1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 09 Aug 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 439       Contents: Re: HSD partitioning+ Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul + RE: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul + Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul + Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul + Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul  LK201 BE needed.+ OT: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul  Re: Porting to OpenVMS3 Re: Pros/Cons: Radeon 7500 vis-a-vis Powerstorm 350  Re: Resilient VMS server config  RE: Resilient VMS server config  Re: Routing under VMS  RE: Routing under VMS  Re: Routing under VMS @ Re: Stolen IP via India Outsourcing - Getting what they deserve? Re: Touch Screen Voting systems  Re: Touch Screen Voting systems  Re: Touch Screen Voting systems  Re: Touch Screen Voting systems * Re: [Hobbyist] Please fix Webserverproblem* Re: [Hobbyist] Please fix Webserverproblem* Re: [Hobbyist] Please fix Webserverproblem, [OT]: Google as hacker's tool- worth reading0 Re: [OT]: Google as hacker's tool- worth reading  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 01:28:45 -0700 % From: Bart.Zorn@xs4all.nl (Bart Zorn)  Subject: Re: HSD partitioning = Message-ID: <a98cd882.0408090028.6fb966db@posting.google.com>   B This gets a bit confusing. Are we talking about HSD (HSD05, HSD10,C HSD30) Storageworks DSSI to SCSI controllers, or about HDS (Hitachi  Data Systems) storage arrays?   D However, I don't have the feeling that it makes much of a difference
 in this case!   	 Bart Zorn   X Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl> wrote in message news:<cf0ugu$61v$1@news1.tilbu1.nb.home.nl>... > john oxley wrote: H > > Anyone know a way of splitting/partitioning a large disk on a HSD to- > > serve more than one unit to a VMS system? " > What kind of HSD? 99xx or 95xx ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 13:47:56 GMT , From: "Dave Gudewicz" <k9jdk@NOSPAMarrl.net>4 Subject: Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul/ Message-ID: <ggLRc.256148$JR4.245471@attbi_s54>   + I just sent the mentioned link to Stallard.   ; "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message 7 news:f30679fb.0408090335.18f85341@posting.google.com...  > Click  >  > b http://news.com.com/IBM+overhauls+iSeries+for+the+long+haul/2100-1010_3-5300765.html?tag=nefd.lede >  > E > "It's been a pattern for years in the server market: A powerful new @ > machine arrives, grows popular, then fades into history as theC > industry moves to fresh designs. Loyalists are left in the lurch.  > F > The OpenVMS machines led Digital Equipment Corp. to glory, but theirD > current owner, Hewlett-Packard, rarely even mentions them anymore.G > Prime and Data General expired altogether. The once-diverse mainframe / > gene pool has dwindled almost to one lineage.  > E > IBM's iSeries could be one of those endangered species: It has used F > processors and software far from the mainstream. But Big Blue thinks6 > it has found a way to keep the server line relevant. >  > (...)" >  > C > Looks like the AS/400 platform is commited to extinction like the G > OpenVMS base ! I think IBM should ask EMC do develop a VMware version  > to runA > i5/OS - to mantain their customer base. Would be better for IBM E > to run the applications and sell a lot of x450 servers. So they can  > run 1 > Linux/Windows and i5/OS in the other partition.  > = > An other option is develop an afinity program to run AS/400  > applications > under Linux ! Unix ! > 	 > Regards  >  > FC   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 08:02:17 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 4 Subject: RE: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul9 Message-ID: <NDEMLKKEBOIFBMJLCECIIEELDKAA.tom@kednos.com>   F They got their history almost right, it began as the System 3 ca. 19729 and the System 36 was launched before the System 38 IIRC.   G Actually, HP could take page out of their playbook and, using the Alpha  core, G provide emulation for VAX, so as not to lose that customer base, as was F recently reported on in the press.  They could even emulate Itanium:-)   < -----Original Message-----3 < From: Dave Gudewicz [mailto:k9jdk@NOSPAMarrl.net] ' < Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 6:48 AM  < To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 6 < Subject: Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul <  < - < I just sent the mentioned link to Stallard.  < = < "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message 9 < news:f30679fb.0408090335.18f85341@posting.google.com... 	 < > Click  < >  < > D < http://news.com.com/IBM+overhauls+iSeries+for+the+long+haul/2100-1" < 010_3-5300765.html?tag=nefd.lede < >  < > G < > "It's been a pattern for years in the server market: A powerful new B < > machine arrives, grows popular, then fades into history as theE < > industry moves to fresh designs. Loyalists are left in the lurch.  < > H < > The OpenVMS machines led Digital Equipment Corp. to glory, but theirF < > current owner, Hewlett-Packard, rarely even mentions them anymore.I < > Prime and Data General expired altogether. The once-diverse mainframe 1 < > gene pool has dwindled almost to one lineage.  < > G < > IBM's iSeries could be one of those endangered species: It has used H < > processors and software far from the mainstream. But Big Blue thinks8 < > it has found a way to keep the server line relevant. < > 
 < > (...)" < >  < > E < > Looks like the AS/400 platform is commited to extinction like the I < > OpenVMS base ! I think IBM should ask EMC do develop a VMware version 
 < > to runC < > i5/OS - to mantain their customer base. Would be better for IBM G < > to run the applications and sell a lot of x450 servers. So they can  < > run 3 < > Linux/Windows and i5/OS in the other partition.  < > ? < > An other option is develop an afinity program to run AS/400  < > applications < > under Linux ! Unix ! < >  < > Regards  < >  < > FC <  <  < --- ( < Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.< < Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).A < Version: 6.0.735 / Virus Database: 489 - Release Date: 8/6/2004  <  --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.735 / Virus Database: 489 - Release Date: 8/6/2004    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:17:21 -0400# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 4 Subject: Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul, Message-ID: <RuadnQzXg4MfCIrcRVn-hA@igs.net>   Tom Linden wrote: H > They got their history almost right, it began as the System 3 ca. 1972; > and the System 36 was launched before the System 38 IIRC.  > C > Actually, HP could take page out of their playbook and, using the 
 > Alpha core, E > provide emulation for VAX, so as not to lose that customer base, as A > was recently reported on in the press.  They could even emulate  > Itanium:-)    K Personally I think Intel should turn the Itanic into a 4004 emulator. Think E of all the simultaneous 4-function calculators you could emulate  ;-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 16:54:00 +0100 9 From: Andrew Harrison <andrew_._remove_harrison@su_n.com> 4 Subject: Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul' Message-ID: <41179E18.7040905@su_n.com>    John Smith wrote:  > Tom Linden wrote:  > H >>They got their history almost right, it began as the System 3 ca. 1972; >>and the System 36 was launched before the System 38 IIRC.  >>C >>Actually, HP could take page out of their playbook and, using the 
 >>Alpha core, E >>provide emulation for VAX, so as not to lose that customer base, as A >>was recently reported on in the press.  They could even emulate  >>Itanium:-) >  >  > M > Personally I think Intel should turn the Itanic into a 4004 emulator. Think G > of all the simultaneous 4-function calculators you could emulate  ;-)  >  > C How about a multi-function device, calculator and roomheater either D leave the heatsinks exposed so you can bask in the heat they radiateD or stick a big fan with an oscilator option to blow warm air arround	 the room.   D Market it as the only multi-function fan calculator with a 5 billion. dollar development budget, you could clean up.   regards  Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 16:44:24 GMT , From: "Dave Gudewicz" <k9jdk@NOSPAMarrl.net>4 Subject: Re: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul/ Message-ID: <IRNRc.232854$IQ4.183474@attbi_s02>   + Bugged me enough to send the link to Carly.   7 "Dave Gudewicz" <k9jdk@NOSPAMarrl.net> wrote in message ) news:ggLRc.256148$JR4.245471@attbi_s54... - > I just sent the mentioned link to Stallard.  > = > "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message 9 > news:f30679fb.0408090335.18f85341@posting.google.com... 	 > > Click  > >  > >  > b http://news.com.com/IBM+overhauls+iSeries+for+the+long+haul/2100-1010_3-5300765.html?tag=nefd.lede > >  > > G > > "It's been a pattern for years in the server market: A powerful new B > > machine arrives, grows popular, then fades into history as theE > > industry moves to fresh designs. Loyalists are left in the lurch.  > > H > > The OpenVMS machines led Digital Equipment Corp. to glory, but theirF > > current owner, Hewlett-Packard, rarely even mentions them anymore.I > > Prime and Data General expired altogether. The once-diverse mainframe 1 > > gene pool has dwindled almost to one lineage.  > > G > > IBM's iSeries could be one of those endangered species: It has used H > > processors and software far from the mainstream. But Big Blue thinks8 > > it has found a way to keep the server line relevant. > > 
 > > (...)" > >  > > E > > Looks like the AS/400 platform is commited to extinction like the I > > OpenVMS base ! I think IBM should ask EMC do develop a VMware version 
 > > to runC > > i5/OS - to mantain their customer base. Would be better for IBM G > > to run the applications and sell a lot of x450 servers. So they can  > > run 3 > > Linux/Windows and i5/OS in the other partition.  > > ? > > An other option is develop an afinity program to run AS/400  > > applications > > under Linux ! Unix ! > >  > > Regards  > >  > > FC >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 07:38:07 -0700 , From: diego.claeys@pandora.be (Romax MANIAX) Subject: LK201 BE needed. = Message-ID: <de2a082d.0408090638.3d74eb98@posting.google.com>    Hi,   5 I'm looking for a belgian lk201 keyboard for a VT420.    help please.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 04:35:35 -0700 . From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)4 Subject: OT: IBM overhauls iSeries for the long haul= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0408090335.18f85341@posting.google.com>    Click   b http://news.com.com/IBM+overhauls+iSeries+for+the+long+haul/2100-1010_3-5300765.html?tag=nefd.lede    C "It's been a pattern for years in the server market: A powerful new > machine arrives, grows popular, then fades into history as theA industry moves to fresh designs. Loyalists are left in the lurch.   D The OpenVMS machines led Digital Equipment Corp. to glory, but theirB current owner, Hewlett-Packard, rarely even mentions them anymore.E Prime and Data General expired altogether. The once-diverse mainframe - gene pool has dwindled almost to one lineage.   C IBM's iSeries could be one of those endangered species: It has used D processors and software far from the mainstream. But Big Blue thinks4 it has found a way to keep the server line relevant.   (...)"    A Looks like the AS/400 platform is commited to extinction like the E OpenVMS base ! I think IBM should ask EMC do develop a VMware version  to run? i5/OS - to mantain their customer base. Would be better for IBM C to run the applications and sell a lot of x450 servers. So they can  run / Linux/Windows and i5/OS in the other partition.   ; An other option is develop an afinity program to run AS/400  applications under Linux ! Unix !     Regards    FC   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 09:08:35 +0200 ' From: JOUKJ <joukj@hrem.stm.tudelft.nl>  Subject: Re: Porting to OpenVMS * Message-ID: <cf77tj$fds$1@news.tudelft.nl>   John E. Malmberg wrote:  > David Topham wrote: I >> 2) Threading: My initial research suggests this shouldn't be a problem G >> as we use POSIX threads and mutexes. Unless someone knows otherwise?  >  > J > I know that OpenVMS supports POSIX threads, I have not worked much with  > that API though. > K > If you go to http://www.hp.com/go/openvms/ and click on the documenation  B > link, the documentation for the POSIX threads is there with the ! > Operating System Documentation.  > H I use them sometimes, but note that the set is not complete (especially B the part where signalling/interupts are used) Every thing is well F documented in one of the manuals : Guide to the POSIX threads library.                 Jouk   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 13:28:17 GMT 9 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com> < Subject: Re: Pros/Cons: Radeon 7500 vis-a-vis Powerstorm 3501 Message-ID: <RZKRc.7522$Rb1.885@news.cpqcorp.net>   K The PowerStorm 350 is a 3D graphics adapter that was custom built for us by J E&S.  It is a traditional workstation 3D design with traditional features.H It's pretty old in the tooth, and when sold new was quite expensive (midA $3k).  The server and OpenGL implementation had many man years of D development and optimization - so for many things it was quite fast.  K The Radeon 7500 is an ATI 3D graphics adapter made for PC's.  It lacks some J workstation graphics features (like simultanious pixel formats and overlayJ planes).  The server and OpenGL implementation in this case is an enhancedL version of the XFree86/Mesa code used on Linux, and isn't as well optimized.J However, the hardware itself is much faster which tends to balance it out,I and we are still fixing performance in certain areas.  This card is about  10x cheaper.  . If you are only doing 2D, then use the Radeon.  H If you are doing 3D, it's a toss up - it depends on exactly what you are doing.    : "Petros Dafniotis" <pdafniotis@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:e54adf36.0408051043.66a4ba82@posting.google.com... A > As subject says I am looking for the pros/cons of a radeon 7500  > vis-a-vis a Powerstorm 350.  > H > I run now on the Radeon 7500 but I have a 2nd hand Powerstorm 350 that4 > I could get. What are the pros/cons in doing this? > 7 > The Powerstorm looks enormous compared to the Radeon.  > # > Oh, I am running an Alpha XP1000.  >  > Kind regards,  > Petros   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 04:12:36 -0700 ( From: catsoup57@hotmail.com (Chris Hale)( Subject: Re: Resilient VMS server config< Message-ID: <8155f86.0408090312.47b2d71c@posting.google.com>    Thanks for your comments so far.  % To address a couple of the questions.   B By resilient, I mean that it would be extreemly inconvienient, andA costly if the system goes down unplanned. Also the application is ? required almost 24x7. It is a key part in a production process. 0 Planned downtime can occur about 3 times a year.  D The application itself is not particularly dependant on the vaersionF of VMS. It has run on a three node VAX cluster, a four node Alpha, andC a two node Alpha, spanning VMS versions 6.2 thru to 7.3. Throughout B this there has been very little modification needed. So we will beC quite happy to move to whatever version is current for the hardware 	 platform.   B The 'snapshot' backup was questioned. We take a database backup atC present by closing processes that are using the database shadowset, D removing one member, and restarting the application. The applicationD is down for about 1 minuite, and the disk is shadowcopied in about 2F hours later after it has been copied to tape. I know that dismemberingD a shadowset in this way is not remomended, but its worked for us forC many years on a daily basis! We were hoping that a SAN solution may F enable us to take a snapshot at the SAN level, maybe with VMS not even knowing about it??  B As I said before the application does not need CPU power. But disk bandwidth would help alot.  & Thanks again for your comments so far.   Chris.  U Nic Clews <spamthis@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message news:<cf09sk$6ng$1@lore.csc.com>...  > Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:  >  > > Chris Hale wrote:  > > ? > >>We have an application which is not processor intensive,...  > >  > >  > > If > >  > > E > >>...we have had it running on an Alpha1000...without any problems.  > >  > >  > > Then > >  > >  > >>...a pair of DS25's... > >  > > ! > > seems to be a major overkill.  > > A > > Look for a pair of (maybe secondhand) DS10's or maybe AS1200. ; > > They will probably be more then enough and far cheaper.  > > J > > Regarding the other qusetions, don't make it more complex that needed. > >  > > KISS...  > > 6 > > Exactly how "high" is "highly available", b.t.w ?? > > 
 > > Jan-Erik.  > H > But isn't the issue here one of hardware refresh? Why replace old kit A > with not-quite-so-old kit? In certain scenarios, DS25's may be  J > unsuitable, particularly if the current AS1000 are dual PSU'ed and that @ > is part of the resilience. However if equipment longevity for C > servicability wants to be addressed, CPU power is merely a bonus.  > G > There is also no mention of the operating system version, which also  I > governs the hardware, but we're presuming that either they keep on top  < > of current versions, or moving to a current version is OK. > A > Don't take is personally Jan-Erik, I just don't think that the  K > replacement configuration has been properly planned for, the systems and  B > models are mere details. KISS is nice, but some of the business K > processes (as opposed to system and user processes) could well have been  G > built around the way shadowing works, it would not be the first time  = > I've seen it, and I can guarantee it would not be the last.  > I > I know some very resilient single node systems. I also have known some   > unstable clusters...   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:13:44 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> ( Subject: RE: Resilient VMS server configR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB3DF5ED@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Chris Hale [mailto:catsoup57@hotmail.com]=20 > Sent: August 9, 2004 7:13 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com * > Subject: Re: Resilient VMS server config >=20" > Thanks for your comments so far. >=20' > To address a couple of the questions.  >=20D > By resilient, I mean that it would be extreemly inconvienient, andC > costly if the system goes down unplanned. Also the application is A > required almost 24x7. It is a key part in a production process. 2 > Planned downtime can occur about 3 times a year. >=20F > The application itself is not particularly dependant on the vaersionH > of VMS. It has run on a three node VAX cluster, a four node Alpha, andE > a two node Alpha, spanning VMS versions 6.2 thru to 7.3. Throughout D > this there has been very little modification needed. So we will beE > quite happy to move to whatever version is current for the hardware  > platform.  >=20D > The 'snapshot' backup was questioned. We take a database backup atE > present by closing processes that are using the database shadowset, F > removing one member, and restarting the application. The applicationF > is down for about 1 minuite, and the disk is shadowcopied in about 2H > hours later after it has been copied to tape. I know that dismemberingF > a shadowset in this way is not remomended, but its worked for us forE > many years on a daily basis! We were hoping that a SAN solution may H > enable us to take a snapshot at the SAN level, maybe with VMS not even > knowing about it?? >=20D > As I said before the application does not need CPU power. But disk > bandwidth would help alot. >=20( > Thanks again for your comments so far. >=20 > Chris. >=206 > Nic Clews <spamthis@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message=20% > news:<cf09sk$6ng$1@lore.csc.com>...  > > Jan-Erik S=F6derholm wrote:  > >=20   Chris,  @ Fwiw, I know of a number of Customers in very mission critical =D environments that use the host based shadowing / split members for =I backups. One in particular rated their downtime at $750K/hr. The key is = D ensuring the application is down (or "quiescenced") i.e. no writes == happening and all outstanding ones have been flushed to disk.   G What I typically recommend (if not already in place) is a combo of HW = I RAID and host based shadowing. It depends on your budget of course, but = D I like to recommend for high availability that you consider a disk =I controller set as a single device and use HBVS across controller pairs. = H Each single member is a HW raid device on a controller set. Hence, one =I can dismount shadow set member(s) and yet still not have a single point =  of failure.=20  J Shadowing across controller pairs also allows one to schedule controller =B upgrades as a set and not have to rely on "controller fail-over" =0 procedures which do not always work as expected.   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom . (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 16:13:34 +0200 2 From: "Dr. Otto Titze" <titze@ikp.tu-darmstadt.de> Subject: Re: Routing under VMS5 Message-ID: <cf80iv$f2v$1@lnx107.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de>    Hans,   @ to be more specific it are 2 LAN segments. For TCPIP it are two B different subnets. Till now on the Router for tcpip the concerned H protocols were bridged. Our univversity computer center responsible for G the network does not like these bridging and they try to get rid of it  H al#t all. (The new configuration will be that the router is replaced by 3 a firewall which is only able to do tcpip routing.)    Regards  Otto   Hans Vlems schrieb:   A > "Dr. Otto Titze" <titze@ikp.tu-darmstadt.de> schreef in bericht 1 > news:cf026b$1ka$1@lnx107.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de...  >  >>Hi,  >>J >>by changes in our university network (Firewalls etc.) I have the problemJ >>that certain protocols will not be bridged any more between two subnets.0 >>Concerned are cluster, LAT, Last ... at least. >>F >>If I connect one of my VMS systems to both subnets could I then do aD >>routing of this particular protocols (except tcpip)? What should I9 >>observe? Is there special software necessary/available?  >> > M > These protocols are not routable AFAIK.  If you write "subnets" do you mean I > IP subnets or are you referring to two or more different (ethernet) LAN  > segments? I > In the latter case you can build a LAT translator. Connect two terminal 	 > servers N > together with their RS232 / DEC 423 ports. One server can offer the services > of theN > other and vice versa. LAST and SCS traffic is problematic if not impossible. >  > Hans >  >    --  -   ------------------------------------------- , | Dr. Otto Titze, Kernphysik TUD           |, | Schlossgartenstr. 9, D-64289 Darmstadt   |, | titze@ikp.tu-darmstadt.de                |, | Tel: +49(6151)16-2916,FAX:16-4321        |-   -------------------------------------------    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:23:34 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>  Subject: RE: Routing under VMSR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB3DF5F7@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----< > From: Dr. Otto Titze [mailto:titze@ikp.tu-darmstadt.de]=20 > Sent: August 9, 2004 10:14 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com   > Subject: Re: Routing under VMS >=20 > Hans,  >=20D > to be more specific it are 2 LAN segments. For TCPIP it are two=20F > different subnets. Till now on the Router for tcpip the concerned=20< > protocols were bridged. Our univversity computer center=20 > responsible for=20A > the network does not like these bridging and they try to get=20  > rid of it=20@ > al#t all. (The new configuration will be that the router is=20 > replaced by=205 > a firewall which is only able to do tcpip routing.)  >=20	 > Regards  > Otto   Otto -  D Something you might want to ask your network folks, but is there any> reason why you can not implement VLAN's and trunked switches??  D You can actually setup separate VLAN's for normal TCPIP traffic, SCSE cluster traffic and even dedicated Mgmt VLAN's across trunked network G switch/rtrs. You need to add more NIC's per servers, but they are cheap + and imho, offer a cleaner overall solution.   
 Reference:H http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/cc/pd/si/casi/ca6000/prodlit/vlnwp_wp.p df   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom . (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  * Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 15:40:17 +0000 (UTC)7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney)  Subject: Re: Routing under VMS( Message-ID: <cf85t1$kn3$1@pcls4.std.com>  4 "Dr. Otto Titze" <titze@ikp.tu-darmstadt.de> writes:  A >to be more specific it are 2 LAN segments. For TCPIP it are two  C >different subnets. Till now on the Router for tcpip the concerned  I >protocols were bridged. Our univversity computer center responsible for  H >the network does not like these bridging and they try to get rid of it I >al#t all. (The new configuration will be that the router is replaced by  4 >a firewall which is only able to do tcpip routing.)  C Unfortunately, as mentioned, there is no routing defined for those  E protocols.  The proper thing for them is to use boxes that can bridge E them but route (or allow something else to route) TCPIP.  This sounds ( exactly like what you're getting rid of.  J What problem are they trying to solve?  It sounds like it may be "if it's F not TCP/IP, I don't understand it, therefore get rid of it!" politics. --   -Mike    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:16:09 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>I Subject: Re: Stolen IP via India Outsourcing - Getting what they deserve? / Message-ID: <00A36179.F8D4775F.2@tachysoft.com>   , >From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vmsF >Subject: Stolen IP via India Outsourcing - Getting what they deserve?( >Message-ID: <4113A60F.3090306@MMaz.com>& >Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 08:38:55 -0700. >Organization: Info-VAX<==>comp.os.vms Gateway    , >http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D17700 >  >A jolly tough time, nathurally  > K >By Tamlin Magee <mailto:Tamlin.Magee@theinquirer.net>: Friday 06 August=20  >2004, 10:22 > L >*US SOFTWARE COMPANY* Jolly Technologies has reported some of its source=20I >code, as well as "confidential design documents" has been stolen from=20 H >its research and development centre in India. Apparently, the stolen=20K >goods were to do with one of Jolly Technologies' "key products." Thanks=20 G >to the thievery, all development at the centre has been temporarily=20 	 >stopped.  > I >Jolly Technologies reckons the code and documents were sneaked out of=20 L >the centre by a recently-hired software engineer. Supposedly, she used a=20J >yahoo e-mail account to upload the documents and transport them out of=20J >the facility. The blokes at the R+D facility are currently trying hard=20( >to stop the source code from spreading. > J >Unfortunately for Jolly, a lack of tight intellectual property laws in=20K >India makes taking legal action against the employee almost impossible.=20 G >However, the fellows from Jolly's San Carlos, California branch are=20 I >talking to local Indian authorities and trying to sort something out.=20 L >The Indian branch will not be employing or continuing research until the=20$ >facility has been properly secured. > I >The company, which is a vendor of labelling and card software for the=20 J >printing industry, established its R+D base in Mumbai just under three=20 >months ago. =B5 >     L This is the funniest article I have read for some time.  Hopefully this willL happen to all the other companies that have outsourced to India.  Save a few< bucks and lose your product.  Yeah, *that's* cost effective.O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Larry(sniffing):"I smell something awful." Moe:"Yeah, well don't brag about it."   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 12:51:22 GMT 3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) ( Subject: Re: Touch Screen Voting systems1 Message-ID: <erKRc.7521$G91.713@news.cpqcorp.net>   > In article <bf98c417.0408060536.36c1f1bf@posting.google.com>, 4 williamwebb@openvms-rocks.com (William Webb) writes:  @ >I'm amazed that nobody's brought up the Third World practice ofG >dipping voters' thumbs in indelible ink after they've voted to prevent # >anyone from voting multiple times.   H I can see it now -- Thugs going door to door, rousting registered votersJ of the "other party" and forcably dipping their thumbs in indelible ink...   Where will it end!?   H But you're basic point is correct --- touch screens voting machines needM to ignore any touch by a finger, thumb or any other appendage that is coated   with indelible ink.                  hehehehhe... ;-}   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 07:06:03 -0700 . From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)( Subject: Re: Touch Screen Voting systems= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0408090606.1640c4b7@posting.google.com>   d Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote in message news:<87fz70hu3v.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>...7 > hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) writes:  > 5 > > In article <87n01bc6r7.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>,  2 > > Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> writes: >   / > >>What is the `problem' that is being solved?  >   ? > > The goal is to run elections that produce accurate, timely, ) > > verifiable results with minimum cost.  > = > And how will wince improve over a sheet of paper and a pen?  >  > Costs are up a LARGE amount,1 > The lawers will make `timley' seem a sick joke, $ > And you can't verify them to boot.G > I suspect they will produce exactly the result that is wanted though.  > F > > The problem is that current systems do not do this.  As in Florida; > > 2000 and, although we hope not, possibly again in 2004.  > C > Some US systems do not do that. Large parts of the planet seem to 8 > not have that problem. ( Got plenty of other ones... ) > G > > Although we won't have recounts in 2004 -- at least not in distrcts H > > that use the Touch Screen system which cannot provide for recouts --A > > the accuracy and verifiability of the counts are in question.  > G > How do you recount a computer poll? And how do you inspect the `Trade @ > Secret, comercial in confidence' crap lock inside out of view?  E It seems to me that computer voting is the worst way to go because it 9 is probably the easiest system to alter the results with.   C Lotteries are not all that relevant as they are of a very different B nature. Cheating in voting involves manipulation of totals whereasB cheating in a lottery involves altering one lottery number. See my other post for more on this.   See   "     http://www.blackboxvoting.com   ; for more information about the problems of computer voting.    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 09:28:11 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ( Subject: Re: Touch Screen Voting systems3 Message-ID: <PZMtK9V+FOm3@eisner.encompasserve.org>   U In article <2nc1qkFuestfU1@uni-berlin.de>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:  > A > Why would you think that?  If he buried, he would know where to C > find it. As long as someone wrote down the location on the Garmin ! > GPS receiver before they left.    ?    That's exactly the kind of simple competence that I will not $    credit Sadam or his friends with.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Aug 2004 09:30:52 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)v( Subject: Re: Touch Screen Voting systems3 Message-ID: <y0hUOmMPtE$M@eisner.encompasserve.org>a  r In article <bf98c417.0408060536.36c1f1bf@posting.google.com>, williamwebb@openvms-rocks.com (William Webb) writes: > A > I'm amazed that nobody's brought up the Third World practice ofeH > dipping voters' thumbs in indelible ink after they've voted to prevent$ > anyone from voting multiple times. >   D    Remind me not to take up printing as a profession in any of those
    countries!    ------------------------------  * Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:21:30 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)3 Subject: Re: [Hobbyist] Please fix Webserverproblem 1 Message-ID: <newscache$7ef62i$yzi1$1@news.sil.at>e  j In article <newscache$j1fo1i$xtx1$1@news.sil.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) writes:( >Webserver is working now. Thanks folks.  >If only I'd get the mail now...  @ After 4 tries so far, I still haven't received the license mail.6 And a direct mail to David C is also still unanswered.8 Do anyone know of troubles and when the will be fixed or is David also on vacation ;-)d   TIA8   -- 6 Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialista E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------   Date: 09 Aug 2004 11:42:43 GMT/ From: Thierry Dussuet <thierry@dussuet.lugs.ch> 3 Subject: Re: [Hobbyist] Please fix Webserverprobleme/ Message-ID: <slrncheopj.ql.thierry@MARS.Family>.   Hello!  F On 2004-08-09, Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote:l > In article <newscache$j1fo1i$xtx1$1@news.sil.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) writes:) >>Webserver is working now. Thanks folks. ! >>If only I'd get the mail now...e >zB > After 4 tries so far, I still haven't received the license mail.8 > And a direct mail to David C is also still unanswered.: > Do anyone know of troubles and when the will be fixed or > is David also on vacation ;-)b  K I just ordered new licenses some days ago (on the 5th).  Had to try 3 times % until I got them, but then it worked.BL Maybe make sure they don't get recognized as spam (a friend had this problemF where his ISP was filtering all his mail and had to take another email	 address).a   Thierrye   ------------------------------  * Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 16:50:39 +0000 (UTC)7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) 3 Subject: Re: [Hobbyist] Please fix Webserverprobleme( Message-ID: <cf8a0v$2re$1@pcls4.std.com>  1 Thierry Dussuet <thierry@dussuet.lugs.ch> writes:r  L >I just ordered new licenses some days ago (on the 5th).  Had to try 3 times& >until I got them, but then it worked.M >Maybe make sure they don't get recognized as spam (a friend had this problemwG >where his ISP was filtering all his mail and had to take another email 
 >address).  F I, too, had to try about 4 times before I tried another email address ? because it was not getting through.  Try another email address.M -- l -MikeM   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:59:32 -0400# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 5 Subject: [OT]: Google as hacker's tool- worth reading , Message-ID: <MtCdnf8x3YvYHorcRVn-gg@igs.net>  J http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/AnchorDesk/4520-7297_16-5153622.html?tag=adss   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 10:28:05 -0400 3 From: Undisclosed <nomail@dontbeaweaselspammer.com>,9 Subject: Re: [OT]: Google as hacker's tool- worth readingc0 Message-ID: <RJmdnQZiW5OeF4rcRVn-ig@comcast.com>   John Smith wrote: L > http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/AnchorDesk/4520-7297_16-5153622.html?tag=adss >  >     this has been known for a while.   kinda crazy.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.439 ************************