0 INFO-VAX	Sun, 17 Feb 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 94      Contents: Re: "Crashless Windows"  Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL  Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL  Re: C-Kermit & HTTP retrieve Re: C-Kermit & HTTP retrieve Re: Containers and Compaq $ Re: Decamds and Availability manager Free News Server?  Re: Free News Server?  Re: Free News Server?  Re: Free News Server?  Re: Free News Server?  Re: Free News Server?  Re: Free News Server? ? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? ? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? ? Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies? 	 IPO ALERT   Re: MIME Compliant Mail from VMS Re: Mount disk at startup?# OT: Humour - Capitalism Enron style & Re: OT: Proliant DL and DS-10 cabinets Re: PPP for TCPIP on VAX ? Re: Proposal - Hobbyist FAQ  Re: Search Logical using CRELNM  Search Logical using CRELNM 5 Re: Security for VMS systems visable to the  Internet 5 Re: Security for VMS systems visable to the  Internet 5 Re: Security for VMS systems visable to the  Internet P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise       of  P Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise       of  . Re: The stupidity of granting software patents$ Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...$ Re: Using Edit inside a procedure... Re: VXT2000  Re: VXT2000 - RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS? - RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS? 6 Re: Where does VMS fit in here? (Was Re: HP admits...)P Re: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise    of      comP Re: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      compaq  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 16 Feb 2002 23:32:04 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>  Subject: Re: "Crashless Windows"- Message-ID: <87n0y9tpcb.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   3 "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:   D > Hhmmm... Personally, outside of the desktop, I never saw that muchE > overlap between the Q and HP. What in the HP line corresponds to or B > competes with the rack-mount Proliant servers we find in so many > datacenters in America?   A Netserver LXs. SCA SCSI shelves, quad PP200s, 1Gb. I'm tempted to  retire my Pryoris...   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 14:58:27 +0100 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> ( Subject: Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL( Message-ID: <3C6FB703.E9D926D@gtech.com>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:C > > However, in order for a new operating system to gain widespread H > > acceptance as a general-purpose computing platform, it seems that it2 > > probably needs to be written in C or C++.  :-( > E > How does the operating system implementation language have anything @ > to do with languages chosen by users of the operating system ?   It does not.  < But if you want to get a large number of people to work on a= new free operating system, then C/C++ is typical the language @ those people would have experience with and prefer to work with.7 The Linux/GNU/Apache etc. people are used to C and C++.    Arne   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 10:52:51 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ( Subject: Re: BLISS for C Programmers URL3 Message-ID: <AJ80uOWHzQjL@eisner.encompasserve.org>   h In article <3C6FB703.E9D926D@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes: > Larry Kilgallen wrote:D >> > However, in order for a new operating system to gain widespreadI >> > acceptance as a general-purpose computing platform, it seems that it 3 >> > probably needs to be written in C or C++.  :-(  >>  F >> How does the operating system implementation language have anythingA >> to do with languages chosen by users of the operating system ?  >  > It does not. > > > But if you want to get a large number of people to work on a? > new free operating system, then C/C++ is typical the language B > those people would have experience with and prefer to work with.9 > The Linux/GNU/Apache etc. people are used to C and C++.   < I don't want to run software written by people who only know3 one language and are incapable of learning another.   @ I also do not want to run software whose implementation language& was not chosen for reasons of quality.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 15:03:12 +0100 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> % Subject: Re: C-Kermit & HTTP retrieve ) Message-ID: <3C6FB820.55FFD6FF@gtech.com>    JF Mezei wrote: J > Much simpler and quicker than kermit for that purpose. Note however thatF > kermit is still needed when you need to send POST type transactions.  $ POST requests is not that difficult.  5 ftp://ftp.hhs.dk/pub/vms/cgi/postaction.c actually do  send POST requests.   5 It only fetches text, but it would be simple to merge ! some binary file stuff into that.    Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 15:27:27 +0100 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> % Subject: Re: C-Kermit & HTTP retrieve & Message-ID: <3C6FBDCF.88257A0@aaa.com>   Sorry Arne :-)  G 550 No access to [PUB.VMS.CGI]POSTACTION.C. Requested action not taken.    Jan-Erik Sderholm.      Arne Vajhj wrote: >  > & > POST requests is not that difficult. > 7 > ftp://ftp.hhs.dk/pub/vms/cgi/postaction.c actually do  > send POST requests.  >  > Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:12:06 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> " Subject: Re: Containers and Compaq' Message-ID: <3C6FE5BE.4F671E68@fsi.net>    JF Mezei wrote:  > [snip]O > Perhaps that is what Curly and Carly really intend to do. sell the same boxes L > as Dell, but diffentiate themselves by the breath of services they provide2 > around the standard vanilla box (the container). > O > And you know, once the infrastructure is developped around that standard (the I > container ships, the container railway cars, etc etc), it becomes quite J > difficult to change that standard. (perhaps that is why IA64 will fail).  G The question I gotta ask is: is Q still using their blasted proprietary F hardware mounts? The Deskpro I have at work has the CD-ROM drive looseC inside the chassis because even though it (CD-ROM) was ordered from E Compaq, the Q failed to ship the necessary mounting hardware with it. 0 (Scotch tape still works wonders - for a while.)   *SIGH*   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:05:37 +0000 1 From: Steve Reece <SYSTEM@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk> - Subject: Re: Decamds and Availability manager 6 Message-ID: <3C6FE2E1.700BE9ED@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>   Carl, D Your comments are spookily similar to comments that I made to CompaqG here in the UK a few years back with a problem related to DCPS v1.3 (or  1.4) and UCX v4.1.  C The response I got was that the CSC do not look deep into the crash F dumps unless there is diagnosis required for something like a hardwareE problem.  For crashes that are in the database as known footprints or @ very similar to known footprints there will be little crash dumpB analysis carried out over and above that required to determine the
 footprint.  D In other words, if it looks like something that they've already seenE then the dump gets forgotten and the existing solution recommendation D gets recommended to the customer.  If the customer says "NO!  I wantG more information!" then the answer is "that is up to you sir, but we've  given you a solution so JFDI".   Steve.   Carl Karcher wrote:  > = > In a previous article, "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote:  > ->L > ->Our GS140 w VMS 7.2-1 began crashing daily after we installed a batch ofM > ->important Fibre Channel related ECOs.  Compaq support said it is probably L > ->DECAMDS and that installing the new DECAMDS  **and/or**   AVAIL_MAN kits > ->should fix the problem.  > I > "Probably DECAMDS?" If they said this after actually looking at a valid H > crash dump then that's not acceptable. They should be able to tell you= > exactly why the system crashed (that's been my experience).  > A > Granted, you should have the latest AMDS073B kit as others have  > recommended. > I > -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madison 2 > --                      karcher@waisman.wisc.edu   --  G "A shadow fell over her face; clear, as if the composure were rent like E a veil.  And her lips parted, but only with a short intake of breath. A Then she said, 'Well, then you are right.  Indeed, we are even.'" % 		Louis, "Interview with the Vampire"    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 09:54:42 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>  Subject: Free News Server?4 Message-ID: <VA.0000053e.4106e3fe@bluewin.delete.ch>   Hi good folks,  F I recall someone telling of a free news server here recently, IIRC in H Germany. I can't get Google to spit forth on the subject, so assistance  would be appreciated.    TIA. ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 10:38:10 +0100 2 From: "Thomas H. Pauli" <thomaspauli@arcormail.de> Subject: Re: Free News Server?) Message-ID: <3C6F7A02.60205@arcormail.de>    Hi Paul,  & occaionally I use news.uni-mannheim.de   Thomas   Paul Sture wrote:    > Hi good folks, > H > I recall someone telling of a free news server here recently, IIRC in J > Germany. I can't get Google to spit forth on the subject, so assistance  > would be appreciated.  >  > TIA. > ___  > Paul Sture
 > Switzerland  >  >      --  9 Thomas H. Pauli, Hammersteinstr.19, 14199 Berlin, Germany    ------------------------------   Date: 17 Feb 2002 10:15:31 GMT) From: leslie@clio.rice.edu (Jerry Leslie)  Subject: Re: Free News Server?' Message-ID: <a4nvs3$n0f$1@joe.rice.edu>   0 Paul Sture (paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch) wrote:H : I recall someone telling of a free news server here recently, IIRC in J : Germany. I can't get Google to spit forth on the subject, so assistance  : would be appreciated.   *    http://news.cis.dfn.de/en/register.html"    Registration at News.CIS.DFN.DE  4 --Jerry Leslie     (my opinions are strictly my own)   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 13:05:01 GMT 1 From: CSABA  HARANGOZO   <csabah@zipworld.com.au>  Subject: Re: Free News Server?3 Message-ID: <1UNb8.35$j7.4946@nasal.pacific.net.au>   0 Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> wrote: > Hi good folks,  H > I recall someone telling of a free news server here recently, IIRC in J > Germany. I can't get Google to spit forth on the subject, so assistance  > would be appreciated.   1 	http://www.webring.org/cgi-bin/webring?ring=nntp    						Cheers,    Csaba  I    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- E    * Csaba I. Harangozo     |    'To err is human', said the hedgehog E    * csabah@zipworld.com.au |           as he dismounted a wirebrush. I    ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ;    EARTH::AUSTRALIA:[SYDNEY]HARANGOZO.CSABA;1, delete? [N]:    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 13:54:00 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>  Subject: Re: Free News Server?4 Message-ID: <VA.0000053f.41e1f7ff@bluewin.delete.ch>  @ In article <3C6F7A02.60205@arcormail.de>, Thomas H. Pauli wrote:
 > Hi Paul, > ( > occaionally I use news.uni-mannheim.de >  > Thomas >  Many thanks. ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 19:48:35 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Re: Free News Server?- Message-ID: <87adu8tjl8.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   1 Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> writes:   D > I recall someone telling of a free news server here recently, IIRC
 > in Germany.   F That was probably newscache1.freenet.de. From memory, 2 and 3 exist as well.   F > I can't get Google to spit forth on the subject, so assistance would > be appreciated.   F The words of power are "NNTP server open" ;) That should return a list> of open and public servers. Look for one you can post through.  E In addition to freenet, there is a US server that is pretty good, but 2 I do not have the details. Also ccnews.thu.edu.tw.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 14:53:35 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>  Subject: Re: Free News Server?4 Message-ID: <VA.00000541.42188546@bluewin.delete.ch>  K In article <1UNb8.35$j7.4946@nasal.pacific.net.au>, Csaba  Harangozo wrote: 2 > Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> wrote: > > Hi good folks, > J > > I recall someone telling of a free news server here recently, IIRC in L > > Germany. I can't get Google to spit forth on the subject, so assistance  > > would be appreciated.  > 3 >  http://www.webring.org/cgi-bin/webring?ring=nntp  > K Now that is a good one :-) I'll note that registration for News.CIS.DFN.DE  H is processed manually on working days only (applied for but I won't get J access today) and wants a non-munged email addresses in postings (it does & suggest ways to avoid spam from this). ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 09:54:42 +0100 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> H Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?4 Message-ID: <VA.0000053c.4106e3e0@bluewin.delete.ch>  D In article <LMEKq+LifbvC@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Rob Young wrote:   [snip] > : >  You should not break out each and every division within? >  a company or your competition knows just how strong you are, A >  what your growth is year to year allowing them to adjust their ? >  strategy.  It is not uncommon in this industry and others to E >  put out false information in the hopes your competitors will spend ; >  resources (in the end money) on wrong ideas, directions.  > D Oh boy you've got me a-wishing that VMS is the ace up the sleeve :-) ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 16:04:37 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> H Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?- Message-ID: <pwQb8.1745$lG.51@news2.bloor.is>   5 "Bill Gunshannon" <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote in message ; news:20020216114359.T3512-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu... & > On Fri, 15 Feb 2002, JF Mezei wrote: >  > Correct me if I'm wrong, but: ( >    HP needs more than 66% "yes" votes.I >    The "H" and "P" families control 18% that is definitely voting "no". ( >    All unvoted stock counts as a "no". > G > Based on this simple bit of info, it merely takes 15% of the stock to J > remain unvoted for the deal to fall.  I would imagine there is that muchG > in the hands of little old ladies who wouldn't know a proxy if it bit  them. H > And surely the "H" and "P" families have enough influence in among theJ > people who are likely to be holding more than single shares to garner at) > least a few more percent to their side.  >   H Shares which are directly held by people, ie. in a non-margin account atI their broker, in their safety deposit box, under their mattress, or in an F account type that does not have a trustee of one sort or another,  areE probably the only shares which have the possibility of being unvoted.   K Any shares held under professional management (ie. a mutual fund, a managed G account, by a trustee, or in a margin account) are required to be voted2H under the terms of the trust, management agreement, etc... under pain ofJ breach of fiduciary duty. That doesn't mean that the vote has to be 'YES',& but simply that they have to be voted.  K That's why you have to tell your pension fund manager, mutual fund company, L broker corporate actions dept., etc... that the shares they own in-trust forK your retirement, etc..should be voted 'NO' if you have the option to direct K how they should be voted, otherwise the fund manager will vote the way theya want to.  L Just a note about margin accounts at stock brokers - you've 'borrowed' moneyL from your broker when you have stock in a margin account, and the broker hasL the stock as collateral for the loan. Unless you explicitly tell them how toD vote it, they will vote the shares the way they see fit. Some marginL agreements in some jurisdictions may deny you the right to vote the stock in2 favor of the brokerage firm's view on how to vote.  L Even if you don't have the option to direct a specific number of votes, it'sL worth while to send them a letter expressing how you think they SHOULD vote.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 12:43:52 -0500e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>pH Subject: Re: Hello Compaq!  What happens to us VMS users if Itanic dies?+ Message-ID: <3C6FEBD7.34B52F6@videotron.ca>2   John Smith wrote:EM > your retirement, etc..should be voted 'NO' if you have the option to directfM > how they should be voted, otherwise the fund manager will vote the way theye
 > want to.  L Says a lot about Compaq when people say they should urge HP not to be bogged down with Compaq.   M Remember when Compaq announced it would buy Digital ? At the time, Compaq was-L seen as a winner, capable of marketing and there were high hopes that CompaqL would be able to fix Digital's disease (marketing). And indeed, the first adM in the magazines (the gas pumps) showed "VMS" (not openVMS) in big letters, afT sign that Compaq's agency knew what customers wanted. Compaq was to be VMS' saviour.  N Alas Compaq made a big mistake and adopted Digital's old marketing company and= things went downhill from there, pulling Compaq down with it.   L Now, if HP is smart enough, it will dump 100% of Compaq's marketing dept andB agencies to ensure that the disease doesn't get transmitted to HP.   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 16:09:37 -0000* From: "Mag Net News" <MAG@lb.bcentral.com> Subject: IPO ALERT( Message-ID: <1013962177.39385.qmail@ech>  C Adult Entertainment Company, Jade Entertainment Group Announces IPOeJ MELVILLE, N.Y....Jade Entertainment Group, Inc. Is Proud to Announce the =  Initial Public Offering of JENT.  J The company is offering 500,000 shares of common stock to the public. Int=J erested investors can Download the preliminary prospectus from the compan=3 y's corporate site at: http://www.jadegrp.com/ipo .   < ------------------------------------------------------------  J A registration statement relating to these securities has been filed with=J  the Securities and Exchange Commission but has not yet become effective.=J  These securities may not be sold nor may offers to buy be accepted prior=J  to the time the registration statement becomes Effective. This communica=J tion shall not constitute an offer to sell or the solicitation of an offe=J r to buy nor shall there be any sale of these securities in any jurisdict=J ion in which such offer, solicitation or sale would be unlawful prior to =J registration or qualification under the securities laws of such jurisdict= ion.  J No offer to buy the securities can be accepted and no part of the purchas=J e price can be received until the registration statement becomes effectiv=J e, and any such offer may be withdrawn and revoked without obligation or =J commitment of any kind, at any time prior to notice of its acceptance giv=J en after the effective date. An indication of interest in response to thi=H s advertisement will involve no obligation or commitment of any kind.=20    G _______________________________________________________________________  Powered by List Builderb To unsubscribe follow the link: J http://lb.bcentral.com/ex/manage/subscriberprefs?customerid=3D11414&subid= =3DBA86191F97A2E11D&msgnum=3D17g   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:42:34 +0000e1 From: Steve Reece <SYSTEM@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>N) Subject: Re: MIME Compliant Mail from VMS 5 Message-ID: <3C6FEB8A.1CA37E9@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>o  6 (Cross posts to groups other than comp.os.vms removed)   Peter Weaver wrote:a <trim> >oN > Of course others have already mentioned in this newsgroup that MCR MIME SHOWG > VERSION does not do what people who have VMS experience expect it to. I > Experienced people also expect to be able to do command line recall and:	 > editing  >P  0 So that would be like, erm, SYSGEN then....  :-) Steve.  z -- oG "A shadow fell over her face; clear, as if the composure were rent likeeE a veil.  And her lips parted, but only with a short intake of breath.cA Then she said, 'Well, then you are right.  Indeed, we are even.'"p% 		Louis, "Interview with the Vampire"e   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:07:20 GMTg1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>-# Subject: Re: Mount disk at startup? ' Message-ID: <3C6FE4A2.B5BB6513@fsi.net>a   David Froble wrote:= > [snip]C > Mount your disks as follows, either in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM, another H > command file invoked by SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM, or in subsequent batch jobsJ > that are part of system startup.  (Note, there are advantages to keepingE > SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM minimal, doing just what's required for a running F > system, and then doing the rest of the start-up processing in one orG > more batch jobs.  Of course, starting the batch queue will have to bee > done in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM.)v >  > $! Mount public disks here > $  > $ wso "  mount public disks") > $ mount /system /noassist DKA100: DISK1t > E > Note the /NOASSIST switch.  This is highly recommended.  Otherwise,aN > you'll need to hire operators 24 x 7 to assist with any mount problems.  :-) > G > Also define logical names for all disks.  Then reference the disks bycJ > the logical names.  This allows the physical disks to change, but for it$ > to be transparent to applications. >  > $! Define disk logical names > $i > $ wso "  define disk names"o$ > $ define /system /exec DISK0 DKA0:& > $ define /system /exec DISK1 DKA100:& > $ define /system /exec DISK2 DKA200:& > $ define /system /exec DISK3 DKA300:& > $ define /system /exec DISK4 DKA400:& > $ define /system /exec DISK5 DKA500:& > $ define /system /exec DISK6 DKA600:  / An explanation of "wso" might also be in order.n   -- a David J. Dachterac dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 09:54:42 +0100o/ From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch>u, Subject: OT: Humour - Capitalism Enron style4 Message-ID: <VA.0000053d.4106e3f4@bluewin.delete.ch>   This gem just arrived...   Big bucks in the bull market  H In case you were wondering how Enron came into so much trouble, here is F an explanation reputedly given by a Texas A&M professor to explain it ' in terms his students could understand.d  
 Capitalism You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull., Your herd multiplies, and the economy grows.' You sell them and retire on the income.a   Enron CapitalismB You have two cows. You sell three of them to your publicly listed F company, using letters of credit opened by your brother-in-law at the G bank, then execute a debt/equity swap with an associated general offer wH so that you get all four cows back, with a tax exemption for five cows. G The milk rights of the six cows are transferred via an intermediary to dH a Cayman Island company secretly owned by your CFO who sells the rights F to all seven cows back to your listed company. The annual report says 8 the company owns eight cows, with an option on six more.  D Now do you see why a company with $62 billion in assets is declaring bankruptcy?      ___ 
 Paul Sture Switzerlandn   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 01:50:02 -0800) From: P.Young@unsw.EDU.AU (Patrick Young)n/ Subject: Re: OT: Proliant DL and DS-10 cabinetsV< Message-ID: <55f85d77.0202170150.cdc0481@posting.google.com>  v Fabio Cardoso <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message news:<20020217012225.24625.qmail@web20205.mail.yahoo.com>...   ( > Alpha is (almost) DEAD !!!! You should1 > accept this, like VAX are dead for a long time.s* > I dont know why people insist on this...  8 Because there is nothing to replace it. Crapulence city!  : I'm looking at my 500Mhz Alpha here in my bedroom just now8 as I type this using it, VMS, and Mozilla (Yes Alpha is B bedroom(tm) compatible, up to you how you would interpret that :-)  @ Wondering what I will be replacing it with when that time comes.  ? It for sure won't be Window(tm). It might (must?) be on anotheriA processor ... AMD .... Maybe - needs VMS. Itanic (Intels A-hole?)    (sorry).  $ I could go on and rant, however  ---   (more than) Enuf said.   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 19:56:30 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com># Subject: Re: PPP for TCPIP on VAX ?w- Message-ID: <871yfktj81.fsf@prep.synonet.com>n  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:s  A > With Compaq in a state of limbo until its fate is decided by HP B > shareholders, would there be any chance that VMS engineers wouldB > release the code for the PPP interface to TCPIP software so that" > hobbyists could port it to VAX ?  = I am pretty sure that the PPPD et al code *has* been released @ somewhere... Now if someone :) can fill in the correwct value of 'somewhere' :) :)a     -- e< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.a@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:04:49 GMTu1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>e$ Subject: Re: Proposal - Hobbyist FAQ' Message-ID: <3C6FE409.30EE3630@fsi.net>.   William Barnett-Lewis wrote: >  > Hello, > C > Reading Mark Reddings experiences and pondering my own trials andsE > tribulations as a Vax and VMS hobbyist/newby, I got to wondering if J > maybe the time isn't ripe for a Hobbyist specific FAQ. While much of theH > information that the Hobbyist needs is available in places like Hoff'sH > OpenVMS FAQ, there are still some headaches and gotchas that should be > addressed some place.. > H > There is a short FAQ at http://www.montagar.com/hobbyist/faq.html thatI > would be a good place to start. Other things I'd like to see mentioned:g > G > 1) pointers to basic user tutorials - several good ones exist, but is 0 > there a basic tutorial on the VMS HELP system?  < Well, yeah, there sort of is. Problem: it's in HELP. Classic chicken-and-egg problem.  G Kinda like UN*X (Linux, *BSD, etc.). They tell you to read the manpages-C to learn about it and how to install it. That means to learn how toaC install it, you first must install it. Ya gotta unpack the manpagesi, before you can unpack the manpages before...   > It's a great and powerful-G > system, but in it's own way it can be just as cryptic as the Unix manI	 > system.A  G Yeah, I s'pose so. Perhaps the top-level "Topic?" prompt of HELP shouldu? include "Press CTRL+Z to exit HELP, or just press <RETURN>. ForwH information on how to use HELP, type "HELP" at the "Topic?" prompt, thenG press <RETURN>.", although I s'pose UN*X purists may be confused by theh/ reference to "<RETURN>" instead of "<NEWLINE>".l  @ > Also pointers to various programming resources would be good -I > like the link to the Bliss for C programmers document that was recently2J > posted or a tutorial on how to use Forms (since it's on the hobbyist PAK > list.)  H Are your referring to "forms" as in DEFINE/QUEUE/FORM and PRINT/FORM, or DECforms, or FMS?l  ? > A pointer to the fact that a single user developer version ofrF > Oracle Rdb for both VAX and Alpha is available for download from the/ > Oracle Technical Net for a free registration.    Agreed! That'd be a good one!h  3 > 2) pointers to what hardware documentation exists   D Oh, YEAH! Fer sure! Even the main OVMS FAQ needs that, no? Excellent idea!o   > - trying to putsG > together an uptodate list of known good CD-ROM drives would be a nicea > thing.   AMEN!   C > A listing of the basic information about common hobbyist machines J > - the VAX stations, the MVs, the various Alpha workstations - would alsoE > be good. Most of the information is scattered all over creation and G > seems to concentrate on the bigger systems. A reminder that a Vax cansE > sit on a desktop and not need a basement might not be out of place.,  H Very true. Even VAX 4000's, while a bit costly to run power-wise can fit3 under a desk or be used as an end- or coffee-table.n  H > Much of the good hardware information on the web has been put togetherI > by the NetBSD folks and there emphasis and needs are different from the> > VMS hobbyist.o  E They were the source of much the available research on Alpha Multias.   G > 3) basic system management - for example how to create a user accountyJ > that has sufficient privileges to mount a cd without having to log in asF > system. Not being VMS savvy I'm still not sure if I have that right.  C That's REALLY a sticky one. In UN*X land, unless you've set up someaC elaborate ACLs, group memberships, etc., you're either root (can dogG anything) or not (can't do too much damage). The VMS privilege paradigmu8 can be quite challenging if you're not familiar with it.   > A D > tutorial on how to set logical names for foreign executables (i.e. > Unzip) in the login.com.  @ Well, not just logical names but symbols and such, as well as anF introduction to logical names vs. symbols since the whole logical nameB paradigm is foreign to UN*X-land while DCL symbols are parallel to, environment variables in UN*X, DOS/Win, etc.  0 > A tutorial on how to use Backup, especially ifI > all you have is a second disk and no tape device or how to do a restorei> > of a non-image saveset to it's original directory structure.  	 Yes, sir!i   > A listingsI > of _what_ all the software is that is available on the layered products J > PAKS - while all the VMS experienced folks may know what ACMS or GKS is,H > it took me much searching of Compaq's web site to determine what those > software packages were.   D I always got a kick out of "PHIGS". When one is in a silly mood, the( jokes/puns can flow for quite some time.  G > I'm sure there are other things that would be of use to the Hobbyist.l > Anyone have any suggestions?  H The idea of the VAX console as well as Alpha SRM should probably also beH compared and contrasted with the typical BIOS setup screens one finds on@ Intel machines. This can be equally as daunting as the items you mentioned earlier.  I > I'll start pulling together what I can find - in the meantime, any help I > that could be posted here would be greatly appreciated. Perhaps by next J > Saturday, I can post at least an outline of the questions that should be > answered.l   What can I do to help?  H I hesitate to ask anything of the D/FW guys - they're kind of upset withD me right now, but I'll volunteer to compile the CD-ROM compatibilityH info. and put it on the web. Anyone who wants to can e-mail me privatelyH with info. re: your successes/challenges in this area. How to de-mung myG reply-to address should be obvious. Whatever info. I receive I'll sharesA with DFWCUG/Montagar and they can post it or not as they see fit.    -- r David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsd http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:08:34 +0200n2 From: Mike Rechtman <michael.rechtman@digital.com>( Subject: Re: Search Logical using CRELNM+ Message-ID: <3C6FE392.134EEE65@digital.com>b  * Snipped from an old 'SD' program in BASIC: ...a           record itemp                 word lengthu                 word codet                 long address                 long ret_length.         end record itemo  )         common(tmp)     item spec( 10% ) c ...     C         spec(i)::length, spec(i)::code = "0"W for i = "0"W to "10"Wu                  for i = "0"W to "9"W9                 if edit$( sd_directories(i),-"1"W ) <> ""l                 thenH                         save_i = len( edit$( sd_directories(i),-"1"W ) ) &n*                                 and "255"W0                         spec(i)::length = save_i3                         spec(i)::code = LNM$_STRINGlC                         spec(i)::address = LOC( sd_directories(i) ),9                         spec(i)::ret_length = LOC(buflen)n                 end if         next i  G         ret_status = SYS$CRELNM( LNM$M_NO_ALIAS,                       o ! attr &G                                 "LNM$PROCESS",                         v	 ! table & G                                 "SD_DIRECTORIES",                      t ! logical name&-5                                 access_mode by ref, &02                                 spec(0%) by ref  )    ...<end snip>...   Mike    $ john babiarz at endor dot com wrote: > ? > I need to program a search list logical name using sys$crelnmE > L > can someone post an example. I am missing something in construction of the1 > lnm item list as it is not clear by the manual.g >  > in DCL, I would use  > ' >  $ define big_disk  dka0:,dka1:,dka2:o >  > tiay >  > john   --  E ---------------------------------------------------------------------oE Usual disclaimer: All opinions are mine alone, perhaps not even that.f? Mike Rechtman                            *rechtman@tzora.co.il*oF Kibbutz Tzor'a.                          Voice (home): 972-2-9908337  B   "20% of a job takes 80% of the time, the rest takes another 80%"E ---------------------------------------------------------------------e -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----e Version: 3.1: GCM/CS d(-)pu s:+>:- a++ C++ U-- L-- W++ N++ K? w--- V+++$6 PS+ PE-- t 5? X- tv-- b+ DI+ D-- G e++ h--- r+++ y+++@ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------l   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 05:41:51 -0800= From: john babiarz at endor dot com <john_member@newsguy.com>-$ Subject: Search Logical using CRELNM) Message-ID: <a4obuv02u13@drn.newsguy.com>t  = I need to program a search list logical name using sys$crelnm@  J can someone post an example. I am missing something in construction of the/ lnm item list as it is not clear by the manual.s   in DCL, I would use   %  $ define big_disk  dka0:,dka1:,dka2:      tias   john     ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 10:49:47 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>o> Subject: Re: Security for VMS systems visable to the  Internet5 Message-ID: <20020217104947.2778.qmail@gacracker.org>i  " -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----  > On Thu, 14 Feb 2002, David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:I >Well, I've read about security, and I've talked about security, but I'm  < >pretty sure that it's what I don't know that could hurt me.  8 Me too, can anyone recommend a good book on the subject?  A >I've recently made one of my VMS systems visable to my internet =I >connection, via settings in my router.  It's a rather plain venella VMS =J >V7.2-1 system with TCPIP V5.0A, DECnet IV, etc.  Since doing this, I see # >the following several times a day.  > 9 >%%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM  14-FEB-2002 17:28:39.08  %%%%%%%%%%% # >Message from user INTERnet on JODI H >INTERnet ACP FTP Accept Request from Host: 209.127.72.194   Port: 49637 >tH >Yep, there appears to be those with nothing better to do than probe IP G >addresses.  I haven't yet been able to identify the domain for any of  J >the IP addresses I've seen.  Most probes are FTP connect requests, but I  >did see one TELNET attempt.  J I get the same on my shell accounts hobbyist system, I've locked down anon" ftp but allow users access to FTP.  J http://www.cotse.com has a host of trace and lookup tools you can use. TheI given IP address traces out as being somewhere called Corpus Christi, TX.D  I >I've got only a few user accounts, some with privs, and others without. -J >  It's my feeling that reasonable username and password data, along with F >break-in detection and countermeasures, should be adequate security.   K I hope you're right, I'm in the same position. However, as I use Multinet IrF am able to use SSH to log in remotely when I'm working away from home.  G >There's nothing important on the system, but it could be a gateway to EF >other systems (once someone's in) that are a bit more valuable to me. >eB >Keeping up with the hackers and their techniques isn't one of my D >activities.I do development work.  Security has never been a daily G >activity for me.  It's the things that I'm not aware of that will get e >me, if anything does.  D So far I'm more worried about abuse of my system by users on it thanI hackers/crackers gaining illegal access. However, as I advertise serviceseG OPCOM is beeping away day and night with bozos who can't read the login1J messages. I think most are morons who don't read the message stating there% is no "NEWUSER" or "ADDUSER" account.   F >I don't think I really need to lock the system down in ways that are G >available to VMS.  If I thought that, I wouldn't have allowed outside  H >access in the first place.  Any suggestions on things that I should be 
 >considering?f  K You're running VMS, for me that is good enough to start with. If you've gotiK a good enough password policy in place and don't telnet in from the outsideeA you should be safe. Out of curiosity, why did you make the systemc publically visible?a     Doc. - -- v6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                              http://vmsbox.cjb.netn   -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----e Version: 2.6.2  @ iQEVAwUBPG7kcsriC3SGiziTAQHm9Af9EoTCsW51N9263e5dmuBDD7nLzNIjkJ6u@ tA/ZOq6QErn3uIONHeiAsnu1E3CsiQ4qNHfC9zVoxBGMwajO5E5pFo+djTOPccqr@ eihfPGJgXA4QodVjPAyIZBnAOi834H0Q6jyWLy3Yt66Ljr5LuZRvg+otPwmpWr+C@ 8DMy26aujRoUHN0scPCaAeIHVu4uq+CKoASYclo5Scxigkc1W2a/5M1KO6oJifLE@ D19P7GXc70ad6j+DuVBJ8UC7aeyyBZxHAizBWmXqj6396Q3TYspTLejjmNYSS2gN8 adO1nQy464U3jNfSqHL86rjfCF7qOGFKGIvXid+GMNrck19T3ibsVA== =YJBB  -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----D   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 14:25:29 +01002/ From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> > Subject: Re: Security for VMS systems visable to the  Internet4 Message-ID: <VA.00000540.41fece19@bluewin.delete.ch>  G In article <20020217104947.2778.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher wrote:t$ > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > @ > On Thu, 14 Feb 2002, David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:K > >Well, I've read about security, and I've talked about security, but I'm 0> > >pretty sure that it's what I don't know that could hurt me. > : > Me too, can anyone recommend a good book on the subject? >0   Me too.f   [snip]   Dave Froble wrote:   > H > >I don't think I really need to lock the system down in ways that are I > >available to VMS.  If I thought that, I wouldn't have allowed outside nJ > >access in the first place.  Any suggestions on things that I should be  > >considering?i >   N I'm currently looking at Robert Byer's setup at http://www.ourservers.net/ (I " found this via the VMS WebRing at > http://members.gtw.net/~taylor/tms/ovmsring/OpenVMShome.html )  N (To go slightly off topic I found quite a few Hobbyist sites via the WebRing, H which may be of interest to those reading the "Proposal - Hobbyist FAQ"  thread.) ___d
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 17:10:39 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> > Subject: Re: Security for VMS systems visable to the  Internet6 Message-ID: <20020217171039.10829.qmail@gacracker.org>  E On Sun, 17 Feb 2002, Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.delete.ch> wrote:oA >> On Thu, 14 Feb 2002, David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:aL >> >Well, I've read about security, and I've talked about security, but I'm @ >> >pretty sure that it's what I don't know that could hurt me.  >> o; >> Me too, can anyone recommend a good book on the subject?L >> >- >Me too. >  >[snip]D >5 >Dave Froble wrote:c  I >> >I don't think I really need to lock the system down in ways that are  J >> >available to VMS.  If I thought that, I wouldn't have allowed outside K >> >access in the first place.  Any suggestions on things that I should be a >> >considering? o  O >I'm currently looking at Robert Byer's setup at http://www.ourservers.net/ (I p# >found this via the VMS WebRing at M? >http://members.gtw.net/~taylor/tms/ovmsring/OpenVMShome.html )S >nO >(To go slightly off topic I found quite a few Hobbyist sites via the WebRing, eI >which may be of interest to those reading the "Proposal - Hobbyist FAQ" e	 >thread.)r  K Yes, it reminded me to join the WebRing. Perhaps that'll give me more users.K who actually want to use the system instead of all these kiddies wanting ton: run IRC bots (I keep saying they can if they port them :).     Doc. -- -6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                              http://vmsbox.cjb.net-   ------------------------------  + Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 14:48:00 +0000 (UTC)  From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.ukY Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise       of  h+ Message-ID: <a4ofr0$gtc$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>r  T In article <3C6E87A1.260E5D93@attbi.com>, Jeff Kenton <JeffKenton@attbi.com> writes:$ >greenaum@BOLLOCKSyahoo.co.uk wrote: >>   >	...l >>  A >> Do you give much credence to the idea that language shapes the C >> thoughts that are possible? I think it's true, there are certain I >> things that the French don't really have a way of saying, and IME justaE >> don't talk about. Similarly German is blessed with dozens of wordsa >> like Angst and Weltschmerz. >>   >e2 >Boy, we're way off topic here, but what the heck: >eO >The book "Language, Thought & Reality" by Benjamin Lee Whorf (MIT Press, 1956):J >proposed this a long time ago.  He has an interesting discussion of Hopi,J >claiming that they have no words for "the present", so that everything isO >either in/continuing from the past, or in/going into the future.  Might affect I >your view of the world to think in Hopi if it's so (it's been disputed).y >   I The idea is older than that. George Orwell's 1984 (written in 1948) makes.K extensive use of the concept. Newspeak was supposed to make the thinking ofc heretical thoughts impossible. seea  0 http://www.ecoglobe.org.nz/ecostory/newspeak.htm      
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 09:29:45 -0800n2 From: "Walter Rottenkolber" <waltjr@sierratel.com>Y Subject: Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise       of  M+ Message-ID: <3c700b39$1@news.sierratel.com>s  - david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote in message ... 6 >In article <3C6E87A1.260E5D93@attbi.com>, Jeff Kenton <JeffKenton@attbi.com> writes:% >>greenaum@BOLLOCKSyahoo.co.uk wrote:T >>>e >> ... >>>hB >>> Do you give much credence to the idea that language shapes theD >>> thoughts that are possible? I think it's true, there are certainJ >>> things that the French don't really have a way of saying, and IME justF >>> don't talk about. Similarly German is blessed with dozens of words >>> like Angst and Weltschmerz.n >>>  >>3 >>Boy, we're way off topic here, but what the heck:  >>J >>The book "Language, Thought & Reality" by Benjamin Lee Whorf (MIT Press, 1956)>K >>proposed this a long time ago.  He has an interesting discussion of Hopi,TK >>claiming that they have no words for "the present", so that everything isuI >>either in/continuing from the past, or in/going into the future.  Mightn affectJ >>your view of the world to think in Hopi if it's so (it's been disputed). >> >tJ >The idea is older than that. George Orwell's 1984 (written in 1948) makesL >extensive use of the concept. Newspeak was supposed to make the thinking of >heretical thoughts impossible.e >see >b1 >http://www.ecoglobe.org.nz/ecostory/newspeak.htme >  >David Webbc >VMS and Unix team leaderi >CCSS  >Middlesex Universityd  K IIRC, Newspeak was the acceptable big brother spin on what you were allowed 8 to think. Today it's called 'Politically Correct Speak'.   Walter Rottenkolberu   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:28:36 +0000a1 From: Steve Reece <SYSTEM@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>f7 Subject: Re: The stupidity of granting software patentst6 Message-ID: <3C6FE844.15719AB3@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>  = Gives the OpenVMS Engineering Group a long time to ponder thet( possibility before Billy boy wakes up...   Warren Spencer wrote:t > J > a@nonymous.com (John Smith) wrote in <fMQ88.1422$LL.597@news1.bloor.is>: > % > >British firm hyper over Web patent & > >With files from Reuters News Agency > >Friday, February 8, 2002  > >o >  > -- snip -- > D > Perhaps someone in the OpenVMS group could patent OS stability andD > security, quick before Bill Gates discovers it for the first time. >  > ws >  > -- >  > Warren Spencer) > Senior Software Engineer (not a writer)p > The Associated Press > > > ** Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a bananna. **   -- sG "A shadow fell over her face; clear, as if the composure were rent likemE a veil.  And her lips parted, but only with a short intake of breath.sA Then she said, 'Well, then you are right.  Indeed, we are even.'"b% 		Louis, "Interview with the Vampire"u   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 16:29:23 GMTe1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>i- Subject: Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...i' Message-ID: <3C6FDBE9.3A6086C0@fsi.net>n   valdemir-@uol.com.br wrote:  > 7 > How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:d >  > vax1> type x.com >       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COM  >       $ EXIT > 4 > When I execute this procedure, I get this message: > 1 > Change mode can be entered only from a terminaln  H Paul has given some good info. Here's a few caveats (things to watch out for):   I /NOCOMMAND or /COMMAND=something_other_than_the_usual_interactive_script i' will solve the SET MODE CHANGE problem.t  H Using "image data" to pass line mode commands to EDT is perfectly legal. Example:   $ EDIT/EDT/NOCOMMAND file.extA" s/this text/that text/whole/notype exit  D Notice that at the line mode ("*") prompt, EDT does *NOT* respond asH expected to EOF on the SYS$INPUT stream. So, "$ EOD" does not work. YourH commands must finish with the EXIT command to EDT. Otherwise, your proc.F or batch job will loop forever on the next DCL command after the image data.u  H It is also possible to include "NOKEYPAD" ("change mode") commands amongH your line mode commands. See the HELP in line mode for NOKEYPAD. I don'tE recall the exact syntax, nor have I an example handy; however, I havehH used this in the past to create, of all things, a series of commands forH DFU to set the backup dates of files that were backed up without /RECORDD (so the date recording and other backups and processing could run inH parallel to further compress the BACKUP window). I believe the techniqueH was to use SEARCH/LOG with SYS$OUTPUT redirected to a file while findingH occurrances of "[" (or maybe it was ";" - I forget) in a BACKUP listing;E then, use the count of occurrances found by SEARCH to build a file of.B commands for EDT to isolate the filespec in the BACKUP listing andH replace all occurrances of "[" with the device name plus "[" preceded byF the necessary SET command and qualifier+value for DFU. Then, feed that as SYS$INPUT to DFU.  H I'm sure there are other EDT things to watch out for. These are the ones that come to mind just now.i   -- r David J. DachteraP dba DJE Systemsd http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/m   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:22:18 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>t- Subject: Re: Using Edit inside a procedure... ' Message-ID: <3C6FE822.935D60E8@fsi.net>    "David J. Dachtera" wrote: >  > valdemir-@uol.com.br wrote:  > >o9 > > How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:e > >i > > vax1> type x.com > >       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COM  > >       $ EXIT > >l6 > > When I execute this procedure, I get this message: > > 3 > > Change mode can be entered only from a terminal$ > J > Paul has given some good info. Here's a few caveats (things to watch out > for):= > J > /NOCOMMAND or /COMMAND=something_other_than_the_usual_interactive_script) > will solve the SET MODE CHANGE problem.l > J > Using "image data" to pass line mode commands to EDT is perfectly legal.
 > Example: >  > $ EDIT/EDT/NOCOMMAND file.exti$ > s/this text/that text/whole/notype > exit > F > Notice that at the line mode ("*") prompt, EDT does *NOT* respond asJ > expected to EOF on the SYS$INPUT stream. So, "$ EOD" does not work. YourJ > commands must finish with the EXIT command to EDT. Otherwise, your proc.H > or batch job will loop forever on the next DCL command after the image > data.  > J > It is also possible to include "NOKEYPAD" ("change mode") commands amongJ > your line mode commands. See the HELP in line mode for NOKEYPAD. I don'tG > recall the exact syntax, nor have I an example handy; however, I havelJ > used this in the past to create, of all things, a series of commands forJ > DFU to set the backup dates of files that were backed up without /RECORDF > (so the date recording and other backups and processing could run inJ > parallel to further compress the BACKUP window). I believe the techniqueJ > was to use SEARCH/LOG with SYS$OUTPUT redirected to a file while findingJ > occurrances of "[" (or maybe it was ";" - I forget) in a BACKUP listing;G > then, use the count of occurrances found by SEARCH to build a file of D > commands for EDT to isolate the filespec in the BACKUP listing andJ > replace all occurrances of "[" with the device name plus "[" preceded byH > the necessary SET command and qualifier+value for DFU. Then, feed that > as SYS$INPUT to DFU.  > Actually, now that I think about it, it was to build a list of> filespec.'s only. Then, the SET command to DFU was similar to:   SET/BACKUP=date_spec @filelist  F Individual SET commands for files ran for 8+ hours. This technique ran for around three(3) hours.  D Note that you needed the DFU V2.7-1 "patch" to make this work at the time. Dunno 'bout now...   -- l David J. Dachterai dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 19:54:37 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Re: VXT2000- Message-ID: <87664wtjb6.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   . "Bart Zorn" <B.Zorn@TrueBit.nospam.nl> writes:  B > The right cable is another thing. Of course, the VXT came with aF > cable originally. I don't have the part number, sorry. This cable isF > also used by DEC 3000 workstations, and by VAXstation 4000 machines.  D That would be the 3W3 connector then? 3 coax conectors on a D shell?   -- t< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.o@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 15:38:36 +0100t, From: "Bart Zorn" <B.Zorn@TrueBit.nospam.nl> Subject: Re: VXT2000> Message-ID: <3c6fc06d$0$4601$e4fe514c@dreader3.news.xs4all.nl>  9 "Paul Repacholi" <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote in message ' news:87664wtjb6.fsf@prep.synonet.com...i0 > "Bart Zorn" <B.Zorn@TrueBit.nospam.nl> writes: >tD > > The right cable is another thing. Of course, the VXT came with aH > > cable originally. I don't have the part number, sorry. This cable isH > > also used by DEC 3000 workstations, and by VAXstation 4000 machines. >kF > That would be the 3W3 connector then? 3 coax conectors on a D shell?   That's correct.e   Bart   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 07:58:26 -0500c+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com>a6 Subject: RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS?T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1CBC@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  6 >>> So VAX/VMS is the only operating system you wanted8 to classify as being just as vulnerable as Microsoft ?<<  ? Nope, what I usually say (and what I forgot to in that original F reference) is something like "not susceptible to the 32bit virus's and* hacker attacks that are so common today.."  > MVS, NSK, VAX/VMS certainly do not fall into this category.=20   :-)e   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Compaq Canada Corp.t Professional Servicest Voice: 613-592-4660n Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----4 From: Larry Kilgallen [mailto:Kilgallen@SpamCop.net] Sent: February 16, 2002 5:36 PM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comr6 Subject: RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS?    6 > From: Larry Kilgallen [mailto:Kilgallen@SpamCop.net]! > Sent: February 15, 2002 1:49 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com'8 > Subject: RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS? >=20 >=20 > In article >iH <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4016CEA74@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>1 > , "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes:t >>=3D20aB >>>>> It's ok, Kerry.  There are no children present.  You can say >> _Microsoft_.<<  >>=3D20rH >> Well, actually I meant all 32bit server OS's since there are a number > of >> them out there. >=20 > Do you mean VAX VMS ?o >=20  > Or would that be MVS and NSK ?  
 In articleH <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4016CEA84@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>/ , "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes:.% >>>> Or would that be MVS and NSK ?<<  >=20$ > Well, if we wanted to be picky :-) >=20A > Actually, MVS is a 31 bit OS and NSK is a 32 bit OS on 64bit HWQ  2 So VAX/VMS is the only operating system you wanted6 to classify as being just as vulnerable as Microsoft ?   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Feb 2002 07:45:45 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)K6 Subject: RE: What is the best NFS package for OpenVMS?3 Message-ID: <+sgKPJnqasTn@eisner.encompasserve.org>I   In article <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1CBC@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>, "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes:7 >>>> So VAX/VMS is the only operating system you wantedj: > to classify as being just as vulnerable as Microsoft ?<< > A > Nope, what I usually say (and what I forgot to in that original2H > reference) is something like "not susceptible to the 32bit virus's and, > hacker attacks that are so common today.." > @ > MVS, NSK, VAX/VMS certainly do not fall into this category.=20 >  > :-)a  J > <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4016CEA74@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>2 >> , "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes: >>>=3D20C >>>>>> It's ok, Kerry.  There are no children present.  You can say  >>> _Microsoft_.<< >>>=3D20I >>> Well, actually I meant all 32bit server OS's since there are a numberM >> ofI >>> them out there.d  @ Your amendment of that "all" to be "many" is hereby accepted :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 15:37:28 +0000o1 From: Steve Reece <SYSTEM@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>r? Subject: Re: Where does VMS fit in here? (Was Re: HP admits...)w6 Message-ID: <3C6FCE38.516DD417@ipl.demon.co.nospam.uk>  D Interesting thoughts, considering the following in the VMS 7.1 SPD :  G MicroVAX I and VAXstation I - final version to support these systems ish VMS Version 5.1-1S  8 VMS V5.1 was the final version to support the VAX 11/725  H OpenVMS VAX Version 6.2 was the final version to support the following :
 VAX-11/730
 VAX-11/750
 VAX-11/751
 VAX-11/780
 VAX-11/782
 VAX-11/785  F I've missed out the typo of the MicroVAX I and the VAXstation I in the 6.2 de-support list.   Steve.       Alan Greig wrote:w > : > On Wed, 30 Jan 02 11:03:40 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >  > >aF > >I don't know anything about the various flavors of Alpha.  However,B > >"retiring" old gear is not an unusual activity for an operatingD > >system business.  In the old days, it just meant that testing and@ > >new functionality was not going to be funded nor will the newF > >stuff be supported on old gear.  This is normal for OS development.C > >TOPS-10 "retired" older PDP-10s, namely the KA-10 and the KI-10.u0 > >The same thing happened with old peripherals. > D > Yes but VMS engineering has gone to unusual lengths to continue toE > support later versions of the O/S on ancient hardware. At a time ofdF > uncertainty for the future of VMS I wouldn't decide *now* was a goodG > time to start reducing the interval to retirement even though I agreefG > with your point in general. Certainly TOPS-20 release 7 (1989?) stillr/ > supported the DECSYSTEM-2040 released in 1976r >  > >i > >/BAHd > >o* > >Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. >  > -- > Alan   -- wG "A shadow fell over her face; clear, as if the composure were rent likeoE a veil.  And her lips parted, but only with a short intake of breath.iA Then she said, 'Well, then you are right.  Indeed, we are even.'"B% 		Louis, "Interview with the Vampire"p   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:53:50 +01000& From: Michael Joosten <joost@c-lab.de>Y Subject: Re: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise    of      come$ Message-ID: <3C6FFC3E.794B@c-lab.de>   Bill Gunshannon wrote: >   B > Unless things have changed in the many years since I was in highD > school 9and if they have, it would most likely not be in directionC > of better education) american german teachers are totally unaware E > of any dialects in the language.  My high school taught german from>F > a book that only showed writting int he form of 100 year old script.  E But with a corrected spelling. Otherwise, there would be lots of 'Th' D (like 'Du junger Thor..!'), signalling a long vowel following, which# were removed in early 20th century.   E > While I didn't learn German in school, shortly afterwards I had thepC > good fortune to live there for a few years.  On my first return IpF > visited my school and spoke with the German teacher, who had been myF > senior home room teacher.  While I had no problem understanding her,F > she could not understand most of what I said.  I had not been living > in Berlin.  :-)y >   1 Berlin? What has Berlin to do with High German ?? G As far as I know, the folks near Hannover (some 2-300km west of Berlin,oG capitol of state Lower Saxonia) are supposed (or they think they do...)p. to speak very close to an offical High German.     > H > But I think most of the dialectic differences are in pronunciation, so4 > written examples probably don't provide much help.  E Not quite. Often, the local newspapers have weekend inlets with small:F stories told in the local dialects, 'transcribed' in (High) German. IfE you try to pronounce it like 'normal' German, you get an idea what itm means...  B This is similar to my feeling towards Dutch: The spelling is quiteF different, so it is easier for me to try to speak it silently in order to understand the meaning.   -- y* Michael Joosten, SBS C-LAB, joost@c-lab.de* Fuerstenallee 11, 33094 Paderborn, Germany, Phone: +49 5251 606127, Fax: +49 5251 6060658 C-LAB is a cooperation of University Paderborn & SIEMENS   ------------------------------   Date: 17 Feb 2002 18:13:35 GMT& From: sthaug@nethelp.no (Steinar Haug)Y Subject: Re: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( was The demise of      compaq", Message-ID: <a4orsf.11oo.1@verdi.nethelp.no>   [Terje Mathisen]  > |   > > >     tae mak        machen          to make    te mekK |   > > >     dochter        Tochter         daughter   wor lass (or bairn)a: |   > > >     hardneckit     hartnaeckig       ???      ??; |   > > >     wha            Wie             Who        whew> |   > > >     tae gae        gehen           to go      te ganA |   > > >     I gang         Ich gange       I went     ah ganned) |   G |   og lage, datter, gjenstridig (no good/direct translation), hvem (orn) |   vem/kem in dialects),  g, jeg gikk.e  E Ah, but we *do* have "hardnakket". We also have "barn" (for child), Ic4 assume this is the same root as the Geordie "bairn".  3 Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.094 ************************ Walter Rottenkolberu   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:28:36 +0000a1 From: St@BS    ABS    BBS    CBS    DBS    EBS    FBS    GBS    HBS    IBS    JBS    KBS    LBS    MBS    NBS    OBS    PBS    QBS    RBS    SBS    TBS    UBS    VBS    WBS    XBS    YBS    ZBS    [BS    \BS    ]BS    ^BS    _BS    `BS    aBS    bBS    cBS    dBS    eBS    fBS    gBS    hBS    iBS    jBS    kBS    lBS    mBS    nBS    oBS    pBS    qBS    rBS    sBS    tBS    uBS    vBS    wBS    xBS    yBS    zBS    {BS    |BS    }BS    ~BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS    BS     CS    CS    CS    CS    CS    CS    CS    CS    CS    	CS    
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