> <disk logical name>e  H The bare bones systartup_vms that comes with the installation of vms has= an example disk mounting.  The disk logical name is optional."   Jim    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 12:47:08 -0500a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>n# Subject: Re: Mount disk at startup? , Message-ID: <3C6E9B11.9D79CF21@videotron.ca>  G > > startup disk as online but not as mounted. Can I simply put a mountnD > > command in the systartup_vms.com file? Or is there a more subtle > > incantation needed?   C MOUNT/SYSTEM is your friend. HELP MOUNT/SYSTEM is your best friend.   ! You need to know the volume name.r   something such as # $MOUNT/SYSTEM dka200 shimano $DISK2t   where dka200 is the device namel 	 shimano is the volume name; 	 $disk2 is the logical name created to point to that drives  K If you are in a cluster, it gets a bit juicier. you can add /CLUSTER to thefI mount command to automatically mount your disk onto all the other cluster# members in one simple command.  J But your system will not automatically inherit mounted drives belonging toB other systems, you will need to mount them youserlf for that node.   You can use something like:i  ) $IF F$GETDVI("$1$DUA0","EXISTS") .NES. ""9 $THENr& $	MOUNT/SYSTEM $1$DUA0 MARINONI $DISK4 $ENDIF  M This lets you test whether a disk drive owned by another node is available on"
 your node.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 13:20:16 -0500s- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: PPP for TCPIP on VAX ?d, Message-ID: <3C6EA2D3.917C9DE1@videotron.ca>  M With Compaq in a state of limbo until its fate is decided by HP shareholders,eK would there be any chance that VMS engineers would release the code for thebH PPP interface to TCPIP software so that hobbyists could port it to VAX ?  N It woudldn't take much to just post the code to some unsupported directory andI let the hobbyists take it from there. Compaq wouldn't really need to knowiM about it. And once hobbysist have ported and tested it, perhaps the engineerseT could then integrate it into VAX-VMS before the last version of VAX-VMS is released.  L The availability of PPP on VAX would allow connectivity between PDAs and VMS to be developped for instance.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 16:30:31 GMT 0 From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com>  Subject: Proposal - Hobbyist FAQ+ Message-ID: <3C6E8915.9AEF35D5@mailbag.com>    Hello,  A Reading Mark Reddings experiences and pondering my own trials and C tribulations as a Vax and VMS hobbyist/newby, I got to wondering ifqH maybe the time isn't ripe for a Hobbyist specific FAQ. While much of theF information that the Hobbyist needs is available in places like Hoff'sF OpenVMS FAQ, there are still some headaches and gotchas that should be addressed some place.   F There is a short FAQ at http://www.montagar.com/hobbyist/faq.html thatG would be a good place to start. Other things I'd like to see mentioned:V  E 1) pointers to basic user tutorials - several good ones exist, but isoH there a basic tutorial on the VMS HELP system? It's a great and powerfulE system, but in it's own way it can be just as cryptic as the Unix man6F system. Also pointers to various programming resources would be good -G like the link to the Bliss for C programmers document that was recentlynH posted or a tutorial on how to use Forms (since it's on the hobbyist PAKD list.) A pointer to the fact that a single user developer version ofD Oracle Rdb for both VAX and Alpha is available for download from the. Oracle Technical Net for a free registration.   A 2) pointers to what hardware documentation exists - trying to putoE together an uptodate list of known good CD-ROM drives would be a nicenH thing. A listing of the basic information about common hobbyist machinesH - the VAX stations, the MVs, the various Alpha workstations - would alsoC be good. Most of the information is scattered all over creation anddE seems to concentrate on the bigger systems. A reminder that a Vax canoD sit on a desktop and not need a basement might not be out of place. F Much of the good hardware information on the web has been put togetherG by the NetBSD folks and there emphasis and needs are different from thea
 VMS hobbyist.s  E 3) basic system management - for example how to create a user accountmH that has sufficient privileges to mount a cd without having to log in asF system. Not being VMS savvy I'm still not sure if I have that right. AB tutorial on how to set logical names for foreign executables (i.e.G Unzip) in the login.com. A tutorial on how to use Backup, especially ifpG all you have is a second disk and no tape device or how to do a restore F of a non-image saveset to it's original directory structure. A listingG of _what_ all the software is that is available on the layered products1H PAKS - while all the VMS experienced folks may know what ACMS or GKS is,F it took me much searching of Compaq's web site to determine what those software packages were.   E I'm sure there are other things that would be of use to the Hobbyist.n Anyone have any suggestions?    G I'll start pulling together what I can find - in the meantime, any helpoG that could be posted here would be greatly appreciated. Perhaps by nextiH Saturday, I can post at least an outline of the questions that should be	 answered.   C Hoff - if we were to get something like this together, would you belG willing to add it as another section to the OpenVMS FAQ or host it as ao separate FAQ at Compaq?C   William F (who probably is getting in _way_ over his head, but what the heck...) -- a* You better watch out    What you wish for;+ It better be worth it   So much to die for.--                                 Courtney Love8   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 18:42:38 GMTH2 From: "Stephen Fuld" <s.fuld.pleaseremove@att.net>Y Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The  demise       of yG Message-ID: <yKxb8.25353$Nv5.721800@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>g  5 "Jeff Kenton" <JeffKenton@attbi.com> wrote in messageg# news:3C6E87A1.260E5D93@attbi.com...c% > greenaum@BOLLOCKSyahoo.co.uk wrote:S > >0 > ...m > >1B > > Do you give much credence to the idea that language shapes theD > > thoughts that are possible? I think it's true, there are certainJ > > things that the French don't really have a way of saying, and IME justF > > don't talk about. Similarly German is blessed with dozens of words > > like Angst and Weltschmerz.o > >o >t3 > Boy, we're way off topic here, but what the heck:s    L Yes, but it doesn't have to be.  Think of computer languages.  Certainly theA ones you know influence the way you think about solving problems.   G As an example, I used to teach Fortran to people who already knew COBOLoL (Yes, it was a long time ago).  In COBOL, there is a "Perform" verb which isK sort of like an internal procedure call but with all the variables visible.eI It essentially transfers control to code at some label, executes the code F until the next label then returns.  This encouraged a style that said,J essentially "If something is true, go perform code to handle that." So theL code to handle the situation had to be physically removed from the mainline.  I In contrast, most Fortrans of the time, didn't have such a construct, but I had conditional if statements where the conditionally performed statementyI could be a goto.  This encouraged a style like "if something is NOT true, I goto around the code that handled it", followed immediately by that code.a  J It was sometimes hard to get the programmers to realize the difference andI change accordingly and led to very different looking programs.  COBOL had0J the main stuff together with lots of small to moderate sized pieces later,I wheras Fortran tended to have the code in one larger "inline" chunk, withn the logic in line.  I And these were fairly similar - procedural - languages.   Consider peoplehH who only know say lisp or forth and think about how they solve problems.   --  - Stephen Fuld.+    e-mail address disguised to prevent spam    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 16:24:07 GMTs( From: Jeff Kenton <JeffKenton@attbi.com>Y Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise       of  i) Message-ID: <3C6E87A1.260E5D93@attbi.com>u  # greenaum@BOLLOCKSyahoo.co.uk wrote:m >  	... > @ > Do you give much credence to the idea that language shapes theB > thoughts that are possible? I think it's true, there are certainH > things that the French don't really have a way of saying, and IME justD > don't talk about. Similarly German is blessed with dozens of words > like Angst and Weltschmerz.y >   1 Boy, we're way off topic here, but what the heck:/  N The book "Language, Thought & Reality" by Benjamin Lee Whorf (MIT Press, 1956)I proposed this a long time ago.  He has an interesting discussion of Hopi, I claiming that they have no words for "the present", so that everything ishN either in/continuing from the past, or in/going into the future.  Might affectH your view of the world to think in Hopi if it's so (it's been disputed).   -- a  I ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I =    Jeff Kenton      30 years of consulting and software development   =eI =                     http://home.attbi.com/~jeffkenton                 =-I -------------------------------------------------------------------------2   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 13:31:10 +0100:/ From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>tJ Subject: Re: Swiss ADSL - Any success with green.ch ADSL? Feedback please.4 Message-ID: <VA.00000538.3ca6b51d@bluewin.delete.ch>  H In article <3C66EF91.2E800BC4@firstdbasource.com>, Michael Austin wrote: > Paul Sture wrote:d > >  > > Hoi zusamme! > > G > > I have just wasted a lot of time and money (2 Sfr per minute on theeI > > support line) trying to get my ADSL connection working. It fails withiC > > an authentication error and the support guy finally suggested a D > > hardware problem, either with the ADSL box or the Swisscom line. > > F > > Has anyone out there had success with green.ch, or should I simply. > > cancel the contract and send the kit back? > >  >  > Definately off topic... :) D > E Yes, except one of the aims is to put another VMS box on the 'net :-)t  I > Make sure it is an Ethernet modem and get a DSL/Cable-ready Router/Hub.oJ > the username/password will be entered in the PPPoE config. I am not sure> > how the telco service/protocols work in Switzerland, but try> > username@providersdomain.{com|net}  (ie.  myname@myisp.com ) > / > What platform, software, modem are you using?a > I Zyxel ADSL router. VMS, Linux and NT all talk to it successfully, but it    won't talk to the outside world. ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland-   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 17:57:54 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>tJ Subject: Re: Swiss ADSL - Any success with green.ch ADSL? Feedback please.4 Message-ID: <VA.0000053b.3d9aeb18@bluewin.delete.ch>  H In article <3C66EF91.2E800BC4@firstdbasource.com>, Michael Austin wrote: > Paul Sture wrote:  > >  > > Hoi zusamme! > > G > > I have just wasted a lot of time and money (2 Sfr per minute on theeI > > support line) trying to get my ADSL connection working. It fails with C > > an authentication error and the support guy finally suggested aiD > > hardware problem, either with the ADSL box or the Swisscom line. > > F > > Has anyone out there had success with green.ch, or should I simply. > > cancel the contract and send the kit back? > >  >  > Definately off topic... :) 1 > I > Make sure it is an Ethernet modem and get a DSL/Cable-ready Router/Hub.jJ > the username/password will be entered in the PPPoE config. I am not sure> > how the telco service/protocols work in Switzerland, but try> > username@providersdomain.{com|net}  (ie.  myname@myisp.com ) > / > What platform, software, modem are you using?n > H It's now working. I deleted the config and started from scratch. Now to ? work on the router filters before I open it up to the world :-)t ___O
 Paul Sture Switzerlando   ------------------------------  , Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:06:12 -0200 (BRST) From: valdemir-@uol.com.br) Subject: Using Edit inside a procedure...y6 Message-ID: <200202161306.LAA01603@walters.uol.com.br>  5 How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:t   vax1> type x.com       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COMm       $ EXIT  2 When I execute this procedure, I get this message:  / Change mode can be entered only from a terminal       	 Thanks...a   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:01:00 +0100h/ From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>o- Subject: Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...i4 Message-ID: <VA.00000539.3cf8f536@bluewin.delete.ch>  > In article <200202161306.LAA01603@walters.uol.com.br>,  wrote:7 > How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:- >  > vax1> type x.com >       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COMs >       $ EXIT > 4 > When I execute this procedure, I get this message: > 1 > Change mode can be entered only from a terminalK >OA That's the message you get if you do a SET MODE CHANGE in an EDT e! initialization file (EDTINI.EDT).    Trye  "  $ EDIT /READ /NOCOMMAND LOGIN.COM  DD If OTOH, you want to use the procedure to launch EDT in interactive E mode so that you can see and maybe type into it during the procedure P try   %  $ DEFINE /USER SYS$INPUT SYS$COMMANDl"  $ EDIT /READ LOGIN.COM /NOCOMMAND  H If you give us a more detailed explanation of what you are tying to do,  that would help.   ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:22:25 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>?- Subject: Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...d4 Message-ID: <VA.0000053a.3d0c8eef@bluewin.delete.ch>   Sorry - got the last bit wrong:r  F In article <VA.00000539.3cf8f536@bluewin.delete.ch>, Paul Sture wrote:@ > In article <200202161306.LAA01603@walters.uol.com.br>,  wrote:9 > > How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:  > >  > > vax1> type x.com > >       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COM, > >       $ EXIT > > 6 > > When I execute this procedure, I get this message: > > 3 > > Change mode can be entered only from a terminal  > >9C > That's the message you get if you do a SET MODE CHANGE in an EDT p# > initialization file (EDTINI.EDT).n >  > Tryt > $ >  $ EDIT /READ /NOCOMMAND LOGIN.COM >  eF > If OTOH, you want to use the procedure to launch EDT in interactive G > mode so that you can see and maybe type into it during the procedure s > try  > ' >  $ DEFINE /USER SYS$INPUT SYS$COMMAND($ >  $ EDIT /READ LOGIN.COM /NOCOMMAND   This should read:d  &   $ DEFINE /USER SYS$INPUT SYS$COMMAND.   $ EDIT /READ LOGIN.COM /COMMAND=YOURFILE.EDT   = And then YOURFILE.EDT _can_ contain a SET MODE CHANGE command      > J > If you give us a more detailed explanation of what you are tying to do,  > that would help. >    ___o
 Paul Sture Switzerlands   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 09:04:20 +0000k0 From: Mark W J Redding <grawlfang@ukhackers.net>+ Subject: Re: Very Very Slow Telnet (SOLVED)i- Message-ID: <3C6E2094.51231CB7@ukhackers.net>    Freddy,r   Frederik Meerwaldt wrote:o  
 > Hi Mark, >e; > there were many Probs in 5.0 - I advice to upgrade to 5.1 F > Try setting your TERM on your Linux Box to something which is known: > ( > [root@blah]# TERM="vt100"; export TERM >iI > This was the workaround for one bug, but actually I don't think this isB0 > your problem as the ping takes very long, too. >t > Greetings - Freddy  J And this solved it...I'd previously had  TERM set to "xterm" !!!!!!!!!!!!!  
 Thank you,   -- Mark W J Redding  F Chaos reigns within.  Reflect, repent and reboot.  Order shall return.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 08:09:02 +0000u0 From: Mark W J Redding <grawlfang@ukhackers.net># Subject: Re: Very Very Slow Telnet.a- Message-ID: <3C6E139E.CC377253@ukhackers.net>t   Michael Austin wrote:   F > on the PC do a tracert (traceroute) to the VAX.  What is the default > gateway?  What version TCPIP?i  & The version of TCPIP on the VAX is 5.0A The default gateway on the VAX was set to the IP of the Linux boxnL (192.168.2.2), and whcn booted into Win98 the IP of the PC was 192.168.2.1 .F I thought this may be a factor so changed the IP when running Linux toA 182.168.2.1 and 'unconfigured; ROUTE on UCX (But didn't restart).      >t > H > I run 7.2-1 on my Alpha 2100's, Caldera Linux 2.3 with a hub connectedE > to a router/hub to ADSL modem.. I actually have 6 systems connectedsE > (although spaceheater #2, I mean the second Alpha, is powered down) E > (2 Linux, 2 Windows98/ME and when the airconditioning is set really I > cold, 2 Alphas.)  Pretty slick... I use reflections and Pathworks32 for G > emulators on the PC, and command-line telnet on the Linux boxes.  Thet& > Linux boxes are Pent-133 and 166Mhz.  H Nice...This also implies that there is nothing inherently wrong with theG comms twix Linux and VMS. What version of the Linux kernel do you run ?m   -- Mark W J Redding  F Chaos reigns within.  Reflect, repent and reboot.  Order shall return.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 09:44:50 +0100w/ From: Frederik Meerwaldt <frederik@freddym.org> # Subject: Re: Very Very Slow Telnet.$/ Message-ID: <a4l65e$s1v$04$1@news.t-online.com>O   Hi Mark,  9 there were many Probs in 5.0 - I advice to upgrade to 5.1aD Try setting your TERM on your Linux Box to something which is known:  & [root@blah]# TERM="vt100"; export TERM  G This was the workaround for one bug, but actually I don't think this is . your problem as the ping takes very long, too.   Greetings - Freddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 08:57:58 +0000 0 From: Mark W J Redding <grawlfang@ukhackers.net># Subject: Re: Very Very Slow Telnet. - Message-ID: <3C6E1F16.AF90A7B2@ukhackers.net>o   Mark W J Redding wrote:X  8 I've also tried a tcpdump when I've telnet'ed to the VAX  
 The output ->o   ... I 08:54:16.151892 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2238:2244(6) ack 
 4104 win 4369nJ 08:54:16.151944 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4104:4115(11) ack 2244 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.154894 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2244:2250(6) ackw
 4115 win 4369eJ 08:54:16.155424 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4115:4126(11) ack 2250 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.157979 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2250:2256(6) ack>
 4126 win 4369oJ 08:54:16.158031 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4126:4137(11) ack 2256 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.160952 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2256:2262(6) ackt
 4137 win 4369oJ 08:54:16.161000 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4137:4148(11) ack 2262 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.165877 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2262:2268(6) acke
 4148 win 4369dJ 08:54:16.165932 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4148:4159(11) ack 2268 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.168877 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2268:2274(6) ackk
 4159 win 4369nJ 08:54:16.168930 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4159:4170(11) ack 2274 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.171886 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2274:2280(6) ackt
 4170 win 4369 J 08:54:16.171935 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4170:4181(11) ack 2280 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10]I 08:54:16.174874 isis.egypt.telnet > 192.168.2.1.33845: P 2280:2286(6) ack 
 4181 win 4369 J 08:54:16.175540 192.168.2.1.33845 > isis.egypt.telnet: P 4181:4192(11) ack 2286 win 13936 (DF) [tos 0x10] ...f    _ flash up the screen as fasr as they can...When I logout of the VAX the output stops completely.e   -- Mark W J Redding  F Chaos reigns within.  Reflect, repent and reboot.  Order shall return.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:55:58 -0500i( From: Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> Subject: VXT2000A Message-ID: <20020216115212.A3512-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu>   C I have recently become the proud(?) owner of a VXT2000+ X-terminal.nA I had no problem finding the software to boot on it.  However, itaC appears to have a video connector I have never before seen on a DECp@ box.  Is there any chance anyone here has one clutering up their@ office that they would like to get rid of??  Is there any chanceA there is actually one that connects this box to an SVGA MultiSync-B monitor??  I didn't think so, but in any case, I have some old DEC+ monitors here, if I can just find a cable!!    Any help appreciated.    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |> Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 13:06:00 -0500l+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> 6 Subject: RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS?T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4016CEA84@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  $ >>> Or would that be MVS and NSK ?<<  " Well, if we wanted to be picky :-)  ? Actually, MVS is a 31 bit OS and NSK is a 32 bit OS on 64bit HWe   :-)n   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultante Compaq Canada Corp.n Professional Serviceso Voice: 613-592-4660d Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----4 From: Larry Kilgallen [mailto:Kilgallen@SpamCop.net] Sent: February 15, 2002 1:49 PMt To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comu6 Subject: RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS?    
 In articleH <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4016CEA74@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>/ , "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes:  >=20A >>>> It's ok, Kerry.  There are no children present.  You can say  > _Microsoft_.<< >=20G > Well, actually I meant all 32bit server OS's since there are a number- of > them out there.e   Do you mean VAX VMS ?m   Or would that be MVS and NSK ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 19:31:56 +0100 ' From: "Luyen Tran" <l.v.tran@hccnet.nl> M Subject: With a littel help of ... to get process info at some remote node(s)J) Message-ID: <a4m861$28k$1@news.hccnet.nl>s   > Hi,. >EL > Can someone tell me how to obtain information about a process running on a > remote VAX node.H > DEC Ada provides 2 system service routines to presumely get this done,! > namely Process_Scan and GetJPI.e( > But I somehow won't succeed, does you?F > Any help to direct me in the right direction is greatly appreciated.	 > Cheers!i   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 14:03:33 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>eQ Subject: Re: With a littel help of ... to get process info at some remote node(s)t, Message-ID: <3C6EAD04.FA43D8FE@videotron.ca>   Luyen Tran wrote:sN > > Can someone tell me how to obtain information about a process running on a > > remote VAX node.J > > DEC Ada provides 2 system service routines to presumely get this done,# > > namely Process_Scan and GetJPI.v  N This only works for clusters. If the two nodes are just linked with decnet, it won't work.   L Also, your process needs WORLD privilege to get list of processes outside of your username.  F This is a bit of code I had from a previous life (about 11 years ago):    5 globaldef struct proc_list_desc { char  username[13];n.                                   short mode ;!                                 }tH                                    *process_table , *process_table_curr;     int found ;c int status ; unsigned long pidctx ;   long my_mode ; o char my_username[13];e long temp, temp2 ;  " struct items_desc GETJPI_items[] =4                         {4,JPI$_MODE,&my_mode,&temp,>                          12,JPI$_USERNAME,&my_username,&temp2,#                          0,0,0,0} ;t  % struct { unsigned short item_length ;z!          unsigned short buf_code;n          unsigned long  value;$          unsigned long  item_flag; }"                 PROCSCAN_items[] =E                         {0,PSCAN$_MODE,JPI$K_INTERACTIVE,PSCAN$M_EQL,p:                          0,PSCAN$_NODE_CSID,0,PSCAN$M_NEQ,#                          0,0,0,0} ;g      B     process_table_size = 0 ;               /*declared extrenally*/B     process_table_curr = process_table ;   /*declared externally*/    H /** first, clear the event flag which caused this routine to execute **/  /         status = SYS$CLREF(update_table_event);m  I /** next, set the timer so that flag is set again in max_elapsed time **/c  I         status = SYS$SETIMR (update_table_event,&max_elapsed_bin,0,0,0) ;    /** now, do the real work ! **/   5   status = SYS$PROCESS_SCAN(&pidctx,&PROCSCAN_items);g   if (status != SS$_NORMAL)aO         { printf("IM-USR-UPDATE-> PROCESS_SCAN Error / Status = %d\n", status);e           pidctx = -1 ;y	         }h  found = FALSE ;   status = SS$_NORMAL ;a  "  while (status != SS$_NOMOREPROC)    {f9    /* get the next process information from the system */a  ;    status = SYS$GETJPIW(0,&pidctx,0,&GETJPI_items,0,0,0);  w     ?    if ((status != SS$_NOMOREPROC)  && (my_username[0] != 0x00))o$         {   my_username[12] = 0x00 ;>             strcpy(process_table_curr->username,&my_username);2             process_table_curr->mode = my_mode ;  =             if(!strcmp(my_username,username)) found  = TRUE ; 5             if(process_table_size < my_MAXPROCESSCNT) '               { process_table_curr ++ ;t'                 process_table_size ++ ;                }-,             else { status = SS$_NOMOREPROC ;Y                    im_log_text("WARNING: found more processes than expected (IM-USR)",0);0                  }	         }u  }  /* end of while */      return(found);S   } /* end of lookup_update */   ------------------------------  + Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 10:48:09 +0000 (UTC)a" From: greenaum@BOLLOCKSyahoo.co.uk( Subject: Re: [off-topic] eighty et al...5 Message-ID: <3c7c37de.643579731@news.btopenworld.com>j  B On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 23:19:30 GMT, junkmail@moreira.mv.com (Alberto Moreira) sprachen:  G >"What do you know, get out of my way, I want to get through. The samba C >is lively, I want to dance. That samba is sort of a half maracatu,rG >it's the samba of old black men, it's the samba of the black man. WhathE >do you know, such a cool samba, you'll not want to see me getting ton >the end of it. "?  8 Is that the whole song? Still I suppose there's a lot of9 aaaaa-eeeee-aaa-iiiiiiiii-ooooooo to fill the rest of it.   E Thanks a lot, I've always wondered what it meant, I've got the Sergiob! Mendes and Brasil 66 version too.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  H if love is a drug, then, ideally, it's a healing, healthful drug... it's@ kind of like prozac is supposed to work (without the sexual side5 effects and long-term damage to the brain and psyche)l   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.092 ************************rland-   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 17:57:54 +0100 / FrS    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S     S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    	S    
S    S    S    
S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S     S    !S    "S    #S    $S    %S    &S    'S    (S    )S    *S    +S    ,S    -S    .S    /S    0S    1S    2S    3S    4S    5S    6S    7S    8S    9S    :S    ;S    <S    =S    >S    ?S    @S    AS    BS    CS    DS    ES    FS    GS    HS    IS    JS    KS    LS    MS    NS    OS    PS    QS    RS    SS    TS    US    VS    WS    XS    YS    ZS    [S    \S    ]S    ^S    _S    `S    aS    bS    cS    dS    eS    fS    gS    hS    iS    jS    kS    lS    mS    nS    oS    pS    qS    rS    sS    tS    uS    vS    wS    xS    yS    zS    {S    |S    }S    ~S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    S    