1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 10 Aug 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 440       Contents:4 $$$ PayPal $$$ (by patrick stephens psteph2@lsu.edu)+ Calculating a delta time from two absolutes / Re: Calculating a delta time from two absolutes A Re: Can VMS still be improved?  Yes!  (Was Re: Netware is no VMS) * Re: Gaining control of build dependency...* Re: Gaining control of build dependency...* Re: Gaining control of build dependency...* RE: Gaining control of build dependency...& patch corrupts product install utility* Re: patch corrupts product install utility* Re: patch corrupts product install utility* Re: patch corrupts product install utility Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates  Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates  Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates  Sizes of logical name tables  Re: Sizes of logical name tables  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 04:59:44 GMT - From: JohnFarber928@hotmail.com (John Farber) = Subject: $$$ PayPal $$$ (by patrick stephens psteph2@lsu.edu) * Message-ID: <358329681003@192.168.113.131>  > Follow the directions below and in two weeks you'll have up to> $20000.00 in your PayPal account. There is a very high rate ofC participation in the program because of its low investment and high ) rate of return. Just $5.00 to one person!    THAT'S ALL !!!  B If you are a skeptic and don't think the program will work, I urge8 you to give it a try anyway! It REALLY WORKS! Why do you' think so many people are promoting it ?   F LOOK AT IT THIS WAY: If the Program is a total failure for you and you4 never get even $1.00 in return, your total loss willE be the $5.00! If you are not yet a paypal member, there is no risk at 7 all!!! If the Program is only moderately successful for D you, your PayPal account will have several hundred dollars deposited1 into it within the next few days! If you actively C participate in the Program, you could have up to $20,000.00 in your   PayPal account within two weeks!  ' Now let me tell you the simple details.    Getting Started!!   E If you're not already a user of PayPal, the very first thing you need 7 to do is go to PayPal and sign up. It takes two minutes B and Pay Pal will deposit $5.00 in your account just for becoming a9 member. That makes this program's total cost $0!!! Follow & this link to open your PayPal account:   https://www.paypal.com  D Now log into your PayPal account, and send the PayPal account of the8 person listed in Position 1 $5.00 PayPal will ask you to; select type. (Select "service" and put "$5.00 donation" for A subject.) When person in Position 1 receives notification of your > payment, you can simply copy this page and change the names in> position #1 & #2 & #3 as instructed. Remember, only the person? in Position 1 on the list gets your $5.00 donation. Send them a = donation then remove #1PayPal account from the list. Move the E other two accounts up & add your Paypal account to #3 position. After , you have retyped the names in the new order,  C IMMEDIATELY send the revised message to as many people as possible. 7 PROMOTE! PROMOTE! The more you promote the Program, the ? more you will receive in donations!! That's all there is to it.   B When your name reaches Position 1 (usually in less than a week) it9 will be your turn to receive the cash. $5.00 will be sent F to your PayPal account by people just like you who are willing to send6 $5.00 dontation and receive up to $20,000 in less than? two weeks. Because there are only (3) names on the list you can - anticipate 80% of your cash within two weeks.   @ Anytime you find yourself short on cash just take out your $5.00< donation program and send it to 50 prospects. Imagine if youB sent it to 100 or even more. Most people spend more than $5 on the5 lottery every week with no real hope of ever winning.     THIS PROGRAM WORKS - JUST TRY IT  5 POSITION # 1 PAYPAL ACCOUNT: pricewatch01@hotmail.com   - POSITION # 2 PAYPAL ACCOUNT: jabjwhat@aol.com   + POSITION # 3 PAYPAL ACCOUNT: lamsmo@aol.com   * Integrity and honesty make this plan work.I Participants who actively promote this program will average between $8000  and 2 $12000 and receive the donations within two weeks.  E This is not a chain letter. You are simply making a donation of $5.00 5 to another person. The Program does not violate title / 18 section 1302 of the Postal and lottery code.   8 Remember -TIME is of the essence. YOU can choose to liveB Paycheck-to-Paycheck or live FREE from FINANCIAL BONDAGE. Become a9 part of the donation program and help people help people.   ) This program is about helping each other!   ) Success is a journey - Not a destination!    Start Your Journey TODAY!!!!        M ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- M Would you like to reach millions of customers for only the cost of bandwidth? K You can post messages like this to thousands of newsgroups with a simple to I use software application called Message Poster 2003.  For more details on * this extremely affordable software, visit:  http://www.exibitionsoftware.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 05:36:53 GMT + From: Jeff Cameron <JCam90502@jcameron.com> 4 Subject: Calculating a delta time from two absolutes2 Message-ID: <BB5B27D1.A875%JCam90502@jcameron.com>  D Can anyone offer a DCL example of using the lexical functions F$TIMEB () and F$CVTIME to calculate the elapsed or delta time between twoG absolute times without breaking down the days hours minutes and seconds @ And calculating a difference using a semi complicated algorithm?  1 Suppose I have a command procedure, and I need to A find out how long a certain operation takes. Well I save the time E before the action by $TIME1 = F$TIME(), then I do the action, and get < the absolute time again from $TIME2 = F$TIME(). Now how do I7 calculate the elapsed time between these two absolutes?    Thank you in advance.    ------------------------------   Date: 10 Aug 03 09:16:21 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) 8 Subject: Re: Calculating a delta time from two absolutes) Message-ID: <B3yzXxxSf90B@elias.decus.ch>   ` In article <BB5B27D1.A875%JCam90502@jcameron.com>, Jeff Cameron <JCam90502@jcameron.com> writes:F > Can anyone offer a DCL example of using the lexical functions F$TIMED > () and F$CVTIME to calculate the elapsed or delta time between twoI > absolute times without breaking down the days hours minutes and seconds B > And calculating a difference using a semi complicated algorithm? > 3 > Suppose I have a command procedure, and I need to C > find out how long a certain operation takes. Well I save the time G > before the action by $TIME1 = F$TIME(), then I do the action, and get > > the absolute time again from $TIME2 = F$TIME(). Now how do I9 > calculate the elapsed time between these two absolutes?  >  > Thank you in advance.  >   4 Try using a Google Groups search with the following:   comp.os.vms time difference dcl   O There are various solutions there. Pick the one you feel most comfortable with.    ------------------------------   Date: 10 Aug 03 09:07:40 +0200) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture) J Subject: Re: Can VMS still be improved?  Yes!  (Was Re: Netware is no VMS)) Message-ID: <5+Dt3sZIOio8@elias.decus.ch>   [ In article <3F351A07.5DED628C@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > Paul Sture wrote:    <snip>     >>  N >> Incorrect. I just did a STOP/ID on the queue manager (my home system folks,O >> don't try this at work:-)), and could happily talk to an existing batch job.  > G > Check your setup and make sure you only have one queue manager. Also, F > please cite your VMS version. This behavior appears to have changed. >   ' V7.3-1 (Alpha). Only one queue manager.     J > At a  former site, we had multiple queue managers. Don't recall why, butF > it was necessary and made queue management at startup time rather anH > interesting exercise. In that case, it was possible to kill one of theJ > print queue managers and have the batch queue manager and the batch jobs > under its control survived.  > G > Just tried this on my V7.2-2 system here. The QUEUE_MANAGER restarted 	 > itself:  >  > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sys/b E > OpenVMS V7.2-2  on node DJAS01   9-AUG-2003 10:57:28.36  Uptime  48 
 > 15:40:29I >   Pid    Process Name    State  Pri      I/O       CPU       Page flts   > Pages D > 000000A2 BATCH_1         LEF      5      170   0 00:00:00.40       > 337     73  B # > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sys/proc=q* E > OpenVMS V7.2-2  on node DJAS01   9-AUG-2003 10:57:38.72  Uptime  48 
 > 15:40:39I >   Pid    Process Name    State  Pri      I/O       CPU       Page flts   > Pages D > 0000004C QUEUE_MANAGER   HIB      8      301   0 00:00:00.55       > 199    145     > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ stop/id=4c  > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sys/b E > OpenVMS V7.2-2  on node DJAS01   9-AUG-2003 10:57:48.83  Uptime  48 
 > 15:40:50I >   Pid    Process Name    State  Pri      I/O       CPU       Page flts   > Pages D > 000000A2 BATCH_1         LEF      4      170   0 00:00:00.40       > 337     73  B ( > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh que/al sys$batch/ > Batch queue SYS$BATCH, available, on DJAS01::  > 6 >   Entry  Jobname         Username             Status6 >   -----  -------         --------             ------9 >       1  WAIT            DDACHTERA            Executing # > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sys/proc=q* E > OpenVMS V7.2-2  on node DJAS01   9-AUG-2003 10:58:09.69  Uptime  48 
 > 15:41:10I >   Pid    Process Name    State  Pri      I/O       CPU       Page flts   > Pages D > 000000A3 QUEUE_MANAGER   HIB      8      244   0 00:00:00.36       > 167    126     >   I Um, I'll have to try and replicate that (can't do it right now, as I have I a few batch/Print jobs queued). I didn't look to see if the queue manager 4 had restarted, but simply did a start/queue/manager.   ------------------------------    Date: 10 Aug 2003 00:02:57 -07002 From: brendantregear@hotmail.com (Brendan Tregear)3 Subject: Re: Gaining control of build dependency... < Message-ID: <cbae7795.0308092302.63e264e@posting.google.com>  f jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message news:<o6b2jvgmo34selni85gt0hlftfuccidmgk@4ax.com>...L > Even adding a new constant is a potential for a bug to show up (hell, evenH > adding a comment ;-), and you neve know when you might need to rebuildK > those other programs under a stressful situation (e.g., an outage of some D > kind).  That is not the time to find out that a bug was introduced > somewhere.  @ Good point. The idea is that *if* I get this working we can save> significant build times for developers during their day-to-dayD fix-build-test cycle. Because the local includes files are generatedF from the master include file, if we need to release a build, we have aE utility that deletes all local include files, to ensure that the next  build starts from scratch.   > I > Isn't easier to, rather than use compiled-in parameters/constants, have J > them read in from a data file?  Then you don't need to recompile at all.  C Could well be. Inertia has lead us down this path... ain't no going  back yet! :)   ------------------------------    Date: 10 Aug 2003 00:12:41 -07002 From: brendantregear@hotmail.com (Brendan Tregear)3 Subject: Re: Gaining control of build dependency... = Message-ID: <cbae7795.0308092312.6817c050@posting.google.com>   c lewis@spyder.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) wrote in message news:<bgrfr9$rlt$2@newslocal.mitre.org>...  > brendan@scanoptics.com.au (Brendan Tregear) writes in article <4ea25e04.0308051640.153088e4@posting.google.com> dated 5 Aug 2003 17:40:08 -0700: > 4 > >local_include_file DEPENDS_ON global_include_file > >    RUN UTILITY COM FILE  > > E > >Now, every time the global include file is updated, my utility com I > >file will run. This works fine, except there is now a build dependency 9 > >that means the source file gets rebuilt every time the I > >global_include_file changes, which is what i don't want! What I really  > >want is this: > > ? > >IF global_include_file is newer than local_include_file THEN  > >   RUN UTILITY COM FILE > >ENDIF > 5 > That's what the above MMS rule is supposed to do.    > - > --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org   6 Hi Keith, thanks for the comments. As I understand it:  1 local_include_file DEPENDS_ON global_include_file      RUN UTILITY COM FILE  B checks the revision time of the target (local_include_file) to theE source (global_include_file). If the source is newer than the target, F the target is rebuilt. Therefore, utility.com gets run. The problem is; utility.com may *not* update local_include_file! So even if 5 utility.com has worked out there is no need to update E local_include_file, its too late, the target will get rebuilt (and up F to the object file (which I didn't include in my post) and finally the executable). By writing:  < IF global_include_file is newer than local_include_file THEN    RUN UTILITY COM FILE  ENDIF  ... 0 target_object_file DEPENDS_ON local_include_file  1 local_include_file DEPENDS_ON global_include_file   F I can update local_include_file *before* the dependency is worked out,B the utility com file may or may not update the local include file.D Then the dependency is checked, and if the local_include_file hasn't6 been updated, the target executable won't get rebuilt.   Brendan    ------------------------------    Date: 10 Aug 2003 00:18:42 -07002 From: brendantregear@hotmail.com (Brendan Tregear)3 Subject: Re: Gaining control of build dependency... = Message-ID: <cbae7795.0308092318.13bbba82@posting.google.com>    Hi,   C First of all, thanks to everyone for posting, it's been more than I F expected! Thanks Bob Koehler, I think you're solution may well help meD crack this nut! Your solution allows me to run my com file each timeE before a build - before any dependencies are checked; I'll try it out & tomorrow and let you know how it goes.  ] John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> wrote in message news:<1030806155546.1951A-100000@Ives.egh.com>... # > On 6 Aug 2003, Bob Koehler wrote:  > @ > Another possibility, does MMS allow you to define a callout toG > determine "older"?  Or is it just based on file creation/modification @ > dates?  If it allows you to define a method to determine which? > is older, you could use your utility to create a test version B > of local_include_file from global_include_file, compare the test? > version to the current version, and if identical, then return   > the appropriate status to MMS. >  > HTH.  A Well, in an ideal world that's what I'd like to have, some way of B modifying 'DEPENDS_ON' to mean something other than 'is the sourceD file newer than the target file.' I've scoured the MMS documentation) and haven't been able to find anything...    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 06:41:00 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 3 Subject: RE: Gaining control of build dependency... 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIEEAFHMAA.tom@kednos.com>   ; Do you gave a different suffixes for the two include files?  something like   foo.lin:  foo.inc  	UTILITY_COM_FILE foo.inc    >-----Original Message----- : >From: Brendan Tregear [mailto:brendantregear@hotmail.com]' >Sent: Sunday, August 10, 2003 12:13 AM  >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com4 >Subject: Re: Gaining control of build dependency... >  > : >lewis@spyder.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) wrote in message + >news:<bgrfr9$rlt$2@newslocal.mitre.org>... A >> brendan@scanoptics.com.au (Brendan Tregear) writes in article  D ><4ea25e04.0308051640.153088e4@posting.google.com> dated 5 Aug 2003  >17:40:08 -0700: >>  5 >> >local_include_file DEPENDS_ON global_include_file  >> >    RUN UTILITY COM FILE >> >F >> >Now, every time the global include file is updated, my utility comJ >> >file will run. This works fine, except there is now a build dependency: >> >that means the source file gets rebuilt every time theJ >> >global_include_file changes, which is what i don't want! What I really >> >want is this:  >> >@ >> >IF global_include_file is newer than local_include_file THEN >> >   RUN UTILITY COM FILE 	 >> >ENDIF  >>  6 >> That's what the above MMS rule is supposed to do.   >>  . >> --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org > 7 >Hi Keith, thanks for the comments. As I understand it:  > 2 >local_include_file DEPENDS_ON global_include_file >    RUN UTILITY COM FILE  > C >checks the revision time of the target (local_include_file) to the F >source (global_include_file). If the source is newer than the target,G >the target is rebuilt. Therefore, utility.com gets run. The problem is < >utility.com may *not* update local_include_file! So even if6 >utility.com has worked out there is no need to updateF >local_include_file, its too late, the target will get rebuilt (and upG >to the object file (which I didn't include in my post) and finally the  >executable). By writing:  > = >IF global_include_file is newer than local_include_file THEN  >   RUN UTILITY COM FILE >ENDIF >.... 1 >target_object_file DEPENDS_ON local_include_file  > 2 >local_include_file DEPENDS_ON global_include_file > G >I can update local_include_file *before* the dependency is worked out, C >the utility com file may or may not update the local include file. E >Then the dependency is checked, and if the local_include_file hasn't 7 >been updated, the target executable won't get rebuilt.  >  >Brendan >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). @ >Version: 6.0.506 / Virus Database: 303 - Release Date: 8/1/2003 >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.506 / Virus Database: 303 - Release Date: 8/1/2003    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 14:41:04 GMT 4 From: "Phillip R Sobottke" <psobottke@ameritech.net>/ Subject: patch corrupts product install utility A Message-ID: <4QsZa.19661$Vx2.10179887@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com>   H I have version openvms version 7.3-1, and when installing the pcsi v0100K critical update.. it installs but then corrupts the product install utility G preventing the installation of additional patches.  Any ideas on how to  overcome this?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 11:16:39 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 3 Subject: Re: patch corrupts product install utility ' Message-ID: <3F366FE7.1C135C13@fsi.net>    Phillip R Sobottke wrote:  > J > I have version openvms version 7.3-1, and when installing the pcsi v0100M > critical update.. it installs but then corrupts the product install utility I > preventing the installation of additional patches.  Any ideas on how to  > overcome this?  B I don't think you want/need to apply that patch to V7.3-1, do you?   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  + Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 16:13:12 +0000 (UTC) 7 From: hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) 3 Subject: Re: patch corrupts product install utility / Message-ID: <bh5quo$2aa$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>   x In article <4QsZa.19661$Vx2.10179887@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com>, "Phillip R Sobottke" <psobottke@ameritech.net> writes:I !I have version openvms version 7.3-1, and when installing the pcsi v0100 L !critical update.. it installs but then corrupts the product install utilityH !preventing the installation of additional patches.  Any ideas on how to !overcome this?   D I installed UPDATE after having installed PCSI V0100, and I have notJ encountered this problem.  Can you provide us with some more detail (errorN messages)?  Please check the archives of this newsgroup (at Google) for recentM (within the past month) discussions regarding the use of PCSI V0100, as well.     !  !    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 16:47:18 GMT % From: "Mike Naime" <mnaime@kc.rr.com> 3 Subject: Re: patch corrupts product install utility ; Message-ID: <qGuZa.76670$7O4.1798776@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com>   K PCSI V100 is a pre-requisite  to UPDATE V100.  The answer is easy actually.    Either. L A.) Simply log out/in after applying the patch.  Then apply the Update, LAN,J and RMS patch.  There are some DCL table changes that make the new product1 install crash if you still have the old logicals.  OR. 1 B.) Reboot your system after applying each patch.   < Option A works ok, and takes less time.  Remember to use theJ /SAVE_RECOVERY_DATA switch after applying the PCSI patch if you want to be% able to back out a patch application.       = Phillip R Sobottke <psobottke@ameritech.net> wrote in message ; news:4QsZa.19661$Vx2.10179887@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com... J > I have version openvms version 7.3-1, and when installing the pcsi v0100E > critical update.. it installs but then corrupts the product install  utility I > preventing the installation of additional patches.  Any ideas on how to  > overcome this? >  >    ------------------------------  ! Date: Sun, 10 Aug 03 09:52:55 GMT  From: jmfbahciv@aol.com $ Subject: Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates+ Message-ID: <bh58cu$mlg$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   , In article <868yq5zomw.fsf@fuckup.hack.org>,&    Mikael Cardell <mc@hack.org> wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > G >> Everybody has to learn about I/O and memory  management.  What might A >> work stand-alone with one flavor of program, will not work for D >> others.  If they had learned the do's and don'ts of I/O which wasC >> in every program on the -10, the lore would have carried over to  >> DOS and Windows.    > B >I understand now. I agree completely that every programmer has to >learn these things. > G >However, I don't think Bill Gates and Paul Allen, the original authors E >of MS/Altair BASIC, had much to do with the programming of MS DOS or F >MS Windows. I would be very surprised if Gates had even looked at the& >code of any part of, say, MS Windows.  A Perhaps not, but they set the policy (which would have slued into = coporate folklore) of how to do their biz.  IF their business = plan had been geared to software development rather than just = software distribution, the funding allotments would have been  very different.      > A >My guess is that Bill was mainly a manager type and Paul was out D >playing venture capitalist, sponsoring basketball teams and playing? >with his home hacking stuff. I really doubt anyone of them had G >anything to do with programming Microsoft products after the BASIC for  >Altair.  < So what?  How a product gets produced is directly related to3 how it gets funded.  This is how companies are run.    /BAH    ' Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.    ------------------------------  ! Date: Sun, 10 Aug 03 09:56:48 GMT  From: jmfbahciv@aol.com $ Subject: Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates+ Message-ID: <bh58k6$mlg$2@bob.news.rcn.net>   / In article <bgtj2h$i34$1@tabloid.uwaterloo.ca>, 2    dfevans@bcr10.uwaterloo.ca (David Evans) wrote:H >In article <bgtate$60n$4@bob.news.rcn.net>,  <jmfbahciv@aol.com> wrote:4 >>In article <3f3f0cd2.12775862@news.supernews.com>,% >>   ian@hammo.com (paramucho) wrote: G >>>One of the big problems with cramped spaces was that users would use C >>>up every available byte of user space available, thus increasing 6 >>>system size would render their programs inoperable. >>@ >>This makes no sense.  That would be problem only if their code: >>(or data placement) was hardwired to absolute addresses. >> > E >  In my experiences in micro land, absolute addresses were the rule. F >Not many folks bothered with relocating loaders when you only had one> >64K address space and something like the 6502 makes it pretty5 >irritating to write fully position-independant code.   E Wait a minute...this doesn't make any sense.  Code had to be location B independent if it can be loaded into core starting at any address. > + >>Users learned how about memory management + >>and the difference between code and data.  >> > @ >  On weenie machines there was no such high-falutin excitement.   Define weenie machines.      /BAH  ' Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.    ------------------------------  + Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 16:00:54 +0000 (UTC) . From: dfevans@bcr10.uwaterloo.ca (David Evans)$ Subject: Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates/ Message-ID: <bh5q7m$ddm$1@tabloid.uwaterloo.ca>   G In article <bh58k6$mlg$2@bob.news.rcn.net>,  <jmfbahciv@aol.com> wrote: 0 >In article <bgtj2h$i34$1@tabloid.uwaterloo.ca>,3 >   dfevans@bcr10.uwaterloo.ca (David Evans) wrote: I >>In article <bgtate$60n$4@bob.news.rcn.net>,  <jmfbahciv@aol.com> wrote: 5 >>>In article <3f3f0cd2.12775862@news.supernews.com>, & >>>   ian@hammo.com (paramucho) wrote:H >>>>One of the big problems with cramped spaces was that users would useD >>>>up every available byte of user space available, thus increasing7 >>>>system size would render their programs inoperable.  >>> A >>>This makes no sense.  That would be problem only if their code ; >>>(or data placement) was hardwired to absolute addresses.  >>>  >>F >>  In my experiences in micro land, absolute addresses were the rule.G >>Not many folks bothered with relocating loaders when you only had one ? >>64K address space and something like the 6502 makes it pretty 6 >>irritating to write fully position-independant code. > F >Wait a minute...this doesn't make any sense.  Code had to be locationC >independent if it can be loaded into core starting at any address.   H   That was my point: frequently one could not load code into core at anyH address and expect it to work.  The assembler would be provided with theJ expected start address and resolve labels to absolute addresses.  As thereH was no proper link loader (loading the code simply consisted of stuffingH the bytes in memory beginning at the proper address) no relocation could be done.  , >>>Users learned how about memory management, >>>and the difference between code and data. >>>  >>A >>  On weenie machines there was no such high-falutin excitement.  >  >Define weenie machines.   >    >   I realise I may have misunderstood what you meant by "memoryE management." Things such as the KIM-1 or the Commodore 8-bit machines E (the micros that I have the most experience with) had no real concept ? of physical vs. virtual addresses or what not.  While there was E sometimes memory management hardware of some sort, it wasn't the kind - of thing that you could use to write a pager.    --  M David Evans          (NeXTMail/MIME OK)             dfevans@bbcr.uwaterloo.ca M Ph.D. Candidate, Computer/Synth Junkie     http://bbcr.uwaterloo.ca/~dfevans/ M University of Waterloo         "Default is the value selected by the composer M Ontario, Canada           overridden by your command." - Roland TR-707 Manual    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 05:48:03 GMT + From: Jeff Cameron <JCam90502@jcameron.com> % Subject: Sizes of logical name tables 2 Message-ID: <BB5B2A6F.A877%JCam90502@jcameron.com>  J I know the UAF quota value JTQuota governs the size of a job's job logicalK name table. What parameters or quotas govern the size of the process, group  and system logical name tables.   J I have an old utility (executable image) written by a company no longer inJ business called SIMPART. The company's name escapes me now which simulatesK certain physical interactions in physics. It is aborting with a simple text / message : "VMS error - Logical name table full"   J When I run the image interactively, the error does not occur. When it runsK with all of it's other images and scripts in a multi-process job is when it  aborts.   K I have already determined it is not the job table that is running out, as I K have increased the Jtquota for the account that it runs under, and modified J the supporting scripts and tested the image by itself, and it does not use" the job tables to define logicals.  I How can I determine which logical name table it is compalining about, and ! How do I increase the table size?   
 Thank you.        ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 09:53:11 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ) Subject: Re: Sizes of logical name tables & Message-ID: <3F365C57.30EB37B@fsi.net>   Jeff Cameron wrote:  > L > I know the UAF quota value JTQuota governs the size of a job's job logicalM > name table. What parameters or quotas govern the size of the process, group ! > and system logical name tables.  > L > I have an old utility (executable image) written by a company no longer inL > business called SIMPART. The company's name escapes me now which simulatesM > certain physical interactions in physics. It is aborting with a simple text 1 > message : "VMS error - Logical name table full"  > L > When I run the image interactively, the error does not occur. When it runsM > with all of it's other images and scripts in a multi-process job is when it 	 > aborts.  > M > I have already determined it is not the job table that is running out, as I M > have increased the Jtquota for the account that it runs under, and modified L > the supporting scripts and tested the image by itself, and it does not use$ > the job tables to define logicals. > K > How can I determine which logical name table it is compalining about, and # > How do I increase the table size?  >  > Thank you.  G I'll be interested (most curiosity, though) to see the answers to these C questions. I've seen application implementations that use *TONS* of ( process-level logicals with no problems.  H I can only suggest to remember that JTQuota is stated in bytes (per HELPF ADD /JTQUOTA in AUTHORIZE). Try jacking it up to some outrageous valueC like 65535 (64K) or (WSQUOTA * 512) and try running the test again.   C Of course, its always possible that the app.'s is returning a bogus , status value and thus a bogus error message.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.440 ************************                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    RT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.46 accepted.  <<< PORT 147,162,156,46,200,346 >>> 200 Port 200.34 at Host 147.162.156.