1 INFO-VAX	Sun, 02 Nov 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 607       Contents:H Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsingH Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsingH Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsingH Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsingP Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsing  www.hp Re: Announcing the FutureVAX Announcing the FutureVAX( Authorised reseller application - UPDATE, Re: Authorised reseller application - UPDATE, Re: Authorised reseller application - UPDATE. Re: backing up VMS files to PC based CD writer$ Re: Concurrent users from Accounting$ Re: Concurrent users from Accounting$ Re: Concurrent users from Accounting$ Re: Concurrent users from Accounting Re: Copy of SuperLat Re: Copy of SuperLat) Re: Database selection (was: Advertising)  Re: EV79 CANCELED !!!!!!!!! ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ! Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s ( Re: Not all RZ1DB-VWs are created equal?5 Re: Object filesystem could be done in VMS as a layer 2 Re: OpenVMS I64 ISV application count now over 5002 Re: OpenVMS I64 ISV application count now over 5002 Re: OpenVMS I64 ISV application count now over 500 OpenVMS, Itanium and Blades... OT:  This newsgroup and spamK Re: Pathworks 32 on Windows XP mapping to shares on OpenVMS Advanced Server  Re: RMS File Record Size Re: RMS File Record Size Re: SIMH used with VMS?  Re: SIMH used with VMS?  Re: SIMH: used with VMS? Re: SIMH: used with VMS? Re: SIMH: used with VMS? Re: SIMH: used with VMS? Re: SIMH: used with VMS? Re: SIMH: used with VMS?- Speaking of Cincom (Was Re: World Wide Wake])  Re: TS10, still around?  Re: TS10, still around?  Re: TS10, still around? 0 Re: UK source of 800/1600 BPI SCSI reel to reel?0 Re: UK source of 800/1600 BPI SCSI reel to reel? Re: used with VMS?P Re: VAX Emulator licensing was( Next VAX/VMS Mig Newsletter on emulation:        VUP? Re: Re: World Wide Wake] Re: Re: World Wide Wake] [Fwd: Re: World Wide Wake]# Re: [survey] Do you use CHARON-VAX?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 12:18:19 -0600; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Q Subject: Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsing 3 Message-ID: <yDLc2ev7ChtY@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <3FA279D0.D65513F@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: > F > I have recently been made aware (in a non-NDA environment yet!) of aI > large religious sect that has a geneology database of cica. 5 petabytes H > running on an OpenVMS + StorageWorks backend. Not sure which database, > but I'd guess Oracle.  >  > Can you say, "scalability"?  >  > T'would make a good ad, eh?       Bring out your dead.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 14:26:47 -0500 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>Q Subject: Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsing , Message-ID: <3FA2B777.4090500@tsoft-inc.com>   David J. Dachtera wrote:    F > I have recently been made aware (in a non-NDA environment yet!) of aI > large religious sect that has a geneology database of cica. 5 petabytes H > running on an OpenVMS + StorageWorks backend. Not sure which database, > but I'd guess Oracle.     O I get mildly amused when I see automatic assumptions that every application in  P the world is using a relational database.  I will admit that for an application J that is mainly retrival of data a relational database is a good fit.  But 6 Oracle?  Thought you were a proponent of 'affordable'?   Dave   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:16:10 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> Q Subject: Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsing ' Message-ID: <3FA3176A.6C7812AC@fsi.net>    Bob Koehler wrote: > \ > In article <3FA279D0.D65513F@fsi.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: > > H > > I have recently been made aware (in a non-NDA environment yet!) of aK > > large religious sect that has a geneology database of cica. 5 petabytes J > > running on an OpenVMS + StorageWorks backend. Not sure which database, > > but I'd guess Oracle.  > >  > > Can you say, "scalability"?  > >  > > T'would make a good ad, eh?  >  >    Bring out your dead.    A: But I'm not dead yet!   B: You will be soon...   A: But I'm getting better...  C I just had a flash of jlsue and Bill Todd in that scene from "Monty  Python and The Holy Grail".   H Sorry to be so rough on you, Jeff. With all the sunshine hp is likely toH be "blowing up your skirt", it's easy to drift into a PollyAnna state...   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:17:34 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> Q Subject: Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsing ' Message-ID: <3FA317BE.BEB9BC16@fsi.net>    David Froble wrote:  >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: > H > > I have recently been made aware (in a non-NDA environment yet!) of aK > > large religious sect that has a geneology database of cica. 5 petabytes J > > running on an OpenVMS + StorageWorks backend. Not sure which database, > > but I'd guess Oracle.  > P > I get mildly amused when I see automatic assumptions that every application inQ > the world is using a relational database.  I will admit that for an application K > that is mainly retrival of data a relational database is a good fit.  But 8 > Oracle?  Thought you were a proponent of 'affordable'?  H I'd be pleasantly surprised to see an "affordable" db handle anything on that scale.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:46:15 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>Y Subject: Re: Advertising  - was Re: [OT/FUN] HP live chat popped up when browsing  www.hp ) Message-ID: <3FA29FE1.8EB516F5@istop.com>    John Smith wrote: 8 > Be in totalitarian control. Only with OpenVMS from HP. > [/wicked humor]     S Not exactlty humour since it is happening. not sure of VMS is part of this however.   I But consider the potential liability to a computer manufacturer using the G "total information awareness" project in the USA as marketing leverage:   I JetBlue, a popular USA airline  got into a massive PR problem when it was K discovered that they had participated into that total information awareness L project by donating 5 million reservations records to the defense departmentJ who then passed this onto some private contractor who then started to make$ public presentations on the subject.  M So HP shouldn't brag about being part of such endeavours because it will come J back to haunt them, even though in its present state, the US population isN highly supportive of all those government projects associated with the patriot act/homeland security.  E Until the USA passes strict data privacy laws, the "total information M awareness" projects will ammass petabytes of data on individuals and the lack N of restrictions on data exchanges will continue to generate JetBlue-like leaks+ from the private/personnal to public realm.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 15:52:52 -0800 . From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)% Subject: Re: Announcing the FutureVAX = Message-ID: <f30679fb.0311011552.47d10c31@posting.google.com>   ? This is a nice idea but I dont understand why HP/Compaq through > the Services Group didnt developed a project like this before.7 They could seel Proliant DL-360, Windows XP Server and  , Charon-VAX to substitute the obsolete VAXes.F How much HP spend with spare parts for old systems ? Logistics, etc..?   Regards    FC  ^ Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> wrote in message news:<3fa33eac$0$27017$626a54ce@news.free.fr>...5 > http://www.didiermorandi.com/vms/FutureVAX_3196.pdf    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 06:03:33 +0100 " From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>! Subject: Announcing the FutureVAX 4 Message-ID: <3fa33eac$0$27017$626a54ce@news.free.fr>  3 http://www.didiermorandi.com/vms/FutureVAX_3196.pdf  --  =           Read the November VAX/VMS to Itanium Migration News D        French: www.didiermorandi.com/vms/vaxvms2itanium_200311fr.pdf  F didier morandi  ~ sarl au capital de 8 000 euros ~  Revendeur agr HPC      Expertise en environnement DIGITAL ~ Formation ~ Programmation F Offshore ~ 5 av. A. Durand 31700 Blagnac France. Tl: 33(0)5 6131 6287D    SIRET 448 694 851 00016 RCS Toulouse http://www.didiermorandi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 13:40:22 -0500 & From: "Island" <dbturner@islandco.com>1 Subject: Authorised reseller application - UPDATE / Message-ID: <vq5b6mafi99235@news.supernews.com>   J Well, after 4 months we still have received nothing, not even notification of denial of authorization.   J If anyone within Compaq/HP knows anyone high up in the Supply chain within HP, please let them know we  are waiting to hear from them.  0 FYI - We ARE a SMALL WOMAN OWNED Company !!! :0)  J Amazing - we have orders being offered to us left right and center for BIG systems, and can't quote. K Frighteningly though, our customers can't find anyone else to quote them as  well. H AVNET and PIONEER seem to want to push Intel based stuff according to my clients    Hmm    David    --   David B Turner Island Computers US Corporation  2700 Gregory St., Suite 180  Savannah GA 31404  Tel: 912 447 6622  Fax: 912 201 0402  Email: dbturner@hpaq.net http://www.hpaq.net    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:29:23 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 5 Subject: Re: Authorised reseller application - UPDATE ' Message-ID: <3FA31A83.81DB3266@fsi.net>   
 Island wrote:  > L > Well, after 4 months we still have received nothing, not even notification > of denial of authorization.  > L > If anyone within Compaq/HP knows anyone high up in the Supply chain within > HP, please let them know we   > are waiting to hear from them. > 2 > FYI - We ARE a SMALL WOMAN OWNED Company !!! :0) > L > Amazing - we have orders being offered to us left right and center for BIG > systems, and can't quote. M > Frighteningly though, our customers can't find anyone else to quote them as  > well. J > AVNET and PIONEER seem to want to push Intel based stuff according to my	 > clients  >  > Hmm   ' I trust you're not surprised by that...    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:30:09 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 5 Subject: Re: Authorised reseller application - UPDATE ' Message-ID: <3FA31AB1.F2DAE5B2@fsi.net>   
 Island wrote:  > L > Well, after 4 months we still have received nothing, not even notification > of denial of authorization.  > L > If anyone within Compaq/HP knows anyone high up in the Supply chain within > HP, please let them know we   > are waiting to hear from them. > 2 > FYI - We ARE a SMALL WOMAN OWNED Company !!! :0) > L > Amazing - we have orders being offered to us left right and center for BIG > systems, and can't quote. M > Frighteningly though, our customers can't find anyone else to quote them as  > well. J > AVNET and PIONEER seem to want to push Intel based stuff according to my	 > clients  >  > Hmm   - You have Mark.Gorham's e-mail address, right?    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 19:19:01 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) 7 Subject: Re: backing up VMS files to PC based CD writer 2 Message-ID: <FAyob.8195$uq7.1708@news.cpqcorp.net>  U In article <3FA08D27.5070405@MMaz.com>, "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> writes:  :Hoff Hoffman wrote: : U :>In article <vpva3dshmqi0bc@corp.supernews.com>, Z  <zarlenga@conan.ids.net> writes: G :>:Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann <vaxinf@chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de> wrote: 1 :>:: To get rid off all file conversion problems: I :>:: Burn CDs under OpenVMS. cdrecord + lddriver is available at no cost.  :>: 2 :>:CD burners are not (available at no extra cost) :>J :>  New CD-R recorders are cheap, and getting cheaper.  Entry-level pricesK :>  for a new ATAPI CD-R drive appear to be around US$35 to US$45, based on J :>  a quick search.  Used or slower or older or close-out CD recorders areE :>  accordingly even cheaper than that and particularly if you have a J :>  computer parts salvage house around, or are willing to wade through anJ :>  on-line auction, or if somebody you know is retiring an older computer :>  with an older burner, etc. :>   :>J :Hoff, the original post was for VAXstations running 5.5, now how are IDE F :drives going to be a practical solution?  They aren't, at best you'd H :need SCSI which are more costly, much more, and at that rev of VMS, if J :you could even get cdrecord and the drivers running, I suspect you would * :have more coasters than good data CD's...    E   Ah, this is part of the joy of being over ten years of software and )   an entire hardware architecture behind.   G   Rather than continuing to dig the current hole, I'd suggest acquiring F   one of the various cheap (used) Alpha systems around, thus upgradingE   to slightly-less ancient and far faster hardware on that.  EV4- and F   EV5- class boxes can't cost much, given the used-equipment prices on'   the EV56- and EV6- workstation boxes.   E   The older the hardware and the software gets, the harder it gets to E   manage and maintain it and the more expensive and more difficult it F   gets to upgrade it.  Not upgrading hardware or software is certainlyC   a valid choice, but the choice certainly has its own costs -- and C   unfortunately, the costs involved do tend to sneak up on you (and C   any savings that might be realized do seem to be spent elsewhere, B   and with no allocation and no reserve fund for the older boxes).  E   I'd also look around for a used or surplus SCSI CD-R drive -- folks G   with older iron are certainly known as being capable scroungers. :-)  F   At one time, at least one of the CD-R vendors was running an auction"   site with refurbs, for instance.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 11:12:51 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) - Subject: Re: Concurrent users from Accounting 3 Message-ID: <CB0wDFQeswvL@eisner.encompasserve.org>   a In article <ip35qv8s2nav2rhe0v1td6juivfqfkjcb4@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes: J > On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 16:27:18 -0500, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> > wrote: > L >>Since the accounting file layout is documented, write a small program that >>scans the accounting file. >>N >>For every record where start time is less than the selected time and the endC >>time is more than the selected time, then increment counter by 1.  > L > The main problem with using Accounting to produce this information is that  > it is easily lost information. > I > I ran systems with batch jobs that ran for days, sometimes weeks (a VAX I > 11/785).  If the system crashed all this information was not written to  > accounting file.  D That is appropriate, since accounting is for billing purposes and ifC the system crashed the user did not really get their money's worth.   B But times have changed.  I have one machine that crashes due to an@ internal hardware defect, but the others come down only when theE electric utility fails to deliver.  If availability were that crucial % in my environment, I could buy a UPS.    ------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 11:18:55 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.org- Subject: Re: Concurrent users from Accounting 3 Message-ID: <+AogulyNEDQM@eisner.encompasserve.org>   a In article <ip35qv8s2nav2rhe0v1td6juivfqfkjcb4@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes: J > On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 16:27:18 -0500, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> > wrote: > L >>Since the accounting file layout is documented, write a small program that >>scans the accounting file. >>N >>For every record where start time is less than the selected time and the endC >>time is more than the selected time, then increment counter by 1.  > L > The main problem with using Accounting to produce this information is that  > it is easily lost information. > I > I ran systems with batch jobs that ran for days, sometimes weeks (a VAX I > 11/785).  If the system crashed all this information was not written to  > accounting file. > K > Unfortunately, as Rob has said, he need this information for time periods  > that are already in the past.   D Fortunately, the system may not have crashed since then.  After all, it's running VMS.   B And if it crashed, it may have left a crash dump.  After all, it's? running VMS -- an operating system with a useful built-in crash  analysis tool.  > So he either needs to adjust the count to add in the number ofD currently logged in users who were already logged in at the selected> time.  Or he needs to adjust the count to add in the number of? logged in users as of the time of the crash (found by analyzing @ the crash dump) who were already logged in at the selected time.  = If the system has crashed twice without saving the crash dump 0 then we could have some unavoidable lost counts.  @ Clean shutdowns should not be an issue.  Those kill users before running MCR OPCCRASH  M > The programming can be done, but it may not be completely accurate results.   H The results should be quite accurate.  I'd hesitate to say "completely".C There are still race conditions if you have users logging out close = to when you are doing your analysis or immediately prior to a  hypothetical system crash.   	John Briggs   ------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 11:51:08 -0600+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) - Subject: Re: Concurrent users from Accounting 3 Message-ID: <SrUMrDPrI59P@eisner.encompasserve.org>   T In article <+AogulyNEDQM@eisner.encompasserve.org>, briggs@encompasserve.org writes:c > In article <ip35qv8s2nav2rhe0v1td6juivfqfkjcb4@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes:    >>  M >> The main problem with using Accounting to produce this information is that ! >> it is easily lost information.  >>  J >> I ran systems with batch jobs that ran for days, sometimes weeks (a VAXJ >> 11/785).  If the system crashed all this information was not written to >> accounting file.  >>  L >> Unfortunately, as Rob has said, he need this information for time periods  >> that are already in the past. > F > Fortunately, the system may not have crashed since then.  After all, > it's running VMS.  >   @ 	We had a node crash a while ago (year).  The beauty here is the: 	folks that were logged in thought they lost their network; 	connection.  On hitting return, they got a username prompt  	on the other node.   @ > So he either needs to adjust the count to add in the number ofF > currently logged in users who were already logged in at the selected@ > time.  Or he needs to adjust the count to add in the number ofA > logged in users as of the time of the crash (found by analyzing B > the crash dump) who were already logged in at the selected time. > ? > If the system has crashed twice without saving the crash dump 2 > then we could have some unavoidable lost counts. >   8 	We must be bored.  It must be Friday.  I needed a close< 	approximation.  If some knucklehead logged in at 9 a.m. and= 	either neglected to log out by 11 p.m. or left their session 5 	active (a select few know a menu where they won't be : 	kicked out of the app) - I missed them.  Plus I'm looking> 	far enough in the past that current sessions aren't an issue.   				Rob    ------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 15:54:40 -0600; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) - Subject: Re: Concurrent users from Accounting 3 Message-ID: <EMn076qv9e2r@eisner.encompasserve.org>   h In article <bnu927$15lp5o$1@ID-118202.news.uni-berlin.de>, "Martin O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com> writes: > _ > Back in the mid 80's we were looking at using the VAX for electric power control systems. The f > accounting was a stumbling block since most important stuff was done by detached processes that stay# > up until the system is shut down.   C    Back in the 70's a friend of mine had to deal with a nasty litle A    problem in the "campus computer", IIRC DECSYSTEM-10.  It seams C    the students knew of a little bug that would cause the system to D    crash.  They also knew accounting records were written on logout..    And in those days CPU time cost real money.  H    Imagine what happens when a student in a COBOL class has been chewing6    up CPU time all day and doesn't want to pay for it.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:24:13 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: Copy of SuperLat ' Message-ID: <3FA3194D.F0B01B71@fsi.net>    Michael Moroney wrote: > 5 > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes:  > < > >Amazing. Your environment's net-folks still tolerate LAT?L > What do you mean by this? Is LAT (perceived to be) a bad neighbor on a LAN  D LAT is considered "chatty" and its packetsizes onerous, since it can< combine data for multiple sessions in a single transmission.  # ...and since it's not routable, ...   D > or do you mean the "It's not TCP/IP, get it off my LAN!" attitude?  > That's the other most common complaint from the unenlightened.  K > >Note sure what SuperLAT would do for you that can't be served some other H > >way. Maybe if you describe your quandry in some detail, other posters" > >might have a suggestion or two. > 4 > Yes, almost anything non-ancient can speak TCP/IP.  B I don't follow. Are you running a VMS system with no TCP/IP stack?   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:25:20 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>  Subject: Re: Copy of SuperLat ' Message-ID: <3FA31990.861CF355@fsi.net>    "Barry Treahy, Jr." wrote: >  > Michael Moroney wrote: > 6 > >"David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> writes: > >  > >  > > = > >>Amazing. Your environment's net-folks still tolerate LAT?  > >> > >> > > M > >What do you mean by this? Is LAT (perceived to be) a bad neighbor on a LAN E > >or do you mean the "It's not TCP/IP, get it off my LAN!" attitude?  > >  > > H > We still use LAT in limited cases for DECservers, etc but the point isJ > that if you are looking for LAT support for a PC, well you should reallyC > be using a different protcol stack which is rather evident by the B > difficulties of trying to find the abandon stack you speak of... >  > >  > > L > >>Note sure what SuperLAT would do for you that can't be served some otherI > >>way. Maybe if you describe your quandry in some detail, other posters # > >>might have a suggestion or two.  > >> > >> > > 5 > >Yes, almost anything non-ancient can speak TCP/IP.  > >  > > J > Even ancient can speak TCP/IP, there are very few systems where a TCP/IPF > stack cannot be obtained, in some cases for free (ie. CMU/IP for VMS  
 /VAX, only   > )...     --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 20:18:55 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 2 Subject: Re: Database selection (was: Advertising)3 Message-ID: <qiv6Q26EMyUg@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <00A2835E.723BF18B@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") writes:   Q > Besides, I would really have thought a geneaology database (tracking ancestors, G > children, etc) would be an excellent fit for a hierarchical database.   C There is a danger in having those who know a lot of technology make C judgements based on just a smattering of domain knowledge.  I infer A from your comment that you figure each person has just one father C and one mother.  That is the same mistake made by those who attempt C to design genealogy software and provide a single field for date of . birth, for instance, a VMS date-time quadword.  D In actual genealogy work, diverse data may indicate several possibleE birth dates for an individual, so the important thing is that each of E those dates are entered in the database with a full indication of the C original source for that particular date assertation.  The VMS date J field is inadequate since it has no way to indicate "sometime in November"< or "the 16th of some month in 1936, the writing is smudged".  D Similarly, the parentage of a person may be in dispute, and rigorousA genealogists will preserve all evidence.  My wife points out that G patriarchal naming is rather backward, since the identity of the mother C is much better known than the identity of the father.  But even the < identity of the mother can be obscured by the mists of time.     ======  E Besides, _my_ database bias is Codasyl, rather than either relational  or hierarchical :-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 04:55:07 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>$ Subject: Re: EV79 CANCELED !!!!!!!!!- Message-ID: <871xstm8k4.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   = koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   D >> I thought that HP was free to choose any FAB it wanted to produce >> Alphas ?   B >    I think EV68 and later are depending on IBM's copper process.D >    I'm sure IBM would move to protect any direct challenge to what> >    is surely a patented process.  It may be too expensive orF >    technically difficult to fab EV7 et.al. with a different process.  ? There are a couple of FABs that now do DD copper in addition to = IBM. Re-tweeking the design would not be fun though. IBM have @ probably kept the difference between processes well charaterised+ and clean. Moving to another vendor is not.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:49:30 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>* Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s) Message-ID: <3FA2A0A3.6B1AE8AE@istop.com>   ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: E > Dunno.  I am on the east coast.  Having Guinness on tap in my home, F > I've made it a rule to not imbibe until after 5:00pm on any weekday.E > Of course, there are exceptions to every rule.  Hmmm... It's nearly  > noon.     N At noon on the east coast, it is already 17:00 where that Guinness comes from.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 13:00:40 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>* Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s) Message-ID: <3FA2A341.6B34ED98@istop.com>    William Webb wrote: G > http://www.research.compaq.com/wrl/techreports/html/TN-13/pickle.html  > B > (The research, of course, was done during the d|i|g|i|t|a|l era,  M This was at the western labs. I wonder what the folks in new hampshire did in  terms of similar research ?   S I find it amazing that such research documents would have survived the takeovers...    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 18:39:55 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG* Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s0 Message-ID: <00A2833C.F0241D33@SendSpamHere.ORG>  V In article <3FA2A0A3.6B1AE8AE@istop.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> writes:" >VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:F >> Dunno.  I am on the east coast.  Having Guinness on tap in my home,G >> I've made it a rule to not imbibe until after 5:00pm on any weekday. F >> Of course, there are exceptions to every rule.  Hmmm... It's nearly	 >> noon.   >  > O >At noon on the east coast, it is already 17:00 where that Guinness comes from.   E Yeap.  I was there last week.  In fact, I'm still suffering the stiff D neck and sholder from the flight home in luggage class seating.  Got9 to finally see the Guinness Storehouse at St. James Gate.    --  L VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker    VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 22:04:49 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> * Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*sK Message-ID: <50Bob.132251$3f.46209@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>    Dan O'Reilly wrote: - > At 09:54 AM 10/31/2003, William Webb wrote: ? >> Remember when there was much speculation as to what the "EV" - >> in the Alpha chip revs actually stood for?  >>A >> One of the more interesting suggestions was "Electoluminescent B >> Vlasic"- (Vlasic is a brand of pickle in case your shop doesn't >> stock them) >> >> Hence my submission:  >>5 >> "Characterization of Organic Illumination Systems"  >>H >> http://www.research.compaq.com/wrl/techreports/html/TN-13/pickle.html >>C >> (The research, of course, was done during the d|i|g|i|t|a|l era, G >>  as it is generally accepted that the concept of original scientific A >>  research was one of many things that was forgotten during the ( >>  d|i|g|i|t|a|l => Compaq transition.) >>F >> I had an mpeg once showing one of these little beauties flaming outD >> after almost a minute of luminescing, but I've forgotten where it >> was located.  > H > I saw a demo at a Wizard session at DECUS in Anaheim in, I think, '97.B > The smell of a smoked pickle is REALLY interesting in a confined	 > room...     G After having read the report, I think I will have to claim 'prior art'.   K Cira 1972 I did similar experiments with 120v 60Hz ac and 'fork' electrodes L with thawed hot dogs. The resulting levels of illumination were insufficientL to notice in a lighted room, however a very faint red glow was detected whenJ the lights were extinguished. Our test media was not as highly instumentedL as those in the report. Upon completion, the experimental media was recycled! with highly satisfactory results.    Cheers. / http://www.creemoresprings.com/aboutthebeer.asp    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:19:41 -0600 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> * Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s' Message-ID: <3FA3183D.12319B0C@fsi.net>    Paul Sture wrote:  >  > Didier Morandi wrote:  > >  > > Nic Clews wrote: > > ' > > > VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: R > > >>I know that p*o*e*t*s gatherings are popular in UK pubs; I wasn't aware thatR > > >>they were held here in the states too! ;)   Perhaps, you'd care to enlighten> > > >>those that do not know the significance of this acronym. > > >  > > > 
 > > > p***	 > > > off  > > > early  > > > tomorrow's > > > Saturday > >  > > or "everyone"  > > H > I've never heard that variation. Nic's is the most common definition .  7 I heard it as "Piss On Everything Tomorrow's Saturday".    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 21:49:35 GMTe# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>h* Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*sK Message-ID: <PNAob.132090$3f.64894@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>w   Nic Clews wrote:# > VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  >>D >> In article <3fa21998$0$239$636a55ce@news.free.fr>, Didier Morandi >> <no@spam.com> writes: >>> Today is Friday.F >>> At DEC we use(d?) to have a beer or something together each Friday? >>> evening in a bar in Maynard, Nashua and probably elsewhere. $ >>> The meeting was named p*o*e*t*s. >>> Is it still alive? >>D >> I know that p*o*e*t*s gatherings are popular in UK pubs; I wasn't
 >> aware thatsE >> they were held here in the states too! ;)   Perhaps, you'd care toe >> enlighten; >> those that do not know the significance of this acronym.  >9 > p*** > off! > early  > tomorrow's
 > Saturday > 	 > I wish.D >NA > Actually I was in early this morning (0700) so I can leave at 3DG > (1500), follow the sun support has benefits. Of course this brings anC@ > issue, while in the UK it's a little after midday, in Oz (NSW)C > they'll have downed enough schooners; that the next thing they'llnA > remember is that they must have arrived home on a beer scooter.r >0F > How early does your typical west coast US resident take an alcoholic/ > beverage on the last day of the working week?m   At lunch - on Wesdnesday . ;-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 03:55:04 +0100c" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>* Subject: Re: INTRODUCING Virtual P*o*e*t*s4 Message-ID: <3fa3208f$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   Paul Sture wrote:d   > Didier Morandi wrote:w >  >>Nic Clews wrote: >> >>$ >>>VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >>>dP >>>>I know that p*o*e*t*s gatherings are popular in UK pubs; I wasn't aware thatP >>>>they were held here in the states too! ;)   Perhaps, you'd care to enlighten< >>>>those that do not know the significance of this acronym. >>>r >>>  >>>p***w >>>off >>>early
 >>>tomorrow'si >>>SaturdayV >> >>or "everyone"  >> > H > I've never heard that variation. Nic's is the most common definition .  < t'was the Maynard version at VAX HW Engineering around 1984.   D.: (closing the French version of the Letter in two hours...)   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 13:35:50 -0500o& From: "Island" <dbturner@islandco.com>1 Subject: Re: Not all RZ1DB-VWs are created equal?p/ Message-ID: <vq5au87ohkp494@news.supernews.com>i   Not that I know of  - They are supposed to co-exist without problemiI To be honest though, we have had so few problems with Seagate based disksm" and bloody nightmares with QuantumK (if anyone is a Quantum employee reading this, maybe they should tell theire	 QA staff) L Still to this day, though, our preferred disks are Hitachi - very quiet, run very cool and ultra reliable   DT      A "Marty Kuhrt" <kuhrt@nospammy.encompasserve.org> wrote in messageu- news:1mpios+BUOtA@eisner.encompasserve.org...a; > So is there some SCSI page doodly that needs to be set toe > make them co-exist?c >R: > In article <vq0b1o6l9js88c@news.supernews.com>, "Island" <dbturner@islandco.com> writes:7 > > Sounds about right > >a# > > -CA is an Atlas drive (Quantum)r  > > -CS is a Barracuda (Seagate) > >n > > DT > >! > >aE > > "Marty Kuhrt" <kuhrt@nospammy.encompasserve.org> wrote in messagey1 > > news:aWtbtw2Xq7QI@eisner.encompasserve.org...dE > >> I have, what I thought were identical, RZ1DB-VW disks in a BA356aC > >> shelf.  The labels on the exterior of the drives are the same,hB > >> but when I started seeing errors on all the drives on the busA > >> right after replacing an SBB, I found that all RZ1DB-VWs mays > >> _not_ be the same.e > >>E > >> Seems that the "odd" drive, when stressed by backup, would causeeD > >> SCSI bus resets, which in turn would cause all the other drivesE > >> on the bus to drop into, and quickly out of, mount verify.  PushvF > >> enough I/Os to the odd drive and eventually all the devices would, > >> fall into "mount verify mounted" state. > >>C > >> When I took at look at the drive info via sys$etc:scsi_info, Ij. > >> found that the odd drive returned this... > >>5 > >> $!      Product Identification: RZ1DB-CA (C) DECC) > >> $!      Product Revision Level: LYJ0a > >>+ > >> while the good drives returned this...r > >>5 > >> $!      Product Identification: RZ1DB-CS (C) DEC ) > >> $!      Product Revision Level: 0307e > >>F > >> There were a number of other differences starting with the amountE > >> of data returned from the original INQUIRY QIOW.  Unfortunately,i@ > >> I don't know enough about the information the various pagesC > >> return to know if something is misconfigured on the odd drive.g4 > >> (The info output is about 900 lines per drive.) > >>E > >> I tried it with a number of -CS and -CA drives and found that ituC > >> seems that the -CS drives play nice, and the -CA drives don't."C > >> So there is something I'm missing, but I'm not sure just what.l+ > >> Any illumination would be appreciated.s > >>F > >> P.S. This is on a DS10L running V7.3 with all the latest patches. > >  > >/   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 20:36:41 GMTd# From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)-> Subject: Re: Object filesystem could be done in VMS as a layer2 Message-ID: <tJzob.8201$dq7.4770@news.cpqcorp.net>  F In article <3FA2C13B.7040806@gce.com>, G Everhart <ge@gce.com> writes:P :I wrote the following around 1997 to some folks, but it never had any followup.  F   Andy and I and others have discussed similar layering within the I/OG   subsystem on occasion, and this particular proposal looks reminiscentaG   to what Atria ClearCase calls a VOB; to a data-driven simulation of ac   disk volume.  F   This layering would involve connections into the XQP and the abilityH   to provide alternative file systems (via a traditional ACP file systemG   implementation, or by sliding support into the I/O subsystem directlyiI   adjacent to or in place of the existing XQP code), as well as requiringc=   connections into MOUNT and other volume-related processing.e  B   This is not a small ("midnight engineering") project, of course.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq-N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 17:04:45 +0000EO From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com>w; Subject: Re: OpenVMS I64 ISV application count now over 500m0 Message-ID: <bnu4nd$39t$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   jlsue wrote:H > On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 21:30:06 GMT, "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote: >  >  > M >>So go to see what platforms Bloomberg supports as clients - Windoze on x86,, >>and Solaris on Sparc.o >>  >>No IA-64 in sight for any o/s. >  > E > Er... are any of the *client* platforms supported 64-bit platforms?  > I > This is CLIENT platform not server, where the greatest concentration of H > resources is working toward for the IA-64 systems - including OpenVMS. >  >    You are right howeverj  C Bloomberg also run their services on Sun's including their web sitee and these are server based.    regardst Andrew Harrisone   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:48:10 -0500r* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>; Subject: Re: OpenVMS I64 ISV application count now over 500w) Message-ID: <3FA2A053.BBD44A9C@istop.com>e   jlsue wrote:I > This is CLIENT platform not server, where the greatest concentration ofhH > resources is working toward for the IA-64 systems - including OpenVMS.  L If you want to use the "industry standard" phrase for IA64, then IA64 *MUST*L replace the current standard, the 8086 which does both desktops and servers.  M If you accept that IA64 is just a niche player in a server business, then youc9 must stop using "industry standard" when discussing IA64.m   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 16:00:19 -0800b. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso); Subject: Re: OpenVMS I64 ISV application count now over 500.= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0311011600.7648c88e@posting.google.com>s  6 What worries me more is the great amount of redundant 0 product running under OVMS. Like Schedluers soft. and Tape Managament Systems. I think HP should5 help this companies in consolidate with each other or-1 gave the low market share products for OpenVMS to 3 ... OpenVMS.org for example ! Or sell this products  to another partner ... ! a    , How many Databases are running under OVMS ?    For me it enough Oracle RDB !    Regards- FC    v keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) wrote in message news:<cf15391e.0310141019.442e7ac4@posting.google.com>...C > "HP OpenVMS: ISV commitment and enthusiasm grow for HP OpenVMS ond > Integrity serversp > B > With more than 500 ISV applications now committed to port to theF > OpenVMS operating system on HP Integrity servers, ISV commitment andB > enthusiasm continue to grow. "The momentum continues!" says MarkG > Gorham, Vice President, OpenVMS systems. "This milestone demonstrates D > that HP and its partners are true to our commitment to ensure thatE > OpenVMS customers experience a smooth evolution as they incorporatel> > OpenVMS on the Integrity server family into their OpenVMS onB > AlphaServer environments. We expect these application numbers to> > increase rapidly after we ship the native compilers with theF > evaluation release of OpenVMS v 8.1 for early adopters in December." > E > For more information about OpenVMS on Integrity servers, visit thisf
 > website:P > http://www.hp.com/products1/evolution/alpha_retaintrust/openvms/boot0703.html"   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 15:48:42 -0800m. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)' Subject: OpenVMS, Itanium and Blades...a= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0311011548.79d29e76@posting.google.com>.  ? Do you know if HP will develop Itanium Blades to run OpenVMS ? 08 I am imagining this blades for industrial automation and massive clustering....     Regards    FC   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 15:50:49 -0800f. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)% Subject: OT:  This newsgroup and spam.= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0311011550.28bcaa7e@posting.google.com>s  9 I am receiving massive spam in my yahoo.com.br mailbox ! d6 So the Info-Vax manager disabled the sending of emails1 to my account. Are you having the same problem ?     Regardse   FC   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 19:12:09 -0500W$ From: "PEN" <paul.nuneznosp@mhp.com>T Subject: Re: Pathworks 32 on Windows XP mapping to shares on OpenVMS Advanced Server, Message-ID: <bnutou$ci5$1@hplms2.hpl.hp.com>   > Hi,a > > > I have installed Pathworks 32 onto a new Windows XP desktop. >eA > From my other Windows 2000 nodes, I can see the Advanced Server G > OpenVMS system. From the Windows XP system I cannot, and I cannot mapc > a drive on the server. >pB > Not sure why this is happening, but any suggestions appreciated. >w > With regards > Andrew  
 Hi Andrew,  I Boy, you sure didn't give us much to go on :o).  What specific errors are  you seeing?e  E What transport are you using on client and server?  You mentioned youTJ installed PW32 on the client, but you don't need PW32 to map shares on theL Advanced Server if you're using TCP/IP (or even NetBEUI).  PW32 includes theL DECnet transport which you can also use to map shares (as long as the server' is configured for it - $ ADMIN/CONFIG).l  G If you're trying to use TCP/IP, does PING to the Alpha work?  How aboutA       nbtstat -a <advsrv-name>   get a response?h  B Is the XP client in the same TCP/IP subnet as the Advanced Server?   Paul   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 05:31:17 +0800t, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>! Subject: Re: RMS File Record Sizes- Message-ID: <87sml9ksbe.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   ; Hein van den Heuvel <hein_netscape@eps.zko.dec.com> writes:.   > JF Mezei wrote:y   >> Hein van den Heuvel wrote:   E >> > The VAXmail application opted for external files to hold message D >> > objects larger then a given size (1500 byte, which is too small >> > these days)..  @ >> How feasable would it be to increase that size in an upcomingC >> version of VMS ?  Woudl it require a convert/fdl of all mail.main >> files on a system ?  F > Very feasible. I've done lunchtime discussions on this with the lady > who could/would fix it.<  : A one line SDL change if you don't care about old files...  C > A while back I analyzed my own mail message size behaviour: I hadzC > 2000 external messages ($DIR MAIL$*.*) out of 3500 (search/stat).:@ > Looking in detail at the sizes of the external files I saw the > following distribution:r  B Going to a 4k block qould eliminate over 90% of the external files8 in my mail swamp. That is now just over 100K messages...   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.r@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 19:39:06 -0800 5 From: hein_news@eps.zko.dec.com (Hein van den Heuvel) ! Subject: Re: RMS File Record Sizeu< Message-ID: <e02b550f.0311011939.7a7fbfe@posting.google.com>  p "Michael D. Ober" <obermd-.@.-alum-mit-edu-nospam> wrote in message news:<ihuob.95$ss3.22002@news.uswest.net>...9 > Thanks for the replies.  I asked because I didn't know.h    > Thanks for the perfectly reasonable explanation for what was a1 perfectly reasonable question in the first place.h  ? My answer was a bit extensive as I saw it was an opportunity to C finally address this issue more completely as it comes up every nowg	 and then.h   Hein.a   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 16:03:11 -0800s. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)  Subject: Re: SIMH used with VMS?< Message-ID: <f30679fb.0311011603.8ee88e5@posting.google.com>   By the way ...  4 Why HP dont liberate MicroVMS ! I remember it was a 3 version of  VMS which used to consume low memory ! g       Regards    FC w  u martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) wrote in message news:<3fa3a75a.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>...e! > [Getting the VMS OS CD to SIMH]  > ) > H Vlems (hvlems.nieuw@zonnet.nl) wrote: L > > Another method is to use linux or unix and make a raw copy of the VMS cd > > (the dd command).o > H > Though, if you operate SIMH under Linux (or any other *ix, I suspect),/ > you can access the CD-ROM from SIMH directly.. >  > cu,t
 >   Martin > C > P.S.: Has anyone yet looked into porting the pcap library to VMS?bB > (needed for SIMH to have Ethernet access, e.g. when running SIMH > under OpenVMS Alpha).-   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 02:21:37 +0100n" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>  Subject: Re: SIMH used with VMS?4 Message-ID: <3fa30aa8$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   How did you install VMS ?h   D.  
 PEN wrote:  	 > Indeed!- > N > I have it setup on my WinXP Pro box (OpenVMS VAX v7.3) running PATHWORKS too > :o)  >  >  > Paul   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 15:56:37 -0800m. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)! Subject: Re: SIMH: used with VMS?e= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0311011556.635f69d8@posting.google.com>8  ; What about developing a version of SIHM to run the obsoletei: DEC SNA Gateway. We have a  few DEC Channel Servers here. 2 Bless of God (HP/DEC) had an Q-Bus AUI interface. 1 So, why not develop a version to run in a PC withl8 standard PCI NICs. May b e just installing a third party Channel Controller.o   Regards    FC    t "P.Lj" <plj@MAROONPbyron.ext.telia.se> wrote in message news:<Xns942696CD8DD3Bplj69byronextteliase@195.67.237.51>...* > Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net> wrote in. > news:slrnbq6aue.87h.rivie@Stench.no.domain:  > G > > In article <3fa320fb$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>, Didier Morandih > > wrote: i > >> Roger Ivie wrote: > >>> H > >>> The key part of it is making an image of the CD in a file that youC > >>> can attach to SimH, since SimH couldn't talk to a raw Windersc > >>> device.  > >> n( > >> Too late. I'm closing in two hours. > > J > > Hmm. I thought I'd do a quick HOWTO showing how to do it, but I've runH > > into a spot of trouble myself. The hobbyist CD doesn't recognize the4 > > CPU. See http://anachronda.webhop.org/howto.html >  > L > I tried to run it on an image from a VAX-6000 VMS but it didn't work, CPU  > not supported. >  >  > >>> ^P.Lj    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 00:08:19 +0100s" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>! Subject: Re: SIMH: used with VMS?<4 Message-ID: <3fa2eb6e$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   Robert Alan Byer wrote:o  D > As the maintainter of SIMH for OpenVMS I can say that the SIMH VAX6 > emulator runs OpenVMS pretty well on a fast machine.  P Super. So you can tell me where to start from. I have a Sim> prompt and a whole O bunch of text displayed in response to the HELP command, but found nowhere how n. to load my Hobbyst VAX/VMS CD and install VMS.   Thanks,t   D.! (Letter closing in 6 hours UTC-6)m   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 02:19:33 GMTi% From: Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net>l! Subject: Re: SIMH: used with VMS? 3 Message-ID: <slrnbq65u1.5th.rivie@Stench.no.domain>h  J In article <3fa2eb6e$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>, Didier Morandi wrote: > Robert Alan Byer wrote:s > E >> As the maintainter of SIMH for OpenVMS I can say that the SIMH VAXa7 >> emulator runs OpenVMS pretty well on a fast machine.l > L > Super. So you can tell me where to start from. I have a Sim> prompt and a  > whole M > bunch of text displayed in response to the HELP command, but found nowhere i > how 0 > to load my Hobbyst VAX/VMS CD and install VMS.  0 Well, I've done it before, but it's been awhile.  D What I did was take the VMS CD over to my NetBSD box, dd it out to aC file, FTP the file over to the Winders box on which I wanted to runhH SimH, attach the CD image as a disk, and boot the disk. I also installedA NetBSD/VAX on SimH that way (only using a NetBSD/VAX boot ISO, ofC course).  F The key part of it is making an image of the CD in a file that you canA attach to SimH, since SimH couldn't talk to a raw Winders device.o -- e
 Roger Ivie rivie@ridgenet.net <input type crash>   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 03:56:51 +0100p" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>! Subject: Re: SIMH: used with VMS?-4 Message-ID: <3fa320fb$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   Roger Ivie wrote:s  2 > Well, I've done it before, but it's been awhile. > F > What I did was take the VMS CD over to my NetBSD box, dd it out to aE > file, FTP the file over to the Winders box on which I wanted to runoJ > SimH, attach the CD image as a disk, and boot the disk. I also installedC > NetBSD/VAX on SimH that way (only using a NetBSD/VAX boot ISO, ofh
 > course). > H > The key part of it is making an image of the CD in a file that you canC > attach to SimH, since SimH couldn't talk to a raw Winders device.   # Too late. I'm closing in two hours.m   D.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 04:16:19 GMT>% From: Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net>d! Subject: Re: SIMH: used with VMS? 3 Message-ID: <slrnbq6csi.9ev.rivie@Stench.no.domain>t  B Apparently, the magic is to attach the CDROM -r. There's already aH HOWTO over at http://www.wherry.com/gadgets/retrocomputing/vax-simh.html --  
 Roger Ivie rivie@ridgenet.net <input type crash>   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 03:43:10 GMT % From: Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net>s! Subject: Re: SIMH: used with VMS?n3 Message-ID: <slrnbq6aue.87h.rivie@Stench.no.domain>y  J In article <3fa320fb$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>, Didier Morandi wrote: > Roger Ivie wrote:g >>  I >> The key part of it is making an image of the CD in a file that you canhD >> attach to SimH, since SimH couldn't talk to a raw Winders device. > % > Too late. I'm closing in two hours.m  F Hmm. I thought I'd do a quick HOWTO showing how to do it, but I've runD into a spot of trouble myself. The hobbyist CD doesn't recognize the0 CPU. See http://anachronda.webhop.org/howto.html --  
 Roger Ivie rivie@ridgenet.net <input type crash>   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 19:13:09 -0500 From: norm.raphael@metso.com6 Subject: Speaking of Cincom (Was Re: World Wide Wake])Q Message-ID: <OFC78EB0AE.261B8D94-ON85256DD2.0000F4E8-85256DD2.0000BB19@metso.com>5  + This is a multipart message in MIME format.s" --=_alternative 0000BB1185256DD2_=. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   ' Funny you should mention them, Paul....uL From:   "Cincom Systems" <owner-pr=5Fenglish@lm01.cincom.com> on 10/30/2003= =20  01:47 PM  G Subject:        Cincom's 2003 Fiscal ROIC Performance Breaks 35-Year=20o Record  > Cincom's 2003 Fiscal ROIC Performance Breaks 35-Year Record=20  J Cincom's  ROIC of 106.8 percent was five times better than its previous=20H record-breaking 2002 performance. No other software company even came=20 close.  A CINCINNATI, Ohio - October 29, 2003 - Cincom announced today a=20iK record-breaking 106.8% Return On Invested Capital (ROIC) for fiscal year=20g 2003.s  H ROIC cuts past the glamour of both profit and ROI figures to paint an=20L unvarnished picture of how well the company is run. It is the raw measure=20I of profits generated relative to the capital employed to generate that=20-
 profit.=20  = Cincom's 106.8% ROIC is 2.6 times greater than that of the=20 L industry-standard bearer Oracle=AE (ORCL), whose numbers for the same perio= d=20 were just 40.8%.  L Cincom achieved this remarkable feat despite the challenging and turbulent =  K economic climate. The tumultuous technology sector of the economy in the=20 L last couple of years had most technology vendors just trying to "survive." =  J  Cincom not only survived, but thrived: calendar 2001 and 2002 were its=20A best two years in a row, ever (see: www.cincom.com/pr/financial).o  C Cincom's CEO Tom Nies attributes the ongoing success to Cincom's=20yI "high-value, low-cost, and rapid ROI" offerings. "In the 'irrationally=20hK exuberant' economy of the last several years, few seemed to be concerned=20mJ about long-delayed and minimized ROI, immense implementation costs, and=20I long development cycles where lots could go wrong - and too often did.=20aE Customers are returning to more rational and sound decision-making=20mI processes that focus much more on cost, value, and rapid ROI," says Nies./  L He continues, "We will continue to follow Cincom's golden rule: 'Help our=20L customers grow their businesses faster and more profitably, with far less=20I upfront investment, much less risk, and much greater and quicker ROI.'=20R, Simple rule. It's worked well for 35 years."  L Cincom's operating success is also a testimony to the effectiveness of CEO =  L Tom Nies' approach to fiscal management that has, over the last 35 years,=20F steered Cincom to its present status as one of the leading software=20J companies, now ranked in the top 5 percent of all software companies in=20I the world.  Among these larger software firms, during the fiscal years=20uK 2001-2002, Cincom led the industry in both ROI and in earnings-per-share=20  improvement.   About CincomL Cincom, the world's most experienced software company, builds, sells, and=20C supports software for 1) data access and integration, 2) process=20 C automation, 3) manufacturing business solutions, and 4) business=20>F communications. Thousands of major clients around the world rely on=20L Cincom's 35 years of experience to provide innovative solutions to some of =  J their toughest and most complex business problems.  High quality, rapid=20C implementation and excellent service give Cincom clients greater=20kK productivity, faster speed-to-market, and a quicker Return on Investment=20d (ROI).  I For more information about Cincom products and services, contact us at=20 L 1-800-2CINCOM (US), send e-mail to info@cincom.com, or visit the company's =   website at www.cincom.com.   Media Contacts:o Steve Kayser Cincom Systems, Inc. 513-612-2348 skayser@cincom.com   Donna Hedgeg Cincom Systems, Inc. 513-612-2305 dhedge@cincom.comb  C From:   Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net> on 11/01/2003 02:28 AMm6 Please respond to Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net>   To:     Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComC cc:     =20   $ Subject:        Re: World Wide Wake]     Bill Todd wrote:@   A variant of Cincom's TOTAL (no shame there - DEC's first DBMSC > was a reworked version of Cullinane's IDMS), it was only somewhat L > heavier-weight than RMS but provided real database capabilities without=20 the J > overhead of other hierarchical or network DBMSs of the time (or of their > relational successors).  >hD > If Cincom still sells TOTAL it would presumably be a reasonable=20	 migrationhJ > alternative from IMAGE.  There are certainly cases in which a relational > database would not be.    H Holy mackerel Batman! I was just talking about TOTAL to a colleague whenG we were in "reminicences mode" a couple of days ago. Way back when, thenE company I worked for bought TOTAL, coupled with SHADOW (a lightwieghta: form of CICS), when IBM were trying to push DL/1 and CICS.  H One of the best IT courses I ever attended was the TOTAL one, given by aG Cincom guy. Sod PowerPoint, those were the days when true professionalshH did it with carefully prepared flipcharts, notes and handouts, and could1 answer any technical question you cared to throw.l  C And were prepared to admit that they didn't know the answer to somewC questions, but rather than ignoring you, would be on the phone that   evening to HQ to find an answer.  G Mind you, the DEC lady who ran an RSX course I attended about 18 months=F later came an extremely close second. Same deal really, both lecturers' beat IBM's best of the time hands down.-   --
 Paul Sture  " --=_alternative 0000BB1185256DD2_=- Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1"o+ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printables    L <p><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">Funny you should ment= ionB them, Paul....</font> L <p><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">From: &nbsp; &nbsp; &= nbsp; K &nbsp;&quot;Cincom Systems&quot; &lt;owner-pr=5Fenglish@lm01.cincom.com&gt;s on 10/30/2003 01:47 PM</font>n <br>L <br><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">Subject: &nbsp; &nbs= p;D &nbsp; &nbsp;</font><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom's 20034 Fiscal ROIC Performance Breaks 35-Year Record</font> <br>L <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom's 2003 Fiscal ROIC Performance Breaks 35-Year Record </font>t <div align=3Dcenter> <br>L <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif"><i>Cincom's &nbsp;ROIC of 106.8 perc= ent I was five times better than its previous record-breaking 2002 performance. ; No other software company even came close.</i></font></div>  <br>L <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif"><b>CINCINNATI, Ohio - October 29, 20= 03H -</b> Cincom announced today a record-breaking 106.8% Return On Invested+ Capital (ROIC) for fiscal year 2003.</font>- <br>L <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">ROIC cuts past the glamour of both p= rofitoG and ROI figures to paint an unvarnished picture of how well the company.J is run. It is the raw measure of profits generated relative to the capital) employed to generate that profit. </font>n <br> <ul>L <li><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom's 106.8% ROIC is 2.6 times gr= eatertI than that of the industry-standard bearer Oracle=AE (ORCL), whose numbersn0 for the same period were just 40.8%.</font></ul>K <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom achieved this remarkable featcF despite the challenging and turbulent economic climate. The tumultuousL technology sector of the economy in the last couple of years had most techn= ology K vendors just trying to &quot;survive.&quot; &nbsp;Cincom not only survived,NJ but thrived: calendar 2001 and 2002 were its best two years in a row, everK (see: </font><a href=3Dhttp://lm01.cincom.com/t/1603/7487/38/0/><font size=hL =3D3 color=3Dblue face=3D"sans-serif"><u>www.cincom.com/pr/financial</u></f=4 ont></a><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">).</font> <br>K <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom's CEO Tom Nies attributes the K ongoing success to Cincom's &quot;high-value, low-cost, and rapid ROI&quot;sL offerings. &quot;In the 'irrationally exuberant' economy of the last severalG years, few seemed to be concerned about long-delayed and minimized ROI,SJ immense implementation costs, and long development cycles where lots couldF go wrong - and too often did. Customers are returning to more rationalH and sound decision-making processes that focus much more on cost, value,& and rapid ROI,&quot; says Nies.</font> <br>K <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">He continues, &quot;We will continuepI to follow Cincom's golden rule: 'Help our customers grow their businessesdG faster and more profitably, with far less upfront investment, much lesssF risk, and much greater and quicker ROI.' Simple rule. It's worked well for 35 years.&quot;</font> <br>K <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom's operating success is also asL testimony to the effectiveness of CEO Tom Nies' approach to fiscal manageme= ntF that has, over the last 35 years, steered Cincom to its present statusI as one of the leading software companies, now ranked in the top 5 percent.I of all software companies in the world. &nbsp;Among these larger softwareiI firms, during the fiscal years 2001-2002, Cincom led the industry in botht1 ROI and in earnings-per-share improvement.</font>f <br>A <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif"><b>About Cincom</b></font>nK <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom, the world's most experiencedoI software company, builds, sells, and supports software for 1) data access L and integration, 2) process automation, 3) manufacturing business solutions,K and 4) business communications. Thousands of major clients around the worlddG rely on Cincom's 35 years of experience to provide innovative solutionsrH to some of their toughest and most complex business problems. &nbsp;HighG quality, rapid implementation and excellent service give Cincom clientspL greater productivity, faster speed-to-market, and a quicker Return on Inves= tment 
 (ROI).</font>t <br>L <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">For more information about Cincom pr= oductsL and services, contact us at 1-800-2CINCOM (US), send e-mail to info@cincom.= com,L or visit the company's website at </font><a href=3Dhttp://www.cincom.com/><=L font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3D"sans-serif"><u>www.cincom.com</u></font>=/ </a><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">.</font>  <br>D <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif"><b>Media Contacts:</b></font>: <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Steve Kayser</font>B <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom Systems, Inc.</font>: <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">513-612-2348</font>L <br><a href=3Dmailto:skayser@cincom.com><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3D=1 "sans-serif"><u>skayser@cincom.com</u></font></a>- <br>9 <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Donna Hedge</font> B <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">Cincom Systems, Inc.</font>: <br><font size=3D3 face=3D"sans-serif">513-612-2305</font>L <br><a href=3Dmailto:dhedge@cincom.com><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3D"=/ sans-serif"><u>dhedge@cincom.com</u></font></a>O <br>L <p><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">From: &nbsp; &nbsp; &= nbsp;h> &nbsp;Paul Sture &lt;nospam@sture.homeip.net&gt; on 11/01/2003 02:28 AM</font>gL <p><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">Please respond to Paul, Sture &lt;nospam@sture.homeip.net&gt;</font> <p> L <p><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">To: &nbsp; &nbsp; &nb= sp; L &nbsp;</font><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com</font>L <br><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">cc: &nbsp; &nbsp; &n= bsp; &nbsp; </font> <br>L <br><font size=3D1 color=3D#800080 face=3D"sans-serif">Subject: &nbsp; &nbs= p;E &nbsp; &nbsp;</font><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Re: World Wide  Wake]</font> <br> <br>+ <br><font size=3D2><tt>Bill Todd wrote:<br>tI  &nbsp;A variant of Cincom's TOTAL (no shame there - DEC's first DBMS<br>cJ &gt; was a reworked version of Cullinane's IDMS), it was only somewhat<br>L &gt; heavier-weight than RMS but provided real database capabilities without the<br> G &gt; overhead of other hierarchical or network DBMSs of the time (or ofo	 their<br>   &gt; relational successors).<br> &gt;<br>L &gt; If Cincom still sells TOTAL it would presumably be a reasonable migrat= ion<br>vG &gt; alternative from IMAGE. &nbsp;There are certainly cases in which an relational<br> &gt; database would not be.<br>  </tt></font> <br>K <br><font size=3D2><tt>Holy mackerel Batman! I was just talking about TOTALe to a colleague when<br> G we were in &quot;reminicences mode&quot; a couple of days ago. Way backc
 when, the<br> I company I worked for bought TOTAL, coupled with SHADOW (a lightwieght<br>p> form of CICS), when IBM were trying to push DL/1 and CICS.<br> </tt></font>I <br><font size=3D2><tt>One of the best IT courses I ever attended was theh TOTAL one, given by a<br> K Cincom guy. Sod PowerPoint, those were the days when true professionals<br> L did it with carefully prepared flipcharts, notes and handouts, and could<br>5 answer any technical question you cared to throw.<br>e </tt></font>K <br><font size=3D2><tt>And were prepared to admit that they didn't know thec answer to some<br>G questions, but rather than ignoring you, would be on the phone that<br> $ evening to HQ to find an answer.<br> </tt></font>L <br><font size=3D2><tt>Mind you, the DEC lady who ran an RSX course I atten= ded  about 18 months<br>tJ later came an extremely close second. Same deal really, both lecturers<br>+ beat IBM's best of the time hands down.<br>e </tt></font> <br><font size=3D2><tt>--<br>g Paul Sture</tt></font> <br>$ --=_alternative 0000BB1185256DD2_=--   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 05:31:58 +0800>, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>  Subject: Re: TS10, still around?- Message-ID: <87oevxksa9.fsf@prep.synonet.com>t  $ Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> writes:  E > Does anyone know if TS10 is still a project under development? Does-2 > not look like, according to the SourceForge site' > http://sourceforge.net/projects/ts10/c  0 > Does anyone know if VMS once booted with TS10?  
 alt.sys.pdp10D   -- u< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.o@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Nov 2003 05:05:05 GMTT From: healyzh@aracnet.comt  Subject: Re: TS10, still around?, Message-ID: <bnveu102007@enews2.newsguy.com>  # Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> wrote: O > Does anyone know if TS10 is still a project under development? Does not look qO > like, according to the SourceForge site http://sourceforge.net/projects/ts10/   0 > Does anyone know if VMS once booted with TS10?  H The Sourceforge link is basically dead/bad, has been almost since it wasF setup.  Try ftp://ftp.firesword7.net/pub/ts10/ unfortunatly it severalN months old.  I'm pretty sure I saw a post where he was looking for info quite 	 recently.    			Zanes     DEC Emulation Website + http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/decemu.html    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 06:20:14 GMTe" From: Rob Komar <rkomar@telus.net>  Subject: Re: TS10, still around?+ Message-ID: <a7jvnb.u32.ln@robpc2.home.org>s  # Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> wrote:  > O > Does anyone know if TS10 is still a project under development? Does not look rO > like, according to the SourceForge site http://sourceforge.net/projects/ts10/>  0 I don't know; I haven't fooled with it recently.   > 0 > Does anyone know if VMS once booted with TS10?  H Yes, I installed my V7.3 Hobbyist Kit using ts10-021004 last March.  I'mE using Linux rather than Windows, though.  I don't know if things are   different for the latter OS.   Cheers,C	 Rob Komar    ------------------------------    Date: 31 Oct 2003 12:48:46 -0600; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)19 Subject: Re: UK source of 800/1600 BPI SCSI reel to reel? 3 Message-ID: <mh0++9d3eFp1@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  T In article <bntv6g$8tg$1@lore.csc.com>, Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]> writes: > Longshot time. > I > We're looking for what is detailed in the subject. Cipher is a possibles# > make (the long flat autoloaders).d > E > 800 BPI is the real requirement, unfortunately due to the situationtH > there is no way a bureau service could be used for data transfer etc.,D > the general idea is to hang the tape drive on the back of an Alpha > (PCI). > H > A less preferable alternative is to connect a tape drive to a HSC70 on > CI...i >  > Any ideas/leads? h  I    If you have an HSC, you're in a cluster, or you'll get into one if you-    have to?-  F    There are SCSI tape drives which will do 800 and 1600 BPI (just didG    a quick Google search).  There are also PCI-SCSI adapters.  Or maybea5    you could cluster an older system with a SCSI bus.e  F    I'd take a cluster solution first, if you don't have space or otherH    constraints.  If you go with a PCI-SCSI adapter do try to see if the H    vendor has tried this configuration as even an 800 BPI tape can move     a lot of data in a hurry.  E    In any case I would try to sell the customer on permanently movinglD    the data to another media even if they have to do it on site.  OrA    if they have an older system still generating 800 BPI that's aa    candidate for an upgrade.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 05:25:44 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>9 Subject: Re: UK source of 800/1600 BPI SCSI reel to reel? - Message-ID: <87wualkskn.fsf@prep.synonet.com>d  , Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]> writes:    @ > We're looking for what is detailed in the subject. Cipher is a, > possible make (the long flat autoloaders).  E > 800 BPI is the real requirement, unfortunately due to the situation B > there is no way a bureau service could be used for data transferD > etc., the general idea is to hang the tape drive on the back of an > Alpha (PCI).  E Then Cypher is out. They don't do 800, for that you need a Kenardy or3B a badge equivalent. HP did one, you may be able to get one through, what was FS, if there is still such a thing.   -- :< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.n@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 19:22:56 -0500 $ From: "PEN" <paul.nuneznosp@mhp.com> Subject: Re: used with VMS?t, Message-ID: <bnuud3$dng$1@hplms2.hpl.hp.com>  / "Didier Morandi" <no@spam.com> wrote in messageo, news:3fa2619a$0$245$636a55ce@news.free.fr...; > Has anyone around here (successfully) used VMS with SIMH?   > http://simh.trailing-edge.com/ >r > Tx,  >- > D. >-   Indeed!-  L I have it setup on my WinXP Pro box (OpenVMS VAX v7.3) running PATHWORKS too :o)o     Paul   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2003 07:28:10 +0100A* From: Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net>Y Subject: Re: VAX Emulator licensing was( Next VAX/VMS Mig Newsletter on emulation:       w0 Message-ID: <3FA4B20A.54BCF499@sture.homeip.net>   Tom Linden wrote:  > H > I was curious to follow the discussion on VAX emulation so I posed the
 > questionI > to HP and I received permission to post the answer here.  Teh result isI	 > twofold 7 > 1  You can only get a transfer license for CHARON-VAX I > 2  You can only run this license on an HP produced computer, you can't,-D >    for eaxmple, run it on a Dell that you might have lying around. >   C Well, I can understand them not supporting non-HP hardware - vendore specific drives and all that.3  C But on point 1, the corollary is that if I find a piece of softwarerC which was never ported to Alpha (for whatever reason), but suits my F business needs, I would need to find a second hand fully licensed VAX,G do the necessary license transfer, and then do it again for CHARON-VAX.f  > Just a theoretical situation of course, but am I right in that assumption?r   > >-----Original Message-----t6 > >From: St Laurent, Pat [mailto:pat.stlaurent@hp.com]+ > >Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2003 6:43 AMO > >To: Tom Linden; SWLICENSING > >Cc: Vazquez, MaryJane > >Subject: RE: VAX emulators. > >e > >.
 > >Hi Tom, > >:E > >Correct, HP OpenVMS does not license VAX-VMS OS software to run onvB > >systems other than HP's.   Regarding emulators, we partner with> > >SRI to deliver a VAX emulator, and we only offer a transfer > >license for CHARON-VAX.L > >There are no plans today to offer transfer licenses for another emulator. > >  > >Regards,m > >Pat St.Laurentd > >t > >-----Original Message-----e+ > >From: Tom Linden [mailto:tom@kednos.com] * > >Sent: Monday, October 27, 2003 12:43 PM# > >To: SWLICENSING; St Laurent, Pat  > >Cc: Vazquez, MaryJane > >Subject: RE: VAX emulatorsl > >r
 > >Hi Pat, > > B > >Thanks for your reply.  Just a couple of clarifications please. > >tM > >Does this mean that we could not get such a license for CHARON-VAX runningd > >on, say, a Dell computer? > >eC > >Is it possible to obtain a transfer license for other emulators?t > > H > >The reason I ask is that we have several large PL/I customers runningK > >on VAXes who have clearly indicated that they will not port to Alpha andrH > >have no intention of doing so to Itanium if there is no PL/I compilerJ > >availale there.  And this gives us the opportunity to retain a customer > >to our mutual benefit.d > >p
 > >regards > >Tom > >e > >>-----Original Message-----7 > >>From: St Laurent, Pat [mailto:pat.stlaurent@hp.com].* > >>Sent: Monday, October 27, 2003 8:38 AM# > >>To: SWLICENSING; tom@kednos.com4 > >>Cc: Vazquez, MaryJane@ > >>Subject: RE: VAX emulators > >> > >> > >>Hi Tom,p > >>A > >>The transfer licenses referenced on the website are valid forsA > >>OpenVMS/VAX and associated layered software on the CHARON-VAXt? > >>emulator environment and HP hardware only.  Thus these part.E > >>numbers are not valid for VAX emulators offered by other vendors.- > >> > >>Regards, > >>Pat St.Laurent > >> >  > >-----Original Message-----e, > >From: Didier Morandi [mailto:no@spam.com], > >Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 9:20 AM > >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComE > >Subject: Next VAX/VMS Mig Newsletter on emulation: call for papers  > >a > >WB > >As I said a few days ago, the next VAX/VMS to Itanium Migration > >News letter will I > >focus on: "Emulation as a solution to the VAX/VMS obsolescence issue".  > >r@ > >As of today, I have the following list of suppliers and their > >products dealinge3 > >with emulation and/or sources/image translation:, > >s > >SRI CHARON-VAXm" > >Accelr8 OpenDCL and translators > >Bob Supnik SIMH > >Forest Edge eVAXa5 > >HP MSVA aka DECmigrate aka VEST (for VAX to Alpha) 4 > >HP MSAI (for Alpha to Itanium) (not yet released) > >pB > >Other vendors/suppliers are welcome. Please include data sheets > >and references.% > >and send to didier.morandi@free.frs
 > >Thanks, > >e > >D.o > >--h> > >          Read the latest VAX/VMS to Itanium Migration NewsB > >       English: www.didiermorandi.com/vaxvms2itanium_200310.pdfC > >       French: www.didiermorandi.com/vaxvms2itanium_200310fr.pdf  > >aI > >didier morandi  ~ sarl au capital de 8 000 euros ~  Revendeur agr HP-F > >     Expertise en environnement DIGITAL ~ Formation ~ ProgrammationG > >   5 avenue Albert Durand 31700 Blagnac France Tl: 33(0)5 6131 62878G > >   SIRET 448 694 851 00016 RCS Toulouse http://www.didiermorandi.coms > >d > >---) > >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.a= > >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).eD > >Version: 6.0.530 / Virus Database: 325 - Release Date: 10/22/2003 > >  > ---h( > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).C > Version: 6.0.530 / Virus Database: 325 - Release Date: 10/22/2003n   -- l   --  
 Paul Sture   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 03:58:37 +0100h" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>
 Subject: VUP?y4 Message-ID: <3fa32164$0$27028$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   VUP?   VAX Unit Performance or6 VAX Units of Processing (*never* heard of this one...)   D.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 21:47:35 GMTf# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>i! Subject: Re: Re: World Wide Wake]lK Message-ID: <XLAob.132065$3f.65889@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>e   Greg Cagle wrote: 0 > FYI from our friends in the HP 3000 community. >C$ > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: World Wide Wake? > Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:01:48 -0600 (Central Standard Time)6. > From: John Burke <John_Burke@mindspring.com>! > Organization: e3000.org gatewayl > Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp.mpee >  > <snip> >lD > I share Christian's sentiments. I will not be attending any of theF > World Wide Wakes because of family and professional obligations, butE > I will hoist one late this evening in honor of the HP 3000, MPE and0E > IMAGE. I will hoist one in honor of the many good people who worked@C > on and with the system for the last 30-some years. And, perhaps I.1 > will dream a little about what could have been.b >uF > Today is the end of an era and the beginning of another. Tomorrow weG > start to find out if HP's failure to follow through on its promise toaD > port MPE to Itanium was an aberration or whether failure to followG > through on promises to customers when the promise does not suit it is C > S.O.P. at the "new" HP. Since 11/14/2001, HP has made a number of1D > promises. It has also held off addressing a number of issues untilA > after EOS. Frankly, I am not optimistic that even a majority ofiE > promises will be kept nor that any of the many issues from firmwareeE > availability, to converting used HP9000s to HP3000s, and to support A > for a commercial emulator, will be addressed in a way that wille > satisfy the user community.7 >5A > I will never forgive those people (virtually all of whom are notG > longer at HP) who by active neglect started the ball rolling downhillhB > to the point where Winston Prather, etc. believed that HP had to > cancel the HP 3000 line. > E > We will probably never know the numbers and corporate politics thataE > drove the decision. I do not blame Winston Prather for creating the E > situation; but I do, and will forever, blame him for the way it wasnE > communicated. For the way HP executives boldly lied at HPWorld 2001 G > about the status of the HP 3000. For the way users and customers were0A > cut out of any decisions about how and when the system would be:; > phased out. For not having any kind of plan developed fornE > transitioning HP 3000 customers, ISVs and consultants to life aftereE > EOS. And, finally, for not allowing MPE/IMAGE to try to have a lifei
 > outside HP.o > H > Here's hoping that character and integrity come back into style in the > corporate world, >  > John Burke >.D > * To join/leave the list, search archives, change list settings, *D > * etc., please visit http://raven.utc.edu/archives/hp3000-l.html *      ! It's like deja vu all over again.l   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 16:20:06 -0500G* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>! Subject: Re: Re: World Wide Wake]i2 Message-ID: <E_qdnUgBq-mRTz-iRVn-jg@metrocast.net>  < "Greg Cagle" <news@removethisgregcagle.com> wrote in message) news:vq59cjnqp62852@corp.supernews.com...e0 > FYI from our friends in the HP 3000 community. >e$ > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: World Wide Wake? > Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:01:48 -0600 (Central Standard Time)3. > From: John Burke <John_Burke@mindspring.com>! > Organization: e3000.org gateway  > Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp.mpea >o > <snip> >gJ > I share Christian's sentiments. I will not be attending any of the WorldG > Wide Wakes because of family and professional obligations, but I willI hoisti? > one late this evening in honor of the HP 3000, MPE and IMAGE.h  I Ah, yes - IMAGE.  While IIRC HP was a bit behind DEC in record managementyH (KSAM vs. RMS), IMAGE was a step ahead where complex data management wasI required.  A variant of Cincom's TOTAL (no shame there - DEC's first DBMStA was a reworked version of Cullinane's IDMS), it was only somewhat-K heavier-weight than RMS but provided real database capabilities without theiH overhead of other hierarchical or network DBMSs of the time (or of their relational successors).e  I If Cincom still sells TOTAL it would presumably be a reasonable migrationrH alternative from IMAGE.  There are certainly cases in which a relational database would not be.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:10:24 -0800 / From: Greg Cagle <news@removethisgregcagle.com>,# Subject: [Fwd: Re: World Wide Wake]H/ Message-ID: <vq59cjnqp62852@corp.supernews.com>   . FYI from our friends in the HP 3000 community.  " -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: World Wide Wake= Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 12:01:48 -0600 (Central Standard Time)h, From: John Burke <John_Burke@mindspring.com> Organization: e3000.org gateway2 Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp.mpee   <snip>  H I share Christian's sentiments. I will not be attending any of the WorldK Wide Wakes because of family and professional obligations, but I will hoisttJ one late this evening in honor of the HP 3000, MPE and IMAGE. I will hoistJ one in honor of the many good people who worked on and with the system forK the last 30-some years. And, perhaps I will dream a little about what couldV
 have been.  J Today is the end of an era and the beginning of another. Tomorrow we startK to find out if HP's failure to follow through on its promise to port MPE toiJ Itanium was an aberration or whether failure to follow through on promisesI to customers when the promise does not suit it is S.O.P. at the "new" HP. H Since 11/14/2001, HP has made a number of promises. It has also held offK addressing a number of issues until after EOS. Frankly, I am not optimisticiF that even a majority of promises will be kept nor that any of the manyI issues from firmware availability, to converting used HP9000s to HP3000s,,I and to support for a commercial emulator, will be addressed in a way thatR  will satisfy the user community.  I I will never forgive those people (virtually all of whom are no longer at H HP) who by active neglect started the ball rolling downhill to the pointL where Winston Prather, etc. believed that HP had to cancel the HP 3000 line.  I We will probably never know the numbers and corporate politics that drove,L the decision. I do not blame Winston Prather for creating the situation; butJ I do, and will forever, blame him for the way it was communicated. For theH way HP executives boldly lied at HPWorld 2001 about the status of the HPI 3000. For the way users and customers were cut out of any decisions aboutsL how and when the system would be phased out. For not having any kind of planK developed for transitioning HP 3000 customers, ISVs and consultants to lifeSI after EOS. And, finally, for not allowing MPE/IMAGE to try to have a life  outside HP.t  F Here's hoping that character and integrity come back into style in the corporate world,  
 John Burke  B * To join/leave the list, search archives, change list settings, *B * etc., please visit http://raven.utc.edu/archives/hp3000-l.html *       --  
 Greg Cagle gregc at gregcagle dot com   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 01 Nov 2003 20:07:05 +0100y) From: Michael Unger <unger@despammed.com>e, Subject: Re: [survey] Do you use CHARON-VAX?: Message-ID: <bo10l6$15cr5b$1@ID-152801.news.uni-berlin.de>  * On 2003-10-30 21:24, "Alan Frisbie" wrote:   > [...]eG > The next thing I would look for would be down-loadable documentation.   < See <http://www.softresint.com/charon-vax/index.htm> for theE documentation including SPDs. ("VAX Emulators" on the left-hand side)D  J CAUTION: JavaScript has to be enabled for the navigation to work properly!   Michaele   -- @; Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers.-@ Please do *not* send "Security Patch Notifications" or "SecurityA Updates"; this system isn't running a Micro$oft operating system.e= My e-mail account at DECUS Munich will expire on 31-Dec-2003.0   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.607 ************************