1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 26 Mar 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 167       Contents:M ACCEPT CREDIT CARDS & TRIPLE YOUR SALES TODAY!                          30146  Re: ADA95 for ia64/OpenVMS, another hint of post-merger direction, maybe0 Re: another hint of post-merger direction, maybe Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  Re: Blade architectures  compiler issue.. Re: compiler issue.. Re: creating a mailbox in DCL  Re: creating a mailbox in DCL / Re: DEC C: why does exit(0) really exit with 1? / Re: DEC C: why does exit(0) really exit with 1? / Re: DEC C: why does exit(0) really exit with 1?  Re: DECterm X client, ACCPORNAM 
 ERRLOG.SYS Re: ERRLOG.SYS Re: ERRLOG.SYS Excursion (DECterm) API? Re: Excursion (DECterm) API? Re: Excursion (DECterm) API?: Re: External authentication + trapping password changes...1 Flash plugin now available for Mozilla on OpenVMS 5 Re: Flash plugin now available for Mozilla on OpenVMS & Followup Re: creating a mailbox in DCL  Re: Hacker Using My Mail Server? Re: How to fork() ? ' How to know if EDS hires for VMS Eng. ? F Re: HP's viewpoint on Linux, was: Re: Sun eating major helping ofLinuxF Re: HP's viewpoint on Linux, was: Re: Sun eating major helping ofLinux5 Re: IF-THEN-ELSE oddity: Extra ELSE's cause no error! # Re: Installing Star Receipt Printer ! Re: Interesting Alpha advertising ! Re: Interesting Alpha advertising 4 Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?4 Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?4 Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?4 Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK? Lottery and VMS  Re: Lottery and VMS 7 RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC 7 RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC 7 Re: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC 7 Re: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC 7 Re: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC * Re: LP11/LA11/LS11 Line Printer Supported?* Re: LP11/LA11/LS11 Line Printer Supported?G Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver G Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver G Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver G Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver G Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver G Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver G RE: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver  News Server Software* Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...* RE: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...* Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...* Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...* Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...( Re: Resumes [was: Right down the middle]( Re: Resumes [was: Right down the middle]( Re: Resumes [was: Right down the middle] Re: Right down the middle  Re: Set user similar to SU Re: Set user similar to SU Re: Set user similar to SU Re: Set user similar to SU Re: Set user similar to SU$ Re: Shannon knows DEC -> CPQ -> ????$ Re: Shannon knows DEC -> CPQ -> ????* SNMP question (finding modem's IP address). Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address). Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address). Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address). Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address) Re: Where is Freeware 5.0? RE: Where is Freeware 5.0? RE: Where is Freeware 5.0?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:51:32 -0200 ! From: 6merchantoptinleads@msn.com V Subject: ACCEPT CREDIT CARDS & TRIPLE YOUR SALES TODAY!                          30146C Message-ID: <200203260022.g2Q0Lwn12668@mail009.syd.optusnet.com.au>    <html>   <head>8 <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Language" content=3D"en-us">= <meta name=3D"GENERATOR" content=3D"Microsoft FrontPage 5.0"> < <meta name=3D"ProgId" content=3D"FrontPage.Editor.Document">K <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-=  1252">. <title>NO MONEY Down Merchant Accounts</title> <style>  <!-- fine {K 	FONT-SIZE: 9px; COLOR: #666666; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma, Arial, Helvetica, sa=  ns-serif }  -->  </style> </head>   + <body text=3D"#006699" bgcolor=3D"#006699">    <p align=3D"center"><i><strong> K <font color=3D"#FFFF00" face=3D"Arial" style=3D"font-size: 28pt">NO MONEY =  Down  * Merchant Accounts!</font></strong></i></p>K <p align=3D"center"><font color=3D"#00FF00" face=3D"Arial" size=3D"2">&nbs= K p;</font><font color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><font fac=  e=3D"Arial"><b>If = you own your own business, you're starting a new business<br> K or know someone who is.</b>..</font><b><font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"2"> </= 	 font></b> 
 </font><i><b> K <font color=3D"#00FF00" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"4" FAMILY=3D"SAN=  SSERIF">Being  able to accept Major Credit<br> M Cards can make all the difference in the world!</font></b></i><font color=3D= K "#00FF00" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"4" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">&nbsp;= K </font><font color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"2" FAMILY=  =3D"SANSSERIF"><br> K <span class=3D"271340518-02012002"><font color=3D"#0000ff">&nbsp;</font></= K span></font><b><font color=3D"#ff0080" lang=3D"0" size=3D"5" FAMILY=3D"SAN=  SSERIF"><br>J </font><i><font face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"5" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">K <a href=3D"http://rd.yahoo.com/dir/?http://202.102.9.82/merch/1/index.html=  " target=3D"_blank">K <font color=3D"#FFFF00">CLICK HERE</font></a></font></i></b><font color=3D= K "#FFFF00" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"5" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">&nbsp;= K </font><font color=3D"#0000ff" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"5" FAMILY=  =3D"SANSSERIF"><br> C </font><font color=3D"#000000" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><br> K </font><strong><font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D=  "SANSSERIF">B Just the fact that you accept credit cards adds credibility to<br>K your business. Especially if you are a New, Small or Home Based Business.<= M /font><font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"2" color=3D"#000000" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D=  "SANSSERIF"><br> </font></strong>K <font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"2" color=3D"#000000" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D"SAN=  SSERIF">K <span class=3D"271340518-02012002"><font color=3D"#ff6600">&nbsp;</font></= K span></font><font color=3D"#ff6600" lang=3D"0" size=3D"1" FAMILY=3D"SANSSE= 	 RIF"><br>  </font><strong><em> K <font color=3D"#FFFF00" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"6" FAMILY=3D"SAN=  SSERIF">No  K Payment For The First Month!</font><font color=3D"#ff8000" face=3D"Arial" = / lang=3D"0" size=3D"5" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><br>  </font></em></strong> K <font color=3D"#ff8000" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"5" FAMILY=3D"SAN=  SSERIF">K <span class=3D"271340518-02012002"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2">&nbs= K p;</font></span></font><font color=3D"#000000" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D"SANSSE= 	 RIF"><br> 
 </font><b>K <font color=3D"#00FF00" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"4" FAMILY=3D"SAN=  SSERIF">Setup K within 3-5 Days</font></b><font color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" size=3D"2" FA=  MILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><br> K </font><font color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" size=3D"1" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">=  <br>K </font><font face=3D"Arial"><font color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" FAMILY=3D"S= 
 ANSSERIF">I Approval is quick and our set up times range from 3 - 5 days. Guaranteed  K approval on all leases for equipment or software. Bad credit, no credit, n=  o K problem! </font><font color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" size=3D"2" FAMILY=3D"SA= 
 NSSERIF"><br>  <br>K </font><b><font color=3D"#00FF00" lang=3D"0" size=3D"4" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERI= 
 F">ACCEPT K CREDIT CARDS ONLINE or OFFLINE !!</font></b></font><font color=3D"#000000"= 0  lang=3D"0" size=3D"1" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><br> <br>* </font><span class=3D"271340518-02012002">K <font color=3D"#000080" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" size=3D"1" FAMILY=3D"SAN= K SSERIF">&nbsp;</font><font color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Arial" lang=3D"0" siz= K e=3D"1" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"5"><strong><em><= K a href=3D"http://rd.yahoo.com/dir/?http://202.102.9.82/merch/1/index.html"= 1  target=3D"_blank"><font color=3D"#FFFF00">CLICK  K HERE</font></a></em></strong></font><font color=3D"#FFFF00" face=3D"Arial"= +  size=3D"5">&nbsp;</font></font></span></p> K <p align=3D"center"><span class=3D"fine"><font color=3D"#000000" size=3D"1= 
 ">Did you K receive an email advertisement in error? Our goal is to only target indivi=  duals K who would like to take advantage of our offers. If you'd like to be remove=  d from  F our mailing list, please click on the link below. You will be removed K immediately and automatically from all of our future mailings.</font></spa=  n></p>K <p align=3D"center"><span class=3D"fine"><font color=3D"#000000" size=3D"1= 
 ">We protect  K all email addresses from other third parties. Thank you.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=   </font>K <font size=3D"1">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb= K sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=  ;&nbsp; </font> K <a href=3D"http://202.102.9.82/mort/remove.htm"><font color=3D"#FFFF00" si= 	 ze=3D"1"> - Please <b>remove</b> me</font></a></span></p>    </body>    </html>    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 13:52:26 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) # Subject: Re: ADA95 for ia64/OpenVMS 3 Message-ID: <me8QOSdNBuyk@eisner.encompasserve.org>   i In article <3C9F49DD.29AB7480@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes:  > Bob Koehler wrote:l >> In article <3C9B50A5.F49DD68D@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes: >> > Good news.  >> > >> > For those that use Ada. >>  I >>    Nope.  A lot of users are heavily tied to DEC Ada (83?).  Moving to ' >>    GNAT is going to be a major cost.  >  > Hmmm.  > 4 > Would they not have to migrate from Ada83 to Ada95  > at some point in time anyway ?  @ No.  Ada95 introduces dynamic dispatching and other capabilities> that may be forbidden to those writing certain safety-critical= applications.  I understand there is a SPARK subset for Ada95 > as well, but for someone to want to move to Ada95 there should be a reason.  ? This is not just a matter of personal desire -- it is perfectly A reasonable for someone to use DEC Ada for some projects and Ada95  for other projects.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 06:07:09 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>5 Subject: another hint of post-merger direction, maybe C Message-ID: <heUn8.259339$uv5.22780768@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>    from  L http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/25/technology/ebusiness/25HEWL.html?ex=1017724 3600&en=bdff2cffee432af8&ei=5035&partner=MARKETWATCH  J "... a big mistake after Compaq acquired Digital Equipment in 1998 was notH moving early to focus the Digital Unix business on its niche strength inL technical computing rather than trying to compete broadly in the Unix marketI against bigger rivals like Sun Microsystems (news/quote), Hewlett-Packard 4 and I.B.M. (news/quote), Mr. Clarke of Compaq said."  J Now, that's Compaq stupidity at its finest.  Let's relegate a product thatG could be potentially miles ahead of any commercial Unix competitor to a L niche market that has relatively little need of the unique value (clustering7 being a biggie) that we're in a unique position to add.    Fucking idiots.    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:54:17 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 9 Subject: Re: another hint of post-merger direction, maybe , Message-ID: <3CA01B10.FF4BA578@videotron.ca>   Bill Todd wrote:D > http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/25/technology/ebusiness/25HEWL.html    F Thanks for the pointer. most interesting article. However, I found the following more telling:    ##M "Out of the blocks, we have to move as fast as we can," said Bar- bara Braun, J a senior manager for the Hewlett-Packard integration team. To do that, Mr.M McKinney said, the team has taken as one of its operating principles the need C to make tough decisions instead of "trying to make everyone happy."  <...> M But according to members of the transition team, the decisions that have been N made include what products will be promoted and supported most aggressively. AN day or so after the merger is approved, the top 100 corporate customers of theN combined company will be visited by Hewlett-Packard representatives with boundI "play books" detailing the company's product plans and who the customer's  account team will be.   J  The product lines no longer marked for continued investment, Mr. McKinneyI emphasized, will not be jettisoned immediately. For example, he said that N Hewlett-Packard's standard service contracts routinely call for the company toN continue supplying technical support for five years after a line is obsolete.   H  Still, a crucial element in the merger's success will be how convincingB corporate customers find the Hewlett-Packard "migration path" fromJ discontinued product lines to other offerings the company will feature. IfJ customers do not go along, and defect to competitors, the revenue loss forJ Hewlett-Packard could be far more than the 5 percent over all it expects.  ##   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:59:30 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> Subject: Blade architectures@ Message-ID: <65Nn8.52405$7b.5366589@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  H In toting up the many and varied problems Itanic faces in overcoming itsA competition I've tacitly made some assumptions about where system G architecture will go in the fairly immediate future.  So let's expose a 8 major one ("blade servers are dumb") to critical review.  @ Alpha EV7, Hammer, and POWER4, in their decision to optimize SMPI configurations by bringing routing on-chip and eliminating external glue, H all seem to have made a bet that blade servers (which would I suspect beD hard-pressed to extend such interfaces across a backplane - e.g., myL impression is that Infiniband, though possibly usable, would have far higherJ latency) would be a passing fad, and I agree.  Blade servers seem somewhatI akin to Itanic (which placed its faith in the development of sufficiently I intelligent compilers that did not - and to a significant degree still do K not - exist) in their assumption that if you build a platform that may seem I superficially attractive (I still suspect that a design where entry-level E users have to pay fixed expansion costs up front won't turn out to be I optimally cost-effective) the OS and application communities will develop  software to make use of it.   G Because AFAICT there really aren't any existing OSs, and relatively few J existing applications, that are well-suited to a blade architecture.  HPTCG Linux networks of workstations and the Google server farm might be if a L single blade (at the last price I saw for one, and even ignoring the cost ofC the backplane) didn't cost considerably more than an entire low-end B workstation, but HPTC and Internet search engines, while extremelyK interesting in their own right, do not a major market segment make, even if H blade prices decrease dramatically enough to make them attractive there.  L Furthermore, blades seem to be the wrong choice for modular decomposition ofJ a system.  Coupling one's unit of storage (the disk on the blade) to one'sJ unit of processing/memory just doesn't make sense:  not only do the ratiosK vary dramatically from one use to another (i.e., they'd like to be scalable I separately), but there's just no benefit to placing the storage alongside K the processing given the intrinsic latencies involved in accessing rotating D media.  Couple in the desire to centralize storage management, allowE (possibly shared) access from multiple (possibly heterogeneous, often A distributed) platforms, and support synchronous on-line, off-site E replication, and even blade servers that support specialized 'storage J blades' and 'processing blades' don't look as attractive as having storageK servers separate from processing servers (or, for small systems, single-boxI1 servers with externally-pluggable storage slots).   I Blade advocates may counter by saying that such specialized servers wouldtE themselves be best implemented as bladed servers, but that brings thehH question back to the original one:  blades as currently defined seem tooL fine-grained to be cost-effective in addressing either increasing processingL needs (e.g., will even a depopulated but expandible blade server really costI any less than an 8- or even 4-processor SMP-optimal board with processing J capability approaching that of a fully-populated blade box?) or increasingK storage needs (where a single fast processor with post-PCI interconnect can I easily handle 8 - 12 disks, each of which - including a hot-plug external D disk bay - costs a small fraction of the cost of a 'storage blade').  E Most applications that require significant processing capacity (e.g.,lC databases) seem consistently to have found SMP a better solution tolI expansion up to at least 4 - 8 processors than some kind of 'clustering':a@ tight coupling is usually a performance win until it runs out ofF scalability.  If it's even feasible to place that many processors on aJ single conventional blade (yeah, someday they may all be on a single chip,J but it'll be quite a while before that's feasible, especially with Itanic)I and handle the heat generated, such a blade will have dramatically higher K edge-of-the-blade interconnect requirements than the low-common-denominatoreJ blades that the backplane likely must be designed for to be cost-effective in the low end.V  L So blades as I currently understand their definition don't look particularlyI attractive to me compared with alternatives, even if Itanic were remotelynK feasible for use in them (after enough future process-shrinks that its heat H becomes dissipatable in a densely-populated environment).  But the bladeL vision isn't one I'm intimately familiar with, so if I'm missing significant, aspects I'd welcome getting better educated.   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 14:40:18 -08004 From: gherbert@gw.retro.com (George William Herbert)  Subject: Re: Blade architectures' Message-ID: <a7o90i$9q0$1@gw.retro.com>e  ) Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:n= >[...] So let's expose a major one ("blade servers are dumb")h >to critical review.  A I am going to cut out the Itanium discussion context and focus on  the premise above.   > [...] H >Because AFAICT there really aren't any existing OSs, and relatively fewK >existing applications, that are well-suited to a blade architecture.  HPTC H >Linux networks of workstations and the Google server farm might be if aM >single blade (at the last price I saw for one, and even ignoring the cost offD >the backplane) didn't cost considerably more than an entire low-endC >workstation, but HPTC and Internet search engines, while extremelyhL >interesting in their own right, do not a major market segment make, even ifI >blade prices decrease dramatically enough to make them attractive there.   A How many hosting facility server rooms have you been in recently?t  C There are many such which are largely full of 3 and 4u rackmount PCQA systems, running load-balanced web stuff.  Each of those racks istE expensive... hundreds of dollars a month or more.  And often, you pay I big bucks for a chunk of the space, build a cage, and then *can't expand* K because there's no space left in the facility, much less right next to you.rE That's why 1U systems have gotten so popular.. you start yanking your-G old systems out and replacing them 3 or 4 to 1 with new small 1U boxes.0  E The tradeoff there is saving space and machine room costs in exchangeTE for slightly higher system costs with blade systems.  But blade costs0D should come down as volume ramps up, so even that won't be that much4 of a disadvantage over an extended period of time.    M >Furthermore, blades seem to be the wrong choice for modular decomposition ofeK >a system.  Coupling one's unit of storage (the disk on the blade) to one'snK >unit of processing/memory just doesn't make sense:  not only do the ratiosoL >vary dramatically from one use to another (i.e., they'd like to be scalableJ >separately), but there's just no benefit to placing the storage alongsideL >the processing given the intrinsic latencies involved in accessing rotatingE >media.  Couple in the desire to centralize storage management, allow"F >(possibly shared) access from multiple (possibly heterogeneous, oftenB >distributed) platforms, and support synchronous on-line, off-siteF >replication, and even blade servers that support specialized 'storageK >blades' and 'processing blades' don't look as attractive as having storagerL >servers separate from processing servers (or, for small systems, single-box2 >servers with externally-pluggable storage slots).  G You're making the "all clusters are alike" mistake here.  Blade servers=G are not the right solution for problems which don't decompose well intoeE large-pile-of-small-systems clusters.  They are potentially the rightFE solution for evolving what people are now using in buying loads of 1U C rackmount systems.  Given the sales volume of 1U rackmount systems,A$ blades are a logical thing to build.  F That doesn't suggest that every component in such clusters is going toI be a blade, any more than every component in existing clusters of systemsSF like that are 1U rackmount boxes.  Larger SMP DB systems, network fileD servers (dedicated like NetApp, or GP such as generic NFS server useG of workgroup servers), etc are all important components of many or mostCG such clusters.  But if 2/3 of your rackspace is 1U servers now, or even"H worse 2U, 3U, or 4U servers, then you can save a lot of space, and cost,D going to blades.  And while that may only describe a fraction of theB total system / cluster space, it's a huge and viable total market.     -george william herberto gherbert@retro.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:40:54 -0500u- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>o  Subject: Re: Blade architectures, Message-ID: <3C9FB56B.E60D8465@videotron.ca>   Bill Todd wrote:N > So blades as I currently understand their definition don't look particularlyK > attractive to me compared with alternatives, even if Itanic were remotelyL  G I was under the impression that Compaq's version of Blades was simply a6L packaging/cabinet product that allowed many wintel pizza boxes to be screwedK into the same cabinet with an ethernet in the back. The advantage being theFN reduced floor space and more professional look. (making wintel boxes look like
 a PDP-11).   Is this a correct perception ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:50:23 GMT , From: adi@pirx.hexapodia.org (Andy Isaacson)  Subject: Re: Blade architectures. Message-ID: <3JOn8.37$vm6.34895@ruti.visi.com>  @ In article <65Nn8.52405$7b.5366589@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>,) Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:nM >Furthermore, blades seem to be the wrong choice for modular decomposition ofeK >a system.  Coupling one's unit of storage (the disk on the blade) to one'sDK >unit of processing/memory just doesn't make sense:  not only do the ratiosSL >vary dramatically from one use to another (i.e., they'd like to be scalableJ >separately), but there's just no benefit to placing the storage alongsideL >the processing given the intrinsic latencies involved in accessing rotating >media.   C Making this even worse, the current BL10e product from Compaq has a E 4200 RPM 2.5" hard drive.  Fitting a standard 3.5" drive into a blade  makes this even harder.I   -andy    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:56:33 GMT=* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>  Subject: Re: Blade architecturesC Message-ID: <ROOn8.254421$uv5.22319930@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>=  A "George William Herbert" <gherbert@gw.retro.com> wrote in message ! news:a7o90i$9q0$1@gw.retro.com...a+ > Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:R   ...s  J > >Because AFAICT there really aren't any existing OSs, and relatively fewG > >existing applications, that are well-suited to a blade architecture.3 HPTCJ > >Linux networks of workstations and the Google server farm might be if aL > >single blade (at the last price I saw for one, and even ignoring the cost ofF > >the backplane) didn't cost considerably more than an entire low-endE > >workstation, but HPTC and Internet search engines, while extremely0K > >interesting in their own right, do not a major market segment make, even  ifK > >blade prices decrease dramatically enough to make them attractive there.s >fC > How many hosting facility server rooms have you been in recently?o >hE > There are many such which are largely full of 3 and 4u rackmount PCaC > systems, running load-balanced web stuff.  Each of those racks is>G > expensive... hundreds of dollars a month or more.  And often, you pay K > big bucks for a chunk of the space, build a cage, and then *can't expand* H > because there's no space left in the facility, much less right next to you.G > That's why 1U systems have gotten so popular.. you start yanking yourbI > old systems out and replacing them 3 or 4 to 1 with new small 1U boxes.m >fG > The tradeoff there is saving space and machine room costs in exchange>G > for slightly higher system costs with blade systems.  But blade costs F > should come down as volume ramps up, so even that won't be that much4 > of a disadvantage over an extended period of time.  J You seem to be saying that Web server farms are prime candidates (and realH volume-generators) for blade servers, and that may be true (though bearsJ some analysis - below).  I confess that my initial reaction and subsequentL argument was due in large part to the suggestion by some of those supportingK Compaq's decision to kill Alpha that the next coming thing for *higher-end*e  servers after Marvel was blades.  L When it comes to Web server farms, it's debatable how much blades buy you inI terms of density.  Current 2U boxes support 9 hot-plug 3.5" drives (i.e., I 4.5 drives/U) plus attendant motherboard, power supply, etc., whereas theyD densest blade configurations I've heard of support 24 blades in a 3UI configuration (at most 8 drives/U if you can use, say, 3 CPU/drive bladest: plus 21 drive-only blades):  noticeable, but not dramatic.  K And when it comes to cost, you can buy such 9-drive 2U boxes, complete withoE innards (e.g., Gigabit Ethernet) and (e.g.) 100+ GB IDE drives, at an J *overall* cost of about $3.30/GB (around $3000, last I checked; a bit moreL if you want to use, say, a dual-Athlon motherboard):  is there any reason toH suspect that you'll be able to buy a fully-populated 24-blade server forC much under $24K (which translates to about $10/GB in this example)?e  G A standard rack takes up around 5 square feet of floor space.  Two suchRK racks can hold 42 2U servers at $3K apiece ($126K total); one such rack can8L hold 14 blade server boxes with slightly less total disk capacity at a totalJ cost of over $300K.  Is the 5 square feet of floor space you save by usingH blades really worth $200+K, even in Tokyo?  Is it even worth $60K if the2 blade server cost were decreased by a factor of 2?  H (And as Andy Isaacson has just pointed out, if blades are constrained toI using 2.5" drives rather than 3.5" drives, the above comparison may favortJ them too much as stated:  2.5" drives are more expensive - both absolutely and per MB - and often slower.)t   >eL > >Furthermore, blades seem to be the wrong choice for modular decomposition ofG > >a system.  Coupling one's unit of storage (the disk on the blade) tof one'spF > >unit of processing/memory just doesn't make sense:  not only do the ratiosE > >vary dramatically from one use to another (i.e., they'd like to bet scalableL > >separately), but there's just no benefit to placing the storage alongsideE > >the processing given the intrinsic latencies involved in accessingl rotatingG > >media.  Couple in the desire to centralize storage management, allowaH > >(possibly shared) access from multiple (possibly heterogeneous, oftenD > >distributed) platforms, and support synchronous on-line, off-siteH > >replication, and even blade servers that support specialized 'storageE > >blades' and 'processing blades' don't look as attractive as havinga storagecC > >servers separate from processing servers (or, for small systems,n
 single-box4 > >servers with externally-pluggable storage slots). >vI > You're making the "all clusters are alike" mistake here.  Blade serversdI > are not the right solution for problems which don't decompose well intoc' > large-pile-of-small-systems clusters.e  I As I said initially above, part of my reaction was to the suggestion thatn? they constituted the next step 'forward' after the Alpha MarveliC architecture, which is emphatically aimed at problems that do *not*rL decompose well into large-pile-of-small-systems clusters.  For problems thatH *do* decompose well that way, the question then becomes whether they areC compute-intensive (where significantly denser CPU elements may be amK noticeable win) or storage-intensive (where existing boxes are pretty denses already, and *much* cheaper).       They are potentially the rightG > solution for evolving what people are now using in buying loads of 1U E > rackmount systems.  Given the sales volume of 1U rackmount systems,-& > blades are a logical thing to build.  = Only if they offer significantly higher density at at least aeL somewhat-comparable price.  For compute-intensive activities they might; forH storage-intensive activities (which I suspect Web servers qualify as, as, well as Google) it's not clear that they do.   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 17:19:40 -08004 From: gherbert@gw.retro.com (George William Herbert)  Subject: Re: Blade architectures' Message-ID: <a7oibc$gql$1@gw.retro.com>,  ) Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:t8 >"George William Herbert" <gherbert@gw.retro.com> wrote:, >> Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote: >r >... >cK >> >Because AFAICT there really aren't any existing OSs, and relatively fewnH >> >existing applications, that are well-suited to a blade architecture. >HPTCaK >> >Linux networks of workstations and the Google server farm might be if aoM >> >single blade (at the last price I saw for one, and even ignoring the costl >ofnG >> >the backplane) didn't cost considerably more than an entire low-end F >> >workstation, but HPTC and Internet search engines, while extremelyL >> >interesting in their own right, do not a major market segment make, even >ifsL >> >blade prices decrease dramatically enough to make them attractive there. >>D >> How many hosting facility server rooms have you been in recently? >>F >> There are many such which are largely full of 3 and 4u rackmount PCD >> systems, running load-balanced web stuff.  Each of those racks isH >> expensive... hundreds of dollars a month or more.  And often, you payL >> big bucks for a chunk of the space, build a cage, and then *can't expand*I >> because there's no space left in the facility, much less right next tot >you.eH >> That's why 1U systems have gotten so popular.. you start yanking yourJ >> old systems out and replacing them 3 or 4 to 1 with new small 1U boxes. >>H >> The tradeoff there is saving space and machine room costs in exchangeH >> for slightly higher system costs with blade systems.  But blade costsG >> should come down as volume ramps up, so even that won't be that muchb5 >> of a disadvantage over an extended period of time.m > K >You seem to be saying that Web server farms are prime candidates (and realeI >volume-generators) for blade servers, and that may be true (though bears K >some analysis - below).  I confess that my initial reaction and subsequentiM >argument was due in large part to the suggestion by some of those supportingaL >Compaq's decision to kill Alpha that the next coming thing for *higher-end*! >servers after Marvel was blades.r  F IMHO, the whole Compaq/Alpha discussion is really orthogonal to bladesE per se, and looking at it through those blinders is likely to confusel! you as to what's really going on.a  M >When it comes to Web server farms, it's debatable how much blades buy you innJ >terms of density.  Current 2U boxes support 9 hot-plug 3.5" drives (i.e.,J >4.5 drives/U) plus attendant motherboard, power supply, etc., whereas theE >densest blade configurations I've heard of support 24 blades in a 3UcJ >configuration (at most 8 drives/U if you can use, say, 3 CPU/drive blades; >plus 21 drive-only blades):  noticeable, but not dramatic.g  E You're assuming here (and later explicitly ask) that Web server farms E are disk-intensive.  I would challenge that assumption.  The websitesoD I have been associated with typically broke down into a small staticB content site (would fit, along with OS and webserver S/W and logs,A into a few gig at most), a small dynamic content site (would fit, C along with OS and app server S/W and logs, into a few gig at most),f) and a very, very large back end database.p  B As you yourself said earlier, small slice systems of any sort makeF poor database systems, so there's not much point in trying to shoehornC the database into a small-U server if you can't get enough CPUs andi memory as well as disks in.f   >[...] >n> >A standard rack takes up around 5 square feet of floor space.  < 5??  Try 8 or more, unless you're 3" thick to be able to get; between racks to work on cables and such.  The rack spacingw< needs to be enough to get behind and in front of systems for> maintenance, plus needs to be enough to get the systems in and< out of the racks.  And hosting facilities charge you for the: empty space floorspace as well as the physical rack space.  
 > Two suchL >racks can hold 42 2U servers at $3K apiece ($126K total); one such rack canM >hold 14 blade server boxes with slightly less total disk capacity at a totala >cost of over $300K.  = Or you can stop trying to stuff hard drives into your clusterc@ work engines to handle your main storage, which is a mismatch in the first place 8-)B   > [...]e >i" >>  They are potentially the rightH >> solution for evolving what people are now using in buying loads of 1UF >> rackmount systems.  Given the sales volume of 1U rackmount systems,' >> blades are a logical thing to build.r >o> >Only if they offer significantly higher density at at least aM >somewhat-comparable price.  For compute-intensive activities they might; foroI >storage-intensive activities (which I suspect Web servers qualify as, asr- >well as Google) it's not clear that they do.n  I I don't know of any storage-intensive websites which don't centralize theeI mass storage into a proper DB machine.  They are all essentially compute- J intensive front end clusters (often two coupled clusters, one doing staticI content and one doing dynamic content; sometimes three or more, includinglD additional clusters for search, image service, and other specializedB functions as required) with a back end classical large system hot  standby cluster database.d  G You were mentioning hundred gig IDE drives earlier.  Those are an order,A of magnitude larger than what's required on the front end clustereC member systems, for the websites I've built and the ones I've seen.i> Much less putting five or ten of those drives in a single box.B Website contents just aren't that big, and in the areas where theyC are (user / subscriber info, product catalogs with 100K-1M entries)vB they need to be managed by a proper DB, not by static files out in3 system local drives, just from management purposes.n  C Google's got a two level architecture, as I understand it (and I ameF not particularly up on it); a distributed search tree with the indexes@ basically all in RAM, and then backing storage with the detailed8 per-reference information and archives of the web pages.  H The front end... the distributed indexes, in RAM, doesn't need much moreF disk than the OSes need.  The back end needs primarily fast manageable$ I/O but not necessarily distributed.     -george william herbert  gherbert@retro.com   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 21:59:47 -05005 From: Christopher Brian Colohan <colohan+@cs.cmu.edu>s  Subject: Re: Blade architectures1 Message-ID: <uclzo0w2fvg.fsf@gs138.sp.cs.cmu.edu>e  6 gherbert@gw.retro.com (George William Herbert) writes:C > How many hosting facility server rooms have you been in recently?u  B In the thread that starts here, there is one point I have not seenE made: web hosting facilities often host web sites for many customers,dE not just one.  It is much easier to manage web sites if each customeroE gets their own machine(s), since this limits interactions between twos? customers on a single machine.  So I would imagine that a largerD selling point of "small, self contained, easy to stack" computers is< you can pack a large number of customers into a small space.  E From a hardware utilization standpoint having a computer per web sitesA is inefficient as hell.  But in this case it is more important tos have:o  8 a) Simple units of computation to sell to customers, and  B b) Isolation of web sites -- if one web site is heavily loaded, it1 should not adversely affect your other customers.s   Chrisr -- eK Chris Colohan  Email: chris@colohan.ca       PGP: finger colohan@cs.cmu.edu : 	       Web: www.cs.cmu.edu/~colohan  Phone: (412)268-4751   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 04:04:03 GMTn* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>  Subject: Re: Blade architecturesA Message-ID: <SqSn8.86726$2q2.7742180@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>a  B "Christopher Brian Colohan" <colohan+@cs.cmu.edu> wrote in message+ news:uclzo0w2fvg.fsf@gs138.sp.cs.cmu.edu...i8 > gherbert@gw.retro.com (George William Herbert) writes:E > > How many hosting facility server rooms have you been in recently?c >aD > In the thread that starts here, there is one point I have not seenG > made: web hosting facilities often host web sites for many customers,oG > not just one.  It is much easier to manage web sites if each customer G > gets their own machine(s), since this limits interactions between twomA > customers on a single machine.  So I would imagine that a large5F > selling point of "small, self contained, easy to stack" computers is> > you can pack a large number of customers into a small space. > G > From a hardware utilization standpoint having a computer per web sitedC > is inefficient as hell.  But in this case it is more important to, > have:I >i: > a) Simple units of computation to sell to customers, and >rD > b) Isolation of web sites -- if one web site is heavily loaded, it3 > should not adversely affect your other customers.a  L That's fine if a single blade can handle the demands of an entire Web site -K but I question whether that fits the profile of the typical bulk-hosted WebsJ site, or at least of a sufficient absolute number of bulk-hosted Web sitesL to justify the creation of the blade architecture.  Not to mention the issueF of the degree to which each blade is unaffected by the activity of theD others (backplane kinds of issues, though if the current blades haveJ independent access to the external network that's not a problem - but alsoI is a significant impediment to using them in more cooperative endeavors).e  J And if there's a significant ancillary back-end database required behind aJ Web site, then the potential for adverse interactions exists there as wellK (unless each database is run on a separate machine, which comes back to therK question of whether it can fit on a single blade disk).  Not to mention thehJ common desire for data redundancy for higher availability, which is betterK satisfied by multi-hosted back-end redundant storage than by replicating itdK on each individual blade (and the former is supported by existing software,IG via fail-over mechanisms, while the latter is comparatively unusual and:9 supported by few if any OSs that run on Intel platforms).j  J Yes, redundancy can be handled at the application level, and at least someJ Web applications do.  But it requires on-the-fly rebuild code (trivial forK read-only data, not so trivial for read/write data) in the application whenrE a component is replaced, rather than simple use of existing OS (e.g., L Windows or Unix clustering) facilities and fail-over mechanisms with storage1 back-ends that take care of their own redundancy.k  K Of course, common Intel platform OSs may not support the full-fledged quota J mechanisms that prevent individual applications from gobbling up more thanH their share of system resources, but when you're talking about large WebG server farms you're talking about environments that can easily consider H making use of higher-end consolidated server platforms that *do* supportL such facilities.  And from the sound of things, such platforms could be moreD than cost-competitive with blade approaches offering similar overallL performance (even Linux on z-Series seems to be so at the moment, and that's; likely far from the most cost-effective solution possible).   K So while I'll freely admit, as I did originally, that certain kinds of HPTC J environments may fit blade servers like a glove (at least if the per-bladeC price decreases to be competitive with a low-end PC box), I'm still G unconvinced of any major commercial utility (unless one considers theiryK ability to run Windows to be of some major importance, which I suppose somes people might).   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 16:52:57 -0500e+ From: "anup" <anupkumar.mittal@digital.com>  Subject: compiler issue..a8 Message-ID: <000801c1d447$727ce9c0$0ed82010@zko.dec.com>  , This is a multi-part message in MIME format.  + ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C1D41D.83D50380r Content-Type: text/plain;l 	charset="iso-8859-1"r+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printableb   Hi,oG I am not sure if this is the right place to log a problem I am seeing =  for my c++ compiler on openVms. * can you please redirect in case it is not.  D I was facing a few issues between the compiler version 6.2-035 and = 6.2-048vJ Compiling and linking my app on 6.2-048 gives me an executable lesser in = size (blocks)then 6.2-035=20F but when i run the app compiled and linked on 6.2-048 it gives me an =7 accvio (access violation with a crash dump) but when=20uH  compiles and linked on compiler version 6.2-035  everything works fine.  I Can anybody give me any pointers to where to look for this prob exactly =3 (e.g newsgroup)t.  or any ideas to be tried will be most welcome   Thanks,. Anup  + ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C1D41D.83D50380v Content-Type: text/html; 	charset="iso-8859-1"t+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printablea  > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD>7 <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =t charset=3Diso-8859-1">8 <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2712.300" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE>u </HEAD>  <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>1 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hi,</FONT></DIV> E <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I am not sure if this is the right =U place to log a=20e@ problem I am seeing for my c++ compiler on openVms.</FONT></DIV>I <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>can you please redirect in case it is=20h not.</FONT></DIV>f4 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>H <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I was facing a few issues between the = compiler=20 ( version 6.2-035 and 6.2-048</FONT></DIV>J <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Compiling and linking my app on 6.2-048 = gives me an=20< executable lesser in size (blocks)then 6.2-035 </FONT></DIV>F <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>but when i run the app compiled and = linked on=20H 6.2-048 it gives me an accvio (access violation with a crash dump) but = when=20 
 </FONT></DIV>pH <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;compiles and linked on compiler =
 version=201 6.2-035&nbsp; everything works fine.</FONT></DIV>a4 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>F <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Can anybody give me any pointers to = where to look=202 for this prob exactly (e.g newsgroup)</FONT></DIV>I <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;or any ideas to be tried will be =e most=20o welcome</FONT></DIV>4 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>5 <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></DIV>l@ <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Anup</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>  - ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C1D41D.83D50380--    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:38:01 GMTh2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: compiler issue..s3 Message-ID: <dFNn8.1473$fL6.29139@news.cpqcorp.net>s  f In article <000801c1d447$727ce9c0$0ed82010@zko.dec.com>, "anup" <anupkumar.mittal@digital.com> writes:  C   I have passed (internal) support pointers to AnupKumar via email.g  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:14:58 GMTh2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)& Subject: Re: creating a mailbox in DCL3 Message-ID: <CjNn8.1472$fL6.29300@news.cpqcorp.net>t  O In article <3c9f33e5$1@news.post.ch>, "Jakob Erber" <nospam@nospam.com> writes:u  + :is there a way to create a Mailbox in DCL?b  H   Not directly, but tools that permit this are readily available on the    Freeware and elsewhere.e  K :So far, we found a possibility in snatching the termination mailbox of thetA :spawned subprocess. But isn't there a more straight forward way?i  I   The correct answer depends highly on what you wish to do, something notvF   necessarily entirely clear from the particular solution you propose.K   Please back up, and please tell us the OpenVMS version and platform, and mJ   please provide us with the details and the background on the particular J   problem you seek to solve.  There may well be an approach here that you I   have not considered -- but I am not yet able to provide alternatives...:    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:00:02 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>r& Subject: Re: creating a mailbox in DCL& Message-ID: <3C9FD85D.C9324D9@fsi.net>   Jakob Erber wrote: >  > Hi there DCL Gurus,m > , > is there a way to create a Mailbox in DCL?L > So far, we found a possibility in snatching the termination mailbox of theB > spawned subprocess. But isn't there a more straight forward way?   Take a look at:h  - http://www.djesys.com/freeware/vms/crembx.zip   F This contains a VAX (DEC) BASIC program to create a permanent mailbox,H and a matching perversion of a CREATE.CLD (V5.5-2) for an example of how2 to add a /MAILBOX qualifier to the CREATE command.  F See http://www.djesys.com/vms/freevms/mentor/dcl_cmd.html to view this information on-line.  B I had an old CompuServe VAX Forum submission called VMSPIPE.TLB (ID think). I just got done burning a bunch of my old diskettes to CD-R.A I'll see if I can find that and put it up in my freeware area. Ita@ includes a "CREMBX" program and DELMBX program in both BASIC andF Macro32, as well as edited .CLDs for CREATE and DELETE to add /MAILBOX functionality.   -- t David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systemso http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------   Date: 25 Mar 2002 18:56:16 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)o8 Subject: Re: DEC C: why does exit(0) really exit with 1?+ Message-ID: <a7nrsg$nqj$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>m  5 In article <20020325181659.1792.qmail@gacracker.org>,t@  Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:E |> On 25 Mar 2002, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote:g |> t	 |> <snip>eF |> >I would posit that the statement made in K&R on page 154 of "The C. |> >Programming  Language" suggests otherwise. |> > e@ |> >        "By convention, a return value of 0 signals that allA |> >         is well, and various non-zero values signal abnormal, |> >         situations."d |> oI |> I wondered how long until someone would reference Brian and Dennis :-)' |> a  = What more authoritative source is there for the  C Language??s   bill   -- sJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   e   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 20:32:07 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>n8 Subject: Re: DEC C: why does exit(0) really exit with 1?5 Message-ID: <20020325203207.4973.qmail@gacracker.org>   B On 25 Mar 2002, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote:6 >In article <20020325181659.1792.qmail@gacracker.org>,A > Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:gF >|> On 25 Mar 2002, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: >|> 
 >|> <snip>G >|> >I would posit that the statement made in K&R on page 154 of "The Cs/ >|> >Programming  Language" suggests otherwise.  >|> > A >|> >        "By convention, a return value of 0 signals that allnB >|> >         is well, and various non-zero values signal abnormal >|> >         situations." a >|> J >|> I wondered how long until someone would reference Brian and Dennis :-) >|>  >l> >What more authoritative source is there for the  C Language??  G Er, none that I know of. I considered looking it up myself, but haven'tiH really programmed in C for over 10 years so didn't want to get myself in trouble.  I To be honest, I can't quite see what all the fuss here is about. Any .EXEiG should be considered a black box that returns values appropriate to theaE operating system it is running on. If that means that exit(0) in C isiI translated into SS$_NORMAL for DCL to interpret then so be it. C compliesaI with its language standard by taking 0 as a successful completion status,vE and the .EXE complies with VMS standards by returning the appropriater status code.     Doc. -- n6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                              http://vmsbox.cjb.netn   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:55:52 -0000l/ From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net>o8 Subject: Re: DEC C: why does exit(0) really exit with 1?/ Message-ID: <u9vl98541hv4c7@corp.supernews.com>a  > Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:K : To be honest, I can't quite see what all the fuss here is about. Any .EXE;  @ The fuss is a programmer types "exit(x);" and DCL sees x, unless, x was 0, then exit silently passes 1 to DCL.  C This is the kind of malarky I[ve come to expect from companies likel Microsoft/Windows, not Deq/VMS.i   -- u -- Mike Zarlenga  >    "Now, throughout history, whenever people get wood, they'll'     think of Trojans!"  - Ned Flanders.r   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:11:44 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)( Subject: Re: DECterm X client, ACCPORNAM3 Message-ID: <ANQn8.1480$fL6.29421@news.cpqcorp.net>f  p In article <a7fso4$2uv$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>, "Malcolm MacArthur" <malcolmix@neverness.freeserve.co.uk> writes:N :OK, as you rightly point out, a DECterm is connected 'back-to-front' comparedM :to a normal terminal device. But, just because the connection was initiated uK :the other way around doesn't make the location it's displayed AT any less a :useful... e  J   I've learned that ambiguity can be, well, a problem -- again, ACCPORNAM I   is usually the storage for the incoming network connection, so (unless hJ   the DECterm is operating detached, of course) it really isn't available M   for this use.   You want the outgoing or the X Windows display connection, -I   and you specifically want this value from within the DECterm X Windows pK   client application -- and you want this value available to auditing, too.e  K :Umm, yeah, right. So how does an ordinary unprivileged user know that, forgI :instance, FTA23: is using DECwindows pseudodevice WSA3: for its display?o  B   The user's application display is FTA23:, of course.  Not WSA3:.F   If the user has a prefered display, the application accesses it via    SET DISPLAY callbacks.  J   Assuming you cannot use CREATE/TERMINAL/DEFINE or the equivilent DECtermH   API call (and a cooperating user), traversing back to the workstation L   device specification used by the X Windows client (DECterm and the DECtermJ   controller, in this case) does definitely look to be "interesting".  YouK   are correct.  Retrieving this is an interesting idea, but the only way I nI   can see out of this -- and to return this information to the DECwindows I   client application -- involves rummaging around inside the DECterm and tK   particularly inside the DECterm controller code, or (for the more generic 0   approach) inside xlib and the X Windows layer.  G   An alternative that is possible involves the use of an SDA extension.gH   (This still means rummaging through the kernel, of course.  This wouldH   simply be a somewhat "cleaner" approach to that end...)  And one otherH   approach involves rummaging around inside the X Windows code; a searchF   for information that might be available within the xlib and related.H   (I've checked decw$utils: and do not see anything immediately useful.)     N :There is another point in all this as well. Say someone tries to hack into myL :system, and he is using X Windows. Now, he logs on, does a CREATE /TERMINAL> :/DETACHED /NOLOGGED_IN, and logs in as (for instance) SYSTEM.J :days later, I notice something unusual happened. So I go through my auditJ :records and discover that SYSTEM logged on to terminal FTA23:. Now, from L :this historical perspective, how do I find out where pseudoterminal FTA23:  :was initiated from?  I   Ok, this is definitely an "uncooperative" user.  Pseudoterminal FTA23: oE   was originally created on the node that got hacked, of course, so IaH   expect you really want to know where the X Windows display for FTA23: 6   is going and, well, that (again) gets "interesting".  I :So, as a compromise, I would settle for a method of auditing creation ofI= :pseudoterminals and DECwindows WSAnn: display pseudodevices.d  L   If network connection auditing, device creation, or process or subprocess L   creation auditing is insufficient, you will want to make a formal request I   for this auditing capability -- given the cracker had enough access to tH   create a DECterm, there are also other file, audit, and login-related 2   security considerations obviously involved here.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:45:23 +1100g8 From: "Jaime H. Barroco" <jbarroco@broadway.bigpond.com> Subject: ERRLOG.SYSn9 Message-ID: <XXSn8.22673$uR5.48134@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>   	 Hi there,    I have a question.1 It is possible to create another ERRLOG.SYS file?eH If I can create another ERRLOG.SYS file, which processes should I stop ( ERRFMT, OPCOM,....).. When the file ERRLOG.SYS will be create again.   Thanks in advance for your helpt  
 Jaime Barrocor   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:29:22 +0400i4 From: Valentin Likoum <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru> Subject: Re: ERRLOG.SYSn4 Message-ID: <1675010766.20020326092922@ncc.volga.ru>  E On 26.03.2002 Jaime H. Barroco <jbarroco@broadway.bigpond.com> wrote:e   > Hi there,    > I have a question.3 > It is possible to create another ERRLOG.SYS file?fJ > If I can create another ERRLOG.SYS file, which processes should I stop ( > ERRFMT, OPCOM,....).0 > When the file ERRLOG.SYS will be create again.  ?   Just rename it. New ERRLOG.SYS will be created automatically.    -- o   Valentin Likoumt   valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:02:10 -0500e' From: Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net>u Subject: Re: ERRLOG.SYSl< Message-ID: <howard-CAC999.01021026032002@enews.newsguy.com>  9 In article <XXSn8.22673$uR5.48134@newsfeeds.bigpond.com>,u:  "Jaime H. Barroco" <jbarroco@broadway.bigpond.com> wrote:   > I have a question.3 > It is possible to create another ERRLOG.SYS file? J > If I can create another ERRLOG.SYS file, which processes should I stop ( > ERRFMT, OPCOM,....).0 > When the file ERRLOG.SYS will be create again.  H Just rename it and the ERRLOG process will create a new one.  You don't  need to kill any processes.s   --   Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"' Aren't there any networked SJFs around?v   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 15:51:25 -0800/ From: Adrian.Lumsden@sss.co.nz (Adrian Lumsden)m! Subject: Excursion (DECterm) API? = Message-ID: <e050a30a.0203251551.17b10741@posting.google.com>p  E I have a DECterm window running on my NT Workstation 4.0 system which-, is connected to an Alpha running OpenVMS 7.1  B I would like to be able to pipe characters into the DECterm windowD from another application running under NT to simulate a command line being typed to VMS.t  8 Is there an Excursion API that will allow me to do this?  D Alternatively can anyone recommend a general purpose Windows utility. that I could use to do the same sort of thing?  
 best regards,r   Adrian Lumsden   Scientific Software and Systemse
 Wellington New Zealande   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:57:21 GMTg2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)% Subject: Re: Excursion (DECterm) API?y3 Message-ID: <RHPn8.1478$fL6.29429@news.cpqcorp.net>i  o In article <e050a30a.0203251551.17b10741@posting.google.com>, Adrian.Lumsden@sss.co.nz (Adrian Lumsden) writes:vC :I would like to be able to pipe characters into the DECterm windowpE :from another application running under NT to simulate a command line  :being typed to VMS.  @   You could roll your own, using pseudo terminals on OpenVMS and@   a network connection and protocol of your choosing between the   platforms.  E :Alternatively can anyone recommend a general purpose Windows utilityr/ :that I could use to do the same sort of thing?T  @   rcp, direct connection into the telnet port, etc., might help.  D   What are you trying to do when feeding the data into the X Windows'   client application; into the DECterm?.  G   This really isn't specifically an OpenVMS question (since the desired>H   task involves stuffing characters into the X Windows data originating I   from the X Windows server running on the Windows NT box), rather it is bH   specific to the X Windows environment running on the platform running :   the X Windows server.  The Windows NT box, in this case.  G   If you want to poke around inside the X Windows transport, xliddy and>I   such might be useful -- I know there is an xliddy port for OpenVMS, and G   there are probably newer and better tools than xliddy available, too.D    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 03:46:36 GMT / From: "James Wilkinson" <elementyl@hotmail.com>/% Subject: Re: Excursion (DECterm) API?iC Message-ID: <waSn8.58228$Zv7.1123950708@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>o  2 "Adrian Lumsden" <Adrian.Lumsden@sss.co.nz> wrote:D > I would like to be able to pipe characters into the DECterm windowF > from another application running under NT to simulate a command line > being typed to VMS.f > [...]a> > Alternatively can anyone recommend a general purpose Windows8 > utility that I could use to do the same sort of thing?  J Since you are working with source code under windows you should be able toH take care of all this on the Windows side.  Approximately, write code toK locate the window, set it active, then simulate keyboard input.  As long as 6 the window can be activated this should do it for you.   James    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:42:34 -0500m* From: Chuck Chopp <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com>C Subject: Re: External authentication + trapping password changes...-+ Message-ID: <3C9F7DAA.3FB0D7DE@rtfmcsi.com>-   Rick Barry wrote:   9 > "Chuck Chopp" <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com> wrote in messagem' > news:3C9F2DD1.245DF457@rtfmcsi.com...- > >p > [snip] > >iN > > Ever since the ability to authenticate to an NT domain while logging in toN > > OpenVMS was introduced people have been asking for the SDK to allow customM > > external authentication providers to be developed.  Many times mention ofuK > > OpenVMS v7.3 has been made in connection to this SDK becoming availablec > fornG > > use by ISVs.  However, after going through the master index for them	 > OpenVMSsN > > v7.3 docs it is clear that if this SDK exists then it is not documented in > > the online docs. >iN > OpenVMS 7.3-1 field test contains the SYS$ACM system service. SYS$ACM is theL > programming interface for user authentication, both VMS authentication and > external authentication. >dC > See the New Features documentation for details, but to summarize:  >eF >     - $ACM supports authentication and password change functions and >        persona acquisition.nE >     - Authentication policies are provided by "plug-in" ACME agentsi > (currently, >        limited to VMS and NT ACME agents). > K > The VMS and NT ACME agent limitation is not intended to be permanent. OuraI > goal is to document the plug-in interface so users or third-parties can N > develop their own agents. By phasing in functionality, we've given ourselvesM > a shake-out period as $ACM is adopted to accommodate changes to the plug-in L > interface. We'd like to avoid having people write a new plug-in agent onlyN > to have to change it in the next release. However, you can get a copy of theL > current plug-in interface description under a non-disclosure agreement, if > you'd like (see below).y >o > >fE > > Who would I need to speak to at Compaq to get a definitive answer. > regardinge7 > > the availability of an External Authentication SDK?  > >t >eK > Contact Leo Demers (leo.demers@compaq.com) for more information regardinghK > the plans and schedules or to request information (under NDA) on the ACMEo > provider interface.? >  > Rick Barry > OpenVMS System Software Groupa > Compaq Computer Corporationa > Nashua, NH   Rick,r  N Many thanks to for the information that you have provided....  It is much more2 along the lines of what I have been searching for.     Regards,   Chuckm -- Chuck Chopp/  8 ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com            http://www.rtfmcsi.com0                                   ICQ # 22321532@ RTFM Consulting Services Inc.     864 801 2795 voice & voicemail2 103 Autumn Hill Road              864 801 2774 fax4 Greer, SC  29651                  800 774 0718 pager7                                   8007740718@skytel.comi   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 11:03:24 -0800 0 From: Mark Berryman <Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com>: Subject: Flash plugin now available for Mozilla on OpenVMS, Message-ID: <3C9F03FC.167C45DD@Mvb.Saic.Com>  E I have ported Olivier Debon's open source flash player to VMS.  While0E this player does not do all things Flash, it certainly does more thanjB VMS currently has.  It currently does most of Flash 4 but does not- support the actionscript features of Flash 5.0  H I am currently trying to add support for sound and, once that is done, IF will put the full source kit up.  Until then, anyone who would like to! try the plugin can fetch it from:t  * ftp://mvb.saic.com/extra/libflashplugin.so  F Just copy the LIBFLASHPLUGIN.SO file into SYS$COMMON:[MOZILLA.PLUGINS]H (or into the [.PLUGINS] directory of wherever you installed Mozilla) and restart your browser.    Feedback welcome.u  
 Mark Berryman  Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com  G P.S.  As I mentioned earlier, there will be some flash sites that don'teG       work with this plugin, but if you find any that actually cause ito/       to generate an error, please let me know.n   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:09:17 GMTc1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>d> Subject: Re: Flash plugin now available for Mozilla on OpenVMS' Message-ID: <3C9FDA8B.F6B55A21@fsi.net>    Mark Berryman wrote: > G > I have ported Olivier Debon's open source flash player to VMS.  WhilelG > this player does not do all things Flash, it certainly does more than D > VMS currently has.  It currently does most of Flash 4 but does not/ > support the actionscript features of Flash 5.  > J > I am currently trying to add support for sound and, once that is done, IH > will put the full source kit up.  Until then, anyone who would like to# > try the plugin can fetch it from:B > , > ftp://mvb.saic.com/extra/libflashplugin.so > H > Just copy the LIBFLASHPLUGIN.SO file into SYS$COMMON:[MOZILLA.PLUGINS]J > (or into the [.PLUGINS] directory of wherever you installed Mozilla) and > restart your browser.s >  > Feedback welcome.    Kudos for your efforts, Mark!u   -- a David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems" http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 03:41:54 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>a/ Subject: Followup Re: creating a mailbox in DCLs' Message-ID: <3C9FF03E.405984CA@fsi.net>    "David J. Dachtera" wrote: >  > Jakob Erber wrote: > >b > > Hi there DCL Gurus,  > >d. > > is there a way to create a Mailbox in DCL?N > > So far, we found a possibility in snatching the termination mailbox of theD > > spawned subprocess. But isn't there a more straight forward way? >  > Take a look at:g > / > http://www.djesys.com/freeware/vms/crembx.zipt > H > This contains a VAX (DEC) BASIC program to create a permanent mailbox,J > and a matching perversion of a CREATE.CLD (V5.5-2) for an example of how4 > to add a /MAILBOX qualifier to the CREATE command. > H > See http://www.djesys.com/vms/freevms/mentor/dcl_cmd.html to view this > information on-line. > D > I had an old CompuServe VAX Forum submission called VMSPIPE.TLB (IF > think). I just got done burning a bunch of my old diskettes to CD-R.C > I'll see if I can find that and put it up in my freeware area. It[B > includes a "CREMBX" program and DELMBX program in both BASIC andH > Macro32, as well as edited .CLDs for CREATE and DELETE to add /MAILBOX > functionality.  G You can now find this at http://www.djesys.com/freeware/vms/vmspipe.zipk  : There's full source and .OBJs for VAX, but not for Alpha.   F I never had to use this on Alpha, and haven't re-installed BASIC on myF home Alpha since I recovered from the system disk failure. It was usedD in it's day on a good size VAX, however, to allow for converting 8mm> "dd" tapes to ANSI-labelled magtapes for an IBM mainframe. The9 "pipeline" was COPY (from 8mm tape) -> Deblocker(MBX1) ->8E ASCII-to-EBCDIC(MBX2) -> CONVERT/FDL(MBX3) to 9-track. The "pipeline"lE allowed that the data didn't have to first be copied down to disk andeC massaged multiple times before being written out to 9-track. *MUCH*o faster that way!  B I'll try to make time to re-install BASIC and make Alpha .OBJs forD CREMBX and DELMBX to go with the .CLDs and .HLP segments. Obviously,/ development of this stopped at VMS V6.1, so ...   G Another of my VMS wish-list items would be to have this (CREATE/MAILBOXoH and DELETE/MAILBOX) developed by OVMS Engr. as part of the base product, if it's not already there.  E By the way, if anyone knows how to fix the compile-time errors in thet3 .MAR files, I'd be grateful for a pointer or two...c   -- n David J. Dachterai dba DJE SystemsX http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/h   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 03:47:48 +0100c2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender)) Subject: Re: Hacker Using My Mail Server?d; Message-ID: <3c9fe154.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>   " Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com) wrote:G > Thanks, Martin, I did become aware of this yesterday, and hope to getE* > updated records with Sprint by tomorrow.   and via Email:   > I think it is working now.  % Sorry, Tom, same error message still.a  F Anyway, regarding your question whether I had a working Emacs on 7.2+:  B No, sorry, I never felt the need - I'm using MicroEmacs on all theH platforms I work on (DOS, Windows, OS/2, *ix, VMS). It has been activelyE supported on VMS (at least until version 3.11), and even with version B 4.0, it's easily ported. And BTW, I just read it's Linus Torvald's favorite editor, too ;-)  H IMHO, Emacs is a long beyond the point of being portable to anything butH different Unices. It should probably be rewritten from scratch, but thisG time following ANSI or POSIX standards. I guess, however, that'll never  happen.l   cu,u   Martin -- dF                           | Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmer3  Cetero censeo            | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de F  Redmondem delendam esse. |   http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/:                           | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 03:43:06 +0100t2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) Subject: Re: How to fork() ?; Message-ID: <3c9fe03a.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>G  ( Colin Blake (colin@theblakes.com) wrote:H > Try using DECC$SET_CHILD_STANDARD_STREAMS()  to get the pipe fd's intoD > the child. Then you won't have to do all the dup'ing in the child.  F Thanks for pointing me to that function, it seems like the exact thing I need.   @ There's an entry for it in the reference section of my C 6.4 RTLC manual, but it is mentioned nowhere else (neither in the Subprocesso8 section nor in the exec() descriptions). Bad doc glitch.  G So now I have replaced LIB$SPAWN with the above, vfork(), and execvp(), D but it won't work <sigh>. Image Accounting tells me that LOGINOUT isB starting a SUBPROCESS, but there's no entry for the child program.    How does one debug such a beast?   cu,f   Martin -- tG                            | Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmert4 Microsoft isn't the Borg:  | work: mv@pdv-systeme.deK the Borg have proper       |       http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/ ; networking.                | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.den   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 06:57:24 +0100-- From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@free.fr>-0 Subject: How to know if EDS hires for VMS Eng. ?' Message-ID: <3CA00DC5.8A347193@free.fr>m   ../..c Working storage section. 	01 subject pic x(80). 	01 text    pic x(80). 	01 answer  pic x value "Y","N"o Procedure division.e Main.  	move subject to textc
 	display text- 	accept answer( 	if answer = "Y" then goto SpitBrook Rd.  E (no kiddin' my next mission may be "return to the Cobol future"...:-)E   D. --  H   ----------------------------------------------------------------------H MORANDI Consultants  -  WEB: http://Didier.Morandi.Free.fr/index_us.htmlH Pflanzschulstrasse 53, 8004 Zurich, Switzerland. GSM: +41 (0)79 705 4670H 19, chemin de la Butte, 31400 Toulouse, France.  GSM: +33 (0)6 7983 6418  H Disaster Recovery Plans, Computer Security Audits, DEC OpenVMS ExpertiseH On parle franais Man spricht Deutsch se habla Castellano English spoken   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:37:57 GMT0* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>O Subject: Re: HP's viewpoint on Linux, was: Re: Sun eating major helping ofLinux B Message-ID: <o0Ln8.162862$1g.13357221@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message- news:zRJn8.1465$fL6.29026@news.cpqcorp.net...n >e4 > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote in message > <3C9F5B5A.4080804@sun.com>...t   ...m  F > >It depends what you call "industry" and it depends what you mean byI > >performance. Most commercial customers don't care a S**T about SPECintr > >or SPECfp performance,s >sJ > Wow.  Tell the to Bill Todd.  After all, even you want people to believe> > that IA64 will fail because it doesn't measure up in SpecInt  G Now, now, Fred, you'll just have to pay better attention if you want to:B actually debate rather than just throw (rather inaccurate) stones.  E While it's perhaps true that most people have concentrated on SPECintoG performance (and when I respond to them that's what I respond to), I'vecE pretty consistently identified Itanic's deficiencies in memory-access K latency (compared with both EV7/EV8 and Hammer, though possibly not POWER4)iJ and SMP scalability (compared with EV7/EV8, Hammer, and POWER4) along withA SPECint in any general discussions, plus its even more deplorableaF performance per Watt and performance per unit of chip area (which willL plague it through multiple generations of process-shrinks when compared with its competition).o  J So while it remains the case that Itanic (assuming it stays afloat at all)I would likely have fallen increasingly behind Alpha in SPECint performanceaL had Alpha development continued and will likely trail both POWER4 and HammerL significantly, equally serious problems for the next 3 years exist elsewhereI (until on-chip support for memory and SMP communication can be glued on).m   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:49:23 GMTn% From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@insightbb.com> O Subject: Re: HP's viewpoint on Linux, was: Re: Sun eating major helping ofLinux-8 Message-ID: <8rkv9u8pku7rl0dt4mgk4f6t9mamvldock@4ax.com>  E On Fri, 22 Mar 2002 15:44:16 +0000, Andrew Harrison SUNUK ConsultancyE3 <andrew_nospam.remove_this.harrison@sun.com> wrote:c     >n@ >One attribute of technical people is generally an understanding= >of what they indevidually know and don't know. This facilityd; >seems to have deserted you, it seems to have happened soon  >after the merger.  . My vote for the pot-and-kettle award for 2002.    1 Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaqi- (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 18:37:22 -0800. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)> Subject: Re: IF-THEN-ELSE oddity: Extra ELSE's cause no error!= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0203251837.782516f9@posting.google.com>,  s hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond) wrote in message news:<7Nnm8.1320$fL6.26489@news.cpqcorp.net>...C! > 1	$    WSO = "WRITE SYS$OUTPUT"f >      2	$    IF P1.EQ.0 >      3	$    THEN >      4	$        WSO "P1 = 0" >      5	$    ELSE  ! 1d& >      6	$        WSO "ELSE 1 P1 != 0" >      7	$    ELSE  ! 2o& >      8	$        WSO "ELSE 2 P1 != 0" >      9	$    ELSE  ! 3n& >     10	$        WSO "ELSE 3 P1 != 0" >     11	$    ELSE& >     12	$        WSO "ELSE 4 P1 != 0" >     13	$    ENDIFr > J > Did you notice that line 4 is executed if P1 is 0, and line 6 is execute > for ANY other value of P1? >   > i.e. lines 7-12 are "ignored". > K > So, this is a case -- some would say "yet another case" -- where DCL will-B > run without error even though a syntax rule is clearly violated. > I > If you are depending on this to do something, be aware that it probably-G > doesn't do what you want, AND that it is undefined behaviour that may  > change in the future.M    D Nope. I was working on inherited code when I discovered this. I knowD DCL supports only one ELSE per IF-THEN-ELSE block, but was surprised= to see it run without the "IF-THEN-ELSE inconsistency" error.     H > If you want DCL to be changed to generate a warning about this, report% > it via your normal support channel.r     OK.     L > The DCL_CHECK procedure mentioned in a prior reply will catch this problemN > and many others that may be lurking in your DCL procedures.  It is available > on the FREEWARE CD.l     I'll check it out. Thanks.   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldmanu" afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:35:38 GMTl1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>p, Subject: Re: Installing Star Receipt Printer' Message-ID: <3C9FD2A5.6BF4B746@fsi.net>p   JF Mezei wrote:h >  > "David J. Dachtera" wrote:J > > Really, the terminal should pass the data transparently. Thus, if it'sJ > > receiving data that displays o.k., but isn't 100% right, you may get a$ > > good display but bad print outs. > M > Nop. The printer port can operate at a baud rate that is different from theB > terminal's serial port.o > O > So if the terminal operates at 9600, has its printer port set to 4800 and the.9 > printer is set at 9600, the printer will get jibberish.h > M > There should be a printer setup menu in the 420 setup. (you may have to seteL > the terminal comm ports feature on the Global Setup Screen to "Sessions on1 > Comm1" or "S1=Comm1" to make that menu appear).n  
 Nota bene:   "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > [snip]& > ... verify that the data format ... !                       ^^^^ ^^^^^^m  H Certainly, the data *RATE* between the terminal and host can differ from* the that between the terminal and printer.  H However, for both links, the data *FORMAT* must be correct. The terminalA must be expecting/using what the host is expecting/using, and thetE terminal must be expecting/using what the printer is expecting/using. ? Here again, the data *FORMAT* may differ between the two links.e  G Just because the data appears ungarbled on the screen - this does *NOT* F guarantee that the terminal is set for the correct data format for the- host link, which was my original speculation.     -- t David J. DachteraM dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:20:07 GMTn* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>* Subject: Re: Interesting Alpha advertisingC Message-ID: <GLKn8.252411$uv5.22028632@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>e  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3C9F590A.54A7AA51@videotron.ca...@ > AlphaServers & StorageWorks Products Provide Animation Realism  C Just what cHomPaq needs:  kudos for a declared-dead OS running on ayI declared-dead platform.  Next thing, we'll be seeing VAX success stories.a  " I especially liked this paragraph:  L Carl Ludwig, vice president of Research and Development at Blue Sky Studios,J said, "Compaq's technology gives us computational strength on a reasonableF number of processors at a cost that makes economic sense. Coupled withD Compaq's Tru64 UNIX, which allows us to network all these processors togetherK effectively, this tremendous increase in power will place the studio firmly  in;  the forefront of digital content creation and innovation."e    J Just imagine what a change Itanic will bring:  double the processor count,I and no reasonable OS but (possibly) Linux (you don't think these guys are ' going to become VMS converts, do you?).s   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:41:45 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> * Subject: Re: Interesting Alpha advertisingE Message-ID: <ZAOn8.1275$RQq.528@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>-  C David Mathog  pointed out in a post some time ago, that the computeeD intensive high-performance buyers - and that includes the animation,F high-energy physics, molecular modeling, fluid dynamics - read 'nucs',< supercomputer centers, and crash simulation guys are whores.  I They buy whatever the hottest box is for the best price/performance. TheyrE have no loyalty to a particular vendor's hardware. They just view the K compute cycles as commodity items because they are for the most part numberr! crucnhing lots of floating point.i  B A good friend of mine who is assistant chair of physics at a largeE university confirmed this to me from his perspective, and experience.p  J Compaq (maybe HP) has to know that the revenue from this market segment is' going to evaporate in the next 2 years.f  . There goes another $1 billion in annual sales.  D Way to go Curly. Shrewd  move on Carly's part to pay a premium for a disappearing business.  H Much vaunted business management expertise in action. Ooop, meant to say 'inaction'.b  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3C9F590A.54A7AA51@videotron.ca...@ > AlphaServers & StorageWorks Products Provide Animation Realism >mK >   HOUSTON, March 25 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Compaq Computer Corporation H > today announced that Compaq's high performance AlphaServer systems andI > StorageWorks products were the technologies used to power the animationlD > process for ICE AGE, the high-tech, full-length animated film just released byy > Twentieth Century Fox. >nL >   From Blue Sky Studios and Oscar-winning Director Chris Wedge, ICE AGE is aiL > heart-warming, computer animated feature film involving prehistoric familyI > characters set amidst a time when glaciers covered the earth. Developed K > entirely using computer generated images (CGI), Blue Sky Studios utilizedv aaD > sophisticated rendering technology which was crucial to convey the unsurpassed$H > realism of the landscape and prehistoric characters shown in the film. > L >   Blue Sky Studio's proprietary rendering technology, known as CGI Studio,H > requires high levels of computing performance and massive power -- forL > example, the time to render a single frame ranged from eight to as much as 30D > hours, and every minute of film required rendering 1,440 frames of
 animation. >:J >   To meet the technological demands of the animation process, a total of 512 G > Compaq AlphaServer DS10L systems were configured into 13 RenderWalls,  runningJH > Compaq's Tru64 UNIX operating system. In addition, Compaq's TruCluster ServerC > clustering system was used with multiple AlphaServer ES40 systemsd	 providingiK > more than three Terabytes of clustered storage for production. The systems washD > based on Compaq's StorageWorks scalable architecture which allowed
 additionalG > disks, controllers and cache to be added incrementally when required.a >oK >   In the movie, the advanced animation technology paid off with realistic.K > effects for the prehistoric characters and their environment, replicatingn the H > matrix of colors, textures, and shadows experienced in the real world.H > Attention to detail is extremely evident throughout the film, and this6 > contributes significantly to the film's unique look. > + >   Blue Sky Studios Executives Laud Compaqs >iL >   John Donkin, associate producer at Blue Sky Studios, said, "Using CompaqK > technology on our first all-computer generated feature film, ICE AGE, has.I > enabled us to do something which wouldn't be possible otherwise. We are  usingiJ > some of the most sophisticated rendering technology in existence, and we areOL > able to meet our rendering demands for both full-on high resolutions finalD > renders as well as allowing us to have a better and shorter design cycle --8 > all of which results in higher quality on the screen." >,G >   Carl Ludwig, vice president of Research and Development at Blue Sky  Studios,L > said, "Compaq's technology gives us computational strength on a reasonableH > number of processors at a cost that makes economic sense. Coupled withF > Compaq's Tru64 UNIX, which allows us to network all these processors togetherF > effectively, this tremendous increase in power will place the studio	 firmly ina= >  the forefront of digital content creation and innovation."d >LK >   Blue Sky Studios has been working with Compaq technology since 1998 andt thisL > has included the earlier creation of the Oscar-winning short film feature,G > BUNNY, directed by Chris Wedge. Wedge also directed ICE AGE, which isfF > Twentieth Century Fox's first venture in high-tech animation cinema. >wE >   Bill Blake, Compaq's vice president of High Performance Technicalu
 Computing,D > said, "Compaq technology has provided superior performance and the	 computingoI > power for a number of well-known Hollywood films in the past few years,o and L > we're pleased that Blue Sky Studios and Twentieth Century Fox have allowed us) > the opportunity to be part of ICE AGE.")   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:08:19 GMT4* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>= Subject: Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?eC Message-ID: <DAKn8.252381$uv5.22017619@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>y  - "Jon" <jsmyth69@hotmail.com> wrote in messageo2 news:bbgu9uc35cdatag465b4ho66kd7ui0ktnb@4ax.com... > Hi,w > D >   I was wondering if Compaq was ever going to develop a NSK kernel > that is VMS based?  / I think it's safe to say that the answer is no.    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:27:51 -0500l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> = Subject: Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?a, Message-ID: <3C9F7A32.DF0BA409@videotron.ca>   Bill Todd wrote:F > >   I was wondering if Compaq was ever going to develop a NSK kernel > > that is VMS based? > 1 > I think it's safe to say that the answer is no.r  H It is certain that it is  "NO". Compaq will not develop anything becauseC Compaq has ceased to exist, barring a NO vote from HP shareholders.C  N And I personally think it is more likely that HP would choose to port parts ofN VMS to NSK than the other way around. HP has said that Tandem will survive. It  had not said anything about VMS.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:09:20 GMTt0 From: prune@ZAnkh-Morpork.mv.com (Paul Winalski)= Subject: Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?r9 Message-ID: <3c9f8490.1197380672@proxy.news.easynews.com>t  E On Mon, 25 Mar 2002 08:26:41 -0700, Jon <jsmyth69@hotmail.com> wrote:n   >Hi, >hC >  I was wondering if Compaq was ever going to develop a NSK kernels >that is VMS based?h  D Unlikely in the extreme that either Compaq or HP (when/if the merger goes through) would do that.  
 ---------- Remove 'Z' to reply by email.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 03:54:21 GMTc. From: "Duane Sand" <Duane.Sand@mindspring.com>= Subject: Re: Is there going to be a VMS based kernel for NSK?w? Message-ID: <NhSn8.129776$uA5.112796@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>r  * "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote >h$ > "Jon" <jsmyth69@hotmail.com> wroteE > >  I was wondering if Compaq was ever going to develop a NSK kernel  > > that is VMS based? >o1 > I think it's safe to say that the answer is no.- > - bill  6 VMS is little-endian only, and NSK is big-endian only.9 If NSK were somehow ported onto VMS, it couldn't take anyr* existing customer software & data with it.  5 The subject of merging or porting NSK onto VMS etc orr. combining their ABIs has never come up at NSD.H We did try to add some "nonstop fundamentals" onto WinNT, to no benefit.  +  -- Duane Sand, not speaking for Compaq etco   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:26:55 GMTu, From: peterw@u.genie.co.uk (Peter Watkinson) Subject: Lottery and VMS2 Message-ID: <3c9fa2fe.15161187@news.cable.ntl.com>   Hi,o  E A few months ago I applied for a job on jobserve.com the UK's leading.C IT recruitment website for a junior VMS administrator type roll for-C the UK's main lottery firm which I took to mean Camelot who run therD National Lottery. I didn't get the job! Anyway since then I've had aF part time job working in a service station that has a lottery machine.B Is it VMS that runs on these machines? I've never heard of Camelot; having any downtime problems so the OS must be very stable.aB Is it VMS that runs on these systems worldwide? Are there a vax or" alpha processor in these machines?   I'd like to know.0  C I know the till is a Windows '98 epos machine. it crashed on me thenE other day - not funny. The Epos machines in the UK Job centres run onLA NT 4 Dell Optiplex machines - I've seen those down also. EDS BTW.r      
 Kind regards,z         Peter Watkinsona peterw@u.genie.co.uk   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:46:48 +0100 - From: "Martin Hoogenboom" <martinh@xs4all.nl>  Subject: Re: Lottery and VMS3 Message-ID: <006c01c1d44e$f6b66250$8349130a@wws00b>p   Peter,  D Not that i know a lot about the subject but one thing i know is that; in europe a lot of lotteries run on OpenVMS Alpha machines.lB I have worked for several of these in The Netherlands, Switserland and UK.mG The machines you find at the local service stations are usually specialt@ terminals connecting to the cental VMS servers via ISDN or POTS  (sometimes leased lines).   @ Not much downtime, thats exactly the reason VMS is used. HoweverE we once had a split cluster, both administering sold lottery tickets.I4 No downtime, but double uptime isn't good either ;-)   Regardso Martin ----- Original Message -----  . From: "Peter Watkinson" <peterw@u.genie.co.uk> To: <Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com>e% Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 11:26 PMn Subject: Lottery and VMS     >  > Hi,s > G > A few months ago I applied for a job on jobserve.com the UK's leadingiE > IT recruitment website for a junior VMS administrator type roll forrE > the UK's main lottery firm which I took to mean Camelot who run theaF > National Lottery. I didn't get the job! Anyway since then I've had aH > part time job working in a service station that has a lottery machine.D > Is it VMS that runs on these machines? I've never heard of Camelot= > having any downtime problems so the OS must be very stable.tD > Is it VMS that runs on these systems worldwide? Are there a vax or$ > alpha processor in these machines? >  > I'd like to know.  > E > I know the till is a Windows '98 epos machine. it crashed on me the G > other day - not funny. The Epos machines in the UK Job centres run on C > NT 4 Dell Optiplex machines - I've seen those down also. EDS BTW.  >  >  >  > Kind regards,+ >  >  >  >  > Peter Watkinsona > peterw@u.genie.co.uk >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:14:35 -0500e* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>@ Subject: RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC- Message-ID: <0033000057645417000002L072*@MHS>r  2 =0AWebsearch Google using "VLC" and "system disk".   3 articles.o   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET-$ Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 1:10 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET@ Subject: RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC     Michael Austin wrote:D >b > "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > >. > > Michael Austin wrote:@ > > >b > > > Ralph Kloess wrote:n > > > >i > > > > Hello All, > > > >6H > > > > I just got ahold of a VS4000-VLC and after finally finding a ha= rddiscE > > > > and a CD-Rom drive, the Standalone Backup complains about the$" > > > > filestructure on the disc. > > > > H > > > > I recal there is a command to low-level format the disc, so VMS=  canD > > > > use it. But for the life of me I can't remember the command. > > > >E/ > > > > Is Somebodies memory better than mine??3 > > > >IH > > > > BTW the disc is a Seagate ST32151N and the CD-Rom is a Plextor = drive. > > > >N > > > > thanks,P > > > >  > > > > Ralph Kloess > > >.H > > > On the VAX VLC, there is a >>> T70 at the console prompt that wil= lwH > > > format a disk. INITIALIZE cannot work until the drive has been FO= RMATTEDy > > > for the VAX. > >tH > > Um, I'm not real sure about that. Remember, we're talking LOW LEVEL=  H > > format here - the one that would be required before *ANY* o.s.'s I/= O A > > primitives could consider the disc valid for use. There is no ? > > "VAX-specific" or "VMS-specific" format (below ODS), AFAIK.  >s > Are you sure about that :)  D Well, I've taken SCSI disks (2GB or less) known to have been used onD DOS, DOS/Win and NT machines and plugged them into various Alpha and@ MicroVAX machines running VMS and was able to INITIALIZE without@ reformatting. (Booting VMS from them would be another question.)  B So, yes, based on my own experiences, I'm reasonably sure that the3 low-level format is o.s. transparent, but not 100%.l   -- David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:  http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/=   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:27:18 -0500r* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>@ Subject: RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC- Message-ID: <0033000057647588000002L082*@MHS>.  - =0AWhat I meant to say was search comp.os.vmso using Google groups search.u   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETa$ Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 3:22 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET@ Subject: RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC    / Websearch Google using "VLC" and "system disk".h   3 articles.h   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET $ Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 1:10 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET@ Subject: RE: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC     Michael Austin wrote:. >  > "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > >  > > Michael Austin wrote:* > > >n > > > Ralph Kloess wrote:d > > > >m > > > > Hello All, > > > >aH > > > > I just got ahold of a VS4000-VLC and after finally finding a ha= rddiscE > > > > and a CD-Rom drive, the Standalone Backup complains about the " > > > > filestructure on the disc. > > > >hH > > > > I recal there is a command to low-level format the disc, so VMS=  canD > > > > use it. But for the life of me I can't remember the command. > > > >s/ > > > > Is Somebodies memory better than mine??f > > > >rH > > > > BTW the disc is a Seagate ST32151N and the CD-Rom is a Plextor = drive. > > > >. > > > > thanks,J > > > >  > > > > Ralph Kloess > > >nH > > > On the VAX VLC, there is a >>> T70 at the console prompt that wil= l-H > > > format a disk. INITIALIZE cannot work until the drive has been FO= RMATTEDo > > > for the VAX. > >eH > > Um, I'm not real sure about that. Remember, we're talking LOW LEVEL=  H > > format here - the one that would be required before *ANY* o.s.'s I/= OtA > > primitives could consider the disc valid for use. There is no ? > > "VAX-specific" or "VMS-specific" format (below ODS), AFAIK.  >t > Are you sure about that :)  D Well, I've taken SCSI disks (2GB or less) known to have been used onD DOS, DOS/Win and NT machines and plugged them into various Alpha and@ MicroVAX machines running VMS and was able to INITIALIZE without@ reformatting. (Booting VMS from them would be another question.)  B So, yes, based on my own experiences, I'm reasonably sure that the3 low-level format is o.s. transparent, but not 100%.,   -- David J. Dachterar dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:  http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/=   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 14:16:46 -0800. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)@ Subject: Re: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0203251416.6f2f1b07@posting.google.com>y  l Ralph Kloess <Ralph.Kloess@imkesun.de> wrote in message news:<gkaq9ugf0oj6kok7ono5qtglafp634sv9e@4ax.com>... > Hello All, > G > I just got ahold of a VS4000-VLC and after finally finding a harddisc2? > and a CD-Rom drive, the Standalone Backup complains about the  > filestructure on the disc. > E > I recal there is a command to low-level format the disc, so VMS can > > use it. But for the life of me I can't remember the command. > ) > Is Somebodies memory better than mine??c      ^^^^^^^^^^u  C A classic case of apostrophe disease. (Many of us, myself included,c suffer from this occasionally.)a     Dislcaimer: JMHO Alan E. FeldmanT" afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 18:30:44 -0800. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)@ Subject: Re: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0203251830.72c9c93f@posting.google.com>q  s SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) wrote in message news:<343f30ae.0203251416.6f2f1b07@posting.google.com>... n > Ralph Kloess <Ralph.Kloess@imkesun.de> wrote in message news:<gkaq9ugf0oj6kok7ono5qtglafp634sv9e@4ax.com>... > > Hello All, > > I > > I just got ahold of a VS4000-VLC and after finally finding a harddiscsA > > and a CD-Rom drive, the Standalone Backup complains about the  > > filestructure on the disc. > > G > > I recal there is a command to low-level format the disc, so VMS cana@ > > use it. But for the life of me I can't remember the command. > > + > > Is Somebodies memory better than mine??' >      ^^^^^^^^^^A > E > A classic case of apostrophe disease. (Many of us, myself included,t! > suffer from this occasionally.)o >   N On second thought, not really classic at all. I've never seen this one before.   Dislcaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldmand" afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 19:32:47 -0800/ From: chris@applied-synergy.com (Chris Scheers)a@ Subject: Re: Low Level format of SCSI Disc in VaxStation 4000VLC= Message-ID: <754a27c1.0203251932.59a1d398@posting.google.com>i  l Ralph Kloess <Ralph.Kloess@imkesun.de> wrote in message news:<gkaq9ugf0oj6kok7ono5qtglafp634sv9e@4ax.com>... > Hello All, > G > I just got ahold of a VS4000-VLC and after finally finding a harddiscr? > and a CD-Rom drive, the Standalone Backup complains about thee > filestructure on the disc. > E > I recal there is a command to low-level format the disc, so VMS can > > use it. But for the life of me I can't remember the command. > ) > Is Somebodies memory better than mine??  > G > BTW the disc is a Seagate ST32151N and the CD-Rom is a Plextor drive.f    ! There can be several issues here.e  A First, when you do the BACKUP/IMAGE, do NOT use the /NOINITIALIZEUA switch.  If the disk can be initialized (high level) by VMS, thisl
 should do it.   F There are a couple of SCSI MODE page settings that can cause trouble. D IIRC, the error correction flags AWRE, ARRE, and RC should be zero. A Disks coming from the PC world quite often have these set to one.w  D (I think that this restriction was removed at about VMS 6.2.  I know that it exists in 5.5-2.)n  D I have heard that some early versions of the VLC ROMs do not supportD drives larger than 1GB.  I do not know whether or not this is reallyE true, as none of my VLCs have this problem.  I have successfully usedt disks larger than 1GB on them.  F It may be that the devices you have on your SCSI bus do not get along.?  This can be difficult to diagnose.  Make sure that all devicesEF (including the VLC itself) have a unique ID and that no devices exceptD the last one on the cable are terminated.  If the last device is not7 terminated, ensure that an external terminator is used.   F Finally, a low level format may be needed.  To do this on the VLC, getE to the console prompt (">>>") and enter the command "TEST/UTIL SCSI".r  C While a low level format is not OS specific, some parameters of theoF format may affect the OS.  For example, the SCSI FORMAT command allowsF different block sizes.  The VLC format uses parameters appropriate for VMS.  
 Good luck!   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:23:35 -0700a From: Kevin Handy <kth@srv.net> 3 Subject: Re: LP11/LA11/LS11 Line Printer Supported?r& Message-ID: <3C9FA367.4070201@srv.net>   sword7@speakeasy.org wrote:T > Hello folks: > F > I just implemented simple LP-11 line printer emulation into my TS10 F > emulator but OpenVMS 7.2 did not detect LP-11 device.  Does OpenVMS E > support LP-11 device for line printer?  If not, which line printer S > device(s)?  ' According to configure it does (as LP).    > 8 > How about card reader/puncher and tape reader/puncher?  7 Look in [sys0.syscommon.sys$ldr] for most of the device  drivers (*driver.exe).  = You can check for some type of support by running a configuree> for them in VMS. The configure option is only used to tell you: what CSR's and Vectors your devices are supposed to be at,/ but should tell you if the device is supported.d   run sys$system:sysgen  SYSGEN> configurel
 DEVICE> DHV11d DEVICE> CR11% DEVICE> ^Z		<-- Type a control/Z here ; Device: CR11	Name: CRA	CSR: 777160	Vector: 230	Support: yes > Device: DHV11	Name: TXA	CSR: 760440*	Vector: 300*	Support: yes
 SYSGEN> ^Z  : Configure wants the name of the controller, not the device- being controlled. i.e. rqdx3 instead of rd54.r   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 15:48:44 -08000 From: chris_doran@postmaster.co.uk (Chris Doran)3 Subject: Re: LP11/LA11/LS11 Line Printer Supported?9= Message-ID: <948f0720.0203251548.37798853@posting.google.com>   Q sword7@speakeasy.org wrote in message news:<u9ufbq49shpq6c@corp.supernews.com>...  > Hello folks: > F > I just implemented simple LP-11 line printer emulation into my TS10 F > emulator but OpenVMS 7.2 did not detect LP-11 device.  Does OpenVMS E > support LP-11 device for line printer?  If not, which line printer f > device(s)?  F I don't seem to be able to access any site where the 7.2 SPD may lurk,< but LP-11 is listed in a printed 5.5 SPD which came to hand.   > How about card reader/puncher    and so is CR-11.   > and tape reader/puncher?  F PC-11 was _never_ supported by DEC, but there is a driver in the DECUSB stuff somewhere. It needed some tweaks when DEC changed the deviceB driver macros years ago, but I managed it without knowing anything about driver writing.a   Chrise   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:47:57 +0100n From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>P Subject: Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver& Message-ID: <3C9FA91D.2010004@home.nl>    Thanks Kerry, this is good news.  E I've ordered the book,  but someone at Compaq should consider giving  ; this book away to the customers that have software support.>B In fact  I would have expected this announcement from Compaq .....) If Compaq wants e-bussiness on VMS ......h   Main, Kerry wrote:   >Jean-Franois:o >q >Thanks for the posting.   >s! >Alan Winston - way cool stuff ! - >  >:-) >'l >[I have posted it internally to Compaq as well as pointing it out to a number of key Customers I deal with] >"M >Fot the benefit of others - here is the book description:  ISBN - 1555582648n >f< >"OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver" >by Alan Winston > % >Editorial Reviews - Book Descriptionh > L >-If your business needs reliable, full-featured web service, you need this I >book -Offers information not available anywhere else for OpenVMS, whose fP >unbeatable reliability makes it the web server of choice for institutions that O >can't afford downtime for their websites - Provides examples and step-by-step xP >procedures that show how to do the same task in different servers Learn how to P >successfully run a web server on an OpenVMS system, using any one of the three Q >currently supported servers - OSU, WASD, and Compaq Secure Web Server (based on aP >Apache). The book explains the suitability of VMS clusters for 24x7 operation, G >covers the various TCP/IP products, and discusses cluster aliases and eN >load-balancing techniques. The chapters are organized by function, answering L >the question How do I do X for each of the servers. Winston evaluates many 0 >relevant freeware and some commercial products. >o >From the Publisher:Q >OpenVMS with Apache, OSU and WASD also discusses specific tasks, such as how to tO >port CGI programs from other operating systems, and gives working examples in tJ >PERL, Python, and DCL. One chapter also covers database connectivity for  >VMS-based CGI programs. >y >w	 >Regards.e >s >Kerry Main  >Senior Consultant >Compaq Canada Corp. >Professional Services >Voice: 613-592-4660 >Fax  :  819-772-7036m >Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com  >  >w >-----Original Message-----o? >From: Jean-Franois PIRONNE [mailto:jf.pieronne@laposte.net]   >Sent: March 25, 2002 9:24 AMr >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComM >Subject: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webservere >  >kX >A new very interesting book which will be a valuable contribution to the VMS community. >6W >http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1555582648/qid%3D1017069087/104-6148870-9011156  >s >- >Jean-Franois Pironne0 >4   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:27:14 GMTn. From: "Richard L. Dyson" <rickdyson@mchsi.com>P Subject: Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver) Message-ID: <3C9FC05C.C0890B1E@mchsi.com>n   Jean-Franois PIRONNE wrote:s > J > A new very interesting book which will be a valuable contribution to the > VMS community. > X > http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1555582648/qid%3D1017069087/104-6148870-9011156 >  > Jean-Franois Pironne  M How does the Amazon.com price (US$31.49) compare with the discount price fromoH full Encompass members?  This is supposed to be a Digital Press book andL Encompass gets some sort of discount (though I have yet to figure out how to# get it via the on-line purchase...)c  
 Rick Dyson   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 16:53:46 -0800( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)P Subject: Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0203251653.288b628b@posting.google.com>t  j Jean-Franois PIRONNE 	<jf.pieronne@laposte.net> wrote in message news:<3C9F3300.994C56DF@laposte.net>...J > A new very interesting book which will be a valuable contribution to the > VMS community. > X > http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1555582648/qid%3D1017069087/104-6148870-9011156 >  >  > Jean-Franois Pironne   what about Purveyor?   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:14:04 GMTn) From: rob.buxton@wcc.govt.nz (Rob Buxton) P Subject: Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver1 Message-ID: <3c9fbd1d.416772677@news.wcc.govt.nz>.  C On Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:47:57 +0100, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:n  ! >Thanks Kerry, this is good news.  >-F >I've ordered the book,  but someone at Compaq should consider giving < >this book away to the customers that have software support.C >In fact  I would have expected this announcement from Compaq .....5* >If Compaq wants e-bussiness on VMS ......  D I certainly second that. I'll also try and find out what budget I've got left fot "training"    >V >Main, Kerry wrote:o >t >>Jean-Franois: >> >>Thanks for the posting.  >>" >>Alan Winston - way cool stuff !  >> >>:-)C >>m >>[I have posted it internally to Compaq as well as pointing it out to a number of key Customers I deal with]  >>N >>Fot the benefit of others - here is the book description:  ISBN - 1555582648 >>= >>"OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver"t >>by Alan Winston0 >>& >>Editorial Reviews - Book Description >>M >>-If your business needs reliable, full-featured web service, you need this  J >>book -Offers information not available anywhere else for OpenVMS, whose Q >>unbeatable reliability makes it the web server of choice for institutions that cP >>can't afford downtime for their websites - Provides examples and step-by-step Q >>procedures that show how to do the same task in different servers Learn how to tQ >>successfully run a web server on an OpenVMS system, using any one of the three  R >>currently supported servers - OSU, WASD, and Compaq Secure Web Server (based on Q >>Apache). The book explains the suitability of VMS clusters for 24x7 operation, oH >>covers the various TCP/IP products, and discusses cluster aliases and O >>load-balancing techniques. The chapters are organized by function, answering  M >>the question How do I do X for each of the servers. Winston evaluates many n1 >>relevant freeware and some commercial products.l >> >>From the Publisher: R >>OpenVMS with Apache, OSU and WASD also discusses specific tasks, such as how to P >>port CGI programs from other operating systems, and gives working examples in K >>PERL, Python, and DCL. One chapter also covers database connectivity for g >>VMS-based CGI programs.u >> >>
 >>Regards. >> >>Kerry Main >>Senior Consultante >>Compaq Canada Corp.r >>Professional Servicesm >>Voice: 613-592-4660  >>Fax  :  819-772-7036 >>Email: Kerry.Main@Compaq.com >> >> >>-----Original Message-----@ >>From: Jean-Franois PIRONNE [mailto:jf.pieronne@laposte.net]  >>Sent: March 25, 2002 9:24 AM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com1N >>Subject: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver >> >>Y >>A new very interesting book which will be a valuable contribution to the VMS community.W >>X >>http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1555582648/qid%3D1017069087/104-6148870-9011156 >> >> >>Jean-Franois Pironne >> >.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:55:27 -0600 C From: "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com>lP Subject: Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop WebserverH Message-ID: <craig.berry-EBC1B0.21552725032002@news.directvinternet.com>  ) In article <3C9FC05C.C0890B1E@mchsi.com>, 0  "Richard L. Dyson" <rickdyson@mchsi.com> wrote:   > Jean-Franois PIRONNE wrote:. > > L > > A new very interesting book which will be a valuable contribution to the > > VMS community. > > P > > http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1555582648/qid%3D1017069087/104-61488 > > 70-9011156 > >  > > Jean-Franois Pironne > O > How does the Amazon.com price (US$31.49) compare with the discount price fromaJ > full Encompass members?  This is supposed to be a Digital Press book andN > Encompass gets some sort of discount (though I have yet to figure out how to% > get it via the on-line purchase...),  C Just go to http://www.openvms.compaq.com/ and look for the Digital  C Press link.  It looks like the discount has been extended until 31 ?< March (and has nothing to do with Encompass that I can see).   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 04:10:54 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")P Subject: Re: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver8 Message-ID: <00A0B7C1.A1E0CAD9@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  h In article <d7791aa1.0203251653.288b628b@posting.google.com>, bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) writes:k >Jean-Franois PIRONNE 	<jf.pieronne@laposte.net> wrote in message news:<3C9F3300.994C56DF@laposte.net>... K >> A new very interesting book which will be a valuable contribution to the  >> VMS community.  >>  Y >> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1555582648/qid%3D1017069087/104-6148870-9011156a >> s >> p >> Jean-Franois Pironnep >a >what about Purveyor?u  6 Sorry, Bob.  Only webservers under active development.   -- AlanV    O =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056/M  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA  94309-0210.O ===============================================================================8   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 04:10:10 GMTlL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")P Subject: RE: New book: OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver8 Message-ID: <00A0B7C1.879C8B13@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  
 In articleI <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF401AB1DB0@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>,s- "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@Compaq.com> writes:    >Jean-Fran=E7ois:  >i >Thanks for the posting.=20  > # >Alan Winston - way cool stuff !=20  >m
 Thank you.   >:-) > I >[I have posted it internally to Compaq as well as pointing it out to a =S% >number of key Customers I deal with]  >^D >Fot the benefit of others - here is the book description:  ISBN - = >1555582648  >f< >"OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD, The Nonstop Webserver" >by Alan Winston >i  H Everyone should note that the book won't actually be printed until June.    % >Editorial Reviews - Book Descriptionm >lH >-If your business needs reliable, full-featured web service, you need = >this=20K >book -Offers information not available anywhere else for OpenVMS, whose=20Y? >unbeatable reliability makes it the web server of choice for =1 >institutions that=20oC >can't afford downtime for their websites - Provides examples and =g >step-by-step=20J >procedures that show how to do the same task in different servers Learn =
 >how to=20K >successfully run a web server on an OpenVMS system, using any one of the =t	 >three=20cH >currently supported servers - OSU, WASD, and Compaq Secure Web Server =
 >(based on=20mF >Apache). The book explains the suitability of VMS clusters for 24x7 = >operation,=20I >covers the various TCP/IP products, and discusses cluster aliases and=20' >load-balancing techniques.   L Now I'm worried. While that discussion is in there, it's in the introductoryN material and doesn't go in to step-by-step detail on cluster aliases and otherO IP-product-based techniques, nor does it explain in any detail how to set up a i disaster tolerant cluster.  M Where the book goes step-by-step is in installing and configuring webservers,eB freeware support (eg, Perl, PHP, SSL) and all those other goodies.    ) The chapters are organized by function, =2
 >answering=205H >the question How do I do X for each of the servers. Winston evaluates = >many=200 >relevant freeware and some commercial products.  
 This is true.l   >  >From the Publisher:K >OpenVMS with Apache, OSU and WASD also discusses specific tasks, such as =h
 >how to=20D >port CGI programs from other operating systems, and gives working = >examples in=20mK >PERL, Python, and DCL. One chapter also covers database connectivity for =  >I >VMS-based CGI programs.  H This is also true.  (That last chapter is limited to Rdb, incidentally.) >g   -- AlanN  O ===============================================================================s0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056lM  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA  94309-0210eO ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 16:45:21 -0500i1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com>. Subject: News Server Software.1 Message-ID: <3C9F9A71.54B77D1@firstdbasource.com>t  F I am looking for a newsgroup server similar to ANU, but needs to scaleD to full, near-realtime updates and support 1-2K concurrent requests.F OpenVMS or Tru64 and any recommendations on which box(clustered) would4 support this in an N+1 configuration is appreciated.   -- T Regards,  7 Michael Austin            Registered Linux User #261163u7 First DBA Source, Inc.    http://www.firstdbasource.com  Sr. Consultant 704-947-1089 (Office)e 704-236-4377 (Mobile)d   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 21:12:11 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>h3 Subject: Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...h5 Message-ID: <20020325211211.5684.qmail@gacracker.org>t  > On 25 Mar 2002, koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote:B >In article <20020324082557.22755.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher, ><Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes: >> fJ >> Indeed it is, there is a lot of advertising mileage in going up againstN >> over 4000 hackers and surviving everything they can throw at you. Why can't >> VMS Marketing see that? > F >   They did.  Much of the choir got the glossy referring to it.  WhatG >   they didn't do it publically answer Bill Gate's claim that there isi) >   no secure, reliable OS on the market.2  I Thanks for the correction Bob, I wasn't one of those that got the glossy. I Probably because I don't give out mailing details over the internet. (I'muF probably viewed as disreputable and untrustworthy anyway because I useK remailers to post to Usenet.) What I'd like to know is just who did the thevH glossy go to? Was it just existing customers? To continue being a littleI critical of the marketing I'd like to say that I think this was something  that merited advertising...e  8     Las Vegas. For 3 days the home to over 4000 hackers.0     They'll break anything you put in their way.     Except VMS.E>     Shouldn't your business run *the* secure operating system?  D Put something like that in 40 point text in the WSJ with contact andK website details for VMS and I'll bet you'd notice an increase in sales - ifg& the sales followup was done correctly.  I >   They should have told him where to put it in no uncertain terms.  But-B >   that might jeopardized the money loosing part of the bussines.  J That would've been nice to see, but seems about as likely as hell freezingD over. Compaq marketing appears to have a distinct lack of testicles. (Apologies to Sue :).y     Doc. -- e6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                              http://vmsbox.cjb.net    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:47:51 -0600n+ From: Christopher Smith <csmith@amdocs.com>?3 Subject: RE: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...'H Message-ID: <7E008308CD77154485FEF878168D078E260B7C@CMIMAIL1.amdocs.com>   > -----Original Message-----F > From: Doc.Cypher [mailto:Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]]  ? > That would've been nice to see, but seems about as likely as y > hell freezingsF > over. Compaq marketing appears to have a distinct lack of testicles. > (Apologies to Sue :).r   That sounds personal.m   Chris     ! Christopher Smith, Perl Developerw Amdocs - Champaign, IL   /usr/bin/perl -e '? print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n");  'n  o   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:27:01 GMTn1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>n3 Subject: Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...d& Message-ID: <3C9FD0A4.DFFF435@fsi.net>   Christopher Smith wrote: >  > > -----Original Message-----H > > From: Doc.Cypher [mailto:Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]] > @ > > That would've been nice to see, but seems about as likely as > > hell freezingnH > > over. Compaq marketing appears to have a distinct lack of testicles. > > (Apologies to Sue :).e >  > That sounds personal.a  A Probably tired of all the posts here about their lack of "balls".]  E ...and I don't mean the sparkly-bouncy kind! (NO! DON'T SAY IT! DON'T1& EVEN THINK IT! I DON'T WANNA HEAR IT!)   --   David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemsn http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:53:04 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>3 Subject: Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ... @ Message-ID: <4wQn8.87983$Gf.7971923@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message  news:3C9FD0A4.DFFF435@fsi.net... > Christopher Smith wrote: > >   > > > -----Original Message-----J > > > From: Doc.Cypher [mailto:Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]] > >oB > > > That would've been nice to see, but seems about as likely as > > > hell freezinguJ > > > over. Compaq marketing appears to have a distinct lack of testicles. > > > (Apologies to Sue :).a > >a > > That sounds personal.e >aC > Probably tired of all the posts here about their lack of "balls".  >hG > ...and I don't mean the sparkly-bouncy kind! (NO! DON'T SAY IT! DON'Tm( > EVEN THINK IT! I DON'T WANNA HEAR IT!)  J That does bring to mind a vivid picture of Curly dancing around his officeH in a too-short tutu in the manner suggested by the Babelfish translationJ from the German of one of his inimitable pronouncements cited here a while ago.   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:15:44 GMTo1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>c3 Subject: Re: Once a fool, always a fool I guess ...a' Message-ID: <3C9FDC0F.1B8565BB@fsi.net>-   Bill Todd wrote: > > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message" > news:3C9FD0A4.DFFF435@fsi.net... > > Christopher Smith wrote: > > >e" > > > > -----Original Message-----L > > > > From: Doc.Cypher [mailto:Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]] > > >vD > > > > That would've been nice to see, but seems about as likely as > > > > hell freezing8L > > > > over. Compaq marketing appears to have a distinct lack of testicles. > > > > (Apologies to Sue :).- > > >  > > > That sounds personal.1 > >nE > > Probably tired of all the posts here about their lack of "balls".: > >VI > > ...and I don't mean the sparkly-bouncy kind! (NO! DON'T SAY IT! DON'T.* > > EVEN THINK IT! I DON'T WANNA HEAR IT!) > L > That does bring to mind a vivid picture of Curly dancing around his officeJ > in a too-short tutu in the manner suggested by the Babelfish translationL > from the German of one of his inimitable pronouncements cited here a while > ago.  	 *LOL*!!!!o   --   David J. Dachteraw dba DJE Systemsp http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/s   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 13:29:36 -0500e1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com>-1 Subject: Re: Resumes [was: Right down the middle]82 Message-ID: <3C9F6C90.B4FFC074@firstdbasource.com>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:  G > In todays world of temporary workforces and management by MBA - it is3L > prudent to always keep an up-to-date resume regardless of who and what youN > work on.  While I do have an up-to-date one - it isn't being kept up-to-dateN > because I am worried about IA64 or about Linux, nor am I worried about beingC > laid off.  I just take my own advice in this case and am prudent.7    F It appears that most companies only want <very> junior level people soE they can pay them squat. Rates for Senior level Oracle DBA's are more:D than 50-60% under last year. I can't even travel with the rates theyF want to pay.  They will, however, get what they pay for and they won't care until it's too late.@  G Been looking for CONTRACT or CONTRACT to HIRE or PERM for 3+ months andoH 6 out of the last 12.  Others I know have been looking for 9-14 months.  -- k Regards,  / Michael Austin            OpenVMS for 18+ Yearsa7 First DBA Source, Inc.    Registered Linux User #261163t7 Sr. Consultant            http://www.firstdbasource.com./ 704-947-1089 (Office)     704-236-4377 (Mobile)    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:17:06 -0500e5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>e1 Subject: Re: Resumes [was: Right down the middle]>3 Message-ID: <OHLn8.1468$fL6.29108@news.cpqcorp.net>I  I Michael Austin wrote in message <3C9F6C90.B4FFC074@firstdbasource.com>...f >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:h > H >> In todays world of temporary workforces and management by MBA - it isI >> prudent to always keep an up-to-date resume regardless of who and whatt youyD >> work on.  While I do have an up-to-date one - it isn't being kept
 up-to-dateI >> because I am worried about IA64 or about Linux, nor am I worried abouts beingaD >> laid off.  I just take my own advice in this case and am prudent. >i >yG >It appears that most companies only want <very> junior level people sodF >they can pay them squat. Rates for Senior level Oracle DBA's are moreE >than 50-60% under last year. I can't even travel with the rates theyoG >want to pay.  They will, however, get what they pay for and they won'tn >care until it's too late. >uH >Been looking for CONTRACT or CONTRACT to HIRE or PERM for 3+ months andH >6 out of the last 12.  Others I know have been looking for 9-14 months.  K Welcome to the new world.  This has been true of about every industry for a J long time, and it is catching up with the computer industry as the dot comH bubble burst, and the recession hit - and now there are more bodies than people.n  J Of course you can specialize in narrow fields where people are highly paidL because there are so few of them (say, OS development) - but what goes alongH with that is that there aren't many places that need a lot of them.  AndL even that can be dicey.  A lot of UNIX kernel experts have hit the street asA Linux startups have toed up.  As well as commercial UNIX layoffs.>  J There are many people I know who have lost there jobs in the last 6 monthsL (inside and outside of Compaq) and who are still not working, or are working5 in a job that pays far less - just to tide them over.m   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:21:20 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>1 Subject: Re: Resumes [was: Right down the middle]T0 Message-ID: <3C9F9341.EF7AECEA@blueyonder.co.uk>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:  u > L > There are many people I know who have lost there jobs in the last 6 monthsN > (inside and outside of Compaq) and who are still not working, or are working7 > in a job that pays far less - just to tide them over.   L Thats if you can GET a job that pays far less in the current market climate.  B Interviewer : And exactly what were you earning in your last role?  O Interviewee : 3 times what you are offering (well, put it a bit more delicatelynT than that but thats the basic answer, unless one wants to start a new job by lying).  H Interviewer thinks : He won't stay around long when the market picks up.  L It appears that with current IT salaries in London it would be impossible toR get a mortage on anything, rates/salaries are so low (rule of thumb mortage=2.5-3 B times salary, what can you get for 75-100k in London these days?).     regardso  o -- e tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk a  F * tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk address will cease to work June 2002 *   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:23:49 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>v" Subject: Re: Right down the middle' Message-ID: <3C9FCFE0.631919BE@fsi.net>    Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > C > David J. Dachtera wrote in message <3C9CF300.E5606C2C@fsi.net>...  > >"Terry C. Shannon" wrote: > >>? > >> "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message,+ > >> news:3C9BE54B.CAB55429@videotron.ca...L > >> > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:oI > >> > > Compaq *has* provided a roadmap, and VMS is on it.  Until the HP, > merger > >> istN > >> > > certified and the merger closes, HP *can't* provide you a roadmap forJ > >> > > Compaq.  I see no reason to believe that the OpenVMS readmap will > >> change. > >> >N > >> > HP has provided a broad roadmap for Tru64 as well as Tandem, as well as > >> the > >> > Proliant wintel servers.r > >> >G > >> > It is a fact that HP has meddled into Compaq's products but wenty	 > through>
 > >> greatN > >> > strides to avoid mentioning VMS. HP and Capellas have also made a point > ofN > >> > mentioning stuff such as "proprietary is bad" and "industry standard is > >> good".d > >>E > >> What lies ahead for VMS I do not know, but JF makes a very valid= > assertion=J > >> here. Best case scenario is that VMS has been damned by faint praise. > WorstlG > >> case is, VMS goes away, and so does the current VMS customer base.  > >iJ > >I'd like to know what the "Plan B" might be should either (or both!) of, > >these possibilities become eventualities: > >=K > >1. Itanic is declared unworkable and unsalvageable, and Intel decides to I > >press forward with an architecture that proves to pose similar porting & > >challenges to those posed by IA-32. > >o > I > Perhaps there is a plan B, but I don't know about it.  I would also notBN > expect anyone to explicitly state what it was, or even if there was one.  We? > have full confidence that IA64 has a high-performance future.K > G > >2. OpenVMS's "profitable, large-scale" customers decide en-mass thattC > >Security-Enhanced Linux is more cost effective and comparable in G > >security and stability to OVMS. (Nota bene: Whether that is or couldoD > >ever be true or not is not the issue. The issue is the customer's5 > >perception, since that is the customer's reality.)  > >5 > M > Aside from the obvious high-cost of a port to UNIX (UNIX/Linux it's all theWN > same) - you'll need to show me the Linux kernel (today) that scales to 8, 16D > or 32 CPUs.  I'm sure it will get there, but it isn't there today. > K > No, for the majority of todays VMS users - especially ones using GS classr+ > machines, Linux isn't a real alternative.   H Tell that to the folks whose racks of Linux servers will soon out numberF their racks of NT/W2K servers. CPUs per machine seems to be less of an3 issue than machines per square foot of floor space.o  K > >Either one of those would leave OVMS up the shit creek on white water in=K > >a leaky boat with no paddles drifting toward the falls on a current that 2 > >nothing short of a turbine engine can overcome. > >  > L > The law of gravity may also be suspended, and I know I don't have a plan BD > for that either.  And while your scenerio has better odds than theD > probability of the laws of gravity being suspended, they are still > relatively long.  G That's what I thought before I got laid off back in 2000. Check out theo. word "complacency" in Merriam-Webster On-Line.  E > >I hope the OVMS denizens of the Q who are doing the IA64 ports are I > >polishing up their resumes while their software builds are running. IthK > >wouldn't much more than one "bump in the road" for them to end up in the ( > >same spot I'm in, and others like me. > >h > G > In todays world of temporary workforces and management by MBA - it isgL > prudent to always keep an up-to-date resume regardless of who and what youN > work on.  While I do have an up-to-date one - it isn't being kept up-to-dateN > because I am worried about IA64 or about Linux, nor am I worried about beingC > laid off.  I just take my own advice in this case and am prudent.p  " Indeed - speaks volumes of wisdom.   -- e David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Mar 2002 13:42:18 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)=# Subject: Re: Set user similar to SUA3 Message-ID: <7I6aIUP94UBM@eisner.encompasserve.org>l  x In article <dzEn8.249204$uv5.21651094@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "William Hymen" <t18_pilot@hotmail.spam.com> writes:	 > Hi all,, > 2 > I have been administering our migration software0 > (similar to CMS) for 2 years. I really need to- > do a (S)et (U)user similar to Unix.  I have / > full system privs, and the blessing of my SA.i > . > Our software license manager needs to see me# > as the other person "completely".s  B In other words, with no ability to switch back if the other person did not have that ability.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:21:46 +0100T9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> # Subject: Re: Set user similar to SUi' Message-ID: <3C9F86DA.9CB2E7A1@aaa.com>e   Larry,% What do you mean with "switch back" ?u8 When using HGLOGIN, a separate process is set up running< as the "other" user and your terminal is connected through a0 FTA device. You just "switch back" by login out.   Like this :1  	 $ sh term > Terminal: _TNA84:     Device_Type: VT400_Series  Owner: SYSTEM ...:   $  $ hglogin <some_user> 0 %HGLOGIN-I-LOGIN, logging in as user <some_user> $c	 $ sh termtC Terminal: _FTA119:    Device_Type: VT400_Series  Owner: <some_user>I ...i $ $ $  <do whatever needed as some_user> $> $ lo<   <some_user>          logged out at 25-MAR-2002 21:15:17.045 %HGLOGIN-I-EXIT, returning to original SYSTEM session  $  $p  B The ability to use HGLOGIN is, of course, depending on having someB privs, can't remember right now which but SYSTEM is having them...  	 Jan-Erik.o       Larry Kilgallen wrote: > z > In article <dzEn8.249204$uv5.21651094@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "William Hymen" <t18_pilot@hotmail.spam.com> writes: > > Hi all,r > >c4 > > I have been administering our migration software2 > > (similar to CMS) for 2 years. I really need to/ > > do a (S)et (U)user similar to Unix.  I haved1 > > full system privs, and the blessing of my SA.  > >l0 > > Our software license manager needs to see me% > > as the other person "completely".  > D > In other words, with no ability to switch back if the other person > did not have that ability.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:17:40 GMT.2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)# Subject: Re: Set user similar to SUa3 Message-ID: <UtMn8.1470$fL6.29189@news.cpqcorp.net>   x In article <dzEn8.249204$uv5.21651094@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "William Hymen" <t18_pilot@hotmail.spam.com> writes:  B :Our software license manager needs to see me as the other person B :"completely". I want to do this without constantly asking people  :for their username/password.  :- :Can anyone help?o    C   Um, so you want help violating your software licensing agreement?c  "   Or am I misreading this request?         N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:05:49 GMT / From: StevenU@POBoxes.com (Steven P. Underwood)0# Subject: Re: Set user similar to SUM9 Message-ID: <3c9fd078.308778446@news.directvinternet.com>   D On 25 Mar 2002 13:30:30 +0100, huber@vms.mppmu.mpg.de (Joseph Huber) wrote:  y >In article <dzEn8.249204$uv5.21651094@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "William Hymen" <t18_pilot@hotmail.spam.com> writes:k
 >> Hi all, >>  3 >> I have been administering our migration softwareh1 >> (similar to CMS) for 2 years. I really need tos. >> do a (S)et (U)user similar to Unix.  I have0 >> full system privs, and the blessing of my SA. >>  / >> Our software license manager needs to see mee6 >> as the other person "completely". I want to do this@ >> without constantly asking people for their username/password. >> Can anyone help?s >> Thanks,  Bill >FB >At the DCL level, there is the PERSONA program , and H.Goatley's B >HGLOGIN , look into the usual archives (VMS freeware,TK archive). >eE >At program level , the $PERSONA_* system services are the way to go,l# >see HELP system_service $PERSONA .r >o >qE On my system, a Compaq AlphaServer ES40 running OpenVMS V7.2-1, I cansD find no PERSONA program.  We currently have a SET UIC in some of ourE backup procedures to run COM files to shutdown and restart Oracle forp instance.  k  E I know that SET UIC " is obsolete and no longer supported." per help, C but I have not been able to find the replacement.  If someone could F point me to the documentation (possibly a DSN search string that would5 give usable results) it would be greatly appreciated.a   Thanks,3 Steve      Steven P. Underwood,DNRC Whitinsville,MAu StevenU@POBoxes.coml   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 04:04:27 GMTrL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")# Subject: Re: Set user similar to SU.8 Message-ID: <00A0B7C0.BADA33FA@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  c In article <7I6aIUP94UBM@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:hy >In article <dzEn8.249204$uv5.21651094@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "William Hymen" <t18_pilot@hotmail.spam.com> writes:a
 >> Hi all, >> k3 >> I have been administering our migration software 1 >> (similar to CMS) for 2 years. I really need tol. >> do a (S)et (U)user similar to Unix.  I have0 >> full system privs, and the blessing of my SA. >>  / >> Our software license manager needs to see meN$ >> as the other person "completely". > C >In other words, with no ability to switch back if the other person  >did not have that ability.e  I While that's a good point - but at least in HGLOGIN, what happens is thattI the other person can log off, and then your original process is restored.a   -- Alan     O ===============================================================================R0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056aM  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA  94309-0210 O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:27:59 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>m- Subject: Re: Shannon knows DEC -> CPQ -> ???? ' Message-ID: <3C9FD0DD.2F3A53D9@fsi.net>a   JF Mezei wrote:o >  > Tom Linden wrote:o > >s > > OK, but let MARY know. > & > Where's VERONICA when you need her ?  8 Probably on a date with REGgIE (I think that was it...).   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsy http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:59:18 GMTt% From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@insightbb.com>b- Subject: Re: Shannon knows DEC -> CPQ -> ???? 8 Message-ID: <6flv9uoid1ed4ogdpqgdltvrgpc8pteqr9@4ax.com>  , On Mon, 25 Mar 2002 01:19:41 -0500, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:n   >Tom Linden wrote: >>   >> OK, but let MARY know.y >o% >Where's VERONICA when you need her ?-  ) I can see this is all some wack-o SCHEME.0  1 Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaq-- (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)d   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:24:46 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>r3 Subject: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address)y, Message-ID: <3C9F797A.822CA1CC@videotron.ca>  L I read a message on a newsgroup that described a way to get a DOCSIS (cable)N modem to download its configuration file from the ethernet side instead of the cable side (ISP).d  M One of the first steps is to find the modem's IP address. The author mentionsa( using "snmpwalk" to find its IP address.  $ I know the modem's ethernet address.  A What does "snmpwalk" mean in VMS terms ? Is there an equivalent ?t   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:37:07 GMTh From: system@SendSpamHere.ORGn7 Subject: Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address)f0 Message-ID: <00A0B792.FF5FB90F@SendSpamHere.ORG>  \ In article <3C9F797A.822CA1CC@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:M >I read a message on a newsgroup that described a way to get a DOCSIS (cable) O >modem to download its configuration file from the ethernet side instead of theu >cable side (ISP). >(N >One of the first steps is to find the modem's IP address. The author mentions) >using "snmpwalk" to find its IP address.  >i% >I know the modem's ethernet address.  >jB >What does "snmpwalk" mean in VMS terms ? Is there an equivalent ?  ! Compaq's TCP/IP services for VMS:i  4 $ snmp_request <ip-address> <community> getnext -l 1    4 Can you provide the newsgroup message contents here?   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMe            tJ   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbesb   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 16:25:13 -0500u- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>n7 Subject: Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address)r, Message-ID: <3C9F95AB.14D55CCE@videotron.ca>   system@SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:6 > $ snmp_request <ip-address> <community> getnext -l 1 > 6 > Can you provide the newsgroup message contents here?  H Thanks. But rather hard to use the snmp_request if you don't know the ip address of the modem :-(  ^ http://online.securityfocus.com/archive/82/261454  , scroll down after the debate/disclaimers.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:10:54 GMTt From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG 7 Subject: Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address)d0 Message-ID: <00A0B7CA.0246B3CA@SendSpamHere.ORG>  \ In article <3C9F95AB.14D55CCE@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: >system@SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:a7 >> $ snmp_request <ip-address> <community> getnext -l 1) >> t7 >> Can you provide the newsgroup message contents here?c >tI >Thanks. But rather hard to use the snmp_request if you don't know the ip  >address of the modem :-(  > _ >http://online.securityfocus.com/archive/82/261454  , scroll down after the debate/disclaimers.w  # JF, in your initial post you wrote:   ( JF> I know the modem's ethernet address.  < So check your arp cache for the IP -> ethernet relationship.    I Also, the article you reference in the supplied URL states that the modem,% address is typically 192.168.100.1.  l --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMi            gJ   "And of course, I'm a genius, so people are naturally drawn to my fiery I   intellect.  Their admiration overwhelms their envy!" -- Calvin & Hobbest   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:05:53 -0500w- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 7 Subject: Re: SNMP question (finding modem's IP address)f, Message-ID: <3CA001AF.9A55D18C@videotron.ca>   system@SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:* > JF> I know the modem's ethernet address. > > > So check your arp cache for the IP -> ethernet relationship. > K > Also, the article you reference in the supplied URL states that the modemi% > address is typically 192.168.100.1.t   Arp remains empty.L I used ethermon to trace anything coming out of modem. After a minute or twoL or the modem trying over the coax (which is disconnected), it starts to sendL an arp REQUEST every 30 seconds. The arp request provides 127.0.0.2 for BOTHB requestor and requested IP adresses. Is there a meaning for this ?  I my local lan is set in a 10.0.0.* subnet. Would the VMS arp table contain2* entries for hosts not on the same subnet ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:06:35 GMTm2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)# Subject: Re: Where is Freeware 5.0? 3 Message-ID: <%yKn8.1466$fL6.28988@news.cpqcorp.net>t  F In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEFLEGAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote:j :z :Wasn't in 7.3 kit that I got.  J   Deja Vu.  You never answered the "was this a real distribution" questionN   from the earlier thread on this topic, thus I might infer that you received J   a "special" or custom kit from somewhere/someone.  Had this been a real J   kit, well, please contact the Compaq folks that process and ship orders %   and get yourself the complete kit. a  M   That said -- and as a result of the earlier discussion on this topic -- see K   below for the highlights of that discussion -- individual directories on aM   the Freeware website have been zipped for easy incremental download.  (LookeK   in the directory for a .zip of the same name as the directory.)  FreewarepI   Media is available for replicating and handling (cheap; US$20?  See thetI   FAQ for part numbers) or you can borrow the two-disk set from somebody nF   that got it and CD-R it...  Or you can contact whomever you got the '   distribution from, and get the disks.p     --  "  From: Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com)  Subject: FREEWARE 5.0 V  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  Date: 2002-02-01 12:17:58 PST n    D I didn't get one of these with my 7.3 distribution.  Is there a siteF from which it can be downloaded in its entirety?  The Compaq, AFAICT, % isn't suitable for such an endeavour.a  <  From: Mark\(unMASK\)Forsyth (forsytMhm@optAushoSme.com.aKu)  Subject: Re: FREEWARE 5.0    Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  Date: 2002-02-01 17:00:04 PST k   ..0  From: Hans Bachner (Hans.Bachner@altavista.net)  Subject: Re: FREEWARE 5.0    Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  Date: 2002-02-02 15:24:37 PST 4    " Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com) wrote:  F > I didn't get one of these with my 7.3 distribution.  Is there a siteH > from which it can be downloaded in its entirety?  The Compaq, AFAICT, ' > isn't suitable for such an endeavour.W  F What's wrong with http://www.openvms.compaq.com/freeware/freeware50/ ?   ..  3  From: Hoff Hoffman (hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam)e  Subject: Re: FREEWARE 5.0 s  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  Date: 2002-02-04 17:47:30 PST x    _ In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEBFEBAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:3E :I didn't get one of these with my 7.3 distribution.  Is there a siteoG :from which it can be downloaded in its entirety?  The Compaq, AFAICT,  & :isn't suitable for such an endeavour.  L   You either got your OpenVMS distribution kit informally (and incomplete), K   or there is a problem with the distribution kit you received.  In either uI   case, please contact the folks that provided you with your kit and ask w   for the missing disk(s).  L   Alternatively, use the part numbers in the OpenVMS FAQ and order yourself K   one or more copies of the Freeware CD-ROM disks -- the charge covers the  %   shipping and handling of the disks.e  K   Downloading two packed-full CD-ROM disks via FTP will take some time.  I rJ   was considering asking the webmaster to load the individual directories K   of the Freeware website into zips for ease of downloads, but I had never oM   even considered that somebody would want the whole thing, and would forego eL   acquiring the CD-ROM media -- that somebody would want to try to download N   the entire contents of the disks directly.  (Your level of budget, patience,J   and/or available network link bandwidth clearly differ(s) from mine. :-)  G   And before anybody asks, I do not have any OpenVMS Freeware disks to o   pass out.  Sorry.f   ..  "  From: Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com)  Subject: RE: FREEWARE 5.0 a  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  Date: 2002-02-02 19:12:22 PST      @ What's wrong with it is  that I want to download a single image,   ok so I am lazy.   ..  "  From: Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com)  Subject: RE: FREEWARE 5.0 a  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  Date: 2002-02-03 07:51:39 PST s    F I just wanted to download the entire CD.  I was aware of the site that you reference.   ..  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 11:49:11 -0800.# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>e# Subject: RE: Where is Freeware 5.0?t9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIOEMEEGAA.tom@kednos.com>o  B It was, and I did.  How's that for terse!  It came from CSA and it@ was missing, they are sending a new one.  Just out of curiosity,B why does it ship with the OS instead of the Software products Lib?   > -----Original Message-----; > From: Hoff Hoffman [mailto:hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam]-' > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 11:07 AM2 > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comr% > Subject: Re: Where is Freeware 5.0?a >m > H > In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEFLEGAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" > <tom@kednos.com> wrote:  > :w  > :Wasn't in 7.3 kit that I got. >GL >   Deja Vu.  You never answered the "was this a real distribution" questionB >   from the earlier thread on this topic, thus I might infer that > you receivedK >   a "special" or custom kit from somewhere/someone.  Had this been a real K >   kit, well, please contact the Compaq folks that process and ship orderss& >   and get yourself the complete kit. >FB >   That said -- and as a result of the earlier discussion on this > topic -- see= >   below for the highlights of that discussion -- individualu > directories on> >   the Freeware website have been zipped for easy incremental > download.  (LookC >   in the directory for a .zip of the same name as the directory.)c >  Freeware K >   Media is available for replicating and handling (cheap; US$20?  See thelJ >   FAQ for part numbers) or you can borrow the two-disk set from somebodyG >   that got it and CD-R it...  Or you can contact whomever you got thel) >   distribution from, and get the disks.  >r >   -- >a$ >  From: Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com) >  Subject: FREEWARE 5.0 >  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  >  Date: 2002-02-01 12:17:58 PST >a >tF > I didn't get one of these with my 7.3 distribution.  Is there a siteG > from which it can be downloaded in its entirety?  The Compaq, AFAICT,h' > isn't suitable for such an endeavour.e >n> >  From: Mark\(unMASK\)Forsyth (forsytMhm@optAushoSme.com.aKu) >  Subject: Re: FREEWARE 5.0 >  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  >  Date: 2002-02-01 17:00:04 PST >u > ...R2 >  From: Hans Bachner (Hans.Bachner@altavista.net) >  Subject: Re: FREEWARE 5.0 >  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  >  Date: 2002-02-02 15:24:37 PST >o > $ > Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com) wrote: >oH > > I didn't get one of these with my 7.3 distribution.  Is there a siteI > > from which it can be downloaded in its entirety?  The Compaq, AFAICT, ) > > isn't suitable for such an endeavour.y > H > What's wrong with http://www.openvms.compaq.com/freeware/freeware50/ ? >t > ...  >a5 >  From: Hoff Hoffman (hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam)- >  Subject: Re: FREEWARE 5.0 >  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  >  Date: 2002-02-04 17:47:30 PST >e >e@ > In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEBFEBAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom" > Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:G > :I didn't get one of these with my 7.3 distribution.  Is there a siteoH > :from which it can be downloaded in its entirety?  The Compaq, AFAICT,( > :isn't suitable for such an endeavour. >e@ >   You either got your OpenVMS distribution kit informally (and > incomplete),A >   or there is a problem with the distribution kit you received.0 > In eitherbJ >   case, please contact the folks that provided you with your kit and ask >   for the missing disk(s). >c> >   Alternatively, use the part numbers in the OpenVMS FAQ and > order yourselfA >   one or more copies of the Freeware CD-ROM disks -- the chargeS > covers the' >   shipping and handling of the disks.  >iC >   Downloading two packed-full CD-ROM disks via FTP will take some.
 > time.  IK >   was considering asking the webmaster to load the individual directorieseB >   of the Freeware website into zips for ease of downloads, but I > had neversA >   even considered that somebody would want the whole thing, ande > would foregoA >   acquiring the CD-ROM media -- that somebody would want to trya
 > to downloade> >   the entire contents of the disks directly.  (Your level of > budget, patience,yL >   and/or available network link bandwidth clearly differ(s) from mine. :-) >pH >   And before anybody asks, I do not have any OpenVMS Freeware disks to >   pass out.  Sorry.I >n > ...f >r$ >  From: Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com) >  Subject: RE: FREEWARE 5.0 >  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  >  Date: 2002-02-02 19:12:22 PST >n > B > What's wrong with it is  that I want to download a single image, >t > ok so I am lazy. >o > ...t >h$ >  From: Tom Linden (tom@kednos.com) >  Subject: RE: FREEWARE 5.0 >  Newsgroups: comp.os.vms  >  Date: 2002-02-03 07:51:39 PST >  > H > I just wanted to download the entire CD.  I was aware of the site that > you reference. >- > ...a > 2 >  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> > ----------------------------- 5 >       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ --o www.openvms.compaq.com*  --------------------------- pure personal# opinion ---------------------------sL    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 02:25:35 GMT_2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)# Subject: RE: Where is Freeware 5.0?a3 Message-ID: <z_Qn8.1481$fL6.29345@news.cpqcorp.net>a  _ In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIOEMEEGAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:gC :It was, and I did.  How's that for terse!  It came from CSA and it>A :was missing, they are sending a new one.  Just out of curiosity,iC :why does it ship with the OS instead of the Software products Lib?e  H   Because the OpenVMS operating system group paid for it to be created, K   and because the Freewarean Prime -- "Alpha Freewarean" being, of course, aJ   ambiguous -- maintaining the Freeware kit works for the OpenVMS group?  F   And because its regeneration is generally tied to the "dot" OpenVMS D   releases, and not the quarterly LP distributions?  (Elsewise, the J   Freewarean Prime would likely quickly head screaming off into the hills :   upon any threat of a quarterly update release schedule.)     :-)=  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.167 ************************