1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 31 Oct 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 601       Contents: Re: 100baseT for Turbochannel  Re: 100baseT for Turbochannel 
 Re: <None>
 Re: <None>+ Re: ??== OVMS 7.3-1:.PCSI_INSTALL_MIN hangs  Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck  Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck  Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck 6 Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck (in V7.3 XFC dated 3-APR-2001)! Best WEB server for OpenVMS 7.3-1 % Re: Best WEB server for OpenVMS 7.3-1 % Re: Best WEB server for OpenVMS 7.3-1  decwindows resolution ' Re: Does anyone use P7 in DCPS$STARTUP? ' Re: Does anyone use P7 in DCPS$STARTUP? ' Re: Does anyone use P7 in DCPS$STARTUP?  RE: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS Re: equivalent of touch in VMS+ Re: how to read .bck files on a windows box + Re: how to read .bck files on a windows box + Re: how to read .bck files on a windows box  HP Advocacy Site RE: HP Advocacy Site Re: HP Advocacy Site! HP Hints at New Software Strategy % Re: HP Hints at New Software Strategy  Re: Immutable laws of the PC Re: Immutable laws of the PC0 Re: installing the Adobe Acrobat Viewer for Java" Looking for contract opportunities& Re: Looking for contract opportunities7 Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld 7 Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld 7 Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld 7 Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld 7 Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld 7 Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld  Re: Palladium article  Re: Palladium article  Re: Palladium article  Re: Palladium article % Re: Pathworks v6 (AS) & Win2000 (SBS) ! Re: perl, perlrte and WASD Server   Re: So I went to the HP IT forum TCL/TK on OpenVMS " Re: TCPIP buglet ... (UCX$UCP.EXE)* Re: TCPIP v 5.3 and bad password ip block?* Re: TCPIP v 5.3 and bad password ip block?  Re: Timezone-change observations  Re: Timezone-change observations  Re: Timezone-change observations  Re: Timezone-change observations  Re: Timezone-change observations8 Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)8 Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)8 Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)8 Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)8 Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)8 Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)A Re: VUPS, MIPS, microfortnights and other arcane units of measure A Re: VUPS, MIPS, microfortnights and other arcane units of measure  Whatever happened to ....   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:05:14 -0500 * From: Brian Hechinger <wonko@4amlunch.net>& Subject: Re: 100baseT for Turbochannel9 Message-ID: <20021030160514.S1728947@marvin.4amlunch.net>   C On Wed, Oct 30, 2002 at 02:08:56AM +0000, rivie@ridgenet.net wrote:  > D > There were two different FDDI interfaces for the TURBOchannel. OneE > could do DMA and the other couldn't. I don't recall which the DEFTA 7 > is, nor do I recall the part number of the other one.   N DEFTA can do DMA, DEFZA can't.  i think the DEFZA maxes out at about 40mbit orC so.  even so, that's still 4x faster than the onboard ethernet.  ;)   G > I am not aware of a 100baseT TURBOchannel adapter. Doesn't mean there < > isn't one, just means I don't know about it if there is...  " i really don't think there is one.   -brian --  L "Today, put your best foot forward. If you're not sure which of your feet isL  your best foot, cut one off. Then it doesn't matter."   - www.lowbrow.com -   ------------------------------   Date: 31 Oct 2002 02:03:30 GMT# From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) & Subject: Re: 100baseT for Turbochannel* Message-ID: <apq31i$28m$1@web1.cup.hp.com>  t In article <Xiyv9.803$rA5.62@tornadotest1.news.pas.earthlink.net>, "Stephen Eickhoff" <operagost@emayle.com> writes:F : I have a DEC 3000-600. Is there a 100baseT Turbochannel adapter that& :would fit this machine, or just FDDI?  J   AFAIK, there is no TURBOchannel Fast Ethernet controller option from HP.J   There might be a third-party option around, but (if so) I'm not familiar
   with it.  H   Given the age and the performance of the DEC 3000 series, it'll likelyF   be cheap and easy to upgrade to a faster PCI-based AlphaStation box.K   (There are certainly regular offers of EV56- and EV6-class systems here.) J   Most of these "newer" Alpha systems are PCI-based, and either include orI   provide optional Fast Ethernet controllers; the DE500 and DE600 series  5   options, or an integrated Fast Ethernet controller.     N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------J       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.comN  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------   Date: 30 Oct 2002 12:37 CST ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)  Subject: Re: <None> - Message-ID: <30OCT200212373016@gerg.tamu.edu>   ' "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes... M }I think that the accepted wisdom is that Alpha/Tru64 is about 5% faster than L }Alpha/VMS on non-disk intensive operations. It's probably a wash on the i/o	 }to disk.   * I'm not sure who would accept that wisdom.  A The "accepted widom" that I am aware of is that for computational B purposes VMS and Tru64 are essentially equal (some things a littleA faster on one or the other, but in most cases they work out to be B about the same). But, due to the comparatively limited caching and@ the RMS overhead and some very poor default I/O related settingsE that many programs use, disk I/O on VMS is often significantly slower B than on Tru64 with the same hardware (until you try to use some ofB the more complex RMS features, anyway - indexed files on VMS are aC lot faster than on Tru64 because it hasn't got them, and are likely D still noticably faster, and less prone to error, even if you installC some 3rd party ISAM package on Tru64 - RMS has had a lot of time to D be tuned). By "significantly" I mean by maybe as much as an order ofG magnitude in some cases. This is one of the more common complaints here  on comp.os.vms.   B The one time that I am aware of that the SPEC benchmarks were doneB on what appeard to be the same hardware running both VMS and Tru64D (then Digital Unix), I recall tha VMS came out a little more than 1%F slower on the integer rating and about 1% faster on the floating pointC rating. This was something like 7 or 8 years ago. The difference is G easily within the range one might expect from just compiler variations.   C It is also known that using all the default settings with the C RTL D used to (and may still) give disk I/O performance that is very slow.F Manually adding some stuff to the open() statement could (and probablyE still can) improve performance by a factor of 10 in same cases. Other A languages' default settings may, or may not, be better than the C B RTL's. (As I recall, the defaults for Fortran are better but a lot? less tweaking is possible without going to a useropen routine.)   C Note that this was all from before the new XFC - that may help even  things out some.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:41:09 -0500  From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: <None> ? Message-ID: <OFF8CE8C7A.5FE268DA-ON85256C62.006C3047@metso.com>    Good catch! E That might be a useful line to add at the end of the procedure  ;-) .         I "Art in .ca" <SpamSpamSpamSpam@WonderfulSpam.WonderfulSpam> on 10/29/2002  04:01:48 PM    Please respond to "Art in .ca"5        <SpamSpamSpamSpam@WonderfulSpam.WonderfulSpam>    To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:  Subject:    Re: <None>    > *** post for FREE via your newsreader at post.newsfeed.com ***    ) <norm.raphael@metso.com> wrote in message 9 news:OFD5BC7101.F268E05D-ON85256C61.004FB321@metso.com...  .  > - - - - - - - - - - 3 > $       !VUPOMETER.COM  -  super simple VUP meter  .  > $       set process/prio=12   5 Don't forget to put your process back to prio=4 ! ;-)    Art         >  -----= Posted via Newsfeed.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----@ http://www.newsfeed.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!B -----== 100,000 Groups! - 19 Servers! - Unlimited Download! =-----   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:50:54 GMT 8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)4 Subject: Re: ??== OVMS 7.3-1:.PCSI_INSTALL_MIN hangs3 Message-ID: <yKWv9.24$aP2.1358967@news.cpqcorp.net>   C In article <aus-53AA69.18364730102002@wrzx08.rz.uni-wuerzburg.de>,  5 "Aus, Hans Magnus" <aus@vim.uni-wuerzburg.de> writes:   / >> Do you have /PARSE_STYLE=EXTENDED in effect?   J >Interesting idea - I'll try it after I return to the office next week on 
 >Thursday. > I >I haven't set anything non-standard. Wlll $show process show what parse   >is in effect?  > I think you need to do SHO PROC /ALL and look for parse_style.  1 e.g.  $ PIPE SHO PROC /ALL | SEAR SYS$INPUT PARSE   	     -----   ? Yes, if this "fixes" the problem, it is a bug in the procedure. C At a minimum, if traditional parse style is required, the procedure & should warn if you are using EXTENDED.  C Note that I do NOT have high expectations that this is the problem,  but it is somethign to check.    --  I       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Pompano Beach  FL USA H        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------    Date: 30 Oct 2002 13:30:21 -0800" From: horn@shsu.edu (James T Horn)  Subject: Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck= Message-ID: <843706dc.0210301330.68fe6706@posting.google.com>   $ Here is the start of the CLUE CRASH:   Crashdump Summary Information:  -----------------------------* Crash Time:        28-OCT-2002 21:39:16.84= Bugcheck Type:     ASSERTFAIL, System ASSERT failure detected $ Node:              NELL    (Cluster)* CPU Type:          Compaq AlphaServer ES40 VMS Version:       V7.3  Current Process:   SYSTEM_1 4 Current Image:     $5$DKB500:[VORTEX.BIN]VTX4.EXE;129 Failing PC:        FFFFFFFF.802DCA6C    SYS$XFCACHE+22A6C $ Failing PS:        28000000.00000201K Module:            SYS$XFCACHE    (Link Date/Time:  3-APR-2001 18:32:22.28)  Offset:            00022A6C % ===================================== e Paddy O'Brien <paddy.o'brien@tg.nsw.gov.au> wrote in message news:<3DBF977E.2030007@tg.nsw.gov.au>...  > Paddy O'Brien wrote:I > > Not to denigrate Robert's comments, but this needs to be reported to   > > DEC/COMPAQ/HP asap.  > > L > > I would go as far as copying my dump file to somewhere else so that the N > > failure was still available.  Give the field engineer access to that file. > > A > > Even with the source, you aren't going to be able to do much.  > > H > > For programmers, this is similar to any internal compiler bugcheck.  > > Report immediately.  > >  > > Regards, Paddy > >  > >  > > Robert Deininger wrote:  > > B > >> In article <843706dc.0210290634.11a3f890@posting.google.com>,( > >> horn@shsu.edu (James T Horn) wrote: > >> > >>L > >>> Anyone familar with the ASSERTFAIL bugcheck? We had a system crash dueI > >>> to this bugcheck and can't find anything in connection with OpenVMS  > >>> for this error.  > >> > >> > >>M > >> It generally means an OS component recognized an "impossible" condition, N > >> and gave up.  It committed suicide.  The hope is that by crashing as soonK > >> an the condition is detected, it will be easier to isolate the fault.  J > >> It's pretty certain this bugcheck was explicitly requested for a very > >> specific reason.  > >>H > >> Much worse is to let a horrible internal corruption propagate untilK > >> something _really_ bad crashes the system.  By then, the root cause if " > >> often lost in the bit bucket. > >>N > >> Your crash will need to be analyzed by HP, but you can get a clue via SDAL > >> if you have a crash dump file.  (If you don't have a dump file, HP willL > >> first have to help you configure the system to generate a dump the next > >> time.)  > >>* > >> $ ANALYZE/CRASH_DUMP <dump file name> > >> SDA> CLUE CRASH > >>L > >> This should tell you which system image requested the BUGCHECK.  For anJ > >> ASSERTFAIL, the crash address from the dump will point to a specific 
 > >> placeN > >> in the source listings, and they will likely be a clear indication of the= > >> symptom, if not the cause.  But that analysis is for HP.  > >>N > >> For a user, CLUE CRASH might point you to a particular component, and youB > >> could look for ECO kits addressing problems in the component. > >>M > >> If you have a software service contract, now is a good time to use it...  >  >  > I > ***********************************************************************  > E > "This electronic message and any attachments may contain privileged @ > and confidential information intended only for the use of the D > addressees named above.  If you are not the intended recipient of E > this email, please delete the message and any attachment and advise D > the sender.  You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, 9 > distribution, reproduction of this email is prohibited.  > C > If you have received the email in error, please notify TransGrid  C > immediately.  Any views expressed in this email are those of the  ? > individual sender except where the sender expressly and with  E > authority states them to be the views of TransGrid.  TransGrid uses @ > virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses > contained in any attachment. > > > Please note the email address for TransGrid personnel is now& > firstname.lastname@transgrid.com.au" > I > ***********************************************************************    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:21:24 -0500 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)  Subject: Re: ASSERTFAIL BugcheckK Message-ID: <rdeininger-3010021921240001@1cust215.tnt2.nashua.nh.da.uu.net>   = In article <843706dc.0210301330.68fe6706@posting.google.com>, # horn@shsu.edu (James T Horn) wrote:   % >Here is the start of the CLUE CRASH:  >  >Crashdump Summary Information:  >------------------------------ + >Crash Time:        28-OCT-2002 21:39:16.84 > >Bugcheck Type:     ASSERTFAIL, System ASSERT failure detected% >Node:              NELL    (Cluster) + >CPU Type:          Compaq AlphaServer ES40  >VMS Version:       V7.3 >Current Process:   SYSTEM_15 >Current Image:     $5$DKB500:[VORTEX.BIN]VTX4.EXE;12 : >Failing PC:        FFFFFFFF.802DCA6C    SYS$XFCACHE+22A6C% >Failing PS:        28000000.00000201 L >Module:            SYS$XFCACHE    (Link Date/Time:  3-APR-2001 18:32:22.28) >Offset:            00022A6C& >=====================================  G The crash seems to be indicating XFC involvement.  But the link date of J the XFC image indicates that you have NOT installed the latest XFC ECO for VMS 7.3.  I If you log a call for this crash, expect to be advised to install the ECO - and try again.  Or disable XFC and try again.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:37:10 -0500 , From: Mark Jilson <jilly@clarityconnect.com>  Subject: Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck2 Message-ID: <YU_v9.126$M8.8871@newsfeed.slurp.net>  H Do you have the VMS_XFC V2.0 patch installed?  Use PRODUCT SHOW HISTORY J VMS73_XFC to see if it has been installed.  If it has been installed then B you will find it at ftp.support.compaq.com in /public/vms/axp/v7.3   James T Horn wrote:   & > Here is the start of the CLUE CRASH: >   > Crashdump Summary Information:  > ------------------------------, > Crash Time:        28-OCT-2002 21:39:16.84? > Bugcheck Type:     ASSERTFAIL, System ASSERT failure detected & > Node:              NELL    (Cluster), > CPU Type:          Compaq AlphaServer ES40 > VMS Version:       V7.3  > Current Process:   SYSTEM_1 6 > Current Image:     $5$DKB500:[VORTEX.BIN]VTX4.EXE;12; > Failing PC:        FFFFFFFF.802DCA6C    SYS$XFCACHE+22A6C & > Failing PS:        28000000.00000201@ > Module:            SYS$XFCACHE    (Link Date/Time:  3-APR-2001 > 18:32:22.28) > Offset:            00022A6C ' > ===================================== > > Paddy O'Brien <paddy.o'brien@tg.nsw.gov.au> wrote in message* > news:<3DBF977E.2030007@tg.nsw.gov.au>... >> Paddy O'Brien wrote: I >> > Not to denigrate Robert's comments, but this needs to be reported to  >> > DEC/COMPAQ/HP asap. >> >  L >> > I would go as far as copying my dump file to somewhere else so that theI >> > failure was still available.  Give the field engineer access to that 
 >> > file. >> >  B >> > Even with the source, you aren't going to be able to do much. >> >  H >> > For programmers, this is similar to any internal compiler bugcheck. >> > Report immediately. >> >   >> > Regards, Paddy  >> >   >> >   >> > Robert Deininger wrote: >> >  C >> >> In article <843706dc.0210290634.11a3f890@posting.google.com>, ) >> >> horn@shsu.edu (James T Horn) wrote:  >> >>  >> >> I >> >>> Anyone familar with the ASSERTFAIL bugcheck? We had a system crash F >> >>> due to this bugcheck and can't find anything in connection with >> >>> OpenVMS for this error. >> >>  >> >>  >> >> C >> >> It generally means an OS component recognized an "impossible"  >> >> condition,J >> >> and gave up.  It committed suicide.  The hope is that by crashing asI >> >> soon an the condition is detected, it will be easier to isolate the K >> >> fault. It's pretty certain this bugcheck was explicitly requested for  >> >> a very specific reason.  >> >> I >> >> Much worse is to let a horrible internal corruption propagate until L >> >> something _really_ bad crashes the system.  By then, the root cause if# >> >> often lost in the bit bucket.  >> >> K >> >> Your crash will need to be analyzed by HP, but you can get a clue via 	 >> >> SDA H >> >> if you have a crash dump file.  (If you don't have a dump file, HPI >> >> will first have to help you configure the system to generate a dump  >> >> the next time.)  >> >> + >> >> $ ANALYZE/CRASH_DUMP <dump file name>  >> >> SDA> CLUE CRASH  >> >> J >> >> This should tell you which system image requested the BUGCHECK.  ForD >> >> an ASSERTFAIL, the crash address from the dump will point to a >> >> specific placeK >> >> in the source listings, and they will likely be a clear indication of 	 >> >> the > >> >> symptom, if not the cause.  But that analysis is for HP. >> >> K >> >> For a user, CLUE CRASH might point you to a particular component, and G >> >> you could look for ECO kits addressing problems in the component.  >> >> H >> >> If you have a software service contract, now is a good time to use >> >> it...  >>   >>   >>  J >> *********************************************************************** >>  F >> "This electronic message and any attachments may contain privileged@ >> and confidential information intended only for the use of theD >> addressees named above.  If you are not the intended recipient ofF >> this email, please delete the message and any attachment and adviseD >> the sender.  You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,: >> distribution, reproduction of this email is prohibited. >>  C >> If you have received the email in error, please notify TransGrid C >> immediately.  Any views expressed in this email are those of the ? >> individual sender except where the sender expressly and with F >> authority states them to be the views of TransGrid.  TransGrid usesA >> virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses  >> contained in any attachment.  >>  ? >> Please note the email address for TransGrid personnel is now ' >> firstname.lastname@transgrid.com.au"  >>  J >> ***********************************************************************   --  C Jilly - Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley - Waverly, NY H       - jilly@clarityconnect.com                      - Brett Bodine fanH       - Mark.Jilson@hp.com                            - since 1975 or soH       - http://www.jilly.baka.com           - http://www.brettbodine.com   ------------------------------    Date: 30 Oct 2002 14:44:21 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ? Subject: Re: ASSERTFAIL Bugcheck (in V7.3 XFC dated 3-APR-2001) 3 Message-ID: <IK3$s2+Mcwpk@eisner.encompasserve.org>   b In article <843706dc.0210301330.68fe6706@posting.google.com>, horn@shsu.edu (James T Horn) writes:& > Here is the start of the CLUE CRASH: >   > Crashdump Summary Information:  > ------------------------------, > Crash Time:        28-OCT-2002 21:39:16.84? > Bugcheck Type:     ASSERTFAIL, System ASSERT failure detected & > Node:              NELL    (Cluster), > CPU Type:          Compaq AlphaServer ES40 > VMS Version:       V7.3  > Current Process:   SYSTEM_1 6 > Current Image:     $5$DKB500:[VORTEX.BIN]VTX4.EXE;12; > Failing PC:        FFFFFFFF.802DCA6C    SYS$XFCACHE+22A6C & > Failing PS:        28000000.00000201M > Module:            SYS$XFCACHE    (Link Date/Time:  3-APR-2001 18:32:22.28)  > Offset:            00022A6C ' > =====================================   H I was under the impression people were not supposed to use XFC with V7.3I unless they were running the patch released contemporanously with V7.3-1,   certainly well after 3-APR-2001.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:36:50 -0500 . From: "Jerry Alan Braga" <jabraga@flanagan.ca>* Subject: Best WEB server for OpenVMS 7.3-13 Message-ID: <oaZv9.165559$C8.417195@nnrp1.uunet.ca>   1 Compaq (oops) HP Apache lastest release 1.2 / 1.3  WASD latest release 8.01  L I would also like to use yahMAIL for web mail. Which one does it better sync with ?, Are there other web mail solutions for VMS ?1 I would like to use PHP, does WASD support that ?   , These are my choices based upon my licenses.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 18:49:24 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> . Subject: Re: Best WEB server for OpenVMS 7.3-1, Message-ID: <3DC07004.F617DA58@videotron.ca>   Jerry Alan Braga wrote: . > Are there other web mail solutions for VMS ?3 > I would like to use PHP, does WASD support that ?     L OSU is your best bet. Written for VMS, by a very smart person. Great support (and you have source code too).   9 http://www.er6.eng.ohio-state.edu/WWW/doc/serverinfo.html    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 00:14:37 GMT $ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU. Subject: Re: Best WEB server for OpenVMS 7.3-18 Message-ID: <00A163B7.E838EA32@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  F In article <oaZv9.165559$C8.417195@nnrp1.uunet.ca>, "Jerry Alan Braga" <jabraga@flanagan.ca> writes:   2 >Compaq (oops) HP Apache lastest release 1.2 / 1.3 >WASD latest release 8.01   O I'm going to assume that you're running on Alpha; CSWS isn't (if memory serves) 7 supported for VAX, which would make your question moot.    > M >I would also like to use yahMAIL for web mail. Which one does it better sync  >with ?   O Works just fine with either one; was developed by the author of WASD, but uses  A his polymorphic CGILIB that happily supports CSWS, WASD, and OSU.   - >Are there other web mail solutions for VMS ?   I It's possible that you could get one of the Perl or PHP-based IMAP or POP N web client solutions to run on VMS, but most of the people who are using thoseL seem to be running them on Unix systems.  YahMAIL is all VMS, and works very well.   2 >I would like to use PHP, does WASD support that ?  M Yes.  (You can of course run anything you can run on your VMS system in a CGI I script as part of a DCL file, but WASD also has a persistent PHP run-time O environment (so you don't have to spin up a new process and load PHP each time) L which works with either the CSWS_PHP kit or the kit from Dave Jones at OSU. M This gives you the same kind of performance improvements as mod_php does for   Alpha.     > - >These are my choices based upon my licenses.   K If it's based on licenses, I don't see why the freeware OSU server isn't in B your evaluation list (unless you don't have a C compiler license).  F Anyway, all three servers work.  There is no one-size-fits-all answer.  > WASD and OSU are more VMS-y than Apache; Apache is pretty muchF industry-standard (and requires a certain mental agility in convertingI configuration Unixisms to VMS).  Existing OSU applications will run under O Apache using  the special OSU environment.  WASD probably does the job fastest, K but if you're doing serious PHP applications that's where you'll spend your B CPU time, and that'll be about the same between all three servers.  K (WASD and OSU have extensive cacheing which the webmaster can tune; Apache  K relies on the file system.  XFC may make a big difference to Apache (if the N workload is amenable to it) that it won't make to the other servers, so ApacheM becomes more competitive, speedwise, on 7.3-1 with XFC running than it was on  7.2-1.)   O WASD comes with good documentation; Apache has some quite good documentation at N apache.org and in bookstores, except that it all describes Unix/Windows ApacheL and doesn't tell you what isn't implemented or doesn't make any sense in VMS context.  J It really depends what you're trying to do, what you know already, whetherM there are pre-existing applications you're trying to get working, server-side L include documents you need to have running (SSI implementations are mutually( incompatible among the three), etc, etc.  M CSWS has official VMS Engineering support under your OS support contract; you M can phone Colorado Springs, get put in the queue, etc.  Support for the other F two is by mailing list or here, but what this means is that either theM developer or knowledgeable users around the world will get back to you either 3 with help or with code fixes, often amazingly fast.   L You can run both (or all three) at once on different ports and see which you
 like better.    K -- Alan (or you can read my book and figure out which ones you want to try)    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 21:25:06 GMT 2 From: "Phillip Sobottke" <psobottke@ameritech.net> Subject: decwindows resolution> Message-ID: <S6Yv9.2980$z5.2115277@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com>  E How do I change the display resolution when using decwindows?  I want + something like 1024X768 pixels if possible.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:34:17 GMT * From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com>0 Subject: Re: Does anyone use P7 in DCPS$STARTUP?5 Message-ID: <301020021133594430%paul.anderson@hp.com>   ? In article <1ZwRzvP$ublo@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Bob Koehler " <koehler@encompasserve.org> wrote:  M > I'd much rather you talk to VMS engineering about adding 8 more parameters.   E Well, that would solve my immediate problem, wouldn't it?  I bet this F request is second only to making the DCL command line buffer larger or- allowing command line editing over two lines.   < In article <urvt8bcnio8h47@news.supernews.com>, John Vottero <John@mvpsi.com> wrote:   @ > I don't even use DCPS$STARTUP.  It's not tuned up for the V5.5G > enhancements to the queue manager and it wants to do a bunch of stuff D > at startup that only needs to be done once.  I made my DCPS queuesE > autostart queues.  The only thing I have to do at startup is define  > some DCPS logical names. > H > If you're working on it, I would suggest breaking it into two pieces. 7 > A startup piece that runs during system startup and a C > define_new_queue piece that is used when you want to define a new  > queue.  $ Do you work for the psychic hotline?   Paul   --    Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineering    Hewlett-Packard Company    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:57:19 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 0 Subject: Re: Does anyone use P7 in DCPS$STARTUP?, Message-ID: <3DC0399F.67E12600@videotron.ca>   Paul Anderson wrote:O > > I'd much rather you talk to VMS engineering about adding 8 more parameters.  > G > Well, that would solve my immediate problem, wouldn't it?  I bet this H > request is second only to making the DCL command line buffer larger or/ > allowing command line editing over two lines.   N How about a DCPS$CONFIG file that would contain the DCPS queue definitions andL all the parameters you ever wanted, and when you start DCPS, you simply giveL the name of the config file as single argument and then the startup takes it
 from there ?    J You could then have a startup procedure , and a config procedure, with theN config procedure creating the queues and changing attributes while the startupP one would let autostart take care of queues and simply define the logicals etc ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:33:03 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 0 Subject: Re: Does anyone use P7 in DCPS$STARTUP?, Message-ID: <3DC041FC.D97936A8@videotron.ca>   John Vottero wrote: N > prefer to let the queue manager database be the "gold standard" then I run aN > command procedure that uses f$getqui to examine the queue database and build+ > a command procedure that can recreate it.    Fair point.   N On the other hand, you'll have 2 separate configuration places for your queue.F The actual VMS queue definitions with all its attributes, and the DCPSN specific definitions that cannmot be stored in VMS queue information. (perhapsH that could be an improvement to the VMS queue manager, adding a few moreN fields so that all of DCPS's config about a queue could be stored in the queue itself ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 11:21:45 -0800 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> ' Subject: RE: equivalent of touch in VMS 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIKEOLFPAA.tom@kednos.com>   3 Should have realized that nl was an abrev for nla0.    >-----Original Message----- 5 >From: Bob Koehler [mailto:koehler@encompasserve.org] * >Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 9:33 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com( >Subject: RE: equivalent of touch in VMS >  > @ >In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIGEOBFPAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom ! >Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes: F >> As the question was posed this works.  However, touch is often used; >> to change the date of an existing file.  BTW, is nl: the  >> equiv of /dev/null ?  > H >   nl: is to /dev/null as tt: is to /dev/tty.  Yep, same kind of stuff. >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). B >Version: 6.0.404 / Virus Database: 228 - Release Date: 10/15/2002 >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A Version: 6.0.404 / Virus Database: 228 - Release Date: 10/15/2002    ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:27:34 +0000 (UTC) + From: david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb) ' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMS + Message-ID: <apoq8m$fgb$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>   c In article <3DBFE09F.D1528F96@mindspring.com>, Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> writes:  >Kesav Tadimeti wrote: > 
 >> Hello all, N >> What is the equivalent command in VMS to create an empty file? In UNIX this >> would be touch. > # >There's no supplied utility AFAIK.  > 8 >I used to just keep a DCL command procedure (TOUCH.COM)= >that copied the touched items to themselves, thus creating a  >new version dated now.  >  >Atlant   = Well if you want to create an empty file the standard way is     CREATE filename.exe  <CTL-Z>   G Alternatively if you don't want to have to type <CTL-Z> there is always    COPY nl: filename.ext     L However unlike touch on Unix this will create new empty versions of existing files.N On existing files in Unix touch updates the file access and modification timesL but does not change the contents of the files. The equivalent of that actionK is obtained by using the procedure described by Atlant of copying a file to  itself.   
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:14:36 GMT ' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com> ' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMS , Message-ID: <3DBFF742.1090501@theblakes.com>   Kesav Tadimeti wrote:    >Hello all, L >What is the equivalent command in VMS to create an empty file? In UNIX this >would be touch. >O& You could always install GNV and then:    $ @sys$common:[gnv.bin]gnv_setup .  .e .0 $ touch foor $h   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 10:32:10 -0500 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMSL. Message-ID: <3DBFFB7A.17EFE649@mindspring.com>   "kenrbnsn1@rcn.com" wrote:  C > "Kesav Tadimeti" <Kesav_Tadimeti@KeaneIndia.com> wrote in message E > news:8EA11405E59BD611BA7100104B93C2607580BA@exdel01.del.mgsl.com...  > > Hello all,C > > What is the equivalent command in VMS to create an empty file ?  > K > Everyone seems to be overlooking the easiest way to create an empty file:  >c >  $ copy nl: file.txt > F > One line, no need to enter at control-z. And you can set up a symbol >S >  $ touch :== copy nl:  >V > and use it >t >  $ touch file.txt   * Yes, but that misses the obvious danger to) someone who "knows" that, for an existing 1 file, "touch" will only change the mod date; thisf, simple form of "touch" that you propose will) "empty" an existing file. (Admittedly, onH' VMS, the problem is recoverable as longn' as you're allowing at least one versionl behind you.)  , A true "touch" has to have some logic behind* it so a DCL command file the minimum full- function approach.   Atlant   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 10:44:12 -0500i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMSe, Message-ID: <3DBFFE40.990B036F@videotron.ca>  ( to create an empty file in VMS, you can:   CREATE chocolate.txt <ctrl-z>  X (note that in a command procedure, you can simply use CREATE chocolate.txt for instance: $write sys$output "Creating" $create chocolate.txte $write sys$output "Created"l  K (the <ctrl-z> is implicit since "end of file" is detected st the first lineA that begins with a $ sign.)t     or f   COPY NLA0: chocolate.txt    L To create a file with various attributes (the above 2 examples create a textL file with variable length records), you can use CREATE/FDL= and supply a FDL' file that describe the file attributes.e   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:38:20 GMTg+ From: jcring@switch.com (John C. Ring, Jr.)m' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMSa, Message-ID: <app0dj$sup$1@usenet.switch.com>  [ In article <3DBFFF69.2EEA9754@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:e >David Webb wrote:K >> On existing files in Unix touch updates the file access and modificationi > timesiO >> but does not change the contents of the files. The equivalent of that actionoN >> is obtained by using the procedure described by Atlant of copying a file to
 >> itself. >e >o9 >To change the revision date of a *normal* file, you can:- >-( >SET file chocolate.txt/attrib=(org:seq) >:L >You can supply any attribute that are benign (serch as VRS:2 to set version >numbers to 2)  - I threw together the following some time ago.a   $!vfy = 'f$verify(0) $!M $!Abstract:  This DCL script will open and close a file without modification.d6 $!           The intent is to update the revised date. $! $set := sete$ $set symbol/scope=(NOLOCAL,NOGLOBAL) $if P1 .eqs. ""  $thenI4 $       write SYS$OUTPUT "ERROR - No file specified.2 $       write SYS$OUTPUT "Usage: touch <filename>" $       exit $endif" $open/read/write FILE_TO_TOUCH &P1 $close FILE_TO_TOUCH   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:51:13 +0000 (UTC)r* From: bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau)' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMSi0 Message-ID: <appr9h$f9e$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>  L I know what Unix touch does, but on VMS I use it only to update the revision5 date of an existing file.  I define a benign touch asm   $ touch :== set prot=o:rwed-  M I figure that if you can't change the protections on a file, you shouldn't bejG able to change its revision date, either.  I realize this isn't true in.G general, but for our site (and, I suspect most folks) they're the same.,   Lawrence Bleau University of Maryland" Physics Dept., Space Physics Group 301-405-6223 bleau@umtof.umd.edup   ------------------------------   Date: 31 Oct 2002 02:44:17 GMT# From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)o' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMSt* Message-ID: <apq5e1$28m$3@web1.cup.hp.com>   In article <8EA11405E59BD611BA7100104B93C2607580BA@exdel01.del.mgsl.com>, Kesav Tadimeti <Kesav_Tadimeti@KeaneIndia.com> writes:  ? :What is the equivalent command in VMS to create an empty file?l  E   The OpenVMS approaches and tools similar to the UNIX touch command  B   are discussed in the OpenVMS FAQ.  The UNIX touch command is notB   usually discussed nor mentioned in the context of file creation.  D   OpenVMS has various different file and record formats that can allA   be considered an empty file.  Indexed, sequential, and relativeo3   files can all be created, and can be quite empty.m  @   There are accordingly various ways to create an empty file on F   OpenVMS, and you will find great value from learning the differencesG   between OpenVMS and UNIX in the area of files and particularly in thetE   record management (RMS) area.  The OpenVMS documentation is readily:E   available, abd includes the User's Guide, the Programming Concepts,".   an RMS Files manual, and many other volumes.  F   Tools related to file creation include the CREATE and the CREATE/FDLG   commands, the fdl$create API, the various RMS application programmingkF   interfaces, various language-specific APIs, and the I/O User's GuideI   discussions of the $qio call; the OpenVMS $qio call is the rough analoge   of the UNIX C ioctl() call.      N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------J       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.comN  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.comd   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 21:03:30 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>4' Subject: Re: equivalent of touch in VMSl' Message-ID: <3DC09D82.22116D45@fsi.net>e   Kesav Tadimeti wrote:s >  > Hello all,M > What is the equivalent command in VMS to create an empty file? In UNIX thisi > would be touch.a  H Of all the responses so far, John Ring's comes the closest to "touch" in: that it will update the revision date of an existing file.  , However, the purpose of "touch" is two-fold:  3 1. If the file exists, update its last access date.o  4 2. If the file does not exist, create an empty file.  2 So, I would complete and augment John's code thus:  ) $ vfy = 'f$verify(0)	! DJD mod: uncommenti $!? $!Abstract:  This DCL script will open and close a file withouti
 modification.i@ $!           The intent is to update the revised date of an	!DJD6 $!		existing file or create an empty file if none	!DJD $!		currently exists.				!DJDi $! $set := set $ $set symbol/scope=(NOLOCAL,NOGLOBAL) $if P1 .eqs. ""u $thenh4 $       write SYS$OUTPUT "ERROR - No file specified.2 $       write SYS$OUTPUT "Usage: touch <filename>"$ $       GOTO exit	! Augmented by DJD $endif@ $! Really should include some code here to use F$PARSE() to test- $! the validity of the target filespec. - DJDp $ fsp = f$search( p1 ) $ if	fsp .nes. "". $ then@ $	open/read/write FILE_TO_TOUCH &P1 ! Default ext. is .DAT - DJD $	close FILE_TO_TOUCH- $! DJD additions...- $ ELSE= $	COPY/NOLOG/NOCONFIRM NLA0: &P1	! No default extension - DJDm $ ENDIFm $EXIT:  $ EXIT 1 + (0 * F$VERIFY( VFY ))   -- C David J. Dachtera2 dba DJE Systemst http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:23:33 -05000% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>A4 Subject: Re: how to read .bck files on a windows box/ Message-ID: <us0cdm5aculg5a@news.supernews.com>   - "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> wrote in messagei/ news:app7qk$3o82c$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de...n >.9 > "Henrik Ohlsson" <h.ohlsson@cats.se> schreef in bericht09 > news:b6f6fb2f.0210300633.4f8d84ed@posting.google.com...  > > Hi!  > > F > > I'm writing a small application to extract .bck files on a windowsI > > box. I have an app running, but I'm not sure of the exact layout of a G > > .bck file. For example, how big is each block. Where can I find anyp/ > > documentation about this? Anyone who knows? F > > I downloaded the file vmsbackup.c from freevms.org, but it doesn'tG > > work out of the box (i.e. it compiles, but doesn't unpack the files5 > > correctly).mF > > I write software for a living, so don't hesitate to get technical. > >. > > Thanks,M > >n	 >  Henrik- > K > incidentally I had that same urge a couple of weeks ago. I found the file2 > SYS$EXAMPLES:BACKDEF.HH > rather interesting. Right now my program can read a backup saveset and > produce output similar toDH > BACKUP/LIST on a VMS system. VMS time support is completely missing. I have > no idea how to interpret3 > the 64 bit date&time information on a Wintel box.e  J On Windows a "Filetime" is the same as a VMS quadword time except the base* time is 1-JAN-1600 instead of 17-NOV-1858.  J Conversion is simply a matter of adding or subtracting the number of ticks between those base dates.p   > Missing functionality: > - no extract functionality$ > - image backup savesets not tested > - no alias support > 7 > If you're interested in the program, send me an emailt >p > Hans >u   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 11:33:24 -0500a& From: David M Smith <dsmit115@csc.com>4 Subject: Re: how to read .bck files on a windows box8 Message-ID: <7c20su8imkelr28tuj3slpvvgunvhllhhl@4ax.com>  H On 30 Oct 2002 06:33:52 -0800, h.ohlsson@cats.se (Henrik Ohlsson) wrote:   >Hi! >0C >I'm writing a small application to extract .bck files on a windowsS >box.   
 Why?!  ;<)  A >I have an app running, but I'm not sure of the exact layout of a D >.bck file. For example, how big is each block. Where can I find any, >documentation about this? Anyone who knows?  N My recollection is the format was originally published in the VMS docset aboutF Version 3, but has since been removed. I believe that it is considered# proprietary, and subject to change..I -------------------------------------------------------------------------VI David M. Smith 302.391.8533                       dsmit115 at csc dot comlI Computer Sciences Corporation     (Opinions are those of the writer only)aI -------------------------------------------------------------------------=   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 21:10:42 -0600r1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>>4 Subject: Re: how to read .bck files on a windows box' Message-ID: <3DC09F32.51D57E28@fsi.net>r   Henrik Ohlsson wrote:H >  > Hi!  > D > I'm writing a small application to extract .bck files on a windowsG > box. I have an app running, but I'm not sure of the exact layout of atE > .bck file. For example, how big is each block. Where can I find anyl- > documentation about this? Anyone who knows? D > I downloaded the file vmsbackup.c from freevms.org, but it doesn'tE > work out of the box (i.e. it compiles, but doesn't unpack the files 
 > correctly).rD > I write software for a living, so don't hesitate to get technical.  G The /BLOCKSIZE of a saveset can be specified on the command line. ThereE@ are no hard and fast rules about what to expect, except that theC recordsize will be fixed. That recordsize might (probably will) geteG scrambled in transit from VMS to non-VMS, so observe the other posters'zF recommendations about determining the blocksize from the data found inE the first 2048 data bytes, regardless of how many actual records thateB may be. The minimum value for /BLOCKSIZE is 2048, so that's a safe? guesstimate until you can determine what the real blocksize wasi originally.   E BTW, transferring saveset as BINARY usually protects the integrity oftH the contents, but will lose the record and file (RMS) attributes. So, ya: gotta examine the saveset to find out how to deal with it.   -- i David J. Dachteraz dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 30 Oct 2002 11:48:49 -0800, From: ed.stuart@austinenergy.com (Ed Stuart) Subject: HP Advocacy Site = Message-ID: <d45fc237.0210301148.7fe76e43@posting.google.com>m  F While c.o.v is a good place to exchange ideas, thoughts, questions andF solutions it may not be the best place to get a response from HP.  TheB HP Advocacy site at http://www.hpuseradvocacy.org/ allows folks to@ submit issues for HP to respond to. While most c.o.v readers areF probably already aware of this site I just learned something new about> it today. I submitted an issue and the auto-generated responseF informed me that "An issue that has collected at least 5 Me Too! votesA is guaranteed to be brought to the attention of HP management and*@ responded to on the HP User Advocacy Program's web site." So, if= there's an issue that the readers of c.o.v would like to havefF addressed then one reader could post it to the advocacy site, and thenD ask other c.o.v readers who agree to go to the site and submit a "MeB Too" vote. This has more of a potential to get a response from HP, than posting to c.o.v.   EdE **Please apply a generous amount of all the usual disclaimers here.**i   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 11:59:44 -0800y$ From: Shane Smith <ssmith@icius.com> Subject: RE: HP Advocacy Siteh0 Message-ID: <01C2800B.EF740970@sulfer.icius.com>  G So, how about starting a VMS advertising issue, and dropping as many mea too's as we can on it?  G Only one problem. I enter my email address to log in so I can put in aniD issue, and it takes me straight back to the login page. This is withF Mozilla and IE (hawk, spit) with and without cookies, with and without* Javascript. How did you submit your issue?   Shane*   -----Original Message-----D From: ed.stuart@austinenergy.com [mailto:ed.stuart@austinenergy.com]* Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 11:49 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comc Subject: HP Advocacy Sitee    F While c.o.v is a good place to exchange ideas, thoughts, questions andF solutions it may not be the best place to get a response from HP.  TheB HP Advocacy site at http://www.hpuseradvocacy.org/ allows folks to@ submit issues for HP to respond to. While most c.o.v readers areF probably already aware of this site I just learned something new about> it today. I submitted an issue and the auto-generated responseF informed me that "An issue that has collected at least 5 Me Too! votesA is guaranteed to be brought to the attention of HP management andV@ responded to on the HP User Advocacy Program's web site." So, if= there's an issue that the readers of c.o.v would like to havelF addressed then one reader could post it to the advocacy site, and thenD ask other c.o.v readers who agree to go to the site and submit a "MeB Too" vote. This has more of a potential to get a response from HP, than posting to c.o.v.   EdE **Please apply a generous amount of all the usual disclaimers here.**u   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:50:09 -0500r- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>- Subject: Re: HP Advocacy Sitea, Message-ID: <3DC05409.16C2A719@videotron.ca>   Shane Smith wrote:I > Only one problem. I enter my email address to log in so I can put in an.F > issue, and it takes me straight back to the login page. This is withH > Mozilla and IE (hawk, spit) with and without cookies, with and without, > Javascript. How did you submit your issue?  L You're supposed to save the HTML, study it, and modify it so it will work onF your browser. Haven't you learned yet that you are expected to do thatK whenever you visit sites designed with microsoft software which is designed91 specifically to fail when not using MS software ?E   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 18:27:52 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>M* Subject: HP Hints at New Software StrategyI Message-ID: <IwVv9.119761$Q3S.25098@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>n  G It will be very interesting to see how VMS fits into this. Too bad they2> don't still have a lot of the software that Digital developed.  K I wonder how many of the companies that bought software rights from Digital=% will suport VMS with this initiative.'  * ------------------------------------------  ! HP Hints at New Software Strategys Wed Oct 30, 9:00 AM ET Ashlee Vance, IDG News Service  H Hewlett-Packard plans to announce a new software roadmap next month thatL will provide information on its plan to marry a variety of disparate product3 lines, according to a top executive at the company.G  G HP will kick off the next wave of its software strategy by providing antK architecture for the ways in which its popular OpenView management softwareeC can be linked tightly with software used in its Utility Data CentermL architecture for network management, said Nora Denzel, senior vice presidentG of HP's software business unit. Along with this new technology, HP willgH announce new partnerships with software vendors and new services for its telecommunications customers.A  L "In November, you will see a complete roadmap unveiled," Denzel said. "ThereH will be... software and services from HP and partners that will arrive."     Management ToolsH Like IBM and Sun Microsystems, HP has embarked on a long-term project toK make it easier to manage large data centers. All three vendors want to poolhK hundreds of servers and storage systems and give administrators one view of J an entire network. HP calls this vision "adaptive infrastructure" and sees2 its UDC architecture as one tool for achieving it.  L Along with developing this type of network mapping technology, HP has workedJ to strengthen its OpenView management software, which checks on the healthE of a wide variety of hardware. HP now appears ready to join pieces ofeK OpenView with its UDC technology to create a large, over-arching management I suite. The company expects to roll out products that fit into this vision % over the next few years, Denzel said.e  K A clear software vision from HP would be a welcome change, according to onef analyst.  J "HP has had a mixed story," said Gordon Haff, an analyst at Illuminata, inL Nashua, New Hampshire. "There has really been a grab bag of pieces that have$ made up their virtualization story."     Post-Merger LifeH Part of the confusion surrounding HP's software stems from the company'sK acquisition of Compaq Computer earlier this year. After the deal closed, HP>H announced it would drop a large chunk of its middleware product line andH partner with Microsoft and BEA Systems for application server technologyJ instead. This strategy forces HP to give up some control of the middleware6 software stack that Sun and IBM still have, Haff said.  J However, Denzel contended that the move toward Microsoft and BEA helps theH company build on the strengths of pre-merger HP in the Java world and of Compaq in the.Net world.  D "As time shifts, your strategy should shift," Denzel said. "We thinkL application servers will be heavily commoditized. They are just a feature of the OS."  C The potential gaps in its middleware strategy and lack of a unifiedoI architecture for its management products have triggered doubts about HP's  software story, Haff said.  K "Software remains a gaping hole at HP," he said. "HP's software strategy issH really management, and it's really OpenView. I, and I think many others,J remain skeptical of their abilities to fill in all the missing pieces withK partners. IBM and Sun are more masters of their own destiny with respect toe
 software."     Providing Answers L With its November announcement, HP should make some headway toward answeringK these questions. The company will bring out more software partners to prove*3 that it can pull off the union of UDC and OpenView.l  K Haff expects the company to present a way for OpenView to sit on top of the@F UDC technology. This would allow administrators to check on individualG servers and form refined pictures of the systems' health. It would alsopG allow administrators to see all the hardware on the network in a single- view.-  I HP already includes "a piece of OpenView" with its UDC technology, Denzel D said. The company will simply be drawing closer ties between the two management architectures.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:29:55 -0500.- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>m. Subject: Re: HP Hints at New Software Strategy, Message-ID: <3DC04141.3C2ED0AC@videotron.ca>   John Smith wrote:- > I > It will be very interesting to see how VMS fits into this. Too bad they @ > don't still have a lot of the software that Digital developed.  L My current view is not to build/trust/count on any of the "Digital" softwareK on VMS. I don't mind some of the legacy stuff on my machines because I have0F them installed and running fine, but I certaintly would never advise aG customer to buy a HP software product for VMS, unless it were blatantly " obvious that it would not go away.  J Look at the number of packages that are in a state of limbo since Palmer'sH randomized lobotomy ? There are many packages that won't make it to IA64K because of clever wording in those commitments. That clever wording is whataJ allowed them to announce All-In-1's death even though it has one or 2 more versions coming on Alpha.3  L With ALL-IN-1 gone, expect Mailbus 400 to go too. (Message Router is alreadyG long gone). If they build a separate LDAP server, then expect the X.5009" Directory server to also be toast.    M Based on the text I have rtead so far, that new "strategy" is just some fancy M announcement that HP will port its Openview to its 2 new operatings systems ,tM Tandem and VMS. I don't think that HP will announce anything about VMS's reala software needs.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:29:52 +0000e' From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy % Subject: Re: Immutable laws of the PC . Message-ID: <3DBFFAF0.1030806@nospamn.sun.com>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > David Mathog wrote in messagen1 > <20021028091705.3fff90df.mathog@caltech.edu>...s >r > L > This is where it gets interesting.  The assumption is that Opteron will beJ > able to compete on price/performance with whatever generation of IA32 isM > then current when it finally appears.  As you imply, there is no compelling I > reason at this point for 64-bits on the desktop.  We can construct some M > examples where 64-bits might potentially be used, but the mass-market ISV's7L > are not going to retarget their applications for the IA64x and exclude theN > IA32 market.  So the question really gets down to:  Can Opteron IA32 competeN > with Intels IA32.  The big problem that AMD has is that Intel can underpriceN > them, and has a significant market clout both with consumers and with systemI > builders.  So it's unlikely that Opteron will be able to compete with a K > better price, and we'll get to find out just how much that "Intel Inside"r$ > sticker really means to consumers. >   > Your answer highlights unintentionally the differences between= Itanium and Opteron in terms of what AMD and Intel are trying  to do with their CPU's.   : Itanium is a hot, expensive 64 bit CPU that isn't destined> for volume desktops anytime soon. From a price and performance9 standpoint Itanium would have a real difficulty competingt- with IA32 plus it has no apps, triple whammy.a  8 Opteron or at least what you appear to be refering to is6 also aimed at the server market and it would also haveA difficulty competing with IA32 in terms of price, its performanceo is ok, and apps are ok.s  ? But AMD also have a desktop version, 1 hypertransport etc which = is cost reduced, that will compete in price performance termsh& with IA32 and will also have the apps.  C And then we get to AMD's huge advantage, it will have a competitivevC 64bit processor that is also able to run x86 32bit apps and competea> with Intels IA32 processor, one that does run on a desktop andA in a server. Sort of like why SPARC is still here and Alpha isnt.s  E So people can continue to run their 32bit desktop apps of which there @ are thousands while also having access to a small number of apps@ that have been ported to 64bit. You cannot do this with Intel in8 any way that is competive in price or performance terms.  @ If AMD is sucessfull in bringing out their 64bit desktop variant> then it is possible that it could sink IA32. All you need is a= desktop bandwagon around 64bit computing (however dubious the'< claim is in general) coupled with a few killer 64bit desktop apps. Quake64 or whatever.    L > That leaves performance for Opteron to compete on, and if it's performanceM > will be significant enough for people to pay a premium for it...  how large I > is the potential base of super-high-end desktop PC users?  If the pricepH > point today for an entry PC is about $600, and a high-end is say $1500G > (ignoring options) - will the user pay more for "64-bit ready OpteronmN > Inside"?  How much more?  Or is it more likely that the system builder needsL > to hit a price point - and needs to eat the incremental cost for the chip? > J > So, I believe that the only logical target for Opteron is the higher-endK > IA32 server space (say up to 8-way SMP boxes) - where people will pay foroM > the performance - NOT the desktop which is far more price sensitive.  WhichnM > if I am right, reduces that "95%..." you speak of to 95% of a small segment. > of the IA32 space. >   4 This is why AMD are doing a reduced cost x86-64 CPU.  I > The 64-bit capabilities may take years for anyone to seriously exploit.e" > Probably database vendors first. > J > And note - the only real business for "shrink wrap software" (outside ofL > perhaps Apple) is Windows.  So that is really the only place the IA32-nessN > is an advantage.  Linux (despite Linus's dislike if IPF) will happily run on, > IPF, or IA32, or one would imagine x86-64. >  > L >>With Itanic, assuming any actually ever appear for sale, you're looking at# >>all new software from the get go.2 >  > I > Not really.  You need new software for the applications you really caredN > about performance for, and others can use the IA32 capabilities.  So, if youM > are buying a 8-way Windows Server to run Oracle - you really only care thathM > Oracle is native.  Not that Solitare doesn't run faster.  So Intels job haseK > to be to convince the major server ISV's to produce IPF versions of their  > software for Windows64.e >   > But with Intels own modest projections for IA-64 sales this is; going to be an uphill struggle for Intel. Small volumes and @ lots of tuning to get good performance are not a very attractive proposition to put to an ISV.     ; Opterons huge advantage is that this isn't really an issue.e< It can run 32bit apps perfectly well and the limitted number: of apps that really need 64bit support like Oracle in some scenarios will get done.  : Remember this isn't really a discussion about 32/64bit but2 about compiling for a new ISA. All apps need to be2 compiled and optimised for IA-64 (the alternatives1 arn't worth considering). All apps do not need ton2 be compiled and optimised for x86-64 only the ones2 where maximum performance is required or 64bit may be usefull.      > & >> And the only reason to go to Itanic? >>is to get a 64 bit machine. It's a jarring transition and onewD >>that there's no compelling reason to make outside the data center. >  > N > There is no jarring transition for most people.  Yes, it may be work for theK > ISV, but fewer and fewer customers are writing their own code these days, M > instead of using off-the-shelf software, and applets written in things like- > Java.- >    Rubbish.  / Lets look at one small but significant example.z4 Currently there are no production versions of Oracle1 available for Itanium/HP-UX, a beta 9i release is9 however there.  1 Oracle are increasingly unlikely to port 8.1.7 to , HP-UX/IA-64 so you are likely to end up with 9i and thats it.  - Try telling any DBA worth their salt that thew* transition between 8.1.7 on HP-UX/PA to 9i# on HP-UX/IA-64 will be non-trivial.    Regardse Andrew Harrisonc   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:36:17 +0000o' From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancyd% Subject: Re: Immutable laws of the PCn. Message-ID: <3DBFFC71.8090901@nospamn.sun.com>  ( I know its bad form to followup ones own! posts but the lack of a supportede. release of Oracle for HP-UX/IA64 puts the seal- on any discussions about the validity of HP'se- claims to have sucessfully migrated customerss from HP-UX/PA to HP-UX/IA64.   Regardsr( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >  >  > Fred Kleinsorge wrote: >   >> David Mathog wrote in message2 >> <20021028091705.3fff90df.mathog@caltech.edu>... >> >>F >> This is where it gets interesting.  The assumption is that Opteron 
 >> will beK >> able to compete on price/performance with whatever generation of IA32 iseD >> then current when it finally appears.  As you imply, there is no 
 >> compellingiJ >> reason at this point for 64-bits on the desktop.  We can construct someI >> examples where 64-bits might potentially be used, but the mass-market f >> ISV'sJ >> are not going to retarget their applications for the IA64x and exclude  >> theH >> IA32 market.  So the question really gets down to:  Can Opteron IA32 
 >> competeE >> with Intels IA32.  The big problem that AMD has is that Intel can e
 >> underpricesI >> them, and has a significant market clout both with consumers and with e	 >> system-J >> builders.  So it's unlikely that Opteron will be able to compete with aL >> better price, and we'll get to find out just how much that "Intel Inside"% >> sticker really means to consumers.o >> > @ > Your answer highlights unintentionally the differences between? > Itanium and Opteron in terms of what AMD and Intel are tryinge > to do with their CPU's.W > < > Itanium is a hot, expensive 64 bit CPU that isn't destined@ > for volume desktops anytime soon. From a price and performance; > standpoint Itanium would have a real difficulty competing@/ > with IA32 plus it has no apps, triple whammy.d > : > Opteron or at least what you appear to be refering to is8 > also aimed at the server market and it would also haveC > difficulty competing with IA32 in terms of price, its performancem > is ok, and apps are ok.  > A > But AMD also have a desktop version, 1 hypertransport etc whichs? > is cost reduced, that will compete in price performance termse( > with IA32 and will also have the apps. > E > And then we get to AMD's huge advantage, it will have a competitive(E > 64bit processor that is also able to run x86 32bit apps and competea@ > with Intels IA32 processor, one that does run on a desktop andC > in a server. Sort of like why SPARC is still here and Alpha isnt.( > G > So people can continue to run their 32bit desktop apps of which theregB > are thousands while also having access to a small number of appsB > that have been ported to 64bit. You cannot do this with Intel in: > any way that is competive in price or performance terms. > B > If AMD is sucessfull in bringing out their 64bit desktop variant@ > then it is possible that it could sink IA32. All you need is a? > desktop bandwagon around 64bit computing (however dubious thed> > claim is in general) coupled with a few killer 64bit desktop > apps. Quake64 or whatever. >  > B >> That leaves performance for Opteron to compete on, and if it's  >> performanceI >> will be significant enough for people to pay a premium for it...  how Y >> largeJ >> is the potential base of super-high-end desktop PC users?  If the priceI >> point today for an entry PC is about $600, and a high-end is say $1500cH >> (ignoring options) - will the user pay more for "64-bit ready OpteronJ >> Inside"?  How much more?  Or is it more likely that the system builder  >> needsH >> to hit a price point - and needs to eat the incremental cost for the  >> chip? >>K >> So, I believe that the only logical target for Opteron is the higher-end4L >> IA32 server space (say up to 8-way SMP boxes) - where people will pay forI >> the performance - NOT the desktop which is far more price sensitive.  e >> WhichG >> if I am right, reduces that "95%..." you speak of to 95% of a small t
 >> segment >> of the IA32 space.c >> > 6 > This is why AMD are doing a reduced cost x86-64 CPU. > J >> The 64-bit capabilities may take years for anyone to seriously exploit.# >> Probably database vendors first.  >>K >> And note - the only real business for "shrink wrap software" (outside ofnD >> perhaps Apple) is Windows.  So that is really the only place the  >> IA32-nessI >> is an advantage.  Linux (despite Linus's dislike if IPF) will happily  	 >> run on - >> IPF, or IA32, or one would imagine x86-64.e >> >>D >>> With Itanic, assuming any actually ever appear for sale, you're  >>> looking at% >>> all new software from the get go.e >> >> >>J >> Not really.  You need new software for the applications you really careI >> about performance for, and others can use the IA32 capabilities.  So,  	 >> if you:J >> are buying a 8-way Windows Server to run Oracle - you really only care  >> thatoG >> Oracle is native.  Not that Solitare doesn't run faster.  So Intels h
 >> job hasL >> to be to convince the major server ISV's to produce IPF versions of their >> software for Windows64. >> > @ > But with Intels own modest projections for IA-64 sales this is= > going to be an uphill struggle for Intel. Small volumes andeB > lots of tuning to get good performance are not a very attractive > proposition to put to an ISV.- >  > = > Opterons huge advantage is that this isn't really an issue.m> > It can run 32bit apps perfectly well and the limitted number< > of apps that really need 64bit support like Oracle in some > scenarios will get done. > < > Remember this isn't really a discussion about 32/64bit but4 > about compiling for a new ISA. All apps need to be4 > compiled and optimised for IA-64 (the alternatives3 > arn't worth considering). All apps do not need tod4 > be compiled and optimised for x86-64 only the ones4 > where maximum performance is required or 64bit may
 > be usefull.  >  >  >>' >>> And the only reason to go to Itanic A >>> is to get a 64 bit machine. It's a jarring transition and oneaF >>> that there's no compelling reason to make outside the data center. >> >> >>H >> There is no jarring transition for most people.  Yes, it may be work 
 >> for theL >> ISV, but fewer and fewer customers are writing their own code these days,J >> instead of using off-the-shelf software, and applets written in things  >> likeF >> Java. >> > 
 > Rubbish. > 1 > Lets look at one small but significant example.W6 > Currently there are no production versions of Oracle3 > available for Itanium/HP-UX, a beta 9i release ise > however there. > 3 > Oracle are increasingly unlikely to port 8.1.7 toi. > HP-UX/IA-64 so you are likely to end up with > 9i and thats it. > / > Try telling any DBA worth their salt that thea, > transition between 8.1.7 on HP-UX/PA to 9i% > on HP-UX/IA-64 will be non-trivial.Y > 	 > Regardsn > Andrew Harrisone >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:21:51 GMTe. From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)9 Subject: Re: installing the Adobe Acrobat Viewer for Javaf3 Message-ID: <jjWv9.41080$aa2.475849@news.chello.at>s  U In article <CFN375594785171181@news.felk.cvut.cz>, Jiri Kulhan <lars@post.cz> writes: I >I've got Viewer running with 1.1.8-5 with no problem. Just followed the  A >install guide on openvms.compaq.com. But yes, it's slow as hell.e  F Yes, so did I. But for newer JAVA one needs the Apple supplied stub...   -- - Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER,% Network and OpenVMS system specialistm E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 11:39:28 -0500s From: TR <if-or@cogeco.ca>+ Subject: Looking for contract opportunitiese7 Message-ID: <MPG.1829d54a96ecb6da989816@news.cogeco.ca>e  [ Forgive me if this post is inappropriate in this newsgroup...I am just trying everything I s
 can think of.r  \ I'll be blunt about this. I have 19 years of experience with VMS/OpenVMS, yet opportunities ^ for contract work are fading fast. I am looking for any leads that may lead to contract work, 3 preferably programming. Duration is not important. -  X I am looking for VMS opportunities in Canada. Actually, I'm just looking for one....not Z greedy here :) I am not opposed to a finder's fee, if that's what it takes. Telecommuting [ opportunities, in the US, Canada, or anywhere else in the world, will also be appreciated. a8 Unfortunately, extensive travel is not an option for me.  ] If you have any info, a lead, or might be interested in my services, then please email me at m if-or@cogeco.ca for my resume.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:17:26 -0500e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> / Subject: Re: Looking for contract opportunitiest, Message-ID: <3DC03E54.537C2873@videotron.ca>   Don Sykes wrote: >  > Welcome to the club.   Yeah, misery loves company.p   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:16:52 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>l@ Subject: Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorldI Message-ID: <UBTv9.134561$%h2.18163@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>T  @ "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com> wrote in message$ news:apommb$a8l$1@web1.cup.hp.com...+ > Thanks to Keith Parris for sending to me.u >.K > A quote from Martin Fink, head of HP's Linux organization, in LinuxWorld:  >m >s >hG > "Post-merger HP is 'very adept at managing multiple environments.' He G > cited VMS support in addition to HP-UX, and Tandem in addition to thefD > others. Making the point that it's not just a Windows versus Linux > world for HP these days."- >-= > http://www.linuxworld.com/site-stories/2002/1014.hp-p2.html-        HP owns/developed MPE and PH-UX. It now owns VMS, NSK, Tru64. It sells Windows and Linux.-  L It never was simply a Windows vs. Linux world at HP, (well it shouldn't be).  L For Fink to have to make a comment like the one he made just shows how badlyI HP gets the message out that they have operating systems for all kinds ofe applications and environments.  J Ford makes all kinds of vehicles, and they advertise and market every lastL one of them to their intended target audiences. And they all manage to sell.K Maybe HP ought to hire the marketing types from GM, Ford, Proctor & Gamble,lK Unilever, and a myriad of other companies that know how to market products.i   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:34:58 GMTo" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG@ Subject: Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld0 Message-ID: <00A16390.D84B4F4A@SendSpamHere.ORG>  o In article <UBTv9.134561$%h2.18163@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:t >lA >"Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com> wrote in messagei% >news:apommb$a8l$1@web1.cup.hp.com...a, >> Thanks to Keith Parris for sending to me. >>L >> A quote from Martin Fink, head of HP's Linux organization, in LinuxWorld: >> >> >>H >> "Post-merger HP is 'very adept at managing multiple environments.' HeH >> cited VMS support in addition to HP-UX, and Tandem in addition to theE >> others. Making the point that it's not just a Windows versus Linux  >> world for HP these days." >>> >> http://www.linuxworld.com/site-stories/2002/1014.hp-p2.html >  >) > ! >HP owns/developed MPE and PH-UX.a >It now owns VMS, NSK, Tru64.a >It sells Windows and Linux. >IM >It never was simply a Windows vs. Linux world at HP, (well it shouldn't be).N >eM >For Fink to have to make a comment like the one he made just shows how badly-J >HP gets the message out that they have operating systems for all kinds of >applications and environments.  >pK >Ford makes all kinds of vehicles, and they advertise and market every last3M >one of them to their intended target audiences. And they all manage to sell.:L >Maybe HP ought to hire the marketing types from GM, Ford, Proctor & Gamble,L >Unilever, and a myriad of other companies that know how to market products.  K ... as a Mustang enthusiast, I must say that I can't recall the last time IsL saw a Ford ad for their Mustang (save for the video tape of old Mustand ads 8 that I take out every now and again to remember when...) --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMh            t5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" c   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 11:36:04 -0500 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>@ Subject: Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld. Message-ID: <3DC00A73.8A74BC00@mindspring.com>   John Smith wrote:r  L > Ford makes all kinds of vehicles, and they advertise and market every lastN > one of them to their intended target audiences. And they all manage to sell.M > Maybe HP ought to hire the marketing types from GM, Ford, Proctor & Gamble,nM > Unilever, and a myriad of other companies that know how to market products.S  2 Do you suppose RJR/Nabisco has any more executives1 to spare? I understand that the last "Cookie Guy"i. that went into computers did okay for himself.   Atlant   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:53:37 -0500s- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>m@ Subject: Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld, Message-ID: <3DC038C1.B98C8244@videotron.ca>   > John Smith wrote:y > N > > Ford makes all kinds of vehicles, and they advertise and market every last4 > > one of them to their intended target audiences.   K Why don't they target their construction trucks ads with that awfull "builtrJ like a rock" stuff only to the construction industry trade rags instead ofN spending megabucks on TV ads aired on all sorts of programs ? Could it be thatL by reaching into different audiences, they do expand the marketplace for its trucks ?  J Isn't that how SUVs were able to steal customers from normal japanese cars back into US built cars?  M Heck, why then would Hummer advertise on TV since they make military vehiclesbN ? oops, that one is obvious: they saw an opportunity to expand their market byF advertising in the non traditional places to open/develop new markets.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:43:16 -0500 2 From: Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com>@ Subject: Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorld. Message-ID: <3DC04464.4F63DCA6@mindspring.com>   John Smith wrote:   A > "Atlant Schmidt" <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote in messagef >e6 > > Do you suppose RJR/Nabisco has any more executives5 > > to spare? I understand that the last "Cookie Guy"-2 > > that went into computers did okay for himself. > 1 > He's open for offers as of the end of the year. 1 > http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/x% > mp/20021030/tc_cmp/iwk20021029s0007t  1 And he's only 60! Heck, he's got a few good yearsr0 left in him! But he probably wouldn't suffer C&C gladly.s   Atlant   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:15:15 GMTf# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>c@ Subject: Re: Not sure if anyone else I seen this from LinuxWorldI Message-ID: <TRYv9.121315$Q3S.80267@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>t  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3DC038C1.B98C8244@videotron.ca... > > John Smith wrote:  > > K > > > Ford makes all kinds of vehicles, and they advertise and market every  last5 > > > one of them to their intended target audiences.a >oF > Why don't they target their construction trucks ads with that awfull "builtL > like a rock" stuff only to the construction industry trade rags instead ofK > spending megabucks on TV ads aired on all sorts of programs ? Could it ben thatJ > by reaching into different audiences, they do expand the marketplace for itsh
 > trucks ? > L > Isn't that how SUVs were able to steal customers from normal japanese cars > back into US built cars? >rF > Heck, why then would Hummer advertise on TV since they make military vehiclesF > ? oops, that one is obvious: they saw an opportunity to expand their	 market by H > advertising in the non traditional places to open/develop new markets.    J God forbid (oooops. make that Bill Gates forbids) that HP should advertiseH in channels and venues that dissatisfied Microsoft Exchange and Advanced; Server users might see that there are robust alternatives..u  K So to steal a 'rugged' page from Hummer...maybe we'll put this ad in 'Field28 & Stream', after all don't some CEO's hunt and fish too?  : (stars and stripes flutter in the background, eagles soar,C J-Stars images, stock trading, operating rooms, stirring music....)A  ( "High over the mountains of Afghanistan,/ in the trenches of stock and commodity trading,n" in the guts of telecommunications,$ or in some of the largest hospitals,* you'll find the most scalable and reliable, computers and operating system in the world.  5 Whether it's national defense, protecting your money,l5 protecting your health, or enabling your free speech,e6 when the going gets tough, the toughest challenges get; OpenVMS and AlphaServers (none of this IA-64 crap) from HP.t  % They're right for your business too."v    * (c) 2002, John Smith. All rights reserved.  D p.s.  HP...I want the royalty money wired to my bank in the Caymans.J        Only if you send enough money can you edit out the IA-64 reference. ;-)s   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:46:08 GMTt$ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Subject: Re: Palladium article8 Message-ID: <00A1639A.C830AFD5@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  \ In article <3DC03D99.998DB700@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: >uN >That low maintenance option was a neat marketing material. For instance, thisN >disabled many Windows menus, and prevented folks from puting documents on theK >desktop, saying that putting documents on desktop was a time consuming andeA >caused many problems and calls from employees to their IT folks.s >iO >When I got to that paragraph, that is when I realised how much of a propagandaiJ >machine Microcoft was, just like IBM used to be. Having been on MAC sinceM >1986, I can tell you that allowing folks to put stuff on the desktop is a noo( >brainer and doesn't cause any problems. >.M >I saw the "don't put stuff on desktop" as a clear marketing attack on Apple.n  N No, or not only that.  If you're on a normal NT network where you can log intoM different workstations and get approximately the same environment (modulo thelM necessity to have partial installations of software that you try to run from mL the server, since they all need local DLLs), files stored on the desktop areI stored in your 'profile' and all user profiles are stored together on the M server (and have to be replicated around among primary and backup servers, ifoO memory serves).  If they're stored on network disks rather than on the desktop,eM then it's a lot easier to manage them, back them up, etc, and the replicationt# activity doesn't flood the network.   # (Or so the NT people here tell me.)t   -- Alant   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:14:18 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>g Subject: Re: Palladium article, Message-ID: <3DC03D99.998DB700@videotron.ca>   Shane Smith wrote: > H > Hardly anyone knows about it, and of those hardly anyone knows what itJ > really is. It's being sold and marketed as a defence against viruses andJ > a way to keep your privacy intact. It's only the technical people who're > seeing the other side.  M I haven't read this stuff, but from the way you just presented it, it remindsnM me of some document I had once read about some option in windows,. I think it E was called the "low maintenance option". One of my customers had beentJ brainwashed into that mentality and adopted it 100%. I didn't mind so muchK because their montreal office gave me business supporting them to go aroundoI those silly restrictions, or in some cases, do stuff from my home becausew+ their office didn't allow them to do that. a  N You can't imagine the political problems they had trying to get head office toI provide me with the maintenance password to a workstation so that I couldsJ install an expansion utility (Stuffit Expander) so that the employee couldI properly receive binary attachements that came from the magasine's layoutt' people who, of course, worked on MACs).n  M Low maintenance ! Yeah sure. Employees contantly fought to get around all thehK restrictions that had been imposed, and the support folks were swamped withaL requests to install this and install that. I bet they got more support callsJ because of the low maintenance package than if they just had normal, fully functional Windows machines.    M That low maintenance option was a neat marketing material. For instance, thistM disabled many Windows menus, and prevented folks from puting documents on the J desktop, saying that putting documents on desktop was a time consuming and@ caused many problems and calls from employees to their IT folks.  N When I got to that paragraph, that is when I realised how much of a propagandaI machine Microcoft was, just like IBM used to be. Having been on MAC sincehL 1986, I can tell you that allowing folks to put stuff on the desktop is a no' brainer and doesn't cause any problems.s  L I saw the "don't put stuff on desktop" as a clear marketing attack on Apple.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:53:54 -0500"- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>y Subject: Re: Palladium article, Message-ID: <3DC054EA.F2BA4CBB@videotron.ca>  % winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote:oQ > memory serves).  If they're stored on network disks rather than on the desktop, O > then it's a lot easier to manage them, back them up, etc, and the replication % > activity doesn't flood the network.i  L On the mac, the "desktop" is actually just a normal folder on the disk driveK called, you guessed it, "Desktop Folder". If you have multiple drives, eacheN drive can have a "Desktop Folder" and then files in that folder just appear on) whatever desktop the drive is mounted on.l  N MS's implementation is much poorer, which is why they probably dissuaded folksF from using it. They probably hacked some "desktop capability" just for0 marketing withough really planning it carefully.   ------------------------------   Date: 30 Oct 2002 18:20 CSTa' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)  Subject: Re: Palladium article- Message-ID: <30OCT200218200445@gerg.tamu.edu>e  1 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes...e& }winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote:R }> memory serves).  If they're stored on network disks rather than on the desktop,P }> then it's a lot easier to manage them, back them up, etc, and the replication& }> activity doesn't flood the network. } M }On the mac, the "desktop" is actually just a normal folder on the disk driveyL }called, you guessed it, "Desktop Folder". If you have multiple drives, eachO }drive can have a "Desktop Folder" and then files in that folder just appear onM* }whatever desktop the drive is mounted on. } O }MS's implementation is much poorer, which is why they probably dissuaded folks G }from using it. They probably hacked some "desktop capability" just forl1 }marketing withough really planning it carefully.a  J In Windows, of all flavors I have looked at, the desktop is just a folder.  > Well, OK - its really two folders: your desktop folder and theD "All Users" desktop folder, but anything you add will go into yours,@ only an administrator grouped user can add to or delete from theC other one (normally) and they have to do it on purpose (or just leta, various installations add them, as some do).  G And that is, of course, for one specific user. Each user has their own,sE which is a good thing - when I log in I certainly don't want all yournC junk showing up on my desktop, just my junk (of which there is veryo6 little, as I prefer an uncluttered desktop on screen).  E The only disadvantage I can see is that you can put shortcuts on yourDF desktop that point to files on disks - CDs, floppies, network drives - that you don't have mounted.   --- Carl   ------------------------------   Date: 30 OCT 2002 23:20:03 GMT4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher). Subject: Re: Pathworks v6 (AS) & Win2000 (SBS)2 Message-ID: <30OCT02.23200321@thuria.waisman.wisc>  = In a previous article, whohe@whoever.com (DL Phillips) wrote:    ->... I now thinkiF ->getting to Pw6.1 then AS 7.(latest) where I can just be a member of < ->the domain will be my only hope of making this thing work.  - Not sure if you have a cluster but it you do:o  B Keep in mind when you upgrade to VMS 7.3-1 you cannot do a rollingH upgrade if you have AS installed due to registry issues. To do a rollingH upgrade you will want to be at PW 6.1 before the VMS upgrade and installH AS 7.x after the VMS upgrade. This is mentioned in the VMS 7.3-1 release notes.   --G -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madisond3 --                karcher.nospam@waisman.wisc.edu  v   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:40:13 GMTa! From: rob.buxton@wcc.spam.govt.nzd* Subject: Re: perl, perlrte and WASD Server$ Message-ID: <3dc03488.87668360@news>   Hi All,b  @ Thanks for the info. Apologies for the typos - yep I am on 8.0.1F Probably trying to run before I could crawl and have retreated back to* straight perl. I'll leave the rte for now.B Found that the protection code on perlshr was not allowing the web server access.- Now working so we're back on track for a bit.   A Glad to know Winstons' book is out, I knew it was delayed and hadsF forgotten about it - pressure of work 8-) I'll see if I can get a copy
 through work.e   Thanks,r   Rob.  D On Wed, 30 Oct 2002 02:54:33 GMT, rob.buxton@wcc.spam.govt.nz wrote:   >Hi All, > E >Trying to get Perl going on a VAX VMS System with a WASD Web Server.i >This is WASD 8.0 under VMS 7.3  >'$ >Perl is installed and works (5.8.0)< >From DCL a command like "perl test.pl" works as I'd expect. >-* >Now trying to get this working from WASD. > G >There seems to be a number of options so I may have confused myself...t >     whats new! >30 >I have the following entries in the conf files. >r >http$map.conf@ >exec+ /plrte/* (ht_root:[script]perlrte.exe)/ht_root/src/perl/* >>	 >http$map ! >.pl $ht_root:[script]PERLRTE.EXEn >also triedp" >.pl (ht_root:[script]PERLRTE.EXE) > . >I've copied the perlrte.exe to this location. >o; >Whenever I try and call the page http://node/plrte/test.pl % > all I get back from the browser is:nC >ERROR 502  -  External agent did not respond (or not acceptably).   >mF >Anyone already set this up and have the correct entries to add to the >configuration files?t2 >Anything else you need to do to get this to work? >Any tips grarefully received! >  >TIA g >  >Rob.:   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:04:11 -0500a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ) Subject: Re: So I went to the HP IT forume, Message-ID: <3DC03B3B.2A827682@videotron.ca>   "Doc.Cypher" wrote:eG > Anyway, as I suspect you'd agree, the average student who takes an ITh. > course is looking for marketable job skills.  N Correct. But this is where there is currently a WINDOW of opportunity for VMS.M Because clustering and disaster tolerance are becoming important to business,iN having had lectures and perhaps hands on stuff on some obscure VMS system willK give students who took that course a definite edge over those who stayed ona2 Unix and are 10 years behind the state of the art.  L If HP waits too long, then Unix will hava narrowed the gap sufficiently thatM having a separate platform for clustering/DT wouldn't be worth the effort foriJ a university. But right now, VMS would be the only way for a university to give its students an edge.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:09:53 +0530a5 From: "Sandeep Yelwatkar" <Sandeep_Yelwatkar@bmc.com>n Subject: TCL/TK on OpenVMS/ Message-ID: <us1g3l7gl77578@corp.supernews.com>l   Hi ,  7 I would like to know if TCL/TK is available on OpenVMS?3  B If yes, can someone send me the URL from where I can download it .   Thanks in advance for any help   Sandeeph   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 21:13:36 -0600i1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> + Subject: Re: TCPIP buglet ... (UCX$UCP.EXE) & Message-ID: <3DC09FE0.7FED245@fsi.net>   JF Mezei wrote:t > [snip]O > I am curious, shouldn't UCS$UCP.EXE be created as an alias of TCPIP$UCP.EXE ?lN > Or is this considered potentially too much of a potential problem later on ?  H NO! IMO, if anything, it should at least be a copy. Let's not get "link"* crazy like the Eunuchs (UN*X folks), o.k.?  K > I'll just temporarily copy the TCPIP$UCP file to the UCX name so that thee- > install will work and then remove it back.    E That's what I would do, with the caveat that you'll need to update itm! when you upgrade TCP/IP Services.t   -- b David J. Dachteran dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------   Date: 31 Oct 2002 02:31:55 GMT# From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) 3 Subject: Re: TCPIP v 5.3 and bad password ip block?e* Message-ID: <apq4mr$28m$2@web1.cup.hp.com>  X In article <apmfmi026ki@enews4.newsguy.com>, "DigiDemon" <digidemon@hotmail.com> writes:I :Just a quick question is all....after upgrading to 5.3 on OpenVMS 7.2-1,aG :now one someone types in their pass a few times wrong it locks out thetH :machine...system can't even log in =(  Any help on where to change this	 :setting?e  E   One- or two-line questions often aren't quick, they're surprisinglyo5   often among the most diffucult questions to answer.a  B   You indicate an upgrade to TCP/IP Services which would imply theC   comands involve IP operations, but you have provided no specific "C   details of the context used entering the (bogus) password values.y  B   Please provide us with some idea of what the user has typed, andA   if the username is SYSTEM or one of the TCP* usernames or such.eA   I will assume you have ECO1 or the MUP for TCP/IP Services V5.3f6   installed, or that you are not using the NFS server.  C   Larry Killgallen has pointed to the system console as a path for iB   an emergency login, and I'd point to the SHOW INTRUSION command D   to see what has happened here -- assuming that this is the OpenVMS@   security mechanisms and specifically breakin evasion involved.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------J       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.comN  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.comt   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:44:27 -0600I1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>t3 Subject: Re: TCPIP v 5.3 and bad password ip block?e& Message-ID: <3DC0990B.BB8BD9E@fsi.net>   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > ] > In article <3DBF4F37.5CC4500D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:6 > > DigiDemon wrote: > >>M > >> Just a quick question is all....after upgrading to 5.3 on OpenVMS 7.2-1,tK > >> now one someone types in their pass a few times wrong it locks out theiL > >> machine...system can't even log in =(  Any help on where to change this > >> setting?  Thanks! > >>J > > Intruder evasion will block the source IP, regardless of the username, > 6 > But logging in from the console as SYSTEM beats all.J > (Logging in from the DECwindows screen does _not_ count as the console.)  B Granted. However, the subject line addressed a specific version ofH TCP/IP Services and mentioned IP specifically. So, took for granted thatF the issue is with access via telnet - comments in another thread aboutB UCX$TELNETSYM appearing to notice and respond to telnet access not withstanding, of course.   -- o David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemst http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------   Date: 30 Oct 2002 12:53 CST.' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)t) Subject: Re: Timezone-change observations/- Message-ID: <30OCT200212534400@gerg.tamu.edu>   , Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net> writes... }Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:, }> cY }> In article <3DBD81BC.C10356B1@pacbell.net>, Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net> writes:w7 }> >I'm running VMS 7.2 w/ TCPIP 5.1. My logicals show:o }>  2 }> $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$GETSYI ("AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV") }> a# }$ echo F$GETSYI("AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV") B }%DCL-W-IVKEYW, unrecognized keyword - check validity and spelling }  }> Do you run DECdts ?( }No. I guess that's why it doesn't work?  . No, it didn't work because you are on VMS 7.2.  4 The AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV is only there on V7.3 and later.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:14:09 GMT.8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)) Subject: Re: Timezone-change observationsl1 Message-ID: <RORv9.9$Xi2.221203@news.cpqcorp.net>e  4 In article <A8Dv9.24674$aa2.291232@news.chello.at>, 0 peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER) writes:  4 >...@SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP BOTH [doesn't work].  : O.K.  Just leave BOTH off and select BOTH when/if prompted  * Or try @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP "" BOTH  ; Or read the documentation and don't trust my memory <smile>    --  I       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Pompano Beach  FL USAnH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:17:42 GMTe8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)) Subject: Re: Timezone-change observationsu2 Message-ID: <aSRv9.11$Xi2.221203@news.cpqcorp.net>  - In article <3DBF026C.809F13D0@videotron.ca>, t/ JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:   M >... your procedures includes a time zone (Yukon) which has not existed since I >the last millenium... (and Yukon is also included in the source code fore >Canada's time zones).   O.K., I missunderstood.e  = The time zone source code came/comes from an external source. D I do not know why YUKON is there -- possibly for historical reasons.   -- tI       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Pompano Beach  FL USAwH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:06:38 -0500 & From: David M Smith <dsmit115@csc.com>) Subject: Re: Timezone-change observationsw8 Message-ID: <bcb0sukdvm80sbok70henkrq43mbg8r23l@4ax.com>  K On Wed, 30 Oct 2002 18:00:15 GMT, Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net> wrote:h   >Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote:h >> e  - >> >Still PDT. I wonder wht this didn't work?k >>  2 >> $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$GETSYI ("AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV") >>  # >$ echo F$GETSYI("AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV")pB >%DCL-W-IVKEYW, unrecognized keyword - check validity and spelling >  >> Do you run DECdts ?( >No. I guess that's why it doesn't work?  O AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV is a new parameter in VMS V7.3. That's why you don't have it on D your V7.2 system, and why it is an unrecognized keyword to F$GETSYI.I -------------------------------------------------------------------------dI David M. Smith 302.391.8533                       dsmit115 at csc dot comcI Computer Sciences Corporation     (Opinions are those of the writer only) I -------------------------------------------------------------------------r   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:54:36 GMTt8 From: hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond)) Subject: Re: Timezone-change observationsp3 Message-ID: <0OWv9.25$aP2.1358967@news.cpqcorp.net>e  . In article <30OCT200212534400@gerg.tamu.edu>, ) carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) writes:>  5 >The AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV is only there on V7.3 and later.s   And only on OpenVMS Alpha.  N It is very unlikely that this functionality will be backported to OpenVMS VAX.   -- ,I       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Pompano Beach  FL USAIH        (hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 10:19:02 -0500s% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>eA Subject: Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software) / Message-ID: <urvu37ipn9ma49@news.supernews.com>   - "Cor Mom" <cor.mom@momss.nl> wrote in messagee7 news:774640de.0210300122.4f37ab76@posting.google.com...sF > I am sorry to all of you if you think that we have been spamming. WeE > have just selected a number of users that are regular posting here,eD > because we thought the software we are developing could be of yourE > interest. Please do not look to us as a spammer, because we are not,A > and will not become one. We are company that is writing serioustC > software for the OpenVMS platform. We are sorry that we made this  > small mistake. >   L You're a spammer and a liar.  You sent your spam to a support e-mail addressG that doesn't represent a person and has NEVER been used to post here orwB anywhere else.  You probably lifted the address from our web site.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:00:02 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>pA Subject: Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software) , Message-ID: <3DC03A42.D6859960@videotron.ca>   Mike Rechtman wrote:  > ... and enlarged body parts...    L Yeah, but I am disapointed I haven't yet seen products that can add 3 inches to my toes. :-) ;-)o   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:02:12 +0000 (UTC) , From: lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis)A Subject: Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)o. Message-ID: <appkt4$4sg$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> writes in article <kcVv9.16993$H67.75510@tor-nn1.netcom.ca> dated Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:08:40 -0500:oJ >Someone suggested to send a press release to Sue, and I really think it's >the way to go.   L Sue of HP?  If the product competes with something they sell, there might beK a conflict of interest.  It's better for the company selling the product to H just post the ads here (but not every day or even every week).  That guyL from islandco.com posts his Alpha hardware "sale prices" on a regular basis,E and we tolerate* it because his products are very much related to thee" subject of this newsgroup -- VMS.   L * Some may have chosen to killfile him, and that's fine too.  It's not as if1 he's rotating his From: address to avoid filters.r  J Sending individual e-mails to regular posters here gets a smaller audienceJ because it excludes lurkers, and it pisses off pretty much everybody.  I'm sure they won't do it again.  E >> > The Boulder Pledge: "Under no circumstances will I ever purchasee	 >anythingl  K That pledge is good, but it will only stop spam if 100% of consumers follow  it.  So eat a spammer today!  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.orgn> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:54:49 GMT-$ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUA Subject: Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)u8 Message-ID: <00A163B5.242F01B9@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  ] In article <appkt4$4sg$1@newslocal.mitre.org>, lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) writes:c >"Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> writes in article <kcVv9.16993$H67.75510@tor-nn1.netcom.ca> dated Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:08:40 -0500:K >>Someone suggested to send a press release to Sue, and I really think it'sn >>the way to go. >hM >Sue of HP?  If the product competes with something they sell, there might beML >a conflict of interest.  It's better for the company selling the product toI >just post the ads here (but not every day or even every week).  That guy-M >from islandco.com posts his Alpha hardware "sale prices" on a regular basis,cF >and we tolerate* it because his products are very much related to the# >subject of this newsgroup -- VMS. e  D While it would be harmless to post to the newsgroup whenever there'sL a new version of the product, I think going through Sue is a good idea.  SheK won't suppress competing products - a bigger portfolio and a wide array of s choices is a good thing. d >h -- Alana   ------------------------------    Date: 30 Oct 2002 20:57:31 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)aA Subject: Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)a3 Message-ID: <Y+dmMUZ8Luiu@eisner.encompasserve.org>k  ] In article <appkt4$4sg$1@newslocal.mitre.org>, lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) writes:  > "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> writes in article <kcVv9.16993$H67.75510@tor-nn1.netcom.ca> dated Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:08:40 -0500:iK >>Someone suggested to send a press release to Sue, and I really think it's- >>the way to go. > N > Sue of HP?  If the product competes with something they sell, there might be > a conflict of interest.g  + That has not seemed to be a problem lately.3   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:40:20 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>-A Subject: Re: VIP software e-mails (spamming to sell VMS software)m' Message-ID: <3DC09814.87B3615D@fsi.net>s   JF Mezei wrote:I >  > Mike Rechtman wrote:" > > ... and enlarged body parts... > N > Yeah, but I am disapointed I haven't yet seen products that can add 3 inches > to my toes. :-) ;-)   ? Trying to salvage a past investment in oversize shoes, or what?s   -- t David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsk http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/a   ------------------------------   Date: 30 Oct 2002 12:56 CSTo' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)fJ Subject: Re: VUPS, MIPS, microfortnights and other arcane units of measure- Message-ID: <30OCT200212565372@gerg.tamu.edu>x  k In article <Xns92B788BBF800LenNewsgroupID@16.105.248.153>, Leonard Fehskens <len.fehskens@hp.com> writes...6= }hammond@not@peek.ppb.cpqcorp.net (Charlie Hammond) wrote in w, }news:A0Cv9.27$_z1.1168492@news.cpqcorp.net: } 8 }>>Presuppose a unit of measurement called the redmond.  }>>How should it be defined? }> e }> Ambiguously?e } 
 }Incorrectly?s }  }len.l  8 It is already defined, but they won't tell you how it is; defined because if they did it would expose bugs that might  threaten national security.    --- Carl   ------------------------------    Date: 30 Oct 2002 20:35:10 -08002 From: cwhii_google_spam@yahoo.com (C.W.Holeman II)J Subject: Re: VUPS, MIPS, microfortnights and other arcane units of measure= Message-ID: <77555df7.0210302035.44d16b2a@posting.google.com>M  t VAXVMS <bounce@notmail.com> wrote in message news:<BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E4903027B8F@rlghncst964.usps.gov>...7 > Presuppose a unit of measurement called the redmond. 3 > How should it be defined?s  @ My answer is inspired by a quote that was shown at the "OpenVMS C comes to Itanium" by HP in Long Beach, CA, US this morning. It was nK something like "VMS was clustering when MS was trying to get DOS on an IBM o PC".  7 The sum of this for each feature in a software product:a  B         the_release-date_of_the_MS_product_with_the_same_feature -'         the_release_date_of_the_productc  @ So, for a specific feature a negative value indicates MS leading@ and a positive value indicates your product leading. Zero is the( value for all MS products by definition.   -- C.W.Holeman II< cwhii5@Julian5Locals.com                http://also.as/cwhii remove the fives# Send spam to junkmail@earthlink.net4   ------------------------------    Date: 30 Oct 2002 20:56:49 -0800# From: dooleys@snowy.net.au (dooley)n" Subject: Whatever happened to ....= Message-ID: <1ca82fc6.0210302056.44831917@posting.google.com>e  - What do you do when you no longer have a vax?m take up photography?  2 http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/4401100.htm   (as seen on www.slashdot.org)s   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.601 ************************