1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 24 May 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 285       Contents:2 Re: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie?2 Re: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie?F Re: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie? Plus European langu" Re: Current Version of VMS's TCPIP DCPS Questions Re: DCPS Questions Re: DCPS Questions Re: DCPS Questions! Re: Deleting intrusion records... 
 Disk Failures  Re: Disk Failures - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning - Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning . Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC. Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC. Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC. Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC. Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC. Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DECA HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) E Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) E Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) E Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) E Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) E Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) N Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) DEC)DEC)D Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ orDEC), Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?, Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?, Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?; Re: Looking for Digital Serial Number Identication Resource " Re: Management Agents and Multinet Re: More DECNET help please!! P Re: off-topic: dubbing (was: RE: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie?" Re: OpenVMS SNMP TRAP  Replacing ALL-IN-1 applications  SHOW LOGICAL bug?  Re: SHOW LOGICAL bug?  Re: SHOW LOGICAL bug?  Re: SHOW LOGICAL bug?  Re: Some DECNET help please!! # Re: Terminal Services on VMS client  Re: USB on OpenVMS VMS Clusters with FDDI/Ethernet $ Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?$ Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?$ Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?$ Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ? Re: Which Unix for VMS users ? Re: Which Unix for VMS users ? Re: Which Unix for VMS users ? Re: Which Unix for VMS users ?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 19:57:37 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>; Subject: Re: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie? C Message-ID: <RQbH8.114220$fU2.11669373@bin8.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   / "Joe" <cstranslations@msn.com> wrote in message 7 news:d56d1c2d.0205230602.1f8a30e4@posting.google.com...    ...   7 > I'm what you would call "language challeged" (it's my E > wife that knows 3 or 4 other than English). From what I've heard if E > you go to most European countries (Italy in particular) and make an D > attempt to speak the language they will be thrilled (no matter how2 > badly you "botch it") that you made the attempt.  L 'Appreciative' might be a bit closer than 'thrilled', but otherwise that wasL the experience my wife and I had in Germany, Austria (just a really friendlyK country in all ways), Italy, and Switzerland 15 years ago, despite our lack I of any formal education in any local languages (except French in the last I case).  I think most Europeans realize that the *practical* need for even I just a second language (ignoring the ancillary benefits of having learned H one or more - preferably plus Latin and/or Greek) in most of the U.S. isI minimal (as compared with that in Europe) and are therefore both tolerant / and appreciative of any effort to speak theirs.     Same in French G > speaking Canada from what I've heard (they'll love you for making the ? > effort). YMMV ... but it's my understanding that the above is E > typically not the case with a foreigner attempting French in France > > unless they've been exposed to French from a very early age.  I Can't say whether that's a language issue or a nationality issue (despite F the historical friendship between the U.S. and France, the French as aL modern people often don't seem to like us very much - some attribute this toL their disdain for what passes as U.S. culture coupled with its propensity toI invade).  Though a long time ago now, I studied the language for 5+ years H and certainly speak it far more competently even today than any other weE attempted, but found the French to be definitely the chilliest hosts.    - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 23 May 2002 20:39:49 GMT9 From: "Thomas. Stephenson" <support@none.tstephenson.com> ; Subject: Re: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie? ? Message-ID: <Xns92178AFA4DF2FPegasusSupportmailan@129.197.1.64>   G cstranslations@msn.com (Joe) wrote in news:d56d1c2d.0205230602.1f8a30e4  @posting.google.com:   >> This is a joke, right?  > E > Probably not. I'm what you would call "language challeged" (it's my E > wife that knows 3 or 4 other than English). From what I've heard if E > you go to most European countries (Italy in particular) and make an D > attempt to speak the language they will be thrilled (no matter howA > badly you "botch it") that you made the attempt. Same in French G > speaking Canada from what I've heard (they'll love you for making the ? > effort). YMMV ... but it's my understanding that the above is E > typically not the case with a foreigner attempting French in France > > unless they've been exposed to French from a very early age. >   I Concur and have confirmed it many times when travelling through Europe.   K Same thing in Asia, you try and they appreciate the effort.  France is the  D only place where I've found the "Language police" ensuring that the G original name of something is not used even when they have to create a   French term.   ------------------------------   Date: 23 May 2002 20:14:52 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) O Subject: Re: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie? Plus European langu , Message-ID: <acjijs$1vpc$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>  . In article <3CED102A.D42D55B0@mindspring.com>,5  Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> writes:  |>  H |> I doubt that "I'm gonna get them doors open if it hair lips everybody/ |> on Bear Creek" translates all that well. :-)   D Your probably right.  I'm a native born American speaker and I don't. have a clue what that's supposed to mean.  :-)   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 24 May 2002 02:42:27 GMT2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>+ Subject: Re: Current Version of VMS's TCPIP , Message-ID: <ack9aj112ol@enews1.newsguy.com>  + Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com> wrote: # >> When will TCPIP 5.3 be released.   I > TCP/IP Services V5.3 is shipping now.  It's on the Q2 Software Products  > Library CDs.  K When will the manuals show up on the documentation site?  Alternatly, where 5 can one find a list of new features and enhancements?    			Zane    ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 13:14:16 -0700. From: Jack.Trachtman@vmmc.org (Jack Trachtman) Subject: DCPS Questions < Message-ID: <69d784c4.0205231214.d3a2bdf@posting.google.com>  5 I just installed DCPS V2.0 (I'm new to this product).   % I'd like to use it with two printers:   0 HPLJ 4+ w/duplexor and large capacity input tray  & Xerox 440ST w/duplexor, multiple trays    2 When I Telnet to each at port 9100, the HP answers0 a ^T as expected, but the Xerox doesn't (I guess this bodes ill for the Xerox).  1 Could someone help me with the commands that will 3 select duplexing and specific input & output trays?    Thanks   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 21:00:15 GMT * From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com> Subject: Re: DCPS Questions 5 Message-ID: <230520021654486965%paul.anderson@hp.com>   A In article <69d784c4.0205231214.d3a2bdf@posting.google.com>, Jack * Trachtman <Jack.Trachtman@vmmc.org> wrote:  7 > I just installed DCPS V2.0 (I'm new to this product).  > ' > I'd like to use it with two printers:  > 2 > HPLJ 4+ w/duplexor and large capacity input tray  , If it's the 4M Plus, it's supported by DCPS.  ( > Xerox 440ST w/duplexor, multiple trays  & This printer is not supported by DCPS.  F > When I Telnet to each at port 9100, the HP answers a ^T as expected,? > but the Xerox doesn't (I guess this bodes ill for the Xerox).   G If it isn't already, try setting the printer to PostScript mode and see A if it answers a ^T.  Then try typing in some nonsense command and F pressing Return, which should generate a PostScript error.  If you see2 nothing come back then yes, it bodes ill for DCPS.  D > Could someone help me with the commands that will select duplexing$ > and specific input & output trays?  B For duplex, it's PRINT /PARAMETERS=SIDES=2.  For trays, it's PRINTE /PARAMETERS=INPUT_TRAY=x or OUTPUT_TRAY=y.  Note that DCPS can select ! trays only on supported printers.   @ More information is available online with HELP PRINT_PARAMETERS.   Paul   --    Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineering    Hewlett-Packard Company    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 17:43:18 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: DCPS Questions , Message-ID: <3CED6270.446A240B@videotron.ca>   Jack Trachtman wrote: 3 > Could someone help me with the commands that will 5 > select duplexing and specific input & output trays?   K If you have access to the PPD files for each printer, you should be able to   deduct what commands are needed.  L For instance, for the DEClaser5100: (the lines with * are used for PPD only,G but in between is the postscript code to set a paper tray to that value      *InputSlot Lower/Cassette: "*     currentpagedevice /InputAttributes get   1 get dup    null eq {pop}    { dup length 1 add dict copy       dup /InputAttributes      1 dict dup /Priority [1] put     put setpagedevice    } ifelse"  *End* *InputSlot LargeCapacity/Large Capacity: ")    currentpagedevice /InputAttributes get    2 get dup    null eq {pop}    { dup length 1 add dict copy       dup /InputAttributes      1 dict dup /Priority [2] put     put setpagedevice    } ifelse"  *End  & *InputSlot Envelope/Envelope Feeder: "*     currentpagedevice /InputAttributes get   3 get dup    null eq {pop}    { dup length 1 add dict copy       dup /InputAttributes      1 dict dup /Priority [3] put     put setpagedevice    } ifelse"  *End   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 10:54:07 +1000 / From: "Phil Howell" <phowell@snowyhydro.com.au>  Subject: Re: DCPS Questions . Message-ID: <6cgH8.56$TY3.3497@ozemail.com.au>  ; "Jack Trachtman" <Jack.Trachtman@vmmc.org> wrote in message 6 news:69d784c4.0205231214.d3a2bdf@posting.google.com...7 > I just installed DCPS V2.0 (I'm new to this product).  > ' > I'd like to use it with two printers:  > 2 > HPLJ 4+ w/duplexor and large capacity input tray > ( > Xerox 440ST w/duplexor, multiple trays >  > 4 > When I Telnet to each at port 9100, the HP answers2 > a ^T as expected, but the Xerox doesn't (I guess  > this bodes ill for the Xerox). Try another port for the xerox (5001 springs to mind) Phil   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 15:40:23 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)* Subject: Re: Deleting intrusion records...= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0205231440.23dd7961@posting.google.com>   r contracer11@uol.com.br (Shiva MahaDeva) wrote in message news:<ddf392ea.0205221616.70e17b8a@posting.google.com>...E > How can I delete intrusion records in OpenVMS V5.5-2 ? The command:  > ( >  $ Delete/intru DRVAX5::telnet_acs0542 >  > It doesnt work !  > D > Which SYSGEN parameter can I modify to disable intrusion records ?. > ( I forgot this command... LGI_BRK_TMO  ???) > Thanks in advance...    B Try INTR.COM. It will list all intrustion records and allow you to delete them by number.  E Cut and paste the VMS SHARE file below to a file on your VAX or Alpha D and run it with @. Ignore the error about "blocks" not being a verb.B You should get INTR.COM as a result. INTR.COM contains 65 records. Then just run @INTR.COM!.    Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman " afeldman atski gfigroup dotski com   6 $! ------------------ CUT HERE -----------------------/ $ v='f$verify(f$trnlnm("SHARE_UNPACK_VERIFY"))'  $! $! This archive created: $!  Name : INTR  $!  By   : feldman" $!  Date : 23-MAY-2002 22:31:17.65? $!  Using: VMS_SHARE 8.5-1, (C) 1993 Andy Harper, Kings College  $!         London UK $!: $! Credit is due to these people for their original ideas:" $!    James Gray, Michael Bednarek $! $! To unpack this archive:A $!    Minimum of VMS 4.4 (VAX) / OpenVMS 1.0 (Alpha) is required. B $!    Remove the headers of the first part, up to `cut here' line.* $!    Execute file as a command procedure. $!9 $! The following file(s) will be created after unpacking:  $!       1. INTR.COM;1 $! $ set="set" % $ set symbol/scope=(nolocal,noglobal) * $ f="SYS$SCRATCH:."+f$getjpi("","PID")+";"/ $ if f$trnlnm("SHARE_UNPACK") .nes. "" then $ - !  f=f$parse("SHARE_UNPACK_TEMP",f) $ $ e="write sys$error  ""%UNPACK"", "$ $ w="write sys$output ""%UNPACK"", "6 $ if .not. f$trnlnm("SHARE_UNPACK_LOG") then $ w = "!"/ $ if f$getsyi("CPU") .gt. 127 then $ goto start  $ ve=f$getsyi("version")7 $ if ve-f$extract(0,1,ve) .ges. "4.4" then $ goto start * $ e "-E-OLDVER, Must run at least VMS 4.4" $ v=f$verify(v) 	 $ exit 44 M $unpack:subroutine!P1=file,P2=chksum,P3=attrib,P4=size,P5=fileno,P6=filetotal + $ if f$parse(P1) .nes. "" then $ goto dirok  $ dn=f$parse(P1,,,"DIRECTORY")) $ w "-I-CREDIR, Creating directory ''dn'"  $ create/dir 'dn'  $ if $status then $ goto dirok8 $ e "-E-CREDIRFAIL, Unable to create ''dn' File skipped"
 $ delete 'f'*  $ exit $dirok:  $ x=f$search(P1)' $ if x .eqs. "" then $ goto file_absent + $ e "-W-EXISTS, File ''P1' exists. Skipped" 
 $ delete 'f'*  $ exit
 $file_absent: D $ w "-I-UNPACK, Unpacking ", P5, " of ", P6, " - ", P1, " - ", P4, " Blocks"  $ n=P1 $ if P3 .nes. "" then $ n=f 7 $ if .not. f$verify() then $ define/user sys$output nl: : $ EDIT/TPU/NOSEC/NODIS/COM=SYS$INPUT/NOJOURNAL 'f'/OUT='n' PROCEDURE GetHex(s,p)LOCAL/ x1,x2;x1:=INDEX(t,SUBSTR(s,p,1))-1;x2:=INDEX(t, E SUBSTR(s,p+1,1))-1;RETURN 16*x1+x2;ENDPROCEDURE;PROCEDURE SkipPartsep  LOCAL m;C LOOP m:=MARK(NONE);EXITIF m=END_OF(CURRENT_BUFFER);DELETE(m);EXITIF  INDEX(6 ERASE_LINE,"-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+")=1;ENDLOOP;ENDPROCEDURE;< PROCEDURE ProcessLine LOCAL c,s,l,b,n,p;s := ERASE_LINE;c := SUBSTR(s,1,1);s :=?  s-c;IF c = "X" THEN SPLIT_LINE; ENDIF;MOVE_HORIZONTAL(-1);l :=  LENGTH(s);p :=C  1;LOOP EXITIF p > l;c := SUBSTR(s,p,1);p := p+1;CASE c FROM ' ' TO 	 '`' ['`'] . : COPY_TEXT(ASCII(GetHex(s,p))); p:=p+2;[' ']: p:=p+1;[INRANGE,OUTRANGE] D : COPY_TEXT(c);ENDCASE;ENDLOOP;ENDPROCEDURE;PROCEDURE Decode(b)LOCAL m;3 POSITION(BEGINNING_OF(b));LOOP m:=MARK(NONE);EXITIF  m=END_OF(b);DELETE(m);A IF INDEX(CURRENT_LINE,"+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-")=1 THEN SkipPartSep;ELSE  ProcessLine;N MOVE_HORIZONTAL(1);ENDIF;ENDLOOP;ENDPROCEDURE;SET(FACILITY_NAME,"UNPACK");SET(F SUCCESS,OFF);SET(INFORMATIONAL,OFF);t:="0123456789ABCDEF";f:=GET_INFO(G COMMAND_LINE,"file_name");o:=CREATE_BUFFER(f,f);Decode(o);WRITE_FILE(o, + GET_INFO(COMMAND_LINE,"output_file"));QUIT;  $ if p3 .eqs. "" then $ goto dl  $ open/write fdl &f  $ write fdl "RECORD" $ write fdl P3 $ close fdl 2 $ w "-I-CONVRFM, Converting record format to ", P3 $ convert/fdl='f' 'f'-1 'f' % $ fa=f$getdvi(f$parse(f),"ALLDEVNAM") & $ Pa=f$getdvi(f$parse(P1),"ALLDEVNAM")/ $ if fa .eqs. Pa then $ rename &f 'f$parse(P1)' - $ if fa .nes. Pa then $ copy &f 'f$parse(P1)'  $dl: delete 'f'* $ checksum 'P1' ( $ if checksum$checksum .nes. P2 then $ --   e "-E-CHKSMFAIL, Checksum of ''P1' failed."  $ exit $ endsubroutine  $start:  $! $ create 'f' X$!+`20INTR.COM  X$! M X$!`20`20PURPOSE:`20To`20list`20records`20in`20the`20breakin`20database`20and  V`20to`20delete A X$!`20`20`20`20`20`20`20`20`20`20`20any`20of`20them`20by`20number  X$! + X$`20`20`20SHOW`20INTRUSION/OUTPUT=INTR.TMP4E X$`20`20`20IF`20(F$TRNLNM("FILE")`20.NES.`20"")`20THEN`20CLOSE`20FILEi& X$`20`20`20OPEN/READ`20FILE`20INTR.TMP. X$`20`20`20READ/END=_END`20`20FILE`20`20HEADER& X$`20`20`20WRITE`20SYS$OUTPUT`20HEADER X$`20`20`20N`20=`200 X$_LOOP:) X$`20`20`20READ/END=_END`20`20FILE`20LINEo X$`20`20`20N`20=`20N`20+`201! X$`20`20`20LINE_'N'`20=`20LINE`20e0 X$`20`20`20LENGTH`20`20`20=`20F$LENGTH(LINE_'N')1 X$`20`20`20LOCATION`20=`20F$LOCATE("::",LINE_'N')  X$! * X$`20`20`20IF`20(LOCATION`20.NE.`20LENGTH) X$`20`20`20THEN G X$!`20Convert`20a`204-byte`20Hex`20number`20to`20decimal`20IP`20addresse X$! 8 X$`20`20`20HEXSTR`20=`20F$EXTRACT(LOCATION+2,8,LINE_'N'), X$`20`20`20LEN_HEXSTR`20=`20F$LENGTH(HEXSTR)! X$`20`20`20!SH`20SYM`20LEN_HEXSTRt7 X$`20`20`20BYTE4`20=`20F$EXTRACT(LEN_HEXSTR-2,2,HEXSTR)r7 X$`20`20`20BYTE3`20=`20F$EXTRACT(LEN_HEXSTR-4,2,HEXSTR)a7 X$`20`20`20BYTE2`20=`20F$EXTRACT(LEN_HEXSTR-6,2,HEXSTR)e7 X$`20`20`20BYTE1`20=`20F$EXTRACT(LEN_HEXSTR-8,2,HEXSTR)P X$`20`20`20!SH`20SYM`20BYTE%7 X$`20`20`20NUM4`20=`20F$STRING(F$INTEGER("%X''BYTE4'")) 7 X$`20`20`20NUM3`20=`20F$STRING(F$INTEGER("%X''BYTE3'"))d7 X$`20`20`20NUM2`20=`20F$STRING(F$INTEGER("%X''BYTE2'"))n7 X$`20`20`20NUM1`20=`20F$STRING(F$INTEGER("%X''BYTE1'"))e X$`20`20`20!SH`20SYM`20NUM%e" X$`20`20`20IPADR`20=`20NUM1`20`09-# X`09`20`20`20`20+`20"."`20+`20NUM2- # X`09`20`20`20`20+`20"."`20+`20NUM3-r" X`09`20`20`20`20+`20"."`20+`20NUM4 X$`20`20`20!SH`20SYM`20IPADR; X$`20`20`20LINE_'N'`5BLOCATION+2,17`5D`20:=`20`5B'IPADR'`5D  X$`20`20`20ENDIF X$!k X$`20`20`20!SH`20SYM`20LOCATIONnK X$`20`20`20SOURCE_'N'`20=`20F$ELEMENT(4,"`20",F$EDIT(LINE,"COMPRESS,TRIM"))pL X$`20`20`20WRITE`20SYS$OUTPUT`20F$FAO("!2SL!AS",N,F$EXTRACT(2,999,LINE_'N')) X$`20`20`20GOTO`20_LOOP  X$_END: E X$`20`20`20IF`20(F$TRNLNM("FILE")`20.NES.`20"")`20THEN`20CLOSE`20FILEL X$`20`20`20INQUIRE`20CHOICE`20-eO X`20`20`20`20"Select`20a`20number`20to`20delete`20or`20enter`20'A'`20to`20abortS V`20`5BA`5D"? X$`20`20`20IF`20(CHOICE`20.EQS.`20"")`20THEN`20CHOICE`20=`20"A" ; X$`20`20`20IF`20(CHOICE`20.NES.`20"A")`20THEN`20GOTO`20_DELe	 X$_ABORT:hN X$`20`20`20WRITE`20SYS$OUTPUT`20"INTR.COM`20exited.`20No`20intrusion`20records V`20were`20deleted."! X$`20`20`20PURGE/NOLOG`20INTR.TMPn X$`20`20`20EXIT? X$_DEL:c X$`20`20`20SET`20VERIFY  X$`20`20`20!SH`20SYM`20CHOICE-' X$`20`20`20RECORD`20=`20SOURCE_'CHOICE' B X$`20`20`20DELETE/INTRUSION`20"''RECORD'"`20`20!`26SOURCE_'CHOICE' X$`20`20`20SET`20NOVERIFY`20! X$`20`20`20PURGE/NOLOG`20INTR.TMP  X$`20`20`20EXIT-+ $ call unpack INTR.COM;1 842668094 "" 4 1 1. $ v=f$verify(v)  $ exit   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 12:38:16 -0700. From: Jack.Trachtman@vmmc.org (Jack Trachtman) Subject: Disk Failures= Message-ID: <69d784c4.0205231138.1acdce10@posting.google.com>n  E This year we purchased a Compaq SAN, including 84 of the new 36GB 15Ka rpm disk drives.  = So far we have replaced 17 of the disks as they have startinge  generating (recoverable) errors.  D Compaq has escalated this to Fujitsu but has not received a response$ as to the high error (failure) rate.  6 Does anyone else have any experience with these disks?   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 20:17:36 -0700) From: P.Young@unsw.EDU.AU (Patrick Young)r Subject: Re: Disk Failures= Message-ID: <55f85d77.0205231917.6eba1d16@posting.google.com>p  s Jack.Trachtman@vmmc.org (Jack Trachtman) wrote in message news:<69d784c4.0205231138.1acdce10@posting.google.com>...rG > This year we purchased a Compaq SAN, including 84 of the new 36GB 15KS > rpm disk drives. > ? > So far we have replaced 17 of the disks as they have startingr" > generating (recoverable) errors. > F > Compaq has escalated this to Fujitsu but has not received a response& > as to the high error (failure) rate.   D Our PC supplier was recently requested not to supply Fujitsu disks -F they now supply Seagate disks as we experienced a similar failure rateC with their IDE disks earlier in the year. I'm not sure if the same l: mfg. plant is used to produce the HDAs for the SCSI disks.  C We have a Compaq RA3000 that AFAIK, uses Compaq badged Seagate 36GblD disk drives - no failures so far - wonder why they also use Fujitsu?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 12:46:03 -0700n" From: GreyCloud <cumulus@mist.com>6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning( Message-ID: <3CED46FB.56116EB2@mist.com>   JF Mezei wrote:p >  > GreyCloud wrote:@ > > or two happening on board everyday... I don't think win2k is9 > > capable of putting out or fighting a fire... it needs ! > > trained sailors for that job.t > O > On such a large ship, it is important that fire fighters have ready access togK > information about what is in the area where the fire occurs. (fuel depot,m& > ammunition, dangerous chemicals etc) > H > Furthermore, on such a large ship, there may be many automated actionsO > necessary in case of a fire (shutdown ventilation, cut power, close valves ofnN > fuel/gas lines in the area or whatever else, and this is where a computer is' > needed on such a large complex ship).a  4 I've been there.  The aircraft carriers rely on fire9 watches, not automation that can fail.  I can imagine the 8 Captain using an aircraft carrier seeing a red fire Icon8 show up on his board showing a fire in the bilge.  Who's6 going to put it out??  There are too many variables to6 consider and sailors will always be needed for various8 conditions.  After all the most advanced weapon is still man.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 12:47:54 -0700 " From: GreyCloud <cumulus@mist.com>6 Subject: Re: Forced migration to HPHUX - Storm Warning( Message-ID: <3CED476A.2688D9E4@mist.com>   Atlant Schmidt wrote:a >  > GreyCloud wrote: > , > > .  Who's going to throw the Battle Short5 > > switch when they get into it with another enemy??  > 8 > When you said this, I had this very funny mental image4 > that when you throw the "Battle Short" switch, the1 > computer monitor would display a message saying 1 > "Battle Short enabled -- Switching from Windowsa > 2000 to Linux!"2 >   9 That is a funny image at that.  Of course the old weaponsc: systems used a covered red switch that said "Battle Short"9 on a Sperry Univac system.  It'll try to keep going untilt# the weapon(s) are fired during war.l   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 14:38:10 -0500t1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>G7 Subject: Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DECh1 Message-ID: <acjgl0$6kb$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>   I Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in its ownn1 section, didn't before.  No mention of migration.-4 http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htm  H I call that progress.  Maybe due to some of us writing to the new powers that be.   -- Dave...C  6 Many a small thing has been made large by advertising. -----Mark Twainn  3 "jlsue" <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> wrote in messages2 news:45upeu8jp8a039ftuvp7p54bgrh7r52vn0@4ax.com.... > On Wed, 22 May 2002 20:51:33 -0400, JF Mezei' > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:c >n > >jlsue wrote:eJ > >> Ya know.  It just doesn't matter what piece of paper we show you.  IfH > >> we produced one that says *exactly* what you wanted, you'd just sayF > >> something like "Yeah, that's what you said about NT on Alpha, and > >> about Alpha itself.". > >3# > >Actions speak louder than words.  > >i > >[snippage...] >'@ > Which is *exactly* part of my point.  But actions don't happenD > immediately.  You just have to wait and see (just like the rest of > us). >uF > But continually repeating the same stuff several notes a day doesn'tE > help matters in the least.  Your posts are so repetitive that I canXH > grab something 1 or 2 years ago and re-post it and nobody'd be able to > tell the difference. >u3 > Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaq-/ > (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 16:35:20 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 7 Subject: Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DECc, Message-ID: <3CED5287.464D6202@videotron.ca>   jlsue wrote:@ > Which is *exactly* part of my point.  But actions don't happenD > immediately.  You just have to wait and see (just like the rest of > us).  H But there are those HP apoligists who claim that VMS has a bright futureI already. By the same token you should also be telling them to shut up andh "wait and see".c  H > grab something 1 or 2 years ago and re-post it and nobody'd be able to > tell the difference.  M That should tell you that Digital, Compaq and now HP don't even bother to fix L the problems that irritate the customers and that the problems keep going on and on and on.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 20:33:17 GMT . From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)7 Subject: Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC 3 Message-ID: <hmcH8.47620$ze7.512829@news.chello.at>t  e In article <acjgl0$6kb$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>, "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> writes:aJ >Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in its own2 >section, didn't before.  No mention of migration.5 >http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htme >tI >I call that progress.  Maybe due to some of us writing to the new powers0	 >that be.   > Yep, that's progress (a tiny one, but nevertheless it is one).  L But I still like to see more than one sentence (saying: Q did say something)F and I still want to see actions like BIG ADS, cheap Alpha/IA64 OpenVMSC servers and workstations, VMS for free for all systems up to 8 CPUssH (where do I've seen it ? Ah, yes, SUN) _clear_ future/progress/strategicF statements to customers and ISV (and not a "as long as they want it"),E more ported products to OpenVMS IPF (eg. why not also Office Server ?tE What will the WhiteHouse and NSA use then ?) and many articles in therE press/analysts papers mentioning OpenVMS (but NOT in the Past Tense).   A But history seems to have made some of you already very humble...p  B Yes, I do expect VMS to still live at the end of the decade, but II unfortunately still expect VMS to continue declining and I'm not amused !    --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atP A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMS Job(s)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 17:00:35 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>a7 Subject: Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC/, Message-ID: <3CED5871.3E9E6235@videotron.ca>   Dave Gudewicz wrote:K > Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in its owni3 > section, didn't before.  No mention of migration.D6 > http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htm >  > I call that progress.   N Isn't it the same exact text that essentially states that HP will allow VMS to5 continue to wither away as it has done under Compaq ?o  0 All I noticed is that they bolded the VMS word.   L Now, I have to ask: how often are we expected to check that may 7th document3 and what tools can we use to detect changes to it ?l   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 16:00:47 -0500 1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> 7 Subject: Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DECh1 Message-ID: <acjlfr$7d1$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>y  J Might I suggest writing to the people previously mentioned at hp with your% views.  They do seem to be listening.s   -- Dave...a  > An honest man in politics shines more than he would elsewhere. -----Mark Twaina  ; "Peter LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in messageo- news:hmcH8.47620$ze7.512829@news.chello.at...rC > In article <acjgl0$6kb$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>, "Dave Gudewicz"e# <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> writes: L > >Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in its own4 > >section, didn't before.  No mention of migration.7 > >http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htmt > >eK > >I call that progress.  Maybe due to some of us writing to the new powers  > >that be.  >i@ > Yep, that's progress (a tiny one, but nevertheless it is one). >bC > But I still like to see more than one sentence (saying: Q did sayO
 something)H > and I still want to see actions like BIG ADS, cheap Alpha/IA64 OpenVMSE > servers and workstations, VMS for free for all systems up to 8 CPUsEJ > (where do I've seen it ? Ah, yes, SUN) _clear_ future/progress/strategicH > statements to customers and ISV (and not a "as long as they want it"),G > more ported products to OpenVMS IPF (eg. why not also Office Server ? G > What will the WhiteHouse and NSA use then ?) and many articles in thesG > press/analysts papers mentioning OpenVMS (but NOT in the Past Tense).! >!C > But history seems to have made some of you already very humble...0 >lD > Yes, I do expect VMS to still live at the end of the decade, but IK > unfortunately still expect VMS to continue declining and I'm not amused !o >g > -- > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERc' > Network and OpenVMS system specialist= > E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atK > A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMSA Job(s)   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 04:36:26 GMTs* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>7 Subject: Re: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC > Message-ID: <erjH8.1816$%y.218365@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3CED5871.3E9E6235@videotron.ca... > Dave Gudewicz wrote:I > > Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in itst ownP5 > > section, didn't before.  No mention of migration."8 > > http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htm > >R > > I call that progress.d > I > Isn't it the same exact text that essentially states that HP will allown VMS to7 > continue to wither away as it has done under Compaq ?k > 1 > All I noticed is that they bolded the VMS word.a  F What I believe they did was prefix the single VMS sentence with a boldF header, so that it no longer falls under a Unix header.  Otherwise, noH changes are apparent (including the other nearby statements that all new4 business would be directed to the PA-RISC platform).  J Calling that 'progress' is pathetic:  nothing of any substance has changedL one iota.  Reminds me of the burst of enthusiasm that ensued when someone inK Marcello's organization sent out the flashing balls:  desperate people tend) to clutch at any straw.B  H OTOH, it does indicate that someone is listening and willing at least toI make an occasional purely cosmetic change, which is more than Compaq ever K did above the Marcello level.  That *could* be an encouraging sign, or just)K a slightly less incompetent brush-off than we're used to:  the test will be J whether any *real* changes are forthcoming, assuming people are willing toJ wait hopefully yet one more time to see if the leopard will finally change
 its spots.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 16:24:18 -0400E; From: "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov>rJ Subject: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC)I Message-ID: <032D86684229CC4AB84588A0BE50FC4002FCCF@rlghncst625.usps.gov>5   Speaking strictly for myself:_  2 As I said in previous posts, I sent someone at HP 8 a polite note which contained various discussion points.  2 I got back a prompt, polite response which made it4 quite clear that the recipient had not only read but4 had thought about my points and had cogent things to say about them.f      They *are* listening.  0 I won't discuss specific content because it's my4 general principle that private emails should remain , private unless both parties agree otherwise.  / And, as I also said in previous posts, it's my e. opinion that the more people send them polite 1 emails which explain why VMS is valuable to what o3 they do, the more likely the chances are that they  ! might grow the OpenVMS franchise.`  . It's just my opinion, but I think that the HP 1 folks just don't know the history of what's gone `. on from Palmerdom onward, and therefore don't 3 have a grasp as to why these VMS people seem to be 0/ so hypersensitive to everything that gets said.F  3 But if all they hear is bitching about the sentence23 structure of every pronouncement they make, they'llE/ conclude that nothing they do will ever make usL3 happy and they might as well let VMS die if for no 2  other reason than to shut us up.   WWWebb   -----Original Message-----0 From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET $ Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 3:41 PMB To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET7 Subject: RE: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DECl    I Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in its own)1 section, didn't before.  No mention of migration.24 http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htm  H I call that progress.  Maybe due to some of us writing to the new powers that be.   -- Dave...0  6 Many a small thing has been made large by advertising. -----Mark TwainE  3 "jlsue" <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> wrote in messageB2 news:45upeu8jp8a039ftuvp7p54bgrh7r52vn0@4ax.com.... > On Wed, 22 May 2002 20:51:33 -0400, JF Mezei' > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:` >$ > >jlsue wrote:"J > >> Ya know.  It just doesn't matter what piece of paper we show you.  IfH > >> we produced one that says *exactly* what you wanted, you'd just sayF > >> something like "Yeah, that's what you said about NT on Alpha, and > >> about Alpha itself."4 > >2# > >Actions speak louder than words.L > >N > >[snippage...] >2@ > Which is *exactly* part of my point.  But actions don't happenD > immediately.  You just have to wait and see (just like the rest of > us). >,F > But continually repeating the same stuff several notes a day doesn'tE > help matters in the least.  Your posts are so repetitive that I canTH > grab something 1 or 2 years ago and re-post it and nobody'd be able to > tell the difference. >e3 > Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaqt/ > (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)`   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 15:56:38 -050001 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com>WN Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC)1 Message-ID: <acjl82$7a3$1@fizban.pprd.abbott.com>`   I couldn't agree more.  Thanks.T   -- Dave...2  > An honest man in politics shines more than he would elsewhere. -----Mark TwainL  F "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> wrote in messageC news:032D86684229CC4AB84588A0BE50FC4002FCCF@rlghncst625.usps.gov...l > Speaking strictly for myself:  >.3 > As I said in previous posts, I sent someone at HP-: > a polite note which contained various discussion points. >n4 > I got back a prompt, polite response which made it6 > quite clear that the recipient had not only read but6 > had thought about my points and had cogent things to > say about them.5 >  >    They *are* listening. >a2 > I won't discuss specific content because it's my5 > general principle that private emails should remaind. > private unless both parties agree otherwise. >s0 > And, as I also said in previous posts, it's my/ > opinion that the more people send them polite-2 > emails which explain why VMS is valuable to what4 > they do, the more likely the chances are that they# > might grow the OpenVMS franchise.- > / > It's just my opinion, but I think that the HPp2 > folks just don't know the history of what's gone/ > on from Palmerdom onward, and therefore don'ti4 > have a grasp as to why these VMS people seem to be1 > so hypersensitive to everything that gets said.d >e5 > But if all they hear is bitching about the sentencee5 > structure of every pronouncement they make, they'll 1 > conclude that nothing they do will ever make ust4 > happy and they might as well let VMS die if for no" > other reason than to shut us up. >y > WWWebb >t > -----Original Message-----1 > From: Info-VAX-Request@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNETi& > Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 3:41 PMD > To: Webb, William W Raleigh, NC; Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com at INTERNET9 > Subject: RE: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC3 >  >tK > Found this today at hp.com, page 1.  New roadmap doc.  Has VMS in its ownw3 > section, didn't before.  No mention of migration.-6 > http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press/07may02b.htm >mJ > I call that progress.  Maybe due to some of us writing to the new powers
 > that be. >s > --	 > Dave.... >18 > Many a small thing has been made large by advertising. > -----Mark Twaini >o5 > "jlsue" <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> wrote in message 4 > news:45upeu8jp8a039ftuvp7p54bgrh7r52vn0@4ax.com...0 > > On Wed, 22 May 2002 20:51:33 -0400, JF Mezei) > > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:h > >e > > >jlsue wrote:nL > > >> Ya know.  It just doesn't matter what piece of paper we show you.  IfJ > > >> we produced one that says *exactly* what you wanted, you'd just sayH > > >> something like "Yeah, that's what you said about NT on Alpha, and > > >> about Alpha itself."l > > >v% > > >Actions speak louder than words.  > > >r > > >[snippage...] > >aB > > Which is *exactly* part of my point.  But actions don't happenF > > immediately.  You just have to wait and see (just like the rest of > > us). > >aH > > But continually repeating the same stuff several notes a day doesn'tG > > help matters in the least.  Your posts are so repetitive that I can J > > grab something 1 or 2 years ago and re-post it and nobody'd be able to > > tell the difference. > > 5 > > Not speaking for anyone, certainly not DEC/Compaq-1 > > (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)0   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 17:02:51 -0400 ! From: Jim Agnew <jpagnew@vcu.edu> N Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC)' Message-ID: <3CED58FB.139DA824@vcu.edu>o  $ "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" wrote: >  > Speaking strictly for myself:  >  >   
 WELL SAID!!!!   5 > But if all they hear is bitching about the sentenceh5 > structure of every pronouncement they make, they'lld1 > conclude that nothing they do will ever make us-4 > happy and they might as well let VMS die if for no" > other reason than to shut us up. >  > WWWebb >n   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 17:51:00 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> N Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC), Message-ID: <3CED643E.18640708@videotron.ca>  $ "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" wrote:4 > I got back a prompt, polite response which made it6 > quite clear that the recipient had not only read but6 > had thought about my points and had cogent things to > say about them.n  ' OK, let you ask this generaic question:g  M How high must one go at HP before a person responding to emails has authorityg> to actually implement the stuff he agrees to in his response ?  M I have absolutley no idea who this Stallard fellow is. And I am not impressed- at all by his tactics.J Anyone below him clearly has absolutely no authority to make real changes,H unless they are willing to mount a campaign and require as much customer complaints as possible.c  I It is my belief that what is needed is to convince Carly and/or one levelpM below her to change their mind about VMS and instruct the folks below them too pass on the new message.    N This is the type of stuff which cannot make it way from the grass roots to theK very top because they are clearly people up the chain that will simply playe8 lip service to the message and not pass it on higher up.  L And unless the message about a new policy for VMS comes from carly and henceK disseminated thorughout the orgaisation, you will continue to have folks inaI the unix and wintel department who think that VMS is there as a source ofaL customers for their platform. And unless there is a ***CLEAR*** message fromK Carly about the role of VMS, the HP sales force and marketing machines willC continue to ignore VMS.h   So, I ask this:s  0 who stands in the way between Carly and Gorham ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 20:28:27 -0500t& From: "Dave Gudewicz" <k9jdk@arrl.net>N Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC)8 Message-ID: <3ced9741$0$1416$1dc6e903@news.corecomm.net>  E Scott Stallard is a senior vp.  He is 2 rungs up the ladder from MarkeK Gorham.  My guess is one notch or 2 below Peter Blackmore.  Peter BlackmorehH heads up the big iron group for hp.  One of the 4 groups in the new org.. PCs, Imaging and Services make up the other 3.  ( You could ask him and find out for sure.   Dave...   : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3CED643E.18640708@videotron.ca...& > "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" wrote:6 > > I got back a prompt, polite response which made it8 > > quite clear that the recipient had not only read but8 > > had thought about my points and had cogent things to > > say about them.u >c) > OK, let you ask this generaic question:o >EE > How high must one go at HP before a person responding to emails has<	 authority1@ > to actually implement the stuff he agrees to in his response ? > E > I have absolutley no idea who this Stallard fellow is. And I am notM	 impressedn > at all by his tactics.L > Anyone below him clearly has absolutely no authority to make real changes,J > unless they are willing to mount a campaign and require as much customer > complaints as possible., >aK > It is my belief that what is needed is to convince Carly and/or one level L > below her to change their mind about VMS and instruct the folks below them to > pass on the new message. >hL > This is the type of stuff which cannot make it way from the grass roots to thesH > very top because they are clearly people up the chain that will simply play: > lip service to the message and not pass it on higher up. >"H > And unless the message about a new policy for VMS comes from carly and hencewJ > disseminated thorughout the orgaisation, you will continue to have folks inK > the unix and wintel department who think that VMS is there as a source of I > customers for their platform. And unless there is a ***CLEAR*** message  fromH > Carly about the role of VMS, the HP sales force and marketing machines will > continue to ignore VMS.e >  > So, I ask this:L > 2 > who stands in the way between Carly and Gorham ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 04:22:39 GMTo* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>N Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC)> Message-ID: <jejH8.2110$%o.168403@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  1 "Dave Gudewicz" <k9jdk@arrl.net> wrote in message72 news:3ced9741$0$1416$1dc6e903@news.corecomm.net...  > Scott Stallard is a senior vp.  H So, IIRC, were Bill Heil and (I think) Jesse Lipcon at Compaq.  And theyK clearly weren't high enough even to have a clue about what was really going I on (let alone influence it) when they wrote their "Compaq's commitment to  Alpha" letter.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 22:01:59 -0700i& From: Greg Cagle <gregc@gregcagle.com>W Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ or DEC) DEC)DEC)t, Message-ID: <3CEDC947.3090909@gregcagle.com>   Dave Gudewicz wrote:G > Scott Stallard is a senior vp.  He is 2 rungs up the ladder from MarkdM > Gorham.  My guess is one notch or 2 below Peter Blackmore.  Peter Blackmore J > heads up the big iron group for hp.  One of the 4 groups in the new org.0 > PCs, Imaging and Services make up the other 3.  + Correct - Scott reports to Peter Blackmore.s   --  
 Greg Cagle gregc at gregcagle dot com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 01:14:26 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>hM Subject: Re: HP is listening (was: HP doesn't listen any more than CPQ orDEC)d, Message-ID: <3CEDCC31.BF0D69F1@videotron.ca>   Greg Cagle wrote: - > Correct - Scott reports to Peter Blackmore.o   or so we have:   Gorham Marcello Stallard	 Blackmore   ) but what is between Blackmore and Carly ?m   Is Capellas in between ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 14:52:05 -0400o  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com5 Subject: Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?i? Message-ID: <OFF3449C80.B32A13E1-ON85256BC2.0066CC96@metso.com>(   Rob,  H Thanks for the continuing dialog.  My reason for wanting the backport is not becauseOK I as a customer am too conservative to rush to upgrade (although I may be),E butwE because my 3rd-party supplier will not commit to support V7.3*.  That  supplier hasC not said whether or not this app will run on V7.3* or if there is ar documented reasonnG why it will not run, just that there are no plans to qualify it.  That,d too, may change.   -Normr          C brooks@cuebid.zko.dec.nospam (Rob Brooks) on 05/22/2002 04:29:49 PM   ; Please respond to brooks@cuebid.zko.dec.nospam (Rob Brooks)a   To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:x8 Subject:    Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?    " norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:  A > Yes, as I asked later in another way, since V7.2-2 specificallyE
 backportedJ > support for FiberChannel, what reason would there be not to complete theH > backport by reincorporating V7.3-1 features into V7.2-2, especially as one A > of the expressed purposes of V7.2-2 backport was to protect theM
 investmentF > of those who could not quickly go to V7.3* for whatever reason.  TheH > volume-shadowing changes have been backported to keep multiple-version( > migration-support clusters functional.  B We know that many customers are somewhat conservative in upgradingC to new versions of VMS, especially releases like, V7.1, V7.2, V7.3,w thinkingF that by the time the -1 release comes out, all the bugs will have been workedG out.  That's not how engineering views those releases, but we know that C perception exists.  So, with the knowledge that folks would be morea comfortableaH with the V7.2-whatever versions for quite some time, there was an effortJ made to backport some features from V7.3, although, as it was pointed out,F V7.3 came out before V7.2-2.  However, the thought is that once V7.3-1E comes out, those conservate sites will upgrade from V7.2-2 to V7.3-1.   3 The mini-merge won't be backported to V7.3, either.t  I > I asked - and it is herein also asked - what that reason is.  No one istF > yet crying fowl.  That said, however, the comments about sacrificing > customers are not irrelevant.h  J I hope that I've been able to shed some light on why the backport won't beC done.  Also note that the engineering team doesn't make these lofty 
 decisions;D that's left to product management.  I'm not trying to pass the buck;J engineers actually like it when customers want to run their code, but as IG stated earlier, you'll need to make a case to product management if youy would like reconsideration.h   --  / Rob Brooks    VMS Engineering -- I/O Exec Groupc brooks!cuebid.zko.dec.comu   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 15:01:32 -0400l  From: norm.raphael@jamesbury.com5 Subject: Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?e? Message-ID: <OF650E697B.40CAE1EE-ON85256BC2.006844B9@metso.com>h   John,eG Not to put too fine a point on it, but we all know that V7.3 introducedyG "new fuctionality" and thus became more than just another dash release,CF and fudging the name of the release will not responsibly address that.K I believe full requalification was not needed for a patched V7.2, but woulduA be for a V7.3, even though (as stated elsewhere) it may well workm unmodified.  -Normh        4 John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> on 05/22/2002 11:03:49 PM  , Please respond to John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>   To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:'8 Subject:    Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?    - On Thu, 23 May 2002, David J. Dachtera wrote:e   > John Santos wrote: > >s1 > > On Wed, 22 May 2002, David J. Dachtera wrote:y > >p > > > Rob Brooks wrote:e > > > >mG > > > > In article <OFF40156AB.E20B313F-ON85256BC0.004833D1@metso.com>,e" norm.raphael@jamesbury.com writes:	 > > > > > ) > > > > >  From the fibre channel slides:y	 > > > > >uK > > > > >  A V7.3-1 TIMA will later provide HSG80 mini-merge capability andn	 that willr0 > > > > >  speed up merge operations quite a bit	 > > > > >eE > > > > > Will this be back-ported to V7.2-2?  (Obviously we have thed classic . > > > > > 3rd-party software provider holdup.) > > > >r* > > > > It will not be backported.  Sorry. > > >u- > > > What would it take to make that happen?p > > >hK > > > What's your price? (Read: "How many more VMS sites are you willing to  > > > sacrifice?") > > >sI > > > Executive types (read "decision makers") tend to take a dim view of  such
 > > > things.  > >eJ > > I tend to take a dim view of software that is so O/S version dependent5 > > that it doesn't work across a simple O/S upgrade.h > >dF > > V7.3 has been out for a year.  Is the 3rd party software known notE > > to work with it, or has it just not been tested?  If so, did theyrF > > test it with V7.2-2 (more recent than V7.3!) or are you making theE > > assumption that if something is qualified with V7.2(-1?), it williH > > work fine with V7.2-x (and with ECO's), but it needs to be re-tested > > for V7.x (x>2)?w >e& > Say, "Food and Drug Administration". >g% > Say, "Department of Public Health".2 >  > Say, "certification".  >j > Are there any questions? >o: > I am currently upgrading a Sunquest Lab machine to theirI > latest-and-greatest: under V7.2-2 on an ES40. V7.3 certification is not*J > expected until circa this time next year. This upgrade I'm working on is< > not expected to go into production until very late summer. >   > Have you completely lost track of the point of this thread, or= would you like to run HSG80's with mini-merge enabled on your / system that requires FDA and DPH certification?   9 If so, would they let pass a drastic change to underlyinge6 stuff like the disk and port drivers and the shadowing6 driver (as listed by Rob Brooks in another followup in6 this thread), merely because the the principal version number didn't change?   5 People who are stuck in the past due to certification,8 requirements probably can't use HSG80's (or HSV110's) or6 ES45's or anything else new...  They're also why prior7 version support exists.  Norm (the OP) clearly isn't ini3 this category, or he wouldn't be asking about doingl mini-merges on HSG80's.     7 BTW, why if your customer (vendor?) needs to recertify,i6 did they choose to do so on V7.2-2 instead of on V7.3,' which was released earlier than V7.2-2?l  7 Is it somehow less work to recertify on a point releaseL! than on a major or minor release?w  4 Maybe VMS should never release a V7.4 (or V8.0), but7 make the next release be V7.2-3 (identical in every wayp1 with V7.3-1, except for the version number stringe1 printed by "show system") and all future versions 5 be both V7.2-x and V7.3-y, where x=y+2, and increases  step without limit?    -- John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 21:29:15 -0400 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)5 Subject: Re: HSG80 Mini-merge, will it be backported?rK Message-ID: <rdeininger-2305022129160001@11cust76.tnt1.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>e  ? In article <OFF3449C80.B32A13E1-ON85256BC2.0066CC96@metso.com>, ! norm.raphael@jamesbury.com wrote:    >Rob,t > I >Thanks for the continuing dialog.  My reason for wanting the backport ise >not becauseL >I as a customer am too conservative to rush to upgrade (although I may be), >butF >because my 3rd-party supplier will not commit to support V7.3*.  That
 >supplier hasaD >not said whether or not this app will run on V7.3* or if there is a >documented reasonH >why it will not run, just that there are no plans to qualify it.  That, >too, may change.a >t >-Norm  F Note that Compaq (oops, HP) has VMS "customer engagement" labs stocked> with VMS systems.  Customers and ISVs can arrange for time forC benchmarking, tuning, and testing their applications.  The labs areyH staffed with folks who do the setup and logistical work.  It is possible+ for customers to do their testing remotely.   I If your supplier needs some support qualifying the product on V7.3*, prod  them to contact the lab folks.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 14:08:28 -0400 # From: "Island" <sales@islandco.com> D Subject: Re: Looking for Digital Serial Number Identication Resource/ Message-ID: <ueqbelree7e3b0@news.supernews.com>    Oops  $ But it is Northern Eire is it not???   DT3 "McEagle" <mlynch@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in messagee7 news:BPtQ7.28597$Ga5.5618182@typhoon.tampabay.rr.com...e > David, > Galway is located in Ireland. 8 > http://www.galway.net/galwayguide/streetmap/ei-map.jpg >p > Mike >p= > "Island Computers" <dbturner@islandco.com> wrote in message0+ > news:u14ikp3v3kdqde@news.supernews.com...>H > > SO what did DEC manufacture in Galway, NOrthern Ireland and what was theirp& > > prefix for product serial numbers? > >d > > DT > >  > >* > >l > >a > > -- > > David Turner > > ! > > We sell Alpha systems & partsh > > http://www.islandco.com, > > sales@islandco.com > > Island Computers US Corp.s > > 2700 Gregory Street  > > Savannah GA 31404e > > Tel: 912 447 6622s > > Fax: 912 201 0096oA > > Hoff Hoffman <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in messagew0 > > news:sIWi7.901$bB1.41939@news.cpqcorp.net...B > > > In article <DKBi7.123$p81.87382@typhoon1.gnilink.net>, "John > Fredrickson"% > > <jafred@bellatlantic.net> writes:s > > >i; > > >   Follow-ups set to comp.os.vms, to try to reduce thep cross-postings...  > > > G > > > :I have yet to get it to display anything. The graphics card is ay Maxtor > > VGA, > > >tJ > > >   You might not get get anything with that widget.  Try removing it. > > >eL > > > :but when I attached the system to a monitor, keyboard, and mouse, the > > unitF > > > :powers up but displays no video. I also tried disconnecting the mouse,J > > > :keyboard, and monitor and connected a VT420 to the serial COM ports > > instead 2 > > > :(9600,N,8,1), but again obtained no output. > > > L > > >   I'd *guess* you are seeing the results of a graphics controller thatL > > >   is not supported by OpenVMS -- each one of these widgets tends to be8 > > >   a just enough different to screw up the drivers. > > >o > > > ..< > > > :When I get a console prompt, I'll learn for about it. > > >2 > > >0, > > >  ---------------------------- #include+ > > <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------e9 > > >       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ --s > www.openvms.compaq.com0 > > >  --------------------------- pure personal' > > opinion ---------------------------n5 > > >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineeringn > > hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com > > >y > >t > >  > >o >t >i   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 13:14:00 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)n+ Subject: Re: Management Agents and Multineta3 Message-ID: <6WIp3sVBDOUP@eisner.encompasserve.org>?  S In article <ach4kh$sv1$1@news.process.com>, "Chuck Viau" <viau@process.com> writes:aG > This looks like something that recently came up last week. The systemtK > manager  did not have the local loopback device LPB0: defined. It must be J > equated with the real interface device name (like EWA0:) and tied to theA > loopback address 127.0.0.1 - Then the Compaq agents came up ok.h > 
 > -Chuck Viaua > Process software >   ; 	Thanks for everyone's help.  The problem was caused by me. ) 	I created a small script to start it up:s   $ ! > $ !  This will have everything to get OpenVMS managment agents $ !  running under Multinet. $ !o+ $ DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXEC MULTINET_SNMP_AGENTX 1 + $ DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXEC MULTINET_INET_PORT 705 , $ DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXEC MULTINET_LOCAL_PORT 705 $ !h! $ MULTINET NETCONTROL SNMP RELOADn $ ! " $ @SYS$SPECIFIC:[WBEM]WBEM$STARTUP $ !t, $ RUN/PROCESS=HR_MIB SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$HR_MIB $ !u  ? 	The above script works.  The line that *was* not there was thegE 	RELOAD.  Since AgentX wasn't defined as true and the listener turnedaD 	on, etc.. that is why the WBEM$CPQ agents died off on reboot.  They! 	try for a time and then give up.h   				Rob-   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 16:46:11 -0700$ From: chuck@parsec.com (Chuck Amend)& Subject: Re: More DECNET help please!!= Message-ID: <69a68ecb.0205231546.41eaab52@posting.google.com>$  A If you get really stuck, please contact me.  We have expertise in E DECnet IV and V (Plus), and provide consulting and training in DECneto= as well as UCX (& TCP/IP for VMS).  My number is 888-472-7732i   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 16:32:31 -0400r- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> Y Subject: Re: off-topic: dubbing (was: RE: "Best" programming language on VMS for newbie?"s, Message-ID: <3CED51DE.A7D82580@videotron.ca>   Phillip Helbig wrote:h > C > > I would like to know in which countries with a sufficient large K > > population dubbing is used. I thought that in Spain dubbing isn't used.y  N Last week, I went to see Star Wars in its original french  with my nephew. TheN Qubec government passed a law a few years ago forcing movie houses to releaseJ french version of their movies essentially at the same time as the englishN version. They don't seem to have any problems releasing the french versions at! the same time as the english one.l  J Usually however, many more theatres will show the english version than theN french one.  had to travel 20km to a theatre that had the french version while, the nearby cinema complex had it in english.  I In the past they would wait until the movie was released in france (which M could be weeks or months later) before bringing the french version to Qubec,oI at which time the movie was old news here. This law has given the dubbingmM companies in montreal a lot of business since they get to dub the movie firsteM and their version is often used when the movie is finally released in france.p    I The more interesting form of dubbing I saw was a McCain "Pizza Pocket" TVoI advert which had been made in canada. But when shown in Australia, it wasw? "dubbed" in australian english to make it look like a local ad.w   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 20:11:41 -07000 From: Nancy.Fink@COMTEKServices.com (Nancy Fink) Subject: Re: OpenVMS SNMP TRAP= Message-ID: <98c5c7ad.0205231911.1ebc32b7@posting.google.com>e  C The SNMP authentication failure trap is only sent if the SNMP agenteD receives a message that doesn't have a valid community string and/orF IP address, so loading a patch or new version of TCP/IP Services won't0 get you traps when a user's login attempt fails.  D If you are looking for a way to send Security related OPCOM messages@ as SNMP traps, you can write your own subagent to do this (not aC trivial matter) or you may want to look at COMTEK's OPCOM subagent,t which does this and more:   5            http://www.comtekservices.com/nmopcom.htm.C  
 Nancy Fink COMTEK Services'   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 21:16:46 -0400n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ( Subject: Replacing ALL-IN-1 applications, Message-ID: <3CED947B.26BD5E79@videotron.ca>  K Ok, forget menus and word processing. I use ALL-IN-1 for its scripting, itsR@ text generation, as well as accessing indexed files through FMS.   Indexed files though FMS:EN The fields of an FMS form are mapped to an RMS file. The named data of the FMSM file contains ALL-IN-1 functions to define the filename, validation of fieldshM etc etc. ALL-IN-1 provides option to create, delete, edit, view, copy, deleteoK records. There are also index forms (scrolled regions in FMS) where you canuL browse a dataset's records and pointing at a record, you can then edit, view etc etc.  	 ScriptingeF ALL-IN-1 provide perl-like scripting, which includes ability to accessM individual fields of an RMS file and process only selected records that matchs a certain selction (for instance:) 	FOR CUSTOMERS with .province = "QC" do -C; 	merge_line  <.custno> <.first> <.last> <.city> <.province>      Boilerplate documentskK One can have a  file with a text layout and with "<variable name>" and whentL you merge it, it automatically replaces the variables in the file as well as execute other directives.   J There are also plenty of built-in datasets, such as access to UAF records, queue information etc etc.  M It also has a feature where symbols that begin with a $ are permanent symbols(@ for your user and are stored in an indexed file in your account.   ------------------------  H I have applications on A1 that range from accounting/invoice generation,F keeping track of all my bike trips, keeping GPS waypoints and had evenM developed a symposium management system that kept trtack of sessions, had theoH scheduling logic (no scheduling conflicts etc etc) and generated all theI various documents such as the sessions-at-a-glance, schedules for all the K sessions chairsm including bios of speakers etc etc. I also had associationeM management software to keep track of members, generate the membership roster,aR send out invoices (by email to those capable of, and paper mail to others etc etc)  J Of course, because all of this is integrated with A1's email capabilities,9 emailing documents generated for each user is very simple  --------------------------  I What solutions would you recommend to replace the above functionalities ?,  H Is Perl something that will dispear if I choose to go with it ? Is there something better ?J What about the interactive use such as the FMS forms mapped to the indexedK file ? Is there something simple that exists to replace that (and that Perl : could interface to to get the list and position of fields)  M I know that FMS is being ported to IA64. But unless they make it open source,lM it won't spread to Unix. What about DECforms, is that something also bound to G disapear or is that something that has the potential to spread to othern platforms ?t  L So what sort of technologies are going to replace what ALL-IN-1 did for me ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 17:42:43 -0500uC From: "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com>o Subject: SHOW LOGICAL bug?H Message-ID: <craig.berry-B9EA98.17424323052002@news.directvinternet.com>  M Why, when I create a logical name where the logical name and the equivalence  N name are the same (though they may differ by case), does show logical show me M the translation 10 times?  Other mechanisms for translating the logical name t only see it once.  o  L OpenVMS Alpha 7.3, patch history below (though it looks like the same thing H happens on 7.1).  It appears to be indifferent which table and mode are P involved.  As far as I know the only damage this is doing is confusing the heck M out of me, but if there's a loop condition that's not being checked properly t1 then who knows what else might go wrong in there.t   $ show logical foo3 %SHOW-S-NOTRAN, no translation for logical name FOOl $ define foo foo $ show logical/full foos,    "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 1  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 2  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 3  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 4  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 5  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 6  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 7  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 8  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE), 9  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE) $ perl -e "print $ENV{FOO};" FOOi" $ write sys$output f$trnlnm("FOO") FOOv2 $ write sys$output f$trnlnm("FOO",,,,,"MAX_INDEX") 02 $u     $ product show hist vms*P ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------------I PRODUCT                             KIT TYPE    OPERATION   DATE AND TIMESP ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------------P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_ACRTL V2.0         Patch       Install     23-MAR-2002 16:00:57P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_FIBRE_SCSI V2.0    Patch       Install     17-MAR-2002 22:39:17P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_DW_MOT_MUP V1.0    Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002 14:10:10P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_LIBRTL V2.0        Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002 14:10:10P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_RMS V2.0           Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002 14:10:10P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_SYS V3.0           Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002 14:10:10P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_DW_MOT_MUP V1.0    Patch       Install     10-FEB-2002 16:18:42P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_CLUSTER V2.0       Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002 17:25:05P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_DCL V1.0           Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002 17:25:05P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_SHADOWING V2.0     Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002 17:25:05P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_UPDATE V1.0        Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002 17:15:54P DEC AXPVMS VMS V7.3                 Oper System Install     27-JAN-2002 20:58:16P ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------------   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 23:24:01 GMT 0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com> Subject: Re: SHOW LOGICAL bug?@ Message-ID: <lSeH8.170674$o66.505392@news-server.bigpond.net.au>  G The OpenVMS User's Manual, describes iterative translation.  The systempH limits the number of iterative levels to at least nine, depending on the	 facility.-   Matt.t   --= -------------------------------------------------------------a OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Company  Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA"= -------------------------------------------------------------i    F "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com> wrote inJ message news:craig.berry-B9EA98.17424323052002@news.directvinternet.com...B > Why, when I create a logical name where the logical name and the equivalencerL > name are the same (though they may differ by case), does show logical show meI > the translation 10 times?  Other mechanisms for translating the logicalt name > only see it once.r >iG > OpenVMS Alpha 7.3, patch history below (though it looks like the samet thingeI > happens on 7.1).  It appears to be indifferent which table and mode arekL > involved.  As far as I know the only damage this is doing is confusing the heckE > out of me, but if there's a loop condition that's not being checkedc properly3 > then who knows what else might go wrong in there.r >S > $ show logical foo5 > %SHOW-S-NOTRAN, no translation for logical name FOO  > $ define foo foo > $ show logical/full foo,. >    "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 1  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 2  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 3  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 4  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 5  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 6  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 7  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 8  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE). > 9  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE) > $ perl -e "print $ENV{FOO};" > FOOl$ > $ write sys$output f$trnlnm("FOO") > FOO,4 > $ write sys$output f$trnlnm("FOO",,,,,"MAX_INDEX") > 0o > $n >  >v > $ product show hist vms*L > ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- -------------- ------K > PRODUCT                             KIT TYPE    OPERATION   DATE AND TIMEHL > ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- -------------- ------I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_ACRTL V2.0         Patch       Install     23-MAR-2002B 16:00:57I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_FIBRE_SCSI V2.0    Patch       Install     17-MAR-2002o 22:39:17I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_DW_MOT_MUP V1.0    Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002  14:10:10I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_LIBRTL V2.0        Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002e 14:10:10I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_RMS V2.0           Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002s 14:10:10I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_SYS V3.0           Patch       Install     24-FEB-2002w 14:10:10I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_DW_MOT_MUP V1.0    Patch       Install     10-FEB-2002n 16:18:42I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_CLUSTER V2.0       Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002o 17:25:05I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_DCL V1.0           Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002u 17:25:05I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_SHADOWING V2.0     Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002e 17:25:05I > DEC AXPVMS VMS73_UPDATE V1.0        Patch       Install     28-JAN-2002  17:15:54I > DEC AXPVMS VMS V7.3                 Oper System Install     27-JAN-2002t 20:58:16L > ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- -------------- ------   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 20:27:57 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>D Subject: Re: SHOW LOGICAL bug?, Message-ID: <3CED890C.8A63A835@videotron.ca>   "Craig A. Berry" wrote:m > N > Why, when I create a logical name where the logical name and the equivalenceO > name are the same (though they may differ by case), does show logical show meeN > the translation 10 times?  Other mechanisms for translating the logical name > only see it once.e   If you 0& $DEFINE/TRANSLATION=(TERMINAL) FOO FOO  6 then SHOW LOG FOO will only show its equivalence once.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 21:43:25 -0500dC From: "Craig A. Berry" <craig.berry@nospam.SignalTreeSolutions.com>  Subject: Re: SHOW LOGICAL bug?H Message-ID: <craig.berry-7BB7D2.21432523052002@news.directvinternet.com>  @ In article <lSeH8.170674$o66.505392@news-server.bigpond.net.au>,2  "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com> wrote:  I > The OpenVMS User's Manual, describes iterative translation.  The systembJ > limits the number of iterative levels to at least nine, depending on the > facility.,  7 Thanks for the reply; the section you refer to is here:s  I <http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/73final/6489/6489pro_031.html#index_x_s 1210>n  - OK, so you're telling me that because we needs   FOO -> BAR -> BAZ -> myfile.dat    to work, and perhaps even    FOO -> Foo -> foo -> myfile.dati  . that we can't stop ourselves in the middle of    FOO -> FOO -> FOO -> FOO -> ...   aE and realize we are no longer iterating but are in fact just stuck in l
 one place?  E Surely if we're looping over sys$trnlnm and the search list index is d3 the same as in the previous pass (or LNM$_MAX_INDEXaG returns -1, meaning no search list) and the logical name itself is the 'H same as in the previous pass (the definition of which varies by whether E the flags contain LNM$M_CASE_BLIND) then we can tell if we're really  & iterating or just spinning our wheels.  D In any case, if SHOW LOGICAL were really exiting because it hit the E maximum number of iterations, shouldn't it exit with SS$_TOOMANYLNAM?-  H I admit this is more interesting than I originally thought, but I still H don't quite see that looping 10 times as though iterating when there is > in fact only one logical name is really the right thing to do.   > > $ define foo foo > > $ show logical/full foof0 > >    "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 1  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 2  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 3  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 4  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 5  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 6  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 7  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 8  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)0 > > 9  "FOO" [super] = "FOO" (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)   ------------------------------    Date: 24 May 2002 08:01:48 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>& Subject: Re: Some DECNET help please!!- Message-ID: <87d6vmh0r7.fsf@prep.synonet.com>u  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:r   > Bill Gunshannon wrote:  > > > But, if I try to "SET HOST" from the VAX to the PDP I get:A > > %SYSTEM-F-NOSUCHOBJ, network object is unknown at remote node   " No Cterm, but it should have RTPAD  IB > MC NCK SHOW KNOWN OBJECTS on a VAX reveals that there is a CTERM > object created by REMACP.S  /B > I would therefore assume that when you do a SET HOST to a remoteF > note, it tries to connect to a "CTERM" object If that object doesn't: > exist on the remote note, it would explain your message.  F CTERM - CTERM, OK, RTPAD - RTPAD, ok, RTPAD - CTERM, VMS falls back to RTPAD automajikly.  C HELP hints that SET HOST/APPLication_protocol=RTPAD rsts11 might ben a winning mix.  A Thanks to JF for jaring the memorys of a VERY old bug report. RSX- had a simular problem.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.5@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 22:51:51 +0100-# From: R <haxxxby_rem2x@vizzavi.net>0, Subject: Re: Terminal Services on VMS client@ Message-ID: <LvdH8.2607$4N.567349@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com>   Michiel Erens wrote:   > F > I don't know if it helps, but there are at least two RDP clients for? > several Unix/X windows flavours. I guess that porting them to . > OpenVMS shouldn't be too much of a problem : >  >  http://www.rdesktop.org/ + >  http://sourceforge.net/projects/rdesktops* >  http://www.ccm.ece.vt.edu/~lscharf/rdp/ >   H I'm working with Nick on this, and have had some success in starting to B port rdesktop to VAX/VMS.  (works, show display ok, with some workE still to do with keymapping).  One problem is the select  operation, eL which is not behaving in the way I would expect.  The main loop uses this to wait before doing anything.l  A There are two sockets, one a TCP/IP one and the other an X windowo> connection number, which are being put into the select.  First7 seems to work, the second never seems to say its ready.   > If someone has an real example (apart from the example in the - VAX C manual) that works please let me know. n  4 Can anyone confirm that the value returned from an XB ConnectionNumber(display) call is the same as a socket descriptor.   (VAX VMS 6.1).   Roger Haxbyo   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 21:02:35 +0200s From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> Subject: Re: USB on OpenVMSw& Message-ID: <3CED3CCB.3060104@home.nl>   A small update on this matter:  D The Lucent USS344 chip is also known or rebranded as Agere USS344S .I Another company that produces a interface card with this chip is Vivanco M
 from Germany.1 http://www.vivanco.com  G Partnumber of the card is KWE 580W. I just bought one, now I'm waiting D for my VMS 7.3-1 CD-Rom :-)b   Regards,   Dirk   Forrest Kenney wrote:t  E >    The history of USB and OpenVMS where it has been and where it is , >going.  There has been an ongoing effort toI >get USB into OpenVMS.  The original plan was to support it with the DS10 ( >ES40 platform.  As part of this work weF >built and for a limited time supplied a USB kit for a V7.2 code base.1 >This code was also demonstrated at the San DecustI >in 1999.  At that time the plan was to ship full support for USB as part , >of V7.3.  But plans changed for a number of& >reasons and the work was put on hold. >mK >    When it was obvious that some of the new  platforms would not have anya' >of the legacy ISA I/O devices work wasmJ >restarted and the code was dug out of mothballs.  We recently finished up) >all the work that we know of to make USBdA >viable on these new platforms.  Officially only the embedded USBf1 >controllers on these platforms are supported and H >only for keyboards and mice.  All of the supported code is checked into- >the version that is presently in field test.T >nI >    In addition support for keyboards, mice, we are shipping drivers form- >printers and cables that conform the the USBvG >printer standard.  We also have support for modems that conform to thea. >communications class standard.  These are notI >going to be listed as supported because we did not have the resources tot2 >test and qualify devices for this relase.  PleaseH >feel free to use them and report problems but don't be surprised if you. >get a these are not supported answer from the >support organizations.i >e/ >    What is not supported at the present time:i > : >              1) UHCI controllers, or USB 2.0 controllersH >              2) Any random OHCI based controllers.  We have tested and% >had good luck with ones based on thedK >                  Lucent USS344 chip and Symbios 6080.  We have tried somew' >other with varying degrees of success.r* >              3) Customer written drivers >  >Forrest Kenneyo >OpenVMS USB project leadert >  >t   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2002 11:31:45 -0700! From: pyeargi@yahoo.com (Peter Y)d( Subject: VMS Clusters with FDDI/Ethernet= Message-ID: <15a86a22.0205231031.1bbc0512@posting.google.com>f  A Alright...I have a situation on my hands and I'm looking for somesF advice on where to proceed.  I have a VMS cluster currently configuredC with three local bootnodes attached to an HSJ via CI.  They are allhD networked via gig-E to a Cisco 6509 Switch.  I also have a satellite@ that I am attempting to boot into the cluster.  The satellite isE running FDDI and is attached to a DECHUB 900 Multiswitch.  The DECHUBaC is attached to a DEC Multiswitch 700 which converts FDDI to GigabittC Ethernet.  In this configure, the satellite boots with no problems.   @ However, when I add a VNSwitch900 FX module to the DECHUB900 and= connect its Fast ethernet uplink to the Cisco switch, therebye@ bypassing the MS700, the satellite will not boot.  The satelliteE receives its operating system just fine as it did before, but when itPE goes out to look for its disk partition, it hangs indefinitely.  If Io? disconnect the Fast ethernet and reconnect the FDDI, the systemf- finishes coming up.  Anyone offer any advice?e   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 17:51:21 GMT * From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com>- Subject: Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?u5 Message-ID: <230520021345546880%paul.anderson@hp.com>i  5 In article <3CEAC982.A4CE44A5@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei % <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:t   > Paul Anderson wrote:3 > > DCPS does not provide the communications layer.a > O > But if VMS gains USB communications, wouldn't DCPS have to be equipped with aaP > shareable image used by the symbiont to send/receive data to the printer ? (jnD > the same way that it has shareable images to serial, appletalk etc > communications).   Yes.  ? > > Correct.  Printer information is hardcoded in the symbiont.h > O > I realise that in the good old days of proprietary Digital, having it embeded M > in the symbion't code was good because you could ensure that it worked onlymH > with Digital printers, and I guess this is how DCPS has its roots now. > K > But these days, shouldn't DCPS have a very vanilla symbiont with seperate.2 > support files/library modules for each printer ? > M > If you used PPDs with, say a logical  for a queue pointing to the PPD file,cP > not only could DCPS use the PPD to find out how to set paper tray etc etc, butM > also this logical could then be used by applications when they generate theO > postscript for a queue.f  G Your suggestions are good ones, and they have been discussed at various[G times.  Although there are no current plans to read PPD files directly,_4 such a capability is permanently on the "wish list".  M > Not that the Adobe Postscript printer driver on the MAC is capable of smartSN > interaction with any printer with a valid PPD. So this should technically beP > possible on VMS as well, unless, of course, VMS is inferior to the MAC :-) :-)	 > :-) :-)(  E This interaction is indeed done on the Mac via PostScript queries for-B AppleTalk queues.  You don't have to go in later and describe whatG options the printer has like you do in Windows.  LPR, however, being asc= dumb on Macs as it is everywhere else, doesn't work this way.-  G Asking the printer about its capabilities via PostScript over IP is not G reliable, as many printers do not have a bi-directional IP stack.  Such-E queries could be better handled by SNMP or the emerging IPP (Internet  Printing Protocol).n  O > The main advantage of DCPS supporting PPDs would be that it would require fartM > less work at your end to add supported printers since manufacturers of realn> > postscript printers will provide PPD files with the printer.  D Correct, although as you noted, DCPS is not designed this way and it3 would require a good amount of effort to change it.1   Paul   -- S  Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineeringn   Hewlett-Packard Company:   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 20:49:48 +0200  From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>- Subject: Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?0& Message-ID: <3CED39CC.9060708@home.nl>   Paul Anderson wrote:  6 >In article <3CEAC982.A4CE44A5@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei& ><jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote: >  >>Paul Anderson wrote: >>2 >>>DCPS does not provide the communications layer. >>>1O >>But if VMS gains USB communications, wouldn't DCPS have to be equipped with a5P >>shareable image used by the symbiont to send/receive data to the printer ? (jnD >>the same way that it has shareable images to serial, appletalk etc >>communications). >> >r >Yes.M >.> >>>Correct.  Printer information is hardcoded in the symbiont. >>>8O >>I realise that in the good old days of proprietary Digital, having it embededrM >>in the symbion't code was good because you could ensure that it worked only H >>with Digital printers, and I guess this is how DCPS has its roots now. >>K >>But these days, shouldn't DCPS have a very vanilla symbiont with seperate 2 >>support files/library modules for each printer ? >>M >>If you used PPDs with, say a logical  for a queue pointing to the PPD file,-P >>not only could DCPS use the PPD to find out how to set paper tray etc etc, butM >>also this logical could then be used by applications when they generate theh >>postscript for a queue.n >> >rH >Your suggestions are good ones, and they have been discussed at variousH >times.  Although there are no current plans to read PPD files directly,5 >such a capability is permanently on the "wish list".e > M >>Not that the Adobe Postscript printer driver on the MAC is capable of smartkN >>interaction with any printer with a valid PPD. So this should technically beP >>possible on VMS as well, unless, of course, VMS is inferior to the MAC :-) :-)	 >>:-) :-)g >> >eF >This interaction is indeed done on the Mac via PostScript queries forC >AppleTalk queues.  You don't have to go in later and describe whatSH >options the printer has like you do in Windows.  LPR, however, being as> >dumb on Macs as it is everywhere else, doesn't work this way. >uH >Asking the printer about its capabilities via PostScript over IP is notH >reliable, as many printers do not have a bi-directional IP stack.  SuchF >queries could be better handled by SNMP or the emerging IPP (Internet >Printing Protocol). >=I I'm not completely familiar with the Postscript level 3 standard, but if  C I'm not mistaken it also comprises the presence of a web interface "G (=server) on the printer.  I can't imagine that these kind of printers  * would not have a bi-directional IP stack .     >y >uO >>The main advantage of DCPS supporting PPDs would be that it would require far)M >>less work at your end to add supported printers since manufacturers of real-> >>postscript printers will provide PPD files with the printer. >> > E >Correct, although as you noted, DCPS is not designed this way and it-4 >would require a good amount of effort to change it. >- >Paul- >-   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 20:09:52 GMTR* From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com>- Subject: Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?o5 Message-ID: <230520021604255603%paul.anderson@hp.com>   F In article <3CED39CC.9060708@home.nl>, Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote:  K > I'm not completely familiar with the Postscript level 3 standard, but if .E > I'm not mistaken it also comprises the presence of a web interface SI > (=server) on the printer.  I can't imagine that these kind of printers  , > would not have a bi-directional IP stack .  B That's a good point, so let me clarify.  (I don't know that it's aE PostScript standard that requires a Web interface, but certainly most3 printers today have one.)   E Since DCPS conducts a conversation in PostScript on the port used for G printing (9100 for example) it expects to hear back from the printer onDG that port.  Printers that do not talk back on that port, or return onlyVA some information, often do have a fully functional, and obviously0 bi-directional, Web page.-  A So, DCPS needs a bi-directional IP stack as well as a printer and-B network card that return all requested information on the printing port.m   Paul   -- e  Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineering:   Hewlett-Packard Company-   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 16:55:38 -0400,- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> - Subject: Re: What is the exact role of DCPS ?t, Message-ID: <3CED5748.1E6CF5EB@videotron.ca>   Paul Anderson wrote:G > This interaction is indeed done on the Mac via PostScript queries fornD > AppleTalk queues.  You don't have to go in later and describe whatI > options the printer has like you do in Windows.  LPR, however, being as-? > dumb on Macs as it is everywhere else, doesn't work this way.C  E The way I use LRP on my MAC is to use the ADOBE print driver, setup a:K "virtual" printer simply plrints to a file instead of attempting to talk totI the printer. Then I use one of the very few LPR applications available toe* spool the generated postscript to the vax.  N I used to have the printer directly connected to the appletalk port, but I gotL very tired of switching appeltalk from the printer port to the ethernet port and back and forth.,   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 18:28:35 +0100.U From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> ' Subject: Re: Which Unix for VMS users ?>0 Message-ID: <acj8s5$rvr$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Nic Clews wrote:  * > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >  > 7 >>One reason for this is that Linux does not scale mucha5 >>beyond 4 CPU's though peoples mileage may vary. Thet! >>Regatta boxes support 32 CPU's.e >>< >>So in this sense IBMs Linux strategy makes more sense even* >>if the execution details make it horrid. >> > G > I am led to believe that IBM are working on the SMP scaling of linux,eH > yes they appreciate it fairs badly in SMP systems, although 'clusters' > like Rockhopper fare better. >  > 9 >>Port Linux to z900's hosted under VM and try to sell iti7 >>as a consolidation for lots of Linux instances, dittoy7 >>for OS400. Use this to host horizontally scaling appss >>like web farms, proxies etc. >>6 >>Use MVS OS400 and AIX for the big vertically scaling4 >>servers (SMP) that have to host the DBMS backends. >> > I > This is pretty much their strategy. Have you seen the presentations, ora' > was it a really good guess / deduced?e >      I have seen the presentations.     regards[   Andrew Harrison$   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 16:49:24 -0400O- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>"' Subject: Re: Which Unix for VMS users ? , Message-ID: <3CED55D2.F236E611@videotron.ca>  ( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:= > The only possible use for it would be if you happen to have 9 > spare capacity and cannot be bothered to buy a Sun or a[< > x86 box so that your admins/developers can get access to a > UNIX like environment.    N What about if you have a VM based 360 running mostly MVS, but want to allocate+ one partition to Linux to run new programs.m  N Another potential use that has not been mentioned is perhaps educational. Give4 each student his own Linux running on the mainframe.  I Years ago, McGill University had developed MUSIC which was a low cost andeK highly efficient OS that ran on top of VMS and was used to provide studentsCM with computer access on 3270 terminals (as well as dial-up). It could supportsM 149 users on a 4341 with 8 meg of RAM. (we know when it hit 150 that it woulds go down :-)n  N I could see them dump Music and install a whole bunch of Linux machines on the IBM mainframes.n   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 20:13:03 GMT . From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)' Subject: Re: Which Unix for VMS users ?P3 Message-ID: <j3cH8.47457$ze7.512505@news.chello.at>1  d In article <DI5H8.7$xB2.19@news-srv1.fmr.com>, sy18889@rabbit.fmr.com (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:M >One other reason could be that some folks are just beginning to learn how tonO >spell and pronounce "Linux" (note IBM's "mainstream" ads - still can't get the  >proper pronunciation!)  >WF >Now you want to go and ask these same people to spell/prononce BSD???  2 The M$ weenies ? "Blue Screen of Death" naturally.   SCNR   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER-% Network and OpenVMS system specialist0 E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atP A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMS Job(s)   ------------------------------    Date: 24 May 2002 08:27:27 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: Which Unix for VMS users ?n- Message-ID: <878z6agzkg.fsf@prep.synonet.com>m  / JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes::   > Bill Gunshannon wrote:? > > Why do oyu find Linux on S390 to be a "truly awfull idea"??w  
 see below.  ~E > It is just strange to imagine Linux on 3270 terminals, SNA network,c > operator consoles etc.  eE > What sort of user interface is Linux capable on when running on IBM D > mainframe ? IS it capable of ethernet and supporting X terminals ?E > Has IBM ever been able to support full duplex serial communicationst > on its mainframes ?l  D IBM Federal Systems Division have been doing this stuff for decades.F The scary bit is someone outside the US gov getting ASCII on their IBM  rD > It is a bit like MVS supporting stuff such as FTP. You wonder whatD > sort of hack they had to do to allow on-the-fly file creation withA > correct dataset attributes to make the file usable on MVS. (foro > instance a text file).  B Many zillion instances of Linux on a single box is a good solutionD for, for instance, web hosting with a low to moderate page hit rate.B You can give each customer full access to `their' system and avoidE all sorts of political etc problems that you would have with a sharedoC system. Plus, unless you are running VMS, MVS or AS400, you can notsG give the customers `full' access to only their part of a shared system.s  B It is a good solution to a problem that should never have existed.   -- h< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.e@                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.285 ************************