1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 01 May 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 240       Contents:# Re: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought # RE: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought # Re: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought  RE: Adding drives to an HSZ80 
 Re: AIM HACK? 
 Re: AIM HACK? 
 Re: AIM HACK? 
 Re: AIM HACK? 
 Re: AIM HACK? 
 Re: AIM HACK? 	 ALPHASCAN 
 Re: ALPHASCAN 
 Re: ALPHASCAN  Re: Another VMS win...& Re: Anticipating the HP court decision& Re: Anticipating the HP court decision& Re: Anticipating the HP court decision& Re: Anticipating the HP court decision& Re: Anticipating the HP court decision Re: BACKUP Question  Re: BACKUP Question 6 Re: Can I delete those *.EXE_OLD files on system disk?6 Re: Can I delete those *.EXE_OLD files on system disk?6 Re: Can I delete those *.EXE_OLD files on system disk?) Cross linking (was: Re: VMS SCAN product) - RE: Cross linking (was: Re: VMS SCAN product) + Re: DCL labels out of scope after ON ERROR? + Re: DCL labels out of scope after ON ERROR? + Re: DCL labels out of scope after ON ERROR?   Re: DCPS Help Required..........  Re: DCPS Help Required..........  Re: DCPS Help Required..........  Re: DCPS Help Required..........  Re: DCPS Help Required..........  Re: DCPS Help Required..........: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows DS10L's for USD995 - May !!!!  Re: exceed escape characters Re: exceed escape characters  Re: Fix for EDT emulation in EVE Fw: process quota exceeded  ?  Re: Gold key Re: HP vote cleared  Re: HP vote cleared - Re: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium!  Re: Itanium troubles Re: Itanium troubles Re: Itanium troubles0 Judge backs HP; Hewlett concedes (One more take) license question Re: license question7 Re: New HPS Times - You ARE the weakest link, Good bye! 7 Re: New HPS Times - You ARE the weakest link, Good bye! 7 Re: New HPS Times - You ARE the weakest link, Good bye!  Re: process quota exceeded  ? P Re: put up or shut up (was: RE: AMD To Announce Microsoft Support For   New Chip9 Re: Reducing size of incremental backup - will this work? 9 Re: Reducing size of incremental backup - will this work? , Re: removing extra carriage return/line feed, Re: removing extra carriage return/line feed% Re: Running CSWS 1.2 on Alpha VMS 7.2 # SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC ' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC P Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no  merger!)* Re: UK/EU OpenVMS job market: non-existant* Re: UK/EU OpenVMS job market: non-existant" URGENT to all Info-VAX subscribers" Re: VMS 6.2 file ownership problem( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( RE: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( RE: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company( Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company VMS Job Opportunities  Re: VMS SCAN product Re: VMS SCAN product Re: VMS SCAN product4 VMSBACKUP on Unix/Linux -  VAX / VMS tape archives ? Re: Whining about HPS Times   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 1 May 02 12:17:03 +0200 ) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) , Subject: Re: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought) Message-ID: <9FPArrwK5c8B@elias.decus.ch>   g In article <c113b52c.0204300757.2656ddb6@posting.google.com>, jbecker@ui.urban.org (Jim Becker) writes: E > I'm looking for sage advice, useful warnings, etc. on the following  > situation. > C > Currently, I have an "AlphaServer 4100 5/533 4MB" running OpenVMS G > V6.2-1H3. I'm about to buy an AlphaServer ES45, which will be running  > 7.3. > H > I'd like to cluster them for one primary reason: disk sharing. The twoG > nodes will be largely independent of each other -- separate purposes, G > separate software, separate storage, separate users -- but there will D > be some need for tossing files back and forth. For the application@ > that needs to do this, life will be FAR easier if crossing theF > boundary from one box to the other is transparent, hence clustering. > $ > However, here's the basic problem:6 > - A 6.2/7.3 mix doesn't even have migration support.. > - The minimum OS version for an ES45 is 7.3.E > - The 4100 is locked into 6.2-1H3 because of the one application it H > will carry after I migrate everything else to the ES45. The app vendor. > won't budge; we fought that battle and lost. > < > So either a) I run an unsupported mixed two-node cluster,   ? Please don't. The last unsupported mixed version cluster I came @ across was subject to losing files. (they were there, but needed+ an ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR to find them - yuk).   	 > or b) I E > break a critical, problem-child application, thereby requiring some C > sort of highly unwelcome Rube Goldberg solution to get around the  > breakage.  > F > I prefer the first approach (lesser of two evils), so I'm hoping forH > your sage advice on how to minimize difficulties of a mixed cluster of > 7.3 and 6.2-1H3. >  DECnet would be better. + NFS might also provide a suitable solution.   ! Both methods should be supported.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 06:04:07 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> , Subject: RE: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEAOEOAA.tom@kednos.com>   D Well, I guess I am just dumb and lucky because the following has run7 for a number of years with the addtion of 7.3 last year G View of Cluster from system ID 2055  node: FREJA             1-MAY-2002  06:05:07 +-------------------+---------+  |      SYSTEMS      | MEMBERS |  +--------+----------+---------+  |  NODE  | SOFTWARE |  STATUS |  +--------+----------+---------+  | FREJA  | VMS V7.3 | MEMBER  |  | ODIN   | VMS V7.1 | MEMBER  |  | HERMES | VMS V7.1 | MEMBER  |  | NORNS  | VMS V6.2 | MEMBER  |  +--------+----------+---------+    >-----Original Message----- 1 >From: Paul Sture [mailto:p_sture@elias.decus.ch] & >Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 3:17 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com- >Subject: Re: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought  >  > > >In article <c113b52c.0204300757.2656ddb6@posting.google.com>,* >jbecker@ui.urban.org (Jim Becker) writes:F >> I'm looking for sage advice, useful warnings, etc. on the following
 >> situation.  >>D >> Currently, I have an "AlphaServer 4100 5/533 4MB" running OpenVMSH >> V6.2-1H3. I'm about to buy an AlphaServer ES45, which will be running >> 7.3.  >>I >> I'd like to cluster them for one primary reason: disk sharing. The two H >> nodes will be largely independent of each other -- separate purposes,H >> separate software, separate storage, separate users -- but there willE >> be some need for tossing files back and forth. For the application A >> that needs to do this, life will be FAR easier if crossing the G >> boundary from one box to the other is transparent, hence clustering.  >>% >> However, here's the basic problem: 7 >> - A 6.2/7.3 mix doesn't even have migration support. / >> - The minimum OS version for an ES45 is 7.3. F >> - The 4100 is locked into 6.2-1H3 because of the one application itI >> will carry after I migrate everything else to the ES45. The app vendor / >> won't budge; we fought that battle and lost.  >>< >> So either a) I run an unsupported mixed two-node cluster, > @ >Please don't. The last unsupported mixed version cluster I cameA >across was subject to losing files. (they were there, but needed , >an ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR to find them - yuk). > 
 >> or b) IF >> break a critical, problem-child application, thereby requiring someD >> sort of highly unwelcome Rube Goldberg solution to get around the >> breakage. >>G >> I prefer the first approach (lesser of two evils), so I'm hoping for I >> your sage advice on how to minimize difficulties of a mixed cluster of  >> 7.3 and 6.2-1H3.  >> >DECnet would be better., >NFS might also provide a suitable solution. > " >Both methods should be supported. >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). A >Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 4/19/2002  >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 4/19/2002   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 11:39:57 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> , Subject: Re: 6.2/7.3 Cluster - Advice Sought$ Message-ID: <3cd00cdf$1@news.si.com>  # >However, here's the basic problem: 5 >- A 6.2/7.3 mix doesn't even have migration support. - >- The minimum OS version for an ES45 is 7.3. D >- The 4100 is locked into 6.2-1H3 because of the one application itG >will carry after I migrate everything else to the ES45. The app vendor - >won't budge; we fought that battle and lost.   I Just because the vendor won't produce a V7.3-generated image doesn't mean J the software won't run on V7.3.  You should try it.  You may be pleasantly
 surprised. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com = 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 09:54:58 -0400* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>& Subject: RE: Adding drives to an HSZ80- Message-ID: <0033000062241003000002L032*@MHS>    =0AHe is recalling HSZ50s.  * I think that the docs said that before you' swapped disks, you pushed the button to  "quiesce the bus".  * The word always made me think of something) that the driver of a school bus does on a  regular basis.  + The level of activity/noise may decrease to % a very, very low level but it's never  **totally** silent or still.   :^)    WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET & Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 10:31 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET& Subject: RE: Adding drives to an HSZ80     John, 6      No buttons to press ....  just plug the drives in>      one at a time. Its a good idea to wait for each drive you:      plug in to finish its spin-up although not necessary.  5      Once the drives are in place just " RUN CONFIG " 2      and the drives will be added into the config.  6      Then you should be able to "SHOW DEVICE " and the8      drives will be seen but not assigned to any logical      "container".   1      You can then stripe, raid or "jbod" them and       create a suitable unit #.   Regards, John Welsh. I =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= I =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=  =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D     -----Original Message-----/ From: Jan-Erik S=F6derholm [mailto:aaa@aaa.com] & Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 11:36 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com & Subject: Re: Adding drives to an HSZ80    = AFAIK, there should be this "add/remove" buttons on the HS*80 @ series also. One for each SCSI bus. I setup a HSZ80 about a year= ago, and I'm positive there is a button to press to remove or : add disks. Shouldn't be hard to find just by loking at it.   Jan-Erik S=F6derholm.    John Santos wrote: >  > Hi, all -  > @ > (On HSJ40/50's, you were supposed to press the port button forC > the bus and it would blink for about 30 seconds, while suspending C > all activity, and you could safely install, remove, or swap disks & > while the light continued blinking.) >=   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 08:25:21 -0000 = From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>  Subject: Re: AIM HACK?6 Message-ID: <20020501082521.21732.qmail@gacracker.org>  D On 30 Apr 2002, BaltimorePlayboy@yahoo.com (BaltimorePlayboy) wrote:F >Man... first of all, I'm new to this whole usenet thing. Threads, andE >newsgroups and flaming, and all that shit have NO meaning to me. I'm D >new. So if you dont have the answer to my questions, or some adviceG >for a newbie, dont turn it into a cocksucker chatroom for you and your F >pussy friends to try to make fun of someone less experienced. Yes I'mB >talking to you. FUCK YOU. And since I dont know all the rules andB >stuff, if I get in trouble for saying that, then oh well, I'll goE >elsewhere. Anyone that can help me I appreciate it. Even if you just @ >tell me where I should post this thread to in order to get moreF >results from ADULTS and not kids who have nothing better to do. Holla >Back.   Translation...  F "I am a clueless idiot who doesn't even know what Usenet is about, andD don't care that the name of the newsgroup seems inappropriate for myH question. I hate you all because you won't help me, and just to prove it I'll call you a bunch of kids."   E Ok "playboy", you don't know what a flame is? Well, it's were you get B insulted for being stupid, arrogant, unpleasant, or just downrightI annoying. Your ill-mannered, toilet-mouthed reply makes you fair game for E every insult you get. If you want help you should use the grey matter G between your ears to figure out a polite way to ask, and an appropriate = place to ask. It's patently obvious to everyone here that the H aforementioned organ has atrophied beyond recovery and you might as well= have a pencil between your ears to stop your head collapsing.   J For your information, this is a technical newgroup populated by people whoE manage serious computer systems, it has nothing whatsoever to do with K Windows or Windows applications. I don't know how you managed to stumble in K here, hell! I don't even know how you managed to get on the internet in the B first place because you obviously have the IQ of a rotting carrot.  J I'm sure that Comcast would be embarassed to know that they'd let an idiotG like you loose with a cable modem, but perhaps everyone in Essex, MD is I just as stupid as you - I really don't know and don't care. However, from H your posts into this newsgroup I can see precisely why more knowlegeableG people would choose to kick you off chatrooms. You're lucky they didn't 1 hack your system and delete your porn collection.     B [Apologies to c.o.v. regulars, but I feel better for saying that.]     Doc. --  6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.net    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 19:54:52 +0010 % From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au  Subject: Re: AIM HACK?5 Message-ID: <01KH84MDSFDE000823@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>   C >[Apologies to c.o.v. regulars, but I feel better for saying that.]   K Probably no apologies are required.  It's probably only a few of we idiots   still reading this :-)  > This sort of thing reminds me of walking up to work in Sydney.  M Him: "Excuse me, sir, but could you lend me a cigarette?" [I like the "lend"]   ( Me: Shake of head, or just keep walking.   Him: "You !!**!!***."    Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 11:32:55 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>  Subject: Re: AIM HACK?8 Message-ID: <rvgvcukjrtoit8tgrhq689boj3m6hb3c9t@4ax.com>  9 On 30 Apr 2002 13:50:20 -0700, BaltimorePlayboy@yahoo.com  (BaltimorePlayboy) wrote:   F >Man... first of all, I'm new to this whole usenet thing. Threads, andE >newsgroups and flaming, and all that shit have NO meaning to me. I'm D >new. So if you dont have the answer to my questions, or some adviceG >for a newbie, dont turn it into a cocksucker chatroom for you and yourO  ) Danger Will Robinson --- Troll Alert !!!!   F >pussy friends to try to make fun of someone less experienced. Yes I'mB >talking to you. FUCK YOU. And since I dont know all the rules andB >stuff, if I get in trouble for saying that, then oh well, I'll goE >elsewhere. Anyone that can help me I appreciate it. Even if you justS@ >tell me where I should post this thread to in order to get moreF >results from ADULTS and not kids who have nothing better to do. Holla >Back.   -- Alan   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 11:40:12 -0000H= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>e Subject: Re: AIM HACK?4 Message-ID: <BaltimorePlayboy.isStoopid@nowhere.nil>  ; On Wed, 01 May 2002, paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au wrote:DD >>[Apologies to c.o.v. regulars, but I feel better for saying that.] >rL >Probably no apologies are required.  It's probably only a few of we idiots  >still reading this :-)o >o? >This sort of thing reminds me of walking up to work in Sydney.R > N >Him: "Excuse me, sir, but could you lend me a cigarette?" [I like the "lend"] > ) >Me: Shake of head, or just keep walking.. >. >Him: "You !!**!!***."  I Yes, you get that sort of ignorance all over the world. The idiot we haveyI here though is certainly spreading his unpleasantness far and wide (I wass+ bored, I looked in google). He's posted to:-  9 alt.2600 asking really stupid questions about ISO and DVD @ formats/compression. You can bet he got a rough reception there.  I alt.sex.phone (also crossposted to alt.2600.phreakz & alt.dss.hack) whereo6 he asked about getting fraudulent phone calling cards.  I alt.sex.passwords where he is asking for illegally obtained logins to web  sites.   and,  5 comp.lang.c++ where he just made himself look stupid.u  @ This does of course leave me wondering why on Earth he picked on# comp.os.vms to ask for an AIM hack.P     Doc. -- R6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.netk   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 07:12:54 -0700E% From: Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com>  Subject: Re: AIM HACK?) Message-ID: <3CCFF7E6.DE01DBC4@rdrop.com>k   "Doc.Cypher" wrote:f > B > This does of course leave me wondering why on Earth he picked on% > comp.os.vms to ask for an AIM hack.g  F Almost by definition, if he's using AIM, he's an AOLuser.  You can get4 an AIM login separately, but it does require a clue.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:41:36 -0400 From: William_Bochnik@acml.com Subject: Re: AIM HACK?> Message-ID: <OF00AF5DF2.3EBDA186-ON85256BAC.0050AA8C@acml.com>  > or he was looking for EXPERT advice, rather than going to some Microsoft weenie group :-)      g                                                                                                        og                       Dean Woodward                                                                    eg                       <deanw@rdrop.com                To:  Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                        g                       >                               cc:                                              eg                                                Subject: Re: AIM HACK?                                   g                       05/01/2002 10:12                                                                  g                       AM                                                                               og                       Please respond                                                                    g                       to Dean Woodward                                                                 -g                       <deanw@rdrop.com                                                                 .g                       >                                                                                ug                                                                                                         g                                                                                                        r       "Doc.Cypher" wrote:e >1? > This does of course leave me wondering why on Earth he pickedl on% > comp.os.vms to ask for an AIM hack..  > Almost by definition, if he's using AIM, he's an AOLuser.  You can gete4 an AIM login separately, but it does require a clue.               The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and confidential information and is intended only for theo use of the person(s) name above.  If you are not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this{ message to the intended recipient, any review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this communication is strictlyp prohibited.  If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender immediately by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:04:57 GMT " From: "Arie" <Arie150@hotmail.com> Subject: ALPHASCAN; Message-ID: <dCSz8.436961$Fw2.11044511@nlnews00.chello.com>t  K We are in the process of migrating VAXSCAN to Alpha (ALPHASCAN). ApparentlyeG there is a wider interest in this product than just the customer we arebD working for right now. Please let me know when you are interested in$ ALPHASCAN as a ready to use product.  5 (FYI we are the people that created the VAX-emulator)   
 Arie de Grootr Arie.deGroot@softresint.comi    > "Lock Horsburgh" <lock@lohmacs.fsnet.co.uk> schreef in bericht( news:aalnvg$7s7$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...L > Once upon a time we had a DEC product called SCAN, which was used to parseG > input text and generate different outputs - like code generation, and-( > language translations from Basic to C. >r* > We understand this product is long dead. >:L > Does anyone remember the package, and does anyone have any recommendationsI > for other tools to do this kind of thing, whether on VMS or UNIX or PC?i >h >r > Lock.  > Lock.  >r >i > ---a( > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A > Version: 6.0.336 / Virus Database: 188 - Release Date: 11/03/02R >  >-   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:52:34 -0400% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>S Subject: Re: ALPHASCAN/ Message-ID: <ud009k6pf6bi32@news.supernews.com>   G Are you talking about VAX Scan the language or VAXScan the interface to- PLCs?   - "Arie" <Arie150@hotmail.com> wrote in messagem5 news:dCSz8.436961$Fw2.11044511@nlnews00.chello.com...1B > We are in the process of migrating VAXSCAN to Alpha (ALPHASCAN).
 ApparentlyI > there is a wider interest in this product than just the customer we areeF > working for right now. Please let me know when you are interested in& > ALPHASCAN as a ready to use product. >l7 > (FYI we are the people that created the VAX-emulator)a >v > Arie de Groot" > Arie.deGroot@softresint.comI >a >t@ > "Lock Horsburgh" <lock@lohmacs.fsnet.co.uk> schreef in bericht* > news:aalnvg$7s7$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...H > > Once upon a time we had a DEC product called SCAN, which was used to parserI > > input text and generate different outputs - like code generation, ande* > > language translations from Basic to C. > > , > > We understand this product is long dead. > > > > > Does anyone remember the package, and does anyone have any recommendationsbK > > for other tools to do this kind of thing, whether on VMS or UNIX or PC?e > >c > >l	 > > Lock.A	 > > Lock.x > >n > >e > > ---g* > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.> > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).C > > Version: 6.0.336 / Virus Database: 188 - Release Date: 11/03/02i > >s > >t >E >.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:17:14 GMT>3 From: "Arie de Groot" <arie.degroot@softresint.com>s Subject: Re: ALPHASCAN; Message-ID: <_FTz8.437135$Fw2.11059360@nlnews00.chello.com>a  & Apologies for the confusion I created.  $ I was referring to the SCAN language   Rgrds,   Arie arie.degroot@softresint.coma www.softresint.com  2 "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> schreef in bericht) news:ud009k6pf6bi32@news.supernews.com...eI > Are you talking about VAX Scan the language or VAXScan the interface tow > PLCs?  >I/ > "Arie" <Arie150@hotmail.com> wrote in messagei7 > news:dCSz8.436961$Fw2.11044511@nlnews00.chello.com...1D > > We are in the process of migrating VAXSCAN to Alpha (ALPHASCAN). > ApparentlyK > > there is a wider interest in this product than just the customer we areiH > > working for right now. Please let me know when you are interested in( > > ALPHASCAN as a ready to use product. > >s9 > > (FYI we are the people that created the VAX-emulator)r > >e > > Arie de Groota > > Arie.deGroot@softresint.como > >m > >eB > > "Lock Horsburgh" <lock@lohmacs.fsnet.co.uk> schreef in bericht, > > news:aalnvg$7s7$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...J > > > Once upon a time we had a DEC product called SCAN, which was used to > parse K > > > input text and generate different outputs - like code generation, and., > > > language translations from Basic to C. > > >2. > > > We understand this product is long dead. > > >m@ > > > Does anyone remember the package, and does anyone have any > recommendations I > > > for other tools to do this kind of thing, whether on VMS or UNIX orE PC?T > > >v > > >  > > > Lock.  > > > Lock.t > > >  > > >t	 > > > ---b, > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.@ > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).E > > > Version: 6.0.336 / Virus Database: 188 - Release Date: 11/03/02  > > >  > > >n > >i > >_ >a >t   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 02 12:43:09 +0200v) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)d Subject: Re: Another VMS win...n) Message-ID: <dmgkKU+Dfgds@elias.decus.ch>"  a In article <cbjgSg3I9kt1@eisner.encompasserve.org>, kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt) writes:-A > Took me a while to find this press release, but here is anotherB> > win for VMS on Alpha.  Even though the press release doesn't? > mention the OS, since I installed it I can vouch for the factH, > that the POSIT trading system runs on VMS. > < > http://www.tse.com/en/mediaNews/newsreleases/news2265.html  8 There's also a link to this from http://www.openvms.org/   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 11:27:15 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> / Subject: Re: Anticipating the HP court decision $ Message-ID: <3cd009e4$1@news.si.com>   Bill Todd prognosticates:t  K >I think the judge will order a new shareholder vote and give Carly & Co. a, >stern slap on the wrist.a  B Well, now we know how poorly this prognostication missed the mark. -- tA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.coms= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventl< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 12:04:06 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>"/ Subject: Re: Anticipating the HP court decisiona$ Message-ID: <3cd01287$1@news.si.com>  C >Well, now we know how poorly this prognostication missed the mark.3    I should have said "how widely". -- 3A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comaA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.come= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:48:56 GMTt1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>i/ Subject: Re: Anticipating the HP court decisioni; Message-ID: <I7Uz8.60332$%s3.23768382@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>   F "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote in message news:3cd009e4$1@news.si.com... > Bill Todd prognosticates:s >eK > >I think the judge will order a new shareholder vote and give Carly & Co.  ah > >stern slap on the wrist.i >)D > Well, now we know how poorly this prognostication missed the mark.  H Yeah, it seems to be one o' those Gartner "Probability Factor" thingies.  J On the other hand, there's still the matter of the SEC and the US District Court to be dealt with...b  J And a stern slap on the wrist of Carly and Co. would be a most welcome pat on the back for IBM and Sun!   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 12:43:54 -0400  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com/ Subject: Re: Anticipating the HP court decisioni4 Message-ID: <C2256BAC.005AEA6C.00@jklh22.valmet.com>  P Actually, Brian, it greatly missed the mark. It hit the mark not poorly, but not at all.  ;-)        = tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com on 05/01/2002 11:27:15 AMr  5 Please respond to tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com    To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.comc/ cc:    (bcc: Norm Raphael/WOR/Automation/METSO)l0 Subject:  Re: Anticipating the HP court decision       Bill Todd prognosticates:a  K >I think the judge will order a new shareholder vote and give Carly & Co. ai >stern slap on the wrist.a  B Well, now we know how poorly this prognostication missed the mark. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.coml= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 17:30:44 GMTl* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>/ Subject: Re: Anticipating the HP court decisiont@ Message-ID: <8DVz8.15273$q8.2276377@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  F "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote in message news:3cd009e4$1@news.si.com... > Bill Todd prognosticates:g > K > >I think the judge will order a new shareholder vote and give Carly & Co.  aa > >stern slap on the wrist.i >aD > Well, now we know how poorly this prognostication missed the mark.  I Yup.  I probably should stick to more technical matters (such as Compaq'soE unbelievable screw-up with Alpha - though of course since we're stilluF waiting for McKinley benchmarks that's still up in the air), given how8 out-of-step I seem to be with contemporary real-politik.  I On the other hand, I didn't notice you (or Terry) commenting *before* the  result was known...k   - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 05:23:52 -0700e. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) Subject: Re: BACKUP Question= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0205010423.197fbceb@posting.google.com>   s SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) wrote in message news:<343f30ae.0204301739.6bcdc724@posting.google.com>...md > lewis@PROBE.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) wrote in message news:<aan3et$lqd$1@newslocal.mitre.org>... > > Hauser <Hauser@Fauske.com> writes in article <4E1C1F1AC66D3743BC95ACBC8DA96726731274@server.FAUSKE.COM> dated Tue, 30 Apr 2002 15:38:39 -0500:4 > > >$ backup/record/fast/ignore=(interlock,label) - > > > /media_format=compact - 2 > > > /list=$7$dka0:[hauser.backup]$1$DKA200.LIS -$ > > > /since=backup/modified/noinc - > > >  $1$DKA200:[*...] -   > > >  DS10A$MKA600:29APR02.USR4 > >  [quoted material snipped]f > > P > > I had a similar problem once.  Something about normal BACKUP not setting theN > > modification date on the top level directory [000000]000000.DIR.  Try this
 > > one time:  >  > F > This appears to be exactly the problem. The backup date field in the? > problem directory is <No backup recorded>. This directory was:@ > apparently copied to the disk after the last image backup, andG > apparently the incremental backups don't update the backup date fieldoH > on the .DIR file. And maybe this file's backup date field is not beingB > updated because the last image backup never saw it (you said youE > copied it to that disk since) and didn't itself update it. So maybetE > the incremental realizes that and leaves the field alone to be suretG > you always copy stuff from there, because BACKUP then knows that somepG > files from that directory may not ever otherwise end up on your tapeslC > and thereby never make it back to disk in the event of a restore.fD > Yeah, that's what happened, maybe. VMS Engineering really wants toH > make sure you don't miss any data! But then the incremental could justD > copy everything in that directory and update the backup date field > anyway. Whatever.h  F Uh, never mind most of the above. What you did should not be differentF from simply creating a new directory via CREATE/DIRECTORY which shouldE be handled normally by BACKUP. (I guess I need to catch up on sleep!)s   [more snipped]   Just try this:  h3 >     $ BACKUP/RECORD $1$DKA200:[000000]ELICSON.DIR. > NL:A.B/SAVE_SET/NOCRC/GROUP=0t > ; > since that's the only misbehaving directory in this case.a >  > [rest of quote snipped]   s Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman " afeldman ATSKI gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 08:33:53 -0500  From: briggs@encompasserve.org Subject: Re: BACKUP Question3 Message-ID: <aP5qxxmPeELS@eisner.encompasserve.org>i  n In article <343f30ae.0204301739.6bcdc724@posting.google.com>, SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) writes:d > lewis@PROBE.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) wrote in message news:<aan3et$lqd$1@newslocal.mitre.org>...O >> I had a similar problem once.  Something about normal BACKUP not setting theoM >> modification date on the top level directory [000000]000000.DIR.  Try this  >> one time: > F > This appears to be exactly the problem. The backup date field in the? > problem directory is <No backup recorded>. This directory wasg@ > apparently copied to the disk after the last image backup, andG > apparently the incremental backups don't update the backup date fieldv > on the .DIR file.   B The incremental backup command in this case (which I snipped) used# a file specification of [*...]*.*;*   : That file specification does not match [000000]problem.dir  A Because the problem directory was not mentioned explicitly in the-D source file specification, it does not get its backup date recorded.  A That's one reason that a lot of folks use [000000...] as a sourcerI file specification.  It matches the top level directory files themselves.e   	John Briggs   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 02 12:24:07 +0200 ) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)s? Subject: Re: Can I delete those *.EXE_OLD files on system disk?c) Message-ID: <iHzE1vtkwa3X@elias.decus.ch>a  S In article <3CCEC3A4.10409@bigfoot.com>, Martyn <mpattKNICKERS@bigfoot.com> writes:C! > Wilson Guerrero-Coltters wrote:6 >  >>Hi everybody,a >>G >>Well, we have an alpha DS10, OpenVMS 7.2-1 I want to backup my systemi& >>disk using the following combination? >>LD devices+ BACKUP+FTP to PC+burn to CDs using Nero, whatever A >>You may ask why bother, well we don't have a tape drive on this  >>machine, don't ask :-)A >>The process is very straightforward, and I successfully tested.dA >>My problem is that at present my system disk occupies 3 CDs and % >>I would like to reduce it to 2 CDs. D >>During the backups I notice that on the system disk there are many >>files like these:  >>A >>[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.SYSEXE]SYSMAN.EXE;1                       389    >>7-DEC-2000 01:46@ >>[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.SYSEXE]SYSMAN.EXE_OLD;2                   389  >>29-DEC-1999 04:06 @ >>[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.SYSEXE]SYSMAN.EXE_OLD;1                   387  >>28-MAY-1999 23:23  >>: >>May I assume that those .EXE_OLD are created by patches?$ >>Can I delete securely those files? >> >>Thanks in advance, >>	 >>Wilson.  >>J > I doubt that they're created by patches, more likely they're created by F > the person doing the installations as a safety copy. You can almost H > certainly get rid of them (espescially if you've got a backup of them  > somewhere just in case). > O No! They are indeed created by the PRODUCT INSTALL facility as backups, so that O the PRODUCT REMOVE command can be subsequently used to remove ECO kits if needs  be.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 12:35:52 +0200 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> ? Subject: Re: Can I delete those *.EXE_OLD files on system disk?n' Message-ID: <3CCFC508.C03E0CE7@aaa.com>   < Note that there is a number of other alternatives besides of8 always backing up the *.EXE_OLD files and deleting them. Some of them could be :    1. Set them /NOBACKUP.3 2. Move them to another disk and set them /NOBACKUPi) 3. /EXCLUDE them from the BACKUP command.o> 4. Copy only the *.EXE_OLD to a separate CD (and delete them).   Jan-Erik Sderholm.e     Wilson Guerrero-Coltters wrote:  >  > Hi,g7 > Thank you to all the people who reply to my question.i7 > This newsgroup has proved to be very useful during myl > learning years of OpenVMS. > 6 > As a last comment, I will keep those .EXE_OLD files.> > One more CD is a minimum detail compared to a reinstallation! > of OpenVMS in case of problems.- >  > Best regards,a > 	 > Wilson.  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:01:59 GMTS8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)? Subject: Re: Can I delete those *.EXE_OLD files on system disk?e9 Message-ID: <rzSz8.10$fS1.173180@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>u  * In article <iHzE1vtkwa3X@elias.decus.ch>, + p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) writes:S   [_OLD files]  H >... They are indeed created by the PRODUCT INSTALL facility as backups,   Corect.o  G >so that the PRODUCT REMOVE command can be subsequently used to remove c >ECO kits if needs be.  e Wrong.  > PRODUCT REMOVE works only on PRODUCTS, not PATCHES (ECO kits).  E Once the _OLD files are created, the PCSI utility has nothing more tofJ do with them.  In some cases the CAN be used to "manually" backout changes6 made by a patch kit, but not with any PRODUCT command.  K Even the code that deletes _OLD files (in OpenVMS V7.3 and higher versions)oH is straight DCL -- although it does run within an EXECUTE procedure that is part of a PRODUCT INSTALL.    -- iK     Charlie Hammond -- Compaq Computer Corporation -- Pompano Beach  FL USAuH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 11:36:28 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>p2 Subject: Cross linking (was: Re: VMS SCAN product)$ Message-ID: <3cd00c0d$1@news.si.com>  F >   I was under the impression that the currently shipping versions of' >   LINK include cross link capability.   L I've wondered about that myself.  On a VAX, if I use the /ALPHA qualifier toA the LINK command, does it produce an Alpha image from VAX object?  --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comeA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com = 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 08:41:10 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 6 Subject: RE: Cross linking (was: Re: VMS SCAN product)9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIMEBFEOAA.tom@kednos.com>.   HERMES> help link/alphah   LINK     /ALPHA  F      Directs the linker to produce an OpenVMS Alpha image. The defaultD      action, when neither /ALPHA nor /VAX is specified, is to createC      an OpenVMS VAX image on an OpenVMS VAX system and to create an 4      OpenVMS Alpha image on an OpenVMS Alpha system.  C Of course, this only has meaning if the objects you are linking are C alpha code, i.e. they resulted from a cross-compile.  I'm not aware " of any commercial cross-compilers.     >-----Original Message-----aA >From: Brian Tillman [mailto:tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com]t& >Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 8:36 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com3 >Subject: Cross linking (was: Re: VMS SCAN product)o >  >aG >>   I was under the impression that the currently shipping versions ofo( >>   LINK include cross link capability. >hA >I've wondered about that myself.  On a VAX, if I use the /ALPHA @
 >qualifier tocB >the LINK command, does it produce an Alpha image from VAX object? >--rB >Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comB >Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com> >3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent= >Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"h9 >       This opinion doesn't represent that of my companye >  >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.A; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).eA >Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 4/19/2002e >G ---s& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 4/19/2002   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 06:41:37 GMT - From: djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall)e4 Subject: Re: DCL labels out of scope after ON ERROR?5 Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-smBdKgej71W1@localhost>t  5 On Wed, 1 May 2002 02:03:07 UTC, "David J. Dachtera" c <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:   > Syltrem wrote: > > L > > > GOTO'ing _back_ to before the IF, definitely was a problem. Whether itL > > > is still, I don't know, because after that expererience, I always jump
 > > (snip) > > J > > When IF..THEN..ELSE...ENDIF was first introduced I remember there were > > problems with GOTOs.M > > Not anymore. Actually, the problem didn`t last very long and was probably 3 > > fixed in the next minor release (was it 6.1 ?).  >   > It's still bad practice, IMHO. >   D And still less than a year since our lowest supported version moved  from 5.5-4 to 6.2 :-)e   -- " Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 06:41:38 GMTr- From: djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall)h4 Subject: Re: DCL labels out of scope after ON ERROR?5 Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-JtbdKPJixvEd@localhost>t  B On Tue, 30 Apr 2002 18:45:29 UTC, paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au  wrote:   > Dave Weatherall wrote: <Biggish snip> >eB > >	x = 0		! this does nothing more restore sanity to DCL - why I  > >dunno > >t > M > In DCL, Fortran, C and PL/I codes I have inherited, I have often seen such 2L > comments.  I don't believe they have any merit excepting for very obscure P > buried code.  I assume that you are quoting DCL, so my conjecture is that way K > down in a large convoluted procedure symbol X is used irreverently.  The lP > solution was not to find what X did (or more probably not do), but to obscure  > the procedure even more. > J > Apologies to the original authors of that code, there could have been a B > significance, but obscured in the mists of time and then hidden.   Hi PaddyB                     that's the point, I am the original author :-)  F ISTR, and its nearly 10 years ago, that I'd had a long day, trying to E get this procedure working. DCL always went barmy in this subroutine -B and I couldn't see where or why. I was aware of the GOTO/IF/ENDIF F quirks and had gone through every construct looking for such problems.D  Eventually I added the line shown above and it worked. I never did F figure out why. Out of curiosity, I could try taking it out and see ifA it's any better now under V6,2. However, 'never change a running n4 system' wins - even if its only to save a Q/A cycle.  C x definitely isn't used anywhere else. X is a symbol/variable/name  / that I normally use _only_ as absolute scratch.    -- 2 Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 19:17:08 +0010m% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au 4 Subject: Re: DCL labels out of scope after ON ERROR?5 Message-ID: <01KH83AMIP5U00081C@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>c  M Dave Weatherall wrote [I,ve snipped my comments, as the sense should come -- i& if not check the thread in Google :-)]  G >ISTR, and its nearly 10 years ago, that I'd had a long day, trying to .F >get this procedure working. DCL always went barmy in this subroutine C >and I couldn't see where or why. I was aware of the GOTO/IF/ENDIF iG >quirks and had gone through every construct looking for such problems.mE > Eventually I added the line shown above and it worked. I never did tG >figure out why. Out of curiosity, I could try taking it out and see ifeB >it's any better now under V6,2. However, 'never change a running 5 >system' wins - even if its only to save a Q/A cycle.t >bD >x definitely isn't used anywhere else. X is a symbol/variable/name 0 >that I normally use _only_ as absolute scratch.   Dave,   0 This may be going slightly OT from the original.  L I note that other respondents have commented that IF .. ELSE ..ENDIF and an F earlier GOTO (a GOTO above the IF block) had problems in the earliest M inception.  I forget the OpenVMS variant, but I was around when this came in r5 -- V6?  But cannot remember encountering this buglet.   L As I implied (stated) I am a Fortran programmer but I use a lot of DCL .COM M files as ancilliaries.  Fortran warns when things are unused, but not in the  C same way as this; X would be considered used because it is defined.   N I use cross-referencing lists to get rid of such variables (I have to get the N listing from a VAX when I can; i.e., no F95 code, and no cross referencing on  the Alpha compiler.s  N This is not possible with DCL, and searching through an editor other than LSE M for X is pretty unproductive.  The wonders of longer names, why not change X M? to X_DW or something and then do a sho symbol around its usage.h  N As you said/implied, why modify if it works.  My comment to that is -- future M maintainers.  I've inherited maintenance of a lot of Fortran and DCL amongst  K other sources, and the first thing I find I have to do to understand is to gM remove "detritus".  Possibly spending 1/2 hr working out what X does and why sK your DCL line made the routine work, and then being able to get rid of it, tM will help you when you return to the procedure next century or pass it on to s2 the nth generation of programmer who succeeds you.  J Sorry, this is almost a hobby-horse.  I have had code which assigned to a I variable which was then never used.  The temporary variables used in the AN assignment had me scratching my head as to why the several line algorithm was O written that way.  Since the final assigned variable was never used, who cared aN what the inane algorithm was -- all that code could be wiped out.  Yes, there O was the possibilty that another variable was used mistakenly, but certain code eL I remember that was not the case.  And yes, a good compiler would eliminate K all that code; but I don't want to read it in the source -- my brain takes n longer to realise dead code.   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 03:54:34 -0700g6 From: mgattaura@collins-stewart.com (Mandeep Gattaura)) Subject: Re: DCPS Help Required..........l= Message-ID: <781290e2.0205010254.4ceda504@posting.google.com>t  s Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com> wrote in message news:<300420021123375697%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>...eG > In article <781290e2.0204300125.6b01a4b5@posting.google.com>, Mandeep 1 > Gattaura <mgattaura@collins-stewart.com> wrote:  > C > > I have define forms, and added the postscript form in the setupAF > > qualifier. But when I do a PRINT/FORM=xyz, with a dummy postscriptK > > file a DCPS error page is printed with the error %DCPS-F-SETUPNOTFOUND.o > . > At first glance, your setup appears correct. > I > Is the library PS_LIB.TLB available to the system on which the queue ispH > running?  Are any other error messages displayed?  (Do a REPLY /ENABLE= > to see if any OPCOM messages appear.)  Do you still get thefG > SETUPNOTFOUND message with PRINT /SETUP instead of PRINT /FORM?  Havet@ > you restarted the queue since defining DCPS_LIB?  (If you haveH > DCPS$MAX_STREAMS defined to be more than 1, you will have to make sureH > the new queue gets put into a new symbiont process; it might be easier1 > to stop all your DCPS queues and restart them.)e >  > Paul   Paul,s  E Thanks for the advice, the problem was due to the fact that we hadn't C bounced the print queue. That has now been done, I tried reprintingrB and found there was an offending command in the postscript file. ID have taken out the offending command and replaced the file back intoF the TLB file. I have tried to reprint the form, and some dummy text toB overlay the form but the form and the dummy text are coming out onB separate pieces of paper. Is there anyway to get the dummy text to3 overlay the form. The print command I am using is :   ; PRINT/QUEUE=PS_PRINT_QUEUE/NOTIFY/FORM=CONTRACT_PS 123.PS. I  D The rest of the set-up is as above, I have tried swapping /FORM with; /SETUP but with no effect. Any ideas were I am going wrong.   " Any help will be most appreciated.   MandeepI   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:21:33 GMTv0 From: Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>) Subject: Re: DCPS Help Required..........e; Message-ID: <010520021116294352%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>-  E In article <781290e2.0205010254.4ceda504@posting.google.com>, Mandeeps/ Gattaura <mgattaura@collins-stewart.com> wrote:D  F > I have tried to reprint the form, and some dummy text to overlay theH > form but the form and the dummy text are coming out on separate piecesF > of paper. Is there anyway to get the dummy text to overlay the form.  F Does the PostScript form have a 'showpage' command in it?  If so, take it out.    Paul   -- C  Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineeringa   Compaq Computer Corporation0   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 16:10:18 GMTt From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG ) Subject: Re: DCPS Help Required..........c0 Message-ID: <00A0D491.98740155@SendSpamHere.ORG>  n In article <010520021116294352%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>, Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com> writes:F >In article <781290e2.0205010254.4ceda504@posting.google.com>, Mandeep0 >Gattaura <mgattaura@collins-stewart.com> wrote: >oG >> I have tried to reprint the form, and some dummy text to overlay thedI >> form but the form and the dummy text are coming out on separate piecesoG >> of paper. Is there anyway to get the dummy text to overlay the form.t >oG >Does the PostScript form have a 'showpage' command in it?  If so, takea >it out. >c >Paul    Paul,   < I've found that I have to redefine showpage...  for example:  ) userdict /SOME-DICTNAME-HERE 2 copy known0    { pop pop }    {    2 dict dup 4 1 roll put    begin    :      %% postscript codei    :    /SOME-FORM-NAME-HERE (     :      %% postscript code     :    ) cvx def  #    /old-showpage /showpage load defC    end      /showpage        {.        userdict /SOME-DICT-NAME-HERE get begin        gsave        initgraphics1        SOME-FORM-NAME-HERE        grestore         old-showpageo
        end        }    def    } ifelse  C --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMp            i5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" a   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 09:18:35 -0700s6 From: MGATTAURA@COLLINS-STEWART.COM (Mandeep Gattaura)) Subject: Re: DCPS Help Required..........s= Message-ID: <c83ecc62.0205010818.1cfa79a0@posting.google.com>t  { mgattaura@collins-stewart.com (Mandeep Gattaura) wrote in message news:<781290e2.0205010254.4ceda504@posting.google.com>...Su > Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com> wrote in message news:<300420021123375697%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>... I > > In article <781290e2.0204300125.6b01a4b5@posting.google.com>, Mandeept3 > > Gattaura <mgattaura@collins-stewart.com> wrote:  > > E > > > I have define forms, and added the postscript form in the setupbH > > > qualifier. But when I do a PRINT/FORM=xyz, with a dummy postscriptM > > > file a DCPS error page is printed with the error %DCPS-F-SETUPNOTFOUND.l > > 0 > > At first glance, your setup appears correct. > > K > > Is the library PS_LIB.TLB available to the system on which the queue is J > > running?  Are any other error messages displayed?  (Do a REPLY /ENABLE? > > to see if any OPCOM messages appear.)  Do you still get theeI > > SETUPNOTFOUND message with PRINT /SETUP instead of PRINT /FORM?  Have B > > you restarted the queue since defining DCPS_LIB?  (If you haveJ > > DCPS$MAX_STREAMS defined to be more than 1, you will have to make sureJ > > the new queue gets put into a new symbiont process; it might be easier3 > > to stop all your DCPS queues and restart them.)  > >  > > Paul >  > Paul,v > G > Thanks for the advice, the problem was due to the fact that we hadn'tKE > bounced the print queue. That has now been done, I tried reprintinghD > and found there was an offending command in the postscript file. IF > have taken out the offending command and replaced the file back intoH > the TLB file. I have tried to reprint the form, and some dummy text toD > overlay the form but the form and the dummy text are coming out onD > separate pieces of paper. Is there anyway to get the dummy text to5 > overlay the form. The print command I am using is :  > = > PRINT/QUEUE=PS_PRINT_QUEUE/NOTIFY/FORM=CONTRACT_PS 123.PS. a > F > The rest of the set-up is as above, I have tried swapping /FORM with= > /SETUP but with no effect. Any ideas were I am going wrong.i > $ > Any help will be most appreciated. > 	 > Mandeepp  D I have managed to solve that problem - I had a "showpage" at the endD of the form. I am still having a problem printing multiple page dataD files. The first page is overlayed onto the form, but the subsequent pages come out with no form.C Not sure if the is a way of telling the print (or queue), to retainn? the form until the end of the job. Does anyone know the answer?s   Thanks Mandeep    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 17:40:30 GMTI From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG ) Subject: Re: DCPS Help Required.......... 0 Message-ID: <00A0D49E.3201E3CC@SendSpamHere.ORG>  v In article <c83ecc62.0205010818.1cfa79a0@posting.google.com>, MGATTAURA@COLLINS-STEWART.COM (Mandeep Gattaura) writes:| >mgattaura@collins-stewart.com (Mandeep Gattaura) wrote in message news:<781290e2.0205010254.4ceda504@posting.google.com>...v >> Paul Anderson <paul.r.anderson@compaq.com> wrote in message news:<300420021123375697%paul.r.anderson@compaq.com>...J >> > In article <781290e2.0204300125.6b01a4b5@posting.google.com>, Mandeep4 >> > Gattaura <mgattaura@collins-stewart.com> wrote: >> > nF >> > > I have define forms, and added the postscript form in the setupI >> > > qualifier. But when I do a PRINT/FORM=xyz, with a dummy postscripteN >> > > file a DCPS error page is printed with the error %DCPS-F-SETUPNOTFOUND. >> > a1 >> > At first glance, your setup appears correct.a >> > fL >> > Is the library PS_LIB.TLB available to the system on which the queue isK >> > running?  Are any other error messages displayed?  (Do a REPLY /ENABLEr@ >> > to see if any OPCOM messages appear.)  Do you still get theJ >> > SETUPNOTFOUND message with PRINT /SETUP instead of PRINT /FORM?  HaveC >> > you restarted the queue since defining DCPS_LIB?  (If you have K >> > DCPS$MAX_STREAMS defined to be more than 1, you will have to make sure-K >> > the new queue gets put into a new symbiont process; it might be easiere4 >> > to stop all your DCPS queues and restart them.) >> > d	 >> > Paulg >>   >> Paul, >> OH >> Thanks for the advice, the problem was due to the fact that we hadn'tF >> bounced the print queue. That has now been done, I tried reprintingE >> and found there was an offending command in the postscript file. IrG >> have taken out the offending command and replaced the file back into I >> the TLB file. I have tried to reprint the form, and some dummy text tonE >> overlay the form but the form and the dummy text are coming out oneE >> separate pieces of paper. Is there anyway to get the dummy text tos6 >> overlay the form. The print command I am using is : >> T> >> PRINT/QUEUE=PS_PRINT_QUEUE/NOTIFY/FORM=CONTRACT_PS 123.PS.  >> yG >> The rest of the set-up is as above, I have tried swapping /FORM withn> >> /SETUP but with no effect. Any ideas were I am going wrong. >> o% >> Any help will be most appreciated.o >> >
 >> Mandeep > E >I have managed to solve that problem - I had a "showpage" at the end,E >of the form. I am still having a problem printing multiple page datauE >files. The first page is overlayed onto the form, but the subsequent  >pages come out with no form.iD >Not sure if the is a way of telling the print (or queue), to retain@ >the form until the end of the job. Does anyone know the answer? >G >Thanksd >Mandeep    C See my previous followup in this thread.  You'll need to define thep= form properly to get it to print over every page in the file.t --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMr             5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" -   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:03:49 -0400m- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>V) Subject: Re: DCPS Help Required..........2, Message-ID: <3CD02DFE.CEEDEACF@videotron.ca>   Mandeep Gattaura wrote:mF > I have managed to solve that problem - I had a "showpage" at the endF > of the form. I am still having a problem printing multiple page dataF > files. The first page is overlayed onto the form, but the subsequent > pages come out with no form.E > Not sure if the is a way of telling the print (or queue), to retainyA > the form until the end of the job. Does anyone know the answer?f    K Normally, you would have your application data draw the form on every page..T (or more efficiently generate a postscript form, and just execute it for each page).  M If you want to have the form automatically applied to every page, you need tonF redefine showpage to execute the "showpage" and then execute the form.  
 example:    ? (VAGlogo, drawbox, fillbox, centreshow are defined before this)    %*****************************	 /drawpagev %***************************** {- gsavee 0.46 0.52 0.85 setrgbcolor 1.5 1.5 347  387 3 drawbox 2 350 348 40 0.5 fillbox	 0 setgrayl( gsave 306 349 translate VAGlogo grestore& gsave 4 349 translate VAGlogo grestore  6 175 370 moveto hel10 (xxx INITIATIVE GROUP) centreshow6 175 5 moveto hel10 0.5 setgray confidential centreshow grestore } def   " %*********************************  %% Definition of form dictionary" %*********************************& userdict /vagform 7 dict dup begin put /FormType 1 defu /BBox [0 0 350 390] deft /Matrix [1 0 0 1 0 0] deft /PaintProc {drawpage} def  endu    & and then, as someone else pointed out:   /old_showpage showpage load def   	 /showpageg { old_showpage    vagform execforme } defe  L and then, at the end of your prologue, add a "vagform execform" to paint the first page.r  N The execform operator is extremely efficient because it only executes the codeL once and keeps a rasterized "image" of the form in memory. So for the second- and subsequent pages, it saves a lot of time.   K However, the recommended way of doing this would be to have the applicationeF call the form for each page. (in a bilingual environment this would beK important since you would have a french or an english form, and call up the.1 right form depending on each customer's language)g   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 14:46:26 +0000  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.comC Subject: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windowsg: Message-ID: <OFB45DABD0.3810AD7B-ON00256BAC.005114EA@btyp>   Why's that then?   Steve St          B carl@gergl1.gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) on 05/01/2002 02:04:00 AM    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc: J From:      carl@gergl1.gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins), 1 May 2002, 2:04 a.m.  : Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows   [cut...]  G If as few as something like 23 people with one postal code answer, oddsoA are better than 50% that two of them will have the same birthday.o   --- Carl          F ______________________________________________________________________     [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beG confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message hastG been addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce,i$ distribute or use this transmission.  H Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee isG not intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have receiveduK this transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.n  
 Thank you.  D Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT.; Registered in England and Wales, registered number 4205228.n  I Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire,bD RG1 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:21:13 +0100e% From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>iC Subject: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows 8 Message-ID: <09uvcu8d2ghllt5c15bcia5hsj4tg9ugaf@4ax.com>  D On Wed, 1 May 2002 14:46:26 +0000, Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com wrote:   >oH >If as few as something like 23 people with one postal code answer, oddsB >are better than 50% that two of them will have the same birthday.  F I'm not sure how wide an area US ZIP codes cover but I'd be absolutelyB astonished if you could find 23 people resident in any UK PostcodeF who'd even heard of DECUS. Just maybe you could find 23 working in one though.o   >e	 >--- Carla >s >c >g >r >hG >______________________________________________________________________  >g >n >[Information] -- PostMaster:DE >This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beiH >confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message hasH >been addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce,% >distribute or use this transmission.f > I >Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee is/H >not intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have receivedL >this transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message. >p >Thank you.  >tE >Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT.o< >Registered in England and Wales, registered number 4205228. > J >Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire,E >RG1 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.r >l   -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:50:31 +0100,- From: Roy Omond <Roy.Omond@BlueBubble.UK.Com>lC Subject: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windows 1 Message-ID: <3CD000B7.9BD7423B@BlueBubble.UK.Com>o  ! Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com wrote:e   > Why's that then?  6 Ah, so you didn't do statistics in school then Steve ?1 Probably too busy remembering the chocolate brownt7 Coventry City strips :-) Just been discussing them with-5 a colleague sitting next to me, who's a CCFC fan :-))m  	 Roy Omondo Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 17:43:57 +0100 ( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>C Subject: Re: DECUS/EncompassUS Survey -- no longer assuming Windowsg) Message-ID: <3CD01B4D.A7EC65EF@127.0.0.1>c   Alan Greig wrote:a > F > On Wed, 1 May 2002 14:46:26 +0000, Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com wrote: >  > >aJ > >If as few as something like 23 people with one postal code answer, oddsD > >are better than 50% that two of them will have the same birthday. > H > I'm not sure how wide an area US ZIP codes cover but I'd be absolutelyD > astonished if you could find 23 people resident in any UK PostcodeH > who'd even heard of DECUS. Just maybe you could find 23 working in one	 > though.q  H In most cases, just a name and /or house number and a postcode will find any UK address.i  D I've 'experimented' from UK and overseas postings. Not lost one yet.  E May not work in some places in London where person density is higher.h  # Postcodes are such personal things.o -- e( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot comm   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 13:11:06 -0400# From: "Island" <sales@islandco.com>u& Subject: DS10L's for USD995 - May !!!!/ Message-ID: <ud07tm2tvuc418@news.supernews.com>e   DS10La 512MB Memory (2 x 256MB) Dual 10/100 Ethernet On board IDE One PCI slot   Refurbished wqith 1 Yr warrantyn     -- David B Turner	 Sales Dptt Island Computers US Corporationn 2700 Gregory Streeta	 Suite 180e Savannah GA 31404  Tel: 912 447 6622t Fax: 912 201 0096  sales@islandco.com www.islandco.com' http://www.islandco.com/legal-email.htmm   We sell Alpha's !p* All emails are checked for Virus and Worms   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 02 12:35:57 +0200 ) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)N% Subject: Re: exceed escape characterse) Message-ID: <xZ5STdNXb7UU@elias.decus.ch>R  W In article <C2256BAB.006B7ADB.00@jklh22.valmet.com>, norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:s >  >  >  >  >  >  > ? > tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com on 04/30/2002 12:06:41 PM3 > 7 > Please respond to tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.comj >  > To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.com. > cc:s( > Subject:  Re: exceed escape characters >  >  >  > O >> By the way, what does CTRL-3 supposedly do?  It's not a pre-defined functiona >> in EDT, I don't believe.o > K > <CTRL-3><CTRL-3> or <CTRL-[><CTRL-[> within EDT change mode will generatet( > one <ESC> as will <GOLD-27><GOLD-KP3>. >  >> -- D >> Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comD >> Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com@ >> 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent? >> Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"-; >>        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company1 >  >  >  >  >  >  >  >  --     ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 02 12:39:16 +0200.) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)1% Subject: Re: exceed escape characters.) Message-ID: <odn700V254tF@elias.decus.ch>.  W In article <C2256BAB.006B7ADB.00@jklh22.valmet.com>, norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:a > ? > tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com on 04/30/2002 12:06:41 PMp > O >> By the way, what does CTRL-3 supposedly do?  It's not a pre-defined functiony >> in EDT, I don't believe.a > K > <CTRL-3><CTRL-3> or <CTRL-[><CTRL-[> within EDT change mode will generatem( > one <ESC> as will <GOLD-27><GOLD-KP3>. >   P In fact CTRL-3 is something generated by LK keyboards to compensate for the lackN of an escape key. To my knowledge it originally appeared on the VT200 keyboard
 (LK201 ?).  L It does not suprise me that a terminal emulation package might miss out this0 feature (as the original poster was suggesting).   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 12:54:23 -0400- From: "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca>{) Subject: Re: Fix for EDT emulation in EVEb5 Message-ID: <aap6ko$chbj4$1@ID-141708.news.dfncis.de>O  K Below is the reply I sent to David through private e-mail, I'm not going todL post the attachments here, if anyone wants to look at any of the attachments= I sent David then let me know and I will send them privately.e   ------------------------------- < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3CCF5BCC.6F7DD929@fsi.net...W >... Have at it! ...L I can't spend the time to go through every line, but I did some of them. TryK the command "EDIT/TPU/COMMAND=DAVID.TPU filename" and give it a try. If youGJ really want to try TPU and get stuck converting a key you really need then( let me know and I can try to convert it.  J I also included my own .EDT file, my EDT help file (plain text, not a help: library) and a support file. If you want to give it a try;K             1. Edit the EDP_PETER.TXT and put your name in the spot my name  is in.J             2. ASSIGN the logical PRW$EDP_HEAD_LINE to point to this file.2             3. Edit a new file using my .EDT file.J             4. Press CTRL-D, it will ask for the language, then use CTRL-D to move to each place marker.   F GOLD-H will bring in my help file, KP7 will navigate around the pages.  L I like the GOLD-CTRL-W (although I think I stole that from someone else) and+ the way GOLD-CTRL-L changes with the width.N  K A lot of my commands used to have <ESC> codes embedded in them, this workedUG until V4 came out, then they did not work for V5 and V6. But VMS V7 nowoJ allows them again. I removed all of the ESC for V4 and never put them backI in again because I don't know what VMS V8, V9, V10... will do :). I thinkuL the GOLD CTRL-P also only works pre V4 or post V7, but don't try it on OPA0: ;)   Peter Weaver  D Do you know why computer scientists confuse Christmas and Halloween?,                     Because 31 OCT = 25 DEC. -------------------------------.   -- Peter WeaverL Opinions are my own, and do not reflect the opinions of my employer, nor theK company that it sub-contracts to, nor the company that it sub-contracts to.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 09:13:24 -0500y& From: Jenny Butler <jbutler@utmem.edu>& Subject: Fw: process quota exceeded  ?6 Message-ID: <005001c1f11a$5b98aa60$bf01c084@utmem.edu>  I On a more general note for handling and monitoring process quotas, if youR haveK access to an X-display (a workstation running VMS, etc) and can install theeK appropriate version of AMDS (comes with VMS v7.x - no extra license needed)cL on your systems, it is wonderful.  You can install the Data Provider on yourH production VMS systems, and the whole thing on your workstation, you can pullK up a very good visual of any specific process and watch the resource usage.aK     On more than one occasion, I have found cases where a process quota was G running tight and the documentation for that particular software didn't  mentiono. the need for tuning.  I highly recommend AMDS.8                                         Good luck, Jenny ----- Original Message -----) From: "Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu>t To: <Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com>:% Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 1:56 AMs% Subject: Re: process quota exceeded ?.    5 > Roger Fong <rfong@cegep-chicoutimi.qc.ca> writes...o" > }Is there somebody who knows how/ > }to fix a "process quota exceeded" on OpenVMSs > }a? > }============================================================2 > }ALPHA> run test2 > }%DCL-W-ACTIMAGE, error activating image BONTEST9 > }-CLI-E-IMGNAME, image file DKA100:[ROGER]BONTEST.EXE;6a, > }-SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded	 > }ALPHA>1 > }0 > }ALPHA>type test.c > }int m[8196][8196];a	 > }main()u > }{int i,j,k; > }for(k=0;k<100;k++)  > }      { for(i=0;i<8196;i++) > }        for(j=0;j<8196;j++) > }        m[i][j] = 1; 
 > }      } > }}	 > }ALPHA>z >iE > No. There is nobody in the entire universe who knows how to fix it.hG > Once you see this, you may as well retire to Florida (or the Canadiana$ > equivalent, wherever that may be). >r > Well OK, not really. > C > You have done exactly what it says. You have exceeded one of yourmD > quotas. It is apparent that the relevant quota is memory related -E > specifically the total amount of memory, physical and virtual, thatRD > your process is allowed to use. The total memory required for justE > the array "m" in your program is 8196*8196*4 bytes = 256 megabytes. D > This is well over the default quotas for user accounts on most VMSE > systems. Ask your system manager to increase your pagefile quota tolA > at least 524000 (that's 524000 pagelets of 512 bytes each - thePB > other 800 pagelets you need for "m" plus the memory requirementsB > of everything else should fit in your working set, even if it is? > at the very stingy default setting) and review your account's B > maximum working set extent value to see if a larger one might beD > more appropriate for your requirements (although doing nothing butC > filling the memory with 1s hardly seems worth increasing it for).oA > If you are lucky, or it is required for some actual reason, thee; > system manager will adjust your account's quotas upwards.f >.F > Even with a moderately large working set extent of 64MB, or anythingD > under 256MB actually, this program will not run very quickly - youF > will see a vast number of pagefaults as chunks of memory are shiftedF > to and from the pagefile, which is not the quickest operation in theE > universe. You are visiting every memory location in 256MB in order, J > not just once but 100 times. This is very bad for purposes of locality -G > unless your working set can hold all 256MB or the system allows therefC > to be at least 32000 pages on the modified page list, you will bef@ > churning all 256MB to disk 100 times (it has no way of knowingE > that the data you write to the memory each time is the same - if it F > could tell this, it would only have to write it once) and read it 99G > times (being demand-zero pages they are not "created" until the firsttF > access rather than at image initialization before the first write toE > them, which saves you a trip through the pagefile). How long do you E > suppose some 50GB of disk I/O run through the virtual memory system2C > will take you? It depends on how fast your disk is and what otherjG > things are going on on the system, but it will certainly be over halfdI > and hour, probably over an hour, and maybe 2 hours. (Even on a somewhatlF > fast disk, on a system that is doing nothing else, shifting the dataI > like this to and from a disk drive that dedicated to the task will taketJ > over half an hour.) That's a long time to spend doing absolutely nothing	 > useful.w >oD > If you really need to manipulate this much data, you should try toF > arrange for it to all fit into the physical memory - preferably intoG > your working set, at least the extent if not the quota (assuming yourg0 > system actually has enough memory to do this). >cH > You might also consider the command HELP/MESSAGE EXQUOTA (the relevantD > information is liky to not come up on the first screen, hit returnD > until the top line of information matches the error exactly - thenE > read the information). The information as to what the messages meanp; > is available on the system, at least in a broad overview.. >sD > Actually considering that "m" is never actually used for anything,D > and the program doesn't do anything else, I'm a bit surprised thatD > the above program isn't optimized away to essentaily nothing - "m"F > and all 3 loops should be optimized out of existance, along with theF > 3 loop variables, leaving nothing. It should return immediately when, > you run it. So much for clever optimizing. >r
 > --- Carl >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 11:02:56 +01000( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: Gold keys) Message-ID: <3CCFBD50.772018B6@127.0.0.1>    warren sander wrote: > J > The reason it's called 'gold key' was that at one point Digital actually3 > manufactured keyboards with a 'gold key' on them.e >  > I still have one..  H I have several. Also I used to use a VT52 which also had red and blue as well as gold keys.  A It allows you to use the little publicized DCL define/key and usep   /SET_STATE=colouro   then DEFINE/KEY,   /IF_STATE=GOLD...o /IF_STATE-RED... /IF_STATE=BLUE...l  , So one keypad key could have four functions.   -- e( Regards, Nic Clews CSC Computer Sciences nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 08:26:04 -05001 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>  Subject: Re: HP vote cleared8 Message-ID: <aaoqh2$s0e$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>  + I liked the reach and frequency phrase btw.d   Dave...g  A  what's to become of VMS. No, I don't think it'll die off. I juste	 > want to C >     see some sort of statement made LOUD and CLEAR with reach and0
 frequency. >o >  > mike >A >v   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:50:24 GMTM1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>- Subject: Re: HP vote cleared; Message-ID: <49Uz8.60333$%s3.23768939@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>p  < "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> wrote in message2 news:aaoqh2$s0e$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com...- > I liked the reach and frequency phrase btw._ >_	 > Dave..._ >_C >  what's to become of VMS. No, I don't think it'll die off. I justo > > want toaE > >     see some sort of statement made LOUD and CLEAR with reach ande > frequency. > >   L Word has it this will happen once the acquisition is a done deal. The PowersB That Be did not have the guts to come forth with same prior to the consummation of the deal.a  J Fortunately for the Windoze and NSK contingent, statements regarding their! products were not embargoed. Doh.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 17:54:07 +0100lU From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> 6 Subject: Re: I was right!  Alpha will live in Itanium!0 Message-ID: <aap712$27h$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Main, Kerry wrote:  E >>>>RAC is not a way to improve overall performance *in general*, but- >>>>E > only after an SMP (or perhaps slightly NUMA) single-Oracle-instanceg- > solution has started to run out of gas: <<<m > H > I stated in my original note that RAC is not for every application. ItH > is no different than SMP is not for every application. Both require an? > understanding of the applications and the underlying hardwarep > configurations.c >     
 Nice spin.  < Claiming that RAC and SMP are in some way comparable when it8 comes to applicability as far as running applications is concerned is rubbish.i  = For one thing Oracle 9i RAC isn't the only DBMS on the market'? Sybase, Informix, DB2 are also available and they don't supporte@ clusters in the same way that Oracle does. For apps that requireB these DBMS's SMP is a much better option than a parallel clustered	 solution.]  ? The bottom line is that people don't do clusters for throughputr= with DBMS's until they have exhausted the scalability optionsd; within the SMP system that they are using. This is for goodo: reason, Oracle charge more for RAC and OPS and lots of the7 apps vendors like SAP, Siebel and until recently Oraclea8 themselves don't support it. Incedentally if you want to9 verify the increased costs of having to use OPS then lookd7 no further than your own TPC-C results which detail it.r  A And thats why your attempts to compare results from a NUMA systemkC using OPS in a box to get performance with non OPS results for SMP a machines is missleading.  A Imagine that I am a customer that has an app that requires Sybase,A you pitch the GS320, HP pitches the SuperDome. There are no TPC-Cg= results using Sybase for either but there are Oracle ones and-C with the Oracle results it would appear that the GS320 has slightly & better per CPU throughput that the HP.  ? The customer ends up buying a smaller GS or a larger HP withoutg= realising that the tuning trick that got the GS320 30% betterl< per CPU throughput and tipped the balance in its favour on a= per CPU basis is not available to them because they are usingr Sybase.h  : I have absolutely nothing against OPS its a very good tool7 for providing increased levels of uptime, but it cannotf6 be relied appon in the same way as a SMP system can to' deliver increased levels of throughput.0   Regards  Andrew Harrison   8 P.S What happend to the SAP/Oracle Apps/TPC-H comparison you seem fixated on TPC-C.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 08:29:27 GMTe( From: nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk (Nick Maclaren) Subject: Re: Itanium troublesu0 Message-ID: <aao917$r3v$1@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk>  ' In article <3CCF4B97.E423F00B@fsi.net>, 0 David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote: >Nick Maclaren wrote:. >>   >> and (b) the people with theE >> attitude that using a computer is the user's problem started to bed= >> the people running the show.  And this has never reversed.E >.H >Well, not sure about that. If that were true, Mandrake, Red Hat and the> >others would not be dumping dollars into installers and otherH >"usability" software to wrap around Linus's work and the work of others
 >(Gnu, etc.).a  E There is a difference between realising that you have to do SOMETHINGoH and admitting to yourself that usability is primarily the responsibility of the implementor.s  F >> Berkeley computer science, as seen in BSD etc., has NEVER taken anyF >> interest in usability by anyone except hackers.  Witness the almostE >> total lack of specifications - EVEN more than for A,T&T code - theS< >> users is expected to read the source to use the utility.  >ED >Of course, other than the code upon which it is based, Berkeley has> >preciosu little to do with anything we currently call "*BSD".  B It trained most of the authors and started much of the mindset :-)  @ But, yes, I did admit that there has been massive improvement as4 the developers got some contact with the real world.   >> And theyfF >> are not exceptional.  The modern BSDs are better than the old ones, >> but are still pretty bad. >aI >Well, if you're total VMS bigot like me, yeah. On the other hand, if youDB >recall AT&T System 3.7 or older, you'll think some of today's GnuF >utilities (as found in the average Linux or *BSD distro) are, as they >say, "the cat's ass".  = I go back rather further than that :-)  Yes, you are correct.a     Regards, Nick Maclaren,* University of Cambridge Computing Service,> New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QH, England. Email:  nmm1@cam.ac.uk/ Tel.:  +44 1223 334761    Fax:  +44 1223 334679a   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 13:58:03 GMT>& From: peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva) Subject: Re: Itanium troublesn- Message-ID: <aaos9b$9ff@web.eng.baileynm.com>   ' In article <3CCF4B97.E423F00B@fsi.net>,e0 David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:J > Actually, some did. These were the PC-Tools, the Symantec programs, etc.H > that found their way into modern world. As you say, though, others did% > not. We know what happened to them.   + Have you looked at Norton Utilities lately?n  F I recently found myself with a Magneto-Optical drive that was supposedE to have some data on, but it had been deleted. No problem, I think toSF myself, I'll just D/L a copy of Norton Utils and use the disk tools to fix it.e  H A few minutes later, thanks to the wonders of corporate credit cards and/ the Internet, I'm bringing up Norton Utilities.n  I It's been gutted. There's no tools in there, it's basically got someone'sRJ "super recycle bin" renamed as "unerase", and some more extensive versionsH of things like checkdisk. No sector editor, file system browser, none of5 the things you actually need when something goes bad..   --  O I've seen things you people can't imagine. Chimneysweeps on fire over the roofs O of London. I've watched kite-strings glitter in the sun at Hyde Park Gate.  AllLL these things will be lost in time, like chalk-paintings in the rain.   `-_-'K Time for your nap.  | Peter da Silva | Har du kramat din varg, idag?    'U`-   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 14:08:43 GMTt& From: peter@abbnm.com (Peter da Silva) Subject: Re: Itanium troublesn- Message-ID: <aaostb$aa4@web.eng.baileynm.com>.  ' In article <3CCF49D3.D874B30B@fsi.net>,n0 David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:I > No one wants to "enforce" anything on anyone. Don't read it if it's notm > there.  I "Reading books on usability should be a requirement for all programmers."-  F If it's a requirement you don't enforce it's not a requirement, is it?  J > > Now you may read *that* as usability not "having as much weight as theF > > other issues involved in the development of open-source software",  I > You and I can bandy it about until Bill Gates goes belly-up. The bottomwG > line is this: if you want people to use your software, give them whate > they want - usability.  K You can bandy it about all you want. The bottom line is this, talking about L what should be a requirement for a developer isn't going to get any softwareK developed, and it's not going to get any documentation written. If you have K something to contribute, then you know where the CVS tree is. If you're not K a coder, then write documentation. That's what I mostly did for the FreeBSDiL Project when I was more closely involved with it... I was one of the FreeBSDK Handbook maintainers. Yes, I did coding as well, but I do that for a living L and I need to do something ELSE to relax these days (it's hell getting old).  H If you're as good as you seem to be, they'll be happy to give you commitH privileges. It's not that they don't want to make the system more usableC or better suited to end users, it's that they're up to their ass inrI alligators and Microsoft and Intel and a hundred frantic hardware vendorsnH struggling to stay ahead of the pack are busily pumping toxic waste into
 the swamp.   -- oO I've seen things you people can't imagine. Chimneysweeps on fire over the roofstO of London. I've watched kite-strings glitter in the sun at Hyde Park Gate.  AllTL these things will be lost in time, like chalk-paintings in the rain.   `-_-'K Time for your nap.  | Peter da Silva | Har du kramat din varg, idag?    'U`t   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 12:56:45 -0400  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com9 Subject: Judge backs HP; Hewlett concedes (One more take)e4 Message-ID: <C2256BAC.005C1938.00@jklh22.valmet.com>  : http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/3170841.htm   Posted on Tue, Apr. 30, 2002    Judge backs HP; Hewlett concedes  % By Michelle Quinn and Therese Polettit Mercury News    ( The bitter Hewlett-Packard feud is over.    H In a ruling Tuesday, a Delaware judge soundly rejected Walter Hewlett's=  legalH effort to overturn the March 19 vote in which HP's shareholders narrowl= ys? approved the company's $18 billion purchase of Compaq Computer.r    H Hewlett, who led an intense effort by HP's founding families to stop th= e deal,oH said Tuesday night that he won't appeal the judge's decision, which fou= nd no H evidence that HP misled shareholders or bought the votes of a key insti=	 tution to  secure its victory..    H Instead, the eldest son of HP co-founder Bill Hewlett said he would ``d= oeH everything possible to support the successful implementation of HP's ac=	 quisitiontH of Compaq and encourage others who have shared my views in the past sev= eral months to do the same.''    H Hewlett's concession paves the way for the company to close the compute= roE industry's biggest merger sometime next week and then begin a complex=H integration process that even optimists say will take years to complete=  and result in about 15,000 layoffs.-    H The company said it was ``gratified'' by the judge's ruling, which repe= atedlyH praised the credibility of HP's witnesses during the trial. ``We look f=	 orward tou& the opportunity to move on,'' HP said.    H Hewlett waged a six-month battle with HP Chief Executive Carly Fiorina = over theH fate of the fabled computer and printer maker, which Hewlett's father s= tarted0 with Dave Packard in a Palo Alto garage in 1938.    H The epic struggle pitted Fiorina, an outsider who is trying to transfor= m HPH through a big strategic merger, against the descendants of HP's founder= s, whoH worry that the deal will destroy the company's vaunted culture and hurt=  theH value of the 350 million shares of HP stock held by the families and th= eir, charitable foundations.     H In an era of Enron and other boardroom failures, the battle made Hewlet= t, an HPH director for 15 years, a shareholder hero for challenging HP's other ei= ghtuH directors on a deal that divided shareholders and Wall Street. HP's boa=	 rd bootede- him off the governing body for his rebellion.g    H It also made Fiorina, the only woman to lead a top-20 American company,=	  a symboluH of tenacity and determination as she campaigned nonstop to convince sha=	 reholderseH to approve the deal -- and then aggressively defended her actions in co= urt.    H The battle began with a Nov. 6 announcement by Hewlett that the William=  andH Flora Hewlett Foundation, along with a Hewlett trust and other Hewlett = familyH members, would be voting against the merger. David Woodley Packard and =	 the DavideF and Lucile Packard Foundation soon joined Hewlett's opposition effort.    H After an arduous struggle that featured a blitz of daily filings with t= heH Securities and Exchange Commission, dueling newspaper ads, character at=	 tacks andaH leaks of sensitive information, HP shareholders voted for the merger Ma=	 rch 19 bye a 2.8 percent margin.t    H Still, Hewlett refused to concede, filing a suit in Delaware, where HP = isH incorporated. Hewlett asked the Chancery Court to overturn the vote on = grounds H that HP made misleading financial projections to shareholders and ``bou=	 ght'' thegH votes of a large institution, Deutsche Bank, which switched 17 million =	 shares tot$ support the deal at the last minute.    H In his ruling Tuesday, Chancellor William Chandler III gave HP what it =	 had askedyH for in its closing brief in the case -- vindication ``of the integrity =	 and moral H rectitude of Carly Fiorina and Bob Wayman,'' HP's chief financial offic= er.     H The judge said that the company did not mislead shareholders or coerce = DeutscheH Bank to vote for the deal with Compaq. ``The evidence demonstrates that=  HP'slH statements concerning the merger were true, complete and made in good f= aith,''o the judge wrote.    H Although unsuccessful, the suit did open a window into the inner workin= gs ofuH Silicon Valley's biggest company. The trial revealed how intensely HP e=	 xecutivesnH fought to win shareholder approval of the deal and how Deutsche Bank wa= siH persuaded to switch 17 million votes even as small investors were physi= callyiD casting their final ballots on the deal at Cupertino's Flint Center.    H The trial also revealed internal dissension at HP and Compaq over the p= rospects0 for a risky merger of the two technology giants.    H For HP, it is an understatement to say that now the real work begins. H= P andoH Compaq have the hard task of merging two companies under the extra scru=	 tiny thats/ the shareholder battle and lawsuit has brought.u    H ``Now we have to make sure that HP hits its goals and hits its quarterl= ytH numbers,'' said Tom Burnett, president of Merger Insight, a merger advi=	 sory firm  in New York.    H Legal experts had expected the judge to rule in favor of the company be= causefF Hewlett's team had mostly circumstantial evidence to support its case.    H ``From what we viewed at the trial, there wasn't enough there,'' said C= harlesH Elson, director for the Center of Corporate Governance at the Universit= y of	 Delaware.v    H Hewlett alleged that HP executives should have disclosed to shareholder= soH internal reports that purportedly showed the post-merger company's fina= ncial  goals were unattainable.    H HP executives said the reports didn't reflect the company's entire fina= ncial5H picture and were compiled by people who were familiar with only some of=  the company's integration efforts.    H Chandler found that HP's senior executives ``testified credibly, in acc= ordanceeH with the evidence and without exception, that throughout the proxy cont= est theyH believed that the cost synergy and revenue loss targets were realistic = and, in  fact, would be exceeded.''    H The judge also said that HP had no obligation to tell shareholders abou= t theoH internal reports, and top executives had adequately warned investors th= at their? financial projections were estimates based on many assumptions.     H Chandler said that Hewlett's second claim -- that HP coerced Deutsche B= ank toH switch at least 17 million votes at the last minute -- was entirely bas= ed ona circumstantial evidence.    H Hewlett had cited as evidence a March 17 voice mail, obtained by the Me= rcury D News, in which Fiorina told Wayman they might need to do ``something* extraordinary'' to win over Deutsche Bank.    H Chandler said he believed Fiorina's testimony that ``something extraord= inary'' D simply meant an action such as flying to New York to make a personal presentation to Deutsche Bank.    H However, the judge was troubled by the content of the March 19 conferen= ce call,H in which Deutsche Bank executives heard pitches from Fiorina and Hewlet= t abouto the merits of the merger.n    H In particular, the judge said he was concerned that Deutsche's bankers,=  whoH managed the company's relationship with HP, arranged the call with Deut= sche's! voting committee and listened in.     H ``This fact raises clear questions about the integrity of the internal = ethical H wall that purportedly separates Deutsche Bank's asset management divisi= on froms# its commercial division,'' he said.     H However, he found no credible evidence that HP threatened to withhold f= utureaH business from Deutsche Bank, and he said Deutsche appeared to have vote=	 d in what0A it believed was the best fiduciary interest of its own customers._    H Paul Regan, an associate professor at the Widener University School of = Law inH Delaware, said the judge was likely sending a warning for all future pr= oxynH fights: ``Don't let your commercial side get involved with your shareho=	 lder vote  side.''p    H Analysts who follow the company said the judge's decision was not a sur= prise.H ``There wasn't a smoking gun,'' said Martin Reynolds, a research fellow=  att
 Dataquest.    H In his statement, Hewlett said he will remain involved with HP as chair= man ofH the Hewlett Foundation and a trustee of the Hewlett Trust, which togeth= er( control about 5.6 percent of HP's stock.    H ``I will continue to monitor the company's performance to ensure that i=	 t acts inc2 the best interests of all stockholders,'' he said.    H Contact Michelle Quinn at mquinn@sjmercury.com or (408) 920-5749. There= se4 Poletti at (415) 477-2510 or tpoletti@sjmercury.com.      H       =A9 2001 siliconvalley and wire service sources. All Rights Reser= ved.6                           http://www.siliconvalley.com =n   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:30:04 GMT # From: "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com>s Subject: license questionT> Message-ID: <MZSz8.154549$nc.21286476@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>  L I have four Alpha departmental class machines.  One of them has an unlimitedI user license, but could get by with a 16 user license.  Two of the AlhpassJ have 32 user licenses.  One of them needs more licensed user seats. One of them Icould actuallyB get rid of.  One has a four user license, and will soon need more.  L Can I move these licenses around as I see fit, or do I need to notify Compaq and/or pay any sort of fees.   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 15:05:08 +0000 (UTC), From: lewis@PROBE.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) Subject: Re: license questionh. Message-ID: <aap074$nur$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> writes in article <MZSz8.154549$nc.21286476@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com> dated Wed, 01 May 2002 14:30:04 GMT:gM >I have four Alpha departmental class machines.  One of them has an unlimited J >user license, but could get by with a 16 user license.  Two of the AlhpasK >have 32 user licenses.  One of them needs more licensed user seats. One ofl >them Icould actuallytC >get rid of.  One has a four user license, and will soon need more.c >oM >Can I move these licenses around as I see fit, or do I need to notify Compaqe >and/or pay any sort of fees.   9 The legal details are on the back of the PAK certificate./  K If you cluster your alphas, you can dynamically share the activity (n-user) L licenses.  I have dozens of users sharing 4 CMS activity licenses across the
 cluster here.i  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org.> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 06:21:33 GMT ( From: "C.W.Holeman II" <cwhii5@ACM5.org>@ Subject: Re: New HPS Times - You ARE the weakest link, Good bye!B Message-ID: <NPLz8.401$nY5.32890@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>   Terry C. Shannon wrote:fH > One exception being letting CPQ senior management know about some goodH > folks who deserve positions of responsibility in the new organization!   In that light, who owns VAXELN?(   -- c C.W.Holeman II cwhii5@ACM5.orgw remove the fives http://also.as/cwhii   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 01:49:33 -0400i( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>@ Subject: Re: New HPS Times - You ARE the weakest link, Good bye!, Message-ID: <3CCF81ED.9020507@tsoft-inc.com>   Terry C. Shannon wrote:l  8 > "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@mmaz.com> wrote in message# > news:3CCD818B.4000707@mmaz.com...u > I >>I do not always want to come across as the antagonist or the complainerbG >>of the list, but doesn't anyone else object to the elimination of thelH >>VMS Times?  I have no objection to other newsletters focusing on Tru64H >>and Linux, frankly I would be interested in a 'Linux Only,' but what IC >>also want is a 'VMS Only' as this is becoming a scarce commodity.  >> > 	 > Agreed.n >  > G >>I, for one, have opted out of the HPS Times.  Perhaps Compaq/HP might 3 >>get the message if enough VMS folks balk at this.n >> > L > Not bloody likely. It was a "Marketing Decision." Name withheld to protect8 > the guilty, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist....    O And once SHE makes one of HER (usually) bad decisions, you can expect hell and )N high water, but no reversal.  Hey, pretty good, and I haven't built any rocks  for many years.  :-)       >>BTW, is that HPS for6 >>High Performance Systems or Hewlett Packard Systems? >> > D > At the time of the name change, it was "High Performance Systems." >  > 
 >>Loosing the2I >>distinction of VMS, couldn't that make it a tad too easy for HP to alsom >>do the same? >> > C > Ya never know. The good news about the merger is that it offers as> > much-needed opportunity to clean up some deadwood at Compaq!    N Unfortunately SHE seems to have a patron, who is actually pretty good, except  for this specific problem.  N I guess it really wouldn't be good to get into a discussion about methods for 2 removing chrome from the balls on trailer hitches.     Dave   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 04:35:26 -0400u- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> @ Subject: Re: New HPS Times - You ARE the weakest link, Good bye!, Message-ID: <3CCFA88F.1DEA8CC0@videotron.ca>   David Froble wrote:rN > > Not bloody likely. It was a "Marketing Decision." Name withheld to protect: > > the guilty, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist.... > P > And once SHE makes one of HER (usually) bad decisions, you can expect hell andO > high water, but no reversal.  Hey, pretty good, and I haven't built any rocksn > for many years.  :-)  K Any news on whether SHE is high enough to have been named as part of the HPn2 combined organisation, or is she below the radar ?  M If SHE is below the radar, who gets to decide her fate when the axe must fall I for 12,000 (mostly) compaq employees ? DOes that person have a favourablea opinion of HER ?   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 01:56 CDT' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) & Subject: Re: process quota exceeded  ?, Message-ID: <1MAY200201561794@gerg.tamu.edu>  3 Roger Fong <rfong@cegep-chicoutimi.qc.ca> writes...C! }Is there somebody who knows how .- }to fix a "process quota exceeded" on OpenVMSo } = }============================================================m }ALPHA> run test0 }%DCL-W-ACTIMAGE, error activating image BONTEST7 }-CLI-E-IMGNAME, image file DKA100:[ROGER]BONTEST.EXE;6n* }-SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded }ALPHA>a }  }ALPHA>type test.c }int m[8196][8196];h }main()s }{int i,j,k; }for(k=0;k<100;k++)t }      { for(i=0;i<8196;i++) }        for(j=0;j<8196;j++) }        m[i][j] = 1;l }      } }} }ALPHA>T  C No. There is nobody in the entire universe who knows how to fix it.vE Once you see this, you may as well retire to Florida (or the Canadianu" equivalent, wherever that may be).   Well OK, not really.  A You have done exactly what it says. You have exceeded one of youreB quotas. It is apparent that the relevant quota is memory related -C specifically the total amount of memory, physical and virtual, thatfB your process is allowed to use. The total memory required for justC the array "m" in your program is 8196*8196*4 bytes = 256 megabytes. B This is well over the default quotas for user accounts on most VMSC systems. Ask your system manager to increase your pagefile quota toE? at least 524000 (that's 524000 pagelets of 512 bytes each - theg@ other 800 pagelets you need for "m" plus the memory requirements@ of everything else should fit in your working set, even if it is= at the very stingy default setting) and review your account'sa@ maximum working set extent value to see if a larger one might beB more appropriate for your requirements (although doing nothing butA filling the memory with 1s hardly seems worth increasing it for).o? If you are lucky, or it is required for some actual reason, theo9 system manager will adjust your account's quotas upwards.k  D Even with a moderately large working set extent of 64MB, or anythingB under 256MB actually, this program will not run very quickly - youD will see a vast number of pagefaults as chunks of memory are shiftedD to and from the pagefile, which is not the quickest operation in theC universe. You are visiting every memory location in 256MB in order, H not just once but 100 times. This is very bad for purposes of locality -E unless your working set can hold all 256MB or the system allows thereaA to be at least 32000 pages on the modified page list, you will be > churning all 256MB to disk 100 times (it has no way of knowingC that the data you write to the memory each time is the same - if it'D could tell this, it would only have to write it once) and read it 99E times (being demand-zero pages they are not "created" until the firstaD access rather than at image initialization before the first write toC them, which saves you a trip through the pagefile). How long do youaC suppose some 50GB of disk I/O run through the virtual memory systemhA will take you? It depends on how fast your disk is and what otheriE things are going on on the system, but it will certainly be over half G and hour, probably over an hour, and maybe 2 hours. (Even on a somewhatlD fast disk, on a system that is doing nothing else, shifting the dataG like this to and from a disk drive that dedicated to the task will take H over half an hour.) That's a long time to spend doing absolutely nothing useful.u  B If you really need to manipulate this much data, you should try toD arrange for it to all fit into the physical memory - preferably intoE your working set, at least the extent if not the quota (assuming your`. system actually has enough memory to do this).  F You might also consider the command HELP/MESSAGE EXQUOTA (the relevantB information is liky to not come up on the first screen, hit returnB until the top line of information matches the error exactly - thenC read the information). The information as to what the messages meane9 is available on the system, at least in a broad overview.r  B Actually considering that "m" is never actually used for anything,B and the program doesn't do anything else, I'm a bit surprised thatB the above program isn't optimized away to essentaily nothing - "m"D and all 3 loops should be optimized out of existance, along with theD 3 loop variables, leaving nothing. It should return immediately when* you run it. So much for clever optimizing.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 13:56:30 +0100aT From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.remove_this.harrison@sun.com>Y Subject: Re: put up or shut up (was: RE: AMD To Announce Microsoft Support For   New Chipr& Message-ID: <3CCFE5FE.8000106@sun.com>   JF Mezei wrote:d  * > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > B >>on IA64 without having to do any work. Customers running a mixed< >>bag of IA32 and IA64 apps on the same box will end up with< >>a very sub optimal platform from a performance standpoint. >> > H > You are forgetting the fact that in the Wintel word, many run just oneO > application per machine. So if you have one app compiled for IA64, you run ittP > on an IA64 wintel, and if another app is optimised for the 8086, you run it on > an 8086 box. >     A This may well be true for small servers and desktops but it isn'tl= the case with larger servers which is the market that IA64 iss	 aimed at.n  A HP one of the key developers of IA64 aim to use it to replace allaA their current HP-PA processors. This means 64 way SuperDomes withe< IA64 CPU's rather than HP-PA. A SuperDome has roughly 2x the? throughput of the largest GS320 and comes with partitioning andh@ resource management whose whole aim is to allow multiple apps to% play nicely together in the same box.a  ? The recompilation issues are just as important to HP with HP-PAt6 binaries running on IA64 as they are to Windows users.  C But even in the low end windows server space where people are using B Win32 based boxes as servers you may only be running one "app" but. the app may consist of a number of components.  B DBMS, WebServer, JVM, Apps Server and messaging infrastructure forC example all of these need to have been recompiled for IA64 to avoidi= one of them chewing CPU resources to deliver poor throughput.f    O > However, in the end, if the 8086 box costs less than IA64 box and can run then= > same application, why bother with IA64 for windows at all ?o    G Quite and if you lob in the fact that the IA32 based box is faster theno/ IA64 becomes a much less atractive proposition.e     Regardsh   Andrew Harrisonw   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 04:37:09 -0700h# From: tadamsmar@aol.com (Tom Adams) B Subject: Re: Reducing size of incremental backup - will this work?= Message-ID: <793af3df.0205010337.4b9e6dbc@posting.google.com>i  ` Bart Zorn <B.Zorn@xs4all.nospam.nl> wrote in message news:<3CCED2FD.4040503@xs4all.nospam.nl>... > Tom Adams wrote:G > > I want to try to do backup/record on a directory to keep the entire 7 > > contents from being backuped.  Something like this:h > > * > > !Backup to force record of backup date/ > > $BACKUP/RECORD  DSA0:[FOO]BAR.DIR DUMMY.TMPe > > $DELETE DUMMY.TMP.*u) > > !Proceed with real incremental backupt< > > $BACKUP/SINCE=BACKUP DSA0{000000...]  TAPEDRIVE:BLAHBLAH > > F > > This directory will never be renamed.  It is a large direcory withM > > some file creates and deletes happening in it every day, but only a smalla< > > portion of the files in it are changed on a daily basis. > > J > > Is there any problem with this?  I am not sure of all the reasons thatG > > VMS was revised in the first place to backup all the contents of a e7 > > directory when the directory's modify date changed.  > I > There are several possibilities to have BACKUP ignore certain files or t > directories. You could:p >  > - Use SET FILE/NOBACKUPa  > - Use DFU SET FILE/BACKUP_DATE > - Use BACKUP/EXCLUDE > ; > The third one seems the one to use in your case, I think.  > I > The reason that BACKUP includes directories without an apparant reason '& > has to do with Incremental Restores. >  > HTH, >  > Bart Zorns  N Well, I want files in the directory backed up if they have been modified sinceK their last backup.  A set group of files are added daily.  These would needdG to be backed up.  I could just say that any file that was more than two.G days old that had been backed up once could be marked NOBACKUP I guess.s   ------------------------------   Date: 1 MAY 2002 13:41:52 GMT 4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher)B Subject: Re: Reducing size of incremental backup - will this work?5 Message-ID: <1MAY02.13415285@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>n  ; In a previous article, tadamsmar@aol.com (Tom Adams) wrote:s  P ->Well, I want files in the directory backed up if they have been modified sinceM ->their last backup.  A set group of files are added daily.  These would need I ->to be backed up.  I could just say that any file that was more than twocI ->days old that had been backed up once could be marked NOBACKUP I guess.g  K If this is VMS 7.2 or later consider using BACKUP/NOINCREMENTAL when saving  files. If 7.0 or 7.1 then:   	$ CREATE/NAME_TABLE BACKUP$BTEd> 	$ DEFINE/TABLE=BACKUP$BTE BACKUP$BTE_DISABLE_SAVE_ALL_DIR " "  E prior to the backup command. Either of these tells backup not to saveeD every file under a directory if the directory revision date changes,C which it will as you add files. This behavior started with VMS 7.0.o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 01:09:56 -0400c( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>5 Subject: Re: removing extra carriage return/line feede, Message-ID: <3CCF78A4.9050802@tsoft-inc.com>  ' Ok, here's _probably_ what's happening.=  N You create a text file on VMS.  This is most likely a sequential variable RMS N file, but possibly stream.  The sequential variable file on VMS does NOT have ? the <CR> and <LF> embedded in the data.  Look at the following:l  3 Z1.BAS;8                      File ID:  (1299,12,0)e- Size:           11/11         Owner:    [DFE] " Created:    9-OCT-2001 14:32:33.28& Revised:    8-NOV-2001 16:33:24.89 (3) Expires:   <None specified>  Backup:    <No backup recorded>  Effective: <None specified>i Recording: <None specified>d File organization:  Sequential Shelved state:      Online  Caching attribute:  WritethroughE File attributes:    Allocation: 11, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0e%                      No version limithH Record format:      Variable length, maximum 255 bytes, longest 69 bytes4 Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control RMS attributes:     None Journaling enabled: None= File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RE, World:s Access Cntrl List:  None Client attributes:  None  N Note the record format, Carriage return carriage control.  I stress, there is Q not carriage returns and line feeds in the file, unless they are put in as data, j, but they don't exist for record termination.  J Now you FTP the file to a non-VMS system, as an Ascii text file.  The FTP P utility you're using probably knows enough to re-format the file as a string of M bytes with embedded <CR><LF> to terminate records.  Guess what, that file on nO windoz has a <CR><LF> at the end of the file.  Don't believe that, just FTP it  L back to VMS as a binary file, and use whatever tool you want to look at the H file.  Note, don't use EDT, the data will likely be more than 255 bytes.  O So, when you go into Wordpad to look at the file, going to the end of the file oQ includes going to after the last <CR><LF>.  This is because the <CR><LF> is part  M of the data on windoz, not file record attributes.  Most utilities will know n1 this, and use the two bytes as record delimiters.-  Q If you do have a file less than 255 characters, with multiple lines, FTP it back KL to VMS as a binary file and then open it with EDT.  You will see the record  delimiters.r   Alan E. Feldman wrote:  r > hughest@esm-semi.co.uk (Tracey Hughes) wrote in message news:<d0058b0e.0204290458.e6d4b52@posting.google.com>... > G >>I have some txt files created by Sqlplus running on an OpenVMS Alpha. H >>On the Alpha that created them, if I edit the file the end of the fileE >>is the last line however if I open these in Wordpad and do CTRL-END.9 >>the cursor jumps to the 1st character of the next line.o >>A >>These files are to be uploaded into another system and they aresH >>rejected due to this extra line. At the moment I have to open the fileF >>in Wordpad and delete back once to the end of the last line and thenF >>resave the file. Is there anyway of using OpenVMS to have to the end* >>of the file at the end of the last line?    L Actually, VMS is doing this.  It's the FTP utility that's adding the record  delimiters.i  1 Offhand, without working on it a bit, I'd say no.p  & Oh hell, Ok, I'll spell out an option.  O If you want to control the format of a file, then you must totally control the iL format, and have utilities treat the file as a binary file, not a test file.    I hope you don't have big files.  M Open the file on VMS, and read in each line.  For each line, take the record nL data and concatenate it to a string, inserting into the string between each M record the 2 characters <CR><LF>.  Do not add anything after the last record.E  L Now you need to write the single string to a file.  You'll probably have to P segment it into 512 byte sections and write each section separately.  Note that B the last section should be padded to 512 bytes with nulls (zeros).  P Then FTP the file to windoz as a binary file.  The FTP utility will not add the 	 <CR><LF>.   O If this sounds a bit much, it is.  It's too bad that the target system chooses eN to be STUPID!  I know, it's probably not something you can control, and those F controlling it refuse to cooperate.  They're really the ones at fault.  ( Consider the following text file on VMS:   1       RECORD TESTo                  LONG    T1%                  STRING  T1$=5                  STRING  T2$=5          END RECORD           DECLARE TEST T(99)s 3       map (w) test w          map (w) string z$=14d 10      T(1%)::T1% = 123%a          T(1%)::T1$ = "ABCDE"           T(1%)::T2$ = "VWXYZ"  20      w = T(1%)g 30      PRINT LEN(Z$)s          PRINT MID(Z$,5%,5%)          PRINT MID(Z$,10%,5%).          T(2%) = w          PRINT T(2%)::T1%t          PRINT T(2%)::T1$n          PRINT T(2%)::T2$m  Q Then FTP it to windoz as a text (ascii) file, then FTP it back as a binary file, o and run EDT on the file.   *tD      1       1   RECORD TEST<CR><LF>             LONG    T1%<CR><LF>J STRING  T1$=5<CR><LF>           STRING  T2$=5<CR><LF>   END RECORD<CR><LF>P DECLARE TEST T(99)<CR><LF>3     map (w) test w<CR><LF>  map (w) string z$=14<CR>P <LF>10  T(1%)::T1% = 123%<CR><LF>       T(1%)::T1$ = "ABCDE"<CR><LF>    T(1%)::TP 2$ = "VWXYZ"<CR><LF>20  w = T(1%)<CR><LF>30     PRINT LEN(Z$)<CR><LF>   PRINT MI D(Z$,5%,5%)<CR>  *u  M The above is the first 255 characters of the file.  EDT truncated the single  K record to 255 characters.  Each character is there, including the <CR><LF> i. inserted by the FTP transfer of the text file.  P Back in the early days of VMS I had occasion to move programs from RSTS to VMS. Q   The early utilities didn't always work too well, and the person doing the work 0O (me) never was too bright.  So, I got good at writing my own programs to strip HM out the <CR>s and <LF>s and reformat the program text so it could be used on vP VMS.  Those were the fun days when not too much worked as it should and you got P to first figure out what the heck happened, and then what you had to do to make 	 it right..  4 Back when programmers did more than point and click.  K Let's see, it's after 1:00 AM, so the above is probably a bunch of drivel. d Better wrap this up.   Dave     >> >  > E > If there is truly nothing funny at the end of the file on the Alpha F > side, then you probably need to fine tune how you FTP/e-mail them toG > the other system. What software are you using to do the file transfert- > and what system is it being transferred to?D >  > Disclaimer: JMHO > Alan E. Feldman $ > afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 03:12:14 -0400u- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>D5 Subject: Re: removing extra carriage return/line feed@, Message-ID: <3CCF9515.CE329926@videotron.ca>   David Froble wrote:.K > Now you FTP the file to a non-VMS system, as an Ascii text file.  The FTP=Q > utility you're using probably knows enough to re-format the file as a string ofc5 > bytes with embedded <CR><LF> to terminate records. 1  K The problem is that the person with the problem did post a DIR/FULL and the  file structure is streamlf.m  J But you do have a point that the last record is probably terminated with aI <LF> followd by the end of file marker. But isn't that normal behaviour ?}  M If you use C routines to get a line, the buffer will include the newline, and & the next read will return end of file.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 12:07:19 GMT + From: "Rick Barry" <barry@star.zko.dec.com>l. Subject: Re: Running CSWS 1.2 on Alpha VMS 7.28 Message-ID: <XTQz8.4$lS1.175237@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>  J You may be able to get it working, but not guranteed. Even with 7.2-1 it'sK helpful to have the latest ECO installed for the most up-to-date C run-timea library.  G But the CSWS installation requires 7.2-1 as a minimum, so you'd need toeF unpackage the PCSI kit, change the software requirement statement, and3 repackage. (No, that's not a supported operation :)4  G You're really better off going to 7.2-1, if you can, to avoid problems.u  
 Rick Barry( Compaq Secure Web Server Deveopment Team OpenVMS Systems Software Group Compaq Computer Corporationv
 Nashua, NH  G "Simon Clubley" <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote ine5 message news:9lFRb$IHKYcg@eisner.encompasserve.org...yH > The installation guide for the latest version of Apache (IE: CSWS 1.2)G > states that at least VMS 7.2-1 is required. Can it be made to work one, > VMS 7.2 (the version on the hobbyist CD) ? >l > Thanks for any information,u >r > Simon. >wI > PS: In order to head off what is currently a standard response to these C > types of postings, I would like to declare in advance that I haves	 precisely D > _zero_ interest in running Purveyor, nor do I have any interest in debatingI > the merits of that webserver versus the rest of the VMS webservers. :-)o >i > --= > Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP - > Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:39:39 GMTp1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>i, Subject: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC; Message-ID: <L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>s  I Another year, another name change. We at Shannon Knows DEC, Shannon Knows G Distributed Enterprise Computing, Shannon Knows Compaq, and now ShannonhJ Knows HPC are getting used to the good old name game. And we hope that youG Constant Readers will take the latest name change in stride. Here's the L deal: Shannon Knows Compaq has withstood the rigors of two name changes plusE the economic angst of the thermonuclear winter incited by a wholesalegH dot-com bombing. Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware ChanceryK Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKC hasyL changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course,? can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,.F post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance ComputingI arena. In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a new five-letter H acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended "dance version"L five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coverage we'veJ been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more. And for those ofI you who wonder why we didn't opt for Shannon Knows HPS, it turns out thateJ HPS is the acronym for Hewlett Packard Services! Thanks to a senior Compaq4 manager for pointing out this potential gaffe to us!   -- Terry C. Shannon Consultant and Publisher Shannon Knows HPCa" PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESS email: terryshannon@attbi.comd2 Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 15:00:42 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>o0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPCC Message-ID: <uqTz8.166$zk1.90@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>l   Terry,  A So will anything built with Itanic/McKinley/etc.... ever be 'high-
 performance'?-  J If you have your doubts, maybe you should reconsider the name change to beL something along the lines of "Shannon Knows Commodity Platforms with Various% Operating Systems".  www.skcpwvos.comt  K I know it's a mouthful, but it seems to be where the industry is heading soo; you'll truly be on the leading edge of naming for all time.I  I Besides, it'll save on additional domain registration and trademark fees.n :-)4        < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message5 news:L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...tK > Another year, another name change. We at Shannon Knows DEC, Shannon KnowsaI > Distributed Enterprise Computing, Shannon Knows Compaq, and now ShannonwL > Knows HPC are getting used to the good old name game. And we hope that youI > Constant Readers will take the latest name change in stride. Here's thesI > deal: Shannon Knows Compaq has withstood the rigors of two name changes  plusG > the economic angst of the thermonuclear winter incited by a wholesaleiJ > dot-com bombing. Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware ChanceryI > Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKC  has F > changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course, A > can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,oH > post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance ComputingK > arena. In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a new five-lettervJ > acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended "dance version"H > five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coverage we've L > been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more. And for those ofK > you who wonder why we didn't opt for Shannon Knows HPS, it turns out that L > HPS is the acronym for Hewlett Packard Services! Thanks to a senior Compaq6 > manager for pointing out this potential gaffe to us! >i > -- > Terry C. Shannon > Consultant and Publisher > Shannon Knows HPCb$ > PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESS > email: terryshannon@attbi.comc4 > Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org >r >o   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:40:36 -05001 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>R0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC8 Message-ID: <aap2d9$1r7$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>  F Or perhaps SK___   <--- underscores;  let's start with 3.  Fill in theL blanks as required.  Seems like every few years.  Think of the fun one might  have with different colors!  ;-)   Dave...t  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message= news:uqTz8.166$zk1.90@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...  > Terry, >EC > So will anything built with Itanic/McKinley/etc.... ever be 'higho > performance'?c >eL > If you have your doubts, maybe you should reconsider the name change to beF > something along the lines of "Shannon Knows Commodity Platforms with Variouso' > Operating Systems".  www.skcpwvos.comi >vJ > I know it's a mouthful, but it seems to be where the industry is heading so= > you'll truly be on the leading edge of naming for all time.u >oK > Besides, it'll save on additional domain registration and trademark fees.t > :-)e >  >a >  > > > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message7 > news:L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net... G > > Another year, another name change. We at Shannon Knows DEC, Shannon  KnowsFK > > Distributed Enterprise Computing, Shannon Knows Compaq, and now Shannon J > > Knows HPC are getting used to the good old name game. And we hope that yourK > > Constant Readers will take the latest name change in stride. Here's the K > > deal: Shannon Knows Compaq has withstood the rigors of two name changest > plusI > > the economic angst of the thermonuclear winter incited by a wholesaleiL > > dot-com bombing. Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware ChanceryK > > Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKCA > hasgH > > changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of	 > course,cC > > can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,eJ > > post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance ComputingA > > arena. In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a newo five-lettereL > > acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended "dance version"J > > five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coverage > we'veeK > > been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more. And for thosec ofH > > you who wonder why we didn't opt for Shannon Knows HPS, it turns out thatG > > HPS is the acronym for Hewlett Packard Services! Thanks to a senior  Compaq8 > > manager for pointing out this potential gaffe to us! > >N > > -- > > Terry C. Shannon > > Consultant and Publisher > > Shannon Knows HPCn& > > PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESS! > > email: terryshannon@attbi.comi6 > > Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org > >a > >l >  >s   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 10:52:24 -0500 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC3 Message-ID: <vVZS78ztr3Xq@eisner.encompasserve.org>   o In article <L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes:s  D > In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a new five-letterJ > acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended "dance version"N > five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coverage we've< > been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more.   D 	Oh boy!  Does this mean you will soon be coming up your own versionD 	of the "five-note siren song of the Intel Xylophone Orchestra" ????   	HA!   				Robs   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 11:46:05 -0400* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>0 Subject: RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC- Message-ID: <0033000062266088000002L082*@MHS>   
 =0A  S-hannone     K-nows  
   C-ompany     D-ua     J-ourt   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETr& Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 11:23 AMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET0 Subject: RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC     Terry,  A So will anything built with Itanic/McKinley/etc.... ever be 'highs
 performance'?o  H If you have your doubts, maybe you should reconsider the name change to=  be H something along the lines of "Shannon Knows Commodity Platforms with Va= rious % Operating Systems".  www.skcpwvos.com   H I know it's a mouthful, but it seems to be where the industry is headin= g so; you'll truly be on the leading edge of naming for all time.h  H Besides, it'll save on additional domain registration and trademark fee= s. :-),        < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message5 news:L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net... H > Another year, another name change. We at Shannon Knows DEC, Shannon K= nowsH > Distributed Enterprise Computing, Shannon Knows Compaq, and now Shann= onH > Knows HPC are getting used to the good old name game. And we hope tha= t youlH > Constant Readers will take the latest name change in stride. Here's t= heH > deal: Shannon Knows Compaq has withstood the rigors of two name chang= es plusH > the economic angst of the thermonuclear winter incited by a wholesale=  H > dot-com bombing. Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware Chanc= ery@H > Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, S= KC hasoF > changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course,nA > can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,iH > post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance Computin= g H > arena. In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a new five-le= tterH > acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended "dance versi= on"dH > five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coverag= ea we'vetH > been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more. And for tho= se ofwH > you who wonder why we didn't opt for Shannon Knows HPS, it turns out = thatH > HPS is the acronym for Hewlett Packard Services! Thanks to a senior C= ompaqr6 > manager for pointing out this potential gaffe to us! >' > -- > Terry C. Shannon > Consultant and Publisher > Shannon Knows HPCr$ > PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESS > email: terryshannon@attbi.comn4 > Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org >e >=   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 16:45:59 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC+ Message-ID: <aap647$k1k$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>d  o In article <L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes:  .a .l . 9 > Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware Chancery L >Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKC hasM >changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course, @ >can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,G >post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance Computingo >arena.D  I I doubt they'll be  "Numero Uno in the High Performance Computing arena" nH if they persist in their plans to force all their customers onto Itanic.  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 08:45:23 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 0 Subject: RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIGEBGEOAA.tom@kednos.com>    How about SKX V3.0   >-----Original Message-----X7 >From: Dave Gudewicz [mailto:david.gudewicz@abbott.com] & >Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 8:41 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com1 >Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC2 >: >nG >Or perhaps SK___   <--- underscores;  let's start with 3.  Fill in theiC >blanks as required.  Seems like every few years.  Think of the fun 
 >one might! >have with different colors!  ;-)  >  >Dave... >C/ >"John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message2> >news:uqTz8.166$zk1.90@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...	 >> Terry,e >>D >> So will anything built with Itanic/McKinley/etc.... ever be 'high >> performance'? >>@ >> If you have your doubts, maybe you should reconsider the name
 >change to beEG >> something along the lines of "Shannon Knows Commodity Platforms with2 >Various( >> Operating Systems".  www.skcpwvos.com >>K >> I know it's a mouthful, but it seems to be where the industry is heading  >sot> >> you'll truly be on the leading edge of naming for all time. >>L >> Besides, it'll save on additional domain registration and trademark fees. >> :-) >> >> >> >>? >> "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message.8 >> news:L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net...H >> > Another year, another name change. We at Shannon Knows DEC, Shannon >KnowsL >> > Distributed Enterprise Computing, Shannon Knows Compaq, and now ShannonK >> > Knows HPC are getting used to the good old name game. And we hope thatk >youL >> > Constant Readers will take the latest name change in stride. Here's theL >> > deal: Shannon Knows Compaq has withstood the rigors of two name changes >> plus.J >> > the economic angst of the thermonuclear winter incited by a wholesale; >> > dot-com bombing. Acting on the news yesterday that thet >Delaware ChanceryL >> > Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKC >> hasI >> > changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, ofl
 >> course,D >> > can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,K >> > post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance ComputingpB >> > arena. In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a new >five-letter= >> > acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended. >"dance version"K >> > five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coveragee >> we'veL >> > been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more. And for those >of>I >> > you who wonder why we didn't opt for Shannon Knows HPS, it turns outb >that H >> > HPS is the acronym for Hewlett Packard Services! Thanks to a senior >Compaqh9 >> > manager for pointing out this potential gaffe to us!o >> > >> > --f >> > Terry C. Shannon  >> > Consultant and Publishery >> > Shannon Knows HPC' >> > PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESSi" >> > email: terryshannon@attbi.com7 >> > Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.orge >> > >> > >> >> >  >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).XA >Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 4/19/2002t >  ---n& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.351 / Virus Database: 197 - Release Date: 4/19/2002   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 12:39:29 -0400  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC4 Message-ID: <C2256BAC.005A940E.00@jklh22.valmet.com>  1 Interesting Sig file in the light of the message.S5 When exactly are you going to complete this morph...?a ->2 Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org <-        0 terryshannon@attbi.com on 05/01/2002 10:39:39 AM  ( Please respond to terryshannon@attbi.com   To:   Info-VAX@mvb.saic.comt/ cc:    (bcc: Norm Raphael/WOR/Automation/METSO)I- Subject:  SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPCi      I Another year, another name change. We at Shannon Knows DEC, Shannon Knows)G Distributed Enterprise Computing, Shannon Knows Compaq, and now ShannontJ Knows HPC are getting used to the good old name game. And we hope that youG Constant Readers will take the latest name change in stride. Here's the_L deal: Shannon Knows Compaq has withstood the rigors of two name changes plusE the economic angst of the thermonuclear winter incited by a wholesaleiH dot-com bombing. Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware ChanceryK Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKC has-L changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course,? can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,sF post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance ComputingI arena. In the interest of brevity-plus a desire to coin a new five-letter H acronym-we'll now operate under the SKHPC name. Extended "dance version"L five-letter acronym aside, we'll continue to provide the same coverage we'veJ been dishing out for the last nine years, plus even more. And for those ofI you who wonder why we didn't opt for Shannon Knows HPS, it turns out thataJ HPS is the acronym for Hewlett Packard Services! Thanks to a senior Compaq4 manager for pointing out this potential gaffe to us!   -- Terry C. Shannon Consultant and Publisher Shannon Knows HPC " PLEASE NOTE MY *NEW* EMAIL ADDRESS email: terryshannon@attbi.comi2 Web (info on SKC):  www.openvms.org, www.tru64.org   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 12:06:43 -0500+ From: Christopher Smith <csmith@amdocs.com> 0 Subject: RE: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPCJ Message-ID: <7E008308CD77154485FEF878168D078E01784505@CMIMAIL1.amdocs.com>   --=_IS_MIME_Boundary Content-Type: text/plain;  	charset="iso-8859-1"e   > -----Original Message-----B > From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk [mailto:david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk]  : > I doubt they'll be  "Numero Uno in the High Performance  > Computing arena" f> > if they persist in their plans to force all their customers  > onto Itanic.  ( Probably Numero Ses, if they're lucky ;)   Chris     ! Christopher Smith, Perl Developer  Amdocs - Champaign, IL   /usr/bin/perl -e '? print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n");w 't  4 --=_IS_MIME_Boundary) Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit< Content-Disposition: inline:  U -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------a  C The information contained in this message is proprietary of Amdocs,e1 protected from disclosure, and may be privileged.hN The information is intended to be conveyed only to the designated recipient(s)L of the message. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient,P you are hereby notified that any dissemination, use, distribution or copying of ? this communication is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. nN If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately> by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer.
 Thank you.  U -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------r   --=_IS_MIME_Boundary--   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 12:23:34 -0500i+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC3 Message-ID: <evznA+pScZM6@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  L In article <aap647$k1k$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes:q > In article <L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes:l > .i > .o > . : >> Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware ChanceryM >>Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKC has N >>changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course,A >>can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,,H >>post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance Computing >>arena. > K > I doubt they'll be  "Numero Uno in the High Performance Computing arena" cJ > if they persist in their plans to force all their customers onto Itanic. >   A 	Don't count on it.  It may take a few billion more but they willv? 	be at or near the top.  Their boxes will cost a lot less, thatn 	really is a key.o  8 	Seems a good dose of technical mo-jo and even lecturers 	change their tune:s  1 http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/3/25099.htmla  O A fortnight ago UCB grad student Nick Weaver explained to us in some detail the K deficiencies of the IA-64 architecture. He's teaching some classes, and oneN1 caught our eye: entitled "Voyage of the Itanic". t  N "Itanic describes the architecture very well," he told us. The class, which isN scheduled for next week, was going to describe how a bright idea went horribly wrong. v  P " My personal apology for any confusion and offense this page may have caused."   N "As a response to my previous public rant disparaging the IA64, I was directedL to take a good look at McKinley (now called Itanium 2) as it has been vastly improved. It is."   @ The Lord moves in mysterious ways, and none more so than this:-   F "IA64 is an interesting architecture.the current version may have beenN disparagingly dubbed the Itanic, but the successor really is vastly superior."   [snip]  A "There was no pressure," he told us. "I simply read the McKinley   documentation."    ---o  ? 	Seems he had enough panache to check his facts.  Good for him.f  < 	One other thing not to be overlooked... HP will be buildingE 	servers for 4 or 5 major OSes.  HP/UX, Tru64, OpenVMS, NSK, Windows,sA 	the engineering gathered/saved across the board (no more MIPS , lH 	no more Alpha) will allow the marshalling of a good bit of engineering  	talent.   				Robo   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 17:37:01 GMTr* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPCA Message-ID: <1JVz8.13825$Ii2.1368690@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>h  8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:evznA+pScZM6@eisner.encompasserve.org... F > In article <aap647$k1k$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes:RI > > In article <L6Tz8.60193$%s3.23734634@typhoon.ne.ipsvc.net>, "Terry C.h) Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes:  > > .n > > .n > > . < > >> Acting on the news yesterday that the Delaware ChanceryK > >>Court has given Hewlett-Packard's acquisition of Compaq a go-ahead, SKCe haswH > >>changed its name to Shannon Knows High Performance Computing. HP, of course,dC > >>can be construed as High Performance or Hewlett-Packard, which,eJ > >>post-acquisition, will be Numero Uno in the High Performance Computing
 > >>arena. > >wL > > I doubt they'll be  "Numero Uno in the High Performance Computing arena"L > > if they persist in their plans to force all their customers onto Itanic. > >e > B > Don't count on it.  It may take a few billion more but they will@ > be at or near the top.  Their boxes will cost a lot less, that > really is a key.  I If that really is the key, then the fact that Hammer box prices will be ao, lot lower still means it won't fit the lock.   ...r  1 > Seems he had enough panache to check his facts.e  K Or just got leaned on - since 'the facts' (you know, actual benchmarks) are   (at least AFAIK) not yet public.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:08:15 -0400n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>A0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC, Message-ID: <3CD02F07.E2354A44@videotron.ca>  
 How about:  M Shannon knows companies that shoot themselves in the foot and disapear withinr
 a few years ?o    $ or Shannon can spot losing companies    * SSPTL : Shannon spots the losing companies  & Shannon knows a loser when he sees one  0 How about Shannon follows VMS wherever it goes ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 14:35:44 +0100iT From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.remove_this.harrison@sun.com>Y Subject: Re: The 'tone' of c.o.v. (was Re: Prediction:  VMS lives, merger or no  merger!)u& Message-ID: <3CCFEF30.3030408@sun.com>   jlsue wrote:  . > On Sun, 21 Apr 2002 17:46:29 -0400, JF Mezei' > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:i >  >  >>"Doc.Cypher" wrote:  >>I >>>Apart from the infamous Mr Harrison, everybody here seems to be of thesJ >>>opinion that VMS is one of the finest operating systems ever developed, >>> P >>In all fairness to "Andy boy", I have rarely seen unjustified criticism of VMSP >>itself at the technical level. He has rightly criticised its marketing and theK >>uncertainty which reigns about its (lack of) future.  And he has recently N >>criticised Wildfire performance claims. But I don't recall intensive battles, >>against VMS at the technical level by him. >>O >>It is pretty hard for him to criticise VMS's clustering for instance since it 2 >>is still ahead of everyone else (including Sun). >> > G > Well, there are a few of these.  One of the most notable involved hisoE > claims of VMSclusters and their usability.  He tried to use  a very"F > small, hand-picked dataset to try to prove that the generality about > VMSclusters was false. >     > Since when did using SAP, Oracle Applications, Baan and other > applications suites as examples constitute a small hand picked9 dataset. I know as an OpenVMS practitioner you havn't hadn9 much exposure to them but that doesn't give you an excuser: to write them off as small hand picked none representative9 examples. Do you know how many customers use Oracle Apps,a* SAP, Baan, JDE, PeopleSoft and Siebel ????  < I also used App servers iPlanet and WLS as examples they are$ also not small hand picked datasets.    H > Pointing out the error of this kind analysis, even including extensiveA > *successful* experience in the area of highly-available cluster = > configurations never produced a positive response from him.m > H > And his "tecnical" claims about the horrible performance of "wildfire"A > has also never been born out by anything more than a handful ofh! > carefully-selected data points.r >     G Sorry bzzt, the datapoints are all the DBMS based benchmarks Compaq hashG published for the GS320's. 100% of the database based benchmark resultseD published by Compaq for the GS320 prove my claims and disprove yours* again not a small unrepresentative sample.  B Let me re-iterate, the DBMS based benchmarks Compaq have published= for GS320's are SAP, Oracle Apps, TPC-H and a number of TPC-CoA results. There are no other comparative published benchmarks frome> Compaq for the boxes and all of them show WildFire performance? to be well below the claims being made by Compaq unless Leadinge" actually means being in 4th place.  5 BTW where are the references you were going to dig upt4 in google to support your claims to have "wacked" me; in the technical discussions we have had on this newsgroup.o  8 Could they be proving more difficult to unearth than you thought.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 01:26:11 -0400A( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>3 Subject: Re: UK/EU OpenVMS job market: non-existanto, Message-ID: <3CCF7C73.5060704@tsoft-inc.com>  D I've fot to back Rob up on this one all the way.  This is how it is.   Rob Young wrote:  o > In article <9f261edc.0204301640.348a0007@posting.google.com>, tessier-ashpool@usa.net (Chris Bardell) writes:3 > h >>young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) wrote in message news:<fwt4dmBcvlvW@eisner.encompasserve.org>... >>  >>[snipped cos getting too long] >> >>F >>>	Perhaps the following is a jaded perception (and came quickly , soB >>>	obviously not a ton of thought) but consider it is most likely >>>	better to: >>>b6 >>>			1)  Have fewer more talented employees than more >>>				less talented employees.m >>>nA >>Absolutely. But what if this isn't a factor, with many staffingeF >>decisions being purely economic? Isn't there a growing short-termism@ >>about everything? In other words, staff regarded as a drain onG >>expenditure, rather than a resource which could be properly exploited-H >>(in the nicest sense of the word). Better get rid of them quick beforeE >>they eat up any of the execs' bonus kitty or make the balance sheetH >>look ...errm ...realistic. >> >>9 >>>			2)  Pay them above industry rates and they won't gog >>>				anywhere. >>>oE >>Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha etc. I'm on planet Earth - not sure about you. G >>Some larger employers haul out Powerpoint presentations every year tosG >>prattle on to the staff about 'position in the upper market quartile' D >>(in English this means "no pay rise this year"). Does your exampleF >>handle favouritism / sycophancy / patronage? These are often reasons >>for paying above the norm. >> >> > > > 	There is paying above the norm and there is being above the
 > 	norm.   > D > 	Perhaps this is a thin analogy... but imagine if your career was A > 	housekeeping.  Now unfortunately, most housekeeping folks makeoC > 	minimum wage (I'm not talking about independents that run a verybC > 	good business, I am talking about folks that work at companies).sD > 	If perchance you are in housekeeping and find yourself making $30J > 	dollars per hour, (as opposed to the normal $6.50-$12 per hour) chancesC > 	are you are there for life or until the job is no more.  So when C > 	I say "pay them above industry rates" I'm not talking about a 3%kA > 	delta, but I'm also not necessarily referring to a 500% delta.@ > 	Somewhere in between.    N Look at this from the perspective of finding a replacement. It costs money andC time. Probably more than what it would cost to retain the employee.r    P Now you may not have seen such, but I have.  It's smart business.  If you as an P employer have grown a good resource, sent him to classes and such, and now have Q a very valuable resource, you do what's required to protect that resource, if at o
 all possible.i      D >>>	I've seen too many cases where there were a goodly number of notI >>>	so talented employees.  Yes, they work and show up every day but wheniE >>>	it comes time to get out of a "tight spot" they don't and flee togG >>>	the hills.  It isn't often that happens of course, but when it does>  >>>	it impacts business - badly. >>>  >>>rF >>Could you be sure such a decision stood up to any real scrutiny? HowE >>could you objectively judge a person's value to a business? Do manyrE >>larger corporations actually know what their staff do? Can they seef >>the (dead)wood for the trees?n >> >> > B > 	I'm wondering why that read so badly.  I'm referring to someoneC > 	because of decision making capacity (use our imaginations) makes I > 	a bad decision which in review was clear to many of his contemporariesnA > 	what should have be done.  As Jerrie noted, these folks seldomhC > 	leave.  What I meant by "flee to the hills" should probably haveS8 > 	read: "duck and cover" and/or "Cover Your Posterier". > G > 	Added value of these people?  You are often better off without them. F > 	I worked with someone over 5 years ago, I had mentioned to a formerI > 	co-worker - that I am still in contact with - the person we knew wouldlG > 	be there until they shut the place down.  She was.  She once told merD > 	"don't expect me to do as much as you do."  Okay, fine with that.D > 	Fact was she would plod along and eventually get something done. F > 	Don't give her more than a couple things to do are she *literally* F > 	looked like she was about to have a breakdown.  Now not everyone isE > 	an overachiever, and being part of a team, it is only fair to helpbH > 	those that are not as strong or skilled as others.  But if you end upB > 	with a boatload of folks like that, you find yourself doing far > 	too much.    N We're talking about 'lifers'.  If you do too good of a job, they're likely to O complain to you about it.  It might give the 'bosses' the idea that more could uL be done by everyone, and then they'd really have to work, not just wait for  quitting time.  O At one company I worked at, an employee was being given a review.  He was told rL that his performance wasn't cutting it.  He was unable to code the simplest M things.  His response, "I've only been here a little over a year.  You can't nL expect me to be able to do that."  Hey, he was hired as a programmer, not a P trainee, and it was a simple, and I do mean simple, coding technique.  This guy F took good money for over a year, and nothing he worked on ever worked!    O >>>>Don't PhD's come these days for stating the obvious, or what is obvious to  N >>>>people trying to stay in the workforce?  These "guys" must be in line for  >>>>Harvard scholarships.c >>>> >>>>F >>>	Probably.  The idea of course is to take a downturn in an economy,H >>>	purge the folks that just hang out and draw a paycheck (we have seenB >>>	them and know who they are) leaving the talent to work harder,G >>>	increasing productivity.   Add doses of automation and viola!  Look-E >>>	at the growth in the U.S. economy and productivity in the last 15oJ >>>	years!  Isn't it marvelous!  Not always .. if you are being wracked byC >>>	mandatory overtime (I know those people) and you don't want it.e >>>" >>> E >>Mandatory overtime? How about banning overtime and to hell with the % >>consequences? That's more the norm.e >> >> > J > 	Ban overtime?  Not if there is a hiring freeze, get it?  I don't agree ; > 	with it.  But that is the way it is (example I know of).r    G The critical work MUST get done.  A company does whatever it has to do.t      D >>My words aren't intended in a sh!tty tone at all - your points areD >>very  interesting - but I think you're idealistic, too trusting ofD >>management, or just plain wrong in a lot of your arguments. And it? >>doesn't sound like you've been on the receiving end of such a0  >>situation in a while, if ever. >> > 0 > 	Trusting of management?  I think you misread. > C > 	Not been on the receiving end?  Right, but I acknowledge I am inMF > 	no way immune.  That person I was referring to above... I left thatE > 	company late 1997.  Things had slowed there considerably and I hadlE > 	been there 7 years.  Four years later they sold the whole divisioneC > 	off parce and parcel.  I had also decided I wanted a VMS career,eB > 	not a career with that company and they were moving their small( > 	installed VMS base to Eunuchs anyhow. > C > 	I may be wrong in my arguments, but I wouldn't know where or hown > 	reading your refrain. > 	 > 				Rob\ >  >    Dave   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 09:15:15 GMT-1 From: LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (Jerry Leslie)r3 Subject: Re: UK/EU OpenVMS job market: non-existant-: Message-ID: <DmOz8.18367$My4.742907@typhoon.austin.rr.com>  ( Carl Perkins (carl@gerg.tamu.edu) wrote:7 : LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (Jerry Leslie) writes...cD : }The trend here is to off-shore outsource as many IT-enabled jobs C : }as quickly as possible, much like the policy of your government:e : } @ : }   http://old.smh.com.au/news/0112/04/national/national1.html; : }   Blueprint for bosses: dump workers and head for Delhic : } H : }  "Australian companies should consider moving operations to India to< : }   exploit lower wages, says a Federal Government report. : } G : }   For operations ranging from call centres to software development, G : }   the report says there would be substantial cost savings in India.- : } F : }   It is the clearest Government endorsement yet of a strategy thatF : }   Australian-based companies are increasingly adopting to maximiseH : }   returns in a globalised economy. The Department of Foreign AffairsH : }   and Trade's economic analytical unit produced the report - India: " : }   new economy, old economy..." : B : It seems to me that Australians could save a considerable amount8 : of money by moving all government operations to India. : I : Which is good, because then they could pay less taxes which goes nicelyeI : with not having any jobs unless they move to India and thus get paid atK : the rates paid in India. : G : Which all works out really well for the Australian aboriginal people,dF : since they are then the only ones left in the country after everyone" : else moves to India to get jobs. :   B The only difference between the Australian and U.S. governments onD offshore outsourcing is that the Australians are more candid (or not as cunning) about it:r  I    http://iwsun4.infoworld.com/articles/fe/xml/01/08/20/010820feindia.xml !    The back office moves to India   ;    http://www.e-businessworld.com/ic_669335_1036_1-729.html !    The back office moves to Indiaj  !    The back office moves to Indiau    By John Ribeiro    August 17, 2001 1:01 pm PT9  G   "...Revenue from IT-enabled services is likely to continue to grow inoH    India despite -- or because of -- the U.S. slowdown, but it is likelyI    to be a low-profile activity, because most customers are wary of beingIG    named. "It doesn't make for good public relations in the U.S. market E    to be seen to be moving jobs outside the United States, even if itnH    makes great economic sense," says a representative for a U.S. company.    that outsources customer support to India."  E There are reports that AT&T Wireless is using an Indian telemarketer, / possible to circumvent new "no call list" laws.   G Here's a list of some of the IT-enabled jobs being relocated offshore :,  4    http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-8324464.html>    India becoming world's back office -  Tech News -  CNET.com  	    [snip]a  E   "They are part of an emerging work force for India's latest export:s    IT-enabled services..  H    These include telemarketing, helpdesk support, medical transcription,@    back-office accounting, payroll management, maintaining legalH    databases, insurance claim and credit-card processing, animation, andI    higher-end engineering design--all of which can be delivered by phone,e     computer and the Internet..."  D U.S. companies like Ford are moving their IT-enabled jobs to India, E saving millions in salaries once paid to American workers/tax payers:e  E    http://www.computerworld.com/storyba/0,4125,NAV47_STO58739,00.html 1    Ford opens IT hub in India to save millions | e'    Computerworld News & Feature Storiesn  C    "...Ford expects to save $30 million to $60 million per year..."    It's not just India, either:  E    http://www.computerworld.com/storyba/0,4125,NAV47_STO60047,00.html -    Outsourcers Begin to Tap Russian Talent | c&    Computerworld News & Features Story  C   "...Unlike India's, Russia's talent is mostly untapped. Although  G    the Washington-based World Bank estimates that Russia has more than hH    1 million technically trained personnel--a little more than the U.S. H    or Japan, and three times as many as India - only about 8,000 people 5    work in the nascent offshore software industry..."h  H    http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36%257E33%257E510226,00.html5    Laid-off tech, telecom workers embrace job centers   I   "...But the job that will grow most in the future may be disappointing nK    to those white-collar workers accustomed to $80,000 to $100,000 salariesi    of the dot-com heyday.   C    Most of Colorado's job growth over the next six years will be inhG    fields like retail sales, office clerks and cashiers - jobs that payt    less than $21,490 a year....a  C There will have to be a sound financial case, or some legal reason,t5 for a whilte-collar job not to be relocated offshore.c  H --Jerry Leslie   leslie@clio.rice.edu  (my opinions are strictly my own)9   Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for email    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 10:05:38 -070000 From: Mark Berryman <Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com>+ Subject: URGENT to all Info-VAX subscribersw, Message-ID: <3CCFBDF2.38514862@Mvb.Saic.Com>  G Because Info-VAX has recently been used to relay messages containing PCeB virii to the Info-VAX mailing list (and comp.os.vms) I have had toB change Info-VAX to be a closed mailing list.  This means that only subscribers can post to it.   E My apologies for doing this out of hand but, since SAIC was receiving-H complaints that SAIC was sending out viruses in email that came from it,= my only choices were to do this or shut down the mailing listo altogether.u  D There are, of course, some side-effects as a result of this action. 	 They are:e  D o  If I don't have a subscription on file for you, you can't post to	 Info-VAX.0B    This will impact all those that subscribe via UGA or some other info-vax relay.C  G o  If the address you subscribed from doesn't match the address you ares
 posting from,h    the post will be rejected.o  H To work around these issues, I have added support for subscriptions thatH are set to NOMAIL.  If you send a message with the following in the body of the message:.   subscribe info-vax set info-vax nomaild  A You will create a subscription that you can post from but doesn'th receive any mailing list mail.  F Again, my apologies for having to do this in this manner.  Please send? me email directly if you have any issues or problems with this.   
 Mark Berrymans Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com Info-VAX administrator  E P.S. This change does not affect the Info-VAX<-->comp.os.vms gateway.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 13:32:40 GMTh8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)+ Subject: Re: VMS 6.2 file ownership problemi8 Message-ID: <Y7Sz8.8$fS1.173180@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>  ( In article <3CCF5057.4C715738@fsi.net>, 3 "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:a  F >What always goofed me up about that was because I could, the softwareG >did, without me so specifying. Wish I could have had more control overe* >it without dropping/resetting privileges.  @ If you run with privs on by default, you are asking for trouble.? With privs on, it is just TOO EASY to do something "bad" before > you realize it.  I have caused myself worse problems than you . describe by forgettting I had privs turned on!  ; I have defined two symbols to turn privs on and off easily:e   PEEK> sho sym priv   PRIV == "SET PROC/PRIV=ALL"g PEEK> sho sym depriv1   DEPRIV == "SET PROC/PRIV=(NOALL,NETMBX,TMPMBX)"c  G Other's have a "PRIV" command that re-sets the "$" (or whatever) promptr6 to something else that reminds you of having privs on.   -- -K     Charlie Hammond -- Compaq Computer Corporation -- Pompano Beach  FL USAaH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.            6                                                          ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 13:52:25 GMTS8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Companye8 Message-ID: <tqSz8.9$fS1.173180@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>  ( In article <3CCF4F4E.D7F77FC5@fsi.net>, 3 "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:m   >Charlie Hammond wrote:  ..A >> Please let us know where we can download your business plan...p .tF >Not sure why when everything you need has already been spelled out in* >this thread and countless others like it.  G Is there specifc, valid market research that shows higher total revenue-@ could be achieved by making OpenVMS "cheap"?  Or giving it away?   -- eK     Charlie Hammond -- Compaq Computer Corporation -- Pompano Beach  FL USAgH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 14:21:32 -0000e= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]>b1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Companye5 Message-ID: <20020501142132.2581.qmail@gacracker.org>n  G On Wed, 01 May 2002, hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)l wrote:) >In article <3CCF4F4E.D7F77FC5@fsi.net>, s4 >"David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: >a >>Charlie Hammond wrote: ..eD >>> Please let us know where we can download your business plan... .G >>Not sure why when everything you need has already been spelled out ine, >>this thread and countless others like it.  > H >Is there specifc, valid market research that shows higher total revenueA >could be achieved by making OpenVMS "cheap"?  Or giving it away?>  J When I first read the initial posts in this thread I thought it was a jokeF because they were talking about practically giving away VMS. That's noK business model at all. However, to address your point, I'd have to say thathK I don't think there is any market research on potential revenue from makingeK VMS "cheap". If Compaq were curious enough I would expect them to carry outr such research.  J However, I do not believe there is a serious entry-level pricing strategy,G and I think there should be. What I would like to see is an entry-levelpH system aimed at smaller businesses, this to include all things like VMS,G TCP/IP, and CSWS - all preinstalled. Basically something with no hiddennH extra costs. This should be something aimed at companies with 50 or lessG employees and be a secure alternative to using Exchange and IIS. MarkettI something like that aggresively and you'll get good sales on it, it won'toJ make an Earth-shattering difference to the revenue figures but it will getF businesses used to the reliability and virus immunity of VMS. As theseH companies grow they'll want to stick with VMS for these reasons - *that* will increase the revenue.     Doc. -- t6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.net    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:36:40 -0400* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>1 Subject: RE: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Companyi- Message-ID: <0033000062249759000002L092*@MHS>t   =0ADoc:l   re:  your last paragraph   Please send address. Cigar to be forthcoming.   WWWebb     -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETh& Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 10:23 AMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET/ Cc: mail2news@freedom.gmsociety.org at INTERNET 1 Subject: RE: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company     H On Wed, 01 May 2002, hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)=   wrote:( >In article <3CCF4F4E.D7F77FC5@fsi.net>,4 >"David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: >d >>Charlie Hammond wrote: .. D >>> Please let us know where we can download your business plan... .H >>Not sure why when everything you need has already been spelled out in=  + >>this thread and countless others like it.u >yH >Is there specifc, valid market research that shows higher total revenu= e>A >could be achieved by making OpenVMS "cheap"?  Or giving it away?o  H When I first read the initial posts in this thread I thought it was a j= oke F because they were talking about practically giving away VMS. That's noH business model at all. However, to address your point, I'd have to say = thatH I don't think there is any market research on potential revenue from ma= kingH VMS "cheap". If Compaq were curious enough I would expect them to carry=  out such research.  H However, I do not believe there is a serious entry-level pricing strate= gy, H and I think there should be. What I would like to see is an entry-level=  H system aimed at smaller businesses, this to include all things like VMS= ,dH TCP/IP, and CSWS - all preinstalled. Basically something with no hidden=  H extra costs. This should be something aimed at companies with 50 or les= stH employees and be a secure alternative to using Exchange and IIS. Market=  H something like that aggresively and you'll get good sales on it, it won= 'tH make an Earth-shattering difference to the revenue figures but it will = getsF businesses used to the reliability and virus immunity of VMS. As theseH companies grow they'll want to stick with VMS for these reasons - *that= *b will increase the revenue.     Doc. --6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.H ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb= net=   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 15:03:38 -0000e= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> 1 Subject: RE: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company 5 Message-ID: <20020501150338.4663.qmail@gacracker.org>o  ? On Wed, 1 May 2002, WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov> wrote:t >  Doc: >e >re:  your last paragraphh >d >Please send address.  >Cigar to be forthcoming.p  J Thanks, I'll pass on the cigar - the Belgian postal service would probably
 mangle it.  H It was just a less sensationalist rework of my "Free The OpenVMS 7" post which can be found atoB http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=FreeThe.OpenVMS_7@nowhere.nil     >-----Original Message----- 0 >From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET' >Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 10:23 AMwC >To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET 0 >Cc: mail2news@freedom.gmsociety.org at INTERNET2 >Subject: RE: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company   <snip>  L >>However, I do not believe there is a serious entry-level pricing strategy,I >>and I think there should be. What I would like to see is an entry-leveloJ >>system aimed at smaller businesses, this to include all things like VMS,I >>TCP/IP, and CSWS - all preinstalled. Basically something with no hidden J >>extra costs. This should be something aimed at companies with 50 or lessI >>employees and be a secure alternative to using Exchange and IIS. Market,K >>something like that aggresively and you'll get good sales on it, it won'tnL >>make an Earth-shattering difference to the revenue figures but it will getH >>businesses used to the reliability and virus immunity of VMS. As theseJ >>companies grow they'll want to stick with VMS for these reasons - *that* >>will increase the revenue.     Doc. -- l6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.net    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 16:01:55 GMTt8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company.9 Message-ID: <TjUz8.15$9W1.295971@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>e  6 In article <20020501142132.2581.qmail@gacracker.org>, ? Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:.  K >When I first read the initial posts in this thread I thought it was a joke G >because they were talking about practically giving away VMS. That's no. >business model at all.    As did I -- we agree on this.w  K >However, I do not believe there is a serious entry-level pricing strategy,-H >and I think there should be. What I would like to see is an entry-level& >system aimed at smaller businesses...  C While I am sympthetic to this argument, once again I do not see the C market research to back it up.  However, the good news is that whengC OpenVMS runs on Intel hardare, there are likely to be better pricedrB entry-level systems.  No, don't expect OpenVMS to run on absolutly$ every cheap PC in the market, but...   -- iK     Charlie Hammond -- Compaq Computer Corporation -- Pompano Beach  FL USA1H        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 12:23:22 -0400r- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Companye, Message-ID: <3CD01679.EC2F87BC@videotron.ca>   Charlie Hammond wrote:I > Is there specifc, valid market research that shows higher total revenueuB > could be achieved by making OpenVMS "cheap"?  Or giving it away?  M Compaq has, hidden in its "don't ever tell anyone" safe, data that shows thatrG a token marketing of VMS can result in significant increased VMS sales.c  6 VMS is purposely not marketed in for whatever reason.   M Buy it from HP/Compaq, and  VMS is no longer under a gag order from MicrosoftoE and can then be freely marketed against Windows and Unix. Buy it fromeK HP/Compaq and VMS no longer has to subsidize the unprofitable PC operationsd and THEIR marketing.    J If Compaq had sold the Digital assets it wasn't interested in (Alpha, VMS,L Tru64) at the time it bought Digital, the buyer of those products might haveG agressively re-energized those ex-Digital products and in fact grown toe surpass Compaq.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 12:27:30 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Companyx, Message-ID: <3CD01770.DBDBDBF1@videotron.ca>   "Doc.Cypher" wrote: M > I don't think there is any market research on potential revenue from makingeM > VMS "cheap". If Compaq were curious enough I would expect them to carry outA > such research.  M If at all, I think that Compaq would have commissioned studies that show thatiN VMS has no long term future, no potential for small/medium businesses and thatL Windows will slowly encroach what is left of the VMS marketplace. Such studyL would help support certain people inside of Compaq who have as an agenda, to help Bill Gates.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 16:33:53 -0000 4 From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]>1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company 5 Message-ID: <20020501163353.7389.qmail@gacracker.org>a  G On Wed, 01 May 2002, hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)  wrote:7 >In article <20020501142132.2581.qmail@gacracker.org>, h@ >Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes: >oL >>When I first read the initial posts in this thread I thought it was a jokeH >>because they were talking about practically giving away VMS. That's no >>business model at all. l >r >As did I -- we agree on this. >rL >>However, I do not believe there is a serious entry-level pricing strategy,I >>and I think there should be. What I would like to see is an entry-level ( >>system aimed at smaller businesses...  >hD >While I am sympthetic to this argument, once again I do not see theD >market research to back it up.  However, the good news is that whenD >OpenVMS runs on Intel hardare, there are likely to be better pricedC >entry-level systems.  No, don't expect OpenVMS to run on absolutly % >every cheap PC in the market, but...   I I don't think any market research would give you conclusions on which you F could base a business decision about entry-level systems. What are youK going to ask people? The biggest problem is that the second you say VMS (orhI OpenVMS if you prefer) they're going to say "what's that?". It ain't your J fault, but I'm disgusted that nobody is addressing *that* problem. Anyway,J how you word the questions is something that can show you just how useless% or pointless market research can be. a   Example, ask the following:h  B   "Would you invest in a VMS system given that it is immune to allC   recent internet worms and virii and can provide you with the same.@   services as a PC server and potentially offer 99.999% uptime?"  I Everyone would say yes, and you've got the market research to back up the.	 decision.   I Ask different questions and you'll get different answers. Market researchoK is mostly just a good way of getting someone else to tell you what you wanteG to do is a good idea. Unless you've got a really good set of questions.eH And, as I mentioned before, it should be the job of the VMS owners to doH said market research. I believe it is in the company's best interests toJ investigate all and any way of increasing the installed base, and thus theG revenue. Like any intelligent "dealer" you want to get people hooked onr your products early on.e  K As to VMS running on Intel hardware, I'd say that this resulting in cheaper-G systems is seeming less likely. Hammer and Yamhill may just destroy anyrH hopes of IA64 systems becoming commodity items and thus more affordable.# Now, if there's a port to Hammer....     Doc. --  6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.net    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 17:23:56 GMTr* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: VMS Bigots Unite To Form New Company-@ Message-ID: <MwVz8.26459$Lj.2046866@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  J "Doc.Cypher" <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in message/ news:20020501150338.4663.qmail@gacracker.org...tA > On Wed, 1 May 2002, WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov> wrote:s > >i > Doc: > >  > >re:  your last paragraphn > >X > >Please send address.l > >Cigar to be forthcoming.A > L > Thanks, I'll pass on the cigar - the Belgian postal service would probably > mangle it. > J > It was just a less sensationalist rework of my "Free The OpenVMS 7" post > which can be found at D > http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=FreeThe.OpenVMS_7@nowhere.nil  I Which (not to in any way detract from the above) was also very much alongeH the lines of the entry-level system suggestions we included in our groupI letter to Curly two years ago.  And we know how well *that* got received.a   - bill   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 09:29:16 -0500/ From: "Stuart, Ed" <Ed.Stuart@austinenergy.com>k Subject: VMS Job OpportunitiesT Message-ID: <92EFB80E551BD511B39500D0B7B0CDCC0642C3B8@ohms.electric.ci.austin.tx.us>  J I was recently contacted by the folks at a ticketing and access company asI they were looking for VMS developer talent and leadership in the Phoenix,6< Arizona area.  If you are interested in learning more go to: http://abouttmcs.com/jobs/   EdE **Please apply a generous amount of all the usual disclaimers here.**i   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 01:28:15 -0400 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> Subject: Re: VMS SCAN productc, Message-ID: <3CCF7CEF.7060905@tsoft-inc.com>  
 ualski wrote:y  ? > My favorite is PCCTS (Perdue Compiler Construction Tool Set).p3 > I didn't check this link but it might still work:f( > http://www.ece.purdue.edu/~hankd/PCCTS >  > Hope this helps. >  > -- Aaron Sliwinski >  > Lock Horsburgh wrote:  > L >>Once upon a time we had a DEC product called SCAN, which was used to parseG >>input text and generate different outputs - like code generation, andO( >>language translations from Basic to C.    J This product would be more helpful if the translation was from C to Basic.  * Let the religous language wars begin.  :-)    * >>We understand this product is long dead. >>L >>Does anyone remember the package, and does anyone have any recommendationsI >>for other tools to do this kind of thing, whether on VMS or UNIX or PC?e >> >>Lock.e >>Lock.. >> >>--- ( >>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< >>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A >>Version: 6.0.336 / Virus Database: 188 - Release Date: 11/03/02( >>   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 08:38:43 -0500s- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen). Subject: Re: VMS SCAN productF3 Message-ID: <IWkPI34M0k5F@eisner.encompasserve.org>f  W In article <3CCF7CEF.7060905@tsoft-inc.com>, David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:a > ualski wrote:l > @ >> My favorite is PCCTS (Perdue Compiler Construction Tool Set).4 >> I didn't check this link but it might still work:) >> http://www.ece.purdue.edu/~hankd/PCCTSc >> t >> Hope this helps.e >> - >> -- Aaron Sliwinskim >>   >> Lock Horsburgh wrote: >> aM >>>Once upon a time we had a DEC product called SCAN, which was used to parsecH >>>input text and generate different outputs - like code generation, and) >>>language translations from Basic to C.e >  > L > This product would be more helpful if the translation was from C to Basic. > , > Let the religous language wars begin.  :-)  C There is no benefit for a particular language if it is coded in the B foreign style of some other language.  That would be the result ofD performing such translations with SCAN.  Thus it is not particularlyD useful except for the pathelogically trivial case of not having some particular compiler license.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 16:17:05 GMT * From: John Reagan <john.reagan@compaq.com> Subject: Re: VMS SCAN productr) Message-ID: <3CD013D0.1020704@compaq.com>t   Larry Kilgallen wrote:   >  > Try the command: >  > 	HELP LINK/VAX    B Has anybody actually used this?  You would still need all the VAX F shareables, VAX object libraries (STARLET.OLB), etc. to link against. H You don't want Alpha GSMATCH values to be in your VAX .EXE (even if you  just turn around and VEST it).  F I don't think documenting the "cross-linker" was a good idea.  It has C limited value.  I can't imagine this being carried over to Itanium.h   -- e John Reagan ' Compaq Pascal/{A|I}MACRO Project Leader    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2002 09:29:52 -0700o) From: pk@perdignus.com (Patrick Kirchner)e= Subject: VMSBACKUP on Unix/Linux -  VAX / VMS tape archives ? = Message-ID: <f793c8b5.0205010829.6cd16fb9@posting.google.com>    Hello,  D I've found the source code for the vmsbackup utility and was able to: compile it in Linux, but I'm not able to restore any data.   The error I'm stuck at is:  * "Snark: Invalid header block size 1 !=256"  > I do see the Volume name and  SaveSet name with  this command. "vmsbackup -tf /dev/st0"  A but no matter what I enter for a block size I get the above errore message.  B Restore says the tape block size is (80) which it doesn't care for# since it is not a multiple of 1024.o  D The closest  I've found of anyone solving this  was a gentleman thatA stated he was able to modify the source code to ignore the headertC block size, but I'm not that  adept with C and haven't been able to  successfully do this.v  9 Has anyone been able to use this utility to restore data?,  ; If anyone could please offer me some assistance I'd be mostp
 appreciative.:   Thanks much, Patrick.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 01 May 2002 10:14:53 -0400l% From: Jim Agnew <agnew@mail2.vcu.edu>s$ Subject: Re: Whining about HPS Times- Message-ID: <3CCFF85D.A8535885@mail2.vcu.edu>m   "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > 2 > John@helferlein.net, Jones@helferlein.net wrote:    A > > I got mine.  Too bad you didn't get yours.  Maybe bad karhma?  > 9 > Maybe folks should stop whining about people whining...B >        Qua'Pla!!!!!!!!  Amen, Bro!!     J.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.240 ************************