1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 18 Jun 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 335       Contents: Re: Advanced Server Anomalie0 Re: An impressive amsterdam itanium vms demo ...0 Re: An impressive amsterdam itanium vms demo .../ Re: Another unix/linux cert ... but not on VMS! / Re: Another unix/linux cert ... but not on VMS! ! Backup Software for VMS and Linux % Re: Backup Software for VMS and Linux % Re: Backup Software for VMS and Linux % Re: Backup Software for VMS and Linux L Re: Change owner of the file from unpriv account with Control access allowedL Re: Change owner of the file from unpriv account with Control access allowedP Re: Change owner of the file from unpriv account with Control access allowed all Re: Clustering Re: cxx performance  Re: cxx performance P Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was Re: Installation P Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was Re: Installation P Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was Re: Installation + Digital Terminal Servers 8 Port only USD350 , Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboards, Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboards, Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboards, Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboards EVA-5000 performance monitoring # RE: EVA-5000 performance monitoring  Re: FC Tape on OpenVMS Re: FC Tape on OpenVMS0 HP's largest database customers - TopTen Program4 Re: HP's largest database customers - TopTen Program/ Re: IBM won't buy VMS ... has NIH syndrome too! + Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1 7 Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1 - question? 7 Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1 - question?   Re: Johnny English is a VMS user Re: lib$convert_date_string  Re: lib$convert_date_string  lib$spawn and persona services" Re: lib$spawn and persona services* Re: Max length of Nodename in OpenVMS 7.31* Re: Max length of Nodename in OpenVMS 7.31* Re: Max length of Nodename in OpenVMS 7.31' McNealy: SCO-IBM Spat Could Aid Solaris E Re: Motorola 68000 BSO cross assembler/Simulator available on VAX/VMS  Of VMS and chipmunks Re: Portents of Itanium death  Re: Portents of Itanium death  Re: Portents of Itanium death  Re: Portents of Itanium death  Re: Portents of Itanium death 7 Re: problem after upgrading to compaq (DEC) fortran 7.5 ' PW V5.0F ECO 2 and VMS V7.3-1 resources + Re: PW V5.0F ECO 2 and VMS V7.3-1 resources + Re: PW V5.0F ECO 2 and VMS V7.3-1 resources # Re: Rookie question for the experts # Re: Rookie question for the experts # Re: Rookie question for the experts # Re: Rookie question for the experts  SAN-SWitch 16 for only USD1895 Saving on HP World registration # Re: Saving on HP World registration # Re: Saving on HP World registration @ Re: SEC:U MIT-MAGIC-COOKIE-1, Motif 1.3 and HP TCP/IP XDM (long) Small village and IBM  Re: Sun to be the next DEC!  Re: Sun to be the next DEC!  Re: Sun to be the next DEC!  Re: Sun to be the next DEC! ; Sun's Migration Campaign To Target VMS (And Tru64 & HP3000)  Re: Suspended process  Re: VMS Freeware CDs Re: VMS Freeware CDs, Re: What Tape Library for VMS and FC cluster5 Re: WHY I WANT TO: Re: manually setting the ProcessID 3 Re: You say you want apps for VMS?  Here they come! , ZKO email problems re: CXML on OpenVMS Alpha0 Re: ZKO email problems re: CXML on OpenVMS Alpha@ Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?@ Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?@ Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?@ Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: RE: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:04:56 -0400 5 From: "Brad McCusker" <brad.mccuskerNosp@Mcompaq.com> % Subject: Re: Advanced Server Anomalie / Message-ID: <vevlneob6dj9e4@corp.supernews.com>   5 "John Brandon" <brandon@dalsemi.com> wrote in message + news:03061706335499@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com... L > > I've just noticed the following behaviour of Advanced Server (V7.3A-Eco1  > > under OpenVMS/Alpha V7.3-1): > > L > > If a subdirectory e.g. ABC.DIR exists and a file ABC., the directory ABCJ > > cannot be accessed via AdvancedServer, the error message says 'illegalB > > directory name'. Deleting the ABC. file and everything is o.k.  L Actually, that is a known problem, but, it isn't documented as a restiction. Perhaps it should be.   I There was a change made in V7.3A that would prevent you from getting into I that situation from the client side.  However, you could still do it from  the VMS (DCL) side of things.    > > / > > mit freundlichen Gr|_en | with best regards  > > # > > Karl Rohwedder iT-Ingenieurteam ' > > Ellernbruch 11 D-38112 Braunschweig  >  > Odd, it works fine with V7.2.  > H > The only time there is a problem if there is an null file name created > $ > Directory DISK$XXXXX:[XXXXXXX.ABC] > E > ;1                                            1/4       17-JUN-2003 F > ABC.;1                                         1/4       17-JUN-2003 >  > K > This will not allow you to see any files beyond the .;1 file.  Delete the  .;1 ( > and you can see the ABC.;1 no problem.  @ That one is known and fixed.  From the V7.3A-ECO1 release notes:  @      5.2.2 Directory Enumeration Incorrect If a File Named ".;1"%               Exists in the Directory                  Problem:  A               When a client attempts to display the contents of a E               directory that contains a file named ".;1", the display H               will be incorrect. For example, the directory might appear/               empty although it contains files.                  Solution:   G               This problem is resolved in Advanced Server V7.3-ECO1 for                OpenVMS.   Regards,  
 Brad McCusker  OpenVMS Engineering    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 17:54:43 -0400 . From: Steve DiPirro <steve.dipirro@oracle.com>9 Subject: Re: An impressive amsterdam itanium vms demo ... * Message-ID: <3EEF8E23.C9417857@oracle.com>  H I suddenly feel like I'm in the movie "Groundhog Day" for some reason...   John Smith wrote:   7 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message . > news:xt2dnUd0sJpt_HOjXTWJhA@metrocast.net... > > 9 > > "Bob Ceculski" <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message ; > > news:d7791aa1.0306161555.1d9b95af@posting.google.com... A > > > with all the depressing posts by people on this board about ; > > > amsterdam, this little tidbit must have slipped their  > > > feeble minds ... > > >  > > >  > > H > http://www.hp.com/products1/evolution/alpha_retaintrust/openvms/intere > x.html > > G > > While it may have slipped *your* feeble mind, Bob, I doubt that too  > manyH > > other people missed it - nor do I suspect they were unduly surprised	 > to find - > > that the VMS port had reached that stage.  > > H > > There has never been much doubt that the engineering team could port > VMS toF > > Itanic.  The main issues are rather whether it made sense to do soG > > (especially considering scrapping Alpha in the process) and whether 
 > it wouldC > > make any difference given the complete apathy VMS's owners have  > otherwise , > > shown toward the future of the platform. > G > A real advertising and marketing department would have taken this and D > made a full-page ad in the WSJ under really large print, "PromisesF > Made. Promises Kept." and then ended the ad with "Stay Tuned to This	 > Space."  > : > But since HP has no intention of advertising VMS, ...... > F > OVMS Engineering should take some time from the Itanic port and portD > VMS to Sony Playstation 2 or Xbox. There's your low-cost platform.F > Then they can put the hobbyist CD and some instructions as an insertG > in the Sunday paper the way AOL hands out CD's. They'd probably get 1 , > million new VMS users in a month that way.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 18:47:30 -0400 * From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>9 Subject: Re: An impressive amsterdam itanium vms demo ... 2 Message-ID: <EROdnWfvXY4SB3KjXTWJhA@metrocast.net>  ; "Steve DiPirro" <steve.dipirro@oracle.com> wrote in message $ news:3EEF8E23.C9417857@oracle.com...J > I suddenly feel like I'm in the movie "Groundhog Day" for some reason...  F That would be an improvement, since there they *finally* got it right.   - bill   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 18:20:59 +0000 (UTC) + From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb) 8 Subject: Re: Another unix/linux cert ... but not on VMS!+ Message-ID: <bcnm6b$c1c$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>   h In article <d7791aa1.0306170933.59a5aa35@posting.google.com>, bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) writes:_ >david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb) wrote in message news:<bcna4i$apc$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>... k >> In article <d7791aa1.0306170515.6890946d@posting.google.com>, bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski) writes: 9 >> >this would never happen on VMS, but on os's like unix 9 >> >and linux with such poor security models, it does ...  >> >Z >> >http://www.computerworld.com/securitytopics/security/holes/story/0,10801,82197,00.html >>  - >> Are you sure VMS isn't affected by this :-  >>   >> "Q >> Adobe Systems Inc.'s Acrobat Reader 5.06 is affected by the problem, as is the 9 >> open-source reader Xpdf 1.01, according to the report.  >>   >> " >>   >> XPDF is available on VMS. >>  R >> Note the problem is to do with the PDF reader calling out to run other programsM >> when it encounters a link and the potential for someone to write malicious R >> code which would allow them to affect other files OWNED by the USER running the >> pdf reader.   >>   >> "R >> In the report, Gilmore describes a problem in the way that PDF viewing programsL >> for the Unix platform process hyperlinks within valid PDF documents. WhenQ >> processing hyperlinks, common PDF readers use the Unix "shell" command (sh -c) O >> to launch and pass commands to external programs. For example, clicking on a Q >> hyperlink for a Web page would launch the associated Web browser, according to  >> the report. >> "O >> I would assume that a VMS based pdf reader port would similarly spawn out to   >> DCL to run external programs. >>   >>   >> "N >> While attackers are limited by the privilege level of the user clicking theP >> malicious link, the vulnerability could enable a remote attacker to use shellO >> commands to delete files from the user's hard drive or perform other actions 8 >> without the knowledge of the victim, the report said. >> " >>  N >> I don't see how VMS's security model would prevent this. The fact the shellI >> commands are different from Unix would provide protection from someone Q >> expecting the target system to be a unix system but it would probably be very  > >> easy to come up with links which would delete files on VMS. >>   >>  
 >> David Webb  >> VMS and Unix team leader  >> CCSS  >> Middlesex University  > B >I didn't even know a pdf reader was available for vms, but we run6 >our pdf readers on thin clients with a vt emulator!    F Well as well as XPDF there is a Java based PDF reader from Acrobat and7 you can also read PDF files with Ghostscript/Ghostview.      >I would never> >put unix shareware garbage on a vms system without it provingC >itself security wise ... why would you even take the risk when you = >can run your mail and web browser apps on a thin client w/vt D >emulation for vt or decwindows access?  That is asking for trouble!   So that means lets see :-    No JAVA  No PERL 	 No Python 	 No Apache 4 (No Oracle since it includes its own copy of Apache)
 No OpenSSL
 No Mozilla No Lynx  No PGP or GNuPG 
 No Ckermit   etc   G unless you have personally inspected every single line of code to prove  it's total security.  I Security is about balancing risks and benefits. No system not even VMS is N totally secure. VMS security model does provide a greater level of protection M against system compromises from installing buggy public domain packages than  M Unix systems. But it does not protect the user's own files from a program he  N runs whether it is ported Unix code or a program written specifically for VMS.  N I let students write and run their own CGI scripts with the OSU webserver. TheO scripts run under the username of the user so they can't destroy files owned by J other users. But if the user writes his CGI script incorrectly then anyone2 accessing it remotely could delete all his files. M This is a tradeoff of security against functionality. Perfectly acceptable on A a teaching system - totally unacceptable on a back office system.     
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 15:24:53 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)8 Subject: Re: Another unix/linux cert ... but not on VMS!= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0306171424.5260297b@posting.google.com>   ^ david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb) wrote in message news:<bcnm6b$c1c$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>... >  > So that means lets see :-  > 	 > No JAVA   2 not an absolute necessity for vms web services ...  	 > No PERL   ( right, use dibol/cobol/fortran/basic cgi   > No Python   # not needed for vms web services ...    > No Apache    no, purveyor ...  6 > (No Oracle since it includes its own copy of Apache)    oracle for db engine is fine ...   > No OpenSSL  2 only when necessary ... not as buggy as other apps   > No Mozilla  $ right, use a windoze thin client ...  	 > No Lynx   % useless, use windoze if necessary ...    > No PGP or GNuPG   , right, again use a vms 3 or 4 gl for cgi ...   > No Ckermit   no, unnecessary ...    >  > etc    depends what that is ...   > I > unless you have personally inspected every single line of code to prove  > it's total security. > K > Security is about balancing risks and benefits. No system not even VMS is P > totally secure. VMS security model does provide a greater level of protection O > against system compromises from installing buggy public domain packages than  O > Unix systems. But it does not protect the user's own files from a program he  P > runs whether it is ported Unix code or a program written specifically for VMS.  A correct, but you can take advantage of that security by not using ? risky stuff and use what vms has to offer, unless that new tech  proves itself ...    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 02:53:36 GMT ; From: "CHANGE username to westes" <DELETE_westes@uscsw.com> * Subject: Backup Software for VMS and LinuxE Message-ID: <QuQHa.52919$Io.5007556@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>   H I was told today that VMS cannot use an LTO-1 tape drive because of someJ limitation around writing odd-byte writes on LTO.   What options are there for using LTO-1 drives on VMS?  F What backup applications implement good agents for both VMS and Linux?K Could we run the LTO-1 drives on a Linux backup server, and then backup and D restore data for VMS through a VMS agent that works with that backup application?   What other options do we have?   -- Will  E NOTE:   To reply, CHANGE the username to westes AT earthbroadcast.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:48:27 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> . Subject: Re: Backup Software for VMS and Linux' Message-ID: <3EEFE10B.80CABE78@fsi.net>     CHANGE username to westes wrote: > J > I was told today that VMS cannot use an LTO-1 tape drive because of someL > limitation around writing odd-byte writes on LTO.   What options are there  > for using LTO-1 drives on VMS?   None.   H > What backup applications implement good agents for both VMS and Linux?M > Could we run the LTO-1 drives on a Linux backup server, and then backup and F > restore data for VMS through a VMS agent that works with that backup > application?   None.     > What other options do we have?   SDLT now, or wait for LTO-2.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 04:01:05 GMT ; From: "CHANGE username to westes" <DELETE_westes@uscsw.com> . Subject: Re: Backup Software for VMS and LinuxE Message-ID: <5uRHa.52987$Io.5016592@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>   L I was told that there is a VMS application that interfaces to Tivoli StorageK Manager named ABC (http://www.storserver.com) that integrates with VMS very H well and would allow you to run the LTO-1 tape drives on the TSM storage host.    -- Will  E NOTE:   To reply, CHANGE the username to westes AT earthbroadcast.com   < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3EEFE10B.80CABE78@fsi.net... " > CHANGE username to westes wrote: > > L > > I was told today that VMS cannot use an LTO-1 tape drive because of someH > > limitation around writing odd-byte writes on LTO.   What options are there " > > for using LTO-1 drives on VMS? >  > None.  > J > > What backup applications implement good agents for both VMS and Linux?K > > Could we run the LTO-1 drives on a Linux backup server, and then backup  and H > > restore data for VMS through a VMS agent that works with that backup > > application? >  > None.  > " > > What other options do we have? >  > SDLT now, or wait for LTO-2. >  > -- > David J. Dachtera  > dba DJE Systems  > http://www.djesys.com/ > * > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/  >    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 23:31:02 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) . Subject: Re: Backup Software for VMS and Linux3 Message-ID: <6ozo2t2uX844@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <3EEFE10B.80CABE78@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: " > CHANGE username to westes wrote: > I >> What backup applications implement good agents for both VMS and Linux? N >> Could we run the LTO-1 drives on a Linux backup server, and then backup andG >> restore data for VMS through a VMS agent that works with that backup  >> application?  >  > None.  >   < 	Sure, but you will have to do the rest of the digging. . .    	TSM has a server for Linux:  H http://www-3.ibm.com/software/tivoli/products/storage-mgr/platforms.html  5 http://www-3.ibm.com/software/tivoli/solutions/linux/   ; 	IBM has been hot after LTO since intro.  Ultrium is LTO-1.   > 	The TSM client for OpenVMS is sold by Storsol.  Their support= 	is excellent.  Their product works and works very well.  The C 	client is surprisingly cheap, I believe less than $2000 for Alpha  , 	departmental server but would have to look.  N http://www.storserver.com/main.cfm?menu=2&submenu=abc&detail=include/p_abc.inc  ! >> What other options do we have?    	Maybe Legato?   				Rob    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 00:31:50 GMT  From: Rob.Buxton@wcc.govt.nzU Subject: Re: Change owner of the file from unpriv account with Control access allowed $ Message-ID: <3eefb3b3.15654218@news>  D On Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:35:54 +0500, Valentin Likoum <me@privacy.net> wrote:   >Hello all,  > % >   I need to do the following thing:  >  ><DEMO SESSION>  >$ create test.txt >test  >^Z & >$ copy test.txt usr_home:[other_user]( >$ dir/sec usr_home:[other_user]test.txt >   >Directory USR_HOME:[OTHER_USER] > , >TEST.TXT;1           [VALENT]   (RWED,RE,,)> >(IDENTIFIER=OTH_ACC,ACCESS=READ+WRITE+EXECUTE+DELETE+CONTROL)> >             ^^^^^^^^                                 ^^^^^^^4 >$! copy to OTHER_USER directory succeeded as it has6 >$! appropriate ACL as well as marked ACL with OPT=DEF > 9 >$ set file USR_HOME:[OTHER_USER]TEST.TXT /own=OTHER_USER ? >%SET-E-NOTSET, error modifying USR_HOME:[OTHER_USER]TEST.TXT;1 4 >-SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object  >protection violation  >  >$ sho proc /ri  >... >Process rights:* >  VALENT                         resource% >  INTERACTIVE                      ^ % >  REMOTE                           | - >  OTH_ACC          <-------------- Note this  >  ></DEMO SESSION> > 3 >Well, time to read the Guide to system security... # >... and in section 5.4.2 we found:  >  ><QUOTE> >type of access - Control  > < >Gives you the right to change the protection code and ACL. 8 >You need to satisfy one of the following conditions to  >change the owner: > 6 >- (1) Hold both the old and the new owner identifier.: >- (2) Hold the Resource attribute to the identifier that < >owns the object while also being allowed control access to ) >the object through an ACL on the object. 7 >- (3) Qualify as a system user, hold SYSPRV or BYPASS  < >privilege, or hold a UIC that matches that of the owner of - >the volume containing the file or directory. = >- (4) Hold the GRPPRV privilege while also holding a UIC in  $ >the same group as the object owner.	 ></QUOTE>  > > >   Well, I think I satisfy the second condition - my process > >holds the identifier VALENT with Resource attribute and this = >identifier owns the file and I am allowed Control access to  : >the file through OTH_ACC right identifier and ACL on the 2 >file. So what's wrong here? Why -SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV?5 >   Alpha OVMS 7.3 with approprite patches installed   >(excluding SYS5 and SYS6).  >   Thank you. >  >--  >Best regards, >  Valentin * >  valentin.likoum at ncc dot volga dot ru >  I'm guessing a bit, but...E You've got permission to change the protection and/or acl of the file > but you're actually tring to change the ownership of the file.  4 So, it's a Privilege issue, not a permissions issue.; I think you may need the  CMKRNL privilege to achieve this.    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 17:08:55 -0700# From: dooleys@snowy.net.au (dooley) U Subject: Re: Change owner of the file from unpriv account with Control access allowed = Message-ID: <1ca82fc6.0306171608.3040c9bd@posting.google.com>   c Valentin Likoum <me@privacy.net> wrote in message news:<bcmgco$ki5og$1@ID-184585.news.dfncis.de>...  > Hello all, > & >    I need to do the following thing: >  > <DEMO SESSION> > $ create test.txt  > test > ^Z' > $ copy test.txt usr_home:[other_user] ) > $ dir/sec usr_home:[other_user]test.txt  > ! > Directory USR_HOME:[OTHER_USER]  > - > TEST.TXT;1           [VALENT]   (RWED,RE,,) ? > (IDENTIFIER=OTH_ACC,ACCESS=READ+WRITE+EXECUTE+DELETE+CONTROL) ? >              ^^^^^^^^                                 ^^^^^^^ 5 > $! copy to OTHER_USER directory succeeded as it has 7 > $! appropriate ACL as well as marked ACL with OPT=DEF  > : > $ set file USR_HOME:[OTHER_USER]TEST.TXT /own=OTHER_USER@ > %SET-E-NOTSET, error modifying USR_HOME:[OTHER_USER]TEST.TXT;15 > -SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object   > protection violation >  > $ sho proc /ri > ...  > Process rights: + >   VALENT                         resource & >   INTERACTIVE                      ^& >   REMOTE                           |. >   OTH_ACC          <-------------- Note this >  > </DEMO SESSION>  > 4 > Well, time to read the Guide to system security...$ > ... and in section 5.4.2 we found: > 	 > <QUOTE>  > type of access - Control > = > Gives you the right to change the protection code and ACL.  9 > You need to satisfy one of the following conditions to   > change the owner:  > 7 > - (1) Hold both the old and the new owner identifier. ; > - (2) Hold the Resource attribute to the identifier that  = > owns the object while also being allowed control access to  * > the object through an ACL on the object.8 > - (3) Qualify as a system user, hold SYSPRV or BYPASS = > privilege, or hold a UIC that matches that of the owner of  . > the volume containing the file or directory.> > - (4) Hold the GRPPRV privilege while also holding a UIC in % > the same group as the object owner. 
 > </QUOTE> > ? >    Well, I think I satisfy the second condition - my process  ? > holds the identifier VALENT with Resource attribute and this  > > identifier owns the file and I am allowed Control access to ; > the file through OTH_ACC right identifier and ACL on the  3 > file. So what's wrong here? Why -SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV? 6 >    Alpha OVMS 7.3 with approprite patches installed  > (excluding SYS5 and SYS6). >    Thank you.  Just a guess... 8 Maybe you should $set /rights /attrib=(resource) OTH_ACC8 For similar situations I have used BACKUP/OWNER=PARENT   Phil   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 09:46:20 +0500 & From: Valentin Likoum <me@privacy.net>Y Subject: Re: Change owner of the file from unpriv account with Control access allowed all 5 Message-ID: <bcoqr0$lcntn$1@ID-184585.news.dfncis.de>    Rob.Buxton@wcc.govt.nz wrote: F > On Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:35:54 +0500, Valentin Likoum <me@privacy.net> > wrote: >  [snip]	 >><QUOTE>  >>type of access - Control >>= >>Gives you the right to change the protection code and ACL.  9 >>You need to satisfy one of the following conditions to   >>change the owner:  >>7 >>- (1) Hold both the old and the new owner identifier. ; >>- (2) Hold the Resource attribute to the identifier that  = >>owns the object while also being allowed control access to  * >>the object through an ACL on the object.8 >>- (3) Qualify as a system user, hold SYSPRV or BYPASS = >>privilege, or hold a UIC that matches that of the owner of  . >>the volume containing the file or directory.> >>- (4) Hold the GRPPRV privilege while also holding a UIC in % >>the same group as the object owner. 
 >></QUOTE> >>> >>  Well, I think I satisfy the second condition - my process ? >>holds the identifier VALENT with Resource attribute and this  > >>identifier owns the file and I am allowed Control access to ; >>the file through OTH_ACC right identifier and ACL on the  3 >>file. So what's wrong here? Why -SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV? 5 >>  Alpha OVMS 7.3 with approprite patches installed   >>(excluding SYS5 and SYS6). >>  Thank you. >> >  > I'm guessing a bit, but...G > You've got permission to change the protection and/or acl of the file @ > but you're actually tring to change the ownership of the file. > 6 > So, it's a Privilege issue, not a permissions issue.= > I think you may need the  CMKRNL privilege to achieve this.  >   =    No, accordinly to manual quoted above user can change the  ; owner of the object in certain conditions without elevated  9 privileges. In my case suggestion of Joseph Huber (thank  < you, Joseph) make sense - I need to have resource attribute : on the target identifier as I could affect disk quotas of . that identifier then change file' owner to it.   --  
 Best regards, 
   Valentin)   valentin.likoum at ncc dot volga dot ru    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 15:33:20 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)  Subject: Re: Clustering = Message-ID: <cf15391e.0306171433.256aad02@posting.google.com>   f "Insomnee" <robert.heyes@btinternet.com> wrote in message news:<bcidjf$2m3$1@sparta.btinternet.com>...N > How do I tell which route my SCS traffic is taking? We have it configured soN > that we have redundancy at the suggestion of our engineer, but he didnt knowK > how to tell which path it is taking so we could test it. I would tell you H > how we have it configured at present, but I cant remember from memory.  C You didn't say which interconnect(s) are involved.  You also didn't ( say what version of VMS you are running.  F If you have different types of interfaces, VMS tends to select and use, a single one, in the order of preference of:2 1. Galaxy Shared Memory Cluster Interconect (SMCI) 2. Memory Channel  3. CI  4. DSSI   5. LANs such as Ethernet or FDDID unless you're running 7.3-1 or above, in which case a fast LAN (e.g.C Gigabit Ethernet or Fast Ethernet) may be placed higher in the list B than CI or DSSI.  (This selection is based on relative theoretical bandwidths.)  C If you have multiple adapters of either CI, DSSI, or Memory Channel C type, or if you have a mix of interconnect types, VMS will use only ? one of the interconnect types at a time between a given pair of / systems.  Use $SHOW CLUSTER/CONTINUOUS with ADD E CIRCUITS,CONNECTIONS,LPORT_NAME and look for the port pair being used  by the VMS$VAXcluster SYSAP.  C If you have no CI, DSSI, Memory Channel, or SMCI in place, but have F multiple LAN adapters, PEDRIVER tends to use multiple adapters at onceD (prior to 7.3, it transmitted cluster packets from a given node to aE given remote node over only one LAN adapter at a time, but in 7.3 and B above it will transmit on multiple adapters to a given remote node simultaneously).  F If you're not sure of your LAN cluster interconnect configuration, youC can use http://encompasserve.org/~parris/show_segments.com to get a D drawing of all the LAN paths enabled for cluster communications, andF then to see what paths are actually being used at a given instant, useD show_paths.com (or show_paths_ecs.com for 7.3 and above, which shows@ which channels are being used to transmit packets as part of the) Equivalent Channel Set to a remote node).    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:01:31 GMT , From: "Kenneth Block" <krblock@computer.org> Subject: Re: cxx performance1 Message-ID: <%cMHa.2787$uZ.1279@news.cpqcorp.net>   H A problem report (cxxc_bugs10188) has been logged against the HP VMS C++K compiler to review your performance issue. Hopefully this performance issue < can be reviewed while we are preparing for the next release.   ------------------------------   Date: 17 Jun 2003 20:50 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)  Subject: Re: cxx performance- Message-ID: <17JUN200320500012@gerg.tamu.edu>   8 "Johan Nilsson" <johan.nilsson@esrange.ssc.se> writes...6 }"Nic Clews" <sendspamhere@127.0.0.1> wrote in message$ }news:3EEEDF47.CE064EF1@127.0.0.1... }> Johan Nilsson wrote:  }> > } [snip] }> > envronment.  }>D }> My point here is around the file systems. XP has a fair amount ofG }> optimization added. The executive of 7.3 is leaner with a read cache ( }> *but no write back cache* as with XP. }>K }> I suggest you need a read cacher, on 7.1 you'll have to buy in a caching G }> product, but free trials of the software are available. Do this only  }> after the following advice. }>D }> We are talking tuning this system as a compilation engine, you've@ }> already mentioned adjusting a few parameters but here's a fewD }> suggestions in that area. Increase channelcnt and fillm, make theI }> wsdefault and wsquota the same big size as allowable by the memory you K }> have (observation required). For the file system, increase the values of A }> extend size, make sure highwater marking is off, make sure the G }> cxx$startup file has been run, use bypass privilege (controversial!)  } 5 }I'd say ... not something you'd normally like to do.  }  }>J }> Use AUTOGEN FEEDBACK data to size up some of the variables, bump up theG }> ACP (sic) caches, with only 1 or 2 disks, mount /processor=unique to  }> keep the caches separate. }  }  }>B }> This is by no means exhaustive, and I would also add individualJ }> circumstances may vary, others will have different but possibly equally  }> effective ideas of tuning up. }>G }> I'd suggest observing MONITOR MODES during your compilation, no idle H }> time and 50 to 75% user mode and I don't think you'll get much betterJ }> out of the system. Any idle time would suggest that the IO system couldB }> be holding things up, low user mode (and no idle) would suggest* }> operating system overhead is excessive. }  }Thanks, good suggestion.  } 	 }// Johan   F Tuning your system is often a good idea, but my suggestion is that you3 reconsider which should be faster, and by how much.   C What PC hardware is XP running on? As I recall your Alpha is an EV5 D (or 56) system clocked at 500 MHz (or slower) that you are comparingK it to. This system should be the equivalent of at most a 1 GHz Pentium-III, H and probably only 800MHz (as a compile is, as far as I know, pretty muchD entirely integer instructions, the Alpha's fast floating point won'tG help you). Then there is the disk drives. Are they of comparable speed?vG If the disk drive in the Alpha is of the same vintage as the Alpha, but J the one on the PC is new then the one on the PC could easily be 50% fasterG or more - cxx compiles do a lot of disk I/O. There are also things like F memory speed. I'm not sure what a DPWS uses, probably PC100. Your PC'sG memory could be transfering data a lot faster (even taking into accountfL that it is probably only half as wide, a recent vintage PC's memory transfer- rate is still likely to be about 50% higher).   F As much as people in these parts malign PCs, you should note that a PCD of recent vintage is fast. Very fast. Even compared to most Alphas -I especially one that is as old as an EV5 or 56. (A DS10/600 would probablyoH be at least twice as fast as the Alpha you have, and even that is around two years old now.)H  C Would you compare the speed of the compile on a new PC to the speed D on a 4 year old PC and expect them to be anywhere near each other in performance?   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 17:58:15 GMTi3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond)oY Subject: Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was Re: Installation n0 Message-ID: <XEIHa.2770$sJ.875@news.cpqcorp.net>  @ In article <OFF3BD5A43.CF51B8C8-ON85256D48.00553609@metso.com>,  norm.raphael@metso.com writes: ..L >It seems to me that anything like this inside paired double-quotation marks >should not be checked/flagged.p  $ Your opinion is valid; mine differs.  9 In almost all cases paranthesis inside quotes are paired.h; Of cource, DCL doesn't care, but this is a sort of one-plus_ in my view.   E > 2141  PSQ-W  possible error using single-quote (') in quoted stringa >e- >[$librarian /text /extract="''sft_opt''1" -]h  & This is a bogus error, not a real one.C The library module being extracted actually contains the singl quoti$ charactter, "'", in its module-name.    E > 2558  ICF-W  possible invalid character found (& in PIPE) (warning)  >n3 >where the code contains the quite common constructn >oD >[(symbol_name = expression | define/job logical_name &symbol_name)] ..H >                     ...  It is unfortunate that this cannot be somehowD >identified as valid to remove the need for that particular warning.  @ I agree, but don't know how to do this without possibly missing  real erros.h  G >Charlie, wouldn't it be grand if someone just ran all these proceduresh? >through the tool before releasing the next version of OpenVMS?o  I I try to check the installation/upgrade procedures each time they change.sF Also any other DCL that I, personally change tends to get DCL_CHECKED.I But some OpenVMS supplied DCL procedures are, shall we say, a bit outsideoH the mainstream in the sorts of things they do and the ways in which theyG do these things.   For a real experience, run DCL_CHECK on AUTOGEN.COM.S   -- rJ       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:48:24 -0400  From: norm.raphael@metso.comY Subject: Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was Re: Installation R? Message-ID: <OF8401FCF6.A45616F2-ON85256D48.00655E72@metso.com>R   >w  . > From:     hammond@not on 06/17/2003 01:58 PM  A > Please respond to hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond)t   > To:  Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > cc:  >!J > Subject:  Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was3        Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1)] >O >lA > In article <OFF3BD5A43.CF51B8C8-ON85256D48.00553609@metso.com>,n  > norm.raphael@metso.com writes: > ..H > >It seems to me that anything like this inside paired double-quotation marks ! > >should not be checked/flagged.e >O& > Your opinion is valid; mine differs. > ; > In almost all cases paranthesis inside quotes are paired.u= > Of cource, DCL doesn't care, but this is a sort of one-plusM
 > in my view.O >l  J I guess, as usual, I cannot quibble with erring on side of caution; better  to check it out than to miss it.    G > > 2141  PSQ-W  possible error using single-quote (') in quoted stringc > >r/ > >[$librarian /text /extract="''sft_opt''1" -]A >a( > This is a bogus error, not a real one.G > The library module being extracted actually contains the single quotee% > character ("'") in its module-name.. > H Boy, that's a good one.  Why should DCL get in the way of module-naming!H This is a clear case of why the author of the procedure should check it.   >eG > > 2558  ICF-W  possible invalid character found (& in PIPE) (warning)n > >r5 > >where the code contains the quite common constructe > >lF > >[(symbol_name = expression | define/job logical_name &symbol_name)] > ..J > >                     ...  It is unfortunate that this cannot be somehowF > >identified as valid to remove the need for that particular warning. >tA > I agree, but don't know how to do this without possibly missingo > real errors. >i  K Sigh.  I knew that would be the answer, and I don't know how either.  Sigh.   I > >Charlie, wouldn't it be grand if someone just ran all these procedures A > >through the tool before releasing the next version of OpenVMS?s >pK > I try to check the installation/upgrade procedures each time they change.XH > Also any other DCL that I, personally change tends to get DCL_CHECKED.K > But some OpenVMS supplied DCL procedures are, shall we say, a bit outside-J > the mainstream in the sorts of things they do and the ways in which theyI > do these things.   For a real experience, run DCL_CHECK on AUTOGEN.COM.i  B Well, as it turned out, this procedure had zero actual DCL errors.  J As to AUTOGEN, I have already fixed it mightily, and have had to correct aH bug, and have submitted both the fix and the stuff revealed by DCL_CHECK@ back, and I am waiting for V7.3-2 to see if everything is clean.   >a > --G >       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FLp USAhH >           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)@ >       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.c >S  F P.S.  I forgot to say, "Thanks for the pointers to the logical names." -N.R.M   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 19:36:24 GMT33 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond)oY Subject: Re: DCL_CHECK of SYS$COMMON:AXPVMS$PCSI_INSTALL.COM (sic) (was Re: Installation 20 Message-ID: <Y4KHa.2779$dR.358@news.cpqcorp.net>  @ In article <OF8401FCF6.A45616F2-ON85256D48.00655E72@metso.com>,  norm.raphael@metso.com writes:  H >> > 2141  PSQ-W  possible error using single-quote (') in quoted string >> >0 >> >[$librarian /text /extract="''sft_opt''1" -] >>) >> This is a bogus error, not a real one.9H >> The library module being extracted actually contains the single quote& >> character ("'") in its module-name. >>I >Boy, that's a good one.  Why should DCL get in the way of module-naming! I >This is a clear case of why the author of the procedure should check it./   DCL doesn't get in the way.lH The thing is that some of the text modules in the PCSI Product text file1 include the single quote charater in their names.w  < SO, for example, if the symob SFT_OPT contained "TCPIP_KIT",E the the librarian command would extreac the module named "TCPIP_KIT'"g  ; Do a LIBR/LIST/TEXT on any PCSI$TLB file for more examples.s/ (Look in SYS$SYSDEVICE:[VMS$COMMON]*.PCSI$TLB.)e    K >As to AUTOGEN, I have already fixed it mightily, and have had to correct a I >bug, and have submitted both the fix and the stuff revealed by DCL_CHECKwA >back, and I am waiting for V7.3-2 to see if everything is clean.v  J Ah yes.  That was YOU.  I checked that fix in for V7.3-2 back in February.H Others have propigated it to the V7.3 and V7.3-1 remedial streams, so it5 should be in these remedial kits soon if not already.p   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 19:24:56 -0400a, From: "David Turner" <dbturner@islandco.com>4 Subject: Digital Terminal Servers 8 Port only USD350/ Message-ID: <vev93ho2nbk118@news.supernews.com>1    We have about 20 of these left .G These are not in any way perfect looking but fully functional - plastici# vents on side are slightly damaged.O  F Part no is DSRVW-ZC - purchased from large Government agency - cleaned tested with 30 day warranty -3   Call if interested   -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp.  2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404d Tel: 912 4476622 Fax: 912 2010402 http://www.islandco.com  dbturner-at-hpaq.net (Change the -at- to @ to reply),   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:43:35 +0100e" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>5 Subject: Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboardsq% Message-ID: <3EEF7D77.20104@spam.com>1   Paul Sture wrote:pJ > In article <3EEDA906.52ECC327@127.0.0.1>, Nic Clews <sendspamhere@127.0= =2E0.1> writes:v >=20 >>Paul Sture wrote:e >>J >>>My heartful thanks to the person who recommended putting my LK keyboar= d@ >>>through the dishwasher. >>>h >>>It is beatifully clean now. >>>h) >>>But a pity it doesn't work any more...i >>J >>After 1 or two episodes of cleaning out keyboards I've talked about her= epJ >>before, you can also dismantle the keyboard for a proper electrical fix= =2ElD >>It is a matter of removing all the keys gently and opening all theD >>catches under the keyboard and between the keys, then the case andH >>membranes can be easily separated and cleaned, but don't rub too hard.E >>Make sure it is absolutely bone dry before reassembling, and having @ >>another keyboard to look at while putting the keys back helps. >>J >>If the kb still refuses to work, it could be track or other damage that=  J >>is beyond repair. Track type damage often affects a row or two, or line=  
 >>of keys. >> >=20 >=20C > Thanks for that. A day's more drying in the sun has got it almost E > working again. The space bar is still sticking, but it is progress.l   Paul, I miss you !   :-)o   D. --=20l- Didier Morandi sarl au capital de 8 000 euroso-   19 chemin de la Butte 31400 Toulouse Francet/   T=E9l: 33(0)5 6120 1964 Fax: 33(0)5 6154 1928 &           http://www.didiermorandi.com                    RC en cours   ------------------------------   Date: 17 Jun 2003 21:02 CDTs' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)o5 Subject: Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboards>- Message-ID: <17JUN200321024679@gerg.tamu.edu>l  r In article <2RFHa.2737$lv.2468@news.cpqcorp.net>, "John E. Malmberg" <Malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq.hp> writes... }David Michaels wrote: }> Paul Sture wrote: }> iJ }>>My heartful thanks to the person who recommended putting my LK keyboard }>>through the dishwasher. }>>t }>>It is beatifully clean now. }>>r) }>>But a pity it doesn't work any more...  }>> # }> WD-40 = water displacement - 40 c }> fJ }> I've never seen it harm electronics. Not to say it can't, but I haven't }> seen it.  } D }Any high pressure stream of gas or other small propellent, if fast F }enough can build up a static charge and can destroy some electronics. } G }I know from personal experience spray paint has enough pressure to do sG }that.  I was attempting to waterproof a circuit, coincidentally for a eG }keyboard, back in the days when people were building Z80 based systems  }from parts. }  } J }The fumes from WD-40 are quite combustable for at least a minute or two, 3 }so any sparks near them can cause a fire to start.i } H }The small spark from the ON/OFF switch of most electrical devices that 0 }do not have specially rated switches is enough. }  }-John  ? Your keyboard gets dirty, so you run it through the dishwasher.e? It then doesn't work so you use WD-40 on it to dry it out. Whenc= you plug it in it bursts into flames. This then triggers yourz& machine room's fire suppresion system.   Now that's comedy.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:33:25 -0400.* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>5 Subject: Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboards ( Message-ID: <3EEFDD7F.1A7BCC8@istop.com>   "David J. Dachtera" wrote:E > The petroleum distillates it contains can do considerable damage tox/ > plastic and rubber products. Not recommended.f  N You should note that Digital had won environmental awards when it developped a* way to clear PCB boards with... WATER !!!!  E (I assume it may have been finely pulverised water at high pressure).    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:29:52 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>e5 Subject: Re: Do's and don'ts about cleaning keyboardsl' Message-ID: <3EEFCEA0.849FAAFB@fsi.net>i   David Michaels wrote:  >  > Paul Sture wrote:  > >cK > > My heartful thanks to the person who recommended putting my LK keyboard  > > through the dishwasher.S > >d > > It is beatifully clean now.- > >-* > > But a pity it doesn't work any more... > >r > > -- > > Paul Sture > ! > WD-40 = water displacement - 40i > I > I've never seen it harm electronics. Not to say it can't, but I haven'tt
 > seen it.  C The petroleum distillates it contains can do considerable damage ton- plastic and rubber products. Not recommended.e   -- s David J. DachteraJ dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:35:32 -0400 " From: "Hal Kuff" <kuff@tessco.com>( Subject: EVA-5000 performance monitoring- Message-ID: <bcnn2e$sf2@library2.airnews.net>   G     We have 3 EVA5000 storage arrays.  My understanding is that no tool,K exists that would show the i/o read and write rates on units in the SAN....sJ It appears that the only tool available is host based and shows the effectC of reads/writes woth all of the caches inline....  We are primarilyhE interested in what the SAN is actually doing... rememebr VTDPY on thel HSZ/HSJ/HSG...   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 16:16:02 -0400n From: koskaj@bender.com , Subject: RE: EVA-5000 performance monitoring< Message-ID: <03061716160218.ea7a.36917038@alaxp3.bender.com>  A >From:	SMTP%"kuff@tessco.com"  "Hal Kuff" 17-JUN-2003 14:48:07.63  >To:	Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >CC:	t& >Subj:	EVA-5000 performance monitoring > H >    We have 3 EVA5000 storage arrays.  My understanding is that no toolL >exists that would show the i/o read and write rates on units in the SAN....K >It appears that the only tool available is host based and shows the effectsD >of reads/writes woth all of the caches inline....  We are primarilyF >interested in what the SAN is actually doing... rememebr VTDPY on the >HSZ/HSJ/HSG...u >o   Would HP Fabric Watch help?  -  K I believe it enables features resident in the firmware and hardware of the d HP StorageWorks SAN switches.    :) jck   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:21:00 +0200o/ From: "Marc Van Dyck" <marc.vandyck@brutele.be>  Subject: Re: FC Tape on OpenVMSe* Message-ID: <bcnpmh$ua0$1@news.brutele.be>  : On the other hand, if you have OpenVMS V7.3-1, you can getA rid of all the SCSI stuff, and attach the tape drive to the Alphah> host directly. We did that with STK 9840 and 9940 too, but you: have to set the FC HBA in arbitrated loop mode rather than switched fabric.  < With brocade switches in between, we haven't tried yet. With Omniserves, it works OK.   Marc.a   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:28:21 -0500L1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>H Subject: Re: FC Tape on OpenVMS ' Message-ID: <3EEFCE45.3EBE99C6@fsi.net>a   Marc Van Dyck wrote: > < > On the other hand, if you have OpenVMS V7.3-1, you can getC > rid of all the SCSI stuff, and attach the tape drive to the Alpha  > host directly.  # The drives are LVD-SCSI, not Fibre.    --   David J. Dachterar dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/k   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 17:32:52 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) 9 Subject: HP's largest database customers - TopTen Program/= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0306171632.19bd5280@posting.google.com>.  = Winter Corporation's TopTen Program is a global campaign that C identifies the largest and fastest-growing databases in the world. tA Participating in the program provides visibility of HP customers'sF success at building, managing, or using the world's largest databases.  A If you're an HP customer with a very large database running on HPoA systems (AlphaServer, Superdome, or NonStop), please visit the HP C Business Intelligence site at http://www.hp.com/go/bi/ and click on C the link at the top right for the Top Ten Program, and fill out thee9 short survey.  Winter Corp. will send you a gift just forhA participating and you'll be eligible for awards.  Surveys will beE accepted until July 31.u   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 02:24:00 GMTa# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> = Subject: Re: HP's largest database customers - TopTen ProgramoI Message-ID: <43QHa.130011$3Sm.72994@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>h  > "Keith Parris" <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:cf15391e.0306171632.19bd5280@posting.google.com...e? > Winter Corporation's TopTen Program is a global campaign thatVD > identifies the largest and fastest-growing databases in the world.C > Participating in the program provides visibility of HP customers'T= > success at building, managing, or using the world's largestp
 databases. >oC > If you're an HP customer with a very large database running on HPyC > systems (AlphaServer, Superdome, or NonStop), please visit the HPnE > Business Intelligence site at http://www.hp.com/go/bi/ and click onjE > the link at the top right for the Top Ten Program, and fill out thei; > short survey.  Winter Corp. will send you a gift just for.C > participating and you'll be eligible for awards.  Surveys will beu > accepted until July 31.   1 I don't think you'll get a response from the NSA.o   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:37:45 -0400s* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>8 Subject: Re: IBM won't buy VMS ... has NIH syndrome too!) Message-ID: <3EEFD077.CF9310E4@istop.com>,   John Smith wrote: A > a) hp has bashed 'proprietary o/s'es as 'bad' for so long, that ' > advertising VMS makes them lose face.u  M Why then did HP buy Compaq ? The only distinctive stuff Compaq brought HP waslR VMS and Tandem.  They are ditching Alpha and Tru64.  The rest is all wintel stuff.  L And by many standards, isn't HP-UX just as proprietary as VMS ? You can onlyC buy it from HP, right ? Does anyone else provide official support ?I    F > b) it's better not say anything about ANY of the o/s'es you own than > to praise ANY or ALL of them.o  H Why then does HP have no problem mentioning HP-UX, Tandem NSK, Linux and windows ? (omitting only VMS).  C > customers, which means selling against hp, among others. Properly0E > advertised and marketed, VMS could make significant sales gains. HPe1 > wouldn't want that to occur at their expense...s  I This is where I really don't know HP's true understanding of VMS. Does HP:G believe that VMS is a "legacy" OS that is on its last days with no real L potential (or which woudl require megabucks to bring it back to life), or doE they see it as an OS with great potential... to hurt HP-UX sales ????h   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 20:24:24 GMT." From: Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org>4 Subject: Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1' Message-ID: <3EEF78FD.60209@ebruno.org>   6 Here is last file lines of the output when it freezes:  E %PCSI-I-DELFIL, deleted DKA0:[000000.PCSI$WRK26.][SYS.HELP]CDSA.HLP;1  %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created l; DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DAALPROXY_SHR.EXE;1S %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created E< DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.ESW;1 %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created o< DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.EXE;1 %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created  ; DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$EAYCSP300_SHR.EXE;1T     Charlie Hammond wrote:* > In article <3EEEA595.20407@ebruno.org>, & > Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org> writes: >  > / >>I have an Aspen Durango II (164LX) Alpha box.i/ >>I am having problem installing OpenVMS 7.3.1.f >  > .. > . >>The install starts and gets to 60% point and6 >>just freezes no message no response at the keyboard. >  > .. > , >>Is there way to get log or trace info ...? >  >  > Yes. >  > Select the DCL option, then) > 4 >     $$$ DEFINE/SYSTEM AXPVMS$PCSI_LOG_TRACE "BOTH" > andb8 >     $$$ DEFINE/SYSTEM AXPVMS$PCSI_EXECUTE_VERIFY "YES" > I > LOGOUT from DCL to return to the main menu, then [re]do the insallationV
 > or upgrade.p > I > This will generate a *LOT* of output.  The last lines before the "hang"iG > will give an indicatin of where exactly the process is "stuck".  Copyo@ > them _exactly_ and post them -- 5-10 lines is probably enough. >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 17:29:47 -0400e From: norm.raphael@metso.com@ Subject: Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1 - question?? Message-ID: <OF7677A225.13543627-ON85256D48.0075EFDA@metso.com>a   [interrupting the analysis]s8 Is that a comma after "[VMS$COMMON" and is that correct? [end of interruption]s  : From:  Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org> on 06/17/2003 04:24 PM  . Please respond to Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org>   To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com cc:u  7 Subject:    Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1r    6 Here is last file lines of the output when it freezes:  E %PCSI-I-DELFIL, deleted DKA0:[000000.PCSI$WRK26.][SYS.HELP]CDSA.HLP;1  %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created; DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DAALPROXY_SHR.EXE;1- %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created< DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.ESW;1 %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created< DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.EXE;1 %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created; DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$EAYCSP300_SHR.EXE;1n     Charlie Hammond wrote:) > In article <3EEEA595.20407@ebruno.org>,5& > Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org> writes: >  >n/ >>I have an Aspen Durango II (164LX) Alpha box.O/ >>I am having problem installing OpenVMS 7.3.1.t >. > .. >o. >>The install starts and gets to 60% point and6 >>just freezes no message no response at the keyboard. >  > .. >1, >>Is there way to get log or trace info ...? >= >_ > Yes. >R > Select the DCL option, thenL > 4 >     $$$ DEFINE/SYSTEM AXPVMS$PCSI_LOG_TRACE "BOTH" > and^8 >     $$$ DEFINE/SYSTEM AXPVMS$PCSI_EXECUTE_VERIFY "YES" > I > LOGOUT from DCL to return to the main menu, then [re]do the insallationR
 > or upgrade.E >EI > This will generate a *LOT* of output.  The last lines before the "hang"EG > will give an indicatin of where exactly the process is "stuck".  Copyr@ > them _exactly_ and post them -- 5-10 lines is probably enough. >    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:30:18 GMT " From: Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org>@ Subject: Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1 - question?) Message-ID: <3EEF967E.1070708@ebruno.org>e   norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:. > [interrupting the analysis] : > Is that a comma after "[VMS$COMMON" and is that correct? > [end of interruption]g >  No period "." sorry,  H  > %PCSI-I-DELFIL, deleted DKA0:[000000.PCSI$WRK26.][SYS.HELP]CDSA.HLP;1  > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, createdd>  > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON.][SYSLIB]CDSA$DAALPROXY_SHR.EXE;1  > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, createdt?  > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON.][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.ESW;1a  > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, createdu?  > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON.][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.EXE;1S  > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created,>  > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON.][SYSLIB]CDSA$EAYCSP300_SHR.EXE;1  6 Reran the install and dropped out the DECWindows Motif% to see if fails in at the same place.   
 It hung at %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created  < DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON.][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.ESW;1  
 It stopped at   < > From:  Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org> on 06/17/2003 04:24 PM > 0 > Please respond to Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org> >  > To:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > cc:g > 9 > Subject:    Re: Installation problem with OpenVMS 7.3.1h >  > 8 > Here is last file lines of the output when it freezes: > G > %PCSI-I-DELFIL, deleted DKA0:[000000.PCSI$WRK26.][SYS.HELP]CDSA.HLP;1  > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created= > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DAALPROXY_SHR.EXE;1d > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created> > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.ESW;1 > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created> > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$DUMMYMULTI_SAR.EXE;1 > %PSCI-I-CREFILE, created= > DISK$ALPHASYS:[VMS$COMMON,][SYSLIB]CDSA$EAYCSP300_SHR.EXE;1. >  >  > Charlie Hammond wrote: > ) >>In article <3EEEA595.20407@ebruno.org>,4& >>Eric Bruno <eric@ebruno.org> writes: >> >> >>0 >>>I have an Aspen Durango II (164LX) Alpha box.0 >>>I am having problem installing OpenVMS 7.3.1. >> >>.. >> >>/ >>>The install starts and gets to 60% point andi7 >>>just freezes no message no response at the keyboard.h >> >>.. >> >>- >>>Is there way to get log or trace info ...?t >> >> >>Yes. >> >>Select the DCL option, then  >>4 >>    $$$ DEFINE/SYSTEM AXPVMS$PCSI_LOG_TRACE "BOTH" >>andh8 >>    $$$ DEFINE/SYSTEM AXPVMS$PCSI_EXECUTE_VERIFY "YES" >>I >>LOGOUT from DCL to return to the main menu, then [re]do the insallatione
 >>or upgrade.o >>I >>This will generate a *LOT* of output.  The last lines before the "hang" G >>will give an indicatin of where exactly the process is "stuck".  Copy>@ >>them _exactly_ and post them -- 5-10 lines is probably enough. >> >  >  >  >  >  >  >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 17 Jun 2003 23:24:40 GMT2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>) Subject: Re: Johnny English is a VMS useri, Message-ID: <bco7vo02ngj@enews2.newsguy.com>  : Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> wrote:H > I think there is an episode of Battlestar Galactica which has a VT100  > terminal.'  L It's more likely that it was some Tektronix terminal.  Three Million DollarsK of Tektronix hardware went into the sets for Battlestar Galactica.  All thee8 computer graphics readouts are from Tektronix terminals.   			ZaneL   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:00:03 -0700e( From: Alan Frisbie <Abuse@NelsonUSA.com>$ Subject: Re: lib$convert_date_string, Message-ID: <3EEF6533.3030905@NelsonUSA.com>   Chris Sharman wrote:I > Been playing around with lib$convert_date_string & lib$dt_input_format n> > logical, in an effort to get a more forgiving input routine. > H > Can't even figure out how to do what DCL does, & accept 2 AND 4 digit I > years. I can pick one or the other (Z2 or Y4), but apparently not both.n > Am I missing something ? > H > As for allowing every illiterate user's random selection of separator G > and month format, no chance. You say "please enter dd-mmm-yyyy", and oH > they use /, ., space, numeric months, etc. Best I've done is about 10 K > different format strings to try. The application can figure out which to  G > try by checking the first non-digit (that's the separator), then the n0 > character after that is either numeric or not. > F > Be nice to have a "figure it out" mode - the only ambiguity is with I > numeric months when you need to rule on the field order: dmy or mdy or t > whatever.a  D Strange that you should mention that.   :-)   I had exactly the same problem.  C I wrote a DEC BASIC function that accepts a date string to test andg; the desired format to return it in.   The function returns:r  4      Status, indicating if the date was valid or notG      The date in the form "YYYYMMDD" for use in comparison calculations G      The date in the user-requested "display" format (e.g. 21-Sep-2003)e  @ It tests for dates in the following formats (and in this order):        DD-Mmm-YYYY      DD-Mmm-YY      MM/DD/YYYY 
      MM/DD/YYt      MM-DD-YYYYe
      MM-DD-YY 
      MMDDYYYYe
      YYYYMMDD       MMDDYYx      YYMMDDe  > For North American users, this seems to give the best results.< The "pivot" date for 2-digit years is 50, but that code will< need to be updated for dates outside 1950-2049.   Four digit dates are always valid.   F Because this was written to replace an existing routine (which was farC less forgiving), there are two site-specific additions to the usualoD formats.   If the string is "--------", it returns "Date_Is_Invalid"E status and sets the two output strings to "".   If the string is "BU"pC (standing for "Back Up" -- used to back up to a previous field), itaB returns "Date_Is_BU" status and sets the two output strings to "".E The status values are NOT standard VMS status values, but instead arecC site-specific codes that are compatible with old (1985) code.   Youe9 can easily remove this code and change the status values.   G The code consists of one DEC BASIC subroutine and three "Include" filesc for various constants, etc.:  B -------------------- Start Format_Dates_2.BAS --------------------  O 100	%Title "Format_Dates_2 -- Translate user-entered dates to standard formats"- 	%Ident "V01.02"  & 	FUNCTION INTEGER Format_Dates_2(				& 				STRING Test_Date,			&k& 				LONG   Requested_Display_Format,	& 				STRING Calculation_Date,		&1 				STRING Display_Date)     ! Passed variables:g  2   !	Test_Date			Date string to be tested/convertedT   !	Requested_Display_Format	Format to return Display_Date in (see Date_Formats.B2I)=   !	Calculation_Date		Date string returned in YYYYMMDD format-@   !	Display_Date			Date string returned in user-specified format  :   ! Possible function values returned by this routine are:     !	1 = Test_Date was invalidu   !	2 = Test_Date was OKC   !	3 = Test_Date string was "BU" (for compatibility with old code)1  5   ! This subroutine provides the following functions:.   !.B   !	Accepts an ASCII date string in unknown format and attempts toA   !	convert it into both a calculation-format date (YYYYMMDD) andf)   !	a display format date (user-defined)..   !lJ   !	The allowed formats are defined in Customer_Programs:Date_Formats.B2I.   !e   !	Written:   !c(   !	07-Jul-1997	Alan E. Frisbie (V01.00)   ! 
   !	Modified:    !t(   !	14-Aug-1997	Alan E. Frisbie (V01.01)A   !			If passed date was "--------", return it in both positions,i'   !			but still return "Invalid" statuso   ! (   !	25-Aug-1997	Alan E. Frisbie (V01.02)0   !			Change COMMON name so there is no conflict   !c  J   !=======================================================================  ? 	OPTION TYPE = EXPLICIT		! Require all variables to be declared   F 	%Include "Customer_Programs:Common_Constants.B2I"	! TRUE, FALSE, etc.     ! Declarations  H 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Date_Is_Invalid = 1	! Unable to translate date> 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Date_Is_OK = 2		! Date translated OK@ 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Date_Is_BU = 3		! Date string was "BU"* 							! (for compatibility with old code)  / 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Max_Date_Formats = 10n  N   ! NOTE: The values defined in Date_Formats.B2I are not used in this program,L   !       but are a reminder that they must be updated if the format strings'   !       used herein are ever changed.f  . 	%Include "Customer_Programs:Date_Formats.B2I"  , 	%Include "Customer_Programs:Edit_Masks.B2i"  G   ! Flags to tell LIB$CONVERT_DATE_STRING which fields might be omittede  *   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Year = 1+   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Month = 2d)   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Day = 4w+   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Hours = 8 .   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Minutes = 16.   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Seconds = 32/   !	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Frac_Sec = 64w  Y   ! Allow the time and year to be defaulted (2-digit year will get 2 digits from century)u  < 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Omit_Time = 120	! 64 + 32 + 16 + 8  G 	DECLARE STRING Date_String	! String returned from VMS library routines P 	DECLARE STRING Date_String_YYYYMMDD	! String returned from VMS library routinesA 	DECLARE LONG Quadword_Date( 0 TO 1)	! VMS 64-bit date/time value   I 	DECLARE STRING Format_String	! String returned from VMS library routineso  E   ! By putting these variables in COMMON, we ensure that they are notsG   ! initialized every time this subroutine is invoked, unlike all othera   ! variables.   	COMMON (No_Init_02)						&   		LONG Context_Initialized,				&/ 		LONG Date_Context( 1 TO Max_Date_Formats),		&S5 		STRING Input_Format( 1 TO Max_Date_Formats) = 40,	&f3 		STRING Output_Format( 1 TO Max_Date_Formats) = 40h  8   !		Context_Initialized	Flag so we only initialize once9   !		Date_Context		Context variable used by LIB$ routines)@   !		Input_Format		FAO strings used to define date input formatsB   !		Output_Format		FAO strings used to define date output formats    L 	DECLARE LONG Date_Length	! Number of bytes returned by LIB$Format_Date_TimeK 	DECLARE LONG Date_Flags		! Flags to control formatting of date/time stringuB 	DECLARE LONG Time_of_Day	! Time of day in 10 ms units  (not used)E 	DECLARE LONG Format_Found	! Number of format that matched user inputaI 	DECLARE LONG Sys_Status		! VMS Status returned from system service calls-D 	DECLARE LONG Space_Loc		! Location of the space in returned formats5 	DECLARE LONG I			! The usual random integer variableE7 	DECLARE STRING Temp_String	! Temporary string variablen  B   ! Externally-defined constants for use with System Service calls  " 	EXTERNAL LONG CONSTANT SS$_NORMAL) 	EXTERNAL LONG CONSTANT LIB$M_DATE_FIELDSc* 	EXTERNAL LONG CONSTANT LIB$K_INPUT_FORMAT+ 	EXTERNAL LONG CONSTANT LIB$K_OUTPUT_FORMATr      ! Run-time library definitions  B 	EXTERNAL LONG FUNCTION LIB$INIT_DATE_TIME_CONTEXT( LONG BY REF,	& 			LONG BY REF,					&  			STRING BY DESC) 							! Context 							! Component to init 							! Init string  2 	EXTERNAL LONG FUNCTION LIB$DAY( LONG BY REF, 			&# 			OPTIONAL LONG DIM () BY REF,			&e 			LONG BY REF)t, 							! Days (since 18-Nov-1858) of Param 2$ 							! 64-bit time of desired date( 							! .01 second units since midnight    B 	EXTERNAL LONG FUNCTION LIB$CONVERT_DATE_STRING( STRING BY DESC, & 			LONG DIM () BY REF,				&  			LONG BY REF,					&t 			LONG BY REF)t 							! Date/Time string  							! Quadword date/timeo 							! Context 							! Flags (omitted fields)   @ 	EXTERNAL LONG FUNCTION LIB$FORMAT_DATE_TIME( STRING BY DESC, 	& 			LONG DIM () BY REF,				&o 			LONG BY REF,					&r 			LONG BY REF,					&g 			LONG BY REF)o   							! Returned date 							! Quadword date/timeh 							! Context 							! Date length(bytes)u 							! Flags  Q   !==============================================================================r  M   ! The date formats are chosen so that if the input string is tested againstoH   ! them in this order, there should be no ambiguous dates for the range)   ! likely to be encountered by Customer.s     ! *** NOTE ***   !aF   ! If these format strings are EVER changed, you must also change the5   ! definitions in Customer_Programs:Date_Formats.B2IA   !N   ! *** NOTE ***  F   ! The following section of code is only executed the first time thisB   ! function in invoked.   Thereafter, it is skipped to save time.    	IF NOT Context_Initialized THEN  G 	  Input_Format( 1)  = "|!D0-!MAAC-!Y4 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"	! DD-Mmm-YYYY-( 	  Output_Format( 1) = "|!D0-!MAAC-!Y4|"E 	  Input_Format( 2)  = "|!D0-!MAAC-!Y2 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"	! DD-Mmm-YYP( 	  Output_Format( 2) = "|!D0-!MAAC-!Y2|"F 	  Input_Format( 3)  = "|!MN0/!D0/!Y4 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! MM/DD/YYYY' 	  Output_Format( 3) = "|!MN0/!D0/!Y4|"/D 	  Input_Format( 4)  = "|!MN0/!D0/!Y2 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! MM/DD/YY' 	  Output_Format( 4) = "|!MN0/!D0/!Y2|"aF 	  Input_Format( 5)  = "|!MN0-!D0-!Y4 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! MM-DD-YYYY' 	  Output_Format( 5) = "|!MN0-!D0-!Y4|"lD 	  Input_Format( 6)  = "|!MN0-!D0-!Y2 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! MM-DD-YY' 	  Output_Format( 6) = "|!MN0-!D0-!Y2|" B 	  Input_Format( 7)  = "|!MN0!D0!Y4 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! MMDDYYYY% 	  Output_Format( 7) = "|!MN0!D0!Y4|"aB 	  Input_Format( 8)  = "|!Y4!MN0!D0 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! YYYYMMDD% 	  Output_Format( 8) = "|!Y4!MN0!D0|"s@ 	  Input_Format( 9)  = "|!MN0!D0!Y2 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! MMDDYY% 	  Output_Format( 9) = "|!MN0!D0!Y2|"oA 	  Input_Format( 10)  = "|!Y2!MN0!D0 !H04:!M0:!S0.!C1|"		! YYMMDD & 	  Output_Format( 10) = "|!Y2!MN0!D0|"    	  FOR I = 1 TO Max_Date_Formats 	    Date_Context( I) = 0%  	    Format_String = SPACE$( 40)     ! Specify the date formatsP 	    Temp_String = EDIT$( Input_Format( I), Trim_Trail)	! Remove trailing spacesA 	    Sys_Status = LIB$INIT_DATE_TIME_CONTEXT( Date_Context( I),	& # 			LIB$K_INPUT_FORMAT, Temp_String)l\   !****	    PRINT "Status = "; Sys_Status; "     Date_Context("; I; ") = "; Date_Context( I)  Q 	    Temp_String = EDIT$( Output_Format( I), Trim_Trail)	! Remove trailing spacesCA 	    Sys_Status = LIB$INIT_DATE_TIME_CONTEXT( Date_Context( I),	& $ 			LIB$K_OUTPUT_FORMAT, Temp_String)\   !****	    PRINT "Status = "; Sys_Status; "     Date_Context("; I; ") = "; Date_Context( I)  N   !****	    Sys_Status = LIB$GET_DATE_FORMAT( Format_String, Date_Context( I))_   !****	    PRINT "Status = "; Sys_Status; "     Date_Context("; I; ") = "; Date_Context( I);	&t0   !****			"     Format_String = "; Format_String4   !****	    Space_Loc = POS( Format_String, " ", 1%)<   !****	    Temp_String = LEFT$( Format_String, Space_Loc-1)3   !****	    PRINT "Format #"; I; " = "; Temp_Stringu	 	  NEXT Ir  8 	  Context_Initialized = TRUE			! Only do this code once  # 	END IF		! NOT  Context_Initialized/  Q   !==============================================================================h  #   ! Start the conversion process...o     Get_Input:  * 	IF EDIT$( Test_Date, Up_Case) = "BU" THEN 	  Calculation_Date = "" 	  Display_Date = ""= 	  EXIT FUNCTION Date_Is_BU	! For compatibility with old coder 	END IFi  8   ! Make sure that the requested display format is valid  Z 	IF ((Requested_Display_Format < 1) OR (Requested_Display_Format > Max_Date_Formats)) THEN 	  Calculation_Date = "" 	  Display_Date = ""K 	  EXIT FUNCTION Date_Is_Invalid	! Return error status on programming errori 	END IF.  < 	Date_String = Test_Date		! Get user-supplied date (we hope)  0   Re_Convert:				! Entry after fixing bogus date  G 	FOR I = 1 TO Max_Date_Formats	! Loop through all possible date formatsr 	  Quadword_Date( 0) = 0 	  Quadword_Date( 1) = 0H 	  Sys_Status = LIB$CONVERT_DATE_STRING( Date_String, Quadword_Date(),	&. 		Date_Context( I), Omit_Time)		! Try a format:   !****	  PRINT "Status for format "; I; " = "; Sys_Status$ 	  IF (Sys_Status = SS$_Normal) THEN5 	    Format_Found = I			! Save the input format foundo> 	    GOTO Return_Date			! Reformat date as requested by caller	 	  END IF- 	NEXT Ia  A   ! If we fall through to here, none of the tested formats match.5M   ! Because many Customer routines use "--------" to indicate non-schedulableWI   ! activities/dates, return that same string as a convenience (but stillr   ! with "invalid" status).'  $ 	IF (Left( Test_Date, 1) = "-") THEN  	  Calculation_Date = "--------" 	  Display_Date = "--------" 	ELSE  	  Calculation_Date = "" 	  Display_Date = "" 	END IF 4 	EXIT FUNCTION Date_Is_Invalid	! Return error status  Q   !------------------------------------------------------------------------------o  G   ! All is well, return the date to the caller in the requested formatsh     Return_Date:  6   !****	PRINT "That date is in format #"; Format_Found   	Date_Flags = LIB$M_DATE_FIELDSm  E   ! No matter which format the user requested, get a copy in the formn&   ! YYYYMMDD for calculation purposes.  L 	Sys_Status = LIB$FORMAT_DATE_TIME( Date_String_YYYYMMDD, Quadword_Date(),	&: 		Date_Context( Format_YYYYMMDD), Date_Length, Date_Flags)  B   ! THE FOLLOWING IS FOR EASE OF USE IN THE TRANSITION PERIOD NEAR   ! THE YEAR 2000.   !hA   ! IF the format that the date was submitted in was one of those B   ! with 2-digit years, AND that year is less than 50 (the dawn ofD   ! the computer age, THEN assume that they mean a date between 2000@   ! and 2050.   If it is 50 or above, then assume that they mean    ! a date between 1950 and 1999   	SELECT Format_Found  # 	  CASE 1, 3, 5, 7, 8	! DD-Mmm-YYYYC 				! MM/DD/YYYY 				! MM-DD-YYYY 				! MMDDYYYY 				! YYYYMMDD  K 	    ! Don't do anything to the date -- assume they know what they're doingn  , 	    Calculation_Date = Date_String_YYYYMMDD  G 	    Sys_Status = LIB$FORMAT_DATE_TIME( Date_String, Quadword_Date(),	&TC 		Date_Context( Requested_Display_Format), Date_Length, Date_Flags)o  I   !****	PRINT "Status = "; Sys_Status; "     Date_String = "; Date_StringbK   !****	PRINT "Date format #"; Requested_Display_Format; " = "; Date_Stringn7   !****	PRINT "Quadword_Date( 0) = "; Quadword_Date( 0) 7   !****	PRINT "Quadword_Date( 1) = "; Quadword_Date( 1)gH   !****	PRINT "Date_Context = "; Date_Context( Requested_Display_Format)K   !****	PRINT "Date_Length = "; Date_Length; "   LEN = "; LEN( Date_String)a)   !****	PRINT "Date_Flags = "; Date_Flags2  Q 	    Display_Date = Date_String		! Return date in user's requested display formaty  " 	  CASE 2, 4, 6, 9, 10	! DD-Mmm-YY 				! MM/DD/YY 				! MM-DD-YY 				! MMDDYY 				! YYMMDD  C 	    ! See if the date is less than 1950.   If so, assume that theyq3 	    ! *really* meant a date between 2000 and 2050.e  X 	    IF (LEFT$( Date_String_YYYYMMDD, 4) < "1950") THEN	! Bozo entered 2-digit year < 50  A 	      ! 1) Change the year portion of the date from 19xx to 20xxt= 	      ! 2) Loop back to the top to do the conversions again.h  X 	      Date_String = "20" + SEG$( Date_String_YYYYMMDD, 3, 8)	! Change from 19xx to 20xx6 	      GOTO Re_Convert					! Re-convert the fixed date	 	    ELSEd  H 	      ! See if the date is greater than 2050.   If so, assume that they5 	      ! *really* meant a date between 1950 and 1999.   Z 	      IF (LEFT$( Date_String_YYYYMMDD, 4) > "2050") THEN	! Bozo entered 2-digit year > 50C 	        ! 1) Change the year portion of the date from 20xx to 19xxa? 	        ! 2) Loop back to the top to do the conversions again.r  Z 	        Date_String = "19" + SEG$( Date_String_YYYYMMDD, 3, 8)	! Change from 20xx to 19xx8 	        GOTO Re_Convert					! Re-convert the fixed date  
 	      END IFa  K 	        Calculation_Date = Date_String_YYYYMMDD		! Return calculation date   K 	        ! The year is OK, just convert the quadword date to display formati  K 	        Sys_Status = LIB$FORMAT_DATE_TIME( Date_String, Quadword_Date(),	& E 		  Date_Context( Requested_Display_Format), Date_Length, Date_Flags)rT 	        Display_Date = Date_String	! Return date in user's requested display format 	    END IF3   	END SELECT   - 	EXIT FUNCTION Date_Is_OK		! Return OK statuse
 	END FUNCTION   @ -------------------- End Format_Dates_2.BAS --------------------  D -------------------- Start Common_Constants.B2I --------------------     ! Common_Constants.B2I  B   ! Constants likely to be needed in almost any VAX BASIC program.  # 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT TRUE = -1w# 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT FALSE = 0a  B 	DECLARE STRING CONSTANT UPPER_CASE = "ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ"B 	DECLARE STRING CONSTANT LOWER_CASE = "abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz"  . 	DECLARE STRING CONSTANT DIGITS = "0123456789"  B -------------------- End Common_Constants.B2I --------------------  @ -------------------- Start Date_Formats.B2I --------------------     !	Date_Formats.B2I  8   ! Constants to select the format that a date should be3   ! returned from Format_Date_Sub or Format_Dates_2s  0 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_DD_Mmm_YYYY = 10 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_DD_Mmm_YY   = 27 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_MM_DD_YYYY_Slashes = 3h5 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_MM_DD_YY_Slashes = 4 6 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_MM_DD_YYYY_Dashes = 54 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_MM_DD_YY_Dashes = 6- 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_MMDDYYYY = 7 - 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_YYYYMMDD = 8t+ 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_MMDDYY = 9e, 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Format_YYMMDD = 10  0   ! Status returned from Format_Dates_2 function  H 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Date_Is_Invalid = 1	! Unable to translate date> 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Date_Is_OK = 2		! Date translated OK@ 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Date_Is_BU = 3		! Date string was "BU"* 							! (for compatibility with old code)  > -------------------- End Date_Formats.B2I --------------------  > -------------------- Start Edit_Masks.B2I --------------------     ! Edit_Masks.B2I   !    ! Masks for EDIT$ function:@   !.'   !	  1 = Discard parity bit (H.O. bit)c#   !	  2 = Discard all spaces & tabsD,   !	  4 = Discard CR, LF, FF, DEL, ESC, NULL'   !	  8 = Discard leading spaces & tabsn:   !	 16 = Convert multiple spaces & tabs to a single space*   !	 32 = Convert lower case to UPPER CASE3   !	 64 = Convert brackets "[]" to parenthesis "()"e(   !	128 = Discard trailing spaces & tabs4   !	256 = Suppress editing within quotation marks ""  * 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Strip_Parity = 1& 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Squeeze =  23          DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Strip_Control = 4e( 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Trim_Front = 84   	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Compress_Whitespace = 16(   	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Up_Case = 32. 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Up_Case_Squeeze = 34* 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Trim_Trail = 128= 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Discard_Trail_Junk  = 132	! 4 + 128   F   ! Create mask to: Discard control characters, leading spaces & tabs,J   !                 trailing spaces & tabs, Convert multiple spaces & tabs&   !                 to a single space.  , 	DECLARE INTEGER CONSTANT Cleanup_Mask = 156  < -------------------- End Edit_Masks.B2I --------------------   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:55:50 -0700 ( From: Alan Frisbie <Abuse@NelsonUSA.com>$ Subject: Re: lib$convert_date_string, Message-ID: <3EEF7246.2030409@NelsonUSA.com>   Alan Frisbie wrote:-  H > Because this was written to replace an existing routine (which was farE > less forgiving), there are two site-specific additions to the usualDF > formats.   If the string is "--------", it returns "Date_Is_Invalid"/ > status and sets the two output strings to "".t  G Oops, I meant to say that the two output strings are set to "--------",pE to match the input.   This feature is present because this routine isfG used a lot when computing production schedules.   Certain "activities",eJ such as comments, should not a date associated with them, hence this flag.   Alan   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 14:55:44 -07005 From: forrest.cahoon@merrillcorp.com (Forrest Cahoon)f' Subject: lib$spawn and persona services1= Message-ID: <8369d643.0306171355.7bb3649e@posting.google.com>s  A I've been attemping to use persona services, and I'm running intoC? trouble using lib$spawn while impersonating a user who has onlya* the standard NETMBX and TMPMBX privileges.  2 I'm using Compaq C V6.5-001 on OpenVMS Alpha V7.3.  @ Here's my sample code. It uses lib$spawn to run an arbitrary DCLC command, with both SYS$INPUT and SYS$OUTPUT set to NL:. I've made as? point to explicitly specify everything which would otherwise be D inherited from the parent process, on the hypothesis that the parent8 process, belonging to a different user, is inaccessible.  I /***********************************************************************/e   #include <stdio.h>   #include <descrip.h> #include <impdef.h>  #include <lnmdef.h>3 #include <starlet.h> #include <lib$routines.h>d   main() {eD    unsigned int persona_h, prev_persona_h, resume_persona_h, status;*    unsigned long flags = 0, substatus = 0;?    $DESCRIPTOR(username_dsc, "JOE6PACK"); /* a standard user */c+    $DESCRIPTOR(cmd_dsc, "SHOW SYMBOL FOO");.!    $DESCRIPTOR(prompt_dsc, "$ ");     $DESCRIPTOR(cli_dsc, "DCL");H'    $DESCRIPTOR(table_dsc, "DCLTABLES");w"    $DESCRIPTOR(input_dsc, "_NL:");#    $DESCRIPTOR(output_dsc, "_NL:");   9    status = sys$persona_create(&persona_h, &username_dsc,-L                                IMP$M_ASSUME_DEFPRIV | IMP$M_ASSUME_DEFCLASS,(                                0, NULL);7    printf("persona_create status = %%X%08X\n", status);n  *    status = sys$persona_assume(&persona_h,L                                IMP$M_ASSUME_SECURITY | IMP$M_ASSUME_ACCOUNT,0                                &prev_persona_h);  7    printf("persona_assume status = %%X%08X\n", status);a  D    /***************************************************************/D    /* I am now JOE6PACK with the amazing power of BEING ORDINARY! */  F    status = lib$spawn(&cmd_dsc, &input_dsc, &output_dsc, &flags, 0, 0,'                       &substatus, 0, 0, <                       0, &prompt_dsc, &cli_dsc, &table_dsc);  >    printf("lib$spawn status = %%X%08X, substatus = %%X%08X\n",           status, substatus);g  E    /****************************************************************/g      resume_persona_h = 1;2    status = sys$persona_assume(&resume_persona_h, L                                IMP$M_ASSUME_SECURITY | IMP$M_ASSUME_ACCOUNT,+                                &persona_h);e  >    printf("return persona_assume status = %%X%08X\n", status);  +    status = sys$persona_delete(&persona_h);t7    printf("persona_delete status = %%X%08X\n", status);  }   I /***********************************************************************/y    The results of this program are:   $ run impersonate_test" persona_create status = %X00000001" persona_assume status = %X000000015 lib$spawn status = %X00000024, substatus = %X000000001) return persona_assume status = %X00000001"" persona_delete status = %X00000001  0 The %X00000024 status returned from lib$spawn isG %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violation   > When I change "JOE6PACK" to my own account, which has a lot ofE authorized privileges (including IMPERSONATE and SYSPRV needed to runaE this program) but with my default privs pared down to just NETMBX ande# TMPMBX, this is what I get instead:h   $ run impersonate_test" persona_create status = %X00000001" persona_assume status = %X000000015 lib$spawn status = %X00000001, substatus = %X00038140.) return persona_assume status = %X00000001y" persona_delete status = %X00000001  # The subprocess status %X00038140 iso= %CLI-W-UNDSYM, undefined symbol - check validity and spelling/D which shows that the call worked correctly because I haven't set the
 symbol "FOO".,  5 What's going on here?  Is there any way I can fix it?n   Forrest Cahoon$ not speaking for merrill corporation   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 17:08:22 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)o+ Subject: Re: lib$spawn and persona servicesu3 Message-ID: <oNFLvSqePGIX@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  u In article <8369d643.0306171355.7bb3649e@posting.google.com>, forrest.cahoon@merrillcorp.com (Forrest Cahoon) writes:,  C > I've been attemping to use persona services, and I'm running into A > trouble using lib$spawn while impersonating a user who has only , > the standard NETMBX and TMPMBX privileges.  2 > The %X00000024 status returned from lib$spawn isI > %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violationt  D I would suggest turning on appropriate security auditing to get moreF information about that error.  Since you have privilege to impersonateE that user, I presume you have sufficient privilege (and authority) top) mess with the security auditing settings.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:00:44 -0400t* From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <stan@stanq.com>3 Subject: Re: Max length of Nodename in OpenVMS 7.31s. Message-ID: <3EEF1F0C.28983.F11F6D2@localhost>  8 On Tue, 17 Jun 2003 15:22:17 +0100 (MET), Phillip Helbig+ <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> wrote:sC >> Does this have anything to do with the 6-character limit on the O length  5 >> of variable names in Fortran prior to Fortran 90? d  = Other responses aside, a limit of 6 characters for names was  $ considered "enough" for many things.  C Heck, aviation in the US is limited to 5 characters for navigation  D intersections -- there was no limit before they were computerized.  D Now, they're trying to figure out how to expand it without breaking 1 all the software.  Nothing like planning ahead...t  
 --Stan Quaylee Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------C Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  +1 614-868-1363  Fax: +1 614 868-1671I1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147.= Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.com[   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 13:11:38 -0500; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)-3 Subject: Re: Max length of Nodename in OpenVMS 7.31B3 Message-ID: <MOQ8UbPwlZqV@eisner.encompasserve.org>:  w In article <01KX7F38TCBOAOKN0V@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:(F > STANDARD Fortran had the 6-character limit for variable-name length F > until the Fortran 90 standard came out.  Of course, longer variable I > names were available as compiler extensions with many compilers before   > this time.  E    What standard?  You think you can find this in the ANSI Fortran 77 J    standard?  I've never seen anything from any vendor documenting longer G    variables as an extension to the standard.  FORTRAN-IV (ANSI Fortrano    66) had the limit.e   > ( >> And no, it has nothing to do with it. > A > Just a guess!  Parts of VMS are, I believe, written in Fortran.   D    Variable name lengths have nothing to do with data lengths.  I'veD    never seen any Fortran compiler on VMS restrcited to 67 characterG    variable names, even those which predated Fortran 77 (which came oute-    in 1981, three years after the first VAX).s  A    And while VMS is written in lots of languages, I've never seenA!    Fortran listed as one of them.t   ------------------------------   Date: 17 Jun 2003 20:56 CDT[' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) 3 Subject: Re: Max length of Nodename in OpenVMS 7.31 - Message-ID: <17JUN200320561424@gerg.tamu.edu>c  y In article <01KX7F38TCBOAOKN0V@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes... J }> Does this have anything to do with the 6-character limit on the length 5 }> of variable names in Fortran prior to Fortran 90?   } I }> What planet did you lean Fortran on?  Some early Fortran compilers had.D }> a 6 character variable name limit, but this was fixed long before }> Fortran 90. } E }STANDARD Fortran had the 6-character limit for variable-name length $E }until the Fortran 90 standard came out.  Of course, longer variable OH }names were available as compiler extensions with many compilers before  }this time.5 } ( }> And no, it has nothing to do with it. } @ }Just a guess!  Parts of VMS are, I believe, written in Fortran.  : What, exactly, would the length of the nodename have to doB with the length of a variable name? Do you think that somehwere inA NCL there is a way to make it write some Fortran source code thatw, uses the nodename as the name of a variable?  = You might use the nodename as the *value* of a varaiable, butE2 when would you use it as the *name* of a variable?   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:40:56 GMTm# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>R0 Subject: McNealy: SCO-IBM Spat Could Aid SolarisI Message-ID: <cGNHa.129891$3Sm.49043@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   F http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=1209&e=7&u=/ap/2003060 17/ap_on_hi_te/sco_sun_microsystems&sid=95573712   ......A "There's no question we're going to go after the AIX base and sayBF Solaris is free and clear, with no legal or intellectual cloud hanging over it," McNealy said.- ......    7 It could possibly aid VMS, if HP put their minds to it.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:59:06 +0100s" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>N Subject: Re: Motorola 68000 BSO cross assembler/Simulator available on VAX/VMS' Message-ID: <3EEF811A.5000202@spam.com>E   Dick Hertz wrote:S: > Does anybody have any additional information about this?, > Haven't been able to find much via Google. >=20 > Who / what is BSO?@ > Is this opensource?  Is it still available?  Anybody using it? >=20 > Thanks >=20 > Dick  @ BSO stands for Boston Systems Office.  It is now called Tasking.   Tasking] (Founded 1974)+ United States (International Headquarters):p
 Tasking, Inc.W 333 Elm Street Dedham, MA 02026-4530  USAp tel: +1-800-458-8276 tel: +1-781-320-9400 fax: +1-781-320-9212 sales.us@tasking.com support.us@tasking.com   Hope that helps... :-)    Why do you ask?b   D. --=200- Didier Morandi sarl au capital de 8 000 eurosc-   19 chemin de la Butte 31400 Toulouse France@/   T=E9l: 33(0)5 6120 1964 Fax: 33(0)5 6154 1928l&           http://www.didiermorandi.com                    RC en cours   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:53:02 -0400S* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> Subject: Of VMS and chipmunks:) Message-ID: <3EEFE217.72DF2169@istop.com>;  K While working around the cottage to fix it up, I noticed a few things aboutM the local squirrels.  M There are 2 chipmunks, one of which lives right next to cottage. And there isE< a red/brown squirrel which is pesky and dominant (and loud).  L Chipmunk 1 used to have live easy because living next to the cottage, he had7 easy access to all the nuts we placed on a window sill.r  M Then came the red/brown squirrel who visited a few times a day.  And that one>N would intimidate and push away the chipmunk (who is a bit smaller), using loud% sounds (as well as running after it).j  M Now, this year, we have an additional chipmunk. So chipmunk 1 not only has torL deal with red/brown squirrel, but also another direct competitor encroachingK on a territory chipmunk 1 though was safe. The window sill which used to be M safe territory (niche market!) is not hotly contested. If chipmunk 2 shows up J when 1 is loading its mouth with nuts, #2 will scare #1 and they then raceN against each other to decide who wins access to the nuts. And if the red/brownB squirrel shows up, both chipmunks are scared away into submission.  L The morale: if you want your food, you have to fight for it. And you have toC shout as loud as possible (advertise) to gain superiority over your71 competitors, as well as being able to run faster.y  N And interestingly, the only ares of nature where the above competition doesn'tN happen is the relationship between mothers and offspring. Mothers will give up food to give it to offspring.s  L So, when you look at how VMS has been handled since Palmer, VMS would be theF mother who donated so much, and Unix , Windows would be the offspring.    K On the other hand, I could have compared Windows to the mosquitos and blacktW flies who have bugged the hell out of me (as well as drawn a lot of blood) all weekend.-   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 14:31:49 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)t& Subject: Re: Portents of Itanium death3 Message-ID: <jomTkTPmcupf@eisner.encompasserve.org>a  V In article <bcno9701tlr@enews2.newsguy.com>, "Dann Corbit" <dcorbit@connx.com> writes:: > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message   > M > Depends on what you are doing.  For database benchmarks and for things thatt4 > need huge memory or disk, 32 bits craps out early. >    	Oh really??  M > Here is a favorable TPC report, even using a database compiled for 32 bits: @ > http://www.tpc.org/results/FDR/TPCC/RackSaverQuatreX-64FDR.pdf  < 	Good thing to bring up I suppose.  Bill has chided me, that= 	is a 82000 tpmC result if memory serves.  You should be ablei6 	to find its corresponding Xeon equivalent competitor - 	- a 4-CPU 2.0 GHz Xeon Dell - at 78000 tpmC.   = 	When the Xeon goes from 2.0 GHz to 2.8 GHz, the Opteron willo? 	be trailing the Xeon.  In a month.  That was part of my point.e   >   > A fairly detailed examination:: > http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20030422/opteron-28.html >  > AMD's benchmarks: T > http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_8796_8800,00.html >  > DB/2 on Opteron:M > http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupdate/stories/main/0,14179,2877957,00.htmli >  > Linux on Opteron article:rR > http://searchenterpriselinux.techtarget.com/qna/0,289202,sid39_gci900998,00.html >   < 	All wonderful links.  But my point was/is Xeon gets a huge = 	speedup in the 2 processor space - going to 3.06 GHz and thedE 	Xeon MP gets a big speed bump going from 2.0 to 2.8 GHz.  June 30th.Y  K > Someday in the near future, due to active development by AMD, it may be aY > better than the Alpha chip.m  C 	Sure.  Athens - the next spin on Opteron - is "the great hope" nowr; 	as Xeon will be faster than Opteron for at least 6 months.f   				Robt   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 11:56:40 -0700w' From: "Dann Corbit" <dcorbit@connx.com>i& Subject: Re: Portents of Itanium death, Message-ID: <bcno9701tlr@enews2.newsguy.com>  8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:gA9dQJtFjTSa@eisner.encompasserve.org... F > In article <bcnci0$av6$1@aquila.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk (David Webb) writes:7 > > In article <MzAU7KWTtp6t@eisner.encompasserve.org>, - young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:aA > >>In article <7500353b.0306170604.5a775456@posting.google.com>,e0 mistdragon@zdnetonebox.com (mist dragon) writes: > >>>v6 > >>> Where are the Intel counterads of proving that : > >>> 6 > >>> - No-one needs 64 bit with native 32 bit support. > >>> - No-one needs 64 bit unless its ItaniumA > >>> - No-one would like to pay less for 64 bit than for Itaniumo > >>>t@ > >>> Intel is already under competition of 64 bit. May the best > >>> architecture win!N > >>>o > >>D > >> The best architecture doesn't always win.  X86 has been winning > >> for years.T > >> > >> IA64 versus x86-64... > >>@ > >> Maybe someday x86-64 gets a tier 1 vendor to really push itE > >> hard.  Maybe not.  No one seems to want to lose their sweetheartrB > >> x86 deals.  Hard to stay competitive if you have to pay quiteB > >> a bit more for your x86 CPUs compared to your competition ;-) > >>K > > The question then becomes how quickly AMD can ramp up production. Since  thenK > > x86-64 can replace the x86 for 32bit applications then if Intel were toeI > > seriously threaten a vendor about it's 32bit chip x86 sweetheart dealo then itvL > > would pay AMD to offer them an equivalent deal to move all their systems to > > AMD chips. > >o > E > The built-in assumption is that Opteron has some sort of advantage.  >p
 > However: >  >ec http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=2ZMZE2N7r3vl%40eisner.encompasserve.org&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain  >	 >t* > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=9384 >1! > Q203 Q303 Q403   Q104 Q204 2H04  >4 > 4u) > $10K+ Xeon MP ServerWorks    | 2.8 GHz+e! > Anvik 2.8 GHz 2MB L3   | 4MB L3  >h2 > 2u      Xeon E7501   | Nocona  | Nocona Lindenhu0 > $5.5K+  3.06 GHz     | 3.46 GHz| Dual Northway >  > 2u  Xeon 7501  > $3K+ >r >s > etc. >t' > From another quote at the end of May:= >=* > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=9765 >OL > RECENT ROADMAPS seen by the INQUIRER show that Intel is close to releasing a_G > 3.06GHz Xeon with a 533MHz front side bus and 1MB of integrated level  threeEL > cache.  This processor is a regular Xeon processor and not one of the very$ > much more expensive Xeon MP chips. >s1 > At launch, it will cost Intel's customers $690.	 >a@ > That will be very hard on Opteron in that space.  The space is > 1-2 CPU server space.  >_	 > It has:s >1 > Higher clock > Faster Bus+ > Just as cheap or cheaper than an Opteron.  >g> > There is no reason it won't outperform a 2 processor Opteron > in MOST benchmarks.  >  > ---h >iE > The MP Xeon goes from 2 GHz to 2.8 GHz in 2 weeks, similar argument A > there comparing the mythical 4-CPU Opteron against the mythical 
 > 4-CPU Xeon.E >R6 > Suppose for the sake of argument some Tier 1 were toC > cutover lock-stock-and-barrel to Opteron.  Until they can do thatd@ > , their next shipments of Xeon and Pentium4/PentiumM would get8 > quite pricey.  Losing millions in the cutover process. >i@ > But maybe the bigger danger in going the Opteron route is that@ > it looks to be outperformed in the near term (next 1-6 months)E > by Xeon.  So in a sense you would cutover , not only lose millions, > > but have a less attractive server part as a result!  PerhapsA > good business sense (and Intel pricing discount advantages) areu? > keeping Tier 1 players away from Opteron.  One would think ito > would surely attract Sun.A    K Depends on what you are doing.  For database benchmarks and for things thato2 need huge memory or disk, 32 bits craps out early.  K Here is a favorable TPC report, even using a database compiled for 32 bits: > http://www.tpc.org/results/FDR/TPCC/RackSaverQuatreX-64FDR.pdf   A fairly detailed examination:8 http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20030422/opteron-28.html   AMD's benchmarks:1R http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/0,,30_118_8796_8800,00.html   DB/2 on Opteron:K http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupdate/stories/main/0,14179,2877957,00.htmli   Linux on Opteron article:tP http://searchenterpriselinux.techtarget.com/qna/0,289202,sid39_gci900998,00.html  I Someday in the near future, due to active development by AMD, it may be ad better than the Alpha chip.A -- N0 C-FAQ: http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/C-faq/top.html$  "The C-FAQ Book" ISBN 0-201-84519-9H C.A.P. FAQ: ftp://cap.connx.com/pub/Chess%20Analysis%20Project%20FAQ.htm   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 16:41:51 -0400d* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>& Subject: Re: Portents of Itanium death2 Message-ID: <4qacnQRQZ4qO4HKjXTWJiA@metrocast.net>  8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:jomTkTPmcupf@eisner.encompasserve.org...l< > In article <bcno9701tlr@enews2.newsguy.com>, "Dann Corbit" <dcorbit@connx.com> writes:t< > > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message >  > >OJ > > Depends on what you are doing.  For database benchmarks and for things that6 > > need huge memory or disk, 32 bits craps out early. > >  >u > Oh really?  K Actually, by definition in the case of 'things that need huge memory'.  And,J that includes current TPC-C configurations (at least those using > 4 GB ofK physical memory):  IA32 *can* address it, but nowhere nearly as efficientlyN. (let alone easily) as a flat 64-bit model can.  F There's no obvious reason that the architecture word size has anythingB whatsoever to do with heavy disk activity, though:  it's Opteron'sE significant bandwidth advantage that makes it superior to IA32 there.D   >&I > > Here is a favorable TPC report, even using a database compiled for 32	 bits:DB > > http://www.tpc.org/results/FDR/TPCC/RackSaverQuatreX-64FDR.pdf >	= > Good thing to bring up I suppose.  Bill has chided me, thatT> > is a 82000 tpmC result if memory serves.  You should be able6 > to find its corresponding Xeon equivalent competitor. > - a 4-CPU 2.0 GHz Xeon Dell - at 78000 tpmC. > > > When the Xeon goes from 2.0 GHz to 2.8 GHz, the Opteron will > be trailing the Xeon.=  L That's probably true in the specific case of TPC-C (Opteron's lead over XeonJ in other benchmarks probably won't be threatened, because other benchmarksF don't seem nearly as cache-size-sensitive), though it's not clear fromC analysis of the patterns of TPC-C scores just how much better TPC-C F performance that 40% boost in clock rate will translate to (since evenH though they'll supposedly be available within weeks no one seems to have> posted TPC-C results for them yet:  do you still consider thatJ irresponsible?) - nor how long they'll retain whatever lead they manage toJ eke out (since the 2 GHz Opterons are also imminently due, followed by 2.2( and 2.4 GHz versions before year's end).  J What *is* clear is that those Xeon MPs will still cost close to 5 times asJ much as their Opteron counterparts, and that the systems they're availableJ in will still cost close to twice as much (i.e., far costlier $/tpmC).  SoE the only reason you'd buy one would be if your performance needs were/G precisely in the (SWAG) 85K - 100K tpmC range:  lower, and Opteron will/L satisfy your needs far more cost-effectively; higher, and Xeon won't satisfy them at all.   ...)  &   But my point was/is Xeon gets a huge6 > speedup in the 2 processor space - going to 3.06 GHz  F From its current 2.8 GHz:  do you consider a 9% speed increase 'huge'?    and theF > Xeon MP gets a big speed bump going from 2.0 to 2.8 GHz.  June 30th. >8K > > Someday in the near future, due to active development by AMD, it may be4 a0 > > better than the Alpha chip.! >!D > Sure.  Athens - the next spin on Opteron - is "the great hope" now  I No:  current Opterons will be more than adequate as long as they meet theO> dates for 2, 2.2, and 2.4 GHz versions that AMD has set forth.  < > as Xeon will be faster than Opteron for at least 6 months.  J Not if AMD keeps to its schedule:  2.2 GHz Opterons in 2 - 3 months shouldL about equal the $3692 2.8 GHz Xeon MPs in TPC-C and 2.4 GHz Opterons in lateJ fall should surpass them - still at far lower prices.  The late-fall 90 nmD 3.4 GHz Xeons with 1 MB of on-chip cache should be considerably moreL cost-effective for most uses than the Xeon MP dinosaurs and just about equalB the 2.4 GHz Opterons in both performance and price (though only inK applications where multi-processor bandwidth is not critical, since OpteronRL promises to lead there for the foreseeable future) - though since they'll beH a full process generation ahead of Opteron that's hardly impressive, and9 Opteron is scheduled to move to 90 nm before next summer.D   - bill   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 22:28:53 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)(& Subject: Re: Portents of Itanium death3 Message-ID: <SGLzySdBEGr9@eisner.encompasserve.org>*  _ In article <4qacnQRQZ4qO4HKjXTWJiA@metrocast.net>, "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:y > : > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message/ > news:jomTkTPmcupf@eisner.encompasserve.org...== >> In article <bcno9701tlr@enews2.newsguy.com>, "Dann Corbit"e > <dcorbit@connx.com> writes:D= >> > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message  >> >> >K >> > Depends on what you are doing.  For database benchmarks and for thingsE > that7 >> > need huge memory or disk, 32 bits craps out early.d >> > >>
 >> Oh really?a > M > Actually, by definition in the case of 'things that need huge memory'.  AndnL > that includes current TPC-C configurations (at least those using > 4 GB ofM > physical memory):  IA32 *can* address it, but nowhere nearly as efficientlys0 > (let alone easily) as a flat 64-bit model can.  ? 	But well enough to crank high tpmC in a 4-processor footprint.o   > H > There's no obvious reason that the architecture word size has anythingD > whatsoever to do with heavy disk activity, though:  it's Opteron'sG > significant bandwidth advantage that makes it superior to IA32 there.R >   = 	There being where exactly?  In 4-processor CPU tpmC metrics?S4 	If so, how long does that lead last?  2 more weeks?   >>J >> > Here is a favorable TPC report, even using a database compiled for 32 > bits:-C >> > http://www.tpc.org/results/FDR/TPCC/RackSaverQuatreX-64FDR.pdfa >>> >> Good thing to bring up I suppose.  Bill has chided me, that? >> is a 82000 tpmC result if memory serves.  You should be abler7 >> to find its corresponding Xeon equivalent competitoru/ >> - a 4-CPU 2.0 GHz Xeon Dell - at 78000 tpmC.C >>? >> When the Xeon goes from 2.0 GHz to 2.8 GHz, the Opteron will  >> be trailing the Xeon. > N > That's probably true in the specific case of TPC-C (Opteron's lead over XeonL > in other benchmarks probably won't be threatened, because other benchmarksH > don't seem nearly as cache-size-sensitive), though it's not clear fromE > analysis of the patterns of TPC-C scores just how much better TPC-C H > performance that 40% boost in clock rate will translate to (since evenJ > though they'll supposedly be available within weeks no one seems to have@ > posted TPC-C results for them yet:  do you still consider that > irresponsible?)   A 	No.  Marketing.  Your dig is referring to my dig at AMD.  We see = 	Opteron roll-out in April with tpmC 4-way 1.8 GHz , hardwareE@ 	availability in July 2003.  My dig is: if 2.0 GHz was coming in  	July, simply bench it in April.  > 	tpmC is no doubt part of a rollout strategy.  I suspect parts@ 	announced on June 30th and vendors rolling out tpmC in a day or 	 ; >- nor how long they'll retain whatever lead they manage toe= > eke out (since the 2 GHz Opterons are also imminently due,    < 	But as you would be quick to acknowledge, going from 1.8 to@ 	2.0 GHz certainly isn't going to do much regarding an increase.2 	It won't be close to the 2.8 GHz MP Xeon in tpmC.   > followed by 2.2n   	In September, maybe.M  * > and 2.4 GHz versions before year's end).   > L > What *is* clear is that those Xeon MPs will still cost close to 5 times asL > much as their Opteron counterparts, and that the systems they're availableL > in will still cost close to twice as much (i.e., far costlier $/tpmC).  SoG > the only reason you'd buy one would be if your performance needs were0I > precisely in the (SWAG) 85K - 100K tpmC range:  lower, and Opteron will N > satisfy your needs far more cost-effectively; higher, and Xeon won't satisfy > them at all. >   @ 	You will buy a Xeon because that is what your tier 1 vendor you< 	buy from today will be selling.  Sure, some will experiment! 	with Opteron.  A small minority.y   > ...S > ( >   But my point was/is Xeon gets a huge7 >> speedup in the 2 processor space - going to 3.06 GHzi > H > From its current 2.8 GHz:  do you consider a 9% speed increase 'huge'? >   = 	No.  I guess I got thinking about Opteron in comparison.  MyM> 	mistake.  And 3.06 GHz is shipping today with 512KByte cache,
 	400 MHz FSB.e  C http://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_result_detail.asp?id=103053003t  9 	Note too that was posted May 29th, hardware availability" 	May 27th.    
 >  and theG >> Xeon MP gets a big speed bump going from 2.0 to 2.8 GHz.  June 30th.o >>L >> > Someday in the near future, due to active development by AMD, it may be > a   >> > better than the Alpha chip. >>E >> Sure.  Athens - the next spin on Opteron - is "the great hope" now_ > K > No:  current Opterons will be more than adequate as long as they meet thee@ > dates for 2, 2.2, and 2.4 GHz versions that AMD has set forth. >   < 	No.  Because Opteron will be at 2.2 GHz in September.  Will: 	it really be equivalent in performance to a 2.8 GHz Xeon?  = >> as Xeon will be faster than Opteron for at least 6 months.e > % > Not if AMD keeps to its schedule:  a  9 	Sure.  Maybe not across all segments but in quite a few.   ) > 2.2 GHz Opterons in 2 - 3 months should N > about equal the $3692 2.8 GHz Xeon MPs in TPC-C and 2.4 GHz Opterons in late9 > fall should surpass them - still at far lower prices.  e  > 	But no tier 1 vendors.  That $3700 list price isn't the price@ 	Dell pays for them.  What would Dell pay, $1600?   You see partA 	of the problem is the Opteron is actually too cheap.  At $900 or < 	so a pop, AMD may have a sweetheart deal of $600 to a largeA 	OEM.  It is in Dell's and other's best interest to sell a higheroA 	priced part.  Especially if they are paing quite a bit less than = 	list price for the part.  It isn't a stretch to presume theyaA 	are making a very nice chunk on each Xeon they sell.  They wouldN? 	make a lot less on Opteron.  Smart business to sell/push thoseK
 	4-way Xeons."   > The late-fall 90 nmTF > 3.4 GHz Xeons with 1 MB of on-chip cache should be considerably moreN > cost-effective for most uses than the Xeon MP dinosaurs and just about equalD > the 2.4 GHz Opterons in both performance and price (though only inM > applications where multi-processor bandwidth is not critical, since OpteronaN > promises to lead there for the foreseeable future) - though since they'll beJ > a full process generation ahead of Opteron that's hardly impressive, and; > Opteron is scheduled to move to 90 nm before next summer.s >   @ 	But that 3.4 GHz Xeon is for the 1-2 CPU space.  Prior to that,H 	3.06 GHz with 1 MByte cache and 533 MHz bus which ought to bump tpmC.  H 	That in the 3rd quarter and priced less than Opteron.  That link above:  C http://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_result_detail.asp?id=103053003N  : 	43000 tpmC with 2 processors and a decent $3.71 per tpmC.> 	Where is Opteron in that space?  That space gets more crowdedD 	when Xeon goes to 3.4 GHz 1 MB before year-end and 533 MHz bus, 667C 	MHz bus later (1).   That 3.4 GHz 1 MByte 533 MHz FSB part at $690DE 	should be a shutout for Xeon in the 1-2 processor space.  After all,!? 	a 2.0 GHz, 1 MByte , 400 MHz is doing 78000 tpmC.  I don't seetC 	Opteron doing well at all in the 1-2 processor server space versus_= 	Xeon in the next 6 months.  Opteron's niche gets real narrow  	real soon.T  B 	But no matter, we will know more in a few weeks.  But I think theD 	only metric Opteron will be leading at in 3 months will be $/metric	 	and SSL.    				Rob   ( http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=9765   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:23:28 -0400E* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>& Subject: Re: Portents of Itanium death) Message-ID: <3EEFDB2A.C8FD296A@istop.com>i   David Webb wrote:aM > The question then becomes how quickly AMD can ramp up production. Since the I > x86-64 can replace the x86 for 32bit applications then if Intel were toEO > seriously threaten a vendor about it's 32bit chip x86 sweetheart deal then it M > would pay AMD to offer them an equivalent deal to move all their systems tos > AMD chips.  L Another potential problem is if Intel decides to take steps to dissuade highL end 8086 usage and steer (read: force) customers to IA64.  This may backfire' and push customers to AMD 8086 systems.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 15:20:01 -0400 + From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@intel.com>N@ Subject: Re: problem after upgrading to compaq (DEC) fortran 7.58 Message-ID: <oaquevoqsihj140s5rttcbqotgoff5ak5c@4ax.com>  E On Tue, 17 Jun 2003 15:23:05 GMT, hoblit@liii.com (Sam Hoblit) wrote:n  B >Thanks for the replies. Of course, if it's really a  compiler bug< >a report should be filed. But since so many programs caused? >the compiler to crash after the upgrade I suspected that I hadeD >screwed something up with the installation rather than the compiler< >being buggy, and that maybe someone else had seen a similar? >problem. Guess not. I'll look around a bit more, and then look > >into filing a report. Unfortunately, at the moment we have no >service contract in place.s  L Well, I can tell you that I've never seen such a report before, (and I wouldN have if any made their way to Compaq/HP), so it may well be something specificF to your system.  I'd suggest uninstalling (PRODUCT REMOVE FORTRAN) and
 reinstalling.7  K 7.6 is out now - I'm not sure what the schedule is for the Software Productf Library CD-ROMs.       Steve Lionel Software Products Division Intel Corporation@
 Nashua, NH  = User communities for Intel Fortran and Compaq Visual Fortran:r%   http://intel.com/IDS/forums/fortranh   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 16:06:09 -0300i2 From: Rodman S. Regier <rregierNOSPAM@dymaxion.ca>0 Subject: PW V5.0F ECO 2 and VMS V7.3-1 resources8 Message-ID: <7pouevk95ml4on1c4qob0prrd0cgkaqf8l@4ax.com>  = I had Pathworks V5.0F ECO 2 w/XP patch working on V/A V7.1-2.f  D I had to upgrade the VMS node to V/A V7.3-1 to support new hardware.  D After the upgrade, I cannot get the Pathworks server to successfully@ start.  It complains about insufficient resources to support any clients.  > Repeated iterations of ADMIN/CONFIG, reboot for AUTOGEN change$ fail to resolve the resources issue.  9 I suspect either the resource calculator for ADMIN/CONFIG A is broken under V7.3-1, or the resource verifier in the Pathworkss startup is broken.  . I have logged a call with TSC, but since PW V5= is not officially supported with V7.3-1 they can only provideC
 limited help.   3 I am not in a position to change to PW V6 or PW V7.     Anyone have a fix or workaround?   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 00:20:01 GMT" From: Rob.Buxton@wcc.govt.nz4 Subject: Re: PW V5.0F ECO 2 and VMS V7.3-1 resources$ Message-ID: <3eefaf54.14535187@news>  4 On Tue, 17 Jun 2003 16:06:09 -0300, Rodman S. Regier" <rregierNOSPAM@dymaxion.ca> wrote:  > >I had Pathworks V5.0F ECO 2 w/XP patch working on V/A V7.1-2. > E >I had to upgrade the VMS node to V/A V7.3-1 to support new hardware.  >IE >After the upgrade, I cannot get the Pathworks server to successfully A >start.  It complains about insufficient resources to support anyX	 >clients.) > ? >Repeated iterations of ADMIN/CONFIG, reboot for AUTOGEN change*% >fail to resolve the resources issue.a >i: >I suspect either the resource calculator for ADMIN/CONFIGB >is broken under V7.3-1, or the resource verifier in the Pathworks >startup is broken.  > / >I have logged a call with TSC, but since PW V5d> >is not officially supported with V7.3-1 they can only provide >limited help. >t4 >I am not in a position to change to PW V6 or PW V7. >*! >Anyone have a fix or workaround?  >   D I have no direct advice to offer, but included below are the entriesF made by Pathworks V6 in our Modparams file (some are old and commented out)E You may want to check these against your resources and see if there'se any obvious candidates.%> I'm not recommending you just add this to your Modparams file.  E ! min_intstkpages = 10          ! Reqd. for PWIP Driver for Pathworks* ! MIN_CHANNELCNT = 644       ! MIN_MAXPROCESSCNT = 60       * MIN_PROCSECTCNT = 40     MIN_CHANNELCNT = 793   e ADD_GBLPAGES = 4473      MIN_GBLPAGES = 95966     ADD_GBLSECTIONS = 75   0 MIN_GBLSECTIONS = 573  = ADD_MAXPROCESSCNT = 13   MIN_MAXPROCESSCNT = 59   ADD_NPAGEDYN = 35296     ADD_PAGEDYN = 410784     ADD_SPTREQ = 39736     0 MIN_VIRTUALPAGECNT = 61412     w MIN_WSMAX = 11020            >e >p   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:10:11 -0400o5 From: "Brad McCusker" <brad.mccuskerNosp@Mcompaq.com>i4 Subject: Re: PW V5.0F ECO 2 and VMS V7.3-1 resources/ Message-ID: <vevm17nkscjn8e@corp.supernews.com>u  ? "Rodman S. Regier" <rregierNOSPAM@dymaxion.ca> wrote in messages2 news:7pouevk95ml4on1c4qob0prrd0cgkaqf8l@4ax.com...? > I had Pathworks V5.0F ECO 2 w/XP patch working on V/A V7.1-2.b >tF > I had to upgrade the VMS node to V/A V7.3-1 to support new hardware. >eF > After the upgrade, I cannot get the Pathworks server to successfullyB > start.  It complains about insufficient resources to support any
 > clients. >kL Hmmm... I thought I had heard of people using V7.3-1 and PW-V5, but I may be wrong.  G Regardless, can you get us anything more specific on the error you see?oK something that might lead to a hint of what is wrong?  How much memory does L this box have, maybe its got more available memory than we ever anticipated?L In admin/config, does V5 have that field to choose the %physical memory?  IfJ so, what might happen if you lower that to 50% or even less?  Essentially,! give it less memory to play with?,  % Just taking wild guesses here, sorry.s  
 Brad McCuskerr   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 00:11:55 GMTs6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER), Subject: Re: Rookie question for the experts5 Message-ID: <f7OHa.265424$lL2.2758333@news.chello.at>e   In article <00A217BD.7A751218@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") writes:uo >In article <cttHa.250240$lL2.2584498@news.chello.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) writes: T >>In article <3EEE00E1.2030006@iee.org>, Antonio Carlini <arcarlini@iee.org> writes:# >>>Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:yP >>>> Only problem/annoyance I have with is the absence of multiwildcard support. >>>sD >>>It's been a long time now since I had my hands anywhere near the J >>>relevant area of DECnet's guts, but IIRC it's down to the way that the K >>>various calls keep their context between one invocation and the next. I gL >>>suspect that it's fixable (with some considerable effort, given how deep G >>>in the guts this is) but probably not deemed to be worthwhile for a  / >>>product that is largely in maintenance mode.e >>D >>Geee, there is this word again: VMS software in "maintenance mode" >e8 >What bold new development do you want to see in DECnet?   As was already written heree 1.) Multilevel Wildcard Supportg+ 2.) Better graphical Management Applicationu	 and maybet 3.) DECnet over [Open]SSLn just to name a few   -- 1 Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER8% Network and OpenVMS system specialistk E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 01:22:40 GMTrL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr"), Subject: Re: Rookie question for the experts6 Message-ID: <00A21885.E6DA5F1C@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  n In article <f7OHa.265424$lL2.2758333@news.chello.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) writes: >In article <00A217BD.7A751218@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") writes:p >>In article <cttHa.250240$lL2.2584498@news.chello.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) writes:U >>>In article <3EEE00E1.2030006@iee.org>, Antonio Carlini <arcarlini@iee.org> writes:e$ >>>>Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:Q >>>>> Only problem/annoyance I have with is the absence of multiwildcard support.e >>>>E >>>>It's been a long time now since I had my hands anywhere near the oK >>>>relevant area of DECnet's guts, but IIRC it's down to the way that the oL >>>>various calls keep their context between one invocation and the next. I M >>>>suspect that it's fixable (with some considerable effort, given how deep rH >>>>in the guts this is) but probably not deemed to be worthwhile for a 0 >>>>product that is largely in maintenance mode. >>>nE >>>Geee, there is this word again: VMS software in "maintenance mode"- >>9 >>What bold new development do you want to see in DECnet?e >( >As was already written here  >1.) Multilevel Wildcard Support, >2.) Better graphical Management Application
 >and maybe   >3.) DECnet over [Open]SSL  N I keep thinking there should be a way to use STUNNEL to do this, but I haven'tK been able to figure it out.  I would indeed like this feature (at least forl DECnet-over-IP).   -- Alani -- tO ===============================================================================l0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056tM  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025 O ===============================================================================e   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:26:28 -0500a1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> , Subject: Re: Rookie question for the experts' Message-ID: <3EEFCDD4.53EF7678@fsi.net>d   Dirk Munk wrote: >  > David J. Dachtera wrote:$ > > Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote: > > 
 > >>[snip]8 > >>This seems to become another religion war (4 vs. 5). > >  > >e9 > > Well, not so much "religion" as "ease of management".v > > K > > For those outfits with a big enough DECnet network, Phase-V is probably-F > > valuable, if rather ponderous to learn to manage. For most others,D > > Phase-IV is probably still the ticket for "set it and forget it" > > networking.d > R > With Phase IV you can build networks of appr. 64000 DECnet hosts, I doubt if any? > DECnet network of that size exists. So size is not the issue.0  E Well, yes and no. In theory, (63*1024)+1023 or 65,535 nodes total aresH possible in a Phase-IV only network. However, the total number is not asF much an issue as the limit on area numbers. In an organization of suhcF size, there would likely be a need to organize nodes into more than 63E "areas". Hence, the DECnet-Plus concept of "domains". This allows, at:H the very least, a naming scheme that will allow a degree of organization not available in Phase-IV.  * With that, however, also comes complexity.  
 > >>[snip]O > >>Only problem/annoyance I have with is the absence of multiwildcard support.o > >>8 > >>        NCL> SHOW NSP LOCAL NSAP * REMOTE NSAP * ALL > >>or? > >>        NCL> SHOW ROUTING CIRCUIT * REACHABLE ADDRESS * ALLy > >>D > >>gives %NCL-E-MULTILEVELWILD, multi-level wildcarding not allowedB > >>If this is fixed, then I'd say, DECnet-Plus is almost perfect. > >e > >tG > > ...except that it then still lacks a comprehensible user interface.0 > / > I admit NCL does have a steep learning curve.- > Q > However, it is not as difficult as many people think. NCL stricktly follows theeR > 7-layer OSI model, and once you understand that in principle rather simple modelQ > and how it is implemented in NCL, then NCL becomes far more easy to understand.62 > Then you can see the logic in the NCL structure.  H What is lacking, then is a "wizard"-like facility that accepts data fromH teh user and builds/maintains the configuration building the layers from the bottom up.  R > And from my experience then you will learn to appreciate Phase V as an excellentM > product, and again in my view a better, more high-tech product as Phase IV.   G For the need it fills, I'm sure DECnet-V *IS* an excellently functionalg: product. The management "layer" was all but left out, IMO.   -- ( David J. Dachterau dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:31:49 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>, Subject: Re: Rookie question for the experts) Message-ID: <3EEFDD20.B64D7D4D@istop.com>j   "David J. Dachtera" wrote:G > Well, yes and no. In theory, (63*1024)+1023 or 65,535 nodes total are J > possible in a Phase-IV only network. However, the total number is not as- > much an issue as the limit on area numbers.u  K In the DEC heydays, I can understand why you'd need a large DECNet network.2L However, today, with TCPIP as the "de-facto standard", wouldn't a very largeM organisation be more likely to have multiple small (isolated) decnet networksr8 with a corporate-wide TCPIP network to link everything ?  L BTW, does HP have DECNET in every sales office around the world ? (inheritedK from Compaq, inherited from Digital)  ?  What is HP's core backbone network  technology ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 20:00:15 -0400o, From: "David Turner" <dbturner@islandco.com>' Subject: SAN-SWitch 16 for only USD1895e/ Message-ID: <vevb5oairqg4ea@news.supernews.com>o  0 We have some refurbished Brocade 2800's in stock  ( Installed license, 16 GBICS and Dual P/S  J These are the beige ones (indentical to the Compaq SANswitch 16 that sells for $28000 new)e  2 And you get Island's 12 month same-as-new warranty   Call or email us to ordera     -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp.t 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404- Tel: 912 4476622 Fax: 912 2010402 http://www.islandco.com@ dbturner-at-hpaq.net (Change the -at- to @ to reply)f   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 15:54:22 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)n( Subject: Saving on HP World registration= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0306171454.6e237f1b@posting.google.com>   F If you're thinking about attending HP World, but would like a discount: on the registration fee, consider becoming an HP Certified
 Professional.?  E For example, becoming a Certified System Administrator for OpenVMS V73C requires passing only one exam, at a cost of $100 at Prometric, andR7 saves $995, for almost a 10:1 return on investment. SeeeE http://www.hp.com/go/certification/na/ for information on becoming anl HP Certified Professional.  0 (Discounts listed here are good through July 11)  F Highest Certification Level    HP CP Registration Price   Your SavingsE Master ASE                              $395              $1395 savedoE Accredited Systems Engineer (ASE)       $595              $1195 savedhE Certified Systems Engineer (CSE)        $595              $1195 savedtE Certified Systems Administrator (CSA)   $795               $995 saved0E Accredited Presales Consultant (APC)    $795               $995 savedaE Accredited Sales Consultant (ASC)       $795               $995 savedeE Accredited Integration Specialist (AIS) $795               $995 savediE Accredited Sales Professional (ASP)     $995               $795 savedeE Accredited Presales Professional (APP)  $995               $795 savedhE Accredited Platform Specialist (APS)    $995               $795 savedh7 Note: All registration prices are listed in US dollars.mB Note: Public price with no group affiliation is $1790 U.S. dollars  D Note: All the HP-specific certification exams will also be available= on-site in case you attend and decide that you wish to become > certified or upgrade your certification level during the week.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:45:02 GMTt# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>9, Subject: Re: Saving on HP World registrationI Message-ID: <2KNHa.129892$3Sm.91483@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>s  > "Keith Parris" <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:cf15391e.0306171454.6e237f1b@posting.google.com...<? > If you're thinking about attending HP World, but would like ar discount< > on the registration fee, consider becoming an HP Certified > Professional.e >iD > For example, becoming a Certified System Administrator for OpenVMS V7E > requires passing only one exam, at a cost of $100 at Prometric, andi9 > saves $995, for almost a 10:1 return on investment. SeenD > http://www.hp.com/go/certification/na/ for information on becoming an > HP Certified Professional. >s2 > (Discounts listed here are good through July 11) >>@ > Highest Certification Level    HP CP Registration Price   Your SavingsyA > Master ASE                              $395              $1395s saved6A > Accredited Systems Engineer (ASE)       $595              $1195y savedtA > Certified Systems Engineer (CSE)        $595              $1195e saved A > Certified Systems Administrator (CSA)   $795               $995  savedtA > Accredited Presales Consultant (APC)    $795               $995  savedsA > Accredited Sales Consultant (ASC)       $795               $995h saved A > Accredited Integration Specialist (AIS) $795               $995e saved A > Accredited Sales Professional (ASP)     $995               $795d savedhA > Accredited Presales Professional (APP)  $995               $795a savedrA > Accredited Platform Specialist (APS)    $995               $795s savedp9 > Note: All registration prices are listed in US dollars. D > Note: Public price with no group affiliation is $1790 U.S. dollars >oF > Note: All the HP-specific certification exams will also be available? > on-site in case you attend and decide that you wish to become @ > certified or upgrade your certification level during the week.       Keith,   What are these....?c  $ Accredited Presales Consultant (APC)! Accredited Sales Consultant (ASC)   B I'm surprised that HP even has these courses given that they don'tD sell VMS....oh, of course...they teach PeeCee in these certification	 sessions.R      E So is the presales consultant the guy who finds out which pocket your6E wallet is in, and the sales consultant the guy who picks your pocket?e   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 22:04:26 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris)s, Subject: Re: Saving on HP World registration= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0306172104.4b9e64dd@posting.google.com>   t "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message news:<2KNHa.129892$3Sm.91483@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>... > What are these....?h > & > Accredited Presales Consultant (APC)# > Accredited Sales Consultant (ASC)   E These certifications are aimed at salespeople who work for resellers.m   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:40:47 -0400t* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>I Subject: Re: SEC:U MIT-MAGIC-COOKIE-1, Motif 1.3 and HP TCP/IP XDM (long)O) Message-ID: <3EEFD12D.B57EBACF@istop.com>    Dirk Munk wrote:L > I did understand that. But the two are connected, so if it is 'normal' forM > present day versions of Motif to be accompanied by a newer version of XDM,    G For what its worth, MI-X, the X-terminal software for old MACs uses theyN MIT-MAGIC-COOKIES, so that technology can't be that recent. The XMD server wasM introduiced with TCPIP Service 5.3, which *is* brand new. There is no excuse.I   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 00:02:21 -0400O* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> Subject: Small village and IBM) Message-ID: <3EEFE446.B773C892@istop.com>   K Pump pressure controller failed. So I bike to the local village (7 km away)eJ which has a small hardware store. I get there, and the guy asks me: do youK need a male or female connector for the controller (it screws onto the pumpi4 assembly to sense the pressure to starts/stop pump).   Arghhhhh ! .  L No problem though. he said, here: take both male and female, install the oneN you need, bring back the other later this week and we'll settle the bill then.  F In the end, I brought back the other the same day before their closed.  N Life in a small village is very interesting. OK, if I don't pay, they probably> can catch up to me on their pickup trucks ( I travel by bike).  N   But you know what, such service does exist in the "real" world. I distinctlyL remember IBM providing such service. Our department (I was the lone VMS guy,J the rest were MVS etc) had a project to evaluate OS2 for dial-in access byK customers to download files. The night before a presentation, the IBM salesbN rep shows up to talk to the bank folks working on the pilot/demo. He finds outL they are having a few problems, so he said "don't worry, I'll go back to theN office, get you extra memory boards and an additional RS232 controller and getH back to you in half an hour, don't worry about any bills/invoices, we'll settle that later".y  K When I tried to get DEC to make a presentation about their EDI product whenrN the bank was looking for an EDI solution, I couldn't even get the sales rep toM call the EDI product manager in Canada (I had provided his her name and phoneo' number: had met her at a  decus event).e  S It is no wonder IBM is still alive and DEC isn't. At least IBM did try to push OS2.f   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 16:02:56 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) $ Subject: Re: Sun to be the next DEC!= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0306171502.3b6df5b6@posting.google.com>   d "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message news:<44udnTnTRYtPhnOjXTWJgQ@metrocast.net>...J > Sun's main problem is that it expanded more than most higher-end vendorsH > during the dot-com boom and is now imploding more than most higher-end" > vendors during the ensuing bust.  E I agree that this was a huge problem for Sun, but it's not their maine problem now.  0 > But its customer base appears to remain loyal,  @ Maybe.  VAX/VMS customers in the late '80s were loyal, until Sun/ workstations provided better price/performance.H  % > its hardware remains cost-effectivel  F As many examples (such as E*Trade's dumping Solaris-on-Sun in favor ofD Linux-on-Intel for its web front-end, and Sun's own foray into Linux9 via Cobalt) indicate, Sun has a big problem in this area.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:04:58 -0400c* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>$ Subject: Re: Sun to be the next DEC!) Message-ID: <3EEFD6D6.FA3C4A0E@istop.com>o   Bob Ceculski wrote:i > M > http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupdate/stories/main/0,14179,2914032,00.htmli    M The article shows a lot of bias in my opnion. While it is true that linux andoL wintel do pose a serious challenge, it may not mean the end of "prorpietary"+ systems (windows is proprietary after all).h  M Interesting that they say that if Sun doesn't go "wintel", it may end up like L Digital. Ironic that Digital went belly up exactly because it abandonned its! own products in favour of Wintel.e  N Does Linux DRIVE technology or does it follow ? If it doesn't drive/lead, thenK you need some other systems that do. VMS, Solaris and IBM's MVS are perhapsd. the leaders. Does HP-UX have anything unique ?  N I also found it interesting that they claim that Solaris isn't seen as a driveG of Web services. I was under the clear impression that it was the exact I opposite. When Banks woke up and had to scramble to put a presence on the' internet, theyr chose Sun.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 02:28:55 GMTo# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>v$ Subject: Re: Sun to be the next DEC!J Message-ID: <H7QHa.130018$3Sm.112134@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  > "Keith Parris" <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:cf15391e.0306171502.3b6df5b6@posting.google.com...27 > "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in messageX. news:<44udnTnTRYtPhnOjXTWJgQ@metrocast.net>...D > > Sun's main problem is that it expanded more than most higher-end vendorsh? > > during the dot-com boom and is now imploding more than most 
 higher-end$ > > vendors during the ensuing bust. > B > I agree that this was a huge problem for Sun, but it's not their main > problem now. >n2 > > But its customer base appears to remain loyal, >eB > Maybe.  VAX/VMS customers in the late '80s were loyal, until Sun1 > workstations provided better price/performance.w >e' > > its hardware remains cost-effectivel >iE > As many examples (such as E*Trade's dumping Solaris-on-Sun in favorg ofF > Linux-on-Intel for its web front-end, and Sun's own foray into Linux; > via Cobalt) indicate, Sun has a big problem in this area.e    C I think the Cobalt acquisition was a recognition that Sun needed annE easily configurable/maintainable 'appliance' to serve the sector thatjF Cobalt was serving. It was probably a case of Sun being able to buyoutD Cobalt for about the same amount of money it would have taken Sun toD get to market with a similar product, with the added benefit that it- took a competitor out of the market entirely.s   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:13:04 -0400s* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>$ Subject: Re: Sun to be the next DEC!) Message-ID: <3EEFD8BB.D678183A@istop.com>    Bill Todd wrote:G > vendor support niches aren't anything to be sneezed at), its softwarehK > directions are about as ho-hum as everyone else's (which seems to satisfy 9 > the current market), *and it listens to its customers*.n  K One aspect of the article which has credibility is that if Sun continues to(K focus on hardware sales to generate profits, the squeeze to low margin, lowuN cost hardware by competitors may squeeze profits right out of Sun.  But if SunJ starts to charge more for Solaris, then it may lose market share to Linux.  L But guess what, HP is in the same boat with its HP-UX. At least Solaris runs" on commodity chips, HP-UX doesn't.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 03:07:59 GMTs+ From: LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (leslie)iD Subject: Sun's Migration Campaign To Target VMS (And Tru64 & HP3000); Message-ID: <jIQHa.30366$1w1.2215834@twister.austin.rr.com>v+ Keywords: sun,migration,campaign,target,vmsi  )    http://makeashorterlink.com/?C13D516F4/4    Sun targets AIX with new campaign - Computerworld  & The original link, wrapped to 2 lines:  =    http://www.computerworld.com/softwaretopics/os/unix/story/u    0,10801,82209,00.html4    Sun targets AIX with new campaign - Computerworld  $   "Sun targets AIX with new campaign1    It's hoping to capitalize on the IBM/SCO fight   '    By Robert McMillan, IDG News ServiceX    JUNE 17, 2003      Content Type: Story f    Source: IDG News Service   H    Looking to capitalize on IBM's legal dispute with The SCO Group Inc.,C    Sun Microsystems Inc. is readying a new AIX-to-Solaris migrationiE    program that will kick off tomorrow with full-page ads in The Wall 0    Street Journal and the San Jose Mercury News.  I    The advertisements, designed by New York-based J. Walter Thompson Co.,aD    will obliquely refer to SCO's $1 billion lawsuit with IBM and itsA    recent announcement that it had terminated IBM's AIX licensingaH    agreement (see story), and they will present Sun's Solaris as a safer"    version of Unix than IBM's AIX.  	    [snip]   F    Sun expects to roll out similar migration campaigns for a number ofH    other rival systems during the next few months. Hewlett-Packard Co.'sD    Tru64, VMS and HP3000 operating systems are being targeted, as isE    Windows NT, for which Sun will be offering a migration program fora    Solaris on x86.  E    Sun had originally planned roll out its Tru64-to-Solaris migrationeE    program first, Singer said, but as SCO's lawsuit with IBM remainedgB    unresolved, the company decided to move up the AIX program. "WeF    thought we'd just pull it out a little earlier for [AIX] because of;    the opportunity that IBM has handed us," said Singer..."l    2 --Jerry Leslie   (my opinions are strictly my own)9   Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for emails   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 00:44:54 GMTe From: Rob.Buxton@wcc.govt.nz Subject: Re: Suspended process$ Message-ID: <3eefb5cd.16562718@news>  + On Tue, 17 Jun 2003 13:26:20 GMT, "labadie"a$ <tonari_no_tottoro@127.0.0.1> wrote:   >oD >"Tomasz Dryjanski" <tdryjanski.nospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message) >news:bcn2in$ddn$1@nemesis.news.tpi.pl...c( >> > if it is a quota problem, go in sda >> > $ ana/sys >> > set proc/id=000084E2e >> > sh procI >> > see if the EFWM (event flag wait mask) has the same value as the Jibi >(jobg >> > information block) G >> > If it has, this means the process is waiting for a job wide sharedz >> resources >> > (bytlm, or tqelm) >> >> This is the case. >> >> > look at >> > jib$b_flags >> >> Where can I find it?A >Do in >sda> read sysdefa >sda> format jib >, >4 >M >> >> > 1 -> bytlm exhaustedt >> > 2 -> tqelm exhaustedaK >> > 3 -> should mean  2 jobs in the same job tree, one waitying for Bytlm,l >teh+ >> > other for Tqelm (I have never seen it)  >> >M >> > If you have Availability Manager or Amds installed, you can add Bytlm orf5 >> > Tqelm dynamically, and your process will resume.  >>J >> I don't have any of the above. Does it mean that a re-boot is required?0 >If you install Amds or Availability Manager, no  A That can depend, on Alpha, AMDS or Availability Manager sometimese7 update the RMDriver in which case a reboot is required.. >  >Regards >a >Grardo >i >b >t   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 17:52:59 GMTa" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: VMS Freeware CDss0 Message-ID: <00A21860.36AE95A1@SendSpamHere.ORG>  b In article <bcnfrr$roa$2@pcls4.std.com>, moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes:J >I can host files if necessary.  I have a DSL line with no transfer limit. >--  >-Mike  G FYI, I've had the freeware CDs V1 through V5 hosted at my site for somei time and I've got a T1.    --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" o   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:50:27 GMTI# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>e Subject: Re: VMS Freeware CDsaI Message-ID: <7PNHa.129895$3Sm.40260@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>h  , <VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message* news:00A21860.36AE95A1@SendSpamHere.ORG...* > In article <bcnfrr$roa$2@pcls4.std.com>,9 moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes: E > >I can host files if necessary.  I have a DSL line with no transfero limit. > >--a > >-Mike >oD > FYI, I've had the freeware CDs V1 through V5 hosted at my site for some > time and I've got a T1.o    E So all that's required is someplace to list your site, Michael's, ands others who are willing to host.c   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:34:51 -0500i1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>f5 Subject: Re: What Tape Library for VMS and FC clusterh' Message-ID: <3EEFDDDB.773AC35E@fsi.net>r   Gunther Schadow wrote: >  > Hi,o > G > we are in the process of purchasing a tape library to back up our EMCz> > Symmetrix SAN. Would like to poll some experiences with VMS. > % > The alternatives I'm looking at are  > - > 1) StorageWorks MSL6060 with 4 LTO-2 drivesl  9 OpenVMS support for LTO-2 is a future. Not yet available.e  * > 2) ADIC Scalar 1000 with 6x2 AIT-2 slots  * Not sure if OpenVMS has qualified AIT yet.   > 3) ADIC Scalar 100 with LTO-1- > 4) StorageTek L180, LTO-1z > 5) StorageTek L700, LTO-1z  9 OpenVMS does not (and never will, I'm told) support LTO-1X  I > the options 2-5 are recertified used devices. I have the choice in tapesH > drives for some of them, which I need, because as I undertstand, LTO-1$ > will never be supported under VMS. > G > However, we may need a backup server anyway, in which case the backupn) > server machine doesn't have to run VMS.   G Oh, yes it does! ...unless you never intend to save/restore your systemb disk using a non-VMS system	   > My questions are:n > ? > - any issues to report with either of the alternatives above?u > B > - how can you control the robots of non-DEC/COMPAQ/HP libraries, >    does MRU work for those?a  G Depends. Contact HP for authoritative reference. I'm told it works witha L700.   G > - given the little competition of tape library backup server software E >    on VMS, isn't it more useful to install a non-VMS backup server?E  C No. Non-VMS systems in general do not fully support /IMAGE backups.a  G > - does server-less backup directly over fibre channel work for peoplee >    here with VMS?   C Sort of. It DEFINITELY can be made to work with all HP-badged gear.o6 Outside of that arena, it's hit-or-miss (mostly miss).  - See my earlier posts on this topic (FC tape).s   -- t David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems- http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/m   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:31:37 -0500g1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> > Subject: Re: WHY I WANT TO: Re: manually setting the ProcessID' Message-ID: <3EEFCF09.89D3B9CE@fsi.net>o   Dave Brennan wrote:  > 6 > "Tim Aisthorpe-Buckley" <Tim_A_B@Hotmail.com> wrote: > H > The easiest thing to do is to use the process name like a virtual PID.G > So if each script does a set process name to one or two or three. You F > can find out which process is running and stop that process by using > its name.l  D Hint: Jacket the programs with enough DCL to determine the PID based5 onteh process name. See HELP LEX F$CONTEXT() Examplesp   --   David J. Dachteray dba DJE Systemsr http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 22:48:35 -0400V* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>< Subject: Re: You say you want apps for VMS?  Here they come!) Message-ID: <3EEFD300.CF8BDAC7@istop.com>    Bob Ceculski wrote:i > * > they're on the way says the inquirer ... > + > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=10022n  M So that article says that Oracle will port some software to VMS-IA64. Will itaI port ALL of its Oracle software to VMS ?  If not, will it port all of the@7 software presently available on VMS-Alpha to VMS-IA64 ?u  K If you have 100 products, you can claim suport for VMS-IA64 by porting justkN one product. But it doesn't mean much to the customers if only one of your 100 products is available.  M Now, if I saw an Oracle statement conforming they would port their full suites. of products to VMS, then I would be impressed.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 18:30:19 -0400r- From: Jonathan Boswell <jsb@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>e5 Subject: ZKO email problems re: CXML on OpenVMS Alphat0 Message-ID: <3EEF967B.EC9727E1@ost.cdrh.fda.gov>  M I downloaded the beta CXML V5.2-1 from HP's web site, and I am having troublel! getting it to work.  The page at:o  3 	http://h18000.www1.hp.com/math/download/index.html   A is a form which emails a request for joining an interest group to M mathsup@zko.dec.com, but this bounces with user unknown.  After unzipping and M installing, the IVP works fine but then my users cannot get the DSS module to5N compile.  (This version of CXML works fine in CVF 6.6.)  The email link in theO OpenVMS block of the download page for comments and questions is a mailto: linktA to cxml@compaq.com.  This *also* bounces with "user unknown" from. mathsup@zko.dec.com.  Hmmm.M  G Is there a valid email address for support on CXML?  Thanks in advance!a   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 01:27:38 GMTu- From: "Steve Lionel" <steve.lionel@intel.com>n9 Subject: Re: ZKO email problems re: CXML on OpenVMS AlphaA. Message-ID: <eePHa.59758$YZ2.221394@rwcrnsc53>  : "Jonathan Boswell" <jsb@ost.cdrh.fda.gov> wrote in message* news:3EEF967B.EC9727E1@ost.cdrh.fda.gov...G > I downloaded the beta CXML V5.2-1 from HP's web site, and I am havingd troublei# > getting it to work.  The page at:i >l4 > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/math/download/index.html >hC > is a form which emails a request for joining an interest group toA: > mathsup@zko.dec.com, but this bounces with user unknown.  8 Try cxml  -at- compaq.com   See also the Support link at http://compaq.com/math   Steve(   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 00:33:12 GMTr6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)I Subject: Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?n5 Message-ID: <crOHa.265533$lL2.2759750@news.chello.at>h  W In article <veu7nh3g14vleb@news.supernews.com>, "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> writes:0D >"Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message0 >news:d4uHa.250531$lL2.2584498@news.chello.at... >> You probably know >> >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTARTP) >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/NAME_OF_MANAGER=... ! >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/ON_NODE=...Q >>I >> but what about showing the current state of what queue manager on what . >> node is already enabled or still disabled ? >>$ >> Is there a SHOW (QUEUE) command ?9 >> Is there a lexical function (item code for F$GETQUI) ?RM >> Am I blind^Wtired or is there something still missing in VMS and/or docu ?p >> >c? >Try SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER and/or f$getqui("DISPLAY_MANAGER",....)e  ! I did (before posting). Did you ?d And I even tried /FULL...a   -- o Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERw% Network and OpenVMS system specialistu E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:51:53 -0400 % From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com>kI Subject: Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ? / Message-ID: <vevhdrfrr0cif5@news.supernews.com>   C "Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in messagen/ news:crOHa.265533$lL2.2759750@news.chello.at...b@ > In article <veu7nh3g14vleb@news.supernews.com>, "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> writes:F > >"Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message2 > >news:d4uHa.250531$lL2.2584498@news.chello.at... > >> You probably know > >> > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTARTk+ > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/NAME_OF_MANAGER=...e# > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/ON_NODE=...  > >>K > >> but what about showing the current state of what queue manager on whatA0 > >> node is already enabled or still disabled ? > >>& > >> Is there a SHOW (QUEUE) command ?; > >> Is there a lexical function (item code for F$GETQUI) ?TH > >> Am I blind^Wtired or is there something still missing in VMS and/or docu ? > >> > > A > >Try SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER and/or f$getqui("DISPLAY_MANAGER",....)o >r# > I did (before posting). Did you ?s > And I even tried /FULL...3 >6  F They both work for me.  What version of VMS are you using?  What error message are you getting?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:59:46 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>aI Subject: Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?w' Message-ID: <3EEFD5A2.F2F4BB6E@fsi.net>k   John Vottero wrote:e > E > "Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message 1 > news:crOHa.265533$lL2.2759750@news.chello.at...sB > > In article <veu7nh3g14vleb@news.supernews.com>, "John Vottero" > <John@mvpsi.com> writes:H > > >"Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message4 > > >news:d4uHa.250531$lL2.2584498@news.chello.at... > > >> You probably know > > >> > > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTARTt- > > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/NAME_OF_MANAGER=...M% > > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/ON_NODE=...  > > >>M > > >> but what about showing the current state of what queue manager on what 2 > > >> node is already enabled or still disabled ? > > >>( > > >> Is there a SHOW (QUEUE) command ?= > > >> Is there a lexical function (item code for F$GETQUI) ?-J > > >> Am I blind^Wtired or is there something still missing in VMS and/or > docu ? > > >> > > >AC > > >Try SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER and/or f$getqui("DISPLAY_MANAGER",....)g > > % > > I did (before posting). Did you ?D > > And I even tried /FULL...l > >5 > H > They both work for me.  What version of VMS are you using?  What error > message are you getting?  A I think his point is that there is no (obvious) equivalent to theiE missing "SHOW AUTOSTART/ENABLED" or "SHOW QUEUE/AUTOSTART=ENABLED" or2B some such. SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER/FULL does not seem to indicate this,A either, at least not on V7.2-2 which is what I have here at home.l  F HELP Lexical F$GETQUI Arguments does not list "AUTOSTART" or "ENABLED"  as a valid item code or keyword.   --   David J. Dachterai dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/D   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:16:06 -0400e% From: "John Vottero" <John@mvpsi.com> I Subject: Re: [ENABLE AUTOSTART] How to determine the state of AUTOSTART ?o/ Message-ID: <vevmbpq721kp3b@news.supernews.com>t  < "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message! news:3EEFD5A2.F2F4BB6E@fsi.net...n > John Vottero wrote:s > > G > > "Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in messagen3 > > news:crOHa.265533$lL2.2759750@news.chello.at... D > > > In article <veu7nh3g14vleb@news.supernews.com>, "John Vottero" > > <John@mvpsi.com> writes:J > > > >"Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message6 > > > >news:d4uHa.250531$lL2.2584498@news.chello.at... > > > >> You probably know > > > >> > > > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTARTn/ > > > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/NAME_OF_MANAGER=...=' > > > >> $ ENABLE AUTOSTART/ON_NODE=...= > > > >>J > > > >> but what about showing the current state of what queue manager on what4 > > > >> node is already enabled or still disabled ? > > > >>* > > > >> Is there a SHOW (QUEUE) command ?? > > > >> Is there a lexical function (item code for F$GETQUI) ?=L > > > >> Am I blind^Wtired or is there something still missing in VMS and/or
 > > docu ? > > > >> > > > >:E > > > >Try SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER and/or f$getqui("DISPLAY_MANAGER",....)c > > >R' > > > I did (before posting). Did you ?D > > > And I even tried /FULL...  > > >n > >tJ > > They both work for me.  What version of VMS are you using?  What error > > message are you getting? > C > I think his point is that there is no (obvious) equivalent to themG > missing "SHOW AUTOSTART/ENABLED" or "SHOW QUEUE/AUTOSTART=ENABLED" orhD > some such. SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER/FULL does not seem to indicate this,C > either, at least not on V7.2-2 which is what I have here at home.  >bH > HELP Lexical F$GETQUI Arguments does not list "AUTOSTART" or "ENABLED"" > as a valid item code or keyword. >   H "I see" said the blind man!  I misunderstood the original question.  NowE that I understand what you were asking, you're right there's a bit of)0 information left out of SHOW QUEUE/MANAGER/FULL.  G You'll have to use lexicals to find a queue that's managed by the queuetI manager of interest and autostarted and then look at it's status.  Take aeJ look at the "MANAGER_NAME", "QUEUE_AUTOSTART", "QUEUE_AUTOSTART_INACTIVE",6 "QUEUE_STOPPED", "QUEUE_STATUS" and maybe other items.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 13:46:34 -0400l$ From: "rob kas" <news@paychoice.com>C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!v/ Message-ID: <veulheat2p0jb3@corp.supernews.com>    > I > True.  And had BSD not been pulled because of the lawsuit it would have F > gained more than enough momentum before Linux came out to make LinuxE > redundant.  Even today, in most respects, the BSD's are technically I > better than the various Linux derivatives.  Remove Linux for any periodeD > of time to give BSD a little steam and it is unlikely anyone would > return to Linux later. >eI > Today, Linux has only one thing better than BSD.  Marketing.  But then,i& > everybody here knows all about that. >S                      Way to true.aH                    I have Freebsd Running on a AlphaServer 2100 , it hadC been online for over a year, serving upWeb Pages and as a FTP site.lH                    Just took it down to upgrade to version 5.0 which now makes use of all four CPU's     <                                                          Rob   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 15:28:50 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!s= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0306171428.7d94cdd8@posting.google.com>l  } clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) wrote in message news:<UM7kCsw3DvEl@eisner.encompasserve.org>...p >wI > At least the BSD issue has got settled in court, so if the US courts doy7 > something stupid, then we can always switch to BSD...e >  > Simon.  8 why would you want to switch to that junk when you could
 be on VMS?   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 15:30:29 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS! = Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0306171430.69d24ea6@posting.google.com>   e bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote in message news:<bcnisa$l3qm0$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>...w > G > And that was the point BSD had just reached when the lawsuit hit. UCB-F > shut down the CSRG and got out of the OS business.  All the old CSRGE > denizens split up taking copies of BSD with them.  I was one of theCG > lucky ones to have gotten my copy of the sources before the ftp siteseH > all shut down so I got to at least continue to play until the suit was
 > settled. >  > bill  9 why are you running that junk, what happened to RSTS/E or- Primos?a   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 18:35:48 -0400c2 From: John Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org>C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!i4 Message-ID: <20030617223548.GB4991@eisenschmidt.org>   Once again:P  $ 	inexpensive fast commodity hardware  B While VMS is certainly more mature, a quick visit to netcraft willF show you that *BSD systems outnumber VMS boxen (unless the majority of them live on NSA's rednet).   B I've been using RAIDFrame for about six months now, and while it'sC certainly not Volume Shadowing, it's somewhere between that (on then? high end) and Solaris Disk Suite on the low end. I've been very- pleased.  D And without BSD, most of us wouldn't have an IP stack. I suggest youE choose your targets better before you throw those stones (aim them atg Linux and hurl).  : Rumor has it that Bob Ceculski (bob@instantwhip.com) said: > clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) wrote in message news:<UM7kCsw3DvEl@eisner.encompasserve.org>...  > >xK > > At least the BSD issue has got settled in court, so if the US courts dos9 > > something stupid, then we can always switch to BSD...a > > 
 > > Simon. > : > why would you want to switch to that junk when you could > be on VMS?   -- r/ John W. Eisenschmidt (jweisen@eisenschmidt.org)..   http://www.eisenschmidt.org/jweisen/pgp.html  J "Big Gray Wall n. :: What faces a VMS user searching for documentation. A L  full VMS kit comes on a pallet, the documentation taking up around 15 feet K  of shelf space before the addition of layered products such as compilers,  K  databases, multivendor networking, and programming tools" -The Jargon Filem   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 15:33:56 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> C Subject: RE: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS! 9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIOEMJHGAA.tom@kednos.com>5  F Anybody want to buy my ATT source license dated 1982?  Maybe I should  put it on ebay.    >-----Original Message-----f0 >From: Bob Ceculski [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]% >Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2003 3:30 PM9 >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComD >Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS! >p >e5 >bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote in message e2 >news:<bcnisa$l3qm0$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>... >> aH >> And that was the point BSD had just reached when the lawsuit hit. UCBG >> shut down the CSRG and got out of the OS business.  All the old CSRG-F >> denizens split up taking copies of BSD with them.  I was one of theH >> lucky ones to have gotten my copy of the sources before the ftp sitesI >> all shut down so I got to at least continue to play until the suit was  >> settled.i >> e >> bill_ >P: >why are you running that junk, what happened to RSTS/E or >Primos? >. >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.n; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).tA >Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 6/10/2003  >  ---l& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 6/10/2003   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 18:46:56 -0400f2 From: John Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org>C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!h4 Message-ID: <20030617224656.GC4991@eisenschmidt.org>  T Rumor has it that Simon Clubley (clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP) said:b > In article <bcn1ko$kmrhf$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:7 > > In article <zCc28l++KQ3p@eisner.encompasserve.org>, I > > 	clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:  > >> tO > >> This SCO lawsuit is now starting to turn nasty. I would not want to be SCOl6 > >> when IBM starts getting serious in it's response. > > I > > I can just see IBM buying SCO and firing everybody.  With one foot in I > > the grave already, how much could SCO cost?  And with the first legal E > > attack from IBM I would bet even that value would drop drasticly.r  D Their market value is about $130 million. IBM is about $143 billion.  K > While I can see that is one possibility, I would hate for this to happen.c > N > It would come across as SCO having won and IBM having caved in as one of theL > themes running through this lawsuit is that SCO considers it an acceptableK > outcome to get bought out and it may encourage other financially insecure # > companies to try the same tactic.   C To be honest, and smarter people than me have speculated on this, ItC don't think IBM can buy SCO. The legal affect of one SYS V licenseeu- buying it up...what about Sun and SGI and HP?c  > Unless they bought SCO and released the SYS V source into Open Source.   L > > Another interesting side to this has not yet been addressed.  Linux cameM > > to ascendency because/while BSD was tied up with a lawsuit.  Couldn't the-L > > reverse occur if there turns out to be enough credence to any of this to* > > result in any kind of injunction?  :-) > >  > I > At least the BSD issue has got settled in court, so if the US courts do 7 > something stupid, then we can always switch to BSD...N  ) The US courts? Stupid? C'est impossible! .  E I really hope that Oracle/Peoplesoft and IBM/SCO lasts until the falla TV season returns...   > Simon. >n > --  D > Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       N > VMS advocate: One who makes a Mac advocate look like a beginner at advocacy.   --  / John W. Eisenschmidt (jweisen@eisenschmidt.org):.   http://www.eisenschmidt.org/jweisen/pgp.html  E "And the kids said, 'Mommy, why is Tony Curtis calling you a whore?'"r 						     -Sharon Osbourne.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 23:48:16 GMTo# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>wC Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!wI Message-ID: <4NNHa.129893$3Sm.34408@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>t  ? "John Eisenschmidt" <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org> wrote in message . news:20030617224656.GC4991@eisenschmidt.org...! > Rumor has it that Simon Clubleye4 (clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP) said:9 > > In article <bcn1ko$kmrhf$1@ID-135708.news.dfncis.de>,e* bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:9 > > > In article <zCc28l++KQ3p@eisner.encompasserve.org>,lB > > > clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:a > > >>B > > >> This SCO lawsuit is now starting to turn nasty. I would not want to be SCO8 > > >> when IBM starts getting serious in it's response. > > >hC > > > I can just see IBM buying SCO and firing everybody.  With onei foot ineE > > > the grave already, how much could SCO cost?  And with the firsth legalt< > > > attack from IBM I would bet even that value would drop
 drasticly. >.F > Their market value is about $130 million. IBM is about $143 billion.  A And SCO will be spending every cent of that on legal fees if theyi0 think they have even a remote chance of winning.    E > > While I can see that is one possibility, I would hate for this toO happen.m > >IE > > It would come across as SCO having won and IBM having caved in ase
 one of theC > > themes running through this lawsuit is that SCO considers it ann
 acceptableD > > outcome to get bought out and it may encourage other financially insecure% > > companies to try the same tactic.e > E > To be honest, and smarter people than me have speculated on this, IoE > don't think IBM can buy SCO. The legal affect of one SYS V licenseel/ > buying it up...what about Sun and SGI and HP?w  6 HP could always rename OSF/1-based Tru64 to HP-UX. ;-)      @ > Unless they bought SCO and released the SYS V source into Open	 > Source.o >iB > > > Another interesting side to this has not yet been addressed.
 Linux cameA > > > to ascendency because/while BSD was tied up with a lawsuit.  Couldn't theF > > > reverse occur if there turns out to be enough credence to any of this toh, > > > result in any kind of injunction?  :-) > > >J > >0A > > At least the BSD issue has got settled in court, so if the US 	 courts doR9 > > something stupid, then we can always switch to BSD...2 >6* > The US courts? Stupid? C'est impossible! >tB > I really hope that Oracle/Peoplesoft and IBM/SCO lasts until the fall > TV season returns...   Survivor???i   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jun 2003 17:50:35 -0700# From: owski@hotmail.com (Adam Ruth) C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!a< Message-ID: <f0f51c80.0306171650.490b586@posting.google.com>  n John Eisenschmidt <jweisen@eisenschmidt.org> wrote in message news:<20030617224656.GC4991@eisenschmidt.org>...E > To be honest, and smarter people than me have speculated on this, IdE > don't think IBM can buy SCO. The legal affect of one SYS V licenseep/ > buying it up...what about Sun and SGI and HP?r > @ > Unless they bought SCO and released the SYS V source into Open
 > Source.   B Shouldn't be a problem, SCO bought it up and they were a licensee.  E However, I think that IBM could win the PR battle if they bought SCO,.F open sourced all of Unix, and trumpeted the fact that this did this asC a gesture to the Open Source Community.  To forever end any of this.@ Unix vs. Linux nonsense.  Then it wouldn't look like they caved.  	 Adam Rutho   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 01:01:25 GMTaL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS! 6 Message-ID: <00A21882.EEB26EBF@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  w In article <01KX7EGRO3VCAOKN0V@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com>, Phillip Helbig <HELBPHI@sysdev.deutsche-boerse.com> writes:nK >> Another interesting side to this has not yet been addressed.  Linux came L >> to ascendency because/while BSD was tied up with a lawsuit.  Couldn't theK >> reverse occur if there turns out to be enough credence to any of this tot) >> result in any kind of injunction?  :-)i >. >I DO note your smiley.  :-) > H >While what you say might be true, I doubt that is the reason WHY Linux E >took off when it did.  I think it has a lot to do with being in the -I >right place at the right time.  The essential thing necessary for Linux <E >to take off was the ability for the average home user to be able to QJ >download the software he needs in a reasonable time.  My retrodiction is F >that whatever unix variant for Intel hardware was in the air at that * >time would experience substantial growth.  K I think Linux ascendancy required Linus, or someone like him.  A reasonablymF charismatic figure with a sense of mission and the idea of paying someL attention to marketing.  (And that's marketing both the open source movementH and Linux itself.) That allowed a somewhat immature product, technicallyN inferior to xBSD, to gain an avid audience of developers and a large community	 of users.    -- Alant   -- sO =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056 M  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025tO ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 21:54:29 -0500s1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>aC Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!r' Message-ID: <3EEFD465.ADDB076E@fsi.net>    Bob Ceculski wrote:f >  > clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) wrote in message news:<UM7kCsw3DvEl@eisner.encompasserve.org>...o > >cK > > At least the BSD issue has got settled in court, so if the US courts doa9 > > something stupid, then we can always switch to BSD...e > >m
 > > Simon. > : > why would you want to switch to that junk when you could > be on VMS?  " Since when does VMS run on RS6000?  B None of the *BSD sites list an RS6000 port, AFAICT. Didn't look at Linux. e   -- a David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/l   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 03:10:33 +0000 (UTC)g) From: Dan Foster <dsf@globalcrossing.net> C Subject: Re: [OT] SCO tells IBM no more AIX ... IBM better buy VMS!u3 Message-ID: <slrnbevm1i.6uc.dsf@gaia.roc2.gblx.net>e  X In article <3EEFD465.ADDB076E@fsi.net>, David J. Dachtera <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote: > D > None of the *BSD sites list an RS6000 port, AFAICT. Didn't look at	 > Linux. -  J NetBSD runs on some PReP-based (older) RS/6000s; that's only an handful ofH machines as IBM soon came out with CHRP-based RS/6000s starting with theH F50 in about 1997 or so. It doesn't work with the pre-PReP MCA machines,G either. So the net effect is that this port works only on an handful ofiH older RS/6000 models. The NetBSD port for the PReP based boxes is calledF port-prep. There is no NetBSD port known to be working with any of the! newer (or the even older) boxes.    G I know for sure the RS/6000 platform isn't covered by either FreeBSD orr OpenBSD.  H Several Linux distributions works on the current RS/6000s (or pSeries ifG you prefer the new name) such as YellowDog Linux, and reportedly Gentoo & Linux, and at least one or two others.  G Despite these options, I wouldn't run anything but AIX on a RS/6000 andSK anything but VMS on a VAX or Alpha because in my honest opinion, most otherrI options are relatively immature (although I could see running Tru64 on anlI Alpha), especially in area of device driver and hardware support honed bytH years of skilled people and knowledge and experience along with detailedG documentation about internals available to these commercial developers.t  J It's just simply a long way from polished when you deviate from the common hardware/OS combinations.i  I My two cents for this thread: it's a shame IBM's not interested, but thencC again, they already have enough platforms to support in-house and IrE wouldn't want see them buying VMS only to relegate it to a continuing4J engineering type of support from being overextended. Besides, HP still hasK what remains of the long-time VMS team and existing customer relationships.   K Rather, the focus should probably be to convince HP to make the most of theoK great thing they own. Dreaming of a knight on a white steed rescuing VMS ise just wishful thinking at best.  I Alas, I don't know how one would effectively bridge the gap between great A HP VMS advocates such as Ms. Skonetski and the rest of the seniorS management team at HP.  K Perhaps we could all pool money together to send the most convincing personmK from comp.os.vms to meet the senior HP management folks at a celebrity golf G tournament and wine-n-dine them with a lot of compelling and persuasivep
 arguments? :)-   -Dan   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.335 ************************