1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 09 Sep 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 499       Contents:+ Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch + Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal M Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal 7 Re: ANN: some new freeware and freeware updates for VMS 7 Re: ANN: some new freeware and freeware updates for VMS $ Re: Backup/Copy tree with alias file	 Re: BCC08 6 Can an OpenVMS program access a DB2 database directly?% Re: Choosing between ASTs and Threads % Re: Choosing between ASTs and Threads . Re: copy bootable CD to disk and boot from it?0 Current events put to good use by some companies& Dell to double the size of his company Re: Do we need a DCL debugger? Re: Do we need a DCL debugger?, Re: Documentation for $setenv system service FOCUS replacement with SQL Re: ftp/ucx timeout setting?) Re: How to set timeout for MOUNT/NOASSIST ) Re: How to set timeout for MOUNT/NOASSIST ) Re: How to set timeout for MOUNT/NOASSIST % HP Education Services teaches OpenVMS ) Re: HP Education Services teaches OpenVMS : Re: Limit Processor utilisation per user (Class Scheduler)B Missing bytes and buffer overrun when reading with terminal driverF Re: Missing bytes and buffer overrun when reading with terminal driverF Re: Missing bytes and buffer overrun when reading with terminal driver1 Re: OpenVMS Hobbyist licence for layered products  Re: OpenVMS Security Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates  Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates   Re: Philips CDR2600 and CDRECORD Re: PWS 500 question! Re: RDB Interactive SQL questions  Tapesys and system disk rebuild # Re: Tapesys and system disk rebuild # Re: Tapesys and system disk rebuild   Re: The vultures are circulating  Re: The vultures are circulating Re: VMS website updated. Re: VMS website updated.' What is T4 and what can it do  for you? 2 Re: Will OpenVMS I64 run on a Dell PowerEdge 3250n/ WordPerfect for OpenVMS Alpha - License Problem 3 Re: WordPerfect for OpenVMS Alpha - License Problem 3 Re: WordPerfect for OpenVMS Alpha - License Problem   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 17:46:51 GMT 9 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch2 Message-ID: <fg37b.4228$L_4.1316@news.cpqcorp.net>  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageC news:_x27b.192572$_V.176081@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...  >  > F > Having worked in the investment business for a number of years as an analyst G > I think I can safely claim to have a better understanding of how that 0 > industry works and what the 'code words' mean.  + Oh my.  Well.  *that* helps explain things.    > I merely point out theH > existence of the investment research report written by a Merrill Lynch> > analyst, as reported by the ace cub reporter from Bloomberg.  K Gee.  Does Jimmy Olsen from the Daily Planet take pictures for the "ace cub 
 reported".  L And what's your mission in life, and motivation for "merely pointing out theJ existance"?  Have a stake in ML?  Bloomberg?  Sun?  I don't know - you are
 anonymous.   > Don't blame meK > for the apparent failings of that Bloomberg reporter who may not know how  to7 > complete a cogent thought or communicate effectively.  >   D I only question motivations.  Since you are an anonymous poster, whoJ formerly (?) was in the investment business - I'll give you the benefit ofF the doubt that you aren't with Bloomberg, Merrill Lynch, or an ace cubH reporter for a major metropolitan paper, Barrons, WSJ, or Smith Blarney.  I I'm not a broker.  I don't give investment advice.  I have a positive HP, H and VMS bias.  You know my name.  I can be right, I can be wrong - I canK even manage to be both.  But when/if you're wrong (being anonymous) you can C just change your name-dejur and cut off your past - so your current   incarnation can always be right.   > > I > > Wanna talk to investors who are now cancelling their retirement plans ) > > because of the great advice they got?  > J > Just because somebody gives you advice doesn't necessarily mean that youL > have to take it. When investing, your range of possible outcomes cover theJ > spectrum from total loss to obscene profits, and all points between. Had the J > advice brought profits, as much advice did during the 1990's, would that@ > have made you less bitter even though the risks were the same? >   J I'm not bitter.  I was conservative during the 90's and didn't ride to theD top, and I moved mostly out of stocks well before the market tubed -K frankly, I haven't lost a dime in the 2000's - call it "Fear of the Dubya". I Nor am I anywhere near retirement - and I don't take advice from brokers. G The problem with Oracles is that like the one at Delphi - many of their  predictions seem drug induced.   > K > BTW...don't worry about carly when that does happen...she'll get millions  inL > a 'retirement package' and she'll still be able to serve as an independentK > on boards as 'the former Chair & CEO of Hewlett Packard", raking hundreds  ofL > thousands per year in director's fees.  Oh, I forgot to ask...what happensI > to you and your VMS colleagues when there are no bids when the 'VMS For L > Sale' sign is hung out because no potential buyer thinks there's any brandE > awareness or value left worth paying for? Two weeks severance and a I > cardboard box to carry your personal items on the way out? Don't get me J > wrong.....I hope that doesn't happen to you or all the other good peopleF > where you work....but as each day goes by with VMS not being heavilyA > promoted and contributing more and more to the bottom line.....  >   K I don't worry about Carly, and I'm pretty sure she's not worried about me - I I hope that she's spending her time concentrating on making HP a success. K I'm pretty optimistic about VMS - but hey I could be wrong.  I could be hit L by a bus.  There's no way to predict.  Life is about change.  I tell my bossI that I plan to retire still working for VMS - which should be 10-15 years  down the road.  L But this has no bearing on the original note.  Six months from now, we couldJ be in the middle of the Dubya Bounce, and see the next big surge in retailK and business spending - throwing everyones predictions in the trash.  Or we K could be in a Japaneese deflationary spiral.  To predict, or even recommend H what HP should do requires an understanding of a lot of things about theG company and it's competition, plus being right when you guess where the K economy will go.  That's what Carly and company are paid to figure out.  To I me, analysts seem akin to film critics - they don't have the talent to do J it - so they critique it.  I used to work with a SW specialist in New YorkI who was a really bad SW specialist, he made an even worse analyst when he 8 went to work for one of those large, mostly wrong firms.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 18:23:36 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill LynchI Message-ID: <IO37b.193157$_V.125489@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   D "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> wrote in message, news:fg37b.4228$L_4.1316@news.cpqcorp.net... >  > K > I'm not a broker.  I don't give investment advice.  I have a positive HP, J > and VMS bias.  You know my name.  I can be right, I can be wrong - I canI > even manage to be both.  But when/if you're wrong (being anonymous) you  can E > just change your name-dejur and cut off your past - so your current " > incarnation can always be right.  I I guess that means you want me to revert back to my previous identiy, the K one everyone knew me by before I used the internet....okay...'Deep Throat'.  ;-)         K > > > Wanna talk to investors who are now cancelling their retirement plans + > > > because of the great advice they got?  > > L > > Just because somebody gives you advice doesn't necessarily mean that youJ > > have to take it. When investing, your range of possible outcomes cover the L > > spectrum from total loss to obscene profits, and all points between. Had > the L > > advice brought profits, as much advice did during the 1990's, would thatB > > have made you less bitter even though the risks were the same? > >  > L > I'm not bitter.  I was conservative during the 90's and didn't ride to theF > top, and I moved mostly out of stocks well before the market tubed -E > frankly, I haven't lost a dime in the 2000's - call it "Fear of the  Dubya". K > Nor am I anywhere near retirement - and I don't take advice from brokers. I > The problem with Oracles is that like the one at Delphi - many of their   > predictions seem drug induced.   Good for you (seriously). L Drug induced...caught up in the euphoria...lack of persective...whatever youF want to call it. Some people made boatloads of money during the recentI downturn while others lost their shirts, some gained nor lost. How do you L explain that? In general it is possible to ascribe those outcomes to varying@ degrees of education/training, understanding of human behaviour,L 'situational awareness', aggressive/passive nature, and willingness to be an  active participant in ones fate.     >  > > D > > BTW...don't worry about carly when that does happen...she'll get millions > inB > > a 'retirement package' and she'll still be able to serve as an independent D > > on boards as 'the former Chair & CEO of Hewlett Packard", raking hundreds > ofF > > thousands per year in director's fees.  Oh, I forgot to ask...what happens K > > to you and your VMS colleagues when there are no bids when the 'VMS For H > > Sale' sign is hung out because no potential buyer thinks there's any brand G > > awareness or value left worth paying for? Two weeks severance and a K > > cardboard box to carry your personal items on the way out? Don't get me L > > wrong.....I hope that doesn't happen to you or all the other good peopleH > > where you work....but as each day goes by with VMS not being heavilyC > > promoted and contributing more and more to the bottom line.....  > >  > H > I don't worry about Carly, and I'm pretty sure she's not worried about me -K > I hope that she's spending her time concentrating on making HP a success. I > I'm pretty optimistic about VMS - but hey I could be wrong.  I could be  hit I > by a bus.  There's no way to predict.  Life is about change.  I tell my  bossK > that I plan to retire still working for VMS - which should be 10-15 years  > down the road.  G Perhaps you shall. But perhaps not with the same employer, as the evens " since 1997 have shown is possible.      H > But this has no bearing on the original note.  Six months from now, we could L > be in the middle of the Dubya Bounce, and see the next big surge in retailJ > and business spending - throwing everyones predictions in the trash.  Or weC > could be in a Japaneese deflationary spiral.  To predict, or even 	 recommend J > what HP should do requires an understanding of a lot of things about theI > company and it's competition, plus being right when you guess where the I > economy will go.  That's what Carly and company are paid to figure out.   * And the Wall Street 'casino' analysts too.       > ToK > me, analysts seem akin to film critics - they don't have the talent to do L > it - so they critique it.  I used to work with a SW specialist in New YorkK > who was a really bad SW specialist, he made an even worse analyst when he : > went to work for one of those large, mostly wrong firms.  E Not all are as you describe. I know many capable investment analysts, K covering many industries, who had previously worked for many years in those J industries as talented engineers, corporate treasurers/financial analysts,H research scientists, physicians, and many other roles. However, like allJ industries, there are ones you wouldn't listen to if your life depended onH it - I'll even go so far as to speculate that there are people like that1 within HP too -all companies have some like that.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 18:50:53 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch/ Message-ID: <3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk>    John Smith wrote:  > F > "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> wrote in message. > news:fg37b.4228$L_4.1316@news.cpqcorp.net... > >  > > M > > I'm not a broker.  I don't give investment advice.  I have a positive HP, L > > and VMS bias.  You know my name.  I can be right, I can be wrong - I canK > > even manage to be both.  But when/if you're wrong (being anonymous) you  > can G > > just change your name-dejur and cut off your past - so your current $ > > incarnation can always be right. > K > I guess that means you want me to revert back to my previous identiy, the M > one everyone knew me by before I used the internet....okay...'Deep Throat'.  > ;-)  >   S In defence of Mr Smith, I would say that posting the sort of material that he does  H anonymously is undoubtedly less detrimental to his career prospects thanI doing so openly. I doubt he puts on his resume "regularly posts to usenet * using the name John Smith a@nonymous.com".  F I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all.   regards    --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 13:58:04 -0500 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch3 Message-ID: <9Zsh1s0ZGyrp@eisner.encompasserve.org>   n In article <yD27b.192617$_V.71839@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes: > : > "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message/ > news:8JhbuJLiz5ut@eisner.encompasserve.org... K >> In article <Fs17b.192049$_V.95728@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, ' > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:  >> > >> >J >> > A respected individual named Walter Hewlett happens to think the same > way as. >> > the ML&Co analyst...or had you forgotten? >> > >>@ >> And Walter lost, therefore this guy like Walter is a "loser." >> Is that your point? >  >  > That isn't worthy of a reply.  >   A 	No.  Not easily defended so time to bail.  I mean after all,  if C 	you are arguing ad verecundiam - and have chosen a source such as  A 	Walter Hewlett - you have to devote quite a bit of resources to  4 	defending/reforming such a source.  Easier to bail.   				Rob    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 19:07:28 GMT 9 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch2 Message-ID: <Qr47b.4242$H95.1232@news.cpqcorp.net>  . "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageC news:IO37b.193157$_V.125489@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...  >   J > Drug induced...caught up in the euphoria...lack of persective...whatever you H > want to call it. Some people made boatloads of money during the recentK > downturn while others lost their shirts, some gained nor lost. How do you F > explain that? In general it is possible to ascribe those outcomes to varying B > degrees of education/training, understanding of human behaviour,K > 'situational awareness', aggressive/passive nature, and willingness to be  an" > active participant in ones fate. >   H I think you can find a number of thesis on probability theory that mightI help.  I also think that those with the knowledge, experience, intuition, J skill, and money can generally be successful in the market no matter where' the market goes - and will remain rich.   J The rest of us rely on luck, fear and greed.  Getting the balance right isL the hard part.  Did you happen to find someone with *good* advice instead ofI great BS skills (if he's that good why isn't he retired on his investment I acumen)?  Did you guess right about the market, a company, a stock, world E events?  Did you hold on too long hoping to be able to afford the new L Porche?  Or get out before all the insiders bailed out?  Did you get out too/ early and miss the tripling of your investment?   ) > > Life is about change.  I tell my boss G > > that I plan to retire still working for VMS - which should be 10-15  years  > > down the road. > I > Perhaps you shall. But perhaps not with the same employer, as the evens $ > since 1997 have shown is possible. >   I My *plan* is to retire from HP in 10-15 years.  We all need a plan.  That I doesn't mean that you exclude all other possibilities.  Or don't make any H contingency plans.  That would be foolish no matter who I worked for, orK what I did for a living.  My *plan* was to retire from DEC.  Things change.    > > ToJ > > me, analysts seem akin to film critics - they don't have the talent to doI > > it - so they critique it.  I used to work with a SW specialist in New  YorkJ > > who was a really bad SW specialist, he made an even worse analyst when he< > > went to work for one of those large, mostly wrong firms. > G > Not all are as you describe. I know many capable investment analysts, G > covering many industries, who had previously worked for many years in  those L > industries as talented engineers, corporate treasurers/financial analysts,J > research scientists, physicians, and many other roles. However, like allL > industries, there are ones you wouldn't listen to if your life depended onJ > it - I'll even go so far as to speculate that there are people like that3 > within HP too -all companies have some like that.  >   I Give me someone who does basic fundamental research.  Present me with the L facts and figures, and in general leave out "recommendations" about what theB company "should" do - unless the company is soliciting the advice.  H I have no problem listening to a talented engineer give an accessment ofJ technology that they are an expert in the field on (although the conundrumB is that if they were really talented wouldn't they make more moneyL engineering than giving advice?  Or is the advice worth more that the talentH to actually do the thing that you give advice about?).  But I don't knowJ that you should take my (for example, as a quasi-talented engineer) adviceL that Sun should switch to selling internet toasters, and merge with Gateway.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 19:21:53 GMT 9 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch1 Message-ID: <lF47b.4245$G85.291@news.cpqcorp.net>   A "Tim Llewellyn" <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message ) news:3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk...  >  >  > John Smith wrote:  > >  > L > In defence of Mr Smith, I would say that posting the sort of material that he does J > anonymously is undoubtedly less detrimental to his career prospects thanK > doing so openly. I doubt he puts on his resume "regularly posts to usenet , > using the name John Smith a@nonymous.com". > H > I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all. >   H 1) Why would you put anything about contributions to usenet on a resume?  C 2) There is an attraction to being accountable for what you say.  I H accidentally "insulted" someone in this forum in a moment of heat.  ThatJ reinforced to me that when you post as yourself, you have to be a bit moreJ careful.  As an anonymous poster, you can say what you think - but you canI also make things up, dissappear, insult people or whatever.  Without some L accountability, how can you test someones opinion?  Being anonymous, you canG simply stop posting, and assume a new identity when you are shown to be  wrong, or a liar, or worse.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 19:24:58 GMT 9 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch1 Message-ID: <eI47b.4246$WX4.613@news.cpqcorp.net>   8 "Rob Young" <young_r@encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:9Zsh1s0ZGyrp@eisner.encompasserve.org...    > B > No.  Not easily defended so time to bail.  I mean after all,  ifC > you are arguing ad verecundiam - and have chosen a source such as A > Walter Hewlett - you have to devote quite a bit of resources to 5 > defending/reforming such a source.  Easier to bail.  >   C I would rather avoid insulting, bad mouthing, or questioning Walter K Hewlett's motivations.  He seems to be OK to me.  But it doesn't mean he is J right (or wrong).  His financial interests may also differ from mine (mineE probably are more interested as HP as an employer, than HP as a stock  investment).   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 19:17:39 GMT 3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch2 Message-ID: <nB47b.4244$N95.1956@news.cpqcorp.net>  0 In article <3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk>, 6 Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:  G >I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all.   L To state the obvious: There is an awfully lot of missleading, contradictory,H and just plan WRONG informtion on the internet.  Information that cannotH be verified is not to be trusted.  If information posted in an anonyouseI fashion offers no verifiable source, that I woudl prefer not too have it.   J This is not intended to take or support any position regarding the subject at hand.   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 20:35:25 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch0 Message-ID: <3F5CE517.1F2C1494@blueyonder.co.uk>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > C > "Tim Llewellyn" <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message + > news:3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk...  > >  > >  > > John Smith wrote:  > > >  > > N > > In defence of Mr Smith, I would say that posting the sort of material that	 > he does L > > anonymously is undoubtedly less detrimental to his career prospects thanM > > doing so openly. I doubt he puts on his resume "regularly posts to usenet . > > using the name John Smith a@nonymous.com". > > J > > I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all. > >  > J > 1) Why would you put anything about contributions to usenet on a resume?  ` You put your name at the top. If you post with your real name potential employers can enter thatX in google either at pre or post interview stage. You might not get an interview because b of some slight error in a post a few years back, over-political posting, slagging off marketing orM somesuch. Don't laugh, I have had recent conversations about this effect with R two other regular non-anonymous posters here. Lurkers appear to be at an advantage when looking for work.   > E > 2) There is an attraction to being accountable for what you say.  I J > accidentally "insulted" someone in this forum in a moment of heat.  ThatL > reinforced to me that when you post as yourself, you have to be a bit moreL > careful.  As an anonymous poster, you can say what you think - but you canK > also make things up, dissappear, insult people or whatever.  Without some N > accountability, how can you test someones opinion?  Being anonymous, you canI > simply stop posting, and assume a new identity when you are shown to be  > wrong, or a liar, or worse.   I I do agree, but what does integrity and accountability really mean today?    regards    --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 15:54:38 -0500 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young) 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch3 Message-ID: <1dbQKozFDfd8@eisner.encompasserve.org>   g In article <3F5CE517.1F2C1494@blueyonder.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:  >  >  > Fred Kleinsorge wrote: >>  D >> "Tim Llewellyn" <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message, >> news:3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk... >> > >> > >> > John Smith wrote: >> > > >> >O >> > In defence of Mr Smith, I would say that posting the sort of material that 
 >> he doesM >> > anonymously is undoubtedly less detrimental to his career prospects than N >> > doing so openly. I doubt he puts on his resume "regularly posts to usenet/ >> > using the name John Smith a@nonymous.com".  >> >K >> > I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all.  >> > >>  K >> 1) Why would you put anything about contributions to usenet on a resume?  > b > You put your name at the top. If you post with your real name potential employers can enter thatZ > in google either at pre or post interview stage. You might not get an interview because d > of some slight error in a post a few years back, over-political posting, slagging off marketing orO > somesuch. Don't laugh, I have had recent conversations about this effect with T > two other regular non-anonymous posters here. Lurkers appear to be at an advantage > when looking for work. >   ? 	I had just the opposite experience.  Someone was impressed (or ? 	seemed to be) by the thousands of posts with my name attached. A 	Since groups.google.com "bubbles up" or ranks posts , several of = 	mine are near the top on certain subjects and have generated 4 	a number of emails as follow-up questions/concerns.   >>  F >> 2) There is an attraction to being accountable for what you say.  IK >> accidentally "insulted" someone in this forum in a moment of heat.  That M >> reinforced to me that when you post as yourself, you have to be a bit more M >> careful.  As an anonymous poster, you can say what you think - but you can L >> also make things up, dissappear, insult people or whatever.  Without someO >> accountability, how can you test someones opinion?  Being anonymous, you can J >> simply stop posting, and assume a new identity when you are shown to be >> wrong, or a liar, or worse. > K > I do agree, but what does integrity and accountability really mean today?  >   = 	Quite a bit.  Quite a bit indeed.  If you say something will @ 	be done and you do it, folks remember.  If you say you will fix, 	something and you do, folks remember.  etc.  O "Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are L ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gatheredM from thorn bushes, nor figs from thistles, are they? Even so, every good tree N bears good fruit; but the bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot produceM bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. So then, you will know them ! by their fruits." Matthew 7:15-18    				Rob    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 21:30:49 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch0 Message-ID: <3F5CF1BD.5ABB1E7B@blueyonder.co.uk>   Rob Young wrote: > i > In article <3F5CE517.1F2C1494@blueyonder.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:  > >  > >  > > Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > >>M > >> 1) Why would you put anything about contributions to usenet on a resume?  > > d > > You put your name at the top. If you post with your real name potential employers can enter that[ > > in google either at pre or post interview stage. You might not get an interview because f > > of some slight error in a post a few years back, over-political posting, slagging off marketing orQ > > somesuch. Don't laugh, I have had recent conversations about this effect with V > > two other regular non-anonymous posters here. Lurkers appear to be at an advantage > > when looking for work. > >  > H >         I had just the opposite experience.  Someone was impressed (orH >         seemed to be) by the thousands of posts with my name attached.J >         Since groups.google.com "bubbles up" or ranks posts , several ofF >         mine are near the top on certain subjects and have generated= >         a number of emails as follow-up questions/concerns.   A Recent experience? I must admit I am overanalyzing at the moment, A long term unemployment does that. I am wondering why I can't even S get an interview for an operator position at one of the few known local VMS shop's.   , I notice you don't post from work addresses.   >  > >>H > >> 2) There is an attraction to being accountable for what you say.  IM > >> accidentally "insulted" someone in this forum in a moment of heat.  That O > >> reinforced to me that when you post as yourself, you have to be a bit more O > >> careful.  As an anonymous poster, you can say what you think - but you can N > >> also make things up, dissappear, insult people or whatever.  Without someQ > >> accountability, how can you test someones opinion?  Being anonymous, you can L > >> simply stop posting, and assume a new identity when you are shown to be  > >> wrong, or a liar, or worse. > > M > > I do agree, but what does integrity and accountability really mean today?  > >  > F >         Quite a bit.  Quite a bit indeed.  If you say something willI >         be done and you do it, folks remember.  If you say you will fix 5 >         something and you do, folks remember.  etc.   H Hmmm, I had an interview for a support role last year, they had some VMSH legacy app and Windows. I think I blew the interview when I said I likedJ VMS because you can set it up so you KNOW who did what. I got the distinctJ impression that the business preferred, how shall I put it, more ambiguity
 in this area.   L As a counter example, look at M$. They said they had reviewed their code andF removed buffer overflow vulnerability. If they had they wouldn't stillI be issuing patches for buffer overflow vulberabilities by the bucketload. G Are senior IT people who pushed that cr*p loosing their jobs because of H the extra cost to their business of antiviral support and being replacedC by out of work VMS professionals? Was the NY blackout really caused  by Slammer?   O What about HP Gold service customers. If recent articles at www.theinquirer.net I are even only slightly truthful, they are going to start feeling very let  down very soon now.   O The real problem seems to be that the rules in director-/CEO-/stockbroker-land  P are very much different and being manipulated for short term personal advantage K rather than with any long term vision or responsibility. Can anyone say "UK % Rail debacle" after me, for starters?    > Q > "Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are N > ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gatheredO > from thorn bushes, nor figs from thistles, are they? Even so, every good tree P > bears good fruit; but the bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot produceO > bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. So then, you will know them # > by their fruits." Matthew 7:15-18  >   ( ? Lets keep religion out of comp.os.vms.   regards  --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:15:47 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch6 Message-ID: <00A259B5.4F309B74@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  h In article <nB47b.4244$N95.1956@news.cpqcorp.net>, hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) writes:1 >In article <3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk>, u7 >Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:y > H >>I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all. > M >To state the obvious: There is an awfully lot of missleading, contradictory, I >and just plan WRONG informtion on the internet.  Information that cannotrI >be verified is not to be trusted.  If information posted in an anonyousenJ >fashion offers no verifiable source, that I woudl prefer not too have it. >HK >This is not intended to take or support any position regarding the subject 	 >at hand.   J Although I'm not one of the people who have communicated offline with JohnE Smith, I don't consider him an anonymous or irrelevant poster.  He's  L maintained a consistent comp.os.vms persona for _years_.  C.O.V. is a littleJ different from much of Usenet since there are a bunch of posters who have H met at DECUS, worked together, provided phone support, etc, but being a K meatspace acquaintance of an existing c.o.v. member isn't a requirement to wJ be a contributor yourself.  "John" isn't a drive-by poster; he's concernedC for the future of VMS, he's consistent, and he's part of the group.l  L (And he's so consistent that we only know he's anonymous because he says so;J if he picked a less-intentionally-obvious fake name and email address, we ! really wouldn't be able to tell.)M   -- Alan: --  O =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056AM  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025sO ===============================================================================o   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 01:24:24 GMTo# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>e4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill LynchJ Message-ID: <cZ97b.424526$4UE.132292@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  @ "Charlie Hammond" <hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com> wrote in message, news:nB47b.4244$N95.1956@news.cpqcorp.net...1 > In article <3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk>,o8 > Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes: >nI > >I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all.e >e? > To state the obvious: There is an awfully lot of missleading,w contradictory,J > and just plan WRONG informtion on the internet.  Information that cannotJ > be verified is not to be trusted.  If information posted in an anonyouseK > fashion offers no verifiable source, that I woudl prefer not too have it.Q >uL > This is not intended to take or support any position regarding the subject
 > at hand.    G In general I agree. As you'll no doubt notice, whenever possible I haverG provided URL's or other attribution to the original sources and clearlyh7 stated what my opinions are, as opinions, not as facts.I    E Just an aside: Wrong can sometimes be just a matter of perspective orrE time/place. Pfeiffer wasn't wrong, unless you happen to be Ben Rosen.eE Melling was wrong, period. Curly...remember him? Only time will tell.-   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 02:05:59 GMT:# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>m4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill LynchJ Message-ID: <bAa7b.424563$4UE.150366@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  H ""Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr"" <winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>A wrote in message news:00A259B5.4F309B74@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU...i4 > In article <nB47b.4244$N95.1956@news.cpqcorp.net>,5 hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) writes:a2 > >In article <3F5CCD10.A2BE8DC@blueyonder.co.uk>,9 > >Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:t > >pJ > >>I would prefer to have his input in anonymous fashion than not at all. > >e@ > >To state the obvious: There is an awfully lot of missleading, contradictory,K > >and just plan WRONG informtion on the internet.  Information that cannottK > >be verified is not to be trusted.  If information posted in an anonyousetL > >fashion offers no verifiable source, that I woudl prefer not too have it. > > E > >This is not intended to take or support any position regarding the  subjectf > >at hand.a >lL > Although I'm not one of the people who have communicated offline with JohnF > Smith, I don't consider him an anonymous or irrelevant poster.  He'sG > maintained a consistent comp.os.vms persona for _years_.  C.O.V. is a  littleK > different from much of Usenet since there are a bunch of posters who have,I > met at DECUS, worked together, provided phone support, etc, but being amL > meatspace acquaintance of an existing c.o.v. member isn't a requirement toL > be a contributor yourself.  "John" isn't a drive-by poster; he's concernedE > for the future of VMS, he's consistent, and he's part of the group.y >sJ > (And he's so consistent that we only know he's anonymous because he says so; K > if he picked a less-intentionally-obvious fake name and email address, we # > really wouldn't be able to tell.)       K Alan, thank you for that post. I am a VMS fan/user since 1980, a former DEC L ISV partner, a source of many sales of DEC gear over the years, and a formerK regular poster/contributor in the long-since dead Compuserve VAX forum. ThenL constant carping about my remaining anonymous doesn't bother me. It's reallyJ only a couple of people who object, and those who would like to contact meE off-line need only ask (in case Fred needs a reminder, Sue and I havetI corresponded, as I have with others....and I think Ken Farmer finds me ansK interesting conversationalist on the telephone). Fred, if it makes you feel0H any better I'll change my posting name to Carly Fiorina and the reply-to* address to carly.fiorina@removethis.hp.com  E In this day and age of dwindling VMS customers and VMS opportunities,dJ coupled with a sadly conservative and 'politically correct' attitudes, andH ever invasive/intrusive government, a little anonimity is not such a bad thing.  K BTW, I have many years worth of the Compuserve forum threads still in theireK original threaded form that I really ought to convert to something that can.H be contributed someplace if for no other reason than historic curiosity,H although I suspect that Stu Fuller (one of the former sysops on CI$) hasK them as well. Speaking of CI$ and VAXforum, does anyone ever hear from Nicka de Smith these days?   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 02:09:04 GMTu# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>t4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill LynchJ Message-ID: <4Da7b.424567$4UE.332985@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  D "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> wrote in message, news:Qr47b.4242$H95.1232@news.cpqcorp.net... >e0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageE > news:IO37b.193157$_V.125489@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...s > >b > L > > Drug induced...caught up in the euphoria...lack of persective...whatever > youtJ > > want to call it. Some people made boatloads of money during the recentI > > downturn while others lost their shirts, some gained nor lost. How do  younH > > explain that? In general it is possible to ascribe those outcomes to	 > varying D > > degrees of education/training, understanding of human behaviour,J > > 'situational awareness', aggressive/passive nature, and willingness to be > an$ > > active participant in ones fate. > >  >hJ > I think you can find a number of thesis on probability theory that mightK > help.  I also think that those with the knowledge, experience, intuition, L > skill, and money can generally be successful in the market no matter where) > the market goes - and will remain rich.   K Setting stop loss orders and not being afraid to limit your gains (pigs getc$ fat, hogs get slaughtered) can help.    L > The rest of us rely on luck, fear and greed.  Getting the balance right isK > the hard part.  Did you happen to find someone with *good* advice insteado ofK > great BS skills (if he's that good why isn't he retired on his investment"K > acumen)?  Did you guess right about the market, a company, a stock, worldeG > events?  Did you hold on too long hoping to be able to afford the newtJ > Porche?  Or get out before all the insiders bailed out?  Did you get out too 1 > early and miss the tripling of your investment?t  5 Check out Exchange-traded index funds with low MER's.oF (Disclaimer - not intended to solicit orders or be construed as giving advice)t        + > > > Life is about change.  I tell my boss I > > > that I plan to retire still working for VMS - which should be 10-15a > yearsa > > > down the road. > >sK > > Perhaps you shall. But perhaps not with the same employer, as the evensr& > > since 1997 have shown is possible. > >. >yK > My *plan* is to retire from HP in 10-15 years.  We all need a plan.  ThataK > doesn't mean that you exclude all other possibilities.  Or don't make any J > contingency plans.  That would be foolish no matter who I worked for, orE > what I did for a living.  My *plan* was to retire from DEC.  Thingsu change.v >  > > > ToL > > > me, analysts seem akin to film critics - they don't have the talent to > doK > > > it - so they critique it.  I used to work with a SW specialist in New  > YorkL > > > who was a really bad SW specialist, he made an even worse analyst when > he> > > > went to work for one of those large, mostly wrong firms. > >aI > > Not all are as you describe. I know many capable investment analysts,II > > covering many industries, who had previously worked for many years in  > thosehD > > industries as talented engineers, corporate treasurers/financial	 analysts,OL > > research scientists, physicians, and many other roles. However, like allK > > industries, there are ones you wouldn't listen to if your life dependedh onL > > it - I'll even go so far as to speculate that there are people like that5 > > within HP too -all companies have some like that.o > >e >sK > Give me someone who does basic fundamental research.  Present me with theiJ > facts and figures, and in general leave out "recommendations" about what thenD > company "should" do - unless the company is soliciting the advice.  I Without expertise in the matter, armed with the information you requested C you'd just be making a W.A.G.  It may work out right, it might not.g    J > I have no problem listening to a talented engineer give an accessment ofL > technology that they are an expert in the field on (although the conundrumD > is that if they were really talented wouldn't they make more money! > engineering than giving advice?p  K It's partly the money, partly the ego, and in some cases a desire not to beoL the geologist camping in the bush year after year with mosquitos, scorpions,B snakes, or other creatures sharing your waking and sleeping hours.    - > Or is the advice worth more that the talentnJ > to actually do the thing that you give advice about?).  But I don't knowL > that you should take my (for example, as a quasi-talented engineer) adviceE > that Sun should switch to selling internet toasters, and merge withe Gateway.  K Eventually EVERY household will have an internet toaster. The same can't be K said for Sun Sparc boxes. If I were Sun, I'd re-tool the assembly line. ;-)c   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 21:36:02 -0500 - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch3 Message-ID: <FImXt6KIm$Wj@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  U In article <3F5CB1FC.1010105@MMaz.com>, "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> writes:. > Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > 0 >>"John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in messageD >>news:FL07b.191736$_V.46659@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... >>   >>J >>Anal-yst Yessir Imat-hief of the brokerage firm Dewey, Cheatum, and Howe >>   >>D > You must listen to Click and Clack, the Tappet Brothers on PBS :-)  B Around here (Boston, where it originates) I thought it was only on radio, NPR rather than PBS.n   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:20:53 -0500a+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)s4 Subject: Re: "HP breakup on the way" - Merrill Lynch3 Message-ID: <EExWEuqyiU1Y@eisner.encompasserve.org>e  p In article <bAa7b.424563$4UE.150366@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes: >   M > BTW, I have many years worth of the Compuserve forum threads still in theircM > original threaded form that I really ought to convert to something that can J > be contributed someplace if for no other reason than historic curiosity,J > although I suspect that Stu Fuller (one of the former sysops on CI$) hasM > them as well. Speaking of CI$ and VAXforum, does anyone ever hear from Nickn > de Smith these days?   	He popped in last year:  m http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=9bbbf474.0206190009.6bae99f1%40posting.google.com&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain   & From: nick@desmith.net (Nick de Smith) Newsgroups: comp.os.vms   Subject: Re: Hot new Itanic pics  Date: 19 Jun 2002 01:09:16 -0700    ! 	But Nick doesn't do VMS anymore:   p http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=950628447.2578.0.nnrp-09.c1edd378%40news.demon.co.uk&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain  6 From: "Nick de Smith" <nick@nick01.demon.co.uk.wombat>, Subject: Re: DECUS Europe - Change of Season Date: 2000/02/15  G Nick (who no longer even uses OpenVMS, though I keep 4 VAXen and 2 AXPscG running in my shed. They keep the humidity down and stop the tools from  rusting. Sad really...).   ---I   				Rob    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:10:31 GMTk From: healyzh@aracnet.comtV Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal+ Message-ID: <bjj5pn1lke@enews4.newsguy.com>n  9 In comp.os.vms Paul Sture <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote:n^ > In article <030920032053246189%elliott@yrl.co.uk>, Elliott Roper <elliott@yrl.co.uk> writes:0 > > ps. It's nice to see so many Mac+VMS people.  + > It's been a pleasant surprise for me too.-  L I've noticed an unusually high number of Mac Users on comp.os.vms, just likeG on the Mac OS X mailing list I'm on, there seem to be an unusually high  number of VMS users.   		Zane   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:16:00 GMTh From: healyzh@aracnet.comsV Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal+ Message-ID: <bjj6402lke@enews4.newsguy.com>   ? In comp.os.vms Thomas Dickey <dickey@saltmine.radix.net> wrote: ; > In comp.os.vms Paul Sture <p_sture@elias.decus.ch> wrote:"  J > > You mention "resource settings" and "translations resource" at several5 > > points in this and other threads found by Google.s  2 > > Can you please point me to where I find these?  P > offhand - I've not had to look for this information since I've been developingL > with X for about 15 years, and have my own offline resources - the manpageH > for the X server gives an overview of resource settings, and the xtermO > manpage gives details on its "translations" resource.  I've got some examplespI > in my xterm faq.  Looking for "translations" "resources" with google, It$ > see this page which looks helpful:  F > http://www.ccd.bnl.gov/xterminal/xterminal_support/vms_keyboard.html  > If you're talking about settings such as the following snipit:     HP-UX | Linux).     ${DECXTERM_EMULATOR:=/usr/bin/X11/xterm} \E                          -xrm 'xterm*VT100.Translations: #override\n\eE            <Key>BackSpace           :               string("\177")\n\oE       Shift<Key>F1                  :string("\033") string("[23~")\n\ E            <Key>F1                  :string("\033") string("[11~")\n\n  I This will not work with the Apple X11 kit.  Their 'xterm' is compilied soh, that it doesn't support the '-xrm' flag. :^(  L BTW, for anyone that needs a script that does this for other UNIX's I've got2 a copy at ftp://zane.brouhaha.com/pub/vms/vt100.sh  	 		   Zanec   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:26:00 GMT  From: healyzh@aracnet.comeV Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal+ Message-ID: <bjj6mo3lke@enews4.newsguy.com>i  " Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote: > Is xmodmap an option?   B > http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2003-July/025354.html  J I've learned since I posted wrote what is at the above URL that every timeH you restart X11, you have to remember to reload the .Xmodmap.  It's very7 annoying.  I really hope that X11 works better in 10.3.p   			Zaneh   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:30:03 GMTa From: healyzh@aracnet.comuV Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal+ Message-ID: <bjj6ub4lke@enews4.newsguy.com>t  D In comp.os.vms Craig A. Berry <craigberry@mac.com.spamfooler> wrote:. > FWIW, I've had pretty good luck with GLTerm:  ! > <http://www.pollet.net/GLterm/>e  F > It has some trouble with double-high, double-wide characters but is F > otherwise the most stable, VMS-friendly Mac OS X emulator I've used.  < If you don't mind paying for a terminal emulator, check out J "dataComet-Secure VX" from http://www.databeast.com/.  I've tried the demoK and it's really nice.  It's the only affordable solution that I've found torL fully support things such as double-high, double-wide characters and offer aL fully functional keypad.  One of these days I'm going to have to get a copy.   			Zanec   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:07:45 GMTP From: healyzh@aracnet.comeV Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal+ Message-ID: <bjj5kh0lke@enews4.newsguy.com>s  = In comp.os.vms Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@spamcop.net> wrote:lD > There are keys at the top of the keypad on my Apple Keyboard whereC > PF1-PF4 should be, but they do not send those codes.  F1-F4 would B > be all the way on the other end of the keyboard, if I had a less& > space-efficient keyboard from Apple.  G > Note that under OS 9.1 Reflections 2+ has no trouble honoring PF1-PF4o
 > keystrokes.m  L Unfortunatly the Apple xterm in their X11 implementation is missing a coupleE of options, so you can't remap the keyboard for just a single xterm.  L However, I've created an .Xmodmap file that remaps the keyboard under X11 toF have proper Keypad support (I can't live without it in EVE or Mail).     			Zane.   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 21:47:22 -0500t- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) V Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal3 Message-ID: <MYTx$MlAY3np@eisner.encompasserve.org>b  G In article <bjj5kh0lke@enews4.newsguy.com>, healyzh@aracnet.com writes: ? > In comp.os.vms Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@spamcop.net> wrote:lE >> There are keys at the top of the keypad on my Apple Keyboard whereeD >> PF1-PF4 should be, but they do not send those codes.  F1-F4 wouldC >> be all the way on the other end of the keyboard, if I had a lessa' >> space-efficient keyboard from Apple.h > H >> Note that under OS 9.1 Reflections 2+ has no trouble honoring PF1-PF4 >> keystrokes. > N > Unfortunatly the Apple xterm in their X11 implementation is missing a coupleG > of options, so you can't remap the keyboard for just a single xterm. t  E But I thought the Terminal utility (which is where I had the problem) ) did not use the Apple X11 implementation.o   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 03:46:00 GMT@ From: healyzh@aracnet.comcV Subject: Re: ??==Delete key only backspaces w/o delete from Telnet in Mac OSX Terminal, Message-ID: <bjjido01704@enews4.newsguy.com>  = In comp.os.vms Larry Kilgallen <Kilgallen@spamcop.net> wrote:dI > In article <bjj5kh0lke@enews4.newsguy.com>, healyzh@aracnet.com writes:iP > > Unfortunatly the Apple xterm in their X11 implementation is missing a coupleI > > of options, so you can't remap the keyboard for just a single xterm. l  G > But I thought the Terminal utility (which is where I had the problem)a+ > did not use the Apple X11 implementation.   F Terminal.app doesn't, I was talking about a work around.  UnfortunatlyJ Terminal.app seems to be one of the more brain dead terminal emulators out there.   			Zaneo   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 23:27:26 +0200n From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>@ Subject: Re: ANN: some new freeware and freeware updates for VMS2 Message-ID: <bjirbh$pm7$1@news1.tilbu1.nb.home.nl>   >  > XPDF v2.02pl1u@ > The fixes here were mainly in the build procedure (there is a G > configure.com that performs the VMS equivalent of GNU configure that  D > needed several updates) as well as some fixes to T1lib so that it J > correctly finds all of the font files XPDF tries to pass to it.  If you I > have ghostscript, edit the XPDFRC file to use the font files that come F> > with ghostscript and set the two variables t1libControl and K > freetypeControl to high (this is documented in the file).  Doing so will sG > cause XPDF to render anti-aliased fonts that look as nice as acrobat e > reader does on the PC. > K > All of the packages build without error on any supported version of VMS.  I >  I do not have the resources to test on earlier versions.  However, if  H > you try to build them on earlier versions and they don't work, let me 6 > know what errors you get and I will try to fix them. >  > Mark Berrymanh >   M Thanks for all of your efforts Mark (And I was still able to to use the only sI true way we should use to get this stuff: COPY with DECnet over IP!!) :-)n  M However I did run into some problems when I tried to UNzip, compile and link:   P With UNzip I got several warnings/questions about overwriting existing (already H unzipped) files. Did you use the /VMS switch when you zipped the stuff ?  P ********************************************************************************  * With freetype I got the following warning:  1 CC /include=([--.include],[--.src.type1]) TYPE1.Ci          if ( len <= 0 ) ...........^N %CC-I-QUESTCOMPARE, In this statement, the unsigned expression "len" is being M compared with a relational operator to a constant whose value is not greater a0 than zero.  This might not be what you intended.P at line number 428 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.FREETY PE-2_1_3.SRC.TYPE1]T1LOAD.C;1o  P ********************************************************************************  ' T1LIB produced these errors / warnings:g  P cc /prefix=all/float=ieee_float/define=(T1LIB_IDENT="""1.3""",GLOBAL_CONFIG_DIR=@ """T1_FONT_DIR""",T1_AA_TYPE16="short",T1_AA_TYPE32="int") t1env  +          T1_PFAB_ptr[i+1]=T1_PFAB_ptr[i--];p	 ........^eP %CC-W-UNDEFVARFETCH, In this statement, the expression "T1_PFAB_ptr[i+1]=T1_PFABP _ptr[i--]" modifies "i", and fetches its value in a computation that is not usedQ   to produce the modified value without an intervening sequence point.  This beha3 vior is undefined.P at line number 812 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.T1LIB- 1_3.LIB.T1LIB]T1ENV.C;2e  )          T1_AFM_ptr[i+1]=T1_AFM_ptr[i--];.	 ........^ P %CC-W-UNDEFVARFETCH, In this statement, the expression "T1_AFM_ptr[i+1]=T1_AFM_pP tr[i--]" modifies "i", and fetches its value in a computation that is not used tP o produce the modified value without an intervening sequence point.  This behavi or is undefined.P at line number 849 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.T1LIB- 1_3.LIB.T1LIB]T1ENV.C;2   )          T1_ENC_ptr[i+1]=T1_ENC_ptr[i--];a	 ........^ P %CC-W-UNDEFVARFETCH, In this statement, the expression "T1_ENC_ptr[i+1]=T1_ENC_pP tr[i--]" modifies "i", and fetches its value in a computation that is not used tP o produce the modified value without an intervening sequence point.  This behavi or is undefined.P at line number 886 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.T1LIB- 1_3.LIB.T1LIB]T1ENV.C;2   '        T1_FDB_ptr[i+1]=T1_FDB_ptr[i--];n ......^sP %CC-W-UNDEFVARFETCH, In this statement, the expression "T1_FDB_ptr[i+1]=T1_FDB_pP tr[i--]" modifies "i", and fetches its value in a computation that is not used tP o produce the modified value without an intervening sequence point.  This behavi or is undefined.P at line number 1014 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.T1LIB -1_3.LIB.T1LIB]T1ENV.C;2    :      { char *p= strrchr(FullPathName, DIRECTORY_SEP_CHAR); .......................^E %CC-W-UNINIT1, The scalar variable "FullPathName" is fetched but not iQ initialized.  And there may be other such fetches of this variable that have not o" been reported in this compilation.P at line number 564 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.T1LIB- 1_3.LIB.T1LIB]T1ENV.C;2i  P ********************************************************************************  ! XPM-3_4K ended with this problem:    Building XPMlib ...  lib/crea libxpm.olb *.objvJ CC  /prefix=all/define=(NEED_STRCASECMP,NEED_STRDUP,NO_ZPIPE) [-.sxpm]sxpm   #include <X11/xpm.h> .^P %CC-F-NOINCLFILEF, Cannot find file <X11/xpm.h> specified in #include directive.P at line number 47 in file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[DOWNLOAD_KITS.xpdf-2-02-p11-mvb.XPM-3_4 K.SXPM]SXPM.C;1l  P ********************************************************************************   So not all seems to be ok...       Regards, Dirk   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 15:03:30 -0700 0 From: Mark Berryman <Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com>@ Subject: Re: ANN: some new freeware and freeware updates for VMS' Message-ID: <3f5c9a43$1@cpns1.saic.com>h   Dirk Munk wrote: >  >> >> XPDF v2.02pl1A >> The fixes here were mainly in the build procedure (there is a  H >> configure.com that performs the VMS equivalent of GNU configure that E >> needed several updates) as well as some fixes to T1lib so that it  G >> correctly finds all of the font files XPDF tries to pass to it.  If eI >> you have ghostscript, edit the XPDFRC file to use the font files that  D >> come with ghostscript and set the two variables t1libControl and G >> freetypeControl to high (this is documented in the file).  Doing so nE >> will cause XPDF to render anti-aliased fonts that look as nice as i! >> acrobat reader does on the PC.  >>G >> All of the packages build without error on any supported version of iC >> VMS.  I do not have the resources to test on earlier versions.   H >> However, if you try to build them on earlier versions and they don't D >> work, let me know what errors you get and I will try to fix them. >> >> Mark Berryman >> > J > Thanks for all of your efforts Mark (And I was still able to to use the G > only true way we should use to get this stuff: COPY with DECnet over l > IP!!) :-)u > J > However I did run into some problems when I tried to UNzip, compile and  > link:> > I > With UNzip I got several warnings/questions about overwriting existing >H > (already unzipped) files. Did you use the /VMS switch when you zipped 
 > the stuff ?e  C Oops.  My mistake.  I neglected to mention that the zip files were cH created with the -w switch and that you must specify the -V switch when F unpacking.  I kept the original of all files and my edited version is F simply a later version of the same file.  If you unzip without the -V 2 switch you will end up using the unedited version.  A I will amend each of the readme files to include this instuction.   
 Mark Berrymant   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:13:27 +0800m, From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>- Subject: Re: Backup/Copy tree with alias filer- Message-ID: <87k78jl0m0.fsf@prep.synonet.com>r  0 spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) writes:  B > So why not have the initial cluster code use [SYSn.foo] and then@ > [VMS$COMMON.foo] ? (Substitute VMS$COMMON with whatever it was > called back then.)  6 > The question remains: Why is [VMS$COMMON] aliased as > [SYSn.SYSCOMMON]?.  : Because untill (sort of) recently, [VMS$COMMON...] may not9 exist on the disk at all. It is only recently that it hasl become standard.  B Oh, and because you may have moved the contents of [VMS$COMMON...]> to your [SYSn.SYSCOMMON...] so as to replace the lot, as in anA upgrade or the like. So [VMS$] et al may not exist at the moment,m' or is may be the WRONG syscommon stuff.k   -- s< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 18:47:24 -0000f4 From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> Subject: Re: BCC086 Message-ID: <20030908184724.16756.qmail@gacracker.org>  B On Mon, 08 Sep 2003, "warren sander" <warren.sander@hp.com> wrote:% >I think what you are referring to isa0 >http://h71000.www7.hp.com/wizard/padapters.html   No, this was quite different.   J >if there is another let me know (I couldn't get the waybackmachine url to >work either). If therekI >is some historic things that need saving I try to put them in the wizardn >area.. (look at the left nav).b5 >the padapters page has been there for 4 or 5 years..t  J Here's a copy I retrieved out of my Browser cache - the Wayback URLs would+ need trimmed to make the # references work.e  * http://vmsbox.cjb.net/VMS/Cable-guide.html     Doc. --  K OpenVMS.         Eight out of ten hackers prefer *other* operating systems. K [PGP Key via finger]     http://openvms-rocks.com     http://vmsbox.cjb.nets   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 21:36:18 -0000e4 From: wspencer@ap.org.nospam.please (Warren Spencer)? Subject: Can an OpenVMS program access a DB2 database directly?y/ Message-ID: <vlptiig6huo013@news.supernews.com>    Hi,   H We're looking to alter one of our OpenVMS applications such that it can H have full access to a DB2 database located on another machine.  By full J access, I mean the usual insert/update/delete/select functions, and full  I distributed transaction support.  I'll also need a C pre-compiler (for C h programs with embedded SQL).  E IBM (pre-sales tech support) told me on the phone today they have no  I client-side tools for OpenVMS.  Would anyone out there know if there are r- are 3rd party tools that could do this job?  o   Many thanks!   ws   Warren Spencer' Senior Software Engineer (not a writer)o The Associated Press   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 12:40:55 -0500w; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) . Subject: Re: Choosing between ASTs and Threads3 Message-ID: <nRhQIvm$3yv9@eisner.encompasserve.org>b  a In article <jv9plv4s1kdgdra6h07c6aorljrcqsk1et@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes:dL > On 8 Sep 2003 08:06:43 -0500, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob > Koehler) wrote:b >  >  >>G >>   You use threads when there's significant parallel work that can behC >>   done and the synchronization techniques provided by the threade >>   package suffice.  > F > Not having done any thread programming, I'll ask what may be a sillyI > question:  Can you use the lock manager to synchronize threads for somenK > activities?  For example, when pulling work off the queue, can one thread I > lock the queue to prevent multiple threads from stepping on each other?s > F    Generally, no.  Either your process has the lock or it doesn't (VMSH    DLM locks).  There's no mechanism to distinguish what thread in your     process has it.  8    Thread packages provide their own locking mechanisms.   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 21:32:40 -0500h- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) . Subject: Re: Choosing between ASTs and Threads3 Message-ID: <H3VcbA67ACL6@eisner.encompasserve.org>s  q In article <nRhQIvm$3yv9@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:tc > In article <jv9plv4s1kdgdra6h07c6aorljrcqsk1et@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes:nM >> On 8 Sep 2003 08:06:43 -0500, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bobo >> Koehler) wrote: >>   >>   >>>.H >>>   You use threads when there's significant parallel work that can beD >>>   done and the synchronization techniques provided by the thread >>>   package suffice. >> MG >> Not having done any thread programming, I'll ask what may be a silly0J >> question:  Can you use the lock manager to synchronize threads for someL >> activities?  For example, when pulling work off the queue, can one threadJ >> lock the queue to prevent multiple threads from stepping on each other? >> eH >    Generally, no.  Either your process has the lock or it doesn't (VMSJ >    DLM locks).  There's no mechanism to distinguish what thread in your  >    process has it.  K Generally yes you _can_, since which thread has the lock need only be knownt! by the thread which has the lock.   : >    Thread packages provide their own locking mechanisms.  C Which likely will be more efficient if you are certain the resourcei> will always be in use by another thread from the same process.   ------------------------------   Date: 08 Sep 2003 21:47:19 GMT) From: Tony Arnold <tony.arnold@man.ac.uk>n7 Subject: Re: copy bootable CD to disk and boot from it? 9 Message-ID: <3f5cf8e6$0$273$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com>   Q Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply <helbig@astro.multiclothesvax.de> wrote:wI > I'm trying to figure out the best way to upgrade VAX systems with no CDeF > drive on them.  (OK, in the long run I'll probably have every systemG > disk a shadow set and just do one upgrade on a system with a CD drive F > then upgrade the other systems by using the new disk as a new shadowI > master, but that's in the future for now.)  Can I do an image backup ofcJ > the distribution CD to a disk then boot from this disk as if it were the@ > CD (i.e. get into the menu etc)?  (Even though it might not beH > supported, I know I can copy the .% savesets to disk and upgrade from K > that, but I'd like to avoid that hassle.)  Would this also work on ALPHA I= > in the event I don't have a (working) CD drive on a system?A  F Assuming you have plenty of space on the boot disk of the VAX, you canE copy the the VMS save-sets from the CD to [000000] of the system disk=A and invoke VMSINSTAL telling it where to find the save-sets. This C assumes, you can mount the CD on some other machine in your cluster:E and copy the files accross. Oh, if you need DECwindows, you will have$  to copy those save-sets as well.  C I'm not sure, but you may be able to copy the save-sets to any disk A that is directly attached to the VAX, but I think they must be inc% [000000] for upgrading of VMS itself.o   Tony.l -- yF Tony Arnold, Deputy to the Head of COS Division, Manchester Computing,: University of Manchester, Oxford Road, Manchester M13 9PL.F T: +44 (0)161 275 6093, F: +44 (0)870 136 1004, M: +44 (0)773 330 0039E E-mail: tony.arnold@man.ac.uk, Home: http://www.man.ac.uk/Tony.Arnolda   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 17:55:22 GMTn# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>i9 Subject: Current events put to good use by some companieshF Message-ID: <eo37b.192980$_V.859@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  I http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=14400036s  G Imagine that, an 'article' about DR document management, published in anK widely read and respected IT magazine, written by people who just happen tot& work for a document managment company.  K Do you think HP could do the same to highlight VMS DR/cluster capabilities?n Nah.  K I'm beginning to think that the role of VMS marketing and advertising oughteH to be renamed to "The Department for Making Up T-shirts for Carly's Next Visit".m  J How many of you have seen 'Bowling For Columbine'? Maybe VMS marketing canL do a deal with Citibank in NYC - instead of giving away rifles/shotguns with@ each account opened,  give away VMS systems instead???  very ;-)   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 17:46:25 GMTO# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>N/ Subject: Dell to double the size of his companyhH Message-ID: <Rf37b.192928$_V.56123@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  J ***** All are areas where VMS scalability and managability can be pitched.       New Worlds To Conquers  K For Michael Dell to double the size of his company, he'll need to move intoe9 new markets held by rivals that promise tough competitiond    & By Larry Greenemeier,  InformationWeek
 Sept. 8, 2003h URL:I http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=14500034n      J Michael Dell is determined to conquer new markets as he grows his namesakeL company into a $60 billion business. But the quest to nearly double the sizeE of the $35 billion-a-year computer-products vendor won't be easy. TheoH company needs to keep increasing its market share in Intel-based PCs andI servers, yet grab a greater piece of the market for handhelds, networkingeF equipment, printers, and storage devices--things customers used to buy2 elsewhere and then attach to Dell PCs and servers.  G It took Michael Dell from 1984, when he started his computer company ineK college, until 2001 to become the world's No. 1 PC maker. It now has aroundeK 18% of the worldwide PC market; Hewlett-Packard is No. 2 with about 16%. InoF the United States, Dell has a 31% market share compared with HP's 19%,K research firm Gartner says. Dell became a major player in the server marketoG more quickly. It launched a line of Intel-based servers in 1996 and nowsK ships more than any other company, although HP and IBM, with their high-endp7 Unix machines, are still the leaders in server revenue.a  L But Dell needs to succeed in new areas if it's to reach its ambitious growthG goals. And it faces tough competitors: HP dominates the printer market,sI Cisco Systems owns the networking market, and other vendors sit on top ofnL the markets for handhelds and storage devices. But Dell, which is famous forE controlling every step of the product-development, manufacturing, andrK delivery process, has shown a willingness to adopt new tactics to penetrateeL new markets. It partnered with Cisco to enter the networking market but thenI turned on the market-leading networking company and offered a competitive J product. It works with Lexmark International Inc. on printers and with EMCJ Corp. in storage. To highlight its shifting focus, the company changed its2 name in July from Dell Computer Corp. to Dell Inc.  H Michael Dell sees plenty of room for growth. "As we look across the $800B billion IT market, there are lots of opportunities," he says. "TheJ fastest-growing areas have been enterprise servers, storage, and services,E not to mention some of the new areas--networking, printers, PDAs, andt projectors."  L Of course, Dell isn't ignoring PCs and servers. To boost sales of enterpriseD servers, Dell advocates a strategy he calls "scale out," which urgesJ businesses to use clusters of low-cost Intel servers as the foundations ofJ their IT infrastructures. "What we're talking about is aggregating all theJ computing power and being able to dynamically allocate resources amongst aG pool of shared servers," Dell says. "Scale out is really leveraging thedF high-volume, industry-standard economics of microprocessor chip- sets,K high-volume disk drives, and other components built in hundreds of millions1; of units per year to run large databases and applications."   I That approach runs counter to the server-consolidation strategies of manyoJ companies. "We don't have a fear of adding capacity," says Mark Thomas, anJ IT director at Progressive Corp., "but we don't want to necessarily followD this [scale-out] model in the Intel environment." Progressive is theJ nation's third-largest seller of vehicle insurance and the top provider of9 motorcycle insurance, with $9 billion in sales last year./  F Still, Progressive and Dell have a strong relationship. Progressive ITJ managers meet regularly with Randy Groves, VP and chief technology officerL for Dell's product group, and other Dell executives to discuss product plansI and technology needs. Over the past several years, Progressive has boughtaF hundreds of Dell servers and PCs. *****Progressive's IT staff worries,G however, that Dell's scale-out approach could create a proliferation of L servers, which would increase management complexity and cost. "We've broughtD this up to them, and they say they're working on it," says Joe Self,1 director of Progressive's client enterprise.*****f  G Michael Dell argues that clusters of low-cost servers can do just aboutnF anything that larger, and more expensive, servers can do. Orange SA, aL British telecommunications provider, in May moved its database of 13 millionL customers from a RISC-based Sun Microsystems platform to four Dell PowerEdgeE 6650 Xeon servers running Oracle9i and Red Hat Inc.'s Linux operatingu system.e  J The real growth for Dell, however, needs to come from newer markets, where? the company will try to apply its highly efficient just-in-timebJ manufacturing model to undercut competitors' prices. That approach invitesC rivals' criticism of Dell for failing to spend much on research and J development and for not introducing innovative technology. Even customers,G Progressive's Self among them, acknowledge that Dell isn't a technologyeC leader. Instead, Self says, Dell skillfully plays a waiting game totJ determine when it should enter a market. "When you get their product, it's pretty well proven," he says.o  J That's just fine by Progressive, which uses Dell products to make sure itsJ call-center workers get access to information from all channels, includingK the Web, E-mail, and phones. Claims adjusters use wireless devices that letiH them file reports from the field. "We rely on data to determine industryI trends before our competitors do," Self says. "This has been particularly L important since the insurance downturn of 2000." Progressive supports Dell'sI move into new markets, in particular the IT vendor's storage area networkiL and network-attached storage technology. Storage is the fastest-growing partE of Dell's enterprise business. That's thanks largely to the company'slL ability to ship storage capacity in high volume along with its servers, saysK Yankee Group senior analyst Jamie Gruener. For Dell's second quarter, endedpK July 31, the company shipped an average of 486 terabytes of capacity daily,eJ up 91% from the second quarter a year ago. The amount of nonserver storageG capacity shipped grew 74% year over year, far outpacing the rest of the K storage industry, which grew 49% from the second quarter of 2002, accordinghC to IDC. Last year, Dell's storage business did $1 billion in sales.e  I The next step for Dell is to figure out how to succeed in the broader SANeL market. While Dell can "ride the price curve as low as possible" to grow, itG has to address the complexity of more-advanced storage systems, GruenermE says. HP, IBM, and Network Appliance may have all been hurt by Dell'stL entrance into the storage market, which made price competition much tougher.E But Dell is at a disadvantage against the incumbents when it comes tolL software, because it offers few software products. "And that's where storage1 technology is increasingly moving," Gruener says.n  L Another challenge for Dell will be to keep its relationship with EMC cordialL as it grows in the storage market. By working together on products, EMC madeI it possible for Dell to jump into the storage market quickly. But if Dell H cuts prices far enough, that could hurt EMC's margins. "There might be a? time when the relationship doesn't work anymore," Gruener says.h  I "Dell is really getting in touch with what helps them win deals or what'scK keeping them from winning deals," says Stephen Elliot, IDC's senior analyst-L of network management. Last month, Dell moved beyond simply being a providerD of Ethernet switches and added management software to its networkingL portfolio. That product, OpenManage Network Manager, centralizes the abilityK to configure and manage PowerConnect switches and will be bundled with Delld switches at no additional cost.m  L Dell's strength in the PC, server, and storage markets continues to pave theL way for the company's success in new areas. The company reported a profit ofK $621 million on revenue of $9.8 billion for its second quarter. This was updL from a profit of $501 million on revenue of $8.5 billion in the same quarterJ a year ago. Dell expects third-quarter unit sales volume to grow more than 25%.  H Intervet Inc., the U.S. operating division of veterinary-pharmaceuticalsD company Intervet International, has standardized on Cisco networkingH equipment, but that hasn't stopped it from buying four Dell PowerConnectI switches. Like many of Dell's customers, Intervet first got hooked on theaH company a few years ago through Dell's low-cost PCs and servers. "Dell'sG move into more markets does make the company more appealing," says ChadyG Elliott, Intervet's technology team leader. "It really cuts down on theoI finger pointing between vendors and provides a single point of contact inu the event of a problem."  E Intervet has more than 700 Dell PCs and 40 Dell servers, and plans tonK replace another 100 Compaq PCs and 15 servers with Dell products by the end I of the year. Elliott doesn't base buying decisions on whether a vendor is.J No. 1 in its market as long as the vendor proves it will be around for theC long haul and is making the right decisions to help Intervet remain9 competitive.  G Dell is gaining ground in the PDA market. It has been working with GoodcJ Technology Inc. since April to deliver wireless handhelds that synchronizeI with not only personal E-mail, contact, and calendar information but alsouC customer-relationship-management, enterprise-resource-planning, and(K sales-force-automation data stored on company servers. Dell, which has beennK in the handheld/PDA market since November, owns 20% of the PocketPC market,rE well behind rival HP, says Tim Mattox, Dell's VP of marketing for thee) company's worldwide client product group.r  L In late March, Dell, making good on last fall's promise to enter the printerI market, began taking orders for a line of printers and cartridges made in.I partnership with Lexmark. In June, Dell introduced its high-end Workgroup0J Laser Printer M5200n for $999. During the second half of 2002, HP held 56%J of the U.S. printer market, followed by Lexmark at 18%. Intervet's ElliottJ says Dell's situation in the printer market is similar to its place in theJ networking market. "They still don't have the heavy-duty workhorse to take on the market leader," he says.   I That may be true. But Michael Dell can afford to take the slow and steady0F approach as he develops the right product mix to turn his company intoK something more than a PC and server vendor. "Probably the best indicator ofnH whether something is working or not is, do people actually buy it?" Dell$ says. "People are buying our stuff."   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 19:49:53 -0400  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>' Subject: Re: Do we need a DCL debugger?a5 Message-ID: <1030908194653.3498A-100000@Ives.egh.com>w  ! On 8 Sep 2003, Bob Koehler wrote:e  L > In article <bjhkuj$51t$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>, david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes: > > P > > Personally I see absolutely no need for an FTP listing to be sorted by date 
 > > or size.  Q > > If you want this so desperately then you are free to submit your own proposalo7 > > for a new RFC. With the RFC process you are "them".n > H >    I do.  I've used it often with GUI FTP clients.  That's why I thinkI >    there should be an addition to the RFC to provide it.  I don't thinkrD >    the current trend of parsing what is meant to be human readable3 >    output should ever be expected to be bug free./  K Exactly.  Not to denigrate the hard work done to make Mozilla 1.5 work withrG all the VMS FTP servers (BTW, did they try MadGoat?) but that must have7+ felt unnecessarily painful to all involved.s   -- \ John Santos" Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 22:56 CDT' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)s' Subject: Re: Do we need a DCL debugger?a, Message-ID: <8SEP200322564513@gerg.tamu.edu>  1 Marc Van Dyck <marc.vandyck@brutele.be> writes...t }Another few suggestions :A }- DCL language definition for LSE - get the DCl procedures right : }  from start, rather than have to debug them afterwards ! }  }Marc.   LSE already comes with this.   See LSE$EXAMPLE:DCL.LSE    --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 22:51:17 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) 5 Subject: Re: Documentation for $setenv system service52 Message-ID: <FJ77b.4272$ew5.2625@news.cpqcorp.net>  ` In article <BB7BE7BE.B4F4%JCam90502@jcameron.com>, Jeff Cameron <JCam90502@jcameron.com> writes:A :Can anyone provide documentation for the $setenv system service?   C   Yes, but you should be able to figure it out from the headers and0B   from the sys$getenv call -- I've covered this call in several of   my presentations, as well.  -   It will not do what you want here, however.@  B :I have a need to update the LCD display. Is there another method?  B   That depends highly on which OpenVMS version and which platform.  @   Various of the AlphaServer systems have a fairly difficult andB   involved path to get out onto the bus where the operator control?   panel (OCP) is connected, and consequently no easy way at them?   OCP except through the system console.  I'm fairly sure there >   have been previous discussions of the I2C bus, for instance.  D   There is no particular consistency in OCP implementation, as well.D   (Different systems will require different user-written code to getC   at the panel, assuming there is no existing driver call that will    let you at the OCP.)  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 15:18:26 -0500b( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)# Subject: FOCUS replacement with SQLe1 Message-ID: <03090815182624@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>i  N Does anyone have experience with migrating off of FOCUS to application SQL (orD other application) and would care to share that experience with me?    (sounds kind of 60'ish I know!)n    N I am looking for ideas to replace FOCUS with a cheaper solution.  We are using CODASYL (DBMS32) on VMS V7.2-1.    TIAa           J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*no VMS Systems Administratort* firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 20:37:43 GMT2' From: Don Sykes <anonymous@pacbell.net>r% Subject: Re: ftp/ucx timeout setting? + Message-ID: <3F5CE950.777A52CA@pacbell.net>    Mike wrote:l >  > Hi,D > P > I'm having a problem w/ a W2K to VMS ftp connection timing out on the VMS end. >  > Here's what we're running :  > @ > Digital TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V4.2 - ECO 4< >   on a AlphaServer 4100 5/466 4MB running OpenVMS V6.2-1H3 > L > Is there a logical or something I can set to control the timeout settings?    H If you mean timing out due to idle conditions, the I think the following should work:  + define/sys TCPIP$FTP_IDLETIMEOUT "hh:mm:ss"c then restart FTP via:  @sys$manager:tcpip$ftp_shutdown  @sys$manager:tcpip$ftp_startup  F If you mean timeout during a transfer, you might look into the account= limitations on the account you logged in as, particulary the:u@ CPU, BIOlm, DIOlm and Bytlm which could all be problematic here.   --     Have VMS, Will Traveli Wire paladin, San Francisco-   (paladinATalphaseDOTcom)   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 22:23:46 +0100y  From: David Gray <blah@blah.com>2 Subject: Re: How to set timeout for MOUNT/NOASSIST8 Message-ID: <jnsplvofli9rlafn3arik1sfirbj7tdar5@4ax.com>   Hi,    Thanks to all who answered.  5  D If the time taken for a mount/noassist to fail is indeed part of theC image then I'll just work around it.  Just thought there might be a D way to make the command fail immediatley if no tape was found in the drive. u   Cheers,  	David.   8 On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 17:02:36 +0000 (UTC), Michael Moroney <moroney@TheWorld.com> wrote:   7 >brad@.gateway.2wire.net (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:. >nb >>In article <fj2plvsv58cp8g3jrbs7sg4tmn6kc6b8pg@4ax.com>, David Gray <police@spamcop.net> writes: >>!Greetings all,  >>!-F >>!Just knocking up a simple bit of DCL to see if SDLT tapes have beenA >>!mounted in the correct drives.  Issuing the following command u >>!s  >>!$ mount/noassist dev lab log  >>!sE >>!I get a %MOUNT-F-MEDOFL, medium is offline message after two mins.n >>!How do I change this value? i > M >>Unless I'm greatly mistaken, that value is MVTIMEOUT in SYSGEN; its defaulte >>value is 3600 seconds. > F >No, MVTIMEOUT is the time that an already-mounted disk that goes intoJ >mount verify has to recover.  If it is exceeded it goes into Mount Verify. >Timeout state and outstanding IOs are failed. >tD >I think the time Mount gives to mount a disk/tape with noassist is ; >compiled into the mount image and is not easily changable.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 21:57:41 -0500e1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>l2 Subject: Re: How to set timeout for MOUNT/NOASSIST' Message-ID: <3F5D41A5.F14DCA75@fsi.net>    David Gray wrote:w >  > Hi,  >  > Thanks to all who answered.v > F > If the time taken for a mount/noassist to fail is indeed part of theE > image then I'll just work around it.  Just thought there might be afF > way to make the command fail immediatley if no tape was found in the > drive.  B Perhaps one of the resident SCSI wizards can suggest a way to test device ready from a program.   -- p David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsg http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho//   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 03:25:19 GMT*- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>*2 Subject: Re: How to set timeout for MOUNT/NOASSIST< Message-ID: <zKb7b.38835$Nc.9466946@news1.news.adelphia.net>   David Gray wrote:. > Hi,  >  > Thanks to all who answered.  t > F > If the time taken for a mount/noassist to fail is indeed part of theE > image then I'll just work around it.  Just thought there might be abF > way to make the command fail immediatley if no tape was found in the	 > drive. 2  H I do not work with the tape code, but I have used the mount/noassist on E tapes at a previous employer, and it would fail immediately with the dG drives that I used if there were no tape in them.  I never noticed any ( delay.  # I never used the SDLT tapes though._  I It may be a characteristic of the tape model or something else.  You may BB wish to make sure that you have the more current ECO installed of A course, and otherwise log a support call through formal channels.m  G I always used that on the backup procedures to verify that the correct pJ tape was inserted.  This way my DCL procedures could diagnose the problem.   -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion OnlyS   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 13:47:16 -0700.1 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) . Subject: HP Education Services teaches OpenVMS= Message-ID: <cf15391e.0309081247.7d243975@posting.google.com>   C After having seen Digital sell Digital Learning Services during thec@ early '90s, and seeing OpenVMS training relegated to 3rd partiesE (albeit excellent ones), it was encouraging to me to see HP EducationNF Services start offering OpenVMS training courses immediately after the( merger, and quite a few of them at that.  ' See http://www.hp.com/learn/openvms/ ort  http://education.hp.com/openvms/   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 01:17:55 GMTh# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>i2 Subject: Re: HP Education Services teaches OpenVMSJ Message-ID: <7T97b.424512$4UE.118490@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  > "Keith Parris" <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:cf15391e.0309081247.7d243975@posting.google.com...EE > After having seen Digital sell Digital Learning Services during the B > early '90s, and seeing OpenVMS training relegated to 3rd partiesG > (albeit excellent ones), it was encouraging to me to see HP EducationeH > Services start offering OpenVMS training courses immediately after the* > merger, and quite a few of them at that. > ) > See http://www.hp.com/learn/openvms/ orp" > http://education.hp.com/openvms/  J The best deal going was from Digital back in the early 90's when you couldI take unlimited training, on any course Digital offered for any product orcI language, for a flat fee of something like $4-5k per year per named user.tJ Great for getting newbies up to speed on VMS, Rdb, ACMS, and a language or two.   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 21:41:40 -0500*- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)KC Subject: Re: Limit Processor utilisation per user (Class Scheduler)l3 Message-ID: <Jau04An+mbkL@eisner.encompasserve.org>D  a In article <%137b.4227$EW4.2154@news.cpqcorp.net>, "warren sander" <warren.sander@hp.com> writes:x  < > "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote in message/ > news:IWDpaL07wtcy@eisner.encompasserve.org...XD >> In article <3f5ba886$0$49108$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>, "AWN_VSIS"+ > <anty_SPAM_email_adres@email.com> writes:n >>G >> > Is it possible to limit a user tot a maximum of for example 30% of-= >> > processing time on an Alpha800 running OPEN VMS 7.1.2 ??a >>J >> You need to look for "Class Scheduler" in the documentation.  There areH >> two different ways to do it, both too complex to avoid looking at the= >> documentation.  The Master Index is (usually) your friend.n  ? > Class Scheduler is defined in the 'system managers reference'tK > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/731FINAL/6017/6017pro_023.html#index_x_1185a& > and points to the sysman commands in  > the system managers utilities:K > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/731FINAL/6048/6048pro_067.html#index_x_1947f  @ That would take care of the pre-built utility method of control.  = For the older "roll-your-own" more dynamic method, check out:h  D http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/731FINAL/4527/4527pro_095.html#jun_469  D Don't try to use both methods at the same time (on the same system).   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 13:18:53 -0700e. From: mejde@dtek.chalmers.se (Martin Ejdestig)K Subject: Missing bytes and buffer overrun when reading with terminal driver = Message-ID: <4687034c.0309081218.39e4ad5c@posting.google.com>o  J Why do I sporadically miss bytes when reading from a port in the followingK way [1]? I would expect malformed data if it's a setup issue, not entirely uM missing bytes. A colleague has also reportedly seen "buffer overrun" errors.    O The code [1], consisting of excerpts from various places all jumbled together, kI has been simplified and haven't yet been tested nor compiled. It should, s/ however, give you a firm grasp of my conundrum.h   Help greatly appreciated!      [1]t #include <stdio.h> #include <stdlib.h>  #include <string.h>i /* #include <stdint.h> */h /* #include <stdbool.h> */8 /* Some godforsaken compilers don't support C99. Pah! */ typedef char           int8_t; typedef short          int16_t;r typedef int            int32_t;z typedef unsigned char  uint8_t;l  typedef unsigned short uint16_t;  typedef unsigned int   uint32_t; typedef char           bool;   #ifndef true # define true 1- #endif
 #ifndef false- # define false 0 #endif   #include <agndef.h>m #include <descrip.h> #include <efndef.h>u #include <iodef.h> #include <lib$routines.h>e #include <ssdef.h> #include <starlet.h> #include <ttdef.h> #include <tt2def.h>d     #define PORT_NAME "lta1232:"    " static void IOEventAst(void *Nada) {      sys$wake(0, 0);o }?     int main(void) { #     int32_t SysStatus = SS$_NORMAL;h  %     char DescStr[64], MbxDescStr[64];M#     $DESCRIPTOR(PortDesc, DescStr);O%     $DESCRIPTOR(MbxDesc, MbxDescStr);l  !     uint16_t Channel, MbxChannel;t'     int32_t  Terminators[2] = { 0, 0 };i     uint32_t PortPrefs[3];  
     struct     {a         int16_t  Status;         uint16_t Transfercount;.         uint16_t Terminator;         uint16_t TerminatorLen;e     } Iosb;S  
     struct     {t         uint16_t Status;         uint8_t  TransmitSpeed;          uint8_t  ReceiveSpeed;         uint8_t  CRFillCount;          uint8_t  LFFillCount;          uint8_t  ParityFlags;          uint8_t  Unused;     } Iosb2;  $     char FlushBuf[1024], Data[4096];  E     /* Create temporary mailbox to associate with device (text to theeF        left of : will be interp. as semaphore, remove if it exists) */J     MbxDesc.dsc$w_length = sprintf(MbxDescStr, "PLOS_PORT_%s", PORT_NAME);  4     if (MbxDescStr[MbxDesc.dsc$w_length - 1] == ':')     {:4         MbxDescStr[MbxDesc.dsc$w_length - 1] = '\0';         MbxDesc.dsc$w_length--;"     }s  O     MbxDesc.dsc$w_length += sprintf(&MbxDescStr[MbxDesc.dsc$w_length], "_MBX");:  ;     if ((SysStatus = sys$crembx(0, &MbxChannel, 1024, 1024,e?                                 0, 0, &MbxDesc)) != SS$_NORMAL)t     {a.         printf("Failed to create mailbox.\n");         exit(EXIT_FAILURE);d     }        /* Open the device */r     strcpy(DescStr, PORT_NAME);),     PortDesc.dsc$w_length = strlen(DescStr);  =     SysStatus = sys$assign(&PortDesc, &Channel, 0, &MbxDesc);         if (SysStatus != SS$_NORMAL)     {a+         printf("Failed to open device.\n");j         exit(EXIT_FAILURE);      }        /* Set port parameters */o@     if ((SysStatus = sys$qiow(EFN$C_ENF, Channel, IO$_SENSEMODE,6                               &Iosb2, 0, 0, PortPrefs,@                               3 * 4, 0, 0, 0, 0)) == SS$_NORMAL)!         SysStatus = Iosb2.Status;r        if (SysStatus != SS$_NORMAL)     {C+         printf("Failed get parameters.\n");i         exit(EXIT_FAILURE);g     }@  "     PortPrefs[1] |= TT$M_NOBRDCST;!     PortPrefs[1] |= TT$M_PASSALL; $     PortPrefs[1] &= ~TT$M_NOTYPEAHD;  >     if ((SysStatus = sys$qiow(EFN$C_ENF, Channel, IO$_SETMODE,=                               &Iosb2, 0, 0, PortPrefs, 3 * 4,sM                               &SpeedPrefs, 0, ParityPrefs, 0)) == SS$_NORMAL) !         SysStatus = Iosb2.Status;L        if (SysStatus != SS$_NORMAL)     {o+         printf("Failed set parameters.\n");          exit(EXIT_FAILURE);o     }t       while (true)     {r@         /* Prompt for data to write (just hit return to skip) */         printf("Write: ");  )         fgets(Data, sizeof(Data), stdin);t+         if (Data[strlen(Data) - 1] == '\n') *             Data[strlen(Data) - 1] = '\0';           if (strlen(Data) != 0)	         {l             /* Write to port */e9             if ((SysStatus = sys$qiow(EFN$C_ENF, Channel,aO                                       IO$_WRITEVBLK | IO$M_NOFORMAT | IO$M_NOW,eF                                       &Iosb, 0, 0, Data, strlen(Data),A                                       0, 0, 0, 0)) == SS$_NORMAL) (                 SysStatus = Iosb.Status;  (             if (SysStatus != SS$_NORMAL)
             {r7                 printf("Failed to write to device.\n");e#                 exit(EXIT_FAILURE); 
             }i  B             printf("Written %d bytes: %.*s\n", Iosb.Transfercount,-                    Iosb.Transfercount, Data);i	         }e           /* Setup ast */f7         if ((SysStatus = sys$qio(EFN$C_ENF, MbxChannel, I                                  IO$_SETMODE | IO$M_WRTATTN, &Iosb, 0, 0,eN                                  IOEventAst, NULL, 0, 0, 0, 0)) != SS$_NORMAL)	         {t-             printf("Failed to setup ast.\n");.             exit(EXIT_FAILURE);e	         }i  $         /* Wait for ast to strike */         sys$hiber();  N         /* Flush mbx associated with device (SS$_ENDOFFILE => no more data) */         SysStatus = SS$_NORMAL;a  '         while (SysStatus == SS$_NORMAL)a	         {s<             if ((SysStatus = sys$qiow(EFN$C_ENF, MbxChannel,E                                       IO$_READVBLK | IO$M_NOW, &Iosb,<G                                       0, 0, FlushBuf, sizeof(FlushBuf),nA                                       0, 0, 0, 0)) == SS$_NORMAL)m(                 SysStatus = Iosb.Status;	         }>           /* Read from port */5         if ((SysStatus = sys$qiow(EFN$C_ENF, Channel, <                                   IO$_READVBLK | IO$M_TIMED,B                                   &Iosb, 0, 0, Data, sizeof(Data),G                                   0, Terminators, 0, 0)) == SS$_NORMAL)k$             SysStatus = Iosb.Status;  @         if (SysStatus != SS$_NORMAL && SysStatus != SS$_TIMEOUT)	         {d4             printf("Failed to read from device.\n");             exit(EXIT_FAILURE); 	         }   ;         printf("Read %d bytes: %.*s\n", Iosb.Transfercount,D/                (int) Iosb.Transfercount, Data);h     }a  
     return 0;p }e   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 23:04:29 GMTe1 From: Forrest Kenney <Forrest.Kenney@hp.com.doom> O Subject: Re: Missing bytes and buffer overrun when reading with terminal driverl+ Message-ID: <3F5D0AB1.926174B1@hp.com.doom>s  P    There is really not enough data in the post to explain why you might see data over runs or lost-R data.  Things like what system, what terminal line controller, and finally what is the data rate.  AsS a general rule the serial line ports built into the Alpha systems are not real goodx at sustaining evenR moderately high data rates.  The devices have tiny data silos that are easily over run.  O     For the 16 years that I have had ownership of the VMS or direct involvementi with the VMSP terminal driver I have discouraged using mailboxes to see how much data in to be read.  It isP much better to always keep a read posted than it is to let data pool in the type ahead buffer and
 then read it.u  S     The single most efficient data path from the hardware into a users buffer is ifr you read inaS pasthru/pasall and no echo.  In that case the data is read from the hardware into a  register andS shortly there after directly copied into the users buffer.  Any other scheme is hasi a noticeablyQ longer data path.  The other thing you do not want to do is let lots of data poole in the typeAP ahead buffer and do a large read to drain it all.  That draining read will block interrupt processingH and if long enough will cause the hardware to start dropping characters.  S     So if you know what the data stream is you should double or triple buffer readsn ofM sufficient to hold the data block and structure terminator masks that end thel read.  If you aresN truly dealing with asynchronous data flows a better scheme is to post a single character readO when that completes wait a small amount of time say 10% of the time it takes tog	 flood theMP hardware silo and do a read large enough to take any accumulated characters plus the R data in the silo.  Repeat this read until it returns no data and repost the single	 character  read.(     Forrest Kenney OpenVMS Development-   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 23:57 CDT' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) O Subject: Re: Missing bytes and buffer overrun when reading with terminal driverc, Message-ID: <8SEP200323574167@gerg.tamu.edu>  2 mejde@dtek.chalmers.se (Martin Ejdestig) writes...K }Why do I sporadically miss bytes when reading from a port in the followingjL }way [1]? I would expect malformed data if it's a setup issue, not entirely N }missing bytes. A colleague has also reportedly seen "buffer overrun" errors.  } P }The code [1], consisting of excerpts from various places all jumbled together, J }has been simplified and haven't yet been tested nor compiled. It should, 0 }however, give you a firm grasp of my conundrum. }  }Help greatly appreciated!   }#define PORT_NAME "lta1232:"s  = }            if ((SysStatus = sys$qiow(EFN$C_ENF, MbxChannel,wF }                                      IO$_READVBLK | IO$M_NOW, &Iosb,H }                                      0, 0, FlushBuf, sizeof(FlushBuf),B }                                      0, 0, 0, 0)) == SS$_NORMAL)    ; I haven't looked at what you are doing very closely, but...t  D For reading from LAT devices, you might investigate the IO$M_NOFILTRD modifier. When talking to an instrument (a spectrofluorometer, to beF specific) attached to a DECserver 200/MC it turned out to be necessaryD to use this. Without it there would occasionally be "missing bytes", as I recall.   --- Carl   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 03 00:21:39 +0200g) From: p_sture@elias.decus.ch (Paul Sture)I: Subject: Re: OpenVMS Hobbyist licence for layered products) Message-ID: <14RkbXgH3e3l@elias.decus.ch>1  a In article <rn9plvomb0m5k22hveu3qq4u34ffou51vb@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes:nL > On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 12:05:58 -0700, Dean Woodward <deanw@rdrop.com> wrote: >  >>JF Mezei wrote:r >>K >>> But at the end of the year, it becomes a real pain to remove/delete the  >>> expired licences.s >> >>You're kidding, right? >> >>  $ LICENSE DELETE * > J > Yeah, otherwise, just create a new version of the ldb, then execute bothD > command files (one for OpenVMS, and one for the layered products). >   C No. I have two sets of Hobbyist licenses here - 2 nodes you  see...o  " Plus ones from from third parties.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 21:30:50 GMTl# From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)I Subject: Re: OpenVMS Security 2 Message-ID: <ey67b.4264$Hm5.1265@news.cpqcorp.net>   In article <binflf$abs$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> writes:  E   Still flailing on reports that are three to five years old now, andeD   involving products multiple releases back?   (We are clearly doingF   nicely with the contents and the frequency of CERT reports involving/   OpenVMS, then.  Thanks for the confirmation!)H  E :>That was me and I don't work for Sun Marketing, do you really thinkt> :>that marketing people read CERTS and OpenVMS patch reports ?  D   Yes, I do.  The best FUD has flavoring overtones of the technical,D   with vaguely official citations for the unwary or the uninitiated.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faqaN  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.comg   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 20:02:56 +0200, From: Harti Brandt <hbb@fokus.fraunhofer.de>$ Subject: Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates> Message-ID: <20030908195947.E54920@beagle.fokus.fraunhofer.de>  & On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, John Sauter wrote:   JS>Harti Brandt wrote: JS>eD JS>We used EDT on a 128kw machine with six terminals. It took me twoH JS>weeks to feed all the EDT objects through DOB, edit them to make themE JS>compileable with MAC and make a shared library out of most of EDT.eH JS>This left even space for an OMSI pascal V2 when 4 people were working JS>in EDT on that machine. JS>  JS>John Sauter responded:f JS>uH JS>We divided EDT into lots of modules so we could overlay it on a smallF JS>PDP-11.  On the VAX it was always a shared library.  What operating0 JS>system were you using?  What are DOB and MAC?  H We had a RSX11M 4.0 as far as I remember. DOB is a dis-objecter that wasG one one of the DECUS tapes (I suppose). With a bunch of TECO macros andfH a little hand editing you could feed it's output into MACRO-11 (== MAC).H The biggest problem was to find out which psects are pure and which not.= This made EDT really fast and usable even on a small machine.M  I The only thing I couldn't figure out was in what language EDT was writtens! - it did not look like assembler.l   hartin -- n
 harti brandt,gP http://www.fokus.fraunhofer.de/research/cc/cats/employees/hartmut.brandt/private- brandt@fokus.fraunhofer.de, harti@freebsd.org    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 03:36:12 GMTn* From: don@news.daedalus.co.nz (Don Stokes)$ Subject: Re: PDP-11 OS Release Dates/ Message-ID: <MUb7b.68$tv1.9545@news02.tsnz.net>e  > In article <20030908195947.E54920@beagle.fokus.fraunhofer.de>,. Harti Brandt  <hbb@fokus.fraunhofer.de> wrote:J >The only thing I couldn't figure out was in what language EDT was written" >- it did not look like assembler.   BLISS, 	IIRC.    -- don   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 02:49:03 GMT + From: "Joe Heimann" <heimann@ecs.umass.edu> ) Subject: Re: Philips CDR2600 and CDRECORDe+ Message-ID: <3f5d3f9d@news-1.oit.umass.edu>f  / Glenn Everhart <Everhart-nospam@gce.com> wrote:e > H Vlems wrote:1 >> <VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG> schreef in berichte- >> news:00A250B5.1DF839D3@SendSpamHere.ORG...c >> sI >>>In article <bikivf$a0v6g$1@ID-143435.news.uni-berlin.de>, "Hans Vlems"a >> u# >> <hvlems.nieuw@zonnet.nl> writes:P >> d. >>>>Is the Philips 2600 supported by CDRECORD? >>>cM >>>I should have also asked, are you experiencing a problem that precipitatedo >>>your question?t >>>e >> hK >> Err, no, it was a question of a boolean nature actually and the expected O >> answer was a simple yes or no. The reason I asked the question is that I wasfK >> given a Philips CDD2600 (it's CDD not CDR) and before connecting it to arH >> VAXstation 4000-90A running VMS 7.3 and figuring out how to use it, I9 >> thought let's ask c.o.v whether it stands a chance :-)t >> SM >> In the mean time I learned that the CDD2600 is on line but all attempts tot0 >> get to the medium result in an error message:J >> "no disk/invalid medium"; and this with CDRECORD 1.8. CDRECORD seems toM >> recognize the device and that more or less answers my initial question. ItrO >> is not possible to write, read or blank CD-RW disks at any speed. So my beste: >> guess up to now is that the 2600 is useless. Any hints? >> y >> Hanst >> e >>  C > My CDD2600 was what I mastered VMS SIG tapes on for a few years, nC > connected to an alpha (3000-300lx) and using cdwrite or cdrecord.r  E > I did find it to be terribly picky about media. Verbatims generallyrH > worked and most others did not. The ones that failed often would neverE > be detected by the drive, even. However sometimes they got detectedn( > and just failed partway thru the burn.  G I have one at home and can also say they are picky about mdeia.  I usedoF to use Nashua disks, but can't find them anymore.  The drive also willG not work properly with the extended capacity disks, just use the 700 MB  CD-R's.o  G > I got a notice some time back that there was a recall, would I like asE > replacement. I said yes, got a faster burner...but it was IDE only. F > I called and said I needed SCSI but the legal folks apparently neverC > heard of installations that might need SCSI. Bought another brand F > for my current work. It as a 4x writer is at any rate more tolerable7 > than the Philips drive and accepts most any CD blank.s  E There are a few different firmware versions out there for the PhilipsoD drive.  Some are for OEM versions only.  I have come across a numberF of utilities that require that the firmware be at least some level, orF the drive will not work with it.  Came across some mention of firmware( updates, but never managed to find them.    Joe Heimann   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Sep 2003 00:54:26 GMTn From: healyzh@aracnet.com  Subject: Re: PWS 500 question + Message-ID: <bjj8c25lke@enews4.newsguy.com>C  % issinoho <issinoho@slayme.com> wrote:eH > I've also got a 433au which doesn't boot and was definitely being usedF > as a VMS workstation prior to breaking (I think it must be somethingE > on the motherboard that is faulty). Presumably in this case I couldn  K Try moving your SCSI card to a different slot.  The slot I had mine pluggedwH into slowly went bad.  Which unfortunatly probably means I need to start" shopping for a replacement system.  H > salvage the graphics card, memory, etc from the 433 into the 500. *Or*C > could I pull the motherboard from the 500 and put it into the 433 D > chassis? Which would make more sense? What is the best permutation > here?e  I Yes, you can move the parts from the dead system to the new one.  I wouldiG recommend moving the parts from the dead one to the new one rather thansH trying to move the Motherboard from the new one to replace the dead one.   		Zane   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 21:16:07 +0200) From: "Peter Grevel" <p.grevel@hccnet.nl>u* Subject: Re: RDB Interactive SQL questions) Message-ID: <bjiked$8ce$1@news.hccnet.nl>r  < I think I tthink the layout of the mail is a litte cunfused.  . The rownumber is not a attribute in the table. So using the command& select FLD1 from TABLE1, the result is   FLD1 AA BB CC EE .......   5 I want to publish it with an rownumber just like thisy   1    AAl 2    BBn 3    CCt 4    EEe .....f  & Is this possible with using cursors ?>   Thanks in advance    Peter Grevel   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 12:14:50 -0700s From: aharris@mmm.com (ann h)e( Subject: Tapesys and system disk rebuild= Message-ID: <f41c3e24.0309081114.516d8bc4@posting.google.com>t   system: alpha 2100 OVMS 6.2s tapesys: V5.2.7f thuway  D i had to rebuild the system disk a couple of months ago.  since thenC TAPESYS jsut has refused to backup a remote system.  the new system1B disk is on the remote system. the tapesys system runs backups just> fine.  but it just will not do the remote backups via thruway.  E i have stopeed/restarted reinitialized everything I can think of. i'mn@ sure this is some silly little parameter that needs to be reset.F i can "see" the remote system just fine via proxies and remote logins.  & here is the error i've been receiving:   $DISKMOUNT_CHECK:e $       I = RUNNING + 1h% $       TWAY_LOGICAL := SBTWAY_10B8_1 5 $       IF DO_NODE .EQS. "" THEN GOTO DISKMOUNT_LOCALa $!2 $!  - On remote node, start remote processor going $!3 $       ON WARNING THEN GOTO DISKMOUNT_REMOTE_ERRORh8 $       THRUWAY CONNECT/LOG=TAPESYS_HOME:SBTWAY_10B8_1 -/                 DISK PRSV1 SYS001 SBTWAY_10B8_1P> %THRUWAY-I-SPAWNED, process SBTWAY_10B8_1 created, id 226B10BF3 %THRUWAY-F-NETRCV, failed to receive network buffer, $DISKMOUNT_REMOTE_ERROR: $       I = $STATUSe- $       @TAPESYS_SYSTEM:GETMESSAGE %X0823808Ce# $!      G E T M E S S A G E . C O M     / Any ideas or thoughts on what else to check ???s   thanks, Annr   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 15:07:44 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>, Subject: Re: Tapesys and system disk rebuild/ Message-ID: <00A259A3.6B65945F.1@tachysoft.com>r   >t >system: alpha 2100 OVMS 6.2 >tapesys: V5.2.7 >thuway    which?   >wE >i had to rebuild the system disk a couple of months ago.  since then D >TAPESYS jsut has refused to backup a remote system.  the new systemC >disk is on the remote system. the tapesys system runs backups just ? >fine.  but it just will not do the remote backups via thruway.n >hF >i have stopeed/restarted reinitialized everything I can think of. i'mA >sure this is some silly little parameter that needs to be reset.-G >i can "see" the remote system just fine via proxies and remote logins.o > ' >here is the error i've been receiving:  >s >$DISKMOUNT_CHECK: >$       I = RUNNING + 1& >$       TWAY_LOGICAL := SBTWAY_10B8_16 >$       IF DO_NODE .EQS. "" THEN GOTO DISKMOUNT_LOCAL >$!h3 >$!  - On remote node, start remote processor goingl >$! 4 >$       ON WARNING THEN GOTO DISKMOUNT_REMOTE_ERROR9 >$       THRUWAY CONNECT/LOG=TAPESYS_HOME:SBTWAY_10B8_1 -e0 >                DISK PRSV1 SYS001 SBTWAY_10B8_1? >%THRUWAY-I-SPAWNED, process SBTWAY_10B8_1 created, id 226B10BFu4 >%THRUWAY-F-NETRCV, failed to receive network buffer >$DISKMOUNT_REMOTE_ERROR:d >$       I = $STATUS. >$       @TAPESYS_SYSTEM:GETMESSAGE %X0823808C$ >$!      G E T M E S S A G E . C O M >e    J Why are you posting here?  Contact Software Partners and log a bug report.  L That said, the above message means that the server process, which resides onO the same node as the remote disk, died for some reason.  All the NETRCV messagelJ means is that the client process lost the link to the server process.  TheH actual cause of the failure will be in the server log on the other node.  O By the way, the current versions are 6.1.17 for tapesys and 3.2.3 for thruway. uH There have been a *lot* of bug fixes and enhancements to both products. O ===============================================================================iN Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html   iO ===============================================================================-N Butler:"Gentlemen!"  Curly(as he and other Stooges look around):"Who came in?"   ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 21:44:17 -0500F- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)c, Subject: Re: Tapesys and system disk rebuild3 Message-ID: <MhymSOCTDDd1@eisner.encompasserve.org>n  Z In article <00A259A3.6B65945F.1@tachysoft.com>, Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> writes:  F >>i had to rebuild the system disk a couple of months ago.  since then5 >>TAPESYS jsut has refused to backup a remote system.l   > Why are you posting here?   > Probably for the same reason people discuss VMS problems here.   ------------------------------  * Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 19:18:33 +0000 (UTC)! From: Bagbourne <noway@noway.com>A) Subject: Re: The vultures are circulatinga( Message-ID: <3F5CD875.3050909@noway.com>  ( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > Wayne Sewell wrote:qI >> Anybody with two brain cells to rub together can figure out that they a	 >> have ahJ >> hidden agenda for saying this shit.  Unfortunately, there are a lot of 	 >> peoplea( >> in the industry with brain cells < 2. >  > 6 > So where are you now with your comments about people > and brain cells ?t  F What's yer point? There *are* a lot of people in the industry without  two braincells to rub together!-   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 21:35:37 -0500i1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>/) Subject: Re: The vultures are circulatingp' Message-ID: <3F5D3C79.649A8EE5@fsi.net>-   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:m > 6 > Just received this SPAM from sector7 under the titleB > "Reduce TCO through server consolidation and platform migration" > [snip]  ( Sent this to Mark Gorham and Cc'd Sue S.  B I got the distinct impression that JP is well known among the OVMSD executives. That's about all I can say without risking a lawsuit for libel.   -- e David J. Dachteraw dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:28:20 GMT2) From: bob smith <sfmc68@bellatlantic.net>*! Subject: Re: VMS website updated.s/ Message-ID: <3F5D1EEE.2090205@bellatlantic.net>-    works fine with mozilla under nt   John Travell wrote:MN > Folks, perhaps a bit cheeky, and certainly self-advertising, but I have done# > a bit of an update to my website.pI > I know it works how I want it to in Mozilla, both on VMS (checked there2K > first!) and on a PC. It also works in the latest billyware, but I haven'tuJ > got older editions of netscape or IE, or Opera, or lynx, etc to check it > with.n > M > It should display acceptably with JavaScript disabled, as the CSS files are 0 > not loaded unless you allow the script to run. > M > If anyone who has any of those other browsers can bother to look at my siteh) > with them, I would appreciate feedback.O >  > http://www.jomatech.com/ >  > -- > John Travell$ > Independent VMS crashdump analyst.! > john- at - jomatech - dot - comi > +44-(0)23-92552229 > http://www.jomatech.com/ >  >  >  >  >  > ---u( > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.< > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).C > Version: 6.0.515 / Virus Database: 313 - Release Date: 01/09/2003n >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 02:45:51 +02004& From: Michiel Erens <erens@wanadoo.nl>! Subject: Re: VMS website updated. & Message-ID: <3F5D22BF.6F4B@wanadoo.nl>   John Travell wrote:d > E > Folks, perhaps a bit cheeky, and certainly self-advertising, but I  - > have done a bit of an update to my website.tD > I know it works how I want it to in Mozilla, both on VMS (checked D > there first!) and on a PC. It also works in the latest billyware, C > but I haven't got older editions of netscape or IE, or Opera, or 0 > lynx, etc to check it with.n > D > It should display acceptably with JavaScript disabled, as the CSS : > files are not loaded unless you allow the script to run. > C > If anyone who has any of those other browsers can bother to look  4 > at my site with them, I would appreciate feedback. >  > http://www.jomatech.com/  9 Image not found : http://www.jomatech.com/images/bup4.gif    -- > ME Posted by news://news.nb.nu>   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 02:50:18 GMTn> From: Michael Austin <maustin@no-more-spam.firstdbasource.com>0 Subject: What is T4 and what can it do  for you?9 Message-ID: <Kdb7b.256$436.66@newssvr23.news.prodigy.com>i   Where to get T4:. http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/products/t4/  G Basically ANY stat you can show using Monitor, you can now collect and o" graph using T4 and a bit of Excel.   Copied from the HP Link....u= T4 (Tabular Timeline Tracking Tool) systematically captures, eF consolidates, and creates a composite timeline view and an historical H archive of important OpenVMS performance statistics. T4 can help insure @ that a detailed, day-by-day performance history of each node is I available whenever it might be needed. The output for T4 is in an easily  I reusable Comma Separated Value (CSV)format with exactly one row per time sD sample. T4 simplifies the job of observing how the performance of a ? single OpenVMS node varies over the course of a single day and aD identifying peak periods for further analysis. The T4 CSV files are E especially well suited to carrying out Before-and-After comparisons,  I e.g. to evaluate the performance gains achieved as a result of upgrading .H hardware. T4V32 can be used with OpenVMS versions 7.2-2, 7.3, and 7.3-1.    F And a quick demo of how you will be able to view the data in the near G future - coming to a browser near you.  The following link selects all tI of the ZIP files for the last month or so and lets you select them. Then .G you can select Mon.SYST you get the following data and grphs using the  C VERBOSE check box. -- as you can see, this box is not very busy....   F   # Parameter Name                                Min     Avg      MaxF 1  [MON.SYST]Direct I/O Rate                       0       0       41 H   2  [MON.SYST]Buffered I/O Rate                     0       0       78 I    14 [MON.SYST]Page Fault Rate                       0       1       95 fI    15 [MON.SYST]Page Read I/O rate                    0       0        9 mI    20 [MON.SYST]Process Count                        32      32       38  H    25 [MON.SYST]Cpu Busy                              0       0       28    I Test drive a VMS-Apache-based tool for displaying your system stats. The n/   kit should be available in the near future...n  , http://www.firstdbasource.com/t4/t4chart.php  F The cool thing is that if you can put the data in the correct format, - you can use this tool to view ANY statistics.   > be gentle on my system as it only has a 256K upload link... :)   Michael Austin.    ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 12:49:59 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)s; Subject: Re: Will OpenVMS I64 run on a Dell PowerEdge 3250n 3 Message-ID: <5FW1dRQ37o96@eisner.encompasserve.org>c  a In article <0j9plv44jnqre3r4oj8cvvvh865niiu7qf@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes:nL > On 5 Sep 2003 12:16:23 -0500, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob > Koehler) wrote:s > 2 > Couldn't have said it better myself... heh, heh.  D    Except that I didn't write any of the stuff you actually quoted. A    Next time please remove the excess attributions and reduce the     quoting level.M  :    You are using an editor with column remove, aren't you?        ------------------------------   Date: 8 Sep 2003 11:56:10 -0700.! From: joanne.korol@hp.com (Josie)K8 Subject: WordPerfect for OpenVMS Alpha - License Problem= Message-ID: <123bebf5.0309081056.5afe72ac@posting.google.com>   E I'm at a customer site who is still running WPCORP V5.1+ on our ALPHAa5 system.  It's working fine on our Production Cluster.p  F I'm field testing VMS V7.3-2 and have successfully installed it there,/ but I cannot seem to get the license installed.g  D The node name of test box is 732TST.  I'm wondering if the node name/ started with a numberic is causing the problem?p  D I have tried using the non-network node of .cluster and that doesn't seem to work either.   Does anyone else still use it?   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 15:47:20 -0400o* From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <stan@stanq.com>< Subject: Re: WordPerfect for OpenVMS Alpha - License Problem- Message-ID: <3F5CA488.7873.EC9A246@localhost>-  G > I'm at a customer site who is still running WPCORP V5.1+ on our ALPHAe7 > system.  It's working fine on our Production Cluster.e >   > Does anyone else still use it?  C Check out:  http://www.legacy-2000.com/   They support it on VMS...c    
 --Stan Quayle2 Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------C Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  +1 614-868-1363  Fax: +1 614 868-1671a1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147n= Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.com1   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 20:40:19 GMTs4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>< Subject: Re: WordPerfect for OpenVMS Alpha - License Problem0 Message-ID: <3F5CE635.9EC49900@blueyonder.co.uk>   Josie wrote: > G > I'm at a customer site who is still running WPCORP V5.1+ on our ALPHAo7 > system.  It's working fine on our Production Cluster.  > H > I'm field testing VMS V7.3-2 and have successfully installed it there,1 > but I cannot seem to get the license installed.. > F > The node name of test box is 732TST.  I'm wondering if the node name1 > started with a numberic is causing the problem?l  D Some idea of the problem encountered (eg error message) might enable( those expert in VMS to help you further.   > F > I have tried using the non-network node of .cluster and that doesn't > seem to work either. >   > Does anyone else still use it?  E Not me, but I am wondering, maybe HP decided to cut India out of the tD loop and just use INFO_VAX/comp.os.vms for its VMS support now :-).    --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.499 ************************