1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 08 Sep 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 495       Contents:# Re: Cancelling writes to a log file  Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB% Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK 4 DECwindows X11 display server: creating visuals - Re Re: How to create Sys$BATCH  Re: ImageMagick freeware= Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS! = Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS! = Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS! = Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS! = Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS! 8 Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!8 Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns! Re: The Gauntlet is Cast! A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on K Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on  OpenVMS? - Re: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha - RE: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha - Re: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha < Re: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha, RISC and IDE?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 7 Sep 02 20:14:14 +0200 ) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) , Subject: Re: Cancelling writes to a log file) Message-ID: <nQZ+2OIbGTfz@elias.decus.ch>   a In article <unjvn8ps9gbi45@corp.supernews.com>, Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> writes: , > Paul Sture <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote:E > : On a system I worked on many moons ago, transaction commits were  C > : single threaded within the activity log so that all updates for B > : a transaction were grouped together in the log - i.e. only oneC > : user at a time was writing to the log. In the event of a system B > : crash, the recovery system only had to deal with what had beenA > : the current transaction at the time of the crash (assuming no * > : disks had been lost due to the crash). > / > Does the company sell online lottery systems?   @ No. I believe that software is still alive somewhere, but I haveB no idea if the lotteries use it. They may of course have recruitedD some of my ex-colleagues or customers and written their own version. I honestly don't know.  ? A pity, I used to enjoy doing that stuff and getting it right.   __
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 14:03:30 -0400 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB , Message-ID: <3D7A3F72.2030903@tsoft-inc.com>   David J. Dachtera wrote:   > David Froble wrote:  >  >>David J. Dachtera wrote: >> >> >>>Brian Tillman wrote:  >>>  >>> I >>>>>I checked the faq and it doesn't mention how to do this.  Is there a G >>>>>simple way to convert the block figures I get when I do a "dir" to ( >>>>>megabytes which is the way I think? >>>>>  >>>>> J >>>>Since each block is 0.5K, the arithmetic is straight forward.  A closeJ >>>>approximation is to divide the number of blocks by 2000 and that's the9 >>>>megabytes.  For example, 2000 blocks is one megabyte.  >>>> >>>> >>>Oops! Try again!  >>> % >>>DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 1024 * 1024 
 >>>1048576$ >>>DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 512 * 2048
 >>>1048576 >>> I >>>A megabyte is 2048 blocks, not 2000. Remember: machines deal in powers 9 >>>of two, REGARDLESS of what the disk salesmen tell you!  >>> F >>>Remember also that 1K = 1024 bytes. Therefore, 0.5K = 512 bytes = 1$ >>>block (one track for one sector). >>>  >>>  >>> R >>Sorry, I'll go with Brian on this one.  Remember, he said "close approximation",O >>and dividing by 2000 will get you close.  With people using x.xx GB, and many I >>times ignoring the fractional part of the number, close seems to be Ok.  >>O >>Gee, is this the same Dave that was talking about precision and accuracy last  >>evening?  :-)  >> > $ > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 200000/2048 > 97" > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 50000/512 > 97 > " > WOW!!! 3% error in both cases!!! > F > If that's "close" to you, I'd avoid working in either the financial,7 > healthcare or scientific industries, if I were you...  >  > ...just a thought. ;-)    P When I'm counting money, I'm precise to 3 digits after the decimal point.  When S I'm looking at free space on disks, I'm looking at percentages, to the nearest 10%.   " Try to keep things is perspective.   Dave   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 15:07:49 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB , Message-ID: <3D7A4E7C.DE8D6205@videotron.ca>   David Froble wrote: L > When I'm counting money, I'm precise to 3 digits after the decimal point.   I You wouldn't be comfortable in civilised countries like Australia and New N Zealand where they round off cents to the nearest 5 cent at the store. (eg: ifG something costs $1.03, you pay $1.05). There are no pennies left there.   A (ok, when you pay with eftpos, they take off the right amount...)   N For large funds transfers, 3 decimals aren't even enough. Can't remember if it was 4 or 6 decimals.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 22:12:45 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB ' Message-ID: <3D7A7F3A.2C1C85FD@fsi.net>    David Froble wrote:  >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: >  > > David Froble wrote:  > >  > >>David J. Dachtera wrote: > >> > >> > >>>Brian Tillman wrote:  > >>>  > >>> K > >>>>>I checked the faq and it doesn't mention how to do this.  Is there a I > >>>>>simple way to convert the block figures I get when I do a "dir" to * > >>>>>megabytes which is the way I think? > >>>>>  > >>>>> L > >>>>Since each block is 0.5K, the arithmetic is straight forward.  A closeL > >>>>approximation is to divide the number of blocks by 2000 and that's the; > >>>>megabytes.  For example, 2000 blocks is one megabyte.  > >>>> > >>>> > >>>Oops! Try again!  > >>> ' > >>>DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 1024 * 1024  > >>>1048576& > >>>DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 512 * 2048 > >>>1048576 > >>> K > >>>A megabyte is 2048 blocks, not 2000. Remember: machines deal in powers ; > >>>of two, REGARDLESS of what the disk salesmen tell you!  > >>> H > >>>Remember also that 1K = 1024 bytes. Therefore, 0.5K = 512 bytes = 1& > >>>block (one track for one sector). > >>>  > >>>  > >>> T > >>Sorry, I'll go with Brian on this one.  Remember, he said "close approximation",Q > >>and dividing by 2000 will get you close.  With people using x.xx GB, and many K > >>times ignoring the fractional part of the number, close seems to be Ok.  > >>Q > >>Gee, is this the same Dave that was talking about precision and accuracy last  > >>evening?  :-)  > >> > > & > > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 200000/2048 > > 97$ > > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ say 50000/512 > > 97 > > $ > > WOW!!! 3% error in both cases!!! > > H > > If that's "close" to you, I'd avoid working in either the financial,9 > > healthcare or scientific industries, if I were you...  > >  > > ...just a thought. ;-) > Q > When I'm counting money, I'm precise to 3 digits after the decimal point.  When U > I'm looking at free space on disks, I'm looking at percentages, to the nearest 10%.  > $ > Try to keep things is perspective.   Sure:    Q: What's 3% of a terabyte?   ( A: Roughly equivalent to 28 or so RZ26s.  E Looks like we'll have to keep a sharper eye on our powers of two, eh?   G Case study: At work, the GS160s can "see" some 3.74TB, which in reality H is closer to 7.5 by time you construct all the raid- and shadow-sets andB non-redundant volumes. One 36GB volume would be enough to hold theF entire "copy of production" code warehouse plus about half of the test	 database.   F Thanx, but I'll stick to powers-of-two until the budget "fist" loosens' up a bit. 36GB disks aren't THAT cheap!    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 00:10:48 GMT ! From: Andy <acs@fcgnet.works.net> . Subject: Re: Copy of OpenVMS hobbyist CD in UK> Message-ID: <Xns9282CCF6D3727acsfcgnetworksnet@216.166.71.232>  ? "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> enlightened us with   news:3D795FC6.1D42D3E6@fsi.net:    > Larry Kilgallen wrote: >>  7 >> In article <3d78b4a5$1@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" 1 >> <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:  > >> >>As an additional alternateive the dd command seemed quite3 >> >>functional on Mac OS X the last time I used it  >> > ...snip... > >> >>Sure it's a command line program but I don't think anyone) >> >>"here" is afraid of such things :-).  >> >B >> > Well, I learned something new today.  I had no idea you would( >> > even _get_ a command line on a Mac. >>  9 >> Mac OS X is not the old secure MacOS we know and love.  >>  < >> It a variation of Unix with the Macintosh UI glued on the
 >> front.  > ? > I'm told that it's built on a FreeBSD kernel. Dunno if that's  > true or not... > > Those who don't know, really care, and want to be informed can check out:    3     	http://developer.apple.com/darwin/history.html   / (Which is where I'm getting the following info)    Roughly speaking....  > Mac OS X = Darwin (Apple's open sourced OS) + the Aqua GUI (toB make it look almost like a traditional Mac) + a bunch of tradionalC Mac compatibility features so it can run older Macintosh software.  ) (And the developer tools come with it...)   A Darwin = the Mach 3.0 microkernel + Apple's customized version of A the 4.4 BSD-Lite2 kernel and userspace. Darwin has been ported to 9 Intel (but not Auqa or any of the Mac specific features)    5 All of which is a vague descendant of NextStep. Or to ; put it more apptly... Mac OS X looks like what would happen @ if you left NextStep and Mac OS too long together in a dark room and allowed them to breed.  3 Not sure how much further off-topic this can get...   8 It would be nice if someone would port that ODS2 utility7 that allows you to read ODS-2 media on other operating  4 systems to Mac OS X (No, it doesn't "just compile".)   -Andy-   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 21:49:01 +0200 ' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.not> = Subject: DECwindows X11 display server: creating visuals - Re ( Message-ID: <3D7A582D.84E5771D@spam.not>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > M > Sounds like a TGA2 (the 12 bit is a clue).  What visuals are supported is a J > function of the server DDX.  You can use any/all of the visuals that areI > supported on the screen.  Some of these (like 1bit) are actually pixmap C > formats.  The TGA2 as well as some of the 3D adapters can support = > simultanious use of different visual types and even depths.  > N > What you were doing was probably right, but there are little gotcha's (well,M > things that don't jump out at you) if I remember correctly.  So if you were N > trying to create a 24-bit window when the default is set to 8-bit, you wouldL > find the right visual - and  use it.  But pay special attention to all the< > nit-picking parameters - like background/border pixel etc. > K > I'll see if I can hunt down some code that opens a 24-bit window when the  > default is 8-bit.   D Thanks, Fred, you are *the* display server expert as we all know :-)  @ I wrote some test programs and I'm perfectly able to use all the	 existing  I visuals independently of the default visual. There are two nice routines  E one of which, XGetVisualInfo, can be used to exactly deliver a visual  with  
 a certain ID.   D My problem is: how can I use a depth of 1, 4, 12 or 32 which doesn't match I the depth of one of the visuals (all visuals have either depth 8 or 24).  ? The server reports that it supports depths 1, 4, 8, 12, 24, 32.   A My routine to create a window with arbitrary depth is as follows:   H Window create_window(XVisualInfo *v, Colormap map, int depth, int w, int h){       XSetWindowAttributes xswa;   4    xswa.event_mask = ButtonPressMask | ExposureMask;0    xswa.border_pixel = XBlackPixel(dpy, screen);    xswa.colormap = map;   6    return XCreateWindow(dpy, RootWindow(dpy, screen), :             0, 0, w, h, 0, depth, InputOutput, v->visual, =             CWEventMask | CWBorderPixel | CWColormap, &xswa);  }   I This works fine if "depth" is equal to the depth of the selected visual.  I But since there are only visuals with depth either 8 or 24 I can't get a  I window with a depth other than 8 or 24. Therefore I thought it might ev.  G be possible to create a visual with a certain depth and type either by  C calls to the server or by telling the server to create them during  ( startup by changing some DCL procedures.  D If the depth is different from the depth of the chosen visual I get:E "BadMatch (invalid parameter attributes)" when calling XCreateWindow.   F Of course there are two areas of possible problems with this routine.   D 1.Does the supplied colormap depend on the depth? I don't see how I C   would specify any depth when creating the colormap or when using     the default colormap.   A 2.Do I have to create the border_pixel differently? To create my  D   own Pixmap I have to supply a drawable parameter to XCreatePixmap    which doesn't exist yet.   Christof   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 23:20:45 -0400  From: Everhart <ge@gce.com> $ Subject: Re: How to create Sys$BATCH+ Message-ID: <alefmj$rci$2@bob.news.rcn.net>    Paul Sture wrote: r > In article <W84e9.27553$%P6.7062748@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com>, "Francisco Ortega" <fortega@iblues.cc> writes: > , >>How do you create Sys$BATCH AND Sys$print. >> >  >  > As ever, use HELP: >  > $ HELP INIT/QUE EXAMPLES >  > __ > Paul Sture
 > Switzerland   $ One thing I had to do way back when:   init/queue/new  = to create the queue files. Needed once only but it IS needed.    ------------------------------   Date: 7 Sep 02 20:30:08 +0200 ) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) ! Subject: Re: ImageMagick freeware ) Message-ID: <ssLdSdq54b2Y@elias.decus.ch>   l In article <20020907151920.4534.qmail@nym.alias.net>, Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes:C > On 7 Sep 2002, randeg@alum.rpi.edu (Glenn Randers-Pehrson) wrote:  >  > <snip> > J >>Not from HP in particular.  Also we don't actually need the system, justO >>access to one, with a couple hundred MB disc quota and sufficient permissions H >>to be able to install software in the usual places.  We have a similar* >>requirement for access to an SGI system. > J > There are a few VMS systems on the web that you can get at *remotely*. IH > run one, but I am not certain it could meet your needs. However, if itK > would, I'd be happy to install any additional software you might need and L > grant you the disk quotas. What may be an issue is precisely what you mean > by "sufficient permissions". >  > : I have privately emailed Glenn. My problems with this are:  A a) does the VMS Hobbyist license cover me here? I am not going to     violate that. b) "sufficient permissions"    __
 Paul Sture Switzerland    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 02:54:38 GMT * From: "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net>F Subject: Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS!. Message-ID: <OZye9.398734$UU1.62271@sccrnsc03>  K Heh.  Sorry, ever since I heard about the hack that gave you admin acces in ' HP-UX mashines, that last line is true.   L Not to say VMS sucks, but to say its just not known, or used widly enough to be tested:P    Though, it does rock;)5 "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message 5 news:d7791aa1.0209070541.ad855a@posting.google.com... B got it right except for the last line, he must not know about VMS!    *  Lead Windows developer bugged by security   By Matt Berger September 5, 2002 1:46 pm PT    0  SEATTLE -- BRIAN Valentine says he's not proud.  F The senior vice president in charge of Microsoft's Windows developmentE team has reason not to be. One of his most notable works, the WindowseE 2000 operating system, has a security record that is nothing to boast.8 about. In fact, it's downright dismal, many experts say.  D Security bulletins warning of holes and vulnerabilities in Microsoft? operating systems are a regular occurrence. Late Wednesday, theC< company released a bulletin warning of a flaw in its digitalC certificate technology that could allow attackers to steal a user's6A credit card information. It is the second security bulletin to bea issued this month.  E In August, Microsoft warned in one of eight security bulletins issuedAE that month, that many of its customers have experienced "an increasedaB amount of hacking," in their various Windows systems. The Redmond,@ Wash., company has yet to identify the root of the problem, onlyE saying that it has noticed some major similarities between the stringw of hack attacks.  D "As of August 2002, the PSS [Product Support Services] Security TeamB has not been able to determine the technique that is being used to? gain access to the computer," the company wrote in its security  bulletin posted on August 30.    In short, Microsoft is stumped.   C It is a case in point of the problems that the company is currently A facing as it struggles to release more secure code around its newnF generation of .Net software and win redemption from customers who haveF been burned by buggy products. Its latest attempt to fight the problemE is embodied in a company-wide effort called the Trustworthy ComputingtB Initiative. As that effort lumbers to show results, the company is# filling in the gaps with apologies.c  E "I'm not proud," Valentine said, as he spoke to a crowd of developersdC here at the company's Windows .Net Server developer conference. "We D really haven't done everything we could to protect our customers ...2 Our products just aren't engineered for security."  @ The Windows 2000 operating system has been pummeled by continualC security holes, some so widespread that they have resulted in majornF damage to computer systems around the world. Most notable are the CodeC Red and Nimda worms, which exploit a vulnerability in the operating  system.w  D Customers seem to agree that Microsoft's spotty record with securityF has been a detriment to their own development of computer systems. OneE Windows systems consultant here, who wished to remain anonymous, saidm? that security issues with Microsoft's IIS (Internet informationsC Server) Web server have left a bad taste in many customers' mouths.g  B "Some of the customers I've worked with simply won't use IIS," theB systems consultant said. "That's bad for us. We're losing business because of it."u  E Microsoft's Trustworthy Computing Initiative, which was launched withc? a memo from Bill Gates, Microsoft's chairman and chief softwarea< architect, has become the blanket program that resulted fromE Microsoft's revelations. With the launch of the initiative, Microsoft @ halted production on new code in all of its products and chargedE employees with scanning through every line of existing code in search- of vulnerabilities.e  D "We realized that we couldn't continue with the way we were building@ software and expect to deliver secure products," Valentine said.  ? But the company is dealing with a problem that isn't going awaywE anytime soon. Valentine noted here that as the company works to shore ; up its products, the security dilemma will evolve with more  sophisticated hackers.  F "It's impossible to solve the problem completely," Valentine said. "AsB we solve these problems there are hackers who are going to come up with new ones.  " "There's no end to this," he said.  A During Microsoft's early years, security didn't drive the way theuE company built its software, said Michael Cherry, lead systems analyst 8 at independent research company Directions on Microsoft.  @ "If you go back a few years, unless you were working on login atB Microsoft, you really didn't worry about security. The risk wasn't worth the effort," Cherry said.*  @ One reason is because many of the early hackers who drilled intoB Windows didn't disrupt business with their hack attacks, ValentineF noted. Rather they were just out for glory. But in the past year, manyB of the hacks launched against Microsoft software, most notably theC Code Red and Nimda worms, have been malicious, going after businessv; processes, and in many cases shutting those processes down.r  A "They went from glory hackers to what I call digital terrorists,"u Valentine said.   B Microsoft has also been employing new tools developed by Microsoft> Research that are designed to detect errors in code during the$ development process, Valentine said.  C Adam Kolawa, CEO of ParaSoft, a company that makes error-prevention A tools used by IBM, said Microsoft has long ignored the problem ofuA fixing code when it is being produced. "Microsoft is paying a lipa& service to this problem," Kolawa said.  D It is not only Microsoft that is to blame for the creation of faulty? software, said Chandra Mugunda, a software consultant with Dell D Computer in Round Rock, Texas, who attended Valentine's presentation here.h  F "It's an industry-wide problem, it's not just a Microsoft problem," heF said. "But they're the leaders, and they should take the lead to solve these problems"p  E Valentine, too, took the opportunity to point out the widespread bugs A that have been discovered in competing operating products such as2 Linux and Unix.   A "Every operating system out there is about equal in the number ofe2 vulnerabilities reported," he said. "We all suck."   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 23:19:12 -0400. From: Everhart <ge@gce.com>tF Subject: Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS!+ Message-ID: <alefjn$rci$1@bob.news.rcn.net>E  B I believe that Microsoft is trying hard to spin its own insecurity? as a generic problem and would do so whether it knows about VMS D and OS/400 or not. These statements are not innocent uninformedness;I they are deception and attempts to conceal the existence of alternatives.hA Neither are they mentioning the next two runner-up candidates forLJ half decent security, NSA enhanced Linux (which they have been trying hard. to make go away) and PitBull enhanced Solaris.  H It is pretty clear that the whole direction of making everything able toG call everything else transparently has been a security disaster, and itcE has been built tightly into Microsoft's whole software system so that E reworking it would in effect mean Microsoft could now start trying toeJ engineer a system that works like some of the secure ones from scratch, ifG it truly wanted to attain secure operation, rather than convince peopletF that a few more kludge patches is the best that can be had. After all,I they convinced many that power cycling boxes multiple times a day was theyI best an OS vendor could do. If they succeed they can continue business aseF usual, with a few new wrinkles, or possibly they will be able to get aG non-consumer-controllable appliance (Palladium) that might just be ableiK to block some attacks, at the cost of also blocking customer choice of whattP the platform runs. (Darn if I will pay for a box that wants to be locked againstF me. When I pay for a box I pay for the right to do with it as I like.)  K Obviously anywhere we can point out that there exist several already secureMR OS choices, of which VMS is arguably the best, it will dispel this misinformation.   Bob Ceculski wrote:aD > got it right except for the last line, he must not know about VMS! >  > - >  Lead Windows developer bugged by security s >  > By Matt Berger t > September 5, 2002 1:46 pm PT >  >   2 >  SEATTLE -- BRIAN Valentine says he's not proud. > H > The senior vice president in charge of Microsoft's Windows developmentG > team has reason not to be. One of his most notable works, the WindowsuG > 2000 operating system, has a security record that is nothing to boastA: > about. In fact, it's downright dismal, many experts say. > F > Security bulletins warning of holes and vulnerabilities in MicrosoftA > operating systems are a regular occurrence. Late Wednesday, the > > company released a bulletin warning of a flaw in its digitalE > certificate technology that could allow attackers to steal a user'ssC > credit card information. It is the second security bulletin to be  > issued this month. > G > In August, Microsoft warned in one of eight security bulletins issued G > that month, that many of its customers have experienced "an increased D > amount of hacking," in their various Windows systems. The Redmond,B > Wash., company has yet to identify the root of the problem, onlyG > saying that it has noticed some major similarities between the stringS > of hack attacks. > F > "As of August 2002, the PSS [Product Support Services] Security TeamD > has not been able to determine the technique that is being used toA > gain access to the computer," the company wrote in its securityj > bulletin posted on August 30.  > ! > In short, Microsoft is stumped.  > E > It is a case in point of the problems that the company is currently C > facing as it struggles to release more secure code around its newhH > generation of .Net software and win redemption from customers who haveH > been burned by buggy products. Its latest attempt to fight the problemG > is embodied in a company-wide effort called the Trustworthy Computing0D > Initiative. As that effort lumbers to show results, the company is% > filling in the gaps with apologies.R > G > "I'm not proud," Valentine said, as he spoke to a crowd of developers-E > here at the company's Windows .Net Server developer conference. "WehF > really haven't done everything we could to protect our customers ...4 > Our products just aren't engineered for security." > B > The Windows 2000 operating system has been pummeled by continualE > security holes, some so widespread that they have resulted in major H > damage to computer systems around the world. Most notable are the CodeE > Red and Nimda worms, which exploit a vulnerability in the operatinge	 > system.t > F > Customers seem to agree that Microsoft's spotty record with securityH > has been a detriment to their own development of computer systems. OneG > Windows systems consultant here, who wished to remain anonymous, saidaA > that security issues with Microsoft's IIS (Internet information E > Server) Web server have left a bad taste in many customers' mouths.f > D > "Some of the customers I've worked with simply won't use IIS," theD > systems consultant said. "That's bad for us. We're losing business > because of it."h > G > Microsoft's Trustworthy Computing Initiative, which was launched withtA > a memo from Bill Gates, Microsoft's chairman and chief software-> > architect, has become the blanket program that resulted fromG > Microsoft's revelations. With the launch of the initiative, MicrosoftkB > halted production on new code in all of its products and chargedG > employees with scanning through every line of existing code in search  > of vulnerabilities.n > F > "We realized that we couldn't continue with the way we were buildingB > software and expect to deliver secure products," Valentine said. > A > But the company is dealing with a problem that isn't going away>G > anytime soon. Valentine noted here that as the company works to shorer= > up its products, the security dilemma will evolve with moreo > sophisticated hackers. > H > "It's impossible to solve the problem completely," Valentine said. "AsD > we solve these problems there are hackers who are going to come up > with new ones. > $ > "There's no end to this," he said. > C > During Microsoft's early years, security didn't drive the way therG > company built its software, said Michael Cherry, lead systems analystR: > at independent research company Directions on Microsoft. > B > "If you go back a few years, unless you were working on login atD > Microsoft, you really didn't worry about security. The risk wasn't! > worth the effort," Cherry said.e > B > One reason is because many of the early hackers who drilled intoD > Windows didn't disrupt business with their hack attacks, ValentineH > noted. Rather they were just out for glory. But in the past year, manyD > of the hacks launched against Microsoft software, most notably theE > Code Red and Nimda worms, have been malicious, going after businessa= > processes, and in many cases shutting those processes down.t > C > "They went from glory hackers to what I call digital terrorists,". > Valentine said.  > D > Microsoft has also been employing new tools developed by Microsoft@ > Research that are designed to detect errors in code during the& > development process, Valentine said. > E > Adam Kolawa, CEO of ParaSoft, a company that makes error-prevention-C > tools used by IBM, said Microsoft has long ignored the problem offC > fixing code when it is being produced. "Microsoft is paying a lips( > service to this problem," Kolawa said. > F > It is not only Microsoft that is to blame for the creation of faultyA > software, said Chandra Mugunda, a software consultant with DelldF > Computer in Round Rock, Texas, who attended Valentine's presentation > here.r > H > "It's an industry-wide problem, it's not just a Microsoft problem," heH > said. "But they're the leaders, and they should take the lead to solve > these problems". > G > Valentine, too, took the opportunity to point out the widespread bugsbC > that have been discovered in competing operating products such asa > Linux and Unix.2 > C > "Every operating system out there is about equal in the number ofc4 > vulnerabilities reported," he said. "We all suck."   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 00:03:34 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>DF Subject: Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS!, Message-ID: <3D7ACC09.2090F4B5@videotron.ca>   Everhart wrote:I > D > I believe that Microsoft is trying hard to spin its own insecurity > as a generic problem b  N Of course. They don't want to admit that their operating system started off asL a toy and grew with fancy features being more important than security. SinceH it started off as a non-multitasking, single user DOS, it didn't have to consider security.  N Real operating systems started off as time sharing systems with not only multiI tasking but also multi=user, so security was part of the original design.8  J Perhaps X-BOX should become Microsoft's core business and MS should forget9 plans about shoving its windows in the enterprise market.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 00:20:55 -0400T- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> F Subject: Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS!, Message-ID: <3D7AD019.A847FF54@videotron.ca>  % winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote:wO > This quote attempts to equate virus writers who exploit criminally-inadequatefN > security with terrorists who kill thousands - they're not only so smart thatL > no system can truly be secure against them, they're evil and depraved too.    E Actually, the real criminals in this are the corporations who install1) untrustworthy systems to do serious work.     L If a bank put your money in a vault that didn't have any lock and was easilyI accessible from the street, would you blame the folks who walked into theiM vault to take some money, or blame the bank for being criminally negligent ore= blame the builder of the room that the bank used as a vault ?'    L Where Microsoft can be made responsible however is in falsely marketing thatL its windows is enterprise ready, and definitely companies like HP and Compaq4 for pushing wintel servers so much into enterprises.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 03:39:55 GMT $ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUF Subject: Re: Micro$oft exec says all os's stink ... forgets about VMS!8 Message-ID: <00A13A37.303868A3@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  I In article <alefjn$rci$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, Everhart <ge@gce.com> writes:o    C >I believe that Microsoft is trying hard to spin its own insecurityt@ >as a generic problem and would do so whether it knows about VMSE >and OS/400 or not. These statements are not innocent uninformedness;wJ >they are deception and attempts to conceal the existence of alternatives.B >Neither are they mentioning the next two runner-up candidates forK >half decent security, NSA enhanced Linux (which they have been trying hard / >to make go away) and PitBull enhanced Solaris.W  H I agree with this completely.  While this at first blush appeared like aK confession of not having designed security in, it's actually fairly clearlytL an attempt to get people to buy in to the Trustworthy Computing and possiblyJ Palladium initiatives - in other words, so they can say (as they always doE in effect) "the last thing we sold you really sucked; let us sell youa something better."   Note this quote:  B >> But the company is dealing with a problem that isn't going awayH >> anytime soon. Valentine noted here that as the company works to shore> >> up its products, the security dilemma will evolve with more >> sophisticated hackers.r >>I >> "It's impossible to solve the problem completely," Valentine said. "AsgE >> we solve these problems there are hackers who are going to come upt >> with new ones.  >>% >> "There's no end to this," he said.u  N In other words, it doesn't matter how good the product is, those wiley hackersK are just so devilishly smart that they'll screw it up.  (And concomitantly,oM it therefore doesn't really matter - like, say, enough to sue over - that theyK current products are so vulnerable that they're not really fit for service,w7 because getting broken into is just inevitable anyway.)        >f   >>D >> During Microsoft's early years, security didn't drive the way theH >> company built its software, said Michael Cherry, lead systems analyst; >> at independent research company Directions on Microsoft.o >>C >> "If you go back a few years, unless you were working on login ats% >> "There's no end to this," he said.g  N In other words, it doesn't matter how good the product is, those wiley hackersK are just so devilishly smart that they'll screw it up.  (And concomitantly,n Note this quote:  B >> But the company is dealing with a problem that isn't going awayH >> anytime soon. Valentine noted here that as the company works to shore> >> up its products, the security dilemma will evolve with more >> sophisticated hackers.i >>I >> "It's impossible to solve the problem completely," Valentine said. "AsoE >> we solve these problems there are hackers who are going to come up' >> with new ones.o >>% >> "There's no end to this," he said.d  M In other words, it doesn't matter how good the product is, those wily hackerspK are just so devilishly smart that they'll screw it up.  (And concomitantly,sM it therefore doesn't really matter - like, say, enough to sue over - that the K current products are so vulnerable that they're not really fit for service,i7 because getting broken into is just inevitable anyway.)h  M In other words, it doesn't matter how good the product is, those wily hackersrK are just so devilishly smart that they'll screw it up.  (And concomitantly,lM it therefore doesn't really matter - like, say, enough to sue over - that theiK current products are so vulnerable that they're not really fit for service,iK current products are so vulnerable that they're not really fit for service,h7 because getting broken into is just inevitable anyway.)w   >>C >> One reason is because many of the early hackers who drilled intopE >> Windows didn't disrupt business with their hack attacks, ValentineeI >> noted. Rather they were just out for glory. But in the past year, manysE >> of the hacks launched against Microsoft software, most notably themF >> Code Red and Nimda worms, have been malicious, going after business> >> processes, and in many cases shutting those processes down.> >> processes, and in many cases shutting those processes down. >>D >> "They went from glory hackers to what I call digital terrorists," >> Valentine said.  M This quote attempts to equate virus writers who exploit criminally-inadequatetL security with terrorists who kill thousands - they're not only so smart thatJ no system can truly be secure against them, they're evil and depraved too.  G >> It is not only Microsoft that is to blame for the creation of faultyoB >> software, said Chandra Mugunda, a software consultant with DellG >> Computer in Round Rock, Texas, who attended Valentine's presentationi >> here. >>I >> "It's an industry-wide problem, it's not just a Microsoft problem," he I >> said. "But they're the leaders, and they should take the lead to solvet >> these problems"  G You can definitely trust someone who works for Dell for a dispassionate N and disinterested analysis of whether Microsoft software is disproportionately insecure.  Not.l   >>H >> Valentine, too, took the opportunity to point out the widespread bugsD >> that have been discovered in competing operating products such as >> Linux and Unix. >>D >> "Every operating system out there is about equal in the number of5 >> vulnerabilities reported," he said. "We all suck."o  D Maybe we all suck, but that every OS is about equal in the number ofM vulnerabilities _reported_, that's, well, seriously misinformed if not a lie.hL (Andrew can now speak up again and say that just because VMS doesn't have asF many CERT advisories as Solaris doesn't mean it's any more secure, butL Valentine said "reported."   Maybe he's thinking of fudging by adding up allO the advisories for all versions of SunOS/SOlaris, but counting only NT 3.51 andi6 4 together, 2000 separately, and XP separately again.)   -- Alani   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Sep 02 20:17:53 +0200") From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) A Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!j) Message-ID: <Dp6nhNnN$UrY@elias.decus.ch>   [ In article <3D7A1885.12FFCD2D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:t > "Main, Kerry" wrote: >> w >> Michael,  >> g% >> >>> When VMS is free on new PCs<<<i >> wJ >> The MS OS is certainly not "free" on new PC's. You pay for the MS OS as1 >> part of the PC purchase. It is simply bundled.t >> i7 >> >>> sells with a single user license for $99/copy<<<  >> t$ >> OpenVMS Hobbyist license is free.$ >> http://www.montagar.com/hobbyist/ >> yE >> There are obviously other area's to compare, but the ones you have ( >> raised are not good ones you can use. > I > ...because OVMS hobby still has the "non-commercial" poison pill in it.  > D > For VMS to live, thrive and survive, it's gonna take "affordable". > C > ...although like OpenVMS-IA32, I'm probably the only one here whol# > believes and/or understands that.s >   E No you are not the only one. Look at the recent outcry the Solaris on  Intel folks have come up with.   It is not only happening to us.w   __
 Paul Sture Switzerlandt   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2002 14:54:06 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com>SA Subject: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!sT Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4026609CC@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  E >>> Out of curiosity, when one purchases a new PC from a real companytD (not a garage operation), how much does the windows licence cost the builder ?<<<  G It typically depends on the volume you deliver - hence big players havef1 bigger discounts from MS than smaller players.=20e  + I have no idea what the actual numbers are.t   Regardss  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultants Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Servicess Voice: 613-592-4660e Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----7 From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca]=20y Sent: September 7, 2002 1:11 PMt To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com A Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!h     "Main, Kerry" wrote:I > The MS OS is certainly not "free" on new PC's. You pay for the MS OS=20e3 > as part of the PC purchase. It is simply bundled.a  H Out of curiosity, when one purchases a new PC from a real company (not aG garage operation), how much does the windows licence cost the builder ?r  H I realise that the exact price would vary depending on the type of leashE the builder is willing to have attached to its own neck by microsoft,a: but I would expect that they all pay in the same ballpark?  " Are we talking $50 ? $100 ? $150 ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 22:14:32 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>wA Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!t' Message-ID: <3D7A7FA8.D2F1557A@fsi.net>a   Paul Sture wrote:t > ] > In article <3D7A1885.12FFCD2D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:t > > "Main, Kerry" wrote: > >>
 > >> Michael,h > >>' > >> >>> When VMS is free on new PCs<<<s > >>L > >> The MS OS is certainly not "free" on new PC's. You pay for the MS OS as3 > >> part of the PC purchase. It is simply bundled.t > >>9 > >> >>> sells with a single user license for $99/copy<<<, > >>& > >> OpenVMS Hobbyist license is free.& > >> http://www.montagar.com/hobbyist/ > >>G > >> There are obviously other area's to compare, but the ones you havec* > >> raised are not good ones you can use. > > K > > ...because OVMS hobby still has the "non-commercial" poison pill in it.i > >eF > > For VMS to live, thrive and survive, it's gonna take "affordable". > >tE > > ...although like OpenVMS-IA32, I'm probably the only one here whoe% > > believes and/or understands that.i > >s > G > No you are not the only one. Look at the recent outcry the Solaris oni  > Intel folks have come up with. > ! > It is not only happening to us.r   I hear ya, bro!    -- a David J. Dachterad dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/u   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 22:52:44 -0000e/ From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net>eA Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns! / Message-ID: <unl0psb2bg0b93@corp.supernews.com>s  & Main, Kerry <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote:F :>>> Out of curiosity, when one purchases a new PC from a real companyG 	: (not a garage operation), how much does the windows licence cost thea : builder ?<<<  I : It typically depends on the volume you deliver - hence big players havel1 : bigger discounts from MS than smaller players.    ; About $45; it varies on the actual details of the contract.   = Users can buy upgrades for $50-$100 or complete installationso
 for ~$200.  A Clearly, VMS is a FAR SUPERIOR o/s, but let's get real anent each C o/s's financial resources ... MS gets FAR LESS per copy (and that's B where all the after-sale support is, which is the greatest expense! for a mature o/s like Win or BMS)e  B When VMS can be had for ~$200 w/ a license that does not proscribe+ commercial use, then let's compare the two.l  @ If DEC/Compaq/HP got $200 per copy, they'd be over their head in black ink supporting it.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2002 20:45:47 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com>cA Subject: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!cT Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4026609CD@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  D >>> If DEC/Compaq/HP got $200 per copy, they'd be over their head in black ink supporting it.<<<   G With respect to "commercial use" - it depends if you factor in security G patching and the time administrators spend keeping up. Once these costsa/ are factored in then it's a different story.=20   J OpenVMS hobbyist (free license) time spent worrying about Virus's =3D 0. =     :-)h  A Btw - Windows XP Pro is a $300 (Cdn) upgrade from Windows XP Homei@ edition which comes with retail PC's.  XP Pro is what businessesE (commercial) use - not Home Edition. What is this upgrade cost in the, US? In Europe?  A I'm all for lower VMS costs, but lets compare real apples to real  apples.o   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantg Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Servicesc Voice: 613-592-4660t Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----9 From: Michael Zarlenga [mailto:zarlenga@conan.ids.net]=20n Sent: September 7, 2002 6:53 PMn To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComwA Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!l    & Main, Kerry <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote:F :>>> Out of curiosity, when one purchases a new PC from a real company> 	: (not a garage operation), how much does the windows licence cost the : builder ?<<<  D : It typically depends on the volume you deliver - hence big players have3 : bigger discounts from MS than smaller players.=20e  ; About $45; it varies on the actual details of the contract.r  H Users can buy upgrades for $50-$100 or complete installations for ~$200.  G Clearly, VMS is a FAR SUPERIOR o/s, but let's get real anent each o/s'sbG financial resources ... MS gets FAR LESS per copy (and that's where allnE the after-sale support is, which is the greatest expense for a maturer o/s like Win or BMS)  B When VMS can be had for ~$200 w/ a license that does not proscribe+ commercial use, then let's compare the two.t  F If DEC/Compaq/HP got $200 per copy, they'd be over their head in black ink supporting it.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 21:39:23 -0400s- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>eA Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns! , Message-ID: <3D7AAA48.B021C90F@videotron.ca>   "Main, Kerry" wrote:H > OpenVMS hobbyist (free license) time spent worrying about Virus's = 0.  J Does this mean that we need not worry about the West Nile Virus ? Are onlyL microsoft weenies affected by it ? Perhaps GOD has sent a virus to eliminate# the lower forms of life on earth...,   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 22:50:13 -0400D From: Everhart <ge@gce.com> A Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!0+ Message-ID: <aledta$n4j$1@bob.news.rcn.net>    Main, Kerry wrote:E >>>>Out of curiosity, when one purchases a new PC from a real companyb >>>fF > (not a garage operation), how much does the windows licence cost the > builder ?<<< > I > It typically depends on the volume you deliver - hence big players haveo1 > bigger discounts from MS than smaller players. t > - > I have no idea what the actual numbers are.e > 	 > Regardsa >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultantl > Hewlett-Packard Canada# > Consulting & Integration Servicesi > Voice: 613-592-4660p > Fax   : 613-591-4477 > Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com >  >  > -----Original Message-----7 > From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca] -! > Sent: September 7, 2002 1:11 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComFC > Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!a >  >  > "Main, Kerry" wrote: > G >>The MS OS is certainly not "free" on new PC's. You pay for the MS OS T3 >>as part of the PC purchase. It is simply bundled.i >  > J > Out of curiosity, when one purchases a new PC from a real company (not aI > garage operation), how much does the windows licence cost the builder ?  > J > I realise that the exact price would vary depending on the type of leashG > the builder is willing to have attached to its own neck by microsoft,i< > but I would expect that they all pay in the same ballpark? > $ > Are we talking $50 ? $100 ? $150 ?  L I chanced to look over at www.pricewatch.com for systems and noticed severalM where you "configure your own". Normally prices include some kind of windows,lP but if you change the configuration to "no operating system" you get a credit of
 about $70.  K Part of the credit may be savings from not having to load the OS, the othernA part may be OS license fees, or it may all be fees; I can't tell.u   Just a data point.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 04:07:10 -0000r/ From: Michael Zarlenga <zarlenga@conan.ids.net>MA Subject: Re: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!D/ Message-ID: <unlj7efgo8uedf@corp.supernews.com>   & Main, Kerry <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote:C : Btw - Windows XP Pro is a $300 (Cdn) upgrade from Windows XP HomeyB : edition which comes with retail PC's.  XP Pro is what businessesG : (commercial) use - not Home Edition. What is this upgrade cost in thea : US? In Europe?  : AFAIK, XP Home can be used to produce commercial products.  9 And if you check Gateway or Dell, you'll see that you cane2 upgrade from XP Home to XP Pro for less than $100.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 22:14:33 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> " Subject: Re: The Gauntlet is Cast!I Message-ID: <dTue9.120862$GK2.89509@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>e  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D795DE5.A64C9FAB@videotron.ca... > Rob Young wrote:H > >         I agree that unix server margins are higher.  I also see boxF > >         counts and Intel servers (4 and 8 way) sell in much higher% > >         numbers than Sun 4+8 way.  >>L > It is a given that wintel servers sell in greater quantities. Dell has 160I > wintel boxes acting as its web server farm, but a serious company wouldd need3 > just a couple of real servers to do the same job.t >tK > However, as the wintel weenies mature, they will realise the advantage oftI > buying fewer larger servers instead of basing everything on virus pronet wintel > that is unweildy to manage." >r* > >  Because Intel margins are thinner andI > >         counts are higher, increasing pressure comes to unix servers.u >sJ > This is Curly/Winkler talk.  The increased pressure on unix servers will comeF > when Wintel crap gains the stability, secirity and manageability and# > scalability and serious software.y >      JF  J The pressure is on the unix servers already because the morons who do mostG of the systems internally at most companies think that Windows/Intel ise 'good enough' right now.  L Lots of people in the US can afford better cars than they typically buy, ie.K BMW vs. Buick, but they don't the step up the car food chain because eithers they:s a) don't know any better,a- b) think that they will save money on servicen0 c) don't want the slightly larger capital outlay  I Similar things hold true for servers. Providing functionally similar appst are available on both.   ------------------------------   Date: 7 Sep 02 20:25:33 +0200m) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)lJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on) Message-ID: <3UsVREPmnnjF@elias.decus.ch>>  [ In article <3D7A18E4.C563F1A1@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:a > Paul Sture wrote: 	 >> [snip]e >> DTR> help wombatw >> e$ >> Sorry, no documentation on WOMBAT >  > There used to was... > J Darn. I never had the fancy graphics VT100 to display that thing properly.L Now that I have Motif and a variety of VT100 emulators, the Wombat has gone!   __
 Paul Sture Switzerlande   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 18:46:10 GMTn From: sasadmin <jec@nospam.net> T Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on  OpenVMS?2 Message-ID: <87it1hd3qx.fsf@Alethion.systasis.net>  / wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) writes:   H > aaa@aaa.com (Jan-Erik Sderholm) wrote in <3D77BFCA.D69AD051@aaa.com>: >  > >Warren Spencer wrote: > >>  
 > >> Kenneth,v > >> aG > >> Here's a couple of things that frustrate me in the last 12 months:r > >> eD > >> * An SMTP API that can do MIME encoding right (instead of those* > >> interactive tools like MIME and MPACK > >nI > >Yes, the MIME tool is built to be interactive, but MPACK/MUNPACK workss
 > >just greatt) > >in batch, if that was what you wanted.  > B > I'm looking for an API.  Sorry for not making that clear enough.% It might be interesting to hack on <aoB href="http://www.google.com/search?query=libgmime">libgmime</a>. IE have some free time; let me know if you're interested in working on a D port to VMS. I haven't looked at the source code of the library yet,C but I'm assuming a port isn't out of reach of a competant C/OpenVMSy programmer.o  ? If you're looking for support yesterday, this probably isn't an  option.o   Regards, jecu   -- u Microsoft Free By 2003   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 20:32:25 +0200 ' From: Brass Christof <welcome@spam.not>l6 Subject: Re: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha( Message-ID: <3D7A4639.5C5D3BD5@spam.not>   WarlockD wrote:t > L > It went into the terminal unlike the the 400 I had.  Nice 150mhz processor > too! > N > Anyone know where the startup sound came from?  It sounds like a grandfather > clock.  ; The startup sound comes from the built-in loudspeaker IIRC.   I I have the same type of machine but I don't have to boot it because it's >I always running. Therefore I don't remember clearly what kind of sound it  @ produces when it is booted. VMS 6.2 works without problems on my machine.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2002 14:34:44 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com>u6 Subject: RE: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alphaT Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4023D95B9@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>  4 >>> VMS 6.2 works without problems on my machine.<<<  E VMS V7.3-1 also works ok on both my home 3000-400 and lab 3000-400 at  work.n   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanth Hewlett-Packard Canada! Consulting & Integration Servicesa Voice: 613-592-4660a Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: Kerry.Main@hp.com     -----Original Message-----1 From: Brass Christof [mailto:welcome@spam.not]=20d Sent: September 7, 2002 2:32 PMg To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coml5 Subject: Re: YEA! I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha      WarlockD wrote:  >=20E > It went into the terminal unlike the the 400 I had.  Nice 150mhz=20- > processor too! >=20E > Anyone know where the startup sound came from?  It sounds like a=20a > grandfather clock.  ; The startup sound comes from the built-in loudspeaker IIRC.g  H I have the same type of machine but I don't have to boot it because it's  H always running. Therefore I don't remember clearly what kind of sound it  @ produces when it is booted. VMS 6.2 works without problems on my machine.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2002 23:05:39 -0400  From: Everhart <ge@gce.com>t6 Subject: Re: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha+ Message-ID: <aleeq8$pak$1@bob.news.rcn.net>S   WarlockD wrote:s > Thats it!t >  > It was like music. > / > "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> wrote in messagem2 > news:ald103$1o9p6b$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de... > 9 > "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net> schreef in berichtn% > news:rHQd9.9661$Jo.873@rwcrnsc53...  > L >>It went into the terminal unlike the the 400 I had.  Nice 150mhz processor >>too! >>B >>Anyone know where the startup sound came from?  It sounds like a > 
 > grandfather  >  >>clock. >> > N > A year ago I had a 3000-400 for a couple of weeks and the sound comes from aL > small speaker inside the box. The VAXstation 4000-90A  produces some music > near the end of POST.- >  > Hans >  >  > O my 3000-300 plays the first few notes of the theme from Close Encounters of theoM Third Kind when it boots...the one used to communicate with the aliens in theA movie, that is.6   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2002 02:58:46 GMTr* From: "WarlockD" <warlockd@drakesmith.net>E Subject: Re: YEA!  I have a working Dec 3000 300 alpha, RISC and IDE? . Message-ID: <G1ze9.398762$UU1.61819@sccrnsc03>  J Can't wait for my paycheck.  I mean its perfect.  Takes standard ram, that: 150Mhz processor seems to completely out do my P2 at home.  K Though I do have a question.  I know the 21064 is a 64bit processor, but itIK takes pairs of DRAM 72-pin.  Each chip is only 16 bit wide.  Is it really ayF 64/32.  That is its internally a 64 bit, but the data path is only 32?  K Also, is there a turbo channel card out there that can use IDE hard drives?MC I figure with such an open architecture, someone would of made one.u    4 "Brass Christof" <welcome@spam.not> wrote in message" news:3D7A4639.5C5D3BD5@spam.not... WarlockD wrote:e > L > It went into the terminal unlike the the 400 I had.  Nice 150mhz processor > too! >sB > Anyone know where the startup sound came from?  It sounds like a grandfathers > clock.  ; The startup sound comes from the built-in loudspeaker IIRC.   H I have the same type of machine but I don't have to boot it because it'sH always running. Therefore I don't remember clearly what kind of sound it@ produces when it is booted. VMS 6.2 works without problems on my machine.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.495 ************************