1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 05 Jul 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 367       Contents:% Free Alphas and uVAX II  in Las Vegas ) Re: Free Alphas and uVAX II  in Las Vegas ) Re: Free Alphas and uVAX II  in Las Vegas # Re: Hardware Games - Guru needed...  Re: New OpenVMS-to-Itanium FAQ" Re: OpenVMS 7.3.1 Install problem. Re: Sign of the demise of Alpha  Re: Sign of the demise of Alpha P Re: SNMP Commands (was Re: How do I monitor the CPU temperature in an ES40 runniJ Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical UpdateP Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update UpdatP Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update UpdatP Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update Updat Re: ucx printing problems F Re: VAX support (was: Re: OpenVMS Technical Seminar Highlights (some))F Re: VAX support (was: Re: OpenVMS Technical Seminar Highlights (some))F Re: VAX support (was: Re: OpenVMS Technical Seminar Highlights (some))= Re: VMS makes "General News" section of HP's "Customer Times" = Re: VMS makes "General News" section of HP's "Customer Times"  Re: VMS-Upgrade from disk? Re: VMS-Upgrade from disk? Re: VMS-Upgrade from disk? Re: what is VMS advanced Server  Re: what is VMS advanced Server   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 10:47:53 -0700* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com>. Subject: Free Alphas and uVAX II  in Las Vegas2 Message-ID: <S6SdnUTL1NhXIJiiRTvU2Q@mpowercom.net>  % I forgot to add in a few more extras: I MicroVAX II, BA23 pedestal, 16MB, RD54, TK50, DELQA ethernet w/coax xcvr,  1987 vintageJ condition is unknown but was running last time powered up a few years ago, dusty but in good shape   0 Miscellaneous CDs and TK50s for VMS and Alpha NT  H That makes a total of two Alphas and one VAX, someone please save it allI from the garbage dump.  No room left in my own collection so they have to  go.     Jack Peacock    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 21:34:08 -0400, From: "David Turner" <dbturner@islandco.com>2 Subject: Re: Free Alphas and uVAX II  in Las Vegas/ Message-ID: <vgcb1fsqikvi0c@news.supernews.com>   & Sadly - this lot of  stuff is so heavy   Take it home !0 Serious ISP's have less than that in M$ hardware   DT   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 19:24:25 -0700* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com>2 Subject: Re: Free Alphas and uVAX II  in Las Vegas2 Message-ID: <Ib-dnWz0K7uXqpuiRTvUpQ@mpowercom.net>  7 "David Turner" <dbturner@islandco.com> wrote in message ) news:vgcb1fsqikvi0c@news.supernews.com... ( > Sadly - this lot of  stuff is so heavy >  > Take it home !2 > Serious ISP's have less than that in M$ hardware > J Alas I have no more room.  Already have a Vax 3100 and an Alpha 400 for myI collection, small enough to fit in with the S-100 machines.  Plus I don't C have the power (or a/c during the summer) to run the 2100 with both 	 supplies.   J The 2100 has an interesting history.  It ran 24x7 for about 7 years as theG principal accounting machine for a casino in Las Vegas, replacing a Vax I 3600.  The 2100 was replaced with a faster Alpha (and sadly that was just L replaced by an IBM AS/400).  About the only unplanned downtime for users wasI when someone would cut the network cabling, which happened several times. J It was so critical to operations that the only time it could be taken downE for updates was between 12am and 6am, and only mid-week.  Unlike most L systems evenings, holidays and weekends were never available...those are the busiest times for casinos.  L During those 7 years the only hardware failure was one RZ74 drive, half of aL shadow set.  No impact on production.  Other problems were facility induced,G including the adventure of the guy who connected the PA intercom to the  primary ethernet cable.     Jack Peacock    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 21:13:40 +0200+ From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems.nieuw@zonnet.nl> , Subject: Re: Hardware Games - Guru needed...5 Message-ID: <be4jl6$181lm$1@ID-143435.news.dfncis.de>   G A year ago I did that too, had quite some fun with it. The DS3000 had a F graphics interface (ELSA Gloria IIRC). I never tried to connect to theJ serial ports though. On a DS5305 the firmware checks for the presence of aI keyboard (possibly the mouse too). When absent then the 5305 assumes that L the console is a serial device. The db25 connector on the 5305 is a parallelE port so I use a DB9 to mmj convertor to connect to a C.Itoh terminal.   7 Edit the file nvram (use ls on the srm prompt) and add:    10 set boot_reset on 20 set srm_boot on  A Switch off, wait 60 secs and restart. The 3300 will now boot VMS.   I Side question: what would be a reasonable price for a 3305 with 64 MB and  one disk, no ethernet?  
 Hans Vlems  6 "Tim Smith" <timasmith@hotmail.com> schreef in bericht7 news:a7234bb1.0307040220.5b785f75@posting.google.com...  > Hi,  > * > Trying to build my own play VMS machine. > A > So I have purchased an alpha powered Digital Server 3000, model 8 > FR-K7F2W-WC and there is a great picture and specs at:@ > http://h18002.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/SOC/QB00EJPF.PDF > It turns on (and beeps a lot)  > H > I also purchased a Wyse WY-520 Terminal with keyboard, DECVT400M WY-60; > compatible which turns on and I can access the setup menu  > F > The terminal has a 25 pin / phone like cable from the main port to aD > 25 pin male which supposedly goes to the console though as per theD > spec above the only 25 pin female is the printer which is no good. > D > 1) Can I get a 25 to 9 adapter and somehow use the 'Remote Console > Port'?& > 2) Do I have to find MMJ data leads?@ > 3) Are there any other options for connecting up the terminal? > 	 > thanks!  >  > Tim    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2003 05:30:58 GMT 3 From: wallacethinmintr@eircom.net (Russell Wallace) ' Subject: Re: New OpenVMS-to-Itanium FAQ 0 Message-ID: <3f066185.977262333@news.eircom.net>  @ On Fri, 4 Jul 2003 07:34:12 -0700, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote:  H >ON conditions provide for the ability to write self correcting programsG >by provide specific error handlers for signals otherwise caught by the  >system J >or for programmeer generated signals.  These error handlers may reside in >anyC >scope and once a signal is caught stack frames are popped until an  >appropriateI >handler is found, and after processing control returns to the point from  >whichJ >it all started.  If no handlers found then system defaults.  Read more in >Chap 8 J >of the reference manual which you may freely download from www.kednos.com  E Ah, like exceptions except with the option of resuming from the point E where the condition occurred? Cool. (One thing I'm curious about here A - what exactly did people use the resume option for in practice?)   + (Rest of explanation snipped, with thanks.)    --   "Sore wa himitsu desu."  To reply by email, remove  the small snack from address. ! http://www.esatclear.ie/~rwallace    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:39:25 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> + Subject: Re: OpenVMS 7.3.1 Install problem. ' Message-ID: <3F05C9DD.7DEB86F3@fsi.net>    Eric Bruno wrote:  > < > Well I think I found the line that is hanging the install.C > If reboot the system after the install locks up and boot the disk A > it does an autogen complains about some missing files but runs.  > K > If I try to manually install products they complain VMS is not installed. K > Digging around the forums/newsgroups using information from various posts 4 > I determined that a PCSI database was not present. >  > So I did the following:  > * >  $DIRECTORY/DATE/SIZE SYS$SYSTEM:*.PCSI* >  >  This showed show NO files.  > 2 >  $DIRECTORY/DATE/SIZE SYS$COMMON:[000000]*.PCSI* >   >  This showed these four files: > 5 >     DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0703-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 - >     DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0703-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1 1 >     DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0703-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 ) >     DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0703-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1    Try:  7 $ RENAME SYS$COMMON:[000000]*.PCSI* SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE]   H That should put the files into the correct path and get you going again.  @ FWIW, installing VMS on "unsupported" hardware tends to be a bitH challenging. Not sure why - most of this should be "don't care" stuff to such things.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:56:39 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ( Subject: Re: Sign of the demise of Alpha& Message-ID: <3F05CDE7.81A0236@fsi.net>   Robert Deininger wrote:  > @ > In article <vg9p0kh8obfcc0@news.supernews.com>, "David Turner"  > <dbturner@islandco.com> wrote: >  > >Not my point  > > 4 > >Then point is, they had no interest in trading up& > >Wanted "rid" of their Alpha systems >  > Their loss, your gain.    H Well, not sure why DT would assume they are not running VMS, but I wouldE tend to see this as a loss all around, not just for them but also for  HP, OpenVMS and Alpha->Itanic.  4 > You probably got the systems for a good price, andF > can arrange for their re-deployment with a fair profit for yourself.  = Now, if only those boxes could find new life as VMS machines.    If only... (Famous last words)  F Y'know, I'm stilling thinking of startup a non-M$ computer store. U.S.F readers may remember a chain called ComputerLand from the middle 80's.F Imagine that happening again with focus on Linux, *BSD and (YES!) VMS,A perhaps also sub-contracting with someone else to provide Windows > Servers for those prospects who insist on insecure, unreliable
 systems...   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 19:57:09 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ( Subject: Re: Sign of the demise of Alpha' Message-ID: <3F062265.64B9285B@fsi.net>    David Turner wrote:  >  > Point is we didn't buy them.N > 250 Systems here, plus 430 DS10L's were getting in the end of July/BeginningK > August - for a small company like us, it's a big expense, and a hell of a  > risk ! > A > Unless anyone wants to buy say 250 DS20's for $2200 a pop ??!?!  > - > Call me if anyone out there wants that many  > We won't buy them on spec.  H Wow! That's a half a megabuck-plus for the DS20's alone. That's a lot toE swallow for any company these days, much less on a declining platform  like Alpha.   D I can tell you this much in a public forum: if I were in position toD start up my non-M$ computer store soon enough, I'd offer to strike a= deal of some kind. That'd make a kick-ass start-up inventory!   B As Linux and/or *BSD server machines, I bet we could clear 'em outD handily. I doubt we could get HP onto the affordability bandwagon in! time to see a benefit to OpenVMS.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:49:20 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> Y Subject: Re: SNMP Commands (was Re: How do I monitor the CPU temperature in an ES40 runni ' Message-ID: <3F05CC30.A410275D@fsi.net>   
 dooley wrote:  > [snip] > + > Since you have the vaulues in dcl anyway, E > if you have tcpip/snmp enabled and you know what trap to send where 3 > (this involves knowing a bit about mibs and oids)   > you can do is "manually" using4 > $ snmp_request == "$SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$SNMP_REQUEST": > $!!! snmp_request agent "community" request_type [flags]% > $!!!     variable [data-type value]  > $!!! > $!4 > $ snmp_trapsnd == "$SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$SNMP_TRAPSND"K > $!!!   snmp_trapsnd enterprise agent generic-trap specific-trap timeticks F > $!!!     [-v version] [-c community] [-d] [-h host] [-p port] [-tcp], > $!!!     [variable_name [data-type value]] > $!4 > $ snmp_traprcv == "$SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$SNMP_TRAPRCV") > $!!! snmp_traprcv [-d] [-tcp] [-p port]  > $! > $!  F Does anyone know how to do the above using Multinet? The documentation is less than ludcid...   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Jul 2003 05:17:41 -0000 4 From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]>S Subject: Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update 6 Message-ID: <20030705051741.19174.qmail@nym.alias.net>  H On Sat, 5 Jul 2003, "David McKenzie" <david.mckenzie@paradigm-shift.biz> wrote:  L >Why isn't it possible to get back to a system where all players are honest,M >and there is that which is supported, i.e. no option but for HP to provide a K >solution, and that which is reasonable, "should work, negligence accepted, K >but stupidity ignored", and " your on your own mate, it might work, but it  >might not".  5 You'd have to drown a hell of a lot of lawyers first.    :)     Doc. --  K OpenVMS.         Eight out of ten hackers prefer *other* operating systems.    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Jul 2003 00:09:29 +0200 2 From: "Lars Holmstrm" <lars.holmstrom@flysta.net>Y Subject: Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update Updat ( Message-ID: <3f05fb18$1@news.wineasy.se>  L Possible ? It is not supported. I also guess it can not since there are onlyK one single instance of many functionallity block like SYSGEN parameters etc * that are required by the (single) cluster.  G Why do you ask (Do you have a problem we can help you solve, or are you  simply curious) ?    /Lars     . "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message3 news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIGEIAHIAA.tom@kednos.com... C > Is it possible for a VMS image to be a member of two separate and ' > distinct clusters?  A cluster bridge?  >  > >-----Original Message----- 4 > >From: Nic Clews [mailto:sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]]& > >Sent: Friday, July 04, 2003 8:45 AM > >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComE > >Subject: Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa ! > >Technical Update Update Update  > >  > >  > >David McKenzie wrote: > >>K > >> It seems to me that this may be the time to address the whole issue of A > >> supported and unsupported. Without wishing to get to "legal"  > >this has alwaysH > >> been a "nice" concept, in the English sense rather than a real one. > >>? > >> When there was a "Digital" and it was really competing for  > >market share itC > >> was more than content to stretch for market share. Nowadays it  > >appears that F > >> people are obsessed by "contract" in the formal sense rather thanG > >> innovation. This is a debate that leads to lawyers splitting hairs  rather2 > >> than technicians dealing with practicalities. > >>D > >> Why isn't it possible to get back to a system where all players > >are honest,D > >> and there is that which is supported, i.e. no option but for HP > >to provide a E > >> solution, and that which is reasonable, "should work, negligence  > >accepted,B > >> but stupidity ignored", and " your on your own mate, it might > >work, but it  > >> might not". > >>A > >> There was a time where, and I mean this as a legal term, the  > >intent to actF > >> reasonablely, and accept reasonable risk was a commercial reality rather; > >> than a legal excuse to suck the hell out of inovation.  > >>, > >> Anyway, maybe this is too off the topic > > J > >No not really. I left in all what you said because it is correct and inH > >context. At the recent update, Andy Goldstein who came over to the UKK > >did talk specifically about clustering with VAX and he said, but gave no H > >public hint to, cluster wide features that could only ever be seen onJ > >Alpha and Itanium, and the participation of a VAX would prevent the useJ > >of the features to the non-VAX members. It's more technical than legal.K > >While it may be "innovative" to have a tri-architecture cluster, it will 6 > >also stifle it, due to the limitations of the same. > > H > >The support is a legal issue that is backed up with amount of effort.K > >With a given amount of effort, it could be spent perfecting the port and J > >the alignment of Alpha and Itanium, or spent including (supporting) theK > >VAX architecture, and limiting the former. I know what I'd vote for, and = > >I don't need a legal contract, it is down to practicality.  > >  > >-- B > >Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences > >nclews at csc dot com > >  > >---) > >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. = > >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). C > >Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 6/10/2003  > >  > --- ( > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).B > Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 6/10/2003 >    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:28:32 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>Y Subject: Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update Updat ) Message-ID: <3F05B93F.DCFAEE81@istop.com>    re: folks still running VAXEs   L If I were the onwer of VMS, I'd go to any/all VAX customers and ask them whyN they are still on VAX and what it would take to get them to upgrade to a newer5 platform. Until this is done, one can only speculate.   I Does HP want to get rid of VAX customers ASAP because they seen them as a N hindrance, or would it be very interested in getting those customers back intoG the "upgrade every couple of years" cycle that generates HP's revenus ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 19:46:15 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> Y Subject: Re: Tri-architecture cluster demonstrated at DECUS Ottawa Technical Update Updat ' Message-ID: <3F061FD7.DD5F9DB8@fsi.net>   > (cross posted to the General and Techical fora of OpenVMS.org)   JF Mezei wrote:  >  > re: folks still running VAXEs  > N > If I were the onwer of VMS, I'd go to any/all VAX customers and ask them whyP > they are still on VAX and what it would take to get them to upgrade to a newer7 > platform. Until this is done, one can only speculate.   H My speculation is: applications that will never be ported to VAX for anyE of a variety of reasons, including (but not limited to) the demise of . the original vendor, loss of source code, etc.  K > Does HP want to get rid of VAX customers ASAP because they seen them as a P > hindrance, or would it be very interested in getting those customers back intoI > the "upgrade every couple of years" cycle that generates HP's revenus ?   B My "hallucination" is that HP would like to get them back into theH revenue stream, but is not willing to "go the extra miles" that would be; necessary to reach that point. They can survive without it.   B Until HP prefers (for VMS) excellence over mere survival, I do notB foresee a change in their posture. Most of the VMS folks at HP areF Digital legacy (read: senior) employees. They have no desire to rejoinH the battle; they've long since lost their entrepreneurial "hunger". TheyH are in their comfort zone and, like any of us, will fight tooth and nailA to stay there, not realizing that (returning to the "Who Moved My E Cheese?" paradigm) the supply of "cheese" (read: VMS sites) is slowly B but surely dwindling and the "existing stock" (read: user base) isF getting old and stale. HP will "Hem and Haw" until they arrive one dayB to find no "cheese", and will then - like the masses - wonder whatH happened, rather making things happen like Sniff and Scurry: getting out% into "the maze" to find new "cheese".   G Y'know what? Someone (ANYone, Sue maybe?) tell me how many folks to buy G for and I will dip into my own funds and buy the "Who Moved My Cheese?" B desk calendar for each and every OpenVMS-related HP employee. I'llD deliver them, if someone inside HP will commit to distributing them.  B THAT will be MY contribution to the longevity of VMS. Fair enough?   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 14:01:03 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> " Subject: Re: ucx printing problems' Message-ID: <3F05CEEF.809ACD5D@fsi.net>    bayden cline wrote:  > M > Hello, i have just setup ucx 4.2 on a VMS 6.2 system and am trying to setup K > lpd printing to a couple of xerox document centers, the problem that i am K > running into is trying to print in landscape mode, it will just not do it L > everything is being outputed in portrat.  Just wondering if anyone has anyN > sujestions or help that they might be able to give in how to setup landscape > printing?  thanks in advance  H Refer to the Xerox documentation for the correct escape sequences and/orC post-script segments, then include the appropriate code in a device F control library (maybe call it XDCDEVCTL.TLB), build forms using those> text modules, and associate the library with the print queues.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 15:29:47 -0600 ( From: emanuel stiebler <emu@ecubics.com>O Subject: Re: VAX support (was: Re: OpenVMS Technical Seminar Highlights (some)) * Message-ID: <3F05F1CB.1040904@ecubics.com>   David J. Dachtera wrote:  F > What is needed is a direct VAX -> I64 migration tool. It could be asF > simple a .EXE -> Macro/32 translator that can understand a VAX imageH > without user intervention. (HINT! HINT! That banging sound you hear is > opportunity knocking!)  ? What's wrong with a VAX-Emulator for executing old VAX images ?    cheers   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 19:16:05 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> O Subject: Re: VAX support (was: Re: OpenVMS Technical Seminar Highlights (some)) ' Message-ID: <3F0618C5.697B0058@fsi.net>    emanuel stiebler wrote:  >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: > H > > What is needed is a direct VAX -> I64 migration tool. It could be asH > > simple a .EXE -> Macro/32 translator that can understand a VAX imageJ > > without user intervention. (HINT! HINT! That banging sound you hear is > > opportunity knocking!) > A > What's wrong with a VAX-Emulator for executing old VAX images ?   E Well, think about it: unless you can figure out how to provide for CI F interconnect, many VAX clusters cannot be duplicated using PC hardware; (due to the lack of CIPCA drivers for the underlying o.s.).   H Then again, there's the whole underlying o.s. thing: even on Alpha, whenF the Alpha crashes (yes, even VMS can bugcheck!), you lose the emulated VAX as well.  , Sorry, but even Charon-VAX is not a panacea.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 22:34:49 -0400 * From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <stan@stanq.com>O Subject: Re: VAX support (was: Re: OpenVMS Technical Seminar Highlights (some)) . Message-ID: <3F060109.18868.233AE24@localhost>  0 On 4 Jul 2003 at 19:16, David J. Dachtera wrote:. > Sorry, but even Charon-VAX is not a panacea.  F I agree with this statement.  CHARON-VAX makes sense for some people,  not all.   > emanuel stiebler wrote: C > > What's wrong with a VAX-Emulator for executing old VAX images ?   @ That's not a bad idea in some contexts.  You could have the VAX E emulation cluster with an Alpha, and send VAX-specific things to the  = emulation as a batch job, or a DECnet task-to-task operation.   G > Well, think about it: unless you can figure out how to provide for CI H > interconnect, many VAX clusters cannot be duplicated using PC hardware= > (due to the lack of CIPCA drivers for the underlying o.s.).   * This is where the Alpha flavor comes in...  J > Then again, there's the whole underlying o.s. thing: even on Alpha, whenH > the Alpha crashes (yes, even VMS can bugcheck!), you lose the emulated > VAX as well.  @ Yes, but if your Alpha is required to get work done, them's the C breaks.  If you follow the recommendation to not run anything else  A except emulation on a host (much more important for Windows than  D Alpha/VMS), losing the Alpha is the same as losing the emulated VAX.  E [Truth in advertising: I am a CHARON-VAX reseller.  Be sure to catch  6 my session at HP World covering this subject (#2166).]
 --Stan Quayle  Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------C Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  +1 614-868-1363  Fax: +1 614 868-1671 1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147 = Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.com    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2003 01:54:35 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> F Subject: Re: VMS makes "General News" section of HP's "Customer Times"G Message-ID: <vdqNa.64486$x4o.2788@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   7 "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> wrote in message # news:3F059A80.EFF460AE@istop.com...  > "Doc.Cypher" wrote: D > > JF on the other hand has gone from, "bash 'em for ignoring VMS",
 to what looks F > > like, "ignore 'em and hope they go back to a situation where I can
 bash 'em". > F > Wrong. All I have said is that I reserve judgement to see whether HP	 has truly ? > changed their mind about VMS and continues this by itself, or  whether this was1 > just a single event to shut up the complainers.     B JF's approach is somewhat like 'Gipper' Reagan in signing treatiesF with the Soviets about arms reduction - 'Trust, but verify.'   ....and I agree with him on that.   @ There's a big difference in producing .pdf files for the successF stories link on the HP web site, and carly (tm) standing in front of aB crowd of customers' Chairmen, CEO's, Presidents, and the like, andB extolling them to *buy* VMS (I used the word *buy* deliberately as; opposed to 'mentioning'), and HP spending real money on VMS E advertising in the types of publications talks about at various times 	 in c.o.v.   D I won't say that carly (tm) is HP's best salesperson, but she is theB most high profile one. If she can't stand in front of a customer'sB executive committee and pitch $50+MM in VMS hardware and services,@ then she shouldn't be in the job. Gerstner did this for IBM fromC time-to-time. Sooner or later the penny is going to drop and she'll @ realize that selling $50MM worth of VMS makes HP more money than selling $300MM of PeeCees.   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Jul 2003 05:29:04 -0000 4 From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]>F Subject: Re: VMS makes "General News" section of HP's "Customer Times"5 Message-ID: <20030705052904.9734.qmail@nym.alias.net>   9 On Sat, 05 Jul 2003, "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote: 8 >"JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> wrote in message$ >news:3F059A80.EFF460AE@istop.com... >> "Doc.Cypher" wrote:E >> > JF on the other hand has gone from, "bash 'em for ignoring VMS",  >to what looksG >> > like, "ignore 'em and hope they go back to a situation where I can  >bash 'em".  >>G >> Wrong. All I have said is that I reserve judgement to see whether HP 
 >has truly@ >> changed their mind about VMS and continues this by itself, or >whether this was 2 >> just a single event to shut up the complainers. >  > C >JF's approach is somewhat like 'Gipper' Reagan in signing treaties G >with the Soviets about arms reduction - 'Trust, but verify.'   ....and  >I agree with him on that. > A >There's a big difference in producing .pdf files for the success G >stories link on the HP web site, and carly (tm) standing in front of a C >crowd of customers' Chairmen, CEO's, Presidents, and the like, and C >extolling them to *buy* VMS (I used the word *buy* deliberately as < >opposed to 'mentioning'), and HP spending real money on VMSF >advertising in the types of publications talks about at various times
 >in c.o.v.  L I'd agree with that, JF's tone is a little to strident for my tastes though.  E >I won't say that carly (tm) is HP's best salesperson, but she is the C >most high profile one. If she can't stand in front of a customer's C >executive committee and pitch $50+MM in VMS hardware and services, A >then she shouldn't be in the job. Gerstner did this for IBM from D >time-to-time. Sooner or later the penny is going to drop and she'llA >realize that selling $50MM worth of VMS makes HP more money than  >selling $300MM of PeeCees.   G I hope so, but have indications that her front office staff are cluless  Winwoes weenies.     Doc. --  K OpenVMS.         Eight out of ten hackers prefer *other* operating systems.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:21:15 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com># Subject: Re: VMS-Upgrade from disk? ) Message-ID: <3F05B78B.97027BCD@istop.com>    Phillip Helbig wrote: I > I have heard of people installing from a copy of an ALPHA CD (for speed F > reasons).  Both are Files-11 CDs and an image copy is an image copy.  8 Mr Deininger mention BACKUP/IMAGE of the CD onto a disk.  E On VAX, one can simply copy the svaesets to some other drives and use C VMSINSTAL from there, installing over the currently running system.   N On ALPHA, must one absolutely boot from another drive (CD etc) to install on aK system disk, or can one simply copy the .PCSI files and do a product instal  over the running system ?    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 20:00:47 GMT A From: "Colin Butcher" <colin_DOT.butcher_AT@xdelta_DOT.co_DOT.uk> # Subject: Re: VMS-Upgrade from disk? = Message-ID: <P1lNa.1641$7Q1.10814629@news-text.cableinet.net>   L Oh yes. It's MUCH faster too. Even did it with an update to V4.3 a couple of) weeks back after copying kits to an RA60! I Whenever I'm doing systems upgrade work I take a pizza box and SCSI discs K with me - them merge all the pieces I need (patches, layered products etc.) K together onto a single disc and leave them a copy so they have a single kit C of parts rather than having to rake through all their CDs or tapes.   A -----------------------------------------------------------------  Hope this helps, Colin. ) colin DOT butcher AT xdelta DOT co DOT uk L Systems Archaeologist - Investigation & troubleshooting of older systems and	 networks.    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Jul 2003 00:11:10 +0200 2 From: "Lars Holmstrm" <lars.holmstrom@flysta.net># Subject: Re: VMS-Upgrade from disk? ( Message-ID: <3f05fb7d$1@news.wineasy.se>  " Can also be the same drive on VAX. /Lars 7 "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> wrote in message # news:3F05B78B.97027BCD@istop.com...  > Phillip Helbig wrote: K > > I have heard of people installing from a copy of an ALPHA CD (for speed H > > reasons).  Both are Files-11 CDs and an image copy is an image copy. > : > Mr Deininger mention BACKUP/IMAGE of the CD onto a disk. > G > On VAX, one can simply copy the svaesets to some other drives and use E > VMSINSTAL from there, installing over the currently running system.  > K > On ALPHA, must one absolutely boot from another drive (CD etc) to install  on aF > system disk, or can one simply copy the .PCSI files and do a product instal > over the running system ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 13:34:56 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> ( Subject: Re: what is VMS advanced Server' Message-ID: <3F05C8D0.22D182AC@fsi.net>    Kesav Tadimeti wrote:  >  > Hello all H > What exactly is the VMS advanced server & how is it different from theI > normal VMS? Does VMS also have a concept of workstation and server like 
 > windows?  C "Advanced Server" is a layered product, not a flavor of the o.s. As 7 others have noted, it was formerly known as Pathworks.    E Similar functionality is available in Samba for OpenVMS, but Samba is H still a bit "green" - configuration and administration of it takes a lotH more knowledge of its internals than really should be required. Samba isD freeware, however, where Adavanced Server client licenses tend to be+ priced on a par with VMS (i.e., excessive).o  F FWIW, workstation/server is not much of a distinction even in Windows.@ It was said that NT 4.0 could be installed as NT Server from theC workstation CD if you knew how to twiddle certain things. Also, the @ server CD contains server-side elements that were lacking on the workstation CD.i   -- l David J. Dachterah dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/u   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 20:55:32 GMTc+ From: LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (leslie)h( Subject: Re: what is VMS advanced Server: Message-ID: <8RlNa.41051$XV.2651062@twister.austin.rr.com>  0 David J. Dachtera (djesys.nospam@fsi.net) wrote: : H : FWIW, workstation/server is not much of a distinction even in Windows.B : It was said that NT 4.0 could be installed as NT Server from theE : workstation CD if you knew how to twiddle certain things. Also, the B : server CD contains server-side elements that were lacking on the : workstation CD.c :   E Here's an article that goes into more detail, including NT 4.0 having"5 a common kernel between NT Workstation and NT Server:p  D    ftp://ftp.ora.com/pub/examples/windows/win95.update/ntnodiff.html,    Minimal NT Server/Workstation Differences  <   "Differences Between NT Server and Workstation are Minimal'                                        7>    Registry Settings Used to Force Use of Microsoft Web Server  &    This page updated November 14, 1996    S    Andrew Schulman'    Senior Editor, O'Reilly & Associatesw    andrew@ora.comr    I@    Much of the research discussed in this article was done by NTI    Internals expert Dr. Mark Russinovich, a Consulting Associate for OpeneH    System Resources, Inc. Russinovich is coauthor of numerous NT systemsG    utilities, such as the NT registry monitor, the NT file monitor, and G    the NTFS file system for DOS. OSR specializes in file system, devicetH    driver, and data communications consulting, training, and developmentF    for Windows NT and other platforms. Neither Dr. Russinovich nor OSR=    are responsible for the conclusions drawn in this article.s    sH    This article has been written to describe and explain the differencesI    between Microsoft's Windows NT Server and NT Workstation products, notMI    for the purpose of encouraging readers to defeat Microsoft's licensing D    restrictions. The author and O'Reilly & Associates recommend thatI    readers carefully review the terms of Microsoft's NT license agreementp(    and comply in all respects therewith.    lF    For additional technical details, see the article "Six in One, Half?    Dozen in the Other? Inside the Difference Between Windows NT F    Workstation and Windows NT Server" in the Fall 1996 issue of The NT    Insider..."    2 --Jerry Leslie   (my opinions are strictly my own)9   Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for email'   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.367 ************************