1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 05 Sep 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 489       Contents: Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article RE: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article	 Re: am/pm 	 Re: am/pm 	 Re: am/pm 	 Re: am/pm  Re: Anyone need a RX50?  RE: Anyone need a RX50?  Calculating GB Re: Calculating GB Re: Calculating GB Re: Calculating GB Re: Calculating GB> Re: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.3> Re: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.3 Compression Utility?% Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK % Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK  CSV2JPEG /BMP/???  Re: CSV2JPEG /BMP/??? G Re: Current ways to restrict FTP access to user's login directory tree? ( Re: DECC RTL Migration - Advice Required Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format./ DECwindows X11 display server: creating visuals & Digital Alpha DEC Alphastation 500/266* Re: Digital Alpha DEC Alphastation 500/266) Engana o Fisco, o Estado, os amigos  9504  Re: Escape Sequences Re: Escape Sequences Re: File open (URGENT!) E Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly) E Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly) E Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly) E Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly) . Re: Hardware Question . Alphastation 255 266/49 Re: Heterogenous Clusters and Shadowsets for system disks 9 Re: Heterogenous Clusters and Shadowsets for system disks  Hitachi and VMS   Re: How to configure DECNet-plus7 Re: Humm, I am getting confused between a PDP and a Vax + Re: IBM did it, Sun did it, why Compaq not? + Re: IBM did it, Sun did it, why Compaq not?  Re: Itanic2 performance  Re: Itanic2 performance  Re: Lint tool for HPQ CXX   Re: Looking for a VMS favour....  Re: Looking for a VMS favour....  Re: Looking for a VMS favour....  Re: Looking for a VMS favour....  Re: Looking for a VMS favour....  Re: Looking for a VMS favour....  Re: Looking for a VMS favour....- Mapping PF1-PF4 in DECwindows or Linux xterm? 1 Re: Mapping PF1-PF4 in DECwindows or Linux xterm? 1 Re: Mapping PF1-PF4 in DECwindows or Linux xterm?  Re: MATCHC Instruction9 Re: netscape/modzilla/HP/open-source: system requirements   Re: Networking with Alpha Server" Re: OpenOffice ODBC and Oracle Rdb Re: OpenSSL woes. Re: OpenVMS Plans (was: Re: Please Sum it up.) Re: Please Sum it up. 
 PortmapperA Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum? A Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum? A Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum? A Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum? A Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum? A Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum? A Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?  Re: simh is back up. Re: simh is back up. simh is back up. Re: simh is back up. Re: simh is back up. Re: simh is back up. Re: simh is back up.8 Re: Size of I/O count fields in SHOW PROC and SHOW SYS ?" Re: Storageworks paritioned drives" Re: Storageworks paritioned drives" Re: Storageworks paritioned drives! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question ! Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question  Re: TCPTRACE5 Re: VMS and HP (Was Re: Some interesting Linux Press)  Re: VMS for i86  Re: VMS Printing To CA/Dispatch = Who are the largest VMS customers. Top ten? (Was: VMS and HP) @ Re: XFC V2.0 and VDDRIVER (was: RE: XFC v2 ECO, negative report)@ Re: XFC V2.0 and VDDRIVER (was: RE: XFC v2 ECO, negative report)  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:37:39 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article , Message-ID: <3D7652EE.7CD704F1@videotron.ca>   Keith Parris wrote: E > Another thing I came across: HP's MC/Service Guard clustering has a H > product called Quorum Server, which is software that runs as a processH > on a non-clustered system (or a member of a different cluster) and canF > provide a tie-breaking vote to up to 50 different clusters, totaling > as many as 100 nodes.   J I was thinking ahout the very same thing the other day while waiting at anL intersection. If one were allowed to build a program/process that knows yourJ config and adds a vote to the quorum, it would allow for an installtion toJ further automate the process of deciding which node in a disaster tolerant setup remains active.   G For instance, such a process could check for access to various ethernet D devices (decservers, routers etc) to intelligently determine what isM happening. For instance, if it can see the other site's terminal servers, but K not the CPUs, it can deduct that the ether link to the other site is up and L that the machines are down and this this side must get the required votes to continue to operate.  F However, the problem with such a scheme is at boot time. Since clusterL formation occurs so early in the boot, such a process would not exist yet soN the whole quorum might be in a state of limbo between the initial boot and the6 time such process is triggered and contributes a vote.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 13:47:14 -0500 & From: jlsue <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> Subject: Re: "inview" Article 8 Message-ID: <u6lcnukb0sjlust7jpa1eldntksho2trjd@4ax.com>  , On Wed, 04 Sep 2002 00:31:01 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:    >"Main, Kerry" wrote:  >> - common system disk  > M >For smaller clusters, wouldn't having separate systems disks be the prefered O >solution since it provides each node with greater independance in case another O >node fails, and especially allows a node to be taken off-line and upgraded and  >then brought back in ?  > O >(I realise that volume shadowing of system disk can somwhat make single system A >image AND still provide each node with the needed independance).   B Not in my experience.  Single system disk is a completely separate9 issue to node independence (at least 99.99% of the time).   A And with a single system disk, I can still make a copy to perform  upgrades on separately.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 15:17:38 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com>  Subject: RE: "inview" Article T Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4026609A9@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   JF -  G >>> For smaller clusters, wouldn't having separate systems disks be the  preferred solution..>>  H Every system has a certain amount of maintenance associated with it i.e.H start-up, tuning and config files, OS upgrades and/or patches etc, third  party products installed etc.=20  E Therefore, the value of a common system disk goes up as the number of - systems in the overall solution increases.=20   F Note - Fwiw, I like to recommend a HW RAIDED common system disk with aD combo of HW RAID and HBVS RAID for user / application drives. Two ofH these can be put in place (with common sysuaf/queue files etc) for added= availability i.e. doing OS upgrades and/or patching with zero D application availability impact. The dual common system disk is what9 would typically be used for a multi-site cluster as well.    Regards     
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Services  Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca]=20   Sent: September 4, 2002 12:31 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  Subject: Re: "inview" Article      "Main, Kerry" wrote: > - common system disk  C For smaller clusters, wouldn't having separate systems disks be the G prefered solution since it provides each node with greater independance D in case another node fails, and especially allows a node to be taken0 off-line and upgraded and then brought back in ?  G (I realise that volume shadowing of system disk can somwhat make single G system image AND still provide each node with the needed independance).    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 15:27:40 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article , Message-ID: <3D765EA5.4D98CC60@videotron.ca>  ( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:C > However the big 4 applications server products, BEA, iPlanet (now  > known as SunONE,    , Andrew, perhaps you can clarify some things.  J My ISP just converted last week its email infrastructure (losing messages, down for a days or etc etc).  H When I started with them, they were with SIMS (PMDF for sun). Then, theyF migrated to Netspace Enterprise server, and now they are with iPlanet.  I Now, I am told that all 3 of these products are associated with Sun. This I seems to me like a nightmare similar to wintel shops having migraded from P cc:MAIL to MS-MAIL to Outlook/Exchange, each time, having to start from scratch.  N Is there a reason why Sun didn't just stick with SIMS and grow that product toJ allow greater scalability ?  Have there been changes in strategy at Sun in< terms of messaging which resulted in those product changes ?  K note: it is a real shame that VMS is out of the big email business for ISPs N since its clustering would be such a natural for the types of disk acesses andM transactions done by multiple nodes at a time and the load balancing etc etc.    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 13:27:15 -0700 1 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article = Message-ID: <cf15391e.0209041227.1a39cef2@posting.google.com>   C One of the major advantages I see for VMS Clusters over the present A state of most Unix solutions is in transparency.  The VMS Cluster F environment provides the illusion to the application (and to the user). that the environment is identical on any node.  E I can take (and I have often seen this happen) an application written F with no knowledge of clusters, put it onto a VMS Cluster platform, andA I can immediately reap the benefits of the VMS Cluster platform's @ higher availability and scalability without having to modify theC application code and without having to write failover scripts to be D invoked on a failure.  I can run it on multiple nodes in the clusterE at once, not just one node at a time, because the file system and RMS ? do the right thing.  Put the same application, unmodified, on a C disaster-tolerant VMS Cluster platform, and it can indeed survive a 	 disaster. . ----------------------------------------------. Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 16:12:16 -0600 - From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article 3 Message-ID: <N7UcbyKtynNs@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <al5h1h$1jb$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> writes: >  > C > However the big 4 applications server products, BEA, iPlanet (now A > known as SunONE, WebSphere and Oracle don't make any use of VMS ? > clustering to provide their resource sharing or availability.   :    So the apps that you care about are built to run on top@    of less capable systems.  Naturally they can't take advantage$    of what isn't there.  Moot point.  ; > Neither does SAP, Oracle apps, PeopleSoft, Seibel, all of 9 > which have their own apps servers none of which use any 9 > form of OpenVMS clustering. Well to be fair they mostly  > don't run on OpenVMS.       Same.   > 2 > I am sure it does, the fact that very few people1 > actually use it for this purpose is because the . > additional features which as you say are not2 > necessary are provided in a platfrom that cannot. > compete price wise against low end 1-2U UNIX- > or Linux appliances. Sub 1000 dollars for a , > 1U server is not a price point that anyone& > expects OpenVMS to be able to match.  9    I don't know about sub $1K, but I do expect to see the 6    price come down.  1-2U certainly doesn't guarrantee(    a low price, it's just a form factor.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 18:47:17 +0100 U From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com>  Subject: Re: "inview" Article 0 Message-ID: <al5h1h$1jb$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   jlsue wrote:  G > On Tue, 03 Sep 2002 18:38:20 +0100, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy 6 > <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> wrote: >  >  > 4 >>It all depends what you want to do with a cluster. >>1 >>If you want to provide a resiliant scalable web 3 >>server infrastructure then neither NSK or OpenVMS 2 >>are the "Gold Standard" for this kind of service4 >>because the facilites they offer are not required. >> > G > I completely agree, clustering web servers (assuming static pages, or D > minimal updating) is way overkill.  Blade servers with imaged boot@ > disks is the more economical way to go, and the network can be4 > configured to load-balance requests among servers. >     - A big proportion of web pages are now dynamic , anyway, the pages being created on some sort- of apps tier that may be on the other side of / a firewall from the web servers. The web server * needs a modicum of disk, some sort of easy* cloning system, CPU, possibly a crypto and. 2 network interfaces all its doing is encoding+ whatever protocol the apps server tier uses - into HTTP/HTTPS and managing the connections.      >  >>Ditto an apps server cluster.  >> > D > This is not *necessarily* true.  There are many, many applicationsF > that work great in a cluster.  The big payback is that you can share> > resources easily (at least you can with a VMScluster).  MostG > applications do not utilize resources, or even locking activity, that = > heavily to be much of a problem.  Clustering them gives you G > scalability, flexibility, and availability.  You can load-balance all ? > workload activity among cluster members, and still have fault 4 > resilience in the event of failures (or upgrades). >     A However the big 4 applications server products, BEA, iPlanet (now ? known as SunONE, WebSphere and Oracle don't make any use of VMS = clustering to provide their resource sharing or availability.   D I would hazard a guess that none of the other available apps servers
 do either.  9 Neither does SAP, Oracle apps, PeopleSoft, Seibel, all of 7 which have their own apps servers none of which use any 7 form of OpenVMS clustering. Well to be fair they mostly  don't run on OpenVMS.     F > This has been true for well over 95% of the applications - both COTS2 > as well as home-grown - that I have worked with. >  > 3 >>If you want a shared nothing compute cluster then 8 >>you will also find that there are different contenders3 >>for the "Gold Standard" none of which require NSK 2 >>or OpenVMS. If you want to verify this then look1 >>no further than the top500 list where there are 0 >>laods of shared nothing clusters none of which$ >>are running either NSK or OpenVMS. >> >  > I agree, partially.    > E > First off, imho, NSK solves a different problem than clusters, so I < > don't really consider that when I'm discussing clustering. >     ; I tend to agree, OpenVMS and UNIX clusters are technologies : that you can use to deliver highly available but not fully8 FT services (at least not without software engineering).  1 NSK, Stratus, FT-SPARC etc provide a FT platform.     B > My 3 overriding reasons for clustering are in my response above.G > Depending on what you mean by "compute clusters", they may be able toAF > provide near linear scalability.  E.g., in my scientific environmentH > experiences the apps mostly performed calculations, with minimal-to-no> > locking activity.  Now, they don't share too much, true, but= > clustering (with shared-everything approach) can reduce theX8 > administration overhead of utilizing multiple servers:F > Install/configure/maintain  the software *once* for all servers, and< > load-balance the workloads for all apps among the servers.    8 I think we are in agreement. Though some of the LSF/Grid7 type environments are now taking a lot of the managmentn$ headaches out of compute clustering.     > 4 >>The problem is that clusters cover everything from2 >>Compute, to Web to Apps to file and DBMS. No one3 >>cluster technology is the "Gold Standard" because 2 >>one one technology is suitable for all the tasks >>that you may need to run.e >> > G > True, to an extent.  Now, obviously, my favorite is VMSclusters.  And F > I can use them for practically any environment you can come up with.F > I just don't think web farms is the most ideal use for them.... withA > one exception:  If you want a web farm that's is very simple to F > maintain multiple servers, with a high level of security, and a highE > level of reliability, then I can see putting in a VMScluster.  It's # > not necessary, but it works well.2 >     0 I am sure it does, the fact that very few people/ actually use it for this purpose is because thee, additional features which as you say are not0 necessary are provided in a platfrom that cannot, compete price wise against low end 1-2U UNIX+ or Linux appliances. Sub 1000 dollars for am* 1U server is not a price point that anyone$ expects OpenVMS to be able to match.     RegardsP   Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:42:51 -06002$ From: Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> Subject: Re: "inview" Article ) Message-ID: <3D76704B.EC8C92D1@cha.ab.ca>r  S During my long experience with VMS, I have always used separate system disks in ouriP cluster.  During this period, the number of nodes in the cluster has been fairlyO constant at 4 or 5.  Initially, I avoided the common system disk because of thenQ hassle required for VMS upgrades.  I find that imaging the system disks daily and O using batch procedures to keep the SYS$MANAGER files synchronized has been more Q than adequate.  I do however keep some of the system files (SYSUAF, NET$PROXY...) 4 on a shadow drive accessible to all cluster members.     jlsue wrote:  . > On Wed, 04 Sep 2002 00:31:01 -0400, JF Mezei' > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:d >  > >"Main, Kerry" wrote:C > >> - common system diske > >iO > >For smaller clusters, wouldn't having separate systems disks be the preferedpQ > >solution since it provides each node with greater independance in case anotherSQ > >node fails, and especially allows a node to be taken off-line and upgraded andd > >then brought back in ?m > >eQ > >(I realise that volume shadowing of system disk can somwhat make single systemrC > >image AND still provide each node with the needed independance).l > D > Not in my experience.  Single system disk is a completely separate; > issue to node independence (at least 99.99% of the time).l > C > And with a single system disk, I can still make a copy to performh > upgrades on separately.    -- Lee   ; Lee Y T Mah                        Capital Health Authority ? Email: lytmah@cha.ab.ca            Information Systems, RAH CSC 4 Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NW? Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 16:05:33 -0600e- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)v Subject: Re: "inview" Article 3 Message-ID: <tNZbpBd3ToAM@eisner.encompasserve.org>e   In article <al5b4m$t3g$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> writes: > ? > I wasn't talking about SAP. You don't have iPlanet/SunOne Web 
 > server.   G    Why in the wold would I want a web server with Suns name in it, whenA    there are better?  4 > Some apps servers require this, you don't have any< > crypto plugin support or any HSM support so you are out of? > the picture in any B2B infrastructures you don't have support); > for a number of the popular load balancing products. This-= > is just what you need for web serving. Where is FireWall-1,F: > Tripwire. What caching proxy server capabilities can you5 > provide, does OpenVMS support any kind of directory>9 > caching. What about Portal support, BEA Portal Server ?'  B    Nope.  Don't need them, so I don't care aboutt not having them.A    Many of these "apps" make up for poor underlying strucure, andeA    none of them are needed for the typicalyy web servers we have.a    v3 > I just did, when did you last look at what a realn' > ebusiness infrastructure looks like ?t  ;    Somehow I think you define that as "start with a Sun..."i   > 4 > Really, there have been loads of requests for this > in the past from customers t  :    One or two requests in this forum is NOT the same thing%    as a significant customer request.d   > (its called affordable7 > OpenVMS in case you are having difficulty rememberingd > the threads).   ?    It might be in that thread, but it's very different from theeA    affordable VMS issue.  You still have to pay for good softwareo'    no matter which box it's sitting on.h                > 7 > So what about LSF, Grids message passing toolkits andt > hardware etc for OpenVMS ??h  D    Well, I already answer part of that and I already stated the rest    we can't use.  8 > And do the ones that are available make any active use$ > of OpenVMS's cluster capabilites ?  =    Sure 'nough.  For just a simple example, check out the OSU @    web server.  And for a great many of the capabilities the app>    does not have to be aware of or in any way modified to make&    use of what the OS is doing for it.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:43:01 -0400e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>a Subject: Re: "inview" Article0, Message-ID: <3D767E57.C14BF7C4@videotron.ca>   Keith Parris wrote:aG > I can take (and I have often seen this happen) an application writtenwH > with no knowledge of clusters, put it onto a VMS Cluster platform, andC > I can immediately reap the benefits of the VMS Cluster platform's   L That assumes that the application was written to allow multiple instances of9 itself to co-exist. (for instance, file IO, logging etc).    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:13:53 GMTe* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> Subject: Re: "inview" ArticleyC Message-ID: <QZzd9.433472$2p2.17516386@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>a  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D767E57.C14BF7C4@videotron.ca... > Keith Parris wrote:-I > > I can take (and I have often seen this happen) an application written J > > with no knowledge of clusters, put it onto a VMS Cluster platform, andE > > I can immediately reap the benefits of the VMS Cluster platform's. >>K > That assumes that the application was written to allow multiple instancesb of; > itself to co-exist. (for instance, file IO, logging etc).n  J And more to the point, if it *is* so written then multiple instances couldK run equally well on a Unix cluster, where the file system (though 'serving'rJ specific portions from specific places rather than being fully-distributed- as VMS's is) 'just does the right thing' too.-  G Now, I can't speak for the distributed transparency of *other* forms ofHI inter-process communication in both cases, but my impression is that UnixtG applications often just use (some might say misuse, but if it works fore) them...) the file system for general IPC.r   - bill   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 14:38:23 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>  Subject: Re: am/pm$ Message-ID: <3d765380$1@news.si.com>  E >Well, I'm 100% sure that there have *never* been produced any analog9F >(the normal round type) clock/watch that have a 24h dial, even though/ >there are many countries that don't use am/pm.   K Then you are 100% wrong.  I have seen them.  There are two types.  One, thenL more common, has 1-12 in large numerals and 13-00 in small numerals radiallyG inward.  The other (and, as I say, I have seen one, has 01 to 12 on thetL right half f the dial (with 12 in the bottom-most position) and 13-00 on theJ left side (with 00 at the top).  The hour hand moves once around the clock in 24 hours.  F >Some wrist watches have both 1-12 and 13-24 printed on the dial, and,D >if not, you probably don't need a calculator to do the "conversion" >anyway.  I You contradict yourself.  Above you say you're "100% sure" that none have0A ever been produced and here you way that they have.  Which is it?" --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comwA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.coms= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventn< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 14:43:02 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>r Subject: Re: am/pm$ Message-ID: <3d765497$1@news.si.com>  # >Same thing when I run for the bus.o  H It is an unusual bus system if 45 seconds either way makes a difference., What if the bus driver's watch is incorrect? --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comaA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.como= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevente< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 13:43:33 -0400t- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>t Subject: Re: am/pm, Message-ID: <3D764644.786ACBB5@videotron.ca>   "Jan C. Vorbrggen" wrote:K > A bus running to its time table with errors smaller than 45 seconds? Whatc > planet are you living on?R  % The bus line I use is rather on time.1  M When I leave home, I dial into the number associated with the bus stop and itoL tells me the time for the next 3 buses and they are fairly accurate. I don'tL really notice if the bus is a bit late, but I definitely notice when it is aM minute early and I am not yet at the bus stop and I see it get on the highway(J without me on it :-) And invariably, if "my" bus was one minute early, theF next bus will be one minute late, extending the time I have to wait...  L On the way home, that bus starts its journey at a metro station in the city, so it is very rarely late.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 21:47:11 +0200b9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>n Subject: Re: am/pm' Message-ID: <3D76633F.B8A60A30@aaa.com>h  @ Well, in the first case I ment a clock/watch with a dial divided@ into 24 "parts" and teh hands doing one turn in 24h, I was wrong there, yes.   D In the second case I ment a clock/watch divided into 12 "parts", but double marked with 1-12 and 13-24.e  H I didn't contradict myself, but I was wrong in the first case, and I was a bit unclear in both cases.  A And in Sweden you can buy a wall clock with the 1-12 marks markedU? counter-clockwise (and the hands also going counter-clockwise).n! They call it a "Norwegian clock".s Just for fun...n   Jan-Erik Sderholm.s   Brian Tillman wrote: >  > K > You contradict yourself.  Above you say you're "100% sure" that none have C > ever been produced and here you way that they have.  Which is it?  > --   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 19:29:04 GMTp* From: "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net>  Subject: Re: Anyone need a RX50?> Message-ID: <4atd9.128233$kp.763143@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>  H The drive:)  I hard you can just use normal disks in it, though they are. formated to like 153 or 183k, I can't remeber.    4 "Howard S Shubs" <howard@shubs.net> wrote in message6 news:howard-3823F1.23583803092002@enews.newsguy.com...? In article <0sNc9.109030$_91.141305@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>,e,  "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net> wrote:  F > Found one in our tape isle.  Sell it for 10, and I think 10 shippingD > anywhere in the states.  Ship oversease if you have a UPS or Fedex Account.   You mean a disk, or a drive?   --6 Today, on Pay-per-view: The World Origami Championship   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 17:26:47 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>2  Subject: RE: Anyone need a RX50?9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIENCFKAA.tom@kednos.com>-  > Well, If you send it to me, I could make Ultrix available withB PL/I to those of you who still have Mips boxes, unless, of course,! theowners of Ultrix would object.i   >-----Original Message-----@0 >From: WarlockD [mailto:warlockd@drakesmith.net]- >Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2002 12:29 PMU >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com! >Subject: Re: Anyone need a RX50?m >r >:I >The drive:)  I hard you can just use normal disks in it, though they aref/ >formated to like 153 or 183k, I can't remeber.> >v >i5 >"Howard S Shubs" <howard@shubs.net> wrote in messageG7 >news:howard-3823F1.23583803092002@enews.newsguy.com...i@ >In article <0sNc9.109030$_91.141305@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>,- > "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net> wrote:o > G >> Found one in our tape isle.  Sell it for 10, and I think 10 shippingiE >> anywhere in the states.  Ship oversease if you have a UPS or Fedexr	 >Account.b >n >You mean a disk, or a drive?  >  >-- 7 >Today, on Pay-per-view: The World Origami Championshipe >e >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.o; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).b@ >Version: 6.0.381 / Virus Database: 214 - Release Date: 8/2/2002 >  ---p& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.381 / Virus Database: 214 - Release Date: 8/2/2002    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 16:15:13 -05004 From: "Lucas, Edward A (SAIC)" <Edward.Lucas@bp.com> Subject: Calculating GBe? Message-ID: <EF1DC894691AD5118AF000508BB85FDE034CC80C@AMCLVX11>y  	 Question:   L I wrote a simple little command procedure that will produce disk statistics.  J At the bottom of my procedure, I am calculating storage in GB. Hmmmmm, but# my total should be greater than 1. aE But the calculation is only showing 1, what the heck am I doing wronge  + I take the (total storage * 512)/1000000000h  B This is simple and I am going bonkers. daaaaaaa WHAT am I missing.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:56:11 -0700a+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com>  Subject: Re: Calculating GBg' Message-ID: <3D76817B.5090300@MMaz.com>e   Lucas, Edward A (SAIC) wrote:l  
 >Question: >oM >I wrote a simple little command procedure that will produce disk statistics.a >tK >At the bottom of my procedure, I am calculating storage in GB. Hmmmmm, butl$ >my total should be greater than 1. F >But the calculation is only showing 1, what the heck am I doing wrong >-, >I take the (total storage * 512)/1000000000 >  o >dC You didn't state where you were doing the calcuations but a couple   points to consider.t  2 1. Divide before you multiply to avoid overflowingE 2. Your definition of a GB is the marketing version and not the true  
 Power 2 value H 3. I presumed you are discussing this in the context of VMS, because of < the COV post, but other OS's use different blocking sizes...   Barry    -- g  @ Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   A E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028c   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 19:25 CDT' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)e Subject: Re: Calculating GBb, Message-ID: <4SEP200219255797@gerg.tamu.edu>  8 "Lucas, Edward A (SAIC)" <Edward.Lucas@bp.com> writes...
 }Question: } M }I wrote a simple little command procedure that will produce disk statistics.e } K }At the bottom of my procedure, I am calculating storage in GB. Hmmmmm, bute$ }my total should be greater than 1. F }But the calculation is only showing 1, what the heck am I doing wrong } , }I take the (total storage * 512)/1000000000 } C }This is simple and I am going bonkers. daaaaaaa WHAT am I missing.g  , Consider the phrase "32 bit signed integer".   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:26:51 -0500 4 From: Arlen Williams <arlen.williams@remove.eds.com> Subject: Re: Calculating GB - Message-ID: <3D7688AB.9040304@remove.eds.com>    Lucas, Edward A (SAIC) wrote:r > Question:a > N > I wrote a simple little command procedure that will produce disk statistics. > L > At the bottom of my procedure, I am calculating storage in GB. Hmmmmm, but% > my total should be greater than 1. GG > But the calculation is only showing 1, what the heck am I doing wrongs > - > I take the (total storage * 512)/1000000000a > D > This is simple and I am going bonkers. daaaaaaa WHAT am I missing. >  >   3 How big a number are you trying to fit into 32bits?    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:33:34 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>i Subject: Re: Calculating GB ' Message-ID: <3D76D5E1.CA778E18@fsi.net>n   "Lucas, Edward A (SAIC)" wrote:h >  > Question:i > N > I wrote a simple little command procedure that will produce disk statistics. > L > At the bottom of my procedure, I am calculating storage in GB. Hmmmmm, but$ > my total should be greater than 1.G > But the calculation is only showing 1, what the heck am I doing wrong  > - > I take the (total storage * 512)/1000000000i > D > This is simple and I am going bonkers. daaaaaaa WHAT am I missing.  ( MBF (Megabytes, formatted) = 2048 blocks/ GBF (Gigabytes, formatted) = 2048 * 1024 blocks-   DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym gbf 6   GBF == 2097152   Hex = 00200000  Octal = 00010000000  = A signed longword can only represent 2GB-1B or %X7fffffff or 1! DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say %X7fffffffr
 2147483647  E ...or one byte short of two Gigs. For your own sanity, you'll want toi; express storage in some larger unit (blocks, MB, GB, etc.).   D Remember that machines deal in powers of two, regardless of what the disk salesmen tell you.    --   David J. Dachterah dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 19:04:54 GMTF2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)G Subject: Re: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.34* Message-ID: <al5lgm$h94$2@web1.cup.hp.com>  Q In article <3D6DB653.48AB3722@telocity.com>, Koloth <koloth@telocity.com> writes:a > or earlier?  Why the limit?s  G   Please acquire and read DECmigrate documentation for specific detailsnG   and for the current release and the product support status.   Thanks!aH   The DECmigrate materials and information is available via a URL listedC   in the OpenVMS FAQ; in the OpenVMS Frequently Avoided Quotations.c    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:18:22 GMTl1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> G Subject: Re: Can one still vest Vax executables onto Alpha OpenVMS V7.30' Message-ID: <3D76C443.87D37E6B@fsi.net>9   Hoff Hoffman wrote:  > S > In article <3D6DB653.48AB3722@telocity.com>, Koloth <koloth@telocity.com> writes:  > > or earlier?  Why the limit?e > I >   Please acquire and read DECmigrate documentation for specific detailsaI >   and for the current release and the product support status.   Thanks!rJ >   The DECmigrate materials and information is available via a URL listedE >   in the OpenVMS FAQ; in the OpenVMS Frequently Avoided Quotations.    Quotations from Chairman Hoff?   -- w David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systems, http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 00:33:30 -0400a) From: FalconFan <falconfan@falconfan.com>  Subject: Compression Utility?n8 Message-ID: <dandnucgt9k7cdc9njjhlnk131a9v2edik@4ax.com>  ? I'm in need of a VMS compression utility.  I need to be able toaC compress a large binary file then ftp it from one server to anothertC server then uncompress.  I don't have a lot of experience in VMS in D this area.  Anyone care to recommend a good compression utility (and( where to find it) for a beginner to use?   Thanks for any info :)	 FalconFan    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 11:50:22 -0700d$ From: issinoho@slayme.com (issinoho). Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK= Message-ID: <d0141774.0209041050.18c47bb4@posting.google.com>    All,  B I'm out of the office until Monday so it shan't be until then, andC I'll need to restrict access to UK nocturnal hours so I don't upseti. anyone by hogging the bandwith during the day.  . I'll email you all privately with the details.  d "TFranco" <TFranco@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:<al52tg$al1$1@server-b.cs.interbusiness.it>... > Hi,  > E > same problem, subscribed the Vax Hobbyst program but no hobbyst CD. N > Could you kindly provide me with your ftp address so I can download an image > of your CD ? > Thanks in advance L > P.S. my email address is franco(dot)tassone(at)inwind(dot)it --- obviously > substitute (dot) and (at)w   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 11:30:26 -0600u- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)S. Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK3 Message-ID: <G4OnVVoUZSFb@eisner.encompasserve.org>h  d In article <d0141774.0209040802.5d1f6a93@posting.google.com>, issinoho@slayme.com (issinoho) writes:G > Wrong, I'm afraid. It's perfectly possible to have an ISO image of an G > ODS disk. I used WinImage to grab an ISO copy of my VAX CD, which can D > then be transferred and burned back to CD, and is perfectly usable > (and bootable) from a VAX.  & In what sense is that an "ISO" image ?  / Does it have a Volume Descriptor at Sector 16 ?g  % I think you really have an ODS image.p   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 16:41:28 -0700r$ From: tshoppa@wmata.com (Tim Shoppa). Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK= Message-ID: <8327b166.0209041541.4708febc@posting.google.com>)  _ "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D756282.1CEC619@fsi.net>...l   > issinoho wrote:    > >   	 > > Guys,    > >   D > > OK. Will email you privately with FTP details in next day or so.   > >   C > > It will be an ISO image so burn it to CD-R with any half-decentB   > > package (I use  I > > Click 'n Burn Pro, but a simpler package like FireBurner will do just   
 > > as well).e  3 > > The CD will then be bootable from VAX chevrons.S   >   : > If it's an ISO image, it will not be bootable or usable.   >    > It needs to be ODS image.t    D You are technically correct, David.  But in common usage "ISO image"B tends to mean "block-by-block image of a CD-ROM" as few users know what ISO-9660 is!,  K And to be even more pedantic, ISO-9660 is known in the source code listingsx as "ODS-3" in a few places :-)   Tim.   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 19:32:52 -0600f- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)i. Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK3 Message-ID: <xxiEBIvKyMwf@eisner.encompasserve.org>r  d In article <8327b166.0209041541.4708febc@posting.google.com>, tshoppa@wmata.com (Tim Shoppa) writes:a > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D756282.1CEC619@fsi.net>...-   >> It needs to be ODS image. >  > F > You are technically correct, David.  But in common usage "ISO image"D > tends to mean "block-by-block image of a CD-ROM" as few users know > what ISO-9660 is!   H Please, follow the conventions of comp.os.vms by using the proper terms.I Some users call any sort of video display a "computer".  If you encountereA users who are sloppy in their terminology, do not encourage them.h  E It seems to me that "disc image" works quite well for what was reallyr (apparently) intended.  M > And to be even more pedantic, ISO-9660 is known in the source code listings2  > as "ODS-3" in a few places :-)  H I would be interested in a citation of such locations, since I have read4 the F11CD listings and do not recall any such usage.   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 21:50:06 -0600o- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)e. Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK3 Message-ID: <Svu7ZBVnYnFh@eisner.encompasserve.org>0  _ In article <3D76875E.4AADFB5E@trailing-edge.com>, Tim Shoppa <shoppa@trailing-edge.com> writes:r > Larry Kilgallen wrote: >> ng >> In article <8327b166.0209041541.4708febc@posting.google.com>, tshoppa@wmata.com (Tim Shoppa) writes:0  P >> > And to be even more pedantic, ISO-9660 is known in the source code listings# >> > as "ODS-3" in a few places :-)  >>  K >> I would be interested in a citation of such locations, since I have read-7 >> the F11CD listings and do not recall any such usage.i > D > I just checked and it's not mentioned in the 7.2 listings.  Let me# > poke around earlier listing CD's.  > B > I think the ISO-9660 == ODS-3 connection is mentioned in the VMS > FAQ as well, section MGMT3.f   You are correct:  3    "On OpenVMS, the ISO-9660 format is (internally) 8     considered to be the ODS-3 file structure, while the9     High Sierra extensions to the standard are consideredo2     to be the ODS-4 file structure. The Rock Ridge7     extensions are not currently available on OpenVMS."a   Just before the section citing:o  - 	http://pdp-11.trailing-edge.com/www/ods1.txt-   :-)-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 22:21:18 -0400f+ From: Tim Shoppa <shoppa@trailing-edge.com>/. Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK1 Message-ID: <3D76875E.4AADFB5E@trailing-edge.com>i   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > f > In article <8327b166.0209041541.4708febc@posting.google.com>, tshoppa@wmata.com (Tim Shoppa) writes:c > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D756282.1CEC619@fsi.net>...h >  > >> It needs to be ODS image. > >t > >dH > > You are technically correct, David.  But in common usage "ISO image"F > > tends to mean "block-by-block image of a CD-ROM" as few users know > > what ISO-9660 is!u > J > Please, follow the conventions of comp.os.vms by using the proper terms.  ? I try to.  I apologize to you, Larry, for explaining how otherst% in this thread have misused the term.y  O > > And to be even more pedantic, ISO-9660 is known in the source code listings-" > > as "ODS-3" in a few places :-) > J > I would be interested in a citation of such locations, since I have read6 > the F11CD listings and do not recall any such usage.  B I just checked and it's not mentioned in the 7.2 listings.  Let me! poke around earlier listing CD's.n  @ I think the ISO-9660 == ODS-3 connection is mentioned in the VMS FAQ as well, section MGMT3.n   Tim.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:09:10 GMTy1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> . Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK' Message-ID: <3D76D029.EDBD2B0E@fsi.net>s   Tim Shoppa wrote:c > a > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D756282.1CEC619@fsi.net>.... >  > > issinoho wrote:s >  > > >i >  > > > Guys,  >  > > >o > F > > > OK. Will email you privately with FTP details in next day or so. >  > > >c > E > > > It will be an ISO image so burn it to CD-R with any half-decent- >  > > > package (I use > K > > > Click 'n Burn Pro, but a simpler package like FireBurner will do just: >  > > > as well).5 > 5 > > > The CD will then be bootable from VAX chevrons.t > > < > > If it's an ISO image, it will not be bootable or usable. > >  > > It needs to be ODS image.o > F > You are technically correct, David.  But in common usage "ISO image"D > tends to mean "block-by-block image of a CD-ROM" as few users know > what ISO-9660 is!1  A ...and one distinguishes an "ISO image" from an "ODS image", how?h  , ...and an "ISO image" from a "Joliet image"?  M > And to be even more pedantic, ISO-9660 is known in the source code listings   > as "ODS-3" in a few places :-)  H ...which makes it even more amazing that ODS-3 is not supported natively! by the file primitives or by RMS.-   -- - David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems7 http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/E   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:05:33 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>f. Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK' Message-ID: <3D76CF52.58ED9DC2@fsi.net>    issinoho wrote:a > G > Wrong, I'm afraid. It's perfectly possible to have an ISO image of an = > ODS disk. I used WinImage to grab an ISO copy of my VAX CD,e  H Then you do not understand what an "ISO image" is. An "ISO image" is a aH disk image in ISO-9660 format (as opposed to Joliet, High sierra, ODS-2, ODS-5, etc.)  H Simply making an image of a physical disk does not "magically" transformD the format of its contents. If you make an image of an ISO-9660 diskG (i.e., CD-ROM), the image is still ISO-9660. If take an image of an ODStA volume, the image is still ODS. Likewise, with EXTFS, ADVfs, etc.    > which cansD > then be transferred and burned back to CD, and is perfectly usable > (and bootable) from a VAX.  F If the bootstrap, secondary loader, tertiary loader, etc. can read theA disk, rest assured it is at least ODS-2 and *NOT* an "ISO image".i  H > Incidentally, the image is also usable directly within Simh so you can1 > confirm its validity without even having a VAX.e   This was understood...  F Please take the time to read up on the various disk formats. You'll be  much better off in the long run.   -- V David J. Dachtera- dba DJE Systems2 http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/d   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:11:31 GMTE1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> . Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK' Message-ID: <3D76D0B8.1455C781@fsi.net>c   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > f > In article <8327b166.0209041541.4708febc@posting.google.com>, tshoppa@wmata.com (Tim Shoppa) writes:c > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D756282.1CEC619@fsi.net>...0 >  > >> It needs to be ODS image. > >r > >aH > > You are technically correct, David.  But in common usage "ISO image"F > > tends to mean "block-by-block image of a CD-ROM" as few users know > > what ISO-9660 is!i > J > Please, follow the conventions of comp.os.vms by using the proper terms.K > Some users call any sort of video display a "computer".  If you encounteroC > users who are sloppy in their terminology, do not encourage them.u > G > It seems to me that "disc image" works quite well for what was reallyt > (apparently) intended. > O > > And to be even more pedantic, ISO-9660 is known in the source code listings0" > > as "ODS-3" in a few places :-) > J > I would be interested in a citation of such locations, since I have read6 > the F11CD listings and do not recall any such usage.  H Might SEARCH be of some assistance? I don't have the source listings CDsF or I'd look into that myself. I know there have been posts in the pastH either detailing it or citing URLs referencing the various relationshipsF between disk formats and their ODS level. I think I recall ODS-4 being4 something that we recognize by another name, also...   -- 4 David J. Dachtera- dba DJE Systems- http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/a   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 11:13:35 -0700a' From: austinms@att.net (Michael Austin). Subject: CSV2JPEG /BMP/???= Message-ID: <a3a4dd30.0209041013.77f54547@posting.google.com>s  @ Does anyone have a simple csv2???? plotter that can take CSV andD create a web-viewable graph of that data (single or multiple items),F and given the fact that Unisys is now wanting royalties to use GIF, so$ a jpeg converter would be just fine.   sample data:B [MON]Sample Time, [MON_SYST]Direct I/O Rate,[MON_SYST]Buffered I/O Rate,...!  3-SEP-2002 15:15:00.18,0,0,0,... !  3-SEP-2002 15:18:00.27,0,0,0,...-  @ This generated from an app that gets info from Monitor System...  ? There is a PC-based viewer for this, but I would like to have ag2 Apache/CGI that would accomplish the same thing...   Michael Austin First DBA Source, Inc.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 19:10:55 GMTt From: lbohan@dbc..spamless..comr Subject: Re: CSV2JPEG /BMP/???8 Message-ID: <j2mcnuopncb9eb2vkcqq508bklgnhuleri@4ax.com>  F On 4 Sep 2002 11:13:35 -0700, austinms@att.net (Michael Austin) wrote:  A >Does anyone have a simple csv2???? plotter that can take CSV and E >create a web-viewable graph of that data (single or multiple items),oG >and given the fact that Unisys is now wanting royalties to use GIF, so-% >a jpeg converter would be just fine.: >3
 >sample data:DC >[MON]Sample Time, [MON_SYST]Direct I/O Rate,[MON_SYST]Buffered I/OG	 >Rate,...-" > 3-SEP-2002 15:15:00.18,0,0,0,..." > 3-SEP-2002 15:18:00.27,0,0,0,... > A >This generated from an app that gets info from Monitor System...l >r@ >There is a PC-based viewer for this, but I would like to have a3 >Apache/CGI that would accomplish the same thing...o >  >Michael Austin. >First DBA Source, Inc.s  1 You might look into the perl  GD::Graph modules.    ? Getting all the required pieces in order, is a bit of a chore, e
 but doable.     = I haven't found a way (w/ OSU http server) to do this without); creating tmp files along the way.   Most examples I've seenk6 appear to pipe a jpg stream to the cgi output stream.   < Below is a hacked up version of one the GD::Graphs examples;  ? to do something similar, using a CSV file for input, shouldn't f (in theory) be too hard.     use GD::Graph::lines3d;  use VMS::Stdio qw( &vmsopen );< use constant TITLE => "Average Commute Time: 3D Line Chart";   / my $graph = new GD::Graph::lines3d( 400, 300 ); 
 my @data  = (h&     [ qw( Mon  Tue  Wed  Thu  Fri ) ],&     [      33,  24,  23,  19,  21   ],&     [      17,  15,  19,  15,  24   ], );    $graph->set(     title           => TITLE,/     x_label         => "Day",-!     y_label         => "Minutes",5     long_ticks      => 1,a     y_max_value     => 40,     y_min_value     => 0,i     y_tick_number   => 8,o     y_label_skip    => 2,g     bar_spacing     => 4,p     accent_treshold => 400,6 );  3+ $graph->set_legend( "Morning", "Evening" );m $graph->plot( \@data );    $fh = vmsopen(  !         ">DISK1:[TMP]TEST.JPG;0" e         ,"ctx=bin"         ,"rfm=fix"           ,"mrs=512" e          ,"rat=none" ) || die $!;  ' $bytes_in = length( $graph->gd->jpeg );d $cnt = $bytes_in / 512;  for( $j=0; $j < $cnt; $j++ ) {@         $bytes_out = syswrite( $fh, $graph->gd->jpeg, 512, ($j * 512));?         printf "%d, In/Out %d/%d\n", $j, $bytes_in, $bytes_out;  }   
 close( $fh );    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 19:39:15 GMT-2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)P Subject: Re: Current ways to restrict FTP access to user's login directory tree?* Message-ID: <al5nh3$h94$4@web1.cup.hp.com>  f In article <cc5619f2.0208290710.43e1ea58@posting.google.com>, jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan) writes:* :OpenVMS Alpha V7.3 with TCPIP V5.1 eco 4. ...OB :We've got a fair number of users on this system who are moving to= :using FTP ... to move files between VMS and their peecees...K :tG :The Q's TCPIP apparently doesn't have a way to restrict the CD command D :so that the user is confined to their login directory tree, meaningE :they can attempt to move anywhere in the filesystem (and in fact twohB :users have to do just that to move files to special import/export :directories).  6 :The remaining users need access to their home tree soF :the anonymous aliases wouldn't work (there are too many users for theD :10 alias limit anyway).  The TCPIP V5.3 docs seem to be the same asA :the V5.1 in this area, and the release notes don't show anything-" :useful so no joy with an upgrade.  D   Please approach this from the perspective of OpenVMS security, and>   not from the perspective of implementing security within theB   application.  If you don't want the users to access a directory,@   don't look to TCP/IP to enforce this, configure this using theC   OpenVMS usernames (possibly a parallel set of usernames, with oneoC   set enabled for network and the other not), resource identifiers,o:   OpenVMS file protections, and (if needed) ACLs and ACEs.  E   Restricting the FTP CD mechanism is akin to a solution used on some-F   other platforms, and not one I would recommend -- security should beF   left to the base operating system when possible, and not implementedI   within an application.  Security is far from trivial, and applications oD   that attempt to implement or to enforce security almost invariably@   get it wrong -- and potentially with disasterous consequences.  F   Of course the other approach uses controlled upload and download andE   servers (working within the existing OpenVMS security), via (say) atE   set of webpage forms or URLs which invoke CGI scripts or via DECnetuF   task-to-task servers.  (I've provided DCL CGI and DECnet server taskG   examples in the DCL book, and there are examples available at the AskD<   The Wizard website and in various postings and documents.)  B   One of my "favorite" ACE-based approaches is a combination of a C   user-created standard OpenVMS identifier (or resource identifier)uB   and either the pre-defined local or the pre-defined network task?   identifier -- an ACE set up to either accept or to reject anyc$   accessor(s) with both identifiers.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 23:20:48 GMTe2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)1 Subject: Re: DECC RTL Migration - Advice Required-+ Message-ID: <al64gg$h94$10@web1.cup.hp.com>   g In article <3D7618BB.6435E137@SPAMhp.com>, Charlie McCutcheon <charlie.mccutcheonNO@SPAMhp.com> writes:.  : :I think, the customer needs to link against vaxc2decc.exeA :interoperability tool. The only purpose in life of vaxc2decc.exesA :is to allow linking objects which were previously linked against F :vax c rtl (vaxcrtl.exe image) to link against dec c rtl (decc$shr.exe@ :image). The vaxc2decc tool is described in section 1.2.2 of the :Migration Guide.k  G   Correct.  That said and as the C code for this application is clearlywH   available :-), I would encourage you to move to a more recent compilerH   than the decade-old VAX C compiler.  The current C compiler provides aI   reasonable VAX C emulation with CC/STANDARD=VAXC, and (with the /PREFIXcF   stuff discussed in the OpenVMS FAQ) can simplify maintenance and the>   "porting" of this C code to more a modern C dialect: ANSI C.  F   The underlying behaviour here involves the lack of facility prefixesE   on the VAXCRTL entry points -- hence this RTL could not be added to-E   the default LINK path; this RTL could not be inserted into the mainrC   IMAGELIB.OLB library -- and the use of these entry point prefixesgG   on the HP C library.  Put another way, the VAX C library entry points0H   are exactly what you enter in your code when you reference the libraryF   entry points, while the HP C compiler adds the decc$ facility prefixE   used on the RTL entry points; on the routines that are available in E   DECC$SHR.  With the prefix, you don't need to specify the RTL as it F   can be picked up automatically by the LINKER; it can be in IMAGELIB.A   This is the /PREFIX stuff that is discussed in the OpenVMS FAQ.   F   The VAXC2DECC RTL image effectively maps these older external symbolF   names and routines through to the names and routines used in the newG   DECC$SHR.  (If you can recompile with the current C compiler, all thew   better...)  E   Oh, and as you have the command "CC/VAXC", you already have a newer-G   C compiler installed; you have a V4.0 (itself quite ancient) or later:C   C compiler around, in addition to also having the VAX C compiler.h    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:43:05 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>4' Subject: Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format.a, Message-ID: <3D765434.703D7963@videotron.ca>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:M > Is JF somehow saying that any software that is not being actively developed- > should be provided as source?d  M No, I was saying that the file format for the DECW$CALENDAR program should beoK made available so that users could write their own utilities to make use oft their own data.   I The file format for many files on VMS has been documented (accounting forDR instance). And if you're not willing to provide a file format, the provide an API.  N Considering that ALL-IN-1 (whose file formats are not only documented, but APIJ provided for their access, as well as access to UAF and queue manager) hasK been abandonned, the DECW$CALENDAR utility as well as MAIL will become more I important to many. But the lack of file format documentation hinders moree- intelligent use of the decw$calendar utility.c  G That utility looks very nice, but lacks just a few features and thus is K relegated to a cute demo. With the addition of a few tools that users couldcL write to interface to the database, clean it up, synchronise with their PDAs0 etc, this "demo" would become enterprise ready.    Same applies to cardfiler.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 16:55:13 GMT 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>s' Subject: Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. 2 Message-ID: <RVqd9.37$4B6.409735@news.cpqcorp.net>  K I'm afraid I didn't see the original message (which no longer appears to be  on my server).  K Is JF somehow saying that any software that is not being actively developedaL should be provided as source?  I'm not quite sure how you can conclude that,H or reasonably ask for it.  There are many examples of code that has beenL stable and not "developed" for a long time.  That doesn't mean that bugs areG not fixed, just that new functionality is no longer added.  They still, ( however, are useful and provide revenue.      F Tim Llewellyn wrote in message <3D762F05.699C72EB@blueyonder.co.uk>... >s >. >JF Mezei wrote: >d >>K >> If HP is not willing to  COMMIT to further development of DECW$CALENDAR,s thenK >> the source code for this "example" utility that comes with VMS should be,# >> included in the VMS freeware CD.- >-. >I'd say DECW$EXAMPLES wold be a better place. >--M >tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uke >.I >* PLEASE NOTE tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk address is NO LONGER VALID *D   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 19:16:36 GMTh5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>7' Subject: Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format.o2 Message-ID: <o_sd9.44$xs6.229529@news.cpqcorp.net>  K I don't believe that it was ever intended to be used by other applications. F Feel free to file a request for documentation on the format.  I lookedG around briefly, and aside from the code itself, I can't find the designaJ documents (they are so old - like 1986 or so - I believe they are archived	 on tape).w    = JF Mezei wrote in message <3D765434.703D7963@videotron.ca>...i >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:aD >> Is JF somehow saying that any software that is not being actively	 developedo  >> should be provided as source? >SK >No, I was saying that the file format for the DECW$CALENDAR program shouldw beL >made available so that users could write their own utilities to make use of >their own data. >aJ >The file format for many files on VMS has been documented (accounting forK >instance). And if you're not willing to provide a file format, the provide  an API.h >kK >Considering that ALL-IN-1 (whose file formats are not only documented, butm APIsK >provided for their access, as well as access to UAF and queue manager) has.L >been abandonned, the DECW$CALENDAR utility as well as MAIL will become moreJ >important to many. But the lack of file format documentation hinders more. >intelligent use of the decw$calendar utility. >tH >That utility looks very nice, but lacks just a few features and thus isL >relegated to a cute demo. With the addition of a few tools that users couldH >write to interface to the database, clean it up, synchronise with their PDAs0 >etc, this "demo" would become enterprise ready. >w >Same applies to cardfiler.O   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 20:53:17 -0400i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>i' Subject: Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format.l, Message-ID: <3D76AAFC.7CB297F9@videotron.ca>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:H > Feel free to file a request for documentation on the format.  I lookedI > around briefly, and aside from the code itself, I can't find the designcL > documents (they are so old - like 1986 or so - I believe they are archived > on tape).     L Speaking unofficially, and with your employer's hat off, do you feel it is a4 reasonable request ? Or is it likely to be refused ?  N And if so, how does one go about filing a request for the documentation on the9 format of the file generate by the calendar application ?e   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:17:24 GMTe1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>b' Subject: Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. ' Message-ID: <3D76C409.701429BF@fsi.net>w   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > M > I don't believe that it was ever intended to be used by other applications.-H > Feel free to file a request for documentation on the format.  I lookedI > around briefly, and aside from the code itself, I can't find the designiL > documents (they are so old - like 1986 or so - I believe they are archived > on tape).<  H Dumb question time: is it something that one might divine if one had the source listings CDs to peruse?   -- d David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/h   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 21:52:30 -0600o- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ' Subject: Re: DECW$CALENDAR file format. 3 Message-ID: <ZS3xi6dGDbfH@eisner.encompasserve.org>g  [ In article <3D76C409.701429BF@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:o > Fred Kleinsorge wrote: >> iN >> I don't believe that it was ever intended to be used by other applications.I >> Feel free to file a request for documentation on the format.  I looked J >> around briefly, and aside from the code itself, I can't find the designM >> documents (they are so old - like 1986 or so - I believe they are archiveds >> on tape). > J > Dumb question time: is it something that one might divine if one had the  > source listings CDs to peruse?  A The older DECwindows XUI modules were in the source listings, but ? since the replacement DECwindows Motif is considered a separatet product, it is not included.  7 The same relationship holds for DECnet IV and DECnet V.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 22:14:24 +0200a' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.not>J8 Subject: DECwindows X11 display server: creating visuals( Message-ID: <3D7669A0.E1D2C675@spam.not>   Hi folks  E Is it possible to create visuals after the server has been started orrG define e.g. in one of the startup DCL procedures what visuals it has togD create? My DECwindows X11 display server for OpenVMS AXP V7.1-001212D reports several visuals which either use a depth of 8 or 24. OTOH it9 reports that it supports six depths: 1, 4, 8, 12, 24, 32.   F Since I didn't find a way to use one of the other depths besides 8 andG 24 I thought there should be a way to create a visual of a certain typeSB with one of the supported other depths. Or is there a way to use aG certain visual with a different depth than that of the visual? I wasn'tfG able to create a window by XCreateWindow from the Xlib which combined aiH certain visual id and a different depth than the one associated with the supplied visual.  F Since I'm not an expert in X11 programming I might lack some basics ofH understanding. I would appreciate to get some pointers to documentation.D I already have read a lot of documentation about how the X11 displayE server should work but I didn't find anything about creating visuals.n   Many Thankst   Christof   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 16:15:28 -0700 & From: cspowart@telus.net (Cam Spowart)/ Subject: Digital Alpha DEC Alphastation 500/266c< Message-ID: <85908da3.0209041515.3ba6826@posting.google.com>  > I've got a nifty alphastation for sale on ebay.  Check it out:  V http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2051145924&ssPageName=ADME:B:LC:CA:1   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 18:29:01 -0600e- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)m3 Subject: Re: Digital Alpha DEC Alphastation 500/266 3 Message-ID: <LW+mON$NTryj@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  e In article <85908da3.0209041515.3ba6826@posting.google.com>, cspowart@telus.net (Cam Spowart) writes::@ > I've got a nifty alphastation for sale on ebay.  Check it out: > X > http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2051145924&ssPageName=ADME:B:LC:CA:1  L I notice you are not offering a license transfer (for any Operating System). Not everybody is a hobbyist.   ------------------------------  * Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 01:18:11 +0000 (UTC) From: stfxnr@dwdddaae.comu2 Subject: Engana o Fisco, o Estado, os amigos  9504( Message-ID: <1031187887.277842@spynews5>  ) >>>>   http://burlasdoleo.cjb.net    <<<<t  ? ACTIVISM - HELP STOP A CRIMINAL ENTERPRISE OF DESTROYING PEOPLEeC ACTIVISMO - AJUDE A PARAR UMA EMPRESA CRIMINOSA DE DESTROIR PESSOASe  ) >>>>   http://burlasdoleo.cjb.net    <<<<, hue    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 22:30:36 GMTe2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: Escape Sequences * Message-ID: <al61ic$h94$9@web1.cup.hp.com>  U In article <QQ+IfcNsn4hY@elias.decus.ch>, p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) writes: X :In article <3D724D16.3DB23F2C@Free.fr>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> writes: :> Roy Omond wrote:  :>>  :>> Didier Morandi wrote:> :>>  :>> > within EDT:  :>> >(_ :>> > PF1 27 (numeric in main keyboard) PF1 3 (on numeric keyboard, which is "special insert").1 :>> ' :>> Even easier, just hit Escape twice.s :>   :> on a VT100 ?d :> g :d :CTRL/[$  ?   Direct embedding of escape sequences -- rather than providingt=   or generating the sequence at run-time -- has some serious     maintenance problems.  ,  &   I do not recommend direct embedding.  @   Wanna know why I don't?  Consider embedding the VT100 terminalB   reset sequence into a file, and then try to TYPE or -- depending>   on the prefered text editor -- even edit the file.  Consider8   what happens when this or other sequences are invoked.  D   I recommend it is best to use the run-time generation as describedE   in the FAQ, or (even better) determine the appropriate sequence for F   the current terminal, and load and use the correct sequence entirelyE   dynamically using the available SMG$GET_TERM_DATA call or similar. tE   (This approach also means you don't have to maintain your own tablenD   of escape sequences.  And no, you don't need to haul in all of SMG   to use this call.)    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 21:50:51 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: Escape Sequencesh* Message-ID: <al5v7r$h94$8@web1.cup.hp.com>  o In article <kh8c9.11972$vY2.204724@e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com>, "Francisco Ortega" <fortega@iblues.cc> writes:   G :      I forgat how to place escape sequences in EDIT and which are theeL :escape sequences for bold, big letter and so on. If anyone can help. Thanks  G   Please acquire and read the OpenVMS Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ),iG   and specifically the OpenVMS FAQ sections entitled "How to use escapeDF   and control characters in DCL?" and "Where can I find information onI   escape and control sequences?" and "How do I set the title on a DECtermgI   window?" -- a search of the text-format FAQ for "escape" finds these...i  G   The FAQ also has information on how to ask questions, on the sorts oftF   details and the sorts of information that can be useful to the folksH   that might answer (and thus helping you get your answer more quickly),F   and general tips on how to get answers to your questions quickly andF   also how to reduce the likelyhood of getting yourself added into theF   killfiles of various folks reading and answering newsgroup postings.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 05:31:50 GMTA( From: Carlo <carlo.pettirossi@libero.it>  Subject: Re: File open (URGENT!)) Message-ID: <3D76EC79.ADFBEBC8@libero.it>c   Carlo ha scritto:-   > Hi everyone, >-J > I'm a beginner in Fortran. I wanted to have some informations concerningD > the opening of file copied from a VMS machine onto a unix computer > (probably an Alpha).G > At the moment there is a fortran application running on unix, opens a-E > file coming from the VMS machine (say vms.dat) previously convertedoD > through a C application which doesn't do anything else but copying@ > string, integer, and byte values as they are onto another file1 > (unix.dat) as they are, but converts the float.C@ > This is a solution that I don't like that much. Aside from its@ > inefficiency (2 programs doing what only one can do), what theG > programmer did is converting only the VAXF (real*4) data. If the datalB > inside the original file will change, the modifications affect 2B > programs in 2 different languages. I don't know why the originalC > programmer chose this solution. As he is a programmer with a goodiE > knowledge of C and Fortran - well...surely better than mine :-) - I G > thought that he did like that, cause the CONVERT="...." placed in the J > OPEN command doesn't work well. I tried just today for the first time toG > use the conversion, overriding the C application. The results are not A > good. I opened the file vms.dat (copied on the unix machine) asnJ > SEQUENTIAL, STREAM, UNFORMATTED. I'm pretty sure that this is the reason > of the bad data reading. > Anyway, my questions are:fD > 1) how does the CONVERT "behave" when it has to cope with integer,< > character, byte and real values together in the same file?J > 2) can someone tell me how it works? How does it recognize the format ofJ > data just by reading a file? Is there a tag within the record indicating3 > that the data is an integer, a float or whatever? 4 > I need to find a solution asap. Thanks in advance. >  > Carlo   G Sorry for my late reply. I just wanted to thank you for your advices. IsI wasn't able to read data in a good way cause of wrong variables declaring @ (integer*4 instead of integer*2 for instance) and moreover I was9 transferring the file via ftp in ascii instead of binary.P Thanks a lot. Bye  Carloe   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 15:14:23 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>aN Subject: Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly)$ Message-ID: <3d765bf0$1@news.si.com>  F >I understand you may have strong feelings in the other direction, butG >like the man said: when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.e  I That would certainly make the outlaws easy to spot, though. <grin>  Got a  gun?  Go to jail!- --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comdA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.com = 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent-< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:49:03 GMT.1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>fN Subject: Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly)/ Message-ID: <PZwd9.299378$983.535981@rwcrnsc53>a  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message  news:3D6FBA1C.B7A16DE@fsi.net... > Malcolm Dunnett wrote: > >A0 > > In article <3D6EEF1D.4020209@tsoft-inc.com>,1 > >    David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:h > > > H > > > Things are going downhill rapidly.  Now we have an NRA argument in c.o.v. > > >tL > > > I do have to ask this question of those that think it's guns that kill and notdL > > > people.  When a drunk driver kills someone, do we blame the driver, or banf > > > automobiles? > > > C > >     Neither, we blame the person that served him the drinks :-)D >uG > The gal I lived with ten year or so years ago went to Osco for Vodka, J > then went home and got tanked up. Do we blame the counter person? ...the1 > retailer? ...the distributor? ...the distiller?   J NO, the guy who made the pocketknife or the tampons, or course. I am truly sorry to hear about your S.O.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:06:28 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>eN Subject: Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly)' Message-ID: <3D76C176.30574FD9@fsi.net>F   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:t > > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message" > news:3D6FBA1C.B7A16DE@fsi.net... > > Malcolm Dunnett wrote: > > >h2 > > > In article <3D6EEF1D.4020209@tsoft-inc.com>,3 > > >    David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:a > > > >sJ > > > > Things are going downhill rapidly.  Now we have an NRA argument in > c.o.v. > > > >oN > > > > I do have to ask this question of those that think it's guns that kill	 > and notbN > > > > people.  When a drunk driver kills someone, do we blame the driver, or > bans > > > > automobiles? > > > >lE > > >     Neither, we blame the person that served him the drinks :-)  > >iI > > The gal I lived with ten year or so years ago went to Osco for Vodka,.L > > then went home and got tanked up. Do we blame the counter person? ...the3 > > retailer? ...the distributor? ...the distiller?f > L > NO, the guy who made the pocketknife or the tampons, or course. I am truly > sorry to hear about your S.O.X  G Not so bad, really. I wound up marrying my teen-age sweetheart. We went D our separate ways for 24+ years, got back together in Spring of '97, married in '98.-  D The booze-hound was also a suicidal depressive. Didn't have to worryH 'bout kicking her out - the day before she was supposed to move out, sheD thought it would be fun to sit down in the middle of the living roomH floor (where she'd been sleeping since I kicked her out of the bedroom),D eat aspirin and Tylenols and wash 'em down with straight vodka. LikeH many attempted suicides, she called a friend to "say good bye", his wifeF called the cops, and (long story short) the paramedics hauled her out.C She was on some other planet for the next two days, her gut full ofvE powdered charcoal (ever seen black puke?). I was set free of that onet 22-Aug-1992.  E Of course, now the whole group knows what a poor judge of character I 	 can be...w   -- n David J. Dachteram dba DJE SystemsA http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 17:29:35 +1200 From: "AG" <ang@xtra.co.nz>iN Subject: Re: From the Peanut Gallery: (was Re: HP-Compaq Merger Went Smoothly)2 Message-ID: <XYBd9.3542$Y3.549795@news.xtra.co.nz>  < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message7 news:bf5c9.66913$kp.721815@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net...b   > from folks who are not HPA4 > customers and have no vested interest in VMS, etc.  2 From Webster's Encyclopedic Unabridged Dictionary:  ? "vest'ed in'terest, 1. a special reason interest in an existinga; system, arrangement, or institution for particular personalt reasons"  - Did it mention being an HP customer anywhere?e   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 20:16:50 GMTn2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)7 Subject: Re: Hardware Question . Alphastation 255 266/4c* Message-ID: <al5pni$h94$5@web1.cup.hp.com>  l In article <gnWb9.590$FJ1.27099@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>, "Francisco Ortega" <fortega@iblues.cc> writes:K :   I have a question. This alpha seems to have an scsi-2 drive (2 or 4gb),eG :and simms memory 72 pinns. I just want to be sure so I can upgrade therM :disks. What scsi drives can this alpha run and what type of cables it's needtK :it (how many pins). and how much the max memory that i can put with simms,rJ :been that it has 8 slots. If I take the 64 out, and put all new syms, howM :much can I put (max)? . And what is the biggest hard drive that I can put. Is! :think I could put up two inside.a  F   Please review the OpenVMS FAQ.  This "which SCSI disk?" topic arisesG   seemingly every two weeks or more frequently, and related information D   has been accordingly incorporated into the FAQ.  (You can also useD   Google to search the newsgroup archives for existing discussions.)  H   Device integration involves not only testing -- not all SCSI disks areD   alike, and I'm not sure you could even find two alike! -- but alsoI   involves ensuring thermal (cooling) requirements are met.  Accordingly,rI   I'd tend to go external with larger and faster disks; into an enclosureo&   that can avoid cooking the spindles.  E   For details on the largest supported disks for the AlphaStation 255iD   enclosure, see the old Systems and Options Catalog (SOC) archives.%   The SOC archive URL is in the FAQ.    D   For the largest supported SCSI device for particular platforms andF   OpenVMS versions (where restrictions are known to exist), please seeF   the details on the restrictions and on the ECOs that are included in   the OpenVMS FAQ.  G   As for the memory, there are two banks of four 72-pin SIMMs each, andrI   each slot in a bank must have the same size SIMM.  The AlphaStation 255aG   has two banks, with the first four SIMM slots nearest the edge of the H   board being bank 0.  (Good quality) 60ns and 70ns SIMMs can usually beJ   mixed within a bank.  Max individual SIMM is 128MB.  I personally preferJ   to use the 36-bit parity memory SIMMs, though I've heard that non-parity,   33-bit memory can also (sometimes?) work.   H   I'm sure this SIMM stuff has been posted before -- please try a Google#   search of the newsgroup archives.v    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:23:10 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>gB Subject: Re: Heterogenous Clusters and Shadowsets for system disks, Message-ID: <3D764F8A.12C850B1@videotron.ca>   Syltrem wrote: > Now the VAXes don;t wee DSA10t > $ sh dev dsa10/ > %SYSTEM-W-NOSUCHDEV, no such device available    First, VAXes don't wee...   L Have you made sure that each machine has its own allocation class ? When youN try to mount the DSA10 that was created by an alpha, have you tried specifying an allocation class ?o    3 > $ mount dsa10 /shad=($1$DUA2:,$1$DUA13:) ALPHAVMSs  J Have you considered just mount/system dsa10:  ?  The above command impliesK that the vax might be trying to change the membership of the existing DSA10eN set, especially if that vax has an allocation calss of 1 also which would mean5 that the vax is trying to put its own disks in DSA10.   , > %MOUNT-I-OPRQST, device is already mounted@ > %MOUNT-I-OPRQST, device _DSA10: is not available for mounting./ > %MOUNT-I-OPRQSTCAN, operator request canceledu6 > The drive is indeed successfully mounted onm the VAX  N > I can't do a MOUNT/CLUSTER on the system disk so I have to mount it manually > on the VAXes  K Try issuing a mount/cluster DSA10: from the node that created DSA10.  On my-N vaxes, each booting vax issues a MOUNT/CLUSTER of its own system drive to make it mounted on the other nodes.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 16:46:39 -0400* From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>B Subject: Re: Heterogenous Clusters and Shadowsets for system disks5 Message-ID: <Tiud9.10354$H67.54208@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>D  J "Kenneth H. Fairfield" <My-Full-Name@intel.com> a crit dans le message de$ news: 3D764041.37758A7B@intel.com...5 > > $ mount dsa10 /shad=($1$DUA2:,$1$DUA13:) ALPHAVMSt > 
 >    ^^^^^ >g@ > Make this: $ mount /SYSTEM /shad=($1$DUA2:,$1$DUA13:) ALPHAVMS >                    ^^^^^^^C > and you'll be a lot happier.  You've inadvertantly tried to mountaA > the shadow set _private_ which isn't allowed since it's alreadyc- > mounted (/system) elsewhere in the cluster.4 >4    D What was I thinking? Now it's ok. I didn't see I missed the /SYSTEM.B I really should wear my glasses all the time, like the doctor said
 yesterday.   JF suggested I do ae7 $ mount/CLUSTERdsa10/shad=($1$DUA2:,$1$DUA13:) alphavmsd1 from the node that has DSA10 for its system disk.gK I didn't think that would work (reason why I never tried it before), as thee4 disk is already mounted, but it does work just fine.5 I will change my STARTDISK.COM procedure accordingly.A   Thanks to u both.N   --   SyltremEI http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site - en franais)-8 To reply to myself directly, remove zulu from my address   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 11:18:42 -0700u# From: beantown31@hotmail.com (Evan)1 Subject: Hitachi and VMS= Message-ID: <47ab7ff7.0209041018.62762fd3@posting.google.com>u  J Anybody have experience with the Hitachi 9960 FC disk array and true copy?   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 19:19:57 GMTr2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)) Subject: Re: How to configure DECNet-pluso* Message-ID: <al5mct$h94$3@web1.cup.hp.com>  r In article <1Ibb9.121665$8aG1.91786@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "Yong Liu" <fdu9774@rogers.com> writes: :Hi, :e/ :To configure TCP/IP, you take following steps:t! :(1) Make the hardware connected. 9 :(2) Run @tcpip$config (Set you local node in the nework)c- :(3) tcpip set host (set the local host file)d# :(4) ping a neighbor (verification)e :nH :My question is: What are the similar steps for configuring DECNet-plus? :tL :I installed DECNet-plus. run decnet-config. The problem is even a show host- :local file takes forever. What's wrong here?o     Beware: this is a GUESS.  ?   It's probably going to DECdns or to DNS/BIND, and timing out.r  ; :Any pointers? Detailed direction will be most appreciated.   B   If you want details of how DECnet-Plus operates, please read theA   DECnet-Plus installation and configuration manual.  (When first @   working with DECnet-Plus, reading the manuals is effectively a@   necessity -- DECnet-Plus is sufficiently different from DECnetC   Phase IV that you really need to understand some of the new terms-4   and concepts before you proceed with the package.)  C   Case in point: the order of the name resolution is central to the-E   operation of DECnet-Plus -- both for the speed of the translations,hD   and for such things as back-translation.  In most cases, I tend to@   prefer to use the local database and then DNS/BIND resolution.B   (See the OpenVMS FAQ for details of the back-translation failureC   BCKTRNSFAIL error -- that's another related configuration issue.)<  D   If you have just installed, I'd probably shut down DECnet-Plus andC   blow away the DECnet-Plus data files and reconfigure DECnet-Plus,eA   either manually or from any existing DECnet Phase IV database.  F   (IIRC, the name resolution sequence prompt is only easily accessableE   when you first install or first upgrade to DECnet-Plus.  Once it iseG   configured, DECnet-Plus tends to remember this setting -- well, shorte?   of digging around inside the various NCL files to change it.)n  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 15:21:45 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>l@ Subject: Re: Humm, I am getting confused between a PDP and a Vax$ Message-ID: <3d765daa$1@news.si.com>  7 >I remember the RSX compatibility mode, I think it wentt? >out with VMS V4, and at the same time therefore, the wonderfule >sos line editor went.  ) VAX-11 RSX works fine on OpenVMS VAX V7.2-  	 $ mcr pipr PIP>/lil     Directory $$13:[TILLMAN] 4-SEP-02 15:19  . ACLEDIT.TPU;1       198.       06-MAR-02 14:46. ADMINS.DIS;1        4.         16-FEB-95 09:45. AIRBUS.DIS;1        2.         03-JUN-99 11:36. ALIAS.FOR;1         2.         27-JUL-01 12:26. ALIASES.SMA;6       4089.      04-SEP-02 08:54. ALIASES.SMA;5       4085.      03-SEP-02 13:20. ALIASES.SMA;4       4085.      29-AUG-02 13:23. ARCHIVE.LOG;1       14.        05-JUL-02 17:15 -- pA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comoA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comn= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:09:34 GMT 0 From: Paul Winalski <prune@ZAnkh-Morpork.mv.com>4 Subject: Re: IBM did it, Sun did it, why Compaq not?8 Message-ID: <1kfcnug6ngorg0rt4tcf37emltpgpoklt6@4ax.com>  ; On Wed, 4 Sep 2002 08:16:42 +0200 (MET DST), Rudolf Wingertd <win@fom.fgan.de> wrote:  % >But Compaq did not pay for that. TheeB >SVPs did not see the potential number of users. The did only hear@ >VMS is dead. Why did Compaq not buy StarOffice? I know that's aF >hypothetical question. Also why did they not give Legato, Veritas ...A >monye to port there (killer) application to OpenVMS? I think, in A >case of not knowing the power of OpenVMS. IMHO HP do not see they# >potential and poer of OpenVMS too.v: >My hope is, that this forum is able to chnage there mind.  ? Because Compaq had no interest in growing the VMS market.  They @ were content with milking a cash cow.  They had a captive set ofC customers loyal either for emotional reasons or because VMS was the F only appropriate platform for their application.  As long as there wasB a steady flow of revenue from these customers, Compaq was content.   >P.S. May HP will do it!?H   I wouldn't bet on it.f  
 ---------- Remove 'Z' to reply by email.h   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:15:45 GMTf1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>p4 Subject: Re: IBM did it, Sun did it, why Compaq not?' Message-ID: <3D76D1B6.A74EA234@fsi.net>o   Nic Clews wrote: >  > Rudolf Wingert wrote:d > I > > hypothetical question. Also why did they not give Legato, Veritas ...nD > > monye to port there (killer) application to OpenVMS? I think, in > I > VERITAS Netbackup is on VMS, and is planned for Itanium, I presume that I > is the product you implied. However I think that Veritas have (always?)n" > funded their own work into this.  F You may be right. Reports from the field seem to indicate that Veritas' don't know shit from Shinola about VMS.d   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemst http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/w   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 19:13:06 GMT?* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>  Subject: Re: Itanic2 performanceC Message-ID: <6Xsd9.423976$2p2.17156036@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>s  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D76486A.1D7E47E3@videotron.ca...H > There has been mention that the use of 64 bit pointers would slow down IA64 bym > about 15%.  K Paul later qualified this with the statement that exactly what platform theCL number he had heard applied to was not clear.  And Jan reported John Henning, as saying the number for Alpha was about 5%.   > K > Is it really fair then to claim that IA64 is a 64 bit architecture if alli its 3 > performance metrics are measured in 32 bit mode ?   H The only evidence I've seen mentioned is for SPECint.  I remember notingJ exactly the same thing about the SPECint values reported for Merced (whereH the HP results were so much higher than Dell's, in part because of usingC 32-bit pointers).  At the time, ISTR someone saying that it made nosH difference because the Alpha numbers were obtained the same way, but nowL that appears not to be the case (at least for the base numbers which are theC only comparable ones, since peak numbers aren't quoted for Itanic).i  H Even 5% would make a noticeable difference, boosting the effective AlphaE SPECint2K_base value up to nearly 890 (about the same as the 2.53 GHz - Pentium, and about 10% faster than McKinley).h   > L > Considering that the 8086 will continue to power 32 bit servers at a lowerL > price and respectable performance, wouldn't it be fair to think that those who2L > can live within the limits of 32 bits would stay on the traditional wintel > servers ?l  L The same argument I raised a year ago.  But it only applies to the relevance= of the measurement, not to how people actually use the boxes.a   >eI > And if performance of the IA64 in 64 bit mode sucks, it won't really do  wellJ > in the market it was designed for: those users who need the 64 bit mode.  L It doesn't suck.  But neither is it quite as good as HP and Intel would have
 it appear.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 13:52:44 -0400h- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>'  Subject: Re: Itanic2 performance, Message-ID: <3D76486A.1D7E47E3@videotron.ca>  N There has been mention that the use of 64 bit pointers would slow down IA64 by
 about 15%.  M Is it really fair then to claim that IA64 is a 64 bit architecture if all itsn1 performance metrics are measured in 32 bit mode ?   J Considering that the 8086 will continue to power 32 bit servers at a lowerN price and respectable performance, wouldn't it be fair to think that those whoJ can live within the limits of 32 bits would stay on the traditional wintel	 servers ?   L And if performance of the IA64 in 64 bit mode sucks, it won't really do wellH in the market it was designed for: those users who need the 64 bit mode.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 12:03:09 -0700r. From: JMK <jeffrey.m.klopotic@lmco.nospam.com>" Subject: Re: Lint tool for HPQ CXX/ Message-ID: <3D7658ED.22132816@lmco.nospam.com>e  	 I concur.    Jeff   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 20:20:13 +0200i@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour....s+ Message-ID: <3D764EDD.4020501@mail.tele.dk>(   Jamie Stallwood wrote:  C > I am bringing my new (old!) VaxStation 3100 to life but it has noa( > MACRO so can't transfer anything over.   ????  7 MACRO-32 is installed with all VMS versions I know off.   6 Has somebody deleted the EXE file from SYS$SYSTEM or ?   Arne   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 21:02:26 +0200" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour..../6 Message-ID: <al5lci$1kq7ck$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de>  + Would you like a zip-ed version of MACRO32?t  L "Jamie Stallwood" <this.no.work.try.something.else@project76.net> schreef in: bericht news:1d8cnucmtli8ft5n9bjjvolpc4t973nc06@4ax.com...C > I am bringing my new (old!) VaxStation 3100 to life but it has noe( > MACRO so can't transfer anything over. >t  > I would like to install CMU-IPG > (http://www.agh.cc.kcl.ac.uk/files/vms/cmu-tcpip/) but have no way oft > transferring binary savesets.i >rG > I have installed VMS_UNSHARE from the HG archive. If anybody can helpyH > by VMS_SHARE'ing the 4 savesets I would be grateful if they could mail > me.n >n > Thnaks > Jamie Stallwoode   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 21:21:00 +0200m@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour....s+ Message-ID: <3D765D1C.2090602@mail.tele.dk>a   Hans Vlems wrote:.  N > "Jamie Stallwood" <this.no.work.try.something.else@project76.net> schreef in< > bericht news:1d8cnucmtli8ft5n9bjjvolpc4t973nc06@4ax.com...C >>I am bringing my new (old!) VaxStation 3100 to life but it has nos( >>MACRO so can't transfer anything over. >>  >>I would like to install CMU-IPG >>(http://www.agh.cc.kcl.ac.uk/files/vms/cmu-tcpip/) but have no way ofa >>transferring binary savesets.h >>G >>I have installed VMS_UNSHARE from the HG archive. If anybody can help H >>by VMS_SHARE'ing the 4 savesets I would be grateful if they could mail >>me.u    - > Would you like a zip-ed version of MACRO32?M  8 You will have to VMS_SHARE it, because he can not upload binary files !   :-)r   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 21:59:31 +0200Q@ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour....a+ Message-ID: <3D766623.4070306@mail.tele.dk>I   H.Vlems wrote:  G > (red head, mine) since I have no idea what VMS_SHARE is, I decided toe > mention ZIP. > What is it anyway?  < It is a COM-file that can take a binary file like EXE or ZIP: and convert it to text and chunk it up in small parts that0 when concatanated is a self-extracting COM file.  5 That way you can receive and unpack binary files evene9 though you only can transfer text files. And all you need  is DCL and TPU.s  / Pretty neat. And a very used tool 10 years ago.d   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 19:25:30 GMTo From: "H.Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>e) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour....h0 Message-ID: <K6td9.484$hf3.3963@typhoon.bart.nl>   Arne  E (red head, mine) since I have no idea what VMS_SHARE is, I decided toa mention ZIP. What is it anyway?   Hans  < "Arne Vajhj" <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk> schreef in bericht% news:3D765D1C.2090602@mail.tele.dk...n > Hans Vlems wrote:i > E > > "Jamie Stallwood" <this.no.work.try.something.else@project76.net>u
 schreef in> > > bericht news:1d8cnucmtli8ft5n9bjjvolpc4t973nc06@4ax.com...E > >>I am bringing my new (old!) VaxStation 3100 to life but it has noi* > >>MACRO so can't transfer anything over. > >>" > >>I would like to install CMU-IPI > >>(http://www.agh.cc.kcl.ac.uk/files/vms/cmu-tcpip/) but have no way of ! > >>transferring binary savesets.- > >>I > >>I have installed VMS_UNSHARE from the HG archive. If anybody can helppJ > >>by VMS_SHARE'ing the 4 savesets I would be grateful if they could mail > >>me.- >- > / > > Would you like a zip-ed version of MACRO32?o >a: > You will have to VMS_SHARE it, because he can not upload > binary files ! >1 > :-)  >0 > Arne >F   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 22:15:55 +0200a9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>0) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour....h' Message-ID: <3D7669FB.8842F952@aaa.com>0  % Arne Vajhj wrote (about VMS_SHARE) :v > 1 > Pretty neat. And a very used tool 10 years ago.  >e  , And still available from Hunter's archive at+ "http://www.process.com/openvms/index.html"r/ if you'd like to take a look at some clever DCLa
 programing...    Jan-Erik Sderholm.    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 17:03:52 -0600t- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)h) Subject: Re: Looking for a VMS favour....m3 Message-ID: <g9xB8Fr8pYxQ@eisner.encompasserve.org>a  n In article <3D764EDD.4020501@mail.tele.dk>, Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk> writes: > Jamie Stallwood wrote: > D >> I am bringing my new (old!) VaxStation 3100 to life but it has no) >> MACRO so can't transfer anything over.r >  > ???? > 9 > MACRO-32 is installed with all VMS versions I know off.   J But not with all sets of installation options. Try the following on a VAX:  * 	$ SEARCH SYS$UPDATE:VMSKITBLD.DAT MACRO32   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 16:22:55 -0700t, From: colive@technologEase.com (Chris Olive)6 Subject: Mapping PF1-PF4 in DECwindows or Linux xterm?= Message-ID: <b10654c6.0209041522.7abe11e6@posting.google.com>4  B If this is already in an FAQ, my apologies.  (I did TRY to look!) C Someone just stick my mose in the right place if it's in an FAQ... 4D Otherwise, here's the issue.  I know it's got to be somewhat common:  C Most of my VMS career has been terminal based access to VMS hosts. oF I'm somewhat familiar with DECwindows on VMS, and more familiar with X@ Windows on Unix.  I use DECwindows mainly for debugging, with myF client side platform being Windows for YEARS (use Exceed for Windows XE server).  So terminal emulation, esp. of the PF1-PF4 keys was never aiE problem.  Windows emulation packages either mapped PF keys across thecE PC keypad (NumLock, /, *, -), or from the F1 thru F4 keys on a PC 102e	 keyboard.E  D Well, I just decided to convert entirely to Linux for my client-sideD platform.  Running xterm (telnet into VMS), with the NumLock key on,C all the keypad keys (application mode) work fine.  But I don't haveiB any PF keys neither by way of the NumLock row, or the F1-F4 keys. A When in the editor and I press F1, it just says "F1 not defined.".  E So I fired up DECwindows to my local X server, and ran DECterm.  SameoB deal basically.  No F1,F2,F3... -> PF1,PF2,PF3... mapping, and theB keypad does work except the NumLock row.  I've seen some things onE loadkeys for Linix and other things here and there, but haven't found0E a put-together solution.  Surely someone out there has issue solved. cF I don't care either way; I can run DECwindows on my local X server, orF I can telnet via xterm into the VMS box.  Getting BOTH solutions would' put someone into the bonus round... 8-)-  E Again, sorry if this is addressed in an FAQ somewhere, but I couldn'tH find a total solution there.   Thanks,r Christ -----  Chris Olivea colive(at)technologEase(dot)comn   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 23:48:57 GMTc2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman): Subject: Re: Mapping PF1-PF4 in DECwindows or Linux xterm?* Message-ID: <al6659$pan$1@web1.cup.hp.com>  l In article <b10654c6.0209041522.7abe11e6@posting.google.com>, colive@technologEase.com (Chris Olive) writes:? :...So terminal emulation, esp. of the PF1-PF4 keys was never apF :problem.  Windows emulation packages either mapped PF keys across theF :PC keypad (NumLock, /, *, -), or from the F1 thru F4 keys on a PC 102
 :keyboard....oD :Well, I just decided to convert entirely to Linux ... Running xterm5 :(telnet into VMS)... But I don't have any PF keys...   B   This is associated with the abilities and configuration of your D   terminal emulator, and how it maps keys -- and which keys it maps.8   For some details and assistance with this, please see:  ?     http://www.openvms.compaq.com/freeware/freeware50/decxterm/l  %   and to a lesser extent, please see:   <     http://www.openvms.compaq.com/freeware/freeware50/xterm/    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2002 03:55:10 GMTa2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>: Subject: Re: Mapping PF1-PF4 in DECwindows or Linux xterm?+ Message-ID: <al6kiu0lfa@enews3.newsguy.com>d  - Chris Olive <colive@technologease.com> wrote:nF > Well, I just decided to convert entirely to Linux for my client-sideF > platform.  Running xterm (telnet into VMS), with the NumLock key on,E > all the keypad keys (application mode) work fine.  But I don't havelD > any PF keys neither by way of the NumLock row, or the F1-F4 keys. C > When in the editor and I press F1, it just says "F1 not defined."s  L The following shell script that someone posted here ages ago, should do the 8 trick for you.  ftp://zane.brouhaha.com/pub/vms/vt100.sh  G It creates a Xterm with a remapped keyboard that has a fully functional J keypad.  You might need to switch the mapping on the left and right arrow J keys around.  I use it to access systems running OpenVMS and several other	 DEC OS's.e   			Zanep   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 15:50:29 -0700o, From: colive@technologEase.com (Chris Olive) Subject: Re: MATCHC Instruction = Message-ID: <b10654c6.0209041450.6e6f10f6@posting.google.com>p   "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<PNpd9.437$2L.74228@e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com>...J > > > Thanks for the response. The string is indeed longer than what wouldL > > > fit into a word. It will now have to become a subroutine call that can  > > > accomodate the size issue. > >ED > > It wouldn't be terribly hard to view your object "string" in 65kD > > blocks and iterate those blocks of your "string" over the MATCHCG > > instruction <x> number of times for a string of <x> blocks, esp. ifMD > > your match string fits within one block.  You could do it with a@ > > custom .MACRO more than likely, and just replace your MATCHCF > > instruction instances with your custom .MACRO (call it BLKMTCHC orE > > something like that.)  R0 holds the address at the end of the 65ktF > > block (or any block size you choose up to 65k). If you don't get aB > > match on MATCHC, increment your starting object pointer (usingJ > > register displacement for example) by R0 on no match, and iterate overA > > MATCHC again until you get a match or run out of blocks (or anG > > sub-block as in the case of the last block short of an even block.)@F > > Could conceivably be done with a custom .MACRO I think... (If yourI > > match string can be larger than 65k, then this would perhaps be a bit  > > of a different story.) > >oG > > Obviously, you basically have to consider R0-R3 volatile within thec
 > > .MACRO...s > >h	 > > Chris 	 > > -----l > > Chris Oliveo# > > colive(at)technologEase(dot)com  > I > Would this work in the case of a string that crossed a block boundary ?t  E Yes.  Say you had a string that was 262,420 bytes long.  262420/65535VD = 4 blocks plus 280 bytes left over or 280 bytes which would cross aE logical 65k block boundary.  Your first 4 iterations over MATCHC theneC would specify 65535 for the source length (3rd operand).  Your lastrE iteration would specify the 280 bytes left over as the source length.o  E Of course if your match string length (MATCHC 1st operand) is greateroF than any bytes you have left over in your source after <x> iterations,F then you wouldn't need to check any remaining bytes past a logical 65kD block because there is no way it would match.  So you can give a fewF smarts to the algorythm in that way.  You could also tune your logicalE block size to anything less than or equal to 65k blocks if you wantedBB to and you have some statistical data that provides you with match# length medians on your target data.s  F But the idea is basically, look at the string in logical blocks of <x>E (where x | ~16k < x < 65k), and iterate those blocks over MATCHC.  If E there are bytes left over and they are >= to the match string length,iE specify the leftover bytes as the source length on the last iterationn@ and search one last time, otherwise, you are done searching.  No match.  F It would be easier than all that sounds. (Conciseness is something I'mC weak in...)  Of course if your match string length could be greaterA1 than 65k, than all this goes out the window!! 8-)/   Chrisw ------ Chris Olive- colive(at)technologEase(dot)com    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 21:09:50 GMTj2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)B Subject: Re: netscape/modzilla/HP/open-source: system requirements* Message-ID: <al5squ$h94$6@web1.cup.hp.com>  w In article <01KLWZJ4X4K49QUS7H@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:   @ :What do folks recommend?  The latest official HP product, some ? :open-source mozilla thingy, or what?  What are MINIMUM system eH :requirements (CPU speed, memory---I'm sure I have enough disk space)?    8   You do need a recent OpenVMS Alpha version, of course.  C   Mozilla (and CSWB) are both very memory- and processor-intensive.d  D   CSWB adds encryption and such to Mozilla, but plain Mozilla works C   nicely for typical browsing.  (For discussions of performance ande=   related, I'd tend to treat Mozilla and CSWB as equivalent.)r  ?   As for minimum requirements, IMNSHO, an EV56 series with 128 iA   megabytes of memory free -- I'd not run OpenVMS Alpha with lesspB   than 256 megabytes total in any case -- is about the minimum for)   reasonable Mozilla or CSWB performance.w  F   Performance of Mozilla on a local (five-plus-years-old) AlphaStationD   255 (and specifically an AlphaStation 255 with an EV45 at 300 MHz)D   is, well, bad.   The system is operating with 320 megabytes total.  F   On a related note, there exists the potential for a Galeon port, butG   no schedule and no commitments as yet.  (Galeon is based on the GeckorG   rendering engine used under Mozilla, but does not bring along all thetE   other components of Mozilla.)  And yes, I know about Opera -- thererG   are folks around that would like to see that browser ported, as well.   ! :Will any old graphic card be OK?   E   Mozilla itself tends not to be particularly graphics-intensive, andnI   works nicely on a PowerStorm 3D30 or PowerStorm 4D20 series or similar.l   ..B :What do I need to know about Java and Javascript in this context?  @   Comparatively little.  :-)  I tend to run with these disabled.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 18:26 CDT' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)c) Subject: Re: Networking with Alpha Server , Message-ID: <4SEP200218260045@gerg.tamu.edu>  ) "Yong Liu" <fdu9774@rogers.com> writes...cJ }I am working on hooking up a HP-UX based client to a Open VMS based AlphaF }server. TCP/IP is working on both machines. Can I connect them like I? }connect two HP-UX work stations? Since I am concerned with lab'8 }implementations, I will appreciate detailed directions.  / Define "like I connect two HP-UX workstations".-  & Can you glue them together? Certainly.N Can you weld them together? Possibly. (If they both have metal cases, anyway.)- Can you telnet from one to the other? Easily.8M Can you FTP stuff from one to the other? Sure. (Watch the formatting issues.) O Can you run something on one and have the X window displayed on the other? Yes.eL Can you NFS mount the disks of each on the other? Of course. (See FTP note.)= Can you use LPD to access print queues on the other one? Yep. . Can you cluster them together? Not even close.   Be more specific.    --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 04:25:45 GMTS( From: Alder <PGDEHMKOKIMD@spammotel.com>+ Subject: Re: OpenOffice ODBC and Oracle Rdbe* Message-ID: <3D76DCC8.40907@spammotel.com>   Dean Woodward wrote: > Alder wrote: > H >>Anyone here manage to make a successful ODBC connection with an OracleB >>Rdb database from the OpenOffice 1.0 or 1.0.1 suite of programs? >  > J > Nope- my experiences are quite similar.  Bummer, because it'd be nice toI > start pushing OO to customers as an alternative, but several of them doa+ > database queries into Excel for analysis.a  C I'm getting some kind assistance with this problem over on the Rdb eI mailing list at JCC.COM.  If there's any success, I'll report back here. l5     The OO newsgroups are not helpful at all, so far.b   Aldere   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 05:43:20 +0200c2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) Subject: Re: OpenSSL woesa; Message-ID: <3d76d2d8.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>-  3 Martin Vorlaender (martin@radiogaga.harz.de) wrote:0G > I'm trying to integrate SSL with ht://Dig to enable it to index httpsj > URLs.L  F Using a debug version of the OpenSSL library, I have been able to moveC closer to the cause of the problem. It seems that it can't seed thehG random number generator, and thus can't create a client master key. Thel1 final point in the code where the error occurs is!/ MD_RAND\ssleay_rand_bytes\%LINE 7540 (listing):   A         RANDerr(RAND_F_SSLEAY_RAND_BYTES,RAND_R_PRNG_NOT_SEEDED);PB         ERR_add_error_data(1, "You need to read the OpenSSL FAQ, ";                 "http://www.openssl.org/support/faq.html");l  % So I'll do just that. Thanks for now.y   cu,n   Martin -- SG  Your mouse has moved.     | Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmer 4  Windows must be restarted | work: mv@pdv-systeme.deH  for the change to take    |    http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/;  effect. Reboot now? [OK]  | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de,   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Sep 2002 03:44:59 GMT<2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)7 Subject: Re: OpenVMS Plans (was: Re: Please Sum it up.)l* Message-ID: <al6jvr$3u5$1@web1.cup.hp.com>  q In article <pkmd9.402013$q53.13366862@twister.austin.rr.com>, LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (Jerry Leslie) writes:a# :Vivek Soni (visoni@bmc.com) wrote:Z :: OpenVMS future trends...d :: kN :: Could somebody who is touch with the market/industry and the "new HP" plans0 :: please sum up:  What is the future of OpenVMS :: for the next 5 years.  H   For the OpenVMS "rolling roadmap", please see the the OpenVMS website.  J   In the near(er) years (and in fewest words), the Marvel platform supportH   (Alpha EV7 and EV79 processors) and the Intel IA-64 (Itanium) port areJ   two of the major engineering projects.  There are various other projectsI   underway -- too many to mention here -- with the roadmap providing someA-   details on various of these other projects.a  J :Are you asking this question for yourself, or has someone in BMC Software  :management asked the question ? :.I :If the latter, it may be appropriate for a VMS Ambassador to pay a visith :to BMC Software.n  C   Ayup.  Though I've not yet seen the original posting -- given theaC   generic subject, I may well have missed it -- I'll assume this is B   BMC and have passed this question along to (other) folks here in!   OpenVMS Engineering for a look.h    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:14:26 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>- Subject: Re: Please Sum it up.' Message-ID: <3D76D167.436521E8@fsi.net>m   Jerry Leslie wrote:? > $ > Vivek Soni (visoni@bmc.com) wrote: > : OpenVMS future trends... > :eO > : Could somebody who is touch with the market/industry and the "new HP" plans 1 > : please sum up:  What is the future of OpenVMSo > :e > : for the next 5 years.m > :eK > Are you asking this question for yourself, or has someone in BMC Softwareo! > management asked the question ?r > J > If the latter, it may be appropriate for a VMS Ambassador to pay a visit > to BMC Software.  F As BMC is one of those rare creatures known as an ISV, I'd recommend aG visit from at least an executive-level person as well as an ambassador.o   --   David J. DachteraD dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 14:10:56 -06006 From: "Michael D. Ober" <obermd.@.alum.mit.edu.nospam> Subject: Portmapperl0 Message-ID: <uNtd9.21$KC5.51470@news.uswest.net>  H Anyone have an example of how to write a portmapper based service in VMS Basic?   TIA,
 Mike Ober.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 15:55:35 -0400; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>MJ Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?$ Message-ID: <3d766598$1@news.si.com>  C >So Tennant will habe to learn Mandarin. Or how to pull a rickshaw.n  I Hmm.  When I was in China in 1997, I didn't see a single rickshaw.  Mayber they were hiding them all. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comaA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comn= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevento< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:50:05 GMTw1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>hJ Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?? Message-ID: <N_wd9.153552$_91.209495@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>o  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D701849.620F0ADA@videotron.ca... > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote: H > > www.openvms.org and www.tru64.org. More news, minimal BS, no blather from > > non-customer trolls. >t' > In other words, edited HP propaganda.e  0 Your opinion, Sport. Your refund is in the mail/   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:52:30 GMT21 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>hJ Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?? Message-ID: <21xd9.153574$_91.209973@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>u  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D704997.2D0C5439@videotron.ca... > Kenneth Farmer wrote:tH > > Try to do or say something positive and you become a lackey, is that what > > you think JF?- > J > I was responding to Mr Shannon's accusations that this forum was full ofI > "lackeys" while the www.openvms.org one was all nice without complaintsa etc etc. >sJ > If you have a forum where customers can only say positive things, then I call > that a propaganda forum. >aH > If HP would prefer customers didn't complain, it needs to do very few,K > inexpensive things and they have been outlined here, and directly to many1H > Compaq/HP employees over the years. Yet, these people have either beenK > unwilling, or prevented from taking such simple, inexpensive actions. Ando itC > is exactly because of this that many customers question HP's truee
 intentions > with regards to VMS.  K Umm. JF, for the umteenth time, are yoe even a DEC/CPQ/CUSTOMER? When's thee5 last time  you attended a DECUS? Bought a broduct????.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:55:48 GMTt1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>,J Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?? Message-ID: <84xd9.153599$_91.210038@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>o  2 "Tom Crabtre" <tccrab@sunset.net> wrote in message$ news:3D718EC3.C1579C10@sunset.net...F > Actually, I'm sick of people who just complain how Compaq and now HP screwed  > them.<@ > If DEC had such a good thing, Bill Gates would have bought it.& > It's not like he couldn't afford it.- > Since he didn't it means one of two things: 1 > 1. He was smarter than you give him credit for.f9 > 2. Ken was so short sighted he couldn't see the future.z   Both are true.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:54:19 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>:J Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?> Message-ID: <L2xd9.131360$kp.763782@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>  3 "Peter da Silva" <peter@abbnm.com> wrote in message ' news:akrrcn$cjj@web.eng.baileynm.com...x0 > In article <ujTb9.236506$me6.32409@sccrnsc01>,2 > Terry C. Shannon <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote:H > > www.openvms.org and www.tru64.org. More news, minimal BS, no blather from > > non-customer trolls. >rL > Terry, neither you nor Bill have enough credibility left to be spending it > this profligately.  > Shimatta! I have made a mistakle. Your refund is in the mail..   >u > --K > I've seen things you people can't imagine. Chimneysweeps on fire over thet roofs L > of London. I've watched kite-strings glitter in the sun at Hyde Park Gate. AlloF > these things will be lost in time, like chalk-paintings in the rain. `-_-' F > Time for your nap.  | Peter da Silva | Har du kramat din varg, idag? 'U`0   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:24:30 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>@J Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?' Message-ID: <3D76C5B1.1DA2A9DF@fsi.net>2   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:m > < > "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message( > news:3D704997.2D0C5439@videotron.ca... > > Kenneth Farmer wrote:uJ > > > Try to do or say something positive and you become a lackey, is that > what > > > you think JF?y > >bL > > I was responding to Mr Shannon's accusations that this forum was full ofK > > "lackeys" while the www.openvms.org one was all nice without complaints 
 > etc etc. > >rL > > If you have a forum where customers can only say positive things, then I > call > > that a propaganda forum. > >AJ > > If HP would prefer customers didn't complain, it needs to do very few,M > > inexpensive things and they have been outlined here, and directly to manylJ > > Compaq/HP employees over the years. Yet, these people have either beenM > > unwilling, or prevented from taking such simple, inexpensive actions. Andm > itE > > is exactly because of this that many customers question HP's truey > intentions > > with regards to VMS. > M > Umm. JF, for the umteenth time, are yoe even a DEC/CPQ/CUSTOMER? When's theo7 > last time  you attended a DECUS? Bought a broduct????I  F I would postulate that if he is at least an ex-customer (which IIRC isF his current status), then his points are perhaps a bit more valid than any current customers.  F I wouldn't expect ex-customers to attend the symposia, unless just forH personal interest if one has a couple weeks' pay hanging about burning a hole in a pocket...    -- o David J. Dachterar dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/2   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:35:12 GMTt1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> J Subject: Re: Sick of the trolls, whiners, and non-customers in this forum?' Message-ID: <3D76C833.8DC50EDE@fsi.net>    Alan Greig wrote:a > . > On Tue, 03 Sep 2002 13:46:26 -0400, JF Mezei' > <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  >  > >tN > >Not only do I own multiple VAXes, but the first one, I paid $20,000 **OF MYJ > >OWN MONEY**. And I invested heavily in VMS for my carreer, and am now aM > >worthless ugly bag of mostly water because the owners of VMS had made surelN > >that VMS skills are not in demand. I think I have a right to comment on the > >fate of VMS.t > E > And this sums it up nicely. As long as there's a large number of ussE > looking at career changes (or already emptying the trash) thanks to<E > the actions of VMS's owners then these owners are going to get shitIC > thrown at them. Why is this so hard for some folks to understand.g   That's what I'd like to know.a  H It's like I've said so many times: it comes down to "messing with folks'H rice bowl". O.k., so you're a senior VMS person, you've been assimilatedH and VMS has no longer holds the same value in your estimation as perhapsE it once did or as it perhaps does to others. If that's the case, thentG exercise one of the options expressed in the old saying: "Do SOMEthing!(- ...either lead, follow or GTF outta the way!"a  H > Had first Digital , then Compaq and perhaps HP helped me every step ofG > the way to push VMS but it failed in the marketplace, I would feel no G > animosity But instead I've spent the last decade fighting them tryingSH > to push me towards Unix then Windows. Yes, there are the advocates whoF > *do* help but, unless you are in a particular specialist applicationF > area, that's just not good enough to fight their employers corporate > momentum.q > C > This is perhaps the real reason Capellas would like to see VMS go G > away. He knows that the constant complaints will never go away unlessCF > VMS goes into strong growth mode. He doesn't plan for this I'm sure.# > Now the problem is over to Carly.   H That's the part that my little peanut-brain finds so difficult to grasp.C Here's this product that churns out bux at a good pace, all factors.C considered (cost vs. margin and all that). Under what circumstancesiC would you *NOT* want to promote the living (Censored) out of it??!!   H Corollary: suppose you held a winning lottery ticket worth a lump sum in excess of $50 megabux. Do you:  
 A. Cash it inc B. Flush it down the toilet-G C. Burn it because so many people are complaining that you won and they  didn't.V  ) If you're smart, you'll choose option A.    4 Why does VMS Mgt. consistently choose either B or C?  . Please, Please, Please, someone TELL ME WHY!!!   --   David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/l   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 00:35:44 GMTh* From: "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net> Subject: Re: simh is back up.l? Message-ID: <AFxd9.153962$_91.210546@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>s  . Heh, I ment that simh emulates a MicroVAX 3900  K But it dosn't give much specs on it, anyone have a site on the hardware and. such?   8 Or anyone know if there are tape images avalable for it?G "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> wrote in message 6 news:dpxd9.170$%P6.7963@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...) > Can you install VMS on a MicroVAX 3900?l >lH Yes, most were installed from tk50 media on the tk70 drive. The standardI DSSI bus didn't support a lot of drives. Get a qbus scsi controler if youh can.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:03:32 GMT-- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>  Subject: Re: simh is back up.P* Message-ID: <3D76B66C.8090009@qsl.network>   WarlockD wrote:D  > Oh hey!  This is neet.m  >  > Can this run VMS 7.2?  3 A real VAX 3900 can run the current OpenVMS VAX 7.3P  H A VAX 3900 series is rated at 3.8 VUPs of cpu power or approximately 3.8  times the speed of a VAX 11/780.  I Of course, I do not know how closely a specific emulator tracks the real e speed of the system.  H There are only a handful of VAX processors that can not run the current G version of OpenVMS, and in most cases the lack of support is due to it rB no longer being cost effective to test the latest release on them.  G In addtions most of the systems that are no longer supported either do SD not support enough physical memory or supported disk drives for the " minimum recommended configuration.  @ It may be possible to get OpenVMS to run on less than supported D configurations, but if it does not work, well, you are on your own, J which in the case of the hobbyist license is the same case as you are now.  E There were also some VAX processors that where hardware limited from  I running OpenVMS.  These were made to run non virtual memory applications R0 under specialized operating systems like VAXELN.  F For a list of supported platforms for OpenVMS, please see the OpenVMS E Software Product Description.  It is available on the world wide web.e  G Please see the OpenVMS home page at http://www.openvms.compaq.com, and  / look in the OpenVMS Frequently Asked Questions.e   -Johne wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Onlyt   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 00:00:16 GMT * From: "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net> Subject: simh is back up.l? Message-ID: <k8xd9.153625$_91.210266@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>c  ' Can you install VMS on a MicroVAX 3900?n  K Thats the current emulation that is going on simh.  What can you install if-
 you can't?   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 19:18:21 -0500< From: "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: simh is back up.a< Message-ID: <dpxd9.170$%P6.7963@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>  ) > Can you install VMS on a MicroVAX 3900?/ > H Yes, most were installed from tk50 media on the tk70 drive. The standardI DSSI bus didn't support a lot of drives. Get a qbus scsi controler if you  can.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 19:49:29 -0500< From: "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: simh is back up.y= Message-ID: <pSxd9.400$%P6.18738@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>L  L Sorry I didn't understand your question the yes was for a real 3900. Look at
 netbsd/vax atp, www.netbsd.org/Ports/vax/emulator-howto.html   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 20:57:53 -0500< From: "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: simh is back up. > Message-ID: <xSyd9.1001$%P6.44701@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>   > Can this run VMS 7.2?pI > "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> wrote in messager9 > news:pSxd9.400$%P6.18738@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com... K > Sorry I didn't understand your question the yes was for a real 3900. Lookf at > netbsd/vax ate. > www.netbsd.org/Ports/vax/emulator-howto.html  H It maybe only legal if you run it on a vax or alpha not sure the licenseK covers intel. But why not pick up a 3100 on ebay microvax or vaxstation andaH use your intel for a terminal that will run faster and only set you back2 about $50 usd, $20 for the 3100 $30  for shipping.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 01:40:13 GMTe* From: "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net> Subject: Re: simh is back up.s> Message-ID: <1Cyd9.132335$kp.762352@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net>   Oh hey!  This is neet.   Can this run VMS 7.2?pG "Stanley Reynolds" <nospam_stanley_reynolds@yahoo.com> wrote in message 7 news:pSxd9.400$%P6.18738@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com...eL Sorry I didn't understand your question the yes was for a real 3900. Look at
 netbsd/vax ata, www.netbsd.org/Ports/vax/emulator-howto.html   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:12:50 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>rA Subject: Re: Size of I/O count fields in SHOW PROC and SHOW SYS ?M' Message-ID: <3D76C2F6.A36DDE25@fsi.net>y   Barry Kierstein wrote: > C > Which fields are you refering to?  I'd like to check into this...s > " > Barry Kierstein, AM/DECamds team& > ====================================; > "Paul Repacholi" <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote in message-) > news:878z2qde1o.fsf@prep.synonet.com...-7 > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:V > >QJ > > > Interesting question. I would expect it to just quietly overflow andG > > > roll back around to zero like DCL does in the following, but thatn  > > > may be a brash assumption: > > C > > Or, as the AMDS NISCS stuff does, go negative then wrap around.M  : I think the behavior Paul cites can be illustrated in DCL:  ! DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = %x7fffffff  DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym a 6   A = 2147483647   Hex = 7FFFFFFF  Octal = 17777777777 DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = a + 1 DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym ae7   A = -2147483648   Hex = 80000000  Octal = 20000000000P DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = a + 1 DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym ao7   A = -2147483647   Hex = 80000001  Octal = 20000000001g" DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = %xffffffff  DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym aa.   A = -1   Hex = FFFFFFFF  Octal = 37777777777/ DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say f$fao( "!UL !SL", a, a )o
 4294967295 -1  DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = a + 1/ DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say f$fao( "!UL !SL", a, a )r 0 0e DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym ae-   A = 0   Hex = 00000000  Octal = 00000000000o  7 DCL deals in longwords, treated as signed "by default".d   -- o David J. Dachteraf dba DJE Systemso http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 11:47:03 -0700>1 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)1+ Subject: Re: Storageworks paritioned drivese< Message-ID: <cf15391e.0209041047.63755fa@posting.google.com>  U Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> wrote in message news:<3D75A82C.8112C78F@cha.ab.ca>...0E > I will soon be installing some Storageworks 18GB drives.  I want to:J > partition these drives into smaller ones and use them for shadowing withH > existing 4.3GB and 9.1GB drives..  For example, four 4.3GB, two 9.1GB,G > or one 9.1GB and two 4.3GB.  Is anyone using these partitioned drives H > for HBVS?  Is their behaviour the same as true 4.3GB and 9.1Gb drives?B > HP Support says VMS 7.3 and 7.3-1 should allow this type of disk > partitioning.   > A very important piece of information missing from the problem1 statement is the type of HSx controller involved.   C If you have HSJ controllers, there is no problem with shadowing ands multiple partitions on drives.  B If you have HSZ or HSG controllers, then the concerns expressed by@ other noters apply (you can shadow one partition, but not shadowE multiple partitions on the same dtive at the same time).  The ReleasesE Notes for 7.3-1 indicate this restriction is lifted for 7.3-1.  It ise NOT fixed in 7.3.@. ----------------------------------------------. Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:23:10 -0600h$ From: Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca>+ Subject: Re: Storageworks paritioned drives ) Message-ID: <3D766BAD.B129FEE4@cha.ab.ca>m  V So sorry.  I am using HSJ50 disk controllers (v52J).  Do HSJ40 controllers (v37J) have  the multi-partitioning facility?  W Warning: Yesterday, we had the HP FE try to connect a used third party HSJ50 controller-Y (v57J) to the production CI.  All hell broke loose.  Two nodes crashed and all the shadoweQ members at the site dropped.  Fortunately, three production nodes remained up andrP continued servicing the clients.  HP SE suspect the HSJ50 to be the cause of theW problem.  I have been shadow copying since yesterday and the cluster is now almost backfS to normal status.  HBVS saved the day.  We didn't lose any of the shadow sets, evenl. though they were reduced to one-member status.  W I have heard from just one party so far about multi-partitioning experience (on an HSG)f and it was positive.    Thanks to all for their replies.     Keith Parris wrote:   W > Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> wrote in message news:<3D75A82C.8112C78F@cha.ab.ca>...tG > > I will soon be installing some Storageworks 18GB drives.  I want torL > > partition these drives into smaller ones and use them for shadowing withJ > > existing 4.3GB and 9.1GB drives..  For example, four 4.3GB, two 9.1GB,I > > or one 9.1GB and two 4.3GB.  Is anyone using these partitioned driveseJ > > for HBVS?  Is their behaviour the same as true 4.3GB and 9.1Gb drives?D > > HP Support says VMS 7.3 and 7.3-1 should allow this type of disk > > partitioning.< >r@ > A very important piece of information missing from the problem3 > statement is the type of HSx controller involved.3 >$E > If you have HSJ controllers, there is no problem with shadowing andn  > multiple partitions on drives. >1D > If you have HSZ or HSG controllers, then the concerns expressed byB > other noters apply (you can shadow one partition, but not shadowG > multiple partitions on the same dtive at the same time).  The ReleaseoG > Notes for 7.3-1 indicate this restriction is lifted for 7.3-1.  It ise > NOT fixed in 7.3.r0 > ----------------------------------------------0 > Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org   -- Lee-  ; Lee Y T Mah                        Capital Health Authorityy? Email: lytmah@cha.ab.ca            Information Systems, RAH CSCt4 Phone:  (780) 477-4725, 477-4233   10240 Kingsway NW? Fax:      (780) 491-5119, 491-5619    Edmonton, AB, CAN  T5H3V9t   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 20:51:04 -0700.1 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)6+ Subject: Re: Storageworks paritioned drivess= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0209041951.13dedb49@posting.google.com>.  U Lee Y T Mah <lytmah@cha.ab.ca> wrote in message news:<3D766BAD.B129FEE4@cha.ab.ca>...y > So sorry.a  D No apology necessary.  I was just alarmed that we in the group mightB be making an incorrect diagnosis based on a wrong assumption aboutD your configuration.  I didn't mean to chide you about your note, andC it obviously came across that way, so now it's me that is sorry.  Ii: should have simply asked what type of controllers you had.  M > I am using HSJ50 disk controllers (v52J).  Do HSJ40 controllers (v37J) havee" > the multi-partitioning facility?  @ I first used partitioning with HSJ50s.  I don't think the HSJ40s7 supported it.  HSJ50s could have up to 4 partitions pero# storageset/disk; HSJ80s can have 8.t  Y > Warning: Yesterday, we had the HP FE try to connect a used third party HSJ50 controller2[ > (v57J) to the production CI.  All h--l broke loose.  Two nodes crashed and all the shadowaS > members at the site dropped.  Fortunately, three production nodes remained up andoR > continued servicing the clients.  HP SE suspect the HSJ50 to be the cause of the
 > problem.  < Symptoms sound like a CI addresssing conflict or something. E Arbitration (16 or 32 maximum nodes, and synchronous vs. asynchronousiB arbitrtion) might also be an issue.  Although the newly-introduced> HSJ50 is the primary suspect, don't rule out a problem with anD existing CI adapter (perhaps it is faulty and answers to multiple CIF IDs, which happen to include the one you set up the new HSJ50 for).  IC experienced similar symptoms in a CI configuration at E*Trade years 9 ago, and would be happy to compare notes with your HP FE.i. ----------------------------------------------. Keith Parris | parris at encompasserve dot org   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 20:08:38 GMTi0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question2 Message-ID: <aLtd9.45$VN6.744558@news.cpqcorp.net>  	 >This wasI> > the TCPIP 5.0-9 which came with the hobbyist package on VAX.  K That explains the route differences.  In V5.1 the localhost interface routehJ was added as a performance optimisation.  You can certainly do without it.G I should have asked what version you were using.  I don't have a V5.0-9y= system handy to check why the network route may not be added..  / > laptops on the beach ???? :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)/$ > Is Gold Coast an actual locality ?  B It is the city of the Gold Coast. http://www.goldcoast.qld.gov.au/  , >I thought it denoted the regions made up ofL > many localities such as Coolangatta, Surfers Paradise and the many beaches in4 > between ? (is SOuthport included in Gold Coast ?).  H Yep as well as suburbs stretching west (inland).  That's the city thing.I Southport is a very nice beach suburb just North of me.  Worth a visit if  you haven't already.   Matt.i   --= -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Company  Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA = -------------------------------------------------------------     : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D75394D.B80A264F@videotron.ca... > Matt Muggeridge wrote:K > > However, you should have automatic routes configured when you configuren yourH > > interface.  The automatic routes point to themselves.  For instance, yourF > > 10.0.0.10 interface ought to have the following associated routes: > > $ > >     Type   Destination   Gateway% > >     AN    10.0.0.0/16   10.0.0.10s& > >     AH    10.0.0.10      10.0.0.10 >r/ > > Neither of these exist.  Were they removed?n >MH > Nop. as a matter of fact, on VELO, I just installed TCPIP services and justH > put my router (10.0.0.1) as default gateway, and the TCPIP$CONFIG just setup 2iL > routes, the one to the router, and the loopback 127.0.0.1 to itself.  This wast> > the TCPIP 5.0-9 which came with the hobbyist package on VAX. >lK > I can understand the first AN route, telling it to route anything for the D > 10.0.0.* subnet through the interface bearing IP address 10.0.0.10 >t- > But what does the second route accomplish ?n >n > > OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering > > Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAl > / > laptops on the beach ???? :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) J > Is Gold Coast an actual locality ? I thought it denoted the regions made up of L > many localities such as Coolangatta, Surfers Paradise and the many beaches in4 > between ? (is SOuthport included in Gold Coast ?).   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 20:14:05 GMTI0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question2 Message-ID: <hQtd9.46$6H6.606239@news.cpqcorp.net>  F > But lets suppose I had 5000 VMS nodes. Isn't there a way for VELO to	 advertisehK > that it serves as gateway to the [PSION] subnet to all others on the lan,eF > which would save me from having to define routes to [PSION] in every	 machine ?h  L Your network administrator would never allow their routing infrastructure toK be compromised with a 10.x.x.x network address which points to your router.nL If you want to be part of the larger network you will have to obtain a fully, routable IP address from your network admin.   Matt.  --= -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companyg Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAo= -------------------------------------------------------------     : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D75CFFC.FD22F0A8@videotron.ca... > John Santos wrote: > > >  Interface: SE0sE > > >    IP_Addr: 10.0.0.10         NETWRK: 255.255.255.240   BRDCST: 
 10.0.0.255 > >cC > > Broadcast should be "all ones" in the current subnet: 10.0.0.15a >nJ > Thanks. That was a setting that dated from when I had set my subnet mask toL > 255.255.255.0, but later I reduced it to .240 to isolate one node that had > been set higher. > C > > the router.  The router has to know about this path, of course.d >oK > I added a route to the router to reach the 10.1.*.* network via 10.0.0.11f andeK > that seemed to greatly improve things. My PSION can now traceroute to the # > outside of my lan via the router.- >rH > My problems is now one of data corruption/flow control. For short data burstsL > like a DNS query, it works fine, but for a web page or long email message, thetK > PSION really seems to get confused and cut off the link when it gets muchMK > stuff. And interestingly, the remote end still thinks it is connected andaK > attempst to resend the stuff as soon as the psion comes back on-line, buto itK > no longer has that port/socket opened and gets more confused :-)  I thinky it' > might be a limitation of slip though.  > L > Tomorrow, I will remove the decconnect cord and plugs and set the cable toJ > full modem control so that I can implement hardware RTS/CTS flow control  > between the PSION and the VAX. >aI > > (I think through thread drift and snippage, we have lost the originaluI > > configuration.  IIRC, you have a router (ROUTER1) and two VMS systemsbG > > (BIKE and VELO) on an ethernet, and a 3rd system (???) connected to 4 > > one of BIKE or VELO via SLIP on a serial line... >c > That is correct. >          [PSION] >             | / >  [MAC]   [VELO]   [BIKE]   [ROUTER1]   [IMAC]r, >    +--------+--------+--------+----------+ >n >.E > Now, another question. I manually added a route on ROUTER1 to allowa trafficr1 > from there to know how to reach PSION via VELO.e >lF > But lets suppose I had 5000 VMS nodes. Isn't there a way for VELO to	 advertiseaK > that it serves as gateway to the [PSION] subnet to all others on the lan,/F > which would save me from having to define routes to [PSION] in every	 machine ?  >h > L > Also, since the MACs don't have routing tables, what would be the strategy toJ > employ for VELO to tell the MAC and IMAC how to reach PSION ? The manual talksjL > about faking an ARP containing the IP address of the PSION pointing to the; > ethernet address of VELO (the gateway). Is that correct ?t   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:37:09 -0400o- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>a* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question, Message-ID: <3D767CF7.AEDE81EF@videotron.ca>   Matt Muggeridge wrote:D > It is the city of the Gold Coast. http://www.goldcoast.qld.gov.au/  K Ok, so it is more of a legal combination of all the localities. I knew GolddN Coast represented a region, but wasn't aware that the region had been combined into a single city.   K > Southport is a very nice beach suburb just North of me.  Worth a visit ifS > you haven't already.  H Been there, done that back in 1997, by pushbike nonetheless. I found the? beaches south of surfers paradise to be nicer and less crowded.n  M So, do you have ocean view from your office ? Go surfing for lunch ?  Work in3J your bathers with the secretaries in their bikinis ?  Is there sand on the- floor instead of carpeting ?  :-) ;-) ;-) ;-)4   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:27:15 -0400@- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>s* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question, Message-ID: <3D767AA6.9C52733A@videotron.ca>   Matt Muggeridge wrote:N > Your network administrator would never allow their routing infrastructure toM > be compromised with a 10.x.x.x network address which points to your router.a  M But I am the network admin :-( My ISP refuses to grant static IP adresses, soo I must live behind a NAT wall.  G However, this brings up interesting question: does my use of a 10.*.*.* K address space result in some of the VMS software deciding not to route it ?r@ (for instance between the SLIP interface and the ethernet lan) ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 21:48:24 GMT-0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question2 Message-ID: <Icvd9.47$eN6.729231@news.cpqcorp.net>  J > Been there, done that back in 1997, by pushbike nonetheless. I found theA > beaches south of surfers paradise to be nicer and less crowded.o   Yep, me too.  L > So, do you have ocean view from your office ? Go surfing for lunch ?  Work inL > your bathers with the secretaries in their bikinis ?  Is there sand on the/ > floor instead of carpeting ?  :-) ;-) ;-) ;-)-  J Yes, t al of th abve ... I hate it when sand gets stuck in my keyboard :-)   Matt.d   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 02:12:47 GMTC- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>5* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question* Message-ID: <3D76B8B6.8050407@qsl.network>   JF Mezei wrote:. > Matt Muggeridge wrote: > N >>Your network administrator would never allow their routing infrastructure toM >>be compromised with a 10.x.x.x network address which points to your router.  > O > But I am the network admin :-( My ISP refuses to grant static IP adresses, sos  > I must live behind a NAT wall. > I > However, this brings up interesting question: does my use of a 10.*.*.*nM > address space result in some of the VMS software deciding not to route it ? B > (for instance between the SLIP interface and the ethernet lan) ?  F I am not aware of any limitation in OpenVMS or TCPIP services in this  regard.:  F However, your node that is going through SLIP will not be able to get I through your NAT device, unless you can specify a manual route from your 4; NAT device for the I.P. address assigned to your SLIP node.R  D With most commercial NAT firewalls available for home consumer use, ) there is no way to enter in such a route.T   -John% wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 19:43:08 -0400  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question4 Message-ID: <1020904184445.416A-100000@Ives.egh.com>  # On Wed, 4 Sep 2002, JF Mezei wrote:0   > John Santos wrote:   [snip]  I > > (I think through thread drift and snippage, we have lost the originaltI > > configuration.  IIRC, you have a router (ROUTER1) and two VMS systemsnG > > (BIKE and VELO) on an ethernet, and a 3rd system (???) connected to-5 > > one of BIKE or VELO via SLIP on a serial line... t >  > That is correct.   >          [PSION] >             |o/ >  [MAC]   [VELO]   [BIKE]   [ROUTER1]   [IMAC]9, >    +--------+--------+--------+----------+ >  > M > Now, another question. I manually added a route on ROUTER1 to allow trafficl1 > from there to know how to reach PSION via VELO.   G This is where the ICMP redirects come in.  If, e.g. IMAC1 wants to talkdC to PSION, it will send its first packet to ROUTER1.  ROUTER1 should3C forward the packet to VELO, and also send an ICMP redirect to IMAC,pB telling it to send stuff destined to PSION directly to VELO.  (I'mE not sure this works if IMAC and VELO are on separate subnets, though.lA If that's the case, it may be that ROUTER1 has to forward all the E packets.  Someone with better understanding of IP routing should knowr
 for sure.)   > P > But lets suppose I had 5000 VMS nodes. Isn't there a way for VELO to advertiseK > that it serves as gateway to the [PSION] subnet to all others on the lan, P > which would save me from having to define routes to [PSION] in every machine ?  J That's what routing protocols (RIP, EGP, BGP, etc., etc. do.)  I've looked1 at these a little bit, but it makes my head hurt.-  G Usually, even if there are 5000 nodes, the vast majority are end nodes,-F and they just need to talk to one router, which handles everything forG it.  If there are only a small number of routers, you can set up static : routes in all of them (but make sure they are consistant!)  A A useful thing here might be DHCP.  This is often used to provides@ addresses to PC clients out of a pool, but is much more powerful@ than that.  You can configure a DHCP server with the MAC addressB (ethernet address, nothing to do with Apples :-) and IP address of> each system, so each system will always have the same address.? Then add the IP address and host name to the master DNS server.,  D (Microsoft wants to use a pool of addresses and then use Dynamic DNSD to tell the world which IP address a particular PC actually ended upA with.  This is easier to configure, but this seems to me to be ancD enourmous security hole.  Nothing stops a PC from lying and spoofingG another system.  For some reason, it is the DHCP *client* that tries toaB tell the DNS server what its name and IP address are.  It would beC much better if the DHCP *SERVER* told the DNS server what was goinglA on, but for some reason they don't do it this way.  I think it isw@ much safer, though a little more work, to use static addresses.)  D Then configure each system to obtain its network info automatically.A When it boots (or when TCP/IP starts up), the DHCP client sends ah< broadcast message on the ethernet looking for a DHCP server.? TCP/IP isn't running yet - this is just a raw ethernet message.tD The DHCP server responds telling it what IP address and network maskH to use, what router to use, the DNS server addresses, etc.  TCPWare V5.5A or later can do this.  I'm pretty sure Multinet must have it too.aG I think the latest UCX (TCPIP V5.3) can also function as a DHCP client.   D DHCP server capability has been built into all the VMS TCP/IP stacks> for years.  So has DNS server.  So you can keep both your host databases on a VMS system.  O > Also, since the MACs don't have routing tables, what would be the strategy todP > employ for VELO to tell the MAC and IMAC how to reach PSION ? The manual talksL > about faking an ARP containing the IP address of the PSION pointing to the; > ethernet address of VELO (the gateway). Is that correct ?-  ? I don't know how a MAC could *not* have a routing table.  I cansB believe that it isn't accessible, and only has a default route (to< the local router) and whatever dynamic routes it obtains via? ICMP redirects.  Maybe it is permitted in TCP/IP to always send0> everything to a router, and ignore the redirects?  It would beB less efficient, but everything should eventually get to the PSION.  E An ARP packet is a way of obtaining an ethernet address correspondingjA to a particular IP address.  I guess it is an alternative to ICMP9@ redirects for telling a host the best route to another host, butC only works on a LAN.  I'm not sure if the ARP info is kept separaterE from the normal routing info.  (Maybe at a lower layer in the stack?)mB To run TCP/IP over ethernet, you have to be able to understand ARPB packets, at least to the extent of recognizing the ARP packet fromC your router, so you can send stuff to it.  You also need to be ablerD to generate an ARP packet, so your router can find you.  So the MacsB must have at least this much capability.  Some routers are capableB of generating ARP packets for hosts that they connect to.  TCPWareB has an "ADD ARP" command that may be the right thing for this, butA I've never had to use it.  Just looked at my TCPIP system, and itaD has an arp command that seems to do just this.  "UCX arp -s hostnameE hardware-address pub" (where hardware-address is the ethernet addressl> in hex with : between each pair of digits, and "pub" is a flag@ meaning to publish the address, i.e. send ARP packets for it.  IC think since VELO is routing packets to PSION which doesn't have its C own ethernet address, you would want to use VELO's ethernet addresss@ as the hardware-address, but PSION's name (or IP address) as the
 host name.  B BTW, OS X is Unix (BSD?) inside, and I'm sure it must have all the, network features of a real operating system.   -- o John Santosa Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 22:22:12 -0400u- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>i* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question, Message-ID: <3D76BFCE.41FC0AA4@videotron.ca>   John Santos wrote:I > This is where the ICMP redirects come in.  If, e.g. IMAC1 wants to talkeE > to PSION, it will send its first packet to ROUTER1.  ROUTER1 should E > forward the packet to VELO, and also send an ICMP redirect to IMAC,>? > telling it to send stuff destined to PSION directly to VELO. 4  H Yeah, yesterday I went into the router and changed a few things, such as7 enabling RIP-v2, setting a route to PSION via VELO etc.t  K It is interesting how many little things I had "wrong", yet for my previousn setup, things worked well.  % > A useful thing here might be DHCP. e  M I have the DHCP server on VMS setup, but I don't enable it. It is much easier J when all machines have fixed adresses. But I realise that if I had a largeI fleet of machines to support, then DHCP would become useful to distribute C uptodate configurations to machines (such as dns server adresses).    L What I have not seen though is dynamic updates to the DNS server by the DHCPI server or other method. I know that if I change the DNS config, I have to?M TCPIP SET NAME_SERVER/INIT to make the changes become known. Has that changed  with more recent versions ?h  A > I don't know how a MAC could *not* have a routing table.  I can A > believe that it isn't accessible, and only has a default route -  M Yes, it has the "gateway" address. (eg: default route for anything outside of K the subnet). But I don't know of any real route. The TCPIP stack on earlied- MAC OS was very simplistic.e  G > An ARP packet is a way of obtaining an ethernet address correspondingF > to a particular IP address.   N The TCPIP manual mentions it should be possible to get VELO to make a "public"M ARP that points the ip address of the PSION to the ethernet address of VELO. sH But since PSION is in a different subnet, I wonder if the mac would justM automartically send it to the router and ignore an arp that doesn't belong to1 the same subnet as itself.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:27:46 -0400v- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>I* Subject: Re: TCPIP services: SLIP question, Message-ID: <3D76CF2D.5E9A9C77@videotron.ca>   "John E. Malmberg" wrote:uE > With most commercial NAT firewalls available for home consumer use,s+ > there is no way to enter in such a route.e  F Then I am lucky. My netgear RT314 has telnet and serial port access to2 "command line" and an option to add static routes.  K This is not available from the web based configuration menus (which I nevere
 use anyways).u   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:28:58 -0400A- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>- Subject: Re: TCPTRACEo, Message-ID: <3D7650E6.CD929FC5@videotron.ca>   Tom Linden wrote:o > A > I am being bombarded on the ftp server, running hgftp, tcpip5.1yD > under 7.3.  I need to turn on TCPTRACE to track down the culprits.: > What all options do I need to supply to gather the info?     $ HELP TCPTRACEt$ $ @SYS$MANAGER:TCPIP$DEFINE_COMMANDS $ TCPTRACE host/port=21i  N where host is the IP address of the target host. Make sure you run this on theM machine that has the ftp server other machines may not see the traffic. (doesh% TCPTRACE get into promiscuous mode ?)s  N If you have a router for incoming calls, you might also think about having theF router generate syslog entries for each call attempt to port 21 (ftp).   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 14:13:09 -0400n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>f> Subject: Re: VMS and HP (Was Re: Some interesting Linux Press), Message-ID: <3D764D32.AF22E320@videotron.ca>   Alan Greig wrote: D > > HP-3000 machines.  HP eventually provided the necessary APIs for= > > HP-UX and encouraged the migration of customers to HP_UX.a  C > It's not surprising you believe this but its not what HP tell VMS- > customers.  M Remember Scott Stallard's memo ? That made it very clear that HP would expect I (and later revised to "help") VMS customer to migrate to HP-UX. I haven'ta4 checked what the text has been changed to this week.  L HP may not care about what the many outside the circle of the few very largeN and important customers think. HP may be focused only on keeping the remainingK VMS large customers who generate the profits. But the bad image that existsiL outside of that circle will make it very very hard for HP if it ever decides9 to grow VMS and get non trivial amounts of new customers.   G > The costs of the VMS migration had nothing to do with it. VMS was andf- > remains an *extremely* profitable division..    M But the Winklers and Capellas of HP are probably equipped with charts showingyN that in the long term, VMS will stop being profitable through attrition of theM remaining customer base and as a result, investing time , energy and money intN VMS is pointless. In other words, once they have conviced the power of HP thatL the demise of VMS is inevitable and the best that can be done is to lengthen; the time where VMS generate profits, then all bets are off.k      E > > VMS support was grandfathered into the DEC/Compaq merger, but mayfF > > have been less critical in the Compaq/HP merger.  To HP, VMS isn'tG > > a strategic product, and represents a substantial expense with veryo& > > little hope of significant return. > 0 > Again not true but no surprise you think this.  M On the other hand, the fact that Compaq/HP refuses to publicly state that VMStI is a very profitable product does give them the flexibility to kill it atwN their own leasure, just as they did with Alpha.  Consider that the beloved SueG isn't allowed to talk publicly about anything financial related to VMS.t     Someone else wrote:[C > > Unless VMS customer suddenly perk up and start ordering massiveM> > > quantities of new machines to replace or upgrade their oldB > > machines, it's unlikely that HP will spend the $4-5 billion it/ > > would cost to retool VMS to Merced/Itanium.   L The port is paid largely by Intel in exchange for Compaq murdering Alpha andM donating its remains and slaves to Intel. So to Compaq/HP, the port of VMS ish
 a freebie.  N Now, had there not been a big incentive from Intel, would Compaq have investedK the time/money into porting VMS to IA64  ?  I am not certain it would have.b   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 21:39:10 GMTt2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: VMS for i86* Message-ID: <al5uhu$h94$7@web1.cup.hp.com>  l In article <672067e5.0208302257.6865da60@posting.google.com>, depaula@praxitek.com (Carlos de Paula) writes:> :Does anybody know if there is a VMS (small version) for IntelD :plataforms. I would like to play with it. Where can I get a copy of :it?  I   There is no version of OpenVMS for Intel IA-32 (Pentium, etc) systems.  E   There are VAX emulators around, and some of these operate on IA-32.aE   For details on the VAX emulators and for information on the OpenVMSu8   Hobbyist program licenses, please see the OpenVMS FAQ.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 03:26:54 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ( Subject: Re: VMS Printing To CA/Dispatch' Message-ID: <3D76D454.4EF900B0@fsi.net>1   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > m > In article <1ef525c1.0209040737.4f1770b0@posting.google.com>, ghairst@mcvh-vcu.edu (G. W. Hairston) writes:nH > > Currently we are looking at taking multiple vms reports from the vms? > > systems over to mvs system and storing them in CA/Dispatch.x > >nD > > How can we retrived the reports from dispatch and send them to a' > > printer on the vms system directly.P > G > I am fairly certain one of the SNA Gateway products from DEC providede: > printing straight from MVS to a printer attached to VMS.  A IIRC, this required the SNA/PrE (Printer Emulation) product, or ai) printer stream of an SNA/RJE workstation.e   --   David J. Dachtera- dba DJE Systems- http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/:   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 05:08:22 GMT.1 From: "C.W.Holeman II" <cwhii5@Julian5Locals.com>7F Subject: Who are the largest VMS customers. Top ten? (Was: VMS and HP)D Message-ID: <aFBd9.8528$LI2.565066@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>   JF Mezei wrote:o  H > HP may not care about what the many outside the circle of the few veryL > large and important customers think. HP may be focused only on keeping the: > remaining VMS large customers who generate the profits.   + Who are the largest VMS customers. Top ten?    -- - C.W.Holeman II cwhii5@Julian5Locals.com remove the fives http://also.as/cwhii   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 20:05:44 +0200 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com>eI Subject: Re: XFC V2.0 and VDDRIVER (was: RE: XFC v2 ECO, negative report)a' Message-ID: <3D764B78.41FD29CD@aaa.com>e  C Glenn Everhart posted some updates to VDdriver just a few hours agorC (in "VDdriver_64 synch bug" thread), but I saw no ref to XFC there.i! Might have been some other bug...e   Jan-Erik Sderholm.    Hoff Hoffman wrote:  >  > 2 >   The investigational theory has been confirmed. > J >   XFC has exposed a latent bug within the Freeware VDDRIVER Virtual Disk >   package    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2002 17:40:15 GMT 2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)I Subject: Re: XFC V2.0 and VDDRIVER (was: RE: XFC v2 ECO, negative report) * Message-ID: <al5ghv$h94$1@web1.cup.hp.com>  _ In article <akdscj$pfq$2@web1.cup.hp.com>, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:   K :  As mentioned earlier, this appears to be an adverse reaction between thesK :  XFC V2.0 baselevel and the use of inner-mode driver-level APIs within a iK :  site-locally-supported privileged-mode software component.  The initial 8L :  investigation points to a potential "disagreement" within the kernel-modeI :  I/O completion path of this privileged-mode code within the context ofeK :  XFC, but (as noted in my earlier posting) we've not yet duplicated this r- :  particular problem within the OpenVMS lab.e    0   The investigational theory has been confirmed.  H   XFC has exposed a latent bug within the Freeware VDDRIVER Virtual DiskJ   package -- the particular customer site that initially reported this wasI   making very heavy use of VDDRIVER-based disks.  OpenVMS Engineering has K   also subsequently duplicated the crashes and the hangs that were reported-K   by the customer site, using some existing I/O diagnostic applications andnI   DECram-based VDDRIVERs.  (Please don't think too much or too hard aboutO7   that I/O configuration, it was only for testing.  :-)   K   The details of the bug: VDDRIVER was (incorrectly) not holding the deviceEM   lock when it called REQCOM, and, well, things got ugly -- hangs and crashespL   are to be expected when a device I/O queue becomes corrupted.  (One of theK   bugchecks that has been seen: an INVEXCEPTN at IOC_STD$REQCOM_C+00198.)     K   The presence of XFC changed clearly the timings enough to expose this bugtJ   in VDDRIVER.  I'm told there should be a fix for VDDRIVER made availableJ   -- the maintainer of XFC here in OpenVMS Engineering have been in directI   contact with the maintainer of the VDDRIVER package -- but I don't havehF   a schedule for the release of the updated VDDRIVER.  (Nor is OpenVMS<   Engineering in a position to support VDDRIVER, of course.)  J   If you have VDDRIVER in (heavy) use (particularly) on OpenVMS Alpha V7.3J   or later, I would encourage disabling VDDRIVER pending the resolution ofI   this bug.  Other potential options -- including disabling XFC entirely, G   or a MOUNT/NOCACHE on the VDDRIVER devices -- might well be possible,i5   but these are neither tested or certain to funtion.   I   The OpenVMS Freeware package LD (LDDRIVER) is an available alternative,oH   pending resolution.  (LDDRIVER does handle the device locks around the:   REQCOM call correctly -- the XFC maintainer checked. :-)    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------N       For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.openvms.compaq.com    N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.489 ************************