1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 30 Jun 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 357       Contents:% RE: Delay in publication of VMS books  Re: parsing >255 Re: parsing >255 Re: parsing >255 Re: parsing >255 Re: parsing >255? RE: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...) ? Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...) ? Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...) ? RE: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...) + Powerstorm 300/350 cards and OpenGL on OVMS / Re: Powerstorm 300/350 cards and OpenGL on OVMS ( Re: TELNET service startup file missing?( Re: TELNET service startup file missing? Re: Worldcom MCI and VMS  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 09:34:29 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> . Subject: RE: Delay in publication of VMS booksT Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4026607D7@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Alan,    >>> Sorry to disappoint.<<<   E Not an problem - I am sure the rest of the readership understands.=20   G Fwiw, you are right about the amount of work required in writing a book > - a collegue of mine wrote a couple a few years ago and he wasF describing the time writing as incredibly time consuming with with all( sorts of pressure from the Publisher.=20  < And of course, there is also that day job to handle as well.   :-)    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----+ From: "Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr" * [mailto:winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU]=20 Sent: June 29, 2002 1:33 PM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com . Subject: Re: Delay in publication of VMS books    E In article <3D1DD318.90609@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> writes:   I >Many of us were hoping to receive our copies of "OpenVMS with Apache,=20  >OSU andE >WASD" and of the "OpenVMS System Management Guide" by now, but alas.    > H >Both books were scheduled for publication on June 15. However the first   >book isF >scheduled now to be published on August 30, and the second book isn't
 even on=20D >the web pages of the publisher yet (that is not the new edition !). >   E I can't speak to the "OpenVMS System Management Guide", but as to the A other one, the delay is all my fault.  That's the first book I've E written, and I seriously underestimated the time and trouble it would  take.  I returned=20F corrected proofs to the relevant freelance Frame person in early June.  D >I just hope the books will be up to date when they are published=20 >(Apache 2.x and  VMS 7.3-1).  G The book will have inevitably fallen somewhat behind.  There won't be a E CSWS based on Apache 2.x by the publication date, but WASD 8.0 (maybe H 8.1) will be out and the book is based on 7.2; OSU 3.9 and 3.10alpha areB covered, but 3.10a is out.  The book isn't particularly OS-version2 specific, but my tests were all done on VMS 7.2-2.   Sorry to disappoint.   -- Alan     L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=B =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU?  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056A  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA 
 94309-0210L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=B =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 06:27:17 GMT & From: Guy Peleg <guy.peleg@compaq.com> Subject: Re: parsing >255 ( Message-ID: <3D1EA354.843A47@compaq.com>   Aaron,  E The current DCL limit is 255 bytes per command. It can be extended to  1024 using the hyphen sign.   H We are currently working on a project to increase this limit. New limitsF should be 4096 bytes per command, using the hyphen 8192 bytes. We have, also increased the symbol size to 1024bytes.  5 The new DCL is currently scheduled to ship in H1CY03.    Regards,  	 Guy Peleg  OpenVMS Engineering    Chuck Aaron wrote:   > Group, > > > It appears DCL command procedures cannot parse more than 255F > characters at one time into a single form_fld buffer. Is there a way7 > around this or is this still an internal restriction?  > 	 > Thanks,  >  > Chuck    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 18:37:53 +0010 % From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au  Subject: Re: parsing >255 5 Message-ID: <01KJJVEO5QO20002DK@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>    Guy Peleg wrote: >Aaron,  > F >The current DCL limit is 255 bytes per command. It can be extended to >1024 using the hyphen sign. > I >We are currently working on a project to increase this limit. New limits G >should be 4096 bytes per command, using the hyphen 8192 bytes. We have - >also increased the symbol size to 1024bytes.  > 6 >The new DCL is currently scheduled to ship in H1CY03.  E My problem is not so much with DCL, but with an MMS command line.  I  H currently have to generate two script files as part of the command line.  G Will EDS (who I think now own DECset -- er VAXset even on Alphas) also  K increase their limit?  The last contact a colleague of mine had was with a   lady, Barbara Burri.   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------   Date: 30 Jun 02 10:47:19 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)  Subject: Re: parsing >255 ) Message-ID: <KdSHPCTxX$ia@elias.decus.ch>   Q In article <3D1EA354.843A47@compaq.com>, Guy Peleg <guy.peleg@compaq.com> writes:  > Aaron, > G > The current DCL limit is 255 bytes per command. It can be extended to  > 1024 using the hyphen sign.  > J > We are currently working on a project to increase this limit. New limitsH > should be 4096 bytes per command, using the hyphen 8192 bytes. We have. > also increased the symbol size to 1024bytes. > 7 > The new DCL is currently scheduled to ship in H1CY03.  >    Thanks for the update.   __
 Paul Sture Switzerland / If you want to lose data big time, use Mac OS X    ------------------------------    Date: 30 Jun 2002 06:21:55 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: parsing >255 3 Message-ID: <NYSxoOXlLX+x@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ] In article <01KJJVEO5QO20002DK@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>, paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au writes:   I > Will EDS (who I think now own DECset -- er VAXset even on Alphas) also    F That would be news to me.  For years they have done maintenance on it,? but that is under contract and they have not owned the product.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 14:34:17 GMT & From: Guy Peleg <guy.peleg@compaq.com> Subject: Re: parsing >255 * Message-ID: <3D1F157C.B63025FD@compaq.com>   Paddy,  J Without going into DCL internals too much, the token size was increased asN well, therefore  all utilities/applications will enjoy from this change. On myI test system I was able to enter 4000 characters MMS command. Once the DCL  change@ is ready it is only a matter of qualification by other products.   Guy   & paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote:   > Guy Peleg wrote:	 > >Aaron,  > > H > >The current DCL limit is 255 bytes per command. It can be extended to > >1024 using the hyphen sign. > > K > >We are currently working on a project to increase this limit. New limits I > >should be 4096 bytes per command, using the hyphen 8192 bytes. We have / > >also increased the symbol size to 1024bytes.  > > 8 > >The new DCL is currently scheduled to ship in H1CY03. > F > My problem is not so much with DCL, but with an MMS command line.  IJ > currently have to generate two script files as part of the command line. > H > Will EDS (who I think now own DECset -- er VAXset even on Alphas) alsoL > increase their limit?  The last contact a colleague of mine had was with a > lady, Barbara Burri. >  > Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 06:48:48 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> H Subject: RE: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEGCFEAA.tom@kednos.com>   * Do we know yet how it will operate on IPF?   >-----Original Message----- 5 >From: Larry Kilgallen [mailto:Kilgallen@SpamCop.net] & >Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2002 7:08 PM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComI >Subject: RE: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)  >  > @ >In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIEEFJFEAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom ! >Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes: I >> Of course, a binary translator, doesn't need to know what the original G >> source languqage was.  Making the PL/I runtime avaialble on IPF is a I >> piece of cake, since it is all C code, and that is the first thing we  ( >> will provide, both for VMS and Tru64. >>  # >> I hope that addresses the issue.  > ? >The Translated Image Environment on Alpha has separate runtime 5 >libraries specifically to support translated images.  >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). A >Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release Date: 6/20/2002  >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release Date: 6/20/2002   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 14:08:19 GMT - From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> H Subject: Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)* Message-ID: <3D1F0CC4.3080702@qsl.network>   Tom Linden wrote: , > Do we know yet how it will operate on IPF?  G It may be best to contact SRI and HP OpenVMS through official channels.   3 SRI is reported to be doing the binary translation.    -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:27:47 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)H Subject: Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)J Message-ID: <rdeininger-3006021127480001@1cust44.tnt3.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>  F In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEFLFEAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote:    >>-----Original Message-----; >>From: Robert Deininger [mailto:rdeininger@mindspring.com] ' >>Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2002 8:18 AM  >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com J >>Subject: Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...) >> >>H >>In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIMEFJFEAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" >><tom@kednos.com> wrote:  >> >>L >>>>If HP and Kednos want to remedy this gap in PL/I functionality, they can? >>>>come up with an agreement to make the RTL available on IPF.  >>> A >>>As I said in my previous posting responding to Terry, the RTL   >>will be there.L >>>It may not ship as part of the OS, but you can certainly download it from' >>>our (HG)ftp site  (plug for Hunter!)  >>L >>If you want it to ship with VMS (like all the other RTLs), you should workJ >>with HP to come up with a license agreement that eases the terror in the >>legal department.  > D >In HPQ's legal department?  Why, if they download it from our site?    G To support current PL/I images in a translated environment, I think the B current, compatible alpha PL/I RTL needs to be translated as well.  H HP/Compaq/Digital sold their rights to PL/I quite a few years ago.  TheyH retained the right to distribute the alpha PL/I RTL with OpenVMS alpha. F HP does NOT think it has the right to translate the alpha PL/I RTL andE distribute it with OpenVMS IPF.  That legal loophope, rather than any F technical problem, it why they are telling people that tranlating PL/IH images from alpha to IPF won't work.  At leat that's the way it has been explained to me.  J I understand another company owned VMS PL/I before Kednos.  I have no ideaG who owns the current alpha RTL.  If Kednos owns it, I assume Kednos can J grant HP the right to translate it to IPF and distribute it.  Maybe HP hasJ something Kednos needs, like access to an IPF version of GEM or some otherJ support in porting PL/I to IPF.  I hope the various parties work this out,D because the current plans leave some PL/I customers out in the cold.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 08:39:52 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> H Subject: RE: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEGEFEAA.tom@kednos.com>    >-----Original Message----- : >From: Robert Deininger [mailto:rdeininger@mindspring.com]$ >Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2002 8:28 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComI >Subject: Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)  >  > G >In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEFLFEAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden"  ><tom@kednos.com> wrote: >  >>>-----Original Message----- < >>>From: Robert Deininger [mailto:rdeininger@mindspring.com]( >>>Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2002 8:18 AM >>>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComK >>>Subject: Re: PL/I apps on IPF (was RE: Fearless IPF Prognostications...)  >>>  >>> I >>>In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIMEFJFEAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden"  >>><tom@kednos.com> wrote: >>>  >>> 5 >>>>>If HP and Kednos want to remedy this gap in PL/I  >functionality, they can@ >>>>>come up with an agreement to make the RTL available on IPF. >>>>A >>>>As I said in my previous posting responding to Terry, the RTL  >>>will be there. < >>>>It may not ship as part of the OS, but you can certainly >download it from ( >>>>our (HG)ftp site  (plug for Hunter!) >>> A >>>If you want it to ship with VMS (like all the other RTLs), you  >should workK >>>with HP to come up with a license agreement that eases the terror in the  >>>legal department. >>E >>In HPQ's legal department?  Why, if they download it from our site?  >  > H >To support current PL/I images in a translated environment, I think theC >current, compatible alpha PL/I RTL needs to be translated as well.   K I guess I am somewhat ignorant of the proposed architecture.  I had assumed F that building shared library in the target environment would have been sufficient, I the assumption being that the translated images had symbols that would be L resolved in the same manner as on Alpha.  On the other hand, translating the RTL is no biggy.   > I >HP/Compaq/Digital sold their rights to PL/I quite a few years ago.  They H >retained the right to distribute the alpha PL/I RTL with OpenVMS alpha.G >HP does NOT think it has the right to translate the alpha PL/I RTL and F >distribute it with OpenVMS IPF.  That legal loophope, rather than anyG >technical problem, it why they are telling people that tranlating PL/I I >images from alpha to IPF won't work.  At leat that's the way it has been  >explained to me.   H Yes, this is true, but the RTL has had a number of improvements over theG version to which HP has the rights to distribute.  Of course thay can't J distribute it without our approval, but since they have never asked, it isJ odd that they so cavalierly are telling their PL/I customers to recode, an0 approach guaranteed to send the customers to IBM   > K >I understand another company owned VMS PL/I before Kednos.  I have no idea H >who owns the current alpha RTL.  If Kednos owns it, I assume Kednos canK >grant HP the right to translate it to IPF and distribute it.  Maybe HP has K >something Kednos needs, like access to an IPF version of GEM or some other K >support in porting PL/I to IPF.  I hope the various parties work this out, E >because the current plans leave some PL/I customers out in the cold.   I That was UniPrise Systems, from whom we acquired the PL/I for Tru64 after I they went belly up.  We own the current RTL.  I think these questions are G better asked of HP, we have certainly indicated our desire to work with  them, - but so far have been essentially stonewalled.      >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). A >Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release Date: 6/20/2002  >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release Date: 6/20/2002   ------------------------------    Date: 30 Jun 2002 00:05:08 -07005 From: Hiroyuki_Tanaka4@excite.co.jp (Hiroyuki Tanaka) 4 Subject: Powerstorm 300/350 cards and OpenGL on OVMS= Message-ID: <68cfa44d.0206292305.4ba1fbf4@posting.google.com>p  
 Dear Readers,   B I have a DEC Alpha 500AU with an Elsa Gloria card and I wishing toE upgrade to use OpenGL.  I have looked at the SPD for Open3D and thereTB is no mention of support for the Powerstorm 300 and Powerstorm 350 cards.  C Will the Powerstorm 300 and 350 series of card work with OpenGL and- OVMS?-  5 What is the minimum version of VMS I need to install?   > Which card do I need to get if I to use OpenGL overlays?  (The6 Powerstorm 4d20 supported overlays, but not the 3d30.)   Thanks 5   Tanaka   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 12:10:30 -0500 C From: "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com>28 Subject: Re: Powerstorm 300/350 cards and OpenGL on OVMSH Message-ID: <craig.berry-EA7B71.12103030062002@news.directvinternet.com>  2 You can get kits for OpenVMS 7.1-2 and later.  See  H <http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/faq/vmsfaq_005.html#powerstorm300>  F However, check the support details to make sure the EV56 processor in & your 500au is supported by the driver.  = In article <68cfa44d.0206292305.4ba1fbf4@posting.google.com>,:7  Hiroyuki_Tanaka4@excite.co.jp (Hiroyuki Tanaka) wrote:p  D > I have a DEC Alpha 500AU with an Elsa Gloria card and I wishing toG > upgrade to use OpenGL.  I have looked at the SPD for Open3D and there0D > is no mention of support for the Powerstorm 300 and Powerstorm 350 > cards. > E > Will the Powerstorm 300 and 350 series of card work with OpenGL andr > OVMS?  > 7 > What is the minimum version of VMS I need to install?h > @ > Which card do I need to get if I to use OpenGL overlays?  (The8 > Powerstorm 4d20 supported overlays, but not the 3d30.)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 10:48:19 +0200t/ From: Frederik Meerwaldt <frederik@freddym.org>i1 Subject: Re: TELNET service startup file missing?e/ Message-ID: <afmgkj$qae$02$1@news.t-online.com>    Hi,o  3 On Sat, 29 Jun 2002 18:36:12 +0200, JF Mezei wrote:   C > VAX-VMS 7.2 and TCPIP 5.0 (hobbyist stuff) does not have a telnettG > startup procedure in sys$startup I think I recall noticing it because I > the documentation does mention its existence. But it works fine withoute > one.  C It doesn't matter whether this is hobbyist stuff or not as just the= licenses are different.S I have this file:k  ; [frederik@vax6k5]$ dir sys$startup:tcpip$telnet_startup.com    Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR]   ( TCPIP$TELNET_STARTUP.COM;1                , And - no - it won't work without one, I bet.G Perhaps you just searched for the wrong name, or I got the thread wronga (not following the whole one).   Greetings from Germany,  	Freddy    ------------------------------  + Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 17:07:56 +0000 (UTC)3 From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk1 Subject: Re: TELNET service startup file missing?3+ Message-ID: <afndtc$h1t$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>D  W In article <3D1D4D16.5030409@spammotel.com>, Alder <PGDEHMKOKIMD@spammotel.com> writes:  >JF Mezei wrote:Q >> It is normal that there is no telnet srartup file in sys$manager. Telnet isn't/G >> a "normal" service, it is closer to a fancy terminal driver I think.C >> 4" >> You can enable/disable it with: >> 3 >> 3  >> $TCPIP DISABLE SERVICE TELNET >>   >> or:	 >> $TCPIP3 >> TCPIP> HELP ENABLE  >> TCPIP> HELP DISABLE >D >Thanks JF,3 >DF >I was just going on the TCPIP docs which said the TELNET_STARTUP.COM  >file was "supplied".- >- >Cheers, >Alder >   M I think this changed at version 5.1. At that point I think individual startupRL and shutdown procedures were supplied for each service. Up until then it wasM hit and miss whether a startup and shutdown command procedure was supplied oreI whether you just went into the TCPIP/UCX program and disabled/enabled them	 service. i? The TELNET_STARTUP.COM file is definitely on my Alpha System in. sys$common:[sysmgr] -    Alpha2:ucx sh ver0  ?   Compaq TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.1 - ECO 3 2   on a AlphaServer 2100 5/300 running OpenVMS V7.3  / Alpha2:dir sys$startup:tcpip$telnet_startup.comc   Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR]r   TCPIP$TELNET_STARTUP.COM;1   as is   0 Alpha2:dir sys$startup:tcpip$telnet_shutdown.com   Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR]l   TCPIP$TELNET_SHUTDOWN.COM;1      Note.   M Sometimes some of these commandfiles were also put in the earlier directoriesm, of sys$startup rather than in sys$manager eg  # Directory SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]5   TCPIP$LPD_SYSHUTDOWN.COM;3   Total of 1 file.  " Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYS$STARTUP]  ; TCPIP$SHUTDOWN.COM;1                    TCPIP$STARTUP.COM;1     J (actually I need to deal with that LPD_SHUTDOWN since there is also one inD sys$manager hence one or other is probably from an older version of  DEC TCPIP Services).    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------   Date: 30 Jun 02 08:52:13 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) ! Subject: Re: Worldcom MCI and VMSp) Message-ID: <Ey9xVnyY7hqk@elias.decus.ch>l  j In article <5.1.0.14.2.20020629073914.01b5d6a8@raptor.psccos.com>, Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com> writes:( > At 01:54 AM 6/29/2002, JF Mezei wrote: >>Dan O'Reilly wrote:aP >> > Yep!  There are still LOTS of VMS systems that just plain can't be replacedH >> > by UNIX systems, even though there have been attempts to do so for  >> (literally)M >> > 10 years or more in some cases.  The UNIX systems just can't do the job!u >> >>N >> From a technical point of view, what sort of aspects would give VMS such an  >>advantage over a UNIX system ? >>M >>The way it was described, high perforance was the key factor. Isn't  UNIX a  >>better performer than VMS ?d >>O >>Or was it the reliability/clustering features that made it possible to handleeE >>the load where a Unix system couldn't be scalable enough to do it ?  > J > It's both, actually.  I won't go into technical details here, but from aI > performance standpoint, there are some features of VMS that UNIX simply-L > can't duplicate, and that these systems exploit to their fullest.  SufficeH > it to say, I'll bet you've never seen a non-paged pool that's multiple > gigabytes in size... >a  J On that topic I heard the other day that a disaster tolerant site is beingG located somewhere other than I expected. Reason: IBM cannot support theo& distances available with VMS clusters.  eK >  From a reliability standpoint, when WorldCom came in, they actually tolddH > some groups that the systems they were doing were too reliable!  TheirG > (WorldCom's) view was "put it out there, and if it crashes, that's OK>J > so long as the features are there".  And it's just exactly that point ofJ > view that's become so prevalent in business today - and it's why MS getsL > so much business.  Do the systems on the cheap and worry about reliability > last, if at all. >   K Can you say "No budget for system testing"? Unfortunately I heard that too.y   <GROUSE AND ANGER>  L Bloody Apple! I've just lost the approx 250 photos I have taken recently. NoL apparent cause, just vanished into thin air after iPhoto locked up and I had to kill it.m  " Even Windows never did that to me.  F I simply don't trust this beast to hold data reliably any more. Bloody expensive way to lose data too.   N Where are my backups you say? Well sorry, I've kinda got used to systems which  hold data for more than 3 hours.   </GROUSE AND ANGER>w  5 Distinctly unhappy. Understatement of the year there.p   cc Steve Jobs @apple __
 Paul Sture Switzerlandn   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.357 ************************