1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 26 Nov 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 654       Contents: Re: allocating from P1 Re: allocating from P1 Carly on Newsnight, Re: Configure XPDF helper in Netscape 3.03??, Re: Configure XPDF helper in Netscape 3.03?? Re: Database for VMS, Re: Directory and Copy with un-expired filesP Re: Exam 010-627 (HSx80 Solutions for OpenVMS): read this beforeyouwrite  it you Re: Galaxy and ES47 vs ES80....  Re: Galaxy and ES47 vs ES80....  Re: Galaxy and ES47 vs ES80.... P How to discover what is waiting a process WAS:Re: SMTP non working after upgrade) Re: Independent Consultants + OpenVMS.org ) Re: Independent Consultants + OpenVMS.org 8 Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha8 Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha8 Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha8 Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha6 RE: Jumper settings for TZ87 in StorageWorks enclosure Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping RE: OT: Hamburger Flipping Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping RE: OT: Hamburger Flipping% Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance % Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance % Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance % Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance @ Re: Problem with HSZ50 (access to the CLI from the console port) Re: Recursive Deletion Re: Recursive Deletion# Re: Removing phantom TCPIP services # Re: Removing phantom TCPIP services # Re: SMTP non working after upgrade. # Re: SMTP non working after upgrade.  Suggestions for Removing LAT  Re: Suggestions for Removing LAT  Re: Suggestions for Removing LAT' RE: System uptime - The Uptimes Project  TIFF processing on VMS?   Re: Weak $DELPRC and mighty AMDS  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 12:29:08 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: allocating from P1 0 Message-ID: <00A178A5.FA4CBD34@SendSpamHere.ORG>  q In article <477e0934.0211251716.6ec2d2ba@posting.google.com>, usenet_vms@lehrerfamily.com (Joshua Lehrer) writes: Y >VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A17803.D5110413@SendSpamHere.ORG>...  > $ >> >1- how do I allocate an NA page?I >> >2- how do I allocate a page at the bottom of the stack?  Do I do what H >> >you suggest, use the linker option to start with a reasonable stack,0 >> >then allocate 1 page from P1 and mark it NA? >>   >> Sounds like a plan. > G >But you still haven't told me how to mark the page as NA?  I thought I D >could create the page in a more priv. mode than myself, then get anF >accvio with each access, but sys$expreg doesn't let you create a page >in a more privs. mode.  > G >So, what I settled on was creating on global page in P1, right up next G >to the stack, and never using it, thus allowing my stack some space to  >grow.   SYS$SETPRT doesn't work?    F >Also, I can not find any linker option that lets me control the stack >size.  Here are all of them:  > 8 > /ALPHA     /BPAGE     /BRIEF     /CONTIGUOUS          < >/CROSS_REFERENCE      /DEBUG     /DEMAND_ZERO          /DSFD >  /EXECUTABLE           /FULL      /GST       /HEADER    /INCLUDE  9 >/INFORMATIONALS       /LIBRARY   /MAP       /NATIVE_ONLY D >  /OPTIONS   /P0IMAGE   /PROTECT   /REPLACE   /SECTION_BINDING     / >/SELECTIVE_SEARCH     /SHAREABLE /SYMBOL_TABLE D >  /SYSEXE    /SYSLIB    /SYSSHR    /SYSTEM    /THREADS_ENABLE      & >/TRACEBACK /USERLIBRARY          /VAX   /OPTIONS   STACK=   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:30:48 GMT + From: Ryan Moore <rmoore@rmoore.dyndns.org>  Subject: Re: allocating from P1 < Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.50.0211252228450.1725-100000@jaipur>  ) On Mon, 25 Nov 2002, Joshua Lehrer wrote: Z > VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A17803.D5110413@SendSpamHere.ORG>... > % > > >1- how do I allocate an NA page? J > > >2- how do I allocate a page at the bottom of the stack?  Do I do whatI > > >you suggest, use the linker option to start with a reasonable stack, 1 > > >then allocate 1 page from P1 and mark it NA?  > >  > > Sounds like a plan.  > H > But you still haven't told me how to mark the page as NA?  I thought IE > could create the page in a more priv. mode than myself, then get an G > accvio with each access, but sys$expreg doesn't let you create a page  > in a more privs. mode.    I Allocate the page(s).  When you allocate it, you should know the address.   F Use the sys$setprt() system service to change the memory protection on
 memory pages.    -Ryan    ------------------------------    Date: 26 Nov 2002 07:29:24 -0600B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) Subject: Carly on Newsnight 3 Message-ID: <PR$gPlbU9Jlm@eisner.encompasserve.org>   A Carly was on Newsnight (a UK news analysis programme) last night.   @ Here's an online (Real Player) URL in case anyone is interested:  N http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/video/38512000/rm/_38512639_fiorina22_mason_vi.ram  + Nothing unique, just the usual bland stuff.   D Something caught my attention however: Why is she so focused on onlyF promoting cost savings when discussing how the merger is going instead: of also talking about technology integration/development ?  K Combined with other interviews that I've seen/read, it seems as if the only H thing that matters is cost cutting, cutting, cutting. That just feels soF short term. What happened to the part of the CEO's job that focuses on5 developing the products/technologies for the future ?    Simon.   --  B Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       & "This is VMS. Viruses are irrelevant."   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:44:15 GMT . From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)5 Subject: Re: Configure XPDF helper in Netscape 3.03?? 4 Message-ID: <j8JE9.102477$up.1109172@news.chello.at>  N In article <3de2ac10$1@nubby2.>, "Mike Scott" <mscott_NOSPAM@axys.com> writes:M >I have installed and configured XPDF on my system (OVMS 7.3).  It works fine H >as a stand-alone app.  I have tried to make it work as a "Helper" underM >Netscape 3.03 and can't get it to go.  I've tried: quotes, no quotes, %s, no K >%s, and any other tips I've found on the net.  Has anyone been able to get F >Netscape to properly display .PDF files using this Helper mechanism??  9 I had it working with NETSCAPE V3 with %s without quotes. 6 I didn't manage to get it working with MOZILLA so far.H That reminds me, that I had to do some more testing in this area soon...   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 12:35:21 GMT ' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com> 5 Subject: Re: Configure XPDF helper in Netscape 3.03?? , Message-ID: <3DE36A89.6090505@theblakes.com>   Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:  : >I had it working with NETSCAPE V3 with %s without quotes.7 >I didn't manage to get it working with MOZILLA so far. I >That reminds me, that I had to do some more testing in this area soon...  > I Please open a bug report (http://bugzilla.mozilla.org) if the directions  ) in the release notes are not up to snuff:   P http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/mozilla_relnotes.html#plugins   Colin.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 09:24:12 +0100 6 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jean=2DFran=E7ois=20PI=C9RONNE?=  Subject: Re: Database for VMS + Message-ID: <3DE32FAC.8E639154@laposte.net>    > O > Borland open sourced its Interbase a few years ago. I ported the last version P > (4.0) circa 97, but that was before it was open sourced. Interbase is a big dbL > with a small footprint. It supports all the standard stuff: client/server,# > triggers, sql precomps, etc, etc. R > As was metioned in the PostgreSQL message, fork was one of the biggest issues. IN > had to work around it. Actually, the biggest issue for me was making all the% > various QA scripts work as on Unix. Q > Interesting thing is Interbase, like Oracle, was first written using VMS as the  > base platform!P > There is a ng (borland.public.interbase.opensource) if anyone wants to take on > this for free.R > Also, Ann Harrison (an old vms'er) has a website (http://www.ibphoenix.com) with8 > all the info on other platforms that have been ported. >  >     C A very interesting project based on Interbase is the SGBD Firebird:   http://firebird.sourceforge.net/  P It probably would not be very difficult to port this database system to OpenVMS.  N In fact, we have choose to port MySQL instead of firebird because MySQL is the widely deploy system. 9 But I had preferred to port firebird, may be next year...   O We have made the first run of our port of MySQL server on OpenVMS, we were able / to create a database, table, insert, select,... M So, if there is some interest, we can release for testing purpose a beta kit.     
 Jean-Franois    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 22:25:55 +0100 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> 5 Subject: Re: Directory and Copy with un-expired files ' Message-ID: <3DE29563.56A4DE13@aaa.com>    In DFU you can do :    $ DFU SEARCH /EXPIRED=NONE  ( (SEARCH in DFU is much like DIR in DCL.)     DFU> help search /expired    DFU      SEARCH       /EXPIRED        /EXPIRED=keyword(=value)   <        This qualifier is used in combination with 3 possible4        keywords BEFORE=date, SINCE=date or NONE. The:        expiration date is used in for selecting files. You8        can either use SINCE and BEFORE or NONE , but not9        both. The NONE keyword gives you files which don't 2        have a expiration date recorded. Examples :          o  /EXPIRED=BEFORE=date2        o  /EXPIRED=(BEFORE=date,SINCE=anotherdate)        o  /EXPIRED=NONE     3 Let DFU output a list on file and use that for (2).    Jan-Erik Sderholm.    Dennis Baker wrote:  >  > How do you > < > (1) get a directory of all files with no expiration dates?) > (2) copy files with no expiration date?  >    ------------------------------    Date: 26 Nov 2002 00:31:56 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>Y Subject: Re: Exam 010-627 (HSx80 Solutions for OpenVMS): read this beforeyouwrite  it you - Message-ID: <87d6otehkz.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   2 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> writes:   > "David J. Dachtera" wrote:  A > > From what I've read elsewhere, the current greatest hurdle is ; > > getting teh HP-ers to distinguish between "OpenVMS" and  > > "OpenView".    F > One more reason to remove the unwanted "open" from VMS and return to, > VMS' real name, the one used by customers.  # And the answer to the next idea is, 5 "No, because then people will confuse View with Vue."    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 26 Nov 2002 07:14:49 GMT- From: djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall) ( Subject: Re: Galaxy and ES47 vs ES80....5 Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-tC3svHs7EMNT@localhost>   A On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 23:36:50 UTC, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob  
 Young) wrote:   e > In article <3DE2A0B2.29202300@aaa.com>, Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> writes: A > > Hm, from the PPT file, it isn't clear if it's the GCM client, 1 > > the GCM server or both that will run on IA64.  > > @ > > It *could* be that you can use a IA64 GCM *client* to manage5 > > an Alpha GCM *server* on a Alpha Galaxy server...  > >  > 5 > 	Could be.  But that certainly wouldn't make sense.  > 	Besides:  > Z > http://h18003.www1.hp.com/hps/ipf-enterprise/download/OpenVMS_clusters_to_Itanium_WP.pdf > 0 > 	OpenVMS Clusters move to Itanium Architecture > J > Subsequent production releases Larger configurations. Support for GalaxyL > configurations. Support for FDDI and ATM for cluster (SCS) communications.I > Possibility of support for VAX systems, based on customer requirements.  > D > 	Now maybe you would care to read "client" into that.  I doubt it. > 2 > 	Things that won't be coming to Itanium include: > Q > OpenVMS Cluster software supports three proprietary interconnects that will not E > be ported: DSSI (DIGITAL Systems Storage Interconnect), CI (Cluster $ > Interconnect), and Memory Channel. > # > 	I don't see Galaxy in that list.   D Maybe Rob but the above just infers where VMS Clustering is/will be F supported. I don't read it as being a statement about Galaxy features A being included on VMS/IPF. That's why VAXen get a mention. Funny  : though, I thought clustering already worked on VMS/Vax :-)   Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Nov 2002 14:09:18 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) ( Subject: Re: Galaxy and ES47 vs ES80....3 Message-ID: <lGgyvZwUNIfU@eisner.encompasserve.org>   w In article <8a646952.0211251257.2a936488@posting.google.com>, jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) writes: | > "Hal Kuff" <kuff@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<F86DB227673F0C2B.B3DFA56007275969.82A6D33CED452EDA@lp.airnews.net>...O >> It's my understanding that an ES4x is limited to two Galaxy instances... one H >> per PCI bus..... any idea how many instances one can run on the ES80?0 >> Hopefully the restriction is now more like 4? >  > Hal, > > > This is just a reminder, Galaxy will not be supported on the > VMS-Itanium configuration. >   F 	Where do you get your information from?  Do you make it up as you go = 	along?  Part of an NDA presentation in Nashua recently?  The @ 	reason I ask, is slide 30 of the latest roadmaps clearly shows	G 	the Galaxy Configuration Manager being on Itanium and Alpha (H1 2004).   B http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/roadmap/openvms_roadmaps.htm   				Rob   : And the wind shall say:  "Here were decent godless people:>                           Their only monument the asphalt road:                           And a thousand lost golf balls."-                                 -- T.S. Eliot    ------------------------------    Date: 26 Nov 2002 05:28:40 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ( Subject: Re: Galaxy and ES47 vs ES80....3 Message-ID: <MGBUamRaGEeq@eisner.encompasserve.org>   e In article <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-tC3svHs7EMNT@localhost>, djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall) writes:   F > Maybe Rob but the above just infers where VMS Clustering is/will be H > supported. I don't read it as being a statement about Galaxy features C > being included on VMS/IPF. That's why VAXen get a mention. Funny  < > though, I thought clustering already worked on VMS/Vax :-)  D Regarding Galaxy, talks at the recently concluded US DECUS SymposiumE in St. Louis said there was close cooperation between VMS Development D and the HP Superdome designers.  Certainly that cooperation would be8 required in order to get the console support for Galaxy.  @ Regarding Clusters, VMS Development talks at that same SymposiumB said their current plans do not include testing VAX and Itanium inF the same cluster (though they do not plan to do anything to break it).A They said they had some VMS-savvy customers request them _not_ to B certify VAX and Itanium in the same cluster, since those customers- want their bosses to spring for new machines.   ? I get the impression that VMS Development understands that ISVs * will be running tri-architecture clusters.   ------------------------------   Date: 26 Nov 2002 14:03:43 GMT# From: rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam Y Subject: How to discover what is waiting a process WAS:Re: SMTP non working after upgrade ' Message-ID: <arvuvv$ceh$1@tejo.csic.es>   M In article <artsm6$btn$1@tejo.csic.es>, rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam writes: c >In article <3DE26184.F69E8ADD@vl.videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> writes: & >>rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam wrote:K >>> The problem happen with all the arriving message, the system is able to Q >>> deliber the message (it arrive to the user mailbox) but the user is no notify Q >>> of the arriving message but if he enter in the mail utility the mail is there R >>> as a new mail, But the process in the queue keep in the process state, but notS >>> using using any recourse, seems to be waiting for some call to return and block  >>> the queue. >>O >>"But the process is in the queue"... which queue are you talking about ? What 4 >>commands do you enter to obtain that information ? >> >  >I do  >  >sh queue/all *smtp** >Generic server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_00 > K >Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_01, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT  > 5 >  Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status 5 >  -----  -------         --------     ------  ------ # >      2  02112519304566_TCPIP$SMTP 9 >                         TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing  >  <Skiped...>       F I have runned de DECamds over the process and all the quotas seems ok.  H and is in a wait state of the type control and the event log say that isA waiting for a lock, how can I discover why is waiting that lock??    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:42:30 GMT 1 From: LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (Jerry Leslie) 2 Subject: Re: Independent Consultants + OpenVMS.org; Message-ID: <qJEE9.65092$Kj1.2919950@twister.austin.rr.com>   1 JF Mezei (jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca) wrote:  : J : Another aspect of luxury the USA has is its medical system. It may have M : rights to brag about many things, but in the end, low-tech Cuba has higher  H : life expectancy than the USA, and the USA is the world's highest cost H : medical system (in prcentage of medical expenses per gdp). While most N : western nations have their medical costs between 10 and 15% of GDP, I think I : that the USA's is closer to 18%. This means that in the end, producing  M : a widget in the USA means it costs more because the employer must disburse  H : at least 3-5% more in medical benefits than competing western nations. : K : So while you may enjoy brand spanking new fancy medical equipment in ever L : hospital and plenty of capacity , hence no waiting lists, it does put your' : nation at a competitive disadvantage.  : I From reports I've read, and from comments of people who have traveled to  M Cuba (legally), their medical schools are still considered to be world class.   D Perhaps the U.S. should normalize relations with Cuba, and then send9 some patients requiring surgery and chemotherapy to Cuba.   I The UK's National Health Service currently sends some patients requiring  8 surgery and chemotherapy to South Africa, to save money.  E The U.S. is already using offshore doctors, such as American-trained  ? radiologists who interpret xrays of patients in U.S. hospitals:   D    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow.asp?art_id=9101731L    City radiologist is tele-consultant for US hospitals - The Times of India  	    [snip]   <   "The obvious question is why and how the US is benefiting?  H    "There is an explosion in emergency coverage during nights, and thereI    is a 20 per cent shortage in radiology workforce in the US. Night call G    radiologists are expensive there. The idea is to exploit global time G    difference as a way to turn their night into my day. It is effective I    cost wise and gives me the opportunity to contribute to emergency care (    across the world," Kalyanpur says..."    2 --Jerry Leslie   (my opinions are strictly my own)9   Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for email    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:35:19 -0500 % From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> 2 Subject: Re: Independent Consultants + OpenVMS.org/ Message-ID: <uu55sonpq4jqe1@news.supernews.com>   > "Jerry Leslie" <LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM> wrote in message5 news:XxvE9.63015$Kj1.2779393@twister.austin.rr.com... & > John Vottero (John@mvpsi.com) wrote: > : L > : Certainly there are many oppressed people in the world but we won't help* > : them by withholding job opportunities. > F > U.S. corporations seem all too glad to export jobs to dictatorships,% > which they prefer over democracies:  >   L I'm not an economist but I believe that's the way it's supposed to work (notH that I like it).  For some strange reason, it seems that publicly tradedH companies have to put the interests of the shareholders above everythingK else.  As far as I can tell, the only reason a corporation wouldn't exploit I children in sweat shops is because it might make for bad press that hurts K sales.  That's why the government has to get involved, because corporations  have no conscience.   > >    http://www.globalexchange.org/economy/econ101/survey.htmlJ >    : Globalization Survey Reveals U.S. Corporations Prefer Dictatorships > H >   "American businesses may say they believe in democracy, but they areH >    not putting their money where their mouth is, according to a report& >    by a Washington-based think tank. > F >    Democratic countries in the developing sector, such as Poland andI >    South Africa, are losing out in the race for American export markets D >    and American foreign investment. Dictatorships such as China or5 >    semidictatorships such as Indonesia are winning.  > E >    And the trend is growing. As more of the world's countries adopt K >    democracy, more American businesses appear to prefer dictatorships..."  > E > U.S. corporations are now making Communist China the beneficiary of ' > R&D work, as well as manufacturing...  > . >    http://news.com.com/2009-1001-940319.html. >    Tapping brainpower - Tech News - CNET.com > J >   "...While many technology giants are expanding manufacturing plants inK >    China, a significant number of multinationals are increasingly combing F >    the mainland for engineers and researchers to handle projects forI >    global applications that, in recent years, would have been performed , >    in labs in the United States or Europe. > F >    "I'm hiring Ph.D.s with years of experience for less than what itG >    would cost to hire a new college grad out of Stanford," said Chief J >    Executive Al Sisto of Phoenix Technologies, a software company in San >    Jose, Calif..." > J >    http://www.townhall.com/columnists/paulcraigroberts/pcr20020425.shtml! >    Smug in a no-think existence  >  > H >   "...Intel, IBM, Motorola, Lucent Technologies, GE and Microsoft wereK >    among the first to set up R&D labs in China, where skilled researchers K >    can be hired at one-third the U.S. wage. The United States has trained J >    enough Chinese scientists and engineers to support a massive shift in8 >    R&D from the United States (and Japan) to China..." > J > R&D is the "seed corn" that leads to new goods & services, and new jobs.K > How many new jobs will be created in the U.S. from an invention overseas?   H How do you want to keep those ideas and those Ph.D jobs from leaving the U.S.? 12 foot fences?    >  > : F > : Instead of trying to erect barriers that prevent jobs from leavingH > : the US, we should be trying to enforce standards for workers rights,, > : environmental controls and human rights. > I > Sounds noble, but the U.S. is currently going backwards on those issues  > here:  >   K I'm not saying the U.S. is doing everything right, we have lots of problems  as you've noted.  4 >    http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0823-02.htm$ >    What About Corporate Terrorism? > K >   "...According to Senate testimony from Kenneth Roth, whose Human Rights B >    Watch group two years ago documented "widespread labor rightsK >    violations" in the United States, in the 1950s a few hundred workers a H >    year were fired - illegally - for trying to organize unions. But inE >    1998 - despite a much lower level of union organizing activity - D >    24,000 workers lost their jobs just because they were trying toH >    exercise their internationally guaranteed freedom to associate with! >    other workers on the job..."  >  > < >    http://www.ombwatch.org/article/articleview/1115/1/152/A >    OMB Watch - Report Links Environmental Rollbacks to Industry 
 Contributions  > K >   "Earthjustice and Public Campaign recently released a joint report that I >    links recent Bush rollbacks of environmental protections to industry  >    campaign contributions. >  >    Specifically: > K >      * The administration revoked protections against hard rock mining -- I >        allowing increased dumping in streams, rivers and wetlands -- as D >        mining interests forked over a total of $3.1 million to theJ >        Bush-Cheney campaign and the Republican National Committee during' >        the 2000-2002 election cycles; H >      * The administration moved to allow increased logging in nationalJ >        forests after the timber industry made $3.4 million in donations;H >      * The chemical industry and other manufacturers contributed $18.6E >        million as the administration asked taxpayers, not polluting E >        industry, to pick up the burden for the cleanup of hazardous  >        waste; @ >      * The oil and gas industry contributed $17 million as theD >        administration proposed to open sensitive areas in and near@ >        national monuments and parks to increased drilling; andH >      * Coal burning utilities donated $2 million as the administrationK >        moved to relax standards and enforcement efforts to clean up aging $ >        coal-fired power plants..." >  > : H > : It will be much easier help people build or repair boats than to try% > : and prevent the tide from rising.  > J > Corporate-driven globalization is NOT a natural event like an earthquake= > or hurricane. Nor is it a commandment from a supreme being.   J Oh yes it is!  If there's a buck to be made, just try stopping that force!   >  > :  > : K > : Call your congressman and demand that they support "globalization-from-  > : below".  > K > People like you and I don't call Congressmen. That form of communications K > is reserved for the people running this oligarchy, such as CEOs like Bill ) > Gates, Craig Barrett, or Carly Fiorina.  > J > The common people aren't in a position to demand anything from Congress. >   L Are you suggesting that we throw our hands in the air and give up or that we( call our CEO instead of our Congressman?  K > : It has to be the government because the corporations won't do it unless  > : something forces them to.  > : L > Considering the power and influence corporations have with the government,/ > it's unlikely the government will force them.  >   L The government forces corporations to do lots of things that they don't want0 to do.  Just look that the EPA, OSHA, NHTSA etc.  K > The reason the sweatshops in U.S.-controlled Saipan were allowed to abuse L > human rights so long was due to the influence of powerful Congressmen like > Tom DeLay (R-TX):  > C >    http://abcnews.go.com/sections/world/DailyNews/saipan0331.html 5 >    ABCNEWS.com :  Forced Labor, Abortions in Saipan  > $ >   "...Millions Spent to Sway Votes > D >    Saipan has spent millions on Washington lobbyists and given topH >    Republicans in Congress free trips to the beautiful Pacific island,D >    including one over Christmas for House Majority Whip Tom DeLay. > K >         "You represent everything that is good about what we're trying to I >    do in America," he told outgoing Governor Froilan Tenorio, a distant H >    cousin of the current governor, at a dinner in Saipan this past New >    Year's eve. > J >         DeLay and other Republicans have vowed to fight to keep the laws! >    the way they are on Saipan."  > I > Organizations such as the Global Exchange filed lawsuits in U.S. courts 6 > that eventually provided those workers with justice: > ? >    http://www.sweatshopwatch.org/marianas/2002settlement.html B >    SWEATSHOP WATCH: Stop Saipan Sweatshops -  Retailers Agree to
 Settlement >  > K > "We, the People" lost out to corporations in 1886, when the Supreme Court K > deemed a corporation to be a "natural person", entitled to the protection 2 > under the Bill of Rights, including free speech: > 2 >    http://www.adbusters.org/magazine/28/usa.html >    Adbusters: USA (TM) > J >   "...This 1886 decision ostensibly gave corporations the same powers asF >    private citizens. But considering their vast financial resources,I >    corporations thereafter actually had far more power than any private J >    citizen. They could defend and exploit their rights and freedoms moreK >    vigorously than any individual and therefore they were more free. In a J >    single legal stroke, the whole intent of the American Constitution --K >    that all citizens have one vote, and exercise an equal voice in public D >    debates -- had been undermined. Sixty years after it was inked,K >    Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas concluded of Santa Clara that H >    it "could not be supported by history, logic or reason." One of theJ >    great legal blunders of the nineteenth century changed the whole idea! >    of democratic government..."  > H > "We, the People" will continue to be subservient to corporations until thatH > decision is nullified by a new decision or a Constitutional Amendment: > 1 >    http://www.iiipublishing.com/afd/changes.htm 6 >    What would change if corporations lost personhood >   E Revoking corporate personhood would be a step in the right direction.   H >   "...Ending corporate personhood would result, not in a level playing field,J >    but in a field where We the People have the advantage again, where in any L >    particular issue that is fought out in the public arena, the people are/ >    more likely to win than the corporations."  > A > The WTO conducts much of its business out of public arenas. :-(  >   / It appears that we agree more than we disagree.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 21:56:46 +0100 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> A Subject: Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha ' Message-ID: <3DE28E8E.50567E59@aaa.com>   . I'm sure you've heard it before, but anyway...  B What's the similarity between US beer and making love in a canoe ?& They are both f---ing close to water !   Jan-Erik Sderholm.      Marty Kuhrt wrote: > 8 > But, wait!!!  I spy a Bud to the left of the keyboard!" > This can't be the VAXman I know! >  > ;^)    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 21:01:21 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORGA Subject: Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha 0 Message-ID: <00A17824.5E43AB4B@SendSpamHere.ORG>  a In article <SC+QhnVTBXdu@eisner.encompasserve.org>, kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt) writes: x >In article <01KPAKNGL0HIA24IEW@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:M >>> > I can picture him in his computer den - surrounded by monitors, perhaps K >>> > a VT or two, maybe a bunch o' DECterm sessions where he TELNETted in, 	 >>> > ...  >>> I >>> Nope.  The VAXman's VMS den is much bigger than that.  I've seen it.  H >>> I doubt HP has an official demo room with as much equipment in it... >>> 8-)  >>  H >> http://www.tmesis.com/pics/vaxman_hard-at-work.jpg is an interesting H >> shot (no, that's NOT me, although there is a certain similarity when : >> seen from the back (I've also been told I could win an F >> Andy-Goldstein-lookalike contest).  He used to have some "VAXcave" I >> pictures there, but not anymore.  Hopefully he's updating the archive   >> with some new pictures. >>   > @ >I fear this may be a picture of an imposter!  Yes, this person @ >is leaning into a Digital monitor, poised over an LK keyboard, > >and wearing a Process tye-died shirt....  But, wait!!!  I spy> >a Bud to the left of the keyboard!  This can't be the VAXman 
 >I know!   >  >;^)   Arrgh!  OK.  How about:   3 http://www.tmesis.com/pix/THIS_IS_MORE_LIKE_IT.JPG;    --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------    Date: 25 Nov 2002 13:27:49 -0600+ From: kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)oA Subject: Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alpha33 Message-ID: <SC+QhnVTBXdu@eisner.encompasserve.org>   w In article <01KPAKNGL0HIA24IEW@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:eL >> > I can picture him in his computer den - surrounded by monitors, perhapsJ >> > a VT or two, maybe a bunch o' DECterm sessions where he TELNETted in, >> > ... >> :H >> Nope.  The VAXman's VMS den is much bigger than that.  I've seen it. G >> I doubt HP has an official demo room with as much equipment in it...E >> 8-) > G > http://www.tmesis.com/pics/vaxman_hard-at-work.jpg is an interesting AG > shot (no, that's NOT me, although there is a certain similarity when e9 > seen from the back (I've also been told I could win an sE > Andy-Goldstein-lookalike contest).  He used to have some "VAXcave"  H > pictures there, but not anymore.  Hopefully he's updating the archive  > with some new pictures.  >   ? I fear this may be a picture of an imposter!  Yes, this person T? is leaning into a Digital monitor, poised over an LK keyboard, t= and wearing a Process tye-died shirt....  But, wait!!!  I spy = a Bud to the left of the keyboard!  This can't be the VAXman e	 I know!  c   ;^)    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 21:28:36 GMTv" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORGA Subject: Re: Interesting SHOW USERS "feature" under VMS 7.3 Alphar0 Message-ID: <00A17828.2D38799A@SendSpamHere.ORG>  a In article <5EK9FhjrK$b3@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes: V >In article <00A17824.5E43AB4B@SendSpamHere.ORG>,   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:d >> In article <SC+QhnVTBXdu@eisner.encompasserve.org>, kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt) writes:z >>>In article <01KPAKNGL0HIA24IEW@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:O >>>>> > I can picture him in his computer den - surrounded by monitors, perhaps1M >>>>> > a VT or two, maybe a bunch o' DECterm sessions where he TELNETted in,r >>>>> > ...a >>>>> K >>>>> Nope.  The VAXman's VMS den is much bigger than that.  I've seen it.  J >>>>> I doubt HP has an official demo room with as much equipment in it...	 >>>>> 8-)  >>>> sJ >>>> http://www.tmesis.com/pics/vaxman_hard-at-work.jpg is an interesting J >>>> shot (no, that's NOT me, although there is a certain similarity when < >>>> seen from the back (I've also been told I could win an H >>>> Andy-Goldstein-lookalike contest).  He used to have some "VAXcave" K >>>> pictures there, but not anymore.  Hopefully he's updating the archive d >>>> with some new pictures. >>>> o >>>iB >>>I fear this may be a picture of an imposter!  Yes, this person B >>>is leaning into a Digital monitor, poised over an LK keyboard, @ >>>and wearing a Process tye-died shirt....  But, wait!!!  I spy@ >>>a Bud to the left of the keyboard!  This can't be the VAXman  >>>I know!   >>>e >>>;^) >> h >> Arrgh!  OK.  How about: >>  6 >> http://www.tmesis.com/pix/THIS_IS_MORE_LIKE_IT.JPG; >> U >  >	Much better! > B >	Sheewah... you had me very worried there for a moment.  It would# >	be like ... VMS without the V !!!I >R >				Rob >   I If you'd have heard a Spruce Stringspleen album or some other top 40 clapNI trap playing in a .WAV file accompanying that picture, THEN you'd be bestS to start worrying!  I BTW, that makeshift image edit prompted me to have to go and pop open theT real thing. ;)   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:18:51 -0000r* From: Andrew Robinson <arobinson@hspg.com>? Subject: RE: Jumper settings for TZ87 in StorageWorks enclosure2M Message-ID: <CDA4BAD1E10ED41181AC00508B6051D3C3EA4F@grumpy.internal.hspg.com>A  E If it helps, I've just pulled mine out of its BA350 cabinet & the themA switches are set to 1 ON 2 OFF 3 ON 4 OFF 5 OFF 6 OFF (Or UDUDDD)oB This changes address depending on where I shove it in the cabinet.   Regardse   Andrew Robinsono   -----Original Message-----9 From: mcbill20@hotmail.com [mailto:mcbill20@hotmail.com] A Sent: 25 November 2002 15:40 To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coma? Subject: Re: Jumper settings for TZ87 in StorageWorks enclosurer    L Thanks for the info. However, I don't see anything here related to the TZ87.K The closest thing I found was the info for jumper settings on the back of a.I non-Storageworks 10/20 DLT drive. The number of switches I see on mine iseL different from the number of jumpers in the documentation. Also, I don't seeL any mention of any of the Storageworks drives on these pages. Doing a searchH in the search box for TZ87 also doesn't produce any results. DOes anyone& have any documentation for this drive?   Thanks.- Bill McLaughlin@  2 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote in messageL news:<BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF402660B87@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net >... > Bill,n > A > >>> Can anyone point me to any documentation for this drive?<<<2 >  > This might be of assistance:  F > ftp://ftp.compaq.com/pub/supportinformation/techpubs/qrg/app b scsi  > tape  drive config charts.pdfn > : > Other product specific tech doc's for future reference: 1 > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/support/Techpubs/qrg/a >  > 	 > Regards  >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant' > Hewlett-Packard (Canada) Co.# > Consulting & Integration Servicest > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax   : 613-591-4477 > Email: kerryDOTmain@hpDOTcom/ >     (remove the DOT's and replace with "."'s)e >  >  >  > -----Original Message-----5 > From: Bill McLaughlin [mailto:mcbill20@hotmail.com]e! > Sent: November 23, 2002 7:52 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt= > Subject: Jumper settings for TZ87 in StorageWorks enclosure1 >  > I > Hello all. I just bought a TZ87 DLT drive in a StorageWorks enclosure. eB > Unfortunately, it didn't come with any documentation and the HP - > website doesn't seem to contain any either.b > E > It seems to work fine-- the only thing is that it ignores the SCSI  F > address set by jumpers on the back of my StorageWorks enclosure and C > always comes up as SCSI ID #4, no matter which slot it is put in.  > H > There is a tiny 6 position DIP switch on the ribbon cable in the back 6 > but there is no indication of what the settings are. > : > Can anyone point me to any documentation for this drive? > 	 > Thanks.i > Bill McLaughlinr   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:38:02 +1100o1 From: Paddy O'Brien <paddy.o'brien@tg.nsw.gov.au> # Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flippingr, Message-ID: <3DE340FA.7080704@tg.nsw.gov.au>   Atlant Schmidt wrote:t# > VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:e >  > < >>but the kids will be with me and their NJ public schooling9 >>educated minds are not ready for that much stimulation.  >  > / > I'm always amused at the Right Wing hypocricys6 > that says that they can slip in gratuitous political4 > slams whenever they wish, but woe unto any lefties1 > who bring up politics in a technical newsgroup.h >  > But nice try, VAXMAN.q >  > Atlant > F You snipped a lot of Brian's comments. (Oh, I think these were from a " subsequent post of Brian's, sorry)  E Be it left-wing, right-wing, US, UK or .au.  What I think that Brian )H (subsequently) expressed a desire for was to get his kids educated at a ( similar level/pace to his own education.  F I had similar desires/problems when I emigrated  to .au.  My daughter A was then (1982) about 4, she had been to school in UK for a year JG (nepotism -- I was chairman of our PTA where my son was a 6 year old). -I She could read (my wife was a grammar teacher) and write and do a lot of rD maths, like binary conversions and very basic trig -- numbering the H degrees round a circle (I'm a mathematician and the kids loved learning G these things).  The kids loved a competition where I said a number and eE they would draw a radius on the Cartesian co-ordinates.  If I said a gF number greater than 360, the kids just looked at me and scribbled all G over the page :-)  Huh, I'd not got round to teaching them the MODULUS r function :-)  H When we came here, she was "not old enough" to go to school, so we kept F educating her at home.  When she did start school in New South Wales, F they tried to teach her ITA, which at 5 she refused to do because "it  was not proper reading".  E When we moved to South Australia, because of birthday rules, she was mI deemed to start school again several months later.  Her teachers did not nG know what to do with her knowledge and she became a "helper".  This is o> not good for the kid concerned.  It alienates them from peers.  H Probably similar to Brian's kids, she had help from interested parents,  but nothing from school.  F To summarise, I do not see Brian's comments in any way of a political D flavour (they're all -- parties -- as bad as each other -- it's the F funding that matters), but his frustration as a parent not seeing his ? kids given the education that he/we had in an earlier lifetime.a  : I trust I have the flavour of what you were saying, Brian.   Regards, Paddy    F Hey, and this is OT from the OT subject of Hamburger Flipping :-)  My G kids hated McDonalds food, but loved the playgrounds, and I was on CDC DH (IBM pre .au) not VMS in those days.  I'm a new kid on the block -- VMS  in 1984.        G ***********************************************************************F  C "This electronic message and any attachments may contain privileged > and confidential information intended only for the use of the B addressees named above.  If you are not the intended recipient of C this email, please delete the message and any attachment and advisenB the sender.  You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, 7 distribution, reproduction of this email is prohibited.d  A If you have received the email in error, please notify TransGrid EA immediately.  Any views expressed in this email are those of the  = individual sender except where the sender expressly and with oC authority states them to be the views of TransGrid.  TransGrid usest> virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses contained in any attachment.  < Please note the email address for TransGrid personnel is now$ firstname.lastname@transgrid.com.au"  G ***********************************************************************h   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 21:49:50 +0100 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>D# Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flippingw' Message-ID: <3DE28CEE.3973D535@aaa.com>t  C You havn't seen the report from National Geographic the other day ?   = Only around 37 % US'es could point out Iraq on a map and event less could find Afganistan...o  0 In Europe the numbers was between 80 and 90 %...   Jan-Erik Sderholm.t  ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:w >  > J > This morning on the local talk radio there was discussion of the NJ/GEPAK > (Grage Eight Proficiency Assessment) tests.  Only about 3/4 of the eighth + > graders could identify the Pacific Ocean.  >t   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 15:37:13 -0500-2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com># Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping . Message-ID: <3DE289F9.E1EA34BC@mindspring.com>  ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:j  e > In article <3DE22992.7A447547@mindspring.com>, Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> writes:j$ > >VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > >5? > >> but the kids will be with me and their NJ public schoolingw< > >> educated minds are not ready for that much stimulation. > >80 > >I'm always amused at the Right Wing hypocricy7 > >that says that they can slip in gratuitous politicale5 > >slams whenever they wish, but woe unto any lefties 2 > >who bring up politics in a technical newsgroup. > >i > >But nice try, VAXMAN. > >M	 > >Atlantn >AI > Perhaps if you lived in the US and not fantasy land, you'd see that the I > educational system is in a state of disarray.  How "slamming" this pooriE > excuse of an educational system is "Right Wing hypocricy" fails me.   - You're either missing or deliberately dodgingo1 my point. The topic was (at least for the moment) 1 non-political. But you saw an opportunity to slipf3 your little political stilleto in and make a Right-p, Wing snide remark slamming public education.   So you took the opportunity..u  . But would you have taken it as kindly if I had, slipped in a Left Wing point in an otherwise non-political discussion?s   Atlant   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:25:49 -0500S0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca># Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flippingn/ Message-ID: <3DE2955C.84783B5B@vl.videotron.ca>    Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:i? > Only around 37 % US'es could point out Iraq on a map and event > less could find Afganistan...y  N When Bush Jr aims the missiles to Iraq, will be part of the 37% who know whereG Iraq is, or part of the majority who don't ???? :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-).  ? Shouldn't Hawaiians be scared they could be mistaken for Iraq ?6   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:10:18 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG# Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping 0 Message-ID: <00A178AB.BAE3FED7@SendSpamHere.ORG>  ` In article <3DE340FA.7080704@tg.nsw.gov.au>, Paddy O'Brien <paddy.o'brien@tg.nsw.gov.au> writes: >  >t >Atlant Schmidt wrote:$ >> VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >> D >> a= >>>but the kids will be with me and their NJ public schoolingd: >>>educated minds are not ready for that much stimulation. >> w >>  0 >> I'm always amused at the Right Wing hypocricy7 >> that says that they can slip in gratuitous politicals5 >> slams whenever they wish, but woe unto any leftiese2 >> who bring up politics in a technical newsgroup. >> o >> But nice try, VAXMAN. >> k	 >> Atlanty >>  G >You snipped a lot of Brian's comments. (Oh, I think these were from a  # >subsequent post of Brian's, sorry)m > F >Be it left-wing, right-wing, US, UK or .au.  What I think that Brian I >(subsequently) expressed a desire for was to get his kids educated at a o) >similar level/pace to his own education.l  G That would be nice.  Mr. Harrison suggested we take in the Tate Modern.nF The education system in the UK may be one that exposes school childrenF art/art appreciation but not so here in the US and, more specifically,E here in the state of NJ.  I believe your statement is correct in manyiE respects; I would love to see my children educated at a similar level ) and/or pace to that of my own experience.e    G >To summarise, I do not see Brian's comments in any way of a political jE >flavour (they're all -- parties -- as bad as each other -- it's the bG >funding that matters), but his frustration as a parent not seeing his a@ >kids given the education that he/we had in an earlier lifetime.  H Funding, schmunding...  Here we throw money at problems and nothing everI really seems to change.  States that, from myriad reports, throw the mostcH money at education seem to report some of the lowest overall achievementG (based on standardized test scores).  When I see these reports, it doesnI not make me feel like my tax dollar has been well spent.  Our schools getfG more money than ever, and yet I'm importuned to support school programso< through fund raisers and pandering outside of shop doorways.  I I could go on and rant about my daughter's "geometry" homework last night H as an example of where school *isn't* going in our country, but it's 8am6 here and I need to get little Kevin off to pre-school.  ; >I trust I have the flavour of what you were saying, Brian.   	 Somewhat.s --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMu            -5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" 3   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 09:21:01 -0500s! From: VAXVMS <bounce@notmail.com> # Subject: RE: OT: Hamburger FlippingaK Message-ID: <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E4903027BA4@rlghncst964.usps.gov>l  ; To any who would posit that what passes for education todayv: is anything more substantial than a rough outline drawing > of what once was considered to be essential common knowledge, 9 here is a link to an eighth grade final examination from t Salinas, Kansas dated 1895.i  = Most of *us* couldn't answer all of the questions correctly. t  7 http://skyways.lib.ks.us/kansas/genweb/ottawa/exam.html    WWWebb  J When I attended school, (way too long ago), there was an emphysis on doing well.nK   Then there came a time when it was decided that some doing more well than A others was a bad thing, and that students coming from any type of.H 'underprivilidged' background/environment should not have to suffer from such aJ background.  The result, such were not graded to the standards used in the past.CG   In short, it's called "dumbing down the education system", so that weR don'tu  have poor (relatively) students.  E I cannot understand what type of idiot could concieve of lowering the-	 standards-E rather than addressing the real problem, bring all students up to the 	 standard.I   But, that's what we got.  H Now, with education being attacked, and achievement test scores becoming moreK important, I see the standards being raised again, on students that are notgK prepared for such.  Some of them are facing a cliff that they cannot climb.?I After years of nothing much being expected from the students, some cannot  meet the new expectations..  L There is always a price for stupidity.  Unfortunately, the guilty are rarely theD ones that pay the price.   Dave     Shane Smith wrote:  H > I agree with VAXman on the education. When I came over to America fromJ > England, a bunch of other families came over with me. Every single childF > in the group found they were at least a year ahead of their peers atI > school, some quite a bit more so. They had to sit through things they'd(H > already covered until the American children caught up. Before you ask,7 > these were supposed to be very good American schools.n > C > I have no political axe to grind here, merely stating my personali@ > observation. America's educational system does not impress me. >m > Shaner > ? > In article <3DE289F9.E1EA34BC@mindspring.com>, Atlant Schmidt ' > <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> writes:a >s# >>VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:n >> >>@ >>>In article <3DE22992.7A447547@mindspring.com>, Atlant Schmidt >>> ' > <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> writes:a > % >>>>VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:c >>>> >>>>? >>>>>but the kids will be with me and their NJ public schoolingl< >>>>>educated minds are not ready for that much stimulation. >>>>> 1 >>>>I'm always amused at the Right Wing hypocricyp8 >>>>that says that they can slip in gratuitous political6 >>>>slams whenever they wish, but woe unto any lefties3 >>>>who bring up politics in a technical newsgroup.f >>>> >>>>But nice try, VAXMAN.i >>>>
 >>>>Atlant >>>>J >>>Perhaps if you lived in the US and not fantasy land, you'd see that theJ >>>educational system is in a state of disarray.  How "slamming" this poorF >>>excuse of an educational system is "Right Wing hypocricy" fails me. >>>l/ >>You're either missing or deliberately dodgingv3 >>my point. The topic was (at least for the moment) 3 >>non-political. But you saw an opportunity to slipg5 >>your little political stilleto in and make a Right-i. >>Wing snide remark slamming public education. >> >>So you took the opportunity..  >>0 >>But would you have taken it as kindly if I had. >>slipped in a Left Wing point in an otherwise >>non-political discussion?  >> >n > J > I believe the discussion was, at Mr. Harrison's suggestion, about taking= > my family on a tour of the Tate Modern.  The discussion was  > non-politicalsH > as you have pointed out but it was also non-technical.  You've alluded > toI > my introduction of the former into the latter which is simply not true.c >R >IG > If it makes you any happier, yes, the americun edyoucayshun cystum isp > thecJ > graytest in the hole world!  I'm certain that 3/5 of all americuns (that+ > would be 75% right?) wood agree with you.m >  > --4 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 > VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM >l6 >   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" >o >p   ========================  William W. Webb / DSSC/RLM, USPS OpenVMS Support Services& 4924 Green Road Raleigh, NC 27616-2800: 919.874.3043 <FirstInitialDotLastNameAtEmailDotUSPSDotGov>   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Nov 2002 07:17:09 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) # Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flipping 3 Message-ID: <cONyQ8l7rUI5@eisner.encompasserve.org>l  b In article <3DE2955C.84783B5B@vl.videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> writes: > A > Shouldn't Hawaiians be scared they could be mistaken for Iraq ?b  H   Detroit.  But don't worry, Dodge Caravans are actually made in Canada.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:03:51 -0500C2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com># Subject: Re: OT: Hamburger Flippingm. Message-ID: <3DE38D57.B07751F0@mindspring.com>  
 VAXVMS wrote:u  = > To any who would posit that what passes for education todayn; > is anything more substantial than a rough outline drawingu? > of what once was considered to be essential common knowledge,o: > here is a link to an eighth grade final examination from > Salinas, Kansas dated 1895.n >r> > Most of *us* couldn't answer all of the questions correctly. >A9 > http://skyways.lib.ks.us/kansas/genweb/ottawa/exam.htmld  & Syllabi vary. My son has learned a lot$ more biochemistry/mollecular biology& than I was ever taught in high school.' On the other hand, his vocabulary isn't ' as broad. Diff'ren strokes for diff'ren  folks, I guess.s  ( Kids today know far more about computers as well.  * And turning to that Kansas exam, I suspect) those Kansas kids really didn't know muchu( about the calculus or solving systems of* simultaneous equations. Or nuclear energy.) Or physics in general. Or evolution (and, % thanks to the Kansas government, they . still don't!). Or any number of topics outside that 1895 "core curriculum".  ( There's also a bit more American History" now than when those exam questions* were written. I understand we've even been( to the moon, as well as having had a few" foreign adventures since 1895. :-)  + Generally, kids live up to (or down to) the - expectations set by the parents. If you don'th2 like how your kids turned out, look in the mirror; don't blame the schools.   Atlant   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:14:47 GMTe" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG# Subject: RE: OT: Hamburger Flippinga0 Message-ID: <00A178BD.1E86E967@SendSpamHere.ORG>  o In article <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E4903027BA4@rlghncst964.usps.gov>, VAXVMS <bounce@notmail.com> writes:  >s< >To any who would posit that what passes for education today; >is anything more substantial than a rough outline drawing s? >of what once was considered to be essential common knowledge, n: >here is a link to an eighth grade final examination from  >Salinas, Kansas dated 1895. >j> >Most of *us* couldn't answer all of the questions correctly.  >a8 >http://skyways.lib.ks.us/kansas/genweb/ottawa/exam.html >  >WWWebbS  I I looked at this and it reminded me of a joke that I was recently emailednI regarding the state of teaching mathematics.  I've HTMLized it and it canl
 be seen here:d   http://www.tmesis.com/math.html         K >When I attended school, (way too long ago), there was an emphysis on doingv >well.L >  Then there came a time when it was decided that some doing more well thanB >others was a bad thing, and that students coming from any type ofI >'underprivilidged' background/environment should not have to suffer fromw >such a K >background.  The result, such were not graded to the standards used in thee >past.H >  In short, it's called "dumbing down the education system", so that we >don't! >have poor (relatively) students.l  J That's the tenet of the "core curriculum" in NJ.  Before this was enacted,K (very recently too) the school systems here in NJ were good in some localesdI and not so good in others.  Now, there's a consistent dull hue of moronic: mediocrity.  :(g    F >I cannot understand what type of idiot could concieve of lowering the
 >standardsF >rather than addressing the real problem, bring all students up to the
 >standard.  G Atlant ;)   (Hey, if he can get away with calling *ME* right winged...)a   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             m5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" g   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 19:38:04 GMT 0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>. Subject: Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance1 Message-ID: <w_uE9.3$AE2.186524@news.cpqcorp.net>i  
 Hi Rudolf,  L Please provide at least the command line you used.  9.6MB/s for Ethernet andJ GbE smells like you are not using GbE or you have it throttled way back inH your configuration.  Did you verify you are using Jumbo Frames?  Are youH certain your configuration is not inadvertenly using Ethernet instead ofL GbE - check the interface counters ($ mcr lancp show dev /counter) also look' for any TCP errors, ($ netstat -p tcp).   J Using ttcp, GbE, 33Mhz 64-bit PCI bus, between ES40s, I readily exceed 700 Mb/s.r   Matt.    --= -------------------------------------------------------------k OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companya Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA = -------------------------------------------------------------n    3 "Rudolf Wingert" <win@fom.fgan.de> wrote in message 0 news:200211250732.IAA25422@sinet1.fom.fgan.de... > Hello, >tI > now I have tested the network performance with OpenVMS COPY (128MB filegH > via network to the NL: device) and TTCP. With both tests I did get theK > same result: 9.6MB/s. I did the same test with the fast Ethernet adapter.uG > The result (9.6MB/s and 7.5MB/s) is near the one of Gigabit Ethernet.yL > I know that the first generation of Gigabit Ethernet (that one we do have)J > is not the state of the art. But that poor performance should be not the > normal think.s >e  > TIA and regards Rudolf Wingert >h   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:37:38 +0100 (MET) & From: Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de>. Subject: Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance6 Message-ID: <200211260937.KAA28070@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>   Hello,   Rick Jones wrotes:   >>>oC You don't by any chance happen to have a copper GbE NIC and have its9 plugged-into a 10)BT port rather than a GbE one do you?   B I know that on the Alteaon AceSwitch 180 the copper ports are just: 100BT, not GbE, even though the fibre ports below them are >>>   D We do have a 1000BaseSX LWL interface (DEGPA-SA). There is no possi-B bility to change the speed. You may only change the type of DUPLEXI (autonegotiation, on, off). The used switch is an SSR8600 from Cabletron,  just known as Enterasys.   Best regards R. Wingerto   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:45:47 +0100 (MET)l& From: Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de>. Subject: Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance6 Message-ID: <200211260945.KAA28148@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>   Hello,   Kilgallen wrotes:n   >>>sA So what performance do you get copying directly from that file toa' the null device, avoiding the network ?e <<<   B May be it was not clear enaugh. Copying a contiguous file over theC network to the NULL device was in cases (Gigabit and Fast Ethernet)AA 9.6MB/s. That means, that the performace ist about 9% for Gigabit A and about 90% for fast Ethernet. Or clearly we dont need Gigabit,w6 because it is only more expensive, but not faster!!!!!   Best regards Rudolf Wingerte   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Nov 2002 05:31:58 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen).. Subject: Re: poor Gigabit Ethernet performance3 Message-ID: <6xfv1ocqsh7b@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  _ In article <200211260945.KAA28148@sinet1.fom.fgan.de>, Rudolf Wingert <win@fom.fgan.de> writes:o   > Kilgallen wrotes:  >  >>>>C > So what performance do you get copying directly from that file toe) > the null device, avoiding the network ?, > <<<e > D > May be it was not clear enaugh. Copying a contiguous file over theE > network to the NULL device was in cases (Gigabit and Fast Ethernet) C > 9.6MB/s. That means, that the performace ist about 9% for Gigabit C > and about 90% for fast Ethernet. Or clearly we dont need Gigabit, 8 > because it is only more expensive, but not faster!!!!!  6 Only if your application consists of the COPY command.  D My point was that you should determine how much of the lack of speedD you see is due to the COPY command and the disk and null devices. ItE could be either of those, or DECnet that is slowing you down.  Speeds I specified for network adapters should be the raw protocol (i.e. Ethernet) F rather than something layered on top.  Certainly real applications can be faster than COPY.   ------------------------------    Date: 26 Nov 2002 05:54:03 -0800  From: nmanser@progis.de (Manser)I Subject: Re: Problem with HSZ50 (access to the CLI from the console port) = Message-ID: <2178d61f.0211260554.261ba26d@posting.google.com>    Alan Adams <alan.adams@orchard-way.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message news:<18fa279b4b.Alan.Adams@orchard-way.freeserve.co.uk>...> > In message <2178d61f.0211251513.75c9a889@posting.google.com>- >           nmanser@progis.de (Manser) wrote:t >  > > Hi VMS folks,  > > * > > I have inherited the folowing material > > ! > > 2 as 800 5/400 in a rackmountg( > > 2 HSZ50 controllers (dual redundant) > > 5 sbb shelves with disks.b > > 1 vt500 Terminal > > D > > after mounting the Material again, i got the following problems: > > H > > 1) after connecting the DEc connect cable to the serial port of the C > > HSZ50 controller, and powering up the HSZ noting happens at the 0 > > console terminal, i can't get into the CLI .6 > > the LED status of the controller is the following: > >   > > GREEN LED : lit continuously& > > AMBER LED's: the 2 leftmost are on6 > > in the troubleshooting manual here is the meaning: > >  > > Description of error: 6 > > Bugcheck before subsystem initialisation completed > > corrective action: > > reset the controller.h > > = > > but when i restart the controller the status is the same.y > M > Does this happen on both of the HSZ50s - or can you connect the terminal to # > the other one and get to the CLI?e >     This happens on both controllers  - > Can you boot one if the other is shut down?-   no   > M > (Given the symptoms on the terminal, I'd want to try a different terminal - - > could something have damaged both of them?)n > / > If one controller works and one doesn't, try n > show other > on the working one.T > I > If neither is working, and the diagnostic is correct, then something is M > preventing both of them from booting. The only common hardware, as far as ILJ > know, is the disgnostic unit (the one which operates the alarn light andF > buzzer), and I didn't think that could be a single point of failure. >   9 the diagnostic LED's indicate a bugcheck while controller> initialistation.5 so the controller never completes the initialisation.i  @ is in this case normal that the access to the CLI is prevented ?    L > It is likely, if the equipment has been out of service for some time, thatN > the memory batteries are flat, and probably dead. Have you tried leaving the4 > system powered up for 24 hours, then trying again. >I  E it is right that the system has been powered off since some time, butmE the vendor told me that he powered it on the day before i got it, andi the devicese were all OK.  nL > If the batteries are not quiesced (button on the battery housing) when theN > systen is shut down, then they go flat after about 100 hours. Not long after% > that, they are permanently damaged.  >   B the only thing is that i don't know if he shut down the controller by doing this:   HSZ1>shutdown this HSZ1>shutdown other   1 wait untill all ports are quisced,and LED status:G   GREEN : lit continuous, AMBER: the 3 leftmost (ports1,2,3) are lit .   then power off.   6 suppose the case he did'nt do that, what will happen ?  N > It seems possible that badly damaged batteries could prevent the system fron6 > starting up. Disconecting them might be worth a try. >  >   @ the LED status of the ECB is OK, but sometimes one led goes off.; in both cases the status LED of the controller is the same.I  N > > when i power on the system, the disks (on the shelves) attached to the HSZ. > > does not appear when i do >>> show device  > 5 > If the HSX50s are not booting, I would expect this.t > > J > > Have anybody had experiences with this kind of problem, what i can do  > > to get access to the CLI ? > >  > > 2) Terminal (VT520)  > > O > > By powering up the terminal (selftest OK) i can not clear the screen, there K > > is a permanent pattern of signs that prevents output afer 3 lines and 7 ; > > columns,after that the status of the terminal is : waitrS > > nothing happens,the session in not accessible, neither by the F3 nor any other e > > buttons. > >  .% > > what is wrong with the terminal ?i > > 4 > > Help is greetly appreciated , thanks in advance. > >  > > Nazim Manser  @ i have disconnected the ECB cache and tried again, with the same result.e  = i have put off and on the PCMCIA Programm card, following theo
 instrauctionsrE in the manual, i.e while pushing and holding down the reset button, if ejected, and put back again)  / but the result is the same on both controllers.- My question:  A which HW piece is broken ? (the PCMCIA Card, or an other thing ?)pA while init the controller what appears on the console terminal in 
 normal case ?s  	 reguards,7   Nazim Manser   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:48:52 +0000 (UTC)o, From: lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) Subject: Re: Recursive Deletion.. Message-ID: <arvu43$rid$1@newslocal.mitre.org>  z "Vivek Soni" <visoni@bmc.com> writes in article <uu6if1ku99u6ac@corp.supernews.com> dated Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:47:40 +0530:F >I guess  this query might have been put in this newsgroup a number of >times...but...still.. >>M >.......how do we recursily delete down a number of directories.....as we can> >do on unix.  I I checked the FAQ on openvms.org and couldn't find the answer to this, so  I'll answer it here.  I It's not a single command as it is in Unix.  You have a few alternatives.   K * From the CDE File Manager (x windows), you can select the folder icon ands@ "put in trash".  I do not know how or when the trash is emptied.  B * From CSWING (character cell utility), use the "d" command on the
 directory.   * From the command line,  (     $ set file [...]*.dir;* /prot=o=rwed     $ delete [...]*.*;*   E Since the delete command attempts to delete each .DIR file before theaH contents, it fails because a non-empty directory cannot be deleted.  TheJ workaround is to use the uparrow and repeat the delete command until there are no errors.  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.orgL> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 09:04:21 -0500X2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> Subject: Re: Recursive Deletionw. Message-ID: <3DE37F65.5B891E66@mindspring.com>   Alan Adams wrote:   J > delete [...]*.*;* will delete everything down from the current directoryG > EXCEPT the directories. You will get "not empty" messages for all the  > directories. > D > Delete [somewhere...]*.*;* will delete from [somewhere] downwards. >gN > Repeat the command and the empty directories will be deleted. Keep repeatingJ > until no errors. It's a bit stupid, but that's how it is. File searching? > returns directories before their contents, hence the problem.T  + Before you begin this, you may also need toi- first set the protection on all the files and- directories to allow deletion.   Atlant   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:18:13 +0000 (UTC)J, From: lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis), Subject: Re: Removing phantom TCPIP services. Message-ID: <arvsal$ree$1@newslocal.mitre.org>  z Alder <PGDEHMKOKIMD@spammotel.com> writes in article <3DE2E51B.1050708@spammotel.com> dated Tue, 26 Nov 2002 03:06:10 GMT:Q >Using TCPIP$CONFIG to shut down the network, I get a message telling me to stop dO >the processes associated with several BG devices, but when I do a SHOW DEVICE [ >BG*, they do not appear.]  J The correct command is "show device bg"; the * will screw up your results.  Q >Could someone please tell me how to clean out these DCE services from the point   >of view of TCP/IP Services?   I think it's       $ tcpipn0     TCPIP> set noservice [your_unwanted_service]  5 There's also a help command inside the tcpip utility.o  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.orge> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 02:22:50 -0500n0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>, Subject: Re: Removing phantom TCPIP services/ Message-ID: <3DE3213A.A0323777@vl.videotron.ca>M   Alder wrote:Q > Could someone please tell me how to clean out these DCE services from the pointo > of view of TCP/IP Services?.   @SYS$MANAGER:TCPIP$CONFIGo  K Choose the server components, locate the offending service, and disable thesL service from there (and stop it as well). This gets done in the TCPIP ".com"M database which is used at startup to call each product specific startup file.   G If the service is not configurable via those menus, you can disable the  "chocolat" service with:   TCPIP> DISABLE SERVICE chocolat " TCPIP> SET CONF NOSERVICE chocolat TCPIP> SET NOSERVICE chocolat   M You may also wish to SHOW CONF SERV/FULL before the above to see what command L procedure is used to  start the service, and then check your various startupG command procedures during boot to make sure it isn't "manually" startedtC (especially if this is a separate service not provided by digital).:   ------------------------------   Date: 25 Nov 2002 19:12:06 GMT# From: rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam , Subject: Re: SMTP non working after upgrade.' Message-ID: <artsm6$btn$1@tejo.csic.es>a  b In article <3DE26184.F69E8ADD@vl.videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> writes:% >rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam wrote:rJ >> The problem happen with all the arriving message, the system is able toP >> deliber the message (it arrive to the user mailbox) but the user is no notifyP >> of the arriving message but if he enter in the mail utility the mail is thereQ >> as a new mail, But the process in the queue keep in the process state, but notiR >> using using any recourse, seems to be waiting for some call to return and block
 >> the queue.  >2N >"But the process is in the queue"... which queue are you talking about ? What3 >commands do you enter to obtain that information ?0 >@   I do v   sh queue/all *smtp*w) Generic server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_00e  J Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_01, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT  4   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status4   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------"       2  02112519304566_TCPIP$SMTP8                          TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing  J Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_02, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT  4   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status4   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------"       5  02112519402761_TCPIP$SMTP8                          TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing  J Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_05, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT  4   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status4   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------"       6  02112519404194_TCPIP$SMTP8                          TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing    	 If I run a   TCPIP ANALYZE MAIL.m   All that jobs became stopping.  7 the queues must be stop/queue/reset so could be cleared     the smtp stoped and the procces.   STOP/IDr   So the files could be cleared.  e >The way VMSmail works:a >mM >MAIL$SEND ADD_ADDRESS does a basic verification (and established DECNET linki >if adressee is remote)a >eL >then, when you call MAIL$SEND_MESSAGE, it actually delivers the contents toM >each of those adresses it called ADD_ADDRESS for, and after each adressee, ag& >success or failure routine is called. >hL >For a recipient that is on the same node and the SMTP server, it would meanM >that it would get stuck inside of MAIL$SEND_MESSAGE. I believe the broadcast : >to terminal is done before the success routine is called. >h[ >So MAIL$SEND_MESSAGE might be waiting for some resource or confirmation before proceeding.e >s >Questions:  >eM >if you try to deliver to "pastry::chef"@pastry.chocolate.com" does it behaved> >the same was as if you tried to : chef@pastry.chocolate.com ? >eL >(i.e. if VMS mail is done via DECNET, does it behave the same as if it were >done direct on same node) ? >i  D The MAIL done via DECnet only, arrive cleanly and the mail is notify  sM >Also, when the user logs on, or starts MAIL, is he given an updated count ofeJ >messages ? If not, it might indicate a problem prior to MAIL$SEND_MESSAGED >updating VMSMAIL_PROFILE.DATA. Have you tried ANA/RMS of the file ?  $ When logon the new mails are notify.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:28:14 GMT / From: "Jeff Goodwin" <jgoodwin@maine.rrr-r.com>O, Subject: Re: SMTP non working after upgrade.7 Message-ID: <iqME9.5157$f6.117267@twister.maine.rr.com>a  J My newserver doesn't have the original posting, so I'm not sure if this is
 the issue.  F Have you installed the VMS731_SYS_V0200 ECO?  I've installed it and amF having SMTP hang issues similar to yours.  I'm contacted support and I( understand the issue is being addressed.   -Jeff     0 <rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam> wrote in message! news:artsm6$btn$1@tejo.csic.es...o: > In article <3DE26184.F69E8ADD@vl.videotron.ca>, JF Mezei) <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> writes:o' > >rifepe@langran.iem.csic.espam wrote:tL > >> The problem happen with all the arriving message, the system is able toK > >> deliber the message (it arrive to the user mailbox) but the user is noe notifyL > >> of the arriving message but if he enter in the mail utility the mail is thereiK > >> as a new mail, But the process in the queue keep in the process state,i but notiJ > >> using using any recourse, seems to be waiting for some call to return	 and blocka > >> the queue.  > >sK > >"But the process is in the queue"... which queue are you talking about ?* What5 > >commands do you enter to obtain that information ?* > >h >  > I do >- > sh queue/all *smtp*a+ > Generic server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_00a >rL > Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_01, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT >n6 >   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status6 >   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------$ >       2  02112519304566_TCPIP$SMTP: >                          TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing >oL > Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_02, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT >A6 >   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status6 >   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------$ >       5  02112519402761_TCPIP$SMTP: >                          TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing >dL > Server queue TCPIP$SMTP_LANGRA_05, busy, on LANGRA::, mounted form DEFAULT > 6 >   Entry  Jobname         Username     Blocks  Status6 >   -----  -------         --------     ------  ------$ >       6  02112519404194_TCPIP$SMTP: >                          TCPIP$SMTP        6  Processing >c ><
 > If I run >4 > TCPIP ANALYZE MAIL.n >c  > All that jobs became stopping. >r9 > the queues must be stop/queue/reset so could be clearedt >e" > the smtp stoped and the procces. >i	 > STOP/IDw >   > So the files could be cleared. >h > >The way VMSmail works:  > >mJ > >MAIL$SEND ADD_ADDRESS does a basic verification (and established DECNET link > >if adressee is remote)s > >eK > >then, when you call MAIL$SEND_MESSAGE, it actually delivers the contentsi toC > >each of those adresses it called ADD_ADDRESS for, and after eache adressee, al( > >success or failure routine is called. > >tI > >For a recipient that is on the same node and the SMTP server, it wouldh meanE > >that it would get stuck inside of MAIL$SEND_MESSAGE. I believe thee	 broadcaste< > >to terminal is done before the success routine is called. > >aJ > >So MAIL$SEND_MESSAGE might be waiting for some resource or confirmation before proceeding. > >t
 > >Questions:a > >RH > >if you try to deliver to "pastry::chef"@pastry.chocolate.com" does it behave@ > >the same was as if you tried to : chef@pastry.chocolate.com ? > >fI > >(i.e. if VMS mail is done via DECNET, does it behave the same as if it- were > >done direct on same node) ? > >o >0F > The MAIL done via DECnet only, arrive cleanly and the mail is notify >cL > >Also, when the user logs on, or starts MAIL, is he given an updated count ofL > >messages ? If not, it might indicate a problem prior to MAIL$SEND_MESSAGEF > >updating VMSMAIL_PROFILE.DATA. Have you tried ANA/RMS of the file ? > & > When logon the new mails are notify. >h >n   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:13:39 -0600-& From: tolkien <limer1don@netscape.net>% Subject: Suggestions for Removing LAT-8 Message-ID: <srs6uu470qs8l5a7t0df7hm0vtb1fe4nq9@4ax.com>  E I have 2 Alpha Servers which are running LAT.  Our Datacom DepartmentrB is currently Bridging it across the Network which is creating some	 overhead.3  C Both servers run OpenVMS 7.2-1.  We currently have about 25 devices>> which are utilizing the LAT which we would like to move to IP.  E I would like to see any feedback from any of you that have ever movedpB devices from LAT to IP as far as pitfalls, gotcha's and success's.  ! You can reply to the group or to m   sfm1115@bjc.orgi     Thanks,    Shawna   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:17:33 -0700,+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com>o) Subject: Re: Suggestions for Removing LATB% Message-ID: <3DE3908D.50700@MMaz.com>    tolkien wrote:  F >I have 2 Alpha Servers which are running LAT.  Our Datacom DepartmentC >is currently Bridging it across the Network which is creating some 
 >overhead. >iD >Both servers run OpenVMS 7.2-1.  We currently have about 25 devices? >which are utilizing the LAT which we would like to move to IP.  >hF >I would like to see any feedback from any of you that have ever movedC >devices from LAT to IP as far as pitfalls, gotcha's and success's.n >r >    >r Shawn,  H you mentioned the version of VMS but not the hardware or which IP stack B you are using...  Years past, LAT was the ticket for LAN terminal G sessions because of its efficiency in reducing the I/O overhead on the fG host system.  On slower VAX hardware, the I/O overhead of a TCP telnet  @ session when compared to an equivalent LAT terminal session was H astonishing, primarily because LAT buffered multiple I/Os into a single B I/O packet where as telnet handled each keystroke as a single I/O.  G Now with todays faster systems, one can argue that there is enough CPU  G horse power to absorb any telnet I/O overhead.  To be honest with you, mI we use both, telnet supported by way of TCPware and good old fashion LAT hF connections for dumb VT terminals.  Frankly Interrupt Stack or Kernel D time due to terminal I/O traffic has never an issue and we're still I running on a VAX, so unless you're running something like a 8250, or any o: other low VUP boat anchor, you're probably going to be ok.   Regards,   Barry    -- o  @ Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   A E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028c   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:34:00 +0000 (UTC)I. From: Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com>) Subject: Re: Suggestions for Removing LATM, Message-ID: <as0498$d6v$1@reader1.panix.com>  K On Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:13:39 -0600, tolkien <limer1don@netscape.net> wrote:sG > I have 2 Alpha Servers which are running LAT.  Our Datacom Department:D > is currently Bridging it across the Network which is creating some > overhead.nE > Both servers run OpenVMS 7.2-1.  We currently have about 25 devicess@ > which are utilizing the LAT which we would like to move to IP.  < If any of these 25 devices are actual VT terminals using DECD multisessions through a terminal server, then there is no direct IP D alternative on the VT terminal itself.  You may need to replace the > VT's with PC's (running Linux perhaps?), or run a third party F software like NetworkingDynamics Multisessions on one of AlphaServers.   --  7 Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> (lose the Q's)h   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Nov 2002 15:06:45 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)t0 Subject: RE: System uptime - The Uptimes Project3 Message-ID: <h2o$$33fmJCC@eisner.encompasserve.org>m  W In article <01C2948A.6EB0E680@sulfer.icius.com>, Shane Smith <ssmith@icius.com> writes:oI > If the Irish Railways VAX is still up, maybe we can persuade someone tohH > send stats from it? Slap these Windoze Weenies down a little... ;-) IfH > it's still in service, it'd be something like 17 years constant uptime > by now wouldn't it?a   It is not still up.r  F But I think the folks running the contest only count systems connected> to the Internet and the Irish Railways VAX was running VMS V3.   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:52:42 -0700 (MST)n" From: John Nebel <nebel@csdco.com>  Subject: TIFF processing on VMS?G Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.21.0211261034450.18337-100000@athena.csdco.com>   J Does anyone know of a VMS program for rezizing large TIFFs?  I've ended upJ with several 1.8 GB TIFFs which exceed anything than can be processed withH Photoshop on a Mac.  Resizing them down for the time being is a possible	 solution.i  H I tried Mac Imagemagick and after the program executed for 12 hours withI several malloc failures, figured that it was never going to get anywhere.s  ( VMS Imagemagick didn't seem much better.  J The images can be re-scanned, however, it would be a pain taking apart theC document holders again, paper money sheets in a museum.  The person D who scanned them didn't realize that the default 2540 dpi setting ofI the scanner, whilst working fine for single bank notes, may not have beena a good idea for sheets.s  I This is clearly a case where a 64-bit desktop would be handy and it looksg> like it will very soon be a requirement for professional imageI processing.  I can't use a Sinar electronic camera at the full capability.J of the hardware because of the limitations on the desktop.  A Creo flatbed scanner has the same problem.@  
 John Nebel   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 12:16:05 +0100i$ From: "Peter Flunger" <p-i-b@gmx.at>) Subject: Re: Weak $DELPRC and mighty AMDS 0 Message-ID: <arvl5n$6ip$1@newsreader1.netway.at>  6 "Valentin Likoum" <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru> wrote > H >   And while we are on the topic, another close but unrelated question:H > bulletproof X25-related processes. They can't be stopped by any means.E > $EXIT, $FORCEX, $DELPRC, all force the processes to loop somethere.aG > AMDS is out of luck too. Processes are in COM state, so many articles   K If you are having problems when stopping processes that declared themselveso: as X.25 applications, you need to get a patch from Compaq.F This problem has been in place with ( AXP ) versions 1.1B, 1.3 and 1.5F ( I am not sure about 1.6, as i have'nt had the time to test it, yet )> The file you need is an updated X25$NWDRIVER.EXE, that has notH been shipped as a working copy  for any of the versions mentioned above,= and that had never been included in any of the ECOs for X.25.iG God only knows why Compaq sends this one out to customers reporting the I problem for three versions, but never has incorporated this fix in any of  the official kits. Petern   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.654 ************************