1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 13 Sep 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 505       Contents: Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: "inview" Article Re: 7.3-1 craziness  Re: 7.3-1 craziness  Re: 7.3-1 craziness 	 Re: AD/BC 	 Re: AD/BC & Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein* Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein* Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein* Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein* Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein' AM/PM, BC/AC and different calendars... 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Assistance Solicited - Petition for Candidacy 1 Re: Assistance Solicited - Petition for Candidacy 1 Re: Assistance Solicited - Petition for Candidacy # Re: Cancelling writes to a log file # Re: Cancelling writes to a log file  Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: definition of SYS$SYSROOT 1 Re: Encompass - how long before I get a response? 7 Re: Fabio Cardoso Enemy of the United States of America  FMS on Alpha Re: FMS on Alpha Re: FMS on Alpha Re: FMS on Alpha, Re: Help:  Error Linking Samba 2.2.4 for VMS Re: hobbyist license reg Re: hobbyist license reg Re: hobbyist license reg Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT@ Re: lexicals (was: RE: SET PROTECTION (SET SECURITY/PROTECTION)"P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns! Re: MANUaL DCL( Re: Memo:  Re: Deleting expired licenses Re: Mr. Bush at the U.N. Re: Mr. Bush at the U.N. Re: ORD  Re: ORD  RE: ORD > Re: still poor randomness of TCP/IP  sequence numbers in VMS ?= Re: still poor randomness of TCP/IP sequence numbers in VMS ?  Re: Sybase and VMS Re: TCP/IP not running fine  Re: The Gauntlet is Cast!  v7.3-1 Arrived TodayA Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on P Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenV+ Who was looking for old VMS for an 11/750??   [Fwd: Mozilla under  eXcursions]$ Re: [Fwd: Mozilla under  eXcursions]D [Heavily OT] Re: Fabio Cardoso Enemy of the United States of America; Re: [OT] Re: [OT] IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT [OT] [Off Topic]   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:05:11 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article 3 Message-ID: <EsyNtnqxcn3R@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Y In article <alnrc8$ri$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy writes:    >>  B >>    It might be in that thread, but it's very different from theD >>    affordable VMS issue.  You still have to pay for good software* >>    no matter which box it's sitting on. >>   > 
 > Do you ? > 5 > Apache is free its a well thought of Web server and 3 > if you have a box running Solaris you even get it  > supported and free from Sun.      My point, exactly.    ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:07:49 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article 3 Message-ID: <SM88+nOdwdDy@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <alns35$121$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy writes: > = > This statement is rather like saying that the Ford explorer ; > isn't really a Ford, instead its a Goodyear because thats $ > what connects the car to the road.  A    Well, now.  If Ferarri bought Explorer from Ford, then stopped B    shipping all but the tires, well yes, I'd call that a Goodyear.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:01:28 +0200 @ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk> Subject: Re: "inview" Article + Message-ID: <3D80E488.6090109@mail.tele.dk>    Bob Koehler wrote:   > In article <al5b4m$t3g$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> writes:4 >>Some apps servers require this, you don't have any< >>crypto plugin support or any HSM support so you are out of? >>the picture in any B2B infrastructures you don't have support ; >>for a number of the popular load balancing products. This = >>is just what you need for web serving. Where is FireWall-1, : >>Tripwire. What caching proxy server capabilities can you5 >>provide, does OpenVMS support any kind of directory 9 >>caching. What about Portal support, BEA Portal Server ?  > D >    Nope.  Don't need them, so I don't care aboutt not having them.C >    Many of these "apps" make up for poor underlying strucure, and C >    none of them are needed for the typicalyy web servers we have.  > 3 >>I just did, when did you last look at what a real ' >>ebusiness infrastructure looks like ?  > = >    Somehow I think you define that as "start with a Sun..."    No.        |  (HTTPS)      |  [web server]     |  (AJP)      |  [JSP/servlet container]  [EJB container]      | 
 (properitary)      |  [EIS system]   Is the way it is done today.   And that is not just SUN.   5 BTW, it is not in the web server layer the money are.    Arne   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:09:53 +0000 (UTC) + From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb)  Subject: Re: 7.3-1 craziness+ Message-ID: <alql9h$bv6$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>   ^ In article <alqdb7$562$1@newslocal.mitre.org>, lewis@spyder.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) writes:J >Last night I took the plunge and installed 7.3-1 on my office workstationA >and my nearly-identical hobbyist machine.  Here's what happened:  > G >The process names assigned by SPAWN used to be predictable!  Now I get  > - >    %DCL-S-SPAWNED, process LEWIS_32 spawned  > J >when LEWIS_1 through LEWIS_31 don't even exist.  I had PF1-PF4 defined toM >attach to LEWIS_1 through LEWIS_4 so I could switch between TPU sessions and J >the DCL prompt easily in a single telnet window, now I have to re-work itL >(maybe I'll write a comfile that does SPAWN/PROC=LEWIS_'i' and increments i >until it succeeds). > J Documented in section 4.19 of the New features and documentation overview.E The naming of sub-processes has been changed to improve performance.  @ The problem was in determining the next available number to use.M There is a DCL_CTLFLAGS system parameter which can be set to get back the old   behaviour if you really need it.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   >Another thing I'm getting is  > 6 >    %PTHREAD_CONFIG keyword "vp-count=1" is not valid > C >This happens in Mozilla, Java 1.2.2, and Java 1.4.0 (my reason for 4 >upgrading).  I don't know if it's hurting anything. > I >And the upgrade broke one of my critical communications apps again.  Not L >sure if it was the VMS 7.3 to 7.3-1 or the TCPIP 5.0A to 5.3 that did it.  K >Last time around I was able to fix it by relinking on the upgraded system; K >now I'm thinking about changing the distribution so that I ship .OLB files K >and a script to produce the .EXE they need.  Right now I link in-house and L >ship the .EXE.  Does anybody have an opinion about which is better?  I know6 >Wollongong used to ship some .OLBs back in the day... > E >My final gotcha was my REPLY/ALL stopped working due to lack of OPER M >privilege.  I added an INSTALL command to SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM to fix it, but I L >wonder why it worked before.  Did it not need that priv under 7.3 or what?  >Not a problem, just a mystery.  > , >--Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org? >The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.    ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 19:14:29 +0000 (UTC) - From: lewis@spyder.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis)  Subject: Re: 7.3-1 craziness. Message-ID: <alqp2l$5s2$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   "konabear" <maurert@ameritech.net> writes in article <Fp3g9.8601$2E6.4269450@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com> dated Thu, 12 Sep 2002 16:37:57 GMT: 2 >HINT: Check out the sysgen parameter DCL_CTLFLAGS > I >And I strongly recommend reading Release Notes, New Features and Install % >guides, before upgrading OpenVMS. ;)   L That's 3 books.  Do you know how long it's been since this ADD sufferer read< 3 books?!  Thanks for the pointers to all those who helped.   L Perhaps my ADD is catching, because 100% of the responses from this forum soL far have addressed only the first of the four issues I raised in my originalI article.  I'm still in the dark about the PTHREAD thing, the REPLY thing, D and whether people think its a good idea to ship object libraries in software distributions.   H >BTW the change is for performance improvements. The random number is on  I Now that I've read that section of the FM I don't have a problem with it, L probably will do a workaround for my TPU-spawning so I can leave the rest of$ the system in high-performance mode.  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org > The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:22:18 GMT ( From: "konabear" <maurert@ameritech.net> Subject: Re: 7.3-1 craziness? Message-ID: <_H6g9.8629$2E6.4289261@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com>    Keith,  J The "power" drain of the old behavior is limited to the time of the spawn.C So take the number of times you spawn a day that there is already a K subprocess, and those are the very descrete times you'll see an improvement  from the new behavior.  I Also the change was specifically targeted for SMP boxes where pinging the J SCHED spinlock hunting for a unique process name not only adds overhead toI the process doing the spawning, but has the potential to slow things down F for other CPUs as well.  Very specifically this change is targeted for scaling up to 32 cpus.  L So if you have a single CPU, you log in once a day, create <username>_1 thruJ _4 at login time, the "high_performance mode" will not accomplish much. ;)H If you have 32 CPUs, 1000 users attached with an applicaiton that spawnsI every few user seconds, then things will seem better compared to previous 	 behavior.    <snip>K > Now that I've read that section of the FM I don't have a problem with it, K > probably will do a workaround for my TPU-spawning so I can leave the rest  of& > the system in high-performance mode. > - > --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org @ > The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 18:43:02 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) Subject: Re: AD/BC= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209121743.7d84683c@posting.google.com>   h koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote in message news:<6wlVyHsLog7E@eisner.encompasserve.org>...p > In article <343f30ae.0209120912.4e3e1544@posting.google.com>, SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) writes: > > I > > I say to those who still insist that 12:00 is neither am nor pm: what 	 > > about E > > A.D. and B.C.? Historians have determined that Christ was born at C > > least a few years before A.D. 1. The Calendar Faq says before 4  > > B.C.[1]. > >  > G >    Many are now usuing the terminaology C.E. (common era) instead of  	 >    A.D.     * Fine with me. I can handle either system.     * >  IIRC B.C. then means before common era.    F In the Common Era system, B.C. becomes B.C.E.: before the Common Era.     6 >    Maybe we should all just use  star date instead.     So what is star date zero?     Disclaimer: JMO  Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:07:27 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: AD/BC' Message-ID: <3D813FCB.C2314E89@fsi.net>    Bob Koehler wrote: > p > In article <343f30ae.0209120912.4e3e1544@posting.google.com>, SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman) writes: > > I > > I say to those who still insist that 12:00 is neither am nor pm: what 	 > > about E > > A.D. and B.C.? Historians have determined that Christ was born at C > > least a few years before A.D. 1. The Calendar Faq says before 4  > > B.C.[1]. > >  > F >    Many are now usuing the terminaology C.E. (common era) instead of2 >    A.D.  IIRC B.C. then means before common era.  A B.C. means "Before Christ". B.C.E. means "Before the Common Era".   6 >    Maybe we should all just use  star date instead.   New VMS wish list item?    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 12:04:21 -0700 (PDT) . From: Fabio Cardoso <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br>/ Subject: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein @ Message-ID: <20020912190421.69909.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com>  1 Anynone know a date when the first Itanium server , will be available to run HP-UX and OpenVMS ?) What will be the name of this beast ? :-)  GlobalDome ?   Regards    FC     =====  ========================== Fbio dos Santos Cardoso OpenVMS System Manager Rio de Janeiro - Brazil  fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br ==========================  2 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines  http://news.yahoo.com    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:27:03 GMT 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> 3 Subject: Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein 1 Message-ID: <rM6g9.9$7Y6.315461@news.cpqcorp.net>   I You can order the RX2600 (I think is the platform #, a dual CPU rackmount J server) today with HP-UX.  I believe it's backordered.  We have some beingI delivered in the next week for development.  There is also a workstation, 8 which also runs HP-UX and which we have ordered several.  F For a hint of the types of initial platform we'll be running on... seeG above.  We'll be working from small to big on the idea that the initial I systems will be for development and porting.  We'll eventually run on the C entire range of IPF systems from 1 to (say) 128 CPU's or even more.   F As to dates, I believe there is a roadmap published somewhere.  So I'd  rather not throw out dates here.       Fabio Cardoso wrote in message7 <20020912190421.69909.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com>... 2 >Anynone know a date when the first Itanium server- >will be available to run HP-UX and OpenVMS ? * >What will be the name of this beast ? :-)
 >GlobalDome ?  >  >Regards >  >FC  >  >===== >==========================  >Fbio dos Santos Cardoso  >OpenVMS System Manager  >Rio de Janeiro - Brazil >fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br  >==========================  > 3 >__________________________________________________  >Do you Yahoo!?   >Yahoo! News - Today's headlines >http://news.yahoo.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:04:48 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> 3 Subject: Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein . Message-ID: <Pj7g9.403773$me6.45862@sccrnsc01>  ; "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message : news:20020912190421.69909.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com...3 > Anynone know a date when the first Itanium server . > will be available to run HP-UX and OpenVMS ?  L Unless VMS is ported to Superdome II, it'll be a post-Superdome, post-Marvek box.  + > What will be the name of this beast ? :-)  > GlobalDome ?  G Nope. Something with a nautical motif. And no, not "Three Sheets to the  Wind."   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:47:12 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 3 Subject: Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein ' Message-ID: <3D81491C.2D67A4C3@fsi.net>    "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > = > "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message < > news:20020912190421.69909.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com...5 > > Anynone know a date when the first Itanium server 0 > > will be available to run HP-UX and OpenVMS ? > N > Unless VMS is ported to Superdome II, it'll be a post-Superdome, post-Marvek > box. > - > > What will be the name of this beast ? :-)  > > GlobalDome ? > I > Nope. Something with a nautical motif. And no, not "Three Sheets to the  > Wind."  ? Maybe that boat name they used in "Caddyshack": The Flying Wasp    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 22:51:25 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> 3 Subject: Re: Alpha + PA-RISC = Itanium Frankenstein + Message-ID: <3D81528B.B6F0A55@videotron.ca>    somebody wrote: K > > Nope. Something with a nautical motif. And no, not "Three Sheets to the 
 > > Wind."  I When I was in New Zealand back in 1992 and 1993, the HP building near the L shores had the winning America's cub boat. I suspect they were a big sponsorL of the NZ team and got their boat after the race.  I can't remember its name4 though. (I'd have to go though my slides to get it).   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:56:40 +0200 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> 0 Subject: AM/PM, BC/AC and different calendars...& Message-ID: <3D80E368.460011D@aaa.com>  : Speaking about time/dates, AM/PM, BC/AC and such things...  6 Note that the Islamic calendar is 11 days shorter then5 the western version, so why are people afraid of that ; something should happen on the 11-sep-2002 (western time) ? 1 It should have been the 31-Aug, which was exactly 6 one year (according to the islamic calendar) after the 11-sep-2001.  % Just to get things on topic again :-)    Jan-Erik Sderholm.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:08:36 GMT  From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium0 Message-ID: <00A13DEE.596F1E24@SendSpamHere.ORG>  b In article <alqe7e$kta$1@web1.cup.hp.com>, "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com> writes: >OpenVMS Into the Future > J >Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceJ >the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take placeH >November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. ThisI >Symposium is designed for the intermediate - advanced level technologist L >wishing to increase their knowledge of OpenVMS and associated technologies. >  > ( >Please visit the Symposium web site at:) >http://www.openvms.compaq.com/symposium/  > G >The OpenVMS Symposium web site will be changing on a regular basis, so  >please make sure to stop by.  > 5 >We look forward to your participation at this event.  >  >Warm Regards, >  >Sue >  >  >   M Does this mean that I should request my money back for my HPets registration?  --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:28:34 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium3 Message-ID: <12zw1M$xPa9r@eisner.encompasserve.org>   b In article <alqe7e$kta$1@web1.cup.hp.com>, "Sue Skonetski" <susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com> writes:  K > Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announce % > the first annual OpenVMS Symposium.       Yes!  Good move.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 14:58:29 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium+ Message-ID: <3D80E3D1.A5B5DB0@videotron.ca>    Sue Skonetski wrote: >  > OpenVMS Into the Future  > : > <...>VMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceK > the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take place D > November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA.  N Haven't checked the web site, but right way, KUDOS for the concept. If I had aE suggestion to make, I would ask that as much of the materials be made L available for download for those who may not have the budgets to travel down? there, thus reaching a greater proportion of the VMS customers.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:55:26 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium- Message-ID: <yq5g9.296892$aA.51549@sccrnsc02>   * <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message* news:00A13DEE.596F1E24@SendSpamHere.ORG...< > In article <alqe7e$kta$1@web1.cup.hp.com>, "Sue Skonetski"' <susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com> writes:  > >OpenVMS Into the Future > > L > >Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceL > >the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take placeJ > >November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. ThisK > >Symposium is designed for the intermediate - advanced level technologist @ > >wishing to increase their knowledge of OpenVMS and associated
 technologies.  > >  > > * > >Please visit the Symposium web site at:+ > >http://www.openvms.compaq.com/symposium/  > > I > >The OpenVMS Symposium web site will be changing on a regular basis, so  > >please make sure to stop by.  > > 7 > >We look forward to your participation at this event.  > >  > >Warm Regards, > >  > >Sue > >  > >  > >  > A > Does this mean that I should request my money back for my HPets 
 registration?   J Not necessarily. The event that Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski cooked up isK all VMS, all the time. HEPTS is a bit more diverse. Hope to see you at both  of them, though.       > --4 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM > 6 >   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" >    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:58:53 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. Message-ID: <Nt5g9.456419$UU1.73846@sccrnsc03>  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message% news:3D80E3D1.A5B5DB0@videotron.ca...  > Sue Skonetski wrote: > >  > > OpenVMS Into the Future  > > < > > <...>VMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceG > > the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take  place F > > November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. > J > Haven't checked the web site, but right way, KUDOS for the concept. If I had a G > suggestion to make, I would ask that as much of the materials be made I > available for download for those who may not have the budgets to travel  downA > there, thus reaching a greater proportion of the VMS customers.   K The kudos should be directed at Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski. Good idea on  the availability of collateral.   K If you plan on attending this event, be advised that there's a Red Roof Inn L less than a mile from the Sheraton Tara. Dunno the tariff, but it's gotta be cheaper than the Sheraton.  H Manchester NH is generally far less expensive to fly into than is Boston Logan.  J I'd get my registration in real fast. Word has it that the event will sell out rapidly.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:55:31 +0200 - From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium' Message-ID: <3D80F134.7275F0F3@Free.fr>   ! Do you plan an European show too?  When?  Where?   Thanks,    D.   Sue Skonetski wrote: >  > OpenVMS Into the Future  > B > Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased toD > announce the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS SymposiumC > will take place November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in  > Nashua, NH, USA.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:18:29 GMT 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium1 Message-ID: <pE6g9.7$OX6.306264@news.cpqcorp.net>   > Not to answer for Sue...  but I'll give my understanding.  No.  C The idea is to bring a symposium someplace where the engineers, and G management can easily attend and interact - without having to send some - limited number of them to some far off place.   I The meetings we run here internally - and for other more focused forums - I generally get well attended by everything from engineers to higher ups in H the food chain.  Almost everyone who attends them, makes a point to comeJ back for the next one.  *I* hope this is much the same on a broader scale.  H If it were done in Europe, it would end up being just a "Technical Days"J type thing, which is great - but it's much more limited in who (especially( us lower in the foodchain) might attend.   _Fred   > Didier Morandi wrote in message <3D80F134.7275F0F3@Free.fr>..." >Do you plan an European show too? >When? >Where?  >  >Thanks, >  >D.  >  >Sue Skonetski wrote:  >> >> OpenVMS Into the Future >>C >> Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to E >> announce the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium D >> will take place November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in >> Nashua, NH, USA.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:19:36 GMT . From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER): Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium4 Message-ID: <sF6g9.85286$1S3.2817173@news.chello.at>  a In article <yq5g9.296892$aA.51549@sccrnsc02>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes: K >Not necessarily. The event that Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski cooked up is L >all VMS, all the time. HEPTS is a bit more diverse. Hope to see you at both >of them, though.   I So, then the symposium is the event with "the warm and cosy VMS feelings" J and HPets is the event with (some?) guys who tell us to migrate to HP-UX ?   SCNR   -Peter  6 PS: You won't see me there neither nor unfortunately..   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atP A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMS Job(s)   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:00:03 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium- Message-ID: <nf7g9.297658$aA.51895@sccrnsc02>   ; "Peter LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message . news:sF6g9.85286$1S3.2817173@news.chello.at...B > In article <yq5g9.296892$aA.51549@sccrnsc02>, "Terry C. Shannon"  <terryshannon@attbi.com> writes:J > >Not necessarily. The event that Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski cooked up isI > >all VMS, all the time. HEPTS is a bit more diverse. Hope to see you at  both > >of them, though.  > K > So, then the symposium is the event with "the warm and cosy VMS feelings" L > and HPets is the event with (some?) guys who tell us to migrate to HP-UX ?  D Better to look at the sites and session offerings that to rely on myG opinion. HPETS covers many things, clearly Tru64 and the ultimate HP-UX I migration will be discussed. There are sessions on VMS, Windows, storage, H etc, etc, etc. But if your interests are VMS-specific, the VMS SymposiumI would be the place to be. I've seen the agenda, it does not seem warm and   cosy, looks pretty good in fact.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:02:38 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. Message-ID: <Oh7g9.403762$me6.46792@sccrnsc01>  < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message( news:Nt5g9.456419$UU1.73846@sccrnsc03... > < > "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message' > news:3D80E3D1.A5B5DB0@videotron.ca...  > > Sue Skonetski wrote: > > >  > > > OpenVMS Into the Future  > > > > > > > <...>VMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceI > > > the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take  > place H > > > November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. > > L > > Haven't checked the web site, but right way, KUDOS for the concept. If I > had a I > > suggestion to make, I would ask that as much of the materials be made K > > available for download for those who may not have the budgets to travel  > downC > > there, thus reaching a greater proportion of the VMS customers.  > J > The kudos should be directed at Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski. Good idea on! > the availability of collateral.  > I > If you plan on attending this event, be advised that there's a Red Roof  Inn K > less than a mile from the Sheraton Tara. Dunno the tariff, but it's gotta  be > cheaper than the Sheraton. > J > Manchester NH is generally far less expensive to fly into than is Boston > Logan. > L > I'd get my registration in real fast. Word has it that the event will sell > out rapidly.    C Futher to the lodging suggestions, I received the fiollowing from a 
 freiend...  B > The Red Roof is not only much cheaper than the Tare, it also hasB > better beds. The Howard Johnson motel an exit up is also cheaperA > and has better beds, but is a bit harder to navigate around due G > to an intersection you really want to negotiate in daylight the first E > time or two...it is up around Exit 5 if I recall right, of the tpk.  > B > The Tara's beds when I stayed there felt like something from theF > bottom of the line at Levitz', after 5 years of heavy abuse. SpringsD > that were worn out/tired, and the place was subtly dirty. The HoJoD > was much cleaner, had a nicer pool (and open longer!) and cheaper. > J > The Tara is of course next door to Spit Brook ZK3, so it is a reasonable > convention place.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 22:10:16 GMT ? From: "John Gemignani, Jr." <Firstname.Lastname@You.Know.Where> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. Message-ID: <3D80D5F1.159D99F3@You.Know.Where>  C BTW, Howard Johnson's is gone.  You'll be sleeping at a (soon to be * opened) Porsche/Audi dealership at exit 5.   -John        Terry C. Shannon wrote:  > > > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message* > news:Nt5g9.456419$UU1.73846@sccrnsc03... > > > > > "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message) > > news:3D80E3D1.A5B5DB0@videotron.ca...  > > > Sue Skonetski wrote: > > > >  > > > > OpenVMS Into the Future  > > > > @ > > > > <...>VMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceK > > > > the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take 	 > > place J > > > > November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. > > > N > > > Haven't checked the web site, but right way, KUDOS for the concept. If I	 > > had a K > > > suggestion to make, I would ask that as much of the materials be made M > > > available for download for those who may not have the budgets to travel  > > downE > > > there, thus reaching a greater proportion of the VMS customers.  > > L > > The kudos should be directed at Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski. Good idea > on# > > the availability of collateral.  > > K > > If you plan on attending this event, be advised that there's a Red Roof  > Inn M > > less than a mile from the Sheraton Tara. Dunno the tariff, but it's gotta  > be > > cheaper than the Sheraton. > >2L > > Manchester NH is generally far less expensive to fly into than is Boston
 > > Logan. > >cN > > I'd get my registration in real fast. Word has it that the event will sell > > out rapidly. > E > Futher to the lodging suggestions, I received the fiollowing from ae > freiend... > D > > The Red Roof is not only much cheaper than the Tare, it also hasD > > better beds. The Howard Johnson motel an exit up is also cheaperC > > and has better beds, but is a bit harder to navigate around due I > > to an intersection you really want to negotiate in daylight the firstrG > > time or two...it is up around Exit 5 if I recall right, of the tpk.p > > D > > The Tara's beds when I stayed there felt like something from theH > > bottom of the line at Levitz', after 5 years of heavy abuse. SpringsF > > that were worn out/tired, and the place was subtly dirty. The HoJoF > > was much cleaner, had a nicer pool (and open longer!) and cheaper. > > L > > The Tara is of course next door to Spit Brook ZK3, so it is a reasonable > > convention place.a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:18:03 -0400e6 From: "John.Malmberg" <Malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq>: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium* Message-ID: <alr3qu$sa2$1@web1.cup.hp.com>   Terry C. Shannon wrote:l > E > Futher to the lodging suggestions, I received the fiollowing from av > freiend... >  e5 >>The Howard Johnson motel an exit up is also cheaperoA >>and has better beds, but is a bit harder to navigate around due G >>to an intersection you really want to negotiate in daylight the first E >>time or two...it is up around Exit 5 if I recall right, of the tpk.e  C I definitely would not consider using that specific Howard Johnson.i  < I do not think that you could get reservations there anyway.  H The building there looks quite drafty right now, and the parking lot is I a mess.  That may all be cleaned up by November, but I doubt that a stay T there would be comfortable.T   -JohnO! malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq.hp  Personal Opinion OnlyO   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 16:05:50 -07001 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski)s: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium= Message-ID: <857e9e41.0209121505.1a5149b5@posting.google.com>a   Terry is correct.t  C The OpenVMS Symposium is not designed to replace ETS and if that isi1 what you are looking for you will be disapointed.t   sueV  e Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message news:<yq5g9.296892$aA.51549@sccrnsc02>...e, > <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message, > news:00A13DEE.596F1E24@SendSpamHere.ORG...> > > In article <alqe7e$kta$1@web1.cup.hp.com>, "Sue Skonetski"* >  <susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com> writes: > > >OpenVMS Into the Future > > >sN > > >Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceN > > >the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take placeL > > >November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. ThisM > > >Symposium is designed for the intermediate - advanced level technologist B > > >wishing to increase their knowledge of OpenVMS and associated >  technologies. > > >  > > >a, > > >Please visit the Symposium web site at:- > > >http://www.openvms.compaq.com/symposium/y > > > K > > >The OpenVMS Symposium web site will be changing on a regular basis, so?! > > >please make sure to stop by.] > > >F9 > > >We look forward to your participation at this event.o > > >y > > >Warm Regards, > > >e > > >Sue > > >: > > >M > > >  > >IC > > Does this mean that I should request my money back for my HPets- > registration?- > L > Not necessarily. The event that Mark Gorham and Sue Skonetski cooked up isM > all VMS, all the time. HEPTS is a bit more diverse. Hope to see you at bothr > of them, though. >  >  >  > > --6 > > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 >  VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM> > >t8 > >   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" > >    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:42:17 GMTo1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>y: Subject: Re: Assistance Solicited - Petition for Candidacy- Message-ID: <de5g9.296835$aA.51274@sccrnsc02>v  5 "David Froble" <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in message,& news:3D7E8C63.7010209@tsoft-inc.com...   <snip> > K > As for me, I'm not that big of a glutton for punishment.  However, I willu: > support VMS bigots, should they wish to buck the system. >eJ > Dave, who might have a list of directors that are definitely NOT friends of VMS,n+ > and isn't allowed to share the list.  :-(e  I Well, having sat on the Board, I know of several definite friends of VMS.eJ Jean Norton, whose term expires at the end of the year. Clyde Poole (worls& for TECSys, a definite VMS supporter).K Clay Denton, who was on the BoD but was not re-elected last time around. HehD may be running this time, though. Another definite pro-VMS person. IK consider myself to be a friend of VMS, too, having known and used it for 20. years.  B Beyond that, I'm not sure. We have a couple of Directors with UNIXJ backgtrounds, but I can'r recall any definite VMS-bashing at BoD meetings.F Closest I've heard is expressions of concern that Encompass is equated6 exclusively with VMS, which of course is not the case.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:44:08 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>s: Subject: Re: Assistance Solicited - Petition for Candidacy. Message-ID: <Yf5g9.456346$UU1.73685@sccrnsc03>  ; "Dale Coy" <dalecoy@obfuscation.spinn.net> wrote in messagec) news:untaum391fh8e6@corp.supernews.com...r  F > I try very hard to not be a BIGOT, and to appreciate the benefits ofL > diversity.  On the other hand, I started using VMS in 1982, and still love > using it every day.i >t > VMS and I are mutual friends.a >u  K Now that's something I didn't know... we both became acquainted with the OSc at the same time. " Amazing how fast 20 years goes by!   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:20:08 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>w: Subject: Re: Assistance Solicited - Petition for Candidacy, Message-ID: <3D811307.74BAD8E3@videotron.ca>  I I am of the opinion that VMS should have its one, single, worldwide, usersH group. Therefore, if what is left of DECUS is giving trouble to proe-VMSJ supporters, then such a group should be allowed to go where it wants and a dedicated VMS group be formed.  M The DECUS group (or whatever its name is this week) will quickly find that it:O has nothing left to support, with tru64 dead and VMS sent off to its own group.d  H Also, a unified worldwide group would have far more powerful membership.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 14:53:49 -0400i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> , Subject: Re: Cancelling writes to a log file, Message-ID: <3D80E2B9.80667BC5@videotron.ca>   Hein van den Heuvel wrote:P > Yes. It is trivial for a non-shared sequential file: Just use the 'Truncate on > Put' option. > See RMS reference manual:S   Thanks for the pointer.l   Another question:s  L When I do a $PUT, the RFA field is updated. Does the RFA now reflect the end. of the record I just wrote, or its beginning ?  8 would the following be correct: (all PUTs are sequential  
 	PUT record Ai 	Store RFA in "lastRFA" 
 	PUT record Bc
 	PUT record Cv
 	PUT record Dg 	$FIND by RFA with "lastRFA" 	PUT/Truncate record E   Would the above yield:	 	record Ag
 	record E  ?     K Also, in the case of shared access to the file, is the only issue to ensuregN that a second process does not do any writes between the PUT A (which gets the  last RFA) and the Put/truncate ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 19:29:13 GMTd9 From: Hein van den Heuvel <hein_netscape@eps.zko.dec.com>a, Subject: Re: Cancelling writes to a log file/ Message-ID: <3D80E830.3E4E8001@eps.zko.dec.com>    JF Mezei wrote:e  N > When I do a $PUT, the RFA field is updated. Does the RFA now reflect the end0 > of the record I just wrote, or its beginning ?  R In a sequential file a record is identified by its first byte (the length word for	 RFM=VAR).k  : > would the following be correct: (all PUTs are sequential >aT >         PUT record A;       Store RFA in "lastRFA"; PUT record B; PUT record;  PUT
 > record D< >         $FIND by RFA with "lastRFA"; PUT/Truncate record E >n7 > Would the above yield:       record A        record Ea >o  8 No it would yield just 'record E'. Easy enough to try...E If you want "record A;  record E" Then you need to save the RFA of B, K or have RMS refind that with 1 RAC=SEQ find/get after the  reposition to A.   M > Also, in the case of shared access to the file, is the only issue to ensuremP > that a second process does not do any writes between the PUT A (which gets the" > last RFA) and the Put/truncate ?  R Correct. If a process is likely to write those records with good speed (no waitingQ for unpredictable length terminal IOs) then one could consider calling SYS$MODIFYkQ with the KEEP_LOCK option to get a kind of 'bulk write'. Warning... there is very8 little> experience with this in combination with a truncate operation.   Cheers,e            Hein.   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:14:18 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)n! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB 3 Message-ID: <ga+bGKAdBdK7@eisner.encompasserve.org>   m In article <b096a4ee.0209111858.fe0dabc@posting.google.com>, spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) writes:e  - > That's why they have pilots and navigators.l  H    You miss the Reagan era?  Navigators haven't been flying for decades.   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 16:28:03 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB = Message-ID: <343f30ae.0209121528.31b643c9@posting.google.com>b  h koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote in message news:<ga+bGKAdBdK7@eisner.encompasserve.org>...o > In article <b096a4ee.0209111858.fe0dabc@posting.google.com>, spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) writes:  > / > > That's why they have pilots and navigators.  > J >    You miss the Reagan era?  Navigators haven't been flying for decades.   gee,E now that you state your position so well, I'm compelled to abandon myj position.   :-)a  F Uh, let's make that navigation tools, or, That's why they have pilots. Hey, someone's navigating!     Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:51:32 GMTe1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>d! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MBm' Message-ID: <3D813C0B.C4C5A3B2@fsi.net>c   Carl Perkins wrote:t > 7 > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes...i > }Carl Perkins wrote: > }>: > }> "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes...% > }> }briggs@encompasserve.org wrote:  > }> }>ec > }> }> In article <3D7D4ADD.45E7B55D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:aI > }> }> > "Approximation" in this case means "error". The difference *IS*i > }> }> > significant! > }> }>e0 > }> }> No.  That statement is false in general. > }> }F > }> }Some commercial aircraft are capable of being flown to a landingN > }> }entirely on automation (or so I am told, I've been out of aviation sinceN > }> }the early 90's). Given that, if a plane leaves New York for Honolulu andM > }> }the inertial guidance system commits an aggregate error of 3% en route, K > }> }instead of landing in Honolulu, I should think that one would need torN > }> }remember that one's seat cushion can also be used as a flotation device. > }> } > }> }-- > }> }David J. Dachtera2 > }>L > }> Any person who is not a moron knows that flying aircraft and estimatingB > }> the size of something on a disk drive are not the same thing. > }h
 > }Obviously.v > } K > }> Reread the subject line. What do aircraft have to to with this thread?. > }n  > }Ever heard of a "sub-thread"? > }pJ > }In this case, the issue is: is 3% an acceptable margin of error or not.H > }Various have been asserting yes, I've been disagreeing. The above was > G > No you haven't. You have been changing the subject to things that areoE > irrelevant to the topic at hand while completely missing the point.r  G Actually, no I haven't. You're just choosing to ignore the comparisons..   > [snip]; > Well, at least we now know where you are in your studies.t  E Wrong, again. That's YOUR milepost, I'm well past the graduate stage.C  I > }At work, we're developing (or trying to - new sub-thread danger here!)eH > }an enterprise backup strategy. I've been asked to assess the existingH > }systems and fill in a questionnaire. To provide meaningful numbers, ID > }can tolerate no more than a 0.1% error since in our case, 0.1% isG > }roughly 4 GB - 4 RZ26s (approx.), 2 RZ28s or one(1) RZ29. Most folksEG > }would consider 0.1% less than negligible. (Yes, you read that right:.@ > }"less than negligible", as in "not worthy of consideration".) > }--i > }David J. Dachtera > N > I seriously doubt that you really need to know it to the accuracy you claim.  E I don't doubt it, since I'm the one filling in the questionnaires andsA since we're talking about backup capability, yes, 4GB (that's 4 *.% 1024^3, by the way) *IS* significant.i  J > The variation in the size of a backup saveset of your data can easily beJ > larger than your margin of error, especially if you are using media withN > data compression to store your backups. How do you plan to account for that?  E I don't. They're asking how much data/disk space I have. What happensp( after that is up to *THEM* to deal with.   > [snip]B > The "fill in a questionnaire" thing sounds to me that it is some7 > bean-counting dufus that wants that kind of accuracy.   C Try again. It's being supervised by top-level management, so it hadC0 DAMNED well better be accurate *AND* verifiable.   > If so, perhapsF > you should explain to that person that such accuracy is irrelevant -G > this isn't a airline fight so nobody will be killed if you are off byf > a couple of percentb  % Never worked in healthcare, have you?=  5 >, and disk usage fluctuates - quite possibly by moreME > than that on a monthly or weekly, if not daily, basis in many cases=9 > (maybe not yours though, your data may be more static)._  F Hardly. Our data growth rate well exceeds the current hardware budget.  J > Considering the amount of storage you have, if the size of RZ26s, RZ28s,B > or RZ29s seems important to you then rethink what you are doing.   We already have. When we have:   o No budget for upgrades  B o No floorspace to install the upgrades, even if we could get them  E o No cooling capacity to allow the higher capacity, higher speed (andh hence higher heat) disks  G ...every kilobyte of disk space is precious. However, until our systems B are certified to run at ODS-2.5 (allows bigger BITMAP.SYS so lowerF clustersize per huge disk volume), we have to watch EVERY LAST EXTENT!   > [snip]I > Here is a question for you: Does the original poster need a figure that 1 > is exact, or is an estimate all that is needed?n > D > Answer (no fair peaking before you give yours): We don't know. THe/ > post did not give much in the way of details.l  < Then why teach him out to err? Teach him how to be accurate!  9 ...or did this suddenly change to a WhineBloze newsgroup?   ? I think you'll do well to study some, especially communication,kE especially in those areas where mostly visually-oriented people (mostUB women and a large percentage of the male population) learn best byH illustration. The more varied the "pictures" you can paint for them, theG easier it is for any individual in the group to find a familar frame of B reference. Hence, the better your chance to get your point across.  D I don't really expect as you'll grasp that, since it's not stated inA terms of heads, cylinders or sectors, but hey - it's worth a try!-   -- - David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/=   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:52:52 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB.' Message-ID: <3D813C60.7A46A269@fsi.net>n   Carl Perkins wrote:f > 7 > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes...e" > }briggs@encompasserve.org wrote: > }>` > }> In article <3D7E2896.C93618B9@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:& > }> > briggs@encompasserve.org wrote: > }> >>ac > }> >> In article <3D7D4ADD.45E7B55D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: I > }> >> > "Approximation" in this case means "error". The difference *IS*  > }> >> > significant! > }> >>a0 > }> >> No.  That statement is false in general. > }> >G > }> > Some commercial aircraft are capable of being flown to a landingoO > }> > entirely on automation (or so I am told, I've been out of aviation since.O > }> > the early 90's). Given that, if a plane leaves New York for Honolulu andaN > }> > the inertial guidance system commits an aggregate error of 3% en route,L > }> > instead of landing in Honolulu, I should think that one would need toO > }> > remember that one's seat cushion can also be used as a flotation device.A > }>+ > }> And your point would be what, exactly?  > }>L > }> That 3% in some cases counts as a grossly unacceptable margin of error? > }>> > }> That's true and nobody has been arguing with you about it > }M. > }Did you read Carl P.'s latest contribution? > }- > }--- > }David J. Dachtera > 
 > Did you? > C > Do you have the slightest hint of a clue as to what my point was?u  E I understand YOUR point completely (but of course I cannot agree with.3 it). I hold little hope of your ever grasping mine.    -- n David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systems" http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:55:25 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>e! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MBa' Message-ID: <3D813CF8.C64FC6FE@fsi.net>d   Bob Koehler wrote: > o > In article <b096a4ee.0209111858.fe0dabc@posting.google.com>, spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) writes:a > / > > That's why they have pilots and navigators.d > J >    You miss the Reagan era?  Navigators haven't been flying for decades.  H I thought he fired the ATC's... (Alzheimers had already set in then, butG no one noticed.) Nothing like endangering the flying public just to geth your point across...   -- e David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemsa http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/p   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 19:18:22 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)& Subject: Re: definition of SYS$SYSROOT= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209121818.646d388f@posting.google.com>O  h "John.Malmberg" <Malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq> wrote in message news:<alnr6k$l40$1@web1.cup.hp.com>... [...]uH > IIRC: Steve Hoffman did post an eplanation of why SYS$SYSROOT and the G > related SYS$COMMON.DIR are structured the way they are on this forum t" > sometime in the last year or so. > $ > A google search should turn it up.    I looked, but couldn't find it.   h Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. FeldmanA   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:57:46 GMTn1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>p: Subject: Re: Encompass - how long before I get a response?' Message-ID: <3D813D84.E9EBCF1D@fsi.net>n   Greg Cagle wrote:i >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: > > "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:  > >aP > >>Even as an Encompass BoD member, I haven't a clue. I note with interest that% > >>INTEREX has a VMS page, though...d > >  > >e > > ...and the URL is... ? > >aD > > (I'd assume one might try "http://www.interex.org/", but without? > > Yahoo-ing or Google-ing it first, that's a guess, at best.)I > >) > 1 > http://www.interex.org/tech/openvms/portal.htmls   Thax, much!"   -- - David J. Dachtera- dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/h   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:48:04 GMTa1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>p@ Subject: Re: Fabio Cardoso Enemy of the United States of America- Message-ID: <Ej5g9.296857$aA.51889@sccrnsc02>a  & "AG" <ang@xtra.co.nz> wrote in message- news:wqCf9.5387$Y3.1071654@news.xtra.co.nz...e > > > "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message* > news:doAf9.386669$me6.43562@sccrnsc01... >eK > > Of course, non-Americans have, in myh experience, a much different viewg of > > the USA than do we natives.  > >uJ > > Here's hoping for a peaceful 9-11. I'm betting it will be, at least on@ > > passenger aircraft. I'm flying from DFW to  BOS on  9-11-02. >m@ > Hmmm, I'm still trying to figure out if DFW = "Dead From Work" > or BOS = "Beaten On Sight" > F > Just an example, of course, but you sort of asked for it. After all,I > abbreviations assume that all the parties know what those stand for ...  >   / Doh, aren't all the TLAs in the DEC Dictionary?e  I The airlines use a somewhat different TLA system. Many abbreviations makepH sense (DFW = Dallas Fort Worth, BOS = Boston) but there's a few that are downright strange!   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:02:57 GMT:# From: "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com>V Subject: FMS on AlphaD; Message-ID: <Rp6g9.20108$R7.361686@twister.tampabay.rr.com>O  J We are beginning to upgrade our Alpha systems from VMS 7.2-1 to VMS 7.3-1,K but the software rollout schedule shows that FMS is a "mature" product withcH a max OS level of 7.3.  Some products show max os as 7.3-1, so it is notL that the list doesn't know about 7.3-1.   This will cause us quite a problemH as we have a lot of old code based on FMS.  If we have to rewrite it, itI will set our upgrade plans back quite a ways.  We have some very pressingn& needs for VMS 7.3.  What do we do now?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 17:43:19 -0400i From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: FMS on Alphap? Message-ID: <OF194E19A2.B450594F-ON85256C32.007716FA@metso.com>    Larry,  K Do you recall when I asked Mark Gorham about FMS and he assigned someone tos get back to me (which I has not happened, by the way)?  You said at that time something that madeW me think you think it's alive  and native Alpha. @ Would you care to comment about FMS going now and going forward?   -Normi        7 "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> on 09/12/2002 04:02:57 PMt  / Please respond to "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com>    To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:b Subject:    FMS on Alpha    J We are beginning to upgrade our Alpha systems from VMS 7.2-1 to VMS 7.3-1,K but the software rollout schedule shows that FMS is a "mature" product with-H a max OS level of 7.3.  Some products show max os as 7.3-1, so it is notD that the list doesn't know about 7.3-1.   This will cause us quite a problemsH as we have a lot of old code based on FMS.  If we have to rewrite it, itI will set our upgrade plans back quite a ways.  We have some very pressingD& needs for VMS 7.3.  What do we do now?   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 16:59:05 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: FMS on AlphaS3 Message-ID: <YFv0pL2vvhM$@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ^ In article <OF194E19A2.B450594F-ON85256C32.007716FA@metso.com>, norm.raphael@metso.com writes: >  > Larry, > M > Do you recall when I asked Mark Gorham about FMS and he assigned someone tot > get back to me (which K > has not happened, by the way)?  You said at that time something that madet > me think you think it's alivei > and native Alpha.oB > Would you care to comment about FMS going now and going forward? >  > -Normk >  >  >  > 9 > "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> on 09/12/2002 04:02:57 PMa > 1 > Please respond to "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com>  >  > To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > cc:r > Subject:    FMS on Alpha >  > L > We are beginning to upgrade our Alpha systems from VMS 7.2-1 to VMS 7.3-1,M > but the software rollout schedule shows that FMS is a "mature" product withoJ > a max OS level of 7.3.  Some products show max os as 7.3-1, so it is not) > that the list doesn't know about 7.3-1.0  E Don't count on "the list" as being uniformly updated, as they have tocD get approval from individual product managers, and FMS is not really getting a lot of attention.E  C Looking at the VMS V7.3-1 release notes, I see no changes likely tor affect FMS.p   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 19:33:35 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>  Subject: Re: FMS on AlphaV, Message-ID: <3D812439.6AF9B910@videotron.ca>   norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:iK > has not happened, by the way)?  You said at that time something that madee > me think you think it's alive  > and native Alpha.g  L FMS has been "mature" since before Alpha. It was part of the wholesale "sentI to wastebasket" operation by Bobbby GQ Palmer, until it was realised thatuN without FMS on Alpha, Digital would lose a lot of customers. (inlcude ALL-In-1< customers who at the time still represented a hefty revenu).  I So the mature FMS was ported native to Alpha. But no development was donee- except for ensuring it works on new versions.t  J It was said that FMS was one of the few exceptions to the Compaq rule thatK stated that mature products would not be ported to that IA674 thing. FMS ise) supposed to be ported/recompiled on IA64.a  L I would not worry about FMS not working on 7.3x Alpha. It is a stable mature* products and I doubt it will stop working.   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 15:49:52 -0700: From: craig.berry@signaltreesolutions.com (Craig A. Berry)5 Subject: Re: Help:  Error Linking Samba 2.2.4 for VMSg= Message-ID: <aae510ff.0209121449.6d85f33d@posting.google.com>   A "Michael D. Ober" <obermd.@.alum.mit.edu.nospam> wrote in messageo* news:7v3g9.19$zV6.26421@news.uswest.net...A > Below is the results of attempting to link Samba 2.2.4 for VMS.   B I've never built Samba, but there are some common porting gotchas.   > SYSTEM>set def [.source.vms] > SYSTEM>@link  J Are you sure there are no configuration parameters that are supposed to be passed to the link?0   > Linking SMBD4 > %LINK-W-MULDEF, symbol DECC$UTIME multiply defined; > in module DECC$SHR file SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]DECC$SHR.EXE;1-  K That's because before v7.3, VMS did not have a utime() in the C RTL but now4K it does, and it looks like Samba supplies its own version. One option wouldsJ be to recompile with /PREFIX=EXCEPT=(utime) to prevent it from looking forF the version in the C RTL. Or you could rename the home-made version to my_utime and do a    #define utime my_utime  K in a header that will be seen everywhere. Or you could put an #ifdef aroundsI the home-grown utime() so that it is only visible to the compiler for VMSoK versions 7.3 and greater (actually __CRTL_VER would be the predefined macroEA to check), thus causing the C RTL version to be used on VMS v7.3.e  F There is no way of knowing without extensive testing whether the C RTLI version will be as good as or better than the home-grown version at doing:F what Samba wants to do. More than likely the Samba version needs to beJ updated to fiddle with the FIB appropriately on ODS-5 volumes, which is toI say set the new access time field in the file information block when it'si
 available.    ' > %LINK-W-NUDFSYMS, 1 undefined symbol:. > %LINK-I-UDFSYM, SNPRINTF  C This appears to be a Samba-specific function and in fact there is aeK snprintf.c file in the distribution. Possibly an oversight that this didn'tpA get built and included in the object library, but that's only oneo possibility.  @ > When we attempted to compile from source we got the following:  L Are there any configuration options that should be passed to the compilation
 procedure?   > Compiling INTERFACES in LIBt >t% > if (!(ifr[i].ifr_flags & IFF_UP)) {g, > .........................................^@ > %CC-E-UNDECLARED, In this statement, "IFF_UP" is not declared.J > at line number 132 in file DKA300:[SAMBA$2_2_4.SOURCE.LIB]INTERFACES.C;1  I Traditional and tedious methods for finding out where and whether this istE defined and why that declaration (if it exists) is not visible to thet= compilation unit in question are really the only alternative.,0 CC/LIST/SHOW=ALL may provide useful information.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:59:48 GMTe. From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)! Subject: Re: hobbyist license reg"4 Message-ID: <Eu5g9.84502$1S3.2781019@news.chello.at>  w In article <Fm1g9.1462$Cw1.72148@newsfep1-win.server.ntli.net>, Peter Watkinson <peter.watkinson1@ntlworld.com> writes:i0 >I have an XP1000 workstation this isn't listed.  / What's wrong with "Unlisted Workstation" then ?V  J >                                                 AM I supposed to unscrewH >the heatsink then look at the cpu to get the cpu serial number? Is this >absolutely neccesary?  F Surely not. It's the system serial number, not the CPU one. Its on the+ back and something like (maybe) AYxxxxxxxx.    --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atP A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMS Job(s)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 15:23:35 -0400d  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>! Subject: Re: hobbyist license regv5 Message-ID: <1020912151703.1033B-100000@Ives.egh.com>i  + On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, Peter Watkinson wrote:o   > Hi folks,s >  > AT the Montagar License reg. >  > ' > Hobbyist OpenVMS License Registration  >  > page >  > it says cpu type >  > then >  > cpu serial numbero > J > I have an XP1000 workstation this isn't listed. AM I supposed to unscrewI > the heatsink then look at the cpu to get the cpu serial number? Is thisg > absolutely neccesary?e  @ Absolutely not!  Look on the back of the box for a serial numberB sticker.  (It usually has model info as well, and serial number in? the form "S/N aannnnnnn" where "aa" is a two-letter code givingtB the factory where the system was made, and "nnnnnnn" is a number.)  A If you can't find a serial number, then make one up, e.g. PW00001   (for Peter Watkinson system #1.)  > This serial number is only used for keeping track of licenses.? It isn't enforced by anything.  The system serial number is nota@ normally visible to software.  (Some Alphas have a serial number> field in the console environment variables, that can be set by= anyone using the console stand-alone, but the license managers doesn't look at this.)  	 > cheers,i >  > Peter  > peter.watkinson1@ntlworld.com-   -- - John Santos- Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 16:54:49 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)e! Subject: Re: hobbyist license rego3 Message-ID: <pgOU0z7nLR3m@eisner.encompasserve.org>   X In article <1020912151703.1033B-100000@Ives.egh.com>, John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> writes:- > On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, Peter Watkinson wrote:<   >> cpu serial number >>  K >> I have an XP1000 workstation this isn't listed. AM I supposed to unscrew<J >> the heatsink then look at the cpu to get the cpu serial number? Is this >> absolutely neccesary? > B > Absolutely not!  Look on the back of the box for a serial numberD > sticker.  (It usually has model info as well, and serial number inA > the form "S/N aannnnnnn" where "aa" is a two-letter code givingtD > the factory where the system was made, and "nnnnnnn" is a number.)  F Obviously the Montegar web page should be changed to say System Serial% Number rather than CPU Serial Number.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:07:00 GMTi From: system@SendSpamHere.ORGo% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERTh0 Message-ID: <00A13DEE.206CB781@SendSpamHere.ORG>  b In article <3D80BEAF.1974F9E@mindspring.com>, Atlant Schmidt <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> writes: >"David J. Dachtera" wrote:  >aJ >> The issue with Sadly Insane himself is that he is a lying barbarian whoH >> will stop at nothing to further his own personal image in the eyes ofH >> his (captive) nation. The issue is the danger he poses as a terrorist= >> sympathizer and/or proponent, even as a terrorist himself.r >y. >That could, of course, describe another world& >leader, one who is *KNOWN* to possess+ >Nuclear, excuse me, "Nukular", Biological,t* >and Chemical Weapons of Mass Destruction. >h >Atlant  >g >i   You have someone in mind?  f --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 14:42:15 -0400u- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>e% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERTe+ Message-ID: <3D80E004.9837151@videotron.ca>r  $ "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" wrote: > 9 > The real reason behind virtually all of this starvationt3 > is the fact that most of the foreign aid, whethers6 > in financial or commodity form, is diverted from its9 > intended use by the kleptocratic despots who hold powere > in these counties.  M The real reason that famine continues is that 1first world government usually L respond only in times of severe crisis (eg: when the media take notice and aK government is compelled to be seen as helping those poor people in order tow. maintain voter approval in their own country).  E In such cases, the only help they can bring is to send tons of wheat.>  C But in reality, the real need for those countries is to build waterII wells/bores to help the people survive a dry period and still have enoughmN water to plant stuff and be more self sufficient. Give them a permanent sourceH of water and the people will settle down at that location and build fromM there. Without a permanent source of water, they have to move around in large K "heards" to follow the water and find the next area where they can survive.h  H Some may say that the australian aboriginal were savage when they killedK killed the second baby when they had twins. (or so I am told). But in fact,sM considering the very limited amount of water available and their need to movelM around to find the next water hole after the emptied one, then it makes senseiL to ensure that you have enough water to make one baby healthy. If you have 2M babies, and you have insufficient water, then neither will be healthy and youhH also risk making the rest of the tribe unhealthy because of greater than expected water consumption.r  G Perhaps people in africa need better birth control to ensure that theiriN population remains at sustainable levels versus the amount of water available.L With greater technology, you can increase the amount of water available, butJ you still need to ensure your population matches that of the water supply.  H Having cycled across the australian desert, I can tell you that WATER ISI EVERYTHING.  I have great respect for the aboriginals who survived in theeM harshest of times ON FOOT, without maps or GPS or computers, and without nicez= plastic water containers etc. I had it easy compared to them.p   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 15:04:09 -0400h- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> % Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERTr, Message-ID: <3D80E525.11B3EE5E@videotron.ca>   "Alan E. Feldman" wrote:9 > So the whole A.D./B.C. system falls apart using literal  > interpretations.  N Actually, the A.D/B.C. calendar is perhaps unconstitutional since it assumes aZ particular religion and does not respect the religions of citizens who are not christians.  K As such, the world should change over to a new calendar whose year 0 is thenI smithsonian astronomical year. This would definitely be agnostic.  And it K would be a great marketing thing for VMS since it would be the only OS withmM date format that is native with the real calendar, unlike Unix which has somen& arbritary meaningless date for year 0.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:14:52 -0400t- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>p% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT1, Message-ID: <3D8111CB.A18AA360@videotron.ca>   Bob Koehler wrote:E >    Influential members of Congress do have access to the secrets heaE >    can't share with the U.N., can't share with the American public,n< >    and even those he probably can't share with Tony Blair.  K When there are claims of such secrets that cannot be shared with anyone, it<D usually means that the information does not exist or was fabricated.  H The USA has already downgraded their accusations. Irak no longer has theK ability to build nuclear bombs as was accused before. Now the USA says thatsJ given access to the materials, it would take at least one year for Irak toF build such a bomb (or the proprietary USA equivalent, a nukular bomb).N (big whoopty doo, I suspect that anyone, given the materials, could build such a bomb inside of a year).t  E Note that the UN inspection teams should be UN teams, not teams whoseoL membership is dictated by the USA where the USA makes sure that at least oneH person is not acceptable to Irak, resulting in Irak appearing to preventL inspection teams. And while the teams are on site, the USA should not recall5 them just before attacking Irak, as was done in 1998.l   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 22:04:09 GMTM* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERTpC Message-ID: <tb8g9.604088$2p2.24993848@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>.  F "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> wrote in messageE news:BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E49028BEAA8@rlghncst964.usps.gov...s   ...o  3 > The use of chemical weapons against the Kurds has6 > been documented. >>8 > Saddam's son-in-law, Hussein Kamel Hassan, was heavily2 > involved in Iraq's weapons development programs. > 5 > He defected and has made numerous public statementse7 > about what Iraq is doing wrt NBC weapons development.u  L You seem to be as confused (or deliberately obfuscating) as Dubya is.  WhileL brutal repression of one's internal population is certainly repugnant to anyK civilized people, it is in no way terrorism but rather much more similar to J the kind of thing that the Israelis do with the weapons we give them - andD thus in no way connected with the post-9/11 jihad that the Shrub hasC embarked upon.  I personally happen to believe that state-sponsoredvL atrocities are even more heinous than terrorist atrocities, but that's about- as much connection as exists between the two.   K As for weapons of mass destruction, Saddam appears more to be following our L own time-honored policy of defense through strength than to be preparing forL outward aggression.  At least the probability of Iraq getting invaded in theF near future seems to be a great deal higher than that of Iraq invadingF anyone else:  if I were in his shoes, I'd be trying to develop a hefty/ deterrent as well to make the U.S. think twice.   J And, as most of the rest of the world has observed more times than one canG count, the countries near Iraq who would be most at risk from any Iraqi0I aggression are far less anxious for us to take matters into our own handsrF than our own leaders are, sitting safely here on the other side of the world.   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 23:53:18 GMTd, From: "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@openvms.org>% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT > Message-ID: <ON9g9.19009$ip3.1416129@twister.southeast.rr.com>  ? "Atlant Schmidt" <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote in messageA' news:3D80BEAF.1974F9E@mindspring.com...r > "David J. Dachtera" wrote: >tK > > The issue with Sadly Insane himself is that he is a lying barbarian who I > > will stop at nothing to further his own personal image in the eyes of I > > his (captive) nation. The issue is the danger he poses as a terrorist(> > > sympathizer and/or proponent, even as a terrorist himself. >-/ > That could, of course, describe another world ' > leader, one who is *KNOWN* to possesss, > Nuclear, excuse me, "Nukular", Biological,+ > and Chemical Weapons of Mass Destruction..       That's a bit of a stretch.   --   Kenneth Farmer http://www.Tru64.org http://www.OpenVMS.org http://www.LinuxHPC.org    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:55:11 GMTa* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT C Message-ID: <PHag9.486332$Aw4.20576325@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   7 "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@openvms.org> wrote in messagee8 news:ON9g9.19009$ip3.1416129@twister.southeast.rr.com...A > "Atlant Schmidt" <atlantnospam@mindspring.com> wrote in messager) > news:3D80BEAF.1974F9E@mindspring.com...l > > "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > >.I > > > The issue with Sadly Insane himself is that he is a lying barbarian  whovK > > > will stop at nothing to further his own personal image in the eyes oflK > > > his (captive) nation. The issue is the danger he poses as a terrorist @ > > > sympathizer and/or proponent, even as a terrorist himself. > >e1 > > That could, of course, describe another worldc) > > leader, one who is *KNOWN* to possessc. > > Nuclear, excuse me, "Nukular", Biological,- > > and Chemical Weapons of Mass Destruction.r >l >g >S > That's a bit of a stretch.  J Agreed, if one can take your statement literally.  GWB can't reasonably beJ characterized as a 'barbarian' (though some of the same arguments could beJ made against characterizing Saddam as one as well, and the 'lying' portionJ they can both lay claim to).  The 'will stop at nothing to further his ownH personal image in the eyes of his nation' part hits a lot closer to homeJ (again, for both), but the parenthetical '(captive)' is less applicable toK the Shrub (his captives are for the most part willing).  Neither appears tosK be a 'terrorist sympathizer and/or proponent', but both could reasonably be.J considered 'terrorists' by those on or potentially on the receiving end of their military actions.(   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:23:39 GMT51 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>s% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERTe' Message-ID: <3D814397.17B636F9@fsi.net>o   Larry Kilgallen wrote: > ] > In article <3D800633.31CD5415@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > < > Please restrict comp.os.vms discussion to relevant topics.   Ya-VOL, Herr Kommandant!   Shultz???!!!   Shutup, Klink!   -- , David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:26:34 GMTO1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>-% Subject: Re: IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERTe' Message-ID: <3D814446.593A9202@fsi.net>m   Paddy O'Brien wrote: > [snip]A > To go back to where you mentioned VMS, in the scenario that youiH > postulated you would surely alert all "friends -- even Fred, to ensure > that VMS kept going :-)> >  > Regards, Paddy  $ Quite right, my friend, quite right!   -- r David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systems} http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/s   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:05:01 GMT*1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> I Subject: Re: lexicals (was: RE: SET PROTECTION (SET SECURITY/PROTECTION)"t' Message-ID: <3D813F38.95F03B67@fsi.net>    Bob Koehler wrote: > ] > In article <3D800310.5EDCAF5D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:l > E > > If DCL supported floats, I could even see letting that behind them. > > "brains" behind a new lexical: F$FORMAT(). > $ >    Redundant with f$fao, isn't it?  C Dunno. Does (F)$FAO provide directives that allow the formatting ofnF floating point and/or scaled integer data with decimal points, commas,8 trailing signs and floating dollar signs like FORMAT$()?  H I don't recall ever seeing anything like that, but I'm hardly the expert
 on it ($FAO).s   -- n David J. Dachteras dba DJE SystemsR http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/-   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 14:00:57 -0700 From: ar14ya@yahoo.com (Ar Ya)Y Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!a= Message-ID: <fbd58baf.0209121300.1d98fe78@posting.google.com>t  d winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote in message news:<00A13BCA.F50E06FD@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>...^ > In article <3D7D646A.AFDBC0F1@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > >tP > >Since CSWS is nothing more than a rebadged Apache server compiled on VMS,  IsN > >the cost difference   really worth the difference between Apache on VMS and > >Apache on Linux ? > N > "Nothing more than a rebadged Apache server compiled on VMS."  It's a littleM > hard to tell if you mean to be as dismissive of the considerable efforts ofcO > the CSWS team in VMS Engineering as you sound.  They've done a lot more work 20 > just unpacking gzipped sources and typing MMS. > 	 > -- Alan,  C Out of curiosity, does anyone know what exactly they've done?  What C are the big advantages over Apache on some Unix variant (aside frombD the obvious of being on VMS)?  What are the drawbacks (e.g. will all* the usual modules compile cleanly on VMS)?  5 Is anyone here using CSWS for serious production use?p   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 15:52:55 -0600 (MDT)a" From: John Nebel <nebel@csdco.com>Y Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!sE Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.21.0209121551260.427-100000@athena.csdco.com>a  B Yes, there is someone using Apache/VMS for serious production use.   It works well.  
 John Nebel   On 12 Sep 2002, Ar Ya wrote:  f > winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote in message news:<00A13BCA.F50E06FD@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>...` > > In article <3D7D646A.AFDBC0F1@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > > >aR > > >Since CSWS is nothing more than a rebadged Apache server compiled on VMS,  IsP > > >the cost difference   really worth the difference between Apache on VMS and > > >Apache on Linux ? > > P > > "Nothing more than a rebadged Apache server compiled on VMS."  It's a littleO > > hard to tell if you mean to be as dismissive of the considerable efforts ofaQ > > the CSWS team in VMS Engineering as you sound.  They've done a lot more work y2 > > just unpacking gzipped sources and typing MMS. > >  > > -- Alane > E > Out of curiosity, does anyone know what exactly they've done?  What E > are the big advantages over Apache on some Unix variant (aside fromhF > the obvious of being on VMS)?  What are the drawbacks (e.g. will all, > the usual modules compile cleanly on VMS)? > 7 > Is anyone here using CSWS for serious production use?c >    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:24:36 GMTd$ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUY Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!B8 Message-ID: <00A13E09.BB22FAD4@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  ^ In article <fbd58baf.0209121300.1d98fe78@posting.google.com>, ar14ya@yahoo.com (Ar Ya) writes:e >winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote in message news:<00A13BCA.F50E06FD@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>...n_ >> In article <3D7D646A.AFDBC0F1@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:  >> >Q >> >Since CSWS is nothing more than a rebadged Apache server compiled on VMS,  IshO >> >the cost difference   really worth the difference between Apache on VMS andl >> >Apache on Linux ?e >> yO >> "Nothing more than a rebadged Apache server compiled on VMS."  It's a littleeN >> hard to tell if you mean to be as dismissive of the considerable efforts ofP >> the CSWS team in VMS Engineering as you sound.  They've done a lot more work 1 >> just unpacking gzipped sources and typing MMS.  >> e
 >> -- Alan >e> >Out of curiosity, does anyone know what exactly they've done?  M The release notes should give a clue.  Useful stuff that they've done or  had J done: Mod_openvms_auth, which lets Apache authenticate against the SYSUAF,L expanded in 1.3 to allow authentication against ACLs held by processes, etc.K Support of su_exec via the persona services.  Ability to put ssl_cache into:M Galactic shared memory or cluster-accessible disk with access mediated by thenL DLM - no crufty semaphore files. Apache module intercommunication via sharedB memory, not disk files. Nice supported, packaged, PCSI-installable
 PERL and PHP.o     >  What D >are the big advantages over Apache on some Unix variant (aside from  >the obvious of being on VMS)?    O This isn't a complete account; it's what I can think of off the top of my head.A  M For my laboratory (SSRL - what I say wouldn't be agreed with at higher levels>M in SLAC, which runs Unix and NT webservers), the biggest advantage _is_ being J on VMS - we've already got a VMS cluster, our databases live on VMS, we'reL serving data that was already on the VMS system, etc.  We don't have to mess. with NFS mounting, file replication, etc, etc.  I For new installations, I think there's a case to be made for VMS as a webpN platform - ease of management, uptime benefits of clustering (although currentI webserver practice seems to do pretty well with much less overall capablelM clusters), invincibility against common scripted attacks, etc, etc.  (There'soL also cases to be made for considering WASD and OSU servers instead of CSWS.)  & >What are the drawbacks (e.g. will all+ >the usual modules compile cleanly on VMS)?g  I Not sure what all the usual modules are; I think I recall that everythinguH designated core is present, and mod_perl, mod_php, mod_ssl are included,J mod_WebDAV shows up in 1.3 (beta), mod_python was ported in the Python 1.5$ timeframe and may be ported again.    J However, judging by porting Perl extensions, there's no guarantee that anyJ given extension will build cleanly, although with recent versions of DECC,K it's pretty likely to compile even if DECC complains about a lot of sloppy eL usage.  I'd suspect that most modules that compile on multiple Unices and onN Windows will compile on VMS, but I don't have any direct experience with that.  6 >Is anyone here using CSWS for serious production use?   Define "serious."i   -- Alano   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 02:33:12 GMTo From: lbohan@dbc..spamless..com Y Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!Y8 Message-ID: <2cj2ougg5ho3qa6uvecp25vdbrqmhjve6q@4ax.com>  @ On Fri, 13 Sep 2002 00:24:36 GMT, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU wrote:  J >Not sure what all the usual modules are; I think I recall that everythingI >designated core is present, and mod_perl, mod_php, mod_ssl are included, K >mod_WebDAV shows up in 1.3 (beta), mod_python was ported in the Python 1.5w% >timeframe and may be ported again.  - >-K >However, judging by porting Perl extensions, there's no guarantee that anymK >given extension will build cleanly, although with recent versions of DECC,aL >it's pretty likely to compile even if DECC complains about a lot of sloppy M >usage.  I'd suspect that most modules that compile on multiple Unices and on.O >Windows will compile on VMS, but I don't have any direct experience with that.e  < iirc, if one wanted to use a version of perl, other than the= 5.6.1 kitted in PCSI,  one had to rebuild CSWS from sources;    5 I wondered  if you knew if that was still the case ? h   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 14:30:24 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>dY Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!s, Message-ID: <3D80DD3E.A9EA1465@videotron.ca>   jlsue wrote:G > I have no problem with selling the systems, but we still need to make D > money at it.  I sincerely doubt that we should put too much of ourB > resources into the effort to try to "gain marketshare" from a PC	 > market.d  H Based on all of the May 7th announcements and documents, "gaining marketU share" does not seem to be part of the "plan of record" commitments from Carly/Curly.)  K However, consider that VMS now has 0% market share in new systems. Consider-F that units sold is an important metric to attract the attention of theH media/press to show that yor product has growth momentum. (this is turns attracts ISVs).-  K It is far easier to take VMS, configure it for a workstation (already done)eH and sell it on competitive workstations. I am not talking about consumerM desktops that sell for less than a vacuum cleaner. But the markup from wintelaL must be reasonable in order to make your product viable. Apple seems to haveK found a right product markup percentage to allow it to have better quality,3@ and still sell enough units to make the product line profitable.  N One could apply the very same logic to Digital/Compaq/Whatever's philosophy ofJ concentrating only on the largest machines (Wildfire stuff).  Do they sell> them in sufficient qualitities to really make money on them ?   J According to Compaq's propaganda, the answer would be a resounding NO. TheH June 25 decisions were "justified" on the fact that Compaq wasn't makingK enough money to continue to develop Alpha. But I bet that if there had been L higher production volumes of Alpha due to it being used in more workstationsJ and lower end systems, Compaq would have had a much more difficult time to justify the murder of Alpha.  J (we all know that Compaq's excuses for the murder of alpha were bogus, butM some of them were credible enough that the press didn't really question them,JM but had Alpha been more visible in more markets instead of just being used inRG a few Wildfire systems sold here and there, then the press may have hadhI questiosn about Compaq's wisdom of killing Alpha (which means that Compaqh, would have thought twice before killing it).  J Another important issue: Lets *assume* that Scott Stallard's original memoN reflect the true intentions of HP. If you have just a few large customers thatJ still use VMS, it is far easier to implement your "mass migration to Unix"M than if you have tens of thousands of individual smaller customers all around.> the world, using an ever widening array of 3rd party software.  J The smaller customers are still VERY beneficial to VMS even if they do notN bring any incremental profit to Digital/Compaq/Whatever. I'd say that they are% crucial to the survival of a product.d  L I ask you: where are Cray and CDC today ? As the low end products scaled up,L they were pushed out of the market completely. The only way to survive is toM have low end market share and competed head to head against those who have noM  problems competeing against you.    N I find it ironic to witness the catfight between Andrew and Fred. I do not seeK Sun as such a large threath to VMS anymore.  Both Sun and VMS have a commonbJ enemy: HP's wintel stuff that is being shoved up the enterprise as fast asE they can convince customers to forget about all the flaws of Windows.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 23:17:48 -0500 7 From: "Craig A. Berry" <craigberry@nospam.telocity.com> Y Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS just yawns!d% Message-ID: <3d8166ed$1_2@nopics.sjc>   G For folks interested in what really went into the CSWS port, there's no 8 reason to guess. Read the source, which is available at:  L <http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/apache/csws_source.html>    lbohan@dbc..spamless..com wrote:> > iirc, if one wanted to use a version of perl, other than the? > 5.6.1 kitted in PCSI,  one had to rebuild CSWS from sources; > > 7 > I wondered  if you knew if that was still the case ? r  G That can't be true for Perl. It might be true for mod_perl, but only if C the CSWS binary kit does not ship with headers and either object ort run-time libraries.m   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:29:02 GMT . From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER) Subject: Re: MANUaL DCL 4 Message-ID: <yG7g9.85876$1S3.2836280@news.chello.at>  _ In article <ee9e24f1.0209060220.2eb70c61@posting.google.com>, ac.atn@sarenet.es (David) writes:.F >Im trying to redo a .com file for printing on a plotter and i need a0 >mual of dcl, someone knows where can i find it?  - Online at http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/w$ (Used) Paper at http://www.ebay.com/   -- a Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERo% Network and OpenVMS system specialistt E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atP A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm looking for (a) Network _and_ VMS Job(s)   ------------------------------   Date: 13 Sep 02 04:40:32 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)o1 Subject: Re: Memo:  Re: Deleting expired licensesn) Message-ID: <WUq+7bekb01E@elias.decus.ch>-  I In article <yCV$ZIOa3JkW@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net< (Larry Kilgallen) writes:a >> u >> :* >> ** HSBC's website is at www.hsbc.com ** >> 0G >> ********************************************************************tE >>  This message and any attachments are confidential to the ordinaryi  = <longest email disclaimer I think I've seen snippety snipped>c  G >> ********************************************************************o > , > We're not happy until you're not happy :-) > C > IMPORTANT: This email is intended for the use of  the  individualLC > addressee(s)  named  above  and  may  contain information that is C > confidential,  privileged  or  unsuitable  for  overly  sensitivesC > persons  with  low  self-esteem, no sense of humour or irrational C > religious beliefs. If you are not  the  intended  recipient,  anydC > dissemination,  distribution  or  copying  of  this  email is noteC > authorised (either explicitly or implicitly) and  constitutes  anuC > irritating  social  faux  pas. Unless the word absquatulation hasIC > been used in its correct context somewhere  other  than  in  thiseC > warning, it does not have any legal or grammatical use and may beoC > ignored. No animals were  harmed  in  the  transmission  of  this C > email,  although  the  yorkshire  terrier  next door is living on C > borrowed time, let me tell you. Those of you with an overwhelming C > fear  of  the unknown will be gratified to learn that there is no C > hidden message revealed by reading  this  warning  backwards,  souC > just ignore that Alert Notice from Microsoft: However, by pouring.C > a complete circle of salt around yourself and your  computer  youeC > can  ensure  that  no harm befalls you and your pets. If you have C > received this email in error, please  add  some  nutmeg  and  eggCC > whites  and place it in a warm oven for 40 minutes. Whisk briefly C > and   let    it    stand    for    2    hours    before    icing.i   LOL!  e __
 Paul Sture Switzerlando   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:24:34 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)C! Subject: Re: Mr. Bush at the U.N.m3 Message-ID: <nQW7qBtQlCt$@eisner.encompasserve.org>y   In article <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E49028BEAA8@rlghncst964.usps.gov>, "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> writes:t > 7 > President Bush is going to address the U.N. today andT, > I think he's going to make the case there.  A    Much more important to me is that he has said he will seek thesA    blessing of Congress and the support of the American people.  s  D    Influential members of Congress do have access to the secrets he D    can't share with the U.N., can't share with the American public, :    and even those he probably can't share with Tony Blair.  H    I don't normally hold too much faith in the politicians, after all itK    was they who sent so many to VietNam, but I do want to see the reaction  G    of those in the know.  Only then will I have a real grasp on whetheraH    Iraq is close to a weapon of mass destruction, or whether the currentE    president just feels he had some kind of destiny to finish the joby    his father felt he couldn't.t  E    If Bush can't convince Congress and cannot drum up support amongst D    Americans, our allies and others around the world should clearly 1    stand against him and be wary of his policies.t  E    If he convinces Congress and the American people there really is a.F    problem now in Iraq; and England, or just some of its leaders, are G    the only ones willing to stand up with us, well nothing's new there.N  E    I was much more sceptical of George W. Bush before Tony Blair came D    out in his support.  I don't think the PM is that easy to sway orH    leans toward anywhere near the same politics.  I do believe that Bush0    gave Blair details that he can't make public.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:21:29 GMT91 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>E! Subject: Re: Mr. Bush at the U.N. ' Message-ID: <3D814312.D5E0A67B@fsi.net>9   Bob Koehler wrote: >  > In article <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E49028BEAA8@rlghncst964.usps.gov>, "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> writes:t > >h9 > > President Bush is going to address the U.N. today and". > > I think he's going to make the case there. > C >    Much more important to me is that he has said he will seek theuA >    blessing of Congress and the support of the American people.u > E >    Influential members of Congress do have access to the secrets heaE >    can't share with the U.N., can't share with the American public,E< >    and even those he probably can't share with Tony Blair. > J >    I don't normally hold too much faith in the politicians, after all itL >    was they who sent so many to VietNam, but I do want to see the reactionI >    of those in the know.  Only then will I have a real grasp on whether J >    Iraq is close to a weapon of mass destruction, or whether the currentG >    president just feels he had some kind of destiny to finish the jobi! >    his father felt he couldn't.V > G >    If Bush can't convince Congress and cannot drum up support amongst E >    Americans, our allies and others around the world should clearlyt3 >    stand against him and be wary of his policies.k > G >    If he convinces Congress and the American people there really is a G >    problem now in Iraq; and England, or just some of its leaders, areeI >    the only ones willing to stand up with us, well nothing's new there.  > G >    I was much more sceptical of George W. Bush before Tony Blair cametF >    out in his support.  I don't think the PM is that easy to sway orJ >    leans toward anywhere near the same politics.  I do believe that Bush2 >    gave Blair details that he can't make public.  G Anyone wishing to "view the evidence" and wiat for Pres. Bush to "cougha> it up" may need to visit your local public library's archives.  G The "Gulf War" was late summer of 1991 until early Winter of 1992. ThatuF was, in good measure, before the Internet's rise to public prominence.C So, searching the web for it may not as fruitful as one might hope. & (Then again, it might - y'never know.)  = Some items (among many) to look for - you should find photos,-A eye-witness accounts and such in the U.S. press as well that fromL	 overseas:l  C o Iraq's use of bio weapons against its own citizens (ref: "Kurds")n  ; o Iraq's push into Kuwait and attrocities committed during.0  G o Iraq's eco-sabotage upon retreating from Kuwait and the cleanup afterP  G o Iraq's refusal to capitulate to conditions it had already accepted tooB cease hostilities: that it allow free and unfettered access to its% weapons stores and development areas.   D o Recent British intelligence (including recon. photos) showing thatA Iraq has developed drone aircraft with the sole design purpose ofs2 delivering biological and/or toxic chemical agents  H I offer no statements regarding these or anything you may find. I simplyH state their existence and suggest how to find them for yourself. Make of these what you will.   -- b David J. Dachteras dba DJE Systemsr http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:01:25 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)H Subject: Re: ORD3 Message-ID: <Nrx29U9B491a@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  Z In article <alnjqs$hnm$1@milo.mcs.anl.gov>, "Tony Scandora" <Scandora@cmt.anl.gov> writes: > L > A bit off the track of this newsgroup, but for the record, ORD was OrchardL > Field, a military airport.  It was converted to commercial use and renamedC > in honor of Lt. Col. Edward F. O'Hare, a World War II pilot, whenpJ > land-locked Midway airport could no longer support Chicago's air trafficN > demand.  Chicago's original Municipal airport was renamed Midway in honor of > that World War II battle.i  =    Now tell us why the VORTAC at IAD (Dulles) is AML (Armel)?e   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:30:24 GMT01 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>W Subject: Re: ORD' Message-ID: <3D81452A.F9494442@fsi.net>-   Bob Koehler wrote: > \ > In article <alnjqs$hnm$1@milo.mcs.anl.gov>, "Tony Scandora" <Scandora@cmt.anl.gov> writes: > >RN > > A bit off the track of this newsgroup, but for the record, ORD was OrchardN > > Field, a military airport.  It was converted to commercial use and renamedE > > in honor of Lt. Col. Edward F. O'Hare, a World War II pilot, whensL > > land-locked Midway airport could no longer support Chicago's air trafficP > > demand.  Chicago's original Municipal airport was renamed Midway in honor of > > that World War II battle.r > ? >    Now tell us why the VORTAC at IAD (Dulles) is AML (Armel)?(  F There's one west of ORD alongside the I-290 extension. It's actually aC low-frequency beacon, but it's name is "Deana", co-located with thetG outer marker for Runway 9-Right, also named "Deana". Why? Your guess iseC probably as good as anyone's but I'm sure there's story to that, ase well.    -- a David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:51:32 -0700t# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>p Subject: RE: ORD9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJICEKBFLAA.tom@kednos.com>l   >-----Original Message-----a7 >From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@fsi.net]t+ >Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2002 6:30 PMd >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >Subject: Re: ORDo >o >a >Bob Koehler wrote:s >> s? >> In article <alnjqs$hnm$1@milo.mcs.anl.gov>, "Tony Scandora"   ><Scandora@cmt.anl.gov> writes:  >> >D >> > A bit off the track of this newsgroup, but for the record, ORD  >was OrchardD >> > Field, a military airport.  It was converted to commercial use  >and renamedF >> > in honor of Lt. Col. Edward F. O'Hare, a World War II pilot, whenB >> > land-locked Midway airport could no longer support Chicago's  >air traffic? >> > demand.  Chicago's original Municipal airport was renamed   >Midway in honor of  >> > that World War II battle. >> o@ >>    Now tell us why the VORTAC at IAD (Dulles) is AML (Armel)? >uG >There's one west of ORD alongside the I-290 extension. It's actually ahD >low-frequency beacon, but it's name is "Deana", co-located with theH >outer marker for Runway 9-Right, also named "Deana". Why? Your guess isD >probably as good as anyone's but I'm sure there's story to that, as >well.  2 Yes, and unfortunately I'm sure it will get posted   >i >--  >David J. Dachtera >dba DJE Systems >http://www.djesys.com/- >-) >Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:h  >http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ >e >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.R; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).F@ >Version: 6.0.385 / Virus Database: 217 - Release Date: 9/4/2002 >e --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.385 / Virus Database: 217 - Release Date: 9/4/2002e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 14:13:34 -0400w- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>rG Subject: Re: still poor randomness of TCP/IP  sequence numbers in VMS ?e+ Message-ID: <3D80D94D.14E1B76@videotron.ca>t   Charlie Hammond wrote:G > Compaq TCP/IP Servics for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.3 is shipping withrL > OpenVMS Alpha Version V7.3-1.  The POLYCENTER Software Installation (PCSI)O > utility sees this as TCPIP V5.3-18.  (E.g. in PRODUCT SHOW PRODUCT commands.)p  7 But hobbyists are still stuck at 5.0-9  :-( :-( :-( :-(1  M Are are we to learn about the new features of TCPIP if we can't get access tog it ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 15:14:45 -0400r  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>F Subject: Re: still poor randomness of TCP/IP sequence numbers in VMS ?5 Message-ID: <1020912151422.1033A-100000@Ives.egh.com>y  $ On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, JF Mezei wrote:   > Charlie Hammond wrote:I > > Compaq TCP/IP Servics for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.3 is shipping withgN > > OpenVMS Alpha Version V7.3-1.  The POLYCENTER Software Installation (PCSI)Q > > utility sees this as TCPIP V5.3-18.  (E.g. in PRODUCT SHOW PRODUCT commands.)o > 9 > But hobbyists are still stuck at 5.0-9  :-( :-( :-( :-(a  	 Not true.g  O > Are are we to learn about the new features of TCPIP if we can't get access toi > it ?   -- ) John Santosa Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 01:32:34 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>e Subject: Re: Sybase and VMSp' Message-ID: <3D8145AE.26854403@fsi.net>e   Arne Vajhj wrote: >  > Jakob Erber wrote: > N > > The ending support of sybase for VMS is the reason for us to leave VMS. WeO > > cannot live with an unsupported DB and migration is easier than changing toe > > oracle.R > = > I think that many has choosen to migrate from Sybase/VMS to8( > Sybase/non-VMS instead of Oracle/VMS !  D I forwarded this info. to Sue Skonetski, Cc: Mark Gorham and Richard> Marcello with the subject line "More Endangered VMS accounts".   --   David J. Dachterai dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:21:27 GMTa0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>$ Subject: Re: TCP/IP not running fine1 Message-ID: <bH6g9.8$YV6.253081@news.cpqcorp.net>   . In addition to Peter's suggestions, ensure the8 SYS$SYSDEVICE:[TCPIP$FTP]LOGIN.COM is (RWED,RWED,RE,RE).  % To narrow the problem down some more:r  
     $ set verm$     $ @sys$startup:tcpip$ftp_startup   Matt.e --= -------------------------------------------------------------n OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companyh Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAt= -------------------------------------------------------------     / "Peter Flunger" <p-i-b@gmx.at> wrote in messagex* news:alq4t8$8ii$1@newsreader1.netway.at... >s- > "Pavel Smejkal" <psmejkal@envinet.cz> wroten: > > <.. in fact a lot of stuff, that i am omitting here..>J > > INTERnet ACP AUXS error during process exit  Status = %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV > >eH > Please be aware that the FTP demon runs in a very restricted an poorlyF > privileged account on VMS (ucx$ftp,  which in fact is a good thing )L > Check all files executed during login ( sylogin, files called by sylogin )F > for actions that might not be possible for the ucx$ftp account. This! > could be a $set process/priv=..uJ > As you see the error returned when your ftp server tries to logon you do note > evenC > have to check the accounting file, which would have been my firstn
 suggestion > in > such a case.L > Make sure you have got a $set noon in your sylogin to avoid other types ofC > problems your detached processes might encounter when receiving aA > fatal error during login.D >O > Peter9 >3 >1   ------------------------------    Date: 12 Sep 2002 13:11:42 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)4" Subject: Re: The Gauntlet is Cast!3 Message-ID: <q3DghkjHTkFV@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Y In article <alnqm4$kk$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy writes:s  - > It would seem that the sole reason for HP'si, > current stock price being as high as it is+ > is printing consumables. Hardly reasuringn) > to customers who are dependant on the 2 * > hardware business units. At least the HP* > Wintel folks are prepared to make a stab) > at dates for returning to profitabilityh, > but this isn't the case for the people who- > write OpenVMS and bend the AlphaServer tin.r  C    Why would a profitable group like OpenVMS need to make a stab at (    dates for returning to profitability?  D    Profits from groups like printer consumables and OpenVMS are whatC    pay for HP to engineer its way off of non-profit Alpha and carry3,    Wintel through these money loosing years.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 19:00:56 -05009. From: Lyndon Bartels <lbartels@pressenter.com> Subject: v7.3-1 Arrived Todays. Message-ID: <3D80E468.1C568455@pressenter.com>  E Though y'all've probably gotten yours, I received my 7.3-1 CDs today.    I've got to hand it to HP... s  C 1.) They didn't mess up the packaging with a Sun workstation on thet cover.  F 2.) They put the Documentation a Files-11 disk, as well as an ISO-9660
 disk.....     $ What an extremely pleasant surprise.           -- oG My opinions are mine and mine alone. They seldom align with those of myr	 employer.     H The only good thing about putting the cart before the horse is you don't have to look at the horse's butt.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:40:59 +0200 @ From: Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on+ Message-ID: <3D80DFBB.4070400@mail.tele.dk>m   JF Mezei wrote:d   > David Webb wrote:hJ >>Yes I'm totally mystified why Andrew constantly tries to distant the SunB >>mail products from their PMDF MTA heritage. Sun bought Innosoft." >>The PMDF MTA is a great product. > N > The way I understand it, Sun essentially dropped PMDF, keeping only bits andK > pieces which it integrated into the Netscape product when Sun became goodoJ > buddies with AOL/Netscape. It would therefore be logical to expect a Sun) > employee to distance himself from PMDF.  > N > Perhaps the purchase of PMDF was just a .COM thing when SUN felt its pocketsN > were too full of cash. Perhaps the goal of buying innosoft was the buying ofI > its employees instead of the product, as well as destabilising the only N > remaining email infrastructure for VMS (remember all the questions about theJ > futire of PMDF that came up when Sun annouced it was buying innosoft ?).    4 1)  I do not think feel very threatened by VMS - and&      definatetly not as a mail-server.  : 2)  I once heard that what SUN really wanted from Innosoft9      was the directory server (a good directory server isw=      essential for a modern e-commerce infrastructure today).e   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:48:18 GMTt( From: Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net>J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on+ Message-ID: <3D810C94.4FE920EA@pacbell.net>    Martin Vorlaender wrote:  H > The Unix convention is that if an application has a filename parameterD > to use "-" as a placeholder instead to signal input from stdin (orE > output to stdout - more seldom as that's the standard case). But asd: > always with Unix, that's entirely up to the application. > H > If you want to have a Unix shell instead of DCL, why not use one? I'veD > heard that in the course of the GNV project, bash has been ported. > G > While I occasionally use PIPE, I dislike Unix shells in general. WhenOG > brevity is a dogma, scripts tend to quickly become *very* unreadable. H > I dislike having to go through a script character by character without; > being able to glance over it and get the overall context.d > I You miss my point. I do NOT want to use a Unix shell for some of the same(M reasons you cite, but the pipe command is a direct interjection of unix shelleP functionality. So, for that command, and for that command only, it would be nice# to continue the unix look and feel.sK As far as putting pipe in a shell script, I think of pipe as an ease of useaL vehicle for interactive use only. That is if I didn't always have to specify5 sys$input/output. As it is it's pretty useless to me.    -- i   Have VMS. Will Travel. Wire Paladin (@alphase.com)/
 San Francisco-   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 19:28:05 -04004- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>sJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on, Message-ID: <3D8122F0.87AC4093@videotron.ca>   Don Sykes wrote:O > reasons you cite, but the pipe command is a direct interjection of unix shellDR > functionality. So, for that command, and for that command only, it would be nice% > to continue the unix look and feel.W  J To make PIPE a truly inherent part of VMS to give it the same look/feel asE Unix, the engineers would probably have to change much of the command < interpreter, and risk making a lot of existing things break.  M The PIPE command is a nice kludge that gives you the same functionality (moreiL or less) without requiring deep down changes to the command interpreter, and( possibly breaking existing applications.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 04:10:35 +0200 2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender)J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on; Message-ID: <3d81491a.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>   ) Don Sykes (annonymous@pacbell.net) wrote:a > You miss my point.   Granted - mostly.o  8 > I do NOT want to use a Unix shell for some of the sameI > reasons you cite, but the pipe command is a direct interjection of unixsG > shell functionality. So, for that command, and for that command only,k6 > it would be nice to continue the unix look and feel.  G But the point is: to really do it the *ix way, all commands that are topD interact with PIPE (that is, *all* commands really) would have to be& changed to allow the special file "-".  I Or one would have to reserve another character besides <, >, &, and | forAD PIPE to recognize the special file (and replace it by SYS$PIPE). And2 what about commands that use that character, then?  I > As far as putting pipe in a shell script, I think of pipe as an ease of G > use vehicle for interactive use only. That is if I didn't always haveAB > to specify sys$input/output. As it is it's pretty useless to me.  E I don't really see a connection between a few keystrokes (SYS$PIPE is D even shorter than SYS$INPUT) and the term "useless". That's where my# rant about *ix shells stemmed from.a   cu,o   Martin -- oJ One OS to rule them all       | Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmer7 One OS to find them           | work: mv@pdv-systeme.dewJ One OS to bring them all      |   http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/> And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:58:46 GMTl( From: Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net>Y Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenV0+ Message-ID: <3D810F08.E946E51B@pacbell.net>N   Arne Vajhj wrote: >  <snip> >  > Is this practical possible ? > / > To do this PIPE should know the syntax of all. > commands - or ?? > E Yes, but PIPE is really only useful for those commands that allow foroM redirection of sys$output anyway. I don't see using it with a $mount command,mP for example. I think it only needs to know where input files or strings are used0 (like in search) and where /output is an option.   -- e   Have VMS. Will Travel. Wire Paladin (@alphase.com)e
 San Franciscod   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 22:52:07 -0400h* From: Brian Hechinger <wonko@4amlunch.net>4 Subject: Who was looking for old VMS for an 11/750??6 Message-ID: <20020912225207.T3493@marvin.4amlunch.net>  4 email me off list.  i might be able to help you out.   -brian -- fE "Hope you don't have much traffic then... ya turn on any feature in anD crisco and you tax the hell outta the cpu..don't be so cruel to thatF little 68030, he never did anything to hurt you.  Really, he loves youI and just wants to shovel the bits around.  meanie"   Derrick D. Daughertyt   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 12:47:27 +1000e1 From: Paddy O'Brien <paddy.o'brien@tg.nsw.gov.au>e) Subject: [Fwd: Mozilla under  eXcursions]t* Message-ID: <3D8151BF.30807@tg.nsw.gov.au>  G Forwarding on behalf of a colleague.  I do not get this behaviour when e* connecting to the ES40 from my DECstation.   Regards, Paddy      = Suggest text for an InfoVax posting. Please edit as required.    Thanks,    DWCp    H We have recently installed Mozilla on our VMS alpha ES40 which runs fineD from any VMS workstation or Linux client over our TCP/IP network butE when I try to access Mozilla via eXcursions running on a PC (PII 400,tD 128MB RAM, W2k) eXcursions consumes nearly 100% CPU and simple tasksE like scrolling a web page, selecting a menu item, moving a window etcaB take forever (up to 30 seconds) which make the application totally	 unusable.t  B I tried these same operations using Exceed's Xserver (Ver 6.0) andD performance is fine with only a very small time delay due to network latency as expected etc.  H Has anyone tried running Mozilla from an eXcursions X client and did you# experience the same slow behaviour?m          G ***********************************************************************o  C "This electronic message and any attachments may contain privilegeda> and confidential information intended only for the use of the B addressees named above.  If you are not the intended recipient of C this email, please delete the message and any attachment and advisecB the sender.  You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, 7 distribution, reproduction of this email is prohibited.n  A If you have received the email in error, please notify TransGrid 3A immediately.  Any views expressed in this email are those of the  = individual sender except where the sender expressly and with nC authority states them to be the views of TransGrid.  TransGrid uses > virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses contained in any attachment."o  G ***********************************************************************    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 13:19:23 +0930i/ From: Mark Daniel <Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au>n- Subject: Re: [Fwd: Mozilla under  eXcursions]e3 Message-ID: <alrnjd$fhf$1@fang.dsto.defence.gov.au>-  7 Yes.  Right from the early BETA Mozilla days up to 1.1..  E I moved to X-Win32 (which fortunately my organization has a bunch of o licences for).      http://www.StarNet.com/  9 Seems more stable and (perhaps) efficient than eXcursion.p   Paddy O'Brien wrote:I > Forwarding on behalf of a colleague.  I do not get this behaviour when a, > connecting to the ES40 from my DECstation. >  > Regards, Paddy >  >  > ? > Suggest text for an InfoVax posting. Please edit as required.t > 	 > Thanks,w >  > DWCn >  > J > We have recently installed Mozilla on our VMS alpha ES40 which runs fineF > from any VMS workstation or Linux client over our TCP/IP network butG > when I try to access Mozilla via eXcursions running on a PC (PII 400,yF > 128MB RAM, W2k) eXcursions consumes nearly 100% CPU and simple tasksG > like scrolling a web page, selecting a menu item, moving a window etc D > take forever (up to 30 seconds) which make the application totally > unusable.  > D > I tried these same operations using Exceed's Xserver (Ver 6.0) andF > performance is fine with only a very small time delay due to network > latency as expected etc. > J > Has anyone tried running Mozilla from an eXcursions X client and did you% > experience the same slow behaviour?i >  >  >  >  > I > ***********************************************************************t > E > "This electronic message and any attachments may contain privileged K > and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressees  E > named above.  If you are not the intended recipient of this email, e9 > please delete the message and any attachment and advise D > the sender.  You are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, 9 > distribution, reproduction of this email is prohibited.n > C > If you have received the email in error, please notify TransGrid nC > immediately.  Any views expressed in this email are those of the aI > individual sender except where the sender expressly and with authority t; > states them to be the views of TransGrid.  TransGrid usesV@ > virus scanning software but excludes any liability for viruses > contained in any attachment."n > I > ***********************************************************************f >    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 14:38:52 +1200i From: "AG" <ang@xtra.co.nz>vM Subject: [Heavily OT] Re: Fabio Cardoso Enemy of the United States of America 3 Message-ID: <Pccg9.5886$Y3.1207270@news.xtra.co.nz>   < "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com> wrote in message' news:Ej5g9.296857$aA.51889@sccrnsc02...p  1 > Doh, aren't all the TLAs in the DEC Dictionary?n  % Well, let me quote from another post:i  	 <<quote>>q   Ontario  Airport Codes   Hamilton YHM   <<unquote>>o  - Well, it just so happens that there is a townn, called "Hamilton" about 1.5 hour drive or so+ away. It also has an airfield. No idea whatu- it's code is (never flown there) but probablyt not the "YHM".  0 So, to roll the thread a little bit back :-) ...( I s'pose you need to know which Hamilton- you're talking about. (I'll bet there are wayo+ more places called that than just these twol
 examples).   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 18:55:00 -0400e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>dD Subject: Re: [OT] Re: [OT] IMPORTANT SECURITY ALERT [OT] [Off Topic], Message-ID: <3D811B31.D876B7A1@videotron.ca>   "Doc.Cypher" wrote:eJ > I can understand when people conclude that working with the UN is not anM > effective approach. However, it is a body that you are obliged to work withnH > if you wish to be viewed as a reasonable and cooperative member of the > international community. i  F Here is an example of the US "working with the UN": During the BalkansN conflict where many nations got involved BEFORE the USA, the UN had decided onH an arms embargoe to minimise the conflict. the USA refused to comply and6 continued to send arms to one of the warring factions.  L Meanwhile, those UN troups in Kosovo were being fired on by the faction thatE was being given arms by the USA. They requested that their mandate beaN increased to give them the right to fight back when attacked. That request was vetoed BY THE USA.  H Years later, the US waltzes in, claimes the UN is a bunch of incompetentL twits, and solves the Kosovo conflict unilaterally and claims all the glory.  K In the case of UN inspectors to Irak, the USA insisted on having control onnN their makeup, and made sure that UN inspection teams consisted of at least oneM person to which Irak objected.  These teams would have been just as effectivetD without the problematic members and would have continued their jobs.  N I am affraid that there are many instances where the USA allows the UN to takeL a mandate, but ensures that the mandate fails so that the USA can claim that0 the UN is useless and can then act unilaterally.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.505 ************************