1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 14 Sep 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 507       Contents: Re: "inview" Article
 Re: <None>1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 RE: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium 1 Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium   Re: Checking $STATUS for success  Re: Checking $STATUS for success  Re: Checking $STATUS for success  Re: Checking $STATUS for success Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: Convert Blocks to MB Re: DEC AMDS VAX 7.3 bug Re: definition of SYS$SYSROOT . first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?2 Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?2 Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?2 Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?2 Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?@ Re: lexicals (was: RE: SET PROTECTION (SET SECURITY/PROTECTION)"@ Re: lexicals (was: RE: SET PROTECTION (SET SECURITY/PROTECTION)"P Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS   just yawn< Re: Licenses, MicroVAX 3800 Console (was: Re: Two questions)< Re: Licenses, MicroVAX 3800 Console (was: Re: Two questions) Re: Mr. Bush at the U.N.' Oracle 7.3, Pro*FORTRAN and using dates + Re: Oracle 7.3, Pro*FORTRAN and using dates + Re: Oracle 7.3, Pro*FORTRAN and using dates  Re: ORD  Re: ORD  RE: ORD + OT: Another security flaw in Microsoft Word ' Re: Press Release from Digital Networks ' Re: Press Release from Digital Networks ' Re: Press Release from Digital Networks 0 Seeking Senior VMS System Administrator Position4 Re: Seeking Senior VMS System Administrator Position4 Re: Seeking Senior VMS System Administrator Position; Start Earning right now in 30 mins - Instant Download  8767  Re: Sybase and VMS Re: Sybase and VMS! TCPIP 5.3 VAX: sysgen INTSTKPAGES  Re: v7.3-1 Arrived TodayA Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on A Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on L Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on   OpenVMS?K Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on  OpenVMS? P Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenVP Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenVP Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenV Re: Whither my VAX...   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 18:10:55 +0000 (UTC) + From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb)  Subject: Re: "inview" Article + Message-ID: <alt9nf$8dt$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>    In article <alsha2$hkb$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> writes: >  >  >David Webb wrote: >> In article <alns35$121$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> writes:  >>   >>>  >>>David Webb wrote: >>>  >>>>In article <al7tk6$p8u$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <andrew_nospam.harrison_remove_this@sun#.com> writes: >>>> >>>> >>>>>JF Mezei wrote: >>>>>  >>>>>  >>>>> . >>>>>>Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>  >>>>>   >>>>>SIMS was Sun's IMAP server. >>>>>  >>>>5 >>>>SIMS was as you well know not SUN's IMAP server.  E >>>>SIMS was an OEMd version of the PMDF MTA with various Sun addons. J >>>>You'll find our previous discussions on this topic archived on google. >>>> >>> > >>>This statement is rather like saying that the Ford explorer< >>>isn't really a Ford, instead its a Goodyear because thats% >>>what connects the car to the road.  >>> > >>>A mail server contains a number of components, MTA, Message9 >>>store etc. PMDF was part of SIMS but SIMS wasn't PMDF.  >>> 
 >>>Regards >>>Andrew Harrison >>>  >>   >>  @ >> If you KNOW THAT then WHY THE HELL did you say that SIMS was  >> SUN's IMAP SERVER !!!!  >>   >>   > 0 >Akkk do you have a major comprehension problem. > . >SIMS stands for Solaris Internet Mail Server.  >Part of SIMS is an IMAP server. >   - >Which bit confusted you and which bit didn't  >you understand. >  >Your response proves my point.  >   > What point. I have NEVER said that SIMS was just the PMDF MTA.I You though have said it is JUST an IMAP server and implied that since the B SIMS IMAP server had been replaced in iPlanet that all of the SIMS( components had been dropped from SunOne.    > Please reread what you have said and stop trying to spin this.    * >Go back to the Ford example. The Explorer- >is a package that includes body, drive train  >wheels tires etc. > / >If we were to follow your point through to its * >logical conclusion we should refer to the, >Ford Explorer as the Goodyear X1234 or what) >ever the tyre on the thing is every time & >we are talking about its road holding >or not capabilities.  > 2 >Should we refer to AlphaServers as Micron Servers0 >or whoever it is who supplies the DRAM. Or call4 >them Sun Servers every time you use NFS on Tru64 or+ >OpenVMS or Java servers evverytime you use  >a JVM, don't make me laugh. >   F This is totally irrelevent since I have NEVER made the claim that SIMSF is PMDF. Though I do regard the MTA as the most important part of any F messaging server rather than any associated IMAP servers, POP servers, mailing list servers etc  M As I have stated in another thread here I still cannot understand why you get D so upset over the relationship of SIMS to PMDF. Sun bought Innosoft.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University       >Regards >Andrew HArrison >    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:42:35 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: <None> ' Message-ID: <3D828B77.9BEAE34F@fsi.net>    Bob Koehler wrote: > ] > In article <3D813CF8.C64FC6FE@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > > Bob Koehler wrote: > >>r > >> In article <b096a4ee.0209111858.fe0dabc@posting.google.com>, spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) writes: > >>2 > >> > That's why they have pilots and navigators. > >>M > >>    You miss the Reagan era?  Navigators haven't been flying for decades.  > > L > > I thought he fired the ATC's... (Alzheimers had already set in then, butK > > no one noticed.) Nothing like endangering the flying public just to get  > > your point across... > H >    And he stopped the FAA modernization.  He did so much damage to theG >    aviation infrastructure that namig an airport for him is downright 
 >    sick. > @ >    We couldn't they give him credit in a manner related to his> >    accomplishments instead of his damages?  Isn't there someF >    landmark they could name after him that has to do with ending the >    cold war?  $ Maybe they could rename the Kursk...   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 14:33:56 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium, Message-ID: <3D822F92.67159844@videotron.ca>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:H > And your point is?  Yup.  Standard stuff.  If enough people are at theD > hotel, and at the conference, the cheaper it is overall to put on.  J However, for those with limited budgets, using an expensive hotel may be a
 show stopper.   M Of course, it depends on whether you would have negotiated a competitive rate J for guests or whether the hotel will still charge guests a very high rate,N which may turn away customers. Providing a low cost alternative is still good,L unless you are interested in only attracting the few customers who are flush1 with cash and have no budget travel restrictions.    ------------------------------   Date: 13 Sep 2002 18:46:52 GMT, From: bill@gw5.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon): Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium5 Message-ID: <altbqs$10kuf$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>   , In article <3D822F92.67159844@videotron.ca>,0 	JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:I >> And your point is?  Yup.  Standard stuff.  If enough people are at the E >> hotel, and at the conference, the cheaper it is overall to put on.  > L > However, for those with limited budgets, using an expensive hotel may be a > show stopper.  >   E And we won't even go into holding it in the middle of the week in the D middle of a semester.  Just another example of not placing any value@ whatsoever on getting VMS back into educational visibility.  :-(   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:48:50 +0200 - From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium' Message-ID: <3D823311.C307D98D@Free.fr>    Yep, Fred. I like your answer. I'll travel, then.   See you there.  , Could you set up a Noter's Party for me? :-) I'll wear my PRSTSC::DTL shirt.    D.   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > @ > Not to answer for Sue...  but I'll give my understanding.  No. > E > The idea is to bring a symposium someplace where the engineers, and I > management can easily attend and interact - without having to send some / > limited number of them to some far off place.  > K > The meetings we run here internally - and for other more focused forums - K > generally get well attended by everything from engineers to higher ups in J > the food chain.  Almost everyone who attends them, makes a point to comeL > back for the next one.  *I* hope this is much the same on a broader scale. > J > If it were done in Europe, it would end up being just a "Technical Days"L > type thing, which is great - but it's much more limited in who (especially* > us lower in the foodchain) might attend.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:50:48 +0200 - From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium& Message-ID: <3D823388.B3831C9@Free.fr>   "John N." wrote: > I > Sorry if I over-reacted to your post.  There is just so much negativism M > sometimes that it gets frustrating.  It really looks like HP is going to be 5 > the best thing that happened to VMS in a long time.    Not difficult.   D.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 19:41:37 GMT 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium2 Message-ID: <Rbrg9.32$%J7.635941@news.cpqcorp.net>  $ Bill Gunshannon wrote in message ... >> > F >And we won't even go into holding it in the middle of the week in theE >middle of a semester.  Just another example of not placing any value A >whatsoever on getting VMS back into educational visibility.  :-(  >   L It's an interesting point.  But I'm not sure that you will find any timeslotI that will not conflict with some group.  If you were to have come here in I August, you'd have found a lot of people burning vacation time.  Besides, K Nashua in November should minimize distractions - it's too cold to golf (in ( general), and not cold enough to ski ;-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 16:12:28 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium, Message-ID: <3D8246A4.DEBCA38A@videotron.ca>  K I think i know why they want us to go to Nashua and meet all the engineers.   G I have this strange feeling that if I were to show up there, I would be P greated by VMS engineers each armed with a foam bat, waiting to pounce on me ...   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 13:24:53 -0700 , From: "Scott Stark" <starkh@saic.com_nospam>: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium' Message-ID: <3d81e726$1@cpns1.saic.com>   : "Bob Koehler" <koehler@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:397LGgcJmzYM@eisner.encompasserve.org...  > * >    Secure web site for NDA signers only? >    Yes, what about this idea?H My West Coast situation prevents me from attending this refreshing idea.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:24:37 GMT * From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com>: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium5 Message-ID: <130920021618091403%paul.anderson@hp.com>   5 In article <3D8246A4.DEBCA38A@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei % <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:   F > I have this strange feeling that if I were to show up there, I wouldD > be greated by VMS engineers each armed with a foam bat, waiting to > pounce on me ...  C All particpants in comp.os.vms will be required to have the letters ! C-O-V painted on their foreheads.    Paul   --    Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineering    Hewlett-Packard Company    ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 15:28:04 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium3 Message-ID: <yizbed0UO6Np@eisner.encompasserve.org>   d In article <altbqs$10kuf$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>, bill@gw5.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:. > In article <3D822F92.67159844@videotron.ca>,2 > 	JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: >> Fred Kleinsorge wrote: J >>> And your point is?  Yup.  Standard stuff.  If enough people are at theF >>> hotel, and at the conference, the cheaper it is overall to put on. >>  M >> However, for those with limited budgets, using an expensive hotel may be a  >> show stopper. >>   > G > And we won't even go into holding it in the middle of the week in the F > middle of a semester.  Just another example of not placing any valueB > whatsoever on getting VMS back into educational visibility.  :-(  F I think they laid it out pretty clearly that the design principle hereD is to give priority to content by ensuring the maximum number of VMSG developers are able to participate.  That means not doing it when their * kids are liable to be on school vacation !   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 16:52:14 -0400 ; From: "Webb, William W Raleigh, NC" <wwebb1@email.usps.gov> : Subject: RE: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS SymposiumK Message-ID: <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E49028BEABD@rlghncst964.usps.gov>    Plappermaul!  C That's the *real* reason they wanted to put everybody in one hotel!    WWWebb   -----Original Message-----6 From: "JF Mezei" [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca]( Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 4:12 PM To: "Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com" : Subject: RE: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium    K I think i know why they want us to go to Nashua and meet all the engineers.   G I have this strange feeling that if I were to show up there, I would be L greated by VMS engineers each armed with a foam bat, waiting to pounce on me ..   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 17:00:10 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium, Message-ID: <3D8251D0.13F79346@videotron.ca>   Paul Anderson wrote:E > All particpants in comp.os.vms will be required to have the letters # > C-O-V painted on their foreheads.   K Or a target painted on their back ?  If you get lots of "John Doe" who work K for "Acme Inc" show up, you'll know why some choose to remain anonymous :-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 17:07:05 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium, Message-ID: <3D82536D.8BAF2D59@videotron.ca>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:H > I think they laid it out pretty clearly that the design principle hereF > is to give priority to content by ensuring the maximum number of VMSI > developers are able to participate.  That means not doing it when their , > kids are liable to be on school vacation !  @ VMS developpers have lives ? wives and kids ? How can that be ?   : I thought they lived 7/24 in their cubicles hacking away ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 21:58:10 GMT * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS SymposiumC Message-ID: <Sbtg9.621402$2p2.25865443@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message& news:3D8246A4.DEBCA38A@videotron.ca...B > I think i know why they want us to go to Nashua and meet all the
 engineers. > I > I have this strange feeling that if I were to show up there, I would be K > greated by VMS engineers each armed with a foam bat, waiting to pounce on  me ...  J Similar thoughts had crossed my mind also.  However, there are people fromD c.o.v. whom I'd like to see (for the first time, or again), also VMSF engineers as well (though how many of them would like to see me may beE questionable), and even technical topics relating to file systems and L storage that I'd like to discuss.  So since it's within reasonable commutingK distance of my home, had it been free I would have considered attending; as J it is, if congenial acquaintances will be attending and would like to find? time to get together outside the proceedings, drop me an email.    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 16:33:51 -0700 ( From: Alan Frisbie <Abuse@NelsonUSA.com>: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium- Message-ID: <3D8275DF.179DCD21@NelsonUSA.com>    Sue Skonetski wrote:   K > Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announce K > the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take place D > November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA.  6 Now *this* is worth spending time and money to attend!A I'm sure it will be a much bigger value for the money than HPETS.   A For those of us who are not in the habit of travelling to Nashua, < what makes the most sense (when coming from the west coast):   1. Fly to Logan $    A. Rent a car and drive to Nashua5    B. Take bus/van/(other ground transport) to Nashua 	    C. ???   9 2. Fly to Manchester (do those flights go through Logan?) $    A. Rent a car and drive to Nashua5    B. Take bus/van/(other ground transport) to Nashua 	    C. ???    3. ???  ? It would be nice to hear from the people who live in Nashua and  do this regularly.   Thanks,  Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:05:17 -0400 & From: Ken Robinson <kenrbnsn1@rcn.com>: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium< Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020913195805.043ad8d8@pop.rcn.com>  1 At 04:33 PM 9/13/2002 -0700, you wrote (in part):   B >For those of us who are not in the habit of travelling to Nashua,= >what makes the most sense (when coming from the west coast):  >  >1. Fly to Logan& >    A. Rent a car and drive to Nashua7 >    B. Take bus/van/(other ground transport) to Nashua  >    C. ???   0 Not unless you can't find a flight to Manchester    : >2. Fly to Manchester (do those flights go through Logan?)& >    A. Rent a car and drive to Nashua7 >    B. Take bus/van/(other ground transport) to Nashua  >    C. ???   K There are direct flights to Manchester (I'm from NJ, so I usually drive to   Nashua when I go there) J The Manchester airport is about a 15 to 20 minute drive from the Sheraton J depending on the traffic. The construction on the road between Nashua and E Manchester finally finished about a year ago. The Sheraton might run  = shuttle busses. They probably have a web site with that info.      >3. ???   K Fly to Newark, NJ and drive. It's only about a 4 hour drive through scenic   NJ, NY, CT, and MA. :-)     @ >It would be nice to hear from the people who live in Nashua and >do this regularly.   H Like I  said, I live in NJ, but I drive to Southern NH at least twice a I year and a friend of mine lives in Nashua. If you have any down time and  K like ethnic food there are a number of good Thai and Indian restaurants in   the Nashua area.   Ken Robinson   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 23:55:13 GMT $ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium8 Message-ID: <00A13ECE.CA7F942C@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  \ In article <3D822F92.67159844@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: >Fred Kleinsorge wrote: I >> And your point is?  Yup.  Standard stuff.  If enough people are at the E >> hotel, and at the conference, the cheaper it is overall to put on.  > K >However, for those with limited budgets, using an expensive hotel may be a  >show stopper. > O I have _no_ travel budget this year, and didn't get enough notice of this event N - which sounds like a great event, and which I sure hope will be repeated - to do anything about it.   N I don't know what rates HP has negotiated.  I know the Sheraton Tara hosts allK kind of conferences and conventions and is very unlikely stick HP attendees J with the "rack" rate.  However, there are a ton of places to stay that areI quite close by.  I've stayed in the Travelodge (something like $90/single J $100/double two years ago) and in a motel that was $70 for two last year. I That really, really shouldn't be a showstopper.  I can even recommend the O Natick Cab Company, who will make an appointment to pick you up at a particular M time and actually be there then, in case you're staying too far away from the 
 Tara to walk.   N >Of course, it depends on whether you would have negotiated a competitive rateK >for guests or whether the hotel will still charge guests a very high rate, O >which may turn away customers. Providing a low cost alternative is still good, M >unless you are interested in only attracting the few customers who are flush 2 >with cash and have no budget travel restrictions.  N There are a bunch of low cost alternatives in the near neighborhood.  HP isn'tL _requiring_ people to stay at the Tara, they're recommending it.  There's no9 conscionable way to paint this as an exclusionary move.      -- Alan    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:13:29 GMT $ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium8 Message-ID: <00A13ED1.57C965E5@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  X In article <3D8275DF.179DCD21@NelsonUSA.com>, Alan Frisbie <Abuse@NelsonUSA.com> writes: >Sue Skonetski wrote:  > L >> Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceL >> the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take placeE >> November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA.  > 7 >Now *this* is worth spending time and money to attend! B >I'm sure it will be a much bigger value for the money than HPETS. > B >For those of us who are not in the habit of travelling to Nashua,= >what makes the most sense (when coming from the west coast):   N Glad to be able to give Alan some advice for once.  Logan is the most-annoyingM but nearest airport; I haven't flown to Manchester, but someone else here has L and says it's nice.  There may well be some cheap flights to Manchester that don't exist to Logan.   H If you fly to Logan, you can take the "Logan Express" bus, which is veryM well-organized and which has a stop within either optimistic walking distance   or a cheap cab ride of the Tara.  N You probably don't want to rent a car and drive to-from Logan, unless you haveL sightseeing plans that'll make the car useful elsewhere.  Even so, you'll be dealing with Boston drivers.   > @ >It would be nice to hear from the people who live in Nashua and >do this regularly.   O I'm obviously not one of those, but I'm a Californian who's made a trip to this ( area three times in the last four years.   -- Alan    ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 20:09:09 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium3 Message-ID: <uT+dbhlhAgZJ@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3D82904B.ACBFF43C@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:  >>   >> Sue Skonetski wrote:  >> >? >> > If we use enough hotel rooms we do not need to pay for the K >> > conference rooms which is a good thing considering how many we will be  >> > using.  >>  G >> So, if enough *customers* pay for there hotel rooms, *HP* don't have A >> to pay for the conference rooms, is that what you are saying ?  > J > I'd tend to look at it this way: the less burden this symposium is to HPI > corporate, the better the chance of it being repeated next year (though I > 6-months might be better, but that's just a "DECUS withdrawl" left over   $ They already decided on "annual" :-)  H > in my system). Think of your accomodations as your contribution to theI > well being of VMS, and you get a place to sleep, s**t, shower and shave 
 > to boot!  B Alternatively, it is your contribution to keeping the registration( cost from rising for the following year.  E By the way, for those who have not guessed, the Red Roof Inn does not C have adequate facilities to have such a conference, and perhaps not , even enough to house those who would attend.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:54:22 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> : Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium, Message-ID: <3D8288BC.11A00672@videotron.ca>  N Here is some info about the hotel. From the pictures, it really does look like	 a castle.       SHERATON NASHUA HOTEL  11 TARA BOULEVARD   Nashua, NH 03062    336 Rooms / 7 Floors   
 Hotel Summary H Very comfortable hotel, built in the style of a castle, offering meetingG facilities to 1000.Air conditioned rooms with phone,radio,TV and coffee N maker.Retsaurant,lounge,pub. Nightclub with  entertainement.Excellent sportingM facilities include 2 tennis courts, indoor & outdoor pools, jogging trail and  raquetball court.    TransportationN                                                                                       Back to main details .                         Primary Airport - Bos F                         Distance From The Airport To Property - 45 Mi     G                         Additional Forms Of Transportation From Primary  Airport &                         To Property - /                         Taxi - Approx 60.00USD    I                         Limo - Flight Line - 0530-1930 - Approx 35.00USD  H                         800-245-2525 M And L Transportation - 0730-2300 5                         Approx 32.00USD 800-225-4846    #                         Rental Car    O                         Additional Forms Of Transportation From City Center To  #                         Property -                           Taxi    #                         Rental Car        "                         DirectionsN                                                                                       Back to main details =                         Driving Directions To The Property -  O                         From North - Manchester Airport - Exit Toward Front Of  K                         Airport And Take A Right Onto Brown Ave. Go Left On  101 H                         West And Exit Right Approx. 1 Mile Onto Everett E                         Turnpike/Rte 3 South. Take Right Off Exit 1.    M                         From South - Logan Airport - Take 93 North To 128/95  M                         South To Rte 3 North. Take Exit 1 Off Of Rte 3. Turn  O                         Left Off Exit..Go Under Overpass..Hotel Will Be On The                           Right.    O                         From East - Portsmouth/Portland - Take 95 South To 495  H                         South To Rt 3 North Exit 1. Turn Left..Go Under >                         Overpass..Hotel Will Be On The Right.   M                         From West - Keene Area - Take 101 East To Rte 3 South  To  N                         Exit 1. Turn Right Off The Exit. Hotel Will Be On The                          Right.        ,                         Property InformationN                                                                                       Back to main details -                         On-site Facilities -  1                         * Ballroom * Coffee Shop  6                         * Dataport * Disabled Parking <                         * Elevators * Executive/Club Floors 3                         * Free Parking * Gift Shop  <                         * Handicap Facilities * Health Club =                         * Ice/Vending Machines * Indoor Pool  1                         * Jogging Track * Lounge  ;                         * Meeting Room * Non-smoking Rooms  4                         * Outdoor Pool * Restaurant -                         * Sauna * Steam Room  F                         * Tennis Courts * Wheelchair Accessible Eleva   .                         Off-site Facilities - &                         * Golf Course   8                         Total Nbr Of Meeting Rooms - 11 @                         Capacity Of Largest Meeting Room - 1000 ?                         Capacity Of Smallest Meeting Room - 18                                ServicesN                                                                                       Back to main details +                         On-site Services -  ;                         * Concierge * Limited Room Service  6                         * Masseuse * Safe Deposit Box (                         * Video Billing                                DiningN                                                                                       Back to main details ;                         Property Has 1 Restaurants On-site  E                         Room Service Offered From 0630hrs To 2300hrs    (                         -Granite Bistro -                         Hours Of Operations-  8                         From 1130hrs To 0030hrs Mon-sun N                         Cozy Pub Atmosphere With Fireplace. Restaurant Serves M                         Lunch And Dinner Daily From 1100-2300. Only Open For  ,                         Lunch On Saturdays.   .                         -Lobby Coffee Service -                         Hours Of Operations-  8                         From 0630hrs To 1100hrs Mon-fri F                         Starbucks Coffee Cart Complete With Muffins.. +                         Bagels..Juice Etc.    "                         -Zj S Pub -                         Hours Of Operations-  8                         From 1130hrs To 0030hrs Mon-sun H                         Cozy Pub Atmosphere With Fireplace. Lighter Fare Served  E                         From 11 30-2300 Daily. Espresso And Cappacino  Available.        "                         RecreationN                                                                               1                            On-site Recreations -  L                         -Health Club - Boston Sports Club Is Open 0530-2130 K                         Mon-fri..0700-2100 Sat And 0700-2000 Sun. Features  <                         Nautilus Equipment.. Cardiovascular K                         Equipment..Steamrooms..Saunas.. Whirlpool..Aerobic nN                         Studio..Free Weights..Massage Therapy..Volleyball And O                         Horseshoes. -Tennis - Outdoor. -Pool - 1 Indoor Heated yM                         Pool..1 Outdoor Pool And A Whirlpool. -Jogging Trailse - F                         Numerous Outside Trails Located On And Off The
 Property.   /                         Off-site Recreations - eG                         -Golf - Sky Meadows Golf Course..1mi. / Amherstt Country O                         Club..20mi. / Nashua Country Club..6mi. / Green Meadow i,                         Country Club..15mi.       N                         Ratings/Awards                                        
           6                         Aaa 3 Diamonds - Mobil 3 Stars   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 21:09:11 -0400n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>t: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium, Message-ID: <3D828C35.E7429054@videotron.ca>  Q According to Travelocity , rates for the Sheraton castle on Tara road range from:e   CAD 227 to CAD 358.    or ~about~ USD 145 to USD 230   L So the USD 92.00+tax rate negotiated by Sue isn't bad at all, considering it is a castle.  K Unfortunatly, in such conferences, one rarely gets to take advantage of theS, extra amenities such a nice hotel provides.   G And they weren't joking about having a packed schedule. I see they haveaK sessions planned for 03:00 in the morning. Perhaps one need not rent a roome. after all... Is Jolt available at that hotel ? :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) ;-)s   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 01:03:13 GMTe1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>s: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium' Message-ID: <3D82904B.ACBFF43C@fsi.net>e   Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:a >  > Sue Skonetski wrote: > > > > > If we use enough hotel rooms we do not need to pay for theJ > > conference rooms which is a good thing considering how many we will be
 > > using. > F > So, if enough *customers* pay for there hotel rooms, *HP* don't have@ > to pay for the conference rooms, is that what you are saying ?  H I'd tend to look at it this way: the less burden this symposium is to HPG corporate, the better the chance of it being repeated next year (though G 6-months might be better, but that's just a "DECUS withdrawl" left overaF in my system). Think of your accomodations as your contribution to theG well being of VMS, and you get a place to sleep, s**t, shower and shavet to boot!   -- i David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemso http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/s   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 02:39:36 GMTd- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>e: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Message-ID: <Ijxg9.2725$Zi.952783@news1.news.adelphia.net>   Alan Frisbie wrote:i > Sue Skonetski wrote: > K >>Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased to announceeK >>the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take place D >>November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA. > 8 > Now *this* is worth spending time and money to attend!C > I'm sure it will be a much bigger value for the money than HPETS.s > C > For those of us who are not in the habit of travelling to Nashua,l> > what makes the most sense (when coming from the west coast): >  > 1. Fly to Logano& >    A. Rent a car and drive to Nashua7 >    B. Take bus/van/(other ground transport) to Nashua- >    C. ???- > ; > 2. Fly to Manchester (do those flights go through Logan?) & >    A. Rent a car and drive to Nashua7 >    B. Take bus/van/(other ground transport) to Nashuan >    C. ???a > A > It would be nice to hear from the people who live in Nashua and  > do this regularly.  A I flew in through Logan once, and Manchester all the other times.D  G The prices were better for Manchester, and there was a lot less hassle w" getting in and out of the airport.  ( Of course that was well over a year ago.   -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Onlyt   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 03:06:45 GMTn1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>i: Subject: Re: Announcing the first annual OpenVMS Symposium- Message-ID: <9Jxg9.312304$aA.54570@sccrnsc02>t  1 <winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> wrote in messages2 news:00A13ED1.57C965E5@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU...< > In article <3D8275DF.179DCD21@NelsonUSA.com>, Alan Frisbie <Abuse@NelsonUSA.com> writes:s > >Sue Skonetski wrote:r > >sE > >> Hewlett Packard's OpenVMS Engineering organization is pleased tot announceH > >> the first annual OpenVMS Symposium. The OpenVMS Symposium will take placeoG > >> November 19-21 2002 at the Sheraton Tara Hotel in Nashua, NH, USA.m > >e9 > >Now *this* is worth spending time and money to attend!eD > >I'm sure it will be a much bigger value for the money than HPETS. > >dD > >For those of us who are not in the habit of travelling to Nashua,? > >what makes the most sense (when coming from the west coast):  > B > Glad to be able to give Alan some advice for once.  Logan is the
 most-annoyingtK > but nearest airport; I haven't flown to Manchester, but someone else heret hasuI > and says it's nice.  There may well be some cheap flights to Manchestert that > don't exist to Logan.V  J Well, I'm gonna get another spanking since the Powers That Be have ordered: me to eschew making comments in this thread, but so be it.  L CHEAP FLIGHTS: Yep, like Providence, Manchester is served by Southwest, I'veH saved several hunded bucks flying PVD-LAX instead of BOS-LAX. Have never done Manchester, though.   >aJ > If you fly to Logan, you can take the "Logan Express" bus, which is veryF > well-organized and which has a stop within either optimistic walking distance" > or a cheap cab ride of the Tara.  K PLEASE CHECK CAREFULLY ON THE WEB AS TO *WHICH* THERE ARE HALF-HOURLY LOGAN J EXPRESS BUSES TO FRAMINGHAM, WOBURN, AND BRAINTREE SATELLITE PARKING LOTS,L but the rides to NASHUA are a bit less frequent. Check out www.massport.com.' YOUR OPTIONS ARE BUSES AND SHARED VANS.    >yK > You probably don't want to rent a car and drive to-from Logan, unless you  haveK > sightseeing plans that'll make the car useful elsewhere.  Even so, you'llc be > dealing with Boston drivers.  C Not a smart move, especiallty with the Big Dig. Boston is a genuinetD goat-rope these days. Even without the Boston drivers. I've lived inK Taxachusetts for 17 years (much too long) but I have not driven into BostonhJ in over three years. They change the roadway configurations daily, and the traffic jams can be monumental.x   Hope this helps!   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 14:25:52 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>2) Subject: Re: Checking $STATUS for success., Message-ID: <3D822DAF.CF14A3C7@videotron.ca>   "John.Malmberg" wrote:I > A larger fragment may be needed, and what version(s) of OpenVMS are you> > seeing the behavior on?y    $CREATE/FDL=myfdl.fdl myfile.dat $IF $STATUS .AND. 1  $THEN 5 $	write sys$output "File creation failed, terminating> $ENDIF    H Now, in writing the above, I just realised why my procedure consistentlyM failed. Mea Culpa. I should have realised I was writing this in the wee hoursnK of the morning. I wasn't sure whether .AND. could be used as an operator toeM "merge" two binary nnumbers and focused on that , especially sicne when I didnI it in one line interactive, it seemed to work fine.  I was blinded by the " really obvious and stupid mistake.  H (hint: if $STATUS .AND. 1 does indicate success, not failure :-) :-) :-)   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 13:04:29 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)) Subject: Re: Checking $STATUS for successr= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0209131204.7586e121@posting.google.com>w  a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3D81D0BA.6FD6DC91@videotron.ca>...b > I am a bit stomped > 5 > Interactively, it seems that I can succesfully use:: > 4 > IF $STATUS .AND. 1 THEN write sys$output "Success" > O > But the above fails in a command procedure or if I test against anything else@ > than "1".   D It works for me. Can you give an example? And what is the purpose of@ testing it against anything other than 1? What are you trying to accomplish?i   A > So I gather that .AND. is not really legal in such a construct.   > .AND. is legal. If one operand is a string and the other is anC integer, the string is converted to integer before the operation iswD carried out. If the first non-space character in the string is t, T,A y, or Y, then it is converted to 1. If the string begins with anycE other letter, it is converted to 0. If the string is a valid integer,gD that integer is used. DCL treats all odd integers as logical 1's andE all even integers as logical 0's. So by doing IF ($STATUS) you are inu) effect testing the least significant bit.-  ! This is all in the User's Manual.   D > Is there a way to test only the first bit of $STATUS for success ?   $ IF ($STATUS) THEN ...l   More detail:  
 $ SET NOON $ <your-exciting-command>. $ STATUS = $STATUS $ SET ON3 $ IF (STATUS) THEN <command in the case of success>i6 $ IF (.NOT.STATUS) THEN <command in the case of error>  E (Parentheses are not needed here; I just think it makes the code moreh
 readable.)  ( > Or must I use the ON ERROR construct ?   No.t   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldmanw   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 15:06:12 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)) Subject: Re: Checking $STATUS for success = Message-ID: <343f30ae.0209131406.7efa8365@posting.google.com>t  Y Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in message news:<3D81EAA7.71438B63@127.0.0.1>...  > Joshua Cope wrote: > > M > > Oops - of course .AND. is bitwise. Not sure where I pulled that out from.o > >  > >   - Josh > >  > > Joshua Cope wrote: > > >n- > > > The .AND. operator is a logical AND. Soi; > > >    IF $STATUS .AND. 1 THEN write sys$output "Success"  > > > is really equivalent to ; > > >    IF $STATUS         THEN write sys$output "Success"c > > > R > > > If you need to break things down into error, warning, failure, etc., insteadE > > > of just success/failure, then use $SEVERITY instead of $STATUS.o > . > I have a feeling that is why I do what I do. > J > My (perhaps unfounded) theory is that I save the $STATUS to a symbol, inI > case I lose the $STATUS while manipulating $SEVERITY, and it's a simpleoH > matter to extract the severity from the status. Decisions taken on theD > severity reflect whether or not I need to use the remainder of the	 > status.o  D Once you save $STATUS, you've lost the original $SEVERITY. When I am in such a situation, I doe   $ STATUS = $STATUS $ SEVERITY = %X7.AND.STATUSs  E Yeah, I know you don't need the %X, but it reminds one that this is am bit operation.   > E > I had a complex set of decisions, and even a severe error had to bec: > viewed in context with other errors. Maybe I'm rambling.   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldmang   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 15:08:40 -0700. From: SPAMSINK2001@YAHOO.COM (Alan E. Feldman)) Subject: Re: Checking $STATUS for successe= Message-ID: <343f30ae.0209131408.3e07ee9f@posting.google.com>e  h "John.Malmberg" <Malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq> wrote in message news:<alslc9$gkm$1@web1.cup.hp.com>... > JF Mezei wrote:  > > I am a bit stomped > > 7 > > Interactively, it seems that I can succesfully use:i > > 6 > > IF $STATUS .AND. 1 THEN write sys$output "Success" > > Q > > But the above fails in a command procedure or if I test against anything else 
 > > than "1".- > G > You do realize that you are attempting to do mathematical AND with a r > string and a number?  A Why is that a problem? The string will be converted to an integerm) before the binary operation is performed.c   [...]    Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:59:20 GMT $ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MBa8 Message-ID: <00A13ED7.BF88864C@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  [ In article <3D828B29.A0EACECC@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:l >Carl Perkins wrote: >> w8 >> "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes... >> } [snip]f) >> }Never worked in healthcare, have you?  >> dB >> So you are telling me that if you are off on an estimate of how; >> big a file is someone will die. This is simply not true.- >-A >Clearly, you never have - and never should - work in healthcare.  >mI >I'm not going to waste my time with rest of that senseless prattle sincesH >you clearly lack the intellectual capacity to comprehend any response I >might try to enter.  I That's always a good argumentative tactic; tell somebody that they're toog$ stupid to understand your arguments.   >IA >I just hope you're not the poor, unfortunate son-of-bitch thirtyiE >heartbeats away from death when the medical records database crashes,H >because someone "approximated" the size of a database table and guessedF >wrong by 3%, especially if the ER people need to know something aboutC >your medical history or any other bit of info locked away in theire >paperless chart system...  K That's really a terrible example.  The database crashes because it runs outgJ of room to expand?  It still ought to be able to retrieve info even if it L can't store anything else.  And if there's no paper backup to the paperless J chart system, what does the ER do in a power failure?  Admittedly, the DBAJ should get the sizes right, but then the DBA should fudge upwards (turningI from precision to approximation) to allow for growth in the application. AL If you get the storage area size 100% correct for the table, what do you do  when you need to add a column?    C Y'know, Carl never said that an estimate was _always_ good enough. dK However, that's the position you seem to be arguing with.  Either that, or sK your position is that an estimate is _never_ good enough. (If your position + is actually something else, please say so.)n  I Neither of those positions is really defensible, even in the case of lifeaF and death situations.  The ambulance driver looks at the gas gauge andK estimates how long he can drive before he has to buy gas.  The gas gauge isDK shockingly imprecise, he's sure to be off - but if he figures that he's got3K a hundred miles and buys gas at 90, he'll be fine - and he'll be better offtG than if he drained the tank so he could measure exactly how much gas heoK has, then refilled it and drove a known distance, then drained and measuredtJ again so he could tell exactly (within measurement error, anyway) what gasH mileage he's currently getting, all during time when he could presumably have been out saving lives.n  I So estimates are sometimes good enough, and your choice of whether to use G an estimate or an exact calculation has to be based on a balance of thes5 need for precision and the effort it takes to get it.r   >eI >Oh yeah, I keep forgetting - you don't understand practical examples, not< >matter how relevant they may be to the main thread subject.  K Individual counter-examples can prove that an "always" or "never" statementpI is wrong, but they can't prove it's right.  You're not arguing with a lots of precision here.   -- Alan-   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:41:18 GMT,1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>u! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MBu' Message-ID: <3D828B29.A0EACECC@fsi.net>0   Carl Perkins wrote:4 > 7 > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes...e
 > } [snip]( > }Never worked in healthcare, have you? > A > So you are telling me that if you are off on an estimate of howj: > big a file is someone will die. This is simply not true.  @ Clearly, you never have - and never should - work in healthcare.  H I'm not going to waste my time with rest of that senseless prattle sinceG you clearly lack the intellectual capacity to comprehend any response It might try to enter.   @ I just hope you're not the poor, unfortunate son-of-bitch thirtyD heartbeats away from death when the medical records database crashesG because someone "approximated" the size of a database table and guessediE wrong by 3%, especially if the ER people need to know something aboutmB your medical history or any other bit of info locked away in their paperless chart system...m  H Oh yeah, I keep forgetting - you don't understand practical examples, no; matter how relevant they may be to the main thread subject.o   I'm done - have a great life!A   -- " David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:49:46 GMTh* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>! Subject: Re: Convert Blocks to MB > Message-ID: <kIvg9.1298$gf6.86588@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3D828B29.A0EACECC@fsi.net...    ...   B > I just hope you're not the poor, unfortunate son-of-bitch thirtyF > heartbeats away from death when the medical records database crashesI > because someone "approximated" the size of a database table and guessed G > wrong by 3%, especially if the ER people need to know something abouteD > your medical history or any other bit of info locked away in their > paperless chart system...n  I Please provide the name of that hospital that not only skates blithely sobI close to the hairy edge of its computing resources but uses software thatrL crashes when it bumps up against that edge, so that I can be sure *never* to	 go there.    - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 16:32:51 -0700  From: nmanser@progis.de (Manser)! Subject: Re: DEC AMDS VAX 7.3 buge= Message-ID: <2178d61f.0209131532.7a992a08@posting.google.com>   & the vms v7.3 system is the vaxstation.8 in my personnal cluster i am running the following nodes   2 alpha station v7.2-1 1 vax station v7.3  H when i start from the vax station decamds data analyser only the 2 alpha systems appear.e  J it seems that the file: amds$system:amds$vmsvax73.lib is buggy (12 blocks)% the other *.lib files have 60 blocks.c maybe the bug is there.h  S the problem is that the update are temporarly not available at the compaq web site.i   Nazim Manser.   n "Barry Kierstein" <Barry.Kierstein@Compaq.Com> wrote in message news:<uwMf9.51$tT5.645226@news.cpqcorp.net>...L > Is the V7.3 system you are trying to monitor the Vaxstation or another vax > node running V7.3? >  > Barry Kierstein: > / > "Manser" <nmanser@progis.de> wrote in messageg9 > news:2178d61f.0209110945.6d36a00a@posting.google.com...r > > Hi vms folks,  > >rE > >  I have installed on my vaxstation (vms 7.3)  4000-60 decamds 7.3s > >  data analyser.o  > >  the installation went fine.B > >  but when i started the data analyser the node with vaxvms 7.3< > >  doesn't appear,all the nodes with other versions appear > >n/ > >  in the logfile i got the following messageh > >eK > >  Copyright (c) 1995 Digital Equipment Corporation. All rights reserved.aJ > >  %AMDS-W-BADPARAM, bad parameter for program RMCONFIG request for node > >  URANUS 4 > >  %TRACE-W-TRACEBACK, symbolic stack dump followsG > >  module name     routine name                     line       rel PCr > >  abs PCi > >gH > >  COMM_UTILITY    AMDS$CheckIosbStatus            65614      000003D1
 > >  000538D5dH > >  COMM_UTILITY    ConfigDone                      66093      0000008E
 > >  00053E6EwH > >  ECL_ROUTINES    ecl$send                        62633      0000015D
 > >  00058E91-H > >  COMM_UTILITY    greetings                       66900      000003A4
 > >  0005476CuH > >  DECAMDS         rcv_from_comm                   62738      00000196
 > >  000511D63H > >  DECAMDS         AMDS$check_message              62597      00000010
 > >  00051020rG > >                                                            001B095Ce
 > >  001B095CeG > >                                                            001B0C2Ba
 > >  001B0C2BtG > >                                                            001AFFC5C
 > >  001AFFC5nG > >                                                            001AFFA1 
 > >  001AFFA1oH > >  DECAMDS         main                            61972      000008CC
 > >  00050644u > >a, > >  i have no service contract with compaq.+ > >  have anyone experienced this problem ? ! > >  is there a patch available ?  > >  thanks in advance > >r > >  Nazim Mansert   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 02:08:14 GMTr- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>t& Subject: Re: definition of SYS$SYSROOT: Message-ID: <iSwg9.2711$Zi.947087@news1.news.adelphia.net>   Alan E. Feldman wrote:C > "John.Malmberg" <Malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq> wrote in messageu)  > news:<alnr6k$l40$1@web1.cup.hp.com>...A > [...]  > H >>IIRC: Steve Hoffman did post an eplanation of why SYS$SYSROOT and the G >>related SYS$COMMON.DIR are structured the way they are on this forum e" >>sometime in the last year or so. >>$ >>A google search should turn it up. > " > I looked, but couldn't find it.   / I have looked also, and can not find it either.h  C My remembering of the discussion is that a few early VAX bootstrap eF loaders were hard coded to look for certain files in specific places, I and this structure allowed that to work.  I think the MicroVAX I was one A of them.  I It is thought that none of the current supported VAX platforms have that ,D limitation, but there really is no reason to make a change and risk  breaking something.n   -Johnp wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:57:07 +0200 - From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> 7 Subject: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest? ' Message-ID: <3D823502.A9B0F48A@Free.fr>d   Sue,  9 Maybe HPlovesVMS could invite Ken Olsen to the Symposium?n   D. -- h2   ------------------------------------------------2 MORANDI Consultants  http://Didier.Morandi.Free.fr0   19 chemin de la Butte, 31400 Toulouse, France.2 Tel.: +33 (0)6 7983 6418 - Fax: +33 (0)5 6154 19282 OpenVMS, APPLE, Computer Security, Migration plans2 --------------------------------------------------   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 15:36:59 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)f; Subject: Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?o3 Message-ID: <uyCdQKBYFbwd@eisner.encompasserve.org>   W In article <3D823502.A9B0F48A@Free.fr>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> writes:e  ; > Maybe HPlovesVMS could invite Ken Olsen to the Symposium?   G Or maybe they could stick to their promise and restrict it to technicalv	 sessions.r   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 22:34:43 GMT 1 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@attbi.com>t; Subject: Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?n. Message-ID: <7Ktg9.416653$me6.48228@sccrnsc01>  : "Didier Morandi" <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> wrote in message! news:3D823502.A9B0F48A@Free.fr...i > Sue, >n; > Maybe HPlovesVMS could invite Ken Olsen to the Symposium?a  I Nice idea, but unlikely. Ken turned 76 on Feb 20 and supposedly is not ineK the best of health. That's why he missed the DECworld 2001 event last year.a Stan Olsen was there, though.r   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 23:44:43 GMTu1 From: "C.W.Holeman II" <cwhii5@Julian5Locals.com>5; Subject: Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?eD Message-ID: <LLug9.5079$Os3.358493@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:  8 > In article <3D823502.A9B0F48A@Free.fr>, Didier Morandi" > <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> writes: > < >> Maybe HPlovesVMS could invite Ken Olsen to the Symposium? > I > Or maybe they could stick to their promise and restrict it to technicalh > sessions.e  E OK. Have Dave Cutler show up and reveal which lines of VMS and VAXELNm are in Windows-NT.   -- t C.W.Holeman II cwhii5@Julian5Locals.com remove the fives http://also.as/cwhii   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 07:31:28 +0200s- From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr>g; Subject: Re: first annual OpenVMS Symposium: Special Guest?e' Message-ID: <3D82C9B0.5EA63FF2@Free.fr>T   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:l > < > "Didier Morandi" <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> wrote in message# > news:3D823502.A9B0F48A@Free.fr...s > > Sue, > > = > > Maybe HPlovesVMS could invite Ken Olsen to the Symposium?t > H > Nice idea, but unlikely. Ken turned 76 on Feb 20 and supposedly is not > in the best of health.    E Terry DrinksWater, my dad is 88 and is in the best of health, thanks.e  9 > That's why he missed the DECworld 2001 event last year.r  5 Which DECworld 2001? Noone heard of this in France...i   D.   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 20:05:47 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) I Subject: Re: lexicals (was: RE: SET PROTECTION (SET SECURITY/PROTECTION)"-3 Message-ID: <daN6L9fdRRzB@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3D828D23.E34161F6@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:o > Arne Vajhj wrote:  D >> Since DCL does currently not support floating & fixed point, then' >> F$FAO ofcourse do not support those.m >> n> >> But if DCL supported floating & fixed point, then F$FAO may+ >> be the logical place to put formatting !  > J > I should think that F$FAO would support anything that $FAO supports, no?G > ...regardless of whether DCL supports the associated data(type(s))...*  E The "@" directives of $FAO do not make much sense in the DCL context.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:49:43 GMTa1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> I Subject: Re: lexicals (was: RE: SET PROTECTION (SET SECURITY/PROTECTION)"g' Message-ID: <3D828D23.E34161F6@fsi.net>s   Arne Vajhj wrote: >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: >  > > Bob Koehler wrote:_ > >>In article <3D800310.5EDCAF5D@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:yF > >>>If DCL supported floats, I could even see letting that behind the/ > >>>"brains" behind a new lexical: F$FORMAT().i& > >>   Redundant with f$fao, isn't it?G > > Dunno. Does (F)$FAO provide directives that allow the formatting ofnJ > > floating point and/or scaled integer data with decimal points, commas,< > > trailing signs and floating dollar signs like FORMAT$()? > >-L > > I don't recall ever seeing anything like that, but I'm hardly the expert > > on it ($FAO).t >  > ???? > C > Since DCL does currently not support floating & fixed point, then8& > F$FAO ofcourse do not support those. > = > But if DCL supported floating & fixed point, then F$FAO mayi* > be the logical place to put formatting !  H I should think that F$FAO would support anything that $FAO supports, no?E ...regardless of whether DCL supports the associated data(type(s))...g   -- g David J. Dachtera0 dba DJE Systemsr http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 13:53:25 -0400 % From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> Y Subject: Re: license costs (was: RE: Microsoft reeling from hack attacks, VMS   just yawn / Message-ID: <uo49gnesvtke7b@news.supernews.com>   3 "jlsue" <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> wrote in message 2 news:mnr3ou0q3ccesm60l5s3jm9fvh3m948oqu@4ax.com...E > On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 11:34:42 -0400, "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>r > wrote: > 6 > >"jlsue" <jlsuexxxz@screaminet.com> wrote in message5 > >news:9d31ou4ue6ajnmqvgvhdr89mg8jicbdf5v@4ax.com... 1 > >> On Wed, 11 Sep 2002 19:01:22 -0400, JF MezeiD* > >> <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote: > >> > >> >jlsue wrote:K > >> >> But the competitor, low-end products (especially Windows) do not go H > >> >> through the exhaustive qualification that VMS does for supported > >> >> platforms. > >> > > > L > >Yes, they do.  It's called Windows 2000 Datacenter Edition and it costs a > >LOT.  > E > Minor NIT.... I said "low-end products".  Datacenter Edition is not C > low-end.  And, just fyi, your statement is exactly what I've been  > saying all along.e >l  H Windows NT/2000 Workstation is the same code as Datacenter edition.  TheC difference is qualification and some registry tweaks to enable morefK processors and RAM.  I think we agree that if you want to compare VMS to NTO+ you have to look at the Datacenter edition.i   >h > >>J > >> Sure, but again, there's a trade-off that if we decide not to performG > >> the qualifications on the low-end systems, the result could easilyt4 > >> become a parity in the reliability comparisons. > >> > >eG > >Are you suggesting that when the Itanium port is released, HP shouldO refuse. > >to license OpenVMS on unqualified hardware? > G > I don't think I ever made this statement.  Honestly, I can't even seeh6 > how what I did say could even be construed this way. >   H HP can either sell a low cost, unqualified VMS license and live with theJ reliability problems and complaints or it can refuse to sell a license forB unqualified hardware.  There's no way they can qualify everything.   > >xK > >When OpenVMS/IA-64 is released I hope that HP comes up with pricing that H > >mimics Microsoft.  If you want an OpenVMS license, it's $300.  If you callL > >for support, have your credit card ready.  If you want an OpenVMS license onI > >qualified hardware with support, it's $3,000.  If you need a developer J > >license, it's $1,000 a year for everything HP has.  A single person can runaE > >the software on as many machines as they need to but it's only for K > >development use, not production.  Just take a Microsoft MSDN License and  > >change Microsoft to HP. >uE > This is interesting.  Hey, I'm all for cheaper VMS solutions.  I've E > been asking for it since the late 80s, early 90s (I have not always G > been a DEC/CPQ/HPQ employee).  I have no idea if they are consideringo2 > this since I'm not in that part of the business. >a >o > >>B > >> I don't see how one can expect that a system+OS that has veryF > >> controlled hardware variability, with a significant qualification> > >> effort and higher reliability, should be capable of beingI > >> cost-competitive with a throw-away system that may have a huge array-K > >> of possible hardware combinations, and almost no qualification effort.  > >> > > L > >There's no added cost in selling low-end OpenVMS licenses for unqualified > >hardware. > F > Well, I can tell you that this assertion is not always true.  We hadH > low-cost storage (compared to certain competitors) in our StorageWorksB > SAN products, and we got bit with customer sat. issues when theyH > couldn't/didn't implement them correctly.  The failures were generally9 > blamed on the product, when it was more often incorrect F > implementation.  This has forced us to require the purchase of a SanF > Implementation Service with all our SAN hardware.  It's the only wayG > we can guarantee that the stuff is implemented correctly.  And we can B > verify that, at the time we leave, it is all working fine (well,E > assuming the customer doesn't change things when we get back to ourb > hotel rooms in the evenings).u >t  I I can understand the problem but I don't think the solution is to require G SAN implementation service.  That will just raise the cost of entry and H those low-end cistomers will go to Dell or someone else.  They should beE improving the software to make implementation easier, creating better # documentation, training videos etc.r  C > >The main fear that HP will have is that selling low-end licenses G > >will cannibalize their high-end, qualified sales.  If HP doesn't eatO theirn > >young, someone else will. > >1 >hF > I don't know if this is even an issue today.  For one thing, at thisE > point nobody is predicting the low-cost IA64 products we've come to2@ > expect from Intel-world systems.  Intel, itself, appears to be2 > charging a good bit of scratch to get the chips. > " > Only time will tell on that one.  - Yep, and I'm glad I'll be along for the ride!R   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 16:07:35 -0400s( From: "David M Smith" <dsmit115@csc.com>E Subject: Re: Licenses, MicroVAX 3800 Console (was: Re: Two questions) ' Message-ID: <altgi9$6qn$1@lore.csc.com>   ? "Hoff Hoffman" <hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam> wrote in message.$ news:alj8ta$ss6$1@web1.cup.hp.com...J >   The KA650 and KA655 series consoles had at least one function commonlyH >   found and commonly used on previous KA630 MicroVAX consoles excised,F >   simply to provide room in the ROM for the then-new console commandI >   interface.    Extra credit: name this most significant feature of therJ >   KA630 console that was removed from the KA650 and KA655 series console >   program.   I give -- was it HELP?   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:45:42 GMTu1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> E Subject: Re: Licenses, MicroVAX 3800 Console (was: Re: Two questions)s' Message-ID: <3D828C32.56F92D56@fsi.net>    Chris Scheers wrote: > f > hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) wrote in message news:<alj8ta$ss6$1@web1.cup.hp.com>... > L > >   The KA650 and KA655 series consoles had at least one function commonlyJ > >   found and commonly used on previous KA630 MicroVAX consoles excised,H > >   simply to provide room in the ROM for the then-new console commandK > >   interface.    Extra credit: name this most significant feature of the L > >   KA630 console that was removed from the KA650 and KA655 series console > >   program. > D > Hmmm... I would have to boot up a KA650 to check, but could it be: > # >      Searching for a boot device?r  F Good question. I remember seeing my MV-II/Q5 do that, but don't recall3 seeing a machine do it since. (Well, maybe MV2K...).   -- s David J. Dachteraa dba DJE Systems. http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/a   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:52:24 GMTp1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>u! Subject: Re: Mr. Bush at the U.N.3' Message-ID: <3D828DC4.6FB14A8E@fsi.net>d   Atlant Schmidt wrote:  >  > "David J. Dachtera" wrote: > A > > Some items (among many) to look for - you should find photos,oE > > eye-witness accounts and such in the U.S. press as well that from  > > overseas: ...c > >eC > > o Iraq's push into Kuwait and attrocities committed during. ...e > - > You did read the follow-ups to that, right?e > / > It turns out that many of those "attrocities"s0 > (e.g., "babies tossed out of incubators so the( > incubators could be moved to Baghdad")3 > never existed except in the minds of a particulara1 > PR firm that was hired to promote the war. And,d/ > BTW, that same PR firm is still in the employ   > of some of the factions today.  C I think you'll find that these attrocities were documented (photos, D eye-witnesses, survivors, dying declarations of victims, etc.) quite thoroughly./   -- e David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems- http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 12:11:49 -0700, From: colive@technologEase.com (Chris Olive)0 Subject: Oracle 7.3, Pro*FORTRAN and using dates= Message-ID: <b10654c6.0209131111.60abf2a3@posting.google.com>   C Well, I'm just a system hack doing an applications programmer's job = right now...  On an OpenVMS 7.1 system running Oracle 7.3 andoE Pro*FORTRAN.  (It's old, but hey, it's paying the bills right now...)m  E In doing some maintenance on an Oracle-based app, I need to introduce A some logic that deals with dates.  Now, I'm much more comfortableoE using VMS system dates (64-bit internal) and using system service/RTL D calls to accomplish date manipulation.  And I'm somewhat familiar onF the Oracle side with Oracle's built-in DATE type (which isn't the sameC as VMS), and the TO_DATE() function.  So my appeal is to those withoA more application experience than myself -- which method would YOUn+ choose to stick with in dealing with dates?   @ I'd rather just define my columns in Oracle as RAW(8), store theE 64-bit VMS internal time in the RAW column, use VMS calls and be donecE with it, but alas it appears RAW() isn't a good choice (from what I'maC reading and experiencing myself) in dealing with data.  But I don't F want to do a lot of work moving between Oracle's DATE type and the VMS format.l  E In short, I'm admitting I'm plenty deficient in using the Oracle DATE2C type.  I'd rather just use the VMS 64-bit internal time format, butu> any dates (in this app) HAVE to be stored in an Oracle table. > Suggestions?  I am going to have to do some date comparisions,? manipulations, etc. in this app... not just store static dates.C   Chris.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 15:53:01 -0400e! From: Jim Agnew <jpagnew@vcu.edu>o4 Subject: Re: Oracle 7.3, Pro*FORTRAN and using dates' Message-ID: <3D82421D.B36A3330@vcu.edu>n  E I cobbled up some routines to convert to/from SAS dates, # of secondsl since Jan 1st, 1960.(I think)..2  H Only problem is that old software tends to live til the date arithimeticE blows up, as the Integer * 4 word overflowed with that evil scheme ofm mine..  B one could use UT datetimes, and Fortran routines would be portableF across *ALL* systems known.  We have an ICU monitoring system that wasF born and will die on VMS, as all the system calls are not portable. If7 you are not worried about portablity, do what you want.   G I don't know too much about Oracle. Long ago, we went with Ingres as itu was superior back then..   Chris Olive wrote: > E > Well, I'm just a system hack doing an applications programmer's jobo? > right now...  On an OpenVMS 7.1 system running Oracle 7.3 andeG > Pro*FORTRAN.  (It's old, but hey, it's paying the bills right now...): > G > In doing some maintenance on an Oracle-based app, I need to introduce C > some logic that deals with dates.  Now, I'm much more comfortablehG > using VMS system dates (64-bit internal) and using system service/RTLeF > calls to accomplish date manipulation.  And I'm somewhat familiar onH > the Oracle side with Oracle's built-in DATE type (which isn't the sameE > as VMS), and the TO_DATE() function.  So my appeal is to those withAC > more application experience than myself -- which method would YOUI- > choose to stick with in dealing with dates?s > B > I'd rather just define my columns in Oracle as RAW(8), store theG > 64-bit VMS internal time in the RAW column, use VMS calls and be done G > with it, but alas it appears RAW() isn't a good choice (from what I'm E > reading and experiencing myself) in dealing with data.  But I don't H > want to do a lot of work moving between Oracle's DATE type and the VMS	 > format.s > G > In short, I'm admitting I'm plenty deficient in using the Oracle DATEmE > type.  I'd rather just use the VMS 64-bit internal time format, butT? > any dates (in this app) HAVE to be stored in an Oracle table.s@ > Suggestions?  I am going to have to do some date comparisions,A > manipulations, etc. in this app... not just store static dates.< >  > Chriso   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:04:48 -00003- From: wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer)g4 Subject: Re: Oracle 7.3, Pro*FORTRAN and using dates5 Message-ID: <9288A34AFwarrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>n  0 colive@technologEase.com (Chris Olive) wrote in 2 <b10654c6.0209131111.60abf2a3@posting.google.com>:  D >Well, I'm just a system hack doing an applications programmer's job> >right now...  On an OpenVMS 7.1 system running Oracle 7.3 andF >Pro*FORTRAN.  (It's old, but hey, it's paying the bills right now...) >tF >In doing some maintenance on an Oracle-based app, I need to introduceB >some logic that deals with dates.  Now, I'm much more comfortableF >using VMS system dates (64-bit internal) and using system service/RTLE >calls to accomplish date manipulation.  And I'm somewhat familiar oncG >the Oracle side with Oracle's built-in DATE type (which isn't the same D >as VMS), and the TO_DATE() function.  So my appeal is to those withB >more application experience than myself -- which method would YOU, >choose to stick with in dealing with dates? >wA >I'd rather just define my columns in Oracle as RAW(8), store the3F >64-bit VMS internal time in the RAW column, use VMS calls and be doneF >with it, but alas it appears RAW() isn't a good choice (from what I'mD >reading and experiencing myself) in dealing with data.  But I don'tG >want to do a lot of work moving between Oracle's DATE type and the VMSf >format. >uF >In short, I'm admitting I'm plenty deficient in using the Oracle DATED >type.  I'd rather just use the VMS 64-bit internal time format, but? >any dates (in this app) HAVE to be stored in an Oracle table. s? >Suggestions?  I am going to have to do some date comparisions,t@ >manipulations, etc. in this app... not just store static dates. >u >Chris >i   Chris,  K I've done a lot of Oracle programming in Pro*C, with heavy date usage (one eH app was a shop-floor scheduler).  I really can't say enough good things @ about Oracle's date handling.  Want an OpenVMS formatted date?    5     	TO_CHAR (mydate_column, 'DD-MON-YYY HH24:MI:SS')0  J The only downside is no hundredths of a second (IIRC) in the Oracle world.  I Want to convert a date in your program variable to store in the database?    insert into myTableS     	(mydate_column) values 6     	(TO_DATE(:DateVariable, 'DD-MON-YYY HH24:MI:SS'))  J Do you have desktop users that need to select rows from your tables using H perhaps MS Access, Excel, or other similar tools?  They'll be unable to < decode your raw dates if you store them as OpenVMS binaries.  L Best advice I can give:  Absolutely use Oracle's native date data types and J functions.  They're very good, and your "adjustment" period will be quite  minimal.  L And yes, RAW columns have restrictions - avoid their use until you *really* K need them.  Betcha can't even sort on them (but I'm not sure), which would o/ make retrieving rows sorted by date impossible..   ws   -- i   Warren Spencer' Senior Software Engineer (not a writer)C The Associated Press  < ** Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a bananna. **   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:03:04 GMT $ From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Subject: Re: ORD8 Message-ID: <00A13ECF.E3A6FD63@SSRL04.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  d In article <alsu6e$rho9$1@ID-141708.news.dfncis.de>, "Peter Weaver" <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> writes:/ >"Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message 4 >news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJICEKBFLAA.tom@kednos.com... >>...s5 >> Yes, and unfortunately I'm sure it will get postedg >a >>...y >dI >Yes, but hopefully over in rec.aviation.piloting where there is a threadSK >called "Airport Codes" that started yesterday. If anyone wants to carry on L >this discussion then that is the place to do it, we have WAY TOO MANY otherK >OFF TOPIC threads going on in this group for this one. Is it again time tot" >ask that this group be moderated?  J While I agree about the OT threads, it is not again time to ask that this J group be moderated.  It will never be time for that.  (As I understand theF process, it's virtually impossible to convert an existing unmoderated I newsgroup into a moderated one.)  What you'd have to ask for would be the M creation of a different moderated newsgroup and for a moderator to volunteer,lM and for somebody to shepherd the creation of the newsgroup through the voting-G process, and for somebody to arrange an email gateway for the new groupn3 (because there are valuable info-vax contributors).4   -- Alan@   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 01:13:14 GMTw1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>. Subject: Re: ORD' Message-ID: <3D8292A3.988FCC92@fsi.net>n   Peter Weaver wrote:h > 0 > "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message5 > news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJICEKBFLAA.tom@kednos.com...b > >...6 > > Yes, and unfortunately I'm sure it will get posted >  > >... > J > Yes, but hopefully over in rec.aviation.piloting where there is a threadL > called "Airport Codes" that started yesterday. If anyone wants to carry onM > this discussion then that is the place to do it, we have WAY TOO MANY other L > OFF TOPIC threads going on in this group for this one. Is it again time to# > ask that this group be moderated?   D If threatening posts, profanity and obscenity were problematic, thenH yes, it might time to moderate this forum (though that would likely be aD full-time job, and I don't know who we'd get to sponsor it - HP? NotG likely!). Until then, I think we can tolerate the occasional flame war,sA Dachtera Vs. Perkins, Todd Vs. Shannon, Andrew Vs. The World, ...e   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsf http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 19:27:20 -0700m# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>  Subject: RE: ORD9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAELPFLAA.tom@kednos.com>   - It isn't flamewars, it is the ennui of boring.) irrelevant topics, also known as bullshiti     >-----Original Message-----g7 >From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@fsi.net]e) >Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 6:13 PMt >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >Subject: Re: ORDe >d >l >Peter Weaver wrote: >>  1 >> "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in messagea6 >> news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJICEKBFLAA.tom@kednos.com... >> >...e7 >> > Yes, and unfortunately I'm sure it will get postedo >> b >> >...o >> eK >> Yes, but hopefully over in rec.aviation.piloting where there is a threadpB >> called "Airport Codes" that started yesterday. If anyone wants  >to carry onD >> this discussion then that is the place to do it, we have WAY TOO  >MANY others@ >> OFF TOPIC threads going on in this group for this one. Is it  >again time to$ >> ask that this group be moderated? >tE >If threatening posts, profanity and obscenity were problematic, theneI >yes, it might time to moderate this forum (though that would likely be agE >full-time job, and I don't know who we'd get to sponsor it - HP? NothH >likely!). Until then, I think we can tolerate the occasional flame war,B >Dachtera Vs. Perkins, Todd Vs. Shannon, Andrew Vs. The World, ... >b >--  >David J. Dachtera >dba DJE Systems >http://www.djesys.com/  >_) >Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:a  >http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ >. >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.n; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).a@ >Version: 6.0.385 / Virus Database: 217 - Release Date: 9/4/2002 >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.385 / Virus Database: 217 - Release Date: 9/4/2002    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:19:02 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>i4 Subject: OT: Another security flaw in Microsoft Word, Message-ID: <3D82B8A8.A03FD089@videotron.ca>  5 Since many are forced to use Microsoft's WORD here...e      1   Microsoft Finds Security Flaw in Word Software a     9/12/02 5:40pm v     Associated Press  N  WASHINGTON -- Microsoft Corp.'s (MSFT) flagship word processor has a securityN flaw that could allow the theft of computer files by "bugging" a document with. a hidden code, the company disclosed Thursday.  M   Microsoft said it is exploring how to fix the problem and whether to extendaG the repair to an older  version of the software still used by millions.   N   The attack begins when a bugged document goes out, usually with a request toN be revised and returned to the sender -- a common form of daily communication.N When the document is changed  and sent back, the targeted file accompanies it.  G   "It has the potential of allowing people to get at data that they areuM explicitly not allowed to get to," said Woody Leonhard, who has written booksd( on Microsoft's Word and Office software.  K   The flaw would most likely occur in the workplace, where Word is the mosttM prominent  word-processing program. Potential targets for theft are sensitiveiI legal contracts, payroll records  or e-mails, either from a hard drive oru< computer network, depending on the victim's access to files.  N   "The issue appears to affect all versions of Microsoft Word," Microsoft saidN in a statement issued  in response to questions by the Associated Press. "WhenI the investigation is completed, we will  take the action that best servesh Microsoft's customers."e  H   Word 97, an earlier version of the program, is most susceptible to theK attack. But Word 97 won't  be repaired because Microsoft no longer providesm! support for it, the company said.   J   A research firm reported in May that about 32% of offices have copies ofM Word 97 running, according to a survey of 1,500 high-tech managers worldwide.   N   Analyst Laura DiDio of the Yankee Group said the companies are taking a riskN by using such old  software. But she said Microsoft should correct the problemF because of its severity. "These are paying customers," Ms. DiDio said.  H   Mr. Leonhard said Word 97 users "bought the package with full faith inE Microsoft and its ability to protect them from this kind of exploit."s  J   Word 97 users may be able to get some help through Microsoft's telephoneN tech support,  company spokesman Casey McGee said. But, referring to MicrosoftA engineers, Mr. McGee said "there's only so far back they can go."i  M   The flaw involving Word 97 was discovered by Alex Gantman of cellular phonesJ company  Qualcomm Inc. (QCOM) and was released on the Internet last month.  N   An attacker only has to place hidden codes in a Word document, which is sentM to a would-be victim with a request for a response. If the recipient has WordrI 97 and revises the Word document, any file sought by the attacker will bee> hidden inside the Word document and sent back to the attacker.  N   If the intended target uses Word 2000 or 2002, the most recent versions, theJ attack will only work if the Word document is printed first before a reply goes out to the attacker.3  M   After seeing Gantman's work on a public security e-mail forum, Mr. Leonhard K found a similar flaw that affects recent Word versions even when a document3L isn't printed. In this case, the stolen file is visible within the document,/ although the attacker can make it hard to find.7  L   Microsoft says that in both security flaws, an attacker would have to knowM the exact file name to be stolen and its location. But many critical files --gK an address book or saved e-mails, for example  -- are usually in obvious ore7 predictable places on every Microsoft Windows computer.v  L   Microsoft suggests users view hidden codes in every document they open. InL Word 2002, the latest version, that can be done by selecting tools, options,M then checking the "field codes" box.  Many companies, however, use such codesr% for legitimate and harmless purposes.   M   Mr. Leonhard said that if an attacker tries to steal a very large file, the.N victim might notice it when saving or e-mailing the bugged document. A smaller" file might not get that attention.  K   "It's very much dependent on the greed of the person fishing for a file,". Mr. Leonhard said.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 14:10:45 -0400h From: norm.raphael@metso.com0 Subject: Re: Press Release from Digital Networks? Message-ID: <OF83F78982.06D9BD97-ON85256C33.00635641@metso.com>r  E They still have the Digital Networking products we all know and love.o  H (Some of the pictured products still have the |d|i|g|i|t|a|l| logo on t= hem, too.)p   Do any of these seem familiar?   PART #    DESCRIPTION B DSRVH-RA  DECserver 90M Access Server with 2MB FLASH (Stand-alone)B DSRVH-PA  DECserver 90M Access Server with 2MB FLASH (Hub Version)3 DSRVW-GA  DECserver 700-16 No FLASH for U.S./Canada0E DSRVW-GC  DECserver 700-16 with Factory Installed FLASH Card for U.S.  Canada/ DSRVZ-MC  DECserver 900TM Network Access ServerC) DEHUA-CA  DECserver 900TM Docking Station < H8585-AA  DB9 to MJ8 Console Port Adapter for PC Serial Port1 BN25G-03* Patch Cord for Console Port Connections , H0345-AA  Flash Card for DECserver 700/900TM3 DSRVW-EA  DECserver 700-08 No FLASH for U.S. Canada1E DSRVW-EC  DECserver 700-08 with Factory Installed FLASH Card for U.S.1 Canada  DSRVW-KA  DECserver 732 No FLASH' DSRVW-KC  DECserver 732 with FLASH Card             C Arne Vajh=F8j <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk> on 09/13/2002 01:44:33 PM   ; Please respond to Arne Vajh=F8j <arne.vajhoej@mail.tele.dk>    To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:03 Subject:    Re: Press Release from Digital Networks      Tom Linden wrote:   > > Not sure what this has to do with VMS, did I miss something?  6 I believe Digital Networks is a spinoff from Cabletron5 that bougth the Digital network hardware products, soa) there are a historical connection to VMS.   0 That said then I assume their products today are! completely server vendor neutral.M   Arne               =o   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 18:49:29 -040070 From: "Alan Boyles" <alan.boyles@mindspring.com>0 Subject: Re: Press Release from Digital Networks/ Message-ID: <uo4q72c46abne9@corp.supernews.com>e  J Digital Networks is going to be doing some GREAT things in the near futureJ with clustering and SANs.  DN has the best cluster gigabit backbone deviceI and they will be coming out shortly with a combo Network and SAN backboneg0 box.  Look for them at HPETS in their own booth.   Alan.f    . "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message3 news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIAEKNFLAA.tom@kednos.com...a> > Not sure what this has to do with VMS, did I miss something? >t > >-----Original Message----- = > >From: Sue Skonetski [mailto:susan.skonetski@hp.nospam.com]I+ > >Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 6:49 AMn > >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com/ > >Subject: Press Release from Digital Networksl > >  > >a > >FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE > >  > >i > >m > >g; > >DIGITAL NETWORKS INTRODUCES TWO NEW NETWORKING PRODUCTS:- > >-# > >Multiswitch fast ethernet 948TXG1 > >   > >DNWireless(tm) NetCatcher(tm) > >n@ > >Digital Networks Relocates Corporate Offices to Nashua, ANN.. > >S > >l > >tI > >Nashua, N.H., August 5, 2002 - Digital Networks, a leading provider ofuJ > >networking solutions, today announced availability of two new products:F > >MultiSwitch Fast Ethernet Switch 948TXG for data centers and wiring closets G > >and DNwireless(tm) NetCatcher(tm) providing wireless connectivity of-5 > >computer systems in an office or home environment.r > >MJ > >"Digital Networks is continuing to expand its product offerings for our< > >traditional enterprise customers with the introduction of > >MultiSwitch 948TXG.F > >which allows businesses to extend their network without significantI > >investment," said Vic Capozzi, CEO of Digital Networks.  "And today wet are<C > >extending our product line into the small business - home officer > >market withE > >the launch of DNwireless(tm) NetCatcher(tm) which allows companies  > >to createL > >and maintain their own network that allows fast, dependable access to the > >Internet. > >eD > >"Digital Networks is committed to providing enterprises and small
 > >businesses L > >with the products and services they need to remain competitive in today'sA > >economy. These two new products are reflective of the types ofF > >solutions our@ > >customers are telling us they need to deploy," added Capozzi. > >VH > >The MultiSwitch Fast Ethernet Switch 948TXG, a high-density standards basedeB > >10/100 switch for the MultiSwitch 900 family, has been designed > >for the dataeA > >center and wiring closet to bring more capacity for high speed  > >switching. ItI > >comes with wire-speed performance and full features to bring low-cost," highF > >density Fast Ethernet switching and Gigabit Ethernet uplinks to the= > >MultiSwitch 900 family.  The switch can be deployed either. > >stand-alone usingG > >the DEChub ONE single slot chassis or in a modular form factor usingr eitherL > >of the MultiSwitch 900 chassis.  The MultiSwitch 948TXG is list priced at
 > >$6,595. > >p' > >MultiSwitch 948TXG Product Features:o > >rE > >       Works with 48 port 10/100 switch with two Gigabit Ethernetu uplinks I > >       Has 24 physical RJ45 connections; each supporting two switched.D > >10/100 ports allowing the network designers flexibility on wiring > >configurations- > >-; > >       Can be installed in seconds and is hot swappablerH > >       Supports SNMPv2, CLI and web based management using clearVISN6 > >allowing network configuration from any web browser > >FJ > >The DNwireless NetCatcher enables fast, dependable, and secure wirelessI > >computer access within a home or small office environment.  NetCatcher D > >allows businesses and consumers to build a network based on their specificH > >needs and gain the advantages of a private wired and wireless networkI > >without the high cost of technical support. Multiple access levels and G > >filtering options provide a secure business environment.  NetCatchert allowsJ > >network users to browse the web at the same time - without adding extraH > >phone lines or Internet accounts.  NetCatcher is priced competitively underp > >$300. > >y* > >DNwireless NetCatcher Product Features:L > >       Connect the NetCatcher unit via Ethernet cable to existing DSL orD > >cable modem - (connects up to 253 users with a shared IP address) > >aJ > >       Use ISDN or analog modem connections to the NetCatcher unit for8 > >dial-up access or to back up the broadband connection > >FG > >       Add DNwireless RC 11 Radio Card for wireless connectivity toiK > >desktops, laptops and PDA's between rooms or floors without any wires to  > >confine operationst > >$L > >       Out of the box installation with easy step-by-step instructions -< > >and uses any standard web browser to configure the system > >sK > >       Hardwire computers in proximity directly to the three 10/100 LAN- > >portsJ > >       Built in print server allows shared printer for everyone on the
 > >networkK > >       Built in firewall lets you set access levels by individual usersgL > >       NetCatcher comes with a one-year warranty plus telephone support. > >c > >About Digital NetworksoK > >Digital Networks designs and develops products and solutions that enable B > >business of all sizes to share Internet access, peripherals and > >applicationsiK > >among multiple computer and Internet-enabled devices.  Digital Networks'RD > >roadmap for the future includes new products aimed at meeting the businessH > >requirements in the area of wireless, enterprise backbones, workgroupJ > >computing and device server products. The company is privately held and@ > >recently relocated its corporate headquarters to Nashua, N.H. > >b > >mB > >For further information about Digital Networks and its products > >please visittL > >their site at www.digitalnetworks.net <http://www.digitalnetworks.net> or > >call 603-589-0300.o > >f > >Press Information:t > >Cheryl Delgreco > >Media Strategies  > >617-723-4004  > >delgreco@shore.net$ > >o > >u > >  > >---) > >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.w= > >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).aB > >Version: 6.0.385 / Virus Database: 217 - Release Date: 9/4/2002 > >A > ---l( > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A > Version: 6.0.385 / Virus Database: 217 - Release Date: 9/4/2002  >j   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 01:18:04 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>r0 Subject: Re: Press Release from Digital Networks' Message-ID: <3D8293C9.ACA7EB81@fsi.net>s   Tom Linden wrote:o > > > Not sure what this has to do with VMS, did I miss something?  - That depends on whether you've ever heard of:e   o DECnet   o LATm   o MOP   	 o TCP/IP:u%   - UCX / TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS    - TCPware1   - Multinet   - Wollongong Pathway
   - CMU/IP   -- o David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsl http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 17:01:02 -0700/ From: chinachowchow@mailcity.com (Rick Nickles)c9 Subject: Seeking Senior VMS System Administrator PositionT= Message-ID: <ac4e3b24.0209131601.743d87ba@posting.google.com>E  
 Greetings!  D      I was recently involved in a major downsizing, and I am seeking@ employment.  If there is anyone who knows of any VMS openings orA anything that may be appropriate for a person with a MS degree in A Computer Science and 15 years of VMS experience.  Apparently thiswC layoff was primarily due to the financial state of our company, andhF also due to the fact that they do not plan to use VMS in the future.  E I would be more than happy to forward my resume on request. Thank youl so much for any help or ideas.   Thanks   Rick Nickles chinachowchow@mailcity.com   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 19:48:01 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) = Subject: Re: Seeking Senior VMS System Administrator Positiond3 Message-ID: <Ewq47tZ5sOcT@eisner.encompasserve.org>   k In article <M7vg9.15992$Wa.914882@twister.southeast.rr.com>, "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@openvms.org> writes:aN > You may want to post this message in the OpenVMS.org resume forum.  It can't > hurt.f > , > http://www.openvms.org/phorum/list.php?f=3  : It also would not hurt to indicate a geography preference.   > Kenneth Farmer > http://www.Tru64.org > http://www.OpenVMS.org > http://www.LinuxHPC.orge >  >  > > > "Rick Nickles" <chinachowchow@mailcity.com> wrote in message9 > news:ac4e3b24.0209131601.743d87ba@posting.google.com...h
 >> Greetings!$ >>G >>      I was recently involved in a major downsizing, and I am seekingnC >> employment.  If there is anyone who knows of any VMS openings oriD >> anything that may be appropriate for a person with a MS degree inD >> Computer Science and 15 years of VMS experience.  Apparently thisF >> layoff was primarily due to the financial state of our company, andG >> also due to the fact that they do not plan to use VMS in the future.aH >> I would be more than happy to forward my resume on request. Thank you! >> so much for any help or ideas.t >>	 >> Thankss >> >> Rick Nickles  >> chinachowchow@mailcity.comp >  >  -- sN ==============================================================================I The Boulder Pledge: "Under no circumstances will I ever purchase anythinggJ      offered to me as the result of an unsolicited email message. Nor willI      I forward chain letters, petitions, mass mailings, or virus warningstH      to large numbers of others. This is my contribution to the survival      of the online community."N ==============================================================================   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:10:20 GMT , From: "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@openvms.org>= Subject: Re: Seeking Senior VMS System Administrator Position < Message-ID: <M7vg9.15992$Wa.914882@twister.southeast.rr.com>  L You may want to post this message in the OpenVMS.org resume forum.  It can't hurt.s  * http://www.openvms.org/phorum/list.php?f=3   --   Kenneth Farmer http://www.Tru64.org http://www.OpenVMS.org http://www.LinuxHPC.orgy      < "Rick Nickles" <chinachowchow@mailcity.com> wrote in message7 news:ac4e3b24.0209131601.743d87ba@posting.google.com...i > Greetings! >aF >      I was recently involved in a major downsizing, and I am seekingB > employment.  If there is anyone who knows of any VMS openings orC > anything that may be appropriate for a person with a MS degree inoC > Computer Science and 15 years of VMS experience.  Apparently thisrE > layoff was primarily due to the financial state of our company, anduF > also due to the fact that they do not plan to use VMS in the future.G > I would be more than happy to forward my resume on request. Thank youl  > so much for any help or ideas. >i > Thanks >  > Rick Nickles > chinachowchow@mailcity.com   ------------------------------  + Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 05:03:25 +0000 (UTC)i From: myfmbz@yahoo.comD Subject: Start Earning right now in 30 mins - Instant Download  87672 Message-ID: <alufut$7go$4077@nobel.pacific.net.sg>  % http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/PETE7323/l  % http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/PETE7323/b            - Instant Download-    - Instant Download-    - Instant Download0      
 Free Downloadr  4 The Absolute Beginner's Guide to Starting a Web Site   Totally Free Web Resources   Unlimited Profitss   7 Secrets To Unlimited Traffic   Scientific Advertising  # How to Start Your Own Traffic Viruse   Marketing Warriors Tipss   eBookoMatic.   eBook Submitter5   The Best of Web Gold   On Line Stealth Marketing   	 and more        % http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/PETE7323/r  % http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/PETE7323/v            - Instant Downloadn    - Instant Download     - Instant Downloadr          % http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/PETE7323/   % http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/PETE7323/hP jdsmdddioimrltybhpmpgyxzjhjxdpumfmbgmuvdkwhviflijwfvmrnspjszhueskbdcccxbeckhovmd   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:55:06 GMTD1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>: Subject: Re: Sybase and VMSC' Message-ID: <3D828E67.B3501C41@fsi.net>-   Arne Vajhj wrote: >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: >  > > Arne Vajhj wrote:? > >>I think that many has choosen to migrate from Sybase/VMS tob* > >>Sybase/non-VMS instead of Oracle/VMS ! > >eH > > I forwarded this info. to Sue Skonetski, Cc: Mark Gorham and RichardB > > Marcello with the subject line "More Endangered VMS accounts". >  > Probably 2 years too late.  3 ...better a crooked furrow than a field unplowed...t   -- t David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/m   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 00:54:25 GMT 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>I Subject: Re: Sybase and VMSd' Message-ID: <3D828E3E.208E6191@fsi.net>e   David Webb wrote:m > ] > In article <3D8145AE.26854403@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:A > >Arne Vajhj wrote:P > >> > >> Jakob Erber wrote:/ > >>Q > >> > The ending support of sybase for VMS is the reason for us to leave VMS. WeDR > >> > cannot live with an unsupported DB and migration is easier than changing to > >> > oracle. > >>@ > >> I think that many has choosen to migrate from Sybase/VMS to+ > >> Sybase/non-VMS instead of Oracle/VMS !l > >oG > >I forwarded this info. to Sue Skonetski, Cc: Mark Gorham and RichardSA > >Marcello with the subject line "More Endangered VMS accounts".p > >n > >--i > K > Probably too late. Most sites running Sybase on VMS have probably alreadyaK > been forced to move. Our Library system was running Sybase based softwareaJ > on VMS. It's now running the latest version of that software on Solaris.  E I know, but that's the "nature of the beast". By the time a post or aw> rpess release appears, the damage is done and difficult if not impossible to undo.   C All the more reason to keep a fire going under them to try to avoido- losing the few ISVs and partners that remain.,   -- o David J. Dachterao dba DJE Systemsc http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/i   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 01:53:18 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> * Subject: TCPIP 5.3 VAX: sysgen INTSTKPAGES, Message-ID: <3D82CEBB.F4F1B5F3@videotron.ca>  H With TCPIP 5.0 and 5.3, the installation guide specifies that the SYSGENB parameter INTSTKPAGES needs to be set to 12 if one uses Pathworks.  ? With 5.0, INTSTKPAGES = 6 worked fine if no pathworks was used. Y With 5.3, the TCPIP$STARTUP procedure stops very early on, complaining about INTSTKPAGES.g  G The installation guide should be updated to say that 12 is the requiredtJ minimum value for any type of system. (or the startup procedure changes to/ accept a lower value if pathworks is not used).     F Interestingly, reviewing the autogen report, I noticed how many SYSGENK parameters have become invalid (eg: beyond obsolete) in VAX 7.2 compared toa= 5.5-2.  I am somewhat surprised I hadn't noticed this before.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 13:42:32 -0700t, From: "Scott Stark" <starkh@saic.com_nospam>! Subject: Re: v7.3-1 Arrived Todays' Message-ID: <3d81eb48$1@cpns1.saic.com>i  J And there is only 1 CD for the Layered Products (don't mind the "Disk 1 of 2").I Bummer, the *.TXT (and *.PDF) files are gone from the F/W Update V6.2 CD,e? only *.PS and those can be difficult to access these days.  ;^)e; "Lyndon Bartels" <lbartels@pressenter.com> wrote in message'( news:3D80E468.1C568455@pressenter.com...G > Though y'all've probably gotten yours, I received my 7.3-1 CDs today.  >m > I've got to hand it to HP... >AE > 1.) They didn't mess up the packaging with a Sun workstation on thet > cover. >eH > 2.) They put the Documentation a Files-11 disk, as well as an ISO-9660 > disk.....i >  >-& > What an extremely pleasant surprise. >1 >e >0 >1 >3 > --I > My opinions are mine and mine alone. They seldom align with those of myR > employer.d >s >eJ > The only good thing about putting the cart before the horse is you don't > have > to look at the horse's butt.   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 18:24:40 +0000 (UTC) + From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb)tJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on+ Message-ID: <altah8$8dt$2@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>o  ` In article <3d81eb91@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:C >>It is a real pity that Sun bought Innosoft (and therefore PMDF). e >b8 >Sun bought Innosoft, but PMDF went to Process Software. >--   K No as far as I am aware. I believe SUN retains the full rights to the PMDF i product.0 Process is just licensed to develop and sell it.F In a sense PMDF is now the OEMD version of Sunone's  messaging server.N Process are restricted in what they can do with the product - for instance theK agreement with Sun precludes them from currently producing a free hobbyist  J version of PMDF. If they want to produce such a version they would have to$ negotiate a new agreement with SUN. K In particular it would not be possible for HP to negotiate with Process formI the rights to include PMDF code in the VMS Mail code - they would need to  negotiate with SUN.h  - I would be happy to be proved wrong on this. f  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 18:39:01 -0000n- From: wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on5 Message-ID: <928894F46warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>a  0 Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in) <H+pChT9zZDqy@eisner.encompasserve.org>: e  @ All this discussion has been very enlightening, and I thank you J contributors for that.  But there's no way most employers (like mine) are L going to turn me loose to build a C to C++ XML engine interface.  For those H of use building business applications on tight schedules, having modern I tools like a fully validating XML parser with a native interface for the  L language at hand is really mandatory.  And when it's not there, the project   gets pushed to another platform.  K My superiors think such tools should come with the OS, no doubt due to the  . fact they do with *other* operating systems.    I Another tool I couldn't find is an LDAP client.  I've gotta believe it's pL there and I missed it, but given the lack of a MIME API, and the XML parser 0 problem, maybe my expectations are out of whack.   ws   -- m   Warren Spencer' Senior Software Engineer (not a writer)  The Associated Press  < ** Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a bananna. **   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 13:52:17 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)iJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on3 Message-ID: <fppIu11$V6Sf@eisner.encompasserve.org>   e In article <928894F46warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>, wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) writes:i2 > Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in+ > <H+pChT9zZDqy@eisner.encompasserve.org>:   > B > All this discussion has been very enlightening, and I thank you L > contributors for that.  But there's no way most employers (like mine) are N > going to turn me loose to build a C to C++ XML engine interface.  For those J > of use building business applications on tight schedules, having modern K > tools like a fully validating XML parser with a native interface for the cN > language at hand is really mandatory.  And when it's not there, the project " > gets pushed to another platform. > M > My superiors think such tools should come with the OS, no doubt due to the l0 > fact they do with *other* operating systems.   > K > Another tool I couldn't find is an LDAP client.  I've gotta believe it's lN > there and I missed it, but given the lack of a MIME API, and the XML parser 2 > problem, maybe my expectations are out of whack.     	10 seconds google time:    A http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/731FINAL/6657/6657pro_001.htmlt    D OpenVMS Alpha Version 7.3--1 New Features and Documentation Overview    . 2.4 Compaq Enterprise Directory for e-BusinessL Compaq OpenVMS Enterprise Directory for e-Business combines the best of bothH industry standard LDAPv3 and X.500 capabilities, and delivers robust andL scalable directory services across intranets, extranets, and the Internet toI customers, suppliers, and partners. Lightweight Directory Access ProtocolOL (LDAP) support allows access by a myriad of LDAP-based clients, user agents,H and applications. The X.500 support brings high performance, resilience,J advanced access controls, and easy replication across the enterprise. ThisI latest release includes support for SSL/TLS between clients and directory L servers, Selective Shadowing of data to consumer directories, and a new Java based Management GUI.   M For further information, refer to the Compaq OpenVMS Enterprise Directory foruF e-Business Software Product Description (SPD 81.03.01) included on theO e-Business CD-ROM in the Enterprise Directory Services documentation directory. H This product is also available to download from the following Web site:       / http://www.openvms.compaq.com/commercial/edir/ l    i   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 19:52:04 -00002- From: wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer)DJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on5 Message-ID: <9288A1C56warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>.  . young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) wrote in) <fppIu11$V6Sf@eisner.encompasserve.org>:    6 >In article <928894F46warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>,1 >wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) writes:  3 >> Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in , >> <H+pChT9zZDqy@eisner.encompasserve.org>:  >> aC >> All this discussion has been very enlightening, and I thank you oH >> contributors for that.  But there's no way most employers (like mine)H >> are going to turn me loose to build a C to C++ XML engine interface. F >> For those of use building business applications on tight schedules,G >> having modern tools like a fully validating XML parser with a nativedI >> interface for the language at hand is really mandatory.  And when it's': >> not there, the project gets pushed to another platform. >> rI >> My superiors think such tools should come with the OS, no doubt due toi5 >> the fact they do with *other* operating systems.  o >> vF >> Another tool I couldn't find is an LDAP client.  I've gotta believeH >> it's there and I missed it, but given the lack of a MIME API, and the> >> XML parser problem, maybe my expectations are out of whack. >r >4 >     10 seconds google time:- >- >-B >http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/731FINAL/6657/6657pro_001.html >a >dE >OpenVMS Alpha Version 7.3--1 New Features and Documentation Overview2 >i >t/ >2.4 Compaq Enterprise Directory for e-BusinessoH >Compaq OpenVMS Enterprise Directory for e-Business combines the best ofC >both industry standard LDAPv3 and X.500 capabilities, and delivers H >robust and scalable directory services across intranets, extranets, and@ >the Internet to customers, suppliers, and partners. LightweightF >Directory Access Protocol (LDAP) support allows access by a myriad ofE >LDAP-based clients, user agents, and applications. The X.500 support H >brings high performance, resilience, advanced access controls, and easyH >replication across the enterprise. This latest release includes supportG >for SSL/TLS between clients and directory servers, Selective ShadowingdG >of data to consumer directories, and a new Java based Management GUI. - >?@ >For further information, refer to the Compaq OpenVMS EnterpriseE >Directory for e-Business Software Product Description (SPD 81.03.01)rG >included on the e-Business CD-ROM in the Enterprise Directory Services.I >documentation directory. This product is also available to download from/ >the following Web site: - >- >- >-0 >http://www.openvms.compaq.com/commercial/edir/   J Thanks Rob. Sadly, this is about 24 months too late for our needs.  But I K shouldn't have raised the LDAP client issue since it's been solved in 7.3, n. and Sue was asking for "new" feature requests.  J But I think the other needs I've mentioned are as yet unanswered:  A MIME J api (not a command line tool), and a fully validating XML parser with a C 
 interface.  J And here's new one (admittedly, I have not researched this one, so pummel D me if it's already there):  How about a SOAP API for C?  WDSL?  I'm G sincerely hoping that OpenVMS' apparent lag (from my viewpoint) on all pH internet-related API's shrinks fast.  And a footnote:  Delivering these J API's in Java won't help those of us who need to integrate existing C (or D Cobol or Fortran...) applications with internet-connected customers.   ws   -- o   Warren Spencer' Senior Software Engineer (not a writer)s The Associated Press  < ** Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a bananna. **   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 15:08:47 -0500e7 From: "Craig A. Berry" <craigberry@nospam.telocity.com>(J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available onG Message-ID: <craigberry-C75949.15084713092002@news.directvinternet.com>e  5 In article <928894F46warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>,s/  wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) wrote:D  2 > Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in+ > <H+pChT9zZDqy@eisner.encompasserve.org>: m > 0 > there's no way most employers (like mine) are C > going to turn me loose to build a C to C++ XML engine interface. s  = For the umpteenth time, what's wrong with expat?  It's fully aD validating, it's written in C (no calling C++ from C), and it works  just fine on VMS.e  2 > Another tool I couldn't find is an LDAP client.   D It's there in Mozilla/CSWB.  I haven't tried it so I don't know how  good it is.-   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 15:34:19 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)AJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on3 Message-ID: <e1fXZUKrgo5m@eisner.encompasserve.org>W  e In article <928894F46warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>, wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) writes:t2 > Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in+ > <H+pChT9zZDqy@eisner.encompasserve.org>: t > B > All this discussion has been very enlightening, and I thank you L > contributors for that.  But there's no way most employers (like mine) are N > going to turn me loose to build a C to C++ XML engine interface.  For those J > of use building business applications on tight schedules, having modern K > tools like a fully validating XML parser with a native interface for the  N > language at hand is really mandatory.  And when it's not there, the project " > gets pushed to another platform. > M > My superiors think such tools should come with the OS, no doubt due to the t0 > fact they do with *other* operating systems.    K And has been noted in this thread, it comes with VMS effective with V7.3-1.r  1 > Another tool I couldn't find is an LDAP client.l  B I believe the LDAP client API provided with VMS V7.3 is C-centric.F (I presume you meant "client API", since a "client" might do something+ quite different from what you had in mind.)o   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:30:47 -0000a- From: wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer),J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on5 Message-ID: <9288A5CFBwarrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>e  E craigberry@nospam.telocity.com (Craig A. Berry) wrote in <craigberry-o0 C75949.15084713092002@news.directvinternet.com>:  6 >In article <928894F46warrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>,0 > wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) wrote: >t3 >> Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in , >> <H+pChT9zZDqy@eisner.encompasserve.org>:  >> 91 >> there's no way most employers (like mine) are  D >> going to turn me loose to build a C to C++ XML engine interface.  >e> >For the umpteenth time, what's wrong with expat?  It's fully E >validating, it's written in C (no calling C++ from C), and it works " >just fine on VMS. >e3 >> Another tool I couldn't find is an LDAP client. s > E >It's there in Mozilla/CSWB.  I haven't tried it so I don't know how o >good it is. >i  E My apologies Craig - I was under the impression that expat was not a u2 *validating* parser.  I stand (and sit) corrected!   ws   -- M   Warren Spencer' Senior Software Engineer (not a writer)e The Associated Press  < ** Time flies like an arrow.  Fruit flies like a bananna. **   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 17:08:12 -0400n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on, Message-ID: <3D8253B1.1A8B492E@videotron.ca>   New feature suggestion:s  C How difficult would it be to allow user-written lexical functions ?e   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 17:22:21 -0500 7 From: "Craig A. Berry" <craigberry@nospam.telocity.com>sJ Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available onG Message-ID: <craigberry-783E3D.17222113092002@news.directvinternet.com>m  5 In article <9288A5CFBwarrenspencer1977@216.168.3.30>, /  wspencer@ap.nospam.org (Warren Spencer) wrote:e  G > My apologies Craig - I was under the impression that expat was not a i4 > *validating* parser.  I stand (and sit) corrected!  H Oops, you're right.  It's non-validating.  I got it confused with James H Clark's earlier SGML parser SP, which I'm almost sure *is* validating.  G There actually aren't that many XML parsers in C and there aren't that o: many that are validating, and that's true on any platform.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 05:45:54 +0200i2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender)J Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on; Message-ID: <3d82b0f2.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>s  ) Don Sykes (annonymous@pacbell.net) wrote:sD > If a user program needs to ask for parameters of any type, then it# > doesn't belong in a pipe command.   A All DCL commands ask for (required) parameters if you ommit them.t  # > For DCL commands, we already knowyJ > which ones can/can't, or shouldn't, be used in the pipe command, so pipeI > could know that too. Pipe just needs to know to throw an error when any4 > of the component parts fails.o  5 Agreed - for system commands. What about third-party?e  G > The only reason pipe exists (in either Unix or VMS) is as a shorthandl@ > method of obtaining a final result through the redirection andE > synchronization of commands, and user programs, that use platforms'  > standard i/o.o  B I think you unterestimate pipe's importance in *ix. It's more of aG philosophy there. All *ix (system) programs have limited functionality, A because if you want more, you can pipe. 'cat' just TYPEs a file's H contents. If you want it paged, you can pipe it to 'more'. No need for a /PAGE qualifier.  F In the same line of thought, all (system) programs have options to getD their input from stdin and/or put their output to stdout, to support piping.p  C DCL is built on a different philosophy. So PIPE is something like an stranger in a strange land.D  G > I'm saying that the more shorthand it is, the better it fulfills thatSF > mission. And if I have to type "sys$output" & "sys$input" instead of6 > "|", then it doesn't fulfill that mission very well.  G In contrast to *ix (where the programs deal with special input/output),.B VMS' PIPE would have to handle those cases. Any character reservedE to PIPE to be replaced by SYS$INPUT/SYS$OUTPUT can't be passed to thec program any more.e  < And if "|" were to be that special character, how would PIPE6 differentiate it from the "|" separating two commands?  / If it were "-", you'd have to quote it, e.g. inr  0 $ PIPE GUNZIP -c archive.tar-gz | VMSTAR xvf "-"  K (actually, this works - because VMSTAR knows how to handle a file name "-")h   cu,d   Martin --  D                         | Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmer1  VMS is today what      | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de1E  Microsoft wants        |    http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/c8  Windows NT 8.0 to be!  | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 02:02:54 GMTn From: sasadmin <jec@nospam.net>uU Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on   OpenVMS?h2 Message-ID: <87fzwdl44t.fsf@Alethion.systasis.net>  * Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net> writes:  : > It has nothing to do with a component being able to work > standalone.   ) Unfortunately, we disagree on this point.e  8 > Whatever knowledge would be required to make this work5 > belongs in pipe, not in the potential components.     A Components must cooperate with the shell to attain a reliable I/O:= redirection model. IIRC, this is one theme of the K&R C book.C  D > If a user program needs to ask for parameters of any type, then it# > doesn't belong in a pipe command.   D Many Unix programs don't ask for input; because they don't ask, they then assume stdio, e.g. grep.9  < > For DCL commands, we already know which ones can/can't, orA > shouldn't, be used in the pipe command, so pipe could know that  > too. N  ? I think you're asking for too much information to be built intooF PIPE. That's the reason it behaves as it does: the less it knows about@ individual program behavior, the more general its applicability.  ; > Pipe just needs to know to throw an error when any of theo > component parts fails.  G Doesn't PIPE already do that? I don't have a VMS system handy, but if ai@ component fails, surely the entire command sequence fails. IIRC,F there's a syntax extension involving the semicolon that addresses that issue.  = > The only reason pipe exists (in either Unix or VMS) is as aoF > shorthand method of obtaining a final result through the redirection> > and synchronization of commands, and user programs, that use > platforms' standard i/o. r  E Agreed w/r/t/ Unix. On VMS, that's more problematic, as some programslC don't use stdio. They may assign a separate channel to a device anda@ use that in lieu of stdio; which design is uncommon on Unix. The@ potential for that behavior excludes the PIPE syntax you desire.  B > I'm saying that the more shorthand it is, the better it fulfills@ > that mission. And if I have to type "sys$output" & "sys$input"A > instead of "|", then it doesn't fulfill that mission very well.   D Agreed. My point is that your request is unlikely to appear on VMS -C there are too many programs that don't fit the environment in whichh you would like PIPE to operate.h  
 Over and out.    -- t Microsoft Free By 2003   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 23:02:06 GMT  From: sasadmin <jec@nospam.net>eT Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on  OpenVMS?2 Message-ID: <87k7lplci7.fsf@Alethion.systasis.net>  * Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net> writes:  E > A small, but annoying thing to me is the requirement of "sys$input" F > & "sys$output" in the pipe command. One of the few nice things aboutD > the Unix shells is brevity. "<" means input from; ">" means outputD > to; and "|" means both. If VMS is going to support a pipe command,D > then I would like to use it in a Unix fashion, instead of spelling > out the input & output - e.g.t >s > Currently, I have to say:o' > 	$ pipe dir | search sys$input ".log"  > I'd like to be able to say:- > 	$ pipe dir | search ".log"nE > and have the pipe command fill in "sys$input", or at least, specify  > sys$input as < , e.g.: > 	$ pipe dir | search < ".log"g  C I believe the problem that most VMS programs are designed using thes> file-as-argument model. I think there's a better term for this+ difference, but it will have to do for now.c  A Many Unix programs don't explicitly check for a input/output filetC arguments. This file-is-stdio model requires that the user pass thenC filename via the shell's I/O redirection facility, e.g. /cat/ whichl4 omits "fopen()" and moves directly to "fread(stdin)"; Others conform to the if-no-file-argument-then-stdio model,o e.g. /grep/ which uses& "if (argc > 1) then fopen(argv[1])"[1]  4 Most VMS programs employ the file-is-required model:C if-no-file-argument-then-ask-or-fail.[2] This model poses a problemrD for the I/O redirection syntax you envision: these programs expect aE filename before performing useful work. When using the "|" symbol, itwE so happens that the filename argument must be SYS$INPUT. However, thenI program must still be reliable when it's executed standalone, and in thataH mode it expects the appropriate filename.[3] I believe this dual purpose precludes the DCL shorthand.  D Obviously, nothing prevents writing VMS programs using either of the first two models.n     [1] >   The "fopen()" of the file occurs on a duplicate of the stdin
   channel.   [2]dE   Another poster, when reflecting on this problem suggested that PIPE C   watch for prompts. However, any image is free to assign a channel D   for user input. It's very likely that PIPE only watches and writes   process-permanent files.   [3] E   Another poster, when reflecting on this problem suggested using "-"9   symbol as a sentinel for the appropriate stdio channel.h   -- p Microsoft Free By 2003   ------------------------------    Date: 14 Sep 2002 02:59:42 +0800, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>Y Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenVa- Message-ID: <87znulww9t.fsf@prep.synonet.com>R  ) "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> writes:u  9 > That would be a huge security concern. Even MS does noteC > auto-complete usernames and passwords. Remember that hackers mustcB > first identify valid usernames before attacking the password for > that account.r  J Why? Tops-20 had it for years. Password completion did not work correctly,2 but a fix was promised for the next major release.  ; If VMS can steal 39+39, why not at least *some* completion.e :)   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 19:43:30 GMTr( From: Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net>Y Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenVD+ Message-ID: <3D8240A4.7B3854B0@pacbell.net>-   Arne Vajhj wrote: >  > Don Sykes wrote: >  > > Arne Vajhj wrote:  > >>Is this practical possible ? > >>1 > >>To do this PIPE should know the syntax of all8 > >>commands - or ?? > I > > Yes, but PIPE is really only useful for those commands that allow forsQ > > redirection of sys$output anyway. I don't see using it with a $mount command,mT > > for example. I think it only needs to know where input files or strings are used4 > > (like in search) and where /output is an option. > ; > Admitted - I can not see any particular use of PIPE MOUNTf	 > either.r > 4 > But I can see use of PIPE in connection some of my5 > own programs - and I am afraid VMS Engineering does  > not have a list of those.o > J No, but if your program takes data from sys$input & outputs to sys$output,@ what's so difficult about making pipe do the substitutions? Like  > 	pipe dir/col=1/nohead/notrail | YourProgram | search "string"   -- n   Have VMS. Will Travel. Wire Paladin (@alphase.com)n
 San Franciscoa   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 01:19:28 GMTM( From: Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net>Y Subject: Re: What features/capabilities would you like to see available on OpenVMS? OpenVo+ Message-ID: <3D828F66.12186797@pacbell.net>h   sasadmin wrote:s > , > Don Sykes <annonymous@pacbell.net> writes: > G > > A small, but annoying thing to me is the requirement of "sys$input" H > > & "sys$output" in the pipe command. One of the few nice things aboutF > > the Unix shells is brevity. "<" means input from; ">" means outputF > > to; and "|" means both. If VMS is going to support a pipe command,F > > then I would like to use it in a Unix fashion, instead of spelling! > > out the input & output - e.g.@ > >e > > Currently, I have to say:a. > >       $ pipe dir | search sys$input ".log" > > I'd like to be able to say:O$ > >       $ pipe dir | search ".log"G > > and have the pipe command fill in "sys$input", or at least, specify  > > sys$input as < , e.g.:& > >       $ pipe dir | search < ".log" > E > I believe the problem that most VMS programs are designed using the @ > file-as-argument model. I think there's a better term for this- > difference, but it will have to do for now.o > C > Many Unix programs don't explicitly check for a input/output file E > arguments. This file-is-stdio model requires that the user pass thenE > filename via the shell's I/O redirection facility, e.g. /cat/ whichi6 > omits "fopen()" and moves directly to "fread(stdin)"= > Others conform to the if-no-file-argument-then-stdio model,a > e.g. /grep/ which uses( > "if (argc > 1) then fopen(argv[1])"[1] > 6 > Most VMS programs employ the file-is-required model:E > if-no-file-argument-then-ask-or-fail.[2] This model poses a problemaF > for the I/O redirection syntax you envision: these programs expect aG > filename before performing useful work. When using the "|" symbol, it=G > so happens that the filename argument must be SYS$INPUT. However, the K > program must still be reliable when it's executed standalone, and in thattJ > mode it expects the appropriate filename.[3] I believe this dual purpose > precludes the DCL shorthand. >  <snip>M It has nothing to do with a component being able to work standalone. WhateverhI knowledge would be required to make this work belongs in pipe, not in the= potential components.=J If a user program needs to ask for parameters of any type, then it doesn'tF belong in a pipe command. For DCL commands, we already know which onesM can/can't, or shouldn't, be used in the pipe command, so pipe could know that1N too. Pipe just needs to know to throw an error when any of the component parts fails.O The only reason pipe exists (in either Unix or VMS) is as a shorthand method ofpG obtaining a final result through the redirection and synchronization ofgN commands, and user programs, that use platforms' standard i/o. I'm saying thatO the more shorthand it is, the better it fulfills that mission. And if I have toiL type "sys$output" & "sys$input" instead of "|", then it doesn't fulfill that mission very well.     -- s   Have VMS. Will Travel. Wire Paladin (@alphase.com)a
 San Franciscor   ------------------------------    Date: 13 Sep 2002 13:21:50 -0700& From: jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan) Subject: Re: Whither my VAX...= Message-ID: <cc5619f2.0209131221.7e2578ad@posting.google.com>t  l Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message news:<3D80C176.E1E7B97D@blueyonder.co.uk>... > "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > + > > Rich Jordan <jordan@ccs4vms.com> wrote: # > > > Or is there really a good and-F > > > useful reason worthy of the considerable effort it would take toE > > > retain the VAXstation once remodeling the office gets underway?  > > L > > I say get rid of the Monitor for the VAXstation and run it headless....  > > I'd say keep the VAXM > > clustered in so that you can play with mixed architecture clustering, and-N > > run any legacy VAX apps that can't be Vested (just becuase you can't think7 > > of any right now doesn't mean you won't find some).  > >   > >                         Zane >  >  > I agree, run it headless.  > H > Just keep a keyboard plugged in so VMS doesn't think its a VAXServer.  > H > You will of course have to go though a licence transfer process to use > the box legitimately at work.o > 
 > Regards,  D I don't think licenses are a problem; the closeted system is the oneC that ran hobbyist and is certain to be surplused simply because thesB closet is threatening to explode.  The 11-month-asleep system thatB could transition to work is the one that had its DEC-issued (Real)? licenses officially transferred to me back in 1996; if I retain-D ownership of the system but only _use_ it at work, I believe that isB within the bounds of the licenses (no work licenses would be used,E though it would be clustered with the work cluster using my personal, E legitimate, transferred cluster license).  If thats not legit, I'd beh very interested in knowing.e  B I'm looking at some 'server shelving' solutions that might provideE enough flexibility to keep the VAXstation if it is headless; that wasaD a good thought.  I can still take the VR290 and SPX board to work to4 upgrade the 3100-30 to nice bright, leisurely color.  ? Thanks all for the input.  We'll just have to see how space andb shelves (and A/C) work out.e   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.507 ************************