1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 13 Apr 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 203       Contents:5 Re: attention Sue: alert your task force immediately! 5 Re: attention Sue: alert your task force immediately! , Re: Email to Geoff.Graves@hp.com is rejected, Re: Email to Geoff.Graves@hp.com is rejected Re: HP, P&G, Ericsson  Re: HP, P&G, Ericsson  Re: looking for VMS work Re: looking for VMS work Memory interchangability ?' Re: Need to buy 8 x VAX 4000 or similar M Re: starting batch job on windows machine when process on vms alpha completes  Re: StorageTek on SAN with VMS Re: StorageTek on SAN with VMS Re: TPU: SHOW BUFFER code  Re: TPU: SHOW BUFFER code   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 14:41:12 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>> Subject: Re: attention Sue: alert your task force immediately!/ Message-ID: <3E985DC7.80393069@vl.videotron.ca>    re: usage of word "legacy".   E No matter what the "industry standard" definition of legacy might be.   H In the VMS environment, applying the word legacy brings back memories ofJ Palmer, attempts at killing VMS, distrust of the vendor, lack of marketingM etc. It is synonymous with all of VMS' management problems and has nothing to  do with technology.   H Using the word "legacy" in the VMS enviroment strikes extremely negative" response from loyal VMS customers.  G More importantly, the CONTINUED use of "legacy" when refering to VMS by M HP/Compaq is a clear sign that the management folks are out of touch with the N VMS community and/or are out to insult and send a clear message that VMS is on its way out.  N At this point in time, Marcelo and friends are fully aware that the use of theN word LEGACY has extremely negative connotations. Any attempt by VMS managementM or higher to justify continued use of the word translates into "yeah, we know M exactly what message it sends, which is exectaly why we use that word because & it sends the message we need to send".   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 21:55:34 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> > Subject: Re: attention Sue: alert your task force immediately!' Message-ID: <3E98D1A6.70525DAA@fsi.net>    JF Mezei wrote:  >  > re: usage of word "legacy".  > G > No matter what the "industry standard" definition of legacy might be.  > J > In the VMS environment, applying the word legacy brings back memories ofL > Palmer, attempts at killing VMS, distrust of the vendor, lack of marketingO > etc. It is synonymous with all of VMS' management problems and has nothing to  > do with technology.  > J > Using the word "legacy" in the VMS enviroment strikes extremely negative$ > response from loyal VMS customers. > I > More importantly, the CONTINUED use of "legacy" when refering to VMS by O > HP/Compaq is a clear sign that the management folks are out of touch with the P > VMS community and/or are out to insult and send a clear message that VMS is on > its way out. > P > At this point in time, Marcelo and friends are fully aware that the use of theP > word LEGACY has extremely negative connotations. Any attempt by VMS managementO > or higher to justify continued use of the word translates into "yeah, we know O > exactly what message it sends, which is exectaly why we use that word because ( > it sends the message we need to send".  E I'd qualify that as "the message we INTEND to send". The message they # NEED to send is quite the contrary.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 14:34:39 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>5 Subject: Re: Email to Geoff.Graves@hp.com is rejected / Message-ID: <3E985C3E.123954F1@vl.videotron.ca>   ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: H > Sent another email to you Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 07:18:17 -0400 and itG > too was rejected.  In fact, it would appear that *anything* I send to ! > HP.COM/Compaq.com is rejected.    . http://work-rss.mail-abuse.org/cgi-bin/nph-rss  I Try inputting the IP address of the SMTP server that would connect to the  HP.COM server.  K Are you using your ISP's SMTP server or your own ? If you have a setup that I bypasses your ISP's restrictions, it is possible that your ISP would have K declared all its IP adresses to be "spam" in the RBLs to prevent any of its 5 customers from using a home SMTP server to send spam.   J One way is to configure you SMTP server to use your ISP's relay instead of. sending messages all by itself like a big boy.  M Damned those ISPs that put in such silly restrictions like that (and no fixed 
 IP adresses).    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 14:47:23 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>5 Subject: Re: Email to Geoff.Graves@hp.com is rejected / Message-ID: <3E985F39.E9A0D4DA@vl.videotron.ca>    "John E. Malmberg" wrote: 7 > A quick check with http://www.samspade.org shows that I > mail(dot)tmesis(dot)com is totally clean and is set up correctly with a   > valid rDNS on the mail server.  = I checked the other service I mentioned and it too was clean.   M If I were you, I would write to postmaster@hp.com from another account (yahoo M etc) and ask them why your smtp server is prevented and on which list you are  on (which lists HP uses).   N When my ISP was not allowed to send to HP, its main SMTP server address showedM up on the RBL lists, so I had my answer as to why (so I started to use my own 0 SMTP server to send stuff out, bypassing my ISP.   ------------------------------   Date: 12 Apr 2003 18:45:55 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: HP, P&G, Ericsson5 Message-ID: <b79mt3$cma02$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>   ) In article <3E984145.9070002@vajhoej.dk>, & 	Arne Vajhj <arne@vajhoej.dk> writes: > Bill Gunshannon wrote:B >> That would be a surprise to me.  My sister works for P&G and at1 >> least in her plant it is all Windows and HPUX.  > : > Considering the size of P&G, then I am not sure'that one+ > plant with Win and HPUX proves that much.   K If you knew how draconian their management style is, you wouldn't say that. H No joke, my sister has a label on here desk that shows where the staplerI must go.  And the desk calendar.  And the phone.  And foam cutouts in her B drawers so that the contents are always in the their proper place.   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 21:58:58 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: HP, P&G, Ericsson' Message-ID: <3E98D272.8D73C62C@fsi.net>    Bill Gunshannon wrote: > + > In article <3E984145.9070002@vajhoej.dk>, / >         Arne Vajhj <arne@vajhoej.dk> writes:  > > Bill Gunshannon wrote:D > >> That would be a surprise to me.  My sister works for P&G and at3 > >> least in her plant it is all Windows and HPUX.  > > < > > Considering the size of P&G, then I am not sure'that one- > > plant with Win and HPUX proves that much.  > M > If you knew how draconian their management style is, you wouldn't say that. J > No joke, my sister has a label on here desk that shows where the staplerK > must go.  And the desk calendar.  And the phone.  And foam cutouts in her D > drawers so that the contents are always in the their proper place.  ? I'd call that neurotic, possibly psychotic before I'd call that A draconian, though that's a good analogy in a very negative sense.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 16:04:22 -0400 ' From: Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> ! Subject: Re: looking for VMS work < Message-ID: <howard-771A05.16042212042003@enews.newsguy.com>  ' In article <3E9849CD.2F778B69@fsi.net>, 3  "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote:   G > Now, dilute that $150/hr with health insurance costs, self-employment H > taxes and other business related expenses, self and dependent life andG > dependent health care insurance, etc. and you may be surprised at the 
 > results.   Good analysis.   --  4 Today, on Paper-view: The World Origami Championship   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 01:12:27 -0400 * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>! Subject: Re: looking for VMS work 2 Message-ID: <gIKcnVa85N4hbAWjXTWcpQ@metrocast.net>  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3E9849CD.2F778B69@fsi.net...  > John Smith wrote: 
 > > [snip]H > > They are offering to top-up his pension plan to make it as though heI > > was never laid-off, and to pay him $150/hr. for the next year ( about E > > $315k) based on a full-time commitment on his part. Before he was , > > laid-off, he was making $80k. Go figure. > G > Now, dilute that $150/hr with health insurance costs, self-employment H > taxes and other business related expenses, self and dependent life andG > dependent health care insurance, etc. and you may be surprised at the 
 > results.  J It's still around $150K annually after *all* taxes and expenses.  Hardly aG king's ransom, but not exactly shabby either - even for only one year's H duration (unless he had to pass up a more stable high-paying job to take it).   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 18:36:37 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> # Subject: Memory interchangability ? 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIKENKGPAA.tom@kednos.com>   2 Before i go through the effort does anyone know if< memory modules on Alphastation 200s are interchangeable with DEC3000 300LX?   --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.467 / Virus Database: 266 - Release Date: 4/1/2003    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 01:23:51 -0400 0 From: "Rob L Lyons" <rob.lyons@resilientsys.com>0 Subject: Re: Need to buy 8 x VAX 4000 or similar+ Message-ID: <b7asc3$ipb$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   N > > > I could buy a bunch of Vaxes for that, with licences. They would be more= > > > reliable than a new W2K box . Seems to be a bad option.  > > I > > Actually, W2k can be a very reliable platform.  We recommend that all C > > unnecessary services (which are most of them) be disabled.  The A > > system must be dedicated to CHARON-VAX, and run nothing else.  > D > I still don't understand why this emulator is running on a WinwoesH > platform (letting aside the Alpha version) and not based on a reliable > real-time OS.   H As long as the price of an Alpha is many times the price of a comparableC Intel box (comparable being CPU speed, memory size, I/O bandwidth), G we will still see Windows systems.  Maybe when Itanium is available for ) every OS, then a new truth will be known.   F If you would rather use Linux, there are custom versions of Charon-VAX that may fit your need.   K Although Stan tends to be more vocal, there are a few others of us that can J help with a Charon solution.  And with HP raising VAX service prices, 2003+ and 2004 may be a good year for Charon-VAX.   	 Rob Lyons  Resilient Systems, Inc.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 18:56:17 GMT & From: "Tim Brown" <tbrownsr@sc.rr.com>V Subject: Re: starting batch job on windows machine when process on vms alpha completes= Message-ID: <ljZla.12040$RE3.848925@twister.southeast.rr.com>   L You could make the last file you ftp an additional one byte file to "signal"I the .bat to run. Set up the .bat to check if the signal file exists (once L every minute, 5 minutes, etc.). If the signal file exists, delete it and run your .bat apps.  Tim   . "Rusty" <wilmesr@hotmail.com> wrote in message7 news:f0d7bf28.0304111237.6fc8f07d@posting.google.com...  > Hi,  > A > I have a batch job that runs on an Openvms 7.1-2 UCX 5.0a eco 3  > machine that basically...  > 8 > a) creates a bunch of text files in a single directory9 > b) ftp's them to a single windows 2k SQL server folder.  > c) waits about 4 hours! > d) creates some more text files . > e) ftps them to the SQL server (same folder) > C > After step B, we run a .bat file on the SQL server that takes the E > first group of text files and stuffs them into SQL.  I'd like to be = > able to start this bat file from the vms host after the ftp  > successfully completes.  > C > After step E we kick off a sql agent job that processes the files  > created in step d. > > > The windows server doesn't have the telnet server installed. > ; > Any tips (or which fm to r) would be greatly appreciated.  >  > Rusty    ------------------------------    Date: 12 Apr 2003 16:14:20 -0700$ From: svieth@wi.rr.com (Scott Vieth)' Subject: Re: StorageTek on SAN with VMS = Message-ID: <5a85bce2.0304121514.79214bef@posting.google.com>   G > > 1) HSG controllers do *not* support anything but disk drives.  Stop F > > thinking of them like they are HSJ controllers (or, heaven forbid,
 > > HSCs). > D > Not sure why each new generation of HSx has to "grow up" like thatF > (witness: HSZ). Why not build it all in from the start (HSZ's didn't= > support tape right from the off - you had to define them as J > pass-thru's), and "hit the ground running" rather than forcing customers6 > to "make" do" until your product gets "up to speed"?   Dave:   D The HSGs do not currently and *never* will have support for anything@ other than tape drives.  If it is not an SBB or a Universal diskC drive, it can not be connected to an HSG controller.  End of story. ? [Okay, technically, the controllers are connected to shelves or 1 enclosures and then the disks live inside there.]    > G > > 2) As other folks have mentioned, you will need a SCSI-to-fc bridge G > > like the Modular Data Router or NSR (both from HP) to attach a tape F > > library to a SAN fabric.  Some of the bigger, newer tape librariesG > > come with that functionality built-in so you can run fiber directly  > > into the library.  > J > Well, I wouldn't quite say that. The STK's SCSI-FC bridge/switch appearsI > to be optional. The robot and the tape drives are all SCSI devices, and C > so could be connected directly to a VMS system, given appropriate  > software to drive the robot.   > H > The FC-SAN's sole purpose in life is to share those devices with otherJ > servers. Case in point: our two L700E's are shared among the W2K, NovellH > and VMS machines, with the ACSLS server providing shared robot control
 > to the lot.   > Exactly.  The SAN is there so that many servers can access the? library.  And to attach the library to the SAN, you will need a  SCSI-to-f.c. bridge.  @ > As to the "tape-on-a-SAN" concept, if you'd care to share yourH > TAPESTART.COM (part of the SLS startup) and SYS$DEVICES.DAT files withI > me, how to demung the reply-to address should be obvious. If you happen J > to also be using DCSC, so much the better. Send also the library listing9 > and LUN listing files from DCSC's configuration editor.   B Dave, I do not have experience with connecting VMS systems to tapeB systems on a SAN.  My experience has been with using NT, Win2k andC Solaris in a SAN-based backup environment.  I always follow the EBS ? (Enterprise Backup Solution) guidelines when building my backup * solutions and have never had any problems.  D My VMS systems have direct-attached (SCSI card right in the CPU box)C tape drives.  Even though we have a really nice Compaq ESL9326DX in A the data center that is SAN-attached, I backup the VMS systems to  locally-attached tape drives. < The Suns and Windows systems store their secrets in the ESL.  E But as far as designing EBS-style backup schemes, I've done the other F 99% of what you are asking about: installing HBAs in hosts, setting-upD switches (zoning), connecting and configuring MDR to SAN, connecting MDR to Enterprise Library, etc.   E You seem to be a little confused on the "How do I attach a library to  the SAN" part.   Just trying to be helpful. :^)
 -Scott :^)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 21:54:05 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ' Subject: Re: StorageTek on SAN with VMS ' Message-ID: <3E98D14D.581F11CA@fsi.net>    Scott Vieth wrote: > [snip] > djesys wrote: B > > As to the "tape-on-a-SAN" concept, if you'd care to share yourJ > > TAPESTART.COM (part of the SLS startup) and SYS$DEVICES.DAT files withK > > me, how to demung the reply-to address should be obvious. If you happen L > > to also be using DCSC, so much the better. Send also the library listing; > > and LUN listing files from DCSC's configuration editor.  > D > Dave, I do not have experience with connecting VMS systems to tapeD > systems on a SAN.  My experience has been with using NT, Win2k andE > Solaris in a SAN-based backup environment.  I always follow the EBS A > (Enterprise Backup Solution) guidelines when building my backup , > solutions and have never had any problems.  H Well, not to intentionally be insulting, but that is my primary concern:C the subject of this as originally posted. You seem to have good SAN = experience in other areas, but my need is extremely specific.    > [snip]G > But as far as designing EBS-style backup schemes, I've done the other H > 99% of what you are asking about: installing HBAs in hosts, setting-upF > switches (zoning), connecting and configuring MDR to SAN, connecting! > MDR to Enterprise Library, etc.   C I'd liken that to the 80/20 rule: in this case, 80% of your efforts D produce 20% of your results. I, on the other hand, have done the 20%E that produces 80% of my results before: develop Backup automation (on F VMS) that splits shadow/mirror sets, load balances across tape drives,H performs (crude) locking to reduce interference with the overnight batchF jobs, export cart.'s and rejoin shadow/mirror sets, all done in batch,F hands-off, lights-out and unattended. The original environment was theE SAN predecessor known as CI, but it went to direct-attached SCSI when A higher tape throughput with lower CI impact was need to satisfy a G mandate to shorten the backup "window" and lessen the interference with  the nightly processing.   G > You seem to be a little confused on the "How do I attach a library to  > the SAN" part.  E Well, take the subject of the original post very literally. Attaching H the library to the SAN is one thing. Getting VMS to recognize and accessH the drives is of much broader scope, and that is the specific area whereB I need the expertise of someone who has already been where I'm now	 trekking.   B By appearances, I am blazing a VMS trail here as few, if any, haveF already done what I'm trying to do, including the vendors selling thisG stuff. They know it's possible, but when it comes to "how", they're all  left scratching their heads.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 14:48:24 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>" Subject: Re: TPU: SHOW BUFFER code/ Message-ID: <3E985F76.23E0642E@vl.videotron.ca>    Arne Vajhj wrote:2 > You got the source code for EVE, so you can just > see how it is done.   K Are you sure that SHOW BUFFER is done in TPU code and not built-in to the C  code deep down ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 23:29:07 -0500 - From: Hunter Goatley <goathunter@goatley.com> " Subject: Re: TPU: SHOW BUFFER code: Message-ID: <Ty5ma.27471$fw.24801@fe02.atl2.webusenet.com>   JF Mezei wrote: N > In the "SHOW BUFFER" command, it creates a buffer containing a list of itemsN > (buffer). Then, you can click on a line (or press return with cursor at that8 > line) and special action is taken to show that buffer. > ? > Has anyone implemented routines that perform similar stuff ?   > L > (for instance, have a list of files, and if you click on one, it is loaded4 > into a separate buffer/window in the TPU session).  = My FLIST file and directory manager (a TPU-based file manager @ similar in concept to Explorer under Windows or the File Manager= in Motif) does similar stuff: when you run it, you get a list = of files from the current or specified directory, and you can B move through the buffer, easily viewing, deleting, renaming, etc.,? the files.  It's similar to C-Swing, but nowhere near as large.   7 FLIST is written primarily in TPU, with some C support. 4 It's the one tool I would hate to do without on VMS.   You can find it here:   : http://vms.process.com/scripts/fileserv/fileserv.com?FLIST   Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/ 6 goathunter@goatley.com, http://www.goatley.com/hunter/   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.203 ************************