1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 01 Aug 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 422       Contents: DS10 600Mhz Special for August Re: Firewall for VMS" Re: Free VMS course for new users!" Re: Free VMS course for new users!" Re: Free VMS course for new users! I wonder if it'll run on VMSE Re: IDC reports PC Market Share: Dell over HP by a nose; both pulling ' Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer + Re: Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer + RE: Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer  Re: Itanium performance news... # Re: Java 1.4.1 installation rant... D Re: KZPCC-CE (three channel RAID controller) - poor read performanceD Re: KZPCC-CE (three channel RAID controller) - poor read performanceP KZPCC-CE (three channel RAID controller) - poor read performance from RAID-1 froP PR: HP Delivers Next Step on AlphaServer Roadmap: 32-processor Systems Now Shipp Re: Sun and SCO  Re: Sun and SCO  Re: Sun and SCO  Re: Sun and SCO  Re: Sun and SCO # Re: Sun Micro Profit, Revenues Fall F Re: Sun Micro Profit, Revenues Fall - H-P retains server shipment lead3 Re: Sun tries to woo AlphaServer users away from HP  Re: TCP/IP feature request, Re: The solution is... Rhonda Lea does Mezei, Re: The solution is... Rhonda Lea does Mezei* Re: VMS and Intel, yet another question... Re: Web Apps for VMS Re: Web Apps for VMS Re: Web Apps for VMS& Re: [Change topic -> OT] Pence/Pennies  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 11:26:16 -0400& From: "Island" <dbturner@islandco.com>' Subject: DS10 600Mhz Special for August / Message-ID: <vil1o7aqioh1c0@news.supernews.com>    Alphaserver DS10 617Mhz EV676 1GB Island Memory (upgrade to 2GB for additional $500) CDROM Floppy U160 SCSI Controller U160 36.7GB 15KRPM Disk 
 Dual Ethernet " Dual Serial, USB and Parallel Port OpenVMS Base License   Total US$ 4995  - Compare to Compaq's price of $11,000 !!!!!!!!   B We offer extended warranty to 3 years next day parts for only $800   Call or email today !      --   David B Turner Island Computers US Corporation  2700 Gregory St., Suite 180  Savannah GA 31404  Tel: 912 447 6622  Fax: 912 201 0402  Email: dbturner@hpaq.net http://www.hpaq.net    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 10:00:47 -0000 4 From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> Subject: Re: Firewall for VMS 4 Message-ID: <20030801100047.662.qmail@gacracker.org>  L On 30 Jul 2003, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote:B >In article <20030729161506.17051.qmail@gacracker.org>, Doc.Cypher, ><Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> writes: >>  C >> It certainly does... Until you run into a DoS attack or similar.  > F >   Andrew is the only one concerned that VMS was susceptable to a DOSF >   attack.  Although I believe reports that early versions of UCX mayC >   have had these issues, I've never known any VMS system actually H >   bothered by one.  And I know of several VMS systems sitting naked on >   the internet ignoring them.   J I've personally had to mop up after 2 DoS attacks on the Deathrow Cluster.  J Neither qualified as VMS-specific.  Any system could've been DoSsed in the same manner.     Doc. --  K OpenVMS.         Eight out of ten hackers prefer *other* operating systems. K [New PGP Key - Get via finger]        http://deathrow.vistech.net/BOFH/doc/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 04:49:40 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>+ Subject: Re: Free VMS course for new users! ) Message-ID: <3F2A29A0.860DC725@istop.com>    Kevin Monceaux wrote:  > L > Humm, an introductory course on VMS that requires Windows 95/98/NT to viewK > the course.  It would seem that a web based course on VMS would be hosted B > on a VMS server and be accessible from any os with VMS being the > preferable os.  R MC DECW$CBI.EXE (or from the "help" item in the session manager, choose "tutorial"  L The engine is there. Digital should just release the documentation on how toA develop course material and make use of the little known utility.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 11:22:09 -0400$ From: "rob kas" <news@paychoice.com>+ Subject: Re: Free VMS course for new users! / Message-ID: <vil1d0lfl3dq3a@corp.supernews.com>   = "Kevin Monceaux" <OwnedByDogs@grandecom.net> wrote in message B news:Pine.LNX.4.50.0308010028370.6692-100000@Linux.monceaux.com... > L > Humm, an introductory course on VMS that requires Windows 95/98/NT to viewK > the course.  It would seem that a web based course on VMS would be hosted B > on a VMS server and be accessible from any os with VMS being the > preferable os. >  >   6  Of Course a Working browser on VMS would be required.  &                                  Bob k   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 11:20:11 -0500 - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) + Subject: Re: Free VMS course for new users! 3 Message-ID: <rhLQ2nLsjSKH@eisner.encompasserve.org>   V In article <vil1d0lfl3dq3a@corp.supernews.com>, "rob kas" <news@paychoice.com> writes: > ? > "Kevin Monceaux" <OwnedByDogs@grandecom.net> wrote in message D > news:Pine.LNX.4.50.0308010028370.6692-100000@Linux.monceaux.com... >>M >> Humm, an introductory course on VMS that requires Windows 95/98/NT to view L >> the course.  It would seem that a web based course on VMS would be hostedC >> on a VMS server and be accessible from any os with VMS being the  >> preferable os.  >> >> > 8 >  Of Course a Working browser on VMS would be required.  H With Bookreader, one could follow the course even on a machine like mine% on which no web browser is installed.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 17:13:12 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> % Subject: I wonder if it'll run on VMS G Message-ID: <IcxWa.22266$4UE.3332@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>    Product of India.    Java SQL-99 rdbms , The per seat price is certainly interesting.D Perfect (if it works) for vars to build turnkey solutions on, though( My-SQL might be a more strategic choice.; It'd be very interesting if it could be made to run on VMS.    Reminds me a lot of Interbase.      : http://www.daffodildb.com/datasheet-db.html#power-features  " http://www.daffodildb.com/faq.html   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 09:23:50 GMT * From: "Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com>N Subject: Re: IDC reports PC Market Share: Dell over HP by a nose; both pulling: Message-ID: <GkqWa.1783$jg.747753@news1.news.adelphia.net>   Andrew.Harrison@sun.com   K "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> ; wrote in message news:bfopsj$ff8$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...  > Rob Young wrote:J > > In article <bfmadq$hlg$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK; Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> writes:  > >  > >>Rob Young wrote: > >  > > B > >>Right so in the same period the bits of HP that you care aboutB > >>lost 472 million dollars despite bunging their R&D budget into> > >>a central pot funded by printing and Sun lost 292 million. > >> > >  > > D > > Ah, and there's the rub Andrew.  Sun has Java and the associated@ > > Java revenue stream to prop it up.  Ah... okay, a joke.  But? > > as Scott talks about growth and futures he declares Sun the G > > second largest software house (not so, IBM is that owner).  Nothing  > > to prop Sun up.  > > A > > Face it - 9 straight quarters of declining revenue highlights  > > a company in decline.  > >  > >  > 1 > Odd, Sun's revenue last quarter was higher than 7 > it was the previous quarter and the previous quarters 0 > revenues were higher than the one before that.    < http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/tech/kcswanson/10104445.html  H "According to its most recently filed annual report, for the fiscal yearJ 2002 ending June 2002, Sun's net loss of $587 million would have surged toB $1.2 billion if the company had accounted for options. Stock-based< compensation tacked on an additional $647 million in costs."  6 When one digs deeper, you find how bad it really is!!!  J Ohhh my, ooh my, how long doeth your nose grow?  Do not let the woodpeckerE land on it or your number of nostrils will grow!  Peck, peck, peck...   ) Dr. King FUD, you make this too easy! ;-)    mark   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 10:01:19 -0700 * From: Alan Frisbie <Abuse@Flying-Disk.com>0 Subject: Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer. Message-ID: <3F2A9CDF.4050908@Flying-Disk.com>  : As I was clearing out this morning's accumulation of spam,> I found the usual "Microsoft security patch".   Uh huh, right.1 Like I would ever install such code on my system.   = What struck my eye, however, was the list of addressees.   It = appears that the spammer harvested his list from comp.os.vms. = This would appear to be a less-than-optimal list for spamming D a Windows virus.   I doubt that even Andrew would fall for it.   :-)   Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 19:03:05 +0200 $ From: Michael Unger <unger@decus.de>4 Subject: Re: Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer9 Message-ID: <bge6ra$o1upt$1@ID-152801.news.uni-berlin.de>   ) On 01-Aug-2003 19:01, Alan Frisbie wrote:   < > As I was clearing out this morning's accumulation of spam,@ > I found the usual "Microsoft security patch".   Uh huh, right.3 > Like I would ever install such code on my system.  > ? > What struck my eye, however, was the list of addressees.   It ? > appears that the spammer harvested his list from comp.os.vms. ? > This would appear to be a less-than-optimal list for spamming F > a Windows virus.   I doubt that even Andrew would fall for it.   :-)  B That isn't really news. About once a month I get similar "security? patches" with lots of addresses in the "To:" and "CC:" headers,  harvested from this news group.   ; Ans yes, it's about the same as spamming to "abuse" groups.    Michael    --    @ Please do *not* send "Security Patch Notifications" or "SecurityA Updates"; this system isn't running a Micro$oft operating system. = And don't annoy me <mailto:postmaster@[127.0.0.1]> please ;-)    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 10:06:24 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 4 Subject: RE: Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIOEBEHLAA.tom@kednos.com>   A Yeah, that one is usually in my inbox every morning, but the free G virus scanner that I use seems to disarm it by removing the executable.   C If I am curious about any mail, of which I don't know the origin, I H open it with vmsmail.  Of course, having said that the gremlins will now& go to work to create a vms version :-)   >-----Original Message----- 2 >From: Alan Frisbie [mailto:Abuse@Flying-Disk.com]' >Sent: Friday, August 01, 2003 10:01 AM  >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com1 >Subject: Idiot (I know that's redundant) spammer  >  > ; >As I was clearing out this morning's accumulation of spam, ? >I found the usual "Microsoft security patch".   Uh huh, right. 2 >Like I would ever install such code on my system. > > >What struck my eye, however, was the list of addressees.   It> >appears that the spammer harvested his list from comp.os.vms.> >This would appear to be a less-than-optimal list for spammingE >a Windows virus.   I doubt that even Andrew would fall for it.   :-)  >  >Alan  >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). A >Version: 6.0.502 / Virus Database: 300 - Release Date: 7/18/2003  >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.502 / Virus Database: 300 - Release Date: 7/18/2003   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 13:26:51 -0400* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>( Subject: Re: Itanium performance news...2 Message-ID: <QaCdncyykrF3P7eiU-KYvA@metrocast.net>  8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:gzCra0GHiUHR@eisner.encompasserve.org... @ > In article <kamdnZmlr_4vBrSiXTWJiQ@metrocast.net>, "Bill Todd"  <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes: > > < > > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message >   H [I've reinserted the statement to which you first responded.  It will be useful later.]  C >>> > Sun *wasn't* doing fine last quarter.  But if you look at the 	 full-year I >>> > results for 2002 over 2001, Sun grew significantly while HP shrank: ; >>> > different companies have problems at different times.    > >>@ > >> Nonsense.  Sun had a disasterous 2002 (on par with the 2003, > >> disaster?  Don't know - have to check). > > L > > Of course you don't know - because you're wrong.  Unlike you, however, I( > > knew what I was talking about above: > >  >  > Wrong about what?   E Wrong in your statement immediately preceding that assertion, nitwit.   (   That Sun had a disasterous 2002 versus > 2001?   E Wrong in asserting that anything resembling 'nonsense' attached to my L statement that "if you look at the full-year results for 2002 over 2001, Sun$ grew significantly while HP shrank."  1   They went from a 18 billion dollar company with > > associated earnings and slid to a 12 billion dollar company.  * Not in the applicable context:  see below.   > C > > http://www3.gartner.com/5_about/press_releases/pr24jan2003a.jsp  > > J > > If you will examine the Worldwide Server Unit Shipment chart, you will see K > > that (the combined) cHumPaq sold 4.6% fewer server units and held lower J > > market share in 2002 than in 2001.  And that Sun sold 6.7% more server units B > > and held (slightly) greater market share in 2002 than in 2001. >  > So?  They sold more kit.  H While HP sold less.  And gained market share while HP lost it.  In otherI words, "if you look at the full-year results for 2002 over 2001, Sun grew  significantly while HP shrank."    >  Big deal.    Most companies seem to think so.     That obviously wasn't = > one of my supporting points claiming they had a disasterous ) > 2002 compared to 2001.  This might make 7 > things even more clearer (as if they weren't before).   / It makes it *extremely* clear, Rob:  see below.      In > Sun's own words: > H > http://www.sun.com/smi/Press/sunflash/2002-07/sunflash.20020718.1.html > I > "For the full 2002 fiscal year, Sun reported revenues of $12.5 billion,  down 32 6 > percent from record high revenues of the prior year.  K Perhaps you have difficulty understanding the difference between fiscal and K calendar years, Rob.  The decline you note above compares the July, 2000 to J June, 2001 period (Sun's FY 2001) with the July, 2001 to June, 2002 periodJ (Sun's FY 2002):  the first period (as Sun noted, its all-time record highL fiscal year) was dominated by the peak of the dot-com boom, while the secondJ resided entirely in the depths of the dot-com (and post-9/11) bust - so ofE *course* Sun's revenue and profitability plunged dramatically in that ( comparison, just as everyone else's did.  J My statement to which you were responding, however, referred to *calendar*K years 2001 and 2002.  It makes absolutely no sense to suggest that it might L have referred to fiscal years, since HP and Sun have significantly different< fiscal years and hence such a comparison would be senseless.  L Since the rest of your post continued driveling on with similar irrelevance,> I guess we can dispense with any additional play-by-play here.   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 15:03:04 GMT 3 From: wallacethinmintr@eircom.net (Russell Wallace) , Subject: Re: Java 1.4.1 installation rant...0 Message-ID: <3f2a80da.262389941@news.eircom.net>  E On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 02:32:16 -0400, John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> wrote:   @ >It turns out the whole thing is a fixed width table, wider thanH >my screen, so I have to keep scrolling left and right to read it.  Ugh!* >Can you spell "repetitive stress injury"? > ? >THIS IS PURE TEXT, for God's sake!  What is wrong with people?   D I agree completely, this is extreme silliness on the part of whoeverF formatted the document. I find there's an easy fix though: Select All,A Copy, switch to a text editor window, Paste, then read the pasted  version.   --   "Sore wa himitsu desu."  To reply by email, remove  the small snack from address. ! http://www.esatclear.ie/~rwallace    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 11:58:39 -0500 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) M Subject: Re: KZPCC-CE (three channel RAID controller) - poor read performance 3 Message-ID: <ZDIq29z4GGJu@eisner.encompasserve.org>   V In article <bgdcgb$997$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>, Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> writes:= > Gentle colleagues (cross-posted to comp.os.vms since that's  > where I mostly live),  > 7 > I'm baffled by the poor read performance when reading - > from a RAID-1 set on a KZPCC-CE controller.  > ; > Scenario: 3-processor ES40 (500 MHz), running Tru64 4.0F, 7 > 4 Gbytes (4 Mbyte cache), KZPCC-CE with 15K rpm disks 1 > RAID-1 set mirrored over 2 separate SCSI buses.  > = > Using vdump to an SDLT-1, we're observing a read throughput < > of ca. 44 Mbytes/sec to tape from a single disk.  When the; > disk is mirrored (as configured above), we're getting ca. & > 20 to 21 MBytes/sec read throughput. > 9 > I do note the rather baffling paragraph in the KZPCC-CE ( > release notes (see: may wrap) page 23: > Y > ftp://ftp.compaq.com/pub/products/alphaserver/storage/controllers/kzpcc/aa-rkl7c-te.pdf  >  > Quote: > @ > "This is explained by reads from RAID devices take longer than > from a single disk drive." > " > (Yes, I know it's poor grammar). > : > Can anyone come up with a logical explanation for this ?? > It certainly goes against conventional wisdom wrt mirrorsets.  >   3 	Well actually... it doesn't go against the wisdom.   < 	With the vdump, you are sending sequential IO.  If you sentA 	a large amount of Random IO to the RAID1 versus the single disk,  	the RAID1 wins.  > 	To explain how or why a single disk with the *CONTROLLER* you6 	are using is slower than a mirror involves what it is? 	doing with sequential IO.  It is round-robining those requests  	to the mirror members, < 	that is not a good thing as the next IO request to the diskA 	is not recognized as sequential at a disk level.  (Plus the disk @ 	has spun past the next LBNs so you are spinning back around and 	changing tracks).  : 	What do more modern/smarter controllers do?  They performE 	sequential pre-fetch at the controller when it recognizes sequential : 	IO coming in and sends those requests on to the drives so= 	when the next batch of IO requests come in they are sittin'    	pretty in the controller cache.  > 	What does that KZPCC-CE do?  Well.. if it did pre-fetch, they: 	would be bragging about it somewhere - they don't so I'm C 	ASSUMING (with reasonable certainty) it doesn't support it.  Which B 	makes one wonder what they use the cache for.  Writeback which isA 	a very good thing.  I guess it helps databases that have to PING @ 	blocks (Bill certainly would enlighten us here) as it can writeF 	them and then immediately turn around and read them (still in cache).  A 	In fairness, it probably is a cost issue.  To stuff the prefetch A 	logic into a controller and qualify it must cost bucks.  The HSJ < 	series doesn't have prefetch.  I think prefetch shows up inA 	the HSx80 series (anyone care to confirm?  Quick google shows no < 	hits with prefetch and hsz70 and the HSZ70 Array Controller, 	HSOF manual has no hits of prefetch in it).  C 	How can you confirm this is exactly what is happening?  Get RZDISK < 	for Unix (or equiv) and go to Page 8 and tweek prefetch to , 	essentially disable it on that single disk:   Page 8 - caching parameters:)   PS                                    1 )   Page code                             8 *   Page length                           18)   Read cache disable bit                0 )   Multiple selection bit                0 )   Write cache enable bit                0 )   Write retention priority              0 )   Demand read retention priority        0 -   Disable prefetch transfer length      65535 )   Minimum prefetch                      0 -   Maximum prefetch                      65535 -   Maximum prefetch ceiling              65535      	Set Maximum prefetch to 512.   ; 	I'll bet you will see a big drop off in throughput on that < 	single drive.  Most drives have 8 MByte cache so that vdump; 	is most likely doing 32-64K IO and a number of them are in 8 	drive cache when the next batch of IO requests come in.  ' 	You can find rzdisk by doing a Google.    				Rob     B Men with walkie-talkie                  I'm home again to you babeC Men with flashlights waving             You know it makes me wonder G Up upon the tower                       Sittin' in the quiet slipstream > The clock reads daylight savin'         Rollin' in the thunder  -                                 -- Neil Young    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 12:26:22 -0500 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) M Subject: Re: KZPCC-CE (three channel RAID controller) - poor read performance 3 Message-ID: <fnn+Gab6EQn4@eisner.encompasserve.org>   a In article <ZDIq29z4GGJu@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:    	Hate when this happens.   > @ > 	To explain how or why a single disk with the *CONTROLLER* you: > 	are using is [faster] than a mirror involves what it isA > 	doing with sequential IO.  It is round-robining those requests  > 	to the mirror members,    	faster - not slower.    				Rob    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 10:40:04 +0100  From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> Y Subject: KZPCC-CE (three channel RAID controller) - poor read performance from RAID-1 fro 4 Message-ID: <bgdcgb$997$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>  ; Gentle colleagues (cross-posted to comp.os.vms since that's  where I mostly live),   5 I'm baffled by the poor read performance when reading + from a RAID-1 set on a KZPCC-CE controller.   9 Scenario: 3-processor ES40 (500 MHz), running Tru64 4.0F, 5 4 Gbytes (4 Mbyte cache), KZPCC-CE with 15K rpm disks / RAID-1 set mirrored over 2 separate SCSI buses.   ; Using vdump to an SDLT-1, we're observing a read throughput : of ca. 44 Mbytes/sec to tape from a single disk.  When the9 disk is mirrored (as configured above), we're getting ca. $ 20 to 21 MBytes/sec read throughput.  7 I do note the rather baffling paragraph in the KZPCC-CE & release notes (see: may wrap) page 23:  W ftp://ftp.compaq.com/pub/products/alphaserver/storage/controllers/kzpcc/aa-rkl7c-te.pdf    Quote:  > "This is explained by reads from RAID devices take longer than from a single disk drive."    (Yes, I know it's poor grammar).  8 Can anyone come up with a logical explanation for this ?= It certainly goes against conventional wisdom wrt mirrorsets.   $ Many thanks in advance for any help,  	 Roy Omond  Blue Bubble Ltd.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 13:55:48 GMT / From: "Ken Farmer" <kfarmer@NOSPAM.OpenVMS.org> Y Subject: PR: HP Delivers Next Step on AlphaServer Roadmap: 32-processor Systems Now Shipp ? Message-ID: <EjuWa.300416$nr.12540086@twister.southeast.rr.com>   J PR: HP Delivers Next Step on AlphaServer Roadmap: 32-processor Systems Now Shipping9 http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=03/08/01/5909099      -- Kenneth Farmer  <><   = Unix:  http://www.EnterpriseUnix.org  |  http://www.Tru64.org ; OpenVMS:  http://www.OpenVMS.org  |  http://dcl.OpenVMS.org B Linux:  http://www.EnterpriseLinux.org  |  http://www.LinuxHPC.org   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 08:43:24 GMT * From: "Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Sun and SCO: Message-ID: <MKpWa.1776$jg.742248@news1.news.adelphia.net>  K "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> ; wrote in message news:bg8sef$97u$3@new-usenet.uk.sun.com... K > > Your responses generally seemed aimed at starting name calling matches,  doJ > > you perhaps need some anger management - maybe a little extra lithium?J > > Someone asked a question, and yes - we were specilating on why so manyL > > people suspect Sun's motives.  Just like I suspect your "public service"D > > motives for spending so much of your time in the VMS conference. > ! > Its my hobby whats your excuse.    Dr. FUD,  J Actually, I find it quit enjoyable - seeing our little friend yabber aboutI inane minutia.  If anything it helps one understand why Sun is getting so 
 desperate.  1 Keep up the good work and giving us a good laugh!    mark   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 09:03:45 GMT * From: "Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Sun and SCO: Message-ID: <R1qWa.1780$jg.744825@news1.news.adelphia.net>  F "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew.Harrison@sun.com> wrote in2 message news:bg8opr$7vd$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...  ? > I havn't detected any like for or much understanding of Linux 0 > on the part of Fred, doesn't stop him posting.   Dr. Sun FUD,  J I have seen some pretty loose drivel, but this sounds like you are gettingI ready to pout.  Were you mistreated as a child or do you always act like,  "Mommy, he started it!"   1 We are getting some classic quotes, as of recent!    mark   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 09:03:45 GMT * From: "Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Sun and SCO: Message-ID: <R1qWa.1781$jg.744835@news1.news.adelphia.net>  K "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> ; wrote in message news:bg86nt$1gq$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...  > Fred Kleinsorge wrote:E > > "Doc.Cypher" <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in message 2 > > news:20030721163441.653.qmail@gacracker.org... > >  > > < > >>>Ahh so your supposition is that Sun is financing SCO to > >>>sue IBM !!!!  > >>H > >>According to Terry Pratchett, use of multiple !s is a sure sign of a > >  > > diseased > >  > >>mind. :) > >> > >  > > 1 > > Yes, but let's not get into giant turtles ;-)  > >  > > C > >>>You didn't consider that the deal could simply be a technology B > >>>licensing deal that has nothing to do with SCO's ongoing case > >>>against IBM ??? > >>>  > >>>How typical.  > >> > > D > > I suppose the implication here is that Sun wants to be seen as a	 supporter I > > of Linux on the one hand, but hedge it's bets on the other hand - but  not inH > > public.  The option to buy a stake in SCO is curious, since the onlyB > > apparent way for that to have been beneficial is for SCO to be
 successful in L > > it's crusade to stop Linux, and force companies to license it's UNIX IP. SoH > > it does question just how firmly Sun really is committed Linux.  The death H > > or crippling of Linux certainly would help Solaris - at least in the short 	 > > term.  > >  >  > Humm so we didn't donate. E > NetBeans, Java, OpenOffice, Mozilla, Grid, Chillisoft, Cubic Spline ( > etc etc to the OpenSource community... > @ > In a previous discussion the only thing of note that an of the> > HP appologists to come up with as leading the Linux, ItaniumA > port. Not that noteworthy when you remember what Linus Torvalds " > thinks of Itanium as a platform.  : > So cut the sactimonous BS it only makes you look foolish   Dr. Andy "KING" FUD -   F http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nf/20030730/bs_nf/21994  G "Sun is slowly and tentatively embracing open-source software, probably L driven by its clients more than a desire to be a leader in the open-source mJ arket," IDC analyst Dan Kusnetzky told NewsFactor. Sun's decision to offerF the Gnome interface is "incremental, not earth shattering" because theL interface has been available with Solaris "one way or another for quite some time."  D So Andy, the truth be known, Sun is being pulled along, gnashing and fighting the whole way...   H "For Sun, '03 has to be the year of execution of product launches -- and  very compelling ones," Day said.   SUN IS IN TROUBLE....  -)    mark   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 13:05:36 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Sun and SCO9 Message-ID: <bgdoj0$ndecq$1@ID-135708.news.uni-berlin.de>   : In article <R1qWa.1781$jg.744835@news1.news.adelphia.net>,- 	"Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com> writes:  > H > http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nf/20030730/bs_nf/21994 > I > "Sun is slowly and tentatively embracing open-source software, probably N > driven by its clients more than a desire to be a leader in the open-source m
 > arket,"   2 If this wasn't so ludicrous it would be hilarious.  B Like most Unix vendors from the early days Sun has been supporting? (and even distributing) "open-source software" since before the > Linuxoids and GNUbots created the term and tried to co-opt the? concept.  Or does no one here remember comp.source.sun?  (silly B question, of course you don't.)  Of course, so did DEC.  Ultrix-32> came with a whole TK50 of "unsuported software".  That was the) nature of Unix almost from the beginning.    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 10:26:02 -0700 1 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)  Subject: Re: Sun and SCO= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0308010926.355670a3@posting.google.com>    Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<bg8okf$7vd$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>... & > HP is just as keen to protect its IP+ > as any other commercial software company.   F It appears HP has been careful to protect others' IP as well: SCO says$ HP is not under threat of a lawsuit.   From EnterpriseUnix.org:< "InformationWeek: SCO Group Threatens Users In Linux Fight  @ Posted by Staff (Friday August 01 2003 @ 11:43AM EDT) views: 1  ? ...Sontag [SCO VP] wouldn't mention names, although he says Sun D Microsystems and Hewlett-Packard are in good standing and won't face legal threats..."   M See http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=12803210   B And HP didn't have to go pay more license money to SCO recently toC ensure all was well, as did Sun and then Microsoft.  Both HP-UX and F Tru64 would be covered by this statement by SCO, as both are now owned by HP.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 09:40:26 GMT * From: "Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com>, Subject: Re: Sun Micro Profit, Revenues Fall: Message-ID: <eAqWa.1787$jg.751371@news1.news.adelphia.net>  K "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> ; wrote in message news:bg8enu$4du$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...    > BS Freddy.  & A little testy - you are Dr. king FUD.  6 http://biz.yahoo.com/rc/030728/tech_sun_options_1.html  K "Sun last week reported an 80 percent decline in profits to $12 million for E its fiscal fourth quarter on a 13 percent decline in revenue to $2.98 I billion. It has suffered more than rivals from the drop in tech spending"   L As the little FUDster would say, "Ooohhh  dear, oohhh dear, what is a littleI wabbit like "the king" going to do with such dramatic downturn in revenue  and profits..."   C Does the "king of fuddery" have a bullseye painted on his arse? :-)    mark   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 09:40:26 GMT * From: "Mark Buda" <buda_NO@SPAM.yahoo.com>O Subject: Re: Sun Micro Profit, Revenues Fall - H-P retains server shipment lead : Message-ID: <eAqWa.1786$jg.751386@news1.news.adelphia.net>  K "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> ; wrote in message news:bg8enu$4du$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...  > > K > >>>SUN is having earnings problems big time and it is most interesting to  > > see  > >>>how you "explain" it away.   L Ooohhhh dear, oh dear...  Dr. King FUD, such interesting twists you apply to you stories...  > > So whats you boards public position now that HP has lost its@ > market lead in Storage and Servers. IBM was the largest server@ > vendor in 2002 and tied with HP as the largest storage vendor.  @ "...results from technology research firm Gartner Dataquest showK Hewlett-Packard holding on to its worldwide lead in server shipments during  the second quarter..."  1 Over 100,000 more than its closest competitior...    http://www.marketwatch.com/news/yhoo/story.asp?source=blq/yhoo&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo&guid=%7BCAD48FC8%2D1EBF%2D4496%2DAC0F%2D4FB0FC869E24%7D  @ > In the subsets of the server market Dell is now the largest PC> > server vendor and Sun the largest UNIX vendor. In almost all) > HP's markets it is losing market share.e  G HP had 30% of the server market sales, up 16% and growing.  The FUDsterl< tends to stretch and make up numbers as he feels are needed.  K Dr. King FUD's little tribe was not even mentioned as being in the top 3...   E Sun kept its fourth-place position with 64,000 server shipments and a4L 5-percent stake. However, Sun's shipments fell 19.4 percent from a year ago.  I Yowzer, dropped 20% from a year ago!!???  No doubt HP was easting away atr it!  :-)   SUN IS IN TROUBLE...   mark   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 03 11:37:14 +0200e) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)r< Subject: Re: Sun tries to woo AlphaServer users away from HP) Message-ID: <NmLt65SMaZvi@elias.decus.ch>C  a In article <Yv6BEcOODsBd@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:is > In article <cf15391e.0307310823.6fdc8b72@posting.google.com>, keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) writes:Rg >> "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message news:<6QidnRmbeI6sXbWiXTWJjQ@metrocast.net>...oG >>> And Winkler when he predicted that Linux would 'eviscerate the softe >>> underbelly of Unix'n >> nB >> The prediction was about Windows, not Linux. (Winkler came from@ >> Compaq, the PC Company.)  I'd have a lot more respect for the( >> predicion if it HAD been about Linux. >  > L > http://www.crn.com/sections/BreakingNews/dailyarchives.asp?ArticleID=35060 > P > "You're going to see Linux and Windows absolutely eviscerate the midrange Unix > market," said Capellas.  > @ > 	Capellas was/is the source and we beat this about quite a bit > 	1.2 years ago.e >   1 Let's lob this one at you then. From 17-DEC-2001:f   http://groups.google.ch/groups?q=%2Beviscerate+%2Bsoft+%2Bunderbelly+%2Bwinkler&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=b61s1u89np59h4jedrcga0m1g08mi4nej8%404ax.com&rnum=1U   Full thread at 0   http://groups.google.ch/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=b61s1u89np59h4jedrcga0m1g08mi4nej8%404ax.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DISO-8859-1%26q%3D%252Beviscerate%2B%252Bsoft%2B%252Bunderbelly%2B%252Bwinklerh      ` > http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=eviscerate%20unix&safe=images&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&lr=&hl=en > + > 	And of course he is right.  Look at Sun!. > 	 > 				Robr >    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 05:59:58 -0700.( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)# Subject: Re: TCP/IP feature requestt= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0308010459.63899319@posting.google.com>   h "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<wKhWa.111$Ji1.44454@news20.bellglobal.com>...N > At a recent OpenVMS symposium in Ottawa, I approached Gaitan D'Antoni with aM > suggestion to add an "FTP API" and a "Telnet API" into "TCP/IP Services formN > OpenVMS". After all, every major OS (including Windows) provides this so whyI > not OpenVMS? (BTW, these modules have been available forever in ProcessV' > Software Corps "TCPware for OpenVMS")S > = > I followed up with an e-mail and this is Gaitan's response.t >  > * * * * *r >  > -----Original Message-----: > From: D'Antoni, Gaitan [mailto:gaitan.dantoni[at]hp.com] > Sent: 2003-07-30 21:21 > To: RIECK, NEIL-= > Cc: Woodcome, Lawrence [mailto:lawrence.woodcome[at]hp.com]<' > Subject: RE: OpenVMS TCP/IP Wish ListF > 
 > Hi Neil, > O > I heard back from the Product Manager and the Technical Leader regarding your F > suggestion. This is one of the items on the list of things to do butO > unfortunately it never seems to make it to the top of the list due to limitedsL > resources and other requirements. I'd say the soonest we could get to this* > would be post V5.5, or sometime in 2005.  > tcpware also has alot of other features ucx doesn't or is just; starting to get ... instead of wasting all this development ; time trying to play catchup with ucx, they should have justo8 bought tcpware, and because it is still based on the vms7 kernel, it runs crisper than either ucx or multinet ...o   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 09:55:59 -0400& From: "Island" <dbturner@islandco.com>5 Subject: Re: The solution is... Rhonda Lea does Mezei / Message-ID: <viksf0rlp66gc9@news.supernews.com>n   Well, that was strange :0|     C "Rhonda Lea Kirk" <rhondaleakirk@worldnet.att.net> wrote in messageh3 news:bgbefh$mv2ve$1@ID-181658.news.uni-berlin.de...M > starwars wrote:  >n; > > Uh huh.  You keep saying that, but you keep coming backe; > > and responding. Sorry, sweetie, but something don't gel  > > (besides your brain).  > > 3 > >> In just a couple of weeks, I'm out of here, so-6 > >> even if you keep fucking with me, I won't see it. > >e > > Where you going? >a > Away from you? ;)F > < > Okay, I'll be serious. I spent three happy years away from> > usenet. Why did I come back? Well, you do know the story, so= > I won't repeat it here. But in spite of your little barb upe: > above, my brain gels just fine, and I see the problem. I> > don't want to be a part of it. I've got better things to do.> > At the moment, I've some loose ends to tie up, some mistakes9 > to fix, but on August 16, I'm gone. Turn out the light,b > babe. I won't be back. >o= > Actually, I guess my destination puts me closer to you, but  > it won't matter. >l: > >> It's not making much sense, but in the end, you don't8 > >> make much sense either, except to the extent you're; > >> the sickest SOB I've ever run across in all my time ons > >> usenet. >-8 > > Does that mean you won't be having phone sex with me > > anymore? > = > Such a clever son-of-a-bitch you are. No. I won't be havingo > phone sex with you.x >25 > Take care of yourself, boy toy. You may be the most = > clear-cut sociopath I've ever run across, but you do have a  > certain charm. >. > rl >    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 10:17:07 -04008 From: "Rhonda Lea Kirk" <rhondaleakirk@worldnet.att.net>5 Subject: Re: The solution is... Rhonda Lea does Mezei 9 Message-ID: <bgdv3t$np5mc$1@ID-181658.news.uni-berlin.de>m   "Island" wrote:    > Well, that was strange > :0|   / Only because you haven't been paying attention.u  ; That's not a criticism, by the way. It would be smarter for>8 everyone to killfile my name in the "from" and "subject"< lines, which will prevent you from having to endure both the3 abusive posts and any replies I might make to them.A   Anon Flood Boy is on a roll.   rl  : > "Rhonda Lea Kirk" <rhondaleakirk@worldnet.att.net> wrote
 in message5 > news:bgbefh$mv2ve$1@ID-181658.news.uni-berlin.de...t > > starwars wrote:w  	 <snipped>n   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 10:38:46 +0100n" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>3 Subject: Re: VMS and Intel, yet another question...h' Message-ID: <3F2A3526.9010001@spam.com>t   Jonathan Boswell wrote:e > Didier Morandi wrote:  >=20> >>http://www.intel.com/ebusiness/pdf/prod/itanium/ds022001.pdf >>C >>When you open the document, you do not find anymore matches. Why?h >=20 >=20J > My supposition is that you have Acrobat running as a plug-in for your b=
 rowser.=20J > Are you by chance accidentally searching with the browser Find in Page = ratherJ > than the plug-in's binoculars button?  (The one-and-only OpenVMS refere= nce is$ > just above the bottom line on P3.) >=20 >  - JB    bingo!   D. --=20 - Didier Morandi sarl au capital de 8 000 euros                      Tout VMS-   19 chemin de la Butte 31400 Toulouse France /   T=E9l: 33(0)5 6120 1964 Fax: 33(0)5 6154 1928 &           http://www.didiermorandi.com$             RCS Toulouse 448 694 851   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Aug 2003 05:54:10 -0700d( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) Subject: Re: Web Apps for VMSb= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0308010454.5bc54883@posting.google.com>o  d "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com> wrote in message news:<bgckf805t@enews4.newsguy.com>...+ > Bob Ceculski <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote:t> > > Kevin, if you want the best ... both for alpha and vax ... >  e7 > > http://www.sss.co.nz/software/purveyor/purveyor.htmg > N > ?!?!?!  Purveyor *was* a nice product, but it's been dead for *how* long?  IK > think Process will provide Hobbyist Licenses for it, but that's about it.> >  > 		Zane  ; purveyor "is" a nice product, and you can still purchase it0; thru process, either commercial or hobbyist ... purveyor isa8 rock solid, and runs on alpha or vax ... there are still; many porducts for it, like yahmail and web printer ... alsod9 support is available from the company above in NZ ... ands9 if you want, you can purchase the source and port it yourh self to itanium!   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 13:53:24 GMT - From: "labadie" <tonari_no_tottoro@127.0.0.1>l Subject: Re: Web Apps for VMS 1 Message-ID: <ohuWa.1272$3C5.972@news.cpqcorp.net>   G "Carlc Internet Services" <cc@nospamming-to-carlc.com> wrote in messagei+ news:U4dWa.416$kl5.23885@news.uswest.net...- > J > I've messed with MySQL a bit on OpenVMS. I can't get it to compile causeD > I don't have the cxx (c++ I think its called) compiler. There is a > pre-compiled   Hello   & You have a pre-built version available   get the Zip built file at ( http://pi-net.dyndns.org/anonymous/kits/  0 Follow the instructions on that page (search for
 MySQL V4.0.13e Software Requirements)  % and as they say at the end of the docs5 _____________________________________________________n   a.. 7   1.. Finally, run the DCL procedure MYSQL_STARTUP.COM.iF         1.. (You might want to add this line to your SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM file.)  &       $ @MYSQL_ROOT:[VMS]MYSQL_STARTUP  + You should now have a running MySQL server!s  6 ______________________________________________________      L Thanks to Alder for his nice job about documenting all this stuff and how to/ install (Mysql, Python for Vms, Zlib, LibBZ2) !u   Regardsr       Grard   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 11:10:51 -0400< From: "Carlc Internet Services" <cc@nospamming-to-carlc.com> Subject: Re: Web Apps for VMS"0 Message-ID: <0qvWa.10$ES4.33471@news.uswest.net>  8 "labadie" <tonari_no_tottoro@127.0.0.1> wrote in message+ news:ohuWa.1272$3C5.972@news.cpqcorp.net...s >lI > "Carlc Internet Services" <cc@nospamming-to-carlc.com> wrote in messaget- > news:U4dWa.416$kl5.23885@news.uswest.net...I > >uL > > I've messed with MySQL a bit on OpenVMS. I can't get it to compile causeF > > I don't have the cxx (c++ I think its called) compiler. There is a > > pre-compiled >) > Hello- >g( > You have a pre-built version available >t > get the Zip built file atn* > http://pi-net.dyndns.org/anonymous/kits/ >-2 > Follow the instructions on that page (search for > MySQL V4.0.13  > Software Requirements)  H Yeah, I tried it... I required openssl from HP installed and a few other things I DONT USE!  E I build my own openssl (newest version) but since I could not installa7 the MySQL pre-built, I started working on my own build.t  ? Now, if you want to build a version of MySQL V4.0.13 that's notTC going to require 3 different things to be preloaded, I will be MOREo= than happy to load it up on the test box and see how it does!    Thanks,  Carl ==================== http://www.carlc.com/   =       "Price, Performance, Quality. Choose any two you like."r   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2003 12:48:40 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com/ Subject: Re: [Change topic -> OT] Pence/Pennies/? Message-ID: <OFF7977F4E.8B56E3E3-ON85256D75.005C34A6@metso.com>a  8 Bobs and half-crowns I know, but what is/was  "tanners"?  4 From:  Rob.Buxton@wcc.govt.nz on 07/31/2003 08:44 PM  ( Please respond to Rob.Buxton@wcc.govt.nz   To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:n  2 Subject:    Re: [Change topic -> OT] Pence/Pennies   <snip>  - Not to mention tanners, bobs and  half-crownsi   <snip>   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.422 ************************