1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 16 May 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 270       Contents:: Re: $CHECK_ACCESS fails if there is no read access to fileG Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS G Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS  Re: Building Perl  Re: Calling DecFroms from CXX 3 Re: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix 3 RE: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix 4 Comments on ITUG/DECUS joint Euro conference in Lyon$ Re: DCL symbol substitution question$ Re: DCL symbol substitution question$ Re: DCL symbol substitution question$ Re: DCL symbol substitution question$ Re: DCL symbol substitution question8 Re: Experts (Was : internet address on a Decserver 90TL)4 fetch_http revisited (was: C-Kermit & HTTP retrieve) File sizes from lib$file_scan ? # Re: File sizes from lib$file_scan ? - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning  FTP queue ?  Re: FTP queue ?  HGFTP non-standard port  ICC question( Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL( Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL( RE: internet address on a Decserver 90TL( Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TLP JOB OPENINGS IN MA: **  Senior Architects / Internal Systems *** 100-150K in  BOD Re: Most unusual resident in a system ?, was: Re: No new Alpha sales) Re: Network device for wide area clusters  Re: No new Alpha sales Re: No new Alpha sales Re: No new Alpha sales Re: No new Alpha sales Re: No new Alpha sales% Re: Non-interactive TECO? (of course)  Re: OpenVMS SNMP TRAP % Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support? % Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support? 0 Re: Problem with the internal clock of an XP10000 Re: Problem with the internal clock of an XP1000 Re: Proxy question scsi cluster Re: scsi cluster Re: scsi cluster Re: System manager available Re: TCP/IP for VMS...HELP!? Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools? ? Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools? ? Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools? ? Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools? 0 Re: What is good model for disk i/o w/shadowing? Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! RE: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing! Re: Who cares about marketing!9 Re: Windows XP Updates: More Trouble Than They're Worth ?  Re: Worth a read Re: Worth a read X WINDOWS question Re: X WINDOWS question Re: [announce] FreeVMS 0.0.14 P [Q]  How do you set the SQO bit in the FAB (FAB, RAB, which field has this bit?)P Re: [Q]  How do you set the SQO bit in the FAB (FAB, RAB, which field has this b1 Re: [Q]  VMS incremental backups vs. other brands   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 04:53:38 -0700 From: cbdeja@my-deja.com (-)C Subject: Re: $CHECK_ACCESS fails if there is no read access to file < Message-ID: <611952a3.0205160353.238bb5a@posting.google.com>  k "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com> wrote in message news:<3CE26DE0.B409D051@clarityconnect.com>... I > The only change in this area that I can (quickly) find is documented in I > OpenVMS VAX Version 6.0 Release Notes, (AA-PV6ZA-TE), MAY 1993, Section E > 2.2.14 Security Changes and deals with SYS$CHECK_ACCESS and CONTROL E > access.  See also the DSNlink article (may be available in askvms)  > > [OpenVMS] $CHECK_ACCESS Returns SS$_NOPRIV On Control Access  E Thanks for the reference. Unfortunately that doesn't seem to be it. I D coundn't find anything in the Version 6.0 Release Notes that covered my problem.    Colin    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 07:22:13 -0600B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley)P Subject: Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS3 Message-ID: <B+K6yEdnJ5St@eisner.encompasserve.org>   T In article <abu00v$q3d$1@reader1.panix.com>, John Forkosh <john@invalid.com> writes:E > Simon Clubley <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> wrote: 
 > <<snip>>: > : The kinds of things that I would really like to see on > : Linux/Unix are:  > : K > : 2) RMS. The purpose here is to have a decent free ISAM facility (I know L > :    that C-ISAM is commercially available) in it's own right, and RMS hasB > :    proven to be very reliable and feature rich over the years. > ; > Try Berkeley db.  That's actually the current "standard". F > The current software is freely available (for noncommercial/hobbyistA > purposes) from  www.sleepycat.com, and works real well for most  > isam requirements.  H You have just managed to get another item added to my "list of things to, look at over the next few weeks/months". :-)   Thanks for the pointer.   B Also thanks to Alan for warnings about the data corruption issues.   Simon.  J BTW, I got pointed to a list of free ISAM packages a couple of months ago,G but after looking at several of them and discovering that they had poor K functionality compared to RMS, I gave up looking. It seems as if you either H have to be lucky or somehow know the name of a decent package in advance in order to find it...   --  B Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       + Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 07:39:28 -0600B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley)P Subject: Re: A (free) VMS environment in a Linux/Unix system ?, was: Re: freeVMS3 Message-ID: <Mi+MMZIsspHa@eisner.encompasserve.org>   U In article <3CE29276.C69829A9@caltech.edu>, David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu> writes:  > David Mathog wrote:  >>   >>  If you use my extract and  >> execinput programs from >>  @ >>   ftp://saf.bio.caltech.edu/pub/software/linux_or_unix_tools/ >>     [snip]   > P > and the modified find line, which should work with any file name no matter how
 > hideous is:  > L >  % find . | grep \.txt$ | extract -bs -cols 'echo searching in [1,] ; grep > string [1,]' | execinput >   . Thanks for this. I've downloaded the programs.   Simon.   --  B Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       + Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 10:10:51 -0500 C From: "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com>  Subject: Re: Building PerlH Message-ID: <craig.berry-358E92.10105116052002@news.directvinternet.com>  G Unless you have an interest in or special need for antiquities, please  E get the current production release of Perl from one of the following  2 sources, in increasing order of installation ease:  / <http://www.perl.com/CPAN-local/src/index.html>   " or an easy-to-install VMS kit from   <http://www.sidhe.org/vmsperl>  " or the HPQ-supported PCSI kit from  I <http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/apache/csws_modperl.h  tml>  H Oops.  I see that you are on VAX so the PCSI kit won't do you any good, C but the other methods will.  If you are dead-set on getting a very  H outdated version of Perl up and running, you might hack the descrip.mms - to add  /STANDARD=VAXC to the compiler flags.   $ In article <3ce2dae7$1@news.si.com>,=  "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote:   J > I'm trying to build Perl V5.3.5 from the Freeware 4 CD on an OpenVMS VAX@ > V7.2 system with COmpaq C V6.4-5.  I get to one point and see: > L >             (void)times((tbuffer_t *)&timesbuf);  /* time.h uses different > name > for */ >         ................^ J > %CC-W-PTRMISMATCH, In this statement, the referenced type of the pointer > value D >  "(tbuffer_t ...)&Perl_timesbuf" is "struct tbuffer", which is not > compatible >  with "struct tms". ( >                 At line number 3091 in2 > A305_DISK:[TILLMAN.PERL.PERL5_003_05]PP_SYS.C;1.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:11:59 GMT 3 From: "Duane Smith" <Duane.Smith@nospam.compaq.com> & Subject: Re: Calling DecFroms from CXX9 Message-ID: <3uME8.13$bk3.107622@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>   K When you see the linker list parameters as part of an undefined symbol this H means that it is demangling C++ mangled names which include both routineF information as well as parameter information.  You need to modify yourL declaration of the DecForms routines to tell the C++ compiler that these are2 external C routines and not external C++ routines.   #ifdef __cplusplus extern "C" { #endif   routine declarations   #ifdef __cplusplus }  #endif   Duane   6 "Damian Williams" <DWilliams@wga.com> wrote in message7 news:4e909558.0205151506.22b2fc2d@posting.google.com... A > Has anyone been able to call a decforms screen using Compaq C++ H > V6.2-016?  I have tried the examples provided by Digitial (compaq/HP?)B > with no success.  The first error I received at compile time wasF > "%CXX-E-MANYARGUMENTS, too many arguments in function call " and was > told by support that > F > "the C++ engineering team suggested this particular problem seems toE > be with how forms$enable() function is declared. Most likely, it is F > declared in some header file supplied by DecForms and suggested thatF > we need to check to ensure that it is declared with the exact numberF > of arguments and extern "C" linkage.  C++ Engineering noted, that anH > empty identifier list in the function declaration will work for C, but > not for C++: " > @ > OK, so I changed the FORMS$C_DEFINITIONS.H file from "long int > forms$enable();"" > to "extern long int forms$enable >                 ( 3 >                         long int *vector_address, ? >                         struct dsc$descriptor_s *device_name, > >                         struct dsc$descriptor_s *session_id,B >                         struct dsc$descriptor_s *form_file_name,. >                         __optional_params);"@ > and now receive no errors on the compile but on the link I get > ( > %LINK-W-NUDFSYMS, 2 undefined symbols:@ > %LINK-I-UDFSYM,         long forms$disable(dsc$descriptor_s *)G > %LINK-I-UDFSYM,         long forms$enable(long *, dsc$descriptor_s *, . > dsc$descriptor_s *, dsc$descriptor_s *, ...)H > %LINK-W-USEUNDEF, undefined symbol long forms$disable(dsc$descriptor_s > *) referenced + >         in psect $LINK$ offset %X00000050 ) >         in module CLCLIB0402_TEST1 file $ > [CLCLIB0402]CLCLIB0402_TEST1.OBJ;1> > %LINK-W-USEUNDEF, undefined symbol long forms$enable(long *,B > dsc$descriptor_s *, dsc$descriptor_s *, dsc$descriptor_s *, ...) > refere > nced+ >         in psect $LINK$ offset %X00000060 ) >         in module CLCLIB0402_TEST1 file $ > [CLCLIB0402]CLCLIB0402_TEST1.OBJ;1 > 1 > ANY help or suggestions are greatly apreciated.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 14:58:01 +0100 U From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> < Subject: Re: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix0 Message-ID: <ac0dt9$f3a$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Bob Ceculski wrote:   c > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3CDC104D.938DB683@videotron.ca>...  >  >>Bob Ceculski wrote:  >>I >>>it already has survived, and I would say that jstars, miltary, DOD, US J >>>gov use, Cerner, Pitts. Super Computing and the list goes on and on areL >>>the reason vms will survive ... MPE was 16 bit, neglected, no clustering, >>> J >>Consider some recent "super computing" deal that HP signed, promising toN >>deliver a super machine with over 1000 CPus based on IA64. Sounds to me thatK >>HP isn't even interested in selling Alphas NOW, they prefer to delay cash % >>input until IA64 is actually ready.  >>L >>Secondly, jstarts, military etc are just like existing MPE customers: theyN >>will continue to receive support. They do not mean that VMS will continue to >>be developped. >> > C > the only tools vms needs are in place ... "C" and Java and Apache C > (html,xml) are in place ... anything can now be ported w/relative A > ease from unix/linux ... 3rd party vendors/shareware will take  F > over from here ... ports have already begun, esp. java (BEA,Ericom)! >   ! No BEA is actually a bad example.   C WLS is available but OpenVMS support lags other platforms and other A BEA ecommerce products do not run on OpenVMS meaning that you are F unlikely to pick up any platform business if you are in an environment6 where other BEA products are required appart from WLS.   Regards  Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:15:28 -0400 # From: "Dan Allen" <dallen@nist.gov> < Subject: RE: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix: Message-ID: <NEBBIALHDHJMJINPGMOAMEEPEKAA.dallen@nist.gov>  S 	Bill's reponse not withstanding Mssr. Green, are you suggesting that functionality ? 	that is not needed by everyone is somehow diminished in value?    > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net] % > Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 3:26 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > > Subject: Re: Capellas: Linux, Windows Will 'Eviscerate' Unix >  >  > 5 > "Ken Green" <Ken.Green@kgcc.co.uk> wrote in message & > news:3CE16112.EC41AF98@kgcc.co.uk... >  > ...  > K > > Not everyone wants shared disk, sharing disk is SSSSLLLLOOOOOWWWWW!!!!!  > 6 > Not at all, at least if you know how (and VMS does). >  > - bill >  >  >  >  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 15:57:16 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> = Subject: Comments on ITUG/DECUS joint Euro conference in Lyon E Message-ID: <wFQE8.8684$ah_.779@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>     The following is excerpted from:9 http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=02/05/14/1646308     H "Live on Tape: Scott Stallard Key customer and employee visits precludedG Scott Stallard, the newly-minted head of the New HP's Business Critical I Systems group, from attending the Lyon event. Mr. Stallard did assert his L presence in a videotaped interview wherein he assured customers that the NewB HP will continue to aggressively promote and sell OpenVMS-based HP1 AlphaServers as long as customer demand exists. "   J *** (added comment) The big question is whether HP is be doing ANYTHING toK actively STIMULATE demand of VMS, whether on Alpha today or IA64 in several  years.    K "We expect [customer demand] to exist for at least several years beyond the K 2004 introduction of EV79-based AlphaServers," Stallard said. Since the New J HP will continue to support HP AlphaServers for at least five years beyondI their final sales date, customers can be sure that their Alpha investment . will be protected well into the next decade. "  C *** (added comment) Nice about the support for Alpha for at least 5 A additional years...that sort of thing is also mandated by federal J regulations, so HP isn't really going out of its way to be nice guys here.  F *** (added comment) But where are Stallard's comments about giving the9 marketing of VMS some prominence in the HP constellation?     J Alpha: A Marvelous Future at the New HP Among the featured speakers duringC Lyon Day One was Alpha Systems Division VP and General Manager Rich F Marcello, who offered a multitude of reasons why it's safe to bet your2 business on the New HP's Alpha and IPF technology.  F OpenVMS Group VP Mark Gorham followed up with a detailed review of theL OpenVMS roadmap (again, no surprises here, except to competitors who falselyH claim that the New HP will abandon the OpenVMS customer constituency andE force users to embark on a near-term migration) and the status of the : VMS-to-IPF port (which is on track and ahead of schedule).  L We'll provide detailed coverage of the Marcello and Gorham presentations, asF well as the presentations delivered by NonStop Division VP and GeneralF Manager Pauline Nist, EMEA Alpha Systems Director Tom Yeates, and UNIXE specialist Don Jenkins. Stay tuned for more in-depth ITUG/DECUS Joint ' Conference coverage in the coming days.     J *** (added comment) I don't think the issue is one of HP saying to currentF VMS customers, "We're closing up the shop today. It's more an issue ofI whether VMS customers will be able to know with certainty that HP will betL actively promoting VMS to non-VMS customers of IBM, Sun, SGI, Windows users,K as the best alternative for their businesses. Only in that way can ISV's beeJ comfortable in supplying products and services to the VMS marketplace. AndJ only in that way can current and prospective customers be assured that VMS= is a safe place for their companies to invest the IT dollars.    ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 06:12:35 GMT5 From: ccburgess@uqstu.jdstory.uq.edu.au (Ian Burgess)s- Subject: Re: DCL symbol substitution question . Message-ID: <abvikj$9on$1@bunyip.cc.uq.edu.au>  a In article <R3BE8.80207$vm6.15015645@ruti.visi.com>, "Mark Jensen" <markje@vistainfo.com> writes:dK >I'm writing a little tool that allows our support staff to create flatfilesL >archives of data.  To do this I simply assign sys$output to a temp file, doM >a sql display to get the data, deassign sys$output, then read each line fromtJ >the temp file into a symbol and write append from that into the flatfile, >one line at a time. >dG >The two problems I'm running into is one, something is transforming mynF >data's single quotes into double quotes, then (problem two) recursiveL >substitutions are mucking up the empty single quotes by trying to transform) >the text after it as a symbol.  Example:sC >The data in the symbol often has something like "<FIELD Name="BOB"c >Override="" />"0 >That becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />"G >Which then becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override= />", stripping out thee >double single-quoatations.e? >Which is a bad thing, as poor data integrity sometimes can be.  .h .k .a" >$ open/read WIZINPUT 'WIZARDTEMP' >$ READWIZARDTEMP:+ >$ read/end=CLOSEWIZINPUT WIZINPUT TEMPLINEa' >$ TEMPLINE = f$extract(6,400,TEMPLINE) * >$ TEMPSTRING1 = f$extract(0,200,TEMPLINE), >$ TEMPSTRING2 = f$extract(200,200,TEMPLINE)$ >$ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'"$ >$ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING2'"  D At this point I could not trace how <FIELD Name="BOB" Override="" />' became <FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />r but I notice this ...      $ show symbol line-     LINE = "<FIELD Name="BOB" Override="" />"    $ write sys$output line "   <FIELD Name="BOB" Override="" />   $ write sys$output "''line'"   <FIELD Name=BOB Override=" />    $t   So try h $ write WIZARCHIVE TEMPSTRING1
 instead of# $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'"k   Ian Burgess  University of Queensland I.Burgess[at]its.uq.edu.au www.its.uq.edu.auu   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 19:34:08 +0010e% From: paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.auD- Subject: Re: DCL symbol substitution questionu5 Message-ID: <01KHT29UTVCI000MUY@tgmail.tg.nsw.gov.au>n  M Under this subject title, I would suggest that one looks through a search of i; this newsgroup and finds some of the posts by Alan Feldman.i  J His discussions of symbol substitution rules, including the &, are of the  best that I have seen.  , [Not to decry other posters in this thread.]   Regards, Paddy   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 08:11:21 -0400l7 From: "news.spacelots.com" <maustin@firstdbasource.com>l- Subject: Re: DCL symbol substitution questiont2 Message-ID: <3ce3707e.0@ALPHA1.FIRSTDBASOURCE.COM>    Mark Jensen wrote in message ...K >I'm writing a little tool that allows our support staff to create flatfilesL >archives of data.  To do this I simply assign sys$output to a temp file, doH >a sql display to get the data, deassign sys$output, then read each line fromJ >the temp file into a symbol and write append from that into the flatfile, >one line at a time. >cG >The two problems I'm running into is one, something is transforming mytF >data's single quotes into double quotes, then (problem two) recursiveL >substitutions are mucking up the empty single quotes by trying to transform) >the text after it as a symbol.  Example:.C >The data in the symbol often has something like "<FIELD Name="BOB"  >Override="" />"0 >That becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />"G >Which then becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override= />", stripping out thee >double single-quoatations.j? >Which is a bad thing, as poor data integrity sometimes can be.e >eF >Here's a code snippet.  Can anyone tell me how to only substitute the symbol0 >once?  It's a string literal so I can't amp it. >)& >$ read/end=CLOSEINPUT INPUT NAMESLINE >$ deassign sys$output' >$ assign /user 'WIZARDTEMP' sys$outputyA >$!Order in NAMESLINE: wWIZCOMP, wNAME, wLEVEL, wRESOURCE, wAGENTy; >$ if (f$edit(NAMESLINE,"trim").eqs."") then goto READINPUTyF >$! Commas are allowed in a wizard name, so cannot use f$element...use' >f$extract since fields are fixed widthb& >$ wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,NAMESLINE). >$ wNAME = """"+f$extract(2,32,NAMESLINE)+""""% >$ wLEVEL = f$extract(35,1,NAMESLINE)aD >$ wRESOURCE = """"+f$element(0,".",f$extract(37,34,NAMESLINE))+""""? >$ wAGENT = """"+f$edit(f$extract(72,12,NAMESLINE),"trim")+""""AD >$ sql display wizards sequence, wizard where wizcomp='wWIZCOMP' and' >name='wNAME' and blah blah blah *snip*g" >$ open/read WIZINPUT 'WIZARDTEMP' >$ READWIZARDTEMP:+ >$ read/end=CLOSEWIZINPUT WIZINPUT TEMPLINE J >$! the record is 396 bytes fixed, the first six are the sequence field, 6 >bytes' >$ TEMPLINE = f$extract(6,400,TEMPLINE)dC >$! split into two 200 byte strings to evade the DCL 255 byte limite* >$ TEMPSTRING1 = f$extract(0,200,TEMPLINE), >$ TEMPSTRING2 = f$extract(200,200,TEMPLINE) >$! append to the text file-$ >$ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'"$ >$ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING2'" >$ TEMPSTRING1=""r >$ TEMPSTRING2=""e >$ TEMPLINE="" >$ goto READWIZARDTEMP >n >L >x >Thanks, >Mark Jensen >FNISS  K Can you give us a description of what exactly you are trying to accomplish?CD What database are you using? Rdb or Oracle?  What versions - this isD important to know what features are avaible to accomplish your task.   in Rdb   $SQL$  set output <filename>l. set line length <big enough to hold your data>
 select....	 set noout   K If this is Rdb I would prefer to use the RMU/UNLOAD/ to text files myself -iJ you can set the quotes anyway you like - and generally a whole lot faster.   Michael Austin First DBA Source, Inc.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:02:00 -0500 * From: "Mark Jensen" <markje@vistainfo.com>- Subject: Re: DCL symbol substitution questiont4 Message-ID: <0KQE8.81048$vm6.15241244@ruti.visi.com>  J Was able to get it to work by skipping the double quotes in the write line! $ write WIZARCHIVE ''TEMPSTRING2'   J So if TEMPSTRING2="FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />" then it will write the Override='' into the text file.y  F As to why my double quotes in the actual records are showing as singleL quotes, not sure.  The "SQL" server is homegrown so if I can find the bug in, the code (if it is a bug) then I can fix it.   Thanks for you help. Mark Jensent    5 "Mark Jensen" <markje@vistainfo.com> wrote in messagei. news:R3BE8.80207$vm6.15015645@ruti.visi.com...L > I'm writing a little tool that allows our support staff to create flatfileJ > archives of data.  To do this I simply assign sys$output to a temp file, doI > a sql display to get the data, deassign sys$output, then read each liney fromK > the temp file into a symbol and write append from that into the flatfile,d > one line at a time.  >pH > The two problems I'm running into is one, something is transforming myG > data's single quotes into double quotes, then (problem two) recursiveVC > substitutions are mucking up the empty single quotes by trying tom	 transform5* > the text after it as a symbol.  Example:D > The data in the symbol often has something like "<FIELD Name="BOB" > Override="" />" 1 > That becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />" H > Which then becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override= />", stripping out the > double single-quoatations.@ > Which is a bad thing, as poor data integrity sometimes can be. > G > Here's a code snippet.  Can anyone tell me how to only substitute the_ symbol1 > once?  It's a string literal so I can't amp it.h >1' > $ read/end=CLOSEINPUT INPUT NAMESLINEi > $ deassign sys$outputo( > $ assign /user 'WIZARDTEMP' sys$outputB > $!Order in NAMESLINE: wWIZCOMP, wNAME, wLEVEL, wRESOURCE, wAGENT< > $ if (f$edit(NAMESLINE,"trim").eqs."") then goto READINPUTG > $! Commas are allowed in a wizard name, so cannot use f$element...usen( > f$extract since fields are fixed width' > $ wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,NAMESLINE)f/ > $ wNAME = """"+f$extract(2,32,NAMESLINE)+""""e& > $ wLEVEL = f$extract(35,1,NAMESLINE)E > $ wRESOURCE = """"+f$element(0,".",f$extract(37,34,NAMESLINE))+""""x@ > $ wAGENT = """"+f$edit(f$extract(72,12,NAMESLINE),"trim")+""""E > $ sql display wizards sequence, wizard where wizcomp='wWIZCOMP' andm( > name='wNAME' and blah blah blah *snip*# > $ open/read WIZINPUT 'WIZARDTEMP'b > $ READWIZARDTEMP:c, > $ read/end=CLOSEWIZINPUT WIZINPUT TEMPLINEK > $! the record is 396 bytes fixed, the first six are the sequence field, 6. > bytess( > $ TEMPLINE = f$extract(6,400,TEMPLINE)D > $! split into two 200 byte strings to evade the DCL 255 byte limit+ > $ TEMPSTRING1 = f$extract(0,200,TEMPLINE)e- > $ TEMPSTRING2 = f$extract(200,200,TEMPLINE)m > $! append to the text file% > $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'" % > $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING2'"s > $ TEMPSTRING1="" > $ TEMPSTRING2="" > $ TEMPLINE=""k > $ goto READWIZARDTEMPl >d >t >h	 > Thanks,b
 > Mark Jensenn > FNIS >r >C   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 10:19:34 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)- Subject: Re: DCL symbol substitution questionR= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0205160919.5760acd3@posting.google.com>o  f "Mark Jensen" <markje@vistainfo.com> wrote in message news:<R3BE8.80207$vm6.15015645@ruti.visi.com>...L > I'm writing a little tool that allows our support staff to create flatfileM > archives of data.  To do this I simply assign sys$output to a temp file, do N > a sql display to get the data, deassign sys$output, then read each line fromK > the temp file into a symbol and write append from that into the flatfile,  > one line at a time.  > H > The two problems I'm running into is one, something is transforming myG > data's single quotes into double quotes, then (problem two) recursiverM > substitutions are mucking up the empty single quotes by trying to transforme* > the text after it as a symbol.  Example:D > The data in the symbol often has something like "<FIELD Name="BOB" > Override="" />" 1 > That becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override='' />"S    C At what point does this happen? Looks like "double quotes" going to 3 "single quotes" (you said it in the reverse order).t    H > Which then becomes "<FIELD Name='BOB' Override= />", stripping out the > double single-quoatations.@ > Which is a bad thing, as poor data integrity sometimes can be. > N > Here's a code snippet.  Can anyone tell me how to only substitute the symbol1 > once?  It's a string literal so I can't amp it.i     What does "amp it" mean?     > ' > $ read/end=CLOSEINPUT INPUT NAMESLINER > $ deassign sys$outputw( > $ assign /user 'WIZARDTEMP' sys$outputB > $!Order in NAMESLINE: wWIZCOMP, wNAME, wLEVEL, wRESOURCE, wAGENT< > $ if (f$edit(NAMESLINE,"trim").eqs."") then goto READINPUTG > $! Commas are allowed in a wizard name, so cannot use f$element...usee( > f$extract since fields are fixed width' > $ wWIZCOMP = f$extract(0,1,NAMESLINE)r/ > $ wNAME = """"+f$extract(2,32,NAMESLINE)+"""" & > $ wLEVEL = f$extract(35,1,NAMESLINE)E > $ wRESOURCE = """"+f$element(0,".",f$extract(37,34,NAMESLINE))+""""e@ > $ wAGENT = """"+f$edit(f$extract(72,12,NAMESLINE),"trim")+""""    @ Why the """"? Even if the result of f$extract contains quotationE marks, you shouldn't need to enclose them in more quotation marks. IncC fact, that may be part of your problem since it adds an extra outer, layer of quotes:  + $ A = "Hello there. ""My friend"" is home."c
 $ SH SYM A)   A = "Hello there. "My friend" is home."i $ AB = F$EXTRACT(1,999,A)p $ SH SYM AB )   AB = "ello there. "My friend" is home." # $ AC = """"+F$EXTRACT(1,999,A)+"""") $ SH SYM AC +   AC = ""ello there. "My friend" is home.""     > See how AC differs from AB? I think that AB is what you want.     E > $ sql display wizards sequence, wizard where wizcomp='wWIZCOMP' and ( > name='wNAME' and blah blah blah *snip*# > $ open/read WIZINPUT 'WIZARDTEMP'  > $ READWIZARDTEMP:t, > $ read/end=CLOSEWIZINPUT WIZINPUT TEMPLINEK > $! the record is 396 bytes fixed, the first six are the sequence field, 6a > bytese( > $ TEMPLINE = f$extract(6,400,TEMPLINE)D > $! split into two 200 byte strings to evade the DCL 255 byte limit+ > $ TEMPSTRING1 = f$extract(0,200,TEMPLINE)1- > $ TEMPSTRING2 = f$extract(200,200,TEMPLINE)g > $! append to the text file% > $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING1'"e% > $ write WIZARCHIVE "''TEMPSTRING2'".    % Like another poster replied, you wanth      $ WRITE WIZARCHIVE TEMPSTRING1  6 etc. Don't use quotation marks when you don't have to!     Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman-" afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 09:33:30 -040063 From: John McLachlan <jmclachlan@nospam.draper.com>pA Subject: Re: Experts (Was : internet address on a Decserver 90TL)e> Message-ID: <jmclachlan-1CC0A7.09333016052002@news.draper.com>  C > Well, I'm in control of a rather importent VMS system, bit still,kE > I'm no "expert" in all areas. But, never the less, in the case withiF > the TL90, I'd suspect that trying with HELP in the server would have > also given the answer...  P UNfortunately, the command I was using WAS what the help system and manual said N would work.  There is also no troubleshooting section for when the serve just  says "no".  :-)b  E > The term "expert" is rather rellative, isn't it. It depends on what/$ > you happens to know at the moment.  # or have forgotten over the years...t   -- r- <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>c   John McLachlan Draper Laboratoryf Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 jmclachlan@draper.comf" http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 06:58:49 -07001 From: asytnyk@mcscns.cc.telcordia.com (A. Sytnyk) = Subject: fetch_http revisited (was: C-Kermit & HTTP retrieve) = Message-ID: <89b6afcc.0205160558.74d51097@posting.google.com>i  
 G'day VMSers!t  F 	I had been using fetch_http within my scripts for the longest of time' and was pleased with its functionality!.  I Then one day it stopped working and I started to scratch my head...  Boo!               The return was as such...h   HTTP/1.0 302 Found) Proxy-agent: iPlanet-Web-Proxy-Server/3.6p8 Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:21:00 GMT                     ? Location: http://www.xyz.com/itc/sysaccsec/security/secser.htmln Content-type: text/htmll Content-length: 248.  ; <HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Found</TITLE></HEAD><BODY><H1>Found</H1>a# This document has moved to a new <aoJ href="http://www.xyz.com/itc/sysaccsec/security/secser.html">location</a>.D Please update your documents and hotlists accordingly.</BODY></HTML>  G Of course I was baffled so I turned to network security folks and askedn for some debugging advice...  7 Well they instructed me to use TELNET and lo and beholdr   $ TELNET www.reachme.com 80e GET www.reachme.com HTTP/1.0 <CR> <CR>   ! And off we go! ...   M So I was a bit perturbed as to why fetch_http('s) output was being brandished  in the proxy server...   Was it the port ? Although  	         .o	         . 	         .r     rem_port = 80;	         .a	         .r	         .,  J Later in the fetch_http.c code the sockaddr structure is being set for the call to connect the socket    o,     remote.sa_family = hostinfo->h_addrtype;	         .t	         . )     remote.sa_data[0] = rem_port >> 8;   d'     remote.sa_data[1] = (rem_port&255);c	         .t	         . 	         .p6                                                       : so   -----------------------------------------------------;      |   |00 |80 |   |   |   |   |  |~|  |   |   |   |   | J:      -----------------------------------------------------9        ^   d0 d1  d2  --------------------------->    d14t&        |       ^                     ^&     sa_family  |                     |&              port                    |1                       hostinfo->h_addr_list[0][j]w    T Fair enuff! Was working ... now its not! The proxy server was not allowing the HTML M script to be sent to me so following the original post by Christoph Gartmann tP (Danke for the example KERMIT script) I FTPed the appropriate version of KERMIT ? for VMS7.1 and all was well! (As suggest by some on this list.)e     >Christoph Gartmanns >Hello,l > M >currently I am using C-Kermit 7.0.197 to retrieve HTML documents from within-N >DCL. Now I would like to do the same for binary files, e.g. a .GIF . But hereJ >I don't succeed. I had a look at the new 8.0 version and noticed, that itJ >includes full HTTP support but in Unix only :-(  Why? And is there really4 >no way to achieve a HTTP retrieve of a binary file. > N >Here is a Kermit script to fetch a HTML ASCII file and save it as TEMP.TEMP : >iJ >; This script will connect to a WWW server and request a single document. >; Call it like this:a> >;   kermit this.file "=" "www.server.name" "remote/file.name"K >; Note that the VMS global symbol CKERMIT_STATUS contains the exit status.aL >;                                                           Ch.G., 25.05.00  N Searching through the archives, I noticed that several people had accomplishedK the same goal through TELNET/CREATE_SESSION which creates a psuedo terminalt
 device TNAx:.t      yK I would appreciate if anyone has any example DCL code using open/read/writemR to the device which would since this would be done by native VMS layered products.M No big deal - KERMIT works well! (As always there are many ways to skin VMS!)g   Brudder Andrusha   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:44:32 -0100 - From: Peter Harding <harding@herald.ox.ac.uk>R( Subject: File sizes from lib$file_scan ?/ Message-ID: <3CE3A9B0.BAFDC950@herald.ox.ac.uk>E  G To cut a long story hopefully not too short, in the file-handler called2 by lib$file_scan I havee   size = xabfhc->xab$l_ebk alloc = fab->fab$l_alq  A which often, but not always, gets the same answer as DIR/SIZ=ALL.B  + What can I do to make them more consistent?r   Thanks   --  , ICQ 40628243 Tel 07092057581 Fax 07092308800   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 18:05:27 +0200FE From: Jan C. =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vorbr=FCggen?= <jvorbrueggen@mediasec.de>D, Subject: Re: File sizes from lib$file_scan ?+ Message-ID: <3CE3D8C7.E3269367@mediasec.de>r   > size = xabfhc->xab$l_ebk > alloc = fab->fab$l_alq > C > which often, but not always, gets the same answer as DIR/SIZ=ALL.-  I The ALQ should always be the same as the allocated value. IIRC, EBK comesaH with FFB (first free byte), which gives you the semantics: If FFB=0, EBKJ is one block too many because it's pointing to the start of the next block  containing said first free byte.   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:58:48 +0000n  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning: Message-ID: <OFC47B9E8F.541C3ED2-ON00256BBB.0041BA5B@btyp>  I Then why upgrade at all? Supposedly to move to GS320 boxes running VMS...1   Steve S0        A JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> on 05/15/2002 06:57:53 PMu    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:oJ From:      JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>, 15 May 2002, 6:57 p.m.  - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warningl     Bill Sticker wrote:  >aG > A decision to scrap all of their Alphas because of an upgrade failureo shows $ > incompetency at the highest level.  J It is possible that the customer already had plans to migrate off VMS, and0 used probems with 7.3 to accelerate the process.          F ______________________________________________________________________     [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beG confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message has G been addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce,h$ distribute or use this transmission.  H Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee isG not intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have receivedqK this transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.e  
 Thank you.  D Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT.; Registered in England and Wales, registered number 4205228./  I Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire,RD RG1 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 15:08:07 +0100UU From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com>s6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning0 Message-ID: <ac0eg7$f3a$3@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   JF Mezei wrote:E   > Bill Sticker wrote:I > M >>A decision to scrap all of their Alphas because of an upgrade failure showsN$ >>incompetency at the highest level. >> > L > It is possible that the customer already had plans to migrate off VMS, and2 > used probems with 7.3 to accelerate the process. >      No  C The SW product they run is available for Solaris as well as OpenVMST+ but they had decided to stick with OpenVMS.,  ? The OS failures and the costs of moving to GS320's plus the nonx; strategic nature of OpenVMS in the account all contributed.o   RegardsD Andrew Harrisone   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 15:10:20 +01000U From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com>w6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning0 Message-ID: <ac0ekd$f3a$4@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Dave Gudewicz wrote:  N > Good catch Bill.  And *if* the XFC was their problem, then shame on them for) > not turning it off like most here know.  >       XFC was not one of the problems.   Regardsm Andrew Harrisonh     > --	 > Dave...l > + > Adam and Eve had many advantages, but thee/ > principle one was that they escaped teething.  > -----Mark Twain  > 7 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messagee> > news:LQwE8.148960$M7.14504213@bin7.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com... > . >>"Roy Omond" <Roy@Omond.net> wrote in message% >>news:3CE256EB.2A084B2C@Omond.net...n >>+ >>>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:, >>>a >>>2 >>>>Roy Omond wrote: >>>> >>>>- >>>>>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:m >>>>>s >>>>>n >>>>>oF >>>>>>No the upgrade to 7.3 went badly and they lost their environment6 >>>>>>completely for more than an hour more than once. >>>>>>D >>>>>>This has not made them happy bunnies hence the desire to scrap >>>>>>OpenVMS. >>>>>> >>>>>>F >>>>>I can think of only one scenario where this could have pertained,E >>>>>namely gross incompetence, both at the technical level ("upgrade"4 >>>>>to VMS 7.3") and at the (PHB) managerial level. >>>>>eF >>>>>I am a bit suspicious of your claim.  Sounds like you made it up. >>>>>  >>>>>eB >>>>I didn't. The upgrade to 7.3 was done so that it would make it3 >>>>easier to migrate off the GS140's onto GS320's.o >>>>+ >>>>The failures were caused by bugs in 7.3  >>>>; >>>Now I'm convinced you made it up.  I'll call your bluff.p >>>,D >>>I'll bet we don't get to know which customer this is meant to be.@ >>>If it were true (and I'm convinced it's not), then I'd expectB >>>we'd get to hear of this in the meeja.  Why not drop Mike Magee >>>an anonymous hint ? >>>o$ >>>Ha, didn't think you would.  FUD. >>>sJ >>Hmmm.  Didn't I recently see the comment that XFC was by default enabled >> > in > E >>7.3?  If they didn't think to disable it, that might explain a lot.r >> >>- bill >> >> >> >> >> >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 04:36:08 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>> Subject: FTP queue ?, Message-ID: <3CE36F73.9DF3FC56@videotron.ca>  L Listening to communications between the space station and Houston, I find itT "funny" that something as simple as a file transfer requires som much manual effort.  N The crew up there have to put the file in some folder on a laptop and then useJ radio communications to tell ground support to go and fetch the files in aJ specific folder, and of course, they must wait for a long enough window of. communications before initiating the transfer.   Which got me to think:  9 Is it possible to create a queue for FTP file transfers ?nM You'd submit the file transfer request and it would get executed in due time.PM You could control the number of concurrent processes managed by the symbiont, , as part fo the standard queue manager stuff.   something like:e  . SUBMIT/QUEUE=FTP$QUEUE chocolate_mousse.data -[ 	/para=(host=ftp.recipes.com,user=chef,password=squirrel,target="recipes/chocolate mousse")e  N If you submit many, you then benefit from all the goodies of the queue managerK (clustered operation, job priorities so that a more important job submittedE4 after the others would get processed first etc etc).     Anyways just an idea.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:55:35 GMT)L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") Subject: Re: FTP queue ?8 Message-ID: <00A0E026.C31422CC@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  \ In article <3CE36F73.9DF3FC56@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:M >Listening to communications between the space station and Houston, I find it U >"funny" that something as simple as a file transfer requires som much manual effort.- >-O >The crew up there have to put the file in some folder on a laptop and then useCK >radio communications to tell ground support to go and fetch the files in a-K >specific folder, and of course, they must wait for a long enough window ofj/ >communications before initiating the transfer.0 >m >Which got me to think:. > : >Is it possible to create a queue for FTP file transfers ?N >You'd submit the file transfer request and it would get executed in due time.N >You could control the number of concurrent processes managed by the symbiont,- >as part fo the standard queue manager stuff.  >  >something like: >t/ >SUBMIT/QUEUE=FTP$QUEUE chocolate_mousse.data - \ >	/para=(host=ftp.recipes.com,user=chef,password=squirrel,target="recipes/chocolate mousse") >iO >If you submit many, you then benefit from all the goodies of the queue managertL >(clustered operation, job priorities so that a more important job submitted5 >after the others would get processed first etc etc).i >l >  >Anyways just an idea.  I But couldn't you just create an ordinary batch queue and submit jobs likea  . $! COMMAND PROCEDURE TO FTP FROM HITHER TO YON+ $ COPY/FTP HITHER:[...]*.*;* YON.DOMAIN.TLD   0 and have all the queue manager goodies you want?   -- AlanB    O ===============================================================================i0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056 M  Physical mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 69, PO BOX 4349, STANFORD, CA  94309-0210?O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 09:03:50 -0700$ From: issinoho@slayme.com (issinoho)  Subject: HGFTP non-standard port< Message-ID: <d0141774.0205160803.a9a7f2a@posting.google.com>  
 All (Hunter?)s  A How do I run the HGFTP server on a port that is NOT 21, I seem toZF recall you mentioning this was possible but can't find it in the docs.   Cheers.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:38:36 +0400"4 From: "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev@SMTP.DeltaTel.RU> Subject: ICC questionN0 Message-ID: <3CE3700C.5EFA0F60@SMTP.DeltaTel.RU>  
 Hello All!  S 	I wrote test programs ("client" and "server") with ICC-interface, if I ommit (justoJ passing zero) the remote_node parameter in the sys$icc_connect calls I gotU "%SYSTEM-F-NOSUCHOBJ, network object is unknown at remote node", according the docs I  may not use explicite node: # -----------------------------------p remote_node           OpenVMS usage:                    char_string+
      type:-                   character-coded text string.      access:                   read onlyf      mechanism: 8                   by 32-bit or 64-bit descriptor (Alpha)      mechanism:d,                   by 32-bit descriptor (VAX)    U     The name of the node where the target association resides. A null or blank string  can be used toN     indicate the local node. If omitted (by passing zero by value), the simple clusterwide association U     registry is to be used. Each node name is a one-to-six character SCS node name. At comma-delimited5S     list of nodes may be specified, indicating that one is to be chosen at random. c# -----------------------------------t  5 	Is there what I'm need to check on a "server" side ?  	OVMS 7.2-1/Alpha.     	TIA.'     -- i Cheers,rF +OpenVMS [Sys|Net] HardWorker .......................................+E  Russia,Delta Telecom Inc,                    Cel:  +7 (901) 971-3222 E  191119,St.Petersburg,Transportny per. 3                     116-3222-F +http://starlet.deltatel.ru ................. SysMan rides HailStorm +   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 06:37:27 +0000 (UTC)e5 From: "Bill Sticker" <NOSPAMPLEASE@SPAMSTOPPER.CO.UK>71 Subject: Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TLc/ Message-ID: <abvk37$b3j$1@paris.btinternet.com>l  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3CE31D5A.9083F802@fsi.net...  > Bill Sticker wrote:n > >s% > > This is not an "Experts" problem.eE > > I am disgusted at the lack of knowledge that people who are being  chargedl1 > > with control of VMS systems these days, have.n >e > I think that's a bit harsh.   K Sorry, I wasnt having a go at the administrator, rather the company who putd, him there. Please forgive if I upset anyone.   > G > You have the experience you have because of the environments to whichtE > you've been exposed. Likewise others, whose experience differs from  > yours. >mF > In the secular world-at-large, this concept is known as "diversity". >- > -- > David J. DachteraM > dba DJE Systems7 > http://www.djesys.com/ >e* > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 09:32:17 -0400 3 From: John McLachlan <jmclachlan@nospam.draper.com> 1 Subject: Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TL > Message-ID: <jmclachlan-C0C9FB.09321716052002@news.draper.com>  # > This is not an "Experts" problem. K > I am disgusted at the lack of knowledge that people who are being chargedi/ > with control of VMS systems these days, have.0   Should I be offended???   hmmmm   O First problem - VMS is dead.  I loved it, but no one is buying them, no one is eO using them.  This system I'm asking on itself is being replaced with a PC in a 1O years time.   There is no way we're going to hire a proper admin to babysit an s! albatross.  (sorry, that's life).t  P Second problem - VMS was such a good system, it doesn't NEED someone to babysit Q it.  This isn't a UNIX or PC machine that needs a guru aroudn to fis problems.   b  There haven't BEEN any problems.  P This server itself.  I configured it 9 YEARS ago, threw it under the floor, and O it's been a good doobie ever since!  now that's quality.  Just because I can't uC remember commands from 9 years ago, don't burst a blood vessle. :-)o   - Je   --  - <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>    John McLachlan Draper Laboratory  Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 jmclachlan@draper.come" http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 10:28:57 -0400_* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>1 Subject: RE: internet address on a Decserver 90TL - Message-ID: <0033000064211584000002L042*@MHS>   4 =0ATake a Valium or something before you stroke out!  0 I rather think that given the age of the device,4 and the fact that most of them are ex-devices today,# it qualifies as an arcane question.|  + WWWebb, whose cache of aracana grows daily.-   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET1% Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2002 10:12 AM B To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET1 Subject: RE: internet address on a Decserver 90TLd    # > This is not an "Experts" problem.nH > I am disgusted at the lack of knowledge that people who are being cha= rged/ > with control of VMS systems these days, have.p   Should I be offended???   hmmmme  H First problem - VMS is dead.  I loved it, but no one is buying them, no=  one islH using them.  This system I'm asking on itself is being replaced with a = PC in arH years time.   There is no way we're going to hire a proper admin to bab= ysit ano! albatross.  (sorry, that's life).i  H Second problem - VMS was such a good system, it doesn't NEED someone to=  babysitH it.  This isn't a UNIX or PC machine that needs a guru aroudn to fis pr= oblems.d!  There haven't BEEN any problems.e  H This server itself.  I configured it 9 YEARS ago, threw it under the fl= oor, andH it's been a good doobie ever since!  now that's quality.  Just because = I can'tnC remember commands from 9 years ago, don't burst a blood vessle. :-)s   - J=   --- <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>t   John McLachlan Draper Laboratoryo Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 jmclachlan@draper.com # http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc=C   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 10:39:07 -0400o3 From: John McLachlan <jmclachlan@nospam.draper.com>E1 Subject: Re: internet address on a Decserver 90TLe> Message-ID: <jmclachlan-0CE8A3.10390716052002@news.draper.com>  D Well, thanks to the person who e-mailed with the correct solution...  ( - Use DEFINE to change the permanent db. - Init or cycle powerr? - when server comes up, it will read in and init to the new IP.   O I can only assume when set or change tried to change the 'in use' database, it  : didn't want to do such a switch in the middle of being ON.    Q (of course, I now have the problem that it can't seem to find the VAX with LAT - cD mebbie I need to move the VAX to the new subnet at the same time...)  	 - John Mcc  N > I'm running an ancient VAX 4000/VMS5.5 et al system.  We have to change our L > networking, and one of the things needing to change is the IP of the 90TL 	 > server.s > K > Unfortunately, when I do a set/change internet address <new address> the -
 > blasted M > thing comes back and says "server internet address already set".   yah, no - > kidding.     > O > Cant' clear the address, can't reset it, cycling power doesn't make it happy.- > M > Any thoughts on how to actually change this address?  We need to move this f > baby   > onto a different network.w   -- t- <<remove  nospam for correct e-mail replies>>h   John McLachlan Draper Laboratoryt Cambridge, MA 02139-3563 jmclachlan@draper.comb" http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/johnmc   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 10:24:39 -0400 # From: Ben Oifer <tfi@ix.netcom.com> Y Subject: JOB OPENINGS IN MA: **  Senior Architects / Internal Systems *** 100-150K in  BO0, Message-ID: <3CE3C127.8060900@ix.netcom.com>  ? One of my clients, a leading software development company based9B in the Boston area, has the following three senior level openings:  #     Sr. Internal Database Architectg$     Sr. Kernel Development Architect$     Sr. Compiler/Languages Architect  A The company is a leader in developing middleware technology-based ; software and a strong player in the relational DBMS market.5  D They are looking for senior-level individual contributors to developA new software products and enhance and maintains existing softwaref= products; consult on a wide range of issues among all producte@ development departments, not limited to any specific platform or product.  @ The caliber of people that this company employs are from the top= schools in the country having exceptional skills (distributed_A databases, client/server technology, relational databases, etc.).e? Requirements include: BS, MS or PhD; 10+ years experiences withe@ software product development; Relational Database engines/tools,= UNIX or Windows; Experiences working at a System Level ratheriA than Application Level.   Highly technical knowledge of operatinge? systems, compiler and interpreter methods, software engineeringo techniques, would be preferred.a  + U.S. Citizen or Permanent Resident required 9 Very competitive salary package:  100K - 150K+ Base  plus  incentives  plus full benefits.   % The 2 key mandatory requirements are:t?    1.  Systems level experiences (not at the application level)P@    2.  Degreed from one of the top technical universities in the         country.' Local New England candidates preferred.e  / Please EMAIL your resume to:  tfi@ix.netcom.come  > Your resume will remain strictly confidential, and will not be0 disclosed to anyone without your prior approval.                  Ben Oifer$              Technical Futures, Inc.+              354 Turnpike Street, Suite 102>              Canton, MA  02021"              Phone: (781) 821-1600"              Fax:   (781) 821-0099%              Email: tfi@ix.netcom.comn   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 00:25:51 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>M Subject: Re: Most unusual resident in a system ?, was: Re: No new Alpha salese0 Message-ID: <87elgdtm28.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  D clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:  q > In article <9tYD8.89584$GLp1.20086@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes: K > > You forgot the bit about cleaning out the 'dust bunnies' from the power1O > > supplies, and if in Australia, the odd python that finds large server boxese# > > nice warm places to curl up in.r   ! > A python ? Is this verifiable ?   sI > So what is the most unusual resident or object ever found in a system ?o  K I've had a Dugite going over my foot in one. Dugite are DEFINATLY venimous,oK but not nasty. Only bite if you upset them. I also had a Blue Tongue Skink mK in my computer room at home. Stupid thing got in, then hid when ever anyonedF went in. After several months, it had starved itself past recovery. :(     -- -< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda..@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:00:11 GMT>. From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)2 Subject: Re: Network device for wide area clusters3 Message-ID: <v3OE8.44670$1q3.482505@news.chello.at>>  _ In article <200205140630.IAA03528@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>, Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de> writes:>B >>The Cabletron SmartSwitchRouter (now called Enterasys Xpedition)F >>was originally designed by a small company named YAGO and was boughtI >>(with the company) by Cabletron some months before Cabletron bought the>I >>Digital Network Product Group. Unlike DNPG, YAGO was very fast absorbed M >>within Cabletron. YAGO did AFAIK not cooperate with DEC, neither did CTRON.> >iD >Sorry too. Digital/Compaq did sold the same box with an other labelE >(GigaSwitch) and a modified firmware. Also did Compaq sold Cabletron F >network products for a few month before they changed there mind. This, >was before Cabletron splitts and sold DNPG.  E Yup. Digital did sign a contract when selling the DNPG to CTRON, thatiF they will use CTRONs products and sell them (as OEM products). But theF development was in the hand of CTRON. (I never heard that DEC did makeD their own firmware version for the Gigaswitch _after_ they sold it -A means the GigaSwitch/FDDI and the GigaSwitch/ATM - to CABLETRON). J And DEQ did sell an OEM version of the SSR named GigaSwitch/Ethernet (sp?)  I Some months after COMPAQ did buy DEC, this contract was worthless becauseoJ Q (had already bought a network company before - MICROCOM - and) no longerH wanted to sell/use CTRON/DNPG products (Might be the switch to Capellas)  I Pfeiffer' Q wanted to get an enterprise company and bought company/piecesaG to get there while DEC before wanted to get into oblivion. Capellas's QaJ wanted then also to get into oblivion (aka 'core competences') and did it.  D Btw: The DNPG.COM do now also sell Enterasys's products. See the newI DNswitch 224s, which are CABLETRON/ENTERASYS SmartStack/Vertical Horizon.     E And regarding the CLUEXIT with a SSR reboot: a SSR firmware update isnI even worse. You have to upgrade one CPU, failover to the 2nd (which isn'tiH supported and leads to a crash of both CPUs !!) then upgrade the 2nd CPUJ and then reboot again. So, this is AT LEAST 3 times the 3-5min. And that'sJ a hot-standby high-avaibility core-routing-switch. Surprise, surprise, ...   -- s Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERi% Network and OpenVMS system specialiste E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atP A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMS Job(s)   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 00:33:00 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Re: No new Alpha sales-0 Message-ID: <87adr1tlqb.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  ) "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> writes:A  E > For those doubting "show-me" readers, if no new Alpha business wereDE > to be allowed, how does one explain the following new VMS Customer:97 > http://www.mgex.com/news/news_releases/release28.htmln  >@ > Or do you think Customers with these types of mission criticalE > environments did not receive the assurances from the powers on highn' > that they had nothing to worry about?-  D 15th Feb is a bit before hp got the keys to the door Kerry. It was a done deal well before.  F Not thaat the 'no new' is ALPHA sales, not any OS. Unix fans can stickB their head up HPUX, but VMS customers can *only* use Alphas at the! monent, so that means no new VMS.   C If that is not what hp means, then a clear, unequivical statment toe clear the air is needed RSN.  H BTW, IMO, hp saying in effect 'opps, sorry we slipped there, here is the) fix...' would be a *very* positive thing,f   -- r< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.I@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:15:05 +0100 (MET)a9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>e Subject: Re: No new Alpha sales ; Message-ID: <01KHSP03KTHU99DNNX@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>   F > The problem is that HP stated very clearly that new sales were to go > PA-RISC and not Alpha. F   For unix, yes.   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:23:35 +0100 (MET)B9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>= Subject: Re: No new Alpha sales ; Message-ID: <01KHSP27LRC899DNNX@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>e  H > Not thaat the 'no new' is ALPHA sales, not any OS. Unix fans can stickD > their head up HPUX, but VMS customers can *only* use Alphas at the# > monent, so that means no new VMS.=  F Total bullshit.  Total, complete bullshit.  Sorry to be so harsh, and E please don't take it personally, but there is a real danger that some)B VMS novice might read statements like that here and get confused.   C Of course you can buy a new ALPHA from HP, running whatever OS theyPH support on it.  Sure, they will target new unix sales as PA-RISC and notI ALPHA, but this doesn't affect VMS.  Ring them up and ask them.  OK, the -H sales folks might be clueless, but during the last 10 years it was also H not straightforward to buy an ALPHA running VMS---but that doesn't mean  it couldn't be done.  C Let's face it.  The wording was confusing.  Some of the wording is vB obviously wrong, like listing VMS under unix.  If there is a high F probability that the wording is mixed up, there is no point in taking F something as gospel, especially in this case where it is pretty clear G that the "new customers won't get alpha" means a) unix and b) even new d2 customers can get alpha (unix or VMS if they ask).  E Some confusing wording was actually changed, which I think is a good   thing.  H As far as targetting VMS to new customers, well, probably not, but this 3 is the same things have been for the last 10 years.   F I'm not saying the situation couldn't be better, I'm just saying that I there is no point in making it out to be worse than it is.  Is there any  F evidence that the situation with VMS is WORSE than with Compaq?  No.  E Actually, it is better since all Compaq roadmaps were subject to the  E "might change in the merger" disclaimer.  This is no longer the case.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 14:43:29 +0100oU From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com>r Subject: Re: No new Alpha sales 0 Message-ID: <ac0d21$esf$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Paul Repacholi wrote:.  + > "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> writes:o >  > E >>For those doubting "show-me" readers, if no new Alpha business werepE >>to be allowed, how does one explain the following new VMS Customer: 7 >>http://www.mgex.com/news/news_releases/release28.html- >> >  - > @ >>Or do you think Customers with these types of mission criticalE >>environments did not receive the assurances from the powers on highs' >>that they had nothing to worry about?3 >> > F > 15th Feb is a bit before hp got the keys to the door Kerry. It was a > done deal well before. > H > Not thaat the 'no new' is ALPHA sales, not any OS. Unix fans can stickD > their head up HPUX, but VMS customers can *only* use Alphas at the# > monent, so that means no new VMS.h > E > If that is not what hp means, then a clear, unequivical statment toh > clear the air is needed RSN. > J > BTW, IMO, hp saying in effect 'opps, sorry we slipped there, here is the+ > fix...' would be a *very* positive thing,e >  >     2 I have the latest market share numbers for the UK.  9 I know that it isn't the whole world but Compaqs share of : the RISC server market is now lower than at any time since7 1999, it is also half what it was before the HP, Compaq 
 announcments.7  ? HP's current market share is slightly above its average for thee9 period since 1999 but lower than its peak for the period.-  9 It would appear that the effect is allready being felt atr least in the UK.     Regardsn   Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------   Date: 16 MAY 2002 12:33:00 GMT4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher) Subject: Re: No new Alpha sales 6 Message-ID: <16MAY02.12330074@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>    In a previous article, JF wrote:  D ->... How many new customers will fight against HP to gain the rightK ->to buy a new alpha ? It was bad enough during Compaq era to get VMS sales . ->stuff, imagine what it will be like with HP.  B You don't have to deal with Compaq/HP. Go to a reseller like Avnet? Computer who will sell you whatever you want and actually knowssD something about the VMS product (at least the Avnet reps I deal with do).   --G -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madison 9 --                      karcher.nospam@waisman.wisc.edu  o   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 00:05:20 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>. Subject: Re: Non-interactive TECO? (of course)0 Message-ID: <87it5ptn0f.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  , Ingemar Olson <IOLSON@dairyland.com> writes:   > If a have a file containing: > $ set ver  > $ teco = "$teco32 teco"r% > $ define/user sys$command sys$inputc& > $ teco ODSR4510_FINV_16_19_56_58.PRTE > EX<esc><esc>    and those 2 <esc>'s really ARE the escape character2 > $8
 > $ set noverm  I
 > Then I get B	 > $ @testp > $ teco = "$teco32 teco"e% > $ define/user sys$command sys$input-& > $ teco ODSR4510_FINV_16_19_56_58.PRT) > %SYSTEM-F-BADPARAM, bad parameter valuesD > %DCL-W-SKPDAT, image data (records not beginning with "$") ignored
 > $ set novert  @ The <esc> terminates the line, not the TECO command. This leaves> and empty line (with an esc terminator) that causes the SKPDAT error.   --   ~prepn< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.-@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:35:24 GMTu From: fred818@ameritech.net  Subject: Re: OpenVMS SNMP TRAP) Message-ID: <3CE3C3A4.12D1A399@yahoo.com>   F I'm not sure what you meant by Stack, I know we are using COMPAQ TCPIP v5.0a - ECO 3 ..   Thanks,e Fred   "David J. Dachtera" wrote:   > Fabio Cardoso wrote: > >t > > Trya > >.! > > http://www.comtekservices.comp > >m) > > They have SNMP Agents for OpenVMS !!!E >s > Great stuff, Fabio! Thanx! >s > -- > David J. Dachteraa > dba DJE Systemsd > http://www.djesys.com/ >e* > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 09:42:43 +0100w4 From: "Chris Sharman" <chris.sharman@ccagroup.co.uk>. Subject: Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support?A Message-ID: <1021538601.2838.1.nnrp-10.9e989e7e@news.demon.co.uk>e  ? "Bob Harris" <harris@zk3.dec.com> wrote in message news:harris-3J > Side note:  In my opinion, I think it is amazing that the software stillJ > runs after 7 years without maintenance, through Y2K, and through several > major releases of OpenVMS.   I'll second that - thanks.D Although I've never quite understood "unsupported" wrt pw/mac: as inF "Pathworks for Macintosh is unsupported, upgrade to DCPS" which is/wasH supported, and uses Pathworks for Macintosh to access Appletalk printers !!??!   L We still have a major client/server system using Appletalk: we fixed the VMSI server to alternatively use tcp/ip some years ago now, but the Mac clienteK hasn't yet been upgraded. Still running happily on VMS 7.3. Just shows whato, you can do with production quality software.   Chris    ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 08:07:27 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) . Subject: Re: Pathworks Macintosh >2GB support?0 Message-ID: <abvpbv$eis$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  e In article <harris-9F1CA3.17595715052002@juggl7.zk3.dec.com>, Bob Harris <harris@zk3.dec.com> writes:e9 >In article <imuoduc4gpb5m76ofibdnh2604v1kdo28d@4ax.com>, 2 > Clay M. Denton <denton@orison.dsserv.com> wrote: >yO >X Back when Pathworks Macintosh was a current product, Mac volumes/files were p >X limited to 2GBtM >X in size.  Pathworks Mac server on VMS reported no more than 2GB free on a o >X volume back toyQ >X the Mac - even if the VMS drive had more available space to as not to confuse e >X the
 >X Macintosh.  >X rK >X Mac OS 8 and newer support larger drives and files.  Does anyone have a s >X hack/patch forcO >X Pathworks Mac server on VMS to allow it to report actual free space instead m
 >X of 2GB? >X i
 >X Thanks, >X Clayc >JG >I can not think of anyway to hack that (unless someone is thinking of i >patching the executable :-) >0C >The probem is that the AFP protocol used by PATHWORKS for OpenVMS n> >(Macintosh) was at the time limited to a signed 32 bit value.  O This is still the case. As long as we are talking about classic AppleTalk therepL is the 2 GB limit. OS9 supports AppleTalk over TCP/IP where there is no such8 restriction. But this is something completely different.   Regards,    Christoph GartmannD  H -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, Germany                                           |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  / Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 08:26:33 +0200 (MET DST)1& From: Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de>9 Subject: Re: Problem with the internal clock of an XP1000o6 Message-ID: <200205160626.IAA03720@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>   Hello,   Fred Kleinsorge wrotes:c   >>>kL What graphics are you using?  There is a problem in the ELSA server that wasK fixed recently that fixes a time loss problem.  It seems that there is someiJ bug in the hardware where a memory barrier in a spin loop reading the fifoI counter was putting the PCI into a disconnect/retry sequence, and causing  timer interrupts to be lost. <<<o  G Thank's for your answer. Yes, there is an ELSA graphicadpater there. IsuD there any patch out, to solve this kwon problem? Or will the problem5 gone away with a newer OpenVMS version (e.g. V7.3AXP).   TIA and regards Rudolf Wingert   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:51:33 GMTi5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>T9 Subject: Re: Problem with the internal clock of an XP1000u9 Message-ID: <pXNE8.19$4k3.100447@cacnews.cac.cpqcorp.net>e  L I'm not sure when it was checked in (the fix was done a while ago by someoneH else), and if it is in a recent patch kit.  I know it is fixed in V7.3-1 (comming soon).a  L Send me a mail message, and I'll follow it up when the engineer gets in this5 morning, and we'll make sure you get the fixed image.g  L FWIW, if you are using a EV6 based system, I'd take up Islands offer to swapE a VX1 card for the ELSA - it's faster and can even generate nice highlL resolutions very cleanly - I run it at 1600x1280 on my system, but it can goL higher if you have a really good monitor.  The V7.3-1 version will run it inC DMA mode instead of PIO, which should also reduce the CPU overhead.e   _Fredi   Rudolf Wingert wrote in message - <200205160626.IAA03720@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>...a >Hello,m >  >Fred Kleinsorge wrotes: >e >>>>I >What graphics are you using?  There is a problem in the ELSA server that  wasAL >fixed recently that fixes a time loss problem.  It seems that there is someK >bug in the hardware where a memory barrier in a spin loop reading the fifoeJ >counter was putting the PCI into a disconnect/retry sequence, and causing >timer interrupts to be lost.c ><<< > H >Thank's for your answer. Yes, there is an ELSA graphicadpater there. IsE >there any patch out, to solve this kwon problem? Or will the problemW6 >gone away with a newer OpenVMS version (e.g. V7.3AXP) >  >TIA and regards Rudolf Wingert  >    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 09:03:13 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)r Subject: Re: Proxy questione3 Message-ID: <pO8x2lYjWX87@eisner.encompasserve.org>a  Z In article <3CE3241B.8090801@qsl.network>, "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> writes: > Tom Adams wrote: >> .H >> All nodes? How to I get a list of all nodes that can access the node? > J > You will need to ask your network administrator.  All Decnet nodes that / > have a route to your node can attempt access.p > F > Your system security settings determine which ones can actually get F > access.  There are many controls that can be used to control access $ > depending on a sites requirements. > J > There is no requirement that a node be registered in the local database  > in order to gain access.  B But for better security you should add such a requirement with the command:  , 	MCR NCP DEFINE EXECUTOR DEFAULT ACCESS NONE  9 and then for each node to which you want to grant access:u  + 	MCR NCP DEFINE NODE <whatever> ACCESS BOTH   : Those will take effect on the next reboot, you can make it happen now with:   	MCR NCP SET KNOWN NODES ALL   or something close.n  D DECnet does not prevent masquerading as other node, but it does giveB errors (to the attacker) if they try to masequerade as a node thatC is actually up at the time.  You are better off if you can restrictRG access to nodes that are most likely to be up -- such as major machines ' rather than every node in your network.h   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:00:51 GMTa# From: "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com>( Subject: scsi clusterC> Message-ID: <DjME8.323340$nc.47359116@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>  F Trying to create a scsi cluster without documentation. (thru trial and error).C Openvms 7.2-1.  D I have a DS10 with one scsi controller and an AS2100 with three scsiA controllers. They both have ethernet, so that will be the clustereH interconnect, but I want to connect to the DS10 to the HSZ70 that is nowF connected only to the 2100.  The HSZ70 is connected to the second scsiK controller on the 2100, therefore the 2100 sees all the disks on the HSZ asc $1$dkB*   L But if I connect the only scsi adapter in the DS10 into the HSZ, it sees the disks as $1$dkA*J This won't work;  will it?  I would rather not re-configure the 2100, so tL looks like I need to put a second scsi controller in the DS10 and connect to. the HSZ that way.  Is this a valid conclusion?   Thanks.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 07:20:16 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger) Subject: Re: scsi cluster K Message-ID: <rdeininger-1605020720170001@1cust216.tnt1.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>   H In article <DjME8.323340$nc.47359116@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>, "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote:  G >Trying to create a scsi cluster without documentation. (thru trial ands >error). >Openvms 7.2-1.w  B Have you looked at the "Guidelines for Cluster Configurations" and# "OpenVMS Clustering Guide" manuals?n  E >I have a DS10 with one scsi controller and an AS2100 with three scsi B >controllers. They both have ethernet, so that will be the clusterI >interconnect, but I want to connect to the DS10 to the HSZ70 that is nowoG >connected only to the 2100.  The HSZ70 is connected to the second scsiaL >controller on the 2100, therefore the 2100 sees all the disks on the HSZ as >$1$dkB*  I You didn't mention the models of the controllers.  For multihost SCSI, it  matters.  M >But if I connect the only scsi adapter in the DS10 into the HSZ, it sees then >disks as $1$dkA*IK >This won't work;  will it?  I would rather not re-configure the 2100, so toM >looks like I need to put a second scsi controller in the DS10 and connect to / >the HSZ that way.  Is this a valid conclusion?   I It sounds like you need to use port allocation classes.  I haven't set upW9 such a config myself, but it is explained in the manuals.  >e >Thanks.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:42:32 +0200-9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>0 Subject: Re: scsi clustere' Message-ID: <3CE39B28.DA2E54BA@aaa.com>e   Robert Deininger wrote:  > J > In article <DjME8.323340$nc.47359116@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com>, "John N." > <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote: > I > >Trying to create a scsi cluster without documentation. (thru trial and 
 > >error). > >Openvms 7.2-1.- > D > Have you looked at the "Guidelines for Cluster Configurations" and% > "OpenVMS Clustering Guide" manuals?j >   F And those are on the internet on "http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/"C in both HTML and (yes!) PDF versions. So there is realy *no* excuseU *not*s to read the manuals !d   Jan-Erik Sderholm.m   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 15:02:48 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>s% Subject: Re: System manager availableeF Message-ID: <sSPE8.8654$ah_.3084@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  8 At least being a garbage man is an honorable profession.  J It fulfills a civic need, whereas being a Windows man is a pox on society.    < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3CE317C5.6F3EB134@fsi.net...V > "Mark E. Levy" wrote:  > > @ > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message% > > news:3CE1D332.9592C5D2@fsi.net...  > > > Bill Sticker wrote:- > > > >t5 > > > > I'd switch to anything if I could find a job.  > > >dF > > > I've often said that I wished I'd gotten that job on the garbage > > > truck... > >IF > > But David, is that really any different from working with Windows? Either, > > way, you're slinging garbage all day.... >i= > Yeah - the garbage man smells better at the end of the day!  >  > -- > David J. Dachtera  > dba DJE Systemsr > http://www.djesys.com/ >i* > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 08:25:56 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)e# Subject: Re: TCP/IP for VMS...HELP! 3 Message-ID: <yHxejTcTCBBL@eisner.encompasserve.org>i  i In article <3ce2730f$0$19587$4c41069e@reader1.ash.ops.us.uu.net>, "J. Tang" <jaltang@hotmail.com> writes:tJ > I apologize for the terminalogy used in my post.  I love the VMS system.: > This was not my idea, I am merely stuck implementing it. >   3    Do you know the one about "get three envelopes"?-   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 09:31:20 +0100m From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net>cH Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?) Message-ID: <3CE36E57.FAFD196D@Omond.net>n   Paul Sture wrote:l   > [... snip ...] > K > Better yet, this potential client of Andrew's obviously has the immediatewF > problem of making sure that his VMS systems remain stable meanwhile. > O > Andrew, if you really want to do your potential client a favour, get in touchsM > with one of the UK members of this newsgroup to offer the client some solid 1 > quality consultancy. He/she obviously needs it.e >sQ > Go for your sale by all means, but if you don't give us a chance to address the 8 > situation, then you don't deserve that client's trust. > ! > Bluff called. Your turn Andrew.   1 Andrew, I'm currently available.  Over to you :-)O  B And yes indeed, if it turned out to have been XFC then that proves" the gross incompetence accusation.  	 Roy Omondo Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 10:21:19 +0000a  From: Steve.Spires@yellgroup.comH Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?: Message-ID: <OF08416F4F.C6DC4A1D-ON00256BBB.00388F7C@btyp>  I I don't know what the truth of this is, but why would an organisation whooB don't have OpenVMS in their future plans invest the time and moneyJ upgrading the OS and buying in some larger machines, only to be moving offJ the platform? With apparent 'stupidity' like that, any wonder they screwedJ the upgrade? And why have they upgraded their nodes without testing first?B And if your staff screw up, why do you then ditch the hardware and	 software?    Glad I don't work there...   Cheers   Steve S-        = p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) on 05/16/2002 05:52:14 AMi    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc::F From:      p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture), 16 May 2002, 5:52 a.m.  ; VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?c    K In article <3CE256EB.2A084B2C@Omond.net>, Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> writes:a* > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >> >> Roy Omond wrote:t >>- >> > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:t >> > >> >E >> >>No the upgrade to 7.3 went badly and they lost their environmenta5 >> >>completely for more than an hour more than once.  >> >>sC >> >>This has not made them happy bunnies hence the desire to scrapm
 >> >>OpenVMS., >> >>n >> >F >> > I can think of only one scenario where this could have pertained,E >> > namely gross incompetence, both at the technical level ("upgrade04 >> > to VMS 7.3") and at the (PHB) managerial level. >> >F >> > I am a bit suspicious of your claim.  Sounds like you made it up. >> > >>A >> I didn't. The upgrade to 7.3 was done so that it would make it 2 >> easier to migrate off the GS140's onto GS320's. >>* >> The failures were caused by bugs in 7.3 > : > Now I'm convinced you made it up.  I'll call your bluff. > C > I'll bet we don't get to know which customer this is meant to be. ? > If it were true (and I'm convinced it's not), then I'd expecteA > we'd get to hear of this in the meeja.  Why not drop Mike MageeT > an anonymous hint ?  > # > Ha, didn't think you would.  FUD.a >d  I Better yet, this potential client of Andrew's obviously has the immediatemD problem of making sure that his VMS systems remain stable meanwhile.  G Andrew, if you really want to do your potential client a favour, get inR touchiK with one of the UK members of this newsgroup to offer the client some solid / quality consultancy. He/she obviously needs it.   K Go for your sale by all means, but if you don't give us a chance to addressh thea6 situation, then you don't deserve that client's trust.   Bluff called. Your turn Andrew.-   __
 Paul Sture Switzerland,          F ______________________________________________________________________     [Information] -- PostMaster:D This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beG confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message hashG been addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce,w$ distribute or use this transmission.  H Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee isG not intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have receivedeK this transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.o  
 Thank you.  D Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT.; Registered in England and Wales, registered number 4205228.P  I Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire,9D RG1 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 15:28:10 +0100a From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net>rH Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?) Message-ID: <3CE3C1FB.A8E93B3C@Omond.net>a  ( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:  # > Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com wrote:r >fM > > I don't know what the truth of this is, but why would an organisation who F > > don't have OpenVMS in their future plans invest the time and moneyN > > upgrading the OS and buying in some larger machines, only to be moving offN > > the platform? With apparent 'stupidity' like that, any wonder they screwedN > > the upgrade? And why have they upgraded their nodes without testing first?F > > And if your staff screw up, why do you then ditch the hardware and
 > > software?y > >  >0C > The plan to upgrade to 7.3 was put in place because Compaq wantedc= > to upgrade the GS320's to GS140's. Blaming the customer foriA > initiating an upgrade in this circumstance seems to be pointing0! > the finger at the wrong person.< >rD > The problems that they ran into were not with the process of doingB > the upgrade but with bugs that they found once they had done it. > B > Sure people should test their systems but in this case they were? > doing tests for their vendor. Again finger pointing mostly ine > the wrong direction.  $ OK, I'll bite (I can smell the rat).  F You'd not be breaking any confidentiality if you'd reveal to all of us what these "bugs" were.M  C I simply do not believe you, and I'm not sure I'd believe that even.A a bank could display such gross incompetence and sheer stupidity.   @ C'mon Andrew, spill some more beans, or else admit that you made this cock-and-bull story up.   > > Glad I don't work there... > >t > @ > Probably a good call on your part, unless you have UNIX skills0 > because they are trying to get rid of OpenVMS.  ; Glad I don't work there too, and I have plenty UNIX skills.   	 Roy Omond  Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 14:54:31 +0100sU From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com>.H Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?0 Message-ID: <ac0dmn$f3a$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>  ! Steve.Spires@yellgroup.com wrote:a  K > I don't know what the truth of this is, but why would an organisation whooD > don't have OpenVMS in their future plans invest the time and moneyL > upgrading the OS and buying in some larger machines, only to be moving offL > the platform? With apparent 'stupidity' like that, any wonder they screwedL > the upgrade? And why have they upgraded their nodes without testing first?D > And if your staff screw up, why do you then ditch the hardware and > software?n >     A The plan to upgrade to 7.3 was put in place because Compaq wantedX; to upgrade the GS320's to GS140's. Blaming the customer for>? initiating an upgrade in this circumstance seems to be pointing  the finger at the wrong person.   B The problems that they ran into were not with the process of doing@ the upgrade but with bugs that they found once they had done it.  @ Sure people should test their systems but in this case they were= doing tests for their vendor. Again finger pointing mostly inr the wrong direction.   Regards  Andrew     > Glad I don't work there... >     > Probably a good call on your part, unless you have UNIX skills. because they are trying to get rid of OpenVMS.   Regardsn Andrew Harrison      > Cheers > 	 > Steve Se >  >  >  > ? > p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) on 05/16/2002 05:52:14 AMm > " > To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > cc:mH > From:      p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture), 16 May 2002, 5:52 a.m. > = > VMS 7.3 upgrade problems - a bad workman blaming his tools?e >  > M > In article <3CE256EB.2A084B2C@Omond.net>, Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> writes:r > * >>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >> >> >>>Roy Omond wrote:  >>>m >>>e, >>>>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>E >>>>>No the upgrade to 7.3 went badly and they lost their environmentg5 >>>>>completely for more than an hour more than once.  >>>>>aC >>>>>This has not made them happy bunnies hence the desire to scrapu
 >>>>>OpenVMS.n >>>>>r >>>>>tE >>>>I can think of only one scenario where this could have pertained,dD >>>>namely gross incompetence, both at the technical level ("upgrade3 >>>>to VMS 7.3") and at the (PHB) managerial level.i >>>>E >>>>I am a bit suspicious of your claim.  Sounds like you made it up.d >>>> >>>>A >>>I didn't. The upgrade to 7.3 was done so that it would make itu2 >>>easier to migrate off the GS140's onto GS320's. >>>A* >>>The failures were caused by bugs in 7.3 >>> : >>Now I'm convinced you made it up.  I'll call your bluff. >>C >>I'll bet we don't get to know which customer this is meant to be.P? >>If it were true (and I'm convinced it's not), then I'd expecttA >>we'd get to hear of this in the meeja.  Why not drop Mike Mageen >>an anonymous hint ?e >># >>Ha, didn't think you would.  FUD.i >> >> > K > Better yet, this potential client of Andrew's obviously has the immediateXF > problem of making sure that his VMS systems remain stable meanwhile. > I > Andrew, if you really want to do your potential client a favour, get inK > touchrM > with one of the UK members of this newsgroup to offer the client some solido1 > quality consultancy. He/she obviously needs it." > M > Go for your sale by all means, but if you don't give us a chance to addressd > the 8 > situation, then you don't deserve that client's trust. > ! > Bluff called. Your turn Andrew.d >  > __ > Paul Sture
 > Switzerland  >  >  >  >  > H > ______________________________________________________________________ >  >  > [Information] -- PostMaster:F > This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) and may beI > confidential. If you are not the named addressee, or if the message hasgI > been addressed to you in error, you must not read, disclose, reproduce,r& > distribute or use this transmission. > J > Delivery of this message to any person other than the named addressee isI > not intended in any way to waive confidentiality.  If you have receivedEM > this transmission in error please contact the sender or delete the message.m >  > Thank you. > F > Yell Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, RG1 7PT.= > Registered in England and Wales, registered number 4205228.o > K > Yellow Pages Sales Limited, Queens Walk, Oxford Road, Reading, Berkshire, F > RG1 7PT. Registered in England and Wales, registered number 1403041. >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 10:15:39 +0200t? From: "Bo Hermanson" <informentor.hermanson@mailbox.swipnet.se>29 Subject: Re: What is good model for disk i/o w/shadowing?c6 Message-ID: <80KE8.4788$iB4.13658@nntpserver.swip.net>   Hi Lawrence,  7 "Lawrence Bleau" <bleau@umtof.umd.edu> wrote in messaget* news:abuuib$sgv$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu... >.; > Normally these are good issues to raise, just not with my : > boss.  On your fist question, his answer would be half a< > day, just grab a spare disk, replace the failing disk with5 > the spare, reload backups from the previous night's11 > backup, and you're up and running (*his* way oft3 > thinking, not mine!).  He doesn't see serving webi > pages as that critical.  > H Well, half a day recovery seems to be, more or less, the most optimistic' calculation. What about the worst case?i< My experience says that it's then the disk is going to fail. Can't say it's the LAW but ;)i   >r: > As to the second question, there *is* no "business cost" > as we're not a business.  D There are usually business cost even if it's not measuered in directI dollars. You are doing something valuable, aren't you? . Peoples time ands+ failed experiments/measurements have costs,75 however they can be difficult to estimate or measure.c   >The closest thing we have to an7 > product is a web page that we update every half hour. 9 > No one pays us to view it, no sales are generated, etc.t, > We have folks that use the web page and do. > occaisionally complain, but that's about it.6 > If it's down for a day or less, he's okay with that;# > more than a day and he's unhappy.r9 > In short, your well intended rhetorical questions don'tt2 > help me, and they would utterly fail to convince > the powers that be.c  L Measure his "unhappy" factor and what the convinance is worth for him. A day/ or two waiting for recovery isn't unreasonable.eE I'm not the one to value these things for you, but usually these soft$; factors aren't in the calculation sheet until they happend.rL The disk/license cost is may or may not be worth the money. However, I think( it's marginal with university discounts.   I wish You good luck   Regardsl Bo   >w > Lawrence Bleau > University of Maryland$ > Physics Dept., Space Physics Group > 301-405-6223 > bleau@umtof.umd.edut   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 14:32:24 GMT3 From: bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu (Bob DeBula)t' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! : Message-ID: <ac0fto$fk5$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  F Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> carefully crafted electrons to say: > 0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageD > news:M_uE8.19960$t8_.18714@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... > >gK > > Wrong. These were exactly the things that CAUSED the 'fall from grace'.m > ThenM > > crap Sun was selling at the time couldn't hold a technical candle to whatoM > > DEC could and was delivering technically. But Sun ate DEC's lunch becauseyM > > they did ALL the things that constitute marketing well - and in my books,rN > > marketing starts with the CEO and the Board of Directors and permeates the > > whole organization > L > I'm beginning to suspect that you don't have a clue what I've been talking& > about, so I'll give it another shot.  D I think you guys may be missing another important shift somewhere inF all of this "evolution". Early on, IT departments tended to be centralF and controlled by techies who essentially moved on up into management.4 As a trend, that started to change as IT became moreD important/essential to the bottom line (and a peculiar devolutionaryB trend it is too, IMO) of most companies and institutions.  TechiesB started to get dropped out of management and the era of the PHB ITJ sauropods began. Now-a-days it can be rather rare to find a true techie inG IT management a lot of places.  There's even a bit (or even more than aeL bit some places) of anti-techie sentiment amongst the conifer-browsing PHBs.C Back then, DEC could sell to technical managers on technical merit.eC Now, Diablo Bill has the complacently browsing herd of ponderous ITrI PHBs collective earholes and "technical merit" isn't consideration number.F one (or two or three, or even among the top ten it seems at times) anyB more. Techies have been falling more and more under the heading of; "necessary evil" for a lot of modern PHBs, it seems from myt= perspective. (And I haven't seen a DEC/Compaq salesdroid come- calling in over a decade here).6      J ==========================================================================9               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U'si  ?         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright >   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 14:43:24 GMT3 From: bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu (Bob DeBula) ' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!m: Message-ID: <ac0gic$fnn$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  ? John Smith <a@nonymous.com> carefully crafted electrons to say:a: > HP, we really have to talk about promoting OpenVMS more. >  >  > Ad #13= > "We all know how much governments love to count money 24/7.D > N > Chances are that every time a lottery ticket is sold, there is a server fromK > HP running OpenVMS managing the transactions and keeping track of all ther > winning numbers reliably.  > F > OpenVMS. The operating system of xx% of the world's lottery systems.  G "So, if you're into taking a gamble with your business and your career,sC gamble on OpenVMS and feel the wind rushing beneath your kilt"? :-)a      J ==========================================================================9               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U'so  ?         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright     ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 15:03:21 GMT3 From: bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu (Bob DeBula)t' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!t: Message-ID: <ac0hnp$ftl$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  t Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy  <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> carefully crafted electrons to say: > 9 > You run software on your OpenVMS boxes, without SW they4- > are about as usefull as a chocolate teapot.   F Okay, one too many "chocolate teapot" analogies out of you Andrew. ForA the next ten posts, use, hmmmmm, "compressed jelly baby submarinedE hatches" or "a moggie with a tin opener in a cargo bay full of tinnedhH tuna" or "Milkbone skivvies at CorgyFest" or "truffle sniffing flounder"@ or "courier mollusk" or something for a while and give the Lindt teapots a rest. :-)       J ==========================================================================9               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U's.  ?         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright -   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:36:06 -0400M* From: WILLIAM WEBB <WWEBB1@email.usps.gov>' Subject: RE: Who cares about marketing! - Message-ID: <0033000064222645000002L052*@MHS>   + =0AIncessant repetition of short phrases iso) one indicator that the communicator mightd, have a bit of trouble passing a Turing test.  ; ('least 'e's not going round saying 'SPAM' all the time...)l   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----/ From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET % Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2002 11:04 AMaB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET' Subject: RE: Who cares about marketing!h    H Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy  <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@=	 sun#.com>e% carefully crafted electrons to say: >t9 > You run software on your OpenVMS boxes, without SW theys- > are about as usefull as a chocolate teapot.>  F Okay, one too many "chocolate teapot" analogies out of you Andrew. ForA the next ten posts, use, hmmmmm, "compressed jelly baby submarineiE hatches" or "a moggie with a tin opener in a cargo bay full of tinnedpH tuna" or "Milkbone skivvies at CorgyFest" or "truffle sniffing flounder= "t@ or "courier mollusk" or something for a while and give the Lindt teapots a rest. :-)       I =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=sI =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=pI =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=  =3D=3D9               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U'su  ?         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright=    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 15:32:19 GMTi# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>u' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! F Message-ID: <7iQE8.8669$ah_.3356@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   'Gales' of laughter. :-)  G But seriously, it's the gamble on one's career that's the problem theseeF days. Without serious marketing effort from HP to truly convince upperJ management that VMS is here to stay and will be heavily promoted, there isL no reason for anyone lower down in the organization to champion it no matter< how technically superior it may be, no matter how robust and  best-you-business-capable it is.  K People gotta eat, pay the mortgage, and send the kids to university. And insH fewer cases these days, sticking with VMS won't do that for you. Too fewK sites, too few VMS jobs, too much risk in looking like an old dinosaur thatrJ isn't with the latest technology, facts notwithstanding. It's difficult to8 get around the prejudices people come to the table with.    H Just an example I know of (a bit O.T.) - a guy I know saw a job ad for aG VP-level position and sent his resume in. Eminently qualified, loads ofPL experience, a great fit. The HR department was the place the resume was sentJ to - they looked at it and didn't see some of the buzzwords they were toldL to look for, so they sent him a rejection letter. He got curious, called HR,G and was told that the business unit head never saw his resume...that HRiK reviewed it and found it not the right fit and rejected him as a candidate.   J He did some digging and found out who the real power was behind the hiringF decision in the business unit itself and called the guy, got himself aJ face-to-face meeting, and got himself hired, much to the chagrin of the HR department.t  E If it is the 'suits' that are doing the buying these days and not thehI technologists, then this is where HP has to come it to the boardrooms and J convince potential customers that they are serious about VMS. If it is theI technologists that are doing the buying, then HP has to still go into theoK boardroom to backup the technologists' decisions and careers. Until HP does  this, VMS is dead.       That aside, I saw an articleL http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nyt/20020512/tc_nyt/for_old_p$ arts__nasa_boldly_goes_______on_ebay  J that's worth reading. Sort of analogous to what will happen in a few years with Alpha.       @ "Bob DeBula" <bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message4 news:ac0gic$fnn$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu... >nI > "So, if you're into taking a gamble with your business and your career,nE > gamble on OpenVMS and feel the wind rushing beneath your kilt"? :-)e >M >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:04:49 -0500k1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>u' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! 1 Message-ID: <ac0lg4$g3j$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>u  , Sauropods....conifer-browsing.....devolution  D If a picture says a thousand words, these words conjer up a thousand pictures.  Thanks  ;-)   -- Dave...d  ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but thea- principle one was that they escaped teething.l -----Mark Twain   @ "Bob DeBula" <bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message4 news:ac0fto$fk5$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu...H > Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> carefully crafted electrons to say: > > 2 > > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageF > > news:M_uE8.19960$t8_.18714@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... > > >'E > > > Wrong. These were exactly the things that CAUSED the 'fall from  grace'.e > > TheiJ > > > crap Sun was selling at the time couldn't hold a technical candle to whatG > > > DEC could and was delivering technically. But Sun ate DEC's lunch  becauseyH > > > they did ALL the things that constitute marketing well - and in my books,L > > > marketing starts with the CEO and the Board of Directors and permeates thec > > > whole organization > >nF > > I'm beginning to suspect that you don't have a clue what I've been talkingu( > > about, so I'll give it another shot. >sF > I think you guys may be missing another important shift somewhere inH > all of this "evolution". Early on, IT departments tended to be centralH > and controlled by techies who essentially moved on up into management.6 > As a trend, that started to change as IT became moreF > important/essential to the bottom line (and a peculiar devolutionaryD > trend it is too, IMO) of most companies and institutions.  TechiesD > started to get dropped out of management and the era of the PHB ITL > sauropods began. Now-a-days it can be rather rare to find a true techie inI > IT management a lot of places.  There's even a bit (or even more than a H > bit some places) of anti-techie sentiment amongst the conifer-browsing PHBs. E > Back then, DEC could sell to technical managers on technical merit.cE > Now, Diablo Bill has the complacently browsing herd of ponderous ITeK > PHBs collective earholes and "technical merit" isn't consideration number2H > one (or two or three, or even among the top ten it seems at times) anyD > more. Techies have been falling more and more under the heading of= > "necessary evil" for a lot of modern PHBs, it seems from my>? > perspective. (And I haven't seen a DEC/Compaq salesdroid comeg! > calling in over a decade here).h >  >e >aL > ==========================================================================; >               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U'so > @ >         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:11:59 -0500 1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>s' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing! 1 Message-ID: <ac0lti$g6l$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>t  G Back to the kids for a moment, I have 3.  How can you sit at the supper0L table telling the kids that you should stick up for what you think is right,& then go to work and do something else?  I And yes, I understand all too well the need to put food on the table, paya for education, etc.e  " And this just popped into my head.  K Never give up.  Never surrender.    <---- remember that movie and the storya it told?   -- Dave...   ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but the - principle one was that they escaped teething.  -----Mark Twainu  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message@ news:7iQE8.8669$ah_.3356@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... > 'Gales' of laughter. :-) >aI > But seriously, it's the gamble on one's career that's the problem thesenH > days. Without serious marketing effort from HP to truly convince upperL > management that VMS is here to stay and will be heavily promoted, there isG > no reason for anyone lower down in the organization to champion it not matter> > how technically superior it may be, no matter how robust and" > best-you-business-capable it is. > J > People gotta eat, pay the mortgage, and send the kids to university. And inJ > fewer cases these days, sticking with VMS won't do that for you. Too fewH > sites, too few VMS jobs, too much risk in looking like an old dinosaur thatL > isn't with the latest technology, facts notwithstanding. It's difficult to: > get around the prejudices people come to the table with. >s >.J > Just an example I know of (a bit O.T.) - a guy I know saw a job ad for aI > VP-level position and sent his resume in. Eminently qualified, loads ofiI > experience, a great fit. The HR department was the place the resume wasm sentL > to - they looked at it and didn't see some of the buzzwords they were toldJ > to look for, so they sent him a rejection letter. He got curious, called HR,oI > and was told that the business unit head never saw his resume...that HRsB > reviewed it and found it not the right fit and rejected him as a
 candidate. > L > He did some digging and found out who the real power was behind the hiringH > decision in the business unit itself and called the guy, got himself aL > face-to-face meeting, and got himself hired, much to the chagrin of the HR
 > department.n >eG > If it is the 'suits' that are doing the buying these days and not thewK > technologists, then this is where HP has to come it to the boardrooms andtL > convince potential customers that they are serious about VMS. If it is theK > technologists that are doing the buying, then HP has to still go into theiH > boardroom to backup the technologists' decisions and careers. Until HP does > this, VMS is dead. >n >* >* > That aside, I saw an article >HL http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nyt/20020512/tc_nyt/for_old_p& > arts__nasa_boldly_goes_______on_ebay > L > that's worth reading. Sort of analogous to what will happen in a few years
 > with Alpha.i >i >o > B > "Bob DeBula" <bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message6 > news:ac0gic$fnn$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu... > >nK > > "So, if you're into taking a gamble with your business and your career, G > > gamble on OpenVMS and feel the wind rushing beneath your kilt"? :-)s > >l > >p >m >s >a   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2002 17:25:56 GMT3 From: bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu (Bob DeBula)d' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!l: Message-ID: <ac0q34$hcm$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  M Dave Gudewicz <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> carefully crafted electrons to say: I > Back to the kids for a moment, I have 3.  How can you sit at the supper;N > table telling the kids that you should stick up for what you think is right,( > then go to work and do something else? > K > And yes, I understand all too well the need to put food on the table, payt > for education, etc.n  > Or, as a hypothetical, you can ask of yourself something like:A "If the company that owns it doesn't think it's worth any speciallC effort, why should I put my neck on the line to promote it to an ITpE management that increasingly wouldn't know technical excellence if iteA clamped itself to the wrinkly grey rind of the overly-sufficient,uD chair-anchoring, left side of their posterior cortex and blinged theC four note audio IT PHB mating song backwards while launching bottle@D rockets at the executive assistant (sportsmodel, one of) while threeF genetically engineered blue gibbons capered about their office holdingF up placards with the letters "V", "M", and "S" clutched in one paw and# golden Oscar statues in the other?"   " Just as a hypothetical, naturally.      J ==========================================================================9               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U'so  ?         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:56:01 -0500 1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> ' Subject: Re: Who cares about marketing!E1 Message-ID: <ac0s0j$h6e$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>t  - I see your point.  Hypothethically of course.    -- Dave...r  ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but thed- principle one was that they escaped teething.' -----Mark Twains  @ "Bob DeBula" <bobd@araminta.uts.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message4 news:ac0q34$hcm$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu...J > Dave Gudewicz <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> carefully crafted electrons to say:K > > Back to the kids for a moment, I have 3.  How can you sit at the supper I > > table telling the kids that you should stick up for what you think ism right,* > > then go to work and do something else? > >uI > > And yes, I understand all too well the need to put food on the table,s payc > > for education, etc.p >o@ > Or, as a hypothetical, you can ask of yourself something like:C > "If the company that owns it doesn't think it's worth any special E > effort, why should I put my neck on the line to promote it to an ITeG > management that increasingly wouldn't know technical excellence if it,C > clamped itself to the wrinkly grey rind of the overly-sufficient,lF > chair-anchoring, left side of their posterior cortex and blinged theE > four note audio IT PHB mating song backwards while launching bottle F > rockets at the executive assistant (sportsmodel, one of) while threeH > genetically engineered blue gibbons capered about their office holdingH > up placards with the letters "V", "M", and "S" clutched in one paw and% > golden Oscar statues in the other?"a >n$ > Just as a hypothetical, naturally. >= >= >=L > ==========================================================================; >               Disclaimer: These are my views, not the U'si >h@ >         "If it's in the paper it must be true!" --- D. Doright   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:11:23 -0500s1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>tB Subject: Re: Windows XP Updates: More Trouble Than They're Worth ?1 Message-ID: <ac0pcu$goe$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>e  K I've noticed that since October last, XP launch day, I've installed quite a.I few updates/patches to my XP boxes.  I choose not to use the "we'll do it L for you automatically" option.  Just yesterday, yet another security related# fix for IE and who knows what else.n  G This made me remember that someone here that works at a site w/H-P geari named it:  Hourly Patches  ;-)   -- Dave...x  ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but the - principle one was that they escaped teething.a -----Mark Twain   : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3CE31327.C4466A75@videotron.ca...6 > Windows XP Updates: More Trouble Than They're Worth? >  Wed May 15, 1:32 PM ETr >y  >  Jay Lyman, www.NewsFactor.com >tK >  Users of Microsoft (Nasdaq: MSFT - news)'s Windows operating systems are- toldJ > repeatedly to keep up to date on software patches and updates, and those whoeJ > do not upgrade often are blamed when viruses or hackers exploit reported > vulnerabilities. >t@ >  However, for many users, downloading updates for the Redmond,I > Washington-based software maker's latest and greatest operating system,uF > Windows XP , means crashed systems, devices that do not work and and	 sometimesc! > an inability to boot up at all.y >hF >  But even taking into account Windows XP's update problems and other issues,,J > some analysts contend that, on the whole, the operating system has lived up torD > Microsoft's billing as the best OS  the company ever has produced. >f >  Driver Dilemmae > G >  Giga Information Group analyst Rob Enderle told NewsFactor that XP's  updateD > problems center on drivers -- tiny software programs that tell the	 operating=. > system how to work with third-party devices. > H >  "There have been issues where the driver has misidentified and brokenI > things," Enderle said. "Basically, what happens is you won't be able to  boot, $ > or the device might not function." >>G >  Enderle, who described Windows XP as the only OS for which Microsoft0 issuesJ > updated drivers, said the aforementioned issues have affected networking cardsm) > and video drivers, among other devices.s >  >  Loss of Control >sB >  Gartner (NYSE: IT - news) research director John Pescatore told
 NewsFactorI > that while Windows XP is little used in enterprises, so there is littler basisaJ > for drawing conclusions, on the consumer side there have been consistentJ > reports of problems with peripheral  drivers, including printer drivers. >UJ >  Pescatore advised Windows XP users to avoid automatic updates, which he saidF > take control out of users' hands and pose the potential for security holes. > K >  "In general, automatic functions where your computer is talking over thetL > Internet without you knowing it are generally bad things," Pescatore said. >p >  Fixes Elusive >mJ >  There are ways to fix Windows XP and third-party devices when they have beenF > disrupted by an "update," using the new "driver restore" and "system restore"F > functions. But neither method is as simple as updating, according to Enderle. > D >  "Fortunately, the 'system restore' function takes care of [system upsets].5 > But a lot of people don't know it exists," he said.= >3D >  Users also can deal with problem drivers by reverting to earlier, built-inH > versions, Enderle noted. He added, however, that "a lot of folks don't like to - > get into the guts of the operating system."  >D >  Reliance on Restore >-E >  Enderle said that although past versions of Windows did not updatet drivers,K > Microsoft went ahead with driver updates in Windows XP because the system$ had31 > restore functions in case an update went wrong.  >lK >  While there have been hundreds of driver updates since XP began shippingb lateC > last year, driver problems have occurred with only a few of them,e according to
 > Enderle. >sH >  "If we were getting more breakage, we'd be hearing more about it," he said.d >  >  Side Effects Standard >oL >  Meta Group (Nasdaq: METG - news) vice president Steve Kleynhans said that4 > problems with patches and updates are nothing new. > K >  "That's always true with patches, generally," Kleynhans told NewsFactor.sK > "Particularly as they come to market, [they tend to] carry with them sidet > effects."i >oJ >  Enderle added that despite a slow start, third-party device makers haveH > improved their timeliness in releasing drivers, thereby easing  update issues.e >tG >  "It looks like the driver experience is getting reasonably good," hed said.  >l >  Patience for Patchess >sK >  Kleynhans said that unless companies or consumers are left vulnerable byt notwG > patching right away, it is more advisable to wait for a service pack,o which isF > more thoroughly tested, rather than trying to update their operating systemst > piecemeal. >HE >  "Unless there is a compelling reason that you need a patch -- liket securityG > -- and [not patching is] not causing significant pain, it's better to  wait," > Kleynhans said.o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 08:37:39 -0500u1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>t Subject: Re: Worth a reads1 Message-ID: <ac0cs5$ela$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>t   It was worth the read.  Thanks.    -- Dave...g  ) Adam and Eve had many advantages, but the - principle one was that they escaped teething.m -----Mark Twainp  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageA news:1ACE8.20858$t8_.5407@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...s: > http://www.eweek.com/article/0,3658,s=701&a=21086,00.asp >d  > I just came across this today. >  >s   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 11:11:11 -0400.; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>a Subject: Re: Worth a ready" Message-ID: <3ce3cbfd@news.si.com>   >I just came across this today.w  3 They should have outsourced it to Process Software.. -- hA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comoA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comu= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventw< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 08:46:53 -0400s* From: "Stewart, Bill" <wjs-corp@Kaman.com> Subject: X WINDOWS question : Message-ID: <1E4B06029E11D211B47C0000F8207F4DB31D9E@ESKC2>  A 	We are running Vaxcluster-Console on an Alpha station 200 4/100,TF with a 14 inch monitor.  We have added a bunch more nodes, and want toJ change the console to a 17 inch.  How do I change the resolution to 1024 X 768?   Thanks   Bill Stewart Systems Managern Kaman Corporationt Bloomfield, CT   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 14:57:07 +0100c* From: "Rainer Giese" <giese@volkswerft.de> Subject: Re: X WINDOWS questions5 Message-ID: <ac0ab3$lnlsh$1@ID-138444.news.dfncis.de>t  ; "Stewart, Bill" <wjs-corp@Kaman.com> schrieb im Newsbeitragh4 news:1E4B06029E11D211B47C0000F8207F4DB31D9E@ESKC2... > B > We are running Vaxcluster-Console on an Alpha station 200 4/100,H > with a 14 inch monitor.  We have added a bunch more nodes, and want toL > change the console to a 17 inch.  How do I change the resolution to 1024 X > 768?  J That depends on your graphic adapter. Some cards have switches/jumpers, in) other cases you can configure this in thei# DECW$PRIVATE_SERVER_SETUP.COM-file.s   -- Regards, Rainer Giese   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 13:59:34 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>r& Subject: Re: [announce] FreeVMS 0.0.14) Message-ID: <3CE39F26.7450D8AA@gtech.com>n   "David J. Dachtera" wrote:I > That would help, yes. Ideally, of course, we'd like to see DEC-C have aeF > status similar to Macro/32: distributed "free" with VMS, just as gcc@ > seems to come with every *BSD and Linux distro. on the planet. > 5 > ...but that would make too much sense, wouldn't it?a   Not much sense at all.  6 DEC/Digital/Compaq/HP/whatever has to pay the software5 engineers developing and maintaining the compiler. Noa6 revenue is very likely to result in no development and maintenance.  : Macro-32 on VMS Alpha is probably on eof the very very few8 compilers developed and maintained by the OS vendor that is free.   And that must be due to:8   - historic reasons (Macro-32 is an assembler and those     were traditionally free)<   - low cost (I belive that both development and enhancement<     of Macro-32 has been much lower than the other compilers     especially C and C++)d   Arne   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 07:37:57 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)Y Subject: [Q]  How do you set the SQO bit in the FAB (FAB, RAB, which field has this bit?)== Message-ID: <343f30ae.0205160637.696685b4@posting.google.com>=   Hello,   My question is after the quote.e  4 (Jim.Johnson@software-exploration.nospam.com) wrote:  
 [begin quote]- Alan,r  @ You've just encountered the SQO optimization for DAP/FAL in RMS.  E SQO (Sequential-only) is a bit set in the FAB on open when the caller:D knows that it will never randomly read a record.  TYPE knows that isE the case, and '@' knows it isn't (e.g. handling of GOSUBs and GOTOs).   D For the network access, SQO is used to initiate a bulk data transferF protocol that doesn't send back any ACK messages until the eof is hit.? This means that the server can pack in as many data messages as 6 possible, and just keep sending them until it is done.  D If SQO isn't used, then a much slower protocol that is essentially a) request-response pair per record is used.   $ That's the difference you're seeing. [end quote]l    F OK, how do you do that? I found an example, UFO_CONTIG.FOR, in SectionF 8.6.1.3 of the VMS v6.2 Programming Concepts Manual, which is fine forF setting the file to be contiguous. And I showed this to our developer.F He asked on how to find the mnemonic, which field, what symbolic name,* from where, etc., has this SQO bit to set.   Thanks.e   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman " afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 02 08:12:29 PST From: mckinneyj@cpva.saic.comoY Subject: Re: [Q]  How do you set the SQO bit in the FAB (FAB, RAB, which field has this bi( Message-ID: <zFiI6sOlMClM@cpva.saic.com>  = In article <343f30ae.0205160637.696685b4@posting.google.com>, 1  SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) writes:f > Hello, > ! > My question is after the quote.o > 6 > (Jim.Johnson@software-exploration.nospam.com) wrote: >  > [begin quote]t > Alan,. > B > You've just encountered the SQO optimization for DAP/FAL in RMS. > G > SQO (Sequential-only) is a bit set in the FAB on open when the caller F > knows that it will never randomly read a record.  TYPE knows that isG > the case, and '@' knows it isn't (e.g. handling of GOSUBs and GOTOs).a > F > For the network access, SQO is used to initiate a bulk data transferH > protocol that doesn't send back any ACK messages until the eof is hit.A > This means that the server can pack in as many data messages ass8 > possible, and just keep sending them until it is done. > F > If SQO isn't used, then a much slower protocol that is essentially a+ > request-response pair per record is used.w > & > That's the difference you're seeing.
 > [end quote]t >  > H > OK, how do you do that? I found an example, UFO_CONTIG.FOR, in SectionH > 8.6.1.3 of the VMS v6.2 Programming Concepts Manual, which is fine forH > setting the file to be contiguous. And I showed this to our developer.H > He asked on how to find the mnemonic, which field, what symbolic name,, > from where, etc., has this SQO bit to set. > 	 > Thanks.e >  > Disclaimer: JMHO > Alan E. Feldman,$ > afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com    ? Using that particular example code you should be able to insertP  0 FAB.FAB$L_FOP = IBSET (FAB.FAB$L_FOP, FAB$V_SQO)  B You can examine the values of the symbols by looking in FORSYSDEF.  B $ pipe libr/extr=$fabdef/out=sys$output: sys$share:forsysdef.tlb -   | sear sys$pipe sqor   --   - Jim    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2002 09:17:36 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)e: Subject: Re: [Q]  VMS incremental backups vs. other brands3 Message-ID: <HK8ZSusjuksq@eisner.encompasserve.org>i  n In article <343f30ae.0205151510.3b2b5739@posting.google.com>, SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) writes: > Hello, > B > With VMS, incremental restore operations restore the disk to theA > condition it was in as of the time of the last incremental saveuF > operation. Files that were deleted or modified between the last fullC > backup and the last incremental backup remain deleted or modifiedb > after restoration. > ) > Does any other brand of Backup do this?r  @ I would not be surprised if Retrospect on MacOS gets this right.> It certainly has many other characteristics of VMS Backup, but5 with a GUI interface and built-in saveset management.e   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.270 ************************