1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 18 Oct 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 577       Contents:0 Re: Anyone interested in a media player for VMS? Re: Clustering over GB Switches  Re: Clustering over GB Switches  Re: Clustering over GB Switches  Re: Clustering over GB Switches  Re: Clustering over GB Switches $ Re: Cost of process creation on Unix$ Re: Cost of process creation on Unix$ Re: Cost of process creation on Unix$ Re: Cost of process creation on Unix! c|net Article on new AlphaServers % Re: c|net Article on new AlphaServers - Re: DECUS: "C" stands for Computer, not Corp. < Did someone ask HP for VAX to Itanium cluster possibilities?@ Re: Did someone ask HP for VAX to Itanium cluster possibilities?@ RE: Did someone ask HP for VAX to Itanium cluster possibilities?@ Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS@ Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS@ Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS@ Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS@ Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS Latest ESS Customer Times  Re: LGI Callout & SSH  Re: LGI Callout & SSH  Re: LGI Callout & SSH   openVMS alpha 7.3.1 on PWS600au?$ Re: openVMS alpha 7.3.1 on PWS600au?! Re: OpenVMS in an HP advertisment  Re: PL/1 users, where are you?, Re: Read data from a native format zip disk?	 Re: rwast  Re: VMS defeated by wind Re: VMS defeated by wind Re: VMS defeated by wind Re: VMS defeated by wind Re: W2K patches  Re: W2K patches  Re: W2K patches  Re: W2K patches 8 Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disks8 Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disks8 Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disks8 Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disks  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 21:23:49 -0500 ( From: Michael Rice <marice@whiteice.com>9 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in a media player for VMS? / Message-ID: <vp18u0frgfbpf0@corp.supernews.com>   , On 10/17/2003 12:12 AM, Mark Berryman wrote:   > Michael Rice wrote:  > . >> On 10/13/2003 2:58 PM, Mark Berryman wrote: >>H >>> I have ported mplayer (the media player for Linux systems) to VMS.  B >>> It is capable of playing a wide-range of audio/video formats, B >>> including acting as a DVD player.  Unfortunately, most of the G >>> optimizations in the code assume a GNU C compiler and an Intel/AMD  J >>> hardware platform.  There are only a handful of Alpha optimizations.  ? >>> The result is video that plays too slowly, even on my DS10.  >>> I >>> Right now I am looking at finding all of the code that was optimized  I >>> for MMX and writeing a version optimized for Alpha.  I was wondering  H >>> if there was anyone out there willing to lend a hand with this.  My E >>> understanding of the Alpha instruction set is sufficient to read  H >>> crash dumps but doesn't really extend to a knowledge of instruction H >>> latency or scheduling.  (I do have a copy of the Alpha Architecture  >>> manual). >>> E >>> I've also discovered that Motif V1.3 includes a Direct-Rendering  K >>> extension.  Can anyone point me to any info on how to make use of this?  >>>  >>> Thanks,  >>>  >>> Mark Berryman  >>> F >>> P.S.  If there are any Motif for VMS maintainers reading this, it E >>> would be really helpful if VMS supported the Xv extension.  This  J >>> appears to be how Linux on Alpha is able to get such good performance I >>> with mplayer since, among other things, it eliminates the need for a   >>> YUV to RGB conversion. >>>  >>G >> What about using OpenGL to do the rendering? Are the OpenGL libs on  F >> VMS optimized to take advantage of the available graphics hardware? >  > H > An OpenGL output module comes with mplayer and, in fact, works on VMS H > (although, from comments I've seen on the mplayer developers list, it K > hasn't been maintained for awhile).  However, for reasons I have not yet  I > dug into, it is actually slower than using X11 output.  Of course, not  H > being an OpenGL programmer, I'm going to have to learn GL programming ) > before I can figure out why this is so.  >  > Mark Berryman  >   H There are several reasons why this might be true. The most likely being G that the code is not optimized to fully utilize GL and the GL buffers.  G I've seen cases where the code is optimized for X11 output and then GL  : is "tacked on" for other reasons (like PostScript output).   ------------------------------   Date: 17 OCT 2003 15:10:13 GMT4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher)( Subject: Re: Clustering over GB Switches6 Message-ID: <17OCT03.15101352@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>  H In a previous article, dave.baxter@bannerhealth.com (Dave Baxter) wrote:G ->I currently have a 2-node cluster of ES40's running OpenVMS 7.3-1.    B ->They are directly connected to each other via redundant GB FibreH ->adapters (EW_DEGPA)using two Fibre crossover cables.     This was doneE ->for expediency a few months ago, and was fine as long as I only had  ->two nodes. ->  G ->     I now need to add a third node!   To facilitate this I purchased D ->two Cisco Catalyst 3508G-XL Gigabit switches and all the necessary
 ->GBIC's etc.  ->  D ->     I now need to move my existing cluster members off the Direct# ->connection and onto the Switches.  ->  G ->     I have not configured the new switches in anyway, (figuring that F ->the DEFAULT settings would probably work).   They didn't!!    When IC ->brought up the second node it attempted to create its own cluster D ->(which caused me to do an immediate "HALT" on the system to try toD ->forstall any partitioning issues).     This clearly indicated thatB ->NODE_2 could not communicate with the "up" node, NODE_1, via the	 ->switch.   F You will need to closely examine your quorum and votes settings to seeC why this happened. That second node should have been able to form a E cluster only after seeing another node. Perhaps it saw a quorum disk? ( Are you sure it was a different cluster?  G Also, to eliminate any auto-negotiation issues (present or future), set I sysgen parameter LAN_FLAGS to 32 on ALL nodes which disables auto-neg for D the DEGPA's and also disable auto-negotiation on your switches (bothA ends must match). I had to do this for DEGPA's and Enterasys 8600 E switches. In general your cluster communications should not depend on / auto-negotiation to work (it's too unreliable).    --G -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-Madison 9 --                  karcher.nomoresapm@waisman.wisc.edu      ------------------------------    Date: 17 Oct 2003 15:46:04 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) ( Subject: Re: Clustering over GB Switches= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0310171446.4b53aa6d@posting.google.com>   u dave.baxter@bannerhealth.com (Dave Baxter) wrote in message news:<a3c44af1.0310161359.2034df25@posting.google.com>... G > I currently have a 2-node cluster of ES40's running OpenVMS 7.3-1.    B > They are directly connected to each other via redundant GB FibreH > adapters (EW_DEGPA)using two Fibre crossover cables.     This was doneE > for expediency a few months ago, and was fine as long as I only had  > two nodes. > G >      I now need to add a third node!   To facilitate this I purchased D > two Cisco Catalyst 3508G-XL Gigabit switches and all the necessary
 > GBIC's etc.  > D >      I now need to move my existing cluster members off the Direct# > connection and onto the Switches.   E To address the other posters' concerns about relative performance, in C my measurements, round-trip lock request latencies over Gigabit via ? cross-over cables were at 140 microseconds, or 200 microseconds @ through a Cisco switch (different model than yours, but probably	 similar).   A I think moving to a pair of redundant switches is reasonable.  If : lock-request times were terribly crucial to this cluster's@ performance, one would probably use Memory Channel, with its 120: microsecond round-trip times, instead of Gigabit Ethernet.  H >      I have not configured the new switches in any way, (figuring that< > the DEFAULT settings would probably work).   They didn't!!  E As other posters have noted, most likely auto-negotiation between the F switch and the Alphas is failing.  You may have to either dig into the? Cisco manuals far enough to determine how to hard-code the port C settings to Gigabit speed and Full-Duplex, or pay someone who knows B Cisco IOS commands to do so for you.  Or return the Ciscos and buy# switches from dnpg.com instead. :-)    > When IC > brought up the second node it attempted to create its own cluster D > (which caused me to do an immediate "HALT" on the system to try toD > forstall any partitioning issues).     This clearly indicated thatB > NODE_2 could not communicate with the "up" node, NODE_1, via the	 > switch.   C The other thing this seems to clearly indicate is that your setting B for EXPECTED_VOTES must be too low.  It should be the total of allC VOTES parameter values in the cluster, plus QDSKVOTES if you have a  quorum disk.  < Another way to approach this migration would be to leave oneC cross-connect cable in place temporarily while you debug the switch < connection using the other Gigabit cards.  Then once the one= connection via the switch is working, convert the other side.   F >      The new switches are dedicated to the task of SCS comms and areF > not network-attached.   For this reason I have not configured any IP > info on the switches.   D That's good.  They just need to be able to bridge the SCS (EthertypeC 60-07) protocol.  Not being connected to an IP network can insulate B your cluster interconnect hardware from many problems, although it: makes it more difficult to manage or monitor the switches.  F Speaking of monitoring, I recommend setting up LAVC$FAILURE_ANALYSIS. E See my article in the VMS Technical Journal V2 for the easy way to do ? that.  See http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/index.html    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Oct 2003 16:02:42 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) ( Subject: Re: Clustering over GB Switches< Message-ID: <cf15391e.0310171502.7a4451d@posting.google.com>  B With regard to relative performance, I should have noted that it'sD easy to measure the actual lock-request latency yourself and compareD the cross-over cable configuration to the with-switch configuration,B using the LOCKTIME.COM tool from http://encompasserve.org/~parris/   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 09:09:25 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>( Subject: Re: Clustering over GB Switches- Message-ID: <87d6cvgxmi.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   2 dave.baxter@bannerhealth.com (Dave Baxter) writes:  A > has a connection to each of the switches.  The switches are NOT C > going to be connected to each other.  As I see it, the failure of > > either switch still leaves the path through the other switch$ > available.  (am I wrong here ????)  ? No, but you are probably about to plug them into the same power  source. Opps...    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  + Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 01:51:03 +0000 (UTC) 7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) ( Subject: Re: Clustering over GB Switches( Message-ID: <bmq6a7$269$1@pcls4.std.com>  , "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> writes:    Z >"Nic Clews" <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message news:bmo9b7$n5q$1@lore.csc.com...    N >> In this case, take out the switches, and use crossover cables A to B and C,M >> B to A and C, C to A and B, like three people in a ring all holding hands.   L >That seems less robust to me; you have eliminated the switches as points ofQ >failure but now every NIC and cable is a single point of failure, unless you put D >four NICs in each machine. I don't see anything wrong with a simple >'A-bus/B-bus' arrangement.   C It's not a single point of failure for the whole cluster.  If a LAN H adaptor or cable fails in such a configuration, clustering will see thatH not all nodes have connectivity with all other nodes, and (assuming eachC node has 1 vote) one of the nodes at the ends of the failed segment > will CLUEXIT, leaving the other nodes to continue the cluster.  I Two LANS each connecting all three nodes with two switches (NOT connected G to each other!) is probably slightly more reliable, despite introducing  active components.  E re the third node trying to form its own cluster:  Should not happen. 0 You almost certainly have EXPECTED_VOTES misset. --   -Mike    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:11:42 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>- Subject: Re: Cost of process creation on Unix ) Message-ID: <3F9030D8.3F81F37C@istop.com>    Bob Koehler wrote:F >    Modern "UNIX" like Tru64, HP-UX, and Linux all have shared objectG >    libraries, so everybody's printf() maps back to the same blocks in E >    libc.so, unless the user foces the link to be to libc.a.  A user J >    running vi will map its printf() to the same memory as a user running6 >    diff since they both map to the same disk blocks.  J I found out that my ISP uses Linux for his pop server. The owner (a rather" arogant/colourful character) said:   ##H It's not part of the service to teach people computer architecture.  YouG seem to *think* you know what you're talking about but you don't; linux F uses demand-page loading of executables with COW.  That means only the code segment gets shared.  ##  I This, after having calling me names for having said that running multiple M instances of a popd process would not consume significant memory because even 1 Unix was able to share memory bettween processes.     N This guys is supposedly very bright. However, I have seen a few such responsesI from him that devalue his IQ :-) ^:-) ;-) I was really hoping my messages L wouldn't make it to him because his other staff are quite reasonable. ThanksI for all the hints/information so far. But I don't think I can continue to  pursue this with the owner.   N Interestingly, DECW mail seems to view a TO: ralph+d@host.tld to be 2 separate: usernames. (one local, ralph, and one internet d@host.tld.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 20:20:19 -0500 5 From: "Martin P.J. Zinser" <zinser@zinser.no-ip.info> - Subject: Re: Cost of process creation on Unix 9 Message-ID: <bmq4gk$pj7r2$1@ID-209632.news.uni-berlin.de>    John E. Malmberg wrote:  > Martin P.J. Zinser wrote:  >  >>I >> Same over here, Comcast just delivers the bits and an IP address, the  F >> rest is handled via a small router and my VMS system. And having a I >> look at the various logs I think trying to defend a Windows system in  H >> such a setup would be more a less a full time job (and most probably  >> futile in the end ;-) >  > J > And both comcast.net and sympatico.ca have submitted the addresses that C > you and JF Mezei are using to be blocked as dynamically supplied  H > addresses to any mail server or blocking list operators that ask them. > : > http://informatie.easynet.nl/error/errors.html#dynablock > G > The easynet.nl page references the AUP for both networks that states  5 > that no mail servers are allowed on either network.  > 7 > Comcast has an exception for specific rDNS addresses.  > I > To look up your I.P. address in the dynablock list and others, you can  J > use the moensted.dk link.  Read the disclaimer.  Some of the lists will F > list an entire subnet on the first sign of spam and never remove it. > / > So being in some lists is almost meaningless.  >  >   http://www.moensted.dk/spam  > G > If you are running your own mail server and you are in the dynablock  K > list, it means that your ISP is saying that your I.P. address is subject  L > to change with out notice and/or you are not allowed to run a mail server. > H > If that is incorrect, then you should contact your ISP to get them to F > stop listing your IP as a dynamic one and get the dynablock listing  > corrected. > K > My broadband ISP in their internal newsgroups says that they are getting  I > the dhcp ranges from the other consumer ISPs and putting them in their  I > local blocking lists, and that they are providing their DHCP ranges to  K > them in return.  The information in the dynablock.easynet.nl is probably  @ > a good indication of what your ISP is providing to other ISPs. > K > Note that the dynablock.easynet.nl list is not a list of I.P.s that sent  K > spam, it is a list of IPs that your ISP has identified as not to ever be  2 > sending e-mail and are OK to preemptively block. > J > Easynet.nl states that they are willing to remove any I.P. address that 0 > should not be in it when your ISP requests it. >  >  > -John  > wb8tyw@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only  > C Well, I do run an SMTP server and it does work pretty well (once I  I fiugred out smtp.config). The only addresses I ever had problems sending  H mail to where from AOL and honestly speaking, who wants to talk to them 
 anyhow ;-)    Sending mail to hp does work :-)   Greetings, Martin   I P.S. If you know of a good and cheap provider with a static service I am   open to suggestions.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 09:14:05 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>- Subject: Re: Cost of process creation on Unix - Message-ID: <878ynjgxeq.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   6 Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:   > Bob Koehler wrote: >>  Y >> In article <3F8EEB4A.AC3E14FA@istop.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> writes:   E >> > does unix have the equivalent of shareable images where you only C >> > have one copy in memory shared by all similar processes ? (eg: C >> > does the creation of another POP server process using the same E >> > image as an existing one really take up that much more memory ?)    E >>   Older UNIX did not, but just about anything shipping today does.   F > Would you care to expand on that? Shareable image like functionalityB > has been removed from Unix? Or just to complicated to make work?  E It is turned off if you run secure unix variants. No execute only for A code... Sharing is a moderatly recent invention in th unix world.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 02:55:43 GMT - From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> - Subject: Re: Cost of process creation on Unix > Message-ID: <PY1kb.110221$qj6.5676149@news1.news.adelphia.net>   Martin P.J. Zinser wrote:  >>E > Well, I do run an SMTP server and it does work pretty well (once I  K > fiugred out smtp.config). The only addresses I ever had problems sending  J > mail to where from AOL and honestly speaking, who wants to talk to them  > anyhow ;-) > " > Sending mail to hp does work :-) >  > Greetings, Martin  > K > P.S. If you know of a good and cheap provider with a static service I am   > open to suggestions.  H That varies with the area.  My broadband supplier will not allow a mail @ server even on their static addresses.  If they find any server F operating through either complaints or their own port scans, it is an ? immediate disconnection with a $25.00 reconnection service fee.   H I can relay through the broadband supplier's mail server, but I can not % run a receive only server for e-mail.   H There are no other broadband options from my house unless I want to pay ' for the wiring to it from the supplier.   H My only other option would be a server at a remote location.  Not quite  suitable for my budget.   E Sections of my broadband supplier's network were previously owned by  G other ISPs that allowed running servers, and for a period of time they  D were still allowed to run servers after their acquistion, but those $ aggreements apparently have expired.     -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 21:11:40 -0500 ( From: Michael Rice <marice@whiteice.com>* Subject: c|net Article on new AlphaServers/ Message-ID: <vp1876ssngmd96@corp.supernews.com>   % Even mentions VMS in a couple places!   Q http://msn-cnet.com.com/2100-1010_3-5093416.html?part=msn-cnet&subj=cdf&tag=mymsn    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 22:40:39 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>. Subject: Re: c|net Article on new AlphaServers) Message-ID: <3F90A7FF.B6187F37@istop.com>    Michael Rice wrote: ' > Even mentions VMS in a couple places! S > http://msn-cnet.com.com/2100-1010_3-5093416.html?part=msn-cnet&subj=cdf&tag=mymsn   K I find it interesting that it has taken so long before the press started to  take notice of EV7 systems.   L My *impression* is that HP initially hoped to keep EV7s systems secret sinceJ they make IA64 look so lame, but now they are getting fairly desperate forM revenus and are forced to swallow their pride and start to let the media talk  about Alpha systems.  = The last sentence of the article is the more interesting one:  ##/ The company will also release a new entry-level ; AlphaServer that uses the EV7 processor, the company said.   ##  K I thought that EV7's design made it next to useless for entry level systems K due to minimal memory requirements and that EV6x chips would continue to be M used for those systems ? Does anyone have additional information on this ? Is I this a change in policy to introduce EV7 to low end entry level systems ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:03:22 +0200 " From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>6 Subject: Re: DECUS: "C" stands for Computer, not Corp.4 Message-ID: <3f90591f$0$13268$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   JF Mezei wrote:   F > But returning to DECUS would help end that ighmare during the compaq@ > era. What we, the users, need, is a user group that focuses onC > Digital products.  I have no problems with DECUS cooperating with A > ITUG and Interex. But I don't want some global user group whose 6 > contents is diluted amongst too many constituencies. > G > If I have an interest in HP-UX, then I'll become a member of Interex. 9 > But if I have an interest in VMS, I want my DECUS back.    Yeah.    D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 00:46:45 +0200 " From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>E Subject: Did someone ask HP for VAX to Itanium cluster possibilities? 2 Message-ID: <3f90715c$0$236$626a54ce@news.free.fr>  ;  From the OpenVMS to Itanium FAQ (http://tinyurl.com/rcuc):   D "Note that mixed architecture clusters of Alpha and Itanium will be I supported. We will continue to support mixed VAX and Alpha environments.  F However, because there has been no demand for it our current plans do ) not include support for VAX and Itanium".   F Wrong. I answered the survey, I remember very well the question and I  did ask for this feature.   G Anyway, don't worry, a senior expert from VMS Eng who wishes to remain  G anonymous told me that "it will work perfectly for sure", which sounds  H logical as, if VAX - Alpha clusters is a pleasure and Alpha - Integrity 6 a feature, VAX - Alpha - Integrity will be a treasure.   D.  K (Integrity? The name of the future IA64 HP Server: http://tinyurl.com/rcvm)    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 19:42:35 -0400 * From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <stan@stanq.com>I Subject: Re: Did someone ask HP for VAX to Itanium cluster possibilities? - Message-ID: <3F90462B.9404.4EA9EC9@localhost>   - On 18 Oct 2003 at 0:46, Didier Morandi wrote: F > "Note that mixed architecture clusters of Alpha and Itanium will be K > supported. We will continue to support mixed VAX and Alpha environments.  H > However, because there has been no demand for it our current plans do + > not include support for VAX and Itanium".  > H > Wrong. I answered the survey, I remember very well the question and I  > did ask for this feature.   A I asked for this feature, too.  But most of the people living on   comp.os.vms don't count.  C The REAL issue is that I didn't back it up with a promise to buy a  F bunch of Itanium boxes.  Heck, I don't think I've ever bought a *new* 5 VMS system -- Island Computer and eBay don't count...   
 --Stan Quayle  Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------C Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  +1 614-868-1363  Fax: +1 614 868-1671 1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147 = Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 21:47:23 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> I Subject: RE: Did someone ask HP for VAX to Itanium cluster possibilities? R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB17BCAB@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   >=20 > -----Original Message-----. > From: Didier Morandi [mailto:no@spam.com]=20  > Sent: October 17, 2003 6:47 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  >=20= >  From the OpenVMS to Itanium FAQ (http://tinyurl.com/rcuc):  >=20@ > "Note that mixed architecture clusters of Alpha and Itanium=20A > will be supported. We will continue to support mixed VAX and=20  > Alpha environments.=20A > However, because there has been no demand for it our current=20 4 > plans do not include support for VAX and Itanium". >=20; > Wrong. I answered the survey, I remember very well the=20 * > question and I did ask for this feature. >=20A > Anyway, don't worry, a senior expert from VMS Eng who wishes=20 A > to remain anonymous told me that "it will work perfectly for=20 A > sure", which sounds logical as, if VAX - Alpha clusters is a=20 < > pleasure and Alpha - Integrity a feature, VAX - Alpha -=20 > Integrity will be a treasure.  >=20 > D. >=207 > (Integrity? The name of the future IA64 HP Server:=20  > http://tinyurl.com/rcvm) >=20 >=20   Didier,   H We demoed a VAX / Alpha / IPF V7.3-1 cluster running in the same clusterE at the Ottawa CANACU (DECUS) Technical Update seminar this summer. It E has also been demo'ed at other events as well. Works fine. OpenVMS is  OpenVMS.=20   E Actually very cool - think about any other cluster where a 32bit CISC F with a 64bit RISC with a 64bit EPIC architecture is all running in the> same cluster. All using the same shared files system with fullB read-write to the same files from different systems in potentially. different sites up to 500 miles (800km) apart.  H As Engineering has stated a number of times, just because it will not beH supported, does not mean it will not work. They have specifically statedF that they are not doing anything to inhibit this, but the testing of aG ginormous number of different VAX/Alpha/IPF combinations was considered  to be way to costly.=20   8 Especially with the VAX emulator capabilities cooking ..   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom . (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)=20   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 22:17:15 +0200 " From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>I Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS 4 Message-ID: <3f904e51$0$13269$626a54ce@news.free.fr>  3 Product is distributed in Europe by Emulators Int'l 5 http://www.emulatorsinternational.com/en/newsbits.htm     In the USA, I do not know (yet).   D.   Tom Linden wrote:    > You can send mail directly to  >  > Gerrit.Woertman@hp.com > Johan.Michiels@hp.com  >  >  >>-----Original Message-----4 >>From: Sean O'Banion [mailto:seanobanion@attbi.com]( >>Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 8:58 AM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com C >>Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for 	 >>OpenVMS  >> >>2 >>I can't find any costs, purchase or maintenence:< >>is this cheaper than CA's version of the Polycenter suite?   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 22:25:05 +0200 " From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>I Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS 4 Message-ID: <3f905028$0$13284$626a54ce@news.free.fr>  + Don't know (see my previous answer to Tom). G However, what I do know is what my antennas told me (I trust them very   much :-)  G The CA version is a somehow "frozen" version. I doubt that CA did some  F evolution on the VMS part of the Unicenter TNG suite after the 1st of 5 January 1999, due to COMPAQ's "enthusiasm" for VMS...   I The HP Cockpit Mgr version is (as far as I understood) a continuation of  K the life of the VMS Engineering product, so it is probably more "featured".   D Btw, I will not be surprized to see one day HP "purchase back" some : former DEC software sold away during the sinister CPQ era.  4 "Will there be back Gold at the end of the Rainbow?"   D.   Sean O'Banion wrote:  3 > I can't find any costs, purchase or maintenence:  < > is this cheaper than CA's version of the Polycenter suite? >  >  > Sean >  > ` > Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> wrote in message news:<3f8f9ca8$0$27014$626a54ce@news.free.fr>... >  >>FYI.= >>http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/v1/ns3/mgclus.htm  >>' >>Managing Mission-Critical VMSclusters  >>: >>Johan Michiels  Nand Staes  Gerrit Woertman  Jan Knol >>HP Consulting & Integration  >>
 >>Abstract >>E >>In this paper we present the VMS cockpit concept. The cockpit is a  G >>dedicated VMS system that centralizes all management operations. The  H >>main task of this cockpit is to monitor the entire OpenVMS production K >>environment and to take care of event notification in a uniform way. The  D >>cockpit assists the system manager 24 hours per day and automates  >>routine tasks. >> >>Introduction >>I >>The main responsibility of the VMS system manager is to make sure that  K >>his OpenVMS environment always delivers the performance and availability  D >>levels the business demands. To achieve this, he needs tools that B >>support and automate his job, and that cover all aspects of the E >>production environment. In many ways this can be compared with the   >>cockpit of a plane or boat.  >>D >>To build such a cockpit, HP Consulting & Integration has made the H >>toolkit CockpitMgr for OpenVMS available to customers. This toolkit H >>has a number of unique and valuable features every VMS system manager E >>needs. The present paper gives a technical overview of those tools.  >>E >>The CockpitMgr toolkit has already been deployed at many important  H >>OpenVMS customer sites, where it is well appreciated. CockpitMgr runs E >>entirely on OpenVMS, provides a solution for the entire production  F >>environment, and substitutes for the well-known POLYCENTER products. >> >>../..  >>I >>The next version of the CockpitMgr toolkit, to be released early 2003,  A >>will contain its own built-in console management functionality.  >> >>../..  >> >>D.   --  ;           Read the latest VAX/VMS to Itanium Migration News >         http://www.didiermorandi.com/vaxvms2itanium_200310.pdf  F Didier Morandi  ~ sarl au capital de 8 000 euros ~  Revendeur agr HPC      Expertise en environnement DIGITAL ~ Formation ~ Programmation D    5 avenue Albert Durand 31700 Blagnac France Tl: 33(0)5 6131 6287D    SIRET 448 694 851 00016 RCS Toulouse http://www.didiermorandi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 16:29:46 -0500 ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>I Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS 0 Message-ID: <00A27854.577C1FAC.14@tachysoft.com>  # >From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> $ >Organization: www.didiermorandi.comJ >Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS >   E >Btw, I will not be surprized to see one day HP "purchase back" some  ; >former DEC software sold away during the sinister CPQ era.     M I sure wish they would get RDB back from fucking oracle.  Pre-oracle rdb used I to work with datesim, but oracle gave it the same "enhancement" as in the O oracle database, that of accessing the time quadword directly rather than using I sys$gettim.  This is historical residue from the vax days when this was aeO kernel system service.  Seems nobody told the oracle dickweeds that gettim is a N mode of caller service on alpha, no different from any other subroutine call. K So their "performance enhancement" doesn't do a damn thing on alpha.  Otherr than make datesim inoperative.  M So basically I can't sell datesim to anybody running oracle databases (eitherr of them) on vms.   WaynelO ===============================================================================aN Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== H Randolph Duke (in Trading Places): "Mother always said you were greedy."1    Mortimer Duke: "She meant it as a compliment!"e   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 17:36:37 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>rI Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMS ' Message-ID: <3F906EF5.737A3D7D@fsi.net>u   Didier Morandi wrote:  > - > Don't know (see my previous answer to Tom). H > However, what I do know is what my antennas told me (I trust them very
 > much :-) > H > The CA version is a somehow "frozen" version. I doubt that CA did someG > evolution on the VMS part of the Unicenter TNG suite after the 1st of 7 > January 1999, due to COMPAQ's "enthusiasm" for VMS...e > J > The HP Cockpit Mgr version is (as far as I understood) a continuation ofM > the life of the VMS Engineering product, so it is probably more "featured".e > E > Btw, I will not be surprized to see one day HP "purchase back" some < > former DEC software sold away during the sinister CPQ era. > 6 > "Will there be back Gold at the end of the Rainbow?"  . Will there be a light at he end of the tunnel?  3 ...or will we be hit head-on by an on-coming train?y   Due To Budget Cuts,i" The Light At The End Of The Tunnel Will Be Turned Off   Effective: Immediately   -- 1 David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 01:37:01 GMTa+ From: "Bill Johnson" <res0xcil@verizon.net>lI Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for OpenVMSn6 Message-ID: <1P0kb.2024$Ee6.1321@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>  F Is this suite another REAL PRODUCT from Hp (i.e. HP Part Number in theH Global Parts list) or is this another project completed after hours by aJ small unofficial group? Where does support come from - Colorado Springs? -/ Our Platinum guy said he knew nothing of it 8(.r  8 Our sales person does not know how to quote it to us. 8(   anyone have any answers?    . "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> wrote in message3 news:CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJICEHBIEAA.tom@kednos.com...  > You can send mail directly tod >o > Gerrit.Woertman@hp.com > Johan.Michiels@hp.coma >a > >-----Original Message----- 5 > >From: Sean O'Banion [mailto:seanobanion@attbi.com]i) > >Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 8:58 AMx > >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComD > >Subject: Re: Good Bye Polycenter Suite, Hello Cockpit Manager for
 > >OpenVMS > >  > > 3 > >I can't find any costs, purchase or maintenence:r= > >is this cheaper than CA's version of the Polycenter suite?t > >  > >s > >Seans > >> > >e0 > >Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> wrote in message3 > >news:<3f8f9ca8$0$27014$626a54ce@news.free.fr>... 	 > >> FYI.e@ > >> http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/v1/ns3/mgclus.htm > >>* > >> Managing Mission-Critical VMSclusters > >>= > >> Johan Michiels  Nand Staes  Gerrit Woertman  Jan Knoli  > >> HP Consulting & Integration > >>
 > >> Abstractd > >>G > >> In this paper we present the VMS cockpit concept. The cockpit is aII > >> dedicated VMS system that centralizes all management operations. TheaJ > >> main task of this cockpit is to monitor the entire OpenVMS productionI > >> environment and to take care of event notification in a uniform way.r The F > >> cockpit assists the system manager 24 hours per day and automates > >> routine tasks.k > >> > >> Introductionr > >>K > >> The main responsibility of the VMS system manager is to make sure thatn@ > >> his OpenVMS environment always delivers the performance and availabilityF > >> levels the business demands. To achieve this, he needs tools thatD > >> support and automate his job, and that cover all aspects of theG > >> production environment. In many ways this can be compared with the   > >> cockpit of a plane or boat. > >>F > >> To build such a cockpit, HP Consulting & Integration has made theJ > >> toolkit CockpitMgr for OpenVMS available to customers. This toolkitJ > >> has a number of unique and valuable features every VMS system managerH > >> needs. The present paper gives a technical overview of those tools. > >>G > >> The CockpitMgr toolkit has already been deployed at many importantiJ > >> OpenVMS customer sites, where it is well appreciated. CockpitMgr runsG > >> entirely on OpenVMS, provides a solution for the entire productioneI > >> environment, and substitutes for the well-known POLYCENTER products.> > >>
 > >> ../.. > >>K > >> The next version of the CockpitMgr toolkit, to be released early 2003,nD > >> will contain its own built-in console management functionality. > >>
 > >> ../.. > >> > >> D.  > >h > >---) > >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.n= > >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).eC > >Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 10/6/2003  > >y > --- ( > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).B > Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 10/6/2003 >o   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Oct 2003 12:27:34 -07001 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski) " Subject: Latest ESS Customer Times= Message-ID: <857e9e41.0310171127.2b8c5f8f@posting.google.com>i  F Below is the link for the new October issue of Customer Times. Enjoy.  www.hp.com/go/customertimes   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 22:06:57 +0400': From: "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev{at}DeltaTelecom{dot}RU> Subject: Re: LGI Callout & SSH3 Message-ID: <348A63A9A55BD00E84F5B94824C35DAE@nntp>r   Larry Kilgallen wrote:  r > In article <85D8F3A6D73895A24376567B7F243739@nntp>, "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev{at}DeltaTelecom{dot}RU> writes: > 	 >>Hi All!m= >>	We have tried to use a LGI callout (OVMS 7.3-1 & UCX 5.1):w >  > 2 >>ROKOT$DKA0:[SYS0.SYSCOMMON.][SYSEXE]LOGINOUT.EXEG >>Status:                   %LIB-F-ACTIMAGE, error activating image !ASa > 8 >>  Logins with the "SET H 0" works normaly. Any ideas ? >  > B > Consider whether this TCPIP$SSH process might be running without > necessary privileges.eE 	Yeah? you are right. Loginout.exe is installed with privileges, LGI  D logicals defined as /SYS/EXEC so SSH process don't see the logicals.  7   I redefined two logicals w/o /EXEC and all works now:n  F def /sys LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUS ROKOT$DKA0:[RADAUTH]LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUS.EXE1 def /sys LGI$LOGINOUT_CALLOUTS LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUSw       	Thanks all for answers.   -- o Cheers, Ruslan.ID +---------------------pure personal opinion------------------------+<        RADIUS Server for OpenVMS project - www.radiusvms.com9          vms-isps@dls.net - Forum for ISP running OpenVMSnB     TKD (WTF) in Russia, St.-Petersburg - www.TaeKwonDo-WTF.SPb.RU   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Oct 2003 13:33:02 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)t Subject: Re: LGI Callout & SSH3 Message-ID: <bmQQuIw5EqRv@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  p In article <348A63A9A55BD00E84F5B94824C35DAE@nntp>, "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev{at}DeltaTelecom{dot}RU> writes: > Larry Kilgallen wrote:  C >> Consider whether this TCPIP$SSH process might be running withoutr >> necessary privileges.G > 	Yeah? you are right. Loginout.exe is installed with privileges, LGI  F > logicals defined as /SYS/EXEC so SSH process don't see the logicals. > 9 >   I redefined two logicals w/o /EXEC and all works now:p > H > def /sys LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUS ROKOT$DKA0:[RADAUTH]LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUS.EXE3 > def /sys LGI$LOGINOUT_CALLOUTS LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUSf  @ Well I am happy you solved your problem, but the only case I can= think of where DEFINE/SYSTEM (Supervisor mode) would work and A DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXECUTIVE would fail is if there was a pre-existings: conflicting Supervisor mode logical name of the same name.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:01:22 +0400e: From: "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev{at}DeltaTelecom{dot}RU> Subject: Re: LGI Callout & SSH3 Message-ID: <5382197FDBE88B0BB9015DB81E59E185@nntp>T  	 Hi Larry,nI 	sorry, I was wrong when said "the problem was solved" these definitiion aF is not a help. I wrote a mail to OpenVMSsecurity, waiting an answer...     	Thanks.   Larry Kilgallen wrote:  r > In article <348A63A9A55BD00E84F5B94824C35DAE@nntp>, "Ruslan R. Laishev" <Laishev{at}DeltaTelecom{dot}RU> writes: >  >>Larry Kilgallen wrote: >  > C >>>Consider whether this TCPIP$SSH process might be running withoutm >>>necessary privileges. >>G >>	Yeah? you are right. Loginout.exe is installed with privileges, LGI nF >>logicals defined as /SYS/EXEC so SSH process don't see the logicals. >>9 >>  I redefined two logicals w/o /EXEC and all works now:  >>H >>def /sys LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUS ROKOT$DKA0:[RADAUTH]LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUS.EXE3 >>def /sys LGI$LOGINOUT_CALLOUTS LGI$CALLOUT_RADIUSe >  > B > Well I am happy you solved your problem, but the only case I can? > think of where DEFINE/SYSTEM (Supervisor mode) would work andfC > DEFINE/SYSTEM/EXECUTIVE would fail is if there was a pre-existingm< > conflicting Supervisor mode logical name of the same name. 	n       -- A Cheers, Ruslan. D +---------------------pure personal opinion------------------------+<        RADIUS Server for OpenVMS project - www.radiusvms.com9          vms-isps@dls.net - Forum for ISP running OpenVMS B     TKD (WTF) in Russia, St.-Petersburg - www.TaeKwonDo-WTF.SPb.RU   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 03:27:17 GMT21 From: "netnews.comcast.net" <netnews@comcast.net>t) Subject: openVMS alpha 7.3.1 on PWS600au?t* Message-ID: <3F90B341.6070608@comcast.net>  D I'm trying to install the hobbyist version of openvms on a PWS600au F (SROM V7.2-1), but it always hang when the following message comes up:  2 OpenVMS (TM) Alpha Operating System, Version 7.3-1  4 According the FAQ's it should install on a PWS600au.> Is there any chance the CD is bad? or I just missed something.   TIA for any info.-   -Duy   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 04:40:38 GMTe6 From: "Craig A. Berry" <craigberry@mac.com.spamfooler>- Subject: Re: openVMS alpha 7.3.1 on PWS600au?e@ Message-ID: <738b041fd5656f37b3618d7a6d059ba0@news.teranews.com>  * In article <3F90B341.6070608@comcast.net>,3  "netnews.comcast.net" <netnews@comcast.net> wrote:r  F > I'm trying to install the hobbyist version of openvms on a PWS600au H > (SROM V7.2-1), but it always hang when the following message comes up: > 4 > OpenVMS (TM) Alpha Operating System, Version 7.3-1  H It's a supported platform but there are several variants and options to E work through.  Is the CD drive you are booting from SCSI or IDE?  If .G IDE, which chipset does it have?  If SCSI, what SCSI controller?  This  % information should be available from e   >>> show config0   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 17:24:34 -0500y1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>g* Subject: Re: OpenVMS in an HP advertisment' Message-ID: <3F906C22.94DD7BEB@fsi.net>    Nigel Barker wrote:m > O > On 16 Oct 2003 06:30:59 -0700, djesys@earthlink.net (David J Dachtera) wrote:c > x > >Ken Robinson <kenrbnsn1@patmedia.net> wrote in message news:<6.0.0.22.2.20031015165257.051637e8@mail.patmedia.net>...1 > >> At 04:44 PM 10/15/2003, Sue Skonetski wrote:m > >> >Folks, > >> >K > >> >There is now an HP add with VMS in it for Integrity Servers.  It is apH > >> >3M file.  At this point it is not on a web site, but if you need a6 > >> >copy please send me mail at my hp email address. > >>/ > >> I put a smaller version of this file up atcF > >> <http://www.rbnsn.com/Integrity_Server_ad_from_New_Scientist.jpg> > >g? > >Well, so far, we know the publication name: "New Scientist".d > >nF > >Ken, can you verify and quote the publication date and page number? > > H > >Sue, et al: O.k. So, it looks like we got exposure in a UK scientificI > >publication. Not exactly mainstream IT media, but any move off of zero  > >is a start. > >pD > >Now, can anyone tell me what it will take to get this ad into theG > >mainstream IT media? (That's not what I wrote originally, but if I'dnE > >posted that the MIBs would have been at my doorstep by lunchtime.)- > Q > The 'New Scientist' is a popular science magazine i.e. you will find it on sale<L > in most good news vendors in the UK. It's far more mainstream than most ITO > publications. It would be read by scientists, technologists & intelligent lay"
 > people.   D Well, that does a good job of excluding ivory-tower types. How do we; reach them? Maybe get Bart Simpson as a spokes-character...e   -- u David J. Dachterat dba DJE SystemsA http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/h   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 20:24:27 GMTx# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>h' Subject: Re: PL/1 users, where are you? K Message-ID: <%dYjb.366299$Lnr1.347462@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>    Keith Parris wrote:w5 > David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in messaged* > news:<3F8DBB26.2080407@tsoft-inc.com>...& >> My concern is that HP, at least theC >> enterprise and PC business, is going to be a short lived entity.h >rG > In the enterprise area, HP has been taking marketshare away from Sun.nG > In the PC area, HP is very close to and is regaining marketshare from / > Dell.  From the HP World Newsletter, Oct. 16:r >  > "HP Leads PC Sales Surge > H > IDC reported yesterday that global PC shipments jumped 15.7 percent inA > the third quarter to 38.4 million units, dramatically exceedingbD > expectations. IDC had projected 10.4 percent global growth for the
 > quarter. > G > HP led the increase, driven by notebook PC sales and bargain hunting,a > according to IDC.  >b@ > "The race between HP and Dell just got a lot closer," said JimB > McDonnell, vice president of marketing for HP's Personal SystemsH > Group, in a statement. "HP considerably narrowed the gap with only 0.3H > points separating HP from the top spot. What's more, HP's market shareB > grew a solid 21 percent sequentially. That not only gives our PCH > business strong momentum going into the final calendar quarter and theH > traditionally positive holiday buying season, but it also continues to' > help drive overall PC market growth."t >vC > HP's PC business grew 28 percent worldwide, and 34 percent in the 9 > United States compared with the same quarter last year.l > C > Dell retains the number-one worldwide market share spot with 17.4oG > percent versus HP's 17.1 percent (6.67 million units and 6.55 millione > units, respectively).u >iB > One admittedly unsupportable data point indicates that HP may beF > extremely optimistic about overall hardware shipments for next year.F > The Taiwanese Economic Daily News reported this week that HP expectsG > to spend $20 billion on manufacturing in Taiwan next year compared too3 > $16 billion forecast for this year.  - Mike Elgan  > 5 > http://hpworldnews.c.tep1.com/maabyWdaa1lPda4e8YPe/d >h > and following that pointer:t >dH > "When the numbers are broken down, it becomes clear just how close theD > two-horse race truly is. With more than 38.4 million units shippedG > during the third calendar quarter and with only 127,000 units shipped C > separating HP from Dell, that works out to roughly seven hours ofn > production over 90 days."a    J Whatever. HP doesn't make nearly as much profit on its PC business as Dell does.n   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 17:33:25 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 5 Subject: Re: Read data from a native format zip disk?l' Message-ID: <3F906E35.16700FBB@fsi.net>d   Kenneth E Bartlett wrote:w > ? > On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 19:55:42 -0400, Kenneth E Bartlett wrote:r > L > > I would like to be able to read data from a zip disk that was written toH > > on a Windoze machine. It is in the format the disk comes in from theE > > factory. I am relatively new to VMS and have tried PCDisk withoutoH > > success so far. PCDisk expects the disk to have a FAT table on it. IE > > used the command 'use d: dkb500: to try to mount it under PCDisk.  > >yL > > BTW, the disk drive is a SCSI drive in a removeable drive chassis. It isL > > installed at the slot allocated to SCSI ID 5 since I saw on the web thatI > > they supposedly only work at ID 5 or 6 on the SCSI bus and my chassis  > > only supports up to 5. > > G > > I believe the drive is a Zip100, if that matters. Also I am gettingoK > > drive activity when I run the above command in PCDisk and it ejects the J > > disk when I get the 'no file allocation table found' failure. I do notL > > have the exact failure wording at the moment, I am away from the system. > J > I forgot to mention I am running OpenVMS 7.2. I was looking at old postsK > that seem to mention that the OS implemented support of zip/jaz drives inaK > OVMS 7.1. I am sure no one at work has tried to use one since we upgraded I > a couple of years ago to 7.1 and now to 7.2 by just simply mounting the@D > stupid thing. Maybe I am trying to do things the hard way based onJ > everyone telling me the things do not work. I will try it in the morning > and see what I get.i  B Trouble with ZIPs is that they are viewed(viewable) as hard drivesG (non-removeable). That is, they have partition tables. I'm not aware ofa@ any VMS "thingie" that reads info. from other than a FAT floppy.   -- r David J. Dachteras dba DJE Systemsa http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/u   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 22:51:54 +0200r" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> Subject: Re: rwast4 Message-ID: <3f905672$0$13295$626a54ce@news.free.fr>   Chris Sharman wrote:  . > Questions: how do I unjam an RWAST process ?  # Never succeeded in 21 years of VMS.n  < Alpha Internals & Data Structures gives three MWAIT reasons:  3 depleted system resource (no action possible to me) 5 insufficient job quota (not dynamic, so needs reboot) < mutex (how do you fix that? by killing others processes? :-)  " > What's with astlm 0, astcnt 99 ? ASTLMtA       Specifies the AST queue limit, which is the total number ofsE       asynchronous system trap (AST) operations and scheduled wake-up1E       requests that the user can have queued at one time. The default 4       is 40 on VAX systems and 250 on Alpha systems.   ASTCNT< 	Nr of concurrent ASTs the process can request at the moment 	(AI&DS v 1.5 p 181)  J > How do I find out what's going on with it ? (force_process_dump doesn't ! > work, since it relies on ASTs).e  	 $ ana/sysa< SDA> set proc/ind=PID (care, it's "IND" for INDex, not "ID") SDA> sh proc ../..t go to screen #3n' look at the Event Flag Wait Mask (EFWM)oG if the process is in MWAIT, the EFWM should have a value between 1 and eF 18 (AI&DS v 1.5 page 381). The table there (in the "bible") gives the 
 MWAIT reason.e  ( On VAX, you can retrieve this list with:   SDA> read sys$system:sysdef.stbi SDA> sh symb rsn$/alli   HTHs   D. > 	 > Thanks,o > Chrisr >    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 19:42:27 GMTa4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>! Subject: Re: VMS defeated by winde0 Message-ID: <3F9043E5.37F1B521@blueyonder.co.uk>   JF Mezei wrote:  >  > Tim Llewellyn wrote:8 > > USB to serial adaptors and vice versa are available. > N > Careful about those. USB is not peer to perr, it is master-slave (one has to > provide power).t > L > Most USB-Serial adaptors are slaves, expecting to be plugged into a master
 > (eg: a PC).t > 5 > Having [UPS]---<usb>---[Adaptor]---<serial>---[VAX]t > N > May not work if both the UPS and the Adaptor are slaves on the USB. The vastP > majority of adaptors are designed to allow you to connect a serial device onto > a computer, not the reverse.  H I didn't say it would work out of the box on a VAX. USB to ethernet doesO sound cleaner, apart possibly from security/reliability issues raised by others7 including yourself.e  N However, you were the one complaining about lack of USB for VAX. I propose theL following solution, plug your VAX into a PC via a serial port, plug your UPSN into the same PC uing USB, write some comversion software USB-serial to run onF your PC. Wait for the fire or system failure due to power problems :-)  C More seriously, like Nic I would be worried about IP enabled UPS's.n   regards,   -- l tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 19:59:38 GMTd" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG! Subject: Re: VMS defeated by wind 0 Message-ID: <00A27850.29CA636A@SendSpamHere.ORG>  g In article <3F9043E5.37F1B521@blueyonder.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:e >n >a >JF Mezei wrote: >> e >> Tim Llewellyn wrote:l9 >> > USB to serial adaptors and vice versa are available.h >> tO >> Careful about those. USB is not peer to perr, it is master-slave (one has too >> provide power). >>  M >> Most USB-Serial adaptors are slaves, expecting to be plugged into a master  >> (eg: a PC). >> E6 >> Having [UPS]---<usb>---[Adaptor]---<serial>---[VAX] >>  O >> May not work if both the UPS and the Adaptor are slaves on the USB. The vastdQ >> majority of adaptors are designed to allow you to connect a serial device ontoc >> a computer, not the reverse.t >oI >I didn't say it would work out of the box on a VAX. USB to ethernet does,P >sound cleaner, apart possibly from security/reliability issues raised by others >including yourself. >eO >However, you were the one complaining about lack of USB for VAX. I propose theoM >following solution, plug your VAX into a PC via a serial port, plug your UPS O >into the same PC uing USB, write some comversion software USB-serial to run oncG >your PC. Wait for the fire or system failure due to power problems :-)  > D >More seriously, like Nic I would be worried about IP enabled UPS's.   What is the difference?     # Serial cable from UPS to VAX/Alpha?h& Ethernet cable from UPS to VAX/Alpha?    -- IL VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker    VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM            -5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 20:13:13 GMTi" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG! Subject: Re: VMS defeated by windr0 Message-ID: <00A27852.0F220010@SendSpamHere.ORG>  g In article <3F9043E5.37F1B521@blueyonder.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:  >l >n >JF Mezei wrote: >> V >> Tim Llewellyn wrote:.9 >> > USB to serial adaptors and vice versa are available.r >> pO >> Careful about those. USB is not peer to perr, it is master-slave (one has tov >> provide power). >> tM >> Most USB-Serial adaptors are slaves, expecting to be plugged into a master  >> (eg: a PC). >> h6 >> Having [UPS]---<usb>---[Adaptor]---<serial>---[VAX] >> rO >> May not work if both the UPS and the Adaptor are slaves on the USB. The vastrQ >> majority of adaptors are designed to allow you to connect a serial device onto  >> a computer, not the reverse.  >uI >I didn't say it would work out of the box on a VAX. USB to ethernet does-P >sound cleaner, apart possibly from security/reliability issues raised by others >including yourself. >sO >However, you were the one complaining about lack of USB for VAX. I propose the4M >following solution, plug your VAX into a PC via a serial port, plug your UPStO >into the same PC uing USB, write some comversion software USB-serial to run on G >your PC. Wait for the fire or system failure due to power problems :-)b >uD >More seriously, like Nic I would be worried about IP enabled UPS's.     What is the worry?  # Serial cable from UPS to VAX/Alpha?u% Ethernet cable from UPS to VAX/Alpha?      --  L VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker    VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" t   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 20:24:59 GMTH4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>! Subject: Re: VMS defeated by windt/ Message-ID: <3F904D87.FC08D7E@blueyonder.co.uk>n  ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:P > i > In article <3F9043E5.37F1B521@blueyonder.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:   r > > F > >More seriously, like Nic I would be worried about IP enabled UPS's. >  > What is the difference?2 > % > Serial cable from UPS to VAX/Alpha?m' > Ethernet cable from UPS to VAX/Alpha?k  Q OK if you have a separate network circuit for UPS control the worry is withdrawn.E     -- B tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 17:49:31 +0000 (UTC)c From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: W2K patches) Message-ID: <bmpa3b$kft$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>I  a In article <souJQnD0H9gE@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:tK >In article <bmp585$ios$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk writes: d >> In article <uSjURDDq2wfH@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:M >>>In article <bmoi7q$ct3$2@news.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes:vf >>>> In article <DtKaXNLlDitQ@eisner.encompasserve.org>, young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) writes:[ >>>>>In article <3F8EE697.8D337ABE@istop.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> writes:o& >>>>>> david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:T >>>> If they are still going to realease critical patches as they currently do then P >>>> this announcement is pointless - just look at the last few months MicrosoftL >>>> patches the majority have been critical. Of the rest a fair number wereS >>>> classified as important and many people from the testing companies have argued G >>>> that many of those should really have been classified as critical.h >>>m@ >>>	Right.  So maybe the patch cycle shrinks by one go round andC >>>	the whole point of this announcement.  I'm relying on a source,oA >>>	I take it he is right that CRITICAL get released ASAP.  It isI >>>	what he does day to day. >>>e
 >>>				Rob >>>l >> n= >> Sorry Rob I'm having trouble understanding the sentence :-e >> s7 >> So maybe the patch cycle shrinks by one go round andp( >> the whole point of this announcement. >> h >s >	That wasn't very good was it.a > > >	Microsoft talks about moving to a monthly cycle for patches.> >	BUT critical patches will be released immediately.  So maybe= >	when you had a patch come in that wasn't critical you would > >	apply it on the weekends.  Now instead of every weekend, you< >	patch monthly UNLESS a critical patch comes in and you may; >	be back to patching every weekend.  The monthly cycle may ; >	or may not allow you to skip a weekend or skip a go roundy >	on the patch merry-go-round. >' >				Rob >				l  O Still don't see how that improves anything. Organisations have always been able0O to choose when they applied the patches and to prioritise critical patches over  moderate or low impact patches.   . Anyway this is a bit offtopic for comp.os.vms.    
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:21:03 -0400 < From: "Peter Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca> Subject: Re: W2K patches9 Message-ID: <bmpbuh$pcv6i$1@ID-141708.news.uni-berlin.de>i   Jack Peacock wrote:m >...= > the cost to move from Alpha to Itanium.  That alone made use	 decide to8= > end our VMS development.  It helped that VMS inquiries alsoo went toS; > just about zero (one in the last six months, and it was a' dud).a >...  < What is it that you ended development on? I have to ask here8 because every time I go to www.simconv.com my IE browser crashes.   -- 1 Peter Weaver Weaver Consulting Services Inc.i Canadian VAR for CHARON-VAXG www.weaverconsulting.ca    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:19:29 -0400n* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> Subject: Re: W2K patches) Message-ID: <3F9032AB.92046DD9@istop.com>   M Microsoft slaves have lived with buggy software and frequent reboots for over L 10 years now in enterprise. And before Microsoft admitted to the presence ofL the internet, Microsoft slaves didn't really have any way to obtain patches,2 they just lived with the bugs and <alt><ctrl><del>  M If they've had their software installed for 2 years, waiting any extra coupley9 of weeks for a patch to fix a long time bug won't matter.n  M And ***IF*** Microsoft manages to combine a month's worth of debugging into a J single installable patch, won't that save slaves a lot of time compared toL having to go to the microsoft web site on a daily basis to see if there is a new patch that was released ?o  I In the end, I think that this is a good move, escpecially if each monthly.N patch changes the subversion of the OS to indicate that it has been installed,F thus making it much easier to manage a large fleet of microsoft boxes.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:53:46 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> Subject: Re: W2K patches) Message-ID: <3F903AB2.DAC1075B@istop.com>V   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:aQ > Still don't see how that improves anything. Organisations have always been ablenQ > to choose when they applied the patches and to prioritise critical patches overn! > moderate or low impact patches.n    G The problem is that Microsoft issues so many patches that managing thisaH process has become very time consuming for every slave to that software.  L Consider if VMS on Itanium, in its current state were commercially released,K and every week the VMS engineers would issue patches to correct problems asnE they crop up ? How would you feel about it ? That is essentially whataM Microsoft is doing. Releasing software to the slaves at large who just "have"nF to install that new version even though it isn't ready for prime time.  N With the volume of business Microsoft is getting, there is no budgetary excuseF for not having the right level of quality control. Microsoft is eitherK incompetent, or is has a polict of ensuring lowe quality to force people toT% buy the next version of its products.v   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 11:18:34 -0700d+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com>sA Subject: Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disksn' Message-ID: <3F90327A.1090407@MMaz.com>r   Bob Koehler wrote:  q >In article <bmp4tu$peovt$1@ID-152801.news.uni-berlin.de>, Michael Unger <db6st.rev.0131a55a@t-online.de> writes:t >  t >oC >>I still don't understand why -- given the Intel based approach --aD >>Winwoes is used as the "hosting OS". I'd expected a small and fastF >>(real-time) OS as "program loader", perhaps even using the "primary": >>disk and network controllers instead of additional ones.E >>   Because people have them, and can get them cheaply.  If you wanteH >>   it to run on VxWorks or something, try to make a case to the ownersL >>   of Charon-VAX that this would result in more sales than the one running >>   on Alpha VMS. >>- >>   Have you priced good embedded OS lately?- >>     >>C I'm not a MS fan, though I put up with and use Windoze clients and .C servers because in specific situations they serve a purpose better oI suited than VMS since a practical, and cost effective, DesktopVMS OS and e) Office VMS doesn't exist, and never will.w    H The fact is, there are advantages to running Charon on a Wintel/AMD vs. B a Alpha; Cost, Speed and less VMS licensing (you still need a VMS 0 License for both the Alpha and the Charon-VAX).     B Running Charon-VAX isn't for everyone, but most folks do not have G one-arm tied behind their back and can run native on Alpha.  It's very  H easy for folks to spew the 'ideal scenario' but lets face it, if we had F an ideal situation to begin with, we wouldn't have a need to run on a  VAX, or simulated VAX! i    F The bottom line is that Charon runs, and runs well, on a Windows 2000 H based system with most services disabled.  As for downtime, we have had K none compliments of the BillyBoy software component of the configuration...a     Barrye     --      > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                        =   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 18:26:36 GMT ( From: "konabear" <maurert@ameritech.net>A Subject: Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disks=? Message-ID: <wvWjb.2198$P%1.1792760@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com>=  F That and you can contract OpenVMS support for your CharonVAX.  HP willL support VMS on a CharonVAX provided it's running on HP hardware.    The onlyJ caveat is that should VMS exhibit an unexpected behavior, the customer may) be ask to duplicate the problem on a VAX.:  L What I'm not sure of is if Engineering would step up to a problem on the VAXK Shared SCSI cluster mentioned here.   But as always, many things in OpenVMSpJ work even if they aren't supported.  Just don't expect OpenVMS Engineering to fix it if it breaks.   J The solutoin in the white paper it great, but would who support the shared SCSI if there is a problem?V  K Also being on the team that support OpenVMS clusters at the CSC, I STRONGLYMK recommend that the instructions include setting EXPECTED_VOTES to 3 on bothsJ systems.  If left at the defaults of 1 then a partitioned cluster would beJ possible.  I had a partitioned cluster happen the other day.  We could get into a rathole quickly here.  H Since you recommend configing with a quorum disk, I admit it is unlikelyH that a partitioned cluster would happen.  If NodeA booted while EthernetK were unavailable for SCS, NodeA would still see activity in the quorum filetH to let it know NodeB is using the system disk.  Not seeing NodeB via SCSJ NodeA should refuse to boot.  The danger would be a down Quorum disk .AND.J broken Ethernet.  But the point is EXPECTED_VOTES is the design feature toE protect the cluster and the data.  The white paper does a good job of I warning about boot sequence during setup to avoid partitioning, so I known1 avoiding partitioning is important to the author.l   Todd ToddB "Wilm Boerhout" <wboerhoutOLD@PAINTvxcompany.com> wrote in message$ news:bmh9oq$fei$1@reader08.wxs.nl... >T >o > H Vlems wrote: >m) > >  Whatever way you may want to put it,nE > > for VMS system managers the Charon setup is a straight forward NI  cluster.< > > Which incidentally may also be achieved if you run simh. >  >hF > You may have seen by now that it is not an NI-(LAVC)-cluster at all. > I > As for comparing it to simh, that's not fair at all. simh (I've used itaH > and the public domain / open source predecessors for a long time. Used? > to load RSTS/E on the PDP-11 simulator just to run Adventure)h >oJ > simh is perfectly suitable for the hobbyist and educational environment.1 > I bet it can win over some new VMS enthusiasts.0 >:G > CHARON-VAX on the other hand is production class software. One of our J > customers runs it with 800 users logged in and heavy batches at night onI > a single soon to be clustererd Compaq Proliant DL360 / DL380, replacing  > a VAX 7000-620.e > G > The cluster that led to writing the white paper delivers 100 VUPS! Ben* > careful, children, this is not a toy :-) >w > -- > Wilm BoerhoutI > VX Company, The Netherlandsc >o! > wboerhoutOLD@PAINTvxcompany.com ) >   (remove OLD PAINT from reply address)e > ) > *** my opinions are strictly my own ***r >  >r   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 20:31:02 +0200 5 From: Wilm Boerhout <wboerhoutOLD@PAINTvxcompany.com>pA Subject: Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disksl* Message-ID: <bmpcln$790$1@reader10.wxs.nl>  1 Thank you all for your observations and comments.d  @ A slightly revised version of the white paper has been placed on  0     http://www.vxcompany.com/im , bottom of page   and on  7     http://home.planet.nl/~boerh075/SCSI_VAXcluster.pdf   D for those who are offended by the use of Javascript on that website.   -- r
 Wilm Boerhoute VX Company, The Netherlandsr   wboerhoutOLD@PAINTvxcompany.comn'   (remove OLD PAINT from reply address)i  ' *** my opinions are strictly my own ***l   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 18:54:16 -0400e. From: "Rob Lyons" <rob.lyons@resilientsys.com>A Subject: Re: White paper: CHARON-VAX cluster w/ shared SCSI disks + Message-ID: <bmprun$6l0$1@bob.news.rcn.net>   s Michael Unger <db6st.rev.0131a55a@t-online.de> wrote in message news:bmp4tu$peovt$1@ID-152801.news.uni-berlin.de... , > On 2003-10-17 15:24, "Robert Boers" wrote: >m5 > > "Michael Unger" <unger@decus.de> wrote in message 7 > > news:bmmj9m$nto2l$2@ID-152801.news.uni-berlin.de...i0 > >> On 2003-10-15 23:03, "Wilm Boerhout" wrote: > >e	 > > [...]eH > >> "VMS on IA-32" isn't the problem, but "Charon-VAX on *Windows*" ... > >SO > > As might have shown from an earlier message, CHARON-VAX uses Windows mainlyeF > > as program loader, and one can disable unused services. Windows isF >                                                           ^^^^^^^^^^L > > remarkably stable if it is not used. We had our local demo system up for' >   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ : > > over a year before it was time for a hardware upgrade. >n > ;-)s  > Don't laugh, I've seen VMS clusters up for more than a decade.; How can you compare that to software that is designed to bei replaced every other year...  @ The only thing I can think of that has a shorter life expectancy@ is game machines.  (How many people still have an Atari system?)   > P > > CHARON-VAX/AXP on an OpenVMS/Alpha host is a good alternative. One can build& > > nice clusters on a Marvel as well. > >:	 > > [...]  >tF > Agreed. But an AlphaServer *and* an additional license to run VMS as8 > "hosting OS" will probably be a bit more expensive ...  F The price differential between the Alpha version and the Intel versionP helps balance the price difference.  Also, take a look at the Marvel white paperG published earlier this year for some possibilities to gain economies of < scale with Alpha multi-processors.  See www.resilientsys.com% for the white paper download pointer.3 >6C > I still don't understand why -- given the Intel based approach -->D > Winwoes is used as the "hosting OS". I'd expected a small and fastF > (real-time) OS as "program loader", perhaps even using the "primary": > disk and network controllers instead of additional ones. >vD You still need management utilities to backup the emulator files andE local storage-container disks.  You still need an editor to customizenB the configuration.  You still need network management utilities toK tune the system....  so, you still need a host OS with some user interface.S= As it goes, I'm just as glad it doesn't use Solaris or HP-UX.s  	 > Michaeld >l > --= > Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers.AB > Please do *not* send "Security Patch Notifications" or "SecurityC > Updates"; this system isn't running a Micro$oft operating system.-? > And don't annoy me <mailto:postmaster@[127.0.0.1]> please ;-)   	 Rob Lyonsr   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.577 ************************