1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 23 Feb 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 105       Contents: (no subject) Re: (no subject)5 Re: 500au ethernet apparently won't operate at 100bps & Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors7 Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment C Re: Create an Open Mail Relay (GASP!) and Turn it Into a Relay Spam C Re: Create an Open Mail Relay (GASP!) and Turn it Into a Relay Spam P Re: Create an Open Mail Relay (GASP!) and Turn it Into a Relay Spam Honeypot Hon$ Re: DECTERM ERROR MESSAGE???????????$ Re: DECTERM ERROR MESSAGE??????????? Re: Einstein Re: Einstein0 Re: EV7 rules ... more proof of EV8 conspirarcy!, Re: EV8 and McKinley analysis by Paul DeMone0 Re: F$EXTRACT does parsing before giving result?$ Find Out Origin of Detached Process?( Re: Find Out Origin of Detached Process?( Re: Find Out Origin of Detached Process?F Getting VMS running on alphapc 150 - any help or pointers appreciated.J Re: Getting VMS running on alphapc 150 - any help or pointers appreciated.2 Re: Having Nfilename Printed at the end of reports2 Re: Having Nfilename Printed at the end of reports Re: How to CTRL/Z within DCL% How to monitor directory for changes? : Isn't C2 dead? (was: RE: Profitability and the survival of> Re: Isn't C2 dead? (was: RE: Profitability and the survival of+ Re: Monitor lock and monitor io questions !  Re: OpenVMS IPF presentation Re: OpenVMS IPF presentationP Re: Oracle RDB  ABUSIVE PRICE$  was (Re: MPE/iX users form OpenMPE organization)P Re: Oracle RDB  ABUSIVE PRICE$  was (Re: MPE/iX users form OpenMPE organization) Re: PGP for OpenVMS? Re: PGP for OpenVMS? Re: PGP for OpenVMS? Re: PGP for OpenVMS?= Re: Poor Performance with OpenVMS Advanced Server and TCPWare 4 Re: POSIX for OpenVMS - is there something similar ?) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) RE: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS A Re: Proof that EV8 was fantastic ... and Capellas "gave" it away!  Re: Screen Saver Problem (?) Re: Screen Saver Problem (?)" Session Manager Won't Start!! HELP Setting Time and Date  Re: Setting Time and Date  Re: Shannon on the merger  Re: Shannon on the merger  Re: Shannon on the merger  Re: Shannon on the merger $ Re: Using Edit inside a procedure... RE: VMS Printing using PCL6   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:16:15 -0500 - From: Charles Aaron <caaron@ceris.purdue.edu>  Subject: (no subject) 0 Message-ID: <3C76B51F.B52FE1DA@ceris.purdue.edu>   Group,  @ How do you place a ctrl/z to exit and save withing a dcl command
 procedure?  
 Thank you,   chuck    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:46:19 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: (no subject) ' Message-ID: <3C7711F6.406EF094@fsi.net>    Charles Aaron wrote: >  > Group, > B > How do you place a ctrl/z to exit and save withing a dcl command > procedure?  A Um, well, in actuality, you don't, except for some poorly written 
 utilities.  E What does the job is "$ EOD" or simply the next DCL command, like so:    $ CREATE MYFILE.TXT . This is just some stuff I want in a text file. $ EOD   B Be careful, though: some (mostly non-DEC) utilities don't properly/ handle EOF on their SYS$INPUT ("stdin") stream.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:55:30 -0800 7 From: David Spencer <spencer@pageweavers.spaamfree.com> > Subject: Re: 500au ethernet apparently won't operate at 100bpsB Message-ID: <220220021655305014%spencer@pageweavers.spaamfree.com>  N > I've got a 500au (running VMS 7.2-1). I've also got two network hubs. One isK > a 10baseT and the other is a 10/100 autosensing hub. The 500au works fine J > when attached to the 10baseT hub. When I connect it to the 10/100 hub itH > runs only at 10mbs and has lots of problems with traffic. I've got the@ > ewa0_mode set to Auto-Negotiate but it doesn't seem to matter. > L > I've tried switching ports and cables but it makes no difference. I've gotJ > another 500au that's similarly configured and it works at 100bps without > problems.  > M > Do I have a bad part someplace? I've compared the ewa0 settings between the K > two machines and there appears to be no difference between them. Is there L > are hardware jumper or something that I can check? I'd like to get maximum- > performance out of this thing if I could...   M To close this thread, I'd like to report that I imposed a "FastFD" at the SRM : prompt and rebooted. That forced it into the mode desired.  * Many thanks to all who offered their help.     -- Dave Spencer, PageWeavers   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:48:07 -0500 1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com> / Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors 2 Message-ID: <3C769267.3B962671@firstdbasource.com>  F Probably the first thing I would do is dump the block of the offendingG file and see what the difference is....  You can do this in VMS.  It is C simple and doesn't cost you anything.  Now if all of the blocks are G consecutive, then that is another can of worms.  Does backup/restore do E any "conversions" of RMS files with lots of "holes" (and the need for H convert) upon restore or does it do a bit-level restore of those files? - With /IMAGE I would expect bit-level restore.    Rick Dyson wrote:  > J > I've been testing doing image backups to DLT, restoring to a spare disk,D > and then comparing the original disk to the spare disk to test the > integretity of the backup. > Q > I'm bothered by what appears to be hundreds and hundreds of verification errors " > when I perform this exercise. :( > F > I am using Alphas running OpenVMS v7.2-1 with all know ECOs applied. > G > The initial backup command used to a TZ877 tape library (Compac III):  > E > $ Mount /Foreign /Cache = Tape_Data /BlockSize = 65535 MKC600: Blah G > $ Backup /NoInitialize /Image /CRC /BlockSize = 65535 /Label = Blah - @ >          /Ignore = Interlock /List = BackUp_Logs:Foo-bar.log -# >          DSA1: MKC600:FOO-Bar.bck  > N > The original disk is an RZ29B-VA dual shadow set between two nodes each with2 > an HSZ40 controller where the disks are shelved. > . > The restore backup and compare commands are: >  > $ Mount /For $1$DGA117: G > $ Backup /Log /Image /Initialize /BlockSize = 65535 /Ignore = Label -  >          MKC600:Foo-Bar.bck - * >          $1$DGA117: /By_Owner = Original > $  > $ Dismount $1$DGA117: / > $ Mount /Override = Identification $1$DGA117: 6 > $ Backup /Compare DSA1:[Blah...] $1$DGA117:[Blah...] > G > The spare disk is a new 1" Compac 9 GB drive in an EMA12000 SAN off a ; > HSG80 controller via a Fiber Channel switch interconnect.  > F > I then proceed to get from 500-1500 of these kinds of error messages! > (with different block numbers):  > = > %BACKUP-E-VERIFYERR, verification error for block 237034 of  > $1$DGA117:[Blah]DATA.DAT;1 > A > Is this OK?  Does it indicate that if I lost the original disks I > completely and had to restore from tape, that I would not have the same M > data set on the restored volume?  Could it be due to the difference between N > the original and target scratch drives (i.e., RZ29B-VA and Compaq 142671-B22 > 9 Gb Ulta3 10k)? > K > I have tried this with several different savesets from different tapes (I P > have always used the same scratch disk as the restore target), always with theP > same kinds of negative results.  The amount of verification errors varies, butO > is always at least 500 instances per 4 GB disk. (note: these source disks are + > typically 99% full of data in 1-5 files.)  > J > I would greatly appreciate any suggestions or insight you can provide onL > this situation!  I would realy like to be more confident of my backups. :) > 	 > Thanks!  > Rick Dyson > --L > Richard L. Dyson                                      rick-dyson@uiowa.eduL >  _   _  _____                      http://www-pi.physics.uiowa.edu/~dyson/L > | | | ||_   _|  Senior Systems Analyst   --   INFORMM-Cerner Systems Group4 > | | | |  | |    The University of Iowa Health CareL > | \_/ | _| |_   Health Care Information Systems BT1000 GH  O: 319/384-7016L >  \___/ |_____|  Iowa City, IA 52242-1052                 FAX: 319/384-7020   --   Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163 7 First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.com  Sr. Consultant 704-947-1089 (Office)  704-236-4377 (Mobile)    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:26:17 GMT ' From: Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> / Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors ) Message-ID: <3C769B59.4EEB09AD@UIowa.EDU>    Nic Clews wrote: >  > Rick Dyson wrote:  > > L > > I've been testing doing image backups to DLT, restoring to a spare disk,F > > and then comparing the original disk to the spare disk to test the > > integretity of the backup. > > S > > I'm bothered by what appears to be hundreds and hundreds of verification errors $ > > when I perform this exercise. :(  G > You're doing an online backup, backing up all the files also open for I > write, that could change while backup up that file (/IGNORE=INTERLOCK), H > restoring this historical perspective of the disk, then getting a long? > list of all the differences where a WRITE did actually occur.   A 	Actually, this is a static datafile with a dual shadow set where K break the set and then mount the broken-out partner and use it as a source. L There should be no open files.  The Backup job is the only one that actuallyN has this physical disk drive allocated.  I admit, some of the qualifers in the! backup command my be unnecessary.    Rick   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:50:08 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors 0 Message-ID: <3C769FD4.B764E996@blueyonder.co.uk>   Nic Clews wrote: >  > Rick Dyson wrote:  > > L > > I've been testing doing image backups to DLT, restoring to a spare disk,F > > and then comparing the original disk to the spare disk to test the > > integretity of the backup. > > S > > I'm bothered by what appears to be hundreds and hundreds of verification errors $ > > when I perform this exercise. :( >  > Rick,  > H > I've responded AFTER reading Tim's response, that I'm not sure I fully > agree with, but here goes. >   G Nic, out of interest, apart from my unstated assumption (perhaps as you G point out not valid) that the data was not changing DURING the backup,  ! did you disagree with in my post?    regards   A > I believe you're seeing what I would call 'expected behaviour'.  > G > You're doing an online backup, backing up all the files also open for I > write, that could change while backup up that file (/IGNORE=INTERLOCK), H > restoring this historical perspective of the disk, then getting a long? > list of all the differences where a WRITE did actually occur.  > H > Take the case of a single very large file open for write. BACKUP couldG > copy the data, and right after it's copied block 123 of the file, you J > application could change it, and a data block not yet copied to tape. IsA > file integrity affected? Depends on your application. If it's a I > relational database, then almost certainly you'll have a 'corrupt' copy  > of your data.  > J > Is there any point performing a verification as part of the backup of anE > open-for-write disk? Well all it proves (and what your exercise has E > proved) is the integrity of the backup saveset, you can recover the B > data, even if it is a corrupt version, the saveset itself is notH > corrupt. It's a good idea to ensure the saveset is readable, but close8 > to doubling the backup duration may not be acceptable. > D > If you're not taking a queiscesed (sp?)/ database shutdown type ofI > backup of your data, and your data is sensitive to inter and extra file F > relationships, then you need to do this. That would be the saveset I1 > would worry about if I saw verification errors.  >  > HTH  > --* > Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences > nclews at csc dot com    --   Tim.Llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk     C Standard disclaimer applies. My views in no way represent those of  ! my employers or service provider.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 14:40:08 -0500 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors , Message-ID: <3C769E98.6060109@tsoft-inc.com>   Michael Austin wrote:   H > Probably the first thing I would do is dump the block of the offendingI > file and see what the difference is....  You can do this in VMS.  It is E > simple and doesn't cost you anything.  Now if all of the blocks are I > consecutive, then that is another can of worms.  Does backup/restore do G > any "conversions" of RMS files with lots of "holes" (and the need for J > convert) upon restore or does it do a bit-level restore of those files? / > With /IMAGE I would expect bit-level restore.  >  > Rick Dyson wrote:  > J >>I've been testing doing image backups to DLT, restoring to a spare disk,D >>and then comparing the original disk to the spare disk to test the >>integretity of the backup. >>Q >>I'm bothered by what appears to be hundreds and hundreds of verification errors " >>when I perform this exercise. :( >>F >>I am using Alphas running OpenVMS v7.2-1 with all know ECOs applied. >>G >>The initial backup command used to a TZ877 tape library (Compac III):  >>E >>$ Mount /Foreign /Cache = Tape_Data /BlockSize = 65535 MKC600: Blah G >>$ Backup /NoInitialize /Image /CRC /BlockSize = 65535 /Label = Blah - @ >>         /Ignore = Interlock /List = BackUp_Logs:Foo-bar.log -# >>         DSA1: MKC600:FOO-Bar.bck  >>N >>The original disk is an RZ29B-VA dual shadow set between two nodes each with2 >>an HSZ40 controller where the disks are shelved. >>. >>The restore backup and compare commands are: >> >>$ Mount /For $1$DGA117: G >>$ Backup /Log /Image /Initialize /BlockSize = 65535 /Ignore = Label -  >>         MKC600:Foo-Bar.bck - * >>         $1$DGA117: /By_Owner = Original >>$  >>$ Dismount $1$DGA117: / >>$ Mount /Override = Identification $1$DGA117: 6 >>$ Backup /Compare DSA1:[Blah...] $1$DGA117:[Blah...] >>G >>The spare disk is a new 1" Compac 9 GB drive in an EMA12000 SAN off a ; >>HSG80 controller via a Fiber Channel switch interconnect.  >>F >>I then proceed to get from 500-1500 of these kinds of error messages! >>(with different block numbers):  >>= >>%BACKUP-E-VERIFYERR, verification error for block 237034 of  >>$1$DGA117:[Blah]DATA.DAT;1 >>A >>Is this OK?  Does it indicate that if I lost the original disks I >>completely and had to restore from tape, that I would not have the same M >>data set on the restored volume?  Could it be due to the difference between N >>the original and target scratch drives (i.e., RZ29B-VA and Compaq 142671-B22 >>9 Gb Ulta3 10k)? >>  H This would be the first place I would look.  Shouldn't be a problem, as C Michael Austin discussed above.  However, such issues as different   clustersize could be an issue.  H A better test would be a compare of the files, showing the differences. H   Remember that backup is a file oriented operation.  Even /IMAGE still $ gives you a file oriented operation.   Dave   -- f4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 13:52:28 -0800. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errorse= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0202221352.42be11a4@posting.google.com>   g "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> wrote in message news:<Jkvd8.18384$X2.204015@nnrp1.uunet.ca>...n6 > "Rick Dyson" <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> wrote in message% > news:3C7668DB.5EF6573C@UIowa.EDU...  > >...L > > I'm bothered by what appears to be hundreds and hundreds of verification	 >  errorsn$ > > when I perform this exercise. :( > I > As others have pointed out, this should only happen if some process hasuB > written to the original disk between the backup and the restore. >  > >...8 > > $ Backup /Compare DSA1:[Blah...] $1$DGA117:[Blah...] > >... > J > AFAIK you should not use [Blah...] when using /COMPARE. You have to walkJ > through directory by directory and compare them one by one. You probablyM > knew that, but I'm just adding this for anyone else looking at your examplec > and thinking of trying it.    F OK, why is the above BACKUP/COMPARE command bad? And what's wrong with  1     $ BACKUP/COMPARE DSA1:[*...] $1$DGA117:[*...]r   ?e  < I'm not sure, but BACKUP/IMAGE/COMPARE might work here also.   [the rest deleted]   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldmanr) afeldman ononononon gfigroup afasfdas com    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 17:19:36 -0500c- From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca>y/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors:2 Message-ID: <4uzd8.18661$X2.205402@nnrp1.uunet.ca>  ; "Alan E. Feldman" <SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM> wrote in message 7 news:343f30ae.0202221352.42be11a4@posting.google.com...  >...H > OK, why is the above BACKUP/COMPARE command bad? And what's wrong with >a3 >     $ BACKUP/COMPARE DSA1:[*...] $1$DGA117:[*...]G > ...p  + You're right, I once again learn something.M  J BACKUP/COMPARE DKA100:[000000...] DKA600:[000000...] does not work, but ifH you use your example it does work. I could have saved myself some codingL time the other day when I tried the syntax above and saw that it didn't workC the way I expected. I should have tried a few more combinations. :(h  > Actually I just did another test and I see that BACKUP/COMPAREL DKA100:[000000...] DKA600:[*]  works too, its too late on a Friday for me toL figure out why BACKUP/COMPARE DKA100:[000000...] DKA600:[000000...] does not work.l   Have a good weekend.   --E AOL CD Use #3415; As a handy prop when trying to explain the sport of % Curling to your Mother and your Wife.p   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:10:50 +0000l From: nic <junk@127.0.0.1>/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errorsn( Message-ID: <3C76CFFA.B6E24CD@127.0.0.1>   Rick Dyson wrote:e > J >         Actually, this is a static datafile with a dual shadow set whereM > break the set and then mount the broken-out partner and use it as a source.-N > There should be no open files.  The Backup job is the only one that actuallyP > has this physical disk drive allocated.  I admit, some of the qualifers in the# > backup command my be unnecessary.p  / A shadow set is not actually a 'backup' device.o  C The application writes to DSAn:. Those writes end up on the current  member(s) of the shadow set.  H Taking a member out does not give the data some integrity, you can stillD end up with partial files. When you remerge, the shadow server makesG sure that the data on the volumes forming the shadow set is consistent.y  B What I understand from the original post, is you're comparing thisD shadow-split-frozen-in-time with the current picture, and if there's3 been writes, yes there will be verification errors.y  @ The only case you should not see errors is comparing the tape orF restored disk with the split member still out on its own [no remerge]. -- t Regards, Nic Clews (from home), nic at python dot demon dot co dot uk (play) nclews at csc dot com (work)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:19:07 +0000p From: nic <junk@127.0.0.1>/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors-) Message-ID: <3C76D1EB.9F49106D@127.0.0.1>0   Tim Llewellyn wrote: >  > Nic Clews wrote: > >rJ > > I've responded AFTER reading Tim's response, that I'm not sure I fully > > agree with, but here goes. > >@ > I > Nic, out of interest, apart from my unstated assumption (perhaps as you H > point out not valid) that the data was not changing DURING the backup,# > did you disagree with in my post?h  B It was the assumptions. My unstated assumption was that data wouldD change. Rick clarified it was a split shadow set, so in fact I agreeH with you, a VERIFY would be useful in this case, the ignore=interlock is meaningless.  ; Variables don't, constants aren't syndrome, so I apologise.t -- n Regards, Nic Clews (from home), nic at python dot demon dot co dot uk (play) nclews at csc dot com (work)   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2002 08:43:31 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errorss- Message-ID: <873cztuix8.fsf@prep.synonet.com>m  ) Rick Dyson <Rick-Dyson@UIowa.EDU> writes:d  D > I've been testing doing image backups to DLT, restoring to a spareF > disk, and then comparing the original disk to the spare disk to test  > the integretity of the backup.  t= > I'm bothered by what appears to be hundreds and hundreds of-6 > verification errors when I perform this exercise. :(  rF > I am using Alphas running OpenVMS v7.2-1 with all know ECOs applied.  rG > The initial backup command used to a TZ877 tape library (Compac III):>   E > $ Mount /Foreign /Cache = Tape_Data /BlockSize = 65535 MKC600: Blah G > $ Backup /NoInitialize /Image /CRC /BlockSize = 65535 /Label = Blah - @ >          /Ignore = Interlock /List = BackUp_Logs:Foo-bar.log -# >          DSA1: MKC600:FOO-Bar.bck +                                    /save???c    sD > The original disk is an RZ29B-VA dual shadow set between two nodes< > each with an HSZ40 controller where the disks are shelved.  i. > The restore backup and compare commands are:  k > $ Mount /For $1$DGA117:bG > $ Backup /Log /Image /Initialize /BlockSize = 65535 /Ignore = Label -  >          MKC600:Foo-Bar.bck -t2                              /save?? here as well?* >          $1$DGA117: /By_Owner = Original > $h > $ Dismount $1$DGA117:e/ > $ Mount /Override = Identification $1$DGA117:e9 > $ Backup /Compare DSA1:[Blah...] $1$DGA117:[Blah...]   l  nE > The spare disk is a new 1" Compac 9 GB drive in an EMA12000 SAN off = > a HSG80 controller via a Fiber Channel switch interconnect.t  BF > I then proceed to get from 500-1500 of these kinds of error messages! > (with different block numbers):   E Are the source drives (the shadow set) active? The /ign=inter sort of F implies that they are. If so, it is probably writes that have happened? in between the read to create the save set, and the read of ther compare.  G What happens if you compare the tape to each of the drives? HSGs should  be OK...   -- 1< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 14:56:13 -0500 2 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com>@ Subject: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment0 Message-ID: <Ylxd8.98$fL6.1183@news.cpqcorp.net>   Dear Newsgroup,Y  F I just got this and thought you might be interested (few minutes ago).   Sue   L ____________________________________________________________________________ __________________________  G I'm proud to announce the beta release of Compaq Secure Web Browser for 4 OpenVMS Alpha (based on Mozilla), or CSWB for short.  I CSWB provides OpenVMS Alpha with a full featured and customizable browser1K with integrated web browsing, security, HTML document creation and editing,tJ and clients for mail, news, and instant messaging and support for Java andL JavaScript and the following standards: HTML4, CSS1/2, DOM1/2, XML, RDF, and SSL.  E CSWB is the supported browser for OpenVMS Alpha and replaces NetscapeeE Navigator 3.03. CSWB is based on Mozilla, an open-source web browser, L designed for standards-compliance, performance and portability. Netscape 6.x is also based on Mozilla.a    CSWB T1.0 can be downloaded fromL http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/cswb/cswb.html. CSWB V1.0; will be available in the April timeframe from the same URL._  K Mozilla (beta) baselevels will continue to be available on OpenVMS Alpha as| they become available.  J Many thanks are due to Colin Blake for his efforts over the past two years to make this a reality.|   Regards,  
 John Ferguson    John.L.Ferguson@compaq.com   OpenVMS Product Management   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:30:25 -0500i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>2D Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment, Message-ID: <3C76B85A.E2608629@videotron.ca>   Sue Skonetski wrote:I > I'm proud to announce the beta release of Compaq Secure Web Browser forD6 > OpenVMS Alpha (based on Mozilla), or CSWB for short.  E Considering Compaq ceases to exist in a few months, why bother naming  something with "Compaq" in it ?o  4 Why not simply call it VMS-Mozilla, or Mozilla-VMS ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 22:02:14 +0000t% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>rD Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment* Message-ID: <3C76BFE6.D79C16AB@virgin.net>   JF Mezei wrote:t   > Sue Skonetski wrote:K > > I'm proud to announce the beta release of Compaq Secure Web Browser fort8 > > OpenVMS Alpha (based on Mozilla), or CSWB for short. >)G > Considering Compaq ceases to exist in a few months, why bother namingo! > something with "Compaq" in it ?h >   J Come on JF, you don't need to complain about absolutely everything. And my? hunch, for what it's worth, is still that the merger will fail.    >e6 > Why not simply call it VMS-Mozilla, or Mozilla-VMS ?   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 22:23:41 GMTI From: no@way.com (MikeG)D Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment/ Message-ID: <3c76c226.14380878@news.compaq.com>0  
 Mr. Mezei,F if your obvious bitterness and contempt for anything Compaq or OpenVMSE make you blind to even the good news involving this beloved operatingo> system, I would appreciate you reserve your comments in futureE replies.  It is only attitudes like your own which diminish the value C of good news within the VMS camp.  Ultimately you are free to voiceeC your opion however you have a responsibility to be judicious withina that right.   A I for one am very pleased to hear that an updated  web browser isr? available and appreciative to all those involved.  Am very muchr looking forward to using it. l   MikeG       , On Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:30:25 -0500, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:a   >Sue Skonetski wrote: J >> I'm proud to announce the beta release of Compaq Secure Web Browser for7 >> OpenVMS Alpha (based on Mozilla), or CSWB for short.n >hF >Considering Compaq ceases to exist in a few months, why bother naming  >something with "Compaq" in it ? >e5 >Why not simply call it VMS-Mozilla, or Mozilla-VMS ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:56:32 +0100d' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net>hD Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment' Message-ID: <3C76CCA0.23C6DC1@spam.net>e   Sue Skonetski wrote:   [SNIP]  C Really great news! Thanks. I'm already thinking about migrating my o@ browsing environment to VMS. Many thanks also to the people who  did the job.   -- D6 moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 18:11:18 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>aD Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment, Message-ID: <3C76D015.B748EDCE@videotron.ca>   MikeG wrote:H > if your obvious bitterness and contempt for anything Compaq or OpenVMSG > make you blind to even the good news involving this beloved operatings  I For christ's sake, haven't you heard ? HP is buying Compaq. Until further J notice, the buyout will go through. This is not a complaint, it is a fact.  N Yeah, officially Compaq has to provide the appearance of continuing to competeK against HP intil the dotted line ahs been signed. I was not suggesting thatsK Compaq begin to name products with the "HP" monicker, just that they should   name it in a owner neutral way.   J Besides those CSWS and CSWB are totally obscure names that lose any "open" value that have to them.  E Apache-VMS and Mozilla-VMS would be far more meaningful and be vendordJ independant. If you talk to some Unix or NT guy, and tell him you can haveL CSWS on VMS, he will instantly think "little known proprietary and not stateN of the art server thing". But if you tell him that you can have Apache on VMS,; he will know that VMS has up to date "mainstream" software.h  F The VMS folks should be aware of the iomplications of having to renameJ products. They know that removing the unwanted "open" woudl cost money. SoG they should know to choose product names that are not likely to change.   N One need not be a god to know that if HP fails to buy Compaq, Compaq will be aJ lame duck for some time, with the possibility of anythe buying showing up.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:23:31 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>D Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment: Message-ID: <7PEd8.11547$ro5.4154689@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>  % "MikeG" <no@way.com> wrote in messaget) news:3c76c226.14380878@news.compaq.com...i > Mr. Mezei,H > if your obvious bitterness and contempt for anything Compaq or OpenVMSG > make you blind to even the good news involving this beloved operatingd@ > system, I would appreciate you reserve your comments in futureG > replies.  It is only attitudes like your own which diminish the valuetE > of good news within the VMS camp.  Ultimately you are free to voiceoE > your opion however you have a responsibility to be judicious within0
 > that right.   F Heck, is the guy even a customer? If not, of what value is his learned input?   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 13:58:20 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)nL Subject: Re: Create an Open Mail Relay (GASP!) and Turn it Into a Relay Spam3 Message-ID: <MHHFhMFb5PlR@eisner.encompasserve.org>   _ In article <3C76A0A0.8E424C78@mail.tds.net>, "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net> writes:i >  >  > Larry Kilgallen wrote: >> rb >> In article <3C7653C9.A232B76E@mail.tds.net>, "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net> writes:  G >> I have no general objection to SMTP honeypots, but keep in mind that E >> they do not relieve all the extra load on the Internet due to spams >> (or spam attempts). >  > A.  What does?   Life imprisonment for spammers.   C > Last week I sent a single complaint to AltaVista listing 14 email F > addresses used by one spammer as the dropboxes for his spam.  On theG > honeypot you get spam in wholesale quantities and can complain at theoJ > wholesale level.  AltaVista replied (when asked) that they had cancelledI > all 14 addresses.  I got the 14 addresses by dong a VMS SEARCH and then  > a VMS SORT/NODUP.  h  	 Good job.h  J > C.  Why would *anyone* have a general objection to a relay spam honeypot" > (other than a spammer, that is)?  ? It does not fulfill the EFF ideals of a free and open internet. " It does not use physical violence.. It does not make use of government mechanisms.2 It does not make use of United Nations mechanisms.4 Honey sales are a major revenue source for Al Queda.  F (Not that all of those objections would be used by the same people :-)   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 20:21:09 GMTf0 From: "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net>L Subject: Re: Create an Open Mail Relay (GASP!) and Turn it Into a Relay Spam, Message-ID: <3C76A834.F3A42D5A@mail.tds.net>   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > a > In article <3C76A0A0.8E424C78@mail.tds.net>, "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net> writes:  > >t > >a > > Larry Kilgallen wrote: > >>d > >> In article <3C7653C9.A232B76E@mail.tds.net>, "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net> writes: > I > >> I have no general objection to SMTP honeypots, but keep in mind thatdG > >> they do not relieve all the extra load on the Internet due to spam  > >> (or spam attempts). > >e > > A.  What does? > ! > Life imprisonment for spammers.p  4 Thee's also the diagonal cutters / backhoe approach.  E > > Last week I sent a single complaint to AltaVista listing 14 emailSH > > addresses used by one spammer as the dropboxes for his spam.  On theI > > honeypot you get spam in wholesale quantities and can complain at thecL > > wholesale level.  AltaVista replied (when asked) that they had cancelledK > > all 14 addresses.  I got the 14 addresses by dong a VMS SEARCH and then. > > a VMS SORT/NODUP.o >  > Good job.   F Thanks.  There's something absolutely delicious about using the phraseG "these addresses" vs. the phrase "this address."  I'm pretty sure I got H all 14 then in use by the spammer.  I imagine he's used to having one orG two go down a day.  Hitting all 14 at once shuts him off for a while.  -  L > > C.  Why would *anyone* have a general objection to a relay spam honeypot$ > > (other than a spammer, that is)? > A > It does not fulfill the EFF ideals of a free and open internet.c   Imagine my heartbreak.  $ > It does not use physical violence.0 > It does not make use of government mechanisms.4 > It does not make use of United Nations mechanisms.6 > Honey sales are a major revenue source for Al Queda. > H > (Not that all of those objections would be used by the same people :-)  E This is more fun than having the same discussion in NANAE but soon weeG should go away and let the VMS group be about VMS.  I did want to point F out how easy it is to turn an old disused VMS box into a rather wickedC anti-spam tool.  In fact I do the honeypot on a low-volume VMS maileH server but I don't recommend that.  (It is listed one or two places.  In; practice this is seldom a problem.  Not never, but seldom.)t --> "Our problems are mostly behind us.  What we have to do now is. fight the solutions."  ---Stult's Report (from" http://www.reznor.com/~aj/quotes/)  2 See: http://frs.axisline.net/ for my honeypot page   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:48:49 GMT-0 From: "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net>Y Subject: Re: Create an Open Mail Relay (GASP!) and Turn it Into a Relay Spam Honeypot Hong, Message-ID: <3C76A0A0.8E424C78@mail.tds.net>   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > a > In article <3C7653C9.A232B76E@mail.tds.net>, "brad.madison" <brad.madison@mail.tds.net> writes:o > > Create an open mail relay: >  > > Voila: an Open Mail Relay  > >.' > > Turn it into a relay spam honeypot:u > > & > > $ STOP/QUEUE  UCX$SMTP_NODENAME_01 > G > > A Linux honeypot in Moscow stopped (STOPPED!) over 1.7 million spampL > > deliveries in about a month.  That may be an atypical number but it sureK > > is nice.  As a bonus a bunch of spammer dialup accounts were wiped out.  > D > More sophisticated spammers, however, run some test messages to an= > address they control to ensure the mail is getting through.r  F So far I don't think I've seen a "more sophisticated spammer."  I alsoH think that most in this newsgroup are smart enough to figure out ways toG defeat these if they appear.  My honeypot has slacked off in volume, so F it could be that the sophisticated spammers have busted me.  OTOH I'veG posted about it for ~ 19 months so they could just read NANAE and learnsD abut it.  Even with all that it trapped a piddling amount last nightD around 11 p.m.  These could have been relay tests disguised as spam.  F > I have no general objection to SMTP honeypots, but keep in mind thatD > they do not relieve all the extra load on the Internet due to spam > (or spam attempts).E   A.  What does?  G B.  At zeroth order they cut the load in half or more: the mail dies onrC the relay so there's not the added traffic that would come from the D relay (when it delivered).  If/when the spammer realizes his 10's ofC thousands of messages to 1.7 millon people weren't delivered he mayoE repeat the run, but he'd be spamming at that time anyway, so the real F effect is that he's been slowed.  Plus lost a slew of throwaway dialup	 accounts.n  A Last week I sent a single complaint to AltaVista listing 14 emailtD addresses used by one spammer as the dropboxes for his spam.  On theE honeypot you get spam in wholesale quantities and can complain at theeH wholesale level.  AltaVista replied (when asked) that they had cancelledG all 14 addresses.  I got the 14 addresses by dong a VMS SEARCH and then  a VMS SORT/NODUP.  -  G The Moscow honeypot had a live web page that showed the time, "origin,"eH sizes and number of recipients of the most recent 25 captured relay spamH messages.  The spammer was chased from uu.net to starnetusa (popsite) to= ICGCOMM.  All the while the spammer thought his operation wase successful.  Wrong.   G (I put "origin" in quotes because this appears to be split-source spam, D where the real origin is some high-speed connection.  The high-speedF connection spoofs the IP address of a dialup, so that what gets closed3 down is the dialup, not the high-speed connection.)2  H Even if the honeypot doesn't take the extra step of delivering the relayC test it captures the relay test, exposing the spammer.  It has beeneH reported that some spammers interpret acceptance of the relay test emailE as indicating that the tested IP is an open relay, so spam can follow/* even when the relay test is not delivered.  H C.  Why would *anyone* have a general objection to a relay spam honeypotB (other than a spammer, that is)?  Note that if tested by a listingG service it is OK to deliver the test.  This is an IP with no real email H function.  Being listed as an open relay causes no harm. (If the listingD services start listing whole blocks because they contain one or moreH open relays this changes.  That would be highly irresponsible of them.) G One of the early entities to be told of this honeypot was ORBS.  I told / them they could test and list with my blessing.i   --> "Our problems are mostly behind us.  What we have to do now is. fight the solutions."  ---Stult's Report (from" http://www.reznor.com/~aj/quotes/)  2 See: http://frs.axisline.net/ for my honeypot page   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 13:55:06 -08001 From: Alex.Feliziani@space.gc.ca (Alex Feliziani))- Subject: Re: DECTERM ERROR MESSAGE???????????t< Message-ID: <f4436989.0202221355.242e188@posting.google.com>   Hi guys,  E I have attempted everything you have suggested..but nothing changed. n  E When i log in it seems as if it is logged in  by the system but afteraF that it seems to be trying to open the session manger and then it justD logs me out . the session manager doesn't appear on the screen (blueE screen) at this point. I think it seems to have a problem opening the E session manager. Do you know how i can attempt to fix this problem. iP  would really appreciate the help  
 Thanks a lot , Alex      k "Malcolm" <malcolmix@neverness.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message news:<a529l4$81t$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk>...n6 > "Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu> wrote in message) > news:20FEB200204381346@gerg.tamu.edu...D9 > > Alex.Feliziani@space.gc.ca (Alex Feliziani) writes... E > > }I have a VAX STATION 4000. I created an account on $DISK2 called.K > > }PAYNE. When i try to log into the Payne account i get through up until_J > > }the blue screen where the DecTerm tries to open and then it goes backK > > }to the login window. THE FOLLOWING IS WHAT I OBTAIN AFTER ENTERING THEC > > } 
 > > }Alex! > >oE > > By "blue screen", do you mean the one that says "Starting the newhC > > OpenVMS desktop" or something like that? That is leading to thegE > > session manager, not a DECterm (which is just a terminal emulatora > > window). > >a
 > > My guess:g > >dE > > You created an account, PAYNE, that has it's login device definede5 > > as $DISK2 and login directory defined as [PAYNE].i > > < > > But DECwindows can't access the directory either because > > 1) it doesn't existm > > orA > > 2) the PAYNE account can't write to it's own login directory,a- > >    most likely because it doesn't own it.w > >eE > > Make sure that you have created the directory $DISK2:[PAYNE]. The A > > authorize utility does not create the directory for you, onlyt > > the account. > >iK > > Make sure that the PAYNE account is the owner of its own home directorykI > > (i.e. the file $DISK2:[000000]PAYNE.DIR should be owned by PAYNE) andhG > > therefore has write permission for it so that it can create all themE > > DECwindows configuratin files (the old DECwindows put them all ineC > > the login directory, the new one puts most of them in the [.DT]iG > > subdirectory, but it needs to be able to create DT.DIR in the loginn > > directory).- > >3B > > Make sure that the "Owner" field in the file protection of the@ > > PAYNE.DIR file allows writing. You might also make sure thatD > > there is nothing in the file's ACL that is preventing the write. > >c@ > > Generally, you create the login directory via a command like > >p3 > > $ create/dir/log disk:[username]/owner=usernamer > >lI > > substituting the username for "username" in the above, which not only1H > > creates the directory but also assigns it's ownership to the correct > > account. > $ > Does the PAYNE account run a menu? > $ > Put this in LOGIN.COM/SYLOGIN.COM: > J > $ if f$mode() .eqs. "INTERACTIVE" .and. f$getjpi("","TERMINAL") .nes. "" > $ then > $! run the menu  > [...] 	 > $ endifh > H > I encountered this problem. It's because DECwindows starts the sessionN > manager as an interactive process with no terminal. You can see this in SHOW > USERS. >  > -Malcolm.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:54:35 GMTw1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> - Subject: Re: DECTERM ERROR MESSAGE???????????V' Message-ID: <3C7713CC.8AF3CDC1@fsi.net>-   Alex Feliziani wrote:r > 
 > Hi guys, > F > I have attempted everything you have suggested..but nothing changed. > G > When i log in it seems as if it is logged in  by the system but aftercH > that it seems to be trying to open the session manger and then it justF > logs me out . the session manager doesn't appear on the screen (blueG > screen) at this point. I think it seems to have a problem opening the G > session manager. Do you know how i can attempt to fix this problem. ia" > would really appreciate the help  D Well, one problem - similar to yours - jumped up and bit me recentlyC because I didn't own my own login-script files, and don't have muchrH privilege by default (NETMBX, TMPMBX and OPER by default, NETMBX, TMPMBXE and SETPRV authorized). So, when logging in, I could even open my own. login scripts.    + May be worth a look (DIRECTORY/SECURITY)...    -- i David J. Dachterac dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:22:15 +0100 ' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net>e Subject: Re: Einsteint( Message-ID: <3C76C497.57C93E59@spam.net>   Bob Koehler wrote: > T > In article <3C7567BC.C5C06874@spam.net>, Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net> writes: > > "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: > >m
 > > [SNIP] > >RF > > There must be a better place to discuss this - or is it in any way > > related to VMS?m > J >    Of course, it's related to VMS.  I was a grad student in physics when# >    I first got my hands on a VAX.w > I >    What do you want us to discuss the plural of everyone, or the length- >    of Carly's hair?    No offense taken.    -- u6 moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:32:48 +0100u' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net>O Subject: Re: Einsteint( Message-ID: <3C76C710.CA91116E@spam.net>   Tom Linden wrote:  >  > > -----Original Message-----9 > > From: Alan E. Feldman [mailto:spamsink2001@yahoo.com]v- > > Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2002 6:39 PMn > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt > > Subject: Re: Einsteino > >  > > 6 > > Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net> wrote in message( > > news:<3C7567BC.C5C06874@spam.net>... > > > "Alan E. Feldman" wrote:   [SNIP]  E > > If Nobel prizes are based on "invention and discovery", certainlyn+ > > Special Relativity counts as discovery!t > C > Boy, Plato certainly left his legacy, theories are inventions notn > discoveries.  < Not really. Scientific results are regarded as findings not A inventions. This is one major reason why in reasonable countries zA there is no chance to get those patented. Basically, discovering IC scientific laws needs creativity; this makes the results sometimes  D look more like inventions. If you look at mathematics you'll easily = see that the results are independent of time, cultures, sex,  < believes whatever because there are some laws in logic that < are independent the mentioned conditions. Therefore stating : theories and proving them correct is a discovery. I think 4 that only at the very beginning when the axioms are 9 established this could be more similar to inventing than e< discovering. But in case of physics the axioms are normally < derived from observations as abstractions that can formally 8 defined. Therefore in this case the invention factor is  even less than it could be.    -- 26 moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:39:20 GMTn4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>9 Subject: Re: EV7 rules ... more proof of EV8 conspirarcy!e: Message-ID: <Y1Fd8.11557$ro5.4165715@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message* news:KEdd8.2771$4xE.1882@news1.bloor.is... >eA > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in messager5 > news:Tncd8.7110$ro5.3152344@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...  > >  > >aF > > I own perhaps 1K shares of CPQ. Can't do a hell of a lot with this minimalaG > > amount of clout. I will, however, attend the 20 March stockholder'se	 > meetingyL > > (fully equipped with evidence of stock possession so that the PR weeniesI > > can't try to throw me out of the meeting as they almost managed to do- last
 > > year!) > >  > >: > Terry, >mK > Get the SEC involved if they don't let you in, or don't let you vote yourRC > shares (make sure you check for details on your proxy statement).@ >nI > And get a Federal Court judge in Compaq's incorporation jurisdiction tod setsI > aside the shareholder vote if they don't allow you to attend or vote in 0 > accordance with the bylaws and/or proxy terms. > K > Remember, Capella's et al. were hired by shareholders to MANAGE, not own.jE > You might just want to make a motion from the floor to have all thee( > directors and senior executives fired.  K Oh, it wasn't Capellas. It was a PR weenie who hopefully will be one of thepC first victims of a successful merger. I can hardly wait to see thisgL gentleman on March 20. In fact, I think I'll withhold voting my shares until; I see what sort of reception I receive from this gentleman.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 18:34:52 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>5 Subject: Re: EV8 and McKinley analysis by Paul DeMone C Message-ID: <fbwd8.153867$Aw2.11063336@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>e  @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message* news:Jzvd8.86$fL6.1066@news.cpqcorp.net... > I don't get it Bill.   No surprise there.  6   While at least conceding relative performance parityA > between Sparc and McKinley (probably a combination of using theo artificiallyC > inflated Sun spec numbers, and the low side estimates of McKinleyiI > performance) - you then say it doesn't matter - because the devil is in  theeJ > system-level engineering done by Sun - and somehow an "Industry StandardJ > Box" (which I don't know what that means, but will take a wild ass guess itL > means an Intel CPU in it that can run Windows) -- somehow won't measure up, > to the system engineering that Sun can do.  4 1.  Rob introduced the term 'industry standard box'.  F 2.  To avoid complete redundancy it seems reasonable to assume that anJ 'industry standard box' is something more than simply any box that happensK to contain an industry standard processor.  In particular, I think of boxesdC like Sequents that indeed contained industry standard processors assL something other than industry standard boxes, and I expect that at least theI higher-end server boxes from Compaq and HP that contain Itanics will also L offer significant differences from/advantages over 'industry standard boxes'' from Dell (and for that matter Compaq).b  A Rob has a tendency to want to have his cake and eat it too.  WhenaK constrasting Itanic with its competition, he trots out Dell prices as beingeL lower (for both base product and added memory) while completely ignoring theD fact that they're not comparable in their *system* capabilities withJ higher-end servers (such as Sun's and those that HP will be Itanicizing in SuperDome).d  H AFAIK we don't yet know what HP will charge for Itanicized SuperDomes orI what Compaq (if it's still around) will charge for Itanicized post-Marvel H high-end servers (if there are any other than blades that may or may notI achieve comparable capabilities).  I suspect that for obvious reasons therJ prices won't be competitive with 'standard' Dell (or Compaq) Itanic boxes:G if they're as high as current SuperDome/AlphaServer prices (as least assJ compared with then-current Sun prices), then Sun should be able to competeG just as effectively as it does today against similarly-price/performinge	 products.f   > L > I've looked at some of the near term, and long term IPF "enterprise" classG > boxes being designed and built here at Compaq, and they are in no wayoJ > inferior to what Sun is building (or they are likely to build).  I'm notE > sure how the comment got turned into a Dell desktop box comparison.i  * That's Rob's bag - I just responded to it.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 14:45:38 -0500r; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>e9 Subject: Re: F$EXTRACT does parsing before giving result?W$ Message-ID: <3c76a040$1@news.si.com>  ' >$ write sys$output "a string ",'today'w >r >which is equivalent to  >:( >$ write sys$output "a string ",f$time()  ! No, it's not.  It's equivalent to-  6 $ write sys$output "a string", 22-FEB-2002 14:43:45.11  L or whatever the datetime was when you got the value of F$TIME.  The above is( syntactically incorrect and will produce  = %DCL-W-UNDSYM, undefined symbol - check validity and spellinge  \FEB\ --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comaA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com = 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventy< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 11:39:40 -0800( From: Craig.Dedo@abbott.com (Craig Dedo)- Subject: Find Out Origin of Detached Process? = Message-ID: <83afd6f7.0202221139.15ff093e@posting.google.com>u  F I need to find out how a particular detached process is being created.A  I am referring to a specific detached process, run at a specificcD time, under a specific account, NOT the general question.  I alreadyC know how to use the /UIC and /DETACH qulifiers with the RUN command  and how to call SYS$CREPRC.   E     We have an application that is 10 years old (1992), UNDOCUMENTED, B and which runs under VMS 5.5-2.  It uses an Rdb 4.1 database.  ForD some unknown reason, there is a detached process that runs under theF VMS username of the owner of the application and database, at the sameD time that the Rdb database backup (using RMU) is running.  sometimesD this detached process causes the backup to fail.  I need to find out+ how this detached process is being created.e  B     I have already enabled the Accounting Utility, including IMAGED accounting for the period of the backup.  The accounting informationC can tell me when the process started and stopped and what images its@ ran, but it does not tell me how the process was created or what% process created the detached process.b  D     What, if any, way is there to find out how a detached process isF created?  I am especially interested in teh process ID of the creator.  ,     Any help would be very much appreciated.  
 Sincerely, Craig T. Dedo, VMS Consultantd Dept. 30G, Building AP34-21 Abbott Diagnostics Division - Abbott Laboratoriesn 200 Abbott Park Road Abbott Park, IL   60064-3537, Voice:  (847) 938-0144  Fax:  (847) 935-5395 E-mail:  Craig.Dedo@abbott.com   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 14:05:22 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 1 Subject: Re: Find Out Origin of Detached Process?s3 Message-ID: <WjxWFHW7NKw4@eisner.encompasserve.org>   h In article <83afd6f7.0202221139.15ff093e@posting.google.com>, Craig.Dedo@abbott.com (Craig Dedo) writes:H > I need to find out how a particular detached process is being created.  % SET AUDIT/AUDIT/ENABLE=PROCESS=CREPRC    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:14:07 GMTo1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 1 Subject: Re: Find Out Origin of Detached Process?s' Message-ID: <3C771866.1BF1ABDD@fsi.net>t   Craig Dedo wrote:r > H > I need to find out how a particular detached process is being created.C >  I am referring to a specific detached process, run at a specificnF > time, under a specific account, NOT the general question.  I alreadyE > know how to use the /UIC and /DETACH qulifiers with the RUN command  > and how to call SYS$CREPRC.  > G >     We have an application that is 10 years old (1992), UNDOCUMENTED, D > and which runs under VMS 5.5-2.  It uses an Rdb 4.1 database.  ForF > some unknown reason, there is a detached process that runs under theH > VMS username of the owner of the application and database, at the sameF > time that the Rdb database backup (using RMU) is running.  sometimesF > this detached process causes the backup to fail.  I need to find out- > how this detached process is being created.e > D >     I have already enabled the Accounting Utility, including IMAGEF > accounting for the period of the backup.  The accounting informationE > can tell me when the process started and stopped and what images itsB > ran, but it does not tell me how the process was created or what' > process created the detached process.l > F >     What, if any, way is there to find out how a detached process isH > created?  I am especially interested in teh process ID of the creator. > . >     Any help would be very much appreciated.  6 If you can, while the process is running, go into SDA:  	 $ ANA/SYS  SDA> SET PROCESS process_name  SDA> SHO PROC/CHAN  D ...and see if it has a .COM file open, presumably as SYS$INPUT. That& will give you something to SEARCH for.  H You may need to SEARCH the entire disk farm for a proc. that invokes the proc. you just observed. e  H I have some DCL to help make that a touch easier. It creates a series ofG search-list logical names under a logical name ALL_DISKS so you can usee4 a command such as "$ SEAR ALL_DISKS:[000000...]*.COMG comfile_name.COM/WIN=0" to try and find any proc.'s that invoke the onenD you're chasing down, or do some other SEARCHing. Note that this will9 impact performance since it effects the directory caches.A  F If you want my "DEFALL.COM" proc., e-mail me privately (how to de-mung> my reply-to address should be obvious). BTW, I also work for aF healthcare concern (in the city, Superior and Fairbanks - you may know them).  G Larry's idea for auditing on CREPRC calls is good to use in tandem with * this to help find what you're looking for.   -- a David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsh http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/C   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:49:57 GMTs4 From: "PLZI" <janne.peltola@eisikanautaa.sonera.com>O Subject: Getting VMS running on alphapc 150 - any help or pointers appreciated.i+ Message-ID: <FjEd8.5$Cz3.130@read2.inet.fi>i  = Hear my plea, ye gods of VMS, since I'm running out of ideas.t   Here's the situation:i  G I have Alpha AXP 150 minitower, complete with loads of RAM (80MB), scsi I controller, cd-rom and whatnot. When I got it, it was being punished (NT4]F was installed). Ran fine, no problem there. Thought I'd give it a niceA retirement running OpenVMS in my home (yes, the old "VAX in every I garage"-syndrome, but since there are no vaxen around, gotta go with whatN
 you have.)  J Originally it had DEC-made hard disks, a 3gig and a 5gig drives, if memoryH serves. I distinctly remember installing OpenVMS 7.2 or 7.3 (well, thereJ goes the "distinctly") on it, and it booted happily. I had no PAK's at theJ time, so it merely booted to DCL, and complained about the missing productJ keys. Then one of the HD's gave finally in, and I stored the thing away. A7 year and a half later, I decided to give it another go.t  I Now, I have quite a large selection of miscellaneous scsi drives,  but itaI seems the machine is *very* picky. Most of the larger (say, 8 gig) drivestK get recognized wrong by the firmware. Put an 8 gig drive in, it claims it'snG a 500MB or so. Put a 4 gig drive in, it says it's a 100MB drive. I haveiJ exactly one drive, a fujitsu 2 gig, which seems to get reported correctly.D Why does this happen, any ideas? The firmware is the latest version,J installed by compaq's firmware utility (it claimed that no OpenVMS 7.3 for me if I do not upgrade it).A  L So. I pop the 2 gig drive in, and boot. Now the funny part. If I select someG obscure regional options (like, say U.S.) during the install phase, the K machine promptly exits the install with a *very* obscure message and halts..I If I select, say "poland", the install runs it course, but when the OS is0L supposed to boot for the first time, there is a nice crash and halt. First IH suspected a faulty CD or CD drive, tried multiple selections of those asK well - no help. The alpha seems to be very picky about the cd-rom -drive asy
 well, btw.  J Any ideas? I can provide the more specific error messages, but I'd like toJ hear some insights about the scsi controller or firmware, and any quirks /K gotchas they may have, to begin with, so I do not end up running in circles  using incompatible hardware.   TIA.  L Oh, one more thing. How do I really, really low-level format a scsi drive on0 this box? Without a hammer and a chisel, I mean.   - PLZI   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 05:04:26 GMT-! From: Andy <acs@fcgnet.works.net>aS Subject: Re: Getting VMS running on alphapc 150 - any help or pointers appreciated.t< Message-ID: <Xns91BE914B27Eacsfcgnetworksnet@216.166.71.232>  B "PLZI" <janne.peltola@eisikanautaa.sonera.com> enlightened us with$ news:FjEd8.5$Cz3.130@read2.inet.fi:   ? > Hear my plea, ye gods of VMS, since I'm running out of ideas.  >  > Here's the situation:f > < > I have Alpha AXP 150 minitower, complete with loads of RAM. > (80MB), scsi controller, cd-rom and whatnot.  B > Originally it had DEC-made hard disks, a 3gig and a 5gig drives, > if memory serves.n    More likely 1, 2, or 4GB drives.  ? > I have exactly one drive, a fujitsu 2 gig, which seems to get6: > reported correctly. Why does this happen, any ideas? The@ > firmware is the latest version, installed by compaq's firmware< > utility (it claimed that no OpenVMS 7.3 for me if I do not > upgrade it).    A Because they aren't supported by VMS ? Somewhere there is a list s6 of what IS & isn't supported (The VMS SPD most likely)  B > So. I pop the 2 gig drive in, and boot. Now the funny part. If IB > select some obscure regional options (like, say U.S.) during the> > install phase, the machine promptly exits the install with a$ > *very* obscure message and halts.   $ [And let me be the first to ask....]    And the "obscure message is... ?  = > The alpha seems to be very picky about the cd-rom -drive aso > well, btw.   No surprise.  
 > Any ideas? r  B The DECpc AXP 150 (aka Jensen), although apparently not officiallyA supported with VMS (No matter what the SOC for it says about that 5 topic) (If you search comp.os.vms this topic comes up<A occassionally) will work fine if you have VMS compatible hardwarem- (video, SCSI, ethernet, disks, cd-rom, etc.).I  ; In fact, mine, which VMS thinks is a DEC 2000 Model 300 AXP" with:i   2 disks  (an RZ26L & RZ26N), 1 cd-rom (RRD44),  video  (QVision - PB2GA-AA ?)  Adaptec SCSI controller, DE422 etherent controller, and 192MB of memory, t  ! is quite happily running VMS 7.3.    Hope this gets you started...o   -Andy- --     ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:04:38 -0500,; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>t; Subject: Re: Having Nfilename Printed at the end of reportsk$ Message-ID: <3c76a4b4$1@news.si.com>  J >When we print a file that has a 9.3 character name from a VMS system thatI >has a 14 character node name to either a HP LaserJet 5N or a HP LaserJetdI >4001N we see the name of the file followed by an N printed at the end ofy theh >page.  . What symbiont do you use to feed the LaserJet? --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comnA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.coms= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevente< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:39:54 -0500:- From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca>n; Subject: Re: Having Nfilename Printed at the end of reports82 Message-ID: <C0yd8.18474$X2.204893@nnrp1.uunet.ca>  F "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote in message news:3c76a4b4$1@news.si.com...L > >When we print a file that has a 9.3 character name from a VMS system thatK > >has a 14 character node name to either a HP LaserJet 5N or a HP LaserJet K > >4001N we see the name of the file followed by an N printed at the end of  > theu > >page. >I0 > What symbiont do you use to feed the LaserJet?  L We have used both TCPWARE_VMSLPRSMB and TCPWARE_LPRSMB as the symbiont. TheyK both cause the same problem. But if I use the command LPR -pprinter@printere' 123456789.123 I do not see the problem.   G A few people have e-mailed me asking about forms and the device controloH library, but as I mentioned before, all we have to do is change the nodeD name from 12345.stelco.ca to 1234.stelco.ca to recreate the problem,G renaming it from 1234.stelco.ca to 12345.stelco.ca makes the symptom gowH away. But the fact that users tell us they see this from time to time onK other nodes tells us that there are other parameters at play that we do nott understand yet.h     --E AOL CD Use #3415; As a handy prop when trying to explain the sport ofe% Curling to your Mother and your Wife.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 17:55:54 -0500m1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com>t% Subject: Re: How to CTRL/Z within DCL 2 Message-ID: <3C76CC7A.D4076D78@firstdbasource.com>  2 You have to give us a bit more to go on than that.  # Are you thinking of something like e  : ==========================================================	 $!! A.COMe $create xyz.txtE	 some textn here( $mail xyz.txt /subj="test for this thing! smtp%"maustin@firstdbasource.com". $exits: ========================================================== The logfile: ALPHA1>MAUSTIN>TIN.RDB]@aw $create xyz.txt 	 some texte here( $mail xyz.txt /subj="test for this thing! smtp%"maustin@firstdbasource.com"  $exit  ALPHA1>MAUSTIN>TIN.RDB]$ yE New mail on node ALPHA1 from SMTP%"maustin@alpha1.firstdbasource.com"e ALPHA1>MAUSTIN>TIN.RDB]$    A the leading "$" effectively says to DCL "finished .. now move on"e     -- s Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163d7 First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.comw Sr. Consultant 704-947-1089 (Office)a 704-236-4377 (Mobile)n   Charles Aaron wrote: >  > Group, > B > How do you place a ctrl/z to exit and save withing a dcl command > procedure? >  > Thank you, >  > chuckt   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 02:22:15 GMTs/ From: "W. John Guineau" <guineau@earthlink.net>g. Subject: How to monitor directory for changes?8 Message-ID: <r1Dd8.1070$j47.422170@twister.socal.rr.com>  K Is there a way in VMS to monitor a directory to be notified in a program (CsJ for example) if as file is added to a directory? I thought this capabilityK was added back in OpenVMS 6 or around there. Something similar to the WIN32 ! FindFirstChangeNotification()API.m   john   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:21:50 -0500b* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>C Subject: Isn't C2 dead? (was: RE: Profitability and the survival of - Message-ID: <0033000054071593000002L032*@MHS>b  + =0AI thought that the Orange Book Stuff hadt! been replaced by Common Criteria.    http://www.commoncriteria.orgc   WWWebb+ (who has thirty-six books of various colors -  on a shelf near the vintage S&O catalogs...))   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET ( Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 12:16 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET2 Subject: RE: Profitability and the survival of VMS    5 In article <3C75F607.BF161F32@videotron.ca>, JF MezeihH <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > Rob Young wrote list of C2 sys= tems:f3 >> Data General Corporation AOS/VS II, Release 3.10cB >> Digital Equipment Corporation OpenVMS VAX and Alpha Version 6.1H >> Microsoft Corporation Windows NT Workstation and Windows NT Server, = Versioni 4.0 >oH > VMS is not in very good company in that rating. Of course, if NT can = get it, H > it means that the rating is meaningless. Also, the fact that the rati= ng was& > not maintained past 6.1 tells a lot.  H    C2 doesn't mean much.  But the NT system only qualifies if it is not=  H    connected to a network.  Such details are the reality of what little=      meaning there is.=    ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 18:34:36 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)nG Subject: Re: Isn't C2 dead? (was: RE: Profitability and the survival oft3 Message-ID: <sDwgFvFetbW2@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  Z In article <0033000054071593000002L032*@MHS>, WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov> writes:- > =0AI thought that the Orange Book Stuff hadt# > been replaced by Common Criteria.2   Correct.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:39:20 +0000. From: nic <junk@127.0.0.1>4 Subject: Re: Monitor lock and monitor io questions !) Message-ID: <3C76D6A8.76CE3398@127.0.0.1>\   Fabio Cardoso wrote: > 3 > I upgraded my Alphaserver 4100 memory from 4GB tot$ > 6GB. My software configuration is: >l   The display didn't make it :-(   Try these MONITOR commands.o  1 MONITOR DISK/ITEM=QUE ! disks forming bottlenecksPC MONITOR FCP           ! read and write ratio (can memory be used tot cache?)m  C This may give you a clue to diverting memory to do more disk (read)8 caching.  E The performance manual has a good methodology for working performancePE issues out. System performance is a balancing act in most cases whereu something is at capacity.a  F Is locking a problem? It could be the way the application works so itsF hard to tell. Can't really give an answer so understanding the monitorF output is important for you. One value or another on any system is not necessarily bad. Or good.   B I saw a situation where the system manager said there was a memoryH problem and bought more memory. His free list size went from 50% free toE 75% free (of available memory) and still had the problem. Working seteD tuning was all that was required! Mind you, the extra memory came inC useful, so it wasn't wasted. This too is covered in the performanceu manual.R   -- r Regards, Nic Clews (from home), nic at python dot demon dot co dot uk (play) nclews at csc dot com (work)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 14:17:37 -0500l2 From: "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com>% Subject: Re: OpenVMS IPF presentation 0 Message-ID: <MNwd8.97$fL6.1119@news.cpqcorp.net>   John,m  K Can you let me know which presentation you are looking at because I seem toc be missing it.   Thanks,o sueb. "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message* news:oevd8.4691$4xE.2076@news1.bloor.is... > Sue, >eF > About 16 slides into the OpenVMS Customer Presentation, there is theG > timeline showing the 'Alpha-Itanium Processor Family Operating System, > Roadmap'.4 > K > I note that the green arrow labeled 'OpenVMS on Itanium Processor Family'o isG > noticably shorter than all the others, even Tru64, which I though wasl0 > already given last rites. What does this mean? >- >- >  >e? > "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com> wrote in messageK, > news:clud8.78$fL6.1043@news.cpqcorp.net... > > Dear Newsgroup,s > >DG > > If you are interested in what we are doing with porting the OpenVMS1J > > Operating System and Application to the Itanium Processor Family & theL > > Compiler Roadmaps here is the link.  This just went up on the web today. > >UH > > In particular if you have seen Gaitan Dantoni's presentation you may > > remember this prostrationo9 > > http://www.compaq.com/hps/ipf-enterprise/openvms.htmlc > >: > > Warm Regards,  > >h > > Sues > >e > >- > >3 > >6 > >1 >D >i   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:21:21 GMTe4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>% Subject: Re: OpenVMS IPF presentations: Message-ID: <5NEd8.11546$ro5.4152153@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>  @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message) news:tIvd8.87$fL6.706@news.cpqcorp.net... L > Now you want to read meaning into the ability of someone creating graphicsF > by hand in a slide?  Why not ask why the arrow for Linux is so thin?  J Better yet, ask why the enlightened graphics designers in Houston placed a6 picture of a Sun monitor on the VMS V7.3 distribution.  C Hint: It's either Black Helicopters, Ken Lay, Bob Palmer, or Elvis, 3 depending on what Conspiracy Theory you ascribe to.s   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 14:56:04 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)aY Subject: Re: Oracle RDB  ABUSIVE PRICE$  was (Re: MPE/iX users form OpenMPE organization)h3 Message-ID: <BRxBFILGXJ7M@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  [ In article <a568le02tk8@enews4.newsguy.com>, "Frank Sapienza" <sapienza@noesys.com> writes:cL > Are you certain this was RDB pricing?  The web page for Oracle Store shows5 > identical pricing for Oracle 9i Enterprise Edition.   H Prices for Oracle Rdb match the corresponding prices for Oracle Classic.G But the last I knew, Oracle Classic had some low end prices not offered  for Oracle Rdb.g   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:11:50 -0500/, From: "Frank Sapienza" <sapienza@noesys.com>Y Subject: Re: Oracle RDB  ABUSIVE PRICE$  was (Re: MPE/iX users form OpenMPE organization)E, Message-ID: <a568le02tk8@enews4.newsguy.com>  J Are you certain this was RDB pricing?  The web page for Oracle Store showsL identical pricing for Oracle 9i Enterprise Edition.  So, either the price isJ in fact the same for both database products or the salesperson didn't knowL that Oracle has a different enterprise database called Oracle RDB.  I'd voteA for the latter, and I have a call in to try and get pricing.  TheiL salesperson I spoke to didn't know about Oracle RDB 7 Enterprise Edition (asK listed on the Oracle/RDB web site) and initially asked me why I wanted suchdH an old version of the software.  That is, she thought I was asking about Oracle 7, not Oracle RDB 7.k  H I had this argument about the sales staff's lack of familiarity with theK product a couple of years ago but gave up trying.  It would seem to me that J if Oracle really was interested in supporting the installed base they'd at! least educate the sales team, no?/    ; "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in messagea: news:20020220140051.18418.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com...- > Today I received the following information:V >r/ > Each RDB license per processor: US$ 40.000,00e >t. > If I will buy a 6 processor Gs-80 I will pay >  > US$ 240.000,00 >d >f3 > Or each license per user US$ 800,00 x 300 users =s >a > US$ 240.000,00 >a2 > ABSURD !!!! How OpenVMS can be a "free and open"0 > operating system with this prices from Oracle. >i > Do you know this ??? >T > Do you know the Oracle says ?p >l > "-Buy me or I will eat you"  >e >e >e >t	 > Regardse >S > FC >m/ > --- Bob Ceculski <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote: 5 > > Fabio Cardoso <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote inN > > message  > >g> > news:<20020220112744.80035.qmail@web20206.mail.yahoo.com>.../ > > > What am I saying for a long time here !!!O > > >7 > > >.0 > > > OPENVMS CONSORTIUM NOW !!!!! Or better ... > > > YESTERDAY!!! > > > 
 > > > Regardsi > > >i > > > FC- > > > --- VMS Fan <VMSfan@hotmail.com> wrote:p2 > > > > Users of HP's e3000 and MPE/iX have banded > > together > > > > to form a newa8 > > > > organization aimed at prolonging the life of the > > > > platform.  See > > > > http://www.openmpe.org/v > > > >i2 > > > > Unfortunately, two of the most intuitively > > obvious  > > > > alternatives haved+ > > > > already been ruled out by HP.  From, > > > >s8 > > http://www.3000newswire.com/FN-OpenBoard-02Feb.html: > > > >r7 > > > > "R&D manager Dave Wilde of the HP 3000 divisione > > said > > > > that HP has 3 > > > > 'pruned' out the suggestions of selling thel > > division > > > > in total or'1 > > > > making MPE a fully Open Sourced project."f > > > > ---o5 > > > > "Rumors of my death are greatly exacerbated." ) > > > >                            -- VMS & > > > > (with apologies to Mark Twain) > > >g > > >s > > > =====h  > > > ========================== > > > Fbio dos Santos Cardoso > > > OpenVMS System Manager > > > Rio de Janeiro - Brazilt > > > fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br  > > > ========================== > >e5 > > if Compaq/HP doesn't want "paying" vms customers,C > > and try to do thel. > > same to vms, then I hope FreeVMS comes out > > eventually and we will not+ > > buy any Compaq/HP product again "ever"!  >a >I > =====i > ========================== > Fbio dos Santos Cardoso > OpenVMS System Manager > Rio de Janeiro - Brazil  > fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br > ========================== >d4 > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!?4 > Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games > http://sports.yahoo.comh   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 11:17:20 -0800-0 From: Mark Berryman <Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com> Subject: Re: PGP for OpenVMS?r, Message-ID: <3C7628C0.72EB3F59@Mvb.Saic.Com>   david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:a > Y > In article <C2256B68.005F2099.00@jklh21.valmet.com>, norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:t > >i > >a< > >Can anyone confirm or deny or elaborate on the following: > >eQ > >"The latest mention of it on comp.os.vms from Glenn and Mary Everhart suggestseP > >it's on the Fall 2001 Sig Tapes in the [NET] directory. I haven't looked so ID > >don't know whether this is still GNUPG 1.0.4 or a later version." > >  > >-Norm > >i > 5 > I've now looked on ftp://mvb.saic.com/vmslt01b/net/e" > and it appears to be GNUPG 1.0.6 > ) > However the file is in .TAR-BZ2 format.sO > I seem to recall seeing a decompression program which could handle .BZ2 filesaN > some time ago on VMS but haven't got it on my system. I'd expect to find theM > decompression tools on the same system as the ftp archive but can't seem to L > spot them. Anyone know where I can pick up a tool to decompress this file.  1 BZIP2 is on the freeware disk and can be found atv& ftp://mvb.saic.com/freewarev50/bzip2/   
 Mark Berrymanb Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 18:44:43 +0000 (UTC)i From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: PGP for OpenVMS?e+ Message-ID: <a563ir$45j$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>e  L In article <a561a2$3dp$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:M >In article <a55vmf$2nn$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:lY >>In article <C2256B68.005F2099.00@jklh21.valmet.com>, norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:o >>>a >>>o< >>>Can anyone confirm or deny or elaborate on the following: >>>)Q >>>"The latest mention of it on comp.os.vms from Glenn and Mary Everhart suggests,P >>>it's on the Fall 2001 Sig Tapes in the [NET] directory. I haven't looked so ID >>>don't know whether this is still GNUPG 1.0.4 or a later version." >>>  >>>-Norm >>>  >>5 >>I've now looked on ftp://mvb.saic.com/vmslt01b/net/9" >>and it appears to be GNUPG 1.0.6 >>) >>However the file is in .TAR-BZ2 format.dO >>I seem to recall seeing a decompression program which could handle .BZ2 files1N >>some time ago on VMS but haven't got it on my system. I'd expect to find theM >>decompression tools on the same system as the ftp archive but can't seem tobL >>spot them. Anyone know where I can pick up a tool to decompress this file. >> >> > O >Sorry should have looked a bit harder before posting. bzip2 is on the freeware  >5.0 cd. >   M And after all that it looks like the GNUPG is NOT a VMS distribution just thetD standard GNUPG unix version ie no .com files, descrip.mms files, vms sub-directories etc. l  M Does anyone know where to get a VMS version of GNUPG now that the GNUPG 1.0.4s8 version is no longer available from David Mathog's site.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 19:34:38 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>0 Subject: Re: PGP for OpenVMS?e6 Message-ID: <20020222193438.31489.qmail@gacracker.org>  4 On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:M >In article <a561a2$3dp$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes: N >>In article <a55vmf$2nn$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes:7 >>>In article <C2256B68.005F2099.00@jklh21.valmet.com>,1% >>>norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:s >>>> >>>>= >>>>Can anyone confirm or deny or elaborate on the following:y >>>>I >>>>"The latest mention of it on comp.os.vms from Glenn and Mary Everhart  >>>>suggestsE >>>>it's on the Fall 2001 Sig Tapes in the [NET] directory. I haven'ty >>>>looked so IhE >>>>don't know whether this is still GNUPG 1.0.4 or a later version."e >>>>	 >>>>-Norm  >>>> >>>t6 >>>I've now looked on ftp://mvb.saic.com/vmslt01b/net/# >>>and it appears to be GNUPG 1.0.6r >>>b* >>>However the file is in .TAR-BZ2 format.P >>>I seem to recall seeing a decompression program which could handle .BZ2 filesO >>>some time ago on VMS but haven't got it on my system. I'd expect to find the N >>>decompression tools on the same system as the ftp archive but can't seem toM >>>spot them. Anyone know where I can pick up a tool to decompress this file.a >>>t >>>  >>P >>Sorry should have looked a bit harder before posting. bzip2 is on the freeware	 >>5.0 cd.h >> >yN >And after all that it looks like the GNUPG is NOT a VMS distribution just theE >standard GNUPG unix version ie no .com files, descrip.mms files, vms: >sub-directories etc.  > N >Does anyone know where to get a VMS version of GNUPG now that the GNUPG 1.0.49 >version is no longer available from David Mathog's site.i  I If you got to the link below you should be able to find it in the historye of the seqaxp site.o  7 http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://seqaxp.caltech.edu/m  E Unless of course it was held on ftp which they don't seem to archive.=     Doc. -- =6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                              http://vmsbox.cjb.netm   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 17:01:40 -0800a' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>a Subject: Re: PGP for OpenVMS?M+ Message-ID: <3C76E9F4.D415F06C@caltech.edu>v   david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote:v > O > Does anyone know where to get a VMS version of GNUPG now that the GNUPG 1.0.4d: > version is no longer available from David Mathog's site.  G It's still there but it may have moved from the URL you have.  Look in:a  / ftp://saf.bio.caltech.edu/pub/software/openvms/c  N Don't ask me for support though - I don't have a VMS machine anymore to run it on.c   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu   ------------------------------   Date: 22 FEB 2002 17:46:19 GMT4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher)F Subject: Re: Poor Performance with OpenVMS Advanced Server and TCPWare6 Message-ID: <22FEB02.17461921@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>  = In a previous article, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> wrote:I  & ->TCPIP> sysconfig -q inet tcpnodelack ->inet:  ->tcpnodelack = 1S -> i ->TCPIP> sho prot tcp/pari ->TCPC# ->  Delay ACK:              enabled-# ->  Window scale:           enabled # ->  Drop count:                   0m# ->  Probe timer:                  0> -> jA ->If I change with the SET PROT TCP command the tcpnodelack valuee= ->changes but the display shown by SHO PROT TCP/PAR does not.a ->   ->BUG!!o  6 Fixed by at least TCPIP V5.1 ECO3 and probably before.   --G -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madison 2 --                      karcher@waisman.wisc.edu     ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:24:05 -0600 C From: "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com>g= Subject: Re: POSIX for OpenVMS - is there something similar ?iH Message-ID: <craig.berry-F556B7.23240522022002@news.directvinternet.com>  3 In article <HpwXl7C6fxVW@eisner.encompasserve.org>,>/  koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote:   < > In article <3C74A657.D6A56B5C@t-online.de>, Rainer Lehrig  > <lehrig@t-online.de> writes: > G > > I'm searching for a subsystem like "POSIX for OpenVMS", which would A > > allow me to run programs which think of files in unix syntax.nB > > (DEVICE:[dir.subdir]file.ext  <-> /device/dir/subdir/file.ext) > I >    All the I/O routines in the C library already do this.  Not perfect,pA >    but probably what you want and they're getting better.  i.e. 9 >    with no code changes the following WILL work on VMS:  >  >       FILE *ip;a > 6 >       ip = fopen("/device/dir/subdir/file.ext","r"); > ) >    You also get this with C++ and Java.:  	 and Perl.m   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:42:19 -0500s5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>s2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS0 Message-ID: <Ymwd8.91$fL6.1195@news.cpqcorp.net>  J In the course of a career, there are sometimes that you are called upon toH paint the best picture you can.  And yes, my career has included being a8 software services specialist, and I had to do pre-sales.  * I can say that I never lied to a customer.  J I am not paid to read or write in this forum.  In fact, there is no careerK benefit to me personally for doing so.  Nobody has asked me to.  It doesn'ttJ show up on my review.  My boss, and his boss, and his boss don't pat me onH the back and say "good job".  In fact there is more risk that I will sayJ something to piss someone off externally or internally than anything else.  L Are there things I can't say?  Of course.  Some are Compaq confidential, andH some are just my opinons at times that may differ with the corporations.  E I may choose to be optomistic about a particular outcome, but I don'tmD believe that I would write something that I patently believed has noG realistic chance of happening.  For all the doomsayers that have talkedlI about the imminent demise of VMS for the last decade... we're still here..      0 paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote in message, <01KEIAW3FDQA005D2B@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>... >Bill Todd wrote: < >>"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message( >>news:3C732F7D.CCB78621@videotron.ca... >> >>...e >>L >>> HP gains access to the clustering and TCP technologies and access to theJ >>> experienced employees who would make a difference. Those have probably beenI >>> given hefty bonuses to not only stay at Compaq/HP but also prortitute . >>> themselves to defend the companies' plans. >>F >>That last comment was *way* out of line (if it referred to technical people,2 >>as it appeared to).  >eI >Not true, Bill (that J-F's comment was out of line).  In another life int the K >UK (one of several reasons that I ended up here -- .au not c.o.v :-) ), ask a I >technical programmer I had to prostitute myself.  Hmm, no hefty bonus, I  just2 >had to support a wife and young son and daughter. >eH >From my experience, my sympathy goes to our VMS engineers.  They might,K >however, be right in their expectations and we wrong.  Regardless, I wouldeJ >expect them to be primarily interested in keeping the bank account in the >black.h >r >Regards, Paddy  >e   ------------------------------   Date: 22 Feb 2002 20:58:45 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)e2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS, Message-ID: <a56be5$14gk$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  , In article <3C75F607.BF161F32@videotron.ca>,0  JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:& |> Rob Young wrote list of C2 systems:5 |> > Data General Corporation AOS/VS II, Release 3.10tD |> > Digital Equipment Corporation OpenVMS VAX and Alpha Version 6.1T |> > Microsoft Corporation Windows NT Workstation and Windows NT Server, Version 4.0 |> fO |> VMS is not in very good company in that rating. Of course, if NT can get it,oN |> it means that the rating is meaningless. Also, the fact that the rating was' |> not maintained past 6.1 tells a lot.3  E Actually, it merely means they chose not to have it certified.  WhicheE probably means they were not interested in staying in that particulare market.c  C I found NT being there somewhat of a surprise too and agree that itt6 probably makes that level of certifaction meaningless.  = Knowing that the rating means someone has gone over the code,o< hopefully removing bugs and holes along the way, and knowing; that NSA has the money and resources to actually do this, Ik< now plan to give their Linux project a serious look.  I have: been becoming more and more dis-illusioned with FreeBSD of* late for many reasons, including security.   bill; [who worked in security before they wrote the Orange Book.]E   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   p   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 18:37:07 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)c2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS3 Message-ID: <sq4KtyEG2BBX@eisner.encompasserve.org>g  ` In article <a56be5$14gk$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:. > In article <3C75F607.BF161F32@videotron.ca>,2 >  JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:( > |> Rob Young wrote list of C2 systems:7 > |> > Data General Corporation AOS/VS II, Release 3.10 F > |> > Digital Equipment Corporation OpenVMS VAX and Alpha Version 6.1V > |> > Microsoft Corporation Windows NT Workstation and Windows NT Server, Version 4.0 > |> sQ > |> VMS is not in very good company in that rating. Of course, if NT can get it,TP > |> it means that the rating is meaningless. Also, the fact that the rating was) > |> not maintained past 6.1 tells a lot.  > G > Actually, it merely means they chose not to have it certified.  WhichaG > probably means they were not interested in staying in that particulara	 > market.  > E > I found NT being there somewhat of a surprise too and agree that it 8 > probably makes that level of certifaction meaningless.  7 Note that the evaluation of NT was a standalone system.d6 The evaluation of VMS was in a cluster running DECnet.  ? > Knowing that the rating means someone has gone over the code,s> > hopefully removing bugs and holes along the way, and knowing= > that NSA has the money and resources to actually do this, Im> > now plan to give their Linux project a serious look.  I have< > been becoming more and more dis-illusioned with FreeBSD of, > late for many reasons, including security.  E Would it spoil your day to know that the NCSC hired outside companieso to do the evaluations ?t   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:58:54 -08000' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>s2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS+ Message-ID: <3C76E94E.97D7CD5E@caltech.edu>s   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:* >  For all the doomsayers that have talkedK > about the imminent demise of VMS for the last decade... we're still here.   P However most of the doomsayers are not.  VMS may still exist as a product but in manyJ markets (academia in particular) it's but a fond memory.  For instance, in. my lab we don't have any running VMS machines.   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 20:29:31 -0500g- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS, Message-ID: <3C76F079.E132D122@videotron.ca>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:9 > Note that the evaluation of NT was a standalone system. 8 > The evaluation of VMS was in a cluster running DECnet.  D That is lost in marketing. When Microsoft makes claims that NT is C2E compliant, it won't stipulate that to gain that level, it must run ontK batteries, no connected to ANYTHING and run an a room protected from any RFd> radiation etc etc. MS will just claim that NT is C2 compliant.  M The end result is that it dilutes the value of C2 compliance of other systemsr6 who can gain C2 compliance with usable configurations.  H From the PC weenies point of view, it elevates NT to a "real and secure"L operating system. And to the real computer folks, it lowers their OS down to# the gutter levels where NT resides.   D MS couldn't get NT to meet the serious OS' levels of security. So itN broughtthe standards down to its level. Now, one cannot pitch MVS/VMS or otherN proprietary system against NT with C2 compliance/security as a major advantageH worth the extra money since on paper, NT is also just as secure since it passed C2 compliance.=  K One would have hoped that the other OS manufacters would have protested then. awarding of C2 to NT under such circumstances.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 20:34:40 -0500d- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>=2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS, Message-ID: <3C76F1AE.5DAECFB9@videotron.ca>  J I can understand now why it wasn't worth continuing C2 certification afterM version 6.1 of VMS since  C2 became meaningless as soon as Microsoft was ableo- to claim its NT was just as compliant as VMS.t    K Ideally, manufacturers should have pushed for the C2 standards to change in N such a way as to make sre that NT could not qualify, at which poinmt, it mightE has been worth continuing the certification since it would have given1K certified systems a definite edge over NT and would have also sent a strong,, message that NT wasn't ready for prime-time.   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 19:10:33 -08001 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski)G2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS= Message-ID: <857e9e41.0202221910.753103c5@posting.google.com>    Newsgroup folks,  D What Fred has said is true.  It is your choice to belive us or not. D But please keep in mind what Fred has said in this note.  None of usC at Compaq are commended by management for any participation on thistF newsgroup.  We participate because we care about VMS and what you have to say.e  F JF what bonus? you must obviously know something we do not, because we sure have not gotten them.  ; Its funny to me, but all the people from the VMS group that E participate in this newsgroup are known for being straight shooters. lE Why would we take the time to lie, we are very busy?  And if you knewcC Fred or Hoff or Robert or John or Clair or Andy you would know thatm they do NOT lie.  B And if you think that makes me a prostitute too, so be it.  I have< been called worse for saying what I think. And I will not be= intimidated or scared away from stating my opinion by anyone.2  C There are many people from this newsgroup who really value what the F engineers opinion.  And if you doubt the integrity of Compaq employeesA in the VMS Group.  Please feel free to contact our group manager.e Mark.Gorham@compaq.com   Sue       m "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message news:<Ymwd8.91$fL6.1195@news.cpqcorp.net>...GL > In the course of a career, there are sometimes that you are called upon toJ > paint the best picture you can.  And yes, my career has included being a: > software services specialist, and I had to do pre-sales. > , > I can say that I never lied to a customer. > L > I am not paid to read or write in this forum.  In fact, there is no careerM > benefit to me personally for doing so.  Nobody has asked me to.  It doesn't L > show up on my review.  My boss, and his boss, and his boss don't pat me onJ > the back and say "good job".  In fact there is more risk that I will sayL > something to piss someone off externally or internally than anything else. > N > Are there things I can't say?  Of course.  Some are Compaq confidential, andJ > some are just my opinons at times that may differ with the corporations. > G > I may choose to be optomistic about a particular outcome, but I don't F > believe that I would write something that I patently believed has noI > realistic chance of happening.  For all the doomsayers that have talkedoK > about the imminent demise of VMS for the last decade... we're still here.n >  >  > 2 > paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote in message. > <01KEIAW3FDQA005D2B@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>... > >Bill Todd wrote:s> > >>"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message* > >>news:3C732F7D.CCB78621@videotron.ca... > >> > >>...e > >>N > >>> HP gains access to the clustering and TCP technologies and access to theL > >>> experienced employees who would make a difference. Those have probably >  beenuK > >>> given hefty bonuses to not only stay at Compaq/HP but also prortituteF0 > >>> themselves to defend the companies' plans. > >>H > >>That last comment was *way* out of line (if it referred to technical
 >  people, > >>as it appeared to).  > >oK > >Not true, Bill (that J-F's comment was out of line).  In another life ino >  theM > >UK (one of several reasons that I ended up here -- .au not c.o.v :-) ), as' >  aK > >technical programmer I had to prostitute myself.  Hmm, no hefty bonus, I> >  just 4 > >had to support a wife and young son and daughter. > >aJ > >From my experience, my sympathy goes to our VMS engineers.  They might,M > >however, be right in their expectations and we wrong.  Regardless, I wouldBL > >expect them to be primarily interested in keeping the bank account in the	 > >black.  > >d > >Regards, Paddyo > >    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 22:39:33 -0500 * From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>2 Subject: RE: Profitability and the survival of VMS- Message-ID: <0033000054097645000002L052*@MHS>r   =0ASue said:  >    Its funny to me, but all the people from the VMS group that=    participate in this newsgroup are known for being straighto    shooters.  A I, for one, will publicly and without reservation say "thanks" torA Sue, and Fred, and Hoff, and Steve Lionel, and Paul Anderson, andi( Jilly, to name a few within d|i|g|i/paq.  ? Although I can't say as much for some of the exalted personagest? who dwell in the org chart ionosphere for a short time and thenw7 vanish, y'all remain through the changes in regime, anda* FOR THE RECORD YOU GUYS DO SHOOT STRAIGHT.  ? It's especially egregious for folks to disparage y'all during a @ quiet period when the law places limits on the specifics of what y'all can say back.   ? I can only imagine what Carl would say about it if he were here 	 to do so.m   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETF( Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 10:10 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET2 Subject: RE: Profitability and the survival of VMS     Newsgroup folks,  C What Fred has said is true.  It is your choice to belive us or not.hD But please keep in mind what Fred has said in this note.  None of usC at Compaq are commended by management for any participation on thisiF newsgroup.  We participate because we care about VMS and what you have to say.-  F JF what bonus? you must obviously know something we do not, because we sure have not gotten them.  ; Its funny to me, but all the people from the VMS group thateD participate in this newsgroup are known for being straight shooters.E Why would we take the time to lie, we are very busy?  And if you knewIC Fred or Hoff or Robert or John or Clair or Andy you would know that  they do NOT lie.  B And if you think that makes me a prostitute too, so be it.  I have< been called worse for saying what I think. And I will not be= intimidated or scared away from stating my opinion by anyone.a  C There are many people from this newsgroup who really value what the F engineers opinion.  And if you doubt the integrity of Compaq employeesA in the VMS Group.  Please feel free to contact our group manager.a Mark.Gorham@compaq.com   Suee      @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in messageH news:<Ymwd8.91$fL6.1195@news.cpqcorp.net>... > In the course of a caree= r, there) are sometimes that you are called upon topH > paint the best picture you can.  And yes, my career has included bein= g an: > software services specialist, and I had to do pre-sales. >w, > I can say that I never lied to a customer. >WH > I am not paid to read or write in this forum.  In fact, there is no c= areer H > benefit to me personally for doing so.  Nobody has asked me to.  It d= oesn'tH > show up on my review.  My boss, and his boss, and his boss don't pat = me on H > the back and say "good job".  In fact there is more risk that I will = say H > something to piss someone off externally or internally than anything = else.I >rH > Are there things I can't say?  Of course.  Some are Compaq confidenti= al, anduH > some are just my opinons at times that may differ with the corporatio= ns.n >IH > I may choose to be optomistic about a particular outcome, but I don't=  F > believe that I would write something that I patently believed has noH > realistic chance of happening.  For all the doomsayers that have talk= edH > about the imminent demise of VMS for the last decade... we're still h= ere. >P >i >i2 > paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote in message. > <01KEIAW3FDQA005D2B@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>... > >Bill Todd wrote:m> > >>"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message* > >>news:3C732F7D.CCB78621@videotron.ca... > >> > >>...i > >>H > >>> HP gains access to the clustering and TCP technologies and access=  to the H > >>> experienced employees who would make a difference. Those have pro= bablye >  been H > >>> given hefty bonuses to not only stay at Compaq/HP but also prorti= tute0 > >>> themselves to defend the companies' plans. > >>H > >>That last comment was *way* out of line (if it referred to technica= l 
 >  people, > >>as it appeared to).l > > H > >Not true, Bill (that J-F's comment was out of line).  In another lif= e in >  theH > >UK (one of several reasons that I ended up here -- .au not c.o.v :-)=  ), as >  aH > >technical programmer I had to prostitute myself.  Hmm, no hefty bonu= s, I >  justv4 > >had to support a wife and young son and daughter. > > H > >From my experience, my sympathy goes to our VMS engineers.  They mig= ht,bH > >however, be right in their expectations and we wrong.  Regardless, I=  wouldH > >expect them to be primarily interested in keeping the bank account i= n the.	 > >black.  > >  > >Regards, Paddy  > >=   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:33:16 GMT1/ From: "W. John Guineau" <guineau@earthlink.net>c2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS7 Message-ID: <04Ed8.479$1d4.709649@twister.socal.rr.com>e  K Having worked in the VMS Development group for several years (circa OpenVMSoI 5.x and the first releases of OpenVMS Alpha 1.0, when it was still called.K DEC) - I can vouch for people like Fred Kleinsorge and Andy Goldstein. They H are world class developers and have NO NEED to lie. They believe in VMS,K obviously, because they have stood behind it for more years than anyone cant& count. Andy was a VMS V1.0 designer...  L While I'm at it - Hey Fred, Andy! You guys are still there! Wow! Very coool.   john    > "Sue Skonetski" <susan_skonetski@hotmail.com> wrote in message7 news:857e9e41.0202221910.753103c5@posting.google.com...  > Newsgroup folks, >gE > What Fred has said is true.  It is your choice to belive us or not.hF > But please keep in mind what Fred has said in this note.  None of usE > at Compaq are commended by management for any participation on this H > newsgroup.  We participate because we care about VMS and what you have	 > to say.: >:H > JF what bonus? you must obviously know something we do not, because we > sure have not gotten them. >7= > Its funny to me, but all the people from the VMS group thatcF > participate in this newsgroup are known for being straight shooters.G > Why would we take the time to lie, we are very busy?  And if you kneweE > Fred or Hoff or Robert or John or Clair or Andy you would know thato > they do NOT lie. >TD > And if you think that makes me a prostitute too, so be it.  I have> > been called worse for saying what I think. And I will not be? > intimidated or scared away from stating my opinion by anyone.i >iE > There are many people from this newsgroup who really value what thetH > engineers opinion.  And if you doubt the integrity of Compaq employeesC > in the VMS Group.  Please feel free to contact our group manager.a > Mark.Gorham@compaq.com >  > Suet >r >b >mB > "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message, news:<Ymwd8.91$fL6.1195@news.cpqcorp.net>...K > > In the course of a career, there are sometimes that you are called uponm toL > > paint the best picture you can.  And yes, my career has included being a< > > software services specialist, and I had to do pre-sales. > >w. > > I can say that I never lied to a customer. > >rG > > I am not paid to read or write in this forum.  In fact, there is noE careerG > > benefit to me personally for doing so.  Nobody has asked me to.  Itv doesn'tcK > > show up on my review.  My boss, and his boss, and his boss don't pat me  onL > > the back and say "good job".  In fact there is more risk that I will sayH > > something to piss someone off externally or internally than anything else.l > >pL > > Are there things I can't say?  Of course.  Some are Compaq confidential, andeL > > some are just my opinons at times that may differ with the corporations. > >oI > > I may choose to be optomistic about a particular outcome, but I don'ttH > > believe that I would write something that I patently believed has noK > > realistic chance of happening.  For all the doomsayers that have talkedaG > > about the imminent demise of VMS for the last decade... we're stilli here.V > >X > >A > >V4 > > paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote in message0 > > <01KEIAW3FDQA005D2B@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>... > > >Bill Todd wrote:v@ > > >>"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message, > > >>news:3C732F7D.CCB78621@videotron.ca... > > >>	 > > >>...h > > >>L > > >>> HP gains access to the clustering and TCP technologies and access to thehE > > >>> experienced employees who would make a difference. Those haven probably	 > >  beeniB > > >>> given hefty bonuses to not only stay at Compaq/HP but also
 prortitute2 > > >>> themselves to defend the companies' plans. > > >>J > > >>That last comment was *way* out of line (if it referred to technical > >  people, > > >>as it appeared to).n > > >tJ > > >Not true, Bill (that J-F's comment was out of line).  In another life in > >  theL > > >UK (one of several reasons that I ended up here -- .au not c.o.v :-) ), as > >  aK > > >technical programmer I had to prostitute myself.  Hmm, no hefty bonus,s Io	 > >  just 6 > > >had to support a wife and young son and daughter. > > > L > > >From my experience, my sympathy goes to our VMS engineers.  They might,I > > >however, be right in their expectations and we wrong.  Regardless, I- would-J > > >expect them to be primarily interested in keeping the bank account in theg > > >black.e > > >s > > >Regards, Paddya > > >a   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:35:11 GMTr! From: Andy <acs@fcgnet.works.net>e2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS> Message-ID: <Xns91BDEFBE32EE5acsfcgnetworksnet@216.166.71.232>  5 David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu> enlightened us with $ news:3C76E94E.97D7CD5E@caltech.edu:    > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:+ >>  For all the doomsayers that have talkedo@ >> about the imminent demise of VMS for the last decade... we're >> still here.   > A > However most of the doomsayers are not.  VMS may still exist as0B > a product but in many markets (academia in particular) it's but  > a fond memory. s  ? From the context (And things I've seen you write over the yearsr7 here) I'm assuming by academia you mean "as part of theaA educational process", "research" and other venues where students i4 and faculty have the potential to be exposed to VMS.  @ There are still a number of schools using VMS for administrativeA functions. Not a lot, but more than none. Why don't we hear aboutN@ them here ? With very few exceptions, most of the users of those; kinds of systems don't even know this forum exists. And, of A course, this isn't one of Compaq's "target markets" so it doesn'ta@ get much, if any, press. But it's still out there... getting the
 job done.    -Andy- -- v   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 00:02:03 -0500f- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>v2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS+ Message-ID: <3C77224B.DF7EFAB@videotron.ca>r   Sue Skonetski wrote:D > And if you think that makes me a prostitute too, so be it.  I have> > been called worse for saying what I think. And I will not be? > intimidated or scared away from stating my opinion by anyone.i  H I never named names. I was actually thinking of someone else who used toN support Alpha' cause but has now become an IA64 apologist.  It is obvious that+ Compaq employees must tow the company line.   H While your corporation assures us that customers are very happy with theK downgrade from Alpha to IA64, you have to admit that some customers who hadAJ seen the very  pro-Alpha and very Anti IA64 presentations from Digital andJ then Compaq find it very hard to believe Compaq's excuses. Had Compaq beenL honest and simply said that they wanted to be in bed with Intel or whatever, there wouldn't be a discussion.l  N It is obvious that employees of Compaq must tow the company line. I understandL that. But you still have to admit that from a customer perspective, it seemsN extremely strange to see some employee who used to tout the greatness of Alpha? and the sillyness of IA64 who now says that IA64 will be great.a  I For what it is worth, I stayed away from personal insults, something some1F Compaq employees who participate here have not and have personally and specifically insulted me.s  J There have also been some whose employer is not known and who have changedE their tune rather dramatically and now support IA64 when before, theytV supoprted Alpha. One has to wonder what would cause someone to change so dramatically.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:36:09 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>J Subject: Re: Proof that EV8 was fantastic ... and Capellas "gave" it away!: Message-ID: <Z_Ed8.11552$ro5.4163735@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>   > B > The sad fact, too, is that even during the many years that AlphaE > enjoyed a 2x performance (and price/performance) advantage over thekH > competition, Digital (and later Compaq) still somehow didn't have whatH > it took (either in ability, or in willpower) to make it succeed in the > marketplace.  9 As the old expression goes, "It's the MARKETING, STUPID!"   L The DEC Alpha folks were either too stupid to market, or they were gagged byK the Operating System Political Correctness Police. I think it's the latter. H Why do you think Jesse Lipcon finally got fed up with the Houston BS????   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:54:59 -0500r5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> % Subject: Re: Screen Saver Problem (?)d0 Message-ID: <Qywd8.94$fL6.1102@news.cpqcorp.net>  @ This sounds like an old problem on the P300/350.  Also check theB sys$loadable_images directory for a stale image (if you had put on any hand fixed images).l  D Why are you at 7.2-1 instead of V7.2-2 -- bugfixes are not typically3 being made any longer for versions prior to V7.2-2.       ! Jim Strehlow wrote in message ...s+ >Update v3.0 includes VMS721_GRAPHICS-V0400i. >so you should be okay on that side of things. >mB >Some of the other patches that I have applied below are mandatory >and others are optional.n% >Maybe something else needs patching?c >hL >----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------- -n >----y: >PRODUCT                             KIT TYPE    OPERATIONL >----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------- -  >----y8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_DCL V3.0          Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_SYSLOA V2.0       Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_LAN V3.0          Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_IPC V2.0          Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_BACKUP V2.0       Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_DRIVER V4.0       Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_CLIUTL V3.0       Patch       InstallG >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_SYS V11.0         Patch       Install       (warninge >regarding reboot)8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_RMS V3.0          Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_MOUNT96 V3.0      Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_MAIL V1.0         Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_LAT V1.0          Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_FIBRE_SCSI V5.0   Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_DW_MOT_MUP V1.0   Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_AUDSRV V2.0       Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS TCPIP_ECO V5.1-153       Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_LIBRTL V3.0       Patch       Install8 >DEC AXPVMS VMS721_UPDATE V3.0       Patch       Install >t >I hope that might help? >o" >Jim Strehlow, Data911, Alameda CA >e5 >"Brass Christof" <welcome@spam.net> wrote in messager# >news:3C75F95F.40B5F329@spam.net...m >> Jim Strehlow wrote: >> >> >> > I have survived various fixable problems with DECwindows.= >> > Solutions ranged from changing a setting on the graphicse$ >> > adapter board inside the box to9 >> > loading OpenVMS patches for the proper graphics cardc  >> > for the version of OpenVMS. >> >; >> > You should mention what type of graphics card, versiona1 >> > of OpenVMS, and maybe a PRODUCT SHOW HISTORYe/ >> > to see what patches are already installed.  >> >> Of course, as always. >>$ >> DS20E, single cpu 500 MHz, 512MB.? >> Two PowerStorm 300, devices GBB0 (head 1) and GBA0 (head 2).e >> >> $ product show history *  >>< >> PRODUCT                             KIT TYPE    OPERATION> >> ----------------------------------- ----------- -----------: >> DEC AXPVMS VMS721_UPDATE V3.0       Patch       Install: >> DEC AXPVMS VMS721_PCSI V1.0         Patch       Install: >> DEC AXPVMS DECNET_OSI V7.2-1        Full LP     Install: >> DEC AXPVMS DWMOTIF V1.2-5           Full LP     Install: >> DEC AXPVMS OPENVMS V7.2-1           Platform    Install: >> DEC AXPVMS TCPIP V5.0-10            Full LP     Install: >> DEC AXPVMS VMS V7.2-1               Oper System Install >>! >> $ type decw$server_0_error.logl >>8 >> This is the DECwindows X11 display server for OpenVMS6 >> AXP V7.1-001212 compiled on Dec 12 2000 at 16:34:31 >> ... >> --u9 >> moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence- >O >i   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:48:15 +0100r' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net>b% Subject: Re: Screen Saver Problem (?)a( Message-ID: <3C76CAAF.28734FDD@spam.net>   Jim Strehlow wrote:f > , > Update v3.0 includes VMS721_GRAPHICS-V0400/ > so you should be okay on that side of things.  > C > Some of the other patches that I have applied below are mandatoryC > and others are optional.& > Maybe something else needs patching? > N > ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- ---------------- > ----; > PRODUCT                             KIT TYPE    OPERATION N > ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- ---------------- > ----9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_DCL V3.0          Patch       Installg9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_SYSLOA V2.0       Patch       Instally9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_LAN V3.0          Patch       Install 9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_IPC V2.0          Patch       Install 9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_BACKUP V2.0       Patch       Installa9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_DRIVER V4.0       Patch       Installo9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_CLIUTL V3.0       Patch       Install H > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_SYS V11.0         Patch       Install       (warning > regarding reboot)n9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_RMS V3.0          Patch       Installn9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_MOUNT96 V3.0      Patch       Installg9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_MAIL V1.0         Patch       Installe9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_LAT V1.0          Patch       Installd9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_FIBRE_SCSI V5.0   Patch       Installe9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_DW_MOT_MUP V1.0   Patch       Install 9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_AUDSRV V2.0       Patch       Installl9 > DEC AXPVMS TCPIP_ECO V5.1-153       Patch       Install 9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_LIBRTL V3.0       Patch       Installs9 > DEC AXPVMS VMS721_UPDATE V3.0       Patch       Install  >  > I hope that might help?  > # > Jim Strehlow, Data911, Alameda CA.  < Thanks, I'll carefully look at it and patch whatever needed.   -- o6 moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 14:02:13 -08001 From: Alex.Feliziani@space.gc.ca (Alex Feliziani) + Subject: Session Manager Won't Start!! HELP = Message-ID: <f4436989.0202221402.3618dffa@posting.google.com>t   Hi,   D I am logging into an account on $disk2. ($disk1=system disk). When i? enter the Login and password it reaches all the way to the bluelA screen(my screen) where the session manager tries to start but ittD doesn't appear on the screen and the screen turns black for a secondD and then goes back to the login prompt!I would greatly apreciate theD help. Can anyone tell me what files are run one by one to get to the session manager window opened.  
 Thank You! Alex   ------------------------------    Date: 22 Feb 2002 14:21:09 -0800, From: ozoneradical@yahoo.com (Ozone Radical) Subject: Setting Time and Date= Message-ID: <8e0a2732.0202221421.208dcd05@posting.google.com>s  C My college obtained a copule of VMS machines, and I need to set thexC time and day back to get certain software working. How do we do it?lC SET TIME doesn't work. Says too many parameters. Also we don't have  the help file.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 17:48:53 -0500s1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com>t" Subject: Re: Setting Time and Date2 Message-ID: <3C76CAD5.BA22B9BA@firstdbasource.com>    $set time="22-FEB-2002:17:55:30"   Ozone Radical wrote: > E > My college obtained a copule of VMS machines, and I need to set the E > time and day back to get certain software working. How do we do it?hE > SET TIME doesn't work. Says too many parameters. Also we don't haved > the help file.   -- y Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163 7 First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.com  Sr. Consultant 704-947-1089 (Office)t 704-236-4377 (Mobile)e   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:41:03 GMTa4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>" Subject: Re: Shannon on the merger: Message-ID: <jbEd8.11537$ro5.4130245@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>  ? "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in message93 news:29td8.8524$ro5.3746692@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...S >v7 > "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message 8 > news:d7791aa1.0202220652.16a43bd@posting.google.com...9 > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messageeA > news:<sChd8.144851$Aw2.10337398@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...NK > > > Terry has now weighed in at openvms.org and tru64.org in favor of thetJ > > > merger, listing the same tired arguments the principals have trotted out L > > > repeatedly and unconvincingly for 5 months now.  Why he is so securely3 > > > ensconced in Compaq's pocket remains unknown.r  + Thank you for your opinion, oh Learned One!c  I Got a complaint about the merger? Then put your money where your mouth ise  and vote your shares against it.  J Or just keep bitching and whining, for all the good it will do you and for0 anyone else who has a vested interest in Compaq.  I I note with interest that most of the loudest bitchers and whiners aren'tVG even Compaq customers, which renders their bitching and whining totally , irrelevant. Perhaps they need to get a life.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:32:13 GMTV1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> " Subject: Re: Shannon on the merger' Message-ID: <3C771CAF.251B1DD4@fsi.net>r   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:e > A > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in messageo5 > news:29td8.8524$ro5.3746692@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...  > >p9 > > "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in messagea: > > news:d7791aa1.0202220652.16a43bd@posting.google.com...; > > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messageaC > > news:<sChd8.144851$Aw2.10337398@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>... M > > > > Terry has now weighed in at openvms.org and tru64.org in favor of thepL > > > > merger, listing the same tired arguments the principals have trotted > outuN > > > > repeatedly and unconvincingly for 5 months now.  Why he is so securely5 > > > > ensconced in Compaq's pocket remains unknown.n > - > Thank you for your opinion, oh Learned One!o > K > Got a complaint about the merger? Then put your money where your mouth isa" > and vote your shares against it. > L > Or just keep bitching and whining, for all the good it will do you and for2 > anyone else who has a vested interest in Compaq. > K > I note with interest that most of the loudest bitchers and whiners aren'tyI > even Compaq customers, which renders their bitching and whining totallye. > irrelevant. Perhaps they need to get a life.   (DJ dodges flying shrapnel...)  G Damn! I better get busy on my Linux and Solaris projects! This group isp getting too dangerous!  H (Currently downloading CSWB T1.0, FWIW. Maybe my little Alpha can handleC it, maybe not. Probably need more RAM. Gotta find some more 64MB ors better parity SIMMs...)t   -- f David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 05:00:19 GMTn* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>" Subject: Re: Shannon on the mergerC Message-ID: <DlFd8.174484$Re2.13062978@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   ? "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in messageQ4 news:jbEd8.11537$ro5.4130245@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net... > A > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in message 5 > news:29td8.8524$ro5.3746692@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...  > >h9 > > "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message : > > news:d7791aa1.0202220652.16a43bd@posting.google.com...; > > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messagebC > > news:<sChd8.144851$Aw2.10337398@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...lI > > > > Terry has now weighed in at openvms.org and tru64.org in favor of  the>L > > > > merger, listing the same tired arguments the principals have trotted > out E > > > > repeatedly and unconvincingly for 5 months now.  Why he is son securely5 > > > > ensconced in Compaq's pocket remains unknown.o >e- > Thank you for your opinion, oh Learned One!.   Always glad to help.   >tK > Got a complaint about the merger? Then put your money where your mouth is " > and vote your shares against it.  I I wouldn't hold Compaq shares unless they were given to me, in which caseeF I'd unload them ASAP:  I'm perfectly willing to help people understandI what's going on, but feel no obligation to sink with the ship while doingi so.y   >rL > Or just keep bitching and whining, for all the good it will do you and for2 > anyone else who has a vested interest in Compaq.  K I dunno - some people seem to have appreciated my efforts, so it seems theyjD haven't gone completely for naught.  And you've stated yourself thatI competitors have picked up on them, which wasn't my particular intent butuI seems entirely appropriate.  So said efforts appear to have been at leastn= somewhat effective, even though you may not like the effects.a   >tK > I note with interest that most of the loudest bitchers and whiners aren't I > even Compaq customers, which renders their bitching and whining totallyd. > irrelevant. Perhaps they need to get a life.  F Thanks - I already have one.  But it sometimes includes taking a standK against mediocrity and mendacity.  Kind of fun, actually.  And I'm afraid I C don't consider you the last word on what's relevant and what's not.s   Ta ta,   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 04:33:41 GMTl4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>" Subject: Re: Shannon on the merger: Message-ID: <FYEd8.11551$ro5.4161624@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3C771CAF.251B1DD4@fsi.net...e > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > > C > > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> wrote in messageg7 > > news:29td8.8524$ro5.3746692@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...- > > >-; > > > "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in messagef< > > > news:d7791aa1.0202220652.16a43bd@posting.google.com...= > > > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messagerE > > > news:<sChd8.144851$Aw2.10337398@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>... K > > > > > Terry has now weighed in at openvms.org and tru64.org in favor ofl the F > > > > > merger, listing the same tired arguments the principals have trotteda > > out.G > > > > > repeatedly and unconvincingly for 5 months now.  Why he is soe securely7 > > > > > ensconced in Compaq's pocket remains unknown.e > >e/ > > Thank you for your opinion, oh Learned One!o > >nJ > > Got a complaint about the merger? Then put your money where your mouth is$ > > and vote your shares against it. > > J > > Or just keep bitching and whining, for all the good it will do you and for 4 > > anyone else who has a vested interest in Compaq. > >HF > > I note with interest that most of the loudest bitchers and whiners aren'tK > > even Compaq customers, which renders their bitching and whining totallys0 > > irrelevant. Perhaps they need to get a life. >h  > (DJ dodges flying shrapnel...) >fI > Damn! I better get busy on my Linux and Solaris projects! This group ise > getting too dangerous! >sJ > (Currently downloading CSWB T1.0, FWIW. Maybe my little Alpha can handleE > it, maybe not. Probably need more RAM. Gotta find some more 64MB org > better parity SIMMs...)o >r  H No guarantees, but I may have some old SIMMS kicking around. I'll try to take a look, but no guarantees   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 12:51:41 -0700y$ From: Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca>- Subject: Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...l) Message-ID: <3C76A14D.ABB20C3F@cha.ab.ca>   D Here's an example of using a procedure to edit the results of a file created by MONITOR CUSTER<   $   ASSIGN /USER NL: SYS$OUTPUT:E $   EDIT /EDT /NOCOMMAND /NOJOURNAL /OUTPUT:'OUTPUTFILE'  'INPUTFILE's FIND "I/O Operation Rate"6 FIND "SUMMARIZING" DELETE ...      valdemir-@uol.com.br wrote:   7 > How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:e >n > vax1> type x.com >       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COMt >       $ EXIT >a4 > When I execute this procedure, I get this message: >t1 > Change mode can be entered only from a terminal  >t > Thanks...l   -- Leet  ; Lee Y T Mah                        Capital Health AuthorityE? Email: lytmah@cha.ab.ca            Information Systems, RAH CSCe4 Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NW? Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9l   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 14:49:07 -0500a; From: "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> $ Subject: RE: VMS Printing using PCL6K Message-ID: <D46FE9B132FB9B44AEC242A96E4AB75004BC5D65@rlghncst625.usps.gov>.   Serge-   It appears that there is not a e PCL6 Technical Reference Manualo like there was for PCL5.   The closest thing I could find  < was a link to this .pdf on the hpdevelopersolutions website:  D http://www.hpdevelopersolutions.com/downloads/64/358/xl_ref20r22.pdf   Good Luck-   I hope this helps-   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----( From: serge@protos.sochi.ru at INTERNET ' Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 1:50 AMS To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NCa$ Subject: RE: VMS Printing using PCL6  	 Good day,i, Have you documentation on pcl6 command yet? : If you have it, I would very pleased if you send it to me.   Thanks to You, Interesnov Serge.P   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.105 ************************---- ----------- ---------HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV    HV     IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    	IV    
IV    IV    IV    
IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV     IV    !IV    "IV    #IV    $IV    %IV    &IV    'IV    (IV    )IV    *IV    +IV    ,IV    -IV    .IV    /IV    0IV    1IV    2IV    3IV    4IV    5IV    6IV    7IV    8IV    9IV    :IV    ;IV    <IV    =IV    >IV    ?IV    @IV    AIV    BIV    CIV    DIV    EIV    FIV    GIV    HIV    IIV    JIV    KIV    LIV    MIV    NIV    OIV    PIV    QIV    RIV    SIV    TIV    UIV    VIV    WIV    XIV    YIV    ZIV    [IV    \IV    ]IV    ^IV    _IV    `IV    aIV    bIV    cIV    dIV    eIV    fIV    gIV    hIV    iIV    jIV    kIV    lIV    mIV    nIV    oIV    pIV    qIV    rIV    sIV    tIV    uIV    vIV    wIV    xIV    yIV    zIV    {IV    |IV    }IV    ~IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    IV    