1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 23 Feb 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 106       Contents:5 Re: 500au ethernet apparently won't operate at 100bps P =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=F0=E5=E0=EB=FC=ED=FB=E9 =E7=E0=F0=E0=E1=EE=F2=EE=EA, =E2?=	=?ISO& Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment ; Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment  RE: Einstein, Re: EV8 and McKinley analysis by Paul DeMoneJ Re: Getting VMS running on alphapc 150 - any help or pointers appreciated.) Re: How to monitor directory for changes?  Re: Itanium troubles Re: Itanium troubles8 RE: Longest VMS _cluster_ uptime, was: Re: 1 Year uptime Re: Lottery Systems 4 Multilith 1250 Container Load (30 machines) for Sale Re: OpenVMS IPF presentation0 Re: OT gassless cars Was Re: "Crashless Windows" Re: PGP for OpenVMS? Re: PGP for OpenVMS? Re: Postscript printing ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS ) Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS & Re: Session Manager Won't Start!! HELP Re: Setting Time and Date  Shared SCSI Bus Cluster and TCQ # Re: Shared SCSI Bus Cluster and TCQ # Re: Shared SCSI Bus Cluster and TCQ L Re: Singular they was Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( RE: SOAP on OpenVMS? RE: SOAP on OpenVMS?! Re: The portability of Windows NT ! Re: The portability of Windows NT " tool to calc recursive dir sises ?& Re: tool to calc recursive dir sises ?& Re: tool to calc recursive dir sises ?. Re: TS10 - Successful but some PROBE problems.$ Re: Using Edit inside a procedure... VAX SCAN Re: VAX SCAN& Re: VMS 7.2 hobbist + mop? remote bootC [Change topic] Adding memory when simple tuning would be sufficient P | > Incredible Program!                                                           F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 08:55:45 +0100 3 From: "Michel Herrscher" <michel.herrscher@free.fr> > Subject: Re: 500au ethernet apparently won't operate at 100bps3 Message-ID: <3c7748ed$0$8721$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   J Using DS10 and 3com non manageable switches. I got problem when forcing toK FastFd at console level, All my LAN go down to lesss than 1Mb/s Without any  signaled errors   D I set back to Auto all EWx0 and the LAN boosted up to 3 ( EWx0)  x 2 (Duplex) X 100 Mb/s   K According to 3com and Compaq TS no rule except this one : change config and  try....    -- Michel HERRSCHER CONSULTANT ; Prsident WindevAsso Association des dveloppeurs WinDev(r)  http://www.windevasso.org/H Mail = mhc@herrscher.fr  ; Tl.+33(0)450870912 ;  Fax: +33(0)450871741 ; GSM:+33(0)609044711     E "Dave Greenwood" <greenwoodde@ornl.gov> a crit dans le message news: ' 21FEB02.22584504@feda01.fed.ornl.gov... J > In a previous article, David Spencer <spencer@pageweavers.spaamfree.com> wrote:I > > I've got a 500au (running VMS 7.2-1). I've also got two network hubs.  One isH > > a 10baseT and the other is a 10/100 autosensing hub. The 500au works fineL > > when attached to the 10baseT hub. When I connect it to the 10/100 hub itJ > > runs only at 10mbs and has lots of problems with traffic. I've got theB > > ewa0_mode set to Auto-Negotiate but it doesn't seem to matter. > > J > > I've tried switching ports and cables but it makes no difference. I've got L > > another 500au that's similarly configured and it works at 100bps without
 > > problems.  > > K > > Do I have a bad part someplace? I've compared the ewa0 settings between  the G > > two machines and there appears to be no difference between them. Is  there F > > are hardware jumper or something that I can check? I'd like to get maximum / > > performance out of this thing if I could...  > < > In a nutshell - forget auto-negotiate and set it to 100mb. > I > I have a 500au running on 100bps.  I had a heckuva time getting my DS10 I > to do it though.  Turns out both the ethernet card and VMS do their own I > negotiation.  But there are no real standards for negotiation.  Nor are G > there standards for what to do if you can't agree on a speed.  In the K > case of my DS10, the card defaults to 100mb if it fails, but VMS defaults H > to 10mb if *it* fails.  What I was seeing was the card selecting 100mbK > (either through default or successful negotiation) but then VMS defaulted  > back to 10mb.  >  > Dave > --------------; > Dave Greenwood                Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOV J > Oak Ridge National Lab        %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 22:34:54 +0500 & From: "Vladimir" <millioner@wallst.ru>Y Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=F0=E5=E0=EB=FC=ED=FB=E9 =E7=E0=F0=E0=E1=EE=F2=EE=EA, =E2?=	=?ISO ) Message-ID: <a58l3h$bm8$791@news.raid.ru>   I      -   . WMGetter -        .       ,            .       !  http://www.wmgetter.com/vmikheev/    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 14:41:28 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>/ Subject: Re: Backup/Restore Verification Errors 0 Message-ID: <3C77A8FD.901719C1@blueyonder.co.uk>  
 nic wrote: >  > Tim Llewellyn wrote: > >  > > Nic Clews wrote: > > > L > > > I've responded AFTER reading Tim's response, that I'm not sure I fully  > > > agree with, but here goes. > > >  > > K > > Nic, out of interest, apart from my unstated assumption (perhaps as you J > > point out not valid) that the data was not changing DURING the backup,% > > did you disagree with in my post?  > D > It was the assumptions. My unstated assumption was that data wouldF > change. Rick clarified it was a split shadow set, so in fact I agreeJ > with you, a VERIFY would be useful in this case, the ignore=interlock is > meaningless. > = > Variables don't, constants aren't syndrome, so I apologise.   < no problem, at least Rick has a few new angles on the issue.   regards  --   Tim.Llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk     C Standard disclaimer applies. My views in no way represent those of  ! my employers or service provider.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 02:11:33 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> D Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment, Message-ID: <3C7740A3.963E5A94@videotron.ca>   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote: H > Heck, is the guy even a customer? If not, of what value is his learned > input?  N Way to go. Anyone who is displeased by the way Compaq/HP handles a product andJ voices his disaproval can just be considered "inconsequential" because youM assume he is not a customer. That type of handling will ensure that he is not  a customer.   K Successful companies will focus more on the disgruntled customers to try to 7 find out what the problems are and fix those problems.    L Oh, I almost forgot, a company such as Compaq that gives up on trying to fixJ its problems because they seem insurmountable to management and prefers toN hand over the remaining assets to HP, well such a company can hardly be called a "successful company".    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 09:26:31 +0100  From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>D Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment& Message-ID: <3C775237.6050903@home.nl>  C This is good news, however I don't quite understand the difference  G between the present Mozilla port (based on 0.9.8) and this port (based  H on 0.9.6). I suppose both browsers come from the same engineering team, C and I would have thought that it was simply a rename for the last    Mozilla 0.9.8 kit.   Some other remarks:   0 Mozilla loves memory (can't be helped I suppose)F I would like to see a few more helper applications, a (working !) pdf * viewer is the first that comes to my mind.K Maybe we can ask Microsoft for a VMS version of Windows Media Player :-)  ?        Sue Skonetski wrote:   >Dear Newsgroup, > G >I just got this and thought you might be interested (few minutes ago).  >  >Sue > M >____________________________________________________________________________  >__________________________  > H >I'm proud to announce the beta release of Compaq Secure Web Browser for5 >OpenVMS Alpha (based on Mozilla), or CSWB for short.  > J >CSWB provides OpenVMS Alpha with a full featured and customizable browserL >with integrated web browsing, security, HTML document creation and editing,K >and clients for mail, news, and instant messaging and support for Java and M >JavaScript and the following standards: HTML4, CSS1/2, DOM1/2, XML, RDF, and  >SSL.  > F >CSWB is the supported browser for OpenVMS Alpha and replaces NetscapeF >Navigator 3.03. CSWB is based on Mozilla, an open-source web browser,M >designed for standards-compliance, performance and portability. Netscape 6.x  >is also based on Mozilla. > ! >CSWB T1.0 can be downloaded from M >http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/cswb/cswb.html. CSWB V1.0 < >will be available in the April timeframe from the same URL. > L >Mozilla (beta) baselevels will continue to be available on OpenVMS Alpha as >they become available.  > K >Many thanks are due to Colin Blake for his efforts over the past two years  >to make this a reality. > 	 >Regards,  >  >John Ferguson >  >John.L.Ferguson@compaq.com  >  >OpenVMS Product Management  >  >  >    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2002 11:15:56 -0600B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley)D Subject: Re: Compaq Secure Web Browser for OpenVMS Alpha announcment3 Message-ID: <7n3mgzltMFZd@eisner.encompasserve.org>   G In article <3C775237.6050903@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> writes:  > M > Maybe we can ask Microsoft for a VMS version of Windows Media Player :-)  ?  >   F Just make sure that it's not a version of WMP that tracks your viewing habits... See:  ? http://www.geek.com/news/geeknews/2002feb/gee20020221010386.htm    and   ' http://www.theinquirer.net/22020207.htm    for further information.   Simon.   --  B Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       + Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 07:05:20 -0800 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>  Subject: RE: Einstein 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIMEFOEDAA.tom@kednos.com>    > -----Original Message-----0 > From: Brass Christof [mailto:welcome@spam.net]) > Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 2:33 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  > Subject: Re: Einstein  >  >  > Tom Linden wrote:  > >   > > > -----Original Message-----; > > > From: Alan E. Feldman [mailto:spamsink2001@yahoo.com] / > > > Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2002 6:39 PM  > > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  > > > Subject: Re: Einstein  > > >  > > > 8 > > > Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net> wrote in message* > > > news:<3C7567BC.C5C06874@spam.net>...  > > > > "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: >  > [SNIP] > G > > > If Nobel prizes are based on "invention and discovery", certainly - > > > Special Relativity counts as discovery!  > > E > > Boy, Plato certainly left his legacy, theories are inventions not  > > discoveries. > > > Not really. Scientific results are regarded as findings not C > inventions. This is one major reason why in reasonable countries  C > there is no chance to get those patented. Basically, discovering  E > scientific laws needs creativity; this makes the results sometimes  F > look more like inventions. If you look at mathematics you'll easily ? > see that the results are independent of time, cultures, sex,  > > believes whatever because there are some laws in logic that > > are independent the mentioned conditions. Therefore stating < > theories and proving them correct is a discovery. I think 6 > that only at the very beginning when the axioms are ; > established this could be more similar to inventing than  > > discovering. But in case of physics the axioms are normally > > derived from observations as abstractions that can formally : > defined. Therefore in this case the invention factor is  > even less than it could be.  > B This is a rather common, naive point of view.  Theories are modelsE for predictive behaviour, and are neither correct nor incorrect, true < nor untrue.  They either work well or they don't.  There areD many that have fallen by the wayside (Regge pole theory, 8-fold way,I etc.)  Classical Mechanics works fine as long as you don't get too small  F or too fast.  Mathematics is a game, defined by a set of rules, and itF doesn't have an independent existence.  That is my viewpoint and PlatoH certainly had a different one, as did Einstein and many other great men.     > --  8 > moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence >    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 15:22:23 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 5 Subject: Re: EV8 and McKinley analysis by Paul DeMone 0 Message-ID: <PsOd8.6007$4xE.2447@news1.bloor.is>  F Why don't we define an 'Industry Standary Server' to be what it really5 is..... a 19" rack-mount box containing the following  - one or more power supplies - a fan  - mounting brackets  - holes for ventilation ! - holes where connectors can fit.   D The rest of it - what's inside - is proprietary in all cases (no pun
 intended).  C Each of Dell, Compaq, HP, IBM, etc.... industry standard servers is L different - the bioses are different, the cpu's may be different, the memoryJ organization and physical form-factor thereof may be different, the number< of periphel controls and their mix may be different, etc....  H Just because it has an Intel cpu doesn't make it industry standard. It'sF like Ford saying that their Focus car is an industry standard car justL because it uses the same kind of light bulb for its dashboard light as every other car on the planet.  H It is our job to beat the press over the head when they are fast-n-loose with what they write.         8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:0k$edNglCJpf@eisner.encompasserve.org... K > In article <fbwd8.153867$Aw2.11063336@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "Bill & Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes: > J > > 2.  To avoid complete redundancy it seems reasonable to assume that anF > > 'industry standard box' is something more than simply any box that happens . > > to contain an industry standard processor. >  > C > One wrinkle.. Industry Standard Server.  Since AMD really doesn't F > do much with IA32 servers (their share of the server space is almostD > non-existent ... currently).  So Industry Standard Server has comeD > to mean a server with an Intel processor in it and most observers,D > writers and analysts would tend to agree with that.  By leveragingA > that built in marketing, the next step of course is to refer to > > an IPF box as an Industry Standard Server and of course yourB > corporation wants to participate in using Industry Standards andA > leverage all the cost savings and other benefits of being on an  > Industry Standard platform.  >  > Rob  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 09:21:42 +0100 / From: Frederik Meerwaldt <frederik@freddym.org> S Subject: Re: Getting VMS running on alphapc 150 - any help or pointers appreciated. / Message-ID: <a57je1$kup$03$1@news.t-online.com>    Hi!  > J > Because they aren't supported by VMS ? Somewhere there is a list of what0 > IS & isn't supported (The VMS SPD most likely)  3 I think his problem is already at the point of SRM. 3 The Firmware doesn't recognize the drives correctly   D > The DECpc AXP 150 (aka Jensen), although apparently not officiallyJ > supported with VMS (No matter what the SOC for it says about that topic)I > (If you search comp.os.vms this topic comes up occassionally) will work I > fine if you have VMS compatible hardware (video, SCSI, ethernet, disks,  > cd-rom, etc.). > C > In fact, mine, which VMS thinks is a DEC 2000 Model 300 AXP with::  D Well, the DECpc AXP150 is in fact just the same as a DEC 2000/300 :)  % So this is a supported configuration.=H I thought they called the box DECpc because they were originally shippedI with Adaptec AHA 1742A Firmware Revision G and not G.2 which just allowed 0 to run Windows on it. But I might be wrong, too.   Greetings - Freddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 09:58:39 +0100y- From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr>c2 Subject: Re: How to monitor directory for changes?' Message-ID: <3C7759BF.2A0E5B6F@Free.fr>n  G You set a WRITE ACL to the directory name, you enable security auditingRG for ACL and this should produce a message each time amything is entered  in the directory.   . Now the next step will be to get that message.  A What comes to my mind is a mailbox to receive the Security AuditsMG messages (and all others), via a set term/brdcstmbx (or whatever syntax G it is) then do a read attention AST on the mailbox, then filter what isvD written into it, then get your relevant message, then pass a flag to+ your C program to continue your processing.l  0 Not obvious but feasible (as always with VMS :-)  I I'm sture ooops.. sure that someone around this forum wrote this already.    D.   "W. John Guineau" wrote: > M > Is there a way in VMS to monitor a directory to be notified in a program (C L > for example) if as file is added to a directory? I thought this capabilityM > was added back in OpenVMS 6 or around there. Something similar to the WIN32o# > FindFirstChangeNotification()API.n >  > john   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:54:17 +0010o% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.auo Subject: Re: Itanium troubles?5 Message-ID: <01KEMGZ51PKY005I81@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>s  L > The jury is out on this and I remain unconvinced that these people (CarleyM > and Curly) are not just thinking with their collective "big swinging dicks"i4 > a process not at all related to rationmal thought.  9 Hmm, I still have much to learn about the female anatomy.-   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 08:10:12 GMTm  From: cjt <cheljuba@prodigy.net> Subject: Re: Itanium troubles0* Message-ID: <3C774E8D.62E6D3E@prodigy.net>   Bob Koehler wrote: > X > In article <ZC5d8.69$lj4.1925@news.get2net.dk>, "Dr. Dweeb" <Dweeb@NoSpam.com> writes: > >eN > > The jury is out on this and I remain unconvinced that these people (CarleyO > > and Curly) are not just thinking with their collective "big swinging dicks"p6 > > a process not at all related to rationmal thought. > >  > G >    Ah, so you think that's an area where they come up a little short?i  ! Especially Carley, I would think.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 11:47:46 -0500r+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com>7A Subject: RE: Longest VMS _cluster_ uptime, was: Re: 1 Year uptimeeT Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1CDB@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Bill,g  D Its entirely possible that there is something I am missing from yourD argument about standalone production systems being able to offer the same features as a cluster.   / >>> What reseources are you talking about?? <<<s  > Not HW, but OS / System stuff ie. Print / batch queues, sharedG read-write files from any server, config and startup files, single disks quota's for all systems, etc.   G If some local files are being NFS served for read-write access to othertH servers and that NFS server dies, how do the end users access those disk. files with that system not being available?=20  H If using replication tools, how does one keep the file synching in checkD if the master server is down and each of the other servers are doing read-write updates to files?  F As previously stated, everyone has different requirements and there isD no single "right" solution for everyone. I readily admit I'm no UNIXG guru, but please do provide more feedback on this as I am curious as too how this is done.=20   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanti Compaq Canada Corp.a Professional Servicesy Voice: 613-592-4660o Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----; From: Bill Gunshannon [mailto:bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu]=20  Sent: February 19, 2002 8:35 PMa To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComhA Subject: RE: Longest VMS _cluster_ uptime, was: Re: 1 Year uptimeV    
 In articleH <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1CC1@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net> ,t.  "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes: |> Bill, |>=20lG |> >>> Ummm.  I can do that with any group of machines, clustered or=20  |> >>> not.mC |> In fact, I usually do this with my BSD servers now at upgrade=20S |> time.<<<l |>=20 H |> So, is a particular resource is "served" to your user community by=20I |> system A, how do you shutdown System A for planned maint like an OS=20?J |> upgrade without telling your users that System A will be unavailable=20J |> for some period (even if it does go quickly) while its resources are=20 |> failed over to System  B What reseources are you talking about??  All my systems are mirrorH images so everything that's available on one is available on the others.C While I am sure there are cases where this isn't practical, I would: imagine in the majority of locations this works just fine.  C Just like you mentioned, I may have a problem booting off users whorH never log off, but my users can do whatevert hey need to do on any of my@ servers. The worst I may have to do is play with the nameserver.   |>=20>C |> When System A is again back up again, how do you failback the=20:E |> resources on System B back to System A without telling your users?o  G I just make it available again and the next time a user uses the commontG name (kind of like having a Cluster Address) he is as likely to get then' recently returned machine as any other.a   |>=20IG |> >>> Suddenly, I no longer see the advantage of a cluster over the=20a |> >>> bunch! |> of multiple machines I run.<<<w |>=20 F |> Each of which requires individual startup,  config, application,=20F |> database, files, etc etc .. as opposed to management of a single=20 |> environment.   D I don't know how to break this to you, but this isn't 1978 and theseB machines aren't running Version7.  Tools exist to allow a bunch ofC similar machines, like my "cluster" to be maintained automatically.lE Change one file on the master machine and all the others get the samer change applied.-  F |>               Almost all UNIX vendors promote SSI (single system=20A |> image) as a big advantage over managing multiple single boxes.e  F Vendors make money selling systems.  That doesn't always coincide withD what is best for the user.  Any single anything is a single point ofB failure.  Isn't that one of the advantages of a cluster?? I'm justF saying that based on your previous description, I have all of the sameH advantages in a loosely coupled set of machines with simple glue to hold them together.   |>=20sF |> Again, for smaller and/or internal environments that seldom change,  G Ummmmm.  I change considerably more than the administrative data centert0 here (who for the moment are still running VMS).  5 |> and/or with down time relatively easy to schedule,a  E Actually, they have it easier.  Their customers are used to less thannF 24x7 operation.  My customers may be academics, but they are much less$ tolerant of system non-availability.  I |>                                                    managing lots of=20,5 |> boxes on their own may be ok for your environment.e  ' True.  Experience has shown that it is.r   |>=20VH |> However, large and/or dynamic environments with 24x7 mission critical  / |> shops have much more demanding requirements.r  E I was just saying that based on your description, which I must assumebG was somwhat simplistic, there was nothing you mentioned that I couldn't F without any real "clustering".  As an example, I did a rolling upgradeH from FreeBSD 4.3 to FreeBSD 4.4 on Monday morning during the meat of theF workday with no impact on my users (or even the likelyhood that any ofG them noticed!!)  And I can assure you, my users consider this operationaE 24x7 mission critical.  It's just like the "how long has your machine B been up??" question.  If it were not for the annual power shutdownH (which is coming up again in a month) my machines would have longer thanC a year uptimes.  And if you take overall system uptime, like with a_F cluster, it could easily be unlimited.  I can roll new hardware in andC old hardware out using the same methods I used to upgrade the OS on F Monday.  Fact is, it really is time for people here to take other OSesH seriously.  VMS is good, but with the possible exception of Windows, the! others are more than good enough.    bill   --=20iC Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three  wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |C Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>  =203   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:01:13 +0100t= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>  Subject: Re: Lottery Systems) Message-ID: <3C775A59.5DE99ECE@gtech.com>:   gerhard.staub@rizit.at wrote:pH > SCIGAMES or also Scientific Games GMBH Austra (!) is the correct name.  $ I think that is a subsidary company.  8 And that Scientific Games is a US company (Georgia to be more precise).   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 12:42:22 -0500e3 From: "A-1 Enterprises" <offers@a-1enterprises.com>r= Subject: Multilith 1250 Container Load (30 machines) for Sale ? Message-ID: <200202231742.g1NHgM512309@host5.apollohosting.com>-  $ --=_8779a03a485ee6fe79a1558f0c26ef30. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit:  ! We are pleased to offer for sale:e  3 MULTILITH 1250 CONTAINER LOAD (30 MACHINES) $19,500r+ Grey, Single Lever, 10"x15", Chute Delivery6  9 View Photos:. http://www.a-1enterprises.com/photo.php?id=334  8 Request More Info on the MULTILITH 1250 CONTAINER LOAD:  http://www.a-1enterprises.com/moreinfo.php?make=MULTILITH&model=1250%20CONTAINER%20LOAD%20(30%20MACHINES)&asking_price=19,500&item=100-334&account=100  E View our complete list of over 400 pieces of used printing equipment: & http://www.a-1enterprises.com/toc2.htm   A-1 Enterprises 1-248-477-6800 e offers@a-1enterprises.com    S If you wish to unsubscribe to our mailing list, please simply click the link below  D or reply to this e-mail with the word "remove" in the subject field.  I http://www.a-1enterprises.com/unsubscribe.php?email=Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com@  n    $ --=_8779a03a485ee6fe79a1558f0c26ef30- Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"]+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable      <html>  L <body background=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/images/ricebk.jpg" bgcolo=L r=3D"#FFFFFF" text=3D"#000000" link=3D"#666633" vlink=3D"#333366" alink=3D"=	 #990000">cF <table width=3D"942" border=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0">	   <tr>=20.L     <td height=3D"52" valign=3D"top" colspan=3D"3"> <font face=3D"Times New=  Roman, Times">=20L       <p align=3D"center"><b><font size=3D"6">MULTILITH 1250 CONTAINER LOAD=  <br>t,         (30 MACHINES) $19,500</font></b></p>L       <p align=3D"center"><img src=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/images/=. aricerul.gif" width=3D"600" height=3D"10"></p>       </font> </td>h   </tr>e	   <tr>=20 >     <td width=3D"170" valign=3D"top" height=3D"48">&nbsp;</td>L     <td valign=3D"top" width=3D"603"> <font face=3D"Times New Roman, Times"= >=20L       <p align=3D"center"><b><font size=3D"4"> Grey, Single Lever, 10"x15",=D </font><font face=3D"Times New Roman, Times"><b><font size=3D"4">=200         Chute Delivery</font></b></font></b></p>       </font></td>0     <td width=3D"169" valign=3D"top">&nbsp;</td>   </tr>u	   <tr>=20,6     <td height=3D"50" colspan=3D"3" valign=3D"top">=20       <div align=3D"center">=20 L         <IMG SRC=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/images/R_Dsc00141.jpg"  W=L IDTH=3D600 border=3D0><p><a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/moreinfo.=L php?make=3DMULTILITH&model=3D1250 CONTAINER LOAD (30 MACHINES)&asking_price=L =3D19,500&item=3D100-334&account=3D100"><font face=3D"Times New Roman, Time=L s" size=3D"4">Request More Info on this MULTILITH 1250 CONTAINER LOAD (30 M= ACHINES)</font>      </a></div>h	     </td>    </tr> 	   <tr>=20a     <td height=3D"14"></td>i
     <td></td>r
     <td></td>r   </tr>b	   <tr>=20n     <td height=3D"36"></td>o     <td valign=3D"top">=20L       <div align=3D"center"><font face=3D"Times New Roman, Times, serif" si= ze=3D"4">A-1=20eL         Enterprises 1-248-477-6800 <a href=3D"mailto:offers@a-1enterprises.=/ com">offers@a-1enterprises.com</a></font></div>a	     </td>n
     <td></td>r   </tr> 	   <tr>=20 6     <td height=3D"85" colspan=3D"3" valign=3D"top">=20       <div align=3D"center">=20 L         <p><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman, Times, serif">If you w=	 ish to=20 L           unsubscribe to our mailing list, please simply click the button b= elow=200           <br>L           or reply to this e-mail with the word &quot;remove&quot; in the s=	 ubject=20M           field.</font></p>$J         <p><a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/unsubscribe.php?email=L =3DInfo-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com"><img src=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/images/=B unsubscribe.jpg" width=3D"120" height=3D"40" border=3D"0"></a></p>       </div>	     </td>o   </tr>  </table>5 <p><font face=3D"Times New Roman, Times"> </font></p>i    L <p align=3D"center"><font face=3D"Times New Roman, Times, serif" size=3D"3"=L ><b><font color=3D"#808000"><a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/toc2.h= tm">Equipment=20L   List</a> | <a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/SearchForProduct.htm"=L >Search for Product</a> | <a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/RequestI= nformation.htm">Request=20L   Information</a> | <a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/EquipmentWante=L d.htm">Equipment Wanted</a> | <a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/Cont= actInformation.htm">Contact=20L   Us</a> | <a href=3D"http://www.a-1enterprises.com/index.php">Home</a></fo= nt></b></font><br> </p>   </body>  </html>e    & --=_8779a03a485ee6fe79a1558f0c26ef30--   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 15:06:36 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>3% Subject: Re: OpenVMS IPF presentation / Message-ID: <0eOd8.5996$4xE.562@news1.bloor.is>.  L http://www.compaq.com/hps/ipf-enterprise/download/OVMS_Customer_Presentation .ppt  C reached from the link you provided in your 1st post in this thread.o      = "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com> wrote in messageu* news:MNwd8.97$fL6.1119@news.cpqcorp.net... > John,o >cJ > Can you let me know which presentation you are looking at because I seem to > be missing it. >d	 > Thanks,a > suee0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message, > news:oevd8.4691$4xE.2076@news1.bloor.is... > > Sue, > >tH > > About 16 slides into the OpenVMS Customer Presentation, there is theI > > timeline showing the 'Alpha-Itanium Processor Family Operating Systeme
 > > Roadmap'.  > > E > > I note that the green arrow labeled 'OpenVMS on Itanium Processore Family'l > isI > > noticably shorter than all the others, even Tru64, which I though wasm2 > > already given last rites. What does this mean? > >a > >a > >  > >0A > > "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@compaq.com> wrote in message . > > news:clud8.78$fL6.1043@news.cpqcorp.net... > > > Dear Newsgroup,s > > >iI > > > If you are interested in what we are doing with porting the OpenVMSaL > > > Operating System and Application to the Itanium Processor Family & theG > > > Compiler Roadmaps here is the link.  This just went up on the weby today. > > >fJ > > > In particular if you have seen Gaitan Dantoni's presentation you may > > > remember this prostrationp; > > > http://www.compaq.com/hps/ipf-enterprise/openvms.htmlt > > >f > > > Warm Regards,  > > > 	 > > > Suee > > >m > > >s > > >o > > >e > > >c > >n > >  >l >r   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 08:17:39 -0500s( From: Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu>9 Subject: Re: OT gassless cars Was Re: "Crashless Windows"lB Message-ID: <20020223081314.C19121-100000@server2.cs.scranton.edu>  " On 22 Feb 2002, Bob Koehler wrote:  i > In article <3C743188.E8898616@blueyonder.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:e >iO > > according to a recent motoring programon TV in the UK people are converting / > > diesel cars to run on ordinary cooking oil.- >-D >    Diesel tried to design an engine that can run on any fuel.  His >    favorite was coal dust. >cJ >    He did fairly well.  Peanut farmers used to run their diesel tractorsG >    on peanut oil when it was cheap.  Must have been pretty cheap, tooiI >    since most states don't charge fuel taxes on farmers like they do oni >    truckers.  K For those that didn't know it, those big Army trucks you see running up andtJ down the Interstates during summer camp time aren't really diesels at all.L Although I have never seen them run aything else, they are officially listedL as Multi-Fuel engines.  I do know of cases where rags soaked in gas or otherI petroleum distilate cleaners being left inthe vacinity of the air cleanerrL have caused problems by not allowing the engine to be shut down.  The normalJ shutdown is just a fuel cutoff and if it sucks enough fumes in through theO air intake, it will continue to run and may in fact accelerate without control.t   bill   -- rJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |> Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2002 09:18:38 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER) Subject: Re: PGP for OpenVMS?Z* Message-ID: <3c77505e$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  U In article <3C76E9F4.D415F06C@caltech.edu>, David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu> writes:n  >david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote: >> "P >> Does anyone know where to get a VMS version of GNUPG now that the GNUPG 1.0.4; >> version is no longer available from David Mathog's site.a >,H >It's still there but it may have moved from the URL you have.  Look in: >M0 >ftp://saf.bio.caltech.edu/pub/software/openvms/ >aO >Don't ask me for support though - I don't have a VMS machine anymore to run it  >on.  B Shock, Horror... Whereto should we all deliver a donated one ? ;-)   -- >< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111 2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111 888 < KAPSCH AG      Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 15:36:38 GMTr# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>- Subject: Re: PGP for OpenVMS?2/ Message-ID: <aGOd8.3555$qQ.1216@news2.bloor.is>K   Also see" http://www.pgpi.org/news/#20010907  A for general news about PGP, including Network Associates plans to1" sell/discontinue the PGP division.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:28:25 GMTo3 From: Jeff Coffield <Jeffrey@DigitalSynergyInc.com>l  Subject: Re: Postscript printing5 Message-ID: <3C77DF39.A009122F@DigitalSynergyInc.com>r   David Lee wrote:  K > I have no problems printing text file to my printer.  However, whenever IhN > print postscript file to this printer, nothing happen.  Just like it doesn't$ > understand what I am sending over. > L > It is a postscript printer type (HP 4000N).  Am I missing some software onN > the ES-40 machine running VMS 7.2 or am I missing something from the printer	 > itself.i >a > Does anyone  have any ideas? >n > Thank youo  I Check that the printer has Postscript errors turned on. Otherwise you get # nothing with a bad Postscript file.wN Ghostscript can be used to check the file to see if it's okay. Try sending the following to the printer.        %! Adobe-PSr&     72 72 moveto 144 144 lineto stroke     showpage  C You should get a diagonal line in the lower left coner of the page.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 09:10:31 +0100a' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net>42 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS( Message-ID: <3C774E77.ABCB3B35@spam.net>   JF Mezei wrote:m >  > Sue Skonetski wrote:F > > And if you think that makes me a prostitute too, so be it.  I have@ > > been called worse for saying what I think. And I will not beA > > intimidated or scared away from stating my opinion by anyone.1 > J > I never named names. I was actually thinking of someone else who used toP > support Alpha' cause but has now become an IA64 apologist.  It is obvious that- > Compaq employees must tow the company line.i > J > While your corporation assures us that customers are very happy with theM > downgrade from Alpha to IA64, you have to admit that some customers who hadoL > seen the very  pro-Alpha and very Anti IA64 presentations from Digital andL > then Compaq find it very hard to believe Compaq's excuses. Had Compaq beenN > honest and simply said that they wanted to be in bed with Intel or whatever,! > there wouldn't be a discussion.? > P > It is obvious that employees of Compaq must tow the company line. I understandN > that. But you still have to admit that from a customer perspective, it seemsP > extremely strange to see some employee who used to tout the greatness of AlphaA > and the sillyness of IA64 who now says that IA64 will be great.  > K > For what it is worth, I stayed away from personal insults, something sometH > Compaq employees who participate here have not and have personally and > specifically insulted me.d > L > There have also been some whose employer is not known and who have changedG > their tune rather dramatically and now support IA64 when before, theysX > supoprted Alpha. One has to wonder what would cause someone to change so dramatically.  C While I personally don't like the move to IA64 for several reasons n@ I think at present the Compaq VMS group is more concerned about E getting the job done as fast and as good as possible. In the current  F situation there is simply no real alternative unless management would H decide to change directions e.g. implement VMS on several HW platforms. F Investing all the effort in porting VMS to IA64 doesn't mean that the G members of the VMS group at Compaq think this is the best move or IA64 sA is better than Alpha. I don't see any advantage in discussing thel	 possible sI reasons of failure of that move. There are many, they are known to every  H slightly reasonable person involved and we won't help in repeating them.   -- a6 moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:34:24 -0500e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>l2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS, Message-ID: <3C775407.318D08F3@videotron.ca>   Brass Christof wrote:iA > I think at present the Compaq VMS group is more concerned aboutm7 > getting the job done as fast and as good as possible.s  N The actual port itself is not at issue. The Compaq VMS staff have a reasonableM amount of credibility when they say that the port is technically possible ando; that they are not worried about it not going to completion.i  J The problem is that even before June 25, VMS wasn't exactly healthy in theM marketplace and still suffered big time inside fo Compaq outside of the smalluM VMS group. And that problem remains and it is that problem which is a greater I concern, especially when nobody seems to know how VMS will translate once L under HP. This is an issue that is far above the engineers, gorham and where Marcello has little control.    N Consider that Carly has given token commitment to NSK, has explained the deathG of tru64, said that she would keep Compaq's wintel server, but use HP'siH consumer PCs, so that leaves VMS out without any statement of direction.    I What Compaq says doesn't have much credibility right now because in a fewa@ months, the management will change and new directions announced.   ------------------------------  + Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:26:51 +0000 (UTC)o From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS+ Message-ID: <a57qpb$kgq$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>t  \ In article <3C76F1AE.5DAECFB9@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:K >I can understand now why it wasn't worth continuing C2 certification after N >version 6.1 of VMS since  C2 became meaningless as soon as Microsoft was able. >to claim its NT was just as compliant as VMS. >r >nL >Ideally, manufacturers should have pushed for the C2 standards to change inO >such a way as to make sre that NT could not qualify, at which poinmt, it might F >has been worth continuing the certification since it would have givenL >certified systems a definite edge over NT and would have also sent a strong- >message that NT wasn't ready for prime-time.l    H Wel they did drop the C2, B1 etc certification in favour of a new set ofI certifications - the common criteria. Unfortunately (and I'm certainly no.L expert on this) it appears these are a much watered down mismash of criteria which don't have much meaning.    L The C2 criteria were anyway only the first step to security - they just saidM that the system had the facilities built in to be a secure, auditable system. K They didn't have anything to say about how easily those facilities could be L bypassed due to the system having buffer overflows and other security holes.  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 14:40:15 +0100r' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.net>t2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS( Message-ID: <3C779BBF.CE2C5047@spam.net>   JF Mezei wrote:0 >  > Brass Christof wrote:oC > > I think at present the Compaq VMS group is more concerned aboutn9 > > getting the job done as fast and as good as possible.  > P > The actual port itself is not at issue. The Compaq VMS staff have a reasonableO > amount of credibility when they say that the port is technically possible ando= > that they are not worried about it not going to completion.n > L > The problem is that even before June 25, VMS wasn't exactly healthy in theO > marketplace and still suffered big time inside of Compaq outside of the small O > VMS group. And that problem remains and it is that problem which is a greaterhK > concern, especially when nobody seems to know how VMS will translate onceuN > under HP. This is an issue that is far above the engineers, gorham and where > Marcello has little control.  E This is common knowledge. While I don't like to criticise what you'reu saying hD I would like to recommend that it would a good idea to say something new,  F original or helpful. To repeat well known facts to an audience that is well eF acquainted with the situation is not the best use of yours and other's time.m  P > Consider that Carly has given token commitment to NSK, has explained the deathI > of tru64, said that she would keep Compaq's wintel server, but use HP'snJ > consumer PCs, so that leaves VMS out without any statement of direction. > K > What Compaq says doesn't have much credibility right now because in a feweB > months, the management will change and new directions announced.  H Again: these are all trivia. There is simply no point in repeating that @ or complaining about the obvious *without* offering a clear and H convincing alternative. Did you ever think about a second what a person I loving VMS should do? Besides all the recommendations already published? n  . Do you have anything really new to contribute?   -- m6 moc dot slupofni at ssarb - please revert the sequence   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2002 22:07:43 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS- Message-ID: <87k7t4s34g.fsf@prep.synonet.com>p  # Andy <acs@fcgnet.works.net> writes:e  B > There are still a number of schools using VMS for administrativeC > functions. Not a lot, but more than none. Why don't we hear aboutDB > them here ? With very few exceptions, most of the users of thoseE > kinds of systems don't even know this forum exists. And, of course, E > this isn't one of Compaq's "target markets" so it doesn't get much,0B > if any, press. But it's still out there... getting the job done.  2 There are two here, and they date back to the 60s.  F At one, it is NT on Alpha, now something else. Not sure what, but I'llE bet quids it will not be VMS. The other is going Sun.  Good bye aboutn@ 8 Alphas in a split cluster. They will keep one machine for 'oldD stuff' so when some one wanders in with old code, they ca just throwE him onto the clunker. Good bye VMS... They used to give every studento@ a VMS account. The tech colleges have all got rid of all the VMS systems.  Zip, nada, nill.     --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:04:36 -0500=' From: Glenn Everhart <Everhart@gce.com>$2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS' Message-ID: <3C77AF84.21476E10@gce.com>.  R You understate the degree to which C2 was considered a flavor of insecure systems.M C level spoke only of discretionary security, and the testing for C2 features Q was initially rather stronger than it became. (I was surprised that the NT C2 waseO not withdrawn upon publication of the first "getadmin" exploits, but apparentlyDM the level was being used for systems where features checked off supported the N called-out discretionary protections. The notion that these must actually WORKO seems to have been lost. It would not I think have been so when the Orange Booki= first came out; the whole effort would have been laughed at.)-  M The preceived complete failure to make multilevel secure DBMS systems save at/N ruinous performance cost, the decline in importance of timeshared systems, andQ the marginal relevance of the military security model as it was being implemented>K to commercial security practice led to the low interest in common criteria.-  R This is not to say that the military model cannot be formulated in an industriallyR relevant way. It can, and the literature for systems like PitBull (formerly Argus)N explains one such way. I am inclined to believe that not enough is included inM the "need to know" side much of the time here, but for setting up services insN such wise that compromise of their processes by hostile actors does not permitO their access to be expanded beyond the intended functional level, the mil model O is pretty good. Where one wants to protect backend data from leakage, attention.Q to the aggregation problem (at least to the point of access rate control) must beo increased...   Glenn Everhart     david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:i > ^ > In article <3C76F1AE.5DAECFB9@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:M > >I can understand now why it wasn't worth continuing C2 certification aftereP > >version 6.1 of VMS since  C2 became meaningless as soon as Microsoft was able0 > >to claim its NT was just as compliant as VMS. > >m > > N > >Ideally, manufacturers should have pushed for the C2 standards to change inQ > >such a way as to make sre that NT could not qualify, at which poinmt, it might0H > >has been worth continuing the certification since it would have givenN > >certified systems a definite edge over NT and would have also sent a strong/ > >message that NT wasn't ready for prime-time.& > J > Wel they did drop the C2, B1 etc certification in favour of a new set ofK > certifications - the common criteria. Unfortunately (and I'm certainly noaN > expert on this) it appears these are a much watered down mismash of criteria  > which don't have much meaning. > N > The C2 criteria were anyway only the first step to security - they just saidO > that the system had the facilities built in to be a secure, auditable system.0M > They didn't have anything to say about how easily those facilities could beeN > bypassed due to the system having buffer overflows and other security holes. >  > David Webb > VMS and Unix team leader > CCSS > Middlesex University   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:53:28 GMTo4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS: Message-ID: <sGQd8.12696$ro5.4522708@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>   > > Sue Skonetski wrote:H > > > And if you think that makes me a prostitute too, so be it.  I haveB > > > been called worse for saying what I think. And I will not beC > > > intimidated or scared away from stating my opinion by anyone.e  I Good on ya, Sue. You and many others have put up with unwarranted puerile J rantings from people who obviously do not have lives, and many of whom areI not even Compaq customers. Killfiles work fine, a moderated VMS forum foreJ those who have a sincere technical interest in VMS would work even better.  6 Regrettably, Compaq Marketing hasn't figured this out.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 13:33:13 -0500e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>r2 Subject: Re: Profitability and the survival of VMS, Message-ID: <3C77E068.6B9E5135@videotron.ca>   Brass Christof wrote:cH > original or helpful. To repeat well known facts to an audience that is > wellH > acquainted with the situation is not the best use of yours and other's > time.r  K Some still refuse to admit that Compaq is poised to cease to exist in a few  weeks.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:03:07 +0100|- From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr>-/ Subject: Re: Session Manager Won't Start!! HELP:' Message-ID: <3C775ACB.CD292B6D@Free.fr>A   Read the openvms faqO http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/faq_frames/faq.htm entry DECW6 and others.6   D.   Hoff: 96393645172823, Didier: 1<   :-)c     Alex Feliziani wrote:d >  > Hi,d > F > I am logging into an account on $disk2. ($disk1=system disk). When iA > enter the Login and password it reaches all the way to the blueDC > screen(my screen) where the session manager tries to start but itmF > doesn't appear on the screen and the screen turns black for a secondF > and then goes back to the login prompt!I would greatly apreciate theF > help. Can anyone tell me what files are run one by one to get to the  > session manager window opened. >  > Thank You! > Alex   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:00:37 +0100 - From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr>e" Subject: Re: Setting Time and Date' Message-ID: <3C775A35.950ECD2A@Free.fr>I  = Buy the appropriate license. This forum is not a WAREZ forum.-   D.  1 (and tell those VMS machines to stop copuling :-)t   Ozone Radical wrote: > E > My college obtained a copule of VMS machines, and I need to set thesE > time and day back to get certain software working. How do we do it?aE > SET TIME doesn't work. Says too many parameters. Also we don't haveP > the help file.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 12:48:15 +0100 / From: Frederik Meerwaldt <frederik@freddym.org>u( Subject: Shared SCSI Bus Cluster and TCQ/ Message-ID: <a57vhb$lou$02$1@news.t-online.com>a   Hello there,  H I have a question regarding the shared SCSI bus cluster functionality of OpenVMS.E I'm trying to create a shared SCSI bus cluster between 2 old DEC 2000t
 model 300.5 One controller is set to ID 7, the other one to ID 6.i< The Disk Array in the middle consists of 6 HDDs from ID 0-5.  G I installed OpenVMS/alpha 7.2-1 on both of the machines, and configuredt& clustering to use the shared SCSI Bus.I I set the local alloclass to 1 and 3 and the alloclass of the shared SCSI 	 bus to 2.s  B As soon as the second node bootes, it tells me that my system Disk. doesn't support TCQ (Tagged Command Queueing).I After searching in the Net, I found out that my system disk supports TCQ.oG The contoller should be able to support TCQ also, I found the following > link (OK - it is about Tru64, but the controller is the same):a http://www.cs.arizona.edu/computer.help/policy/DIGITAL_unix/AA-QTLLA-TET1_html/sys_overview7.htmlR This lists the following:r  # 6.2.5.1    Command Tagged Queueing B  H Command Tagged Queueing, is supported on these processors and adapters:   "        DEC 3000 series processors   "        DEC 4000 series processors   0        KZPAA, KZPBA, KZPSA, KZPSM, KZPDA, KZTSA           Adaptec 174X           PMAZB, PMAZC   4 So my controller, the Adaptec 1742A is listed there.  ! What's the problem with my setup?  Many many thanks in advance. Greetings - Freddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 11:21:11 -0500 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger), Subject: Re: Shared SCSI Bus Cluster and TCQJ Message-ID: <rdeininger-2302021121120001@1cust95.tnt1.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>  B In article <a57vhb$lou$02$1@news.t-online.com>, Frederik Meerwaldt <frederik@freddym.org> wrote:r   A few guesses...  I >I have a question regarding the shared SCSI bus cluster functionality ofn	 >OpenVMS.nF >I'm trying to create a shared SCSI bus cluster between 2 old DEC 2000 >model 300.e6 >One controller is set to ID 7, the other one to ID 6.= >The Disk Array in the middle consists of 6 HDDs from ID 0-5.i   Ok.s  H >I installed OpenVMS/alpha 7.2-1 on both of the machines, and configured' >clustering to use the shared SCSI Bus.hJ >I set the local alloclass to 1 and 3 and the alloclass of the shared SCSI
 >bus to 2.  I I think you have the set the allocation class the same on both machines. nJ I vaguely recall some documentation changes in this area, but I can't find  anything definite at the moment.    C >As soon as the second node bootes, it tells me that my system Diskp/ >doesn't support TCQ (Tagged Command Queueing).OJ >After searching in the Net, I found out that my system disk supports TCQ.H >The contoller should be able to support TCQ also, I found the following? >link (OK - it is about Tru64, but the controller is the same): b >http://www.cs.arizona.edu/computer.help/policy/DIGITAL_unix/AA-QTLLA-TET1_html/sys_overview7.html >This lists the following: >l$ >6.2.5.1    Command Tagged Queueing  >eI >Command Tagged Queueing, is supported on these processors and adapters:   >I# >       DEC 3000 series processors f >e# >       DEC 4000 series processors e >s1 >       KZPAA, KZPBA, KZPSA, KZPSM, KZPDA, KZTSA   >  >       Adaptec 174X   >l >       PMAZB, PMAZC f >i5 >So my controller, the Adaptec 1742A is listed there.e > " >What's the problem with my setup?  I The SCSI controllers have to support "target mode" as well as TCQ.  Therel? are relatively few adapters that do this right.  If you look ineE "Guidelines for OpenVMS Cluster Configurations", you'll see a list ofeG supported adapters for multihost SCSI.  The adaptec 1742A is not on theD6 list, but maybe the same adapter goes by another name.  I Be careful with Tru64 documentation around multihost SCSI.  For reasons IeF don't understand, Tru64 has supported a lot of configurations that VMS	 does not.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:03:05 GMT ! From: Andy <acs@fcgnet.works.net>n, Subject: Re: Shared SCSI Bus Cluster and TCQ> Message-ID: <Xns91BE7A386575Cacsfcgnetworksnet@216.166.71.232>  @ rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) enlightened us withC news:rdeininger-2302021121120001@1cust95.tnt1.nashua.nh.da.uu.net: r  : > In article <a57vhb$lou$02$1@news.t-online.com>, Frederik) > Meerwaldt <frederik@freddym.org> wrote:  >  > A few guesses... > 9 >>I have a question regarding the shared SCSI bus clustere >>functionality of OpenVMS.eB >>I'm trying to create a shared SCSI bus cluster between 2 old DEC >>2000 model 300. 7 >>One controller is set to ID 7, the other one to ID 6.l> >>The Disk Array in the middle consists of 6 HDDs from ID 0-5. >  > Ok.V > > >>I installed OpenVMS/alpha 7.2-1 on both of the machines, and3 >>configured clustering to use the shared SCSI Bus.a? >>I set the local alloclass to 1 and 3 and the alloclass of the. >>shared SCSI bus to 2.- > @ > I think you have the set the allocation class the same on both? > machines. I vaguely recall some documentation changes in thisf9 > area, but I can't find anything definite at the moment.t >  > ? >>As soon as the second node bootes, it tells me that my systemn5 >>Disk doesn't support TCQ (Tagged Command Queueing). = >>After searching in the Net, I found out that my system diskCA >>supports TCQ. The contoller should be able to support TCQ also,T= >>I found the following link (OK - it is about Tru64, but the  >>controller is the same):  C >>http://www.cs.arizona.edu/computer.help/policy/DIGITAL_unix/AA-QTq< >>LLA-TET1_html/sys_overview7.html This lists the following: >>% >>6.2.5.1    Command Tagged Queueing n >>? >>Command Tagged Queueing, is supported on these processors and  >>adapters:  >>$ >>       DEC 3000 series processors  >>$ >>       DEC 4000 series processors  >>2 >>       KZPAA, KZPBA, KZPSA, KZPSM, KZPDA, KZTSA  >> >>       Adaptec 174X  >> >>       PMAZB, PMAZC  >>6 >>So my controller, the Adaptec 1742A is listed there. >># >>What's the problem with my setup?  > ? > The SCSI controllers have to support "target mode" as well asrA > TCQ.  There are relatively few adapters that do this right.  Ifo> > you look in "Guidelines for OpenVMS Cluster Configurations",B > you'll see a list of supported adapters for multihost SCSI.  The> > adaptec 1742A is not on the list, but maybe the same adapter > goes by another name.   A Hmmm... the VMS 7.3 release notes have this little gem buried in   them:   ?     	7.18.2 SCSI Disk I/O Performance Degradation for KZMSA XMIm'              and Adaptec 1742A Adapterse         V6.2 S  C      As a result of the SCSI-2 Tagged Command Queuing (TCQ) supportr>      in OpenVMS Alpha Version 6.2, Compaq has determined that A      customers with KZMSA XMI to SCSI and Adaptec 1742A adapters  ?      may experience a 20% SCSI disk I/O performance degradation 7      because TCQ is not implemented for these adapters.b   Hope this helps.   -Andy-   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:45:45 +0010g% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au U Subject: Re: Singular they was Re: Sv: Younger recruits versus experienced veterans ( 5 Message-ID: <01KEMGOK42CI0058C8@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>    Bob,+ >      Fish is only singular in New Jersey.t  * Is this some strange US attempt at humour?   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 08:38:25 -0500a+ From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com>e Subject: RE: SOAP on OpenVMS?.T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1CDA@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Robert,e  G Re: SOAP implementations on OpenVMS. I suspect most Application Serverso= will (or plan to) support SOAP as part of their Web  Servicese strategies.=20   As an example - > http://www.iona.com/products/appserv-standard.htm See Features   Regardsa  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanth Compaq Canada Corp.h Professional Services  Voice: 613-592-4660' Fax  :  819-772-7036 Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com     -----Original Message-----= From: Robert A.M. van Lopik [mailto:lopik@mail.telepac.pt]=20h Sent: February 22, 2002 4:59 AM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come Subject: SOAP on OpenVMS?r    C While looking into the whole subject of Web Services, I noticed thenF ubiquity of SOAP implementations. I would also want to have a (more orC less complete) list of SOAP implementations for VMS. So, if anybodycE knows of a SOAP implementation for VMS, could you please let me know.n   Thanks in advancen  
 rob van lopikn   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:15:16 GMTa! From: Andy <acs@fcgnet.works.net>- Subject: RE: SOAP on OpenVMS?3> Message-ID: <Xns91BE7C49B7163acsfcgnetworksnet@216.166.71.232>  9 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> enlightened us witheC news:BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1CDA@kaoexc01.americas.cpqs
 corp.net:      A > Re: SOAP implementations on OpenVMS. I suspect most Application > > Servers will (or plan to) support SOAP as part of their Web  > Services strategies. v      > >> From: Robert A.M. van Lopik [mailto:lopik@mail.telepac.pt]   eB >> While looking into the whole subject of Web Services, I noticedB >> the ubiquity of SOAP implementations. I would also want to haveB >> a (more or less complete) list of SOAP implementations for VMS.  C There are some Perl & Java implementations of SOAP 1.1 listed here:t  6    http://www.soapware.org/directory/4/implementations  ' no idea if they would work with VMS... b  B I was checking into both XML-RPC and SOAP myself and was disturbed= to see that SOAP is turning into one of those "designed by a t@ committee of large software vendors" things. XML-RPC seems to be> a much simpler/easier to implement idea ( See www.xmlrpc.com )= that anyone could use to "build web services in their garage"c? [Oddly enough, Apple has built support for both into Mac OS X] -   -Andy- --     ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 13:48:10 +0000s< From: Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard@tesco.net>* Subject: Re: The portability of Windows NT) Message-ID: <3C779D9A.EC47B9E6@tesco.net>-  G MSS> In terms of kernel architecture smartness NT beats VMS hands down  G MSS> - remember that VMS is 25 years old, and designed and coded by the D MSS> same team as NT. I think the team have learned something, am I  MSS> wrong?i  G You are wrong if you think that when David Cutler left DEC in 1988 thatiF all development of VMS halted.  Development of VMS has continued since, David Cutler stopped being involved with it.  < <URL:http://winntmag.com./Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=4494>   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:55:09 GMTe4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>* Subject: Re: The portability of Windows NT: Message-ID: <1IQd8.12702$ro5.4523955@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>  D Ah, the portability of Windows NT... Alpha's no longer a player, but& whatever happened to MIPS, PPC, et al?  I "Jonathan de Boyne Pollard" <J.deBoynePollard@tesco.net> wrote in messagee# news:3C779D9A.EC47B9E6@tesco.net...eH > MSS> In terms of kernel architecture smartness NT beats VMS hands downI > MSS> - remember that VMS is 25 years old, and designed and coded by theuE > MSS> same team as NT. I think the team have learned something, am Io
 > MSS> wrong?h >iI > You are wrong if you think that when David Cutler left DEC in 1988 that H > all development of VMS halted.  Development of VMS has continued since. > David Cutler stopped being involved with it. > > > <URL:http://winntmag.com./Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=4494>   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 14:26:41 +0100s9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>n+ Subject: tool to calc recursive dir sises ? & Message-ID: <3C779891.6BB6A97@aaa.com>   Hi.p: I'd like a tool that displays the total size and number of9 the files i each dir on a disk. Each dir should display a @ total *incl* all sub-dirs from that level. A "dir /tot" displays@ the actual number of files and size in each dir *excl* sub-dirs.  # Anyone having samething like this ?w  + I once wrote a tool to do this in DCL usingo F$SEARCH("device:[000000...]")F and then using F$FILE_ATTRIBUTES to calculate eof-size, alloc-size forH each dir and then write a report. It included a "level:n" label for eachC directory, so I could do "SEA <report> "level:2"" to get the totalsdD for a specific directory level. It worked fine, it just took so long time to run.m   Regards0 Jan-Erik Sderholm.o   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 15:50:00 GMTs# From: Jim <krait1@worldnet.att.net>v/ Subject: Re: tool to calc recursive dir sises ?e/ Message-ID: <3C77BA25.1090208@worldnet.att.net>    Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:a   > Hi. < > I'd like a tool that displays the total size and number of; > the files i each dir on a disk. Each dir should display aeB > total *incl* all sub-dirs from that level. A "dir /tot" displaysB > the actual number of files and size in each dir *excl* sub-dirs. > % > Anyone having samething like this ?e > - > I once wrote a tool to do this in DCL usinga  > F$SEARCH("device:[000000...]")H > and then using F$FILE_ATTRIBUTES to calculate eof-size, alloc-size forJ > each dir and then write a report. It included a "level:n" label for eachE > directory, so I could do "SEA <report> "level:2"" to get the totals-F > for a specific directory level. It worked fine, it just took so long > time	 > to run.o > 	 > Regardsn > Jan-Erik Sderholm.: >   
 E-mail me.   Jim.   -- a krait1@worldnet.att.netQ- PGP public key available at keyserver.pgp.com 
 941wu/8117hrs    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 16:50:23 +0100 - From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> / Subject: Re: tool to calc recursive dir sises ?a& Message-ID: <3C77BA3E.561D53E@Free.fr>   I do not understand. Why don't you do   $ dir/siz/tot [my_dir...]e   ?r   D.   Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:o >  > Hi. < > I'd like a tool that displays the total size and number of; > the files i each dir on a disk. Each dir should display aeB > total *incl* all sub-dirs from that level. A "dir /tot" displaysB > the actual number of files and size in each dir *excl* sub-dirs. > % > Anyone having samething like this ?1 > - > I once wrote a tool to do this in DCL usinge  > F$SEARCH("device:[000000...]")H > and then using F$FILE_ATTRIBUTES to calculate eof-size, alloc-size forJ > each dir and then write a report. It included a "level:n" label for eachE > directory, so I could do "SEA <report> "level:2"" to get the totalstF > for a specific directory level. It worked fine, it just took so long > time	 > to run.o > 	 > Regardso > Jan-Erik Sderholm..   ------------------------------   Date: 23 Feb 2002 18:33:08 GMT2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>7 Subject: Re: TS10 - Successful but some PROBE problems.e+ Message-ID: <a58n940r6p@enews4.newsguy.com>d  + In comp.sys.dec sword7@speakeasy.org wrote:/G > You mean that handbook called "VAX/VMS Internals and Data Structures 5H > v5.2"?  That is 2-3 inches thick and so heavy book.   I have VAX Arch N > Handbook that is smaller like 1 inch thick.  That is first edition (1987).  E > I still am looking for second edition (PDF or copy) that has KA655 cD > information.  I implemented KA655 and KA630 processors in my TS10  > emulator.e  D I'm talking about the "VAX Architecture Reference Manual", which wasJ published by Digital Press in 1987.  I really think this is the one you'reI talking about.  Unfortunatly I don't have the 2nd Ed. of this one either.   K I've also got the "VAX Architecture Handbook" published by DEC in 1981, and0K the 1980-81 & 1886 versions of the "VAX Hardware Handbook" from DEC.  TheseR are the paperbacks.a  K Something you might want to try and get access to is copies of the "DigitaliH Technical Journal".  I believe some of these are available online still,G somewhere at Compaq.  Unfortunatly they probably don't have what you'reu needing.   			Zanen   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:27:41 -0000H/ From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net>o- Subject: Re: Using Edit inside a procedure...e/ Message-ID: <u7fk8dpiass627@corp.supernews.com>e   valdemir-@uol.com.br wrote:07 : How can I edit a file inside a procedure ? Like this:j : vax1> type x.com :       $ EDIT/READ LOGIN.COMa :       $ EXIT4 : When I execute this procedure, I get this message:1 : Change mode can be entered only from a terminalt   You can spawn it instead.    -- a -- Mike Zarlenga   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 06:18:59 -0800t# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>y Subject: VAX SCANi9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIKEFMEDAA.tom@kednos.com>-  ? I couldn't locate a license pak for subject on the freeware 4.0h
 distribution. D Did I miss it?  If not, does someone have a pak they couls email me?  ? Rebuilding the kit does not seem like a productive use of time.t  + Was this ever ported to Alpha in some form?    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:27:25 +0300d4 From: "Ruslan R. Laishev" <laishev@smtp.deltatel.ru> Subject: Re: VAX SCAN 0 Message-ID: <3C77B4DD.162F0BD1@smtp.deltatel.ru>   Tom Linden wrote:  > A > I couldn't locate a license pak for subject on the freeware 4.0Q > distribution.sF > Did I miss it?  If not, does someone have a pak they couls email me? > A > Rebuilding the kit does not seem like a productive use of time.r > - > Was this ever ported to Alpha in some form?r 	Add my vote too!!!!   -- p Cheers, Ruslan. D +---------------------pure personal opinion------------------------+;       RADIUS Server for OpenVMS project - www.radiusvms.com 8         vms-isps@dls.net - Forum for ISP running OpenVMS*                  Mobile: +7 (901) 971-3222A    TKD (WTF) in Russia, St.-Petersburg - www.TaeKwonDo-WTF.SPb.RU1   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Feb 2002 05:45:47 -0800- From: merritt.robert@spsd.sk.ca (rob merritt)-/ Subject: Re: VMS 7.2 hobbist + mop? remote booth= Message-ID: <b6bf97d5.0202230545.3c71c000@posting.google.com>o  A Thanks Kevin by copy them binary do you mean just use ftp (image)e: also thanks for remining me about lat i will grab that too    M Kevin Handy <kth@srv.net> wrote in message news:<3C713385.7090802@srv.net>...  > rob merritt wrote: > > -2G > > I have a mopd on a linux box that I used to get BSD on a 3100 m38 I 
 > > also havedI > > a decserver 100 and a decserver 200 how would I get boot images to my7F > > linux machine so they could boot also? . I have access to the boot > > images from as- > > server at work alpha 1000 running 6.2-1  l > ? > Did this once (for a lantronix). If mopd is set up correctly.l? > you just need to copy (binary mode) the boot images images to 5 > the correct place, and it works.  You may also wantn? > to get the 'latd' software also (sourceforge?) so you can useo; > the decserver to connect to the linux box, or vice versa.(   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 11:55:10 +0000y From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net>cL Subject: [Change topic] Adding memory when simple tuning would be sufficient( Message-ID: <3C77831D.DFAC07D@Omond.net>   nic frae Bolton wrote:  D > I saw a situation where the system manager said there was a memoryJ > problem and bought more memory. His free list size went from 50% free toG > 75% free (of available memory) and still had the problem. Working setaF > tuning was all that was required! Mind you, the extra memory came inE > useful, so it wasn't wasted. This too is covered in the performanceD	 > manual.   D I'd say that that situation (i.e. buying more memory when relatively6 simple working set tuning is enough) is pretty common.  : Certainly within a certain *big* pharamceutical company in; Harlow (no names) when I was contracting for Digital there.w9 They refused to believe me, bought oodles more memory and ! had exactly the same performance.,  
 *sigh* ...  	 Roy Omondp Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 07:32:11 GMTa0 From: <marketingright5426667d28@eudoramail.com >Y Subject: | > Incredible Program!                                                         u3 Message-ID: <000c22b70cdd$2526b1b4$3eb18ab8@lwixcv>    AS SEEN ON NATIONAL TV:   F ''Making over half million dollars every 4 to 5 months from your home = for an investment of only $25 U.S. Dollars expense one time? D- THANKS TO THE COMPUTER AGE AND THE INTERNET! .G Before you say ''Bull'', please read the following. This is the letter  ; you have been hearing about on the news lately. Due to the .B popularity of this letter on the Internet, a national weekly news @ program recently devoted an entire show to the investigation of B this program described below, to see if it really can make people  money. n  G The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their nE findings proved once and for all that there are ''absolutely NO Laws hJ prohibiting the participation in the program and if people can follow the F simple instructions, they are bound to make some mega bucks with only  $25 out of pocket cost''. 3 DUE TO THE RECENT INCREASE OF POPULARITY & RESPECT o3 THIS PROGRAM HAS ATTAINED, IT IS CURRENTLY WORKING > BETTER THAN EVER.  This is what one had to say: sE ''Thanks to this profitable opportunity. I was approached many times s2 before but each time I passed on it. I am so glad E I finally joined just to see what one could expect in return for the c9 minimal effort and money required. To my astonishment, I tG received total $ 610,470.00 in 21 weeks, with money still coming in''.  # Pam Hedland, Fort Lee, New Jersey. pJ -------------------------------------------------------------------------  Here is another testimonial: tI This program has been around for a long time but I never believed in it. /@ But one day when I received this again in the mail I decided to B gamble my $25 on it. I followed the simple instructions and voila!= Three weeks later the money started to come in. First month IeD only made $240.00 but the next 2 months after that I made a total ofH $290,000.00. So far, in the past 8 months by re-entering the program, I 6 have made over $710,000.00 and I am playing it again. ; The key to success in this program is to follow the simple p! steps and NOT change anything.'' h  # More testimonials later but first,    1 *** PRINT THIS NOW FOR YOUR FUTURE REFERENCE ***      8 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ @ If you would like to make at least $500,000 every 4 to 5 months > easily and comfortably, please read the following...THEN READ  IT AGAIN and AGAIN!!! 8 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$   - FOLLOW THE SIMPLE INSTRUCTION BELOW AND YOUR e, FINANCIAL DREAMS WILL COME TRUE, GUARANTEED!      INSTRUCTIONS: 2 **** Order all 5 reports shown on the list below.   9 **** For each report, send $5 CASH, THE NAME & NUMBER OF  4 THE REPORT YOU ARE ORDERING and YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS B to the person whose name appears ON THAT LIST next to the report. 2 MAKE SURE YOUR RETURN ADDRESS IS ON YOUR ENVELOPE 0 (TOP LEFT CORNER) in case of any mail problems. B **** When you place your order, make sure you order each of the 5 B reports. You will need all 5 reports so that you can save them on @ your computer and resell them. YOUR TOTAL COST $5 X 5 = $25.00. C **** Within a few days you will receive, via e-mail, each of the 5 h> reports from these 5 different individuals. Save them on your E computer so they will be accessible for you to send to the thousands FD of people who will order them from you. Also make a floppy of these B reports and keep it on your desk in case something happen to your 
 computer. ? ****. IMPORTANT - DO NOT alter the names of the people who are q> listed next to each report, or their sequence on the list, in ? any way other than what is instructed below in step "1 through oD 6 '' or you will lose out on the majority of your profits. Once you A understand the way this works, you will also see how it does not S work if you change it.  < Remember, this method has been tested, and if you alter, it J will NOT work!  People have tried to put their friends' and/or relatives' @ names on all five thinking they could get all the money. But it C does not work this way. Believe us, we all have tried to be greedy g and then nothing happened.  @ So do not try to change anything other than what is instructed, ? because if you do, it will not work for you. Remember, honesty   reaps the reward! B 1.  After you have ordered all 5 reports, take this advertisement @ and REMOVE the name & address of the person in REPORT # 5. This > person has made it through the cycle and is no doubt counting  their fortune. l> 2.... Move the name & address in REPORT #4 down TO REPORT #5. > 3.... Move the name & address in REPORT #3 down TO REPORT #4. > 4.... Move the name & address in REPORT #2 down TO REPORT #3. = 5.... Move the name & address in REPORT #1 down TO REPORT #2 C< 6.... Insert YOUR name & address in the REPORT #1 Position. / PLEASE MAKE SURE you copy every name & address 5 ACCURATELY! 2 ================================================= C Take this entire letter, with the modified list of names, and save p4 it on your computer. DO NOT MAKE ANY OTHER CHANGES. ? Save this on a disk as well just in case if you lose any data. R@ To assist you with marketing your business on the Internet, the 8 5 reports you purchase will provide you with invaluable > marketing information which includes how to send bulk e-mails A legally, where to find thousands of free classified ads and much   more. 5 There are 2 Primary methods to get this venture goingl : , METHOD # 1 : BY SENDING BULK E-MAIL LEGALLY - ============================================ o= Let's say that you decide to start small, just to see how it y> goes, and we will assume you and those involved send out only E 5,000 e-mails each. Let's also assume that the mailing receives only LA a 0.2% response (the response could be much better but lets just .A say it is only 0.2%.  Also many people will send out hundreds of  / thousands e-mails instead of only 5,000 each). f? Continuing with this example, you send out only 5,000 e-mails. -; With a 0.2%response, that is only 10 orders for report #1. a7 Those 10 people responded by sending out 5,000 e-mails c= each for a total of 50,000. Out of those 50,000 e-mails only 7B 0.2% responded with orders. That equals 100 people that responded 8 and ordered Report #2.  Those 100 people mail out 5,000 ? e-mails each for a total of 500,000 e-mails. The 0.2% response  ? to that is 1,000 orders for Report #3. Those 1,000 people send  B out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 5 million e-mails sent out. : The 0.2% response to that is 10,000 orders for Report #4. ? Those 10,000 people send out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of L> 50,000,000 (50 million) e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is  100,000 orders for Report # 5. eB THAT'S 100,000 ORDERS TIMES $5 EACH = $500,000.00 (half million). & Your total income in this example is:  1..... $50+ 
 2..... $500+ g 3..... $5,000+ 2 4..... $50,000+ 2 5..... $500,000.........Grand Total = $555,550.00 4 NUMBERS DO NOT LIE. GET A PENCIL & PAPER AND FIGURE / OUT THE WORST POSSIBLE RESPONSES AND NO MATTER a3 HOW YOU CALCULATE IT, YOU WILL STILL MAKE A LOT OF e MONEY! 9I ------------------------------------------------------------------------ N1 REMEMBER FRIEND, THIS IS ASSUMING ONLY 10 PEOPLE i7 ORDERING OUT OF 5,000 YOU MAILED TO. Dare to think for mA a moment what would happen if everyone, or half or even 1/4th of >= those people mailed 100,000 e-mails each or more?  There are e@ over 150 million people on the Internet worldwide and counting. 4 Believe me, many people will do just that, and more!  b/ METHOD #2: BY PLACING FREE ADS ON THE INTERNET g4 =================================================== ? Advertising on the net is very, very inexpensive and there are r@ hundreds of FREE places to advertise. Placing a lot of free ads ? on the Internet will easily get a larger response. We strongly 9> suggest you start with Method # 1 and add METHOD #2 as you go  along. eD For every $5 you receive, all you must do is e-mail them the Report @ they ordered. That's it. Always provide same day service on all E orders. This will guarantee that the e-mail they send out, with your h: name and address on it will be prompt because they cannot ) advertise until they receive the report. .     AVAILABLE REPORTS   - ORDER EACH REPORT BY ITS NUMBER & NAME ONLY. f< Notes: Always send $5 cash (U.S. CURRENCY) for each Report. A Checks NOT accepted. Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping oC it in at least 2 sheets of paper. On one of those sheets of paper, j< Write the NUMBER & the NAME of the Report you are ordering, 6 YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS and your name and postal address. ( PLACE YOUR ORDER FOR THESE REPORTS NOW: / ============================================== uC Report #1:"The Insider's Guide to Advertising for Free on the Net"   Order Report #1 from:     B-1 Marketing '  4 Knapwood   San Antonio, TX 78248  / ============================================== kD REPORT # 2: "The Insider's Guide to Sending Bulk e-mail on the Net"  Order Report #2 from:    Sharron Martin m
 5051 N 850 E d North Webster IN 46555 s USA   / ==============================================  7 REPORT #3: "Secret to Multilevel marketing on the net" H Order Report #3 from:   	 BJ Alter i 1301 Q Los Olivos Ave  Los Osos, CA 93402  / ==============================================  A REPORT #4: "How to Become a Millionaire Utilizing MLM & the Net" " Order Report #4 from:    M S Marketing  2714 West 5th  North Platte, NE 669101  USA   / ==============================================  : REPORT #5: "How to Send Out One Million E-mails for Free"  Order Report # 5 from: t   Cybercc  #14  9163 W. Union Hills Dr. #105 Peoria, AZ 85382 r USA   -    . $$$$$$$$$ YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINES $$$$$$$$$$$ 3 Follow these guidelines to guarantee your success: i@ If you do not receive at least 10 orders for Report #1 within 2 . weeks, continue sending e-mails until you do. B After you have received 10 orders, within 2 to 3 weeks after that 5 you should receive 100 orders or more for REPORT #2. e> If you did not, continue advertising or sending e-mails until @ you do. Once you have received 100 or more orders for Report #2,9 YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for c+ you and the cash will continue to roll in! c7 THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER: Every time your name is  ? moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a different e report. 6 You can KEEP Track of your PROGRESS by watching which = report people are ordering from you. IF YOU WANT TO GENERATE  . MORE INCOME SEND ANOTHER BATCH OF E-MAILS AND 4 START THE WHOLE PROCESS AGAIN. There is NO LIMIT to 2 the income you can generate from this business!!! 5 ____________________________________________________    4 THE FOLLOWING IS A NOTE FROM THE ORIGINATOR OF THIS 	 PROGRAM:  @ "You have just received information that can give you financial ; freedom for the rest of your life, with NO RISK and JUST A R5 LITTLE BIT OF EFFORT. You can make more money in the c7 next few weeks and months than you have ever imagined. o8 Follow the program EXACTLY AS INSTRUCTED. Do not change 7 it in any way. It works exceedingly well as it is now. v< Remember to e-mail a copy of this exciting report after you @ have put your name and address in Report #1 and moved others to > #2 through #5 as instructed above. One of the people you send C this to may send out 100,000 or more e-mails and your name will be eA on every one of them. Remember though, the more you send out the h) more potential customers you will reach. I7 So my friend, I have given you the ideas, information, o= materials and opportunity to become financially independent. a IT IS UP TO YOU NOW! e1 ************** MORE TESTIMONIALS****************  : My name is Mitchell. My wife, Jody and I live in Chicago. 7 I am an accountant with a major U.S. Corporation and I  @ make pretty good money. When I received this program I grumbled ? to Jody about receiving ''junk mail''. I made fun of the whole  ? thing, spouting my knowledge of the population and percentages y? involved. I ''knew'' it wouldn't work. Jody totally ignored my  A supposed intelligence and few days later she jumped in with both lD feet. I made merciless fun of her, and was ready to lay the old ''I A told you so'' on her when the thing didn't work. Well, the laugh oD was on me! Within 3 weeks she had received 50 responses. Within the E next 45 days she had received a total of $147,200.00 all cash! I was  . shocked. I have joined Jody in her ''hobby''. ( Mitchell Wolf, M.D. , Chicago, Illinois J ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9 Not being the gambling type, it took me several weeks to 5C make up my mind to participate in this plan. But conservative that e? I am, I decided that the initial investment was so little that lD there was just no way that I wouldn't get enough orders to at least  get my money back.  D I was surprised when I found my medium size post office box crammed @ with orders. I made $319,210.00 in the first 12 weeks. The nice D thing about this deal is that it does not matter where people live. C There simply isn't a better investment with a faster return and so i big''. . Dan Sondstrom, Alberta, Canada AJ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ? 'I had received this program before. I deleted it, but later I  C wondered if I should have given it a try. Of course, I had no idea  D who to contact to get another copy, so I had to wait until I was e- > mailed again by someone else.........11 months passed then it = luckily came again.  I did not delete this one!  I made more  ? than $490,000 on my first try and all the money came within 22 -	 weeks''. A Susan De Suza, New York, N.Y. H ----------------------------------------------------------------------- B '' It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money < with little cost to you. I followed the simple instructions : and within 10 days the money started to come in. My first = month, I made $20,560 and by the end of third month my total 7 cash count was $362,840. o( Life is beautiful, Thanx to Internet''. $ Fred Dellaca, Westport, New Zealand J ------------------------------------------------------------------------- + ORDERYOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED ON   OUR ROAD TO FINANCIAL FREEDOM! n2 ================================================= C If you have any questions of the legality of this program, contact tB the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal B Trade Commission, Bureau of Consumer Protection, Washington, D.C. D His message is sent in compliance of the proposed bill SECTION 301. 9 per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 1618. Further  @ transmission to you by the sender of this e-mail may be stopped @ promptly by sending a reply with the word REMOVE in the subject G Line to the email address at the top of this page. This message is not  D intended for residents in the State of Washington, and screening of > addresses has been done to the best of our technical ability. - _____________________________________________y   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.106 ************************