1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 24 Sep 2002	Volume 2002 : Issue 528       Contents:5 %SYSTEM-W-HEADERFULL message,,, but only on one node? 9 Re: %SYSTEM-W-HEADERFULL message,,, but only on one node?  Re: CLD question Convert from ODS-2 to ODS-5  Re: Convert from ODS-2 to ODS-5  Differential SCSI  RE: Disaster-Tolerant clusters Re: Disaster-Tolerant clusters RE: Disaster-Tolerant clusters RE: EDIT question. Re: EDIT question. Re: Generic Mail Response 0 Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ?0 Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ?) Re: How to defrag a shadowed system disk? E HSG mini-merge stuff (was Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring)  Re: Marketing suggestion Re: Marketing suggestion Re: Marketing suggestion Re: MySQL for VMS?' Re: New Miss America - Miss Ill-a-Noise " Re: OpenOffice ODBC and Oracle Rdb Re: opensource mail  Re: opensource mail K Re: Proposal: Retirement of some Components of the Compaq C++ Class Library L Re: UCX020B (UCX 2.0-03) - How to transfer file names with version  numbers?= Unexpected <CR> and <FF> after a Setup module of a queue FORM A Re: Unexpected <CR> and <FF> after a Setup module of a queue FORM 0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)0 Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these) Re: warning during copy  Re: warning during copy ' Re: What is happening to the industry ? ' Re: What is happening to the industry ? ' Re: What is happening to the industry ? ( Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPed( Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPed( Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPed( Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPed Re: ZIP version 2.2  ZIP version 2.2   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 02:20:50 -07003 From: perisa.bujosevic@orbit.net (Perisa Bujosevic) > Subject: %SYSTEM-W-HEADERFULL message,,, but only on one node?= Message-ID: <f59edf2b.0209240120.5c16560b@posting.google.com>    Hi All,   E I'm trying to increase size of the dump file on one of the nodes in a D 2-node OpenVMS Cluster (AS4100+ES40, both with 4Gb mem., OVMS 7.2-1,- volume shadowing, almost all recent patches).   B Running AUTOGEN ended with a "%SYSTEM-W-HEADERFULL, file header is? full" error message. Size of the new dumpfile (as calculated by < autogen) should be 1119690 blocks, but we didn't have enough: contiguous disk space on a system disk. Anyway, after someD housekeeping :) we've manage to get the contiguous area of 860000 inD size and then re-run the SYS$UPDATE:SWAPFILES.COM. Unfortunately, we> got the same error message again. (even with request to create' smaller, only 300000 blocks big file!?)   @ ... OK. We will go for DOSD and that (I hope ;-)) shouldn't be a problem.  D What I'm curious about is that trying to create the dump file on theC other node   (same size, 300000 blocks, minute after I tried on the * first node) goes smoothly, successfully...   Why? Any ideas?   # Note: System disk is also shadowed.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:07:34 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> B Subject: Re: %SYSTEM-W-HEADERFULL message,,, but only on one node?' Message-ID: <3D908DC6.4090103@MMaz.com>    Perisa Bujosevic wrote:    >Hi All, > F >I'm trying to increase size of the dump file on one of the nodes in aE >2-node OpenVMS Cluster (AS4100+ES40, both with 4Gb mem., OVMS 7.2-1, . >volume shadowing, almost all recent patches). > C >Running AUTOGEN ended with a "%SYSTEM-W-HEADERFULL, file header is @ >full" error message. Size of the new dumpfile (as calculated by= >autogen) should be 1119690 blocks, but we didn't have enough ; >contiguous disk space on a system disk. Anyway, after some E >housekeeping :) we've manage to get the contiguous area of 860000 in E >size and then re-run the SYS$UPDATE:SWAPFILES.COM. Unfortunately, we ? >got the same error message again. (even with request to create ( >smaller, only 300000 blocks big file!?) > @ >.. OK. We will go for DOSD and that (I hope ;-)) shouldn't be a	 >problem.  > E >What I'm curious about is that trying to create the dump file on the D >other node   (same size, 300000 blocks, minute after I tried on the+ >first node) goes smoothly, successfully...  >  >Why? Any ideas? >    > F Your disk is probably so fragmented and you have too few file headers ? left, for the number of extents necessary to create the file...   D You did state that your contiguous disk space available was 860,000 D blocks, what happens when you go into SYSGEN and do a manual create E swapfile.sys/cont/size=300000.  If it does fail, then you are either  H completely out of file headers, or you don't really have 860,000 blocks  of contiguous space...   Barry    --    @ Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   A E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Sep 2002 18:52:11 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) Subject: Re: CLD question = Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209231752.42fa202e@posting.google.com>   a JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<3D8C3467.3D36636A@videotron.ca>... ; > Thanks for all your comments. I think I have found a way:  >  > DEFINE VERB CHOCOLATE " > 	QUALIFIER LIST, syntax=list_syn4 > 	PARAMETER P1, required,prompt="Enter pastry name" > 	QUALIFIER WHIPPED_CREAM > 	QUALIFIER MOUSSE  > 	QUALIFIER DARK  >  > DEFINE SYNTAX list_syn > 	QUALIFIER LIST,default  > 	NOPARAMETER@ > 	QUALIFIER OUTPUT, value (default="SYS$OUTPUT", type=$OUTFILE) >  > P > when you say CHOCOLATE /LIST, the /LIST is consumed and disapears. This is whyL > one must make /LIST appear in the alternate syntax as a default qualifier,( > otherwise one would have to specicify:= > CHOCOLATE /LIST /LIST. Took a while to figure that one out.     C So what does this CHOCOLATE program do? Is this for the (Star Trek) # Enterprise Make a Meal machine? :-)      Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:16:32 -0600 6 From: "Michael D. Ober" <obermd.@.alum.mit.edu.nospam>$ Subject: Convert from ODS-2 to ODS-5/ Message-ID: <RAZj9.6$z26.17395@news.uswest.net>   I What are the benefits and gotcha's of converting from ODS-2 to ODS-5 on a J VMS 7.3-1 system with Samba VMS 2.2.4 running.  Also, how is it done.  TheJ VMS 7.3-1 upgrade offered to do this for our system drive, but not for our  data drives, so we didn't do it.   Thanks in Advance,
 Mike Ober.   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:59:15 +0000 (UTC) + From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb) ( Subject: Re: Convert from ODS-2 to ODS-5+ Message-ID: <amq5l3$r84$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>   c In article <l1_j9.13$5v3.1514524@news.cpqcorp.net>, "labadie" <labadie_g.tocardsa@decus.fr> writes:  > B >"Michael D. Ober" <obermd.@.alum.mit.edu.nospam> wrote in message* >news:RAZj9.6$z26.17395@news.uswest.net...L >> What are the benefits and gotcha's of converting from ODS-2 to ODS-5 on aG >> VMS 7.3-1 system with Samba VMS 2.2.4 running.  Also, how is it done  >  >If it is a new disk >init/struct=5 ... >else  >set vol/struct=5 ...  > K To use the  set vol/struct=5 command the disk needs to be mounted privately  ie   DISMOUNT/CLUSTER diskname  MOUNT/OVER=ID diskname SET VOL/STRUCT=5 diskname   
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University      ) >But you can not go back to ods-2 easily.  > 5 >For the benefits and gotcha, it is a wide subject...  >  >Regards >  >Grard  >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 24 Sep 2002 15:54:25 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Differential SCSI5 Message-ID: <amq1rh$879d0$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>   D Is there any chance anyone here has a DWZZA-AA or DWZZA-VA that theyD want/need to get rid of??  I have a BA350 box that would work ratherB nicely hooked up to one of my PDP-11's except for the differentialB SCSI controller in it.  :-)  I am assuming that most people are noA longer running differential SCSI, especially considering how rare G the drives seem to be.  Surely someone has one of the signal convertors $ just gathering dust on their shelf!!   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:12:05 -0400 5 From: "Bochnik, William J" <William_Bochnik@acml.com> ' Subject: RE: Disaster-Tolerant clusters O Message-ID: <2D75787AAF09C64481BDFD89113BE6D528A143@ac2kama0102.ac.lp.acml.com>   F then set it up so that bld 1 can survive w/o bld 2, but require manual# intervention if bld 1 goes away....      -----Original Message-----5 From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca]    Sent: September 23, 2002 2:37 PM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ' Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant clusters      Phillip Helbig wrote: G > I was assuming that anyone who could afford two buildings with a lot  D > of hardware in each could also afford a third with just one small  > machine in it.  :-|   K But if you're a small department running VMS in an otherwise IBM shop, just K getting access to the fibre between 2 buildings may be a large enough feat. K And now you want fibre INSTALLED to building 1<->3 and 3<->2 ???? You gotta  be kidding.   K What is technically possible isn't always politically possible. And in some L cities, laying your own fibre under the street requires special permit$ thatC may include both payments to the city and some "gift$" to the civil 	 servants.   L When I did the disaster recovery for a SWIFT system at a bank, I was allowedH to use 2 of the 24 fibres that the bank had been able to lay between itsF main and development data centres. Why ? Because they realised that 24J fibres wouldn't be enough to connect all their IBM disk drives so losing aG pair wasn't a big deal. (they were a test site). But there was no way I J could even get a low speed ethernet bridge between the data centre and theJ head office tower where the users were. To the bank, 19.2kbpos is all thatK was ever needed for users (think 3270 terminals) and "ethernet" was totally J foreign to the bank at that time which knew only synchronous data links at 9600 and X.25 lines.  I If I had asked for fibre links to be added between the 2 data centres and J the office tower, my project would have been rejected from the get go. Not2 so much because of money, but because of politics.    I The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and J confidential information and is intended only for the use of the person(s)L named above.  If you are not the intended recipient, or an employee or agentF responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, anyK review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this communication is J strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contactD the sender immediately by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of theH original message. Please note that for certain accounts we do not acceptK orders and/or instructions by e-mail, and for those accounts we will not be L responsible for carrying out such orders and/or instructions. Kindly refrainL from sending orders or instructions by e-mail unless you have confirmed thatH we accept such communications for your account. Please also note that toJ satisfy regulatory requirements we review the outgoing and incoming e-mail: correspondence of staff members serving certain functions.   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:39:19 +0100 (MET) 9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> ' Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant clusters ; Message-ID: <01KMVWBDDU1M9QW0O4@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>   H > then set it up so that bld 1 can survive w/o bld 2, but require manual% > intervention if bld 1 goes away....   4 Easy--for example, 3 machines in bld1 and 2 in bld2.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 11:12:24 -0400 5 From: "Bochnik, William J" <William_Bochnik@acml.com> ' Subject: RE: Disaster-Tolerant clusters O Message-ID: <2D75787AAF09C64481BDFD89113BE6D528A147@ac2kama0102.ac.lp.acml.com>   
 exactly.     -----Original Message-----A From: Phillip Helbig [mailto:HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com]  ! Sent: September 24, 2002 11:39 AM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ' Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant clusters     I > then set it up so that bld 1 can survive w/o bld 2, but require manual  % > intervention if bld 1 goes away....   4 Easy--for example, 3 machines in bld1 and 2 in bld2.    I The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and J confidential information and is intended only for the use of the person(s)L named above.  If you are not the intended recipient, or an employee or agentF responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, anyK review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this communication is J strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contactD the sender immediately by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of theH original message. Please note that for certain accounts we do not acceptK orders and/or instructions by e-mail, and for those accounts we will not be L responsible for carrying out such orders and/or instructions. Kindly refrainL from sending orders or instructions by e-mail unless you have confirmed thatH we accept such communications for your account. Please also note that toJ satisfy regulatory requirements we review the outgoing and incoming e-mail: correspondence of staff members serving certain functions.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:33:32 +0100 & From: David Gray <GrayD@turpinltd.com> Subject: RE: EDIT question. S Message-ID: <79DE14DAA1A8D3119B6E00805FEB980BE563A4@zakary.turpin-distribution.com>   E Thanks to everyone who answered this question.  It has never been a =  problem D for me as I have never used the symbol "EDIT", always use "LSE =3D =
 EDIT/TPU".    
 Cheers,=20  
 	David.=20     -----Original Message-----2 From: Syltrem [mailto:syltremzulu@videotron.ca]=20 Sent: 23 September 2002 21:09  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  Subject: Re: EDIT question.   D > In order for the trick of using EDIT% to work, there must not be aC > symbol called EDIT%. The better way to do this is to explicitly =  define > 8 > $ EDIT =3D "EDIT"  ! (some people use "$ EDIT :=3D  ") > E > at the top of your procedure or make use of the SET SYMBOL command.  >   ! Beware! Not always a good thing!:    $ edit*or:=3Dedit/tpu  $ edit:=3DeditE %DCL-W-ABSYMD, abbreviated symbol definition conflict - rename symbol  $      --   Syltrem A http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site - en =  fran=E7ais) 8 To reply to myself directly, remove zulu from my address  I "Alan E. Feldman" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> a =E9crit dans le message de =  news: 2 b096a4ee.0209201117.6dd74597@posting.google.com...: > Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> wrote in message# news:<3D8B19C7.9095684F@Free.fr>... F > > Any character in the 5th position of a DCL verb will prevent the = DCL  interpreter = > > to try to translate the verb as a local or global symbol.  > E > Not if you type a 5-character symbol! Or greater than 5 characters,  > also.  > ; > > It is an undocumented feature, for a long time already.  >  > User's Manual (v6.2):  > % > Section 3.5.5 Abbreviating Commands  > F > You can abbreviate a command as long as the abbreviated name remainsF > unique among the defined commands on a system. DCL looks only at the' > first four characters for uniqueness.  > D > For greater clarity and to ensure that your command procedures are> > upwardly compatible, do not abbreviate commands in command = procedures.  >  > [...]  > D > In order for the trick of using EDIT% to work, there must not be aC > symbol called EDIT%. The better way to do this is to explicitly =  define > 8 > $ EDIT =3D "EDIT"  ! (some people use "$ EDIT :=3D  ") > E > at the top of your procedure or make use of the SET SYMBOL command.  >  >  > Disclaimer: JMHO > Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Sep 2002 20:33:38 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) Subject: Re: EDIT question. = Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209231933.53a97395@posting.google.com>   g "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> wrote in message news:<wwKj9.13152$H67.62453@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>... F > > In order for the trick of using EDIT% to work, there must not be aJ > > symbol called EDIT%. The better way to do this is to explicitly define > > 6 > > $ EDIT = "EDIT"  ! (some people use "$ EDIT :=  ") > > G > > at the top of your procedure or make use of the SET SYMBOL command.  > >  > # > Beware! Not always a good thing!:  >  > $ edit*or:=edit/tpu  > $ edit:=editG > %DCL-W-ABSYMD, abbreviated symbol definition conflict - rename symbol  > $     ; And why would you ever want both defined as local symbols?    F The first one, EDIT*OR, is typically defined as a *global* symbol in aD login.com procedure and is intended for direct interactive use. That@ is, to be typed as the first token at an interactive DCL prompt.  F The second one is typically placed near the top of a command procedureB that is *not* run during login; that is, a command procedure whoseF purpose is something other than defining global symbols for subsequentC interactive work. It is normally defined as a local symbol so as to @ override any matching global symbol, like EDIT*OR from the loginE sequence. This is so you can use the command verb EDIT in the command C procedure without having to worry about unintended results due to a - previously defined EDIT symbol. And it works.    I don't see a problem here.    Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 09:50:25 +0100  From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> " Subject: Re: Generic Mail Response) Message-ID: <3D902751.D88384D8@Omond.net>    Brian Tillman wrote:  K > >How does one edit the generic "undeliverable" mail response when Mail is K > >disabled using the /DISMAIL flag?  We would like to add some text to the  > >generic response. > ' > On a VAX, I imagine PATCH would work.   3 Heck, on both Alpha and VAX, why not just use EDT ?   F $ set file/attr=(rfm:fix,lrl:64,mrs:64) mail.exe (or is the message in
 MAILSHR ?) $ edit/edt mail.exe   I I have done this sort of stuff many times.  Of course, VAXman will profer I XDELTA as the proper tool :-)  VFE (Virtual File Editor) would be another 3 easy to use tool (available on both VAX and Alpha).   	 Roy Omond  Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Sep 2002 22:46:15 -0700- From: jodonnell@hrblock.com (Jason O'Donnell) 9 Subject: Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ? = Message-ID: <9059bf6b.0209232146.1e2212d9@posting.google.com>   C > I think an explanation of controller-based mirroring is in order.  >  > Hint: Think: RAID-1, SWXCR >  > For example: >  > VMS sees $1$DUA0:  > E > The HSJ controller pair has a disc alloclass of 1 and presents unit  > number zero(0).  > I > From the HSJ you see unit D0. D0 Consists of mirror-set M0. M0 consists  > of disks DISK100 and DISK200.  > J > So, no such considerations as those you mention. The HSJ pair has littleJ > or no awareness that VMS has been shutdown or that a node of the clusterE > crashed, other than closing virtual circuits and some other things.   @ I am sorry, I did not make my statement clear.  REMOTE mirroring between separate controllers.   D I am familiar with HSJ and HSZ controllers, as I have a couple in my! basement.  ;)  CI is pretty cool.    ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 10:12:42 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 9 Subject: Re: Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring ? 3 Message-ID: <uKmtGxYok58Q@eisner.encompasserve.org>   _ In article <Gzh7vpsv8OB0@cuebid.zko.dec.com>, brooks@cuebid.zko.dec.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes: , > Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> writes: >> Rob Brooks wrote: >>> N >>> I can't give you an example of the type of problem that could cause a fullQ >>> merge; a full merge would be needed only if the context needed for mini-merge 4 >>> has been destroyed.  That shouldn't happen . . . >>  I >> Is the example when a system crashes? the 'dirty' bit is set on both / K >> all members of a HBVS due to improper dismount, and the operating system G >> software will perform a full merge by default. (Also interested in a  >> reply to David's response). > P > No.  A system crash will not _in general_ cause a full merge.  Note that we'reP > putting the finishing touches on this stuff, so we haven't tested all possibleO > combinations of catastrophe.  However, _the_ fundamental design specification O > for this project has been that we'll do a full merge only if something rather I > unexpected has happened.  We will strive for 100% mini-merges.  I can't L > define "unexpected" any better than to describe the situations under whichI > you'd get a system crash with (for example) INCONSTATE or SHADDETINCON. K > Those two are catchall bugchecks that trigger when any number of internal ' > inconsistencies have been detected.    > J > Similarly, a mini-merge requires a fair amount of context to be saved.  K > If the required context is not considered to be valid, we'll fall back to N > a full merge.  However, we've gone to extreme lengths to make sure that thatG > context gets saved across crashes, controller failures, etc . . .  We 5 > really don't like full merges any more than you do.  > L > I'll field any more questions that you guys have, but I'm not really goingN > to get into the details of the implementation, as certain things may change. >   5 	Will this work be controller and vendor independent?   
 			Thanks,   				Rob    ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 08:12:38 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)2 Subject: Re: How to defrag a shadowed system disk?= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209240712.6eda1eed@posting.google.com>   \ "Steven Xie" <r33300@email.mot.com> wrote in message news:<amm0gr$a6f$1@newshost.mot.com>... > Hello all, > N > I have an alpha system (ES40, V7.2-1) with shadowed system disk. After usingM > it for about three years we found that there are lot of fragment inside the N > system disk. Normally we deal with this kind of case is we do a image backupL > from this fragmented disk to tape and then copy it back. But we have neverK > done it on shadowed disk before, and we have never done it on system disk I > either. Do I need break the shadow set before I do the image backup, or    No.   ! > mount/for good for shadow set?     No.   , > Does anybody has this experience can share
 > with me?  
 Shut down.   Boot from CD or standalone.   C Peform a BACKUP/IMAGE/VERIFY from the boot device to tape and back.    Reboot.    Run SH DEV D.   $ Manually reconstruct the shadow set.   Or:   
 Shut down.   Boot from CD or standalone.   0 BACKUP/IMAGE/VERIFY from one member to another.    Boot from the new copy.    Run SH DEV D.   $ Manually reconstruct the shadow set.  N WARNING: I'm using VMS (VAX) v6.2. It's probably not much different for yours.   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 18:02:35 GMT / From: brooks@cuebid.zko.dec.nospam (Rob Brooks) N Subject: HSG mini-merge stuff (was Hardware Mirroring 'vs' Software Mirroring)- Message-ID: <gDKcFSrLnXHu@cuebid.zko.dec.com>   - young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:  > Rob Brooks writes: >>  M >> I'll field any more questions that you guys have, but I'm not really going O >> to get into the details of the implementation, as certain things may change.  >>   > 7 > 	Will this work be controller and vendor independent?   I This will be for the HSG80 controller only.  There is nothing in the work K we're doing in VMS now that would preclude it working on other controllers, < but the other controllers would need firmware modifications.  K If you would like to see this work done for future controllers, please send H email to the Host-Based Volume Shadowing Product Manager Andy Schneider ! (Andy.Schneider@youknowhere.com).   I It would help if you could state an actual business case where this would  be useful to you.    --M Rob Brooks    VMS Engineering -- I/O Exec Group     brooks!cuebid.zko.dec.com    ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 07:49:56 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ! Subject: Re: Marketing suggestion 3 Message-ID: <ed2XMVAC4Hbl@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3D8FC1F8.98E7B0F0@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: @ > I thought Corvair had an engine (belt) driven supercharger...? >   E    I don't know what charging options were available, but the belt on D    the uncharged 62 Corvair we had had enough trouble just trying to0    turn the fan, and was a major pain to change.  E    For those who haven't seen this engineering wonder:  The belt ran  @    vertically over the crankshaft pully, twisted 90 to an idlerA    pulley, ran horizontally untwisting 90 to the fan pulley, and B    returned via two more 90 twists and another idler pulley.  TheA    fan rotated hotizontally on a vertical shaft above the engine. =    Along the way the belt ran into and out of the fan shroud.         ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 07:59:19 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ! Subject: Re: Marketing suggestion 3 Message-ID: <PMsxKu+WG2yX@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ]  In article <87heghk2ql.fsf@prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes:  > J > The Corvair also had; a exhaust heated air heater built to `traditional' > US auto standards,    G    One of the early Corvair problems was that it did not use an exhaust H    heat source for the air heater.  It simply picked up air that had runE    over the outside of the engine (thus subject to any leaks that the E    engine and/or exhaust or their connetions had developed) and into  H    the passenger compartment.  A small leak could introduce significant H    amounts of CO undetected.  Small leaks in exhaust connections are notM    uncommon.  This arangement, Nader claimed, made it safe to run the heater  H    or defroster only with both a CO detector strip and the windows full E    open.  GM countered that the owner should keep the vehicle in good     maintenance.   E    The exhaust heat source used by VW and most small aircraft is much E    safer.  It uses a heat exchanger attached around or built into the G    exhaust manifold, away from the manifold/engine and manifold/muffler E    connections.  Clean air is directed through the heat exchanger and E    into the passenger compartment.  This is much less likely to leak  E    (exhaust manifolds rarely fail) and would likely cause both a loud G    noise and major odor if it did fail.  Many pilots use a CO detector      strip anyhow.   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Sep 2002 14:03:07 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)! Subject: Re: Marketing suggestion 5 Message-ID: <amprar$80dns$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>   3 In article <ed2XMVAC4Hbl@eisner.encompasserve.org>, 0 	koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:] > In article <3D8FC1F8.98E7B0F0@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: A >> I thought Corvair had an engine (belt) driven supercharger...?  >>   > G >    I don't know what charging options were available, but the belt on F >    the uncharged 62 Corvair we had had enough trouble just trying to2 >    turn the fan, and was a major pain to change.  E Your joking, right??  The only problem I ever saw was the cars desire D to constantly throw that belt.  Any truly experienced Corvair driverE carried at least one spare with them at all times and intalling it on " the side of the road took minutes.   > G >    For those who haven't seen this engineering wonder:  The belt ran  B >    vertically over the crankshaft pully, twisted 90 to an idlerC >    pulley, ran horizontally untwisting 90 to the fan pulley, and D >    returned via two more 90 twists and another idler pulley.  TheC >    fan rotated hotizontally on a vertical shaft above the engine. ? >    Along the way the belt ran into and out of the fan shroud.   G Corvairs still show up at many of the car shows I attend (usually in my H MG or Triumph) and I am amazed at how many Corvair drivers still put theI belt on the idlers upside down (with the Vee pointed out rather than into I the pulley channel. And still people blame the car and the engineers when 
 it fails!!   bill      --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 08:52:05 -0700, From: colive@technologEase.com (Chris Olive) Subject: Re: MySQL for VMS? = Message-ID: <b10654c6.0209240752.299a54db@posting.google.com>    Michiel Erens <I.dont.want.spam@this.mailaddress.is.invalid> wrote in message news:<3D8F6926.3FB0@this.mailaddress.is.invalid>...  > Chris Olive wrote: > > G > > I'm a fairly frequent user of MySQL on *nix, and would like to have D > > the same available in VMS.  I've wanted to port MySQL to VMS for= > > years, but never have the time (and probably never will.)  > > E > > I noticed in 1999 here in comp.os.vms one Dan O'Reilly of Process G > > announced a MySQL client for Alpha VMS, but there was no mention of J > > how to get it, or anything beyond that.  Anyone have any details as toI > > whether this is available at all?  I wrote Dan privately, but thought ' > > I would poke around here as well...  > % > It is avaliable at (URL may wrap) : M > http://mysql.holywar.net/Downloads/MySQL-3.22/mysql-3.22.25-clients-vms.zip  > See also the text at :  P > http://mysql.holywar.net/Downloads/MySQL-3.22/mysql-3.22.25-clients-vms.readme > 2 > I also saw this posting a couple of weeks ago : I >  http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&th=a76c5f6529524f3d   F Well, bummer.  The Alpha images were built on VMS v7.2 and I'm runningB Alpha VMS v7.1 (I know it's way behind, but I have no control over; that), so I'm getting sharable image ident mismatch errors:   " Error activating image PTHREAD$RTL> Image file OMEGA$DKB5:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSLIB]PTHREAD$RTL.EXE# Ident mismatch with shareable image   ' Unless someone knows a way around this?   E I'll try and get ahold of the author, although he hasn't yet answered F my FIRST message, so I'm not even sure if he still works at Process or not...   Chris    ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 12:03:24 -0600+ From: kuhrt@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt) 0 Subject: Re: New Miss America - Miss Ill-a-Noise3 Message-ID: <3+sdSiSwGsbh@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3D8FC410.B3C791BE@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > Michael Austin wrote:  >>  F >> > I get a kick out of the Weather Channel folks who say "Miz-UR-ah"J >> > instead of "Miz-UR-ee", which is what *I* grew up with in the Western >> > Suburbs of Chicago. >> > >>  G >> I am in the process of relocating to KC Miz-UR-ee and have been told H >> that there are some southern Miz-UR-ee locations where they do indeed >> pronounce it  Miz-UR-ah.  >>  I >> I do recall Barabara Walter using the correct Spanish pronunciation of K >> Buena Vista, however, in Virginia it is pronounced Bew-NAH Vista instead  >> of Bway-nah Vee-sta > G > They probably also say "Maw-nah LO" instead of "mah-Ooh-nah LO-ah" or # > "Mah-we" instead of "mah-OOH-ee".  > H > Maybe some native German speakers could address the issue of AmericansA > calling the shoe company "floor-shime" instead of "flors-hime".   > Maybe someone can explain why the capital of my home state is > called Duh Moin and the city in Illinois is called Dez Planez = instead of Duh Plane (as spoken by Tatoo from Fantasy Island)    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:32:20 -0500 , From: "Tony Scandora" <Scandora@cmt.anl.gov>+ Subject: Re: OpenOffice ODBC and Oracle Rdb + Message-ID: <amps24$716$1@milo.mcs.anl.gov>   J I run the old ODBC 2.10.14.0 driver to connect to VAX Rdb 6.1.  It vaariesJ between slow and lethargic, but it works for Microsoft clients.  You might3 want to try it and see how it works for OpenOffice.c  1 Tony Scandora, Argonne National Lab, 630-252-7541e scandora@cmt.anl.gov  5 "Alder" <PGDEHMKOKIMD@spammotel.com> wrote in messager& news:3D894B2B.8090203@spammotel.com... > Bob M. Lee wrote:2K > > One other thing - Upgrade to Oracle Rdb v7.1 - SQL*Net for Rdb (NET8) -,K > > will support JDBC thin-clients with better SQL*Plus language complianceo8 > > than before. (Besides that Rdb v7.1 SQL likes JAVA.) > >s >$C > No chance of that, I'm afraid.  I'm only one of many users of thehI > databases, and my trials with OO and ODBC are not on the admin's radar.  > 	 > Cheers,i >p > Alderd >=   ------------------------------   Date: 24 Sep 2002 14:05:03 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: opensource mail5 Message-ID: <ampree$80dns$2@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>n  * In article <3D8FD051.FFA12F4C@qut.edu.au>,+ 	CSSDEC <systemmail.its@qut.edu.au> writes:eE > Is there an opensource program available that can send mail with an.9 > attachment using multinet protocol on OpenVms V6.2-1H3?m > thanks  ...  Terry >     Pine??   bill     -- ,J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   n   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 12:46:18 -0400 ; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>r Subject: Re: opensource mail$ Message-ID: <3d909729$1@news.si.com>  D >Is there an opensource program available that can send mail with an8 >attachment using multinet protocol on OpenVms V6.2-1H3?  , With UUENCODE and some DCL it's easy.  Here:   $!  MAIL_ATTACHMENT.COM C $!  This procedure mails an attachment using UUENCODE and VMS Mail.  $!J $!  Usage: @mail_attachment attachment recipient [messagebody] ["Subject"] $! $   on error then goto cleanup $!- $!  Obtain the name of the file to be mailed.  $! $ getp1:" $   if p1 .nes. "" then goto gotp1- $   read/prompt="_Wide file: " sys$command p1  $   goto getp1 $!G $!  Obtain the address of the person to whom the file should be mailed.t $! $ gotp1:" $   if p2 .nes. "" then goto gotp2- $   read/prompt="_Recipient: " sys$command p2L $   goto gotp1 $!C $!  Obtain the name of any file that should be part of the message.( $! $ gotp2:" $   if p3 .nes. "" then goto gotp30 $   read/prompt="_Message file: " sys$command p3 $!$ $!  Obtain the mail subject, if any. $! $ gotp3:" $   if p4 .nes. "" then goto gotp4+ $   read/prompt="_Subject: " sys$command p4r $!C $!  Determine the name of the input file and derive the name of the 	 temporaryn $!  output files.t $! $ gotp4:( $   filename = f$parse( p1, , , "name" )( $   filetype = f$parse( p1, , , "type" )" $   origfile = filename + filetype $   tempout = filename + ".tmp"s $   uuout = filename + ".uue"b $!K $!  Convert the file to a STREAM format so that a PC-based mail system will0 $!  accept it. $!) $   convert/fdl=sys$input: 'p1' 'tempout'  RECORD     FORMAT stream      CARRIAGE_CONTROL nonei $!D $!  Now UUEncode the converted file.  Assume UUENCODE is in the same	 directoryr: $!  as this file.  Convert the output into a normal format $!E $   thisdir = f$element( 0, "]", f$environment( "procedure" ) ) + "]" A $   mcr 'thisdir'uuencode /out='uuout' /name='origfile' 'tempout'n* $   convert/fdl=sys$input: 'uuout' 'uuout' RECORD     FORMAT variable '     CARRIAGE_CONTROL    carriage_return4 $!J $!  Now, append the encoded file to the message file, if any, and mail theA $!  result to the intended recpient.  Delete the temporary files.m $! $   if p3 .nes. ""% $   then copy 'p3', 'uuout' 'tempout'0 $   else copy 'uuout' 'tempout'i	 $   endifo $! $   if p4 .eqs. "" $   then mail 'tempout' "''p2'"., $   else mail/subj="''p4'" 'tempout' "''p2'"	 $   endifi $!
 $ cleanup:( $   message = f$environment( "message" )& $   set message/nofac/noid/nosev/notex! $   delete 'tempout';*, 'uuout';*f $   set message'message'
 $   exit 1   --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comsA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.come= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventi< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 12:25:31 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)tT Subject: Re: Proposal: Retirement of some Components of the Compaq C++ Class Library3 Message-ID: <psd23bUXAQaQ@eisner.encompasserve.org>'  b In article <is_j9.15$Nx3.1595557@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Kenneth Block" <krblock@computer.org> writes:N > Recompile and go is not just a promise by VMS marketing, it is the mantra inE > engineering. With every decision we make, we ask if this will breakAK > recompile and go. It is our concern for recompile and go that has broughty > forth this survey. > N > Part of the class library was retired on Tru64 a couple years back. The partN > that was retired was never ported to Linux. The intention of this retirementK > is to bring parity to VMS. Any retirement that we would consider would bex1 > for Alpha and Itanium on VMS, Tru64, and Linux.s  J My point is some one "porting" from an older version of VMS to a newer one5 (possibly because they are moving to a new platform).a  9 If things happen to break due to unforseen circumstances,g that is unfortunate.  > If things happen to break because someone took something away, that is intolerable.  C Please do not presume that companies who might have occasion to run-= your compilers still have programmers who know that language.   G Please do not presume that when management signs up to buy new hardwareoE (which can typically only run the newer software) they are signing upg to do a bunch of programming.0   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 03:38:25 -07001 From: svend.jarzombek@alcoa.com (Svend Jarzombek)0U Subject: Re: UCX020B (UCX 2.0-03) - How to transfer file names with version  numbers?h= Message-ID: <36d31132.0209240238.7a3d3871@posting.google.com>l  Y Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in message news:<3D734601.869A6CE6@127.0.0.1>...  > Svend Jarzombek wrote: > > ? > > We bought a second hand coordinate measuring machine with anA > > VAXstation4000-60 that hosts the machine control for the CMM.rF > > Operating system is OpenVMS 5.5.1.0, TCPIP software is UCX020B. NoJ > > chance to update the operating system due to machine control software.B > > We need to transfer files from the VAXstation to UNIX systems.G > > If I specify "put filename.dat;*", all versions from the VMS system J > > are transfered to "filename.dat" on the UNIX system. So after the fileH > > transfer is done, the eldest version of filename.dat is the only one) > > that is available on the UNIX system.  > > G > > We did not receive any written documentation of UCX020B. The online'J > > documentation does not tell how to change parameters for transfer with > > version numbers. > 7 > UNIX does not have a concept of file version numbers.  > J > Therefore, your best course of action would be to use a DCL command fileH > to copy the files to a temporary area on the VMS system, giving them aJ > name which reflects their version, and performing the file transfer from > that area. >  > e.g. > . > filename.dat;3 filename.dat;2 filename.dat;1 > 
 > copy to: > 8 > filename.dat-3;1 filename.dat-2;1 and filename.dat-1;1 > H > (I added the ;1 for completeness). You'll know what you'll end up with > after transfer.h > F > That naming scheme may not support the processing model on your UNIX? > system, so pick one that makes life easy for you. Also bewarerJ > transitions from single to double and more digits in version numbers canI > affect the file search order from the UNIX system depending what naming  > scheme you devise. > I > You'll probably make use of the lexicals f$search("filename.dat;*") and.J > f$parse(symbol,,"VERSION") in your command file to perform the copy. See' > $ HELP LEXICALS for more information.r     Nic,  E I put your workaround into practice. While renaming filename.dat;n to-B filename.dat_n_date_hourminute;1 restore of a special file is much easier now.s Thanks a lot for your replyj   SvendM   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 18:16:44 +0200 - From: "Bert de Geus" <bert.de.geus@xs4all.nl>dF Subject: Unexpected <CR> and <FF> after a Setup module of a queue FORM* Message-ID: <amq3di$o4p$1@news1.xs4all.nl>   AXP/OpenVMS Version V6.1  E When I define a FORM with a SETUP module and create the module in theiK symbiont library, the symbiont prints (unexpected) <CR> and <FF> characterspH between the characters from the Setup module and the text of the printed file.t  H When I use existing FORMS and Setup modules this problem does not occur.D When I extract a Setup module from the library and insert/replace it5 unchanged in the same library the problem does occur.y   Anyone can help?   Thanx,   Bert   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 12:12:37 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.orgJ Subject: Re: Unexpected <CR> and <FF> after a Setup module of a queue FORM3 Message-ID: <czVG5y3BFLvF@eisner.encompasserve.org>c  Z In article <amq3di$o4p$1@news1.xs4all.nl>, "Bert de Geus" <bert.de.geus@xs4all.nl> writes: > AXP/OpenVMS Version V6.1 > G > When I define a FORM with a SETUP module and create the module in the M > symbiont library, the symbiont prints (unexpected) <CR> and <FF> charactersdJ > between the characters from the Setup module and the text of the printed > file.h > J > When I use existing FORMS and Setup modules this problem does not occur.F > When I extract a Setup module from the library and insert/replace it7 > unchanged in the same library the problem does occur.o  G The default VMS print symbiont, in its infinite wisdom scans your setup C modules looking for printable text.  If it finds printable text, iteB assumes that you wanted that text on a separate page and gives youG a form feed for free.  If all it finds are escape sequences, it assumestF that you're trying to set margins and fonts and such and does not give you the form feed.  ? I've been out of the business for a while, but I remember threea approaches.s  6 1.  Put a form feed of your own into the setup module.  I     Paradoxically, this sometimes eliminates a form feed from the output.m  8 2.  Encapsulate the setup module in a <ESC>P <ESC>\ pair  D     But if you have an ANSI printer, this won't generate the desired>     output and if you have a non-ANSI printer, it may generate@     undesired output.  Damned if you do and damned if you don't.  B 3.  Include a special escape sequence -- <ESC>]VMS;2<ESC>\ I think  >     This is supposed to tell the print symbiont: "print what I0     tell you, darn it -- I know what I'm doing".  ; If memory serves, I had the best success combining 1 and 3.e   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 23:30:03 +0100r' From: Elliott Roper <elliott@yrl.co.uk>e9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)o2 Message-ID: <230920022330036982%elliott@yrl.co.uk>  5 In article <3D8F6153.B4505D8E@videotron.ca>, JF Mezeid% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:a   > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:N > > Our primary purpose is to sell HP hardware, software and services.  So youH > > can bet that we will make sure that VMS is targeted at HP hardware.  > N > "targetted at HP hardware" is one thing. "Marketed to customers" is another. > L > Just because it runs on a wide range of hardware doesn't mean that HP will0 > choose to market VMS in those market segments. > M > Consider the Multia debacle where the Multia was prevented from running VMS K > for fear that it would cannabalise sales of more expensive hardware. BackeK > then, they used technical ways to prevent VMS from booting on the low end A > machines. HP may choose other methods (marketing, pricing etc).d  F To pull two sub-threads together, the way to boot VMS on Multia was toE kid it into believing it was a Tadpole. a.k.a "BURN" (for what it didaC to your lap). There was a bit of extra fiddling, but it came close.I  @ DEC really shot themselves in the foot for failing to pursue the VeryLowCost alpha line.e  G Without inexpensive development boxes for the customer's techies, it isaB hard to get the bottom-up support for purchasing decisions for the4 really profitable big stuff. PHBs are lonely people.  E If I were running HP marketing, every lump of big tin would come withhD at least five free 'workstation' VMS boxes like a son-of-DS-10. TheyD would find their way into developer and maintainer cubicles and home= systems. Far more direct and to the point than providing limpl" 'developer' toys on the dark side.  A So what if a few cunning people ship great systems on tinythings?.* They were not going to buy HugeVMS anyway.B Makes the folk who do buy big, more comfortable with second-source9 support and development, and hence more relaxed about hp.   F It is very pleasing to see that VMS is taking advantage of open-source1 stuff like SSL and Gnu-PG (hi Leo - remember us?)p  F With a lively community of developers who can tell the difference, VMS> ain't gonna suffer such a sharp decline any more. Let there be# affordable developer boxes, Please?e  G PS Three cheers to all who are supporting the hobbyist VMS program, andt! whatever CSA is called this week.n   Elliottd   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:14:48 GMTy# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>n9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these) H Message-ID: <Yb0k9.108108$U_.24206@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  @ "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> wrote in message- news:NJ%j9.26$iz3.1639441@news.cpqcorp.net...d? > JF Mezei wrote in message <3D8F9789.F5E35052@videotron.ca>...t > >Fred Kleinsorge wrote:sF > >> I have no reson to believe that any of these three are being cut. > >eK > >At the moment, you are probably right. But when push comes to shove, and  > HP'sJ > >stock is battered with calls for Carly to resign, she will be forced to > startrK > >cutting left and right , play musical chairs with senior VPs, reorganiseL > etcEG > >etc (aks: Bobby GP Palmer, the female version). That is what I worrya about. > >hJ > >Once the honeymoon with Curly is over, the media and wall street casinoI > >analysts won't be so kind to Carly.  Already, some analysts today sent  out. > ahJ > >press release which annouced that they had changed HP to "underperform" > (along > >with about 5 other stocks). > G > I don't believe that VMS will see any cuts for a variety of reasons Ib can'trJ > go into.  But it is highly unlikely that any future plans would kill VMS (asaE > you are implying).  There is more to lose than to gain by doing so.>    I So, for reasons you can't go into, can you tell us if we will be seeing ad' significant amount of marketing of VMS?p  L Highly unfair to ask....I know it's not your department and all that, but ifL you "don't believe that VMS will see any cuts for a variety of reasons" that	 you can't-K go into, then you are privy to some info outside the sphere of your domain.I$ Care to share on the marketing side?    1 Here's a thought to send up the marketing ladder:eJ 1) Assume that HP wants to expand market share of VMS - (however, based onI current marketing efforts, the Armani crowd would give that a probability" factor of 0.0001)s  J 2) HP sells/leases Alpha's to new customers today at the going rate, eg. aJ server priced at $100k, excluding cost of peripherals. (all dollar amounts
 hypothetical)   I 3) HP expects IA-64 boxes equivalent to today's Alpha in 2) above to sellM' for $65k when the VMS port is finished.z  L 4) HP tells today's new customer, "When VMS is released on IA-64, we'll swapJ out the Alpha, give you equivalent IA-64, and credit you the difference inG original purchase price or adjust lease terms accordingly for another 3OJ years. Or if you want the new top-of-the-line IA-64 (assuming it is fasterL than today's middling Alpha), we'll give you the difference in a discount on the price."   D 5) HP books sale today, gets software revenue, peripheral sales, and- maintenance revenue. VMS market share grows,.   J 6) Down the road, Alpha comes back at depreciated value, gets refurbed andJ put into refurb/spares pool, lowers HP's taxable position, and HP has more" customer success stories to write.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:47:47 GMTs* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>9 Subject: Re: VMS future (oh not not another one of these)aC Message-ID: <7z1k9.263759$AR1.11069109@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>   ? "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote in messageaE news:rdeininger-2409020639170001@1cust215.tnt2.nashua.nh.da.uu.net...eK > In article <TtQj9.241785$z91.10302205@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "Bill ' > Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:n >i >OE > >You're getting more than a bit carried away, Fred.  While there isp	 certainlyeH > >no direct evidence that VMS may soon sleep with the fishes, there are7 > >definitely reasons to worry that it very well might:r > >nI > >1.  The report that less than 3 years ago VMS was scheduled for a coded >          ^^^^^^rF > Report from where?  JF on comp.os.vms?  Gartner?  Some trade rag?  AG > Compaq annual report?  SKxxx?  Special bulletin from a flying saucer?u  L Verbal statement by Rich Marcello, since you ask.  Though I've heard it from" at least one other source as well.   >dJ > >freeze in 2003.  It escaped that fate at the time, but the fact that it wasiB >                                                             ^^^^J > And only 1 line later, you've upgraded the "report" to a "fact".   MaybeB > the flying saucers have recently gotten a bandwidth upgrade. :-)   No, you're just ignorant.-   >-G > >considered at all is indicative of VMS's perceived importance to the0 CompaqK > >leadership back then (much of which remains in decision-making positionsE at > >The New HP).o > J > Have you any credible evidence that a code freeze was either "scheduled" > or "considered"?  H See above.  Aside from Rich's staff members present, Dave Froble and Rob Young were witnesses.E   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 07:21:32 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)  Subject: Re: warning during copy= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209240621.5d75dbe8@posting.google.com>o  r "aniruddha patwardhan" <aniruddha_patwardhan@bmc.com> wrote in message news:<uota0ilrvfkmd8@corp.supernews.com>... > Hi > @ > I am trying to copy a file and I am getting following warning.J > Please explain the meaning of this warning as well as how to remove this	 > warninga >   > apatward@oak-ani_vantive> copy5 > DISK$USER01:[USER.APATWARD.FINAL_SAMPLES]PIPPIN_4-Se > EP-2002.MONDAT *.* >  > %COPY-W-INCOMPAT,'@ > DISK$USER01:[USER.APATWARD.FINAL_SAMPLES]PIPPIN_4-SEP-2002.MON > DAT;1 (input) ande@ > VIEW$ANI_VANTIVE:[VMS.USER2.CVAXDEV.ROLLOUT.REFCOPY]PIPPIN_4-S8 > EP-2002.MONDAT;1 (output) have incompatible attributes >  > TIA  > Aniruddham    F How did you manage to do this? Please run DIRECTORY/FULL on both files and report here. Thanks.   You can use * instead of *.*!@   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. FeldmanA   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 07:29:37 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)  Subject: Re: warning during copy= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0209240629.26102a1d@posting.google.com>   ` "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message news:<3D8FC64A.D3CE58CD@fsi.net>... > aniruddha patwardhan wrote:w > >  > > Hi > > B > > I am trying to copy a file and I am getting following warning.L > > Please explain the meaning of this warning as well as how to remove this > > warningn > > " > > apatward@oak-ani_vantive> copy7 > > DISK$USER01:[USER.APATWARD.FINAL_SAMPLES]PIPPIN_4-Sc > > EP-2002.MONDAT *.* > >  > > %COPY-W-INCOMPAT,hB > > DISK$USER01:[USER.APATWARD.FINAL_SAMPLES]PIPPIN_4-SEP-2002.MON > > DAT;1 (input) andtB > > VIEW$ANI_VANTIVE:[VMS.USER2.CVAXDEV.ROLLOUT.REFCOPY]PIPPIN_4-S: > > EP-2002.MONDAT;1 (output) have incompatible attributes > ' [sweep it under the rug method omitted]  >tI > Now that said, I'm not sure I understand why you're doing the copy of a0  > file to a wildcarded filespec. > H > If your intention is simply to make a copy of the file in your currentJ > default device/directory, the following will suffice and not produce the	 > mesage:h >  > $ COPY infile []    A Well, I don't see why he got the message in the first place, so I * don't see how using [] would fix anything.   Also, [] doesn't always work:d  
 DCL> SHOW DEFt   SYS$SYSDEVICE:[FELDMAN]3 DCL> SET DEF SYS$STARTUP
 DCL> SHOW DEFh   SYS$STARTUP:[FELDMAN]i   =   SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]a   =   SYS$COMMON:[SYS$STARTUP]   =   SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR]   =   SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR]d DCL> DIREC SYSF:R.COM;  s! Directory SYS$SYSDEVICE:[FELDMAN].    R.COM;24  3 Total of 1 file. DCL> COPY SYSF:R.COM []-? %COPY-E-OPENOUT, error opening SYS$COMMON:[FELDMAN].; as outputm -RMS-E-DNF, directory not founda" -SYSTEM-W-NOSUCHFILE, no such file DCL>  # $ COPY <file-spec> *   ! works fine.   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Eldman   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 07:33:08 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)n0 Subject: Re: What is happening to the industry ?3 Message-ID: <s8KnzsgDkhUI@eisner.encompasserve.org>P  \ In article <3D8FC233.5DE3071A@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes: > P > Is there anything preventing Bill Clinton from being Vice President ? I though* > only the president had term limitations.  J    The Constitution.  Who would be president if Oliver North decided to go<    once again above and beyond the law and nock off Hillary?  J    From Amendment XII:  "But no person constitutionally ineligible to the J    office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the     United States."   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 07:36:19 -0600- From: koehler@encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) 0 Subject: Re: What is happening to the industry ?3 Message-ID: <9BwXi70CEpjb@eisner.encompasserve.org>c  p In article <c8Rj9.253512$AR1.10600400@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com>, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:  N > Yup - applies to both.  Not that I consider it damning in either case:  thatM > was a war to be avoided, and my main reservation about both of them is thato; > they avoided it without actively speaking out against it.   H    Clinton was criticized for speaking out against the Vietnam war whileG    he was in England.  His critics felt that such criticism should only2    take place at home.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 18:32:55 -0400-- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>x0 Subject: Re: What is happening to the industry ?, Message-ID: <3D8F9696.E10945C6@videotron.ca>   "Terry C. Shannon" wrote:e > Yep, Bush isN > responsible for cancer, psoriasis, the transfer of nuclear technology to theM > ChiComs (a matter that just cost the Democrats over $700K USD!), Enron, the ) > dot-com implosion, and of course 9-11. 2  : Well there you go Atlant, Terry is fully supporting you !    :-) :-) :-) :-)   K > So, are you contributing to the President Daschle/Vice President Hillary!s  I Mr Shannon, your imagination disapoints me. Everyone knowns that the nextRN president will be Hillary Clinton, and the next VP will be Bill Clinton. WhileR hilary will be busy with world leaders, Bill can entertain their wifes :-) :-) :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:12:21 -0400G; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com>S1 Subject: Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPedG" Message-ID: <3d909d44@news.si.com>  : >http://www.openvms.compaq.com now has the HP color scheme >and format.  Happy hunting ...a  A Using Netscape Navigator Gold V3.03 on OpenVMS VAX V7.2 produces:   ; JavaScript Error: http://www.openvms.compaq.com/, line 814:m  
 syntax error.            function D8(d) {  	 ........^i    H In fact, every page I visited produces the exact same error.  Better fix your pages.y --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comoA Smiths Aerospace                          tillman at swdev.si.comi= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventa< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:21:19 -0700-+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com>e1 Subject: Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPed<' Message-ID: <3D909F0F.6080401@MMaz.com>D   Brian Tillman wrote:  ; >>http://www.openvms.compaq.com now has the HP color scheme0  >>and format.  Happy hunting ... >>     >> >dB >Using Netscape Navigator Gold V3.03 on OpenVMS VAX V7.2 produces: >s< >JavaScript Error: http://www.openvms.compaq.com/, line 814: >o >syntax error. >d >        function D8(d) {e >3	 >.......^  >  > I >In fact, every page I visited produces the exact same error.  Better fixi >your pages. >    >a Though I do agree that any VMS site must be friendly to browsers that run on VMS, Netscape 3 is too old that it is unreasonable to expect any browser so out of date to be supported.     DWhere Compaq and HP have really done the VMS community a major injustice is not aiding in the port of something like Mozilla to VMS to run on BOTH the Alpha and VAX architecture.  To run on Alpha only, has the stench of Microsoft and eliminates many of the positive benefits that VMS brought to the table, that VMS is VMS...   Barryn     -- t  @ Barry Treahy, Jr  *  Midwest Microwave  *  Vice President & CIO   A E-mail: Treahy@mmaz.com * Phone: 480/314-1320 * FAX: 480/661-7028s   ------------------------------    Date: 24 Sep 2002 12:31:23 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)l1 Subject: Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPedW3 Message-ID: <6FQsOuOWW4R+@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  ` In article <3d909d44@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:; >>http://www.openvms.compaq.com now has the HP color schemeh  >>and format.  Happy hunting ... > C > Using Netscape Navigator Gold V3.03 on OpenVMS VAX V7.2 produces:s > = > JavaScript Error: http://www.openvms.compaq.com/, line 814:" >  > syntax error.  >  >         function D8(d) { >  > ........^y >  > J > In fact, every page I visited produces the exact same error.  Better fix
 > your pages.e  C Or give up putting JavaScript on pages.  They work fine without it.n   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 19:30:57 +0100 (MET).9 From: Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>n1 Subject: Re: www.openvms.compaq.com has been HPedi; Message-ID: <01KMW24XIM6U9QW0O4@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>f  G > Though I do agree that any VMS site must be friendly to browsers thatoI > run on VMS, Netscape 3 is too old that it is unreasonable to expect anyt* > browser so out of date to be supported.   D What is meant by "not supported" in this case?  With good HTML, the E pages should be set up so that they look OK, or at least don't cause aG errors, if a browser with limited functionality accesses them.  On the  I other hand, if the error is caused by something non-standard in Netscape n 3, then I agree.  J > Where Compaq and HP have really done the VMS community a major injusticeF > is not aiding in the port of something like Mozilla to VMS to run onE > BOTH the Alpha and VAX architecture.  To run on Alpha only, has theeG > stench of Microsoft and eliminates many of the positive benefits thatm. > VMS brought to the table, that VMS is VMS...  E While I agree, I think the crucial point here is that the VAX is not  B IEEE.  Thus, this is really a no-win situation, even if a port of 6 Mozilla for the VAX had been desired by DEC/Compaq/HP.  H Considering that Mozilla is recommended only for machines with at least H 256 MB RAM and rather fast CPUs, I doubt a port could run well on a VAX  anyway.i  G Of course, LYNX runs on VAX, and the HP VMS pages (as indeed all their n pages) should be LYNX-friendly.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:20:10 +0100" From: <aproc5@attglobal.net> Subject: Re: ZIP version 2.2) Message-ID: <3d907856_2@news1.prserv.net>B   >1H > Well, in the first place, you need to use "-V" or /VMS in your commandF > line or the results may be useless, especially in the case of object > files. >tH > If you don't specify a degree of compression effort, the default is -5@ > or /LEVEL=5, roughly equivalent to DeflateN. /LEVEL=8 or -8 is6 > recommended for best compression (equiv.: DeflateX). >   I Hi dave, thanks for the help, The zipfile has no requirement for use on a J VMS system, it's purpose is use on a PC and we don't need the "-V", I haveK also used the /level on other files and it's a great tool but unfortunately)J our software guys won't change the software just for a zip command change.  F I'll look at what Joseph mentioned as soon as I can. The 2.2 is a muchJ better zip version and the self extracting advice you gave me is just what we needed, thanks!   Andy   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 23:17:22 +0100b From: <aproc5@attglobal.net> Subject: ZIP version 2.2) Message-ID: <3d8f96b4_3@news1.prserv.net>t   All,6 I hope this is found to be a user error on my part! :)  G I recently upgraded my ZIP and UNZIP programs to take advantage of someaK features recommended to me by David Dachtera for self extracting files. NowmK I have a small problem. The previous zip version was 2.0 and the new one iscC 2.2. In one portion of our software is coded a ZIP command as belowv  ; $ ZIP GPS$4500:ZIPFILE.ZIP GPS$4500_SCRATCH:*.*;* -X *.TEXTe  * gps$4500 and gps$4500_scratch are logicals  G This works fine in 2.0, but in 2.2 it was failing, so I tried manually:    $ cop *.yuma [.temp]*.*  $ cop *.txt [.temp]*.*. $ zip [.temp]zipfile.zip [.temp]*.*;* -x *.txt [this works in 2.0]iK %CLI-W-MAXPARM, too many parameters - reenter command with fewer parameterssK %DCL-W-MAXPARM, too many parameters - reenter command with fewer parametersw $   ) BUT using the new version switches I got:   4 $ zip [.temp]zipfile.zip [.temp]*.*;* /exclude=*.txt4 adding: [.TEMP]24_PERFECT_ORBITS.YUMA (deflated 95%)4 adding: [.TEMP]32_PERFECT_ORBITS.YUMA (deflated 96%)* adding: [.TEMP]WEEK_90.YUMA (deflated 86%)+ adding: [.TEMP]YUMA_ALM.YUMA (deflated 86%)e $   L So I guess there is a change in the -x switch from 2.0 to 2.2? Is this right  please, or is this a bug in 2.2?  K Any help definately appreciated as our software group don't want to issue a ! new release just for this change!    Regardsa   Andy Proctor   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2002.528 ************************flict - rename symbol  $      --   Syltrem A http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site - en =  fran=E7ais) 8 To reply to myself directly, remove zulu from my address  I "Alan E. Feldman" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> a =E9crit dans le message de =  news: 2 b096a4ee.0209201117.6dd74597@posting.google.com...: > Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Free.fr> wrote in message# news:<3D8B19C7.9095684F@Free.fr>... F > > Any character in the 5th position of a DCL verb wi                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        ·    ÷    ķ    ŷ    Ʒ    Ƿ    ȷ    ɷ    ʷ    ˷    ̷    ͷ    η    Ϸ    з    ѷ    ҷ    ӷ    Է    շ    ַ    ׷    ط    ٷ    ڷ    ۷    ܷ    ݷ    ޷    ߷    ෲ    ᷲ    ⷲ    㷲    ䷲    已    淲    緲    跲    鷲    귲    뷲    췲            ﷲ    𷲪    񷲪    򷲪    󷲪                                                    