1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 01 Oct 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 542       Contents:P Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  (mistakenly released rant and cancel) cancelC Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) C Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT) 0 Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"...0 Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"...0 Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"...0 Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"...0 Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"... Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering P Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering (was Infinite loop bug in TCPIP 5.3 NFS   client witP Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering (was Infinite loop bug in TCPIP 5.3 NFS client with P Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering (was Infinite loop bug in TCPIP 5.3 NFS client with $ Re: CFGETERRORs with TCP/IP 5.1 SMTP! Re: Changing Strings in EXE files ( CSWS: Inconsistent apache$input behavior2 DCL tip of the day: 7.3-1 F$CvTime's new arguments Re: ds10L + sound  Re: DSM Docs On Line? ! Re: e-mail web client (SilkyMail) ! Re: e-mail web client (SilkyMail) 0 Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ?0 Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ?P Re: I want Citrix Metaframe Server for OpenVMS !!!! was (Re: OpenVMSMultisession" jEdit support for Macro-32 & Bliss& Re: jEdit support for Macro-32 & Bliss& Re: jEdit support for Macro-32 & Bliss  OpenVMS Documentation Suggestion$ Re: OpenVMS Documentation Suggestion! Re: Pathworks, and shares on PC's  search command RE: search command Re: search command Re: search command Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  RE: Suggestion for SEARCH  RE: Suggestion for SEARCH  RE: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  RE: Suggestion for SEARCH  RE: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  Re: Suggestion for SEARCH  UAF Problem  Re: UAF Problem  Re: UAF Problem # Re: Upgrade from OpenVMS 6.2 to 7.2 # Re: Upgrade from OpenVMS 6.2 to 7.2  Re: VMS 7.3 DCL / MX0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)! Re: WASD Security Advisory Issued 6 Re: What do the readers want in comp.os.vms / INFO-VAX6 Re: What do the readers want in comp.os.vms / INFO-VAX6 Re: What do the readers want in comp.os.vms / INFO-VAX Writing a new VMS filesystem ?3 Writing a VMS CLI ?, was: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH 7 Re: Writing a VMS CLI ?, was: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH $ ZDnet:  Alpha Preps for Grand Finale  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:00:40 -0400  From: GcE <gce@gce.com> Y Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  (mistakenly released rant and cancel) cancel + Message-ID: <anck19$9ij$1@bob.news.rcn.net>    Tim Llewellyn wrote: >  > GcE wrote: > , >>Nutz...meant to mail reply to Atlant only. >>D >>Is there a way in Mozilla to cancel postings? If not it is I think. >>the first newsreader I've used lacking such. >  > 2 > Probably, in Netscape 4.7 its in the Edit menu.  > A > The problem is once the post hits INFO-VAX you can't cancel all 3 > those emails (I've been bitten by that recently).  > 2 > What the situation is with Google I am not sure. > 	 > regards  >  >  >>Glenn Everhart >  > Q Cancel message is in the Mozilla edit menu too, but is grayed out even though the N message was mine. Not implemented perhaps or for some reason not recognized...  C The buttons in mxrn are laid out a shade differently and my fingers = recalled the wrong set...apologies to fellow non-rant-lovers.  Glenn Everhart   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:10:14 +0100 ( From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1>L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)) Message-ID: <3D996676.CC54A88C@127.0.0.1>    Bob Ceculski wrote:  > w > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message news:<bPFl9.363298$5r1.16859132@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...  > > (URL below wraps)  > > P > > http://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/29/technology/circuits/29CHIP.html?ex=1033876$ > > 800&en=573e03cf736d51a5&ei=5062& > F > all this tells us is that google can't afford to pay for a few extraE > volts of electicity ... doubts about whether co's will want to move E > to a new architecture are old news ... this repeats the doubts from " > the past ... useless article ...  5 Look at this power (pun not intended) in perspective.   G More power (not volts specifically) = more heat = more air conditioning G = more UPSes = more contracts and so on. Ever been in a place where the ? heat output of a human also has to be taken into consideration?   F So it is more than just the power bills (again puns not intended) that matter.    Did someone say floorspace?    --  ? Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:32:31 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)= Message-ID: <3Rem9.22797$ji3.29141@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>   5 "Nic Clews" <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in message # news:3D996676.CC54A88C@127.0.0.1...  > Bob Ceculski wrote:  > > 9 > > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message ? news:<bPFl9.363298$5r1.16859132@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>...  > > > (URL below wraps)  > > >  > > > L http://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/29/technology/circuits/29CHIP.html?ex=1033876& > > > 800&en=573e03cf736d51a5&ei=5062& > > H > > all this tells us is that google can't afford to pay for a few extraG > > volts of electicity ... doubts about whether co's will want to move G > > to a new architecture are old news ... this repeats the doubts from $ > > the past ... useless article ... > 7 > Look at this power (pun not intended) in perspective.  > I > More power (not volts specifically) = more heat = more air conditioning I > = more UPSes = more contracts and so on. Ever been in a place where the A > heat output of a human also has to be taken into consideration?  > H > So it is more than just the power bills (again puns not intended) that	 > matter.  >  > Did someone say floorspace?   G Thzt pretty much sums it up, especially in Govt. Gray "Blackout" Davis' L State of California. Lot of efforts being made by Mary Mcdowell and the crew on this....    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 09:29:39 -0400 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT). Message-ID: <3D99A343.9BF80864@mindspring.com>   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:   2 > Thzt pretty much sums it up, especially in Govt.- > Gray "Blackout" Davis' State of California.   - Uh oh, someone yell at Terry. He's once again + inserted a gratuitous slam at the Left into  an otherwise on-topic post.   1 'Cause otherwise I'll have to explain to everyone . how the blackouts have now been proven to have. been caused by Texas energy firms deliberately! attempting to gouge California...    Atlant   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 13:35:34 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT). Message-ID: <Gwhm9.272085$Jo.125606@rwcrnsc53>  ? "Atlant Schmidt" <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote in message ( news:3D99A343.9BF80864@mindspring.com... > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > 4 > > Thzt pretty much sums it up, especially in Govt./ > > Gray "Blackout" Davis' State of California.  > / > Uh oh, someone yell at Terry. He's once again - > inserted a gratuitous slam at the Left into  > an otherwise on-topic post.   ? Why don't YOU yell? Too lazy? I can be reached at 508 881 5563.   2 Hey, ever fight fpor your country? Dodge a bullet?  " The crap I do for the likes of you     > 3 > 'Cause otherwise I'll have to explain to everyone 0 > how the blackouts have now been proven to have0 > been caused by Texas energy firms deliberately# > attempting to gouge California...  >  > Atlant >   E OK, let's see the legal proof. Something that will stand up in court.    I'm waiting...   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:57:55 -0500 & From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com>L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)8 Message-ID: <aeajpuk4701mbqoqohpcsf8nr98hkmivfb@4ax.com>  F On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 14:30:48 GMT, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:   > 6 >"Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message> >news:bPFl9.363298$5r1.16859132@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com... >> (URL below wraps) >> >>M >http://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/29/technology/circuits/29CHIP.html?ex=1033876 # >> 800&en=573e03cf736d51a5&ei=5062&  > F >Rats - looks as if they make you register for it after it's no longerJ >current.  So I'll reproduce it below for the convenience of those who may >find that difficult:  >   + Now there's a little ethical irony for you.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:06:49 -0400  From: GcE <gce@gce.com> L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)+ Message-ID: <ancdbr$l9h$1@bob.news.rcn.net>    Atlant Schmidt wrote:  > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  >  > 2 >>Thzt pretty much sums it up, especially in Govt.- >>Gray "Blackout" Davis' State of California.  >  > / > Uh oh, someone yell at Terry. He's once again - > inserted a gratuitous slam at the Left into  > an otherwise on-topic post.  > 3 > 'Cause otherwise I'll have to explain to everyone 0 > how the blackouts have now been proven to have0 > been caused by Texas energy firms deliberately# > attempting to gouge California...  >  > Atlant >  > & Please keep political rants off C.O.V.J Had California not had its regulatory mispolicy in place, there would havdH not been the shortages that enabled Enron and others to game the market.H The possibility of such gaming (indeed, its inevitability) had been wellI predicted by folks critical of the legislature's moves there. Yet another G example of a legislature that causes huge damage through being clueless I about what they were doing. Doesn't the behavior of Congress over in D.C. E give ample illustration of how this can happen? The more activist the F legislature the oftener in ny observation this happens. Generally thatI has happened under Democratic administrations, but while DMCA and similar H giveaways of public information and secrity research inhibition happenedG under Clinton, the rush to put in "anti terror" placebos (whose effects Q on civil liberties are alas NOT harmless) happened under bush this time. With not ? much criticism from either side of the aisle when it counted...  ,grumbles of disgust.   = The "proof" isn't worth the powder to blow it to Hell though. F If anything all that is proven is that legislators tend to be cluelessE and that some business people have the ethics of alley cats. A plague  on both their houses.    Glenn Everhart   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:32:46 -0400  From: GcE <gce@gce.com> L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)+ Message-ID: <ancesf$pir$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   * Nutz...meant to mail reply to Atlant only.  B Is there a way in Mozilla to cancel postings? If not it is I think, the first newsreader I've used lacking such. Glenn Everhart   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 11:30:16 -0400 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT). Message-ID: <3D99BF88.C2D3AFF3@mindspring.com>  
 GcE wrote:  ( > Please keep political rants off C.O.V.? > Had California not had its regulatory mispolicy in place, ...   & So what you're saying is, essentially:  - "(You) Please keep (your) political rants off ' of COV, but first, let me give you *MY*  political rant".  ! Have I got that just about right?    Atlant   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 15:58:06 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)0 Message-ID: <3D99C3F5.170C5B32@blueyonder.co.uk>  
 GcE wrote: > , > Nutz...meant to mail reply to Atlant only. > D > Is there a way in Mozilla to cancel postings? If not it is I think. > the first newsreader I've used lacking such.  0 Probably, in Netscape 4.7 its in the Edit menu.   ? The problem is once the post hits INFO-VAX you can't cancel all 1 those emails (I've been bitten by that recently).   0 What the situation is with Google I am not sure.   regards    > Glenn Everhart   --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk    H * PLEASE NOTE tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk address is NO LONGER VALID *   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 17:00:12 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> L Subject: Re: "Intel's Huge Bet Turns Iffy":  Doubts hit the mainstream (NYT)= Message-ID: <vwkm9.25102$ji3.29435@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>   < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message( news:Gwhm9.272085$Jo.125606@rwcrnsc53... > A > "Atlant Schmidt" <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote in message * > news:3D99A343.9BF80864@mindspring.com... > > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > > 6 > > > Thzt pretty much sums it up, especially in Govt.1 > > > Gray "Blackout" Davis' State of California.  > > 1 > > Uh oh, someone yell at Terry. He's once again / > > inserted a gratuitous slam at the Left into  > > an otherwise on-topic post.  > A > Why don't YOU yell? Too lazy? I can be reached at 508 881 5563.  > 4 > Hey, ever fight fpor your country? Dodge a bullet? > $ > The crap I do for the likes of you >  >  > > 5 > > 'Cause otherwise I'll have to explain to everyone 2 > > how the blackouts have now been proven to have2 > > been caused by Texas energy firms deliberately% > > attempting to gouge California...  > > 
 > > Atlant > >  > G > OK, let's see the legal proof. Something that will stand up in court.  >  > I'm waiting... > G Still waiting. How was your tour in Desert Storm or Viet Nam? Or was it  Berkeley or Sweden????  L Had I known I'd be defending vermin like you, I might have chosen one of the3 latter venues, like Prevaricator in Chief Clinton .   H LONG LIVE AMERICA, MORE THAN ENOUGH TO KICK ANY AND ALL TALIBAN BUTT!!!!  
 Viva W-88!   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:49:36 -0500 & From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com>9 Subject: Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"... 8 Message-ID: <3o9jpucr6q31sasb9h5jj45r16d4gpk4mn@4ax.com>  F On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 21:38:38 GMT, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:   > J >I can see why you don't have problems with Carly:  you two appear to have7 >similar concepts of what constitutes ethical behavior.   $ Well, aren't we sanctimonious today.   > M >I've never lied on a resume to match a stated job requirement, regardless of F >my own suspicions about its relevance.  And I've never had difficultyF >getting a job I wanted despite failing to match any such requirement:L >requirements are just as negotiable as the other aspects of employment, and= >that's the way to address the kind of issue you raise above.   @ I've never lied on my resume either.  And, due to very fortunateE circumstances, I've always been able to choose the positions I wanted D to apply for, and have never been unemployed - especially during bad economic times.   B One's need to eat - and support a family - can make one do strange6 things, though.  But for the grace of God, there go I.  A If someone can't do the job they've been hired to do, then by all C means, take them out of that job.  However, if they can perform all @ that's required of them, no piece of paper should mean more than actual ability.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:44:10 -0500 & From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com>9 Subject: Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"... 8 Message-ID: <qg9jpu00qoj8e2e01a3i7jf3nno0b8g20r@4ax.com>  , On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 15:40:29 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:   
 >jlsue wrote: A >> To equate some inflated item on a resume with outright fraud - F >> especially after the employee displays their true value - is silly, >> imho. > L >Would you like to go to a hospital where it is known that they keep doctorsN >who lied about their medical degree  even if they haven't killed anyone yet ?  C Well!  There's a leap.  99.9% (admittedly, a made-up number) of the D jobs are not life-or-death positions.  And it's difficult to believeA that someone without the required knowledge would be able to fool " other professionals for very long.  E And, for the rest of the world, in those non-life-or-death jobs, it's 7 a person's ability to do the job that keeps them there.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:53:49 -0500 & From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com>9 Subject: Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"... 8 Message-ID: <e2ajpukvg9qh7apappll269ba8aur4r46f@4ax.com>  , On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 15:35:34 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:    >Fred Kleinsorge wrote: I >> want to insinuate) that it means that the HP merger was wrong, or that 3 >> somehow HP should be tarred with the same brush.  > H >Consider that the merger passed by a razor thin margin because a singleM >shareholder (Deutche Bank) was bribed at the last minute. One must ask about 4 >what other institutions received similar treatment.  D Ho hum.  Slander and libel do not suit you.  Either take it to court" with evidence, or shut up already.   > G >The fact that it is known that Carly used very "convincing tactics" to L >convince at least one institutional investor to vote for her means that oneV >will wonder what other institutions were the targets of Carly's "convincing tactics".  F Hogwash.  Nothing of the sort is "known".  You suspect, but you've yet- to collect hard evidence to prove your point.   ? If there is impropriety, then it is up to the FTC and/or SEC to A investigate and level charges.  Failing that, you're just blowing  smoke.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 14:42:22 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)9 Subject: Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"... 5 Message-ID: <ancc8d$cnjgu$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>   8 In article <3o9jpucr6q31sasb9h5jj45r16d4gpk4mn@4ax.com>,) 	jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> writes:  > D > One's need to eat - and support a family - can make one do strange8 > things, though.  But for the grace of God, there go I.  E Hmmm.  The end justifies the means.  That covers a multitude of sins.    > C > If someone can't do the job they've been hired to do, then by all E > means, take them out of that job.  However, if they can perform all B > that's required of them, no piece of paper should mean more than > actual ability.   F In an ideal world.  But sadly, most people have to deal with reality.o   bill    --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 14:16:21 GMT 1 From: LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (Jerry Leslie) 9 Subject: Re: "Underqualified tipster backed HP merger"... ; Message-ID: <V6im9.49959$8o3.1281604@twister.austin.rr.com>   ' jlsue (jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com) wrote: . : On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 15:40:29 -0400, JF Mezei' : <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  :  : >jlsue wrote: C : >> To equate some inflated item on a resume with outright fraud - H : >> especially after the employee displays their true value - is silly,
 : >> imho. : > N : >Would you like to go to a hospital where it is known that they keep doctorsK : >who lied about their medical degree  even if they haven't killed anyone   : >yet ? : E : Well!  There's a leap.  99.9% (admittedly, a made-up number) of the F : jobs are not life-or-death positions.  And it's difficult to believeC : that someone without the required knowledge would be able to fool $ : other professionals for very long. :   H Ferdinand Waldo Demara, Jr, the subject of a book and movie, assumed theJ role of a doctor in the Royal Canadian Navy, even though he had no medical traiining...  8    http://www.lawrencefreelibrary.org/english/demara.htm    F. W. Demara Jr.   I   "..,Demara's career as an imposter spanned three decades and included a H    bizarre variety of pseudo-identities. His most famous exploit was theI    adoption of the identity of Dr. Joseph Cyr and his subsequent hitch in D    the Royal Canadian Navy as a surgeon. As Cyr, he managed numerousF    successful surgeries including the removal of a bullet from a man'sI    chest. Gifted with a sharp intellect and a photographic memory, Demara F    simply taught himself the techniques necessary for his deception by    reading text books..."     2 --Jerry Leslie   (my opinions are strictly my own)9   Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for email    ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 13:20:30 +0100 (MET) 9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> $ Subject: Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering; Message-ID: <01KN5H8TBLNS9QWKOO@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>   E > > Makes me worry what other blatant bugs might be lurking in there.  > > > That is what you get when you port software from another OS. > A > Does anyone know if there is a long term strategy for the TCPIP I > product on VMS?  Do they plan to keep it "lowest common denominator" to G > make it easy to port the new versions of Unix based TCPIP software to I > VMS, or do they plan to make the TCPIP Services software evolve its own C > independant track to increase quality, robustness and "VMSness"?    = Actually, it is sad that these are the only two alternatives.   F > having a more "VMS" TCPIP stack might improve quality and robustnessJ > quite a bit, but it might delay introduction of new features that arrive > on Unix platforms.     Again, a sad choice.  G The assumption in both cases, however, is that the porting of features  I from unix is something that will stay.  I think it was with 5.0 that the  F VMS TCPIP kernel started being a unix port.  Sure, TCPIP has improved I since UCX 3.2 or whatever, but I don't think that there is any TECHNICAL  ? reason why this should be connected to moving to a unix kernel.   H TCPIP is by its very nature OS-independent.  The VMS TCPIP folks should I have their own kernel from the ground up.  From the inside, it should be  H pure VMS as far as the look and feel goes.  From the outside, it should F follow the standard to the letter AND interface well with stacks from  other operating systems.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:12:26 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> Y Subject: Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering (was Infinite loop bug in TCPIP 5.3 NFS   client wit 8 Message-ID: <5e0jpu0ut0fa04ela1eu307s58rega9ccr@4ax.com>  , On Tue, 01 Oct 2002 06:50:39 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:    >Alan Greig wrote:D >> Makes me worry what other blatant bugs might be lurking in there. > = >That is what you get when you port software from another OS.  > O >Does anyone know if there is a long term strategy for the TCPIP product on VMS N >? Do they plan to keep it "lowest common denominator" to make it easy to portN >the new versions of Unix based TCPIP software to VMS, or do they plan to makeI >the TCPIP Services software evolve its own independant track to increase $ >quality, robustness and "VMSness" ?  B But this bug is specifically in an area where it tries to make theF interface *more* VMS like. The problem obviously lies in lack of basicA testing. If simple directory commands fail on an nfs /structure=5 F volume then I conclude that almost no realistic testing of the feature has been done.  C But, in general, l  am fairly happy with the way TCPIP nfs tries to B make the nfs protocol as friendly as possible to VMS applications.  M >having a more "VMS" TCPIP stack might improve quality and robustness quite a T >bit, but it might delay introduction of new features that arrive on Unix platforms.   -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:49:49 +0100 % From: Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net> Y Subject: Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering (was Infinite loop bug in TCPIP 5.3 NFS client with  8 Message-ID: <ilripukqsd21af7chglm8lr90qkjb5h8fm@4ax.com>  C On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 13:21:08 +0100, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>  wrote:  1 >On Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:05:51 -0400, David Beatty * ><David.Beatty@qwertysasasdfgh.com> wrote: >  >>' >>Yes, ECO 1 is available and there are  >>quite a few NFS client fixes.  > G >Thanks, just grabbed "Compaq TCPIP] AXPVMS-TCPIP_ECO-V0503-181-4 TCPIP 7 >V5.3 for OpenVMS Alpha" but it doesn't fix the problem  > D >Guess I'll have to report it. Anyone from TCPIP engineering reading >this?  F Ok, I've formally reported this and the CSC has confirmed it as a bug.D I have to say this worries me. Am I the only person in the world who? has tried an NFS mount with /structure=5? The problem should be E obvious to absolutely anyone who mounts /structure=5.  Yet nobody has 7 noticed it in the several months 5.3 has been shipping.   A Makes me worry what other blatant bugs might be lurking in there.      >>David R> Beatty  >>E >>On Fri, 27 Sep 2002 14:16:02 +0100, Alan Greig <a.greig@virgin.net>  >>wrote: >>G >>>Is there an ECO out for TCPIP 5.3 yet? If so any chance it fixes the . >>>following problem with /structure-5 mounts. >>>  >>> tcpip sho ver  >>> : >>>  Compaq TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.37 >>>  on a AlphaStation 400 4/233 running OpenVMS V7.3-1  >>>  >>>/structure=2  >>> 2 >>>$ dir/siz/date     dnfs1:[weealf_manman_backup] >>> ) >>>Directory DNFS1:[WEEALF_MANMAN_BACKUP]  >>> 8 >>>ALAN.BCK;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>ALAN.BCK;2            110250  26-SEP-2002 11:16:49.698 >>>ALAN.BCK;1                 0  26-SEP-2002 11:16:14.398 >>>MANMAN.BCK;1         2419137  25-SEP-2002 14:51:56.208 >>>MANMAN.DIR;1               1  25-SEP-2002 12:11:46.648 >>>SADMAN.BCK;2            4788  25-SEP-2002 13:45:08.338 >>>SADMAN.BCK;1           45612  25-SEP-2002 13:42:18.198 >>>ZLAN.BCK;3           1054976  27-SEP-2002 13:52:11.408 >>>ZLAN.BCK;2           1005102  27-SEP-2002 13:44:13.668 >>>ZLAN.BCK;1            178983  27-SEP-2002 10:46:06.06 >>> % >>>Total of 10 files, 5035317 blocks.  >>> 7 >>>$ dir/siz/date  DNFS1:[weealf_manman_backup]alan.bck  >>> ) >>>Directory DNFS1:[WEEALF_MANMAN_BACKUP]  >>> 8 >>>ALAN.BCK;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>ALAN.BCK;2            110250  26-SEP-2002 11:16:49.698 >>>ALAN.BCK;1                 0  26-SEP-2002 11:16:14.39 >>> # >>>Total of 3 files, 326718 blocks.  >>>$ >>>  >>> . >>>But now the same thing mounted /structure=5 >>>  >>> ) >>>Directory DNFS1:[weealf_manman_backup]  >>> 8 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;2            110250  26-SEP-2002 11:16:49.698 >>>alan.bck;1                 0  26-SEP-2002 11:16:14.398 >>>manman.bck;1         2419137  25-SEP-2002 14:51:56.208 >>>manman.DIR;1               1  25-SEP-2002 12:11:46.648 >>>sadman.bck;2            4788  25-SEP-2002 13:45:08.338 >>>sadman.bck;1           45612  25-SEP-2002 13:42:18.198 >>>zlan.bck;3           1054976  27-SEP-2002 13:52:11.408 >>>zlan.bck;2           1005102  27-SEP-2002 13:44:13.668 >>>zlan.bck;1            178983  27-SEP-2002 10:46:06.06 >>> % >>>Total of 10 files, 5035317 blocks.  >>> 
 >>>But now >>> 7 >>>$ dir/siz/date  DNFS1:[weealf_manman_backup]alan.bck  >>> ) >>>Directory DNFS1:[weealf_manman_backup]  >>> 8 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.408 >>>alan.bck;3            216468  26-SEP-2002 13:05:15.40 >>>  >>>and so on for ever    -- Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 06:50:39 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> Y Subject: Re: Attn: TCPIP engineering (was Infinite loop bug in TCPIP 5.3 NFS client with  , Message-ID: <3D997DF1.52ECD338@videotron.ca>   Alan Greig wrote: C > Makes me worry what other blatant bugs might be lurking in there.   < That is what you get when you port software from another OS.  N Does anyone know if there is a long term strategy for the TCPIP product on VMSM ? Do they plan to keep it "lowest common denominator" to make it easy to port M the new versions of Unix based TCPIP software to VMS, or do they plan to make H the TCPIP Services software evolve its own independant track to increase# quality, robustness and "VMSness" ?   L having a more "VMS" TCPIP stack might improve quality and robustness quite aS bit, but it might delay introduction of new features that arrive on Unix platforms.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:17:19 GMT - From: "labadie" <labadie_g.tocardsa@decus.fr> - Subject: Re: CFGETERRORs with TCP/IP 5.1 SMTP 1 Message-ID: <jScm9.2$hv2.156793@news.cpqcorp.net>   8 "John Johnstone" <jj_usenet2@yahoo.com> wrote in message# news:3D986CB0.5D8E5EE0@yahoo.com... F > I'm seeing a problem with mail delivery of some messages on an AlphaE > with TCP/IP V5.1 ECO 4,  The messages fail to be delivered with the / > following errors showing in the SMTP logfile:  > B > A permanent error makes this mail undeliverable. Must bounce it.E > %TCPIP-E-SMTP_CFGETERROR, error getting address/domain from control # >  file, type of tridentusa.com<CR> 7 > -RMS-W-RTB, 0 byte record too large for user's buffer  > B Check if PQL_MPGFLQUOTA is not too low, and feel free to raise it.   Regards    Grard   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 09:22:30 -0400 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>* Subject: Re: Changing Strings in EXE files. Message-ID: <3D99A196.9075CF30@mindspring.com>   Jim Agnew wrote:  , > hhmm... now just how much disk DOES google$ > have??????????????????????????????   Umm, "a lot!" :-)    Here's some info about Google:  -   http://www.google.com/press/highlights.html   4 Unfortunately, while it tells you that they use more5 than 10,000 servers, it doesn't answer your question.  But here's an older article:  A   http://www.intel.com/eBusiness/casestudies/snapshots/google.htm   9 It talks about 3500 servers and between 1 and 2 terabytes 6 of *INDEX* data. I've seen numbers that state that the8 page data is of a similar size to the indices, so we can5 extrapolate and very safely guess that Google is well $ upwards of 5 TB of indices+data now.  4 They have a job req which speaks of "hundreds of TB"4 and seems to refer to their own data, not cyberspace6 as a whole, so it sounds like they'll have hundreds of TB of data soon.   Atlant   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 07:29:29 -0600 (MDT)" From: John Nebel <nebel@csdco.com>1 Subject: CSWS: Inconsistent apache$input behavior F Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.21.0210010728325.1905-100000@athena.csdco.com>  I A CGI program processing an SSL form broke after upgrading from VMS 7.2-1 # to 7.2-2.  The CSWS version is 1.2.   H The program issues a single read on apache$input for www_content_length.  G The 7.2-1 behavior was that this worked, the 7.2-2 behavior was that ittF probably would not. The data after the 1607th character would probablyI be in a second record.  A DCL wait of around 1-2 seconds before executing 2 the CGI program appears to act as a temporary fix.  E Clearly the logic can be changed to issue multiple reads, but without I knowing the reason for this, that appears pretty sloppy.  Has anyone elselH seen this?  Hearing that it is meant to be that way would be great, caseI closed.  If there is an unpredictable timing problem, this one is waitinge to bite you.  " It's http://coloradojobs.cdle.org   
 John Nebel   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 08:20:10 -0700g< From: alphaman-nixspam@hsv.sungardtrust.com (Aaron Sakovich); Subject: DCL tip of the day: 7.3-1 F$CvTime's new arguments = Message-ID: <8af17fe1.0210010720.6c52b845@posting.google.com>N   Hi all,U  C Just as a tip for all you folks who love to code the number of days C between two dates, it's now a lot easier from within DCL on 7.3-1. .@ The lexical, F$CVTIME has been modified to add the following new
 arguments:    - DAYOFYEAR
  - HOUROFYEARn  - MINUTEOFYEARn  - SECONDOFYEARI  1 (See HELP LEXICAL F$CVTIME ARGUMENTS, of course.)   A I presume you can imagine what they can be used for, but here's aC couple examples:  " YODA echo f$cvtime(,,"dayofyear") 274f1 YODA echo f$cvtime("22-oct-2002",,"dayofyear") -F f$cvtime(,,"dayofyear")  21  E I can now die in peace knowing I've helped to make the world a bettera place for DCL hackers...   Aaronv   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 14:47:41 GMTa= From: peter.watkinson1@<nospam>ntlworld.com (Peter Watkinson)  Subject: Re: ds10L + sound1 Message-ID: <3d99b233.7323703@news.cable.ntl.com>o  ! On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 16:38:18 GMT, > peter.watkinson1@<nospam>ntlworld.com (Peter Watkinson) wrote:   >  >Hi, >oE >I suppose this is a bit of an odd question. But I was looking at theuG >specs of the DS10L and it seems it comes with only one PCI slot and no G >in built sound capabilities therefore if you put in a vga card you areaD >left without sound. Are there any video + sound PCI cards out there >that work with Alpha X? >gG >Shame really as the DS10L is about the cheapest EV6 system you can buy A >out there and I have read that it is possible to use as Desktop.s! >Pretty cool looking one at that.r >AF >Of course I expect there is absolutely no hope of finding such a card: >that works with VMS, though maybe Tru64 is a possibility. >r >cheers, >  >b >  >e >Peter Watkinson& >peter.watkinson1<nospam>@ntlworld.com >remove <nospam> to reply :-)O >V  D Are I have found a card. A Videologic Apocalypse 5D Sonic from about@ 98. It has a Tseng labs chip so should be OK for X plus is SoundF Blaster compatible. However they are about as rare as the proverbial - put your phrase here - ;-).e   Does anyone know of any others.e  $ On the Compaq DS10L Quick specs page    @ http://www.compaq.com/products/quickspecs/10551_na/10551_na.html  B There are plenty of PCI Combo cards available but none for sound +# video - video + scsi + network yes.r  C Also it says that it's OK to use the DS10L as a desktop - so that'sf	 official.   D The quick specs for the DS20L say that only supposed to be used as aB rackmount. The DS20L has two PCI slots though. Maybe someone couldB produce one of those little stands like used with the Multias - beB pretty neat. Though DS20Ls I think are quite a bit more expensive.@ Also with these systems it's only possible to have one hard diskE unless you use an external cd rom/floppy. So no real chance of a dualt boot.   F I had an idea - maybe someone could produce a small rack mount cabinetB you could fit under your desk. That way you could have say up to 5E ds10l/ds20L under your desk clustered and then you could use just oneeD most of the time and then if you wanted to do some serious gaming orF more seriously floating point you could switch on the other 4. ImagineE that 10 EV6 1ghz or maybe now ev7 under your desk! How many Gigaflops  would that be?   cheers,      Peter Watkinson % peter.watkinson1<nospam>@ntlworld.coma remove <nospam> to reply :-)   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 06:14:27 -0700e; From: JNCHAMBL@TEXASCHILDRENSHOSPITAL.ORG (Jesse Chambless)a Subject: Re: DSM Docs On Line?= Message-ID: <764ccbac.0210010514.44acb5f8@posting.google.com>   F True.  Cache is the current product.  It morphed from the ISM product.C  It is an object oriented version of Mumps with the same M databaseeF structure.  Major modifications are the increase in database size fromD a maximum of 16GB to over a terabyte per database.  Even this can be% extended by using translation tables.e  E The below listed books are excellent references for the M programmingb; system and all give a brief overview of database structure.h   Good luck on your interview.   Jesse Chambless5" VMS/DSM/Cache System Administrator  k "Jay E. Morris" <jem@epsilon3.com> wrote in message news:<hr8m9.50159$Fw2.1276691@twister.austin.rr.com>...rK > In message <+ZZy4OyX7984@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.nett > (Larry Kilgallen) wrote:B > > In article <up7if2t7oc4m03@news.supernews.com>, "John Vottero" >  <John@mvpsi.com> writes:rC > > > I'm no MUMPS expert but I think you can find what you need ate" > > > http://www.intersystems.com/ > > > 1 > > > I believe that DSM has morphed into Cache'.  > > A > > I was under the impression that Cache' is a different product M > > and that InterSystems still supports DSM (but does not add new features). P > Correct.  We had an InterSys engineer in last week.  There will be maintenanceL > releases as needed, and to keep current on OpenVMS, but no major upgrades. > O > You might look for these books (I don't think any are still in print though):  > The ABCs of Mumps  > M Programminga > The Complete Mumps   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 12:49:30 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>8* Subject: Re: e-mail web client (SilkyMail)$ Message-ID: <3d99d26d$1@news.si.com>   Francesco Gennai wrote:e  C > I would know if there are any e-mail web clients to access remoteU> > POP (optionally IMAP) mailboxes and to send messages by SMTPL > sessions that someone has successfully tested in some web/vms environment.  I JF Mezei (who apparently didn't read the message he himself quoted) said:a  H >Yahmail runs on VMS and can connect to the DEC Threads server from Dave Jones.  >Accesses your VMSmail messages.  L How in the world can you possibly construe this as an answer to the originalK poster?  He specifically asked for a web app that can acesses a POP server.r  Yahmail does not fill that bill. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.com.A Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com = 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 18:52:26 +0200t@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>* Subject: Re: e-mail web client (SilkyMail)+ Message-ID: <3D9B244A.6070705@mail.tele.dk>t   JF Mezei wrote:p  P > Yahmail runs on VMS and can connect to the DEC Threads server from Dave Jones.! > Accesses your VMSmail messages..  4 It should be mentioned that YahMail originally comes from WASD not OSU !s   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:17:10 -0400h From: GcE <gce@gce.com>y9 Subject: Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ?i+ Message-ID: <anc6u7$22i$1@bob.news.rcn.net>o   Rob Young wrote:Y > In article <30SEP200223044395@gerg.tamu.edu>, carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) writes:s > 3 >>JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes...a >>}Ed Wilts wrote:I >>}> Disk drives are evil little pieces of spinning metal just waiting to  >>}> hurt you. >>} P >>}Out of curiosity, are your physical drives "the latest and greatest" in terms; >>}of speed/capacity or are they a few generations behind ?s >>} J >>}I feel more confident with drives that are not at the current limits. IJ >>}consider the "latest and greatest" to be Version 1.0 of a product. JustQ >>}because they have found a way to put 50 gigs onto a drive doesn't mean it willa >>}be reliable.  >>D >>I'd like to point out that at this point a 50 gig drive is not theG >>latest and greatest. It's probably 2 steps behind that, soon to be 3.lC >>(So you can run out and buy some if you want to since they aren'trG >>V1.0 anymore. They've probably had several firmware revisions by now, I >>and presumably any harware changes needed to allow the vast majority oft8 >>them to last until the end of the warranty, at least.) >>E >>Current "latest and greatest" is around 150GB for SCSI, or slightly C >>larger at about 160GB for ATA - I have no idea why ATA drives arecD >>typically a bit bigger in most "generations", perhaps they reserveD >>fewer blocks for bad block replacement or something. In a month orE >>two the ATA will go up to 320GB drives, if they havn't already, andmG >>SCSI will follow not too long after that (probaby maxing out at aboutn	 >>300GB).0 >> >  >  > 	181 GByte SCSI: > S > http://www.seagate.com/cda/products/discsales/marketing/detail/0,1081,331,00.htmle > 	 > 				Rob6 > L There have been 180GB SCSI disks for some time. There is not a trend to haveQ larger IDE disks first; it has been mostly the reverse with large disks appearing0O for SCSI first, then IDE. With the drop in IDE warranties this may change a bitrI and also one must recall that the IDE standard maxxed out at around 128GBvM until very recently. Most existing IDE controllers can't address larger diskshH than that, which led to the 160GB IDEs being shipped with new controller boards.:  M As for why the IDE max out, apparently someone way back when thought cylinder"  count would never go over 16384.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:40:43 -0500 & From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com>9 Subject: Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ?c8 Message-ID: <fc9jpusr29di6cnogbbt0asifl02obfplu@4ax.com>  , On Tue, 01 Oct 2002 01:41:19 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:n   >rW >In 15 years, perhaps we will be able to store all of humanity's knowledge in a laptop.   > Yabbut, unfortunately the access speeds have not improved muchB (relatively speaking).  At the current rate of speed improvements,5 recalling any of that knowledge could take weeks. ;-)    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 15:20:07 GMTd4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>Y Subject: Re: I want Citrix Metaframe Server for OpenVMS !!!! was (Re: OpenVMSMultisessione0 Message-ID: <3D99BB0D.DDCAB0FE@blueyonder.co.uk>   "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > 7 > Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:bN > > yup, I'm finding the latest vnc release to be quite sufficient, apart from > > lack of direct VMS support.o > M > What I found really irritating about VNC was that I was unable to have appseI > running on my VMS server display on the VNC session running on my LinuxtM > server.  In other words, I fire up a VNC session under Linux, connect to ittJ > on my WinXP box, and then tryed to get DECterm, or DECmail to display onF > that VNC session, no matter what I tried, I couldn't get it to work.  L Ah, did you try the security negating -ac switch to Xvnc? I have to use that0 with Cygwin to get xdm to work from VMS as well.   so Xvnc -ac -query vaxname  - is the way to go if you are happy to use -ac.    > J > I finally gave up when I found a version of X-Windows that runs on WinXPN > (Cygwin I think), and set it up to act as an XTerminal for my VMS server.  IN > just click on an icon on the WinXP desktop, and up pops the login screen forM > my VMS server.  Not bad for some free software, though I must admit gettingD > it setup was a royal pain.  I hmmm, Cygwin has a nasty habit of entering paging frenzy then crashing attL inoportune moments. Also, eats up memory the IP stack on W98 is using. Also,R with xdm from VMS, there is a very odd problem of only partial mouse functionalityJ for me. Xvnc is not quite as nice an Xserver (no scroll mouse for example)) but it isn't crashing continually for me.c   > K > > As my ts10 hosted VMS installation runs pretty much like a MicroVAX II, @ > > using vnc sure beats logging in every time I turn on the PC. > J > For that you might want to take a look at 'screen'.  I run KLH10 and theL > simh PDP-11 emulators under screen.  That way I can run them detached, and6 > access the 'system console' from any telnet session.  L Ah, I've been looking for some trick like like. ts10 doesn't seem to like &.   > N > In the 'tips and tricks' section of the PDP-10 page on my DEC Emulation siteN > http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html I describe how to start such aN > 'screen' session up in the background.  Perfect for having the emulator boot/ > your OS of choice as the UNIX host is booted.l   Thanks for that. .   > J > I've yet to try running either the ts10 or simh VAX emulation.  I really2 > don't see much use for running VMS that slow :^)   Well, if I had a real VAX ...    >  >                         Zane   -- N tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk s  H * PLEASE NOTE tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk address is NO LONGER VALID *   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 16:25:19 GMTl? From: Jim.Johnson@software-exploration.nospam.com (Jim Johnson)o+ Subject: jEdit support for Macro-32 & Bliss-/ Message-ID: <3d99cbbd.9533448@news.demon.co.uk>:  A I've been using jEdit (http://www.jedit.org) for the past severalcC months.  For those who have not run across it, it is an open-source) Java-based editor.  F Because I still have to at least read Macro-32 and Bliss every now andB then, I've created a set of edit modes to support syntax coloring.A These are now available on the jEdit website, in case anyone elsee finds them useful.   Jim.   Jim Johnsons Software Exploration, Ltd.) (remove '.nospam' from the reply address)u   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 18:53:28 +0200a@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>/ Subject: Re: jEdit support for Macro-32 & Blisst+ Message-ID: <3D9B2488.3090604@mail.tele.dk>h   Jim Johnson wrote:  C > I've been using jEdit (http://www.jedit.org) for the past severaluE > months.  For those who have not run across it, it is an open-source  > Java-based editor. > H > Because I still have to at least read Macro-32 and Bliss every now andD > then, I've created a set of edit modes to support syntax coloring.C > These are now available on the jEdit website, in case anyone else  > finds them useful.  0 Have you been able to get jEdit running on VMS ?   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 17:57:27 GMTt? From: Jim.Johnson@software-exploration.nospam.com (Jim Johnson)f/ Subject: Re: jEdit support for Macro-32 & Blissf0 Message-ID: <3d99e16a.15082397@news.demon.co.uk>  E I haven't bothered.  I understand that some people have, but I do allAF my development using a combination of VMS and a Win2K machine.  I findD the Win2K desktop more responsive and, well, denser (more capable of) doing and showing more at the same time).   $ It's all a matter of personal taste.   Jim.  B On Wed, 02 Oct 2002 18:53:28 +0200, Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?=" <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk> wrote:   >Jim Johnson wrote:y >dD >> I've been using jEdit (http://www.jedit.org) for the past severalF >> months.  For those who have not run across it, it is an open-source >> Java-based editor.  >>  I >> Because I still have to at least read Macro-32 and Bliss every now and E >> then, I've created a set of edit modes to support syntax coloring.gD >> These are now available on the jEdit website, in case anyone else >> finds them useful.o >b1 >Have you been able to get jEdit running on VMS ?  >  >Arnea >e   Jim Johnsoni Software Exploration, Ltd.) (remove '.nospam' from the reply address)e   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 09:45:36 -0700 (PDT). From: Fabio Cardoso <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br>) Subject: OpenVMS Documentation Suggestiont@ Message-ID: <20021001164536.66487.qmail@web20201.mail.yahoo.com>  ) Why not write ALL the OVMS Documentation e' in e-book format  ? Would be easier to d" carry than run it from the CD !!!!  ) HP would have a RCA ebook with HP brand !b   Regards   
 Fabio Cardosor   =====h ========================== Fbio dos Santos Cardoso OpenVMS System Manager Rio de Janeiro - Brazil- fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br ==========================  2 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!?) New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!q http://sbc.yahoo.com   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:56:14 +00002 From: John Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org>- Subject: Re: OpenVMS Documentation Suggestioni3 Message-ID: <20021001165614.A8331@eisenschmidt.org>e  D (1) A good portion of the existing docs are available as PDFs. ThereE are two PDF to Palm Pilot tools that I can think of off the top of myb head.i  > (2) Which eBook standard would you like them to conform to?=20  J Unless the Voices are Mistaken, Fabio Cardoso (fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br) = Wrote:- > Why not write ALL the OVMS Documentation=20e+ > in e-book format  ? Would be easier to=20 $ > carry than run it from the CD !!!! >=20+ > HP would have a RCA ebook with HP brand !r >=20	 > Regardsl >=20 > Fabio Cardoso  >=20K > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=- =3D=3D > F=E1bio dos Santos Cardoso > OpenVMS System Manager > Rio de Janeiro - Brazil  > fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.brK > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=6 =3D=3D >=204 > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!?+ > New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!w > http://sbc.yahoo.com   --=20h/ John W. Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org>HC    Public Key   |  http://www.eisenschmidt.org/jweisen/misc/pgp.asceD    Fingerprint  |  5F9B F916 5AD1 3295 CF99 BC1E 1F97 E6A3 37E3 BEF2J Is this mail an attachment? http://www.jensbenecke.de/misc/outlook.en.htm= lt   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 07:26:11 -0600 - From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)c* Subject: Re: Pathworks, and shares on PC's3 Message-ID: <Hun+O4ppCUfl@eisner.encompasserve.org>"  b In article <fK2m9.14057$H67.64770@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>, "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> writes:D > Since peecees's command language (DOS) is dumb and insufficient toN > accomplish most tasks, and because I don't know (nor want to learn just thisL > morning) VBscript or something akin, I was wondering if it was possible to* > copy a VMS file to a PC share, from DCL.J > From DOS you can access shares that sit on both PC`s or VMS, very easily5 > (COPY \\PC\SHARENAME\FILE.TXT \\VMS\SHARENAME\*.*). % > How about doing the same, from VMS?) >   H    There are both DECnet FAL and TCP/IP FTP servers that run on DOS.  If@    you start one of those on the PC then you can use DCL copy or    copy/ftp to do the transfer.j   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 08:08:05 -0700n( From: infogevraagd@emailme.nu (vogelaar) Subject: search commandt= Message-ID: <c015481c.0210010708.5c75151a@posting.google.com>t  E Hi, This could be an easy question but i have looked at several sites " but could not find the answer yet.  B Is it possible in MVS to search for two words in 1 document at the	 same time 
 for example: iC I want to know if a number and a name can be found altough there isy data in between.  8  VKPPT,  D2              ; (121-896) 20 = vrije voorraad<  VKAFG,  D8              ; (534-432) Aantal voorraadeenheden gekorrigeerd8  VKRTY,  D4              ; (232-234) Produktiekosten per voorraadeenheidf  E can i search in the ex. file for "d8" , "534", "eenheden" at the same  time in one search command?   9 4 your information I just work with VMS for a few months,2 thanks   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 08:21:33 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>e Subject: RE: search command99 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEFJFNAA.tom@kednos.com>s   FREJA> help search SEARCH  F      Searches one or more files for the specified strings and displays(      the lines containing those strings.        Formatt  1        SEARCH  filespec[,...] search-string[,...]c   sear file d8,534,eenhedenl  ( Note the description "strings" is plural   >-----Original Message----- 0 >From: vogelaar [mailto:infogevraagd@emailme.nu]( >Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 8:08 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >Subject: search command >  >lF >Hi, This could be an easy question but i have looked at several sites# >but could not find the answer yet.d >'C >Is it possible in MVS to search for two words in 1 document at the 
 >same time >for example: D >I want to know if a number and a name can be found altough there is >data in between.  > 9 > VKPPT,  D2              ; (121-896) 20 = vrije voorraadN= > VKAFG,  D8              ; (534-432) Aantal voorraadeenhedenw
 >gekorrigeerdi9 > VKRTY,  D4              ; (232-234) Produktiekosten per, >voorraadeenheid > F >can i search in the ex. file for "d8" , "534", "eenheden" at the same >time in one search command? >e: >4 your information I just work with VMS for a few months, >thanks  >s >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).eA >Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002w >  ---r& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 01:17:05 +1000: From: forMsytAhm@optusShome.com.aKu (Mark(un-MASK)Forsyth) Subject: Re: search command38 Message-ID: <slrnapjf3h.2ap.forMsytAhm@plague.bogus.com>  N On 1 Oct 2002 08:08:05 -0700, vogelaar <infogevraagd@emailme.nu> gushed forth:F >Hi, This could be an easy question but i have looked at several sites# >but could not find the answer yet.  > C >Is it possible in MVS to search for two words in 1 document at the 
 >same time >for example: D >I want to know if a number and a name can be found altough there is >data in between.c >o9 > VKPPT,  D2              ; (121-896) 20 = vrije voorraad = > VKAFG,  D8              ; (534-432) Aantal voorraadeenhedene
 >gekorrigeerdi9 > VKRTY,  D4              ; (232-234) Produktiekosten pers >voorraadeenheid > F >can i search in the ex. file for "d8" , "534", "eenheden" at the same >time in one search command?  = Yes. "$ search file.name ""d8" , "534", "eenheden" /match=and  ie.b mwf on PLAGUE >> crea aa.txt7 VKPPT,  D2              ; (121-896) 20 = vrije voorraadgG VKAFG,  D8              ; (534-432) Aantal voorraadeenhedengekorrigeerdp7 VKRTY,  D4              ; (232-234) Produktiekosten pera Exit h  B mwf on PLAGUE >> search aa.txt "D8" , "534", "eenheden" /match=andG VKAFG,  D8              ; (534-432) Aantal voorraadeenhedengekorrigeerdt mwf on PLAGUE >> a   See "$ help search / match"      --       Oorooo	 Mark F...a  $ Another Optus Cable Traffic Monitor.3 http://www.members.optushome.com.au/forsythm/traff/a   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 15:54:34 +0000 (UTC)+ From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb)e Subject: Re: search commandt+ Message-ID: <ancgfq$1hh$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>w  h In article <c015481c.0210010708.5c75151a@posting.google.com>, infogevraagd@emailme.nu (vogelaar) writes:F >Hi, This could be an easy question but i have looked at several sites# >but could not find the answer yet.u >nC >Is it possible in MVS to search for two words in 1 document at ther
 >same time >for example: D >I want to know if a number and a name can be found altough there is >data in between.i >r9 > VKPPT,  D2              ; (121-896) 20 = vrije voorraadr= > VKAFG,  D8              ; (534-432) Aantal voorraadeenhedene
 >gekorrigeerdS9 > VKRTY,  D4              ; (232-234) Produktiekosten perf >voorraadeenheid >oF >can i search in the ex. file for "d8" , "534", "eenheden" at the same >time in one search command? > : >4 your information I just work with VMS for a few months, >thanksP  ) search filename.ext    d8, 534, eenheden n  < will find any record containing one of  d8,  534 or eenheden  2 search filename.ext    d8, 534, eenheden/match=and  ; will find any record containing all of d8, 534 and eenhedene  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University n   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:11:05 GMT ' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com> " Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH* Message-ID: <3D9974B0.50503@theblakes.com>   Tom Linden wrote:s  : >Regular espression instead of the string would be useful. >g You just need the right tool:s   $ bash  > grep regexp filed   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:49:28 GMTl- From: "labadie" <labadie_g.tocardsa@decus.fr>u" Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH1 Message-ID: <sRgm9.9$ZH2.373907@news.cpqcorp.net>t  , "Bob Koehler" <koehler@encompasserve.org>  >? >    If you want grep, why don't you just go to GNU and get it?0   You have already awk,M* dir sys$common:<syshlpexamples.tcpip.snmp> gawk.exe   Grard   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 07:19:15 -0600i- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)>" Subject: RE: Suggestion for SEARCH3 Message-ID: <1mllUsU$97G4@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  _ In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEECFNAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:'7 > Yes, but having support for (Unix compatible) regulary5 > expressions gets one step further in justifying thef > hyperbolic name _OPEN_Vms  >   =    If you want grep, why don't you just go to GNU and get it?h   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 06:33:21 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>s" Subject: RE: Suggestion for SEARCH9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIMEFEFNAA.tom@kednos.com>h  2 Thanks, I have bash, but I was referring to SEARCH   >-----Original Message-----e/ >From: Colin Blake [mailto:colin@theblakes.com]2( >Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 3:11 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com# >Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCHt >f >  >Tom Linden wrote: > ; >>Regular espression instead of the string would be useful.c >> >You just need the right tool: >S >$ basho > > grep regexp file >5 >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.S; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). A >Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002A >A --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 06:48:51 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>E" Subject: RE: Suggestion for SEARCH9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIMEFFFNAA.tom@kednos.com>   6 regular expressions work not only with grep, besides I& was talking about SEARCH, I have bash.   >-----Original Message----- 5 >From: Bob Koehler [mailto:koehler@encompasserve.org]8( >Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 6:19 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com# >Subject: RE: Suggestion for SEARCHe >f >n@ >In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEECFNAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom ! >Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes: 8 >> Yes, but having support for (Unix compatible) regular6 >> expressions gets one step further in justifying the >> hyperbolic name _OPEN_Vms >>   > > >   If you want grep, why don't you just go to GNU and get it? >w >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).cA >Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002  >  ---5& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 09:45:04 -06002+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) " Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH3 Message-ID: <LsB2l2JhMS4q@eisner.encompasserve.org>.  T In article <3D9974B0.50503@theblakes.com>, Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com> writes: > Tom Linden wrote:: > ; >>Regular espression instead of the string would be useful.B >> > You just need the right tool:1 >  > $ bash >  > grep regexp file  >   > 	This is a very good point.  In the grand scheme of things, ifF 	the tool exists in Unix, forget about stuffing it into VMS(1).  After? 	all, VMS engineering has *finite* resources and they certainly-: 	want to concentrate on things that add value I would say.   				Rob.  L (1)  Yes, we trust COE will be stuffed into base VMS in the future.  This is
      good.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 15:10:29 -000004 From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]>" Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH5 Message-ID: <20021001151029.7162.qmail@nym.alias.net>s  ; On 1 Oct 2002, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) wrote: 7 >In article <3D9974B0.50503@theblakes.com>, Colin Blakef ><colin@theblakes.com> writes:   <snip>  	 >> $ bashe >>  > grep regexp file >>   > ? >	This is a very good point.  In the grand scheme of things, ifdG >	the tool exists in Unix, forget about stuffing it into VMS(1).  Afters@ >	all, VMS engineering has *finite* resources and they certainly; >	want to concentrate on things that add value I would say.l  M >(1)  Yes, we trust COE will be stuffed into base VMS in the future.  This is  >     good.n  F I would hope that at some point in the future a different CLI would beK available with standard VMS. Then, if user x wants a unix-like environment,o# you just do the following for them:l    $ mc authorize modify x/CLI=bash     Doc. -- V6 The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.K ~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.netx   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 08:24:38 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>e" Subject: RE: Suggestion for SEARCH9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIKEFJFNAA.tom@kednos.com>2  < I guess i differ with the previous poster, I happen to think> that it would add value, in fact, if you had just a few tools,> like autoconfigure, then there would be a lot of software that; could be easily ported,  and that would add a lot of value!v   >-----Original Message-----o< >From: Doc.Cypher [mailto:Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]]( >Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 8:10 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com$ >Cc: mail2news@freedom.gmsociety.org# >Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCHo >R > < >On 1 Oct 2002, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) wrote:8 >>In article <3D9974B0.50503@theblakes.com>, Colin Blake >><colin@theblakes.com> writes:  >- ><snip>- >-
 >>> $ bash >>>  > grep regexp file2 >>>2 >>@ >>	This is a very good point.  In the grand scheme of things, if9 >>	the tool exists in Unix, forget about stuffing it into. >VMS(1).  AfternA >>	all, VMS engineering has *finite* resources and they certainly < >>	want to concentrate on things that add value I would say. > = >>(1)  Yes, we trust COE will be stuffed into base VMS in ther >future.  This is  >>     good. >,G >I would hope that at some point in the future a different CLI would benL >available with standard VMS. Then, if user x wants a unix-like environment,$ >you just do the following for them: > ! >$ mc authorize modify x/CLI=bash  >w >  >Doc.  >--y7 >The bigger the humbug, the better people will like it.tL >~ Phineas Taylor Barnum.                             https://vmsbox.cjb.net >y >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.5; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).oA >Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002s >e ---a& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/2002   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 10:56:53 -0600t+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)0" Subject: RE: Suggestion for SEARCH3 Message-ID: <xXfKY35gK+56@eisner.encompasserve.org>u  _ In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIKEFJFNAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:o> > I guess i differ with the previous poster, I happen to think@ > that it would add value, in fact, if you had just a few tools,@ > like autoconfigure, then there would be a lot of software that= > could be easily ported,  and that would add a lot of value!n >   C 	I think we are in agreement.  COE in VMS adds value.  It certainly < 	doesn't make sense to go off and do the work to add regularB 	expressions to SEARCH as that functionality shows up via bash andF 	would be a waste of limited resources from an engineering standpoint.> 	My opinion of course.  autoconfigure is in bash.  Patience my 	friend.   				Rob    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:24:11 +0100* From: "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>" Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH, Message-ID: <ancelp$1frg@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>  A "Doc.Cypher" <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in message7/ news:20021001151029.7162.qmail@nym.alias.net...i  H > I would hope that at some point in the future a different CLI would beM > available with standard VMS. Then, if user x wants a unix-like environment,e% > you just do the following for them:d >e" > $ mc authorize modify x/CLI=bash  K I believe you used to be able to do this with the old POSIX shell, although D it probably comes into the category of cruel and unusual punishment.  M FWIW, I'm inclined to agree with the sentiment that folk can just use grep iffT they prefer it. If folks want a shell with a jumble of features they can use Perl ;)   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 02:12:02 +1000: From: forMsytAhm@optusShome.com.aKu (Mark(un-MASK)Forsyth)" Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH8 Message-ID: <slrnapjiai.2ap.forMsytAhm@plague.bogus.com>  S On Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:24:11 +0100, Richard Brodie <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> gushed forth:@ >sB >"Doc.Cypher" <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in message0 >news:20021001151029.7162.qmail@nym.alias.net... > I >> I would hope that at some point in the future a different CLI would begN >> available with standard VMS. Then, if user x wants a unix-like environment,& >> you just do the following for them: >># >> $ mc authorize modify x/CLI=bashf >iL >I believe you used to be able to do this with the old POSIX shell, althoughE >it probably comes into the category of cruel and unusual punishment.e  C Yes indeed. At the "Username: " prompt you used to be able to type s? "user_name/posix", IIRC in the even older days you could go fore "user_name/cli=mcr".  F I _distinctly_ remember POSIX though - at one place I worked there wasD this application....... Yes. Cruel and unusual punishment about sums it up.   >sN >FWIW, I'm inclined to agree with the sentiment that folk can just use grep ifU >they prefer it. If folks want a shell with a jumble of features they can use Perl ;)h  L Perl. Now that stuff makes my head spin. I'm getting better at it though. It used to just make my head hurt.p   -- e     Ooroo 	 Mark F...n  $ Another Optus Cable Traffic Monitor.3 http://www.members.optushome.com.au/forsythm/traff/d   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 02:39:27 +1000: From: forMsytAhm@optusShome.com.aKu (Mark(un-MASK)Forsyth)" Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH8 Message-ID: <slrnapjjtv.2ap.forMsytAhm@plague.bogus.com>  e On Wed, 2 Oct 2002 02:12:02 +1000, Mark(un-MASK)Forsyth <forMsytAhm@optusShome.com.aKu> gushed forth:P  	 [deletia]g   >yD >Yes indeed. At the "Username: " prompt you used to be able to type @ >"user_name/posix", IIRC in the even older days you could go for  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^l? "user_name/cli=posix" is how it should read. It's late / early.n     -- u     Ooroon	 Mark F...l  $ Another Optus Cable Traffic Monitor.3 http://www.members.optushome.com.au/forsythm/traff/m   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:04:15 +0000 (UTC)+ From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb)e" Subject: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH+ Message-ID: <anch1v$1hh$2@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>d  l In article <20021001151029.7162.qmail@nym.alias.net>, Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:< >On 1 Oct 2002, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) wrote:8 >>In article <3D9974B0.50503@theblakes.com>, Colin Blake >><colin@theblakes.com> writes:e >o ><snip>r >y
 >>> $ bash >>>  > grep regexp file- >>>  >>@ >>	This is a very good point.  In the grand scheme of things, ifH >>	the tool exists in Unix, forget about stuffing it into VMS(1).  AfterA >>	all, VMS engineering has *finite* resources and they certainly < >>	want to concentrate on things that add value I would say. >eN >>(1)  Yes, we trust COE will be stuffed into base VMS in the future.  This is >>     good. >nG >I would hope that at some point in the future a different CLI would betL >available with standard VMS. Then, if user x wants a unix-like environment,$ >you just do the following for them: > ! >$ mc authorize modify x/CLI=bashg >   H Although it might be possible to argue for having one other "unix" shellH I would hate for VMS to end up like Unix with lots of different slightly incompatible shells. i  L I tend to think the single DCL shell is a strength rather than a weakness of VMS.  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 06:42:22 -0700>( From: robert_kersey@bat.com (Rob Kersey) Subject: UAF Problem= Message-ID: <f936a854.0210010542.20f16bef@posting.google.com>p  F I have created the following account, when I issue the show TICS_ADMIN$ command I get the following details.   UAF> sho tics_admini  = Username: TICS_ADMIN                       Owner:  TICS_ADMIND< Account:                                   UIC:    [300,202] ([TICS_ADMIN])< CLI:      DCL                              Tables: DCLTABLES& Default:  DKA300:[TICS.BIN.TICS_TOOLS] LGICMD:   TICS_TOOLS.COM Flags:  DisWelcome DisPwdDic+ Primary days:   Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri         + Secondary days:                     Sat Sunh No access restrictionsD Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  5   Login Fails:     0? Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:      (pre-expired) c> Last Login:            (none) (interactive),            (none) (non-interactive)e9 Maxjobs:         0  Fillm:       300  Bytlm:        32768l9 Maxacctjobs:     0  Shrfillm:      0  Pbytlm:           0l9 Maxdetach:       0  BIOlm:        40  JTquota:       4096 9 Prclm:          10  DIOlm:        40  WSdef:          256M9 Prio:            4  ASTlm:        50  WSquo:          512t9 Queprio:         0  TQElm:        30  WSextent:      2048E9 CPU:        (none)  Enqlm:       200  Pgflquo:      40960m Authorized Privileges: rF   ACNT      ALLSPOOL  ALTPRI    AUDIT     BUGCHK    BYPASS    CMEXEC    CMKRNLfF   DETACH    DIAGNOSE  DOWNGRADE EXQUOTA   GROUP     GRPNAM    GRPPRV    IMPORT F   LOG_IO    MOUNT     NETMBX    OPER      PFNMAP    PHY_IO    PRMCEB    PRMGBL.F   PRMMBX    PSWAPM    READALL   SECURITY  SETPRV    SHARE     SHMEM     SYSGBLsC   SYSLCK    SYSNAM    SYSPRV    TMPMBX    UPGRADE   VOLPRO    WORLD4 Default Privileges: F   ACNT      ALLSPOOL  ALTPRI    AUDIT     BUGCHK    BYPASS    CMEXEC    CMKRNL F   DETACH    DIAGNOSE  DOWNGRADE EXQUOTA   GROUP     GRPNAM    GRPPRV    IMPORTrF   LOG_IO    MOUNT     NETMBX    OPER      PFNMAP    PHY_IO    PRMCEB    PRMGBL F   PRMMBX    PSWAPM    READALL   SECURITY  SETPRV    SHARE     SHMEM     SYSGBLeC   SYSLCK    SYSNAM    SYSPRV    TMPMBX    UPGRADE   VOLPRO    WORLD   E So the user must be created? However when I try to login I get a useriE authorization failure. To work out why I am getting this I issued the-C command Reply/enable and set hos 0 and tried to login again. Where   got told the following.      Username: TICS_ADMIN
 Password: 8 %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM   1-OCT-2002 11:41:57.11  %%%%%%%%%%%& Message from user AUDIT$SERVER on MHS5@ Security alarm (SECURITY) and security audit (SECURITY) on MHS5, system id: 1129 : Auditable event:          Remote interactive login failure1 Event time:                1-OCT-2002 11:41:57.10e* PID:                      0000030C        * Process name:             _RTA1:          * Username:                 <login>         5 Terminal name:            RTA1:, _RTA1:, MHS5::SYSTEMr* Remote nodename:          MHS5            & Remote node id:           1129 (1.105)  Remote username:          SYSTEM; Status:                   %LOGIN-F-NOSUCHUSER, no such userb    - How can this be if the user has been created?d  > I also did the following to check there was only one UAF file    $ dir sys$system:sysuaf.dat    Directory SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSEXE]   SYSUAF.DAT;1           Total of 1 file.   Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE]u   SYSUAF.DAT;1           Total of 1 file.  E Can anyone tell me why I am getting a user authorization failure when A the user has been created? (I have tried changeing the password &v entering it correctly!)t   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 10:01:59 -0400+ From: "Martin O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com>h Subject: Re: UAF Problem5 Message-ID: <anc9sp$cr6b0$1@ID-118202.news.dfncis.de>i  = It looks like you created a extra sysuaf.dat in sys$specific:>3 The system is probably using the one in sys$common:IZ You could do a show device/files sys$sysdevice to see which one is used and get rid of the
 other one.   Marty O'Connor  5 "Rob Kersey" <robert_kersey@bat.com> wrote in message 7 news:f936a854.0210010542.20f16bef@posting.google.com...pH > I have created the following account, when I issue the show TICS_ADMIN& > command I get the following details. >  > > $ dir sys$system:sysuaf.date >a  > Directory SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSEXE] >t > SYSUAF.DAT;1 >  > Total of 1 file. >  > Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE]e >o > SYSUAF.DAT;1 >  > Total of 1 file. >    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 00:03:09 +1000: From: forMsytAhm@optusShome.com.aKu (Mark(un-MASK)Forsyth) Subject: Re: UAF Problem8 Message-ID: <slrnapjaop.2ap.forMsytAhm@plague.bogus.com>  N On 1 Oct 2002 06:42:22 -0700, Rob Kersey <robert_kersey@bat.com> gushed forth:G >I have created the following account, when I issue the show TICS_ADMIN-  	 [deletia]-   >a >$ dir sys$system:sysuaf.dat >0 >Directory SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSEXE]i >. >SYSUAF.DAT;1        w >  >Total of 1 file.w >  >Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE] >2 >SYSUAF.DAT;1        l >a >Total of 1 file.1 >tF >Can anyone tell me why I am getting a user authorization failure whenB >the user has been created? (I have tried changeing the password & >entering it correctly!)    6 To me that looks suspiciously like you have two files.8 Do a dir/fu sys$system:sysuaf.dat and see what turns up.   On my system here I get :-  4 mwf on PLAGUE >> dir/d/siz=all sys$system:sysuaf.dat   Directory SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE],  = SYSUAF.DAT;1              60/60       16-JUN-2001 00:11:08.49u   Total of 1 file, 60/60 blocks. mwf on PLAGUE >> S mwf on PLAGUE >> sh log sysuaf8    "SYSUAF" = "SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE) mwf on PLAGUE >> n   -- a     Ooroo 	 Mark F...l  $ Another Optus Cable Traffic Monitor.3 http://www.members.optushome.com.au/forsythm/traff/    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 07:33:52 -0700 / From: lgemedia@mestre.if.usp.br (Luiz Emediato)s, Subject: Re: Upgrade from OpenVMS 6.2 to 7.2= Message-ID: <c6406a41.0210010633.338fcd7f@posting.google.com>    Dear Charlie Hammond,,  I I did read the OpenVMS 7.2 Release Notes and am starting with OpenVMS 7.2tG Upgrade and Installation Manual. Both are very nice documents with lotsoB of details and instructions. However, the latter document contains> so many steps that dazzles me. So, I was looking for a shorterG step-by-step document to help with my VAX upgrade. That is what I meantaG by "straightforward". But, re-reading "Upgrade and Installation Manual"aG more carefully I realized that it's better to follow these steps to not N harm my OpenVMS 6.2 and be safe and sound with all the upgrade process to 7.2.   Thanks for your comments.t	   cheers,p    Luizo  r hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond) wrote in message news:<bvZl9.22$ZM1.514184@news.cpqcorp.net>...@ > In article <c6406a41.0209281627.1a0311f6@posting.google.com>, 3 > lgemedia@mestre.if.usp.br (Luiz Emediato) writes:  > I > >I would like to know if there is a straightforward document explainingo= > >how to upgrade OpenVMS 6.2 to 7.2 on a VAXstation 4000/60. ( > >I appreciate any help on this matter. > 	 > Luiz --) > I > Have you read the "VAX Version 7.2 Upgrade and Installation Manual" andn: > the accompanying release notes and new features manuals? > % > If not, that is what you should do.  > L > If so, then please explain what you are looking for in a "straightforwaredC > document".  Is there something that these manuals do not provide?h   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 15:44:14 GMT 8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond), Subject: Re: Upgrade from OpenVMS 6.2 to 7.22 Message-ID: <ipjm9.13$%M2.503972@news.cpqcorp.net>  > In article <c6406a41.0210010633.338fcd7f@posting.google.com>, 1 lgemedia@mestre.if.usp.br (Luiz Emediato) writes:e  ? >                           ... So, I was looking for a shorteroH >step-by-step document to help with my VAX upgrade. That is what I meantH >by "straightforward". But, re-reading "Upgrade and Installation Manual"E >more carefully I realized that it's better to follow these steps ....   Luiz --   H I suspected you were looking for a "short cut".  There are actually someH things in the Guide that you can skip and often not have a problem.  ButE following all the steps is a much better idea -- in the long run, it   often saves time.o  F Once you have read and understand the guide you may find that actually? doing the upgrade is a lot quicker and easier than you thought.:  B One thing NOT to skip is making a good backup of your V6.2 system.C In the unlikely event that something bad happens -- a power failure)C or a hardware failure or a major problem with the upgrade -- a good2J backup may be the ONLy way to recover -- short of doing a new installation
 from scratch..  
 Good luck!   -- aI       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Pompano Beach  FL USA H        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 13:22:51 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>g Subject: Re: VMS 7.3 DCL / MXl$ Message-ID: <3d99da3d$1@news.si.com>  H >This is the behavior that I've seen with V7.3, V7.2, and V7.1.  I think >I saw it with V6.2 also.c  H Not from the DCL command line.  Within the mail utility, the SET FORWARDL command required the "1-2-3" or "3-3" approach to quoting for V6.2, but withG V7.0 that was "fixed" so that a single set of quotes were required.  In  other words, for V6.2n  H MAIL> set forward/user=tillman_brian "mx""tillman_brian@smpgwy.si.com"""   or  J MAIL> set forward/user=tillman_brian mx%"""tillman_brian@smtpgwy.si.com"""  H were required, but V7.1 and V7.2 (I have no direct experience with V7.0) allowed:  F MAIL> set forward/user=tillman_brian mx%"tillman_brian@smtpgwy.si.com"  H If this changed in V7.3 to revert back to the V6.2 behavior, then it's aI bug.  And if the "1-2-3" or "3-3" methods are required on the DCL commanda" line, then something REALLY broke. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comeA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com.= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventh< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 06:00:35 GMT - From: djweath@attglobal.net (Dave Weatherall) 9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)n5 Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-oX9Q6OpGFR9d@localhost>e  1 On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:53:42 UTC, Atlant Schmidt n$ <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote:    a- > The world was *VERY* political during thoseo, > days. Larry Coppenrath (?), the VP who ran, > the organization that housed both E&RT and. > the Terminals Group wasn't paying attention./ > (And he lost his job shortly after the Multia , > debacle.) Bill Armitage, the unterveep who- > ran E&RT, was busy pursuing a three-pronged: > strategy:m > ' >   o Sell VxWorks as our hard-realtime4, >      software platform (along with MC68000 >      and Alpha-based SBCs),n > , >   o Sell Digital Unix as our soft-realtime+ >      software platform and as our VxWorksu >      development platform,  D So are these the guys we VAX/ELN programmers/users have to 'thank' ?   -- i Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 05:04:29 -0400o- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>_9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these) , Message-ID: <3D996518.72E7CEE0@videotron.ca>  K It was recently revealed that even the most boring and conservative british:6 prime minister (John Major) has had an illicit affair.  ( How will this impact the future of VMS ?   :-) :-) :-) ;-)D   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 08:52:00 -0400s2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these) . Message-ID: <3D999A70.AD308722@mindspring.com>   Dave Weatherall wrote:  2 > On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:53:42 UTC, Atlant Schmidt& > <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote: >r > / > > The world was *VERY* political during thoset. > > days. Larry Coppenrath (?), the VP who ran. > > the organization that housed both E&RT and0 > > the Terminals Group wasn't paying attention.1 > > (And he lost his job shortly after the MultiaD. > > debacle.) Bill Armitage, the unterveep who/ > > ran E&RT, was busy pursuing a three-prongedt
 > > strategy:i > >J) > >   o Sell VxWorks as our hard-realtimer. > >      software platform (along with MC68000 > >      and Alpha-based SBCs),3 > > . > >   o Sell Digital Unix as our soft-realtime- > >      software platform and as our VxWorkst > >      development platform, >/F > So are these the guys we VAX/ELN programmers/users have to 'thank' ?  . Ayup. E&RT was also the home of VAX/ELN, which6 got pretty scant attention during the time I was there$ (I was doing VxWorks and SBC stuff).  % VAX/ELN: Another potentially-good DECn- property tossed on the scrap-heap of history.-   Atlant   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 13:36:56 GMTe1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> 9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)r. Message-ID: <Yxhm9.272092$Jo.125807@rwcrnsc53>  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D996518.72E7CEE0@videotron.ca...E > It was recently revealed that even the most boring and conservatived british 8 > prime minister (John Major) has had an illicit affair. >g* > How will this impact the future of VMS ? >  > :-) :-) :-) ;-)a   It won't. They used Windoze.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 09:07:59 -0400\2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)E. Message-ID: <3D999E2F.51450FE5@mindspring.com>   JF Mezei wrote:o   > Atlant Schmidt wrote:y7 > > Because Page Table Entries (PTEs) were 4 bytes long 1 > > and each 512-byte page pf VAX memory required25 > > one, page tables on a VAX consumed an appreciablea) > > portion of the then-expensive memory.c >4N > Is it correct to assume that memory consumption for PTEs on Alpha is also an	 > issue ?v  - Yes, but less so. Whereas VAX took 4 bytes ofe0 PTE per 512 bytes of virtual memory, Alpha takes. 8 bytes of PTE for 8KB (or now 64KB) of VM, so there's less wastage.   + Also, the VAX VM scheme required contiguoush- VM (within a section, S1, P1, or P2); if your - VM address space had "holes" in it, you stillG1 needed to allocate the PTEs for those holes (withd( the PTEs set to "no access", of course).  * The Alpha VM multi-level PTE scheme allows) you to create non-contiguous VM in a much8* more efficient fashion, again reducing the# overhead of storing PTEs in memory.a    L > If a single PTE uses 4 bytes, does this mean that the PTE table requires a > multiplication ? >tP > eg: I want to translate virtual memory 200 : multiply 200 * 4 , add it to baseP > of the PTE and that gives me the address of where the phsycal address to which8 > "200" is mapped resides. Is that what really happens ?  0 No. Remember that all virtual pages are at "page/ aligned" addresses (e.g., on the VAX, xxxxx000,A2 xxxxx400, xxxxx800, xxxxxC00) so the "page number"9 can be extracted just taking the high bits of the virtualr4 address. This page number, shifted left 2 bits (on a0 VAX) and added to the PTEBase directly maps to a- PTE stored in memory.  (Ignore my "hand-wave"C1 regarding the fact that P1/P2 PTEs are themselvesl) stored in Virtual, not physical, memory.)s  ( So it's just an extract, shift, and add.  M > I assume that there is specialized hardware that does the above and not CPU " > instructions that are executed ?  ) Absolutely! The path that takes a Virtuall' Address and eventually delivers data is 0 an extremely critical path in the microprocessor/ and great pains are taken to make it fast. Manyt6 different techniques (TLB designs, virtually-addressed3 data caches, physically-addressed data caches, etc.n% etc.) have been tried over the years.     P > Before, I felt guilty when my program would force my all mighty microvax II toG > do a disk IO. Now I think I will feel guilty if it even has to accessc# > memory... Long live registers :-)   ( Yes. Making good use of the registers is0 very, very important to getting good utilization2 of the processor's resources. So yes, you *SHOULD*  feel guilty going to memory! :-)   Atlant   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 12:55:36 -0400 From: <rob@netcarrier.net>* Subject: Re: WASD Security Advisory Issued9 Message-ID: <V%jm9.374$Je7.109486208@news.netcarrier.net>m  C > what spin?  if you use wasd or webes shareware, this can and does3F > happen ... it happens with apache and it happens w/ucx, although ucxA > was a file protection glitch ... since I use none of the above,: > I am batting 1000 still ...e    K     Ahh Yes I forgot you don't use any software created after 1988 and then $ only if written in Dibol or Bliss :)    "                                Rob   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:46:11 +0000 (UTC)* From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@tukki.cc.jyu.fi>? Subject: Re: What do the readers want in comp.os.vms / INFO-VAX , Message-ID: <anc1u3$qkf$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>   Cg   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 12:18:32 +0000 (UTC)* From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@tukki.cc.jyu.fi>? Subject: Re: What do the readers want in comp.os.vms / INFO-VAXo, Message-ID: <anc3qo$tug$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>  " Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote:; > How about prefixing every subject with the category, i.e. 8 > A:, B: or C:  that way it would be easy to ignore what > you consider irrelevant.  B There's even more epoch-making practice. Lets write the subject in clear text! :-)A  G And I don't really believe that dividing group in pieces would succeed. : We have now many groups, but only comp.os.vms mainly used.  E But we should stop talking here about cars, politics, wines, sports, k  porno, weather, etc. etc. etc.    I Please don't even use cars as examples all the time, I'm illiterate about- American car models.   Osmo   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 18:49:29 +0200i@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>? Subject: Re: What do the readers want in comp.os.vms / INFO-VAXs+ Message-ID: <3D9B2399.3050101@mail.tele.dk>g   Dave Weatherall wrote:  H > Bad form to follow-up on oneself but can anyone tell me why the above H > posting generated a SMEX warning ! ??. Did your original get one Arne?     Yes.  . I got one for every post I made no matter what the topic was.   Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 12:28:10 -0600,B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley)' Subject: Writing a new VMS filesystem ?e3 Message-ID: <lUvAvP3LnO89@eisner.encompasserve.org>2  @ Is there any support in VMS for users writing a new filesystem ?  C If so, are special resources required (source listings, undisclosedcE information except under NDA, etc), or do any examples freely exist ?h   Simon.  I PS: Heading off a Hoff style [:-)] ("what is the problem that I am reallyaJ trying to solve ?") type response, I am just interested in knowing what is	 involved.d   -- lB Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       + Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2002 12:13:46 -06000B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley)< Subject: Writing a VMS CLI ?, was: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH3 Message-ID: <00MMku9mUJh4@eisner.encompasserve.org>   l In article <20021001151029.7162.qmail@nym.alias.net>, Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes: > H > I would hope that at some point in the future a different CLI would beM > available with standard VMS. Then, if user x wants a unix-like environment,s% > you just do the following for them:p > " > $ mc authorize modify x/CLI=bash >   @ So what VMS specific coding is required when writing a VMS CLI ?  B In case it makes any difference, I am interested in the answer forE both a purely foreign shell (ie: bash) as well as an enhanced[*] DCL.   I Note that I am not asking how to write, for example, a parser; I know howuI to do that. I am purely interested in what VMS specific infrastructure iss required in the CLI.  G [*] BTW, here's my list of what I would like to see in an enhanced DCL:c  % At least 64KB length string variableso+ Maximum command line length of at least 8KBeK Much better searching of the recall buffer (bash style Ctrl-R support would  	do very nicely)5 Editing command lines greater than the terminal width-A Many more built in lexicals (f$getuai/f$setuai come to mind here) 5 Support for site specific lexical function libraries. A Directly reading and writing to and from TCP (not telnet!) ports.m+ Lexical style access to various TCP/IP APIsgO A structured multi-option selection construct (in C, that would be switch/case)lI Character I/O support for terminal devices, including the user's terminalc   Simon.   -- eB Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       + Microsoft: The Lada of the computing world.f   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 19:51:19 +0200e@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>@ Subject: Re: Writing a VMS CLI ?, was: Re: Suggestion for SEARCH+ Message-ID: <3D9B3217.1000606@mail.tele.dk>/   Simon Clubley wrote:  B > So what VMS specific coding is required when writing a VMS CLI ?  , I would guess that much of it would be about usage of SYS$CLI !   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 09:10:31 -05006& From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com>- Subject: ZDnet:  Alpha Preps for Grand Finale 8 Message-ID: <q5bjpuo2eqg7tfo8l14a753m828vep9ffp@4ax.com>  K http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupdate/stories/main/0,14179,2877804,00.htmlE   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.542 ************************