1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 16 May 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 269       Contents:G Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS G Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS F Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re:freeVMSF Re: Acrobat (Was: Re: Scott Stallard, forget your VMS to HP UX dream!)F Re: Acrobat (Was: Re: Scott Stallard, forget your VMS to HP UX dream!)F Re: Acrobat (Was: Re: Scott Stallard, forget your VMS to HP UX dream!)
 Building Perl  Calling DecFroms from CXX 3 Re: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix   DCL symbol substitution question$ Re: DCL symbol substitution question( Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........( Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........( Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........( Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........( Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........4 Experts (Was : internet address on a Decserver 90TL)- Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning  Re: FTP mget on latest files ? Re: FTP mget on latest files ? Re: FTP mget on latest files ? Re: FTP mget on latest files ?$ internet address on a Decserver 90TL( Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL( Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL( Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TLP Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager  availabP Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager  availabP Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager availablP Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager availabl8 Re: MacOS/X is the leading Unix (was "Itanium Troubles")= Newsgroup posting guidelines - Was DCPS and Poscript Printing  Re: No new Alpha sales Re: No new Alpha sales Re: No new Alpha sales Re: OpenVMS Hobbyist License Re: OpenVMS SNMP TRAP   Re: Password for Infoserver 1000% Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support? % Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support?  Re: Powered by HP 0 Re: Problem with the internal clock of an XP10004 Re: problems setting socket nonblocking with fcntl() Re: Proxy question Re: Proxy question Re: Proxy question Re: Proxy question Re: Proxy question Rdb Technical Forum Reminder' Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC  Re: System manager available Re: System manager available Re: System manager available Re: System manager available Re: TCP/IP for VMS...HELP! Re: TCP/IP for VMS...HELP!7 Re: Telecom fix-line billing systems running on OpenVMS  Re: Tivoli ABC for VMS Re: Tivoli ABC for VMS Re: Version of the KZPBA Re: Version of the KZPBA; VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools? 0 Re: What is good model for disk i/o w/shadowing?0 Re: What is good model for disk i/o w/shadowing? Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing!5 Windows XP Updates: More Trouble Than They're Worth ?  Worth a read Re: Worth a read Re: Worth a read Re: [announce] FreeVMS 0.0.14 - [Q]  VMS incremental backups vs. other brands   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:50:19 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")P Subject: Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS8 Message-ID: <00A0DFC1.7152D498@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  T In article <abu00v$q3d$1@reader1.panix.com>, John Forkosh <john@invalid.com> writes:D >Simon Clubley <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote:	 ><<snip>> 9 >: The kinds of things that I would really like to see on  >: Linux/Unix are: >:J >: 2) RMS. The purpose here is to have a decent free ISAM facility (I knowK >:    that C-ISAM is commercially available) in it's own right, and RMS has A >:    proven to be very reliable and feature rich over the years.  > : >Try Berkeley db.  That's actually the current "standard".E >The current software is freely available (for noncommercial/hobbyist @ >purposes) from  www.sleepycat.com, and works real well for most >isam requirements.   H Although sleepycat has been the cause of many, many problems in PMDF on I Unix platforms; it seems that concurrent updates from different processes M can result in corrupted databases, which doesn't seem to be a problem on VMS.   # This history makes me very nervous.    -- Alan   O =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056 M  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA  94309-0210 O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:00:05 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> P Subject: Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS' Message-ID: <3CE315DA.4A102E50@fsi.net>    John Forkosh wrote:  > ( > John Forkosh <john@invalid.com> wrote:G > : Simon Clubley <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote:  > : <<snip>>< > : : The kinds of things that I would really like to see on > : : Linux/Unix are:  > : : M > : : 2) RMS. The purpose here is to have a decent free ISAM facility (I know N > : :    that C-ISAM is commercially available) in it's own right, and RMS hasD > : :    proven to be very reliable and feature rich over the years. > = > : Try Berkeley db.  That's actually the current "standard". H > : The current software is freely available (for noncommercial/hobbyistC > : purposes) from  www.sleepycat.com, and works real well for most  > : isam requirements. > 9 > I forgot to mention that I think (haven't tried it yet) 7 > Berkeley db should build okay under vms, too.  So you / > could first migrate apps away from rms [snip]   7 I just wanna make sure that folks understand something:   C RMS "dependence" is more a function of the source language than the D program. Here, of course, I'm speaking of the more "humand readable"F languages like BASIC, FORTRAN, COBOL, etc. where the language elementsB could just as easily be used with C-ISAM or some other ISAM scheme besides RMS.  H In languages where RMS is less "native", it may be more necessary to use: the appropriate macros and/or RTL/System Service routines.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 01:55:24 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> O Subject: Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re:freeVMS ' Message-ID: <3CE314C2.156F1615@fsi.net>    Andrew Balaam wrote: > C > Surely the fundementals at the 'kernel' level are more important.  >  > Decent process scheduling, > ASTs and event flags > Logical names  > Mailboxes  > H > These things (and more) are (in my opinion) what makes VMS VMS and not > just another Unix.  C Perhaps. However, the others are the "look and feel" which are also  unique to VMS (more or less).    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 18:13:42 +0000 2 From: John Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org>O Subject: Re: Acrobat (Was: Re: Scott Stallard, forget your VMS to HP UX dream!) 4 Message-ID: <20020515181342.C26079@eisenschmidt.org>   --7qSK/uQB79J36Y4o* Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline + Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   L Oh sure, I mean I'm not stupid. I think we were talking about bulk reproduc=L tion digitally. I'm not saying it can't be done, but it can be made very, v=  ery difficult if one so chooses.  L Unless the Voices are Mistaken, Atlant Schmidt (atlantnospam@mindspring.com= ) Wrote: > John Eisenschmidt wrote: >=20 > > Print Inhibit Security.  > > 
 > > Next =3D)  >=20 > Fine.  >=20 >   1. Screen-shot, fed to OCR.  >=20= >   2. Human, 3-cents/hour employee in a third-world country,  >       transcribing it. >=20: > Face it, if it's displayed to a human, it can be copied. >=20 >=20 > Atlant >=20   --=20 / John W. Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org> 6  Homepage URL    | http://www.eisenschmidt.org/jweisenL  PGP Public Key  | http://www.eisenschmidt.org/jweisen/misc/jeisenschmidt.a= scD  PGP Fingerprint | 5F9B F916 5AD1 3295 CF99 BC1E 1F97 E6A3 37E3 BEF2  L FOO MANE PADME HUM: "Our first obligation is to keep the FOO counters turni= ng."   --7qSK/uQB79J36Y4o' Content-Type: application/pgp-signature  Content-Disposition: inline    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----  Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (OpenBSD) * Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org  @ iD8DBQE84qVWH5fmozfjvvIRAvHXAJ90Snc8B3bc50ewlJiw5RP+4st/XACfWNZj sLMJsSoWOMYhlLPGWAm5gSk= =5YBc  -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----    --7qSK/uQB79J36Y4o--   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:48:21 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> O Subject: Re: Acrobat (Was: Re: Scott Stallard, forget your VMS to HP UX dream!) , Message-ID: <3CE2AD6F.36666322@videotron.ca>   John Eisenschmidt wrote: >  > Print Inhibit Security.  > 	 > Next =)   M I can import PDF into Freehand or Illustrator.  The disadvantage is that text N is not "flowed", but retaher each text block is a separete object, sometimes aN line is broken into multiple text blocks due to kerming/spacing considerationsA (depends on how the original application generated the postcript)    for instance  3 (the quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog) show    would generate one text block.  L (the ) show (quick brown ) show (fox jumped over ) show (the lazy dog) show   R would generage multiple text blocks so you couldn't select the whole line of text.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:39:36 -0400 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>O Subject: Re: Acrobat (Was: Re: Scott Stallard, forget your VMS to HP UX dream!) . Message-ID: <3CE2AB68.4AB38BC6@mindspring.com>   John Eisenschmidt wrote:  9 > Oh sure, I mean I'm not stupid. I think we were talking < > about bulk reproduction digitally. I'm not saying it can't< > be done, but it can be made very, very difficult if one so
 > chooses.  5 Ahh! The Windows approach to security! Don't actually > make it secure, just make it *APPEAR* secure to the rubes! :-)  8 I remember back to when Digital was training us on their7 brand new shiny Exchange mail system. There's a feature 5 in there that claims to make forwarded mail immune to 3 editing by downstream forwarders. My manager was in 7 the class with me and believed the feature worked, so I 6 asked her to send me any memo with the bit set. I soon9 forwarded it back to her with "her" unmodifiable text now : containing a note that raised my salary to $200K/year. :-)   Atlant   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 18:02:31 -0400 ; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>  Subject: Building Perl$ Message-ID: <3ce2dae7$1@news.si.com>  H I'm trying to build Perl V5.3.5 from the Freeware 4 CD on an OpenVMS VAX> V7.2 system with COmpaq C V6.4-5.  I get to one point and see:  J             (void)times((tbuffer_t *)&timesbuf);  /* time.h uses different name for */         ................^ H %CC-W-PTRMISMATCH, In this statement, the referenced type of the pointer value B  "(tbuffer_t ...)&Perl_timesbuf" is "struct tbuffer", which is not
 compatible  with "struct tms". &                 At line number 3091 in0 A305_DISK:[TILLMAN.PERL.PERL5_003_05]PP_SYS.C;1.  L This aborts the MMS build.  I suppose I could add /IGNORE=WARNING to the MMS; command, but that doesn't seem to address the real problem.   J Have any of you who've built Perl on VMS seen this problem and know how to  fix it?  I'm not a C programmer. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com = 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 16:06:25 -0700) From: DWilliams@wga.com (Damian Williams) " Subject: Calling DecFroms from CXX= Message-ID: <4e909558.0205151506.22b2fc2d@posting.google.com>   ? Has anyone been able to call a decforms screen using Compaq C++ F V6.2-016?  I have tried the examples provided by Digitial (compaq/HP?)@ with no success.  The first error I received at compile time wasD "%CXX-E-MANYARGUMENTS, too many arguments in function call " and was told by support that  D "the C++ engineering team suggested this particular problem seems toC be with how forms$enable() function is declared. Most likely, it is D declared in some header file supplied by DecForms and suggested thatD we need to check to ensure that it is declared with the exact numberD of arguments and extern "C" linkage.  C++ Engineering noted, that anF empty identifier list in the function declaration will work for C, but not for C++: "  > OK, so I changed the FORMS$C_DEFINITIONS.H file from "long int forms$enable();"  to "extern long int forms$enable                 ( 1                         long int *vector_address, =                         struct dsc$descriptor_s *device_name, <                         struct dsc$descriptor_s *session_id,@                         struct dsc$descriptor_s *form_file_name,,                         __optional_params);"? and now receive no errors on the compile but on the link I get    & %LINK-W-NUDFSYMS, 2 undefined symbols:? %LINK-I-UDFSYM,         long forms$disable(dsc$descriptor_s *)  E %LINK-I-UDFSYM,         long forms$enable(long *, dsc$descriptor_s *, , dsc$descriptor_s *, dsc$descriptor_s *, ...)F %LINK-W-USEUNDEF, undefined symbol long forms$disable(dsc$descriptor_s
 *) referenced )         in psect $LINK$ offset %X00000050 '         in module CLCLIB0402_TEST1 file " [CLCLIB0402]CLCLIB0402_TEST1.OBJ;1< %LINK-W-USEUNDEF, undefined symbol long forms$enable(long *,@ dsc$descriptor_s *, dsc$descriptor_s *, dsc$descriptor_s *, ...) refere nced)         in psect $LINK$ offset %X00000060 '         in module CLCLIB0402_TEST1 file " [CLCLIB0402]CLCLIB0402_TEST1.OBJ;1  / ANY help or suggestions are greatly apreciated.    ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 16:14:01 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)< Subject: Re: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0205151514.772f3235@posting.google.com>   a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3CDC104D.938DB683@videotron.ca>...  > Bob Ceculski wrote: J > > it already has survived, and I would say that jstars, miltary, DOD, USK > > gov use, Cerner, Pitts. Super Computing and the list goes on and on are M > > the reason vms will survive ... MPE was 16 bit, neglected, no clustering,  > J > Consider some recent "super computing" deal that HP signed, promising toN > deliver a super machine with over 1000 CPus based on IA64. Sounds to me thatK > HP isn't even interested in selling Alphas NOW, they prefer to delay cash % > input until IA64 is actually ready.  > L > Secondly, jstarts, military etc are just like existing MPE customers: theyN > will continue to receive support. They do not mean that VMS will continue to > be developped.  A the only tools vms needs are in place ... "C" and Java and Apache A (html,xml) are in place ... anything can now be ported w/relative ? ease from unix/linux ... 3rd party vendors/shareware will take  D over from here ... ports have already begun, esp. java (BEA,Ericom)!   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 17:13:04 -0500 * From: "Mark Jensen" <markje@vistainfo.com>) Subject: DCL symbol substitution questione4 Message-ID: <R3BE8.80207$vm6.15015645@ruti.visi.com>  J I'm writing a little tool that allows our support staff to create flatfileK archives of data.  To do this I simply assign sys$output to a temp file, do L a sql display to get the data, deassign sys$output, then read each line fromI the temp file into a symbol and write append from that into the flatfile,a one line at a time.l  F The two problems I'm running into is one, something is transforming myE data's single quotes into double quotes, then (problem two) recursivebK substitutions are mucking up the empty single quotes by trying to transformP( the text after it as a symbol.  Example:B The data in the symbol often has something like "<FIELD Name="BOB" Override="" />"s/ That becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />"rF Which then becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override= />", stripping out the double single-quoatations.> Which is a bad thing, as poor data integrity sometimes can be.  L Here's a code snippet.  Can anyone tell me how to only substitute the symbol/ once?  It's a string literal so I can't amp it.   % $ read/end=CLOSEINPUT INPUT NAMESLINE  $ deassign sys$output & $ assign /user 'WIZARDTEMP' sys$output@ $!Order in NAMESLINE: wWIZCOMP, wNAME, wLEVEL, wRESOURCE, wAGENT: $ if (f$edit(NAMESLINE,"trim").eqs."") then goto READINPUTE $! Commas are allowed in a wizard name, so cannot use f$element...usee& f$extract since fields are fixed width% $ wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,NAMESLINE)a- $ wNAME = """"+f$extract(2,32,NAMESLINE)+""""s$ $ wLEVEL = f$extract(35,1,NAMESLINE)C $ wRESOURCE = """"+f$element(0,".",f$extract(37,34,NAMESLINE))+"""" > $ wAGENT = """"+f$edit(f$extract(72,12,NAMESLINE),"trim")+""""C $ sql display wizards sequence, wizard where wizcomp='wWIZCOMP' and:& name='wNAME' and blah blah blah *snip*! $ open/read WIZINPUT 'WIZARDTEMP'a $ READWIZARDTEMP:e* $ read/end=CLOSEWIZINPUT WIZINPUT TEMPLINEI $! the record is 396 bytes fixed, the first six are the sequence field, 6i bytest& $ TEMPLINE = f$extract(6,400,TEMPLINE)B $! split into two 200 byte strings to evade the DCL 255 byte limit) $ TEMPSTRING1 = f$extract(0,200,TEMPLINE)f+ $ TEMPSTRING2 = f$extract(200,200,TEMPLINE)p $! append to the text file# $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'" # $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING2'"  $ TEMPSTRING1="" $ TEMPSTRING2=""
 $ TEMPLINE=""n $ goto READWIZARDTEMPx       Thanks,  Mark Jensenn FNIS   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 23:05:58 +0000 (UTC)d5 From: "Bill Sticker" <NOSPAMPLEASE@SPAMSTOPPER.CO.UK>m- Subject: Re: DCL symbol substitution questione/ Message-ID: <abupkm$oof$1@helle.btinternet.com>r  I You've snipped some of the lkabels out so it's a bit trick to follow youroE DCL script without exerting a lot of effort. Some suggestions though; I Have you tried setting the output file in an SQL statement? Cant remember I how you do it (something like "SQL$ SET OUTPUT outputfile") but I know ito can be done.J You might preserve the original contents of your strings better if instead of using something like!# wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,NAMESLINE)  you use ( wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,"'NAMESLINE''")	 and so on J The substitution of quotes is explained in the DCL manual. It works if you understand it.    5 "Mark Jensen" <markje@vistainfo.com> wrote in message . news:R3BE8.80207$vm6.15015645@ruti.visi.com...L > I'm writing a little tool that allows our support staff to create flatfileJ > archives of data.  To do this I simply assign sys$output to a temp file, doI > a sql display to get the data, deassign sys$output, then read each liner fromK > the temp file into a symbol and write append from that into the flatfile,S > one line at a time.. >2H > The two problems I'm running into is one, something is transforming myG > data's single quotes into double quotes, then (problem two) recursiveoC > substitutions are mucking up the empty single quotes by trying to 	 transform * > the text after it as a symbol.  Example:D > The data in the symbol often has something like "<FIELD Name="BOB" > Override="" />":1 > That becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />"oH > Which then becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override= />", stripping out the > double single-quoatations.@ > Which is a bad thing, as poor data integrity sometimes can be. >wG > Here's a code snippet.  Can anyone tell me how to only substitute thew symbol1 > once?  It's a string literal so I can't amp it.m >s' > $ read/end=CLOSEINPUT INPUT NAMESLINEs > $ deassign sys$outputi( > $ assign /user 'WIZARDTEMP' sys$outputB > $!Order in NAMESLINE: wWIZCOMP, wNAME, wLEVEL, wRESOURCE, wAGENT< > $ if (f$edit(NAMESLINE,"trim").eqs."") then goto READINPUTG > $! Commas are allowed in a wizard name, so cannot use f$element...use=( > f$extract since fields are fixed width' > $ wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,NAMESLINE)@/ > $ wNAME = """"+f$extract(2,32,NAMESLINE)+"""" & > $ wLEVEL = f$extract(35,1,NAMESLINE)E > $ wRESOURCE = """"+f$element(0,".",f$extract(37,34,NAMESLINE))+""""F@ > $ wAGENT = """"+f$edit(f$extract(72,12,NAMESLINE),"trim")+""""E > $ sql display wizards sequence, wizard where wizcomp='wWIZCOMP' and ( > name='wNAME' and blah blah blah *snip*# > $ open/read WIZINPUT 'WIZARDTEMP'm > $ READWIZARDTEMP:R, > $ read/end=CLOSEWIZINPUT WIZINPUT TEMPLINEK > $! the record is 396 bytes fixed, the first six are the sequence field, 6r > bytese( > $ TEMPLINE = f$extract(6,400,TEMPLINE)D > $! split into two 200 byte strings to evade the DCL 255 byte limit+ > $ TEMPSTRING1 = f$extract(0,200,TEMPLINE)t- > $ TEMPSTRING2 = f$extract(200,200,TEMPLINE)  > $! append to the text file% > $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'" % > $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING2'"  > $ TEMPSTRING1="" > $ TEMPSTRING2="" > $ TEMPLINE=""i > $ goto READWIZARDTEMP  >o >  >b	 > Thanks,a
 > Mark Jensen  > FNIS >h >e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:37:01 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 1 Subject: Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........e, Message-ID: <3CE2AAC8.51D80B5B@videotron.ca>   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:tP > The address involved is in the UK. If the poster or his company is also in theM > UK then I'm pretty sure the poster has just violated the UK Data protectionu > act.  M If you only knew what banks do , you'd know that they don't have much respectoM for data security laws when their money is at stake. I can name a few britishhE banks if you want. ( I worked 15 years helping banks get around thoseeA limitations and helped them exchange private customer informationoK internationally between themselves, if you are refused a large bank deal iniN one bank, don't be surprised if it will be refused by other large banks around the world).e  L Secondly, how do you know that the data posted by the poster isn't some test data ?   ------------------------------   Date: 15 May 2002 18:18 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)h1 Subject: Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........e- Message-ID: <15MAY200218185975@gerg.tamu.edu>r  : mgattaura@collins-stewart.com (Mandeep Gattaura) writes...- }But when I print the file, using the commandnA }"PRINT/QUE=PS_QUEUE/FORM=PS_FORM PRINTFILE.PS" . But the printereF }prints out data (with no form) on the first sheet, and then a load of& }blank forms on the subsequent sheets.    ! }/old_showpage /showpage load defi- }/showpage { old_showpage contract_note } deft; }Can anyone give me some advice on where I am going wrong ?a }  }TIA }Mandeep  A As I mentioned before, you should try putting the form before the 
 old showpage:t  , /showpage { contract_note old_showpage } def  > If you don't, it will execute the old showpage function beforeB the form is actually on the page. Since the old showpage is prettyC much certain to prevent you from putting anything else on the page,a? this would be why you don't get the form on the first page. (If-@ you have a "print stuff, showpage, print stuff" command sequenceC the stuff before the showpage is on the first page, the stuff afterlG the showpage is on the second page. Now notice where your contract_note F currently is located relative to the old_showpage and guess which page# you should expect it to appear on.)t  C You might consider where the "current insertion point" (or whatevereA it is called) is located before and after you put the form on the A page. You may need to make sure that things are positioned to puti> the data on the paper where you expect it to be. You have beenD doing contract_note as the first thing on each page after the first.E This puts the form on the paper and it's last line is probably at, ordC at least near, the end of the sheet but if you don't reposition the B current location to the start of the page, I expect that you wouldD that the data you are trying to print on the form is instead printedC off the bottom of the sheet since normal text tends to use relativepB positioning just moving down a line for every line of text - whichB would explain why your 2nd and subsequent pages currently have the? form printed on them but not anything else. After switching thetG order of the old_shopwage and contract_note as I said above this shouldsD not be a problem as your form printing is using absolute positioning
 in inches.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 20:17:59 -04005- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>B1 Subject: Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........e, Message-ID: <3CE2FA9C.ED0A122F@videotron.ca>   Carl Perkins wrote:iC > As I mentioned before, you should try putting the form before theo > old showpage:r > . > /showpage { contract_note old_showpage } def    J The problem with this is that the form will be imaged OVER the data, so itP would erase any data that was rasterized where the form occupies the same space.  N Consider the case where the form contains a gray square in which you want someL text. If you draw the square after the text, the text is erased. If you drawM the text after the square, the text erases only the areas of the square undere each letter.  J The best technique is to have the program generate postscript that calls aL page initialisation routine, then images the data and then issues a standardG showpage. This way, each page has obvious form drawing before the data.l  K If you redefine showpage, it is best to have it do the showpage to complete33 the current page and then initialise the next page.n  J The drawback is that you have to specifically/manually do the first page'sM initialisation (perhaps at end of prologue), and at the end, the printer will Q have a partially built page which you should eject with a "old_showpage" command.r  E > You might consider where the "current insertion point" (or whatevermC > it is called) is located before and after you put the form on thep > page.   K "currentpoint". This can easily be overcome with gsave/grestore combinationu that wrap the form drawing.o   eg:i gsaveaH x y moveto, translates, rotates, whip cream, bake cake, draw a clown etc grestore  V After grestore, the environment returns to what it was at the time gsave was executed.   ------------------------------   Date: 15 May 2002 20:00 CDTe' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)i1 Subject: Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........t- Message-ID: <15MAY200220001745@gerg.tamu.edu>t  1 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes...  }Carl Perkins wrote:D }> As I mentioned before, you should try putting the form before the }> old showpage: }> t/ }> /showpage { contract_note old_showpage } defs }  } K }The problem with this is that the form will be imaged OVER the data, so it Q }would erase any data that was rasterized where the form occupies the same space.e } O }Consider the case where the form contains a gray square in which you want someeM }text. If you draw the square after the text, the text is erased. If you draw N }the text after the square, the text erases only the areas of the square under
 }each letter.h  F I only took a quick look at his contract_note defintion, but it seemedD to me to consist entirely of line drawing via moveto/lineto with the+ start and end points given in paper inches.I  = If that is all the form really is, then this isn't a problem.s   --- Carl   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 02 06:34:52 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)o1 Subject: Re: DCPS and Poscript Printing..........n) Message-ID: <d164FlZUyCut@elias.decus.ch>a  J In article <3CE2587E.610AE7F@Omond.net>, Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> writes: > Mandeep Gattaura wrote:t > D >> This is a follow up post to a message "DCPS Help Required" on the >> 30-April-2002,  >>H >> I am trying to print a file (which has been converted to postscript),D >> using a form with a postscript setup module. The form needs to beB >> overlaid on to all of the pages of the print file. I have triedG >> creating a form (using xpdf), and modifying for use in this scenariooI >> with no success. I have know taken a different route of trying to draw @ >> the postscript from hand and wrapping it up in a function and= >> re-defining showpage to print the "form" function as well.e >>/ >> But when I print the file, using the command C >> "PRINT/QUE=PS_QUEUE/FORM=PS_FORM PRINTFILE.PS" . But the printeroH >> prints out data (with no form) on the first sheet, and then a load of( >> blank forms on the subsequent sheets. >>) >> An extract of the print file is.......n >  > [... judicial snip ...]h > H > Bloody hell, couldn't you have at least anonymised the name involved ?K > I *know* the person concerned, and I'm sure he'd be pissed off seeing hist > 6 > name and address being banded willy-nilly like that. > I > *sheesh* ... please try to engage the brain before doing something like  > that.  > ; Breach of client confidentiality. Instant dismissal IMNSHO.    __
 Paul Sture Switzerlandr   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 23:20:14 +0200s9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>f= Subject: Experts (Was : internet address on a Decserver 90TL)n' Message-ID: <3CE2D10E.6C089AFF@aaa.com>t  A Well, I'm in control of a rather importent VMS system, bit still,-C I'm no "expert" in all areas. But, never the less, in the case withDD the TL90, I'd suspect that trying with HELP in the server would have also given the answer...  C The term "expert" is rather rellative, isn't it. It depends on whate" you happens to know at the moment.   Jan-Erik Sderholm.%  9 Bill Sticker wrote (about configuring a DECserver Tl90) :0 > # > This is not an "Experts" problem.DK > I am disgusted at the lack of knowledge that people who are being chargedi/ > with control of VMS systems these days, have.  >    ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 18:08:20 +0000 (UTC) 5 From: "Bill Sticker" <NOSPAMPLEASE@SPAMSTOPPER.CO.UK>s6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning/ Message-ID: <abu86j$foh$1@helle.btinternet.com>m  K A decision to scrap all of their Alphas because of an upgrade failure showslG incompetency at the highest level. The upgrades are well documented andgG tested, and if the environment was lost then it is clearly the fault of:L whoever performed the upgrade. Where was the contingency part of the upgradeF plan. Surely a large investment bank would not perform such an upgradeE without testing it first and having a recovery plan if it went wrong.h  Would put my money in that bank.G And if they let it get out into the "meeja" I suspect no-one else will. @ In over 20 years of Admin on VMS systems, I have never found theI documentation and dicumented procedures to be at fault and never had that  kind of a disaster. K Serves them right for hiring cheap incompetent kids with university degrees  instead of experience.      # "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy"c> <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> wrote in message* news:abu2u2$o5f$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com... >. >  >  >y > Roy Omond wrote: > , > > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > >i > >c > >>Roy Omond wrote: > >> > >>- > >>>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:v > >>>s > >>>e > >>>aF > >>>>No the upgrade to 7.3 went badly and they lost their environment6 > >>>>completely for more than an hour more than once. > >>>>D > >>>>This has not made them happy bunnies hence the desire to scrap > >>>>OpenVMS. > >>>> > >>>>F > >>>I can think of only one scenario where this could have pertained,E > >>>namely gross incompetence, both at the technical level ("upgrade 4 > >>>to VMS 7.3") and at the (PHB) managerial level. > >>>tF > >>>I am a bit suspicious of your claim.  Sounds like you made it up. > >>>o > >>>nB > >>I didn't. The upgrade to 7.3 was done so that it would make it3 > >>easier to migrate off the GS140's onto GS320's.o > >>+ > >>The failures were caused by bugs in 7.3d > >> > >t< > > Now I'm convinced you made it up.  I'll call your bluff. > >yE > > I'll bet we don't get to know which customer this is meant to be.pA > > If it were true (and I'm convinced it's not), then I'd expectrC > > we'd get to hear of this in the meeja.  Why not drop Mike Magee- > > an anonymous hint ?  > >2 >a >s> > Its a large investment bank. I really cannot say who or what? > they are doing with the Alphas. I am under non disclosure andn> > while it would be nice to drop an anonymous hint it would be > unethical. >i? > You can choose to believe what you want but as you know there-? > is a longish snagging list with 7.3 and my customer fell foul5
 > of that. >i	 > Regardsp > Andrew HarrisonB >u >c   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:24:22 -0400F- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>m6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning, Message-ID: <3CE2A7D3.B3B11EF2@videotron.ca>   David Harrold wrote:L > So, they listing to you (and others) and change the message to one that is# > better.  Now they're unethical???   K The didn't change the message. That is the problem. They just removed/hid ahF portion that was highly offensive to VMS customers, and did so without explanation or notice.  H I see absolutely no indication whatsoever that they policy to expect VMSK customers to migrate to HP-UX has changed in any way. Only that now they no + longer want to admit to it in the document.c  E If the policy has changed, then let HP state categorically that after N listening to customers, they have re-evaluated the positioning of VMS and willI no longer expect customers to migrate to HP-UX and see a bright long termcF future for VMS, including long term development commitment on whatever* hardware platform is current at that time.  L If Stallard was able to device that policy in a vaccumm without getting fullF approval, then he should be fired on the spot. How would you handle anP employee whose memo will cost your company millions of dollars in lost profits ?  J And if Stallard remains at HP, without any statement from HP to the effectM that Stallard's original memo did not represent HP policy, then it means thati  HP supports the original policy.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:57:53 -0400,- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>o6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning, Message-ID: <3CE2AFAC.4C812AEC@videotron.ca>   Bill Sticker wrote:- > M > A decision to scrap all of their Alphas because of an upgrade failure shows:$ > incompetency at the highest level.  J It is possible that the customer already had plans to migrate off VMS, and0 used probems with 7.3 to accelerate the process.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:13:30 -0500o1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>d6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning1 Message-ID: <abuc5r$3j2$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>u  L Good catch Bill.  And *if* the XFC was their problem, then shame on them for' not turning it off like most here know.t   -- Dave...a  ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but thew- principle one was that they escaped teething.  -----Mark Twaine  5 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message < news:LQwE8.148960$M7.14504213@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com... >i. > "Roy Omond" <Roy@Omond.net> wrote in message% > news:3CE256EB.2A084B2C@Omond.net... , > > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > >i > > > Roy Omond wrote: > > >a0 > > > > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > > > >a > > > >-H > > > >>No the upgrade to 7.3 went badly and they lost their environment8 > > > >>completely for more than an hour more than once. > > > >>F > > > >>This has not made them happy bunnies hence the desire to scrap > > > >>OpenVMS. > > > >> > > > >oI > > > > I can think of only one scenario where this could have pertained,lH > > > > namely gross incompetence, both at the technical level ("upgrade7 > > > > to VMS 7.3") and at the (PHB) managerial level.t > > > >tI > > > > I am a bit suspicious of your claim.  Sounds like you made it up.  > > > >e > > >nD > > > I didn't. The upgrade to 7.3 was done so that it would make it5 > > > easier to migrate off the GS140's onto GS320's.o > > >t- > > > The failures were caused by bugs in 7.3t > >t< > > Now I'm convinced you made it up.  I'll call your bluff. > > E > > I'll bet we don't get to know which customer this is meant to be.eA > > If it were true (and I'm convinced it's not), then I'd expectNC > > we'd get to hear of this in the meeja.  Why not drop Mike Mageet > > an anonymous hint ?  > >e% > > Ha, didn't think you would.  FUD.a >fJ > Hmmm.  Didn't I recently see the comment that XFC was by default enabled inE > 7.3?  If they didn't think to disable it, that might explain a lot.  >s > - bill >t >n >  >o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:33:44 -0500e1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>-6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning1 Message-ID: <abudbo$3po$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>   J OK all those that have written to Mr. Stallard this past week about things7 VMS related, please signify by entering ^VMS in a post.a  E Those that have received a reply from Mr. Stallard, please signify bye entering ^VMS^.c   Here's mine:   ^VMS^  K All those that cannot truly enter the above symbols ----- give it a try anda see what happens.   G If not interested in doing this or you think it won't do any good, thenn) please suggest constructive alternatives.e   -- Dave...0  ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but ther- principle one was that they escaped teething.  -----Mark Twainr  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3CE2A7D3.B3B11EF2@videotron.ca... > David Harrold wrote:K > > So, they listing to you (and others) and change the message to one thato is% > > better.  Now they're unethical???w >gK > The didn't change the message. That is the problem. They just removed/hids aaH > portion that was highly offensive to VMS customers, and did so without > explanation or notice. > J > I see absolutely no indication whatsoever that they policy to expect VMSJ > customers to migrate to HP-UX has changed in any way. Only that now they no- > longer want to admit to it in the document.a >pG > If the policy has changed, then let HP state categorically that after K > listening to customers, they have re-evaluated the positioning of VMS andr willK > no longer expect customers to migrate to HP-UX and see a bright long termtH > future for VMS, including long term development commitment on whatever, > hardware platform is current at that time. >eI > If Stallard was able to device that policy in a vaccumm without gettinge fullH > approval, then he should be fired on the spot. How would you handle anH > employee whose memo will cost your company millions of dollars in lost	 profits ?u > L > And if Stallard remains at HP, without any statement from HP to the effectJ > that Stallard's original memo did not represent HP policy, then it means that" > HP supports the original policy.   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 14:54:22 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning3 Message-ID: <+jfQWHgTlC9u@eisner.encompasserve.org>n  \ In article <3CE2AFAC.4C812AEC@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > Bill Sticker wrote:. >> tN >> A decision to scrap all of their Alphas because of an upgrade failure shows% >> incompetency at the highest level.n > L > It is possible that the customer already had plans to migrate off VMS, and2 > used probems with 7.3 to accelerate the process.    ? 	It really is a matter of change control and when large dollarse@ 	and criticality is involved, change control is a must.  Part of@ 	the process is testing.  Testing doesn't catch everything, just
 	ask eBay.  ? 	Then there are degrees.  If it is very important, you contracte) 	with Compaq to have it done (see below).a  B 	I believe Andrew.  But we only know part of the situation.  AfterB 	all, there are large customers that are on 7.3 and some have been2 	on 7.3 since the very beginning (since shipment):    = http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/brochures/Bank-Austria/a      Business results:a  @ > High performance - moving to OpenVMS version 7.3 results in a  28 percent performance increaseN  G > Scalability - allows the bank to handle a 3,000 percent load increase   1 > Security - provides unparalleled data integrityh   What makes it work:p   > Systems: i  H Production system: Compaq AlphaServerTM GS160 system with 16 CPUs and 32M gigabytes of memory and AlphaServer GS140 system with 12 CPUs and 8 gigabytes @ of memory as local standby running in a clustered configuration   M Test system: AlphaServer GS160 system with 16 CPUs and 64 gigabytes of memory,E plus AlphaServer GS160 system with 8 CPUs and 32 gigabytes of memory A    8 > Software: Compaq OpenVMS operating system, version 7.3    G > Storage: Storage Area Network (SAN) of 62 Compaq StorageWorksTM HSG80a.   controllers with Fibre Channel (FC) switches  N > Service: Compaq Global Services for upgrade consulting services and hardware   and software maintenance    ---)  A 	The fact that this customer has a botched upgrade to 7.3 is more"F 	than likely the result of poor planning and lack of thorough testing.  0 	But it is always easy to be an armchair critic.   				RobI   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 15:44:10 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0205151444.5451f86f@posting.google.com>n  a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3CE2AFAC.4C812AEC@videotron.ca>...r > Bill Sticker wrote:  > > O > > A decision to scrap all of their Alphas because of an upgrade failure shows'& > > incompetency at the highest level. > L > It is possible that the customer already had plans to migrate off VMS, and2 > used probems with 7.3 to accelerate the process.  ; yes, it is possible ... there are a lot of stupid companiesM; out there, and they will pay the price ... if they wanted ai: little more stability, they should have stayed on 7.2-2 or9 7.1-2 until the 7.3-1 release ... this sounds like Andrewt: using it more of an excuse than the customer, or else they; had a moron running the system ... in either case, let themo learn the hard way ...   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:28:08 GMTt# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>.6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm WarningE Message-ID: <s2DE8.1185$ah_.688@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>1  5 "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in messageI7 news:d7791aa1.0205151444.5451f86f@posting.google.com...e >n >.. this sounds like Andrewy< > using it more of an excuse than the customer, or else they= > had a moron running the system ... in either case, let them. > learn the hard way ...    A Hate to tell you....that's sort of what competitors do...slag theaJ competition when it helps to shift them from your gear....all companies do it...t  I And yes they probably had somebody do it when they shouldn't have...i.e..nI like before they upgraded one machine and did some testing of the o/s and  their apps....  K However, most investment banks that I have had dealings with over the yearssF don't take the time to do things correctly...it's the mentality of theH organizations...even the best ones that I've seen waste tens of millions+ each year on bad IT policies and practices.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:17:48 -0400i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>v' Subject: Re: FTP mget on latest files ?E+ Message-ID: <3CE2A649.7C52D36@videotron.ca>e  N Would there be a way to have login.com detect that this is an FTP session, andM if so, then extract/copy the most recent files from the huge directory into abL smaller directory, at which point, you can collect all files in that smaller directory ?C   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 16:14:39 -0400& From: fdc@columbia.edu (Frank da Cruz)' Subject: Re: FTP mget on latest files ?R1 Message-ID: <abufjf$csc$1@watsol.cc.columbia.edu>)  " In article <5084371@MVB.SAIC.COM>,/ David B Sneddon  <dbsneddon@bigpond.com> wrote:.< : On Wed, 15 May 2002 21:55, briggs@encompasserve.org wrote:B : > In article <d60cd868.0205150431.47a18d40@posting.google.com>, 7 : samuel.linjer@nilsongroup.com (Samuel Linjer) writes:RJ : > > I have a folder with many files (+1000). New files are created every : > > day in this folder.,H : > > From the folder i want to copy only the latest via ftp - the files1 : > > that has been created within the last week.l : > > ) : > > Is this possible with "mget" in FTPm :  ...2 : or try C-Kermit, it does selections by date/time : G This is possible with Kermit protocol using C-Kermit on the VMS and thefH appropriate Kermit program on your client (you didn't say what it was -- Windows? Linux? ...):s  !   http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/   I The current Windows and Unix versions of Kermit also include built-in FTP,J clients, but they do not include date/time selections for FTP MGET becauseK of an intrinsic problem reconciling the timezones -- namely that the clientIH doesn't know the timezone of the server, so how can you relate the datesJ on the two computers?  For example, you tell the client to get a directoryC listing from the server.  The dates are listed, but they are in theeE server's local time, zone unknown.  You can't use those times because-L FTP protocol uses UCT. You can't use local time either, for the same reason.I Nor can you use UCT itself because you don't know how to relate it to thee: file timestamps you see in the server's directory listing.   - Franko   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 16:50:28 -0500o: From: "Scandora, Anthony \(35048\)" <Scandora@cmt.anl.gov>' Subject: Re: FTP mget on latest files ?h+ Message-ID: <abuleh$b8v$2@milo.mcs.anl.gov>i  @ "Samuel Linjer" <samuel.linjer@nilsongroup.com> wrote in message7 news:d60cd868.0205150431.47a18d40@posting.google.com...e > Hi,f >uF > I have a folder with many files (+1000). New files are created every > day in this folder. D > From the folder i want to copy only the latest via ftp - the files- > that has been created within the last week.a > % > Is this possible with "mget" in FTPe  L A bunch of people posted kludges involving directory listings, which requireI extra labor, and Kermit, which needs a server client.  WS_FTP, a popular,.K inexpensive shareware client for the lowly PC, has known how to do this fortI years.  This would be a good suggestion SPR for HP, or if anyone is stillR4 maintaining MadGoat FTP, perhaps it could be taught.  1 Tony Scandora, Argonne National Lab, 630-252-7541  scandora@cmt.anl.gov   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 23:09:27 +0000 (UTC)g5 From: "Bill Sticker" <NOSPAMPLEASE@SPAMSTOPPER.CO.UK> ' Subject: Re: FTP mget on latest files ?M1 Message-ID: <abupr7$h7s$1@knossos.btinternet.com>t  L That is possible, but dont think its done by a login.com. Sorry, I dont haveL acces to a system to research it but you should find something in the TCP/IP manual.   : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message% news:3CE2A649.7C52D36@videotron.ca...hL > Would there be a way to have login.com detect that this is an FTP session, and H > if so, then extract/copy the most recent files from the huge directory into aF > smaller directory, at which point, you can collect all files in that smallere
 > directory ?o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:56:42 -0400b3 From: John McLachlan <jmclachlan@nospam.draper.com>>- Subject: internet address on a Decserver 90TLi> Message-ID: <jmclachlan-9AFFEE.14564215052002@news.draper.com>   Howdy.  L I'm running an ancient VAX 4000/VMS5.5 et al system.  We have to change our Q networking, and one of the things needing to change is the IP of the 90TL server.u  Q Unfortunately, when I do a set/change internet address <new address> the blasted tK thing comes back and says "server internet address already set".   yah, no s kidding.      M Cant' clear the address, can't reset it, cycling power doesn't make it happy.   P Any thoughts on how to actually change this address?  We need to move this baby  onto a different network.I   Thanks  	 - John Mc    -- d- <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>e   John McLachlan Draper Laboratoryn Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 jmclachlan@draper.comn" http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 19:28:25 GMTn0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>1 Subject: Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TLe@ Message-ID: <tFyE8.135299$o66.403302@news-server.bigpond.net.au>  H Try using the DEFINE command, which only affects the permanent database,I then re-init your switch, "init delay 0" or power-cycle may be needed.  I,L suspect you cannot use change/set since they affect the active system.   I'm no expert on the 90TL.   Matt.H   --= -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companyg Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAt= -------------------------------------------------------------.    @ "John McLachlan" <jmclachlan@nospam.draper.com> wrote in message8 news:jmclachlan-9AFFEE.14564215052002@news.draper.com... > Howdy. >.I > I'm running an ancient VAX 4000/VMS5.5 et al system.  We have to changeS ourtK > networking, and one of the things needing to change is the IP of the 90TLg server.o >mJ > Unfortunately, when I do a set/change internet address <new address> the blastedlL > thing comes back and says "server internet address already set".   yah, no
 > kidding. >lH > Cant' clear the address, can't reset it, cycling power doesn't make it happy. >fL > Any thoughts on how to actually change this address?  We need to move this baby > onto a different network.S >l > Thanks >t > - John Mc  >i > --/ > <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>  >u > John McLachlan > Draper Laboratoryh > Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 > jmclachlan@draper.comm$ > http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 20:54:24 +0000 (UTC)t5 From: "Bill Sticker" <NOSPAMPLEASE@SPAMSTOPPER.CO.UK>t1 Subject: Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL.1 Message-ID: <abuhu0$2r7$1@knossos.btinternet.com>   ! This is not an "Experts" problem.zI I am disgusted at the lack of knowledge that people who are being charged-- with control of VMS systems these days, have.v      ; "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com> wrote in message : news:tFyE8.135299$o66.403302@news-server.bigpond.net.au...J > Try using the DEFINE command, which only affects the permanent database,K > then re-init your switch, "init delay 0" or power-cycle may be needed.  IcH > suspect you cannot use change/set since they affect the active system. I'mo > no expert on the 90TL. >d > Matt.@ >o > --? > -------------------------------------------------------------g > OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering > Enterprise Computing Group > Hewlett-Packard Companyt > Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAo? > -------------------------------------------------------------. >  >dB > "John McLachlan" <jmclachlan@nospam.draper.com> wrote in message: > news:jmclachlan-9AFFEE.14564215052002@news.draper.com...
 > > Howdy. > >>K > > I'm running an ancient VAX 4000/VMS5.5 et al system.  We have to change. > our H > > networking, and one of the things needing to change is the IP of the 90TL	 > server.  > >wL > > Unfortunately, when I do a set/change internet address <new address> the	 > blastedHK > > thing comes back and says "server internet address already set".   yah,t no > > kidding. > >eJ > > Cant' clear the address, can't reset it, cycling power doesn't make it > happy. > >>I > > Any thoughts on how to actually change this address?  We need to move  this > baby > > onto a different network.  > >h
 > > Thanks > >c
 > > - John Mci > >l > > --1 > > <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>  > >e > > John McLachlan > > Draper Laboratory7 > > Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 > > jmclachlan@draper.com & > > http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc >n >l   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:32:02 GMT31 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 1 Subject: Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL ' Message-ID: <3CE31D5A.9083F802@fsi.net>t   Bill Sticker wrote:v > # > This is not an "Experts" problem.fK > I am disgusted at the lack of knowledge that people who are being chargede/ > with control of VMS systems these days, have.o   I think that's a bit harsh.g  E You have the experience you have because of the environments to whichoC you've been exposed. Likewise others, whose experience differs from  yours.  D In the secular world-at-large, this concept is known as "diversity".   --   David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systemst http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 15:54:52 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)Y Subject: Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager  availaba= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0205151454.649f0548@posting.google.com>a  h Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote in message news:<3CE28E16.27828080@mindspring.com>... > D > As I've been reading c.o.v. the last few days, I've been wonderingH > about this general topic. A lot of you sound like you're sticking with@ > VMS simply because that's what you know. I wonder if this is a4 > wise choice for the long-term good of your career? > I > I can't speak for system administration (because I was never a big-timelF > VMS administrator nor am I a big-time Unix administrator, although IA > could mostly run my own systems in both cases), but for systemsE? > programming, a journeyman VMS programmer already knows nearlytE > all the "good stuff" that they need to know to be a journeyman Unix D > programmer. There just isn't that much difference any more between= > *ANY* of the full-functionality, serious operating systems.h > C > Okay, shells are different than DCL, and VMS still doesn't fork()t> > or grep, and Unix doesn't have EDT (or any emulation worth aA > damn), but beyond that, it's mostly just a matter of sticking an@ > bunch of PostIts! (tm) on your monitor to remind you of what's > what.e > < > Maybe my view is jaundiced by the fact that, for years, my; > LOGIN.COM file had a zillion symbols covering things likeuA > "rm", "more", "head", "tail", etc., but if I were giving careers: > advice, I'd certainly say that a move to Unix/Linux puts; > your career on a much safer footing than being one of ther6 > last few hold-outs on VMS. A change to Windows would< > probably be even better, career-wise, but I understand why% > that doesn't appeall to many of us.u > < > Obviously, I'm interested in your opinions about this (and: > if we stay focused on the "career" aspects, maybe we can' > even avoid a Unix vs. VMS flame war).t > 9 > What do you think? Stay with VMS? Or let it go and mover> > on, if only for the sake of the Salary Continuation Program? >  > Atlant  ? you stay with vms ... vms has and will survive, and I think the < itanium port will bring a new found life to vms ... many who> have left already wish they hadn't (companies) ... and once it? is offered on an industry standard platform, the move back willt? begin ... people are slowly beginning to realize that they havev? been duped by windoze/unix/linux, and that security is no where < to be found, not to mention clustering ... I tried the AS400@ waters 8 years ago, and that one month on it was the worst of myB IT career ... if you must, do apps programming on another platformA for a while until a vms position comes up, then grab it ... avoidt? any admin/network positions on other platforms or you will take A 20 years off of your life, not to mention gray hairs!  Or go intonA an environment and show the company what you can do for them withrD VMS ... tell them what you can give them w/it and do it!  Prove VMS!   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 17:26:35 -0700- From: jodonnell@hrblock.com (Jason O'Donnell)aY Subject: Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager  availabh< Message-ID: <9059bf6b.0205151626.4b412da@posting.google.com>  D > As I've been reading c.o.v. the last few days, I've been wonderingH > about this general topic. A lot of you sound like you're sticking with@ > VMS simply because that's what you know. I wonder if this is a4 > wise choice for the long-term good of your career? >tI > I can't speak for system administration (because I was never a big-timehF > VMS administrator nor am I a big-time Unix administrator, although IA > could mostly run my own systems in both cases), but for systemsc? > programming, a journeyman VMS programmer already knows nearlyAE > all the "good stuff" that they need to know to be a journeyman UnixAD > programmer. There just isn't that much difference any more between= > *ANY* of the full-functionality, serious operating systems.   @ I have been a UNIX administrator, a Novell Administrator, and anE OpenVMS administrator.  I have had training for both the UNIX systems F and OpenVMS systems (certified even).  I have done development on UNIX and OpenVMS.  = SO, with this background, why do I want to stay on OpenVMS???e  = STABILITY, AVAILABILITY, RELIABILITY, SECURITY, and REAL-TIMEc CAPABILITY.   ? Two apps written in vanilla C, I would bet my job running it on	D OpenVMS.  If it needed real-time work, the system services available  on OpenVMS make it hard to beat.    < > Obviously, I'm interested in your opinions about this (and: > if we stay focused on the "career" aspects, maybe we can' > even avoid a Unix vs. VMS flame war).t  9 > What do you think? Stay with VMS? Or let it go and move>> > on, if only for the sake of the Salary Continuation Program?  E Career-wise, having experience in both, I feel comfortable being able  to move to UNIX if I have to...o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:51:04 -0400p- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>eY Subject: Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager available, Message-ID: <3CE2AE13.A33D7E6B@videotron.ca>   Bill Sticker wrote: I > something) but still do not have the experience required to get even ane( > entry level job in the current market. > Will you give me a job?   
 Hear hear.  N If HP wanted to sway the VMS old timers to support HP's plans to move everyoneH to HP-UX, it would offer free retraining classes so we could recycle ourH skills to HP-UX and then sell HP-UX inside our organisations. This mightK significantly raise the prospects of keeping current VMS customers who will $ otherwise move to "anything but HP".   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:28:56 GMTe1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> Y Subject: Re: Let go of VMS for the good of your career? (was "Re: System manager availablr' Message-ID: <3CE31C9D.1902C5A8@fsi.net>.   Atlant Schmidt wrote:. > [snip]9 > (Full disclosure: I made this move about two years ago,e1 > moving from Compaq's VMS Engineering group to ao > Solaris-based OEM.)y  H I was pursuing a move to actually teaching Solaris administration, sinceG the market for VMS trainers has dried up. Personally, I see Linux goingsF further (professionally) than Solaris, unless Sun exhibits exceptionalH prowess exploiting VMS Marketing's continuing blunders and the Alpha/IPF comedy of errors.a  G Until I read another post in this group earlier today, I never realized E how deeply engrained is the dementia in VMS marketing. Apparently, it - goes back to the late 80's, if read it right.F   -- < David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemsc http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/w   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 00:45:36 GMT' From: David <David.J.Hall@jpl.nasa.gov>fA Subject: Re: MacOS/X is the leading Unix (was "Itanium Troubles")y? Message-ID: <Xns920FB4A9FC059DavidJHalljplnasagov@137.78.50.25>-  , p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) wrote in" news:9eZdYVhxpdW8@elias.decus.ch:    <snip> > G > Can you please suggest a decent Mac newsgroup for a computer literates > person who is a Mac novice?c >   2 I use MacSoup on MacOS 9.1, I think there's a beta9 version for OS X. See:- http://home.snafu.de/stk/macsoup/o   HTHv   Davidt   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 02 07:37:12 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) F Subject: Newsgroup posting guidelines - Was DCPS and Poscript Printing) Message-ID: <Zv10p+b9VjfR@elias.decus.ch>d  & News posting guidelines. A suggestion.  O Please folks. If you wish to post examples of problems at work, do your best toe anonymize the content.  " Suggested items for anonymization:   o - company detailsi o - client details. o - names and addresses, not just private ones# o - DECnet node names and addressesh  o - IP addresses / internal URLs o - VMS / other OS usernames o - disk labelsd@ o - directory names, especially if a company name, project name      or username is implied) o - DCL prompts, if anything other than $l  H That's all I can think of at the moment. Additions to that list welcome.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:15:42 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: No new Alpha salest, Message-ID: <3CE2A5CB.F384C566@videotron.ca>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:K > Why would one expect HP Marketing to release collateral that is perfect ?c  M They have had 8 months to prepare and vet that material to ensure it reflects.J corporate policy. The material was released during the unveiling of the HP. product roadmap which was highly "publicised".  N I am sorry, but there is absolutely no excuse. Customers must assume that what2 HP released represents HP policies and directions.  M Had HP wanted to really send a strong message about the bright future of VMS, M it would have had more than a one liner in its product roadmap. It would havelN mentioned VMS during the 8 months of discussions where all other product linesI were mentioned except VMS. And Scott Scallard would have made sure enougha- people read his document before releasing it.c  M Can we assume Stallard was the guy in charge of deciding VMS' fate during theaF "secret" integration phase between HP and Compaq where only about 1000E employees were involved and none of the rest knew what was going on ?d   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 16:04:19 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) Subject: Re: No new Alpha salesr< Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0205151504.39a15c9@posting.google.com>  a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3CE2A370.C437F205@videotron.ca>...p > "Main, Kerry" wrote:J > > For those doubting "show-me" readers, if no new Alpha business were toD > > be allowed, how does one explain the following new VMS Customer:9 > > http://www.mgex.com/news/news_releases/release28.htmlP > J > Oh come on. It is too soon for last week's announcements to have been inM > effect at the time such deals would have been decided. Also, I didn't see anJ > mention of VMS in there. Perhaps the whole sale was done by the softwareM > company, at which point Compaq would have sold the hardware and licenses toaS > the software company who would have then sold a turn key package to the exchange.  >  > B > > Or do you think Customers with these types of mission criticalL > > environments did not receive the assurances from the powers on high that$ > > they had nothing to worry about? > N > Well, nobody claims that HP intends to stop supporting VMS on Alpha any timeQ > soon. (Has anyone noticed the total lack of mention of VAX support for VMS ?). r > N > The problem is that HP stated very clearly that new sales were to go PA-RISCO > and not Alpha. How many new customers will fight against HP to gain the rightMK > to buy a new alpha ? It was bad enough during Compaq era to get VMS sales . > stuff, imagine what it will be like with HP. > N > Even if HP is forced to eventually relax its rules in order to save revenus,G > the fact remains that HP announced its colours last week and its truehP > intentions are not kind to VMS. They may temporarily have to bite their tongue: > and accept VMS, but it is clear that they don't want to.  F read again, they said they plan on marketing vms in niche markets wereC it is strong (i.e. healthcare) ... in other words, they will targete@ market it ... that's marketing 101 ... right on their level!  :)   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 20:31:18 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>0 Subject: Re: No new Alpha salesg, Message-ID: <3CE2FDBB.3B5D69EE@videotron.ca>   Bob Ceculski wrote:DH > read again, they said they plan on marketing vms in niche markets wereE > it is strong (i.e. healthcare) ... in other words, they will targettB > market it ... that's marketing 101 ... right on their level!  :)  N Can you point to HP statements that pain a better picture of VMS as Compaq had been painting since June 25 ?e  A All I have seen is that HP would honour Compaq's June 25 roadmap.-  K All I have seen is that HP will not pitch Alpha solutions to new customers.t  L had HP meant to say that  they wouldn't sell new Tru64, they would have saidN that new Unix sales would go to HP-UX instead of Tru64. They specifically said3 new customers would go to PA-RISC instead of Alpha.0  K If they are so stupid as to no know the difference between Tru64 and Alpha, J then there isn't much hope for intelligent decisions and statements in theM future. If they are not stupid, then they meant every word they said and thato means the end.  G You may hope all you want for VMS once/if IA64 becomes viable. But whatr happens between now and then?t   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:50:07 -0400c  From: "Dave" <nospam@nospam.com>% Subject: Re: OpenVMS Hobbyist License / Message-ID: <ue5bf3ql7tl84b@corp.supernews.com>   H My Encompass associate membership took 4 days to show up, and the e-mailI appologized for the delay.  The next day, a friend signed up, and got hisrK the same day.  I think it comes down to how busy that one guy might be.  AswB for the Hobbyist license, that took nearly a week to be processed.   -- Dave "stirkus ersu venete"U    9 "Steve Pfister" <srp336@getcoactive.com> wrote in messageu6 news:45126e60.0205150844.a3006cc@posting.google.com...G : > If you are the impatient sort - you are never going to enjoy VMS...p : > Good Luck. :u> : I can be patient... It just concerns me a bit when I send inH : applications and emails and there's no response... nothing to indicate? : that my mail was even received or read. I realize that a free.A : membership is hardly on anybody's top priority list, and if thedF : application takes two weeks, or a month before anyone sees it, I canG : understand that. But as it is, it's kind of indefinite. I did get oneu6 : message back last Friday saying "in a day or two"... : E : sorry for venting...I think I've got too much going with too little- : progress... :-)- :-	 : Thanks!-   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:13:58 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>- Subject: Re: OpenVMS SNMP TRAP' Message-ID: <3CE3191E.81C5781E@fsi.net>h   Fabio Cardoso wrote: >  > Tryp >  > http://www.comtekservices.coma > ' > They have SNMP Agents for OpenVMS !!!.   Great stuff, Fabio! Thanx!   -- n David J. DachteraM dba DJE Systems. http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 19:06:29 -0400t! From: "me" <wicklinedd@erols.com>e) Subject: Re: Password for Infoserver 1000n+ Message-ID: <abupsn$814$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   L Worked like clock work.  With some good guesses I even am into the terminal.   Dave  * <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message* news:00A0DE21.B6562E5C@SendSpamHere.ORG...I > In article <abp67s$g79$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "me" <wicklinedd@erols.com>  writes:nJ > >I recently through a salvage claim got two Infoserver 1000's.  Seems to beL > >good but What do I need to hook it up to my VS400-90?  The admin password atJ > >the terminal is not reset and the only jumper sets the box up for a MOPF > >boot.  I am currently running it with the processor pulled and four drivesH > >on the SCSI bus but I would like to have all seven drives.  How can I erase9J > >the password?.  It is a an assumption that I need it since I can get my vaxsK > >to connect, (VMS 7.2 manual says LASTCP, NETBSD website says LATCP, botht arel$ > >just meaningless acronyms to me). > >  > >Thanks in advance > >e > >Daveh > >SYSADMIN by default > >o > >e >e7 > If your Infoserver is connected on your network, try:o >o! > $ @SYS$STARTUP:ESS$STARTUP DISK  > $ MCR ESS$LADCPf > LADCP Version X-7 " > LASTPort Disk (LAD) Version V3.0 > ESS$DADDRIVER Ident X-21 > LADCP> SHOW SERVICES >t >a >b) > Also, assuming you've started LAT, try:n >i
 > $ MCR LATCP  > LATCP> SHOW SERVICEp >wL > Look for a service that might be your InforServer.  If the Infoserver doesK > not have a name assigned to it, it will appear with a name containing theg > ehternet address.  >y > --4 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM >@6 >   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" >r   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 17:59:57 -0400 % From: Bob Harris <harris@zk3.dec.com>w. Subject: Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support?= Message-ID: <harris-9F1CA3.17595715052002@juggl7.zk3.dec.com>p  8 In article <imuoduc4gpb5m76ofibdnh2604v1kdo28d@4ax.com>,1  Clay M. Denton <denton@orison.dsserv.com> wrote:   N X Back when Pathworks Macintosh was a current product, Mac volumes/files were  X limited to 2GBL X in size.  Pathworks Mac server on VMS reported no more than 2GB free on a  X volume back toP X the Mac - even if the VMS drive had more available space to as not to confuse  X the  X Macintosh. X J X Mac OS 8 and newer support larger drives and files.  Does anyone have a  X hack/patch forN X Pathworks Mac server on VMS to allow it to report actual free space instead 	 X of 2GB?  X 	 X Thanks,l X Clay  F I can not think of anyway to hack that (unless someone is thinking of  patching the executable :-)n  B The probem is that the AFP protocol used by PATHWORKS for OpenVMS I (Macintosh) was at the time limited to a signed 32 bit value.  To return  E a larger value, would require a) changing the code that provided the yH information, b) changing the code that reports what protocol the server H uses, c) changing the code to support _ALL_ the new features of the new D protocol, d) plugging in the new larger values into the new message  packet.n  F This is a lot of executable patching, when you don't have the sources.  H So while it might be nice to have larger values returned, I don't think . it is likely that there is a hack to get them.  D [Disclaimer] I wrote the code that limited the reporting so that it H would never be greater than 2GB to keep the Macs at that time happy.  I G was the primary DECserver maintainer for v1.1, v1.2, and v1.3 (someone  B else did the work before me).  So I do have a clue about what I'm I talking about.  The PATHWORKS for Macintosh group was disbanded in '95.   G I've since moved to working on Tru64 UNIX and no longer have access to l the sources.  I Side note:  In my opinion, I think it is amazing that the software still fI runs after 7 years without maintenance, through Y2K, and through several t major releases of OpenVMS.  D An alternative approach might be to consider using Mac OS X and NFS F servers on OpenVMS, if you have the current PATHWORKS for Windows (or I whatever its name is called these days) running on OpenVMS, then try Mac oC OS X and using the SMB protocol, or Dave (from Thrusby Systems) if uF running Mac OS 9 or earlier.  I do not know if SAMBA runs on OpenVMS, 8 but that might be used instead of PATHWORKS for Windows.  A I'm not saying these are better approaches, just alternatives :-)h  2                                         Bob Harris   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 16:17:57 -0700-' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>r. Subject: Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support?+ Message-ID: <3CE2ECA5.67568CC1@caltech.edu>    Bob Harris wrote:t  H > I've since moved to working on Tru64 UNIX and no longer have access to > the sources.  1 It's not entirely clear that HPQ has them either.w5 Or at least has clear legal ownership of them.  Afterd: the product had been EOL'd for a while I tried pretty hard4 to get CPQ to release the source code for PW/Mac but8 they never could work out the legal issues and I finally3 threw in the towel (on Compaq in general and VMS inhC particular) before any of this was resolved.  As I recall I managedh@ to get everybody who CPQ thought had an ownership claim to writeI a note saying that they didn't want the thing, but it wasn't good enough.lE (And the ownership path was incredibly twisted, ending up in some webrE company that was about 3 purchases removed from Bob Denny's company.)Y  8 It's pretty ironic that the appletalk bits and pieces on: Linux are much less reliable than that ancient unsupported PW/Mac code on VMS.t   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 09 May 2002 12:40:56 GMT 3 From: sy18889@rabbit.fmr.com (Bradford J. Hamilton)o Subject: Re: Powered by HP. Message-ID: <s7uC8.19$O3.26@news-srv1.fmr.com>  L Here at the Marlborough, MA (USA) campus, the signage was changed to "HP" onO the day of the announcement.  For those of you familiar with the area, the signs on I-495 has changed from:    d | i | g | i | t | a | l   to   COMPAQ   to   		HP
 	      inventi  ( in the space of four years.  Progress... 	pW In article <3CDA1D3D.399E3E55@Free.fr>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> writes: L >I wonder if they will repaint all buildings walls on which there are COMPAQO >signs. The COMPAQ sign was more or less as wide as the DIGITAL one. But the HPbH >sign is definitely smaller. This change will not be nice looking on the- >buildings if they do not paint the walls :-)  >m >D.M >i >JF Mezei wrote: >> tR >> Went on to Yahoo. They used to have a "powered by Compaq" logon on their pages.# >> It now sports a "powered by HP".1 >> D >> I guess HP won them back :-)r >> eL >> HP sure didn't waste time with these. I wonder how long ago HP would haveM >> gotten in touch with all those web sites that have the "powered by compaq"hM >> logo to prepare them with the new logo and tell themn to wait for a signalv >> when they can switch them Bradford J. Hamilton& braMdhamAilPtoSn@aMtAtPbi.cSom		(home)& sMy1A88P89S@rabMbit.fAmPr.coSm		(work)  ; "All opinions that I express are my own, not my employer's"e "Lose the MAPS"c   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:15:29 GMT-1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 9 Subject: Re: Problem with the internal clock of an XP1000u' Message-ID: <3CE31979.EE7BA970@fsi.net>y   Rudolf Wingert wrote:t >  > Hello, > E > an user reports, that the clock of an XP1000 with OpenVMS 7.1-2 AXP C > slows down if the CPU is heave loaded. Does anybody see the same? / > Is there any patch out to solve this problem?o   Like Fred said.E  B Also, there were known problems in certain versions of the various# TCP/IP stacks. Check for patches...r   -- r David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 19:23:45 GMT 0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>= Subject: Re: problems setting socket nonblocking with fcntl()a@ Message-ID: <5ByE8.135298$o66.403290@news-server.bigpond.net.au>  F I'm not sure why your fcntl() call fails.  However I use the following. ioctl() call to set the socket to nonblocking.  $     /* set socket to non blocking */*     if(ioctl(sd, FIONBIO,(char *)&on) < 0)     {4        perror("ioctl FIONBIO");l        exit(1);      }:   Matt.S   --= -------------------------------------------------------------F OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companye Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAh= -------------------------------------------------------------a    7 "Schild Niklaus" <schin@hta-bi.bfh.ch> wrote in messagei$ news:abtq2g$1uu$1@rex.ip-plus.net...
 > Hi thereI > I'm working on DEC C V6.0-001 on OpenVMS Alpha V7.3 and I need to set am2 > socket to non-blocking mode. The way I do it is: >- > ....+ >  11382:   opts = fcntl(socket, F_GETFL) ;@ >  11383:   if (opts LT ZERO)u >  11384:     {p* >  11385:       perror("fcntl(F_GETFL)") ; >  11386:       return (-1) ;f >  11387:     }d > ...sB > then I get the error "fcntl(F_GETFL): function not implemented "A > I the web then I found a peace of code which does it like this:o > ........... >  11382:   opts = fcntl(socket, F_GETFL, 0) ; >  11383:   if (opts LT ZERO)  >  11384:     {e* >  11385:       perror("fcntl(F_GETFL)") ; >  11386:       return (-1) ;e >  11387:     }R > .....M3 > an here I get "fcntl(F_GETFL): invalid argument".r >aJ > Because the the third argument is declared as optional (help cc run-timeE > fcntl) I do not understand both error messages. I use the followingo compiler > flags: >oL /DECC/STAND=VAXC/MEMBER_ALIGN/INCLUDE_DIRECTORY=(DECC$USER_INCLUDE,C$INCLUDE7 > )/WARNING=DISABLE=ADDRCONSTEXT/NOOPTIMIZE/DEBUG/OBJECi > T=OBJ:/LIST=LISc >RK > Has anyone experiences wiht setting sockets to non-blocking on VMS or has & > anyone an idea what I'm doing wrong? >  > Thanks Nik >a >c >a   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 11:33:52 -0700# From: tadamsmar@aol.com (Tom Adams)  Subject: Re: Proxy questionl= Message-ID: <793af3df.0205151033.357ca2e4@posting.google.com>h  g "Rainer Giese" <giese@volkswerft.de> wrote in message news:<abtjiv$ku8e5$1@ID-138444.news.dfncis.de>...h8 > "Tom Adams" <tadamsmar@aol.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag7 > news:793af3df.0205150349.a04646@posting.google.com...r > > If I add a proxy like this:v > >  > > add/proxy *::doe doe/d > >uG > > Then what determines what nodes can access the doe account and whatoG > > node can't access it?   Can any node that can do a set host to thisa7 > > system access it.  What limit the set host command?e > L > A user doe from _all_ other nodes can access to the local nodes via FAL orM > task-to-task without an explicit authorization. He will mapped to the locale# > user doe by default. For example:l >  > $ DIR remote_node::e > = > will show the default directory of user doe at remote_node.5N > If you create a proxy like "add/proxy *::doe other" (without /default), thenF > he must give the username, that he want to use remote, for example : >  > $ DIR remote_node"OTHER":: > J > otherwise he will mapped to the default decnet account, if you have one. > I > It has nothing to do with set host, after that you are always asked forh > username and password.  E All nodes? How to I get a list of all nodes that can access the node?/   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 18:54:34 -0400o; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>t Subject: Re: Proxy question $ Message-ID: <3ce2e719$1@news.si.com>  F >All nodes? How to I get a list of all nodes that can access the node?   With DECnet Phase IV, use:   $ mcr ncp sho known nodesh -- rA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comu= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventd< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 01:21:52 GMTs- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>X Subject: Re: Proxy question * Message-ID: <3CE3241B.8090801@qsl.network>   Tom Adams wrote: > G > All nodes? How to I get a list of all nodes that can access the node?o  H You will need to ask your network administrator.  All Decnet nodes that - have a route to your node can attempt access.l  D Your system security settings determine which ones can actually get D access.  There are many controls that can be used to control access " depending on a sites requirements.  H There is no requirement that a node be registered in the local database  in order to gain access.  C A proxy is used when you can trust both the security policy of the aI remote system, and the integrity of the network.  In DECNET, proxies can .  not be used for SET HOST access.  G If you can not trust the integrity of the network, then encryption and -G tunnelling can provide some protection, but are not practical for most   internal networks.  E The same principle applies to other network protocols such as TCP/IP.F   -John9 wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:19:15 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>t Subject: Re: Proxy question ' Message-ID: <3CE31A5A.5463A4D0@fsi.net>i   Brian Tillman wrote: > H > >All nodes? How to I get a list of all nodes that can access the node? >  > With DECnet Phase IV, use: >  > $ mcr ncp sho known nodes   H You might also need a VAX running DECnet-IV as a routing node. There youC can do SHOW NETWORK to see the adjacent nodes that NCP's SHOW KNOWNdF nodes might not list. Then again, there could be yet more node outside2 of your DECnet area that could access your node...  E I guess the answer is that it would be rather a daunting task to findiE all the DECnet nodes on a given network, much like trying to find allnC the TCP/IP nodes that consider yours "reachable" by whatever magic.    --   David J. Dachteran dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:45:09 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: Proxy questiono+ Message-ID: <3CE33929.9346183@videotron.ca>e   "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > > $ mcr ncp sho known nodess    M However, if you look at the subject of this thread, the poster probably wantse> to know more about who can access the node without a password.   For DECNET (phase 4):n $MC AUTHORIZE SHOW PROXY *  M This gives you list of foreign username/node and their granted access to this 8 node under what username for all sorts of DECNET access.     then $MC NCP SHOW KNOWN OBJECTS  M This will show some of the DECNET objects which are defined, many of which dopJ allow connections to some process without username password (for instance, MAIL, PHONE)  
 For TCPIP:   MC TCPIP SHOW/PROXYs  G This will give you like of foreign users/node that have access to TCPIPi applications on this node.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 17:03:13 -0400d2 From: norm lastovica <norman.lastovica@oracle.com>% Subject: Rdb Technical Forum Reminder ' Message-ID: <3CE2CD11.70602@oracle.com>    Dear Oracle Rdb Customer:e  > I am writing to remind you that we will be holding a series ofB technical seminars known as the Rdb Technical Forums in 2002.  TheD first of this years' Forums is less then a month away!  I would likeF to  invite you to review the abstracts and speaker information for theD Nashua, NH, USA and European Forums that have just been published on our web site at,  0                      http://www.oracle.com/rdb/.    For a direct link you can go to,  >        www.oracle.com/rdb/tech_forums/index.html?content.html.  @ These Forums are offered at no charge.  They are given by senior; Oracle Rdb development engineers and management who provide:E information on the latest developments in Support, Education, Feature B Enhancement, and Product Direction for Oracle Rdb. In the upcomingC Nashua, NH USA and European Forums there will also be sessions fromsC two of our key Rdb partners, JCC and VX Company.  The Rdb Technical F Forums should be considered a requirement for anyone wishing to remain up-to-date on Oracle Rdb.A  @ Here are some of the benefits that we believe you will gain from  attendance at this FREE seminar:    ?    * Learn how to maximize your investment in Rdb by developingo;      new web based applications and services linked to youro      current database?  >    * Discover new ideas for optimizing the performance of your      system   ?    * Find out how to exploit Oracle Technologies in conjunctionp
      with Rdb   A    * Learn how to exploit HP's latest technologies such as Galaxye      and Itanium    )                         Sessions include:p    .                         Rdb 7.1 SQL Highlights  1                      Rdb Optimizer - a Case Studys  0                       Using Oracle 9iAS with Rdb  /                        Bit Map Indexes with Rdbh  B    Rdb and the XA Protocol - cross-platform, cross-OS transactions  A     Oracle Rdb LogMiner and JCC Loader - An On-line Demonstration   ,                          Row Cache Phase III  -                          Using Rdb and Galaxyn  4                   Porting OpenVMS and Rdb to Itanium  +                            Rdb Future PlansC     Rdb Forum 2002 schedule:  )      Nashua, NH, USA             4-5 Juneo+      Zrich, Switzerland         17-18 Junea+      Reading , United Kingdom    20-21 Junea+      Copenhagen, Denmark         27-28 June 9 	(held in conjunction with Oracle Open World, Copenhagen) -      Sydney, Australia           19-20 August .      Redwood Shores, CA,         9-10 November< 	(held in conjunction with Oracle Open World, San Francisco)    E You can register for the Forums on-line using the same links providednF above.   I hope very much that you will be able attend one of the 2002. Forums or send someone from your organization.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 22:56:30 -0400   From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>0 Subject: Re: SKC Morphs Again... We're Now SKHPC4 Message-ID: <1020515225524.353A-100000@Ives.egh.com>  % On Tue, 14 May 2002, Bill Todd wrote:    > ; > "Dave Hooton" <hooton@salem.zk3.dec.com> wrote in messagee6 > news:mgfE8.37$2G2.1065021@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net...> > > In article <abrqu5$h21$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>,9 > > bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu (Bob DeBula) writes: @ > > > > Or you could go for real focused - Shannon Knows VMS ;-)M > > > Or, the Yoda-ized version of a broad spectrum, never to be obsolescent: / > > > "Shannon, knows things he does, Ummmmmm".  > >m > > Or the Ben Stein route:d > >A# > > "Win Terry Shannon's Knowledge"  >  > Or the Gertrude Stein route: > " > "A Digital is a Compaq is a HP." >  > - bill  @ Having just spent several hours wandering around www.compaq.com, "There is no there there."   -- t John Santoss Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:08:45 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>u% Subject: Re: System manager available , Message-ID: <3CE2A42A.A37C8BEE@videotron.ca>   "Mark E. Levy" wrote: D > > I've often said that I wished I'd gotten that job on the garbage > > truck... > K > But David, is that really any different from working with Windows? Either * > way, you're slinging garbage all day....  J But with a garbage truck, when you look back, you see how much cleaner the street is without any garbage.  L With Windows, no matter how much garbage you collect, you know that there isE more left behind you that will crop up as soon as you turn your head.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:08:12 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>a% Subject: Re: System manager availableg' Message-ID: <3CE317C5.6F3EB134@fsi.net>s   "Mark E. Levy" wrote:r > > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message# > news:3CE1D332.9592C5D2@fsi.net...  > > Bill Sticker wrote:  > > >v3 > > > I'd switch to anything if I could find a job.  > >tD > > I've often said that I wished I'd gotten that job on the garbage > > truck... > K > But David, is that really any different from working with Windows? Eithert* > way, you're slinging garbage all day....  ; Yeah - the garbage man smells better at the end of the day!    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:08:55 GMTr1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> % Subject: Re: System manager availabled' Message-ID: <3CE317EF.5611D298@fsi.net>a   JF Mezei wrote:  >  > "Mark E. Levy" wrote: F > > > I've often said that I wished I'd gotten that job on the garbage > > > truck... > > M > > But David, is that really any different from working with Windows? Eitherh, > > way, you're slinging garbage all day.... > L > But with a garbage truck, when you look back, you see how much cleaner the  > street is without any garbage. > N > With Windows, no matter how much garbage you collect, you know that there isG > more left behind you that will crop up as soon as you turn your head.h  4 ...or install the next patch, package or whatever...   -- n David J. Dachteran dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:13:15 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>,% Subject: Re: System manager available ' Message-ID: <3CE318F4.78462514@fsi.net>h   Tom Linden wrote:5 >  > >-----Original Message-----m9 > >From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@fsi.net]g& > >Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 8:03 PM > >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com( > >Subject: Re: System manager available > >  > >h > >Bill Sticker wrote: > >>2 > >> I'd switch to anything if I could find a job. > >5C > >I've often said that I wished I'd gotten that job on the garbageo > >truck...  > = > And consider the benefits,  free lunch and all you can eat.c  1 MMmmmm, GOOD! Yeah - can't beat bene's like that!r   -- i David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/a   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 14:31:00 -0400h- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s# Subject: Re: TCP/IP for VMS...HELP! , Message-ID: <3CE2A960.363A35AD@videotron.ca>  M > > process and for inquiry purposes after go live.  We are currently running M > > Windows 98SE and using LAT to make connections into the VMS box.  Since I>H > > cannot use LAT with the Windows 2000 PC's, I am looking for a TCP/IP  K This may sound really silly, but have you considered using an actual serialhM port to connect both machines, and then using something such as hyperterminalv on the windows PC ?i  M As others has stated, you can put a TCPIP stack on the VMS machine and telnet9L into it. One option is the CMU-IP stack which is free and there is a version around that works on 6.2. (VAX)   L I do not know if there is software available on the PC for this, but anotherL option for interactive sessions is DECNET via CTERM. (eg: when you $SET HOST
 node at VMS).    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 18:59:03 -0400e; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> # Subject: Re: TCP/IP for VMS...HELP!w$ Message-ID: <3ce2e827$1@news.si.com>  K >Or UCX version 4.2 with the latest eco patches. DEC TCPIP Services (UCX) 5i ande >above won't run on VMS 6.2.J >Look around and see if you already have the license (either a UCX license or aJ >NAS license) and the software on a CD. If not then you will probably have to* >goto process and get Multinet or Tcpware.  % The freeware CMUIP also runs on V6.2.- --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comtA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comn= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent6< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 18:11:25 +0000 (UTC) 5 From: "Bill Sticker" <NOSPAMPLEASE@SPAMSTOPPER.CO.UK> @ Subject: Re: Telecom fix-line billing systems running on OpenVMS1 Message-ID: <abu8cd$epi$1@knossos.btinternet.com>-  > There's BATS too, but I dont know if it is available any more.  C "Andrew Rycroft" <andrew.rycroft@intrinsitech.com> wrote in message-7 news:58ba0101.0205142252.4c7da4ac@posting.google.com...l > Hi,u ><B > Does anyone know of a fix line telecom billing system running on5 > OpenVMS ? We have a potential opportunity for this.n >e > Thanks > Andrew   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:07:02 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>@ Subject: Re: Tivoli ABC for VMS ' Message-ID: <3CE3177B.37171E2A@fsi.net>"   Rob Young wrote: > ] > In article <3CE1D600.7C786560@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:u
 > > jp wrote:e > >>I > >> Can anyone here give any feedback, positive or negative, on Tivoli's.: > >> ABC with OpenVMS? Does it use the VMS Backup utility? > >3H > > I cannot recommend any backup "solution" for OpenVMS that avoids VMSG > > BACKUP or tries to send multiple terabytes of data over an Ethernet  > > link, gigabit or no. > >i- > > The "solution" to ABC is VMS BACKUP, IMO.  > >e > H >         I can recommend any backup solution that does what is supposedC >         to do.  Restore files when you need them.  ABC does that./ > G >         Secondly, many shops have Enterprise backup solutions... i.e.AF >         tape robots, multiple tape drives and dozens of Terabytes of >         tape storage.   C No - not terabytes of tape storge, terabytes of *DISK* storage thata% *MUST* be backed up *EVERY* *NIGHT*. k  H NFW you're gonna transfer all that over Ethernet every night, gigabit or no.0  . > You can't justify separate solutions in many@ >         cases.  That is why there is 3rd party clients for VMS) >         for Enterprise backup vendors. o  & For *VERY* small VMS systems, perhaps.  @ Good luck come disaster recovery time, that's all I gotta say...    > TSM, Legato and surely one forC >         Veritas but don't know the name.  And a quick google doeso4 >         show VMS is there for Veritas as a client:  H ...but if you've ever inquired of Veritas support, you'll find their VMSB support is shaky, at best, and they outright admit that VMS systemE (bootable) disks are not supported, according my partner's experience @ (though he does tend to "embellish" the truth, shall we say...).  G Sorry - I cannot recommend any "solution" that requires another machine 9 to be recovered before the VMS system can even be booted.I  . VMS systems are BACKUP *SERVERS*, not clients!  H ...IMHO, YMMV, no purchase necessary, void where prohibited by law, someH restrictions apply, some assembly (or C) required, see store display for5 details, consult a professional before investing, ...e   -- T David J. Dachteraw dba DJE Systemsd http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 23:26:49 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)  Subject: Re: Tivoli ABC for VMS-3 Message-ID: <Kx6f$kJ7DE14@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3CE3177B.37171E2A@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:s > Rob Young wrote: >> s^ >> In article <3CE1D600.7C786560@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: >> > jp wrote: >> >> J >> >> Can anyone here give any feedback, positive or negative, on Tivoli's; >> >> ABC with OpenVMS? Does it use the VMS Backup utility?  >> >I >> > I cannot recommend any backup "solution" for OpenVMS that avoids VMSrH >> > BACKUP or tries to send multiple terabytes of data over an Ethernet >> > link, gigabit or no.r >> >. >> > The "solution" to ABC is VMS BACKUP, IMO. >> > >> eI >>         I can recommend any backup solution that does what is supposedoD >>         to do.  Restore files when you need them.  ABC does that. >> rH >>         Secondly, many shops have Enterprise backup solutions... i.e.G >>         tape robots, multiple tape drives and dozens of Terabytes ofa >>         tape storage.   > E > No - not terabytes of tape storge, terabytes of *DISK* storage thatt' > *MUST* be backed up *EVERY* *NIGHT*. e > J > NFW you're gonna transfer all that over Ethernet every night, gigabit or > no.a >   @ 	Well... perhaps you tend to believe people with that much stuffH 	back it all up every night.  That mostly isn't the case.  With TSM, you? 	typically perform INCREMENTAL backups, only that which changedaC 	is saved.  Customers keep 20-30 days , that is where the TerabyteseD 	come from.  Yes, doesn't make sense.  Restoring a 30 GByte databaseA 	from 30 days ago and applying archivelogs , well maybe better ton 	leave that for another time.t  D 	But you talk as if it isn't occuring.  The folks I am familiar with? 	do many TSM installations and mid-sized and large corporationsO? 	have dozens, hundreds of servers with a great deal of storage.a< 	The Storsol folks themselves claim to have done hundreds of 	installations:c  I http://www.storsol.com/cfusion/template.cfm?page1=con_main&page2=con_menul       SSSI's Consulting Services  # Storage Solutions Specialists, Inc.cN provides a full range of consulting services to support Tivoli Storage ManagerM (formerly ADSM) sites. Our services include planning, installation, training, . software consulting and system health checks.   F Our consulting team has successfully deployed hundreds of TSM and ADSMH installations and is considered the premier TSM/ADSM service provider.    u  @ 	The situation you describe, Terabytes of storage of course willA 	require several tape libraries, a large setup indeed.  But for al> 	more typical mid-size setup (200-400 GBytes of daily changing@ 	data) the backup over the net goes like this... servers back upB 	to TSM server, the TSM server itself has a very large DiskPool on> 	large write-back cached storage.  The advantages are readily B 	apparent.  The more fortunate servers have Gigabyte cards and getA 	over 40 MByte/sec in throughput, the 100 MBit carded servers get.D 	8-11 MByte/sec.   The DiskPool is rolled into tape.  You don't need; 	a diskpool, but it helps meet backup windows.   The futurei; 	is serverless backups where the TSM server tracks metadatac= 	and backups directly from the SAN with metadata coordinationn: 	with the client.  Sequential pre-fetch and 2 GBit backend< 	, it won't be uncommon to see 150 MByte/sec throughput from: 	large RAIDs to large DiskPools.  Did someone mention DLT? 	Cough - cough - cough.     / >> You can't justify separate solutions in many A >>         cases.  That is why there is 3rd party clients for VMSu* >>         for Enterprise backup vendors.  > ( > For *VERY* small VMS systems, perhaps. >    	Eh?  Define small.f  B > Good luck come disaster recovery time, that's all I gotta say...  : 	Diasaster Recovery is for those that can't.  I believe in= 	Disaster Tolerant solutions.  Business Continuity is all the. 	rage:  ] http://www.computerworld.com/managementtopics/management/recovery/story/0,10801,70366,00.html   1 Business continuity a priority following Sept. 11      Date: APR 10, 2002 Author: Paul Krill, InfoWorld    K SAN FRANCISCO -- Business continuity and disaster recovery, always criticalnM issues for IT, have been highlighted even further in the wake of the Sept. 11rM terrorist attacks, a panel of chief technology officers acknowledged during ae, session here at the CTO Forum on Wednesday.    > ! >> TSM, Legato and surely one foreD >>         Veritas but don't know the name.  And a quick google does5 >>         show VMS is there for Veritas as a client:a > J > ...but if you've ever inquired of Veritas support, you'll find their VMSD > support is shaky, at best, and they outright admit that VMS systemG > (bootable) disks are not supported, according my partner's experience B > (though he does tend to "embellish" the truth, shall we say...). >   < 	Ah, a problem.  My solution is to backup the system disk toA 	a local disk, in case of major corruption of course.  Certainly wG 	wouldn't be losing it as it is shadowed mirrorsets across datacenters.f  I > Sorry - I cannot recommend any "solution" that requires another machine ; > to be recovered before the VMS system can even be booted.n  * 	A nit that is easily overcome, see above.   > 0 > VMS systems are BACKUP *SERVERS*, not clients! >   B 	No, they can be clients.  Just like all the large Unix boxes thatC 	fall into the same category.   Did you know they backup mainframest 	with TSM?  Server or client:l  - Tivoli Storage Manager, Version 5.1 clients:    , 	AIX 4.3.3 or AIX 5L for POWER, Version 5.1 0 	HP/UX with 32-bit and 11.0 and 11I with 64-bit R 	Linux/x86 7 (2.4 kernel): Red Hat 7.1 or 7.2; SuSe 7.1,7.2 or 7.3, TurboLinux7.0 $ 	Linux/390 7 (2.4 kernel), SuSe 7.0  	Macintosh 9.1, X(10).x  	Novell NetWare 5.1, 6  L 	S/390, Version 2, Release 9 or 10 with SMP/E; z/OS Version 1, Release 1; or 	z/OS, Version 1, Release 2  	OS/400 5.1 9 	SGI IRIX UNIX, Release 6.5 with EFS or XFS File Systems e9 	Sun Solaris 2.6, 7, 8 (32-bit) or Solaris 7, 8 (64-bit)  ! 	Tru64 UNIX, Version 5.1 or 5.1A  G 	Windows XP, ME; Windows 2000 Professional, Server, Advanced Server ando& 	DataCenter; Windows NT 4.0 SP5, SP6a    				Rob    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:07:52 +0200U From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>! Subject: Re: Version of the KZPBA8& Message-ID: <3CE2DC38.4060302@home.nl>   Carl Karcher wrote:n  F >In a previous article, Jack Patteeuw <jjpatteeuw@peoplepc.com> wrote: > M >->There appears to be several variation of the KZPBA PCI - SCSI DifferentialcA >->adapter.  I have seen references to -CA, -CB and -CC variants.s >-> @ >->Can some one explain the differences between these versions ? >->  >2H >They are all Ultra-SCSI. From the info I have (the manuals), the -CA isF >single ended, the -CB is differential, the -CC is the replacement for >the -CB (which is eol'ed).C >r& >->Do they all use the same driver ?   >1E >I believe they do. Same firmware too. They all have "Qlogic ISP1020"d >in the SCSI ID string.o >nP >->I have various different vintages of Alphas, all with PCI I/O bus. Is there aE >->simple way I can find which variant is compatible with which box ?o >aH These SCSI controllers are the 'standard' VMS SCSI controllers. In fact G the firmware of the controllers (V5.57) is part of the Alpha firmware, hH and is loaded in the controller by the Alpha. It is save to assume that F any PCI bus Alpha can use this controller. There were narrow variants F (ISP1020) and wide variants (ISP1040) of these controllers, but AFAIK C they all use the same driver. In fact the wide variant is shown as  H ISP1020 (!) quite often, even though it is a wide controller. The KZPCM E (it has also a ISP10x0 controller!) is not supported in every Alpha !.   >- >-E >You'll have to see the supported options list for each box. Or try a2 >google search.  >m >--MH >-- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madison >--e >g   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:50:25 GMTe From: <mreilly36@comcast.net>o! Subject: Re: Version of the KZPBArB Message-ID: <lnDE8.150826$M7.14915940@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  G Be careful of which Intraserver you get! Only rom chip "enhanced" KZPCMhK controllers are supported; that being said-plug each ISP into a win box; at H boot, do ctrl-Q and turn off any bios,etc and each seems to work fine in most alpha boxex.h mhrsF "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com> wrote inJ message news:craig.berry-3AD81C.08251715052002@news.directvinternet.com.... > In article <3CE24DD5.726541CD@peoplepc.com>,1 >  Jack Patteeuw <jjpatteeuw@peoplepc.com> wrote:- > A > > There appears to be several variation of the KZPBA PCI - SCSId DifferentialB > > adapter.  I have seen references to -CA, -CB and -CC variants. > >tA > > Can some one explain the differences between these versions ?g > E > I think CA is single-ended and CB is differential.  CX is the fieldnF > replacement version of CA and CY is the field replacement version of > CB.  I've never heard of CC. >d% > > Do they all use the same driver ?r >eA > Possibly, but that does not mean they are interchangeable.  ThetG > KZPBA-CB is HVD and thus cannot deal with any single-ended devices on.# > the bus the way LVD adapters can.  >eI > > I have various different vintages of Alphas, all with PCI I/O bus. Is  there ahF > > simple way I can find which variant is compatible with which box ? >nI > You need to consult both the VMS SPD and the hardware documentation for8 > supported options. >o= > > Is there any significance between the DS- an 3x- prefix ?I > >e6 > > Is there a newer PCI - SCSI Differential adapter ? > I > There's the KZPEA, but I think it costs a thousand bucks and only workse? > on VMS 7.3 or 7.2-2 (plus ECO in either case) on EV6 systems.a >rH > If you're poking around on the resale market, also keep an eye out forH > the KZPCM which has SCSI and ethernet on one card (but I don't know if > it's differential).h > 1 > > (Don't say talk to sales, they are clueless.)n >    ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 02 07:52:14 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)JD Subject: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?) Message-ID: <s72m27qin3ok@elias.decus.ch>   K In article <3CE256EB.2A084B2C@Omond.net>, Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> writes: * > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >  >> Roy Omond wrote:a >>- >> > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:n >> > >> >E >> >>No the upgrade to 7.3 went badly and they lost their environmenta5 >> >>completely for more than an hour more than once.y >> >>4C >> >>This has not made them happy bunnies hence the desire to scrapm
 >> >>OpenVMS.e >> >>  >> >F >> > I can think of only one scenario where this could have pertained,E >> > namely gross incompetence, both at the technical level ("upgrade 4 >> > to VMS 7.3") and at the (PHB) managerial level. >> >F >> > I am a bit suspicious of your claim.  Sounds like you made it up. >> > >>A >> I didn't. The upgrade to 7.3 was done so that it would make ite2 >> easier to migrate off the GS140's onto GS320's. >>* >> The failures were caused by bugs in 7.3 > : > Now I'm convinced you made it up.  I'll call your bluff. > C > I'll bet we don't get to know which customer this is meant to be.M? > If it were true (and I'm convinced it's not), then I'd expectrA > we'd get to hear of this in the meeja.  Why not drop Mike Mageen > an anonymous hint ?a > # > Ha, didn't think you would.  FUD.  >   I Better yet, this potential client of Andrew's obviously has the immediateoD problem of making sure that his VMS systems remain stable meanwhile.  M Andrew, if you really want to do your potential client a favour, get in touchhK with one of the UK members of this newsgroup to offer the client some solid / quality consultancy. He/she obviously needs it.o  O Go for your sale by all means, but if you don't give us a chance to address thea6 situation, then you don't deserve that client's trust.   Bluff called. Your turn Andrew.b   __
 Paul Sture Switzerlandi   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:30:03 +0000 (UTC)-* From: bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau)9 Subject: Re: What is good model for disk i/o w/shadowing?n0 Message-ID: <abuuib$sgv$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>  x In article <KA7D8.4411$iB4.12044@nntpserver.swip.net>, "Bo Hermanson" <informentor.hermanson@mailbox.swipnet.se> writes: > J >Well, ask him what's the time it will take to make a write (or read) when >one critical disk crashes? :) >nA >And ask him what's the business cost and expected user feedback?i   Bo,a  C Normally these are good issues to raise, just not with my boss.  OneE your fist question, his answer would be half a day, just grab a sparetF disk, replace the failing disk with the spare, reload backups from the@ previous night's backup, and you're up and running (*his* way of? thinking, not mine!).  He doesn't see serving web pages as thata	 critical.h  E As to the second question, there *is* no "business cost" as we're not-F a business.  The closest thing we have to a product is a web page thatC we update every half hour.  No one pays us to view it, no sales areT; generated, etc.  We have folks that use the web page and doDD occaisionally complain, but that's about it.  If it's down for a day? or less, he's okay with that; more than a day and he's unhappy.r  D In short, your well intended rhetorical questions don't help me, and7 they would utterly fail to convince the powers that be.n   Lawrence Bleau University of Maryland" Physics Dept., Space Physics Group 301-405-6223 bleau@umtof.umd.edu    ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:53:02 +0000 (UTC)7* From: bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau)9 Subject: Re: What is good model for disk i/o w/shadowing?-0 Message-ID: <abuvte$sgv$2@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>  _ In article <200205131415.QAA01740@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>, Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de> writes:sH >I think, that it is very important, that you use hardware RAIDs regard-& >less you use RAID1, RAID10 or RAID5.   H Those are interesting numbers, Rudolf.  Is there any similar performanceE gain for host-based shadowing?  Or is this something only obtained by  using special hardware?s   Lawrence Bleau University of Maryland" Physics Dept., Space Physics Group 301-405-6223 bleau@umtof.umd.edu    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 17:41:11 GMTs* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! A Message-ID: <X4xE8.82212$eV5.6435579@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageB news:M_uE8.19960$t8_.18714@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... >a7 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messagea> > news:6QfE8.178251$q8.18022723@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com... > >  > >nH > > *After* DEC fell from grace, *then* the kinds of things you describe aboveyL > > *did* become problems, and marketing could have helped (though not saved > DECeF > > unless the other, more basic, internal problems had been solved as well). > >d >sI > Wrong. These were exactly the things that CAUSED the 'fall from grace'.e The K > crap Sun was selling at the time couldn't hold a technical candle to what K > DEC could and was delivering technically. But Sun ate DEC's lunch becausedK > they did ALL the things that constitute marketing well - and in my books,eL > marketing starts with the CEO and the Board of Directors and permeates the > whole organization  J I'm beginning to suspect that you don't have a clue what I've been talking$ about, so I'll give it another shot.  E The kind of 'marketing' people have been moaning about DEC (and later E Compaq) not doing has been primarily advertising.  That's the kind of.L marketing I assert was not particularly important prior to DEC's decline andG that would not have in any real way 'solved' DEC's problems had it beenl applied after the decline.  J You describe a much wider range of marketing below.  A lot of this changedK when DEC changed, so doesn't apply to criticism of the 'old DEC' but indeedo" would have helped the changed DEC.   >-+ > It's making sure that calls get returned;m    The old DEC did this, very well.  #  it means that ordering new gear is  > easy and painless;    The old DEC did this, very well.  (  it means that executives get schmoozed;  5 The old DEC didn't do this much, and still prospered.n    it means that youD > offer to bring experts in to solve peculiar problems for free from > time-to-time;:    The old DEC did this constantly.    it means advertising;  5 The old DEC didn't do this much, and still prospered.e  $  it means getting lots of young kids* > experienced with your stuff for no cost;    The old DEC did this, very well.     it means that your products are > priced competitively.     The old DEC did this, very well.   >oL > If mentioned this before and I think virtually everyone will agree that inJ > the mid-late 80's when DEC 'owned' the mid-range market, all they had to doI > to seriously cripple unix increasing its market share was to drop theirS	 > prices.n  6 And that was part of what changed:  they didn't do so.  D  Nobody I knew who was sane *wanted* to voluntarily port from VMS toC > unix at the time, but they did so because DEC made it financiallyt
 attractiveB > to do so (and that was part of their flawed marketing strategy).  G You can call that marketing, or you can call that an *overall* strategyaD change from listening to customers and providing what they needed toF becoming 'strategically' focused and attempting to maximize profit.  I= choose the latter, but what one calls it doesn't much matter.h  K IIRC, one of KO's maxims (one of many that got lost in the changed DEC) wascK that growth was not a goal, but a consequence of satisfying customer needs.d    At thatF > time it was Sun that benefited. And dealing with Sun was a whole lot easierH > to do than dealing with Digital when it came to paperwork and billing.  J I never saw the 'old DEC' paper trail from the outside, so I can't comment) on that.  If you didn't, neither can you.a   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 16:06:21 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! < Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0205151506.235467c@posting.google.com>  o "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message news:<R8xE8.348$Yg7.88890@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...O? > "Paul Winalski" <prune@ZAnkh-Morpork.mv.com> wrote in messagec5 > news:3ce29125.2843516750@proxy.news.easynews.com...tJ > > On Wed, 15 May 2002 04:11:29 GMT, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>
 > > wrote: > >rN > > >Sun took over because  1) its products were a lot cheaper and  2) DEC wasL > > >both complacent and arrogant.  Neither of these has anything much to do >  with  > > >marketing.i > >iI > > Pricing is a vitally important part of marketing.  So is knowing yourn7 > > competition, and not being complacent and arrogant.  > E > See other post:  the old DEC had no deficiencies in any such areas.o >  > >e > > >>G > > >> From the perspective of someone who watched the whole thing playrI > > >> out from start to finish from within, the internal bickering was aeK > > >> side issue.  The main problem was that the old, traditional, pre-VAXdG > > >> DEC never "got it" when it came to marketing and its importance.b > > >wK > > >They didn't 'get it' because they didn't need to - until *DEC* changed  >  (notc! > > >the external circumstances).q > >aE > > No, the circumstances changed.  DEC grew too large for the littleeJ > > niche it grew up in, didn't realize it had to actively sell and marketI > > its products rather than just take orders, never learned either skill 2 > > properly, and as a consequence got blown away. > ? > Wrong.  As I said before, DEC managed the move from primarily J > engineering/scientific/academic sales to primarily commercial sales justN > fine.  What it outgrew was its britches, not its niche:  had it continued toN > concentrate on providing what customers needed, it could have continued just > fine.  >  > - bill  H the whole factor in DEC's demise can be summed up into one word, PALMER!   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 19:42:47 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>r' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!C, Message-ID: <3CE2F25F.D53CADFD@videotron.ca>   Bob Ceculski wrote:uJ > the whole factor in DEC's demise can be summed up into one word, PALMER!  G No. The DECline began under KO. Palmer still had the opportunity to fix  things, but he made them worse.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:09:06 GMTt# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>i' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!eE Message-ID: <CMCE8.1115$ah_.244@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>e  H It never ceased to amaze me in the '80's when I looked at the members ofL DEC's Board of Directors. Yes they may have been 'high-powered' types at oneK point in time, but in my opinion at the time, they were a bunch of deadwoodsH sorts that really didn't see what was going on in the marketplace around them.   I Sort of like how HP's current BOD seems to be to me. None of these peopledL have probably ever walked through a data center, much less written a line ofJ code. Now I admit that one doesn't necessarily have to do that in order toH be an effective and talented member of the board, yet...for a technology& company it would probably be an asset.  F I don't remember all the detail of the struggles between Olsen and theI Board, but once that began, the ability to rectify the internal conflictsi0 and marketing/sales problems quickly evaporated.    : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3CE2F25F.D53CADFD@videotron.ca... > Bob Ceculski wrote: L > > the whole factor in DEC's demise can be summed up into one word, PALMER! >.I > No. The DECline began under KO. Palmer still had the opportunity to fix ! > things, but he made them worse.  >W   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:22:55 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>e' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!eH Message-ID: <zZCE8.21189$t8_.15968@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Bill,s  J When I related my opinions, they come principally from my experiences withI DEC and my thoughts about them at the time. Today when I reflect on those.H experiences and my reactions way back then, I find that my reactions and< observations from that period of time still hold true today,  H The passage of time has done nothing to change my opinion about what *I* perceived at the time.  K You have raised some interesting points, and as you have elaborated on themTB more clearly each time you posted them, those points are easier to understand.a  L Not one of us has the *whole* picture of what was wrong....suffice it to sayK that there was enough wrong, on enough fronts, to cause the customer exodus  from the promised land of VMS.  I Let's just say that most of us who are still around using VMS to this daysG have thicker skin than those who got pissed off with Digital and Compaqe7 earlier on and moved their business to Sun, IBM, et al.r  J Those who left VMS long ago were probably thinking, "Imagine how good it's< going to feel when I stop banging my head against the wall."    I It's a little like divorce - typically when you divorce your 1st wife you J don't have any idea what your relationship with be in the future with wife2 #2 (assuming you weren't already living with her).  H Later, when you divorce wife #2, you probably aren't in any hurry to getH back together with wife #1 even though by your own admission you may notF have been fair to her yourself and in hindsight she had many admirable
 qualities.  D Any way, by that time wife #1 probably isn't on the market any more.          5 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messageo; news:X4xE8.82212$eV5.6435579@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...s >o0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageD > news:M_uE8.19960$t8_.18714@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... > >m9 > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messagea@ > > news:6QfE8.178251$q8.18022723@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com... > > >  > > > J > > > *After* DEC fell from grace, *then* the kinds of things you describe > aboveZH > > > *did* become problems, and marketing could have helped (though not savedr > > DEChH > > > unless the other, more basic, internal problems had been solved as > well). > > >e > >aK > > Wrong. These were exactly the things that CAUSED the 'fall from grace'.t > TheaH > > crap Sun was selling at the time couldn't hold a technical candle to whatE > > DEC could and was delivering technically. But Sun ate DEC's lunchD because7F > > they did ALL the things that constitute marketing well - and in my books,J > > marketing starts with the CEO and the Board of Directors and permeates theo > > whole organization >eL > I'm beginning to suspect that you don't have a clue what I've been talking& > about, so I'll give it another shot. >oG > The kind of 'marketing' people have been moaning about DEC (and later G > Compaq) not doing has been primarily advertising.  That's the kind ofsJ > marketing I assert was not particularly important prior to DEC's decline andCI > that would not have in any real way 'solved' DEC's problems had it beene > applied after the decline. >lL > You describe a much wider range of marketing below.  A lot of this changedF > when DEC changed, so doesn't apply to criticism of the 'old DEC' but indeed$ > would have helped the changed DEC. >  > >r- > > It's making sure that calls get returned;s >m" > The old DEC did this, very well. >d% >  it means that ordering new gear isr > > easy and painless; > " > The old DEC did this, very well. >y* >  it means that executives get schmoozed; > 7 > The old DEC didn't do this much, and still prospered.r >  >  it means that youF > > offer to bring experts in to solve peculiar problems for free from > > time-to-time;n >t" > The old DEC did this constantly. >u >  it means advertising; >l7 > The old DEC didn't do this much, and still prospered.  >I& >  it means getting lots of young kids, > > experienced with your stuff for no cost; >y" > The old DEC did this, very well. > " >  it means that your products are > > priced competitively.+ >0" > The old DEC did this, very well. >u > > K > > If mentioned this before and I think virtually everyone will agree that- inL > > the mid-late 80's when DEC 'owned' the mid-range market, all they had to > doK > > to seriously cripple unix increasing its market share was to drop their> > > prices.o >a8 > And that was part of what changed:  they didn't do so. >>F >  Nobody I knew who was sane *wanted* to voluntarily port from VMS toE > > unix at the time, but they did so because DEC made it financially> > attractiveD > > to do so (and that was part of their flawed marketing strategy). > I > You can call that marketing, or you can call that an *overall* strategyeF > change from listening to customers and providing what they needed toH > becoming 'strategically' focused and attempting to maximize profit.  I? > choose the latter, but what one calls it doesn't much matter.> >>I > IIRC, one of KO's maxims (one of many that got lost in the changed DEC)s wasoF > that growth was not a goal, but a consequence of satisfying customer needs. >7
 >  At thatH > > time it was Sun that benefited. And dealing with Sun was a whole lot > easierJ > > to do than dealing with Digital when it came to paperwork and billing. >cL > I never saw the 'old DEC' paper trail from the outside, so I can't comment+ > on that.  If you didn't, neither can you.  >  > - bill >t >k >u   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 00:47:04 GMTu1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! ' Message-ID: <3CE304BC.EDB392FD@fsi.net>o   John Smith wrote:u > 7 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messagep> > news:6QfE8.178251$q8.18022723@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com... > >l > >dN > > *After* DEC fell from grace, *then* the kinds of things you describe aboveL > > *did* become problems, and marketing could have helped (though not saved > DECoM > > unless the other, more basic, internal problems had been solved as well).- > >  > N > Wrong. These were exactly the things that CAUSED the 'fall from grace'.  TheK > crap Sun was selling at the time couldn't hold a technical candle to what K > DEC could and was delivering technically. But Sun ate DEC's lunch becausesK > they did ALL the things that constitute marketing well - and in my books,iL > marketing starts with the CEO and the Board of Directors and permeates the > whole organization > N > It's making sure that calls get returned; it means that ordering new gear isN > easy and painless; it means that executives get schmoozed; it means that youD > offer to bring experts in to solve peculiar problems for free fromI > time-to-time; it means advertising; it means getting lots of young kidstJ > experienced with your stuff for no cost; it means that your products are > priced competitively.' > L > If mentioned this before and I think virtually everyone will agree that inM > the mid-late 80's when DEC 'owned' the mid-range market, all they had to do I > to seriously cripple unix increasing its market share was to drop their M > prices. Nobody I knew who was sane *wanted* to voluntarily port from VMS todN > unix at the time, but they did so because DEC made it financially attractiveB > to do so (and that was part of their flawed marketing strategy).  = *SPUT* Well, I'll be damned! There's that AFFORDABILITY thing  __A_G_A_I_N__ !!!!  - ...you guys thought it was just a DJ thing...B  	 > At thatiM > time it was Sun that benefited. And dealing with Sun was a whole lot easiermN > to do than dealing with Digital when it came to paperwork and billing. I mayN > get some disagreement here when I say this, but in my estimation, Sun didn'tJ > have any hardware that could effectively compete with the larger systemsG > from DEC until around 1995, yet people put up with all Sun's relativeiN > deficiencies in hardware gear and software for a long time because they WERE > marketed to at all levels.  $ How long 'til the lesson is learned?   How long, O Lord?    Indeed, how long...e   -- s David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/v   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 22:02:49 -0400@- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>-> Subject: Windows XP Updates: More Trouble Than They're Worth ?, Message-ID: <3CE31327.C4466A75@videotron.ca>  5 Windows XP Updates: More Trouble Than They're Worth? n  Wed May 15, 1:32 PM ET     Jay Lyman, www.NewsFactor.com r  N  Users of Microsoft (Nasdaq: MSFT - news)'s Windows operating systems are toldL repeatedly to keep up to date on software patches and updates, and those whoH do not upgrade often are blamed when viruses or hackers exploit reported vulnerabilities. ,  >  However, for many users, downloading updates for the Redmond,G Washington-based software maker's latest and greatest operating system, N Windows XP , means crashed systems, devices that do not work and and sometimes  an inability to boot up at all.   L  But even taking into account Windows XP's update problems and other issues,N some analysts contend that, on the whole, the operating system has lived up toC Microsoft's billing as the best OS  the company ever has produced. t    Driver Dilemma   L  Giga Information Group analyst Rob Enderle told NewsFactor that XP's updateL problems center on drivers -- tiny software programs that tell the operating, system how to work with third-party devices.  F  "There have been issues where the driver has misidentified and brokenM things," Enderle said. "Basically, what happens is you won't be able to boot,i# or the device might not function." o  L  Enderle, who described Windows XP as the only OS for which Microsoft issuesN updated drivers, said the aforementioned issues have affected networking cards( and video drivers, among other devices.     Loss of Control r  K  Gartner (NYSE: IT - news) research director John Pescatore told NewsFactortM that while Windows XP is little used in enterprises, so there is little basis H for drawing conclusions, on the consumer side there have been consistentI reports of problems with peripheral  drivers, including printer drivers. l  M  Pescatore advised Windows XP users to avoid automatic updates, which he said L take control out of users' hands and pose the potential for security holes.   I  "In general, automatic functions where your computer is talking over the:K Internet without you knowing it are generally bad things," Pescatore said.      Fixes Elusive ,  M  There are ways to fix Windows XP and third-party devices when they have beenhM disrupted by an "update," using the new "driver restore" and "system restore"yN functions. But neither method is as simple as updating, according to Enderle.   K  "Fortunately, the 'system restore' function takes care of [system upsets]. 4 But a lot of people don't know it exists," he said.   K  Users also can deal with problem drivers by reverting to earlier, built-in N versions, Enderle noted. He added, however, that "a lot of folks don't like to, get into the guts of the operating system."     Reliance on Restore o  L  Enderle said that although past versions of Windows did not update drivers,M Microsoft went ahead with driver updates in Windows XP because the system hade0 restore functions in case an update went wrong.   N  While there have been hundreds of driver updates since XP began shipping lateN last year, driver problems have occurred with only a few of them, according to	 Enderle.    M  "If we were getting more breakage, we'd be hearing more about it," he said. '    Side Effects Standard g  J  Meta Group (Nasdaq: METG - news) vice president Steve Kleynhans said that3 problems with patches and updates are nothing new. i  I  "That's always true with patches, generally," Kleynhans told NewsFactor.dI "Particularly as they come to market, [they tend to] carry with them sidee
 effects."   H  Enderle added that despite a slow start, third-party device makers haveO improved their timeliness in releasing drivers, thereby easing  update issues. M  L  "It looks like the driver experience is getting reasonably good," he said.     Patience for Patches   M  Kleynhans said that unless companies or consumers are left vulnerable by notlN patching right away, it is more advisable to wait for a service pack, which isL more thoroughly tested, rather than trying to update their operating systems piecemeal. 3  L  "Unless there is a compelling reason that you need a patch -- like securityL -- and [not patching is] not causing significant pain, it's better to wait," Kleynhans said.s   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 23:55:41 GMTr# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>  Subject: Worth a read G Message-ID: <1ACE8.20858$t8_.5407@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>g  8 http://www.eweek.com/article/0,3658,s=701&a=21086,00.asp   I just came across this today.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 02:36:07 GMT  From: "McEagle" <spam@spam.com>v Subject: Re: Worth a reade> Message-ID: <rWEE8.320950$nc.46834216@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>  F Good article.  So, when I call Compaq with a question about TCPIP, I'm talking to someone at Array?  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageA news:1ACE8.20858$t8_.5407@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...a: > http://www.eweek.com/article/0,3658,s=701&a=21086,00.asp >t  > I just came across this today. >  >o >h   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 03:19:27 GMTt0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com> Subject: Re: Worth a readc@ Message-ID: <3zFE8.136280$o66.406828@news-server.bigpond.net.au>  H > Good article.  So, when I call Compaq with a question about TCPIP, I'm > talking to someone at Array?  J No.  For TCP/IP at least, your support call is handled by HP Support.  BugK fixes are handled by Array.  Frees up the development team to focus more ont development.   Matt.  --= -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companye Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA-= -------------------------------------------------------------0    * "McEagle" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message8 news:rWEE8.320950$nc.46834216@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com...H > Good article.  So, when I call Compaq with a question about TCPIP, I'm > talking to someone at Array? > 0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageC > news:1ACE8.20858$t8_.5407@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... < > > http://www.eweek.com/article/0,3658,s=701&a=21086,00.asp > > " > > I just came across this today. > >@ > >o > >m >  >j   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 16:35:06 -05001: From: "Scandora, Anthony \(35048\)" <Scandora@cmt.anl.gov>& Subject: Re: [announce] FreeVMS 0.0.14+ Message-ID: <abule9$b8v$1@milo.mcs.anl.gov>m  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3CE1CCE4.6BB5A954@fsi.net... $ > "Scandora, Anthony (35048)" wrote: > >t@ > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message% > > news:3CDDC989.F15E032E@fsi.net... 	 > > > ... L > > > On project I might suggest to the readers is that translators from anyL > > > 3GL (including C, regardless of how you classify it) to Macro/32 wouldL > > > be *VERY* useful freeware items. The resulting code should be suitableJ > > > for use on OpenVMS-VAX and OpenVMA-Alpha as well as whatever evolves outt$ > > > of the current FreeVMS effort. > > > > > That would be a huge project for a miniscule set of users. >fH > Initially. Once it becomes widely known, the potential user base wouldF > justify the effort. Then again, almost any userbase seems to justify > freeware..  J I doubt it.  Macro-32 wasn't a bad source language in its day, and it doesG comple into Alpha and Itanium code, but I can't imagine it being a goodiC intermediate language for compiler output.  To justify it, run someWJ interesting C source through DEC C for VAX and capture the output as MacroK 32.  Compile it for Alpha and compare it to what DEC C for Alpha generates.eI I'm willing to be surprised, but I do not have the inclination to run the  experiment myself.  K > > If there is really a demand for a free C for VMS, fix up GCC so it doest VMSt
 > > right. > I > That would help, yes. Ideally, of course, we'd like to see DEC-C have abF > status similar to Macro/32: distributed "free" with VMS, just as gcc@ > seems to come with every *BSD and Linux distro. on the planet. >t5 > ...but that would make too much sense, wouldn't it?m  L I repeat my suggestion to fix up GCC so it's good on VMS for VAX, Alpha, andL Itanium.  Doing so would be useful to far more people than a collection of X+ to Macro-32 translators, and far less work.r  H Of course GCC comes with BSD and Linux.  That's what made them what theyI are.  There might be some changes, but the last time I looked, all of the I major UNIX system manufacturers gave away GCC but charged for their own CsH and other compilers, which many paying customers perceive as having moreL value than GCC.  I wouldn't mind if DEC C were bundled with VMS, but I don'tH expect HP to do it any more than I expect Sun to bundle Forte C ($1295),: Forte C++ ($3495), or Forte Fortran (($3495) with Solaris.  1 Tony Scandora, Argonne National Lab, 630-252-75411 scandora@cmt.anl.gov   ------------------------------    Date: 15 May 2002 16:10:23 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)6 Subject: [Q]  VMS incremental backups vs. other brands= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0205151510.3b2b5739@posting.google.com>    Hello,  @ With VMS, incremental restore operations restore the disk to the? condition it was in as of the time of the last incremental saveeD operation. Files that were deleted or modified between the last fullA backup and the last incremental backup remain deleted or modified9 after restoration.  F Does any other brand of Backup do this? I think with PKZIP and WindowsD Backup programs the incremental restore step simply tries to restoreA all files that were saved, possibly warning you about overwritingsE files with the same name on the disk and letting you decide on a file  by file basis. (What a pain!)r  A I don't much have experience with other backup programs. So, doeseF anyone know about other brands' incremental backup restore operations?% Do any of them attempt what VMS does?c   Just curious. Thanks.e   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman " afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.269 ************************