/ INFO-VAX	Sat, 04 Jan 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 7       Contents:P =?UTF-8?B?UkU6IEkganVzdCB3YW50ZWQgdG8gc2hhcmUgYSBub3RlIEkgc2Vu?=	=?UTF-8?B?dCB0b) BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - RE: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - RE: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) - Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument) % Re: Cluster crash, ethernet problem ? / Re: ComputerWorld: HP Is Homeland Merger  Model / Re: ComputerWorld: HP Is Homeland Merger  Model 4 Re: Demise of VMS (and most other operating systems)4 Re: Demise of VMS (and most other operating systems)4 Does any version of VMS support Unix message queues?' Re: F$GETDVI ("AVL") in an IF statement ' Re: F$GETDVI ("AVL") in an IF statement 9 FA: Digital DEC LA70 Personal Dot-Matrix Printer Like-new 0 FA: DIGITAL DEC VAX H8571-F MMJ Cable Adapter NR Finding info on Alpha Systems  Re: FTP + FW: new version of OpenVMS password cracker D Re: I just wanted to share a note I sen	t to the group this mornin	gC RE: I just wanted to share a note I sent to the group this mornin	g  Re: is VMS really easy to use? Re: is VMS really easy to use? Java Kit link broken?  Re: Java Kit link broken?  Re: JPEG viewer?+ Re: new version of OpenVMS password cracker + RE: new version of OpenVMS password cracker @ Re: Now "Is HELP on unix" [WAS : RE: is VMS really easy to use?] Re: OpenVMS Technical Journal & Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when...& Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when...& RE: Recovering SYSTEM password when...& Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when...& Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when... Re: Sad news from engineering  Re: Sad news from engineering 2 Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linux2 Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linux2 Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linux2 Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linux2 RE: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, LinuxL Search list logical name translation for JAVA$CLASSPATH using VMS Java 1.3.1 Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth  Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth @ Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail@ Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail@ Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail@ Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail@ Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail Re: VMS troubles Re: VMS troubles Re: VMS troubles0 wallpaper for the "normal" DECWindows interface?4 Re: wallpaper for the "normal" DECWindows interface?* Re: [OpenVMS IPF] Boot Contest - I lost...+ Re: [OT] Lotteries (was Re: Happy New Year) + Re: [OT] Lotteries (was Re: Happy New Year) + Re: [OT] Lotteries (was Re: Happy New Year)   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 16:00:26 -05005 From: "Bochnik, William J" <William_Bochnik@acml.com> Y Subject: =?UTF-8?B?UkU6IEkganVzdCB3YW50ZWQgdG8gc2hhcmUgYSBub3RlIEkgc2Vu?=	=?UTF-8?B?dCB0b O Message-ID: <2D75787AAF09C64481BDFD89113BE6D50BCEF5@ac2kama0102.ac.lp.acml.com>   K way to take an argument to the extreem.  I never said look and sound alike, L but for practical reasons 1 language makes sense.  Now to take your argument> to the extreem, we should have every possible language on all 
 road signs maps instructions
 directions
 medicine's government websites  etc etc etc     not very practical now is it.    H Expecting everyone to at least speak 1 common language is a far cry fromL Naziism.  Next thing you'll tell me that obeying the same laws leads to that too.   -----Original Message-----  - From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org 1 [mailto:koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org]   Sent: Fri 1/3/2003 3:00 PM   To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  Cc: L Subject: RE: I just wanted to share a note I sent to the group this mornin g      
 In articleD <2D75787AAF09C64481BDFD89113BE6D5B3600A@ac2kama0102.ac.lp.acml.com>,7 "Bochnik, William J" <William_Bochnik@acml.com> writes:   C > oficially correct English wasnt the national language, but it was  convention  H > that it was.  My wife's grandparents came here not speaking a word of K > english, but never even thought to speak their home language outside the  L > house.  ever.  They loved and respected this country and made every effort  I > to fit in while not losing site of their past.  It's time we relearned   > this....    H  No thanks.  The Nazis thought everyone should look and sound the same. <  My uncle and great uncle risked thier lives stopping them.       I The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and J confidential information and is intended only for the use of the person(s)L named above.  If you are not the intended recipient, or an employee or agentF responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, anyK review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this communication is J strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contactD the sender immediately by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of theI original message. Please note that we do not accept account orders and/or J instructions by e-mail, and therefore will not be responsible for carrying$ out such orders and/or instructions.   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 11:32:22 -0800 " From: cstranslations@msn.com (Joe)2 Subject: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)= Message-ID: <d56d1c2d.0301031132.5632c762@posting.google.com>   D I can't find it in the docs (and have never made use of this before)8 but in BASIC if you put "bannas" around an argument in aD function/subroutine call the argument is treated as being passed "byA value" into the function/subroutine. When this is done - do these < variables live at the top of the stack (they would have to)?  F It's a long story involving code using ASTs/timers. What I'm wonderingD (and am relatively confident of) is that in the below code expecting; "ast" to print a "4" after printing "hello" is an erroneous  expectation.   Any comments???    thanks joe     1 sub ast(integer param, integer r0, integer r1,  &          integer PC, integer PS)   2    option type = explicit, constant type = integer      print "hello"    print param   end sub   	 sub MySub   2    option type = explicit, constant type = integer  (    external integer function  sys$dclast!    external integer           ast   "    declare integer result, SomeNum      SomeNum = 4*    result  = sys$dclast(ast, (SomeNum),  )   end sub   / option type = explicit, constant type = integer    call sys$setast(0 by value) 
 call MySub call sys$setast(1 by value)   	 while (1)     call sys$hiber( ) next   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 11:38:02 -0800# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 6 Subject: RE: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEKBGFAA.tom@kednos.com>   H You need to determine what "pass by value" means for Basic.  In the case> of PL/I it means that the caller makes a copy of the thing and% passes a pointer to it to the callee.    >-----Original Message----- * >From: Joe [mailto:cstranslations@msn.com]( >Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 11:32 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com2 >Subject: BASIC and "pass by value" --> (argument) >  > E >I can't find it in the docs (and have never made use of this before) 9 >but in BASIC if you put "bannas" around an argument in a E >function/subroutine call the argument is treated as being passed "by B >value" into the function/subroutine. When this is done - do these= >variables live at the top of the stack (they would have to)?  > G >It's a long story involving code using ASTs/timers. What I'm wondering E >(and am relatively confident of) is that in the below code expecting < >"ast" to print a "4" after printing "hello" is an erroneous
 >expectation.  >  >Any comments??? >  >thanks  >joe >  > 2 >sub ast(integer param, integer r0, integer r1,  &  >        integer PC, integer PS) > 3 >   option type = explicit, constant type = integer  >  >   print "hello"  >   print param  >  >end sub > 
 >sub MySub > 3 >   option type = explicit, constant type = integer  > ) >   external integer function  sys$dclast " >   external integer           ast > # >   declare integer result, SomeNum  >  >   SomeNum = 4 + >   result  = sys$dclast(ast, (SomeNum),  )  >  >end sub > 0 >option type = explicit, constant type = integer >  >call sys$setast(0 by value) >call MySub  >call sys$setast(1 by value) > 
 >while (1) >   call sys$hiber( )  >next  >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). B >Version: 6.0.435 / Virus Database: 244 - Release Date: 12/30/2002 >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A Version: 6.0.435 / Virus Database: 244 - Release Date: 12/30/2002    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 21:02:01 +0100 6 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk>6 Subject: Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)) Message-ID: <3E15EC39.6080000@vajhoej.dk>    Tom Linden wrote: J > You need to determine what "pass by value" means for Basic.  In the case@ > of PL/I it means that the caller makes a copy of the thing and' > passes a pointer to it to the callee.    ????  & "pass by value" has a meaning in VMS !  8 So unless otherwise noted, then I would consider it fair( to assume that it is in the VMS meaning.   Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 11:52:42 -0800 5 From: Craig A. Berry <craigberry@nospam.telocity.com> 6 Subject: Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)6 Message-ID: <20030103135241798-0600@news.telocity.com>  ? In <d56d1c2d.0301031132.5632c762@posting.google.com> Joe wrote: F > I can't find it in the docs (and have never made use of this before): > but in BASIC if you put "bannas" around an argument in aF > function/subroutine call the argument is treated as being passed "by' > value" into the function/subroutine.    I What's a "banna"?  To pass by value, use the clearly documented BY VALUE   clause; see   ( $ help/library=basichelp function syntax  6 > It's a long story involving code using ASTs/timers.   8 BASIC is not thread-safe, so you are asking for trouble.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 12:11:52 -0800# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 6 Subject: RE: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIGEKDGFAA.tom@kednos.com>   6 That may be, but it has a different meaning for C than for PL/I for example.    >-----Original Message----- + >From: Arne Vajhj [mailto:arne@vajhoej.dk] ( >Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 12:02 PM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com6 >Subject: Re: BASIC and "pass by value" --> (argument) >  >  >Tom Linden wrote:K >> You need to determine what "pass by value" means for Basic.  In the case A >> of PL/I it means that the caller makes a copy of the thing and ( >> passes a pointer to it to the callee. >  >????  > ' >"pass by value" has a meaning in VMS !  > 9 >So unless otherwise noted, then I would consider it fair ) >to assume that it is in the VMS meaning.  >  >Arne  >  >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. ; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). B >Version: 6.0.435 / Virus Database: 244 - Release Date: 12/30/2002 >  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A Version: 6.0.435 / Virus Database: 244 - Release Date: 12/30/2002    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 12:55:49 -08002 From: "Randy Park" <rjpark@mindspring.nospaam.com>6 Subject: Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)2 Message-ID: <av4td5$pjj$1@slb6.atl.mindspring.net>  - Joe <cstranslations@msn.com> wrote in message 7 news:d56d1c2d.0301031132.5632c762@posting.google.com... F > I can't find it in the docs (and have never made use of this before): > but in BASIC if you put "bannas" around an argument in aF > function/subroutine call the argument is treated as being passed "byC > value" into the function/subroutine. When this is done - do these > > variables live at the top of the stack (they would have to)? > H > It's a long story involving code using ASTs/timers. What I'm wonderingF > (and am relatively confident of) is that in the below code expecting= > "ast" to print a "4" after printing "hello" is an erroneous  > expectation. >  > Any comments???  >  > thanks > joe  >   ; It has been a few years since I've done much programming in / BASIC, but I think I still remember the answer.   9 It's my understanding that to get data passed or received @ by value, you must use the BY VALUE clause.  Placing parenthesis> around an argument makes a copy of the argument before passingA it to the subroutine.  Passing an argument BY VALUE and receiving ; it BY REFERENCE is something you probably don't want to do. A Remember, integers are passed and received BY REFERENCE in BASIC,  unless specified otherwise.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 17:07:55 -0500 $ From: Karl Puder <karl.puder@hp.com>6 Subject: Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)& Message-ID: <3E1609BB.4720FA86@hp.com>  L BASIC is not thread-safe, but it is AST safe, and the RTL is careful to lock access to global data cells.   "Craig A. Berry" wrote:   A > In <d56d1c2d.0301031132.5632c762@posting.google.com> Joe wrote: H > > I can't find it in the docs (and have never made use of this before)< > > but in BASIC if you put "bannas" around an argument in aH > > function/subroutine call the argument is treated as being passed "by( > > value" into the function/subroutine. > J > What's a "banna"?  To pass by value, use the clearly documented BY VALUE
 > clause; see  > * > $ help/library=basichelp function syntax > 7 > > It's a long story involving code using ASTs/timers.  > : > BASIC is not thread-safe, so you are asking for trouble.   --
 Karl Puder Hewlett-Packard Company  karl.puder at hp.com +1.603.884.6245    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 14:26:14 -0800 5 From: Craig A. Berry <craigberry@nospam.telocity.com> 6 Subject: Re: BASIC and "pass by value"  --> (argument)6 Message-ID: <20030103162614668-0600@news.telocity.com>  0 In <3E1609BB.4720FA86@hp.com> Karl Puder  wrote:G > BASIC is not thread-safe, but it is AST safe, and the RTL is careful  & > to lock access to global data cells.  A Ah, good to know.  I must've overinterpreted something I'd heard.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:05:21 -0500  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>. Subject: Re: Cluster crash, ethernet problem ?6 Message-ID: <1030103215643.12958A-100000@Ives.egh.com>  $ On Tue, 31 Dec 2002, JF Mezei wrote:   > This has happened twice now: > P > MAC has a Appleshar connection to BIKE, mapped to a drive MSCP served by VELO.& > All are on same ethernet (thinwire). > O > After a long while of the MAC sending to BIKE, VELO's OPCOM goes wild stating L > it has lost connection to BIKE. BIKE's screen doesn't show anything. A fewP > minutes later, BIKE decides to kill itself and reboots. ANA/ERROR reveals lost4 > connectivity betwene the two nodes. (eg: ethernet) > M > This has happened sporadically a few times , but not often enough for me to K > worry. But in the past 2 days, it has happened as I tried to backup a mac 4 > drive onto my vax with the Pathworks MAC software. >  > - > What would be more likely in your opinion ?  > J > Faulty hardware on the ethernet that would go nuts, preventing VELO from > keeping in touch with BIKE?  > K > Just too much traffic on the ethernet, ovrwhelming both VELO and BIKE who  > can't keep up ?  >  > Anything else ?   A Are you using a hub or a switch?  A switch can drastically reduce D the unrelated traffic.  Until we installed a switch, we were gettingA occasional "Quorum lost" situations on our cluster (VAX 4000-200, C DEC 3000-300, AlphaServer 1200) during busy times.  A 10/100 switch B cured this (plus we can now run the AS1200 at 100MB FD, as well as# most of our other newer equipment.)   ? You can hook an old AUI host (most likely, your MV-II is AUI or D thin-wire) to a 10/100 TP hub using a single-port transceiver, whichC costs about $15.  I think you can get a 4 or 8 port unmanaged (i.e.  cheap) switch for about $50 US.   @ If something is spewing on the ethernet, this would help isolate% it, even if it won't actually fix it.    --   John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 14:24:37 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>8 Subject: Re: ComputerWorld: HP Is Homeland Merger  Model/ Message-ID: <3E15D563.39863538@vl.videotron.ca>    There is an upside to this.   D If the USA government is so keen on leveraging the success of the ITK integration at HP-Compaq, perhaps Our beloved Mr Winkler might be offered a L job he can't refuse at Homeland security to supervise the amalgmation of allJ of the homeland security systems into a single one. Of course, we all know9 that Winkler would make Homeland security run on Windows.   I Terrorists would simply know to wait at airport before proceeding through I immigration until their windows systems crash (every 15 minutes) at which D point, they would be able to porceed because the workstations at the; immigration desk wouldn't get any "hits" on their names :-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 16:03:39 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>8 Subject: Re: ComputerWorld: HP Is Homeland Merger  Model/ Message-ID: <3E15EC92.B68710A3@vl.videotron.ca>    Keith Parris wrote: F > programs as a result of the merger.  And despite the pre-merger talkB > from the now-departed Capellas about how important PCs were as aE > factor in the merger, the reality post-merger seems to be much more B > balanced -- Windows/PCs are no more important in the New HP than@ > Linux, Unix, VMS, or NonStop -- whatever platform the customer
 > chooses.  < Are there any explanations for this fairly radical change ?     J My gut tells me that enough Hewlett suporters indicated to Carly that theyK might vote YES if Carly were to dump the wintel focus. (Deutcshe Bank being N one of the visible ones who changed their minds in the last minute in exchangeG for more business from HP to that bank, but were there other conditions  imposed ?).   F What worries me is that if Carly can change the corporate direction soM radically witbout publicly confirming it, it means that she could also change N it back to a Microsoft-centric pre-merger position also without announcing it.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 20:21:13 +0100 6 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk>= Subject: Re: Demise of VMS (and most other operating systems) ' Message-ID: <3E15E2A9.60003@vajhoej.dk>    David J. Dachtera wrote: > Bob Koehler wrote:' >>   ZIP is not a built in part of VMS.   J > Technically, neither is the Librarian - it's utility, like BACKUP, COPY,F > etc. All the same, that wasn't a part of the original specification.  * Actually I think Librarian is part of VMS.  6 You can make many definitions of what is really "VMS".  5 But one of the more objective criterias is "what gets 6 installed by a standard VMS installation from the CD".   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 18:57:24 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> = Subject: Re: Demise of VMS (and most other operating systems) ' Message-ID: <3E163174.D173BC93@fsi.net>    Bob Koehler wrote: > [snip]E >    In fact, if it did change I think existing tools like Multinet's G >    recordsize command would allow one to revert to the old behaviour.   F Can you expound a bit? I've been using Multinet for some years now and7 this is the first I've heard of a "recordsize command".    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 13:09:01 -0800' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu> = Subject: Does any version of VMS support Unix message queues? 8 Message-ID: <20030103130901.441dd553.mathog@caltech.edu>  2 Does any version of VMS have Unix message queues? . For instance, one with the DII COE bits in it.  ? If so, does this program run on that (those) version(s) of VMS?   H   http://saf.bio.caltech.edu/pub/software/linux_or_unix_tools/msgqueue.c  4 (documented in msgqueue.html in the same directory.)  E The program runs on Solaris and Linux but there are minor differences > in the API between the two platforms.   Presumably it would be Solaris-like on VMS.  C This utility provides a command line interface to the message queue : function, which turns out to be a fairly handy way to passA short messages between unrelated processes on a single Unix node.    Thanks,    David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu> Manager, Sequence Analysis Facility, Biology Division, Caltech   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 17:06:04 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>0 Subject: Re: F$GETDVI ("AVL") in an IF statement/ Message-ID: <3E15FB2F.79F2E80A@vl.videotron.ca>    Brian Tillman wrote:  L > Checking to see if a device is available is identical to checking the freeN > blocks.  The "available" attribute is, I believe, stored in the UCB.  If theH > device doesn't exist, there's no UCB to check, so F$GETDVI errors withH > "NOSUCHDEV", just like a SHOW DEVICE of the non-existent device would.  N Well, in the TCPIP$STARTUP procedure, it checks to see if BG0: is mounted, andI it has to check if it exists first to prevent the error. Your description W explains well the logic behind, but from the user point of view, it isn't as "logical".   N I think that F$GETDVI items that return true of false should just return false instead of generating an error.   M Is  BG0: mounted ? Yes, or No. If BG0: doesn't exist, then it is stll correct   to state that it is not mounted.  I Mounted and available should behave as EXIST in the case where the device  doesn't exist. Just my opinion.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 19:08:31 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 0 Subject: Re: F$GETDVI ("AVL") in an IF statement' Message-ID: <3E16340F.65A9E9DB@fsi.net>    JF Mezei wrote:  > O > Is  BG0: mounted ? Yes, or No. If BG0: doesn't exist, then it is stll correct " > to state that it is not mounted.  E I can simulate a situation here. I have an AS200 connected to a BA350 F shelf. I can take any mounted disk and extract it from the shelf whileG the system is running (don't try this at home!). Now, we have a mounted , device that has a DCB, yet no longer exists.  " Is it available? VMS thinks it is.  F Is it MOUNTed? VMS think it was, but is now in MntVerify and will soon be in MntVfyTimeout.  A Does it exist? In VMS's dreams. It may be here in my lap, but ...   K > Mounted and available should behave as EXIST in the case where the device ! > doesn't exist. Just my opinion.   C What should the o.s. report about other non-existant items? ...like 6 memory that does not exist in the system, for example?  C Should DELETE of a non-existant file act like DELETE/SINCE where no # files match the selection criteria?   H Do I need protection from the radiation of the neighboring star that our sun doesn't have?   F Where do we stop making brash assumptions and begin to report reality?   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 04:14:28 GMT 9 From: "Headley Sappleton" <headley.sappleton@verizon.net> B Subject: FA: Digital DEC LA70 Personal Dot-Matrix Printer Like-new5 Message-ID: <EctR9.4308$tQ6.132@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>   , Digital DEC LA70 Personal Dot-Matrix Printer- Start price:                           $29.95 = End date:                              Jan-10-03 19:25:23 PST L http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2086283652&ssPageName=ADM E:B:LC:US:1    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 04:07:17 GMT 9 From: "Headley Sappleton" <headley.sappleton@verizon.net> 9 Subject: FA: DIGITAL DEC VAX H8571-F MMJ Cable Adapter NR 6 Message-ID: <V5tR9.4288$tQ6.2418@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>  L http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2086281928&ssPageName=ADM E:B:LC:US:1   , Start price:                           $9.95- Buy It Now price:                      $15.00 = End date:                              Jan-10-03 19:14:57 PST    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 23:38:57 -0500 From: "ICUSC" <sales@hpaq.net>& Subject: Finding info on Alpha Systems. Message-ID: <v1cp5tpu4mq33@news.supernews.com>  . Now go to hp.com or compaq.com and try to find anything about alpha systems  $ For the layman, Alphas DO NOT EXIST.   Sad... very sad !    DT   -- Island Computers US Corp.  2700 Gregory St, Ste 180 Savannah GA 31404, USA Tel: (00) 1 912 447 662  Fax: (00) 1 912 201 0402 sales@hpaq.net www.islandco.com   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:16:17 -0500  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> Subject: Re: FTP6 Message-ID: <1030103221257.12958C-100000@Ives.egh.com>  % On Thu, 2 Jan 2003, Hans Vlems wrote:    > : > "Paul Sture" <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> schreef in bericht% > news:zs4+hF41ZMEy@elias.decus.ch... F > > In article <av0ai5$asocj$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de>, "Hans Vlems" > <hvlems@iae.nl> writes:  > > > 8 > TCPIP SHOW SERVICES command shows that FTP is stopped. > > >  > > B > > Do the log files in sys$sysdevice:<tcpip$ftp> reveal anything? > >  > > -- > > Paul Sture > > Switzerland  > Yes, the following text: > K > %DCL-E-NOCMDPROC, error opening captive command procedure - access denied  > E Check protection and ownership of FTP's LOGIN.COM and the system-wide ? login command file (sys$manager:sylogin.com or the logical name  "SYS$SYLOGIN" if elsewhere.)  5 > TCPIP$FTP job terminated at 31-DEC-2002 20:43:37.81  >  > Accounting information:  > 4 > Buffered I/O count: 29 Peak working set size: 1648 > 0 > Direct I/O count: 17 Peak virtual size: 167888 > % > Page faults: 129 Mounted volumes: 0  > = > Charged CPU time: 0 00:00:00.03 Elapsed time: 0 00:00:00.11  >  >  >    --   John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 16:11:36 -0500$ From: Mike Duffy <Duffy@process.com>4 Subject: FW: new version of OpenVMS password cracker> Message-ID: <63D30D6E10CFD11190A90000F805FE860492AF55@LESPAUL>    > -----Original Message----- .  > From: Mike Duffy [mailto:duffy@process.com])  > Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 4:05 PM   > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com7  > Subject: RE: new version of OpenVMS password cracker   >    >    > > -----Original Message----- E  > > From: Brian Tillman [mailto:tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com] +  > > Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 3:44 PM   > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com9  > > Subject: Re: new version of OpenVMS password cracker   > >    > >  6  > > >Construct your file password.lst as described in7  > > >  http://gailly.net/security/john-VMS-readme.html   > >    > > From that page:  > >  ?  > > >To create wordlists optimised for VMS, remember that VMS    > > passwords can only C  > > contain uppercase letters, digits and >the characters '$' and    > > '_'. A good1  > > way to reduce a generic wordlist for VMS is:   > > >@  > > >  tr a-z A-Z < wordlist | tr -cd 'A-Z0-9$_\n' | sort -u >   > > password.lst   > >  3  > > And how do I do that command on a VMS machine?   >    > How about something like:  >  <  > $ SEARCH/EXACT/MATCH=NOR (wordlist) /out=(new_wordlist) -?  >   "a","b","c","d","e","f","g","h","i","j","k","l","m","n", - <  >   "o","p","q","r","s","t","u","v","w","x","y","z","$","_"  >     :  Whoops.  Just realized I should have excluded "$" and "_">  there and included popular VMS-illegal characters.  Still not$  perfetct. but better than before.    ;  Another case where an additional 30 seconds of brainpower  *  used before posting would have helped me.     -Mike Duffy         ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 17:30:37 -0400 0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>M Subject: Re: I just wanted to share a note I sen	t to the group this mornin	g / Message-ID: <3E1600EE.62C2931D@vl.videotron.ca>    "Bochnik, William J" wrote: N > but for practical reasons 1 language makes sense.  Now to take your argument? > to the extreem, we should have every possible language on all  > road signs  H And to use your logic, the logical choice for a single language would beM chinese since it is the dominant language for the world population of humans. I For the same reason the USA wouldn't want to drop english as its de-facto N standard langauge in favour of the more "logical" chinese, many nations preferL to keep their own language instead of adopting english as official language.  J The "global" village will turn out with a whole bunch of language, and oneK common "english" language as interchange, or lowest common denominator. But E there are problems with this since this "english" now has significant  variations around the world.  I I don't expect americans to know what a depanneur is.  But it is a common J expression in english quebec (influence from local dominant language). AndM while americans don't see anything wrong naming a boy "Randy", in the rest of I the world, they wouldn't dare do that. There is Tyre and Tire. Potato and J Potatoe, Rubbish and garbage, bike and pushbike, and then there are commonN words with different meanings, such as fanny. And I think that even inside theJ USA, you will see different english, especially with the spanish influence- affecting some parts of USA more than others.   M A well travelled person learns those differences. One that has been insulated @ in his own country all his life wouldn't know those differences.   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 14:00:03 -0600 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) L Subject: RE: I just wanted to share a note I sent to the group this mornin	g3 Message-ID: <cmJAHM+8Iv1u@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <2D75787AAF09C64481BDFD89113BE6D5B3600A@ac2kama0102.ac.lp.acml.com>, "Bochnik, William J" <William_Bochnik@acml.com> writes: N > oficially correct English wasnt the national language, but it was conventionG > that it was.  My wife's grandparents came here not speaking a word of J > english, but never even thought to speak their home language outside theL > house.  ever.  They loved and respected this country and made every effortH > to fit in while not losing site of their past.  It's time we relearned
 > this....  G  No thanks.  The Nazis thought everyone should look and sound the same. ;  My uncle and great uncle risked thier lives stopping them.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 16:39:35 -0500; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> ' Subject: Re: is VMS really easy to use? $ Message-ID: <3e1602f3$1@news.si.com>  ! >I mean come on which is simpler:  > E >$ DELETE dev:[dir.subdir...]*.*;*,;*,;*,;*,;*,;*,;*,[dir]subdir.dir;  >  >or  >  >$ rm -r dir  I Are you basing your entire argument on the anecdotal evidence of a single  command?  Right.   Actually, I think   / $ dfu delete/directory/tree dev:[dir]subdir.dir   K to be simplest.  Who the hell can remember that "rm" equals "delete" unless  you do it every day? --  I Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at smiths-aerospace dot com 5 Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM. @ 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991 8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 19:13:56 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ' Subject: Re: is VMS really easy to use? ' Message-ID: <3E163554.4FF7D8B8@fsi.net>2   Carl Perkins wrote:n > < > Arne =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk> writes... > }Bill Gunshannon wrote:I > }  > }> cd /usr/share/man8 > }> find ./man? -exec groff -man {} \;|lpr -PPostscript > }>? > }> Not as confusing as the example above, and this one works.v > } 2 > }Still not exactly obvious for the Unix newbie ! > }u > }:-) > }A > }Arnep >  > Or anybody else. > < > How, exactly, would someone who was not an expert go about2 > finding out the the desired command was "groff"? > What does "groff" stand for?  E That's the sound one makes when getting over a cold and trying not tol cough.   -- e David J. DachteraM dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/p   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 14:18:31 -0500" From: "Hal Kuff" <Kuff@Tessco.Com> Subject: Java Kit link broken?O Message-ID: <13C2A15ACF1D8100.65A1F9F34B37D409.15544349C732DCA3@lp.airnews.net>d  I     In both netscape and IE I get an error when I try to register for thec java kit onuK http://h18012.www1.hp.com/java/download/jdk_ovms/1.3.1-5/sdk1.3.1_form.htmle6     It will not allow an operating system selected....  E     Does anyone know where the kit is? Can I get around this link...?n   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 21:03:23 +0100f6 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk>" Subject: Re: Java Kit link broken?) Message-ID: <3E15EC8B.9040504@vajhoej.dk>e   Hal Kuff wrote:hK >     In both netscape and IE I get an error when I try to register for the 
 > java kit on.M > http://h18012.www1.hp.com/java/download/jdk_ovms/1.3.1-5/sdk1.3.1_form.html.8 >     It will not allow an operating system selected.... > G >     Does anyone know where the kit is? Can I get around this link...?g  6 Weird I managed to register fine a coupld of days ago.   NS 6.2.3 / Win32   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 19:25:15 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: JPEG viewer? ' Message-ID: <3E1637FB.306F65FD@fsi.net>T   Didier Morandi wrote:e >  > John Travell a crit: B > > "PRSTSC::DTL" <Didier.Morandi.nospam@Free.fr> wrote in message2 > > news:3e146cae$0$22306$626a54ce@news.free.fr... > > L > >>I'm looking for a JPEG viewer a bit more simple than www.imagemagick.org > >>found in the OpenVMS FAQ.p > >> > >e > >  > > Mozilla ?? :-) > 
 > Mozzarella?s > :-)   ; Is that the Dairy Council's approved version of Cinderella?n   -- y David J. DachteraE dba DJE Systemst http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 15:44:03 -0500; From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> 4 Subject: Re: new version of OpenVMS password cracker$ Message-ID: <3e15f5f0$1@news.si.com>  1 >Construct your file password.lst as described in]2 >  http://gailly.net/security/john-VMS-readme.html   From that page:   L >To create wordlists optimised for VMS, remember that VMS passwords can onlyI contain uppercase letters, digits and >the characters '$' and '_'. A good , way to reduce a generic wordlist for VMS is: >aG >  tr a-z A-Z < wordlist | tr -cd 'A-Z0-9$_\n' | sort -u > password.lstc  . And how do I do that command on a VMS machine? -- 7I Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at smiths-aerospace dot comt5 Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM.s@ 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991t8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 16:04:38 -0500$ From: Mike Duffy <Duffy@process.com>4 Subject: RE: new version of OpenVMS password cracker> Message-ID: <63D30D6E10CFD11190A90000F805FE860492AF53@LESPAUL>   > -----Original Message-----B > From: Brian Tillman [mailto:tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com]( > Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 3:44 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com.6 > Subject: Re: new version of OpenVMS password cracker >  > 3 > >Construct your file password.lst as described inh4 > >  http://gailly.net/security/john-VMS-readme.html >  > From that page:C > < > >To create wordlists optimised for VMS, remember that VMS  > passwords can only@ > contain uppercase letters, digits and >the characters '$' and 
 > '_'. A goodg. > way to reduce a generic wordlist for VMS is: > >'= > >  tr a-z A-Z < wordlist | tr -cd 'A-Z0-9$_\n' | sort -u > t > password.lst > 0 > And how do I do that command on a VMS machine?   How about something like:p  9 $ SEARCH/EXACT/MATCH=NOR (wordlist) /out=(new_wordlist) - <   "a","b","c","d","e","f","g","h","i","j","k","l","m","n", -9   "o","p","q","r","s","t","u","v","w","x","y","z","$","_"l  : Keep in mind that I have not seen the wordlist in question< to see that its characteristics would not cause this to omit some legal combinations.  > Otherwise I might whip up a procedure using F$EDIT(x,"UPCASE"): on each record then do a SORT/NODUP on the resulting file.   -Mike Duffyi         > -- p3 > Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at g > smiths-aerospace dot com7 > Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM.oB > 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." > Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991t: >        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company >    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 14:08:18 -0600r; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)bI Subject: Re: Now "Is HELP on unix" [WAS : RE: is VMS really easy to use?]-3 Message-ID: <3Ooovj9yCHDD@eisner.encompasserve.org>0  \ In article <878yy2mk04.fsf@prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes: > 7 > Yes but for it to be convieniently readable, you need 
 > hlp|less        A GNU variation of hlpmor?a   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 02:18:15 GMTn. From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)& Subject: Re: OpenVMS Technical Journal5 Message-ID: <HvrR9.231692$qq5.2627417@news.chello.at>   q In article <857e9e41.0301021524.49f94ccf@posting.google.com>, susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski) writes: B >Well it is Jan 2nd and no one has asked how the OpenVMS Technical >Journal is coming along?  >pC >So is it that you forgot I said that the first one would be out inn >January 2003? >orn >Maybe you are not interested? >;')	 >big hug,i   Oh come on Sue.  Nobody can rant every day ;-)  Of course I'm interested...n   -- y Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERe% Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 21:18:44 +0100" From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>/ Subject: Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when...n5 Message-ID: <av4r7j$bogib$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de>s   [Snip]>v	 > $ SPAWNl* > %DCL-S-SPAWNED, process SYSTEM_1 spawned< > %DCL-S-ATTACHED, terminal now attached to process SYSTEM_1 > $ @startup >     :       :  >     :       :r? > this will run the startup.com and the systartup_v*.com.    OnbE > completion it will log out the spawned process and leave you logged@ > into the system account. >     :       :a >     :       :s: >   Process SYSTEM_1 logged out at  3-JAN-2003 10:42:59.865 > %DCL-S-RETURNED, control returned to process SYSTEM  > $a >e' >      You can now reset your password.: >eF >     If you run the startup.com without spawning the process, it will	 > log youfB > out of the system automatically,   leaving you exactly where you
 > started.  F The spawn command is a good idea anyway, even if you decide not to runA STARTUP.COM because it allows you to recover from a typing error./K There is one other method : gamble that SYSALTUAF.DAT was never created ande SYSBOOT> SET SYSUAFALT 1
 SYSBOOT> C   Hans   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 22:21:52 GMT % From: Marco Shaw <marco@Znbnet.nb.ca> / Subject: Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when...v+ Message-ID: <3E161209.5030305@Znbnet.nb.ca>x   > boot dka1,dva0 -fl 0,80001 >  > does what?   Gets me in!n  ( All the other things I tried complained:/ "...Unable to locate SYS$CPU_ROUTINES_0B04.EXE"m  B Now, I'm a "$", so more reading...  I obviously need to update my " expired hobbyist license/products.   Marcoe   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 17:42:49 -0500! From: VAXVMS <bounce@notmail.com> / Subject: RE: Recovering SYSTEM password when...rK Message-ID: <BA52530E3149734A9BAABDBBFA808E4903027BB8@rlghncst964.usps.gov>n  
    Marco-   1    DKA1 isn't a valid SCSI device name under VMS.a1    Try using DKA100 instead and see what happens.y  =   > boot dka1,dva0 -fl 0,80001 >  > does what?   Gets me in!u  ( All the other things I tried complained:/ "...Unable to locate SYS$CPU_ROUTINES_0B04.EXE"   B    That's one of the "special files" required for a Multia to boot    VMS ***normally***.  B    I'm posting from memory but as I recall, when you're installingB    VMS from a CD-ROM you do it with the foreign boot command shownD    above but with the CD-ROM device name and 80000 instead of 80001.  ?    One of the following is true but I don't remember which one:-  D    1)	the VMS installation process asks you for the location of the # 	"special files" it needs (DVA0:), e  :    2) it knows about them because of the way you boot, or   D    3)	there's a separate kit you have to install (I remember a PCSI % 	kit but don't remember what it was).   A    Go to Google Groups search and search using the term "Multia".l@    If that's too broad, use my last name too- I'm fairly certainB    that I've posted the details when they were relatively fresh in
    my memory.o      HTH      WWWebb  r  A Now, I'm a "$", so more reading...  I obviously need to update my-" expired hobbyist license/products.   Marco:   ========================  William W. Webb / DSSC/RLM, USPS OpenVMS Support Services& 4924 Green Road Raleigh, NC 27616-2800: 919.874.3043 <FirstInitialDotLastNameAtEmailDotUSPSDotGov>   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 00:27:27 GMTi" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG/ Subject: Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when... 0 Message-ID: <00A196E6.A1334C84@SendSpamHere.ORG>  S In article <3E161209.5030305@Znbnet.nb.ca>, Marco Shaw <marco@Znbnet.nb.ca> writes:o >> boot dka1,dva0 -fl 0,80001T >> s
 >> does what?t >c >Gets me in!   :)   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMr            o5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" y   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 00:42:32 GMT,% From: Marco Shaw <marco@Znbnet.nb.ca>L/ Subject: Re: Recovering SYSTEM password when..."+ Message-ID: <3E163303.6010002@Znbnet.nb.ca>C  
 VAXVMS wrote:J >    Marco-  > 3 >    DKA1 isn't a valid SCSI device name under VMS.n3 >    Try using DKA100 instead and see what happens.l  B Strange then...  I wonder if SRM or whatever accepts shortcuts or D something because it can recognize my disk as dka1 and CDROM as dka6  C >    Go to Google Groups search and search using the term "Multia".tB >    If that's too broad, use my last name too- I'm fairly certainD >    that I've posted the details when they were relatively fresh in >    my memory.s  C There used to be a multia-users mailing list, but seems to be gone.s  = I tried several things, and couldn't get any further, so I'm d- reinstalling.  It's a good exercise anyway...e  E I told myself last time about losing the SYS password, but still did.r  	 Grrrr....d   Marcon   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 14:11:29 -0400a0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca>& Subject: Re: Sad news from engineering/ Message-ID: <3E15D24E.5B046C25@vl.videotron.ca>c   David Froble wrote:/P > 1) No, it wasn't too smart to go into cold water without protection.  The kids: > were probably in worse shape, trying to help the mother.  	 Question:s  N Where I live (Canada), one doesn't go into any water between early october andK may, unless it is the polar bear club's january 1 15 second dip. (or unlesswL you are on a trip to the caribeean or south pacific). One would risk his/herM life walking on ice trying to reach someone who fell through the ice into theBL deadly waters, but one would not voluntarily jump into such waters to rescueN someone because one would know that there is no way to rescue them once you'reF in the water and you then become the rescu-ee instead of the rescu-er.    L In Maine, do people consider the ocean water to be warm enough to be more or less swimmable in winter ?  L I once fell in 7 water on a nice sunny day (outside temp probably near 20.J (celcius, of course). Your body reacts quite violently to the event. BuddyM tried to swim ashore while I tried to climb the canoe to assess the situationnM and mostly try to adapt (breathing violently). Buddy got taken by current ands@ instead of swimming towards shore, he was just going downstream.  L I knew I had to try to keep my neck out of water as much as possible. But atK that time, we weren't far from shore (small river) and didn't think my lifeuM was in any danger, although I though my buddy had done the wrong thing tryinga to swim.    N But When I saw his head go under water a couple of times, I grabbed a floatingM life jacket and swam towards him. I was mad at him because he didn't grab his7M life jacket as he swam away from the upturned canoe. And yeah, at that point,bH I probably didn't think about my own life. When I reached him,  he firstM grabbed the life jacket, but then grabbed ME, so I grabbed the life jacket totN keep me afloat. It is only when he, the all around cool guy, grabbed me that IL started to realise how serious the situation was when I had seen his head goK under a couple of times. This was a tall guy (I am not tall). We reached annM eddy that circled us towards the shore at which point I was able to swim/pulln9 my buddy to shore where some friends were already there.    K The whole thing lasted probably 2-3 minutes. While tugging my friend, I didlI start to think about possibility of death, and once I saw I could swim tolH shore due to the right current, hopes went back up, until I came out andL started to shiver like crazy. Friends who had arrived on scene were all busyJ on my other friend, I was alone. I didn't know why, until later when I wasL told he had lost consciousness. But in the end, after a warm bath and a warm drink, we were OK.  J Perhaps it is my experience that would make me stop and assess a situation$ before proceeding into cold waters.   T Oh, and this event happened in late may on a sunny day. Not in the middle of winter.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 15:11:53 -0500o( From: Bruce Bowler <bbowler@bigelow.org>& Subject: Re: Sad news from engineering5 Message-ID: <av4qq9$c40p8$1@ID-134246.news.dfncis.de>r  H On Fri, 03 Jan 2003 13:11:29 -0500, JF Mezei put fingers to keyboard and said:s   > David Froble wrote:9G >> 1) No, it wasn't too smart to go into cold water without protection.sD >> The kids were probably in worse shape, trying to help the mother. >  > Question:v > F > In Maine, do people consider the ocean water to be warm enough to be$ > more or less swimmable in winter ?  VF No, most of us who live in Maine don't consider the ocean swimmable inH winter.  As others have said, in different words, sometimes the maternal5 instinct is MUCH stronger than the survival instinct.i  G I visit Reid State Park several times a year and it can be a VERY nastyc@ place, especially in the winter, as can most of the rocky coast.   B    -- dI +-------------------+---------------------------------------------------+tF Bruce Bowler        | History is a nightmare from which I am trying to( 1.207.633.9600      | awake.  - Joyce    bbowler@bigelow.org | I +-------------------+---------------------------------------------------+c   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 14:04:38 -0600'+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)o; Subject: Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linux 3 Message-ID: <VYzZE9kb3TRX@eisner.encompasserve.org>w  b In article <3e15c947$1@news.si.com>, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> writes:I >>We would like to implement a SAN (4 TB initially with growth to 100 TB)  > M > We already have a SAN here, for use by our Novell Netware and Unix systems. G > Any way to allow VAXes to use it as well?  (OpenVMS V7.2, but I couldr > upgrade to V7.3 if needed.)i   	Here... read this article:o  [ http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3BDC972F.3BBC21BB%40rtfmcsi.com&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain   6 	Personally, that doesn't sound too hot and is tied to
 	a vendor.  A 	I wonder if the best way to go (do you have 10 MBit cards in then> 	VAXes?  100 MBit were/are third party right?) would be to getC 	a couple smaller Alphas, stick HBAs in them and then serve storageMC 	MSCP over a CI to the VAXes.  I would buy all the equipment secondPC 	hand and CIPCAs for the Alphas should be reasonable by now.  ThereoD 	are obvious config issues and do not have a diagram of your currentB 	setup.  Otherwise, I don't know a real good way to get FC storage 	into a VAX.  C 	Also, even though 3rd party 100 MBit cards were/are expensive , ifeE 	you can find them you might "explore" going that route (MSCP servingsB 	over Ethernet to VAXes.  You would save money there by not havingE 	to buy CIPCAs for the Alphas).  The throughput is a little better.  t$ 	But it will be harder on your CPUs.   				Robi   ------------------------------   Date: 3 JAN 2003 20:17:37 GMTc4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher); Subject: Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linuxo5 Message-ID: <3JAN03.20173737@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>   S In a previous article, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote:>  M ->We already have a SAN here, for use by our Novell Netware and Unix systems..G ->Any way to allow VAXes to use it as well?  (OpenVMS V7.2, but I couldt ->upgrade to V7.3 if needed.)e  F I've found VMS support by SAN vendors to be few and far. There are twoD I'm sure about: HP Storageworks (including EVA) and EMC's Symmetrix.J I've heard IBM also supports VMS in their san product but haven't verified that.   = For a low cost entry level SAN for VMS check out HP's MA1000.    An update on our SAN findings:  D We're still trying to find out if ADIC's StorNext Shared File systemF will work among Sun and linux clients attached to an EVA. We know thatH SGI's CXFS won't as they only support it on their own SAN product. EMC'sF Celerra HighRoad (for Symmetrix) is their shared file system (for Sun,B SGI, Windows and Linux clients) which looks interesting. Symmetrix< doesn't have the fancy virtualization features that EVA has.   --G -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madison 8 --                 karcher.nomorespam@waisman.wisc.edu     ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 15:37:27 -0600-+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) ; Subject: Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linuxj3 Message-ID: <OoRg9g6aGZ4Y@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  l In article <3JAN03.20173737@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>, karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher) writes:U > In a previous article, "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com> wrote:i > O > ->We already have a SAN here, for use by our Novell Netware and Unix systems.oI > ->Any way to allow VAXes to use it as well?  (OpenVMS V7.2, but I couldi > ->upgrade to V7.3 if needed.)  > H > I've found VMS support by SAN vendors to be few and far. There are twoF > I'm sure about: HP Storageworks (including EVA) and EMC's Symmetrix.L > I've heard IBM also supports VMS in their san product but haven't verified > that.f >   6 	Add Hitachi to that list.  And yes, IBM supports VMS.  D 	But you are right, the wanna be SAN players don't support VMS.  But3 	that's okay, you want quality storage and support.e  > 	Back to his question.  SAN for a VAX.  Not sure there is such	 	a beast.v  ? > For a low cost entry level SAN for VMS check out HP's MA1000.g >   > An update on our SAN findings: > F > We're still trying to find out if ADIC's StorNext Shared File systemH > will work among Sun and linux clients attached to an EVA. We know thatJ > SGI's CXFS won't as they only support it on their own SAN product. EMC'sH > Celerra HighRoad (for Symmetrix) is their shared file system (for Sun,D > SGI, Windows and Linux clients) which looks interesting. Symmetrix> > doesn't have the fancy virtualization features that EVA has. >   = 	If you are interested in shared filesystem, why not look at nB 	Veritas?  Veritas is big in the Sun space, so support there isn't
 	an issue.  Q http://www.veritas.com/products/category/ProductDetail.jhtml?productId=filesystemo   				Robe   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 19:11:29 -0600u1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>n; Subject: Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linuxo' Message-ID: <3E1634C1.28E6C234@fsi.net>i   Carl Karcher wrote:i > [snip]H > I've found VMS support by SAN vendors to be few and far. There are twoF > I'm sure about: HP Storageworks (including EVA) and EMC's Symmetrix.  @ Word "on the street" is that EMC doesn't play nice with VOLSHAD.  $ Have you any insights or experience?   -- e David J. Dachtera- dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/R   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 23:05:45 -0500' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> ; Subject: RE: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, LinuxeT Message-ID: <BE56C50EA024184DAF48F0B9A47F5CF4023D9AE0@kaoexc01.americas.cpqcorp.net>   Brian,   Re: VAX's and SAN's ..  E Not sure if still valid or even what the solution involves, but checka out:3 http://www.es.avnet.com/about/news/2000/sanway.asp\t  C "Los Angeles, CA - October 2, 2000 - Avnet Enterprise Solutions, antF architect of e-business infrastructures, today unveiled SANway(tm) forG OpenVMS at Compaq Enterprise Technical Symposium. SANway for OpenVMS is'G a new technology solution that enables VAX cluster environments running B OpenVMS to enhance their storage functionality. SANway for OpenVMSA combines enhancements to Compaq's OpenVMS VAX platform with AvnetrC Enterprise Solutions' financial and technology assessment services,dH allowing for lower cost of ownership due to lower service costs and less required floor space. "-   Regards-  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant8 Hewlett-Packard (Canada) Co.! Consulting & Integration Servicesu Voice: 613-592-4660" Fax   : 613-591-4477 Email: kerryDOTmain@hpDOTcom-     (remove the DOT's and replace with "."'s)G     -----Original Message-----C From: Brian Tillman [mailto:tillman_brian@notnoone.notnohow.com]=20o Sent: January 3, 2003 12:34 PM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comc; Subject: Re: SAN recommendations mixing VMS, Solaris, Linuxe    H >We would like to implement a SAN (4 TB initially with growth to 100 TB)  B We already have a SAN here, for use by our Novell Netware and UnixH systems. Any way to allow VAXes to use it as well?  (OpenVMS V7.2, but I! could upgrade to V7.3 if needed.)  --=20eE Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at smiths-aerospace dot  comp5 Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM.EF 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991r8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 15:15:10 -0800n, From: rcs@slac.stanford.edu (Robert C. Sass)U Subject: Search list logical name translation for JAVA$CLASSPATH using VMS Java 1.3.1e= Message-ID: <ab56e6c6.0301031515.38ed13b9@posting.google.com>t  ; We want to use the search list feature for VMS logical name : translation plus avoid the 255 character limit thus we useC java$classpath instead of classpath. However, while the javah & jar/C commands do all of the translation correctly, the java command does3 not. Here's the details.   $ show logical java$classpathn2    "JAVA$CLASSPATH" = "AIDACP1" (LNM$JOB_81AE4F40)         = "AIDACP2"          = "AIDACP3"          = "AIDACP4"w         = "AIDACP5" 6 1  "AIDACP1" = "SLCIMAGE:DPSLC.JAR" (LNM$JOB_81AE4F40)7 1  "AIDACP2" = "DISK$SLCLIBRARY:[JAVA.FOREIGN]AIDA.JAR"  (LNM$JOB_81AE4F40): 1  "AIDACP3" = "DISK$SLCLIBRARY:[JAVA.FOREIGN]OBEVENT.JAR" (LNM$JOB_81AE4F40)= 1  "AIDACP4" = "DISK$SLCLIBRARY:[JAVA.FOREIGN]CLASSES111.ZIP"- (LNM$JOB_81AE4F40)5 1  "AIDACP5" = "DISK$SLCLIBRARY:[JAVA.FOREIGN]OB.JAR"h (LNM$JOB_81AE4F40)  # Here's the rooted logical slcimage.X   $ show logical slcimageN/    "SLCIMAGE" = "SLC_IMAGE:" (LNM$GROUP_000044)l= 1  "SLC_IMAGE" = "SOFT$ROOT:[IMAGE_ALPHA]" (LNM$GROUP_000044)2   $ show logical soft$root/    "SOFT$ROOT" = "DEV$ROOT:" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)          = "NEW$ROOT:"i         = "PROD$ROOT:"= 1  "DEV$ROOT" = "$255$DUA2:[DEVELOPMENT.]" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)45 1  "NEW$ROOT" = "$255$DUA2:[NEW.]" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE),= 1  "PROD$ROOT" = "$255$DUA2:[PRODUCTION.]" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)j   $ dir slcimage:dpslc.jar    Directory DEV$ROOT:[IMAGE_ALPHA]   DPSLC.JAR;1o   $ jar tf slcimage:dpslc.jarq ----_JAVA_LAUNCHER_DEBUG----$ JRE path is /SYS$COMMON/java$131/jre jvm.cfg[0] = ->-classic<-a  1 micro seconds to parse jvm.cfg" Does `java$jvm_shr' exist ... yes. JVM path is java$jvm_shr JavaVM args:F     version 0x00010002, ignoreUnrecognized is JNI_FALSE, nOptions is 4K     option[ 0] = '-Denv.class.path=aidacp1:aidacp2:aidacp3:aidacp4:aidacp5'7:     option[ 1] = '-Dapplication.home=/SYS$COMMON/java$131'P     option[ 2] = '-Djava.class.path=/SYS$COMMON/java$131/lib/tools.jar:/SYS$COMM ON/java$131/classes'     option[ 3] = '-Xms8m'a  1 micro seconds to InitializeJVM" Main-Class is 'sun.tools.jar.Main' Apps' argc is 2<     argv[ 0] = 'tf'4$     argv[ 1] = '/slcimage/dpslc.jar'" 1 micro seconds to load main class ----_JAVA_LAUNCHER_DEBUG----	 META-INF/i META-INF/MANIFEST.MF, edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcI.class2 edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcIHelper.class2 edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcIHolder.class6 edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcIOperations.class/ edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcIPOA.classo1 edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcI_impl.classo1 edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcServer.classg1 edu/stanford/slac/aida/dp/dpSlc/_DpSlcIStub.class$  F So we see that the jar file of interest slcimage:dpslc.jar is actually? in the development directory dev$root:[image_alpha] and the jar D command finds it. Now if we do a javah on the class file DpSlcI_impl? everything is also properly found and the .h file is generated.l  : $ javah -jni "edu.stanford.slac.aida.dp.dpSlc.DpSlcI_impl" ----_JAVA_LAUNCHER_DEBUG----$ JRE path is /SYS$COMMON/java$131/jre jvm.cfg[0] = ->-classic<-r  1 micro seconds to parse jvm.cfg" Does `java$jvm_shr' exist ... yes. JVM path is java$jvm_shr JavaVM args:F     version 0x00010002, ignoreUnrecognized is JNI_FALSE, nOptions is 3K     option[ 0] = '-Denv.class.path=aidacp1:aidacp2:aidacp3:aidacp4:aidacp5's:     option[ 1] = '-Dapplication.home=/SYS$COMMON/java$131'P     option[ 2] = '-Djava.class.path=/SYS$COMMON/java$131/lib/tools.jar:/SYS$COMM ON/java$131/classes'  1 micro seconds to InitializeJVM( Main-Class is 'com.sun.tools.javah.Main' Apps' argc is 2      argv[ 0] = '-jni'a<     argv[ 1] = 'edu.stanford.slac.aida.dp.dpSlc.DpSlcI_impl'" 1 micro seconds to load main class ----_JAVA_LAUNCHER_DEBUG----  B But if we try to run the main program in class DpSlcServer that isB also in slcimage:dpslc.jar, the java command can't file the class.  4 $ java "edu.stanford.slac.aida.dp.dpSlc.DpSlcServer" ----_JAVA_LAUNCHER_DEBUG----$ JRE path is /SYS$COMMON/java$131/jre jvm.cfg[0] = ->-classic<->  1 micro seconds to parse jvm.cfg" Does `java$jvm_shr' exist ... yes. JVM path is java$jvm_shr JavaVM args:F     version 0x00010002, ignoreUnrecognized is JNI_FALSE, nOptions is 1L     option[ 0] = '-Djava.class.path=aidacp1:aidacp2:aidacp3:aidacp4:aidacp5'  1 micro seconds to InitializeJVM; Main-Class is 'edu.stanford.slac.aida.dp.dpSlc.DpSlcServer'  Apps' argc is 0"" 1 micro seconds to load main class ----_JAVA_LAUNCHER_DEBUG----: Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: edu/stanford/slac/aidu( a/dp/dpSlc/DpSlcServer <---------------   E I tried setting the JAVA$ENABLE_ENVIRONMENT_EXPANSION logical and use A the -cp switch as shown in the release notes but that didn't workrF either. If java$classpath defines all of the jar files explicitly, not9 using any search lists, then the java command works fine.   C Has anyone also encountered this? Any suggestions for a solution orcB workaround? Why did they do it "VMS right" for jar & javah but not java?r   Thanks,s   Bob    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 20:24:46 +0100 6 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk>& Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth) Message-ID: <3E15E37E.4010604@vajhoej.dk>    Joel Gallun wrote:G > My recollection is the vax 6000 was always kind of unloved. I had onesD > as a loner back in the early ninties at NASA. Never really used it9 > much as we had RISC/Unix systems that were lots faster.s  % I think your experiences is uncommon.f  . The VAX 6000 was quite popular in many places.  @ But maybe not at number crunching sites, which your RISC comment somehow indicates you were at.   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 12:28:48 -0700n% From: Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com>d& Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirthB Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030103122826.022c7c58@raptor.psccos.com>  * At 12:24 PM 1/3/2003, Arne Vajh=F8j wrote: >Joel Gallun wrote: G >>My recollection is the vax 6000 was always kind of unloved. I had onedD >>as a loner back in the early ninties at NASA. Never really used it9 >>much as we had RISC/Unix systems that were lots faster.d > & >I think your experiences is uncommon. > / >The VAX 6000 was quite popular in many places.,  2 True enough.  At one time, MCI had dozens of them.   ------J +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+J | Dan O'Reilly                  |  "There are 10 types of people in this |J | Principal Engineer            |   world: those who understand binary   |J | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |J | http://www.process.com        |                                        |J +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 21:49:21 +0000/ From: cbh@ieya.co.REMOVE_THIS.uk (Chris Hedley) & Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth) Message-ID: <1h05va.f13.ln@teabag.cbhnet>B  A According to Rupert Pigott <darkboo-remove-this-ng.@hotmail.com>:oG > I was using a Vax 6K (well, 3 of them) at a site in 1997. They seemediG > to be quite happy. When I offered to take one of them off their handssK > to save them the disposal fee they postively *blanched*... ie: Pry out of G > cold stiff fingers kinda thing. I always thought those boxes were thefE > pinnacle of VAX engineering... Nothing fancy just straight up solidhD > reliable boxes. I think that many machines would really want to be  > VAX 6K's when they grow up....  G DEC used them internally quite a lot.  Nice systems to use, if a little F uninteresting, although that should be the whole point I suppose sinceF "interesting" often translates directly into "problematic"!  They wereG good systems unless overloaded (as some internal systems genius decided J to do, amalgamating all UK MIS machines into two so-called "superclusters"? which couldn't cope with the workload and were almost unusable)n  4 > Hint : I want war stories about 6K's blowing up :)  K Apparently the 8000s had cornered the market in that sort of behaviour.  :) A (I don't think that any of the VAX systems had much in the way of"E notoriety for hardware failures, though; whether or not one likes therH architecture [why did I nearly write "artichoketure"?] I think that most( will agree that they were pretty rugged)   Chris. -- eO "If the world was an orange it would be like much too small, y'know?" Neil, '84 7   Currently playing: Sing-Sing - "The Joy Of Sing-Sing"-N   http://www.chrishedley.com  My stuff, including genealogy, other things, etc   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 20:52:48 -0000; From: "Rupert Pigott" <darkboo-remove-this-ng.@hotmail.com> & Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth4 Message-ID: <av4tde$emn$2$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>  0 "Arne Vajhj" <arne@vajhoej.dk> wrote in message# news:3E15E37E.4010604@vajhoej.dk...  > Joel Gallun wrote:I > > My recollection is the vax 6000 was always kind of unloved. I had oneoF > > as a loner back in the early ninties at NASA. Never really used it; > > much as we had RISC/Unix systems that were lots faster.e >r' > I think your experiences is uncommon.  >m0 > The VAX 6000 was quite popular in many places. >hB > But maybe not at number crunching sites, which your RISC comment  > somehow indicates you were at.  E I was using a Vax 6K (well, 3 of them) at a site in 1997. They seemednE to be quite happy. When I offered to take one of them off their hands-I to save them the disposal fee they postively *blanched*... ie: Pry out ofTE cold stiff fingers kinda thing. I always thought those boxes were the0C pinnacle of VAX engineering... Nothing fancy just straight up solideB reliable boxes. I think that many machines would really want to be VAX 6K's when they grow up....  2 Hint : I want war stories about 6K's blowing up :)   Cheers,  Rupert   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:28:06 -0000; From: "Rupert Pigott" <darkboo-remove-this-ng.@hotmail.com>-& Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth4 Message-ID: <av52pk$17j$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>  < "Chris Hedley" <cbh@ieya.co.REMOVE_THIS.uk> wrote in message# news:1h05va.f13.ln@teabag.cbhnet...f {SNIP]  I > DEC used them internally quite a lot.  Nice systems to use, if a little H > uninteresting, although that should be the whole point I suppose sinceH > "interesting" often translates directly into "problematic"!  They were  = I think that tells the world all they need to know about 6Ks.o  8 Those mofos kept on trucking regardless. That, to me, is8 *interesting* because plenty of their contemporaries did  not.-   Cheers,- Rupert   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jan 2003 22:35:26 GMTy2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>& Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth, Message-ID: <av537e02hcb@enews2.newsguy.com>  @ In comp.sys.dec Chris Hedley <cbh@ieya.co.remove_this.uk> wrote:C > (I don't think that any of the VAX systems had much in the way of>G > notoriety for hardware failures, though; whether or not one likes the J > architecture [why did I nearly write "artichoketure"?] I think that most* > will agree that they were pretty rugged)  G The only 'notoriety' for hardware failures that I can think of would beJL related to disk drives.  Consider how infamous the RD53 is, and I believe atF least one model of the RA8x is noted for problem with the drive heads.  L Now the VAXen themselves, even the ones that suffer from problematic drives, are pretty much rock solid.R   			Zanei   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 00:18:14 +0000/ From: cbh@ieya.co.REMOVE_THIS.uk (Chris Hedley) & Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirth) Message-ID: <6895va.av3.ln@teabag.cbhnet>e  8 According to Zane H. Healy <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>:I > The only 'notoriety' for hardware failures that I can think of would beAN > related to disk drives.  Consider how infamous the RD53 is, and I believe atH > least one model of the RA8x is noted for problem with the drive heads.  E I recall being regailed over the years with stories of RA discs whichi3 had bearings that wouldn't, or something like that.   N > Now the VAXen themselves, even the ones that suffer from problematic drives, > are pretty much rock solid.i  @ Even the little VAXstations (in particular the 3100 series) were@ amazingly well-built; probably moreso than any other PC or work- station I've encountered.e   Chris. -- rO "If the world was an orange it would be like much too small, y'know?" Neil, '84D7   Currently playing: Sing-Sing - "The Joy Of Sing-Sing"ON   http://www.chrishedley.com  My stuff, including genealogy, other things, etc   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 17:48:16 -0700.% From: Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com>n& Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirthB Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030103174641.00ba3428@raptor.psccos.com>  * At 03:35 PM 1/3/2003, Zane H. Healy wrote:A >In comp.sys.dec Chris Hedley <cbh@ieya.co.remove_this.uk> wrote: E > > (I don't think that any of the VAX systems had much in the way ofeI > > notoriety for hardware failures, though; whether or not one likes therL > > architecture [why did I nearly write "artichoketure"?] I think that most, > > will agree that they were pretty rugged) >aH >The only 'notoriety' for hardware failures that I can think of would beM >related to disk drives.  Consider how infamous the RD53 is, and I believe atjG >least one model of the RA8x is noted for problem with the drive heads.$   *SNORT*e  I I worked in the Advanced Technology Disk Business at DEC during the greatrJ RA81 recall of the mid 80's.  We were inprocessing about 2,000 per day forI a long time.  Then again, there was the RA60, early models of which slunge  bearing grease around the HDA...  M >Now the VAXen themselves, even the ones that suffer from problematic drives,i >are pretty much rock solid.  C They always were.  That was DEC's reputation for great engineering.2     ------J +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+J | Dan O'Reilly                  |  "There are 10 types of people in this |J | Principal Engineer            |   world: those who understand binary   |J | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |J | http://www.process.com        |                                        |J +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 04:59:31 GMT 3 From: "Kelli Halliburton" <kelli217@crosswinds.not> & Subject: Re: vax6k.openecs.org rebirthA Message-ID: <SStR9.5895$VU5.117776532@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com>r   Chris Hedley wrote:t  B > Even the little VAXstations (in particular the 3100 series) wereB > amazingly well-built; probably moreso than any other PC or work- > station I've encountered.g  J I would LOVE to have a VAXstation 3100 -- they were the systems on which IL first learned Ixian incantations and lore, at university. I wasn't even a CSJ student, but I signed up for an account on the campus system, and got one.I (I had heard they were for the use of any student,and it turns out it wasiI true.) I decided that I liked Ultrix pretty well in fairly short order; ItH mean, I had absolutely no experience with any form of Unix. All I had toF trade on was my knowledge of my own AmigaDOS, which bears a very faint" resemblance to Unix, but not much.  L Anyway, I learned from scratch on Ultrix, and so I got attached to it. Then,A the university began switching from the VAXstations to HP PA-RISCsK workstations running HP-UX. It was at this point that I began to appreciateiK the small differences that differentiate the various Unices. I decided thatEK I didn't like HP-UX very much, mostly because I had to change a lot of term I settings, via stty, to get my Amiga's term program to work correctly with ( it. Ultrix worked right out of the gate.   Enough jabbering from me. :)   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 19:03:25 GMT / From: "James Wilkinson" <elementyl@hotmail.com>5I Subject: Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail < Message-ID: <18lR9.4506$xT2.1984@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>  5 "Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote: ? > > Is there anyway to configure Mickey$chlock mail programs toe' > > include or send text as plain/text?s >g > AFAIK, there is not.   Bzzzt.  E > I have offered a bounty of 100 quatloos for instructions explaininge= > how to force Nanosoft Outhouse to send plain text messages.a > No one has come forward.  J Under the address book you can set the "Send E-mail using plain text only"I option per user, or use the Format menu when creating your message to set 6 the message to plain text.  Where are my 100 quatloos.  ? > Ask HP to send the PAKs by email directly from the VMS system0 > where they are generated.m  @ It is probably behind 5 firewalls and not configured to do this.   JamesC   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 21:27:21 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORGI Subject: Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail,0 Message-ID: <00A196CD.7845E5C1@SendSpamHere.ORG>  n In article <18lR9.4506$xT2.1984@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>, "James Wilkinson" <elementyl@hotmail.com> writes:6 >"Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote:@ >> > Is there anyway to configure Mickey$chlock mail programs to( >> > include or send text as plain/text? >> >> AFAIK, there is not.s >a >Bzzzt.s > F >> I have offered a bounty of 100 quatloos for instructions explaining> >> how to force Nanosoft Outhouse to send plain text messages. >> No one has come forward.o > K >Under the address book you can set the "Send E-mail using plain text only"uJ >option per user, or use the Format menu when creating your message to set7 >the message to plain text.  Where are my 100 quatloos.0  F ...but can you select the Content-encoding NOT to be quoted-printable? That is the problem.      @ >> Ask HP to send the PAKs by email directly from the VMS system >> where they are generated. > A >It is probably behind 5 firewalls and not configured to do this.h  H I did receive them today from a VMS machine!  Surprises lurk about every corner.  --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             t5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" t   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 22:40:36 GMTo/ From: "James Wilkinson" <elementyl@hotmail.com> I Subject: Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock maile< Message-ID: <EjoR9.4581$DT3.1223@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>  " <VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote:G > >Under the address book you can set the "Send E-mail using plain textiC > >only" option per user, or use the Format menu when creating your , > >message to set the message to plain text. >A6 > ...but can you select the Content-encoding NOT to be( > quoted-printable? That is the problem.  ' Sure, I just tried it, it comes out as:E  . Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit1   James    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 18:56:07 -0500M2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)I Subject: Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mail'L Message-ID: <rdeininger-0301031856070001@user-2ive3tq.dialup.mindspring.com>  C In article <18lR9.4506$xT2.1984@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>, "JamesY) Wilkinson" <elementyl@hotmail.com> wrote:0  6 >"Robert Deininger" <rdeininger@mindspring.com> wrote:@ >> > Is there anyway to configure Mickey$chlock mail programs to( >> > include or send text as plain/text? >> >> AFAIK, there is not.e >f >Bzzzt.h >vF >> I have offered a bounty of 100 quatloos for instructions explaining> >> how to force Nanosoft Outhouse to send plain text messages. >> No one has come forward.t > K >Under the address book you can set the "Send E-mail using plain text only"'J >option per user, or use the Format menu when creating your message to set7 >the message to plain text.  Where are my 100 quatloos.   I That doesn't work on the version of Outhouse that's been inflicted on me,dE nor on any other version that I've heard about.  The menu says "plaintH text", but outhouse actually encodes the message as "quoted printable".  No quatloos for you.    @ >> Ask HP to send the PAKs by email directly from the VMS system >> where they are generated. >>A >It is probably behind 5 firewalls and not configured to do this.4  C HP has lots of VMS systems that can send mail to the outside world.s   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 18:57:37 -0500n2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)I Subject: Re: VERY ON-TOPIC:  quoted-printable shit and Mickey$chlock mailtL Message-ID: <rdeininger-0301031857380001@user-2ive3tq.dialup.mindspring.com>  C In article <EjoR9.4581$DT3.1223@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>, "Jamesl) Wilkinson" <elementyl@hotmail.com> wrote:t  # ><VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote:eH >> >Under the address book you can set the "Send E-mail using plain textD >> >only" option per user, or use the Format menu when creating your- >> >message to set the message to plain text.t >>7 >> ...but can you select the Content-encoding NOT to bee) >> quoted-printable? That is the problem.w > ( >Sure, I just tried it, it comes out as: >r/ >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"   >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  I Is this Outhouse, or Outhouse Express?  What version?  I have seen one orrJ two Outhouse Express installations that can send plain text.  Alas, I have to use plain Outhouse.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 14:30:52 -0400n0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> Subject: Re: VMS troubles / Message-ID: <3E15D6D9.6E5BAD0F@vl.videotron.ca>    vmstroubles wrote:K > software that we are running was throwing fits about the RQDX3 controlelrtK > card so i swapped it out with a replacement card to see what would happenh' > and now my terminal isn't connecting.   1 Can you define "my terminal isn't connecting" ???t  N On a microvax II, only the console (OPA0:) can do anything until well into theL VMS boot sequence. Until then, all other terminals, either directly attachedF (DHV11 or DHQ11 or via etherenet on terminal servers) are inoperative.  M Also, when you swapped the RQDX3, did you ensure all dip switches and jumpers M were the same ? It is possible that the new card would swrew up the Q-BUS duew( to conflicting vector configuration etc.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 13:42:40 -0600% From: "vmstroubles" <jmmyre@wisc.edu>t Subject: Re: VMS troubleso/ Message-ID: <v1br6ccr3mab68@corp.supernews.com>h  D well i got the terminal working and i made sure that all jumpers andF settings were the same on the new RQDX3 as the old one.  Still getting failures though.   joec >    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 16:08:29 -0400n0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vl.videotron.ca> Subject: Re: VMS troubless/ Message-ID: <3E15EDB4.BFD2ECEF@vl.videotron.ca>n   vmstroubles wrote: > K > Another update, I installed the replacement RQDX3 controller card and ranaK > the diagnostics software and the card passed apparently but it gave me anu6 > error after all of the tests were done.  Here it is.  M Do you have the Microvax II hardware manual ? It is a small orange binder. InoK it, the RQDX3 jumpers are explained. YOu really need to do your homework on N this and make a full inventiry of what boards are in your microvax II and what2 their settings are. You may have a Qbus conflict.   I Also, are you sure that your QBUS cards are inserted correctly and in theiN correct order ? (on the left of the Qbus, when looking from the back, you willK see the qubus layout sticket that shows the "serpentine" order in which theo boards have to be inserted.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 23:01:54 +0100e4 From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi.nospam@Free.fr>9 Subject: wallpaper for the "normal" DECWindows interface?d& Message-ID: <3E160852.7000604@Free.fr>  H I found in the FAQ the way to set up a wallpaper for the CPQWindows CDE.  M But, as I'm 52, and following the same motivation which prevented me to move eP from EDT to TPU/EVE/XYZ/whatever, I never "moved" to the CDE (is it because the  DIGITAL logo was missing? :-)   M So, the question is: is it possible to have a wallpaper with the Genuine DEC - DECWindows?o   Thanks,    D. -- s5    -------------------------------------------------- 3 MORANDI Consultants - http://Didier.Morandi.Free.fr-1    19 chemin de la Butte, 31400 Toulouse, France.-3 Tel.: +33 (0)6 7983 6418 - Fax : +33 (0)5 6154 1928 4 JobSeeker, time available, DCL programming for cheap4 ----------------------------------------------------   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 23:27:42 GMTmL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")= Subject: Re: wallpaper for the "normal" DECWindows interface?e6 Message-ID: <00A196C5.1EF93651@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  ] In article <3E160852.7000604@Free.fr>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi.nospam@Free.fr> writes:wI >I found in the FAQ the way to set up a wallpaper for the CPQWindows CDE.f >eN >But, as I'm 52, and following the same motivation which prevented me to move Q >from EDT to TPU/EVE/XYZ/whatever, I never "moved" to the CDE (is it because the   >DIGITAL logo was missing? :-) >nN >So, the question is: is it possible to have a wallpaper with the Genuine DEC  >DECWindows?  I Yes.  You can get XV to display an arbitrary graphic to your root window.   O (Finding your root window can be a challenge, but ISTR a procedure being postedl. here years ago - try googling on XV and root.)   -- Alanu  O ===============================================================================r0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056rM  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025rO ===============================================================================y   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 01:19:21 GMTa. From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)3 Subject: Re: [OpenVMS IPF] Boot Contest - I lost...-5 Message-ID: <tEqR9.231509$qq5.2623644@news.chello.at>a  R In article <00A19613.152D8ECB.11@decus.de>, Michael Unger <unger@decus.de> writes:2 >"Peter LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote: >i >> Happy New Year. >>I >> Sad is, that I expected the OpenVMS IPF port will see a VMS first boot D >> in December 2002. Alas, it seems, I lost. Who won the prize now ? >eL >Apparently the contest is still running. So there is noone who won a prize.   Are you sure ?C The OpenVMS Boot Contest Registration Form had a date of 2002 only, + so why could the contest still be running ?eK Do you expect another year 2002 will come some time in the future ? (eg. DoiM you expect the eg. islamic calendar will be the major calendar for HP then ?)S   Just curious   -- ' Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERo% Network and OpenVMS system specialistt E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 20:44:24 +0100A6 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk>4 Subject: Re: [OT] Lotteries (was Re: Happy New Year)) Message-ID: <3E15E818.5090200@vajhoej.dk>r   Dean Woodward wrote:G > The engineers are right- the odds of winning are vastly against you- CF > close enough to zero that it can be discounted.  OTOH, if you play, J > they're also immeasurably better than if you don't play at all- because F > if you don't buy any tickets, then you obviously will never buy the  > winning one. > I > Myself, I believe the lottery is a tax for people who don't understand r? > math, offset slightly by the entertainment value it provides.n > K > Final thought- I believe a fair number of lottery systems run on VMS- or u7 > used to.  Buy a ticket, support your favorite OS. ;-)o  ; 1)  Most lotteries pay out approx. half the sale as prizes.o=      So the chance of winning something is significant biggers@      than zero. The chance of winning the hundred million dollar?      jackpot is ofcourse extremely small - for obvious reasons.b  B 2)  Normally the profits from lotteries are used by the governmentB      for education and other services for children/young. So it do?      go to a good cause. You can like that way of raising moneyt?      or not, but that is how the people elected by you decided.g  ? 3)  Yes. The majority of the worlds lottery systems run on VMS.    Arne  8 [who earns his monthly salary from the lottery industry]   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 13:27:19 -0800* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com>4 Subject: Re: [OT] Lotteries (was Re: Happy New Year)2 Message-ID: <s72cnV8vCNKqnYujXTWc2Q@mpowercom.net>  0 "Arne Vajhj" <arne@vajhoej.dk> wrote in message# news:3E15E818.5090200@vajhoej.dk...  > Dean Woodward wrote: >p= > 1)  Most lotteries pay out approx. half the sale as prizes.  >mF In private enterprise (i.e. Nevada casinos) the maximum hold is by lawL around 23% but nearly always under 10% due to competitive pressure.  PayoutsE average 90% of wagers...50% would be considered criminal.  Any gaminglJ licensee caught holding that much would be a candidate for the rockpile at the state grey bar hotel.u > D > 2)  Normally the profits from lotteries are used by the government; >      for education and other services for children/young.  >aI Admirable, that's why we all pay taxes.  The profits from govt. lotteriespG free up general revenue for the vote buying slushpile.  How many statesoJ include govt-run lottery revenues as part of their estimated tax base now?J In Nevada it's zero...government lotteries are illegal here, banned by the state constitution.S >aA > 3)  Yes. The majority of the worlds lottery systems run on VMS." > G Even excellent systems can be perverted for ignoble ends.  What kind ofrK machines did the old South Africa govt. use to manage apartheid?  Does Iraq ( use VMS to track payments to terrorists?     Jack Peacock3 (who does NOT make a living by rob^W taxing people)    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 01:33:55 GMTc. From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter LANGSTOEGER)4 Subject: Re: [OT] Lotteries (was Re: Happy New Year)5 Message-ID: <7SqR9.231571$qq5.2624616@news.chello.at>r  P In article <3E14AC1F.7050204@rdrop.com>, Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> writes:G >Final thought- I believe a fair number of lottery systems run on VMS- y9 >or used to.  Buy a ticket, support your favorite OS. ;-)r  B I do. This week is tripple jackpot here in Austria (Lotto 6 of 45)5 About 6 mio Euros at a winning chance of about 1:8mion> And at75cent per lotto ticket I do my best to support VMS ;-)   -- e Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERe% Network and OpenVMS system specialists E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.007 ************************